**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sat Sep 15 02:59:57 2007
Sep 15 03:01:13 <RushPL> night
Sep 15 03:36:28 <bedboi> is there any document which describes the maemo way of setting up a deb repository?
Sep 15 04:10:08 <[31d1]> on this page there seems to be instructions for putting flash 9 on a 770
Sep 15 04:10:11 <[31d1]> but running os20007
Sep 15 04:10:38 <[31d1]> would that definitely not work on os2006 is what im wondering
Sep 15 04:10:47 <[31d1]> http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=9571
Sep 15 05:43:56 <onion> I wonder what I did now.. all buttons, menus, etc lost their decoration
Sep 15 08:41:58 <latzko> hi
Sep 15 08:41:58 <_Monkey> que tal, latzko
Sep 15 08:44:28 <latzko> I have an "warning: implicit declaration of function `strptime'" undel sbox-ARMEL, despite of #include <time.h>. can you help plz why should it be?
Sep 15 08:45:26 <latzko> char *res = strptime(birthday, "%b %d, %Y", &tm_date); birthday is const gchar*
Sep 15 09:05:32 <bearclaw_> my man strptime on debian  #define _XOPEN_SOURCE /* glibc2 needs this */ #include <time.h>says
Sep 15 09:05:49 <bearclaw_> oops pasted at the wrong place
Sep 15 09:06:26 * bedboi is away: sleeping
Sep 15 09:19:27 <latzko> bearclaw_, time.h says # ifdef __USE_XOPEN but #define __USE_XOPEN 1 does not work
Sep 15 09:21:47 <latzko> neither _XOPEN_SOURCE
Sep 15 09:22:43 <bearclaw_> hmm I concurr
Sep 15 09:24:27 <bearclaw_> there must be an other define required
Sep 15 09:29:16 <bearclaw_> or something #undef the __use_xopen
Sep 15 09:30:09 <bearclaw_> /usr/include/features.h has one
Sep 15 09:34:48 <latzko> yepp #define _GNU_SOURCE solved this
Sep 15 09:34:55 <latzko> tnx anyway
Sep 15 09:45:42 <bearclaw_> stupid man page... :)
Sep 15 10:00:27 <lardman> I need to do endianness conversion, and am planning on using something like the following: http://pastebin.com/d3024c51e
Sep 15 10:00:51 <lardman> the question is, will elements of structures work with this?
Sep 15 10:01:55 <lardman> i.e. does &somestruct.someelement == &somestruct + offsetof(struct somestruct, someelement) ?
Sep 15 10:02:45 <bearclaw_> I think yes, that's the point of offsetof
Sep 15 10:03:08 <lardman> so they don't actually match, or rather the first one doesn't work?
Sep 15 10:03:40 <bearclaw_> (type*)((char*)&somestruct + offset) more precisely
Sep 15 10:04:27 <lardman> hmm, I'll need to fix my endianness swapping code then
Sep 15 10:04:29 <bearclaw_> lardman: you forgot the break after each case
Sep 15 10:05:23 <lardman> thanks, was just something I scribbled down quickly
Sep 15 10:06:24 <lardman> too much MATLAB too, forgetting C
Sep 15 10:08:02 <gpd> anyone know where I can get the correct package for libgtk-x11-2.0?
Sep 15 10:08:17 <gpd> I did an upgrade of magic:sys and all is not well.
Sep 15 10:08:31 <gpd> http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/maemo/users/26420
Sep 15 10:08:43 <gpd> that describes my symptoms - but I don't really want to reflash !
Sep 15 10:09:38 <gpd> actually, not my symptoms, but same problem.  my only problem is that maemo-mapper won't run and complains:
Sep 15 10:09:43 <gpd> maemo-mapper: symbol lookup error: /usr/lib/libgtk-x11-2.0.so.0: undefined symbol: osso_g_scanner_cache_open
Sep 15 10:17:28 <lardman> gpd: simply you either need to update the build of maemo-mapper, or downgrade your version of libgtk
Sep 15 10:17:44 <lardman> gpd: Neither of which will be especially easy I imagine
Sep 15 10:17:58 <gpd> lardman: any idea where to get the downgraded version of libgtk?
Sep 15 10:18:22 <gpd> i presume that one comes on the flash image and so isn't in a repository?
Sep 15 10:18:38 <lardman> well it shoud be in a repo
Sep 15 10:19:10 <lardman> though I don;t know where
Sep 15 10:19:26 <gpd> 2.6.10-2.osso30 libgtk2.0-0 <- is that the one you have?
Sep 15 10:19:36 <lardman> n800?
Sep 15 10:19:36 <_Monkey> n800 is much better than a desk phone :-)
Sep 15 10:20:00 <gpd> yes, n800
Sep 15 10:20:47 <lardman> The file is called libgtk-x11-2.0.so.0.600.10
Sep 15 10:21:30 <gpd> I have that in /usr/lib with size 2404212 Jan 25 2007
Sep 15 10:23:00 <lardman> mine's march 21 14:08 2348888 bytes
Sep 15 10:26:15 <gpd> well i can't find the newer version right now :(
Sep 15 10:26:33 <gpd> guess I'll have to reflash -- aargh
Sep 15 10:26:44 <lardman> sorry
Sep 15 10:28:31 <lardman> bearclaw_: Interesting, that code does work (with the addition of the breaks - thanks)
Sep 15 10:33:53 <gpd> Software Edition 2007 version 4.2007.26-8 <<-- is that hacker only atm?
Sep 15 10:34:07 <gpd> or am I just way behind?
Sep 15 10:34:53 <lardman> hacker edition only afaik
Sep 15 10:37:20 <bearclaw_> the 770 port is hacker only, the 800 version is not
Sep 15 10:37:32 <bearclaw_> (if I got that right)
Sep 15 10:37:41 <gpd> yeah - that 4.2 is the one with skype etc. - i was forgetting
Sep 15 10:42:06 <gpd> has anyone written up a reminder list of things to do after a reflash?
Sep 15 11:02:42 <bearclaw_> what is the clean way to update autoconf in scratchbox?
Sep 15 12:33:30 <onion> reboot loop.. again
Sep 15 13:26:09 <pupnik> btw changing the user password caused no problems here
Sep 15 13:34:36 <pupnik> repositories?
Sep 15 13:34:37 <_Monkey> repositories is, like, http://maemo.org/community/wiki/ApplicationRepositories  and a searchable index at http://www.gronmayer.com/n800/repos/index.php
Sep 15 13:36:55 <red-zack> pupnik: anyway to change the username of "user" to another one?
Sep 15 13:37:19 <red-zack> btw,hi
Sep 15 13:37:22 <red-zack> :)
Sep 15 13:43:12 <pupnik> don't change username
Sep 15 13:43:15 <pupnik> servus
Sep 15 13:43:24 <red-zack> k
Sep 15 13:44:36 <_|Nix|_> Hmmm ... does anyone know of a place where I can get a libgnutls later than the one from maemo-hackers? I'm trying to build pidgin-2.2.0, and I think 1.0.16 will no longer do :o(
Sep 15 13:45:17 <_|Nix|_> i.e., a repo other than m-h.o
Sep 15 13:46:21 <pupnik> New freesci Sierra Adventure Game interpreter release - http://pupnik.de/freesci.html
Sep 15 13:46:52 <pupnik> repositories?
Sep 15 13:46:53 <_Monkey> repositories is http://maemo.org/community/wiki/ApplicationRepositories  and a searchable index at http://www.gronmayer.com/n800/repos/index.php
Sep 15 13:48:45 <_|Nix|_> gronmayer.com DNE, AFAIK.
Sep 15 13:48:59 <pupnik> i just used it
Sep 15 13:49:19 <Molagi> http://www.fortunewatch.com/how-a-millionaires-brain-works/
Sep 15 13:49:50 <_|Nix|_> Oh, there it is ... weird ... firefox hickup ...
Sep 15 13:55:18 <pupnik> Molagi [i=samurai@a88-112-4-196.elisa-laajakaista.fi
Sep 15 13:56:14 <Molagi> indeed
Sep 15 14:02:18 <pupnik> http://pupnik.de/freesci.html - for Kings Quest, Space Quest, Leisure Suit Larry etc... on your Nokia 770 / 800 internet tablet
Sep 15 14:02:55 <Molagi> awesome
Sep 15 14:03:10 <pupnik> just added that for the search engines
Sep 15 14:20:11 <bearclaw_> anyone know where I can buy a cable to connect the bluetooth antenna? I think I must look for a mmcx male to mmcx female cable
Sep 15 14:27:31 <bearclaw_> nobody seems to be manufacturing such a cable
Sep 15 14:29:18 <Molagi> how can i get superuser privilige?
Sep 15 14:29:46 <bearclaw_> install sshd, log in as root
Sep 15 14:30:09 <bearclaw_> I think it's the easiest way
Sep 15 14:30:16 <Molagi> where can i get the sshd?
Sep 15 14:30:31 <bearclaw_> its in the packages
Sep 15 14:30:36 <bearclaw_> repositories I mean
Sep 15 14:30:49 <Molagi> ok ill check that out
Sep 15 14:30:50 <Molagi> ty
Sep 15 14:31:52 <bearclaw_> just add http://maemo-hackers.org/apt bora main and http://repository.maemo.org/extras/ bora free in the app manager
Sep 15 14:34:28 <Molagi> is it named sshd
Sep 15 14:35:04 <bearclaw_> yup
Sep 15 14:35:14 <bearclaw_> or openssh
Sep 15 14:35:15 <_Monkey> i think openssh is to big for embbeded devince (just sbz's opinion) and dropbear is done for that, so ...
Sep 15 14:35:30 <bearclaw_> or dropbear...
Sep 15 14:35:31 <_Monkey> dropbear is a relatively small SSH 2 server and client. http://matt.ucc.asn.au/dropbear/dropbear.html
Sep 15 14:36:28 <Molagi> hmm unable to install openssh
Sep 15 14:37:07 <Molagi> i think i got dropbear already
Sep 15 14:38:50 <tso> to bad there is no "simple" way to start or stop the ssh server :(
Sep 15 14:48:16 <Molagi> hmm how do i get root
Sep 15 14:48:26 <Molagi> i got the dropbear installed
Sep 15 14:48:40 <pupnik> becomeroot?
Sep 15 14:48:41 <_Monkey> i think becomeroot is is easily obtained from [770/OS2006] http://eko.one.pl/maemo/dists/mistral/user/binary-armel/becomeroot_0.1-2_armel.deb or [770/OS2007HE and N800/OS2007] http://eko.one.pl/maemo/dists/bora/user/binary-armel/becomeroot_0.1-2_armel.deb or for a more long winded method http://maemo.org/community/wiki/HowTo_EASILY_BecomeRoot
Sep 15 14:48:44 <bearclaw_> tso: you can put menu entries pointing to scripts starting and stopping th ssed
Sep 15 14:48:59 <Molagi> thx
Sep 15 14:49:11 <tso> maybe so bearclaw_, but it would be nice if it was included ;)
Sep 15 14:49:25 <pupnik> somebody fix monkey's response there
Sep 15 14:49:32 <pupnik> or ssh root@localhost
Sep 15 14:50:33 <bearclaw_> even the custom cable ordering at http://www.hyperlinktech.com/ doesn't have MMCX female
Sep 15 14:53:32 <Molagi> now that i installed becomeroot, am i now the root?
Sep 15 14:54:29 <Molagi> requested operation requires superuser privilige
Sep 15 14:54:40 <bearclaw_> just start becomeroot in a term if i remember well
Sep 15 14:55:09 <Molagi> whats the command
Sep 15 14:55:39 <bearclaw_> becomeroot?
Sep 15 14:55:40 <_Monkey> i think becomeroot is is easily obtained from [770/OS2006] http://eko.one.pl/maemo/dists/mistral/user/binary-armel/becomeroot_0.1-2_armel.deb or [770/OS2007HE and N800/OS2007] http://eko.one.pl/maemo/dists/bora/user/binary-armel/becomeroot_0.1-2_armel.deb or for a more long winded method http://maemo.org/community/wiki/HowTo_EASILY_BecomeRoot
Sep 15 14:55:49 <Molagi> becomeroot not found
Sep 15 14:58:14 <Molagi> im such a noob with these things
Sep 15 14:58:29 <Molagi> i only want to try that freeSCI thingy
Sep 15 14:59:00 <pupnik> :)
Sep 15 14:59:09 <pupnik> sido gainroot
Sep 15 14:59:20 <pupnik> the becomeroot help needs to be fixed in monkey
Sep 15 14:59:25 <pupnik> sudo gainroot in xterm
Sep 15 14:59:29 <pupnik> and password is rootme
Sep 15 14:59:46 <pupnik> either that or if you have ssh installed, you should be able to ssh root@localhost and login as root
Sep 15 14:59:50 <bearclaw_> game over, all small antennas are rubber duck type, bigger antennas with MMCX connector are too big, and its impossible do get a MMCX male-female cable
Sep 15 15:00:05 <Molagi> oh thx
Sep 15 15:00:27 <pupnik> Molagi: eventually i'll get freesci polished enough to go into the repositories, i just have to work harder at it.
Sep 15 15:00:32 <erstazi> I didn't know mono was so popular with nokia tablet users that even mono's website lists an .install for 770 and n800!
Sep 15 15:00:50 <Molagi> pupnik ok
Sep 15 15:01:21 <pupnik> Molagi - scummvm is polished and working well - http://fanoush.wz.cz/maemo/scummvm_0.10.0-4_armel.deb  Monkey Island etc (lucasarts games)
Sep 15 15:01:27 <erstazi> Molagi: of course, when you get connected through xterm or ssh, change your passwords!
Sep 15 15:01:34 <erstazi> Molagi: passwd root
Sep 15 15:01:41 <erstazi> Molagi: then passwd user
Sep 15 15:02:03 <erstazi> everyone knows that the root's default password is rootme
Sep 15 15:02:05 <erstazi> ok brb
Sep 15 15:02:46 <Molagi> heh
Sep 15 15:02:47 <Molagi> okay
Sep 15 15:05:32 <Deformative> Best way to become root is to ssh to root@localhost
Sep 15 15:05:37 <Deformative> :)
Sep 15 15:06:55 <pupnik> awesome - big family reunion and the restaurant has set up wlan for me
Sep 15 15:07:05 <pupnik> so everybody will get to play with 770+internet :)
Sep 15 15:09:18 <[31d1]> sudo -s
Sep 15 15:15:29 <pupnik> dropbear scp sux :(
Sep 15 15:16:01 <pupnik> keeps stalling out on me.  am i the only one?  cp, stall, cp, stall ...
Sep 15 15:18:03 <lizhao> hello, I have a question about maemo-icon in debian/control
Sep 15 15:18:34 <lizhao> anybody can help on this? thanks in advance
Sep 15 15:18:35 <pupnik> maemowizard?
Sep 15 15:18:36 <_Monkey> hmmm... maemowizard is a silly script I made to create packages for SDL applications easier
Sep 15 15:19:58 * Deformative needs a script to install maemo sdk
Sep 15 15:20:40 <Molagi> pupnik where can i get games for scummvm
Sep 15 15:21:38 <pupnik> http://geocities.yahoo.com.br/daniel_on_go/MaemoWizard03.zip lizhao <- that has an example icon for you
Sep 15 15:21:51 <pupnik> Molagi: dunno - stw
Sep 15 15:22:07 <Molagi> k
Sep 15 15:22:32 <pupnik> 'abandonware' sites, or maybe lucasarts has released some for download
Sep 15 15:24:06 <Molagi> hmm okay
Sep 15 15:24:18 <Molagi> i thought the games were somehow "converted" for scummvm
Sep 15 15:24:27 <pupnik> no - originals - same with freesci
Sep 15 15:24:36 <Molagi> ok great
Sep 15 15:25:28 <lizhao> hi, pupnik, I have icons, the problem is how to embed them into debian/control
Sep 15 15:25:46 <lizhao> I use: uuencode -m xxx.26x26.png /dev/stdout
Sep 15 15:25:52 <lizhao> and copy the result into debian/control
Sep 15 15:25:55 <roxfan> there were some sierra classic collections released recently
Sep 15 15:26:18 <lizhao> however, seems the icon won't show in application installer
Sep 15 15:26:45 <roxfan> http://www.amazon.com/dp/B000AYH89M SQ 1-5
Sep 15 15:27:19 <roxfan> http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00001OWYP ??
Sep 15 15:27:58 <erstazi> pupnik: I only use openssh, even though its a tad larger install size, its more effective
Sep 15 15:28:28 <pupnik> does openssh give you pauses when using scp for large files?
Sep 15 15:28:39 <pupnik> what is transfer rate to mmc?
Sep 15 15:28:59 <pupnik> dropbear varies between 0 and 300kB/s
Sep 15 15:31:34 <Deformative> Does anyone know what CodeSourcery is exactly?
Sep 15 15:31:45 <lizhao> hi, pupnik, I just copyed the xb-maemo-icon-26 section from your maemowizard03.zip into my debian/control
Sep 15 15:31:53 <lizhao> however, failed again
Sep 15 15:37:17 <suihkulokki> Deformative: a company that works on gcc
Sep 15 15:38:34 <m-vo> lizhao: paste your whole debian/control
Sep 15 15:39:41 <lizhao> Source: sdcv
Sep 15 15:39:41 <lizhao> Priority: optional
Sep 15 15:39:41 <lizhao> Section: user/utils
Sep 15 15:39:41 <lizhao> Maintainer: Li, Zhao <lizhao@lizhao.net>
Sep 15 15:39:41 <lizhao> Build-Depends: debhelper (>= 4.0.0), gettext, zlib1g-dev, pkg-config, libglib2.0-dev, libreadline5-dev | libreadline-dev
Sep 15 15:40:22 <lizhao> m-vo, sorry
Sep 15 15:40:35 <lizhao> too long to mess up screen
Sep 15 15:42:37 <Deformative> suihkulokki: Why does codesource have it's own runtime?
Sep 15 15:42:41 <Deformative> Other than glibc
Sep 15 15:42:46 <Deformative> Doesn't that cause some suckage?
Sep 15 15:42:59 <Deformative> What uses which runtime on the nokia?
Sep 15 15:43:11 <suihkulokki> runtime?
Sep 15 15:43:28 <Deformative> Oh wait.
Sep 15 15:43:30 <suihkulokki> your smoking crack
Sep 15 15:43:55 <Deformative> Yeah.
Sep 15 15:44:01 <Deformative> I was thinking of something completely different.
Sep 15 15:44:18 <Deformative> I apologize.
Sep 15 15:44:26 <lizhao> hi, m-vo, I sent email to you
Sep 15 15:45:18 <m-vo> ok, let's see...
Sep 15 15:50:35 * bedboi is back (gone 06:44:05)
Sep 15 15:50:39 <RushPL_> Deformative: what's up?
Sep 15 15:51:54 <Deformative> RushPL: Trying to setup an environment for me to compile in.
Sep 15 15:51:57 <Deformative> So I can get gdc
Sep 15 15:52:42 <Deformative> With gdc/gcc, the nokia should be able to self sustain itself.
Sep 15 15:52:59 <Deformative> Independant of the desktop that is
Sep 15 15:56:08 <RushPL> yep, I'd like to have the compile environment too, but I need bluetooth keyboard. The damn virtual keyboard is killing me.
Sep 15 15:56:36 <Deformative> Yeah.
Sep 15 15:56:45 <RushPL> Also fuse-gui doesn't want to install because of some python conflict, I wanted to have fuse-ssh.
Sep 15 15:56:49 <Deformative> Could always write on desktop, compile on nokia
Sep 15 15:56:51 <Deformative> Heh
Sep 15 15:56:56 <Deformative> Until we get keyboards
Sep 15 15:59:01 <[31d1]> just ssh into the nokia
Sep 15 16:01:27 <Deformative> Yeah.
Sep 15 16:01:31 <Deformative> That's a good point.
Sep 15 16:01:50 <Deformative> Are nokia supposed to loose connection when idle for a long time?
Sep 15 16:02:58 <sp3000> what kind of lose
Sep 15 16:03:07 <sp3000> as in by what indicators
Sep 15 16:03:27 <Deformative> The icon does not have the antenna anymore.
Sep 15 16:05:12 <RushPL> I saw some setting for that in the control panel.
Sep 15 16:06:59 <Deformative> Maybe data call idle time?
Sep 15 16:07:08 <Deformative> It is currently at 5 minutes
Sep 15 16:08:37 <sp3000> more like the corresponding wlan timeout
Sep 15 16:08:54 * sp3000 wouldn't expect data call to be indicated by an antenna
Sep 15 16:09:20 * sp3000 isn't familiar with os2006 graphics though
Sep 15 16:10:38 <Deformative> Hmm,.
Sep 15 16:10:47 <Deformative> In cpu transparency, why is qemu not listed/
Sep 15 16:10:49 <Deformative> ?
Sep 15 16:10:56 <Deformative> The tutorial says it should be there.
Sep 15 16:11:20 <RushPL> damn damn, even the chat has black font on black background.
Sep 15 16:11:34 <RushPL> are these apps open source?
Sep 15 16:11:41 <RushPL> I would very like to fix them
Sep 15 16:11:58 <Deformative> RushPL: I think most are not.
Sep 15 16:12:02 <bedboi> re
Sep 15 16:12:05 <Deformative> I would like to fix them as well.
Sep 15 16:12:24 <RushPL> Deformative: no kidding, serious?
Sep 15 16:12:49 <Deformative> The browser, pdf reader, chat, etc I think are not.
Sep 15 16:13:02 <Deformative> You can get the sources from the nokia site, I already did.
Sep 15 16:13:11 <Deformative> And the naming is all screwed up.
Sep 15 16:13:18 <Deformative> So I cannot tell what does what.
Sep 15 16:13:48 <Deformative> That is why I suggested you and myself did a top down rewrite in D and fully open source.
Sep 15 16:13:54 <inz> pdf reader is oss
Sep 15 16:14:34 <Deformative> Oh.
Sep 15 16:14:41 <Deformative> What about the file browser?
Sep 15 16:15:01 <Deformative> The pdf viewer is the best working app on it.
Sep 15 16:15:04 <Deformative> IMO
Sep 15 16:15:10 <inz> closed, i think
Sep 15 16:15:20 <Deformative> It's great because I have so many pdf books.
Sep 15 16:15:31 <Deformative> The browser renderer is good.
Sep 15 16:15:35 <Deformative> The browser itself, is not
Sep 15 16:15:53 <inz> which renderer
Sep 15 16:16:00 <Deformative> It is opera, no?
Sep 15 16:16:08 <RushPL> there's always that minimo, but the level of integration is poor.
Sep 15 16:16:11 <Deformative> Whatever it is, it works well.
Sep 15 16:16:13 <RushPL> and it's slower I think.
Sep 15 16:16:34 <RushPL> (it has Gecko 2.0)
Sep 15 16:16:46 <Deformative> Well.
Sep 15 16:16:58 * Deformative shrugs.
Sep 15 16:17:06 <Deformative> Rendering engines are super boring to make.
Sep 15 16:17:26 <inz> you can install microb (gecko) on newest n800 sw
Sep 15 16:17:42 <Deformative> We are both on 770
Sep 15 16:17:49 <inz> but ope
Sep 15 16:17:54 <inz> oops
Sep 15 16:18:07 <Deformative> RushPL: once I get gdc/gcc working, I am going to start rewriting things with or without you. :P
Sep 15 16:18:23 <Deformative> But gdc is rumored not to work on armel
Sep 15 16:18:24 <Deformative> :(
Sep 15 16:18:29 <bedboi> Deformative: are you serious about D, i mean is it consolidated an robust?
Sep 15 16:19:04 <Deformative> bedboi: I program almost exclusively in D because I like it so much better than the rest.
Sep 15 16:19:22 <RushPL> Deformative: I'm not decided for any bigger commitment yet, most of the things work just fine but I'm getting more and more pissed so it may change. :)
Sep 15 16:19:43 <bedboi> are there bindings for glib, gtk, Hildon, blabla
Sep 15 16:19:45 <bedboi> ?
Sep 15 16:20:01 <Deformative> bedboi: C bindings are simple in D.
Sep 15 16:20:18 <Deformative> There is a generator that works perfectly.
Sep 15 16:20:41 <Deformative> Then I could go ahead and make a wrapper or whatever.
Sep 15 16:21:13 <bedboi> what about the cleanness of the assembly?
Sep 15 16:21:24 <bedboi> portability, blabla
Sep 15 16:21:29 <Deformative> D's abi is not frozen yet.
Sep 15 16:21:32 <Deformative> But it is very good.
Sep 15 16:21:49 <Deformative> Walter has extensive experience from his C/C++ compilers
Sep 15 16:22:04 <Deformative> It is all the work of one man, so it is very well designed, unlike huge team projects.
Sep 15 16:22:10 <m-vo> lizhao, the base64 encoding in your debian/control is corrupted.
Sep 15 16:22:43 <m-vo> There is a dubios '+' at the end of line 8, for example
Sep 15 16:23:22 <Deformative> Hmm, I don't understand how to get cpu transparency detected in scratchbox
Sep 15 16:23:30 <bedboi> Deformative: what you are saying about huge team projects is not always true.
Sep 15 16:23:47 <lizhao> hi, m-vo, are you talking about:
Sep 15 16:23:48 <lizhao> there are duplicated
Sep 15 16:23:52 <bedboi> it is just a common side effect
Sep 15 16:23:53 <lizhao> sSv6wkFOTIAM2HOKAECf/lr9ug90EhDx4B63/EkwDFZx9d1u7D0JvgcAcOJz+
Sep 15 16:24:27 <lizhao> but it is copyed from other package
Sep 15 16:24:35 <lizhao> I also tried to copy from maemo example
Sep 15 16:24:48 <Deformative> bedboi: it is often true
Sep 15 16:24:58 <Deformative> GCC is a good example.
Sep 15 16:25:01 <lizhao> plz ignore "there are duplicated "
Sep 15 16:25:20 <Deformative> But
Sep 15 16:25:26 <Deformative> The d frontend does work on gcc
Sep 15 16:25:26 <RushPL> Deformative: so you want to do everything froms scratch?
Sep 15 16:25:27 <Deformative> So whatever
Sep 15 16:25:43 <Deformative> RushPL: No
Sep 15 16:25:45 <Deformative> Top down
Sep 15 16:25:55 <Deformative> Not bottom up
Sep 15 16:26:02 <Deformative> That way it continues to be usable as we go.
Sep 15 16:26:16 <lizhao> BTW: m-vo, how to check whether the section is corrupted?
Sep 15 16:26:35 <m-vo> What do you mean?  Which section?
Sep 15 16:26:44 <bedboi> Deformative: can you be low level in D?
Sep 15 16:26:50 <m-vo> Ahh, the "Maemo-Icon-26" field?
Sep 15 16:26:54 <Deformative> bedboi: of course
Sep 15 16:26:56 <bedboi> i mean, C is good because you can write whatever you want.
Sep 15 16:27:05 <Deformative> You can do anything you want in D.
Sep 15 16:27:08 <bedboi> on whatever platform
Sep 15 16:27:16 <Deformative> There exists a purely D runtime even.
Sep 15 16:27:33 <Deformative> There have been a few D kernels
Sep 15 16:27:37 <Deformative> Some hardware drivers
Sep 15 16:27:43 <m-vo> I tried to decode it using "base64-decode" and it gave me some warnings and produced a corrupted PNG file.
Sep 15 16:27:55 <bedboi> Deformative: you have also C++ kernels.
Sep 15 16:28:12 <Deformative> bedboi: your point?
Sep 15 16:29:07 <bedboi> Deformative: the fact is how they work. how the code performs
Sep 15 16:29:47 <Deformative> Your words are not making sense to me.
Sep 15 16:29:55 <Deformative> RushPL?
Sep 15 16:30:02 <RushPL> don't ask me :P
Sep 15 16:30:19 <Deformative> Hehe.
Sep 15 16:31:02 <bedboi> Deformative: all new languages tends to declare as "the best ever"
Sep 15 16:31:20 <Deformative> bedboi: Well then try it.
Sep 15 16:31:40 <bedboi> or something like that, they tend also to say they are the fastest in the world (even java did it!!!!)
Sep 15 16:32:10 <Deformative> Java's VM is reasonably fast.
Sep 15 16:32:13 <Deformative> I wouldn't use it.
Sep 15 16:32:16 <Deformative> But it's not that slow.
Sep 15 16:32:20 <m-vo> lizhao, if you just want some icon for testing, you can use the one from http://hildon-app-mgr.garage.maemo.org/packaging.html
Sep 15 16:32:31 <bedboi> it is hell slow, trying to do something low level
Sep 15 16:32:36 <RushPL> bedboi: but all those languages tend to completely disregard C.
Sep 15 16:32:40 <Deformative> But in my experience, D is very fast.
Sep 15 16:33:26 <Deformative> Speed is very difficult to measure.
Sep 15 16:33:31 <bedboi> yep itis.
Sep 15 16:33:42 <m-vo> I hear D doesn't have closures.  True?
Sep 15 16:33:52 <Deformative> bedboi: D is compiled to native code.
Sep 15 16:33:54 <lizhao> oh, m-vo, I am trying the codes in the page you gave
Sep 15 16:33:58 <lizhao> hope it works
Sep 15 16:34:16 <Deformative> bedboi: Which often implies faster code, but many disagree with that statement.
Sep 15 16:34:17 <bedboi> Deformative: btw, you can benchmark some simple applications and see if at least they are comparable (not orders of magnitude difference)
Sep 15 16:34:26 <Molagi> what program do i need to unpack .tgz?
Sep 15 16:34:32 <m-vo> Note that in debian/control you need to use "XB-Maemo-Icon-26", not "Maemo-Icon-26" as given in the AM docs.
Sep 15 16:34:50 <Deformative> bedboi: http://shootout.alioth.debian.org/sandbox/benchmark.php?test=all&lang=all
Sep 15 16:35:10 <Deformative> bedboi: Pre-1.0 D was the #1 on that list.
Sep 15 16:35:21 <Deformative> But D's speed decreased very slightly after 1.0
Sep 15 16:35:32 <Deformative> Still damn fast.
Sep 15 16:35:56 <m-vo> speed is not the problem for most of the code, correctness and maintainability are.
Sep 15 16:36:13 <Deformative> m-vo: agreed
Sep 15 16:36:15 <bedboi> m-vo: it does depend on what you are writing.
Sep 15 16:36:20 <Deformative> m-vo: but it doesn't hurt
Sep 15 16:36:21 <Deformative> :)
Sep 15 16:36:28 <Deformative> Speed is always a good plus.
Sep 15 16:36:30 <bedboi> if you are writing high level applications it is quite true (quite)
Sep 15 16:36:32 <lizhao> hi, m-vo, it does not work
Sep 15 16:36:36 <RushPL> I did some pure computational speed algorithmic job in D and compared it to C. The GC proved to be quite a burden, but you can easily disable it. Without GC it managed almost as well as C.
Sep 15 16:36:46 <lizhao> actually, I tried several samples in maemo webpages
Sep 15 16:37:06 <lizhao> any further idea about what I should check?
Sep 15 16:37:20 <Deformative> m-vo: Do you mean delegates?
Sep 15 16:37:49 <m-vo> Deformative, languages in the C family sacrifice expressiveness in the name of speed.  From what I hear, D doesn't, which is nice.
Sep 15 16:38:11 <Deformative> m-vo: D does whatever the hell walter feels like.
Sep 15 16:38:31 <Deformative> He is our bright(haha) dictator whom we all love. :P
Sep 15 16:38:51 <m-vo> Deformative, no, nested functions where the life-time of the inner function can exceed that of the outer function and the inner function can still refer to variables of the outer function.
Sep 15 16:39:39 <Deformative> We have nested functions,  and we have nested function pointers.
Sep 15 16:39:54 <Deformative> nested function pointer = delegate
Sep 15 16:40:00 <m-vo> "nested function pointers"?  How can you nest values?
Sep 15 16:40:15 <Deformative> No, we have pointers to nested functions.
Sep 15 16:40:23 <m-vo> Ahh, of course.
Sep 15 16:40:26 <Deformative> And pointers to object methods
Sep 15 16:40:58 <Deformative> I don't know about closures though, I have never looked into something like that.
Sep 15 16:41:06 <Deformative> Well, maybe I have
Sep 15 16:41:11 <Deformative> But I don't quite understand what you mean
Sep 15 16:41:16 <Deformative> Maybe RushPL does
Sep 15 16:41:22 <Molagi> how can i unpack a .tgz file?
Sep 15 16:41:32 <ch4os_> tar xvpzf
Sep 15 16:41:37 <m-vo> Deformative, can you read Scheme?
Sep 15 16:41:47 <m-vo> I could give a very simple example.
Sep 15 16:41:56 <Molagi> mmmok
Sep 15 16:42:56 <Deformative> I can read very basic scheme
Sep 15 16:42:59 <Molagi> so if i want to unpack like test.tgz i write tar xvpzf test.tgz?
Sep 15 16:43:09 <ch4os_> Molagi: yes
Sep 15 16:43:11 <Deformative> And I can read basic erlang, I am on chaper 5 of erlang if I remember correctly
Sep 15 16:43:14 <Molagi> ok thanks
Sep 15 16:43:39 <ch4os_> tgz -> tar.gz
Sep 15 16:43:50 <m-vo> Ok!  I don't know Erlang, so let's try Scheme.
Sep 15 16:43:50 <Deformative> m-vo: I know of a person making a functional library for functional programming in D.
Sep 15 16:44:19 <Deformative> m-vo: I know who could surely answer your questions.
Sep 15 16:44:27 <Deformative> If you wish to join #D there is downs and cracki
Sep 15 16:44:33 <Deformative> cracki is a lisp fanatic
Sep 15 16:44:39 <Deformative> And downs does functional programming in D
Sep 15 16:44:55 <m-vo> Deformative, this is my source: http://www.hans-eric.com/2007/09/11/d-doesnt-have-real-closures/
Sep 15 16:45:04 <m-vo> Ok, here is the example:
Sep 15 16:45:10 <m-vo> (define (make-adder n) (lambda (x) (+ x n)))
Sep 15 16:45:16 <m-vo> (define add-3 (make-adder 3))
Sep 15 16:45:21 <m-vo> (add-3 5)
Sep 15 16:45:26 <m-vo> => 8
Sep 15 16:45:54 <m-vo> add-3 can still safely refer to the 'n' parameter of make-adder although make-adder has long finished.
Sep 15 16:46:17 <Deformative> half-and-half
Sep 15 16:46:17 <Deformative> [12:44] <downs> D has dynamic closures by default
Sep 15 16:46:17 <Deformative> [12:44] <downs> that is, closures that are valid while their context is valid
Sep 15 16:46:17 <Deformative> [12:44] <downs> so you can't return them
Sep 15 16:46:30 <Deformative>  or you can use bind or stack manip to turn them into full closures.
Sep 15 16:47:18 <m-vo> 'dynamic closures' seems just to be an euphemism for 'no closures, only nested functions'
Sep 15 16:47:39 * Deformative shrugs
Sep 15 16:48:14 <Deformative> Better than C++
Sep 15 16:48:54 <Deformative> I don't know how closures would perform in native rather than interpereted code.
Sep 15 16:49:20 <m-vo> well, whatever, just like the link I posted, I don't see any reason for not offering 'real' closures by default.  It's not that they are some little understood, obscure language feature with only fringe use cases.
Sep 15 16:49:24 <RushPL> Ayyy, my nokia has crashed about 3 times this day.
Sep 15 16:49:28 <Molagi> hmm no such file or directory
Sep 15 16:49:29 <Molagi> damn
Sep 15 16:50:02 <m-vo> If you don't have closures in the language, you have to fake them manually, which is going to be slower (and painful).
Sep 15 16:50:26 <m-vo> Look at all the "data" parameters of your typical C callback.
Sep 15 16:50:52 <Deformative> 12:48] <downs> not true
Sep 15 16:50:52 <Deformative> [12:48] <miller[]> they still access the scope
Sep 15 16:50:52 <Deformative> [12:48] <downs> the nested functions can access their surrounding function.
Sep 15 16:50:52 <Deformative> [12:48] <downs> that's what I meant by "half a
Sep 15 16:51:08 <Deformative> RushPL: mine has never crashed yet
Sep 15 16:51:18 <Deformative> RushPL: the browser is the only thing to crash thus far.
Sep 15 16:51:46 <m-vo> yeah, that's what "nested" means: being able to access the surrounding scope.  If you can't do that, you are not nested. :-)
Sep 15 16:52:24 <m-vo> Anyway, I rest my case.  I think I like D anyway.
Sep 15 16:52:46 <Deformative> :)
Sep 15 16:53:04 <bedboi> the thing that leaves me skeptic about "new" languages is the lack of profiling, debugging, blablabla applications
Sep 15 16:54:00 <Deformative> bedboi: D is just a frontend.
Sep 15 16:54:05 <Deformative> The D backends are VERY mature.
Sep 15 16:54:05 <bedboi> vala is something i `could` like, it generates a C code
Sep 15 16:54:19 <bedboi> Deformative: what you mean by frontend?
Sep 15 16:54:19 <Deformative> There is a D to C compiler
Sep 15 16:55:03 <Deformative> Uh, it is compiler engineering, google compiler frontend/backend to learn more, but basically, you know how gcc can compile multiple languages on the same compiler backend?
Sep 15 16:55:22 <Deformative> m-vo:
Sep 15 16:55:22 <Deformative> [12:52] <cracki> tell him that D still uses a stack and environment frames aren't gc'd at all
Sep 15 16:55:22 <Deformative> [12:52] <cracki> that'll tell him enough to know about delegate literals
Sep 15 16:55:22 <Deformative> [12:52] <cracki> (maybe)
Sep 15 16:56:14 <Deformative> bedboi: Basically, we have an awesome frontend that Walter bright has made,  it is designed for his own backend that he created for his C/C++ compilers, but it also works on GCC and is being proted to LLVM as well.
Sep 15 16:56:39 <bedboi> ah cool
Sep 15 16:56:54 <bedboi> you are telling me you can generate intermediate C?
Sep 15 16:57:35 <Deformative> bedboi: GregorR made a C generator, yes.
Sep 15 16:58:43 <bedboi> i'm going to take what's the quality of the C code
Sep 15 16:58:50 <bedboi> i mean if it is understandable
Sep 15 16:59:39 <Deformative> The C compiler is unrelated.
Sep 15 17:00:26 <Deformative> http://dsource.org/projects/tdc
Sep 15 17:00:34 <Deformative> http://dsource.org/projects/llvmdc
Sep 15 17:00:45 <Deformative> Those are the two compilers that are less recognized.
Sep 15 17:00:52 <Deformative> The two MAIN compilers are DMD and gdc
Sep 15 17:01:03 <m-vo> Deformative, thanks.  You can have a normal stack with closures, of course.  When a variable needs to be in the closure for a nested function, you can either copy its value (when the 'variable' is constant, which is quite often the case when one adopts a more functional programming style which happens quite naturally once you have closures), or you need to store the variable in the heap.
Sep 15 17:01:31 <bedboi> http://dsource.org/projects/tdc/wiki/ExampleConversions
Sep 15 17:01:32 <bedboi> lol
Sep 15 17:01:56 <m-vo> The need to move away from a regular stack ans to start GCing activation frames comes when you have first class continuations.
Sep 15 17:02:12 <bedboi> man that's a huge C code for a so simple function
Sep 15 17:02:39 <Deformative> bedboi: well, I do not know, GregorR made it,
Sep 15 17:02:42 <Deformative> It is not official
Sep 15 17:03:19 <Deformative> bedboi: I imagine that with greater code segments the difference ratio is much smaller.
Sep 15 17:03:49 <lizhao> must leave now, thanks, m-vo
Sep 15 17:03:54 <bedboi> Vala generates very clean C
Sep 15 17:04:02 <m-vo> lizhao, did it work?
Sep 15 17:04:11 <bedboi> but it is still very buggy
Sep 15 17:04:31 <Deformative> http://www.digitalmars.com/d/archives/digitalmars/D/gdc_nokia_arm-_-gnueabi_46720.html   I wonder if that guy from nokia managed to get gdc on armel
Sep 15 17:04:57 <lardman> hmm, lots of assembler remarks and warnings, and a compiled vorbisdec.o dsptask :)
Sep 15 17:07:49 <DaniloCesar> Where is python-sqlite module on scrachbox???
Sep 15 17:15:23 <TPC> i dont think many people in history can claim to having used irc in the bath
Sep 15 17:15:29 <TPC> im doing it right now ;)
Sep 15 17:16:13 <TPC> with waterproof protective casing that fits the N800
Sep 15 17:16:41 <bedboi> in the bath?
Sep 15 17:16:45 <RushPL> rotfl
Sep 15 17:16:48 <bedboi> you mean under the shower?
Sep 15 17:17:00 <bedboi> i always use my laptop when in bath
Sep 15 17:17:02 <`0660> you don't take risks do you? :)
Sep 15 17:17:16 <RushPL> and I'm swimming in the sea, just 50m beneath the surface, cool, huh?
Sep 15 17:17:38 <RushPL> I have an AP on a bouy so that wifi reaches underwater.
Sep 15 17:18:55 <TPC> no, i mean the bath
Sep 15 17:19:33 <bedboi> TPC: i guess it is quite common.
Sep 15 17:19:40 <bedboi> at least for me.
Sep 15 17:19:50 <bedboi> i always bring my laptop with myself
Sep 15 17:19:54 <RushPL> bedboi: you coding in bath too?
Sep 15 17:19:59 <bedboi> of course
Sep 15 17:20:00 <TPC> when in the shower im too busy cleaning myself for irc
Sep 15 17:20:52 <RushPL> bedboi: that's right, bugs do not like water, it's an obvious place to code. :P
Sep 15 17:21:13 <TPC> what are you using to protect it from the water / humid air?
Sep 15 17:34:57 <tso> hmm, i cant stop thinking about a keyboard made for folding that also can be attached to the N800 so that it would act as a screen cover when folded up
Sep 15 17:43:39 <Deformative> Hello.
Sep 15 17:43:54 <Deformative> Does anyone know how to get qemu working with scratchbox?
Sep 15 17:43:58 <Deformative> The tutorial doesn't explain.
Sep 15 17:44:11 <Deformative> All it says for cpu transparency is none.
Sep 15 17:46:42 <suihkulokki> Deformative: you did not install the scratchbox-cputransparency-devkit package
Sep 15 17:46:42 <m-vo> Deformative, without knowing for sure, when you use sb-menu, I think you need to select the "cputransp" devkit and then it will ask you for the version of qemu to use.
Sep 15 17:50:18 <Deformative> Ah.
Sep 15 17:57:53 <Deformative> Hmm.
Sep 15 17:58:03 <Deformative> What cpu do I use?
Sep 15 17:58:16 <Deformative> arm-cvs arm-0.82 arm-7,0 ?
Sep 15 17:58:18 <Deformative> What?
Sep 15 17:58:45 <zuh> arm-0.8.2-sb2 has been the most useful one for me
Sep 15 18:02:26 <Deformative> Thanks
Sep 15 18:20:06 <bearclaw_> is it possible to have iwconfig on the 770?
Sep 15 18:23:33 <tso> i think i have seen a package but do not recall what repo
Sep 15 18:23:47 <bearclaw_> repository?
Sep 15 18:23:48 <_Monkey> i guess repository is http://maemo.org/community/wiki/ApplicationRepositories  and a searchable index at http://www.gronmayer.com/n800/repos/index.php
Sep 15 18:36:59 <bearclaw_> found it
Sep 15 18:37:56 <bearclaw_> is ad-hoc mode supported?
Sep 15 18:41:13 <tso> dont know if the 770 can initate it, but yes, it can do link-local connections. i have done so myself, by accident :P
Sep 15 18:41:49 <bearclaw_> and the other device was visible with iwlist scan?
Sep 15 18:44:33 <tso> yes
Sep 15 18:44:46 <tso> err, it showed up in the connection manager list :)
Sep 15 18:44:56 <bearclaw_> should be the same :)
Sep 15 18:45:23 <bearclaw_> im trying to connect a gumstix with my 770 in wifi ad-hoc
Sep 15 18:45:25 <tso> the diff that i see was that link-local connections where shown by a black "antenna"
Sep 15 18:58:48 <alterego> Woo, I just finished writing a nice little script that toggles bluetooth on/off, handle when added to the cpu/memory graph applet.
Sep 15 18:59:07 <alterego> It even toggles the label on for the menu item :)
Sep 15 18:59:54 <alterego> Took me about an hour to write though, bit rusty at the old shell scripting ..
Sep 15 19:03:03 <tso> interesting. if i do not enter a password in the claw-mail settings, it works fine. but if i enter one, i get a timeout when checking mail. think ill stick to the default one...
Sep 15 19:21:25 <RushPL> Deformative: sshfs works nicely
Sep 15 19:40:36 <DaniloCesar> I'm having problems with my .install file. Users can only see the file. I think that it's a apache issue.
Sep 15 19:41:22 <DaniloCesar> They are not downloading the file, but seeing... I think that some .htaccess changes will fix this, but I don't know what changes I need to do
Sep 15 19:45:09 <Deformative> How do I start dropbear ssh server?
Sep 15 19:50:37 <[31d1]> by uninstalling dropbear and installing openssh?
Sep 15 19:52:14 <Deformative> Bleh.
Sep 15 19:52:21 <Deformative> I just used dropbear because it is in the repo./
Sep 15 19:54:20 <RushPL> Deformative: openssh is too in the repo. Just some other one.
Sep 15 19:54:25 <RushPL> repositories?
Sep 15 19:54:26 <_Monkey> repositories is http://maemo.org/community/wiki/ApplicationRepositories  and a searchable index at http://www.gronmayer.com/n800/repos/index.php
Sep 15 19:54:43 <Deformative> Bleh.
Sep 15 19:55:04 <RushPL> I wonder why there isn't a single repo.
Sep 15 19:55:34 <sp3000> there is but it's somehow not been the path of least resistance
Sep 15 20:03:26 <Deformative> Searching ssh only comes up with dropbear
Sep 15 20:04:22 <TPC> openssh is in the repo, at least it was for me
Sep 15 20:04:32 <Deformative> Which one?
Sep 15 20:04:33 <TPC> maybe I added some weird one without realizing it, but I don't think so
Sep 15 20:05:45 <TPC> I think it only shows up in red pill mode
Sep 15 20:06:07 <Deformative> How do I go into red pill mode?
Sep 15 20:06:19 <TPC> instructions are on the maemo.org wiki
Sep 15 20:09:08 <Deformative> Wow.
Sep 15 20:09:13 <Deformative> That's so weird.
Sep 15 20:12:52 <Deformative> Bleh
Sep 15 20:13:02 <Deformative> Openssh doesn't support ssh root@localhost like dropbear does?
Sep 15 20:13:39 <[31d1]> it should
Sep 15 20:14:03 <Deformative> Oh
Sep 15 20:14:11 <Deformative> I had to get rid of the old .ssh from dropbear
Sep 15 20:14:38 <[31d1]> i turned off root login in ssh_config after i set up etc/sudoers
Sep 15 20:31:02 <Pio> any maemo-mappers know of decent programs to create poi databases?
Sep 15 20:31:18 <Pio> that vb Poi_loader app isn't working out for me..
Sep 15 20:32:13 <Deformative> I need to figure out how to program the DSP
Sep 15 20:32:15 <Pio> i found some guy's perl script which im playing with now, but its not working either..
Sep 15 20:32:16 <Deformative> heh
Sep 15 20:32:18 <Deformative> Looks like fun.
Sep 15 20:32:34 <Deformative> I am getting much more than I expected out of this cool little device.
Sep 15 20:34:13 <roxfan> aren't there specs?
Sep 15 20:35:28 <Deformative> Be back in a few hours.
Sep 15 20:35:29 <Deformative> o/
Sep 15 21:03:22 <skibur> http://img514.imageshack.us/img514/3131/pict0001gi6.jpg
Sep 15 21:19:12 * Pio just wrote his own script to import gpx waypoints into maemo mapper poi db
Sep 15 21:19:28 <Pio> i'll post it to internettablettalk once i clean it up a little
Sep 15 21:20:09 <Pio> python, so unlike other progs out there, it should run fine on maemo
Sep 15 21:21:27 <Pio> now i have every mine in LA, ventura and kern county in my POI db >:)
Sep 15 21:37:21 <TPC> [23:17:49]  * Pio just wrote his own script to import gpx waypoints into maemo mapper poi db
Sep 15 21:37:24 <TPC> ohh
Sep 15 21:38:02 <TPC> mind giving me a link to it when you posted it?
Sep 15 21:38:03 <Pio> http://pio.longstair.com/misc/gpx_to_poi
Sep 15 21:39:19 <TPC> thanks
Sep 15 21:42:03 <wyre> new n800 user here / looking for starting point to fix a problem / after installing several updates my n800 no longer makes sounds correctly, useing the fm radio i get a hint in the form of this error 'audio output switching failed'
Sep 15 21:43:41 <wyre> [when head phones are not in that is] -
Sep 15 21:44:28 <TPC> Pio, where did you get the pysqlite2 module? its not in any repos I have on it
Sep 15 21:44:53 <Pio> hrm yeah actually i dont know if theres a pysqlite for maemo
Sep 15 21:45:13 <Pio> i havent run this on maemo yet
Sep 15 21:45:27 <Pio> http://maemo.org/downloads/product/pysqlite2/ hmm
Sep 15 21:46:02 <TPC> missing install
Sep 15 21:47:19 <TPC> ah well, I'll just run it on my computer then
Sep 15 21:51:58 <TPC> hmm
Sep 15 21:51:59 <TPC> Failed parsing input file:  not well-formed (invalid token): line 35239, column 98
Sep 15 21:52:08 <TPC> oh well, I'll just remove that particular location
Sep 15 21:52:49 <lmoura> Pio, there's sqlite3 in the default pymaemo install
Sep 15 21:53:04 <Pio> ah
Sep 15 21:53:19 <TPC> sqlite3 and sqlite2 are incompatible, aren't they?
Sep 15 21:59:26 <wyre> well - a second restart did the trick [via remote ssh even] after the power button stopped responding...  odd.
Sep 15 22:01:37 <TPC> Pio, hm.. it does not seem to work
Sep 15 22:01:52 <Pio> any error messages?
Sep 15 22:02:08 <TPC> Pio, lots of data gets added to the poi file, but when I start mmaemo mapper they just don't show up
Sep 15 22:02:28 <Pio> hm
Sep 15 22:02:45 <TPC> I'm thinking that maybe it was because the category I added them to didn't exist, gonna try again with an exisiting category
Sep 15 22:02:48 <Pio> you let it add them .. yeah
Sep 15 22:02:51 <TPC> but I'm just guessing here
Sep 15 22:02:56 <Pio> i was just going to ask about the categories
Sep 15 22:03:03 <Pio> by default it just adds to category 11 ("Other")
Sep 15 22:03:13 <Pio> but it'll use any old number you give it
Sep 15 22:03:19 <Pio> ..yeah and its a number, not a strnig
Sep 15 22:03:34 <Pio> i was thinking about adding support for calling categories by name, and creating new categories, etc
Sep 15 22:03:37 <Pio> this is a real rough draft :)
Sep 15 22:03:58 <Pio> but for now, im going to go out biking.. thats what i wrote this for, anyway, to get waypoints into maemo-mapper for my bike ride :)
Sep 15 22:05:08 <TPC> ok :)
Sep 15 22:05:30 <TPC> I'm trying to make it load the nearest 1000 geocaches into my poi
Sep 15 22:08:04 <wyre> caches, cool, get data from gc.com?
Sep 15 22:08:45 <TPC> yeah, using a cli app called geotoad
Sep 15 22:09:03 <wyre> nice tool that one
Sep 15 22:10:08 <wyre> it's ruby ... there an interpreter for maemo [am new, hope i asked _that_ right]
Sep 15 22:10:27 <wyre> ?
Sep 15 22:11:14 <TPC> no idea, I'm quite new also
Sep 15 22:11:53 <TPC> anyway, it seems to have worked, all nearby geocaches show up on the map :)
Sep 15 22:11:55 <TPC> Thanks Pio
Sep 15 22:15:44 <wyre> cool
Sep 15 22:17:06 <toni_> hi, n770 stopped booting.
Sep 15 22:17:40 <toni_> i reflashed it with new HE 2007 edition, still no boot. reflashed it with latest 2006, still no boot. no errors on reflash though.
Sep 15 22:17:50 <toni_> anyone has any ideas what to do?
Sep 15 22:18:42 <TPC> Pio, if I were to run the script again with most of the locations being the same, and some new  / changed, would it create a copy of the old ones, ignore them, or update them?
Sep 15 22:18:44 <tso> how far does the boot go? any graphics at all? how about when you insert the charger?
Sep 15 22:19:04 <toni_> screen with NOKIA blue letter show, but it doesn't go further.
Sep 15 22:19:12 <TPC> Pio, I'm gonna head to sleep, so if you answer please mention my nick in all the lines, so it will show up in my away log
Sep 15 22:19:15 <toni_> with inserted charger.
Sep 15 22:19:53 <toni_> i enabled r&D mode but it only shows few info bits, like kernel version on the top of blue NOKIA logo.
Sep 15 22:19:55 <tso> not a good sign. sad really that nokia didnt provide a way to turn off those graphics somehow (that i know of)
Sep 15 22:20:36 <toni_> the crazy thing is, i bought another n770, as a present for a friend. he arrive today, and both nokias are not booting. mental.
Sep 15 22:20:54 <toni_> i used mine for couple of months without problems.
Sep 15 22:21:11 <erstazi> toni_: you should be under warranty
Sep 15 22:21:17 <erstazi> both both even
Sep 15 22:21:39 <toni_> yes i know. but it's still a pain. i'll be without it for who knows how long.
Sep 15 22:21:51 <lle2> toni_: just as a last resort, try flashing twice with the same release
Sep 15 22:22:04 <lle2> reset by removing the battery in between
Sep 15 22:22:12 <toni_> and it worked fine this morning.
Sep 15 22:22:16 <toni_> lle2, thanks, will try that now.
Sep 15 22:22:24 <sp3000> if you see a black cat crossing your path while flashing, ...
Sep 15 22:22:29 <toni_> LOL
Sep 15 22:22:57 <toni_> both nokias show signs that they are charging, battery full, and a blue NOKIA logo. no more than that.
Sep 15 22:23:42 <lle2> don't leave the charger connected, it affects the bootup
Sep 15 22:25:08 <lle2> also if still doesn't work, try enabling rd mode and disabling lifeguard resets
Sep 15 22:25:31 <toni_> lle2, without the charger, i couldn't even see the blue NOKIA logo. pressing power button does nothing without a charge. with the charger plugged in, blue NOKIA logo shows, stays for 10-15 sec, then goes to white screen, and then to black screen with a small icon shhowing that it is charging.
Sep 15 22:25:44 <toni_> trying reboot with flasher tool does the same thing, no further than logo.
Sep 15 22:26:45 <lle2> well, if you can see the charging icon it boots pretty far, could be that you simply have a dead battery and/or charger
Sep 15 22:28:01 <lle2> would be pretty unlikely though, for two devices
Sep 15 22:28:05 <toni_> lle2, it show that it is fully charged now. also, i have two chargers, and two nokias and both have the same symptpm i desribed above.
Sep 15 22:28:15 <toni_> i tried swapping chargers too.
Sep 15 22:28:46 <toni_> i need a priest, that's how it feels when two devices refuse to work in a same day like these.
Sep 15 22:28:49 <toni_> devil is in my house.
Sep 15 22:29:40 <toni_> however, BBC match of the day football stream didn't work today. and half of the basketball euro championship streaming was broken too today. a bad day.
Sep 15 22:30:07 <fer__> Toni, Hi, do you have a url for that stream?
Sep 15 22:30:08 <lle2> no, it's just two n770s, they like to be the only tablet in the house
Sep 15 22:31:52 <toni_> fer__, it's on BBC website, look under sport, match of the day, for UK only though, unless you can proxy client somehow.
Sep 15 22:32:02 <erstazi> toni_: if they performed an exorcism then it would be perfect
Sep 15 22:33:11 <toni_> ok, flashing twice, with battery taken out inbetwen for few secs, didn't work.
Sep 15 22:33:18 <toni_> on black cat though.
Sep 15 22:33:30 <toni_> i'll now try flashing the other one.
Sep 15 22:34:02 <cypherbios> how long does it take to reflash the device?
Sep 15 22:34:27 <sp3000> <1min
Sep 15 22:34:31 <toni_> yes, under 1 min.
Sep 15 22:34:42 <lle2> I can't entirely understand what the hacker edition could do to the device that would break it so that flashing twice with the original wouldn't fix it
Sep 15 22:34:58 <toni_> with no errors reported. root device is flash, as it should be, since i took the card out.
Sep 15 22:35:21 <fer__> Toni, thanks.
Sep 15 22:35:25 <lle2> unless it screws up the cal area
Sep 15 22:35:39 <fer__> Toni, I'm not in the Uk.. so, guess I won't be able to get it..
Sep 15 22:37:01 <toni_> fer__, i don't think so.
Sep 15 22:37:15 <toni_> fer__, get an account on uknova.
Sep 15 23:27:47 <Deformative> Is there a tar gui utility?
Sep 15 23:28:28 <disq> there's guiTAR but it's not for maemo yet. i'll try to port it sometime, uses the old gtk (1.2) and all
Sep 15 23:29:24 <Deformative> Cool.
Sep 15 23:29:48 <Deformative> Well, let me know if you do it, because I might end up writing one from scratch and I don't want to be doing the same work.
Sep 15 23:31:12 <disq> i have to update it anyways, haven't touched it for 8 years.
Sep 15 23:32:28 <wyre> is there a decent online/offline PIM ...
Sep 15 23:34:24 <wyre> been asked before i see... [sigh]
Sep 15 23:47:39 <wyre> GPE seems to be the main such app...
Sep 15 23:49:03 <TPC> personally I use vi and a text file ;P
Sep 15 23:49:23 <TPC> works for the few todo items and dates I have to keep track off
Sep 15 23:51:55 <wyre> syncronised with shell scripts?  or just shell into one location to track....
Sep 16 00:01:24 <[31d1]> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZJEYjelxmDw
Sep 16 00:01:33 <[31d1]> oops
Sep 16 00:01:56 <[31d1]> wrong window - oh well you guys'll love it too
Sep 16 00:05:06 <Sulis> and we dooooo!
Sep 16 00:06:26 <Deformative> Ugh, making debian packages sucks.
Sep 16 00:09:09 <[31d1]> heh
Sep 16 00:09:29 <[31d1]> thats why i only compile things i can just cp into ~/bin
Sep 16 00:09:53 <Deformative> Heh
Sep 16 00:09:58 <Deformative> Good idea.
Sep 16 00:09:58 <[31d1]> Deformative: you need a copy of nvi or diff for 770 i got u dogg
Sep 16 00:10:09 <[31d1]> nvi is really nice
Sep 16 00:10:16 <[31d1]> better than crappy busybox vi
Sep 16 00:10:27 <[31d1]> and not all big and wonky like vim
Sep 16 00:10:37 <Deformative> Heh, maybe after I splice up a keyboard.
Sep 16 00:10:53 <Deformative> I am going to try to get a cheep usb keyboard working in the usb port.
Sep 16 00:11:08 <[31d1]> http://code.cutup.org/770
Sep 16 00:11:30 <[31d1]> you can afaik if you plug both things into a hub
Sep 16 00:12:13 <Deformative> Well.
Sep 16 00:12:20 <Deformative> You can not just plug it into a hub.
Sep 16 00:12:33 <[31d1]> oh :/
Sep 16 00:12:49 <Deformative> Hubs are host/slave
Sep 16 00:13:03 <Deformative> So you must modify the cable so that nokia is host side.
Sep 16 00:13:09 <[31d1]> i'm happy just sshing in to do stuff, esp with a vi that redrawsthe screen right and has multiple undo
Sep 16 00:13:23 <[31d1]> ah, interesting
Sep 16 00:14:07 <Deformative> The purpose of a hub is because hubs supply power.
Sep 16 00:14:19 <Deformative> Since the nokia is an unpowered usb
Sep 16 00:14:58 <[31d1]> hmm
Sep 16 00:15:23 <[31d1]> man i was driving all over nj today with my new gps and 770 trying not to crash like 'oo neat'
Sep 16 00:15:46 <Deformative> Heh.
Sep 16 00:16:00 <Deformative> I was going to buy a BT keyboard, but the prices are outragous.
Sep 16 00:16:27 <Deformative> I should have bought a hub though.
Sep 16 00:16:30 <Deformative> Wasn't thinking.
Sep 16 00:16:58 <Deformative> What folder is the path variable set on the nokia?
Sep 16 00:18:19 <[31d1]> not to very much by default
Sep 16 00:19:01 <Deformative> s/folder/file
Sep 16 00:19:06 <Deformative>  /etc/what?
Sep 16 00:19:11 <[31d1]> oh
Sep 16 00:19:39 <Deformative> profile
Sep 16 00:19:40 <Deformative> Found it
Sep 16 00:19:49 <[31d1]> i dunno i just set it in .profile to more stuff
Sep 16 00:20:02 <Deformative> Where are the arrows on the key?
Sep 16 00:20:11 <Deformative> board
Sep 16 00:20:33 <[31d1]> one of the first things i did was brick my 770 by saying echo bash > .profile
Sep 16 00:20:40 <[31d1]> hardware keys are arrows
Sep 16 00:21:05 <Deformative> But you recovered it, right?
Sep 16 00:21:10 <Deformative> Not a permanent brick.
Sep 16 00:21:26 <Deformative> I cannot find it on the on screen keyboard
Sep 16 00:21:29 <[31d1]> yeah i had to reflash
Sep 16 00:21:41 <[31d1]> Deformative: yeah use the hardware arrow keys
Sep 16 00:21:55 <Deformative> I am not sshed
Sep 16 00:22:09 <[31d1]> yeah on the nokia
Sep 16 00:22:14 <[31d1]> front top left area
Sep 16 00:22:15 <Deformative> After I get some more stuff working I am going to make a backup
Sep 16 00:22:23 <Deformative> Oh, cool.
Sep 16 00:22:27 <Deformative> Didn't know those worked for that.
Sep 16 00:22:43 <[31d1]> heh took me a few minutes to figure out myself so i wont lol at you
Sep 16 00:24:21 <[31d1]> yeah i thought calling bash in .profile would be a slick way to set that as default
Sep 16 00:24:33 <[31d1]> but it was just a slick way to prevent booting
Sep 16 00:25:09 <Deformative> xD
Sep 16 00:25:37 <Deformative> Need to edit like /etc/passwd or whatever
Sep 16 00:25:47 <Deformative> For user
Sep 16 00:27:39 <[31d1]> it was /etc/shells according to google - i didnt try to mess with that
Sep 16 00:28:08 <[31d1]> i also subtly screwed things up for weeks till i figured it out by editing /etc/sudoers wrong
Sep 16 00:28:36 <[31d1]> everything still worked except application manager wouldnt start
Sep 16 00:29:29 <[31d1]> cause i put 'user ALL = (ALL) ALL' at the bottom instead of at the top
Sep 16 00:29:55 <Deformative> Hmm, well, I should get gdc working.
Sep 16 00:30:09 <[31d1]> what will that do?
Sep 16 00:30:16 <Deformative> D compiler
Sep 16 00:30:17 <[31d1]> (pardon my ignorance)
Sep 16 00:30:19 <[31d1]> ah
Sep 16 00:30:24 <Deformative> I will get gcc too
Sep 16 00:30:35 <Deformative> Then I will have an independent device
Sep 16 00:30:56 <[31d1]> so if i stick gcc on there i wouldnt have to futz with scratchbox?
Sep 16 00:31:10 <Deformative> Well.
Sep 16 00:31:14 <Deformative> You won't have the headers
Sep 16 00:31:17 <[31d1]> i guess i might have to have a bunch of libs and stuff on there too
Sep 16 00:31:19 <[31d1]> yeah
Sep 16 00:31:33 <Deformative> D doesn't need the headers though.
Sep 16 00:31:35 <Deformative> Just bindings.
Sep 16 00:31:36 <Deformative> So
Sep 16 00:31:38 <[31d1]> i suck so hard at anything compiled
Sep 16 00:31:55 <Deformative> What languages do you know?
Sep 16 00:31:56 <[31d1]> i kick anyones ass at awk tho
Sep 16 00:32:40 <[31d1]> i do tons of shell and awk at work so im real good with that stuff, and i play with perl, and unfortunately i know too much php to be able to not use it
Sep 16 00:32:56 <[31d1]> and im reading a lisp book
Sep 16 00:33:12 <Deformative> I don't know any of those.
Sep 16 00:33:54 <Deformative> I am very fluent at D, alright at java/c, and I know the very basics of scheme and erlang
Sep 16 00:34:05 <[31d1]> i loves me some awk, but i end up using it for stuff that i should do in perl or something, but i get yelled at at work for writing perl
Sep 16 00:34:08 <[31d1]> :(
Sep 16 00:34:29 <Deformative> You should try D. :)
Sep 16 00:34:45 <[31d1]> yeah, D sounds pretty awesome from the little i've heard about it
Sep 16 00:39:27 <[31d1]> i started programming so i could one day write audio sequencing stuff and years later i am still baffled by most of that stuff
Sep 16 00:47:50 <pupnik> we could use a simple multitrack song-idea-sketch app for the nokia
Sep 16 00:48:01 <pupnik> 8 bar blocks, recorded from mic
Sep 16 00:48:23 <pupnik> fringe app though
Sep 16 00:52:23 <Deformative> Gdc is compiling.
Sep 16 00:52:24 <Deformative> :)
Sep 16 00:52:25 <Deformative> Hope it works
Sep 16 00:53:44 <Deformative> One of the best things about D is that is compiles VERY fast.
Sep 16 00:53:58 <Deformative> So that should be GREAT for a low power device.
Sep 16 00:55:01 <pupnik> what fantastic app have you written under d?  url pls
Sep 16 00:55:03 <bearclaw_> Why would you care? You rarely if not never compile stuffs while using the device on battery
Sep 16 00:55:33 <Deformative> pupnik: I am part of yage3d.net
Sep 16 00:56:59 <pupnik> lets hope the next tablet has opengl support
Sep 16 00:57:35 <pupnik> i have a great game that needs optimization - 3d - all software
Sep 16 00:58:02 <Deformative> Ugh damnit.
Sep 16 00:58:05 <Deformative> Build error
Sep 16 00:58:46 <pupnik> nogravity
Sep 16 00:59:45 <Deformative> It's not that great.
Sep 16 01:00:01 <Deformative> I haven't had a longterm project yet.
Sep 16 01:01:05 <pupnik> this world is full of awesome things you can do
Sep 16 01:01:19 <pupnik> opportunities all over
Sep 16 01:01:23 <Deformative> Everything has been done.
Sep 16 01:01:30 <pupnik> not on the tablets!
Sep 16 01:01:33 <Deformative> Yeah
Sep 16 01:01:37 <Deformative> That's why I got one.
Sep 16 01:02:04 <pupnik> if anyone here doesn't have something to do, let me know.
Sep 16 01:03:24 <pupnik> lots of heroes in this channel
Sep 16 01:03:26 <Deformative> I am porting gdc
Sep 16 01:03:30 <Deformative> Then I am going to make some stuff I need, followed by a top down rewrite of things I have but do not function properly
Sep 16 01:03:43 <Deformative> Huh?
Sep 16 01:03:59 <pupnik> that's cool.  i don't understand your motivations at all.  but follow your muse etc
Sep 16 01:04:18 <Deformative> Heh
Sep 16 01:06:01 <pupnik> i don't understand the mono and python guys either
Sep 16 01:06:09 <pupnik> but they all enrich the platform
Sep 16 01:07:02 <pupnik> did you get scratchbox running?
Sep 16 01:07:30 <Deformative> I had to install ubuntu
Sep 16 01:07:31 <Deformative> But yes.
Sep 16 01:17:16 <[31d1]> please write midi sequencer/editor for 770 in D, pls, thx in advance
Sep 16 01:18:04 <[31d1]> s/in D, //
Sep 16 01:18:05 <infobot> [31d1] meant: please write midi sequencer/editor for 770 pls, thx in advance
Sep 16 01:18:28 <bearclaw_> nice feat
Sep 16 01:19:40 <pupnik> timidity is compiled, by me and somebody else
Sep 16 01:20:33 <solmumaha> yay, ruby bindings seem to work fine for simple things at least
Sep 16 02:14:01 <Deformative> In scratchbox am I supposed to use glibc 2.5 or the one without a version number?
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Sun Sep 16 02:59:56 2007