**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sat Jun 25 02:59:58 2016
Jun 25 03:06:24 <Napalm> impulse: its called the "notification shade"
Jun 25 03:06:38 <Napalm> oh the settings part is quick settings yea
Jun 25 03:06:45 <impulse> oh ok
Jun 25 03:06:46 <impulse> thanks
Jun 25 03:24:38 <g00s> Napalm|afk you're still alive !
Jun 25 03:28:28 <treelzebub> Hey all-- I can't seem to find any info on this on SO or in the docs. Does Custom Chrome Tabs have functionality like WebView's shouldOverrideUrlLoading to catch urls? or do I have to depend on an intent-filter? Trying to replace an OAuth flow with Custom Tabs, but I don't want the final step to be an App Picker...
Jun 25 03:33:13 <parco> if A calls startActivityForResult to launch B, what happens when B finishes, is A recreated?
Jun 25 03:36:17 <kbs> usually not; but (if the code is handling the standard activity lifecyle events reasonably) it also usually should not matter either, is what I'm thinking...
Jun 25 03:37:04 <parco> kbs: its a bluetooth driven app, so i would like to avoid the teardown and setup that's required
Jun 25 03:37:23 <parco> but i agree, i might have to handle if it gets killed at any time
Jun 25 03:39:52 <kbs> the "usual" case tends to be rotations, but as you say - it's best to code against the lifecycle and hope the runtime does the optimal thing
Jun 25 03:42:24 <kbs> is the teardown/setup somehow tied into the lifetime of the activity instance? (haven't done any bluetooth stuff...)
Jun 25 03:46:03 <parco> kbs: yea when dealing with bluetooth, there's this messy cloud that hangs over the context
Jun 25 03:46:24 <parco> if you don't close it down properly, and give it enough time, you tend to have issues when trying to connect again
Jun 25 03:47:25 <kbs> ah well :)
Jun 25 03:47:47 <parco> and i wish there were some builtin timeouts when working with bluetooth LE
Jun 25 03:48:15 <treelzebub> parco: this doesn't directly address your question, but check out our little library that handles activity results! http://levelmoney.github.io/velodrome/
Jun 25 03:48:48 <parco> treelzebub: commercial use free?
Jun 25 03:49:01 <treelzebub> free and open source
Jun 25 03:49:08 <parco> ill check it out thanks
Jun 25 03:56:33 <parco> treelzebub: seems useful, luckily i only have 2 activities, but it's bookmarked :)
Jun 25 03:57:20 <treelzebub> awesome! :)
Jun 25 04:12:37 <_genuser_> hey devs
Jun 25 04:21:41 <_genuser_> any one here doing TOGAF, or are you all just doing mobile dev and leaving architecture level stuff to someone else?
Jun 25 04:31:02 <mz|alex> or... doing mobile dev and just following common sense
Jun 25 04:38:58 <_genuser_> common sense not being so common is problem number 1.
Jun 25 04:39:07 <_genuser_> people wanting to pay more for certifications is anotehr point.
Jun 25 04:49:04 <mz|alex> I don't care, you were asking
Jun 25 04:49:47 <mz|alex> in my team I put common sense down their throats, no TOGAF , just kicks in the but :)
Jun 25 05:17:59 <treelzebub> i think the point he was trying to make is that there are more than two options between TOGAF and leaving architecture to someone else. I work for an app that has a dedicated backend team, but my personal projects usually depend on third-party APIs, so the architecture for those apps is my own.
Jun 25 05:44:32 <impulse> does the Preference class not exist anymore? I'm getting "cannot find symbol : class Preference
Jun 25 05:46:32 <impulse> oh never mind, i didn't import it
Jun 25 06:13:52 <impulse> where can i find the source for the default wifi settings app/widget/whatever it is
Jun 25 06:15:48 <pfn> in aosp
Jun 25 06:17:18 <impulse> thanks
Jun 25 06:20:58 <hero_biz> hi
Jun 25 06:21:45 <hero_biz> guys,should I ask question about android studio here too?
Jun 25 06:28:39 <hero_biz> guys, I have downloaded ndk and extracted it. but how I can force android studio to detect it?
Jun 25 06:31:05 <orbyt_> Does anyone have decent experience with AI apis and libraries like wit.ai/api.ai/chatbots.io and the like?
Jun 25 06:38:32 <Omnipotent> I have {calendars:[Followed by array of calendars objects here here]}, How do I fetch this by gson? into array of objects?
Jun 25 06:38:45 <Omnipotent> Type type = new TypeToken<ArrayList<CalendarInfo>>(){}.getType(); <= I can't really do this and
Jun 25 06:38:50 <Omnipotent> Calendars = new Gson().fromJson(response, type);
Jun 25 06:38:56 <Omnipotent> as there is object even before the array
Jun 25 06:38:58 <Omnipotent> what can I do?
Jun 25 06:39:18 <Omnipotent> there is an object that holds array of calendars, and that object is known as calendars.
Jun 25 07:09:06 <rohan> hi. Anyone here familiar with nested fragments?
Jun 25 07:09:15 <rohan> I have a problem where the state of my nested fragment is not being restored correctly.
Jun 25 07:15:36 <hero_biz> guys,android studio still need to use experimental gradle for using ndk?
Jun 25 07:16:10 <hero_biz> it was added in version 1.3, still not completely in version 2.1?
Jun 25 07:24:39 <orbyt_> anyone up
Jun 25 07:25:08 <rohan> orbyt_: sup
Jun 25 07:26:39 <orbyt_> say you wanted to have little characters in your app (like a dog, cat etc.). They would need to have small animations (blinking, turning head). Would this better be done using Animated Vector Drawables or creating .gifs and using them?
Jun 25 07:52:33 <s9iper1> i am sharing a data with bluetooth and i am sending string sometimes but i am converting those byte[] to string and parsing it as jsonobject but i am getting this error.  org.json.JSONException: Value image at image of type java.lang.String cannot be converted to boolean
Jun 25 07:54:38 <impulse> is it possible to add my own tile to the quick settings bar without rooting?
Jun 25 07:59:37 <xorgate> s9iper1: clearly your deserializing is flawed. ie. trying to read a type into a variable of another type
Jun 25 08:00:13 <xorgate> impulse: think so, yeah in marshmallow i believe
Jun 25 08:00:41 <impulse> xorgate: know any tutorials or what to search for? everything i'm finding is for the custom quick settings app.
Jun 25 08:01:06 <s9iper1> yes but this source code is opensource https://github.com/simonguest/btphototransfer-sample xorgate
Jun 25 08:01:24 <impulse> xorgate: never mind, might've just found one
Jun 25 08:01:42 <s9iper1> its sending image but i am trying to send string but its giving me that error
Jun 25 08:02:20 <s9iper1> xorgate,  can you tell me what is this protected static final int HEADER_MSB = 0x10;  and protected static final int HEADER_LSB = 0x55;
Jun 25 08:02:48 <xorgate> they are just header bytes for  some binary format, i would believe
Jun 25 08:03:11 <xorgate> msb = most significant byte (the high part of a 2 byte word)
Jun 25 08:03:53 <xorgate> 0xaabb  <-- 0xaa is hsb
Jun 25 08:03:54 <akshitkumar1> hey, does anyone have any experience of taking photo without preview using the camera 2 api?
Jun 25 08:10:14 <s9iper1> xorgate, yes they are header bytes but how does it know that this is an image byte and other one is string
Jun 25 08:10:15 <s9iper1> ?
Jun 25 08:13:34 <xorgate> i would think bt just sends 'data' and not particularly a filetype
Jun 25 08:14:33 <xorgate> s9iper1: i take it you were using this: https://github.com/simonguest/android-btxfr/blob/master/src/com/simonguest/btxfr/ClientThread.java ?
Jun 25 08:14:55 <xorgate> create a stream, output some meta info (including header), send data
Jun 25 08:15:41 <s9iper1> yes using this file
Jun 25 08:26:55 <s9iper1> shahid_rb,
Jun 25 08:27:14 <shahid_rb> s9iper1, here
Jun 25 08:31:39 <rohan> if anyone could take a look at http://stackoverflow.com/questions/38026495/how-to-save-and-restore-state-of-automatically-added-nested-fragment and help answer it, i'd be grateful
Jun 25 09:53:42 <MisterGadfly> Should I use libgdx or AndEngine for a simple 2D game?
Jun 25 09:57:22 <xorgate> how can i run my tv app on my actual tv?
Jun 25 10:48:18 <bolovanos_> adq, hithere
Jun 25 10:49:44 <bolovanos_> so I have written another email to fabric.io - answer is again unclear - this time guy from support is linking some page from crashlytics where information about what is being collected are http://try.crashlytics.com/security/
Jun 25 10:51:24 <bolovanos_> problem is that PP of fabric - which I am using -> which means those I have agreed with has no relation to that security page or crashlytics at all
Jun 25 10:52:37 <adq> hi bolovanos_ ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Jun 25 11:10:17 <AKK9> How can I tell if my activity has been loaded from the backstack
Jun 25 11:10:37 <AKK9> Cause if it has then all the content will still be there, but if it isn't then I need to load it again
Jun 25 11:14:02 <AKK9> Wtf, my fragment doesn't call getSavedInstance when I return to it on the backstack
Jun 25 11:14:18 <AKK9> But all the views have kept their state and stuff
Jun 25 11:14:22 <AKK9> What does this mean
Jun 25 11:14:32 <AKK9> Well not call getSavedInstance
Jun 25 11:14:38 <AKK9> But there is no saved instance state
Jun 25 11:21:46 <SimonVT> Fragment#onSaveInstanceState is called along with Activity#onSaveInstanceState
Jun 25 11:21:57 <SimonVT> View state is separate from that
Jun 25 11:22:22 <SimonVT> Activity#onCreate is called when a new instance of your Activity is created. That's where you need to create your view hierarchy
Jun 25 11:22:56 <SimonVT> You should familiarize yourself with both their lifecycles
Jun 25 11:24:31 <bolovanos_> AKK9, https://github.com/xxv/android-lifecycle/blob/master/complete_android_fragment_lifecycle.png
Jun 25 11:25:29 <AKK9> SimonVT: Thanks, yeah I was understnding the fragment lifecycle wrong. I assumed that onStart only called when the fragment was created brand new, so I forced data refresh. But I stopped doing that and now everything is retained as expected.
Jun 25 11:26:35 <AKK9> Now I set a doRefresh flag in onCreateView if there is no savedstate
Jun 25 12:13:32 <akshitkumar1> hey all, presently the alarm manager on android forces the interval to be of 1 minute minimum. Is there a way to change this functionality?
Jun 25 12:14:32 <SimonVT> Probably not. Consider using a Handler instead
Jun 25 12:18:36 <akshitkumar1> SimonVT: Changing the source code of AlarmManager somehow?
Jun 25 12:19:22 <akshitkumar1> SimonVT: The thing with hander is that it will terminate since the phone goes to sleep
Jun 25 12:19:28 <akshitkumar1> *handler
Jun 25 12:20:26 <SimonVT> Create a foreground service and hold a wakelock
Jun 25 12:20:36 <SimonVT> You can't change AlarmManager
Jun 25 12:21:37 <akshitkumar1> SimonVT: ok. I am presently doing that only. Can you recommend of some way of optimizing the battery?
Jun 25 12:22:08 <akshitkumar1> I am trying to take pictures through a camera every 10 seconds
Jun 25 12:22:23 <SimonVT> That's going to be horribly battery inefficient no matter what you do
Jun 25 12:23:34 <akshitkumar1> SimonVT: I know :/ I have already reduced the screen brightness and preview size to min.
Jun 25 12:24:01 <akshitkumar1> SimonVT: BTW is there a way to take picture without preview using the camera 2 api?
Jun 25 12:24:08 <SimonVT> I have no idea
Jun 25 12:24:29 <SimonVT> If your use case is taking an image every 10 seconds you might want to have a permanent power source for the device
Jun 25 12:24:50 <SimonVT> If you want the device to last a long time, reconsider your requirements
Jun 25 12:25:28 <akshitkumar1> Hmm. As for taking picture without preview?
Jun 25 12:25:48 <SimonVT> I have no idea how the camera api works
Jun 25 12:26:08 <JitanRo> neither has anyone else ;(
Jun 25 12:26:11 <akshitkumar1> oh okay thanks for all the help
Jun 25 12:26:57 <akshitkumar1> BTW is there a battery efficiency differency in Handler, scheduler and timer?
Jun 25 12:40:13 <AlexBerdnikov> Hi guys. In Android Studio whenever I run my apps, AS always use the last device I chose in device chooser, and then doesn't even show it again. And I didn't select this option in the device chooser.
Jun 25 12:40:30 <AlexBerdnikov> Has anyone encountered this?
Jun 25 12:44:00 <Mavrik> Nope.
Jun 25 12:44:10 <Mavrik> Do you have that setting enabled in your run configuration?
Jun 25 12:50:55 <Intruder777> why do I get "No resource identifier found for attribute" error for internal:layout_maxHeight and internal:layout_minHeight attributes with xmlns:internal="http://schemas.android.com/apk/prv/res/android
Jun 25 12:56:15 <SimonVT> What namespace is that?
Jun 25 12:56:58 <xorgate> AlexBerdnikov: yep i get that too.. i just remove the cable / kill the emu so the window pops up again
Jun 25 12:58:13 <purplex88> I created a "lib" folder in project below "app" in Android Studio and I cannot remove it anymore. What to do?
Jun 25 12:58:59 <SimonVT> Use your favorite OS to delete the folder from its file manager
Jun 25 12:59:39 <SimonVT> But you probably still have it referenced somewhere in your build files
Jun 25 13:02:38 <purplex88> I tried deleting it from disk but it comes back
Jun 25 13:02:41 <AlexBerdnikov> Mavrik: no I don't.
Jun 25 13:03:13 <purplex88> Its some kind of java library module folder
Jun 25 13:03:21 <purplex88> that i accidently created
Jun 25 13:03:39 <AlexBerdnikov> xorgate: that's what I do as well, but it's really annoying and shouldn't work that way
Jun 25 13:19:51 <xorgate> file a bug or vote for the current bug.. b.android.com
Jun 25 13:39:59 <AlexBerdnikov> Does anybody know some library for implementing contacts list with alphabetical scrollbar?
Jun 25 13:48:05 <mkinkles> I want to take up programming and make it my profession - problem is, I can't decide what I want to build. I am horrible about learning just to learn, I need a project to complete. I like the idea of Android development so I have been learning Java and Android SDK but only doing Android limits me a lot (although Java can carry through a lot and eve
Jun 25 13:48:05 <mkinkles> n Slack's actual messaging server is written in Java). I don't really appreciate the DOM and JavaScript, but it seems to be the future (or maybe...). What do you all suggest? I also looked into Python and it can build some web apps using Django/Flask and tie into MongoDB (much like MEAN stack with JS). Suggestions on what to master?
Jun 25 13:53:21 <perlsyntax> mkinkles,I have the same prob it hard to think of a projects.:)
Jun 25 13:53:32 <perlsyntax> oh sorry miss spell
Jun 25 13:53:41 <perlsyntax> mkinkles
Jun 25 13:53:47 <perlsyntax> mm
Jun 25 13:58:49 <fr> So do you only have 1000poitns for achievements for good? so if i create a test achievement then 5 points are wasted just there?
Jun 25 13:59:14 <fr> and giving more points to som achievements seem like a bad idea then you are wasting points... for what?
Jun 25 14:00:17 <perlsyntax> Hey all
Jun 25 14:30:33 <Meron> Hello
Jun 25 14:30:42 <Meron> Has anybody run into an issue with using the android placepicker api
Jun 25 14:31:15 <Meron> When I launch the intent, I get an error message saying something about a signature verification error, then Google Play Services itself crashes
Jun 25 14:32:09 <Meron> Has anybody seen this? It's completely preventing me from doing anything and looks like a bug in the google api's themselves
Jun 25 14:33:07 <Meron> OR is there any way to get the stacktrace from the google play services crash
Jun 25 14:33:11 <Meron> Cos I get NOITHING
Jun 25 14:33:20 <Meron> Can't even catch it for some reason.
Jun 25 14:33:26 <Meron> Good job google
Jun 25 14:37:35 <SimonVT> Show your code, maybe someone who has worked with it can point you in the right direction
Jun 25 14:38:38 <Meron> Unfortunately I'm not doing anything different from listed in the place picker setup
Jun 25 14:38:56 <SimonVT> And make sure you're not filtering away any exceptions or logcat messages from place picker
Jun 25 14:40:32 <SimonVT> People always say they're not doing anything wrong.. It's rarely the case
Jun 25 14:40:34 <SimonVT> Hence showing code
Jun 25 14:41:07 <SimonVT> You'll likely have to create a test case if you're going to report it anyway
Jun 25 14:41:28 <Meron> Ah I didn't realise logcat filters out exceptions
Jun 25 14:41:32 <Meron> That's stupid
Jun 25 14:41:47 <Meron> Looks like it's to do with launching from a fragment rather than an activity
Jun 25 14:41:51 <SimonVT> By default AS only shows your app
Jun 25 14:42:12 <Meron> The logcat message IS a bug in Play Services, that's been verified. Crash is to do with this I guess
Jun 25 14:43:07 <Meron> startActivityForResult(builder.build(getActivity()), PLACE_PICKER_REQUEST);
Jun 25 14:43:11 <Meron> This is the launching call
Jun 25 14:53:08 <Meron> Caused by: java.lang.NullPointerException: Attempt to invoke virtual method 'android.content.res.Configuration android.content.res.Resources.getConfiguration()' on a null object reference
Jun 25 14:53:19 <Meron> And this is the error that occurs when gps crashes
Jun 25 14:55:48 <Meron> Seems to be a known issue with no real resolution
Jun 25 14:55:48 <Meron> https://code.google.com/p/gmaps-api-issues/issues/detail?id=9071
Jun 25 15:01:08 <Meron> This means that I literally cannot do what I wanted to do.. purely because google has fucked up
Jun 25 15:01:09 <Meron> Nice
Jun 25 15:02:53 <Meron> Anybody know of any alternatives to the google place picker
Jun 25 15:38:11 <thelawyer> Using android:theme="@style/Theme.AppCompat.NoActionBar" inside manifest > application to hide the application title/caption bar , but it still appearing in AndroidStudio design
Jun 25 15:38:23 <thelawyer> how to hide it in the design mode?
Jun 25 15:38:55 <pfn> choose that theme in the designer
Jun 25 15:39:35 <thelawyer> thanks pfn
Jun 25 15:42:24 <thelawyer> I'm having problems using virtual device on android studio 2.1 which widely talking about it on stackoverflow .. I read almost every thread about it and tried all the solutions there but still not able to get running on avd
Jun 25 15:43:48 <thelawyer> which environment variables are required as a "MUST" for android sdk and studio?
Jun 25 15:43:56 <Meron> So this is my first time experiencing this new android 6.0 permission model
Jun 25 15:43:58 <Meron> is it just me
Jun 25 15:44:02 <Meron> or is it a FUCKING NIGHTMARE
Jun 25 15:44:02 <thelawyer> also which paths are MUST
Jun 25 15:44:29 <Meron> The amount of boilerplate code you have to write is insane
Jun 25 15:44:58 <raoul11> i havnt fiddled with any, but it does seem crazy
Jun 25 15:45:13 <Meron> It's incredibly, incredibly annoying
Jun 25 15:45:27 <Meron> If anybody has any design patterns to help with this
Jun 25 15:45:45 <Meron> let me know
Jun 25 15:46:07 <Meron> For example, what do I do if I want to request two permissions to launch one task?
Jun 25 15:46:10 <Meron> What goes in the callback?
Jun 25 15:46:26 <Meron> I don't want to repeat myself with (case x : task, case y: task)
Jun 25 15:46:53 <thelawyer> which one is obsolete ANDROID_SDK_HOME vs ANDROID_HOME?
Jun 25 15:47:11 <Meron> Why didn't google design it automatically? Why do I, the developer, have to pick up after their shit?
Jun 25 15:47:37 <Meron> What if I want to do two different things?
Jun 25 15:47:39 <g00s> Meron they designed it so you could ask for X when you needed X
Jun 25 15:47:47 <Meron> Except it doesn't work like that lol
Jun 25 15:47:50 <Meron> With this stupid callback model
Jun 25 15:47:59 <Meron> Say I request contacts in two different scenarios
Jun 25 15:48:03 <Meron> And want to return to each scenario
Jun 25 15:48:10 <Meron> I have to CHECK, every time, which scenario made the call
Jun 25 15:48:12 <Meron> to return to it
Jun 25 15:48:14 <Meron> fucking stupid
Jun 25 15:48:29 <Meron> It's just a nightmare of spaghettification
Jun 25 15:49:23 <Meron> There's additionally no tutorials or anything on it
Jun 25 15:49:34 <Meron> I can only assume because people took one look, and decided to set their SDK to 23
Jun 25 15:49:44 <Meron> So they didn't have to deal with googles retarded design decisions
Jun 25 15:49:59 <sss> Is GPGS using secure communication (https or TLS)?
Jun 25 15:52:44 <raoul11> Meron: weird thing is, im not making any runtime permissions calls on an avd emulator targeting sdk23, and it doesnt ask, crash or doing fu^&all about it?
Jun 25 15:53:00 <raoul11> emulator is also 23
Jun 25 15:53:46 <Meron> Are you using any dangerous permissions?>
Jun 25 15:53:52 <Meron> You only need to runtime request those
Jun 25 15:54:06 <raoul11> internet, internal read/write, billing
Jun 25 15:55:10 <Meron> Yeah, those are automatically granted
Jun 25 15:55:16 <Meron> But if you want to use, eg, location
Jun 25 15:55:22 <Meron> Prepare for the pain
Jun 25 15:56:39 <raoul11> is there a list of the auto granted ones/bad permissions?
Jun 25 15:59:11 <Meron> Yeah
Jun 25 15:59:21 <Meron> https://developer.android.com/guide/topics/security/permissions.html#normal-dangerous
Jun 25 16:00:59 <Meron> It's actually a nightmare
Jun 25 16:01:04 <Meron> I want to do a lot of location stuff
Jun 25 16:01:12 <Meron> And the though of having to wrap every call in about 30 lines of code
Jun 25 16:01:20 <Meron> Makes me want to quit android development and never look backl
Jun 25 16:02:10 <raoul11> interesting, i also have write_external_storage, and it hasnt bitched once
Jun 25 16:04:07 <Meron> That is strange
Jun 25 16:04:27 <Meron> It should just crash if you're making a call to something that you don't have the permission granted for
Jun 25 16:06:29 <raoul11> i think i only added it for some ad network sdk requirements
Jun 25 16:06:53 <raoul11> maybe they're properly dealing with it? though i havnt seen any popup permissions requests on the emulator
Jun 25 16:08:42 <Meron> Possibly
Jun 25 16:08:54 <Meron> I don't know really
Jun 25 16:09:07 <Meron> It's good practice (lol) to do it with runtime permissions though
Jun 25 16:09:21 <Meron> I found a 3rd party annotations library for dealing with it
Jun 25 16:09:23 <Meron> gonna try that
Jun 25 16:09:47 <raoul11> report back if its good (:
Jun 25 16:10:13 <shmooz> google ruined android!
Jun 25 16:11:31 <shmooz> they should have left it alone at gingerbread
Jun 25 16:17:18 <pfn> permissions aren't hard
Jun 25 16:17:25 <pfn> use something like rxpermissions
Jun 25 16:17:56 <thelawyer> Error while waiting for device: Timed out after 300seconds waiting for emulator to come online.
Jun 25 16:18:07 <Meron> I'm testing out PermissionsDispatcher
Jun 25 16:18:46 <pfn> also, using stuff like java8 and/or alternative languages makes permissions easy as well
Jun 25 16:20:52 <g00s> shmooz no way, froyo was where it at !
Jun 25 16:20:58 <shmooz> so my app won't work on N if I don't redo the permissions part?
Jun 25 16:21:11 <g00s> lol
Jun 25 16:21:26 <shmooz> because it's working fine on Marshmallow
Jun 25 16:22:00 <shmooz> g00s: gingerbread had everything correct for once
Jun 25 16:22:18 <g00s> i disliked GB, it looked like shit
Jun 25 16:22:29 <g00s> and HC was shit too, those were dark times
Jun 25 16:22:50 <shmooz> to me lollipop was just as bad as Honeycomb
Jun 25 16:23:21 <shmooz> they tried to make it like apple crap with Material Design
Jun 25 16:23:39 <shmooz> and rudely removed my beloved black backgrounds
Jun 25 16:24:06 <Meron> Material design fucking sucked
Jun 25 16:24:21 <Meron> They just released a bunch of guidelines
Jun 25 16:24:23 <Meron> With no implementations
Jun 25 16:24:30 <Meron> And left it to the community to sort it out
Jun 25 16:24:38 <Meron> lazy
Jun 25 16:25:31 <pfn> everything that matters was already implemented
Jun 25 16:25:58 <pfn> except for fab and the collapsing toolbar stuff initially
Jun 25 16:25:59 <shmooz> so then leave it alone, don't ruin it
Jun 25 16:26:24 <shmooz> fabs are a horrible idea
Jun 25 16:27:04 <g00s> there are different places to put a fab; its only /horribe/ when it covers content
Jun 25 16:27:29 <shmooz> if there's nothing behind it don't bother floating it
Jun 25 16:28:09 <g00s> its common though being bottom right, covering content so - yeah that isn't good
Jun 25 16:28:14 <pfn> covering content is no big deal if it can be hidden
Jun 25 16:28:30 <shmooz> it just imlies user attention is not sophisticated enough to follow buttons in a app so we gotta float it above the app
Jun 25 16:28:49 <pfn> wrong
Jun 25 16:28:58 <pfn> convenience and ergonomics
Jun 25 16:29:17 <pfn> big part of the reason behind the resurgence in bottom tabs and sheets
Jun 25 16:29:56 <shmooz> ok we realized again our thumb can reach the bottom part of the screen easier, whoopie
Jun 25 16:30:00 <g00s> pfn have you seen any popular apps with bottom nav? i only see google+ and photos, i wonder if thats stalling
Jun 25 16:30:47 <pfn> yelp
Jun 25 16:32:50 <pfn> I don't use that many apps regularly
Jun 25 16:34:15 <shmooz> they are going to again attempt to replace apps with a single browser and web stuff I bet
Jun 25 16:34:45 <shmooz> people are not downloading apps as much anymore
Jun 25 16:36:39 <g00s> shit, android:icon in preferences xml, even with appcompat version, does not tint icons correctly
Jun 25 16:41:04 <Mike11> hello all :)
Jun 25 16:41:28 <Mike11> I am working on android application that will use volley to send requests and receive responses from a web service
Jun 25 16:42:22 <Mavrik> yay?
Jun 25 16:42:33 <g00s> why do people use volley still
Jun 25 16:43:25 <pfn> shmooz, you kinda pulled that out of your ass
Jun 25 16:43:26 <shmooz> I still have the google IO video where they introduce volley as the next big thing
Jun 25 16:43:52 <CedricBeust>  and recently a Google developer defending AsyncTask and brushing off Rx
Jun 25 16:43:54 <barq> Are there any good frameworks for moving data from the computer to an app? I.e. making use of the computer keyboard, when it is required to type stuff and then move it to the app?
Jun 25 16:43:57 <g00s> that was 2013 or 2014 ?
Jun 25 16:44:15 <Mike11> for now, I am just afraid of activity recreation, I know volley can cache GET requests so that when the activity is recreated, my volley request will get request like it has super-fast internet connection
Jun 25 16:44:19 <shmooz> pfn: I follow a lot of android/mobile related news and podcasts, that's where I'm hearing this from
Jun 25 16:44:33 <g00s> CedricBeust haha :D when i posted that on /r/ i knew it would be controversial, glad to see it was discussed and not downvoted as much
Jun 25 16:44:55 <Mike11> so it is no problem with GET , my problem comes with POST requests like signup for example, activity recreation might cause the user to sign up twice
Jun 25 16:45:17 <Mike11> g00s , should I consider something else??
Jun 25 16:45:52 <g00s> Mike11 i guess retrofit is the go-lib today
Jun 25 16:46:02 <g00s> *go-to lib
Jun 25 16:46:19 <Mike11> g00s , volley solves many problems that can come up if I use AsyncTasks with HttpUrlConnection
Jun 25 16:46:45 <Mike11> g00s, honestly I have never heard of it
Jun 25 16:46:51 <Mike11> googling. . .
Jun 25 16:47:55 <g00s> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vYEXzx-TINc
Jun 25 16:48:02 <Mike11> I just wanted to ask here if using volley inside a retained fragment to solve my issue related to POST requests sounds dumb, what do you guys think?
Jun 25 16:48:53 <barq> What issue?
Jun 25 16:49:11 <barq> You can use a headless fragment if you want.
Jun 25 16:49:45 <Mike11> barq , the issue of the activity being recreated and the POST request being sent again
Jun 25 16:50:19 <barq> Headless fragment or use a library
Jun 25 16:52:41 <Mike11> barq , you mean a library like OTTO square?
Jun 25 16:52:51 <Mike11> Otto Bus**
Jun 25 16:53:16 <barq> like square retrofit/okhttp yes
Jun 25 16:58:46 <CedricBeust>  Mike11 volley is being phased out, use OkIo/OkHttp for this
Jun 25 17:00:50 <Meron> y'know, despite using permissionsdispatcher
Jun 25 17:00:56 <Meron> i'm not actually getting asked for any permissions
Jun 25 17:01:03 <Meron> my action just isn't activating
Jun 25 17:03:19 <Mike11> thanks guys for your suggestions , barq, CedricBeust :)
Jun 25 17:03:33 <Mike11> I am searching for them a little  bit
Jun 25 17:17:21 <Meron> Has anybody used permissions dispatcher?
Jun 25 17:17:31 <Meron> Or knows a lot about runtime permissions
Jun 25 17:17:45 <Meron> Why is my application, (using permissions dispatcher) NOT asking for any permissions?
Jun 25 17:17:52 <Meron> It just autofails
Jun 25 17:21:33 <Meron> Does anybody know why?
Jun 25 17:25:34 <mz|alex> Meron I get auto granted without prompt, I wish I could understand it
Jun 25 17:25:51 <mz|alex> I dont know if the manifest is granting the permission, or what
Jun 25 17:26:21 <mz|alex> this whole android 6.0 permission scheme is driving me nuts and holding me back to release :(
Jun 25 17:27:31 <Meron> Lol same!
Jun 25 17:27:37 <Meron> It's a fucking shitshow
Jun 25 17:27:45 <Meron> And google should be ASHAMED they implemented it like this
Jun 25 17:27:55 <Meron> I see no reason I'm getting auto-deny
Jun 25 17:28:12 <Meron> Additionally there's very little help available anywhere
Jun 25 17:30:49 <g00s> man wtf is going on, in AS i keep doing ^R (Run) - the build completes but AS does not install / run the app
Jun 25 17:30:57 <orbyt_> does anyone use facebook messenger
Jun 25 17:31:00 <g00s> id say its works 80% of the time, 20% it does nothing
Jun 25 17:31:08 <mz|alex> yup, and I'm dealing with SDCArd permissions on android 6, which is very uncommon on most devices.. so help = 0%
Jun 25 17:31:47 <Meron> Are you using any third party libraries?
Jun 25 17:32:20 <mz|alex> well, I'm building with Unity engine, so that is a HUGE library indeed :)
Jun 25 17:32:52 <mz|alex> having to build jar files to import in unity and compile and test on android, the whole process is quite annoying
Jun 25 17:33:38 <g00s> OH, instant run thought the app didn't change, even though it did hmm
Jun 25 17:33:50 <Meron> I meant to deal with permissions
Jun 25 17:33:56 <Meron> Eg 'rxpermissions' 'permissionsdispatcher'
Jun 25 17:35:16 <mz|alex> Im doing it like described in here: https://developer.android.com/training/permissions/requesting.html
Jun 25 17:38:08 <pfn> instant run is so unreliable...
Jun 25 17:38:20 <pfn> they should take out hot swap
Jun 25 17:38:47 <bolovanos> hithere
Jun 25 17:38:59 <pfn> dunno how well they do the translation, but it probably fucks up line numbers hard
Jun 25 17:39:07 <bolovanos> what in app ads do you use in your app?
Jun 25 17:39:07 <pfn> cold swap is absolutely rock solid
Jun 25 17:39:22 <pfn> ads suck
Jun 25 17:39:38 <pfn> I don't use apps that have ads and don't put ads in my own apps :p
Jun 25 17:41:12 <g00s> yep, ads suck. and just as they are failing as monetization mechanism for web in general (through widespread usage of add blockers), they will eventually fail for mobile too
Jun 25 17:41:50 <pfn> they are not failing as a monetization mechanism for web
Jun 25 17:42:00 <bolovanos> ok - for those who probably missed the question " what in app ads do you use in your app?
Jun 25 17:42:01 <bolovanos> "
Jun 25 17:42:01 <g00s> if you read this, you'll see how bad the situation has gotten https://plus.google.com/+ArtemRussakovskii/posts/7jMWV7oCQpn
Jun 25 17:42:31 <bolovanos> if none - it is ok - but i need to help choose some
Jun 25 17:42:33 <g00s> pfn oh they most definitely are, publishers are in a panic, pay-walls are going up
Jun 25 17:42:47 <Meron> Hooray, fixed my issue
Jun 25 17:42:48 <g00s> even google knows this
Jun 25 17:43:04 <Meron> Turns out I had the stupid uses-permission in the wrong place. Clearly I've been away too long
Jun 25 17:43:12 <bolovanos> so philosophy no matter how elegant won't help
Jun 25 17:43:15 <g00s> there just hasn't been a frictionless micro-payment or alternative system to take its (ads) place yet
Jun 25 17:43:26 <Meron> @mz|alex I suggest using PermissionsDispatcher to handle permissions and not writing it yourself
Jun 25 17:43:40 <Meron> Unfortunately I'm still super stuck on this bug:
Jun 25 17:43:42 <pfn> g00s, newspapers and magazines were never free to begin with
Jun 25 17:43:43 <Meron> https://code.google.com/p/gmaps-api-issues/issues/detail?id=9071#makechanges
Jun 25 17:43:50 <pfn> ads alone were never sufficient
Jun 25 17:43:54 <Meron> It seems like googles maps/locations apis don't work on sony devices
Jun 25 17:44:02 <g00s> pfn nothing is ever really free, even if its a blog you still have to host it
Jun 25 17:44:22 <Mavrik> Google Maps works perfectly well on Sony devices.
Jun 25 17:44:32 <Mavrik> Also dafuq is with this shitshow of incompetence on this channel lately.
Jun 25 17:44:46 <pfn> g00s, publications that used to be ad supported to begin with (to self sufficiency) tend to be able to survive on Web ads
Jun 25 17:44:47 <Mavrik> Did anyone make a Slack bridge or something
Jun 25 17:44:51 <g00s> Mavrik we need you to straighten it out !
Jun 25 17:44:55 <bolovanos> setFlame(false);, setHelpFullAnswers(true);
Jun 25 17:45:01 <pfn> Mavrik, that has always been the case here
Jun 25 17:45:06 <Meron> @Mavrik maybe read the thread m90
Jun 25 17:45:23 <Meron> OR
Jun 25 17:45:26 <Mavrik> pfn, eh, never to this stage
Jun 25 17:45:26 <Meron> Come up with an answer
Jun 25 17:45:28 <Meron> If you're so smart
Jun 25 17:45:29 <mz|alex> Meron I'll check out the permissionDispatcher, I'm really new to android :(
Jun 25 17:45:30 <Mavrik> Maybe someone made IRC easier.
Jun 25 17:45:33 <mz|alex> thx
Jun 25 17:45:50 <Meron> > IRC is a difficult technology only for the elite
Jun 25 17:46:13 <pfn> g00s, never said anything about the cost of hosting
Jun 25 17:46:32 <pfn> and that changes nothing in relation to what I was saying earlier
Jun 25 17:46:50 <Mavrik> CPI is dropping quite a bit tho
Jun 25 17:52:04 <Meron> This the crash message you get when you try and launch PlacePicker
Jun 25 17:52:04 <Meron> Process: com.google.android.gms.ui, PID: 1098                                                  java.lang.RuntimeException: Unable to start activity ComponentInfo{com.google.android.gms/com.google.android.location.places.ui.placepicker.v1.PlacePickerActivity}: java.lang.NullPointerException: Attempt to invoke virtual method 'android.content.res.Configuration android.content.res.Resources.getConfiguration()' on a null object referen
Jun 25 17:52:12 <Meron> Google Play Services itself crashes
Jun 25 17:52:36 <pfn> there are several workarounds mentioned in the bug report you linked
Jun 25 17:52:40 <Meron> None of them work
Jun 25 17:52:41 <pfn> try reading
Jun 25 17:52:42 <Meron> Obviously
Jun 25 17:52:45 <Meron> Or I wouldn't be here
Jun 25 17:52:55 <Meron> And most of them are for MapViews
Jun 25 17:53:12 <Meron> Not the stupid placepicker intent
Jun 25 17:56:03 * pfn shrugs 
Jun 25 17:56:58 <Meron> Essentially it's broken and google ain't fixin it
Jun 25 17:57:11 <pfn> ain't? says accepted
Jun 25 17:57:22 <Meron> it's been a few months now
Jun 25 18:00:59 <Mavrik> Cry a river?
Jun 25 18:03:01 <Meron> Looks like that's literally the only option, yes
Jun 25 18:03:23 <Mavrik> Or get an alternative provider?
Jun 25 18:03:42 <Mavrik> I mean c'mon, you wasted to much energy complaining you could probably integrate OSM by now :P
Jun 25 18:05:02 <Meron> There aren't any alternatives to the place picker that I found
Jun 25 18:05:17 <Meron> I was actually considering OSM from the start lol
Jun 25 18:05:22 <Meron> then decided Google native would be easier
Jun 25 18:05:24 <Meron> What a mistake
Jun 25 18:43:04 <thelawyer> why android studio insists on download platform 23 while I'm intending to use API 16?
Jun 25 18:44:00 <SimonVT> There's no reason not to compile using the latest api
Jun 25 18:44:21 <SimonVT> Using e.g. appcompat requires it
Jun 25 18:44:39 <thelawyer> I've sdk platform and system-images already in place yet it keeps downloading new stuff even though I've added "disable.android.first.run=true" into idea.properties
Jun 25 18:47:35 <shmooz> resistance is futile!
Jun 25 18:49:44 <Ashiren> you mean minsdk 16?
Jun 25 18:50:01 <sudhirkhanger> what new stuff?
Jun 25 18:53:11 <orbyt_> anyone used azure?
Jun 25 18:53:21 <orbyt_> how does it compare to say, heroku?
Jun 25 18:55:47 <thelawyer> Ashiren: yes the minimum sdk 16 which is the same of the device i'm using to develop
Jun 25 18:57:41 <DLSteve> orbyt_, Azure is closer to AWS than Heroku
Jun 25 18:58:09 <thelawyer> this is really pissing me off now
Jun 25 18:58:31 <Ashiren> thelawyer: you compile and target to the newest sdk possible, minsdk is different
Jun 25 18:58:49 <orbyt_> DLSteve: ah yea, just did some more reading on it
Jun 25 18:59:08 <orbyt_> they even have machine learning and big data stuff in there, thats coo
Jun 25 18:59:41 <DLSteve> yup. Googles cloud platform has some cool stuff as well.
Jun 25 19:01:36 <thelawyer> Ashiren: I didn't even startup Android studio .. it starts damn downloading just once I create a new application with minimum sdk api 16
Jun 25 19:05:10 <thelawyer> Ashiren: https://snag.gy/OqcwH9.jpg
Jun 25 19:06:17 <thelawyer> Ashiren: https://snag.gy/8QWze4.jpg
Jun 25 19:07:31 <thelawyer> apparently this is the way google try force stupid programmers to get things done for the forcefully
Jun 25 19:07:41 <thelawyer> no one need to know what the heck is going on
Jun 25 19:07:50 <SimonVT> min sdk, target sdk and build target are three different things
Jun 25 19:09:25 <SimonVT> Just because you're selecting 16 as the min sdk doesn't mean it's going to use that sdk for compiling
Jun 25 19:11:04 <thelawyer> SimonVT: ok but not using it since it's already there and I don't want to download API23?
Jun 25 19:13:01 <SimonVT> Why dont you want to compile against api23?
Jun 25 19:14:11 <dfd> ANyone from Bulgaria here?
Jun 25 19:14:18 <ktwo> ive already switched to api24
Jun 25 19:14:32 <SimonVT> That would be a good reason, yeah
Jun 25 19:15:41 <orbyt_> DLSteve: I have a large dislike for GCP
Jun 25 19:16:36 <DLSteve> orbyt_, To each their own. I have used both Azure and GCP and find the latter cheaper and easer to use.
Jun 25 19:18:13 <orbyt_> For me its all about online resources for the platform...SO, official docs, etc..
Jun 25 19:18:34 <orbyt_> and, at least last time i tried, GCP had absolutely shit documentation
Jun 25 19:18:59 <orbyt_> which seems to be a trend....
Jun 25 19:19:05 <orbyt_> :/
Jun 25 20:29:35 <grekkos> in my class I have a private List field and a getter for it. I ensure that this list is never null within the class itself using Collections.<MyType>emptyList(). In the getter I create a defensive copy with the copy constructor a la new ArrayList<>(myField); should I only do this if the list is non-empty or does it not matter?
Jun 25 20:30:22 <yawkat> grekkos: cant you use Collections.unmodifiableList
Jun 25 20:30:35 <grekkos> oh instead of copying it?
Jun 25 20:30:38 <yawkat> yes
Jun 25 20:30:43 <grekkos> hmm that's not a bad idea
Jun 25 20:31:02 <grekkos> it shouldn't be modified anyway
Jun 25 20:31:23 <yawkat> and at least in openjdk new ArrayList<>() is just as cheap as emptyList, not sure about android though
Jun 25 20:32:11 <grekkos> ah thanks
Jun 25 20:32:24 <grekkos> I thought I was in the java channel for some reason but I'm glad you mentioned it
Jun 25 20:32:28 <grekkos> haha
Jun 25 20:33:11 <grekkos> although I thought on the openjdk new ArrayList<>() has an initial capacity to it where as on android it starts off at 0... but I think that might be a detail I shouldn't count on
Jun 25 20:33:28 <yawkat> it was changed in a recent java version
Jun 25 20:33:31 <yawkat> 8 or 7
Jun 25 20:33:33 <grekkos> oh ok
Jun 25 20:33:38 <grekkos> maybe 8
Jun 25 20:33:45 <grekkos> I think I was looking at 7 docs when I saw it
Jun 25 20:33:49 <yawkat> and it actually shares the array.
Jun 25 20:33:58 <yawkat> so it's even cheaper than just capacity 0.
Jun 25 20:34:05 <grekkos> cool
Jun 25 20:34:10 <grekkos> yeah I think that's what android does
Jun 25 20:36:58 <Mavrik> Note that Android doesn't use the same standard library
Jun 25 20:37:07 <Mavrik> So counting on implementation details of JVM 8 on Android is not wise :)
Jun 25 20:43:33 <grekkos> yeah I was just pulling from what I saw in the android sources
Jun 25 20:48:47 <Mavrik> Those are better source yeah :)
Jun 25 21:21:02 <orbyt_> [orbyt, Lookit] erm
Jun 25 21:21:27 <orbyt_> [orbyt, Lookit] test
Jun 25 21:21:33 <orbyt_> [orbyt, Lookit] can any1 see this
Jun 25 21:24:53 <orbyt_> [orbyt, Lookit] Hello?
Jun 25 21:26:14 <orbyt_> [orbyt, Lookit] Anyone here
Jun 25 21:26:24 <orbyt_> [orbyt, Lookit] ?
Jun 25 21:27:38 <orbyt_> [orbyt, Lookit] Hello?
Jun 25 21:27:57 * shmooz keeps quiet
Jun 25 21:28:54 <orbyt_> [orbyt, Lookit] Can u see this? I'm testing something
Jun 25 21:31:04 <nereocystis> Is it possible to set android:installLocation only for minSdkVersion of 23?
Jun 25 21:31:22 <orbyt_> [orbyt, Lookit] Holy shit it does work ha
Jun 25 21:56:01 <mz|alex> This is the weirdest thing I've seen, I'm targeting SDK 22 (to bypass the marshmellow new permission scheme) I put WRITE_EXTERNAL_STORAGE in the manifest, but still can't write to sd card (samsung S7 edge).
Jun 25 21:56:43 <mz|alex> getting UnauthorizedAccessException: Access to the path "........whatever......" is denied
Jun 25 21:57:55 <mz|alex> from what I read, the WRITE_EXTERNAL_STORAGE will only provide write/read access to Primary external storage, which is NOT the sd card on Samsung S7 edge
Jun 25 21:58:17 <mz|alex> is there any way to provide access to the "Secondary external storage" ?
Jun 25 22:03:45 <_genuser_> one of the joys of android is the non-standard behavior from vendor to vendor and even from model to model on teh same vendor.
Jun 25 22:04:02 <_genuser_> samsung will make the sdcard the primary on some devices and the internal storage the primary on others.
Jun 25 22:04:26 <_genuser_> I think mostly tho, the internal is at least 8-16G and the primary lately. but it's samsung and it's android.
Jun 25 22:04:29 <_genuser_> expect no standards.
Jun 25 22:04:31 <_genuser_> lol.
Jun 25 22:04:59 <mz|alex> I just read a doc describing this so clearly.. I can't write on secondary storage outside the app's data directory
Jun 25 22:05:13 <SimonVT> I don't believe you can write wherever you like on the secondary storage, you have to use e.g. DIRECTORY_PICTURES
Jun 25 22:05:41 <mz|alex> SimonVT every single path I tried from the API points to a non-SD card location
Jun 25 22:06:04 <_genuser_> and to hear one of the dev on teh android team. She was harping on about how it will give greater flexibility in how you can add more space to your device.
Jun 25 22:06:30 <_genuser_> and I was reading this thinking I can't believe she's sounding like they did the opposite of what they said they wanted.
Jun 25 22:06:40 <_genuser_> and then I read the comments... I wasn't the only one with that thought.
Jun 25 22:06:41 <mz|alex> hahaha
Jun 25 22:07:04 <Mavrik> mz|alex, you can't just opt out from permissions and still expect OS to allow you to shit all over the SD card and read other apps private data :P
Jun 25 22:07:28 <Mavrik> _genuser_, oh my god
Jun 25 22:07:34 <Mavrik> The horrors.
Jun 25 22:07:46 <Mavrik> What would happen if you would have to write an app for those funny thing called computers
Jun 25 22:07:57 <mz|alex> the only and magic solution for this was the Adoptable Storage mechanism, which was disabled from S7, but can be enabled with a command line formatting
Jun 25 22:07:59 <Mavrik> That could have more than 5 storage devices at once at any point! O.o
Jun 25 22:08:04 <Mavrik> Those had to be wizards!
Jun 25 22:08:30 <_genuser_> originally an app could write private data to it's private folder (internal) and the external SD card could allow for shared space where anybody could dump whatever.
Jun 25 22:08:37 <Mavrik> mz|alex, ask user to point you where the files are via SAF dialog
Jun 25 22:08:45 <Mavrik> That will automatically also grant you permissions to there.
Jun 25 22:08:56 <Mavrik> And display all possible mounted devices including OTA drives
Jun 25 22:08:57 <mz|alex> but when enabling adoptable storage, everything starts to be weird on S7.. space reporting tools fail, usb shows files only if you disconnect/reconnect
Jun 25 22:09:06 <SimonVT> mz|alex: Even the APIs that return multiple paths, e.g. getExternalFilesDirs?
Jun 25 22:09:13 <_genuser_> Mavrik: I don't know what you're intending with your comment. But on a computer the OS never restricts you to only write to one drive and completely render everything else you add as "useless storage"
Jun 25 22:09:16 <SimonVT> Those were added to support multiple external storages
Jun 25 22:09:32 <Mavrik> _genuser_, riiiight :)
Jun 25 22:09:36 <mz|alex> SimonVT I was just reading about that multiple paths, the first one is the primary, and everything else is considered secondary, right?
Jun 25 22:09:55 <_genuser_> Mavrik: ok, so I see you're agreeing with what I was saying. phew. I wasn't sure what you were saying... :)
Jun 25 22:10:01 <Mavrik> SimonVT, thing is, you never get a free write permission on the FAT drives since 4.4
Jun 25 22:10:18 <mz|alex> it took me quite a long time to understand all this hell on SDK 23 and Samsung S7 storage handling.
Jun 25 22:10:28 <Mavrik> SAF is pretty much the only way that OS will grant you write permission there
Jun 25 22:10:33 <_genuser_> yeah I remember 4 is where the change happened to make you buy expensive external SD cards only to realize that's just useless.
Jun 25 22:10:34 <SimonVT> Since API support was added :p
Jun 25 22:10:50 <SimonVT> But yeah, they pretty much regretted letting apps do whatever on external storage
Jun 25 22:10:58 <mz|alex> what is SAF ?
Jun 25 22:11:00 <Mavrik> _genuser_, we support it just fine and works well on devices I own
Jun 25 22:11:08 <SimonVT> Didn't make the same mistake with secondary external storages
Jun 25 22:11:14 <Mavrik> With added bonus that random adware can't read your personal data there.
Jun 25 22:11:38 <_genuser_> Mavrik: you support what? think I missed something.
Jun 25 22:12:00 <Mavrik> Reading and writing to your socalled "useless" storage.
Jun 25 22:12:28 <_genuser_> Mavrik: using SAF?
Jun 25 22:12:39 <Mavrik> SimonVT, the only real complaint form my side is that they let people ship phones with adopted storage disabled
Jun 25 22:12:41 <Mavrik> _genuser_, yes.
Jun 25 22:12:54 <mz|alex> Mavrik indeed! that sucks
Jun 25 22:13:09 <_genuser_> Mavrik: didn't you say the user _HAS_ to navigate there first?
Jun 25 22:13:17 <Mavrik> And that they still let people ship apps with targetSdk < 23
Jun 25 22:13:23 <Mavrik> _genuser_, yes.
Jun 25 22:13:38 <Mavrik> Unless you're inside your environment
Jun 25 22:13:52 <Mavrik> Or you asked for permission to access the media directories.
Jun 25 22:13:53 <_genuser_> Mavrik: I can see how that's a good compromise between declaring all external useless and letting users use it. But not all users are sophisticated enough to even be able to do that.
Jun 25 22:14:14 <Mavrik> So what?
Jun 25 22:14:25 <_genuser_> so it might still restrict you as a dev.
Jun 25 22:14:31 <Mavrik> That's like saying devices shouldn't be secure because people are morons.
Jun 25 22:14:34 <_genuser_> unless you spend time/money to educate your end user.
Jun 25 22:14:44 <gkwhc> Hey everyone! im trying to make an android widget of for a timeline and only have a week to do it. what's the fastest way to make this widget? i see that there are lots of prototyping tools, but im not sure what to use or how they'd help?
Jun 25 22:14:56 <Mavrik> Expecting the user to know basics of how to operate a mobile computer is not unreasonable.
Jun 25 22:15:05 <_genuser_> but they won't.
Jun 25 22:15:15 <Mavrik> Too bad for them.
Jun 25 22:15:16 <_genuser_> there's still people who know what a c:\ is on windows.
Jun 25 22:15:25 <_genuser_> sure, too bad for them. but too bad for you too, as a dev.
Jun 25 22:15:36 <mz|alex> there's people that press F and then 5 when you tell them to press F5
Jun 25 22:15:38 <Mavrik> Nope.
Jun 25 22:15:50 <_genuser_> lol, right on f then 5 type stuff.
Jun 25 22:16:18 <mz|alex> I got that over the phone, I was so angry when the guy finally told me he only reads c:\>f5
Jun 25 22:16:19 <_genuser_> I don't like that android team decided that external storage would become an addendum to the android basic app storage ONLY.
Jun 25 22:16:36 <_genuser_> so it's sandboxed to be able to be used as android storage.
Jun 25 22:16:55 <Mavrik> But they didn't.
Jun 25 22:16:59 <_genuser_> when I plug in external extra storage, I _MAY_ want it to just be that. EXTRA storage.
Jun 25 22:16:59 <Mavrik> It can be merged with main storage.
Jun 25 22:17:36 <_genuser_> I"d much rather have seen something where they said you can consider it as "safe storgage" where apps can only write to with permission, or "extra dumping ground".
Jun 25 22:17:59 <_genuser_> but for the most part, I guess I don't care about this specific point that much.
Jun 25 22:18:07 <SimonVT> Mavrik: Maybe some day they'll restrict target sdk to n-2 or something
Jun 25 22:18:29 <Mavrik> Yeah, or just do the Apple thing and stop accepting updates with older target SDKs.
Jun 25 22:18:33 <nereocystis> _genuser, a limited shell, or chroot could easily limit your ability to write on arbitrary devices, on any Linux machine.
Jun 25 22:18:45 <Mavrik> At least if they don't want to be a security joke anymore.
Jun 25 22:19:14 <_genuser_> most of the apps I write don't end up needing that much space, so I suppose I don't really have that much of a beef with it.
Jun 25 22:19:24 <Mavrik> _genuser_, hm, I'm not sure of your point
Jun 25 22:19:33 <Mavrik> Apps can write to SD card to their own files / cache dir without permissions.
Jun 25 22:19:41 <SimonVT> At least you can't downgrade target sdk below 23
Jun 25 22:19:46 <Mavrik> They can also access other directories via standard OS choose file / directory dialog.
Jun 25 22:19:55 <Mavrik> Or user can adopt all the storage which transparently merges with main storage.
Jun 25 22:20:33 <Mavrik> (With latter sadly not being available on all phones due to OEM politics.)
Jun 25 22:21:52 <_genuser_> Mavrik: my point was that it has caused me any specific problems app-wise, so my "philosophical" point is not really that important. What I think should have been vs. what is, that whole conversation is not that important to have.
Jun 25 22:22:00 <_genuser_> Mavrik: * has NOT caused me
Jun 25 23:40:36 <licksjp> Hello
Jun 25 23:40:42 <licksjp>  I am Japanese
Jun 25 23:40:47 <licksjp> Morning!
Jun 25 23:52:22 <dunkel2> hello guys
Jun 26 00:24:13 <g00s> haha, i like the dog paw icon for 'dogfooding' http://www.androidpolice.com/2016/06/24/exclusive-google-is-building-a-live-support-app-with-screen-sharing-for-nexus-devices/
Jun 26 00:24:22 <g00s> i must add this to my betas immediately
Jun 26 01:29:05 <nereocystis> Is it possible to set android:installLocation only for minSdkVersion of 23?
Jun 26 02:04:24 <wonderingirl_> hej
Jun 26 02:05:02 <wonderingirl_> somebody pls help me
Jun 26 02:05:36 <wonderingirl_> LunarEclipse120: u around?
Jun 26 02:05:49 <LunarEclipse120> wonderingirl_: Yes.
Jun 26 02:06:13 <wonderingirl_> well my redmi has turned into a brick while i was installing
Jun 26 02:06:22 <wonderingirl_> how do i revive it
Jun 26 02:06:24 <LunarEclipse120> wonderingirl_: Is this an app development problem?
Jun 26 02:06:27 <LunarEclipse120> Installing what?
Jun 26 02:06:37 <wonderingirl_> the operating system from their website
Jun 26 02:06:56 <LunarEclipse120> This is for #android-root and why were yu doing that?
Jun 26 02:07:19 <wonderingirl_> i mean, remermber the incoming call quality issue i was telling u about a whole ago
Jun 26 02:07:30 <wonderingirl_> i finally got some time to fix it but installing their official one
Jun 26 02:07:46 <wonderingirl_> but i think I may have accidentally unplugged the USB from my notepad
Jun 26 02:07:51 <LunarEclipse120> RIP.
Jun 26 02:07:53 <LunarEclipse120> wonderingirl_: #android-root
Jun 26 02:08:07 <wonderingirl_> whats that
Jun 26 02:08:31 <phantomcircuit> is there anyway to send/recv audio by making an actual phone call?
Jun 26 02:08:58 <wonderingirl_> what is android root
Jun 26 02:10:24 <wonderingirl_> can you tell me what you mean by that
Jun 26 02:11:00 <wonderingirl_> LunarEclipse120: are you gonna help me or not
Jun 26 02:11:10 <LunarEclipse120> wonderingirl_: Go to that channel.
Jun 26 02:11:18 <wonderingirl_> are you there as well?
Jun 26 02:11:24 <wonderingirl_> I dont know anybody there
Jun 26 02:11:39 <LunarEclipse120> wonderingirl_: Yes this is not a dev question.
Jun 26 02:11:58 <wonderingirl_> who cares, you are here. What difference does it make you stickler lol
Jun 26 02:12:06 <LunarEclipse120> wonderingirl_: It is just the way it is.
Jun 26 02:12:10 <LunarEclipse120> Just go there.
Jun 26 02:12:16 <LunarEclipse120> Otherwise people get angry.
Jun 26 02:12:26 <wonderingirl_> I am afraid of going to unknown places lol
Jun 26 02:12:55 <LunarEclipse120> It isn't unknown.
Jun 26 02:13:23 <LunarEclipse120> "Root? Modded ROMs? Head to #android-root || App development questions? See #android-dev || Not talking Android? Head to #android-offtopic"
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Sun Jun 26 02:59:58 2016