**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Mon Jul 02 02:59:58 2012
Jul 02 14:12:02 <summatusmentis> madnificent: did you ever figure it out?
Jul 02 15:11:38 <unwiredben> back in Austin
Jul 02 15:11:48 <unwiredben> today's code freeze day for Enyo 2
Jul 02 15:12:05 <unwiredben> trying to make the final push on bug fixes, then documentation this week
Jul 02 15:12:20 <unwiredben> (so checkins won't be frozen, but big changes aren't going in)
Jul 02 15:51:40 <madnificent> summatusmentis: sorry, i forgot what it was
Jul 02 15:52:35 * madnificent has just finished the proof of concept for an (in my opinion rather sweet) metaprogramming addition to enyojs.
Jul 02 15:53:26 * madnificent sadly had to hook into enyojs itself, perhaps the guy that helped me with this (startup partner) will handle that
Jul 02 15:54:28 <madnificent> s/me/him/
Jul 02 15:56:20 * PatrickC got some good work done with Jeremy Thomas yesterday...
Jul 02 15:57:48 <madnificent> hey PatrickC, long time no see
Jul 02 15:57:50 <madnificent> what did you do?
Jul 02 15:57:54 <PatrickC> madnificent!
Jul 02 15:57:58 <madnificent> PatrickC!
Jul 02 15:58:00 <madnificent> :P
Jul 02 15:58:08 <PatrickC> worked on getting oAuth working in an app of mine i was having trouble with :)
Jul 02 15:58:16 <PatrickC> now i can continue on my app haha
Jul 02 15:58:32 <madnificent> oh, you have some stuff on oAuth, that's interesting
Jul 02 16:07:05 <madnificent> if fxspec06 reenters the room, could someone point him my way.  i continuously seem to miss him and the metaprogramming framework should remove much of the boilerplate code he was talking about.
Jul 02 16:07:09 <madnificent> at least, i seem to recall it was him.
Jul 02 16:12:12 <madnificent> fxspec06: !
Jul 02 16:12:23 <madnificent> i was just spreading dirt about you
Jul 02 16:22:26 <madnificent> summatusmentis: ah, the scrollback thaught me: yes!  i wasn't sure if a bind occured etc, but enyo seems to play nice.  that means we could play nice also.
Jul 02 16:26:48 <summatusmentis> so everythings working, good
Jul 02 16:27:39 <madnificent> summatusmentis: it is awesome!
Jul 02 16:49:26 <fxspec06> yoooooooo
Jul 02 16:49:31 <fxspec06> dirt
Jul 02 16:49:37 <fxspec06> who's spreading dirt
Jul 02 16:49:49 * fxspec06 can turn dirt into mud
Jul 02 16:58:29 <madnificent> fxspec06: ME! I AM!
Jul 02 16:58:42 <fxspec06> who ?
Jul 02 16:58:42 <madnificent> fxspec06: whatchagonnado?  come over here and drink a pint?
Jul 02 16:59:08 <fxspec06> i'll hit you so hard, when you wake up your clothes will be out of style!
Jul 02 16:59:12 <madnificent> no seriously, you were complaining about some of the boilerplate code you needed to wrote, right?  at least, i seem to recall discussing it with you :)
Jul 02 16:59:23 * fxspec06 ohhhhhhh
Jul 02 16:59:31 <madnificent> fxspec06: haha, it'll swing you back to the 50's!
Jul 02 17:00:11 <fxspec06> i'll knock you right into the middle of next week!
Jul 02 17:00:43 <fxspec06> heh, no that wasn't me i don't think
Jul 02 17:01:26 <fxspec06> i've never used the bootplate
Jul 02 17:01:38 <madnificent> ah no, not that
Jul 02 17:01:55 <madnificent> things like making something published and making sure some trivial update passes thorugh.
Jul 02 17:02:01 <madnificent> so enyo itself, not bootplate
Jul 02 17:02:27 <fxspec06> hmm. the thing that makes something
Jul 02 17:03:36 <fxspec06> oh in like the portal
Jul 02 17:04:08 * madnificent doesn't remember the exact example anymore.  but i think it was something with publishing a variable and then making sure some trivial change occured in the component.
Jul 02 17:04:50 <madnificent> my proof of concept encompasses the creation of a published variable which, when updated, updates the components of the component with the same name as that published variable.
Jul 02 17:05:56 <fxspec06> oh, when you set a variable in hte published
Jul 02 17:06:25 <fxspec06> variableChanged() is called when you call setVariable(value)
Jul 02 17:07:29 <madnificent> i know
Jul 02 17:07:44 <madnificent> but if you have a component which needs to be in sync, you need to manage that manually
Jul 02 17:07:50 <madnificent> sec, i'm plotting an example
Jul 02 17:08:25 <fxspec06> k
Jul 02 17:11:01 <summatusmentis> have either of you used phonegap to upload photos?
Jul 02 17:11:05 <madnificent> sec, i'm going to see if they run as well
Jul 02 17:11:38 <fxspec06> no sir
Jul 02 17:18:27 <madnificent> fxspec06: sorry, i'm a mental retard in making examples, it seems.  is there a defacto standard paste service?
Jul 02 17:18:49 <fxspec06> pastebin.com
Jul 02 17:19:16 <fxspec06> pastie.com / org
Jul 02 17:19:24 <fxspec06> one or the other i gues
Jul 02 17:20:02 <madnificent> pastie is cooler
Jul 02 17:20:13 <madnificent> the one without the feature doesn't run apparently.  but the idea should be clear nonetheless!
Jul 02 17:20:55 <madnificent> http://pastie.org/4188379
Jul 02 17:20:57 <madnificent> less code, more fun!
Jul 02 17:22:25 <madnificent> ah, I see!  finally.  the published variable in the NoFeature version should be example
Jul 02 17:22:35 <fxspec06> yes
Jul 02 17:23:16 <madnificent> but there's more wrong with it
Jul 02 17:23:34 <fxspec06> you don't have this.inherited(arguments) in create
Jul 02 17:23:35 <madnificent> suffice to say, the version with the feature spec has less chance of producing an error
Jul 02 17:23:39 <madnificent> ah, right
Jul 02 17:24:31 <madnificent> that'll be the bastard.  again something that can't be an issue with the feature...  look, if i were smart, i wouldn't need so much help.  (though admittedly, i'm totally fueled about the other stuff than the NoFeature version).
Jul 02 17:24:54 <fxspec06> bah, don't say that. you're plenty smart
Jul 02 17:24:59 <fxspec06> the not smart don't ask questions
Jul 02 17:25:43 <fxspec06> and they also copy their dropbox old files over the files they just wrote
Jul 02 17:26:26 <fxspec06> seriously, why doesn't windows show like super big red bold fonts on the ARE YOU FREAKING SURE YOU WANT TO COPY THIS FILE box
Jul 02 17:26:37 * fxspec06 dislike
Jul 02 17:27:23 <madnificent> fixed it http://pastie.org/4188379
Jul 02 17:27:41 <madnificent> LoL btw
Jul 02 17:27:46 <summatusmentis> fxspec06: because that'd get really annoying
Jul 02 17:28:11 <madnificent> fxspec06: wasn't microsoft dropping fonts in their UI (visual studio)
Jul 02 17:28:12 <fxspec06> well, i think windows should keep shadow copies of recently overwritten files
Jul 02 17:28:31 <fxspec06> especially if they're .js files >_<
Jul 02 17:28:43 <fxspec06> would've saved me an hr yesterday
Jul 02 17:28:44 <madnificent> fxspec06: it's called a repository.
Jul 02 17:28:57 <madnificent> and some call it git.  and they don't have those problems
Jul 02 17:29:29 <fxspec06> does it auto sync as you save
Jul 02 17:29:42 <fxspec06> i should just set up my workspace to auto sync with dropbox
Jul 02 17:30:23 <madnificent> fxspec06: i think a friend of mine places his git folder directly into the dropbox folder, so it syncs for him.
Jul 02 17:30:28 <fxspec06> nothing can save stupidity
Jul 02 17:30:35 <madnificent> i have set up a small git server and that does things nicely as well (gitosis)
Jul 02 17:30:38 <fxspec06> where there's a will to break something, there's a way
Jul 02 17:30:58 <madnificent> if yo u don't know git, there are some tiny good books about it.  but you should tell me (otherwise i won't look up the name)
Jul 02 17:31:32 <fxspec06> i know some git, enough to hook up a repository, pull, commit, and clone fairly comfortably
Jul 02 17:31:45 <fxspec06> but i don't know anything about any of its other features
Jul 02 17:33:04 <madnificent> fxspec06: it's local, it's fast.  and you have a bunch of things to alter the history if necessary.  bootplate uses these nested things of which i can't remember the name right now :)
Jul 02 17:33:12 <madnificent> sheesh, i must've blown a fuse
Jul 02 17:33:42 <madnificent> oh, also cool about features, is that you can use features to specify features (i don't have a direct use just yet, but meta-meta is always cooler than meta)
Jul 02 17:36:03 <fxspec06> lol, yes definitely
Jul 02 17:36:18 <fxspec06> i know there's a way to hook up titanium to git
Jul 02 17:36:25 <fxspec06> i just haven't bothered yet
Jul 02 17:36:41 <madnificent> if you have a server, setting up gitosis is easy as well
Jul 02 17:37:01 <fxspec06> i do not have a server.
Jul 02 17:38:40 <fxspec06> i should have a server, but sadly i'm still a young'n
Jul 02 17:39:01 <madnificent> then i'd just place it in a folder hosted by box.net or dropbox or so
Jul 02 17:39:19 <fxspec06> hrm, you can sync w/ box.net? good to know
Jul 02 17:39:32 <fxspec06> because i have like, 48 more free GB on box.net than i do db
Jul 02 17:39:34 <madnificent> just place the git folder in there, i think it should work (but back it up just in case)
Jul 02 17:39:45 <madnificent> doesn't box.net work the same way?
Jul 02 17:39:53 <fxspec06> ah yes, the daily backups that i haven't set up yet
Jul 02 17:39:55 <madnificent> it has a local folder to store things and it syncs whatever you use?
Jul 02 17:40:07 <fxspec06> box.net is different, i haven't looked into it too much
Jul 02 17:40:17 <fxspec06> i use it for school papers mostly
Jul 02 17:40:31 <fxspec06> dropbox has the public folder
Jul 02 17:40:44 <fxspec06> which is free hosting essentially
Jul 02 17:41:00 <madnificent> then i'm not 100% sure.  either case: git has /everything/ it needs in the folder in which the repository has been created.  so if you have all files in there, then you have everything you need.
Jul 02 17:41:18 <madnificent> so, if you think you're going to screw things up with some git commands you want to try, just copy the folder and try them. :)
Jul 02 17:42:31 <fxspec06> i love how in the beginning of an app, everything is so nice and neat, and you're like 'oh hey this is cool i know where everything is,' and then after it's written you're all like 'sdflhgfdghfd wth is this'
Jul 02 17:43:05 <fxspec06> 1000 lines is like, my headache limit
Jul 02 17:43:14 <madnificent> that's why i work hard to make things simpler
Jul 02 17:43:30 <madnificent> it's why i kind-of like lisp (a lot) and why i built the features thing
Jul 02 17:43:39 <fxspec06> i tried, that's what i focused on with this app
Jul 02 17:43:55 <madnificent> the goal is not to make code trivially simple.  the goal is to keep all things manageable by limiting the scope of your reasoning.
Jul 02 17:44:14 <fxspec06> smaller functions
Jul 02 17:44:28 <madnificent> a human being has 6 to 13 elements in short term memory.  so that's the branching factory ou can use in pieces of your code.  from the big architecture, to the smallest function.
Jul 02 17:44:33 <fxspec06> that's one thing i didn't do last yr that ive been doing more this yr
Jul 02 17:44:35 <madnificent> at least, that's my take on it.
Jul 02 17:45:21 <fxspec06> in this app, i have a bunch of nifty smaller functions, and then one big function that moves the peg around the track
Jul 02 17:45:33 <fxspec06> it's be cool if i had a sidekick buddy to do smaller things for me
Jul 02 17:45:39 <fxspec06> like i had in my internship
Jul 02 17:46:18 <fxspec06> why is this app telling me mojo is not defined -_____________________-
Jul 02 17:47:18 * madnificent doesn't know
Jul 02 17:47:29 <madnificent> i should get more =everything= sometime soon
Jul 02 17:49:28 <fxspec06> my issue is i write stuff and then i realize there's a better way, but instead of taking the time to fix it and make it better i realize it's not worth it, and then i end up working around it later on
Jul 02 17:55:04 <madnificent> yeah, that's common
Jul 02 17:55:24 <madnificent> sometimes you need to do things in a bad way so you can improve on them later.  there's a discovery in there
Jul 02 17:56:03 <madnificent> the costs for leaving something inefficient in there are continuously rising... but it's inial cost may be low.  so in the end, some things turn out to be quite ok :)
Jul 02 17:56:36 <fxspec06> well, sometimes a solution isn't really apparent until later on
Jul 02 17:57:06 <fxspec06> and the time it'd take to fix it not worth it. esp when there's more important things to work on
Jul 02 18:05:04 <fxspec06> i think that's a big problem in small companies trying to get started
Jul 02 18:05:10 <fxspec06> wooo i fixed my position problem
Jul 02 19:55:47 <summatusmentis> I wish there were an easier way to test phonegap/photo access w/o deploying to device every 10 minutes
Jul 02 21:03:00 <summatusmentis> if I have an enyo.Image, how do I get the actual image object out of it?
Jul 02 21:08:11 <fxspec06> image.domnode ?
Jul 02 21:09:08 <summatusmentis> I'm trying hasNode(), and that seems to work
Jul 02 21:39:29 <Tibfib_> call image.hasNode()
Jul 02 21:39:32 <Tibfib_> then you can use image.node
Jul 02 21:42:01 <Tibfib_> hmmm. not sure if my enyo2 app is fast enough :/
Jul 02 22:12:13 <Tibfib_> Might have to go native.
Jul 02 22:17:13 <summatusmentis> I'm worried I'm gonna have to do the same thing, becasue I cannot flipping get this image stuff to work properly
Jul 02 22:18:08 <Tibfib_> enyo is awesome for basic apps… but I don't think it can give me the performance I want with my app
Jul 02 22:18:34 <Tibfib_> summatusmentis: what are you doing?
Jul 02 22:22:07 <summatusmentis> trying to take a photo, and upload a base64-encoded version of it, as a form parameter in the URL, via a POST request
Jul 02 22:22:35 <summatusmentis> and i can take the photo, but one of the 2 following steps is broken
Jul 02 22:22:47 <summatusmentis> (either base64-encoding, or the POST request)
Jul 02 22:22:59 <summatusmentis> I'm postivie it has to d w/ base64 encoding
Jul 02 22:23:17 <Tibfib_> you're using chrome to debug, right?
Jul 02 22:24:32 <summatusmentis> I can't
Jul 02 22:24:38 <Tibfib_> use a sample image
Jul 02 22:24:42 <Tibfib_> and debug in chrome.
Jul 02 22:24:43 <summatusmentis> oh
Jul 02 22:24:48 <summatusmentis> shit
Jul 02 22:25:08 <summatusmentis> well, no, wait
Jul 02 22:25:22 <summatusmentis> the issues that I think I'm having are (as far as I know) android specific
Jul 02 22:38:55 <summatusmentis> although, if I just fixed this with window.btoa, I'm gonna be mad
Jul 02 23:06:20 <summatusmentis> Tibfib_: is there a way to get raw binary image data from image.node ?
Jul 03 00:33:40 <baboo> i need to know how to title sist items
Jul 03 00:35:22 <baboo> list
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Tue Jul 03 02:59:57 2012