**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sat Nov 24 02:59:57 2007
Nov 24 03:56:09 <dasurfrdude> Hello, does anyone have a second to give me a little run down on the osso-xterm?
Nov 24 03:56:32 <dasurfrdude> im not totally new at it, i just need a question or two answered
Nov 24 03:58:00 <dasurfrdude> wow is everyone AFK?
Nov 24 04:03:28 <penguinbait> what questions?
Nov 24 04:06:56 <dasurfrdude> well, i came across this game called the mana world or something of that fancy ona forum
Nov 24 04:07:12 <dasurfrdude> andi thought i would try it out, but oyu have to install it via xterm
Nov 24 04:07:14 <penguinbait> internettablettalk
Nov 24 04:07:15 <_Monkey> internettablettalk is too dark
Nov 24 04:07:20 <dasurfrdude> yes
Nov 24 04:07:21 <dasurfrdude> lol
Nov 24 04:07:27 <penguinbait> ok
Nov 24 04:07:29 <dasurfrdude> well i couldnt get superuser or root to work
Nov 24 04:07:34 <dasurfrdude> so i used ssh
Nov 24 04:07:41 <penguinbait> ok
Nov 24 04:07:50 <dasurfrdude> and logged in as root@localhost blah blah blah
Nov 24 04:07:52 <penguinbait> so you were able to login as root over ssh
Nov 24 04:07:55 <penguinbait> ok
Nov 24 04:08:10 <penguinbait> im with you so far
Nov 24 04:08:27 <dasurfrdude> i had all the deb's and lib's on mmc2 and ran them via dpkg -i package.deb
Nov 24 04:08:32 <dasurfrdude> it did some business
Nov 24 04:08:39 <dasurfrdude> and thats as far as i got
Nov 24 04:08:40 <penguinbait> k
Nov 24 04:08:58 <penguinbait> so did it install or give error?
Nov 24 04:08:59 <dasurfrdude> how do i run it?
Nov 24 04:09:02 <penguinbait> ah
Nov 24 04:09:03 <dasurfrdude> i got no error
Nov 24 04:09:10 <dasurfrdude> so i assume good install
Nov 24 04:09:18 <penguinbait> I am not familiar with it
Nov 24 04:09:20 <penguinbait> but
Nov 24 04:09:47 <penguinbait> try type m and hit tab, this will tell you all the progs that start with m
Nov 24 04:10:01 <dasurfrdude> hold on
Nov 24 04:10:04 <dasurfrdude> lemme grab my nokia
Nov 24 04:10:26 <pupnik> dasurfrdude: if you need any help lemme know
Nov 24 04:10:31 <penguinbait> I am not sure how to start it, you need to type the prog name
Nov 24 04:10:48 <penguinbait> pupnik jump in, I am not familiar with manaworld
Nov 24 04:11:02 <pupnik> well i can start it but it can't connect on a 770 for some strange reason
Nov 24 04:11:12 <penguinbait> just trying to help out
Nov 24 04:11:34 <pupnik> i think you start with 'tmw'
Nov 24 04:12:32 <dasurfrdude> ok im back
Nov 24 04:12:35 <dasurfrdude> i have a n800
Nov 24 04:12:42 <dasurfrdude> with red pill enabled atm
Nov 24 04:12:50 <penguinbait> pupnik says run twm
Nov 24 04:13:01 <dasurfrdude> here, im going to start from scratch
Nov 24 04:13:06 <penguinbait> sorry tmw
Nov 24 04:13:06 <dasurfrdude> well how do i do that?
Nov 24 04:13:29 <penguinbait> type in xterm and hit enter
Nov 24 04:13:43 <dasurfrdude> well how do i do that?
Nov 24 04:13:46 <dasurfrdude> oops
Nov 24 04:13:48 <dasurfrdude> sorry
Nov 24 04:14:19 <penguinbait> where is da surfer dude from?
Nov 24 04:14:26 <dasurfrdude> texas
Nov 24 04:14:28 <dasurfrdude> houston area
Nov 24 04:14:44 <dasurfrdude> why?
Nov 24 04:14:53 <penguinbait> what size waves down there?
Nov 24 04:14:58 <penguinbait> just nosey :)
Nov 24 04:15:05 <penguinbait> I am up in michigan
Nov 24 04:15:24 <dasurfrdude> very very small
Nov 24 04:15:25 <dasurfrdude> lol
Nov 24 04:15:29 <dasurfrdude> i dont surf anymor
Nov 24 04:15:31 <dasurfrdude> i wakeboard
Nov 24 04:15:46 <penguinbait> need to head to honolulu
Nov 24 04:15:54 <dasurfrdude> haha yeah right
Nov 24 04:15:57 <dasurfrdude> i will die
Nov 24 04:16:19 <dasurfrdude> ok im in xterm
Nov 24 04:16:23 <penguinbait> I went there years ago, 14ft wave 10ft offshore
Nov 24 04:16:33 <dasurfrdude> what would be something nice to type so xterm will run tmw?
Nov 24 04:16:50 <penguinbait> tmw
Nov 24 04:16:53 <penguinbait> enter
Nov 24 04:17:05 <dasurfrdude> tmw now found :-/
Nov 24 04:17:13 <dasurfrdude> im going to re-install
Nov 24 04:17:14 <penguinbait> pupnik?
Nov 24 04:17:25 <penguinbait> maybethe name was wrong
Nov 24 04:17:27 <pupnik> i have to check the package
Nov 24 04:17:40 <dasurfrdude> would be a problem on my end or your end?
Nov 24 04:18:04 <pupnik> i don't remumbur where tmw installs stuff
Nov 24 04:18:26 <penguinbait> do you have it installed pupnik?
Nov 24 04:18:26 <dasurfrdude> i spend a good hour using 'ls' and 'cd'
Nov 24 04:18:28 <dasurfrdude> lol
Nov 24 04:18:37 <pupnik> yeah it should be in /usr/bin/tmw
Nov 24 04:18:45 <pupnik> checking pkg now
Nov 24 04:19:31 <pupnik> argh
Nov 24 04:19:38 <dasurfrdude> argh is bad
Nov 24 04:19:47 <pupnik> are you in xterm?
Nov 24 04:19:57 <dasurfrdude> yes
Nov 24 04:20:10 <pupnik> as root?
Nov 24 04:20:22 <dasurfrdude> but i just uninstalled tmw and data via ap manager
Nov 24 04:20:25 <dasurfrdude> not yet
Nov 24 04:20:32 <dasurfrdude> i can ssh real quick
Nov 24 04:21:00 <pupnik> ok uhm well i need to repackage this but i can get you running in a jiffy
Nov 24 04:21:06 <pupnik> reinstall the debs
Nov 24 04:21:10 <dasurfrdude> ok
Nov 24 04:21:12 <pupnik> then grab the config
Nov 24 04:21:12 <dasurfrdude> hold on
Nov 24 04:21:20 <pupnik> mkdir /home/user/.tmw
Nov 24 04:21:49 <pupnik> download the config file and mv config.xml /home/user/.tmw
Nov 24 04:22:06 <pupnik> then mv /usr/games/tmw /usr/bin/tmw
Nov 24 04:23:25 <penguinbait> Man and people complain about installing KDE :)
Nov 24 04:24:04 <penguinbait> where is pupnik located on the planet?
Nov 24 04:24:20 <dasurfrdude> wait, i can put kde on my n800?!
Nov 24 04:24:33 <cesman> yes
Nov 24 04:24:33 <pupnik> germany.  this is all just a plot to teach tablet users basic linux commands, penguinbait
Nov 24 04:24:46 <dasurfrdude> well nevermind that
Nov 24 04:24:49 <penguinbait> hehe
Nov 24 04:24:58 <dasurfrdude> ok i have all debs and libs on mmc2/Tmw/
Nov 24 04:25:06 <penguinbait> get manaworld working first
Nov 24 04:25:07 <dasurfrdude> dpkg -i them?
Nov 24 04:25:16 <pupnik> ya
Nov 24 04:25:48 <dasurfrdude> ok im in root
Nov 24 04:25:52 <dasurfrdude> installing...
Nov 24 04:25:53 <_Monkey> installing is pretty fast that way..
Nov 24 04:26:02 <pupnik> _Monkey: forget installing
Nov 24 04:26:03 <_Monkey> pupnik: I forgot installing
Nov 24 04:26:09 <pupnik> _Monkey: installing is <reply>
Nov 24 04:26:09 <_Monkey> OK, pupnik.
Nov 24 04:26:26 <penguinbait> right turn Clyde!
Nov 24 04:26:59 <pupnik> hope you've got enough space for it dasurfrdude
Nov 24 04:27:13 <pupnik> eventually the game data should go to mmc, imo
Nov 24 04:27:43 <pupnik> and lets hope nokia puts a /usr/local/share on internal mmc someday, or maybe gives us a bigger flash root filesystem
Nov 24 04:28:07 <penguinbait> n810 has 2GB
Nov 24 04:28:10 <dasurfrdude> unpacking
Nov 24 04:28:14 <dasurfrdude> done
Nov 24 04:28:24 <dasurfrdude> n810 sucks dick for 550 dollars
Nov 24 04:28:28 <penguinbait> and there is a usr/local now, theres just nothing in it
Nov 24 04:28:30 <dasurfrdude> sorry, i just got my n800
Nov 24 04:28:35 <dasurfrdude> i was mad to hear another came out
Nov 24 04:28:49 <pupnik> the n800 is a really good deal though
Nov 24 04:28:58 <penguinbait> I bought my n800 in January, and my 770 a year before that
Nov 24 04:29:06 <dasurfrdude> ok so everything is unpacked and installed
Nov 24 04:29:10 <pupnik> mv /usr/games/tmw /usr/bin/tmw
Nov 24 04:29:28 <penguinbait> yeady for n810, wish it had bigger cpu and memory, but the builtin keyboard lends itself to kde nicely
Nov 24 04:30:00 <dasurfrdude> ok
Nov 24 04:30:01 <dasurfrdude> problem
Nov 24 04:30:06 <dasurfrdude> no such dir
Nov 24 04:30:12 <pupnik> heh wtf
Nov 24 04:30:15 <dasurfrdude> usr/games/tmw
Nov 24 04:30:31 <gnuite> Has anyone used the new GPS APIs in OS2007? (libgpsbt, libgpsmgr, etc.)
Nov 24 04:30:32 <dasurfrdude> oh
Nov 24 04:30:33 <dasurfrdude> oops
Nov 24 04:30:36 <dasurfrdude> i had to cd /
Nov 24 04:30:37 <dasurfrdude> :D
Nov 24 04:30:50 <dasurfrdude> done
Nov 24 04:30:54 <dasurfrdude> now what?
Nov 24 04:30:56 <penguinbait> GNUITE RULES!!! :)
Nov 24 04:31:11 <penguinbait> and um, uh no
Nov 24 04:31:13 <gnuite> Ahh, thanks, penguinbait. :)
Nov 24 04:31:21 <pupnik> now tmw should start up, but eventually you'll want to put the config.xml into /home/user/.tmw, and edit that
Nov 24 04:31:32 <gnuite> Any idea when we're getting those free N810s? :)
Nov 24 04:31:42 <dasurfrdude> woohoo
Nov 24 04:31:42 <gnuite> I guess not until December....
Nov 24 04:31:50 <penguinbait> I am still waiting to hear my coupon can be used :I
Nov 24 04:32:01 <dasurfrdude> what would be the significance of putting the config.xml in there?
Nov 24 04:32:16 <gnuite> Jussi told me we can get the freebie _and_ use the coupon.
Nov 24 04:32:25 <pupnik> i think the game creates a config.xml for you - mine just has some examples for tweaks - fullscreen and stuff
Nov 24 04:32:26 <penguinbait> really,
Nov 24 04:32:46 <dasurfrdude> ok, and i can use mv?
Nov 24 04:32:48 <penguinbait> how is the freebie obtained, I assumed the coupon was full discount
Nov 24 04:33:05 <penguinbait> that would be nice
Nov 24 04:33:06 <gnuite> Did you give Jussi your mailing address?
Nov 24 04:33:21 <penguinbait> I dont know who Jussi is?
Nov 24 04:33:43 <pupnik> dasurfrdude: i don't understand.  iirc tmw will now start up in non-fullscreen mode, and you can then enter a user/pass with bluetooth keyboard, synergy, or with xkbd
Nov 24 04:34:12 <dasurfrdude> how do i move the config file in xterm, with mv?
Nov 24 04:34:42 <gnuite> Has someone contacted you about your free N810?
Nov 24 04:34:50 <penguinbait> no
Nov 24 04:34:58 <penguinbait> I got a coupon only
Nov 24 04:35:01 <gnuite> Okay, well, I'm sure it will happen eventually. :)
Nov 24 04:35:14 <penguinbait> Now I am worried :)
Nov 24 04:35:30 <pupnik> yeah mv config.xml /home/user/.tmw
Nov 24 04:35:39 <penguinbait> maybe I will send Quim a note
Nov 24 04:35:54 <pupnik> how does one apply for the coupon?  ($75?)
Nov 24 04:35:55 <dasurfrdude> thank yo uvery uch pupnik
Nov 24 04:36:01 <gnuite> Maybe that's a good idea.  I doubt it's an issue, though, with the delay and everything...
Nov 24 04:36:30 <penguinbait> Is mapper ready on n810?
Nov 24 04:36:42 <gnuite> I don't have an N810 yet, so I have no idea.
Nov 24 04:36:56 <gnuite> There is a patched version on ITT, but I haven't been able to try it.
Nov 24 04:37:07 <[pablo]> penguinbait: there is a version that works, but I can't figure out how to get it to recognize the builtin gps
Nov 24 04:37:08 <penguinbait> Also Gnuite, I wanted to ask, any thoughts to a laptop version or maemo-mapper
Nov 24 04:37:40 <penguinbait> Maemo-Mapper is better than any other linux projust out there
Nov 24 04:38:01 <gnuite> Focusing on 770/N800/N810 now.  When I have free time (baaa hhahahaha), I'll make an arbitrary-sizeable desktop version.
Nov 24 04:38:36 <penguinbait> It really would be welcome, theres nothing close to it
Nov 24 04:38:37 <gnuite> Most of the 800x480 specifics are gone - just need to replace all the hildon_* stuff, which should be easier in Chinook, if I recall.
Nov 24 04:39:00 <gnuite> GPSDrive is kinda close to it - just need a way to get the maps...
Nov 24 04:39:17 <penguinbait> Outstanding application, best ever made for maemo, in my opinion
Nov 24 04:39:35 <gnuite> [pablo]: Funny you should mention that, because I'm trying to fix that at the moment, but libgpsbt is not cooperating...
Nov 24 04:40:09 <[pablo]> i messed around with maemo mapper for a bit and like it MUCH better than the builtin map program on the n810
Nov 24 04:40:43 <gnuite> [pablo]: Really?  Damn, I was hoping to retire when everyone buys an N810. :)
Nov 24 04:40:49 <[pablo]> lol
Nov 24 04:41:06 <penguinbait> I used maemo-mapper cross country, alongside a laptop running microsoft mappoint with a garmin, and maemomapper was much more usefull
Nov 24 04:41:33 <[pablo]> maemo mapper is much more responsive than the built-in maps program too
Nov 24 04:41:44 <penguinbait> what do yoo do in real life gnuite?
Nov 24 04:42:46 <gnuite> All: Don't listen to penguinbait, Maemo Mapper isn't half as awesome as he implies.  I think he's my biggest fan; he'd sacrifice his children for Maemo Mapper, if he could. ;)
Nov 24 04:43:28 <gnuite> I'm a professional software engineer.
Nov 24 04:43:47 <penguinbait> freelance, or for a large corporate entity?
Nov 24 04:44:24 <gnuite> Medium-sized defense contracting company.
Nov 24 04:44:41 <penguinbait> Sorry, I mentioned earlierI was nosey, feel free to tell be to bugger off
Nov 24 04:45:19 <gnuite> Nosey, yes, but you haven't crossed the line quite yet.... :)
Nov 24 04:45:33 <penguinbait> I am picturing you writing software to fly those little airplane drones aroung the planet
Nov 24 04:46:02 <penguinbait> s/aroung/around
Nov 24 04:46:54 <pupnik> lets get color weather radar into mapper :P
Nov 24 04:47:08 <penguinbait> ooh ooh ooh
Nov 24 04:47:11 <penguinbait> :)
Nov 24 04:47:37 <gnuite> Got a repository we can use? :)
Nov 24 04:48:04 <pupnik> someone made a webpage for nokias / 800x480 with weather feeds by region
Nov 24 04:48:10 <pupnik> forgot the url tho
Nov 24 04:48:13 <captlloyd> I'm trying to install UKMP, and I need libgdbm3, and another library, I've been googling, and I can't find the repo or package I need to install first...
Nov 24 04:48:24 <pupnik> repositories?
Nov 24 04:48:25 <_Monkey> repositories is http://maemo.org/community/wiki/ApplicationRepositories  and a searchable index at http://www.gronmayer.com/n800/repos/index.php
Nov 24 04:48:33 <doc|home> I'd like to be able to download/sync the maps for a region :/
Nov 24 04:48:43 <gnuite> gps?
Nov 24 04:48:44 <_Monkey> somebody said gps was nice, though
Nov 24 04:48:48 <gnuite> libgps?
Nov 24 04:48:52 <gnuite> libgpsmgr?
Nov 24 04:48:55 <gnuite> libgpsbt?
Nov 24 04:48:56 <doc|home> finding wireless isn't always easy when you're wandering about
Nov 24 04:49:01 <captlloyd> Thanks
Nov 24 04:53:21 <gnuite> Does anyone know if libgpsbt is supposed to work at all with OS2007?
Nov 24 04:54:39 <gnuite> Because if it is, I'm at a loss as to how.  I somehow had it working 25-50% before, but now gpsbt_start is returning "Invalid argument" all the time, even with gps_saver....
Nov 24 04:57:02 <[pablo]> man, I don't know how I missed the first two generations of these tablets
Nov 24 04:57:07 <[pablo]> i absolutely love this thing
Nov 24 05:13:01 <captlloyd> Anyone use NFS on their tablet?
Nov 24 05:13:48 <captlloyd> I try to mount but my server is telling me  "illegal port 49169", I've not encountered this when using NFS from my other computers
Nov 24 05:14:09 <pupnik_> did you have to flash with a new kernel?
Nov 24 05:14:19 <pupnik_> or is nfs built-in to the n810?
Nov 24 05:14:38 <captlloyd> I flashed the newest image earlier tonight, don't know if it came with that
Nov 24 05:16:37 <pupnik_> mk
Nov 24 05:16:57 <captlloyd> It seems to be in there, but doesn't want to work :)
Nov 24 05:17:20 <[pablo]> captlloyd: there is an option to allow use of higher end ports, can't remember exactly what it is
Nov 24 05:17:23 <[pablo]> gimme a sec
Nov 24 05:18:14 <pupnik_> nfsd takes a -p param, for port num, but i thought that was negotiated
Nov 24 05:18:37 <[pablo]> captlloyd: in your exports file, on the share you are trying to use add the option 'insecure' without quotes
Nov 24 05:18:45 <pupnik_> nice
Nov 24 05:19:14 <[pablo]> and let me know if that works because nfs mount on an 810 would be sweeeet
Nov 24 05:20:45 <captlloyd> k
Nov 24 05:21:07 <doc|home> [pablo]: http://maemo.org/community/wiki/settingupnfs/
Nov 24 05:22:09 <[pablo]> doc|home: nice, thank you =)
Nov 24 05:22:16 <doc|home> np :)
Nov 24 05:24:10 <captlloyd> I think that worked, 1 sec
Nov 24 05:27:16 <captlloyd> when I did insecure my server liked that.  But now I am getting "bindresvport: Permission denied"
Nov 24 05:27:22 <captlloyd> I think I need to be root?
Nov 24 05:28:06 <captlloyd> dunno how to do that
Nov 24 05:28:30 <pupnik_> to run nfs server you must be root
Nov 24 05:28:53 <captlloyd> I just want to be a client
Nov 24 05:29:17 <pupnik_> oh on the tablet
Nov 24 05:29:20 <captlloyd> yeah
Nov 24 05:29:26 <captlloyd> that's what I get on the tablet
Nov 24 05:29:43 <captlloyd> server says that it authenticated my mount request now, but I get that error on the tablet
Nov 24 05:30:08 <captlloyd> Is there a way to get root on os2008?
Nov 24 05:30:20 <pupnik_> yeah standard becomeroot procedure
Nov 24 05:30:33 <pupnik_> ssh to the device for e.g.
Nov 24 05:30:50 <pupnik_> then you can set up a suid script to do the mount
Nov 24 05:45:46 <captlloyd> I can't figure out how to ssh in
Nov 24 05:45:51 <[pablo]> can I not use the openSSH server in os2008 to setup root access? Must I use dropbear?
Nov 24 05:53:08 <pupnik_> openssh?
Nov 24 05:53:12 <pupnik_> hmm
Nov 24 05:53:21 <pupnik_> ssh?
Nov 24 05:53:22 <_Monkey> somebody said ssh was a 'secure shell' client/server.  It lets you get access to the linux shell on a Tablet. See http://maemo.org/community/wiki/installssh2006/
Nov 24 05:53:29 <pupnik_> bleh
Nov 24 05:56:20 <[pablo]> yeah, openssh is just a seperate implementation of the ssh client/server
Nov 24 05:56:32 <[pablo]> standard on *nix machines
Nov 24 05:56:54 <[pablo]> dropbear appears to be the same but compiled for embeded use
Nov 24 05:56:59 <[pablo]> ie really small
Nov 24 07:12:04 <pupnik_> yes dropbear is smaller - it can't handle some features (blowfish compression iirc)
Nov 24 07:16:54 <K`zan> Night all!
Nov 24 07:34:16 <[pablo]> pupnik_: but I can use either one to get root access correct? there is nothing special about dropbear right?
Nov 24 07:34:25 <pupnik_> right
Nov 24 07:34:28 <[pablo]> the wiki says to install dropbear and uninstall openssh if it has been installed
Nov 24 07:34:42 <pupnik_> grglh.  that seems strange, no?
Nov 24 07:34:50 <[pablo]> it does
Nov 24 07:34:53 <[pablo]> why i asked =)
Nov 24 07:35:09 <pupnik_> so ssh root@the.tablet.ip.addr no workee?
Nov 24 07:36:38 <pupnik_> anyway one thing to remember is on os2006 and 2007 at least, 'su' doesn't work, instead use 'sudo gainroot'
Nov 24 07:36:50 <pupnik_> becomeroot?
Nov 24 07:36:50 <_Monkey> becomeroot is a quick howto to become root here http://maemo.org/community/wiki/HowTo_EASILY_BecomeRoot  and more information is here http://maemo.org/community/wiki/HowDoiBecomeRoot
Nov 24 07:37:17 <pupnik_> ssh root@the.tablet.ip.addr doesn't work [pablo]_ ?
Nov 24 07:52:25 <lopz> bye
Nov 24 08:06:30 <[pablo]> pupnik_: i tried sshing to root@localhost from the tablet, it connected okay but the rootme password didn't work
Nov 24 08:06:35 <[pablo]> did it change with os2008?
Nov 24 08:07:36 <pupnik_> hrm
Nov 24 08:08:21 <pupnik_> don't rmemenbr
Nov 24 08:08:44 <[pablo]> i haven't found anything about it
Nov 24 08:08:54 <[pablo]> i did just flash to the new version today though, might have changed there
Nov 24 08:09:05 <swetland> anyone know if the pads next to the battery on N800 have an exposed 3.3v serial port like the N770?
Nov 24 08:32:23 <pupnik_> hi unique311
Nov 24 08:46:36 <pupnik_> http://www.voipbuster.com/en/index.html  this seems to allow some free calls per week to USA - what sip client would i use on n770 for it?
Nov 24 08:59:21 <truls> anyone else having a problem with svn-buildpackage being broken inside scratchbox?
Nov 24 08:59:24 <truls> Can't load '/scratchbox/devkits/maemo3-tools/lib/perl5/site_perl/5.8.4/i686-linux-thread-multi/auto/SVN/_Core/_Core.so' for module SVN::_Core: /scratchbox/devkits/maemo3-tools/lib/libsvn_ra_dav-1.so.0: undefined symbol: RAND_status at /scratchbox/tools/lib/perl5/5.8.4/i686-linux-thread-multi/DynaLoader.pm line 230.
Nov 24 08:59:29 <truls>  at /scratchbox/devkis/maemo3-tools/lib/perl5/site_perl/5.8.4/i686-linux-thread-mullti/SVN/Base.pm line 59
Nov 24 09:06:42 <pupnik_> what is that for?  how is svn_buildpackage different from ./configure && make, or dpkg-buildpackage?
Nov 24 09:20:37 <unique311> whats up pupnik.
Nov 24 09:21:06 <unique311> would give voipbuster a try..but my doesn't have a working OS on it.
Nov 24 09:21:29 <unique311> think it still has poky on it. waiting for  2008 before i relash
Nov 24 09:21:31 <unique311> lol
Nov 24 09:22:53 <pupnik_> heh
Nov 24 09:23:06 <pupnik_> well gizmo seems to be a pain - i wouldn't call people enough with it
Nov 24 09:23:21 <pupnik_> so i'll probably activate sip through my telco
Nov 24 09:23:55 <pupnik_> and that voipbuster needs a windows program to verify a registration - doesn't seem to work on my box (wine)
Nov 24 09:25:06 <unique311> i setup an account a while back with freecalls and another free(something)
Nov 24 09:25:27 <unique311> to my amazement it was still working last time i checked on my IT
Nov 24 09:25:41 <unique311> but only use it when i had to.
Nov 24 09:29:55 <pupnik_> mmh ..  bbl
Nov 24 09:50:34 <unique311> os2008 update....am i late
Nov 24 09:50:40 <unique311> for the n810
Nov 24 09:52:13 <unique311> is this the brick your n800 update?
Nov 24 09:53:16 <[pablo]> haven't tried it on an 800
Nov 24 09:53:40 <unique311> tempted...but i think i needs to wait
Nov 24 09:53:47 <unique311> don't ever want to be first.
Nov 24 09:54:40 <unique311> but nokia is not like apple....don't think we have to worry about nokia bricking devices becuase user are impatient.
Nov 24 09:54:59 <vegai> really?
Nov 24 09:55:00 <[pablo]> heh
Nov 24 09:56:46 <unique311> RX-44_2008SE_1.2007.42-19_PR_COMBINED_MR0_ARM.bin 	NEW
Nov 24 09:56:59 <unique311> RX-44_2008SE_1.2007.42-18_PR_COMBINED_MR0_ARM.bin 	 OLD
Nov 24 09:57:37 <[pablo]> yeah, i haven't noticed anythign user impacting
Nov 24 09:57:54 <[pablo]> gps still blows heh
Nov 24 09:59:49 <unique311> you installed yet?
Nov 24 10:00:04 <unique311> [pablo], ??
Nov 24 10:00:37 <[pablo]> yeah, on an n810 though
Nov 24 10:03:44 <pupnik_> anybody happen to be on gizmo atm?
Nov 24 10:03:48 <pupnik_> to do a quick test?
Nov 24 10:04:16 <[pablo]> i can be
Nov 24 10:04:32 <pupnik_> curious about the feedback supression and quality without headphones
Nov 24 10:04:40 <pupnik_> my nick is pupnik - feel free to ring up
Nov 24 10:06:19 <pupnik_> 'all calls free status says 'inactive here
Nov 24 10:07:17 <[pablo]> calling
Nov 24 10:08:27 <pupnik_> that worked well
Nov 24 10:09:14 <[pablo]> better than I had expected
Nov 24 10:09:33 <[pablo]> my internet connection here at work is nuts though, so that might have had something to do with it
Nov 24 10:09:53 <[pablo]> i get like 15 down on a speedtest from the wired network, haven't tried it on the wireless yet
Nov 24 10:18:40 <[pablo]> woah, i didn't know the firefox browser in os2008 was firefox 3
Nov 24 10:18:51 <[pablo]> that's slick =)
Nov 24 10:29:36 <pupnik_> hows the dpad working for you [pablo] ?
Nov 24 10:31:45 <[pablo]> i have to use the very tip of my thumb/finger to press a direction, which i'm not used to, but it works great when I remember to do that
Nov 24 10:31:50 <[pablo]> otherwise I fat finger it =/
Nov 24 10:31:52 <pupnik_> grr
Nov 24 10:31:59 <pupnik_> what i feared
Nov 24 10:32:10 <[pablo]> yeah, luckily, i rarely use it
Nov 24 10:32:10 <pupnik_> going to be pretty useless for games
Nov 24 10:32:26 <[pablo]> i have not been in a position where I had to either
Nov 24 10:32:44 <pupnik_> maybe i'll add keys asdwx as alternate dpad
Nov 24 10:32:59 <[pablo]> yeah as far as gaming goes it's pretty useless as a dpad
Nov 24 10:33:35 <[pablo]> needs a clip on jostick heh
Nov 24 10:33:46 <[pablo]> clips right on top of the dpad and presses the buttons for you
Nov 24 10:34:16 <pupnik_> there are super cheap bluetooth joypads for pdas.  If someone could manufacture one that could clip onto the tablets, that might be interesting
Nov 24 10:34:55 <[pablo]> it could work just like the car mount that comes with it
Nov 24 10:35:00 <[pablo]> with controls on either side
Nov 24 10:35:09 <pupnik_> hmm.  if it's true that about 300,000 n800s were sold, you might be able to sell 5-10,000 units
Nov 24 10:35:18 <GNUton> 'morning!
Nov 24 10:35:27 <[pablo]> g'morning
Nov 24 10:35:28 <pupnik_> servus
Nov 24 10:35:33 <GNUton> [pablo]: :)
Nov 24 10:36:29 <[pablo]> or g'mo'nin' ... because it's never to early for an overabundance of apostraphes
Nov 24 10:52:30 <guerby> hi, anyone with a N810 around?
Nov 24 10:53:16 <guerby> if so does the FR PDF manual (that should be somewhere on OS2008) show a picture/drawing of the FR keyboard?
Nov 24 10:53:32 <czr> guerby, let me check
Nov 24 10:53:39 <guerby> czr, thx!
Nov 24 10:56:30 <guerby> if it's there that would be great to post the image somewhere for other kbd than EN :)
Nov 24 10:57:07 <czr> no image
Nov 24 10:57:18 <czr> not a lot of images anyway
Nov 24 10:57:26 <czr> but no image of keyboard either, or layout for that matter
Nov 24 10:57:58 <guerby> czr, thanks again for checking
Nov 24 10:58:07 <czr> np
Nov 24 10:58:12 <guerby> I couldn't find any image on the web / mailing list / forum
Nov 24 10:58:18 <guerby> may be none has been produced yet :)
Nov 24 10:58:27 <czr> maybe it's Valuable Intellectual Property(tm)
Nov 24 10:58:41 <guerby> czr, probably not copyrightable :)
Nov 24 10:59:04 <czr> ianal, but I'd guess they can copyright everything :-)
Nov 24 11:00:42 <guerby> czr yeah... I'm thinking about buying it in the US even if I pay VAT it's still only 320 euros
Nov 24 11:00:47 <guerby> thanks to USD/EUR
Nov 24 11:01:15 <czr> yeah. I'm kind of thinking getting a macmini from US when I go there
Nov 24 11:02:05 <czr> it's still not dirt cheap but apple still insists on using 1 USD = 1 EUR in pricing.
Nov 24 11:06:15 <[pablo]> czr: i can take a screenshot of the french keyboard I think
Nov 24 11:06:16 <[pablo]> one second
Nov 24 11:06:44 <czr> [pablo], it was guerby that was interested, I'm sure he'll appreciate it
Nov 24 11:07:00 <guerby> [pablo], yes I'm interested!
Nov 24 11:10:15 <[pablo]> http://flickr.com/photos/bobb/2058770879/
Nov 24 11:11:25 <ryoohki> anyone working on linux for the e90?  or even somehting like cygwoin?
Nov 24 11:11:27 <guerby> [pablo], I was thinking of the hardware kbd :)
Nov 24 11:11:46 <guerby> [pablo], thx anyway :)
Nov 24 11:11:58 <[pablo]> ohhh
Nov 24 11:11:59 <ryoohki> anyone working on linux for e90 or somrthing like cygwin
Nov 24 11:12:10 <[pablo]> i don't think they have a french version out yet
Nov 24 11:12:16 <czr> ryoohki, no
Nov 24 11:12:24 <guerby> [pablo], yep it's not for sale for sure
Nov 24 11:13:56 <[pablo]> i would imagine it would be physically the same, key for key, with the layout in the screensho
Nov 24 11:13:59 <[pablo]> t
Nov 24 11:14:08 <[pablo]> minus the numpad of course
Nov 24 11:14:23 <ryoohki>  
Nov 24 11:14:36 <guerby> [pablo], yes there are not that many possibilities :)
Nov 24 11:15:00 <guerby> I checked and cheapest EU/USA roundtrip flight I could find are about 350 EUR
Nov 24 11:15:23 <[pablo]> actually, there are more keys on the soft keyboard than the hardware one
Nov 24 11:15:53 <ryoohki>  yeah, but can it do flashblock?
Nov 24 11:15:55 <guerby> if you dump the box and take them with you, two N810 pay the flight ... about ridiculous
Nov 24 11:16:02 <czr> 350 EUR is so unfair. takes minimum of 750 EUR from here
Nov 24 11:16:04 * czr cries
Nov 24 11:16:06 <[pablo]> the soft keyboard has 11, 12, and 11 in each row from top to bottom, hardware keyboard only has 10 in each
Nov 24 11:16:25 <guerby> czr, I looked from Frankfurt to NY
Nov 24 11:16:33 <ryoohki>  yeah, but can it do flashblock?
Nov 24 11:16:36 <czr> guerby, I looked from Helsinki to Atlanta :-)
Nov 24 11:16:43 <czr> although NY could be cheaper in some cases
Nov 24 11:16:50 <guerby> czr, well :)
Nov 24 11:16:56 <czr> but it's the .fi bonus
Nov 24 11:17:12 <czr> everything costs more here. and it's further away (geopolitically speaking)
Nov 24 11:18:11 <guerby> czr, so you have a nice GDP :)
Nov 24 11:19:17 <czr> guerby, /me shrugs. somehow it doesn't translate to purchasing power :-)
Nov 24 11:19:49 <guerby> czr, yeah random PPP factors :)
Nov 24 11:19:59 <czr> yeah, broken LCP setup
Nov 24 11:20:01 * czr hides & runs
Nov 24 11:20:30 <pupnik> this is a good time to quit smoking.  since i'm going crazy anyway..
Nov 24 11:31:11 <guerby> czr, interestingly flights prices do respect FX perfectly
Nov 24 11:31:51 <czr> guerby, FX?
Nov 24 11:31:55 <czr> ah yes
Nov 24 11:32:20 <guerby> czr, sorry currency exchange rate
Nov 24 11:32:52 <czr> yeah, I got it :-)
Nov 24 11:33:14 <czr> thought about "Flaming Xenophobe" for a while, and decided it didn't compute.
Nov 24 11:33:32 <[pablo]> lol
Nov 24 11:33:55 <czr> although the F could also mean "Furry"
Nov 24 11:33:58 * czr hmms
Nov 24 11:34:23 <[pablo]> don't furry and flaming go hand in hand?
Nov 24 11:34:26 <guerby> Foreign eXchange
Nov 24 11:34:43 <czr> [pablo], no? esp if fur catches fire easily :-)
Nov 24 11:34:56 <[pablo]> exactly =)
Nov 24 11:35:05 <czr> heh. right :-)
Nov 24 11:49:01 <czr> hmm. maemo.org slow today?
Nov 24 11:49:50 <czr> also, seems that my bugzilla info is not linked to my maemo profile somehow (weird). this leads to karma from bugs being 0. any ideas?
Nov 24 12:10:59 <czr> hmm. who is the maintainer for maemo bugs?
Nov 24 12:14:57 <czr> nm
Nov 24 12:19:52 <alterego> People seem to be getting very frustrated about the delay with the N810
Nov 24 12:20:04 <alterego> I can understand it if they're paying full price.
Nov 24 12:20:30 <alterego> But for those fortunate 500, if nokia paid us as much as we're saving to wait? Do you think people would still complain ^_^
Nov 24 12:20:33 <czr> I think there was a similar delay with N800 as well
Nov 24 12:20:42 <czr> people will always complain :-)
Nov 24 12:20:49 <alterego> Yeah, I wasn't around then :)
Nov 24 12:20:50 <czr> and hello to you too, alterego
Nov 24 12:20:51 <tsavola> no there wasn't
Nov 24 12:20:57 <alterego> Good afternoon czr :)
Nov 24 12:21:05 <czr> tsavola, there wasn't? weird. there should've been
Nov 24 12:21:13 <tsavola> not this long afair
Nov 24 12:21:22 * czr nods
Nov 24 12:21:29 <alterego> I remember hearing something about problems with the discount codes.
Nov 24 12:21:45 <czr> ah. nokia-online problem then
Nov 24 12:21:47 <czr> figures :-)
Nov 24 12:21:49 <alterego> Well, with respect to the delay. I was expecting it by yesterday.
Nov 24 12:22:04 <czr> 30th is a friday as well btw
Nov 24 12:22:08 <alterego> So in my mind the delay is only just begininning :P
Nov 24 12:22:19 <alterego> (30th != mid november) :)
Nov 24 12:22:24 * czr adds more delay into alterego's brain
Nov 24 12:22:31 <czr> ah, someone said mid november?
Nov 24 12:22:50 <czr> I haven't really followed the stuff, since I didn't apply for the dev program anyway
Nov 24 12:22:52 <alterego> Yes, that was from the official announcement in October.
Nov 24 12:22:58 * czr nods
Nov 24 12:23:35 <czr> hmm. tsavola, how do I add multi-arch sources to sources.list?
Nov 24 12:23:37 <alterego> I might just auction off my discount code ^_^
Nov 24 12:23:40 <tsavola> czr: no idea
Nov 24 12:23:49 <czr> but you must know!
Nov 24 12:23:57 <alterego> Well .. That's not likely. After watching those videos on ITT
Nov 24 12:24:24 <tsavola> czr: no
Nov 24 12:24:25 <alterego> Dispite reggie's monotone and rather slow speech. The N810 _looks_ real sweet :)
Nov 24 12:24:45 <czr> tsavola, but you could. in theory
Nov 24 12:24:52 <tsavola> czr: absolutely not
Nov 24 12:25:07 <czr> hmm. I can't really convince you on this one?
Nov 24 12:25:33 <alterego> Are you talking about packages ending in "_all.deb" ?
Nov 24 12:27:07 <[pablo]> i got mine mid-november
Nov 24 12:27:10 <czr> alterego, no
Nov 24 12:27:18 <[pablo]> they just didn't have enough at release time heh
Nov 24 12:27:20 <czr> alterego, I'm mirroring repos.maemo.org
Nov 24 12:27:28 <alterego> Ah
Nov 24 12:27:29 <czr> alterego, trying to figure out how to mirror armel stuff as well
Nov 24 12:27:58 <alterego> Could you mirror downloads.maemo.org?
Nov 24 12:28:00 <alterego> :P
Nov 24 12:28:09 <czr> in theory
Nov 24 12:28:16 <alterego> You should just host it O_O
Nov 24 12:28:27 <czr> why would I bother? :-)
Nov 24 12:28:31 <alterego> :)
Nov 24 12:28:46 <alterego> I'm bored ..
Nov 24 12:28:57 <alterego> I'm lacking motivation to do anything right now :/
Nov 24 12:29:33 <czr> argh. the arm-side of the repos is broken
Nov 24 12:29:40 <czr> suspected as much
Nov 24 12:29:56 <pupnik> [pablo]: you happy with the speaker quality on the 810?
Nov 24 12:30:18 <[pablo]> i am, but i never had an n800, thoguhtfix tells me it's not as good, but it's still really good for a device that size
Nov 24 12:30:39 <alterego> It seemed pretty loud on the ITT video
Nov 24 12:30:49 <pupnik> i love electrostatics
Nov 24 12:31:39 <pupnik> no comparison to a tiny magnet and cone
Nov 24 12:32:41 <czr> haha
Nov 24 12:32:49 <czr> it wasn't a bug in the repo. at least not yet.
Nov 24 12:33:05 <alterego> The N810 shows up on the europe.nokia.com products page.
Nov 24 12:33:17 <alterego> Is that false advertising? :D
Nov 24 12:33:25 <czr> the speaker is pretty loud indeed.
Nov 24 12:33:50 <czr> "lacks bass though"
Nov 24 12:34:07 <alterego> Yeah, they should install a sub woofer ..
Nov 24 12:34:21 <czr> even a regular woofer would do
Nov 24 12:34:28 <alterego> Heh
Nov 24 12:34:39 <alterego> I don't think you can get 10mm woofers.
Nov 24 12:34:50 <czr> "I pressed 'play' and this damn thing started barking on me, just "woof woof woof" all the time"
Nov 24 12:35:01 <alterego> woooof
Nov 24 12:35:23 <czr> 155.3 MiB will be downloaded into archive.
Nov 24 12:35:23 <czr> Downloading 576 archive files using 20 threads...
Nov 24 12:35:24 <czr> whee
Nov 24 12:36:13 <alterego> Heh
Nov 24 12:36:48 * alterego yawns ..
Nov 24 12:36:51 <alterego> What to do ..
Nov 24 12:37:09 <czr> hmm. you could document how to replace the broken qemu with a working one
Nov 24 12:37:20 <czr> per target
Nov 24 12:37:22 <czr> that'd be nice
Nov 24 12:37:35 <alterego> Why would you do it per target?
Nov 24 12:37:49 <czr> no need to break things that work already (3.2)
Nov 24 12:38:01 <alterego> Right
Nov 24 12:38:10 <czr> call me a pessimist if you will :-)
Nov 24 12:40:07 <alterego> Hmm .. I could set up a ruby-maemo repository.
Nov 24 12:40:29 * alterego does that.
Nov 24 12:41:00 <czr> hmm. there's a weird inconsistency in the repositories
Nov 24 12:41:05 <alterego> ??
Nov 24 12:41:06 <czr> dists/chinook, but pool/maemo4.0
Nov 24 12:41:18 <czr> alterego, in the official repos
Nov 24 12:41:26 <alterego> Interesting.
Nov 24 12:41:28 <czr> I think I'm the first person ever to attempt mirroring that
Nov 24 12:41:35 <czr> so I'm running against all kinds of weird foo
Nov 24 12:42:15 <alterego> Know any good resources on setup/managing a debian repo?
Nov 24 12:42:28 <czr> not really. google ought to know though
Nov 24 12:42:39 <czr> hmm. seems that maemo4.0 should be the proper name for the repo, not chinook
Nov 24 12:42:47 <czr> tis fucked me say.
Nov 24 12:43:02 <alterego> Google doesn't know whether somethings good or not :P Just whether it's popular.
Nov 24 12:43:02 <czr> cause the default sources.list uses 'chinook', not maemo4.0
Nov 24 12:43:17 <czr> only whether it's linked to or not :-)
Nov 24 12:43:23 <czr> you might ask on #debian though
Nov 24 12:43:43 <czr> "Description: Debian Nokia repository"
Nov 24 12:43:44 <alterego> I'll read the one on the debian site.
Nov 24 12:43:47 <czr> I wonder what that means :-)
Nov 24 12:48:26 <alterego> In fact, setting up a debian repository is a good idea.
Nov 24 12:48:39 <alterego> If I can automate the building of rubygems into debs I'll be happy :)
Nov 24 12:50:08 <czr> bug 2374 :-)
Nov 24 12:50:09 <_Monkey> Bug 2374 might be found at https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2374
Nov 24 12:50:13 * czr is feeling powerful today
Nov 24 12:50:30 <czr> alterego, you might want to write a small wikidoc on it?
Nov 24 12:50:42 <czr> I think there are already some docs on this, probably quite vague ones, but still
Nov 24 12:51:05 <alterego> On what?
Nov 24 12:51:42 <czr> on setting up custom repos wrt maemo stuff
Nov 24 12:51:58 <alterego> Yeah, that might be a good idea.
Nov 24 12:52:07 <alterego> I'll think about it :P
Nov 24 12:52:14 <czr> lazyass :-)
Nov 24 12:52:28 <alterego> I was under the impression that setting up repositories was frowned upon.
Nov 24 12:52:31 <czr> why is it that people always complain about stuff, but never are willing to fix stuff :-)
Nov 24 12:52:37 <alterego> We're all supposed to adhere to extras/extras-devel
Nov 24 12:52:47 <czr> extras/extras-devel is under construction methinks
Nov 24 12:53:00 <czr> or at least very dependent on the issues with maemo.org
Nov 24 12:53:03 <alterego> But after not having a reply on the mailing list and continuous unsuccessful attempts at uploading to extras-devel I've given up on that ..
Nov 24 12:53:14 * czr nods
Nov 24 12:53:41 <czr> hmm. should I attempt at building my pedagodriver for N810?
Nov 24 12:53:44 * czr ponders
Nov 24 12:54:01 <alterego> Label: YourCompany Debian repository
Nov 24 12:54:43 <czr> but it's not a Debian repository, is it..
Nov 24 12:54:54 <alterego> Hmm ..
Nov 24 12:54:57 <alterego> No I guess not.
Nov 24 12:54:57 <czr> has nothing to do with Debian per se.
Nov 24 12:55:23 <alterego> Well, if Ubuntu doesn't use Debian then maemo shouldn't either ;)
Nov 24 12:55:28 <alterego> Whether Ubuntu do or not I don't know ..
Nov 24 12:55:37 <czr> let me see
Nov 24 12:56:08 <czr> "Description: Ubuntu Feisty 7.04"
Nov 24 12:56:15 <czr> for feisty/Release
Nov 24 12:56:25 <alterego> Right
Nov 24 12:56:36 <czr> alterego, http://fi.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/feisty/Release
Nov 24 12:58:33 <czr> alterego, I appended that bug
Nov 24 12:58:44 <czr> good catch. providing with a real example was a good idea
Nov 24 13:00:16 <czr> uh. out of 60 last bugs, 15 are mine.
Nov 24 13:00:19 * czr should get his coat
Nov 24 13:01:13 <alterego> Grrrr.
Nov 24 13:04:39 <alterego> Should I stick everything under extras in my repo?
Nov 24 13:05:40 <czr> I think you should think about the subrepo name
Nov 24 13:05:48 <alterego> free non-free I guess ..
Nov 24 13:05:51 <czr> neh
Nov 24 13:06:07 <alterego> subrepo name?
Nov 24 13:06:18 <czr> yeah, the "free non-free extras"-bit
Nov 24 13:06:27 <alterego> Yes, my question :P
Nov 24 13:06:30 <czr> you're free to decide what names you use there. those are debian-conventions
Nov 24 13:06:37 <czr> ubuntu uses different ones for example
Nov 24 13:06:50 <alterego> common maemo usage shows 'user' 'free non-free'
Nov 24 13:07:10 <czr> why do you think that common maemo usage is correct? :-)
Nov 24 13:07:24 <czr> is all of your code released under a free open source license?
Nov 24 13:07:29 <czr> if yes, then use just 'free'
Nov 24 13:07:31 <alterego> Consistency is more important than being "correct" ;)
Nov 24 13:07:46 <czr> imho not. especially since the env is changing all the time
Nov 24 13:08:07 <czr> but that was just my imho :-) you're free to ignore it of course
Nov 24 13:08:13 <alterego> :)
Nov 24 13:11:42 <alterego> Don't mind me whilst my computer continually kills itself ..
Nov 24 13:14:45 <barisione> I'm going to ask a stupid question, sorry but I'm playing with maemo for the first time :)
Nov 24 13:14:46 <barisione> I followed the instructions on maemo.org and now I have maemo running but with no apps (except for maemopad and hello world)
Nov 24 13:14:46 <barisione> if I start the app manager I get "Operation failed"
Nov 24 13:17:47 <alterego> Am I right in thinking that the source directory is optional? I only need the binary dirs right?
Nov 24 13:18:40 <czr> barisione, that is a bug in Am
Nov 24 13:18:59 <czr> barisione, also, the environment is meant for software development. it is not a device emulator. hence, there are no applications.
Nov 24 13:19:22 <czr> barisione, see bug 2312
Nov 24 13:19:23 <_Monkey> Bug 2312 might be found at https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2312
Nov 24 13:19:39 <czr> but I doubt you really want to use Application manager for anything
Nov 24 13:19:59 <czr> the software catalog and download feature won't work with it, even if you apply the hack for 2312.
Nov 24 13:20:16 <czr> barisione, you should use 'dpkg -i ' instead, or 'apt-get'.
Nov 24 13:21:50 <Jaffa> Anyone with their tablet handy able to download http://bleb.org/software/maemo/te201-best.avi (12MB) and tell me how well it plays in Media Player and/or mplayer on OS2007/2008?
Nov 24 13:22:16 * Jaffa has reduced the number of presets, bumped up the quality and added a sharpness filter to the output in tablet-encode v2.01
Nov 24 13:22:17 <czr> Jaffa, sure
Nov 24 13:24:42 <czr> damn. this is pretty good jaffa
Nov 24 13:24:53 <czr> some problems with fast pans, but that's just to be expected.
Nov 24 13:25:13 <Jaffa> Stuttering or just the normal tearing?
Nov 24 13:25:17 <czr> slow scenes are just perfect
Nov 24 13:25:26 <czr> normal tearing I'd say
Nov 24 13:25:28 <Jaffa> czr: that's the new "best" preset, 800kbps video, 192kbps audio
Nov 24 13:25:33 <Jaffa> Cool.
Nov 24 13:25:45 <Jaffa> czr: OS2007 or 8?
Nov 24 13:25:48 <czr> OS2008
Nov 24 13:25:49 <_Monkey> well, OS2008 is really fast
Nov 24 13:25:50 <czr> N810
Nov 24 13:25:54 <barisione> czr: thanks
Nov 24 13:25:54 <barisione> I know that it' for sw development but I would work on the telepathy-related sutff already in maemo.
Nov 24 13:25:54 <barisione> I will just use apt-get
Nov 24 13:26:02 <Jaffa> czr: cool, thanks
Nov 24 13:26:03 <czr> you want me to test on 2008/N800 jaffa?
Nov 24 13:26:14 <Jaffa> czr: Nah, I'd expect it to be identical.
Nov 24 13:26:14 <barisione> what packages do I need for IM?
Nov 24 13:26:19 <czr> Jaffa, ok.
Nov 24 13:26:27 <Jaffa> czr: And you were using the normal Media Player or mplayer?
Nov 24 13:26:34 <czr> Jaffa, normal
Nov 24 13:26:36 <Jaffa> cool
Nov 24 13:26:42 <czr> Jaffa, I don't have anything extra installed on N810
Nov 24 13:26:53 * alterego tests out his new spangly repository.
Nov 24 13:27:07 <czr> just put the url into the browser, clicked "open" and media player started
Nov 24 13:27:10 * Jaffa is going to add auto DVD-language selection and VDR-language selection based on $LANG.
Nov 24 13:27:12 <Jaffa> czr: cool
Nov 24 13:27:15 <czr> also reminded me to lower down the volume at some point ;-)
Nov 24 13:27:41 <czr> the max vol on N810 is really loud
Nov 24 13:28:05 <czr> Jaffa, what did you use as source for that?
Nov 24 13:28:43 <czr> barisione, depends on what IM you mean
Nov 24 13:28:50 <czr> barisione, apt-cache search instant  ?
Nov 24 13:29:13 <czr> or whatever you like. some stuff is in the extras repo, for other stuff (most interesting ones) you'll need to modify your sources.list
Nov 24 13:29:31 <alterego> Woo .. It werkz!
Nov 24 13:30:01 <czr> alterego, wiki chop chop. or something else :-)
Nov 24 13:30:51 <alterego> It might be working, but it doesn't mean it's finished :P
Nov 24 13:31:12 <alterego> I've only done it for chinook armel
Nov 24 13:31:23 <alterego> I've still got bora and i386 to do.
Nov 24 13:34:14 <Jaffa> czr: DVD. Coupling, series 3, episode 1
Nov 24 13:35:04 <czr> Jaffa, ah, cool. Pretty decent quality for DVD. xvid?
Nov 24 13:35:08 <czr> (output I mean)
Nov 24 13:35:38 <czr> the picture was somewhat smooth, but not embarassingly so. and certainly suprised me with the quality.
Nov 24 13:36:14 <Jaffa> czr: mencoder through tablet-encode. Xvid/MP3 audio. 800kbps/192kbps bitrates, native framerate.
Nov 24 13:36:28 * DRoBeR is back ^_^
Nov 24 13:37:07 <czr> Jaffa, native as in source framerate?
Nov 24 13:37:13 <alterego> This is a bit of a hack job anyway ..
Nov 24 13:37:53 <czr> alterego, not as much of a hack job as this one though: https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2351
Nov 24 13:38:06 <Jaffa> czr: yeah
Nov 24 13:38:13 * czr nods to jaffa
Nov 24 13:38:21 <Jaffa> 25fps for a PAL DVD
Nov 24 13:38:24 <czr> Jaffa, any idea on how long the battery will last with that quality setting?
Nov 24 13:38:40 <alterego> czr, http://maemo.rubyx.co.uk/dists
Nov 24 13:38:41 <Jaffa> czr: No idea at all.
Nov 24 13:38:42 <czr> does your pipeline do de-interlacing as well?
Nov 24 13:38:44 <alterego> That's my repository.
Nov 24 13:39:09 <Jaffa> czr: Hmm, good question
Nov 24 13:39:35 <alterego> Interesting ..
Nov 24 13:39:36 <czr> Jaffa, I'd imagine one would get better quality with de-interlaced content, since the TFT won't support interlacing anyway
Nov 24 13:39:46 <czr> alterego, hmm. it seems wrong somehow
Nov 24 13:39:57 <alterego> My pretty icon doesn't appear :/
Nov 24 13:40:01 <alterego> czr, how so?
Nov 24 13:40:09 <czr> alterego, also, you only have dists. not dists and pool like normally one would expect
Nov 24 13:40:19 <alterego> Yeah, I know.
Nov 24 13:40:44 <Jaffa> czr: indeed.
Nov 24 13:41:28 <alterego> It's a very simple repository :)
Nov 24 13:44:50 <czr> hmm. is it normal to have a binary package without the Source: tag defined in control?
Nov 24 13:44:57 <czr> or not control, but dpkg --info for example
Nov 24 13:50:44 <alterego> Well, I made a pool dir :P
Nov 24 13:50:53 <czr> good for you :-)
Nov 24 13:51:06 <czr> I'm trying to decide whether to write a repo-verification tool or not
Nov 24 13:51:29 <czr> damn if I will open a separate bug for each package.
Nov 24 13:51:55 <alterego> I need to figure out how to copy acros the maemo icon field :/
Nov 24 13:52:10 <czr> it's in the control file
Nov 24 13:52:25 <alterego> Yes, but it's not getting copied to Packages.gz
Nov 24 13:53:13 <czr> hmm
Nov 24 13:53:32 <czr> what was the icon field name?
Nov 24 13:53:45 <alterego> XB-Maemo something 26
Nov 24 13:54:06 <czr> hmm. interesting
Nov 24 13:54:18 <czr> there is Maemo-Icon-26 in one package, let me scan for more
Nov 24 13:54:22 <czr> (note the lack of XB-)
Nov 24 13:54:54 <czr> actually I think that's a bug
Nov 24 13:54:58 <czr> heh.
Nov 24 13:54:58 <alterego> XB is the tag to say that it's not a standard debian bug.
Nov 24 13:55:02 <czr> I know
Nov 24 13:55:09 <alterego> s/bug/field/
Nov 24 13:55:10 <czr> but I'l going through the Packages of the maemo repo now
Nov 24 13:55:11 <infobot> alterego meant: XB is the tag to say that it's not a standard debian field.
Nov 24 13:55:42 <czr> alterego, the icon field is not present in the repo packages.gz
Nov 24 13:55:51 <alterego> :(
Nov 24 13:55:53 <alterego> Oh well.
Nov 24 13:55:55 <czr> so, I guess it goes into the .deb, but not into packages.gz
Nov 24 13:56:03 <alterego> O guess I'll have to manually do it or forget about it.
Nov 24 13:58:29 <alterego> Grr .. I can't set the .install file for my projects on downloads maemo because it's down!
Nov 24 13:58:36 <alterego> DOWLOADS IS DOWN!
Nov 24 13:58:50 <alterego> Oh, actually it's just real slow ..
Nov 24 13:59:07 <czr> alterego, bug 2376
Nov 24 13:59:08 <_Monkey> Bug 2376 might be found at https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2376
Nov 24 14:00:10 <alterego> I might downgrade ruby-maemo from beta to alpha
Nov 24 14:14:53 <kaltsi> czr about having sources in the same directory as binaries (bug 2351) - that's how debian seems to do it too
Nov 24 14:14:54 <_Monkey> Bug 2351 might be found at https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2351
Nov 24 14:15:45 <kaltsi> for example ftp://ftp.fi.debian.org/debian/pool/main/w/wget/
Nov 24 14:18:05 <czr> kaltsi, hmm. let me see
Nov 24 14:18:19 <czr> interesting.
Nov 24 14:18:40 <czr> so does ubuntu
Nov 24 14:18:57 <czr> kaltsi, thanks, I'll append the bug report :-)
Nov 24 14:19:16 <kaltsi> no sources symlink though :)
Nov 24 14:19:23 <czr> kaltsi, yup
Nov 24 14:19:30 <czr> it's silly
Nov 24 14:19:38 <alterego> How many 500 errors can maemo.org give me in 10 minutes :/
Nov 24 14:19:42 <czr> although I understand why it exists, but still.
Nov 24 14:20:53 <czr> kaltsi, refresh :-)
Nov 24 14:21:49 <kaltsi> pointed out by kaltsi.. hehe :)
Nov 24 14:22:39 <czr> now you're immortal :-)
Nov 24 14:22:59 <kaltsi> maybe it's that Maria Kaltsi that's the first hit in google for kaltsi
Nov 24 14:23:12 * DRoBeR is away: I want to break freak
Nov 24 14:23:57 <czr> kaltsi, maybe it is!
Nov 24 14:24:07 <czr> infact, you could be her for all we know :-)
Nov 24 14:24:16 <kaltsi> me luv you loong time
Nov 24 14:24:21 <kaltsi> oops disregard
Nov 24 14:24:28 * czr is ballmer IRL
Nov 24 14:24:36 <czr> the feeling is mutual :-)
Nov 24 14:25:26 <czr> kaltsi, how did you like my other bugs from today? :-)
Nov 24 14:25:30 <czr> 2374 - 2376
Nov 24 14:25:32 <_Monkey> -2
Nov 24 14:25:38 * czr spanks _Monkey 
Nov 24 14:25:51 <kaltsi> I didn't check those.. arr should I
Nov 24 14:26:00 <czr> not really. other than for chuckles :-)
Nov 24 14:27:15 <kaltsi> I've wanted that osso -> maemo change also.. discussion raised some moans
Nov 24 14:27:17 <alterego> It's bloody cold ..
Nov 24 14:27:51 <alterego> I'm gonna have to get better windows. These ones are very drafty ..
Nov 24 14:28:27 <kaltsi> maybe that 2376 will get fixed since the hello-world is being worked on :)
Nov 24 14:29:28 <czr> kaltsi, it's a separate bug though, easy to miss that one
Nov 24 14:31:35 <czr> kaltsi, I'm thinking of writing a repo verification tool
Nov 24 14:31:45 <czr> since filing each bug separately is insane
Nov 24 14:32:00 <czr> it would generate a report of issues and I'd just update it once a night -> static pages on my server.
Nov 24 14:32:07 <kaltsi> cool
Nov 24 14:32:47 <czr> "thinking of" != going to do :-)
Nov 24 14:32:58 <czr> but I'm seeing a lot of small issues here and there.
Nov 24 14:34:43 <kaltsi> there's a lot of old crap that gets forgotten easily since things work most of the time
Nov 24 14:35:22 <czr> yup. that's why I'm thinking of a single page report
Nov 24 14:35:36 <czr> it would be blunt and work off the public repo directly.
Nov 24 14:35:47 <czr> so the only way to shut it up about something would be fixing the issues
Nov 24 14:36:01 * czr "hee hee"s on the background
Nov 24 14:36:09 <sp3000> plus, then you can deflect any criticism with "the tool did it!" :)
Nov 24 14:37:18 <czr> that is one of the things, yes :-)
Nov 24 14:37:43 <czr> but I'll see. have to finish couple of other things first, might take a stab at the tool later
Nov 24 14:38:09 <czr> also, if someone has a link to nice SVG icons with "traffic signs" with not too restrictive license, I'm all ears
Nov 24 14:38:59 <czr> wondering whether I should report a bug in apt-mirror as well
Nov 24 14:39:12 <czr> or rather, not a bug, but an issue that stops it working with maemo repos
Nov 24 14:39:36 <zerojay> Argh.. Garage down again.
Nov 24 14:39:41 <zerojay> oh.. up now.
Nov 24 14:39:42 <zerojay> nm
Nov 24 14:39:45 <czr> it's not down. it's slow
Nov 24 14:40:04 <alterego> Someone should make a good grease monkey thingy for youtube ..
Nov 24 14:40:11 <zerojay> There already are.
Nov 24 14:40:13 <zerojay> Several.
Nov 24 14:40:19 <alterego> Really?
Nov 24 14:40:24 * alterego looks.
Nov 24 14:40:55 <zerojay> I think youtube's one of the sites that has the most scripts.
Nov 24 14:41:07 <alterego> The video playback in OS2008 is pretty impressive
Nov 24 14:41:38 <kaltsi> czr look at the end of this page http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Road_sign
Nov 24 14:41:44 <alterego> But youtube renders like crap ..
Nov 24 14:41:49 <zerojay> If your video's on the mobile version, you can play it without dropping a frame.
Nov 24 14:41:57 <Jaffa> One which tidies up the page so that you don't need to scroll on an 800x480 screen
Nov 24 14:41:59 <kaltsi> czr there's that traffic signs part where you get different kinds of signs in svg
Nov 24 14:43:23 <czr> kaltsi, thanks.
Nov 24 14:43:59 <czr> ah. /me thanks germany for putting those into public domain
Nov 24 14:45:03 <alterego> zerojay, you can have that on the full version. If you wait for it to download/buffer
Nov 24 14:47:10 <zerojay> No.
Nov 24 14:47:28 <zerojay> It's not that smooth even when fully buffered.
Nov 24 14:47:37 <zerojay> Try it, you'll see.
Nov 24 14:47:44 <alterego> I use it all the time ..
Nov 24 14:47:48 <alterego> Works perfectly ..
Nov 24 14:48:11 <zerojay> It still drops frames when viewed in the browser.
Nov 24 14:48:25 <alterego>  ..
Nov 24 14:48:31 <alterego> It works perfectly for me ..
Nov 24 14:48:39 <zerojay> You just don't notice it then.
Nov 24 14:48:42 <alterego> If it's dropping frames then I've not noticed.
Nov 24 14:49:26 <zerojay> I notice it.. screen tearing and frame drops.. but it's nothing major and nothing that I find unacceptable, that's for sure.
Nov 24 14:49:54 <zerojay> But the same video on the mobile site played through media player  drops nothing.
Nov 24 14:50:00 <zerojay> Probably because there's no flash overhead.
Nov 24 14:50:52 <alterego> Meh, my N800 must be better than yours :P
Nov 24 14:51:01 <zerojay> No, just my eyes. :)
Nov 24 14:51:10 <zerojay> 20/10.
Nov 24 14:51:11 <_Monkey> 2
Nov 24 14:51:13 <alterego> I doubt that.
Nov 24 14:51:51 <czr> bleh. forgot my sf password
Nov 24 14:51:54 <zerojay> I can see scanlines on TVs 50 feet away.
Nov 24 14:52:19 <czr> I see dead people
Nov 24 14:52:32 <czr> s/people/open source projects/
Nov 24 14:52:32 <infobot> czr meant: I see dead open source projects
Nov 24 14:52:38 <zerojay> Anyways, no.. youtube isn't perfect on IT2008.. but it drops frames a lot less than it used to.
Nov 24 14:52:43 <czr> bleh, infobot is irritating
Nov 24 14:52:48 <zerojay> All the bots are.
Nov 24 14:53:00 <czr> esp ones that speak when not spoken to
Nov 24 14:53:13 <zerojay> I forgot the way to kill Monkey...
Nov 24 14:53:29 <zerojay> But when I find it, I'm just going to repeatedly kill it until the owner gets the hint.
Nov 24 14:54:52 * czr seconds
Nov 24 14:56:17 <sp3000> vote for change ;)
Nov 24 14:56:28 <sp3000> meh
Nov 24 14:56:30 <zerojay> By crashing the bot repeatedly. :)
Nov 24 14:56:50 <sp3000> didn't it used to die when you said change
Nov 24 14:57:09 <zerojay> It's Milhouse that's running the bot.
Nov 24 14:57:28 <sp3000> someone must have fixed it or there's a nuance I missed :)
Nov 24 14:58:02 <zerojay> There was something.. can't remember what it was now though.
Nov 24 14:58:19 <sp3000> change socks?
Nov 24 14:58:20 <_Monkey> sp3000: that doesn't look right
Nov 24 14:58:24 <zerojay> Hahahaha
Nov 24 14:58:27 <zerojay> Bingo.
Nov 24 14:58:30 <sp3000> ah, needs to be followed by a word, or something.
Nov 24 14:58:37 <zerojay> change servers?
Nov 24 14:58:38 <_Monkey> zerojay: that doesn't look right
Nov 24 14:58:56 <sp3000> good to know
Nov 24 14:58:56 * zerojay considers writing a macro to do it for him.
Nov 24 14:59:00 <zerojay> change diaper?
Nov 24 14:59:01 <_Monkey> zerojay: that doesn't look right
Nov 24 14:59:38 <zerojay> change pants?
Nov 24 14:59:39 <_Monkey> zerojay: that doesn't look right
Nov 24 15:00:05 <zerojay> change firmware?
Nov 24 15:00:06 <_Monkey> zerojay: that doesn't look right
Nov 24 15:00:11 * sp3000 wonders how much space an upgrade to gutsy is likely to need
Nov 24 15:00:20 <zerojay> change distros?
Nov 24 15:00:21 <_Monkey> zerojay: that doesn't look right
Nov 24 15:00:51 <zerojay> change providers?
Nov 24 15:00:52 <_Monkey> zerojay: that doesn't look right
Nov 24 15:00:53 <zerojay> This is fun.
Nov 24 15:00:55 <czr> sp3000, from feisty?
Nov 24 15:00:57 <zerojay> I could do it all day.
Nov 24 15:01:08 <zerojay> change do it all day?
Nov 24 15:01:09 <_Monkey> zerojay: that doesn't look right
Nov 24 15:01:16 <sp3000> at some point you may need to change how you do that to look like conversation ;)
Nov 24 15:01:17 <czr> sp3000, depends on how much of cruft you've already have installed. it's not much larger after the update process is complete (at least with xubuntu)
Nov 24 15:01:18 <GNUton> O_o
Nov 24 15:01:29 <GNUton> _Monkey: ?
Nov 24 15:01:29 <_Monkey> bugger all, i dunno, gnuton
Nov 24 15:01:34 <GNUton> _Monkey: ?
Nov 24 15:01:34 <_Monkey> gnuton: bugger all, i dunno
Nov 24 15:01:38 <zerojay> sp3000: No worse than the bot.
Nov 24 15:01:41 <zerojay> change die?
Nov 24 15:01:42 <_Monkey> zerojay: that doesn't look right
Nov 24 15:01:48 <GNUton> _Monkey: stupid bot :P
Nov 24 15:01:54 <GNUton> _Monkey: stupid bot :P
Nov 24 15:01:57 <_Monkey> GNUton: sorry...
Nov 24 15:02:02 <GNUton> _Monkey: aaaaaaaaaaA?
Nov 24 15:02:02 <_Monkey> gnuton: bugger all, i dunno
Nov 24 15:02:04 <zerojay> change stfu bot?
Nov 24 15:02:05 <_Monkey> zerojay: that doesn't look right
Nov 24 15:02:11 <Jaffa> Search the logs?
Nov 24 15:02:33 <zerojay> change *boom*?
Nov 24 15:02:34 <_Monkey> zerojay: that doesn't look right
Nov 24 15:03:06 <zerojay> change puke?
Nov 24 15:03:07 <_Monkey> zerojay: that doesn't look right
Nov 24 15:03:39 <zerojay> _Monkey: change death?
Nov 24 15:03:40 <_Monkey> zerojay: that doesn't look right
Nov 24 15:03:59 <zerojay> anyone have some spare change?
Nov 24 15:04:03 <zerojay> Hmm.
Nov 24 15:04:10 <zerojay> Change for a $5?
Nov 24 15:04:11 <_Monkey> zerojay: that doesn't look right
Nov 24 15:04:34 <zerojay> Who changes clothes at 5am?
Nov 24 15:04:39 <zerojay> Who change clothes at 5am?
Nov 24 15:04:50 <alterego> Someone getting dressed?
Nov 24 15:04:58 <zerojay> change your ways, evil doer?
Nov 24 15:04:59 <_Monkey> zerojay: that doesn't look right
Nov 24 15:05:53 <zerojay> change you know, it's not that bad, you dumb bot. you don't have to repeatedly annoy the shit out of everyone in the room and sit here even though no one's ever wanted you to be here in the first place?
Nov 24 15:05:54 <_Monkey> zerojay: that doesn't look right
Nov 24 15:08:15 <pupnikafk> curse you sp3000
Nov 24 15:08:29 <sp3000> pfft
Nov 24 15:08:33 <zerojay> change that to cursing infobot?
Nov 24 15:08:33 <_Monkey> zerojay: that doesn't look right
Nov 24 15:10:08 <zerojay> imdb for clerks
Nov 24 15:10:12 <zerojay> hmm.
Nov 24 15:10:15 <pupnikafk> i should have added a ;) to that
Nov 24 15:21:08 <sp3000> pfft ;)
Nov 24 15:22:55 <maddler> hi all!
Nov 24 15:22:59 <czr> hmm. I wonder whether it's possible to pit _monkey against infobot
Nov 24 15:23:08 <zerojay> They run the same software.
Nov 24 15:23:25 <czr> hmm. maybe I better not try :-)
Nov 24 15:23:54 <zerojay> change die bot die!?
Nov 24 15:23:55 <_Monkey> zerojay: that doesn't look right
Nov 24 15:31:16 <Jaffa> lo maddler. Thanks for the pointer to Quim's comment.
Nov 24 15:38:09 <maddler> Jaffa: no problem...
Nov 24 15:38:32 <maddler> I mean... after all I'm only trying to know more... :)
Nov 24 15:39:06 <maddler> and quim always had a great attitude... imho...
Nov 24 15:39:39 <maddler> Jaffa: beside that... I was considering moving all maemopeolple blogs from b2e to wordpress...
Nov 24 15:43:06 <Jaffa> maddler: As long as there are reasonably decent fluid-width, not overly silly or pervasive themes (I've finally got one I like ;-))
Nov 24 15:48:21 <alterego> Heh
Nov 24 15:52:14 <zpol> hola
Nov 24 15:52:15 <_Monkey> que tal, zpol
Nov 24 15:53:22 <maddler> Jaffa: hehehe... no problem... "actual" maemopeople won't be affected... I mean... if you feel comfortable with actual blog system... you won't have to change it... :)
Nov 24 16:07:16 <Andy80> maddler: about blogs.... can you suggest me a blog service that support the wiki syntax? blogger and wordpress are ugly when you have to publish an howto, where you have to show commands to type, code examples ecc...
Nov 24 16:07:52 <alterego> You can use HTML with blogger.
Nov 24 16:08:37 <zerojay> Andy80: Why don't you just install a wiki then?
Nov 24 16:09:23 <Andy80> zerojay: I've a wiki :)
Nov 24 16:09:39 <alterego> Why don't you use it then? :P
Nov 24 16:10:08 <Andy80> zerojay: but... when I want to publish something on Planet Maemo, for example.... I've to announce it on my blog (maemogeek.blogspot.com) and then write the complete howto in the wiki
Nov 24 16:10:28 <zerojay> so?
Nov 24 16:10:37 <Andy80> two post for the same thing
Nov 24 16:10:53 <zerojay> Just use the wiki then.
Nov 24 16:10:58 <Andy80> would be great if Blogger let me to add box-code or something similar
Nov 24 16:13:51 <maddler> andy.... there should be a WP plugin in order to support Wiki syntax...
Nov 24 16:14:11 <Andy80> maddler: really?? wooow :)
Nov 24 16:14:14 <maddler> Andy80: btw... using WP advanced editors... it shouldn't be too hard... imho...
Nov 24 16:14:58 <Andy80> maddler: advanced editors? I don't know them... I just subscribed yesterday to WP, to evaluate it
Nov 24 16:15:44 <maddler> WP editor is kinda "advanced"
Nov 24 16:16:06 <maddler> you can use WYSIWYG to write your posts...
Nov 24 16:16:11 <maddler> and adding new CSS style is easy...
Nov 24 16:20:07 <sp3000> czr: oh, actually it checks (1483M it says)
Nov 24 16:20:34 <hugol1> hi
Nov 24 16:20:40 <czr> sp3000, hmm?
Nov 24 16:20:51 <sp3000> czr: the gutsy update
Nov 24 16:20:51 <hugol1> I just bought the n800 yesterday and cant find what my root password is
Nov 24 16:20:58 <czr> sp3000, ah. right :-)
Nov 24 16:21:02 <hugol1> can anybody tell me where I should look?
Nov 24 16:21:09 <czr> sp3000, after update the size difference isn't that large. that's what I meant :-)
Nov 24 16:21:13 <zerojay> The pass is rootme.
Nov 24 16:21:30 <czr> hugol1, you'll need to enable r&d mode on the device too.
Nov 24 16:21:55 <kaltsi> czr why do you say that? it's only needed with the sudo gainroot thingy.. otherwise not
Nov 24 16:22:06 <hugol1> czr:  its not
Nov 24 16:22:06 <czr> kaltsi, it's needed with 2008 & openssh-server too
Nov 24 16:22:33 <kaltsi> czr really? didn't know that :-/
Nov 24 16:22:46 <czr> well, at least I needed it. couldn't get root login without it via openssh-server.
Nov 24 16:22:58 <hugol1> czr:  I installed the x-terminal directly into the n800, im not using ssh
Nov 24 16:23:14 <czr> hugol1, how do you plan to get root privs then?
Nov 24 16:23:33 <hugol1> using sudo?
Nov 24 16:23:43 <czr> right.
Nov 24 16:23:47 <hugol1> if I do sudo su it asks me for a pasword
Nov 24 16:23:55 <hugol1> I though maemo was based on Debian
Nov 24 16:23:58 <kaltsi> it asks for your password, not the root password
Nov 24 16:24:11 <hugol1> kaltsi:  ok, then whats my password
Nov 24 16:24:12 <derf> sudo never asks you for someone else's password.
Nov 24 16:24:21 <kaltsi> and then it says that you don't have sudo rights
Nov 24 16:24:21 <hugol1> I havent set the password nowhere
Nov 24 16:24:51 <hugol1> kaltsi:  ok, so you are saying the only way to get root rights on the n800 is through ssh?
Nov 24 16:24:56 <kaltsi> no :)
Nov 24 16:25:04 <kaltsi> I'm trying to find you a link with all the options
Nov 24 16:25:04 <|R> it's just  very easy :)
Nov 24 16:25:04 <hugol1> then?
Nov 24 16:25:06 <czr> btw, if anyone knows of a policy document describing what 'free' and 'non-free' mean in maemo repositories, I'd appreciate a link
Nov 24 16:25:07 <kaltsi> ssh is one way
Nov 24 16:25:31 * czr sees how hugol1 will manage without r&d.
Nov 24 16:25:47 <czr> although 2007 openssh doesn't require r&d for root login afair
Nov 24 16:25:54 <kaltsi> hugol1: http://maemo.org/community/wiki/howdoibecomeroot/
Nov 24 16:26:00 <hugol1> kaltsi:  thanks
Nov 24 16:26:28 <kaltsi> hugol1: that dropbear stuff is for 770. ignore it
Nov 24 16:26:48 <gla55_> hendrix castle made of sand
Nov 24 16:26:50 <gla55_> fjdfiods
Nov 24 16:26:53 <gla55_> wrong channel, sorry
Nov 24 16:26:58 <kaltsi> O_o
Nov 24 16:27:26 <hugol1> kaltsi:  ok
Nov 24 16:30:34 <kaltsi> hugol1: and if you are new then look at stuff in www.maemo.org .. there are how-to's and a wiki for all kinds of things. It seems to be quite slow at the moment though.
Nov 24 16:30:35 <hugol1> kaltsi:  I dont need dropbear but I do need openssh right?
Nov 24 16:31:15 <hugol1> kaltsi:  Ive been looking arround, allredy installed pidgin, kagu, uktube, mplayer, ...
Nov 24 16:31:32 <hugol1> the default n800 software is spartan
Nov 24 16:32:09 <kaltsi> hugol1: yep, you need ssh (or set it up in R&D mode like czr said and then you can just use 'sudo gainroot')
Nov 24 16:32:27 <hugol1> kaltsi:  whats R&D?
Nov 24 16:32:29 <kaltsi> to set it up in R&D mode you need to do it from a linux machine with the linux flasher..
Nov 24 16:32:34 * czr smacks kaltsi and hugol1 with a large trout for not believing him
Nov 24 16:32:35 <kaltsi> research & development mode
Nov 24 16:32:40 <hugol1> I see
Nov 24 16:32:48 <hugol1> guess I will try the ssh way
Nov 24 16:33:00 <kaltsi> czr well I only argued that R&D mode was not needed for the ssh ;-)
Nov 24 16:33:01 <czr> hugol1, ssh root@localhost should work
Nov 24 16:33:13 <czr> kaltsi, so only a small trout for you then!
Nov 24 16:33:29 <kaltsi> troutlet?
Nov 24 16:33:35 <czr> heh. yes.
Nov 24 16:33:44 <czr> Desktop Troutlet
Nov 24 16:33:48 <hugol1> I have read that in December the 2008 OS will be ready, is it going to be a big change?
Nov 24 16:34:05 <czr> hugol1, depends on your definition of big.
Nov 24 16:34:09 <czr> it's better yes.
Nov 24 16:34:12 <kaltsi> hugol1: it's an improvement.. maybe not big but noticeable
Nov 24 16:34:39 <kaltsi> under the hood it's big
Nov 24 16:35:07 <czr> kaltsi, that just sounds plain wrong :-)
Nov 24 16:35:14 <czr> esp when taken out of context :-)
Nov 24 16:35:22 <hugol1> oh, so its more like underground than flashy change?
Nov 24 16:35:26 <hugol1> thats good to hear
Nov 24 16:35:29 <czr> hugol1, both
Nov 24 16:35:35 <hugol1> cool
Nov 24 16:35:51 <hugol1> I had my doubts on buying the n800 and Im completely loving it
Nov 24 16:36:24 <Jaffa> There's also the becomeroot deb which enables `sudo gainroot' without R&D mode, without SSH and without any additional hassle.
Nov 24 16:36:59 <czr> Jaffa, it's difficult to find btw
Nov 24 16:37:04 <zoran> regarding so many questions about gaining root, I supose would be better to make su rein the whole thing.
Nov 24 16:37:36 <hugol1> Jaffa:  you know where I can find this deb?
Nov 24 16:38:17 <kaltsi> the wiki should be updated too
Nov 24 16:38:46 <hugol1> Jaffa:  I think I allredy found it through google
Nov 24 16:39:19 <Jaffa> czr: it is?
Nov 24 16:39:24 <Jaffa> _Monkey: becomeroot?
Nov 24 16:39:25 <_Monkey> becomeroot is probably a quick howto to become root here http://maemo.org/community/wiki/HowTo_EASILY_BecomeRoot  and more information is here http://maemo.org/community/wiki/HowDoiBecomeRoot
Nov 24 16:39:52 <czr> try finding the deb that works
Nov 24 16:40:19 <czr> or maybe I was blind
Nov 24 16:40:33 <czr> I remember I had some problems finding one which wasn't for 770
Nov 24 16:40:44 <Jaffa> It's all the same deb IIRC
Nov 24 16:40:58 * czr shrugs
Nov 24 16:42:01 <zoran> huh, just compiled centerim for freebsd. Using additional protocols made the whole thing unbelievable. Over 25 mb of source, just to get little app, that none use today.
Nov 24 16:45:44 <captlloyd> Anyone know of a good site that has wallpapers or themes for N800/810?
Nov 24 16:48:28 <zerojay> zoran: You mean centericq?
Nov 24 16:48:34 <timelyx> alterego: nokia usa has lots of bogus information on it unfortunately
Nov 24 16:48:40 <zoran> nope, centerim
Nov 24 16:48:49 <zoran> it goes after centericq
Nov 24 16:49:04 <zoran> and what a mess!
Nov 24 16:49:06 <zerojay> Oh, it's a fork.
Nov 24 16:49:09 <zoran> yep
Nov 24 16:49:12 <zerojay> It was a good program.
Nov 24 16:49:20 <zoran> looks fine
Nov 24 16:49:39 <zoran> jsut I made a mistake and included more protocols
Nov 24 16:49:48 <timelyx> Jaffa: fwiw in case it hasn't been mentioned, not all n810s have qwerty keyboards
Nov 24 16:49:58 <timelyx> some have at least qwertz
Nov 24 16:50:12 * timelyx isn't sure if there's an azerty floating around (probably not)
Nov 24 16:50:18 <zoran> somebody else, except pygi, uses im nowadays?
Nov 24 16:51:22 <timelyx> sp3000: yes, that's the bug... *bah*
Nov 24 16:51:25 <timelyx> that's so unexpected
Nov 24 16:51:31 <timelyx> is it documented in help?
Nov 24 16:51:49 <czr> hey timelyx
Nov 24 16:51:49 <_Monkey> timelyx is timelyx's mac, it has scrollback
Nov 24 16:51:59 <timelyx> _Monkey forget friday
Nov 24 16:51:59 <_Monkey> timelyx: I forgot friday
Nov 24 16:52:02 <timelyx> _Monkey friday is <reply>
Nov 24 16:52:03 <_Monkey> OK, timelyx.
Nov 24 16:53:57 <timelyx> czr: clearly nokia didn't consult me on that relnote :(~
Nov 24 16:54:09 * timelyx will need to build an xref to find out what's in that...
Nov 24 16:54:11 <czr> timelyx, me neither :-)
Nov 24 16:55:07 <timelyx> alterego: could you please file a bug documenting what goes wrong w/ vkb form entry?
Nov 24 16:55:25 <lopz> re
Nov 24 16:55:49 <timelyx> _Monkey forget Quim Gill
Nov 24 16:55:49 <_Monkey> timelyx: I forgot quim gill
Nov 24 16:55:51 <timelyx> _Monkey forget Quim Gil
Nov 24 16:55:52 <_Monkey> timelyx: I forgot quim gil
Nov 24 16:55:55 <timelyx> _Monkey Quim Gil is <reply>
Nov 24 16:55:55 <_Monkey> OK, timelyx.
Nov 24 16:55:57 <timelyx> _Monkey Quim Gill is <reply>
Nov 24 16:55:57 <_Monkey> OK, timelyx.
Nov 24 16:56:20 <timelyx> _Monkey forget buildroot
Nov 24 16:56:20 <_Monkey> timelyx: I forgot buildroot
Nov 24 16:56:24 <timelyx> _Monkey buildroot is <reply>
Nov 24 16:56:24 <_Monkey> OK, timelyx.
Nov 24 16:56:36 <zerojay> change die?
Nov 24 16:56:37 <_Monkey> zerojay: that doesn't look right
Nov 24 16:56:38 <zerojay> :D
Nov 24 16:56:50 <timelyx> someone killed _Monkey?
Nov 24 16:56:59 <zerojay> change this works every time?
Nov 24 16:57:00 <_Monkey> zerojay: that doesn't look right
Nov 24 16:57:01 * czr hopes so
Nov 24 16:57:10 <zoran> parrots speak better!
Nov 24 16:57:16 <zerojay> change he doesn't like me?
Nov 24 16:57:16 <_Monkey> zerojay: that doesn't look right
Nov 24 16:57:17 <timelyx> _Monkey forget your mom
Nov 24 16:57:20 <hugol1> Jaffa:  I have installed the repository from http://maemo.org/community/wiki/HowDoiBecomeRoot but becomeroot package doesnt appear
Nov 24 16:57:22 <hugol1> any idea?
Nov 24 16:57:25 <timelyx> _Monkey your mom is <reply>
Nov 24 16:57:30 <hugol1> (besides using ssh)
Nov 24 16:57:35 <zerojay> hehe
Nov 24 16:58:27 <timelyx> _Monkey forget yeah, DSP hacking
Nov 24 16:58:29 <_Monkey> timelyx: I forgot yeah, dsp hacking
Nov 24 16:58:34 <timelyx> _Monkey yeah, DSP hacking is <reply>
Nov 24 16:58:35 <_Monkey> OK, timelyx.
Nov 24 16:59:18 <zoran> timelyx likes to tease animals?
Nov 24 17:00:35 <hugol1> Jaffa:  my fault, I found it
Nov 24 17:01:40 <zerojay> Damn it.. the RSS feed reader's completely broken in the new IT2008 update.
Nov 24 17:01:41 <timelyx> niteOwl2: if the docs are confusing, please file a bug in bugs.maemo.org
Nov 24 17:02:15 <zerojay> Segfaults on launch every time.
Nov 24 17:04:05 <timelyx> captlloyd: you can change the hardware keyboard layout, you /might/ prefer the GB
Nov 24 17:04:13 <zerojay> Ironic, considering the release notes say "added stability".
Nov 24 17:04:18 <timelyx> (of course, then you get to type blindly, but hey...)
Nov 24 17:04:43 <timelyx> _Monkey forget internettablettalk
Nov 24 17:04:44 <_Monkey> timelyx: I forgot internettablettalk
Nov 24 17:05:20 <zerojay> _Monkey die
Nov 24 17:05:21 <_Monkey> zerojay: what?
Nov 24 17:05:50 <timelyx> _Monkey forget gps
Nov 24 17:05:51 <_Monkey> timelyx: I forgot gps
Nov 24 17:06:47 <timelyx> _Monkey forget yeah, openssh
Nov 24 17:06:49 <_Monkey> timelyx: I forgot yeah, openssh
Nov 24 17:06:51 <timelyx> _Monkey yeah, openssh is <reply>
Nov 24 17:06:52 <_Monkey> OK, timelyx.
Nov 24 17:09:41 <timelyx> [pablo] / guerby from memory the hardware keyboard is fairly different
Nov 24 17:09:51 <timelyx> because of `e
Nov 24 17:10:49 <timelyx> czr: please get my bug karma fixed ;-)
Nov 24 17:13:27 <RobAtWork> nice.
Nov 24 17:14:02 <lopz> xD
Nov 24 17:14:12 <RobAtWork> pretty necessary
Nov 24 17:15:12 <pupnik> botnet begone
Nov 24 17:15:18 <czr> timelyx, I added me-too to bug 17something
Nov 24 17:15:19 <_Monkey> Bug 17 might be found at https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=17
Nov 24 17:15:23 <czr> hah
Nov 24 17:15:32 <timelyx> _Monkey forget damn. this
Nov 24 17:15:33 <_Monkey> timelyx: I forgot damn. this
Nov 24 17:15:35 <timelyx> _Monkey damn. this is <reply>
Nov 24 17:15:37 <_Monkey> OK, timelyx.
Nov 24 17:15:57 <timelyx> _Monkey forget slow scenes
Nov 24 17:15:58 <_Monkey> timelyx: I forgot slow scenes
Nov 24 17:16:01 <czr> timelyx, how do I get list of bugs where I'm CCed?
Nov 24 17:16:03 <timelyx> _Monkey slow scenes are <reply>
Nov 24 17:16:04 <_Monkey> OK, timelyx.
Nov 24 17:16:48 <pupnik> quitting smoking is exactly like waiting for a N810
Nov 24 17:16:54 <pupnik> how interesting
Nov 24 17:17:47 <czr> timeless, 2196
Nov 24 17:22:05 <timelyx> _Monkey forget wp editor
Nov 24 17:22:05 <_Monkey> timelyx: I forgot wp editor
Nov 24 17:22:08 <timelyx> _Monkey wp editor is <reply>
Nov 24 17:22:09 <_Monkey> OK, timelyx.
Nov 24 17:22:38 <timelyx> _Monkey forget and adding new CSS style
Nov 24 17:22:39 <_Monkey> timelyx, I didn't have anything matching and adding new css style
Nov 24 17:22:42 <timelyx> _Monkey and adding new CSS style is <reply>
Nov 24 17:22:43 <_Monkey> ...but adding new css style is easy......
Nov 24 17:24:19 <czr> timelyx, you job is to undo all the stuff that monkey learns during the week?
Nov 24 17:24:34 <czr> that sounds even sadder than my job :-)
Nov 24 17:24:42 <timelyx> _Monkey forget your mom
Nov 24 17:24:42 <_Monkey> timelyx, I didn't have anything matching your mom
Nov 24 17:24:47 <timelyx> _Monkey your mom is <reply>
Nov 24 17:24:47 <_Monkey> ...but _monkey's mom is super easy...
Nov 24 17:24:53 <czr> hah
Nov 24 17:25:45 <timelyx> not officially
Nov 24 17:26:05 <timelyx> _Monkey forget monkey's mom
Nov 24 17:26:06 <_Monkey> timelyx, I didn't have anything matching monkey's mom
Nov 24 17:26:13 <timelyx> _Monkey forget _monkey's mom
Nov 24 17:26:14 <_Monkey> timelyx: I forgot _monkey's mom
Nov 24 17:26:20 <timelyx> _Monkey your mom is <reply>
Nov 24 17:26:21 <_Monkey> OK, timelyx.
Nov 24 17:26:26 <timelyx> change it?
Nov 24 17:26:28 <_Monkey> timelyx: that doesn't look right
Nov 24 17:26:31 <timelyx> good bye.
Nov 24 17:26:58 <timelyx> i mostly do this to remind people that monkey is a dumb learner
Nov 24 17:27:15 <timelyx> _monkey timelyx mostly do this to remind people that monkey is?
Nov 24 17:27:16 <_Monkey> i haven't a clue, timelyx
Nov 24 17:27:19 <timelyx> _monkey timelyx mostly do this to remind people that monkey?
Nov 24 17:27:19 <_Monkey> timelyx: wish i knew
Nov 24 17:27:27 <timelyx> hrm
Nov 24 17:27:29 <timelyx> oh well
Nov 24 17:27:35 <czr> yeah, but wasting time on _monkey isn't very productive :-)
Nov 24 17:27:48 <timelyx> it's a saturday night, it's kinda like free entertainment?
Nov 24 17:28:37 * czr nods
Nov 24 17:28:55 <czr> although I found the whole thing with moms quite funny
Nov 24 17:28:59 * czr is a sad person
Nov 24 17:29:25 <timelyx> czr: https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2196#c10
Nov 24 17:29:54 <czr> :-)
Nov 24 17:29:54 <timelyx> btw, in case you're curious, that comment is magical
Nov 24 17:30:08 <czr> it is? how?
Nov 24 17:30:14 <timelyx> if you look through bugzilla.mozilla.org, you'll find that it was used a lot
Nov 24 17:30:14 <czr> repeats the previous comment?
Nov 24 17:30:21 <timelyx> no
Nov 24 17:30:28 <timelyx> a single . on a line is ignored by mailers
Nov 24 17:30:44 <czr> and it's purpose is?
Nov 24 17:30:54 <timelyx> it's like why "From" never appears at the beginning of a line in mail
Nov 24 17:31:01 <timelyx> (you get >From)
Nov 24 17:31:18 <timelyx> it meant something like "blank line please, i'm not really done yet"
Nov 24 17:31:20 <hugol1> hi, I became root and have installed nfs support on my n800 but I can only access the nfs mount directory throught the x-terminal, anybody can give me a clue on how to access it?
Nov 24 17:31:25 <captlloyd> timelyx: I only saw English Netherlands as a keyboard layout option, was I looking in the wrong place?
Nov 24 17:31:38 <timelyx> wait?
Nov 24 17:31:47 <czr> timelyx, hmm. maybe they borrowed the syntax out of debian control files ;-)
Nov 24 17:31:53 <czr> or SMTP
Nov 24 17:31:55 <czr> who knows.
Nov 24 17:32:12 <timelyx> i have 7 choices
Nov 24 17:32:15 <timelyx> it's from SMTP
Nov 24 17:32:30 <timelyx> captlloyd: it's in control panel/text input, first tab
Nov 24 17:32:36 <timelyx> oh
Nov 24 17:32:45 <timelyx> hrm, yeah, you're right, they don't have 2 english layouts
Nov 24 17:32:50 <timelyx> try german :)
Nov 24 17:33:02 <czr> hugol1, mount it under /home/user/MyDocs/somewhere.
Nov 24 17:33:02 <timelyx> sorry, forgot they unified us
Nov 24 17:33:12 <czr> hugol1, MyDocs is the "root" for the graphical dialogs
Nov 24 17:33:12 <timelyx> the software layouts for en-US and en-GB are fairly different
Nov 24 17:33:15 <timelyx> especially wrt |
Nov 24 17:33:26 <captlloyd> hehe
Nov 24 17:33:26 <hugol1> czr:  ok, is it posible to use ln in n800?
Nov 24 17:33:31 <timelyx> from memory, VKB en-GB makes | reachable
Nov 24 17:33:53 <czr> hugol1, of course. don't know how it will affect the graphical dialogs though. do tell after you try it
Nov 24 17:34:00 <hugol1> ok
Nov 24 17:34:03 <timelyx> czr: speaking of fun bugs
Nov 24 17:35:25 <gnuite> What the hey, is libgpsbt/libgpsmgr closed-source in Chinook?
Nov 24 17:36:02 <b0unc3_> hugol1: try wizard-mounter ;)
Nov 24 17:36:23 <hugol1> b0unc3_:  whats wizard-mounter?
Nov 24 17:36:29 <hugol1> a graphical interface?
Nov 24 17:36:53 <b0unc3_> hugol1: https://garage.maemo.org/projects/wizard-mounter/
Nov 24 17:37:16 <timelyx> hrm
Nov 24 17:37:31 <timelyx> is the hover thing from being logged into maemo.org supposed to be 90% offscreen left ? :)
Nov 24 17:38:43 <gnuite> I gave up on that hover thing - it never works for me....
Nov 24 17:42:30 <hugol1> b0unc3:  my n800 doesnt like the .deb of wizard-mounter
Nov 24 17:43:26 <hugol1> it says imposible to install wizard-mounter
Nov 24 17:45:13 <b0unc3> hugol1: strange... try the .install file : http://downloads.maemo.org/OS2007/desktop-environment/
Nov 24 17:46:20 <hugol1> b0unc3:  I allredy have ln in MyDocs directory and its working
Nov 24 17:46:45 <hugol1> czr:  ln seems to work, Im going to try to play a audio file from the nfs mount now
Nov 24 17:47:03 <czr> hugol1, can you take a screenshot of the filemanager with the link?
Nov 24 17:47:09 <czr> does it look like a directory or what?
Nov 24 17:47:33 <hugol1> yes it looks like a carpet
Nov 24 17:48:22 <hugol1> I created the directory nfs in MyDocs and I can see it in file administrator (or whatever the name is in english, I have it in spanish)
Nov 24 17:48:30 <czr> carpet. cool :-)
Nov 24 17:48:31 <hugol1> but it seems the media player doesnt like it
Nov 24 17:48:34 <czr> ah
Nov 24 17:48:54 <hugol1> its stuck at buffering something
Nov 24 17:49:33 <hugol1> no, its working now
Nov 24 17:49:45 <hugol1> it took like 20 or 30 seconds to buffer but its working
Nov 24 17:49:54 <hugol1> this is so cool
Nov 24 17:50:03 <czr> with the symlink?
Nov 24 17:50:08 <hugol1> I can access all the music collection on my nas through the wifi
Nov 24 17:50:20 <czr> ok. good to hear that the symlink works
Nov 24 17:50:40 <hugol1> czr:  yes, with ln. I have mounted in /mnt/media and make a ln -s link to MyDocs
Nov 24 17:50:42 <czr> should probably work on some gui statusbar thingy for nfs/smb attaching at some point, if could be bothered :-)
Nov 24 17:51:06 <hugol1> yep, that be great
Nov 24 17:52:06 <hugol1> going to try the kagu music scaner, hope it doesnt go crazy with all the mp3 on my server hd
Nov 24 17:53:30 <hugol1> one last thing, I have tried maemo mapper, and looks great, but it doesnt calculate a route without internet access
Nov 24 17:53:38 <hugol1> is there any program that can do that?
Nov 24 17:54:05 <hugol1> it would be great to be able to download the maps, save them in the memory, and then move arround without needing a internet conection
Nov 24 17:54:17 <pupnik> yes++
Nov 24 17:54:44 <pupnik> data plan is unaffordable for me
Nov 24 17:55:29 <timelyx> programs do exist
Nov 24 17:55:35 <timelyx> and the map files are most definitely portable
Nov 24 17:55:47 <hugol1> mmm, Im guessing that kagu only looks under the music directory so thats why its not discovering my nfs shares, can anyone confirm this?
Nov 24 17:55:58 * timelyx used a phone demo booth at an airport to collect maps while waiting for a plane
Nov 24 17:56:04 <timelyx> yum, free gprs connection :)
Nov 24 17:56:11 <hugol1> timelyx:  and the program name is?
Nov 24 17:56:14 <Andy80> hugol1: wait for Os2008, you'll have Maps application :)
Nov 24 17:56:21 <hugol1> Andy80:  great
Nov 24 17:56:32 <hugol1> Im absolutely loving my n800
Nov 24 17:56:43 <timelyx> *shrug*
Nov 24 17:56:44 <hugol1> I wonder why nokia didnt make it a phone as well
Nov 24 17:56:49 <timelyx> i know they exist
Nov 24 17:57:11 <timelyx> hugol1: there are enough pages w/ speculation explaining why it's nokia probably didn't
Nov 24 17:57:31 <timelyx> but there's supposedly an n800 derivative to be shipped w/ sprint in 2008 (?)
Nov 24 17:57:40 <timelyx> i just used maemo mapper :)
Nov 24 17:58:25 <Andy80> well... for example I can connect to internet using the UMTS connection, from the device and use Skype to make a call :)
Nov 24 17:59:12 <hugol1> Andy80:  you are saying that I can use a 3g conection with the n800?
Nov 24 17:59:28 <Andy80> hugol1: no... but you can connect to your phone via bluetooth
Nov 24 17:59:44 <hugol1> Andy80:  yes, ok, but then I have to carry both
Nov 24 18:00:12 <Andy80> I've a Nokia N73, and I can connect to internet in two ways: using wifi connection, and using the UMTS connection of the phone... so N800/810 --> N73 --> Internet
Nov 24 18:00:51 <hugol1> Andy80:  yes I have a k800i with 3g as well, but the point was to carry one device only
Nov 24 18:00:57 <L0cutus> i think it is better to have 2 devices pda+cell to have the best of the 2 world
Nov 24 18:02:09 <L0cutus> wha i really need is a good pim on n800 :(
Nov 24 18:02:48 <timelyx> hugol1: so... one device means it's a lot more expensive
Nov 24 18:02:59 <timelyx> and nokia is stuck being locked to networks
Nov 24 18:03:06 <timelyx> and having to deal w/ network / device locks
Nov 24 18:03:39 <hugol1> timelyx:  dont really know what your talking about, probably nokia has its reasons.
Nov 24 18:09:20 <hugol1> czr:  just in case you want to know, I deleted the previous symlinc and I created one at ~/MyDocs/.sounds/ and kagu seems to be scaning the files fine
Nov 24 18:09:49 <czr> hugol1, ok.
Nov 24 18:13:19 <oil> what would be the best / easiest way to do automatic media transfer to n800? I'm thinking of some web-gui to mark wanted music/podcasts/videos on my mediaserver so that those files would be synced to the n800 when it will be on home wlan coverage
Nov 24 18:13:32 <timelyx> rsync ;-)
Nov 24 18:14:03 <oil> timelyx: I'm thinking of that. normally works perfectly. Just wondering how to create the web-gui for it.
Nov 24 18:14:39 <oil> maybe an directory which will contain links (ln -s) to the ablums I wish to rsync to n800 ?
Nov 24 18:14:40 <timelyx> make web gui let you generate symlinks in a drop folder
Nov 24 18:14:47 <timelyx> :)
Nov 24 18:14:54 <oil> ok. that makes sense :)
Nov 24 18:15:53 <GNUton> bye
Nov 24 18:15:54 <oil> the idea is to install n800 (when I get the local maps) to the car. when the car is in home, the files would be syncked.
Nov 24 18:16:51 <hugol1> oil:  install n800 to the car?
Nov 24 18:17:03 <hugol1> you mean fix it to the car?
Nov 24 18:17:39 <oil> anyway. n800 could be an creat car-computer. it can play all the media. do the navigation (with bluetooth gps), record route, play fm-radio etc.
Nov 24 18:18:21 <oil> hugol1: yes. that's an idea. wife said that it would be possible to make an console to fit the device.. with not too much of a cost.
Nov 24 18:19:06 <oil> and it could use gprs/3g as backup connection while on road for chat and email.
Nov 24 18:28:36 <hugol1> oil:  yep, I think I saw somewhere a linux distribution for the car, with hardware recomendations for a project like this
Nov 24 18:29:10 <hugol1> that way you could have a bigger touchscreen
Nov 24 18:29:59 <oil> hugol1: what I have in mind is something very simple. just some srcripting on the device and on the serverside.
Nov 24 18:35:18 <K`zan> Morning all
Nov 24 18:36:36 <sciboy> Morning.
Nov 24 18:36:36 <_Monkey> aloha
Nov 24 18:37:06 <sciboy> Hmmm, solarwolf would be a nice game to port.
Nov 24 18:37:50 <sp3000> oil: what sort of mediaserver
Nov 24 18:38:38 * sp3000 watches random things die while upgrading to gutsy
Nov 24 18:38:46 <sp3000> the panel just hiccuped :)
Nov 24 18:38:58 <sp3000> also, https://bugs.maemo.org/buglist.cgi?resolution=REMIND
Nov 24 18:39:38 <oil> sp3000: it's just an ubuntu laptop filled with audio and video. Can play out to the home steroes and tv. also works as upnp server. one idea is to make an script which will convert the videos to n800 suitable format.
Nov 24 18:40:56 <oil> it's laptop so that it would not (hopefully) use so much energy as it's always on.
Nov 24 18:47:38 * sp3000 "browses" downloads
Nov 24 18:49:07 <sp3000> I'm contemplating some automation to run one of the encoder scripts and syncing some folders
Nov 24 19:17:29 <oil> rsync -rvk --delete 192.168.1.1:/trans/n800/music /media/mmc2/music does the trick with links. then the next steps are to create an web page which will do the links  for wanted media.
Nov 24 19:17:55 <oil> and also how to wake up the process when the tablet is connected to home network
Nov 24 19:19:35 <oil> which mediaserver is preferred for videos? friend said that canola is best to support different encodings?
Nov 24 19:21:25 <cesman> oil: mplayer
Nov 24 19:21:26 <_Monkey> mplayer is a high-performance video player for the tablet OS: https://garage.maemo.org/projects/mplayer
Nov 24 19:22:07 <oil> thanks, I'll use that one
Nov 24 19:22:11 <lsobral> the new canola will use mplayer as the default player for videos
Nov 24 19:23:24 <cesman> nice!
Nov 24 19:24:33 <oil> one thing I'm missing is the tv-out on the device. then we could put movies  on n800 and display those on tv while traveling
Nov 24 19:24:47 <zoran> and 4 wheels?
Nov 24 19:25:17 <oil> nokia n95 has it already.
Nov 24 19:27:27 <gla55_> tvout and 3d accel are probably missing for similar reasons(using the external lcd controller..)
Nov 24 19:34:10 <hugol1> whats wrong with maemo.org?
Nov 24 19:36:23 <pupnik> leeches
Nov 24 19:39:41 <rubiks> i don't know
Nov 24 19:40:54 <hugol1> 2 hours ago maemo.org was slow, but is getting unusable
Nov 24 19:41:52 <keesj>  bug #2368 -> timeless isn't nice
Nov 24 19:41:52 <_Monkey> Bug 2368 might be found at https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2368
Nov 24 20:06:40 <pupnik> it's nice to see all the pics of the tablets, and the public showings and stuff
Nov 24 20:07:19 <pupnik> but i guess things like interviews with developers, or a bit of a show of the production facilities are ... secret?
Nov 24 20:07:43 <pupnik> could almost be a good subject for a short tv sketch
Nov 24 20:08:40 <pupnik> more advertising, more sales, more developres...
Nov 24 20:08:46 <pupnik> the mantra :)
Nov 24 20:09:03 <sciboy> I'm just glad 2008 was leaked so developers can still try stuff out on the n800.
Nov 24 20:11:47 * toresbe wves
Nov 24 20:12:12 <toresbe> is the N810 version out for N800 yet?
Nov 24 20:14:36 <pupnik> dno
Nov 24 20:15:35 <bedboi> hi there
Nov 24 20:15:36 <_Monkey> niihau, bedboi
Nov 24 20:15:48 <bedboi> stupid monkeys
Nov 24 20:16:12 <bedboi> _Monkey: a poisoned banana for you
Nov 24 20:16:13 <_Monkey> bedboi: what?
Nov 24 20:35:48 <jeff1f> N810 unboxing on the front page of digg
Nov 24 20:36:09 <vegai> Hrm
Nov 24 20:36:14 <vegai> This calls for invading America.
Nov 24 20:37:15 <pupnik> just sell your dollar reserves
Nov 24 20:37:47 <toresbe> heh, yeah, you might be able to buy an ice cream
Nov 24 20:58:28 <ThomasM> http://maemovmware.garage.maemo.org/ should be fine for developing simple apps for a new N800, yes?
Nov 24 20:59:54 <pupnik> the maemo sdk is the full-power thing
Nov 24 21:00:16 <pupnik> the vmware image is convenient to save install time, and make portable environments
Nov 24 21:00:55 <ThomasM> I'm on a Windows box for the nonce, and I'd have to do X forwarding or create a new VM for it, so this seems ideal.
Nov 24 21:01:08 <zerojay> the nonce?
Nov 24 21:01:18 <ThomasM> "for the nonce" is the same as "at the moment"
Nov 24 21:01:40 <zerojay> Ah, and where does that come from? Where is that commonly used?
Nov 24 21:02:18 <ThomasM> http://www.webster.com/cgi-bin/dictionary?book=Dictionary&va=nonce  Middle English, and generally in old books. :)
Nov 24 21:02:33 <ThomasM> I don't know that I've ever heard it aloud except from English majors.
Nov 24 21:03:20 <ThomasM> I think I've heard it in old TV shows and movies.
Nov 24 21:05:15 <ThomasM> Side question: Why is maemo.org so damned slow?
Nov 24 21:05:33 <bedboi> yep, damn slow being precise
Nov 24 21:09:00 <pupnik> ~If you're happy and you know it, syntax error!~
Nov 24 21:09:02 <pupnik> Syntax Error.
Nov 24 21:09:03 <pupnik> ~If you're happy and you know it, syntax error!!~
Nov 24 21:09:05 <pupnik> Syntax Error.
Nov 24 21:09:16 <pupnik> ~If you're happy and you know it and you really want to show it if you're happy and you know it, syntax error!~
Nov 24 21:09:20 <pupnik> Syntax Error.
Nov 24 21:09:56 <zerojay> Seg fault would have been better,
Nov 24 21:22:03 <K`zan> Yes, it would :)
Nov 24 21:23:12 <K`zan> May give that skype 3 month freebie sub to a handicapped friend, gonna have to check them out - anyone here using Skype, if so how do you like it?
Nov 24 21:23:37 <zerojay> I'd use Skype.
Nov 24 21:23:47 <zerojay> Except that they have no call-in numbers in Canada.
Nov 24 21:23:49 <zerojay> Still.
Nov 24 21:24:04 <gla55_> i use skype mostly for im
Nov 24 21:24:22 <gla55_> mostly because i know people who use it who aren't on irc..
Nov 24 21:24:46 <K`zan> She can't use a reguar phone but can still deal with keyboard and to some degree mouse, so for her it might be nice.
Nov 24 21:25:06 <K`zan> Grousy about proprietary and closed source, but...
Nov 24 21:25:27 <zerojay> She can't use a phone for physical reasons?
Nov 24 21:25:32 <K`zan> Yes.
Nov 24 21:25:48 <K`zan> VERY limited use of hands/arms
Nov 24 21:26:13 <zerojay> Wouldn't it be the same thing on the tablet?
Nov 24 21:26:44 <K`zan> She hates wincrap, but the lack of handicapped stuff for linux I am afraid is going to push her into it :-(, else she is going to sit in a corner and watch tv all day and veg.
Nov 24 21:27:16 <K`zan> Yes, it is, but I have kind of hacked her desktop system so she can use it in a limited way.
Nov 24 21:27:29 <K`zan> vs not at all.
Nov 24 21:27:41 <K`zan> Types with her nose :-/.
Nov 24 21:28:31 <K`zan> Getting SLOWLY better, but until it gets much better she deals with it as best she can, gotta give her credit for that.
Nov 24 21:29:17 <K`zan> She has found something that seems to be reversing her MS, but it is a slow process considering the medical profession (heh) damn near killed her before she found it.
Nov 24 21:29:27 <K`zan> Great spirit, I will have to give her that.
Nov 24 21:30:09 <K`zan> Rather isolated because of it, thus the idea on skype and DNS, but getting her to use wincrap is like pulling teeth :-).
Nov 24 21:30:14 <Hugol2>  K`zan have u  thought about buying a voice recognition software?
Nov 24 21:30:37 <K`zan> Hugol2: Got DNS for her, but she has a serious adversion to wincrap.
Nov 24 21:30:45 <cbx33> hey peeps
Nov 24 21:30:49 <K`zan> wb
Nov 24 21:30:55 <cbx33> hey K`zan
Nov 24 21:30:59 <cbx33> did ya get it working?
Nov 24 21:31:08 <K`zan> Sigh, no I think I screwed it up :-(.
Nov 24 21:31:13 <cbx33> ahh
Nov 24 21:31:14 <cbx33> :(
Nov 24 21:31:20 <cbx33> did you follow my tut?
Nov 24 21:31:40 <K`zan> Not sure whether I can back up and start or whether I have to wipe / reinstall from deb4 on.
Nov 24 21:31:49 <cbx33> :S
Nov 24 21:32:01 <K`zan> I started reading it, but it got a bit behind with the Thanksgiving Holiday.
Nov 24 21:32:05 <cbx33> heheh
Nov 24 21:32:23 <K`zan> THat I was totally stuffed like the turkey had a bit to do with screwing it up, I should have just gone to bed...
Nov 24 21:32:29 <cbx33> heheh
Nov 24 21:32:40 <cbx33> it's nice and easy to start again iirc,
Nov 24 21:32:42 <K`zan> Hopefully you got some good rest.
Nov 24 21:32:48 <cbx33> yeh
Nov 24 21:32:51 <cbx33> I'm all rested
Nov 24 21:33:07 <cbx33> are we any closer for os2008 on the n800
Nov 24 21:33:16 <K`zan> I think I was OK until I installed the nokia proprietary stuff into no target.
Nov 24 21:33:21 <cbx33> heh
Nov 24 21:33:45 <K`zan> Also, I am not sure I have the "cpu transparaency" stuff and whether that is important or not.
Nov 24 21:34:08 <cbx33> if you follow the tut it should work
Nov 24 21:34:12 <K`zan> Thinking I might be able to select a target and proceed from there, dunno.
Nov 24 21:34:32 <K`zan> Would feel safer just deleting the vm and starting over with a fresh deb install.
Nov 24 21:34:47 <K`zan> THis time I snapshot it before installing the sdk, etc....
Nov 24 21:35:08 <K`zan> And don't eat myself into a stupor :).
Nov 24 21:35:08 <cbx33> yeh
Nov 24 21:35:17 <cbx33> why not try it on ubuntu?
Nov 24 21:35:30 <cbx33> you could probably use ubuntu server, only a 400Mb iso
Nov 24 21:35:31 <K`zan> WAY too many USB problems with ubuntu here.
Nov 24 21:35:35 <cbx33> oh?
Nov 24 21:35:39 <cbx33> even in a vm?
Nov 24 21:35:42 <K`zan> Yes.
Nov 24 21:35:57 <K`zan> Dunno how a vm would be effected.
Nov 24 21:36:15 <cbx33> what problems exactly?
Nov 24 21:36:19 <K`zan> After all the problems, I am leery of ubuntu
Nov 24 21:36:24 <cbx33> oh dear
Nov 24 21:36:34 <cbx33> mind if I ask what version/what was the problem
Nov 24 21:36:46 <cbx33> we can take this to a pm, if people don't like the non-maemo chatting ;)
Nov 24 21:36:47 <K`zan> Don't remember exactly now, but it just had all sorts of problems with usb.
Nov 24 21:36:54 <cbx33> ok
Nov 24 21:36:54 <cbx33> np
Nov 24 21:37:36 <K`zan> Went to deb and didn't have the problems and decided to try out fedora and it doesn't either, so I just don't know.
Nov 24 21:38:04 <K`zan> Previous release of it, grungy badger or something like that :-).
Nov 24 21:41:41 <cbx33> breezy badger?
Nov 24 21:41:45 <cbx33> man not suprised
Nov 24 21:41:49 <cbx33> that's oooolllllddd
Nov 24 21:44:26 <K`zan> It was a while back now, 2 distros to be accurate :)
Nov 24 21:53:14 <sp3000> grudgy goat?
Nov 24 21:53:43 * sp3000 just upgraded and it didn't fail halfway like the two previous times!
Nov 24 21:53:58 <sp3000> it did break metacity's placement cascade though :(
Nov 24 21:58:13 <K`zan> LOL, I rather like numbers rather than clever names myself :)
Nov 24 21:58:35 <elb> Ubuntu has numbers
Nov 24 21:58:56 <K`zan> Those too, but the names ARE easier to remember :-).
Nov 24 21:59:08 <K`zan> IIRC 7.04, but it was a while back.
Nov 24 21:59:26 <elb> 7.04 was Feisty Fawn
Nov 24 21:59:37 * K`zan cornfuzed...
Nov 24 22:02:41 <kaltsi> ubuntu's numbers are the best.. 7.04 means that it was released in April 2007, and the latest is 7.10 released last month.. the next one will be 8.04
Nov 24 22:10:23 <p|> buonasera
Nov 24 22:13:54 <cbx33> yeh i like the ubuntu numbers
Nov 24 22:14:11 <cbx33> but then I'm a little biased, seeing as I was an ubuntu dev for a while ;)
Nov 24 22:26:41 <maddler> dum dee daa...
Nov 24 22:32:29 <cbx33> great tune there maddler
Nov 24 22:32:30 <cbx33> :)
Nov 24 22:36:51 <K`zan> cbx33: Per your earlier comment, is ubuntu preferred over deb4 for development?
Nov 24 22:39:26 <cbx33> heheh
Nov 24 22:39:28 <cbx33> I dunno
Nov 24 22:39:39 <cbx33> I used debian and had problems like you're describing K`zan
Nov 24 22:39:47 <cbx33> ubuntu Just Worked (tm)
Nov 24 22:39:51 <cbx33> and continues for me
Nov 24 22:39:59 <K`zan> Since I am starting over, I figured it is no problem to install much of anything.
Nov 24 22:40:09 <cbx33> yeh i get problems occasionally, who doesn't in IT, but they are much less than any other OS I've ever used
Nov 24 22:40:25 <K`zan> Doesn't matter to me, I am not wed to any distro, they all have one problem or another :-).
Nov 24 22:40:30 <cbx33> indeed
Nov 24 22:40:31 <K`zan> True, exactly.
Nov 24 22:40:42 <cbx33> personal opinion
Nov 24 22:40:46 <K`zan> I'll go snarf the latest ubuntu...
Nov 24 22:40:53 <cbx33> ko
Nov 24 22:41:11 <K`zan> An involved persons opinion :-).
Nov 24 22:41:17 <cbx33> indeed
Nov 24 22:41:23 <cbx33> though not as involved as I used to be
Nov 24 22:41:29 <cbx33> been taking a break
Nov 24 22:42:00 <K`zan> Same here, too many distros, too little time.  Spend more time doing things now than masturbating distros :).
Nov 24 22:42:07 <cbx33> heh
Nov 24 22:42:20 <K`zan> And I can get kubuntu and not have to install kde over gnome.
Nov 24 22:42:27 <cbx33> heheh
Nov 24 22:42:29 <cbx33> yup
Nov 24 22:42:33 * K`zan kde junky
Nov 24 22:42:43 * cbx33 gnome junky
Nov 24 22:42:48 <K`zan> waiting for kde for the n800
Nov 24 22:42:49 <cbx33> though atm running blackbox
Nov 24 22:42:56 <K`zan> :-)
Nov 24 22:42:59 <cbx33> this laptop is a little crappy
Nov 24 22:43:23 <K`zan> Just never got inspired with gnome, although there are some nice elements of it.
Nov 24 22:43:58 <cbx33> is maemo 4 out for development yet?
Nov 24 22:46:08 <K`zan> AFAIK, that is what I thought I was going to install...
Nov 24 22:46:15 * K`zan may be confused
Nov 24 22:46:32 <K`zan> Faster from Swedemn than the US mirror...
Nov 24 22:47:14 <K`zan> Having to wait a whole hour and 20 minutes for a dvd iso, life is tough :)
Nov 24 23:06:29 <hugol1> hi, Im trying to edit fstab in the n800, how can I do it?
Nov 24 23:06:48 <hugol1> Im trying vi, but how can I press the esc key in n800?
Nov 24 23:07:23 <Fatal> it's the backkey (circled arrow) on 770 atleast
Nov 24 23:08:13 <hugol1> Fatal:  Ill try
Nov 24 23:11:10 <kaltsi> hugol1: you could also install nano from the bora sdk repository
Nov 24 23:28:19 <hugol1> kaltsi:  got it working, now can anyone tell me or point me to a webpage where I can see how do I have to edit fstab on the n800 so the nfs share will load at starup?
Nov 24 23:38:09 <GNUton> Hi
Nov 24 23:54:43 <thoughtfix> Evening
Nov 25 00:04:44 <GNUton> thoughtfix: hey!
Nov 25 00:04:55 <thoughtfix> What's new?
Nov 25 00:05:36 <zerojay> Hey Dan.
Nov 25 00:06:34 <zerojay> Hmm.. 12 point modified default themes for IT2008.
Nov 25 00:07:06 <thoughtfix> I am without an OS2008 box
Nov 25 00:07:08 * thoughtfix sobs
Nov 25 00:07:27 <zerojay> I don't understand the long wait for us coupon users.
Nov 25 00:08:40 <thoughtfix> I don't understand it either
Nov 25 00:08:48 <thoughtfix> but it's a tough time
Nov 25 00:09:21 <zerojay> I'd have thought we should be the first to get them, but whatever... probably won't have the money to get it anymore once the coupon does come through.
Nov 25 00:09:24 <thoughtfix> Announcements, holiday season, then CES all in a row
Nov 25 00:11:43 <zerojay> I don't want to feel like an ass and complain about it because it's a huge discount, but still.. kind of feels like we were overlooked.
Nov 25 00:11:49 <harkonen> does anyone know where to get 2008OS for N800?
Nov 25 00:12:00 <zerojay> tablets-dev.nokia.com
Nov 25 00:12:04 <thoughtfix> ... When it is released.
Nov 25 00:12:10 <harkonen> oh
Nov 25 00:12:15 <harkonen> only for 810 now huh?
Nov 25 00:12:36 <zerojay> I don't think that you'd be all that interested in it right now.
Nov 25 00:12:41 <zerojay> The lack of apps...
Nov 25 00:12:52 <zerojay> The fact that RSS Reader segfaults...
Nov 25 00:13:06 <topster> does anyone know if the new skype 2.0b works on maemo? does it work with the webcam?
Nov 25 00:13:19 <zerojay> They didn't annouce it for the tablets.
Nov 25 00:13:32 <zerojay> And no, it doesn't.
Nov 25 00:13:37 <rubiks> How do I clear the "Lock Device" option?
Nov 25 00:13:46 <zerojay> rubiks: Send it to Nokia.
Nov 25 00:13:59 <zerojay> If you forgot the PIN.
Nov 25 00:14:12 <rubiks> yup
Nov 25 00:14:18 <zerojay> Yeah, Nokia.
Nov 25 00:15:08 <zerojay> That's why it's written everywhere "DON'T FORGET THE PIN!!"
Nov 25 00:15:11 <rubiks> if i'm root, can't i just clear it manually?
Nov 25 00:15:21 <zerojay> Nope, don't think so.
Nov 25 00:15:52 <zerojay> Even after reflash, it's still there (though I think someone said the older original firmwares did clear the PIN at somepoint).
Nov 25 00:16:16 <rubiks> hum well, i guess it will be cleared when i load os2008. ;)
Nov 25 00:16:23 <zerojay> No.
Nov 25 00:16:34 <zerojay> It won't.
Nov 25 00:17:25 <rubiks> there has to be something in root i can do.  its linux
Nov 25 00:17:38 <zerojay> There's not.
Nov 25 00:17:55 <zerojay> It's not like it's stored in the rootfs.
Nov 25 00:18:08 <zerojay> If it was, sure you could do something about it.
Nov 25 00:18:10 <zerojay> But it's not.
Nov 25 00:18:15 <toresbe> is OS2008 for the N800 out?
Nov 25 00:18:24 <zerojay> Not officially, no.
Nov 25 00:18:30 <toresbe> not *officially*?
Nov 25 00:18:38 <zerojay> Yes, not officially.
Nov 25 00:18:49 <toresbe> *not* officially?
Nov 25 00:18:50 <toresbe> :)
Nov 25 00:19:02 <zerojay> ...
Nov 25 00:19:17 <toresbe> zerojay: that is, is it available unofficially?
Nov 25 00:19:20 <disq> anybody got modest/tinymail debs? don't have access to my build env right now
Nov 25 00:19:24 <disq> for chinook
Nov 25 00:19:43 <zerojay> disq: I've got some that Yerga sent me from SVN if you're interested.
Nov 25 00:19:57 <disq> i am :)
Nov 25 00:19:59 <zerojay> Maybe a week old.
Nov 25 00:20:18 <zerojay> Send me an msg with your e-mail address.
Nov 25 00:20:34 <disq> thanks a lot
Nov 25 00:20:42 <zerojay> No prob.
Nov 25 00:20:52 <zerojay> I uninstalled it after playing with it for 5 minutes.
Nov 25 00:20:55 <zerojay> Looks really good.
Nov 25 00:21:25 <toresbe> zerojay: Is it available on a testing basis?
Nov 25 00:23:02 <rubiks> :(
Nov 25 00:23:45 <zerojay> toresbe: Are you the kind of user that doesn't mind having nearly no apps ported, files lots of bugs and follows maemo-developer?
Nov 25 00:23:51 <zerojay> toresbe: If not, don't ask.
Nov 25 00:24:17 <toresbe> zerojay: Yes, tmmmntja, not as well as I should, and not as ardently as I should.
Nov 25 00:24:58 <zerojay> toresbe: You'd be better off not bothering then because you'll probably just reflash back to 2007 for a few weeks anyways.
Nov 25 00:25:09 <zerojay> disq: Get it?
Nov 25 00:25:11 <toresbe> but is it really in *that* bad a state? I mean, I've read Somewhere(tm) that the release is scheduled for november
Nov 25 00:25:21 <disq> yep. great
Nov 25 00:25:33 <zerojay> No, it's not in that bad a state, but it's still unfinished.
Nov 25 00:25:44 <zerojay> And that release was pushed back to December.
Nov 25 00:25:45 <toresbe> I'll promise to file bugs. :P
Nov 25 00:26:02 <toresbe> I may well try to work on fmradio if that's not ported. It's my favoritest thing ever.
Nov 25 00:26:13 <rubiks> what is the default lock code?
Nov 25 00:26:28 <zerojay> rubiks: The user manual on your tablet is your friend.
Nov 25 00:27:02 <zerojay> toresbe: They'll be releasing an update to IT2008 for the N810 in December at the same time as releasing IT2008 for the N800.
Nov 25 00:27:33 <toresbe> zerojay: ah, OK. I can wait it out as a beta tester. :0
Nov 25 00:27:36 <zerojay> So unless you like an rss feed reader that segfaults every launch (if you even know what segfault means), I'd suggest you'd stay away.
Nov 25 00:27:49 <toresbe> uh, yeah, I know what a segfault is, thank you.
Nov 25 00:27:54 <zerojay> Just making sure. :)
Nov 25 00:28:05 <toresbe> hehe, I guess you can't make any assumptions. I'm a coder myself.
Nov 25 00:28:26 <zerojay> I made the mistake of installing the latest little update to IT2008 which states "improved stability" in the changelog and suddenly RSS just doesn't work anymore.
Nov 25 00:28:31 <zerojay> The Home applet still works fine.
Nov 25 00:28:32 <toresbe> hah
Nov 25 00:28:49 <toresbe> so, where's the link? I promise I won't complain (loudly) about how much isn't working well.
Nov 25 00:28:50 <zerojay> But clicking on a link to open the RSS feed reader just... opens the window and it dies right after.
Nov 25 00:29:10 <zerojay> I already gave it to you.
Nov 25 00:30:01 <zerojay> thoughtfix: Enjoying the eee?
Nov 25 00:30:06 <thoughtfix> Hmm
Nov 25 00:30:13 <thoughtfix> It's a combination of awesome and suck
Nov 25 00:30:13 <thoughtfix> hehe
Nov 25 00:30:26 <bvsciguy> ratio?
Nov 25 00:30:31 <bvsciguy> eh
Nov 25 00:30:32 <zerojay> I was thinking that the 800x480 resolution on that big a screen would suck.
Nov 25 00:30:51 <timelyx> keesj: heh, that's one way to look at it :)
Nov 25 00:30:56 <thoughtfix> Depends on what you want to do
Nov 25 00:31:02 <zerojay> One of my friends was leaning towards getting a tablet (especially after seeing me with mine) but is opting for the eee instead.
Nov 25 00:31:07 <toresbe> zerojay: where?
Nov 25 00:31:26 <thoughtfix> http://flickr.com/photos/thoughtfix/2061038390/in/photostream/
Nov 25 00:31:39 <zerojay> Haha.
Nov 25 00:31:42 <zerojay> Awesome.
Nov 25 00:32:02 <_|Nix|_> Woah! That thing weighs nearly a kilo ...
Nov 25 00:32:15 <toresbe> zerojay: You didn't give me any links I can find
Nov 25 00:32:15 <zerojay> Your N95 doesn't write out the EXIF stuff?
Nov 25 00:32:55 <zerojay> toresbe: Someone else asked before you.
Nov 25 00:33:11 <zerojay> Scroll up.
Nov 25 00:33:14 <toresbe> uhm, and they received what answer?
Nov 25 00:34:23 <toresbe> there hasn't been an http:// link since 22:02.
Nov 25 00:34:32 <timelyx> rubiks: i think technically as root you can clear the pin
Nov 25 00:34:36 <timelyx> it's in the cal iirc
Nov 25 00:34:49 <rubiks> ?
Nov 25 00:35:06 <thoughtfix> Whoa
Nov 25 00:35:11 <zerojay> thoughtfix: If only Canada had decent data plans, I'd pick up an N95 right away. I decided to fool around with the one we have at work and took a few pictures with it. I was impressed (though a little lost in the UI, so much more used to working on S60).
Nov 25 00:35:27 <rubiks> cal iirc?
Nov 25 00:35:27 <thoughtfix> flickr's geotagging on the N95+Shozu works perfectly. I'd better turn that off while home.
Nov 25 00:35:54 <toresbe> zerojay: hello?
Nov 25 00:35:54 <_Monkey> i heard hello was anyone using pidgen on their device?
Nov 25 00:36:06 <toresbe> zerojay: who did you tell it to? at what time?
Nov 25 00:36:16 <zerojay> Christ.
Nov 25 00:36:48 <thoughtfix> Okay... I am going to make a list of Eee "unacceptable omissions"
Nov 25 00:37:05 <timelyx> rubiks: google.
Nov 25 00:37:05 <_Monkey> i guess google is my friend and you should make it your friend too
Nov 25 00:37:19 <rubiks> ok
Nov 25 00:37:29 <toresbe> zerojay: there have been three http:// links since I joined. None of them were from you.
Nov 25 00:37:30 <thoughtfix> Like Bluetooth, kernel sources for the hardware modules, a downloadable kernel source kit, the option to extend mount points to the flash card...
Nov 25 00:37:38 <timelyx> there's even a tool for it
Nov 25 00:37:41 * zerojay sighs.
Nov 25 00:38:03 <toresbe> zerojay: *what*?
Nov 25 00:38:04 <thoughtfix> _Monkey: Pidgin works wonderfully
Nov 25 00:38:05 <_Monkey> thoughtfix: huh?
Nov 25 00:38:18 <toresbe> I'm asking for a bloody URL. That has taken me 20 minutes.
Nov 25 00:38:23 <toresbe> for fuck's sake.
Nov 25 00:38:27 <toresbe> please give me the link.
Nov 25 00:38:35 <zerojay> Open your eyes then, for fuck's sake.
Nov 25 00:38:39 <thoughtfix> ....
Nov 25 00:38:51 <thoughtfix> Yes. Insolence is exactly what you need to get what you want from IRC
Nov 25 00:39:31 <toresbe> "insolence"!?
Nov 25 00:39:52 <toresbe> so
Nov 25 00:39:58 <timelyx> toresbe: google
Nov 25 00:39:59 <_Monkey> google is, like, my friend and you should make it your friend too
Nov 25 00:40:03 <toresbe> approximately when did you answer the similar question to an unnamed individual?
Nov 25 00:40:04 <zerojay> thoughtfix: Have you been finding it useful besides using it to use it?
Nov 25 00:40:12 <toresbe> I *have* been googling before I asked the question here.
Nov 25 00:40:23 <timelyx> toresbe: it made news.com
Nov 25 00:40:29 <timelyx> i wonder what you sought
Nov 25 00:40:31 <toresbe> timelyx: but it hasn't made google, clearly
Nov 25 00:40:35 <toresbe> I don't know the appropriate search terms anyway
Nov 25 00:40:36 <thoughtfix> Well it was great for music playback and recipe keeping on Thursday. Spent the whole day in the kitchen
Nov 25 00:40:56 <zerojay> 12 point themes aren't anywhere near as useful in 2008, unfortunately.
Nov 25 00:41:04 <zerojay> Well.. I guess it is fortunate in a way.
Nov 25 00:41:07 <timelyx> zerojay: eh?
Nov 25 00:41:20 <toresbe> zerojay: can you tell me who the other fellow was that you answered, then?
Nov 25 00:41:34 <zerojay> thoughtfix: I guess the bigger screen helps when you're in the kitchen following recipies and stuff.
Nov 25 00:42:12 <timelyx> toresbe: blah. a simple google search w/ the hints you have.
Nov 25 00:42:17 <zerojay> timelyx: http://maemo.lancode.de/?path=./themes-chinook
Nov 25 00:42:17 <timelyx> if you can't figure it out, you shouldn't use it
Nov 25 00:42:40 <timelyx> heh, indeed, quite useless
Nov 25 00:42:46 <toresbe> zerojay: I finally found it in the backlog. Thanks for being completely useless, and being unfriendly in the process.
Nov 25 00:42:51 <zerojay> timelyx: Try them out, but I don't really see the point in using them on 2008 anyways.
Nov 25 00:42:51 <timelyx> your font isn't thumbable ;-b
Nov 25 00:42:51 <toresbe> You deserve a cookie, or something.
Nov 25 00:43:23 <timelyx> cookies are delicious delicacies
Nov 25 00:43:29 <timelyx> _Monkey cookies?
Nov 25 00:43:29 <_Monkey> cookies are delicious delicacies
Nov 25 00:43:32 <timelyx> good bot.
Nov 25 00:43:41 <zerojay> toresbe: Yes, I'm useless because I was the one that couldn't find an address and was perfectly friendly up until you expected me to hold your hand, which shows that you clearly aren't ready for installing it to begin with.
Nov 25 00:43:59 <zerojay> So enjoy.
Nov 25 00:44:05 <toresbe> sheesh
Nov 25 00:44:07 <zerojay> I look forward to your complaints.
Nov 25 00:44:15 <thoughtfix> mmmmm cookies
Nov 25 00:44:29 <toresbe> 01:12 < zerojay> tablets-dev.nokia.com
Nov 25 00:44:35 <zerojay> Cookies would be nice right about now.
Nov 25 00:44:39 <toresbe> that's the answer, is it?
Nov 25 00:44:45 <zerojay> toresbe: Yes.
Nov 25 00:44:53 <dasurfrdude> OMG
Nov 25 00:44:56 <dasurfrdude> http://www.news.com/8301-10784_3-9816300-7.html
Nov 25 00:44:59 <dasurfrdude> There
Nov 25 00:45:04 <zerojay> lol
Nov 25 00:45:08 <dasurfrdude> if your talking about os2008
Nov 25 00:45:12 <rubiks> what tool are you talking about?
Nov 25 00:45:54 <timelyx> rubiks: google
Nov 25 00:45:55 <_Monkey> hmmm... google is my friend and you should make it your friend too
Nov 25 00:45:58 <toresbe> so the N810 software will actually run unmodified on an N800?
Nov 25 00:46:00 <zerojay> thoughtfix: Since you seem to spend time in the kitchen, got any good recipe sites?
Nov 25 00:46:04 <toresbe> why have you been assuming I know this?
Nov 25 00:46:14 <rubiks> been looking
Nov 25 00:46:19 <dasurfrdude> toresbe: Yes. Ive done it and gone back. Nothing to worry about
Nov 25 00:46:20 <timelyx> not sure if it actually lets you change it directly
Nov 25 00:46:21 <zerojay> Because I assumed you used Google at least.
Nov 25 00:46:25 <rubiks> pdf now reading
Nov 25 00:46:27 <timelyx> but it at least explains what  acal is
Nov 25 00:46:31 <thoughtfix> oh most of my recipes are a combination of "something I find" plus "Whatever I have in the kitchen" plus "Ooops. I wonder how that will turn out."
Nov 25 00:46:41 <zerojay> thoughtfix: Haha.. okay, cool.
Nov 25 00:47:05 <toresbe> zerojay: I do use google. I haven't been using the right phrases, obviously. That's why you tend to interact with humans.
Nov 25 00:47:06 <thoughtfix> But since you asked - http://www.epicurious.com/
Nov 25 00:47:12 <timelyx> thoughtfix: ever killed anyone that way? :)
Nov 25 00:47:26 * timelyx is ever the pessimist
Nov 25 00:47:32 <thoughtfix> timelyx: An indictment is not a conviction
Nov 25 00:47:40 <timelyx> touche
Nov 25 00:47:49 <dasurfrdude> I used google. It took me one page of search results to find the news.com article.  Please do NOT argue over irc.
Nov 25 00:47:55 <dasurfrdude> Its gay.
Nov 25 00:48:04 <timelyx> it's :(
Nov 25 00:48:07 * timelyx frowns
Nov 25 00:48:12 <toresbe> wow
Nov 25 00:48:20 <zerojay> Yes, arguements sure do cause same-sex attraction.
Nov 25 00:48:22 <rubiks> i feel like a dumb ass
Nov 25 00:48:32 <zerojay> arguments
Nov 25 00:48:39 <toresbe> first, failing to use "it's" correctly, then using homosexuality as a negative. You win the intelligence award!
Nov 25 00:48:49 <dasurfrdude> Well, I can't imagine a masculine person getting pumped up in a chat room.
Nov 25 00:49:06 <zerojay> At least he was able to find the news.com article on Google.
Nov 25 00:49:07 <rubiks> lock device had default pass '12345'
Nov 25 00:49:25 <dasurfrdude> Props to zerojay :D
Nov 25 00:49:48 <toresbe> zerojay: I'd googled. "n800 chinook" doesn't get a single hit for news.com
Nov 25 00:50:20 <dasurfrdude> I googled "OS2008 on N800" the lower-intellect search phrase
Nov 25 00:50:29 <zerojay> toresbe: I guess you don't use the ITT forums or check out Planet Maemo very often then?
Nov 25 00:50:38 <toresbe> zerojay: no, i don't
Nov 25 00:50:44 <rubiks> http://nds1.nokia.com/phones/files/guides/Nokia_N800_UG_en.pdf
Nov 25 00:50:52 <zerojay> Okay, that would explain it.
Nov 25 00:50:54 <toresbe> zerojay: for fuck's sake. I asked you a question. You could've replied with a URL.
Nov 25 00:51:02 <toresbe> It's as simple as that.
Nov 25 00:51:05 <_|Nix|_> This is weird. I type "apt-cache policy libnss3" on my N800 and it tells me "http://repository.maemo.org bora/free Packages". Yet, when I add "deb http://repository.maemo.org bora free" to my N770, and run apt-get update, I get nothing.
Nov 25 00:51:09 <_|Nix|_> Very strange.
Nov 25 00:51:14 <dasurfrdude> If you ask google a question, it replies with a URL :D
Nov 25 00:51:16 <rubiks> :)
Nov 25 00:51:25 <toresbe> dasurfrdude: not the right one
Nov 25 00:51:31 <timelyx> _|Nix|_: um, we shouldn't be in bora
Nov 25 00:51:36 <dasurfrdude> It's all about selection
Nov 25 00:51:37 <timelyx> we're supposed to be in extras or something
Nov 25 00:52:03 <_|Nix|_> timelyx: OK, but this makes no sense. The same repo gives different results for N770 vs. N800?
Nov 25 00:52:09 <zerojay> toresbe: I like to help people. I do. I do it often. I don't help people that want to have their hand held through everything and that act like I owe them the help.
Nov 25 00:52:10 * timelyx shrugs
Nov 25 00:52:14 <timelyx> there's no such thing as n770
Nov 25 00:52:16 <rubiks> unofficial os2008 stable?
Nov 25 00:52:24 * timelyx slaps _|Nix|_ with a marketing letter
Nov 25 00:52:24 <zerojay> toresbe: It's not my fault you missed the URL repeatedly.
Nov 25 00:52:34 <_|Nix|_> Whatever ...
Nov 25 00:52:40 <toresbe> You _never pasted a URL which answered my question_
Nov 25 00:53:05 <dasurfrdude> OK! I posted the URL, everyone is fine now. MOVE ON
Nov 25 00:53:22 <toresbe> you pasted a URL to someone else 10 minutes before I asked my question, and after repeatedly saying "you don't want it", you then say "i've already answered" and refused to elaborate
Nov 25 00:53:55 <zerojay> toresbe: So go ahead and continue to complain and whine and whatever you choose to do. I told you that I had given the URL already and you made a lazy search through the scrollback. I'm over it and I'm going to go and have a nice dinner. Enjoy.
Nov 25 00:54:19 <toresbe> technically you hadn't given a URL actually, it didn't have the http:// prefix :P
Nov 25 00:54:33 <timelyx> you're not going to win points here
Nov 25 00:54:45 <timelyx> if you can't find it w/ google, you aren't its intended audience
Nov 25 00:54:52 <timelyx> to the extent such a creature exists
Nov 25 00:54:54 <dasurfrdude> LOL
Nov 25 00:54:56 * toresbe facedesks
Nov 25 00:54:56 <timelyx> as it isn't intended at all
Nov 25 00:55:28 <toresbe> FFS, I write microcode for CPUs, and I repair problems with a soldering iron. I kinda consider myself to be a competent person.
Nov 25 00:55:40 <timelyx> google disagrees :)
Nov 25 00:55:46 <kaltsi> _|Nix|_: I think the architecture for 770 is arm and for n800 it's armel..
Nov 25 00:55:49 <timelyx> sorry, it's 3am on what was a saturday
Nov 25 00:55:51 <toresbe> I googled for "chinook n800" and found nothing
Nov 25 00:55:54 <_|Nix|_> kaltsi: No.
Nov 25 00:55:57 <timelyx> kaltsi: no
Nov 25 00:56:00 <kaltsi> oh
Nov 25 00:56:04 <timelyx> for 2005 it was arm, for 2006/2007 it's armel
Nov 25 00:56:10 <kaltsi> ok :)
Nov 25 00:56:27 <_|Nix|_> This is weird. After adding all the extras repos, now I get "http://repository.maemo.org bora/free Packages"
Nov 25 00:56:27 <timelyx> and "architecture" is a bit of a strange word
Nov 25 00:56:39 <_|Nix|_> But, WTF?! I had that in there before adding all the extras repos.
Nov 25 00:56:41 <timelyx> _|Nix|_: apt is "special"?
Nov 25 00:56:55 <_|Nix|_> Don't get me started.
Nov 25 00:57:02 <dasurfrdude> Hey, i heard earlier someone say something about KDE on N800. Can anyone just gimme a yes or no on this?
Nov 25 00:57:11 <kaltsi> architecture as in the architecture line in debian control file
Nov 25 00:57:12 <toresbe> dasurfrdude: google
Nov 25 00:57:13 <_Monkey> google is my friend and you should make it your friend too
Nov 25 00:57:38 <_|Nix|_> My fault though ... should've looked on http://www.gronmayer.com/it/index.php?lang=en&system=maemo2
Nov 25 00:57:40 <toresbe> dasurfrdude: because if you can't find that out without google, you're an idiot
Nov 25 00:57:48 <toresbe> and you shouldn't be using a Linux device.
Nov 25 00:58:04 <timelyx> _|nix|_ according to http://browser.garage.maemo.org/news/6/ you should be able to read http://repository.maemo.org/extras/dists/gregale/install/microb-browser.install
Nov 25 00:58:10 <dasurfrdude> Lol. Shut up dude. I found it on ITT. First result. Suck it up.
Nov 25 00:58:37 <timelyx> dasurfrdude: there are people who come into this channel talking about it
Nov 25 00:58:46 <timelyx> you can read/search the log for the people
Nov 25 00:58:52 <timelyx> personally, i consider it a waste of time
Nov 25 00:59:03 <timelyx> not because i have any love for hildon/gnome/gtk (i don't)
Nov 25 00:59:45 <dasurfrdude> I saw some pics.  Resolution is kinda off, but suprisingly well.
Nov 25 00:59:47 <timelyx> _|Nix|_: ooh, the ui looks familiar :)
Nov 25 00:59:51 <dasurfrdude> I loathehildon
Nov 25 00:59:57 <_|Nix|_> *sigh* ... I'm'na have to start a whole new project for pidgin-otr ... I wanna separate it from Pidgin, so that, with Pidgin, I can get away from using maemo-hackers.
Nov 25 01:00:01 <timelyx> _|Nix|_: please file a bug about that site misspelling 770 :)
Nov 25 01:00:22 <_|Nix|_> What? Where?
Nov 25 01:00:36 <timelyx> last url you listed, in the welcome paragraph
Nov 25 01:00:54 <_|Nix|_> Mispeled? I don't see it.
Nov 25 01:01:00 <timelyx> (also fails to use an "and" in the os list, odd given that it includes it in the product list)
Nov 25 01:01:27 <_|Nix|_> Too bad it's not a wiki.
Nov 25 01:01:35 <timelyx> Here you will find a collection of repositories for the Nokia N810, N800 and *N770* Internet Tablets running maemo IT OS 2008, 2007, ** 2006.
Nov 25 01:01:44 <timelyx> **s added ...
Nov 25 01:01:59 <_|Nix|_> And that's mispeled, how?
Nov 25 01:02:08 <timelyx> 'n' doesn't belong
Nov 25 01:02:11 <timelyx> it's Nokia 770
Nov 25 01:02:13 <toresbe> ooooh.
Nov 25 01:02:16 <timelyx> it isn't n series
Nov 25 01:02:17 <toresbe> OS2008 is *hawt*
Nov 25 01:02:30 <timelyx> #define hawt buggy
Nov 25 01:02:32 <_|Nix|_> Whatever.
Nov 25 01:03:19 <rubiks> later hackers
Nov 25 01:05:18 <toresbe> whoa, holy shit
Nov 25 01:05:35 <toresbe> my WLAN finder just found the WLAN of a friend of mine who lives four blocks from ehre
Nov 25 01:06:08 <doc|home> hehe, yeah, the wifi on these things rock
Nov 25 01:06:17 <timelyx> yeah, *finding* is good
Nov 25 01:06:24 <timelyx> connecting is a slightly different story
Nov 25 01:06:27 <toresbe> heh
Nov 25 01:06:32 <doc|home> I've never had any problems
Nov 25 01:06:33 <toresbe> still, that's fscking impressive, man
Nov 25 01:06:51 <toresbe> this is downtown Oslo
Nov 25 01:06:57 <toresbe> and through several buildings
Nov 25 01:07:23 <toresbe> what? they switched to microB? :(
Nov 25 01:07:27 <toresbe> Where's my Operaaa!
Nov 25 01:07:37 <timelyx> it's dead jim
Nov 25 01:08:32 <timelyx> if you want opera, you're free to pay opera software asa whatever they ask for it :)
Nov 25 01:08:36 <lopz> re
Nov 25 01:08:48 <timelyx> you're probably local to them :)
Nov 25 01:10:33 <doc|home> gecko's kinda slow in general
Nov 25 01:11:27 <timelyx> care to be less vague?
Nov 25 01:11:34 * timelyx can't fix "slow in general"
Nov 25 01:12:01 <timelyx> if you mean slow to launch
Nov 25 01:12:05 <toresbe> timelyx: yep, I've worked for them too, indirectly :)
Nov 25 01:12:09 * toresbe is a rabid Opera zealot.
Nov 25 01:12:15 <doc|home> the gecko engine in comparison to opera, if you use epiphany vs opera, opera renders the pages much more quickly
Nov 25 01:12:18 <timelyx> i can suggest that you want a less sucky ld toolchain
Nov 25 01:12:33 <timelyx> doc: sorry, that's not really less vague
Nov 25 01:12:50 <timelyx> i mean, at least you're talking about pages and not launch time
Nov 25 01:12:50 <toresbe> "rendering" is perfectly fine timelyx
Nov 25 01:12:52 <doc|home> well, I can't be more specific than that :)
Nov 25 01:13:00 <doc|home> I haven't profiled both of them or anything :)
Nov 25 01:13:08 <timelyx> doc: leave the profiling to me
Nov 25 01:13:12 <timelyx> just provide specific pages
Nov 25 01:13:17 <timelyx> preferably dead
Nov 25 01:13:19 <toresbe> any large HTML page
Nov 25 01:13:34 <timelyx> toresbe: do you want me to find a large page where opera sucks?
Nov 25 01:13:36 * timelyx can do it
Nov 25 01:13:43 <timelyx> although, probably not at 3am
Nov 25 01:13:46 * timelyx should sleep
Nov 25 01:14:07 <doc|home> timelyx: engadget.com
Nov 25 01:14:14 <toresbe> Opera is faster at damn near everything, while having a smaller binary size, more features, and better standards compliance.
Nov 25 01:14:16 <timelyx> that's a site. pick a page
Nov 25 01:14:28 <doc|home> the index page
Nov 25 01:14:29 <timelyx> (preferably static)
Nov 25 01:14:36 <timelyx> index pages tend to change too often
Nov 25 01:14:44 <timelyx> and i don't really feel like skipping sleep cycles
Nov 25 01:14:51 <timelyx> sleep is apparently of some value/important
Nov 25 01:14:54 <timelyx> s/t$/ce/
Nov 25 01:15:04 <toresbe> for every page you find that Opera renders slower, I'm more than happy to show you ten that Gecko will do slower.
Nov 25 01:15:05 <doc|home> ok, night
Nov 25 01:15:34 <timelyx> toresbe: anyway, if you can beat gecko's price w/ opera, someone might listen
Nov 25 01:15:42 <timelyx> unfortunately atm, i think that price is an obstacle
Nov 25 01:16:08 <doc|home> even if it was free, and open source, it'd still be faster :/
Nov 25 01:16:17 <doc|home> in my usage ecperience
Nov 25 01:16:18 * timelyx chuckles
Nov 25 01:16:20 <doc|home> *experience
Nov 25 01:16:24 * doc|home fails at typing today
Nov 25 01:16:39 <timelyx> you're saying being free or open source could make a product slower?
Nov 25 01:16:42 <doc|home> chuckle all you like, few people would argue that
Nov 25 01:16:44 <timelyx> that's not very logical
Nov 25 01:17:05 <doc|home> no, I'm saying your price angle doesn't really change it being slower, which is the point we're trying to make
Nov 25 01:17:20 <timelyx> i'm not really arguing speed
Nov 25 01:17:23 <timelyx> i have two points:
Nov 25 01:17:30 <timelyx> 1. if you aren't complaining about a specific *page*
Nov 25 01:17:35 <timelyx> i can't do anything
Nov 25 01:17:37 <timelyx> and you're being annoying
Nov 25 01:17:46 <timelyx> 2. the reason gecko was chosen is probably not speed
Nov 25 01:17:55 <doc|home> sorry for pointing out a flaw, my bad
Nov 25 01:18:03 <timelyx> you weren't pointing out a flaw
Nov 25 01:18:06 <timelyx> you were being annoying
Nov 25 01:18:13 * doc|home thought Open development meant discussing these things
Nov 25 01:18:31 <doc|home> I'm not being "annoying", you may take it as such
Nov 25 01:18:35 <timelyx> pointing out a flaw is saying that "on http://a/x/a.html, the page loads 10x slower because of the foo.css file "
Nov 25 01:18:42 <timelyx> you're not discussing
Nov 25 01:18:44 <timelyx> you're being annoying
Nov 25 01:18:45 <doc|home> ok, look, forget it
Nov 25 01:18:51 * doc|home does something productive
Nov 25 01:19:04 <timelyx> file a bug. include a real static url
Nov 25 01:19:11 <timelyx> preferably attach a zip file of the page
Nov 25 01:19:29 <doc|home> sure, I'll do that, to which, mozilla.org?
Nov 25 01:19:35 <timelyx> preferably, yes
Nov 25 01:19:43 <timelyx> otherwise you'll spend too much time dealing w/ me
Nov 25 01:19:50 <timelyx> which really isn't a good use of anyone's time
Nov 25 01:20:30 <timelyx> probably read the top 4 items on http://www.google.com/search?q=mozilla%20performance&sourceid=mozilla2&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8 too
Nov 25 01:20:37 * timelyx gives up pasting specific urls ...
Nov 25 01:21:21 * doc|home avoids asking why those settings aren't defaults for fear it might be taken as being "annoying"
Nov 25 01:21:37 <timelyx> not sure which settings you mean
Nov 25 01:21:47 <timelyx> but generally speaking the people picking settings were stabbing in the dark
Nov 25 01:21:54 <doc|home> sorry, thought you had linked me to a tweaks page
Nov 25 01:21:55 <timelyx> the results are pretty bad
Nov 25 01:22:09 <timelyx> which one?
Nov 25 01:22:15 <timelyx> wiki.mozilla.org/Performance:Home_Page
Nov 25 01:22:25 <timelyx> www.mozilla.org/quality/help/performance.html
Nov 25 01:22:31 <timelyx> www.mozilla.org/performance/tools.html
Nov 25 01:22:36 <timelyx> www.mozillazine.org/talkback.html?article=1123
Nov 25 01:22:51 <timelyx> none of those /sounded/ like tweak pages to me, although i didn't read them thoroughly
Nov 25 01:23:07 <doc|home> and that would be why I said "sorry"
Nov 25 01:23:30 <timelyx> still curious which page you got
Nov 25 01:23:37 <timelyx> i'm moderately interested in reading it
Nov 25 01:27:33 <GreySim> Does anyone know how to hide an application from the app menu in OS2007? I tried adding "NoDisplay=true" to the .desktop file in /usr/share/applications/hildon but that seems to get ignored.
Nov 25 01:28:44 <_|Nix|_> OOooh! Pidgin 2.3.0 is out ... *crack knuckles*
Nov 25 01:36:04 <GreySim> I guess not. I guess I'll just have to suck it up as yet another example of Hildon *almost* following existing standards but deviating just enough to be frustrating. :\
Nov 25 01:36:18 <timelyx> GreySim: file a bug?
Nov 25 01:38:00 <K`zan> Notice that kubuntu assumes a dhcp connection during install...
Nov 25 01:38:38 <K`zan> Been scanning the apt mirror for some time now at 82% into the install, sigh...
Nov 25 01:41:14 <GreySim> timelyx: I suppose I should, and will later. But in the meantime I need to finish moving the .desktop files of applications I don't use to .desktop.fake files, and hope there are no unseen repercussions.
Nov 25 01:43:15 <K`zan> Never mind, it is that damn wireless router that gives itself out as the gateway, sigh.
Nov 25 01:43:24 <K`zan> Fixed that
Nov 25 01:46:46 <_|Nix|_> Oh, that's brilliant ... /usr/lib/microb-engine/libnss3.so ...
Nov 25 01:48:08 <timelyx> what's wrong?
Nov 25 01:48:23 <_|Nix|_> The libs are not in /usr/lib
Nov 25 01:48:35 <timelyx> they're not properly versioned
Nov 25 01:48:36 <_|Nix|_> Pidgin's not picking up nss.
Nov 25 01:48:45 <timelyx> and don't belong in /usr/lib
Nov 25 01:48:51 <timelyx> if you want to use them, get a contract from us
Nov 25 01:48:59 <timelyx> otherwise they may change randomly
Nov 25 01:49:10 <timelyx> (that's the way it works in real platforms, like solaris)
Nov 25 01:49:28 <_|Nix|_> They don't belong in /usr/lib? O_o
Nov 25 01:49:58 <timelyx> yeah, polluting /usr/lib (should) require[s] a versioning story
Nov 25 01:50:01 <_|Nix|_> Well, OKOK, there's a nss.pc in /usr/lib/pkgconfig
Nov 25 01:50:16 <_|Nix|_> So, I just gotta figure it out, I guess ...
Nov 25 01:50:31 <Robot101> _|Nix|_: don't ptlo/resiak's packages fix that?
Nov 25 01:50:37 <_|Nix|_> Aaaaah, that's what resiak was talking about ...
Nov 25 01:50:52 <_|Nix|_> Yes, yes ... he gave me his configure.ac
Nov 25 01:51:02 <timelyx> Robot101: eh, what's he doing?
Nov 25 01:51:05 <_|Nix|_> He said he'd push it to i.p.p ...
Nov 25 01:51:13 <_|Nix|_> timelyx: telepathy-haze
Nov 25 01:51:37 <_|Nix|_> Meanwhile, I'll push it to omgp.p ...
Nov 25 01:51:38 <timelyx> he's just providing a configure.* file?
Nov 25 01:51:50 <Robot101> timelyx: no, a patch to pidgin's configure.ac
Nov 25 01:51:58 <timelyx> ok
Nov 25 01:52:05 <timelyx> so long as he isn't changing the system path :)
Nov 25 01:52:17 <timelyx> _|Nix|_: basically, if someone wants to install minimo
Nov 25 01:52:22 <timelyx> and it has a different version of libnss
Nov 25 01:52:24 <Robot101> no, we know how to package things :)
Nov 25 01:52:36 <ptlo> 'evening
Nov 25 01:52:37 <timelyx> bad things would happen if either of them are stupid enough to live in /usr/lib
Nov 25 01:52:51 <timelyx> as such, they don't belong there
Nov 25 01:53:42 <timelyx> Robot101: sorry, i don't trust packagers :)
Nov 25 01:53:51 <timelyx> (as it happens, the original packaging of microb wasn't correct)
Nov 25 01:54:02 <timelyx> so i'm speaking from experience :)
Nov 25 01:54:03 <Robot101> timelyx: we're not packagers, we're developers. :)
Nov 25 01:54:21 <timelyx> i don't trust those either, the packaging i believe was done by devs :)
Nov 25 01:54:25 <Robot101> although about half of the company are also debian developers
Nov 25 01:54:29 <timelyx> and they're my coworkers :)
Nov 25 01:54:33 <Robot101> so many of us are both
Nov 25 01:55:17 <timelyx> anyway, sounds like you aren't hurting too many things, so i'll go nap or something
Nov 25 01:55:21 * timelyx has <5hrs
Nov 25 01:58:32 <_|Nix|_> Robot101: Interestingly, resiak's patch merely checks for microb-engine-nss.pc in addition to nss.pc, however, there is a symbolic link called nss.pc in /usr/lib/pkgconfig that points to microb-engine-nss.pc ...
Nov 25 01:59:45 <Bodhammer> hi all - quick question.  I want to port a command line application to Chinook.  I have the dev environment running as per the tutoriall
Nov 25 01:59:49 <Bodhammer> here http://maemo.org/development/documentation/tutorials/maemo_4-0_tutorial.htm
Nov 25 02:00:14 <Bodhammer> Should I start with GNU sources or a Debian file?
Nov 25 02:00:47 <Bodhammer> debian package I mean
Nov 25 02:03:33 <timelyx> debian is arguably slightly easier
Nov 25 02:11:13 <Bodhammer> do I need to look for only ARM ports?
Nov 25 02:11:47 <Bodhammer> BTW - is this the right place for newbie questions?  I do not have a N8xx yes, but seriously condsidering a N810
Nov 25 02:14:54 <[pablo]> Bodhammer: i'm sure people will be more than willing to answer your questions, i'm a newb too, just got mine and have been receive pretty well =)
Nov 25 02:17:44 <_|Nix|_> What's the command line to make /etc/ld-2.3.6.so list dependencies for a .so like ldd does?
Nov 25 02:32:49 <[pablo]> i don't suppose anyone has ever heard of a bluetooth hsdpa modem that is dedicated and not a phone?
Nov 25 02:41:53 <GNUton> night!
Nov 25 02:41:53 <_Monkey> night is so feminine...
Nov 25 02:50:51 <MoRpHeUz> _Monkey: forget night
Nov 25 02:50:51 <_Monkey> MoRpHeUz: I forgot night
Nov 25 02:52:49 <catfarm> knite
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Sun Nov 25 02:59:56 2007