**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Wed Jan 21 02:59:57 2009
Jan 21 03:00:26 <benson> Haven't actually used it for routing, just to connect on a wired network.
Jan 21 03:01:09 <benson> Have thought about rigging N800+phone = wired uplink for laptop.
Jan 21 03:01:24 <benson> But I don't use my old laptop (the one with no wifi) in ages.
Jan 21 03:01:35 <benson> So never really did it.
Jan 21 03:03:11 * benson smacks forehead.
Jan 21 03:03:41 <benson> So I'm currently downloading a Debian installer with my N800 onto my old laptop's harddrive.
Jan 21 03:03:50 <benson> And the download's taking forever.
Jan 21 03:04:07 <benson> Then I realize I'm on my phone uplink (EDGE), not WiFi.
Jan 21 03:04:20 <benson> At that moment, the novice was greatly enlightened.
Jan 21 03:04:24 <benson> XD
Jan 21 03:06:11 <pupnik> hmm
Jan 21 03:06:24 <pupnik> hjehe
Jan 21 03:25:41 * FireFox is frustrated when he trys to run sudo but gets a "cannot acsess /etc/sudoers: permission denied" error in gentoo
Jan 21 03:26:19 <FireFox> hello, TheFatal
Jan 21 03:26:23 <TheFatal> hello
**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Wed Jan 21 04:28:46 2009
Jan 21 06:02:13 <Stskeeps> fuck exam mornings #|/%
Jan 21 06:11:49 <benson> Stskeeps: Good luck!
Jan 21 06:13:14 <Stskeeps> ta. HCI exam
Jan 21 07:11:53 <pohobbit> browser engine chooser is great, some pages work with webkit some with microb
Jan 21 07:23:13 <Macer> holy shit this goddamn episode of boston legal had my dying laughing
Jan 21 07:23:22 <Macer> my/me
Jan 21 07:24:12 <Stskeeps> you are watching marathon boston legal?
Jan 21 07:26:53 <Macer> yah
Jan 21 07:26:56 <Macer> haha.. i'm on season 3
Jan 21 07:27:08 <Macer> they had a case against homeland security
Jan 21 07:37:40 <Stskeeps> okay, someone's really set out to piss me
Jan 21 07:37:40 <Stskeeps> off
Jan 21 07:37:49 <Stskeeps> - there's a richard stallman poster just across from my office
Jan 21 07:38:10 <Stskeeps> it's kinda like a silver cross against a vampire
Jan 21 07:52:44 <johnx> eh?
Jan 21 08:00:14 <johnx> what's up Stskeeps?
Jan 21 08:03:41 <RST38h> EHLO all
Jan 21 08:05:00 <johnx> hey RST38h
Jan 21 08:07:24 <solmumaha> morning
Jan 21 08:25:54 <Jaffa> Morning, all
Jan 21 08:26:25 <Meiz_n810> morning Jaffa
Jan 21 08:27:58 * johnx heads off to work
Jan 21 08:47:16 <Pavlz> hello
Jan 21 08:47:40 <Pavlz> i got one good news and one bad
Jan 21 08:47:57 <Pavlz> the good news is http://www.nokia.com/imaginemaemo
Jan 21 08:48:32 <Pavlz> the bad news is that the nokia loop and does not start
Jan 21 08:49:03 <Pavlz> i see only to the boot the image Nokia
Jan 21 08:49:16 <Pavlz> there is one bad news
Jan 21 08:49:43 <Pavlz> the socket of mmc espulse the mmc
Jan 21 08:49:59 <Pavlz> i got the nokia 770
Jan 21 08:50:36 <Pavlz> what can i do to solve the problem ?
Jan 21 08:53:36 <Pavlz> the computer does not see the pda nokia 770
Jan 21 08:54:45 <Pavlz> the nokia 770 goes in loop
Jan 21 08:55:06 <Pavlz> without to stop
Jan 21 08:55:18 <Pavlz> i see only the image nokia
Jan 21 08:55:29 <slonopotamus> is THUMB mode worth using?
Jan 21 08:55:52 <Pavlz> how to reset all ?
Jan 21 08:57:33 <Stskeeps> Pavlz: http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware
Jan 21 08:59:03 <Stskeeps> johnx: just that i'm not a friend of stallman :)
Jan 21 08:59:07 <RST38h> slono: depends
Jan 21 08:59:23 <RST38h> Sts: What is that thing between you and Stallman?
Jan 21 08:59:39 <Stskeeps> RST38h: ah, not a fan of stallman and gnubies :>
Jan 21 09:00:00 <slonopotamus> RST38h, tell me then it does :)
Jan 21 09:00:13 <RST38h> Does he come up in your dreams? Does he carry a kettle and a plastic bag with tea like he is said to do?
Jan 21 09:00:37 <slonopotamus> s/then/when
Jan 21 09:00:46 <Stskeeps> and someone put up a stallman poster across from my office :>
Jan 21 09:00:53 <RST38h> Sts: they are funny little maniacs, what is there not to like? =)
Jan 21 09:00:58 * slonopotamus looks around for infobot
Jan 21 09:01:00 <RST38h> Sts: Well, you know what to do
Jan 21 09:01:04 <RST38h> DESECRATE!
Jan 21 09:01:31 <aquatix> Stskeeps: don't you like bearded gnomes?
Jan 21 09:01:40 <slonopotamus> why on earth this xchat doesn't insert user login in message fob on left click on user :(
Jan 21 09:01:40 <Pavlz> if you want to contact richard matthew stallman write to rms@gnu.org
Jan 21 09:01:57 * aquatix was about to ask Stallman about vim when he last saw him, but thought better of it
Jan 21 09:02:05 <aquatix> Pavlz: :)
Jan 21 09:02:44 <RST38h> slono: unless you are executing code from a very slow memory (especially over 16bit bus) you will not see much advantage from thumb
Jan 21 09:02:53 <slonopotamus> ahha. n8x0s should even support thumb-2
Jan 21 09:03:43 <slonopotamus> RST38h, won't it decrease memory usage?
Jan 21 09:04:14 <Stskeeps> eh, no, that's armv7 i guess
Jan 21 09:04:16 <slonopotamus> less code need to be read from mmc -> faster cold start?
Jan 21 09:04:24 <slonopotamus> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ARM_architecture#Thumb-2
Jan 21 09:04:30 <slonopotamus> Thumb-2 technology made its debut in the ARM1156 core
Jan 21 09:04:41 <RST38h> slono: it will, a bit
Jan 21 09:04:42 * Stskeeps passed his HCI exam btw :)
Jan 21 09:04:46 <Pavlz> for stallman vi means : VI, VI, VI that in Roman characters is associated with the devil
Jan 21 09:04:55 <RST38h> human computer interface?
Jan 21 09:05:04 <Pavlz> so rms uses GNU/EMACS
Jan 21 09:05:19 <Pavlz> i know him
Jan 21 09:05:35 <AStorm> lcuk, RST38h, whee, hwr now works with decent speed and excellent quality of single letter detection
Jan 21 09:05:51 <RST38h> AStorm: ! :)
Jan 21 09:05:52 <AStorm> now, I need to add subitization and dictionary
Jan 21 09:06:06 <AStorm> RST38h: still in Python :>
Jan 21 09:06:35 <AStorm> turned out I had a bug in the hash function which pushed a lot of features to slot 0
Jan 21 09:06:39 <AStorm> :P
Jan 21 09:06:56 * RST38h was once shown a letter from RMS to the MIT mailing lists where RMS advocated against license plates on cars because "this is how government takes your freedom away by tracking you"
Jan 21 09:07:11 <RST38h> AStorm: imagine the speed in C! =)
Jan 21 09:07:31 <AStorm> yes, should be very fast
Jan 21 09:08:07 <AStorm> the about only problem with this classifier is that it learns fairly slowly as opposed to certain others
Jan 21 09:08:08 <RST38h> The guy may not be a commie, but he has got all the rethorical devices of a ranking party member, scary
Jan 21 09:08:30 <AStorm> learns faster than a neural net for sure :P
Jan 21 09:13:16 <AStorm> the classifier is not as generalizing than certain others - both good and bad :>
Jan 21 09:13:32 <RST38h> AStorm: Is a new input method coming?
Jan 21 09:13:48 <AStorm> oh, not until I flesh out all the algorithms
Jan 21 09:13:56 <AStorm> then, yes
Jan 21 09:14:09 <AStorm> UI work is to be done last
Jan 21 09:15:30 <AStorm> I find it most fun that if it makes a mistake, it's really between similar letters
Jan 21 09:15:40 <AStorm> it almost never gives you "garbage"
Jan 21 09:17:03 <AStorm> so, it mistook O, Q and 0 at first (slashed 0)
Jan 21 09:17:14 <AStorm> but finally learned the differences
Jan 21 09:25:07 <Stskeeps> johnx: saw Jaffa's HAM?
Jan 21 09:27:44 * Stskeeps glances at beagleboard
Jan 21 09:28:52 <Pavlz> i tried to flash i receive this message : permission denied
Jan 21 09:29:24 <Pavlz> the sequence is : root@obelix:~/Desktop# ./flasher-2.0 -F SU-18_2007HACKER_4.2008.45-1_PR_P5_MRO_ARM.bin -f -R
Jan 21 09:32:16 <Stskeeps> chmod +x iit
Jan 21 09:34:02 <Pavlz> root@obelix:~/Desktop# chmod +x iit
Jan 21 09:34:19 <Stskeeps> ..
Jan 21 09:34:20 <Stskeeps> :P
Jan 21 09:34:26 <Stskeeps> chmod +x flasher-2.0
Jan 21 09:34:56 <Pavlz> impossible to access to iit no such file or directory
Jan 21 09:35:59 <Stskeeps> do the chmod +x flasher-2.0 instead
Jan 21 09:41:51 <Pavlz> i did chmod +x flasher-2.0
Jan 21 09:41:57 <Pavlz> and goes well
Jan 21 09:42:13 <Stskeeps> good
Jan 21 09:42:29 <Pavlz> but when i do ./flasher-2.0 -F SU-18_2007HACKER_4.2008.45-1_PR_P5_MRO_ARM.bin -f -R
Jan 21 09:42:36 <Pavlz> nothing happen
Jan 21 09:44:16 <Pavlz> i got the nokia in contiunuos loop
Jan 21 09:48:35 <Pavlz> how to solve the problem ?
Jan 21 09:50:08 <Stskeeps> Pavlz: turn off your 770 by battery
Jan 21 09:50:12 <wazd> hello everybody :)
Jan 21 09:50:16 <Stskeeps> morning wazd
Jan 21 09:50:22 <Jaffa> johnx: http://www.flegg.org/~andrew/mer-ham-03.png <- showing the grid view patch is installed, and the "only show defined categories" patch when looking at maemo.org Extras
Jan 21 09:50:32 <Jaffa> s/johnx/Ststkeeps
Jan 21 09:50:36 <Jaffa> s/johnx/Stskeeps
Jan 21 09:50:46 <Stskeeps> Jaffa: i suspect if red pill was enabled it would crash
Jan 21 09:51:06 <Stskeeps> as in, showing -all- the ubuntu packages :P
Jan 21 09:51:13 <Pavlz> root@obelix:~/Desktop# ./flasher-2.0  -l SU-18_2007HACKER_4.2008.45-1_PR_P5_MRO_ARM.bin
Jan 21 09:51:13 <Pavlz> flasher v0.8.1 (May 30 2006)
Jan 21 09:51:13 <Pavlz> Suitable USB device not found, waiting
Jan 21 09:51:13 <Pavlz> USB device found found at bus 002, device address 073
Jan 21 09:51:13 <Pavlz> Found device SU-18, hardware revision 1802
Jan 21 09:51:14 <Pavlz> NOLO version 0.9.14
Jan 21 09:51:16 <Pavlz> Version of 'sw-release': SU-18_2006SE_3.2006.49-2_PR_MR0
Jan 21 09:51:47 <Stskeeps> Pavlz: follow the instructions on the page
Jan 21 09:52:36 <Stskeeps> Jaffa: but it is really a challenge for Mer - the huge amount of software :P
Jan 21 09:53:11 <Stskeeps> and if we should only show user/ or how we note that applications are 'hildon friendly'
Jan 21 09:55:38 <Jaffa> Stskeeps: I'd still only show 'user/' for now, TBH.
Jan 21 09:55:49 <Stskeeps> yeah, for now
Jan 21 09:56:15 <Stskeeps> maybe "if you would like to explore the full ubuntu repository, install synaptic" ;)
Jan 21 09:56:29 <Jaffa> Yeah, and there can be a meta-package for that.
Jan 21 09:56:30 <Stskeeps> or giving red pill a purpose
Jan 21 09:56:49 * Jaffa wonders about an auto-Hildonising LD_PRELOAD hack for Gtk
Jan 21 09:57:03 <Jaffa> auto-menu & window hildonising, anyway.
Jan 21 09:57:07 <Stskeeps> i really wonder why they didn't do auto hildonising really
Jan 21 09:57:23 * Jaffa really thinks they should have, but Nokia didn't want to maintain a fork.
Jan 21 09:57:24 <Stskeeps> i mean, it would be a specialization of GtkWindow
Jan 21 09:57:31 <Jaffa> Totally defeats the point of OO though.
Jan 21 09:57:32 <Stskeeps> and such
Jan 21 09:57:35 <Stskeeps> mm
Jan 21 09:57:57 <RST38h> Sts: Have you filed that alignment bug in Sapwood?
Jan 21 09:58:07 <Jaffa> There's an argument that since you have to rethink the UI to properly port something to a finger-friendly mobile device, new widgets aren't a problem. I like having the same API, and doing as much automatically, though
Jan 21 09:58:08 <Stskeeps> RST38h: no, not yet - had to pass an exam this morning
Jan 21 09:58:19 <RST38h> Sts: I will file it in a moment, with the other bugs
Jan 21 09:58:23 <Stskeeps> RST38h: alright
Jan 21 09:58:30 <RST38h> Sts: Could you give me the URL to that file again?
Jan 21 09:58:43 <Stskeeps> i'll grab you the "real" sapwood, sec
Jan 21 09:59:41 <Stskeeps> https://stage.maemo.org/svn/maemo/projects/haf/trunk/sapwood/engine/sapwood-pixmap.c?
Jan 21 10:00:00 <Stskeeps> same file really
Jan 21 10:00:13 <RST38h> thanks
Jan 21 10:00:25 <RST38h> one think I worry about is that they will claim it does not occur in Diablo
Jan 21 10:00:38 <Stskeeps> well it does but the OS fixes it up, doesn't it?
Jan 21 10:00:46 <Stskeeps> er, the processor
Jan 21 10:01:09 <AStorm> Jaffa: everybody likes that
Jan 21 10:01:10 <Stskeeps> besides that, sapwood is going to exist in Fremantle too, so :P
Jan 21 10:01:22 <AStorm> but in GTK, with all the subclassing, it might be hard to do correctly
Jan 21 10:02:27 <Stskeeps> RST38h: poke me with the bug # when reported and i'll add it to our tracking of mer-related bugs
Jan 21 10:02:29 <Stskeeps> lo johnx
Jan 21 10:02:39 <johnx|zaurus> hey
Jan 21 10:02:46 <johnx|zaurus> slow day at work :/
Jan 21 10:03:03 <Pavlz> it is impossible to flash
Jan 21 10:03:22 <Pavlz> the nokia 770 continue to go in loop
Jan 21 10:03:47 <Stskeeps> Pavlz: what flash error do you get?
Jan 21 10:03:56 <Stskeeps> (put it on http://rafb.net/paste )
Jan 21 10:04:22 <Pavlz> no error is impossible
Jan 21 10:04:45 <Pavlz> any time i see only the first boot of the image nokia
Jan 21 10:05:01 <Stskeeps> Pavlz: ok. turn off your tablet, take out the battery.
Jan 21 10:05:13 <Pavlz> then it does the same cicle of boot
Jan 21 10:05:15 <Pavlz> yes
Jan 21 10:05:24 <Pavlz> i did many times it
Jan 21 10:05:30 <Pavlz> what to do ?
Jan 21 10:05:44 <Stskeeps> send it for repairs if it's still under warranty?
Jan 21 10:05:50 <Pavlz> i must remove the battery
Jan 21 10:05:50 <Stskeeps> there's always the chance it's dead
Jan 21 10:05:57 <Pavlz> no
Jan 21 10:06:04 <Pavlz> it is not in warranty
Jan 21 10:06:09 <Stskeeps> well then
Jan 21 10:06:26 <Stskeeps> Pavlz: did you use clone-to-SD before?
Jan 21 10:06:50 <Pavlz> no
Jan 21 10:06:56 <Pavlz> instable os
Jan 21 10:07:15 <Pavlz> the yesterday the battery goes down
Jan 21 10:07:41 <Pavlz> and when i put in charge where impossible to access
Jan 21 10:08:16 <Pavlz> i always used itas own mmc
Jan 21 10:08:24 <Pavlz> its own mmc
Jan 21 10:08:30 <Pavlz> of 64 mb
Jan 21 10:08:41 <Stskeeps> Pavlz: you might be running into simply not having sufficinet battery power to boot
Jan 21 10:09:13 <Pavlz> it is charging now
Jan 21 10:09:24 <Stskeeps> good
Jan 21 10:09:24 <Pavlz> but i can't say how much is charge
Jan 21 10:09:32 <Stskeeps> let it charge fully
Jan 21 10:09:50 <Pavlz> bewcause any time it did the same loop
Jan 21 10:10:18 <RST38h> Sts: https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=4023
Jan 21 10:10:26 <Pavlz> if i don't stop the loop the battery never charge
Jan 21 10:10:31 <Stskeeps> RST38h: thanks
Jan 21 10:10:39 <Stskeeps> Pavlz: take out the battery and leave it outside the 770 for 24 hours
Jan 21 10:11:02 <RST38h> Pavlz: In the freezer.
Jan 21 10:11:04 <RST38h> ;)
Jan 21 10:11:49 <Pavlz> in the freezer ? for what ?
Jan 21 10:13:23 <Stskeeps> RST38h: elaboration - it doesn't crash, it corrupts silently
Jan 21 10:13:35 <Stskeeps> if the OS ignores the traps, it does it at least
Jan 21 10:14:13 <AStorm> hey
Jan 21 10:14:32 <AStorm> could someone quickly build me a package of snakeoil for maemo? (it's a python, C, package)
Jan 21 10:14:36 <AStorm> pkgcore.org
Jan 21 10:16:46 <Pavlz> how to enable R and D mode ?
Jan 21 10:17:03 <AStorm> you don't need r&d mode
Jan 21 10:17:11 <Pavlz> i need
Jan 21 10:17:13 <AStorm> it only enables serial port/jtag I think
Jan 21 10:17:24 <AStorm> you don't - you probably want root access...
Jan 21 10:17:27 <AStorm> ~root
Jan 21 10:17:35 <AStorm> hmm
Jan 21 10:17:36 <AStorm> !root
Jan 21 10:17:38 <Stskeeps> no infobot
Jan 21 10:17:41 <AStorm> meh
Jan 21 10:17:42 <Stskeeps> very annoying
Jan 21 10:17:45 <Pavlz> until to see nokia
Jan 21 10:17:55 <Pavlz> i can see what happen on the lcd
Jan 21 10:18:04 <AStorm> no, you can't
Jan 21 10:18:10 <AStorm> R&D mode doesn't enable that
Jan 21 10:18:17 <Pavlz> is possible
Jan 21 10:18:20 <AStorm> it enables the nice version display (of kernel, initfs)
Jan 21 10:18:28 <AStorm> nothing really important
Jan 21 10:18:31 <AStorm> not the kernel boot log
Jan 21 10:18:55 <Pavlz> ok, but it is just a big step
Jan 21 10:18:56 <AStorm> for that, you need a specially built kernel (with automatic screen updates)
Jan 21 10:19:05 <RST38h> A new Modest bug: https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=4024
Jan 21 10:19:06 <AStorm> or a tool to switch it into auto mode
Jan 21 10:19:09 <AStorm> there was one
Jan 21 10:19:11 <RST38h> Please, comment&vote
Jan 21 10:20:25 <AStorm> damn
Jan 21 10:20:29 <AStorm> I cannot confirm the bug
Jan 21 10:20:40 <AStorm> actually, can't set the bug state to NEW
Jan 21 10:20:58 <AStorm> meh@nokia's bugzilla
Jan 21 10:28:01 <Stskeeps> Jaffa: were you on jaiku btw?
Jan 21 10:37:25 <RST38h> Sts: What is your email address?
Jan 21 10:37:38 <slonopotamus> anyone has something to read about hildon future in fremantle?
Jan 21 10:37:41 <Stskeeps> RST38h: carsten.munk@gmail.com or cvm@cs.au.dk, why?
Jan 21 10:39:05 <Pavlz> where to buy the jtag cable ?
Jan 21 10:39:22 <RST38h> Sts: Nokia wants details on the bug
Jan 21 10:42:38 <GeneralAntilles> slonopotamus, more details to be expected with the beta SDK.
Jan 21 10:43:19 <slonopotamus> GeneralAntilles, and what do we know now?
Jan 21 10:43:46 <RST38h> slono: hildon not going anywhere for now
Jan 21 10:43:52 <X-Fade> slonopotamus: A few new widgets etc.
Jan 21 10:44:40 <X-Fade> Kinetic scrolling in lists for example. Hildon is here to stay (for Fremantle at least).
Jan 21 10:45:03 <slonopotamus> i see. at least it won't go.
Jan 21 10:45:23 <RST38h> X-Fade: Ubuntu seems to be reconsidering Hildon in favor of Qt
Jan 21 10:45:32 <Pavlz> i think that it need of os 2006 to be flashed the first time
Jan 21 10:45:37 <RST38h> X-Fade: so I guess we should expect more people with these questions =)
Jan 21 10:45:56 <X-Fade> RST38h: If they want to stay with GTK, they don't have too much other options.
Jan 21 10:46:04 <slonopotamus> http://www.computerworld.com.au/article/273605
Jan 21 10:47:17 <RST38h> X-Fade: The thing is, they do not want to stay with GTK when Qt is available on LGPL basis
Jan 21 10:47:39 <RST38h> X-Fade: Show me any sane person willingly developing for GTK
Jan 21 10:48:10 <GeneralAntilles> "Hilton"
Jan 21 10:48:21 <GeneralAntilles> I'm sorry, I can't take these articles seriously when they change the spelling every paragraph.
Jan 21 10:48:22 <inz> RST, am I sane?
Jan 21 10:48:55 <X-Fade> RST38h: It is also a C vs C++ discussion.
Jan 21 10:49:12 <RST38h> General: They misspelt TWICE
Jan 21 10:49:15 <GeneralAntilles> slonopotamus, what percentage of that page do you think is actual content?
Jan 21 10:49:18 <RST38h> inz: Dunno!
Jan 21 10:49:24 * RST38h moves away from inz just in case =)
Jan 21 10:50:08 <Pavlz> it needed of SU-18_2006SE_1.2006.26-8_PR_F5_MR0_ARM.bin
Jan 21 10:50:12 <X-Fade> And I thought that Intel dropped Hildon?
Jan 21 10:50:34 <RST38h> X-Fade: True. But Glib/GTK has gone to such lengths with its object-model-but-not-evil-C++ architecture, that it is really easier to just use C++ now
Jan 21 10:50:57 <RST38h> X-Fade: Intel dropped Ubuntu/Debian for some reason
Jan 21 10:51:23 <RST38h> X-Fade: Moblin2 is based on RedHat, with the official reason being "we like wider availability of rpm better"
Jan 21 10:51:31 <X-Fade> RST38h: So this article has all the signs of being clueless? :)
Jan 21 10:51:51 <Pavlz> i flashed it
Jan 21 10:51:58 <Pavlz> and now it works fine
Jan 21 10:52:00 <RST38h> X-Fade: Well, the part about ubuntu reconsidering Hildon is true
Jan 21 10:52:04 <Pavlz> :-)
Jan 21 10:52:12 <suihkulokki> clueless speculation on the internet? you must be joking
Jan 21 10:52:16 <Pavlz> were necessary the old os 2006
Jan 21 10:52:38 <X-Fade> And about that article. 4 columns and only one is content?
Jan 21 10:52:47 <X-Fade> Nice design :D
Jan 21 10:52:56 <GeneralAntilles> ^
Jan 21 10:53:13 <GeneralAntilles> X-Fade, at least they didn't split it onto multiple pages.
Jan 21 10:53:19 <X-Fade> Heh, yeah..
Jan 21 10:53:40 <Pavlz> well
Jan 21 10:53:53 <Pavlz> i turned back to the original firmware
Jan 21 10:54:09 <Pavlz> now i am very happy
Jan 21 11:04:41 <RST38h> General,X-Fade: something is telling me the upcoming maemo redesign won't be different, column-wise =(
Jan 21 11:05:24 <X-Fade> RST38h: Well at least it won't be 4 columns with only one content ;)
Jan 21 11:06:09 <X-Fade> RST38h: But you are invited to the meeting this afternoon to learn more/ discuss alternatives.
Jan 21 11:06:57 <RST38h> X-Fade: No point, have been at previous meetings
Jan 21 11:07:21 <RST38h> What is to be, will be.
Jan 21 11:08:32 <wazd> RST38h: moo, is there any other emu, waiting for an icon?)
Jan 21 11:08:49 <Stskeeps> btw, -what- 770 specific sapwood version? :P
Jan 21 11:09:25 <RST38h> wazd: No, will have to write one =)
Jan 21 11:09:59 <RST38h> wazd: There is some work going on the SNES emulator, but I do not even have the CPU emulation yet
Jan 21 11:10:57 <lcuk> i once tried emulating a woman but could not get the function to make the nose look right
Jan 21 11:11:16 <wazd> RST38h: whoa, SNES is awesome :)
Jan 21 11:12:05 <RST38h> lcuk: Lemme guess, you did it with liqsketcher? =)
Jan 21 11:17:37 <GeneralAntilles> RST38h, well, more than a few people aren't satisfied with the fixed-width setup.
Jan 21 11:21:07 <lcuk> no RST38h it was before digital, i was coding in lego
Jan 21 11:21:31 <Pavlz> hello
Jan 21 11:22:06 <Pavlz> when i launched ./flasher-2.0 -F SU-18_2006SE_1.2006.26-8_PR_F5_MR0_ARM.bin -f  –enable-rd-mode -R
Jan 21 11:23:00 <GeneralAntilles> Why R&D mode?
Jan 21 11:23:05 <Pavlz> all went well, but at the start i don't see the shell on the image nokia
Jan 21 11:23:12 <Pavlz> why like me
Jan 21 11:23:15 <Stskeeps> RST38h: https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=4023#c6
Jan 21 11:23:26 <Stskeeps> does this confirm your hypothesis?
Jan 21 11:23:42 * lcuk smiles cos his multitouch idea gets more and more feasible the more i think about it
Jan 21 11:23:44 <Pavlz> so when i installed xterm and i launched it
Jan 21 11:24:21 <Pavlz> says: Enable RD mode if you want to break your device
Jan 21 11:24:48 <Pavlz> how to launch the R"D at the boot ?
Jan 21 11:25:38 <AStorm> Pavlz, meh
Jan 21 11:25:47 <AStorm> you don't have to do that to break it
Jan 21 11:25:50 <X-Fade> Pavlz: That is not what R&D mode does.
Jan 21 11:26:06 <AStorm> it usually enables root access and serial port
Jan 21 11:26:16 <AStorm> root you can get in many other ways
Jan 21 11:26:19 <X-Fade> lcuk: Tell us more ;)
Jan 21 11:26:23 <Pavlz> i want the shell on the image nokia
Jan 21 11:26:40 <Pavlz> i hate that image
Jan 21 11:26:45 <X-Fade> Pavlz: Just open the terminal and type sudo gainroot ?
Jan 21 11:26:54 <Pavlz> i did it
Jan 21 11:27:03 <AStorm> Pavlz, you do that with he flasher
Jan 21 11:27:06 <X-Fade> So? Then you should have root?
Jan 21 11:27:22 <Pavlz> yes
Jan 21 11:27:43 <AStorm> it has an option to enable that
Jan 21 11:27:48 <lcuk> x-fade :) i just did - in #liqbase, ive found the PERFECT use case for the multitouch which is just a really elegent function :)
Jan 21 11:27:54 <lcuk> you will find out soon
Jan 21 11:28:03 <X-Fade> lcuk: Aw, not another window :)
Jan 21 11:28:18 <X-Fade> My irssi is getting cluttered aready..
Jan 21 11:28:25 <lcuk> heh, i ramble more in #liqbase about my tech ideas and progress :P
Jan 21 11:28:32 <Pavlz> now i must to digit ./flasher-2.0 -F SU-18_2006SE_1.2006.26-8_PR_F5_MR0_ARM.bin -f  –enable-rd-mode -R
Jan 21 11:28:51 <X-Fade> lcuk: We demand blog posts :)
Jan 21 11:29:06 <lcuk> x-fade not until im ready :)
Jan 21 11:29:31 <lcuk> at the moment things are gelling together nicely but theres some pieces not slotted in yet
Jan 21 11:29:57 * lcuk just wishes he could work on it for more of the time
Jan 21 11:30:13 <lcuk> anyway, back to vb
Jan 21 11:33:26 <ppires> hi all. i'm looking for a WiMAX enabled device and I've heard about N810 WiMAX Edition. I'm wondering how WiMAX is supported and managed in this device. Also would like to know if any access to drivers exist.
Jan 21 11:34:10 <Stskeeps> ppires: beware that wimax edition has been EOLed.. and was only out in US i think
Jan 21 11:34:20 <ppires> yes i know that.
Jan 21 11:34:27 <Stskeeps> drivers, hmm
Jan 21 11:36:04 <Stskeeps> i can't remember the name but i -think- the wimax driver was OSS
Jan 21 11:36:20 <ppires> that would be lovely
Jan 21 11:36:30 <Stskeeps> that doesn't mean you can calibrate it for EU bands though
Jan 21 11:37:07 <Pavlz> the nokia crashed
Jan 21 11:37:16 <Pavlz> why the battery were low
Jan 21 11:37:22 <Stskeeps> unless you know how to :P
Jan 21 11:37:23 <ppires> actually i'm not interested in using commercial networks, but to be able to do handovers between wifi and wimax. n810 would be perfect for that
Jan 21 11:37:33 <Pavlz> but it turned back immediately on
Jan 21 11:37:39 <ppires> i have wimax mobile testbed available
Jan 21 11:37:46 <Stskeeps> ah
Jan 21 11:37:48 <Pavlz> i must to install xchat
Jan 21 11:45:50 <ppires> Stskeeps: can you point me to any maemo related articles on how to hack the wimax connection?
Jan 21 11:46:53 <Stskeeps> ppires: i must honestly admit i am not knowledge about N810W's at all, as i don't have one and have no access to it through work :P
Jan 21 11:47:56 <GeneralAntilles> ppires, there are none.
Jan 21 11:48:06 <GeneralAntilles> There's maybe 6 or 7 people who actually own the thing.
Jan 21 11:48:28 <Stskeeps> ppires: driver is called pc2400m
Jan 21 11:48:33 <X-Fade> GeneralAntilles: Well, I know quite a few more ;)
Jan 21 11:49:04 <Stskeeps> ppires: and it looks OSS
Jan 21 11:50:30 <suihkulokki> ppires: you are better of asking from maemo-devel mailing list
Jan 21 11:50:40 <Jaffa> Stskeeps: I am on jaiku (jaffa2)
Jan 21 11:50:57 <GeneralAntilles> Time for another community highlights. :\
Jan 21 11:51:13 <Stskeeps> Jaffa: a bunch of stuff for you in messages, if merbuilder doesn't respond to you, it's cos of your upper/lowercase username :P
Jan 21 11:51:34 <Stskeeps> messages as in /msg on irc :P
Jan 21 11:53:48 <Jaffa> This connection keeps dropping SSH connections.
Jan 21 11:54:11 <Stskeeps> ah
Jan 21 11:54:31 <Stskeeps> as in you didn't get it, or you have issues with the ssh upload :)
Jan 21 11:56:00 <Jaffa> No, got 'em, my SSH connections keep disconnecting, though
Jan 21 11:56:34 <Stskeeps> ah
Jan 21 11:56:49 <Stskeeps> ftp can be arranged too for the first part
Jan 21 11:57:34 <Stskeeps> it's just a temporary thing until we have gotten things so stable that we can move them to maemo.org :P
Jan 21 11:57:38 <Stskeeps> (if they still want us ;)
Jan 21 11:57:48 * Jaffa tries going in on port 443, rather than 22 to see if it's n/w related (nope: it's not)
Jan 21 11:59:17 <ppires> Stskeeps, GeneralAntilles suihkulokki tks a lot :-)
Jan 21 12:00:33 <GeneralAntilles> Stskeeps, Mer: Bugzilla, wazd's mockups, ... ?
Jan 21 12:01:05 <Stskeeps> GeneralAntilles: are you hinting on the wide range of mer spam? ;)
Jan 21 12:01:31 <GeneralAntilles> Stskeeps, trying to compile a highlights article.
Jan 21 12:01:35 <Stskeeps> GeneralAntilles: ah
Jan 21 12:01:36 <Pavlz> where i can find xchat for nokia 770 ?
Jan 21 12:01:38 <Stskeeps> GeneralAntilles: 0.6
Jan 21 12:01:40 <Stskeeps> definately 0.6
Jan 21 12:01:47 <GeneralAntilles> Ah, right, that too.
Jan 21 12:02:01 <Stskeeps> and hinting at having a VDI you can download and use on your own PC :P
Jan 21 12:03:50 * Stskeeps is joyful over having proper 770 soon
Jan 21 12:03:54 <Stskeeps> +support
Jan 21 12:04:51 <GeneralAntilles> I can't think of anything not Mer-related, though.
Jan 21 12:06:51 * lcuk wonders how many pages his blog post will need to be
Jan 21 12:07:05 <lcuk> does the internet ever run out of ink?
Jan 21 12:08:15 <Stskeeps> GeneralAntilles: Nitdroid.. Samba support
Jan 21 12:08:48 <GeneralAntilles> Nitdroid is stupid
Jan 21 12:08:53 <GeneralAntilles> Samba I could care less about. :P
Jan 21 12:09:08 <Jaffa> GeneralAntilles: it's not just what /you/ care about, of course ;-)
Jan 21 12:09:16 <GeneralAntilles> Jaffa, pfft. :P
Jan 21 12:09:43 <GeneralAntilles> Jaffa, well consider non-GeneralAntilles-interesting material when somebody else starts writing them.
Jan 21 12:09:51 <Pavlz> where i can find xchat for nokia 770 ?
Jan 21 12:11:25 <GeneralAntilles> Besides, I can't very well write intelligently about something I don't care about. :P
Jan 21 12:12:56 <Jaffa> Stskeeps: Got an error on /import-new--ignore or is it an error (changelog says 'jaunty')
Jan 21 12:13:10 <Stskeeps> it's fine, just ignore it
Jan 21 12:14:07 <GeneralAntilles> Stskeeps, file some bugs so your new product doesn't look so lame. https://bugs.maemo.org/buglist.cgi?&product=Mer
Jan 21 12:14:33 <Stskeeps> GeneralAntilles: hehe
Jan 21 12:14:37 <Stskeeps> we will :P
Jan 21 12:15:03 <Pavlz> i found xchat for nokia 770
Jan 21 12:16:10 <m0zzie> any other developers awake?
Jan 21 12:16:27 <Stskeeps> er, yes
Jan 21 12:16:31 <Stskeeps> but for what purpose
Jan 21 12:16:56 <m0zzie> specifically i'm after anyone who has worked on stlc45xx :]
Jan 21 12:17:12 <Jaffa> Stskeeps: HAM in queue :-)
Jan 21 12:17:15 <Stskeeps> Jaffa: woo
Jan 21 12:17:24 <m0zzie> i'm a developer too, but i don't currently have a nokia tablet.. just contemplating purchasing one
Jan 21 12:17:32 * Jaffa goes to get some fish & chips
Jan 21 12:17:36 <Stskeeps> m0zzie: stlc45xx-devel is a good place
Jan 21 12:17:42 <Stskeeps> i don't think anyone in here fiddled on it
Jan 21 12:17:51 <Stskeeps> we are much interested in the results, especially 770 support too :P
Jan 21 12:18:18 <Stskeeps> ( https://garage.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/stlc45xx-devel )
Jan 21 12:18:30 <Stskeeps> Jaffa: i can hear it building behind me :>
Jan 21 12:18:53 <m0zzie> just subscribed
Jan 21 12:18:56 <m0zzie> cheers Stskeeps
Jan 21 12:19:18 <Stskeeps> m0zzie: so where lies your interest in stlc?
Jan 21 12:19:57 <m0zzie> well, as i said, i'm a developer.. but i'd like a project other than my actual work, as a hobby
Jan 21 12:20:06 <m0zzie> to work on sometimes :)
Jan 21 12:20:12 <Stskeeps> *nod*
Jan 21 12:20:17 <m0zzie> i'm looking at buying an n810 as a little toy
Jan 21 12:20:20 <Stskeeps> plenty of projects on the tablets really
Jan 21 12:20:27 <Stskeeps> watch out though, they're addictive :)
Jan 21 12:20:38 <m0zzie> that's a good thing
Jan 21 12:20:44 <m0zzie> although my girlfriend would disagree
Jan 21 12:20:57 <Stskeeps> my gf thinks mine is cool :P
Jan 21 12:21:11 <Stskeeps> if i get a n900, she'll inherit my n800 :P
Jan 21 12:21:22 <m0zzie> i gave her my old laptop for christmas though, so that keeps her busy and not complaining when i'm sitting here coding some nights
Jan 21 12:21:32 <m0zzie> ohh.. n900 is on its way?
Jan 21 12:21:59 <Stskeeps> well, probably summer, but we don't know
Jan 21 12:22:03 <Stskeeps> n810 is still perfectly usable
Jan 21 12:22:14 <Stskeeps> and there's a OSS wifi driver on the rx-51, so
Jan 21 12:23:14 <m0zzie> yeah i think i'd still go for the n810.. don't want to dish out too much money for a new project just yet
Jan 21 12:23:53 <m0zzie> my main interest in the stlc45xx driver is to patch it to support packet injection
Jan 21 12:24:14 <m0zzie> i do a fair bit of pentesting for work colleagues, family and friends etc
Jan 21 12:24:15 <AndrewFBlack> Morning
Jan 21 12:24:55 <Stskeeps> morning AndrewFBlack
Jan 21 12:24:58 <m0zzie> so my ultimate goal would be to get that going, and then build a small toolset/package
Jan 21 12:31:39 <m0zzie> Stskeeps: i've subscribed to the list, although do any of the stlc45xx devs hang around here often?
Jan 21 12:32:09 <RST38h> Cellular-infrastructure manufacturer Ericsson will lay off 5,000 in a bid to cut costs
Jan 21 12:32:20 <RST38h> (that it not handsets, mind you)
Jan 21 12:33:33 <Pavlz> xchat for nokia 770 os 2006 is on http://maemo-hackers.org/apt/pool/main/x/xchat/
Jan 21 12:34:26 <Pavlz> the version is xchat_2.6.4-2_armel.deb
Jan 21 12:34:57 <Stskeeps> m0zzie: i'm not sure, but i don't think so
Jan 21 12:36:16 <GeneralAntilles> m0zzie, no.
Jan 21 12:37:35 <johnx|z> m00f
Jan 21 12:37:37 <Stskeeps> f00m
Jan 21 12:38:39 <inz> Pavlz, skyhusker's version was better than mine, but it seems to be no longer available :(
Jan 21 12:40:00 <inz> Hmm, maybe the version from diablo extras could be rebuilt for mistral...
Jan 21 12:40:57 <Myrtti> hello dearies
Jan 21 12:41:17 <Stskeeps> 'lo Myrtti
Jan 21 12:41:18 <inz> Myrtti, welcome back!-)
Jan 21 12:41:20 <Stskeeps> thought you left irc :P
Jan 21 12:41:46 <Myrtti> oh no... the last time I think I dropped the channel it was because irssi segfaulted
Jan 21 12:42:04 <Myrtti> was trying to move a window from a split window to another...
Jan 21 12:42:18 <inz> Grr, no sources for xchat in extras
Jan 21 12:43:01 <GeneralAntilles> inz, er?
Jan 21 12:43:30 <inz> General, I see no xchat in: http://repository.maemo.org/extras/pool/diablo/free/source/x/
Jan 21 12:43:43 <GeneralAntilles> So it is.
Jan 21 12:43:44 <GeneralAntilles> Huh
Jan 21 12:43:46 <GeneralAntilles> Looks like a bug.
Jan 21 12:43:50 <johnx|z> odd
Jan 21 12:43:52 <Stskeeps> Myrtti: we'll soon be bringing ubuntu & Mer to your 770, btw :)
Jan 21 12:44:03 <johnx|z> it's not in non-free is it?
Jan 21 12:44:12 <Myrtti> WHEE! excellent
Jan 21 12:44:13 <inz> johnx, the binaries are in free
Jan 21 12:44:20 <johnx|z> huh
Jan 21 12:44:25 <johnx|z> no idea then
Jan 21 12:44:29 <pupnik_> that ubuntu+mer addresses a lot of our structural/community difficulties, IMO
Jan 21 12:44:42 <GeneralAntilles> inz, well, http://repository.maemo.org/extras-devel/pool/diablo/free/source/x/xchat/
Jan 21 12:44:49 <inz> GA, yeah, just noticed
Jan 21 12:46:06 <GeneralAntilles> Bleh, Unicomp shipped my keyboard to the billing address. <_<
Jan 21 12:47:25 <Stskeeps> pupnik_: definately gives us strength..
Jan 21 12:47:50 * johnx|z revies ubuntu h-d patches, figures out what he wants
Jan 21 12:48:17 <pupnik_> and keep the name 'mer' i hate the name 'ubuntu'
Jan 21 12:49:18 <johnx|z> pupnik_: agreed :) also it really isn't exactly ubuntu...
Jan 21 12:49:33 <Stskeeps> yeah, we're far more reckless
Jan 21 12:49:33 <Stskeeps> :P
Jan 21 12:49:54 * GeneralAntilles chuckles at Stskeeps' sig.
Jan 21 12:49:58 <johnx|z> well, we need a little recklessness I think
Jan 21 12:50:11 <Stskeeps> GeneralAntilles: mm?
Jan 21 12:50:15 <GeneralAntilles> Karma whore.
Jan 21 12:50:19 <GeneralAntilles> Worse than me. :P
Jan 21 12:50:49 <Stskeeps> GeneralAntilles: well, it's being a karma whore but it is also a way for me to evaluate if i'm doing things right as i have trouble reading that occasionally :)
Jan 21 12:51:02 <GeneralAntilles> Yeah, yeah. :P
Jan 21 12:51:09 <Stskeeps> if i didn't get thanked for the work done, or people showing they appreciate it, i get bored :)
Jan 21 12:51:31 <johnx|z> also makes sure we can get him sent to the summit to slap some noia reps with a frzeon trout
Jan 21 12:52:15 <GeneralAntilles> I hope we have more cash to bring in non-EU people. :\
Jan 21 12:52:41 <Stskeeps> johnx|z: https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=4023 <- sapwood bug btw
Jan 21 12:53:00 <johnx|z> yup, was reading earlier
Jan 21 12:53:11 <Stskeeps> k
Jan 21 12:53:38 <johnx|z> I think I'll have to leave applying the fix to someone else O_o
Jan 21 12:53:53 <Stskeeps> i bet it would do some small performance enhancement if it didn't have to do a alignment every single time it requests a pixbuf :P
Jan 21 12:54:17 * Myrtti whistles innocently
Jan 21 12:54:30 <johnx|z> heh. that'd be a nice selling point
Jan 21 12:54:42 <Stskeeps> johnx|z: eero came up with that one
Jan 21 12:55:37 <Stskeeps> johnx|z: i just look forward not having to deal with the 770 as a special case :)
Jan 21 12:56:12 <Stskeeps> or the zaurus for that sake
Jan 21 12:56:17 <johnx|z> yup, onlu special thing about it will be 64MB RAM
Jan 21 12:56:36 <Stskeeps> yeah, but that's besides the point
Jan 21 12:58:05 <johnx|z> anyways, looks i have nothing to do here at work, so i'll head home
Jan 21 12:59:28 <lcuk> hiya Myrtti, back from the uk already?
Jan 21 13:00:53 <Myrtti> lcuk: nope, am currently looking from the window to some nice fields out of Warboys, Cambs :-)
Jan 21 13:01:58 <Khertan_work> Hello !
Jan 21 13:02:10 <lcuk> cool, your knitting is great by the way, i keep thinking of sierpinski's gaskets
Jan 21 13:02:15 <lcuk> hiya Khertan_work
Jan 21 13:02:43 * Myrtti loves her job
Jan 21 13:02:52 <Myrtti> excellent to be able to work from anywhere in the world
Jan 21 13:03:46 <lcuk> i would agree, but im stuck behind a desk writing vb crap dreaming of a better life :)
Jan 21 13:03:57 * aquatix looks jealously at Myrtti 
Jan 21 13:04:22 <lcuk> aquatix, dont believe the hype ;) myrtti changes her mind every 5 minutes :P
Jan 21 13:04:35 <aquatix> ghehehe
Jan 21 13:04:54 <Myrtti> the work is nice - sometimes the people are disappointing though
Jan 21 13:05:09 <inz> Myrtti, and who do you mean by "people", me?
Jan 21 13:05:24 <Myrtti> inz: I haven't done a thing with you :-)
Jan 21 13:05:47 <inz> Myrtti, oh, right, nevermind then
Jan 21 13:05:54 <Khertan_work> do you know existance of any gtk that permit to edit html in a wysiwyg way like fckeditor in java ?
Jan 21 13:06:06 <Khertan_work> javascript
Jan 21 13:06:33 <inz> Khertan, some versions of gtkhtml do, but they produce ugly html
Jan 21 13:06:34 <lcuk> khertan, doesnt the "notes" app let you do basic html
Jan 21 13:06:46 <Khertan_work> notes ?
Jan 21 13:06:50 <Khertan_work> which one mnotes ?
Jan 21 13:06:54 <Khertan_work> :)
Jan 21 13:06:58 <lcuk> no, the default one
Jan 21 13:07:22 <Khertan_work> some version of gtkhtml ... hum i ll look
Jan 21 13:07:27 <Myrtti> inz: besides I suspect you do know how a simple "for file in *.foo;do bar --baz ${file} > ${file}.zyzzy;done" works :-)
Jan 21 13:08:00 <inz> Myrtti, sure I do, it would break whenever there is a space in *.foo
Jan 21 13:08:11 <Myrtti> inz: there isn't :-)
Jan 21 13:08:23 <inz> Myrtti, is there a spec that says so?
Jan 21 13:08:26 <aquatix> pft, spaces in file names...
Jan 21 13:08:53 <Myrtti> inz: somewhere in an app that generates the *.foo's in the first place
Jan 21 13:09:01 * lcuk knows nothing of this strange cryptic language you utter
Jan 21 13:09:17 <aquatix> lcuk: that's `code'
Jan 21 13:09:18 <lcuk> ancient command line incantations are the work of the devil!
Jan 21 13:09:22 <aquatix> ghehe
Jan 21 13:09:28 <inz> Khertan, the widget used by osso-notes is also public, check wpeditor in repository.maemo.org
Jan 21 13:09:33 <lcuk> no aquatix, its the mark of the beast
Jan 21 13:09:41 <inz> Khertan, whichever is worse, I know not
Jan 21 13:09:54 * aquatix is thinking what script he can write in 666 lines
Jan 21 13:10:06 <Myrtti> lcuk, aquatix: don't mock bash. It's a nice thing.
Jan 21 13:10:08 <inz> Khertan, probably both will cause you frustration beyond your wildest believes
Jan 21 13:10:32 <Khertan_work> What are your plans for GNOME 2.28?
Jan 21 13:10:38 <aquatix> Myrtti: i love it
Jan 21 13:10:40 <lcuk> Myrtti, im not mocking it - im deadly serious that stuff boggles my mind
Jan 21 13:10:42 <Khertan_work> Evolution should move to Webkits, deprecating GtkHTML
Jan 21 13:11:05 <aquatix> Myrtti: i write bash scripts for hobby even
Jan 21 13:11:07 <Khertan_work> hum ...
Jan 21 13:11:11 <Khertan_work> not great
Jan 21 13:11:13 <Myrtti> aquatix: I write them for work.
Jan 21 13:11:24 * aquatix not yet ;)
Jan 21 13:11:28 <Myrtti> aquatix: which one of us got the worst deal, don't know
Jan 21 13:11:35 <aquatix> ghehe
Jan 21 13:11:46 * aquatix is struggling with visual studio for work
Jan 21 13:11:56 <aquatix> so i have an idea about worse deals
Jan 21 13:12:00 <inz> Khertan, I think webkit does not include any "editor"
Jan 21 13:12:18 <Khertan_work> there isn't
Jan 21 13:12:18 <Myrtti> I've done that with zero skills of MS's "development tools" ;-)
Jan 21 13:12:47 <lcuk> webkit should include a  html edit mode surely
Jan 21 13:12:53 <inz> Oh, it does?
Jan 21 13:12:57 <lcuk> its a standard expected thing, whether or not the app has wired it in
Jan 21 13:14:21 <lcuk> googling "webkit edit mode" brings back various results
Jan 21 13:14:49 <inz> lcuk, it does, but most of them seemed to have some javascript mumbojumbo in them
Jan 21 13:15:01 <inz> lcuk, but wk.org/projects/editing looks right
Jan 21 13:15:05 <lcuk> yeah, its a big mishmash
Jan 21 13:15:23 <lcuk> aquatix, which visual studio  are you stressin about?
Jan 21 13:15:29 <aquatix> 2005
Jan 21 13:15:37 <aquatix> want to make an mdi gui in c++
Jan 21 13:15:42 * lcuk hates all of them equally
Jan 21 13:15:48 <inz> me too
Jan 21 13:15:55 <aquatix> and somehow it decides i can't have a graphical form editor in MDI app mode
Jan 21 13:16:00 <lcuk> vb6 ide was spot on :)
Jan 21 13:16:01 <aquatix> lcuk: yeah, me too
Jan 21 13:16:05 <aquatix> i love delphi
Jan 21 13:16:11 <aquatix> that one just works
Jan 21 13:16:33 <lcuk> anyway, bbl again
Jan 21 13:16:40 <aquatix> yeah, /me is afk too
Jan 21 13:23:47 <Passeli> in scratchbox, what is the quickest way to duplicate existing target (example. DIABLO_X86)
Jan 21 13:27:16 <GeneralAntilles> Myrtti, what is the Diablodoctest?
Jan 21 13:27:49 <inz> Passeli, cp -r /scratchbox/users/$USER/targets/DIABLO_X86 /scratchbox/users/$USER/targets/DIABLO2_X86; sed -e 's/DIABLO_X86/DIABLO2_X86/g' /scratcbox/users/$USER/targets/DIABLO_X86.config > /scratchbox/users/$USER/targets/DIABLO2_X86
Jan 21 13:27:53 <inz> Passeli, or something like that
Jan 21 13:28:11 <inz> Passeli, add .config to the end
Jan 21 13:28:49 <Myrtti> GeneralAntilles: *cough*
Jan 21 13:29:09 <Myrtti> GeneralAntilles: exactly what it looks like
Jan 21 13:29:48 <Myrtti> GeneralAntilles: if you have a sandbox, you could move it there I guess, but don't do it now. The person who is doing those has very little of clue how Mediawiki works
Jan 21 13:30:54 <Myrtti> and of course, this is again one of those things I could have done in PM
Jan 21 13:30:55 <Myrtti> oh well
Jan 21 13:31:11 <Myrtti> time for a new pot of tea
Jan 21 13:31:28 <GeneralAntilles> Myrtti, well, we don't do camelCase or anything like that. :P
Jan 21 13:31:31 <X-Fade> Myrtti: No need, this has been announced a long time ago..
Jan 21 13:31:40 <GeneralAntilles> So "Nokia documentation test" would be more appropriate.
Jan 21 13:32:02 <Myrtti> GeneralAntilles: it took me a while to tell the person how to create a new page in the first place...
Jan 21 13:32:06 <GeneralAntilles> Myrtti, if you need any mediawiki support, feel free to ask me or point whoever my way.
Jan 21 13:32:29 <Myrtti> GeneralAntilles: oh, I'm quite proficient with Mediawiki :->
Jan 21 13:32:40 <Myrtti> She's not :-D
Jan 21 13:32:44 <Jaffa> Stskeeps: Seems to have been fun triggering the HAM build?
Jan 21 13:33:01 <X-Fade> Myrtti: And if you need any plugins or config changes....
Jan 21 13:33:06 <StsN801> sec, getting off bus
Jan 21 13:33:08 * X-Fade waves :)
Jan 21 13:33:44 <Myrtti> X-Fade: few lines in the css, later on prolly need a bot to fix the rough edges from the syntax
Jan 21 13:35:12 <Myrtti> there's too much to be fixed manually
Jan 21 13:35:22 <X-Fade> All the better.
Jan 21 13:35:37 <GeneralAntilles> Also: https://wiki.maemo.org/Template:Official
Jan 21 13:36:06 <Myrtti> yeah, will remember that, thanks.
Jan 21 13:36:25 <lcuk> Myrtti, do not underestimate the editing abilities of a single person with an unlimited supply of cheetos and coke
Jan 21 13:36:30 <GeneralAntilles> Who's going to be "in charge" of documentation on the wiki?
Jan 21 13:36:44 <lcuk> look at GeneralAntilles for one ;)
Jan 21 13:36:44 <Myrtti> GeneralAntilles: your guess is as good as mine
Jan 21 13:36:49 <GeneralAntilles> They're gonna need admin and the ability to "bless" their team.
Jan 21 13:37:17 <Myrtti> GeneralAntilles: "I only work here"
Jan 21 13:37:50 <Myrtti> GeneralAntilles: atm this is only proof of concept work
Jan 21 13:38:15 <Myrtti> to show that the stuff can be imported somehow
Jan 21 13:44:06 * Myrtti facepalms
Jan 21 13:46:51 <Stskeeps> Jaffa: yes, too long version => >160 character messages..
Jan 21 13:47:31 <Myrtti> if someone could delete http://wiki.maemo.org/Maemo_diablo_getting_started, I would be most happy
Jan 21 13:47:35 <kozak|work> good evening all...
Jan 21 13:47:41 <Stskeeps> afternoon kozak|work
Jan 21 13:48:37 <kozak|work> Stskeeps> thanks for the inputs on Mer and beagle board yday
Jan 21 13:48:42 <Stskeeps> np
Jan 21 13:49:00 <kozak|work> Would like to work more towards it.....
Jan 21 13:49:30 <lopz> hola
Jan 21 13:49:53 <kozak|work> I am an absolute newbie... so pardon me if I ask some dumb questions....
Jan 21 13:50:18 <Stskeeps> kozak|work: well, how much can you do with your beagle already? (i have one myself, so :P)
Jan 21 13:51:24 <kozak|work> Sts> Well till now I just have android on my beagle up ... but that was starightforward stuff
Jan 21 13:52:18 <kozak|work> Sts> 1. You suggested that the way to go forward is to have mer on beagle is to get ubuntu jaunty on beagle first....
Jan 21 13:52:41 <Khertan_work> nope ... the first thing is to have beagle
Jan 21 13:52:44 <baaba> erf, where do desktop applet settings actually get saved?
Jan 21 13:52:45 <Khertan_work> :)
Jan 21 13:52:51 <kozak|work> I ahve one :)
Jan 21 13:53:03 <Khertan_work> baaba : depends on the desktop applet
Jan 21 13:53:22 <GeneralAntilles> Myrtti, done.
Jan 21 13:53:24 <baaba> er sorry, i mean the settings of the desktop itself
Jan 21 13:53:30 <baaba> does hildon-desktop come with a bunch of built-in applets?
Jan 21 13:53:31 <Khertan_work> ha :)
Jan 21 13:54:01 <baaba> because i only see three entries in /etc/hildon-desktop/home.conf
Jan 21 13:54:02 <Khertan_work> if i remember this is something like ~/.hildon-desktop/
Jan 21 13:54:21 <Myrtti> GeneralAntilles: ♥
Jan 21 13:54:37 <GeneralAntilles> Myrtti, I also upgraded your permissions. ;)
Jan 21 13:54:46 <baaba> hmm, no  ~/.hildon-desktop/ anywhere
Jan 21 13:54:59 <Khertan_work> ~/.osso/hildon-desktop/ to be exact
Jan 21 13:55:13 <baaba> ahh thanks a bunch :)
Jan 21 13:55:18 <Khertan_work> i've just verify on my nit
Jan 21 13:55:42 <kozak|work> sts> Jaunty is based on 2.6.28 . So I can start of with patching the beagleboard port for 2.6.27 on to 2.6.28?
Jan 21 13:56:02 <Stskeeps> kozak|work: kernel doesn't matter that much, just that we can get a kernel package for it
Jan 21 13:57:05 <Stskeeps> brb
Jan 21 13:57:11 <kozak|work> Sts> Ok .. I am not aware of what other changes need to be done to Jaunty to have to up on beagle.
Jan 21 13:57:17 <kozak|work> ok
Jan 21 13:58:48 <Stskeeps> kozak|work: i think some people in #ubuntu-arm are working on that part
Jan 21 13:59:59 <Stskeeps> they're waiting for kernels
Jan 21 14:00:11 <kozak|work> Oh ok
Jan 21 14:17:53 <Khertan_work> oh my god ... gtkhtml2 doesn't have editing ???
Jan 21 14:19:00 <kozak|work> sts> is the #ubuntu-arm channel logged somewhere?
Jan 21 14:19:33 <Jaffa> Stskeeps: Do I need to change the version number to something shorter? (Presumably the builder errors posting to Jaiku and it aborts, or can we just not see the results?)
Jan 21 14:20:32 <Stskeeps> Jaffa: yeah, builder crashes :) i think i might have solved it now
Jan 21 14:20:50 <Stskeeps> it's a horrible horrible python script
Jan 21 14:20:56 <Jaffa> Stskeeps: Cool :-) Glad I can stress test these things :-)
Jan 21 14:21:42 <Khertan_work> someone know where i can found the doc for pygtkhtml2
Jan 21 14:22:21 <Jaffa> Stskeeps: BTW, when is the '1:' prefix required on the version numbers?
Jan 21 14:22:35 <Khertan_work> i ve try to read the ruby one .... but 403 : http://ruby-gnome2.sourceforge.jp/hiki.cgi?Gtk::HtmlView
Jan 21 14:22:37 <Stskeeps> Jaffa: whenever
Jan 21 14:22:55 <Khertan_work> an other i know containing the pydocs return a 502 : https://www.astro.rug.nl/efidad/gtkhtml2.html
Jan 21 14:23:14 <Stskeeps> Jaffa: it's when you have a version you need to override but you can't do it with version .. or something
Jan 21 14:23:33 <persia> kozak|work, It's not logged anywhere.  I think someone opened a ticket to get it logged, but it's yet undone.
Jan 21 14:24:03 <kozak|work> thanks persia
Jan 21 14:24:57 <persia> One uses an epoch (1:) when one needs to use a version number that is lower than the version currently in the repository.  For example, if foo 3.9 was merged into bar 1.2, and one uploaded a bar 1.2 package providing foo (at version 1.2), nobody would be upgraded, so one uploads bar 1:1.2 to force the upgrade.  Use sparingly, with caution, and only when you *really* must.
Jan 21 14:27:35 <Stskeeps> persia: ta for that info :)
Jan 21 14:28:16 <Stskeeps> Jaffa: also, either ports.ubuntu.com is being unstable or my uni connection
Jan 21 14:29:11 * johnx returns home, eats a sammich
Jan 21 14:31:45 <Khertan_work> hum ... someone have already use pygtkhtml2 module ?
Jan 21 14:32:41 * johnx reads 4023
Jan 21 14:33:03 <johnx> well...that's not exactly the result I was hoping for...
Jan 21 14:33:25 <Stskeeps> hmm?
Jan 21 14:33:26 <Khertan_work> nope ... surely the wrong question
Jan 21 14:33:57 <johnx> Stskeeps, I was hoping they'd own up immediately and push out a patch
Jan 21 14:34:48 <Stskeeps> johnx: we'll see
Jan 21 14:34:52 <Stskeeps> things don't go that fast
Jan 21 14:35:11 <Stskeeps> and eero putting it as performance is a good thing
Jan 21 14:35:16 <Khertan_work> pygtkhtml return 9 result in google ...
Jan 21 14:35:20 <johnx> yeah, I suppose so
Jan 21 14:35:43 <Stskeeps> johnx: i think it's fairly trivial to fix really
Jan 21 14:36:18 <Stskeeps> i'll take a grab at it after watching BSG :P
Jan 21 14:36:35 <johnx> yeah, no rush. :) finals done now?
Jan 21 14:38:21 <Stskeeps> one paper left but too sleepy to finish it right now
Jan 21 14:38:32 <Khertan_work> stskeeps: zode 11 ?
Jan 21 14:38:57 <Stskeeps> Khertan_work: hmm?
Jan 21 14:39:04 <wazd> back
Jan 21 14:39:04 <Stskeeps> Khertan_work: ah, yes
Jan 21 14:39:41 <Khertan_work> stskeeps, i'm a real fan of bsg
Jan 21 14:40:49 <Khertan_work> arg ! also on gnome svn doc is blank !
Jan 21 14:40:51 <Khertan_work> http://svn.gnome.org/viewvc/gtkhtml2/trunk/docs/
Jan 21 14:40:56 <Stskeeps> Khertan_work: maybe it's generated docs
Jan 21 14:41:45 <Stskeeps> oh ffs
Jan 21 14:41:55 <Stskeeps> 214b/s lag on ports.ubuntu.com is back
Jan 21 14:42:26 <johnx> heh, you'd be better off dialing into it if you could
Jan 21 14:42:33 <Khertan_work> stskeeps : i can't found any generated doc ... or other things
Jan 21 14:44:19 <Stskeeps> johnx: is your speed OK towards it?
Jan 21 14:44:20 <Khertan_work> from what i see there is no way to have a editable GtkHTML2 widget
Jan 21 14:44:25 <Khertan_work> pfff
Jan 21 14:44:35 <johnx> Stskeeps, I'll check
Jan 21 14:46:34 <Myrtti> *sigh*
Jan 21 14:47:38 <johnx> holy craps! plain vanilla open GL 2 drivers for the OMAP3 O_o
Jan 21 14:47:48 <Stskeeps> url?
Jan 21 14:47:54 <johnx> http://openpandora.wordpress.com/2009/01/21/opengl/
Jan 21 14:48:05 <GeneralAntilles> johnx, no, idiot bloggers. :P
Jan 21 14:48:17 <johnx> GeneralAntilles, this is different than yesterday I think
Jan 21 14:48:28 <Stskeeps> "or not"?
Jan 21 14:48:28 <Stskeeps> :P
Jan 21 14:48:34 <johnx> gaaah
Jan 21 14:48:36 <johnx> furk
Jan 21 14:49:24 <Stskeeps> johnx: if i patch sapwood will you test it?
Jan 21 14:49:34 <johnx> Stskeeps, yup :)
Jan 21 14:49:59 <johnx> BTW, was getting a decent connection to ports.u.c between 50KB/s and 150KB/s
Jan 21 14:50:07 <Stskeeps> mmk
Jan 21 14:50:26 <johnx> this whole pandora thing is like some kind of instructional demonstration of why you hire PR people
Jan 21 14:50:44 <aquatix> lol
Jan 21 14:52:48 <glass> hehe
Jan 21 14:53:28 <johnx> "A public service announcement funced by the Public Relations Workers' Union."
Jan 21 14:56:56 <RST38h> johnx: PR people will not save them
Jan 21 14:57:12 <glass> they already try way too much pr on their own
Jan 21 14:57:19 <johnx> RST38h, I still think they can pull it off
Jan 21 14:57:19 <RST38h> johnx: They needed people who could plan and had cool heads
Jan 21 14:57:30 <glass> should just get some devices out and not talk empty about quality of parts and shit like that
Jan 21 14:57:35 <RST38h> johnx: They probably can but by the time they do, the world will stop caring
Jan 21 14:57:40 <johnx> RST38h, yeah, they needed people who had experience, contacts and big money
Jan 21 14:58:03 <RST38h> glass: Maybe they hired Artemiy Lebedev for PR? =)
Jan 21 14:58:20 <RST38h> glass: I mean, this whole thing looks like the Optimus Maximus resurrected
Jan 21 14:58:26 <GeneralAntilles> Ha
Jan 21 14:58:38 <RST38h> johnx: No need for contacts or huge money
Jan 21 14:58:43 <johnx> RST38h, well hopefully it's not *that* bad to type on
Jan 21 14:58:57 <johnx> RST38h, the whole original problem was that they needed pre-order money to do their production run
Jan 21 14:58:57 <RST38h> johnx: Chinese will gladly do the work for them for relatively small sums (<1mil bucks)
Jan 21 14:59:16 <RST38h> johnx: Including the ee design and mechanical design
Jan 21 14:59:25 <johnx> yeah, they didn't have 1mil
Jan 21 14:59:36 <glass> RST38h: hehe
Jan 21 14:59:39 <RST38h> Then 100-300k will suffice but just barely
Jan 21 15:00:03 <johnx> maybe s/big money/some money/
Jan 21 15:00:05 <wazd> ICQ is down
Jan 21 15:00:07 <glass> RST38h: i think they've should've just made some dial with some chinafactory or htc or such for the production
Jan 21 15:00:08 <wazd> again
Jan 21 15:00:12 <glass> deal
Jan 21 15:00:17 <johnx> I think their multiple redesigns cause a serious hit
Jan 21 15:00:20 <glass> how the f i wrote dial..
Jan 21 15:00:22 <RST38h> glass: HTC would be too expensive
Jan 21 15:00:33 <RST38h> glass: But they could bag a smaller outfit, no problem there
Jan 21 15:01:17 <RST38h> That is not the problem though. The problem was that they were too loose mouthed. Talked a lot about their cool design process (making it look like they were doing it for the first time in their lives - NOT a good sign)
Jan 21 15:01:41 <glass> yeah
Jan 21 15:01:58 <Khertan_work> huh ?
Jan 21 15:01:59 <RST38h> Kept promising delivery real-soon-now. You can't keep promising this for too long
Jan 21 15:02:10 * Khertan_work just discover the existance of gtkhtml3
Jan 21 15:02:12 <glass> RST38h: and funding with pre-orders..
Jan 21 15:02:16 <johnx> yes, I would say a little more clue would have helped, but you get that through experience
Jan 21 15:02:20 <glass> RST38h: wouldn't pre order from guys like that
Jan 21 15:02:26 <glass> RST38h: i'd love to have the device probably though
Jan 21 15:02:28 <RST38h> glass: no sane person would
Jan 21 15:02:34 <johnx> <- dur
Jan 21 15:03:12 <RST38h> glass: Penguin worshippers are not sane people, but even for them one ripoff is usualyl enough to learn a lesson
Jan 21 15:03:35 <glass> RST38h: then they stop being worshippers :p  and start being practical/realistical
Jan 21 15:03:41 <johnx> I'm still waiting for the other shoe to drop :)
Jan 21 15:03:59 <johnx> the bad thing would be if I/we get proved right :P
Jan 21 15:05:32 <Khertan_work> apt-get search gtkmozembed
Jan 21 15:05:39 <Khertan_work> oups ... wrong window
Jan 21 15:05:53 <aquatix> :)
Jan 21 15:07:54 <Khertan_work> and gtkhtml3 exist but 1) No doc ... 2) No python binding
Jan 21 15:08:20 <Khertan_work> i m tired ... all of this for a stupid simple wyciwyg editor
Jan 21 15:08:32 * Khertan_work decide to do plain text only !
Jan 21 15:09:49 <radic> hi
Jan 21 15:10:04 <Stskeeps> lo
Jan 21 15:10:12 <radic> I've connected a USB-Stick to my N800 running os2008
Jan 21 15:10:16 <wazd> fucking icq, I hate them
Jan 21 15:10:26 <radic> I set it into hostmode but nothing happens
Jan 21 15:12:22 <johnx> radic, can you try a different usb stick?
Jan 21 15:13:07 <radic> johnx: no, but the mouse connectet trough a hub with power-supply dosn't work too
Jan 21 15:13:08 <GeneralAntilles> radic, powered hub?
Jan 21 15:13:29 <johnx> radic, well mice won't work
Jan 21 15:13:42 <johnx> I have one stick that tries to draw too much power and doesn't work
Jan 21 15:13:49 <johnx> the other one works
Jan 21 15:13:55 <radic> ok, IÃ'll try the cadreader
Jan 21 15:14:10 <aquatix> wazd: icq still works here
Jan 21 15:14:46 <Stskeeps> hm, does HAM only look at packages in its catalogues?
Jan 21 15:15:28 <johnx> ah, yes, that sounds right
Jan 21 15:15:37 <radic> hmm
Jan 21 15:16:02 <radic> Stskeeps: you are one of the unrealIRCd-coders?
Jan 21 15:16:51 <Stskeeps> radic: not anymore, but i started the project..
Jan 21 15:17:30 <Stskeeps> johnx: my scratchbox's acting up but i can give you a diff
Jan 21 15:17:37 <Stskeeps> if you have a compiling version ready
Jan 21 15:17:41 <johnx> yeah, that's fine
Jan 21 15:17:48 <johnx> lots of build machines here :)
Jan 21 15:18:16 <radic> johnx: I've now a stick, a mouse and the cardreader on the powered hub
Jan 21 15:18:22 <radic> nothing works
Jan 21 15:18:58 <johnx> do things light up like they're getting power?
Jan 21 15:19:13 <radic> no
Jan 21 15:20:27 <radic> in /sys/devices/platform/musb_hdrc/mode is "a_wait_bcon
Jan 21 15:20:31 <radic> +"
Jan 21 15:20:32 <johnx> did you ever try the stick directly?
Jan 21 15:20:37 <radic> yes
Jan 21 15:21:06 <Myrtti> GeneralAntilles: hola, you still there?
Jan 21 15:21:15 <Myrtti> (or any other wiki admin)
Jan 21 15:21:25 <Myrtti> oh
Jan 21 15:21:27 <Myrtti> wow
Jan 21 15:21:48 <Myrtti> GeneralAntilles: unpong
Jan 21 15:22:00 <GeneralAntilles> ;)
Jan 21 15:23:16 * Myrtti blinks
Jan 21 15:24:04 <Stskeeps> like a LED? :P
Jan 21 15:24:31 <X-Fade> Myrtti: A different world now, eh?
Jan 21 15:24:49 <Myrtti> indeed :-D
Jan 21 15:24:54 <Myrtti> I thought I was seeing things
Jan 21 15:26:06 <radic> I've now tested 3 sticks
Jan 21 15:26:07 <aquatix> Myrtti: easy on the coffee!
Jan 21 15:26:12 <radic> direct and at the hub
Jan 21 15:26:20 <radic> none worked
Jan 21 15:27:56 <Stskeeps> johnx: bzr lp:~carsten-munk/m-r/sapwood
Jan 21 15:27:57 <Stskeeps> has fix
Jan 21 15:28:24 <johnx> branching now
Jan 21 15:28:28 <Stskeeps> k
Jan 21 15:28:34 <Stskeeps> you can also just 'get' it
Jan 21 15:28:37 <RST38h> Wow, that Modest fix was *fast*
Jan 21 15:28:53 <Stskeeps> RST38h: maybe the modest developers are just waiting for stuff to do
Jan 21 15:29:07 <RST38h> General: Any chance we can get stuff like Modest committed to Extras-Devel before the official SSUs?
Jan 21 15:29:10 <johnx> exciting...something ate my boot menu :/
Jan 21 15:29:12 <RST38h> Sts: I doubt it =)
Jan 21 15:29:39 <Stskeeps> johnx: woops
Jan 21 15:29:40 <RST38h> Sts: There is SO much stuff to do there. For example, Modest still does not remember text zoom setting and does not allow to set the message font either
Jan 21 15:29:43 <Stskeeps> johnx: forgot to push it
Jan 21 15:29:50 <Stskeeps> pushed now
Jan 21 15:30:04 <RST38h> Sts: I have filed a bug for that a while ago, but it does not look like it will be fixed any time soon =(
Jan 21 15:30:04 <GeneralAntilles> RST38h, doubtful.
Jan 21 15:30:13 <GeneralAntilles> Not by Nokia, anyway.
Jan 21 15:30:17 <GeneralAntilles> You're welcome to upload it yourself.
Jan 21 15:30:25 <radic> why dose the flasher dosn't detect my N800?
Jan 21 15:30:36 <RST38h> General: I may try - just get the current trunk and compile it
Jan 21 15:30:37 <Stskeeps> radic: you have it in host mode? :P
Jan 21 15:30:49 <Stskeeps> (i dunno)
Jan 21 15:30:52 <radic> Stskeeps: yes
Jan 21 15:31:05 <GeneralAntilles> RST38h, beta releases have been discussed previously.
Jan 21 15:31:13 <GeneralAntilles> and Nokia seems to want to move in that direction.
Jan 21 15:31:20 <Stskeeps> RST38h: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~carsten-munk/m-r/sapwood/revision/177 <- looks reasonable?
Jan 21 15:31:29 <RST38h> General: For open sourced components, this can be done without Nokia
Jan 21 15:32:16 <GeneralAntilles> RST38h, but it'll be a lot less work for us if it's just a part of their workflow.
Jan 21 15:32:20 <RST38h> Sts: yea, that is it
Jan 21 15:32:25 <Stskeeps> alright
Jan 21 15:32:27 <GeneralAntilles> It also means we'll be tied a little more closely to their release cycles.
Jan 21 15:32:29 <Stskeeps> we'll test and forward to nokia
Jan 21 15:32:33 <GeneralAntilles> So have a better chance of getting bugs fixed.
Jan 21 15:32:37 <RST38h> General: In fact, this can be automated
Jan 21 15:33:12 <RST38h> General: A script can be written to go over open sourced components once a week, check for changes and if there are significant changes detected, build, package, upload to Extras-devel
Jan 21 15:33:29 <johnx> s/significant//
Jan 21 15:33:37 <RST38h> General: with a special postfix in the package name if needed, like -weekly"
Jan 21 15:33:38 <X-Fade> Mer will be better than Sardine ever was. (And it serves the same purpose)
Jan 21 15:33:50 <lcuk> radic, try this http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=25869
Jan 21 15:33:57 <lcuk> let me know if its similar
Jan 21 15:34:24 <johnx> X-Fade, only thing is that Mer isn't quite the same in some ways...
Jan 21 15:34:30 <RST38h> X-Fade: Well, we do not have fully functioning Mer right now, and even if we get it, I would still prefer to stay with the original Nokia firmware
Jan 21 15:34:54 <lcuk> x-fade :P mer is based on nokias stuff, if nokia starts pulling from mer whos pulling from nokia whos pulling from mer whos pulling from nokia whos .....
Jan 21 15:35:07 <RST38h> johnx: Not sure if you want new packages on just any changes though
Jan 21 15:35:09 <GeneralAntilles> Universe implodes.
Jan 21 15:35:10 <GeneralAntilles> Game over.
Jan 21 15:35:13 <X-Fade> RST38h: Sure, but there is currently no beta firmware from Nokia.
Jan 21 15:35:13 <Stskeeps> lcuk: but that's really how it is supposed to work though
Jan 21 15:35:31 <johnx> RST38h, so your script will have a grammar parser that reads changelogs? :P
Jan 21 15:35:34 <X-Fade> lcuk: That is called cooperation? Or synergy..
Jan 21 15:35:41 <RST38h> johnx: at least counts the lines :)
Jan 21 15:35:45 <Stskeeps> lcuk: we get loads of quality components from nokia, we provide fixes, alignment, spreading the maemo platform..
Jan 21 15:36:08 <RST38h> X-Fade: Yes, but as I understand, the current source code for open sourced Nokia components (like Modest) is available
Jan 21 15:36:10 <johnx> RST38h, thus that really simple one-line fix that saves it from crashing doesn't get to you?
Jan 21 15:36:21 <RST38h> X-Fade: So, checking it out and building betas is not impossible
Jan 21 15:36:23 <lcuk> x-fade, sure but it would be better having the principle nokians working directly on the new bits of mer at the same time the principle community people are so the work is not duplicated
Jan 21 15:36:27 <johnx> Stskeeps, alignment in more ways than one :D
Jan 21 15:36:49 <X-Fade> RST38h: No, but receiving it as binary installs makes it a lot easier for casual testers.
Jan 21 15:37:04 <Stskeeps> johnx: did we port modest yet? ;P
Jan 21 15:37:08 * lcuk casually tests mer whilst supping a beer
Jan 21 15:37:18 <X-Fade> lcuk: That is where real cooperation inside git.maemo.org come into place.
Jan 21 15:37:19 <RST38h> X-Fade: Well, we con upload compiled weekly betas as binary deb files to extras-devel
Jan 21 15:37:24 <johnx> Stskeeps, I heard mumblings about it on debian pkg-maemo
Jan 21 15:37:29 <radic> Is there a way to reset the lock-code?
Jan 21 15:37:30 <RST38h> s/con/can/
Jan 21 15:37:34 <johnx> we might want their packaging of it
Jan 21 15:37:35 <radic> I fergot it :(
Jan 21 15:37:35 <lcuk> X-Fade, :) 10000000% agree
Jan 21 15:37:47 <X-Fade> lcuk: Which will happen.
Jan 21 15:38:05 <RST38h> X-Fade: Then testing becomes easy
Jan 21 15:38:16 <Stskeeps> johnx: im just worried that'll strip conic and everything.
Jan 21 15:38:20 <Stskeeps> but thats me :P
Jan 21 15:38:32 <X-Fade> RST38h: True. That is what we can do with OSV-community-testing orso ;)
Jan 21 15:38:59 <johnx> Stskeeps, I'll look at it, but you're probably right. I guess using conic does get us better compatibility
Jan 21 15:39:06 <X-Fade> RST38h: I'll let that idea in the hands of GA.
Jan 21 15:39:10 <Stskeeps> johnx: we probably also need to adopt a policy on sb vs native.. i see sb building as an accelerator, not as a requirement
Jan 21 15:39:26 <lcuk> hurrray!
Jan 21 15:39:33 <lcuk> +9
Jan 21 15:39:53 <johnx> Stskeeps, that sounds reasonable. this might be crazy, but I was thinking about some tag in control, maybe: x-scratchbox-ok: yes
Jan 21 15:39:59 <Stskeeps> maybe
Jan 21 15:40:12 <RST38h> X-Fade: One note though; the install process will probably require displaying a message box saying that this is an unofficial external beta and Nokia has nothing to do with it
Jan 21 15:40:13 <johnx> the debian guys would probably just kill us O_o
Jan 21 15:40:31 <johnx> RST38h, H-A-M is real good at that already...
Jan 21 15:40:32 <Stskeeps> johnx: ten again this is a different field :P
Jan 21 15:40:50 <lcuk> RST38h, ALL of linux is an unofficial beta
Jan 21 15:41:09 <johnx> Stskeeps, I mean neither of us can *ever* go to debian conference for our sins against dpkg
Jan 21 15:41:38 <lcuk> personally i think the dpkg guys shouldnt go to conferences either ;)
Jan 21 15:41:54 <lcuk> installshield ftw :P
Jan 21 15:42:00 <johnx> O_O;
Jan 21 15:42:05 <qwerty12> RST38h, you'll have to get it to depend on osso-software-version-rx*4-unlocked. The fun part is how you can get the right one to install for the right device...
Jan 21 15:42:22 <qwerty12> lcuk, installshield is now a piece of shit wrapped around the more shittier windows installer
Jan 21 15:42:31 <r2d2rogers> hello #maemo
Jan 21 15:43:06 <johnx> lcuk, last time I checked installshield didn't have any ability to handle dependencies
Jan 21 15:43:42 <qwerty12> johnx, pretty sure that quite a few installs will ask you to download net framework for example
Jan 21 15:43:43 <lcuk> not at all, the windows installer is full of fun and shiny and since microsoft carefully upgraded it and maintained its sleek exterior and logical running to allow parallel app merging and an easy way to deploy your apps its never been so good
Jan 21 15:43:46 <StsN800> that's okay for me. i'd probably get in a fight with some gnubies anyway
Jan 21 15:43:47 * lcuk throws up a little
Jan 21 15:44:29 <qwerty12> lcuk, ever had a install interrupted? I still can't install office under vista because it's fucking up somewhere and I have to use it under vmware in xmp
Jan 21 15:44:29 <qwerty12> *xp
Jan 21 15:44:34 <StsN800> anyway, im gonna ns
Jan 21 15:44:36 <lcuk> yeah i know john, i fight with it quite often - its upto the IDE to give it a list of deps (just like dpkg but with a mouse click)
Jan 21 15:44:38 <johnx> StsN800, s/get in a fight with/crucified and hung on the wall by/
Jan 21 15:44:49 <lcuk> qwerty12, your problem is vista :P
Jan 21 15:45:07 <lcuk> anyway, for the uninitiated : i was joking, i frikkin hate is
Jan 21 15:45:10 <StsN800> nap 2 hrs to catch up on sleep - good luck with sapwood
Jan 21 15:45:17 <johnx> thanks
Jan 21 15:45:20 <qwerty12> lcuk, no, it's windows installer fucking up and not letting me uninstall it before I upgraded :P
Jan 21 15:45:22 <johnx> will tell you how it works out
Jan 21 15:45:54 <lcuk> sounds like my problem with apt
Jan 21 15:46:37 <johnx> lcuk, ah, poorly written .deb's can cause problems
Jan 21 15:47:00 <lcuk> just like poorly written windows installer programs
Jan 21 15:47:23 <lcuk> poorly written anything
Jan 21 15:47:41 <johnx> lcuk, so where is the nice apt-like repository of all the good free windows apps?
Jan 21 15:47:41 <qwerty12> windows installer is a shit hole, I honestly have more success installing more programs that use the old installshield from 95 era
Jan 21 15:48:02 <RST38h> lcuk: That is why I really prefer FreeBSD
Jan 21 15:48:11 <RST38h> lcuk: It is no beta. It is -STABLE :)
Jan 21 15:48:24 <lcuk> johnx, google is my apt, all checked and verified by the site themselves,  they even have little stickers guaranteeing virus free
Jan 21 15:48:38 <lcuk> RST38h, sounds like my sort of app :)
Jan 21 15:48:41 <RST38h> lcuk: But Ubuntu has done relatively good job at polishing Linux, it is pretty bearable now
Jan 21 15:49:11 <johnx> RST38h, except that lots of stuff in -STABLE ports just doesn't build...
Jan 21 15:49:46 <johnx> and I'm still unclear how freeBSD binary packages interact with ports...
Jan 21 15:49:51 <lcuk> RST38h, i am constantly surprised by the quality of linux whilst at the same time constantly shocked by the number of hoops you also have to jump through - simplicity is best for me
Jan 21 15:50:15 * lcuk installs sco unix
Jan 21 15:50:24 <Myrtti> ew
Jan 21 15:50:29 <qwerty12> /ignore lcuk
Jan 21 15:50:29 <lcuk> heh
Jan 21 15:50:36 <johnx> "Linux, making the impossible things hard and the easy things slightly more difficult."
Jan 21 15:50:45 <qwerty12> Where can I buy?
Jan 21 15:51:24 <johnx> at FTP-R-US
Jan 21 15:51:51 * qwerty12 googles and sees far manager. The memories...
Jan 21 15:52:22 <RST38h> johnx: Never had any of them fail really
Jan 21 15:52:31 <RST38h> johnx: But I am lazy, stupid, and thus prefer packages
Jan 21 15:52:37 <johnx> RST38h, I never had one succeed
Jan 21 15:52:57 <RST38h> johnx: Something in your setup was wrong. Probably wrong FTP server setting.
Jan 21 15:53:07 <johnx> nah, patches failing to apply
Jan 21 15:53:10 <johnx> configure failing
Jan 21 15:53:21 <RST38h> johnx: This is abnormal really
Jan 21 15:53:30 <johnx> I discovered the opposite
Jan 21 15:53:31 <RST38h> johnx: Some tweak broke something
Jan 21 15:53:39 <johnx> it was a fresh install of stable
Jan 21 15:54:07 <RST38h> lcuk: FreeBSD is very boring in that sense - once you set it up, it never ever fails. The opposite side is that a lot of cool flashy stuff is missing
Jan 21 15:54:46 <johnx> meh, I'll try it again one day and document what goes wrong
Jan 21 15:54:51 <RST38h> johnx: Either these guys screwed it after I installed it the last time, or there is something wrong =)
Jan 21 15:55:02 <johnx> so, there are binary packages of most things in ports?
Jan 21 15:55:12 <johnx> cause that sounds more like what I want
Jan 21 15:55:16 <RST38h> But we have -STABLE at komkon.org and it installs ports just fine
Jan 21 15:55:33 <RST38h> johnx: Yep - run /stand/sysinstall and got to Postinstall Config -> packages
Jan 21 15:55:45 <johnx> I'll just do that instead
Jan 21 15:56:21 <johnx> it was mostly GUI stuff that was failing
Jan 21 15:56:41 <johnx> but it's not like wmaker for example is a moving target...
Jan 21 15:58:18 <X-Fade> Pilot wants to have dinner at home ;)
Jan 21 15:58:39 <X-Fade> Hmm wrong window :)
Jan 21 15:58:55 <johnx> oh no! it's the go-code from Nokia!
Jan 21 15:59:20 <johnx> (how do I respond?!) the monkeys are in the yard and the cake is ready
Jan 21 16:01:27 <GeneralAntilles> Execute order 66!
Jan 21 16:03:22 <johnx> opcode not supported: Segmentation Fault
Jan 21 16:04:08 <Stskeeps> sapwood?
Jan 21 16:04:21 <andre__> Garr. Thank you Scratchbox for crashing my system.
Jan 21 16:04:32 <RST38h> mifki is selling his N810. Does it mean no more WebKit-based browser plugin?
Jan 21 16:04:33 <johnx> Stskeeps, works great
Jan 21 16:04:52 <johnx> RST38h, thanks again for the fix.
Jan 21 16:05:00 <RST38h> [mechanically] 0x66 is an instruction prefix in x86.
Jan 21 16:05:09 <Stskeeps> johnx: built fine? and works
Jan 21 16:05:11 <Stskeeps> ?
Jan 21 16:05:28 <johnx> yup and yup
Jan 21 16:05:32 <RST38h> johnx: [wondering how many more fragments like this are out there in Maemo]
Jan 21 16:05:45 <johnx> RST38h, not a lot as AFAIK
Jan 21 16:05:52 <Stskeeps> isnt there a gcc -W to  deetect it?
Jan 21 16:06:08 <RST38h> Sts: Nope
Jan 21 16:06:12 <Stskeeps> k
Jan 21 16:06:22 <johnx> for most of this they should have been somewhat focused on armv5 compatibility
Jan 21 16:06:30 <RST38h> Sts: When you are doing a cast, C assumes you know what you are doing
Jan 21 16:06:40 <Stskeeps> true
Jan 21 16:06:52 * RST38h loves the explanation why ARM fixed it in ARMV6 though
Jan 21 16:07:07 <johnx> RST38h, what was it? "better performance"?
Jan 21 16:07:12 <RST38h> johnx: No :)
Jan 21 16:07:26 <Stskeeps> RST38h: patch is the url earlier if you want to include it in bug report
Jan 21 16:07:30 <johnx> RST38h, Maemo 4 compatibility? :D
Jan 21 16:07:38 <Stskeeps> r2d2rogers: ping
Jan 21 16:07:43 <RST38h> More and more ARM chips started coming with DSPs and DSPs operate on streams of 16bit values
Jan 21 16:07:59 <RST38h> So, reading a misaligned stream suddenly became an issue
Jan 21 16:08:11 <johnx> RST38h, ahaha. so they figured people would be making dumb mistakes? or is it unavoidable?
Jan 21 16:08:16 <RST38h> Sts: Just post that URL into the bug tracker
Jan 21 16:08:25 <RST38h> johnx: It is unavoidable
Jan 21 16:08:45 <RST38h> johnx: You have got a stream of compressed data from somewhere and you have no idea how values will be aligned in that stream
Jan 21 16:09:36 <RST38h> johnx: Aligning it manually becomes a bottleneck
Jan 21 16:09:53 <Stskeeps> johnx: think r2d2rogers should test it and then we build -mer2
Jan 21 16:10:12 <johnx> Stskeeps, sounds like a plan :)
Jan 21 16:10:19 <johnx> r2d2rogers, we have something awesome for you :)
Jan 21 16:10:41 <johnx> s/awesome/unbroken/
Jan 21 16:14:38 <r2d2rogers> johnx: hullo ;)
Jan 21 16:14:49 <kozak> Hi all
Jan 21 16:15:01 <johnx> hey r2d2rogers. I have a build of sapwood for you to try, courtesy of Stskeeps and RST38h :)
Jan 21 16:15:07 <r2d2rogers> \o/
Jan 21 16:15:44 <r2d2rogers> johnx, dev770 up and ready, apt-get updated
Jan 21 16:16:00 <johnx> ok, will upload in a sec
Jan 21 16:16:32 <Myrtti> whee
Jan 21 16:16:58 <johnx> uploading...
Jan 21 16:20:54 * Stskeeps waits eagerly
Jan 21 16:21:05 <r2d2rogers> rebooting
Jan 21 16:22:13 <Stskeeps> starting with auto-startx/start-hildon i presume?
Jan 21 16:22:28 <johnx> ah, need to test my changes to that :)
Jan 21 16:22:41 <r2d2rogers> yes, for  a user r2d2rogers, not root or user
Jan 21 16:22:46 <Stskeeps> k
Jan 21 16:23:22 <r2d2rogers> desktop menu and applet menus work
Jan 21 16:23:32 <johnx> and they look 'right'?
Jan 21 16:23:46 <r2d2rogers> application menu comes up but doesn't list the apps in extras
Jan 21 16:24:12 <r2d2rogers> they look better than before
Jan 21 16:24:27 <r2d2rogers> getting screenshot
Jan 21 16:24:34 <johnx> do you have the load applet?
Jan 21 16:24:40 <r2d2rogers> yup
Jan 21 16:24:46 <r2d2rogers> on light grey background
Jan 21 16:25:00 <johnx> can you get a screenshot of list processes too?
Jan 21 16:25:11 <r2d2rogers> should be able to
Jan 21 16:26:18 <r2d2rogers> wait, I am getting the icons in extras now
Jan 21 16:26:46 <johnx> haha! woo
Jan 21 16:27:16 <radic> yeahh, I found my lost lock-code in /dev/mtd1
Jan 21 16:28:18 <r2d2rogers> http://handhelds.org/scap/port.22122.png
Jan 21 16:28:42 <johnx> errr...are you sure sapwood is running?
Jan 21 16:29:00 <johnx> did you possibly disable it?
Jan 21 16:29:13 <r2d2rogers> I just reenabled it I thought...
Jan 21 16:29:15 <r2d2rogers> checking
Jan 21 16:29:27 <johnx> ah, nm, see it in the screenshot :)
Jan 21 16:29:29 <Jaffa> re
Jan 21 16:29:29 <johnx> odd
Jan 21 16:29:29 <r2d2rogers> http://handhelds.org/scap/port.22161.png
Jan 21 16:29:48 <johnx> well this is even weirder...
Jan 21 16:30:03 <johnx> hi Jaffa
Jan 21 16:30:12 <Proteous> even more weirder
Jan 21 16:30:23 <r2d2rogers> I can re run start hildon manually?
Jan 21 16:30:38 <Jaffa> Stskeeps: when I first ran HAM it picked up the repos from /etc/apt/sources.list in its catalogues list.
Jan 21 16:30:54 <Stskeeps> r2d2rogers: swap enabled and such?
Jan 21 16:30:59 <Jaffa> Stskeeps: you may need to do the "assume-connection 1" trick, if libconic is reporting always disconnected
Jan 21 16:31:11 <Stskeeps> r2d2rogers: try yeah
Jan 21 16:31:17 <r2d2rogers> Swap:   265064k total,    14520k used,   250544k free,    21252k cached
Jan 21 16:31:22 <r2d2rogers> from top
Jan 21 16:31:53 <Stskeeps> r2d2rogers: dist-upgraded too?
Jan 21 16:32:00 <r2d2rogers> yup
Jan 21 16:32:14 <Stskeeps> hmm
Jan 21 16:32:43 <Stskeeps> put xsession-errors somewhere
Jan 21 16:33:00 <Stskeeps> johnx, yours show gfx fine?
Jan 21 16:33:09 <r2d2rogers> wilco, waiting for double check on update & dist-upgrade
Jan 21 16:33:29 <johnx> Stskeeps, it did. I'm rebooting to make sure there wasn't a running sapwood-server
Jan 21 16:36:06 <Stskeeps> im gonna collapse in bed a bit
Jan 21 16:36:08 <Stskeeps> bbl
Jan 21 16:36:43 <Stskeeps> my hypothesis is some strange collision of theming stuff
Jan 21 16:36:57 <johnx> Stskeeps, sleep :P
Jan 21 16:38:31 <johnx> still works fine here
Jan 21 16:38:35 <johnx> *shrug*
Jan 21 16:38:48 <r2d2rogers> I jsut add public_html on trac.tspre to get a web readable dir?
Jan 21 16:38:59 <r2d2rogers> was  planning to reimage today anyhow...
Jan 21 16:39:13 <slonopotamus> hmm... gpe is dead?
Jan 21 16:39:34 <johnx> slonopotamus, gpe-pim or the whole desktop project?
Jan 21 16:39:47 <slonopotamus> last news from their site is September 01 2005
Jan 21 16:39:56 <johnx> slonopotamus, that's the wrong site :)
Jan 21 16:39:58 <slonopotamus> johnx, whole project
Jan 21 16:40:08 <b1ackdeath> any any one recomend a way for me to monitor how much trafic i use on my ppp0 connection
Jan 21 16:40:17 <slonopotamus> that's the one that google knows
Jan 21 16:40:31 <johnx> slonopotamus, http://gpe.linuxtogo.org/
Jan 21 16:40:43 <johnx> their old site was somewhat hijacked it appears
Jan 21 16:41:49 <slonopotamus> that's better :)
Jan 21 16:44:33 <dob> Trying to install Mer on N800, getting "Unable to install merinstaller. Incompatible application package." Now what?
Jan 21 16:45:02 <johnx> dob, could you try installing it with dpkg ?
Jan 21 16:45:40 <dob> johnx: ok, I'll try that
Jan 21 16:47:06 <johnx> you're using the latest release of diablo, right?
Jan 21 16:47:21 <qwerty12> The section is missing a user/
Jan 21 16:47:37 <Jaffa> Presumably the end-user release will include user/?
Jan 21 16:47:43 <Jaffa> Who's doing merinstaller? Meiz_n810?
Jan 21 16:48:43 <qwerty12> b-man
Jan 21 16:51:38 <dob> johnx: 5.2008.43-7, right?
Jan 21 16:51:47 <johnx> yeah, just checking
Jan 21 16:52:14 <Jaffa> qwerty12: ta
Jan 21 16:54:33 <dob> johnx: ok, I had to -f install e2fsprogs zenity gnutar to get merinstaller to install
Jan 21 16:55:20 <johnx> dob, ok, thanks for the info. I'll poke at b-man next time he's around :)
Jan 21 16:56:15 <radic> hmm
Jan 21 16:56:49 <radic> If I connect my USB-hub then I get the message that the hub isn't supported
Jan 21 16:56:51 <GeneralAntilles> Anybody have a guess at this one? https://wiki.maemo.org/index.php?title=Knots&curid=1414&diff=9958&oldid=9868&rcid=9961
Jan 21 16:57:01 <GeneralAntilles> Should I just revert it, or is there a reason it should be wget?
Jan 21 16:57:05 <radic> If I connect the stick directly it works
Jan 21 16:58:06 <Jaffa> GeneralAntilles: where's maemo-mini-curl come from?
Jan 21 16:58:32 <qwerty12> GeneralAntilles, the "maemo-mini-curl http://nakkiboso.com/knots/dl.php?file=client" doesn't work even if I fix the command line.
Jan 21 16:58:57 <qwerty12> Jaffa, comes with OS2008, part of apt-https
Jan 21 16:59:22 <GeneralAntilles> Jaffa, it's bundled.
Jan 21 16:59:28 <GeneralAntilles> qwerty12, doesn't work?
Jan 21 16:59:30 <Jaffa> Ah, wow.
Jan 21 17:00:01 <qwerty12> GeneralAntilles, nope. Even if I use -o <whatever I want to call it>
Jan 21 17:00:10 <dob> GeneralAntilles: doesn't curl just dump to stdout? I'd guess wget is correct
Jan 21 17:01:21 <qwerty12> maemo-mini-curl won't save automatically with the correct file name - you have to enter it manually. So assuming that solmumaha updates that link from time to time, it'd always have some other name. Wget is the way to go.
Jan 21 17:01:40 <GeneralAntilles> Ah
Jan 21 17:01:51 <GeneralAntilles> dob, well, wget isn't bundled
Jan 21 17:01:54 <GeneralAntilles> maemo-mini-curl is.
Jan 21 17:02:00 <GeneralAntilles> So it saves a step when it works.
Jan 21 17:07:15 <r2d2rogers> johnx: I'm seeing "unable to locate theme engine" messages in xsession-errors
Jan 21 17:07:48 <johnx> now that's odd
Jan 21 17:09:03 <johnx> does it say what theme engine it's looking for?
Jan 21 17:09:16 <r2d2rogers> "sapwood"
Jan 21 17:09:24 <r2d2rogers> nm-applet[2040]: GLIB WARNING ** Gtk - Unable to locate theme engine in module_path: "sapwood",
Jan 21 17:09:53 <r2d2rogers> johnx: wouldn't that be /usr/lib/gtk-2.0/2.10.0/engines/libsapwood.so
Jan 21 17:09:54 <r2d2rogers> ?
Jan 21 17:09:55 <johnx> could you do this: ls maemo-mini-curl http://nakkiboso.com/knots/dl.php?file=client
Jan 21 17:10:01 <johnx> errr.
Jan 21 17:10:05 <johnx> stupid paste buffer
Jan 21 17:10:08 <r2d2rogers> <G>
Jan 21 17:10:11 <johnx> ls /usr/lib/gtk-2.0/2.10.0/engines/libsapwood.so
Jan 21 17:10:17 <johnx> <- late o'clock
Jan 21 17:10:26 <r2d2rogers> ;)
Jan 21 17:10:58 <r2d2rogers> johnx: is there is permission 644
Jan 21 17:11:13 <johnx> same here
Jan 21 17:11:46 <johnx> sorry, no idea right now
Jan 21 17:11:56 <r2d2rogers> no worries
Jan 21 17:12:03 <r2d2rogers> just making sure I'm not missing obvious
Jan 21 17:12:04 <johnx> I think this will work once we sort out why it won't load for you
Jan 21 17:12:20 <r2d2rogers> I think I'll try a fresh image in the mean time
Jan 21 17:12:30 <johnx> might be a good idea
Jan 21 17:12:31 <r2d2rogers> give sts time for a good nap <G>
Jan 21 17:12:38 <johnx> I'm gonna catch some sleep too
Jan 21 17:12:45 <r2d2rogers> g'night johnx
Jan 21 17:12:50 <johnx> 'night r2d2rogers
Jan 21 17:13:07 <johnx> back in ~6-8 hours
Jan 21 17:36:35 * Guest90884 [W2I=000:u:0:000:]
Jan 21 17:36:48 <Khertan_n810> hi
Jan 21 17:37:05 <Khertan_n810> my nit crash three time without any reason
Jan 21 17:37:10 <Khertan_n810> and reboot after
Jan 21 17:37:29 <Khertan_n810> how can i understand wh i get this crash ?
Jan 21 17:38:07 <Khertan_n810> the third it was just after hildon-desktop finish loading
Jan 21 17:39:13 <Khertan_n810> i get a fade out display and bump nokia logo
Jan 21 17:41:48 <Khertan_n810> ping ?
Jan 21 17:42:40 <Khertan_n810>  cat /proc/bootreason > 32wd_to
Jan 21 17:42:47 <TheFatal> take a look... http://www.engadget.com/2007/06/08/ebs-menlow-based-mimd-umpc-remembers-to-bring-the-sexy/
Jan 21 17:42:58 <dob> X-Fade: I noticed a repo, that's not on your list, in the wiki: https://wiki.maemo.org/Knots#Ruby_for_Maemo_OS2008
Jan 21 17:46:05 <Khertan_n810> since to be related to watchdog
Jan 21 17:46:15 <GeneralAntilles> dob, Ruby's in Extras.
Jan 21 17:46:26 <Khertan_n810> what watchdog do
Jan 21 17:46:28 <Khertan_n810> ?
Jan 21 17:46:28 <GeneralAntilles> dob, our goal is to discourage more 3rd-party repos, not encourage them, anyway.
Jan 21 17:47:08 <GeneralAntilles> http://wiki.maemo.org/Reporting_reboot_issues
Jan 21 17:47:15 <GeneralAntilles> http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/maemo/developers/30750
Jan 21 17:48:47 <Khertan_n810> something strange too is that the screen luminosity go more and more low each minute
Jan 21 17:48:56 <Khertan_n810> thx gan
Jan 21 17:53:35 <Khertan_n810> its a good start
Jan 21 17:53:56 <GeneralAntilles> Khertan_n810, personally, I'm in favor of the hitting-it-with-a-stick method. ;)
Jan 21 17:53:58 <Khertan_n810> someone know what is the purpose of '/usr/sbin/dsp_dld' ?
Jan 21 17:54:34 <GeneralAntilles> dld
Jan 21 17:54:37 <GeneralAntilles> Dynamic load?
Jan 21 17:54:50 <qwerty12> "dsp_dld performs dynamic loading of tasks into the DSP of the OMAP platform and loads tasks on demand"
Jan 21 17:54:52 <GeneralAntilles> Yeah, http://gforge.embedded.ufcg.edu.br/projects/dspdld/
Jan 21 17:55:00 <GeneralAntilles> lardman|gone is gone
Jan 21 17:55:32 <dob> GeneralAntilles: are you sure it's there? I can't find it.
Jan 21 17:55:39 <Khertan_n810> hum ...
Jan 21 17:55:46 <Khertan_n810> strange ...
Jan 21 17:55:49 <dob> GeneralAntilles: also, I meant that perhaps the repo owner should be contacted to have it closed.
Jan 21 17:56:01 <Khertan_n810> it look li;ke more and more an hw problem
Jan 21 17:56:03 <GeneralAntilles> dob, thought it was, but I guess not yet.
Jan 21 17:56:09 <GeneralAntilles> dob, ah, right, that list.
Jan 21 17:56:12 * GeneralAntilles was confused.
Jan 21 17:56:18 <GeneralAntilles> Apologies, dob. ;)
Jan 21 17:56:23 <dob> GeneralAntilles: X-Fade has another list? :)
Jan 21 17:56:40 <GeneralAntilles> dob, well, there are several lists on a number of different Maemo-related wikis, so. . . .
Jan 21 17:56:56 <GeneralAntilles> Anyway, it's alterego that's doing the maemo-ruby stuff.
Jan 21 17:57:03 <GeneralAntilles> He was going to upload it to Extras a couple weeks ago
Jan 21 17:57:10 <GeneralAntilles> But I guess he never got around to it.
Jan 21 17:57:31 <Khertan_n810> do you hear of problem with advanced backlight ?
Jan 21 17:57:37 <dob> GeneralAntilles: oh, sorry for the ambiguity :)
Jan 21 17:57:45 <GeneralAntilles> dob, he was just here, too. . . .
Jan 21 17:57:55 <GeneralAntilles> Um, I'll prod him for a status update next time I see him.
Jan 21 17:58:04 <GeneralAntilles> Khertan_n810, what sort of problem?
Jan 21 17:58:06 <dob> ok, thanks
Jan 21 17:58:51 <Khertan_n810> gan> screen luminosity going more and more low every minute
Jan 21 17:59:53 <Khertan_n810> (as nit restart and restart without any reason)
Jan 21 18:00:14 <Khertan_n810> (sorry for short message
Jan 21 18:01:05 <lcuk> Khertan_n810, are you on it now?
Jan 21 18:02:31 * GeneralAntilles can't decide what to make for dinner.
Jan 21 18:02:52 <qwerty12> hash brownies
Jan 21 18:03:27 <GeneralAntilles> qwerty12, well, I've got brownies anyway. :P
Jan 21 18:03:38 <qwerty12> So bring them to life :P
Jan 21 18:03:41 * Guest90884 [W2I=000:u:0:000:]
Jan 21 18:04:03 <Khertan_n810> no i m on it
Jan 21 18:04:08 <Khertan_n810>  s/no/now
Jan 21 18:04:45 <Khertan_n810> dmesg have plenty of 'DSP Pausing failed'
Jan 21 18:04:55 * qwerty12 goes and hildonizes epdfview. I need a light pdf viewer that is better than the built in one and less whorish than evince
Jan 21 18:06:06 <lcuk> Khertan_n810, oooer, do you listen to music?
Jan 21 18:06:13 <lcuk> have you installed anything new last few days?
Jan 21 18:06:18 <lcuk> have you dropped it ( :O )
Jan 21 18:06:18 <Khertan_n810> nope
Jan 21 18:06:37 <Khertan_n810> and no mp3 on the card
Jan 21 18:06:39 <Khertan_n810> nope ... hometool
Jan 21 18:07:06 <Khertan_n810> yep i ve dropped it since sdcard failed and not reloaded it on it
Jan 21 18:07:15 <lcuk> oooer
Jan 21 18:07:22 <lcuk> crap, reallife
Jan 21 18:08:31 <Khertan_n810> i got also since 3 days some freeze of the nit during 1ts or 30s
Jan 21 18:08:33 <Khertan_n810> witghout
Jan 21 18:08:41 <Khertan_n810> any reason
Jan 21 18:08:43 <Khertan_n810> but i use this new version of hometool since 2 weeks so ... i don t understand
Jan 21 18:08:55 <Khertan_n810> yep
Jan 21 18:09:15 <Khertan_n810> real life
Jan 21 18:10:56 <Khertan_n810> hum ... loadavg 9.04
Jan 21 18:11:51 <lcuk_mashingpota> have you installed vista on it?
Jan 21 18:12:25 <woglinde> he lcuk
Jan 21 18:12:30 <woglinde> give me some bacon
Jan 21 18:12:55 <lcuk_boilingkett> sorry, its mash n chicken grillsteaks and peas tonight :)
Jan 21 18:13:43 <Khertan_n810> does an sdcard corrupted can cause a device reboot ?
Jan 21 18:14:01 <lcuk> depends whether software tries writing to it?
Jan 21 18:14:16 <lcuk> or if your virtual memory is on it
Jan 21 18:14:31 <Khertan_n810> vm is on internal
Jan 21 18:15:08 <lcuk> dunno then, does mcal point its data onto mmc1 and try to autosync to it?
Jan 21 18:15:19 <lcuk> or any other apps
Jan 21 18:15:30 <Khertan_n810> nope mcal autosync it disabled :)
Jan 21 18:15:41 <lcuk> is this the same sdcard that didnt like to be frozen btw?
Jan 21 18:16:06 <lcuk> crap, better dash anyway before the cats eat my chicken
Jan 21 18:16:07 <Khertan_n810> and after a reboot only metalawtyerr-crappy-crawler is running
Jan 21 18:16:24 <Khertan_n810> but was formatted since
Jan 21 18:16:28 <Khertan_n810> lcuk: yep the same ...
Jan 21 18:16:33 <Khertan_n810> i ll go on too
Jan 21 18:16:41 <Khertan_n810> bye and thx for help
Jan 21 18:28:45 <solca> GeneralAntilles: I don't care that you consider NITdroid stupid, measured by it's success many people don't think the same, nice way to be in the "community council chair" !!
Jan 21 18:29:20 <GeneralAntilles> solca, don't take it personally.
Jan 21 18:29:25 <GeneralAntilles> It's an impressive accomplishmentI
Jan 21 18:29:31 <GeneralAntilles> I just don't like Android.
Jan 21 18:29:35 <GeneralAntilles> There's nothing more to it than that.
Jan 21 18:31:14 <solca> GeneralAntilles: attacking NITdroid is a different thing that you don't like Android
Jan 21 18:31:30 <solca> GeneralAntilles: as I said I don't care what you said anymore
Jan 21 18:31:33 <solca> GeneralAntilles: EOT
Jan 21 18:31:44 * GeneralAntilles shrugs.
Jan 21 18:31:58 <GeneralAntilles> You can hardly take something I say and twist it then refuse to hear me out.
Jan 21 18:32:00 <GeneralAntilles> But fine.
Jan 21 18:36:27 <RST38h> hehe, ICQ is yet again screwing up people
Jan 21 18:36:40 <lcuk> solca, since you know a bit about android, can i install maemo on the g1?
Jan 21 18:36:56 <GeneralAntilles> RST38h, I'm surprised people use it.
Jan 21 18:37:01 <GeneralAntilles> Is it popular over there or something?
Jan 21 18:37:08 <lcuk> its been popular for a while
Jan 21 18:37:15 <qwerty12> Apart from Russians, I've never seen anyone else use it.
Jan 21 18:37:16 <RST38h> General: it has got the cloud
Jan 21 18:37:31 <RST38h> General: At least in .RU and .IL dunno about the rest of the world
Jan 21 18:37:35 <GeneralAntilles> I recall it being popular around 2001 or 2002 when I last used it.
Jan 21 18:37:45 <GeneralAntilles> I haven't seen anybody use it since.
Jan 21 18:38:05 <RST38h> General: Written by Israelis of Russian descent in VB (or so rumors say). Initially used IRC network for handshaking.
Jan 21 18:38:11 <Java08523> is there any site with tutorial on Maemo SDK?
Jan 21 18:38:21 <RST38h> General: Royally pissed off IRC admins at that time
Jan 21 18:38:40 <RST38h> General: Got sold to AOL at some point, I think
Jan 21 18:39:36 <RST38h> General: The official client is an evil monstrosity written in Java and looking like a flashing, rainbowing, blinking LSD hallucination
Jan 21 18:40:09 <RST38h> (of course, nobody uses it, so no ad revenue, so AOL is really disappointed now)
Jan 21 18:41:09 <solca> lcuk: I don't think so, in any case not in the G1 but probably the ADP1
Jan 21 18:41:12 <GeneralAntilles> Jake42-2, http://maemo.org/development
Jan 21 18:41:17 <luke-jr> wtf
Jan 21 18:41:29 <solca> lcuk: and not Maemo but something more like Mer
Jan 21 18:41:30 <luke-jr> ICQ used to be *the* *only* IM program/service
Jan 21 18:42:26 <GeneralAntilles> luke-jr, where and when?
Jan 21 18:42:33 <luke-jr> like 10 years ago
Jan 21 18:42:35 <luke-jr> maybe a little longer
Jan 21 18:42:59 <lcuk> whats wrong with the g1?  i thought it was meant to be an open phone?
Jan 21 18:43:07 <GeneralAntilles> lcuk, pfft.
Jan 21 18:43:10 <GeneralAntilles> "Open"
Jan 21 18:43:13 <luke-jr> lcuk: from the sound of it, it's just expensive
Jan 21 18:43:21 <RST38h> luke is essentially right
Jan 21 18:43:22 <GeneralAntilles> luke-jr, where?
Jan 21 18:43:29 <luke-jr> GeneralAntilles: ?
Jan 21 18:43:34 <RST38h> there was IRC. then there was ICQ. and then there was everything else.
Jan 21 18:43:37 <GeneralAntilles> Geography has a lot to do with perceived popularity.
Jan 21 18:43:41 <woglinde> G1 is not open
Jan 21 18:43:42 <luke-jr> RST38h: IRC is MUC, not IM
Jan 21 18:43:49 <RST38h> General: this statement is not geography specific
Jan 21 18:43:58 <GeneralAntilles> I was using AIM in 1999.
Jan 21 18:44:13 <lcuk> but but but android is open, how can you put something open on something closed without closing it
Jan 21 18:44:15 <luke-jr> I was using Excite! PAL in… 1995?
Jan 21 18:44:17 * lcuk asplodes
Jan 21 18:44:17 <RST38h> General: ICQ existed before that, circa 1995-1996 I think
Jan 21 18:44:27 <GeneralAntilles> RST38h, 1996.
Jan 21 18:44:28 <luke-jr> lcuk: bootloader requires a signature
Jan 21 18:44:35 <solca> lcuk: the G1's bootloader check for signed images
Jan 21 18:44:37 <GeneralAntilles> RST38h, but luke-jr said 10 years ago.
Jan 21 18:44:40 <lcuk> isnt that available in the android source?
Jan 21 18:44:50 <solca> lcuk: although it can be hacked easily
Jan 21 18:44:51 <mgedmin> lcuk: there's a completely open version of the G1 called the android dev phone, iirc
Jan 21 18:44:53 <luke-jr> lcuk: it should be, but you'll need to prove it in court
Jan 21 18:45:01 <RST38h> General: Well, 10 years ago is 1999, so ICQ satisfies.
Jan 21 18:45:03 <solca> lcuk: the ADP1 doesn't require signed images
Jan 21 18:45:03 <mgedmin> http://code.google.com/intl/lt/android/dev-devices.html
Jan 21 18:45:12 <GeneralAntilles> lcuk, surely you're being facetious?
Jan 21 18:45:14 <lcuk> solca, im not asking about the adp1
Jan 21 18:45:22 <GeneralAntilles> RST38h, not from my experience at the time
Jan 21 18:45:23 <GeneralAntilles> But so be it.
Jan 21 18:45:27 <lcuk> no GeneralAntilles im serious, i want mer/maemo on the g1
Jan 21 18:45:30 <luke-jr> anyhow, real problem with Android:
Jan 21 18:45:32 <luke-jr> it's pro-Java
Jan 21 18:45:36 <RST38h> Android's top honcho just left google for coupons.com
Jan 21 18:45:38 <RST38h> hehe
Jan 21 18:46:00 <mgedmin> android is very "let's avoid GPL so that people can build closed versions of our stuff"
Jan 21 18:46:04 <luke-jr> does anyone but me remember Excite! PAL?
Jan 21 18:46:16 <lcuk> mgedmin, but its built on a gpl framework
Jan 21 18:46:18 <solca> lcuk: adp1 = g1 except bootloader
Jan 21 18:46:24 <RST38h> mgedmin: this has nothing to do with android being java only though
Jan 21 18:46:34 <lcuk> solca, but i want my friends to be able to install it
Jan 21 18:47:01 <mavhc> android is open, g1 isn't, simple
Jan 21 18:47:02 <lcuk> if we get a kickass mer/maemo distro going i wanna shout from the rooftops
Jan 21 18:47:13 <RST38h> mgedmin: and based on a "let us call all the usual stuff with new names" framework =)
Jan 21 18:47:15 <lcuk> but it can be hacked open?
Jan 21 18:47:30 <solca> lcuk: it would be a nice project to port Mer to G1, it just needs developer man power
Jan 21 18:47:33 <luke-jr> lcuk: do you volunteer to reverse engineer the battery blob?
Jan 21 18:47:40 <mgedmin> I've heard of people jail-breaking the g1
Jan 21 18:47:40 <RST38h> lcuk: Judging from the bug it had where whatever you typed went straight to a root shell in the background, yes =)
Jan 21 18:48:05 <GeneralAntilles> luke-jr, how is that relevant to Maemo on the G1?
Jan 21 18:48:13 <lcuk> i find it incredible that you haveto jailbreak the linux os
Jan 21 18:48:21 <GeneralAntilles> lcuk, then you're being naive. ;)
Jan 21 18:48:23 <luke-jr> GeneralAntilles: it's relevant to a Free Maemo OS in general
Jan 21 18:48:30 <mgedmin> that was one of the arguments FSF had for GPL v3
Jan 21 18:48:34 <GeneralAntilles> luke-jr, oh, right, zealotry.
Jan 21 18:52:02 <lcuk> GeneralAntilles, its called debate
Jan 21 18:53:32 <luke-jr> how big is the battery blob anyhow?
Jan 21 18:53:46 <lcuk> cant be that big, its only a small phone
Jan 21 18:53:53 <GeneralAntilles> luke-jr, it's hardly relevant to Maemo as an OS, anyway.
Jan 21 18:54:04 <solca> lcuk: oh and I almost forgot, Maemo could never be ported to other devices per the proprietary software
Jan 21 18:54:13 <luke-jr> lcuk: referring to a blob on N810
Jan 21 18:54:48 <lcuk> solca, i know default maemo couldnt, but mer is on the right track and we never know - it could form the basis for a new better primary maemo
Jan 21 18:56:00 <solca> lcuk: Mer could but without the propietary parts is very hard for just a few devels
Jan 21 18:56:12 <solca> lcuk: at least Android is completely open in all aspects
Jan 21 18:57:10 <lcuk> could i put my liqbase on it?
Jan 21 18:57:39 * solca searching info for liqbase
Jan 21 18:57:55 <lcuk> http://maemo.org/downloads/product/OS2008/liqbase/     http://liqbase.net/
Jan 21 18:57:59 <lcuk> save you the hassle
Jan 21 18:58:27 <lardman> morning :)
Jan 21 18:58:42 <lcuk> heh i see your pills are in full effect again lardman
Jan 21 18:58:58 * qwerty12_N800 passes lardman a watch ;P
Jan 21 18:58:59 <GeneralAntilles> Hi, lardman.
Jan 21 18:59:07 * lcuk passes lardman hair of the dog
Jan 21 18:59:25 <lardman> well chaps, I've been working solidly (i.e. no interweb) all day
Jan 21 18:59:32 <lardman> so it's internet morning for me ;)
Jan 21 18:59:45 <solca> lcuk: nice project, it is open source?
Jan 21 18:59:51 <lcuk> yes
Jan 21 18:59:55 <lardman> ooo, supper's up, bbiab
Jan 21 18:59:58 <lcuk> and very very fast :)
Jan 21 19:00:04 <lcuk> lardman, BREAKFAST
Jan 21 19:00:13 <lardman|eating> :p
Jan 21 19:00:58 <lcuk> solca, yes very much so - and very efficent and fast on any platform with x11+xv graphics
Jan 21 19:01:33 <lcuk> its wrote in c, i gather i can just reinstall and run on android?
Jan 21 19:01:47 <lcuk> recompile^
Jan 21 19:02:11 <solca> lcuk: it could run if it doesn't depend on x11
Jan 21 19:02:22 <woglinde> lcuk no
Jan 21 19:02:31 <lcuk> what graphics do i need?
Jan 21 19:02:33 <woglinde> android has no X11
Jan 21 19:02:37 <lcuk> ill refactor if required
Jan 21 19:02:55 <solca> lcuk: if it could rewriten in skia...
Jan 21 19:03:04 <lcuk> skia?
Jan 21 19:03:28 <lcuk> i gather you mean the graphics lib and not the font :D
Jan 21 19:03:50 <solca> I didn't know there was a font with that name... :p
Jan 21 19:03:56 <woglinde> lcuk hm I guess they are using framebuffer
Jan 21 19:04:13 <lcuk> solca, does skia support YUV graphics?
Jan 21 19:04:21 <lcuk> well wikipedia tells me thats what skia is
Jan 21 19:04:26 <lcuk> with a bootnote about the lib
Jan 21 19:05:01 <solca> lcuk: no idea but I think it would be nice to have on Android, but it would run "fullscreen"
Jan 21 19:05:18 <solca> I have never used liqbase so I don't know if that's a factor tho
Jan 21 19:12:06 <lcuk> solca, :) maybe you should, its nice and the next version will be even better
Jan 21 19:12:23 <lcuk> can i send my kids to siberia?  jakes just blocked the toilet
Jan 21 19:13:02 <lcuk> and solca liqbase runs at fullscreen on this device for now anyway so thats not a problem ;)
Jan 21 19:14:04 <woglinde> lcuk what should your kids do in seberia, freezing?
Jan 21 19:14:27 <timeless> anyone here *not* have skype installed on their tablet?
Jan 21 19:15:16 <lcuk> woglinde, anything they want.  as long as i dont have to use a coat hanger to fish out half a loo roll from the toilet i will be happy
Jan 21 19:15:20 <lcuk> timeless, no
Jan 21 19:15:33 <woglinde> hm
Jan 21 19:15:35 <GeneralAntilles> timeless, no Skype.
Jan 21 19:15:40 <woglinde> I dont use skype
Jan 21 19:16:10 <Jaffa> timeless: I don't. Built in call s/w works for the rare (late nights at work) times I want to video call my wife/son/daughter on their tablet
Jan 21 19:16:18 <timeless> GeneralAntilles: i need someone to try clicking on skype, letting it try to install and tell me if they see "%s successfully installed. Launch application?"
Jan 21 19:16:26 <timeless> (%s would be replaced w/ something, not sure what)
Jan 21 19:16:44 <GeneralAntilles> A Skype installer .desktop I do not have.
Jan 21 19:16:45 <timeless> after that you can uninstall skype
Jan 21 19:16:54 <timeless> um, rhapsody maybe?
Jan 21 19:16:59 * timeless shrugs
Jan 21 19:17:03 <GeneralAntilles> Not that, either.
Jan 21 19:17:03 <timeless> any of the adware nokia apps
Jan 21 19:17:07 <GeneralAntilles> But I've got the installer still.
Jan 21 19:17:45 <timeless> well errm, could you find out if that does it?
Jan 21 19:17:48 <timeless> i'm not picky
Jan 21 19:17:49 <keesj> lcuk: did you compare liqbase xv and  SDL or similar?
Jan 21 19:17:55 <Jaffa> timeless: Click entry in menu, it says "Install Skype?". app Mgr loading...
Jan 21 19:17:56 <timeless> the string comes from application manager
Jan 21 19:17:59 <GeneralAntilles> Installing. . . .
Jan 21 19:18:14 <Pavlz> i have flashed the nokia 770 this morning
Jan 21 19:18:29 <timeless> http://mxr.maemo.org/diablo/source/hildon-application-manager-l10n-public-5.0+r6160/po/en_GB.po?mark=1049-1051#1040
Jan 21 19:18:41 <timeless> (for people playing along at home)
Jan 21 19:18:55 <Pavlz> now i tried to use the shell
Jan 21 19:19:09 <Pavlz> of nokia 770
Jan 21 19:19:16 * Jaffa twiddles thumbs "preparing installation"
Jan 21 19:19:28 <Pavlz> and when i digit
Jan 21 19:19:34 <GeneralAntilles> Gave me "skype successfully installed" and nothing more.
Jan 21 19:19:35 <Pavlz> sudo gainroot
Jan 21 19:20:24 <Pavlz> it replies me to enable R&D
Jan 21 19:20:46 <timeless> pavlz: install an sshd instead
Jan 21 19:20:54 <timeless> or find one of the other rooters
Jan 21 19:21:10 <lcuk> keesj, yeah, sdl tears horribly
Jan 21 19:21:13 <Jaffa> "Installing Skype"
Jan 21 19:21:19 <lcuk> i started my journey there :)
Jan 21 19:21:31 <GeneralAntilles> qwerty12_N800, why didn't you name it Roto-Rooter? :(
Jan 21 19:21:33 <Jaffa> timeless: easiest way is one of the pkgs in Extras
Jan 21 19:21:38 <lcuk> well, technically i started with pygtk
Jan 21 19:21:40 <Jaffa> EULA...
Jan 21 19:21:45 <Pavlz> and it does not change the $ of user in # of root
Jan 21 19:21:46 <lcuk> but thats not exactly graphics
Jan 21 19:22:06 <Pavlz> where i find ssh ?
Jan 21 19:22:07 <Jaffa> "Installing _s_kype", sorry. Miscapitalisation there
Jan 21 19:22:15 <keesj> http://mxr.maemo.org/diablo/source/hildon-application-manager-l10n-public-5.0+r6160/po/en_GB.po?mark=1049-1051#1040
Jan 21 19:22:21 <qwerty12_N800> GeneralAntilles, because I sucked @ packaging then :P
Jan 21 19:22:28 <Jaffa> Pavlz: http://wiki.maemo.org/Root_access
Jan 21 19:22:31 <keesj> lcuk: but performance?
Jan 21 19:23:05 <Jaffa> timeless: same as GeneralAntilles: "skype installed" Nowt else
Jan 21 19:23:08 <lcuk> keesj, define performance, i get 27fps fullscreen tearfree 800*480 updates - can sdl match?
Jan 21 19:23:17 <timeless> ok
Jan 21 19:23:25 <PaulAnagrama> hi
Jan 21 19:23:30 <luke-jr> uh
Jan 21 19:23:33 <timeless> could someone figure out if that string i mentioned is used somewhere? :(
Jan 21 19:23:40 <luke-jr> Jaffa: what's wrong with sudo -i -H?
Jan 21 19:23:48 <keesj> performance: workable UI with no anoying delays
Jan 21 19:24:06 <Jaffa> timeless: poke me later when I'm at my desktop with the HAM src checked out on
Jan 21 19:24:13 <PaulAnagrama> does anyone know if the wayfinder licensing server is down?
Jan 21 19:24:22 <Jaffa> luke-jr: that it won't work OOB on Maemo?
Jan 21 19:24:22 <lcuk> keesj, you've seen liqbase (at linuxtag first) its evolved lots since then, get it on your 8x0 and try it :)
Jan 21 19:24:23 <qwerty12_N800> luke-jr, have you actually tried that on a stock tablet?
Jan 21 19:24:49 <luke-jr> qwerty12_N800: no, but I'd be glad to if you send me one ;)
Jan 21 19:25:10 <lcuk> since the summit ive been working towards making it a library (so i can put my apps on it) and its faster than anything else out there
Jan 21 19:25:29 <Jaffa> GeneralAntilles: http://www.flegg.org/~andrew/mer-ham-03.png shows the grid view in mer, and the "bundle everything into Other" if it isn't a defined thing. Extras never looked so good
Jan 21 19:25:42 <keesj> lcuk: I do use it quite often I don't know if its the latsest version or not.
Jan 21 19:25:56 <lcuk> probably is, ive only technically released one version
Jan 21 19:26:00 <qwerty12_N800> luke-jr, nah, no point in doing something that has no benefits for me and knowing it won't work without installing sudser anyway ;)
Jan 21 19:26:36 <keesj> I only use my n800 as my n810's touch screen is f*cked up
Jan 21 19:26:51 <lcuk> ive reorganised it all into a nice little library now and just wiring through everything :) i have the main parts of the UI ive wanted for a while
Jan 21 19:26:55 <luke-jr> keesj: configure the keypad as a mouse? ☺
Jan 21 19:26:55 <keesj> I do get weird artifacts quite often
Jan 21 19:27:09 <GeneralAntilles> Jaffa, yeah, that's nice.
Jan 21 19:27:25 <GeneralAntilles> Jaffa, we need some of the alternate category views, now, too.
Jan 21 19:27:26 <keesj> luke-jr: it send mouse events every now and then
Jan 21 19:27:38 <Jaffa> GeneralAntilles: aye
Jan 21 19:28:07 <keesj> timeless: that http://mxr.maemo.org/ is quilte usefull
Jan 21 19:28:14 <GeneralAntilles> keesj, display cable coming loose?
Jan 21 19:28:17 * Jaffa homes
Jan 21 19:28:22 <woglinde> bye jaffa
Jan 21 19:28:27 <lcuk> cya jaffa
Jan 21 19:28:29 <Jaffa> bbl
Jan 21 19:28:30 * GeneralAntilles deploys flares.
Jan 21 19:28:34 <timeless> keesj: it'd have fremantle too
Jan 21 19:28:44 <timeless> but IT took away network access for my internal box
Jan 21 19:29:42 <lcuk> timeless, i thought you were entirely digital until we sat down in berlin
Jan 21 19:29:55 <keesj> GeneralAntilles: nop. the problem is commonly called forks or KIDS
Jan 21 19:30:26 <Pavlz> what is the passwd of nokia 770 when it came flashed ?
Jan 21 19:31:54 <timeless> rootme
Jan 21 19:32:03 <keesj> I wonder if the n800 screen and the n810 screens can be interchanged
Jan 21 19:32:17 <qwerty12_N800> different connectors
Jan 21 19:32:36 <GeneralAntilles> ^
Jan 21 19:32:36 <timeless> ok, next question
Jan 21 19:32:46 <timeless> would you say "remove application" or "uninstall application"?
Jan 21 19:32:52 <timeless> and once that's done
Jan 21 19:33:01 <GeneralAntilles> Remove
Jan 21 19:33:03 <timeless> would you say "application removed" or "application uninstalled"
Jan 21 19:33:05 <timeless> ok
Jan 21 19:33:18 <GeneralAntilles> Uninstall leads to uninstallable.
Jan 21 19:33:45 <timeless> 130 # List item in the main view
Jan 21 19:33:45 <timeless> 131 msgid "ai_li_uninstall"
Jan 21 19:33:45 <timeless> 132 msgstr "Show installed applications"
Jan 21 19:33:55 * timeless grumbles
Jan 21 19:34:04 <timeless> totally broken logical ids
Jan 21 19:34:23 <timeless> perhaps i should have one bug for them
Jan 21 19:36:50 <Pavlz> it is not rootme
Jan 21 19:37:02 <timeless> 596 msgid "ai_fi_details_packages_uninstall"
Jan 21 19:37:02 <timeless> 597 msgstr " Application packages to remove:"
Jan 21 19:37:12 <timeless> amusingly enough, we arne't consistent about using the word "uninstall"
Jan 21 19:37:14 * timeless grumbles
Jan 21 19:37:41 <Pavlz> i tried to change with passwd
Jan 21 19:37:51 <Pavlz> nothing to do
Jan 21 19:38:05 <timeless> 1238 msgid "ai_ni_error_uninstallation_failed"
Jan 21 19:38:05 <timeless> 1239 msgstr "Unable to uninstall %s"
Jan 21 19:38:16 <timeless> you were talking about uninstallable. uninstallation is my favorite :)
Jan 21 19:50:48 <timeless> help
Jan 21 19:50:55 <timeless> would someone please translate this into English:
Jan 21 19:50:55 <timeless> 933 # Confirmation note shown to the user when s/he has selected a catalogue to be deleted from the list
Jan 21 19:50:55 <timeless> 934 msgid "ai_nc_remove_repository"
Jan 21 19:50:55 <timeless> 935 msgstr ""
Jan 21 19:50:55 <timeless> 936 "Delete catalogue?\n"
Jan 21 19:50:56 <timeless> 937 "Package list originating from this catalogue will also be deleted."
Jan 21 19:51:23 <aquatix> erm
Jan 21 19:51:37 <aquatix> looks English to me?
Jan 21 19:51:38 <timeless> in case you're curious: that is *NOT* English
Jan 21 19:51:46 <aquatix> ah
Jan 21 19:51:57 <timeless> it's words which independently can be found in a British dictionary
Jan 21 19:52:04 <aquatix> :)
Jan 21 19:52:26 <Stskeeps> timeless: speaking of strings, any good reason why perfectly good msgids have been stripped from various l10n packages? (if you know, that is), https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=4001
Jan 21 19:52:35 <timeless> however, selecting random sets of words won't always get you valid (or meaningful) sentences,
Jan 21 19:52:36 <Stskeeps> sfil_li_modified_today is really a wonder to me
Jan 21 19:52:56 <aquatix> timeless: talking about line 937?
Jan 21 19:52:58 <timeless> stskeeps: having had a very very bad run in w/ the internal localizers today/yesterday
Jan 21 19:53:04 <timeless> i'm staying very far away from them
Jan 21 19:53:11 <Stskeeps> ah, gang of thugs ;)
Jan 21 19:53:51 <timeless> fwiw, internally fremantle shows all sorts of id's in all sorts of places
Jan 21 19:53:54 <timeless> it's sorta par for the course
Jan 21 19:54:10 * timeless also got yelled at for filing a bug a week before the localization shipped w/ the predictably buggy string
Jan 21 19:54:30 * timeless got a very very bad thrashing for yelling back
Jan 21 19:54:46 <aquatix> aww
Jan 21 19:54:53 <timeless> it could mean i leave nokia :)
Jan 21 19:54:54 <aquatix> yelling back++
Jan 21 19:54:56 <timeless> i'd be much happier
Jan 21 19:55:01 <aquatix> oh?
Jan 21 19:55:05 <aquatix> hm
Jan 21 19:55:07 <timeless> not currently planned, but
Jan 21 19:55:19 <timeless> it's only half in my control
Jan 21 19:55:21 <qwerty12_N800> bribin' dem with vodka++
Jan 21 19:55:30 <herzi> can someone privmsg me his wifi-mac of the n810? http://tablets-dev.nokia.com/nokia_N810.php somehow doesn't accept mine...
Jan 21 19:55:34 <timeless> if i get upset again, they could conceivably (and justifiably) fire me
Jan 21 19:55:50 <timeless> herzi: please call nokia care
Jan 21 19:55:57 <timeless> you can use skype to call the us 800 number
Jan 21 19:56:06 <timeless> (if you can't reach some other nokia care number)
Jan 21 19:56:20 <timeless> herzi: complaints about those things should be made as soon as possible through proper channels
Jan 21 19:56:35 <timeless> (and no, people should not message you the wifi mac)
Jan 21 19:56:53 <timeless> but yes, complaining to nokia care can and should work
Jan 21 19:57:00 <timeless> and some of us (e.g. me) really do read nokia care feedback
Jan 21 19:57:27 * timeless puts down the corporate citizen hat
Jan 21 19:57:54 <timeless> re 4001, i have the fremantle string table maximized behind this chat window
Jan 21 19:58:04 <timeless> and at least some of the examples are definitely present
Jan 21 19:58:20 <timeless> the short answer is "we didn't get localizations until this week, and the beta shipped before then"
Jan 21 19:58:59 <Stskeeps> ah.
Jan 21 19:59:07 * timeless will comment in the bug
Jan 21 20:00:38 <GeneralAntilles> Oh god
Jan 21 20:00:39 <suihkulokki> herzi: fwiw if you have a prototype, you should ask whoever gave you the proto for firmware updates
Jan 21 20:00:40 <GeneralAntilles> "s/he"
Jan 21 20:00:41 <herzi> calling...
Jan 21 20:00:47 * timeless nods
Jan 21 20:00:47 <GeneralAntilles> Please tell me they're kidding. . . .
Jan 21 20:00:53 <timeless> welcome to my workld
Jan 21 20:00:55 <herzi> suihkulokki: it's not a proto, it's a sales device
Jan 21 20:01:03 <herzi> calling anyway...
Jan 21 20:01:12 * timeless likes that typo
Jan 21 20:01:31 <aquatix> that's not a typo
Jan 21 20:01:56 <aquatix> oh, your typo
Jan 21 20:01:58 <aquatix> meh
Jan 21 20:02:00 <aquatix> :)
Jan 21 20:02:27 <timeless> ok, so there were two bug numbers i was supposed to look at
Jan 21 20:02:34 * timeless dealt w/ 4001
Jan 21 20:02:55 <GeneralAntilles> timeless, I'd kill myself if I had to fight over shit like that frequently.
Jan 21 20:03:02 <timeless> yes, 937
Jan 21 20:03:14 <Stskeeps> timeless: ah, thanks for that input - glad we're in same boat :)
Jan 21 20:03:16 <timeless> generalantilles: i only have to do it ~100 times per product cycle
Jan 21 20:03:29 <timeless> and yes, it looks like i can get myself fired for caring
Jan 21 20:03:41 <GeneralAntilles> Well, that's not surprising.
Jan 21 20:04:03 <aquatix> http://share.ovi.com/media/yerga.Hildonwidgets/yerga.11985 <- is that a popup?
Jan 21 20:04:21 <aquatix> oh, file chooser, hm
Jan 21 20:04:21 <Stskeeps> that's a file chooser
Jan 21 20:04:38 <aquatix> it somehow looked part of the appmanager
Jan 21 20:04:44 * aquatix should read captions ;)
Jan 21 20:05:29 <GeneralAntilles> Shipping things to the billing address instead of the shipping address is always appreciated.
Jan 21 20:05:55 <timeless> right, so did someone have a fix for 937?
Jan 21 20:05:57 <aquatix> GeneralAntilles: ah, shipping fsckups?
Jan 21 20:06:03 <herzi> and noone was able to help on the phone line
Jan 21 20:06:20 <aquatix> timeless: add "The" in front?
Jan 21 20:06:25 * herzi hardcodes the glib-version-dependecy of his package now to the old version
Jan 21 20:06:31 <timeless> aquatix: no fair
Jan 21 20:06:42 <GeneralAntilles> aquatix, apparently.
Jan 21 20:06:49 * GeneralAntilles wants his USB Model M. :(
Jan 21 20:06:52 <timeless> fixing a sentence by adding an article because the native finnish speaker never learned to use articles
Jan 21 20:07:09 <aquatix> :)
Jan 21 20:07:20 <aquatix> GeneralAntilles: aww :/
Jan 21 20:08:09 <aquatix> timeless: doesn't nokia have a british person for such translations?
Jan 21 20:08:15 * timeless rotfl
Jan 21 20:08:26 <timeless> or crying?
Jan 21 20:08:35 * aquatix guesses the answer
Jan 21 20:08:40 <timeless> i'm not sure quite how much dirty laundry i want to air in one day
Jan 21 20:08:50 <timeless> and i'm not sure i'm allowed to talk about certain subjects
Jan 21 20:08:56 <timeless> but can we stick to the facts?
Jan 21 20:09:02 <timeless> the urls i'm quoting are from Diablo
Jan 21 20:09:10 <timeless> and they almost certainly existed in the 770's original release
Jan 21 20:09:20 <timeless> that means there were 4+ product cycles containing them
Jan 21 20:09:29 <timeless> i'll let those facts speak for themselves
Jan 21 20:09:40 <aquatix> ouch
Jan 21 20:09:51 <aquatix> (I missed you quoting them?)
Jan 21 20:09:55 <lcuk> timeless, very easy to do - better to leave code alone and without complaints than dive in and change things willy nilly.
Jan 21 20:09:59 <lcuk> basic business logic
Jan 21 20:10:10 <timeless> http://mxr.maemo.org/diablo/source/hildon-application-manager-l10n-public-5.0+r6160/po/en_GB.po?mark=933-937#900
Jan 21 20:10:14 * aquatix likes messing around with code ;0
Jan 21 20:10:15 <aquatix> ;)
Jan 21 20:10:41 <lcuk> even though ive spent the last however many years poring over the codebase at work we still find some doozy things
Jan 21 20:10:51 <timeless> anyway...
Jan 21 20:11:04 * timeless ponders just adding the article (The)
Jan 21 20:11:19 <timeless> ok, so fwiw, here's why i didn't just autocorrect w/ that
Jan 21 20:11:23 <aquatix> timeless: that makes it a valid sentence i think
Jan 21 20:11:28 <timeless> the problem is, do you as a user know what a package list is?
Jan 21 20:11:32 <timeless> yeah, it does
Jan 21 20:11:37 <aquatix> ah right
Jan 21 20:11:37 <Stskeeps> timeless: my gf consistently messes up with 'the' as well (polish descent)
Jan 21 20:11:51 <timeless> there are two parts to localization
Jan 21 20:11:56 <timeless> 1. make sure it's a valid sentence
Jan 21 20:11:59 <aquatix> well, you see it skipped like this often in computer context
Jan 21 20:12:03 <timeless> 2. make sure your target audience will understand it
Jan 21 20:12:32 <aquatix> timeless: is "package list" mentioned in the same app?
Jan 21 20:12:40 <avs> I just have to tell this now: I was leafing through Compute!'s Gazette (the C=64 mag) when I was a small kid, before I learned English at school. So I was constantly asking my parents what it says in there. My father told me to "figure it out myself", so I went to my mom asking what "the" means
Jan 21 20:12:49 <avs> her answer, "it's the definite article", did not help me much
Jan 21 20:12:55 <aquatix> *g*
Jan 21 20:13:00 <timeless> aquatix: have you loaded that url?
Jan 21 20:13:05 <timeless> it contains all strings used in the app
Jan 21 20:13:31 <timeless> avs: heh
Jan 21 20:13:57 <aquatix> timeless: it generally talks about applications
Jan 21 20:14:03 <aquatix> and "software" now and then
Jan 21 20:14:28 <aquatix> so maybe "937 "The Application list originating from this catalogue will also be deleted."  is better?
Jan 21 20:14:38 <timeless> don't worry about the number
Jan 21 20:14:47 <timeless> that's just the cross reference helping others :)
Jan 21 20:14:59 <aquatix> yeah, was just copy/pasting it ;)
Jan 21 20:15:15 <timeless> Applications offered by this catalog* will no longer be available.
Jan 21 20:15:16 <timeless> ?
Jan 21 20:15:34 <timeless> note: i'm en-US, so I don't like catalogue :), but i'll write the proper thing in the end
Jan 21 20:15:35 <Stskeeps> catalogue?
Jan 21 20:15:38 <aquatix> ah, it has sentences like  "Application packages to install" too
Jan 21 20:15:43 <Stskeeps> but yes, that string sounds more sane
Jan 21 20:15:52 <aquatix> timeless: this is _GB ;)
Jan 21 20:15:58 <timeless> yeah, application packages
Jan 21 20:16:06 <timeless> aquatix: i know. but i still personally write en-US
Jan 21 20:16:12 <timeless> ok
Jan 21 20:16:16 * aquatix prefers _GB, but that aside
Jan 21 20:16:21 <timeless> Application packages offered by this catalogue will no longer be available.
Jan 21 20:16:22 <timeless> ?
Jan 21 20:16:30 <RST38h> 68000
Jan 21 20:16:40 <aquatix> hm
Jan 21 20:16:42 * RST38h hates it now.
Jan 21 20:16:55 <aquatix> timeless: won't that be confusing?
Jan 21 20:17:04 <timeless> ?
Jan 21 20:17:05 <aquatix> a user might think it uninstalls the packages too then
Jan 21 20:17:22 <timeless> 'offered'
Jan 21 20:17:29 <aquatix> yeah
Jan 21 20:17:29 <timeless> hrm 'available from' ?
Jan 21 20:17:49 <timeless> Application packages available from this catalogue will no longer be available for installation.
Jan 21 20:17:58 <timeless> no, that uses 'available' twice
Jan 21 20:17:59 <aquatix> or say ".. available for installation or upgrading"
Jan 21 20:18:00 <aquatix> yeah
Jan 21 20:18:04 <aquatix> heh
Jan 21 20:18:10 <aquatix> just skip the first "available"
Jan 21 20:18:18 <aquatix> erm
Jan 21 20:18:29 <timeless> Application packages offered by this catalogue will no longer be available for installation and upgrades.
Jan 21 20:18:31 <aquatix> "Application packages offered by this catalogue will no longer be available for installation or upgrading"
Jan 21 20:18:32 <GeneralAntilles> "Application packages offered by this catalogue will no longer be available for installation"?
Jan 21 20:18:34 <aquatix> ?
Jan 21 20:18:35 <aquatix> yeah
Jan 21 20:18:39 <aquatix> timeless: yours
Jan 21 20:18:48 <GeneralAntilles> Hehe
Jan 21 20:18:54 <aquatix> :)
Jan 21 20:19:11 <aquatix> timeless: i think that makes it clear
Jan 21 20:19:19 <Stskeeps> i vote for app_manager_removing_catalogue. let the user look it up in the manual what it means
Jan 21 20:19:22 <Stskeeps> :P
Jan 21 20:19:24 <aquatix> as the applications themself stay installed of course
Jan 21 20:19:24 <Stskeeps> ;)
Jan 21 20:19:28 <aquatix> Stskeeps: :P
Jan 21 20:19:41 <timeless> stskeeps: we actually shipped diablo w/ some unlocalized things
Jan 21 20:19:44 * timeless can't remember where they were
Jan 21 20:20:02 <aquatix> ah, app_manager_dont_use_this_itll_kill_your_mother ?
Jan 21 20:20:13 <herzi> okay, my app crashes when shutting down, is there a way to debug this using gdb? or look at a core dump file?
Jan 21 20:20:36 <herzi> Stskeeps: ping
Jan 21 20:20:36 <timeless> herzi: mkdir /media/mmc1/core-dumps
Jan 21 20:20:51 <Stskeeps> yeah, what timeless said
Jan 21 20:21:09 <Stskeeps> (or mmc2, look at sysctl -a | grep core-dumps)
Jan 21 20:21:16 <herzi> Stskeeps: I almost fixed your first sapwood issue (the inf-loop-on-short-request)
Jan 21 20:21:59 <timeless> /proc/sys/kernel/core_pattern
Jan 21 20:22:00 <Stskeeps> herzi: i'm glad to hear that :) - we have a patch for the alignment issue now, tested on zaurus but waiting out on 770 testing (other reasons we think)
Jan 21 20:22:34 <herzi> Stskeeps: I sold my n770, otherwise I'd happily test it there
Jan 21 20:22:40 <Stskeeps> herzi: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~carsten-munk/m-r/sapwood/revision/177
Jan 21 20:23:01 <Stskeeps> we'd very much like to support the 770's too, so that's why we're a bit engaged in the bugs
Jan 21 20:24:01 <herzi> Stskeeps: don't mind, I still have the plan to keep sapwood # of reported bugs as close to 0 as possible
Jan 21 20:24:24 <Stskeeps> hehe, i think these two are about the only two directly encountered :)
Jan 21 20:24:27 <herzi> but of course, if nokia want's something urgently, they have precendence
Jan 21 20:24:31 <Stskeeps> obviously
Jan 21 20:24:45 <herzi> there was another one in the public bug tracker some time ago, I think
Jan 21 20:27:27 <dneary> Minutes from the web design meeting away
Jan 21 20:28:21 * Stskeeps notes to himself he really needs to get the 19" touchscreen in his office working..
Jan 21 20:28:27 <timeless> ok, since we're filing bugs against all these strings
Jan 21 20:28:42 <timeless> http://mxr.maemo.org/diablo/source/hildon-application-manager-l10n-public-5.0+r6160/po/en_GB.po?mark=883-888#870
Jan 21 20:28:49 <timeless> "
Jan 21 20:28:49 <timeless> Device will restart after installation and all applications will be closed.\n
Jan 21 20:28:49 <timeless> Do not use the device during this time.\n
Jan 21 20:28:49 <timeless> Creating backup is recommended."
Jan 21 20:28:52 <timeless> ---
Jan 21 20:29:05 <timeless> am i alone in thinking this thing didn't make sense?
Jan 21 20:29:13 <Stskeeps> timeless: i was thinking of yoda a bit :)
Jan 21 20:29:36 <timeless> i have a replacement, so think about it a bit, and then tell me when you want to see the replacement
Jan 21 20:30:56 <timeless> actually
Jan 21 20:31:00 <timeless> has anyone ever gotten that message?
Jan 21 20:31:14 <timeless> because... i haven't, so i don't actually know what it does
Jan 21 20:31:16 <lcuk> Updating your computer is almost computer is almost complete. You must restart your computer for the updates to take effect. Do you want to restart your computer now?
Jan 21 20:31:21 <timeless> i'm just betting it doesn't do what it says it will do
Jan 21 20:31:38 <lcuk> -doubling ;)
Jan 21 20:31:40 <qwerty12_N800> it comes when updating via ssu iirc
Jan 21 20:31:45 <timeless> yeah, it should
Jan 21 20:31:46 <r2d2rogers> Stskeeps: awaiting the imaging now
Jan 21 20:31:53 <timeless> that little i can infer from the message
Jan 21 20:31:53 <GeneralAntilles> I just click through everything in h-a-m these days.
Jan 21 20:31:59 <timeless> but the question is...
Jan 21 20:32:06 <timeless> does it close your apps before or after it reboots
Jan 21 20:32:10 <timeless> if after, why?
Jan 21 20:32:16 <timeless> or how
Jan 21 20:32:17 <timeless> :)
Jan 21 20:32:19 <Stskeeps> r2d2rogers: alright
Jan 21 20:32:48 * GeneralAntilles sighs @ https://wiki.maemo.org/Booting_from_a_flash_card_770_version
Jan 21 20:33:39 <GeneralAntilles> We don't need a 770 version
Jan 21 20:33:51 <GeneralAntilles> as the regular version should work fine with the 770.
Jan 21 20:35:05 <timeless> right... so
Jan 21 20:35:13 <timeless> am i wrong in thinking that the apps close before it reboots? :)
Jan 21 20:36:17 * aquatix misses the part where it makes me coffee
Jan 21 20:36:23 <GeneralAntilles> Probably.
Jan 21 20:36:30 <GeneralAntilles> But with Nokia you could never be sure.
Jan 21 20:36:31 <timeless> i'm probably wrong? :(
Jan 21 20:36:34 <timeless> lol
Jan 21 20:36:37 <aquatix> timeless: it implies the wrong order
Jan 21 20:36:44 <timeless> good
Jan 21 20:36:46 <timeless> bug filing in 3.2..
Jan 21 20:36:50 <aquatix> but it's also just a warning
Jan 21 20:36:54 <Stskeeps> a reboot normally implies it'll close the applications ;)
Jan 21 20:37:03 <timeless> yah think?
Jan 21 20:37:05 <Stskeeps> as in, they cease to exist :>
Jan 21 20:37:10 <aquatix> like "Device will restart after installation; mind that all applications will be closed"
Jan 21 20:37:11 <timeless> i think actually that what it does is:
Jan 21 20:37:14 <timeless> 1. kill everything
Jan 21 20:37:17 <timeless> 2. update junk
Jan 21 20:37:18 <timeless> 3. reboot
Jan 21 20:37:21 <timeless> 4. update more junk
Jan 21 20:37:26 <timeless> but what it implies is:
Jan 21 20:37:28 <timeless> 1. update junk
Jan 21 20:37:31 <timeless> 2. reboot
Jan 21 20:37:34 <timeless> 3. kill everything
Jan 21 20:37:46 <aquatix> the killing is done by rebooting?
Jan 21 20:37:55 <GeneralAntilles> Can't we just skip the boring stuff and go to "kill everything"? :)
Jan 21 20:37:57 <timeless> anyway, feel free to browse the last couple of bugs filed in bugs.maemo.org
Jan 21 20:37:58 <GeneralAntilles> https://wiki.maemo.org/Talk:Booting_from_a_flash_card_770_version <- thoughts.
Jan 21 20:38:01 <aquatix> it could be correct
Jan 21 20:38:08 <aquatix> as you can update while stuff is runnnig
Jan 21 20:38:16 <timeless> this is for an osupdate_Restart
Jan 21 20:38:22 <timeless> so i highly doubt it's correct
Jan 21 20:38:29 <aquatix> GeneralAntilles: was thinking of "kill everyone" rather
Jan 21 20:38:30 <timeless> it'd be nice if someone actually paid attn when they got that dialog
Jan 21 20:38:33 <qwerty12_N800> Apps programmed to listen to quit events using libosso get closed before the update starts
Jan 21 20:38:49 <aquatix> timeless: it's a dialog, why would they pay attention?
Jan 21 20:38:50 <timeless> qwerty: cool, that's precisely what i was looking for
Jan 21 20:38:58 <aquatix> timeless: just bash "Yes" or "OK"
Jan 21 20:39:21 <aquatix> qwerty12_N800: erm, isn't that a tad geeky?
Jan 21 20:39:29 <GeneralAntilles> aquatix, ah, right. That. Thanks. :D
Jan 21 20:39:32 <aquatix> now users go "WTF is libosso"
Jan 21 20:39:38 <timeless> ok, next
Jan 21 20:39:39 <timeless> http://mxr.maemo.org/diablo/source/hildon-application-manager-l10n-public-5.0+r6160/po/en_GB.po?mark=838-840#820
Jan 21 20:39:46 <aquatix> or maybe i should just go get some sleep
Jan 21 20:39:57 <timeless> 840 msgstr "Certificate name is invalid or does not match the name of the server"
Jan 21 20:40:08 <timeless> can someone suggest what it would mean for a certificate name to be invalid? :)
Jan 21 20:40:28 <aquatix> it contains crippled characters?
Jan 21 20:40:45 * GeneralAntilles doesn't do certs.
Jan 21 20:40:47 <timeless> supposing it did contain crippled characters
Jan 21 20:40:47 <Stskeeps> timeless: i think i've seen similar error in openssl really
Jan 21 20:40:55 <timeless> would it match the server name?
Jan 21 20:41:11 <timeless> (the answer should obviously be no)
Jan 21 20:41:15 <aquatix> indeed
Jan 21 20:41:24 <timeless> so that portion is superfluous, no?
Jan 21 20:41:36 <aquatix> not sure
Jan 21 20:41:46 <aquatix> is the name of a cert the domain it's for?
Jan 21 20:41:53 <aquatix> not necessarily right?
Jan 21 20:41:58 <timeless> well, cert names could be other things
Jan 21 20:42:00 <timeless> ip addresses
Jan 21 20:42:02 <timeless> user@host
Jan 21 20:42:06 <lcuk> doesnt that kind of msg come up when you have a cert for www.example.com but are on example.com
Jan 21 20:42:12 <timeless> but the point is, it either matches the host or it doesn't
Jan 21 20:42:19 <timeless> lcuk: it should, yes
Jan 21 20:42:28 <aquatix> lcuk: yeah, domain mismatch
Jan 21 20:42:34 <aquatix> but i wonder about the invalid name
Jan 21 20:43:22 <lcuk> well the same msg is in outlook2007
Jan 21 20:43:46 <aquatix> i say, keep it
Jan 21 20:44:00 <aquatix> at least it's consistent with other ssl-using apps
Jan 21 20:44:51 <aquatix> timeless: somehow i shiver at the thought of the Dutch translation
Jan 21 20:45:58 <Stskeeps> Meiz_n810: it seems like we already have python-hildondesktop
Jan 21 20:46:12 <Stskeeps> i'll see what that means for getting applets on the home screen
Jan 21 20:46:33 * aquatix is gone for today
Jan 21 20:46:38 <Meiz_n810> kourou could work?
Jan 21 20:46:38 <aquatix> hf all
Jan 21 20:46:49 <aquatix> timeless: don't lose hope in humanity yet ;)
Jan 21 20:46:51 <Stskeeps> Meiz_n810: ah, no, but all the python stuff from maemo could
Jan 21 20:47:34 <Meiz_n810> okay/
Jan 21 20:48:06 <Meiz_n810> ?
Jan 21 20:48:14 <Meiz_n810> merinstaller just crashed
Jan 21 20:48:51 <Meiz_n810> When i tried to set up the userspace partition
Jan 21 20:50:22 <Stskeeps> Meiz_n810: alright, advanced mode? -> bman :P
Jan 21 20:50:37 <Meiz_n810> yep
Jan 21 20:51:41 <Meiz_n810> i think i know what causes it
Jan 21 20:51:56 <Meiz_n810> i am booted from internal card
Jan 21 20:54:12 <Meiz_n810> URL=http://stskeeps.subnetmask.net/mer/mer-armel-n8x0-image-v0.6.tar.gz latest?
Jan 21 20:54:22 <Stskeeps> it's the latest published one, yeah
Jan 21 20:54:30 <Meiz_n810> ta
Jan 21 20:57:42 <Stskeeps> http://bsd.tspre.org/~stskeeps/mer-homediskfree.png , http://bsd.tspre.org/~stskeeps/mer-homediskfree2.png
Jan 21 20:57:53 <timeless> aquatix: did you look at the dutch translation?
Jan 21 20:57:58 <timeless> they"re all available at obvious urls
Jan 21 20:58:28 <timeless> anyway, would people object to this:
Jan 21 20:58:28 <timeless> "Certificate does not belong to this server
Jan 21 20:58:30 <timeless> "
Jan 21 20:58:32 <timeless> ?
Jan 21 20:59:48 <timeless> (actually, that's not great either, but the original still has the same problem)
Jan 21 20:59:57 <Meiz_n810> Stskeeps: great! :)
Jan 21 21:00:00 <timeless> there's a minor detail which is that the 'certificate' randomly appears
Jan 21 21:00:10 <Stskeeps> Meiz_n810: minor detail in package names though
Jan 21 21:00:17 <timeless> if you're a user, you don't have any idea what a certificate has to do with an apple
Jan 21 21:00:22 <timeless> or pear
Jan 21 21:00:27 <timeless> or tomato
Jan 21 21:01:47 <timeless> I think one of my older suggestions was:
Jan 21 21:01:54 <timeless> "Server sent someone else's certificate"
Jan 21 21:02:00 <timeless> I think it was orginally worded:
Jan 21 21:02:06 <timeless> "Server presented a stolen certificate"
Jan 21 21:02:53 <Jaffa> Stskeeps: yay, armel build finally succeeded :-)
Jan 21 21:03:20 <Stskeeps> Jaffa: i replaced the repository with ftp :P
Jan 21 21:03:31 <Jaffa> Stskeeps: ah
Jan 21 21:03:41 * Jaffa goes to watch BSG
Jan 21 21:39:41 <Stskeeps> lo b-man
Jan 21 21:39:48 <b-man> hello
Jan 21 21:41:58 * b-man had a crazy day today...
Jan 21 21:42:04 <Stskeeps> mm, join the club
Jan 21 21:42:08 <Stskeeps> 4 hours of sleep and exam
Jan 21 21:42:13 <b-man> hehe
Jan 21 21:43:15 <GeneralAntilles> High-five!
Jan 21 21:44:28 <b-man> i just switched classes from sophmore business exploritory  to sophmore construction exploritory... and now needs to deal with math (with semester change)
Jan 21 21:45:27 <lfelipe> hey, how can I launch an application from a Home Applet
Jan 21 21:45:33 <lfelipe> without using rpc_run
Jan 21 21:45:34 <lfelipe> ?
Jan 21 21:46:15 <GeneralAntilles> lfelipe: look at personal launch, perhaps?
Jan 21 21:47:07 <GeneralAntilles> lfelipe, http://repository.maemo.org/extras-devel/pool/diablo/free/p/personal-launch/
Jan 21 21:47:32 <GeneralAntilles> Source: http://repository.maemo.org/extras-devel/pool/diablo/free/source/p/personal-launch/
Jan 21 21:49:28 <lfelipe> personal launch uses xterm ?
Jan 21 21:49:39 <lfelipe> I had just downloaded it, taking a look now
Jan 21 21:49:45 <GeneralAntilles> xterm?
Jan 21 21:49:48 * b-man starts working on patching merinstaller while he still has the time
Jan 21 21:50:52 <lfelipe>         retVal=osso_rpc_async_run(osso,"com.nokia.xterm","/com/nokia/xterm","com.nokia.xterm","run_command",NULL,NULL,DBUS_TYPE_STRING,executable,DBUS_TYPE_INVALID);
Jan 21 21:52:32 <GeneralAntilles> b-man|hacking, did Jaffa bug you about packing?
Jan 21 21:52:40 <GeneralAntilles> Make sure it's in the current section.
Jan 21 21:53:08 <b-man|hacking> for extras?
Jan 21 21:53:20 <b-man|hacking> ?
Jan 21 21:53:28 <GeneralAntilles> er
Jan 21 21:53:31 <GeneralAntilles> s/current/correct/
Jan 21 21:53:33 <GeneralAntilles> user/*
Jan 21 21:53:58 <Stskeeps> b-man|hacking: i'll hack up some proper packaging for you during the weekend i think
Jan 21 21:54:05 <LinuxCode> any of you guys got a mac ?
Jan 21 21:54:19 * GeneralAntilles raises his hand hesitantly.
Jan 21 21:54:33 <b-man|hacking> Stskeeps: thanks :)
Jan 21 21:54:33 <LinuxCode> GeneralAntilles, ever used entourage ?
Jan 21 21:54:44 <LinuxCode> because i think that crap is not rfc compliant
Jan 21 21:54:46 <GeneralAntilles> LinuxCode, many, many moons ago.
Jan 21 21:54:51 <GeneralAntilles> Actually
Jan 21 21:54:58 <GeneralAntilles> I guess it wasn't Entourage at the time.
Jan 21 21:55:00 <GeneralAntilles> rfc
Jan 21 21:55:05 <GeneralAntilles> Er
Jan 21 21:55:08 <GeneralAntilles> Random spam
Jan 21 21:55:14 <LinuxCode> GeneralAntilles, their encoding is wrong and marks a 1.4 scoring on spamassassin
Jan 21 21:55:38 <GeneralAntilles> It's Microsoft, why do we care?
Jan 21 21:55:48 <LinuxCode> as they exceeed the 76 character limit for quoted-printable
Jan 21 21:56:01 <LinuxCode> GeneralAntilles, I just wondered..I dont care about MS either...
Jan 21 21:56:10 <LinuxCode> but im getting grief from users of it
Jan 21 21:56:15 <GeneralAntilles> Anybody using OS X either uses Mail.app or GMail.
Jan 21 21:56:27 <LinuxCode> maill doesnt have the problem
Jan 21 21:56:31 <LinuxCode> yeh
Jan 21 21:56:33 <LinuxCode> ;-|
Jan 21 21:56:40 <LinuxCode> gaaar i hate mS
Jan 21 21:57:01 <LinuxCode> thanks anyway
Jan 21 21:57:20 <LinuxCode> just wondered if there was a way to tell them to change the mime encoding
Jan 21 21:57:28 <LinuxCode> I myself dont have a mac nor entourage
Jan 21 21:57:37 <GeneralAntilles> Dunno
Jan 21 21:57:42 <LinuxCode> and explaining to some idiot..is....impossible
Jan 21 21:57:47 <GeneralAntilles> I haven't had Office installed on here in years.
Jan 21 21:57:54 <LinuxCode> GeneralAntilles, good on you haha
Jan 21 21:57:54 <GeneralAntilles> Just make them switch to Mail. ;)
Jan 21 21:57:56 <LinuxCode> ;-}
Jan 21 21:57:59 <LinuxCode> yeh
Jan 21 21:58:06 <LinuxCode> seems the easiest option
Jan 21 21:58:08 <GeneralAntilles> It's a better client anyway.
Jan 21 21:58:19 <LinuxCode> has to be... as it is RFC compliant
Jan 21 21:58:23 <LinuxCode> at least it appears so
Jan 21 21:58:34 <andre__> just file a bug. bugzilla.microsoft.com :-P
Jan 21 21:58:40 <LinuxCode> andre__, rofl
Jan 21 21:58:58 <andre__> hey, it's all open source! :)
Jan 21 21:59:15 <andre__> uh wait... "microsoft", you said? damn, wasn't that this company that...
Jan 21 21:59:25 <andre__> anyway
Jan 21 22:00:29 <LinuxCode> that..never complies to RFCs ?
Jan 21 22:00:34 <LinuxCode> YES THAT COMPANY
Jan 21 22:01:07 * b-man|hacking hates microsoft
Jan 21 22:01:46 * Stskeeps uses his xp and is happy about it.
Jan 21 22:04:28 <b-man|hacking> i just don't like microsoft's closed-sorce philosophy
Jan 21 22:07:25 <lardman> at least Bill spends his money on useful things though
Jan 21 22:09:28 <pupnik_> i rather move a lever
Jan 21 22:09:30 <pupnik_> than lift a rock
Jan 21 22:11:35 <lardman> hmm, good to see the Pandora folks are now demanding cash/bank transfer and no CC allowed
Jan 21 22:11:53 <lardman> s/good/<sarcasm>good</sarcasm>
Jan 21 22:11:55 <r2d2rogers> Stskeeps: h-i-m works on the imager run, but not 0.6
Jan 21 22:12:05 <Stskeeps> r2d2rogers: k
Jan 21 22:12:12 <GeneralAntilles> Ah, Pandora.
Jan 21 22:12:15 <Stskeeps> lardman: jesus christ
Jan 21 22:12:17 <GeneralAntilles> It's too bad Karel gave up on them.
Jan 21 22:12:28 <Stskeeps> lardman: that just signals way too many alarm bells for me to handle
Jan 21 22:12:34 <lardman> yeah, definitely
Jan 21 22:13:07 <b-man|hacking> true...
Jan 21 22:13:13 <lardman> interesting there was a *news flash* this morning, that full opengl would be supported, which now turns out to be a misunderstanding. hmm
Jan 21 22:13:52 <r2d2rogers> Stskeeps: homerun!  all very NICE
Jan 21 22:14:02 <Stskeeps> r2d2rogers: sapwood works?
Jan 21 22:14:06 <Stskeeps> i want screenshots
Jan 21 22:14:13 <r2d2rogers> latest imager plus the sapwood from johnx
Jan 21 22:14:18 <r2d2rogers> you'll get them
Jan 21 22:15:21 <Stskeeps> i'll send sapwood to the presses then
Jan 21 22:15:28 <r2d2rogers> yessir
Jan 21 22:15:55 <lardman> anyone here used cwiid?
Jan 21 22:16:41 * Stskeeps tries to figure out how to make vmdk images automatically
Jan 21 22:16:51 <GeneralAntilles> lardman, use konttori's package.
Jan 21 22:17:05 <lardman> GeneralAntilles: yep, I have done and it works nicely
Jan 21 22:17:15 <GeneralAntilles> cwiid is a mess.
Jan 21 22:17:25 <lardman> GeneralAntilles: I was just thinking about linking it through a joystick dev entry though
Jan 21 22:17:27 <GeneralAntilles> It's not actually packaged
Jan 21 22:17:31 <lardman> hmm, ok
Jan 21 22:17:38 <GeneralAntilles> So it just shits all over four FS and then you can't remove it. ;)
Jan 21 22:17:43 <GeneralAntilles> s/four/your/
Jan 21 22:17:48 <lardman> yeah, not ideal ;)
Jan 21 22:18:05 <r2d2rogers> Stskeeps: what do youthink about changing the usbnet-emergency-telnetd script to remove those read foo's
Jan 21 22:18:32 <lardman> I quite fancy the look of this (very basic app): http://www.harbaum.org/till/tiltstick/index.shtml#soft
Jan 21 22:18:43 <Stskeeps> r2d2rogers: go ahead for now, it's weird 770 doesnt have it
Jan 21 22:19:11 <r2d2rogers> it seems like it doesn't make it to console on that option
Jan 21 22:19:27 <r2d2rogers> will dig before I commit it as a change
Jan 21 22:20:42 <lcuk> oooh lardman you are getting into this accel stuff :D
Jan 21 22:20:49 <r2d2rogers> Mer on 770 http://handhelds.org/scap/port.3812.png
Jan 21 22:21:01 <Stskeeps> r2d2rogers: \o/
Jan 21 22:21:02 <lardman> lcuk: fun toy :)
Jan 21 22:21:24 <lcuk> yeah i got frustrated and bored when i played in windows, it will work nicely on rx-51
Jan 21 22:21:48 <r2d2rogers> Mer on 770 http://handhelds.org/scap/port.3862.png
Jan 21 22:22:18 <Stskeeps> r2d2rogers: hehe, looks just like on n800 :)
Jan 21 22:22:30 <r2d2rogers> that's good <G>
Jan 21 22:22:39 <lcuk> r2d2rogers, step backwards and take a pic including the bezel and a copy of todays newspaper :P
Jan 21 22:23:14 <r2d2rogers> lol
Jan 21 22:27:04 <lcuk> could we use that tiltstick inside the extended case from craves1 and using the internal serial port?
Jan 21 22:27:15 <Stskeeps> r2d2rogers: how does it work speed wise?
Jan 21 22:27:38 <lardman> lcuk: no idea, I've not seen either, but the hw for that should be pretty small
Jan 21 22:28:01 <lcuk> that page has links
Jan 21 22:28:05 <lcuk> pictures sorry
Jan 21 22:28:32 <lardman> serial port & case?
Jan 21 22:28:59 <lardman> ah, accelerometer
Jan 21 22:30:15 <lcuk> http://www.remotefactory.com/32gbn810sdSSMetal.html
Jan 21 22:30:34 <lcuk> get one of those for the 32gb upgrade and use the extra space for an accel
Jan 21 22:30:59 <lardman> hmm, interesting
Jan 21 22:31:51 <lardman> quite a cool hack
Jan 21 22:32:06 <t_s_o> ok, mnotes have really turned into a wonderapp :D
Jan 21 22:33:27 <GeneralAntilles> lcuk, who cares, the RX-51 has accelerometers. :P
Jan 21 22:34:38 <lcuk> you only have to look around at the number of functional 770s people have to see that the 810 isn't going anywhere in a hurry
Jan 21 22:35:50 <lardman> GeneralAntilles: and RDS...
Jan 21 22:35:52 <lardman> :)
Jan 21 22:36:34 <lcuk> random dot stereograms? :D
Jan 21 22:36:43 <lardman> close...
Jan 21 22:36:53 <timelE61i> mS doesn't have a closed source philosophy
Jan 21 22:37:02 <mavhc> apparently the RDS traffic updates are trivially easy to spoof, you could report accidents all along your journey to work, causing people to avoid that route, and getting there much sooner
Jan 21 22:37:07 <lardman> hmm, Google gives me something else as the first link ;)
Jan 21 22:37:17 <timelE61i> They write quality documentation and offer real support contracts
Jan 21 22:37:25 * lcuk googled after
Jan 21 22:37:37 <timelE61i> Like many vendors they can't write a search engine
Jan 21 22:37:42 <lardman> mavhc: yep, I was thinking about receiving the actual reports though, but spoofing would be good too as it also has an RDS transmitter
Jan 21 22:37:50 <timelE61i> But that's why people use googe
Jan 21 22:37:55 <timelE61i> Google....
Jan 21 22:38:27 <timelE61i> If you want bad support or bad documentation. Look closer to home
Jan 21 22:38:43 <r2d2rogers> Stskeeps: seems good, will boot the other 770 to OS2008HE to compare
Jan 21 22:43:31 * RST38h curses Genesis and its software
Jan 21 22:46:24 <timelE61i> sega?
Jan 21 22:46:35 <Stskeeps> Myrtti: damn, you're busy on wiki
Jan 21 22:48:50 <Myrtti> Stskeeps: I just realized that I'm two hours behind from Finland
Jan 21 22:48:51 <lardman> any thoughts as to how to make using  conic synchronous?
Jan 21 22:49:24 <Myrtti> so if qlin shows the wikipages tomorrow, she'll be doing it about two hours before I'm even off the bed
Jan 21 22:49:44 <Stskeeps> Myrtti: you employed for this? just curious :)
Jan 21 22:49:45 <Myrtti> Stskeeps: also, I'm a pro in this
Jan 21 22:49:50 <Myrtti> Stskeeps: yup
Jan 21 22:49:54 <Stskeeps> alright
Jan 21 22:50:00 <Myrtti> well, semipro
Jan 21 22:50:19 <Stskeeps> it usually requires quite a bit of wiki-OCD to do that without pay ;)
Jan 21 22:50:25 <Myrtti> semipro in the sense that I really breathe Mediawiki syntax in and out
Jan 21 22:50:47 <Myrtti> Stskeeps: which I've done when I was seriously addicted to editing Wikipedia
Jan 21 22:51:12 <Myrtti> Stskeeps: http://toolserver.org/~interiot/cgi-bin/count_edits?user=Myrtti&dbname=fiwiki_p
Jan 21 22:51:35 <Jaffa> lardman: There's a mud package for cwiid
Jan 21 22:51:49 <Jaffa> Not been built for a while, AFAICT, mind.
Jan 21 22:51:52 <Stskeeps> Myrtti: neat :P
Jan 21 22:53:52 <lardman> Jaffa: thanks, as the General recommended, I think I'll stick with kontorri's app
Jan 21 22:55:10 <LinuxHack3r> sisto: Let me tell you, waiting like this and not knowing when it'll ship, or even when they'll get it, is driving me crazy.
Jan 21 22:56:02 <r2d2rogers> Stskeeps: looks like it's comparable at least, load times for 770 will not be quick I'm sure
Jan 21 22:56:17 <Stskeeps> r2d2rogers: alright
Jan 21 22:56:37 <r2d2rogers> Stskeeps: installing midori to play
Jan 21 22:56:46 <r2d2rogers> Stskeeps: anything you suggest checking out?
Jan 21 22:57:44 <Stskeeps> r2d2rogers: maemopad? ;p
Jan 21 22:58:02 <r2d2rogers> it's there, and works
Jan 21 22:58:08 <Stskeeps> hehe, good
Jan 21 22:58:15 <r2d2rogers> was going to make that the backoff shot, but boss walked in <G>
Jan 21 22:58:27 <r2d2rogers> brb
Jan 21 22:58:34 * Stskeeps is pondering how to structure the development process of mer.
Jan 21 22:59:43 <LinuxHack3r> Just thought of something...what sorta font stuff can you change on the 810? Could I use the Liberation fonts on it?
Jan 21 23:00:06 <Jaffa> LinuxHack3r: Drop ttf files into ~/.fonts/. Use them. Job done.
Jan 21 23:00:28 <r2d2rogers> Stskeeps:  what are the options? <G>
Jan 21 23:00:39 <LinuxHack3r> Jaffa: That'll work great once I get the thing. Can't wait.
Jan 21 23:01:22 <Stskeeps> r2d2rogers: i'm a little dissatified with having a sprint which has goal of "basic installable image", and more thinking of structuring into release-often sprints, as in, sprint towards 0.7 for instance, set up some goals for 0.7
Jan 21 23:02:07 <Stskeeps> but i'm not sure what would work for very spread developers
Jan 21 23:02:25 <Jaffa> Stskeeps: yes, "basic" isn't a well-defined goal. Something we learned at work when started doing agile (and I hate the word "sprint" for something you're supposed to do every 4 weeks. Sprints should be for big milestones, not every single iteration)
Jan 21 23:02:42 <r2d2rogers> lap?
Jan 21 23:03:06 <Jaffa> "period" and "timebox" are what we use, but then we're not using SCRUM - some other, slightly adapted, agile naming
Jan 21 23:03:27 <Jaffa> Or, given we release at the end of every timebox, "release" would do it :-)
Jan 21 23:05:58 <Stskeeps> so maybe a model where there's a release every week, accompanied with "this week in Mer" blog post, where people commit to tasks for the next period, and hope to deliver that at end of week?
Jan 21 23:06:11 <Stskeeps> week/two weeks
Jan 21 23:06:15 <Jaffa> I'd say 2 weekly.
Jan 21 23:06:16 <Jaffa> Yeah.
Jan 21 23:06:33 <Jaffa> Otherwise you get into a branching nightmare for anything which might take longer than 2 weeks :-)
Jan 21 23:06:41 <Stskeeps> *nod*
Jan 21 23:07:42 <Seb> hi everyone
Jan 21 23:07:47 <Stskeeps> wello
Jan 21 23:08:11 <Jaffa> Stskeeps: I assume you installed HomeDiskFree, on a mer-running device, from Extras through HAM?
Jan 21 23:08:32 <Seb> I recently got a n800 as a gift, and am wondering how to best make use of SDHC cards that came with it (one is 2GB, the other is 16GB)
Jan 21 23:08:32 * timelE61i ponders
Jan 21 23:08:32 <Stskeeps> Jaffa: uhm, no, not directly, i needed python-hildondesktop to have an extra provides
Jan 21 23:08:47 <timelE61i> could mer consider fixing the .po strings? :)
Jan 21 23:08:49 <Stskeeps> Jaffa: and that's being built atm :)
Jan 21 23:08:54 <timelE61i> Please :)
Jan 21 23:08:54 <Jaffa> Stskeeps: happy for me to mark the existing HAM task on the blueprint as 100%? There's lots which can be done to it, but probably not part of the initial Merification
Jan 21 23:08:57 <Stskeeps> timelE61i: which ones, 4001?
Jan 21 23:09:02 <Stskeeps> Jaffa: yes, it's fine
Jan 21 23:09:22 <Seb> for instance, i would like to install EasyDebian, which is apparently quite large, and i am confused as to where one can install apps on the n800
Jan 21 23:09:24 <Jaffa> timelE61i: I was thinking about this earlier. I thought of a few hacks one could do, but why bother? Nokia are going to have to do it through the SDK releases anyway
Jan 21 23:09:30 <Jaffa> Stskeeps: ta
Jan 21 23:09:44 <timelE61i> jaffa: not 4001
Jan 21 23:09:55 <timelE61i> ham
Jan 21 23:10:03 <Stskeeps> but fixing the .pos you mean
Jan 21 23:10:03 <Seb> do they always try to go to the flash memory ? If so, how do I go about making the best us of those 2 cards ?
Jan 21 23:10:16 <timelE61i> Jaffa: have you read bugs filed today?
Jan 21 23:10:18 <Stskeeps> timelE61i: with the weird english strings?
Jan 21 23:10:23 <Jaffa> timelE61i: oh? including the improved messages you were talking about earlier
Jan 21 23:10:24 <timelE61i> Yes
Jan 21 23:10:31 <Myrtti> I think I'm done for today
Jan 21 23:10:54 <timelE61i> Fwiw, i'm mostly walking through the whole fremantle string table
Jan 21 23:11:03 <Seb> is there a channel best suited for end-user questions ? :)
Jan 21 23:11:19 <Stskeeps> Seb: we always have http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums
Jan 21 23:11:20 <Jaffa> timelE61i: I'd rather rant at Nokia for a bit (shoddy translations indicative of a general sloppiness to the detail which takes an adequate device to a great device) and then put a patch on Bugzilla and merge it into the mer branch.
Jan 21 23:11:26 <timelE61i> Where possible i'm just going to file public bugs and pray someone forces them fixed
Jan 21 23:11:34 <Seb> Stskeeps: yep, but I like IRC a lot :>
Jan 21 23:11:41 <timelE61i> Jaffa: be my guest
Jan 21 23:12:12 <Jaffa> Stskeeps: BTW, my HAM branch should probably be merged to the ~m-r one ASAP
Jan 21 23:13:18 <Stskeeps> Jaffa: https://launchpad.net/~mer-committers feel free to sign up :)
Jan 21 23:14:01 <Jaffa> Stskeeps: ta :-)
Jan 21 23:20:32 <webulator70> Could someone help me with a small prob?
Jan 21 23:21:45 <lardman> depends what it is; spit it out
Jan 21 23:22:05 <Stskeeps> hmm, are there any "free" planet-sites? like, for creating your own
Jan 21 23:22:32 <webulator70> Fm radio on os2008s radio applet only plays fuzz
Jan 21 23:22:41 <GeneralAntilles> Stskeeps?
Jan 21 23:22:44 <Stskeeps> webulator70: plug in the headphones
Jan 21 23:22:49 <Stskeeps> GeneralAntilles: got a crazy idea..
Jan 21 23:23:23 <webulator70> So the phones are anteae?
Jan 21 23:23:29 <Stskeeps> webulator70: yes
Jan 21 23:23:49 <webulator70> :PThanks
Jan 21 23:24:44 <webulator70> Awsome
Jan 21 23:25:12 <lardman> night chaps
Jan 21 23:25:18 <Stskeeps> GeneralAntilles: basically, we're dealing with widespread collaborative work, and microblogging seems to allow people to "catch up" - and having a planet feeding off these rss'es would be a way to render eachothers activities visible to eachother
Jan 21 23:25:47 <GeneralAntilles> Jaiku?
Jan 21 23:25:55 <Stskeeps> maybe.
Jan 21 23:25:56 <lcuk> irc :P
Jan 21 23:26:03 <webulator70> I cant seem to use my bt headset after pairing it
Jan 21 23:26:17 <Stskeeps> GeneralAntilles: i'm not too fond of their rss feeds though
Jan 21 23:26:30 <GeneralAntilles> RSS feeds suck anyway
Jan 21 23:26:36 <GeneralAntilles> I don't know how people use them.
Jan 21 23:26:45 <Stskeeps> as in, the way they drag them into channels
Jan 21 23:27:05 * b-man|hacking uses rss feeds for important information
Jan 21 23:32:33 * FireFox ponders if palm pre will ever be able to run on our tablet since palm pre uses an arm ompa prosessor..... nah :P
Jan 21 23:32:53 <FireFox> (sdk)
Jan 21 23:32:57 <Jaffa> FireFox: Do you think Windows CE will ever run on our tablets since it uses an ARM processor? Or EPOC?
Jan 21 23:34:11 <FireFox> no, because we would need to create a costom bootloader for wince.. witch would be a licencing nightmare
Jan 21 23:34:33 <Jaffa> Indeed. Why would Palm Pre be any different?
Jan 21 23:36:07 <GeneralAntilles> Jaffa - Dream Killer
Jan 21 23:36:18 <FireFox> because, if i am correct, palm pre uses a linux core witch (could) function with our bootloader
Jan 21 23:36:29 <FireFox> kinda like Android..
Jan 21 23:36:39 <Jaffa> Android's open source and designed to be ported.
Jan 21 23:36:42 <GeneralAntilles> Pre isn't open like Android.
Jan 21 23:36:53 <GeneralAntilles> Palm makes its money off the hardware
Jan 21 23:37:04 <FireFox> i know, that would be another problem ;p
Jan 21 23:37:10 <Jaffa> There's no evidence at all that Pre will be open - which given the competitive edge it (may) give them, would be surprising
Jan 21 23:37:23 <Jaffa> The kernel is such a tiny component of the problem
Jan 21 23:48:44 <t_s_o> hmm, TI released a opengl driver for omap3?!
Jan 21 23:49:28 <Jaffa> t_s_o: no
Jan 21 23:50:15 <t_s_o> ok, seems there has been some confusion, crap...
Jan 21 23:50:34 <GeneralAntilles> t_s_o, Pandora people are, apparently, idiots.
Jan 21 23:50:47 <t_s_o> GeneralAntilles: heh, maybe so...
Jan 21 23:52:33 <Jaffa> timelE61i: yeah
Jan 21 23:52:48 <Jaffa> *cough*
Jan 21 23:52:53 <GeneralAntilles> t_s_o, the sad part is that they seem to have announced it twice in two days.
Jan 21 23:53:18 * ENTERANICK [W2I=000:u:0:000:]
Jan 21 23:53:49 <Jaffa> Stskeeps: worth splitting the Mer pages into a series of sub-pages (e.g. wiki.maemo.org/Mer/Introduction Mer/Development_process Mer/Releases etc.)?
Jan 21 23:54:00 <glass> the problem with announcing vapor shit is that people read the first announcement and not the correction and then go shout it like the fanboys they are(the fanboys who've pre-ordered)
Jan 21 23:54:05 <t_s_o> GeneralAntilles: could be a case of inmates running the asylum ;)
Jan 21 23:54:17 <Stskeeps> Jaffa: yes, once i'm done butchering it today :P
Jan 21 23:54:31 <GeneralAntilles> t_s_o, oh, like here? ;)
Jan 21 23:54:39 <Jaffa> Stskeeps: cool, I'll leave you to it and try and take this opportunity to go to bed.
Jan 21 23:54:54 <t_s_o> GeneralAntilles: heh, here its only the software part...
Jan 21 23:56:36 <AStorm> t_s_o: but we can actually write the driver ourselves
Jan 21 23:56:49 <AStorm> a gallium backend
Jan 21 23:56:50 <AStorm> unlike now
Jan 21 23:56:56 <t_s_o> AStorm: not that i find it likely to ever happen tho :P
Jan 21 23:58:48 <AStorm> uhm?
Jan 21 23:59:11 <AStorm> just alter it to run llvm-compiled armel code on the chip
Jan 21 23:59:19 <AStorm> for starters
Jan 21 23:59:35 * FireFox wonders if it is time to start saving money for an "N900"..
Jan 22 00:00:05 <Jaffa> FireFox: or time to start really putting loads of effort into big impact community efforts and hope there's a discount programme
Jan 22 00:01:33 <FireFox> shure... ;p
Jan 22 00:02:23 <AStorm> FireFox: I'm saving since I bought the n810
Jan 22 00:02:28 <AStorm> so I have enough
Jan 22 00:02:30 <m0z_work> is there any rumours of roughly when the 900 may be released?
Jan 22 00:02:49 <AStorm> m0z_work: fremantle is likely to show around summer... I'd guess then?
Jan 22 00:02:51 <Jaffa> m0z_work: Next Summer, or thereabouts.
Jan 22 00:02:53 <t_s_o> end of 2009 at earliest
Jan 22 00:03:03 <Jaffa> October 21st, 2015
Jan 22 00:03:07 <t_s_o> :P
Jan 22 00:03:10 <AStorm> Jaffa: ;)
Jan 22 00:05:13 * FireFox works on merinstaller some more..
Jan 22 00:05:18 * FireFox made $1200.00 last summer ;) - but that's reserved for a future Dell Studio 15
Jan 22 00:12:17 <timelE61i> gAn: they don't have a monopoly on that
Jan 22 00:14:47 <GAN800> timelE61i, hehe, well. . . . ;)
Jan 22 00:16:50 * FireFox needs to go, somehow got involved with some theater business
Jan 22 00:17:04 <Jaffa> Right. Bed.
Jan 22 00:17:06 <Jaffa> g'night
Jan 22 00:26:43 <Jaffa> Stskeeps: can you also document how the dev process should work (personal branches when working on big things perhaps, but also how they should be merged. Is it a new branch working copy of ~mer-committers, a pull from ~aflegg, a commit then a push?)
Jan 22 00:26:57 * Jaffa can find no good information on how to actually best use Launchpad and bzr.
Jan 22 00:29:59 <Stskeeps> Jaffa: yeah, working on it :)
Jan 22 00:32:31 <Jaffa> cool. I *think* I've done it right. bzr branch lp:~mer-committers/...; cd hildon-application-manager; bzr pull lp:~aflegg/....; bzr push lp:~mer-committers ...
Jan 22 00:32:37 <Jaffa> Now I need to bed.
Jan 22 00:32:39 <Jaffa> Properly.
Jan 22 00:34:12 <Stskeeps> as we witness jaffa's transformation into a mer developer.. like johnx and me, trying to cheat sleep ;)
Jan 22 00:34:34 <Jaffa> I've got baby bottles to fill with water downstairs too.
Jan 22 00:34:49 <Jaffa> I'm gone
Jan 22 00:34:54 <Jaffa|gone> see
**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Thu Jan 22 01:14:16 2009
Jan 22 01:26:44 * ENTERANICK [W2I=000:u:0:000:]
Jan 22 01:26:55 <Mousey> looks ipv6ish
Jan 22 01:27:01 <Mousey> not enough :'s tho
Jan 22 01:27:19 <Mousey> oh, and "u" isn't hex
Jan 22 01:27:24 * Mousey just shuts up
Jan 22 01:28:21 <Stskeeps> Mousey: or MS comic chat
Jan 22 01:28:55 <Mousey> whats that mean? software isn't panning out anymore, so microsoft is going into the comic biz?
Jan 22 01:29:34 <Stskeeps> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_Comic_Chat
Jan 22 01:30:08 <Mousey> holy shit, it's jerkcity
Jan 22 01:30:58 <sisto> Obama got owned
Jan 22 01:31:07 <sisto> they gave him a windows mobile pda
Jan 22 01:31:08 <sisto> http://www.boygeniusreport.com/2009/01/21/obama-keeps-berry-for-personal-use-uses-clunky-sectera-edge-for-official-business/
Jan 22 01:31:55 <Mousey> crap, so much for hope
Jan 22 01:39:21 <doc|home> wtf is a classified usb port?
Jan 22 01:39:41 <Mousey> it's like an unclassified usb port, but i'm not allowed to tell you about it
Jan 22 01:39:49 * doc|home waterboards Mousey 
Jan 22 01:39:56 * Mousey insurges!
Jan 22 01:40:01 <doc|home> oh wait, only presidents are allowed to do that
Jan 22 01:40:16 <Mousey> but ANYBODY can be a terrorist =)
Jan 22 01:40:29 <doc|home> and that's why they have you by the balls :)
Jan 22 01:40:45 <doc|home> "I'm sorry sir, but we believe you to be a terrorist and are going to shoot you in the face"
Jan 22 01:40:54 <sisto> does the nsa have access to the source code?
Jan 22 01:40:56 <Mousey> no trial for j00!
Jan 22 01:41:03 <Mousey> it's windows! so yes
Jan 22 01:41:09 <doc|home> hahaha
Jan 22 01:43:05 <sisto> it looks like a 90's pda
Jan 22 01:44:19 <sisto> will it run maemo?
Jan 22 01:44:21 <sisto> or better...
Jan 22 01:44:26 <sisto> will it run crysis?
Jan 22 01:46:40 <Mousey> heh
Jan 22 01:46:56 <Mousey> wtf is a trusted LCD?
Jan 22 01:48:04 <sisto> lol
Jan 22 01:48:17 <sisto> it tells you when the other one is lying
Jan 22 01:48:59 <AStorm> nah
Jan 22 01:49:13 <AStorm> it blurs the screen when you play DRMed content
Jan 22 01:49:19 <Mousey> hahaha
Jan 22 01:59:10 <jaem> hello everybody
Jan 22 02:00:56 <jaem> has anyone gotten the built-in chat to work properly with multiple accounts using the same login name?
Jan 22 02:01:57 <Mousey> apt-get install pidgin
Jan 22 02:02:12 <jaem> yes, I thought aboiut that
Jan 22 02:02:16 <Mousey> ^_^
Jan 22 02:02:20 <jaem> but does it have proper integration yet?
Jan 22 02:02:25 <Mousey> whats that mean
Jan 22 02:02:26 <jaem> I haven't tried it in a while
Jan 22 02:02:31 <Raytray> There an option on pidgin to make the full screen keyboard hit send instead of return when I hit the enter button?
Jan 22 02:02:50 <jaem> well, in terms of full hildonization, as well as notifications (e.g LED)
Jan 22 02:02:52 <Mousey> thats among the regular pidgin options i beleve
Jan 22 02:03:01 <Mousey> oh yea, and there's a LED notification plugin, has been for a while
Jan 22 02:03:15 <Mousey> but the contacts menu item is useless
Jan 22 02:03:16 <Raytray> Mousey, Hmm.. and yet it alluds me. brb while I hunt for it.
Jan 22 02:03:17 <jaem> okay - I hadn't looked into it, because I was hoping they would fix the default app
Jan 22 02:03:31 <jaem> I filed a bug on that issue ages ago, and never heard back :S
Jan 22 02:03:35 <Mousey> Raytray: yah man, it's called n800 LED something
Jan 22 02:03:36 <jaem> thanks, Mousey
Jan 22 02:03:53 <Mousey> default schmefault... pidgin! =)
Jan 22 02:04:02 <jaem> I do like Pidgin...
Jan 22 02:04:07 <Mousey> i don't
Jan 22 02:04:09 <Raytray> Mousey, I was referring to...
Jan 22 02:04:10 <jaem> but I like Kopete rather better
Jan 22 02:04:11 <Mousey> its just the best of the worst
Jan 22 02:04:11 <Raytray> There an option on pidgin to make the full screen keyboard hit send instead of return when I hit the enter button?
Jan 22 02:04:27 <Mousey> jaem: if kopete (or KDE for that matter) did SOCKS proxies properly, i'd like it more
Jan 22 02:04:37 <jaem> mousey: it doesn't?
Jan 22 02:04:45 <jaem> to be honest, I haven't tried that
Jan 22 02:04:49 <Mousey> Raytray: oh. hang on
Jan 22 02:05:00 <jaem> I haven't been running KDE much since I sold my laptop
Jan 22 02:05:09 <jaem> and I have little need to run SOCKS for my desktop
Jan 22 02:05:36 <Raytray> Heh, you don't need to keep your toes warm? :P
Jan 22 02:05:57 <jaem> Raytray: that's what the USB slippers from DealExtreme are for :P
Jan 22 02:06:01 <jaem> although I don't have any
Jan 22 02:06:04 <Raytray> lol
Jan 22 02:06:12 <jaem> on that topic... is there a way of configuring the tablet to use a SOCKS proxy?  I noticed some config entries for it, but nothing I could decipher
Jan 22 02:06:19 <jaem> I mean globally
Jan 22 02:06:29 <Mousey> ctrl-enter sends
Jan 22 02:06:35 <born2wonder> has anybody tried b-man's rootfs for ubunty jaunty. I keep getting an unexpected EOF error when i extract it
Jan 22 02:06:35 <Raytray> Hmm, wonder if I could convert my computer to a footrest/warmer
Jan 22 02:06:44 <Raytray> Mousey, onscreen keyboard?
Jan 22 02:06:50 * Raytray has an n800
Jan 22 02:06:57 <jaem> Raytray: just get a couple quad-core boxen - the whole room will be toasty
Jan 22 02:06:58 <Mousey> there's no ctrl on the onscreen keyboard?
Jan 22 02:07:06 <Raytray> There's no multitouch?
Jan 22 02:07:24 <jaem> Raytray: and if that isn't good enough, put your computer in a toaster, like that guy somewhere on the Net
Jan 22 02:07:26 <jaem> and no
Jan 22 02:07:32 <Raytray> Oh and I can't see the ctrl button either :D
Jan 22 02:07:44 <Raytray> lol jaem.
Jan 22 02:08:20 <jaem> personally, I'm waiting for the KDE devs to release plasma-mid
Jan 22 02:08:42 * Raytray is stuck on kde 3.5 :D
Jan 22 02:08:47 <Raytray> Forget 4. >.>
Jan 22 02:08:59 <jaem> Raytray: do you know what 4.2's codename is?
Jan 22 02:09:06 <Raytray> Nope.
Jan 22 02:09:10 <jaem> "The Answer"
Jan 22 02:09:10 <Raytray> I think I heard it somewhere though.
Jan 22 02:09:12 <jaem> :D
Jan 22 02:09:13 <Raytray> lol
Jan 22 02:09:52 <jaem> hmm... I've tried Debian on my N810, but I keep running into pointer calibration issues
Jan 22 02:10:02 <jaem> I couldn't find anything conclusive on ITT\
Jan 22 02:10:04 <jaem> any ideas?
Jan 22 02:10:36 <Raytray> No idea, sorry.
Jan 22 02:10:37 <jaem> I heard something about copying the calibration data from Maemo over
Jan 22 02:10:44 <jaem> but I don't know where that's stored
Jan 22 02:10:50 <jaem> (not that I've really looked)
Jan 22 02:11:38 <jaem> my cursor has rendering issues right now... so the Hand looks like it's giving your the Ol' Binary 4
Jan 22 02:11:42 <jaem> lol
Jan 22 02:17:27 <jaem> thanks for the help
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Thu Jan 22 02:59:57 2009