**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Fri Sep 26 02:59:56 2008 Sep 26 03:00:12 it looks um Sep 26 03:00:13 strange Sep 26 03:00:13 lol Sep 26 03:00:57 that took alot of tinkering Sep 26 03:00:57 heh Sep 26 03:06:29 ugh Sep 26 03:06:39 didn't take long? Sep 26 03:06:39 GeneralAntilles: how did you get fennec working at all? Sep 26 03:06:40 :> Sep 26 03:06:59 Just install it Sep 26 03:07:05 but, seriously, it's not worth the trouble right now. Sep 26 03:07:14 it wont run Sep 26 03:07:20 xulrunner is broken >.< Sep 26 03:07:48 i can do fennec in terminal and it'll run Sep 26 03:07:50 but its screwey Sep 26 03:08:04 the tabs form an L shape in the top left Sep 26 03:18:46 hmm Sep 26 03:18:49 how do i use openssh xD Sep 26 03:19:01 ... Sep 26 03:19:14 ssh user@host Sep 26 03:19:21 mmk Sep 26 03:19:29 host = ip user=? Sep 26 03:19:35 ip or domain Sep 26 03:19:43 user is a user you want to log as Sep 26 03:19:48 root, user, jaredu Sep 26 03:19:59 whatever is in /etc/passwd and enabled to login Sep 26 03:22:15 hmm Sep 26 03:22:17 connection refused Sep 26 03:22:18 heh Sep 26 03:22:40 have you installed openssh after reflash? Sep 26 03:23:01 yes Sep 26 03:23:09 ps ax|grep sshd Sep 26 03:23:17 though; xulrunner is on here again after trying to install fennec x..x Sep 26 03:23:22 sec Sep 26 03:24:52 i cant find the stupid | key on the tablet O_O Sep 26 03:25:06 chr ? Sep 26 03:25:20 yu Sep 26 03:25:23 ty Sep 26 03:25:43 ok Sep 26 03:26:11 1933 root 3180 swn /usr/sbin/sshd 2577 user 1888 RTW grep sshd Sep 26 03:26:16 RW* Sep 26 03:26:18 then it's running Sep 26 03:26:28 check the ip Sep 26 03:26:29 :) Sep 26 03:26:55 problem is my windows machine lol Sep 26 03:30:36 ughh Sep 26 03:30:42 /does not get it Sep 26 03:30:51 get what? Sep 26 03:31:07 vnc server properties Sep 26 03:31:12 or anything on this windows crap Sep 26 03:31:17 well Sep 26 03:31:20 on linux it's so freaking easy Sep 26 03:31:29 just leave on defaults Sep 26 03:31:30 then Sep 26 03:31:32 :) Sep 26 03:31:36 i have to set a port and crap Sep 26 03:31:42 its over wifi so i have a specific ip Sep 26 03:31:51 like 127.0.0.11 or something Sep 26 03:32:03 127.0.0.1 is localhost Sep 26 03:32:06 virtual network Sep 26 03:32:20 ok Sep 26 03:32:29 so say im trying to login to that from my tablet or viceversa Sep 26 03:33:00 use normal ip Sep 26 03:33:06 that is on the interface Sep 26 03:33:13 usually 192.168.something Sep 26 03:33:14 hmm Sep 26 03:33:16 connection refused Sep 26 03:33:20 may be router settings Sep 26 03:33:22 sec Sep 26 03:33:28 unlikely Sep 26 03:33:35 most probably wrong machine Sep 26 03:33:36 :) Sep 26 03:34:00 Connection refused means there's no sshd running on whatever machine you're trying to connect to. Sep 26 03:34:39 ok Sep 26 03:34:44 so how do i do that o.O Sep 26 03:34:53 in windows: ipconfig Sep 26 03:34:58 should print your ip Sep 26 03:34:59 :) Sep 26 03:35:08 in linux: ifconfig Sep 26 03:36:15 |> In Common Fabrics - Electric Universe (PsyShow 1) Sep 26 03:36:43 i have my ip Sep 26 03:36:45 70.113.61.211 Sep 26 03:36:50 that's public ip Sep 26 03:36:53 yes Sep 26 03:37:00 probably router's one Sep 26 03:37:05 nope Sep 26 03:37:08 www.whatismyip.com Sep 26 03:37:11 ... Sep 26 03:37:15 heh Sep 26 03:37:15 trust me Sep 26 03:37:21 im going to have to be able to do this from school as well Sep 26 03:37:25 it's ip that will router respond Sep 26 03:37:27 so i need the public setup Sep 26 03:37:33 ah, well Sep 26 03:37:38 so you need port forwrding then Sep 26 03:38:19 i have that Sep 26 03:38:30 it's setup for my torrents so i know the port as well Sep 26 03:38:48 yes, but do you also forward vnc/ssh/whatever you want? Sep 26 03:38:58 hmm? Sep 26 03:39:08 i simply set the vnc ports to the same forwarded ports im already using Sep 26 03:39:12 32xxxx Sep 26 03:39:17 k Sep 26 03:40:27 http://darisa.files.wordpress.com/2007/06/guillotine-toilet.jpg Sep 26 03:40:33 windows makes me want to go there. Sep 26 03:40:40 won't work Sep 26 03:40:50 too high Sep 26 03:40:58 you'd be suprised ;) Sep 26 03:40:59 and too close to the wall Sep 26 03:41:11 anyway Sep 26 03:41:17 anyway, breakfast time Sep 26 03:41:17 back to vnc crap Sep 26 03:43:32 hmm Sep 26 03:43:52 i tried the ip and then the port number like xx.xxx.xx.xx:32xxx Sep 26 03:43:53 didnt work >.< Sep 26 03:44:07 you can't try it from inside your network Sep 26 03:44:18 ah Sep 26 03:44:26 what port it is? Sep 26 03:44:26 would i have to do local then? Sep 26 03:44:29 32459 Sep 26 03:44:39 what password? Sep 26 03:44:44 sec Sep 26 03:44:56 testalpha Sep 26 03:44:58 ==pass Sep 26 03:45:04 ok Sep 26 03:45:05 works Sep 26 03:45:17 hmm? Sep 26 03:45:25 how so o.O Sep 26 03:45:28 i just logged to your vnc Sep 26 03:45:30 :) Sep 26 03:45:32 heh Sep 26 03:45:33 change the pass Sep 26 03:45:37 see the desktop? Sep 26 03:45:42 yeah Sep 26 03:45:44 hmm Sep 26 03:45:47 but closed it already Sep 26 03:45:53 also it's slow Sep 26 03:45:57 odd, linux prompts me :P Sep 26 03:46:00 remove the wallpaper Sep 26 03:46:04 heh Sep 26 03:46:38 and try tightvnc Sep 26 03:46:46 ah Sep 26 03:46:46 sec Sep 26 03:46:47 should give jpeg compression Sep 26 03:47:02 which looks ugly, but is very good for slow links Sep 26 03:47:03 :) Sep 26 03:47:23 and yes, locally you have to use local ips Sep 26 03:47:35 :P Sep 26 03:47:47 mmk then... lesee.. Sep 26 03:47:54 on the tablet, how would i start the server? Sep 26 03:48:01 so i can view it on my desktop Sep 26 03:48:03 don't know Sep 26 03:48:06 :) Sep 26 03:48:10 ah Sep 26 03:48:20 i think there is only client for nit Sep 26 03:48:31 nope Sep 26 03:48:34 it might have changed since i last checked Sep 26 03:48:39 openssh openssh client openssh server Sep 26 03:48:43 i got all installed :D Sep 26 03:48:46 vnc != ssh Sep 26 03:48:52 gah Sep 26 03:48:57 difference being? Sep 26 03:49:04 ssh is text based Sep 26 03:49:10 ah crap Sep 26 03:49:13 any vnc's for nit? Sep 26 03:49:18 but more powerfull Sep 26 03:49:44 this could be why it wasnt working Sep 26 03:49:45 heh Sep 26 03:49:49 :) Sep 26 03:50:10 rdesktop eh? Sep 26 03:50:14 lesee.. Sep 26 03:50:16 windowsissh Sep 26 03:50:22 and also only client Sep 26 03:50:22 rdesktop is just a client Sep 26 03:50:22 ? Sep 26 03:50:31 hmm Sep 26 03:50:32 meaning Sep 26 03:50:46 meaning you can view m$ desktop on nit Sep 26 03:50:49 but not other way Sep 26 03:50:52 ah Sep 26 03:50:55 can i edit? Sep 26 03:50:58 edit what? Sep 26 03:51:00 like drag file etc Sep 26 03:51:05 upload to site or w/e Sep 26 03:51:09 basic things Sep 26 03:51:17 same as in vnc Sep 26 03:51:20 kk Sep 26 03:51:24 ie. virtual monitor Sep 26 03:51:28 k Sep 26 03:51:32 you can do anything you can on usual one Sep 26 03:51:40 so long as the tablet can see the pc, i dont care about viceversa Sep 26 03:51:48 yes Sep 26 03:51:55 then just run vnc client on nit Sep 26 03:52:03 and give it windoze ip Sep 26 03:52:16 local when in home Sep 26 03:52:22 and public when in school Sep 26 04:19:25 boo. Sep 26 04:19:31 bliny. Sep 26 04:19:34 mmm Sep 26 04:20:31 hey kotCzarny or RST38h are you good with python by anychance? Sep 26 04:20:40 * KotCzarny not Sep 26 04:21:03 i prefer cats to reptilians Sep 26 04:21:44 nope Sep 26 04:22:13 morning Sep 26 04:24:04 "...urgent warnings from the president and pleas from a Treasury secretary who knelt before the House speaker and appealed for her support." Sep 26 04:24:33 He *knelt*. That's how you know things are fucked up in the XXI century Sep 26 04:25:53 If money isnt loosened up, this sucker could go down, President Bush declared Thursday as he watched the $700 billion bailout package fall apart before his eyes, according to one person in the room. Sep 26 04:30:47 O.o Sep 26 04:30:54 rst38h: link? Sep 26 04:33:26 nvm, googled it Sep 26 04:33:39 anybody has any idea when/if lightmediascanner with ogg support will be out? it's been 2 months since I got my n800 and still no dice =/ Sep 26 04:34:09 greg, recompile/hack yourself? Sep 26 04:34:17 then submit a patch :) Sep 26 04:34:36 it'd love to, but it's out of my league atm Sep 26 04:34:42 hrm Sep 26 04:34:47 copypaste mp3 sections? Sep 26 04:35:11 I think somebody would've already done it if it were so easy Sep 26 04:36:08 i think all are just being lazy Sep 26 04:36:10 ;) Sep 26 04:39:13 I hope canola beta 10 includes ogg support Sep 26 04:39:24 i just use mplayer Sep 26 04:39:24 I don't think anyone's being lazy, to be honest Sep 26 04:39:35 and my playfilelist ncurses ui Sep 26 04:39:35 :) Sep 26 04:39:56 ncurses? too hacky for me :) Sep 26 04:40:11 but more versatile Sep 26 04:40:12 :) Sep 26 04:42:31 ncurse has its roll but I usually feel it is a dev being lazy if they use it Sep 26 04:42:41 :) Sep 26 04:42:52 i like ncurses because then i can use app over ssh Sep 26 04:42:54 and on screen Sep 26 04:43:10 it's not so trivial with graphical uis Sep 26 04:43:18 that are more shiny, but less usefull Sep 26 04:43:35 so don't underestimate text mode Sep 26 04:44:05 haha Sep 26 04:44:08 KotCzarny: http://www.nytimes.com/2008/09/26/business/26bailout.html?ref=politics Sep 26 04:45:11 ahh I cannot get os.execvp to work Sep 26 04:57:19 hey guys I need your help with a python script I am running. have a background python script running from init.d. The script takes in parameters and then executes a commandline program. System is debian based. I would like the program to launch the second program in its own environment. As it a completely seperate process. I am using os.execvp but i keep getting errors. command is as follows... os.execvp( 'sudo', 'sudo', 'program', Sep 26 04:57:19 '-s', '-f', 'config.file') is that the correct format? I am getting all sorts of errors...also would you recommend using a different api instead of os.execvp? I have read the doc's and call popen don't seem to fit the bill. Sep 26 04:58:31 * KotCzarny is not python proficient Sep 26 05:04:36 aww raspberries trolling the doc's so more it is Sep 26 05:04:41 fuck deadlines! Sep 26 05:05:02 raspberries? Sep 26 05:07:15 from the simpsons...like cussing but no so much Sep 26 05:07:28 :-) Sep 26 05:07:36 hrm Sep 26 05:07:37 :) Sep 26 05:14:56 RST38h, VGBA feels much snappier Sep 26 05:15:02 but the upscaling is kinda ugly. Sep 26 05:15:06 when did they update it? Sep 26 05:15:16 A few hours ago. Sep 26 05:15:18 ah Sep 26 05:15:19 nice Sep 26 05:15:21 i will have to try Sep 26 05:15:26 it was terrible a few days ago O_O Sep 26 05:15:34 sound was super choppy :P Sep 26 05:16:57 maybe your nokia is slower than other? :P Sep 26 05:17:03 *others Sep 26 05:17:16 heh Sep 26 05:17:21 just kidding Sep 26 05:17:24 :P Sep 26 05:20:07 * bef0rd updates vgba Sep 26 05:20:55 wow Sep 26 05:20:58 im super impressed Sep 26 05:21:09 like 93% speed Sep 26 05:24:32 night all Sep 26 05:24:55 i love the creator of vgba now :D Sep 26 05:31:03 anyone know of any snes emus that work decently for n810? Sep 26 06:27:02 tekojo, how close are we to the new servers? Sep 26 06:32:13 The pages are served from there Sep 26 06:32:22 But not downloads, planet and wiki :-( Sep 26 06:35:20 Actually when I compare the load speeds, ssl seems to be the biggest factor slowing the system Sep 26 06:40:22 tekojo: SSL is a slowdown factor? How so? What processor are you using? Sep 26 06:40:36 oh, sorry Sep 26 06:40:42 I thought this was another channel O:-) Sep 26 06:41:27 No problem Sep 26 07:33:40 morning all Sep 26 07:39:21 hello Sep 26 07:39:46 how can i develop gps program inside scratchbox, i mean how can i get some fake gps signal? Sep 26 07:42:48 morning Sep 26 07:43:03 samppa: connect gps to you box? Sep 26 07:43:32 is it easily done? Sep 26 07:44:17 samppa: remember one simple thing - scratchbox is NOT emulator Sep 26 07:44:38 it is just sick tool to build software in crazy way Sep 26 07:44:45 indeed :) Sep 26 07:46:05 but if i dont have gps, but i still want to do gps software, is there some fakegps to provide gps data ? Sep 26 07:47:04 no idea Sep 26 07:47:49 Morning, all Sep 26 07:48:13 Morning. Sep 26 07:48:40 morning Sep 26 07:57:01 hi all Sep 26 08:07:35 ehlo to whoever entered Sep 26 08:10:07 blah, it seems that there's no maemo-mapper for Diablo... Sep 26 08:10:18 mm? Sep 26 08:10:24 AStorm, isn't it in extras or extras-devel? Sep 26 08:10:31 in neither Sep 26 08:10:54 * RST38h did install it from somewhere Sep 26 08:10:56 and to be extra sure, I did a search in redpill Sep 26 08:11:06 and the chinook version doesn't work? Sep 26 08:11:09 yeah, I guess chinook install file will work Sep 26 08:11:17 but then, PEOPLE, fix the repos! Sep 26 08:11:36 http://ageofikon.info/packrat/index.php?Action=list&System=OS2008&Arg=maemo-mapper&Section=&Repo=0 Sep 26 08:11:40 gnuite made a mistake with the diablo upload. It will be fixed soon, I guess. Sep 26 08:11:55 gah Sep 26 08:11:58 bugs ;P Sep 26 08:12:03 what a release Sep 26 08:12:15 and I thought I waited long enough Sep 26 08:12:59 funny part is that topomaps are in Sep 26 08:13:04 but not mapper Sep 26 08:14:31 there are topographic maps for the mapper? Sep 26 08:15:29 finland, yes Sep 26 08:15:39 not important for me, obviously Sep 26 08:15:55 "unable to download, package not found" Sep 26 08:15:59 * AStorm screams blood Sep 26 08:16:11 you *tricked* me into installing broken diablo Sep 26 08:16:31 I'd probably have to add chinook repos Sep 26 08:16:46 but that will most likely break the system Sep 26 08:17:24 AStorm, it shouldn't Sep 26 08:17:31 and for maemo mapper just grab the .debs for now Sep 26 08:17:50 from where? gnuiite's site? Sep 26 08:17:58 another q: maemopad+ Sep 26 08:18:09 first result for maemo mapper is the garage page Sep 26 08:18:41 which has .install files and older versions? :P Sep 26 08:19:06 it'll work for now to tide you over :P Sep 26 08:20:13 hmm, is there already that nice hacked version available? (with more efficient map storage) Sep 26 08:33:25 * bongo will start a new money box for the next tablet :D Sep 26 08:34:00 * keesj simply will try not to buy a iphone Sep 26 08:34:48 i don't like the iphone ;) Sep 26 08:35:12 hmm, it seems that my new Samsung U700 looks over USB like a standard AT modem in one mode Sep 26 08:35:25 but then, I couldn't connect to it with gnokii over BT Sep 26 08:35:33 because it doesn't recognize it Sep 26 08:35:35 blah Sep 26 08:47:56 AStorm: you have u700? Sep 26 08:48:21 gnokii.... no comments Sep 26 08:48:31 hrw: sure, I do Sep 26 08:48:42 phonelink uses gnokii, so, yes comments Sep 26 08:48:45 AStorm: satisfied? Sep 26 08:48:54 no idea yet, too new Sep 26 08:49:04 there are pyqt4 packeges now. do pyqt4 apps work with internal input methods? Sep 26 08:49:18 battery seems fairly ok, but I can't test with HSDPA yet, due to lack of plan Sep 26 08:49:31 AStorm: gnokii does not support nearly nothing other then nokias. gammu has wider support for phones but phonelink would need to be changed Sep 26 08:49:34 connects fine though over DUN Sep 26 08:49:52 AStorm: does screen on standby works as a mirror? Sep 26 08:50:06 yes Sep 26 08:50:10 cool Sep 26 08:50:23 not cool, because it kind of works as mirror not in standby Sep 26 08:50:25 ;P Sep 26 08:50:31 so I will probably suggest u700 instead of lg shine for my wife Sep 26 08:50:36 reflects clouds Sep 26 08:50:46 this is actually horrible IMO ;P Sep 26 08:51:39 ah, also, it does data transfer using camera protocol Sep 26 08:51:54 I'll check if it knows obex too Sep 26 08:52:27 AStorm: can you send java app to it over obex? Sep 26 08:52:35 to get it installed Sep 26 08:53:47 no idea, though I've heard its java is slightly crippled Sep 26 08:53:53 e.g. doesn't have bluetooth libs Sep 26 08:54:32 and I can see no files with n810 and obex, and there are quite a few Sep 26 08:54:38 (just dirs) Sep 26 08:54:38 AStorm: I use j2me for games and simple apps Sep 26 08:55:23 so something is broken with obex either on n810 or that samsung ;P Sep 26 08:58:40 after having problems with transfers to a f... macbook, I suspect it's obex in n810 that is flaky Sep 26 08:59:35 23694 files, 922MB Sep 26 08:59:53 AStorm: Works like a charm with other Nokias, Windows, and Ubuntu Sep 26 09:01:20 Early Samsungs had problems with OBEX to an S60 phone but I hope it is not the case any more. Sep 26 09:04:39 it didn't work vs Mac Sep 26 09:04:49 at least, I had to bind 3 times Sep 26 09:05:03 and it broke connection semi randomly ;P Sep 26 09:05:25 it seems that obex is working, but doesn't show any actual *files* Sep 26 09:05:26 only dirs Sep 26 09:05:30 ehh... Sep 26 09:06:24 oh well, file manager crashed *again* Sep 26 09:06:41 drag'n'drop is crashy Sep 26 09:09:12 seems to be copying Sep 26 09:10:28 well, this is *slow* Sep 26 09:14:24 Stskeeps: deblet installer cfdisk complaints my every sdcard primary partition and quits? but i can run fdisk on them in pc Sep 26 09:17:01 eh, sending these few MB over obex from n810/sdhc to this samsung is really slow Sep 26 09:17:22 thux, hmm? complains how? Sep 26 09:17:37 what was the speed again? 300 kbps? Sep 26 09:17:57 johnx: bad primary partition ends0 Sep 26 09:18:18 thux, ah. it did that for my stuff too. I would use another tool to blank it Sep 26 09:18:46 I think it's some vaguely questionable partitioning from the factory Sep 26 09:19:31 johnx: is one ext3 partiton enough if i make them in pc? or do i need swap? Sep 26 09:19:50 you don't *need* swap but it's nice to have Sep 26 09:20:02 ok Sep 26 09:20:11 I would just delete all the partitions on something else then use cfdisk to make them again Sep 26 09:20:17 not that it matters either way Sep 26 09:20:27 ok Sep 26 09:20:50 is it possible to set swap to use the external card on a n810? Sep 26 09:20:59 i don't want to wear out the internal flash Sep 26 09:21:21 Yes - definitely if you don't mind not using the GUI. Sep 26 09:21:42 i don't mind :) Sep 26 09:21:46 Although I don't think worrying about the internal flashing wearing out is very realistic. Sep 26 09:21:50 any tips on establishing an ssh tunnel to N800 through usbnet? Sep 26 09:22:01 aquatix: just setup your own swap file and include it in /etc/fstab Sep 26 09:22:02 i thought i remembered an article on it indeed Sep 26 09:22:04 ah Sep 26 09:22:09 Jaffa: sounds logical :) Sep 26 09:22:30 You could probably carry on using the GUI with a symlink to the /media/mmc2 one, but YMMV Sep 26 09:22:53 i don't really trust the internal flash; the FS already failed once, but that was the factory formatted one; i since formatted it myself Sep 26 09:23:16 Jaffa: atm, i don't use swap at all Sep 26 09:23:22 fairy nuff Sep 26 09:23:31 well it wasn't a hw failure, just a logical format problem Sep 26 09:23:39 * Jaffa had to reformat his internal flash for the second time after some FAT-related corruption Sep 26 09:23:55 Jaffa: yeah Sep 26 09:24:03 Jaffa: i'm thinking of formatting it ext2 or 3 Sep 26 09:24:15 and maybe adding a swap partition when i'm at it Sep 26 09:24:38 would also make subversion work better i think Sep 26 09:24:52 it gave some errors on checking out to fat Sep 26 09:28:15 Hi ! Sep 26 09:29:00 good morning :) Sep 26 09:29:51 someone have see that ovi.com is now open ... Sep 26 09:29:54 ? Sep 26 09:30:17 Are they relaunching ovi then? Sep 26 09:30:25 N900 must be just around the corner! *cough* Sep 26 09:30:35 johnx: thanks, now cfdisk works Sep 26 09:30:50 thux, good deal. :) Sep 26 09:31:10 Is ovi.com an Apple site? Sep 26 09:31:19 It has got the same design =) Sep 26 09:31:29 RST38h, yes, it's apple's attempt to sell Nokia phones Sep 26 09:31:39 RST38h: not possible ... i still get no error ... so i couldn't be me.com Sep 26 09:31:40 Ah, the Horror! Sep 26 09:31:49 not really nice design Sep 26 09:31:53 Khertan, heh. I was just about to say the same thing... Sep 26 09:32:43 i've already contact the support to know if there is api to sync from external apps Sep 26 09:32:50 like mCalendar ;) Sep 26 09:33:31 * aquatix just created an ovi.com account Sep 26 09:34:06 * RST38h promises to create ovi.com account as soon as Nokia updates E70 firmware adding NGage support Sep 26 09:43:18 hi Khertan :) Sep 26 09:43:47 Hi andy Sep 26 09:44:20 meh, ovi.com really wants to have a nokia Sep 26 09:44:37 settings for similar nokia's don't seem to work on my sony ericsson m600i Sep 26 09:45:27 Khertan: I was lookig at your python packager... there's something I don't understand.... a Maemo installer is available, to install it on the device.... but... I did think it was a tool to install inside Scratchbox anda package python application in .deb files... am I wrong? Sep 26 09:46:25 yep ... your wrong (not really ...) Sep 26 09:46:36 It s a tools to create packages on device Sep 26 09:46:45 oh :\ Sep 26 09:46:52 not what I need then.. :( Sep 26 09:47:05 as you can do it with dpkg on scratchbox Sep 26 09:47:16 anyway ... there is also py2deb Sep 26 09:47:17 :) Sep 26 09:47:35 which can create source package to upload it to extras builder Sep 26 09:47:43 and works too on scratchbox Sep 26 09:48:00 you mean this one: http://manatlan.infogami.com/py2deb ? Sep 26 09:48:18 but you can also launch PyPackage on scratchbox using ./run-standalone pypackager Sep 26 09:48:24 Andy80: not this version ... Sep 26 09:48:48 i ve made a more recent one that can sign file too, and add maemo icon on packages Sep 26 09:48:57 it s available in maemo repository Sep 26 09:49:20 at least i should send my patch to manatlan ... as the last one i ve send wasn't complet Sep 26 09:49:23 complete Sep 26 09:49:43 http://khertan.net/py2deb.php Sep 26 09:49:58 Khertan: where can I find your py2deb version to be able to use it on my Scratchbox? Sep 26 09:50:00 thanks! Sep 26 09:50:11 uhm.... Sep 26 09:50:13 but... Sep 26 09:50:18 there's .install Sep 26 09:50:43 no wait... Sep 26 09:50:51 The requested URL /downloads/product/raw/OS2008/py2deb/ could not be found on this server. Sep 26 09:50:58 it doesn't exist on server :) Sep 26 09:52:30 Hi all, How to login to Scrach-box without password is there any way ? Sep 26 09:54:11 atul: you don't need a password Sep 26 09:54:22 Andy80: it seems there is some problem with .install location ... it s seems the location change ... i ll look. thx. Anyway it s available in repository ... so you can install it by the app manager on the device, or apt-get install py2deb on scratchbox Sep 26 09:55:01 Andy80:=> We login to scratch-box by typing command over command prompt /scrachbox/login Sep 26 09:55:22 atul: yes, but it doesn0t ask you for a password Sep 26 09:56:00 Khertan: whic repository do I have to use? if I write: fakeroot apt-get install py2deb, it cannot find it... Sep 26 09:56:09 Andy80:=> I have install scratch-box on almost 5 system and in all it is asking me for password. ok is there any way to remotelly login to scratch-box wihtout aksing apsswork. Sep 26 09:56:14 password Sep 26 09:56:41 andy http://repository.maemo.org/extras-devel/ Sep 26 09:56:53 atul: I installed Scratchbox and all Maemo SDK lot of times, and it never asked me for a password :) are you sure you've installed it correctly? Sep 26 09:57:17 Khertan: I've that repository on my Scratchbox... very strange! I'll check again... Sep 26 09:57:27 Andy80:=> Yes. Sep 26 09:58:05 atul: cannot help you then... Sep 26 09:58:18 Andy80:=> ok thanks for your kind reply. Sep 26 09:58:25 atul: I'm almost sure you didn't add your user to Scratchbox.... Sep 26 09:58:38 Andy80:=> yes your right. Sep 26 09:59:02 Andy80:=> I need to create user account and then it wont ask me for password it seems. Sep 26 10:00:14 atul: you didn't follow installation instructions then. Instructions tell you to add your user to Scratchbox, to have permissions to login and install all the stuff Sep 26 10:00:55 Andy80:=> I add one user in to the scratch-box. Sep 26 10:01:24 atul: "Specify users to be added to scratchbox users with '-u USER' " -->http://tablets-dev.nokia.com/4.1/INSTALL.txt Sep 26 10:02:08 Andy80:=> ok thanq i will try and let you inform thanks for helpl. Sep 26 10:02:19 you're wellcome Sep 26 10:04:07 Khertan: I'm browsing http://repository.maemo.org/extras-devel/ from firefox... I can see all packages, but not py2deb... Sep 26 10:06:11 Khertan: solved :) the package name is python2.5-py2deb not py2deb Sep 26 10:06:28 sorry ... i m at work and chief was here :) Sep 26 10:06:37 so a yep ... python2.5-py2deb Sep 26 10:06:38 :) Sep 26 10:06:52 apt-cache search is always usefull :) Sep 26 10:08:22 Khertan: oh sorry, then I won't disturb you :) Sep 26 10:08:27 crofton what does file say when you ran it on cursor-bad.png Sep 26 10:09:32 args Sep 26 10:09:48 sorry Sep 26 10:09:50 wrong channel Sep 26 10:12:40 Does syncml is the used protocol to sync device from ovi ? Sep 26 10:20:46 * lcuk peeks in Sep 26 10:29:22 Khertan: I'd guess so Sep 26 10:30:50 Khertan: according to http://www.allaboutsymbian.com/news/item/7993_Nokia_demonstrates_Ovi_updates.php - yes, it's SyncML based Sep 26 10:38:14 Jaffa: meeting 8pm sat? Sep 26 10:38:31 lardman: aye Sep 26 10:38:40 right Sep 26 10:38:50 ...unless I forget. Sep 26 10:39:56 likewise :) Sep 26 10:41:00 melmoth: I tried the suggestion, and in the end found a configure switch to disable python binding generation Sep 26 10:41:19 melmoth: mainly as the suggestion didn't seem to work for me, user error I imagine Sep 26 10:42:34 configure switch to disable python binding generation ... gggrrrrrr not a good idea Sep 26 10:42:53 why not? Sep 26 10:43:17 thx jaffa Sep 26 10:43:29 I'd be happy to reenable it but scratchbox gets hung up Sep 26 10:43:46 lardman: i don't know ... as i don't know what your are talking about :) Sep 26 10:43:58 building Navit Sep 26 10:44:33 hum ... Sep 26 10:44:50 yep ... but it can be usefull for python dev to create the binding too :) Sep 26 10:45:11 true, I'll post the error output and a python dev can track down the source ;) Sep 26 10:48:40 bye ... going to eat Sep 26 10:49:00 ahhh food, something i cannot have :( Sep 26 10:49:09 * lcuk dreams of bacon Sep 26 10:51:51 lcuk: how so? Sep 26 10:52:12 tooth is still throbbin like a bitch and my throat feels like its on fire Sep 26 10:52:24 lcuk: urgh! Sep 26 10:52:48 when are you plannin on comin over my way - we will have to take youngest to the pub if its before 3pm ;) Sep 26 10:53:16 lcuk: well, dunno yet, I'm waiting for the people selling the piano to let me know when they're free Sep 26 10:53:33 lardman: so you got navit compiled then ? Sep 26 10:54:06 fair enough, ill ask the missus where a decent pub is then (for obvious reasons im not normally a drinker) Sep 26 10:54:50 lcuk: obvious reasons == small children? :) Sep 26 10:56:03 heh, thats part of it yer, anyway give me a shout later, im goin for lunch Sep 26 10:56:32 lardman: enjoy Sep 26 10:56:38 * lcuk Sep 26 10:58:54 obvious reasons == muslim/mormon? Sep 26 10:58:57 ;) Sep 26 11:05:23 melmoth: not quite, missing hildon libs, need to update pkg-config Sep 26 11:10:35 melmoth: what I could do with is some debianisation stuff, tried to copy in from elsewhere and it killed the build Sep 26 11:21:14 Hi again ... Sep 26 11:32:28 hi mgedmin Sep 26 11:32:40 gaargh Sep 26 11:32:41 hi Sep 26 11:33:06 im sorry i dont have highlights for gaargh Sep 26 11:33:08 :D Sep 26 11:33:14 everythin ok? Sep 26 11:36:56 * mgedmin shrugs Sep 26 11:36:59 headache again Sep 26 11:37:32 and bloody apple with their bloody proprietary lock-in policies Sep 26 11:37:49 I wanted to get an iPod shuffle, but they don't like to work with ubuntu Sep 26 11:38:12 haha ... the proprietary lock-in policies help me to take the decision to not use anymore their products Sep 26 11:39:13 Apple. Harumph. Sep 26 11:40:40 booo mgedmin i finally had my tooth sorted yesterday and ive been in mega pain since Sep 26 11:40:56 * lcuk wouldnt mind an apple laptop Sep 26 11:41:03 Apple and MS are equally evil when it comes to lock-in. But Apple doesn't even try to hide it. But Apples stuff often plain works, that's the reason they are popular... Sep 26 11:41:08 but i have no use for an ipod yet Sep 26 11:41:08 apple is more insidious Sep 26 11:41:13 they actually make stuff that I want Sep 26 11:41:15 crave, evenb Sep 26 11:41:18 Haha. Sep 26 11:41:20 lol Sep 26 11:41:25 b**tards Sep 26 11:41:35 crashanddie, i wanna talk to you later if you are around Sep 26 11:41:41 What. You don't want a Zune?!? ;) Sep 26 11:41:58 a polished turd is still shit Sep 26 11:42:33 * jott lurks Sep 26 11:42:38 * sneakret lurks harder. Sep 26 11:42:47 oi, stop lurking! Sep 26 11:43:25 * mgedmin throws a paper airplane at the lurkers Sep 26 11:43:28 * lcuk reprograms jott's cat to become a ferocious attack kitty and sends it to menace you while you lurk Sep 26 11:43:34 OUCH! Sep 26 11:44:06 heh the cat sits on my chest and sleeps :) Sep 26 11:44:09 Speaking of ubuntu, I've heard good things about mint. Is it hype? Sep 26 11:44:18 ah now he is awake lcuk. you woke him :/ Sep 26 11:44:25 well soon it will extend its claws and not release until it removes a rib Sep 26 11:44:37 damn, the code was meant to mask that Sep 26 11:44:42 what's mint? Sep 26 11:44:54 yaf - yet another fork :p Sep 26 11:45:46 :) Sep 26 11:46:12 I was about to forget my n810 today, so I thought ...is there any "phone home" software that basically every 5 minutes checks for gps and wifi and if available then posts that info somewhere ? Sep 26 11:46:30 and no i have not tried it and i can't tell if it's any good :) Sep 26 11:46:44 Fine. I'll try it now. Sep 26 11:46:54 pusling, there was a security threda on itT fairly recently talking about this kindof stuff Sep 26 11:46:55 pusling: i think there is such a script mentionned on internet tanlet talk Sep 26 11:47:36 When I got my N810, that was one of the first applications of the GPS that I thought of. Sep 26 11:47:45 but I never followed through. I guess I oughta. Sep 26 11:48:04 pusling: there was a thread on itt iirc about phoning home after being stolen Sep 26 11:48:13 yeah, like if the n810 would get a gps fix in critical situations :) Sep 26 11:48:18 lol Sep 26 11:48:20 :( Sep 26 11:48:49 "dear thief, please go into a large area and stand very still for 5 minutes" Sep 26 11:48:50 jott: it usually gets fix when I don't really need it, but not when I do. Sep 26 11:48:56 large open area Sep 26 11:49:06 pusling: exactly my point :) Sep 26 11:49:11 I have a phone that supposedly has really great GPS, but it's through Verizon and their firmware blocks GPS access unless you buy some stupid navigator service. Sep 26 11:49:18 $7/month or something Sep 26 11:49:20 grr Sep 26 11:49:28 android yesterday please Sep 26 11:49:45 ha Sep 26 11:49:57 the first android phone was announced 3 days ago Sep 26 11:50:02 it is sim-locked and has no tethering Sep 26 11:50:17 bloody phone operators Sep 26 11:50:18 any gps phone-home application has to cache the data anyway as it's even more unlikely that there is a active wifi connection the same time you got a gps fix. Sep 26 11:50:32 Yeah. Hooray for freedom. :/ Sep 26 11:51:25 jott: That's a valid point, but at some point you'd think whoever found/stole it would get it on wifi (hopefully prior to wiping it) Sep 26 11:51:59 sneakret: yeah that's why you have to cache/store the track and then submit it :) Sep 26 11:52:26 Uh... yeah. Maybe I should read the WHOLE sentence. Sep 26 11:52:35 my phone operator is selling the iphone 3g starting today Sep 26 11:52:39 must resist evil apple lockin Sep 26 11:52:43 best have some security penetration software running that exploits the local network and tries to get personal data :P Sep 26 11:52:54 Haha. Sep 26 11:52:56 wrrr Sep 26 11:53:00 will nokia ever make an android phone? Sep 26 11:53:01 no maemopad+ for Diablo Sep 26 11:53:15 I will *kill* the person that suggested flashing it. Sep 26 11:53:18 Andrade? Sep 26 11:53:22 i hope they toss symbian soon Sep 26 11:53:27 or at least do something horrible to the one Sep 26 11:53:36 mgedmin: quite unlikely for now... Sep 26 11:53:37 let me check the logs... Sep 26 11:53:42 hi Sep 26 11:53:55 Is that your last name? Sep 26 11:54:00 im' new here... Sep 26 11:54:11 Felipe Andrade is my real name :) Sep 26 11:54:42 Cool. I know an Andrade. :) Sep 26 11:54:52 Not Felipe though. Sep 26 11:54:52 from Brazil? Sep 26 11:55:01 cool Sep 26 11:55:03 He's in Texas, US. Sep 26 11:55:14 but maybe his ancestors are from Brazil. Sep 26 11:55:24 I'm in Recife, BR Sep 26 11:55:41 My brother spent a couple years in Brazil. Sep 26 11:55:57 Oops. I lied. Portugal. I have a friend who spent a couple years in Brazil though. :) Sep 26 11:56:02 Same language at least! ;) Sep 26 11:56:08 sure Sep 26 11:56:45 My favorite restaurant is brazillian though! Sep 26 11:57:04 Glad I could be so helpful. Sep 26 11:57:20 :) Sep 26 11:57:37 Oh, and I work with a guy from Brazil! Sep 26 11:57:50 I'm just full of useful information! Sep 26 11:58:19 where do you work? Sep 26 11:58:23 Nokia? Sep 26 11:58:26 I can't say. I'd be murdered. Sep 26 11:58:46 :P Sep 26 11:58:51 (Microsoft) Sep 26 11:58:54 hahahaha Sep 26 11:58:57 ok, hrw, you're getting the stick Sep 26 11:58:58 (Shh!) Sep 26 11:59:14 because it was probably either you or GeneralAntilles Sep 26 11:59:15 ;P Sep 26 11:59:42 ok, who has another maemopad+-like application? Sep 26 12:00:10 Xournal? Sep 26 12:00:56 5 minutes left on my mint download... Sep 26 12:02:03 AStorm: ? Sep 26 12:02:08 * Khertan don't like syncml protocol ! Sep 26 12:02:43 sneakret: Portugese and Portugese-Brazil are not quite same language Sep 26 12:03:09 Are they more different than US and UK English? Sep 26 12:03:34 yes Sep 26 12:03:58 I didn't realize that. Cool. Sep 26 12:05:40 well, that app has to be local Sep 26 12:05:55 MacBook Pro Automatically Self-Destructs in Time for Next Version Sep 26 12:06:09 Haha. Sep 26 12:06:27 so, question: who has a xournal package for diablo for me to try? Sep 26 12:06:41 AStorm: Chinook Extras does Sep 26 12:06:53 and it works with Diablo? Sep 26 12:06:59 Yes Sep 26 12:07:17 what about maemopad? Sep 26 12:07:23 *maemopadplus Sep 26 12:07:27 isn't maemopad in diablo extras? Sep 26 12:07:34 nope Sep 26 12:07:56 Find X-Fade and bug him into moving a few crucial packages from chinook extras to diablo extras Sep 26 12:08:03 X-Fade: do it :) Sep 26 12:08:07 Haha. Sep 26 12:08:08 even if the source is not available Sep 26 12:08:14 All taken care of now! Sep 26 12:08:15 xournal is OSS Sep 26 12:08:18 'cause this is no longer funny Sep 26 12:08:25 maemopadplus is open too Sep 26 12:08:34 AStorm: OSS != compiles on Extras autobuilder Sep 26 12:08:41 * lcuk yowls in pain :( Sep 26 12:08:51 I see no xournal in extras/pool/chinook Sep 26 12:08:56 lcuk: 810 is not THAT heavy Sep 26 12:09:02 AStorm: A moment Sep 26 12:09:05 ok, I need to get my sight checked again Sep 26 12:09:06 :P Sep 26 12:09:17 810 isnt the problem Sep 26 12:09:30 or change the pointless unreadable courier font to dejavu sans mono or sth Sep 26 12:09:41 found it? ok Sep 26 12:10:11 http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=18837&page=25&highlight=xournal Sep 26 12:10:14 need libart, libgnomecanvas2-0, libgnomeprint2.2-0 and poppler-utils Sep 26 12:10:16 so... Sep 26 12:11:22 ah well, it's in -devel Sep 26 12:11:25 let me try that out Sep 26 12:11:32 DO NOT touch the version in devel Sep 26 12:11:38 really? Sep 26 12:11:38 It's fucked up Sep 26 12:11:43 mhm, well Sep 26 12:11:48 I could just uninstall that ;P Sep 26 12:12:03 I can vouch for the xournel devel fail. Sep 26 12:12:13 xournal Sep 26 12:12:13 trick is... the .install won't work :P Sep 26 12:12:19 rejects these chinook repos now Sep 26 12:12:19 it will pull up a whole bunch of devel packages though Sep 26 12:12:34 Find and bug X-Fade. Sep 26 12:12:54 X-Fade: you will be killed... after that person who told me it's safe to switch to Diablo Sep 26 12:12:59 :> Sep 26 12:13:02 Hah. Sep 26 12:13:30 hey guys, is there a kind of widget support like in Nokia N-Series for Maemo? Sep 26 12:13:31 AStorm's "to do" list means something different from what you might think. Sep 26 12:13:44 It's got people's names on it. Sep 26 12:14:35 I mean Web Runtime... Sep 26 12:16:50 Andrade[1]: uhm... you probably mean desktop widgets? sure there is Sep 26 12:17:31 Andrade: no web runtime. Sep 26 12:17:38 ~lart dentists Sep 26 12:17:45 There is a web browser though Sep 26 12:17:49 Ajax and Flash Development to build small apps Sep 26 12:17:52 lcuk: Screams from the first floor? Sep 26 12:17:54 reboot time Sep 26 12:18:11 screams from here, bloody hurts Sep 26 12:18:49 lcuk: i can't remember visiting a dentist and *not* having more pain afterward than before. Sep 26 12:19:28 that's pure marketing - what if they would actually make it proper - we would never come back :) Sep 26 12:19:37 jott, normally its cured on the whole, or i get painkillers, but none were offered and ive not got a chemists nearby to grab anything stronger than paracetamol Sep 26 12:20:16 RST38h: thanks :P Sep 26 12:20:18 there is web runtime Sep 26 12:20:25 which is actually a modded Gecko Sep 26 12:20:33 so, you can use that Sep 26 12:20:54 not entirely sure if source to that is available Sep 26 12:22:22 No, this is not what he needs Sep 26 12:22:31 no problem... i can start it from scratch Sep 26 12:22:40 He wants html/javascript widgets transparently integrated with the desktop Sep 26 12:22:44 I mean widger S60 Sep 26 12:22:46 http://wiki.forum.nokia.com/index.php/Category:Web_Runtime_(WRT) Sep 26 12:22:56 ah, no, there's no API like that Sep 26 12:23:09 go port google widgets ;) Sep 26 12:23:31 sure :P Sep 26 12:23:36 you can run plasma :P Sep 26 12:23:42 is there a project like this? Sep 26 12:23:49 no. Sep 26 12:36:37 Andrade: forget about web runtime based gadgets/widgets on maemo Sep 26 12:36:54 hrw: They are announced for the next release. Sep 26 12:37:10 hrw: ? Sep 26 12:37:27 X-Fade: which has unknown release date Sep 26 12:37:47 hrw: Well, there were some clues ;) Sep 26 12:38:01 hmm Sep 26 12:38:05 hrw: secret plans Sep 26 12:38:07 hmm... it would perhaps be nice to add support for maemo's widgets to plasma, so you can use the same widget when running plasma-on-maemo as with normal maemo, and also use them on your normal kde desktop... :) Sep 26 12:38:07 nice Sep 26 12:38:11 Not entirely unknown - there's a clear roadmap from the announcement last week -> November alpha -> March-May betas -> mid-2009 release. Sep 26 12:38:11 xournal is almost good, but has no means to manage information Sep 26 12:38:44 * hrw -> lunch Sep 26 12:40:07 hrw: it s possible to do google widget ... Sep 26 12:40:19 but ... hum ... it ll eat many cpu cycle and memory Sep 26 12:40:39 what is plasme ? Sep 26 12:40:42 plasma ? Sep 26 12:41:01 Khertan: plasma is kde's desktop shell (which incidentally also can run on maemo :) ) Sep 26 12:41:28 (and plasma currently has support for google gadgets, macosx dashboard widgets, and its own plasmoids) Sep 26 12:41:46 Mek: oh ... don't know Sep 26 12:41:54 also for the support of the widget Sep 26 12:42:24 google gadgets is at this time really useless ... as they are all horrible Sep 26 12:42:28 :) Sep 26 12:42:29 hmm, its shape recognizer could use some more fudge setting Sep 26 12:42:31 :) Sep 26 12:43:06 widget development is easy Sep 26 12:43:15 take a look at this one Sep 26 12:43:17 http://mosh.nokia.com/content/56A93DC9BC2656C1E040050A4430251D Sep 26 12:43:27 Andrade ... hum ... Sep 26 12:43:42 only one hour Sep 26 12:43:52 * jott has yet to see a widget that draws his attention for more than 20 seconds... Sep 26 12:44:12 jott: use HomeCalendar it s an usefull widget :) Sep 26 12:44:35 at least if you use mCalendar :) Sep 26 12:44:46 Sep 26 12:44:48 :) Sep 26 12:44:54 * Jaffa needs to try the latest version Sep 26 12:44:58 blah, shape recognizer still requires very careful drawing Sep 26 12:45:00 pointless Sep 26 12:45:15 jott: where do you live? i can make a camera surveillance system for your region in only few minutes Sep 26 12:45:37 Khertan: although you don't want to do a grid, it might be interesting to vary the height of an item depending on its duration (within min & max limits, of course) Sep 26 12:45:45 Andrade: i live at Varinfroy ... in France ... try to found a web cam Sep 26 12:46:24 Jaffa: i say i ll not like a grid not i will not do it :) Sep 26 12:46:35 just not the first priority Sep 26 12:47:00 Ah :) Sep 26 12:47:22 But maybe with your last sentence i ve found a solution to implement an home made grid without using cairo and making my own widget Sep 26 12:47:34 THX JAFFA !!!!! Sep 26 12:47:44 Woohoo! :) Sep 26 12:47:56 i will made a TreeView with custom bg color ... and size ! Sep 26 12:48:00 * Jaffa aims to be helpful (most of the time ;-)) Sep 26 12:48:39 pity xournal can't use text recognition as well (directly Sep 26 12:48:48 * Khertan just hope i can made different line size in a gtk.TreeView Sep 26 12:49:05 or even... at all! Sep 26 12:49:18 blah, no handwriting recognition... needs improvements Sep 26 12:50:09 oufffff we can set height of a line separatly Sep 26 12:50:45 Jaffa: an another idea ? :) Sep 26 12:51:21 khertan: do you know a website like this one for your region? http://www.paris-live.com/ Sep 26 12:51:26 jaffa: something about implementing syncml easily ? Sep 26 12:51:43 Andrade: lol there is nothing around my home Sep 26 12:51:52 :P Sep 26 12:52:08 Andrade: my town is arround 200 hundred habitant Sep 26 12:52:17 Khertan: not found any existing Python code? Sep 26 12:52:22 hum ... 200 habitant Sep 26 12:52:41 Jaffa: i ve found something that i prefer to not read anymore ... Sep 26 12:53:18 as this is not really well coded and based on an python module, based itself on a non free lib Sep 26 12:53:29 Eugh Sep 26 12:54:20 Use some of the Java SyncML services - stick on a server somewhere and have it mangle the SyncML into something more sensible for your code? Sep 26 12:54:28 the best thing i ve found is a young python module named pysyncml : https://pysyncml.forge.funambol.org/ Sep 26 12:55:06 Jaffa: i prefer a real sync ... image if people don't use google because they don't trust it ... imagine my own server :) Sep 26 12:55:11 :) Sep 26 12:55:31 Still wrapping the C++ API - building it'll be a lot more fun, though that could be a separate port (using mud to generate the auto-builder package) Sep 26 12:55:32 s/image/_ Sep 26 12:56:14 Jaffa: yep but it wrap a free c++ api / lib which is the one implemented in the most of the server Sep 26 12:56:25 Indeed Sep 26 12:56:38 but it require that i build the lib Sep 26 12:56:45 something i can try tomorrow Sep 26 12:57:09 but ... hum ... as you know i don't have many time to spent on my home computer Sep 26 12:57:27 heh Sep 26 12:58:06 re lardman Sep 26 12:58:14 hi Jaffa Sep 26 13:00:25 hi lardman Sep 26 13:00:32 hi hrw Sep 26 13:00:41 sorry I missed your talk on qemu Sep 26 13:01:00 lardman: no problem Sep 26 13:01:29 lardman: I enjoyed your talk even if did not understood most of it;D Sep 26 13:01:52 lol Sep 26 13:02:10 I'm expanding that to make a document which should be more understandable, hopefully Sep 26 13:02:33 wrrraugh Sep 26 13:02:37 there's no Pidgin there either Sep 26 13:02:44 evil! Sep 26 13:02:45 lardman: I am not interested in dsp programming but attended your talk as it looked as most promising talk. Sep 26 13:02:59 web2py or py2web talk for example was disaster Sep 26 13:03:09 X-Fade: ... Sep 26 13:03:29 AStorm: Sorry, not here ;) Sep 26 13:03:30 I hope to get more people interested by showing that it's pretty easy to get started, etc. Sep 26 13:04:00 anyway, task of the moment is getting Navit to compile Sep 26 13:06:35 AStorm: Pidgin is elsewhere Sep 26 13:06:46 boo, hrw Sep 26 13:07:22 ? Sep 26 13:07:26 nothing Sep 26 13:07:35 lardman: which version do you use for navit? Sep 26 13:07:42 svn Sep 26 13:07:54 just ./autogen.sh && make ? Sep 26 13:08:40 lardman: navit does not work. Sep 26 13:08:42 also needs the following configure switches: --enable-hildon --disable-binding-python Sep 26 13:08:58 and now I need to work out why pkg-config isn't finding the hildon libs Sep 26 13:09:00 Are you gonna make it work?> Please? Pretty-please-with-sugar-on-top? =) Sep 26 13:09:03 RST38h: how so? Sep 26 13:09:11 lardman: Crashes unpredictably Sep 26 13:09:12 ah, yeah, I thought I'd take a look Sep 26 13:09:36 wants weird things. does weird things. Sep 26 13:09:49 just like us then? ;) Sep 26 13:10:11 pretty much although it is not supposed to have free will Sep 26 13:10:15 we do not crash unpredic Sep 26 13:10:30 we do not? Sep 26 13:10:48 web2py talk was a disaster ? are you sure this was not the py2deb talk ? Sep 26 13:10:53 hrw: ? Sep 26 13:10:59 RST38h: really? where? Sep 26 13:11:08 (as there is one in chinook extras) Sep 26 13:12:22 AStorm: http://ageofikon.info/packrat/index.php?Action=list&System=OS2008&Arg=pidgin&Section=&Repo=0 Sep 26 13:12:59 + there is one in collabora repo Sep 26 13:13:34 Collabora one is weird. Takes 20MB extra, according to installer Sep 26 13:13:57 Khertan: I did not attended py2deb talk Sep 26 13:14:05 And hopefully something like mud will be considered a home for the build receipe (or upstream), rather than a navit.garage.maemo.org Sep 26 13:14:42 Jaffa: I'll liaise with you Sep 26 13:14:55 but ideally yes Sep 26 13:15:03 and I don't see why now Sep 26 13:15:05 not Sep 26 13:15:31 I don't see why not (just to avoid any doubts about that) Sep 26 13:15:43 RST38h: that one is Chinook extras... Sep 26 13:15:48 not in diablo, but it works Sep 26 13:15:54 X-Fade: you failed truly Sep 26 13:16:04 * lardman finds his fingers type random almost matching words Sep 26 13:16:15 lardman: one of these days eh? Sep 26 13:16:16 AStorm: Thanks for the encouraging comments ;) Sep 26 13:16:26 aquatix: yeah :) Sep 26 13:16:33 * aquatix is not really coherent too today Sep 26 13:16:35 damn flue Sep 26 13:16:36 X-Fade: so, please move or copy some of these packages Sep 26 13:16:38 flu Sep 26 13:16:52 aquatix: lol, was going to say buy a CO detector Sep 26 13:17:01 :) Sep 26 13:17:16 but in this case will say "get well soon" :) Sep 26 13:17:23 heh, thanks Sep 26 13:17:36 Is hildon-libs now known as hildon-1 ? Sep 26 13:17:40 for pkg-config Sep 26 13:17:53 * lardman shows his lack of GUI programming experience Sep 26 13:17:59 X-Fade: Stuff that does not build on the extrasautobiulder but is still very important (like xournal) Sep 26 13:18:02 so it's a quiet day at work for me today Sep 26 13:18:24 X-Fade: Could you simply copy it to Diablo repo? Copy it into non-free if you like, does not matter as long as it is there Sep 26 13:18:33 RST38h: Dude, things like that can be fixed with very little effort. Sep 26 13:18:51 X-Fade: Yes, but it has been so long, and they have not been fixed yet Sep 26 13:18:54 It seems that people just don't care about that package, otherwise it would have been there already. Sep 26 13:19:11 to answer my question, yes http://inz.fi/blog/2007/10/21/leetle-hildon-1chinook-migration-things/ Sep 26 13:19:30 X-Fade: yes but the users care Sep 26 13:19:54 RST38h: It is in extras-devel. Sep 26 13:19:59 Not fair to keep it from the users just because package's author is having hard time Sep 26 13:20:11 X-Fade: No, the extras-devel xournal is an unusable alpha version Sep 26 13:20:38 X-Fade: Dunno about maemopad+ - AStorm is saying it is not there either Sep 26 13:20:58 lardman: compiled fine with http://slexy.org/raw/s2iTDrCIcH applied Sep 26 13:20:58 RST38h: maemopad+ got uploaded yesterday, but a lib is missing. Sep 26 13:21:04 ah Sep 26 13:21:13 mhm Sep 26 13:21:14 RST38h: https://garage.maemo.org/pipermail/extras-cauldron-builds/2008-September/thread.html Sep 26 13:22:05 X-Fade: btw, the maemo logo there has opaque background Sep 26 13:22:40 RST38h: Where? Sep 26 13:22:58 X-Fade: See https://garage.maemo.org/ in IE Sep 26 13:23:13 maemo-logo.png Sep 26 13:23:14 RST38h: Upgrade to 7. Sep 26 13:23:23 hmmmm Sep 26 13:23:38 RST38h: That is the IE png bug. Sep 26 13:23:49 It is a machien at work. I do not decide on upgrades for these Sep 26 13:23:57 Maybe just replace it with a gif? Sep 26 13:24:20 ie6 is the spawn of evil Sep 26 13:24:24 1 bit transparancy is not really great looking for that ;) Sep 26 13:24:49 jott: you mean ie7 is not? Sep 26 13:24:50 there is a nasty hack to allow almost proper transparency in PNG in IE Sep 26 13:25:11 well, replacing it with gif will fix the problem Sep 26 13:25:16 if you do website then please forget that ie6 exists Sep 26 13:25:19 some directshow tuneup, can be done locally with javascript Sep 26 13:25:19 RST38h: well it is too but ie6 really caused so much damage to the whole web. Sep 26 13:25:31 RST38h: No, because then you would have very ugly borders. Sep 26 13:25:44 oh Sep 26 13:25:47 X-Fade: you can blend it to a fixed background color Sep 26 13:25:49 Wait, why? Sep 26 13:25:58 check about "IE6 png workaround" Sep 26 13:26:03 You mean the image is antialiaced? Sep 26 13:26:17 jott: So did NS4 =) Sep 26 13:26:19 We have less than 10% IE6 users orso. Sep 26 13:26:36 At some point you should just stop caring about that.. Sep 26 13:26:39 Yes, send them a message Sep 26 13:26:42 IE6 = ugly Sep 26 13:27:06 jott: And if we only let Gopher live, imagine what would web look like today! Sep 26 13:27:12 And I am still hoping we get a new design soon. Sep 26 13:27:19 there would be no "web" as we know it Sep 26 13:27:21 So perhaps it will fix itself. Sep 26 13:27:22 just a WSDL hell Sep 26 13:27:28 X-Fade: Well, General asked me and I have done the layout Sep 26 13:27:37 plus gopher ;P Sep 26 13:27:41 X-Fade: Fast, resizable, looks well on the tablet, no JS Sep 26 13:28:18 ok, anyway... a good file manager for the tablet? (no, the default one sucks major) Sep 26 13:28:25 AStorm: MC Sep 26 13:28:33 RST38h: i guess with gopher we would have much less of evil webapps :p Sep 26 13:28:35 no, that doesn't work well with the touchscreen Sep 26 13:28:42 AStorm, emelfm2 and pcmanfm, IIRC Sep 26 13:28:43 AStorm: Errata: you will have to ssh to the tablet from outside to run it well =) Sep 26 13:28:49 I don't use 'em but supposedly they work Sep 26 13:28:54 well, mc in the xterm works too Sep 26 13:28:57 emelfm is an abomination Sep 26 13:28:58 AStorm: osso-xterm is a good one Sep 26 13:29:01 if you know that esc, letter == alt+letter Sep 26 13:29:07 mgedmin: except that its input is unusbale =( Sep 26 13:29:09 Khertan: doesn't like touchscreen either Sep 26 13:29:12 and that you can simulate function keys by esc + number 0..9 Sep 26 13:29:21 * jott wished webapps would just be extinguished... Sep 26 13:29:34 jott: then vote for WSDL and such initiatives Sep 26 13:29:34 jott: Don't take my gmail from me Sep 26 13:29:45 the cripledness of the traditional unix terminal i/o works to our favour here Sep 26 13:29:46 and kick W3C for making the standard unreadable/unwritable by humans Sep 26 13:29:54 stupid design by M$ Sep 26 13:30:04 namespace abuse and all that Sep 26 13:30:20 Please, gentlemen, let us be more general and just vote for KILLING ALL PEOPLE Sep 26 13:30:29 People are the problem, don't you see? Sep 26 13:30:29 AStorm: i don't like the idea of code being run on remote servers i don't have access to. Sep 26 13:30:38 then run local apps? Sep 26 13:30:42 I'm not sure about ALL PEOPLE Sep 26 13:30:43 i do :) Sep 26 13:30:44 jott: JS runs locally Sep 26 13:30:46 they can use WSDL too, so... Sep 26 13:30:51 I mean, who will draw the webcomics I read daily? Sep 26 13:30:57 mgedmin: robots. Sep 26 13:31:08 RST38h: uhm, gmail does not use js for it's database engine :P Sep 26 13:31:11 Most stuff consumed by geeks can be written by robots anyway Sep 26 13:31:12 does "kill all people" include yourself? Sep 26 13:31:13 atleast i hope so ;) Sep 26 13:31:20 AStorm: Alas, yes Sep 26 13:31:23 only if he isn't SECRETLY A ROBOT!!! Sep 26 13:31:30 * johnx is obviously a bot Sep 26 13:31:32 AStorm: But only AFTER I am done with the rest Sep 26 13:31:34 BAN ;) Sep 26 13:31:39 * johnx isn't on the list of course :) Sep 26 13:32:17 jott: I see no problem with remote database engines Sep 26 13:32:20 I'll check that pcmanfm Sep 26 13:32:38 jott: May have a problem with who manages them of course, but this is always a concern Sep 26 13:32:50 does it support obex nicely? Sep 26 13:32:58 that is a major selling point Sep 26 13:33:00 RST38h: well i prefer opensource software. Sep 26 13:33:12 RST38h: Please tell me that you don't listen to evil metal or play violent and aggressive video games. Sep 26 13:33:23 and webapps are a usually a step further to even binary software. Sep 26 13:33:33 blafasel: 1. I do not listen to evil metal Sep 26 13:33:39 i mean i can attach a debugger or disassemble binaries :) Sep 26 13:33:55 blafasel: 2. I play extremely violent and aggressive video games, such as Zombies Ate My Neighbors and XEvil Sep 26 13:34:11 Damn. Now I'm scared. Sep 26 13:34:12 but that's as always is a matter of choice and preferences.. Sep 26 13:34:17 blafasel: [and yes, I enjoy 'em immensely] Sep 26 13:34:38 jott: What if you manage the server yourself? Sep 26 13:35:03 RST38h: that works. as i said "i don't like the idea of code being run on remote servers i don't have access to." Sep 26 13:35:06 blafasel: If you heard stuff I listen to, you would be even more scared Sep 26 13:35:34 blafasel: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yhuMLpdnOjY Sep 26 13:46:34 kulve: ping Sep 26 13:48:57 bloody thing, doesn't navit.c apparently calls a fn which has been removed Sep 26 13:49:22 hi etrunko_lap Sep 26 13:49:44 msut have a replacement though Sep 26 13:49:55 lardman: cheers! Sep 26 13:50:04 strange that navit.c calls it though, from the same svn checkout Sep 26 13:50:16 etrunko_lap: not happy that you have 30C weather! Sep 26 13:50:31 it is possible that the committer had an older component that still supplied that function Sep 26 13:50:48 and nobody tried to build the codebase after commit Sep 26 13:50:51 I'm sure there are reasons, just a bit annoying Sep 26 13:50:54 lardman: come and join us! Sep 26 13:50:55 hi all! Sep 26 13:50:55 :) Sep 26 13:50:57 lardman: hmm strange i wonder why it compiled here :/ Sep 26 13:51:08 jott: did you enable hildon? Sep 26 13:51:13 * jott checks Sep 26 13:51:32 * RST38h sighs and gets to merging the source trees =( Sep 26 13:51:38 check config.log, it silently fails when it can't find the hildon-libs pkg-config file Sep 26 13:52:05 ah no Sep 26 13:52:08 indeed Sep 26 13:52:47 need to change that to hildon-1, and alter the include path in gui_gtk_window.c, and then pass the correct pkg-config strings to place in CFLAGS, etc. Sep 26 13:53:10 looks like its made for a newer/older version of hildon .. Sep 26 13:53:22 what function? Sep 26 13:53:37 yeah, older version Sep 26 13:53:50 RST38h: ? Sep 26 13:54:01 what function is missing? Sep 26 13:54:17 map_get_filename() Sep 26 13:54:52 kulve: is there any problem if we have libogg and libvorbis packages in the extras repo? Sep 26 13:55:00 please please please Sep 26 13:55:18 this isn't a hildon function Sep 26 13:55:23 no Sep 26 13:55:58 but maybe you should try including libhildonfm/libhildonfm2 ? Sep 26 13:56:13 no, it's a fn which should be in map.c Sep 26 13:56:45 lardman: mm compiles here :p Sep 26 13:56:55 lardman: changed configure.in to use hildon-1 Sep 26 13:57:00 morning :) Sep 26 13:57:09 configure.in Sep 26 13:57:09 and changed path to hildon-1/hildon/... Sep 26 13:57:10 uaha Sep 26 13:57:14 jott: strange, have you altered the path to the hildon include files? Sep 26 13:57:17 ah, ok Sep 26 13:57:21 smells like rotten autotools use Sep 26 13:57:29 rm_you: hey Sep 26 13:57:32 right, got 0.0.4 to compile Sep 26 13:57:57 woglinde: the pkg-config stuff is broken, have to manually add the pkg-config output for hildon to the main CFLAGS, etc. Sep 26 13:58:15 lardman hm in sratchbox? Sep 26 13:58:15 I have to go out, bbl Sep 26 13:58:20 lardman: i just added the full path :) Sep 26 13:58:20 woglinde: yeah Sep 26 13:58:25 in the .h :) Sep 26 13:58:30 woglinde: it's the Makefile at fault though Sep 26 13:58:33 (excluding /usr/include) Sep 26 13:58:35 that seems to work Sep 26 13:58:41 jott: yeah, it will do Sep 26 13:58:56 try 0.0.4, that has the correct fn in map.c Sep 26 13:58:58 yeah poor developers Sep 26 13:59:06 I'll try some testing when I get home Sep 26 13:59:09 ah, well i use svn :) Sep 26 13:59:09 cu all later Sep 26 13:59:11 later Sep 26 13:59:16 dont get the 10 minutes for autotools love Sep 26 13:59:22 bye lardman Sep 26 13:59:26 jott: and it's built? Sep 26 13:59:29 yes Sep 26 13:59:31 * lardman is interested now Sep 26 13:59:53 as i said just changed configure.in and then changed the path to hildon-1/.. Sep 26 13:59:56 hmm, I'm missing that filename fn Sep 26 14:00:04 when it comes to linking Sep 26 14:00:07 hm what package it is? Sep 26 14:00:11 navit Sep 26 14:00:15 ah Sep 26 14:00:22 is navit really this old Sep 26 14:00:31 well at least that broken :) Sep 26 14:00:57 map_get_filename is defined in map.h, but isn't actually in map.c afaict; no idea how you got it to compile, unless they fixed the error since my pull last night? Sep 26 14:01:08 hmm who knows :) Sep 26 14:01:10 hm registerd 3 years ago Sep 26 14:01:34 bbl Sep 26 14:02:11 lardman: It is. codesearch.google.com finds its source :) Sep 26 14:02:57 jott and you get it compiled? Sep 26 14:03:01 got Sep 26 14:03:20 woglinde: it seems so Sep 26 14:03:27 not actually started it yet :) Sep 26 14:04:26 does it work with the 810 gpsd ? Sep 26 14:04:52 i seem to recall that it does. Sep 26 14:05:10 i never actually tried it, but the osm guys at linuxtag had it running. Sep 26 14:05:20 ah hm Sep 26 14:06:32 lol Sep 26 14:06:35 #DIRECTFB_CFLAGS="-D_REENTRANT -I/data/oe/tmp/staging/arm-angstrom-linux-gnueabi/usr/include/directfb/" Sep 26 14:06:42 in the configure.in Sep 26 14:06:44 hehe Sep 26 14:08:21 jott yep its funny because I maintained the last directfb recipes in oe Sep 26 14:13:11 hmm well it does not look very hildonized :P Sep 26 14:14:03 hehe on the default location there is a place called "Hackerbrücke" :) Sep 26 14:15:02 What is a "3" before "j" , Sep 26 14:15:04 ? Sep 26 14:15:31 I mean, in latin charset? Sep 26 14:15:42 ???? Sep 26 14:16:54 abcdef[g]hij?! Sep 26 14:17:10 *g* Sep 26 14:17:48 hm i see navit is partly hildonized. the hw keys work but the menu is still gtk-ish Sep 26 14:18:40 and it even create a route :O Sep 26 14:19:46 jott hehe Sep 26 14:19:55 which cardmatrial you have? Sep 26 14:19:59 hm Add:graphics:Add WM_Class support to windows Sep 26 14:20:10 that's an osm snapshot of munich as it seems Sep 26 14:20:12 commited 4 days ago Sep 26 14:20:16 some area of it. Sep 26 14:21:15 hm you probably have to use an external tool to fetch/create the maps Sep 26 14:21:37 jott they have no hildon-progamm in the gtk code Sep 26 14:21:41 so its clear Sep 26 14:21:51 yeah. Sep 26 14:22:00 just key bindings. Sep 26 14:22:07 jepp Sep 26 14:22:21 but this shouldnt be hard to add Sep 26 14:22:22 better than nothing :) Sep 26 14:22:27 no indeed Sep 26 14:22:56 the rendering quality is actually quite acceptable Sep 26 14:23:07 etrunko_lap: yes, I guess there is a problem. Afaik, mogg project already provides those? But with the missing symbols.. Sep 26 14:23:30 hm I wonder why they have to set WM_CLASS manually Sep 26 14:23:34 ah i spotted theresienwiese :) Sep 26 14:23:53 I thought a gtkwindow has it per default Sep 26 14:24:41 kulve: No problem at all.. the mogg packages are quite outdated Sep 26 14:25:05 kulve: just in case i uploaded the vorbisidec to extras-devel Sep 26 14:25:07 hmm i only see WM_CLASS in the cegui frontend Sep 26 14:25:08 as a matter of test Sep 26 14:25:10 :) Sep 26 14:26:00 kulve: it was your package without any modifications Sep 26 14:26:05 jott hm in add_bookmark window Sep 26 14:26:46 etrunko_lap: I mean that I don't think I should upload my packages there, if the mogg project has already uploaded them.. Sep 26 14:27:01 hm but they have a clutter port too Sep 26 14:27:52 now we only need clutter on the n8x0 :) Sep 26 14:28:14 kulve: may i send you a mail so we can discuss about that issue? i'll copy the mogg guy... at least the base packages such as libogg and libvorbisidec should be shared by both of you guys Sep 26 14:29:17 urgh Sep 26 14:29:56 qwerty123 Sep 26 14:30:07 etrunko_lap: sure Sep 26 14:30:14 kulve: great Sep 26 14:30:29 it'll ease things a lot Sep 26 14:32:14 kulve: https://garage.maemo.org/pipermail/extras-cauldron-builds/2008-September/002698.html Sep 26 14:34:25 I don't mind you overriding the mogg's packages, but I just see it a bit suspicous :) Sep 26 14:35:20 I don't want to end up in a situation where we upgrade the version numbers to get our package to be the one that gets installed Sep 26 14:36:48 i understand Sep 26 14:37:08 guys:( Sep 26 14:37:28 thanl u so much for be with u Sep 26 14:37:28 o think Sep 26 14:37:32 i am crying Sep 26 14:37:46 i think i should say goodbye here forever Sep 26 14:38:03 we have good time together Sep 26 14:38:07 :''''''( Sep 26 14:38:17 i missed my n800 Sep 26 14:38:36 a robber :( Sep 26 14:38:40 .........oh Sep 26 14:38:46 a reason to buy n810 Sep 26 14:38:55 goodbye maemo Sep 26 14:38:58 * qwerty12 would rather wait for the next device Sep 26 14:39:15 but maybe can find it :( Sep 26 14:39:21 ouch Sep 26 14:39:41 qwerty12: that would be a wait until next may Sep 26 14:39:43 ok so goodbye i am really crying. Sep 26 14:39:47 bye Sep 26 14:39:49 hm we will throw it away if he finds out that it not runs windows Sep 26 14:39:52 mgedmin: at least until the next may Sep 26 14:39:54 italodance: where do you live? Sep 26 14:40:06 'cause as General said, they promise to release SDK in may Sep 26 14:40:09 Andrade iran Sep 26 14:40:31 Italodance: they do not cut hands for robberies in Iran? Sep 26 14:40:38 thank u for ur always favor guys Sep 26 14:40:46 how did a robber get their hands on it? they must be pissed off with themselves to discover its not a phone ;) Sep 26 14:41:00 mgedmin, true. but I don't find an upgrading to an N810 from a N800 worthwhile. Plus, at least next device will hopefully be able to play video back properly. (i.e not have shit epson chipset) Sep 26 14:41:05 RST38h .....maybe they can find my device Sep 26 14:41:14 qwerty12: have you upgraded? Sep 26 14:41:18 Italo: Even if they can't, you can buy a new one Sep 26 14:41:25 I was very sceptical of the n810 before I got one Sep 26 14:41:28 I'm very happy I got one Sep 26 14:41:35 it took me maybe two days to convert Sep 26 14:41:50 RST38h IT is available only in USA Sep 26 14:42:05 i bought mine in dubai,and there was very rare Sep 26 14:42:06 Italo: Also available in Europe and even in Russia Sep 26 14:42:36 mgedmin, nope. still using an N800. I don't doubt the N810 has useful things on it like the keyboard etc but the GPS isn't much cop and it shares lacking hardware too :( Sep 26 14:42:36 yes but asia really no! Sep 26 14:42:38 :"''( Sep 26 14:42:47 it's prettier Sep 26 14:43:09 mgedmin: easier to scratch though Sep 26 14:43:24 RST38h, Seen my N800? Sep 26 14:43:33 qwerty: That's yours =) Sep 26 14:43:40 ok thnx forever Sep 26 14:43:44 bye Sep 26 14:43:45 My n810 got scratched by breadcrumbs on the back =( Sep 26 14:44:15 bread crumbs? Sep 26 14:44:23 yep Sep 26 14:45:26 The latch for opening the battery cover is scratched on my and my "d-pad" (if that is right term) is scratched heavily too. (At least led is more visible now) Sep 26 14:45:52 You abuse your little sweet n800! Sep 26 14:46:01 Oh, the monster! Sep 26 14:46:06 [do you spank it?\ Sep 26 14:46:13 sometimes Sep 26 14:46:43 terrible. Sep 26 14:46:53 meh, I've damaged it a bit. touchscreen stops working sometimes :/. Once alarm was going off and I had no touchscreen working so I went straight for the battery Sep 26 14:47:07 ouch Sep 26 14:47:12 You took its breath away! Sep 26 14:47:47 Stskeeps: in the end after couple hours installer failed and quit, i chroot to sdcard and dpkg --configure -a tells: "Errors were encountered while processing:nit-env-stskeeps"? Sep 26 14:55:18 Rah ... user reports other errors about reccuring event in mCalendar Sep 26 14:55:21 arggeegegergrgrg Sep 26 14:55:42 so ... i ll take some time tomorrow to review all the code with a bigger screen Sep 26 15:31:49 hi again dear friends Sep 26 15:32:00 plz tell me who has iphone 3g? Sep 26 15:32:13 not me, but what's the question Sep 26 15:32:22 my uncle has one and my aunt has the normal Sep 26 15:32:55 Jaredu tell me can it read ebooks like pdf files>? Sep 26 15:33:04 i want to buy one Sep 26 15:33:13 i dont believe it can do pdf's/ Sep 26 15:33:14 and hope be the same IT :( Sep 26 15:33:22 :( Sep 26 15:33:26 sure? Sep 26 15:33:33 sec Sep 26 15:33:36 ill double check Sep 26 15:33:37 but im pretty sure Sep 26 15:33:58 while you're waiting, www.t-mobileg1.com ;) Sep 26 15:35:07 tnx Sep 26 15:35:15 i'll see you Sep 26 15:35:20 http://www.talkiphone.com/forums/iphone-articles/223-101-most-commonly-asked-iphone-questions.html#faq59 Sep 26 15:35:30 aww Sep 26 15:35:42 :'( Sep 26 15:36:02 i paused my torrent to get that link grrr >.< Sep 26 15:36:12 AStorm, just pull whatever you need from Chinook Extras. . . . Sep 26 15:36:15 Jaredu: not entirely useful FAQ - given it doesn't mention 3G Sep 26 15:36:36 3g is the same phone w/ 3g support and front facing camera pretty much Sep 26 15:36:59 ...and a new software version. Sep 26 15:37:08 yeah Sep 26 15:37:24 firmware can be updated lol Sep 26 15:47:54 Somebody needs to beat Quim up for using camel case. Sep 26 15:48:58 where/ Sep 26 15:48:59 ? Sep 26 15:49:10 On the Wiki Sep 26 15:59:57 Bwaaaahaaahaa! Mark complains about the "your concerns and use cases are irrelevant" attitude!! :) Sep 26 16:00:31 Oh the irony! Sep 26 16:08:05 back Sep 26 16:17:56 generalAntilles, whatIsWrongWithCamelCase? itWorksWhenYouHaven'tGotASpaceBar Sep 26 16:18:14 Well, if you haven't got a spacebar then you shouldn't be editing the wiki. Sep 26 16:18:27 heh Sep 26 16:18:32 There's nothing wrong with camel case if it's what you're using. Sep 26 16:18:38 But we're not using camel case on the wiki. Sep 26 16:18:40 thatsj ust bein spacist :P not all keyboards were brought up the same Sep 26 16:18:46 Using it breaks consistency. Sep 26 16:19:10 nokia could afterall have decided not to include a spacebar (hell, its one step away from tab:P) and then where would you be? huh! huh! :D Sep 26 16:19:28 With a lot of dumbass N810 users not editing a wiki. Sep 26 16:19:46 or your blood pressure boiling when they do :D Sep 26 16:20:12 yes, thats how we will describe the bug report to nokia "please insert extra keys so GeneralAntilles doesn't explode" Sep 26 16:21:36 on a slightly lighter note: tracy decided to smash the car up today Sep 26 16:21:45 Awesome Sep 26 16:21:46 she rung me and told me she had picked up all the pieces :S Sep 26 16:21:47 She ok? Sep 26 16:22:00 perfectly, it was her vs a trolley park Sep 26 16:22:06 and she lost Sep 26 16:22:13 Clearly Sep 26 16:22:43 i could barely listen to her for laughin :D it was awesome, i really hope the store got cctv footage :D Sep 26 16:23:12 will it be covered by insurance? Sep 26 16:23:28 lcuk: Data Protection Act means they *have* to turn it over, too ;-) Sep 26 16:23:28 * johnx hears some people actually have more than minimum coverage on their vehicles Sep 26 16:24:23 i obviously dont care - cars need bumps and dents and you cannot worry about it - but it was her descriptions of how everytime she moved the scrapin nooise got worse Sep 26 16:24:31 :D excellent jaffa Sep 26 16:24:48 johnx, nahhh not worth it, its just a bit of a panel bashin needed Sep 26 16:24:58 im not givin up my mega no claims for this Sep 26 16:25:00 ah, that doesn't even count then Sep 26 16:25:21 * johnx reminisces about the car before his present one Sep 26 16:25:39 heh,. right off again, bblater Sep 26 16:25:55 i am totally loving the creator of vgba right now :D Sep 26 16:25:59 the optimizations are excellenntttt Sep 26 16:31:39 GeneralAntilles: the others seem to have been Sprint'n', though. Why isn't the next one Sprint6/ Sep 26 16:31:40 ? Sep 26 16:31:50 Dunno Sep 26 16:31:58 'cause the 100 days are over Sep 26 16:32:07 but I'm not sure why we can't continue on with that naming scheme. Sep 26 16:32:16 Maybe poke Quim on -community. Sep 26 16:36:26 Jaredu: he is in the channel, thank RST38h directly :) Sep 26 16:39:01 Stskeeps, is there a readme on the .items somewhere? Sep 26 16:39:34 lcuk, if you're curious, I'm quite familiar with the concept of "cars that have character" http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v119/JohnX/793c0a17.jpg Sep 26 16:41:36 * GeneralAntilles sighs. Sep 26 16:42:46 johnx: thaqt looks like seattle Sep 26 16:43:04 RST38h, you are amazing. Sep 26 16:43:20 moontiger, why do you say that? Sep 26 16:43:54 i do wonder if there's a way to change the button layout Sep 26 16:43:57 moontiger, though you're correct :) Sep 26 16:44:19 hehe i spend a lot of time in redmond and thsat looks very familiar Sep 26 16:45:59 lol, i cans play pokemon on nit while waiting for torrents xD Sep 26 16:46:11 games look awesome fullscreen now... Sep 26 16:46:21 * johnx downloads new vgba Sep 26 16:46:26 :D Sep 26 16:46:30 its playable now :P Sep 26 16:46:43 goes down to 8fps sometimes and the sound is somewhat choppy Sep 26 16:46:50 but the good old gba feel is there Sep 26 16:48:28 now if only the d-pad on my n800 hadn't degenerated into a mushy, unusable mess Sep 26 16:48:37 ah Sep 26 16:48:46 im hoping theres a way to hack the button layout :P Sep 26 16:49:09 //wants to use the keyboard layout gba style Sep 26 16:50:07 qwe asd zxc = directionals fn = L ^ = R l = a + =b Sep 26 16:50:08 :P Sep 26 16:50:12 that'd be great Sep 26 16:50:13 heh Sep 26 16:55:18 * GeneralAntilles switches back to fanoush initfs. Sep 26 17:00:35 * Jaffa tries to work out what he's done apart from "help people" this week Sep 26 17:32:46 Somebody want to push svn to Diablo Extras? Sep 26 17:38:05 Hi there Sep 26 17:39:16 GNUton: Hi :) Sep 26 17:39:55 Hey Andy80! :) Sep 26 17:40:15 GNUton: you remember me? :) (andrea grandi) ;) Sep 26 17:40:20 GeneralAntilles: I'd like a git package too :) Sep 26 17:40:30 Andy80: of course! :) How are you Andrea Sep 26 17:40:31 GNUton: I'm so happy for the PyQt4 release :D Sep 26 17:40:31 ? Sep 26 17:40:40 Andy80: me too! :D Sep 26 17:40:46 I'm fine, and you? How is the life in the north :P ?? Sep 26 17:40:57 AStorm, I'm playing around with on-device building without much success here. Sep 26 17:41:09 The busybox grep sucks too much to compile subversion, apparently. Sep 26 17:41:19 it does Sep 26 17:41:25 you need coreutils and others Sep 26 17:41:35 I had to hack things a bit to install all the real tools Sep 26 17:41:42 not much loss of disk space Sep 26 17:41:44 Stupid busybox Sep 26 17:41:58 busybox is not meant for a full system like the one on Maemo Sep 26 17:42:07 Andy80: it's quite good.. in these days it's sunny... Sep 26 17:42:18 Hopefully Fremantle will make it easier to replace Sep 26 17:42:22 coreutils built with uclibc are small enough Sep 26 17:42:33 GNUton: good :) Sep 26 17:42:36 but then, the device *is slow* Sep 26 17:42:47 building perl took quite long, some 20 minutes Sep 26 17:43:16 or not exactly perl, but some package from perl I required Sep 26 17:43:33 tons of stuff from CPAN Sep 26 17:43:39 it's all slow (due to tests) Sep 26 17:44:35 should use a cross compiler instead somewhere else Sep 26 17:44:46 GNUton: have you published/linked your slides in the wiki? :) Sep 26 17:44:51 but unfortunately Debian doesn't like cross Sep 26 17:45:02 there's no way to build a package w/o a full system Sep 26 17:45:07 :> Sep 26 17:45:19 Andy80: not yet.. Sep 26 17:45:34 so, it boils down to T2 SDE and Gentoo Sep 26 17:47:04 GNUton: in wich city are you? is it funny or just cold and boring? Sep 26 17:48:57 GeneralAntilles: if I could somehow rig distcc to only build on a remote machine, now that would be better, but not good enough still Sep 26 17:51:27 linking would still have to happen on the device, and so would autotools Sep 26 17:51:28 Andy80: I'm in Helsinki.. it guess it's quite funny if you have a beautiful girl and a couple of friends.. if you spend all your time behind a pc.. It's not very fun.. Sep 26 17:51:28 so, I made a test app in eclipse using maemo sdk wmware. compiles and runs fine in soapbox. what do I change now to compile for the tablet? Sep 26 17:52:37 ion_cu_vaca, compile for the armel target in scratchbox Sep 26 17:53:45 I know that I have to do that, I don't know how to do it Sep 26 17:54:10 ion_cu_vaca: ok, It's a good starting point :P Sep 26 17:56:10 GNUton: well... then I hope you have a beautiful girl and a couple of friends :) (if you don't have one, there should be enough girls there!! :D) Sep 26 17:57:25 Andy80: I've got a wonderful girl, but unfortunately she's in Italy.. :( Sep 26 17:57:46 GNUton: doh! :( Sep 26 17:57:51 heh Sep 26 18:09:31 jott: you still about? Sep 26 18:09:42 jott: I did svn update and still the same error! Sep 26 18:14:54 lardman: hmmm strange. let me do a clean checkout. Sep 26 18:22:02 Maybe if you tell me the exact problem I will locate you the missing function that you can paste in? Sep 26 18:23:05 lardman: still compiles fine. http://slexy.org/raw/s21DCIwnGw <- these are the only changes i made to svn Sep 26 18:23:24 (r1419 obviously) Sep 26 18:24:00 and then ./autogen.sh && ./configure --enable-hildon && make Sep 26 18:24:39 Maybe you have different Maemo SDKs? Sep 26 18:24:42 maybe you miss some strange dependency that i have installed and the configure script isn't looking for? Sep 26 18:24:43 BTW http://exiledonline.com/daily-inquisition-bugs-bunny-as-role-model/#more-1212 Sep 26 18:25:49 hmm Sep 26 18:25:49 woo hoo! works! compiled for armel, transfered with scp and works from first try! Sep 26 18:25:59 I wonder if I'm checking out from the right place then? Sep 26 18:27:03 svn co https://navit.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/navit/trunk <- as on the navit homepage Sep 26 18:27:24 yeah, I thought that's what I used Sep 26 18:27:28 I'll go again Sep 26 18:27:31 Damn you all and your navi highlighting ways Sep 26 18:28:06 Navi Sep 26 18:28:12 ion_cu_vaca, great. glad it worked. did you have to change something in eclipse? Sep 26 18:28:13 Navi: check for navi[\s:,] ;) Sep 26 18:28:22 :D Sep 26 18:28:43 You got my hopes up Sep 26 18:28:56 I thought someone actually wanted to talk to me ._. Sep 26 18:29:03 Nope, sorry. Sep 26 18:29:13 QQ Sep 26 18:29:39 Navi: just compile navit it will make you feel better :P Sep 26 18:29:49 Doubt it Sep 26 18:30:06 you haven't even tried :P Sep 26 18:30:07 :) so true Sep 26 18:30:08 Unless they've modeled Navit after Navi Sep 26 18:30:26 Hey! Turn left in five seconds! Sep 26 18:30:43 Listen! A stop sign is five meters away! Sep 26 18:30:49 if you miss a turn a flashing little faerie flies all over the screen obscuring your map Sep 26 18:30:53 Look! Turn left... NOW! Sep 26 18:31:07 Navi: sure, your nit glows in the dark and i bet you can make it even use flite to make it talk to you ;) Sep 26 18:31:16 :( Sep 26 18:31:32 Ha Sep 26 18:31:33 It's not the same Sep 26 18:31:34 hmm, looks like I pulled from somewhere else, certainly didn't have a trunk Sep 26 18:31:38 Somebody should put together a Navi voice for flite. Sep 26 18:31:50 lardman: ah does it work now? Sep 26 18:32:12 not sure yet, waiting for it to pull "trunk/navit/navit/script/osm2navit_sea/data" Sep 26 18:32:19 johnx, yes. menu Project->Propreties->ESBox build target->DIABLO_ARMEL Sep 26 18:32:46 ion_cu_vaca, cool. now I'll be able to answer the next person using eclipse :) Sep 26 18:37:56 * lardman twiddles his thumbs waiting for svn Sep 26 18:38:06 and decides to go and have a drink Sep 26 18:42:13 * RST38h read it as "go and have a trunk" Sep 26 18:42:37 * moontiger laughs Sep 26 18:42:38 svn to blame. Sep 26 18:45:03 * Jaffa gets outbid on an old 770 with Navicore on eBay. May have to look at some reverse engineering fun on the Wayfinder format Sep 26 18:45:47 it's encrypted afaik Sep 26 18:45:52 so happy hacking Sep 26 18:46:01 Hopefully, the market conditions next summer'll mean navigaation has to be bundled; given phones are including built-in mavigation. Sep 26 18:46:04 Bah. Sep 26 18:46:49 don't nokia's own phones already include navigation? Sep 26 18:47:04 yes, but you have to pay Sep 26 18:47:14 * keesj hopes that this includes software from a known navigation thingy company Sep 26 18:47:21 and you pay for the "service" i.e. on constant basis Sep 26 18:48:01 * RST38h bets on Google improving Mobile Gmaps to have decent navigation and pushing all these greedy motherfuckers out of the market Sep 26 18:48:06 keesj, I think Nokia owns the makers of wayfinder now. I doubt they'll go with someone else Sep 26 18:49:06 How's OSM navigation? Sep 26 18:49:23 Think they'll ever get to the point where offline turn-by-turn would be workable? Sep 26 18:49:26 GeneralAntilles, it depends on if anyone has made maps of your area I suppose Sep 26 18:50:55 OSM is useless pretty much anywhere but US Sep 26 18:51:09 what is OSM? Sep 26 18:51:11 Fine by me. :P Sep 26 18:51:15 Where it uses TIGER data afaik Sep 26 18:51:18 openstreetmap Sep 26 18:51:21 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open_Street_Map Sep 26 18:51:26 ~osm is http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open_Street_Map Sep 26 18:51:27 okay, GeneralAntilles Sep 26 18:51:31 oke... Sep 26 18:51:39 General: TIGER isn't very precise to begin with - it has not been collected for navigation Sep 26 18:52:50 http://www.techamok.com/?pid=5139 Sep 26 18:52:51 lol Sep 26 18:53:33 osm data for berlin is really good. Sep 26 18:53:47 GeneralAntilles: navit supports turn-by-turn with osm data :) Sep 26 18:53:55 (not sure how good though) Sep 26 18:54:28 Kot: I am currently suspecting Ubuntu of killing my HD Sep 26 18:54:44 killbuntu Sep 26 18:54:44 The way it starts and stops it every few seconds can't be good Sep 26 18:54:49 yeah, osm is pretty bare around here...which means 100 times better than the coverage of wayfinder Sep 26 18:55:03 ah, screw the wayfinder... Sep 26 18:55:08 rst38h: that's i think is the problem of any distro Sep 26 18:55:10 even windows Sep 26 18:55:20 Windows does not appear to do it too often Sep 26 18:55:21 stupid parkeverysecond idea Sep 26 18:55:33 I set it to ~5 minutes and this is how it does it Sep 26 18:55:34 RST38h: there was a bug in an older ubuntu version... afair. Sep 26 18:55:35 because windows accesses disk all the time Sep 26 18:55:56 i think you can try using ftool if it's a hitachi Sep 26 18:55:56 jott: Any references or fixes? I keep mine up to date though... Sep 26 18:56:05 or firmware flash Sep 26 18:56:05 Toshiba Sep 26 18:56:11 hrm Sep 26 18:56:16 RST38h: i think this one https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DanielHahler/Bug59695 Sep 26 18:56:20 aha Sep 26 18:56:22 then you have hdparm -S Sep 26 18:56:24 :) Sep 26 18:56:33 Tried that, looks ok so far Sep 26 18:57:25 and power management too Sep 26 18:57:33 -B Sep 26 19:00:04 * RST38h read the page. Evil stuff Sep 26 19:00:12 indeed. Sep 26 19:00:12 http://www.cnn.com/2008/LIVING/personal/09/26/o.improve.your.marriage/index.html Sep 26 19:00:13 :> Sep 26 19:01:11 Jaffa: will join you with the rev eng effort Sep 26 19:01:55 then again with 3G connection, may as well just use Google routing for free on the next device! Sep 26 19:02:58 You can already do that. :P Sep 26 19:03:37 yeah, expensive as it is though Sep 26 19:03:46 does it really work? like when you drive the wrong way it instantly corrects the directions? Sep 26 19:04:36 if you mean maemo-mapper, it does not work very well on directions Sep 26 19:04:42 No, it's not as fast as a real navigator. Sep 26 19:06:20 RST38h: that's the google backend though Sep 26 19:06:36 GeneralAntilles: really, most of the ones I've seen need a few seconds at least to think about it Sep 26 19:07:42 jott: aargh, same error Sep 26 19:07:55 jott: In function `navit_window_items_open':navit.c:(.text+0x36c0): undefined reference to `map_get_filename' Sep 26 19:09:42 lardman: hmmm well only thing i see now is that you miss some dependencies.. :/ Sep 26 19:10:12 hmm, that's in map.c though, in the main program Sep 26 19:10:30 http://slexy.org/raw/s20GbczSeP <- fwiw Sep 26 19:10:33 or rather it's in map.h, not in map.c Sep 26 19:11:43 still strange that you get a linker error.. Sep 26 19:12:07 do you have the fn in question declared in map.h and implemented in map.c? Sep 26 19:12:33 mmh no :O Sep 26 19:12:43 hmm Sep 26 19:13:03 I checked out from the url you have above - was different to my first checkout Sep 26 19:13:20 so you have nothing in map.h? Sep 26 19:13:27 nothing related anyway Sep 26 19:13:45 just the char *map_get_filename(struct map *this_); in map.h Sep 26 19:14:15 hmm, I wonder how you got it to link then? Sep 26 19:14:25 heh. it just did. Sep 26 19:15:03 maybe you could just comment out the line in navit/navit.c ... it seems to be just a dbg message anyway Sep 26 19:15:14 yeah, still weird though Sep 26 19:15:57 so. did you guys catch that Fennec installs nicely on a Nokia N8x0 now? Sep 26 19:16:13 oh right, and does it run nicely? Sep 26 19:16:17 lardman: indeed. esp. that it compiles and runs here... Sep 26 19:16:26 yeah looks quite ok to me. Sep 26 19:16:32 jott: if I comment that line it compiles ok Sep 26 19:16:50 hm still mysterious.. Sep 26 19:17:03 nemo, that's been the case for a while. Sep 26 19:17:16 GeneralAntilles: reallly. Sep 26 19:17:25 maybe dbg is a macro? Sep 26 19:17:30 GeneralAntilles: hrm. so I guess apart from this Milestone 8, nothing else is new Sep 26 19:17:38 jott: yeah, I was wondering that Sep 26 19:17:40 GeneralAntilles: I thought it was still in crashy alpha territory before. Sep 26 19:17:45 nemo, the N8x0 is the original Fennec demo device. Sep 26 19:17:53 Well, running doesn't have a lot to do with installing. :P Sep 26 19:17:58 jott: anyway, will try it a bit later on Sep 26 19:18:06 GeneralAntilles: oh. oops. "runs nicely" :-p Sep 26 19:18:30 runs nicely? /me jumps to try it Sep 26 19:18:32 http://starkravingfinkle.org/blog/2008/09/fennec-m8/ - I was just reading this thingy is all Sep 26 19:18:47 oh. no plugins though :( Sep 26 19:18:59 plugins will come later I'm sure Sep 26 19:19:05 it's what makes firefox, firefox :) Sep 26 19:19:16 :) Sep 26 19:19:19 yeah Sep 26 19:19:25 lardman: yeah as long as it compiles now you can finally go and mess with it :) Sep 26 19:19:41 xul is really heavy. Sep 26 19:19:44 although i'll be happy with properly rendering every page Sep 26 19:19:47 and fast Sep 26 19:19:48 :) Sep 26 19:21:11 johnx: um. not addons. plugins Sep 26 19:21:16 johnx: flash vs, say, firebug. Sep 26 19:21:29 ah, then I care even less. woo! Sep 26 19:21:44 saves me disabling flash on my own Sep 26 19:21:49 johnx: flash is number one source of firefox crashes :) Sep 26 19:22:20 and general slowness and focus stealing and johnx annoyance Sep 26 19:22:32 Top Sep 26 19:22:33 top Sep 26 19:22:34 top Sep 26 19:22:35 top Sep 26 19:22:37 flash is number of source of all linux based browser crashes :) Sep 26 19:22:39 ^ MicroB Sep 26 19:22:44 one Sep 26 19:22:46 jott: blows up windows a lot too Sep 26 19:23:08 mac os x users have no love for it either Sep 26 19:23:10 actually i really hope html5 will make flash disappear forever :) Sep 26 19:23:18 ahaha Sep 26 19:23:20 Well, it doesn't crash my browser. Sep 26 19:23:34 it survived the dotcom crash...I don't think it will ever go away Sep 26 19:23:41 Just brings it to a screeching halt for about 30 seconds with certain applets. Sep 26 19:24:00 google has the power of youtube. and 95% of the end-users use flash just because of youtube :) Sep 26 19:24:25 so if google offers html5 video rendering... :) Sep 26 19:24:27 youtube can be used with js + mplayer Sep 26 19:24:32 KotCzarny: bleh. Sep 26 19:24:35 :) Sep 26 19:24:45 KotCzarny: it can be used with wget too Sep 26 19:24:48 yes Sep 26 19:24:51 and telnet Sep 26 19:24:54 and what ever Sep 26 19:24:59 + mplayer Sep 26 19:25:00 :) Sep 26 19:25:06 still this is well below 0.0001% of users :) Sep 26 19:25:35 that's only because they have it easy Sep 26 19:25:38 :) Sep 26 19:25:52 the majority Sep 26 19:25:57 "Why back in my day..." *shakes cane* Sep 26 19:26:11 sugar cane daddy? Sep 26 19:26:13 :) Sep 26 19:26:18 yeah, that's why html5 at least brings chances to destroy flash hegemony. Sep 26 19:26:40 :) Sep 26 19:26:41 :) Sep 26 19:26:41 :) Sep 26 19:26:45 if someone invents on-the-fly swf2html5 converter.. Sep 26 19:26:58 then it could work Sep 26 19:27:05 GeneralAntilles: try to get some KotCzarny style extra lines? ;> Sep 26 19:27:25 jott, don't use smileys, or you will be next ;) Sep 26 19:27:44 KotCzarny: i use many smileys but not on a separate line ;) Sep 26 19:27:58 jott: like it does matter :) Sep 26 19:28:05 smiley is a smiley Sep 26 19:28:18 KotCzarny: http://outpo.st/irc/ :P Sep 26 19:28:20 so we reckon Fennec works? Sep 26 19:28:34 lardman, it's still slow. Sep 26 19:28:35 lol Sep 26 19:28:39 seriosusly? Sep 26 19:28:42 i'm first? Sep 26 19:28:44 O.o Sep 26 19:28:51 yeah, was in the other room sorry, multitasking! Sep 26 19:28:53 still, not even counted your "comeback" :) Sep 26 19:28:56 and i wasn't even active in the last few months Sep 26 19:28:58 :) Sep 26 19:29:18 jott: rig the fucking stats so that I get cursing award please :p Sep 26 19:29:21 Spam Sep 26 19:29:31 yeah but lcuk beats the shit out of your word count ;) Sep 26 19:29:46 jott: btw. pisg allows sorting by wordcount too Sep 26 19:29:47 :) Sep 26 19:29:48 lulz...my bt headphones crashed Sep 26 19:29:57 KotCzarny: yeah. Sep 26 19:30:17 maybe add support to sort by smiley count :P Sep 26 19:30:34 :) Sep 26 19:30:42 i think it's there already Sep 26 19:30:51 'is happy/unhappy' Sep 26 19:30:54 maybe smileys are counted at least Sep 26 19:30:57 Smiley-only lines count negative. Sep 26 19:31:03 hah Sep 26 19:31:09 chelli brings happiness to the world. 49.2% lines contained smiling faces. :) Sep 26 19:31:11 ;) Sep 26 19:32:15 anyway, it doesn't matter Sep 26 19:32:26 Nobody likes spammers anyway. Sep 26 19:32:35 qwerty12_N800: have to poke mgedmin again. Sep 26 19:32:57 GeneralAntilles: says the #2 ;) Sep 26 19:33:02 k Sep 26 19:33:03 :> Sep 26 19:33:04 :) Sep 26 19:33:38 ga will be very bad husband Sep 26 19:33:44 according to the article i posted Sep 26 19:33:56 with all his stuckness to being stiff Sep 26 19:34:09 and hatred to nonverbal communication Sep 26 19:34:10 ;) Sep 26 19:34:15 * qwerty12_N800 misread stiff part. sorry. Sep 26 19:34:19 ;) Sep 26 19:35:04 I like the idea of non-verbal communications over IRC Sep 26 19:35:10 :) Sep 26 19:35:14 we can just sit here and make faces at our computers Sep 26 19:35:32 or...no verbs? just nouns and adjectives? Sep 26 19:35:38 urls Sep 26 19:35:57 although, the effect of a good *headdesk* is lost over irc :/ Sep 26 19:36:38 *headkb* could get through Sep 26 19:38:44 oh man, I like the look of fennec on epaper :) Sep 26 19:39:31 I'm not into the non-native UI. Sep 26 19:39:51 johnx: scrolling is probably not so funny.. Sep 26 19:39:56 :> Sep 26 19:40:02 The end result seems to be bloat (xul) and poor integration. Sep 26 19:40:21 isn't epaper limited to some cycle count? Sep 26 19:40:22 * jott just tried to start it. Sep 26 19:40:25 still at 100% cpu Sep 26 19:40:37 jott, I assume they have some kind of intelligent trick to deal with scrolling on epaper Sep 26 19:40:42 GeneralAntilles, tried it yet? Sep 26 19:41:37 GeneralAntilles, try it first. then you have much more authority to bash it later. Sep 26 19:41:49 :> Sep 26 19:42:29 it's slow. this i can tell for running it a few seconds :) Sep 26 19:42:36 johnx, tried the last version. Sep 26 19:42:38 but the interface seems nice. Sep 26 19:42:57 (of course not integrated) Sep 26 19:43:29 GeneralAntilles, well apparently they improved lots of things. Anyways, I'll give you the analysis vs midori .21 in a sec Sep 26 19:43:46 and it's buggy :D Sep 26 19:44:02 the url bar floats like 50 pixel blow the top Sep 26 19:44:25 and it's a 9.5MB download O_o Sep 26 19:44:31 ok, that's skeery Sep 26 19:44:42 xul Sep 26 19:45:00 probably debug symbols too Sep 26 19:45:05 yeah they should just dump xul :) Sep 26 19:45:23 Well, it wouldn't work then. Sep 26 19:45:26 it was a bad idea in the first place ;) Sep 26 19:45:30 The interface is xul. Sep 26 19:45:30 yeah, considering how they're moving towards desktop integration everywhere Sep 26 19:45:41 yeah, that's why it's so sluggish :) Sep 26 19:45:46 "integration" Sep 26 19:46:08 GeneralAntilles, well, that's their stated goal, and xul won't help them with it Sep 26 19:46:10 More like "xul still sucks at pretending it's native". :P Sep 26 19:46:30 GeneralAntilles, I think we're agreeing :) Sep 26 19:46:34 bleh not even +/- keys work Sep 26 19:46:39 Yeah, sorry. Sep 26 19:46:47 I just really hate Firefox's non-native widgets. Sep 26 19:47:19 * jott waves fennec "goodbye" Sep 26 19:47:59 johnx, jott tried it, can I use his experience to justify my bashing? :D Sep 26 19:48:11 GeneralAntilles, you can use mine in a sec Sep 26 19:48:18 unless I love it Sep 26 19:48:22 Ha Sep 26 19:48:31 Weee neeeed neeeew seeeerveeeers Sep 26 19:49:27 a recent version of opera might be nice to have around... Sep 26 19:49:31 johnx: you love it for about 2 secs, as the default theme looks quite nice. when you start using it your opinion will change quite rapidly :) Sep 26 19:49:39 yeah a recent opera would be great. Sep 26 19:49:52 I want an updated MicroB. Sep 26 19:50:01 jott, you have an n810, right? Sep 26 19:50:05 yes Sep 26 19:50:14 you'll like it more than me I think Sep 26 19:50:20 no onscreen keyboard on the n800 Sep 26 19:50:21 hah no keyboard? Sep 26 19:50:24 and...fail Sep 26 19:50:28 haha Sep 26 19:50:47 just surf the mozilla.org startpage :D Sep 26 19:50:55 or start xvkbd Sep 26 19:50:56 :) Sep 26 19:51:05 dougt, can you guys just use Extras-devel? Sep 26 19:51:09 na, that would be too much appreciation. Sep 26 19:51:18 GeneralAntilles: for fennec? Sep 26 19:51:22 Yeah Sep 26 19:51:44 yeah would make sense. Sep 26 19:51:52 mind commenting on a bug, if I open one? Sep 26 19:51:59 dougt, sure. Sep 26 19:52:04 I get an error about not being able to find a compatible GRE Sep 26 19:52:13 I think a lot of people will want xulrunner even if they don't use Fennec, anyway. Sep 26 19:52:22 gah, I really like the idea behind it...it's such a neat idea. I guess I'll wait until things get a little more polished in a later milestone Sep 26 19:52:23 right. Sep 26 19:52:35 Well, Fennec isn't even actually an alpha yet is it? Sep 26 19:52:38 no Sep 26 19:52:50 johnx, there you go. ;) Sep 26 19:53:06 and there is a lot of stuff between alpha and release. Sep 26 19:53:10 yeah well it needs to get atleast 3-4 times as fast to be usable .. Sep 26 19:53:43 not sure how much potential is there with the current code base.. Sep 26 19:53:57 jott: there was a significant problem discovered w/ sites with flash. Sep 26 19:54:11 the flash that ships w/ the device is pretty busted. Sep 26 19:54:13 yeah well i don't care for flash :) Sep 26 19:54:26 jott: nor do i, but is found and used. Sep 26 19:54:28 but the ui itself, like the tabs and url bar. Sep 26 19:54:30 ah, there goes the keyboard! w00! Sep 26 19:54:51 and bookmarks. all is very very sluggish at the moment. Sep 26 19:55:04 GeneralAntilles: http://tinyurl.com/3escd3 Sep 26 19:55:13 ^ bugzilla prefilled for you. Sep 26 19:55:23 jott: yup. Sep 26 19:55:24 * GeneralAntilles registers an account. Sep 26 19:55:25 it is. Sep 26 19:55:40 GeneralAntilles: please cc' me. Sep 26 19:56:58 how many people work on fennec? Sep 26 19:59:11 Guided is somewhat less than appropriate for this bug. Sep 26 20:00:19 jott: 6 or so Sep 26 20:00:20 well, it's definitely great progress from earlier milestones Sep 26 20:01:07 jott: on the shoulders of the firefox giants. Sep 26 20:03:43 hm what's also quite annoying is that you always get to the left/right menus when not scrolling 100% vertical. Sep 26 20:04:38 well let's wait for 1.0 ;) Sep 26 20:04:40 hmm Sep 26 20:04:51 could someone refresh that pidgin with newer libgadu? Sep 26 20:05:03 or at least newer pidgin Sep 26 20:05:14 this version (2.4.3) fails to download contacts :> Sep 26 20:05:17 why don't you do it AStorm ? Sep 26 20:05:56 because I have no scratchbox ready Sep 26 20:06:18 and there are probably no source debs for 2.5.1 to just upload to the builder Sep 26 20:06:26 poor excuse :d Sep 26 20:06:30 hi astorm Sep 26 20:06:31 :) Sep 26 20:06:35 KotCzarny: hello Sep 26 20:06:50 build me newer pidgin (vs diablo), please Sep 26 20:07:01 or help me find one Sep 26 20:07:02 no diablo on my sb/n800 Sep 26 20:07:16 anyway, the one for chinook works Sep 26 20:07:21 so you can build against that too Sep 26 20:07:42 btw. you are still without sbox? Sep 26 20:07:55 I have one, but not prepared for building Sep 26 20:08:00 just unpacked etc. Sep 26 20:08:06 heh Sep 26 20:08:22 but it's just a matter of running one script Sep 26 20:08:23 step-by-step guide to sbox would be very appreciated Sep 26 20:08:27 which? Sep 26 20:08:34 let's try.. Sep 26 20:08:36 ~sbox Sep 26 20:08:44 ~scratchbox Sep 26 20:08:45 [scratchbox] a cross-compiling system that uses binfmt_misc, rpc calls, and an nfs mount to make a cross-build appear to be 100% native, and is found at http://www.scratchbox.org/ Sep 26 20:08:49 wrong Sep 26 20:08:50 hrm Sep 26 20:08:53 ~sdk Sep 26 20:08:54 Software Development Kit Sep 26 20:08:57 bah. Sep 26 20:08:59 ~howto scratchbox Sep 26 20:09:05 nah Sep 26 20:09:10 ~open sesame Sep 26 20:09:10 IMHO, you should get down with the genie. Sep 26 20:09:11 AStorm for installing or using it? Sep 26 20:09:18 both Sep 26 20:09:24 installing less, as I already have it Sep 26 20:09:26 i mean the sdk install instructions are fine. Sep 26 20:09:39 and the maemo 4.1 documentation is not that bad. Sep 26 20:09:54 or "reference manual" Sep 26 20:09:58 http://tablets-dev.nokia.com/4.1/INSTALL.txt Sep 26 20:10:07 http://maemo.org/development/sdks/maemo-4-1-diablo-sdk/ Sep 26 20:10:18 there is a script Sep 26 20:10:32 actually there is not much about using scratchbox for most cases. Sep 26 20:10:36 and in install you have a line to start installed sbox Sep 26 20:10:36 yeah, new sdk Sep 26 20:10:47 MOSH is spamming me with surveys Sep 26 20:10:53 jott: well, I need that, I haven't packed a .deb in some 10 years Sep 26 20:10:54 How low have the fallen! Sep 26 20:11:01 rst38h: crosspost them Sep 26 20:11:11 Urgh Sep 26 20:11:20 Kot: And they are spamming in Russian, too. Sep 26 20:11:27 AStorm: but that's more about debian packaging than scratchbox. Sep 26 20:11:46 well Sep 26 20:11:53 that is what scratchbox is used for Sep 26 20:11:54 :P Sep 26 20:12:00 maemo is debian ;P Sep 26 20:12:12 * RST38h sighs and restarts the NXC2600 board Sep 26 20:12:29 no it's not Sep 26 20:12:40 it uses dpkg and stuff Sep 26 20:12:44 but it's not a debian Sep 26 20:12:51 debian can't use closed stuff Sep 26 20:12:55 :) Sep 26 20:13:04 blah blah Sep 26 20:13:08 ok, say, debian-based Sep 26 20:13:11 better Sep 26 20:13:14 or debian offshoot Sep 26 20:13:20 debian spawn? Sep 26 20:13:21 anyway, it looks like debian to me Sep 26 20:13:33 KotCzarny, what is debian non-free? Sep 26 20:13:51 johnx: but it's not provided by default? Sep 26 20:13:59 who cares about defaults ;P Sep 26 20:14:01 only because users need them Sep 26 20:14:01 AStorm: Debian maintainers would tear you apart for saying such things Sep 26 20:14:02 KotCzarny, nope. but it's provided by the debian people Sep 26 20:14:14 RST38h: I know, because they're friggin zealots Sep 26 20:14:19 AStorm, and maemo isn't debian just because of the non-free stuff. It's not debian because it's not compatible in naming or packaging Sep 26 20:14:21 yep Sep 26 20:14:27 johnx: yes Sep 26 20:14:34 but it's definitely debian-based Sep 26 20:14:45 definitely Sep 26 20:15:09 or it was at one point. :) Now it's diverged painfully Sep 26 20:15:16 anyway, I need that pidgin quick (as in, in about 4 hours) Sep 26 20:15:30 you should make it Sep 26 20:15:32 :> Sep 26 20:15:38 yes, but.... how? :) Sep 26 20:15:44 first Sep 26 20:15:48 get to sbox Sep 26 20:16:12 Fucking shit Sep 26 20:16:12 then dpkg -x or something on pidgin-src.deb Sep 26 20:16:14 or something Sep 26 20:16:18 Unbelievable Sep 26 20:16:32 then fakeroot dpkg-buildpackage Sep 26 20:16:35 or something Sep 26 20:16:41 It is running!!! Sep 26 20:16:49 rst38h: who? Sep 26 20:16:56 RST38h, why? Sep 26 20:16:59 KotCzarny: is there source deb for pidgin 2.5.1? Sep 26 20:17:06 AKA latest release? Sep 26 20:17:12 AStorm, debian probably has one Sep 26 20:17:35 nope Sep 26 20:17:37 2.5.0-1 Sep 26 20:17:42 http://packages.debian.org/search?searchon=names&keywords=pidgin Sep 26 20:17:54 2.5.0 is ok too I think Sep 26 20:18:06 assuming it has that fixed gadugadu Sep 26 20:18:08 but prepare for dependency hell Sep 26 20:18:21 dependancy? Sep 26 20:18:21 eh, I can fix those... maybe Sep 26 20:18:23 Kot: VGBA. On the NXC2600 board. 6" screen. Sep 26 20:18:25 AStorm, I would backport just what you need, if I were you Sep 26 20:18:30 dependency is correct spelling Sep 26 20:18:31 johnx: Because I ported it Sep 26 20:18:41 johnx: impossible, architectural changes Sep 26 20:18:51 AStorm, ick Sep 26 20:18:55 AStorm, good luck O_o Sep 26 20:18:57 guess why I need 2.5 Sep 26 20:19:01 johnx: More or less recompiled it, really Sep 26 20:19:09 + added SDL glue layer Sep 26 20:19:10 someone did hildonize 2.4.3 somewhat Sep 26 20:19:18 hmmh Sep 26 20:19:31 well, a backport of that gg fixes would be great Sep 26 20:19:45 RST38h, pretty cool. BTW, I'll try out your new VGBA on the train tomorrow :) Sep 26 20:20:00 but finding the actual fix will be hard Sep 26 20:20:48 I see no svn there Sep 26 20:21:19 dougt__, @gmail.com ? Sep 26 20:22:06 doug.turner@gmail.com Sep 26 20:22:14 OK, https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=457307 Sep 26 20:23:06 KotCzarny: do you have a solution for using GG from the device? Sep 26 20:23:13 ekg Sep 26 20:23:23 wanna binary? Sep 26 20:23:25 unworkable, not responsive to touchscreen Sep 26 20:23:37 we need clicky thing there Sep 26 20:23:40 :) Sep 26 20:23:41 'we' ? Sep 26 20:23:43 :) Sep 26 20:23:50 teh users ;P Sep 26 20:23:56 fsck the users :P Sep 26 20:24:00 that was royal we Sep 26 20:24:01 let them learn :P Sep 26 20:24:03 GeneralAntilles: ty Sep 26 20:24:04 yeah learn Sep 26 20:24:10 and abuse the keyboard Sep 26 20:24:22 gg is about typing messages, right? Sep 26 20:24:27 and reading them Sep 26 20:24:29 it's much faster to use the screen Sep 26 20:24:38 instead of abusing that small n810 keyboard Sep 26 20:25:09 johnx: =) Sep 26 20:25:19 ekg especially sucks with many contacts Sep 26 20:25:26 :> Sep 26 20:25:27 he he Sep 26 20:25:30 scrub them Sep 26 20:25:33 yeah sure Sep 26 20:25:34 go quality Sep 26 20:25:37 over quantity Sep 26 20:25:39 I can't scrub them Sep 26 20:25:43 these are the core Sep 26 20:25:52 which are a bit over 50 Sep 26 20:25:52 but are they hard core? Sep 26 20:25:55 yes Sep 26 20:26:03 I could maybe drop 2 of them Sep 26 20:27:13 i'm a console freak Sep 26 20:27:30 console is not comfortable ein such a device Sep 26 20:27:30 i use pidging only because i have yet to find nice ncurses aim client Sep 26 20:27:36 *enough in Sep 26 20:27:43 for me it is Sep 26 20:27:47 centericq? Sep 26 20:27:54 (yes, it supports AIM) Sep 26 20:27:59 is it big? Sep 26 20:28:02 no Sep 26 20:28:12 thx, i'll check it later Sep 26 20:28:17 but touchscreen is so much better than most of those "portable" input devices Sep 26 20:28:33 and it's even sometimes better than the real keyboard Sep 26 20:28:44 well Sep 26 20:28:50 definitely better than mouse Sep 26 20:28:53 that's only if app isn't broken Sep 26 20:29:04 and tuned for mouse or kb Sep 26 20:29:17 how do you tune for mouse? :P Sep 26 20:29:21 rmb Sep 26 20:29:22 :P Sep 26 20:29:25 abuse right and middle click? Sep 26 20:29:26 :P Sep 26 20:29:29 yes Sep 26 20:29:55 yes, next-gen nokia device should have doublesided pen :> Sep 26 20:30:11 or mind reader, perhaps? Sep 26 20:30:19 mind reader is too hard just yet Sep 26 20:30:31 there were some successfull attepmpts Sep 26 20:30:42 but reading front and back of the stylus differently is easier Sep 26 20:30:56 not that much Sep 26 20:30:59 although it would actually need a multitouch Sep 26 20:31:06 it's not magnetic Sep 26 20:31:08 hmmmh Sep 26 20:31:13 so it can't distinguish Sep 26 20:31:17 like it can in wacoms Sep 26 20:31:18 no need for magnetic, shape is different Sep 26 20:31:23 even resistance is Sep 26 20:31:46 ah, it distinguishes finger from stylus so well already... Sep 26 20:31:52 ;P Sep 26 20:31:56 :> Sep 26 20:31:59 not too well Sep 26 20:32:12 yeah, only kinda Sep 26 20:32:14 it could, but isn't precise enough Sep 26 20:32:24 I can get it about 70% of the time Sep 26 20:32:28 headtouch Sep 26 20:32:32 ;) Sep 26 20:32:32 hehe Sep 26 20:32:43 well, more like headbang Sep 26 20:32:44 but then, you could use two different materials in stylus Sep 26 20:32:50 with huge resistance difference Sep 26 20:33:17 don't know, i know only from my experience with current implementation Sep 26 20:33:29 it can definitely get size Sep 26 20:33:33 and fake multitouch Sep 26 20:33:36 AStorm, so switch to a capacitive screen? Sep 26 20:33:36 yup Sep 26 20:33:40 so it can fake eraser Sep 26 20:33:46 not necessarily Sep 26 20:34:09 but that would make it easier, yes Sep 26 20:34:21 it would be nice to tune rmb-delay on press Sep 26 20:34:27 yup Sep 26 20:34:40 i fake multi-touch using buttons and it works great Sep 26 20:34:52 Ha Sep 26 20:34:56 keesj: but can you rock? Sep 26 20:34:56 using buttons? nah Sep 26 20:34:58 ;) Sep 26 20:35:07 and roll.. Sep 26 20:35:11 buttons aren't good enough Sep 26 20:35:19 well navit is apparently working (displays maps at least), time to see if its coord system is offset like the last time Sep 26 20:35:36 must reboot, gf wants ipod to have some songs loaded, bbl Sep 26 20:35:46 reminds me I should check if mapper finished downloading Sep 26 20:35:48 Poor lardman. . . . Sep 26 20:40:03 huh what? he has to reboot to upload to ipod? Sep 26 20:40:28 reboot to win xp i guess Sep 26 20:40:34 what for? Sep 26 20:40:47 for syncing Sep 26 20:40:50 itunes fan? Sep 26 20:41:01 available for Linux too? :P Sep 26 20:41:05 sure Sep 26 20:41:09 works fine.. Sep 26 20:41:14 but then windowsish one would get out of sync Sep 26 20:41:23 b0rken design Sep 26 20:41:28 even better as you don't have to import you collection into itunes first. Sep 26 20:41:34 oh well Sep 26 20:41:45 broken design with worm-ridden apple logo Sep 26 20:42:12 it would scream about missing tunes Sep 26 20:42:37 media libraries are evil Sep 26 20:42:40 yeah i could imagine it would even delete the song locally :) Sep 26 20:42:49 if you set itunes to "manage my songs" Sep 26 20:43:36 well media libraries are good if not borked by some stupid design decisions ... Sep 26 20:43:48 yeah, media libraries are spawns of hell Sep 26 20:43:55 I like my filesystem Sep 26 20:44:05 media libraries fail only for people who are not able to tag their stuff properly :P Sep 26 20:44:09 esp. compulsory media libraries Sep 26 20:44:20 grr Sep 26 20:44:21 no, I have the tracks tagged properly too Sep 26 20:44:27 jott, i like my tunes tagged by folders/names, thank you :P Sep 26 20:44:29 but, adding these to media lib is waste of time Sep 26 20:44:33 like "madona" "MadONNA" "MaDDona from KAZZA1" Sep 26 20:44:37 ^W in xchat is not backward-word-delete. It closes the window. Sep 26 20:44:44 not some redundant centralized junk Sep 26 20:44:58 sneakret: well, that's the default GTK shortcut for "close tab" Sep 26 20:44:59 File systems need to be better indexed. Sep 26 20:45:09 sneakret: you mean like beagle? ;P Sep 26 20:45:12 AStorm: Yeah. It's the default in Windows. Sep 26 20:45:17 too Sep 26 20:45:21 in linux too Sep 26 20:45:22 i guess Sep 26 20:45:26 at least in firefox Sep 26 20:45:29 jott: Fortunately I have no such dilemma Sep 26 20:45:30 Yeah. :( Sep 26 20:45:32 hey! stop trying to catch me up Sep 26 20:45:37 hi lcuk Sep 26 20:45:46 jott: No Madonna in my mp3 library, however you speel it =) Sep 26 20:45:46 unfortunately if you switch between shell and GUI, that ^W is pretty nasty Sep 26 20:45:52 i have stopped trying to catch up with a backlog Sep 26 20:45:55 s/shell/console/ Sep 26 20:45:55 sneakret meant: unfortunately if you switch between console and GUI, that ^W is pretty nasty Sep 26 20:46:05 Thanks, infobot. Sep 26 20:46:08 jott: most broken apps are those that can't even play files w/o adding them to media lib Sep 26 20:46:15 RST38h: hah you just try to hide it :) Sep 26 20:46:16 this is brain damage Sep 26 20:46:20 :) Sep 26 20:46:22 yup Sep 26 20:46:35 evening Sep 26 20:46:38 well works for me. :) Sep 26 20:46:41 anyway... I'm not familiar with beagle. Sep 26 20:46:45 I want to try a few tracks out before I remove them... so then I get to delete them twice Sep 26 20:46:46 thanks to booze my tooth no longer hurts \o/ Sep 26 20:46:49 hey lcuk. Sep 26 20:46:56 more booze! Sep 26 20:47:02 lcuk, i told you need disinfection Sep 26 20:47:03 :) Sep 26 20:47:05 * lcuk will NOT be coding this evening Sep 26 20:47:08 sneakret: it's the indexing engine, fairly well integrated with Gnome and KDE Sep 26 20:47:16 uses inotify Sep 26 20:47:21 Cool. Sep 26 20:47:24 Alcogolics Anonymous againt the Dental Industry Sep 26 20:47:42 yer, good job the dentist wasnt drunk Sep 26 20:47:44 ah, they use alcohol as a disinfectant? Sep 26 20:47:46 This beagle was pretty well indexed. It showed up in a google search for beagle: http://www.myfreewallpapers.net/nature/wallpapers/beagle-puppy.jpg Sep 26 20:47:47 hehehehe Sep 26 20:47:57 thou im sure in a past job he was a tunnel engineer Sep 26 20:48:02 sneakret: google for beagle search engine Sep 26 20:48:15 lcuk, remember to floss. : Sep 26 20:48:22 lcuk: a dwarf? Sep 26 20:48:23 sneakret: http://beagle-project.org/ Sep 26 20:48:31 the size of hole i couldv flossed with cat56 Sep 26 20:48:36 -6 Sep 26 20:48:37 GAN800: flossing is overrated Sep 26 20:48:48 just brush teeth after every meal as recommended Sep 26 20:48:49 Actually, beagle search engine is the top hit on google. Sep 26 20:48:51 AStorm, not if you like your teeth. Sep 26 20:48:59 sneakret: lol Sep 26 20:49:06 Brushing misses a lot Sep 26 20:49:10 I just wanted to share the picture of the beagle. :) Sep 26 20:49:11 not if done properly Sep 26 20:49:13 It was cute! Sep 26 20:49:19 and brushing after every meal is bad for your enamel. Sep 26 20:49:33 hmmm... [citation needed] Sep 26 20:49:34 snoopy is a beagle too Sep 26 20:49:39 yup Sep 26 20:49:46 astorm, its an abrasive Sep 26 20:49:48 snoopy isn't as cute as that one though. Sep 26 20:49:49 AStorm, there's no 'proper' way that'll get between teeth. Sep 26 20:50:00 flushing Sep 26 20:50:08 "Beagle is a search tool that ransacks your personal information space to find whatever you're looking for." Sep 26 20:50:09 AStorm, acid in food softens your teeth Sep 26 20:50:21 ransack has some negative connotations to me. It implies that things are left in disarray. Sep 26 20:50:26 Takes at least 30 minutes to harden back up. Sep 26 20:50:26 obviously, but then, fluoride hardens them Sep 26 20:50:29 yup Sep 26 20:50:29 but it's funny Sep 26 20:50:36 so you shouldn't use full power etc. Sep 26 20:50:40 our civilization is going to end soon anyway Sep 26 20:50:44 so what's the point Sep 26 20:50:48 Haha. Sep 26 20:51:03 :) Sep 26 20:51:03 anyway, modern toothbrush does get between teeth if used correctly Sep 26 20:51:10 No they don't. Sep 26 20:51:11 if im gonna become a savage im gonna at least have fresh minty breath Sep 26 20:51:21 GAN800: again, [citation needed] Sep 26 20:51:25 Not unless you have giant gaps between your teeth. Sep 26 20:51:28 you contradict my dentist's advice Sep 26 20:51:40 If you eat enough altoids, you can have fresh minty pee, too. Sep 26 20:51:42 AStorm, cite your own 'facts'. Sep 26 20:51:51 dentists are part of white mafia Sep 26 20:51:58 I dare someone to ask me to prove that one. ;) Sep 26 20:51:58 nothin worse than linux folks startin a flamewar between flossing and brushing Sep 26 20:52:03 they are going to make you buy products Sep 26 20:52:08 AStorm, well, this is from my own dentist and a hygenist. Sep 26 20:52:31 sneakret, Altoids are bad for your teeth, sadly. Sep 26 20:52:33 hmmh Sep 26 20:52:41 yes, they are sugar Sep 26 20:52:45 "nothin worse than linux folks startin a flamewar between flossing and brushing" <- that was worthy of being quoted. Sep 26 20:53:10 how about linux folks trying to sing? Sep 26 20:53:17 together Sep 26 20:53:17 sneakret, im sure ive made many more quotable lines :) Sep 26 20:53:18 :) Sep 26 20:53:25 can't be as bad as RMS singing. Sep 26 20:53:33 pms singing Sep 26 20:53:35 :) Sep 26 20:53:52 singing with pms Sep 26 20:54:01 sneakret: it could be rms times "number of people singing" Sep 26 20:54:09 GAN800: obviously, soft fibers are recommended Sep 26 20:54:12 so it can get worse :) Sep 26 20:54:32 and yes, proper technique does remove most of the material from tooth gaps Sep 26 20:54:50 you could floss, but this can't replace brushing teeth Sep 26 20:54:51 That's highly dependent on the person. Sep 26 20:55:03 AStorm, who argued that flossing replaces brushing? <_< Sep 26 20:55:04 hey qwerty12_N800 :) dont see you around much Sep 26 20:55:48 and every free software fan should support "floss" :P Sep 26 20:55:55 GeneralAntilles: I've yet to see a person who flosses after brushing teeth ;P Sep 26 20:55:58 lol jott Sep 26 20:56:04 :) Sep 26 20:56:09 lcuk: hey :), i'm lurking more now :) Sep 26 20:56:12 or before Sep 26 20:56:15 but m$ says oss is bad Sep 26 20:56:19 AStorm, must hang out with a lot of people with stinky breath, then. ;) Sep 26 20:56:20 for humankind Sep 26 20:56:26 thats perfectly ok, just hope you are still doin ok Sep 26 20:56:50 qwerty12_N800's been failing @ teh schoolz. :P Sep 26 20:57:01 Now his parent's've got him grounded. ;) Sep 26 20:57:03 he got caught hazz0ring Sep 26 20:57:07 xx even Sep 26 20:57:10 * lcuk cant type again Sep 26 20:57:11 lcuk: yeh, i'm doing good thanks :D Sep 26 20:57:19 GeneralAntilles: so true >.< Sep 26 20:57:21 excellent Sep 26 20:57:25 RMS singing the free software song: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1BH7poMtPVU&feature=related Sep 26 20:57:32 Haaaa Sep 26 20:57:41 lcuk: xx eh? Sep 26 20:57:46 qwerty12_N800, remember, your education is important for your future. :P Sep 26 20:57:49 joooin us noooow and shaaaare the soooooftware Sep 26 20:57:51 don't open that unless you want your head to explode Sep 26 20:58:08 or are deaf Sep 26 20:58:13 haxx0r Sep 26 20:58:18 GeneralAntilles, horrible lies :P Sep 26 20:58:20 yeah rickrolling is out, rmsing is better :) Sep 26 20:58:38 it's more in the spirit of floss :D Sep 26 20:58:52 GeneralAntilles: yeah, i'm trying to curb my habit of leaving things till last minute lol. rushed my coursework this morning >.< Sep 26 20:59:02 Haha Sep 26 20:59:05 Haha. People applauded at the end of that song! Sep 26 20:59:07 But procrastination is fun! Sep 26 20:59:12 jott: floss = Free Losing Open Source Software? Sep 26 20:59:14 ;) Sep 26 20:59:19 AStorm: exactly :) Sep 26 20:59:22 well Sep 26 20:59:26 not really :) Sep 26 20:59:37 or was that Free Licenced Open Source Software or whatever? Sep 26 20:59:39 l = libre Sep 26 20:59:48 Free Free? ;P Sep 26 20:59:49 lucid ? Sep 26 20:59:56 lurking? Sep 26 21:00:01 We know which licence is really free Sep 26 21:00:01 lunatic? Sep 26 21:00:10 * AStorm awaits the licence flame war Sep 26 21:00:12 Freaking Lunatic Sep 26 21:00:15 Hey, this is kinda cool: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S-xb1miTjoE&feature=related Sep 26 21:00:25 what we need is for software patents to be short Sep 26 21:00:36 that would probably be enough Sep 26 21:00:57 As in "Violation punishable by death" Sep 26 21:01:12 (a 70s funk version of the free software song) Sep 26 21:01:53 * RST38h wonders if cutting down screen size, scaling, and the number of drawn frames will make vgba faster on the nxc2600 Sep 26 21:02:00 only one way to know... Sep 26 21:02:09 cut the bastard! Sep 26 21:02:12 blah, tongue cleaners are overrated Sep 26 21:02:25 astorm: candida alibins? Sep 26 21:02:26 :> Sep 26 21:02:30 albinis Sep 26 21:02:38 albicans if you mean that Sep 26 21:02:46 probably Sep 26 21:03:00 i usually see only first part of the name Sep 26 21:03:01 actually, there was a nice scientific efficacy test Sep 26 21:03:12 a proper mouthwash was more effective ;P Sep 26 21:03:22 yes, just spit in the glass of water Sep 26 21:03:37 if it's glue-jello like Sep 26 21:03:39 you have it Sep 26 21:03:40 :) Sep 26 21:04:53 not necessarily that one Sep 26 21:05:04 other germs produce biofilms too Sep 26 21:05:27 still, you have something infecting your oral cavities Sep 26 21:05:39 definitely, as has everyone ;P Sep 26 21:05:49 but then, you have a lot of it Sep 26 21:05:57 oral cavities? Sep 26 21:07:45 no, germs... obviously, there's one oral cavity Sep 26 21:08:05 more with genetic failures Sep 26 21:08:15 I think patents (and intellectual property laws in general) need reform. They were intended to reward innovation and creativity rather than stifle it. Sep 26 21:08:46 No shit? :P Sep 26 21:08:59 sneakret: that would be nice, if the lawmakers weren't close friends with bussiness Sep 26 21:09:45 GA: I realize I'm stating the obvious, but it's not so obvious that it's happening. Sep 26 21:10:20 I sure hope society can eventually repay Walt Disney for inventing Mickey Mouse! Sep 26 21:10:29 :) Sep 26 21:10:33 he's dead Sep 26 21:10:37 Exactly. Sep 26 21:10:49 and his copyright lives on Sep 26 21:10:52 hitting the clone isn't the same Sep 26 21:10:53 er...trademark Sep 26 21:10:54 whatever Sep 26 21:11:10 it's the mickey mouse rule Sep 26 21:11:28 every time mickey mouse is in danger of going into the public domain, copyrights must be extended Sep 26 21:11:40 Yeah. That's why I chose Mickey. :) Sep 26 21:12:41 trademark is ok Sep 26 21:12:56 patents are definitely another issue Sep 26 21:13:01 how bout copyright? Sep 26 21:13:05 Mickey is not patented, but trademarked Sep 26 21:13:07 and what makes trademarks okay? Sep 26 21:13:10 copyright is... well :) Sep 26 21:13:17 hmm Sep 26 21:13:24 the problem is not copyright, but patent Sep 26 21:13:27 isn't it that they hunt down mm clones? Sep 26 21:13:29 Oh? Sep 26 21:13:50 Copyright is a problem too, in my opinion. Sep 26 21:13:51 yeah, e.g. MP3 was patented, it only began to spread because of leaked illegal copies of encoders ;P Sep 26 21:14:08 then reimplementation (still patented) spread Sep 26 21:14:19 Sure... LZW, too. Sep 26 21:14:40 sneakret: it really is not, because copyright can't harm others :> Sep 26 21:14:42 I agree that patents are a problem. I think copyright is also a problem. Sep 26 21:14:50 m$ windows/dos to Sep 26 21:14:51 what can harm is underdescribed protocols Sep 26 21:14:51 too Sep 26 21:15:04 and x86 pcs too Sep 26 21:15:22 although that was intended i think Sep 26 21:15:23 patents are the worst problem, copyright's are an unfortunate limitation and trademarks are just annoying sometimes Sep 26 21:15:25 trick is, copyright should not amount to protocols Sep 26 21:15:36 and deciphering protocols should not be considered reverse engineering Sep 26 21:15:39 I can go along with johnx Sep 26 21:15:51 That's how I'd rank them too. Sep 26 21:16:06 * lcuk cannot find svn for tablet anymore - has anyone seen it anywhere? Sep 26 21:16:15 deciphering algorithms... meh, shouldn't be too Sep 26 21:16:20 how about hw access protocols? Sep 26 21:16:28 this clause should die Sep 26 21:16:31 that does not stop the copyright mafia :) Sep 26 21:16:34 oops Sep 26 21:16:38 backscroll :D Sep 26 21:16:50 AStorm: Yeah, now you're starting to talk about why I say copyright is a problem. Sep 26 21:17:10 reverse engineering costs money and time anyway :) and you can actually patent your UI solutions Sep 26 21:17:13 and algorithms Sep 26 21:17:16 There are clauses and surrounding laws that make copyright suck. Sep 26 21:17:41 I'm sure the ipod touch wheel is patented Sep 26 21:17:41 trick is, how does the company profit if a competitor rev-engs their product Sep 26 21:17:58 actually, reverse engineering is... a slow method Sep 26 21:18:01 Yep. Sep 26 21:18:19 Intellectual property isn't simple to resolve. :) Sep 26 21:18:20 and you can patent the algorithms anyway (somewhere) Sep 26 21:18:31 somewhere? Sep 26 21:18:37 in some parts of the world Sep 26 21:18:43 Ah. Yeah, in the US. Sep 26 21:18:48 lcuk, Chinook Extras. Sep 26 21:18:49 EU too Sep 26 21:18:59 Nobody has packaged it up for Diablo Extras. Sep 26 21:19:05 you can also register them in eu but you can't really enforce them in the eu. Sep 26 21:19:10 but, the patent clause is idiotic, it is far too long Sep 26 21:19:21 "provisional" Sep 26 21:19:28 so, that's where the reverse engineering clause steps in Sep 26 21:19:34 it's because no one expected the progress Sep 26 21:19:56 to make everyone unable to produce a similar product Sep 26 21:20:06 copyright actually has nothing to do with reverse engineering Sep 26 21:20:10 thanks GeneralAntilles :) Sep 26 21:20:13 while IP on protocols should be banned Sep 26 21:20:32 i wonder when someone patents bliny, or pancakes Sep 26 21:20:36 Intellectual Property is a lie Sep 26 21:20:39 "IP on protocols"... haha Sep 26 21:20:42 software patents are not Sep 26 21:20:47 jott, package svn up for Diablo Extras. Sep 26 21:20:49 Just IPv4, or are you including IPv6 in that? Sep 26 21:21:12 GeneralAntilles: 1.5 or is 1.4 enough? :) Sep 26 21:21:13 there's no intellectual property, while you can patent algorithms already (e.g. chemicals) Sep 26 21:21:24 jott, whatever's handy. Sep 26 21:21:42 medical companies do it all the time (and too long time also) Sep 26 21:22:03 I wanna copyright my DNA, then design a virus that splices it into other people, and sue them. Sep 26 21:22:04 patents should automatically expire on failure to produce in a set time Sep 26 21:22:31 It'd also be nice if patents expired if they went unenforced for too long. Sep 26 21:22:33 sneakret: pity, you actually can't patent life just yet Sep 26 21:22:35 patents are much more effective than copyright :) Sep 26 21:22:35 similar to trademark Sep 26 21:22:42 hmm Sep 26 21:22:42 some guys tried to do that Sep 26 21:22:52 aren't some folks patenting dna? Sep 26 21:22:59 or something related to it Sep 26 21:23:04 read up on Mycobacterium laboratoriae (or sth) JVCI-1.0 Sep 26 21:23:08 Yeah. The mapping of DNA. Sep 26 21:23:11 or whatever Sep 26 21:23:14 yeah Sep 26 21:23:15 of the human genome, specifically Sep 26 21:23:16 that's it Sep 26 21:23:25 so I was just taking it to another ludicrous level. Sep 26 21:23:34 trick is, that can't be patented as it's not an invention Sep 26 21:23:41 you can't patent your own DNA ;P Sep 26 21:23:46 why? Sep 26 21:23:54 if i am special Sep 26 21:24:02 and it can be used for something? Sep 26 21:24:09 that bacterium is synthetic... so the whole organism could theoretically be patented... if patent system allowed that Sep 26 21:24:10 and no one else has it? Sep 26 21:24:23 as organisms are not considered inventions, even if synthetic Sep 26 21:24:41 somehow though, math IS an invention Sep 26 21:24:43 KotCzarny: no, it's not an invention, it's prior work Sep 26 21:24:45 That's bizarre. Sep 26 21:24:48 sneakret: prior work again Sep 26 21:25:00 well Sep 26 21:25:05 AStorm: Hmm? Sep 26 21:25:28 you can patent algos Sep 26 21:25:28 right? Sep 26 21:25:28 math is all algosw Sep 26 21:25:28 math as a whole was described long before patent system was in place Sep 26 21:25:28 algos Sep 26 21:25:31 some algorithms Sep 26 21:25:36 you can't patent long division for example Sep 26 21:25:38 :> Sep 26 21:25:53 :) Sep 26 21:26:05 but you can patent physical application Sep 26 21:26:06 AStorm: Ah. I meant specific mathematic discoveries can be patented as if they're inventions. Sep 26 21:26:07 but if you find a new way to do that operation, be sure to patent it Sep 26 21:26:15 when in fact they're inherent laws Sep 26 21:26:16 discoveries? Sep 26 21:26:22 like which? Sep 26 21:26:39 methods to solve misc things? Sep 26 21:26:50 == algorithms Sep 26 21:26:59 you can't patent the law these are based on Sep 26 21:27:07 http://righttocreate.blogspot.com/2005/12/ridiculous-patent-patenting-math.html Sep 26 21:27:21 what if there is only one way to solve something? Sep 26 21:27:42 or one "best" way Sep 26 21:27:51 where everything else is just an approximation or obfuscation Sep 26 21:27:52 that one is previous work Sep 26 21:28:01 they can patent the circuit, but not algorithm Sep 26 21:28:11 that algorithm was long known and described in literature Sep 26 21:28:22 enforcing this will fail in court Sep 26 21:28:36 sure. Sep 26 21:28:46 It's still patented. Sep 26 21:28:52 just obfuscate it with weird words Sep 26 21:28:55 and it is still a nuisance to be sued Sep 26 21:28:59 and people at patent office allow it Sep 26 21:29:11 sneakret: yes, so what? Sep 26 21:29:23 they will pay the costs, not even the best lawyer would get them out of it Sep 26 21:29:28 http://www.amazon.com/Math-You-Cant-Use-Copyright/dp/0815749422 Sep 26 21:29:49 KotCzarny: yes, so what? a court will reject it Sep 26 21:30:01 what if they bribe the court? Sep 26 21:30:02 :> Sep 26 21:30:02 patent can be contested in court as most other things Sep 26 21:30:05 If you the party suing you has enough money, and you have little enough, it doesn't really matter if they win the suit. They can still put you out of business. Sep 26 21:30:11 law is a law Sep 26 21:30:12 then they break the law already by bribery Sep 26 21:30:14 no matter how stupid Sep 26 21:30:14 ;P Sep 26 21:30:15 :) Sep 26 21:30:27 sneakret: they can stop your business Sep 26 21:30:44 which is horrible in case of patents Sep 26 21:31:00 hmm Sep 26 21:31:05 the clause should be revised to disallow such stupid actions and instead require a full recall if a violation is found Sep 26 21:31:06 someone tried to patent @ also Sep 26 21:31:09 Yeah. So when you say math can't be patented, it seems like that's only a technicality. Sep 26 21:31:15 and doubleclick Sep 26 21:31:15 X-Fade, when the fuck are we gonna get git as an RCS on the garage? Sep 26 21:31:22 sneakret: laws can't be Sep 26 21:31:22 (or was it tripleclick) Sep 26 21:31:28 algorithms based on the laws can Sep 26 21:31:29 laws can't be what? Sep 26 21:31:34 patented Sep 26 21:31:41 Oh. Mathematic laws. Gotcha. Sep 26 21:32:07 so, if they manage to compute small cosines another way, then they win Sep 26 21:32:12 Still, if someone patented the provably most efficient way of calculating pi, that would suck. Sep 26 21:32:31 well, that patent should be impossible to extend Sep 26 21:32:40 patent extension is the most horrible thing ever Sep 26 21:32:42 it should die Sep 26 21:32:51 crashanddie, you don't remember the answer to that one from before? :P Sep 26 21:33:01 and it should be short enough in case of software Sep 26 21:33:04 crashanddie, it's a very non-trivial task to integrate it into gforge. Sep 26 21:33:10 crashanddie, feel free to provide patches, though. ;) Sep 26 21:33:15 at most a few years (as in, <=5) Sep 26 21:33:18 bleh Sep 26 21:33:32 crashanddie, you could always talk a semi-integrated solution, though. Sep 26 21:33:45 GeneralAntilles, I might have had a few beers, my memory doesn't serve me well Sep 26 21:33:46 patents are meant to provide a headstart to the developer of technology Sep 26 21:33:50 i.e., account sharing, but no website-integration. Sep 26 21:33:54 Extension of copyright is also something I'd like to see killed. Sep 26 21:33:57 were meant Sep 26 21:34:14 well, copyright is not timed Sep 26 21:34:15 now it's a lock on competition Sep 26 21:34:25 actually, it is, but it's specifically a very long time Sep 26 21:34:37 GeneralAntilles, I just want to have a RCS that allows a circular development, and that tracks contents, not files Sep 26 21:34:37 Yeah. And you can file for extensions. Sep 26 21:34:42 as copyright was meant to work for life of an artist Sep 26 21:35:03 copyright should never have been extended to corporations... or in that case, should've been impossible to extend Sep 26 21:35:26 AStorm: You keep saying you disagree, but then you agree. Sep 26 21:35:40 well, I do agree Sep 26 21:35:49 but copyright can be longer, much longer than patent Sep 26 21:36:08 it's nowhere as important as patents Sep 26 21:36:11 Hmm... you're talking as if you know more about this than everyone else here. Sep 26 21:36:13 crashanddie, well, poke -community. Sep 26 21:36:28 sneakret: see, copyright is on this exact product Sep 26 21:36:35 crashanddie, and get with ferenc Sep 26 21:36:37 not on a whole family of products Sep 26 21:36:39 AStorm: I know about copyright. Sep 26 21:36:47 I know about patent. Sep 26 21:36:53 good for you :) Sep 26 21:36:59 * lcuk burps Sep 26 21:37:00 Dude. Sep 26 21:37:04 No, I know about copyright!!!! >:| Sep 26 21:37:05 You're being pretty obnoxious. Sep 26 21:37:14 I'm sorry, what? Sep 26 21:37:14 You're lecturing on stuff. Sep 26 21:37:20 Yeah Sep 26 21:37:29 I have to stop being a preacher Sep 26 21:37:41 who? Sep 26 21:37:41 I say something, then you disagree, then you explain it as if I don't know about it, then you agree. Sep 26 21:37:50 Sorry. Talking to AStorm. Sep 26 21:37:57 Haaa Sep 26 21:37:59 well Sep 26 21:38:04 it's a matter of dictionaries Sep 26 21:38:06 sneakret: well, in case of copyrights, you're right Sep 26 21:38:12 and explaining thoughts Sep 26 21:38:14 but in case of patents vs math, you were wrong :) Sep 26 21:38:23 I said "math can be copyrighted" Sep 26 21:38:26 er... patented Sep 26 21:38:27 it's usually the cause of misunderstandngs Sep 26 21:38:31 math can't Sep 26 21:38:35 Haha. Sep 26 21:38:36 algorithms can Sep 26 21:38:37 :) Sep 26 21:38:42 Algorithms are math. Sep 26 21:38:47 algorithms ) math Sep 26 21:38:48 They fall within that space. Sep 26 21:38:59 I wasn't saying "all math can be patented" Sep 26 21:39:19 well, it sounded like that, you didn't qualify which part of math ;P Sep 26 21:39:25 No, I didn't. Sep 26 21:39:30 the default quantifier is "any" Sep 26 21:39:36 To you, maybe. Sep 26 21:39:41 no, in math Sep 26 21:39:49 * lcuk pisses higher than KotCzarny Sep 26 21:39:49 or even, every Sep 26 21:39:50 It might make sense for the default qualifier to be the one that makes sense. Sep 26 21:39:53 ;) Sep 26 21:39:59 math is more than algos Sep 26 21:40:04 Yep. Sep 26 21:40:20 lcuk: but i piss more freely Sep 26 21:40:23 sneakret: well, math is about generalization Sep 26 21:40:36 math is about modelling Sep 26 21:40:44 * lcuk drinks more and hits the ceiling of the chatroom Sep 26 21:40:51 so there the default quantifier is "for every possible value of variables" Sep 26 21:40:58 AStorm: If I use "math" in a sentence, it doesn't mean Sep 26 21:41:00 I think language should follow that rule too Sep 26 21:41:02 ;P Sep 26 21:41:19 (unless context suggest something else) Sep 26 21:41:21 ... it doesn't mean my language is suddenly bound by mathematic conventions Sep 26 21:41:23 (and it didn't) Sep 26 21:42:13 so, again, we're at miscommunication ;P Sep 26 21:42:16 Yeah. Sep 26 21:42:50 welcome to the internet. Sep 26 21:42:58 :) Sep 26 21:43:01 heh... are there some free vector maps I could abuse? Sep 26 21:43:07 osm Sep 26 21:43:17 these are vector? excellent Sep 26 21:43:23 i believe so yes Sep 26 21:43:24 so, regarding miscommunication... I've found that rather than looking for a way in which someone is wrong, it's more effective to look for a way to interpret what someone says so that it makes sense, then restate it for clarification. Sep 26 21:43:24 I know they're missing much Sep 26 21:43:33 http://3d2f.com/tags/trace/map/ Sep 26 21:43:34 People don't go "Dude. You're being obnoxious." Sep 26 21:43:35 :) Sep 26 21:43:43 sneakret: except sense is relative Sep 26 21:43:45 but advertising for them and using where practical makes for a better experience as others join in Sep 26 21:43:51 there's no "common" sense Sep 26 21:43:55 AStorm: Sure. That's why you restate it. Sep 26 21:44:12 I'm just saying... look for a way to agree rather than disagree. Sep 26 21:44:22 hmmh Sep 26 21:44:24 You can reach the same conclusion. Sep 26 21:44:27 math isn't relative Sep 26 21:44:50 i think it's the only thing in universe (other than God) that isn't Sep 26 21:44:52 if you remove notation from it, then definitely it's not :) Sep 26 21:45:15 my mother in law isnt relative either (or i wish) Sep 26 21:45:20 KotCzarny: hard science isn't relative, hehe Sep 26 21:45:20 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abuse_of_notation Sep 26 21:45:21 :) Sep 26 21:45:36 hard science works on perceived world Sep 26 21:45:44 and our ways to perceive are flunky Sep 26 21:45:49 => relative Sep 26 21:46:51 has anyone tried to steal the vector maps from google maps instead of the tiles? Sep 26 21:47:06 * lcuk feels funky - mouth startin to throb agian Sep 26 21:47:27 lcuk, apply more anasthesia Sep 26 21:47:29 Jeez, lcuk. Sep 26 21:47:32 mavhc, i guess yo uare gonna try soon Sep 26 21:47:38 im out of beer Sep 26 21:47:42 KotCzarny: well, hard is the non-relative part Sep 26 21:47:45 any other anasthesia? Sep 26 21:47:54 astorm: still, you work on flunky data Sep 26 21:47:58 or that relativity is very precisely described by laws (guess, physics) Sep 26 21:48:08 only hard coding Sep 26 21:48:18 lcuk: bats? Sep 26 21:48:33 KotCzarny: flunky data is described by error laws Sep 26 21:48:33 lcuk, you know they sell stuff at the drug store for oral pain, right? Sep 26 21:48:55 which is part of statistics, which is a branch of math Sep 26 21:48:59 drugs + alco == bad things happen Sep 26 21:49:00 :P Sep 26 21:49:10 Local anesthetic. Sep 26 21:49:13 some drugs, yes, NSAIDs and antibiotics Sep 26 21:49:14 astorm: applied math Sep 26 21:49:27 KotCzarny: pure too Sep 26 21:49:40 if it involves statistical DATA, then not Sep 26 21:49:45 Something like Orajel Sep 26 21:49:54 algos in statistics are pure Sep 26 21:49:55 yes, then it's math applied to data Sep 26 21:50:15 you can say that something is true with a confidence interval of... Sep 26 21:50:19 GeneralAntilles, yer but im a man - i have a god given right to moan and complain and not do anything about it :D Sep 26 21:50:34 (or in other words, with probability of...) Sep 26 21:50:38 lcuk, suit yourself. :P Sep 26 21:50:53 besides it only hurts when i yawn for now Sep 26 21:51:01 or eat? Sep 26 21:51:03 :> Sep 26 21:51:19 havin 3 hands a drill and a hoover in my mouth tents to strain it somewhat Sep 26 21:51:26 i had spag bol Sep 26 21:51:48 spag bol? Sep 26 21:52:26 spaghetti bolognese Sep 26 21:52:38 mmm Sep 26 21:52:39 yummy Sep 26 21:52:45 have a soup ;P Sep 26 21:52:52 i haven't eaten spaghetti for a long time Sep 26 21:53:20 im good at sucking Sep 26 21:53:45 (thats another quote people will take out of context) it only hurts when i have to open my mouth wide Sep 26 21:53:49 fnarr Sep 26 21:54:21 lol jaffa - why have you got "sucking" as a highlight thing. you only stopped lurkin when i mentioned it :P Sep 26 21:54:23 lcuk: fearing double entendre? Sep 26 21:54:34 wouldnt be the first time in here Sep 26 21:55:15 lcuk: coincidence, I brought back up my screen session to set something downloading with wget Sep 26 21:55:26 lcuk: I thought "it only hurts when I yawn" was a pretty funny followup to your comment about having the right to complain and do nothing about it. It was kinda the ultimate expression of apathy. Sep 26 21:55:38 heh Sep 26 21:55:42 :) Sep 26 21:56:12 it should settle down soon, at least i can talk now Sep 26 21:56:22 I can't hear you! Sep 26 21:56:48 put your ear closer to the monitor then Sep 26 21:56:51 joinusnowandsharethesoftwaareyouwillbefreehackerssyoullbefreee Sep 26 21:56:59 Haha. That's stuck in my head too. Sep 26 21:57:22 we will kick out those dirty licences Sep 26 21:57:23 :) Sep 26 21:57:36 It's so bad it's catchy! Sep 26 21:57:39 yup Sep 26 21:57:45 looking for advice for the best lightweight http server for n800/os2008/diablo. had apache, but it's really overkill for what i need. i've read about thttpd, but can't seem to find it for os2008 Sep 26 21:58:04 * Jaffa had to do a quick Google after reading a couple of bits from Russell T. Davies' book which the Times printed last week whilst we were in Berlin; including some stuff about the Christmas Special (Doctor Who) Sep 26 21:58:19 cool jaffa Sep 26 21:58:28 thttpd ? Sep 26 21:58:28 that reminds me, i got nivens latest book Sep 26 21:58:43 it was meant to come in time for the summit, but arrived a couple of hours after i setoff Sep 26 21:58:43 lighttpd could work too Sep 26 22:00:17 jaffa - did they print extracts or could you get the book itself? Sep 26 22:00:27 mind you, it was the times, it probably had the hardback included Sep 26 22:00:36 * lcuk rememebers those hefty bastards from bein a paperboy Sep 26 22:02:48 As far as I can tell, there aren't any downloadable builds of lighttpd or thttpd for os2008 Sep 26 22:02:58 wanna bin? Sep 26 22:03:03 i think it compiles cleanly Sep 26 22:03:14 I think tlacuache would appreciate it. Sep 26 22:03:45 yeah, that's what i found Sep 26 22:03:59 couldn't find a build for 2008 Sep 26 22:04:05 tlacuache: Sounds like KotCzarny is volunteering to provide you with one. Sep 26 22:04:10 that'd be sweet Sep 26 22:04:20 but compiling will be good for you Sep 26 22:04:23 Haha. Sep 26 22:04:26 as it's a trivial task Sep 26 22:04:28 :) Sep 26 22:04:37 Oh? Sep 26 22:04:45 yes Sep 26 22:04:48 i've not cross-compiled for my tablet yet, i'm afraid. Sep 26 22:04:59 unpack, ./configure, make Sep 26 22:05:10 Ah. Once you have a build enviromnent. Sep 26 22:05:21 :) Sep 26 22:05:23 Getting the build environment set up isn't trivial. Sep 26 22:05:31 that one is a matter of running one script Sep 26 22:05:39 at least was for me Sep 26 22:05:41 :) Sep 26 22:05:41 Oh yeah? Sep 26 22:05:51 Enlighten me. Sep 26 22:05:54 downloads and installs everything Sep 26 22:05:58 Awesome. Sep 26 22:06:23 that was around april though Sep 26 22:06:35 don't know if the complicated things in diablo sdk Sep 26 22:06:38 you could even use the vmware image if you don't have linux running :) Sep 26 22:06:46 lcuk: two extracts; book's supposed to be good. Lots of interesting behind-the-scenes stuff: it a series of emails between RTD and the co-writer Sep 26 22:06:52 http://maemo.org/development/sdks/maemo-4-1-diablo-sdk/ Sep 26 22:06:56 Almost blog-like Sep 26 22:06:57 there is a script Sep 26 22:07:00 na, it's always trivial. at least if you use the right distribution :) Sep 26 22:07:13 jott: worked in slackware :) Sep 26 22:07:17 jaffa, cool i may have to check it out Sep 26 22:07:25 Seems like it wasn't trivial in ubuntu when I did it. Sep 26 22:07:34 It wasn't extremely painful though. Sep 26 22:07:39 ubuntu/debian couldn't be easier. Sep 26 22:07:42 Oh? Sep 26 22:07:50 Hook me up! Sep 26 22:07:51 it was made for ubuntu/debian. :/ Sep 26 22:08:01 just read the 3 step manual :) Sep 26 22:08:04 Maybe the doc I found was overcomplicated. Sep 26 22:08:11 Maybe I WILL! Sep 26 22:08:14 that's what you get for giving clicky-shiny ui for the people! Sep 26 22:08:27 http://tablets-dev.nokia.com/4.1/INSTALL.txt Sep 26 22:08:32 I think maybe the doc I found was trying to set up too much other crap. Sep 26 22:08:48 maybe you just tried to follow manual install chapter Sep 26 22:08:52 my n810 diablo just asked me to update canola, but then said it can't find python2.5-terra, am I missing a repo? Sep 26 22:08:53 Could be. Sep 26 22:08:54 instead of 'automatic install' one Sep 26 22:09:25 manual install is indeed longer Sep 26 22:09:27 mavhc, ignore it or disable Extra-devel. Sep 26 22:09:27 i mean it boils down to run "maemo-scratchbox-install_4.1.sh" as root and "maemo-sdk-install_4.1.sh" as user Sep 26 22:09:31 good to know how it works Sep 26 22:09:31 mahvc do you have extras-devel Sep 26 22:09:52 but then automatic script is just doing all those steps in a script Sep 26 22:09:53 :) Sep 26 22:09:56 even the vsdo stuff should show up in the script.... Sep 26 22:10:11 so you won't have to look it up Sep 26 22:10:17 Ahaha. The Canola flickr plugin is _awesome_. Sep 26 22:10:29 GA: Oh yeah? Sep 26 22:10:30 GeneralAntilles: I was so happy about that :) Sep 26 22:10:35 Good to hear! Sep 26 22:11:20 * GeneralAntilles browses handful_'s Summit photos. Sep 26 22:11:29 handful_: yes, should I not? Sep 26 22:11:36 Oh. I know what was wrong with the installation instructions. It didn't define the components. Sep 26 22:12:27 mavhc, just ignore it. Sep 26 22:12:32 It's a false alarm. ;) Sep 26 22:12:33 mavhc: yes.. you shouldnt.. because cabnoola beta10 is bening uploaded Sep 26 22:12:37 yeah Sep 26 22:12:40 we are fighting Sep 26 22:12:43 it just assumes you know what scratchbox is, etc. Sep 26 22:12:46 against segfaults :) Sep 26 22:12:47 Extras-devel is fine in general, though. Sep 26 22:13:13 well Sep 26 22:13:23 those are install instructions. read it up elsewhere if you want to know :/ Sep 26 22:13:23 there is a script for scratchbox install too Sep 26 22:13:27 so just ignore the errors if I have it enabled? Sep 26 22:13:47 jott: I understand that the information is available. :) Sep 26 22:14:15 but a summary sentence would also be cool Sep 26 22:14:28 file a bug. Sep 26 22:14:36 handful_, what are you shooting with? The close up of that wooden motorcycle model looks really nice. Sep 26 22:14:52 mavhc, yes, just ignore it for now. Sep 26 22:14:53 what? Sep 26 22:14:54 but still. those are installation instructions. you should know what you want to install ;) Sep 26 22:15:10 I haven't actually done any NIT development yet, and I'm not familiar with the tools. Where should I start? Sep 26 22:15:13 ah the pictures? Sep 26 22:15:15 Yeah Sep 26 22:15:21 sneakret: maemo reference manual? Sep 26 22:15:21 How to I learn what I want to install? :) Sep 26 22:15:24 it's the cheapest canon Sep 26 22:15:27 the rebel xti Sep 26 22:15:28 :) Sep 26 22:15:30 thanks Sep 26 22:15:31 I am a noob :)O Sep 26 22:15:36 Hehe Sep 26 22:15:41 * GeneralAntilles also has an XTi. Sep 26 22:15:55 Just got on the DSLR train a few months ago. Sep 26 22:15:59 It's a wonderful thing. :D Sep 26 22:16:36 X-Fade, HALP Sep 26 22:16:47 I need to learn, then I will buy some lenses Sep 26 22:17:29 does anyone know how i can recover my "Project admin" position on liqbase. ermmmm at some point in time i appear to have demoted myself :S Sep 26 22:17:33 50mm f/1.4 and a 50-250mm IS (or the 70-300mm if you want to splurge). Sep 26 22:17:34 jott: Thanks for pointing me at the maemo reference manual. That was seriously the piece of information I was missing. Sep 26 22:17:43 The bundled 18-55mm really sucks. Sep 26 22:17:48 <<<< fail Sep 26 22:17:58 Word, meet lcuk: http://www.knitemare.org/cats/halp_orange.jpg Sep 26 22:18:02 world** Sep 26 22:18:04 lcuk, did you ever upgrade me? :P Sep 26 22:18:17 lol you are listed higher than me \@/ Sep 26 22:18:32 * Jaffa sleeps Sep 26 22:18:34 * lcuk wonders when you are releasing the new version :P Sep 26 22:19:07 The 50mm f/1.4 is pretty pricey. I settled for the f/1.8 Sep 26 22:19:12 Less than a third as much money Sep 26 22:19:21 sneakret, yeah, a _lot_ cheaper Sep 26 22:19:28 But you do pay for it. ;) Sep 26 22:19:35 crashanddie, its no hassle for now - at least now the issue is known i can wait until monday and have a go and cleanup the package myself Sep 26 22:19:35 lcuk, you'll probably need X-Fade or ferenc to fix it for you. Sep 26 22:19:40 yer i know Sep 26 22:19:54 more x-fade than ferenc Sep 26 22:19:56 Well, I also got the 70-300mm Sep 26 22:20:37 or something close to that. Now I have to check. Sep 26 22:20:46 Hehe Sep 26 22:20:48 hi Sep 26 22:22:20 sneakret, worst thing about the 1.8 is the 5-blade aperture. Sep 26 22:22:26 I lied. I got a 28-75mm Sep 26 22:22:39 The 70-300 is on my wish list though! Sep 26 22:23:11 Lenses are the worst Sep 26 22:23:21 You'd think the camera would be the real investment Sep 26 22:23:23 Not sure what 5-blade aperture is. Sep 26 22:23:29 but, nooo, it's all the damn lenses you have to buy. Sep 26 22:23:37 Yeah, the camera ends up being cheap in the long run. :) Sep 26 22:23:57 I assume it means the shutter only has 5 blades Sep 26 22:24:00 sneakret, look at the images here: http://photo.net/equipment/canon/ef50/ Sep 26 22:24:03 Right Sep 26 22:24:06 Ruins the bokeh. Sep 26 22:24:14 but I don't know how that translates to photos Sep 26 22:24:16 bokeh? Sep 26 22:24:32 Blurred lights in the background. Sep 26 22:24:47 I see. Sep 26 22:25:36 For me, it was the f/1.8 or no 50mm. Sep 26 22:25:54 Of course, I have the 28-75mm, so maybe no 50mm would've been okay. Sep 26 22:26:09 :/ Sep 26 22:26:17 I didn't know what I was doing when I chose my lenses. Sep 26 22:26:33 Nah, 50mm is a fantastic lens Sep 26 22:26:46 It's been nice. Sep 26 22:26:46 the type of lens you can take into a dark party and shoot without a flash. Sep 26 22:26:48 Very fast Sep 26 22:26:51 Yeah. Sep 26 22:27:06 I refer to it as my Christmas Morning lens. Sep 26 22:27:26 Hehe Sep 26 22:27:26 (Great for taking pictures on Christmas morning.) Sep 26 22:27:38 I haven't had it on a Christmas morning yet though. Sep 26 22:28:40 I really want to get a macro lens Sep 26 22:28:50 I've been loving mine. Sep 26 22:29:56 * lcuk wonders if hes ok to drink n code Sep 26 22:30:04 * lcuk backs up first Sep 26 22:30:34 I just got extension tubes, works ok for macro and very cheap :) Sep 26 22:30:45 lcuk, yeah, backup Sep 26 22:31:14 lol - i had an "experience" recently kot whilst you were afk and I somehow managed to add a bug somewhere Sep 26 22:31:15 coding while intoxicated is very damaging to the code Sep 26 22:31:42 That's for sure. Sep 26 22:31:52 but theres a ballmer threshhold Sep 26 22:31:56 peak Sep 26 22:32:14 but it's only for pros Sep 26 22:32:57 :D http://xkcd.com/323/ Sep 26 22:33:01 i know Sep 26 22:33:03 :) Sep 26 22:33:19 * lcuk is mostly amateur and writes sloppy code Sep 26 22:33:29 mmmm nikon 105/2 ftw Sep 26 22:50:20 did anyone record video of the varioes Maemo Summit talks? Sep 26 22:50:48 Yes, a few people Sep 26 22:50:57 Ari's talk and the dev session are already up. Sep 26 22:51:41 GeneralAntilles: I saw a few of them.. but I was wondering if someone had collected links to everything Sep 26 22:52:28 Most of them have been mentioned on Planet. Sep 26 22:52:51 I found a great list of torrents from the CCC and it's nice for us students that don't have time/money to travel Sep 26 22:53:27 GeneralAntilles: I'll have another read-through and keep my eyes open Sep 26 22:54:25 They'll probably be aggregated on the wiki at some point. Sep 26 22:55:21 GeneralAntilles: that would be nice.. it was what I was looking for Sep 26 22:55:51 Feel free to bug maemo-community about it. Sep 26 22:57:09 wiki.maemo.org is down, if not, I'd start it myself.. maybe later Sep 26 22:57:46 It's up Sep 26 22:57:49 reload Sep 26 23:15:14 GAN800: I still can't get http://wiki.maemo.org to load. I can connect, send my request, and then recieve no response Sep 26 23:22:52 oys: it often happens to me too Sep 26 23:23:57 ok, does anyone have that fork of maemo-mapper available for diablo, or anything new? Sep 26 23:24:04 because gdbm is horrible Sep 26 23:24:18 esp. the fact that mapper has to copy the whole db to compact it Sep 26 23:24:34 AStorm: why a fork? I'm not updated about this news... sorry.. Sep 26 23:24:47 htm, isn't mm using sqlite? Sep 26 23:24:51 hrm Sep 26 23:24:56 Andy80: ITT one Sep 26 23:25:01 KotCzarny: it's using gdbm Sep 26 23:25:10 I found something by chance Sep 26 23:25:11 AStorm: what are the main differences? Sep 26 23:26:31 http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=16838 Sep 26 23:26:40 it's more efficient and easier to manage Sep 26 23:26:53 and doesn't kill mmc as fast Sep 26 23:27:26 2.2.mod.1 :> Sep 26 23:28:11 for some reason, no one even tried to include these mods to mainline Sep 26 23:29:33 astorm, nice find Sep 26 23:29:47 forward port should be fairly easy Sep 26 23:30:02 because changes between 2.2, 2.3 and 2.4 were mostly cosmetic Sep 26 23:30:04 why not contacting author directly? Sep 26 23:30:39 removing memory cache is nice too Sep 26 23:30:57 as it's slowing down everything and even crashing the app Sep 26 23:31:07 (system needed to close blabla) Sep 26 23:32:16 oh, gnuite not liky Sep 26 23:32:42 they had a talk long time ago and mapper is still worse than this modded 2.2 Sep 26 23:32:45 so... Sep 26 23:32:52 The MM2.2 Mod 1 includes all the features up to official MM2.3.1 release, Sep 26 23:34:23 yes, why not :) Sep 26 23:34:44 trick is, that for some reason mapper is friggin slow after I downloaded 0,6 GB of maps Sep 26 23:34:58 it takes a long time to find them, which means gdbm is to blame Sep 26 23:35:22 pure ext3+htrees is faster Sep 26 23:35:53 (and that is not stellar as far as dbs are concerned) Sep 26 23:37:10 ext2+htrees should be faster still Sep 26 23:37:27 for some reason, I'm probably overflowing gdbm's hash tables Sep 26 23:37:43 or at least they're not cached in memory and have to be read in every time Sep 26 23:37:52 I put the maps on immc Sep 26 23:38:13 so it's entirely uncompressed Sep 26 23:39:09 I'll contact the author later and see if we can devise a solution Sep 26 23:40:07 damn dhl. Sep 26 23:40:26 seems there is some cache Sep 26 23:40:38 but it might be just pure filesystem cache of the kernel Sep 26 23:40:54 (closest zoom levels of a location are cached) Sep 26 23:56:26 AStorm: is this version "maemo-mapper_2.2.mod.1-os2008_armel.deb" valid for os2008 DIABLO? Sep 27 00:06:57 no idea Sep 27 00:07:08 btw, how can I export a google maps route to mapper? Sep 27 00:07:30 the default planning in mapper uses Google, but allows only two points... and no inter-routes Sep 27 00:08:27 alternatively, how can I merge routes? Sep 27 00:08:47 It's just gpx Sep 27 00:09:29 You can append as many routes as you want to the end of the route. Sep 27 00:10:42 http://www.techamok.com/?pid=5141 Sep 27 00:10:43 mmm Sep 27 00:10:49 16gb sd micro Sep 27 00:10:53 by sandisk Sep 27 00:11:37 well, sdhc micro Sep 27 00:11:39 Yeah, I've heard "will be shipping" before. Sep 27 00:12:10 GAN800: I know it's gpx... Sep 27 00:12:13 will ship in October. Sep 27 00:12:20 soon we will know Sep 27 00:12:23 but, how do I export a route from google maps ;P Sep 27 00:12:32 alternatively, how do I append to the route Sep 27 00:12:36 Wake me when we know. Sep 27 00:12:37 astorm: rip it with a knife Sep 27 00:13:01 (it seems that route download option fails on second time too ;P ) Sep 27 00:13:44 onlt class 2 though Sep 27 00:13:48 o.O Sep 27 00:13:53 (as in, mapper dies) Sep 27 00:13:54 http://www.gearlog.com/images/16gbmicro.jpg Sep 27 00:15:41 could someone suggest a good video converter from avi to something the n810 can play well? Sep 27 00:16:42 ~mediautils Sep 27 00:16:43 i guess mediautils is http://mediautils.garage.maemo.org/ Sep 27 00:17:10 thanks Sep 27 00:22:26 hello! Sep 27 00:23:13 Does the 770 with a 512 MB rs-mmc running hackeros2007 store downloaded software on the memory card? Sep 27 00:23:58 Only if you're booting from it. Sep 27 00:24:51 is it better to boot from the mmc? Sep 27 00:25:11 Can be. Sep 27 00:25:13 yup Sep 27 00:25:16 more capacity Sep 27 00:25:19 more fun Sep 27 00:25:40 and you can have few cards with different oses Sep 27 00:26:30 what is the latest version of maemo? Sep 27 00:26:40 diablo, but not for 770 Sep 27 00:26:41 i think Sep 27 00:27:04 is it past the first official release of diablo? for the n810 Sep 27 00:27:18 does it need to be formatt/what partitions/what size? Sep 27 00:27:27 ~release-history is http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maemo_(operating_system)#Release_history Sep 27 00:27:27 okay, GeneralAntilles Sep 27 00:28:13 hmm, now it didn't die Sep 27 00:28:20 something must've happened then ;> Sep 27 00:28:40 the 770 has 64 mb built in ram right? Sep 27 00:29:11 yes Sep 27 00:29:40 (damn dhl) Sep 27 00:29:51 but I could partition my 512 mb card and have more room for programs and such right? Sep 27 00:30:08 mdg what has ram to do with partitions? Sep 27 00:30:35 I don't know? Sep 27 00:30:38 :) Sep 27 00:30:43 and it shows Sep 27 00:30:50 GeneralAntilles thanks Sep 27 00:31:00 mapper could use some optical zoom (not just double pixels) Sep 27 00:31:22 otherwise most maps are too small to read when using a car for instance Sep 27 00:31:25 I meant the memory card that came with the 770 was 64 mb? Sep 27 00:31:40 and double-pixel is ugly, also only 100% zoom :> Sep 27 00:31:54 some simple bicubic filter would be enough Sep 27 00:31:56 Turn off pixel doubling, then. . . . Sep 27 00:32:05 then the map is too small! Sep 27 00:32:10 I mean, roads are Sep 27 00:32:13 Increase the zoom level. Sep 27 00:32:15 get a bigger map ? Sep 27 00:32:16 :) Sep 27 00:32:23 GeneralAntilles: zoom 4 is not enough even Sep 27 00:32:27 the road is very thing Sep 27 00:32:29 *thin Sep 27 00:32:35 get a bigger road? Sep 27 00:32:37 ;) Sep 27 00:32:37 Very blind? Sep 27 00:32:55 no, the n810 is located about 0.5m from the driver Sep 27 00:33:06 or more Sep 27 00:33:09 mount hud projector? Sep 27 00:33:14 harhar... funny Sep 27 00:33:32 but how nice of an idea Sep 27 00:33:34 this is a major lack of feature Sep 27 00:33:34 isn't it? Sep 27 00:33:45 yes, but how do I wire it to n810? ;P Sep 27 00:33:53 also, expensive Sep 27 00:33:59 Buy a Beagle and build a carputer. Sep 27 00:34:02 while software scaling is free (excluding CPU time) Sep 27 00:34:12 remember that video where they used n8x0 for presentation? Sep 27 00:34:19 that was USB Sep 27 00:34:24 no HUD does this Sep 27 00:34:28 ..yet Sep 27 00:34:34 well Sep 27 00:34:45 simple stupid bicubic scaler would be good and fast enough Sep 27 00:34:59 why isn't that implemented? ;P Sep 27 00:35:05 ask author? Sep 27 00:35:12 I will suggest such a feature Sep 27 00:35:16 good Sep 27 00:35:16 maybe even implement it Sep 27 00:35:17 :) Sep 27 00:35:23 better Sep 27 00:35:27 but, pity no one did it earlier Sep 27 00:35:32 it is a must-have Sep 27 00:35:35 no o ne needed probably Sep 27 00:35:46 double px is almost ok at that range Sep 27 00:35:59 but looks pixelated obviously ;P Sep 27 00:36:16 i'm shortsighted anyway Sep 27 00:36:17 :P Sep 27 00:36:26 uhm, in a car? Sep 27 00:36:42 if you were that shortsighted, you wouldn't be able to read a printed map Sep 27 00:37:00 :> Sep 27 00:37:08 trick is, with this high DPI the screen has... the maps are about 1/4 the original size (on my laptop) Sep 27 00:37:35 wrong, 1/3 Sep 27 00:37:36 :) Sep 27 00:37:37 hud. Sep 27 00:37:42 :) Sep 27 00:37:44 no, scale the maps Sep 27 00:38:01 x3 to get actual 1:1 vs an 85 dpi screen Sep 27 00:38:10 or close to it Sep 27 00:38:25 hmm Sep 27 00:38:29 sdl pixel doubling? Sep 27 00:38:44 there is pixel doubling, but it's not true scaling Sep 27 00:38:49 == looks horrible Sep 27 00:39:05 i mean sdl uses hardware chip to double pixels Sep 27 00:39:10 well, scale Sep 27 00:39:13 pixel Sep 27 00:39:16 hmmmm, interesting Sep 27 00:39:25 that could be useful, although I don't know how to do that Sep 27 00:39:31 but it changes whole screen res Sep 27 00:39:31 and mapper doesn't use SDL for display Sep 27 00:39:35 anyone else here a noob too or all you all old pros? Sep 27 00:39:40 and hw chip scales it to fs Sep 27 00:39:47 ah, so unusable Sep 27 00:39:49 mdg: mixed Sep 27 00:39:57 astorm: not really, useful Sep 27 00:40:04 yes, but not in this case Sep 27 00:40:09 why? Sep 27 00:40:16 full screen -> 400x240 Sep 27 00:40:19 and you are done Sep 27 00:40:20 because mapper is not necessarily fullscreen Sep 27 00:40:26 and doesn't even use SDL Sep 27 00:40:31 but it supports going to fs Sep 27 00:40:32 I'd have to rewrite it more or less Sep 27 00:40:40 yes, but uses GTK then Sep 27 00:40:44 i don't know if it's sdl or x11 Sep 27 00:40:50 one of them Sep 27 00:40:54 it's GTK Sep 27 00:40:58 whatever gtk uses Sep 27 00:41:06 (most likely x11 ;P ) Sep 27 00:41:31 so, I'll have to do the scaling manually, in asm Sep 27 00:41:51 not that hard Sep 27 00:41:55 maybe in C first, bicubic scaler is simple enough though to try it in asm Sep 27 00:41:56 you can probably steal mplayer code Sep 27 00:42:19 maybe, depends on the format Sep 27 00:42:57 I'll get a GTK canvas, from which I can get context Sep 27 00:43:09 actually, not Sep 27 00:43:16 I get an unpacked PNG Sep 27 00:43:22 or jpg Sep 27 00:43:26 or whatever format is that Sep 27 00:43:49 then scale as usual Sep 27 00:44:29 code is a bit messy Sep 27 00:44:37 anyway, I'll contact gnuite first Sep 27 00:51:49 I found directions at the wiki for extending the rootfs on the 770 - any extra tips? Sep 27 00:57:02 anyone with experience with ext2 vs ext3 on the MMC - which is better? Sep 27 00:57:22 i have ext3 on sd Sep 27 00:57:27 still works Sep 27 00:57:40 don't know about 770 and mmc Sep 27 00:58:15 sorry, got lazy typing rs-mmc Sep 27 00:58:39 mmc equals rs-mmc Sep 27 00:59:41 I guess all I need is the "become root" package Sep 27 01:05:56 where did you find your rs-mmc? Amazon? Sep 27 01:06:09 i have n800 Sep 27 01:06:27 but froogle is nice too Sep 27 01:07:14 http://www.aflashstore.com/Transcend-512MB-Reduced-Size-MultiMedia-Cards/M/B0006SPE6G.htm Sep 27 01:07:20 512mb rs-mmc for a 7.75 Sep 27 01:07:25 unless it's a lemon Sep 27 01:07:31 quite nice price Sep 27 01:08:42 $7.75? That is quite inexpensive! Sep 27 01:08:59 assuming seller is not a thief Sep 27 01:09:02 yes Sep 27 01:09:07 otherwise, no Sep 27 01:09:08 :) Sep 27 01:11:49 can you find it in stores? Sep 27 01:12:10 don't know Sep 27 01:12:12 maybe Sep 27 01:12:35 google for it in big stores Sep 27 01:12:43 amazon would work too Sep 27 01:13:29 searches are mostly bringing up card readers Sep 27 01:13:42 'mostly' Sep 27 01:14:40 wonder if I would have any luck at the local camera store Sep 27 01:14:48 maybe Sep 27 01:17:33 what size would you recommend - 1 gig? Sep 27 01:17:48 don't know, probably the more the merrier Sep 27 01:18:41 I have 512 card now - would it get some good basics? Sep 27 01:19:50 how about second hand n800? Sep 27 01:19:51 :) Sep 27 01:20:49 I wish! But bills come first right now Sep 27 01:20:58 100? 150$ ? Sep 27 01:21:38 used n800 for $100-150? where? Sep 27 01:21:43 craiglist Sep 27 01:21:47 craiglist Sep 27 01:21:49 darn Sep 27 01:21:51 craigslist Sep 27 01:22:16 I don't know if I can trust craigslist Sep 27 01:22:21 well Sep 27 01:22:30 it's for hand to hand dealing Sep 27 01:22:39 so you can check the device at the spot Sep 27 01:23:16 n810 for 225 Sep 27 01:23:18 :) Sep 27 01:23:34 and to be honest i got mine n800 for a 150 in march Sep 27 01:23:51 from craigslist? Sep 27 01:23:54 yes Sep 27 01:24:33 I'll think about it. This 770 has to be good for something though Sep 27 01:24:43 yup Sep 27 01:24:53 sd has 2 full sd slots Sep 27 01:24:56 wink, wink Sep 27 01:24:57 ;) Sep 27 01:25:16 i mean n800 has 2 full sd slots Sep 27 01:26:17 I think I saw you can use flash/thumb/jump drives (whatever you prefer to call them) with the n800 Sep 27 01:26:24 ? Sep 27 01:26:32 yes, usb works both ways on n8x0 Sep 27 01:26:45 as long power is sufficient Sep 27 01:27:40 sounds nicer! Sep 27 01:28:02 yes, i like my n800 Sep 27 01:28:04 :) Sep 27 01:28:07 is a hackers 2009 in the works? Sep 27 01:28:30 don't know, unfortunatelly i haven't got 770 Sep 27 01:28:46 would you like one? Sep 27 01:28:58 O.o Sep 27 01:29:02 LOL Sep 27 01:29:13 well, i wanted 770 at first Sep 27 01:29:25 then i have found that n800 on cl Sep 27 01:29:45 and should suit me for some time :) Sep 27 01:29:52 I've heard the n800 is better than the n810? Sep 27 01:30:04 depends on user Sep 27 01:30:17 if you prefer big storage, then n800 is the winner Sep 27 01:30:27 n810 has keyboard, gps, and nicer look Sep 27 01:30:49 n800 only has touchscreen keyboard? Sep 27 01:30:53 yes Sep 27 01:30:55 or bt Sep 27 01:31:07 do you have bt keyboard? Sep 27 01:31:09 yes Sep 27 01:31:12 25$ Sep 27 01:31:16 also from cl Sep 27 01:31:25 :) Sep 27 01:31:37 is yours a foldable keyboard? Sep 27 01:31:40 yes Sep 27 01:31:46 igo ultra slim model Sep 27 01:32:09 http://g-ecx.images-amazon.com/images/G/01/ciu/18/9f/fa2a92c008a01778b0485010._AA280_.L.jpg Sep 27 01:32:10 so n800 and bt keyboard would fit in a day planner? Sep 27 01:32:25 they are roughly the same size Sep 27 01:32:30 n800 and that kb Sep 27 01:32:59 does the keyboard feel generally sturdy? Sep 27 01:33:08 well Sep 27 01:33:19 it's not as stable as my laptop Sep 27 01:33:30 but generally does it's work Sep 27 01:33:59 I'm leaning toward an apple bt keyboard, but it might be a bit much to haul around Sep 27 01:34:15 on the other hand - those laptops can get so heavy! Sep 27 01:34:29 mine is 12", 3lbs Sep 27 01:34:31 :) Sep 27 01:34:45 less than inch thick Sep 27 01:34:51 oh, you have an Eee pc? Sep 27 01:34:54 nope Sep 27 01:34:57 thinkpad x40 Sep 27 01:35:12 solid state harddrive? Sep 27 01:35:20 2x cf Sep 27 01:35:28 with ide-cf adapter Sep 27 01:35:32 hi ssvb Sep 27 01:35:38 what os is it running? Sep 27 01:35:41 hi Sep 27 01:35:43 linux, of course Sep 27 01:35:52 which distro? Sep 27 01:36:02 ssvb: do you still hack mplayer? Sep 27 01:36:06 mdg: slackware Sep 27 01:36:16 KotCzarny: not much Sep 27 01:36:25 ssvb: lack of time or ideas? Sep 27 01:36:31 did you install slackware or came already installed? Sep 27 01:36:43 mdg: i'm a geek Sep 27 01:36:59 i just use the same os since my first install of slackware 8.0 Sep 27 01:37:02 oh, so you installed it Sep 27 01:37:08 just swapping from pc to pc Sep 27 01:37:20 ever tried Mint? Sep 27 01:37:29 slackware suits me Sep 27 01:37:37 don't need anything else :) Sep 27 01:38:05 hackers are supposed to be adventurous? Sep 27 01:38:14 i'm a slacker Sep 27 01:38:19 LOL Sep 27 01:38:37 KotCzarny: I mostly switched to low level codecs optimizations, packaging and providing releases is not so fun Sep 27 01:39:08 ssvb: ahm, anyone stepped up in your place? Sep 27 01:40:31 it would be nice to have someone to pass this job to him Sep 27 01:40:42 :) Sep 27 01:40:55 i assume that means 'no' Sep 27 01:45:25 how do you change the time from 24 hour to 12 hour in the statusbar? Sep 27 01:47:39 Happy Friday! Sep 27 01:48:08 er...unless it's already Saturday for you.. Sep 27 01:50:07 yawn Sep 27 01:50:59 night! Sep 27 01:58:11 how do you update the n810 to diablo? Sep 27 01:58:31 depends Sep 27 01:58:41 you can simply install .debs Sep 27 01:58:45 and hit upgrade Sep 27 01:58:52 or flash whole sys Sep 27 01:58:55 and hit upgrade Sep 27 01:59:06 i want to flash the whole system Sep 27 01:59:11 ~diablo Sep 27 01:59:12 Fast and efficient NNTP newsfeeder software. URL: http://www.backplane.com/diablo/, or a better link-time optimizer. More information can be found at http://www.elis.ugent.be/diablo Sep 27 01:59:16 bah. Sep 27 01:59:24 ~firmware Sep 27 01:59:25 somebody said firmware was hardware that is beginning to melt Firmware for GrandStream phones is at http://www.hellofone.com/files/ Sep 27 01:59:30 bah2. Sep 27 01:59:37 ~maemo Sep 27 01:59:38 ~flashing Sep 27 01:59:38 extra, extra, read all about it, maemo is a development platform to create applications for Nokia 770 Internet Tablet and other maemo compliant handheld devices in the future. http://www.maemo.org/ Sep 27 01:59:39 from memory, flashing is http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware Sep 27 01:59:55 thanks Sep 27 02:02:53 anyone using gizmo? Sep 27 02:03:24 what's gizmo? Sep 27 02:03:33 like skype Sep 27 02:03:57 it's supposed to allow sms for free, but I can't figure it out Sep 27 02:04:20 nothing is free Sep 27 02:04:31 that's what I'm starting to wonder Sep 27 02:04:43 http://gizmosms.com/cgi-bin/gizmosms.cgi Sep 27 02:05:10 that's a separate site Sep 27 02:05:25 googletalk? Sep 27 02:05:39 well, maybe that's how they implemented it Sep 27 02:05:44 googletalk can send text messages? Sep 27 02:06:13 googlechat Sep 27 02:15:00 night all! Thanks for all the help! Sep 27 02:15:05 nite nite Sep 27 02:49:43 to flash the n810 with the nokia internet tablet updater, it says to turn the tablet off, connect the usb cable to it and the computer, then press and hold the "switch button." Are they talking about the application swap button on the front to the left of the screen? I held it down for a long time and it never came on. Sep 27 02:50:47 It says swap, doesn't it? Sep 27 02:50:48 nevermind. i didn't see where it said to hold the power switch at the same time Sep 27 02:50:59 yeah i meant swap button **** ENDING LOGGING AT Sat Sep 27 02:59:57 2008