**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sat Dec 30 03:00:02 2017 Dec 30 03:00:30 ok thanks Dec 30 03:01:00 pullups are rarely critical values, unless you're dealing with real high-speed stuff Dec 30 03:03:07 ok, I am still trying to get the weather click module to work, and I am trying to directly connect it to P9.19 and 20 instead of using the Mikroelectronica cape in between, so I can see where the problem is. Nothing pops up with i2cdetect -y -r 2 maybe I fried it... Dec 30 03:03:16 both SCA and SCL need pullup circuits right? Dec 30 03:03:25 *SDA Dec 30 03:04:06 there are some great i2c app notes you should skim over :) http://www.ti.com/lit/an/slva704/slva704.pdf https://www.nxp.com/docs/en/application-note/AN10216.pdf Dec 30 03:04:09 for instance Dec 30 03:04:29 yepp open in a tab already Dec 30 03:05:00 just making sure that I don't do something stupid and never find the problem. First time I do stuff with i2c Dec 30 03:06:31 Yup, the two lines are electrically the same, same drivers on 'em inside the chips, same pullup requirements. They just carry two signals that together make up an i2c bus. Dec 30 03:07:40 got it Dec 30 03:16:26 back up with my 'good' keyboard Dec 30 03:27:58 zmatt you mentioned there were a couple waysyo make the BBB boot to the sdcard every time.? Dec 30 03:28:37 . Dec 30 03:29:27 zeroing out the eMMC ... not sure if there was a downside with that Dec 30 03:30:39 if you're more selective(e.g. only wipe the u-boot.img and MLO sectors), then it's totally fine Dec 30 03:31:35 I dont really want to mess with the emmc if it can be avoided Dec 30 03:31:47 Isnt there a uEnv option? uenvcmd? Dec 30 03:32:29 but I would like to have networking running in Angstrom. Dec 30 03:32:44 but that's a whole different issue. Dec 30 03:33:06 fasle more info ?? Dec 30 03:33:57 Hey also finally got networking up on the bbb under 9.x but it seems unreliable to me. Dec 30 03:34:12 I looked it up once but I remember I freaked out... See on the google group I think it was posted there Dec 30 03:34:46 For me Debian on beaglebone is rock solid so far, I really like it. Dec 30 03:35:08 I was thinking of a jumper on the pin to the s2 button Dec 30 03:36:30 Yeah, Debian does seem solid. the networking in 9.x seems a bit unreliable. had it going last night and when I booted up this morning it was down again Dec 30 03:36:56 While you were out, I learned something: > booting from sd card generally doesn't require powering up with S2 button held down, although it doesn't hurt Dec 30 03:37:05 > the S2 button (sampled at power-up, not at reboot/reset) determines whether the bootloader (u-boot) gets loaded from eMMC or SD card Dec 30 03:37:12 > it usually doesn't matter too much, since the bootloader on eMMC will still try to boot linux from SD card before booting linux from eMMC Dec 30 03:37:22 > but it helps to avoid accidently using some combination of ancient bootloader and recent kernel or vice versa Dec 30 03:37:31 > if the system flashed to eMMC and the system on SD card are roughly of the same age, then using S2 button is probably unnecessary Dec 30 03:38:02 on mine, it stops with ds 0,1, &2 on and stops there. Dec 30 03:38:06 myself: you could also just have used pastebin instead of pasting that pile of text directly :P Dec 30 03:38:31 I usually do; this one seemed shorter than my usual pastebin threshold. Sorry. Dec 30 03:38:41 wa5qjh: probably too large difference in age between bootloader and system Dec 30 03:38:55 I dont want to mess with the Angstrom in the emmc tho. I like a good fallback :) Dec 30 03:39:06 angstrom... o.o Dec 30 03:39:08 that old Dec 30 03:39:13 why keep an ancient good fallback, rather than updating it to a recent good fallback? Dec 30 03:40:20 but yeah, you can alternatively connect P8.43 to ground via a 1-10 KΩ resistor Dec 30 03:40:20 well, my only access to my BBB without wifi running is keyboard and TV monitor with HDMI so pasting to pastbin with no neetworking is impossible Dec 30 03:40:47 P8.43, roger that Dec 30 03:41:46 Or invest some time now in cooking up a setup that brings up wifi on boot, and write *that* to emmc as your fallback, and be more prepared for the future :) Dec 30 03:42:19 or implement a morse code console that blinks the user LED and accepts input on one of the pushbuttons, and never be locked out again! Dec 30 03:42:23 wa5qjh: also, get a serial cable for the debug console Dec 30 03:42:46 maybe when I'm more comfortable with 9.x, I might. 9.x seems pretty well stripped down but I dont have networking up in Angstrom either.. Dec 30 03:42:53 ^^ yessss. Having a little ftdi cable around is the best thing ever. Dec 30 03:43:06 pretty much the only way to debug boot issues, and a very convenient way to debug networking issues Dec 30 03:43:18 at least the serial console lets you copy-paste stuff in and out of it Dec 30 03:43:27 ftdi allows debugging all the overlay loading process as well right? Dec 30 03:43:46 see uboot in action i mean Dec 30 03:43:49 I mean, you're on the local console, yeah Dec 30 03:44:06 the serial console gives you access to u-boot and the linux console Dec 30 03:44:08 they dont have those out here. cant even get double-row pin headers here. and shipping barely gets close to me. Dec 30 03:44:25 I forget sometimes that people don't own those and their only view into the machine is over networking or something Dec 30 03:44:43 wow man your setup sounds either like living on a glacier, in low earth orbit, the ocean floor, or Mars :) Dec 30 03:44:52 wa5qjh: you live in antarctica? Dec 30 03:44:56 where the heck did you get a beaglebone? heh Dec 30 03:44:59 yeah, that's pretty much my case here. Dec 30 03:45:17 no, middle earth Philippines! Dec 30 03:45:49 Get a cheap flight to shenzhen and empty one of the electronics shopping malls lol Dec 30 03:45:57 on W. Samar, and the stores around here dont stock stuff only one person Might buy Dec 30 03:46:26 (on a random note: it's really worth it to reconfigure the serial baudrate from 115200 to 460800 ... amazingly, it turns out that this makes the console four times as fast :P ) Dec 30 03:46:52 especially when using something like vim this gets very noticible Dec 30 03:48:21 that's interesting, I wonder if it's redrawing the whole screen when it doesn't need to Dec 30 03:48:32 I'm pretty accustomed to 9600; 115200 feels blazing fast :P Dec 30 03:48:44 9600 ... why oh god why? Dec 30 03:49:03 it's reliable over 200' cables Dec 30 03:49:16 and thus the default on a lot of telecom gear made in the 90s :) Dec 30 03:49:30 before ethernet console was the default Dec 30 03:50:15 dmx512 does 250kbps over 1.2 km Dec 30 03:50:20 there's really no need to use 9600 baud :P Dec 30 03:50:48 rs232 is single-ended and doesn't have a specified drive strength Dec 30 03:50:59 so don't use rs232 for long distances Dec 30 03:51:08 that's a recipe for making awful ground loops anyway Dec 30 03:51:55 a flight to china back and forth would be all I could afford, no electronics when I got there :) Dec 30 03:51:58 yes and no; the whole industry is like half ground-bars by weight Dec 30 03:52:13 so much copper Dec 30 03:52:30 well then good job making do with what you got Dec 30 03:53:06 guys in east germany built their computers from scanvenging west german floppy disk drives that were sent as trash Dec 30 03:53:46 so you got that going for you Dec 30 03:54:50 See all this copper? There's a ladder at the end of the aisle for scale. That's how you avoid ground loop problems, the brute-force way: https://i.imgur.com/vpQk2DW.jpg Dec 30 03:55:13 HEH, as for electronics parts, I did buy some stuff for the few years or months before I retired. and fortunatly just found them again a few days ago. Dec 30 03:56:14 anyway, should anyone wish to join the 460800-club, here's the u-boot patches I used: https://github.com/dutchanddutch/u-boot/commits/am335x-v2017.01 of course that speed really isn't needed in u-boot, but it's annoying if u-boot remains at 115200 while the kernel console is at 460800 Dec 30 03:56:29 hmm, I should forward-port those patches Dec 30 03:56:49 maybe submit some of them back to the u-boot project... although the process there looks fucking tedious Dec 30 03:56:51 thanks! Dec 30 03:58:41 been wanting to ask somebody what I gotta do to ssh -X which remotes the X window to a remote location. Dec 30 03:59:00 ssh -X is what you got to do for that Dec 30 03:59:01 so on a bbb wireless... should I put `dtb=am335x-boneblack-wireless.dtb` or `dtb=dtb=am335x-boneblack-emmc-overlay.dtb`, or nothing? Dec 30 03:59:18 fasle: overriding the dtb is normally not needed Dec 30 03:59:21 k Dec 30 03:59:57 if you do this, on a bbb wireless you definitely only want to use dtbs whose name start with "am335x-boneblack-wireless" Dec 30 04:00:05 ok Dec 30 04:00:44 note that if you use the latest image, u-boot overlays are used which means that instead of having a bunch of variations of the base dtb, it just uses one base dtb and you can turn various features on/off individually (like emmc, video, audio) Dec 30 04:02:57 So does this make sense? Dec 30 04:02:59 `uboot_overlay_addr0=/lib/firmware/cape-univ-audio.dtbo Dec 30 04:03:01 uboot_overlay_addr1=/lib/firmware/cape-univ-hdmi.dtbo Dec 30 04:03:03 uboot_overlay_addr2=/lib/firmware/cape-universalh.dtbo` Dec 30 04:03:44 my goal is to have everything available to config by using config-pin Dec 30 04:05:01 wa5qjh: Don't suppose you have TWO beaglebones, possibly? Cuz it occurs to me, I'm pretty sure you could just crosswire the two uarts together and use one as a console adapter for the other :) Dec 30 04:05:18 would probably mean moving a getty out of the way, but.. Dec 30 04:06:19 that sounds like fun, I'm gonna try it. Dec 30 04:08:03 yeah I was thinking of learning & simulating i2c functionality by having one of my bbbs act as slave but I was not sure if this is not just crazy. Dec 30 04:12:57 no, but I've got an rPi and a BBB. been thinking of doing something like that as well as ethernet between them. Dec 30 04:13:37 oh yeah! their uarts are both at 3.3v, that should work... I'd throw some resistors in between just in case. I'm gonna try that as soon as I clear off this table.. Dec 30 04:13:51 either of you ever think of a computer as a programable pulse generator? Dec 30 04:14:53 a BBB could be a pretty fancy dewsk/bench top piece of test equipment especially since it could also do monitoring and measurement too. Dec 30 04:15:11 pulse characterization? Dec 30 04:15:15 yeah my other project is a PRUDAQ setup Dec 30 04:15:33 with sigrok as logic analyzer, ideally networked Dec 30 04:15:42 as a replacement for my bitscope Dec 30 04:16:05 pulse, i2c,spi, uart stimulous and monitoring... Dec 30 04:16:06 So, there's Beaglelogic... Dec 30 04:16:57 you could add a TI launchpad or the like as additional channels Dec 30 04:17:01 yeah exactly, it was just rough to setup when I tried because most of the scripts still used the old device tree stuff like slots.9.something Dec 30 04:17:23 I like the idea of adding more stuff on top of beaglelogic capture though Dec 30 04:18:13 well it would be perfect as a multi channel logic analyzer, and I do not need so high resolution. Pretty sure beaglebone could do continous mode Dec 30 04:18:28 So, there's Beaglelogic... Dec 30 04:18:32 heh. Dec 30 04:18:38 I had built a simple python flask app that would show the data in a web browser Dec 30 04:18:56 b back shortly.. Dec 30 04:19:13 yeah but how many protocols does beaglelogic support natively? Dec 30 04:19:36 it's a Sigrok frontend.. Dec 30 04:20:07 ok I thought they had launched a beaglelogic cape separate from the prudaq Dec 30 04:20:19 then what you mean is what I used yes Dec 30 04:20:56 I still find it very complex at my level of beagle understanding Dec 30 04:23:29 beaglelogic can just capture the raw signals at up to 100Msps until memory is full :) Dec 30 04:23:45 continuous operation merely depends on being able to process the data in real-time Dec 30 04:24:09 yeah that's slight overkill for me. I do not need 100 Msps so I was hoping lower rates would allow processing and transmission Dec 30 04:24:42 processing the data in real time obviously will be easier at lower rates Dec 30 04:25:56 Hey could you guys please check this picture of my i2c setup if I got the pullups right and all that? i2detect finds absolutely nothing on i2c2 and the short C program I compiled gives IO error. https://imgur.com/a/F8MhU Dec 30 04:27:13 what value are those resistors? Dec 30 04:27:17 5k Dec 30 04:27:22 should be fine Dec 30 04:28:00 P9.19 / cape i²c scl 95 fast rx up 3 i²c 2 scl i2c@4819c000 (pinmux_i2c2_pins) Dec 30 04:28:02 P9.20 / cape i²c sda 94 fast rx up 3 i²c 2 sda i2c@4819c000 (pinmux_i2c2_pins) Dec 30 04:28:08 the pinmux is correct as well? Dec 30 04:28:19 avoid using i2cdetect btw, it can easily confuse the fuck out of an i2c device, including badly enough that the device won't respond anymore Dec 30 04:28:23 yes Dec 30 04:28:25 the big thing I'd suspect is marginal contact on those little jumper wires, a lot of the ones I've seen have some schmutz on the metal part of the pin when I first take 'em out of the package Dec 30 04:28:37 interesting Dec 30 04:29:19 would power-cycling the module reset it? Or do you mean lasting confusion? Dec 30 04:29:34 i2c is not a discoverable bus. just use the right transactions to the right address Dec 30 04:29:46 I mean until the peripheral is reset / power-cycled Dec 30 04:29:51 the module Dec 30 04:30:09 ok Dec 30 04:30:57 so in effect what you mean is that I should use e.g. the python api for this chip to talk to it, and assume it is there until i get IO error? Dec 30 04:31:24 for example Dec 30 04:31:45 ok thanks Dec 30 04:36:27 But still, when I load the bb.org uboot overlay for this module, it should not throw an error like the -121 error I had before. The expected dmesg output would be something like "BME280 loaded"? Can I deduce from the dmesg error that my scripts will have NACKs as well? Dec 30 04:37:17 the i2c bus has no way of knowing there's a BME280 there, it's not gonna print a message like that Dec 30 04:37:35 got it Dec 30 04:38:19 If you happen to have an arduino handy, there's plenty of example code for that platform, it might make a good stepping-stone Dec 30 04:38:52 Yeah I had it running on my arduino a while ago. I'll go back to that step when I return home. Dec 30 04:39:10 ahh okay, so you know the sensor isn't DOA Dec 30 04:39:50 well I might have killed it in the meantime :) Dec 30 04:40:31 entirely possible! I just rolled out a big piece of ESD matting onto my table because I keep getting a zap every time I stand up Dec 30 04:41:02 ouch... if you can feel it, the situation was very bad Dec 30 04:41:35 Crashed my laptop a few times cuz I keep zapping the touchpad Dec 30 04:41:52 so yeah. Now I've got a big chunk of mat with a grounding clip Dec 30 04:42:23 Yeah so I got my shirt stuck under my really nice new ESP mat and everything on it crashed on stone tiles ... not my best day Dec 30 04:42:41 oh jeez Dec 30 04:42:41 yeah so watch out for the grounding clip haha Dec 30 04:45:30 That's interesting apt remove chromium and fping and map and now gkrellm going in nicely. Dec 30 04:47:35 nope gkrellm did not go in nicely. several Hash mismatches Dec 30 04:50:07 heck, might even try re-installing chromium again, now all it's old dependencies are gone ( I hope) Dec 30 05:52:04 well after like 40 minutes of distractions and dicking with trying to get the rpi to move its console off the serial port, I've successfully used a raspi as a uart adapter to watch a bbb boot :) Dec 30 05:53:16 I wonder if there's a getty that would ignore text coming from another machine's console, until some special character Dec 30 05:54:11 such that two boards could always be null-modemed to each other and either one could act as a console server for the other, without requiring config changes per-use on either side Dec 30 05:55:58 great! Dec 30 05:56:24 so you plugged the raspi into the BBB's serial pins Dec 30 05:56:42 ? Dec 30 15:38:10 WOO! I got LWIP upgraded now time to port everything over to BBBlue Dec 30 15:53:28 nice! Dec 30 15:57:25 yeah Dec 30 15:57:38 not a huge kernel Dec 30 15:57:44 maybe 100k lines of code Dec 30 15:58:00 I'm curious how resource-heavy other non-lightweight implementations are, now... Dec 30 15:58:05 builds out to aboud 220k Dec 30 15:58:14 i am having issues with LWIP Dec 30 15:58:20 but it could be my scheduler Dec 30 15:58:44 like, I understand lwip on a severely constrained system like a softcpu on an fpga, but... beaglebones are pretty beefy in comparison, no? Dec 30 15:58:45 i get about 15-50ms Dec 30 15:58:47 on pings Dec 30 15:59:02 from a pi zero Dec 30 15:59:09 and a pi zero is about the same as a BB Dec 30 15:59:52 but what I changed because i felt the system was suffering on IO Dec 30 16:00:07 was instead of running rx from the nics IRQ Dec 30 16:00:41 was to put rx in it's own thread and just poll the rx buffer chain Dec 30 16:01:01 but with only about half a dozen threads running it would get near 0ms ping times Dec 30 16:02:12 there could be other unerlying issues I forgot about too.. I started writing the OS in 2002 stopped in 2005 and picked it backup 2017 Dec 30 16:03:25 plus i broke everything upgrading lwip but the lwip that was in my kernel was from 2005 Dec 30 16:03:37 and none of my semaphores were compatible Dec 30 16:04:22 myself: are you a developer or more of an admin? Dec 30 16:06:52 neither; I'm a solder guy who listens to conversations involving developers and admins and picks up words and then repeats them back out of context :) Dec 30 16:08:31 solder guy Dec 30 16:08:33 like hardware? Dec 30 16:08:36 I love to solder Dec 30 16:09:00 there is to much fun in everything to do one things Dec 30 16:09:25 I have more success in making machines that are tools than other things Dec 30 16:09:44 lots of CNC type machines... lathes, printers, laser etchers Dec 30 16:32:29 MrOlsen: Have you built spectrometry instruments by any chance? Dec 30 16:32:58 no, but I thought about it Dec 30 16:33:07 I started to build an MRI Dec 30 16:33:39 you looking to do mass spectrometry Dec 30 16:33:43 nice yeah some people in the Bay area consciousness hacking group experiment with DIY MRI etc Dec 30 16:33:55 well Im thinking about ion mobility spectrometry Dec 30 16:34:24 you're in the bay area? Dec 30 16:34:28 there are some off the shelf components that are not too expensive / complex Dec 30 16:34:31 I Was there a couple weeks ago Dec 30 16:34:42 the problem was the vast amounts of magnetic sensors Dec 30 16:34:43 add up Dec 30 16:34:47 yeah well over the holidays I'm with family but usually yes East Bay Dec 30 16:35:20 I was in SF for a short while, but I stay in Palo alto south of there Dec 30 16:35:23 was interviewing at FB Dec 30 16:35:32 oh great good luck! Dec 30 16:35:44 I felt so old :/ Dec 30 16:35:48 facebook MRI for better psycho advertisement targeting ouh? Dec 30 16:35:50 even though I'n that old Dec 30 16:36:06 the culter there was very different than here in NY Dec 30 16:36:10 haha I would not worry the kids got way too much self confidence Dec 30 16:36:13 culture Dec 30 16:37:03 I will admit everyone I met with there and all the interviewers (7 i had to deal with) were great and brilliant Dec 30 16:37:59 Oh certainly high level of tech competence. But lot's of self declared geniuses who think knowing how to code means they understand the universe. Dec 30 16:38:20 yeah Dec 30 16:38:46 I wouldn't say i got into any arguements, but it definitely got a little heated Dec 30 16:39:51 Haha nice keep pushing all good. Comfort zoning does not help them. My friends at FB were shicked how their product was used in the elections. They got to be reminded of the world out there. Dec 30 16:40:11 got to go, once I am further down the road with my IMS specs would be great to get your thoughts Dec 30 16:40:21 sounds good Dec 30 16:40:35 I'll be here for a while I'm enjoying this group.. no one to brash :) Dec 30 16:40:42 yeah me too Dec 30 19:45:03 hi all Dec 30 19:46:02 thanks everyone who helped yesterday to get into my first BBB box Dec 30 19:46:24 now I'm digging into rotex g1 box Dec 31 01:04:43 eject! **** ENDING LOGGING AT Sun Dec 31 03:00:02 2017