**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Thu Jul 12 02:59:57 2007 Jul 12 03:00:05 i don't have to press real hard at certain spots anymore... Jul 12 03:01:02 ah nice Jul 12 03:01:42 what would have been nice is fucking java.... Jul 12 03:01:47 lol Jul 12 03:02:46 oh let me not even talk about opera browser being screwed up after the update.. Jul 12 03:02:55 scroll bar is screwed.. Jul 12 03:03:03 fullscreen its not there..ok Jul 12 03:03:48 going to take a screenshot of the mess. Jul 12 03:06:50 http://www.flickr.com/photos/unique0nez/782445658/ Jul 12 03:08:06 mm Jul 12 03:08:42 alot of stuff missing.. Jul 12 03:09:01 next to the Yahoo ID: the box is missing.. Jul 12 03:09:10 only shows up when it feels like it. Jul 12 03:09:23 scroll bar is missing.. Jul 12 03:09:51 which cuase the graphics on the webpage to be all fucked up on the right side.. Jul 12 03:10:44 so this is a new version of opera too? Jul 12 03:10:52 oh man...the youtube video issue that thoughtfix brung up on the blog... Jul 12 03:10:58 not a new version of opera.. Jul 12 03:11:21 just a version that doesn't seem to be getting along with the changes in the firmware.. Jul 12 03:11:37 youtube video is better.. Jul 12 03:12:05 but you have to wait till the whole video plays and then start from the beginning to get smooth playback.. Jul 12 03:14:15 Just pause it and wait for it to finish loading Jul 12 03:14:17 Then it's fine. Jul 12 03:14:23 Switch your theme Jul 12 03:14:25 reboot Jul 12 03:14:26 switch back Jul 12 03:14:31 Opera scrollbar will be fixed. Jul 12 03:15:19 ok Jul 12 03:15:29 understand the theme fix... Jul 12 03:16:41 I'll poll this question again: anybody have any luck with 3rd party themes on the latest firmaware. Jul 12 03:16:42 the youtube fix I don't like much...pause Jul 12 03:16:50 no Jul 12 03:17:01 i cannot install konttorri nuvo theme Jul 12 03:17:02 I agree, it's buggy as shit for no reason. Jul 12 03:17:08 But, at least we've got Flash 9 Jul 12 03:17:10 It's a START Jul 12 03:18:37 ok, so my scroll bar is back.. Jul 12 03:20:23 I'm still sticking to UKTUBE Jul 12 03:20:26 It works well Jul 12 03:20:31 Minus the copy-paste irritation. Jul 12 03:21:19 i couldn't get uktube to work even after a couple of installs on my 770 running os2007-HE Jul 12 03:21:30 Haven't bothered to test it on the 770 Jul 12 03:21:37 That's just a book reader at the moment. ;) Jul 12 03:22:07 well, no n800 here, just the newly purchased 770 from woot Jul 12 03:22:57 Congrats Jul 12 03:23:11 FBReader plus Project Gutenberg and gnuetella Jul 12 03:23:14 i'll really be tempted to get the 'latest, greatest, fastest' model out when wimax is everywhere and supported in the device Jul 12 03:23:33 N800 is way better than the 770 Jul 12 03:24:40 yeah, but the $135 price was sweet to me - half of the current n800 price... Hopefully more people will continue to upgrade and buy the recent models from Nokia Jul 12 03:24:57 actually, even less than half Jul 12 03:25:04 amazon is 357 now or something? Jul 12 03:25:07 I bought one, too. Jul 12 03:25:14 Mostly for an extra battery for the N800. ;) Jul 12 03:25:30 oh, u get 2 batteries with it? Jul 12 03:25:41 or you need another because of the battery life? ;-) Jul 12 03:25:47 Battery life is great Jul 12 03:26:05 But I'm going to be flying back and forth between Cali and Florida fairly often pretty soon. Jul 12 03:26:23 4.5 hours Atlanta to San Jose, 1 hour Tampa to Atlanta Jul 12 03:26:28 5.5 hours flight Jul 12 03:26:36 Plus whatever time I have to spend connecting Jul 12 03:26:46 I use it to play movies and TV shows Jul 12 03:26:57 Which gets me about 3 hours of battery life Jul 12 03:27:00 i need to buy a 2gb mobile mmc card for the 770, then move the main filesystem to the mmmc card Jul 12 03:27:04 Can charge a little in the airport Jul 12 03:27:12 don't watch for the whole flight Jul 12 03:27:23 That's a nice speed upgrade, for sure. Jul 12 03:27:40 Have 3g access so I don't have to buy a wifi pass in Atlanta Jul 12 03:28:13 it looks like $40 or so is the going price for the 2gb card ... i did see some cheaper on ebay, but not sure what I'd end up with there Jul 12 03:28:34 newegg? Jul 12 03:29:06 This SDHC corruption issue on the N800 is disturbing me. Jul 12 03:29:12 I was just about to pick up two 8gb cards, too. Jul 12 03:29:19 i didn't hear about that Jul 12 03:29:24 Not much info Jul 12 03:29:24 newegg and some others i ran across Jul 12 03:29:30 A little bit of discussion on ITT Jul 12 03:29:38 I want 32gb SDHC cards so I can have 64gb in my N800. Jul 12 03:29:48 that would be awesome Jul 12 03:30:36 I encoded all of Metalocalypse onto the N800 Jul 12 03:30:39 1.3GB Jul 12 03:30:52 If somebody hasn't heard of it I can just pull it out and show them. Jul 12 03:31:03 Be great if I could do that with South Park, too. ;) Jul 12 03:43:23 so what does media streamer look for Jul 12 03:43:41 ... media? Jul 12 03:44:02 server wise. Jul 12 03:48:32 UPnP Jul 12 03:50:11 i dont know exactly what that is? what protocol will do that? avahi kinda thing? i just want to know how to build the server for it. Jul 12 04:14:42 Hello - just got my N800 today. I'm smitten. Jul 12 04:15:06 You guys must enjoy writing programs for it. Jul 12 04:16:09 Disappointed about OGG not being given it's due place on a Linux system, though. Jul 12 04:22:58 eh Jul 12 04:25:44 I'm assuming that the N800's 'RSS' feed reader doesn't support Atom feeds.. is there a way to get my google reader atom feed on my N800 desktop? Jul 12 04:26:33 I don;t think anyone is responding. Jul 12 04:27:09 oh well Jul 12 04:27:12 IIRC is does support Atom. Try it anyway. Jul 12 04:27:51 it's possible I just typed the feed wrong (it's a really long url). Thanks, I'll try it again Jul 12 04:28:17 It does support copy/paste you know ... Jul 12 04:28:39 I know.. I couldn't find the feed through the N800 browser though Jul 12 04:28:59 google reader doesn't make it very apparent on the screen.. only in the src Jul 12 04:29:30 Know how to modify the main menu on the N800 yet? Jul 12 04:29:32 RSS feed reader help says Atom is supported. Jul 12 04:29:46 JussiP: cool. Jul 12 04:30:10 teer2: yea, thanks. Although it's only been an hour since I first turned it on. I'm a newb Jul 12 04:31:04 EnigmaCurry: Oh, can you tell me? I couldn't figure it out. I want to consolidate some directories. Also I made a typo creating one directory and I'm looking to delete it. Jul 12 04:32:28 Hmm, I installed Kilikali hoping it would play OGG media. No dice. I am not sure if it is trying to play them or not, but there's no sound coming out. I thought Kilikali was okay with OGG media, at least that's what I read on a forum. Jul 12 04:33:47 teer2: You go to the control panel and go down to personalization. Then Navigation. Then Applications->Organize Jul 12 04:33:55 * thoughtfix wanders back Jul 12 04:34:29 EnigmaCurry: Wicked nice! Thanks Jul 12 04:35:22 w00t! I got the OGG songs playing Jul 12 04:35:48 I dumped all my MP3 files, and I would have been real sad if I couldn't get the OGG files I paid for working. Jul 12 04:38:36 what did you use for playing ogg teer2? Jul 12 04:39:34 thoughtfix: not a bad mockup for the nokia successor! Do you think a clamshell (Zaurus/ Psion 5MX style) could sell well? Or does it look too clunky and outdated? Jul 12 04:39:36 Kilikali (I hope the Maemo team are good guys, because it opened their whole repository when I installed it. Little scary.) Jul 12 04:40:08 I had to also install the ogg-support package to get Kilikali happy. Jul 12 04:40:17 ahh Jul 12 04:40:25 So far it is better than the other media player, I think. Jul 12 04:42:09 I suck at photoshop Jul 12 04:42:22 Clamshells have the advantage of screen protection but require being open for interaction Jul 12 04:42:25 It's a balance of user desires Jul 12 04:42:43 And with a touchscreen, a slider makes more sense Jul 12 04:45:52 I need more applets Jul 12 04:46:09 ... more! ... applets! rraarrghh! Jul 12 04:46:30 <`0660> :) Jul 12 04:46:35 thoughtfix: I have to thank you, your blog is what introduced me to the N800. Just got mine today. Jul 12 04:46:49 Wow ... congrats Jul 12 04:46:59 I wonder how many people purchased tablets based on my writing. Jul 12 04:47:00 hehe Jul 12 04:47:07 <`0660> must be quite many Jul 12 04:47:12 I've had no fewer than 20 people tell me so Jul 12 04:47:18 So I wonder how many are silent Jul 12 04:48:09 <`0660> doesn't directly relate to this, but there was a news story about n800 and skype in the second most watched news in finland yesterday Jul 12 04:48:12 Well, everyone in my office today was jealous.. so you've affected a few even indirectly Jul 12 04:49:14 Exciting. My liveblogging of the new N800 firmware was front-paged on digg (my first time) and I got 10x my usual traffic that day and double my usual traffic every day since. Apparently Skype is a very big deal. Jul 12 04:50:04 Oh yeah... I moved to a new office to train some people in a new call center today and everyone said "What's that?" Jul 12 04:50:10 And started drooling as I explained it Jul 12 04:50:18 <`0660> :P Jul 12 04:50:34 <`0660> did you train them to sell n800? :) Jul 12 04:50:36 I need to print new business cards Jul 12 04:50:44 Awww crap... Flash Player works on the N800 ? Flash Player doesn't even work on my Linux computer! Son of a gun. What kind of chip does the N800 have? Jul 12 04:50:51 but am 3/4 of the way to changing from ThoughtFix to ThoughtFix, LLC Jul 12 04:51:05 Hahahaha Jul 12 04:51:10 I wish I got money from Nokia Jul 12 04:51:17 but they're nice to me and accessable Jul 12 04:51:22 and that's all I need as a journalist Jul 12 04:51:36 should have been selling ads, dude. Jul 12 04:51:41 <`0660> you would probably lose your credibility if you worked for them :) Jul 12 04:51:52 I have AdSense ads but they suck. I'd prefer a real sponsor Jul 12 04:52:14 When I saw your youtube videos at first I thought you worked for Nokia.. or maybe CNet or somerewhere like that Jul 12 04:52:20 Gotta sell yourself - I'm trying to do that with my site before it pops Jul 12 04:52:23 `0660: I may lose credibility in pimping Nokia products, but most of my blog is on what you can DO with it... that won't change. Jul 12 04:52:40 <`0660> you're right on that Jul 12 04:52:51 High praise, EnigmaCurry... Thank you. I'm a one-man shop Jul 12 04:53:04 I want to finish forming the blogs into an LLC so I can insure myself. Jul 12 04:53:13 As it stands, one lawsuit can wipe me out Jul 12 04:53:41 <`0660> so you live in us? :) Jul 12 04:53:48 lol Jul 12 04:54:23 Phoenix, AZ USA Jul 12 04:54:33 thoughtfix, I'm laughing w/ you Jul 12 04:54:39 Home of GoDaddy Jul 12 04:54:39 as I'm in the same boat... Jul 12 04:54:58 I applied for GoDaddy a long time ago... Jul 12 04:55:10 I could apply again Jul 12 04:55:18 but I've been at this company 5.5 years with 5 job titles Jul 12 04:55:26 and their online application is HARD to fill out with that. Jul 12 04:55:43 they run a lot of linux Jul 12 04:56:07 * cesman thought GoDaddy switch to MS a few years back.... Jul 12 04:56:14 1+ million linux systems, if you count virtual machines Jul 12 04:57:22 Yep Jul 12 04:57:25 huh - you can turn the n800 into a gps machine? Jul 12 04:57:44 Yep Jul 12 04:58:01 Two ways. Open-source Maemo Mapper or commercial Nokia N800 NAVKIT Jul 12 04:58:07 ... well, I figured you would agree, I'm reading your forum post. ;) Jul 12 04:58:34 Maemo Mapper works with your own Bluetooth GPS and the NAVKIT comes with a GPS, car charger, 2GB memory card, car mount, and software Jul 12 04:58:36 You are like a one man authority on N800s - that's cool Jul 12 04:58:58 Especially when nokia is so known for secrecy of product. Jul 12 04:59:46 Can I set myself up with GPS on this n800 for cheap? Jul 12 04:59:55 Haha. Yeah... My pre-holiday speculation at a CES launch of the 880 (what became the N800) didn't make NOK happy because it cut into holiday sales Jul 12 05:00:08 But my coverage of the tablets since and after made up for it and they were REALLY nice at CES Jul 12 05:00:13 oh - now you tell me. ;) Jul 12 05:00:30 oh, what became the N800 (whew!) Jul 12 05:00:51 We were all calling it the 870/880 at that point Jul 12 05:00:56 Yeah, actually, I was looking at the N700 when I heard about the N800 coming out on the Internet. I am one of those who waited Jul 12 05:00:56 didn't know it made it into the Nseries Jul 12 05:01:16 *N770 Jul 12 05:01:44 Between us it kinda bugs me when people call it the N770. The Nseries is their flagship multimedia line. The 770 wasn't part of that. Jul 12 05:01:50 Now I sound like a Nok marketing rep Jul 12 05:01:50 heh Jul 12 05:02:26 You've lost me, but I promise not to mention anything other than my new love, the N800, ever again. Jul 12 05:02:33 Oh no Jul 12 05:02:45 I was just clarifying... it's the Nokia 770, not the Nokia N770 Jul 12 05:02:54 Oh - gotcha Jul 12 05:03:00 You can see how high-end the Nseries devices are at nseries.com Jul 12 05:03:06 they even have their own site Jul 12 05:03:07 heh Jul 12 05:03:16 I WANT the N93i, but I am stuck on Verizon Jul 12 05:03:24 I bought a nokia cell phone just because I wanted it to be compatible with the N800 bluetooth. :) Jul 12 05:03:51 I saw the POI screen on your navicore video thoughtfix, but didn't read anywhere about street addresses. Can you navigate to typed in street addresses? Jul 12 05:04:01 How many hits do you get on your site, thoughtfix? Jul 12 05:04:12 EnigmaCurry: That's a problem with the POI database. Jul 12 05:04:25 teer2: I don't discuss specific numbers yet... not until I recruit sponsors Jul 12 05:04:34 but it's a low traffic site since it's a niche platform Jul 12 05:04:35 Gotcha!! Jul 12 05:04:55 I've had over a half million pageviews, but that's over time. Jul 12 05:05:28 My site is for a niche area too, but, like you, I am hoping it pops and the site is the "established authority" Jul 12 05:05:59 I also own ultramobilegeek.com but that's not even as popular as tabletblog Jul 12 05:06:05 Too bad everyone is iPhone crazy right now, though. Jul 12 05:06:22 No Jul 12 05:06:23 not too bad. Jul 12 05:06:29 This thing is waaaaaaay better than the iPhone (he says, never having seen an iPhone) Jul 12 05:06:39 It's being panned as weak by the top journalistic dogs like Pogue and Mossberg Jul 12 05:07:03 It's a fascinating device. If it had Flash, A2DP, Bluetooth DUN, and 3G, I'd have spent $599 for it Jul 12 05:07:05 Iphone doesn't do WiFi, does it? Jul 12 05:07:10 * EnigmaCurry wonders if the N800 will blend? Jul 12 05:07:17 but browsing the web without flash is asinine and the other ones are features I REALLY need Jul 12 05:08:08 Bluetooth + Tablet = Internet in my Pocket. I can't stand how cool that is. Jul 12 05:08:16 <`0660> yeah Jul 12 05:08:30 <`0660> i wish it was possible to block ads in n800 Jul 12 05:08:37 I can literally Jul 12 05:08:39 <`0660> or maybe i should just turn off the flash in it Jul 12 05:08:46 put my cell phone and N800 in my pocket Jul 12 05:09:05 Arg. Why did I have to get a blackberry? Jul 12 05:09:14 `0660: http://everythingisnt.com/ Jul 12 05:09:18 it doesn't work with the N800 Jul 12 05:09:30 0660 if you can find a convenient way to get lists of ad sites, you can add them to /etc/hosts as 127.0.0.1 Jul 12 05:09:48 0660:you can run privoxy on your n800 Jul 12 05:10:15 http://www.everythingisnt.com/hosts Copy this over your hosts file. Done and done. Jul 12 05:10:15 but you have to set up the proxy for every connection profile individually Jul 12 05:10:30 I helped work on this project. It is awesome. Jul 12 05:10:55 (he says, with no modesty) Jul 12 05:10:58 <`0660> thank you! Jul 12 05:11:03 brb Jul 12 05:11:15 `0660: you betcha Jul 12 05:12:42 Mike, who runs the website hosting the file, could use a couple bucks to help his expenses. If you're really thankful, you could make a donation. (Just a thought.) I've known the guy for a while (over the Internet) and he's kept this service up and running for years without fail. Jul 12 05:13:38 I just mention it because I think it is an important project. I was out of work for four months and just helped him update and update and update that list. Jul 12 05:14:11 nice. It might also be possible to parse the popular firefox adblocker lists with a script Jul 12 05:14:29 And, pupnik_ is right, you can use a proxy to get rid of the error messages Jul 12 05:14:49 can we disable opera's "could not connect to server: ad.doubleclick.net...." popups or are those js-generated... Jul 12 05:17:18 Which do you think is better and easier: Setting up an application to get into the N800 shell, or setting up a SSH server so I can access it remotely? Jul 12 05:17:42 (I don't even know how to see my host file yet!!) Jul 12 05:17:51 ssh is the first thing I install Jul 12 05:18:18 Hmm Jul 12 05:18:24 I just had the greatest thought Jul 12 05:18:27 Blendtec blenders Jul 12 05:18:39 Take that to IPO, man! Jul 12 05:18:45 ;-) Jul 12 05:18:56 <`0660> ssh is really good Jul 12 05:18:58 John Wayne Gacy and Dahmer and others got caught when their stashed bodies got found ... but if they had a Blendtec... Jul 12 05:21:22 ... Jul 12 05:21:27 I should keep some thoughts to myself Jul 12 05:21:48 Sounds delicious. Okay - next question - where do I get instructions for installing SSH. :) Jul 12 05:22:10 It's in the repository Jul 12 05:22:12 called dropbear Jul 12 05:23:34 :( Application Manager -> Add -> Drop bear? I don't see that. Jul 12 05:24:28 Lots of crappy, proprietary skype packages, though Jul 12 05:24:41 dropbear sshd. Jul 12 05:24:42 hmm Jul 12 05:24:48 do you have the maemo-hackers repository? Jul 12 05:25:38 I think the repository list changed when I one-click installed Kilikali Jul 12 05:25:56 But otherwise, I haven't seen how to see the repository list Jul 12 05:28:01 Can the default PDF reader flip 90 degrees.. or am I going to have to use a different reader? Jul 12 05:28:09 Do I download dropbear from the Maemo site? Jul 12 05:30:22 Or I could make a Public Service Announcement: "Beware. If you visit someone's house and they have no fresh fruit nor Margarita mix but do have a Blendtec blender, they are a serial killer." Jul 12 05:30:35 Are the application manager's Catalog functions the same as Repositories ? Jul 12 05:31:13 I have the Tuomas Kulve catalog present, at least. Jul 12 05:32:09 Oh, I see how to set up the hackers one now Jul 12 05:32:32 teer2: http://maemo.org/community/wiki/ApplicationRepositories Jul 12 05:34:46 cesman: thank you. Jul 12 05:34:57 you're welcome Jul 12 05:35:23 Okay, added the hackers to my list. *fingers crossed that I don't end up downloading someone's rootkit* Jul 12 05:36:28 You Maemo fellows are good guys, right? Jul 12 05:36:40 Sure seems like you put together a good collection of tools Jul 12 05:36:49 I'll be happier when I can check out the source code Jul 12 05:37:27 Sorry if I sound unappreciative of all the work you must have done to port these apps! Jul 12 05:38:07 <`0660> don't be sorry :) Jul 12 05:39:00 <`0660> i think everyone will be happy if you download the code and start submitting patches :) Jul 12 05:39:23 SSH server got installed... and? I'm not seeing step 2... hmm... No new menu items.. Jul 12 05:39:32 <`0660> it's started already Jul 12 05:39:41 Even if I could get to port 22, what's the user name? password? Jul 12 05:39:41 <`0660> open a connection to the device as root Jul 12 05:39:53 <`0660> the password is "rootme" (change it instantly) Jul 12 05:40:00 lol Jul 12 05:40:03 rofl Jul 12 05:40:08 <`0660> why? :) Jul 12 05:40:19 funny password Jul 12 05:41:55 that's awesome Jul 12 05:42:04 <`0660> :) Jul 12 05:43:50 What is /media/mmc2 ? Jul 12 05:44:02 Maybe just a placeholder... hmm... Jul 12 05:44:03 They're both SD card slots Jul 12 05:44:20 Thought there was just one? Jul 12 05:44:29 <`0660> there's two Jul 12 05:44:44 There are two SD card slots Jul 12 05:46:33 That's sick. I love it. Jul 12 05:46:34 Can you install an application to an SD card.. or only to the N800 itself? Jul 12 05:46:49 Currently only to the N800 itself Jul 12 05:46:50 but Jul 12 05:46:58 Some apps can store data on the SD cards Jul 12 05:47:03 Like the camera, GPS software, media softare Jul 12 05:47:57 Anyone run out of space on the N800 for apps? ;) Jul 12 05:48:15 Okay, so I know now why Tiger Direct was encouraging my purchase of a 2 pack of SD cards. Glad I got both - for 4 GB total extra space. Amazing amount of space. Jul 12 05:49:56 lol - I am running vi on my phone. Long have I awaited this day. *lightning* Jul 12 05:50:20 <- easily pleased Jul 12 05:50:45 * EnigmaCurry was looking for emacs but couldn't find it.. probably too big anyway. Jul 12 05:51:07 Pow. I broke your stuff. Jul 12 05:51:58 (top): 0x0004b448 *** Jul 12 05:51:58 *** glibc detected *** double free or corruption (top): 0x0004b448 *** Jul 12 05:51:58 *** glibc detected *** double free or corruption (top): 0x0004b448 *** Jul 12 05:51:58 *** glibc detected *** double free or corruption (top): 0x0004b448 *** Jul 12 05:54:21 Sorry about that!! I didn't realize how much was in my buffer. Jul 12 05:55:22 So my shell is spewing errors at an alarming rate, but the GUI is still holding up just fine. Unfortunately, I can't open a new session to SSH to kill processes. Jul 12 05:56:10 Have you guys seen readermini.com? Works like a charm on the 800 Jul 12 05:57:30 My friend John coded it :D Jul 12 05:58:32 it's a godsend, I *almost* started to regret the 800 purchase when I saw how horrible google reader looked... but all is well now! Jul 12 05:58:44 So I think dropbear has a bit of a buffer overflow issue. I am going to reboot the unit, I guess. Jul 12 06:00:43 Really sorry about the flood. Jul 12 06:03:51 i didn't. thanks EnigmaCurry Jul 12 06:03:58 i love that nick btw Jul 12 06:04:50 using synergy to steer two PCs, a laptop and a nokia is so fun. :) Jul 12 06:11:00 Hi - anyone not have me on auto-ignore? Where is the "Documents" directory in the shell? I saved a file in the GUI and I can't find it in the SSH shell. Jul 12 06:11:47 nm - I put it on the SD card Jul 12 06:15:04 <`0660> MyDocs/.Documents? Jul 12 06:15:55 Oooh - sorry - didn't think it would be hidden Jul 12 06:17:25 <`0660> yeah, don't know why they would hide it Jul 12 06:27:39 synergy2 works on the 800? This I've got to try! Jul 12 06:31:08 So ... awesome ... zzzzzzz... (falls asleep snuggled up to his N800) zzzzzz..... Jul 12 06:42:55 haha Jul 12 06:45:54 hi Jul 12 06:45:55 <_Monkey> que tal, latzko Jul 12 06:48:18 In sbox x86 target, the virtual keyboard never comes up - none of the applications- it says GLIB WARNING ** default - Unable to get the window id. Have you ever met this? Jul 12 06:49:10 pupnik: Does synergy work only with some applications? I've got it working but I don't see a mouse cursor on the 800 when I move my mouse onto it. Jul 12 06:49:22 maybe install is incomplete but I dunno how and why.. Jul 12 06:52:08 I can use my PC mouse on the N800 inside a pygame application that uses the mouse, just no where else :( Jul 12 07:13:23 Hi to everyone! One question: Jul 12 07:13:31 Can I access my PC's usb ports while inside scratchbox Jul 12 07:30:41 morning Jul 12 07:34:03 hi polac_ i don't know Jul 12 07:34:34 polac_: if you need to transfer data, you can certainly do it outside of scratchbox and copy into a SB directory Jul 12 07:34:38 hi Jul 12 07:34:39 <_Monkey> salut, pupnik Jul 12 07:35:40 heya. If anyone here is a webdesigner please be careful not to make the site use CPU heavily Jul 12 07:38:55 pupnik: I would like to debug my program that uses usb first inside the scratchbox Jul 12 07:39:51 polac i think it would be useless: you are using your host kernel in scratchbox Jul 12 07:40:13 so any usb device thingy you may play with wont be necessarily the same on the device itself Jul 12 07:40:42 melmoth hmmm... good point. Jul 12 07:41:23 polac_: i also see no entries under /proc/bus/usb in scratchbox Jul 12 07:42:12 So I probably need to get 770 to test my app Jul 12 07:46:47 anyone knows if it is possible to install LAMP(Apache; MySQL;PHP) platform on nokia n800? Jul 12 07:47:49 stddoubt, it should be, LNSP (Linux; Nginx; SQLite; PHP) is trivial Jul 12 07:49:03 std, I dunno if apache is the best choice with such limited memory though Jul 12 08:02:28 polac_: If the usb is handled via ioctl or device node via /dev it should be usable in scratchbox Jul 12 08:04:04 Also scratchbox could be hacked hack to access the /proc thru a symlink in /mnt Jul 12 08:04:12 s/mnt/tmp/ Jul 12 08:04:12 theril meant: Also scratchbox could be hacked hack to access the /proc thru a symlink in /tmp Jul 12 08:04:23 :inz Mysql is not possible? Jul 12 08:04:52 I need php and mysql Jul 12 08:05:49 I see no reason why mysql couldn't be run, but it's quite resource intensive Jul 12 08:07:02 Morning, all Jul 12 08:08:35 is there any guide on how to install that type of software? Jul 12 08:09:43 good morning Jul 12 08:09:59 stddoubt, it really does not sound like a good idea Jul 12 08:10:11 at least consider sqlite Jul 12 08:10:33 stddoubt: You'll probably have to compile it in scratchbox and create a deb package Jul 12 08:10:54 or better, think about your _real_ problem (ie what will the php application actually do? cant you do the same with something that would fit in a tablet ? ) Jul 12 08:11:12 right Jul 12 08:11:55 tablet-as-webserver is, silly like a monty-python political candidate, imo :) Jul 12 08:13:35 was about to say that try sqlite but it was mentioned .. Jul 12 08:17:13 is it possible to run drupal in slqlite? Jul 12 08:18:29 propably if it has good enough db abstraction .. Jul 12 08:20:01 I think it doesn't Jul 12 08:20:37 But my drupal code reading is from 04 or something Jul 12 08:20:46 some older versions might have some patches.. atleast thats what our friend google said =) Jul 12 08:21:19 thns gonna checkit out Jul 12 08:21:22 :) Jul 12 08:22:49 I think that mysql is better choice for drupal Jul 12 08:23:03 Even on tablet Jul 12 08:23:32 I need the quickest solution I can find Jul 12 08:23:48 and with the least trouble Jul 12 08:24:10 http://my.opera.com/monroe/blog/maemo-postgresql Jul 12 08:24:29 theril my app uses libusb. can it be hacked to use /tmp (where usb is mounted). probably too complicated. I just wait few days and test it in the actual device. Jul 12 08:25:09 Aloha! Jul 12 08:27:32 tnhks Jul 12 08:27:54 where can I find the php and apache package? Jul 12 08:27:58 polac_: if your app/lib is using hardcoded file to access it, you can allways symlink ? Jul 12 08:28:58 or ioctl which would be directly available. dunno how that would work via arm emulation thou. Jul 12 08:29:17 what sort of usb device it is ? Jul 12 08:29:52 Did anyone compile OpenVPN and create Maemosized package for N800 by yourself? I refered http://www.rahkonen.org/openvpn.html but my N800 says "Not Installable" :( Jul 12 08:29:52 my app uses lib (which i made) that uses libftdi that uses libusb Jul 12 08:30:54 that doesnt really mean anything to me. Jul 12 08:31:45 i think the main issue is, how does libusb access the hardware.. Jul 12 08:32:38 BTW, /sys/bus/usb is accessible Jul 12 08:34:47 lsusb could be nice Jul 12 08:37:03 std, there's no apache package, you need to build it yourself Jul 12 08:37:49 std, same for MySQL Jul 12 08:38:16 http://maemo.org/downloads/product/thttpd/ Jul 12 08:39:35 http://maemo-hackers.org/php5-fastcgi.install Jul 12 08:40:23 theril, the php5-fastcgi is most likely easier with nginx Jul 12 08:40:38 (dunno if thttpd supports fastcgi at all) Jul 12 08:41:18 thnks Jul 12 08:41:34 inz: Probably Jul 12 09:56:37 morning Jul 12 09:56:45 (just) Jul 12 10:13:16 <__Nikos__> Is there a debian package for sdl-net in order to install it on a nokia n800 device? Should i build it myself? Jul 12 10:26:37 __Nikos__: There are other sdl packages about. No reason to assume sdl-net isn't among them. And these are n800 specific packages, not debian ones afaicr Jul 12 10:26:59 __Nikos__: Or have you found others and sdl-net wasn't among them? Jul 12 10:33:40 <__Nikos__> I just build an app using sdl-net and now want to install the package on the device Jul 12 10:33:47 <__Nikos__> Can't find it Jul 12 10:41:37 If the next tablet has multi touch support, this xserver might be handy.. http://wearables.unisa.edu.au/mpx/?q=node/86 Jul 12 10:41:44 __Nikos__: What machine? Jul 12 10:42:28 <__Nikos__> lardman: nokia n800 Jul 12 10:42:55 __Nikos__: I see sdl_net for my N800 Jul 12 10:43:14 * lardman wonders if there's an easy way to list his repos Jul 12 10:43:43 what theme is it? http://maemo.org/midcom-serveattachmentguid-db5416d00bd211dcabeeb929c46ee586e586/thumbnail_mirage.png Jul 12 10:43:54 <__Nikos__> lardman: you mean you see the libraries in a directory? Jul 12 10:44:09 __Nikos__: I see it available in the app installer Jul 12 10:44:35 <__Nikos__> lardman: let me check... Jul 12 10:46:36 eugene: Plankton with different icons? Jul 12 10:46:38 __Nikos__: See here http://maemo.org/community/wiki/applicationrepositories/, add http://repository.maemo.org/ and http://repository.maemo.org/extras/ Jul 12 10:46:59 <__Nikos__> lardman: why i can't see the same...should i add these repositories? Jul 12 10:47:11 __Nikos__: I also have http://downloads.kernelconcepts.de/maemo3, but I don't think it's from there Jul 12 10:47:23 __Nikos__: Yes, try adding them Jul 12 10:47:39 X-Fade: plankton? not familiar with this Jul 12 10:47:54 eugene: Then you are really missing out :) Jul 12 10:48:11 googling for it now Jul 12 10:49:23 eugene: http://tigert.1g.fi/blog-files/n800-theme/hildon-theme-cacher_0.2.0-1_armel.deb Jul 12 10:49:23 X-Fade: where can i download it? garage says "This project has not released any files." Jul 12 10:49:26 http://tigert.1g.fi/blog-files/n800-theme/experimental/hildon-theme-plankton_3.1.0-1_all.deb Jul 12 10:49:34 Install in that order! Jul 12 10:49:38 thanks! Jul 12 10:49:53 plankton is a good theme eh? Jul 12 10:51:08 i hope nothing goes wrong with my n800 if i forgot to stop charging it for 2 days Jul 12 10:51:19 Are there any screenshots of plankton? Jul 12 10:51:44 bahh, sometimes i dont charge mine for more than a week Jul 12 10:51:50 o m f g Jul 12 10:51:52 lardman: About every program on downloads has screenshot with plankton :) Jul 12 10:51:54 melmoth: i mean, i overcharged it for 2 days Jul 12 10:51:59 omgz?!1 Jul 12 10:52:01 ohh.. i dont know, i never try :) Jul 12 10:52:08 http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-365586126885215066&q=hacking+democracy Hacking Democracy - The blatant Diebold fraud Jul 12 10:52:16 melmoth: hopefully it is able to stop charging once it reached it's max Jul 12 10:52:17 1:21 Jul 12 10:52:26 eugene, well, you ll tell us :) Jul 12 10:52:28 pupnik: heh yeah I saw that Jul 12 10:52:35 they stored the votes in plaintext on cf cards?! Jul 12 10:52:35 melmoth: :/ Jul 12 10:52:50 you could pre-bias cards before the voting with negative numbers?! Jul 12 10:52:56 lardman: http://downloads.maemo.org/midcom-serveattachmentguid-d74562b2b6f311dbab8c4ddca7cf31573157/fmradio Jul 12 10:52:57 that's criminal. Jul 12 10:53:25 X-Fade: Okay, thanks Jul 12 10:53:57 It is also the default community theme in Sardine.. Jul 12 10:53:57 <_Monkey> okay, X-Fade. Jul 12 10:54:33 trying it now Jul 12 10:55:54 hi all Jul 12 10:57:05 So is the new firmware considered Chinook then? Jul 12 10:57:42 cy-: Chinook will be the next mayor OS upgrade.. Jul 12 10:57:57 k, so this is still bora even though it's 4.x Jul 12 10:58:16 cy-: I think it will be more like 2008OS ? Jul 12 10:58:19 4.2007.whatev Jul 12 10:58:22 k Jul 12 10:58:42 I just flashed Jul 12 10:59:12 any idea how i can remove the background pic? Jul 12 10:59:49 found it Jul 12 11:00:26 whats the default wallpaper for plankton? Jul 12 11:03:48 <__Nikos__> lardman: for this repository http://maemo.org/community/wiki/applicationrepositories/ which components must i define? Jul 12 11:06:33 __Nikos__: that's an awesome link. Jul 12 11:07:17 <__Nikos__> eugene: hope i ll find there sdl-net Jul 12 11:09:31 that's a horrible page Jul 12 11:10:55 suihkulokki: have you looked at the maemo.org recently? :) most of the pages are like that. Jul 12 11:10:57 suihkulokki: hey Jul 12 11:11:08 now, i think, most of the links work :] Jul 12 11:11:27 people creating their own repositories for each and every app... Jul 12 11:11:40 ...that depend on packages on other repositories... Jul 12 11:11:51 that SO no howto be friendly to users Jul 12 11:21:39 <__Nikos__> lardman: have add the three repositories but still no solution. Do you have others? What is exactly the name that you see in the application manager Jul 12 11:29:16 if plankton has a default wallpaper, that would be great. now it looks weird :) Jul 12 11:35:50 Does anybody have idea what "matchbox-wm: X error warning (0x380002a): BadWindow (opcode: 12)" means? Jul 12 11:36:08 or "qemu: uncaught target signal 11 (Segmentation fault) - exiting" Jul 12 11:36:44 after the error X is left running but maemo crashes Jul 12 11:37:34 it's ok. i got it from the svn. somehow it's missing from the deb. Jul 12 11:39:24 Mikho, the BadWindow sounds like matchox trying to do configure a window that has been deleted Jul 12 11:39:40 Mikho, in Xproto.h, there's #define X_ConfigureWindow 12 Jul 12 11:41:12 the error came when I was running my app. First the leftmost toolbar disappeared, and when I closed my app, maemo didn't come back up Jul 12 11:42:14 Mikho, you most likely want to do scratchbox debugging on an i386 rootstrap Jul 12 11:42:29 Mikho, qemu isn't all perfect and can (will) cause unexpected SIGSEGVs Jul 12 11:42:46 i see Jul 12 11:42:59 I couldn't reproduce the error Jul 12 11:43:11 but this isn't the first time it came Jul 12 11:46:45 in addition to qemu, eclipse, cdt, laika and glade aren't all perfect either. I've managed to crash them all Jul 12 11:47:38 wasn't probably even too hard? Jul 12 11:47:39 Mikho: i saw someone else with that qemu error Jul 12 11:48:29 but I'll switch to i386 for development Jul 12 11:48:42 one imperfect component less Jul 12 11:54:47 ok now, laika refuses to change the target :& Jul 12 12:01:18 wow, there are 53 eqmu processes still running on my pc Jul 12 12:01:25 *qemu Jul 12 12:15:24 Anyone got JavaME working on the N800? Jul 12 12:17:27 aleksandyr has, there's a page on sun.com about it too Jul 12 12:23:21 groovy Jul 12 12:23:49 goodluck Jul 12 12:23:56 :) Jul 12 12:31:11 Great, there's a postal strike tomorrow, so the chances of me recieving my N800 are not very likely ^_^ Jul 12 12:31:17 * alterego cries "boo hoooooo" Jul 12 12:32:42 "We need more money because we're trying really hard to work as little as possible." Jul 12 12:32:46 Government workers have it good. Jul 12 12:32:49 They should just STFU. Jul 12 12:33:26 I wouldn't mind, but when we give them more money, they just put their prices up :D Jul 12 12:33:58 It seems to happen every year. One day a year Royal Mail goes on strike. It's so tedious. Jul 12 12:34:33 I was looking forward to a weekend of hacking the N800 and now what? I guess I'll just have to do some actual work and read about hacking the N800 ^_^ Jul 12 12:37:16 alterego, you dont need the device to start using scratchbox Jul 12 12:37:28 Indeed. Jul 12 12:37:35 I have set up scratchbox. Jul 12 12:37:44 But the things I want to hack I do need the device :D Jul 12 12:38:21 I have a GPS module that needs about 100mA @ 3v I want to use with USB OTG Hostmode. Jul 12 12:38:45 I'd like to work on TV out. Jul 12 12:38:59 And possibly look into the PowerVR chip. Jul 12 12:39:18 hmm, yeah, for this kind of stuff , you may need the device :) Jul 12 12:40:07 Well, I'm happy reading up on the developer mailing lists for now :) Jul 12 12:40:23 I do have a lot of catching up to do. I've not done anything maemo in about 2 years :D Jul 12 12:40:35 If PowerVR gets drivers I'll kill myself. Jul 12 12:40:37 alterego: How do you plan to acheive those? Hardware hacking?-) Jul 12 12:41:11 The PowerVR chip is about getting drivers set up. Jul 12 12:41:32 + Jul 12 12:41:32 You can obtain the drivers from the manufacturer. Only problem is. I don't think they're armel. Jul 12 12:42:14 The TV Out well, I have a strong suspicion that nokia has actually already wired it up to the same jack as the headphone socket. Ala N95 et al. Jul 12 12:42:36 Looking at the OMAP2420 kernel tree, getting TV Out to work is a no brainer :) Jul 12 12:42:54 ...after soldering Jul 12 12:43:01 After installing the new IT OS 2007 version ssh:ing to N800 has become very laggy, even when pinging it at the same time which worked before Jul 12 12:43:27 Wiring it up is impossible. I'm betting on it already being wired up to their "Nokia AV 3.5mm connection". Jul 12 12:44:06 alterego: If it works like the N95, that would be really great ;) My N95 on my TV is really nice. Jul 12 12:44:24 alterego: the drivers are binary and for the 2.4 kernel. Jul 12 12:44:26 I'm guessing they're doing a similar thing they did by hiding the existance of the FM reciever I think :) Jul 12 12:45:07 alterego, when you get your n800...all these projects you will be working on? Jul 12 12:45:10 Well, there was this setup on the N800 launch. Where they showed Navicore on a large tv on the N800.. Jul 12 12:45:18 using vnc Jul 12 12:45:28 suihkulokki: Yeah, probably :) Jul 12 12:45:30 GeneralAntilles, I'm pretty certain I saw a 2.6 driver, but yes. I could be wrong. Jul 12 12:45:35 suihkulokki: Or exported X display.. Jul 12 12:45:48 Or Svideo ^_^ Jul 12 12:46:25 Did anyone see the setup? Jul 12 12:46:39 alterego: So you are going to put out the cash for the drivers or are you planning to write some?-) Jul 12 12:47:08 zuh, I'm pretty sure they're working on the drivers themselves. Jul 12 12:47:10 why not bombard the powervr site with emails...asking them for armel drivers Jul 12 12:47:21 2.6 armel drivers ;) Jul 12 12:47:57 There are 2.6 drivers. The Pepperpad has them.. Jul 12 12:48:03 I signed up for a developer account on the website last night and there was a tick box saying "Would you like to be notified about N800 drivers?" Jul 12 12:48:13 The pepperpad uses a different chip X-Fade Jul 12 12:48:15 weird. make zImage doesn't build vmlinux with debuginfo even though CONFIG_DEBUG_KERNEL=y Jul 12 12:48:37 wasn't pepperpad geode? Jul 12 12:48:39 The pepperpad has an intel chip if memory serves me correctly. Jul 12 12:48:46 i'm not sure either Jul 12 12:49:13 Sure, still a MBX format but I don't really know much about the interface of these chips. Jul 12 12:49:31 I'd just love to see OpenGL ES working on the N800 ^_^ Jul 12 12:50:23 I still think that nokia are working on the drivers. Jul 12 12:50:38 They already have the license for the N95, why can't they use it in the N800? Jul 12 12:50:50 I bet it's per device Jul 12 12:51:01 Feckin' con artists ;) Jul 12 12:51:07 Yeah Jul 12 12:51:11 Not per chip? Jul 12 12:51:15 alterego: I just measured the composite output on the N95 cable in my N800. Gives 6.69MOhm. The audio plugs give about 180Ohm.. Jul 12 12:51:15 microsoft tactics Jul 12 12:51:17 The chips are identical. Jul 12 12:51:37 It wouldn't suprise me if Nokia decided on the OMAP2420 for the N800 _because_ of the N95 .. Jul 12 12:52:19 X-Fade, doesn't mean much. The kernel has to enable the TV out. Jul 12 12:53:03 alterego: For your information, I tried the N95 remote too. Doesn't seem to do much there either.. Jul 12 12:53:14 N95 remote? Jul 12 12:53:30 (I don't have an N95) ;) Jul 12 12:53:34 Yeah, the headset control thingie.. Jul 12 12:53:43 Right. Well, why would it? :P Jul 12 12:53:57 Completely different OS you realise ;) Jul 12 12:53:57 Also 4 part 3.5 plug.. Jul 12 12:54:20 Yeah, so no hidden already implemented feature ;) Jul 12 12:54:41 That observation is somewhat meaningless. Jul 12 12:55:09 Check out the N800 internals. There's some detailed images of the PCB look at the headphone jack and tell me it doesn't look weird to you :P Jul 12 12:55:41 it does... Jul 12 12:56:21 But like I said, obviously I don't know. This is all guess work. Jul 12 12:56:34 But I would like to investigate it when I get my N800 .. Eventuall .. Jul 12 12:56:57 Just rip it apart and start measuring ;) Jul 12 12:57:12 I'm not going to take it apart :P Jul 12 12:57:21 There's no need for what I want to do :) Jul 12 12:58:14 I've already seen in great detail what it looks like on the inside. Probably better with my shite eye sight ^_^ Jul 12 12:59:59 Hehe. Jul 12 13:05:31 does anyone have any idea why make zImage does not build a kernel with debuginfo even if CONFIG_DEBUG_KERNEL is y? Jul 12 13:27:03 hmmmm Jul 12 13:27:45 Does anyone else have audio/video sync issues with uktube? Jul 12 13:28:13 Should I just try to download the video again? Jul 12 13:28:40 It plays the video at double(?) speed Jul 12 13:36:52 wow, that sounds like its really fast!! :-) Jul 12 13:37:28 eugene: i dunno - does debug info go through syslog? Jul 12 13:38:00 pupnik: debuginfo == meaning the dwarf info in vmlinux Jul 12 13:38:03 tigert: Did you see that Plankton is broken on Sardine? Jul 12 13:38:12 ok i am clueless sorry Jul 12 13:38:19 that's a funny sentence, X-Fade Jul 12 13:38:22 it does seem like it is not compiling the kernel with -g Jul 12 13:39:13 X-Fade: how is it broken? Jul 12 13:39:18 tigert: The toolbar buttons seem missing in the template.. Jul 12 13:39:21 https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1616 Jul 12 13:39:25 X-Fade: completely? Jul 12 13:39:28 Yep.. Jul 12 13:39:44 So that gives a rather big mess. Jul 12 13:39:56 ah ok Jul 12 13:40:01 probably a snafu with layout.txt Jul 12 13:40:07 we'll fix it Jul 12 13:40:30 right now I am very busy and then theres guadec Jul 12 13:40:31 Yeah, they are mentioned in the gtkrc. But they are not available.. Jul 12 13:40:34 but I'll see Jul 12 13:40:37 right Jul 12 13:40:49 probably accidentally deleted from layout, or there is a typo Jul 12 13:40:52 tigert: is this the wallpaper for plankton? https://stage.maemo.org/svn/maemo/projects/haf/trunk/hildon-theme-plankton/wallpaper/wallpaper.png Jul 12 13:41:19 eugene: its current test wallpaper Jul 12 13:41:22 its a bit weird :) Jul 12 13:41:34 yeah :/ Jul 12 13:41:36 I tried out sardine again, but it was horribly broken again. Random noice on the screen where there are no images.. Jul 12 13:41:40 are there less weird test wallpaper? :) Jul 12 13:42:24 eugene: http://www.flickr.com/photos/tigert/514556524/in/set-72157600335181665/ < this is the original btw Jul 12 13:42:28 eugene: I actually like that one :) Jul 12 13:42:51 I'll try to do ones, now the wallpaper is 800x480 instead of a strange mid-size Jul 12 13:42:53 tigert: colour don't seem to match :) but the theme is nice Jul 12 13:42:56 X-Fade: heh Jul 12 13:43:06 yeah it was just quickly recolored for testing the transparency stuff Jul 12 13:43:56 http://www.flickr.com/photos/tigert/542872539/in/set-72157600335181665/ < try cropping from this? Jul 12 13:44:02 might look nice as wallpaper Jul 12 13:45:35 oops Jul 12 13:46:09 alterego: As you say there are 2.6 drivers, just not for download Jul 12 13:47:06 alterego: I imagine the problems with implementation are related to the fact that they need to write a Linux kernel module to run the hardware, plus a Linux implementation of OpenGL Jul 12 13:47:42 finally. i suspect that somewhere is broken Jul 12 13:47:57 morning all! Jul 12 13:48:37 ok, I have changed the scratchbox target to i386, but now I can't run my app because it complains about SBOX_CPUTRANSPARENCY_METHOD being not set. But why should I need cputransparency if I'm compiling for i386? Jul 12 13:49:10 lardman: MontaVista Linux v2.6 OpenGL ES v1.1 and OpenVG 1.0 SDK based on OMAPSW vL8.11 BSP Jul 12 13:49:14 http://focus.ti.com/general/docs/wtbu/wtbugencontent.tsp?templateId=6123&navigationId=12719&contentId=27458 Jul 12 13:50:22 X-Fade: Ah, now that's interesting Jul 12 13:53:26 lardman: It is :) Jul 12 13:54:17 X-Fade: I assume there are binaries for opengl in there + a kernel module Jul 12 13:55:47 lardman: I used to have an account there, but it doesn't seem to work anymore. Or I forgot my password ;) Jul 12 13:57:58 X-Fade: Ah, mine still works, I'll download and see what it's got inside (but opengl binaries + kernel module was what the 2.4 version had) Jul 12 13:59:21 lardman: Yeah, I downloaded the old one once.. Jul 12 13:59:59 X-Fade: Still doesn't help much as the kernel module is the wrong version and the hardware may or may not be hooked up in the same way Jul 12 14:03:41 luck^: I'm loveing my new python an pycentral pacakges.. almost all gusty packages build withou changes now. just occasionally forcing python2.5 Jul 12 14:03:44 :) Jul 12 14:04:17 robtaylor, great! Jul 12 14:05:07 luck^: I hope you and aCiDBaSe do get the chance to look at stripping it down a bit :) Jul 12 14:05:09 robtaylor, what we need to do in order to put python2.5 inside ubuntu's repository? Jul 12 14:05:20 robtaylor, for sure Jul 12 14:05:30 Can the N770 charge over USB? Jul 12 14:05:37 luck^: I don't understand the question, can you reprase? Jul 12 14:06:29 robtaylor, sorry.. its about your idea to better organize python for maemo.. we talked on monday, i think Jul 12 14:06:41 the idea was to use python2.5 from ubuntu Jul 12 14:06:58 luck^:ah yeah, well if you pull the packages from my repo, its all done for you Jul 12 14:07:11 luck^: all the source is up there and i've doent detailed changlog entries Jul 12 14:07:20 robtaylor: today we've some differences in our python package (for speed up startup and reduce the package footprint) Jul 12 14:07:23 s/doent/done/ Jul 12 14:07:25 robtaylor meant: luck^: all the source is up there and i've done detailed changlog entries Jul 12 14:07:33 X-Fade: Hmm, zip file containing an exe which extracts another zip file! Jul 12 14:07:54 aCiDBaSe: yeah, i know. this is basically just the ubuntu/debian python2.5 packageging ported to maemo Jul 12 14:08:20 robtaylor: for example... we put all our standard python modules inside a .zip and apply some patches to modify the python import machinery... Jul 12 14:08:58 aCiDBaSe: it'd need a bit of work to cut footprint a bit. You're peobably the most experienced person at that :) Jul 12 14:10:20 aCiDBaSe: the important thing is thata) its only a small diff fromthe standard packaging and b) produces -minimal and -dbg, so its simple to build otehr packages from ubuntu/debian without changes Jul 12 14:10:35 Can the N770 charge over USB? Jul 12 14:10:38 no Jul 12 14:10:49 aCiDBaSe: python-central, docutils and defaults are also available in my repo Jul 12 14:10:51 yow, pvr.ko is 1002kb in size Jul 12 14:11:10 the other thing is: we've changed the "semantic" of -dev packages... in our python for maemo the -dev packages contain the "standard -dev" + development modules like pdb, hotshot, distutils, etc. Jul 12 14:11:11 oh. that sux. Jul 12 14:11:41 aCiDBaSe: you'll have to let that go, or use Replaces: Provides: appropriately Jul 12 14:12:04 aCiDBaSe: but using provides: doesnt help if packages have versioned build depends Jul 12 14:12:45 aCiDBaSe: one possible (nice) solution is to make the zip at postinst time, then you can zip everything up Jul 12 14:13:15 aCiDBaSe: at least distutils shouldn't be in -dev as it is used by setuptools Jul 12 14:13:42 dev: yeah, and thats soemthing needed at install time Jul 12 14:14:46 dev: setuptool is not the right way to provide packages to maemo... if you need to provide packages for maemo you need to create a .deb package... Jul 12 14:14:47 aCiDBaSe: and pkg_resources.py even at runtime Jul 12 14:15:42 yes... I really like the idea of python-central but i think that there is a lot of work to make this works... and our priority now is: provide a full support to maemo platform (aka python bindings) Jul 12 14:15:43 robtaylor, are you using git? Jul 12 14:15:56 aCiDBaSe: sure, but 'm not talking about installing Jul 12 14:16:04 aCiDBaSe: well, you can ignore my work, but i already have it working for me :P Jul 12 14:16:17 luck^: nope, not yet Jul 12 14:16:52 no... we'll not ignore your work... we will use it in the (near) future... Jul 12 14:17:01 aCiDBaSe: do you zip the precompiled py, or just the source? Jul 12 14:17:08 .pyo Jul 12 14:17:12 (-OO) Jul 12 14:17:21 but we zip with -0 flag Jul 12 14:17:40 hmm, pycentral does that Jul 12 14:18:08 good... i didn't know that... Jul 12 14:18:59 dh_pycentral is a debhelper program that will scan your package, detect public Python modules and move them in /usr/share/pycentral so that python-central can byte-compile those for all supported Python ver‐ sions. Jul 12 14:19:24 and put them in a .zip file? Jul 12 14:20:28 aCiDBaSe: no, but i think we could have a modified pycentral for maemo that does that Jul 12 14:21:06 What does it mean if the sound icon on my N770 has a red slash through it and is grayed out? Jul 12 14:21:14 Oh, it's mute. Jul 12 14:21:16 I get it. Jul 12 14:21:20 I thought mute just set it to zero. Jul 12 14:23:11 to be honest: we've a roadmap for python bindings and we need to talk about this plan with our coordinator... Jul 12 14:23:42 but I think its totally possible to have this taks included Jul 12 14:23:59 hello there: foolish question time: I am trying to find an xmms2 client for 770. I have looked and must not have looked in the right places, because I can't find one yet. I'm willing to take the esperanza 0.3 sources and try and compile them, but I'm unfamiliar with maemo, - I'm mostly familiar with ubuntu on desktop. Jul 12 14:24:22 so if someone can point me in the right direction, much appreciated! Jul 12 14:24:29 I just need to learn more about pycentral, etc Jul 12 14:24:32 does the current maemo's debian-helper has the dh_pycentral? Jul 12 14:24:56 argh... sorry about my english :/ Jul 12 14:25:54 I HAS YOR PYCENTRALZ!!11 :) Jul 12 14:25:58 aCiDBaSe: i think that's provided by python-central Jul 12 14:26:03 aCiDBaSe: It's okay, you're better than most IRC users who speak English natively ;-) Jul 12 14:26:14 aCiDBaSe: the english is fine, no worrink! Jul 12 14:26:36 man Jul 12 14:26:40 tigert: I OWNZ ALL YOUR CODEZ! Jul 12 14:26:50 robtaylor: ok. we'll take a look at python-central... Jul 12 14:26:52 :) Jul 12 14:26:56 I'M IN UR N800's BLUEJACKIN UR PHONEZ!!!!111! Jul 12 14:26:58 lol Jul 12 14:27:00 theme tools makes "interesting" themes when you accidentally export just a single rectangle from inkscape as the template :) Jul 12 14:27:09 tigert: Minimalist? Jul 12 14:27:13 ...because "all our base is belog to us" Jul 12 14:27:15 ttuttle: cubist, rather :) Jul 12 14:27:25 very transparent :) Jul 12 14:28:54 * ttuttle wants to make an entirely automated bluejacking program, that sets his device name to "Enter 6831 to continue..." (picks a random PIN), then tries to pair with every device in sight until they accept, then tries each cellular provider on each phone until it gets through to the 'net. Jul 12 14:31:08 robtaylor, your repository url is the same? Jul 12 14:31:24 luck^: yeah Jul 12 14:31:29 How's the Hacker upgrade going? Jul 12 14:34:09 man the intel q6600 processor on newegg jumped from $480 yesterday to $660 today for some reason Jul 12 14:35:15 bstock: If that's the 2.4 GHz one, I heard it's dropping to somewhere in the $250-350 range soon. Jul 12 14:35:25 bstock: My next desktop is *totally* gonna be quad-core. Jul 12 14:35:33 bstock: Or maybe octo-core. Jul 12 14:35:36 yeah it's supposed to drop to $266 on the 22nd or 23rd or somewhere around there Jul 12 14:36:12 bstock: It's great, as a Linux user, to watch the Windows users get diminishing returns with more cores, as I get almost perfect speedups in compile times. Jul 12 14:36:35 but yeah, i'm totally upgrading my dual core to quad core when that chip drops Jul 12 14:36:55 yes i agree. i have the dual core 2.93 ghz chip here at work Jul 12 14:37:11 running ubuntu Jul 12 14:37:47 and you can definitely tell a difference with more cores. i can't stand it when i have to use single core machines any more Jul 12 14:38:40 bstock: I've got a dual 2.0 GHz in my laptop, with 2 GB of RAM. Too many people don't realize that RAM is gold. Jul 12 14:39:04 bstock: You can have 200 processors, but they'll all sit idle waiting for the disk if you don't have copious RAM cache for the disk. Jul 12 14:39:35 my laptops are single core :( that's probably why i barely use them anymore Jul 12 14:40:44 bstock: Yeah, I got a nice fast one =D It runs a little hot (around 70C, or 75C if it's been running for really long) but used to run even hotter (98C) until Dell replaced the fan. Problem is they put the fans on the bottom, so they suck up dust and become useless. Jul 12 14:41:12 Does the maemo python runtime come with python imaging library? Jul 12 14:41:49 yeah i have a dell laptop inspiron 8600 and an acer tablet, both are ~2ghz but single core. i'd really like to get a macbook one of these days Jul 12 14:42:29 bstock: Get a ThinkPad. They're better. Jul 12 14:42:51 but last time i bought an iMac, about a month later they upgraded them from the core duo's to the core 2 duo's Jul 12 14:43:14 bstock: You should've seen that coming ;-) Now that they're using Intel chips, you know when the chips come out. Jul 12 14:43:29 yeha Jul 12 14:46:50 luck^: ah, damnit, cdbs python support gets confused that execing python doesnt give python$(pyversions -vd) Jul 12 14:46:54 qgil? Jul 12 14:47:07 Hmmm Jul 12 14:47:10 No sign of Quim? Jul 12 14:47:38 Can someone in the Helsinki office ask him if he has a minute to come on IRC, please? I'd like to have a word with him Jul 12 14:48:00 dneary: He's probably afraid of us ;-) Jul 12 14:48:29 ttuttle: Why, do you have horns & spit fire? Jul 12 14:48:49 anyone know if there are any dual-socket lga775 motherboards? Jul 12 14:48:59 dneary: I might ;-) Jul 12 14:50:00 luck^: might need to get nchip to put a patch in devkit-debian :( Jul 12 14:58:47 I know it's fully insane, but is there any place I can get a working toolchain that runs *on the N770*? Jul 12 14:59:19 well, you could compile it with scratchbox Jul 12 14:59:30 take the deb src packages for the toolchains Jul 12 14:59:40 you won't much like the results tho :P Jul 12 15:00:10 dragorn: I know. Jul 12 15:03:05 ttuttle: downgrade to IT OS 2005 and use Debian/ARM ? Jul 12 15:03:49 dragorn: It should work Jul 12 15:04:55 dragorn: Understanding that I know almost nothing about Scratchbox, could I do this easily? Jul 12 15:05:29 ttuttle: probably. sb is the compile environment for the 770 (and has all the toolchain compiled as arm already, running inside qemu) Jul 12 15:07:20 dragorn: So I just need to install sb, and then what? Jul 12 15:07:30 figure out the deb build process :P Jul 12 15:08:54 in theory it might just be a source package rebuild. The command for which I have no clue at the moment. Jul 12 15:09:25 dragorn: Can I do dpkg-repack? Jul 12 15:09:28 would this be a good place to ask about backup/restoring applications for an n800 firmware upgrade? Jul 12 15:09:40 ttuttle: No idea, I don't use debian Jul 12 15:09:59 namely, would dpkg --get-selections do the job, along with a sources.list? Jul 12 15:10:26 is the n800 can manage lvm volumes? Jul 12 15:10:47 sorry........can n800 manage lvm volumes? Jul 12 15:12:46 i'd just say no with default kernel as a hunch.. why would you? Jul 12 15:13:34 k-s[WORK]: i have a good news. Jul 12 15:13:40 k-s[WORK]: i got systemtap working on n800 :) Jul 12 15:13:42 /media/mmc1 # staprun stap_ef7c58450bc9dec9284bd24ba394b5c5_7253.ko Jul 12 15:13:42 sys_open NULL, O_RDONLY|O_CREAT|O_EXCL|O_LARGEFILE|O_NONBLOCK|O_SYNC, 023224 Jul 12 15:13:42 sys_open NULL, O_RDONLY|O_CREAT|O_EXCL|O_LARGEFILE|O_NONBLOCK|O_SYNC, 0600002 Jul 12 15:13:42 sys_open NULL, O_RDONLY|O_CREAT|O_EXCL|O_LARGEFILE|O_NONBLOCK|O_SYNC, 01101 Jul 12 15:13:45 sys_open NULL, O_RDONLY|O_CREAT|O_EXCL|O_LARGEFILE|O_NONBLOCK|O_SYNC, 01101 Jul 12 15:13:49 eugene: great :-) Jul 12 15:13:54 now, i'm going to update my livejournal with more info. Jul 12 15:13:56 :) Jul 12 15:14:03 profiling n800 would be more interesting now. Jul 12 15:14:19 eugene: anything in mind? Jul 12 15:14:25 app or what? Jul 12 15:14:44 k-s[WORK]: i have some ideas. things that have been done bfore, i.e. olpc. Jul 12 15:14:55 k-s[WORK]: say, first, finding out all the bad apps that do polling, etc Jul 12 15:15:02 dragorn: So what do I need to set up to cross-compile? What's with the i386 sdk stuff? Jul 12 15:15:18 k-s[WORK]: then find out how we can speed up boot-time, or at least, find out how the bootup is like :) Jul 12 15:15:28 there's a website that plots pretty boot graphs Jul 12 15:15:36 eugene: cool Jul 12 15:15:45 k-s[WORK]: not sure, but what's your ideas :) anything in mind? Jul 12 15:15:49 eugene: have you used qemu or qemu-user (scratchbox)? Jul 12 15:15:58 k-s[WORK]: next thing is probably see if i can get uprobes working. Jul 12 15:16:02 k-s[WORK]: not yet. Jul 12 15:16:22 WTF? Do I install scratchbox then the Maemo SDK, or does the Maemo SDK install scratchbox? Jul 12 15:16:29 eugene: how did you managed to compile your systemtap stuff? Jul 12 15:16:43 k-s[WORK]: i'm writing a how-to now :) Jul 12 15:16:48 ttuttle: depends on which script you got Jul 12 15:16:54 ttuttle: both exists Jul 12 15:17:05 k-s[WORK]: i'm so happy :) Jul 12 15:17:16 k-s[WORK]: /me whines. Can you just point me to which one I need to cross-compile things? Jul 12 15:19:27 What parts of Scratchbox do I need? Jul 12 15:20:04 Just the toolchain tarball really Jul 12 15:20:13 but you'd be better off installing scratchbox too Jul 12 15:20:21 lardman|afk: /me is totally confused. Jul 12 15:20:51 lardman: Will one of the toolchain tarballs simply have the binaries I need to package to have a toolchain? Jul 12 15:21:14 I think so Jul 12 15:21:20 Is there a watchdog on the n800 that reboots it automatically after a certain number of hours? Jul 12 15:21:22 lardman: (I mean a toolchain on the N770, of course.) Jul 12 15:21:28 trevarthan: 64 seconds, I think. Jul 12 15:21:37 ttuttle: Oh, no. It's a cross compiler Jul 12 15:21:55 lardman: No, I need a compiler *for the N770 itself*. Jul 12 15:21:58 ttuttle: You want a native toolchain on the 770? Jul 12 15:22:03 lardman: Yes. Jul 12 15:22:09 lardman: (I know it's insane.) Jul 12 15:22:16 ttuttle: You need to compile a compiler using the cross-compiler then Jul 12 15:22:30 lardman: Nobody's got a package for it? Jul 12 15:22:53 ttuttle: It's so insanely slow that no-one's bothered to compile one I imagine Jul 12 15:23:19 * lardman has used compilers on the Zaurus. Too little memory and too little time to wait for it Jul 12 15:23:38 not to mention the lack of space back in those days Jul 12 15:24:02 ttuttle: What do you want to compile on your 770? Why do you want a toolchain? Jul 12 15:24:55 lardman: Zope. Jul 12 15:25:38 ttuttle: as in http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zope? Jul 12 15:25:43 lardman: Yeah. Jul 12 15:25:52 ttuttle: The wikipedia page says it's written in Python Jul 12 15:26:00 lardman: Some of it's C, I think. Jul 12 15:26:06 lardman: At a minimum, it needs make. Jul 12 15:27:01 lardman: Actually, I think it's all Python inside the Makefile. Jul 12 15:27:14 ttuttle: Do you have a Linux box? Compiling on device is a real pita. Jul 12 15:27:18 lardman: Wait, it mentions "binaries" in some places. Jul 12 15:27:28 lardman: I'd rather compile on it, because cross-compiling will take too long to set up. Jul 12 15:27:37 ttuttle: :D Jul 12 15:27:51 ttuttle, you will loose more time trying to compile it on the device Jul 12 15:27:54 ttuttle: You'll still be waiting for it to finish the configure script this time next week Jul 12 15:27:55 lardman: I mean I do have one. Jul 12 15:28:35 ttuttle: You'll waste vast amounts of time trying to build a native toolchain (which btw requires that you setup scratchbox + cross-toolchain), then trying to package the tools that you'll need Jul 12 15:28:55 lardman: If you can tell me really clearly how to do this, I can do it. But I don't have the energy to dig in to Scratchbox a lot. Jul 12 15:29:25 ttuttle: In that case you won't like building your own toolchain. Jul 12 15:29:30 lardman: Good, I won't. Jul 12 15:29:48 Right, let me find the destructions Jul 12 15:30:13 Does anyone have at least a make package? Jul 12 15:30:46 what will you do with make and no compiler ? Jul 12 15:31:07 ttuttle: Read this file: http://tablets-dev.nokia.com/3.1/INSTALL.txt Jul 12 15:31:39 ttuttle: You basically download a few tarballs, extract them (scratchbox, toolchains, etc.), then start scratchbox and setup targets Jul 12 15:31:53 ttuttle: Takes ~30min excluding download times Jul 12 15:32:18 Sorry, I forgot to mention that I'm running amd64 :-\ Jul 12 15:32:37 bbiam Jul 12 15:32:39 ok Jul 12 15:33:35 ttuttle: Download vmware, install ubuntu-32, follow those instructions (honestly I wouldn't let scratchbox have full run of a system I cared about anyhow, I don't trust it's bind-mount voodoo) Jul 12 15:34:30 how I can download something without device ID from nokia site? Jul 12 15:36:16 It is supposed to be possible to get Scratchbox running under AMD64: http://www.maemopeople.org/index.php/jaffa/2007/03/26/leaving_mac_os_x Jul 12 15:36:33 lardman: I've got a somewhat slower x86 box I can use. Jul 12 15:36:49 hrhr_: ask someone with a device handy to give you theirs/look at the MAC ID of the device in the FCC filing docs/an unboxing slideshow Jul 12 15:41:05 Jaffa: It's already under control ;-) Jul 12 15:41:27 =) Jul 12 15:42:36 Jaffa: I don't have an N800. Perhaps someone with an N800 ought to speak with hrhr. Jul 12 15:43:03 Jaffa: I've got IA64 running and scratchbox is fine, though I do have 32bit libs installed too Jul 12 15:43:57 Anyone? Jul 12 15:44:38 Sho_: HEY! Jul 12 15:44:56 hey, someone bought into IA64! Jul 12 15:45:18 ttuttle: What? *wakes up* Jul 12 15:45:20 lardman: You mean amd64 or x86_64, not ia64. ia64 is Itanium. Jul 12 15:45:28 He *might* mean ia64 ;-) Jul 12 15:45:28 hmm, perhaps I said the wrong thing. 64bit Linux running on a Core Duo Jul 12 15:45:34 no, I was wrong Jul 12 15:45:53 EM64T Jul 12 15:46:01 aww, damn it. that means we cant ridicule your arch for flopping. Jul 12 15:46:03 Well, em64t is not all of amd64, I think. Jul 12 15:46:08 timtim: lol Jul 12 15:46:47 ttuttle: em64t near the x86_64 without some AMD features Jul 12 15:47:17 timtim: Well if that's what it sounds like you could ridicule me for having had a machine with RAMBUS Jul 12 15:47:17 Anyone got a gtkrc from a Maemo theme file handy Jul 12 15:47:20 ? Jul 12 15:47:35 hrhr: Yeah. /me loves his Core 2 Duo. Jul 12 15:47:35 well you bought it! ddr was cheaper! :) Jul 12 15:48:02 by orders of magnitude ;) Jul 12 15:48:11 timtim: and rambus was supposed to be the best thing ever; until you wanted more of it that is :D Jul 12 15:48:31 ttuttle: what core2duo you have? Jul 12 15:48:34 * mgedmin once had a 486 with a VESA local bus... Jul 12 15:48:45 <||cw> I knew a guy that got a rambus system, I ridiculed him Jul 12 15:48:56 <||cw> VLB was awesome Jul 12 15:49:05 486 is luxury. my first pc was 8mhz 8086 Jul 12 15:49:24 My first PC was a 33 MHz 486. Jul 12 15:49:27 4 MB RAM. Jul 12 15:49:41 <||cw> kids, my PC loaded programs off tape Jul 12 15:49:53 <||cw> 4k of ram Jul 12 15:49:55 We got the "multimedia upgrade" which had a sound card (Ensoniq SoundScape), a CD-ROM drive (with a really powerful eject motor!), and 8 MB extra RAM. Jul 12 15:50:01 ||cw: Awesome, which one? Jul 12 15:50:03 I had an IBM PC Jul 12 15:50:07 <||cw> ti994/a Jul 12 15:50:10 ||cw: I've got a couple of Timex Sinclairs at home. Jul 12 15:50:51 <||cw> had the expansion that could do speach synthesis too, was freaking awesome Jul 12 15:51:29 <||cw> sounded almost as good as flite on my 770 too Jul 12 15:51:35 * mgedmin saw a speaking Tux droid recently: http://tuxisalive.com/ Jul 12 15:52:31 <||cw> and all I had to do was: print #1, "take me to your leader" Jul 12 15:52:37 ||cw: That rocks. Jul 12 15:53:07 <||cw> ttuttle: especially since it was in the mid 80's Jul 12 15:54:56 Is there something wrong with a2dp that means it uses excessive cpu, or is this normal (http://www.guardiani.us/index.php/N800_custom_packages#Bluetooth_ALSA)? Jul 12 15:59:35 hmm, site's down or not responding Jul 12 16:00:04 ah well, have a nice evening all Jul 12 16:12:00 ||cw: wow , did you also have the (MBX)? http://oldcomputers.net/ti994a.html Jul 12 16:15:14 <||cw> no, I havd the newer plastic one too. in the picture with all the expansion modules, the little one is what I had Jul 12 16:39:14 has anyone tried a java type program on the 770? I'm finding reference to a few, but can't find them or how to install them Jul 12 16:41:49 I found JamVM, I guess I will see if I can install that Jul 12 16:43:26 ok maybe someone can answer this question. If a program says it will work on ARM, does that mean it will work on the 770? Jul 12 16:44:59 <`0660> no Jul 12 16:45:12 <`0660> but it just might Jul 12 16:45:24 arm vs armel? Jul 12 16:45:35 hmm then I wonder if the jamvm will work, it says it's will work with: Power PC, i386; ARM; ARM64;MIPS Jul 12 16:48:51 is there a good spreadsheet program for os2007? Jul 12 16:53:08 <`0660> yes, gnumeric Jul 12 16:53:21 thanks Jul 12 17:21:17 Experiences getting SystemTap work on Nokia N800 Jul 12 17:21:24 http://eugeneteo.livejournal.com/7484.html Jul 12 17:21:43 SystemTap for Linux is similar to what Dtrace is for Solaris Jul 12 17:28:59 eugene: nice, really nice Jul 12 17:50:33 Anyone here familiar with USB hacking on the N770? Jul 12 17:54:59 yes. set to master mode w/ the flasher tool, build a cable which injects power, add a power source. The 770 is fairly easy. Jul 12 17:55:07 s/master mode/host mode/ Jul 12 17:55:08 dragorn meant: yes. set to host mode w/ the flasher tool, build a cable which injects power, add a power source. The 770 is fairly easy. Jul 12 17:57:49 If the device you're hooking up doesn't need host power, do you still need power injection? Jul 12 17:59:49 Yes, IIRC Jul 12 18:02:14 So, it just needs to see power on the pin to wake up the onboard USB chipset, right? Jul 12 18:02:24 Could I feed it power tapped form the 770's own battery? Jul 12 18:03:42 why not use a wireless usb with a powered dongle Jul 12 18:04:14 Because the goal is to make a compact, portable device to control a USB-attached Canon digital camera. Jul 12 18:04:25 ah Jul 12 18:04:27 Rather not haul along another device if it can be avoided. Jul 12 18:04:33 understood Jul 12 18:04:47 Just wondering if I can fool it with its own power with a wire wrap wire or such. Jul 12 18:18:03 hey all Jul 12 18:18:10 is the repo to get xchat from safe? Jul 12 18:18:54 <{abo}> 'ello :) Jul 12 18:19:29 <{abo}> I was wondering... It should be possible to run Maemo in QEmu, right? Jul 12 18:20:46 Xenon3DN: Maybe a suitable voltage battery would do? Guys at the office had a hack like that with a USB headset (but that draws power so it drained pretty quickly IIRC) Jul 12 18:21:01 <{abo}> I'd like to just have a look at what the interface is like and such, before I buy a Maemo-based device. Jul 12 18:21:59 <{abo}> zuh: You're talking about powered USB? Jul 12 18:22:21 <||cw> {abo}: maemo.org has a howto Jul 12 18:22:24 {abo}: You can only run some parts of it, the non-free software are not available. Jul 12 18:22:49 <||cw> and I think there's even a vmware appliance with a minimal ubuntu with the stuff presetup Jul 12 18:23:18 <{abo}> I couldn't find the info. Hmm, yeah, google: vmware/qemu maemo might work... Jul 12 18:23:48 {abo}: And yes, connecting a USB peripherial to a 770 without a "hacked" hub Jul 12 18:23:51 <{abo}> Yeah, some proprietary bits missing, that's expected. Jul 12 18:24:41 so if you have to build softeware from source like for example nmap Jul 12 18:24:45 how do you do it? Jul 12 18:24:48 in scratchbox? Jul 12 18:24:51 <{abo}> That would be awesome because I can get a USB thingy for laptops that gives me a wireless internet connection at up to 3.6 Mbit/s, for a rather modest fixed monthly cost. But doesn't work with N800. :( Jul 12 18:29:10 <{abo}> So... http://www.maemo.org.br/platform/download-maemo-vm.html is trustworthy? Well, I'll run it in a QEmu sandbox anyway so doesn't matter, but anyway... Jul 12 18:29:34 <{abo}> Looks fairly official. :) Jul 12 18:37:29 zuh / abo : I'll let you know if I can fake the USB "phantom" power using the N770's own battery. We could haul along another battery, but that's sort of against the goal of the project. ;) Jul 12 18:39:45 Does anyone know of a cheap bluetooth serial dongle? I want to control serial devices via bluetooth. Like http://www.openservo.com/ Jul 12 18:43:58 Xenon3DN: The one we had was a camera flashlight battery IIRC and was "embedded" (in the "put some electric tape over it" sense) to the connecting coord. That didn't make it a big thing to carry... Jul 12 18:44:37 Makes sense. I'll see if the 3.7v from the Nokia's battery is enough to trigger it, and if not, will go the other way. Jul 12 18:46:20 trevarthan: Check the carman reviews. Those mention a bt->serial convertor they use in combination with the other hardware.. Jul 12 18:47:19 ok. I actually want a bluetooth to i2c adapter, but I'll take bt -> serial. :) Jul 12 18:47:36 Froogle suggests this: Jul 12 18:47:37 http://www.thinkethernet.com/prod.aspx?clvl=4&c1=1&c2=83&c3=256&p=418 Jul 12 18:47:38 $49. Jul 12 18:47:55 <{abo}> I guess I'll just get a cellphone with UMTS+Bluetooth. :) Jul 12 18:49:46 If you're not afraid of soldering, here's some ideas: Jul 12 18:49:46 http://zuff.info/Bluetooth.html Jul 12 18:50:04 you can always get an inline battery tube Jul 12 18:57:13 {abo}: I did. It's awesome. Jul 12 18:59:58 <{abo}> ttuttle: I bet :) Jul 12 19:05:31 Hey, Why maemo's browser does not support proxy address? Jul 12 19:06:04 YEah, that sucks Jul 12 19:06:10 its proxy everything, or nothing Jul 12 19:06:12 not per app Jul 12 19:06:13 I've tryed to made a tsocks port for maemo. To use with SSH Tunnels. But it dosen't work with default browser Jul 12 19:06:50 I want to do the same Jul 12 19:06:52 it works with some applications (like wget, minimo browser), but didn't work with others (like skype and opera browser) Jul 12 19:06:53 ssh tunneling works Jul 12 19:06:59 BUT the browser doesnt care Jul 12 19:07:08 anything cli it will work dan Jul 12 19:07:08 YES! Jul 12 19:07:09 lol Jul 12 19:07:12 you could get elinks Jul 12 19:07:19 and set http_proxy Jul 12 19:07:27 elinks? Jul 12 19:07:34 elinks is a text browser Jul 12 19:09:48 Ok.... but, my tsocks's port had worked with minimo (mozilla's browser).... So I can have a graphical browser with socks... But I could not understand why some applications do work and some applications dosen't... Pidgin, for example, did not work. By pidgin works with tsocks on my desktop. Jul 12 19:10:55 probably because its been removed to taper it down Jul 12 19:13:21 In this vacations I'm decided to port's some programs to maemo..... But I'm just "half-successful" with tsocks =P Jul 12 19:24:36 how many people in here are actually on a n770/n800? Jul 12 19:25:26 just curious Jul 12 19:26:14 metatron: you mean "connected to this channel with a n770/n800"? Jul 12 19:29:47 Im on from my sparc Jul 12 19:29:56 irc from the 770 would be painful without a kb Jul 12 19:30:09 I've done it, but am not right now. Jul 12 19:32:14 yeah, i meant connected to the channel via a nokia it Jul 12 19:32:16 <`0660> i use whenever i don't have a pc with ssh available Jul 12 19:32:31 I probably will never use the 770 with my phone due to the data/tethering fees Jul 12 19:32:38 <`0660> and when i'm too lazy to get up from the bed :) Jul 12 19:32:50 so I would only have access when I have wifi...which greatly reduces the number of times the 770 is useful Jul 12 19:32:54 yeah, a bt kybd is kinda key :-) Jul 12 19:33:05 meta: and expensive just to IRC from Jul 12 19:33:08 <`0660> how much do you pay for a megabyte? :) Jul 12 19:33:31 just wondering if im the only one Jul 12 19:33:40 <`0660> i think the thumb keyboard is just fine Jul 12 19:33:48 <`0660> a bit slow but works Jul 12 19:35:20 its $45/month for data and $15/month for tether Jul 12 19:35:52 $60/month for phone service limited by bluetooth bandwidth isnt worth it :) Jul 12 19:36:20 now if I can only get the damn 770 to support WAPs that use WPA with LEAP it would be better Jul 12 19:36:23 <`0660> horrible Jul 12 19:36:42 <`0660> for me it's 1,5 euros per megabyte Jul 12 19:37:06 I think Verizon charges USD$45 a month for unmetered data. I don't think there's a separate tether fee. Jul 12 19:37:10 <`0660> there was an unlimited 3g data with 10 euros / month couple of months ago Jul 12 19:37:14 I would rather pay per mb Jul 12 19:37:23 xenon: I have verizon Jul 12 19:37:40 its $60/month unless you have a smartphone and dont tether Jul 12 19:38:03 <`0660> irc doesn't consume that much traffic so i prefer to pay by the megabyte :) Jul 12 19:38:31 I have a Palm Treo 650, but I haven't actually tried it. I'd been told I could get a data plan for $45, and I thought that would let me use BT DUN. Jul 12 19:38:37 <`0660> usually i get something like $7 per month for it Jul 12 20:24:10 is there a way to find the original MAC address for the wlan0 interface in the nokia800 ? i.e. if it has previously changed with the ifconfig command and the sticker has disappeared from the back Jul 12 20:25:06 zyxulnaga: wouldn't rebooting reset it? Jul 12 20:25:12 nop, it won't Jul 12 20:25:18 it keeps what I change it too Jul 12 20:25:34 do you have the box? Jul 12 20:25:54 well I know the MAC of it, but I want to be able to do it for another reason Jul 12 20:26:05 I was hoping that it would be somewhere in /proc Jul 12 20:26:12 or it will let me reset it to the original somehow Jul 12 20:28:22 the mac should be on the sticker Jul 12 20:28:33 under the back panel Jul 12 20:28:39 I am aware of this Jul 12 20:29:05 and macchanger does set it back? Jul 12 20:29:12 doesnt Jul 12 20:30:01 (sorry a bit late to the conversation) Jul 12 20:30:07 what's macchanger? Jul 12 20:30:15 upon reboot it doesn't change to the original Jul 12 20:31:07 search the repositories for it Jul 12 20:31:20 it should allow you to change your mac back Jul 12 20:31:35 how did it change in the first place? Jul 12 20:32:21 with ifconfig wlan0 hw ether mynewmac Jul 12 20:32:33 metatron: does it retrieve the vendor mac address? Jul 12 20:33:30 not as far as i know Jul 12 20:34:15 it doesn't I just installed the latest one Jul 12 20:35:36 why dont you just manually reset it with ifconfig and the number on the sticker? Jul 12 20:36:41 it's part of something I am working on Jul 12 20:36:45 it has to be done automated Jul 12 20:36:50 ah Jul 12 20:37:26 how automated? cant pass the command to a shell/through a script? Jul 12 20:38:59 it's a bit complicated, there is no logical problem as to why I can't do it if I know the MAC Jul 12 20:40:24 i see, so you want to be able to retrieve the mac from the burned rom Jul 12 20:40:27 gotcha Jul 12 20:40:28 hello Jul 12 20:40:38 or reset it Jul 12 20:40:50 i thought you needed help resetting it for your own machine Jul 12 20:41:36 http://mg.pov.lt/770/ Jul 12 20:41:51 has the macchanger app in the repository Jul 12 20:42:03 dunno if it helps Jul 12 20:42:07 oh, do I? Jul 12 20:42:10 I already installed that Jul 12 20:42:19 it doesn't find the vendor supplied mac Jul 12 20:42:38 perhaps its only stored in flash? Jul 12 20:43:08 sorry, wish i could help. Jul 12 20:43:22 can't speculate over this, there must be a way though since in a post-flash operation it resets to the original one Jul 12 20:43:28 thanks anyway Jul 12 20:43:40 oh that is interesting Jul 12 20:45:10 neat Jul 12 20:45:17 I took out the flash and battery and it just got reset Jul 12 20:45:33 must have been stored in some internal temp memory Jul 12 20:45:49 "took out the flash"? Jul 12 20:45:51 how do you do that? Jul 12 20:46:29 must be memory card Jul 12 20:47:11 I mean the memory card Jul 12 20:47:16 sorry Jul 12 20:50:08 huh. Jul 12 21:18:14 re Jul 12 21:22:30 lol..... Jul 12 21:23:07 thoughtfix and his N800 successor... Jul 12 21:23:16 lol Jul 12 21:23:36 first pupnik....now thoughtfix.. Jul 12 21:24:39 come on guys, with the iphone looking like it does. Jul 12 21:25:46 my idea of jog dial at the right top corner-side is great btw :P Jul 12 21:25:54 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qg1ckCkm8YI ;-) Jul 12 21:26:57 hey ... I'm having some difficulties using the ALSA API for audio capture on the N800 ... is this the recommended way to record audio or should one use GStreamer instead? Jul 12 21:27:08 dhd: use gstreamer Jul 12 21:27:17 cool thanks, I noticed that's what maemo-recorder does Jul 12 21:28:09 lol Jul 12 21:28:20 will it blend Jul 12 21:28:25 yeah :D Jul 12 21:28:25 that sucks.... Jul 12 21:28:46 should blend a 770 if it wasnt so cute and nice Jul 12 21:28:49 i think he blended a fake.. Jul 12 21:28:55 one of those ifakes Jul 12 21:33:19 it's like a snuff movie for geeks Jul 12 21:35:12 not sure i like to see electronices go out like that Jul 12 21:35:17 also is there any info about the audio capabilities of the device? It appears to be capable of 8kHz 16-bit audio, and I'm presuming it doesn't do anything better since the input is basically meant for VoIP... Jul 12 21:35:25 err Jul 12 21:35:35 the audio input on the N800 that is Jul 12 21:44:11 https://www.guardiani.us/projects/kagu/wiki Jul 12 21:44:28 does look like konttorri's MP Jul 12 21:47:21 <{abo}> disq: haha :) Jul 12 21:47:49 unique311: #it is a "fork" Jul 12 21:48:08 fork...i remember that word.... Jul 12 21:48:22 koen didn't like it being used for angstrom Jul 12 22:07:45 I think I somehow just locked myself out of root level access following the instructions here: http://maemo.org/community/wiki/howdoibecomeroot2/ Jul 12 22:10:55 Step 4 on that doc needs to become Steps 4 though 10... I voluntarily skipped the steps in Step for of adding "user" to sudoer's... Jul 12 22:11:24 Then I proceeded to lock dropbear out of giving root access by changing its config. Jul 12 22:15:25 The way that doc is written, it sounds like I should still be able to "sudo su -" to get root. (Which I know if I'd stepped back maybe I should have realized...but I'd rather fix the doc than figure that out.) Jul 12 22:16:17 I'll figure out how to get edit access to fix the doc later tho.....do I have any hope of ganing root with things as they are? Jul 12 22:18:12 (the Midgard CMS Toolbar seems to be incompatible with Safari....I'm fine in Firefox.) Jul 12 23:02:45 hello folks! Jul 12 23:28:30 someone have the latest google maps url for maemo mapper? Jul 12 23:29:26 dick-richardson: v=w2.56 Jul 12 23:29:42 dick-richardson: changing that in the URL should fix... Jul 12 23:29:50 thank you! Jul 12 23:30:33 you are welcome! Jul 12 23:34:27 ah, fishing for wifi... Jul 12 23:48:49 looking for some help... Jul 12 23:49:04 I think I somehow just locked myself out of root level access following the instructions here: http://maemo.org/community/wiki/howdoibecomeroot2/ Jul 12 23:49:28 Step 4 on that doc needs to become Steps 4 though 10... I voluntarily skipped the steps in Step for of adding "user" to sudoer's...thinking it was optional Jul 12 23:49:38 I'll figure out how to get edit access to fix the doc later tho.....do I have any hope of ganing root with things as they are? Jul 12 23:50:09 ||cw: the ti99 4/a was slick. In 1981 we had a TI guy demo one to us at compu-camp Jul 13 00:09:06 maddler: are either of those correct? Jul 13 00:09:23 Anybody been able to install Xchat on the new firmware? Jul 13 00:09:52 using xchat right now Jul 13 00:09:54 yep Jul 13 00:10:08 Wouldn't go for me earlier today. Jul 13 00:10:17 "Application Package not found" or somesuch. Jul 13 00:10:21 I've been on it using the latest 2006...not sure you're talking about that tho Jul 13 00:10:22 Suppose I should try with apt Jul 13 00:10:28 2007 Jul 13 00:10:45 right..sorry Jul 13 00:10:47 ;) Jul 13 00:10:49 How did SSH suddenly become so SLOW Jul 13 00:12:15 is it possible that the wifi is worse with the new firmware? Jul 13 00:12:21 Once root is enabled, is it recommended to disable root altoghether and just have "user" with sudo access? ..or better to diable root logins altogether? Jul 13 00:12:53 ..or just have a relatively strong root password? Jul 13 00:13:11 matt: user with sudo, passwd -l on root is best Jul 13 00:13:23 thx! Jul 13 00:13:25 not what i do, but best balance Jul 13 00:13:33 :-) Jul 13 00:14:19 metatron: you see my earlier post....I'm in a little root-predicament on my 770 presently Jul 13 00:14:29 some of it Jul 13 00:14:36 my net connection is bad Jul 13 00:14:54 wonder if you have any ideas, or if I should just reinstall the OS again....(which is not a big deal) Jul 13 00:15:08 that's not good! :) Jul 13 00:21:39 my net connection is bad Jul 13 00:21:40 <_Monkey> i already had it that way, metatron. Jul 13 00:21:46 fuckle Jul 13 00:22:18 matt: you disabled root, and didnt add user to sudoers? Jul 13 00:22:28 maemo mapper is killing me Jul 13 00:22:54 i wish maemo mappers didnt die when the gps connection is lost Jul 13 00:23:27 I wish I had a url that worked :/ Jul 13 00:23:45 i wish maemo mappers didnt die when the gps connection is lost Jul 13 00:23:50 gah Jul 13 00:23:58 im sorry everyone Jul 13 00:24:03 np Jul 13 00:24:16 my bt keyboard is acting up Jul 13 00:37:39 Does anyone know if it is possible to connect through a Treo 770wx? Jul 13 00:47:11 is there a reason it's so damn hard to find the url to use google or microsoft live maps w/maemo mapper? it's like I'm asking about tiananmen square in communist china Jul 13 00:48:07 although in china I could at least do a google search via tor :P Jul 13 00:48:48 dick-richardson, the newest maemo-maps supplies them for you Jul 13 00:48:53 er maemo-mapper Jul 13 00:48:58 not for my area it doesn't Jul 13 00:49:01 manage repositories, click download Jul 13 00:49:11 i get great white-ness Jul 13 00:49:14 no? isnt a google maps url the same all over the world? Jul 13 00:49:31 hrm Jul 13 00:50:17 dick-richardson, http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=3514 see the second post Jul 13 00:50:38 the default repo is for openstreet Jul 13 00:56:46 there's no way to do routes directly in maemo mapper? Jul 13 02:03:01 um... how common is a 770 to just have a white screen. Jul 13 02:10:31 depends Jul 13 02:10:44 what kind of white screen - got any vertical streaks/corruption? Jul 13 02:10:54 or has it just hung during boot? Jul 13 02:14:28 man, i want an openmoko kit but i don't have the cash to lay down lol Jul 13 02:14:39 some vertical lines. before i reflashed it it looked like it was running fine just i couldn't see the display Jul 13 02:15:03 now it sounds like it loads and shuts off when i hit power but thats about it. Jul 13 02:15:55 like this? http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=197&d=1165601538 Jul 13 02:17:53 or like this? http://www.maphia-inc.org/dead.jpg Jul 13 02:22:10 like the first one. Jul 13 02:22:20 is your 770 new? Jul 13 02:22:41 or bought second hand? Jul 13 02:22:54 this is a serious problem you have, and requires a repair Jul 13 02:23:44 just bought it from woot. Jul 13 02:23:55 that sucks, i thought this problem had been fixed Jul 13 02:24:08 just for a 2gb mem card. and put a vid on it to play. Jul 13 02:24:20 it's known as a "White Screen of Death" - basically, a chip on the LCD had fried (or something like that - it's a design fault) Jul 13 02:24:26 leaving on a trip next weekend and this was my entertainment/internet connection. Jul 13 02:25:00 you need to contact Nokia for an in-warranty repair, or see if Woot will replace it Jul 13 02:26:06 that's bad luck Jul 13 02:26:12 not a chance I'll have it for my trip then :( Jul 13 02:26:20 is this a common thing ? Jul 13 02:27:29 I don't know if "common" is the right word, but it certainly was a known issue with some 770s Jul 13 02:27:59 if it gets fixed is it likely to fail again Jul 13 02:28:20 if Nokia haven't fixed the design problem, the answer is yes - it's possible Jul 13 02:28:35 a small number of users have had two fail... chances of that happening to you must be pretty low though Jul 13 02:28:37 but possible Jul 13 02:29:15 does anything set it off ? Jul 13 02:29:21 yes, rebootingf Jul 13 02:29:23 rebooting Jul 13 02:29:49 it's caused by a race condition during boot - once it occurs, an LCD driver chip becomes permanently damaged Jul 13 02:29:59 ugh. Jul 13 02:30:22 it usually happens within the first dozen boots Jul 13 02:30:55 i'm amazed this hasn't been fixed on the production line... that is really, really crap Jul 13 02:33:33 thanks for the info. time to go finish cleaning for my 2 year olds b-day party **** ENDING LOGGING AT Fri Jul 13 02:59:57 2007