**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Mon Jun 25 02:59:56 2007
Jun 25 04:04:19 <jga23> is there any way to get distutils on my device?
Jun 25 05:45:43 <jkyro> install python2.5-dev
Jun 25 07:20:01 <mk8> Hi to all ...
Jun 25 07:54:15 <Jaffa> Morning, all
Jun 25 08:07:27 <florian> good morning
Jun 25 08:12:30 <melmoth> yo konttori
Jun 25 08:12:58 <melmoth> i think i understand why yo do stuff directly in the n800, i had a first look at gstreamer this week end
Jun 25 08:13:14 <konttori> morning!
Jun 25 08:13:20 <melmoth> i ended up playing with it directly on the n800: i was not able to have the same sink on scratchbox than on the n800 :(
Jun 25 08:13:26 <melmoth> like no esdsink
Jun 25 08:13:34 <melmoth> how sad is that.
Jun 25 08:13:57 <konttori> Yeah, I think the only test env should be the device itself (for end user app dev).
Jun 25 08:14:13 <melmoth> it s a shame
Jun 25 08:14:20 <Robot101> alsasink works on the device and your PC...
Jun 25 08:14:29 <melmoth> i mean, testing is ok. but developping is crap
Jun 25 08:14:45 <melmoth> no emacs, no place, have to use nework, so it sux the battery
Jun 25 08:15:14 <melmoth> it s just crap...I would be happier with a scratchox coming with exactly the same functionnality than the tablet
Jun 25 08:15:16 <guardian> morning maemo
Jun 25 08:15:43 <melmoth> i was not able to use alsasink (but that could be my mistake)
Jun 25 08:15:58 <melmoth> so i had a look at ukmp and use the same kind of sink there was there :)
Jun 25 08:16:14 <melmoth> but pffff, gstreamer aint easy to learn.
Jun 25 08:16:47 <sbaturzio> Aloha!
Jun 25 08:17:22 <melmoth> so knottori here is a complicated feature request: gapless transition from one song to another one :)
Jun 25 08:20:36 <konttori> memoth: not possible
Jun 25 08:20:57 <konttori> The reason is that the gstreamer component must be rebuilt after each song.
Jun 25 08:21:11 <konttori> This makes some transition period between the songs.
Jun 25 08:21:45 <melmoth> i was thinking of using 2 pipeline, being able to detect with some clock (that i know nothing yet about) when the end is near, and starting to play the second piple line with a low volume
Jun 25 08:21:46 <konttori> And the reason why it must be rebuilt is that songs with mp3 id3 tags containing artwork mess the dsp playback.
Jun 25 08:21:58 <melmoth> and decreasing the volume of pipeline1 while incresaing the volume of pipeline2
Jun 25 08:21:59 <melmoth> and so on
Jun 25 08:22:20 <konttori> might work, but does the dsp support two simultaneous audio threads?
Jun 25 08:22:28 <konttori> for mp3s
Jun 25 08:22:35 <melmoth> i have no clue
Jun 25 08:22:50 <melmoth> i know -nothing- about sound except the info i grabbed this week end :)
Jun 25 08:23:20 <Robot101> konttori: you can play something through esdsink and alsa/dsp*sink
Jun 25 08:24:10 <melmoth> esdsink and several stream worked on the laptop here
Jun 25 08:24:21 <melmoth> but as i do not find any esdsink on the device :(
Jun 25 08:24:31 <melmoth> the idea would be to implement that: http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=6942
Jun 25 08:25:00 <melmoth> you know, the sound of rain , or wind, or radio noise in loop
Jun 25 08:25:09 <melmoth> whatever sample you may fancy
Jun 25 08:25:47 <melmoth> well, anyway, i was not even able to play a single stream twice correctly while playing with gstreamer :)
Jun 25 08:26:07 <melmoth> the second time it was awful noise, like, 1 sec of noise, frozen, 1 sec of noise..And so on
Jun 25 08:26:21 <melmoth> it s a long way to the top, if you wanna rock n roll (tm)
Jun 25 08:34:37 <jani> morning people..
Jun 25 08:55:38 <konttori> melmoth: sounds like a very nice program idea!
Jun 25 08:55:54 <konttori> You might also consider using pygame and its integrated mp3 lib for that.
Jun 25 08:56:08 <konttori> It would be very easy, as pygame is really intended for looping playback
Jun 25 08:56:18 <melmoth> hmmm
Jun 25 08:56:19 <konttori> and Immediate (as in immediate immediate) playback.
Jun 25 08:56:29 <melmoth> now, that s interesing
Jun 25 08:56:35 <konttori> and gapless as in gapless gapless ... not like almost gapless
Jun 25 08:56:55 <konttori> but it will use processor insted of dsp, so that's a bit bad.
Jun 25 08:57:01 <konttori> OTOH, not really that bad.
Jun 25 08:57:05 <melmoth> ok. It may be more easier than with gstreamer then..I ll have a closer look at pygame (at already did a bit, but not sound related stuff)
Jun 25 08:57:17 <konttori> it's really easy.
Jun 25 08:57:24 <melmoth> i like easy stuff...
Jun 25 08:57:27 <unique311> think its possible to eliminate the skin in POSE
Jun 25 08:57:28 <konttori> Use ukmp code. there is alternative pygame playback.
Jun 25 08:58:01 <unique311> located the source file needed to modify the lcd screen..
Jun 25 08:58:12 <unique311> but not sure how to make it a little bigger.
Jun 25 08:58:38 <unique311> the new release has the keys mapped to the hardware...
Jun 25 08:58:47 <unique311> so the sking is not needed.
Jun 25 09:08:52 <pupnik_> sking?
Jun 25 09:09:15 <unique311> skin dude
Jun 25 09:09:19 <pupnik_> isn't double size enough for the display?
Jun 25 09:09:26 <unique311> well yeah..
Jun 25 09:09:35 <unique311> but the buttons are mapped to hardware..
Jun 25 09:09:46 <unique311> whats the use for for the skin
Jun 25 09:09:52 <unique311> get rid of that...
Jun 25 09:10:03 <unique311> go for 420x320
Jun 25 09:10:35 <unique311> and which is the highest palmOS does i just found out from hackndev...
Jun 25 09:10:53 <pupnik_> oh cool
Jun 25 09:11:13 <unique311> 320x320 updated
Jun 25 09:11:42 <unique311> looking over the source..now
Jun 25 09:11:52 <pupnik_> so palm apps will work at higher resolutions?
Jun 25 09:12:05 <pupnik_> i thought most of them assumed 160x160
Jun 25 09:12:35 <unique311> roms lower than 4
Jun 25 09:12:47 <pupnik_> ok
Jun 25 09:13:03 <unique311> <BobOfDoom> ooh that's right it's rom based isn't it?
Jun 25 09:13:03 <unique311> <BobOfDoom> hmmm
Jun 25 09:13:03 <unique311> <BobOfDoom> you'd might have to hack the rom then
Jun 25 09:13:03 <unique311> <BobOfDoom> generally there's no way to autodetect LCD size, so most likely it's hard-compiled into the rom
Jun 25 09:13:05 <unique311> hmmm
Jun 25 09:13:10 <unique311> hacking the rom...
Jun 25 09:13:50 <pupnik_> if apps are written for lower resolution, they will probably break, even if the OS is hacked to support higher resoultions
Jun 25 09:14:12 <pupnik_> but you've got palm xperts to talk to
Jun 25 09:45:33 * konttori just released updated uktube player: https://garage.maemo.org/frs/download.php/1664/UKMP-1.3-uktube0.2.deb
Jun 25 09:45:38 <konttori> http://garage.maemo.org/frs/download.php/1664/UKMP-1.3-uktube0.2.deb
Jun 25 09:46:06 <konttori> If anyone is using uktube, could you try that out before I announce it?
Jun 25 09:46:26 <konttori> It's a bug and performance fix version.
Jun 25 10:06:29 <konttori> Blog post with change log here: http://konttoristhoughts.blogspot.com/2007/06/uktube-02-out.html
Jun 25 10:12:40 <konttori> The blog post contains the same video as for the initial release, so e.g. downloaded videos are stored in mmc1/videos and not in root unlike the video says
Jun 25 10:16:13 <jkyro> does it work on the 770?
Jun 25 10:20:31 <konttori> yeah
Jun 25 10:20:49 <konttori> just fine ... maybe even better than on n800
Jun 25 10:23:57 <konttori> jkyro: if you have 770, please have a test run and tell me how well it performs
Jun 25 10:25:18 <jkyro> I don't have one but my friend does, I can ask him to try it out
Jun 25 10:25:31 <jkyro> it probably requres gregale?
Jun 25 10:26:08 <konttori> Umm... nope
Jun 25 10:26:14 <konttori> should run on 2006 os
Jun 25 10:26:29 <konttori> you just need to install proper python and proper mplayer
Jun 25 10:27:01 <jkyro> 'k
Jun 25 10:32:26 <lardman> Another asm question: after dis55'ing an object file (which has been linked against the avs_kernel and then had the avs_kernel stripped away), where would variables be stored?
Jun 25 10:32:37 <lardman> Presumably some might point into the data section, but this is not the case
Jun 25 10:33:54 <lardman> So the stack is an option, I suppose I should look for the stack address and see if this lines up with the address I'm seeing, however nothing actually appears to have been pushed to the stack, so I'm a little confused
Jun 25 10:35:13 <lardman> Is the bss section mapped to memory as is (or rather in expanded form) for variable declarations?
Jun 25 10:35:28 <lardman> Or is it just used by the loader to allocate memory as it sees fit?
Jun 25 10:37:01 <pupnik_> Frankfurter allgemeine reports YouTube accounts for 10% of internet traffic.
Jun 25 10:37:55 <pupnik_> heh lardman not many devs deal with low level stuff
Jun 25 10:38:25 <lardman> pupnik_: I'd prefer not having to, but it is interesting in a strange masochistic way ;)
Jun 25 10:39:20 <pupnik> what drives your research?
Jun 25 10:39:33 <lardman> Attempting to get sound output from the dsp
Jun 25 10:40:01 <pupnik> you know there are apis for that
Jun 25 10:40:13 <pupnik> sorry i'll just waste your time with questions
Jun 25 10:41:18 <lardman> There is code that is called to interface with the class then mini-driver, which is what I'm looking at. I don't think it's possible to add a new class/mini-driver to the system without recompiling the avs_kernel
Jun 25 10:41:28 <lardman> Unfortunately there is no header file for these calls
Jun 25 10:42:57 * lardman wonders why the bss section isn't returned by dis55 when it is shown by nm55?
Jun 25 10:51:49 <Veggen> uktube: What about embedding a browser-component in uktube? ;) Let it find the videos itself?
Jun 25 10:51:55 <Veggen> eh, konttori.
Jun 25 10:52:18 <Veggen> often you have a link, though.
Jun 25 10:54:38 <konttori> Veggen: I'm thinking about that sort of thing
Jun 25 10:54:51 <konttori> Will happen in the future
Jun 25 10:54:56 <konttori> But not yet
Jun 25 10:55:03 <konttori> This is the first step.
Jun 25 10:55:06 <konttori> did you try the 0.2?
Jun 25 10:55:32 <Veggen> Hmm, I tried this weekend. Either saturday or yesterday, can't remember :)
Jun 25 10:55:41 <Veggen> (but the version, I can't say)
Jun 25 10:55:56 <konttori> I just uploaded a new one half an hour ago
Jun 25 10:55:57 <Veggen> hmm. I can perhaps....ssh to my n800, that should be on and on my home network.
Jun 25 10:56:05 <Veggen> oh, then I didn't try it.
Jun 25 10:56:07 <konttori> https://garage.maemo.org/frs/download.php/1664/UKMP-1.3-uktube0.2.deb
Jun 25 10:56:12 <konttori> Fixes some bugs.
Jun 25 10:56:26 <konttori> changes here: http://konttoristhoughts.blogspot.com/2007/06/uktube-02-out.html
Jun 25 10:56:33 <Veggen> I don't really have a use for my n800 at work, so I usually don't bring it there.
Jun 25 10:56:46 <Veggen> And travel to/from work is by bicycle :) Limited use there too.
Jun 25 10:59:14 <rwhitby> konttori: found any way to get google videos with uktube?
Jun 25 11:17:55 <MoRpHeUz> melmoth: sorry about the delay but I was reading the log about you saying that scratchbox doesnt have emacs, etc..
Jun 25 11:18:03 <MoRpHeUz> melmoth: it doesnt need to have..
Jun 25 11:18:23 <melmoth> Molagi, i agree
Jun 25 11:18:46 <MoRpHeUz> melmoth: scratchbox is an env of a lot of links and so, you can edit your files outside from scratchbox and then just compile/etc inside it
Jun 25 11:18:46 <melmoth> i edit file in the host machine, not hte guest
Jun 25 11:19:08 <melmoth> but i was complaining, and am still because the scratchbox env is not the same as the n800
Jun 25 11:19:16 <melmoth> especially for gstreamer sink
Jun 25 11:19:24 <MoRpHeUz> melmoth: I mean: "emacs /scratchbox/users/your_username/home/your_username/files.c"
Jun 25 11:19:26 <melmoth> so i ended up editing python diretly on the n800
Jun 25 11:19:31 <MoRpHeUz> melmoth: for that you are right....
Jun 25 11:19:39 <melmoth> and there s no emacs there :)
Jun 25 11:19:41 <melmoth> nor nfs expoert
Jun 25 11:19:49 <melmoth> so i m stuck with vi
Jun 25 11:19:58 <MoRpHeUz> melmoth: hhmm...I prefer to do all the stuff in my machine and just test on the device..
Jun 25 11:20:06 <MoRpHeUz> (lots of scp of course)
Jun 25 11:20:12 <melmoth> mhhh.
Jun 25 11:20:12 <MoRpHeUz> but I got your point =)
Jun 25 11:20:15 <melmoth> yop
Jun 25 11:20:28 <suihkulokki> well scratchbox is not *emulator*
Jun 25 11:20:44 <MoRpHeUz> yeah
Jun 25 11:22:03 <kulve> MoRpHeUz: what's the gmyth-streamer? How does it relate to gmyth? What do I install to n800? What to my mythtv box? Can I do the transcoding some other computer than on my weak powered media box (mythtv box)?
Jun 25 11:22:29 <MoRpHeUz> kulve: hi! =) how are you ? hehe
Jun 25 11:22:34 <MoRpHeUz> let's go:
Jun 25 11:22:55 <MoRpHeUz> 1 - it's a "transcoding environment"....a "transcoder+streamer"
Jun 25 11:23:11 <kulve> MoRpHeUz: if you didn't guess, I just got my mythtv box about up'n'running ;)
Jun 25 11:23:12 <MoRpHeUz> 2 - it uses gmyth to retrieve info/data from a mythtv backend
Jun 25 11:23:22 <MoRpHeUz> 3 - just install mplayer to watch the videos
Jun 25 11:24:00 <MoRpHeUz> 4 - you need to have gmyth-streamer and gmyth on the same machine in order to get data/info from mythbackend and transcode/stream
Jun 25 11:24:26 <MoRpHeUz> 5 - yes, you can...but it will take more time to start streaming (but if all of them are on the same lan, it should work well)
Jun 25 11:24:32 <MoRpHeUz> kulve: =)
Jun 25 11:24:51 <MoRpHeUz> kulve: and if you didn't guess, I just wrote a How-to and I'm looking for someone to test it =P
Jun 25 11:26:26 <suihkulokki> is it possible to tell mythtv to automatically n800-suitable copies of recordings after recording the program?
Jun 25 11:26:37 <kulve> MoRpHeUz: same lan, the videos are on nfs anyway..
Jun 25 11:26:47 <suihkulokki> and then *easily* sync them to n800 sd-card
Jun 25 11:27:26 <kulve> MoRpHeUz: I'm happy to test your howtos :) (maybe tomorrow)
Jun 25 11:27:41 <suihkulokki> the other thing I'd like to do is to use n800 as a remote for mythtv frontend
Jun 25 11:27:43 <MoRpHeUz> suihkulokki: the problem is the sync part...but you can say to mythtv auto-transcode files...
Jun 25 11:27:53 <MoRpHeUz> suihkulokki: with gmyth you can do that
Jun 25 11:28:06 <MoRpHeUz> but the point here is to automatically do all the stuff (including live-tv)
Jun 25 11:28:25 <MoRpHeUz> kulve: ok, I can send you the how to =)
Jun 25 11:28:45 <suihkulokki> MoRpHeUz: the keyword was copy, my understanding is the auto-transcode will not save the original quality video but replace it with the transcoded one?
Jun 25 11:28:50 <MoRpHeUz> suihkulokki: gmyth-streamer transcodes on-the-fly
Jun 25 11:29:37 <MoRpHeUz> suihkulokki: i think the answer is yes... but with gmyth-streamer the original one will there..and you'll watch it already transcoded...
Jun 25 11:30:18 <MoRpHeUz> suihkulokki: take a look at my blog
Jun 25 11:31:43 <suihkulokki> MoRpHeUz: hmm, ok. I'll try gmyth as well
Jun 25 11:32:31 <MoRpHeUz> =)
Jun 25 11:43:59 <Jaffa> suihkulokki: a couple of us use http://bleb.org/software/maemo/#encode for auto-transcoding PVRred recordings to N800 compatible videos.
Jun 25 12:07:41 <guardian> i'm also interested in how to install gms
Jun 25 12:25:01 <MoRpHeUz> guardian: I'll post on my blog a how to....
Jun 25 12:25:09 <MoRpHeUz> =)
Jun 25 12:25:20 <guardian> cool
Jun 25 12:30:17 <pupnik> 'Attention, Avatar...'
Jun 25 12:31:18 <MoRpHeUz> guardian: ok, it's there...it's easier than send to everybody through email hehe =)
Jun 25 12:31:28 <guardian> sure
Jun 25 12:31:35 <guardian> gonna try it tonight
Jun 25 12:31:37 <guardian> device is at home
Jun 25 12:31:48 <MoRpHeUz> ok! thanks! please report problems with it ok ?
Jun 25 12:32:20 <guardian> ok
Jun 25 12:34:53 <kulve> ok
Jun 25 13:02:52 * pupnik points at DrPocketSnes again...
Jun 25 13:03:10 <pupnik> <crickets chirping>
Jun 25 13:05:56 <unique311> is it up and working pupnik?
Jun 25 13:06:14 <unique311> anything i can do to assist.....
Jun 25 13:09:07 <pupnik> no i'm hoping to find someone who can take over the port
Jun 25 13:09:24 <pupnik> found a guy who looked at the code for like 5 minutes and found two ways to make it faster
Jun 25 13:09:43 <pupnik> but he doesn't have a Nokia
Jun 25 13:10:09 <unique311> it compiled and is working
Jun 25 13:10:41 <pupnik> um, not my version
Jun 25 13:10:51 <unique311> ok
Jun 25 13:11:13 <unique311> i'm bored...
Jun 25 13:11:24 <unique311> i'll take a loook at the source...
Jun 25 13:52:28 <jani> pupnik: too much asm for me to even take a closer look =)
Jun 25 13:56:48 <guardian> duh
Jun 25 13:56:56 <guardian> status : resolved
Jun 25 13:56:58 <guardian> resolution: later
Jun 25 13:57:13 <guardian> is kind a strange way of expressing "postponed"
Jun 25 13:57:13 <guardian> :D
Jun 25 13:59:08 <guardian> so filtering by status, the bug is resolved ... ;)
Jun 25 13:59:12 <guardian> and IS NOT at the same time
Jun 25 14:00:23 <pupnik> jani: well afaict we can ignore all the core emu code - the main issue is with OS interface issues.  The gp2x DrPocketSnes renders to /dev/fb afaict, and this would need to be changed to SDL.  Then there are some issues with filehandling.  My last attempt made a total mess, since i was merging in portions of the stock snes9x code and trying to make that work.
Jun 25 14:18:28 <pupnik> mashing different versions of the emu together produced a lot of broken glass
Jun 25 14:19:23 <unique311> hey pupnik
Jun 25 14:19:30 <unique311> i compiled the danm thing..
Jun 25 14:20:07 <konttori> rwitby: I haven't had a look at how to process google videos. I may try to have a look tomorrow if I have the time.
Jun 25 14:20:25 <unique311> you compiled it but it doesn't work...thats the only issue correct?
Jun 25 14:20:36 <unique311> and you are playing with the code so it will work.
Jun 25 14:20:37 <pupnik> unique311: i don't remember
Jun 25 14:20:43 <unique311> well it compiled
Jun 25 14:21:05 <unique311> when ran
Jun 25 14:21:18 <unique311> Loading global menu options
Jun 25 14:21:18 <unique311> Failed to load global options, so using defaults
Jun 25 14:21:18 <unique311> Loading default rom directory
Jun 25 14:21:18 <unique311> Failed to default rom dir, so using current dir
Jun 25 14:21:18 <unique311> Entering gp_initGraphics....
Jun 25 14:21:39 <unique311> Loading global menu options
Jun 25 14:21:39 <unique311> Failed to load global options, so using defaults
Jun 25 14:21:39 <unique311> Loading default rom directory
Jun 25 14:21:39 <unique311> Failed to default rom dir, so using current dir
Jun 25 14:21:39 <unique311> Entering gp_initGraphics....
Jun 25 14:21:42 <unique311> sorry
Jun 25 14:34:33 <MoRpHeUz> konttori: did you have time to look at evas stuff from k-s ?
Jun 25 14:34:54 <konttori> nope. I've been having a vacation for the past 3 days.
Jun 25 14:35:01 <konttori> I did have a look at the videos
Jun 25 14:35:27 <konttori> I was kind of left wondering how heavy the toolkit is in terms of size.
Jun 25 14:36:34 <MoRpHeUz> hhmm..I'll take a look at it tonight...
Jun 25 14:36:57 <MoRpHeUz> konttori: I know about your vacation...I'm here in Finland and couldnt find any restaurant open during these days! haha
Jun 25 14:37:44 <konttori> Yeah, Finland really closes during midsummers fest.
Jun 25 14:37:53 <MoRpHeUz> konttori: hehe...are you from Helsinki ?
Jun 25 14:37:58 <konttori> yeah
Jun 25 14:38:10 <inz> it's almost like x-mas, but with less snow
Jun 25 14:38:14 <MoRpHeUz> I'm at Oulu
Jun 25 14:38:21 <konttori> and more to drink
Jun 25 14:38:22 <MoRpHeUz> inz: hehe =)
Jun 25 14:41:36 <kulve> MoRpHeUz: the blog is a bit unclear where to get the debs and how to use the mplayer (or does it see mythtv server directly as there is the mythtv gnomevfs backend?). And what to install to n800 and what to mythtv box (or to transcoding box).
Jun 25 14:42:07 <MoRpHeUz> kulve: all that stuff is for transcoding box
Jun 25 14:42:17 <MoRpHeUz> nothing to n800....
Jun 25 14:42:31 <MoRpHeUz> the debs are not ready yet....that's why I recommend using svn..
Jun 25 14:43:33 <MoRpHeUz> after all that stuff set up, then you can mplayer an special URL.....(ok...it's kind of hard now, but trust me it'll be easier on the future ;-) )
Jun 25 14:47:28 <MoRpHeUz> kulve: updated tutorial with your questions =)
Jun 25 14:54:48 <kulve> I'll do the actual testing maybe tomorrow
Jun 25 14:54:49 <kulve> thx
Jun 25 14:54:57 <MoRpHeUz> thank you =)
Jun 25 15:21:23 <unique311> pupnik the gpe binary gives the same results when ran in scratcbhox...
Jun 25 15:33:24 <dragorn> If no-one noticed, 770 for $120 on woot
Jun 25 15:34:24 <matt_c> dragorn: woot indeed.
Jun 25 16:05:55 <b0o> so I've got a nokia 770 coming in the mail.. I looked around the wiki a bit (unsuccessfully) on the new kernel that supports 2gb mobile mmc cards...is that a tough setup?
Jun 25 16:07:53 <||cw> for those in the US, woot.com has a 770 for $135 shipped today only
Jun 25 16:08:23 <gla55> my non-so-geek friend managed to enable 2gb support by himself ok
Jun 25 16:11:44 <b0o> that's where I picked mine up ;)
Jun 25 16:12:06 <b0o> excellent, I'm pretty geeky, so I'm not afraid of getting my hands dirty
Jun 25 16:12:27 <b0o> I was just about to order a 1gb card when I realized I should probably double check if that was really the limit
Jun 25 16:38:09 <amaury_> hello I have to make choice , nokia 770 or zaurus ? someone can help me ?
Jun 25 16:40:56 <||cw> amaury_: 770!
Jun 25 16:41:05 <||cw> not rally fair to ask here as we're all biased
Jun 25 16:41:27 <||cw> amaury_: main reason though, nokia stillupdated 770 software, somewhat
Jun 25 16:42:02 <amaury_> and zaurus , community don't updrage the rom ?
Jun 25 16:42:44 <amaury_> is the virtual keyboard is easy to use ?
Jun 25 16:42:52 <amaury_> on the nokia
Jun 25 16:44:19 <lardman|gone> amaury_: (Despite being gone ;) ) ask that question in #angstrom (which is the mainly-developer channel for the current Zaurus ROMs). I think the 770 is a little underpowered, but has bt & wifi built-in, while the Zaurus doesn't.
Jun 25 16:45:03 <lardman|gone> s/current zaurus ROMs/current open-source community developed flash images
Jun 25 16:45:18 * lardman|gone is really gone now
Jun 25 16:46:04 <amaury_> ok for the devel, and the keyboard , what thinking about it ?
Jun 25 17:02:25 <bstock> anyone have any good linux scripts for converting videos to n770 format
Jun 25 17:04:53 <suihkulokki> bstock: google 770-encode
Jun 25 17:05:15 <Jaffa> bstock: http://bleb.org/software/770/#encode (I'm Google for my own stuff ;-))
Jun 25 17:06:53 <bstock> heh thx
Jun 25 17:11:36 <bstock> i flashed 2006.2 a while ago on the 770, are there any major improvements since then? looks like they're at 2006.3
Jun 25 17:26:50 <Pio> im in the same position bstock.. im considering doing the it2007 hacker edition too
Jun 25 17:43:32 <Brend[uhway]> can anyone tell me if you can use active x on the 770?
Jun 25 17:45:05 <jani> uniq: well, as pupnik said, it uses framebuffer to outputting graphics which should be converted to sdl..
Jun 25 17:45:10 <Veggen> active x?
Jun 25 17:45:18 <Veggen> that's MS-only-technology, so no.
Jun 25 17:45:49 <Brenduh> ok ty, I have to log in to work using active x, that is why I wondered.
Jun 25 17:46:09 <Veggen> my condolances.
Jun 25 17:46:13 <Veggen> :)
Jun 25 17:46:28 <Brenduh> :)
Jun 25 17:46:37 <jani> yeah, activex is ms proprietery extension, who ever made your work is well.. Moron ;)
Jun 25 17:46:48 <Brenduh> I won't disagree with you there
Jun 25 17:47:18 <jani> :)
Jun 25 17:47:53 <Brenduh> I just bought the 770 on woot.  I've been saving up for something like this, I am disabled and there are times when I am confined to bed.  THe laptop can get cumbersome.  Can you use msn messenger (or something that logs in to msn anyway) and yahoo messenger?
Jun 25 17:48:57 <suihkulokki> there is gaim
Jun 25 17:49:33 <Brenduh> that is a software that is on it?
Jun 25 17:49:35 <Veggen> and there's jabber and the jabber-to-whatever-gateways. I often prefer that, and using the builtin jabber client.
Jun 25 17:49:36 <jani> its called pidgin ..
Jun 25 17:50:17 <Brenduh> can you log into an msn and a yhoo account at the same time?
Jun 25 17:50:18 <vims0r> pidgin connects to almost everything
Jun 25 17:50:18 <Veggen> Brenduh: not per default, but you can install it.
Jun 25 17:50:28 <Veggen> Brenduh: sure.
Jun 25 17:50:28 <jani> Brenduh: http://pidgin.garage.maemo.org
Jun 25 17:50:28 <Brenduh> If I'm bugging you with too many questions, please let me know.
Jun 25 17:50:35 <Brenduh> ty!
Jun 25 17:50:44 <vims0r> Brenduh: you better get start learning some linux basics :)
Jun 25 17:50:48 <jani> gaim was renamed to pidgin for some trademark issues ..
Jun 25 17:51:00 <||cw> Brenduh: check out the application cataloug on maemo.org
Jun 25 17:51:12 <Brenduh> I have bookmarked maemo, thank you
Jun 25 17:51:25 <jani> garage.maemo.org is nice for 3rd party apps ..
Jun 25 17:51:34 <Brenduh> lol vims0r, suggestions where to start?  I don't mind messing with software as long as I don'thave to mess with the hardware innards
Jun 25 17:52:18 <Brenduh> ty jani, bookmarking that for some reading too
Jun 25 17:52:26 <vims0r> i would reccomend testing some live-cd
Jun 25 17:52:36 <Veggen> www.linux.org isn't that bad a place to read, I guess.
Jun 25 17:52:38 <vims0r> open suse or better ubuntu
Jun 25 17:52:45 <Brenduh> I've got a knopix cd.. same thing?
Jun 25 17:52:51 <||cw> Brenduh: FWIW, activex doens't work on windows mobile devices either
Jun 25 17:53:05 <Brenduh> ooh ty ||cw
Jun 25 17:53:06 <||cw> the 770 is basicaly just a pda with a large screen
Jun 25 17:53:09 <Veggen> Brenduh: yah, knoppix is a decent alternative.
Jun 25 17:53:19 <vims0r> maemo is kind of simple but if you know your way arround linux some things get easyer
Jun 25 17:53:30 <vims0r> flashing a new os-versio for example
Jun 25 17:53:35 <vims0r> OS-Version
Jun 25 17:53:38 <Brenduh> if I royally screw up with software.. can I reset it back to it's original configuration?
Jun 25 17:54:14 <vims0r> there is some kind of backup-system for your personal data
Jun 25 17:54:37 <vims0r> und you can always flash the default-os image back on the device
Jun 25 17:54:51 <||cw> Brenduh: the "upgrade" tool will reset to defaults, and you can "upgrade" the same version
Jun 25 17:54:56 <vims0r> but then you have to install the software again
Jun 25 17:55:15 <Brenduh> so let me see if I understand this.  to use these software available on these sites, I'm probably going to have to install a different os?
Jun 25 17:55:19 <Brenduh> on the 770
Jun 25 17:55:21 <Veggen> no.
Jun 25 17:55:30 <vims0r> no
Jun 25 17:55:41 <Brenduh> then why the linux?
Jun 25 17:56:01 <vims0r> because Maemo (the 770s os) is based on linux
Jun 25 17:56:09 <Veggen> uh, because N770 runs Linux.
Jun 25 17:56:14 <||cw> Brenduh: maemo is linux based.
Jun 25 17:56:28 <Brenduh> aha ok
Jun 25 17:56:32 <||cw> maemo is what the IT2006 OS is based on
Jun 25 17:56:39 <Brenduh> so sorry, wasn't aware of that.  Don't know why I was thinking window ce
Jun 25 17:56:58 <||cw> IT2006 is to maemo as Vista is to longhorn
Jun 25 17:57:20 <||cw> wince will not run on the 770 that I know of
Jun 25 17:57:26 <Brenduh> will it run java?
Jun 25 17:57:28 <vims0r> when you get your 770 i would recommend upgrading the os
Jun 25 17:57:32 <vims0r> and then using
Jun 25 17:57:33 <Brenduh> I don't want win ce, I just assumed
Jun 25 17:57:33 <vims0r> http://www.gronmayer.com/n800/repos/index.php?lang=en
Jun 25 17:57:37 <||cw> there are JRE's for maemo
Jun 25 17:57:48 <vims0r> to add repositorys with software to the device
Jun 25 17:58:09 <Brenduh> repositorys?
Jun 25 17:58:22 <||cw> vims0r: nice list, if is it validated regularly?
Jun 25 17:58:29 <vims0r> dunno
Jun 25 17:59:06 <vims0r> is just discovered in a german n800 board and the repos there work fine with my 770 and os20007 hacker :)
Jun 25 17:59:30 <||cw> Brenduh: maemo uses the "software channel" concept.  to install something you don't usually run an installer, you instead add the repository, or channel, and then you can easily get updates all software with one click
Jun 25 17:59:49 <||cw> I say usualy because a few apps are just .deb files with no repo
Jun 25 18:00:07 <Brenduh> how do you know what they are?  For instance, OpenedHand Prebuilt Maemo Packages
Jun 25 18:00:16 <||cw> vims0r: how does hacker work?  I was scared off of it when I was looking to upgrade
Jun 25 18:00:32 <VimS> works fine
Jun 25 18:00:54 <Brenduh> nm I see some of them have webs with info.  That one just had a link to the fils
Jun 25 18:00:55 <Brenduh> files
Jun 25 18:00:57 <VimS> didn't encounter any problems so far
Jun 25 18:01:22 <VimS> only the buildin memory of the 770 gets a little short :D
Jun 25 18:01:43 <||cw> Brenduh: google, or search the application cataloge.  inthat case, OpenHand is a vendor that provides things.  when you add a channel, you can then browse the available packages and choose what to install and leave things you don't want
Jun 25 18:02:14 <VimS> Brenduh: when you've got the 770 you can add the repos to the programm-manager and there you will see more infos about the applications
Jun 25 18:02:19 <||cw> Brenduh: a lot of this will make more sense with the device in hand
Jun 25 18:02:22 <Brenduh> oook so if you install one of these repos.. then you get a list of software available from them and can choose what you want?  Do I have that right?
Jun 25 18:02:29 <jani> like synaptic for "real" linux apps  ?
Jun 25 18:02:30 <||cw> Brenduh: yes
Jun 25 18:02:42 <VimS> Brenduh: yes, that's right
Jun 25 18:02:44 <Brenduh> oook ::lightbulb moment::
Jun 25 18:02:56 <VimS> *g*
Jun 25 18:03:01 <||cw> jani: more or less, and mostly less, but yes
Jun 25 18:03:10 <VimS> jani: yes like snyaptic
Jun 25 18:03:17 <Brenduh> ty, I really look forward to playing with it.  I go out of state for medical treatment next month and they will have wireless connections
Jun 25 18:03:50 <Veggen> Brenduh: I guess it would be very ok for use at hospital :)
Jun 25 18:03:50 <Brenduh> ||cw, do I search for JRE for java software?
Jun 25 18:03:52 <VimS> it'll be fun, but there are some disadvanteges
Jun 25 18:04:09 <VimS> 770 does not support youtube oder gmail for example... :(
Jun 25 18:04:15 <Brenduh> yes, much better than a large laptop
Jun 25 18:04:23 <Brenduh> oooh no gmail
Jun 25 18:04:26 <Brenduh> oh well
Jun 25 18:04:28 <Veggen> VimS: well. youtube support is coming along nicely with uktube.
Jun 25 18:04:39 <VimS> does that work on the 770?
Jun 25 18:04:47 <||cw> Brenduh: is there a certain java app you want to run?  many java things won't run due to the limited resources
Jun 25 18:04:58 <||cw> Brenduh: gmail works in html mode
Jun 25 18:05:04 <Veggen> VimS: I think konttori said so.
Jun 25 18:05:08 <VimS> na silly my
Jun 25 18:05:11 <VimS> gmail works fine
Jun 25 18:05:17 <VimS> google calendar doesn't
Jun 25 18:05:19 <VimS> sorry
Jun 25 18:05:25 <Brenduh> oh good
Jun 25 18:05:36 <||cw> you can downlaod gcal to the calendar apps
Jun 25 18:05:50 * VimS is afk
Jun 25 18:06:00 <Brenduh> can you upgrade the memory?
Jun 25 18:06:24 <||cw> no, but you can use the mmc card as swap
Jun 25 18:06:43 <||cw> makes a very big difference
Jun 25 18:06:52 <Veggen> cw: well, yes and no.
Jun 25 18:07:16 <Veggen> it won't work well with an app that wants 100 MB memory runtime :)
Jun 25 18:07:20 <Brenduh> i will invest in a large mmc card... I think I have one in my old mp3 player.
Jun 25 18:08:13 <||cw> needs to be RS-MMC, the kind made for cell phones
Jun 25 18:08:33 <||cw> 1GB cards are pretty cheap though
Jun 25 18:08:48 <Veggen> 2GB requires a custom kernel, no?
Jun 25 18:08:54 <||cw> not sure
Jun 25 18:09:10 <Brenduh> ahh ok
Jun 25 18:11:30 <Brenduh> I'm not finding anything about java
Jun 25 18:13:02 <keesj> Veggen: 2 gig no, but more yes
Jun 25 18:14:15 <keesj> Brenduh: check the mailing list there is a java project alive http://www.jalimo.org/wiki/doku.php
Jun 25 18:15:04 <Brenduh> ty
Jun 25 18:16:35 <Brenduh> thank you all for your information.  You've helped quite a lot.
Jun 25 18:44:42 <tigert> hmm
Jun 25 18:44:54 <tigert> according to maemo mapper, I just rollerskated 1030km/h ;)
Jun 25 18:45:02 <tigert> something in the gps signal was not quite ok :)
Jun 25 18:45:23 <konttori> time to send that bug report ;)
Jun 25 18:45:40 <tigert> oh, that was gps signal foo
Jun 25 18:45:47 <tigert> it does this "zoom around" thing indoors
Jun 25 18:46:02 <X-Fade> Hehe.
Jun 25 18:46:15 <roope> combine that to some sport tracking application.
Jun 25 18:46:18 <koen> maemo-mapper also has redraw problem
Jun 25 18:46:23 <X-Fade> Hmm SIP & N95 is quite buggy still.
Jun 25 18:46:36 <koen> e.g. going from 100km/h to 2km/h give you 102 or 1002
Jun 25 18:48:27 <ttuttle> Hey.
Jun 25 18:48:36 <ttuttle> You guys do know that N770's are on sale at woot.com for $130, right?
Jun 25 18:48:53 <pupnik> ?!
Jun 25 18:48:55 <tigert> yes. only for continental US
Jun 25 18:48:59 <ttuttle> Yeah.  Sorry.
Jun 25 18:49:03 <tigert> but yeah
Jun 25 18:49:08 <tigert> someone mailed the list
Jun 25 18:49:12 <ttuttle> Okay.
Jun 25 18:49:27 <ttuttle> How hard is it to program for an N770?
Jun 25 18:49:38 <||cw> ttuttle: if you know how to program for gtk, easy
Jun 25 18:49:48 <ttuttle> ||cw: I could learn.
Jun 25 18:49:53 <||cw> ttuttle: maemo.org has some docs to get you started
Jun 25 18:50:06 <ttuttle> ||cw: Okay.
Jun 25 18:50:22 <ttuttle> ||cw: /me is soooooo excited, he's getting an N770 from Woot.
Jun 25 18:50:27 <ttuttle> Oh, and is it true they run Kismet?
Jun 25 18:50:45 <||cw> including emulating the 770 on your desktop for compiling/testing
Jun 25 18:50:54 <ttuttle> ||cw: Oh, that's AWESOME!
Jun 25 18:50:56 <pupnik> that's extremely cheap
Jun 25 18:51:01 <ttuttle> pupnik: Yes, it is.
Jun 25 18:51:07 <||cw> kismet is ported, yes
Jun 25 18:51:14 <ttuttle> pupnik: I figured, I could get a palm for $130.  Why not get an N770?
Jun 25 18:51:26 <ttuttle> pupnik: N770's are cooler, after all.  And Linux-powered.
Jun 25 18:51:39 <pupnik> that's a serious company?
Jun 25 18:51:44 <ttuttle> pupnik: Yes.
Jun 25 18:52:09 <pupnik> i paid approx $350 7 months ago
Jun 25 18:52:26 <ttuttle> pupnik: /me tries not to smile.
Jun 25 18:52:38 <melmoth> happy christmaaaaasss :)
Jun 25 18:52:53 <florian> re
Jun 25 18:54:14 * ttuttle is happy.
Jun 25 18:54:39 <melmoth> kontori i did not find any mixer.init stuff for pygame in ukmp
Jun 25 18:54:53 <||cw> 130 is a good price, not not way cheap.  $150 is not hard to find on ebay
Jun 25 18:55:05 <melmoth> I cannot generate any sound without having to init the mixer (i have an error message otherwise), but fail to do so :(
Jun 25 18:55:10 <pupnik> wal mart has them for $229 or so
Jun 25 18:55:13 <ttuttle> ||cw: For new?
Jun 25 18:55:28 <||cw> didn't look that clode
Jun 25 18:57:21 <ttuttle> So what's the first thing I should do with my N770 when it arrives (after I open the box, charge it, turn it on, etc...)?
Jun 25 18:57:50 <ericz> how hard is typing on an n770? what are the options for like a "real" keyboard?
Jun 25 18:57:58 <ttuttle> Mmm, good question.
Jun 25 18:58:30 <ericz> that's my only issue with getting one, [saw the woot deal too]... everything i could really want, it has, but a keyboard
Jun 25 18:58:43 <ttuttle> ericz: Oh, just buy one ;-) they're cool.
Jun 25 18:58:49 <ericz> haha, i'm poor
Jun 25 19:00:09 <ttuttle> ericz: But it's an awesome gadget!
Jun 25 19:00:30 <ericz> it looks like it. but it would not be awesome to type at 3 words per minute
Jun 25 19:00:42 <ttuttle> ericz: It has word completion.
Jun 25 19:00:50 <konttori> melmoth: it's there. pygame.mixer.music.load(filename)
Jun 25 19:01:30 <||cw> ericz: onscreen isn't too bad, and most bluetooth boards work with it
Jun 25 19:01:39 <konttori> and then : pygame.mixer.music.play()
Jun 25 19:01:41 <ericz> what if i wanted to program? :P typing php/html/css surely wouldn't be completed
Jun 25 19:01:47 <konttori> that's all you need in pygame
Jun 25 19:02:33 <melmoth> well, on my laptop yes.
Jun 25 19:02:50 <melmoth> on the n800 it dies with a 'mixer not initialised' error message
Jun 25 19:02:52 <konttori> hey, is there any way to make mplayer zoom (or crop if you will) the played video?
Jun 25 19:02:54 <melmoth> the _same_ code :(
Jun 25 19:03:22 <konttori> Ahh... damn. maybe that's missing from the python in the device.
Jun 25 19:03:23 <konttori> damn
Jun 25 19:03:38 <konttori> never tested it on the device. I just supposed it would work.
Jun 25 19:03:50 <melmoth> konttori, but were you successfull on ukmp using pygame for sound and not gstreamer ?
Jun 25 19:03:54 <melmoth> ohhh. ok
Jun 25 19:03:56 <melmoth> grumble
Jun 25 19:03:59 <melmoth> i m doomed.
Jun 25 19:04:28 <ttuttle> Is pygtk 1) available on the N770 and 2) any good?
Jun 25 19:04:30 <melmoth> well, the next option is to kill the neighboor if i cannot use a white noise engine to sleep :)
Jun 25 19:05:11 <melmoth> ttuttle, yes (i think so, i have a n800, but with the hacker edition you should have python2.5 that comes with pygtk and pygame (without the sound apparently))
Jun 25 19:05:13 <konttori> If you use ogg, you should (maybe) be able to put songs on queue and get the ogg to play them in loop.
Jun 25 19:05:15 <melmoth> and yes, its good :)
Jun 25 19:05:51 <ttuttle> melmoth: hacker edition?
Jun 25 19:05:54 <melmoth> mhhh, there will probbaly be this little gap, plus most of the sample are in wav (well, i could encode them if needed)
Jun 25 19:06:12 <melmoth> ttuttle, yep, an unofficial os edition with goodies not on the n770 official os
Jun 25 19:06:14 <ericz> n770 does do WPA too, right?
Jun 25 19:06:44 <melmoth> ttuttle http://os2007on770.garage.maemo.org/
Jun 25 19:07:35 <ttuttle> awww, the 800 looks *cooler*.
Jun 25 19:07:57 <melmoth> well, it has no hard cover ..wich is not cooler.
Jun 25 19:08:06 <ttuttle> Oh good, mine's better!  *yay*  ;-)
Jun 25 19:08:17 <ericz> bet you can't get it for $130 either :P
Jun 25 19:08:26 <ttuttle> ericz: Yeah ;-)
Jun 25 19:09:28 <melmoth> hmm... may be i could let my laptop on all night long, with the pygame code that works, so i could listen to the rain sound in loop for 8 hours..with the sound reall really loud....
Jun 25 19:09:35 <ttuttle> lol
Jun 25 19:11:30 <ericz> hrm, i don't really go out enough to need a tablet :/
Jun 25 19:13:07 <ttuttle> ericz: Nah, you need one.
Jun 25 19:13:10 <ericz> ha
Jun 25 19:13:12 <ttuttle> ericz: ;-)
Jun 25 19:13:32 <ericz> odds are i would sit an use it in my computer chair.. right in front of my desktop.
Jun 25 19:15:04 <ttuttle> ericz: Take a walk, do some warwalking, get some fresh air.
Jun 25 19:15:15 <ericz> eh.. too much work
Jun 25 19:15:30 <ericz> though my neighborhood is filled with wireless signals.
Jun 25 19:16:08 <ttuttle> So has anyone written an IDE-type thing for the Maemo, with an input method specially designed for code?
Jun 25 19:17:09 <ttuttle> (Where is the app directory, anyway?)
Jun 25 19:17:38 <melmoth> the what ?
Jun 25 19:17:47 <ttuttle> Directory of applications for the N770.
Jun 25 19:17:58 <melmoth> https://garage.maemo.org/projects/pyphantom
Jun 25 19:18:07 <melmoth> there is no such thing as a 'directory of application'
Jun 25 19:18:11 <ttuttle> Oh.
Jun 25 19:18:34 <melmoth> it s a linux box with binary and data scattered all around, and a hildon library to have a nice and shiny menu to launch the app
Jun 25 19:18:47 <ttuttle> Is a "plug-in for Hildon Desktop" the equivalent of an app?  Does pyphantom run on the N770 itself?
Jun 25 19:19:00 <melmoth> nan, pyphantom runs on you desktop
Jun 25 19:19:05 <ttuttle> Oh :-(
Jun 25 19:19:25 <melmoth> it s like an editor that will setup up most of the regular needed file to package yorur python app easily
Jun 25 19:19:26 <_gpg_> i
Jun 25 19:19:29 <_gpg_> hi
Jun 25 19:19:53 <ttuttle> melmoth: But it said it's based on libhildondesktop -- what does that mean?
Jun 25 19:20:01 <melmoth> ttuttle, you dont want to code on the device directly (well, except if you want to trst gstreamer stuff :) )
Jun 25 19:20:13 <ttuttle> melmoth: You sure?
Jun 25 19:20:21 <melmoth> it means it create the menu files needed for hildon on its own (i guess)
Jun 25 19:20:22 <ttuttle> melmoth: I've been known to code on crazier devices.
Jun 25 19:20:46 <melmoth> who wants to code somewhere emacs is not ported ?
Jun 25 19:20:53 <ttuttle> Oh, is vim ported?
Jun 25 19:20:59 <melmoth> yes yes
Jun 25 19:21:02 <ttuttle> YAY!
Jun 25 19:21:42 <ericz> ew vim :P got a gui text editor?
Jun 25 19:21:55 <melmoth> there is leafpad as well
Jun 25 19:22:15 <melmoth> and 'notes' or whatitsnameagain.
Jun 25 19:23:25 <ttuttle> So what other cool apps are there?
Jun 25 19:24:42 <ericz> i saw this thing called autoscan on maemo.org somewhere
Jun 25 19:25:09 <ericz> i got the desktop linux version of it, looked awesome, i bet the n770 version would rock for random wireless networks
Jun 25 19:25:17 <ttuttle> Does anyone know how long woot normally takes to deliver?
Jun 25 19:25:55 <ericz> i always look at woot, but i don't even have an account, this is the first purchase i've ever considered
Jun 25 19:25:58 <melmoth> ttuttle, well, you can browse them all on garage
Jun 25 19:26:10 <ttuttle> ericz: You should totally get one ;-)
Jun 25 19:26:40 <ericz> it probably would encourage me to go outside.
Jun 25 19:26:51 <ttuttle> ericz: Yeah.  And getting a new toy is always fun.
Jun 25 19:27:38 <ericz> i suppose..
Jun 25 19:28:27 <melmoth> ttuttle, http://tabletblog.com/2006/12/welcome-to-your-new-nokia-770.html :)
Jun 25 19:29:24 <ttuttle> melmoth: Oh man, I'm so excited.  Thanks.
Jun 25 19:31:02 <ericz> ooh *boomarks*
Jun 25 19:32:30 <_gpg_> i dont know from where i can start, but let's give it a  try :)
Jun 25 19:33:29 <_gpg_> i'm working on  realtime embedded software for automotive (telepatics)
Jun 25 19:34:09 <_gpg_> i've just discovered maemo and would like to know if some one thaught about extending its features to automotive domain
Jun 25 19:34:25 <_gpg_> ?
Jun 25 19:34:41 <ttuttle> _gpg_: carman.
Jun 25 19:37:51 <_gpg_> ttuttle seems to be just a monitor, not something to embed to the vehicle, i'm i wrong ?
Jun 25 19:40:26 <||cw> _gpg_: maemo currently only runs on the nokia 770 and n800
Jun 25 19:40:52 <||cw> it's also not "real time"
Jun 25 19:40:59 <pupnik> how does woot do those low prices?  do you sign up for a cellfone contract?
Jun 25 19:41:07 <pupnik> do you sign-off your firstborn?
Jun 25 19:41:10 <pupnik> that is too cheap
Jun 25 19:41:13 <ericz> haha, woot's just awesome.
Jun 25 19:41:38 <pupnik> umm.  i've been in computer/electronics distribution
Jun 25 19:41:46 <_gpg_> ||cw i know, some of my projects arnt realtime too, but still run using qnx and other rtos
Jun 25 19:41:51 <ttuttle> ericz: You gonna get one?
Jun 25 19:41:53 <pupnik> that's a suspicious looking price
Jun 25 19:41:56 <ericz> not sure.
Jun 25 19:42:00 <_gpg_> ||cw this why i'm looking for other solutions
Jun 25 19:42:09 <||cw> pupnik: they buy overstock lots, probably compusa leftovers
Jun 25 19:42:20 <pupnik> hm ok that could explain it
Jun 25 19:43:13 <||cw> I doubt woot makes much per unit, but they move a crap load of stuff in a single day
Jun 25 19:43:37 <||cw> and when you are only packaging one item, it's much faster to do the packaging
Jun 25 19:44:10 <||cw> so they cut costs that way, and cut deals with fedex since they are shipping out a bunch of stuff all the same size and weight
Jun 25 19:44:10 <ttuttle> Anyone bought from them before?
Jun 25 19:44:19 <||cw> I have many times
Jun 25 19:44:22 <ericz> shipping's $5 to all 50 states, i think, for everything.. right?
Jun 25 19:44:27 <ttuttle> ||cw: How's the shipping time?
Jun 25 19:44:30 <ttuttle> ericz: 48 states.
Jun 25 19:44:35 <ericz> ah
Jun 25 19:44:56 <||cw> ttuttle: sometimes it takes a few days for them to ship out, but packaging is always good and fedex delivers well here
Jun 25 19:45:04 <||cw> it's 3day I think
Jun 25 19:45:14 <ericz> not like 4-6 weeks? :P
Jun 25 19:45:19 <ttuttle> ||cw: Where do you live (approximately) and how soon do you think I'll get my order placed today?
Jun 25 19:45:20 <||cw> no
Jun 25 19:45:24 <||cw> st louis
Jun 25 19:45:41 <||cw> no idea, it varies from a couple days to a week
Jun 25 19:46:00 <||cw> midnightbox.com is the same way
Jun 25 19:47:15 <||cw> woot is reliable though, when they say "new" they mean it.  they also stand behind it, if you get and something is wrong they will make an effort to replace or refund
Jun 25 19:47:36 <ttuttle> ||cw: Cool.  Their page sounded like they were sorta lazy about returns/refunds, and really didn't like them.
Jun 25 19:48:45 <||cw> they do prefer to defer to the manufacture warranty if possible
Jun 25 19:49:12 <ttuttle> ||cw: So they're in Dallas, you're in St. Louis, and I'm in Boston.  So my shipping is likely a little slower.  (Although if it's 3-day, it's 3-day.)
Jun 25 19:49:25 <ttuttle> ||cw: Do they start shipping during the day a product sells, or the next day?
Jun 25 19:49:30 <||cw> it's "fedex express saver"
Jun 25 19:49:39 <||cw> don't know
Jun 25 19:49:50 <ttuttle> Ok.
Jun 25 19:50:01 <||cw> maybe depends on the couple days before and how many they sold
Jun 25 19:52:23 <ttuttle> ||cw: Fedex thinks it will get here Thursday if they ship today.
Jun 25 19:52:48 <||cw> I don't think they have ever shipped same day
Jun 25 19:53:11 <ttuttle> ||cw: Awww... so maybe friday.
Jun 25 19:53:12 <||cw> maybe if the prec day was slow and you ordered at midnight
Jun 25 19:53:32 <||cw> at best, friday
Jun 25 19:53:53 <ttuttle> Oh, I *hope* Friday...
Jun 25 19:54:34 <||cw> i woulnd't count it
Jun 25 19:55:09 <ttuttle> Do they ask Fedex to deliver on Saturdays?
Jun 25 19:55:13 <||cw> last thing I got i order on the 19th and they shipped on the 22
Jun 25 19:55:19 <ttuttle> ::grumble::
Jun 25 19:55:28 <||cw> 19 was a saturday though
Jun 25 19:55:53 <||cw> in fed i ordered on the 10th and they shipped ont eh 11th though
Jun 25 19:56:39 <ttuttle> The fact that they're not sold out yet surprises me.
Jun 25 19:57:03 <||cw> me too, especially since it's so much cheaper than ebay
Jun 25 19:57:10 <ttuttle> I should've bought 2 or 3.
Jun 25 19:57:20 <ttuttle> But I didn't want to risk the extra money, and I've never used eBay.
Jun 25 19:57:23 <||cw> if I wasn't tight for money I'd buy 3 and turn them around on ebay
Jun 25 19:57:59 <||cw> likely woulnd't be a huge profit though, $20-$30 after fees
Jun 25 19:58:09 <ttuttle> ||cw: Can I change my order after submitting, and add another to it?
Jun 25 19:58:15 <ttuttle> ||cw: Well, depends where you sell them.
Jun 25 19:58:16 <||cw> never tried
Jun 25 19:58:38 <ttuttle> ||cw: eBay's competitive.  If you found a place where you could mark them up more (for example, sell them to friends for $180) you could make more money.
Jun 25 19:58:56 <||cw> if I had friends with money :D
Jun 25 19:59:04 <ttuttle> ||cw: ...yeah.
Jun 25 19:59:33 <||cw> looks like 1 to 3 days is typical processing time
Jun 25 19:59:58 <||cw> from my purchase history (gmail seatch FTW)
Jun 25 20:00:20 <ttuttle> ||cw: Okay, that's reasonable.  1 to 3 days, plus 3 day shipping = this Friday to next Tuesday.  Sweet.
Jun 25 20:00:24 <bstock> is there any sound at all for the 2007 hacker os or just no screen tap noise
Jun 25 20:02:13 <ttuttle> Oh, what media player is available?  Can I install MPD?
Jun 25 20:03:10 <melmoth> i would recommand ukmp
Jun 25 20:03:13 <ttuttle> Ok.
Jun 25 20:03:16 <melmoth> open source, plays ogg and mp3
Jun 25 20:03:29 <melmoth> plus you can nag the developper here if you find some bugs :)
Jun 25 20:04:04 <||cw> the built in nokia player is ok for mp3s, it's nothing special though
Jun 25 20:04:09 <ericz> woot gives you a tracking number, right?
Jun 25 20:04:22 <||cw> yes
Jun 25 20:04:38 <||cw> they will email you when it ships
Jun 25 20:09:43 <ttuttle> brb
Jun 25 20:13:55 <ttuttle> back
Jun 25 20:14:09 <ttuttle> Is there a good IRC client for the N770?  (Realizing that IRC on it is painful.)
Jun 25 20:14:14 <pupnik> i'm pretty happy with how the buttons turned out
Jun 25 20:14:14 <ttuttle> Has anyone ported Dasher?
Jun 25 20:14:16 <pupnik> http://pupnik.de/aliens_nokia_onscreenbuttons.jpg
Jun 25 20:14:28 <ttuttle> pupnik: Looks cool.
Jun 25 20:14:33 <pupnik> irssi and xchat
Jun 25 20:14:50 <||cw> and gaim, or whatever they are calling it now
Jun 25 20:15:05 <ttuttle> ||cw: pidgin.
Jun 25 20:15:27 <||cw> i'm never gonna remember that name
Jun 25 20:18:07 <zyxulnaga> pidgin
Jun 25 20:25:24 <ericz> ttuttle, wooted it.
Jun 25 20:27:17 <bstock> ok, when flashing and the flash command finishes, the n770 just sits at the white NOKIA screen with a green bar. do i have to unplug the USB or something nwo?
Jun 25 20:27:30 <ttuttle> ericz: Congrats and welcome to the club!
Jun 25 20:27:55 <ttuttle> ericz: /me hopes they ship them quickly.
Jun 25 20:28:00 <ericz> haha, i hope so too
Jun 25 20:28:34 <ericz> did you get an extra sd card or anything?
Jun 25 20:29:01 <ttuttle> ericz: Nah.  Apparently NewEgg sold out of RS-MMC cards today as a result of this listing on woot.
Jun 25 20:29:08 <ericz> haha
Jun 25 20:29:25 <ttuttle> ericz: I'm gonna see how much space I need first, and how much I can get away with online storagew.
Jun 25 20:29:48 <ericz> the woot side deal thing is at http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/campaigns/campaigntemplate.asp?CampaignID=28&SRCCODE=WOOT0107&CMP=SPC-WOOT
Jun 25 20:29:54 <ericz> 2gb sd cards there
Jun 25 20:30:33 <ttuttle> ericz: Ewww, tigerdirect.
Jun 25 20:30:47 <ttuttle> ericz: SD, not RS-MMC.
Jun 25 20:30:53 <ericz> ohh. duh
Jun 25 20:31:04 <ericz> haha, i got a laserprinter from there though, what's wrong with them
Jun 25 20:32:00 <ttuttle> ericz: Er, Newegg is cheaper, and some people have complained about them.
Jun 25 20:32:07 <ericz> ah
Jun 25 20:42:08 <ericz> ttuttle, i want it now :(
Jun 25 20:44:41 <ttuttle> ericz: Me too. :-(
Jun 25 20:44:52 <ttuttle> ericz: Let's go fly to w00t's offices and see if we can pick them up ;-)
Jun 25 20:44:57 <ericz> dallas? k
Jun 25 20:45:14 <ericz> i'd want my $5 for shipping back though
Jun 25 20:45:25 <ttuttle> ericz: ...of course.  And a T-shirt for your trouble, right?
Jun 25 20:45:30 <ericz> sure!
Jun 25 20:45:34 <ttuttle> ericz: ;-)
Jun 25 20:45:41 <ericz> a tour even
Jun 25 20:45:56 <ttuttle> ericz: Yeah.  They'll probably make you pack and ship a few orders though.
Jun 25 20:46:03 <ericz> haha
Jun 25 20:46:11 <ericz> "see what we have to go through?!"
Jun 25 20:48:03 <ttuttle> ericz: Oh man this is gonna ROCK!
Jun 25 20:48:33 <ericz> :)
Jun 25 20:49:02 <ericz> looking into usb keyboards now
Jun 25 20:49:29 <ttuttle> ericz: You know you need a special (probably homemade) adapter to use USB devices with the N770?  It's intended as a USB device.
Jun 25 21:09:11 <Veggen> ah. a gmyth howto.
Jun 25 21:09:26 <Veggen> anyone using gmyth=
Jun 25 21:09:27 <Veggen> ?
Jun 25 21:12:18 <renatofilho_> Veggen: Hi, I working with gmyth
Jun 25 21:14:06 <Veggen> does it work? makes it easy to access mythtv-recordings, etc?
Jun 25 21:15:23 <renatofilho_> Veggen: Yes this is the target of gmyth lib
Jun 25 21:15:25 <Veggen> right now, I used a n770-encode.pl (or whatever it was called), made a user job out of it, that just puts a transcoded version in a web-accessible directory.
Jun 25 21:17:41 <Veggen> renato: no debian packages yet? :)
Jun 25 21:19:22 <renatofilho_> Veggen: you can download gmencoder from here:https://svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/gmyth/trunk/gmyth-stream , for get your videos and transcode, and get this gst element (https://svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/gmyth/trunk/gst-gmyth) to transcode from you tv card
Jun 25 21:19:29 <renatofilho_> Veggen: not yet
Jun 25 21:20:15 <Veggen> Hmm. Nothing to install on the nokia, everything at the mythbox?
Jun 25 21:24:13 <renatofilho_> Veggen: you can use this player (http://barbieri-playground.googlecode.com/svn/maemo/catota/)  or mplayer with gms for play your files on n800
Jun 25 21:26:50 <konttori> melmoth: you around?
Jun 25 21:26:58 <konttori> did you remember to call: pygame.init()?
Jun 25 21:27:20 <konttori> well, of course you did if it works on your pc. silly me. bygones
Jun 25 21:33:40 <pupnik> ericz: get a thinkoutside stowaway (or the nokia) bluetooth keyboard
Jun 25 21:34:27 <ericz> pupnik, thanks, ill look into them
Jun 25 21:52:07 <monteslu> wow, woot's price is a quarter of what I paid :(
Jun 25 21:52:33 <pupnik> it's depressing
Jun 25 21:52:39 <monteslu> yup
Jun 25 21:52:53 <monteslu> but at least we get an influx of users
Jun 25 21:53:01 <ericz> ha, that's why i'm here!
Jun 25 21:53:19 <pupnik> i am hoping one of the DrPocketSNES guys can pick one up
Jun 25 21:53:28 <monteslu> I preorder one at launch, love  the thing
Jun 25 21:53:55 <monteslu> actually put it away for almost a year, but dug it out recently. The repos are awesome these days. Tons of apps
Jun 25 21:54:19 <pupnik> i have a bunch of works in progress at http://pupnik.de
Jun 25 21:55:03 <pupnik> for e.g. http://pupnik.de/dosbox_maemo_065_001.tgz
Jun 25 21:55:45 <monteslu> I did a port of gnuboy, but never got the screen to tilt 90degrees
Jun 25 21:55:59 <pupnik> nice
Jun 25 21:56:10 <monteslu> the buttons are kinda setup so that you need to rotate the screen
Jun 25 21:56:12 <ericz> is it a big deal to get sshd running?
Jun 25 21:56:23 <monteslu> nope, just install the dropbear server
Jun 25 21:56:27 <pupnik> would you be interested in working on DrPocketSNES?  They claim full speed with sound on a 250mhz GP2x
Jun 25 21:56:28 <monteslu> its in the repos
Jun 25 21:56:39 <ericz> i don't have to flash anything or void my warranty, heh
Jun 25 21:56:52 <monteslu> ericz, nope
Jun 25 21:56:56 <ericz> awesome.
Jun 25 21:57:21 <monteslu> pupnik, I'll take a look. been a while since I did any porting. Nokia kinda pissed me off be releasing the N800 so soon
Jun 25 21:57:22 <ericz> how about ssh'ing to other machines?
Jun 25 21:57:35 <monteslu> the dropbear client is in the same repo
Jun 25 21:57:40 <ericz> k, cool
Jun 25 21:57:42 <monteslu> you can even tunnel with it
Jun 25 21:58:44 <monteslu> I was on vacation this weekend, and was using the maemomapper with a bluetooth gps. My hotel had wireless, but not httpS, but i was able to ssh to my house and tunnel a vnc connection to my server
Jun 25 21:59:04 <pupnik> sweet
Jun 25 21:59:38 <monteslu> BTW, mission valley resort in San Diego is kinda overpriced, and the wireless connection doesn't reach far from the lobby :)
Jun 25 22:05:52 <ericz> there's snes9x for n770?!
Jun 25 22:06:29 <pupnik> yeah i just cross compiled it
Jun 25 22:06:49 <pupnik> played a bit of chrono last week, but it's slow and no sound
Jun 25 22:07:00 <pupnik> which is why DrPocketSNES is so crucial - it's much much faster
Jun 25 22:07:04 <ericz> ah
Jun 25 22:07:18 <ericz> what about zsnes?
Jun 25 22:07:27 <ericz> still slow?
Jun 25 22:07:29 <pupnik> zsnes needs x86 cpu
Jun 25 22:07:37 <ericz> oh
Jun 25 22:07:37 <pupnik> or it did, last time i checked
Jun 25 22:07:39 <monteslu> I'd be happy with an emulator for the original NES
Jun 25 22:07:46 <monteslu> can't get enough metroid and smb3
Jun 25 22:07:46 <pupnik> Tak made FCEU
Jun 25 22:07:54 <pupnik> so you can play NES games
Jun 25 22:07:58 <monteslu> screen rotated?
Jun 25 22:08:00 <pupnik> with choppy sound - but it works
Jun 25 22:08:04 <pupnik> why rotated?
Jun 25 22:08:10 <monteslu> because the buttons on the left
Jun 25 22:08:22 <pupnik> FCEU has onscreen buttons on the right
Jun 25 22:08:34 <pupnik> so you have dpad on the left and A/B buttons on the right side of the screen
Jun 25 22:08:41 <monteslu> interesting
Jun 25 22:08:54 <monteslu> can you use b & a at the same time
Jun 25 22:09:06 <monteslu> (for running jumps in SMB)
Jun 25 22:09:21 <pupnik> Afaik no, but he could add a third button that would combine them
Jun 25 22:09:32 <pupnik> That's what i am doing for Ur-Quan Masters (Star Control 2)
Jun 25 22:10:06 <pupnik> Ah but the running jump wouldn't work
Jun 25 22:10:19 <monteslu> yeah, you hold b to run then tap a
Jun 25 22:10:21 <pupnik> Unfortunately the 770/800 buttons only accept one button simultaneously
Jun 25 22:10:24 <monteslu> whiel still hold b
Jun 25 22:10:47 <pupnik> ok that's out.  Given the poor dpad design, action games are pretty much out, imo
Jun 25 22:10:51 <pupnik> unless you're playing with keyboard
Jun 25 22:11:05 <monteslu> or rotating the screen :)
Jun 25 22:11:49 <pupnik> still can't do direction and keypress simultaneously
Jun 25 22:12:16 <pupnik> the 770/800 can only accept one button press at a time
Jun 25 22:12:24 <monteslu> gotcha
Jun 25 22:13:00 <monteslu> but it can through a bluetooth thumboard?
Jun 25 22:13:08 <pupnik> Yeah BT can
Jun 25 22:13:44 <monteslu> can tak's fceu be configured to use different buttons?
Jun 25 22:13:58 <pupnik> I was dreaming of manufacturing a larger aluminum cover, with buttons and d-pad on the sides, that connected via bluetooth
Jun 25 22:14:09 <monteslu> nice
Jun 25 22:14:47 <pupnik> um i think so
Jun 25 22:15:06 <monteslu> add a built-in rechargeable battery that loops out to power up the 770
Jun 25 22:15:58 <pupnik> Yeah, you could also do a homemade version.
Jun 25 22:16:07 <monteslu> and has a slide out thumboard :)
Jun 25 22:16:51 <pupnik> Just buy one of those bluetooth controllers, take it apart.  Buy a spare aluminum cover, then cast or carve out a shell that attaches to the spare aluminum cover.
Jun 25 22:18:03 <pupnik> If you wanted to make a really thick one, you'd have space for a usb hard drive and extra Li-ion battery
Jun 25 22:18:43 <pupnik> Pretty disappointing that the N800 doesn't have the sliding cover, imo
Jun 25 22:19:13 * monteslu is really considering buying a second one as a permanent fixture for the vehicle
Jun 25 22:20:02 <monteslu> maemo mapper with a bluetooth GPS is a good enough nav system for me
Jun 25 22:20:39 <pupnik> the map data is free or commercial?
Jun 25 22:21:44 <monteslu> there is free stuff, but the commercial stuff is better
Jun 25 22:23:49 <monteslu> internettablettalk has some links to sites you can use, and you can tell maemomapper that you want to cache map images on you card
Jun 25 22:27:02 <pupnik> I don't travel.  It's too expensive
Jun 25 23:57:57 <samiam010203> hello all
Jun 25 23:58:06 <samiam010203> anyone active right now ?
Jun 25 23:58:19 <monteslu> sup dude
Jun 25 23:58:52 <samiam010203> im trying to install mh-shot-tool but its complaining about missing dependacies so im woundering what repos i need to at to myu sources.list
Jun 26 00:00:26 <samiam010203> anyone know what repos i should add
Jun 26 00:01:37 <konttori> I hate it when that happens.
Jun 26 00:01:56 <samiam010203> yes it sucks :(
Jun 26 00:01:57 <konttori> people should always include all dependencies in their repos
Jun 26 00:02:14 <samiam010203> thats what i think too
Jun 26 00:02:31 <konttori> take your pick from here: http://maemo.org/community/wiki/applicationrepositories/
Jun 26 00:02:47 <konttori> I would suspect http://repository.maemo.org/
Jun 26 00:02:48 <samiam010203> thanks for the link
Jun 26 00:02:52 <konttori> bora
Jun 26 00:03:02 <konttori> free non-free extras
Jun 26 00:03:11 <konttori> that might be the case.
Jun 26 00:03:13 <samiam010203> cool
Jun 26 00:03:18 <samiam010203> ill look into it now
Jun 26 00:03:20 <samiam010203> brb
Jun 26 00:03:22 <konttori> Up.s the address was:  	http://repository.maemo.org/extras/
Jun 26 00:13:53 <samiam010203> i need hildon-fm1, hildon-libs0, and libosso1 packages
Jun 26 00:14:01 <samiam010203> i cant seem to find them
Jun 26 00:25:54 <samiam010203> thanks guys/gals , i succesfully got it installed :)
Jun 26 01:12:36 <trevarthan> I just got a thinkoutside/igo kb.
Jun 26 01:13:11 <trevarthan> The FN key doesnt work and the SHIFT key doesnt work. how do I fix that?
Jun 26 02:43:35 <kakos> Is there a word processor for the N800?
Jun 26 02:57:14 <Brenduh> I figure ya'll bought rs mmc cards.  I was wondering if you know where the cheapest place is to buy them.
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Tue Jun 26 02:59:56 2007