**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Thu Oct 09 02:59:57 2008 Oct 09 03:01:40 anyone familiar w/this: http://shop.eten.hu/mugen-power-3600mah-extended-battery-for-nokia-n810-with-battery-door-blue-p-475.html Oct 09 03:10:13 is it possible to play urls with mplayer on maemo? Oct 09 03:21:09 and is it possible to speed up video playback using any media player? I get jittery playback Oct 09 03:38:34 how do you get GPS working on the N810? Oct 09 03:38:42 is it built in? Oct 09 03:41:19 anyone? Oct 09 03:41:31 zetheroo-ubuntu: yesit should be Oct 09 03:42:14 is there a program that I have to install to get it to work? Oct 09 03:44:19 I don't know because I don't have one Oct 09 03:44:26 but agps Oct 09 03:44:34 is something that helps with GPS Oct 09 03:44:49 maemo-mapper also uses it Oct 09 03:45:10 maemo mapper is a really good mapping program Oct 09 03:47:26 zetheroo-ubuntu: go to control panel Oct 09 03:47:57 zetheroo-ubuntu: and click on GPS Location item Oct 09 03:48:11 zetheroo-ubuntu: make sure your GPS is turned on Oct 09 03:51:10 yes Oct 09 03:51:12 its on Oct 09 03:51:22 finding only 1 sat though Oct 09 03:52:02 how many do I need to get a map going? Oct 09 03:52:30 I dunno Oct 09 03:52:32 5 Oct 09 03:52:38 I read somewhere Oct 09 03:52:43 zetheroo-ubuntu: install agps Oct 09 03:52:47 i think its 7 Oct 09 03:52:58 zetheroo-ubuntu: that uses internet connection to make lock faster Oct 09 03:53:18 zetheroo-ubuntu: otherwise lock can take 10mins or more Oct 09 03:55:07 but what if there is no internet connection available? Oct 09 03:55:37 it falls back to normal locking Oct 09 03:56:06 so GPS is not all that steady Oct 09 03:56:14 hmm Oct 09 03:56:22 from what i have read Oct 09 03:56:40 it is a complaint of many Oct 09 03:56:45 ok Oct 09 03:56:48 :) Oct 09 03:56:56 well I love the N810 Oct 09 03:56:58 it may be steady Oct 09 03:57:14 just takes a long time to lock satellites Oct 09 03:57:18 super quality and maemo is a great piece of software Oct 09 03:57:34 hmm Oct 09 03:57:41 it WAS good Oct 09 03:57:59 needs a good update now which it will get Oct 09 03:58:07 with a new device Oct 09 03:58:33 why do I have so few apps available for install? Oct 09 03:59:01 you need maemo extras repo Oct 09 03:59:10 http://www.gronmayer.com/it/ Oct 09 04:00:06 ok it was there but disabled Oct 09 04:00:35 is maemo-mapper the best map app? Oct 09 04:01:03 zetheroo-ubuntu: I like it the best Oct 09 04:01:17 ok Oct 09 04:01:38 do I need any other packages other than maemo-mapper to get the full usage from it ? Oct 09 04:02:19 zetheroo-ubuntu: nope, you just need to select a map repository, like openstreetmap or yahoo, google, etc Oct 09 04:02:31 ok Oct 09 04:02:36 and download the maps for the area you want Oct 09 04:02:47 in the GPS setup what do I select for the internal GPS to work? Oct 09 04:02:59 File Path? Oct 09 04:03:10 /dev/pgps Oct 09 04:03:12 ? Oct 09 04:03:17 I dunno Oct 09 04:03:22 I don't have an n810 but try it Oct 09 04:03:46 from the menu Oct 09 04:03:50 select the GPS item Oct 09 04:04:00 and then select enable GPS Oct 09 04:04:02 what does that do? Oct 09 04:04:35 it says Searching for GPS receiver ... and then Error reading GPS data! Oct 09 04:04:47 is that becasue I am not locked on Oct 09 04:04:57 could be Oct 09 04:05:04 install agps Oct 09 04:05:11 and see if that helps it lock on Oct 09 04:05:13 ok Oct 09 04:05:23 GPS performance is not so good indoors Oct 09 04:05:44 ahhh Oct 09 04:05:47 indoors you might have a network connection that helps it get a lock on Oct 09 04:06:10 is it possible to get the pop-up keyboard on the screen with the N810? Oct 09 04:06:18 yes Oct 09 04:06:29 how? Oct 09 04:06:44 tap on a text input area Oct 09 04:06:54 with the stylus or a pen Oct 09 04:06:54 I am Oct 09 04:06:57 nothing is happening Oct 09 04:06:58 err Oct 09 04:07:00 ok Oct 09 04:07:02 one sec Oct 09 04:07:12 go to control settings Oct 09 04:07:24 settings-->control panel Oct 09 04:07:34 yep Oct 09 04:07:40 text input settings Oct 09 04:07:51 ahh Oct 09 04:07:53 enable it Oct 09 04:08:13 agps is not in the repos Oct 09 04:08:17 you need to close the hardware keyboard or it wont appear Oct 09 04:08:20 do I need to download it? Oct 09 04:08:36 agps might be in maemo extras Oct 09 04:08:47 make sure you have enabled the maemo extras repository Oct 09 04:09:22 its enabled Oct 09 04:09:45 hmm Oct 09 04:10:41 agps-ui Oct 09 04:12:39 I have: nokia catalg; nokia catlog 3rd party software; Nokia System sofware updates; maemo extras; Oct 09 04:12:50 catalog* Oct 09 04:14:16 hmm Oct 09 04:14:34 zetheroo-ubuntu: agps-ui should be in the nokia catalogues Oct 09 04:14:44 try reloading your lists Oct 09 04:22:00 will try Oct 09 04:22:59 do you have the N800 or N810? Oct 09 04:23:35 cause its not here Oct 09 04:24:58 n800 here Oct 09 04:25:32 Get:2 http://catalogue.tableteer.nokia.com diablo/user agps-ui 0.10-1beta Oct 09 04:25:35 maybe its been pulled from the repos Oct 09 04:25:50 are you using diablo? Oct 09 04:25:53 or chinook? Oct 09 04:26:09 no idea what either of those are Oct 09 04:26:17 whats red pill mode by the way? Oct 09 04:26:20 go to control panel Oct 09 04:26:41 click about Oct 09 04:26:47 what does it say the Version is? Oct 09 04:27:24 2.2007.51-3 Oct 09 04:27:38 ah Oct 09 04:27:40 thats why Oct 09 04:27:59 zetheroo-ubuntu: how much time are you willing to spend on your tablet? Oct 09 04:29:41 since you got your tablet, Nokia released sofware updates that require that you flash your tablet if you want to update it Oct 09 04:31:11 ahhh Oct 09 04:31:28 well I did that before on the N800 ... so I don't mind doing it again with this one Oct 09 04:31:39 if its not too difficult ... Oct 09 04:31:41 :) Oct 09 04:31:44 its not too bad Oct 09 04:31:59 can you help me? Oct 09 04:32:02 zetheroo-ubuntu: what OS is your laptop/desktop that you use? Oct 09 04:32:08 Ubuntu Oct 09 04:32:10 Hardy Oct 09 04:32:13 I'll point you to simple instructions Oct 09 04:32:30 ah good, me too Oct 09 04:34:13 zetheroo-ubuntu: http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware Oct 09 04:34:37 follow instructions there Oct 09 04:34:46 make sure you backup all your files on the tablet Oct 09 04:34:52 everything will be wiped out Oct 09 04:41:07 zetheroo-ubuntu: let me know how it goes Oct 09 04:54:07 where is the flasher? Oct 09 04:58:36 ~flashing Oct 09 04:58:37 well, flashing is http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware Oct 09 04:59:15 # Download the flasher for your platform and tablet model from Nokia's Tablet Dev site Oct 09 04:59:34 http://tablets-dev.nokia.com/ Oct 09 05:11:18 ./flasher-3.0: command not found Oct 09 05:11:39 zetheroo-ubuntu, you have to tell it where the flasher is. Oct 09 05:11:50 I am in the folder where it is Oct 09 05:12:01 ./flasher Oct 09 05:12:29 ? Oct 09 05:12:41 type ./flasher and press tab Oct 09 05:12:50 I downloaded flasher-3.0 to my desktop Oct 09 05:13:14 nothing happens when I do that Oct 09 05:13:32 AStorm, Maemo Mapper is in Diablo Extras now. Oct 09 05:13:39 zeth@zeth-ubuntu:~/Desktop$ sudo ./flasher-3.0 -F -f -R[sudo] password for zeth: sudo: ./flasher-3.0: command not found Oct 09 05:13:56 ls flash* Oct 09 05:14:28 :-S Oct 09 05:15:07 zeth@zeth-ubuntu:~/Desktop$ ls flash*flasher-3.0 Oct 09 05:16:03 is busybox the archiver for maemo? Oct 09 05:17:42 any ideas? Oct 09 05:22:26 GeneralAntilles : you still there? Oct 09 05:23:42 I tried it without sudo and this is what I got Oct 09 05:23:52 zeth@zeth-ubuntu:~/Desktop$ ./flasher-3.0 -F -f -Rbash: ./flasher-3.0: Permission deniedzeth@zeth-ubuntu:~/Desktop$ Oct 09 05:23:59 what is the most common application for opening tarball files in maemo? Oct 09 05:24:08 prak, tar? Oct 09 05:24:14 xarchiver is around somewhere, too. Oct 09 05:24:28 EruditeHermit : you there? Oct 09 05:24:29 zetheroo-ubuntu, sudo chmod 755 ./flasher-3.0 Oct 09 05:24:46 ok Oct 09 05:24:52 thanks Oct 09 05:25:21 now it gives this Oct 09 05:25:22 zeth@zeth-ubuntu:~/Desktop$ ./flasher-3.0 -F -f -Rflasher v0.8.7 (Oct 17 2006)-R: No such file or directory Oct 09 05:25:35 zetheroo-ubuntu: remove the < and > Oct 09 05:26:27 zetheroo-ubuntu: I hope you backed up your files btw Oct 09 05:26:31 which is the swap button? Oct 09 05:26:38 there where no files... Oct 09 05:26:43 the one with the house Oct 09 05:26:44 its just came brand new Oct 09 05:26:53 looks like a house Oct 09 05:26:54 no house here... Oct 09 05:26:58 hmm Oct 09 05:27:19 zetheroo-ubuntu, the two overlapping rectangles. Oct 09 05:27:37 its nearest the camera Oct 09 05:27:38 Suitable USB device not found, waitingUSB device found found at bus 007, device address 003Error claiming USB interface: Operation not permitted Oct 09 05:27:51 zetheroo-ubuntu, you have to rude flasher as root. Oct 09 05:27:55 s/rude/run/ Oct 09 05:27:55 zetheroo-ubuntu: put sudo infront of that Oct 09 05:27:55 GeneralAntilles meant: zetheroo-ubuntu, you have to run flasher as root. Oct 09 05:28:12 sudo infront of the whole command Oct 09 05:28:21 ok.. its working Oct 09 05:28:25 :) Oct 09 05:30:07 GeneralAntilles: do you know any way to make video playback better? Oct 09 05:30:17 EruditeHermit, install mplayer? Oct 09 05:30:25 yeah, mplayer is slow Oct 09 05:30:38 or my video is stuttering with it still Oct 09 05:30:49 What video? Oct 09 05:30:52 may or may not be slow in absolute terms Oct 09 05:30:54 its a stream Oct 09 05:31:03 There are hard limits on the data that can be transfered to the LCD controller Oct 09 05:31:19 and network activity decreases that even more as it adds CPU overhead. Oct 09 05:31:29 mms://skinkers-livestation-bbcworld-en.wm.llnwd.net/skinkers_livestation_bbcworld_en Oct 09 05:31:42 I wouldn't push more than 400x240 @ ~700-1100Kbps with MPEG4 over the network. Oct 09 05:32:04 that is the stream Oct 09 05:32:08 do you think its too much? Oct 09 05:32:53 * Proteous_ squints really hard at the url and realizes that it wont magicaly tell him the bandwidth and resolution of the stream Oct 09 05:33:08 Dunno Oct 09 05:33:18 Is it WMV or somesuch? Oct 09 05:35:03 VIDEO: [WVC1] 448x288 24bpp 1000.000 fps 470.0 kbps (57.4 kbyte/s) Oct 09 05:36:02 that's a lot of FPS Oct 09 05:36:15 I don't think the refresh rate of the tablet is that high Oct 09 05:36:20 thats what mplayer spat out Oct 09 05:36:26 may or may not be true Oct 09 05:36:54 I'll give you 5000:1 odds Oct 09 05:37:02 lol Oct 09 05:37:03 want to bet me a dollar? Oct 09 05:37:12 only if it is your dollar Oct 09 05:37:30 dollars* Oct 09 05:37:45 only if they are your dollars* Oct 09 05:41:45 mplayer with omapfb is better Oct 09 05:42:03 it drops a lot of frames Oct 09 05:42:22 but it doesn't stop the audio as much as osso player Oct 09 05:44:10 I use tversity to on the fly encode my media for my n810 Oct 09 05:44:18 I've also used orb Oct 09 05:44:35 (both windows programs although there are linux/mac alternatives) Oct 09 06:22:11 is maemo.org really so busy? Oct 09 06:25:18 Yes, it gets pounded a lot. Oct 09 06:44:41 hi, I'm having troubles getting to see in eclipse the documentation (method signature) for the gtk+ api, a full indexing seems to only make that possible for inner project files. Must I include something in the project paths area? I would also wish to get to view the gtk+ files in eclipse when I right-click->open_declaration on a gtk+ method. Can anyone help me? Oct 09 06:50:38 GeneralAntilles, whats with the nokia chat thingy? is anyone using it? how does one sign up for an account? Oct 09 07:03:58 notcoolbuthot: you should probably ask in another channel maybe? Oct 09 07:04:17 notcoolbuthot: is it eclipse for maemo? Oct 09 07:04:21 yes Oct 09 07:04:31 ah Oct 09 07:04:32 eclipse with ESbox Oct 09 07:04:42 well I don't know how to help you Oct 09 07:04:59 but maybe an eclipse channel could help you as well as others in here Oct 09 07:05:10 you might want to ask in other places too Oct 09 07:05:22 seems like a very technical question Oct 09 07:05:31 about eclipse Oct 09 07:43:24 morning Oct 09 07:44:24 morning Oct 09 08:23:39 GeneralAntilles: thanks for info :) Oct 09 08:27:02 GeneralAntilles: ping Oct 09 08:27:37 Jaffa, pong. Oct 09 08:28:34 GeneralAntilles: The maemo.org redesign thread looks like it could do some chairing. Quim seems to be getting very frustrated and there's circular discussions about making things big Oct 09 08:29:44 Carman took an odd approach to implementing its statusbar applet. Oct 09 08:30:00 time to get my sbox up again Oct 09 08:30:05 and build an OpenCV package Oct 09 08:30:21 and python-opencv too Oct 09 08:31:38 * GeneralAntilles was dreading that. Oct 09 08:32:35 btw, I need a less broken xournal :) Oct 09 08:32:43 even the chinook one is rarely crashing Oct 09 08:33:15 as a bonus, someone could implement "hand" panning tool Oct 09 08:33:26 and/or widen the scrollbar Oct 09 08:40:51 Jaffa, problem is, I'm really totally disconnected from that discussion at this point. Oct 09 08:41:14 GeneralAntilles: hmm Oct 09 08:41:55 Looking at it it just feels like so much noise to me. Oct 09 08:56:47 GAN, Jaffa: I am no longer participating. The stuff they discuss does not appear to have anything to do with what was planned. Oct 09 09:32:22 * lcuk ponders the meaning of life Oct 09 09:32:37 (whilst waiting for tps reports to print) Oct 09 09:54:14 I reformated the internal sd card (mmc2) to ext3 and cloned the system there, but now the map application says "no memory card found". any idea how I could use maps again? Oct 09 09:58:26 dfaure, mount something on /media/mmc2? Oct 09 10:02:23 moo, lcuk, johnx Oct 09 10:02:31 m00f RST38h Oct 09 10:02:36 moo, zap too Oct 09 10:03:50 morning Oct 09 10:04:33 hm has someone a idea how I can map/alias the standard locales which is utf of de_DE to de_DE.UTF-8 like on desktop? Oct 09 10:06:08 hm or the other way round Oct 09 10:06:35 i want to set it to de_DE.UTF-8 and it has to map to the standard de_DE on maemo Oct 09 10:10:37 morning all Oct 09 10:10:56 hi lardman Oct 09 10:16:22 johnx: thanks. I reformatted /dev/mtdblock4 as vfat and it works again. the error message was misleading, I thought it was looking for a memory card explicitely, instead it was just looking for a vfat partition anywhere :-) Oct 09 10:16:32 eep! Oct 09 10:16:45 Warning! Oct 09 10:16:50 uhm, you really shouldn't do that to mtdblock4 Oct 09 10:16:51 ? Oct 09 10:16:54 oops? Oct 09 10:17:04 Your internal flash will fail very soon. Oct 09 10:17:06 that's a raw NAND device and it needs a wear leveling file system Oct 09 10:17:23 probably won't fail *soon* but go and reformat it to jffs2 right now Oct 09 10:17:30 Never EVER format a raw mtd block as non-wear-leveling fs. Oct 09 10:17:35 if you need to get stuff off of it remount it read-only first Oct 09 10:18:12 there's no mkfs.jffs2 ... how do I do that? Oct 09 10:18:33 hang on a sec, I'll find you a copy of mkfs.jffs2 Oct 09 10:18:57 these devices confuse me ;) if mtdblock4 is too small for installing real software, but can't hold maps either, it's pretty useless :/ Oct 09 10:19:38 hmm? real software = software that takes lots of space? :P Oct 09 10:19:55 yeah :-) like, say, kdepim :) Oct 09 10:20:02 Works for the vast majority of users. Oct 09 10:20:21 jffs2 is compressed anyway Oct 09 10:20:28 well it was full. Oct 09 10:20:33 kdepim fits in 64MB on a zaurus... Oct 09 10:21:02 remove the useless manuals and images and videos included in /home/user Oct 09 10:21:03 I installed kde4 kdelibs+kdepim (from Mek's package) and the jffs2 system was full Oct 09 10:21:26 Mek told me to boot off the memory card, so now the whole system is cloned there... Oct 09 10:21:35 just clone onto SD. that works for me ;) Oct 09 10:21:48 MangoFusion: and can you still use the maps? Oct 09 10:21:52 dfaure, yeah, booting from sd card isn't a bad idea if you need it Oct 09 10:21:59 just make *two* partitions... Oct 09 10:22:02 is there a problem with the maps on SD? i haven't tried Oct 09 10:22:42 yeah I see that there's lots of empty space, two partitions is probably a good idea. Oct 09 10:23:01 make the first one vfat and it will auto-mount on /media/mmc2 still Oct 09 10:23:04 MangoFusion: well the problem is that if the SD is one big ext2 partition then the maps don't work Oct 09 10:23:30 (since they have to be on a vfat partition, for a reason that totally escapes me) Oct 09 10:23:43 'Map' doesn't work very well either way. ;) Oct 09 10:24:41 actually, I can't find a mkfs.jffs2 for the tablet... Oct 09 10:24:49 GAN800: hey I'm trying to find some usefulness to this device, don't take one third of it away ;) Oct 09 10:24:53 look at fanoush's bootmenu Oct 09 10:25:00 Maemo Mapper Oct 09 10:25:04 just need to make a fat partition before the cloned system partition i think? Oct 09 10:25:06 Stskeeps, ah, good idea Oct 09 10:25:11 dfaure, if it's not useful, why buy it? Oct 09 10:25:20 GAN800: heh ;) it was a gift from nokia Oct 09 10:25:49 dfaure, did you install bootmenu to dual boot? if so, look under /usr/libexec/bootmenu/mkfs.jffs2 Oct 09 10:25:51 or just flasher-3.0 -F --flash-only=rootfs Oct 09 10:26:22 I have some sort of boot menu indeed, but no /usr/libexec/bootmenu/ Oct 09 10:26:40 ah thanks found it Oct 09 10:26:46 inside the initfs_flasher dir Oct 09 10:27:42 hehe that's for making a jffs2 image from a directory tree. why is it named mkfs.jffs2 then :-) Oct 09 10:28:08 * MangoFusion loves when the modest browser decides to choke on JS-heavy sites Oct 09 10:28:39 MangoFusion: that's exactly why you want konqueror on the device :-) Oct 09 10:28:48 that would be 10 times worse ;) Oct 09 10:29:02 nah, webkit has a better js engine for now I think Oct 09 10:29:18 konqueror pulls from webkit now? Oct 09 10:29:24 i thought they were still seperate Oct 09 10:29:32 yes they are separate Oct 09 10:29:45 although we merge fixes from webkit now and then Oct 09 10:30:08 'modest browser'? Oct 09 10:30:16 GAN800, JS heavy email? :) Oct 09 10:30:50 MicroB's getting updates all the time. Oct 09 10:30:57 sorry microb Oct 09 10:30:58 We'll be there soon enough. Oct 09 10:31:05 too many m's Oct 09 10:31:12 Three? Oct 09 10:31:27 Maemo, Modest, MicroB Oct 09 10:31:36 all progress is good progress. It's nice to see cross-polination of ideas and especially nice to see open source browsers overshadowing closed source ones Oct 09 10:31:37 does anyone know if there is a JavaScript console available for microb? Oct 09 10:31:48 i seem to be getting an error in my code Oct 09 10:31:57 which i cannot reproduce anywhere else Oct 09 10:32:14 not even firebug lite seems to help Oct 09 10:32:59 I wonder how Carman does alternate map repos. Oct 09 10:33:13 Has Carman been released? Oct 09 10:33:19 Sorta of Oct 09 10:33:31 metapackage doesn't seem to be in place Oct 09 10:33:39 extras-devel for now? Oct 09 10:33:56 But installing most of the stuff apt-cache search carman* shows will do yah Oct 09 10:34:04 Yeah Oct 09 10:34:15 will be waiting then Oct 09 10:34:18 It's very pretty Oct 09 10:34:40 btw, there is a nice network scanner app released but it has got real problems integrating into hildon ui Oct 09 10:35:05 and it's not in the repo, unfortunately Oct 09 10:35:20 I need to figure out which Bluetooth serial adaptor I want. Oct 09 10:35:50 Meanwhile: "Armed police officers yesterday shot dead a devil dog which attacked four people during a uncontrolled rampage in Mitcham, South London." Oct 09 10:36:05 GAN: There is exactly 1 (one) BT ODB dongle on the market Oct 09 10:36:17 So, it is not necessary figuring out Oct 09 10:36:29 Serial adaptor for the OBDII scanner I already have. Oct 09 10:36:34 ah Oct 09 10:36:45 you kids with your digital ECUs *shakes his head* Oct 09 10:37:18 * GAN800 throws a carb at johnx. Oct 09 10:37:59 heh...not talking carbs either. I'm thinking about early analog ECUs :) Oct 09 10:38:09 I'm really baffled by the Max Payne trailer Oct 09 10:38:16 johnx, lemme guess, a bicycle? =) Oct 09 10:38:34 RST38h, lots of early 80's Japanese cars Oct 09 10:38:38 ah Oct 09 10:38:42 I've played the game at least 20 times and it doesn't look a thing like it. Oct 09 10:38:59 * RST38h had an '84 Camry but it already came with a digital ecu, afaik Oct 09 10:39:27 yeah, it was just a couple really awkward years in the late 70s/early 80s Oct 09 10:40:06 The only movie based on a game that I liked was the Mario Brothers but only because the whole production team seemed to be on toadstools Oct 09 10:40:22 urgh Oct 09 10:41:03 No, really, how else would you produce shit like that? Oct 09 10:41:07 What good video game-based games have there been? Oct 09 10:42:00 street fighter Oct 09 10:42:41 (only cos kylie was in it) Oct 09 10:43:26 it's sad because there's a lot of good material to work from Oct 09 10:45:06 Doom? ;) Oct 09 10:45:07 not really, what would be best is to find a story which can sit on multiple platforms andhas enough backstory to make both the game and the movie entertaining and thrilling Oct 09 10:45:20 * lcuk wants to see half life universe explored in movie Oct 09 10:45:37 games normally have skin-deep back stories, what would you work from? Oct 09 10:45:55 Normally, but that's not true of all games. Oct 09 10:45:59 RST38h, thats the thing, the backstory commonly comes from what the engine is capable of Oct 09 10:46:05 * lardman wants to see the Force Unleashed as it's console only; then again there is already a book of the story of the game, hmm Oct 09 10:46:14 should I flash_eraseall /dev/mtd4 or is this yet another bad idea? Oct 09 10:46:24 lcuk: Not really: books "engine" isn't capable of anything but god do they have rich back stories! Oct 09 10:46:25 Hehe, I want to to Shadows of the Empire made into a movie. Oct 09 10:46:43 GeneralAntilles: there must be books of that already? Oct 09 10:46:49 can I has my snow crash movie? Oct 09 10:46:50 ok, just give me a Dungeonkeeper The Movie... Oct 09 10:46:55 lardman, yes, there's a book. Oct 09 10:47:06 Lucas can't have anything to do with it, though. Oct 09 10:47:07 books are better than movies. Oct 09 10:47:10 He's clearly lost his mind. Oct 09 10:47:17 Books are _different_ than movies. Oct 09 10:47:31 RST38h, books are entirely artistic and mind candy, if theres enough meat inside a good literary universe you can expand to movies/games Oct 09 10:47:37 well written book is better than a movie, unless the movie is going to be 10hrs long of course ;) Oct 09 10:47:37 like star wars as mentioned Oct 09 10:47:42 Few people really push the medium to its limits, though. Oct 09 10:47:52 but more often than not the backstory to a game is like the plot to a porn movie Oct 09 10:47:59 lcuk: Exactly. But games are entirely eye candy and masturbation tools Oct 09 10:48:10 lcuk: No place for backstories there Oct 09 10:48:11 2001 is an example of a movie that really excels at pushing the visual medium. Oct 09 10:48:12 *see previous comment Oct 09 10:48:16 Leisure suite Larry? Oct 09 10:48:20 (spelling?) Oct 09 10:48:31 jet set willy :D Oct 09 10:48:41 in 3d Oct 09 10:48:42 even stuff like WoW is basically a masturbation tool Oct 09 10:48:55 wow is visual IRC Oct 09 10:48:57 depends what you're in to :) Oct 09 10:49:01 * johnx vows never to play WoW against RST38h Oct 09 10:49:02 Queer pleasure through repetitive performance of senseless actions Oct 09 10:49:20 johnx: lol. might be an advantage for you though, not got his mind on the job Oct 09 10:49:22 * RST38h has never played WoW but has just met a WoW addict Oct 09 10:49:23 i like playing the maemo game :) Oct 09 10:49:56 GAN800: SW games have gone downhill since Dark Forces and the first of the Jedi Knights imo Oct 09 10:49:57 i hear its starting to be ported to other gaming systems at the moment though ;) Oct 09 10:49:57 This stuff *isn't* healthy Oct 09 10:50:02 " RST38h, books are entirely artistic and mind candy" Oct 09 10:50:06 That makes no sense, lcuk. :P Oct 09 10:50:19 depends on how you define artistic Oct 09 10:50:20 WoW addicts are just drug addicts who don't know a dealer... Oct 09 10:50:22 GeneralAntilles: probably means you have to use your imagination Oct 09 10:50:34 GeneralAntilles, theres more to read than the back of a cereal packet Oct 09 10:50:40 lardman, for a Calculus textbook, too? :P Oct 09 10:50:57 He obviously did not mean your calculus textbook =) Oct 09 10:51:05 Books are nothing more than bound pages of paper with words printed on them. Oct 09 10:51:10 yeah, imagine how you're going to take over the world using your new skills, motivational ;) Oct 09 10:51:30 RST38h, *shrugs* it _is_ a book. Oct 09 10:51:48 * RST38h is trying to figure out how to get access to a machine in the US Oct 09 10:51:55 * lcuk changes stance: fiction books were intent of my comment Oct 09 10:52:00 From a "controlled country", too... Oct 09 10:52:20 Obfuscated to no end... Oct 09 10:52:34 lcuk, a lot of fiction books fail the "artistry and mind candy" test, too. ;) Oct 09 10:52:39 funny, mount -t jffs2 was enough to get a jffs2 system back. no mkfs needed. Oct 09 10:52:49 uh. Oct 09 10:53:00 O_o Oct 09 10:53:02 GAN: Calculus certainly satisfies the mind candy part Oct 09 10:53:12 dfaure, run mount and make sure Oct 09 10:53:13 GAN: And the artistry depends on the author Oct 09 10:53:17 GeneralAntilles, just like many games fail the entertaining and fun tests Oct 09 10:53:25 RST38h, now _that's_ a highly subjective statement. Oct 09 10:53:27 yep, mount says jffs2. Oct 09 10:53:45 * lcuk stops this convo anyway, we are gettin in the way of a serious problem Oct 09 10:53:50 I'd work through this: Actually the only aspect I get hung up on (and with the comic as well) has to do with fuel for the jet boots. But again, I just suspend disbelief and enjoy the fictional ride... Oct 09 10:53:54 and I can chown a file, so this is definitely not FAT :) Oct 09 10:53:54 oops Oct 09 10:53:59 bloody cut and paste Oct 09 10:53:59 so you mkfs'ed mtdblock4 with vfat, and then you're able to remount it vfat? Oct 09 10:54:00 * RST38h had more Calculus than General can ever imagine Oct 09 10:54:13 this even: http://www.sfsite.com/lists/orion01.htm Oct 09 10:54:23 mount it jffs2, that is Oct 09 10:54:37 RST38h, yes, I'm sure, but not everybody find math enjoyable. Oct 09 10:54:40 Stskeeps: Yep. I mkfs'ed mtdblock4 with vfat, mouted it, umounted it, then mounted it with -t jffs2, and that seems to have reformatted it Oct 09 10:54:58 it matches what I saw while googling, too; people would erase the mtd device and then just mount it... Oct 09 10:55:00 300+ hours total just in the first 4 semesters Oct 09 10:55:06 dfaure: god bless unexpected sideeffects.. Oct 09 10:55:30 yeah what if someone has important data in a vfat partition and just mounts it wrongly.... Oct 09 10:55:43 i swear, at some point i'm going to discover something that'll make me loose all faith in technology, and i'd move into a monastary Oct 09 10:56:38 thank god for that Oct 09 10:57:14 s/loose/lose/ Oct 09 10:57:35 or s/me loose all faith/my faith all loose/ Oct 09 11:00:53 grammar nazi. Oct 09 11:01:08 KILL KILL Oct 09 11:01:09 http://gizmodo.com/5060946/barack-obamas-3-million-overhead-projector-actually-pretty-cool Oct 09 11:01:47 * RST38h gives up on trying to get access =( Oct 09 11:03:46 lardman, related: what killed Iron Man for me was the scientist idiotically waving a rifle running after those two terrorists who were themselves running away like a couple of schoolgirls. Oct 09 11:04:52 well he was probably pretty smelly after living in a cave for a year... Oct 09 11:05:11 All that stupid campy shit that you'd never see in Batman. Oct 09 11:05:44 hmm, I'm not too fond of Batman, film started well, finished poorly Oct 09 11:05:56 first of the new ones that is, I've not seen the latest one Oct 09 11:05:59 O_O Oct 09 11:06:03 Oh Oct 09 11:06:04 Ah Oct 09 11:06:14 * Stskeeps fell asleep during the dark knight.. but then again, that was after several beers Oct 09 11:06:22 I was going to have to kill you for not liking The Dark Knight Oct 09 11:06:22 should rewatch it some other point Oct 09 11:06:31 Dark Knight is probably the greatest superhero movie ever made. Oct 09 11:06:34 When's it out on video? Oct 09 11:06:44 s/video/DVD (of course) Oct 09 11:06:47 Dunno Oct 09 11:06:53 I saw it 4 times in IMAX Oct 09 11:07:06 must be cheaper to go to the cinema over there then! ;) Oct 09 11:07:14 Free Oct 09 11:07:24 hmm, yes that's quite cheap :) Oct 09 11:07:31 I know a few people who work in that theater. Oct 09 11:08:29 Finally got my N810 back from the Big N... Oct 09 11:09:35 towo, how did you get it back from Nigel, he threatened to beat me up when i asked for mine back Oct 09 11:09:48 Bigger guns. Oct 09 11:10:12 was it bein repaired? how long did it take? Oct 09 11:11:25 Gentlemen, do you all understand that you are discussing stupid story-less movies shot in Hollywood based on some goddamn comic books? Oct 09 11:11:48 Heh Oct 09 11:12:15 And you expect these movies to be realitic! =) Oct 09 11:12:46 RST38h, did you see the new Batman's? Oct 09 11:12:52 s/'// Oct 09 11:12:52 GeneralAntilles meant: RST38h, did you see the new Batmans? Oct 09 11:12:53 No and not going to Oct 09 11:13:01 Then stuff it. Oct 09 11:13:10 It is quite sufficient that I have seen Iron Man, while on a plane Oct 09 11:13:25 now, now children. quit bickering Oct 09 11:13:50 * Stskeeps had a flashback of comic book guy for a second there Oct 09 11:13:59 The old Batman at least had the atmosphere. I do not exepct anything but blue-screened visual effects from the new one Oct 09 11:14:08 Stskeeps, only for a second? Oct 09 11:14:25 RST38h, actually, there's not a lot of CGI in the new ones. Oct 09 11:14:27 lcuk: okay, more :P Oct 09 11:14:40 GeneralAntilles, uhm, WTH? Oct 09 11:14:46 johnx, true! Oct 09 11:14:47 General: Really? Why? Oct 09 11:14:52 Ran out of money? Oct 09 11:14:52 Well, more than the latest drama. Oct 09 11:15:09 But Nolan isn't a fan of over-the-top effects. Oct 09 11:15:14 GeneralAntilles, do you think that the batmobile and that ridiculous bat-cycle-thing exist and were driven around a real city? Oct 09 11:15:25 johnx, the batcycle was CGI Oct 09 11:15:28 The batmobile is real. Oct 09 11:15:44 "I think there's a vague sense out there that movies are becoming more and more unreal, I know I've felt it. The demand we put on ourselves was to be as spectacular as possible, but not depend on computer graphics to do it." Oct 09 11:15:46 GeneralAntilles, and it really crushes cars? Oct 09 11:16:13 Mars Attacks was probably the last good SF movie to come from Hollywood Oct 09 11:16:30 johnx, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Batmobile_(Batman_Begins) Oct 09 11:16:41 Given that Wag The Dog is now a documentary. Oct 09 11:17:49 latest decent sci fi i've seen was the man from earth, and code 46.. well, and v for vendetta Oct 09 11:17:58 Man from Earth was excellent Oct 09 11:18:02 Classic science fiction Oct 09 11:18:10 i went to donate cos i couldn't buy it in my region just yet Oct 09 11:18:35 * RST38h checks imdb Oct 09 11:18:53 i need to keep two keyboards on nit-env-gnome-basic that how could write one or an another Oct 09 11:19:09 thux: huh? Oct 09 11:19:14 RST38h, you didn't like the Matrix? Oct 09 11:19:38 * Stskeeps was okay with first matrix, animatrix, but two last ones sucked Oct 09 11:19:45 Stskeeps, well, duh. ;) Oct 09 11:19:56 General: No. Should I? Oct 09 11:19:57 V for Vendetta! I couldn't bring myself to watch that Oct 09 11:20:06 Donnie Dark is another good one post Mars Attacks Oct 09 11:20:13 yeah, donnie darko obviously Oct 09 11:20:14 Children of Men Oct 09 11:20:19 lardman: it's a -very- good movie Oct 09 11:20:22 hmm Oct 09 11:20:43 especially when you live in UK you can probably draw some parrallels :P Oct 09 11:20:44 RST38h, I'm baffled as to why one wouldn't like the Matrix. Oct 09 11:21:04 RST38h, how about Serenity? Oct 09 11:21:08 (why is it always UK that gets the movies about police states, deadly infections, etc?) Oct 09 11:21:11 mostly upper one but it opens first lower one and have to close killing pid Oct 09 11:21:15 GeneralAntilles, to be different. Oct 09 11:21:18 General: Mindless special effects, shallow and unoriginal back story, naive ideas of what networks and hacking are Oct 09 11:21:29 General: I absolutely liked Serenity the series and somewhat liked the move Oct 09 11:21:32 movie Oct 09 11:21:49 General: For the sole reason that it is very low key and not about SF at all Oct 09 11:21:54 Serenity movie was rubbish imho, not seen the series Oct 09 11:22:16 thux: not sure what you're trying to explain Oct 09 11:22:16 lardman: You should see series first, the movie is kinda useless to watch otherwise Oct 09 11:22:17 lardman, it doesn't work too well to see the movie first I think Oct 09 11:22:37 yeah, not much backstory, or indeed story at all afaict Oct 09 11:22:52 lardman, it doesn't give enough character intro in the movie. you need to start watching it with the characters already in your mind Oct 09 11:22:56 Eh, I saw the movie first and enjoyed the hell out of it. Oct 09 11:23:16 Movie isn't bad but kinda incomplete Oct 09 11:25:08 johnx, you read the wiki page? :) Oct 09 11:25:34 GeneralAntilles, what wiki page? Oct 09 11:25:53 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Batmobile_(Batman_Begins) Oct 09 11:26:28 ah, that. yeah...I believe you now. I still think a lot of that scene was done with cgi, but I'll grant not all of it Oct 09 11:32:00 * Stskeeps ponders idly Oct 09 11:32:05 found a comment somewhere: Boot loader is "NoLo". It supports booting off from SD cards as well. Oct 09 11:32:08 i wonder Oct 09 11:33:02 go go stskeeps Oct 09 11:34:36 not that it matters that much when we can add new kernel and such and flash it.. Oct 09 11:35:13 still, .. FreeBSD? ;> Oct 09 11:35:42 with ... no drivers? :P Oct 09 11:35:52 hehe Oct 09 11:35:52 Sweet, the Collabora stuff is coming to Extras ;) Oct 09 11:35:59 didn't say it should be useful Oct 09 11:36:15 johnx: in any case it would probably be possible to replace NOLO with u-boot Oct 09 11:36:24 i'm not going to touch that, but it's probably possible Oct 09 11:36:28 or just kexec if needed Oct 09 11:39:48 hi. i want to get a passwordless root login to diablo. where should i place my pub key? i can add the key to ~/.ssh/authorized_keys to login as user, but i need to do this for root Oct 09 11:40:11 bongo: then /root/.ssh/authorized_keys ;) Oct 09 11:41:12 ok, just create the .ssh folder if it is not there? Oct 09 11:41:17 yes Oct 09 11:42:20 works, thx Oct 09 11:48:46 X-Fade: Just make sure they and Nix merge their Pidgin installations Oct 09 11:49:27 X-Fade: Also, after talking with Collabora guys, it looks like their Pidgin/libpurple packages are kind of bogus: they are not supposed to be used separately, only as support for their own stuff Oct 09 11:49:30 RST38h: That is their idea actually ;) Oct 09 11:49:44 X-Fade: I talked to them about it yesterday ;) Oct 09 11:49:52 RST38h: Ah good ;) Oct 09 11:50:34 Their stuff includes 18MB extra data (which is really optional and this is how Nix' Pidgin treats it) Oct 09 11:52:08 bongo: next time use ssh-copy-id Oct 09 11:52:19 'ssh-copy-id root@nokia.lan' Oct 09 11:52:20 RST38h: Well anyway, it is easier to deal with it when it is all in the same repo. Oct 09 11:52:31 X-Fade: hopefully =) Oct 09 11:52:45 RST38h: Or it might explode earlier ;) Oct 09 11:52:57 hrw: nice hint ;) Oct 09 11:53:21 it will most likely explode due to version conflict but I hope Collabora and Nix resolve it Oct 09 11:54:16 RST38h: Well you can't upload conflicts as those won't build on the builder. So perhaps.. Oct 09 12:03:30 could you please check out this thread on iTT: Oct 09 12:03:30 http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?p=232020#post232020 Oct 09 12:03:30 i've got some problems setting up an rfcomm connection.. Oct 09 12:03:30 thanks and cu l8er Oct 09 12:06:48 Stskeeps: gnome-terminal didnt open browser? Oct 09 12:14:47 thux: i'm sorry, i don't get you? maybe there's no browser installed :P Oct 09 12:15:30 icexeasel is Oct 09 12:15:41 weasel Oct 09 12:16:03 then write iceweasel in terminal? Oct 09 12:16:08 it might take a while to startup :P Oct 09 12:16:36 usually gnome-terminal opens link from irc Oct 09 12:16:59 but deblet doesnt Oct 09 12:18:22 when you do irc with terminal and somebody insert http link Oct 09 12:19:06 klik link browser opens Oct 09 12:20:31 do you have the correct browser selected in the preferences? Oct 09 12:20:54 i check Oct 09 12:24:49 johnx: that helped thanx Oct 09 13:13:03 kudos to Canola team for finally adding back Ogg support in 10-beta2 :) Oct 09 13:13:50 AStorm, Diablo not lookin' so bad anymore? ;) Oct 09 13:15:39 dneary, ping. Oct 09 13:17:10 GeneralAntilles: yeah, almost looking good Oct 09 13:17:23 now, we need maemopad++ and non-broken xournal Oct 09 13:17:52 lardman|lunch, ping. Oct 09 13:17:59 I'd actually rather extend xournal with basic tree note manager :) Oct 09 13:18:22 and a few other minor features Oct 09 13:18:36 AStorm: Maemopad+ is in Extras now. Oct 09 13:18:45 http://maemo.org/downloads/product/OS2008/maemopadplus/ Oct 09 13:18:53 good :) Oct 09 13:19:07 still, broken xournal is in extras-deve Oct 09 13:19:09 *-devel Oct 09 13:19:13 crashy to hell Oct 09 13:19:41 GeneralAntilles: Here Oct 09 13:19:50 But have to go see the accountant in about 15 minutes Oct 09 13:20:10 dneary, whenever you get time, can you look over my lists for killing the old wiki? Oct 09 13:20:31 I reviewed the pages, and put together a list of redirects and a list of salvageable stuff. Oct 09 13:20:39 I need some more people to eyeball it, though. Oct 09 13:21:14 hola Oct 09 13:22:18 xournal has much more mature editing tools, while maemopad+ has the nice tree note manager and text notes Oct 09 13:22:27 GeneralAntilles: Pointer? Oct 09 13:22:44 also, xournal has pdf support Oct 09 13:22:45 Is this wikireorg in the old wiki, or a page in the new wiki that I haven't been watching? Oct 09 13:22:50 so... :) Oct 09 13:22:55 http://wiki.maemo.org/Task:Kill_the_old_wiki Oct 09 13:23:58 I wasn't as methodical as I should have been putting together the redirect list, so I may have missed some. Oct 09 13:27:55 hmmh Oct 09 13:28:10 I'm getting "Unable to read socket" in pidgin Oct 09 13:28:23 with GaduGadu transport Oct 09 13:28:35 while my pidgin on laptop works all right Oct 09 13:29:02 same 2.5.1 version Oct 09 13:29:39 maybe the difference is that mine uses gnutls Oct 09 13:33:02 GeneralAntilles: OK - looks like a good start! Oct 09 13:33:26 dneary, after the list is made, we just need to kill it and put the redirects in. Oct 09 13:33:36 There should definitely be a pointer to wikireorg, since that has a list of the pages we moved before. Oct 09 13:33:56 Oh! There it is, righht at the top Oct 09 13:33:57 Sorry Oct 09 13:34:06 I didn't think "old wiki" would link to that page Oct 09 13:35:13 It could probably be more prominent, but I was being lazy. ;) Oct 09 14:01:37 Weird: apparently cellphones are still stolen and resold around here Oct 09 14:02:11 One would think that IMEIs make this kind of crime a complete deadend Oct 09 14:02:12 RST38h, did you see the awesome iphone scam? Oct 09 14:02:17 oh yes Oct 09 14:02:32 that's full of win Oct 09 14:02:34 and I actually suspect that it is a chinese-made toy they are using Oct 09 14:02:54 heh...but in China they make *real* iphones :P Oct 09 14:03:12 they will make it as real as you are ready to pay =) Oct 09 14:03:55 but iphones are actually going out of fashion: the public eagerly awaits 5800 and HTC Touch HD =) Oct 09 14:04:32 going out of fashion among geeks maybe Oct 09 14:04:44 I mean the razr v3 is still the most sold phone in the US... Oct 09 14:04:56 johnx: it is a bit different here. more like Japan than like USA Oct 09 14:05:11 * Stskeeps is seeing more and more ipod touch'es though Oct 09 14:05:20 heh...iphone isn't going out of style here either, among normal people. try again Oct 09 14:05:30 johnx: dumb-like-a-stump blondes with ultra expensive smartphones like N95 etc Oct 09 14:05:48 people are really upset about iphone + teleproviders here, .. the 3g net is simply not up to par Oct 09 14:06:18 johnx: apparently, people who have enough money to eat but not enough money to buy cars consider cell phones the next available expression of social status Oct 09 14:06:22 i would actually prefer a n810w here, the range is quite good in this area :P Oct 09 14:06:50 johnx: But this also means they have to change cell phones often :) Oct 09 14:08:03 RST38h, two factors here: everyone is in love with the ipod (enthralled is more accurate) and everyone plays cell phone games or surfs the inet on their phone, hence the iphone is going like mad Oct 09 14:08:38 johnx: yea, those two would make it a killer gadget Oct 09 14:08:49 although gaming is somewhat limited on iphone Oct 09 14:09:10 RST38h, not serious gaming, just things to pass the time on a 1 hour commute on a crowded train Oct 09 14:09:51 johnx: I always said that $20/gallon gas will make smartphones mighty popular in US ;) Oct 09 14:10:14 no public transportation infrastructure to speak of though Oct 09 14:10:23 is iphone 3d hardware accelerated? Oct 09 14:10:24 otherwise, poor americans just don't have time to play with their phones Oct 09 14:10:27 yes Oct 09 14:10:40 johnx: Well, bus network is really easy to roll out Oct 09 14:11:01 johnx: And I am pretty sure that under the right management Amtrak will cost like a bus, not like an airplane Oct 09 14:11:08 RST38h, we'll see I guess. it was shrinking over the last few years though in the seattle area Oct 09 14:11:19 johnx: same everywhere Oct 09 14:11:32 RST38h, amtrak doesn't *go anywhere* that people need day-to-day Oct 09 14:11:46 although at the east coast, chinese have built several bus lines of their own Oct 09 14:12:06 johnx: but it does - it connects dc, baltimore, nyc, and boston Oct 09 14:12:23 I'd love to take a train back home. Oct 09 14:12:26 johnx: that covers a lot of places where people go to work Oct 09 14:12:28 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4zBnwqHjQNA <- i kinda want one Oct 09 14:12:36 RST38h, can you actually use it to commute though? Oct 09 14:12:39 There's apparently a track and stations, I can't figure out if it's possible to actually ride it, though. Oct 09 14:12:50 johnx: my dad does Oct 09 14:13:04 RST38h, terrifying! I never knew... O_o Oct 09 14:13:13 johnx: it is either amrtak or driving and parking in DC Oct 09 14:13:29 I heard they want to up the security to airport levels though... Oct 09 14:13:39 johnx: and believe me, driving and parking in DC during the rush hour is way more terrifying and more expensive too Oct 09 14:13:52 if they do, they will lose lots of business travelers Oct 09 14:13:57 RST38h, yeah, I know. been there, done that Oct 09 14:14:27 I wonder if amtrak actually does "commuter" service in seattle->everett Oct 09 14:16:05 i would like to have nvidia gpu and ppc phone with linux Oct 09 14:16:31 johnx: it may but may cost like an airplane ticket too Oct 09 14:16:47 talk to nvidia, they're not offering linux support for their embedded GPUs it appears Oct 09 14:16:56 also, why PPC instead of ARM? Oct 09 14:17:02 thux: would you like a cooling system with that? Oct 09 14:17:18 g5 hotpocket Oct 09 14:17:44 i got ppc ipaq was much better than omap ipaq Oct 09 14:18:12 you do not understand what you are talking about Oct 09 14:18:36 thux, link to the ppc ipaq, please? I'm interested :) Oct 09 14:18:42 "ppc ipaq" = iPaq running PocketPC (WinCE for PDAs) Oct 09 14:18:57 ppc in this case = pocketpc? and not the cpu arch.... Oct 09 14:18:58 the chip inside ipaq is an Intel XScale ARM chip Oct 09 14:19:00 no powerpc Oct 09 14:19:10 thux: link Oct 09 14:19:14 some url to it Oct 09 14:19:31 Now, "ppc phone with linux" is an oxymoron, as you probably understand now Oct 09 14:19:33 i don't have link Oct 09 14:19:43 It is either PocketPC or Linux, choose one Oct 09 14:20:02 lol Oct 09 14:20:08 ppc cpu familiat linux Oct 09 14:20:09 thux: i'm failing to google powerpc ipaq. so. link or it's bullshit Oct 09 14:21:18 thux, I've been following the ipaq line for about 10 years, and they've always based them on ARM processors. I'm not sure if they ever used an OMAP, but I'm pretty sure it was mostly strongARM, then xscale Oct 09 14:21:18 thux: there were no ppc cpus in ipaqs Oct 09 14:21:42 thux: if you think there were, provide us with a url Oct 09 14:22:18 does wince even run on powerpc? Oct 09 14:22:34 Somehow I doubt it. Oct 09 14:22:46 I *think* it does Oct 09 14:22:57 Maybe we could run some 360 games on it, though. ;) Oct 09 14:23:34 Last time I checked, WinCE supported MIPS and ARM Oct 09 14:23:51 WinNT ran on PowerPC and Alha before, but Microsoft killed both ports long time ago Oct 09 14:24:01 s/Alha/Alpha/ Oct 09 14:24:01 RST38h meant: WinNT ran on PowerPC and Alpha before, but Microsoft killed both ports long time ago Oct 09 14:24:06 johnx: what's your view regarding what things need polishing in deblet currently? Oct 09 14:24:08 system level wise Oct 09 14:24:39 Stskeeps, real system level? or user facing control of system level stuff? Oct 09 14:25:17 well things that may not work so well, - beneath the user interface i guess Oct 09 14:26:02 we should look into wifipowersave setting when not connected Oct 09 14:26:25 yes, and more power saving stuff. figure out what's taking CPU cycles while idle Oct 09 14:26:37 BTW, xscreensaver runs while the screen is blank :) Oct 09 14:26:47 by default Oct 09 14:26:50 yeah, i found out by accident Oct 09 14:27:03 i had some s2ram and it returned and had a weirdass display on Oct 09 14:27:16 and wondered.. and realized it was a screensaver Oct 09 14:27:23 heh...I just plugged it into power once and saw it Oct 09 14:27:30 it was really pretty on such a high res screen :) Oct 09 14:27:34 but also really warm Oct 09 14:27:50 yeah, nit-env-lxde needs a loving hand Oct 09 14:27:51 :P Oct 09 14:28:06 Hehehehe: http://www.boston.com/news/nation/articles/2008/10/08/nyc_national_debt_clock_runs_out_of_digits/ Oct 09 14:32:45 johnx: new n-m will have ppp support btw Oct 09 14:32:51 compiled some packages Oct 09 14:34:07 johnx: also i was pondering if we should make cron use retu wakeup or the likes maybe Oct 09 14:34:23 so we can use s2ram? Oct 09 14:34:37 well also saving power Oct 09 14:34:45 and maybe s2ram too i guess Oct 09 14:35:13 i used s2ram in ireland, worked decently but had some deadly encounters with a non-PSM wifi that killed my power Oct 09 14:35:23 but then again i didn't play any sounds (dsp should have problems) Oct 09 14:36:27 should we maybe consider removing cron package since we don't really need it for now, i dunno :P Oct 09 14:36:41 hmm, does it really kill the battery? Oct 09 14:36:48 it should only wake up once a minute Oct 09 14:36:57 or is it constantly running a timer? Oct 09 14:37:26 good question Oct 09 14:37:30 lemme see code Oct 09 14:38:27 I ran it on os2007 without ill effects I believe Oct 09 14:38:35 it certainly didn't have a huge impact Oct 09 14:39:43 well i had problem mine went to sleep so it missed the cron wakeups Oct 09 14:39:47 so it didn't do its job Oct 09 14:40:46 .. could always port maemo's alarmd Oct 09 14:42:00 johnx: wakes up every minute, reads its databases.. Oct 09 14:42:18 that shouldn't be bad I think Oct 09 14:42:52 i wish we had some way of determing what swallows power Oct 09 14:43:14 powertop :) Oct 09 14:43:31 need an oprofile kernel and some other debug thing as well Oct 09 14:43:36 *nod* Oct 09 14:43:43 CONFIG_TIMER_STATS (I think), doesn't like the wifi last time I tried Oct 09 14:44:00 qwerty12, did you recompile the wifi driver? Oct 09 14:44:26 johnx: Hmm, good point, I didn't. umac or cx3110x? Oct 09 14:44:31 out of question :) Oct 09 14:44:33 cx3110x I mean Oct 09 14:45:11 then again if we mess up the wifi we can still analyze on the system itself Oct 09 14:45:43 qwerty12, was it just CONFIG_TIMER_STATS or was there something else? Oct 09 14:45:51 * johnx might have made up the oprofile bit... Oct 09 14:46:09 johnx: nokia provides oprofile kernels Oct 09 14:46:16 johnx: just that for powertop. The other options were not present or already activated Oct 09 14:48:01 johnx: also i'm not sure if it's a problem we use a system compiled not optimally for our processor Oct 09 14:48:15 (jesus, my language is bad today. Oct 09 14:48:59 Probably doesn't help. Oct 09 14:49:02 it is a problem I think *sighs* Oct 09 14:49:10 You could always recompile for armv6 and see. *g* Oct 09 14:49:26 but I'm not sure what to do about it, short of putting effort into angstrom or mamona instead Oct 09 14:49:46 Ublet Oct 09 14:50:09 GeneralAntilles: that's true, but it actually misses some things that are kinda basic for a sane system :P Oct 09 14:50:10 >:| Oct 09 14:50:23 Oh? Oct 09 14:51:02 GeneralAntilles: well bits and pieces around, atleast in the newest versions, that aren't complete, so many of the basic metapackages aren't installable Oct 09 14:51:31 * GeneralAntilles doesn't really know anything about Ubuntu from Mojo other than that it's available for armv6 Oct 09 14:51:46 most of it is available Oct 09 14:52:02 lots of compiling...lots of *native* compiling Oct 09 14:53:39 i guess we can find packages that are intensive and compile some of them for arm and prioritize them or something Oct 09 14:53:43 armv6 Oct 09 14:54:32 you have a beagleboard coming, right? Oct 09 14:54:46 got one but have serial issues atm Oct 09 14:55:05 well, once it's up can find a good use for its spare cycles... Oct 09 14:55:19 hehe Oct 09 14:55:29 hey, I'll pitch in with my pandora when it comes Oct 09 14:56:25 lol Oct 09 14:56:38 I think we should convince tekojo to get a cluster for maemo.org. ;) Oct 09 14:57:15 But I've grown fond of the 770's that host maemo.org Oct 09 14:57:50 For the autobuilder Oct 09 14:58:09 https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=3519 has finally got attention Oct 09 14:58:12 My bad :). That would be a nice idea actually :) Oct 09 14:58:17 Rejoice! Oct 09 14:58:29 I really wish they had a price on the overo. Oct 09 14:59:10 RST38h, can you attach the relevant patches? Oct 09 14:59:42 http://sse2.net/rotate/Updated_blizzard_rotation_support_v2.diff & http://labs.vivi.eng.br/blog/rotation-patches/adding-support-to-xrandr-on-xomap.patch to save time Oct 09 14:59:53 attaching Oct 09 15:00:38 They are already attached there so no need to do it again Oct 09 15:01:14 Linking from a comment is not an attachment. ;) Oct 09 15:01:57 oh ok Oct 09 15:02:08 what arm version was 770? Oct 09 15:02:14 v5 iirc Oct 09 15:02:23 k Oct 09 15:02:27 armv5 Oct 09 15:02:31 It was an ARM9 Oct 09 15:06:21 Jaffa: i'd like to update the vala and libgee packages, get them into extras, and keep them maintained. do you think it makes more sense to do this via mud or shall i just create a garage project? Oct 09 15:07:39 The About box in the latest Gnumeric is hilarious Oct 09 15:12:40 GeneralAntilles: https://garage.maemo.org/projects/mauku/ Oct 09 15:12:47 GeneralAntilles: You knew about that, right? :) Oct 09 15:13:01 When did they open it? Oct 09 15:13:07 Or was I just misremembering? :\ Oct 09 15:13:22 Registered: 2007-10-10 13:34 Oct 09 15:13:39 Hrm Oct 09 15:13:44 I wonder what I was thinking of. Oct 09 15:14:04 It used to be closed. But 11 months ago was the first upload of code. Oct 09 15:15:05 hola Oct 09 15:15:11 Somebody needs to teach tim how to quote. Oct 09 15:15:24 Oh, that reminds me. I need to ask Hendrik to upload to Extras ;) Oct 09 15:16:09 *Henrik Oct 09 15:19:06 what's -vfp for generally? Oct 09 15:19:13 or is that a bad thing on tablets? Oct 09 15:19:32 good on an n8x0, not present on a 770 Oct 09 15:19:36 k Oct 09 15:19:36 Stskeeps: Floating point. N8x0 like that. Oct 09 15:19:54 But it kills performance on 770. Oct 09 15:20:42 Stskeeps: How are you going to optimise it both for 770 and N800 at the same time? Oct 09 15:21:02 Sure, 770 opts should work on N800 but you won't get the best performance Oct 09 15:21:05 You aren't Oct 09 15:21:51 the debian armel builds are probably close to optimal for the 770 Oct 09 15:22:23 ^ Oct 09 15:34:41 okay, what's the use of building thousands and thousands of packages, when you can't even do a good debootstrap package.. Oct 09 15:41:45 http://lwn.net/Articles/243939/ <- that really explains some awkward problems i've been having Oct 09 15:42:32 That's a pretty shitty thing to set as default im Oct 09 15:42:47 recommended to me means you should but you don't strictly have to Oct 09 15:43:05 yes Oct 09 15:43:15 * Stskeeps passes on the crackpipe he just got passed from the apt developers Oct 09 15:43:30 Hehe Oct 09 15:45:18 I'm mixed on the recommends thing Oct 09 15:45:30 it usually means this package will start but not really work unless you do this Oct 09 15:45:52 or it *should* with suggests being "you might also want this" Oct 09 15:47:43 * Stskeeps tries a nit-env-lxde without recommends Oct 09 15:48:09 hi, how can i use n800 as a graphics tablet for a desktop computer? Oct 09 15:48:24 is there a way to forward mouse events from x? Oct 09 15:48:31 or something like that? Oct 09 15:48:35 vnc? Oct 09 15:49:08 the mouse actions should be precise. Oct 09 15:49:25 my main motive to be able to draw diagrams and stuff Oct 09 15:50:43 considered using xournal for sketching instead? i guess you can make a program that translates pressure, x, and y in some way Oct 09 15:51:04 Stskeeps: yes.. i do have xournal. Oct 09 15:51:41 how may i get started suppose i'm willing to write an app? Oct 09 15:51:48 python's a good start Oct 09 15:51:49 :P Oct 09 15:51:51 i've some basic programming skills. Oct 09 15:52:05 i mean the documentation and stuff Oct 09 15:52:36 darx: http://maemo.org/development/documentation/ Oct 09 15:52:50 thanks Oct 09 15:54:01 is n800 diablo or chinook? Oct 09 15:55:04 those are just different software versions Oct 09 15:55:09 it depends on which one you installed Oct 09 15:55:52 OS2008 Oct 09 15:56:03 they are two versions of os2008 Oct 09 15:56:45 2.6.21-omap1 Oct 09 15:56:58 just look in the about box in control panel Oct 09 15:57:04 they *both* use the same kernel Oct 09 15:57:16 Hehe Oct 09 15:57:18 and really, you should try vnc before deciding it's not precise enough Oct 09 15:57:19 same kernel realse but different revisions Oct 09 15:57:38 2.6.21-omap1 from chinook != 2.6.21-omap1 from latest diablo Oct 09 15:57:57 sorry for oversimplifying, it won't happen again Oct 09 15:58:02 4.2008.36-5 :-D Oct 09 15:58:13 diablo :) Oct 09 15:58:25 cool Oct 09 16:18:21 stskeeps, using python for a graphical app is just painful Oct 09 16:18:45 that should get you publically flogged for even suggesting it ;) Oct 09 16:18:53 sorry :P Oct 09 16:19:35 having said that, i did v0.00000000000000000000001 of liqbase sketching in python, and when i swirled my mouse around got a really cool diamond spirograph effect Oct 09 16:20:53 Hrm, rotation for Fremantle. Oct 09 16:22:28 GeneralAntilles, shouldnt that be a core baseline feature anyway, and even if not can be done by any client app on the fly with a texture and a couple of triangles Oct 09 16:22:44 Hrm? Oct 09 16:22:58 I don't think everything will be rendering to clutter... Oct 09 16:23:03 if the real processing is done with optimised code, say C or even assembly, wouldn't python be forgiveable? Oct 09 16:23:05 well if you are rendering a 3d surface does it care whether up is up or not Oct 09 16:23:49 lcuk, that assumes that everything will be rendered in GL, right? Oct 09 16:23:59 johnx, it might not all come from clutter, but wont it be a composited desktop env - basically everything should come through 3d? Oct 09 16:24:31 lcuk, I don't think that's decided yet Oct 09 16:25:36 though doing it with compositing at the wm level would be more flexible than at the widget level in terms of including older tablets... Oct 09 16:25:47 johnx, if we are stepping between 2d and 3d wont we have a visual stutter as screenmode changes and some apps needing 3d windows will have problems etc Oct 09 16:25:51 crashanddie: On an embedded device the real problem is the 10 MB of libraries and interpreter you need to load to execute your 100 line progam. Oct 09 16:26:15 lcuk, uhm, no? Oct 09 16:26:19 derf, I never really python, I maybe typed 10 lines in in my whole life Oct 09 16:26:40 "Your" is of course figurative. Oct 09 16:26:48 Good morning. Anyone known if qt4 for maemo has an IRC channel? Oct 09 16:27:08 derf, of course, I just wanted to point I have no idea about the real performance of python, even when processing is done by a real language Oct 09 16:27:17 lcuk, GL in an X11 window doesn't require a mode change or anything like that. Oct 09 16:27:42 johnx, if my app uses just a single nice widget but the rest is just standard, its gonna be disjointed and jarring and the underlying interface ppl will have to write 2 sets of things for 2d and 3d Oct 09 16:28:05 no, but gl in a window is not the same as whats offered by qt widgets Oct 09 16:28:39 liqbase and canola are already different from the core widget set. doesn't really seem that jarring to me I guess Oct 09 16:28:55 I just have to laugh that Nokia spent all this effort to use things like busybox to save a few KB of disk space and shave a second or two off boot times, and the first thing their users do is say, "Let's put Python on it!" Oct 09 16:28:56 I'm getting the dreaded "qemu: uncaught target signal 11" when calling qmake inside of scratchbox. Oct 09 16:29:20 GeneralAntilles: mind if i send in a patch for adv-backlight for loosing libdsme dependancy? Oct 09 16:29:26 yes but if liqbase and canola want to sit pretty inside the existing frameworks then it should be completely transparent changeover Oct 09 16:29:29 Stskeeps: hrm Oct 09 16:29:31 anyway, hometime, back shortly Oct 09 16:29:43 Stskeeps: we'll look at whatever patches you send it Oct 09 16:29:46 *send in Oct 09 16:30:00 rm_you: cos the libdsme code is a wrapper over a unix socket connect and .. send(). Oct 09 16:30:03 :P Oct 09 16:30:06 as long as it doesn't break stuff, we should be ok :P Oct 09 16:30:22 brb shower Oct 09 16:30:38 rm_you: saw the deblet adv-backlight? Oct 09 16:30:54 no Oct 09 16:30:55 but brb Oct 09 16:33:17 Hi everyone, in the maemo OS exist any system call to turn on and off the bluetooth adapter ? Oct 09 16:33:52 rm_you: http://bsd.tspre.org/~stskeeps/nit-debian/hildlet6.png when you're back from shower Oct 09 16:33:57 VDVsx: Sure, dbus can do it. I can't remember the exact dbus-send command but switchonbt has it in it's scripts Oct 09 16:35:18 qwerty12, thanks, I gonna take a look in the maemo d-bus docs Oct 09 16:37:51 derf, Nokia didn't put Python on the tablets. Oct 09 16:37:56 It isn't officially supported. . . . Oct 09 16:38:27 GeneralAntilles: I never said they did. Oct 09 16:39:49 so, my poor tablet is now in evil hands of nokia support Oct 09 16:40:00 we'll see whether they can fix it. Oct 09 16:40:13 yacoob: What happened? Oct 09 16:41:06 qwerty12, it's in the backlog, two nights back. In short: it has developed some condition, that caused it to instantly power off the moment I close battery cover. Oct 09 16:41:22 Or slide/close keyboard. Or squeeze. Or close the stand. Oct 09 16:41:22 Ouch >.< Oct 09 16:41:45 generally, some physical impact -> tablet goes off Oct 09 16:42:52 qwerty12, yeah, I've been suspecting the funny latch on the battery cover, and I've tried to play with it. Some success (I was able to close the battery cover :) but didn't get to the point where it wouldn't power off after some random pokes... Oct 09 16:42:55 Ah, "their users" Oct 09 16:42:58 misread, nevermind. Oct 09 16:47:04 Where in the world did they get "As the mystery deepens, Max is forced to battle enemies beyond the natural world and face an unthinkable betrayal." from Max Payne? <_< Oct 09 16:47:33 from their butts Oct 09 16:47:36 Stskeeps: coolbeans Oct 09 16:48:11 Stskeeps: submit your patch, i'll review it, and it'll probably get pushed next minor update (when i fix the volume mute bug) Oct 09 16:48:18 johnx, apparently. Oct 09 16:48:49 rm_you, no, push the volume bug update, then push the Deblet patch AFTER. :P Oct 09 16:48:56 roflcaekz Oct 09 16:49:01 Stats whoring, stats whoring, stats whoring. Oct 09 16:49:02 GeneralAntilles: you have a point :P Oct 09 16:49:17 i'll make sure to wait a couple weeks inbetween as well :P Oct 09 16:49:30 Stskeeps: k, submit your patch, i'll build and release like, tonight :P Oct 09 16:49:58 But make sure you introduce some minor cosmetic bug Oct 09 16:50:09 lol Oct 09 16:50:31 I try not to INTRODUCE bugs, even for stats whoring :P Oct 09 16:54:01 rm_you: http://bsd.tspre.org/~stskeeps/advback-dsmeless.patch , but i haven't had a chance to test it (my tablet is reinstalling deblet..), and please note the comment in the _init since you probably test in scratchbox, but i tested it dpkg-buildpackage's Oct 09 16:58:51 juergbi: it makes no sense to me to have a garage project which'd just be build scripts or patches - or, at worst case - a fork. mud's gotta be better for maintaining the build scripts. Oct 09 17:00:16 Jaffa: ok, good :) i should be following the online howtos to see how to keep the packages uptodate, right? Oct 09 17:00:16 rm_you: and that isn't a deblet patch, it's just getting away from having to hax libdsme :P Oct 09 17:00:31 rm_you: but it certainly helps me, i really don't want to add libdsme of all things to deblet Oct 09 17:04:02 yeah Oct 09 17:04:04 that's fine Oct 09 17:04:13 just... could you actually test it first? :P Oct 09 17:04:26 sure, when i'm done debootstrapping Oct 09 17:04:26 :P Oct 09 17:04:37 :) Oct 09 17:05:09 juergbi: yeah - basically you can point a mud XML file at subversion or a release tarball, add a patch to debian/... to pull in the .vapi files and it's good to go. There're ones already there (sub-optimal) as a starting point. Feel free to ask on the mud-builder-users@garage.maemo.org list for help Oct 09 17:05:23 k i have class and work now, but i'll check it out tonight Oct 09 17:05:31 post it via garage? Oct 09 17:05:34 after testing Oct 09 17:05:44 Jaffa: ok, thx, will do this asap Oct 09 17:06:27 juergbi: cool Oct 09 17:20:47 [6~/who Oct 09 17:21:04 neat smiley Oct 09 17:21:05 :P Oct 09 17:21:11 jaffa, sneezing fit or cat on pooter? Oct 09 17:21:20 Eager to get home :) Oct 09 17:21:25 heh Oct 09 17:21:56 Jaffa: If you have a few minutes ;) Oct 09 17:22:01 johnx: nit-env-lxde is 410 without recommends Oct 09 17:22:03 (mb) Oct 09 17:22:19 how much with recommends? Oct 09 17:22:30 * johnx has been playing with a pure matchbox-session Oct 09 17:23:09 * Stskeeps wonders Oct 09 17:23:10 sec Oct 09 17:25:38 johnx: http://rafb.net/p/wg42cr88.html Oct 09 17:26:17 some of those need to be suggests Oct 09 17:26:46 yeah Oct 09 17:29:00 rm_you: patch works fine Oct 09 17:29:07 I can't install pluthon with eclipse ganymede. is there a known problem? Oct 09 17:30:17 any linux/os x users want to test my video streaming app? Oct 09 17:31:48 rm_you: added to garage Oct 09 17:32:51 kk will look tonight if i have time Oct 09 17:40:05 remoo :) Oct 09 17:40:25 evening pupnik810 Oct 09 17:40:44 how goes it Oct 09 17:40:48 solmumaha, Oct 09 17:41:01 fine, looking for testers for knots Oct 09 17:41:20 still way impressed about the latest speedup in vgba Oct 09 17:41:54 i will be back and can test next thurs-fri Oct 09 17:42:11 is debian sid vlc ok now? Oct 09 17:42:14 we want more pupnik. :P Oct 09 17:42:27 nice, i may have german translation by then Oct 09 17:42:32 yeah dosbox neeeds update Oct 09 17:42:47 if you can find 0.9.3, it should do fine Oct 09 17:43:26 oh nand somebody wrote me to ask for duke3d sources.. if you can tar them by next nweek that would be good Oct 09 17:43:33 ok Oct 09 17:43:39 sure Oct 09 17:43:41 hi GAN800 Oct 09 17:43:57 would be nice if someone could debianize them and upload to extras Oct 09 17:44:29 yes extras is where i want to go now Oct 09 17:45:17 I should poke some people about the community packaging team. Oct 09 17:45:39 GAN800: please do, it should be good enough for extras Oct 09 17:46:30 thankless work Oct 09 17:47:03 Karma points Oct 09 17:47:15 nice Oct 09 17:47:30 i'd gladly put rubybox to extras too if someone could convince alterego to put ruby into extras Oct 09 17:47:47 heh Oct 09 17:48:24 Haven't seen him in months. :( Oct 09 17:48:41 he's here at freenode Oct 09 17:48:52 and still has the sources Oct 09 17:48:53 Is he now? Oct 09 17:49:04 ah, not atm Oct 09 17:49:14 Wonder why he stopped coming here Oct 09 17:49:21 school Oct 09 17:49:23 work he said Oct 09 17:49:25 ? Oct 09 17:49:27 oh Oct 09 17:49:43 i talked to him and he wasn't too negative about it Oct 09 17:49:50 * pupnik810 has lots to do :) ttyl1a Oct 09 17:49:52 ! Oct 09 17:49:55 but then started ignoring me :) Oct 09 17:49:59 Hehe Oct 09 17:50:02 cu Oct 09 17:50:21 GAN800: you are an os x user? Oct 09 17:50:28 Yeah Oct 09 17:50:33 tiger? Oct 09 17:50:39 Leopard Oct 09 17:50:46 ppc? Oct 09 17:50:50 G5 Oct 09 17:51:03 wanna test my video streaming app? :) Oct 09 17:51:08 Sure Oct 09 17:51:12 it's pretty easy to setup in os x Oct 09 17:51:32 just download VLC 0.9.3 and install it Applications Oct 09 17:51:38 Done. ;) Oct 09 17:51:48 then the worst part :( Oct 09 17:51:59 http://pupnik.de/ruby.html Oct 09 17:52:25 download the 3 debs for chinook Oct 09 17:52:51 can't remember the order, but i guess libruby was first Oct 09 17:53:09 download to same dir, dpkg -i *deb :) Oct 09 17:53:20 I always let dpkg sort 'em out Oct 09 17:53:29 k, that works then, thanks :) Oct 09 17:53:52 I don't know where Google gets the numbers for GrandCentral Oct 09 17:53:58 I get the weirdest calls on that line. Oct 09 17:57:33 solmumaha, then? Oct 09 17:59:54 pm Oct 09 18:00:16 unless someone else wants to try it too Oct 09 18:13:07 hey dudes Oct 09 18:13:40 yo Oct 09 18:14:06 is there a way to set the time of the backlight to 60minutes bye xterm Oct 09 18:14:34 sure, there's a trick with gconf to add more times to the GUI Oct 09 18:16:50 can you show me maybe?:) Oct 09 18:17:01 trying to dig it up, hang on a sec :) Oct 09 18:17:13 it suckt when i am watch a movie and every few seconds the light turns off Oct 09 18:17:24 thx:) Oct 09 18:17:53 ~moredimmingoptions Oct 09 18:18:22 Barnabas, http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1147 Oct 09 18:18:26 shouldnt the backlight remain on when playing movies tohugh Oct 09 18:18:30 i was sure it did Oct 09 18:18:39 it should and it usually does, except when it doesn't Oct 09 18:19:03 heh Oct 09 18:19:21 i use mplayer....and it doesnt:) or is there a funktion in the app Oct 09 18:21:04 i think theres a difference or bug wiht dim vs off Oct 09 18:21:13 if the 2 values are set to the same i believe it remains lit Oct 09 18:21:24 Barnabas: what kind of device and OS do you have? Oct 09 18:21:38 n770 with HE2007 Oct 09 18:21:48 Anybody know how to fix a blank Application menu? Oct 09 18:22:08 GeneralAntilles, happening to you or someone else? Oct 09 18:22:14 Me Oct 09 18:22:19 For the second time in two months Oct 09 18:22:25 ls /usr/share/applications/hildon/ Oct 09 18:22:36 After installing a package on an almost full disk Oct 09 18:22:48 johnx, everything you'd expect Oct 09 18:22:54 update-desktop-database does nothing Oct 09 18:23:08 wonder what files it opens Oct 09 18:23:17 look in ~/ for cache files? Oct 09 18:23:28 actually, does update-desktop-database run as user or root? Oct 09 18:24:40 Hrm Oct 09 18:24:42 Trying to update database for directory '/usr/local/share/applications' Oct 09 18:24:42 Could not create cache file in directory '/usr/local/share/applications': Oct 09 18:24:42 Error opening directory '/usr/local/share/applications': No such file or directory Oct 09 18:24:53 huh Oct 09 18:24:57 pointed to the wrong place Oct 09 18:25:01 I wonder what freaked it out Oct 09 18:25:17 Could not create cache file in directory '/usr/share/applications': Permission denied Oct 09 18:25:18 No directories in update-desktop-database search path could be processed and updated. Oct 09 18:25:19 As user Oct 09 18:27:05 Barnabas: that's unsupported version of OS unfortunately Oct 09 18:27:07 Hrm, permission denied on /usr/share/applications too. Oct 09 18:27:24 GeneralAntilles, yeah, well being root would help of course :P Oct 09 18:27:38 ssvb:..what does that mean for me? Oct 09 18:27:44 johnx, that was as root. Oct 09 18:27:45 drwxr-xr-x 7 1000 1000 1024 Oct 10 14:22 applications Oct 09 18:28:32 Or maybe not. Oct 09 18:28:34 GeneralAntilles, how the heck did that happen Oct 09 18:29:14 ssvb:..what does that mean for me? Oct 09 18:29:16 Barnabas: I heared that downgrading mplayer to version mplayer_1.0rc1-maemo.24.n770_armel.deb may help Oct 09 18:30:16 anyways, now it's really time for me to sleep Oct 09 18:30:20 good luck GeneralAntilles Oct 09 18:30:30 mhh is this still worked fine with canola youtube plugin? Oct 09 18:30:45 johnx, damn you! :P Oct 09 18:31:05 GeneralAntilles, fix the permissions on applications/ Oct 09 18:31:08 should be root:root Oct 09 18:35:35 * GeneralAntilles sighs. Oct 09 18:35:36 No luck Oct 09 18:35:42 Barnabas: don't know, it is up to you to try Oct 09 18:36:23 evening all Oct 09 18:38:02 * GeneralAntilles really doesn't want to have to reclone. . . . Oct 09 18:38:49 GeneralAntilles, ok, fixed permissions, reran that update as root? right? no luck still? Oct 09 18:39:03 Still no luck Oct 09 18:39:50 and the update works ok now that you're root? Oct 09 18:40:00 Yeah, no evidence of failure. Oct 09 18:40:46 hmm, look at the permissions for things under applications/ Oct 09 18:40:51 do they look sane? Oct 09 18:41:55 -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 2355 Oct 10 01:58 defaults.list Oct 09 18:42:21 s/?/to you?/ Oct 09 18:42:21 johnx meant: do they look saneto you? Oct 09 18:42:40 Should .desktops have +x? Oct 09 18:42:48 nah Oct 09 18:43:15 rw-r-r for .desktops Oct 09 18:43:19 Then yes Oct 09 18:43:30 nothing else owned by random users? Oct 09 18:44:02 Nope Oct 09 18:44:28 GeneralAntilles, /home/user/.osso/menus/applications.menu is blank? Oct 09 18:45:00 Yes Oct 09 18:45:26 try removing it (backup to somewhere), and running update-desktop-database Oct 09 18:46:28 It doesn't recreate it. Oct 09 18:46:49 ok Oct 09 18:47:00 I failed ;) Oct 09 18:49:05 No component for the application menu? Oct 09 18:49:46 btw a little notice....the upgrade fix the problem with the backlight;) thx guys Oct 09 18:50:16 General: No Oct 09 18:52:26 General: Still here? Oct 09 18:53:08 Yeah Oct 09 18:53:32 cat /usr/share/applications/hildon-navigator/applications-menu.desktop Oct 09 18:53:38 please Oct 09 18:54:16 http://slexy.org/view/s2ek6z7QYQ Oct 09 18:55:20 ls -l /usr/lib/hildon-desktop/libhd-applications-menu-settings.so please Oct 09 18:57:14 -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 20908 Aug 11 04:04 libhd-applications-menu-settings.so Oct 09 18:57:24 all righty... Oct 09 18:58:52 ls -l /usr/share/menu Oct 09 18:59:26 http://slexy.org/view/s20C58w0nd Oct 09 19:00:03 GeneralAntilles, cp /etc/xdg/menus/applications.menu /home/user/.osso/menus/ ? Oct 09 19:00:43 yerga, that did it. Oct 09 19:00:58 Heh Oct 09 19:00:59 Now, what's going to happen the next time it's updated? Oct 09 19:01:00 slightly, ot how can I tell the size of a vorbis file's comments? Oct 09 19:01:02 ok, with the extras applications too? Oct 09 19:01:21 GeneralAntilles, test it installing something Oct 09 19:01:28 yerga, all 3rd-party applications are now in Extras. Oct 09 19:01:47 * Stskeeps notes to himself -not- to touch the xscreenserver lock button.. Oct 09 19:01:52 it's better than nothing ;) Oct 09 19:02:27 GeneralAntilles, some reason why it got corrupted? Oct 09 19:02:42 Moving stuff around in Panels works fine. Oct 09 19:02:52 yerga, package install on a very full fs. Oct 09 19:03:29 Anybody willing to bet on DOW hitting 8999 today? =) Oct 09 19:04:59 anyone tested new maemo mapper? Oct 09 19:05:06 yep. works. Oct 09 19:05:28 what's new there? can't test for myself at the moment. Oct 09 19:05:45 hi again lardman: i tried your sharedmem program, if i specify the location of the mmapped buffer with PRAGMA it doesn't load it to the dsp Oct 09 19:07:21 I did not notice anything specific Oct 09 19:07:42 didnt i read something about maemo mapper losing its icon Oct 09 19:07:52 still there for me Oct 09 19:08:01 baddu: do you have some code I could look at? Oct 09 19:08:24 lardman: it was your sharedmem test http://people.bath.ac.uk/enpsgp/nokia770/dsp/shared_memory_test/ Oct 09 19:08:26 maemo.org has completely died, it seems... Oct 09 19:08:30 now that you say, I installed the maemo-mapper update and now it's not in my menu anymore Oct 09 19:08:42 johnx: scaringily, the no-recommends broke nm-applet O_o Oct 09 19:08:59 two people reported that happening on n810.pl too (maemo) Oct 09 19:09:04 (maemo mapper, that is :) Oct 09 19:09:12 gregor: maybe it does not update caches? Oct 09 19:09:15 gregorovius, http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?p=232180 others are having similar Oct 09 19:09:21 then a reboot may fix it Oct 09 19:09:26 its something to do with failing postinst Oct 09 19:09:30 but i don't know how our environment differs. the problem seems to be that if i use own lcf-file it seems to ignore that and claims that it tries to put the stuff to DARAM (and no space left) Oct 09 19:09:32 apparantly Oct 09 19:09:55 RST38h, bugzilla's working fine. :P Oct 09 19:10:08 As is the wiki Oct 09 19:10:09 baddu: do you use the .cmd file? Oct 09 19:10:09 but not the downloads/ Oct 09 19:10:13 thanks lcuk, I'll just wait for it to get figured out Oct 09 19:10:23 sensible Oct 09 19:10:37 and I am not gonna file ANOTHER bug on non-working maemo.org Oct 09 19:10:41 baddu: if dsp_dld doesn't know the memory region it tries to place it in DARAM, then SARAM Oct 09 19:11:00 RST38h, we're in a server transition period, so there's no point. Oct 09 19:11:04 gregorovius, though im sure theres some 400 line incantation you could try manually with the OSK ;) Oct 09 19:11:22 judging from the changelog, it's only bugfixes Oct 09 19:11:28 lardman: yes, as linker parameter. but the loader seems to ignore that. so the information should be in that module.o file, am i right? Oct 09 19:11:56 no, dsp_dld also looks for a linker command file with the same name as the module + a .cmd extension Oct 09 19:12:10 e.g. shared_mem.o + shared_mem.cmd Oct 09 19:12:32 thats very valuable information :) Oct 09 19:13:01 thanks, i thought that i used that already with no help but i must be wrong Oct 09 19:13:39 make sure you give the cmd file name in the avs_kernel.conf file (something like that!) Oct 09 19:14:21 /lib/dsp/dsp_dld_avs.conf Oct 09 19:14:26 close ;) Oct 09 19:15:59 Somebody needs to beat up the Nokia folks still using 'maemo'. Oct 09 19:16:41 ok, in the dsp_dld_avs.conf there is no mention about other module's cmd files? Oct 09 19:17:15 GeneralAntilles, ? i thought nokia still owned maemo, we just had maemo.org (its like a bad divorce) Oct 09 19:17:59 lcuk. . . . Oct 09 19:18:01 baddu: are you using a standard Maemo installation? Oct 09 19:18:04 It's "Maemo" Oct 09 19:18:12 lardman: yep Oct 09 19:18:25 baddu: the last column should be full of paths to .cmd files Oct 09 19:19:03 not according to the "about product" screen on my N810 its not Oct 09 19:19:18 "Internet Tablet OS: maemo Linux based OS2008" Oct 09 19:19:28 lardman: you're right, once again :) it's because of this vi and xterm (or the user of them) Oct 09 19:19:29 It's deprecated and incorrect Oct 09 19:19:43 I filed a bug about it Oct 09 19:19:44 baddu: no worries, been there done that, cursed alot ;) Oct 09 19:19:47 It'll be fixed soon enough. Oct 09 19:19:50 * lcuk wonders why peoplecare about case sensitivity Oct 09 19:19:55 ~brand Oct 09 19:20:11 It's a grammar thing Oct 09 19:20:14 It's a proper noune Oct 09 19:20:14 https://wiki.maemo.org/Task:Maemo_brand Oct 09 19:20:26 lcuk: perhapsitsalsobecauseifyoustartlosingcasesensitivityitsonlyashortsteptoothergrammaticalissues? Oct 09 19:20:56 wow that was hard to type without using space :) Oct 09 19:20:58 soundsreasonablelardman^wasjustwonderingwhypeoplecaredsomuch Oct 09 19:21:13 :) Oct 09 19:23:33 GeneralAntilles was compiled with -pendatic. It's why he has the job he has. Oct 09 19:24:18 -asshole, too! Oct 09 19:24:51 That's a feature. Girls like assholes. Oct 09 19:26:04 http://ircquotes.org/viewQuote/50 Oct 09 19:27:35 Hehe Oct 09 19:40:57 * lcuk kicks itt forum software. on the front page if it says someone posted can i make it always go to the latest one instead of taking me to the point where i last read Oct 09 19:42:45 http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/search.php?do=getnew Oct 09 19:44:50 not quite gen, ive still got to click on the specific page i want, the front thing which just says "active forum topics" which doesnt have real details is ideal, but i want it to always go to last post in the thread Oct 09 19:45:00 thanks though :) Oct 09 19:46:19 Then click the last page and hit end Oct 09 19:51:03 any other adventureous willing to try my video streaming app? Oct 09 19:55:02 wheres the hash key on an apple keyboard, bloody hate macs! Oct 09 19:57:45 Mac users do not need the hash key Oct 09 19:58:01 :) Oct 09 19:58:09 and 3 apparently Oct 09 19:58:10 i do Oct 09 19:58:20 (on a UK keyboard) Oct 09 19:58:39 ircle sucks Oct 09 19:58:52 alt/opt Oct 09 19:59:20 Anybody ever worked with Freescale ARM11 boards? Oct 09 19:59:39 JamieBennett, read: you hate things you don't understand? Oct 09 20:01:13 pressed too many f keys ;) Oct 09 20:01:35 Maybe he missed and hit cmd Oct 09 20:01:44 who doesn't? Oct 09 20:01:52 There's no alt-f4 on Mac Oct 09 20:04:09 * RST38h quietly salivates over Freescale's 90nm ARM SoC datasheet Oct 09 20:04:31 ARM11 is the past Oct 09 20:04:42 "And all I got was that 300MHz MIPS" Oct 09 20:05:14 GAN: Who cares about fashion? It runs at 500+MHz, has separate 16k+16k 1st level caches and a 128k 2nd level cache Oct 09 20:05:59 It is more than sufficient to do the job, past or not Oct 09 20:06:42 I want that OMAP4 with lowpower DDR2 Oct 09 20:06:52 Anybody got a time machine? Oct 09 20:07:10 RST38h: i.mx31/37 ones? Oct 09 20:07:14 i cant wait for the omap5 with neural interfacing Oct 09 20:07:58 liqmind, sketching, moving the cursor just by thoughts Oct 09 20:08:05 nokia n96 phone is ST Nomadik not omap so who knows.. maybe nokia changes provider of cpus? Oct 09 20:08:08 think of an image, send it to your mate Oct 09 20:08:21 hrw: yep Oct 09 20:08:36 GAN: OMAP4 sounds sane but forget about ddr2 Oct 09 20:09:22 http://embeddedblog.blogspot.com/2007/02/3gsm-ti-looks-at-low-power-ddr2-for.html Oct 09 20:09:29 omap4 will use ddr7 Oct 09 20:10:06 crashanddie, why are all your pictures blocked by google safe search Oct 09 20:10:08 How do MCIMX31 and MCIMX31L compare speed-wise with OMAP2 in N8x0? Oct 09 20:10:16 my eyes, the goggles, they do nothing Oct 09 20:10:31 RST38h: no idea Oct 09 20:10:33 oh shit, wrong nickname Oct 09 20:10:44 RST38h: but atleast for imx you get opengl es officially Oct 09 20:10:59 lcuk: He is probably nude there, on top of black velvet to make it easier for google's automatic filters Oct 09 20:12:16 hrw: The part I am looking at does not seem to have 3D hw. It has only got VFP11 Oct 09 20:12:57 And some Image Processing Unit with blending, inversion, and rotation features Oct 09 20:13:30 RST38h: I hope to have imx31 hardware at home in 1-2 months Oct 09 20:13:32 N96 is an ARM9? :\ Oct 09 20:13:36 and then I will be able to test Oct 09 20:13:41 GeneralAntilles: arm926 core Oct 09 20:13:46 Weird Oct 09 20:14:24 GeneralAntilles: with HW h.264 decoder Oct 09 20:14:28 and few other formats Oct 09 20:14:37 * GeneralAntilles wishes we could use ours. Oct 09 20:14:37 Ah, the 31L part has no GPU but 31 apparently does Oct 09 20:15:08 So N96 is more of a step back? Oct 09 20:15:32 hrw: Depending on how things go, I may be able to test it for you before that :) Oct 09 20:16:34 I would not thing that n96 is step back Oct 09 20:17:13 its Nseries so multimedia oriented. and st nomadik should give nice power for decoding Oct 09 20:18:47 * RST38h reads up on Nomadik Oct 09 20:21:49 STM has got ARM11-based Nomadik parts right now Oct 09 20:21:56 Why did Nokia use ARM9? Oct 09 20:27:12 GeneralAntilles, how can you call the hard work i've put in "cheating" ? its lateral thinking Oct 09 20:28:24 What I mean to say is that it's not generally applicable. Oct 09 20:28:43 You seemed to be suggesting that there was no issue with the controller Oct 09 20:28:51 but there clearly is Oct 09 20:31:54 agreed in principle, but in the face of the alternative (lowering resolution and using onboard framebuffer) was probably a worse solution Oct 09 20:32:24 it works as it stands now, its allowed every single one of us to do lots of cool interesting stuff Oct 09 20:33:17 so its not a failure as such, it just doesnt perform under normal load as expected - like a ferrari with a ford engine Oct 09 20:33:21 Point being, whatever you've managed to achieve, the controller is a big problem causer for video playback and x Oct 09 20:33:52 bye Oct 09 20:33:53 OMAP3 solves the controller issue for everybody. Oct 09 20:33:56 no, video playback is fine isnt it? that uses the same "cheat" i do - X11 native mode granted Oct 09 20:34:03 cya hrw Oct 09 20:34:07 bye Oct 09 20:34:13 GAN800: if will be used properly Oct 09 20:34:16 omap3 solves it better if the IVA is available Oct 09 20:34:19 It's limited in the amount of data you can push. Oct 09 20:34:20 leaving the cpu to do much more Oct 09 20:34:27 IVA has no direct effect on this Oct 09 20:34:31 hrw, how do you mean? Oct 09 20:34:48 IVA can decode video leaving cpu to do other things Oct 09 20:34:56 lcuk, IVA is an ARM7 Oct 09 20:35:01 or ARM9 in OMAP3 Oct 09 20:35:06 and, its specialised for decoding Oct 09 20:35:32 its a custom chip that i would rather was in use than sat idle Oct 09 20:35:40 It can't really decode video very fast. I know, I tried. So it most likely feeds DSP with data, doing MPEG stream parsing Oct 09 20:35:41 Whatever the decoder, you wont have the horrifying tearing issues with OMAP3. Oct 09 20:36:13 The Cortex will likely do a lot better with NEON optimizations. Oct 09 20:36:26 GAN: Oh, we will. It is very easy to create a horrifying tearing issue! =) Oct 09 20:37:14 RST38h, look at the current device, the cpu runs fullout trying to do everything itself whilst at least 2 ARM cores sit completely 100% idle, i really dont want a repeat Oct 09 20:37:40 we have been told one of those idle cores will be used, its a perfectly valid question to ask if the other one will be as well Oct 09 20:37:46 lcuk, that's fine, but irrelevant to the controller discussion. Oct 09 20:38:01 Two, actually Oct 09 20:38:20 The ISP will be used for the camera, I'm sure. Oct 09 20:38:48 then we will get an answer in the affirmative and ill jump for joy :D Oct 09 20:39:06 * lcuk just wants to use all the available features :) Oct 09 20:39:28 I don't think the IVA will really offer much Oct 09 20:39:43 realtime movie encoding and decode Oct 09 20:39:49 You're likely better off using the DSP or SIMD. Oct 09 20:40:11 The Cortex is a more capable decodee. Oct 09 20:40:18 r Oct 09 20:40:39 lcuk: What 2 ARM cores? Oct 09 20:40:57 lcuk: One is the main CPU and it is busy. The only idle one is the IVA Oct 09 20:41:19 PowerVR Oct 09 20:41:27 pressumably Oct 09 20:41:28 PowerVR is no ARM core Oct 09 20:41:32 RST38h, there are currently 4 complete arm cores inside our 2420 Oct 09 20:41:43 lcuk: Which ones? Oct 09 20:41:45 its a customized convoluted core, but yes it is one Oct 09 20:41:51 cpu, pvr, dsp, iva Oct 09 20:42:01 AFAIK, PowerVR has nothing to do with ARM Oct 09 20:42:09 have a look closer :) Oct 09 20:42:09 DSP has nothing to do with ARM either Oct 09 20:42:23 lcuk: Wel those bastards do not let me Oct 09 20:45:55 DOW 8579! Oh shit. Oct 09 20:46:27 damn lower than you suggested earlier Oct 09 20:47:27 it's crazy Oct 09 20:47:35 It's awesome is what it is. Oct 09 20:48:02 I can predict stuff but can't predict crazy shit Oct 09 20:48:33 Do I get to fight the zombies yet? Oct 09 20:48:49 GAN: The first wave is homeless stock brokers Oct 09 20:49:20 Whatever score you make there, becomes the second wave after it rots a bit Oct 09 20:52:01 IVA is an ARM9 on omap2 and is the DSP on omap3 Oct 09 20:52:08 just fyi Oct 09 20:52:54 lardman: you mean, omap2 has ARM9+DSP and OMAP3 has just the DSP? Oct 09 20:53:08 yes Oct 09 20:53:18 omap2 has arm11 main core, + arm9 iva + dsp Oct 09 20:53:47 omap2 has cortex main core + dsp (which they call the iva) Oct 09 20:53:58 interesting...so they basically got rid of the iva Oct 09 20:54:23 yes, and moved its functionality (presumably) inside the DSP Oct 09 20:58:01 and the DSPs are cardinally different Oct 09 20:58:02 lardman, looking at the block diagrams its not gone Oct 09 20:58:17 depends Oct 09 20:58:41 lcuk: do you have an url? Oct 09 20:59:04 omap 2xxx uses TI54xx DSP, and 3xxx uses TI6xxx; it's like comparing x86_64 to a z80 Oct 09 20:59:09 zap: yes, c55x vs c64x Oct 09 20:59:32 x86 i pretty similar to z80 =) Oct 09 20:59:38 yep Oct 09 20:59:42 hmm, not that large a difference (from what I've read), but certainly significant Oct 09 20:59:53 sorry lardman, yes a distinct dsp as currently known isnt there, but the cores still have to be seperate Oct 09 20:59:53 http://focus.ti.com/general/docs/wtbu/wtbuproductcontent.tsp?templateId=6123&navigationId=12643&contentId=14649 Oct 09 20:59:53 instruction set wise, it is almost a superset, I would say :) Oct 09 21:00:00 Great, Atom-guy is back on itT. Oct 09 21:00:08 ti64xx executes 8 instructions every clock Oct 09 21:00:09 This is after the 2nd time he said he'd never come back. Oct 09 21:00:15 ie powervr must operate without messing with cpu, and iva must operate without effecting the other stuff Oct 09 21:00:16 it's VLIW Oct 09 21:00:27 Buy him an ASUS already! Oct 09 21:00:38 lcuk: yes, but that's as it is on the omap2 as well Oct 09 21:01:13 lcuk, are you seriously arguing with DSP-man about the DSP? :P Oct 09 21:01:14 zap: is it pipelined or just has 8 ALUs in parallel? Oct 09 21:01:22 yes, but on omap2, its a distinctly named and in function dsp Oct 09 21:01:23 http://focus.ti.com/general/docs/wtbu/wtbuproductcontent.tsp?contentId=4671&navigationId=11990&templateId=6123 Oct 09 21:01:23 8 ALUs Oct 09 21:01:39 every command is 256 bits - 8 commands by 32 bits Oct 09 21:01:40 should make a nice mpeg decoder =) Oct 09 21:02:09 like always, DSPs are hard to program Oct 09 21:02:17 lcuk: yep that's the omap2420, on the omap3 the iva is the dsp Oct 09 21:02:38 TI has a optimizing C compiler though that parallelise computations; I'm not sure though if it's free Oct 09 21:02:52 yes lardman, but we have the ISP as well now Oct 09 21:03:00 lcuk: though I see what you say about a separate ISP + IVA/DSP Oct 09 21:03:06 lardman: what about the second DSP box at that diaram? Oct 09 21:03:07 i think they realised no1 was using the IVA on the omap2 ;) Oct 09 21:03:12 diagram Oct 09 21:03:14 the problem with IVA is that it's absolutely undocumented Oct 09 21:03:19 and TI64xx seems well documented Oct 09 21:03:26 lcuk: I'm sure we would have tried if they'd given us a clue hey? :) Oct 09 21:03:35 yes zap, theres nothing about it, and it had lots of promise Oct 09 21:03:39 in fact, TI has opened a lot of info on OMAP35xx Oct 09 21:03:40 zap: it is ARM7. What is there to document other than how to restart it and share data with it? Oct 09 21:03:47 especially with the graphical problems we have on 8x0 Oct 09 21:03:52 RST38h: you said it Oct 09 21:04:09 RST38h: you don't even know how to execute a NOP on it Oct 09 21:04:20 RST38h: I thought it was ARM9...? Oct 09 21:04:28 its arm0 :( Oct 09 21:04:34 :) Oct 09 21:04:36 lardman: I heard different opinions on the subject =) Oct 09 21:04:41 or simply 'armless :D Oct 09 21:04:42 whatever is it, it's useless undocumented :) Oct 09 21:04:43 yeah, me too Oct 09 21:06:10 guess you guys can look at the openpandora to get omap3 info Oct 09 21:06:48 BULLE_, why in the world would you look at the Pandora? Oct 09 21:06:53 Just go straight to the source. . . . Oct 09 21:07:31 or rather the binary blob ;) Oct 09 21:07:37 hmm, interesting, bit.c in libmad defines CHAR_BIT, that might be good Oct 09 21:07:38 http://focus.ti.com/dsp/docs/dspsupporttechdocs.tsp?sectionId=3&tabId=409&techDoc=6&documentCategoryId=6&familyId=1526 Oct 09 21:07:51 has anyone gotten Genesis Sync for SyncEvolution installed and working? Oct 09 21:07:59 "Open"Pandora Oct 09 21:08:31 thanks GeneralAntilles :) Oct 09 21:08:34 lcuk, the PowerVR driver isn't publicly available yet. ;) Oct 09 21:09:40 you have to wonder: as a chip designer how much you would change between one revision and the next. Oct 09 21:09:50 What revision? Oct 09 21:10:32 any, think of most of your normal code, you dont just rewrite the whole thing from scratch. i wonder how much hacking it would take to try to fire up the pvr using the newer driver when it comes out Oct 09 21:11:09 Um Oct 09 21:11:17 I've answered that question before Oct 09 21:11:28 They're not remotely similar Oct 09 21:11:45 SXG vs MBX Oct 09 21:12:01 We can even use the OMAP2430 driver to get the OMAP2420's PowerVR going. Oct 09 21:12:05 s/can/can't/ Oct 09 21:12:05 GeneralAntilles meant: We can't even use the OMAP2430 driver to get the OMAP2420's PowerVR going. Oct 09 21:12:15 lcuk: you are making a little mistake ;) Oct 09 21:12:38 * lcuk doesnt mind making mistakes :) Oct 09 21:12:41 lcuk: Most ARM-based SoC designs are not really designed in one place. Instead, they are combined from multiple IP blocks Oct 09 21:13:18 lcuk: So, these guys do not have to continue with OAP2 design. They can just take a different set of blocks, glu them together, and this will be OMAP3 Oct 09 21:13:50 yes, but you don't just throw away all the code or layout or interface designs just because its new. GeneralAntilles has already given biggest reason this would fail so its ok, but was just a ponderment Oct 09 21:13:53 Some things do stay the same though, mainly because there are formal and informal standards in ARM-based design Oct 09 21:22:17 ~curse sb2 Oct 09 21:22:18 May you be reincarnated as a Windows XP administrator, sb2 ! Oct 09 21:22:19 lcuk: there's actually some source floating about for the SGX so I see on the pandora.org forum Oct 09 21:22:39 s/pandora/openpandora Oct 09 21:23:47 lardman, you see Quim's thread on -developers? Oct 09 21:24:08 Need to get Nokia to throw some manpower behind the barcode reader. Oct 09 21:24:41 lcuk: isp looks like it's just a camera interface Oct 09 21:24:58 ^ Oct 09 21:25:02 which can do things like jpeg compression Oct 09 21:25:25 GAN800: not sure, will check now Oct 09 21:25:46 software prime time? Oct 09 21:26:07 Yeah Oct 09 21:26:09 Resizer is a HW block in Camera ISP which is responsible for image downscaling and upscaling Oct 09 21:26:15 Preview is a HW block in Camera ISP which is responsible for image processing and color conversion. Oct 09 21:26:33 3A is a HW block in Camera ISP which is responsible for collecting image statistics that can be used by other algorithms Oct 09 21:26:46 all useful things :) Oct 09 21:26:50 sleep. Oct 09 21:27:00 and that as well lardman Oct 09 21:27:10 GeneralAntilles: have time to test my fix? Oct 09 21:27:13 yeah, depends whether it's hooked directly to the camera input though Oct 09 21:27:23 solmuhaha Oct 09 21:27:29 it appears to be feedable from multiple sources Oct 09 21:27:37 Not at the moment. Oct 09 21:27:49 s/gibberish/tab-completion/ Oct 09 21:27:52 either way, as with anything else :) i just want it working, and looking at the notes drivers will be available for it Oct 09 21:27:52 k Oct 09 21:28:10 maybe i should ask help from itt :s Oct 09 21:29:50 i just had the worst task a man can imagine Oct 09 21:30:09 solmumaha, whats the problem? Oct 09 21:30:36 i'd like people to test my app a bit before releasing it Oct 09 21:30:46 on the device? Oct 09 21:30:50 and what does it do Oct 09 21:31:05 it's a server/client based video streaming app Oct 09 21:31:29 cool, gimme a mo and count me in Oct 09 21:31:39 i was gonna look at playing with something like this Oct 09 21:31:57 it's not pretty but should somewhat work Oct 09 21:32:21 heh :) proof of concept is better than nothing Oct 09 21:32:28 but it's not for windows Oct 09 21:32:31 liqbase is entirely poc Oct 09 21:32:36 for maemo i hope Oct 09 21:32:51 yes, but server only works on linux/bsd/os x Oct 09 21:32:58 ive got 2 n810s Oct 09 21:33:04 that should work? Oct 09 21:33:16 what os you have on desktop? Oct 09 21:33:29 windows Oct 09 21:33:35 :( Oct 09 21:33:42 fail! Oct 09 21:33:43 cant one of my 810s be server? Oct 09 21:33:55 no, sorry Oct 09 21:33:58 * lcuk does everything else on his 8109 Oct 09 21:34:04 whats missing from it? Oct 09 21:34:28 vlc 0.9 and juice to transcode video :) Oct 09 21:34:28 lcuk: it's a sign, install Linux! ;) Oct 09 21:34:34 hahahahah Oct 09 21:34:44 transcoding? Oct 09 21:34:48 oooer missus Oct 09 21:35:05 lardman, but but but but but i dont wanna Oct 09 21:35:08 * lcuk huggles xp Oct 09 21:35:21 yes, it allows you to play videos from your desktop machine like they are local Oct 09 21:35:23 hey, hang on ill fire up the laptop Oct 09 21:35:27 thats got ubuntu on it Oct 09 21:35:36 i hate that laptop now Oct 09 21:35:36 supports seeking and all Oct 09 21:35:58 ahhh i thought it would stream video from camera Oct 09 21:36:09 * lcuk has a plan for doing just that Oct 09 21:36:43 so solmumaha could i run your server within vmware if its so configured Oct 09 21:36:55 sure Oct 09 21:37:02 ok, thats easy Oct 09 21:37:12 if your tablet can connect to it Oct 09 21:37:28 yes, i send my source to it to get it to build packages for me Oct 09 21:37:38 hardy? Oct 09 21:37:52 yer, but i prefer to wear a jacket Oct 09 21:38:46 k, add deb http://ppa.launchpad.net/c-korn/ubuntu hardy main to apt Oct 09 21:38:54 and apt-get install ruby vlc Oct 09 21:39:11 after apt-get update of course :) Oct 09 21:39:20 GAN800: What -developers thread? Oct 09 21:40:11 derf "Pushing community software to prime time" Oct 09 21:41:48 derf: you tested on device yet? Oct 09 21:41:57 Must not be archived yet. Oct 09 21:42:02 lardman: Working on it right now. Oct 09 21:42:26 derf: it's on -community actually Oct 09 21:42:34 Oh, that would explain why I can't find it. Oct 09 21:44:03 damn! solmumaha have a different problem, and it might be more convoluted to get running - whilst ive got lan access vmware cant get out into the wide world, ill have a bit of a hack at it, but i dont wanna try too much incase i make problem worse Oct 09 21:44:24 np Oct 09 21:45:00 but where do i get your n8x0 client so if i get it working i can test it Oct 09 21:45:30 i wrote a sucky page for it: http://nakkiboso.com/knots/index.php Oct 09 21:45:47 thats about 1000000x less sucky than mine ;) Oct 09 21:45:57 http://liqbase.net/ :P Oct 09 21:46:03 * lcuk adds a link to the .deb Oct 09 21:46:06 and src Oct 09 21:46:22 haha, maybe a fraction worse Oct 09 21:46:43 my page validates without the youtube video :p Oct 09 21:47:51 it should be quite user-friendly after you get all dependencies installed Oct 09 21:55:48 solmumaha, that looks quite cool - ive saved link if i get the laptop fired up ill try again from there Oct 09 21:57:10 cyas later folks Oct 09 21:58:24 gn Oct 09 21:58:29 gn Oct 09 21:59:06 anyone know of licenses btw? can i use bsd license with gpl stuff? Oct 09 22:00:00 you can combine bsd and gpl stuff if you publish the result under gpl Oct 09 22:00:30 what if my app is bsd and it uses gpl icons? Oct 09 22:00:52 i haven't made changes to gpl stuff Oct 09 22:01:09 should not be a problem, as long as you don't include the gpl bits into your source or link them into your binary... Oct 09 22:01:10 IANAL Oct 09 22:01:55 :) Oct 09 22:02:16 thanks Oct 09 22:02:38 it's written in ruby so i'm not linking to anything and i'm giving credit to gpl authors Oct 09 22:03:08 maybe it would be easier to just change it to gpl, i really don't care about it Oct 09 22:05:02 bsd is just so much shorter Oct 09 22:14:00 night all Oct 09 22:18:38 who wrote liqbase?? Oct 09 22:18:48 me :) Oct 09 22:18:48 moontiger, lcuk Oct 09 22:19:08 how the fuck did you miss it? Oct 09 22:19:13 The YouTube videos are by lcuk Oct 09 22:19:20 the screen yells "Gary Birket" Oct 09 22:19:32 and the main screen says "contact lcuk on #maemo" Oct 09 22:19:39 hell, even error messages tell you to contact him Oct 09 22:19:43 heh Oct 09 22:20:06 actually youtube is lcukmaemo Oct 09 22:20:15 * lcuk is pissin his sides Oct 09 22:20:34 * lcuk raises a beer to seb Oct 09 22:20:43 im busy with other stuff so i just asked .... put your knickers back on Oct 09 22:21:10 * lcuk does Oct 09 22:21:13 why do you ask? Oct 09 22:21:23 * lcuk fears he has blown up his machien Oct 09 22:21:29 lcuk, i'm outa beer :( Oct 09 22:21:31 because i wanted to say i own the patents on that stuff so im going to sue you :)~ Oct 09 22:21:37 no Oct 09 22:21:38 not for lone Oct 09 22:21:41 long Oct 09 22:21:49 really i wanted to say fukin A ... it looks awesome Oct 09 22:21:57 :) Oct 09 22:22:03 yes moontiger, it does and it feels good to use it as well Oct 09 22:22:21 is it installable now? Oct 09 22:22:22 find a way for me to develop it further and i will have you babies :) Oct 09 22:22:25 or still in dev? Oct 09 22:22:26 yes, theres a deb Oct 09 22:22:28 lcuk.pride -= 10; Oct 09 22:22:33 its installable, but not yet in extras Oct 09 22:22:45 you will have my babies?? Oct 09 22:22:50 * moontiger ponders that Oct 09 22:23:00 hey Oct 09 22:23:03 you're not allowed to ask Oct 09 22:23:05 I'm in line first Oct 09 22:23:20 lcuk ... u can have babies? Oct 09 22:23:40 i can do many things for the right money Oct 09 22:23:46 * moontiger laughs Oct 09 22:23:59 ok cos we have completely the wrong bits for you to have my babies Oct 09 22:24:08 but with enough money i guess all is possible Oct 09 22:24:11 ;) Oct 09 22:24:32 im sure we can buy a womb somewhere, either that or theres one going unused inside my n810 at the moment Oct 09 22:24:43 * moontiger laughs Oct 09 22:25:01 the test .deb is available on here Oct 09 22:25:01 what does it use for storage? Oct 09 22:25:01 http://liqbase.net/ Oct 09 22:25:05 flat files Oct 09 22:25:07 liqbase ... not the womb Oct 09 22:25:27 and you read them into a bitmap and scroll that? Oct 09 22:25:34 no, live drawing Oct 09 22:25:38 rendering^ Oct 09 22:25:39 really?? Oct 09 22:25:45 yeah :) 100% live Oct 09 22:25:50 from stroke files? Oct 09 22:25:57 scrollable resizable vector graphics Oct 09 22:25:59 yes Oct 09 22:26:00 he stores every point :) Oct 09 22:26:04 hahaha Oct 09 22:26:06 uh huh Oct 09 22:26:26 oh, btw, lcuk Oct 09 22:26:29 the stamp tool rules :) Oct 09 22:26:36 yeah Oct 09 22:26:37 doesnt he need to store sub-points for sub-pixel rendering? Oct 09 22:26:41 lcuk, test area, you know how it displays images are they are loaded? Oct 09 22:26:41 :rollseyes: Oct 09 22:26:52 yeah Oct 09 22:27:16 moontiger, unfortunately i store points at display resolution, however i could use the native touchsensor resolution which is a lot higher Oct 09 22:27:25 i was kidding Oct 09 22:27:29 points would be fine Oct 09 22:27:30 lcuk, should have the same for the wall Oct 09 22:27:51 im also seriously considering storing everything at 22500dpi and doing full scaling at runtime Oct 09 22:28:20 (theres a bug at present where loading a sketch saved at 800*480 into editor on 400*240 looks too big Oct 09 22:28:31 crashanddie, what do you mean the wall? Oct 09 22:28:33 some what Oct 09 22:28:41 sketch wall Oct 09 22:28:46 yeah, do what to it? Oct 09 22:28:55 have progressive loading Oct 09 22:28:59 it does Oct 09 22:29:01 oh Oct 09 22:29:02 ok Oct 09 22:29:04 :-° Oct 09 22:29:14 you just dont notice it cos you only have a few sketches Oct 09 22:29:25 it kills me cos i cant kinetic for ~20 seconds Oct 09 22:29:30 i cry and want to fix it Oct 09 22:30:14 the amount of bright red sketches ive got saying "fix lazyload" is shocking :) Oct 09 22:31:05 but thats for another day, i think im gonna change the location of the lazyloading so that it doesnt start over again when i close graffiti Oct 09 22:41:01 nice work lcuk ... really Oct 09 22:41:05 well done Oct 09 22:41:16 :) thanks Oct 09 22:41:27 written in C? Oct 09 22:41:30 yes Oct 09 22:41:34 schweet Oct 09 22:41:53 ive really enjoyed picking up all my old habits :) Oct 09 22:42:22 yes im starting to code in C now too ... i like pythin but C is my home (and c++) Oct 09 22:42:30 python too Oct 09 22:42:52 the last time i touched c before this year was in #99 Oct 09 22:42:55 '99 Oct 09 22:42:59 wow really? Oct 09 22:43:04 what u been doing since then??? Oct 09 22:43:13 yeah, ive been coasting in visual basic for far too long ;) Oct 09 22:43:20 ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh he said the V word Oct 09 22:43:44 * moontiger runs aroiund screaming Oct 09 22:44:23 but you best thank it, cos its kept my mind sharp. making a complex vb program run well is as much an art as making a c program run excellently Oct 09 22:44:37 there's nothing wrong with the V word, but the B word should not be spoken in polite company Oct 09 22:44:45 its just syntax Oct 09 22:44:55 plus cultural baggage Oct 09 22:46:02 you're right lcuk ... .i was kidding :) Oct 09 22:46:29 heh, mgedmin i didnt realise you had taken over hte convo, hiya Oct 09 22:46:47 hi Oct 09 22:47:06 i haven't told anyone by the way Oct 09 22:47:30 * mgedmin blinks and searches his unclean conscience for any dirty secrets that lcuk might know Oct 09 22:47:44 muahahahahahha Oct 09 22:48:24 Damn, lardman|gone is gone. Oct 09 22:48:46 yeah derf, i saw him drop out earlier Oct 09 22:49:22 right, i must dash, ive gotta align about 50 styles Oct 09 23:04:53 im heading home ... finished teaching for the day :) Oct 09 23:04:56 laterz Oct 09 23:35:45 Do you have to run the hildon desktop environment or can you replace it with something like lxde? Oct 09 23:40:02 hi Oct 09 23:40:40 any hints for mp3 player for maemo that doesn't suck? Oct 09 23:41:20 (tried canola, youamp, builtin media player) Oct 09 23:42:03 if you find one, tell me Oct 09 23:42:22 the builtin media player is the least sucky one in my experience Oct 09 23:42:33 it sucks a lot, but others suck even more Oct 09 23:42:36 i hate that media library thing Oct 09 23:43:01 I hate the 2-second delay for every action Oct 09 23:43:11 I hate how you cannot skip to next song if you've stopped playing Oct 09 23:43:25 hmm i've never got that far Oct 09 23:43:32 I hate how it doesn't show the full filename Oct 09 23:43:54 so if you have mp3 files with artist - album - title and no tags inside, you have no chance to see what the tracks are Oct 09 23:45:09 who would care for usability as long as it looks like iphone (this is the case of canola) Oct 10 00:15:18 cyrus__: Was that a general query about the tablets? There're projects like deblet (http://trac.tspre.org/projects/deblet) which will let you use other lxde or whatever. Oct 10 00:46:34 cyrus__: And to answer your question from a few days ago about logging into a linux box, if you set up XDMCP (http://tldp.org/HOWTO/XDMCP-HOWTO/procedure.html) and then do something like "Xephyr -query ipaddress :1" on your tablet, you might just be able to get to a login screen. http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=20342 might give you some tips on installing/using Xephyr from within the maemo GUI. :) Oct 10 00:52:24 hmmh, xephyr for tablet would be nice, yes Oct 10 00:52:28 albeit slow Oct 10 01:45:19 closet - ok...thanks Oct 10 01:48:29 closet - one thing. Deblet is a whole other OS though isn't it (actually installed it already). But is it possible to just replace the hildon desktop with something else (like lxde or xfce) Oct 10 01:48:36 is there a gvim port for maemo? Oct 10 01:50:25 using vim in the maemo xterm is really challenging, beyond what I think is reasonable Oct 10 01:57:43 I see debian has vim-gtk for both testing and unstable for armel, but I can't imagine they will work Oct 10 02:04:35 I mean I see this post http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=21719 but are they talking about installing debian and then installing these packages on top of a full debian install or on diablo Oct 10 02:21:05 boo **** ENDING LOGGING AT Fri Oct 10 03:00:06 2008