**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Tue Jun 17 02:59:57 2008
Jun 17 03:25:37 <lopz> night
Jun 17 06:21:42 <ranit> X-Fade:  hi, I am running a simple qt phonon based prg on maemo device (n810), the UI is not manageble, no close option on top right corner please checkout the screenshot http://i30.tinypic.com/2l9iedl.png
Jun 17 06:23:35 <inz> ranit, dialogs don't have close button, only normal windows
Jun 17 06:26:33 <ranit> but on desktop it does have
Jun 17 06:26:51 <ranit> should i opt for QMainWindow
Jun 17 06:29:44 <herwood> hi
Jun 17 06:30:41 <herwood> does anyone know how to get the core dump -file in the N810 when a program crashes?
Jun 17 06:31:09 <herwood> I can't find the core-file in the program's directory
Jun 17 06:32:03 <johnx> herwood, hang on a sec...let me look for something
Jun 17 06:32:49 <herwood> ok thanks
Jun 17 06:35:17 <inz> ranit, QMainWindow sounds right
Jun 17 06:35:19 <johnx> herwood, just dug through the logs here...make a directory on your mmc1 card
Jun 17 06:35:28 <johnx> mkdir /media/mmc1/core-dumps
Jun 17 06:35:44 <inz> ...and reboot
Jun 17 06:35:58 <ranit> ok, just going thru it
Jun 17 06:36:56 <Stskeeps> johnx: saw my last comment that apt-get install binutils is needed before it would install properly? besides that, i have a base system installed :)
Jun 17 06:36:58 <herwood> johnx: thank you very much! that's going to help me very much
Jun 17 06:37:27 <johnx> herwood, sure, no problem :)
Jun 17 06:37:30 <johnx> Stskeeps, good to hear
Jun 17 06:43:08 <Prez00_> hello
Jun 17 06:43:52 <ranit> inz: it's working perferct
Jun 17 06:43:58 <Prez00_> how do I check what image I have installed on my N800?
Jun 17 06:45:57 <johnx> Prez00_, settings -> control panel -> about product
Jun 17 06:47:41 <herwood> johnx: gdb says that the core dump -file's file format is not recognized. Does it need some magic tricks before it starts to work?
Jun 17 06:48:05 <johnx> herwood, I don't know...I just remembered someone talking about it and dug through the log
Jun 17 06:48:17 <herwood> oge
Jun 17 06:48:45 <inz> herwood, it's gipped and includes some logs etc, no idea how it sohould be handled
Jun 17 06:48:52 <inz> gzipped
Jun 17 06:49:00 <herwood> aa, ok
Jun 17 06:49:07 <herwood> I'll try to open it somehow
Jun 17 06:53:51 <herwood> hehheh, I unzipped the file and now it takes ~86mb :D
Jun 17 06:54:19 <Prez00_> johnx: thanks
Jun 17 06:54:59 <Prez00_> hmm... guess i do not have latest version
Jun 17 06:55:18 <Prez00_> where are changelogs fro latest firmware?  I did not see it in site
Jun 17 06:55:25 <Prez00_> i mean in download page
Jun 17 06:55:52 <johnx> you mean 51-3 compared to 50-2?
Jun 17 06:56:03 <Prez00_> yep
Jun 17 06:56:40 <johnx> it has one small patch for NOLO (the nokia loader) which prevents the tablet from getting into a state where it can't be booted until it cools down to a certain temperature
Jun 17 06:57:35 <Prez00_> ok. thanks..
Jun 17 06:57:43 <Prez00_> i am crashing, gnight
Jun 17 06:58:01 <johnx> 'night
Jun 17 07:01:32 <herwood> If someone is interested, you can open the .rcore -file with rich-core-extract
Jun 17 07:29:31 <zap> Nobody's working on a bitbake-based build system for Maemo?
Jun 17 07:33:27 <johnx> zap, you can use openembedded
Jun 17 07:51:25 <X-Fade> Morning.
Jun 17 07:53:24 <X-Fade> johnx: The nolo problem was a timing issue in bringing up the cpu. Temperature slows down crystals and by slowing it down some people got lucky to get past the issue.
Jun 17 07:53:35 <X-Fade> johnx: It was not about temperature detection.
Jun 17 07:54:01 <johnx> X-Fade, fair enough. thanks for clearing that up
Jun 17 07:55:34 <crashanddie> World's first cell phone with projector: http://tinyurl.com/4s389o
Jun 17 07:55:35 <crashanddie> :D
Jun 17 07:56:45 <johnx> infobot, nolo-problem is a timing issue with bringing up the CPU in the 2007 50-2 release of OS2008. Some people worked around it by lowering the temperature of their tablet to slow down the frequency generating crystal.
Jun 17 07:56:48 <infobot> johnx: okay
Jun 17 07:56:56 <johnx> X-Fade, does that seem close enough?
Jun 17 07:57:27 <crashanddie> !nolo-problem
Jun 17 07:57:34 <crashanddie> what is nolo-problem ?
Jun 17 07:57:43 <crashanddie> I'll never understand those friggin bots
Jun 17 07:57:56 <X-Fade> johnx: Yeah, something like that ;)
Jun 17 07:58:17 <johnx> ~nolo-problem
Jun 17 07:58:18 <infobot> it has been said that nolo-problem is a timing issue with bringing up the CPU in the 2007 50-2 release of OS2008. Some people worked around it by lowering the temperature of their tablet to slow down the frequency generating crystal.
Jun 17 07:58:42 <crashanddie> "it has been said that *the* nolo-problem", no ?
Jun 17 07:58:50 <crashanddie> :P
Jun 17 07:59:11 <johnx> crashanddie, I don't see a way to word it to make infobot say the right thing
Jun 17 07:59:30 <crashanddie> yeah
Jun 17 07:59:33 <crashanddie> dayumed bots
Jun 17 08:01:08 <johnx> meh...doesn't really matter. Just lets people avoid typing the same thing a hojillion times
Jun 17 08:10:40 <rm_you> damnit
Jun 17 08:10:44 <rm_you> my server is being a bitch again
Jun 17 08:12:25 <X-Fade> rm_you: It seems that your package fails on the autobuilder because you don't have specified the correct Build-Depends.
Jun 17 08:18:28 <lardman> derf: Are you about?
Jun 17 08:18:49 <drugbalance> yo have anybody 'head' that works with -c option ?
Jun 17 08:18:59 <lardman> derf: Any thoughts on where I should look to understand what's going on in decode_packed_entry_number() in codebook.c?
Jun 17 08:20:17 <rm_you> X-Fade: ?
Jun 17 08:20:26 <rm_you> X-Fade: I know *dick* about debian packaging >_>
Jun 17 08:20:42 <X-Fade> rm_you: advanced_backlight is yours right?
Jun 17 08:20:57 <johnx> rm_you, just set your Build-depends line to depend on the packages it needs to *build* :P
Jun 17 08:21:04 <rm_you> X-Fade: yeah
Jun 17 08:21:12 <rm_you> but
Jun 17 08:21:13 <rm_you> X-Fade: I know *dick* about debian packaging >_>
Jun 17 08:21:27 <rm_you> inz made it work as it is now
Jun 17 08:21:33 <rm_you> i just try not to touch it
Jun 17 08:21:39 <lardman> :)
Jun 17 08:21:42 <rm_you> i just update the changelog by hand every time and do a build :P
Jun 17 08:21:56 <rm_you> even though i'm pretty sure there's a command to do that
Jun 17 08:22:06 <X-Fade> rm_you: you just need to add one line in your .dsc file.
Jun 17 08:22:18 <rm_you> X-Fade: send me a patch? :P
Jun 17 08:22:37 <X-Fade> rm_you: Well, technically your debian/control file.
Jun 17 08:22:56 * rm_you doesn't touch that lest the universe explode
Jun 17 08:23:20 * rm_you knows absolutely nothing about debian packaging, like he said earlier.
Jun 17 08:23:46 <lardman> but as long as you have depends: Universe you can be fairly sure dpkg won't remove it? ;)
Jun 17 08:24:49 <pupnik_> lardman, working on a2dp ?
Jun 17 08:24:51 <rm_you> possibly
Jun 17 08:24:59 <rm_you> lardman: yeah, a2dp? :P
Jun 17 08:25:07 <lardman> pupnik_: no, getting back into Tremor atm
Jun 17 08:25:13 <rm_you> :(
Jun 17 08:25:15 <lardman> a2dp works, just not fast enough
Jun 17 08:25:15 <pupnik_> woo :)
Jun 17 08:25:34 <rm_you> :P
Jun 17 08:26:06 <lardman> I had a look at how to do optimisations last night and I'll see how my reading of the spec/paper matches with the code this evening probably
Jun 17 08:26:22 <lardman> then the standard cursing will begin :)
Jun 17 08:26:33 <lardman> that's why I'm looking at Tremor again, warming up ;)
Jun 17 08:30:16 <rm_you> anyone know how to find out the UUID of a swap partition?
Jun 17 08:30:28 <rm_you> blkid is just giving me "/dev/sdc2: TYPE="swap""
Jun 17 08:30:36 <rm_you> but it gives me the UUID for everything else >_>
Jun 17 08:30:52 <lardman> ~lart Gnome for being crap
Jun 17 08:30:52 * infobot DoSes Gnome for being crap
Jun 17 08:31:26 <rm_you> http://pastebin.ca/1048938
Jun 17 08:31:32 <rm_you> johnx: any ideas?
Jun 17 08:44:41 <johnx> rm_you, did you set a UUID?
Jun 17 08:55:58 <rm_you> johnx: i have to? i thought everything just had one
Jun 17 08:58:07 <rm_you> ah uuidgen?
Jun 17 09:07:13 <lardman> internal bit representation (e.g. Endianness) shouldn't affect shift operations, only casts to different sized types?
Jun 17 09:10:09 <rm_you> johnx: ah got it, thanks
Jun 17 09:10:27 <dneary> moin
Jun 17 09:10:54 <rm_you> there was actually a patched version of util-linux that JUST came out to fix UUIDs on swap :P had to swapoff -a; mkswap /dev/sdc2; swapon -a
Jun 17 09:10:55 <rm_you> :P
Jun 17 09:11:29 <rm_you> lardman: errr, endianness is bit order, right?
Jun 17 09:11:41 <rm_you> left to right VS right to left, essentially?
Jun 17 09:12:04 <rm_you> as long as your compiler knows which endianness it is using, it should interpret your bitshift operators correctly
Jun 17 09:12:12 <rm_you> I believe <_<
Jun 17 09:12:14 <lardman> rm_you: yes
Jun 17 09:12:31 <lardman> let's hope so, 32bit types are mixed Endianness on the DSP
Jun 17 09:12:35 * rm_you tries desperately to remember his Computer Design class
Jun 17 09:13:25 <lardman> I'd assume so, hope so :)
Jun 17 09:13:49 <rm_you> <_<
Jun 17 09:14:07 <rm_you> lardman: this for a2dp or tremor? >_>
Jun 17 09:28:04 <X-Fade> morning _berto_
Jun 17 09:28:12 <lardman> rm_you: tremor
Jun 17 09:28:38 <lardman|away> rm_you: a2dp/sbc works, just too slowly
Jun 17 09:29:00 <rm_you> lardman|away: :(
Jun 17 09:29:09 <rm_you> lardman|away: any ideas at all why?
Jun 17 09:29:11 <_berto_> hi X-Fade
Jun 17 09:29:22 <rm_you> lardman|away: i supposed if you knew, you'd be fixing it :/
Jun 17 09:29:52 <X-Fade> _berto_: Can I convince you to add the proper Build-Depends in the Vagalume source package, so it builds on the autobuilder? :D
Jun 17 09:30:31 <X-Fade> _berto_: Here is the current build log: https://garage.maemo.org/extras-assistant/maemo-chinook-armel-extras/logs/vagalume_0.6-1.dsc.sbdmock.build.log-FAILED
Jun 17 09:31:21 <kulve> lardman|away: I had (still have) the same issue with speex. It should be faster, but it barely runs in real time.
Jun 17 09:31:34 <kulve> but I didn't even try to start debugging why it's so slow..
Jun 17 09:31:36 <lardman|away> rm_you: needs to be optimised for the DSP, I have some ideas
Jun 17 09:32:02 <lardman|away> kulve: I'll let you know when I make some progress (should be this week anyway)
Jun 17 09:32:08 <lardman|away> now I really do have to go, bbl
Jun 17 09:32:10 <lardman|away> :)
Jun 17 09:32:24 <_berto_> X-Fade: yes, I'll do it for the next version :)
Jun 17 09:32:31 <_berto_> that was already planned
Jun 17 09:32:39 <_berto_> or do you want it now? vagalume is already in the repo
Jun 17 09:32:40 <kulve> lardman|away: according to Mr. Valin, the speex should be faster on the DSP even when unoptimized
Jun 17 09:33:17 <X-Fade> _berto_: We are trying to automatically rebuild all source packages, so we can automatically provide diablo packages.
Jun 17 09:33:33 <X-Fade> _berto_: http://communitizer.blogspot.com/2008/06/rebuild-all-chinook-source-packages-on.html
Jun 17 09:33:38 <_berto_> ah
Jun 17 09:33:46 <_berto_> ok, I'll take a look at it this week
Jun 17 09:33:50 <X-Fade> _berto_: And I really love your application, so that is why I push you a bit ;)
Jun 17 09:34:56 <rm_you> X-Fade: so what did I have to change? I'll do the fix and release 0.9b
Jun 17 09:35:05 <rm_you> need to push the new options anyway
Jun 17 09:35:11 <_berto_> I'd like to release the next version before Guadec, anyway
Jun 17 09:36:08 <X-Fade> rm_you: Can you determine on what libraries your package depends? Then I can give you the correct Build-Depends line for you to add to debian/control
Jun 17 09:37:01 <rm_you> X-Fade: Hildon + GTK?
Jun 17 09:37:08 <rm_you> X-Fade: I think thats it >_>
Jun 17 09:38:06 <X-Fade> rm_you: It seems at least libglade, libosso, hildon-1, gconf-2.0, gtk+-2.0, libhildondesktop
Jun 17 09:38:09 <rm_you> i include things from gtk, hildon, libhildondesktop and then a bunch of standard unix stuff
Jun 17 09:38:16 <rm_you> X-Fade: why libglade?
Jun 17 09:38:32 <X-Fade> gcc -Wall -shared `pkg-config gtk+-2.0 libosso hildon-1 libhildondesktop gconf-2.0 libglade-2.0 --libs --cflags` -std=c99 -lm -pedantic advanced-backlight.c -o advanced-backlight.so
Jun 17 09:38:37 <X-Fade> You tell me ;)
Jun 17 09:38:38 <rm_you> oh
Jun 17 09:38:43 <rm_you> i didnt make that Makefile :/
Jun 17 09:38:44 <rm_you> I stole it
Jun 17 09:38:46 <rm_you> lol
Jun 17 09:38:53 <X-Fade> rip everything out you don't need :)
Jun 17 09:39:31 <rm_you> CFLAGS=-Wall -shared `pkg-config gtk+-2.0 hildon-1 libhildondesktop gconf-2.0 --libs --cflags` -D_POSIX_C_SOURCE=199309L -std=c99 -lm -pedantic
Jun 17 09:39:33 <rm_you> there
Jun 17 09:39:38 <rm_you> no libosso or libglade
Jun 17 09:43:52 <inz> That would be approx. Build-Depends: libgtk2.0-dev, libhildon1-dev, libhildondesktop-dev, libgconf2-dev
Jun 17 09:44:17 <rm_you> lol inz
Jun 17 09:44:19 <rm_you> thanks :P
Jun 17 09:44:33 <X-Fade> And add:  debhelper (>= 4)
Jun 17 09:44:38 * rm_you high-fives inz for doing 100% of the packaging work :P
Jun 17 09:44:57 <rm_you> X-Fade: already in there
Jun 17 09:45:04 <X-Fade> ok.
Jun 17 09:45:23 <inz> There might be some version dependencies too, but cannot say which without reading the source
Jun 17 09:45:28 <X-Fade> rm_you: You can test your package here: https://garage.maemo.org/extras-assistant/index.php
Jun 17 09:45:29 <rm_you> gotz it
Jun 17 09:45:50 <inz> And last time I read the source, I almost went blind, so won't do that again
Jun 17 09:45:58 <rm_you> inz: lol
Jun 17 09:46:03 <rm_you> inz: am I that horrible? :P
Jun 17 09:46:08 <rm_you> inz: much less comments :P
Jun 17 09:46:37 <pupnik_> ty for the reminder X-Fade
Jun 17 09:46:44 <inz> rm, well, it certainly wasn't pretty, and I wasn't that much interested in the project
Jun 17 09:46:55 <inz> rm, I just dislike .tgz packages ;)
Jun 17 09:47:04 <rm_you> inz: lol
Jun 17 09:47:08 <rm_you> it's in SVN now :P
Jun 17 09:47:14 <inz> ooh
Jun 17 09:47:32 <inz> or, to be clear, I dislike binary .tgz packages
Jun 17 09:47:44 <rm_you> ?
Jun 17 09:48:07 <rm_you> gah why does the post-commit always fail on garage svn >_>
Jun 17 09:48:47 <rm_you> http://pastebin.ca/1048979
Jun 17 10:00:05 <hrw> morning
Jun 17 10:03:12 <X-Fade> rm_you: It seems that is a real bug and needs fixing on our side.
Jun 17 10:03:37 <rm_you> :(
Jun 17 10:04:26 <X-Fade> Will take a few minutes, don't worry.
Jun 17 10:07:15 <rm_you> ah
Jun 17 10:07:24 <rm_you> was i the only person to report it? >_>
Jun 17 10:07:30 <rm_you> i thought you meant it was like, an ongoing bug
Jun 17 10:07:40 <X-Fade> Somehow you don't have a www dir in your svn.
Jun 17 10:07:46 <rm_you> <_<
Jun 17 10:07:49 <X-Fade> Did you delete that?
Jun 17 10:08:00 <rm_you> how would i delete that?!
Jun 17 10:08:01 <rm_you> lol
Jun 17 10:08:05 <rm_you> i can't ssh in or anything
Jun 17 10:08:11 <rm_you> all i can do is svn commit
Jun 17 10:08:21 <X-Fade> Yeah, so you can remove it..
Jun 17 10:08:30 <rm_you> it's done it since the first commit...
Jun 17 10:08:32 <rm_you> ??
Jun 17 10:08:34 <rm_you> how
Jun 17 10:08:57 <X-Fade> svn rm yourdir_here
Jun 17 10:09:06 <rm_you> ?
Jun 17 10:09:13 <rm_you> it's supposed to be INSIDE my svn dir?
Jun 17 10:09:30 <rm_you> when I did my first svn checkout, the directory was 100% empty, like i thought it was supposed to be
Jun 17 10:09:42 <rm_you> and i copied my code in, and did svn add and commit
Jun 17 10:10:05 <X-Fade> Well, don't worry. We'll add an extra check for this.
Jun 17 10:10:23 <rm_you> why would there be a www directory in my svn anyway?
Jun 17 10:10:27 <rm_you> that doesn't make sense
Jun 17 10:11:10 <X-Fade> rm_you: That is how you update your website. Which you automatically get on garage ;)
Jun 17 10:11:20 <rm_you> oh. :P
Jun 17 10:11:27 <rm_you> i never created that
Jun 17 10:11:30 <rm_you> did I need to?
Jun 17 10:22:22 <rm_you> X-Fade: so... I guess I submitted it.
Jun 17 10:23:15 <rm_you> how do I view the queue?
Jun 17 10:23:20 <rm_you> i had to submit via w3m
Jun 17 10:23:28 <rm_you> it won't show me the link to use on my real PC
Jun 17 10:24:02 <X-Fade> rm_you: What link?
Jun 17 10:24:17 <rm_you> it said at the end i could view the queue of the autobuilder
Jun 17 10:24:19 <rm_you> or somethinb
Jun 17 10:24:28 <rm_you> but the page is indecipherable in w3m
Jun 17 10:25:00 <rm_you> it seems much easier to use dput >_>
Jun 17 10:25:07 <X-Fade> rm_you: It points to the builds mailing list.
Jun 17 10:25:10 <rm_you> ah
Jun 17 10:25:26 <X-Fade> You will get a mail if the package is processed.
Jun 17 10:25:30 <rm_you> k
Jun 17 10:25:41 <rm_you> does it pull my email from the package?
Jun 17 10:25:59 <X-Fade> from your garage account.
Jun 17 10:26:10 <rm_you> ah k
Jun 17 10:26:16 <X-Fade> You can also use dput to upload packages to the autobuilder: http://extras-cauldron.garage.maemo.org/HOWTO.html
Jun 17 10:26:38 <rm_you> ah k
Jun 17 10:33:15 <rm_you> ooo
Jun 17 10:33:17 <rm_you> https://garage.maemo.org/builder/chinook/advanced-backlight_0.9b-1/
Jun 17 10:33:35 <rm_you> X-Fade: so is the new version in -extras?
Jun 17 10:34:02 <X-Fade> rm_you: No, it is in extras-devel now.
Jun 17 10:34:22 <X-Fade> The build went fine btw.
Jun 17 10:34:38 <X-Fade> Who said packaging was hard ;)
Jun 17 10:34:41 <rm_you> lol
Jun 17 10:34:53 <rm_you> k
Jun 17 10:36:44 <rm_you> what is extras-devel for exactly?
Jun 17 10:37:19 <X-Fade> Experimental packages.
Jun 17 10:37:45 <X-Fade> extras should contain end-user packages and all experimental stuff should go to -devel.
Jun 17 10:38:57 <timeless> hello world
Jun 17 10:39:03 <timeless> what's the url for the maemo brand art?
Jun 17 10:39:36 <timeless> http://maemo.org/intro/trademarks/logos/ ?
Jun 17 10:39:45 <timeless> and is tehre anything that's a 64x64 icon?
Jun 17 10:40:01 <X-Fade> timeless: yeah, that's the page.
Jun 17 10:40:07 <timeless> x-fade: it isn't helpful
Jun 17 10:40:10 <timeless> i need a 64x64 icon
Jun 17 10:40:26 <X-Fade> timeless: It seems we don't have one :)
Jun 17 10:40:40 <timeless> ok, take your pick, 'm' in styleof favicon
Jun 17 10:40:46 <timeless> 'e' from brand
Jun 17 10:40:51 <timeless> or squished maemo
Jun 17 10:40:53 <macoute> yeah, id go with that too
Jun 17 10:40:54 <inz> If something strange, in the graphics world, who you gonna call?
Jun 17 10:40:57 <macoute> with e
Jun 17 10:41:40 <timeless> ok, can i get one of you to actually make this picture for me? :)
Jun 17 10:41:46 <X-Fade> timeless: I don't know who did the logo. Maybe you can ask that internally?
Jun 17 10:42:05 <timeless> basically, my goal is to make: http://www.ohloh.net/accounts/timeless/stacks look good
Jun 17 10:42:11 <timeless> and currently Maemo is among the broken bits :)
Jun 17 10:56:58 <jitu3485> when i tried to install xulrunner on CHINOOK_X86 :./xulrunner --register-global it is giving error
Jun 17 10:57:10 <jitu3485> can someone  help!
Jun 17 10:57:19 <timeless> what kind of error?
Jun 17 10:57:37 <jitu3485> scratchbox/tools/bin/misc_runner: SBOX_CPUTRANSPARENCY_METHOD not set
Jun 17 10:57:46 <timeless> gah
Jun 17 10:57:53 * timeless leaves
Jun 17 10:58:10 <jitu3485> hey can someone help
Jun 17 11:02:23 <drugbalance> yooo
Jun 17 11:02:27 <drugbalance> there is no fsck
Jun 17 11:02:36 <drugbalance> how to fix problems with filesystem ?
Jun 17 11:04:15 <atul> Hi who is taking care of xulrunner on maemo ? Can I get name or mail id of his ?
Jun 17 11:04:54 <atul> I want to know is there bindings between C and XULRunner available for maemo paltform ?
Jun 17 11:08:48 <macoute> timeless:  i made a scratch about what (imho) should be the icon, wanna see it?
Jun 17 11:09:05 <macoute> it is a scratch as i can't gimp :)
Jun 17 11:12:31 <macoute> well, here it is http://suursavo.org/temp/maemoicon64x64.png
Jun 17 11:14:43 <jitu3485> Hi atul
Jun 17 11:15:05 <atul> jitu3485, bolo bhai
Jun 17 11:15:23 <atul> jitu3485,  maemo mailing list se muze xulrunner wale ka address de na
Jun 17 11:15:27 <atul> nikalake
Jun 17 11:16:42 <X-Fade> rm_you: The oncommit hook error should be fixed now.
Jun 17 11:16:49 <rm_you> k
Jun 17 11:30:18 <lopz> morning
Jun 17 11:30:38 <rm_you> night
Jun 17 11:31:19 <samppsa> hello, is there some place where to see why the package i uploaded wont get in to extras repo?
Jun 17 11:55:04 <andre____> samppsa, your shell output? :)
Jun 17 11:55:14 <andre____> and make sure your ssh key isn't blacklisted because of the openssl vulnerability
Jun 17 11:57:02 <drugbalance> is ssh patched in os2008 ?
Jun 17 12:00:12 <wiza> any ideas how to sync mac, n810 and lg? contracts and calendar
Jun 17 12:00:23 <wiza> s/contracts/contacts/
Jun 17 12:00:24 <infobot> wiza meant: any ideas how to sync mac, n810 and lg? contacts and calendar
Jun 17 12:02:35 <drugbalance> where from can I get ruby for os2007 ?
Jun 17 12:03:45 <drugbalance> yo is anybody here have a compiller for os2007 ?
Jun 17 12:04:08 <drugbalance> if thereis someone - can't you compile GNU 'head' command for me ?0
Jun 17 12:04:09 <drugbalance> )
Jun 17 12:13:45 <lardman> kulve: re speed when unoptimised, has the code been written to perform memory accesses, loops, multiplies in a way that is fast?
Jun 17 12:14:37 <lardman> the DSP compiler has its own quirks and ways it wants stuff written. I also note there are a few compiler 'CFLAGS' which might help
Jun 17 12:15:48 <lardman> all of which might be considered "not rewriting"
Jun 17 12:15:51 <lcuk2> lol lardman, that compiler sounds like my boss
Jun 17 12:16:10 * lcuk2 optimises PHB
Jun 17 12:16:15 <lardman> lcuk2: does he need #pragmas() everywhere to get anything done? ;)
Jun 17 12:16:52 <lardman>  #pragma(COFFEE_BREAKS_LESS_THAN_10min)
Jun 17 12:17:22 <lcuk2> yer sometimes ;)
Jun 17 12:17:29 <samppsa> andre____: i uploaded one package already and it got there right away
Jun 17 12:17:54 <andre____> hmm, ok
Jun 17 12:18:15 <andre____> what do you use for uploading? dput?
Jun 17 12:18:21 <samppsa> scp
Jun 17 12:18:31 <kulve> lardman: some are, some most likely are not.
Jun 17 12:18:58 <lcuk2> scp? in my day we uploaded data with a rusty leaky bucket.  we would carry the bits uphill both ways
Jun 17 12:19:08 <samppsa> :)
Jun 17 12:19:16 <lardman> kulve: silly things like needing to cast both multiplicands before doing the multiply
Jun 17 12:19:52 <samppsa> maybe they have some lag now on extras
Jun 17 12:20:08 <lardman> Is there a way of outputting a calling tree? So I can see which functions call which others?
Jun 17 12:20:17 <kulve> lardman: something like that there is
Jun 17 12:20:50 <lardman> kulve: ah well, in that case profiling :) - the docs tell us about the wonders of clock() & printf(). lol highly advanced
Jun 17 12:21:14 <lardman> kulve: or were you talking about my call-tree thing?
Jun 17 12:22:29 <lcuk2> lardman, might be an idea to make a macro to wrap all function headers and emit the function name on entry :)  saves you multi typing it.   Lard_Fn(copy_to_dsp,(int a,int b))
Jun 17 12:23:14 <lardman> lcuk2: There are lots and lots of functions
Jun 17 12:23:48 * lcuk2 makes a mental note to do this before my function tree expands beyond reasonable bounds ;)
Jun 17 12:23:51 <lardman> does gprof output a tree?
Jun 17 12:24:26 <lcuk2> gcc does profiling whilst compiling, but you use a custom compiler dont you
Jun 17 12:25:18 <lardman> well I'm happy to compile x86/ARM code to see the calling structure - I'm just trying to narrow down where the errors might be happening
Jun 17 12:25:46 <lardman> if it fails in fn X, there may be some error in the fns it calls, or somewhere higher up the chain
Jun 17 12:25:48 <n800m> anyone now how i could try to fix broken dirs on my sd card from a hard shut down other than fsck?
Jun 17 12:26:10 <lardman> fdisk ;)
Jun 17 12:26:36 <lardman> n800m: what's wrong with fsck?
Jun 17 12:26:49 <n800m> it's not doing anything :/
Jun 17 12:26:54 <n800m> tried fsck -a
Jun 17 12:26:55 <lardman> hmm
Jun 17 12:27:07 <lardman> does it output anything?
Jun 17 12:27:13 <lcuk2> im sure there are programs to view the gcc profiling options somewhere
Jun 17 12:27:17 <n800m> i get a summary of the stuff on the disk but nothing else
Jun 17 12:27:17 <lardman> pastebin it if there's lots
Jun 17 12:27:18 <lcuk2> never wanted to dig though
Jun 17 12:27:28 <n800m> ok, lemme try it
Jun 17 12:27:40 <lardman> lcuk2: ok, I'll have a look around
Jun 17 12:28:18 <lcuk2> start by examining "-fprofile-generate" option for gcc
Jun 17 12:28:52 <lcuk2> if software is available to handle the generated files (they live alongside each .o) then they will tell you to generate the profile information first
Jun 17 12:29:45 <lardman> ah yes, that's what I've been using
Jun 17 12:29:48 <lardman> gprof
Jun 17 12:30:04 <lardman> but for something else with fewer levels of calls, so I didn't see a tree
Jun 17 12:30:08 <lardman> I'll give it a go
Jun 17 12:31:27 <n800m> http://pastebin.com/d2198166a
Jun 17 12:32:03 <lcuk2> lardman http://ndevilla.free.fr/etrace/  seems to be possible, but its runtime
Jun 17 12:32:23 <lcuk2> back to the grind though, cya later
Jun 17 12:32:41 <lardman> looks cool, thanks
Jun 17 12:34:01 <n800m> i tried diskutil on osx with it yesterday but got errors
Jun 17 12:39:31 <lardman> n800m: you got any output from fsck?
Jun 17 12:39:39 <n800m> http://pastebin.com/d2198166a
Jun 17 12:39:41 <n800m> that's i
Jun 17 12:39:42 <n800m> t
Jun 17 12:39:49 <lardman> n800m: for that matter, what's the problem with the directories?
Jun 17 12:39:56 <lardman> ah sorry, missed it above
Jun 17 12:40:21 <n800m> they've turned into tiny blank files
Jun 17 12:40:29 <n800m> not all of them, a few
Jun 17 12:40:42 <lardman> hmm... alleged total clusters: 62990
Jun 17 12:40:47 <lardman> alleged sounds bad
Jun 17 12:40:53 <n800m> 16 gb card
Jun 17 12:40:59 <n800m> yeah
Jun 17 12:41:46 <lardman> was there stuff in there you wanted?
Jun 17 12:41:59 <n800m> yeah but i had a backup
Jun 17 12:42:11 <lardman> I'd fdisk it and cross your fingers it works next time
Jun 17 12:42:18 <n800m> just that i remember doing it a few months ago on the same card and it brought them back from the dead
Jun 17 12:42:27 <n800m> hm
Jun 17 12:42:33 <n800m> ok
Jun 17 12:42:39 <n800m> one more question since i have you
Jun 17 12:42:48 <lardman> sounds like there might be some sort of issue though, is it recreatable?
Jun 17 12:43:28 <n800m> i could try it, everything worked fine until i had fbreader try to open a file on the card while the card wasn't there
Jun 17 12:43:40 <n800m> it opens its own readme instead
Jun 17 12:43:50 <n800m> but that dir is one of the corrupted one
Jun 17 12:44:07 <lardman> was fbreader running when you put the card back in?
Jun 17 12:44:08 <n800m> and the other one is also one that fbreader's prefs were pointing to for the library
Jun 17 12:44:14 <n800m> no
Jun 17 12:44:27 <lardman> hmm, I can't see why it would have any effect then
Jun 17 12:44:35 <lardman> just bad luck?
Jun 17 12:44:39 <n800m> hehe
Jun 17 12:44:42 <lardman> coincidence, etc.
Jun 17 12:45:03 <lardman> though if you do the same steps again and it fails the same way, I'll reconsider :)
Jun 17 12:45:14 <n800m> i'm thinking about trying
Jun 17 12:45:32 <n800m> maybe it'l help other people
Jun 17 12:46:11 <n800m> here goes, it'll take me awhile
Jun 17 12:46:17 <n800m> thanks lardman
Jun 17 12:46:20 <lardman> np
Jun 17 12:55:04 <GAN800> Anybody else get the feeling that Nokia has forgotten the N800 exists? The 770 seems to get more attention than it. :/
Jun 17 13:00:59 <lardman> how do I go from this: http://pastebin.com/m6d46cd1f to something I can use to track it down?
Jun 17 13:02:14 <RST38h> GAN: It has been replaced with N810
Jun 17 13:02:41 <andre____> lardman: hmm... "thread apply all bt" may not be useful after a SIGABRT, but you could try...
Jun 17 13:03:38 <lardman> bt gives me this: http://pastebin.com/m37325435
Jun 17 13:04:01 <lardman> which looks to me like fclose() being called in main()?
Jun 17 13:04:07 <andre____> hmm, missing most of the symbols, but the last line is interesting
Jun 17 13:04:47 <lardman> hmm, is that post-processed line numbers?
Jun 17 13:04:49 <andre____> sp-rich-core package from the tools repo is installed?
Jun 17 13:04:51 <lardman> line 97 is a comment
Jun 17 13:05:21 <lardman> andre____: this is on x86, but I could compile it for ARM is that would work better (I thought not)
Jun 17 13:05:33 <andre____> ah, ok
Jun 17 13:05:51 <lardman> it's for the DSP in the end
Jun 17 13:08:06 <timeless> lardman/x-fade, i gave up, see http://www.ohloh.net/accounts/timeless/stacks
Jun 17 13:08:46 <GAN800> RST38h, but it's supposedly still 'supported'. ;)
Jun 17 13:09:17 <lardman> timeless: I must have missed the start of the conversation, what are you doing?
Jun 17 13:09:19 <X-Fade_> timeless: Nice ;)
Jun 17 13:11:11 <X-Fade_> timeless: Wow, nice rank!
Jun 17 13:12:22 <timeless> x-fade: i'm a 9 iirc
Jun 17 13:12:23 * timeless checks
Jun 17 13:12:44 <timeless> yeah, not a very good rank
Jun 17 13:12:44 <X-Fade_> Lol, darius says Maemo mapper is a closed project ;)
Jun 17 13:13:16 <macoute> whos darius?
Jun 17 13:13:22 <timeless> you don't want to know
Jun 17 13:13:24 <X-Fade_> timeless: Well, I think that 236 is pretty high. I won't ever make that..
Jun 17 13:13:25 <lardman> ooh another post, how exciting! :)
Jun 17 13:13:43 <X-Fade_> lardman: Check the last line :)
Jun 17 13:14:33 <lardman> So please unsubscribe me from maemo-developers list
Jun 17 13:14:33 <lardman> to let me keep my mailbox free from your fight for leadership at maemo.
Jun 17 13:14:40 <lardman> can someone do that please? :)
Jun 17 13:15:05 <andre____> no :)
Jun 17 13:15:56 <timeless> x-fade: consider that i've worked w/ joe hewitt, gavin sharp, mano, ben goodger, blake ross, seth spitzer, scott macgregor, reed loden, david bienvenu, boris zbarsky, brian ryner, pierre, chanial,
Jun 17 13:15:58 <timeless> err
Jun 17 13:16:06 <timeless> s/pierre,/pierre/
Jun 17 13:16:43 <X-Fade_> timeless: Yeah, well. It is still pretty high.
Jun 17 13:17:26 <lardman> andre____: so someone will have to reply and tell him how to DIY?
Jun 17 13:17:35 <dneary> Nick: did you jump on your reply button when you saw that mail? There's like 30s difference between them
Jun 17 13:17:35 <trickie> i did
Jun 17 13:17:40 <X-Fade_> lardman: tricky already did.
Jun 17 13:17:41 <trickie> :)
Jun 17 13:17:47 <trickie> getting too much
Jun 17 13:17:53 <trickie> and that font was offensive :)
Jun 17 13:17:57 <trickie> ha ha
Jun 17 13:17:57 <lardman> lots of lag on my webmail
Jun 17 13:18:19 <lardman> I take it you used HTML with a white bg? ;)
Jun 17 13:18:32 <andre____> lardman, someone already did
Jun 17 13:18:33 <trickie> at least he left us with some good quotes... "I had a dream ..."
Jun 17 13:18:46 <dneary> lardman: It's ironic that he took 100 lines to request an unsubscribe.
Jun 17 13:18:58 <herwood> hi
Jun 17 13:19:00 <lardman> dneary: well at least he got there in the end :)
Jun 17 13:19:02 <andre____> whoa, you actually read that email?!
Jun 17 13:19:18 <herwood> has anybody used hildon banner progressbar or animation?
Jun 17 13:19:21 <X-Fade_> andre____: Sure, I read all of them regiously ;)
Jun 17 13:19:36 <trickie> me too
Jun 17 13:19:43 <lardman> relocating to work, bbiab
Jun 17 13:19:45 <trickie> its like a daily WTF
Jun 17 13:20:04 <herwood> I can't get it appear, but information banner works great
Jun 17 13:20:21 <dneary> hehe - "There is no way to finance developers of free open source applications as they refuse  to accept any money for add-on features."
Jun 17 13:21:20 <dneary> I look forward to the day when all our projects are Finite State Machine Open Projects.
Jun 17 13:22:12 <timeless> david hyatt, alec flett, benjamin smedberg, mike connor, steffen wilberg, myk melez, dietrich ayala, brett w, graydon hoare, shawn wilsh,
Jun 17 13:22:25 <timeless> dneary: where's that line from?
Jun 17 13:22:29 <timeless> or do i really not want to know?
Jun 17 13:23:14 <trickie> latest daily darius diatribe
Jun 17 13:23:30 <trickie> on -developers
Jun 17 13:24:34 <dneary> timeless: In his last message, he says: "What I suggested months ago was to build projects as Finite-State-Machine top-down charts and to have them administered and managed as Open Projects... To move Closed Projects to Finite-State-Machine Open Projects takes some time and efforts, but only acting that way a new quality software products can be made in shortest time."
Jun 17 13:24:52 <dneary> I have a dream
Jun 17 13:25:01 <dneary> It's actually a get-rich-quick scheme
Jun 17 13:25:38 <dneary> Everyone needs to put their toiletries in a closable transparent plastic bag, in plastic containers no bigger than 100ml
Jun 17 13:25:54 <dneary> But it's damn hard to buy a toilet bag that actually looks like that
Jun 17 13:26:59 <dneary> So here's my plan... have an FAA-conformant transparent toiletries bag with 100ml screw-top containers into which you can put your own toiletries, which zips up and doesn't look like a freezer bag
Jun 17 13:27:22 <mgedmin> don't they hand out these empty bags at airports?
Jun 17 13:27:36 <GAN800> lol
Jun 17 13:27:41 <trickie> aren't they removing that law again soon?
Jun 17 13:27:49 <dneary> Would be cheap to produce, easy to sell (parapharmacies, bagage stores, convenience stores in airports, ...)
Jun 17 13:27:54 <GAN800> Where does he cone up with this stuff?
Jun 17 13:27:57 <dneary> trickie: Says who? URL?
Jun 17 13:28:08 <n800m> they're actually letting you take your lighter with you nowadays
Jun 17 13:28:12 <n800m> i was surprised
Jun 17 13:28:13 <dneary> mgedmin: They give out the bags, not the 100ml containers
Jun 17 13:28:33 <dneary> mgedmin: And it's nothing like a toilet bag. It's a main in the tits
Jun 17 13:28:39 <dneary> pain in the tits, even
Jun 17 13:28:45 <trickie> dneary: i got no proof, i thought i remembered someone telling me that
Jun 17 13:29:16 <dneary> trickie: I'd love to see an FAA page saying that
Jun 17 13:29:30 <trickie> tell you what though... its said when the first suggestion in the google search box when you type in liquids is 'liquiids on airplanes'
Jun 17 13:29:35 <trickie> its sad rather
Jun 17 13:29:43 <lcuk2> french air traffic MADE me dismantle my zippe - taking the flammable wadding and throwing it in the regular bin - i had to break a pen apart to get something long and sharp enough to dig out all the flammable wadding - they then made me put my zippo in the baggy all dismantled
Jun 17 13:30:42 * lcuk2 still wonders how he looked with random bits of metal trying to make sure my lighter wouldnt light anymore
Jun 17 13:30:51 <n800m> hehe
Jun 17 13:31:44 <trickie> dneary: maybe something to do with http://www.europarl.europa.eu/sides/getDoc.do?language=EN&type=IM-PRESS&reference=20070823IPR09766
Jun 17 13:31:44 <lcuk2> they didnt mind me taking a pocket knife, uzi and machete on the plane though :)
Jun 17 13:31:49 <trickie> althought that was a while ago
Jun 17 13:32:03 <trickie> and just yesterday i still had to use the little baggies
Jun 17 13:32:07 <dneary> trickie: The new regulations are only in since mid-2007
Jun 17 13:32:32 <dneary> I'd be surprised to see them relaxed before mid 2009 - plenty of time to make 100,000 of these bags & sell 'em
Jun 17 13:32:44 <dneary> Mark-up would have to be a buck a piece at least
Jun 17 13:33:02 <n800m> does canola index directories EVERY time it starts up?
Jun 17 13:33:09 <dneary> Although if you can get in with Carrefour or K-mart, that wouldn't go very far
Jun 17 13:34:12 <dneary> And see - it's not a ridiculous idea. http://www.comforthouse.com/travelbottles.html
Jun 17 13:38:23 <GAN800> Thanks for jumping in on the logo contest, dneary. ;) Quim was pretty insistent about the urgency, and I didn't have a better plan than trying to kick start _something_ with a little discussion, but the results (as you could see) weren't great. :D
Jun 17 13:39:35 <n800m> is the contest still open?
Jun 17 13:39:56 <GAN800> it really hasn't even started yet.
Jun 17 13:44:35 <dneary> GAN800: No big deal
Jun 17 13:44:39 <dneary> I have done this before :)
Jun 17 13:45:01 <dneary> GAN800: And there's no "really" about it - it hasn't started yet.
Jun 17 13:47:40 <GAN800> andre____, ping.
Jun 17 13:47:46 <andre____> GAN800, pong
Jun 17 13:48:25 <GAN800> 3179 is a finger keyboard issue, not a virtual keyboard one.
Jun 17 13:48:51 <andre____> argh.
Jun 17 13:49:02 <andre____> the problem of terms...
Jun 17 13:50:22 <andre____> GAN800, sigh. i should keep in mind that the N800 didn't have a keyboard. the "closes it" confused me it seems :)
Jun 17 13:50:39 <GAN800> lol
Jun 17 13:51:10 <andre____> so, N800 has a physical return key. I remember that. But what does "closes finger keyboard" mean?
Jun 17 13:51:31 <GAN800> I should preface all my bugs with 'IF YOU DON"T HAVE AN N800 TO TEST THIS ON, STFU AND GTFO!!!" :p ;)
Jun 17 13:52:09 <GAN800> It's not a physical key
Jun 17 13:52:26 <GAN800> It's the finger keyboard's soft return key.
Jun 17 13:52:44 <GAN800> That doesn't actually work like a return key
Jun 17 13:52:54 <andre____> GAN800, yesh please :)
Jun 17 13:53:09 <GAN800> It works exactly like the finger keyboard's 'close keyboard' key.
Jun 17 13:53:44 <andre____> if bugzilla supported html, you should have <blink>N800 issue</blink> as the first line ;-)
Jun 17 13:54:24 <timeless> andre: the url field can hold data:text/html,<blink>...
Jun 17 13:54:33 * GAN8001 summons the clones.
Jun 17 13:54:35 <GAN8001> http://www.legacyoflies.com/devuploads/general_antilles/maemofingerkeyboard.jpg
Jun 17 13:54:40 <andre____> awesome.
Jun 17 13:54:52 <timeless> gan800: bugzilla offers hardware fields for n800, no?
Jun 17 13:55:01 <andre____> ah, thanks.
Jun 17 13:55:06 <GAN8001> The return button in the upper right is behaving exactly like the 'close keyboard' button above it.
Jun 17 13:55:11 <andre____> timeless, it does. but andre must actually learn to read.
Jun 17 13:55:30 <GAN8001> timeless, I'd imagine it also effects the N810 when using the finger keyboard, though.
Jun 17 13:55:53 <lardman> re
Jun 17 13:57:22 <GAN8001> The N810 should, mostly, be able to emulate an N800 by keeping the slide closed.
Jun 17 13:58:34 * lardman wonders if Darius was a bot after all, he did seem to spout the same old over and over again, with ocassional adverts thrown in
Jun 17 13:59:08 <GAN8001> That's one amazing bot.
Jun 17 14:00:35 <GAN8001> andre____, did the N800 suddenly acquire a hardware keyboard while I wasn't looking? O_o
Jun 17 14:02:08 <Khertan> Hi !!!
Jun 17 14:02:12 <andre____> GAN8001, hidden magic :-P
Jun 17 14:02:15 <lardman> hrw: ping
Jun 17 14:02:34 <hrw> lardman: pong
Jun 17 14:02:50 <GAN8001> andre____, virtual keyboard (vkb) == half-screen virtual stylus board, finger keyboard (fkb or osk) == fullscreen virtual finger/thumb board and hardware keyboard == N810's slider keyboard.
Jun 17 14:02:54 <lardman> hrw: Can I pick your Polish brain please? ;)
Jun 17 14:03:19 <hrw> lardman: you can ask me questions and I will try to give you answers. but I keep my brain
Jun 17 14:03:23 <andre____> hmm. let's see whether my czech helps me to understand that article. probably not :-/
Jun 17 14:03:25 <lardman> hrw: The email from Frantisek, are those pages about Darius?
Jun 17 14:03:36 <andre____> GAN8001, hah! thanks :)
Jun 17 14:03:39 <hrw> lardman: maemo-dev?
Jun 17 14:03:45 <lardman> yes
Jun 17 14:03:47 <hrw> lardman: I do not follow recent threads
Jun 17 14:03:51 <hrw> moment
Jun 17 14:03:56 <lardman> thanks
Jun 17 14:03:58 <GAN8001> andre____, and, for the time being, you can assume all bugs filed by me have nothing to do with the N810. ;)
Jun 17 14:04:11 <andre____> GAN8001, i've learned that, yupp :)
Jun 17 14:04:14 <hrw> lardman: which thread it was?
Jun 17 14:04:42 <lardman> hrw: I'll get you an url, hang on a tick
Jun 17 14:04:46 <hrw> ok
Jun 17 14:04:48 <sh8dfwk> any ESBox users around? I'm having a n00b issue
Jun 17 14:05:08 <lardman> hrw: http://lists.maemo.org/pipermail//maemo-developers/2008-June/033850.html
Jun 17 14:08:49 <hrw> lardman: DariusJack?
Jun 17 14:09:17 <lardman> hrw: yep
Jun 17 14:09:23 <hrw> lardman: Expert also known as Jacek, Dariusz, DariusJack, Pastor, invention4you is famous Polish usenet troll
Jun 17 14:09:28 <GAN8001> http://translate.google.com/translate?u=http%3A%2F%2Flicorea.pl%2Fbart%2Fblog%2F2007%2F01%2F30%2Fekspierd%2F&hl=en&ie=UTF8&sl=pl&sl=es&tl=en&tl=en
Jun 17 14:09:33 <Khertan> ouch the photo !!!
Jun 17 14:09:54 <lardman> hrw: Thanks :)
Jun 17 14:10:13 <X-Fade_> Well, this is news! :)
Jun 17 14:10:23 <lardman> I forgot about Babelfish-type tools for Polish
Jun 17 14:10:33 <hrw> ;D
Jun 17 14:11:02 <hrw> lardman: google translate is not perfect but more or less readable - but I did not tried PL->EN yet (only reverse)
Jun 17 14:11:03 <GAN8001> It fails, mostly.
Jun 17 14:11:12 <hrw> brb
Jun 17 14:11:19 <X-Fade_> Well, google translation.. hmmm not that great.
Jun 17 14:11:19 <hrw> GAN8001: results are funny mostly
Jun 17 14:11:24 <lardman> hrw: yeah, not so good unless you understand the words it's missed out
Jun 17 14:11:31 <Khertan> so imagine pl->en->fr :)
Jun 17 14:15:50 <RST38h> You have located a photo of your friend Darius?
Jun 17 14:16:02 <andre____> [OT] polish & czech at translate.google.com is quite new - there was an interesting article about it at http://www.praguepost.com/articles/2008/05/28/codebreakers.php
Jun 17 14:16:51 <RST38h> Anybody got a link to the polish original?
Jun 17 14:17:01 <RST38h> The english version is kinda unreadable
Jun 17 14:17:23 <lardman> http://licorea.pl/bart/blog/2007/01/30/ekspierd/
Jun 17 14:17:30 <lardman> http://xox.pl/~zamsz/
Jun 17 14:17:57 <RST38h> thanks
Jun 17 14:21:46 <hrw> it is not photo of Expert
Jun 17 14:22:34 <lardman> shall we have a second maemo.org competition (after the logo one) to see who can be the first to get a photo and turn it into a dart-board?
Jun 17 14:23:04 <RST38h> hrw: Is there a real photo somewhere?
Jun 17 14:23:11 <hrw> RST38h: no idea
Jun 17 14:23:16 <RST38h> hrw: Maybe even some medical information? =)
Jun 17 14:23:28 <hrw> RST38h: I am not in his fanclub
Jun 17 14:23:50 <lardman> hrw: Sorry, I've exposed your secret super power
Jun 17 14:24:23 <RST38h> Now we only need to wait until he axes someone, then the picture will be in the Polish news.
Jun 17 14:28:09 <summatusmentis> !!! I can get the motoq for free... awesome!
Jun 17 14:28:46 <glass_> "yay!"
Jun 17 14:28:52 <andre____> anybody knows whether one can use an external usb gps receiver for the n8x0 (not: bluetooth)?
Jun 17 14:28:53 <glass_> free or bundled with a plan?
Jun 17 14:29:02 <GAN8001> andre____, yes.
Jun 17 14:29:15 <summatusmentis> glass_: well, bundled w/ a Sprint SERO plan, but it's $30/mo for unlimited data/text, and 500 mins
Jun 17 14:29:22 <glass_> andre: should be possible. though, bt gps pucks are easier to come by
Jun 17 14:29:29 <lardman> andre____: Should work, I seem to remember someone had a usb-serial driver somewhere
Jun 17 14:29:35 <glass_> summatusmentis: i wouldn't count it as free then
Jun 17 14:29:42 <qwerty12> usbserial can be found in fanoush's module pack
Jun 17 14:29:42 <andre____> cool, thanks a lot! just wanted to be polite when closing https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=3044
Jun 17 14:29:47 <glass_> summatusmentis: whats the caps on unlimited?
Jun 17 14:29:57 <GAN8001> andre____, google it, there are a few pages on the topic.
Jun 17 14:29:58 <qwerty12> Point maemo mapper to the new /dev/ttySx device
Jun 17 14:30:30 <summatusmentis> glass_: forums are saying 5GB, but I'm not sure
Jun 17 14:30:48 <lardman> andre____: he's talking about the dialogs etc., though isn't he?
Jun 17 14:31:02 <timeless> dneary: btw, where did my unsubscribe request go? i sent it to maemo-devel last friday and never saw it.
Jun 17 14:31:02 <timeless> as for those plastic bags, they were giving them out at one airport i used, so i think someone's making money on them.
Jun 17 14:31:02 <timeless> gan800: did dneary see the logo i made? btw you guys need to work on the requirements. there needs to be a requirement for a square logo (256x256 with versions for 128x, 64x, 48x, 32x, 16x)
Jun 17 14:31:03 <timeless> gan8001: i think i had a docs.google page that defined vkb and friends, wasn't andre supposed to read it?
Jun 17 14:31:17 <summatusmentis> does anyone know if there's a .deb that install's fanoush's initfs?
Jun 17 14:31:22 <lardman> andre____: it should work as long as you setup gpsd to listen to the right thing, but there's no GUI to do that for anythign other than the built-in or BT GPS
Jun 17 14:31:26 <andre____> lardman, do we look at the same ticket? bug 3044? :) don't see anything about dialogs :)
Jun 17 14:31:31 <GAN8001> timeless, I dunno, perhaps I should print some hardcopy and beat him about the head and shoulders with it? :D
Jun 17 14:31:33 <qwerty12> summatusmentis, it's v.easy to use the script
Jun 17 14:31:40 <andre____> timeless, he was, yeah ;-)
Jun 17 14:31:44 <summatusmentis> qwerty12: oh, there's a script? I didn't know that
Jun 17 14:31:51 <lardman> andre____, yeah, I was reading into his first sentance
Jun 17 14:32:00 <andre____> i read a lot of stuff, sorry :)
Jun 17 14:32:34 <timeless> andre: oh, it's ok. i just think that at some point instead of answering questions
Jun 17 14:32:38 <lardman> andre____, np, I understand
Jun 17 14:32:39 <timeless> people should be pointed to answers
Jun 17 14:32:49 <timeless> and told "please (re)read this"
Jun 17 14:33:03 <andre____> +1
Jun 17 14:34:56 <summatusmentis> qwerty12: will i need to be booted from flash to install it?
Jun 17 14:36:08 <m-c> Any idea why the text highlights in the web browser, when trying to scroll the page with the touchpad?
Jun 17 14:36:39 <qwerty12> summatusmentis, I'm unsure how else you would install it from SD (except for some rarely used flasher flags)
Jun 17 14:36:48 <qwerty12> So assume yes :)
Jun 17 14:36:53 <summatusmentis> oh, ok :)
Jun 17 14:36:59 <timeless> m-c: eh?
Jun 17 14:37:18 <timeless> m-c: have you ever used a classic web browser?
Jun 17 14:37:26 <timeless> one of the features in them is text selection
Jun 17 14:37:34 <timeless> and it could be abused to trigger fast scrolling
Jun 17 14:37:43 <timeless> you're probably just experiencing that
Jun 17 14:38:07 <timeless> and we're going to redo how all of that stuff works after diablo, so it's not worth really talking about it
Jun 17 14:38:26 <m-c> well, considering I have never wanted to cut and paste text from the web browser, but instead always want to scroll through a page, I wonder if it can be turned off.
Jun 17 14:38:33 <timeless> no
Jun 17 14:38:50 <timeless> you can upgrade to a new browser in 2010 or maybe 2009
Jun 17 14:39:13 <m-c> you say it will be redone, that's interesting.  okay, then I will use the directional pad until then.  :)
Jun 17 14:39:26 <lardman> timeless:  people might take that the wrong way - no updates for another year!
Jun 17 14:39:33 <timeless> http://timeless.justdave.net/maemo/microb-pageupdown-0.1.deb may or may not be useful
Jun 17 14:39:41 <GAN8001> m-c, stylus/finger scrolling is a lot better in svn.
Jun 17 14:39:47 <timeless> lardman: never quote me on schedules
Jun 17 14:39:53 <timeless> i always offer very large numbers :)
Jun 17 14:39:56 <lardman> timeless: :)
Jun 17 14:39:58 <m-c> Thanks GAN8001 and timeless
Jun 17 14:40:01 <timeless> to try to discourage people from trusting them
Jun 17 14:40:13 <timeless> m-c: anyway, that deb might be to your liking
Jun 17 14:40:19 <timeless> no warrantee of course, but..
Jun 17 14:42:41 <GAN8001> I need to try using the microb svn in Diablo again.
Jun 17 14:43:06 <hrw> lardman: priv/
Jun 17 14:43:07 <hrw> ?
Jun 17 14:46:43 <qwerty111> Nokia aren't really specific on their internal bugs are they? "
Jun 17 14:46:43 <qwerty111>   * Fixes: NB#83382 Browser: 'Browserd' and, 'Internal Error...', Crash
Jun 17 14:48:47 <andre____> "I got this funny text, "Browserd", in the upper right hand corner of the browser."
Jun 17 14:48:48 <andre____> heh
Jun 17 14:50:24 <GAN8001> You done got Browserd, boy!
Jun 17 14:54:36 <RST38h> browserd must be a daemon that automatically loads Internet to your tablet
Jun 17 14:54:52 <qwerty111> It's more like the engine process
Jun 17 14:54:58 <X-Fade> RST38h: Sure, the offline internet. ;)
Jun 17 14:55:06 <RST38h> it must be the evil daemon St Steve Jobs warned us against in the iPhone SDK agreement
Jun 17 14:55:54 <GAN8001> Automatically loads a typoed Bowser onto your tablet?
Jun 17 14:55:59 <GAN8001> That sounds unpleasant.
Jun 17 14:56:10 <qwerty111> Can't escape from firefox crashes in Linux, can't escape from them in Windows >.<
Jun 17 14:56:30 <GAN8001> Why don't you just switch back to 2.0?
Jun 17 14:56:41 <Khertan> ah ... 3.0 is available ?
Jun 17 14:57:02 <summatusmentis> I don't like needing to use flasher for all these things... fix it!
Jun 17 14:57:04 <qwerty111> GAN8001, In Windows, mine is 2.0. But I admit going extension crazy
Jun 17 14:57:11 <GAN8001> <_<
Jun 17 14:57:12 <Khertan> ah ... still the 2.x ...
Jun 17 14:57:18 <GAN8001> There's your problem. . . .
Jun 17 14:57:28 <Atarii> talking of firefox isnt 3 released today?
Jun 17 14:57:37 * GAN8001 takes summatusmentis's N810 away from him.
Jun 17 14:57:39 <GAN8001> There, fixed.
Jun 17 14:57:44 <qwerty111> Heh
Jun 17 14:57:49 <Khertan> i thought ... but it seems to be 19h00 GMT+1
Jun 17 14:57:54 <Atarii> aha
Jun 17 14:58:07 <Khertan> or 20h00 GMT+1
Jun 17 14:58:12 <Khertan> i don't remember
Jun 17 14:58:19 <summatusmentis> GAN8001: but.... but.... no!!!
Jun 17 14:58:38 <GAN8001> You'll get it back when you can learn to appreciate nice things. :P
Jun 17 14:58:39 <aquatix> hm, is there some ctrl+key combo for pgup?
Jun 17 14:58:51 <qwerty111> Man, I wish loader.o would compile for the Nokia 2.6.21 kernel :(
Jun 17 14:58:54 <summatusmentis> I appreciate nice things! I appreciate nice things!
Jun 17 14:58:54 <Khertan> i hope server will crash ... just to have the most request before a server out in guinness record :)
Jun 17 14:59:30 * qwerty111 gets my DDoS program ready :p
Jun 17 14:59:36 <summatusmentis> aquatix: in irssi it's esc + p
Jun 17 15:00:19 <GAN8001> aquatix, shift-space will do it in the browser.
Jun 17 15:00:28 <Fatal> (and esc n for pgdn)
Jun 17 15:02:02 <summatusmentis> GAN8001: I just wanna be able to enable/disable rd mode from the device itself
Jun 17 15:02:31 <qwerty111> summatusmentis, Reverse engineer the config partition
Jun 17 15:02:39 <GAN8001> summatusmentis, why do you need R&D?
Jun 17 15:02:44 <X-Fade> summatusmentis: Why would you want to switch all the time? :)
Jun 17 15:02:48 <GAN8001> There's absolutely nothing that you need it for.
Jun 17 15:02:55 <aquatix> summatusmentis: works, but also closes the terminal
Jun 17 15:03:22 <summatusmentis> except flashing new initfs', installing diablo, etc. etc.
Jun 17 15:03:33 <GAN8001> You don't need R&D for that.
Jun 17 15:03:36 <GAN8001> Just lifeguard for Diablo
Jun 17 15:03:41 <GAN8001> and you can just leave that off. :\
Jun 17 15:03:53 <summatusmentis> you can leave off lifeguard?
Jun 17 15:03:57 <GAN8001> Sure
Jun 17 15:03:58 <qwerty111> summatusmentis, installing easyroot from www.nitapps.com will remove the RD mode message from initfs_flasher
Jun 17 15:03:59 <summatusmentis> I thought lifeguard needed rd
Jun 17 15:04:05 <GAN8001> You can leave off all of the watchdogs.
Jun 17 15:04:38 <aquatix> brb, leaving train ina few sec
Jun 17 15:04:58 <X-Fade> But run the risk that you have to remove your battery to reboot a device which hangs ;)
Jun 17 15:05:30 <summatusmentis> meh, I used to do that a lot w/ my Z :) (or at least the cover, and push the reset button)
Jun 17 15:06:16 * lardman thanks whichever Nokia hw engineer designed the N810 to not need a chisel to remove the battery
Jun 17 15:06:47 <qwerty111> I'm constantly taking out the battery when it freezes, I'm lazy, I can't be arsed to disable the rd-flag for diablo and I like RD-mode because of the green info and I can't be arsed to modify the initfs to show me that information all the time even when RD-Mode is off
Jun 17 15:08:02 <summatusmentis> whereis boot menu?
Jun 17 15:08:11 <GAN8001> lardman, just tap the N800 on your palm. ;)
Jun 17 15:08:14 <GAN8001> It comes right out.
Jun 17 15:08:22 <summatusmentis> s/whereis/where is/
Jun 17 15:08:22 <infobot> summatusmentis meant: where is boot menu?
Jun 17 15:08:34 <GAN8001> summatusmentis, fanoush's initfs, you mean?
Jun 17 15:08:34 <summatusmentis> s/boot menu/bootmenu.conf/
Jun 17 15:08:35 <infobot> summatusmentis meant: whereis bootmenu.conf?
Jun 17 15:08:40 <summatusmentis> yeah
Jun 17 15:08:46 <lardman> GAN8001: I was thinking more of the 770 where you had to throw it at the floor and hopefully it would come out :)
Jun 17 15:08:49 <GAN8001> In the folder you download.
Jun 17 15:08:57 <summatusmentis> I want to set the time-out time to longer than 0
Jun 17 15:09:04 <GAN8001> lardman, I can get the batteries out of my 770 with my fingernail.
Jun 17 15:09:10 <summatusmentis> it stays there? it doesn't get moved to some-place else?
Jun 17 15:09:12 <GAN8001> N800 was a regression from the 770 in that regard.
Jun 17 15:09:17 * lardman needs to drink more milk :)
Jun 17 15:09:18 <qwerty111> summatusmentis, copy the example one to bootmenu.conf
Jun 17 15:09:25 <GAN8001> summatusmentis, change it and reflash the initfs.
Jun 17 15:09:58 <summatusmentis> oh... ok
Jun 17 15:10:20 <qwerty111> lardman, I only drink it because my mom makes me :P
Jun 17 15:11:07 <summatusmentis> the example one has a time-out of thirty, but it's not giving me 1 second on boot, let alone 30
Jun 17 15:12:16 <GAN8001> My memory tells me that this is a dupe, somebody want to pull the bug number out of a hat for me? https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=3253
Jun 17 15:18:17 <GAN8001> Ah, https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2009 Thanks for the help, guys. ;)
Jun 17 15:18:38 <timeless> hey andre?
Jun 17 15:18:39 <lardman> I'm tempted to reply, but not sure I should do - Darius
Jun 17 15:18:44 <timeless> about 'mas', does chr-a let you cycle through and get the accented a?
Jun 17 15:19:17 <timeless> i think it does, but i have an n810 that's running just short of the original shipping (chinook)
Jun 17 15:19:27 <timeless> and then we have internal images running after diablo-23
Jun 17 15:19:31 * andre____ looks up
Jun 17 15:19:34 <andre____> hmm? :)
Jun 17 15:19:36 <timeless> so i'd rather get someone here to confirm w/ diablo-23
Jun 17 15:19:45 <timeless> basically, m;chr+a;s
Jun 17 15:19:51 <sp3000> oh so that's how I've been getting weird characters occasionally
Jun 17 15:19:53 <timeless> does chr+a give you 'a
Jun 17 15:20:06 <timeless> (in browser, you should recognize the bug)
Jun 17 15:21:00 <sp3000> it gives me all sorts of stuff in d21
Jun 17 15:21:15 <sp3000> except the first time it didn't cycle but appended
Jun 17 15:22:23 <andre____> timeless: laugh, but i don't have a diablo build, only classic chinook on n810
Jun 17 15:23:13 <andre____> GAN8001, want to mark 3253 as dup of 2009, or shall i? :)
Jun 17 15:23:18 <GAN8001> I
Jun 17 15:23:20 <GAN8001> O
Jun 17 15:23:24 <GAN8001> Goddamnit
Jun 17 15:23:34 <GAN8001> I'm writing up some boilerplate as we speak.
Jun 17 15:23:39 <GAN8001> (stupid Apple keyboard)
Jun 17 15:23:55 <timeless> andre: heh
Jun 17 15:24:00 <timeless> you need more devices :)
Jun 17 15:25:15 <aquatix> anybody knows why esc+p and esc+n also close the current terminal window?
Jun 17 15:25:16 <andre____> timeless, uargh. i'm already content that i can more or less use these radio and tv thingies of my g/f ;-))
Jun 17 15:25:35 <lcuk2> ~lart my collegue
Jun 17 15:25:37 * infobot stabs my collegue
Jun 17 15:25:41 <aquatix> [using ssh, screen, irssi]
Jun 17 15:25:51 <Fatal> aquatix: it shouldn't, however if you keep esc pressed it will close the current app
Jun 17 15:26:02 <Fatal> aquatix: are you pressing esc+p or esc, p ?
Jun 17 15:26:13 <Fatal> (it's esc then p and esc then n)
Jun 17 15:26:56 <aquatix> oh
Jun 17 15:26:59 <aquatix> together
Jun 17 15:27:06 <aquatix> so long esc press
Jun 17 15:27:11 <aquatix> hm, that closes current app?
Jun 17 15:27:14 <Fatal> that's not how to do it :)
Jun 17 15:27:15 <Fatal> yes
Jun 17 15:27:17 * aquatix learns something new
Jun 17 15:27:22 <aquatix> interesting
Jun 17 15:28:00 <aquatix> well, summatusmentis said esc+p, and that's a combo in my regard, so i typed it that way :)
Jun 17 15:28:26 <Fatal> :)
Jun 17 15:28:53 <aquatix> but paging up and down that way is a hassle ;)
Jun 17 15:29:04 <aquatix> ssh over gprs already isn't that fast...
Jun 17 15:29:36 <Fatal> over shaky 3g it's decent :)
Jun 17 15:29:56 <qwerty111> aquatix, time to upgrade to a UMTS phone? (Or even better, HSPDA?) :P
Jun 17 15:30:07 <aquatix> qwerty111: i have an umts phone
Jun 17 15:30:25 <aquatix> but i won't pay $large_amount_euros for flat-fee mobile internet
Jun 17 15:30:53 <aquatix> 10 euro/month i can justify
Jun 17 15:34:59 * timeless ponders
Jun 17 15:35:24 <aquatix> qwerty111: i now pay 7 euro/month for flat-fee gprs (was some action), and flat-fee umts/hsdpa is 29,95 euro/month
Jun 17 15:35:27 <timeless> anyone here know of  a url for a xine icon/logo
Jun 17 15:35:33 <aquatix> that's what i pay for my 20MBit adsl+phone
Jun 17 15:36:04 <aquatix> timeless: /usr/share/pixmaps/gxine.png
Jun 17 15:36:13 <aquatix> at least, here on my machine ;)
Jun 17 15:36:23 <timeless> that's not a url
Jun 17 15:36:32 <qwerty111> aquatix, Ahh, I can see why :/
Jun 17 15:36:32 <timeless> is it something like http://www.bluebeamentertainment.com/xine/traditional_logo.jpg ?
Jun 17 15:37:10 <aquatix> qwerty111: :)
Jun 17 15:37:40 <qwerty111> xine (and ui) actually compiles for maemo too
Jun 17 15:37:47 <aquatix> qwerty111: hsdpa is a *lot* better though; aside from being faster, the latency is a lot lower
Jun 17 15:37:53 <aquatix> qwerty111: heh, cool
Jun 17 15:39:31 <Khertan> noone have yet ban darius ?
Jun 17 15:39:39 <Khertan> from the mailing list ... ?
Jun 17 15:39:47 <GAN8001> Hehe
Jun 17 15:39:53 <GAN8001> Oh, X-Fade, ping.
Jun 17 15:40:19 <aquatix> qwerty111: whoa, i just notice that that 29,95 euro/month tarif is an action too, normally it's 45,22 euro
Jun 17 15:40:20 <X-Fade> GAN8001: pong
Jun 17 15:41:05 <GAN8001> I sent the email about the voting stuff to the midgard list from my dotmac account, which is the account I'm subscribed with. It said it was being held in the moderation queue.
Jun 17 15:41:12 <GAN8001> Not sure if it ever actually made it to the list.
Jun 17 15:41:22 <X-Fade> GAN8001: it didn't.
Jun 17 15:41:31 <Khertan> hum ... your dotmac ?
Jun 17 15:41:47 <Khertan> take care that it s not youraccount@me.com
Jun 17 15:41:57 <Khertan> if i remember switch will be automatic
Jun 17 15:41:59 <qwerty111> .Mac - http://www.apple.com/dotmac/
Jun 17 15:42:02 <GAN8001> X-Fade, want me to resend using gmail, then?
Jun 17 15:42:23 <timeless>   http://www.tr0ll.net/libsdl/contest/ is pretty
Jun 17 15:42:28 <johnx> timeless, http://xine.cvs.sourceforge.net/*checkout*/xine/xine-ui/misc/desktops/xine.xpm?revision=1.2
Jun 17 15:42:41 <Khertan> qwerty111 > thx :)
Jun 17 15:43:13 <X-Fade> GAN8001: I don't think I have access to that listmanager.
Jun 17 15:43:17 <timeless> johnx: png/svg/gif/jpg/ico? :)
Jun 17 15:43:22 <johnx> xpm :D
Jun 17 15:43:30 <johnx> ugly as sin too
Jun 17 15:43:33 <aquatix> timeless: that's where gimp comes in ;)
Jun 17 15:43:37 <johnx> I'd use a 3rd party one if I were you
Jun 17 15:43:48 <Khertan> i like the logo number 9
Jun 17 15:43:49 <timeless> http://www.ohloh.net/projects/sdl
Jun 17 15:44:15 <timeless> ^ that's based on the official logo
Jun 17 15:44:21 <timeless> it didn't really survive the transform
Jun 17 15:44:21 <aquatix> Khertan: quite nice indeed, but doesn't scale down i guess
Jun 17 15:45:07 <timeless> btw, you guys should take notes from these various logo contests and import the useful bits into the maemo contest :)
Jun 17 15:47:17 <Khertan> aquatix > true
Jun 17 15:48:03 <Khertan> timeless > but with i'm still not able to do something that not look like as something a 3 year aged child could do with mspaint :)
Jun 17 15:48:07 <aquatix> eek, #14 is ugly
Jun 17 15:48:50 <Khertan> No.37
Jun 17 15:48:53 <Khertan> more funny
Jun 17 15:48:58 <macoute> timeless: you saw this sketch?  http://suursavo.org/temp/maemoicon64x64.png
Jun 17 15:49:31 <Khertan> no tm if i remember :)
Jun 17 15:50:50 <timeless> macoute: interesting, but (tm) is a problem
Jun 17 15:50:58 <timeless> unless someone's really holding a tm on the art
Jun 17 15:51:05 <n800m> http://img902.mytextgraphics.com/sparklee/2008/06/17/35367509d6357742cca2666b1ab3b5ac.gif
Jun 17 15:51:07 <n800m> my entry
Jun 17 15:51:25 <aquatix> timeless: that'd be a copyright then, not a trademark
Jun 17 15:51:25 <macoute> timeless: its from the original logo
Jun 17 15:51:32 <macoute> so i thought it is a trademark?
Jun 17 15:51:35 <aquatix> maemo is an official trademark?
Jun 17 15:51:40 <macoute> it seems so :)
Jun 17 15:51:45 <aquatix> n800m: whoa :)
Jun 17 15:52:04 <macoute> of course the trademark is not mine, my work is free
Jun 17 15:52:39 <aquatix> macoute: it can be free, but still have a trademark ;)
Jun 17 15:52:46 <aquatix> [like mozilla's stuff]
Jun 17 15:53:13 <macoute> aquatix: yeah, thats true
Jun 17 15:53:21 <macoute> but imo mozillas logos arent free :)
Jun 17 15:53:38 <aquatix> well, they aren't Free
Jun 17 15:53:50 <n800m> phree
Jun 17 15:53:59 <aquatix> they can be used for free, as long as they ship with the unaltered product
Jun 17 15:54:04 <aquatix> or something
Jun 17 15:54:07 <Khertan> Vote for this one !!! : http://khertan.net/poubelle/logo1.png
Jun 17 15:54:08 <Khertan> :)
Jun 17 15:54:13 <Mousey> hence iceweasel
Jun 17 15:54:15 * timeless grumbles
Jun 17 15:54:18 <aquatix> Mousey: 'xactly
Jun 17 15:54:27 <timeless> http://www.nano-editor.org/favicon.ico
Jun 17 15:54:31 <timeless> can anyone find a bigger icon?
Jun 17 15:54:46 <timeless> (64x64 is best)
Jun 17 15:55:08 <GAN8001> Ahahaha, omg, that's awesome n800m.
Jun 17 15:55:18 <GAN8001> Can you add Hello Kitty, too? :D
Jun 17 15:55:23 <aquatix> noooooes
Jun 17 15:55:35 <aquatix> http://www.kittyhell.com/ :D
Jun 17 15:55:36 <hrw> timeless: I had VGA sized favicon
Jun 17 15:55:57 <qwerty111> timeless, kinda - http://www.gnu.org.ua/software/nano/nano.jpg
Jun 17 15:56:10 <Khertan> timeless > i ve this one : http://khertan.net/poubelle/logo2.png :)
Jun 17 15:57:08 <n800m> lol @ giant pixels
Jun 17 15:57:27 <timeless> khertan: Firefox can't find the server at khertan.net.
Jun 17 15:57:28 <GAN8001> aquatix, http://www.ioquake.org/forums/index.php
Jun 17 15:57:32 <GAN8001> Hooray Hello Sarge
Jun 17 15:58:02 <aquatix> GAN8001: omg
Jun 17 15:58:23 <macoute> aquatix: they can be used if not separated from each other and they only refer to the official (or derivated from official) product
Jun 17 15:59:00 <aquatix> macoute: yeah, that's it
Jun 17 15:59:07 <macoute> so i cant use firefox logo in my texteditor called "editor" or use firefox as a name for my linux distro, but i can use it as a logo for a modded firefox
Jun 17 15:59:45 <aquatix> erm
Jun 17 15:59:56 <aquatix> the latter isn't entirely true i think
Jun 17 16:00:04 <timeless> qwerty111: thanks
Jun 17 16:00:09 <n800m> i think it has to be the intact distro
Jun 17 16:00:14 <aquatix> as mozilla wants to protect its product image
Jun 17 16:00:20 <aquatix> n800m: indeed
Jun 17 16:00:50 <aquatix> so if someone mods a firefox, makes it less stable in the process and puts the firefox logo on it, that's `illegal'
Jun 17 16:00:58 <aquatix> as that erodes the brand firefox
Jun 17 16:01:10 <n800m> or makes it better and puts them to shame
Jun 17 16:01:17 <n800m> they don't like that either
Jun 17 16:01:18 <aquatix> ghehe
Jun 17 16:01:19 <timeless> qwerty: how about an rdesktop icon?
Jun 17 16:01:34 <timeless> n800m: that too actually
Jun 17 16:01:40 <timeless> if you have a feature in your browser
Jun 17 16:01:44 <RST38h> this is an obvious crime against open source
Jun 17 16:01:44 <timeless> and it isn't in the normal browser
Jun 17 16:01:55 <timeless> and people ask "why isn't this there"
Jun 17 16:02:01 <timeless> well, you've now confused the market
Jun 17 16:02:02 <aquatix> GAN8001: daaamn, that forum scares me :/
Jun 17 16:02:09 <timeless> or if people tell their friends "firefox has x"
Jun 17 16:02:17 <n800m> yeah that's what i was saying
Jun 17 16:02:18 <timeless> and then their friends go, get firefox, find it doesn't have x
Jun 17 16:02:21 <timeless> and blame mozilla for it ...
Jun 17 16:02:22 <aquatix> RST38h: sure is, but if you have a trademark, you should protect it
Jun 17 16:02:40 <macoute> aquatix, n800m: it needs to be "of quality work"
Jun 17 16:02:41 <aquatix> RST38h: same with people saying `i'll google it!' and opening yahoo! or msn search
Jun 17 16:02:57 <n800m> haha
Jun 17 16:02:59 <macoute> ubuntus firefox is not the same firefox you can dl from mozilla.org, but they can use the logos
Jun 17 16:03:02 <aquatix> it's all about protecting your name and image
Jun 17 16:03:07 * RST38h urgently trademarks "jackass"
Jun 17 16:03:07 <timeless> see stories of "kleenex", "ketchup", "xerox"
Jun 17 16:03:21 <aquatix> macoute: yeah, mozilla also wanted to approve changes
Jun 17 16:03:22 <n800m> i firefoxed you
Jun 17 16:03:29 <aquatix> if they approve, it's ok to mod
Jun 17 16:03:38 <macoute> aquatix: oh, that could be true too.
Jun 17 16:03:42 <aquatix> but debian wanted to push security patches as soon as possible
Jun 17 16:03:47 <aquatix> without going through mozilla
Jun 17 16:03:53 <timeless> um
Jun 17 16:03:56 <timeless> that was a claim
Jun 17 16:04:01 <timeless> but it wasn't what they actually did
Jun 17 16:04:09 <timeless> what they did was include very bogus patches
Jun 17 16:04:17 <timeless> which broke various parts of the app
Jun 17 16:04:22 <aquatix> oh?
Jun 17 16:04:24 <macoute> timeless: at what point?
Jun 17 16:04:29 <timeless> consistently
Jun 17 16:04:41 <aquatix> timeless: do you have an example?
Jun 17 16:04:42 <n800m> maybe you give them too much credit
Jun 17 16:04:47 <macoute> so you are saying that debian fucked up the whole firefox?
Jun 17 16:04:53 <aquatix> i've used it on debian as long as i used debian :/
Jun 17 16:04:58 <timeless> macoute: it's sufficient to mess up one major feature
Jun 17 16:04:59 <aquatix> like, 5 years or more
Jun 17 16:05:02 <timeless> or break a security feature
Jun 17 16:05:09 <macoute> timeless: but which feature?
Jun 17 16:05:14 <timeless> you don't have to break each and every part
Jun 17 16:05:27 <macoute> i havent heard of that matter
Jun 17 16:05:32 <macoute> so im kinda interested
Jun 17 16:05:37 * aquatix too
Jun 17 16:05:59 <timeless> it's really best to leave this skeleton in its closet
Jun 17 16:06:05 <timeless> i happen to know where most of them are
Jun 17 16:06:19 <timeless> in a number of cases, i'm one of the people who uncovered or burried them :)
Jun 17 16:06:27 <timeless> i was involved in this stuff ..
Jun 17 16:06:51 <aquatix> myeah, but now you're claiming something that i didn't experience
Jun 17 16:06:59 <aquatix> so i'm curious :)
Jun 17 16:07:04 <aquatix> not saying that you're wrong of course
Jun 17 16:07:17 <n800m> let's agree debian is sneaky
Jun 17 16:07:26 <n800m> shifty eyes and all
Jun 17 16:07:27 <timeless> sneaky isn't the right word
Jun 17 16:07:31 <n800m> there's a logo for you!
Jun 17 16:07:31 <aquatix> as quite some projects are ;)
Jun 17 16:07:45 <macoute> me neither, but i havent heard or seen any breakages in firefox/iceweasel which i havent discovered in vanilla
Jun 17 16:08:10 <macoute> flash being one of them :)
Jun 17 16:08:35 <aquatix> flash breaks anyway
Jun 17 16:08:41 <aquatix> don't need firefox for that ;)
Jun 17 16:08:44 <johnx> flash is broken in general
Jun 17 16:08:48 <macoute> thats badly true :)
Jun 17 16:09:02 <macoute> havent used it in ages, but now installed 9 for testing
Jun 17 16:09:09 <macoute> and im pretty much ready to uninstall it :)
Jun 17 16:09:25 <johnx> It's permanently blocked on all my machines, except on youtube :/
Jun 17 16:09:31 <timeless> http://74.125.39.104/search?q=cache%3Ahttp%3A%2F%2Fcbeard.typepad.com%2Fmozilla%2F2006%2F10%2Fmozilla_tradema.html&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a
Jun 17 16:09:45 <timeless> might have enough details
Jun 17 16:09:51 <dneary> Wow
Jun 17 16:09:55 * aquatix reads
Jun 17 16:10:15 <timeless> it doesn't look like it does, sadly
Jun 17 16:10:16 <dneary> Two questions asking for general information on xulrunner in one day, both from Indian names
Jun 17 16:10:19 <dneary> Coincidence?
Jun 17 16:10:20 <timeless> but it's definitely worth a read
Jun 17 16:10:30 <timeless> dneary: highly unlikely
Jun 17 16:12:30 <aquatix> timeless: i think i already read that post once
Jun 17 16:12:40 * timeless sighs
Jun 17 16:12:45 <timeless> finding the right patch sets is hard
Jun 17 16:12:51 <timeless> from memory the ff1.5 set was really bad
Jun 17 16:12:56 <timeless> but please don't quote me
Jun 17 16:13:03 * aquatix blogs
Jun 17 16:13:03 <timeless> (and yes, i know this is logged)
Jun 17 16:13:05 <aquatix> timeless: ;)
Jun 17 16:13:26 <timeless> one change which was wrong: http://benjamin.smedbergs.us/blog/2006-02-22/debian-versioning-of-mozilla-libraries-harmful/
Jun 17 16:13:36 <timeless> it's not the reason we don't like them
Jun 17 16:13:42 <timeless> at least, not the reason for the big problems
Jun 17 16:14:02 <timeless> but it's one of many things they've done which defeats the design of mozilla/gecko/firefox
Jun 17 16:15:55 * timeless sighs
Jun 17 16:16:00 * timeless hates trying to find debian sources
Jun 17 16:16:09 <timeless> can someone find me a debian firefox 1.5 changelog?
Jun 17 16:16:10 <aquatix> they have an svn ;)
Jun 17 16:16:18 <timeless> ^^
Jun 17 16:17:16 <timeless> aquatix: that upstream has to go hunting for the list of changes in some random location from each of its downstreams is a problem of its own
Jun 17 16:17:28 <aquatix> erm
Jun 17 16:17:32 <aquatix> why would you?
Jun 17 16:17:42 <aquatix> if they want it upstream, they should push
Jun 17 16:17:50 <timeless> to see what random unacceptable hacks they've poisoned a product with
Jun 17 16:17:55 <aquatix> myeah
Jun 17 16:18:28 <aquatix> ugh
Jun 17 16:18:39 <aquatix> 1.5 wasn't in an official release
Jun 17 16:18:49 <aquatix> http://packages.debian.org/sarge-backports/firefox
Jun 17 16:18:58 <aquatix> 1.0 was in sarge, 2.0 in etch
Jun 17 16:19:01 <timeless> i want a url to a changelog
Jun 17 16:19:06 <timeless> i'm reading http://changelogs.ubuntu.com/changelogs/pool/main/m/mozilla-firefox-locale-all/mozilla-firefox-locale-all_1.5ubuntu20051207-6/changelog atm
Jun 17 16:19:15 <timeless> although it occurs to me, that that is a locale package
Jun 17 16:19:34 <aquatix> timeless: to the right there's a link with dev info
Jun 17 16:19:51 <aquatix> meh
Jun 17 16:19:53 <aquatix> useless
Jun 17 16:19:57 * aquatix looks
Jun 17 16:20:59 <aquatix> http://packages.debian.org/changelogs/pool/main/i/iceweasel/iceweasel_2.0.0.14-2/changelog
Jun 17 16:21:22 <aquatix> timeless: that might be useful
Jun 17 16:21:36 <timeless> i don't care about iceweasel
Jun 17 16:21:42 <timeless> please keep in mind that this stuff is from 2003
Jun 17 16:21:51 <aquatix> yeah, but that's where the firefox changelog is
Jun 17 16:21:53 <timeless> what matters is which broken changes were made before then
Jun 17 16:22:24 * timeless wonders if it was in firefox or mozilla
Jun 17 16:22:28 * timeless thinks it was probably mozilla
Jun 17 16:22:28 <aquatix> eh
Jun 17 16:22:38 <aquatix> in 2003 it was phoenix :)
Jun 17 16:22:50 <timeless> http://changelogs.ubuntu.com/changelogs/pool/main/m/mozilla/mozilla_1.7.13-0ubuntu5.10/changelog
Jun 17 16:22:55 <timeless>   * debian/patches/embedding-alttext-tooltip:
Jun 17 16:22:56 <timeless>     - show IMG alt text in tooltip if title isn't (embedding only) (#98436)
Jun 17 16:22:56 <timeless>       [HELP]: I coudn't implement it into generic mozilla.
Jun 17 16:22:56 <timeless>       (mozilla.org have tagged it WONTFIX at bugzilla.)
Jun 17 16:23:13 <aquatix> hm
Jun 17 16:23:22 * timeless grumbles
Jun 17 16:23:27 <timeless> that's one of them
Jun 17 16:23:45 <timeless> what numberspace is that number from?
Jun 17 16:24:07 <aquatix> http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=98436
Jun 17 16:24:42 <timeless> and where's the reference to the upstream bug?
Jun 17 16:24:57 <timeless> for those of us who don't like trying to hunt through murk
Jun 17 16:24:58 <aquatix> nowhere that i can see
Jun 17 16:25:03 <timeless> ...
Jun 17 16:25:15 <timeless> i hope you can start to appreciate just how painful this was
Jun 17 16:25:20 <aquatix> hm-hmm
Jun 17 16:25:27 <timeless> it took ages to figure out which stupid package actually contained which stupid hacks
Jun 17 16:25:37 <timeless> then it took ages to figure out what the hacks were doing
Jun 17 16:25:43 <aquatix> [nowadays, the debian bugtracker integrates with bugzilla and such btw]
Jun 17 16:25:47 <timeless> i know
Jun 17 16:25:54 <timeless> things are better
Jun 17 16:26:04 <aquatix> maintainers might have a better clue :)
Jun 17 16:26:08 <timeless> fwiw, there's actually a nice twist of irony here
Jun 17 16:26:23 <timeless> i was one of the people who complained about the debian package because they had so many bad patches
Jun 17 16:26:33 <timeless> well... microb has more bad patches than debian ever did :(
Jun 17 16:26:37 <timeless> and i work on microb
Jun 17 16:26:55 <timeless> there's one difference though :), we aren't called "mozilla" or "firefox" :)
Jun 17 16:26:59 <johnx> it's sad, because overall I like Debian as a distribution
Jun 17 16:26:59 <aquatix> ghehehe
Jun 17 16:27:12 <aquatix> johnx: yups, my favourite too
Jun 17 16:27:19 <timeless> johnx: for end users, debian is nice
Jun 17 16:27:21 * aquatix runs ubuntu on his new workstation though
Jun 17 16:27:23 <timeless> for upstreams, it's a nightmare
Jun 17 16:27:42 <aquatix> timeless: well, some upstreams at least
Jun 17 16:27:52 <aquatix> but you have more insight in it than me
Jun 17 16:27:54 <timeless> debian packages, and i can point to a number (not just mozilla/firefox, also bugzilla, and one of the cdwriters)
Jun 17 16:27:56 <johnx> I can understand that...that's why I think it's sad :/
Jun 17 16:28:03 <timeless> tend to be hacked so their directory structure doesn't match
Jun 17 16:28:12 <timeless> resulting in bugs and incompatibilities and feature breaks
Jun 17 16:28:17 <timeless> that don't exist upstream
Jun 17 16:28:18 <aquatix> cdwriter stuff is because the upstream author is a jerk
Jun 17 16:28:25 * timeless shrugs
Jun 17 16:28:28 <timeless> he's hard to deal w/ sure
Jun 17 16:28:30 <aquatix> they froked
Jun 17 16:28:31 <johnx> OTOH, that's one of the things that make debian nice: every package puts things where I expect it
Jun 17 16:28:34 <aquatix> *forked
Jun 17 16:28:40 <timeless> so is one of the dns upstreams iirc
Jun 17 16:28:42 <aquatix> johnx: indeed
Jun 17 16:28:44 <timeless> and one of the mail upstreams
Jun 17 16:28:57 <timeless> otoh, their code and product is good
Jun 17 16:29:16 <timeless> fwiw wrt bugzilla, the debian dev has been working to reduce the forkage
Jun 17 16:29:24 <aquatix> timeless: it's generally a weird kind of people though, indeed :)
Jun 17 16:29:25 <timeless> but iirc it's still too hashed for my tastes
Jun 17 16:29:40 <timeless> and no, i don't like trying to find the deltas and reading them
Jun 17 16:29:45 * aquatix likes hanging around with the debian xfce people though
Jun 17 16:29:46 <Khertan> bye
Jun 17 16:29:51 <aquatix> Khertan: cya
Jun 17 16:30:16 <timeless> anyway, i think the url i referenced w/ the 1.7 changelog probably has most of the bad changes in it
Jun 17 16:30:26 <timeless> so if you really want to search around, you could probably find them by reading it
Jun 17 16:30:59 <timeless> oh, there's also the debian practice of messing w/ version numbers
Jun 17 16:31:07 <timeless> which meant that if we said a bug was fixed in x.y.z
Jun 17 16:31:13 <timeless> they might have the fix in x.y-1
Jun 17 16:31:22 <timeless> which confuses our users and our upgrade story
Jun 17 16:31:25 <timeless> and everyone's version checking
Jun 17 16:31:39 <timeless> i think someone may have mentioned that problem already
Jun 17 16:31:40 <aquatix> timeless: isn't that backporting?
Jun 17 16:31:53 <timeless> aquatix: so...
Jun 17 16:31:59 <timeless> some things just aren't ok
Jun 17 16:32:05 <timeless> if i ship 1.0.0.1
Jun 17 16:32:05 <aquatix> especially in stable releases, they don't like upgrading the entire package
Jun 17 16:32:14 <timeless> either 1.0.0.1 has a feature or it doesn't
Jun 17 16:32:16 <aquatix> but debian has volatile now
Jun 17 16:32:24 <timeless> aquatix: well... the thing is
Jun 17 16:32:31 <timeless> gecko has always had stable releases
Jun 17 16:32:34 <timeless> and security releases
Jun 17 16:32:40 <aquatix> yeah, but if 1.0.0.0 is in stable, that fix will be ported to 1.0.0.0-2
Jun 17 16:32:41 <timeless> you shouldn't be backporting when those exist
Jun 17 16:32:56 <aquatix> agreed
Jun 17 16:33:00 <aquatix> just update the whole mess
Jun 17 16:33:01 <timeless> you're breaking a version contract
Jun 17 16:33:05 <aquatix> i think debian is doing that now
Jun 17 16:33:12 <aquatix> not sure though
Jun 17 16:34:28 <timeless> anyway, keep in mind this is all from 2003
Jun 17 16:34:30 <timeless> or thereabouts
Jun 17 16:34:43 <hrw> aquatix: not 1.0.0.0-2 but 1.0.0.0-etch2 rather
Jun 17 16:34:43 <timeless> one would hope debian is better now
Jun 17 16:43:13 <GAN800> Hi, konttori.
Jun 17 16:46:26 <GAN800> lol . . . soft poweroff stopped working again. <_<
Jun 17 16:47:30 <qwerty111> Is your home button working?
Jun 17 16:47:49 <GAN8001> Yes.
Jun 17 16:48:10 <qwerty111> Ah skeen, I have to hold down the power button after resuming from softpoweroff.
Jun 17 16:48:44 <qwerty111> But I want suspendtoram to work properly instead, I've only ever got it to work once using FTD
Jun 17 16:50:45 <timeless> hrm, does koffice not have a logo?
Jun 17 16:51:02 * aquatix goes cooking some dinner
Jun 17 16:51:04 <aquatix> laters all
Jun 17 16:51:43 <johnx> mmm...dinner
Jun 17 16:51:52 <aquatix> johnx: i can recommend it ;)
Jun 17 16:52:07 * johnx pulls curry off the stove
Jun 17 16:52:22 * aquatix will be making some spaghetti
Jun 17 16:52:26 <aquatix> that is, if i leave now
Jun 17 16:52:34 <aquatix> otherwise, the gf will throw it to my head
Jun 17 16:52:36 <aquatix> *gone*
Jun 17 16:52:38 <johnx> :D
Jun 17 16:52:41 <johnx> 'later
Jun 17 16:52:54 <macoute> are the hardware buttons programmable by xmodmap?
Jun 17 16:53:07 <macoute> so that could i get display to turn from them?
Jun 17 16:53:54 <johnx> yes, I believe so
Jun 17 16:54:10 <johnx> also, the powerlaunch program seems to accomplish something similar
Jun 17 16:54:13 <macoute> hmm, that could be worth investingation
Jun 17 16:54:36 <qwerty111> For rotation?
Jun 17 16:54:51 <macoute> qwerty111: yeh
Jun 17 16:55:32 <n800m> emjayes on ITT did something like that
Jun 17 16:55:44 <macoute> a dirty hack would be just fine as i dont need but 2 possible positions for display, normal and up
Jun 17 16:55:51 <qwerty111> macoute, This guy does what you want with powerlaunch: http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showpost.php?p=154624&postcount=28
Jun 17 16:56:15 <macoute> qwerty111: and he is using xmodmap too :P
Jun 17 16:57:01 <macoute> i need to tune that script a little to suit my needs
Jun 17 16:57:07 <n800m> using the power button for rotation turned out to be a pain for me
Jun 17 16:57:23 <n800m> not a pain, anoyance
Jun 17 16:57:26 <n800m> +n
Jun 17 16:57:36 <qwerty111> macout, actually, xmodmap is used after rotation to sort out the left, right, up, down button to match the rotation
Jun 17 16:57:40 <qwerty111> *macoute
Jun 17 16:58:22 <qwerty111> I stole those lines from the script and made an quick mod of the rotate applet to xmodmap those buttons with PH5's help :P
Jun 17 17:00:20 <crashanddie> anyone remember what you have to edit to get reboot in the power menu ?
Jun 17 17:01:11 <n800m> powerlaunch has that
Jun 17 17:01:14 <hrw> mce.ini
Jun 17 17:01:18 <hrw> iirc
Jun 17 17:01:47 <GAN8001> crashanddie, /etc/systemui/systemui.xml
Jun 17 17:02:05 <GAN8001> hrw, /etc/mce/mce.ini is for soft poweroff, the LEDs and locking.
Jun 17 17:02:27 <macoute> xml-confs are a pain in the ass :S
Jun 17 17:02:52 <GAN8001> You just have to delete/move one comment line. :\
Jun 17 17:03:04 <crashanddie> yeah, found it, thanks :)
Jun 17 17:03:15 <crashanddie> GAN8001, either way, you answered, found your post on ITT
Jun 17 17:03:18 <macoute> that maybe possible to do even with an xml configuration file :)
Jun 17 17:04:34 <qwerty111> mce.ini is for mapping the softpoweroff to the powerbutton
Jun 17 17:05:23 <GAN8001> Among other things, qwerty111.
Jun 17 17:05:29 <crashanddie> erhm, what is soft poweroff ?
Jun 17 17:05:50 <qwerty111> GAN8001, Obviously. I was refering to the vague "soft poweroff, "
Jun 17 17:06:34 <GAN8001> crashanddie, a really awesome feature that's been broken for close to 8 months now.
Jun 17 17:06:55 <n800m> works with powerlaunch tho
Jun 17 17:07:01 <n800m> or should it work differently?
Jun 17 17:07:07 <crashanddie> and, what does it do ?
Jun 17 17:07:10 <GAN8001> powerlaunch pretty much only manages to break my system.
Jun 17 17:07:14 <qwerty111> powerlaunch is buggy at best.
Jun 17 17:07:20 <qwerty111> V.customisable though.
Jun 17 17:07:31 <GAN8001> It's a bit like locking, except activated with just a longpress on the power button.
Jun 17 17:07:45 <LoCusF> is there an URL handler for maemo, eg. if you copy an url in x-term it opens it (automatically) in a browser or at least suggests it?
Jun 17 17:07:55 <n800m> hm it's been working fine here for the past week or so
Jun 17 17:08:30 <qwerty111> n800m, automatic/bootup lock is broken, alarms don't work and a few other things
Jun 17 17:08:38 <GAN8001> n800m, for me, it's either broken itself while installing and pretty much nuked apt, broken itself in use and nuked the power key or just plain didn't work.
Jun 17 17:09:17 <n800m> hm i haven't used alarms lately
Jun 17 17:09:19 <qwerty111> While a nuisance, the install errors can be fixed.
Jun 17 17:09:23 <n800m> glad you told me that
Jun 17 17:10:04 <crashanddie> ouch (28 No space left on device)
Jun 17 17:10:27 <n800m> scary
Jun 17 17:12:12 <qwerty111> ~lart windows installer
Jun 17 17:12:13 * infobot drops a truckload of VAXen on windows installer
Jun 17 17:13:00 <crashanddie> GAN8001, you discouraged installing the system on the internal memory card right ? (n810 here)
Jun 17 17:13:28 <Anunakin> I think better you use at external card
Jun 17 17:13:43 <n800m> totally
Jun 17 17:14:04 <qwerty111> I'd say use an External too.
Jun 17 17:14:06 <GAN8001> Did I?
Jun 17 17:14:18 * GAN8001 doesn't remember
Jun 17 17:14:28 <GAN8001> I may have, but it probably had some sort of context around it.
Jun 17 17:14:38 <GAN8001> Which I don't remember as of right now.
Jun 17 17:15:44 <Anunakin> because you can remove external memory... install a system ... and use a swap file... can reduce the life time of u card.
Jun 17 17:16:52 <macoute> how much does that actually affect the life of the card?
Jun 17 17:17:05 <GAN8001> These days? Not much.
Jun 17 17:17:52 <crashanddie> quite frankly, being on a n810, I don't think installing on an external card would be such a good idea
Jun 17 17:18:12 <GAN8001> Why?
Jun 17 17:18:17 <crashanddie> I want to be able to pull that card out, so i can transfer big chunks of data at once, without going through wifi/bluetooth/usb
Jun 17 17:18:21 <macoute> id prefer that too
Jun 17 17:18:31 <GAN8001> Then do that. :P
Jun 17 17:18:39 <crashanddie> I might
Jun 17 17:18:42 <crashanddie> 128Mb is a bit... light
Jun 17 17:18:43 <GAN8001> Pick the one that best suites your usage profile.
Jun 17 17:18:44 <macoute> my os is on a external card though
Jun 17 17:18:55 <macoute> as i do not use memory card readers
Jun 17 17:19:02 <GAN8001> I just use scp
Jun 17 17:19:05 <crashanddie> well
Jun 17 17:19:05 <macoute> but i still prefer the possibility of removing that :P
Jun 17 17:19:09 <GAN8001> as it's a pain to try to do it over USB.
Jun 17 17:19:15 <crashanddie> GAN800, word
Jun 17 17:19:20 <GAN8001> s/scp/sftp/
Jun 17 17:19:24 <macoute> scp is kinda slow, isnt it? (100k/s?)
Jun 17 17:19:33 <summatusmentis> I use sshfs :)
Jun 17 17:19:37 <GAN8001> I get about 700-1000KB/sec
Jun 17 17:19:40 <macoute> ah, ok
Jun 17 17:20:02 <GAN8001> Bluetooth is 120KB/sec
Jun 17 17:20:56 <macoute> apt-get at least only gets around 100-150KB/s on my NIT
Jun 17 17:21:03 <macoute> and i blame the card for that
Jun 17 17:21:09 <GAN8001> That's the server or something.
Jun 17 17:21:24 <macoute> that shouldnt be as i get more on my comp
Jun 17 17:21:32 <macoute> (i think?) :)
Jun 17 17:22:12 <lcuk2> dneary, 2 questions about xulrunner in the same day would suggest to me that someone and his friend are interested in the software.  nothing drastic or major :) its a win if we can help them
Jun 17 17:27:35 <l7> hmm
Jun 17 17:28:16 <l7> i think i ran into a problem where the n800 partially shuts down but not completely
Jun 17 17:28:29 <l7> i can't get it to restart from the power button and the screen is black
Jun 17 17:28:32 <l7> but i can ssh in
Jun 17 17:28:54 <l7> is there a specific process i need to kill?
Jun 17 17:29:55 <Anunakin> l7: are u using "shutdown -r now" ?
Jun 17 17:30:02 <Anunakin> not use reboot
Jun 17 17:30:03 <l7> i tried "reboot"
Jun 17 17:30:17 <l7> hmm, i'll try shutdown -r now
Jun 17 17:30:21 <lcuk2> l7, simplest: pop the battery
Jun 17 17:30:22 <Anunakin> try shutdown -r now
Jun 17 17:30:42 <l7> doesn't work..
Jun 17 17:30:49 <lcuk2> command not available i think
Jun 17 17:30:55 <l7> Nokia-N800-50-2:~# shutdown -r now
Jun 17 17:30:55 <l7> Broadcast message from root (pts/0) (Tue Jun 17 17:30:54 2008):
Jun 17 17:30:55 <l7> The system is going down for reboot NOW!
Jun 17 17:30:55 <l7> Nokia-N800-50-2:~# ls
Jun 17 17:31:23 <l7> what could be keeping it from shuting down?
Jun 17 17:31:36 <l7> i tried top, but i can't do top -o cpu
Jun 17 17:31:42 <macoute> does ps aux show any zombies?
Jun 17 17:32:06 <Anunakin> restarted ?
Jun 17 17:32:19 * lcuk2 wonders why "shutdown -r now" comes up with -sh: shutdown: not found
Jun 17 17:32:35 <timeless> did you forget /sbin/ ?
Jun 17 17:32:39 <Navi> woo
Jun 17 17:32:40 <macoute> lcuk2: sudo gainroot/ssh root@localhost?
Jun 17 17:32:44 <timeless> normally you're "user" and /sbin/ isn't in the path
Jun 17 17:32:44 <l7> hmm
Jun 17 17:32:46 <lcuk2> maybe..
Jun 17 17:32:50 <l7> macoute: how do i find a zombie?
Jun 17 17:33:01 <lcuk2> ahhh root issue
Jun 17 17:33:09 <lcuk2> l7, hang out near a graveyard
Jun 17 17:33:27 <l7> heh
Jun 17 17:33:37 <macoute> l7: i think you should get it with ps aux | grep Z as Z is a symbol for zombie in ps
Jun 17 17:33:45 <lcuk2> just pop- the battery and move on with your life :)
Jun 17 17:33:55 <l7> hmm
Jun 17 17:34:21 <l7> no zombies
Jun 17 17:34:33 <qwerty111> My N800 used to do that for a few mins but it would shut off soon anyway.
Jun 17 17:34:37 <lcuk2> thats cos they arent inside your machine any more
Jun 17 17:34:49 <l7> timeless: /sbin/ ?
Jun 17 17:35:07 <macoute> l7: did you try shutdown -h now?
Jun 17 17:35:14 <timeless> as in /sbin/shutdown
Jun 17 17:35:21 <lcuk2> btw, thanks folks i rebooted mine..
Jun 17 17:35:50 <l7> timeless: tried it
Jun 17 17:36:02 <lcuk2> l7, the sbin thing isnt your problem, it was me saying shutdown wasnt found.  onm yours it runs
Jun 17 17:36:08 <l7> it says it's going down for reboot but it doesn't
Jun 17 17:36:15 <l7> oh
Jun 17 17:37:15 <l7>  8076 root       1756 SW  printf Stopping: Media Player Daemon: mediaplayer-eng
Jun 17 17:37:18 <l7> is a strange process
Jun 17 17:37:28 <l7> i think media player caused problems in the past
Jun 17 17:37:47 <lcuk2> the process name is printf Stopping?
Jun 17 17:37:53 <timeless> "printf" is a process
Jun 17 17:38:10 <timeless> the rest of that stuff are arguments
Jun 17 17:38:29 <qwerty111> what does "killall -9 mediaplayer-eng"
Jun 17 17:38:30 <qwerty111> do
Jun 17 17:38:48 <lcuk2> thats like little bobby tables
Jun 17 17:39:09 <l7> qwerty111: i killed them all
Jun 17 17:39:13 <l7> still doesn't reboot
Jun 17 17:39:19 <qwerty111> Ah :/
Jun 17 17:39:27 <l7> is it safer to kill processes until can reboot
Jun 17 17:39:30 <l7> or just pop the battery?
Jun 17 17:39:38 <n800m> yes!
Jun 17 17:39:46 <n800m> :)
Jun 17 17:39:52 <l7> :\
Jun 17 17:39:54 <Anunakin> I .... has been removed the battery at you place
Jun 17 17:40:09 <qwerty111> run sync before you pop it out
Jun 17 17:40:16 <Anunakin> yes
Jun 17 17:40:27 <l7> sync?
Jun 17 17:40:35 <qwerty111> flushes stuff in memory to disk
Jun 17 17:40:44 <qwerty111> http://linux.die.net/man/8/sync
Jun 17 17:40:46 <Anunakin> sync... go write filesystem cache to disks... at case flash/sd
Jun 17 17:40:47 <n800m> ooh
Jun 17 17:40:48 <l7> oh okay dide that
Jun 17 17:40:48 <GAN8001> Mmm . . . fun https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1896#c27
Jun 17 17:41:03 <MangoFusion> anyone here know if there is a *good* vnc client for os2008?
Jun 17 17:41:23 <l7> i get a fun click from the speaker when i hit power
Jun 17 17:41:53 <crashanddie> oh, and for those who care: http://downloadcounter.sj.mozilla.com/
Jun 17 17:42:02 <l7> this battery is hard to remove
Jun 17 17:42:12 * l7 worries about damaging n800 again
Jun 17 17:42:34 <lcuk2> pretend to be a bomb disposal expert and at the last minute just as it pops open dive behind your bed and cower
Jun 17 17:42:49 <l7> it's my precious
Jun 17 17:42:59 <GAN8001> l7, just tap it on your palm. :\
Jun 17 17:43:03 <lcuk2> i dropped my 810 last week
Jun 17 17:43:04 <n800m> you can't really damage it unless it's the internal flash
Jun 17 17:43:10 <lcuk2> time stood still
Jun 17 17:43:20 <l7> wow
Jun 17 17:43:21 <megosdog> Hi all.  Silly question.  I've got an N810 and I tried to get the internal GPS to sync up, but it acts like it can't find any satelites.  Any ideas how I can troubleshoot this?
Jun 17 17:43:26 <l7> reboot just worked
Jun 17 17:43:33 <l7> well
Jun 17 17:43:40 <lcuk2> thankfully, the keyboard acted like a shock absorber and closed on impact
Jun 17 17:43:43 <l7> reboot shutdown the n800
Jun 17 17:44:05 <n800m> the metal frame popping out of my n800 absorbed it for me :(
Jun 17 17:44:05 <lcuk2> megosdog, give it a clear view of the sky and wait
Jun 17 17:44:22 <megosdog> I did.  I got nothing.  I even went out with no clouds in the sky.
Jun 17 17:44:26 <lcuk2> sometimes it will take forever, and others it will be quick
Jun 17 17:44:33 <megosdog> ah, ok.
Jun 17 17:44:37 <timeless> gan8001: gah
Jun 17 17:44:39 <lcuk2> ive had this, reboot your device and try again :)
Jun 17 17:44:39 <timeless> lame users
Jun 17 17:44:58 <timeless> gan8001: which bug is the original bug?
Jun 17 17:45:01 <l7> now it starts up
Jun 17 17:45:04 <lcuk2> i left mine on balcony abroad all afternoon with nothing, after a reboot and back in same location it found them in a couple of minutes
Jun 17 17:45:07 <megosdog> Any way to boost it's ability to recieve GPS data?
Jun 17 17:45:16 <timeless> and is there a bug about 401 sb 403 for X-Forwarded-For ?
Jun 17 17:45:17 <lcuk2> yes, wait for the next update
Jun 17 17:45:25 <timeless> gan8001: because there should be a distinct b ug for that...
Jun 17 17:45:30 <megosdog> lol.  Ok.
Jun 17 17:45:45 <GAN8001> timeless, I have no idea.
Jun 17 17:45:58 <timeless> can you figure that out and fix? :)
Jun 17 17:46:05 <megosdog> And one final question.  I know there's an app that allows the N800 to become an FM radio.  Is it possible, or is something being worked on for the N810 to allow the same functionality?
Jun 17 17:46:08 * timeless goes to read the stupid license comment
Jun 17 17:46:08 * GAN8001 whines.
Jun 17 17:46:12 <GAN8001> Do I have to?
Jun 17 17:46:14 <lcuk2> whether its anidotal, but i run my cpu on performance at all times now and everything is faster, im not sure if this means the driver as well, but its worked better for gps recently
Jun 17 17:46:30 <n800m> the fm reciever is hardware
Jun 17 17:46:33 <lcuk2> megosdog, 800 has radio hardware, 810 doesnt
Jun 17 17:46:38 <megosdog> Ah, ok.
Jun 17 17:46:44 <megosdog> Bummer and all that.  lo.
Jun 17 17:47:16 <lcuk2> not really a big deal, stock it up with mp3s and pretend
Jun 17 17:47:16 <n800m> does the wimax one have fm?
Jun 17 17:47:31 <lcuk2> though the software to make it fuzz when you go under a bridge is a bit tricky
Jun 17 17:47:44 <n800m> hehe
Jun 17 17:47:47 <megosdog> Oh, yeah.  Just thought of something else.  More a curiousity thing really.  Is the 2gb internal SD card removable and upgradable, or is that hard wired to the unit like the 512mb system chip?
Jun 17 17:47:57 <l7> the fm radio is a neat perk
Jun 17 17:48:06 <lcuk2> its removable if you have a degree in soldering
Jun 17 17:48:25 <megosdog> lol.  Ok, was wondering about that since it lists the 2gb card as though it's removable.
Jun 17 17:48:41 <johnx> it's a soldered on sd card basically
Jun 17 17:48:41 <l7> too bad it only works when you plug in headpohones
Jun 17 17:49:07 <megosdog> Ya know, I really like this N810.  Wish it did a tad more, but dang, it's a ton of fun.  :)
Jun 17 17:49:38 <lcuk2> what more could it do?
Jun 17 17:49:40 <megosdog> What would really be cool would be if the next version got one of the Atom processors.  Then it'd be twice as fast.  :)
Jun 17 17:49:55 <megosdog> Well, having the radio on it would be nice.  ;)
Jun 17 17:50:01 <lcuk2> eughh atom, why not the natural progression to the next Ti chip?
Jun 17 17:50:02 <johnx> megosdog, and run out of battery power in maybe 30 minutes?
Jun 17 17:50:05 <GAN8001> Bone up on Atom.
Jun 17 17:50:09 <X-Fade> Nah, that will suck a typical batery dry in half an hour.
Jun 17 17:50:14 <megosdog> Oh, they're that much of a power hog?
Jun 17 17:50:29 <GAN8001> Atom alone eats way more power than the whole OMAP SoC
Jun 17 17:50:31 <johnx> megosdog, they are light on battery usage compared to other x86 chips
Jun 17 17:50:39 <lcuk2> they are a reduced form factor desktop x86 part arent they?
Jun 17 17:50:39 <johnx> but arm chips are in a whole different league
Jun 17 17:50:41 <GAN8001> They're hogs compared to a good ARM.
Jun 17 17:50:56 * lcuk2 wont mention nvidia arm... :P GAN
Jun 17 17:51:06 <megosdog> Ah, ok.  heh.  Shows you what I know about UMPC's.  ;)
Jun 17 17:51:08 <johnx> lcuk2, it's an ARM11...just like ours
Jun 17 17:51:09 <GAN8001> lcuk2, it's ARM1
Jun 17 17:51:13 <GAN8001> 1
Jun 17 17:51:21 <GAN8001> So I'm not sure what your fetish for it is. ;)
Jun 17 17:51:23 <timeless> gan8001: oh wow
Jun 17 17:51:29 <timeless> the original reporter was in iran
Jun 17 17:51:38 <timeless> so yeah, he's actually getting 401 because he's supposed to get 401
Jun 17 17:51:39 <lcuk2> i know that, but everytime i suggest that as a future hardware target GAN has kittens
Jun 17 17:51:52 <megosdog> Another question, is there an app in the works to allow the N810 to do sound recording?
Jun 17 17:51:55 <timeless> gan8001: so, please file a bug for the 401/403 stuff
Jun 17 17:51:56 <johnx> woo! kittens!
Jun 17 17:52:03 <megosdog> Yay!  Kittens!  hehe
Jun 17 17:52:06 <johnx> megosdog, maemo recorder maybe?
Jun 17 17:52:24 <GAN8001> timeless, I don't have a clue about what's going on in that bug.
Jun 17 17:52:29 <megosdog> Oh, didn't know about that.  I was through the entire maemo developers site and never saw it.
Jun 17 17:52:31 <timeless> ok, i'll fix it
Jun 17 17:52:32 <timeless> never mind
Jun 17 17:52:37 <GAN8001> Sorry. ;)
Jun 17 17:52:44 <megosdog> Looking now.
Jun 17 17:52:51 <melmoth> where does one can change its ssh key and gpg sig to upload stuff on extras ?
Jun 17 17:53:16 <melmoth> i m looking on the garage web site, without success up to now
Jun 17 17:53:26 <GAN8001> lcuk2, Cortex A8 > ARM11
Jun 17 17:53:35 <GAN8001> Thus, OMAP3 > Tegra
Jun 17 17:53:51 <megosdog> Ah, found it.  :)
Jun 17 17:54:14 <megosdog> hehe.  Man, I'm having fun learning about this N810.
Jun 17 17:54:20 <Khertan> Hi again
Jun 17 17:54:27 <megosdog> You guys have been great too.  :)
Jun 17 17:54:33 <lcuk2> GAN8001 :) not a problem from my end, im just extremelt happy that ARM is taking off big style and personally wont care where it comes from
Jun 17 17:54:52 <summatusmentis> erm... crap. Does anyone know how to kill a rogue process?
Jun 17 17:54:53 <lcuk2> megosdog, theres a lot to learn and most here are friendly enough
Jun 17 17:55:01 <johnx> summatusmentis, kill -9
Jun 17 17:55:04 <n800m> call wolverine
Jun 17 17:55:11 <summatusmentis> johnx: it doesn't work
Jun 17 17:55:13 <Khertan> lol
Jun 17 17:55:18 <johnx> summatusmentis, then you're screwed
Jun 17 17:55:39 <lcuk2> summatusmentis, wait for your battery to go flat and the process should naturally find a new host.
Jun 17 17:55:45 <megosdog> Cool.  What's funny is, I came here with two questions, and have had a bunch more pop in my head since getting here.  ^_^;;
Jun 17 17:55:49 <Khertan> sudo kill -9 -1
Jun 17 17:55:54 <Khertan> should do it :)
Jun 17 17:56:04 <lcuk2> summatusmentis, what is the rogue process
Jun 17 17:56:26 <lcuk2> superdudomegawhatsitturbokill -999
Jun 17 17:56:42 <Khertan> it s a small guy with a short sword
Jun 17 17:56:44 <lcuk2> hi Khertan btw :)
Jun 17 17:57:07 <Khertan> :)
Jun 17 17:57:40 <johnx> hmmm...maybe we need that doom process manager that was on slashdot a couple years ago :)
Jun 17 17:57:48 <Navi> :P
Jun 17 17:57:59 <Navi> Hi Khertan
Jun 17 17:58:01 <Khertan> 3g connection data is as unreliable as working french train driver !
Jun 17 17:58:08 <lcuk2> actually khertan, got a q - your "Go" button to run python in pygtked, any chance it could be made into an option, so i could (for instance) run "if make; then ./liqbase; fi"
Jun 17 17:58:12 <Khertan> hi navi
Jun 17 17:58:13 <summatusmentis> lcuk2: it was cp on my laptop... now my lappy is locked up
Jun 17 17:58:23 <johnx> Khertan, seems to work nicely here (as do the trains) :)
Jun 17 17:58:56 <lcuk2> johnx, process doom wouldnt work on ours because we havent got proper 3d support ;)
Jun 17 17:58:57 <johnx> summatusmentis, it's probably caught in kernel space :/
Jun 17 17:59:10 <johnx> lcuk2, doom didn't need 3D :P
Jun 17 17:59:12 <lcuk2> ssh transfer cacked up
Jun 17 17:59:17 <megosdog> Hmm, ok.  Next tidbit.  Is there a way to setup an ssh proxy on my 810 so that I can do secure web surfing and email while on a public wifi?  I have a system right now I use on my linux and bsd boxes that allows me to do that, but I'm not sure how to do it on the 810.
Jun 17 17:59:17 <johnx> there *is* a doom port...
Jun 17 17:59:19 <GAN8001> lcuk2, have you played lxdoom?
Jun 17 17:59:20 <lcuk2> psdoom3 does
Jun 17 17:59:22 <summatusmentis> well... hard reboot I guess
Jun 17 17:59:25 <lcuk2> yes of course i have
Jun 17 17:59:28 <Khertan> luck2 > hum ... if u do a sh script with a .sh extension clicking on go will launch it with sh
Jun 17 17:59:34 <n800m> wait who's a train driver?
Jun 17 17:59:37 <timeless> gan: ok, bug managed
Jun 17 17:59:43 <johnx> megosdog, set it up just like you would on any other linux machine
Jun 17 17:59:44 <lcuk2> Khertan, but i edit .c files
Jun 17 17:59:46 <GAN8001> Thanks, timeless. :)
Jun 17 17:59:47 <summatusmentis> n800m: your mom!
Jun 17 17:59:54 <GAN8001> Hehe
Jun 17 17:59:58 <n800m> :(
Jun 17 18:00:10 <GAN8001> I was going to say "You are! HIT THE BRAKES!"
Jun 17 18:00:12 <johnx> lcuk, I'm thinking of something a little different
Jun 17 18:00:14 <megosdog> On linux/bsd I just do "ssh -D 8080 -p ### -i id_dsa 192.168.0.1@username" to setup a local ssh proxy port, but then I have to point the browser to port 8080 to make it work.
Jun 17 18:00:18 <johnx> this one was waaay before doom3...
Jun 17 18:00:20 <Khertan> luck2 ... so an field in prefs should be a good idea :)
Jun 17 18:00:27 <lcuk> johnx, i know that
Jun 17 18:00:41 <lcuk> it was years ago i remember reading (and probably posting in slash..)
Jun 17 18:00:59 <megosdog> However, I can't find any proxy settings for the browser, pidgin or email on the N810.
Jun 17 18:01:15 <johnx> lcuk, well then you remember trying to be sarcastic on /. and getting honest answers :P
Jun 17 18:01:25 <megosdog> Of course, I think email will be moot since I'm using Gmail and that's already ssl.
Jun 17 18:01:38 <megosdog> Which just leaves pidgin and the web browser.
Jun 17 18:01:47 <lcuk> lol johnx, the geeks spoil all the best jokes
Jun 17 18:01:48 <kulve> megosdog: I think proxy settings can be set in the connectivity settings. But I don't know which all apps obey it
Jun 17 18:01:51 * lcuk is a geek
Jun 17 18:02:00 <megosdog> ok, let me look really quickly.
Jun 17 18:02:16 <Khertan> megosdog > be carreful gmail isn't the most secure webmail ... far away between some.
Jun 17 18:02:23 <lcuk> http://www.cs.unm.edu/~dlchao/flake/doom/chi/chi.html
Jun 17 18:02:37 <megosdog> Well, it *does* use ssl when connecting via the N810 pop3 client.
Jun 17 18:02:51 <Khertan> s/between/behind
Jun 17 18:03:02 <GAN8001> megosdog, http://modest.garage.maemo.org
Jun 17 18:03:07 <megosdog> I'm not connecting to gmail via open pop3.
Jun 17 18:03:29 <lcuk> Khertan, it would be an excellent thing if you could do it - i have to keep switching to console to test (incidentally, does the go button save things first?)
Jun 17 18:03:50 <Khertan> no you must save it :)
Jun 17 18:03:57 <lcuk> thats ok, its lal on the same strip
Jun 17 18:04:06 <n800m> so about the french train driver
Jun 17 18:04:24 <megosdog> GAN8001: thanks.
Jun 17 18:04:29 <Khertan> why :) because it let me make comparse between modifications when i do optimisations :)
Jun 17 18:04:52 <Khertan> n800m > yes ?
Jun 17 18:05:11 * lcuk optimizes often
Jun 17 18:05:19 * lcuk opt oftn
Jun 17 18:05:25 * lcuk .
Jun 17 18:05:29 <n800m> can't come up with anything but it'd be a cool job
Jun 17 18:05:56 <megosdog> kulve: I checked and all the connectivity panel does is setup options for connecting and timeouts for the wlan or bt.
Jun 17 18:05:59 <lcuk> was it in france where that guy used a suction cup to surf some super speedy train?
Jun 17 18:06:27 <johnx> megosdog, go deeper to the per connection settings
Jun 17 18:06:40 <Khertan> n800m > oh yes it a great job ... many holidays and if you haven't enough, take more ... u ncan't be fired
Jun 17 18:06:55 <Khertan> just not a train driver
Jun 17 18:07:19 <n800m> my dad used to do that when i was a kid
Jun 17 18:07:21 <Khertan> just a user stupid enough to think that it ll arrived at the right time
Jun 17 18:07:22 <n800m> rough schedule
Jun 17 18:07:33 <n800m> and not in france
Jun 17 18:07:52 <n800m> hah
Jun 17 18:07:55 <Khertan> :)
Jun 17 18:08:26 <Khertan> pfff i must made the code to manage many option in mcalendar
Jun 17 18:08:29 <n800m> france is not doing too well in the euro cup
Jun 17 18:08:35 <n800m> they used to kick ass
Jun 17 18:08:39 <lcuk> anyway, must dash back to graffiti :)
Jun 17 18:08:41 <Khertan> but this really a borring thing to do
Jun 17 18:09:04 <megosdog> johnx: Oh, well, that's interesting.  Didn't happen to pay attention to the "next" button in connection setup.
Jun 17 18:09:15 <lcuk> lol khertan :) grinding at your code is good, it shows dedication
Jun 17 18:09:22 <Khertan> n800m > yeah ! more they will be bad, less they will boring us with foot
Jun 17 18:09:32 <megosdog> AHA!  Found the proxy.  :D
Jun 17 18:09:38 <Khertan> lcuk ? grinding ?
Jun 17 18:09:49 <Khertan> dedication ?
Jun 17 18:09:49 <rixed> Hi y'all.
Jun 17 18:09:52 <lcuk> hacking/coding/playing/working
Jun 17 18:09:53 <hrw> bye
Jun 17 18:10:03 <lcuk> cya hrw
Jun 17 18:10:16 <Khertan> -> google translation is still so bad :)
Jun 17 18:10:33 <rixed> One of you know hoe I can find osso-addressbook sourcecode ?
Jun 17 18:10:35 <johnx> Khertan, using one of these on your code: http://www.germes-online.com/direct/dbimage/50254123/Angle_Grinder.jpg
Jun 17 18:10:42 <lcuk> khertan :) i forget english is not your native language
Jun 17 18:10:48 <lcuk> you manage very well
Jun 17 18:11:11 <n800m> except 4 sentences ago
Jun 17 18:11:16 * lcuk tips his hat at lardman 
Jun 17 18:11:42 <lcuk> n800m, thats what i mean
Jun 17 18:11:44 <Khertan> lol
Jun 17 18:11:47 <n800m> :)
Jun 17 18:11:53 <johnx> angle grinders rock
Jun 17 18:12:00 * lcuk is normally careful
Jun 17 18:12:03 <Khertan> :)
Jun 17 18:12:09 <johnx> ...for optimizing code I mean :D
Jun 17 18:12:39 <lcuk> they work, but getting the bitdust out of your hair is a pain
Jun 17 18:12:45 <summatusmentis> hey Khertan, did you fix the libxml2juuiiii dependency?
Jun 17 18:12:47 <n800m> haha
Jun 17 18:13:48 <konttori> rixed: it's nokia proprietary
Jun 17 18:14:02 <Khertan> summatusmentis > it should be fixed
Jun 17 18:14:10 <summatusmentis> Khertan: thanks! :)
Jun 17 18:14:22 <Khertan> i prefer using this : http://photo.ortho.free.fr/images/outils/masse.jpg
Jun 17 18:14:34 <summatusmentis> now if lcuk would get liqbase to a place where i could use it as an editor, it'd be perfect :)
Jun 17 18:14:48 <Khertan> it s need a bit more work, but result i nicer
Jun 17 18:15:02 <Khertan> :)
Jun 17 18:16:22 <rixed> konttori: wow! Is it definitive or temporary ?
Jun 17 18:16:38 <lcuk> the only weapon a coder should use is a crowbar
Jun 17 18:16:59 <lcuk> summatusmentis, :) i said last night, editing is a little egg
Jun 17 18:17:14 <konttori> rixed: the ui part is closed
Jun 17 18:17:24 <summatusmentis> lcuk: I know, fix it! :)
Jun 17 18:17:25 <konttori> backend is eds (open)
Jun 17 18:17:32 <lcuk> its got to be nurtured and grow, but its not a priority for me at the moment
Jun 17 18:17:44 <summatusmentis> lol, fair enough :)
Jun 17 18:17:46 <timeless> gan8001: ok, i'm really done w/ that bug now
Jun 17 18:17:48 <timeless> what a waste of time
Jun 17 18:17:53 <rixed> konttori: ok thanx.
Jun 17 18:17:58 <timeless> i should probably write a crypto tale part 3
Jun 17 18:18:13 <lcuk> i was discussing releasing certain parts of the scrolling and sooming (ie the whole book side) so you lot will shutup and let me work on the graffiti ;)
Jun 17 18:18:27 <Khertan> lol
Jun 17 18:18:28 <lcuk> sooming?
Jun 17 18:18:47 <megosdog> what system path is the Nokia N810 files on the file system?  Is that /home/user/MyDocs?  Or is it a different path?
Jun 17 18:19:13 <lcuk> which nokia files? examples? docs? binaries? maps?
Jun 17 18:19:24 <summatusmentis> Khertan: is it possible the python-pygtksourceview is still requiring libmxl2juuiiii?
Jun 17 18:19:36 <timeless> ok. so um
Jun 17 18:19:44 <timeless> i'mlooking for advice on a title selection
Jun 17 18:19:56 <megosdog> Well, when you're in the file manager, it shows "Audio Clips", Documents, Games, Images, and Video Clips.  The system drive is listed as "Nokia N810" and the one below it is "Internal Memory Card".
Jun 17 18:19:57 <Khertan> yes, as now it python2.5-pygtksourceview
Jun 17 18:19:59 <lcuk> summatusmentis, are you literate in c?
Jun 17 18:19:59 <timeless> http://viper.haque.net/~timeless/blog/138/ A crypto tale of biblical proportion; SSL an annotated history with blame
Jun 17 18:20:06 <summatusmentis> lcuk: relatively
Jun 17 18:20:09 <megosdog> I'm thinking of the one listed as "Nokia N810" in teh file manager.
Jun 17 18:20:10 <timeless> http://viper.haque.net/~timeless/blog/142/ A crypto tale of biblical proportion, part 2; The Garden of (D)E[db]ienSSL
Jun 17 18:20:24 * lcuk ponders
Jun 17 18:20:29 <timeless> i'm planning to write another entry, which is probably /148
Jun 17 18:20:42 <timeless> but, i need to pick a title
Jun 17 18:20:44 <summatusmentis> lcuk: I've got a lot on my plate right now, doing SoC and all that
Jun 17 18:21:00 <lcuk> ahhh cool, whats your project?
Jun 17 18:21:33 <summatusmentis> implementing OpenAFS pioctl()s in the kAFS implementation
Jun 17 18:21:40 <summatusmentis> (kernel hacking)
Jun 17 18:22:31 <summatusmentis> Khertan: ok, then it looks like the package on your site still needs python-pygtksourceview and python2.5-runtime as dependencies
Jun 17 18:22:49 <Khertan> summatusmentis > and pygtkeditor  depends on python2.5-*
Jun 17 18:23:04 <Khertan> yes package on my site aren't up to date
Jun 17 18:23:06 <megosdog> lcuk: Any ideas?
Jun 17 18:23:12 <Khertan> use the .install file
Jun 17 18:23:29 <Khertan> to install it from extras repository
Jun 17 18:23:29 <summatusmentis> from garage?
Jun 17 18:23:36 <GAN8001> timeless, give me a list of potential titles and I'll tell you which one sucks the least. :P
Jun 17 18:23:49 <lcuk> ahh megosdog its ummm... lemme just open it and see
Jun 17 18:23:54 <Khertan> it available on maemo.org or in the pygtkeditor page of my site
Jun 17 18:24:18 <megosdog> ok
Jun 17 18:24:47 <Khertan> connection will drop
Jun 17 18:24:50 <summatusmentis> Khertan: right, that's what I'm saying. The one from the pygtkeditor page on your site is saying it needs python-pygtksourceview and python2.5-runtime
Jun 17 18:24:54 <Khertan> i ll enter in a tunnel
Jun 17 18:25:14 <lcuk> /home/user/MyDocs i think
Jun 17 18:25:17 <Khertan> ?
Jun 17 18:25:25 <Khertan> hum ... oh maybe they  aven't validate the package
Jun 17 18:26:01 <Khertan> i ll check tomorrow
Jun 17 18:26:02 <Khertan> thx for the report
Jun 17 18:26:08 <summatusmentis> sure thing, thanks for the hlep
Jun 17 18:26:08 <Khertan> s/aven't/haven't
Jun 17 18:26:10 <summatusmentis> help*
Jun 17 18:28:40 <lcuk> is this the part of the movie where radio signals go down and we are left with slow tense music and everyone watching the countdown until they reappear?
Jun 17 18:28:46 <megosdog> lcuk: it says that directory is empty, but I know it's not.
Jun 17 18:28:54 <megosdog> I already looked in there thinking the same thing as you.
Jun 17 18:29:26 <lcuk> well mine has files im expecting and lists one of my folders in there..
Jun 17 18:29:32 <lcuk> maybe theres an additional symlink
Jun 17 18:29:45 <megosdog> Yeah, I'm thinking that too.
Jun 17 18:30:01 <Khertan> could you try to install this one : http://repository.maemo.org/extras/pool/chinook/free/p/pygtkeditor/pygtkeditor-2.2.0-3_all.deb
Jun 17 18:30:01 <Khertan> ?
Jun 17 18:31:26 <summatusmentis> one momemnt
Jun 17 18:31:28 <megosdog> Too bad the n810 doesn't have a "locate" command in the shell.  lol.  This could be so quick and easy to do that way.
Jun 17 18:32:13 <GAN8001> Somebody put together an mlocate package
Jun 17 18:32:21 <GAN8001> You gotta run the database updates manually, though.
Jun 17 18:32:26 <GAN8001> There's always find. ;)
Jun 17 18:34:37 <Navi> updating the db is lame on a desktop, why would you want to do it on the tablet?
Jun 17 18:35:54 <tank-man> a small script updates it for me on my desktop, why is it lame if its automatic?
Jun 17 18:35:59 <||cw> find is really fast on the handhelds
Jun 17 18:36:16 <||cw> tank-man: because you have a limited number of write cycles
Jun 17 18:36:48 <tank-man> on a desktop?
Jun 17 18:36:57 <||cw> tank-man: well, you wouldn't want it auto on the tablets, desktop IMO is fine
Jun 17 18:37:08 <||cw> just schedule it for when you are not using the PC
Jun 17 18:37:36 <tank-man> my distro has it update at 4am
Jun 17 18:37:51 <megosdog> lcuk: AHA!  That's why they didn't show up at first.  They're all hidden directories.  lol.  Sheesh.
Jun 17 18:38:09 <lcuk> but the ones i wanted were there :)
Jun 17 18:38:59 <lcuk> good to know the shell and gui works backwards compared to windows ;)  there hidden files are not visible in the gui but show up in standard dir
Jun 17 18:39:34 <GAN8001> lcuk, don't bring your Windows nonsense in here. ;)
Jun 17 18:39:46 <lcuk> :P pffft
Jun 17 18:40:10 <GAN8001> File manage is not an example to use for anything, anyway.
Jun 17 18:40:14 <orakle> is there much support for 770s anymore?
Jun 17 18:40:16 * lcuk has been tainted.  i might try to find my amiga from the landfill and recover it
Jun 17 18:40:20 <GAN8001> and learn what "ls -a" does. :\
Jun 17 18:40:26 <orakle> i have one in my desk that I bought a year or two back and haven't done anything with
Jun 17 18:40:37 <GAN8001> orakle, flash it with OS2008HE.
Jun 17 18:40:44 <orakle> mainly for lack of a speedy OS and eap-ttls support
Jun 17 18:40:45 <lcuk> it makes an excellent desk orniment
Jun 17 18:41:05 <lcuk> +spelling
Jun 17 18:41:07 <orakle> does os2008 run ok on it? even on 2007he it's sluggish
Jun 17 18:41:15 <GAN8001> orakle, the OMAP1710 isn't exactly a powerhouse. :\
Jun 17 18:41:36 <orakle> yeah, seriously :)
Jun 17 18:41:38 <lcuk> its got faster graphics
Jun 17 18:41:59 <orakle> what about the wifi though.. can I connect to eap-ttls/securew2 with it?
Jun 17 18:42:00 <lcuk> mind you, a dead tortoise has faster graphics than my 810
Jun 17 18:42:07 <GAN8001> lcuk, no it doesn't.
Jun 17 18:42:18 <GAN8001> It's got a less broken controller.
Jun 17 18:42:22 <GAN8001> Not "faster graphics".
Jun 17 18:42:35 <GAN8001> orakle, google, I just use WPA2 here.
Jun 17 18:42:50 <orakle> my university uses it for their wifi.. linux users can apparently get it going with xsupplicant, but the last time i looked there wasn't an port for the 770
Jun 17 18:43:05 <orakle> it's like a wpa/radius type of thing
Jun 17 18:45:48 <orakle> so what would I have to do to get os2008he on my 770? can I install it to my memory card (2gb)?
Jun 17 18:46:11 <Navi> tank-man, my sleep pattern isn't regular
Jun 17 18:46:28 <Navi> I have it cron'd at 4AM as well
Jun 17 18:46:39 <GAN8001> Navi's lame.
Jun 17 18:47:15 <Navi> GAN8001's lamer
Jun 17 18:47:18 <tank-man> ive been up at 4am sometimes and seen my harddisk trashing and thinking someone is hacking me
Jun 17 18:47:39 * GAN8001 has Spotlight.
Jun 17 18:47:56 <Navi> s/have/had/
Jun 17 18:48:37 <Navi> I don't need anything to tell me where anything is, my stuff is organized :P
Jun 17 18:49:03 <GAN8001> pfft
Jun 17 18:50:37 <summatusmentis> Spotlight is a tad too slow for me, and I wish it showed the entire path
Jun 17 18:52:05 <summatusmentis> also, it only shows user files, I wanna play w/ my system files!
Jun 17 18:52:48 <tank-man> i think not showing files you dont have permission to modify is a feature, not a bug
Jun 17 18:52:56 <||cw> orakle: just flash it like any other update, no?
Jun 17 18:54:37 <lcuk_hacking> its better than windows, it wont show files it doesnt know how to parse (and that is most file types i encounter)
Jun 17 18:54:45 <summatusmentis> tank-man: it's my machine, I can do whatever I want
Jun 17 18:54:47 <summatusmentis> :)
Jun 17 18:54:53 <lcuk_hacking> then become root
Jun 17 18:55:03 <RST38h> what is spotlight?
Jun 17 18:55:14 <tank-man> spotlight is from mac os x
Jun 17 18:55:18 <RST38h> oh
Jun 17 18:55:19 <lcuk_hacking> apple std search i assume
Jun 17 18:55:26 <tank-man> search tool
Jun 17 18:55:35 <RST38h> won't be useful here :(
Jun 17 18:55:36 <GAN8001> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spotlight_%28software%29
Jun 17 18:55:45 * RST38h hoped for a new os2008 fm =)
Jun 17 18:56:58 <Atarii> will the release of diablo link in with any new 2008he? or am i barking up the wrong tree?
Jun 17 18:57:21 <GAN8001> Atarii, who knows.
Jun 17 18:57:37 <Atarii> kk
Jun 17 18:58:19 <lcuk_hacking> whos working on he? i thought it was hackers outside of nokia? or is it an actual nokia release?
Jun 17 18:58:46 <RST38h> all right, time to attack that english sentence parser again
Jun 17 18:59:23 <lcuk_hacking> whos working on the n770 Hacker Edition (H.E.)?    i thought it was hackers outside of nokia?      or is it an actual nokia release?
Jun 17 18:59:24 <GAN8001> lcuk_hacking, it's Nokia employees in their spare time.
Jun 17 18:59:55 <lcuk_hacking> cool :)
Jun 17 19:00:19 <GAN8001> Community hackers don't have access to the stuff they'd need to put together a hacker edition.
Jun 17 19:00:23 <lcuk_hacking> googles' 20% is used to create new projects, Nokias' is backporting ;)
Jun 17 19:00:34 <GAN8001> No.
Jun 17 19:01:03 <GAN8001> Google's 20% is Google employee's on google time. HE is largely not on Nokia's time.
Jun 17 19:01:18 <GAN8001> s/employee's/employees/
Jun 17 19:01:19 <infobot> GAN8001 meant: Google's 20% is Google employees on google time. HE is largely not on Nokia's time.
Jun 17 19:01:49 <lcuk_hacking> stop! google time.      duuu duuu deee duuu. can't touch this!
Jun 17 19:02:46 * sp3000 touches it
Jun 17 19:03:11 * ||cw beats it with a stick
Jun 17 19:03:34 <lcuk_hacking> you best go wash your hand now
Jun 17 19:03:56 <||cw> yeah that's why i used a stick
Jun 17 19:04:05 <summatusmentis> lol
Jun 17 19:04:11 <summatusmentis> hawat
Jun 17 19:04:13 <summatusmentis> hawt*
Jun 17 19:04:29 <aquatix> lcuk_hacking: :)
Jun 17 19:09:31 <summatusmentis> GAN8001: what parts don't we have?
Jun 17 19:12:11 <GAN8001> Lot of Nokia proprietary stuff like bme, dsme, mce, etc, wifi drivers, other stuff.
Jun 17 19:12:13 <lardman> lcuk_hacking: what was that hat tipping all about - sorry I was eating supper and forgot I turned the box on
Jun 17 19:13:58 <lcuk_hacking> lardman, i was just saying hi, damn good job i didnt offer you a pint then
Jun 17 19:14:16 <lardman> lol, it'd be flat by now anyway
Jun 17 19:14:31 <lardman> but you Northerners have flat beer anyway don't you? ;)
Jun 17 19:14:33 <lcuk_hacking> and warm
Jun 17 19:14:40 <lcuk_hacking> cant stand it
Jun 17 19:14:40 <lardman> you said it :D
Jun 17 19:14:53 <lcuk_hacking> ice cold lager if im out
Jun 17 19:15:06 <lardman> mmm, stop, you're making me thirsty
Jun 17 19:15:21 <lcuk_hacking> lol right, ive gotta goi play o and x with youngest
Jun 17 19:15:46 <lardman> have fun
Jun 17 19:15:53 <lcuk_hacking> we will
Jun 17 19:16:17 <summatusmentis> o and x?
Jun 17 19:16:23 <summatusmentis> like... tic-tac-toe?
Jun 17 19:16:36 <MangoFusion> oranges and xylophones
Jun 17 19:18:02 <lardman> summatusmentis: I assume so
Jun 17 19:18:14 <summatusmentis> intriguing, I think I like that name better :)
Jun 17 19:18:49 <lardman> pronounced "Noughts and Crosses"
Jun 17 19:19:04 <summatusmentis> oh...
Jun 17 19:19:17 <summatusmentis> I just wanna play 'oh and ex'
Jun 17 19:19:40 <lardman> :)
Jun 17 19:20:08 <summatusmentis> I'm sure it'd be more fun than writing interface documents :)
Jun 17 19:34:54 <Atarii> firefox site working for anyone else?
Jun 17 19:35:05 <summatusmentis> it was working earlier
Jun 17 19:35:08 <summatusmentis> just chill out :)
Jun 17 19:35:52 <Atarii> actually it is working, its just spreadfirefox.com which isnt
Jun 17 19:35:54 <lardman> ~lart oo for not being able to open a .csv file!
Jun 17 19:35:55 * infobot calls oo on the phone ... the lights are on but nobody's home for not being able to open a .csv file!
Jun 17 19:36:34 <qwerty12_N800> infobot, lame
Jun 17 19:36:35 <infobot> i heard lame is an LGPL MP3 encoder, #mp3encoder http://lame.sourceforge.net/ see http://www.apt-get.org/ apt-get sites
Jun 17 19:36:56 <summatusmentis> ... what?
Jun 17 19:37:15 <summatusmentis> lol
Jun 17 19:37:29 <lardman> oo is sooooooooo slow
Jun 17 19:40:03 <lardman> infobot: forget lame
Jun 17 19:40:03 <infobot> lardman: i forgot lame
Jun 17 19:40:10 <lardman> well that's sorted that one out
Jun 17 19:40:41 <qwerty12_N800> infobot, forget life and die
Jun 17 19:40:41 <infobot> i didn't have anything called 'life and die' to forget, qwerty12_N800
Jun 17 19:40:50 <qwerty12_N800> aww
Jun 17 19:41:14 <summatusmentis> infobot help
Jun 17 19:41:20 <summatusmentis> infobot: help
Jun 17 19:41:29 <qwerty12_N800> infobot, I love you really.
Jun 17 19:41:30 <infobot> You love you really.?
Jun 17 19:41:33 <n800m> !help
Jun 17 19:41:36 <summatusmentis> infobot: set lame to qwerty12_N800
Jun 17 19:41:51 <qwerty12_N800> oi!
Jun 17 19:41:58 <summatusmentis> oh, that's what it is
Jun 17 19:42:08 <summatusmentis> infobot: lame is at qwerty12_N800
Jun 17 19:42:10 <infobot> is at qwerty12_N800 is completely not lame.
Jun 17 19:42:14 <timeless> gan8001: eww
Jun 17 19:42:20 <Anunakin> infobot: what time is it?
Jun 17 19:42:21 <summatusmentis> GAN8001: lame
Jun 17 19:42:23 <timeless> akamai is the one handing out the 401, and they do it on their own?
Jun 17 19:42:25 <timeless> that's interesting
Jun 17 19:42:28 <summatusmentis> whoa
Jun 17 19:42:32 <summatusmentis> infobot: lame
Jun 17 19:42:38 <timeless> i would have assumed it was a thing that bound companies that wanted to sell to the us
Jun 17 19:42:42 <timeless> i should check that point
Jun 17 19:42:45 <summatusmentis> I quit
Jun 17 19:43:25 <qwerty12_N800> summatusmentis, haha (in nelson muntz voice)
Jun 17 19:43:42 <summatusmentis> don't know who nelson muntz is, but whatever :)
Jun 17 19:43:48 <nelson> not me!
Jun 17 19:43:53 <qwerty12_N800> lol
Jun 17 19:44:42 <summatusmentis> ~help
Jun 17 19:45:16 <qwerty12_N800> ~dopey
Jun 17 19:45:17 <infobot> extra, extra, read all about it, dopey is summatusmentis
Jun 17 19:45:21 <qwerty12_N800> hahaha
Jun 17 19:45:34 <summatusmentis> wtf? how did you do that? :-P
Jun 17 19:45:50 <qwerty12_N800> infobot, forget dopey
Jun 17 19:45:54 <infobot> i forgot dopey, qwerty12_N800
Jun 17 19:46:08 <qwerty12_N800> summatusmentis, trade secret :p
Jun 17 19:46:13 <lardman> priv msg to infobot?
Jun 17 19:46:42 <johnx> ~maybe
Jun 17 19:46:43 <n800m> whose bot is it
Jun 17 19:46:46 <qwerty12_N800> ~summatusmentis
Jun 17 19:47:03 <infobot> hmm... summatusmentis is a dodgy fake dvd seller
Jun 17 19:47:11 <summatusmentis> how'd you find out about that?
Jun 17 19:47:23 <liquid217> qwerty12_N800: may I pm?
Jun 17 19:47:38 <qwerty12_N800> liquid217, if you wish :)
Jun 17 19:47:39 <summatusmentis> do you want to? he'll just abuse you :)
Jun 17 19:47:48 <qwerty12_N800> >.<
Jun 17 19:48:26 <liquid217> lol
Jun 17 19:49:05 <timeless> http://dictionary.sensagent.com/Restrictions%20on%20the%20Import%20of%20Cryptography/en-en/
Jun 17 19:49:16 <timeless> gan8001: that says iran has import restrictions on crypto
Jun 17 19:50:59 <timeless> it's probably just a stupid process that could be fixed
Jun 17 19:51:04 <timeless> oops, wrong window
Jun 17 19:51:17 <GAN8001> timeless, akamai is the explanation that I've always heard.
Jun 17 19:51:29 <timeless> that makes sense
Jun 17 19:51:30 <timeless> http://rechten.uvt.nl/koops/cryptolaw/cls2.htm#iran
Jun 17 19:51:33 <timeless> is interesting
Jun 17 19:51:36 <timeless> should i mention it?
Jun 17 19:51:57 <timeless> technically not a problem for us, but what are the odds the reporter has a license?
Jun 17 19:52:12 <GAN8001> Slim to none? :D
Jun 17 19:52:52 <qwerty12_N800> 1/999999999999999999999
Jun 17 19:53:13 <timeless> err
Jun 17 19:53:18 <timeless> nokia runs a cell network?
Jun 17 19:53:22 <timeless> that seems unlikely
Jun 17 19:54:29 <timeless> http://press.nokia.com/PR/200008/786451_5.html ?
Jun 17 19:55:02 <timeless> ok, that's NSN these days, not Nokia
Jun 17 19:55:13 <lardman> GSM systems, i.e. components
Jun 17 19:55:52 * timeless nods
Jun 17 19:55:56 <timeless> but it's NSN
Jun 17 19:56:06 <timeless> it used to be Nokia, but at least, i think it shouldn't be today
Jun 17 19:56:16 <konttori> it's part of nokia still.
Jun 17 19:56:16 <timeless> i suppose i could check our job market to see if we have jobs there
Jun 17 19:56:32 <konttori> devices and nsn are just separate entities, but under the nokia corporation
Jun 17 19:56:43 <timeless> konttori: really?
Jun 17 19:56:44 <timeless> gah
Jun 17 19:56:49 <timeless> confusing
Jun 17 19:56:59 <konttori> yeah. there is no nsn in the stock exchanges
Jun 17 19:57:01 <konttori> only nokia
Jun 17 19:57:02 <timeless> fwiw, in case people weren't keeping score, TrollTech is part of Nokia
Jun 17 19:57:27 <timeless> konttori: if that's the case, then why do people lose seniority for moving?
Jun 17 19:57:45 <konttori> interesting. they are separate legal entities
Jun 17 19:57:52 <Paavo> technically nsn is a separate company, but it's owned 50-50 by nokia and siemens.
Jun 17 19:57:54 <konttori> maybe it's so that nokia owns the nsn entity
Jun 17 19:58:01 <timeless> konttori: fwiw, job network doesn't offer anything in iran
Jun 17 19:58:09 <konttori> http://www.nokiasiemensnetworks.com/global/AboutUs/Service/imprint.htm
Jun 17 19:58:16 <timeless> yeah, nsn is a private company
Jun 17 19:58:20 <timeless> hence no listing on markets
Jun 17 19:58:28 <timeless> (only two shareholders!)
Jun 17 19:59:03 * timeless sighs
Jun 17 19:59:13 <qwerty12_N800> Siemens have their hands in everything
Jun 17 19:59:22 <timeless> someone should tell them to write FIN not FI in their mailing address
Jun 17 19:59:35 <timeless> using FI is asking for mail to end up in florida :)
Jun 17 19:59:42 <glass_> nsn sells networks.. and keeps them running
Jun 17 19:59:51 <qwerty12_N800> I thought Florida was FL?
Jun 17 19:59:57 <konttori> "The headquarters of the company will be set up in the Helsinki region, and the company will become part of Nokia - in other words, its net sales will be included in Nokia's turnover figures. Siemens will in turn reap half of the profits. "
Jun 17 20:00:02 <konttori> http://www.hs.fi/english/article/Nokia+strives+for+dominance+of+network+market+through+fusion+with+Siemens/1135220374308
Jun 17 20:00:03 <timeless> qwerty: sure, but change your font
Jun 17 20:00:11 <timeless> I and l look similar in many fonts
Jun 17 20:00:21 <timeless> the font i'm using has a single stroke for both
Jun 17 20:00:32 <glass_> nsn numbers are reported in nokias quarterly reports
Jun 17 20:00:42 <qwerty12_N800> timeless, ah (Nokia Sans so I'm ok atm)
Jun 17 20:01:08 <timeless> oh, you're using a device
Jun 17 20:01:30 <timeless> try the web browser instead? :)
Jun 17 20:01:54 <GAN8001> qwerty12_N800, you using Nokia Sans in XChat, too?
Jun 17 20:02:25 <qwerty12_N800> GAN8001, yeah, fits in better with rest of system and beats Monospace >.<
Jun 17 20:02:40 <GAN8001> Yeah, I like Nokia Sans. It's a nice font.
Jun 17 20:03:36 <GAN8001> The generic "Sans"/SwissA font is great for book reading, too.
Jun 17 20:04:32 <qwerty12_N800> Ah, ok, thanks, will try that out. :)
Jun 17 20:05:58 * timeless finds the internal job search to be useless
Jun 17 20:06:44 <qwerty12_N800> Let us in, We'll forward our suggestions for improvement to Nokia :p
Jun 17 20:07:52 <GAN8001> qwerty12_N800 == landshark
Jun 17 21:49:34 <n800m> holland kicked ass
Jun 17 21:49:47 <n800m> ;x
Jun 17 21:52:01 <sitbon> Stupid question: which package gives me the standard /usr/include headers in ubuntu? I'm not finding it.
Jun 17 21:52:33 <m-vo> should be libc6-dev.
Jun 17 21:53:02 <sitbon> cool, thanks
Jun 17 21:54:41 <m-vo> sitbon, just install build-essential, that should get you started.
Jun 17 21:55:32 <sitbon> will do
Jun 17 21:58:21 <Atarii> anyone here runing 2008he?
Jun 17 22:18:04 <GAN8001> Atarii, me.
Jun 17 22:18:25 <rm_you> GAN8001: you have a 770?
Jun 17 22:18:32 <rm_you> I wan't aware :)
Jun 17 22:19:13 <MangoFusion_> wow, just managed to do an update to diablo
Jun 17 22:19:15 <GAN800> Two, actually.
Jun 17 22:19:28 <GAN800> One from November 2005. ;)
Jun 17 22:19:56 <rm_you> GAN800: heh, interesting :P
Jun 17 22:20:10 <rm_you> GAN800: ever test adv-backlight on them?
Jun 17 22:20:15 <MangoFusion_> yet i still don't get what all he fuss is about ;(
Jun 17 22:21:10 <Atarii> GAN800 have you tried rdesktop?
Jun 17 22:22:42 <konttori> GAN800: from which version from 2005?
Jun 17 22:22:45 <konttori> OS 2005?
Jun 17 22:23:17 <konttori> Uh. Sorry. misunderstood. MangoFusion_ was the one who made the update
Jun 17 22:23:38 <MangoFusion_> haha
Jun 17 22:23:46 <konttori> I thought it would have been very interesting if someone was able to update from pre-chinook to diablo
Jun 17 22:25:12 <MangoFusion_> don't give me ideas now :P
Jun 17 22:25:40 <GAN800> Atarii, no, just vnc
Jun 17 22:25:44 <timeless> konttori: i have prechinook :)
Jun 17 22:25:51 <timeless> if you count 3-4 weeks as pre :)
Jun 17 22:25:57 <konttori> :)
Jun 17 22:25:58 <GAN800> rm_yes, it doesn't work.
Jun 17 22:26:06 <timeless> it's the standard beta hardware :)
Jun 17 22:26:23 <konttori> I actually meant software release
Jun 17 22:26:28 <GAN800> Woo, rm_yes! <_<
Jun 17 22:26:33 <timeless> week 39
Jun 17 22:26:42 <timeless> release is something like 42?
Jun 17 22:26:48 <konttori> i think so
Jun 17 22:26:54 <timeless> so it's 3 weeks early :)
Jun 17 22:27:00 <konttori> anyway, I assume you should be able to ssu to diablo from that
Jun 17 22:27:09 <timeless> i also have n800s running much older versions :)
Jun 17 22:27:13 <konttori> it's still chinook, even if it's a little bit buggy version
Jun 17 22:27:36 <konttori> well, try to ssu to diable on one of those.
Jun 17 22:27:45 <timeless> someone will have to explain how to use ssu :)
Jun 17 22:27:54 <timeless> but not now
Jun 17 22:27:57 <timeless> i want pizza, and then sleep
Jun 17 22:28:01 <timeless> and today is nokia summer party
Jun 17 22:28:43 <GAN800> 42-18, 42-19, 50-2, 51-3
Jun 17 22:28:54 <timeless> gan: you missed 44-xx
Jun 17 22:29:03 <GAN800> Ah, right.
Jun 17 22:29:04 <timeless> wnk
Jun 17 22:29:15 <GAN800> The N800 beta release.
Jun 17 22:29:36 <timeless> gan: if you have time, could you read blog:timeless/148
Jun 17 22:29:50 <GAN800> m-vo has the procedure on his blog. ;)
Jun 17 22:30:10 <GAN800> Will check it later.
Jun 17 22:30:23 <m-vo> GAN800, there is some extra trickery with the initfs that I missed.
Jun 17 22:30:27 <skibur> beta?
Jun 17 22:31:25 <GAN800> m-vo, meh on the kernel/initfs. They're either not flash or make your n810 unbootable at this point. ;)
Jun 17 22:31:28 <timeless> skibur: yeah, we beta'd the browser once, what's wrong w/ beta'ing an os?
Jun 17 22:32:04 <GAN800> s/'re/'ll/
Jun 17 22:32:05 <infobot> GAN800 meant: m-vo, meh on the kernel/initfs. They'll either not flash or make your n810 unbootable at this point. ;)
Jun 17 22:32:20 <timeless> (actually there were more like 3 releases of the beta browser, but who's counting)
Jun 17 22:32:31 <konttori> GAN800: could be that the current initfs / kernel combo is not anymore compatible with the old ones. Thus, ssu cannot be used to jump from chinook to diablo for those parts
Jun 17 22:33:04 <m-vo> konttori, if you flash both then you should be fine.
Jun 17 22:33:04 * konttori goes to sleep ... night all!
Jun 17 22:33:12 <lardman> hmm, my ogg_pack_buffer either contains zeros, or my bitreading code is faulty for 16 and 24bit reads....
Jun 17 22:33:18 <lardman> night konttori
Jun 17 22:33:26 <konttori> you sure? There was something that was done also to bootloader.
Jun 17 22:33:28 <m-vo> the bootloader might be an issue now.  there was a incompatible change in the bootloader / kernel interface at one point.
Jun 17 22:33:44 <konttori> that's what I meant.
Jun 17 22:33:53 <konttori> so, that might be the blocker.
Jun 17 22:34:00 <GAN800> Diablo kernel puts N810 into reboot loop and works fine on the N800, initfs is too big to flash.
Jun 17 22:34:03 <m-vo> ah, ok.
Jun 17 22:34:10 <konttori> anyway, once diablo is out, it's all nice.
Jun 17 22:34:39 <m-vo> the initfs partition in the chinook FIASCO image is too small for the diablo initfs and flashing it during SSU will silently fail.
Jun 17 22:34:44 <m-vo> I think.
Jun 17 22:34:52 <timeless> youch
Jun 17 22:35:03 <timeless> is there any way to fix that?
Jun 17 22:35:25 <m-vo> GAN800 should know all about it, I realize now... :-)
Jun 17 22:35:30 <timeless> (and shouldn't ssu not silently fail that)
Jun 17 22:35:54 <timeless> NAME                                                                 USED  AVAIL  REFER  MOUNTPOINT
Jun 17 22:36:02 <timeless> root_pool/home/svn/lxr-root/lxr-data/nokia-maemo                    11.9G  38.8G  1.13G  /export/home/svn/lxr-root/lxr-data/nokia-maemo
Jun 17 22:36:08 <timeless> root_pool/home/svn/lxr-root/lxr-data/nokia-maemo-old                2.98G  38.8G   808M  /export/home/svn/lxr-root/lxr-data/nokia-maemo-old
Jun 17 22:36:12 * timeless sighs
Jun 17 22:36:18 <GAN800> I deleted the initfs image and flash-and-reboot proceded just fine on the kernel.
Jun 17 22:36:21 <timeless> cross references are interesting things
Jun 17 22:36:26 <m-vo> timeless, no fix except reflashin completely, I think.
Jun 17 22:36:58 <timeless> m-vo: is everything in initfs absolutely necessary?
Jun 17 22:37:20 <m-vo> no, somebody made a smaller version,, actually.
Jun 17 22:37:38 <timeless> could we switch to it?
Jun 17 22:37:50 <GAN800> qwerty12 stripped out the testing stuff and got it to fit.
Jun 17 22:38:04 * timeless ponders
Jun 17 22:38:17 <timeless> a cross reference image for chinook was 1.1g
Jun 17 22:38:32 <timeless> when overlapped w/ a previous week's build, i only pay 500mb
Jun 17 22:38:40 <timeless> so i'm saving >50% per week :)
Jun 17 22:38:53 <m-vo> timeless, i don't think we care enough about upgrading from chinook to diablo via ssu to bother with the initfs now.
Jun 17 22:39:02 <GAN800> Hehe
Jun 17 22:39:32 <timeless> actually, for the previous platform, i was paying more like 200mb for non overlap, so 50% is probably low :(
Jun 17 22:40:04 <timeless> but i should still save 15g :)
Jun 17 22:40:45 <Atarii> can anyone tell me what this theme is plx? http://jacked.ja.funpic.de/up/images/screenshot_tablet_%5B29-03-2008_23-13-09%5D.png
Jun 17 22:41:01 <timeless> and then probably another 15g for diablo
Jun 17 22:41:22 * timeless gets greedy
Jun 17 22:44:15 * lardman cheers, my buffer is fine, thank God
Jun 17 22:47:15 <GAN800> Atarii, Echo with custom icons.
Jun 17 22:47:31 <Atarii> thanks
Jun 17 22:51:16 <lardman> weird http://maemo.pastebin.com/m6a8d0a05 anyone have any ideas?
Jun 17 22:53:27 <lcuk> lardman, which bit is wrong..  im seeing you emit align byte 1 as a 16bit (of 16read), and align byte 2 as only 8 bits (read from 24) ??
Jun 17 22:54:16 <lardman> lcuk: yeah, ignore my output text, that's fine, it's the last two emitted values
Jun 17 22:54:31 <lardman> I set them explicitly in the code, then their values vanish by the time they are output
Jun 17 22:55:36 <lcuk> data type mismatch with endian?  what datatype are those 2 variables you're holding (->dim and ->entries) are they %u compatible?
Jun 17 22:56:01 <lcuk> cos you explicitely cast the others and dont cast those
Jun 17 22:56:25 <lardman> lcuk: indeed, you are almost certainly right
Jun 17 22:56:28 <lardman> they are 32bit
Jun 17 22:56:33 * lardman should go to bed
Jun 17 22:56:45 <lcuk> so the 0 bytes you are seeing are the high order values which are still zero :)
Jun 17 22:57:19 <Alex1> Does anyone knows if Samsung Austin Semiconductor is a good company to work for ?
Jun 17 22:57:23 <lcuk> printf has messed with my head so much i try not to go off the path i know and cast everything
Jun 17 22:57:42 <Alex1> Does anyone knows if Samsung Austin Semiconductor is a good company to work for ?
Jun 17 22:57:49 <lardman> perhaps, but the dbg() fn simply returns 0 if you pass it anything larger than a 16bit type, might be the top bits am not sure
Jun 17 23:00:16 * lcuk is converting to a database
Jun 17 23:01:47 <Dekaritae> Yay winmapper
Jun 17 23:02:13 * lardman adds more explicit casts
Jun 17 23:02:18 <rm_you> wow, I wish I could convert to a database
Jun 17 23:02:29 <rm_you> Maybe then I wouldnt forget my appointments!
Jun 17 23:02:34 * rm_you tries to convert to a database
Jun 17 23:03:24 <lcuk> ive had enough of writing explicit file handlers, im just gonna map tables to my classes and persist away :)
Jun 17 23:03:35 * GAN800 witnesses the fail.
Jun 17 23:03:57 * lcuk looks around to see whos failing
Jun 17 23:04:10 <GAN800> There's one.
Jun 17 23:05:39 <lardman> hmm, even with the cast down to 2x 16bit values, the answer is still 0
Jun 17 23:05:52 <lardman> looks as though the value isn't being set for some reason
Jun 17 23:06:15 <lcuk> do an actual comparison on the next line and triple check its not dbg
Jun 17 23:09:39 <lardman> hmm, very strange, now the dbg() output shows the correct values...
Jun 17 23:10:03 <lardman> all I changed was to add an if(blah==0) printf() after that line
Jun 17 23:10:04 <lcuk> lol
Jun 17 23:10:34 <lcuk> is the .c file #ioncluded from another .c and not included in the make?
Jun 17 23:10:51 <lardman> no, it's one of the main files
Jun 17 23:11:07 <lardman> I can see it's been compiled and linked, no least because my new dbg() outputs turn up
Jun 17 23:11:08 <lcuk> optimized out?
Jun 17 23:11:32 <lardman> yeah, that's a definite possibility, but the value is used later on, so I've no idea why.
Jun 17 23:11:36 <lcuk> no, cant be because you use it, ahhh well phantoms
Jun 17 23:11:53 <lardman> strange compiler though, God only knows what it does :)
Jun 17 23:12:17 <lcuk> i would love to drop gcc one day :)
Jun 17 23:12:34 <lcuk> but only so i can build myself
Jun 17 23:12:47 <lardman> something strange going on though, as some other values have turned up now (which were previously also 0)
Jun 17 23:13:12 <lcuk> more (v1.0) wine needed?
Jun 17 23:13:14 <lardman> ah well, I'll have another look tomorrow, too tired to make much of it tonight
Jun 17 23:13:25 <lardman> lcuk: I'm off the wine, on a being healthy kick
Jun 17 23:13:40 <lcuk> you're missing out then, they released the new one today
Jun 17 23:13:59 <lcuk> http://www.winehq.org/?announce=1.0
Jun 17 23:14:03 <lardman> lcuk: less wine, more exercise. My coding will probably go downhill ;)
Jun 17 23:14:26 <lardman> anyway, thanks for your help
Jun 17 23:14:30 <lardman> night
Jun 17 23:14:34 <lcuk> :) not a bad think in RL though.  keep holly happy
Jun 17 23:14:36 <lcuk> gnite
Jun 17 23:14:45 <Dekaritae> Is there documentation on generating Maemo Mapper .db file from tileset?
Jun 17 23:15:06 <lcuk> Dekaritae, not sure - ive never used mm
Jun 17 23:20:52 <summatusmentis> secureendpoints: jhutz said he took all the updates, and then forgot to put it up, and that he'd get it done this evening or tomorrow
Jun 17 23:22:23 <rm_you> oooo
Jun 17 23:22:27 <rm_you> wine hit 1.0!?
Jun 17 23:23:03 <summatusmentis> err... ignore my previous thing, wrong window
Jun 17 23:25:21 <summatusmentis> but yes, wine hit 1.0 :)
Jun 17 23:25:45 <rm_you> neat
Jun 17 23:26:03 <summatusmentis> I guess... I don't see what it means really
Jun 18 00:58:42 <beford> Hey, I would like to transform a video file into a suitable format for my n810, what format, width and height settings should I use?
Jun 18 01:00:44 <Navi> mpeg4 video, mp3 audio, 400x240
Jun 18 01:06:26 <rm_you> hrm, so anyone ever tried compiling / getting mythtv-frontend to work on ITOS? :P
Jun 18 01:07:04 <rm_you> I want to use my n800 as a mythtv controller :)
Jun 18 01:10:27 <Navi> Someone did
Jun 18 01:10:37 <Navi> video performance wasn't so great
Jun 18 01:10:52 <Navi> It's on itT
Jun 18 01:13:43 <rm_you> ooo
Jun 18 01:15:27 <rm_you> hrm
Jun 18 01:15:33 <rm_you> I guess I was thinking about this wrong
Jun 18 01:15:53 <Navi> Do you want a remote to connect to your PC box?
Jun 18 01:15:55 <rm_you> I really want the video to play on the machine with the backend... I just want to control it
Jun 18 01:16:01 <rm_you> AH!
Jun 18 01:16:03 <Navi> 'cuz there's an app in the repos that lets you do that
Jun 18 01:16:08 <rm_you> ah?
Jun 18 01:16:37 <rm_you> Other option is setting the resolution of the mythtv frontend box to 800x480 and using x11vnc :P
Jun 18 01:16:45 <rm_you> and then use vnc viewer on my tablet, and WIN :P
Jun 18 01:16:53 <Navi> https://garage.maemo.org/projects/pymythremote/
Jun 18 01:16:55 <rm_you> Navi, what app is that? I'll take a look
Jun 18 01:16:58 <rm_you> kk thanks
Jun 18 01:17:13 <Navi> https://garage.maemo.org/projects/mythetomer/
Jun 18 01:17:29 <Navi> Those two
Jun 18 01:17:37 <rm_you> awesome thanks
Jun 18 01:17:39 <rm_you> used either?
Jun 18 01:17:42 <Navi> Nope
Jun 18 01:17:44 <rm_you> hrm
Jun 18 01:17:47 <rm_you> I'll try em
Jun 18 01:17:49 <Navi> I don't have a mythtv box
Jun 18 01:18:33 <Navi> http://netti.nic.fi/~icewood/mythetomer/index.php for mythetomer
Jun 18 01:18:38 <Navi> screenies and info
Jun 18 01:19:03 <ryoohki> doesn't the n800 lack an ir interface?
Jun 18 01:19:53 <Navi> Doesn't do it via IR
Jun 18 01:20:05 <ryoohki> Navi: thanks!
Jun 18 01:20:06 <Navi> mythetomer connects over lan
Jun 18 01:20:49 <ryoohki> anyone know when then nokia n810 wimax edition is coming out and if the specs have changed( like more ram, faster cpu)?
Jun 18 01:21:01 * Navi shrugs
Jun 18 01:21:14 <beford> It's a 4:3 video, so i was unable to select 400x240, I selected 320x240, that'll work, right?
Jun 18 01:21:36 <beford> ryoohki, I think they only added the wimax chipset, afaik other specs are the same as current n810
Jun 18 01:21:48 <Navi> beford, I guess
Jun 18 01:23:35 <ryoohki> beford: thanks!  i hope they upped the ram and cpu a little
Jun 18 01:24:11 <beford> https://www.nokiausa.com/A4952190
Jun 18 01:25:23 <beford> https://www.nokiausa.com/A4626059
Jun 18 01:26:02 <rm_you> Navi, I guess I may have to go with my VNC idea :/
Jun 18 01:26:35 <rm_you> mythtomer looks as if it only does TV related functions...
Jun 18 01:26:56 <rm_you> I don't even have a capture card in this machine, I just want it to be a media player <_<
Jun 18 01:27:03 <rm_you> ah well, thanks for the suggestions :)
Jun 18 01:27:27 <lcuk> rm, you want a remote keyboard for your 800
Jun 18 01:27:42 <Navi> Well, it can do music and videos :P
Jun 18 01:28:04 <Navi> there's enough touch buttons to cover the media aspect of mythtv
Jun 18 01:29:51 <Navi> there's also files sitting in the pymythcontroller svn
Jun 18 01:30:02 <Navi> I've never touched them, so I don't know what it's like
Jun 18 01:58:24 <GAN800> N810W is just an N810 with WiMAX. :/
Jun 18 01:59:48 <summatusmentis> but... but... it's black!
Jun 18 02:16:13 <rm_you> lcuk, ?
Jun 18 02:16:36 <rm_you> anyway, this will be perfect if I can get VNC on my n800 to do REAL fullscreen
Jun 18 02:17:14 <rm_you> right now it thinks "fullscreen" means "almost fullscreen, with about 40px of valuable screen real-estate devoted to a control bar I don't want
Jun 18 02:17:15 <rm_you> "
Jun 18 02:17:45 <rm_you> AH nice there we go, i'm dumb
Jun 18 02:17:57 <rm_you> it has a check in the menu for the toolbar in fullscreen :P
Jun 18 02:18:23 <GAN800> :/
Jun 18 02:18:29 <GAN800> :\
Jun 18 02:22:57 <rm_you> sweet, now I have an awesome remote control :P
Jun 18 02:27:13 <darkblue_B> rm_you: Ive been using the VNC
Jun 18 02:27:26 <rm_you> :)
Jun 18 02:27:27 <darkblue_B> it just has a few quirks
Jun 18 02:27:29 <rm_you> for mythtv?
Jun 18 02:27:38 <darkblue_B> oh, nope
Jun 18 02:27:46 <darkblue_B> just running the thingg
Jun 18 02:27:47 <rm_you> lol
Jun 18 02:28:00 <rm_you> yeah, it seems to work well ;)
Jun 18 02:28:19 <darkblue_B> that feature about preferring the pressure input to clicks
Jun 18 02:28:33 <darkblue_B> prevents the click from being recognized sometimes
Jun 18 02:28:43 <darkblue_B> .. like to bring up the onscreen keyboard
Jun 18 02:29:11 <darkblue_B> or for me .. the "four squares" icon.. I cant clck it via VNC
Jun 18 02:29:28 <darkblue_B> someone has a hack to disable the pressure input
Jun 18 02:29:39 <darkblue_B> but that seems sketchy to me
Jun 18 02:29:49 <darkblue_B> .. or at least, I havent done it
Jun 18 02:30:19 <darkblue_B> thats how far I've gotten
Jun 18 02:30:25 <darkblue_B> -
Jun 18 02:30:47 <darkblue_B> I plan on going to the talk tomorrow night in San Jose, if anyone else on the channel will be there
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Wed Jun 18 02:59:56 2008