**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Wed Jun 13 03:00:02 2018 Jun 13 03:16:21 I just got my Gemini in the mail today, and I'm trying to set up dual-boot with Debian but having a hell of a time; I have the flash tool running (on *buntu 18.04), but I can't seem to download the images; it just gives me "Please select one ROM at least before execution." but I'm unable to checkmark any of the listed items . . . Jun 13 03:46:02 You're probably better off installing Termux and calling it a day ;) Jun 13 03:46:10 At least until the tools/procedure gets a bit more mature. Jun 13 03:48:01 That's . . . silly, I mean I didn't get this for Android, there's a billion small devices I could run Android on, and I have tons already! Jun 13 03:49:05 I mean it's nice to have an actual keyboard but it's not that nice, heh Jun 13 03:51:57 Do what you like. I'm waiting on something a bit more out of the "alpha" zone. Jun 13 03:52:33 Well I mean the default configuration is a dual-boot, it's not like I can't retreat to stability if I want to, right? Jun 13 03:52:53 (Also, why Termux, rather than GNURootDebian? ;)) Jun 13 03:53:24 May your config-and-wipe cycle be brief ;) Jun 13 03:53:56 I have plenty of books to read while things go, heh, if I could only literally get the very first step to work at all . . . Jun 13 03:54:30 I'm sure it will all be fine. < hides forum posts to the contrary > Jun 13 03:54:55 Well again, I'm completely okay (in fact quite expecting) things to go terribly wrong. Jun 13 03:55:00 I do plan on utilizing it fully, I just know when to hold back and let everyone be beta testers. Jun 13 03:55:06 What I wasn't expecting was being unable to download the firmware in the first place... Jun 13 03:55:18 Yes, that's odd Jun 13 03:55:20 Yeah, let me be a beta tester, that's all I'm asking of this device! Jun 13 03:55:25 heh Jun 13 03:55:36 x25 or x27 firmware Jun 13 03:56:01 I have no idea what that means Jun 13 03:56:07 I'm just trying to follow http://support.planetcom.co.uk/index.php/Flashing_Guide Jun 13 03:56:31 Yes, I ran into the "scatter file" nonsense and my "oh, fun" alarm went off Jun 13 03:58:01 Hrmmm wait, maybe I literally can't do this at all. Jun 13 03:58:02 Weird, weird, weird; why aren't there images available for the darned wifi-only model? Jun 13 03:58:03 You'd think that one would be less hassle to support! Jun 13 03:58:30 Its all a dog's breakfast of blog updates and documentation fragmentation Jun 13 03:58:36 * keithzg[m] thinks back to his cellular Nexus 7 and how it always lagged well behind the wifi-only model on updates Jun 13 03:59:28 I love the device, but after being a full-time network admin wrestling with all kinds of cisco chicanery, my patience for figuring out things that aren't well documented is low. Jun 13 03:59:32 So, best of luck. Jun 13 03:59:38 Well geez they should have sent someone else this unit before me, I don't really care about having another Android device to play with! Jun 13 04:00:14 I can deal with a lack of documentation; that there's literally no firmware available for the wifi-only model kindof stops me in my tracks though. Jun 13 04:00:27 Well, the kicker is the Debian distro that you do get on there isn't really optimized for it - at least from the blog/forum posts I read. Jun 13 04:00:56 Honestly I'd be fine with a terminal-only interface haha Jun 13 04:01:00 So its a lot of tweaking for not a lot of functionality. Oh, and don't you dare try to mount the Android partition from Debian, you'll 'eff the install. Jun 13 04:01:02 Fun fun Jun 13 04:01:04 That's how I spend most of my days anyways. Jun 13 04:02:43 "You're in a maze of firmware upgrades, all seemingly alike" Jun 13 04:02:47 hehe Jun 13 04:02:57 lol Jun 13 04:03:33 Sadly the path I know I need to go on, http://support.planetcom.co.uk/index.php/Gemini_Firmware#WiFi-Only_Gemini, just says "coming soon" Jun 13 04:04:30 To be honest, if they sold a second revison with things PRE-LOADED, that would be excellent. And I'd buy it, because I don't care about swinging around my e-peen to show people I know something. Just gimme something that doesn't burn my time with too much micro-managing config/flash nonsense. :) Jun 13 04:04:41 oh well dang Jun 13 04:04:45 dead-ended Jun 13 04:05:56 Yeah see that's the thing, I'm quite fine with futzing about with flashing stuff, compiling and setting up things for a customized desktop environment afterwards, etc etc. But I can't even do step one 'cause there's just no firmware available! Jun 13 04:06:09 Yes, that's unfortunate Jun 13 04:07:45 Time to tinker a bit with Yet Another Android Device I guess, sigh Jun 13 04:08:12 Yes, that dang working OS that installs stuff easily ;) Jun 13 04:08:28 But I sense your dual-boot yearning. I get it. Jun 13 04:08:46 Perhaps it will be soon, and you can get the image. Jun 13 04:09:22 I sure hope so; I already have a decent Android device with a keyboard, I didn't need another! Jun 13 04:09:41 But you could sit them side-by-side and have MEGA DROID Jun 13 04:09:48 and learn to cross-type like two drum kits in a rock band Jun 13 04:10:57 * keithzg[m] 's other keyboard-oriented Android device is also actually on the current version of Android, not, like, two versions behind :P Jun 13 04:11:28 Did you really miss out just a few .01 revs behind Jun 13 04:11:55 Well yeah, actually. Particularly because it's a major and a minor revision behind. Jun 13 04:12:41 If you need those features, sure. Jun 13 04:12:47 So for instance unlike with 8.0 or 8.1, if I want to install and use F-Droid I have to universally enable non-PlayStore installations on the Gemini, rather than only whitelisting F-Droid. That's quite unfortunate from a security standpoint. Jun 13 04:13:23 Yes, obviously, if you don't need features then you don't care if they're not there, that's tautologically true :P Jun 13 04:13:50 Plenty of people walking around with v4.0 and they don't care ;) Jun 13 04:17:00 Oh they fucking should, with that old of a version of Android you can literally get malware from images on webpages . . . Jun 13 04:17:19 Hah, I just checked 13% of people are running around with versions 4.4 and lower ;) Jun 13 04:17:27 Just funny. Jun 13 04:18:35 http://www.statista.com/statistics/271774/share-of-android-platforms-on-mobile-devices-with-android-os/ Jun 13 04:18:52 Yeah in many ways Android is the new Windows; a billion devices (not even necessarily exaggerating) running insecure software . . . Jun 13 06:20:04 moin Jun 13 06:22:57 TheKit: nice! ok, you got 2 warning regarding irqs it seems, and it hangs later at usb Jun 13 06:24:11 it got the 4 GB of ram - good Jun 13 06:24:52 interesting that it got only 5 cpus Jun 13 06:26:44 hmm, did you have a proper initramfs? Jun 13 06:27:43 it could be that the kernel already tried to execute the binary at it Jun 13 06:30:59 try to pack a simple static compiled busybox into your initramfs Jun 13 06:31:20 ah, you limited the cpu count ;) Jun 13 06:32:02 I think that is already worth to mention to https://github.com/gemian/gemini-keyboard-apps/wiki/LinuxMainlining - short list of steps (as you had some problems) and the output Jun 13 06:34:15 after getting a basic busybox working we can try to populate the device tree to get storage and usb running Jun 13 06:36:34 and then: fun :-D Jun 13 06:43:19 it could be worth to try a init=/bin/sh as well (if on the initramfs there is this file) Jun 13 07:05:50 mifritscher, I used current initramfs from Linux, I thought of this as well, but looks more like a hang to me, e. g. watchdog and pstore drivers are not initialized Jun 13 07:06:10 it's not usb hang in particular though Jun 13 07:06:19 ok Jun 13 07:06:42 (I tried disabling it and few other things) Jun 13 07:06:57 if the init process couldn't be initialised ots often apperas as hang Jun 13 07:07:30 should try with init=/bin/sh then Jun 13 07:09:12 yeah. the next step could be disable the complete net + usb to speed up the booting - if the watchdog barks at 0.8 seconds the should see it then ;-) Jun 13 07:09:40 (if init=/bin/sh does not work) Jun 13 07:09:48 no, watchdog waits 10 seconds Jun 13 07:09:55 ah, good Jun 13 07:11:34 you could try to limit the ram as well - perhaps in the upper regions there are other things mapped (modem comes to mind) Jun 13 07:13:01 perhaps we should collect bootlogs (android, debion-TP, recovery, mainline kernel) somewhere to ease comparing Jun 13 07:14:24 I'll start digging deeper into the gemini field of linux this weekend - then I'll some time (its the first weekend with my gemini then ;-) Jun 13 07:15:46 btw, the "Mixoo Präzision Disc Pen" seems to work nicely with the gemini - and both ends. So, we have a pen, which is greatly usefull especially for Linux :-) Jun 13 07:20:35 regarding the UART: what is the voltage? 3,3V or lower? Because if it is lower I need to buy an adapter Jun 13 07:24:43 mifritscher, should be 1.8V, but I have 3.3V, so I didn't connect Tx yet Jun 13 07:25:10 ah Jun 13 07:27:06 about pens, I saw 10$ "active" styluses on AliExpress with USB charging, I wonder what principle do they use and if it will work for Gemini Jun 13 07:28:10 the nice thing is that this is even a passive pen Jun 13 07:29:14 I tried some active pens as well but they don't work. I think that they try to emit some electrical field which changes the capacitance under the pen which gets detected as "finger" Jun 13 07:30:47 like https://www.aliexpress.com/item/YUNAI-Active-Stylus-Pen-For-ipad-For-Sumsung-Universal-Screen-Pen-Tablet-Capacitive-Touch-Screen-Pen/32790270606.html?spm=2114.search0104.3.8.4b4c253dSSxMXt&ws_ab_test=searchweb0_0,searchweb201602_5_10152_10151_10065_10344_10068_5722815_10342_10343_10340_5722915_10341_10543_5722615_10696_10084_10083_10618_10307_10301_5722715_10059_100031_10103_10624_10623_10622_5722515_10621_10620,searchweb201603_25,ppcSwitch_5&algo_e Jun 13 07:30:47 xpid=75413e0e-9815-4800-ba17-e2ecbf08c4d2-1&algo_pvid=75413e0e-9815-4800-ba17-e2ecbf08c4d2&priceBeautifyAB=0 Jun 13 07:31:03 sorry for overgrown link Jun 13 07:31:59 hmm, for the uart I think I'll buy https://www.ebay.de/itm/USB-to-TTL-UART-RS232-Isolated-FT230-5V-3-3V-2-5V-1-8V/173324889284?hash=item285af7ecc4:g:FGEAAOSw7z1aK8A~ . Jun 13 07:32:30 hehe, one of mines could be even that pen^^ Jun 13 07:32:49 you tried it with Gemini, and it didn't work? Jun 13 07:33:38 yep Jun 13 07:34:31 I wonder why 1,8V adapters are so expensive, like the one you linked is 1.8V Jun 13 07:34:35 *13 EUR Jun 13 07:34:59 yes, most of the "normal" 1,8(3.3/5V are even in the range of 20+ Jun 13 07:35:35 and this one is even isolated - and works at (almost) every range because it use the voltage from the target Jun 13 07:35:49 which is a nice thing Jun 13 07:37:18 because then nothing can be destroyed because of choosing a wrong voltage^^ Jun 13 07:45:48 so, gtg, working and so ;) Jun 13 07:45:50 cu Jun 13 07:54:17 ahoy Jun 13 07:55:01 anybody got their HDMI output working? stock install (no changes), rebooted with supplied USB3->HDMI cable already connected. I've tried literally 8 different screens in the last 2 weeks, nothing. Jun 13 07:55:17 *connected to right-hand side usb socket. Jun 13 08:47:25 I have the HDMI adapter but I haven't tried it yet Jun 13 08:51:29 dch, I just checked, and it works for me :) Jun 13 08:51:53 Omegamoon: thanks - then this may be a defective unit :-( Jun 13 08:52:50 there's also the casing that doesn't sit flat on the desk when typing, the whole case bounces a bit during typing, does anybody else have that? Jun 13 08:53:25 it's annoying but not catastrophic. the whole point of this for me, was to enable remote support of "restart that thing please" without needing a full laptop to lug around. Jun 13 08:53:26 checked 2 monitors and both work just fine... as long as you use the right USB that is Jun 13 08:53:52 hmmmm is the cable anything special? maybe I can try to find a local cable to test with Jun 13 09:00:23 I guess there is something special about it... Planet calls it "the dedicated Planet Computers HDMI cable", so that doesn't sound too generic ;) Jun 13 09:02:09 pinout is different from normal type C to HDMI Jun 13 09:03:47 The hdmi adaptor is indeed quite special, yeah... the chipset doesn't usually have the ability, so they did Things(TM) to make it happen :) Jun 13 09:06:50 interestingly the USB extender "dock" cable works perfectly in my Dell XPS13 running FreeBSD, so that bit is just a generic pile o'bits Jun 13 09:17:42 my device is stable while I type, unless I type really hard on it: in this case the screen wobbles a bit and the base unit moves up and down Jun 13 09:18:36 I don't have the habit of typing hard on any keyboard, so that's not an issue for me Jun 13 09:21:09 the problem is that, because of how the hinge is designed, if you press hard on the keyboard while it is open, the lower part of the device will go down, pushing up the hinge and moving forward the screen, though not much, so it doesn't close anyway Jun 13 09:22:24 I believe the idea was to have the keyboard a bit tilted toward the user during use, though I'd have preferred a more traditional and stable hinge Jun 13 09:24:59 I'd have preferred a rotating cantilever like the Psion 5 - I think I've even figured out a way to remove the flexicable weak point Jun 13 09:25:23 I think I just want something that sits still on a flat surface while I type :D Jun 13 09:25:32 y'know, like a keyboard Jun 13 09:25:47 dch: You've not used the "Basic" Dell keyboards then? Jun 13 09:26:13 Bouncy bouncy bouncy - especially if you're hitting the tgb keys :) Jun 13 09:26:28 dapol2: evidently not. I'm a long-time mechanical kb user, but I'm fine with the xps13 one for travelling. Jun 13 09:26:38 I've been toying with the idea of putting a few 'pads' on the bottom to make it grip on a surface like a table, but I suspect that means I won't be able to use the PC leather pouch if I do... Jun 13 09:26:43 really dont like the apple keyboards Jun 13 09:26:45 dch: These things were bargain basement membrane keyboards Jun 13 09:26:48 canny[m]: thats a neat hack idea Jun 13 09:27:07 they could even be removable sticky ones, theyre super cheap these days Jun 13 09:27:15 canny[m]: I'm in the middle of designing a beltpack for mine Jun 13 09:27:38 Granted, the beltpack's going to end up silly as I need it to carry my work phone too :) Jun 13 09:28:26 dapol2: like a holster? let me know how it goes... I always fear damaging my Gemini by putting it in my pocket! Jun 13 09:29:25 btw the linux flashing instructions only have windows screenshots, and i have no windows os around. Jun 13 09:29:26 https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DY-pyRCW0AEwGBF.jpg:large Jun 13 09:29:31 erm http://support.planetcom.co.uk/index.php/Flashing_Guide Jun 13 09:29:35 canny[m]: Mine's beginning to get the finish worn on the metal :( Jun 13 09:30:01 I've never flashed an android device before, is it significantly different? Jun 13 09:30:43 dch: Varies on a device by device basis, but no - not fundamentally Jun 13 09:31:11 dapol2: already? that doesn't bode well...if that starts happening to me, I may 'skin' it with some Sticky-back plastic Jun 13 09:31:11 (only UK kids of a certain age will get that 80's kids TV reference...) Jun 13 09:31:27 canny[m]: A lot of people are already doing that Jun 13 09:31:31 Mine gets a *lot* of use Jun 13 09:31:44 and normally I remember not to dump my car keys in the same pocket Jun 13 09:31:54 yeah I've seen a few on the FB page...they look pretty good too! Jun 13 09:32:00 And here's one I made earlier! Jun 13 09:32:02 :) Jun 13 09:32:13 lol Jun 13 09:32:18 And indeed Down Shep! Jun 13 09:32:26 dapol2: cool, so AFAICT if I make a backup of the NVRAM partition its possible to recover from even the most egregious screw-ups? any other newbie tips? Jun 13 09:32:56 dch: Can't really give any advice on this other than "Back everthing up before you start playing" Jun 13 09:32:56 . o O ( I'd probably start skinning mine.. and end up making a room-sized Tracey Island instead! ) Jun 13 09:33:25 canny[m]: Just at the point you can't get one in the stairs :) Jun 13 09:33:27 umm Jun 13 09:33:30 one in the stores! Jun 13 09:33:31 oops Jun 13 09:33:50 heh Jun 13 09:34:05 dch: the flasher is same on both platforms Jun 13 09:34:09 Damn - now I'm thinking of 3d printing a Thunderbird 2 with the Gemini on a deployment mechanism like Thunderbird 4 Jun 13 09:34:23 That's gonna be a *big* print Jun 13 09:35:33 TB2 was the best craft - chunky and practical! (as some have described me...) Jun 13 09:46:11 any recommendation on inexpensive cases, eg, some sort of padded zip case from amazon Jun 13 09:49:04 some people are recommending the Waterfield case for the PS Vita, which seems to fit the Gemini well, I'm also considering to get one: https://www.oesf.org/forum/index.php?showtopic=34986 Jun 13 09:59:43 thanks Jun 13 10:10:25 yay mines finally locked Jun 13 10:15:23 @hdmi adapter: in my experience, it works only in one direction Jun 13 11:03:28 yep, that's stupid.. on a laptop you wouldn't want all windows to minimize if it's locked and reopened Jun 13 11:07:00 but it is like open the app bar on open changeable Jun 13 11:07:45 i haven't been able to update android to get the app bar setting.. Jun 13 11:10:27 i have flashed the 10.05. release before the first boot x) Jun 13 12:04:52 TheKit, I disassembled the Gemini to look up the serial console pads on the board, but wow... these are small pads! Jun 13 12:46:20 Omegamoon, yeah, but soldering wasn't that difficult with a small soldering iron. Planet told me their ODM just used wire from cheap headphones for that Jun 13 13:43:25 is there a photo about the pcb and the uart? ;-) Jun 13 13:54:56 mifritscher, see here: https://www.oesf.org/forum/index.php?showtopic=35013 Jun 13 14:41:08 hey guys - so my gemini is for sale - i opened it for 3 minutes and put it back in the box Jun 13 14:41:31 i remember some people telling me here that they would buy it from me as soon as i got it so here's your chance... Jun 13 14:42:31 can i not post in here? Jun 13 14:42:47 where di my last 2 posts go? Jun 13 14:43:13 so my gemini pda is for sale Jun 13 14:43:23 all i want is what i paid for it Jun 13 14:44:26 why do you sell it? Jun 13 14:44:42 it's crap Jun 13 14:46:03 i bought it for linux - i so don't need or want anymore android devices Jun 13 14:46:10 but the linux support is very bad Jun 13 14:46:15 so for me it is crap Jun 13 14:46:23 for others it might be the bees knees Jun 13 14:47:29 That's fair, I think the linux support so far is... "near beta", and that's being generous Jun 13 14:48:23 My understanding from the original pitch was that it would have a linux distro on it, and even if it didn't, just having Debian is... 'meh' to me. But I'm willing to wait, or get a second-gen device that is more aligned with their ad-copy. Jun 13 14:48:52 its the mediatek chipset Jun 13 14:48:59 no hardware acceleration Jun 13 14:49:01 ever Jun 13 14:49:05 and kernel 3.18 Jun 13 14:49:07 Yeah, but here's the thing - don't promise and under-deliver Jun 13 14:49:12 right Jun 13 14:49:13 Just say "maybe linux" Jun 13 14:49:18 And don't push that on your site Jun 13 14:49:22 so i'm selling it Jun 13 14:49:29 fakefur: well, they have promised to release up to date kernel some day Jun 13 14:49:30 I hear ya Jun 13 14:49:44 cos- they can't without mediatek allowing it Jun 13 14:49:56 but i understand.. i tried to sell mine when i got it for the same reason Jun 13 14:49:59 and mediatek don't give a flying f*** Jun 13 14:50:25 not sure which will come first, working sailfish or working linux Jun 13 14:50:39 sailfish is the only hope Jun 13 14:50:53 but i don't know how they will do their thing with 3.18 and no hardware acceleration Jun 13 14:51:00 unless they can use the android blobs Jun 13 14:51:05 I'd happily jump ship to Sailfish if it has the full functionality Jun 13 14:51:14 hit-and-miss -- not gonna touch it Jun 13 14:51:21 but then it's going to be like cyanogen on the S3 - always a half assed experience Jun 13 14:51:28 So those Jolla boys better make it work Jun 13 14:51:56 and to top it off i got hit with customs duty because they shipped it from hong kong Jun 13 14:51:59 to germany Jun 13 14:52:07 because... us keyboard Jun 13 14:52:10 idiotic Jun 13 14:52:22 Thats... red-tap crazyness Jun 13 14:52:27 red-tape even Jun 13 14:52:32 ja Jun 13 14:52:39 and i have a us power brick Jun 13 14:52:51 hah Jun 13 14:54:02 i'm that scene in 5th element: "i'm getting VERY disappointed..." Jun 13 14:54:09 fakefur: sailfish already has hw acceleration on gemini, it's really fast Jun 13 14:54:42 cos- how do you know it has hardware acceleration? Jun 13 14:54:55 fakefur: i have it installed and it runs super smooth Jun 13 14:55:07 oh really..... hmmmmmm Jun 13 14:55:08 of course because it uses android side for graphics Jun 13 14:55:12 is that v2? Jun 13 14:55:26 Hah, funny - I recently ripped my old DVD of that on Handbrake to get a portable version for Gemini to play if I'm somewhere Jun 13 14:55:27 yep, 2.x Jun 13 14:55:33 m4v for the win Jun 13 14:55:35 And VLC Jun 13 14:55:42 so it uses the android blobs Jun 13 14:55:48 and kernel i'm guessing then Jun 13 14:56:24 yes, android kernel and then it uses the android blobs via libhybris Jun 13 14:56:39 right Jun 13 14:56:44 well fair enough Jun 13 15:14:41 59XX 4G UK - just received my shipping/tracking details. So close now... Jun 13 15:26:55 dang im still waiting for mine, order locked earlier today Jun 13 15:33:04 cos-: where to get a sailfish build for the gemini? Jun 13 15:34:54 TallTim great movie with some truly memorable scenes Jun 13 15:34:56 :) Jun 13 15:38:07 I'm a sucker for Luc Besson's aesthetic sense. I even liked "Valerian". Set design, etc. Jun 13 15:38:18 It looks great on the Gemini, too ;) Jun 13 15:38:55 i'm just allergic to android these days and the thought of another whole android device infested with google is too much Jun 13 15:40:31 I get it, I just don't have time for endless wipe/tweak cycles Jun 13 15:40:42 If I wanted that, I'd install Gentoo Jun 13 15:40:44 me either Jun 13 15:40:44 lolol Jun 13 15:41:01 i have my main phone running lineage + microg Jun 13 15:41:08 i have an iphone for dev work Jun 13 15:41:19 and i wanted this as a linux pocketable Jun 13 15:42:16 I'm holding out for either process improvement, or second-gen hardware. Jun 13 15:42:28 sheesh Jun 13 15:42:30 But its been useful so far. Jun 13 15:43:07 Rome wasn't built in a day, right? ;) Jun 13 15:43:15 * fakefur sighs Jun 13 15:43:17 So I'll wait. Jun 13 15:43:26 Unless you have a better alternative ready to go Jun 13 15:43:34 With the same functionality. Jun 13 15:43:39 And form-factor. Jun 13 15:43:58 there isn't or we wouldn't be here right? Jun 13 15:44:14 Beats me, some people just like to complain no matter what is in front of them. Jun 13 15:44:30 I have my issues with it, but its working out for a first-gen device. Jun 13 15:44:48 i understand the difficulties and what they have achieved but the whole linux over promising thing Jun 13 15:44:50 If they survive, gen three should be the best iteration ;) Jun 13 15:44:57 right Jun 13 15:45:01 Yes, that's a sticking point, I agree. Jun 13 16:09:40 fakefur, what would be your preferrable usecase in case of pocketable Linux device? Jun 13 16:24:42 TheKit sorry was afk... well having a good linux terminal machine for ssh on the go would be one Jun 13 16:24:59 there are some GUI apps i'd like to be able to run as well Jun 13 16:25:10 but nothing heavy or (imo) ridiculous Jun 13 16:25:42 i'd absolutely love to run a lamp stack but that might be a step too far Jun 13 16:30:23 ssh and lamp are easy... as for true GUI apps, there are still issues with Xorg perfomance when Google Docs in chromium currently run faster than LibreOffice, but it doesn't look impossible Jun 13 16:30:45 TheKit ja no hardware accel Jun 13 16:30:56 but i'm happy with a terminal for now Jun 13 16:31:10 if i can get rid of google from the device Jun 13 17:26:29 i was really hoping for "usable linux phone". Jun 13 17:26:41 (with keyboard) Jun 13 17:26:56 at the moment, i don't even have "usable android phone", though i'll grant that it has a keyboard. Jun 13 17:30:21 brennen, you want a linux phone? check out the librem 5 https://puri.sm/shop/librem-5/ Jun 13 17:36:35 brennen: in what way your android is not usable? Jun 13 17:37:36 btw, regarding to the answer to my question, there will be a new linux version this month Jun 13 17:43:37 mifritscher: i just haven't been able to get the "phone" part working. Jun 13 17:43:49 well, that's not entirely fair. i was able to get voice & sms. Jun 13 17:44:03 so data is your culprit? Interesting Jun 13 17:44:09 but without data i'm not realistically very able to transition to the gemini as a primary mobile device. Jun 13 17:44:21 Verizon? Jun 13 17:44:40 tried verizon, best i could do was sms, no voice or data. Jun 13 17:45:09 tried... i forget the brand, but one of the prepaid options available at wal-mart. Jun 13 17:45:48 with verizon some people got problems, but mostly VoLTE if I remember correctly Jun 13 17:45:52 can't seem to coax it into doing data with any of the provided SIMs / networks. Jun 13 17:46:06 i'd love to know how anybody got anything out of verizon. Jun 13 17:46:08 APN etc. was correct? Jun 13 17:46:23 brennen: Reach down their throat and pull Jun 13 17:47:09 mifritscher: good question. _think_ so, but i might have been messing something up. i'm going to have to revisit this in a few days when i have more hours to burn. Jun 13 17:47:18 ok Jun 13 17:50:21 cos-: mainline 4.17 is already booting until reaching userspace (thanks to TheKit) https://bpaste.net/show/9867fac6f59b . Regarding acceleration, https://rosenzweig.io/blog/ / https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/panfrost/mesa/network/master make fast progress Jun 13 17:54:18 I just added the links to https://github.com/gemian/gemini-keyboard-apps/wiki/LinuxMainlining Jun 13 18:07:19 (a note that while i dropped some negativity in here a minute ago, i appreciate the work people are doing to make this a usable linux device.) Jun 13 18:37:59 Anyone working on getting other environments working on the gemini? I installed i3wm and started it. Things mostly work, but the panel just shows garbage, like visual glitches and no readable info (no clock or memory/cpu usage). Jun 13 18:39:07 The gemini is disappointing and unusable IMO also. Mine mostly just sits around and goes on and off the charger as needed. Jun 13 18:39:33 For some reason my battery has been draining like crazy. I leave it on the Debian side and I think it's not sleeping properly, even though I followed the steps in the wiki. Often I go to open it and it's off, and booting it into android will show 1%. Jun 13 18:40:23 Is there a way to make it manually sleep? I think what I have set up is supposed to kick in after 5 minutes or something. I'd rather just run a command or hit a keyboard shortcut to initiate sleep when I'm gonna close it for a bit. Jun 13 18:41:57 tune, have you looked into sway? Jun 13 18:42:09 I've heard of it, but never used it. It's basically i3 for wayland, right? Jun 13 18:43:00 it's more promising than i3wm in our case due to wayland, but will need some work Jun 13 18:45:28 it looks like it's not packaged in the repos available by default Jun 13 18:45:41 would I have to upgrade to testing or sid? (and is this possible on the gemini even?) Jun 13 18:47:01 I'm a little disappointed with the keyboard layout of the gemini, although after seeing it's the same as the scion, I understand why. I think having another modifier (super key) would've been a huge help, and the arrow keys take up a huge amount of space. some layout similar to 60% keyboards would've been welcome Jun 13 18:47:31 I set alt as my mod key for i3, but I quickly realized it was going to interfere with a lot of programs, like switching channels in irssi and such Jun 13 18:48:22 maybe something could be done with the current keyboard, like changing what key does what to a major degree, and optionally changing out the keycaps for blanks or whatever key you'd rather have there Jun 13 18:49:33 the symbols taking up a lot of the fn layer will mean you can't have fn-# act as the f1-f12 keys, though. I think the keyboard is too narrow. Comparing it to my 60% keyboard, the gemini doesn't have - and = between 0 and backspace. Jun 13 18:49:35 adam_b is working on buster instead of stretch, but I doubt you can just dist-upgrade to it as of yet Jun 13 18:50:55 as for layout, well, I'd like to have more keys as well, for example to map Russian alphabet properly Jun 13 18:51:46 poor keyboard layout + meditek not freely releasing source were things I overlooked when backing. I got caught up in the hype perhaps. Jun 13 18:52:05 I do want UMPCs to make a comeback, and I think this device has some potential, but I worry that it won't get as good as I'd hoped Jun 13 18:52:15 tune: linux keyboard maps f1-10 Jun 13 18:52:17 s/meditek/mediatek Jun 13 18:52:31 adam_b_: to what? Jun 13 18:52:41 fn+shift+1-10 Jun 13 18:53:27 something messed up with the alt+f[n] combination though Jun 13 18:53:29 well if I hit fn-shift and ctrl-alt-(f)1 it doesn't work Jun 13 18:53:34 ah Jun 13 18:53:52 due to all the issues with xorg right now I was kind of hoping to just use it from a tty and uninstall sddm Jun 13 18:53:56 think its because the alt key has 'fn' mapping on it Jun 13 18:54:00 I'm used to using xinit/startx on my computers usually Jun 13 18:54:48 if I could get a tty with a readable font-size, I think I could find some use for it just leaving it in a fullscreen tmux session or something Jun 13 18:55:32 qterminal lets you change the size (and other ones some folk like the kde one) Jun 13 18:56:01 yeah that's not a concern, I'm talking in a future where I can get to a TTY instead of an x session Jun 13 18:56:12 in i3 I have two terminals open and they are fairly readable Jun 13 18:56:23 I also noticed the corners all cut off some stuff. is the actualy screen rounded? Jun 13 18:56:28 s/actualy/actual Jun 13 18:56:42 yea, seems that way, madness Jun 13 18:56:48 I didn't notice on lxqt but it's quite obvious in i3 :/ Jun 13 18:57:22 wonder if they knew that when they were selecting the screen Jun 13 18:58:56 for the next version I'd like them to cut a keys width off the space bar and seperate the alt/planet key into two keys (alt and planet seperate) Jun 13 18:59:19 hm the spacebar is already pretty small, but I guess I'd support that change Jun 13 18:59:46 well it would make it central to my thouch typing home position Jun 13 19:00:13 and for me that end of the key fails to work most of the time (should really do that punched bit of paper fix I guess) Jun 13 19:00:16 tune, to make it clear, it's not mediatek not releasing the source, but more like it completely not existing or being 3rd-party (like Mali GPU) Jun 13 19:00:20 if they could move fn to the right side and have super take its place, that'd match with my usual keyboard Jun 13 19:05:55 tune, the keys are easily removable, though you should be careful, and you can remap the keys in software. Jun 13 19:07:56 Not sure about the power/off function with the fn key though. I believe that one is wired differently. Jun 13 20:37:51 woo! Jun 13 20:38:01 I got an email that my Gemini is on the way! :-) Jun 13 20:38:24 * rah prepares himself to be disappointed :-) Jun 13 20:53:43 yay, there's a channel! hello guys! Jun 13 20:55:09 I was trying to find out the best linux option at the moment, but i'm not even sure what is the best information source. Is planet xda where all the stuff is happening? Jun 13 20:56:10 I think most of the linux chat happens here, also some on telegram Jun 13 20:56:29 I remember having heard about flashing problems. Is it safe to flash the debian image linked here? https://forum.xda-developers.com/gemini-pda/development/stock-android-linux-software-images-t3762642 Jun 13 20:57:02 I'd follow the official guidance, and then go through the DebianTP wiki page for making is usable Jun 13 20:57:09 adam_b_: telegram. nice. Jun 13 20:57:29 generally more happens on here than the telegram chat room Jun 13 20:59:02 also the oesf forum is a good place to look Jun 13 20:59:49 ok, thank you Jun 13 21:00:15 adam_b_: when talking about the debianTP wiki page, i assume you mean this: https://github.com/gemian/gemini-keyboard-apps/wiki/DebianTP ? Jun 13 21:00:24 indeed Jun 13 21:00:30 nice Jun 13 21:38:21 fwiw -- at some point the bullseye-power level thing in lxqt stopped working on my gemini. Jun 13 21:38:50 now shows full charge until it dies, whereupon android reboot shows 1 percent. Jun 13 21:39:14 i don't think i did anything that would have affected it. noticed it over last two days. Jun 13 21:39:25 also, random reboot has returned. Jun 13 21:40:01 and while i'm here, for those who have had the display cover off -- how many little rubber pieces do you have Jun 13 21:40:31 on the underside? i have one, on the right side about midway up. figured it is an insulator Jun 13 21:40:40 but puzzled that there's only one. Jun 13 21:47:31 dep: needs someone who knows how to fix kernels for the random reboot, I've not found reliable repoduction steps for it, but have had it a few times and been able to grab /proc/last_kmsg from the next boot which is supposed to help identify the problem Jun 13 21:55:13 adam_b : thanks -- at least i now know that it's not (entirely) evidence of me going crazy. Jun 13 21:57:54 anybody wants to buy my gemini for what it cost me pls msg me Jun 13 22:43:50 dep, can confirm -- only one rubber pad on the backside display cover - it helps keep the SD card in, I presume Jun 13 23:17:04 TallTim : thanks. what makes me ask is that on reassembly that side is slightly higher than the left side -- feels cheap. Jun 13 23:17:25 Haven't run across fit-and-finish issues, so I don't know what to tell you Jun 13 23:17:35 I suppose there's variation Jun 14 00:47:23 https://www.oesf.org/forum/index.php?showtopic=35147`say stfu Jun 14 00:47:40 oops autohotkey Jun 14 01:00:27 was banging around and got Q14A from an ancient APK repo to load and run Quake 1 Jun 14 01:01:10 Too bad that there's a big problem with some internal functions when you try to start a new game - ends up dumping to console with a server wiating at 0.0.0.0:26000 message Jun 14 01:01:20 I guess it stopped working a few major revs ago on Android Jun 14 01:01:46 the QIIIA app works though, but the controls lose their bitmap and get swapped with something else. Game runs though. Jun 14 01:01:49 Just for giggles Jun 14 01:02:00 The Quake demos played fine though. Jun 14 01:48:35 Hello Jun 14 01:49:50 Anyone on sailfish OS here? I am trying to see if anyone was able to disable or patch the blue LED on the keyboard Jun 14 01:52:51 I had no luck with the config files in /etc/mce, the mce service does not appear to be related since if I kill it its still lit up **** ENDING LOGGING AT Thu Jun 14 03:00:04 2018