**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Fri Aug 22 02:59:56 2008 Aug 22 03:27:37 I love taking my nokia to the big glass apple store Aug 22 03:28:40 first rule of debugging: there IS something wrong with your code Aug 22 03:28:43 *sighs* Aug 22 03:31:23 second rule of debugging: blame someone else Aug 22 03:32:15 that's the first rule of not debugging Aug 22 03:33:43 its more a zen-like acceptance that there is something wrong with your code Aug 22 03:33:49 THEN you can find it and fix it Aug 22 03:33:53 :) Aug 22 03:34:09 after beating your head against the desk for 3hrs first of course Aug 22 03:41:56 Too many bands nowadays are using Apple commercials as the basis for music videos Aug 22 03:41:58 http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=4823630738661410743 Aug 22 03:45:35 you owe me Aug 22 03:46:11 this is worse than half than the internet Aug 22 03:47:32 hello Aug 22 03:48:57 few days ago we spoken about the free software distribution thinked for nokia 770 Aug 22 03:49:26 which is the URL ? Aug 22 03:50:04 thanks Dekaritae. now i need to kill something. Aug 22 03:50:41 http://www.ibm.com/developerworks/linux/library/l-lob800-1.html?S_TACT=105AGX03&S_CMP=EDU Aug 22 03:50:49 Linux on board: Developing for the Nokia N800 Aug 22 03:55:34 why to kill ? Aug 22 03:57:28 i must create now a # for i, my friends and family, why with cell phone finishing many money Aug 22 03:57:56 here in italy all is more expensive Aug 22 03:59:40 ah, i would inform you that the charge battery of my nokia 770 yesterday finished to live Aug 22 04:02:14 the nokia 770 works to 5 volts to 850 mA =4, 25 watt Aug 22 04:04:25 so to find another one i am thinking to use a sony ericsson Standard Charger CST-20 BML 162 170/1 R3A Aug 22 04:05:02 100-240 Volt till 150 mA 50-60 Hz Aug 22 04:05:23 and 4,9 Volt to 850 mA Aug 22 04:05:53 model dc4-3102eu Aug 22 04:06:15 is a sony ericsson thinked for a cellular phone Aug 22 04:07:04 you must only remove the cable from the charger of nokia 770 and to sold on the circuit Aug 22 04:07:18 and the joke is done Aug 22 04:07:50 bene Aug 22 04:08:03 it works yes? Aug 22 04:08:20 i found differening voltages are problematic for charget Aug 22 04:08:46 the cables are the sames, one has the plug more big, the other of nokia 770 is more little Aug 22 04:08:53 this is the difference Aug 22 04:09:45 5 volt or 4,9 are the same thik Aug 22 04:10:02 take a multimeter Aug 22 04:10:17 and set on DC Volt Aug 22 04:10:50 then see the difference is in the order oof 10% max Aug 22 04:12:16 4,9 + 0.049 = 4,949 Volt Aug 22 04:15:01 the charger of nokia 770 works to 5 volts to 890 mA Aug 22 04:16:30 it means the the battery does not to finish immediately as happen with charger of nokia 770 Aug 22 04:16:49 this is the little difference 0,40 mA Aug 22 04:56:04 * GeneralAntilles loves that the N800 picked up internet from the local ISP at the park. Aug 22 04:56:41 <3 Aug 22 04:58:49 the usb port doesn't recharge battery, correct? Aug 22 04:59:33 Right Aug 22 04:59:43 Unless you want to open it up and hack in some leads. ;) Aug 22 05:00:08 hm... no. tempting Aug 22 05:00:38 i tried sautering an ide port on a laptop once Aug 22 05:00:40 take a max 232 Aug 22 05:00:44 not good. Aug 22 05:01:00 max 232? Aug 22 05:01:10 and realize a circuit with a ttl converter to 3.7 volt Aug 22 05:01:51 then a slot for a battery easy to do Aug 22 05:02:00 was thinking about getting a hand crank Aug 22 05:02:06 and 2 pins 2 Aug 22 05:02:14 red and black Aug 22 05:02:25 and all is finish Aug 22 05:02:34 i've been watchin Lost with my gf Aug 22 05:02:56 an the n800 would really help on that island Aug 22 05:03:04 and when the battery is charged you put in nokia n800 Aug 22 05:03:40 wich island ? Aug 22 05:03:51 the lost island Aug 22 05:03:53 which ? Aug 22 05:04:08 The Island Aug 22 05:04:16 ah, Aug 22 05:04:40 but there's no power Aug 22 05:04:47 i do not know if can help you n800 Aug 22 05:04:57 no power ? Aug 22 05:04:59 i have wikipedia on it Aug 22 05:05:06 that helps Aug 22 05:05:21 a little solar panel from 10 watts Aug 22 05:05:37 what if i'm in the jungle? Aug 22 05:05:50 hand crank is the best Aug 22 05:06:12 have you got a byke ? Aug 22 05:06:24 http://www.popgadget.net/2008/05/ecofriendly_han.php Aug 22 05:06:27 yes Aug 22 05:06:41 but i can't take it on a plane Aug 22 05:06:46 the dinamo unmount that Aug 22 05:06:59 don;t have one ;/ Aug 22 05:07:27 the ring of byke ? Aug 22 05:07:41 ring? Aug 22 05:08:21 ii think i'll get that one i linked Aug 22 05:08:48 then i'll laugh in the face if civilization Aug 22 05:08:57 while cranking Aug 22 05:09:03 civilization always wins :( Aug 22 05:09:48 use the bell of bike Aug 22 05:09:54 haha Aug 22 05:09:58 * pupnik listens to awesomeness Aug 22 05:10:04 more great new media added today http://mises.org/media.aspx Aug 22 05:10:23 sober pupnik? Aug 22 05:10:30 no, why? Aug 22 05:11:11 thank the net for lolcatz. it would be a bad day if not... Aug 22 05:11:13 link clickin considerations Aug 22 05:11:56 educational site. austrian economics. lots of mp3s to feed brain Aug 22 05:12:42 not mine ;/ Aug 22 05:13:27 i always wondered why i hated economics at university. now i know Aug 22 05:13:43 wb generalissimo Aug 22 05:15:08 t_s_o Aug 22 05:15:16 bef0rd: Aug 22 05:15:20 I'm working on that lolcatz application Aug 22 05:15:47 hmm, looking forward to a betatest ;) Aug 22 05:16:28 hehe ok Aug 22 05:32:04 obama :No such nick/channel Aug 22 05:33:20 n800n: good, I hear he's a spam bot. Keeps muttering crap about "Change" but then not elaborating on what that change will be when you pm him Aug 22 05:34:20 and he's hosted in a terrorist state Aug 22 05:35:07 Ha Aug 22 05:35:17 Obama sells warm fuzzies. Aug 22 05:35:42 sounds about right for someone whose message was "we will not allow Iran to have a bomb" when neither the CIA nor the IAEA think he's even trying to get one (same for mccainbot too, both whackos) Aug 22 05:36:41 They all need to be fired out of a cannon into the sun. Aug 22 05:37:21 pfft, both of them have the standard politicians' coating of teflon. Fucker's would probably survive and declare war on the sun Aug 22 05:37:54 yeah we should get a swiss guy Aug 22 05:42:22 Hi Aug 22 05:46:38 Hey, pupnik. Aug 22 05:46:43 Hi, Khertan. Aug 22 05:47:17 hi Khertan :) Aug 22 05:52:31 Yet another gem from that idiot mutiny32 https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=176#c79 Aug 22 05:52:52 Somebody please slap him for me if you see him at the Summit. Aug 22 05:56:55 GAN800: i ll be happy to help you Aug 22 05:59:30 maybe we should give free tshirt to all troller to have a better idea of which people we need a slap each we see it ? Aug 22 05:59:43 what do u think of this proposal ? Aug 22 05:59:44 :) Aug 22 06:00:00 s/each/each time Aug 22 06:07:45 lol i don t know that the name of the codec 'Vorbis' come from Terry Pratchett book Aug 22 06:13:52 and so useless thing ... we already have a free audio codec better than ogg : aac Aug 22 06:14:23 Khertan_n810: then you'll just be encouraging people to troll Aug 22 06:14:28 for example, I know want a t-shirt Aug 22 06:16:18 doc|home: yep ... :) Aug 22 06:16:49 you want a tshirt : 'i m a well know maemo troller' ? Aug 22 06:17:06 :) Aug 22 06:19:15 What's maemo? Aug 22 06:19:30 maemo.org Aug 22 06:19:34 re Aug 22 06:20:10 other definition : a community with too many troller Aug 22 06:20:13 :) Aug 22 06:20:37 http://maemo.org Aug 22 06:26:21 yaay why is emma here? Aug 22 06:26:47 buy a nokia internet tablet emma. they're lurvely Aug 22 06:27:33 I just like to explore freenode some times and see what's out there. Aug 22 06:27:41 :) Aug 22 06:27:56 lol Aug 22 06:27:59 topics are good sources of information about channels Aug 22 06:28:10 I'm afraid I know nothing about maemo, however, taking a cursory glance at the webpage, I think that jussi 16 should have won the contest (in my opinion) http://maemo.org/news/announcements/view/logo_contest_results.html Aug 22 06:28:12 http://pupnik.de/GemRB_800x480_XL.jpg look emma! Aug 22 06:28:27 happy fun thing Aug 22 06:28:48 khertan.net/poubelle/logo1.png Aug 22 06:29:00 this onee is the best logo ! Aug 22 06:29:13 looks pretty cool. Is Maemo related to the Nokia n800 series? Aug 22 06:29:36 yes Aug 22 06:29:41 Khertan_n810: only thing better than a nice t-shirt is a free t-shirt! Aug 22 06:29:42 yep this is the communtity around the internet tablet and the os Aug 22 06:29:51 ...or something like that Aug 22 06:29:56 hehe Khertan_n810 Aug 22 06:30:22 I thought that the OS was some Debian variant on that n800 thing. Aug 22 06:30:35 this is ... Aug 22 06:30:53 like ubuntu is a debian variant Aug 22 06:31:03 A nicely schitzoid variant Aug 22 06:31:03 maemo is another ... Aug 22 06:31:07 Oh then is Maemo like a distro? Aug 22 06:31:15 yep Aug 22 06:31:24 ahh okay that's pretty cool. Aug 22 06:31:42 So Maemo is a distro, a variant of Debian, that runs on the n800 gadgets? Aug 22 06:32:18 pretty much Aug 22 06:32:25 And there's an SDK based on scratchbox Aug 22 06:32:27 Or two. Aug 22 06:32:29 Okay pretty cool. Aug 22 06:32:35 it's kind of thrown around as a general term to encompass a lot of tablet related things Aug 22 06:32:36 For cross-compilation Aug 22 06:32:40 What's an SDK? Aug 22 06:32:49 Software Development Kit Aug 22 06:33:10 johnx: sound has been added btw :) Aug 22 06:33:11 compilers, documentation, examples, related tools, etc Aug 22 06:33:12 Maemo's often used as a word for the community side. The other side is Nokia Aug 22 06:33:22 Stskeeps, yeah. just saw that. Sorry I wasn't more help :/ Aug 22 06:33:23 Okay for writing apps specifically for maemo (or the tablet) ? Aug 22 06:33:40 johnx: hehe, seems like most of the work was lifted from beta3 really Aug 22 06:33:51 emma: For building them and making packages. Cross-compiling. Aug 22 06:33:59 khertan ... do you know how to change the bg color of a label widget? ive tried everything and it wont change :( Aug 22 06:34:08 Stskeeps, well, that's good at least. I borrowed a lot of that stuff from Mamona in the first place. Aug 22 06:34:20 build/test/debug/emulate Aug 22 06:34:22 okay so first you write your application and then you use sdk for making them runable on maemo? Aug 22 06:34:43 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maemo_(operating_system) Aug 22 06:34:45 emma: Easier than coding on the device :) (some disagree) Aug 22 06:35:02 XTL: False Aug 22 06:35:11 easier to code on device ! Aug 22 06:35:14 ^^ Aug 22 06:35:18 Is there a maemo repo so that you can use apt-get ? Aug 22 06:35:37 since it is related to debian is there the debian package manager on it? Aug 22 06:35:39 There's several. One big one. Aug 22 06:35:50 Apt's there, of course. Aug 22 06:36:24 Is Maemo much like other Debian based Linux distros if you take it to the command line? Aug 22 06:36:58 emma: pretty much.. there are some minor differences such as using busybox sh instead of bash, but if you know debian, you can get far with maemo Aug 22 06:36:59 Khertan, scratch that ... got it Aug 22 06:37:02 Pretty much. With some tweaks to eg save space etc Aug 22 06:37:27 Could maemo be run on a desktop computer? Aug 22 06:37:58 emma: someone has made qemu emulation images of maemo atleast Aug 22 06:38:22 I'm sorry what is qemu? Aug 22 06:38:43 it's software to emulate another machine Aug 22 06:38:57 Ahh I see. Aug 22 06:39:22 But I guess that maemo itself will not be installable on an i86 computer. Aug 22 06:40:49 well for development you can run parts of it in the SDK / Scratchbox thing.. but i can't see why you'd want to run it on a i86 as it's very dedicated to the tablet format and usage Aug 22 06:41:27 one thing i like about that n800 is the touchscreen keyboard. Aug 22 06:41:34 Stskeeps, it might be neat to run on an MID Aug 22 06:41:52 emma, yeah. the touchscreen keyboard is actually pretty nice Aug 22 06:42:09 johnx: true, true Aug 22 06:42:12 i don't own an n800 but in fact I intend to get one perhaps soon. Aug 22 06:42:22 I think I want the n810 Aug 22 06:42:33 I want the one that has the camera but not the pullout keyboard. Aug 22 06:42:45 I don't feel like I have any use for a pull out keyboard. Aug 22 06:43:00 both has camera, n800 has the pop out camera, n810 has the one in front Aug 22 06:43:05 no pullout on n800 Aug 22 06:43:34 Is the n810 better than the n800 then or not? Aug 22 06:43:48 depends on your perspective.. i like n800 better than n810 Aug 22 06:43:57 what do you mean by popout camera? Aug 22 06:44:00 i don't need gps or pull out keyboard Aug 22 06:44:13 I sure don't need pullout keyboard. gps maybe... Aug 22 06:44:13 on the side of a n800 theres a circle you can gently push and a camera pops out Aug 22 06:44:30 popsout completely or so you can swivle it or what? Aug 22 06:44:49 it goes from completely hidden to visible Aug 22 06:44:54 hm. Aug 22 06:45:00 and you probably want a separate bluetooth GPS anyways Aug 22 06:45:05 webkit has some hildon stuff going for it, is there a usable frontend (eal?) or anyone tried to compime midori for maemo? Aug 22 06:45:10 the one on the N810 is pretty slow even when it works Aug 22 06:45:14 but the choice was made in n810 to change the camera design. Why? Aug 22 06:45:28 Ave, there was a version of midori for maemo a while back Aug 22 06:45:44 emma, probably to save space and make it less fragile Aug 22 06:45:54 I am using below things in my config.ac on maemo platform Aug 22 06:45:54 base code. Aug 22 06:45:54 if test x$ac_cv_header_apt_pkg_configuration_h != xyes; then Aug 22 06:45:54 AC_ERROR([libapt-pkg not found.]) Aug 22 06:45:54 while doing ./configure form console it gives me Aug 22 06:45:55 below error messages ? How to resolve ? Aug 22 06:45:56 Ave, not sure if it got updated recently Aug 22 06:45:57 checking apt-pkg/configuration.h usability... no Aug 22 06:45:59 checking apt-pkg/configuration.h presence... no Aug 22 06:46:01 checking for apt-pkg/configuration.h... no Aug 22 06:46:03 configure: error: libapt-pkg not found. Aug 22 06:46:04 johnx: ok thanks, I'll look around if I can fin dit Aug 22 06:46:05 is the camera a webcam or a digital camera? Aug 22 06:46:13 webcam at best Aug 22 06:46:29 a bad webcam Aug 22 06:46:31 it's a pretty lame webcam quality Aug 22 06:46:34 johnx: i still haven't found the cause of the dreaded fsck problem :/ i thought mounting it all correctly with linuxrc, readonly and all would fix it.. even the fix with moving FSCK_LOGFILE Aug 22 06:46:58 Stskeeps, that's so odd... Aug 22 06:47:07 So it's not really good for use as a digital camera then. Aug 22 06:47:32 What is the most recent model? Is it n900s now? Aug 22 06:47:37 emma, it's not completely awful in direct sunlight Aug 22 06:47:57 emma, "N900" doesn't exist. It's just speculation. No announcement from Nokia about it at all Aug 22 06:47:59 haha that's a ringing endorsement, "It's not completely awful" Aug 22 06:48:17 suppose the camera (VGA resolution I think) is meant for stuff like video calls, think skype Aug 22 06:48:24 nothing else.. Aug 22 06:48:40 It's hard to use for else since it's pointed at the user Aug 22 06:48:50 emma, heh. I don't want to make you think it's better than it is. :) Aug 22 06:48:59 its hard to use because its so sucky quality.. Aug 22 06:49:10 and currently nothing even harnesses it! Aug 22 06:49:12 the camera on my "free with contract" cell phone from a year ago is miles better than the N800's cam Aug 22 06:49:23 You guys are masters of the soft sell. Aug 22 06:49:42 emma, we're interested in the software, not selling hardware for Nokia Aug 22 06:49:44 :) Aug 22 06:50:12 I get you and I'm just kidding, but it sounds like maemo mainly just runs on this hardware. Aug 22 06:50:13 and also, if you buy it and hate it you'll just be back here to yell at us :D Aug 22 06:50:28 http://bundyo.org/maemo/midori/ Aug 22 06:50:28 Phone cameras have gotten pretty amazing anyway Aug 22 06:50:29 that is all Aug 22 06:50:48 XTL, it's too bad Nokia didn't have a nicer camera lying around to put in the tablets :/ Aug 22 06:51:11 shoud have bought a module from sonyericsson Aug 22 06:51:20 what a heresy Aug 22 06:51:29 :) Aug 22 06:51:45 * johnx has no loyalty to huge hardware vendors Aug 22 06:51:47 having even a low end, say 5 mega pixel , digital camera in there would be pretty cool. Aug 22 06:51:51 its quit big tho what I've seen, so wouldnthave fitted Aug 22 06:52:07 also I'm looking forward on trying out andrdoid on the n810 hardware Aug 22 06:52:14 having even a working 1MP camera with white-balance control would be a *huge* improvement Aug 22 06:52:39 One that doesn't take weeks to get from zero to picture Aug 22 06:52:47 well the concensus is that the current camera is almost unusable joke Aug 22 06:52:55 I have heard of people putting Kubuntu on one of these n800s Aug 22 06:53:04 debian Aug 22 06:53:16 once the debian armel port is finished it oughta just plop right in Aug 22 06:53:29 prolly usable even now? Aug 22 06:53:41 Ave, well, kubuntu will plop right in after a couple weeks of compilation :) Aug 22 06:53:51 debian+kde will be just a click away Aug 22 06:54:29 but what a person really needs is that touchscreen keyboard or they are doomed. Aug 22 06:54:31 GAN800: wanna explain to c80 (private/public) how to use mailprefs to skip mail by votes Aug 22 06:54:38 sounds like that touchscreen keyboard is given by maemo Aug 22 06:54:42 kubuntu doesn't have it. Aug 22 06:54:51 n810 needs no virtual keyboard Aug 22 06:54:59 why not? Aug 22 06:55:01 emma, there are a couple software keyboards, but the mameo one is the best one I've used Aug 22 06:55:08 bc it has a real one Aug 22 06:55:16 Esworp : How to install libapt-pkg inside scratch-box ? Aug 22 06:55:17 N810 = slide out keyboard. N800 = onscreen keyboard only Aug 22 06:55:23 that's what i thought but someone said it has no pullout keyboard. Aug 22 06:55:34 I think that the 800 is better then. Aug 22 06:55:37 and that is the reason why I didn't buy internet tablet before n810 Aug 22 06:55:39 How to install libapt-pkg inside scratch-box ? Aug 22 06:56:01 why would i want a pullout keyboard? As if I'm going to use something like an n800 to write my novel. Aug 22 06:56:21 emma: how is n800 better than n810 since they are about the same, except n810 has keyboard and internal gps Aug 22 06:56:38 The internal gps is indeed intriguing. Aug 22 06:56:44 Stskeeps: of course, ubuntu defaults to dash... so sh differences aren't that rare :) Aug 22 06:56:44 that must make it much more expensive though. Aug 22 06:56:47 emma, pullout is better for IM/IRC :) Aug 22 06:56:49 does it actually come with working gps? Aug 22 06:56:55 and the keyboard is imho better for irc,im,email Aug 22 06:57:07 i just don't know. Aug 22 06:57:17 how much does the 800 cost and how much does the 810 cost? Aug 22 06:57:17 emma: yep. I use it when I'm driving, works ok Aug 22 06:57:19 timely: well lenny has support for dash too.. tried it on n8x0 instead of bash, it was actually a lot faster Aug 22 06:57:20 in USD Aug 22 06:57:23 the internal gps sucks as much as the internal camera, sorry Aug 22 06:57:26 its really bad Aug 22 06:57:31 cold start is like 10 minutes Aug 22 06:57:35 the GPS works, just kinda slowish Aug 22 06:57:36 no siree bob Aug 22 06:57:48 Ave: except with diablo, a-gps works Aug 22 06:57:55 kinda Aug 22 06:58:04 but thats what you get for NOT having a sirf3-chipset Aug 22 06:58:06 do you have to pay a monthly service for the GPS ? Aug 22 06:58:06 usually it gets a fix in a max, minute Aug 22 06:58:17 anyways, you're better off with a cheap bt GPS that you can hold someplace where it can get signal Aug 22 06:58:23 yep Aug 22 06:58:24 emma: for the turn-by-turn voice, yes Aug 22 06:58:44 but not for the map and locator? Aug 22 06:58:44 I have a bt-gps as well, you can leave it in your shirt pocket or whatever and get a fix in seconds Aug 22 06:58:49 right Aug 22 06:59:05 johnx: err, it keeps lock inside my motorbiking jacket... Aug 22 06:59:10 whatever happened to kotczarny Aug 22 06:59:21 I can ride over 100 km's and it doesn't loose my location Aug 22 06:59:37 does someone wanna finish the fast snes emu port? Aug 22 06:59:37 once it gets the lock, it keeps it, the initial lock just takes a while :p Aug 22 06:59:39 pupnik: no idea, I was wondering the same thing :(. His website is still alive thouhg :/ Aug 22 06:59:46 The wireless works reliably in maemo? Aug 22 06:59:50 hey guys, see this: http://ta.iki.fi/vauhdinhurmaa.png Aug 22 07:00:01 connects to 802.11a ? Aug 22 07:00:02 *though Aug 22 07:00:04 thats maemo mapper gps status screen, on airplane .. Aug 22 07:00:05 WPA ? Aug 22 07:00:12 wireless reception is great emma. i dunno about unusual WPA setups tho Aug 22 07:00:18 WPA = yes, 802.11a = no Aug 22 07:00:40 just b/g? Aug 22 07:00:44 I thought 802.11a is what the protocol is for wifi Aug 22 07:00:52 rm_you, yup. Aug 22 07:00:59 a b g i n Aug 22 07:01:03 and probably more Aug 22 07:01:07 emma, wifi is a pretty wide set of protocols Aug 22 07:01:11 a is old old, not really used these days Aug 22 07:01:19 its all g/b and newer Aug 22 07:01:29 well how does it find the wifi connection ? Aug 22 07:01:30 802.11b is old but very standard. 802.11g is new but standard. 802.11a isn't that widely used Aug 22 07:01:46 most of my net cards are a/b/g, i guess mobile devices don't want to bother fitting the hardware in there for more than b/g Aug 22 07:02:07 laptop is draft-n :) Aug 22 07:02:12 emma how does anything find a wifi connection Aug 22 07:02:12 as is my WRT-300N Aug 22 07:02:16 rm_you, prolly the antenna rather than the hardware...but Nokia also cheaped out massively on all the components :) Aug 22 07:02:21 heh Aug 22 07:02:35 ack i have to wake up for work in 4 hours <_< Aug 22 07:02:36 i thought the common way to send and recieve wifi is with 802.11a Aug 22 07:02:49 rm_you, ick. I just finished for the week Aug 22 07:02:55 emma: that is one standard... Aug 22 07:02:57 emma, nope. :) Aug 22 07:02:58 no 802.11g is most common Aug 22 07:03:06 iirc Aug 22 07:03:11 802.11* are the wireless protocols Aug 22 07:03:31 and we should all be bathing in the wisdom of Thomas E. Woods Jr. Aug 22 07:04:02 http://ieee802.org/11/ Aug 22 07:04:04 * johnx bathes in ... ya'know...water Aug 22 07:04:06 not sure if that is helpful Aug 22 07:04:17 this might be helpful: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wifi Aug 22 07:04:24 probably more so :P Aug 22 07:04:36 also there's a new dynrec for dosbox on gp2x Aug 22 07:04:43 if anyone wants to try building that Aug 22 07:05:17 Usually wifi strugles on linux. I wonder why it works so well on maemo Aug 22 07:05:28 one device, one driver Aug 22 07:05:35 because really if that tablet cannot reliably get wifi it would be worthless and I'm sure nokia does not allow that. Aug 22 07:05:46 + we will never find out due to a lot of it being closed source :) Aug 22 07:05:46 rm_you said the answer Aug 22 07:05:48 the reason people have problems with wifi on linux is because of crazy wireless chipsets Aug 22 07:06:00 rm_you+1 Aug 22 07:06:02 and lack of support Aug 22 07:06:21 some wireless chipsets work excellently in various flavours of linux... some don't work at all Aug 22 07:06:37 buy a wireless card with a known-to-work chipset, and it will be perfect :P Aug 22 07:06:39 and i miss ssvb and Tak too :( Aug 22 07:06:45 and unique311 Aug 22 07:06:49 I have an aironet cisco wifi card. Aug 22 07:06:54 ssvb still comes sometimes. Aug 22 07:07:01 it ought to be great. but some times I'm not sure. Aug 22 07:07:05 emma: yeah i have one too... it... sort of works Aug 22 07:07:12 emma, how many years old is that? O_o Aug 22 07:07:16 my ralink is similar... works KINDA Aug 22 07:07:19 I can get it working to find my signal, but it seems like it can only handle unsecured, or wep. Aug 22 07:07:19 johnx: many years Aug 22 07:07:25 I have not made it work with WPA yet. Aug 22 07:07:26 mine is a/b only Aug 22 07:07:36 prolly a 340 eh rm_you Aug 22 07:07:40 emma: yeah, wpa_supplicant and the like is tricky Aug 22 07:07:41 350 Aug 22 07:07:44 aironet cisco really should work. That has to be top quality. Aug 22 07:07:54 emma: it has nothing to do with quality, really Aug 22 07:07:54 mine got stolen Aug 22 07:08:00 it has more to do with openness of the chipset driver Aug 22 07:08:09 i still have to arrange a beating for the guy who stole it Aug 22 07:08:13 some of the CHEAPEST cards work like a charm Aug 22 07:08:21 because they use really simple common chipsets Aug 22 07:08:35 someone should go into buisness as an opensource hardware maker. Aug 22 07:08:36 and so many people buy them and work on the driver support that they work flawlessly Aug 22 07:08:44 Khertan, you around? Aug 22 07:08:47 emma: it has been tried Aug 22 07:08:58 in various fields Aug 22 07:09:01 emma, it's a losing proposition. Linux users are notoriously cheap :P Aug 22 07:09:06 yeah Aug 22 07:09:13 one example i can think of offhand, pchdtv Aug 22 07:09:30 I would thik that even linux users would pay for a wifi card they knew would actually work. Aug 22 07:09:31 dunno how profitable that venture was <_< Aug 22 07:09:36 emma: they do :P Aug 22 07:09:40 you just need to do some research Aug 22 07:09:42 emma, that's why they buy intel cards Aug 22 07:09:56 intel has really been "doing the right thing" (tm) lately Aug 22 07:09:58 emma, best buy sells a generic own brand one for $10 that works like a charm Aug 22 07:10:24 I have a thinkpad. It is intel card. But the aironet wifi seems sketchy. As I said. I still have not gotten it to work when my signal is WPA protected. Aug 22 07:10:39 moontiger: dynex? Aug 22 07:10:44 emma: moving to linux/gnu/opensource really requires a redefinition of the standard mindset in many aspects, including hardware Aug 22 07:10:45 yup Aug 22 07:10:49 moontiger: a wifi card you mean? Aug 22 07:10:50 aironet != intel :) Aug 22 07:10:54 emma, yes Aug 22 07:10:59 brand-name crazy expensive hardware is actually likely to be less open Aug 22 07:11:18 Can you open a laptop and change that or are you stuck with whatever your network device is? Aug 22 07:11:33 you can buy a USB or a PCMCIA adapter... Aug 22 07:11:35 emma, depends on the laptop ... i changed the one inside my thinkpad Aug 22 07:11:44 it is difficult to actually swap out the card tho :/ Aug 22 07:11:52 unless the laptop is specifically designed to allow it Aug 22 07:11:53 it all depends on the laptop Aug 22 07:12:05 thinkpads == awesome :) Aug 22 07:12:06 sometimes laptops are a huge PITA to get apart without breaking Aug 22 07:12:08 i've seen maybe one in five that let you Aug 22 07:13:10 but could i get a usb network device that would confidently work with linux, and be able to use it rather than the internal one? Aug 22 07:13:21 emma, yes Aug 22 07:13:44 i would suggest a pcmcia card instead personally Aug 22 07:13:56 emma, just as long as you're willing to buy one you've researched and know will work well with linux :) Aug 22 07:13:58 moontiger: this is a laptop. Aug 22 07:14:07 emma: pcmcia == laptop Aug 22 07:14:14 ummmm the small slots in the side are for pcmcia cards ;) Aug 22 07:14:18 emma, pcmcia is that rectangular slot on the side Aug 22 07:14:21 oh i see. Aug 22 07:14:32 let me take a look and see if it's there. Aug 22 07:14:40 pcmcia aka pc card aka cardbus aka sandwich slot :) Aug 22 07:14:41 i always find usb nics seem to be sluggish Aug 22 07:14:55 There is something there. Aug 22 07:14:59 emma, what laptop do you have? Aug 22 07:15:03 i have a nice ALFA with ext. 9db antenna and 300mw Aug 22 07:15:07 thinkpad x31 Aug 22 07:15:07 aka that slot that every laptop has and i've never once used Aug 22 07:15:31 * pupnik launches into ballistic trajectory to pounce on emma's thinkpad Aug 22 07:15:34 johnx: so most of my hardware is getting to the "falling apart" point <_< Aug 22 07:15:39 emma, and you said there's something already in it? Aug 22 07:15:46 rm_you, eh? what happened? Aug 22 07:15:54 not in that pcmcia slot. Aug 22 07:16:11 but in the computer yes. It's an aironet wireless cisco Aug 22 07:16:16 the thinkpad x300 is like sexxx... led backlight... umts Aug 22 07:16:18 it has the atheros chip in it Aug 22 07:16:25 have you tried the madwifi drivers? Aug 22 07:16:33 johnx: the northbridge fan on my server mb died... then like a week later the power supply in my desktop went up in a shower of sparks and smoke.... and my server's case is like, bent/torqued in a crazy way Aug 22 07:16:36 I don't know. Aug 22 07:16:39 pupnik, I'm liking the x200 actually. but yes, the new x series looks great Aug 22 07:16:47 johnx: when i pick it up, it flexes and TWISTS Aug 22 07:16:54 rm_you, :( Aug 22 07:16:59 well this is not a new computer. I did not say x300 I said x31 :) Aug 22 07:17:27 emma, pupnik and I are just dreaming :) Aug 22 07:17:30 johnx: so, server is out of commission... and the SIX drives i have in there are all pushing five years... of 24/7 runtime... Aug 22 07:17:50 rm_you, skeery. you run smartctl on them, right? Aug 22 07:17:54 they need to be retired like... now. Aug 22 07:18:04 1Tb isn't even that much any more Aug 22 07:18:12 250gb drives are done for Aug 22 07:18:28 * pupnik uses 7 year old thinkpad and is still happy Aug 22 07:18:29 johnx: yeah... one of them is being a little funky, it dies a lot Aug 22 07:18:32 rm_you, even I'm up to almost 1TB on random drives Aug 22 07:18:36 resynched my raid like 3 times in a month Aug 22 07:18:46 EXCEPT at linuxtag the bitch crossed me Aug 22 07:19:04 I need to replace the whole server Aug 22 07:19:05 the closest I have to a working laptop is a Zaurus C1000 Aug 22 07:19:14 cool Aug 22 07:19:15 when researching for a pcmcia card that will 'just work' is it about it working with linux or about it working with the computer you have with linux? Aug 22 07:19:18 if you get my question? Aug 22 07:19:24 and is it distro specific? Aug 22 07:19:27 pretty much just working with linux Aug 22 07:19:33 and MOSTLY not distro specific Aug 22 07:19:35 would it be sufficient to search for such a card that works with debian? Aug 22 07:19:38 i would just check ubuntu Aug 22 07:19:47 if there is a guide for ubuntu, then it will probably work Aug 22 07:19:58 there is a guide for ubuntu. Aug 22 07:20:03 how did you know i used ubuntu? Aug 22 07:20:31 didn't. it's just a good reference point Aug 22 07:20:55 i had the aironet 340 working with linux on a Psion Netbook Aug 22 07:21:02 http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=ubuntu_mid_804 Aug 22 07:21:16 think they are just atheros chipset Aug 22 07:21:38 For lists of supported hardware on Ubuntu see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/HardwareSupport - To help debugging and improving hardware detection, see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebuggingHardwareDetection Aug 22 07:23:00 http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/mobile/releases/hardy/ could it be possible to run the kvm image with something different, such as vmware, qemu? Aug 22 07:23:22 https://help.ubuntu.com/community/WifiDocs/WirelessCardsSupported Aug 22 07:24:02 btw any of you got rtl8187 going on n8x0? Aug 22 07:24:30 pupnik: I've compiled diablo modules and one guy said he had it working with the chinook modules I compiled for you a long time ago Aug 22 07:24:41 yeah ty for that Aug 22 07:24:57 .anyway gotta sleep Aug 22 07:24:59 laterz Aug 22 07:25:01 cheers Aug 22 07:25:09 'Night, rm_you Aug 22 07:25:09 'night rm_you Aug 22 07:25:30 * qwerty12 never used to say 'night before coming here and stealing it off johnx :P :) Aug 22 07:25:33 pupnik: http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=19575 Aug 22 07:25:34 * rm_you rofls at qwerty12/johnx as he powers off monitors Aug 22 07:25:44 :P Aug 22 07:25:56 qwerty12, muahaha Aug 22 07:26:11 this is a great community Aug 22 07:27:27 * qwerty12 is now seeing what using the internet for ages does to me at night. Now that I don't have a tablet to use until my replacement charger arrives, I can't actually get to sleep until really late >.< Aug 22 07:27:52 why does tablet help you sleep? Aug 22 07:28:05 porn @ tablet? Aug 22 07:28:06 :P Aug 22 07:28:14 it do not, but he stays away wanting to play with it... Aug 22 07:28:36 man, 2007 was fun Aug 22 07:28:47 pupnik: It was a really bad habit I got into, I would browse the internet for *ages* and now that I can't, I can't get to sleep quickly anymore >.< Aug 22 07:29:02 qwerty12: ah, shutting your brain off? :P Aug 22 07:29:06 you have confused pupnik Aug 22 07:29:28 Stskeeps: yarr Aug 22 07:29:37 pupnik: sorry, blame it on my tiredness >.< Aug 22 07:30:09 yeah maemo is pretty cool. you guys are cool. Aug 22 07:30:29 * pupnik gazes proudly at a row of empty wine bottles Aug 22 07:30:54 got money for one emma? :) Aug 22 07:30:57 starting the weekend early pupnik? Aug 22 07:31:11 money for what? Aug 22 07:31:16 a n800 or n810 Aug 22 07:31:47 frankly i'm itchy to see the next device Aug 22 07:31:57 omap 3430 has been out for a long time now Aug 22 07:32:00 pupnik, they have medicine for that now... Aug 22 07:32:46 * qwerty12 detests the new sourceforge layout Aug 22 07:34:04 Yeah I can get one. Aug 22 07:34:17 looks like the n810 is about 500 dollars. Aug 22 07:34:17 is there any reason doing "i.set_from_stock()" on an image "i" would crash the tablet? Aug 22 07:34:24 How much is an n800 though? Aug 22 07:34:41 i've found it for 200$ or so, if you can find it Aug 22 07:34:50 that's nothing. Aug 22 07:34:55 emma, yeah, the N800 is technically discontinued now Aug 22 07:35:11 must be on ebay Aug 22 07:35:31 there are some places that still have stock sitting around I think...just somewhat hard to find Aug 22 07:35:38 but if there is an n820 coming.... Aug 22 07:36:02 well there is an N810 w/ wimax support coming...but if you don't know what wimax is you don't need it :) Aug 22 07:36:04 The N810 price may go down when the wimax comes Aug 22 07:36:27 what's the wimax? Aug 22 07:36:52 johnx said it better, there is going to be a n810 with wimax support Aug 22 07:37:02 oh. Aug 22 07:37:12 wimax is like satelite broadband? Aug 22 07:37:29 exactly...except without the satellites :) Aug 22 07:37:30 Or a really long range wlan Aug 22 07:37:50 basically like broadband through cell towers? Aug 22 07:37:52 Or a really broadband packet switched cellular network Aug 22 07:38:01 emma, yeah. pretty close to that. Aug 22 07:38:01 * qwerty12 doesn't buy into WiMax, HSDPA all the way Aug 22 07:38:22 My father has wimax. Nothing else will carry that far into nowhere Aug 22 07:38:24 i probably don't need that but if it did bring down the price of of the older 810s. Aug 22 07:38:24 doesn't cost me anything to wait and see which one will win :) Aug 22 07:38:30 now im not sure if i should wait or not. Aug 22 07:38:47 emma, it won't bring down the cost of the N800 though I'd bet Aug 22 07:38:50 The other end is up a gsm tower 5km away so there's infra there. Aug 22 07:39:02 I'm pretty sure the N800 price is as low as it's going to get for a while Aug 22 07:39:08 But the phonelines are too old and so is the gsm (gprs is slow) Aug 22 07:39:09 moo, johnx, qwerty Aug 22 07:39:09 oh im sure Aug 22 07:39:15 i'm talking about the 810 Aug 22 07:39:18 RST38h, m00 :D Aug 22 07:39:19 hey RST38h Aug 22 07:40:48 yeah im definitely going to be getting either the 800 or the current 810. Aug 22 07:41:12 so i'll just continue to hang out here. Aug 22 07:42:15 emma, heh...darn. I guess we accidentally sold another one of these stupid things :D Aug 22 07:42:23 :) Aug 22 07:42:29 hehe Aug 22 07:42:58 Well, there's a lot of almost this type devices, but if you like the nit, I don't think there's many alternatives. Aug 22 07:43:31 what is nit? Aug 22 07:43:38 Nokia Internet Tablet Aug 22 07:43:54 Or maemo for that matter Aug 22 07:43:57 aka, the 770, N800, N810 and anything else they make in the future Aug 22 07:44:12 ahha Aug 22 07:44:27 i will probably get the n810 so that i have the best one among my friends. Aug 22 07:44:51 hehe, they don't listen to much, do they? Aug 22 07:44:53 So you'll get your friends to get 800's Aug 22 07:44:57 much radio that is >.< Aug 22 07:45:08 i have a friend that has the 770 and another that has the 800. Aug 22 07:45:58 So this wasn't an entirely strange idea Aug 22 07:46:05 * qwerty12 friends are under the impression that the N800 is a phone due to it saying Nokia >.< Aug 22 07:46:39 qwerty12, it's not a phone...I just figured no one was calling me... O_o Aug 22 07:47:02 hehe Aug 22 07:47:18 can you run skype on it? Aug 22 07:47:19 I once had a psion (borrowed, too). People thought it was a communicator (as in Nokia 9xxx) Aug 22 07:47:31 emma: yeah, skype comes bundled Aug 22 07:47:35 Some dumbass friend starts arguing with me that why would Nokia make it then if it wasn't a phone Aug 22 07:47:35 emma: skype, gtalk, SIP... Aug 22 07:47:40 emma, yeah. Skype actually works really well Aug 22 07:47:42 well then it is kind of a phone :) Aug 22 07:47:56 qwerty12: You should show them the boots, tires, network equipment... :) Aug 22 07:48:05 (Ok, so they're separated these days) Aug 22 07:48:12 :) Aug 22 07:48:50 The N800 connects to my Sony Ericsson W810 better for going on the internet than the actual phone does itself Aug 22 07:49:15 no wonder Aug 22 07:49:21 heh, i have a nokia sat tuner here. not the best one, but it gets the job done... Aug 22 07:50:02 Scandinavian technology. Aug 22 07:50:13 Yeh, pretty crap phone but I try opera mini on it, connection failed over and over again. Connect the N800 to it, the icon shows it's connected and I get google. I haven't tried it with my P1 though. Aug 22 07:50:29 P1 sucks though, can't get it to connect with my AP when I keep WPA on. Aug 22 07:50:38 the N80 works fine with WPA Aug 22 07:51:15 heh, your running the latest firmware on all of them? Aug 22 07:52:27 I was at the time :), the N80 is probably a few releases out now but it worked fine with the old firmware. The p1 is probably old but I hate installing that java/flash crap to update the firmware on it. With my W810, because it's hacked, i can just use setool with it Aug 22 07:52:37 t_s_o: Oh, yeah, there's those too. And dsl modems. But I guess that's back to the telco equipment Aug 22 07:53:35 hmm, not sure if my SE Z710 is more recent then the W810. firmwares of the SE phone have been a bit hit and miss with the later models... Aug 22 07:53:37 what webbrowser comes on the n8#0 ? Aug 22 07:53:52 microb, gecko/firefox based Aug 22 07:54:08 t_s_o: it is, it uses a later generation of enea ose come think of it too Aug 22 07:54:35 may explain why i cant say i have seen those kinds of issues on my phone then Aug 22 07:55:00 Oh, I know that phone, my sister has the W710. Z710 can be flashed to W710 Aug 22 07:55:07 but then i more or less used a T610 to death before swapping to the Z710. Aug 22 07:55:14 sure can, but i dont see the need Aug 22 07:55:21 * qwerty12 likes modding sony ericsson phones, my first proper phone was a K750 that I had flashed to W800 Aug 22 07:55:30 hehe Aug 22 07:56:27 hmm, im tempted to go for the C702. but it seems the firmware is a bit problematic. but then it will mostly be used as a 3G "modem" for my tablet so ;) Aug 22 07:57:00 * qwerty12 <3's Sony's Japanese phones Aug 22 07:57:56 * XTL has a T610 Aug 22 07:58:11 Olde. But the battery just keeps on going. Aug 22 07:58:14 well, the ericsson part is swedish. but i think its more and more pure japan these days Aug 22 07:58:20 XTL: If you replace the screen and buy a service cable, you can make it a t630 :P Aug 22 07:58:27 Stskeeps: does skype actually come bundled? Aug 22 07:58:31 or just an installer? Aug 22 07:58:35 installr Aug 22 07:58:35 * qwerty12 has a service cable. my second one come think of it Aug 22 07:59:06 t_s_o: yer, head quartered right here in London though :) Aug 22 07:59:32 heh, silly stuff that... Aug 22 08:00:10 I would like to say that we have a brilliant economy but if it's true that we could be going into recession.... Aug 22 08:00:23 funny thing is, i was considering a motorola phone. until motorola basically said the phone i had my eye on was going to be o2 only or something like that... Aug 22 08:00:40 * qwerty12 empties bank account and converts it into drugs. real hard money. Aug 22 08:01:14 t_s_o: eew, I hate motorola, a razr I had once would start typing random things in texts. the modding was nice though Aug 22 08:01:36 Hmm, you don't have o2 in Norway right? Here, I think it's the biggest network Aug 22 08:01:40 well this one would be using symbian and uiq so... Aug 22 08:02:18 * qwerty12 still wouldn't buy it. Motorola don't believe in touch screens for the UIQ phones, even though UIQ is meant to be used with one Aug 22 08:02:22 nope, only telenor, netcom (teliasonera owned these days) and a bunch of "virtuals" Aug 22 08:03:02 none of the big foreign ones seems to bother. tho i think 3 has a licence here, but never started building... Aug 22 08:03:30 3 are a network here, free MSN is pretty decent Aug 22 08:03:37 t_s_o: the market's too small Aug 22 08:03:41 would you bother? Aug 22 08:03:50 timeless: fully aware of that ;) Aug 22 08:04:21 * qwerty12 gets back to remapping the keys for the linux gameandwatch# Aug 22 08:04:22 but i think we currently have more active mobile phone numbers then there are people so... Aug 22 08:05:11 could you put compiz-fusion on a nokia n810 ? Aug 22 08:05:24 Nah, no hardware opengl Aug 22 08:05:38 Come think of, the default window manager is a little odd too Aug 22 08:05:48 s/of/of it/ Aug 22 08:05:48 qwerty12 meant: Come think of it, the default window manager is a little odd too Aug 22 08:06:05 emma: the cpu is 400mhz Aug 22 08:06:08 do you really want to try? Aug 22 08:06:44 And usually it's battery powered Aug 22 08:07:14 400mhz doesnt mean much to me. Aug 22 08:07:40 hmm, now that i think about it, one other reason why the big operators dont move in, you cant be bound by contract to a single operator for more then 12 months. netcom had to rework the iphone contracts because of that... Aug 22 08:07:49 i guess that means that the electron goes around the loop 400 mega times per second? Aug 22 08:08:26 t_s_o: that's pretty decent come think of it. here, the norm is now becoming 18 months Aug 22 08:08:54 i think the same contracts where 18-24 in sweden Aug 22 08:08:59 Electrons are surprisingly lazy bastards. Mostly the queues just inch along and push. Aug 22 08:09:08 emma, yup. that's a little slow for compiz. 800MHz and a decent graphics card and compiz would work ok... Aug 22 08:09:27 but then i suspect they where all drafted by apple as part of the agreement with teliasonera... Aug 22 08:09:35 Go around in their own little cirles rather than do any work Aug 22 08:09:42 yeah the drift velocity of an electron is pretty slow. Aug 22 08:09:52 but something is going around. I'm not sure what. Aug 22 08:10:06 why must qwerty checkout from svn and not export :/ Aug 22 08:10:11 I guess every time something goes around thats one calculation that can be done. Aug 22 08:11:04 Fetch and execute cycle Aug 22 08:11:05 emma: when i started college 10 years ago, i got a 400mhz x86 pc Aug 22 08:11:19 the n800 has a 400mhz arm chip Aug 22 08:11:21 or fdx Aug 22 08:11:27 does that give you some idea of processing power? Aug 22 08:11:31 i wish i knew what was going around though. Aug 22 08:11:34 hmm, i recently tossed my 66Mhz 486 :P Aug 22 08:11:51 can you put linux on a 486 ? Aug 22 08:11:52 My main server is 466 celeron Aug 22 08:11:58 emma: Of course Aug 22 08:12:12 i haven't seen a 486 in a long time. Aug 22 08:12:14 heh, i would claim that one could put linux on a toaster if it had a cpu ;) Aug 22 08:12:31 there was a toaster running netbsd though :P Aug 22 08:12:36 what about a 243 ? Aug 22 08:12:38 I think there have been linux toasters :/ Aug 22 08:12:54 bef0rd: i could have sworn i read about a expresso machine running windows to... Aug 22 08:12:56 I've actually been thinking of getting a 486 Aug 22 08:12:57 Could you put linux on a TRS 80 color computer 2 ? Aug 22 08:13:03 Or any ISA bus machine. Aug 22 08:13:13 emma: you can put Lunix on a c64 Aug 22 08:13:14 and sure enough, it was infected by a rootkit... Aug 22 08:13:38 I'd just need a small enough one. Aug 22 08:13:40 ah, the C64 :D Aug 22 08:13:53 What's lunix now? Aug 22 08:14:08 i recently read that some people had made a network multiplayer game for the C64 ;) Aug 22 08:14:10 http://lng.sourceforge.net/ Ooh, a NG one :-D Aug 22 08:14:16 heh...got a photo recently of the LCD advertising board hanging over an ATM showing a bluescreen :D Aug 22 08:14:29 "Updated: Sep 10 2004" Aug 22 08:14:43 johnx: there was a bluescreen in the olympic opening... Aug 22 08:14:43 i m back Aug 22 08:14:45 emma, linux needs a 386 or better in terms of x86 computers Aug 22 08:14:51 i see it is little unix written in assembly. Aug 22 08:14:56 http://hld.c64.org/poldi/lunix/lunix.html Aug 22 08:15:17 johnx: yeah, don't know why ATM's run windows. Mostly NT round here Aug 22 08:15:26 t_s_o, It's just different seeing it in person :) Aug 22 08:15:31 i wonder if anyone has ever written the linux kernel in assembly. Aug 22 08:15:42 it was in assembly first afaik Aug 22 08:15:45 johnx: i can agree with that ;) Aug 22 08:15:48 wouldn't that make all linux better if the kernel was written in assembly? Aug 22 08:15:49 qwerty12, mostly they used to run OS/2 but some people couldn't leave well enough alone I guess... Aug 22 08:15:56 emma: hell no Aug 22 08:16:14 emma, a lot of it probably used to be done in assembly Aug 22 08:16:16 johnx: yeah :D Aug 22 08:16:18 emma: some part of it is assembler. the part that do the very basics of booting Aug 22 08:16:35 emma: you know what assembly is but not a SDK? ;) Aug 22 08:16:47 yes i know what it is. Aug 22 08:16:51 not how to do it or anything. Aug 22 08:16:53 Assembly is the magic word that makes everything faster. Aug 22 08:16:54 emma: bugs and since linux supports n+1 architectures ans assembly is per architecture, so that would kinda add code a lot Aug 22 08:17:00 emma, you have a very interesting collection of knowledge :) Aug 22 08:17:05 XTL: only if you compiler is shite :) Aug 22 08:17:09 i like to visit channels like this and chat with people and get some idea about things. Aug 22 08:17:28 emma: A regular Socrates :) Aug 22 08:17:36 * qwerty12 tried learning ARM ASM once, I gave up when I realised the Russians had the hold on that market :> Aug 22 08:17:38 hehehe that's a nice thing to say. Aug 22 08:18:17 * moontiger likes asm Aug 22 08:18:56 I guess 8051 is the only chip I really know asm for. FSVO really. Aug 22 08:19:27 is assembly code itself per architecture or it has to be compiled for the architecture? Aug 22 08:19:38 different for each chip Aug 22 08:19:41 no compiler Aug 22 08:19:45 just an assembler Aug 22 08:19:51 oh yeah sorry Aug 22 08:19:57 assembler, i did know that. Aug 22 08:20:09 so each architecture has it's own assembler? Aug 22 08:20:30 ech chip has its own instruction set ... hence its own asm "language" Aug 22 08:20:38 in other words you could not just assemble assembly source code you have to write the code taylored to the machine? Aug 22 08:20:44 yes Aug 22 08:20:47 emma, exactly Aug 22 08:20:54 hm, that is kind of rough. Aug 22 08:20:57 c == cross platform asm Aug 22 08:21:01 i see. Aug 22 08:21:04 :) Aug 22 08:21:06 that makes c quite handy. Aug 22 08:21:14 and that is the reason for using higher level languages Aug 22 08:21:35 c == bullshit app that 90% suffer from overflaw and possible exploit Aug 22 08:21:35 especially now that optimizing compilers can do a better job than most humans Aug 22 08:21:36 yup. C was *invented* so that Unix could be re-written in it Aug 22 08:22:09 khertan .... as opposed to what? Aug 22 08:23:00 Khertan: and then you have c++ that bumps that to 99% ;) Aug 22 08:23:11 johnx: yeah, quite unfortunate, os/2 just worked.. Aug 22 08:23:27 what would you suggest os's are written in then? Aug 22 08:23:44 python? :P Aug 22 08:23:52 * qwerty12 guesses python. (Not personally, me thinks C pwns python) Aug 22 08:23:57 Haskell Aug 22 08:23:59 Lisp. Aug 22 08:24:03 fortran Aug 22 08:24:04 BRANFUCK Aug 22 08:24:09 GOTO++ ! Aug 22 08:24:11 or BRAINFUCK rather Aug 22 08:24:23 branfuck is high in fibre. Aug 22 08:24:28 Hi, does N810 support ALSA or OSS ? Aug 22 08:24:33 emma: hehe Aug 22 08:24:36 joyious: Alsa, yes Aug 22 08:24:42 At least in some ways Aug 22 08:24:51 http://www.gotopp.org//index.html.en Aug 22 08:25:01 it supports alsa if you squint and turn your head to the left Aug 22 08:25:11 qwerty12: i was wondering who would bring up that one. even assembly is easier that brainfuck... Aug 22 08:25:23 Unlambda ftw Aug 22 08:25:37 t_s_o: hehe, but brainfuck has the name going for it :P Aug 22 08:25:52 oh and emma, there already is a os written in lisp. ever heard of emacs? ;) Aug 22 08:26:21 Real os's are written with switch panels anyway. Aug 22 08:27:08 A real os has a method of making it say hello world Aug 22 08:27:17 t_s_o, hahaha Aug 22 08:27:35 XTL: but I can not open the alsa devices Aug 22 08:27:40 If you *REALLY REALLY* hate someone, sending them a CD with LMOS is a way to get them back Aug 22 08:27:41 XTL: and stored on punchcards? Aug 22 08:27:47 I thought emacs was written in C (fsvo emacs) and the apps are in kind of lisp Aug 22 08:27:50 joyious, did you unlock it forst? Aug 22 08:28:05 moontiger:unlock ? Aug 22 08:28:08 t_s_o: That's the high level interface, yes. Aug 22 08:28:08 joyious, what exactly are you trying to do? Aug 22 08:28:46 johnx: I want write a recorder there, but i can not open the device Aug 22 08:28:53 khertan, is there any reason adding an image to a button would crash the tablet? Aug 22 08:29:04 moontiger:How to unlock that ? Aug 22 08:29:25 joyious, ignore me i was joking ... sorry Aug 22 08:29:37 joyious: someone tried with that I think but didn't have much luck, you may wish to look at the code of https://garage.maemo.org/projects/maemo-recorder/ instead Aug 22 08:29:38 XTL: i think your right about emacs btw, seems it has a lisp interpreter written in C and then everything else above written in lisp... Aug 22 08:29:57 joyious, alsa is a little strange on the tablets. I don't know much about alsa from a programming point of view. It might be helpful to look at the source to some app that deals with sound Aug 22 08:29:59 thats specifically the gnu version btw... Aug 22 08:30:12 maybe maemo recorder? https://garage.maemo.org/projects/maemo-recorder/ Aug 22 08:30:27 still, the joke about emacs being a os written in lisp never grows old ;) Aug 22 08:30:30 Or you might see if gstreamer will work for you Aug 22 08:30:39 thanks guys, i'll take a look at that code Aug 22 08:32:08 moontiger: crash the tablet ? Aug 22 08:32:17 ~curse hp internal card readers. this is my second one and it still stalls with a SD card and a memory stick >.< Aug 22 08:32:18 May the fleas of a thousand camels infest your most sensitive regions, hp internal card readers. this is my second one and it still stalls with a SD card and a memory stick >.< ! Aug 22 08:32:22 moontiger: or just maemo-launcher due to a crash of an applet ? Aug 22 08:32:36 yah ... the screen flashes white and goes goofy ... prolly the launcher Aug 22 08:33:00 yep so it s maemo-launcher which crash Aug 22 08:33:06 wouldn't that be hildon-desktop? Aug 22 08:33:09 and restart with default pref Aug 22 08:33:16 well ... just from adding an image to a button?? Aug 22 08:33:25 maybe an error in code Aug 22 08:33:35 johnx: does maemo recoder has code there ? Aug 22 08:33:36 hmmmmmmm code works fine without image on button Aug 22 08:33:49 joyious: yes, it has a svn Aug 22 08:33:50 moontiger: a number of apps on the device are lifeguarded Aug 22 08:33:53 moontiger: how do you add your image on buton Aug 22 08:33:54 add 2 lines of code and bang! Aug 22 08:33:56 if they crash too many times, the device will reboot Aug 22 08:34:20 timely: really ? Aug 22 08:34:22 the primary life-guarded app is hildon-desktop Aug 22 08:34:25 Khertan, create an image , set from file ,,, add to button Aug 22 08:34:33 joyious, did you look at the svn repository? click on scm Aug 22 08:34:42 which hosts task navigator plugins, home plugins, and status area plugins Aug 22 08:34:45 timely: so this explain my sudden reboot :) Aug 22 08:34:48 they're all one process Aug 22 08:34:50 works on the desktop with pygtk Aug 22 08:35:07 how do you add your image on this button ? Aug 22 08:35:08 timely: Is hildon-desktop lifeguarded? I didn't know it was started from dsmetool, I just thought it had a safe-mode which can be disabled with a simple configure switch Aug 22 08:35:12 Khertan: get a core dump (rich core preferred) Aug 22 08:35:16 johnx:Oh, i'll try thanks Aug 22 08:35:18 button.add(image) Aug 22 08:35:31 qwerty12: open xterm and kill -4 it :) Aug 22 08:35:39 Does it only crash/reboot on the tablet.. How about sb? Aug 22 08:36:00 Maybe you'd see what happens there. Aug 22 08:36:02 XTL: sb doesn't have dsme which is what deals w/ life guarding Aug 22 08:36:03 timely: I would do if I had a charged tablet but you must be right :) Aug 22 08:36:17 bah, charge your tablet Aug 22 08:36:19 timely: Exactly. You might see the actual problem instead of consequences Aug 22 08:36:21 XTL: can't test on sb due to qemu / python on sb / on other things related with that Aug 22 08:36:31 timely: sure, when the charger arrives :D Aug 22 08:36:37 ?! Aug 22 08:36:47 Khertan: I guessed. Aug 22 08:36:56 timely: I broke my charger when I was untangling the headphones from it :/ Aug 22 08:37:14 qwerty12: my charger broke @ whistler Aug 22 08:37:22 thankfully a friend removed the pin from my device Aug 22 08:37:29 * johnx thinks his upstairs neighbor just fell off a ladder or his fridge tipped over or something O_o Aug 22 08:37:32 "stupid cables.. HULK SMASH!" Aug 22 08:37:34 otherwise i had an expensive unchargable phone :) Aug 22 08:38:29 heh, I'm pretty lucky, it's just the charger that is broken, thankfully, it survived my stupid experiement with an old nokia charger + new connector :/ Aug 22 08:38:38 qwerty12: does rootsh really provide "sudo gainroot"? Aug 22 08:38:42 or just "rootsh" command? Aug 22 08:38:47 Stskeeps: sudo gainroot as well Aug 22 08:38:50 alright Aug 22 08:39:08 and "root" Aug 22 08:39:13 love that one ;) Aug 22 08:39:16 the first version I uploaded (1.1) didn't but that was a test as it was my first upload to extras, 1.2 + 1.3 provided sudo gainroot :) Aug 22 08:39:57 the sudo gainroot and root things weren't done by me, I took them from ag2's easyroot, I only uploaded rootsh to extras for the demand of a sudo gainroot app in extras :) Aug 22 08:40:18 ok Aug 22 08:40:55 hmm, msn spam. whats next... Aug 22 08:41:01 rootsh isn't by me either, I left it packaged because it provided a sudo like command and it also let someone get root easily if they messed up sudoers Aug 22 08:41:46 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YiHSYS4O1TU This Mortal Coil - Another Day Aug 22 08:42:55 do desktop widgets like homeIP use my battery more than if I had no widgets on the desktop? Aug 22 08:43:21 yes Aug 22 08:43:32 usicow: rss reader for example will kill your battery :) Aug 22 08:43:44 Stskeeps, testing the deblet install on a completely clean tablet (diablo+ssu1) Aug 22 08:43:45 damn Aug 22 08:44:08 usicow: yes, those ones are in python which isn't exactly known for conservative cpu usage and they poll at certain intervals Aug 22 08:44:20 cool applets none the less :) Aug 22 08:45:09 qwerty12: hehe.. yeah it looks cool. So what would be the right language to write one in? Maybe I could do it.. but Im a java developer. Aug 22 08:45:36 usicow: no Aug 22 08:45:42 timely: false !!!! Aug 22 08:45:57 qwerty: false too !!!! Aug 22 08:46:12 usicow: C I guess, python isn't too bad either Aug 22 08:46:14 python home applet don't wake up the device when this one odle Aug 22 08:46:22 idle Aug 22 08:46:33 and refresh only when coming back to desktop Aug 22 08:46:50 CPU Usage still sux with python Aug 22 08:46:51 johnx: alright - it will prolly give a error in application manager, if you can find some kind of log saying -why- apt-get install deblet-installer can do it but appl manager can't, i'm all ears :P Aug 22 08:46:56 so they don't use cpu until you stay on the desktop while the device is wake up Aug 22 08:46:59 i really dont want to have to clone my chinook :P Aug 22 08:47:08 Khertan: what if your desktop is visible all the time? :) Aug 22 08:47:18 Stskeeps: use mtd-tools and make a flashable jffs2 image :> Aug 22 08:47:20 having items on your desktop does cost something, nothing is truly free Aug 22 08:47:30 timely: yes it cost memory mainly :) Aug 22 08:47:55 johnx: at the same time im running latest deblet installer on chinook right now as well Aug 22 08:48:00 it s true that the first version in chinook draining battery ... but this is no more the case Aug 22 08:48:14 ok.. thanks Khertan and timely.. I'll install it :) Aug 22 08:48:18 :) Aug 22 08:49:09 johnx: just hang on a second while i update the svn base packages snapshot :P Aug 22 08:49:10 Stskeeps, I don't think app manager lets you replace libs that are included with the firmware Aug 22 08:49:27 Stskeeps, do you need that version of libglade for some reason? Aug 22 08:49:29 johnx: lovely.. someone should make a roxterm + zenity that builds towards 2.4 then Aug 22 08:49:33 timely: if you stay on desktop it ll eat cpu as other applet to refresh the data ... but when your device stay in sleep ... no refresh Aug 22 08:49:47 * Stskeeps glances at qwerty12 with begging eyes for roxterm Aug 22 08:49:54 Stskeeps, I see. ick. does it not build with 2.4? Aug 22 08:50:06 Stskeeps: shit, you have a problem with the roxterm? I think I had libglade from extras installed then Aug 22 08:50:22 qwerty12: yeah, me too, i first noticed it when diablo people started complaining Aug 22 08:50:48 johnx: no clue, just lifted debs off qwerty12 and bundyo(sp) Aug 22 08:50:58 Khertan: usicow didn't specify use case Aug 22 08:51:04 if you look in the app mgr log it complains "ignoring version from wrong domain: libglade" Aug 22 08:51:06 the general correct answer for the entire realm is "yes" Aug 22 08:51:14 IIRC, I think I had to compile it against the newer one, I don't think it compiled against 2.4, I'll have another go. if I can't get the latest version to compile against 2.4, I'll go back a few versions :) Aug 22 08:52:00 Stskeeps, can we do without roxterm? osso-xterm doesn't work? Aug 22 08:52:17 johnx: osso-xterm is shite when it comes to curses applications :P Aug 22 08:52:43 in roxterm i had no problems whatsoever with del->^H and generally fitting things on screen Aug 22 08:53:14 Stskeeps: "This is no port, just a straight compile with a bunch of needed libs " - from the zenity page, you could probably package your own version Aug 22 08:53:17 Khertan, they only use battery if they actually DO something yes? just having a static display of something does nothing correct? Aug 22 08:53:18 sadness :/ Aug 22 08:53:27 johnx: basically .install doesnt work but apt-get install deblet-installer works afterwards - but good that we found that error Aug 22 08:53:56 qwerty12: alright.. i'll look into it. i wonder if simply modifying Depends: would do the trick for both Aug 22 08:54:07 Stskeeps, anything else I should test while I have a fresh tablet? Aug 22 08:54:23 johnx: nah, that's the current problem i think Aug 22 08:54:35 johnx: well.. one thing maybe Aug 22 08:54:35 sec Aug 22 08:54:41 sure :) Aug 22 08:54:54 Stskeeps: wouldn't gxmessage work? Aug 22 08:55:04 qwerty12: it's not flexible enough for my stuff Aug 22 08:55:19 how do I remove these things that look like advertisements from the desktop? Aug 22 08:55:32 theres the tutorial applet, and something that looks like ads.. Aug 22 08:55:32 Stskeeps: Ah :( Aug 22 08:55:58 usicow: tap the menu thing next to the word home and choose select applets and untick web applet and tableteer afaik Aug 22 08:56:54 qwerty12: ahh thanks Aug 22 08:57:03 fuck, the roxterm has .modfied.deb on the end which means I repacked it, and I can't remember what I changed :/ Aug 22 08:57:12 usicow: yes ads :) Aug 22 08:57:26 qwerty12, break out diff :D Aug 22 08:57:32 qwerty12: dpkg-deb extract them and compare :) Aug 22 08:57:50 qwerty12: i altered your roxterm deb as well i think.. not sure with what Aug 22 08:57:58 johnx, timely: good ideas, thank you Aug 22 08:58:30 unix tools win all over the place :) Aug 22 08:58:30 Now that I know a bit of GDK, I should remap the buttons on Roxterm while I've got the chance Aug 22 08:58:48 johnx: dpkg --remove deblet-installer, apt-get update, apt-get install zenity - it didn't install libglade 2.6 right? Aug 22 08:58:54 before this Aug 22 08:59:09 just wanting to see if it runs on libglade 2.4 if i fuck it's depends: :P Aug 22 08:59:30 Stskeeps, nothing installed yet. I'll try that. Aug 22 08:59:31 s/it's/its/ Aug 22 08:59:54 * moontiger has had enough of fighting with image button and toolbars for one day Aug 22 08:59:57 nn all Aug 22 08:59:58 :) Aug 22 09:00:06 timely: my coffe haven't had its effect yet Aug 22 09:00:08 +e Aug 22 09:00:39 hmm, after seeing the safari browser on video in the blackberry bold vs iphone shootout, i can see why people like it :( Aug 22 09:01:01 t_s_o: like which? Aug 22 09:01:11 Stskeeps, I usually don't bother with grammar correction...but your original spelling had an interesting reading :) Aug 22 09:01:31 http://www.jkontherun.com/2008/08/blackberry-bold.html Aug 22 09:01:37 Stskeeps: http://pastebin.com/d2aae0b53 - I don't see libglade mentioned there :/. I have a feeling its for the configuration program :/ Aug 22 09:02:13 yep, bingo: Aug 22 09:02:16 [sbox-DIABLO_ARMEL: ~] > ldd roxterm-config | grep glade Aug 22 09:02:20 libglade-2.0.so.0 => /usr/lib/libglade-2.0.so.0 (0x00000000) Aug 22 09:02:43 Stskeeps: you should be able to safely remove libglade from the depends line, just delete roxterm-config as well Aug 22 09:03:10 qwerty12: okay, i just wonder if it works sanely with 2.4 as well - which is next thing johnx will test if zenity works ;) Aug 22 09:03:47 yup...getting ssh installed for root access so I can use apt :) Aug 22 09:05:55 t_s_o: depressing Aug 22 09:05:59 Stskeeps: it would be nice if gxmessage worked, then you could base64 encode it into your preinst which is provided by default on all chinook and diablo tablets Aug 22 09:06:08 timely: hmm? Aug 22 09:07:20 qwerty12: well gxmessage does work as a static binary.. but it doesnt give all the features i need :P Aug 22 09:07:39 heh :) Aug 22 09:08:02 Stskeeps, win. zenity will install without libglade...just roxterm now Aug 22 09:08:17 johnx: does it run, too? Aug 22 09:08:32 the bold Aug 22 09:08:46 are they sure that it's actually *usin* wifi to download? Aug 22 09:08:47 i guess what annoys me the most about microb is that even when the loading bar goes away, its likely to pop back and work some more... Aug 22 09:08:47 Stskeeps, will find out in a sec Aug 22 09:09:01 timely: it was found not to, a later video shows it with Aug 22 09:09:08 not that it helped much imo Aug 22 09:09:11 at least the zooming in microb got ironed out Aug 22 09:09:51 johnx: zenity --calendar should do the trick i guess Aug 22 09:09:52 johnx: mostly, there is some delay between hitting zoom and the actual zooming Aug 22 09:10:38 i also keep seeing the browser not rally grasping that it should go full screen while its working on a page and i hit the button... Aug 22 09:10:41 Stskeeps, will test that. --warning works Aug 22 09:10:43 really Aug 22 09:10:51 t_s_o, it's so much better than it used to be though... Aug 22 09:10:53 johnx: i'll go butcher roxterm then Aug 22 09:11:27 wow...zenity is pretty cool Aug 22 09:11:31 roxterm should do without the -config app :D Aug 22 09:11:31 johnx: that it is Aug 22 09:11:33 calendar works Aug 22 09:11:56 t_s_o would you rather the browser not show the load indicator? Aug 22 09:11:58 http://www.jkontherun.com/2008/08/blackberry-bo-1.html <- someone showing bold doing a proper wifi load Aug 22 09:12:30 timely: i didnt say that. but i would like it to show is for as long as its working on the page at least. having it pop in and out of view makes me wonder if its really finished Aug 22 09:12:52 johnx: apt-get update; apt-get install roxterm Aug 22 09:13:26 t_s_o: so the problem is... Aug 22 09:13:33 a page can do: Aug 22 09:13:36 t_s_o, that's pretty painfully slow. Aug 22 09:13:51 johnx: im guessing its choking on javascript... Aug 22 09:13:53 function foo(){setTimeout(bar)} Aug 22 09:14:01 at what point do you call the page "done"? Aug 22 09:14:21 t_s_o, well javascript is a pretty core part of web surfing... Aug 22 09:14:28 johnx: sadly... Aug 22 09:14:43 timely: i can see the problem Aug 22 09:14:48 t_s_o, were you one of those people against pictures on the internet? Aug 22 09:15:15 we should bring gopher back Aug 22 09:15:15 johnx: well they have their uses. but i can survive having them turned off ;) Aug 22 09:15:25 that is, if i have some way to selectively load them Aug 22 09:15:39 * qwerty12 can't with all the captchas now Aug 22 09:15:40 right, that's what I thought :) Aug 22 09:15:46 t_s_o: i really don't have a solution... i mean, we could cheat and pretend the page *isn't* done loading Aug 22 09:15:57 but what if it was setInterval instead of setTimeout? Aug 22 09:16:03 then the page is "never" done "loading" Aug 22 09:16:40 we could also just ignore any "load" stuff after the page's initial "load" Aug 22 09:16:50 Stskeeps, works. I'll remove roxterm, zenity, the deps and the repos and try the .install from scratch just for grins Aug 22 09:16:59 arrgh1!! JavaScript!!! Responsive web apps!!! It burns!!! Aug 22 09:17:33 timely: as in, not show the bar for any ajax related stuff loading in the background? Aug 22 09:17:38 yep Aug 22 09:17:47 alternatively, what if the initial setTimeout is for 5mins and is designed to log you out? Aug 22 09:17:55 is it done loading, or only done after it's logged you out :) Aug 22 09:18:36 i would say its loaded when the html is parsed and the layout is is correctly in place. but then its that pesky ajax again... Aug 22 09:19:21 we could just remove any progress indicators :) Aug 22 09:19:36 and ajax support, just to be fair Aug 22 09:19:36 now that would be "interesting" Aug 22 09:19:55 what is it, am i that annoying today? Aug 22 09:20:00 johnx: oki :) Aug 22 09:20:06 johnx: we could remove support for users Aug 22 09:20:14 they aren't really that important Aug 22 09:20:25 t_s_o, I should have added a :P to that. I was just being snarky, not mean Aug 22 09:20:56 heh, i found myself surfing on my 770 with javascript off in opera more often then not so... Aug 22 09:21:03 i did too Aug 22 09:21:17 i highly recommend it actually :) Aug 22 09:21:17 but then i would love to show flash the middle finger as well Aug 22 09:21:28 t_s_o, I actually have pic loading turned off on my phone (opera mini). But I get charged by the packet... Aug 22 09:21:41 t_s_o, I'll agree with you about flash. (&$% that $%*& Aug 22 09:21:55 t_s_o: i do that too :) Aug 22 09:22:12 johnx: same here about opera mini. and i also do it in microb when im out and about and tether via the phone Aug 22 09:22:55 the usability of some forums actually improve when i turn images of, as i then get the alternate link text to click on instead ;) Aug 22 09:22:58 Stskeeps, grrr...ok. Still having problems with app mgr and I don't know why :/ Aug 22 09:23:13 johnx: anything in log? Aug 22 09:23:49 nothing about the deblet repo... Aug 22 09:24:00 I'll try and track it down Aug 22 09:24:49 Stskeeps, hang on a sec. what section is deblet in? Aug 22 09:24:53 t_s_o: half the time i have images off too :) Aug 22 09:25:48 johnx: err.. not sure i have a section in the deb Aug 22 09:26:02 Stskeeps, ok then, got the next problem: The section needs to be changed to "user/something" Aug 22 09:26:07 right now it's in "base" Aug 22 09:26:10 maybe by default? Aug 22 09:26:23 okay, alright, got any suggestions for a good section? Aug 22 09:26:38 qwerty12, any ideas? maybe user/Other? Aug 22 09:26:54 or user/Utilities Aug 22 09:27:00 johnx: section for which package? Aug 22 09:27:08 deblet intaller Aug 22 09:27:44 user/qwerty12-is-awesome ? Aug 22 09:28:07 lol, why? Aug 22 09:28:18 (i'll take it as a joke :D) Aug 22 09:28:27 dunno. seems as valid as any other section. :D Aug 22 09:28:37 i'll put it in user/other Aug 22 09:28:51 there's user/Boingo user/utils user/utilities and user/Utilities ... and this is just including Extras Aug 22 09:28:56 You could use user/debian-installer Aug 22 09:29:26 might be nice to do Other instead of other Aug 22 09:29:37 that way app mgr won't list yet another section Aug 22 09:30:10 * qwerty12 never uses sections. All ftw. Aug 22 09:30:23 johnx: moved to user/Other and refreshed rep copy of installerdeb Aug 22 09:30:30 awesome Aug 22 09:30:34 * johnx tries again Aug 22 09:35:10 "Application packages missing: binutils, libslang2, e2fsprogs, debootstrap, libslang2 (>= 2.0.6-4osso1)" Aug 22 09:35:15 .. Aug 22 09:35:24 I assume because they aren't in Section: user/* either Aug 22 09:35:25 :/ Aug 22 09:35:35 they're in extras though Aug 22 09:35:43 maybe it's time to just tell people click the .install file nad go run apt-get Aug 22 09:35:45 diablo, too Aug 22 09:36:01 is diablo app manager just more picky or is it just me? Aug 22 09:36:13 oh, it's really freakin' picky Aug 22 09:36:24 what does apt-cache policy binutils say? Aug 22 09:36:26 it's more picky. to install apps without user/ --> Red Pill Aug 22 09:36:33 qwerty12: even with dependancies? Aug 22 09:36:42 in non-user Aug 22 09:36:47 actually binutils isn't showing up for me from apt Aug 22 09:36:49 * johnx tracks it down Aug 22 09:37:03 Stskeeps: Got a point there actually, you shouldn't need red pill Aug 22 09:37:40 binutils is in the sdk repository, isn't it? Aug 22 09:37:47 johnx: it's not in diablo extras or extras-devel, its in sdk repo Aug 22 09:37:49 yep Aug 22 09:38:09 * johnx sighs Aug 22 09:38:31 .. Aug 22 09:38:41 can binutils even be legitimately installed along with busybox? Aug 22 09:38:45 johnx: you'll have fun adding it. It took me a while to figure out the right entries :/ https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=3405#c6 Aug 22 09:39:47 qwerty12, thanks. I've been figuring out apt-get "deb" lines for 10 years though. saves me the trouble though... :D Aug 22 09:40:00 johnx: you may be able to, busybox's conflict line didn't list binutils Aug 22 09:40:10 johnx: yeah, I'm a n00b at this :D :) Aug 22 09:40:35 we all have our areas of expertise :) You've got me beat in plenty of areas Aug 22 09:41:01 and you certainly have a lot more clue now than I did at your age Aug 22 09:41:27 i have everyone beat in the art of breaking own hand punching solid objects Aug 22 09:41:59 johnx: :). Anyway, I did a quick check, binutils doesn't conflict with busybox Aug 22 09:42:08 pupnik: ouch :( Aug 22 09:42:15 qwerty12, cool, then Aug 22 09:42:27 pupnik, you can have keep the title. I don't want to compete O_o Aug 22 09:42:58 hehe Aug 22 09:43:06 freaky music anyone? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5EH5GFP2Otk&NR=1 Aug 22 09:43:42 alright, debootstrap in extras-devel and the rest in the sdk repo Aug 22 09:45:35 Quick question, is SDLK_ESCAPE correct or SDLK_ESC? I did google but now I'm more confused :/ Aug 22 09:46:36 my sources say SDLK_ESCAPE Aug 22 09:47:01 Yeah, I've got '_ESCAPE here too, thanks# Aug 22 09:47:05 -# Aug 22 09:47:19 sure. thank the guy who wrote ltris :) Aug 22 09:49:28 what's extras-devel again? stuff bound to go into extras at some point? Aug 22 09:49:35 or development extras Aug 22 09:49:42 testing area Aug 22 09:49:43 hi, does anyone know how to (re-)set the admin password of mailinglists on garage? (i am not able to find the passwords for the gnumeric mailinglists on garage anymore) ;-) Aug 22 09:50:09 Stskeeps, stuff that could end up in extras eventually ... unless it never stabilizes or the dev doesn't care Aug 22 09:50:46 johnx: so you found all the packages in which repos? if i have to add them to .install file Aug 22 09:52:09 one sec. I'm making sure this will actually work first... Aug 22 09:52:24 k Aug 22 09:54:34 I guess I need to read the manual. Aug 22 09:54:52 I can't work out when does the device goes to sleep, and when it doesn't. Aug 22 09:55:11 yacoob, it might be a little different than you're used to Aug 22 09:55:16 Also, going into offline mode and then back makes my n810 unable to connect to anything radio-related (both bt and wifi) Aug 22 09:55:21 it puts individual part to sleep when they're not in use Aug 22 09:55:36 yacoob, that second part doesn't sound too good Aug 22 09:58:33 * johnx adds another repository in search of deps Aug 22 09:59:03 10 bucks it'll be just as insane as the chinook .install Aug 22 09:59:04 :P Aug 22 09:59:44 Stskeeps: Can I have that bet with you in an hour when the irc logs are updated? :P Aug 22 09:59:48 bets 10 it will be worse... Aug 22 10:00:30 johnx, tbh, I haven't played around with it much, but I've made it go to offline mode yesterday in the evening, and in the morning it wasn't able to connect to wireless. Aug 22 10:04:01 * johnx kries. debootstrap isn't in diablo extras-devel yet... Aug 22 10:04:33 johnx: trust me, you will be crying for *ages* Aug 22 10:05:01 qwerty12, nah. I'll get debian working and everything will go in one or two repos Aug 22 10:05:47 johnx: http://repository.maemo.org/extras-devel/pool/chinook/free/d/debootstrap/ ? Aug 22 10:05:54 oh, chinook Aug 22 10:05:55 hm Aug 22 10:05:59 :) Aug 22 10:06:05 Stskeeps: it takes *ages* for the Packages file to update though :/ Aug 22 10:06:31 i consider to put debootstrap in the deblet repo just for the hell of it.. Aug 22 10:06:38 that'd make some things easier i gues Aug 22 10:08:01 johnx: i've added debootstrap to deblet repo, does this help? Aug 22 10:08:10 Stskeeps, yes. lots Aug 22 10:08:12 thanks Aug 22 10:08:19 sec, wait for svn to finish comitting Aug 22 10:08:19 :P Aug 22 10:08:38 really, we should poke whoever put it up to extras-devel and tell them to upload again for diablo... Aug 22 10:08:38 done Aug 22 10:08:44 or however that works ... Aug 22 10:08:48 that was the vncviewer debian guy Aug 22 10:09:02 (and we just reached r100 in deblet svn) Aug 22 10:09:07 johnx: can't anybody with upload rights just get the chinook version and upload it for diable? Aug 22 10:09:19 ^ + 1 Aug 22 10:09:27 Mek, you're asking the wrong person. Can they? Aug 22 10:09:41 johnx: yes, they can :P Aug 22 10:09:57 http://repository.maemo.org/extras-devel/pool/chinook/free/source/d/debootstrap/ Aug 22 10:10:02 * qwerty12 whistles and walks away Aug 22 10:10:27 alright, I'll test debootstrap on a fresh diablo install now and if it works I'll poke someone with upload privs to do something about it :) Aug 22 10:11:00 did you get the list of repos needed? Aug 22 10:11:06 Stskeeps, close Aug 22 10:11:10 johnx: it should most definately work.. it's _all, so Aug 22 10:11:14 (it's a shell script) Aug 22 10:11:28 I'm testing if this assembly of repos works Aug 22 10:12:17 yay! it's willing to go through with it! Aug 22 10:12:22 submitted to the diable autobuilder Aug 22 10:13:10 arghh, libsdl-gfx1.2-dev isn't in diablo extras Aug 22 10:13:59 here's the list of repos that ended up working: http://pastebin.ca/1181472 Aug 22 10:14:27 sooo...just five Aug 22 10:16:08 johnx: is extras-devel needed? Aug 22 10:16:58 uhm... let me confirm Aug 22 10:18:04 I thought I needed it for e2fsprogs Aug 22 10:18:05 <_julian_> hi Aug 22 10:18:15 Stskeeps, but now I don't even know :( Aug 22 10:18:23 hi _julian_ Aug 22 10:18:40 <_julian_> I just set up a maemo sdk and installed the qt4 packages. actually I can run qt-maemo-example, but it won't use the maemo look and feel. how can I achieve that? Aug 22 10:18:54 <_julian_> on my n800 it does Aug 22 10:19:18 try running with run-standalone.sh prefixed Aug 22 10:19:39 whats the difference between a catalogue and a repository? Aug 22 10:19:53 johnx: http://trac.tspre.org/svn/deblet/trunk/deblet-diablo.install updated Aug 22 10:19:54 <_julian_> qwerty12: cool that does the trick. thanks (c: - what does that script do? Aug 22 10:20:08 johnx: (without extras-devel), so we can see if it blows up Aug 22 10:20:08 :P Aug 22 10:20:22 Stskeeps, erm...too late. I let it install :) Aug 22 10:20:38 hehe, okay Aug 22 10:21:02 _julian_: sources the af-defines.sh which has variables for sapwood (the theme server), dbus etc. I have to use run-standalone.sh on my N800 when I'm running programs as root Aug 22 10:21:10 any other guinea pigs running diablo without extras-devel who want to try out a .install file? ;> Aug 22 10:21:36 <_julian_> qwerty12: cool, thanks (c: Aug 22 10:21:45 np :) Aug 22 10:21:54 Stskeeps: do I have to use your bootmenu? I'm quite fond of the customisations I have done to mine Aug 22 10:22:03 Stskeeps, I can confirm that extras devel is where e2fsprogs comes from Aug 22 10:22:30 qwerty12: not to test .install Aug 22 10:22:34 johnx: alright, i'll add it then Aug 22 10:22:46 Stskeeps, is that more repos than for chinook? Aug 22 10:22:59 btw, http://repository.maemo.org/extras-devel/pool/diablo/free/d/debootstrap/ :P Aug 22 10:23:06 thanks Mek :D Aug 22 10:23:10 <_julian_> qwerty12: do you use qt4 on maemo? Aug 22 10:23:23 _julian_: no :) Aug 22 10:23:45 <_julian_> maybe some else? (c: Aug 22 10:24:37 _julian_: I do (in fact I'm somewhat working on packaging kde4 stuff as well) Aug 22 10:25:07 <_julian_> I run the SDK with Xephyr, is it possible to send the full-screen key to the apps somehow? Aug 22 10:25:27 <_julian_> Mek: ah cool, do you accidently use eclipse and tried qt+eclispse-integration+maemo sdk? Aug 22 10:25:28 F6 on your keyboard? Aug 22 10:25:34 <_julian_> johnx: thanks (c: Aug 22 10:25:45 _julian_: no, I haven't tried that Aug 22 10:25:49 did it work? Aug 22 10:26:33 Here's a useful document about what N800 key does what: http://mrrau.dyndns.org:23280/n800/n800-hw-keys.txt Aug 22 10:26:52 <_julian_> johnx: yep (c: Aug 22 10:27:21 good deal. the other F# keys will send other signals...but I don't remember Aug 22 10:27:42 ...including zoom+ zoom- and menu Aug 22 10:29:36 jott is my hero for those boost packages Aug 22 10:30:00 * Mek agrees with that :) Aug 22 10:31:47 :). You don't happen to know what provides boost/filesystem.hpp by any chance? I've got libboost-filesystem-dev_1.33.1-10_armel.deb, libboost-filesystem1.33.1_1.33.1-10_armel.deb and libboost-dev_1.33.1-10_armel.deb installed but to no avail :/ Aug 22 10:31:52 <_julian_> cool my app runs on the n800. only graphic effects are a bit slow... (actually did a listview with smooth scrolling, but that is a bit scratchy on n800) Aug 22 10:33:09 <_julian_> Mek: you have experiences with the n800 performance in qt? Aug 22 10:33:35 _julian_: no, I only have an n810 Aug 22 10:34:14 <_julian_> Mek: is that one much faster then n800? Aug 22 10:34:43 they're exactly the same CPU... Aug 22 10:34:55 shit, filesystem.hpp is in 1.34 and later, jott's packaged 1.33 Aug 22 10:36:39 <_julian_> then I guess I need to figure out some way to make it run faster... Aug 22 10:37:15 _julian_: what does your app ? Aug 22 10:38:04 <_julian_> Khertan: it's going to be a remote for a music server Aug 22 10:38:21 _julian_, are you talking about a fullscreen draggable list? Aug 22 10:38:55 <_julian_> johnx: not completely fullscreen, but a big part of the scree Aug 22 10:39:10 johnx: full screen list can be easily made, i ve do it one with edje :) Aug 22 10:39:37 but ... i'm not enough lazy to try to make a real ui with edje Aug 22 10:40:00 just realize that there are some unfixable performance issues with trying to update large parts of the screen at a high framerate Aug 22 10:40:41 well, they're fixable but not if you want to use a premade toolkit like qt or gtk, AFAIK Aug 22 10:40:58 <_julian_> actually I use code from here: http://nodalpoint.madfire.net/2007/9/8/kinetic-scrolling-in-qt Aug 22 10:41:01 * qwerty12 gets to packaging boost 1.35 Aug 22 10:41:22 qwerty12: good luck :) Aug 22 10:41:39 Mek: thanks, I think I'll need it :D Aug 22 10:41:56 <_julian_> additionally I use some code to get a smooth drill-down effect Aug 22 10:42:05 I would have liked to have used jott's packages but I need filesystem.hpp :/ Aug 22 10:43:18 Stskeeps, how up to date are svn snapshots? Aug 22 10:43:40 <_julian_> that for I use this: http://benjamin-meyer.blogspot.com/2006/09/drill-down-view.html Aug 22 10:43:58 <_julian_> both examples should easily compile on maemo sdk if you want to try it Aug 22 10:57:08 johnx: quite,it should run daily Aug 22 10:57:28 only download snapshot works without svn or whatever, so Aug 22 11:00:07 yeah, no svn for diablo yet Aug 22 11:00:18 anyways, install is running along quite merrily :) Aug 22 11:00:52 ah, an earthquake, right on schedule Aug 22 11:02:25 wonder where that one was... Aug 22 11:03:00 anyone know why a package I sent to autobuilder yesterday around midnight still doesn't show up some 12 hours later ? Aug 22 11:03:02 Someone could upload http://repository.maemo.org/extras-devel/pool/chinook/free/source/s/subversion/ to diablo extras Aug 22 11:03:17 just out of question, if you do that, do you change the maintainers name? Aug 22 11:03:28 crashanddie: autobuilder is slowwwwww Aug 22 11:03:40 the deb will be there but Packages won't be updated Aug 22 11:03:41 yeah, but 12 hours ? Aug 22 11:03:51 you should see the wait for the autobuilder for debian :) Aug 22 11:03:54 I mean, I should at least have a log somewhere Aug 22 11:03:54 crashanddie: I waited for about 2 days Aug 22 11:04:08 qwerty12: are you the same guy as on internettablettalk? Aug 22 11:04:14 nifaal: yes Aug 22 11:04:22 but unfortunately, gtg Aug 22 11:04:24 sorry :( Aug 22 11:04:26 bye all Aug 22 11:04:33 crashanddie: which package? Aug 22 11:04:33 sod Aug 22 11:04:39 jott, cloudreader Aug 22 11:04:45 and where did you upload it to? :) Aug 22 11:05:09 dput -f diablo-extras-builder cloudreader*.changes Aug 22 11:05:17 dput -f chinook-extras-builder cloudreader*.changes Aug 22 11:05:37 I saw people changing window manager, how is that possible (without installing debian)? Aug 22 11:06:10 crashanddie: usually does not take that long to see the package in the queue :/ Aug 22 11:06:23 jott, yeah, that's what I figured Aug 22 11:06:36 crashanddie: maybe you did not sign it properly? Aug 22 11:06:44 I think I did Aug 22 11:06:56 and even if I didn't, I should be told so Aug 22 11:07:01 maybe just try it again :) Aug 22 11:07:17 debsign -k2CD24267 cloudreader_1.0.2-1_armel.changes Aug 22 11:07:27 yeah looks good. Aug 22 11:07:40 (if that's the same key autobuilder has :P Aug 22 11:07:47 oh Aug 22 11:07:50 well Aug 22 11:07:54 that might be a problem then :D Aug 22 11:08:10 when I created my garage account, I had a borked debian-pooped key Aug 22 11:08:18 (the SSH one) Aug 22 11:13:15 hey! Aug 22 11:14:41 jott, I think I changed my pgp key also around that time, and I can't change that (I just updated the SSH key) Aug 22 11:14:49 :( Aug 22 11:14:56 jott, so I guess I'm stuck until X-Fade returns Aug 22 11:15:36 autobuilder really ought to be more verbose about these things Aug 22 11:15:55 jott, you wouldn't know if there's a bug about this somewhere ? Aug 22 11:16:15 no, not really. Aug 22 11:16:41 found it Aug 22 11:16:41 https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=3197 Aug 22 11:18:00 hi Aug 22 11:18:22 Khertan, hah ! You filed the bug about no feedback when autobuilder fails ! Aug 22 11:18:42 oh no, you just voted for it, my bad Aug 22 11:18:56 ok so anyone knows how to convert from ILBC to mp3 or wav or whatever? ILBC is the default encoding in maemo recoder and I want to listen to some of my recordings in my computer Aug 22 11:19:15 johnx, fwiw, I've just tested this offline behaviour I was describing earlier, and this time it works fine. Aug 22 11:19:35 * yacoob is curious how often do you people charge your tablets? Aug 22 11:19:37 Edulix, can you play the file in mplayer ? Aug 22 11:19:46 yacoob, depends what I'm doing with it Aug 22 11:19:50 crashanddie: you could also contact ed bartosh, he is in charge of the builder. maybe just send him your public key and politely ask him if he can update it. Aug 22 11:19:52 yacoob, once a day Aug 22 11:20:14 yacoob, when I'm developing heavily, I just leave it plugged in, as the screen stays lit that way Aug 22 11:20:16 i'm not sure who else has the right to do so. Aug 22 11:20:26 errr...I guess the right answer though is: it's plugged in when I'm at home Aug 22 11:20:34 crashanddie: no Aug 22 11:20:37 libavformat file format detected. Aug 22 11:20:37 [mp3 @ 0xb8a560]Could not find codec parameters (Audio: mp1, 160 kb/s) Aug 22 11:20:37 LAVF_header: av_find_stream_info() failed Aug 22 11:20:38 isn't there something like a builder@maemo.org mail addy? :) Aug 22 11:21:17 <_julian_> hmm, thinking about the best way to transfer cd-cover images from the music-server to maemo to display them in the remote... maybe I should run a mini-http-server on the music server Aug 22 11:21:21 <_julian_> or has someone a better idea? Aug 22 11:21:28 I wonder how long will battery last for geocaching (bt on all the time, screen on/off, depending on situation) Aug 22 11:21:34 the address exists atleast and is used by the builder :) Aug 22 11:21:39 <_julian_> the actual controlling is done through a tcpsocket with a text-based protocol Aug 22 11:22:13 johnx: any impressions on the zenity interface? Aug 22 11:22:20 _julian_: have you seen the squeezebox duet? Aug 22 11:22:28 yacoob, what drains the battery is: poor wifi signal and high traffic, high bluetooth traffic, screen on continuously Aug 22 11:22:48 Stskeeps, looks nice. a little bit of a pain with the default gtk theme Aug 22 11:22:49 and ad-hoc wifi networks Aug 22 11:22:55 <_julian_> lbt: no, not really Aug 22 11:22:56 yacoob, I did a benchmark, leaving the GPS on the whole time, but the screen off, and the battery lasted for some 14 hours Aug 22 11:23:03 johnx: yeah, - i should look into how to make it uses maemo theme Aug 22 11:23:09 (which imply "high traffic" :) Aug 22 11:23:22 Stskeeps, it should just inherit it I would think Aug 22 11:23:24 jott: Ed says, this is to Niels Aug 22 11:23:28 it's interesting for what you describe, and, AFAIK, it has an open source backend Aug 22 11:23:28 ok Aug 22 11:23:35 http://www.logitech.com/index.cfm/speakers_audio/wireless_music_systems/devices/3817&cl=roeu,en?WT.ac=ps|4398 Aug 22 11:23:37 Stskeeps, do other things launched inside roxterm not pickup the maemo theme? Aug 22 11:23:43 it's squeezebox related Aug 22 11:23:54 trenka: would be good to have some builder@maemo.org or so for support requests :) Aug 22 11:24:01 crashanddie, that's good sign :) I'll test it over weekend. Aug 22 11:24:08 the music server controls the remote though Aug 22 11:24:25 <_julian_> lbt: ah looks interesting. - actually I am doing the remote for a very high end audio server which my company builds. it's targeted for customers who pay a few thousand euros for a cd-player... Aug 22 11:24:36 btw, is there some battery tracking tool? I used to have something like that for palmOS, I was able to see what was the usage of power over time. Aug 22 11:24:41 http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=nCFir0_5Jws Aug 22 11:24:43 johnx: not sure.. but it does sudo to root in a fancy way Aug 22 11:24:50 <_julian_> the remote is just some "play around" right now -evaluating if it might be worth to make it fully grown Aug 22 11:25:17 Stskeeps, well that would probably do it :) Aug 22 11:25:23 _julian_: well, you're probably aware of the logitech/slimdevices stuff - similar Aug 22 11:25:45 oh and is there any way to use the nokia n810 integrated webcam remotely in another computer as a webcam? or should I start developing support for that by myself hehe :P Aug 22 11:26:47 <_julian_> lbt: yeah... Aug 22 11:26:50 http://www.slimdevices.com/pi_transporter.html Aug 22 11:27:14 was what I was thinking of - which I guess is functionally in the area? Aug 22 11:27:17 Edulix, look up gstmpg (or is it gstmjpg?) or similar for a start Aug 22 11:27:22 jott: that's not a builder related issue, it's about an upload Aug 22 11:27:28 unless you're multimedia (Myth...) Aug 22 11:27:37 Edulix, other people have definitely had a start at it, at least... Aug 22 11:27:58 johnx & jott and anyone else, look at the damned video Aug 22 11:28:02 trenka: hm yeah indeed. Aug 22 11:28:20 crashanddie, ok (will I get rick rolled?) Aug 22 11:28:25 nope Aug 22 11:28:49 <_julian_> lbt: well yes it's kind of in that area out server is too... just that we pretend to still have better audio quality (c; Aug 22 11:29:00 btw, if anyone also wants to keep his/her passwords and encrypted notes in itt, NoteCase is the way to go. Aug 22 11:29:09 <_julian_> lbt: http://www.jusst.de/m1.php Aug 22 11:29:16 <_julian_> lbt: only german though Aug 22 11:29:27 crashanddie, that looks kinda neat :D Aug 22 11:30:26 johnx: you'll run in in a syntax error in the end when installing - not fatal, just doesnt set up the bootmenu item properly Aug 22 11:30:30 just ran into it myself Aug 22 11:30:46 (it has already finished installing at that point) Aug 22 11:32:08 it's basically making a deblet.item like the one on my alpha test itt post Aug 22 11:32:21 and running refresh_bootmenu.d Aug 22 11:32:54 johnx, thanks :) Aug 22 11:33:20 crashanddie, where are you getting the tags from? Aug 22 11:33:27 Hi. Aug 22 11:33:36 http://cloudgate.1080degrees.net Aug 22 11:34:23 Asking questions still being free, true? Aug 22 11:34:33 I'm afraid not Aug 22 11:34:52 lol Aug 22 11:34:54 you have to use paypal now. Aug 22 11:34:56 Binky, of course it's free :) Aug 22 11:35:19 johnx: sssh! don't corrupt our deal :P Aug 22 11:35:23 It's 20p per question, you can get a complete starter pack including 100 questions, 3 trolls and a ban evasion pass for only 20 quid ! Order now ! Aug 22 11:35:55 crashanddie: looks interesting :) Aug 22 11:36:11 No thanks, free, do i have to wait 45 seconds before asking an an hour beetween question? Aug 22 11:36:43 one hour between obtaining an answer for the previous question Aug 22 11:36:49 Ok... But if i pay there are more chances of getting answers... Aug 22 11:36:50 Yes, a limit of 24 questions per day is necessary to keep the channel clean and usable for our Premium users Aug 22 11:37:00 Lol Aug 22 11:37:28 Lol Aug 22 11:37:35 could someone direct me to the platinum rewards channel? Aug 22 11:37:54 (and i hope that question doesnt need support contract to be answered) Aug 22 11:37:59 :D Aug 22 11:38:42 lcuk, please post your customer number to the channel. In your case it's the same as your credit card number :D Aug 22 11:38:44 Anyway, i'll ask... If i make two 1 GBs partitions in a 2GB mmc card, where will the 770 mount both partitions? Aug 22 11:39:01 it will probably only automount the first Aug 22 11:39:07 media/mmc1 and /media/mmc2 Aug 22 11:39:10 Oh ok Aug 22 11:39:11 oi i have paid - i paid in kinetic scrolling cross licensing :P Aug 22 11:39:55 But i can make mount /dev/mmcblpk0(or sthg like it) and mountin it anywhere, true? Aug 22 11:40:18 crashanddie: you shouldn't throw out your premium geeks how are you supposed to attract new customers :P Aug 22 11:40:33 'premium geeks' Aug 22 11:40:42 that's a scary mental image I didn't need >_< Aug 22 11:40:44 thats ok jott, we can setup an alternative Aug 22 11:40:44 in underpants! Aug 22 11:40:58 Binky, of course Aug 22 11:41:16 http://www.caledosphere.com/photos/lutte.jpg <-- Gotta love the Olympics (Probably NSFW) Aug 22 11:41:40 LOL; underpants will only attract a kind of customers... Aug 22 11:41:52 johnx, thank you Aug 22 11:42:09 since platinum is oldhat, i thought i wouldsetup a super-premium maemo support channel for exclusive customers. #maemo-printerink Aug 22 11:42:26 LOL Aug 22 11:43:48 crashanddie, did you get the autobuilder building? Aug 22 11:44:01 lcuk, nope Aug 22 11:44:08 we have to wait for x-fade :/ Aug 22 11:44:10 Stskeeps, I'll just let the installer do it's thing then Aug 22 11:44:12 lcuk, probably a gpgpgpgpg/sssssssssh key Aug 22 11:44:12 booo hiss, that takes the piss Aug 22 11:44:14 or better he has to :) Aug 22 11:44:16 * johnx sleeps Aug 22 11:44:30 gnite johnx Aug 22 11:44:31 s/key/key problem/ Aug 22 11:44:32 crashanddie meant: lcuk, probably a gpgpgpgpg/sssssssssh key problem Aug 22 11:45:06 well with that stutter its feasible you are whispering the key wrong Aug 22 11:45:34 nickname: ccccrrrarrarsshhhhaannnddddieie pgp_key_phrase: 111221212333344444445555 Aug 22 11:45:35 what would eve do now? Aug 22 11:45:52 I love when infobot messes up Aug 22 11:45:56 Oh wait... Aug 22 11:45:57 probably go and copulate with adam Aug 22 11:46:14 or the snake Aug 22 11:46:15 or both Aug 22 11:48:37 lcuk: i thought she had an affair with bob already? Aug 22 11:50:00 welll eve is just randy Aug 22 11:50:15 crashanddie: lol @ picture Aug 22 11:50:36 [or rather, wtf :)] Aug 22 11:50:59 I would love to see a caption on that picture "YOU FUCK MY WIFE? " Aug 22 11:52:54 lcuk, yesterday, I spent 20 minutes reading news stories using CloudReader Aug 22 11:53:05 lcuk, this morning, I thought "oh what the hell, let's do it again", and it segfaults Aug 22 11:53:20 I've been tracking the bug ever since Aug 22 11:53:51 good day for all! Aug 22 11:54:23 johnx: after deblet.item was made and refresh_bootmenu.d, i booted up a healthy deblet baby atleast :) Aug 22 11:54:26 hi, can i change resolution in os2008? somewhere something like xorg.conf? Aug 22 11:54:27 with sound working too Aug 22 11:55:23 crashanddie: that youtube movie of yours is quite blurry :) Aug 22 11:55:43 cloudreader looks interesting though Aug 22 11:56:22 yeah, I know, I'll try to do it again today, with better light conditions Aug 22 11:56:23 crashanddie, thats not good, reproducable and everything? Aug 22 11:56:48 well reproducing it is no problem, it happens every time xD Aug 22 11:57:06 whats your logging telling you? Aug 22 11:57:32 Ah Aug 22 11:57:33 I knew it ! Aug 22 11:57:39 I knew Obama was gonna win Aug 22 11:57:56 [DEBUG] [CloudReader::addWord] Adding word: mccain Aug 22 11:57:56 Fatal signal: Segmentation Fault Aug 22 11:58:00 who's Obama? Aug 22 11:58:02 * aquatix runs Aug 22 11:58:04 lol Aug 22 11:59:02 bug fixed Aug 22 11:59:36 TTF_RenderText_Blended(fonts[(occurences <= 16) ? occurences : 16], word.c_str(), colour[theColour]) Aug 22 11:59:52 gah, off to work <_< Aug 22 12:00:13 Works a lot better when you stay within the range of the array :P Aug 22 12:01:23 heh crashanddie so that tells you people are singing about mccain far too much Aug 22 12:01:33 and i suppose it would blow their database to put an ' in there Aug 22 12:02:07 actually it would he doesnt have one :D Aug 22 12:02:14 :d Aug 22 12:02:18 * lcuk is crap at speling Aug 22 12:02:37 lcuk, cloudgate has been modded, and it now fetches a description of the article Aug 22 12:03:01 can you get rid of the silly having to press a button thing to click Aug 22 12:03:02 lcuk, it already display is, but just on one line, which means you get the first 10 words or so, and then "fuckel off" Aug 22 12:03:10 when its sat in my cradle i cant use it Aug 22 12:03:13 lcuk, yeah, I'm going to implement a timer and double click Aug 22 12:03:46 dont need it, just on mouseup work out how far the mouse has travelled Aug 22 12:03:56 hmm Aug 22 12:04:08 yeah, but see, canola does that Aug 22 12:04:09 and it sucks Aug 22 12:04:19 and not a crows flight start..end, you need actual distance travelled Aug 22 12:04:43 (otherwise it would detect an "O" as a single click Aug 22 12:05:23 totaly += ABS(mousedeltay) Aug 22 12:06:17 yeah, while (mousepressed) storage += abs (yrel); Aug 22 12:06:56 but that is only treating 1 dimension, you could click on something at the left hand side and release on the right and it wouldnt be detected.. Aug 22 12:07:08 which would you open in browser.. Aug 22 12:07:19 z$ Aug 22 12:07:24 sorry, I farted Aug 22 12:07:51 close your windows then, dont want it drifting northwards Aug 22 12:07:54 oh well, storage[0] += abs (yrel); storage[1] += abs (xrel) Aug 22 12:08:24 totaldist+=sqr(dx*dx+dy*dy) Aug 22 12:08:37 or that Aug 22 12:08:50 fuck the sqrt Aug 22 12:08:56 sqrt consumes too much CPU Aug 22 12:08:57 though its wasteful, but since you arent doing a great deal whilst moving Aug 22 12:08:57 :P Aug 22 12:09:11 My programs don't squirt Aug 22 12:09:22 not really, its not like you are sqrting every single point before you draw it Aug 22 12:09:42 its only a single op per mouse move and integer sqrt isnt bad Aug 22 12:09:48 well it's going to be on every SDL_EVENT Aug 22 12:09:55 and there are quite a load of those Aug 22 12:10:01 sdl_event of type mouse Aug 22 12:10:06 yeah, but still Aug 22 12:10:17 have you seen the ouput of mouse movement ? Aug 22 12:10:31 yer - i do lots of mousey stuff Aug 22 12:10:54 at times it was sufficient to get SSH to lag Aug 22 12:11:04 thats only your logging Aug 22 12:11:28 try putting a printf inside the render element - you get 400 or so entries per frame Aug 22 12:11:44 or put it in the line blit routine and get thousands per frame Aug 22 12:11:59 or put it in the point blit routine and get hundreds of thousands per frame Aug 22 12:12:27 1 sqrt operation per frame is inconsequential at the moment :P Aug 22 12:14:30 lcuk, how much tolerance should I accept for movement in a single click ? Aug 22 12:14:41 lcuk, 10p on each axis ? Aug 22 12:15:02 i dunno, but remember when you use thumb you get much larger radius impression Aug 22 12:15:14 I'm gonna try something Aug 22 12:17:13 DON'T PRESS THE RED BUTTON Aug 22 12:20:35 in windows can i find out which devices are connected to my network? Aug 22 12:23:38 lcuk, nmap Aug 22 12:27:15 crashanddie, i had enough sleep last night thanks Aug 22 12:28:23 lcuk, http://download.insecure.org/nmap/dist/nmap-4.68-setup.exe Aug 22 12:29:04 crashanddie, i know what it i, and think it might be installed somewhere, i just dont see why windows doesnt maintain a alist of connections - its authenticated etc so someone must "know" Aug 22 12:30:07 ah Aug 22 12:30:17 you want to know where your box is connected to ? Aug 22 12:30:28 Hey guys Aug 22 12:30:28 yer, i can see the connected icon Aug 22 12:30:35 netstat ? Aug 22 12:30:47 Khertan you here? Aug 22 12:30:49 its normally my 810 but thats not responding so its something else.. Aug 22 12:30:56 lcuk: theres some commandline tools in windows that you can use Aug 22 12:31:02 but i forgot their names Aug 22 12:31:07 lcuk, ipconfig /all Aug 22 12:31:08 ? Aug 22 12:31:38 ipconfig tells me interface, not whats on the backend Aug 22 12:31:45 ill use nmap and scan the entire thing Aug 22 12:31:59 and netstat gives me irc connection and vnc Aug 22 12:33:39 nbtstat ! gives partial Aug 22 12:35:05 hmmm, thats odd - vmware ip ranges are responding to pings Aug 22 12:38:39 lol, bugfest Aug 22 12:39:34 lcuk, I just added something so that by using the zoom hardware buttons, it applies a filter on the words with a lower significance Aug 22 12:39:58 ok, reasonable way to cut the crap Aug 22 12:39:58 lcuk, very simple, just a "if occurences <= filter; return" Aug 22 12:40:22 it worked before, i had it hard coded (I didn't want all those with occurence == 1) Aug 22 12:40:31 and now the dynamic memory allocation stopped working xD Aug 22 12:40:37 just like that, poof :D Aug 22 12:41:05 because the layout changes and you need to reposition everything Aug 22 12:41:12 Khertan: with py2deb do I need dput or other developer tools, or just copy the block like at the end on py2deb.py ( the main ) Aug 22 12:41:35 lcuk, no no no, at the start of the program, filter is at 0, so it doesn't filter out anything, but it still doesn't allocate properly Aug 22 12:42:29 isnt your code set into 2 sections: initial loading inside "addword()" and then as you are rendering Aug 22 12:42:52 or do you rerun the whole load operation with every resize Aug 22 12:43:37 whole load operation at every resize Aug 22 12:43:42 s/resize/filter/ Aug 22 12:43:42 lcuk meant: or do you rerun the whole load operation with every filter Aug 22 12:43:53 s/resize/filter/ Aug 22 12:43:53 crashanddie meant: whole load operation at every filter Aug 22 12:43:59 :P Aug 22 12:44:04 :D Aug 22 12:44:47 oooer, so you have made your load_filter() function none reentrant - you are most likely not reseting the x/y upto variables Aug 22 12:47:21 ayway, bbl Aug 22 12:48:00 hey does anyone know if USBControl will install on Diablo? Aug 22 12:49:11 lcuk, it would appear I deleted something in the constructor at some point... bufferH = 0; so bufferH had a crazy value, and my test to see if the background buffer needed to be expanded failed, and no expansion occured Aug 22 12:49:21 thank you git for bug finding ! Aug 22 12:53:53 i told you crashanddie im used to writing these kinds of things so know the common pitfalls :P Aug 22 12:54:05 but im not here now so nerrr :P glad its workin Aug 22 13:10:02 Anyone know anything about the windows flasher provided by nokia? Im tryin to update my software, but it keeps telling me that it cant connect to nokia servers because my time settings are incorrect.. I've check, my settings are correct. Anyone have any ideas? Aug 22 13:17:59 crashanddie: cloudreader is looking good :) Aug 22 13:18:10 qwerty12, just made a newer/better video Aug 22 13:18:25 Stskeeps: If you are running a gtk application as root, run it with run-standalone.sh in front Aug 22 13:18:27 Nice :) Aug 22 13:19:46 * qwerty12 gets back to compiling boost 1.35.0. A shame the compile messed up when I suspended >.< Aug 22 13:33:38 qwerty12: even under maemo? Aug 22 13:33:49 Stskeeps: yes Aug 22 13:34:16 When you run a gtk app as root, it doesn't pick up the environmental variables that the user account has Aug 22 13:34:18 qwerty12: alright, will fix that in next instance Aug 22 13:38:55 WTF Aug 22 13:39:04 http://pastebin.com/d22b75f2e Aug 22 13:39:21 Error 126 really means a lot to me Aug 22 13:39:25 :rolleyes: Aug 22 13:39:33 any knows, how to have g77/fortran supporte on scratchbox? Aug 22 13:40:02 * qwerty12 enables verbose Aug 22 13:40:42 Anunakin: why would you want that? :P Aug 22 13:40:57 to compile a math application Aug 22 13:41:19 ah Aug 22 13:41:28 i think there's problems with g77 on armel afaik Aug 22 13:41:40 hum Aug 22 13:42:19 on chinook sdk... I cold install gcc 4.3 toolchain... but I not take notes :( Aug 22 13:43:36 Oh, that's easy, grab the testing builds of the cs2008 toolchain and make a new targer Aug 22 13:43:37 *target Aug 22 13:43:53 I've got a DIABLO_ARMEL08 target that uses cs2008 rather than cs2005 Aug 22 13:44:34 Anunakin: maybe gfortran would be usable Aug 22 13:47:53 qwerty12:I have the 2008q1 files Aug 22 13:48:04 Then install it :) Aug 22 13:48:25 qwerty12:but howto make it compatible with sbox? Aug 22 13:49:06 qwerty12:this is a tar.bz2... I made it on past... using a howto... but I cant find now Aug 22 13:49:20 Hmm, I just used deb from here: http://scratchbox.org/~jhakala/unofficial/ Aug 22 13:49:56 Stskeeps: I think better to use g77, because I dont want to need install any more lib Aug 22 13:52:34 hum Aug 22 13:52:46 thanks qwerty Aug 22 13:53:09 Any think on get one Gigabyte M528 ? Aug 22 13:54:36 why the hell would we want to do that for ? Aug 22 13:55:00 hum? Aug 22 13:59:34 it's too big, too fat, doesn't fit in my pocket, no use Aug 22 14:01:06 it's not even big, it's huge :) Aug 22 14:01:14 you need a gigapocket Aug 22 14:02:22 well tbh, i would take one for free :) Aug 22 14:02:54 +1 except I'd sell it and get a smaller MID :P Aug 22 14:03:15 hah :) Aug 22 14:05:32 any scratchbox experts out there that cna answer a few questions ? Aug 22 14:07:25 roadies: don't ask if you can ask, just ask ...... Aug 22 14:09:47 yeah, sorry forgot the rule.... ok so I need to cross compile to a target ARMEL system on a X86 source system, the catch is the make build a executable than executes the program during install, ergo it segment faults. Any examples out there Aug 22 14:12:41 roadies: qemu tends to be fragile. you could try to use the cvs-m version as cpu transparency method. Aug 22 14:16:08 roadies, why does it execute itself during installation? Aug 22 14:16:14 jott: I think a found a way around the problem....fyi. the issue is compiling php for apache.....brb with results if it works Aug 22 14:16:18 surely thats a job for the postinst Aug 22 14:16:23 is anyone being able to run the n810 as an wifi access point? Aug 22 14:17:07 nifaal: I do it by cheating... :-D I run AdHoc on it Aug 22 14:17:57 lcuk: there are quite a few packages that use intermediate tools in the buildprocess Aug 22 14:18:31 roadies: ok, I guess the driver doesn't support master mode Aug 22 14:18:40 yes, those intermediate tools should already be built shouldnt they? or at least built in correct order Aug 22 14:19:51 lcuk: yes, but if qemu fails then this does not help ... Aug 22 14:20:42 I hate this computer it wont open Tar files Aug 22 14:21:55 nifaal: I could not answer that, for what I need to do AdHoc was a quick and dirty....however, Adhoc is a bear sometimes to get hosts to link up Aug 22 14:22:04 jott, more reasons to prefer native compilation Aug 22 14:22:34 lcuk: .. not with 128mb and 400mhz .. way too slow :) Aug 22 14:22:39 and it drains yourr battery considerably faster than infrastructure mode Aug 22 14:22:50 esp. 128mb suck :P Aug 22 14:23:02 never said i liked the speed jott :P i would really like an armel desktop Aug 22 14:23:47 jott: oh blastit, the work around didnt work... back to square one......... make files will be my death Aug 22 14:24:20 * qwerty12 still needs to get round to trying sbrsh Aug 22 14:24:42 * qwerty12 likes this twist of "on device compiling" :P Aug 22 14:24:50 yeah sbrsh can be ok to. Aug 22 14:25:15 or a new version of qemu :> Aug 22 14:25:55 and i doubt we see a desktop anytime soon :/ Aug 22 14:25:58 Indeed :). I miss the qemu upgrades in scratchbox that KotCzarny pointed me to :/ Aug 22 14:26:14 i use a svn snapshot :) Aug 22 14:26:23 jott, didnt we see an omap3 desktop Aug 22 14:26:34 lcuk: where? oO Aug 22 14:26:40 at linuxtag Aug 22 14:26:40 128mb ram != desktop for me. Aug 22 14:26:54 jott: nice :). I'm too lazy to compile qemu, takes too long. deb ftw :P :) Aug 22 14:26:58 lcuk: beagleboard? Aug 22 14:27:37 qwerty12: qemu compiles in 1-2 minutes oO Aug 22 14:27:42 i dunno which it was Aug 22 14:27:52 yeah beagleboard. Aug 22 14:27:53 maybe thou Aug 22 14:27:58 but it has just 128mb ram... Aug 22 14:28:09 cant these things be upgraded? Aug 22 14:28:22 jott: heh, maybe it's because the only time I tried compiling qemu it was N800 emulation version and that took ages for me :/ Aug 22 14:28:46 mmh. not really long :) Aug 22 14:28:55 like compared to openoffice, kde, kernel etc :) Aug 22 14:29:08 True :) Aug 22 14:29:30 * qwerty12 has to add he has never attempted openoffice or kde. I've done a kernel though :/ Aug 22 14:30:51 * qwerty12 does YAXc: Yet Another X11vnc compile Aug 22 14:30:59 but n810 wifi module accept infrastruture mode? Aug 22 14:34:28 Hey guys Khertan get me playing around with mContacts seeing if I can make a cool UI for it what do you guys prefer Text or Icon buttons? Aug 22 14:34:42 Can someone with Diablo run ls /usr/lib/libosso-ic-preload.so and tell me if it exists please? Aug 22 14:34:47 I noticed on mCalendar all his buttons are text but he told me to do it how I want Aug 22 14:34:47 svg Aug 22 14:35:16 icon+text underneath or on mouseover... Aug 22 14:35:25 lcuk: finger over? :) Aug 22 14:36:30 andrewfblack: with icons only the size is more flexible and usually you can spot things faster if the icons are good. Aug 22 14:36:48 * lcuk hates icons usually Aug 22 14:37:04 * jott hates text usually Aug 22 14:37:09 Yeah and I was just thinking that Icons just look cooler lol Aug 22 14:37:19 * jott pokes lcuk Aug 22 14:37:22 too many programs use tiny icon sets which require REALLY precise mousing Aug 22 14:37:35 but that's just bat icons :) Aug 22 14:37:36 or fingering Aug 22 14:37:37 bad Aug 22 14:37:44 no, its the whole design set Aug 22 14:37:51 that's why i restricted the assumption to "good icons" :) Aug 22 14:38:11 i.e. recognizeable and reasonable in size Aug 22 14:38:24 its like the icons on desktop thingy for network and brightness etc - they are just a tiny bit too small for comfortable finger use Aug 22 14:38:29 yeah I plan on making them figer size Aug 22 14:38:34 ok jott yer Aug 22 14:38:58 andrewfblack, but then theres other times when you need to cram 400 icons on screen Aug 22 14:40:19 I am trying to paritionate a memory card. The write-lock is on off. It wasn't working from my n810. I tried on my laptop, every modification of the partition table has no effect. Any idea where the problem can come from? Aug 22 14:40:20 jott, do you spend more time rotated 90degrees or have you settled back at normal landscape orientation? Aug 22 14:40:47 uh i rotate only for a few applications Aug 22 14:40:57 sometimes browsing, email and fbreader Aug 22 14:41:39 qwerty12: not existing Aug 22 14:41:58 i think i might bite the bullet and stick rotation on - and then if it works think a few of us should push nokians present at the summit to add the patch officially Aug 22 14:42:06 nifaal: ok, hmm, must be an icd2 thing. Thanks for checking Aug 22 14:42:30 lcuk: It works :) Aug 22 14:43:16 i dont mean "if it works" as in its broken, i mean if theres clear benefits to usability without dangeous sideeffects Aug 22 14:43:41 ok, yes i mean if it works Aug 22 14:43:45 :D Aug 22 14:43:47 they will never officially support it with hildon... Aug 22 14:44:08 it would be more of a community gift. Aug 22 14:44:17 It's a pisstake that they ship libxrandr2 happily with diablo but not the rotation Aug 22 14:44:43 apps aren't optimized for rotation tho Aug 22 14:44:45 most of them Aug 22 14:45:01 yep nokia apps mostly suck rotated :) Aug 22 14:45:10 they just assume a fixed size Aug 22 14:45:30 3rd party apps usually are better as they don't assume any resultion :) Aug 22 14:45:42 cross platform apps more likely Aug 22 14:45:44 Would have been nice if nokia had forward thinking. My OS2003SE (!) pocket pc happily rotates with the apps too Aug 22 14:45:51 theres plenty who would fall into 800*480 fixed Aug 22 14:46:01 me is included in that statement Aug 22 14:47:06 i've had rotation for months now i dont think i've used more than 10-15 times Aug 22 14:47:23 i wish the statusbar would go away honestly Aug 22 14:48:15 lcuk: think you would be able to integrate libxrandr2 into liqbase? Aug 22 14:48:25 * qwerty12 has no idea if liqbase works when rotated Aug 22 14:48:34 or rather, I can't remember Aug 22 14:48:53 applications should just use the desktop resolution Aug 22 14:49:05 every assuming fixed size is broken by design Aug 22 14:49:16 everything Aug 22 14:50:54 qwerty12 it would work, but it knows nothing about available resolutions, so would still offer 800*480 - it would/should display but the lcd should reformat and stretch to fit Aug 22 14:51:20 ah Aug 22 14:51:25 jott, liqbase is not fixed size - it already operates at arbitary resolution, the main problem is where it gets the list of availabel main resolutions from Aug 22 14:51:37 format is an f word Aug 22 14:53:39 lcuk: root window size? Aug 22 14:54:28 jott, for now it just has a string list of available resolutions - i could build em up dynamically but for right now its not important Aug 22 14:55:35 and even when it does, some display will look "wrong" - it would look stretched and incorrect on the menu screens because it would still layout and split the horizontal in 3 and stuff like that Aug 22 14:55:45 the reader element and graffiti wall should work nbicely Aug 22 14:56:00 anyway, before ibash more kb i best go Aug 22 14:56:09 back later Aug 22 14:56:15 * jott waves Aug 22 15:00:07 andrewfblack: I use text in mCalendar because i don't know how to render a date in an icon :) how do you represent Friday 22 ? :) Aug 22 15:00:32 andrewfblack: but yep icon would be better i think for something like mContacts ... Aug 22 15:00:41 andrewfblack: and thanks for help Aug 22 15:00:53 bye ... coming back to home ... Aug 22 15:06:23 * qwerty12 is still confused how "~/99x/bin/busybox ps -fe | ~/99x/bin/busybox grep x11vnc | ~/99x/bin/busybox grep -v grep | ~/99x/bin/busybox awk '{print $1}' | ~/99x/bin/busybox xargs kill -9" closed gedit Aug 22 15:07:48 oh, scratchbox doesn't differentiate between apps running on host. Aug 22 15:09:48 Khertan I wasn't complaining about text just asking what people thought :) Aug 22 15:09:58 opps he is gone Aug 22 15:24:17 ping ? Aug 22 15:35:15 <[2]baaba> is there a guide somewhere on setting up things so i can run gui programs through sbrsh on the tablet's xserver? Aug 22 15:35:24 <[2]baaba> using diablo on an n810 Aug 22 15:52:09 hey khertan you there? Aug 22 16:01:34 hm Aug 22 16:01:56 johnx, I've found a repeatable scenario when the wireless gets stuck Aug 22 16:02:33 connect to wifi, walk away from its range, wait for dhcp lease to time out. Aug 22 16:03:04 dhcp client seems to get stuck somehow - I wasn't able to disconnect (and connect to anything else) untill I've killed it. Aug 22 16:03:36 who was doing the community kernel project Aug 22 16:07:38 not me Aug 22 16:08:24 ah it was qwerty12 and we discussed git IIRC Aug 22 16:08:43 I think I found it https://garage.maemo.org/projects/kernels/ Aug 22 16:08:52 Hmm, I don't remember discussing git :/ Aug 22 16:08:57 I'm just one of the members :) Aug 22 16:09:01 and quilt? Aug 22 16:09:05 maybe not Aug 22 16:09:11 'twas a while back Aug 22 16:09:29 Oh, the quilt suggestion was mine, trickie said he liked it in -developers Aug 22 16:09:38 I just wanted to see about nfs and autofs Aug 22 16:09:45 http://www.engadget.com/2008/08/21/ask-engadget-best-portable-internet-device/#comments Aug 22 16:09:51 attack! Aug 22 16:10:00 yeah, I think I was saying that andrew morton used quilt Aug 22 16:10:21 I've never tried it Aug 22 16:11:55 Would the sudoers line: "ALL ALL = NOPASSWD: /etc/init.d/vnc-xrdp stop" allow me to run "sudo /etc/init.d/vnc-xrdp stop" fine? (yes, I know I should try it out instead of asking but I don't have a working device atm and my ubuntu's sudo seems a little different) Aug 22 16:15:22 it's the same format as many other lines Aug 22 16:15:28 user ALL = NOPASSWD: /etc/init.d/hildon-desktop stop Aug 22 16:15:52 Ah, great, thanks for that, so hopefully it should work :) Aug 22 16:15:54 but maybe 'user' for consistency Aug 22 16:16:32 yes - all the other lines are "user ALL...." Aug 22 16:18:26 I prefer using ALL, when I'm in a root session already and some script wants to use sudo, I get a message saying that "sorry user 'root' isn't allowed to execute this program" etc Aug 22 16:18:49 I went through each sudoer file and changed it to user ALL to ALL ALL by hand :/ Aug 22 16:19:26 I suppose it depends if you want to distribute it or use it ;) Aug 22 16:21:44 * qwerty12 doesn't differentiate ;) Aug 22 16:23:34 does anyone know if its possible to delete the cache headers that Modest downloaded, cause I have thousands of emails in gmail, and I only want the last 50 or say in Modest, but it downloaded all of them :( Aug 22 16:26:48 qwerty12, newer video: http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=FuDFqr1_i3M Aug 22 16:27:12 crashanddie: ta, watching now :) Aug 22 16:27:43 crashanddie: how much is a mini tripod? Aug 22 16:29:08 * Khertan_n810 hope that one day he can work at home ... to avoid many hours passed in transport Aug 22 16:29:35 crashanddie: it doesn't return straight back to cloudreader after choosing something to view does it? or are you using vnc or something? Aug 22 16:30:23 oh, that reminds me, x11vnc + http://www.unixuser.org/~euske/vnc2swf/ = brilliant. Aug 22 16:30:39 I made a quick video to show to Addison that putty can run in full screen and his tablet is fucked. Aug 22 16:31:31 * qwerty12 hopes the x11vnc with optimisations actually is faster :/ Aug 22 16:32:52 do any of you guys use an external USB stick/thumb drive with the miniusb cabel that comes with the n810? (and a female->female converter + appropriate software) Aug 22 16:33:17 I want to know if it works, and if so whether its good/bad.. a USB thumdrive is cheaper than a new SD card.. Aug 22 16:33:55 rah maemo wiki main page is still empty ! Aug 22 16:36:41 qwerty12, yes it does return straight to cloudreader after you close the browser window Aug 22 16:37:05 usi: I'm curious about that as well :) Aug 22 16:37:22 crashanddie: oh, I didn't realise you closed it Aug 22 16:37:46 GreyFoxx: have you got the female -> female converter? Aug 22 16:37:57 or adapter rather Aug 22 16:37:58 bef0rd: around? Aug 22 16:38:31 lbt, mini tripod ? Aug 22 16:38:59 to keep the camera still - it would make it a lot easier to see what's happening and keep focused :D Aug 22 16:39:10 is pygame installed by default on the n810? Aug 22 16:39:40 liri: no, python doesn't come by default either Aug 22 16:39:48 lbt, who gives a Aug 22 16:39:55 qwerty12: ahh Aug 22 16:40:03 qwerty12: but there are python applications on it Aug 22 16:40:05 lbt, seriously, I nicked the camera from my next door neighbour Aug 22 16:40:16 qwerty12: or am I wrong and I probably installed them afterwards? Aug 22 16:40:40 liri: you probably enabled extras and installed python (or a program depending on python) from there :) Aug 22 16:40:50 No programs come on the device by default that use python Aug 22 16:40:57 someone know what will be the organisation of lightning session ? Aug 22 16:41:02 qwerty12: ahh ok Aug 22 16:41:19 materials ? Aug 22 16:41:41 qwerty12: seems that apt-get search isn't valid, another easy way to search for packages? Aug 22 16:41:49 Khertan_n810: what do you need? Aug 22 16:41:50 liri, apt-cache search Aug 22 16:41:59 usicow: No, just starting to look into it now Aug 22 16:42:10 liri: install mcalendar it depends on python2.5-runtime Aug 22 16:42:20 booooo python Aug 22 16:42:37 brontide: to know how this will ... just to prepare myself Aug 22 16:42:48 FBReader is finally in Extras! Aug 22 16:42:51 Khertan_n810: and what does python2.5-runtime brings with it? :) Aug 22 16:43:00 * qwerty12 isn't a fan of python (despite my only app being in python) due to cpu usage but the language itself is decent Aug 22 16:43:30 brontide: as i don t speak english very well i must prepare my text Aug 22 16:43:33 and the show :) Aug 22 16:43:53 (and make a first release of mContacts) Aug 22 16:44:14 how will be the room Aug 22 16:44:22 liri: python2.5 (>= 2.5.2-1osso2), python2.5-bluez (>= 0.9.1-1osso2), python2.5-dbus (>= 0.82-4osso1), python2.5-gobject (>= 2.14.1-1osso1), python2.5-gstreamer (>= 0.10.5-0osso2), python2.5-cairo (>= 1.4.0-1osso2), python2.5-gtk2 (>= 2.12.1-1osso1), python2.5-hildon (>= 0.8.8-1osso8), python2.5-numeric (>= 24.2-1osso5), python2.5-osso (>= 0.3-1osso4), python2.5-pygame (>= 1.7.1-1osso2), python2.5-xml (>= 0.8.4-1osso9), python2.5-conic (>= 0.1 Aug 22 16:44:22 -1osso1), python2.5-gnome (>= 2.18.0-1osso3), python2.5-id3lib (>= 0.5.1-1osso2), python2.5-imaging (>= 1.1.6-1osso2) :P . It will install python and pygame though for sure Aug 22 16:44:31 oops, didn't realise it was that long, sorry Aug 22 16:44:40 if i can show some video / document ... Aug 22 16:44:52 or it ll be just around a small table Aug 22 16:44:59 aghrk! where the hell is '|' on the n810 keyboard?! Aug 22 16:45:01 Understood. I'll try and get more details, but for now I would assume projector + n810 will be provided and you can always bring your own slideshow/pdf/n8x0 Aug 22 16:45:21 hum ... Aug 22 16:45:22 There will probably be a loaner laptop there as well Aug 22 16:45:28 yacoob: Special Characters > Symbols Aug 22 16:45:37 i ll prepare something in pdf so Aug 22 16:45:44 It's the second row, fifth for the right Aug 22 16:45:53 wait, n810? Aug 22 16:45:55 Nevermind :-P Aug 22 16:46:05 sigh :) Aug 22 16:46:10 mumble, mumble. Aug 22 16:46:15 yaccob: chr key Aug 22 16:46:17 * TrueJournals goes and learns how to read.... Aug 22 16:46:22 I think some people resort to editing the keyboard definition file for N810 :) Aug 22 16:46:24 yaccob:scroll down Aug 22 16:46:30 As I don't have a N810, I'm not one of them :) Aug 22 16:46:46 yaccob: and it ll be at the top left Aug 22 16:47:08 (on my french keyboard layout) Aug 22 16:47:19 Khertan_n810: if you have any specific questions you can also post to the wiki, just remeber that Quim is on Vacation so it will be a week or so before you get a responce Aug 22 16:47:50 brontide: do you have see that the wiki main page is blank Aug 22 16:47:52 empty Aug 22 16:48:00 hit reload Aug 22 16:48:27 ctrl+shift+r Aug 22 16:48:29 ame thing Aug 22 16:48:43 It's working here... must be cached on your end Aug 22 16:48:45 ctrl+shift+r :) Aug 22 16:48:51 (firefox that is) Aug 22 16:48:57 qwerty12: don t work on microb Aug 22 16:48:58 :) Aug 22 16:49:06 F5 ;-) Aug 22 16:49:22 Khertan_n810: Ahh, clear cache then :) Aug 22 16:49:25 lol ... command r ? Aug 22 16:49:35 Khertan_n810: for microb, you can just hit the go button again to reload... Aug 22 16:49:50 yep i know ... Aug 22 16:49:50 It's nice when two short presses on a button are interpretted as one long press. Aug 22 16:49:50 Or hold the stylus over it and tap reload Aug 22 16:50:01 still blank Aug 22 16:50:10 Khertan_n810: https://wiki.maemo.org/Maemo_Summit_2008/Organization#Infrastructure Aug 22 16:50:11 hit it again Aug 22 16:50:13 harder Aug 22 16:50:19 ...speaking of which, I need to get proper keyboard layout... Aug 22 16:50:23 the harder you hit it the more it will push down the wires Aug 22 16:50:32 Yeah, I've problems with the main page of the wiki recently Aug 22 16:50:38 Khertan_n810: I am eager to see calendar, contacts and note bookmarks sync with google Aug 22 16:50:40 hum ... i wan t to keep thesensitivity of the screen Aug 22 16:51:24 khertan, ive lost finger sensitivity in the centre left area of screen, everything actually works, but the left is worse than the right - after my missus leaned her elbow on it ages ago Aug 22 16:51:25 calendar work at this time Aug 22 16:51:36 mcontacts need a better ui Aug 22 16:51:44 Khertan_n810: mContacts - does it integrate with any ldap/groupware? Aug 22 16:52:00 lbt: no ldap Aug 22 16:52:13 no groupware Aug 22 16:52:20 ok :( Aug 22 16:52:24 Khertan_n810: someday we should sit down and work out a bunch of new GTK widgets for the tablet Aug 22 16:52:25 but i ll try to made a sync with eds Aug 22 16:52:43 brontide: yep Aug 22 16:52:54 I've been setting up various groupware VMs here to see if I can get one to work on the N800 Aug 22 16:52:59 specially date/time pickup Aug 22 16:53:02 s/on/with/ Aug 22 16:53:02 lbt meant: I've been setting up various groupware VMs here to see if I can get withe to work on the N800 Aug 22 16:53:14 paf Aug 22 16:53:23 lbt: i don t know a usefull one Aug 22 16:53:43 egroupware is my current best bet Aug 22 16:53:58 apparently it works with the Qt contacts stuff Aug 22 16:53:59 i don t like the usability of it Aug 22 16:54:34 I want it as a home backend - use with Korganiser or similar Aug 22 16:54:35 it can work as a syncml server if i ve well understood Aug 22 16:55:02 yes - I'm starting to look at some of those things - there's a lot of abandonware out there though Aug 22 16:55:16 so 'kinda works' but noone is fixing it Aug 22 16:55:19 lbt: and i don t like kthings excepted klauncher and kmeteo (but s palm softwares) Aug 22 16:55:36 I'm agnostic - whatever does the job Aug 22 16:55:41 :) Aug 22 16:56:09 i ve never found one without problem or miss designed part Aug 22 16:56:27 this is why at work we use a custom made Aug 22 16:56:33 true - maybe it's still DIY with slapd Aug 22 16:56:40 cyrus etc Aug 22 16:56:52 by ourself Aug 22 16:57:23 brontide: is there is a plan to refine hildon widget in a next maemo release ? Aug 22 17:05:33 lbt I have message around with a lot of groupware this last few weeks trying to find something I can modify into something better then what I have now at tabletos.org and most of them suck or are abandonware like you said. The few I did find and like the web interface doesn't work else with tablet Aug 22 17:06:27 andrewfblack: I think I'd like things that implement the various protocols Aug 22 17:06:39 the tablets are going to be disconnected a lot Aug 22 17:06:50 so web i/f is secondary (in my book) Aug 22 17:07:05 then the various Qt PIM apps look useful Aug 22 17:07:16 (limited true) Aug 22 17:08:02 Khertan_n810, there's lots of UI stuff going on for Fremantle. Aug 22 17:08:10 Khertan_n810: I hope so... I really hope we can see something at the summit so I have an idea of what they are thinking Aug 22 17:08:11 plus, tbh, cutting down a web i/f is not too hard... Aug 22 17:08:35 lbt: and a calendar that sync with google isn t enought ? Aug 22 17:08:48 brontide: i hope too Aug 22 17:09:00 no, sorry, I have this thing about not storing my data on an advert server Aug 22 17:09:02 :) Aug 22 17:09:09 GAN800: fremantle ... so this is not for tomorrow Aug 22 17:09:22 Of course not. Aug 22 17:09:26 lbt: it s a choice Aug 22 17:09:32 I'm happy to have my server sync with google Aug 22 17:09:43 but I want some things to be private Aug 22 17:10:01 if all you really wants is notes and calendar I looked at http://chandlerproject.org/ but I havn't tried to see if there Linux App would compile on the Tablets Aug 22 17:10:28 andrewfblack: do u have already try to use it ? Aug 22 17:11:06 i think no ... Aug 22 17:11:12 I'm favouring things based on established servers: cyrus and slapd Aug 22 17:11:28 scalable and supported Aug 22 17:11:57 lbt: you will have less privacy with this thing than google Aug 22 17:11:58 Khertan_n810 I'ved used chandlerprojecton my desktop but not the tablet Aug 22 17:12:33 i ve try it ... and found it really useless Aug 22 17:12:55 Khertan_n810: you mean the chandler thing? I'd run it locally rather than use their server Aug 22 17:13:05 but I've only opened the FAQ so far :) Aug 22 17:13:26 lbt: i mean slapd Aug 22 17:13:36 I also found its useless to since I don't like how everything notes and tasks and all are in same section Aug 22 17:13:38 why? Aug 22 17:13:38 many holes Aug 22 17:13:47 what is needed Aug 22 17:13:55 is an app specifically designed for an IT Aug 22 17:13:59 because lets face it Aug 22 17:14:03 all the current ones suck as Aug 22 17:14:06 as Aug 22 17:14:07 ass Aug 22 17:14:08 andrewfblack: i found the organization totally lazy Aug 22 17:14:25 MangoFusion: don't disagree - but we're talking backend servers Aug 22 17:14:32 mcalendar is designed for it ! Aug 22 17:14:33 :) Aug 22 17:14:52 khertan_n810 I considered writting one my self the web app and database stuff I can do I just don't know enough about python to program a tablet app for it Aug 22 17:15:09 I'd like those to support standard apis Aug 22 17:15:36 lbt: there isn t standart api ... Aug 22 17:16:03 hence "I'd like" :D Aug 22 17:16:12 oups :) Aug 22 17:16:21 there are some that are better than others Aug 22 17:16:28 yep ... Aug 22 17:16:32 * lbt is no expert in this area Aug 22 17:16:43 same thing Aug 22 17:16:46 just looking and learning Aug 22 17:16:58 i ll let ... i take my car to go home Aug 22 17:17:04 bye Aug 22 17:17:13 I was trying to figure out egroupware<->konversation t'other day using wireshark... Aug 22 17:17:40 the xml is interesting... but not *that* hard. Aug 22 17:17:46 anyhow - dinner... Aug 22 17:17:48 l8r Aug 22 17:17:52 lbt: KDE Konversation? Aug 22 17:18:12 y Aug 22 17:18:21 lbt: Ah, interesting (I maintain/develop it) Aug 22 17:18:24 lbt: anyhow, bon appetit Aug 22 17:18:38 ooh - I'll keep your name around ;) Aug 22 17:18:50 anybody know the gtk widget name for the breadcrumb style widget in the application manager? Aug 22 17:19:03 there were some syncml (or whatever I can't recall) bugs Aug 22 17:19:16 anyhow mrs lbt is calling Aug 22 17:19:18 ttfn Aug 22 17:20:14 lbt: The egroupware stuff is in kdepim, though. Konversation integrates with KDE's KAddressBook using the library and KIMProxy, and KAddressBook in turn can set up and access eGroupWare resources. Aug 22 17:31:13 hmm, how much mA is the minimum the N800 needs to effectively charge? Aug 22 17:43:51 qwerty12: Are you here? Aug 22 17:44:01 Anunakin: sure Aug 22 17:44:56 qwerty12: Man, I installed... 2008q1 toolchain!! Aug 22 17:45:38 Anunakin: Nice :) Aug 22 17:45:46 qwerty12: but now I getting a error... Aug 22 17:45:46 checking whether the C compiler works... configure: error: cannot run C compiled programs. Aug 22 17:45:46 If you meant to cross compile, use `--host'. Aug 22 17:45:46 See `config.log' for more details. Aug 22 17:46:05 Is this with a new target? Aug 22 17:46:10 I used... --host... and works Aug 22 17:46:18 ./configure --prefix=/usr --host=arm-linux-gnueabi Aug 22 17:46:37 but I mean... where I can resolve it? Aug 22 17:46:48 Is this with a new target? Aug 22 17:46:58 yes Aug 22 17:47:10 I cloned the old target Aug 22 17:47:35 cp -rp DIABLO_ARMEL DIABLO_ARMEL_2008q1 Aug 22 17:47:59 and change toolchain on sb-menu Aug 22 17:48:11 Sounds like your config file is messed up. Try this one: http://pastebin.com/d5186eebd Aug 22 17:48:37 t_s_o, ~360mA is what the car charger provides. Aug 22 17:48:52 qwerty12: Nice, you have a solution ... for all thinks! Aug 22 17:49:14 anybody know a good place to buy an extra battery for the n810? Aug 22 17:49:42 ok, i have philips power2go (or was it power2charge) battery here with a usb port thats rated for 350mA and with a note about not going above 450... Aug 22 17:49:52 jga23_, nokia online shop? Aug 22 17:54:11 qwerty12: What I must use from this page? top or botton? Aug 22 17:54:11 well it seems its able to charge the N800, even tho the work light flickers on and off all the time (not sure if thats a indication of overload as i cant find the behavior documented anywhere) Aug 22 17:58:22 hi :) Aug 22 17:59:06 hm... what are my choices if I'd like to code an app for maemo? C++/Python? Aug 22 17:59:07 hi Aug 22 17:59:37 yacoob: Python, C, C++ Aug 22 17:59:52 yacoob: there are ports of .NET (mono) and Ruby as far as I know Aug 22 17:59:54 yes yacoob... I think there are: tcl/tk, mono Aug 22 18:00:05 (but they are not there per default) Aug 22 18:00:17 any speed considerations, api limitations? Aug 22 18:00:24 yes not default in any system Aug 22 18:00:34 yacoob: use C if you want speed :) Aug 22 18:00:36 yacoob, depends what you wanna do Aug 22 18:00:42 better use C++ with GTK or QT Aug 22 18:01:00 yacoob: (that includes writing Python C extensions) Aug 22 18:01:07 for a mainly desktop app talking to a database does it matter what language? Aug 22 18:01:45 lcuk: no, for glue it doesn't matter :) Aug 22 18:01:55 TBH, I don't know yet whether I "want" anything. I'm just trying to estimate the effort/resources needed to write/port an app, if it's not there 8) Aug 22 18:02:13 (and here, I'm mostly wondering about maemo-specific part) Aug 22 18:02:41 all depends on what it is - ie python would be useless for games, and asm would be useless for a quick ui around another app Aug 22 18:02:41 yacoob: well, GTK is mostly the standard GTK so if you have done GTK app coding before, it's the same :) Aug 22 18:02:48 yacoob: PyGTK is there, too :D Aug 22 18:03:07 for example, there doesn't seem to be any OTP applications, and it will be relatively easy to code one. The part I don't know, is how much harder it will get with maemo. Aug 22 18:03:19 Never done *any* UI programming 8) Aug 22 18:03:37 printf("OTP application\n"); // todo: find out what OTP actually is Aug 22 18:03:53 one time passwords :) Aug 22 18:04:32 (see, I'm PalmOS refugee, trying to find my ground here in maemo world 8) Aug 22 18:04:42 someone already coded one of those, however it was OTC and he says it needs rewriting everytime he uses it Aug 22 18:05:09 yacoob: I see :) no GUI programming experience (at all, anywhere)? that will be "interesting" then :) Aug 22 18:05:30 yacoob: as for general library availability, Aug 22 18:06:18 yacoob: Maemo is quickly becoming like a normal GNU/Linux distribution and these days almost everything that's on a PC Linux distribution is there :) Aug 22 18:06:31 (everything which makes sense...) Aug 22 18:06:32 dannym, tiny taste of it with webapps, but no desktop apps. I enjoy more implementing some functionality, than making it useful and acessible for others 8) Aug 22 18:06:37 and if its not you can attempt to build it Aug 22 18:07:02 dannym, yes, I've made a quick round trip through the apps - and saddly, some of the "ports" are soooo out of place on tablet. Aug 22 18:07:09 like, application with its own menu bar. Aug 22 18:10:01 yacoob: yeah, I know. A lot of the apps only were minimally changed in order to build on the tablet and everything else kept... someone should "Hildonize" them (Hildon is the Maemo GUI style) :) Aug 22 18:10:03 yacoob, you can say the same thing about some of the nokia apps on the tablet Aug 22 18:10:20 which ones? Aug 22 18:10:45 look around the system and find out how many scrolling solutions you can find Aug 22 18:14:02 way too many Aug 22 18:14:29 hm... scrolling bar, wide scrolling bar, dragging stuff by clicking on the background...? Aug 22 18:14:30 * lcuk thinks kinetic is the way forward Aug 22 18:15:01 a scrollbar is only useful when you have a mouse with no scrolling wheel Aug 22 18:15:20 a scroll area is useful, but not a desktop type scroll bar Aug 22 18:15:30 another use is to "show" where you are on the page, and I agree that can be useful Aug 22 18:15:37 a fixed size grab handle along a rail is plenty Aug 22 18:15:48 agreed, I was about to implement that in CR Aug 22 18:16:06 (especially one that happens to use a sketch as its handle ;) Aug 22 18:16:13 haha Aug 22 18:16:56 whats the best way of relieving a bad day? Aug 22 18:17:25 get a banana milkshake for you, wife and kids, and enjoy it all together Aug 22 18:17:37 Kill the neighbors. Aug 22 18:17:41 or that Aug 22 18:17:47 Breakfast dinner! Aug 22 18:17:52 Make the family pancakes Aug 22 18:17:53 heh GeneralAntilles the neighbours kid isnt helping i must agree Aug 22 18:17:58 BACON! Aug 22 18:18:02 btw, any way to change the default application for a given extension? Aug 22 18:18:13 Then fly into a rage when they refuse to eat the food you made. Aug 22 18:18:41 oh fuck, is it 19:20 already ? Aug 22 18:18:42 djeezus Aug 22 18:18:49 I agree Aug 22 18:18:51 yacoob, yes, you just have to install a new window manager, assign the mime types into it, recompile your kernel and bobs your uncle movies will open in mplayer. (its just mime types really i believe) Aug 22 18:18:51 djeezus Aug 22 18:19:11 8) Aug 22 18:20:00 OH YOU CUNT Aug 22 18:21:05 lcuk: Make sex 10 times... with you wife!!!! Aug 22 18:21:29 make sex ? Aug 22 18:21:37 Anunakin, i'm glad you added that last bit, i was making plans to hump my bass speaker Aug 22 18:21:56 make: *** No rule to make target `sex'. Stop. Aug 22 18:22:22 wouldnt it be "-sh: Make: not found" Aug 22 18:22:37 I can understand how one can "make love", or "have sex" Aug 22 18:22:41 but make it ? Aug 22 18:23:09 $ %blow Aug 22 18:23:09 bash: fg: %blow: no such job Aug 22 18:23:10 yacoob: no really, edit "/ur/share/applications/default.list" :) Aug 22 18:23:34 yacoob: you can put whatever program you want to be associated to a MIME Media Type there... Aug 22 18:23:35 morning all :) Aug 22 18:23:36 crashanddie: hum I dont know... english not is my firt language... I think all can see it... Aug 22 18:23:47 first Aug 22 18:23:58 Anunakin, english isn't my flirt tongue either Aug 22 18:24:16 yacoob: and if they didn't go out of their way hiding the evil evil UNIX filesystem (?), it would be actually quite discoverable... but noo... Aug 22 18:24:36 (in the file manager, I mean) Aug 22 18:24:48 unix folks wouldnt use the filemanager :) Aug 22 18:24:49 s/UNIX/Linux/ Aug 22 18:24:51 make: *** No rule to make target `sex'. Stop. Aug 22 18:24:56 kkkkkk Aug 22 18:25:08 dannym_, nah, I like it this way. Aug 22 18:25:13 lcuk: well yeah... :) Aug 22 18:25:26 wait Aug 22 18:25:29 isn't ls a file manager ? Aug 22 18:25:42 I mean, on limited screen space, I shouldn't be forced to click over through the filesystem :) Aug 22 18:25:47 crashanddie: that's like saying GQView is Photoshop :) Aug 22 18:25:59 *hides* Aug 22 18:26:02 not really Aug 22 18:26:26 ls is to file manager as paint is to image editor Aug 22 18:26:31 Anybody using cairo in pygame ? Aug 22 18:26:36 if it can save then, yeah it is - run it, show image, open console write bits to /dev/memoryx whatever it is, write it back Aug 22 18:26:40 voila, photoshop Aug 22 18:26:43 not even that :P Aug 22 18:27:03 yacoob: it would be actually quite similar to now... if it showed "/", you'd see "media" and the two SD cards... just that they'd be named the same in the filemanager and in the real system :) Aug 22 18:27:35 and you'd see a bunch of shit lusers don't need to know about Aug 22 18:28:07 at the least a menu config option could be added "start from /" Aug 22 18:28:26 quite honestly, why ? Aug 22 18:28:32 crashanddie: as long as they can't write it... could even make the directories supposed to be evil "o-x" and they can't even enter them :) Aug 22 18:28:44 because i dont like having to open another program to browse the filesystem Aug 22 18:28:46 crashanddie: why? For consistency... Aug 22 18:29:11 crashanddie: as in, everything in the system uses the same names for the same things :) Aug 22 18:29:15 I mean, do you need a file manager to go look into a text file in /etc/conf.d, which you'd probably need to edit through the terminal anyway, considering you need root access ? Aug 22 18:29:32 dannym_, of course it doesn't, where the hell do you come from, Linux 2.2 ? Aug 22 18:29:57 crashanddie: hmm? Aug 22 18:30:05 crashanddie: what doesn't? Aug 22 18:31:06 if I mount the diablo II expansion CD from /dev/cdrom0 to /media/cdrom, I want it to appear in my file manager as "Diablo II: Expansion set", not /media/cdrom0 Aug 22 18:31:44 hum Aug 22 18:32:03 use automounter Aug 22 18:32:17 * crashanddie facepalms Aug 22 18:32:51 crashanddie: actually in an ideal world, that would be "/media/cdrom0/Diablo II: Expansion set/" ... Aug 22 18:32:54 * dannym_ sighs Aug 22 18:33:01 dannym_, if the product is targeted at general market, I'd say, stick to "safe" fileselector. Unless there would be "extended" version that you can enable by flipping setting in a config file... Aug 22 18:33:21 dannym, I'm sorry, that wouldn't make sense at all Aug 22 18:33:53 dannym, because it wouldn't either respect the CD filesystem, nor the Linux filesystem Aug 22 18:34:02 crashanddie: try use ivman Aug 22 18:34:13 Anunakin, I don't want to be rude Aug 22 18:34:50 Anunakin, I was citing a mere example, I don't care about mounting CDs or not, I don't care about Diablo II, and if I wanted, I would know how to sort it out Aug 22 18:34:53 crashanddie: it works that way today, with ivman :) and makes perfect sense to me and the UNIX system (i.e. there's no crazy hacks to make this work, if that's what you mean) Aug 22 18:35:03 crashanddie: ivman is a service who mounts you CD using it LABEL Aug 22 18:35:18 I KNOW IT DOES IT JUST DOESN'T MAKE ANY SENSE Aug 22 18:35:42 so does diablo II work on diablo? Aug 22 18:35:47 yes Aug 22 18:35:47 crashanddie: you wants the same name all time? Aug 22 18:35:51 crashanddie: first you say you want it to be that way and then you say it makes no sense... *confused+ :) Aug 22 18:35:56 does diablo work on diablo? Aug 22 18:35:56 cool, Diablo on Diablo ^^ Aug 22 18:36:09 well, not directly Aug 22 18:36:17 but ssh -X never stopped working :P Aug 22 18:36:29 dannym, no, I didn't say I wanted that Aug 22 18:36:43 crashanddie: you wants install diablo II, next it expancion? Aug 22 18:36:58 crashanddie: it should appear in the file manager with the label "Diablo II: Expansion set". Well, it does, then :) Aug 22 18:37:05 Anunakin, say one more word, and I swear I'll send you back down your fucking tubes, got that ? Aug 22 18:37:06 *************** OFFICIAL CHANNEL BREAK ***************** before people get carried away with specifics, crash cited a common example, it matters not anything about it, can we please get back to discussing make sex Aug 22 18:37:37 lcuk, good timing Aug 22 18:37:42 I'm off for a cigarette Aug 22 18:37:51 ok :) Aug 22 18:38:23 http://www.njoynpro.com/ Aug 22 18:39:34 oooohhh, gjiten. Yummy. Aug 22 18:39:35 lcuk: KILL? Aug 22 18:39:41 crashanddie: are you crazy? or what? Aug 22 18:40:03 RST38h, -9? Aug 22 18:42:00 yacoob: learning Japanese? :) Aug 22 18:42:56 I had, some time ago. Still try to revisit things now and then. Aug 22 18:43:18 Right now I've made a list of palmos apps, and I'm trying to match up maemo replacements Aug 22 18:43:26 and I've arrived at PAdict Aug 22 18:43:58 so far so good, only 8 out of 28 apps remain unmatched. Aug 22 18:44:08 and most of them are not crucial. Aug 22 18:48:13 yacoob: have you put that on the wiki? Sounds like a good idea :) Aug 22 18:49:27 No, at the moment it's in my google docs. But that's a good idea indeed. wiki.maemo.org? Aug 22 18:49:34 yes Aug 22 18:49:41 Hmm, mokopedia looks nice. Aug 22 18:50:09 ...looks like I'll need either sshd, or bt keyboard for my tablet. Aug 22 18:50:16 (and there goes my already scarce free time... :) Aug 22 18:50:28 ssh - makes life so easy Aug 22 18:51:51 reminds me, anyone knows how to get a Mesh network to work (for later SSHing)? Aug 22 18:52:07 that is, I have a N800 with wireless, a laptop with wireless but _no_ access point. Aug 22 18:52:28 (no router that can serve as access point) Aug 22 18:53:51 you need to setup ad-hoc mode Aug 22 18:54:17 never needed to do it though - but that's the google term in case you didn't know... Aug 22 18:54:45 does anyone know how to change the bg color of a toolbar? Aug 22 18:55:17 lbt: I see, thanks :) Aug 22 18:56:14 is anyone using a 16GB SD card in the n810? Aug 22 18:56:28 usicow, i have an 8gb only Aug 22 18:56:54 ad hoc mode, then some kind of nat on the laptop, then set routing on the tablet... Aug 22 18:57:36 nat might be tricky to get, depending on whether you have >1 interface, and operating system. If you have bt in your laptop, pan networking can be an option too. Aug 22 18:57:49 moontiger: have you heard of people using up to 16GB, or should I just get an 8GB one? Aug 22 18:58:13 usicow, i havent but i think i read somewhere that 8gb is the max supported for now Aug 22 18:58:21 yacoob: yeah, I have bluetooth there. But if usbnet is any indication (Bluetooth uses the same chip), it will probably not work :) Aug 22 18:58:27 ok Aug 22 18:58:37 (last time I tried usbnet it crashed both my laptop _and_ the tablet ;)) Aug 22 18:58:50 i got a patriot 8gb for $40 or so fyi Aug 22 18:58:51 what os is the laptop? Aug 22 18:59:00 8GB is "officially supported", but I think 16GB should just work... Aug 22 18:59:08 next actual limit is 128GB :) Aug 22 18:59:21 dannym, i use adhoc wifi to my windows desktop and it works really well Aug 22 18:59:25 lbt: Gentoo Linux Aug 22 18:59:28 yacoob, probably but at the time 16gb were *very* pricey and i didnt need more than 8gb Aug 22 18:59:34 watch for battery life though, set it to manually connect and disconnect Aug 22 18:59:41 yacoob: ok Aug 22 19:00:09 adhoc kills battery quicker than normal because the wifi circuits cant sleep and always broadcast the network when you enable it Aug 22 19:00:22 dannym: I have absolutely no problems using usb networking on debian with a home kernel (2.6.25, 26 and 27-rc2) Aug 22 19:00:26 btw, has any of you tried microb extensions? Aug 22 19:00:26 yacoob: have you a summary list of missing apps? Aug 22 19:00:50 lcuk: I see Aug 22 19:01:04 I can get an 8GB one which is class 6, but only a class 4 16GB one.. what do you guys recommend, should I get the slower but bigger SD card, or just get the 8GB one which is faster? Aug 22 19:01:17 lbt: hmm, I tried with 2.6.26.2 last time Aug 22 19:01:34 usicow: what do you need the extra 8gb for? Aug 22 19:01:47 lbt: sometimes, the normal usb storage doesn't work via USB either :( maybe hardware failure somewhere (cable?) ... Aug 22 19:01:57 lbt: I guess nothing.. more movies? :) Aug 22 19:02:01 < crashanddie> My programs don't squirt << quote of the day for me Aug 22 19:02:01 dannym: well, in that case... Aug 22 19:02:03 pupnik_, it's somewhat of a scribble, but: tomerider3 (basically, offline wikipedia reader), world clock (system gives me 2 places, I need 3 8), date diff (not crucial, nice toy :), db (just a relational db, not crucial, I think I can just use sqlite), handyshopper, woman, tsOTP Aug 22 19:02:16 usicow: then you don't need the speed :) Aug 22 19:02:29 lbt: (the N800 is usb storage mode doesn't accept any "address" assigned to it - once every 10 tries or so) Aug 22 19:02:41 hmm. is the /media/mmc1 and /media/mmc2 notation consistent on n800/n810? Aug 22 19:02:45 lbt, is handyshopper your work? Aug 22 19:02:50 or a rival? Aug 22 19:02:59 goddam copycats... Aug 22 19:03:02 lbt: hmm good point.. but what type of operations would I need the extra speed for then? lots of copying or something? Aug 22 19:03:03 :) Aug 22 19:03:17 usicow: not even sure the hw makes use of the speed Aug 22 19:03:24 lcuk: not seen it... Aug 22 19:03:28 Stskeeps: I have a N800 and there, "/media/mmc1" and "/media/mmc2" exist. I don't know about the N810... Aug 22 19:03:51 usicow, you always need more speed Aug 22 19:04:03 lcuk: is adhoc to be set up on both sides? Aug 22 19:04:04 Stskeeps: I'm fairly sure it's consistent Aug 22 19:04:16 k Aug 22 19:04:23 lcuk: yeah I think I'll get the faster 8GB card. Aug 22 19:04:45 dannym, yes. for a completely open connection if 2 computers with the same adhoc name meet they connect :) Aug 22 19:05:17 * Stskeeps is building "install deblet to a file on my MMC card" Aug 22 19:05:34 * lcuk names his adhoc "free wireless internet" Aug 22 19:05:47 "free bird seed" Aug 22 19:06:02 Stskeeps: the tablet, AFAIK, only mounts VFAT to /media/mmc[12] Aug 22 19:06:21 usicow, the faster card should be noticable if you choose to boot from it and store apps etc Aug 22 19:06:34 ive got ext2 on my mmc1 i think Aug 22 19:06:51 but does it automount to that dir? Aug 22 19:06:51 how would i be able to tell? Aug 22 19:06:55 mount Aug 22 19:07:26 i dont ever have to manually mount anything (computer related you dirty bastards) Aug 22 19:07:54 /dev/mmcblk1p1 on /media/mmc1 type ext2 (rw) Aug 22 19:08:03 OK Aug 22 19:08:24 there's a comment on the wiki that may be wrong then - I just believed it Aug 22 19:08:31 (damned wikis) Aug 22 19:09:11 never trust any single fact on the internet Aug 22 19:09:27 or in life itself for that matter Aug 22 19:09:41 is that a fact? Aug 22 19:10:18 yes :P Aug 22 19:11:09 hm... Aug 22 19:11:48 has anyone measured how much cruft builds up with frequent installing of various packages? One thing is dependencies that gets pulled in and not removed, the other - various files sprinkled around in /var Aug 22 19:12:32 yes, theres a cleanup tool around, i think its called flasher-3.0 or something Aug 22 19:12:55 * lcuk goes coding Aug 22 19:13:19 yes, that's my plan so far, test various shit, then reflash and install "wanted" state. :D Aug 22 19:13:58 there was a decrufter in Debian, though. One that was going through whole fs and comparing it to both dpkg db state and various policies Aug 22 19:15:18 hmm. is there a mkfile equivalent for maemo? Aug 22 19:15:22 if i have to make a 2gb file for instance Aug 22 19:15:29 with all zeros Aug 22 19:15:59 is dd there? Aug 22 19:16:03 yeah Aug 22 19:16:13 dd if=/dev/zero of=/tmp/yourfile bs=1G count=2 Aug 22 19:16:17 k Aug 22 19:16:23 watch out for sparsies :) Aug 22 19:17:02 yeah.. since im putting a filesystem inside it, im not doing a sparse file Aug 22 19:17:14 as it will perform even worse with a sparse file Aug 22 19:18:50 lcuk: do I set up the IP address of the ad-hoc WLAN interface manually? Aug 22 19:19:19 i have done, but thats how the rest of my network is configured Aug 22 19:31:54 anybody know the hildon widget name for the "breadcrumb" widget in the application manager? Aug 22 19:32:11 I just got FDOSed Aug 22 19:32:17 it's like a DDOS Aug 22 19:32:45 but it happens when a feline rests her head on your printscreen key and engages autorepeat.... Aug 22 19:32:48 hehe Aug 22 19:33:07 i thought FDOS was gf dragging you away from computer Aug 22 19:33:08 :P Aug 22 19:33:19 had to login to a server to ssh back and kill them - and still they kept coming Aug 22 19:33:27 and she just purred - grrr Aug 22 19:38:43 funny Aug 22 19:39:57 http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20080822-firefox-to-get-massive-javascript-performance-boost.html <- so when can we expect this in microb? Aug 22 19:46:36 t_s_o, it should be merged with trunk by Fremantle. Aug 22 19:46:42 s/it/MicroB/ Aug 22 19:46:42 GeneralAntilles meant: t_s_o, MicroB should be merged with trunk by Fremantle. Aug 22 19:46:54 I doubt if there are any real plans for that for MicroB yet, though. Aug 22 19:47:44 ok. so its just a matter of leaning back, waiting for fremantle and hope that nokia dont find some reason to drop the N8x0 line before that time Aug 22 19:48:45 t_s_o, the tablets aren't going anywhere. Aug 22 19:49:08 sorry, just my fatalist streak kicking in... Aug 22 20:14:54 http://www.ozmodevices.com/release_08.php Aug 22 20:18:51 Qt painting performance on N810 is really really slow: http://www.kdedevelopers.org/node/3631 Aug 22 20:19:04 for those in the community who don't read planetkde.org Aug 22 20:20:23 more reason to get nokia to make powervr stuff availiable ;) Aug 22 20:20:33 manyoso: currently qt is build without vfp Aug 22 20:21:31 yah, but i built qt manually with vfp and it didn't help :) Aug 22 20:21:45 ok Aug 22 20:21:58 i used all the same CFLAGS as found on qtopia phone edition for n810 Aug 22 20:21:59 didn't help Aug 22 20:22:50 regardless, i wonder why antonio doesn't build the packages with vfp and other compiler optimizations Aug 22 20:23:03 it's currently in the queue. Aug 22 20:23:14 i just disabled it for the moment as the builder makes trouble with it. Aug 22 20:25:33 jott: did you seee i posted my patch for QTouchEvent's to the qt4-maemo mailing list? Aug 22 20:25:58 manyoso: yes, i had no time to look at it in detail yet. Aug 22 20:27:23 Anybody knows a way to find out the name of a package which "Provides:" some virtual package? Aug 22 20:27:32 if compiling with Scratchbox you can pass gcc options to the gcc wrapper through environment variables. This way e.g. configure or makefiles doesn't need to know about the options Aug 22 20:27:33 manyoso: have you actually looked how much fps the raster render of qgears2 gives under qt/e? would be interesting. Aug 22 20:27:54 no i haven't Aug 22 20:27:54 for example, package kernel-source-diablo "Provides: kernel-source", how I can find out "kernel-source-diablo" from "kernel-source"? Aug 22 20:28:09 but i've run the identical browser under both and i can say that qt/e is much better Aug 22 20:28:13 on same device Aug 22 20:28:42 yes that's why i thought about it, to get some numbers to compare to :) Aug 22 20:28:58 when i get some more time maybe i'll run qgears2 under qt/e on n810 for comparison Aug 22 20:29:02 but i don't have time soon Aug 22 20:29:22 ok Aug 22 20:31:14 timefail Aug 22 20:32:36 perhaps I could do it :) Aug 22 20:34:12 Any knows? about install g77/fortran on scratchbox? Aug 22 20:34:53 lpotter: would be very interesting Aug 22 20:34:58 you know i just realized i haven't downloaded music in many months Aug 22 20:35:09 maybe 1+ year Aug 22 20:35:24 other than creative commons music Aug 22 20:36:11 i have a new purpose. Aug 22 20:37:08 n800m, you wouldn't have a more obvious nickname, would you ? Aug 22 20:37:32 better? Aug 22 20:37:51 what purpose is that? Aug 22 20:38:11 music binge Aug 22 20:38:48 i play music pretty much nonstop on the n800 hooked up to a sound system, but mostly shoutcast streams Aug 22 20:39:28 not really Aug 22 20:41:05 alternatively, is there a way to determine what's the target OS flavour in current scratchbox? (e.g. chinook, diablo etc) Aug 22 20:41:45 http://engrishfunny.files.wordpress.com/2008/08/cuntexam.jpg?w=500&h=375 Aug 22 20:43:49 elekt, LMFAO Aug 22 20:45:38 i hat how urls give away content Aug 22 20:45:45 ruins the joke 50% of the time Aug 22 20:45:50 hat = hate Aug 22 20:46:40 domain.com/funny-picture-about-guy-falling-on-his-face-after-being-mauled-by-bear.html Aug 22 20:46:48 this one doesn't: http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3020/2785479622_6776be39f7_o.png Aug 22 20:47:34 hahaha Aug 22 20:48:12 i have done, but thats how the rest of my network is configured Aug 22 20:48:16 bollocks Aug 22 20:49:00 lcuk, yes ? Aug 22 20:50:00 xchat was in the wrong position, im coding and alt-tabbed up arrowed and pressed enter (intening to re-run "./mkrun.sh") Aug 22 20:50:30 alt+tab pwned Aug 22 20:51:15 uh huh Aug 22 20:52:13 http://penny-arcade.com/comic/2008/8/20/ Aug 22 20:55:48 * lcuk shouldnt have set a network delete off Aug 22 20:55:51 its takin forever Aug 22 20:56:54 whats the option i need for rm to delete a folder Aug 22 20:57:09 * lcuk wont be including any slashes Aug 22 20:57:16 rm -r Aug 22 20:57:20 thanks :) Aug 22 20:57:23 or rm -rf to delete all inside it Aug 22 20:58:05 sorry, rm -r is recursive, -f is force Aug 22 20:58:35 if you want to just delete a directory and fail if its not empty, use rmdir Aug 22 20:59:17 its ok, it worked as expected Aug 22 21:01:56 rm -rf http://penny-arcade.com Aug 22 21:02:25 rm -rf / Aug 22 21:02:32 403: permission to weirdo denied Aug 22 21:02:51 crashanddie: they are occassional fun :) Aug 22 21:11:27 Why would you want to rm Penny Arcade? Aug 22 21:11:32 You don't have a sense of humor, do you? Aug 22 21:11:36 haha Aug 22 21:13:06 lpotter: so you will do the qgears2 case on N810 while running Qtopia? Aug 22 21:16:28 <||cw> GeneralAntilles: neither does penny arcade... they used to be funny though Aug 22 21:16:46 They're still funny Aug 22 21:16:53 Dunno when you think they became unfunny. Aug 22 21:17:11 they're not that funny anymore tho Aug 22 21:17:13 they're pretty hermetic sometimes Aug 22 21:17:13 <||cw> "there's no dog fscking in golf"? come on... Aug 22 21:17:20 they get in these niches Aug 22 21:17:39 xkcd still rocks Aug 22 21:18:32 apart from emo-tainted strips, when it doesn't :D Aug 22 21:18:37 true Aug 22 21:18:39 but yes, it's pretty decent Aug 22 21:18:53 biggest fall was megatokyo Aug 22 21:19:01 it used to be excellent, it's pure shit now Aug 22 21:20:50 it took me a while to discover the mouseover on xkcd Aug 22 21:21:03 so then i went back a few years and enjoyed the jokes again Aug 22 21:21:06 heh Aug 22 21:23:08 hmm, maybe my media scanner is being a little optimistic... Aug 22 21:23:09 stat failed: '//dev/fd/4/dev/fd/4/dev/fd/4/dev/fd/4/dev/fd/4/dev/fd/4/dev/fd/4/dev/fd/4/dev/fd/4/dev/fd/4/dev/fd/4/dev/fd/4/dev/fd/4/mnt/initfs/sys/module/usbcore/drivers/usb:usbfs/module' Aug 22 21:24:26 * lcuk changes it to scan "/home/user" and "/media" only Aug 22 21:33:06 good lord Aug 22 21:33:20 lcuk: what caused that? Aug 22 21:33:46 i started a recursive scan and it did what i asked it to :) Aug 22 21:34:38 recursing the filesystem is quick enough to identify all files in the /home and /media folders quickly on entry Aug 22 21:35:06 of course, that isnt deep information extracted from database for thumbnails or library info, but as a quick refresh its good enough for me Aug 22 21:39:34 hmm.. one could probably speed that up by storing 'last changed' date on each directory, and skipping it if it hasn't been changed since last scan Aug 22 21:41:54 night all Aug 22 21:43:06 manyoso: I can certainly try :) Aug 22 21:46:20 lpotter: i'm interested in the results too :) Aug 22 22:08:46 pupnik, im running in powersave mode and its scanning and locating all *.txt, *pdf, *.rtf from the folders i specified in under a second Aug 22 22:09:16 acha nice! Aug 22 22:21:20 Hey, I'm having a bit of trouble with the extras builder... it's just failing without reason Aug 22 22:21:26 Log: https://garage.maemo.org/builder/diablo/pyrdesktop_1.5.0-1/i386.root.log.FAILED.txt Aug 22 22:21:29 Any ideas? Aug 22 22:21:45 no but please document your progress for the rest of us Aug 22 22:22:15 Well, not going to make much progress :-P I have to leave for work in a bit Aug 22 22:22:20 TrueJournals, bad builddeps? Aug 22 22:22:37 I haven't changed them, and they've always been fine before Aug 22 22:23:00 I'm using py2deb to package Aug 22 22:23:19 I haven't upgraded it since I made the last package, which worked fine.. Aug 22 22:23:43 "Build-Depends: debhelper (>= 5)" Aug 22 22:24:49 anybody get maemopad+ to work with diablo? Aug 22 22:26:23 It doesn't just install? Aug 22 22:27:35 TrueJournals: definitely looks like broken build instructions or so :) Aug 22 22:27:48 Hm... strange Aug 22 22:27:50 GeneralAntilles: nope, I get an error Aug 22 22:28:03 TrueJournals: dpkg-checkbuilddeps: error: syntax error in control file debian/control at line 13: continued value line not in field Aug 22 22:28:20 there is an new line in the description :P Aug 22 22:28:24 Yup... Aug 22 22:28:26 jga23, OK, when you get an error and you want troubleshooting help, what's usually the next step? :) Aug 22 22:28:37 jott: I'm not allowed to do that? Aug 22 22:28:47 (I'm still pretty new to packaging :-P) Aug 22 22:28:51 no Aug 22 22:29:06 it's a delimiter Aug 22 22:29:23 (an empty line) Aug 22 22:29:47 GeneralAntilles: see if anybody has figured it out already :-) Aug 22 22:30:04 qrong Aug 22 22:30:05 jga23, no, paste the freaking error. . . . Aug 22 22:30:06 w* Aug 22 22:30:13 jott: Is there any way to get the double new line then? Or do I just have to deal with a single line break? Aug 22 22:31:02 " \n" should work Aug 22 22:31:11 OK, thanks :-D Aug 22 22:32:10 GeneralAntilles: unable to install maemopadplus, incompatible application package Aug 22 22:32:22 would using dpkg -i give me a more detailed error? Aug 22 22:32:33 jga23: dpkg -i would work Aug 22 22:32:48 The Application manager throws that error when the package isn't in section user/(...) Aug 22 22:33:02 Where'd you get the package? Aug 22 22:33:10 Shouldn't be a section issue Aug 22 22:33:14 may be a repository issue. Aug 22 22:33:22 GeneralAntilles: http://maemo.org/downloads/product/OS2008/maemopadplus/ Aug 22 22:33:34 Did you try installing from a repository? Aug 22 22:34:53 trying now Aug 22 22:36:06 hmm, not in the repo Aug 22 22:39:32 ahh, its in the chinook repo, not diablo Aug 22 22:45:02 anybody knows how to edit http://wiki.maemo.org/Codenames#Release_Table to add the SSU update? when clicking on edit, i only get "{{Release history table}}" - is this an "include" variant i didn't know yet? Aug 22 22:46:58 andre____, https://wiki.maemo.org/Template:Release_history_table Aug 22 22:47:07 {{}} always means Template: Aug 22 22:47:39 aha... Aug 22 22:48:03 thanks. there should be one and only one wiki markup language... :-) Aug 22 22:48:43 There is Aug 22 22:48:46 Mediawiki. :P Aug 22 22:52:51 fixed, thanks :) Aug 22 22:53:16 GA is the local wiki guru now >_> Aug 22 22:53:41 Doesn't take much. :P Aug 22 22:54:17 well, we just added a link to explain the versions when filing bugs in maemo bugzilla, as it's confusing. but for that that link target should be uptodate :) Aug 22 22:54:46 I updated wikipedia but never got around to updating the maemo.org wiki table. . . . Aug 22 22:54:58 yeah, i saw your changes in wikipedia :) Aug 22 23:18:24 * GeneralAntilles wants his damn Beagle. Aug 22 23:18:28 Still on backorder. :( Aug 22 23:21:30 * moontiger has finished version 0.1 of her first app :) Aug 22 23:21:58 what is it? Aug 22 23:22:06 congrats Aug 22 23:23:08 ummmmm it gets your google calendar stuff and shows it on the home screen Aug 22 23:23:42 bollocks Aug 22 23:24:12 lcuk be a lady Aug 22 23:24:16 i had to change the password on the wifi, now whenever i open network connections it locks up and freezes Aug 22 23:24:17 nice idea :) Aug 22 23:24:21 it doesnt show those yet but maybe in version 2 Aug 22 23:24:44 now i have to package it and all that yadayada Aug 22 23:25:54 theres something wrong on the connections list, does anyone know where the connections are stored? Aug 22 23:26:21 lcuk... wouldnt it be in /etc/networking/something ? Aug 22 23:26:47 i dunno - ill have a look Aug 22 23:27:15 gconf, probably. Aug 22 23:27:26 can anyone tell me the binary name for the networking control panel program Aug 22 23:27:31 ill look GeneralAntilles :) Aug 22 23:27:37 Seems like there's an UNCONFIRMED bug on something like that. . . . Aug 22 23:27:56 Might want to see recent connectivity bugs and see if it sounds like the problem you're having. Aug 22 23:28:05 its not a recent os.. Aug 22 23:28:21 Oh Aug 22 23:28:22 Right Aug 22 23:28:24 Chinook Aug 22 23:30:42 GeneralAntilles, whats the advantage of using garage.maemo.org for hosting my app? Aug 22 23:31:09 Project management Aug 22 23:31:14 svn Aug 22 23:31:21 i have svn already Aug 22 23:31:28 bug tracking Aug 22 23:31:30 libicd? Aug 22 23:31:44 andre____, what about it? Aug 22 23:31:49 hmm? Aug 22 23:31:58 moontiger, it depends a lot on the size of your application. Aug 22 23:32:05 * Stskeeps glares at maemo initfs Aug 22 23:32:15 why on earth does it have an -ancient- version of busybox Aug 22 23:32:27 GeneralAntilles, its only a home screen applet so no big thing Aug 22 23:32:30 Stskeeps, Nokia didn't feel a need to upgrade? Aug 22 23:32:36 "binary name for the networking control panel program" - not exactly, but that's the lib behind Aug 22 23:32:50 Nokia will upgrade for Fremantle Aug 22 23:33:05 yes, probably Aug 22 23:33:08 Stskeeps, Nokia doesn't tend to upgrade thinks for the sake of upgrading Aug 22 23:33:10 definitely. Aug 22 23:33:17 Big changes in the boot process are coming for Fremantle Aug 22 23:33:43 yes, everyone tends to say that, but that doesn't help until fremantle is out ;) Aug 22 23:33:48 hehe Aug 22 23:33:56 * andre____ got to get to a club... later Aug 22 23:34:45 Stskeeps, well, we say that because a Nokia engineer mentioned it in a bug recently. Aug 22 23:35:00 what's before freemantle Aug 22 23:35:04 and moaning about old versions wont change help anything, either Aug 22 23:35:07 elekt, Diablo Aug 22 23:35:13 no E? Aug 22 23:35:27 s/freemantle/Fremantle/g Aug 22 23:35:38 elekt, they dropped Elephanta Aug 22 23:35:59 must've hurt Aug 22 23:36:10 Pure speculation: Elephanta was 4.2, but it was dropped in favor of putting that effort directly into Fremantle. Aug 22 23:36:32 is it gonna be big stuff? Aug 22 23:36:34 whats fremantle going to do for us that the romas didnt? Aug 22 23:36:38 Fremantle? Huge. Aug 22 23:36:40 new gui? Aug 22 23:36:41 romans even Aug 22 23:36:58 Big UI workover Aug 22 23:37:02 aaaargha... Aug 22 23:37:04 sweet Aug 22 23:37:09 ...neeed... less... Aug 22 23:37:11 Question: if my software changed a version, how do I tell dpkg-buildpackage this ? Do I have to recreate a new directory with dh_make and everything ? Aug 22 23:37:12 i think i'm gonna skip diablo Aug 22 23:37:29 elekt, diablo is good Aug 22 23:37:30 elekt, no point in skipping Aug 22 23:37:35 Fremantle is still a ways away Aug 22 23:37:39 i don't wanna flash, it's doing so well Aug 22 23:37:44 and there's already been one update to Diablo Aug 22 23:37:47 on chinook Aug 22 23:37:50 and more will be coming before Fremantle hits. Aug 22 23:38:19 if we get some music apps that will work on diablo i'll flash in a heartbeat Aug 22 23:38:33 elekt, such as? Aug 22 23:38:37 then why not do it immediately ? Aug 22 23:38:44 I mean... If it's just a heartbeat away... Aug 22 23:38:47 music _making_ Aug 22 23:38:51 LOL Aug 22 23:38:54 apps Aug 22 23:39:01 yeah, right, you want a MIDI input with that ? Aug 22 23:39:05 hmmmmmmmm like sequencers and such? Aug 22 23:39:13 no midi Aug 22 23:39:22 sequencers yeah Aug 22 23:39:25 why cant we produce music apps? Aug 22 23:39:29 why not trackers? Aug 22 23:39:33 most need qt Aug 22 23:39:34 without midi it gets tricky Aug 22 23:39:51 milkytracker isn't very good without a kb Aug 22 23:39:52 USB adaptor Aug 22 23:39:58 well sort of crippled Aug 22 23:40:08 hmmmmmmmmm usb midi Aug 22 23:40:12 we have touchscreen - this should be childsplay Aug 22 23:40:12 yeah GA there's always a way around, but it'd be really sweet to just whip it out and make music Aug 22 23:40:31 but not multi-touch Aug 22 23:40:42 for a tracker its not important Aug 22 23:40:50 people have been laying out music for years using a mouse Aug 22 23:41:24 no need Aug 22 23:41:24 iphone apps are just gimmicks Aug 22 23:41:24 music* apps Aug 22 23:41:24 really? for making drum tracks u dont need multi-touch? Aug 22 23:41:24 i like programming more than jamming Aug 22 23:41:28 n810 technically has a keyboard Aug 22 23:41:32 i've been doing fine with one mouse pointer for 14 years Aug 22 23:42:02 I boycott this discussion Aug 22 23:42:04 i would get rather bored laying a drum pattern one drum at a time Aug 22 23:42:16 haha Aug 22 23:42:31 but point taken :) Aug 22 23:42:52 1 drum per key - the touch interface is for laying out your sequences Aug 22 23:43:33 lcuk, LMFAO Aug 22 23:43:34 the keypad only has 2 or 3 key rollover tho no? Aug 22 23:43:34 and the keypad kinda would suck for that too Aug 22 23:43:35 wasn't there a 'mmsget' program, like wget but for mms urls? Aug 22 23:44:44 hm i wonder if you can underclock a macbook pro Aug 22 23:44:52 this thing is so hot Aug 22 23:47:15 elekt, it should automatically Aug 22 23:47:27 Assuming you have the correct settings on. Aug 22 23:47:35 Or you can force it to "low" Aug 22 23:49:55 pupnik: mimms? Aug 22 23:50:24 thank youuuuu Aug 22 23:52:47 n810, diablo. email app, imap, ssl. I am unable to get it to fetch email. I use send/receive, nothing happens, no ui feedback. display remains at 0 messages Aug 22 23:52:56 I'm quite confident I have configured it correctly Aug 22 23:53:11 if I did not, I would expect some error message Aug 22 23:54:04 killall modest Aug 22 23:54:06 try again Aug 22 23:56:15 again nothing. for fun I have not entered a password in account settings. I would expect me to prompt me Aug 22 23:56:29 but when I hit the refresh button or use send/reveice from the menu, nothing happens Aug 22 23:58:44 I'll to move away .modest and start over Aug 23 00:00:20 interesting, it still created a .modest directory with my settings. where are the mail settings from the pre-diablo mail app? Aug 23 00:00:36 maybe it is migrating old settings, when I start modest without a .modest dir Aug 23 00:01:13 probabls apps/email/Mail Aug 23 00:03:15 very very confusing. I killed modest. I moved away .modest and apps. I start modest, and it still knows about my email account Aug 23 00:03:28 so maybe it's the launcher that still has the information cached Aug 23 00:03:36 let me move away and restart system Aug 23 00:04:42 has anyone of you used it successfully with a cyrus email server and imap/ssl ? Aug 23 00:04:58 i think so? Aug 23 00:05:01 i forget whether we' Aug 23 00:05:24 whether we're using cyrus still Aug 23 00:05:50 i set it up with cyrus several years back but i think the server has been upgraded since then by another maintainer... Aug 23 00:06:07 lemmie connect with telnet and see if it gives me version info Aug 23 00:06:45 imap is... 443? Aug 23 00:06:50 143 Aug 23 00:06:55 imap/starttls is 143 Aug 23 00:06:57 imap/ssl is 993 Aug 23 00:07:01 ah 143 Aug 23 00:07:20 hrm Aug 23 00:07:23 ah Aug 23 00:07:24 weird, even after the restart it still knew about my account. time for a find|grep Aug 23 00:07:29 * OK [CAPABILITY IMAP4rev1 UIDPLUS CHILDREN NAMESPACE THREAD=ORDEREDSUBJECT THREAD=REFERENCES SORT QUOTA AUTH=CRAM-MD5 AUTH=CRAM-SHA1 IDLE ACL ACL2=UNION STARTTLS] Courier-IMAP ready. Copyright 1998-2005 Double Precision, Inc. See COPYING for distribution information. Aug 23 00:07:34 Courier-IMAP <_< Aug 23 00:07:38 ok Aug 23 00:07:39 so, not sure about cyrus Aug 23 00:07:59 not sure why it would be especially different if it follows the spec... Aug 23 00:09:10 that said... yeah. i've seen those kind of random compatability issues before <_< Aug 23 00:09:22 lol, how can I investigate why the .desktop/.service file doesn't work ? Aug 23 00:09:35 (as in, the icon appears in the menu, but upon launch, nothing happens) Aug 23 00:12:41 now now kids, don't be shy, you can answer Aug 23 00:12:53 log 2 file Aug 23 00:13:05 oh Aug 23 00:13:05 or error stream Aug 23 00:13:06 never mind Aug 23 00:13:08 I'm an idiot Aug 23 00:13:44 that too Aug 23 00:13:55 just do it right, simple as that :D Aug 23 00:13:58 * rm_you watches crashanddie crashandburn Aug 23 00:14:19 GeneralAntilles: referred users +1 Aug 23 00:14:23 got one more :P Aug 23 00:14:25 cloudreader 1.0.3-1 REJECTED Aug 23 00:14:26 :'( Aug 23 00:14:28 still not close to your total tho Aug 23 00:15:10 hopefully he'll stop by IRC later, maybe tomorrow Aug 23 00:15:13 lol Aug 23 00:15:26 I got two more while you were sleeping. :P Aug 23 00:15:29 pfft Aug 23 00:15:31 bastard Aug 23 00:15:51 8, now, I think. Aug 23 00:16:03 >_< Aug 23 00:16:07 sorry, but diablo doesn't do anything for me. not with a good config, not with a fake config. never any prompts Aug 23 00:16:08 I only have 2 Aug 23 00:16:10 bah Aug 23 00:16:12 wait Aug 23 00:16:14 3 Aug 23 00:16:19 crashanddie: shall i upload it to extras for you? Aug 23 00:17:03 jott, nha that's fine, I'll wait Aug 23 00:17:09 GeneralAntilles: you must just know people with way too much money :P Aug 23 00:17:23 i can usually nearly convince people to get one, but all my friends are poor <_< Aug 23 00:18:02 if they weren't all poor, i'd be at like 10 Aug 23 00:27:06 http://undercity.doesntexist.com/~crashanddie/cloudreader_1.0.3-1_armel.deb Aug 23 00:27:10 for those who want to try Aug 23 00:27:36 should work pretty decently Aug 23 00:28:26 theres no way to get mobipocket books on the IT is there? Aug 23 00:29:30 crashanddie: what does it do? Aug 23 00:30:21 pupnik, it's a new take on RSS readers :) Aug 23 00:30:34 rm_you, they're half students. :P Aug 23 00:30:41 lol Aug 23 00:30:44 A couple buying them in lieu of laptops for school. Aug 23 00:30:50 nifty... will wget Aug 23 00:31:07 Any feedback is welcome Aug 23 00:31:09 jga23, FBReader does mobipocket without DRM just fine. Aug 23 00:31:50 jott, thanks for asking though, but I feel better, now I have an error message :D Aug 23 00:32:27 crashanddie: hm i would not show this "Loading..." screen, otherwise a funny way to read feeds :) Aug 23 00:32:58 why no loading screen ? Aug 23 00:33:04 it would probably look better when you blend between the screens Aug 23 00:33:07 That's exactly what it's doing, no ? Aug 23 00:33:16 can i remove all stored connections from the command line? Aug 23 00:33:19 but it's distracting :) Aug 23 00:33:32 jott, there's a reason why the loading screen is there, it takes time to process Aug 23 00:33:47 better make a progressbar at the bottom of the screen Aug 23 00:33:52 heh Aug 23 00:33:58 I wanted an easy solution Aug 23 00:34:00 and then fade over to the result Aug 23 00:35:20 what's thvdeb url again? Aug 23 00:35:28 [DISCLAIMER] This project is obviously based upon blatantly copied ideas from liqbase :P Aug 23 00:35:33 deb Aug 23 00:35:44 crashanddie: and i suppose it is not loading while the "loading..." fades in and out :) Aug 23 00:36:06 the fading takes one second :P Aug 23 00:36:12 yep Aug 23 00:36:18 * lcuk pulls hair out Aug 23 00:36:25 lcuk, what's the problem ? Aug 23 00:36:29 * rm_you helps lcuk with his hair Aug 23 00:36:47 tracy asked me to get laptop setup to play movies - i couldnt remember my wifi password so i changed it, now all hell has broke loose and i cant get my nokia connected Aug 23 00:36:51 * jott hands lcuk a toupee Aug 23 00:37:02 it crashes everytime i open the connections dialog Aug 23 00:37:02 http://undercity.doesntexist.com/~crashanddie/cloudreader_1.0.3-1_armel.deb Aug 23 00:37:27 jott, thats a merkin, and its used - i ain't wearin that Aug 23 00:37:53 crashanddie: but really make a progressbar and fade to the result, that would most definitely increase the appeal :) Aug 23 00:38:29 jott, I'll think it over Aug 23 00:38:29 lcuk: hey it's an original fetish item worth a million! :P Aug 23 00:38:53 i have managed to create a new network connection item by connecting to a new network - it did that fine, theres a problem with one of the old stored items. i need to delete the stored network connections Aug 23 00:39:02 lol jott Aug 23 00:39:41 jott, though, the appeal of the loading screen, for me, is that I just display it, process what needs to be processed, and then jump on that. I don't draw a single frame in between. Drawing stuff during processing is going to need me rethinking the whole process :P Aug 23 00:40:28 crashanddie: yeah, yeah, i understand, it's an ugly hack :P Aug 23 00:40:34 jott, he accepts patches ;) Aug 23 00:40:43 binary patches? :P Aug 23 00:41:18 is there any way for me to get this network cleared out Aug 23 00:41:26 or am i looking at a massive reflash :( Aug 23 00:41:36 closed (unavailable) source software makes baby jesus cry Aug 23 00:42:10 every time you close the source to an application, god kills a kitten Aug 23 00:42:40 http://undercity.doesntexist.com/~crashanddie/cloudreader_1.0.3-1.tar.gz Aug 23 00:42:49 stop whining, bitches Aug 23 00:43:11 every time you open the source to an application, god resurrects two kittens as cute cuddly zombie kittens :P Aug 23 00:43:29 the source has never been closed Aug 23 00:43:47 i put "unavailable" in parens :P Aug 23 00:43:55 it's even shared with all the user accounts on this laptop, and on the server Aug 23 00:44:55 * lcuk is glad its not him being shouted at any more Aug 23 00:45:06 plus, are you both implying jott isn't good enough to apply binary patches? Aug 23 00:45:14 Oh well, doesn't surprise me that much, really Aug 23 00:45:56 jott routines codes directly in binary, wearing only underpants and a cape he battles the 0 and 1s in a matrix world Aug 23 00:46:18 * jott remembers the good old times of turbo debugger and softice :) Aug 23 00:46:49 grargh Aug 23 00:46:56 working 40 hours in 4 days <_< Aug 23 00:47:14 One of my teachers one told me: "I don't get all these guys always yelling at me for not distributing the source code; but I don't *have* source code. I just cat | gcc" Aug 23 00:47:19 s/one/once Aug 23 00:47:59 jott, I remember the days of softice too... Aug 23 00:48:47 good old dos :) Aug 23 00:49:45 Hey ! People ! Aug 23 00:49:56 This is my first contribution to maemo ! Aug 23 00:50:01 woo! Aug 23 00:50:27 * jott opens a bottle champagne Aug 23 00:50:35 * crashanddie dances Aug 23 00:51:25 join us now and shaaaare the software, you'll be free haaackers youuuu'll be freeee :P Aug 23 00:51:49 Hey Aug 23 00:52:11 It's my first Maemo contribution, but I'm no OSS virgin, bitch :P Aug 23 00:52:35 I declare that modest on diablo is broken. I flashed the n810, did not restore any backups, thus have a clean device. wireless works, but no email activity at all Aug 23 00:52:37 php does not count :P Aug 23 00:52:38 * jott hides Aug 23 00:52:53 kaie, it works, djeezus Aug 23 00:53:18 crashanddie, what is your mail config? pop/imap, plain/tls/ssl ? Aug 23 00:53:28 I try imap/ssl Aug 23 00:53:28 works here, but i would not call it stable. Aug 23 00:53:37 imap/ssl here Aug 23 00:53:39 kaie, gmail, whatever that might be Aug 23 00:54:13 I'm evil, I know Aug 23 00:54:15 http://mintirc.net/quotes/index.cgi?id=802 Aug 23 00:56:30 I know, I'm going to hell for that joke Aug 23 00:56:40 But whatever, I'm going to know people there Aug 23 00:57:37 kaie, did you try killall modest ? Aug 23 00:58:02 GeneralAntilles, I have flashed the device Aug 23 00:58:13 That doesn't answer my question. Aug 23 00:58:19 Yeah, but modest is persistent Aug 23 00:58:21 yes I had killed it Aug 23 00:58:30 It survives reboots and flashes Aug 23 00:59:03 GeneralAntilles, when I quit the app, ps no longer shows a modest process Aug 23 00:59:09 and I killed it in addition Aug 23 00:59:51 killall modest, no process killed Aug 23 01:00:09 start mail, try to fetch mail, it doesn't even attempt to contact my server Aug 23 01:00:18 no prompt, no ui progress status, just nothing Aug 23 01:00:27 tools/accounts, last update remains at "never" Aug 23 01:00:34 same with password stored in accounts, or empty Aug 23 01:00:43 kaie: maybe use tcpdump to see if any traffic is generated. Aug 23 01:02:17 does backup backup the whole of My Docs? Aug 23 01:03:11 jott, I run my own mail server, and shut down my desktop mail app. I started tcpdump. I made a telnet to test that tcpdump works Aug 23 01:03:26 then I start modest and try to fetch mail. no packes arrive at my server Aug 23 01:06:17 hm, well. ltrace/strace modest? :) Aug 23 01:07:03 kaie, reboot your device Aug 23 01:07:36 kaie, could something else be holding the port Aug 23 01:07:46 kaie, then check with tcpdump at startup of modest Aug 23 01:07:48 crashanddie, this was the initial attempt after flashing Aug 23 01:08:03 nothing else could have disturbed the connection Aug 23 01:08:51 I shall restore my backup, so I don't have to do all the manual setup on this naked device Aug 23 01:10:36 I don't know what would hold up the port, unless there is some firewall enabled on the n810 after flashing... Aug 23 01:10:58 lol... Aug 23 01:11:01 A firewall Aug 23 01:12:28 is the rest of the network connection ok Aug 23 01:13:23 whichever way, im off 2 bed, reflashing tomrrow Aug 23 01:13:24 absolutely Aug 23 01:18:30 crashanddie, what app you finished? Aug 23 01:25:20 hi all Aug 23 01:25:34 Hello. Aug 23 01:36:32 moontiger, cloudreader Aug 23 01:36:44 http://undercity.doesntexist.com/~crashanddie/cloudreader_1.0.3-1_armel.deb Aug 23 01:36:49 oooooooo sounds cool ... wassit? Aug 23 01:41:31 it doesnt install :| Aug 23 01:43:23 need libs Aug 23 01:44:27 after restoring the backup, installing all apps, installing tcpdump, modest does not send any tcp packets to my mail server, on no port Aug 23 01:44:44 while when I use the browser to open a page on the same hostname, I get packets Aug 23 01:45:48 moontiger & elekt: apt-get install wget libxml++2.6c2a libsdl-ttf2.0-0 Aug 23 01:46:22 kaie, i cant stand modest either :) Aug 23 01:46:43 so, with a new test, I've now been able to see at least some progress Aug 23 01:46:47 I tried to send an email Aug 23 01:47:21 I see the email in the outbox, and it showed "sending". after some seconds it has changed to "failed". no packages to hostname whatsoeer Aug 23 01:48:03 kaie, my usual arrogant self would tell you you fucked up the config at some point Aug 23 01:48:29 crashanddie, how could I have done that, if I get the same results after a fresh flash of the device? Aug 23 01:48:40 that's exactly what my point is Aug 23 01:48:50 doesn't the flash remove everything in /home/user ? Aug 23 01:49:00 ok Aug 23 01:49:03 let me rephrase that Aug 23 01:49:54 You fucked up the settings in modest, get a grip, change them, play with them. Find a connection that does work, and stop trying on your server, go from working -> non working, and note the differences and thus possible problems Aug 23 01:50:03 but moaning and whining about it for 3 hours straight isn't going to solve it Aug 23 01:50:26 Obviously, we don't know the answer, or we would've tried to help you, but frankly, our guess is as good as yours. So wrap it up, and start doing something useful Aug 23 01:51:23 please tell me, is my assumption true, that after using ./flash-3.0 diablo the device is completely clean, and only has the factory files Aug 23 01:51:27 and nothing from me Aug 23 01:51:55 as long as you don't run the restore-backup tool, it should be clean, yes Aug 23 01:51:59 I mean, /home/user and file system is completely clean. only some files on the internal memory card Aug 23 01:52:01 good Aug 23 01:52:16 then it's impossible that I could have fucked up anything Aug 23 01:52:25 how is that ? Aug 23 01:52:38 I mean, you're obviously feeding something to modest, right ? Aug 23 01:52:46 It doesn't get its parameters for the connection out of thin air ? Aug 23 01:53:09 I know some of us coders are good, but still, even virgin marry couldn't pull that one Aug 23 01:53:23 yes, I'm entering them manually, I'm a developer, I understand mail protocols, I'm absolutely sure that I'm entering the settings correctly Aug 23 01:54:03 I don't care if you're a dev, if you understand mail prots or if you fiddle with the NASA shuttle Aug 23 01:54:19 I haven't fucked it up, but we can agree that modest simply does not work in my ocnfiguration Aug 23 01:54:21 kaie, do you have a GMail account ? Aug 23 01:54:23 whatever the cause is Aug 23 01:55:08 crashanddie, yes Aug 23 01:55:25 try to connect to it Aug 23 01:58:11 kaie, yes, it is very possible Modest is borked in a way it can't connect to your specific connection settings (especially if they're very specific). But repeating it over and over isn't going to help. I'm sure you can understand that. Aug 23 01:58:44 :D Aug 23 01:58:47 gmail working? Aug 23 01:58:57 GMail works fine here Aug 23 02:01:03 gmail imap doesn't work either. ok, I tried to dump all but port 22. I now see that it tries to use dns, but it seems it never gets a response Aug 23 02:01:06 what kind of gpg key do i need to generate for packaging?? Aug 23 02:01:12 which is weird, because the n810 browser succeeds Aug 23 02:01:32 kaie, where are you located? Aug 23 02:01:38 let me try to use some other dns server, rather than the one my home router provides Aug 23 02:01:49 home, dsl, nat Aug 23 02:03:22 germany, t-online Aug 23 02:04:20 kaie, are you sure you have a good image you are flashing from? Aug 23 02:04:32 moontiger, yes, absolutely, checksum verified Aug 23 02:04:45 sorry to ask dumb questions but you never know Aug 23 02:04:51 so, after I changed the dns server of the wireless connection, it immediately works with gmail Aug 23 02:05:17 I conclude my home router dns server is incompatible with modest's connection attempts, but compatible with the rest of the n810 Aug 23 02:05:21 so ur router dns server doesnt like the n810 Aug 23 02:06:16 crashanddie, can you tell me what kind of pgp / gpg key i need to generate for uploading to extras? Aug 23 02:08:09 kaie, my usual arrogant self would conclude something else Aug 23 02:09:59 moontiger, RSA Aug 23 02:10:07 ok cool Aug 23 02:10:49 moontiger, oh wait Aug 23 02:10:56 moontiger, the SSH key needs to be RSA Aug 23 02:11:16 moontiger, I think the PGP key isn't important, i'd pick the one you can do everything with Aug 23 02:11:27 im so confused with all this :| Aug 23 02:11:40 i have an ssh key and an rsa pgp key now Aug 23 02:11:44 hope thats enough Aug 23 02:11:55 you got a garage invitation ? Aug 23 02:13:56 and with that dns changed, the connection to my own server works, too Aug 23 02:14:34 kaie, happy you got it to work Aug 23 02:15:27 crashanddie, what a dogs dinner of a website that is!! there is no "ssh keys" section Aug 23 02:15:40 think i'll just host on my own server and be done with it Aug 23 02:15:50 moontiger, please, don't Aug 23 02:16:27 are there any docs that actually are correct?? Aug 23 02:16:30 moontiger, https://garage.maemo.org/account/index2.php Aug 23 02:16:44 moontiger, you can add your (public) SSH key there Aug 23 02:17:16 errrrrrrr where?? i dont see it Aug 23 02:19:13 oh wait ... i havent had the invite back yet ... cant even upload keys without that ... great Aug 23 02:19:17 *sighs* Aug 23 02:24:30 the key submission page needs EXAMPLES Aug 23 02:24:36 so you at least know the format to put Aug 23 02:24:47 I tried and failed to submit my keys like 15 times Aug 23 02:25:04 had to get at least one extra invite from actually getting it to succeed with incorrect input Aug 23 02:25:15 it's like a random guessing game figuring out what to put in those boxes Aug 23 02:26:14 yah it really needs some work ... or people wont use it Aug 23 02:27:22 i mean if developers cant work out how to use a web site something needs to be made a little clearer no? Aug 23 02:27:54 once i work it out i dont mind helping write better pages to explain it Aug 23 02:33:02 Hello Aug 23 02:35:14 how long does the invite take? i feel like im waiting for godot :| Aug 23 02:35:40 Without X-Fade around? Aug 23 02:35:45 Longer than usual. Aug 23 02:36:05 rm_you, feel free to improve: Aug 23 02:36:09 ~uploading-extras Aug 23 02:36:13 ~extras-upload Aug 23 02:36:26 ~upload-extras Aug 23 02:36:27 [upload-extras] http://wiki.maemo.org/Uploading_to_Extras Aug 23 02:36:30 Hehe Aug 23 02:36:35 I will remember one of these days! Aug 23 02:36:59 how can I improve it? I *STILL* don't understand exactly what is supposed to go in those fields Aug 23 02:37:19 X-Fade or someone who knows what is going on needs to just post some sample formatting data Aug 23 02:37:19 improve what ? Aug 23 02:37:46 what fields ? Lol Aug 23 02:39:10 anyway, almost 4AM Aug 23 02:39:12 I'm out Aug 23 02:39:13 cheers Aug 23 02:42:54 maemo ♥ one of my favorite channels. How are you guys? Aug 23 02:50:47 GeneralAntilles, when will xfade be unfading? Aug 23 02:51:54 hi emma, fine, you? Aug 23 02:53:50 cool :) **** ENDING LOGGING AT Sat Aug 23 02:59:57 2008