**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Wed Jan 20 02:59:59 2016 Jan 20 03:13:12 http://pastebin.com/E478T6y4 Jan 20 03:14:08 I need to get the size of the fragment or the usable space (not sure the right term here), but I end up with the size of the screen (which makes sense). How to get the size of the fragment? Jan 20 03:35:09 hi, what could be the problem with this? ninja: error: 'out/target/product/generic/obj/SHARED_LIBRARIES/libc++_intermediates/export_includes', needed by 'out/target/product/generic/obj/STATIC_LIBRARIES/libfusesideload_intermediates/import_includes', missing and no known rule to make it Jan 20 03:35:47 i got that after running `mm -j` in platform/bootable/recovery Jan 20 03:47:33 btw jessie jakewharton the onFailure of the OKHTTP request does NOT get called when onResponse has an error so who and where is that supposed to be caught? Jan 20 04:29:22 on androidstudio how can I catch ANY exception thrown from MY code.....even if it's uncaught? I've messed with the settings and it always breaks on system code and i dont want that Jan 20 04:32:22 that's not something android studio does Jan 20 05:22:03 I just do not get it Jan 20 05:23:00 everytime I open my android studio I always get this message Internal error occurred and when I checked the event log it says button does not exist... I just even opened a new blank project yet this exist Jan 20 05:24:43 that's normal ;) Jan 20 05:24:55 ok, maybe not really Jan 20 05:25:02 but I get those too from time to time Jan 20 05:25:57 what could be the reson t behinf this Jan 20 05:26:05 i usually chief broken pipe :D Jan 20 05:26:09 *usually see Jan 20 05:41:37 Is it possible to create your own custom map ? i usually use googles api, but it looks so google. I want to make a map that looks like a map in WoW with art/theme, and keeps a static position that dosent move all over depending on where you are, so you have to find yourself on it Jan 20 05:43:54 It would probably involve lots of trial and error. Basically use location services, get latlng and repaint Jan 20 05:44:11 Interesting because a few years ago, somebody did the exact reverse: https://maps.marlam.in/ Jan 20 05:45:37 Thats pretty cool too Jan 20 05:51:31 JimHawking: no idea how openstreetmap does that Jan 20 05:51:45 but they provide few types of map Jan 20 06:31:15 Clojure 1.8 \o/ but was hoping for some android love Jan 20 06:31:51 Major Tom: Take your protein pills and put your helmet on. Jan 20 06:34:38 hamburger! Jan 20 06:44:01 hey guys. I am using a Custom viewgroup who onMeasure() alters a specific child's width and height. The child view has a Listview. the problem is that the child doesn't scroll fully to the extent of the contents it has Jan 20 06:44:22 how can i make the scrolling of the listview based on the contents ? Jan 20 06:44:33 hey sunny_slls, let me ask you a question Jan 20 06:45:01 Can you hear me, Major Tom? Jan 20 06:45:37 groundControl, yes please Jan 20 06:48:38 groundControl, you there ? Jan 20 06:49:31 sunny_slls is standing by .... Jan 20 06:49:35 there's no reply Jan 20 06:49:45 4 ... 3 ... 2 .. 1 ... Jan 20 06:50:06 Commencing countdown, Jan 20 06:50:07 engines on Jan 20 06:55:39 g00s, groundControl please help. I have tried everything but the i am not able to resolve this Jan 20 06:56:09 even if the list has 10 items, it shows only 4 items and doesn't scroll below to show other items in listview Jan 20 07:16:20 never mind . the problem was with onLayout() . Jan 20 07:48:02 Hello :). How do I create a custom project template in Android Studio ? Jan 20 07:52:36 NeoFrontier: i keep templates as skeletons in github and check out the one i need. would be interested if AS can do something though.. Jan 20 07:53:44 http://www.i-programmer.info/projects/215-mobile/6843-custom-projects-in-android-studio.html Jan 20 07:53:54 teasp00n, I am about to read that. Jan 20 08:28:53 Heya, easy one: How do I append a string to an existing string object without creating a new String object in the process? Jan 20 08:31:02 (or I think its an easy one. pretty sure i've done this before) Jan 20 08:31:33 String objects are immutable i'm afraid Jan 20 08:32:09 look at StringBuilder instead Jan 20 08:32:13 pardon me while I hide away now Jan 20 08:32:20 (thanks) Jan 20 08:32:49 that's probably what I thought of, Stringbuilder as opposed to concatenating with + Jan 20 08:37:46 hei, is anyone using libvlc? Jan 20 08:39:20 i want the screen to go black after the last frame Jan 20 08:43:25 problem is that im transforming the surfaceholder to fit in the middle of the screen no matter what resolution the video is - now playing in a loop results in a ugly flickering Jan 20 08:47:53 no one? Jan 20 08:55:44 Hey guys, is there any workaround on how to implement onclicklistener to a recyclerview item? Jan 20 08:56:18 Instead of doing it in Viewholder Jan 20 09:22:32 i'm trying to publish aar with gradle maven-publish and i can only include the aar with artifact("direct/to/file.aar") and not with from, i am losing the ability to have the dependencies in the generated .pom any insight on this? i've seen people using from but i dont know the artifact name Jan 20 09:46:10 more often opening gradle project google "bazel roadmap" Jan 20 09:48:11 well, maybe it's worth to search "idea to vim migration guide" instead Jan 20 09:48:19 but.. nah Jan 20 09:51:45 are you talking to me? Jan 20 09:53:56 listen its all good i just need to have dependencies in the pom Jan 20 09:54:36 nope, to myself Jan 20 09:54:43 have no twitter :( Jan 20 09:54:49 buy twitter Jan 20 09:55:03 how many instagramms ? Jan 20 09:55:08 5 Jan 20 09:55:10 maybe 7 Jan 20 09:55:27 have a change from ten? Jan 20 09:55:42 yes, in my jacket's pocket Jan 20 09:56:05 big man Jan 20 09:56:22 too much macdonald : Jan 20 09:56:24 ;( Jan 20 09:57:27 is it me, or taking picutes with camera on android is... too much boilerplate Jan 20 09:58:38 it's you Jan 20 09:59:58 Nick-S: never tried maven for android Jan 20 10:00:11 Nick-S: may be this will help https://github.com/secondsun/maven-android-plugin-aar-packaging Jan 20 10:00:41 its me and you and the entire human race Jan 20 10:00:50 gordon_: no hastle, just press big button below Jan 20 10:01:21 this is not it, this is maven not gradle Jan 20 10:03:45 Nick-S: ah, sorry, misread Jan 20 10:03:57 oh my fu*ing god Jan 20 10:04:59 there's a bit of help here : http://stackoverflow.com/questions/32339238/publish-aar-file-with-javadocs-attached-on-artifactory-repo Jan 20 10:10:50 non-self-discoverability of gradle really frustrates Jan 20 10:11:15 what do you mean Jan 20 10:11:31 feh_: damn Jan 20 10:11:33 if the android-library plugin would publish components things would be different Jan 20 10:41:42 can i have a maven artifact with optional dependencies? Jan 20 10:57:27 Hi, is there a file on the android system with the mapping between the user id and the username for the android apps? Jan 20 10:58:39 a file? Jan 20 10:58:44 or an api? Jan 20 10:59:07 danijoo, a file, like /etc/passwd on Linux Jan 20 10:59:55 I doubt. And if there iss, you have no access to it Jan 20 11:00:03 at least from an app Jan 20 11:00:50 danijoo, so maybe the system only affects a user id to the app and the username is inferred from the user id? Jan 20 11:01:45 since all usernames for android apps look like u0_axxx Jan 20 11:02:01 no idea. why do you care about that? Jan 20 11:02:19 danijoo, just trying to understand Jan 20 11:08:28 danijoo: if that info isn't stored in a file, where would it be stored? Jan 20 11:09:53 I didnt say that Jan 20 11:10:06 I said its no file that an app has read access to Jan 20 11:10:16 because its irrelevant for app development Jan 20 11:11:39 danijoo, should I ask my question on #android? Jan 20 11:11:42 you said "I doubt [that there's a file mapping between the user id and username]" Jan 20 11:12:10 soulisson, android-root maybe Jan 20 11:12:19 ok Jan 20 11:20:57 weird, toolbar don't shows up in fragment if I include it as in , but it's visible if I place in right inside fragment layout Jan 20 11:23:29 ah, it wants width and height also Jan 20 11:42:27 For height just use ?attr/actionBarSize Jan 20 11:42:43 That scales properly in landscape or on tablets Jan 20 11:46:39 yeah, just not sure why I need to specify it inside tag Jan 20 12:04:24 Is there any way for Android to mark other classes as broken when I make a breaking change in a class they depend on, unlike Eclipse Android Studio just marks one or two files sometimes and the rest come one by one when trying to rebuild, I would like for it to be marked as broken as soon as I save the class I'm working in Jan 20 12:10:23 why not trying to re-build more often? Jan 20 12:10:54 VnM: enabled automatic re-build? Jan 20 12:11:10 It's on by default in eclipse and idea, but off by default in "Android Studio" Jan 20 12:11:33 Rebuild doesn't mark all the classes either though Jan 20 12:12:19 Not till I open them anyway Jan 20 12:13:51 and if you refresh your project list? (F5) Jan 20 12:13:54 hey guys. i need help with Android TV. I'd like to implement a GuidedStepFragment in the player activity. YouTube has that kind of feature. I'd like to trigger the GuidedStepFragment when the user clicks on the HQ Icon, so he can select which streaming quality he wants. Jan 20 12:14:23 How can I make the GuidedStepFragment to be semi transparent, just like YouTube's, so the user can see the video player in the background? Jan 20 12:16:40 Nah refreshing/rebuilding/resyncing doesn't seem to be doing the trick, only opening the files will mark them red in the project view afterwards feh_ Jan 20 12:17:48 ok thats strange - it does with my installation (eclipse mars with android plugin) on rebuild it says project has errors and marks the files for me Jan 20 12:17:55 Which is rather frustrating when refactoring a huge project, trying to deploy after some changes and having to retry a dozen time for new classes to show up as broken Jan 20 12:18:02 Yeah it works in Eclipse, just not in Android Studio Jan 20 12:20:15 Intellij has some pretty great refactoring tools that would probably solve a lot of your issues Jan 20 12:20:33 ah ok, i dont use androidstudio - i tried it once but somehow i have to say eclipse is more comfortable to work with Jan 20 12:22:40 With the official ADT support ending I decided to start my new projects in Android Studio, I still prefer Eclipse but having to use 3rd party projects I figured it'd be easier moving on to AS, till late last year all my development was done in Eclipse Jan 20 12:37:16 I also mainly worked with eclipse and moved over to android studio. My general feeling is that Android Studio runs a bit smoother for Android Dev. Jan 20 12:45:23 Hey gang Jan 20 12:47:28 * NeoFrontier runs Jan 20 12:47:37 Gangstas !!!! Jan 20 12:56:23 hithere Jan 20 12:56:35 I am running search method (not thread safe) in Thread (started from MainActivity). onQueryTextChange(...) I do Thread.interrupt, initiate and start new thread. Problem is that Thread.interrupt takes in my case arround 750ms. I do want to lower cpu burden, which means rewriting search method to be thread safe is not acceptable. Is there a way to kill immediately? Jan 20 12:57:10 to kill running thread immediately Jan 20 12:59:52 sounds like you want to show search suggestions Jan 20 13:02:53 something like that - i would like to have GUI as responsive as possible, especially on slower devices Jan 20 13:03:44 why dont you use the api thats made for that? Jan 20 13:04:15 which API do you mean? Jan 20 13:04:23 rbb Jan 20 13:04:43 SuggestionAdapter Jan 20 13:11:08 guys I've got android:drawable="?android:selectableItemBackground" in the items of my RecyclerView to add the ripple effect. But these items need to be selected and visually show that (i.e. show a gray background) when you click on them Jan 20 13:11:09 how do I do that? Jan 20 14:06:08 bolovanos, thread.interrupt does not take 750ms Jan 20 14:06:17 if it does, you're doing something else Jan 20 14:15:36 pfn, probably it is that initiated search method I have initiated in MainActivity and I am passing to that thread Jan 20 14:16:42 if you mean it takes 750ms for your thread to stop after being interrupted, then you need to check for interruption faster Jan 20 14:16:58 mean initiated search class... Jan 20 14:17:22 because it terminates almost immediately if I suppress running this search method within running Thread and instead run Thread.sleep Jan 20 14:18:48 pfn, running this http://pastebin.com/LSxUDcdV in thread instead searching stops pretty fast - few ms Jan 20 14:19:40 of course, because interrupt ends sleep Jan 20 14:19:40 pfn, by saying it need around 750ms to stop thread running search method, I mean Jan 20 14:20:04 then your thread needs to check for interruption Jan 20 14:20:04 pfn, mm so this test did nothing Jan 20 14:20:33 to proof whether it will work or not, as I could see on case with search method Jan 20 14:21:12 sleep is interruptible, that's why it stops immediately Jan 20 14:21:24 read jcip, come back after you do Jan 20 14:24:23 <_SASDOE> Adding an image background to a relative layout causes lagginess and skipped frames. How come and how can I fix this other than simply removing the image Jan 20 14:27:09 pfn, you mean read 384 pages of this http://www.amazon.com/Java-Concurrency-Practice-Brian-Goetz/dp/0321349601 , in other word my problem leads to something what is essence of java? Jan 20 14:33:28 How do I pass MainActivity to an external class file as seen on line 14 here: http://pastie.org/10695275 Jan 20 14:34:19 bolovanos, your problem is basic java concurrency Jan 20 14:35:19 I've already told you why Jan 20 14:35:31 because you don't check for interruption often enough Jan 20 14:36:24 pfn, was not sure whether I understand it clearly - because it pointed at search class "correction" Jan 20 14:36:31 pfn, thanks Jan 20 14:41:25 somebody has a good profiling tutorial? Jan 20 14:41:56 why would you need a tutorial, launch monitor, run systrace Jan 20 14:42:39 look at how long things take, fix them Jan 20 14:48:50 pfn, well, I'm getting a lot of "art: Suspending all threads took" messages in logcat Jan 20 14:48:57 it shouldn't be normal Jan 20 14:50:26 hey guys. Android TV help needed. How can I make the GuidedStepFragment's background transparent? Just like YouTube's app, when you play a movie and press the HQ button, a GuidedStepFragment shows up with a list of the quality options, and on the left panel you can see the player and the video playing. Jan 20 14:51:51 right now i'm getting the GuidedStepFragment to show, but the background on the left is not transparent. Jan 20 15:03:41 guys anyone with Android TV experience? Please it's urgent Jan 20 15:38:16 lazz, most of us dont do TV here :/ Jan 20 15:39:43 Also ask the damn question :) Jan 20 15:39:53 ^^ Jan 20 15:39:55 danijoo: yeah, I found a way tho :D If anyone's interested, I was adding the GuidedStepFragment into a new Activity, that's why I couldn't see what's behind it. Now I've transfered the triggering code in one of the player's control buttons and it's all good :) Jan 20 15:40:10 Mavrik: I did ask above :) Jan 20 15:46:03 I am trying to pass my activty to my asynctask, but i'm getting an error on line 21 "android.context.Content in ProgressDialog connot be applied..." http://pastie.org/10695335 Jan 20 15:46:50 show the whole trace, Jan 20 15:47:29 oh well.. a WeakReference of an activity is not an activity Jan 20 15:47:37 so you cant pass it as context Jan 20 15:48:42 danijoo: http://pastie.org/10695338 Jan 20 15:49:00 what I said ^ Jan 20 15:49:26 danijoo: well i'm just trying to find the best way to have access to the UI from within my asynctask. But everything I read states to be sure to use a weakreference to make sure you don't cause memory leaks Jan 20 15:50:33 eh, leaking activity from an asynctask is largely not a problem at all Jan 20 15:51:06 what you do want to be sure of is that you don't call on the activity while it is "dead" Jan 20 15:51:36 pfn, so you're telling me not to use a weakreference? Jan 20 15:51:42 yeah what pfn said Jan 20 15:51:46 there's no reason to Jan 20 15:52:13 asynctask should never be used for anything that runs for any extended period of time Jan 20 15:52:17 even if you leak the activity in an async task, its only for the view ms-s the task runs Jan 20 15:52:34 and because of that nature, leaking an activity for that amount of time is irrelevant Jan 20 15:53:48 you probably want something like this: http://pastebin.com/6VYu02N4 Jan 20 15:54:11 arg.. thats wrong Jan 20 15:54:43 now its k: http://pastebin.com/vLxKQmr8 Jan 20 16:02:00 Hello, guys I am having problems with the Android Studio new project can anyone help me? Jan 20 16:02:13 http://imgur.com/jacoj Jan 20 16:03:48 Hey danijoo, its not about stack its about screen resolution Jan 20 16:03:50 danijoo: thanks, that is what i was doing prior, but my concern was after reading about using a weakreference to prevent mem leaks Jan 20 16:04:16 TECFALL, thats only relevant if your thread runs for hours Jan 20 16:04:24 which it shouldnt if you use an async task Jan 20 16:04:48 danijoo, it doesn't. But if it were to run for a long time what would you use? Jan 20 16:05:00 http://prntscr.com/9sk5id this is what happens it won't let me see the next, close buttons ... Jan 20 16:05:09 a proper thread encapsulated by a service Jan 20 16:05:10 hope you don't mind all the questions... just learning Jan 20 16:05:17 pfn, gotcha. Jan 20 16:05:25 I've tried changing sizes, screen resolution Jan 20 16:05:38 TECFALL, a service Jan 20 16:06:04 danijoo: One other question if you don't mind... Is it good practice to use an async task when fetching from a local sqlite db? Jan 20 16:06:05 a service alone is not sufficient Jan 20 16:06:05 what size is that monitor? 1 inch? Oo Jan 20 16:06:36 TECFALL, depends on the context. a loader is another good way to do that Jan 20 16:06:47 but yes. asynctask will work for that Jan 20 16:06:49 danijoo: its 7 inches Jan 20 16:08:02 Danielpe, seems like AS is not optimized to run on postage stamps :/ Jan 20 16:08:30 (no offense) Jan 20 16:08:46 I understand Jan 20 16:08:47 hello Jan 20 16:08:59 Danielpe, but that sucks. you should fill out a bug report Jan 20 16:09:14 But it's a nuissance, most people are going for smaller computers Jan 20 16:09:38 If I have an Object I want to pass into an intent which has an unserializable field. What do I do? Wrap it in a weak reference? Jan 20 16:10:03 danijoo: Where can I report it ? Jan 20 16:10:49 a loader sucks for retrieving data Jan 20 16:10:58 learn to use stuff like jdeferred.org Jan 20 16:11:26 SleepyPikachu, if its not serializeable, you cant pass it into an intent Jan 20 16:11:34 i am trying to get some unit tests which originally ran on eclipse to work in android studio. The original developer is gone and I am pickup from his work. The app runs if built from androidstudio. I've moved some of the tests to unit tests and instrumentation tests. Some of the instrumentation tests with a failure about requiring junit 3.8+. My build.gradle file has 4.1.2 specified as in the android developers page. I've Jan 20 16:11:34 read this is a problem with jar file ordering but my project structure does not have any module dependencies so I am unsure how to proceed. Jan 20 16:12:15 davis, junit 3 and 4 are incompatible Jan 20 16:12:36 danijoo: Ok, thinking about it I see why. Jan 20 16:15:59 oddly it now works. i just let it sit there for a while. Jan 20 16:44:45 Hi all, does anyone know if there is a way to access the sd-card root directory with write access in Android 5.0 without requiring a user prompt? Jan 20 16:52:26 Devthor, fortunatly there is no way Jan 20 16:52:35 thats the point of the permission system Jan 20 16:54:04 Android 5.0 does not require a prompt Jan 20 16:54:43 yeah its 6.. Jan 20 16:54:55 I implied its a typo Jan 20 16:56:38 Android 5.0 doesn't? I'm trying to write a custom filesystem to the sdcard, not following the /Android/[package]/data format Jan 20 16:56:56 though since this is a custom device, I could always modify the sdcard permissions, just trying to see if there was a way through the normal channels Jan 20 16:57:13 pfn, Android 5.0 does require a prompt. Jan 20 16:57:14 :) Jan 20 16:57:26 (For actual SD card on devices which have internal storage.) Jan 20 16:57:35 Mavrik, in the Play Store yes Jan 20 16:57:51 pfn, nope, you need to do the SAF prompt to get write access to SD Jan 20 16:57:56 Since KitKat actually. Jan 20 16:58:11 Yeah, that's what I was finding, a bit tricky since this device doesn't have a display ;) Jan 20 16:58:16 that's only when you want to use SAF not file IO Jan 20 16:58:23 I'll modify the permissions then, thank you Jan 20 16:59:00 Devthor, system apps are automatically granted permissions from manifest Jan 20 17:00:52 hey guys. I am getting this error. AndroidManifest.xml:210: error: Error: No resource found that matches the given name (at 'value' with value '@integer/google_play_services_version'). the problem is my friend told me that was related to google messaging services, gms, I can't find any gms under the android sdk -> sdk tools -> table listing. I see the google play services, but they are Jan 20 17:00:52 installed and at the latest version. Jan 20 17:01:17 PhoenixFyre, you're not actually including play services as a dependency. Jan 20 17:01:22 PhoenixFyre, show your gradle file Jan 20 17:01:39 give me a second to place it on pastebin Jan 20 17:07:54 danijoo here it is, http://pastebin.com/NJ7V0847 Jan 20 17:10:46 the other one Jan 20 17:11:45 which one? Sorry, I am really new to android studio. I was an eclipse dev until a few days ago. Jan 20 17:11:57 there are only 2. this is the wrong one :p Jan 20 17:12:06 app/build.gradle Jan 20 17:12:10 danijoo where is it usually found? Jan 20 17:12:22 ok, let me check. sorry. Jan 20 17:12:44 gimme a second, I found it. let me place it on pastebin Jan 20 17:12:59 last ¨second¨ was 10 mins :D Jan 20 17:17:16 danijoo here ya go. :) http://pastebin.com/fzmZX7Gf Jan 20 17:19:17 newest version is 8.4 but it should work with yours too Jan 20 17:19:43 not sure whats wrong. have you tried cdleaning the project and do you have all the play services repos installed in sdk manager? Jan 20 17:19:55 no to the first, yes to the second. Jan 20 17:19:59 how do you cleanthe project? Jan 20 17:20:09 theres a button in AS Jan 20 17:20:34 can I find it n one of the menus? Jan 20 17:20:45 eclipse had a nifty project menu and it was there. Jan 20 17:24:14 yes. you can find it in one of the menus... Jan 20 18:22:37 hello can I getInstrumentation within a class which extends AndroidTestCase? Jan 20 18:26:14 davis, look at apidoc, it's pretty clear Jan 20 18:27:20 Hey what up? Jan 20 18:32:59 i replaced extends AndroidTestCase to InstrumentationTestCase Jan 20 18:33:27 then i can use getInstrumentation.getContext() Jan 20 18:34:50 davis, apidoc > * Jan 20 19:00:32 Hello! After ferociously rotating the screen, my fragments lose saved instance state Jan 20 19:00:56 Gently rotating the screen does not result in the same problem. It is as if the data is lost between two quick rotations Jan 20 19:15:43 Chris Banes has been pretty quiet lately .. wonder what he's working on :D Jan 20 19:16:10 on how to not be killed by angry devs Jan 20 19:18:11 magic, what else would he be working on Jan 20 19:19:10 hmm, when do IO tickets go on sale, might have to try hopelessly signing up again Jan 20 19:20:03 how would i iterate through JSON as such? {"success":"1","contracts":["640L1","640L2","640L3"]} I need to get the value of success and then loop through contracts. Jan 20 19:23:12 TECFALL: you can you use JSONObject to parse the data and the related API to consume the data. Gson also provides a pretty nice API if you take the time to set it up Jan 20 19:23:31 *Gson provides a *nice* api, where JSONObject doesn't Jan 20 19:24:00 explodes: I am currently using JSONObject, but i guess i'm struggling how to loop through it correctly to grab success and contracts. Jan 20 19:24:38 grab the "contracts" item as a JSONArray and iterate over the contracts Jan 20 19:25:14 TECFALL: https://code.google.com/p/json-simple/wiki/DecodingExamples Jan 20 19:43:07 hey JakeWharton I'm trying to remember when you posted something about code coverage statistic being mostly useless. Was that a blog or just a reddit comment or something. Tl;DR about it? Jan 20 19:47:17 explodes, i still can't get this to work for some reason: {"success":"1","contracts":["640L1","640L2","640L3"]} Jan 20 19:47:19 ooops Jan 20 19:47:27 explodes: http://pastie.org/10695514 Jan 20 19:48:10 pastie just went down Jan 20 19:48:19 we’re doomed Jan 20 19:49:41 explodes: http://pastebin.com/34LXaYZn Jan 20 19:50:34 TECFALL: why not this: http://pastebin.com/2X9ysxRb Jan 20 19:52:44 explodes: well, why not... haha thanks! that worked. I don't know why i was redefining the object Jan 20 19:53:59 eghdk: I don't know what Jake has written about it, but here is an article: http://blog.ploeh.dk/2015/11/16/code-coverage-is-a-useless-target-measure/ and the TL;DR is that it is writing tests that achieve coverage doesn't mean you have covered the relevant eventualities, and writing tests for never-failing code is boring, which makes achieving coverage a chore, which makes you take shortcuts. Jan 20 20:11:00 Hello Jan 20 20:11:12 if you request a page from an Android app - what is the first param in the HTTP_USER_AGENT header? Jan 20 20:15:10 Hello, I'm having trouble loading the emulator with my AVD, keep getting Unknown Target on the API, although I've got the requested one installed. Any help? Jan 20 20:24:09 Does onCreate get called no matter what method is called within the class? Jan 20 20:24:43 huh Jan 20 20:29:54 TECFALL: Yes, and no. Once android has decided to open an activity, there is no method you can call to stop it from invoking onCreate() (unless you do something silly like intentionally throwing exceptions during instance creation), but you can also create instances of an activity that you invoke methods on where android never starts the lifecycle at all. Jan 20 20:30:36 (no idea why you would actually do the latter though) Jan 20 20:30:48 i would posit that doing the later is a serious code smell Jan 20 20:38:35 a code smell? a downright gtfo smell Jan 20 20:42:25 yeah its horrible :/ Jan 20 20:42:27 both.. Jan 20 20:57:06 Is it normal for android devices to send "Dalvik" as user agent? Jan 20 20:57:13 do all android devices do that or only mine? Jan 20 21:13:34 I wrote an EditText view which has syntax highlighting for several languages, history, undo/redo, etc. Thinking of open sourcing it. Does anyone want to test out the sample app? Would like some feedback Jan 20 21:13:55 http://jaredrummler.com/files/bamboo-editor-beta.apk Jan 20 21:14:46 oops... that was the first build with proguard.. looks like there are some crashes. ignore that Jan 20 21:15:09 Hey guys, got a question about new permissions. Whenever user revoked some permission and process is terminated, is there anyway to clear all tasks and when they come back, we can relaunch the app without any tasks? Jan 20 21:15:13 AS 2.0 Preview 6 Jan 20 21:29:41 wwang, huh Jan 20 21:31:37 any idea? Jan 20 21:32:40 wwang, your question makes no sense Jan 20 21:34:55 -S Jan 20 21:35:08 whoops, sorry about that. Jan 20 21:35:31 +S .. just to balance the universe again ;) Jan 20 21:35:38 I'm trying to do this because my cached data is lost when process is terminated and go back to previous task requires cached data... Jan 20 21:35:55 how is this related to permissions Jan 20 21:35:59 what do you mean with task? Jan 20 21:36:11 you mean your app crashes because a permission isn't granted? Jan 20 21:36:12 lol Jan 20 21:36:14 activity Jan 20 21:36:26 i dont get you Jan 20 21:36:38 just ask for a permission evreytime you dont have it but need it Jan 20 21:36:42 problem solved Jan 20 21:36:44 no, its because terminated process Jan 20 21:36:56 what do permissions have to do with anything Jan 20 21:36:56 here's a crazy idea: if the cached data is absent, fetch it? Jan 20 21:37:19 truckcrash, omg, that's so crazy Jan 20 21:37:59 i still dont get the permission thing.. Jan 20 21:44:24 Hi all, for android studio 2 preview 5 - when i launch android studio - it shows up in the task manager, but doesn't ever appear visible to me Jan 20 21:44:37 any idea why that would happen? Jan 20 21:44:59 LetterRip may as well get preview 6 Jan 20 21:45:14 ah did it just appear? Jan 20 21:45:57 ah yeppers Jan 20 21:46:04 thanks g00s will give it a try Jan 20 21:54:33 LetterRip, in the future, if you run Android Studio from the command line, sometimes you can helpful see log messages there if no gui shows up Jan 20 21:55:38 alright.. fixed the crashes introduced by proguard. any feedback would be appreciated. http://jaredrummler.com/files/bamboo-editor-beta2.apk Jan 20 21:56:13 > Overall, a large majority of the American public were personally convinced that global warming is happening (71%). Surprisingly, however, only 48 percent believed that there is consensus among the scientific community, while 40 percent of Americans believed there is a lot of disagreement among scientists over whether global warming is occurring. Thus, many Americans appeared to have already made up their minds, without waiting for a perceived Jan 20 21:56:13 scientific consensus. Further, 69 percent of Americans believed that global warming is caused mainly by human activities (57%), or caused equally by humans and natural changes (12%), while only 29 percent believed it is caused mostly by natural changes in the environment. - See more at: http://environment.yale.edu/climate-communication/article/american-opinions-on-global-warming-a-yale-gallup-clearvision-poll#sthash.F1ddweGo.dpuf Jan 20 21:56:28 this fucking js... I only copy-pasted a single sentence >_> Jan 20 21:56:36 and it adds all that bullshit Jan 20 21:56:51 justJanne, wrong channel Jan 20 21:57:33 justJanne you might like this http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0385535597 Jan 20 21:57:49 <_genuser_> global warming is a myth. Jan 20 21:57:57 _genuser_ lol Jan 20 21:57:58 <_genuser_> android development, tho, sounds somewhat real... Jan 20 21:58:04 i swear you index amazon, g00s ... you have a book link for 'everything' Jan 20 21:58:04 <_genuser_> g00s: :) Jan 20 21:58:08 surf2b1: yes, indeed Jan 20 21:58:13 I wanted to post to ##political_chat Jan 20 21:58:24 hah. I wish global warming was a myth, the weather would get less insane here Jan 20 21:58:28 but yale.edu’s JS turned a half-sentence I copy-pasted into this monster Jan 20 21:58:35 <_genuser_> bankai_: he could be an amazon shill. Jan 20 21:58:43 isn't that called copyjacking or something Jan 20 21:59:44 Yes, it is. Jan 20 21:59:47 And it’s annoying. Jan 20 22:00:05 <_genuser_> what's annoying is not being able to finish an app quickly. Jan 20 22:00:16 <_genuser_> it baloons intoa full blown application requiring lot of things. Jan 20 22:00:33 _genuser_: I know that feeling :/ Jan 20 22:01:26 First I had to write a type of list that allows modifications on multiple threads, but caches them and applies them on the main thread, thereby also notifying any listener attached (for example one can attach a recyclerview adapter, so the notifyItemInserted etc is properly called) Jan 20 22:01:32 _genuser_ just set minSdk=21 and you could be done ! Jan 20 22:01:43 * g00s just set minSdk = 19 Jan 20 22:01:46 then I am now writing an additional version that allows to do this with a tree of items. Jan 20 22:02:21 so I have a tree of elements, and each node can get additional child nodes, or child nodes can be removed. And the recyclerview has to be properly updated, and nodes can be expanded or collapsed... Jan 20 22:03:02 it’s now getting larger and larger, and I am wondering why Android has nothing like this per default. Even worse, why is there no ExtensibleRecyclerView in AppCompat? Jan 20 22:03:21 ExpandableRecyclerView ? Jan 20 22:03:57 i think at the summit, they said RV was still being worked on a bit, and once thats done we will see more convenience things Jan 20 22:04:05 yeah, like that. Isn’t existing per default – you can get ExpandableListView, but not one RecyclerView version Jan 20 22:04:25 And now I am here developing this stupid lib to properly display a tree of nodes correctly updated Jan 20 22:15:43 In the hope that I can actually use it properly one day. Jan 20 22:16:00 Android is this annoying world where you have to write so many of your libraries yourself Jan 20 22:16:21 even Win32, WPF, Qt, Gtk, Cocoa – all contain tree display widgets. Jan 20 22:16:43 i can see being mobile, tree is kinda hard to do beyond 2 levels Jan 20 22:17:01 but yeah, as they want to push more in to tablets and larger, maybe some better widgets are needed Jan 20 22:17:16 Even a 2-level widget would be nice. Jan 20 22:17:28 RV is still 'work in progress' Jan 20 22:17:29 It would also be nice if the whole notifyItemInserted etc would be an interface, Jan 20 22:17:36 crazy its been a few years :) Jan 20 22:17:44 and if it was compatible with SortedList, Jan 20 22:17:53 which uses notifyItemAdded and similar for its callback Jan 20 22:18:52 justJanne i'm surprised google never had anything like cwac-merge, i'm probably going to have to do something like that for RV also Jan 20 22:19:09 seems so basic to stuff a list with pieces of other lists Jan 20 22:19:32 yes, that would make the whole node stuff a lot easier Jan 20 22:19:48 i procrastinate as much as i can, in hope google does that so I don't waste time :D Jan 20 22:19:58 it would also be nice if recyclerview had a concept of elements being subelements of another element Jan 20 22:20:11 that would allow stuff like section headers and similar to be a lot easier Jan 20 22:21:01 justJanne its one step up from writing directly to video memory :D Jan 20 22:21:40 well, ignoring that we can’t even do that unless we use CVE-2016-0728, that’s practically what quite a few of android widgets actually do. Jan 20 22:22:57 (I’ve talked so much about that cve oh-seven-two-eight that I memorized its number – it’s the CVE for the bug that allows any user on a linux system to gain root privileges, and which applies to nearly all android devices, and won’t ever be patched on most of them) Jan 20 22:24:42 (It also gives you full access to the keyring – so any security of Android Pay is practically gone) Jan 20 22:27:01 i just use my device for dev so i'm safe :D Jan 20 22:27:38 and, even better, any way to detect this stuff in apps on the play store is easy to circumvent, thanks to the techniques that Google used in ReCaptcha Jan 20 22:28:09 (the way they recognize if a device is a human or a bot can also be used to recognize if a device is a real android device or the Bouncer) Jan 20 22:29:21 ClassyShark 5.2 does some method counting Jan 20 22:29:26 this is a cool project Jan 20 22:29:33 Google gave malware authors all the tools they needed. And with the "install directly from browser or search" feature, which doesn’t even show reviews or most of the description of the play store app, it will be really easy to convince users into installing an app Jan 20 22:30:01 add some bad SEO, and you can now easily get malware onto user devices which won’t be recognized by Google and leak the users Android Pay keys. Jan 20 22:30:14 Google compromised customizability for 0 security gain. Jan 20 22:30:36 so who wants to write the scary dangerous yet benign piece of malware that demonstrates the problem? Jan 20 22:30:37 * justJanne quacks ClassyShark 5.2 Jan 20 22:33:13 justJanne made a bad comparison for tree widgets, there is no tree widget in winmo, ios, blackberry or maemo Jan 20 22:33:42 indeed there isn’t, but then only one of those is ever used on a tablet. Jan 20 22:34:43 And iOS has several kinds of expandable table views easily available by third parties under MIT license Jan 20 22:35:10 right, by 3rd parties Jan 20 22:35:32 For Android not even that is readily available. Jan 20 22:35:49 I'm sure someone's written something Jan 20 22:35:58 and it's not too difficult to write something like that using recyclerview Jan 20 22:36:21 well, the table aspect is a pain in recyclerview, but not an expandable tree Jan 20 22:36:50 well, the ability to properly handle updates is an issue in every implementation I’ve seen before Jan 20 22:38:55 Luckily I managed to shrink to a 2-level hierarchy, and now use https://github.com/bignerdranch/expandable-recycler-view with quite a bunch of custom utils to provide lists that batch their updates and properly notify listeners on main thread (like the notifyItemInserted in the recyclerview) Jan 20 22:39:22 justJanne nice, thats handy Jan 20 22:39:41 yeah WP has had a tree view since ... at least 8.1 Jan 20 22:40:49 My start into developing mobile was when WP 8.0 came out, and I was at another uni attending an event for devs, and microsoft gave out devices to us and we started exploring the "new" APIs and stuff they provided. Jan 20 22:41:14 After that it was hard to return to Android, although stuff like ButterKnife made it definitely a lot easier. Jan 20 22:41:53 truckcrash: good point I usually do that, but didn't this time for some reason Jan 20 22:42:08 justJanne there is also a bunch of stuff on android arsenal Jan 20 22:42:50 g00s: yeah, I spent about a month going through hundreds of libs on there, building small sample apps for myself to try out how the libs work, and if they’d solve my issues Jan 20 22:43:25 g00s: yep fresh download of preview6 seemed to fix whatever the issue was Jan 20 22:43:26 thanks Jan 20 22:43:35 LetterRip great Jan 20 22:43:42 one example was MikePenz’ MaterialDrawer lib, which is awesome – but makes it very hard to modify the items at runtime Jan 20 22:48:29 justJanne yeah, i was trying to do 2-level things with NavigationView but doesn't work well Jan 20 22:48:43 if they do what you need exactly its fine Jan 20 22:51:09 MikePenz’ MaterialDrawer supports 2-level things, but modifying items at runtime is very hard Jan 20 22:52:37 Ologn http://shop.oreilly.com/product/9781933820293.do Jan 20 22:53:49 with RV, notifydatasetChanged works a little differently than LV - i need to figure out how to tell everything to get new values without recreating all the view holders; the items are constant ... just some data in each one changes Jan 20 22:54:08 then notifyItemChanged Jan 20 22:54:22 notifyItemChanged (all the items) causes problems Jan 20 22:54:29 (they all change at the same time) Jan 20 22:56:07 then notifyItemRangeChanged Jan 20 22:56:10 you know, developing UI stuff for Android might be easier if every manipulation of UI stuff was actually done with pure functions applied to a list, and all manipulations were reactive functional. Jan 20 22:56:29 you can clojure Jan 20 22:56:44 pfn yeah i tried notifyItemRangeChaned (all the things) Jan 20 22:56:49 "There are two different classes of data change events, item changes and structural changes. Item changes are when a single item has its data updated but no positional changes have occurred. Structural changes are when items are inserted, removed or moved within the data set." Jan 20 22:57:08 i would say there are 3 , not 2 : item changes (all items) which are not structural Jan 20 22:58:45 when i tried notifyItemRangeChanged, there was visible flicker Jan 20 22:59:25 maybe, i'll try that again, newer support lib then when i tried last Jan 20 23:08:57 dafuq is that.. http://crashes.to/s/deb41843657 Jan 20 23:11:19 oh no, everyone knows what you wrote now Jan 20 23:11:31 :P Jan 20 23:12:15 TextView seem to not work with texts of size -1 or what is this telling me.. Jan 20 23:12:20 ^^' Jan 20 23:13:02 83 threads ? Jan 20 23:14:20 dunno what all this is Jan 20 23:14:27 ha Jan 20 23:14:34 a lot of RXjava i guess Jan 20 23:14:48 + adcompanys with their shitty sdks Jan 20 23:15:32 yeah at least 6 threads are annotated with Rx. + another 4 for Retrofit Jan 20 23:15:48 Is it this? http://stackoverflow.com/questions/17047172/android-java-lang-arrayindexoutofboundsexception-length-10-index-10 Jan 20 23:16:07 Oh, your index is -1. But it still might be that. Jan 20 23:16:22 TacticalJoke, thanks. yeah maybe Jan 20 23:16:40 problem is the stacktrace does not show which TextView is the cause -_- Jan 20 23:17:24 the best part is that the line numbers don't match Jan 20 23:18:15 you mean the line numbers in TextView.java? Jan 20 23:18:30 no, staticlayout Jan 20 23:19:12 and staticlayout hasn't changed since android 4.4 Jan 20 23:19:21 blame LG Jan 20 23:19:33 yeah i guess. Jan 20 23:19:42 3 reports is negletable anyways. Jan 20 23:19:57 im just having a close eye right now because i pushed a bug update to play store Jan 20 23:20:11 g00s, http://nycuxpa.org/event-2131284 Jan 20 23:20:49 g00s, it is sold out though Jan 20 23:21:07 :( Jan 20 23:23:20 He works at WeWork...the Android Developers meetup was there last Thursday...he didn't speak though Jan 20 23:25:04 my nexus 9 has lasted forever in doze mode, heh Jan 20 23:25:12 59% battery left doing nothing since like the 15th Jan 20 23:25:23 that's rather impressive Jan 20 23:25:49 i wonder how often apps were allowed to sync during that time Jan 20 23:26:05 especially on the last days Jan 20 23:33:10 does anyone here use contants for their putExtra() for creating intents to next activities? how do you handle having multiple activities which can accept an extra with the same key Jan 20 23:34:07 yes. Jan 20 23:34:26 for me its a static variable in the receiver activity Jan 20 23:34:31 what do you do if more than one activity uses the same extra, do you put those extras in a separate class? Jan 20 23:34:41 if 2 activities have the same, they still have a statch String each Jan 20 23:35:07 why not just duplicate the declaration? if the extra is used in two different activities is it really the same extra? Jan 20 23:35:17 damien5314: in this case, yes Jan 20 23:35:18 class MyActivity { public static String EXTRA_USER_ID = "userId" } Jan 20 23:35:28 If I'm trying to pass the same info through a whole flow of screens Jan 20 23:36:01 Ologn: did you mention WeWork? Jan 20 23:36:08 put it in a base activity class? Jan 20 23:36:08 still. duplicate it Jan 20 23:36:21 thay way you have clean activities that can be reused easily Jan 20 23:36:23 grekkos, the NYC Android meeting on Thursday was at WeWork Jan 20 23:36:24 only reason I didn't want to duplicate it is because it would have the same name Jan 20 23:36:45 my team is confusing some of them accidentally (because of auto complete) and using the wrong one in the wrong spot Jan 20 23:36:59 it works because the values are the same but if someone changed one of those values unintentionally it would break Jan 20 23:37:18 Ologn: oh it's in NYC? I think there's a WeWork in Seattle too, where are you based? Jan 20 23:38:07 danijoo: ah yeah I see what you're saying... this project is proprietary however so I don't think these activities are reusable by any means, except within the same project Jan 20 23:38:10 if an intent is targeted to ActivityXY, all intent extras should have a key thats a static in ActivityXY. thats how i keep it Jan 20 23:38:18 grekkos, I am based in NYC. Yes, it started in NYC I believe but went across the country and is even international now. Jan 20 23:38:38 yeah I like the keeping extras in the receiving activity rule Jan 20 23:38:42 some people I know work in the WeWork building I think in Seattle Jan 20 23:40:53 grekkos: if they’re really all the same, I don’t see a problem with putting them in a separate class. Intent defines, e.g., ACTION_VIEW, and anything can use that, but it comes from the framework. If several of your activities will have the same needs, I’d put them in a shared spot. Jan 20 23:43:58 if several activities require the same extras, it might also make sense to use a builder for that intent Jan 20 23:44:13 where the builder takes care of using the correct extra names Jan 20 23:45:32 i am a fan of intent builders Jan 20 23:45:57 i am also a fan of applying the newInstance pattern to activities Jan 20 23:46:03 as much as one can do that Jan 20 23:46:46 yeah I usually have a class that removes that whole logic out of my everyday code Jan 20 23:47:07 ActivityManager.moveToWhateverActivity(some params..) Jan 20 23:50:05 yeah actually I just made an Intent builder for one of my common activities that takes a lot of customizable options in Jan 20 23:51:20 the intent builder idea is interesting also, maybe we can use the same generic intent builder to make an intent for any given activity in the app that uses the very common intent thingers Jan 20 23:51:52 it's hard to make it typesafe Jan 20 23:52:05 not as a generic vlbuilder Jan 20 23:52:32 vl? Jan 20 23:52:48 typo Jan 20 23:52:52 oh Jan 20 23:52:54 heh Jan 20 23:53:03 well if it's returning an Intent i think it's fine Jan 20 23:53:31 can pass in packageContext and a Class like the regular Intent constructor and then build upon it with concrete methods that have very common extras Jan 20 23:53:56 I'll think about it some more, it could be a sign that something else is amiss, architecturally speaking Jan 21 00:34:14 Ologn this just came out, and has lots of good reviews http://www.amazon.com/Designing-Products-People-Love-Successful/dp/1491923679 Jan 21 00:34:43 i read a sample chapter on the 5 states of any UI, it was pretty good Jan 21 00:35:22 g00s, On HN they said one of the best books was the E-Myth Jan 21 00:35:49 g00s, what the book basically says is an expert in a field, like programming, or baking, starts a business Jan 21 00:36:08 Ologn what is the E-Myth book ? Jan 21 00:36:11 g00s, the problems they run into is everything OTHER THAN their expertise. Jan 21 00:36:15 not mythican man month ? Jan 21 00:36:29 Ologn, sounds like the peter principle Jan 21 00:36:36 everyone rises to level of their incompetence Jan 21 00:36:39 g00s, because mythical man month is within the scope of a product Jan 21 00:36:49 within the scope of a project rather Jan 21 00:37:21 dragorn, there is some overlap, but in this case the entrepreneur is running the whole business. So it's like the Peter Principle x 10. Jan 21 00:37:48 Ologn, yup. expertise at X doesn't make you good at business, relationships, etc. Jan 21 00:40:37 dragorn, yes. The parts of the business they have at their expertise, like programming, go well. But they don't account for the marketing, budgeting, accounting, sales etc. they have to do and get buried by it. Jan 21 00:45:23 each time when i move around layout(s) inside CollapsingToolbarLayout, i have to "clean" the project to avoid wrong cast because somehow the id are not (re?)generated properly Jan 21 00:45:26 :feelsadman: Jan 21 00:46:06 i notice that when I delete an ID in general, AS is clueless Jan 21 00:46:16 so you find that out on build Jan 21 00:46:33 i don't even delete any, i just move one view above or below another Jan 21 00:46:54 and it's only inside collapsingtoolbarlayout which this issue occurs, 100% repro Jan 21 00:47:02 AS is pretty strange. I copied a file from the Plaid app, and it had red markers for stuff I needed to adjust - got the whole file green, did a build, bam - more red markers Jan 21 00:47:20 yeah, that's another issue :[ Jan 21 00:47:34 i'm hoping very soon, i don't have to do a build to find errors Jan 21 00:47:35 you have to build the thing to see some errors appearing Jan 21 00:47:43 it's crazy man Jan 21 00:47:45 like , the way it was in 2010 ;) Jan 21 00:47:56 i'm really regretting the eclipse area, years ago now Jan 21 00:48:03 it was far less worst than that Jan 21 00:48:07 worse* Jan 21 00:49:30 this has made me so mad little by little that I hope to switch to another kind of job than android development/consultancy Jan 21 01:11:35 * pfn doesn't mind getting more business Jan 21 01:11:42 need to start finding peons Jan 21 01:12:03 An unskilled laborer? Jan 21 01:28:08 so what is brendan eich's new browser based on ? FF ? Jan 21 01:29:31 chromium Jan 21 01:32:20 Hi all. First application, gauging how deeply I should aim to go for the next ~4 months. I was hoping to hop on Skype with someone to discuss my project briefly, help me sort out some terminology, major milestones. I'm 32, decade in IT, networking, servers and security background, this might be my senior project for my Electrical Engineering degree Jan 21 01:32:20 unless you tell me minimal functionality is unattainable. Jan 21 01:34:22 majuk doubt anyone will hop on skype, but you're losing attention already without having asked a real question :D Jan 21 01:35:21 g00s: Don't have a specific question. Looking to have a conversation with someone. If that's acceptable in the main chat, ok, otherwise I imagine someone interested would PM Jan 21 01:37:14 It's hard to predict how someone new to Android will fare, but FWIW my general attitude towards Android programming, after a long, long time programming in general, is something like "It's not something you can just dip into briefly; it's more like a several-year-long pursuit". Jan 21 01:38:21 TacticalJoke: If it doesn't need to be /marketable/ but merely functional within a small subset of devices, do you feel that is accomplishable? Jan 21 01:38:25 Though I've only been doing Android stuff for one or two yeras. Jan 21 01:38:26 years* Jan 21 01:38:40 i think it depends on what you’re trying to do Jan 21 01:38:53 Location based group/match-making service Jan 21 01:38:57 Grindr for boardgames Jan 21 01:39:23 kind of strange senior design project for EE degree Jan 21 01:39:42 yeah, I assumed it would interact with a circuit or device of some sort Jan 21 01:39:54 I have some ideas for hardware components Jan 21 01:40:16 anyways, if you use something like Parse or Firebase as your backend, it should be fairly doable in 4 months, at least a quick n dirty version Jan 21 01:40:18 And that may be what I end up building over this timeframe while learning more XML and Java Jan 21 01:40:37 s73v3r: Nice. I'll check those out now. Jan 21 01:41:21 But if I can get traction on the cellphone end, I can have up to 2 groupmates and one guy I enjoy working with is ECompE Jan 21 01:42:17 So if we could both develop the application while also figuring out a hardware component, all the better. He hasn't written any Android apps that I'm aware of, but has a fair amount of Java experience. Jan 21 01:43:10 With interactive location-based, there will need to be a server and network components, but that fits into my experience in IT so that's nothing new. Jan 21 01:43:40 But I imagine that step is beyond our available timeline. Jan 21 01:46:19 Ok, well, next step would be outline my minimal functionality idea in activity/view/fragment terminology Jan 21 01:47:53 majuk: pm me some questions you have, ill try and answer them. ive used both Parse and a little Firebase as well Jan 21 01:48:40 orbyt_: Thanks! Jan 21 01:49:01 I'm surprised Kotlin 1.0 isn't out yet. Jan 21 01:49:38 I think they're actually gonna release a Beta 5. Then perhaps an RC. Jan 21 01:51:34 (Definitely an RC; the "perhaps" was about the number of betas before the RC.) Jan 21 01:51:40 TacticalJoke not much should change though, right? i mean, its useful to start a project in Jan 21 01:52:00 probably some crossing i's , dotting t's Jan 21 01:52:01 Yeah, I think so. Jan 21 01:54:36 TacticalJoke i keep hearing conflicting info about kotlin compilation speeds - on one hand, i hear its very slow Jan 21 01:54:52 other people say its normal, like javac speed Jan 21 01:55:20 since my machine is still pretty low spec, i take those things into consideration Jan 21 01:55:43 I've been out of touch with Kotlin for a few weeks. But I used to watch their Git repository, and I remember seeing a lot of changesets about incremental compilation (which, AFAIR, won't make it into 1.0). Jan 21 01:56:09 <_genuser_> kotlin? Jan 21 01:56:20 <_genuser_> I've probably heard of it before. Jan 21 01:56:45 * _genuser_ waits for someone to post a lmgtfy link Jan 21 01:57:00 _genuser_ its a conspiracy like climate change :P Jan 21 01:57:11 <_genuser_> haha, you remember my joke.. Jan 21 01:57:19 The first rule of Kotlin club: you discuss Kotlin as much as possible. Jan 21 01:57:21 i have to remember who is anti-science :) Jan 21 01:57:30 TacticalJoke lol Jan 21 01:57:40 <_genuser_> science shmience Jan 21 01:57:50 oh wait ! _genuser_ == shmoooz ? Jan 21 01:57:56 <_genuser_> if we can rub two sticks together, that's "stick-doing" not science.... Jan 21 01:58:05 <_genuser_> stick-doing makes fiyah!!! Jan 21 01:58:36 assertThat(_genuser_).isSameAs(shmoooz); Jan 21 01:58:50 Assertion failed! Jan 21 01:58:51 <_genuser_> TacticalJoke: that test case will not pass. Jan 21 01:59:02 <_genuser_> haha, and you made shmoooz leave Jan 21 01:59:44 I started the blah shmah fad Jan 21 02:00:15 _genuser_ wishes he was me Jan 21 02:00:28 <_genuser_> heh, you guys have a things against anti-science people? Jan 21 02:01:13 _genuser_ shun the nonbelievers :) Jan 21 02:01:22 shhuuunnn Jan 21 02:01:25 <_genuser_> nonbelievers of science? Jan 21 02:01:32 <_genuser_> wait, science requires belief too? Jan 21 02:01:39 there is a lot of bull science Jan 21 02:01:39 <_genuser_> then isn't everyone just one big happy family? Jan 21 02:01:42 * g00s wonder if anyone remembers Charlie the unicorn Jan 21 02:01:49 like global warming ;) Jan 21 02:02:03 Either you accept science or you work on your critical thinking until you do Jan 21 02:02:08 I guess it's most sensible to define 'science' as a process of investigation. The results of this process might be accurate or inaccurate. Jan 21 02:02:10 or psychology Jan 21 02:02:29 <_genuser_> I like science. and I like the scientific method. Jan 21 02:02:43 It has shown itself to be reliable, though (e.g., planes are safe). Jan 21 02:02:49 _genuser_ you're ok then ! Jan 21 02:02:51 hypothesus experiment proof Jan 21 02:03:03 repeatable experiment Jan 21 02:03:11 <_genuser_> what I do NOT believe in is: every scientist believes in position A, and if you don't then you're stupid. Jan 21 02:03:32 <_genuser_> I choose to use my own thinking and whether my conclusions are right or wrong, at least I'm constantly learning. Jan 21 02:03:33 ah, fun topic: epistemology Jan 21 02:04:02 <_genuser_> for example, there's a lot of people who say, I'm a scientist and there's no supernatural. Jan 21 02:04:29 If there’s general consensus in the science community and you reject it, you are choosing to believe something that’s very likely not true Jan 21 02:04:33 <_genuser_> come to find out they have a PhD in.... sociology. Jan 21 02:04:50 <_genuser_> or something. where they essentially have not qualifiations to be speaking of physical or metaphysical world, lol. Jan 21 02:05:09 _genuser_ usually what happens, is people spend most of their time validating their biases Jan 21 02:05:10 There’s just zero evidence that supernatural exists, so there is zero reason to believe in it. Jan 21 02:05:19 <_genuser_> jaana: if you're choosing to use your critical thinking, you're choosing to stay scientific. even if you conclusions are incorrect and not in line with the community. Jan 21 02:05:39 <_genuser_> jaana: once you follow the community blindly, then it turns into faith. that's the very same thing scientific community wishes to avoid. Jan 21 02:05:57 no, it’s not faith, you accept it because there’s preponderance of evidence for it Jan 21 02:06:27 <_genuser_> no you accept it because you trust the reputation of others. and their integrity. Jan 21 02:06:53 <_genuser_> overall, I think the best science teaches people is to think for themselves. Jan 21 02:06:54 No, there’s peer review and thousands of specialists who agree on a topic. Nothing to do with reputation or faith. Jan 21 02:07:11 <_genuser_> whether temporarily right or wrong, if they keep at it, they should arrive at the right conclusion. Jan 21 02:07:27 <_genuser_> or at least they're always in pursuit of truth/facts (whichever floats your boat), and that's admirable. Jan 21 02:07:56 it's the power of believe which makes up the world, guys Jan 21 02:08:03 <_genuser_> nothing to do with reputation... hmm, you must not have followed scientific community much. Jan 21 02:08:05 I have a feeling you’re following this path of reasoning because you believe something at odds with a scientific consensus and you want to feel better about it Jan 21 02:08:06 the mathematics of probability tell you there are infinite more intelligent alien lifeforms in all directions Jan 21 02:08:31 we just can't reach or see them ;) Jan 21 02:08:36 <_genuser_> jaana: no, I tend to just use my own reasoning. I find when there's two hardcore paths in any area, they tend to get jaded. Jan 21 02:08:36 shmoooz: No, the Drake equation quantifies this and it’s not infinite Jan 21 02:08:43 shmoooz do you think they are using android or ios ? Jan 21 02:08:43 <_genuser_> politics, religion, culture, anything. Jan 21 02:09:08 <_genuser_> but if we're talking beliefs.... I'll offer one of mine. Jan 21 02:09:26 <_genuser_> android team is running around like a headless chicken hoping something they do in UI design can be called innovative. Jan 21 02:09:31 <_genuser_> so everything changes every few months. Jan 21 02:09:38 _genuser_: Thinking for ourselves isn't necessarily a good thing. Imagine if someone had cancer and decided to "think for himself" instead of visiting doctors. We sometimes simply lack the knowledge to arrive at reasonable conclusions. Jan 21 02:09:43 <_genuser_> material design has so far already outlived most google UI fads, lol. Jan 21 02:09:58 <_genuser_> TacticalJoke: you're taking it out of context. Jan 21 02:10:08 TacticalJoke you mean like Steve Jobs ? Jan 21 02:10:10 I'm not saying we should be sheeple; just that a lot of this "Think for yourself" stuff is meaningless (and maybe even dangerous) platitude. Jan 21 02:10:21 <_genuser_> TacticalJoke: thinking for oursevles as in look at the facts ourselves. be diligent. Jan 21 02:10:37 <_genuser_> not rely on others to make really big statements and then say oh that one sounds like he's more educated, I'll do with him. Jan 21 02:10:39 everything keeps changing. ios is hardly a fixed ui paradigm, either. at least materiel seems to have some more guidance and thought from google than holo Jan 21 02:10:47 lol g00s. Exactly. Jan 21 02:10:54 thinking for yourself also means to know when to trust the research that others have done for you because they spent their lifetime studying it and you didn’t Jan 21 02:11:03 _genuser_: I agree; there are a lot of sheeple. Jan 21 02:11:06 if i recall, Steve's thing was treatable but he went the herbal route Jan 21 02:11:14 I think the point when you wouldn't have to redo the UI in your app every few years is long gone Jan 21 02:11:35 <_genuser_> thinking for youself or investigating can also mean figure out which institute or scientists are trustworthy. Jan 21 02:11:45 <_genuser_> who has better qualifications, and no other agendas. Jan 21 02:12:03 <_genuser_> who has objective presentations and those are peer reviewed and accepted. Jan 21 02:12:15 <_genuser_> then you can probably just go with those institutions or scientists. Jan 21 02:12:16 dragorn question is, how well does material work in VR ? that seems like the next UI frontier Jan 21 02:12:42 Definitely. I still have this feeling you’re believing something non standard and you’re just taking roundabout ways to go about it. What is it? You don’t believe in evolution? global warming? Jan 21 02:12:44 i think eventually we will be interacting with devices more through glasses, than looking at 4" screen Jan 21 02:12:45 g00s, i'm sure it'll be something that gets figured out over the next years, what the vr ui paradigm is Jan 21 02:12:57 <_genuser_> but I see lot of people write blogs claiming to be scientists and then have no qualifications in teh area where they're not qualified. Jan 21 02:13:19 Yeah, _genuser_. Spill the beans. :D Jan 21 02:13:25 g00s, sometime someone will figure out some consistent UI and then everyone will adopt something similar, like how the hamburger menu suddenly showed up everywhere Jan 21 02:13:27 <_genuser_> jaana: heh, believe what you will. Jan 21 02:13:37 <_genuser_> I choose not to blindly follow what's labelled scientific. Jan 21 02:13:37 Belief is not a choice, sadly. Jan 21 02:14:01 <_genuser_> for example, I find hawkings statements generally interesting. Jan 21 02:14:04 Ok so what specific part of something scientif do you not believe? Jan 21 02:14:11 <_genuser_> because if anything, he's proven he's always learning and providing ample evidence. Jan 21 02:14:32 as are most scientists Jan 21 02:14:45 <_genuser_> so that would be an example of something that's scientific that I might find worth believing. Jan 21 02:15:07 <_genuser_> another might be small time stuff some guy might be saying he's a scientist and posting. Jan 21 02:15:21 <_genuser_> this could be non hot button topics. Jan 21 02:15:47 <_genuser_> oh pomegranate juice fad for example. Jan 21 02:15:52 <_genuser_> scientists are saying it's the best thing. Jan 21 02:15:52 dragorn virtual material :) Jan 21 02:16:00 <_genuser_> next year, it's the acai berry. Jan 21 02:16:13 g00s, I don't do vr so i have no idea what the paradigm looks like for the UI currently Jan 21 02:16:17 g00s, makes me motion sick instantly Jan 21 02:16:20 <_genuser_> not much by the way of research of evidence. just "experts" are saying.... Jan 21 02:17:02 <_genuser_> dragorn: VR like the occlusion thing? Jan 21 02:17:25 dragorn or even augmented reality, like MS hololens Jan 21 02:17:36 augmented is a lot more interesting to me than VR Jan 21 02:17:44 <_genuser_> g00s: I'd like to play sim city in hololens. :) Jan 21 02:17:49 mostly because I imagine I can deal w/ it without instantly getting ill Jan 21 02:18:45 rayban will be back in 2030 Jan 21 02:19:09 Augmented ones give extra info to your surroundings which can greatly assist you while you're doing stuff Jan 21 02:19:25 While VR doesn't do much unless gaming Jan 21 02:20:27 Hololens is pretty cool tbh Jan 21 02:20:57 <_genuser_> simcity, some first person shooters, that's abot it. Jan 21 02:21:24 <_genuser_> oh need for speed!!! Jan 21 02:24:50 Grand theft auto :^) Jan 21 02:32:58 Any news on Android going OpenJDK soon? Jan 21 02:34:12 Is it gonna be part of Android N? Jan 21 02:40:02 rumors it'll be part of n, no-one knows but google for sure Jan 21 02:41:41 Nanaimo Bar! Jan 21 02:43:04 Is there going to be any difference with the current one? Jan 21 02:43:17 It's Android Nips Jan 21 02:43:49 is N going to be different? I'm sure it is. I also imagine we'll all found how different sometime around IO Jan 21 02:44:30 or N for Nerds Jan 21 02:44:43 Shall inherit them earth Jan 21 02:54:55 hmm, if I have a recycle bin and want to delete stuff via swipe to delete; inside of the recycle bin, should I have swipe to delete enabled (but without undo) or use a pain in the ass method to delete... Jan 21 02:56:56 pfn: are you making a file explorer for android ? Jan 21 02:58:43 let the user be able to enable or disable swipe delete from settings **** ENDING LOGGING AT Thu Jan 21 02:59:58 2016