**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Wed May 13 02:59:57 2009
May 13 04:06:48 <jasta> i wonder why Eclipse doesn't warn about unused variables in R.java
May 13 04:07:05 <jasta> oh maybe because it only warns about local unused varaibles?
May 13 04:11:04 <_Auron_> probably.
May 13 04:23:32 <jasta> wow, the findunusedresources script found a lot of junk in my app ;0
May 13 04:23:45 <jasta> just hacked the source code to make it work on apps outside of google's tree
May 13 04:50:15 <nj> can we change the position of ProgressDialog ?
May 13 04:50:38 <gambler_> is findunusedresources part of the 1.5 SDK?
May 13 04:59:27 <jasta> gambler_: no, i modified the one in android/development/tools/findunused/
May 13 11:00:13 <z3yo> Hi everybody
May 13 11:13:36 <z3yo> There are only problems since 1.5 SDK releases
May 13 11:21:19 <cutmasta> which ones
May 13 11:57:37 <rzr> hi
May 13 11:58:11 <IcE^> hello
May 13 11:58:34 <rzr> i am working on InputMethodService
May 13 11:59:04 <rzr> is there a way to hijack arrows events ?
May 13 12:00:34 <rzr> forget about it
May 13 12:00:36 <rzr> InputMethodService.onKeyDown()
May 13 12:48:24 <blau-mikeDG> is there anything that could be causing log.d not to work?
May 13 12:51:02 <FormicAcid> your console not connected to the emulator?
May 13 12:51:30 <FormicAcid> if you close and restart the emulator sometime the logcat freakout
May 13 12:51:51 <FormicAcid> blau-mikeDG: that was an answer for u
May 13 12:52:44 <blau-mikeDG> seems to be on my device though
May 13 12:53:08 <blau-mikeDG> got it working again though :/
May 13 13:21:47 <soreachilles> damn that monkey tester is useful.. found a weird bug where I didn't have the same id in my layout vs layout-land file
May 13 13:24:48 <blau-mikeDG> monkey tester
May 13 13:24:49 <blau-mikeDG> ?
May 13 13:25:16 <soreachilles> yeah go into adb shell and type monkey -p <your package> 1000
May 13 13:25:22 <soreachilles> it just hammers your app with random input
May 13 13:25:32 <blau-mikeDG> o
May 13 13:25:36 <soreachilles> http://developer.android.com/guide/developing/tools/monkey.html
May 13 13:25:42 <blau-mikeDG> how did monkey tester find it
May 13 13:25:48 <soreachilles> it's an app killer
May 13 13:26:50 <soreachilles> it just goes psycho hitting buttons and doing orientation changes at 100 miles per hour, and eventually it hit a button on a landscape orientation that did something with the portrait id, that wasn't there in landscape, and app died
May 13 13:26:59 <blau-mikeDG> ah
May 13 13:27:24 <blau-mikeDG> you are my monkey
May 13 13:27:28 <soreachilles> heh
May 13 13:27:46 <blau-mikeDG> users are my monkeys!
May 13 13:28:04 <soreachilles> it's good at testing orientation -- all these really subtle bugs got found
May 13 13:28:37 <soreachilles> like with the async bind to my background service... it was using the app faster than any human could, and found a couple cases where my code 'thought' the background service was up already, but it wasn't
May 13 13:29:16 <soreachilles> it'll do like 5 orientation changes in a row super fast, just hammers the oncreate/ondestroy paths over and over
May 13 13:29:59 <soreachilles> it's crystal-meth-monkey.. on steroids
May 13 13:30:11 <soreachilles> from hell
May 13 13:32:41 <blau-mikeDG> its probably not a good idea to play with it on a live phone right?
May 13 13:33:30 <soreachilles> heh dunno, it says it works on the device, but I haven't tried
May 13 13:33:34 <blau-mikeDG> it does
May 13 13:33:35 <soreachilles> you can restrict it to one package
May 13 13:33:51 <blau-mikeDG> thats probably a good idea
May 13 13:33:52 <soreachilles> as long as your app isn't able to dial 911 ...
May 13 13:34:04 <blau-mikeDG> lol
May 13 13:34:29 <blau-mikeDG> oo it does inger volume too
May 13 13:34:46 <soreachilles> yeah and changes keyboards..
May 13 13:34:49 <blau-mikeDG> lol somehow it wound up playing music
May 13 13:35:00 <soreachilles> the psycho monkey starts my app going out on the network, then decides to try and enter text in japanese
May 13 13:35:14 <blau-mikeDG> turned off the music too
May 13 13:35:23 <soreachilles> heh
May 13 13:35:24 <blau-mikeDG> lol woops
May 13 13:35:37 <blau-mikeDG> that was interesting
May 13 13:35:37 <soreachilles> yeah it goes out on the network, then tries to rip out the SD card.. psycho
May 13 13:36:12 <blau-mikeDG> didnt crash my app though
May 13 13:36:13 <soreachilles> you can give the monkey a random number seed, so you can replay the sequence back
May 13 13:36:13 <blau-mikeDG> so win win
May 13 13:37:34 <andrei_null> hy
May 13 13:37:36 <andrei_null>  i have a problem with a ScrollView, how can i know if the scrollbar is on the bottom of the page?
May 13 14:50:49 <soreachilles> huh there's a google i/o session about writing native arm code on android.. didn't think that was possible
May 13 14:56:52 <mp> soreachilles: wow
May 13 14:56:58 <mp> soreachilles: link?
May 13 14:57:30 <mp> soreachilles: co it's possible to publish native app on - for example - android market? or is this talk about hacking internals of android system itself?
May 13 14:57:35 <soreachilles> http://code.google.com/events/io/sessions.html
May 13 14:57:59 <soreachilles> expand the sessions, then serarch for
May 13 14:58:01 <soreachilles> How Do I Code Thee? Let Me Count the Ways
May 13 14:58:27 <soreachilles> sounds like you can write parts of your app in C
May 13 14:58:37 <mp> argh
May 13 14:58:50 <mp> I didn't know that, this changes some things ;)
May 13 14:58:56 <soreachilles> yeah me neither, heh
May 13 15:00:04 <mp> I hope they'll publish podcasts
May 13 15:00:22 <soreachilles> I'm going :)  was just checking the session times and saw that
May 13 15:06:34 <andrewoid> odd they changed the Track of sessions on Android from "Android" to "Mobile"
May 13 15:07:06 <soreachilles> there's still plenty of references to Android in the sessions...
May 13 15:07:24 <soreachilles> maybe there's some issue with that android trademark thing tho
May 13 15:07:41 <andrewoid> They're saying that you can write JNI code for Android? interesting
May 13 15:07:58 <andrewoid> I might have to attend that one, even though writing C gives me hives
May 13 15:07:59 <soreachilles> that session just implies you can write parts of your app in C
May 13 15:08:14 <soreachilles> no clue how...
May 13 15:08:28 <soreachilles> I like c :)
May 13 15:08:38 <soreachilles> puts("c rocks");
May 13 15:09:07 <andrewoid> System.out.println("Java's Better");
May 13 15:11:06 <blau-mikeDG> google cancelled android
May 13 15:11:19 <andrewoid> oh good, I can go home
May 13 15:11:20 <blau-mikeDG> thats why they changed references to mobile
May 13 15:11:28 <soreachilles> char* p = malloc(128*sizeof(char)); strcpy(p, "I -heart- pointers"); free(p);
May 13 15:11:45 <blau-mikeDG> andrewoid: did you make a new toggle gps yet?
May 13 15:11:48 <soreachilles> they did?  ah well back to objective-c I guess
May 13 15:11:50 * andrewoid breaks out in hives.
May 13 15:12:19 <andrewoid> mike, nope. And even if I were to have a breakthrough and figure it out. The world is better off without it.
May 13 15:12:58 <blau-mikeDG> bah
May 13 15:14:12 <Switch`> java is fine until you need lots of math
May 13 15:15:26 <soreachilles> actually I think dalvik is turning a lot of our java into native code anyway
May 13 15:15:27 <blau-mikeDG> java does it for you
May 13 15:16:04 <andrewoid> the G1 is fine, until you need doubles
May 13 15:16:08 <soreachilles> java jit's, but I think dalvik is doing some native code somewhere
May 13 15:16:43 <soreachilles> yeah.. I'm a little worried about that, I've got a lot of lat/lngs I'm keeping around as floats, but not doing (much) math with them.  should be ok.. but 3d graphics in float might hurt
May 13 15:17:09 <blau-mikeDG> turn them into strings!
May 13 15:17:19 <andrewoid> storing floats isn't the problem. Bud if you're doing a lot of calculations with them it'll slow things down
May 13 15:17:27 <soreachilles> yea no fpu on the g1..
May 13 15:17:28 <blau-mikeDG> or stringbuffers!
May 13 15:17:43 <andrewoid> and I'm not a 3d guru, so I don't know what gets optimized by the graphics card
May 13 15:17:51 <soreachilles> i might turn them into ints but not strings :)
May 13 15:17:54 <blau-mikeDG> but all calculations into a database table
May 13 15:18:07 <blau-mikeDG> and putit on your webserver
May 13 15:18:12 <blau-mikeDG> and stream the results in reala time!
May 13 15:18:44 <Switch`> fp 3d graphics/physics run ok'ish on g1
May 13 15:21:03 <andrewoid> Who else is going to Google IO?
May 13 15:25:06 <Poke53281> hi there, I have a newbie question:  i just installed the 1.5 sdk + eclipse for the first time and try to compile some code: i am getting: Android requires .class compatibility set to 5.0. Please fix project properties. i looked at the project properties. the compiler compliances settings are all set to 1.5. not sure what to do !? I am on a Mac
May 13 15:25:31 <andrewoid> ummm
May 13 15:25:44 <andrewoid> 5.0 != 1.5
May 13 15:25:49 <andrewoid> brb, gotta load up eclipse
May 13 15:27:11 <marklar> Poke53281: what version of Java are you using?
May 13 15:27:15 <ziyourenxiang> think 5.0 refers to java 5
May 13 15:27:46 <Poke53281> "1.5.0_16"
May 13 15:27:51 <andrewoid> Window | Preferences, the click on Java, Compiler
May 13 15:28:03 <andrewoid> and there's an option to change the compiler compliance level
May 13 15:28:42 <andrewoid> and I "think" you should be using JDK version 1.6 (Java 6.0) by now
May 13 15:28:50 <Poke53281> andrewoid: yes i see it.  the choices are 1.3 1.4 1.5 and 1.6
May 13 15:29:39 <Poke53281> ok, so i should set the compliance to 1.6 and get a 1.6 java sdk installed?
May 13 15:30:16 <andrewoid> yes
May 13 15:30:32 <Poke53281> I will give that whirl, thanks!
May 13 15:30:48 <soreachilles> how you going to get 1.6 on a mac?
May 13 15:30:58 <andrewoid> good point
May 13 15:30:59 <soreachilles> unless you've got 64bit, you...c an't
May 13 15:31:00 <Poke53281> no idea
May 13 15:31:08 <soreachilles> 1.5 should be fine
May 13 15:31:21 <Poke53281> oh, ok
May 13 15:31:26 <soreachilles> i mean, you can, using soylate.. but you shouldn't need to
May 13 15:31:30 <andrewoid> didn't know that about macs
May 13 15:31:51 <soreachilles> yeah.. apple doesn't like java apparently, heh
May 13 15:32:15 <soreachilles> so on my mac, eclipse project settings... compiler compliance is set to 1.5
May 13 15:32:35 <soreachilles> ensure the "generate .class files compatability" is set to 1.5 as wel
May 13 15:32:37 <soreachilles> well
May 13 15:33:13 <soreachilles> this is under project/properties/java compiler
May 13 15:34:03 <Poke53281> i think it was all set to 1.5 when i ran into the problem, but i will double check
May 13 15:34:18 <soreachilles> all my settings say 1.5 ..
May 13 15:41:38 <soreachilles> I think there should be a jsr to allow null pointer exceptions...
May 13 15:41:53 <soreachilles> it should just do what I mean it to do, instead of throwing an exception
May 13 15:42:13 <soreachilles> i might need to tighten up that language a bit though for the spec.......
May 13 15:44:35 <zhobbs> soreachilles: what do you mean?
May 13 15:44:52 <soreachilles> i'm just rambling.. got another null pointer exception...
May 13 15:45:55 <AppleBoy> how hard would it be to make an app like the youtube viewer that can stream hulu?
May 13 15:46:30 <marklar> AppleBoy: hard
May 13 15:46:45 <zhobbs> soreachilles: I'm a java newb, finally started doing "string".equals(someVar) instead of (someVar != null && someVar.equals("string"))
May 13 15:47:01 <zhobbs> AppleBoy: depends if hulu has the video in the right format
May 13 15:48:01 <soreachilles> yeah I've got an object that is null, but I'd really like it not to be..
May 13 15:49:03 <blau-mikeDG> fill it
May 13 15:49:44 <blau-mikeDG> why would you want to do anythign after a null ptr?
May 13 15:49:47 <blau-mikeDG> in general
May 13 15:49:56 <blau-mikeDG> everything is gonna null ptr out and your state is gonna be awful
May 13 15:50:04 <soreachilles> I want it to magically be the value I want
May 13 15:50:05 <soreachilles> heh
May 13 15:50:17 <soreachilles> is magic too much to ask?
May 13 15:50:20 <blau-mikeDG> just set them all the time
May 13 15:50:21 <eyedol> :)
May 13 15:50:21 <eyedol> can't work
May 13 15:51:06 <blau-mikeDG> anyone wanna buy me a google i/o pass
May 13 15:51:13 <zhobbs> I wish all variables would magically initialize themselves and work together...that way I could just watch tv instead of work
May 13 15:51:19 <soreachilles> exactly
May 13 15:51:31 <soreachilles> classes would magically organize themselves to do something useful
May 13 15:52:03 <soreachilles> i just want to wave a conductor's wand around, and voila, working program
May 13 15:52:22 <soreachilles> someone get on that project please.
May 13 15:52:24 <blau-mikeDG> i cant do that
May 13 15:55:55 <blau-mikeDG> google bookmarks
May 13 16:01:55 <Poke53281> andrewoid: soreachilles : i am a happy camper now. source compiles. I would bet money (small amounts that is) that my compiler compliance setting were set to 1.5 when i ran into the error. so it's set to 1.5 now and compiles ... thanks!
May 13 16:02:10 <soreachilles> have fun :)
May 13 16:05:28 <blau-mikeDG> nubby
May 13 16:05:33 <blau-mikeDG> anyone going to i/o
May 13 16:05:40 <soreachilles> i am..
May 13 16:05:59 * danfuzz is
May 13 16:08:09 <blau-mikeDG> we can now switch from paid to free for apps
May 13 16:08:24 <blau-mikeDG> oh wait, could we always do that?
May 13 16:09:04 <andrewoid> mike, welcome to 3 months ago
May 13 16:09:29 <blau-mikeDG> yeah what i wanted was paid to free
May 13 16:09:36 <blau-mikeDG> err
May 13 16:09:37 <blau-mikeDG> free to paid
May 13 16:10:43 <andrewoid> gawd... why do people from the market feel the need to invite me to myspace
May 13 16:10:55 <perlmonkey2> I was looking around for an android irc app, but didn't see one?
May 13 16:11:22 * danfuzz uses connectbot + screen + irssi
May 13 16:11:38 <danfuzz> though i think there is at least one bona fide irc client
May 13 16:11:52 <perlmonkey2> danfuzz: heh, keep forgetting there is a real OS underneath with real CLI apps.
May 13 16:12:11 <Qwell> danfuzz: you mean, I don't need to connect directly to freenode and send PONGs myself?
May 13 16:12:31 <zhobbs> there are some web based ones that work too
May 13 16:12:58 <pwrcycle> danfuzz: yea, irc client on and unstable wireless connection is not fun.  screen ftw
May 13 16:13:00 <perlmonkey2> I dont' like web based.  Don't like leaving my uid/pwd all around the web.
May 13 16:13:14 <danfuzz> perlmonkey2: connectbot runs on device, screen + irssi on my remote shell
May 13 16:13:24 <Qwell> perlmonkey2: you could host a CGI yourself somewhere.
May 13 16:13:28 <pwrcycle> danfuzz: have you by chance ever tried screen+Finch ?  i can't get encoding correct :(
May 13 16:13:40 <perlmonkey2> Qwell: good point, but I like danfuzz's idea.
May 13 16:13:52 <danfuzz> no, i'm not familiar with finch
May 13 16:14:06 <pwrcycle> danfuzz: finch = Pidgeon commandline version.
May 13 16:14:19 <perlmonkey2> connectbot to my home server, then screen for the irc session
May 13 16:16:18 <danfuzz> i've been using a variation of this setup for like 7 years now
May 13 16:16:52 <danfuzz> (it was formerly terminal on the hiptop for the device side)
May 13 16:21:33 <danfuzz> boo
May 13 16:22:29 <tikkie> connectbot+screen == win indeed
May 13 16:34:34 <kRutOn> yay win
May 13 16:36:06 <kRutOn> I guess I haven't abused dalvik too much, then
May 13 16:37:01 <danfuzz> ?
May 13 16:37:17 <kRutOn> if you're using connectbot, that is :-)
May 13 16:37:20 * _Auron_ is using android irc....
May 13 16:37:30 <danfuzz> oh heh
May 13 16:37:41 <_Auron|G1_> moo
May 13 16:38:20 <_Auron|G1_> I can even click links that people paste
May 13 16:38:35 <danfuzz> connectbot rocks my little world
May 13 16:38:50 <blau-mikeDG> it baffles me that google bookmarks doesnt synch with android
May 13 16:38:52 <blau-mikeDG> lame lame lame
May 13 16:40:07 <kRutOn> danfuzz: I knew it would be the most used app for me when a phone came out, so it was written a couple days after m3 was released
May 13 16:40:34 <_Auron_> lol
May 13 16:40:41 <perlmonkey2> Hah, you've got to be kidding me.  I was expecting finch to be another archaic cli i'd have to learn. Might as well have a GUI.
May 13 16:41:22 <kRutOn> perlmonkey2: They have a FUSE filesystem for XMPP if you want to do archaic.
May 13 16:41:40 <Qwell> kRutOn: xmpp fs?  wtf?
May 13 16:43:05 <kRutOn> Qwell: Yes, you did: echo msg > contact
May 13 16:43:32 <Qwell> wow..
May 13 16:43:45 <danfuzz> that is aw{esome,ful}
May 13 16:45:32 <kRutOn> danfuzz: Are you giving any talks at Google I/O?
May 13 16:46:05 <danfuzz> not quite: i'l be part of the android "fireside chat"
May 13 16:46:10 <danfuzz> i'll
May 13 16:47:12 <kRutOn> danfuzz: Okay, I was getting excited last week when I saw the checkins on Gerrit.
May 13 16:47:15 <romainguy__> danfuzz: every time I read about the fireside chat I can't help but imagine an actual fireplace with Dan sitting on a baroque chair
May 13 16:47:35 <danfuzz> smoking a pipe?
May 13 16:47:40 <romainguy__> :)
May 13 16:48:06 <danfuzz> kRutOn: which checkins?
May 13 16:49:47 <kRutOn> GC stuff
May 13 16:51:18 <kRutOn> There's probably a lot more going on internally that I don't see.
May 13 16:51:33 <perlmonkey2> I can't believe how cool finch is
May 13 16:54:58 <soreachilles> who'se the dev (I assume it's a dev) in the api demos / graphics bitmaps, holding the kid at the beach?
May 13 16:55:06 <soreachilles> ie, bitmapmesh
May 13 16:55:14 <soreachilles> or is the kid the dev? :)
May 13 16:55:15 <romainguy__> soreachilles: Mike Reed
May 13 16:55:37 <romainguy__> Mike wrote the 2D rendering library (SGL/Skia)
May 13 16:55:42 <phishinphree> quick question.. maybe someone can point me in the right direction.  Its taking a while to create a database from an xml file when my application is run for the first time.  is it acceptable or even possible to create the .db file in the emulator and include it in my release or is there a better solution to this problem?
May 13 16:55:47 <soreachilles> heh nice
May 13 16:56:28 <blau-mikeDG> who is Renata Diem?
May 13 17:02:04 <phishinphree> anyone?
May 13 17:02:40 <blau-mikeDG> phish: why make it from an xml file?
May 13 17:02:44 <blau-mikeDG> why not just csv
May 13 17:02:49 <romainguy_> blau-mikeDG: the only Renata Diem I know is a photographer on Flickr
May 13 17:03:22 <blau-mikeDG> yeah thats probably her then http://android-developers.blogspot.com/search?updated-max=2009-01-19T22:09:00-08:00&max-results=7
May 13 17:03:36 <blau-mikeDG> did she contribute wallpaper or something for android?
May 13 17:03:58 <romainguy_> no
May 13 17:04:04 <romainguy_> it's just my list of Flickr contacts
May 13 17:04:10 <blau-mikeDG> ah
May 13 17:05:20 <blau-mikeDG> shes cute in postage stamp size
May 13 17:09:11 <blau-mikeDG> romain: does android have the capability to support x ray vision
May 13 17:11:33 <phishinphree> yeah, i suppose i could but it still takes a while to build the db inserting one row at a time.  any suggestions on how to speed the process up?
May 13 17:12:48 <blau-mikeDG> are you using .beginTransaction and .endTransaction
May 13 17:12:55 <blau-mikeDG> so it doesnt commit after every insert?
May 13 17:13:02 <blau-mikeDG> im pretty sure theres a way to include a db
May 13 17:13:04 <blau-mikeDG> though anyway
May 13 17:15:54 <jasta> hmm, weird, google's Sky Map app didn't used to be branded by Google?
May 13 17:16:02 <jasta> was it always being developed by a google employee?
May 13 17:16:17 <romainguy_> ye
May 13 17:16:20 <romainguy_> yes it was
May 13 17:16:26 <romainguy_> but it was just a side project
May 13 17:16:42 <jasta> its pretty cool, but it used to be really slow
May 13 17:16:49 <jasta> maybe its been fixed
May 13 17:17:17 <blau-mikeDG> youre fixed!
May 13 17:17:49 <blau-mikeDG> i dont like that it starts up with a blank screen and then ANR's
May 13 17:17:57 <blau-mikeDG> and a minute or 2 later we get something usable
May 13 17:18:01 <jasta> romainguy_: it feels like the app is doing 2D rendering when it really should be on a 3D surface... :\
May 13 17:18:16 <jasta> OpenGL|ES should be able to knock that out easily
May 13 17:18:31 <romainguy_> I'm sure whatever they do they had a good reason to do so
May 13 17:18:42 <jasta> you have too much faith ;)
May 13 17:18:48 <blau-mikeDG> jasta: the screen is so small in the scheme of things i think the rendering is fine
May 13 17:19:05 <blau-mikeDG> like if you mapped a 100ft area of the earth
May 13 17:19:12 <jasta> have you used it?  the app is very slow.
May 13 17:19:15 <blau-mikeDG> theres really no point in rendering that on a 3d map
May 13 17:19:15 <jasta> oop, just got an ANR
May 13 17:19:29 <blau-mikeDG> you really wont be seeing much curve to it
May 13 17:19:46 <jasta> the performance has improved greatly since i last used it though
May 13 17:19:52 <blau-mikeDG> i dont think skymap is slow once you start using it
May 13 17:20:00 <jasta> the mapping performance is pretty reasonable now, but startup is really slow
May 13 17:20:14 <jasta> so i guess youre right about the 3D mapping
May 13 17:20:33 <jasta> maybe they are using it though, because the mapping used to be extremely slow before
May 13 17:22:44 <jasta> still, very cool app
May 13 17:24:56 <blau-mikeDG> cool like my apps
May 13 17:25:00 <phishinphree> is skymap open source?
May 13 17:32:37 <Qwell> Dear t-mobile, hurry up so I can test sipdroid compat with Asterisk over your network.  -Qwell  :(
May 13 17:39:31 <balachmar> How do you guys promote your apps? I have just submitted my app to the market. But I know I should do more than just that...
May 13 17:40:03 <perlmonkey2> balachmar: what's the name of the app?
May 13 17:40:20 <balachmar> Panic Button
May 13 17:41:40 <perlmonkey2> balachmar: is it viewable from the web view of android market?
May 13 17:42:11 <balachmar> perlmonkey2: Don't know it is on cyrket en the market on my phone
May 13 17:42:50 <perlmonkey2> balachmar: my phone won't be here for a few more hours.  UPS guy is taking his sweet time.
May 13 17:43:48 <balachmar> perlmonkey2: Well I don't know if I can choose if it shows up on market.android.com. But you can see it here: http://www.cyrket.com/package/nl.wligtenberg.PanicButton
May 13 17:44:06 <jt436> balachmar: you could try contracting various Android websites and blogs
May 13 17:45:03 <balachmar> jt436: That is a good idea!
May 13 17:45:08 <perlmonkey2> balachmar: wow, that is a pretty clever app.
May 13 17:45:39 <balachmar> perlmonkey2: Thank you!
May 13 17:46:14 <perlmonkey2> balachmar: so you are going to get a pound for every download?
May 13 17:46:52 <balachmar> perlmonkey2: No it is 1 euro and a dev gets 70% of that. (And then probably has to pay taxes :) )
May 13 17:48:05 <perlmonkey2> balachmar: well, here's to hoping you get 100,000 downloads this month :D
May 13 17:48:42 <balachmar> I don't think so, I just thought it would be a nice thing to have.
May 13 17:50:21 <perlmonkey2> Can you create multiple buttons for different circumstances?  I'm being mugged! The cops are going Rodney King on me!  I'm drunk and this sleezestack is hitting on me!
May 13 17:52:08 <blau-mikeDG> what about panic mode thattakes pictures and video and sends it somewhere
May 13 17:53:32 <balachmar> perlmonkey2: I could ofcourse do that, but the idea is to only use it in real emergencies. Being mugged, will enable you to just call the police. However being in a car accident not.
May 13 17:53:56 <perlmonkey2> balachmar: is cyrket just you?  If so, you are one prolific dev.
May 13 17:54:02 <balachmar> blau-mikedg: That is a different kind of panic. My app is for life threatening circumstances.
May 13 17:54:22 <balachmar> perlmonkey2: No, not just me. That is the whole market :) just a normal webinterface to it :)
May 13 17:54:40 <perlmonkey2> ic
May 13 17:55:26 <perlmonkey2> I better prepare my finances....I imagine I'm going to blow a ton of cash on new toys for my phone in about 2 hours :P
May 13 17:56:54 <blau-mikeDG> be sure to downlaod dgMoney then
May 13 17:57:02 <jt436> ha
May 13 17:57:24 <balachmar> lol
May 13 17:58:02 <perlmonkey2> dgMoney....looking now
May 13 17:59:31 <perlmonkey2> cool
May 13 18:17:47 <BlindOracle> perlmonkey2, and WiSyncPlus
May 13 18:17:55 <BlindOracle> ;)
May 13 18:22:25 <perlmonkey2> BlindOracle: hmm, just configure alpine to my email.  Not sure if I'll need that app, but we'll see.
May 13 18:45:55 <tauno> tha <application> tag inside the manifest can have a android:description attribute - is this thingi visible for end users currently? I haven't seen it used anywhere but maybe there are some places?
May 13 18:46:45 <romainguy_> it's used in the uninstall apps screen
May 13 18:47:42 <tauno> oh, let me check there then :)
May 13 18:49:06 <tauno> "The value must be set as a reference to a string resource. Unlike the label, it cannot be a raw string. There is no default value." <- why's that?
May 13 18:49:18 <tauno> not that I want to set it as a raw string.. just curious
May 13 18:52:07 <blau-mikeDG> tauno: you win a prize for asking questions like that
May 13 18:52:42 <tauno> romainguy_, where exactly? Settings -> Applications -> Manage Applications -> .. it's not displayed in the app list and not in the app details page
May 13 18:52:46 <tauno> blau-mikeDG, yep
May 13 18:55:54 <tauno> or is there any other app uninstall page?
May 13 18:56:17 <blau-mikeDG> maybe its one of those attributes that has to be in a special place
May 13 18:56:19 <blau-mikeDG> or its ignored
May 13 18:56:23 <romainguy_> it was there in 1.0 and 1.1 at least
May 13 18:56:26 <ctate> tauno: basically, allowing you to use a raw string for android:label is the hack.
May 13 18:56:46 <blau-mikeDG> not allowing raw strings would help me immensely all over the place
May 13 18:56:52 <blau-mikeDG> i get lazy and just start shoving strings
May 13 18:57:12 <ctate> i think under the Android build system apps can't use raw strings in layouts etc, they have to use string resource refs
May 13 18:57:14 <romainguy_> blau-mikeDG: our internal build system doesn't compile if we use raw strings :))
May 13 18:57:18 <ctate> timing :)
May 13 18:57:42 <blau-mikeDG> well fix that for the sdk and eclipse thanks
May 13 18:57:55 <romainguy_> patches are welcome
May 13 18:58:01 <romainguy_> also, it would break existing projects :p
May 13 18:58:07 <ctate> how does sdk/eclipse build?  ant?
May 13 18:58:14 <romainguy_> yes it uses ant
May 13 18:58:19 <romainguy_> well
May 13 18:58:25 <romainguy_> not the eclipse plugin
May 13 18:58:28 <ctate> i suspect that you could get this behavior by modifying the ant setup for aapt to use the -z flag
May 13 18:58:32 <blau-mikeDG> romain: he new plugin broke existing projects already
May 13 18:58:34 <romainguy_> but you can use the android executable to generate an ant script
May 13 18:58:52 <romainguy_> blau-mikeDG: so let's try to not break them again :)
May 13 18:59:02 <blau-mikeDG> but thats the fun!
May 13 20:01:33 <tauno> can I tell TextView that I don't want it to wrap my text in a certain place? For example the string "check out google.com for stuff" in a dialog is wrapped in the middle of google.com (so "check out google." is on the first line and "com for stuff" is on the second)
May 13 20:21:35 <jasta> tauno: it is probably wrapping based on language heuristics, like punctuation.  you could try looking in the code to find that particular logic and seeing if there is some way to control it
May 13 20:21:45 <jasta> like perhaps there is a way to make nobreak spans
May 13 20:29:34 <Rexxars> or perhaps try my strategy: shout at it, and call it silly names
May 13 20:36:29 <tauno> I'm not really familiar with spans but there doesn't seem to be a nonbreak span
May 13 20:36:39 <tauno> Rexxars, tried that - didn't help
May 13 20:36:44 <jasta> did you look at TextView et al code?
May 13 20:37:15 <tauno> not yet - I just looked at the built in xxxSpan classes
May 13 20:37:29 <tauno> I'll go to textview now then
May 13 20:38:21 <silverblade> woo, finally getting the android source to build. i have no idea what im going to do once its built.... but hey, woo, its building.
May 13 20:50:59 <perlmonkey2> hmm, does the G1 come in the mail with a dead battery, or am I not figuring out how to turn it on?
May 13 20:53:56 <jasta> perlmonkey2: press and hold the red button.  if it doesnt turn on, the battery is probably dead.
May 13 20:54:05 <jasta> (so charge it)
May 13 20:54:25 <ctate> it should come with a reasonable amount of charge on the battery
May 13 20:55:08 <Qwell> mine had zero charge when I got it
May 13 20:55:11 <perlmonkey2> jasta: sweet, it's alive!
May 13 20:55:24 <perlmonkey2> I've got mine plugged into a usb port, charging
May 13 20:55:47 <ctate> fwiw it charges faster on AC power, but usb is fine
May 13 20:57:20 <perlmonkey2> ctate: sweet, thanks :)  this is soo cool
May 13 20:59:39 <silverblade> my htc magic came with some charge in it already, though ive always been told you should charge up for several hours with any phone before first use
May 13 21:01:01 <tauno> the StaticLayout text wrapping code is not an easy read
May 13 21:01:17 <jasta> tauno: that means its probably not customizable :)
May 13 21:01:21 <tauno> esp @ midnight
May 13 21:02:11 <soreachilles> hi -- am I getting thi right?  It's currently not possible to test an app compiled with the 1.5 toosls, that uses the google apis (maps, specifically) on a 1.1 device?
May 13 21:03:21 <ctate> right, because you'd be using the 1.5 APIs
May 13 21:04:25 <perlmonkey2> hmm, firmware is 1.1.  Isn't 1.5 supposed to be on it?
May 13 21:04:34 <soreachilles> the libs aren't avail yet to link into a 1.1 app?
May 13 21:05:12 <soreachilles> wasn't this possible on the 1.1 sdk?  that is, with 1.1 you could make a maps app and run it on a 1.1 device?
May 13 21:07:58 <ctate> perlmonkey2: T-Mobile US has not updated its customers' devices with 1.5 yet.
May 13 21:08:08 <soreachilles> oic I guess just some of the maps apis aren't avail -- mapview is coming up on the device..
May 13 21:08:24 <ctate> soreachilles: err, just build with the 1.1 SDK if you want to support 1.1....
May 13 21:09:26 <soreachilles> yeah... so I selected the 1.1 api and all this maps stuff went red in the build, so I wsa under the impression -all- the maps stuff was unavail with 1.1 target -- but that's not the case, just some stuff, like the new zoom control overlay
May 13 21:09:28 <soreachilles> etc
May 13 21:10:18 <ctate> yeah
May 13 21:10:21 <soreachilles> device is much faster than emulator
May 13 21:10:35 <soreachilles> and it all just worked, nice job
May 13 21:11:10 <ctate> the emulator is very heavy on the cpu
May 13 21:11:20 <ctate> so unless you have a really fast machine, it'll be pretty slow even compared to the phone hardware
May 13 21:14:03 <soreachilles> DateFormat's not in 1.1.. sigh...
May 13 21:14:09 <soreachilles> i knew that though
May 13 21:19:18 <soreachilles> all that monkey testing paying off.. orientation changes work fine on the device... pretty slick platform :)
May 13 21:22:21 <tauno> how do I remove an activity from the activity stack (so that when the user presses back on the "next" activity, he isn't going to get back to "this" activity)
May 13 21:22:55 <tauno> or is this against the desing?
May 13 21:24:43 <tauno> ah ok, nevermind.. FLAG_ACTIVITY_EXCLUDE_FROM_RECENTS :)
May 13 21:25:13 <tauno> I was searching for something like "Activity.removeFromRecents()"
May 13 21:31:06 <tauno> ah no, that's not it :(
May 13 21:33:02 <romainguy_> no that's not it
May 13 21:33:07 <romainguy_> just finish() the activity
May 13 21:33:20 <tauno> that applies for the new activity that I start. What I'd want to do is something like: this.removeFromHistory(); startActivity(new Intent(this, A.class)); so when I press back in A, then it's not going back to the previous thingie
May 13 21:33:30 <tauno> romainguy_, ah ok, thanks
May 13 21:34:21 <tauno> I somehow thought that calling finish() on any activity is not something that you should do for whatever reasons, idk why :P
May 13 21:35:22 <romainguy_> tauno: yeah you should not
May 13 21:35:28 <romainguy_> but I stopped trying to reason with you :p
May 13 21:35:41 <romainguy_> that said there might be another way
May 13 21:35:41 <romainguy_> one sec
May 13 21:36:07 <romainguy_> hmm no
May 13 21:36:39 <tauno> romainguy_, I'm not going to do hacks in this app.. I really want it to be as "nice" as possible :)
May 13 21:37:03 <romainguy_> more seriously I think that's what Gmail does with the labels activity
May 13 21:37:10 <romainguy_> it doesn't show up in the history when you press back
May 13 21:37:25 <romainguy_> I just looked at the manifest and there's nothing in there
May 13 21:37:30 <romainguy_> so they must just be calling finish()
May 13 21:37:37 <tauno> ok, I'll do that then
May 13 21:38:16 <tauno> speaking of that - is there a sane way to stop textviews from breaking "google.com" @ the '.' character when wrapping text (without a hack that is :P)?
May 13 21:38:51 <romainguy_> don't make it multilines?
May 13 21:39:57 <tauno> can't shorten it really - it's the message in a Dialog and only a few words long.
May 13 21:40:27 <tauno> but then again.. I might be able to reword it so the address is at the beginning of the text.. or something like that :/
May 13 21:40:30 <sammyF> hey there
May 13 21:40:47 <tauno> ..but that would be a hack by itself :P
May 13 21:40:48 <sammyF> the layout editor for Eclipse is pretty broken, oright?
May 13 21:49:53 <kc8pxy> anyone here that could help me win my wrestling match with eclipse, with the goal of getting the ADT installed?
May 13 21:51:20 <perlmonkey2> which app was used to ssh to a machine?
May 13 21:51:23 <perlmonkey2> connect monkey?
May 13 21:51:34 <Qwell> perlmonkey2: connectbot?
May 13 21:51:54 <perlmonkey2> ahah, thanks Qwell
May 13 22:01:31 <svm_invictvs> When the phone slides open and closed, is the activity destroyed?
May 13 22:01:43 <tauno> TextView has only setError(CharSequence) but not setError(int resid) (like setText() and setHint() have) - is this left out by accident (eg should I file a feature request) or is this designed so?
May 13 22:05:57 <soreachilles> yeah onDestroy is called
May 13 22:09:05 <soreachilles> omg I'm loving this phone --- mostly cuz my app is just running without doing anything, including all the background service and threading stuff
May 13 22:09:58 <soreachilles> and it looks exactly the same as the emulator... just awesome
May 13 22:10:28 <kc8pxy> soreachilles:  I'm a newcomer, what app is it?
May 13 22:10:48 <soreachilles> it's not released yet.. i'm just developing stuff
May 13 22:11:06 <soreachilles> went pretty far with just the emulator, and just now put the app on the device, and it just worked, heh
May 13 22:11:33 <kc8pxy> soreachilles: i'm pumped about having a "mainstream" quality phone running a linux kernel, that i can write apps for also :)
May 13 22:12:07 <soreachilles> why's that mainstream in quotes? heh
May 13 22:27:22 <kc8pxy> soreachilles: i have a friend who has a phone that runs on linux, but it's alpha-quality.   G1 can run, where that thing is at a crippled crawl.
May 13 22:28:27 <zinx> openmoko/maemo/qtopia or whatever?
May 13 22:28:57 <soreachilles> yeah -- I'm just thinking/hoping the various android phones are truly mainstream phones, and not just in the hands of linux enthusiasts
May 13 22:29:07 <soreachilles> time will tell
May 13 22:29:18 <zinx> they are already mainstream
May 13 22:29:22 <soreachilles> ya
May 13 22:29:26 <ctate> well, T-Mobile said they'd sold a million G1's, a while back
May 13 22:29:30 <soreachilles> that's why I asked why "mainstream" was in quotes :)
May 13 22:29:36 <ctate> there aren't a million linux enthusiasts like that, so... ;)
May 13 22:29:40 <soreachilles> heh
May 13 22:29:58 <soreachilles> every damn time I go to a meeting though and mention android, someone says, "aren't there more android developers than owners?"
May 13 22:30:00 <zinx> i know people who don't even have a clue what Linux is
May 13 22:30:03 <soreachilles> I mean, like 3 for 3 now
May 13 22:30:06 <zinx> that have a G1
May 13 22:30:19 <zinx> heck, join #android-cha... you know what, forget i was even going to say that.
May 13 22:30:28 <ctate> :)
May 13 22:32:21 <soreachilles> retrrofitting in 1.1 functionality into my 1.5 app .. ugh
May 13 22:34:02 <soreachilles> what's android-chat -- I mean I can imagine, but -- ok I'll forget you mentioned it
May 13 22:34:23 <kc8pxy> zinx:  or know that their G1 runs on it? :)
May 13 22:34:36 <zinx> kc8pxy: exactly
May 13 22:35:00 <zinx> soreachilles: trust me, you're better off not knowing
May 13 22:35:05 <soreachilles> lol
May 13 22:35:07 <soreachilles> ok
May 13 22:36:25 <kc8pxy> zinx:  I'd heard for a while that andriod was open-source, and SUSPECTED it was linux, but when i read the 2.6.27 update in 1.5, i'm like "YES!" one more nail in the coffin of the myth that linux is not ready to push into society as more than something to run servers on :)
May 13 22:36:42 <soreachilles> am I missing something?  Is there a tag on the apis to say when they were added?  The one I have in front of me is DateFormat -- but there are others.. DateFormat is 1.5+
May 13 22:36:59 <soreachilles> doesn't tivo run linux?
May 13 22:37:19 <sammyF> soreachilles: yep, it does
May 13 22:37:31 <soreachilles> tivo's like the engine in my washing machine.. it just works for years and I don't think much about it :)  heh, ok, not a perfect analogy since I use linux a lot..
May 13 22:37:53 <sammyF> soreachilles: if you count all the embedded devices, linux is probably the most used kernel
May 13 22:37:57 <soreachilles> y
May 13 22:38:01 <soreachilles> I would imagine
May 13 22:38:15 <sammyF> soreachilles: not that I'd like to code games for some electronic toaster ...
May 13 22:38:34 <soreachilles> i coded games for PS1, might as well be a toaster now..
May 13 22:38:48 <ctate> lots of 'real' products run linux.  like, a ton of consumer router products.
May 13 22:39:00 <ctate> note also that Android sits on Linux, but not GNU/Linux.
May 13 22:39:30 <sammyF> ctate: yep. linux is just a kernel after all. most people equate linux to GNU/Linux though
May 13 22:39:41 <ctate> including RMS, tsk tsk
May 13 22:39:42 <soreachilles> so that's why I can't vi from adb shell
May 13 22:40:23 <sammyF> ctate, anyway ... what do you mean by "real" products? I find that offensive towards electronic toasters, you insensitive clod!
May 13 22:41:07 <ctate> as opposed to running linux on desktop PCs :)
May 13 22:41:24 <ctate> which is IMO still a feat suited only for masochists
May 13 22:43:10 <soreachilles> y
May 13 22:43:32 <soreachilles> except osx did pretty well
May 13 22:43:40 <sammyF> ctate, if I was a masochist, I'd tell you it's not true and try to start an OS-FLamewar. I'm not, even though I use exclusively GNU/Linux provately, so I won't ;)
May 13 22:43:48 <ctate> soreachilles: especially in the "not being linux" department
May 13 22:44:00 <ctate> sammyF: heh
May 13 22:44:40 <Qwell> better than using that "other" OS
May 13 22:45:16 * ctate misses BeOS, crazy nostalgia ftw...
May 13 22:45:25 <sammyF> ctate: Ubuntu, despite all the many negative things one can say about it, has really done a great job at democratizing Linux on the desktop
May 13 22:45:45 <soreachilles> BeOs was kinda nutty with all the threads
May 13 22:45:50 <ctate> i used Ubuntu as my primary desktop machine at work for about a year
May 13 22:45:56 <soreachilles> anywa, why am I rattling on, I have backporting to attend to
May 13 22:46:01 <ctate> although this was around the breezy badger timeframe
May 13 22:46:10 <sammyF> ctate: yep. badger was a pain
May 13 22:46:19 <sammyF> ctate: it has come a long way since then
May 13 22:46:28 <ctate> it'd have to :)
May 13 22:46:55 <ctate> does Eclipse still reek for doing C/C++?
May 13 22:47:05 <sammyF> ctate: I tried badger back then, and I *really* wanted to like it ... reverted to XP after a month or so
May 13 22:47:41 <sammyF> ctate: I wouldn't know. I'm using code::blocks for c/c++ normally
May 13 22:47:43 <soreachilles> never tried, I just use eclipse for java and flex.. c++ is msdev and/or vi
May 13 22:48:02 <ctate> never heard of code::blocks, what's that?
May 13 22:48:09 <sammyF> ctate: but knowing Eclipse, I'd say "probably"
May 13 22:48:13 <soreachilles> actually I'm trying to use intellij for android, but aapt thing dies on me.. i don't wanna debug the plugin
May 13 22:48:15 <ctate> yikes, wx based
May 13 22:48:26 <sammyF> code::blocks? it's a really great c++ IDE
May 13 22:48:35 <soreachilles> doesn't "die" what am I saying, intellij sends the wrong params
May 13 22:48:39 <ctate> ew, MDI
May 13 22:48:54 <ctate> oh well
May 13 22:49:27 <ctate> i'll look into it when i need a linux C/C++ environment -- thanks for the pointer
May 13 22:49:29 <soreachilles> turbo c++
May 13 22:50:54 <sammyF> ctate: np. when I finally really moved to ubuntu (hmm .. at 7.04 I think), I needed a replacement for Visual Studio, and that was the best alternative I found.
May 13 22:51:12 * ctate nods.
May 13 22:51:14 <sammyF> (and no, Vi doesn't cut it for me;)
May 13 22:52:25 <soreachilles> so... my app used the 1.5 way to put zoom controls on a map, which I removed and did the 1.1 way, and it works fine on a 1.1 emulator, but when I try to send it to a 1.5 emulator, this is sent to the console: INSTALL_FAILED_MISSING_SHARED_LIBRARY and nothing to logcat.  any idea if this is related to the map api issue, or something else?  commented out the map code and it went away...
May 13 22:53:52 <soreachilles> but doesn't seem like it should be related... checked the boards and didn't find it.  I'll keep digging
May 13 22:54:42 <soreachilles> I don't think it's related to the maps code.. something else in switching between 1.1 and 1.5.. sigh.. nm
May 13 22:56:07 <sammyF> in a gridview, is onKeyDown/onKeyUp triggered for touchscreen events too?
May 13 22:57:10 <sammyF> forget the stupid question
May 13 22:58:46 <soreachilles> oh god is the map signature different between emulators 1.1 and 1.5? i bet they are
May 13 22:58:50 <soreachilles> err the md5 sig
May 13 23:02:14 <soreachilles> anyway I'll figure this out.. but are there (right now) three configurations out there? 1.1, 1.5 without google apis, and 1.5 with google apis ?
May 13 23:06:28 <recursv> yep
May 13 23:07:46 <phishinphree> is there a limit the the number of inserts that can be called in one transaction on a database?
May 13 23:07:47 <soreachilles> ic so theoretically google could not license their maps stuff to someone picking up android and slapping it on their phone
May 13 23:08:19 <jbq> phishinphree: probably the size of the DB buffer, i.e. 2MB, though that's likely to be implementation-dependent.
May 13 23:08:58 <phishinphree> hmm, the db only ends up being a little over 100k if i do it without the start/end transaction
May 13 23:09:47 <phishinphree> im just trying to speed up creating the database.. probably 1000 inserts total on a few tables
May 13 23:09:54 <jbq> I don't know how the data is stored in the buffer - might not be the same format as on-disk.
May 13 23:10:06 <soreachilles> you never figured out how to just ship a pre-populated sqlite db?
May 13 23:10:12 <phishinphree> nope
May 13 23:10:27 <phishinphree> found a post that convinced me it wasn't possible
May 13 23:11:04 <soreachilles> so you starting a thread and inserting it while the users read your eula or something?
May 13 23:11:15 * jbq thought those were just files on the filesystem
May 13 23:11:51 <phishinphree> http://groups.google.com/group/android-beginners/browse_thread/thread/21ac3596a14f4a87 the last post
May 13 23:12:20 <phishinphree> yeah pretty much
May 13 23:13:41 <soreachilles> so that thread doesn't make sense to me
May 13 23:13:50 <soreachilles> the guy can write a text file to the right place, why not binary
May 13 23:14:24 <phishinphree> yeah, i didn't test it but its all i found when i tried searching on the subject
May 13 23:14:45 <soreachilles> good luck :) seems possible, I'll prolly be trying that myself sometime soon
May 13 23:17:01 <soreachilles> the good news is, sqlite's whole database is just one file
May 13 23:17:07 <phishinphree> right on, post your results somewhere :-)
May 13 23:17:27 <soreachilles> all tables, everything, dr hipp stuck it all in one file, which is great
May 13 23:18:13 <phishinphree> yeah it is.. im a little worried about any changes but i suppose they'd need to keep backward compat for databases already on the device
May 13 23:18:37 <soreachilles> they're running an older version of the database on the emulator than is current with sqlite
May 13 23:18:55 <soreachilles> so if you're trying to put one from your desktop with the latest sqlite, onto the emulator/device, I'd think that'd fail
May 13 23:19:48 <phishinphree> so what happens when sqlite gets updated on the hansets?
May 13 23:19:57 <soreachilles> but to pull one from the emulator, not touch it, store it, and just zap it into the right place on an install..... I'd imagine that'd work.. but surely people have been trying
May 13 23:20:19 <soreachilles> sqlite's been backwards compat for a long, long time
May 13 23:20:36 <phishinphree> thats what i figured however the google gods don't want to help me find it
May 13 23:20:41 <soreachilles> he mainly fixes bugs and starts some new experimental features in new versions, heh
May 13 23:21:50 <phishinphree> yeah, it would be nice to just drop in a .db from the emulator instead of building it from scratch on install.  i've just yet to see it done
May 13 23:21:52 <soreachilles> but the basic stuff is solid, especially if you're not accessing it from multiple procs
May 13 23:22:00 <soreachilles> hmm....... yeha
May 13 23:22:15 <soreachilles> i wonder why it's so hard to do that....
May 13 23:24:35 <soreachilles> can you write other binary files, unrelated to sqlite, there?
May 13 23:25:10 <soreachilles> damnit now I have a project for the weekend other than pulling weeds :)
May 13 23:26:07 <phishinphree> found something
May 13 23:26:09 <phishinphree> http://markmail.org/message/yahrhdlytinixxd6#query:android%20including%20.db%20in%20res+page:1+mid:v7gh2u5ukahefjb2+state:results
May 13 23:30:19 <phishinphree> lol, im glad i gave you something to doo this weekend tho.  To be honest tho, I'd rather pull the weeds.  its a nice chainge from pulling my hair during the week.
May 13 23:31:43 <soreachilles> 1. "should" work...
May 13 23:32:09 <soreachilles> I dunno though, I've never tried it, but I've hacked around the sqlite database enuf
May 13 23:32:16 <soreachilles> it's just a binary file
May 13 23:32:48 <phishinphree> indeed.  i'm going w/ whats behind door 2 tho
May 13 23:32:51 <soreachilles> 2&3 are insane
May 13 23:33:11 <phishinphree> it should speed things up, i'll see how much
May 13 23:33:21 <soreachilles> but 3 is all you can do , I guess... sucks!!
May 13 23:33:31 <phishinphree> 3 is insane, 2 is just a pain in the ass.
May 13 23:33:35 <soreachilles> yeah
May 13 23:33:39 <soreachilles> so I dunno dude, it's just a binary file...
May 13 23:34:09 <phishinphree> i know, but can you write to data/data/package/databases
May 13 23:34:10 <ctate> what's wrong with 1?
May 13 23:34:17 <soreachilles> 1's great
May 13 23:34:21 <soreachilles> but they're saying it won't work
May 13 23:34:25 <ctate> they are?
May 13 23:34:27 <soreachilles> y
May 13 23:34:38 <ctate> who is "they"?
May 13 23:34:57 <soreachilles> I think random android-developer posters, non-android OS people
May 13 23:35:08 <phishinphree> the only other person i found who has tried.
May 13 23:35:18 <ctate> the sticky part is how you get the .db file off the device into your raw assets :)
May 13 23:35:32 <ctate> if you have an ADP1 then it's easy; you have root in adb
May 13 23:36:14 <phishinphree> ive got a rooted g1 but i think the db the enulator spits out would work fine
May 13 23:36:24 <ctate> or that, yeah
May 13 23:37:01 <phishinphree> soreachilles says sqlite db files should be completely backward compat.. i guess the emulator uses a slightly older version
May 13 23:37:24 <soreachilles> backwards compat shouldn't matter, you're on the same version
May 13 23:37:50 <phishinphree> o, i thought the emulator was using an older version of sqlite3
May 13 23:37:58 <soreachilles> forwards compat, that is, if you take one from your desktop that is running latest sqlite and slap that in android, prolly won't work
May 13 23:38:11 <soreachilles> android is running older than latest sqlite
May 13 23:38:17 <soreachilles> which is prolly good, btw
May 13 23:39:10 <soreachilles> if you take from device/emulator that's same version as your target sqlite.. heh, should work! just slap it in the right place :)  Maybe there's some permissions issue, I dunno, but that poster said he wrote a text file there
May 13 23:39:12 <phishinphree> ohh, misunderstood but yeah, i imagine there are fewer buggs
May 13 23:39:46 <soreachilles> ctate seems to think 1's the right approach and he'd know best
May 13 23:40:00 <soreachilles> maybe you're just not writing it correctly... ?
May 13 23:40:26 <phishinphree> maybe, i'll look at it some more later on this eve.  ctate?
May 13 23:40:42 <ctate> "right" approach?  heh.
May 13 23:41:01 <ctate> off the top of my head i'd think it'd work.
May 13 23:41:22 <phishinphree> ohh, didn't see your nick.. wasn't looking for ops
May 13 23:45:50 <soreachilles> i gotta try this.. sigh..
May 13 23:46:01 <soreachilles> wtf is so hard about wring a sqlite db to the right place? heh
May 13 23:48:03 <phishinphree> let me know if you discover anything.   ive got to go make some dinner for the youngins
May 13 23:48:19 <soreachilles> k
May 13 23:51:22 <ctate> you find Context.getDatabasePath(...) yet?  ;)
May 13 23:52:27 <soreachilles> omg the version on windows is the same as in the emulator
May 13 23:52:29 <soreachilles> this is hard? heh
May 13 23:52:46 <soreachilles> err the ver in tools == ver in emulator
May 13 23:53:01 <soreachilles> you android folks are good and/or lucky :)
May 13 23:53:33 <soreachilles> you don't even need to suck it off the emulator you can do it from the os shell
May 13 23:53:49 <soreachilles> (I'm betting 'good')
May 13 23:54:48 <ctate> erm
May 13 23:55:07 <ctate> do you trust sqlite3 to be storing its database files in endian-agnostic ways?  ;)
May 13 23:55:17 <ctate> or even platform-agnostic?
May 13 23:55:18 <soreachilles>  no
May 13 23:55:22 * ctate would pull it out of the emulator.
May 13 23:55:54 <soreachilles> really? I'd think intel to arm... kinda known. but ok
May 13 23:56:11 <soreachilles> will do :)
May 13 23:56:34 <soreachilles> why am I shaving this yak
May 13 23:56:50 <ctate> that's the same endianness, but i would still make sure to pul the db file from the actual platform of interest
May 13 23:56:58 <soreachilles> k
May 13 23:57:04 <soreachilles> emulator it is
May 14 00:04:25 <soreachilles> lol works fine so far
May 14 00:09:51 <jasta> ctate: you should...
May 14 00:09:56 <jasta> ctate: sqlite3 is storage portable.
May 14 00:09:58 <jasta> as a feature
May 14 00:11:03 <jasta> they even document this between versions: http://www.sqlite.org/formatchng.html
May 14 00:15:07 <soreachilles> they prolly just hire dr hipp ton consult..
May 14 00:15:13 <soreachilles> he's a saint..
May 14 00:16:01 <soreachilles> any coder that gives a blessing in code instead of a copyright qualifies as saint, heh
May 14 00:16:20 <soreachilles> the sqlite blessing:
May 14 00:16:22 <soreachilles> May you do good and not evil
May 14 00:16:24 <soreachilles> May you find forgiveness for yourself and forgive others
May 14 00:16:26 <soreachilles> May you share freely, never taking more than you give.
May 14 00:17:32 <soreachilles> I kind wonder if that's where paul buchheit got the google do no evil thing..
May 14 00:17:46 <soreachilles> if so, dr hipp... should be well taken care of by google
May 14 00:18:12 <soreachilles> shrug
May 14 00:18:16 <soreachilles> back to io streams
May 14 00:22:48 <recursv> nice monologue though
May 14 00:22:58 <soreachilles> yeah
May 14 00:23:00 <soreachilles> it sure is
May 14 00:23:02 <KNY> recursv, you broke his streak!
May 14 00:23:07 <soreachilles> heh, dr hipp's though
May 14 00:23:08 <recursv> : (
May 14 00:23:09 <KNY> I was wondering how long he would keep going
May 14 00:23:13 <soreachilles> me ?
May 14 00:23:15 <KNY> yes
May 14 00:23:15 <soreachilles> oh man
May 14 00:23:17 <soreachilles> I talk too much
May 14 00:23:19 <soreachilles> ok ok
May 14 00:23:22 * KNY nods
May 14 00:23:38 <soreachilles> no one was asking questions, so I just ramble in between thinking about database issues :)
May 14 00:24:20 <soreachilles> I like to hear myself type :)
May 14 00:25:31 <kc8pxy> gar..  this is frustrating.   can you guys help me sort this out?
May 14 00:25:49 <KNY> kc8pxy, not if you don't ask your question
May 14 00:25:49 <recursv> just reverse it. rag
May 14 00:27:05 <kc8pxy> i'm trying to install ADT 0.9.0 into eclipse. i can get all the deps in place, and get it installed,   but when i try and set my sdk dir,   i find Andriod absent from preferences, but ddms is there. same story for both europa and ganymede.
May 14 00:28:59 <kc8pxy> KNY:  that help?
May 14 00:29:22 <KNY> did you restart eclipse?
May 14 00:30:17 <sammyF> can someone point me to some (even if bad) explanation on how to use OnItemClick for a gridview?
May 14 00:30:45 <kc8pxy> KNY:  yes.
May 14 00:31:24 <KNY> kc8pxy, and it's not under window -> preferences -> android?
May 14 00:32:10 <kc8pxy> KNY:  correct.
May 14 00:32:43 <KNY> I believe it's only supported in ganymede, for what it's worth
May 14 00:33:18 <sammyF> nm .. foudn one at least
May 14 00:40:36 <kc8pxy> KNY:  so why does my ganymede not work either?
May 14 00:41:14 <KNY> kc8pxy, I have no idea.
May 14 00:42:46 <kc8pxy> KNY:  it shoudl not matter that my ganymede is running on a x86_64 linux,  should it??  i mean,  it's all java,   yes?
May 14 00:43:13 <KNY> I'm on x86_64 and it works here
May 14 00:44:55 * kc8pxy wants to throtle his eclipse
May 14 00:45:24 <soreachilles> ctate: works fine..
May 14 00:45:54 <ctate> soreachilles: what does? pulling the .db and splatting it in place at init time?
May 14 00:46:08 <soreachilles> ctate: pulled a db off the emulator using adb pull, put it into my project as a raw, and built it back up from code in like 2 lines, and sqlite3 is fine with it
May 14 00:46:17 <ctate> schweet
May 14 00:46:19 <soreachilles> y
May 14 00:46:41 <soreachilles> I mean, it makes sense, no rocket science here
May 14 00:46:46 <ctate> yeah
May 14 00:46:53 <soreachilles> i just... wrote the commands, heh
May 14 00:47:25 <soreachilles> guess I'l reply to that thread with code linking to  postbin
May 14 00:47:54 <soreachilles> suppose I should try it on the device tho
May 14 00:48:01 <soreachilles> since i have one now
May 14 00:48:46 <soreachilles> I wonder if the real problem is actually going thru the android wrappers to sqlite, with the create db stuff... haven't tested that route
May 14 00:49:11 * kc8pxy wants to dig his teeth into andriod 1.5,  but can't get the #$%#$&^ ADT to load up to where i can start playing with it :-(
May 14 00:51:25 <soreachilles> this db stuff is good to know cuz I was thinking about doing sync by just sending my sqlite db to the server, let the server fix it up, and send it back down, and the android client would just splat it in place.. instead of a whole api to manipulate records
May 14 00:52:00 <soreachilles> [soliloquy over
May 14 00:56:58 <jasta> ***so bored***
May 14 00:57:01 <jasta> i mean, waiting for android to compile :)
May 14 00:59:15 <svm_invictvs> Interesting
May 14 01:03:19 <khert> anyone know if gdata-youtube-2.0.jar would work with android?
May 14 01:03:33 <khert> that's the youtube api btw
May 14 01:04:46 <jsharkey> ooh we had a motorola sighting!
May 14 01:04:54 <jsharkey> @ Simba1
May 14 01:05:03 <jsharkey> actually, lemme grep logs
May 14 01:05:36 <doc_savage> would I use a BroadcastReceiver for an app to detect when a WiFi connection becomes available/unavailable?
May 14 01:06:21 <jsharkey> doc_savage: yep, totally
May 14 01:06:53 <jsharkey> doc_savage: http://d.android.com/reference/android/net/ConnectivityManager.html#CONNECTIVITY_ACTION
May 14 01:06:56 <doc_savage> jsharkey: cool, I'm still hugely new to all of this, is developer.android.com the best place to read about them?
May 14 01:07:12 <doc_savage> jsharkey: ah, you read my mind... thanks I'll have a read
May 14 01:10:03 <jsharkey> doc_savage: i'll be talking specifically about that broadcast at I/O  ;)
May 14 01:10:31 <jsharkey> and how you can listen for it without accidentially wasting battery
May 14 01:11:14 <doc_savage> nice, will that be available online too? (stranded in the UK) :)
May 14 01:11:17 <jasta> jsharkey: you mean by just registering and unregistering it based on your need to know? :)
May 14 01:11:43 <jsharkey> sigh jasta you're taking away all my tricks  :P
May 14 01:12:07 <jasta> i could go on and on ;)
May 14 01:12:14 <doc_savage> lool, on that basis, I have a toggle button for WiFi, so when I enable, I'd register, and once I recevie the "WiFi up" broadcast, I unregister?
May 14 01:12:29 <jasta> basically, yes. but do realize that you may never get it :)
May 14 01:12:40 <jsharkey> jasta: actually im being more clever than that
May 14 01:12:49 <jasta> jsharkey: are you now? :)
May 14 01:13:04 <jasta> how?
May 14 01:13:20 <doc_savage> oh :( how comes? I'm making (for practise) a profile app, with a wifi toggle button, I need to know when Wifi is up/down to set the icon in the button
May 14 01:13:41 <jsharkey> doc_savage: oh, in that case you can query ConnectviityManager directly
May 14 01:13:46 <jsharkey> to get the currently active networkinfo
May 14 01:13:59 <jasta> but then his UI will be stale if it changes while its open
May 14 01:14:20 <jsharkey> right, its a mix of the two though
May 14 01:14:31 <jasta> doc_savage: iw ould recommend getting the state directly, but still registering a receiver while your view is on screen
May 14 01:14:49 <jasta> get the state and register in onresume, unregister in onpause
May 14 01:15:16 <doc_savage> the problem I have, I enable wifi with "wm.setWifiEnabled(!curState)" in the button's onclick, but then wifi doesn't show as up until after that code has completed, I didn't want to change the icon before it's definately come up, incase it failed
May 14 01:15:46 <jasta> why not just do what the settings app does?
May 14 01:16:05 <doc_savage> which is? (sorry, am really new to this)
May 14 01:16:08 <jasta> give some sort of status along with the check mark to indicate that its working on getting connected
May 14 01:16:21 <jasta> or, have a toggle for WiFi enabled, and some other indicator for WiFi _connected_
May 14 01:16:31 <doc_savage> ah, that'd work
May 14 01:16:39 <jasta> offering a toggle for wifi connected makes no sense, because the user cannot control that.
May 14 01:16:47 <jasta> but a light or some indicator does
May 14 01:17:31 <doc_savage> basically the app will list audio profiles, with a toggle button for wifi at the bottom, is the plan, it's more to break me into android than be a serious app
May 14 01:18:00 <jasta> doesnt matter, you cant offer a toggle button for whether wifi is connected
May 14 01:18:09 <jasta> that interface makes no sense
May 14 01:18:19 <doc_savage> a button to enable/disable wifi?
May 14 01:18:38 <jasta> yes, that makes sense.  but the toggle would immediately turn on when enabled.  the connectivitymanager is going to tell you whether its CONNECTED, not enabled.
May 14 01:18:41 <jasta> there is a big difference.
May 14 01:18:44 <doc_savage> button is lit up if wifi is on, dark if off
May 14 01:19:11 <doc_savage> yeah, I see what you mean, like if it's on, but not associated to an access point?
May 14 01:19:22 <jasta> you really have 3 states here: wifi off | wifi on / connected | wifi on / disconnected.  to represent them all, you'd need a toggle button for wifi off/on, and an indicator for connected.
May 14 01:19:47 <jasta> or you can just not show wifi connected status, and avoid the topic entirely.
May 14 01:20:18 <doc_savage> does the icon in the notification bar indicate whether it's connected?
May 14 01:20:22 <jasta> yes
May 14 01:20:29 <jsharkey> well, it only appears once connected
May 14 01:20:33 <jsharkey> it doesnt have a connecting state
May 14 01:20:43 <jasta> but the settings app does.
May 14 01:21:00 <jasta> so it would be best to include a connecting/connected/whatever indicator as well as a toggle button
May 14 01:21:00 <doc_savage> cool, so my button can just be for on/off, and the notification bar for when it's connected, or as you say, have a separate icon for the connected status
May 14 01:21:03 <jasta> and then include status as well
May 14 01:21:26 <doc_savage> ok cool, I'm learning :D
May 14 01:21:27 <jsharkey> (didnt the wifi control move to secure settings in 1.5?)
May 14 01:21:42 <doc_savage> it's letting me toggle it, so I'm guessing not (I'm on 1.50
May 14 01:21:48 <jsharkey> oh cool
May 14 01:22:02 <doc_savage> i think GPS was, if I'm not imaging it
May 14 01:23:50 <jasta> traffic is so bad today im not sure ill get to go home ever :(
May 14 01:24:05 <jasta> solid red for my entire 20mi drive.
May 14 01:24:16 <doc_savage> ouch
May 14 01:44:56 <jsharkey> jasta: work from home, or live at office?  ;)
May 14 01:48:11 <kc8pxy> who do i go to to get this android/eclipse issue solved?
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Thu May 14 02:59:57 2009