**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sun May 17 02:59:57 2009
May 17 03:04:47 <saruji> Hey guys, another quick question, what is the correct command for openssh on your n810 when trying to specify a port that you want ssh to connect through?
May 17 03:05:22 <saruji> Is tried ssh (ip):port
May 17 03:06:01 <saruji> And also tried ssh -D user@ip:port
May 17 03:07:03 <saruji> Ahem thats ssh -D user@ip: port
May 17 03:07:26 <saruji> And ssh user@ip: port
May 17 03:07:33 <tank-man> maybe "-p 22"
May 17 03:07:48 <saruji> At the end or beginning?
May 17 03:08:16 <tank-man> anywhere perhaps
May 17 03:08:44 <saruji> Ok will try thx
May 17 03:30:45 <chx> yeah
May 17 03:30:53 <chx> make note that scp uses capital P for this purpose
May 17 03:31:04 <chx> everyone loves consistent interfaces.
May 17 03:34:12 <luke-jr> XD
May 17 04:12:57 * b-man starts experimenting with Gentoo on his tablet
May 17 04:22:54 <Macer> i am watching ncis.. it's not that bad
May 17 04:37:11 <LiraNuna> are there any plans to upgrade the default gcc cross compiler for maemo5?
May 17 05:18:03 <GeneralAntilles> This expired cert bullshit must be the must user-hostile insanity imaginable.
May 17 05:19:10 <GeneralAntilles> Can somebody tell me how to bypass this reliably before I put a bullet through my phone?
May 17 05:24:29 <Macer> ncis is pretty good
May 17 05:24:48 <GAN800> Yes
May 17 05:25:44 <Macer> they aren't too bad with teh military stuff
May 17 05:25:55 <Macer> usually the military stuff is way off :)
May 17 05:26:15 <Macer> like when they do the dramatic "I REPEAT!" over the radio
May 17 05:35:57 <kfx> GeneralAntilles: when I had an e61 I found some app someone had made that basically wrecks the cert system, and lets you install whatever the hell you want
May 17 05:36:05 <kfx> if I can find it I'll let you know :(
May 17 05:58:26 <MaceWee> hm
May 17 06:00:47 <RST38h> kfx: This is called "a Chinese certificate"
May 17 06:01:23 <RST38h> It is not an app really, but a method to get a "universal" certificate and disable certificate checks
May 17 06:17:01 <napsy> Hello. I  have chinook on my n810 but want to upgrade to diablo. How to  do this. Just edit the sources.list?
May 17 06:30:36 <Jaffa> Morning all
May 17 06:31:33 <RST38h> napsy: You should use Nokia firmware upgrade utility
May 17 06:31:56 <RST38h> napsy: http://tabletschool.blogspot.com/2008/01/nokia-n800-how-to-update-n800s-firmware.html
May 17 06:32:31 <RST38h> http://tablets-dev.nokia.com/nokia_N810.php
May 17 06:34:33 <napsy> Ok tnx
May 17 07:07:32 <ShadowJK> hm, I thought there was a thing in program manager to disable certificte checks
May 17 07:07:57 <ShadowJK> or maygbe that  was just to let you install self-signed stuff :)
May 17 07:09:04 * ShadowJK vaguely recalls the nokia shoutcast client not wanting to install at one point because the certificate they signed it with expired
May 17 07:09:28 <ShadowJK> I think they just signed it with a fresher one when prodded about it...
May 17 07:14:40 <RST38h> Self signed stuff can be installed as is
May 17 07:14:59 <RST38h> Absolutely no problem there, except for a single checkbox in settings
May 17 07:45:05 <RST38h> tperiod
May 17 08:09:59 <liri> canola2 refuses to play any music, I can fire it up, browse my music but when I click a song it goes to the Playing screen and doesn't play, then after a couple of clicks it hangs
May 17 08:10:07 <liri> I un-installed it and re-installed, didn't help
May 17 08:10:26 <liri> Just to test that this isn't a sound driver issue I tried another music player which played it fine
May 17 08:10:34 <liri> I'm thinking maybe to not install the latest version
May 17 08:11:40 <thux> is canola generally better than other players?
May 17 08:15:07 <thux> i think i haven't tried it yet just heard the name often
May 17 08:16:20 <liri> it's a nice interface, good for me as a portable device
May 17 08:16:44 <thux> ok
May 17 08:30:09 <Macer> well
May 17 08:30:14 <Macer> tor seems to be a little bit of a failure
May 17 09:08:05 <lcukx41> is there anyway to teleport milk into my house (preferably bottled)
May 17 09:11:03 * wjt starts writing telepathy-moo with support for MoIP
May 17 09:11:54 <Stskeeps> mooip.
May 17 09:13:24 <lcukx41> Stskeeps: might work lol
May 17 09:38:20 <pupnik> naeno sdk vm image 0.9 is preferred environment to build for extras?
May 17 09:38:23 <pupnik> maemo
May 17 09:38:34 <pupnik> need to get up and running fast
May 17 09:38:52 <pupnik> http://maemovmware.garage.maemo.org/
May 17 09:42:04 <pupnik> hi geaaru
May 17 09:42:41 <geaaru> hi
May 17 09:43:50 <RST38h> moo pupnik, lcuk, Sts
May 17 09:43:56 <Stskeeps> moo RST38h
May 17 09:45:34 <pupnik> ok ok ok ok
May 17 09:55:45 <biiter> is it possible to somehow settup any mail client to try to connect every 20 min to WIFI and check for email, than disconnect automaticaly?
May 17 09:56:23 <lcuk> biiter, i think you can tell the wifi to disconnect if not used and connect as required
May 17 09:56:25 <lcuk> hiya MoonTiger
May 17 09:57:22 <MoonTiger> heya lcuk  :)
May 17 09:57:43 <lcuk> hows your lazy sunday goin
May 17 09:57:47 <biiter> lcuk: that is the "iddle" time? in settings? when i choose any time avaliable in the select box.. it yelds that it conflicts with genera settings
May 17 09:58:00 <biiter> general
May 17 09:58:07 <lcuk> what general settings
May 17 09:58:09 <MoonTiger> well the sea is looking warm and inviting and the sun is warm and the beach isnt too crowded ... not bad id say :)
May 17 09:58:30 <biiter> don§t know
May 17 09:58:36 <lcuk> bleugh! ive got manchester sun (which is i know its there somewhere behind the clouds)
May 17 09:59:02 <MoonTiger> almeria, spain ... right on the south coast
May 17 09:59:02 <lcuk> biiter, how long does your battery last if you just leave it to its own devices?
May 17 09:59:04 <MoonTiger> nice :)
May 17 09:59:23 <lcuk> yeah, and you wont swap lol
May 17 09:59:43 <biiter> lcuk: it didnt survive the night
May 17 10:00:08 <lcuk> thats not good
May 17 10:00:17 <MoonTiger> lcuk, well we are on couchsurfers.com so you're welcome to come for a free stay if you like :)
May 17 10:00:21 <lcuk> cos wifi thats just idling properly should last much longer
May 17 10:01:06 <lcuk> MoonTiger, i know of the service and its a great idea, but im more a stickler for a nice hotel room and privacy lol
May 17 10:02:08 <lcuk> so when you open moontiger hotels inc ill make a booking :D
May 17 10:02:09 <MoonTiger> ahh well ok ... we do have a spare room so you get the privacy thing
May 17 10:02:22 <MoonTiger> but the hotel services etc ... not so much ;)
May 17 10:02:37 <lcuk> damn, so no room service
May 17 10:02:58 <lcuk> do your rooms have air con and free wifi? :D
May 17 10:03:10 <MoonTiger> free wifi yes
May 17 10:03:15 <lcuk> heh
May 17 10:03:16 <MoonTiger> air con - open the window
May 17 10:03:30 <MoonTiger> we are literally a stones throw from the sea
May 17 10:03:30 <lcuk> i couldnt do that in the last hotel i stayed in
May 17 10:03:47 <lcuk> i was on the ground floor and with all the tech i took with me i didnt wanna leave it open over night
May 17 10:04:12 <lcuk> yeah you said, are you woken by the waves crashing on the beach?
May 17 10:04:22 <MoonTiger> (i know cos i threw a stone from our front door into the sea)
May 17 10:04:31 <lcuk> VANDAL!
May 17 10:04:37 <lcuk> you couldv hurt a poor fish
May 17 10:04:51 <MoonTiger> not woken by them but they do relax you to sleep if you cant sleep
May 17 10:05:08 <lcuk> are you a coffee drinker?
May 17 10:05:24 <MoonTiger> well i think the velocity of an object entering water is slowed sufficiently to cause little or no harm from a hand thrown projectile
May 17 10:05:30 <MoonTiger> :rolls eyes:
May 17 10:05:42 <lcuk> whenever ive been awake early mornin near a beach its so relaxing to just sit with feet in the sand drinkin a nice cuppa :)
May 17 10:05:50 <MoonTiger> pg tips me
May 17 10:05:55 <MoonTiger> decaf coffe only
May 17 10:06:51 <lcuk> i can just imagine that little fishy swimming by innocently when a 10tonnoe boulder comes out of the sky and flattens it into the sand
May 17 10:07:17 <lcuk> how do you think all those fossils are made
May 17 10:07:31 <MoonTiger> well if its swimming in 12 inches of water it should expect some problems
May 17 10:07:35 <MoonTiger> haha
May 17 10:08:50 * RST38h looks out of the window: clouds, +5oC
May 17 10:08:59 <RST38h> Where did you say the sun was?
May 17 10:09:06 <lcuk> in the sky
May 17 10:09:12 <lcuk> look upish
May 17 10:09:23 <MoonTiger> 50C ??!!
May 17 10:09:30 <lcuk> heh i thought that too
May 17 10:09:41 * RST38h shudders at the thought
May 17 10:09:53 <MoonTiger> i've been in 46C and that was bad
May 17 10:09:53 <RST38h> +5 I can take, actually. +50 can't
May 17 10:10:04 <RST38h> Anything >25 is bad
May 17 10:10:20 <lcuk> the only time ive ever been in greece i think it was that hot
May 17 10:10:29 <lcuk> after coming back my back peeled
May 17 10:10:38 <MoonTiger> wow i love the sun :)
May 17 10:10:38 <lcuk> literally, in one piece like a tshirt coming off
May 17 10:10:59 <MoonTiger> ewwwwwww
May 17 10:11:06 <lcuk> :D
May 17 10:11:13 <Stskeeps> and we hereby confirm lcuk is a shape shifting alien
May 17 10:11:24 <MoonTiger> hahaha
May 17 10:11:26 * lcuk waves his ET finger around
May 17 10:11:48 <lcuk> ive become quite adept at fitting bandage now :$
May 17 10:13:01 <lcuk> i made a stupid mistake last night
May 17 10:13:16 <lcuk> the end of the bandage is squishy
May 17 10:13:31 <MoonTiger> ewwwwwwww ++
May 17 10:14:03 <lcuk> lol MoonTiger i could show the pics :P
May 17 10:14:42 <MoonTiger> i had yoghurt with strawberries for brkfast ... i'll pass
May 17 10:15:11 <lcuk> and i was just kinda absent mindedly half nibbling the end (proxy finger nail nibbling..) and i caught the end of the finger and yelped so loud i woke tracy up :$
May 17 10:15:57 <lcuk> ive found i like fruit salad with banana yoghurt for breakfast
May 17 10:16:21 <Stskeeps> lcuk: are you at all able to code? :P
May 17 10:16:37 <lcuk> yes, ive got 9 fingers
May 17 10:16:40 <MoonTiger> brb trying to edit xfce menu
May 17 10:16:42 <lcuk> and they work
May 17 10:16:42 <MoonTiger> *sigh*
May 17 10:17:00 <lcuk> :( moon
May 17 10:18:08 <lcuk> i think i need to vanish too, ive got some heavy debugging to do
May 17 10:18:42 <MoonTiger> i'll be around more now i have internet at home :)
May 17 10:18:48 <MoonTiger> see you laterz ;)
May 17 10:18:57 <lcuk> cya \o
May 17 10:52:37 <mlpug> how do I know what filesystems n810 supports. this is diablo/2.6.21. I have NAS box supporting cifs/samba and would like to mount that on boot. I would like to have it just like in ubuntu (=one line in fstab). is this straightforward?
May 17 10:53:32 <mlpug> some cifs.ko module exists. I wonder if i should use that
May 17 10:57:39 <pupnik> who here uses maemo-sdk-0.9?
May 17 10:58:06 <pupnik> is it the right thing to use to get something finished, and in extras?
May 17 11:00:34 <Macer> hm
May 17 11:00:41 <Macer> anybody use tor on n800?
May 17 11:01:05 <Macer> i wish i had known about tor when i had it :)
May 17 11:07:24 <chrisk_> hi there! has anybody some experience with openobex on diablo? anybody ever use the c api?
May 17 11:19:24 <chrisk_> anybody some bluetooth programming experience in c? i hope there are still some c programmers out there ;-)
May 17 11:31:18 <pupnik> sorry chrisk_
May 17 11:31:40 <pupnik> all i remember is bluez-utils
May 17 11:33:08 <chrisk_> np pupnik. i am programming a bluetooth security tool and have some problems with openobex...
May 17 12:05:28 <rmt_> Hmm.. how to read files from a zip files with gnome-vfs?
May 17 12:06:16 <rmt_> And vala. :)
May 17 12:06:31 <rmt_> I was thinking that a simple working replacement for Comix shouldn't be hard..
May 17 12:19:32 <RST38h> Wowowow, somebody ported Crimson Fields!
May 17 12:19:58 <RST38h> mikkov actually
May 17 12:40:36 <lcuk> rmt_, there should be libs for reading zips and stuff
May 17 12:41:28 <rmt_> lcuk, libz, which I think is used by gnome-vfs (at least on my version, don't know about the cut-down osso version)
May 17 12:44:15 <VirginiaSteaks> hi guys, i want to compile a simple xmlrpc-client for maemo and getting the program cannot connect to localhost. why?
May 17 12:44:47 <rmt_> VirginiaSteaks, It does some tests during it's compile, and tries to connect to a local server?
May 17 12:45:14 <rmt_> VirginiaSteaks, What's your build environment?
May 17 12:45:19 <VirginiaSteaks> @rmt_: it has "http://localhost:8080/" hardcoded
May 17 12:45:37 <lcuk> does 8080 have anything listening
May 17 12:45:38 <rmt_> VirginiaSteaks, What's the xmlrpc client for?
May 17 12:45:41 <VirginiaSteaks> i used the sb2 for building and now the maemo sdk sudo runtime for starting
May 17 12:46:12 <rmt_> VirginiaSteaks, in order to make use of an xmlrpc client, you need an xmlrpc server.. it sounds like your client is for a specific purpose, if it has a hardcoded server..
May 17 12:46:40 <VirginiaSteaks> we want to implement a little audio blog software for maemo at university. and i have to build the communication part for it between client and server. we decided to use xmlrpc so that we can easily call functions over the network. but not as easy as expected ;)
May 17 12:47:23 <VirginiaSteaks> rmt_: i already compiled and started a sample xmlrpc-server. wait, i will send you the link, then you see. only a few lines of code. only for a proof that it is working properly..
May 17 12:47:36 <rmt_> Ok
May 17 12:50:52 <VirginiaSteaks> rmt_: the client example: http://xmlrpc-c.sourceforge.net/doc/#clientexample
May 17 12:51:14 <VirginiaSteaks> rmt_: and the server example: http://xmlrpc-c.sourceforge.net/doc/#serverexample
May 17 12:51:22 <biiter> is there any notepad application that behaves like paper and not like text editor??
May 17 12:51:23 <VirginiaSteaks> i can get both compiled for armel
May 17 12:51:40 <rmt_> biiter, With or without character recognition?
May 17 12:51:46 <biiter> rmt_: without
May 17 12:51:54 <rmt_> biiter, MaemoPad lets you draw.
May 17 12:52:03 <VirginiaSteaks> then i start the server, which seems to be listening. after that i start the client, which exits with an error
May 17 12:52:05 <rmt_> But also keep text notes and lists
May 17 12:52:50 <lcuk> biiter, liqbase is faster than paper :)
May 17 12:54:12 <biiter> thx.. i§ll trz both
May 17 12:55:25 <lcuk> biiter, http://maemo.org/downloads/product/OS2008/liqbase/ :)
May 17 12:55:46 <VirginiaSteaks> rmt_: brb
May 17 12:57:11 <rmt_> VirginiaSteaks, Not really sure (and I don't consider looking at random C code fun) .. but I suggest you do "telnet localhost 8080" on the tablet and see if it's actually listening, which should then tell you if the problem's with the client or the server.
May 17 12:57:44 <lcuk> telnet isnt (wasnt) directly available on the tablet lol
May 17 12:57:59 <lcuk> it was compiled and pushed to extras-devel yesterday after a long ML discussion
May 17 12:58:28 <VirginiaSteaks> rmt_: hmm but since even ping localhost doesn't work,..
May 17 12:58:49 <VirginiaSteaks> rmt_: I installed ping in sudo runtime via: apt-get install ping
May 17 12:58:50 <rmt_> install it or netcat or something..
May 17 12:59:40 <VirginiaSteaks> rmt_: XML-RPC Fault: HTTP request completed with HTTp error -906.  Fatal Error: Can't locate remote host (localhost)
May 17 12:59:47 <rmt_> VirginiaSteaks, No iptables rules setup?
May 17 12:59:57 <rmt_> Stop using the client and start testing;.
May 17 13:00:04 <rmt_> Divide and Conquer.
May 17 13:00:39 <rmt_> "sudo apt-get install netcat" (probably in extras or extras-devel) .. then do nc localhost 8080
May 17 13:00:47 <VirginiaSteaks> rmt_: no, I am not yet familiar with the scratchbox. I don't know what the differences are between it and my host system. (except other environment variables)
May 17 13:00:49 <rmt_> ~ $ nc localhost 8080
May 17 13:00:49 <rmt_> Nokia-N810-43-7 [127.0.0.1] 8080 (webcache) : Connection refused
May 17 13:00:56 <rmt_> On mine, I get that - because I have nothing listening.
May 17 13:01:06 <rmt_> VirginiaSteaks, Ah, you're in the scratchbox.
May 17 13:01:28 <VirginiaSteaks> rmt_: alright i will try the netcat
May 17 13:01:31 <rmt_> What kind of scratchbox
May 17 13:01:31 <rmt_> ?
May 17 13:01:33 <rmt_> VMWare image?  chroot?
May 17 13:02:03 <biiter> lcuk: that liqbas is some demo?
May 17 13:02:26 <lcuk> biiter, its got every single note ive taken since i started it last year :)
May 17 13:02:31 <lcuk> and i read and review often
May 17 13:02:36 <VirginiaSteaks> rmt_: we have gotten a VMware image (kubuntu) with an already installed maemo-sdk. i set both rootstrap and toolchain and i am compiling in sb2 and running in "maemo-sdk enter runtime"
May 17 13:02:41 <lcuk> dwhen does a demo become a real app :)
May 17 13:03:08 <lcuk> and im building on what ive started
May 17 13:04:17 <VirginiaSteaks> rmt_: netcat localhost 8080 timing out with: localhost:8080: forward host lookup failed: Host name lookup failure
May 17 13:04:35 <lcuk> try it with 127.0.0.1
May 17 13:05:24 <VirginiaSteaks> lcuk: same problem
May 17 13:05:25 <rmt_> The vmware image doesn't have localhost defined in /etc/hosts ?  Craziness!
May 17 13:05:36 <rmt_> netcat 127.0.0.1 8080 ?
May 17 13:05:45 <rmt_> Shouldn't be returning host name lookup failure
May 17 13:06:59 <rmt_> bbk
May 17 13:07:06 <VirginiaSteaks> rmt_: bash-3.1# nc 127.0.0.1 8080 ....  timing out, no response
May 17 13:07:25 <rmt_> Check iptables.. iptables -nvL
May 17 13:08:20 <VirginiaSteaks> rmt_: iptables v1.3.6
May 17 13:08:58 <pupnik_> http://tablets-dev.nokia.com/maemo-dev-env-downloads.php?f=Maemo_Diablo_Ubuntu_Gutsy_Server_Virtual_SDK_Image.zip
May 17 13:09:05 <pupnik_> how to resume download?
May 17 13:09:16 <pupnik_> wget -c can not resume.  firefox can not resume
May 17 13:10:16 <pupnik_> apparently the server doesn't support 'range' command?
May 17 13:13:24 <VirginiaSteaks> *sigh*, iptables answers this: http://rafb.net/p/ORZmf154.html
May 17 13:14:11 <VirginiaSteaks> if anybody has a clue how to ping localhost in scratchbox or runtime, please tell me
May 17 13:15:30 <pupnik_> kernel module misatch VirginiaSteaks ?
May 17 13:15:44 <VirginiaSteaks> pupnik_: yes, its  obviously server thing, cause firefox can resume normally
May 17 13:16:08 <pupnik_> that's harsh for a 1.7 GB download
May 17 13:16:34 <VirginiaSteaks> pupnik_: y :/..  hmm i don
May 17 13:17:15 <VirginiaSteaks> pupnik_: y :/..  hmm i dont know, wanted to run an xmlrpc client / server on the maemo runtime.. but it doesn't work and i dont know why (not leet enough in linux)
May 17 13:18:07 <pupnik_> hmmhm
May 17 13:18:47 <VirginiaSteaks> pupnik_: even ping localhost doesnt work. he cannot find localhost. but how to make him find localhost?
May 17 13:19:03 <pupnik_> don't check iptables, check interfaces, no?   ifconfig?
May 17 13:19:08 <pupnik_> and then route -n?
May 17 13:19:53 <pupnik_> is there a 'lo' interface in ifconfig in sdk?
May 17 13:19:57 <pupnik_> (/me has no idea)
May 17 13:19:58 <VirginiaSteaks> pupnik_: even ping 127.0.0.1 exits with: ping: icmp open socket: Operation not permitted
May 17 13:20:23 <VirginiaSteaks> not enough rights i guess
May 17 13:20:41 <pupnik_> um.  i don't recall but i think you need to be root to ping
May 17 13:20:50 <luke-jr> yes you do
May 17 13:20:58 <VirginiaSteaks> doesn't work as root also
May 17 13:21:10 <VirginiaSteaks> i enter "sudo" runtime and it doesnt work
May 17 13:21:11 <luke-jr> different error?
May 17 13:21:18 <VirginiaSteaks> or is there another third runtime environment? *confused*
May 17 13:21:24 <VirginiaSteaks> no, exactly the same error
May 17 13:21:29 <luke-jr> oh
May 17 13:21:31 <luke-jr> in scratchbox
May 17 13:21:37 <luke-jr> so it's probably faking root
May 17 13:21:46 <luke-jr> which won't work on a large scale
May 17 13:21:50 <luke-jr> eg, networking
May 17 13:23:05 <GAN800> Symbian is just not a very well put together platform and Nokia's utter failure to sell phones in the states is fully deserved.
May 17 13:23:21 <pupnik_> i haven't logged into scratchbox since april
May 17 13:23:22 <pupnik_> 2008
May 17 13:23:31 <biiter> lcuk: i can't use liqbate, the blitting is superb and it's what I had in mind but I miss the editing features and the GUI is terrible
May 17 13:23:39 <Stskeeps> GAN800: finally had enough? :P
May 17 13:23:41 <VirginiaSteaks> luke-jr: it is working on chroot. but this doesn't mean too much to me since in chroot it is only possible for i386 targets. and we need to compile for arm
May 17 13:23:55 <luke-jr> VirginiaSteaks: I chroot to arm
May 17 13:24:13 <VirginiaSteaks> luke-jr: how? for me there is written it only works for i386
May 17 13:24:20 <VirginiaSteaks> luke-jr: do we have an old verison?
May 17 13:24:25 <luke-jr> gotta hack in a qemu thing
May 17 13:24:54 <luke-jr> and set it up with bin_misc
May 17 13:24:58 <GAN800> Stskeeps, OTA isn't available for the NAM version, apparently, which, of course, they don't tell you when they're advertising the feature and only one person on the internet seems to know.
May 17 13:25:08 <VirginiaSteaks> luke-jr: ok that is too hight for me...*sighs*
May 17 13:25:31 <GAN800> Stskeeps, the cert insanity is ten times worse though.
May 17 13:25:43 <Stskeeps> GAN800: well you're spoiled having had a tablet..
May 17 13:25:51 <VirginiaSteaks> luke-jr: so you had to be in the maemo-sdk's developer team to know how to make a simple ping localhost work? ;-)
May 17 13:26:09 <luke-jr> VirginiaSteaks: what? I don't even USE Maemo, let alone be on some SDK devteam
May 17 13:26:26 <Stskeeps> yeah, luke-jr is a heathen
May 17 13:26:27 <Stskeeps> :P
May 17 13:26:29 <GAN800> Basically, I don't know what software these Symbian freaks have been using (or what they've been smoking) that makes them think this is worthwhile software.
May 17 13:26:34 <luke-jr> ping isn't *that* simple, either
May 17 13:27:31 <luke-jr> IIRC, ping works with raw sockets
May 17 13:27:58 <Stskeeps> GAN800: so, maemo > symbian? ;)
May 17 13:28:42 <VirginiaSteaks> luke-jr: ok luke, any clue what i can do now? i already did the following: -compile xmlrpc api for am -compile the examples provided with the api -start the example xmlrpc server (listening to port 8080). and now i only want to test out if the whole thing is working by starting the xmlrpc-client which should connect to localhost:8080 and make a procedure call (add two numbers).
May 17 13:29:37 <GAN800> Stskeeps, Maemo doesn't not let me install software for no reason.
May 17 13:29:42 <luke-jr> VirginiaSteaks: yeah, now you can migrate to Gentoo and leave that confusing stuff behind :p
May 17 13:30:28 <VirginiaSteaks> luke-jr: i love gentoo, but we have to use this "nice confusing AWESOME" toolchain, because we need to crosscompile for the arm plattform because our blogsoftware has to run on the nokia 800 later on
May 17 13:30:42 <GAN800> Stskeeps, anyway, bring on tge Linux phones. Symbian can rot.
May 17 13:31:08 <luke-jr> VirginiaSteaks: AFAIK, mere crosscompiling won't make it work in Maemo
May 17 13:31:14 <GAN800> I amazed at how much better Maemo's app distribution is than Symbian's.
May 17 13:31:29 <luke-jr> VirginiaSteaks: if you missed the hints: I run Gentoo on my N810, I don't use Maemo.
May 17 13:32:06 <VirginiaSteaks> luke-jr: wow, i really missed your hint ;> was it hard to get it installed on N810?
May 17 13:32:11 <LinuxCode> luke-jr, gps, kb and touch screen work for you ?
May 17 13:32:18 <luke-jr> VirginiaSteaks: it's a work-in-progress
May 17 13:32:27 <luke-jr> LinuxCode: depends
May 17 13:32:34 <luke-jr> LinuxCode: kb is broken in latest 2.6.30
May 17 13:32:39 <LinuxCode> i see
May 17 13:32:49 <LinuxCode> how about gps and the screen ?
May 17 13:32:51 <luke-jr> GPS requires evil dirty hacks due to Nokia being closed source
May 17 13:32:55 <LinuxCode> yeh
May 17 13:33:01 <luke-jr> and unwilling to budge reasonably
May 17 13:33:03 <LinuxCode> I thought of that, hence me asking
May 17 13:33:15 <luke-jr> touchscreen "just works"
May 17 13:33:20 <LinuxCode> k
May 17 13:33:27 <luke-jr> plasma eats RAM tho, so I don't usually run X
May 17 13:33:43 <luke-jr> and my Xmodmap (Fn key support) broke when I installed KDE
May 17 13:34:32 <luke-jr> oh, and qt-webkit needs to be linked on another system
May 17 13:34:35 <luke-jr> 128 MB doesn't cut it
May 17 13:36:02 <LinuxCode> hehe
May 17 13:36:32 <LinuxCode> I hope the new Nxxx will have ta least 512MB
May 17 13:36:57 <luke-jr> I'm not sure I want to buy Nokia again
May 17 13:37:07 <LinuxCode> I will
May 17 13:37:15 <LinuxCode> wouldnt buy a standard mobile though
May 17 13:37:25 <luke-jr> N810 has kinda soured me
May 17 13:37:27 <LinuxCode> I want the Nxxx with 3g and phone support
May 17 13:37:45 <luke-jr> I bought it because I thought it was open source
May 17 13:37:53 <luke-jr> or at least capable of being run open source
May 17 13:38:13 <LinuxCode> luke-jr, well, lets face it, you wont get full OSS on all hardware platforms
May 17 13:38:17 <luke-jr> instead I find it's simply an abandoned product that Nokia won't even let the community support
May 17 13:38:25 <LinuxCode> and thats often not due to compnaies like Nokia
May 17 13:38:45 <LinuxCode> its due to them having to apply the T&Cs they get from other chip makers
May 17 13:38:46 <LinuxCode> ;-[
May 17 13:39:22 <LinuxCode> yeh support for maemo seems to have been abandoned
May 17 13:39:25 <luke-jr> LinuxCode: the GPS example lets me blame Nokia
May 17 13:39:27 <LinuxCode> at least it always sounds like it
May 17 13:39:33 <LinuxCode> luke-jr, why ?
May 17 13:39:41 <LinuxCode> I bet you they dont make the actual part
May 17 13:39:42 <luke-jr> they could have put TI's IPR into a library
May 17 13:39:49 <luke-jr> and left the rest open
May 17 13:39:58 <luke-jr> so I could modify it to not require GTK+
May 17 13:40:09 <LinuxCode> hehe
May 17 13:40:11 <luke-jr> and not require "user" user
May 17 13:40:30 <luke-jr> and a library would be easier to reverse engineer than the entire blob
May 17 13:40:36 <LinuxCode> what we really need is mainstream distros that people can pick and mix from
May 17 13:40:53 <LinuxCode> and then do like interfaces the distros can use to use the hardware
May 17 13:41:03 <luke-jr> sigh, no
May 17 13:41:10 <LinuxCode> why no ?
May 17 13:41:11 <luke-jr> we need the companies to mainline their hardware support
May 17 13:41:18 <LinuxCode> or that
May 17 13:41:22 <luke-jr> so I can just build a vanilla Linux kernel and boot
May 17 13:41:31 <LinuxCode> yeh, that would be better
May 17 13:41:38 <LinuxCode> or ideal reather
May 17 13:41:40 <LinuxCode> rather*
May 17 13:43:17 <VirginiaSteaks> hi guys, on general question about autotools: let's say i downloaded and installed xmlrpc-c library. i do "./configure", "make" and "make install". but let's say i want to write a small piece of c code that uses this (already compiled) library. how can i automatically compile it with the right flags/paths so that it will make use of my xmlrpc-library? or is this too difficult to explain it in short?
May 17 13:43:44 <luke-jr> the thing that really bugs me the most is the whole attitude of "we're not making any money off N810 anymore, so no time to spend giving you the required stuff to use it"
May 17 13:43:58 <LinuxCode> N810 agreed
May 17 13:44:08 <LinuxCode> considering its age too
May 17 13:44:14 <Stskeeps> dear god @ the haiku thread
May 17 13:44:20 <luke-jr> VirginiaSteaks: xmlrpc-c-config
May 17 13:44:56 <luke-jr> LinuxCode: doesn't change the fact that I paid $200 for it and should have fair use rights to information on how to use it
May 17 13:45:06 <luke-jr> instead of having to spend days reverse engineering crap
May 17 13:45:47 <LinuxCode> I know what you mean, but then thats how we got most stuff in the kernel, but its a bit like going to the olden days yeah
May 17 13:46:14 <luke-jr> I suspect most stuff in the kernel was documented :p
May 17 13:46:22 <LinuxCode> sadly some compansies are still ignorant what linux is concerned
May 17 13:46:26 <luke-jr> there's only a few notable exceptions like Atheros and Broadcom wifi
May 17 13:46:53 <LinuxCode> the way I see it though
May 17 13:47:05 <LinuxCode> Id rather see some Linux based devices, than non
May 17 13:47:11 <mavhc> is it more open than any other company managed?
May 17 13:47:13 <Stskeeps> nokia's not ignorant in that regard though, did you see the massive amount of patches nokia have made? :P
May 17 13:47:28 <LinuxCode> or horrible hacks like the Jornada 710 hack, to reset it into system mode to then boot a linux kernel
May 17 13:47:33 <LinuxCode> seems rather stupid
May 17 13:47:43 <LinuxCode> Stskeeps, yeh
May 17 13:47:44 <Stskeeps> some of the equipment used in the tablets however are ofdd
May 17 13:47:53 <luke-jr> mavhc: no
May 17 13:48:17 <luke-jr> SmartQ outdone Nokia well
May 17 13:48:24 <luke-jr> now they just need to get a keyboard and stuff
May 17 13:48:27 <LinuxCode> it requires a combined effort really of mnay manufacturers
May 17 13:49:49 <mavhc> and a sales force
May 17 13:53:13 <LinuxCode> ;-| 128mb mem only
May 17 13:53:29 * LinuxCode bookmarks
May 17 13:54:34 <luke-jr> LinuxCode: ?
May 17 13:55:00 <LinuxCode> http://www.engadget.com/2009/05/17/smartq-7-mid-unboxing/
May 17 13:55:03 <luke-jr> ah
May 17 13:55:05 <LinuxCode> is that what you are talking about ?
May 17 13:55:10 <luke-jr> yeah, I think
May 17 13:55:11 <mavhc> if people are going to write inefficient apps we need >128MB ram
May 17 13:55:13 <luke-jr> Stskeeps has a 5
May 17 13:55:28 <luke-jr> mavhc: I've been mind-ranting over that for a few days
May 17 13:55:36 <luke-jr> mavhc: NT 3.1 only needed 12 MB RAM
May 17 13:55:48 <luke-jr> what do we have today to justify over 10 times that?
May 17 13:55:59 <LinuxCode> smartq havent even got a decent web page
May 17 13:56:04 <LinuxCode> I cant even find the right link
May 17 13:56:11 <luke-jr> LinuxCode: it has no US distributors yet AFAIK
May 17 13:56:13 <luke-jr> just Chinese
May 17 13:56:21 * LinuxCode rolls eyes
May 17 13:56:22 <mavhc> the only thing I can excuse is the browser
May 17 13:56:33 <mavhc> I'd rather buy from nokia than randomchineseguy
May 17 13:56:33 <Stskeeps> LinuxCode: smartdevices.com.cn
May 17 13:56:46 <luke-jr> mavhc: I can't see the browser making up for 118 MB extra RAM use :p
May 17 13:56:58 <LinuxCode> lovely
May 17 13:57:07 <LinuxCode> my mandarin is rusty
May 17 13:57:09 <LinuxCode> lol
May 17 13:57:23 <luke-jr> mavhc: I wish Sharp stayed in the market
May 17 13:57:35 <luke-jr> the Zaurus SL-Cx series was a much better form factor
May 17 13:57:47 <mavhc> there's no reason for other apps to use so much when I ran DTP apps in 1MB ram
May 17 13:59:53 <luke-jr> well, I need to get going
May 17 13:59:55 <luke-jr> or so says my wife
May 17 13:59:57 <luke-jr> ☺
May 17 13:59:58 <luke-jr> bbl
May 17 14:06:09 <mavhc> so smartq has the driver source code on their website?
May 17 14:06:29 <Stskeeps> nah, but i do - i asked for it and got it
May 17 14:06:46 <Stskeeps> excepting some S3C IPR with codecs (which we don't need), we have everything (except one measly tool..)
May 17 14:10:41 <chrisk_> are there normally some differences between distro libraries and the libraries for maemo in it's functions?
May 17 14:14:35 <slonopotamus> oh my
May 17 14:14:51 <slonopotamus> open-wlan-cal learned to set iq values
May 17 14:15:07 <Stskeeps> good work :)
May 17 14:15:11 <Stskeeps> can you set regulatory domain yet? :P
May 17 14:15:46 <lcuk> biiter, :D the ui is terrible how
May 17 14:18:27 <slonopotamus> Stskeeps, nope, i need more strace data for that
May 17 14:20:06 <slonopotamus> err
May 17 14:20:09 <slonopotamus> ~ping
May 17 14:20:11 <infobot> ~pong
May 17 14:20:21 <slonopotamus> ah, thought broke smth
May 17 14:21:55 <pupnik_> i can't get the pic of gothopotamus out of my head
May 17 14:22:58 <pupnik_> nice, someone made cat-typing detection software to prevent cats from chatting on your machine, executing commands etc
May 17 14:23:15 <lcuk> also prevents drunken typing
May 17 14:25:04 <LinuxCode> lcuk, haha
May 17 14:25:09 <LinuxCode> wasnt there a project
May 17 14:25:10 <pupnik_> that would be an impressive feat
May 17 14:25:19 <LinuxCode> didnt google implement that feature /
May 17 14:25:21 <lcuk> google do it for mail
May 17 14:25:24 <pupnik_> neural-net.  train it to detect your Blood-Alcohol-Level
May 17 14:25:24 <LinuxCode> yeh
May 17 14:25:25 <LinuxCode> !
May 17 14:25:28 <lcuk> but thats slightly different
May 17 14:25:38 <lcuk> requires knowledge before sending
May 17 14:25:50 <lcuk> not the same as generic wfaweaegweufaufgkajDGAKDJTG IDENTIFICATION
May 17 14:26:32 <VirginiaSteaks> hi guys, why doesn't provide the "enter sudo runtime" of maemo-sdk REAL root rights?
May 17 14:27:03 <pupnik_> it's a chroot environment, afaik
May 17 14:27:06 <lcuk> parse i sentence cannot
May 17 14:27:15 <slonopotamus> pupnik_, o_O
May 17 14:27:28 <VirginiaSteaks> i need to implement sockets, which isn't allowed in "maemo-sdk enter runtime". it only works in the chroot environment, but the chroot doesn't work for crosscompiling to ARMEL
May 17 14:27:28 <slonopotamus> pupnik_, gothopotamus - ?
May 17 14:27:36 <pupnik_> never seen the pic, slonopotamus ?
May 17 14:27:58 <slonopotamus> nope
May 17 14:28:27 <slonopotamus> luke-jr, http://git.slonopotamus.org/?p=opendsme;a=blob;f=open-wlan-cal.c;h=4b920cb1cab113a6113680a338bba41597d87dec;hb=HEAD#l170
May 17 14:28:32 <pupnik_> http://www.bannedinhollywood.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/04/gothopotamus.jpg  slonopotamus
May 17 14:29:33 <lcuk> the harpoons, man them!
May 17 14:29:57 <lcuk> infact, i think we should nuke it from orbit, its the only way to be sure!
May 17 14:30:06 <slonopotamus> oh my
May 17 14:30:57 <slonopotamus> ah, luke gone
May 17 14:31:40 <Stskeeps> slonopotamus: didn't know you actually coded :P
May 17 14:32:16 <Stskeeps> slonopotamus: good job on open-wlan-cal btw
May 17 14:36:51 <thux> there are two kinds of people some code others don't
May 17 14:37:18 <Stskeeps> GAN800: think there's any way we can tell Maemo SW that closed source dbus APIs are ridicolous?
May 17 14:37:27 <Stskeeps> (sp)
May 17 14:37:57 <lcuk> Stskeeps, send them a letter
May 17 14:38:01 <lcuk> phone them up
May 17 14:38:10 <lcuk> use a very loud tannoy
May 17 14:38:24 <lcuk> t-shirt campaign?
May 17 14:39:22 <man_in_pda> hmm
May 17 14:39:26 <samueldr> I would wear such a t-shirt
May 17 14:39:44 <samueldr> it would sure make everyone asks me what's an API and what's a dbus
May 17 14:39:46 <man_in_pda> stardict doesn't come with dictionaries
May 17 14:39:54 <man_in_pda> this is irritating
May 17 14:40:32 <samueldr> how would it know which dictionnary to load?
May 17 14:40:50 <samueldr> I mean from apt, if that's what you mean
May 17 14:41:10 <lcuk> should it load all dictionaries for the world and hope you speak one of them?
May 17 14:41:15 <man_in_pda> even a simple interface to select dicts to download would be nice
May 17 14:41:20 <samueldr> true
May 17 14:41:22 <lcuk> agreed there
May 17 14:41:25 <man_in_pda> lcuk, yes :P
May 17 14:41:29 <samueldr> but hardly possible from apt
May 17 14:41:49 <samueldr> there should be some "post-apt-installation-tasks-for-localisation-issues" type of tasks available
May 17 14:41:56 <samueldr> I mean, it should be added
May 17 14:42:38 <man_in_pda> yeah, but would be nice from inside app
May 17 14:43:21 <slonopotamus> Stskeeps, uh? you thought i'm just talking? :)
May 17 14:44:14 <Stskeeps> slonopotamus: yeah, well, i'm glad to have underestimated you ;)
May 17 14:45:15 <slonopotamus> Stskeeps, :P
May 17 14:49:25 <slonopotamus> still nobody wants to hack on open-wlan-cal? :) it's still missing rx/tx tuning data reading
May 17 14:50:30 <samueldr> wooh! it's hard to state my thoughts in 140 characters
May 17 14:50:46 <samueldr> what's open-wlan-cal?
May 17 14:53:40 <man_in_pda> bah
May 17 14:54:02 <man_in_pda> i can't find downloadable dictionaries for stardit
May 17 14:54:45 <slonopotamus> samueldr, opensource rewrite of wlan-cal utility
May 17 14:55:27 <samueldr> and wlan-cal is?
May 17 14:55:30 <samueldr> the wlan driver?
May 17 14:56:15 <slonopotamus> userspace driver helper
May 17 14:57:06 <slonopotamus> wifi chip doesn't have persistent memory, so data has to be read from flash and given to it
May 17 14:57:41 <samueldr> I'll nod affirmatively to that, and back away slowly
May 17 14:58:17 <slonopotamus> :P
May 17 15:00:04 <samueldr> is it reverse-engineered or do you have a reference to follow?
May 17 15:00:41 <slonopotamus> i use strace to see what it does to kernel/fs
May 17 15:01:38 <samueldr> okay
May 17 15:13:08 <Stskeeps> oh for fucks sake
May 17 15:13:16 <Stskeeps> "open is not a known keyword. The legal keyword names are listed here. "
May 17 15:13:22 <Stskeeps> (bugzilla)
May 17 15:14:48 <Stskeeps> GeneralAntilles: https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=4560
May 17 15:31:32 <Stskeeps> any device community with linux on it diverges towards having Debian on the device.
May 17 15:34:44 <pupnik_> is android something that should Just Go Away (tm) ?
May 17 15:34:58 <pupnik_> that's my gut feeling atm
May 17 15:36:54 <pupnik_> anybody else want to putz with new dosbox?
May 17 15:37:10 <pupnik_> exciting patches lately
May 17 15:38:00 <pupnik_> with some memcpy optim, perhaps 1.5x faster now
May 17 15:38:09 <pupnik_> and attention paid to cache
May 17 16:00:47 * pupnik_ wants to hwhack the n810
May 17 16:03:42 <pupnik_> http://www.pearl.de/a-PE5328-1010.shtml?vid=713  micro usb dpad - Eu 6,90
May 17 16:04:20 <Stskeeps> interesting
May 17 16:05:59 * pupnik_ ponders a homemade mold to fit around n810 with controls embedded
May 17 16:11:22 <RST38h> pupnik: lcuk is your man
May 17 16:11:27 <RST38h> he has made a wooden one
May 17 16:22:38 <rmt> Jaa - turn n810 into a real gaming device. :-)
May 17 16:22:57 <RST38h> rmt: Wiimote is sufficient for that =)
May 17 16:22:59 <rmt> For < €10 would indeed be ideal. :-)
May 17 16:23:32 <rmt> Hehe, indeed.. how's that project going? :)
May 17 16:40:20 <Guest9971_368> general A is here?
May 17 16:41:35 <Guest9971_368> GeneralAntille   i need some info about make a start up appli ( iam stock in the changelog file editing)
May 17 16:41:55 <Guest9971_368> vs source
May 17 17:42:18 <lcuk> evening maemoers \o
May 17 17:45:36 <GeneralAntilles> Guest9971_368?
May 17 17:45:59 <lopz> hola
May 17 17:46:41 <lcuk> hiya lopz
May 17 17:46:54 <lcuk> lopz i had a user asking me the other night if you are a bot
May 17 17:47:54 <lopz> lcuk, no :)
May 17 17:48:04 <lcuk> well you would say that lol
May 17 17:48:17 <lcuk> what *do* you do then
May 17 17:48:18 <lopz> hehe
May 17 17:49:07 <lopz> lcuk, I love python, but I speak little English
May 17 17:49:09 <lopz> and you ?
May 17 17:49:43 <lcuk> i hack at liqbase :)
May 17 17:50:17 <lcuk> what are you writing in python then
May 17 17:52:22 <lopz> lcuk	
May 17 17:52:23 <lopz> nothing for now, but worked on a GUI for gentoo, for /etc/conf.d/*
May 17 17:52:43 <lopz> 	
May 17 17:52:43 <lopz> and small scripts for my personal use
May 17 17:53:17 <lopz> I have an N800, but little use now that I do not have wifi at home
May 17 17:53:17 <lcuk> :O what happens when you are replaced by one of your own small scripts?
May 17 17:53:50 <lcuk> what other handhelds have you gotten to play with then
May 17 17:53:57 <lcuk> or are you just back on your desktop
May 17 17:54:41 <lopz> I'm in windows, that the Uni I'm learning c# :(
May 17 17:54:42 <lopz> lcuk,
May 17 17:55:51 <lcuk> ewwwwwww c# smells.  they should be teaching you visual basic.net instead :)
May 17 17:56:13 <lopz> haha
May 17 17:56:20 <VDVsx> lcuk, bahh, just C :P
May 17 17:56:30 <RST38h> lcuk
May 17 17:56:32 <VDVsx> lopz, you are Spanish ?
May 17 17:56:45 <lopz> VDVsx, sí, y tu ?
May 17 17:56:56 <lcuk> yeah RST38h
May 17 17:57:11 <VDVsx> lopz, Portuguese ;)
May 17 17:57:24 <lopz> oh, ok
May 17 17:57:49 <lopz> bef0rd, yashira?
May 17 17:59:02 <x29a> anybody set up an openvpn server somewhere and client on n810/maemo?
May 17 17:59:45 <lcuk> http://www.google.co.uk/search?q=openvpn+maemo
May 17 17:59:47 <lcuk> i think they have
May 17 17:59:54 <lcuk> since theres stuff in extras for it
May 17 18:00:53 <x29a> i have it running and everything
May 17 18:01:02 <x29a> just the routes are messed up
May 17 18:01:13 <x29a> so id need somebody with indepth knowledge
May 17 18:01:44 <lcuk> would it be something generic enough that indepth tutorial for maemoline linux could help?
May 17 18:02:00 <lcuk> s\maemoline\mainline\
May 17 18:02:10 <lcuk> or whatever the grep thing is
May 17 18:05:12 <lcuk> hehe Moo-mo :D http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=288217&postcount=199
May 17 18:16:00 <Macer> lol
May 17 18:16:16 <Macer> leave it to the IRS to be the first agency to try to force the swiss to give up banking information
May 17 18:19:08 <RST38h> At least it has not come to bombing Switzerland yet
May 17 18:19:24 <derf> Give us time.
May 17 18:20:38 * RST38h will get some popcorn in the meanwhile
May 17 18:22:05 <LinuxCode> Macer, the US is not the only country to put pressure on Switzerland and other countries
May 17 18:22:11 <LinuxCode> The EU is angry
May 17 18:22:17 <LinuxCode> people hiding money
May 17 18:22:36 <LinuxCode> Liechtenstein is worse
May 17 18:23:00 <derf> Yeah, but the EU usually doesn't go around shooting people when they get angry at them.
May 17 18:23:22 <LinuxCode> define shooting
May 17 18:23:40 <LinuxCode> some memberstates have bribed people to get the info on tax evaders
May 17 18:23:41 * RST38h wonders how to define shooting without killing LinuxCode in the process
May 17 18:23:52 <LinuxCode> RST38h, guns are banned here
May 17 18:23:55 <RST38h> Maybe got for his kneecaps first?
May 17 18:24:47 <derf> "Shoot, v. i. 1. To cause an engine or weapon to discharge a missile; -- said of a person or an agent; as, they shot at a target; he shoots better than he rides."
May 17 18:26:30 <LinuxCode> derf, far better way to kill people
May 17 18:26:38 <LinuxCode> you are living in washington
May 17 18:26:41 <LinuxCode> you should know
May 17 18:26:51 <LinuxCode> every 13th person is hiv positive
May 17 18:27:18 <RST38h> HIV isn't the best way to kill people really
May 17 18:27:34 <derf> I also don't see what HIV has to do with Washington.
May 17 18:28:01 <LinuxCode> derf, Washington DC has a AIDS rate similar to the worst affected areas in the world
May 17 18:28:43 <derf> It was also the murder capital of the world for a long time, and still ranks up there pretty high.
May 17 18:31:09 <derf> I don't know which one actualy results in more deaths, but I know which one makes the news regularly.
May 17 18:49:48 <Macer> LinuxCode: well.. too bad :)
May 17 18:49:50 <Macer> lol
May 17 18:50:12 <LinuxCode> Macer, plenty of other places to stash your billions
May 17 18:50:26 <Macer> why must everybody in the world adhere to invasions of privacy?
May 17 18:50:42 <Macer> i suppose complacency?
May 17 18:50:48 <LinuxCode> why must every rich fucker who has a billion try to not pay taxes
May 17 18:51:02 <LinuxCode> if you dont wan to pay tax, move to a country where they dont have any
May 17 18:51:05 <RST38h> Macer: because there is not much anyone can do
May 17 18:51:22 <Macer> LinuxCode: probably because their success has been penalized
May 17 18:51:23 <RST38h> Macer: or, actually, there is a few simple things you can do but people are sheep and thus do not do them
May 17 18:51:45 <Macer> most countries give breaks to people who decided to make errors in their lives.. and turn around and tax doctors who spent most of their lives in school
May 17 18:51:52 <LinuxCode> Macer, paying 30% tax on the interest of your billion isnt going to make anhy difference to you
May 17 18:52:04 <Macer> so the doctor who decided to do the right thing.. it taxed more for success simply because there are too many stupid people?
May 17 18:52:10 <LinuxCode> Macer, you can negotiate a deal with the swiss cantons
May 17 18:52:11 <RST38h> LinuxCode: Says who?
May 17 18:52:13 <Macer> who need to be taken care of because of their mistakes?
May 17 18:52:23 <LinuxCode> if you ar rich and want to move to switzerland
May 17 18:52:35 <LinuxCode> problem is, the rich people dont want to move
May 17 18:52:52 <LinuxCode> they want to  keep their money and live in the country of choice
May 17 18:53:04 <LinuxCode> then you pay tax! Like you and me do!
May 17 18:53:09 <Macer> LinuxCode: because a lot of rich people would rather stay here and fight it with campaign money
May 17 18:53:36 <Macer> LinuxCode: it is not a matter of percentage. it is the principle that success is being taxed
May 17 18:53:43 * RST38h frankly sees no point in this discussion
May 17 18:53:45 <Macer> while failure is being rewarded
May 17 18:53:46 <LinuxCode> everybody is being taxed
May 17 18:53:53 <LinuxCode> RST38h, +1
May 17 18:53:55 <RST38h> Do any of you have at least one million bucks?
May 17 18:54:08 <LinuxCode> RST38h, exactly
May 17 18:54:10 <RST38h> No? Then you are fucked by definition, punks.
May 17 18:54:15 <LinuxCode> thatnks for that point
May 17 18:54:17 <Macer> lol.. no but i am on track for it.. and in the end i am paying for someone's drug rehab
May 17 18:54:33 <LinuxCode> Macer, you are paying for streets etc..
May 17 18:54:36 <LinuxCode> in a fair manner
May 17 18:54:46 <Macer> thsoe are property taxes and municipal taxes
May 17 18:54:56 <LinuxCode> i.e. by paying a percentage that will not do you much harm
May 17 18:55:02 <Macer> i will give you the national highways.. but a lot of those are also taken care of by tolls
May 17 18:55:07 <Macer> (another "tax")
May 17 18:55:11 <LinuxCode> but will help others earning minimum, to help better themselves
May 17 18:55:34 <Macer> which statistically has failed
May 17 18:55:45 <Macer> yet money is continually pumped into failures
May 17 18:56:00 <Macer> look at aig :)
May 17 18:56:04 * LinuxCode is happy with the 50% tax rate above £100k
May 17 18:56:17 <LinuxCode> very few people earn that
May 17 18:56:22 <Macer> a massive failure . yet .. taxes are "saving" them
May 17 18:56:25 <LinuxCode> and those who do can afford the tax
May 17 18:56:43 <Macer> our sympathy system rewards failures
May 17 18:57:03 <RST38h> Translation: your friendly UK government makes it impossible for people to make >f100k
May 17 18:57:09 <RST38h> and <f1m
May 17 18:57:24 <RST38h> Because if you make >f1m you have ways to stash it
May 17 18:57:26 <Macer> i don't think helping 1 out of 1000 better themselves is a good investment of my money
May 17 18:57:29 <LinuxCode> Macer, you want to pay less tax, tell your government to spen less on amrs
May 17 18:57:33 <RST38h> If you make <f100k you are taxed less
May 17 18:58:05 <RST38h> For the rest of poor hapless brits, the moment they make >f100k, their government takes the half
May 17 18:58:12 <LinuxCode> RST38h, you can keep the money in the business, then you dont pay tax
May 17 18:58:13 <Macer> LinuxCode: protection is more important than helping a woman who decided to have 10 kids with 7 different men while dropping out of school
May 17 18:58:22 <LinuxCode> if it is reinvested
May 17 18:58:27 <RST38h> Linux: Only if you have a business
May 17 18:58:37 <LinuxCode> Macer, thats not the average person
May 17 18:58:47 <Macer> LinuxCode: that is the average person who is on our sympathy programs
May 17 18:58:50 <LinuxCode> RST38h, you dont make a million unless you do have a business
May 17 18:59:04 <LinuxCode> Macer, time to emigrate then
May 17 18:59:11 <LinuxCode> saying that, you get those people everywhere
May 17 18:59:16 <LinuxCode> not the norm though
May 17 18:59:35 <Macer> LinuxCode: norm enough to require massive amounts of currency in order to support failure
May 17 19:00:02 <LinuxCode> well thats your problem lol
May 17 19:00:08 <Macer> then there are people who worked 5 years and collect social security .. amounts that are far more than they put in beacuse they didn't properly prepare for the future
May 17 19:00:22 <Macer> another rewarded failure
May 17 19:00:42 <LinuxCode> if it were that simple
May 17 19:01:13 <Macer> i suppose that is a valid point LinuxCode
May 17 19:02:15 <LinuxCode> Macer, your Health Insurance is also a tax
May 17 19:02:26 <LinuxCode> and thats not even coming from the Government
May 17 19:02:28 <Macer> with so many people the system becomes a complexity of statistical data which is the only way our government can decide on how to deal with, as you said, getting people to better themselves
May 17 19:02:43 <Macer> LinuxCode: but that is worth paying for ;)
May 17 19:02:50 <LinuxCode> you reckon ?
May 17 19:02:55 <LinuxCode> wait until you get ill
May 17 19:03:04 <LinuxCode> only pay 12 months treatment, pay excess
May 17 19:03:12 <lcuk> i dont mind people who work and put their share in and then through no fault of their own they end up jobless and need supporting
May 17 19:03:13 <LinuxCode> then its pre-exisiting condition
May 17 19:03:15 <Macer> i have.. and i have awesome coverage because i pay for it
May 17 19:03:18 <LinuxCode> = you stuffed
May 17 19:03:24 <LinuxCode> God bless America!
May 17 19:03:26 <Macer> lcuk: i agree.
May 17 19:03:38 <Macer> but when is enough.. enough?
May 17 19:03:56 <lcuk> those same people will try what they can to get back to "normality" and a paying job asap
May 17 19:03:58 <LinuxCode> lcuk, I think we in the UK are lucky
May 17 19:04:11 <LinuxCode> lcuk, most will
May 17 19:04:19 <LinuxCode> cant live from job seekers allowance
May 17 19:04:30 <LinuxCode> and there will always be people exploiting the system
May 17 19:04:41 <Macer> honestly. i think the govt should have a "one chance ACT" where they will pay for someone's housing and education and child care long enough for them to finish an undergrad .. and if they fail. then that's it.
May 17 19:04:42 <lcuk> jsa+hb+ctb+xyz
May 17 19:05:01 * Macer writes his congressman
May 17 19:05:03 <Macer> lol
May 17 19:05:20 <LinuxCode> Macer, US unis cost 60k or so
May 17 19:05:32 <LinuxCode> free market economy
May 17 19:05:36 <RST38h> 30k
May 17 19:05:39 <LinuxCode> you cant have all you want
May 17 19:05:43 <LinuxCode> RST38h, per year
May 17 19:05:44 <RST38h> 60k is kinda high for a US uni
May 17 19:05:48 <RST38h> Per year, yes
May 17 19:05:56 <LinuxCode> I paid that per the whole course
May 17 19:05:57 <RST38h> + smart people get workstudy program
May 17 19:06:02 <lcuk> 29.9k on beer
May 17 19:06:07 <LinuxCode> lcuk, exactly
May 17 19:06:10 <LinuxCode> living expenses
May 17 19:06:14 <lcuk> actually, this is us
May 17 19:06:18 <LinuxCode> I didnt even pay fees
May 17 19:06:27 <RST38h> Folks, I think we have met different US students :)
May 17 19:06:28 <lcuk> what DO american students spend money on if its not the SU bar
May 17 19:06:38 * lcuk asks one
May 17 19:06:38 <LinuxCode> lcuk, lol
May 17 19:06:40 <LinuxCode> books
May 17 19:06:48 <LinuxCode> rofl
May 17 19:06:49 <lcuk> z4chh, what would you spend your money on
May 17 19:06:56 <Stskeeps> the only american student i met was one joyous to find out she could drink in denmark but not at home, and ended up sleeping with a lot of danes
May 17 19:06:58 <lcuk> ahhh , so the publishers spend the money on the beer
May 17 19:06:59 <Stskeeps> :P
May 17 19:07:03 <z4chh> hmmm
May 17 19:07:04 <LinuxCode> RST38h, we arent in the US
May 17 19:07:07 <z4chh> gsoc money?
May 17 19:07:17 <RST38h> Linux: I got BS, MS, and PhD in the US
May 17 19:07:20 <lcuk> no, the yearly money you will need to be in uni
May 17 19:07:24 <LinuxCode> Stskeeps, proper American girl then
May 17 19:07:47 <RST38h> Linux: And, as kinda expert, I can tell you that it is NOT partying all day and night
May 17 19:08:00 <LinuxCode> RST38h, I dint imply that or say that
May 17 19:08:04 <LinuxCode> I didnt say beer
May 17 19:08:05 <derf> You can go in-state for <$16k in a lot of places.
May 17 19:08:13 <RST38h> Linux: In fact, UMD.EDU was a pretty boring place. Some frat guys, usually rotating as they get kicked out
May 17 19:08:29 <RST38h> Linux: $30k/year for out of state, less than that in state
May 17 19:08:30 <Stskeeps> LinuxCode: blonde, loose and drunk, just like in porn
May 17 19:08:30 <Stskeeps> :P
May 17 19:08:44 <RST38h> Linux: lots of study if you actually want to graduate
May 17 19:08:51 <LinuxCode> Stskeeps, lets import some American girls
May 17 19:09:03 <LinuxCode> RST38h, Ive been through the University system
May 17 19:09:04 <RST38h> Linux: + some of these poor guys had misfortune of having me as instructor =)
May 17 19:09:07 <LinuxCode> I know how it works
May 17 19:09:18 <lcuk> yeah LinuxCode we can tell
May 17 19:09:25 <LinuxCode> lcuk, lol
May 17 19:09:26 <LinuxCode> ;-p
May 17 19:09:34 <RST38h> Linux: Import Polish girls. Way cheaper, less brain bugs, better looking
May 17 19:09:44 <LinuxCode> brain bugs ?
May 17 19:09:50 <Stskeeps> RST38h: being engaged to one, i will agree
May 17 19:09:50 <derf> Really, I don't know why anyone would want an American girl.
May 17 19:09:51 <LinuxCode> ohh you mean spoilt bitches
May 17 19:09:58 <LinuxCode> yeh I would agree on that
May 17 19:10:02 <RST38h> Linux: I mean feminist shit
May 17 19:10:13 <LinuxCode> but then Europeans are more down to Earth
May 17 19:10:21 <lcuk> i wouldnt mind a world tour actually :)
May 17 19:10:28 <LinuxCode> my ex-gf (US bird) was a bit "warped"
May 17 19:10:30 <RST38h> Linux: and not the women advancement kind but let-us-kill-male-chauvinist-pigs
May 17 19:10:32 <lcuk> one from each country - THEN ill tell you whos best
May 17 19:10:34 <LinuxCode> lcuk, haha
May 17 19:10:53 <derf> lcuk: I assume you will blog your progress.
May 17 19:10:55 <LinuxCode> RST38h, European birds dont take no shit
May 17 19:10:57 <lcuk> god i hope mrs lcuk isnt watching :D
May 17 19:11:00 <lcuk> lol derf
May 17 19:11:11 <LinuxCode> so I guess you could say a lot of EU chicks are just like that
May 17 19:11:13 <lcuk> LinuxCode, you sure about those german girls
May 17 19:11:19 <LinuxCode> lcuk, yah
May 17 19:11:22 <lcuk> ive heard about those videos
May 17 19:11:28 <LinuxCode> lcuk, wanna meet my sister in law
May 17 19:11:37 <LinuxCode> she will tear your balls off
May 17 19:11:40 <Tracey> Gary... I want a word....
May 17 19:11:43 <RST38h> Heh
May 17 19:12:00 <lcuk> phew, for a minute there i thought david was my missus - but thankfully he misspelt her name :P
May 17 19:12:07 <LinuxCode> lolol
May 17 19:12:08 <lcuk> now we just know hes a tranny
May 17 19:12:11 * RST38h noticed that too
May 17 19:12:13 <LinuxCode> back to Uni for him
May 17 19:12:20 <LinuxCode> Level 1 Spelling
May 17 19:12:30 <lcuk> its ok everyone gets it wrong
May 17 19:12:35 <lcuk> shes given up fixing bday cards lol
May 17 19:12:37 <lbt> <sihg>
May 17 19:12:49 <derf> But RST38h is right. I swear there isn't a girl in this country who's right in the head.
May 17 19:13:01 <LinuxCode> lcuk, thats because most British suck at spelling
May 17 19:13:14 * LinuxCode recalls his Business lecturer
May 17 19:13:38 <lcuk> i am crap at spelling as well, but im consistently bad - otherwise my code wouldnt compile
May 17 19:13:38 <RST38h> derf: Not entirely true, there are trace amounts left
May 17 19:14:04 <derf> RST38h: The odds of encountering one in a random walk appear to be pretty low.
May 17 19:14:12 * soap weighs the probabilities.  1-That 100% of women in USA aren't right in the head VS. 2-That a single male isn't right in the head.
May 17 19:14:28 <LinuxCode> me goes with 2
May 17 19:14:36 <derf> Oh, I make no claims that I'm sane.
May 17 19:14:38 <LinuxCode> thats what he hears all the time
May 17 19:14:53 <LinuxCode> forgot the action there
May 17 19:15:10 <lcuk> no woman will ever admit they are wrong
May 17 19:15:15 <RST38h> derf: true
May 17 19:16:03 <LinuxCode> lcuk, lol
May 17 19:16:07 <derf> Maybe they keep them all in Iowa or something.
May 17 19:16:14 <derf> They are as gekk aren't in DC.
May 17 19:16:51 * RST38h still remembers a nightmare of encounterng UMD lacrosse team (?) at the student union
May 17 19:17:26 <RST38h> Same clothes, same hair, same size, same faces x 30
May 17 19:17:49 <LinuxCode> all 30 had boob jobs ?
May 17 19:18:08 <RST38h> Linux: Don't think they had problems in that department really
May 17 19:18:10 <lcuk> hairy tash
May 17 19:18:13 <lcuk> tatoos
May 17 19:18:16 <derf> Not if they're at UMD, they don't.
May 17 19:18:18 <LinuxCode> hairy tash lolol
May 17 19:18:27 <RST38h> It is just seeing 30 clones of the same girl is disturbing
May 17 19:18:39 <LinuxCode> lcuk, Im sure the US is wax nation of the world
May 17 19:19:00 <derf> That's really more of a west-coast thing.
May 17 19:19:21 <lcuk> RST38h, depends upon the situation, but im sure theres a top shelf video
May 17 19:19:42 <RST38h> umgh...
May 17 19:20:26 * RST38h will stick with Tremors for now
May 17 19:20:36 <lcuk> lbt, btw, your cross dressing nickchange was transmitted over all the chans :P
May 17 19:20:41 <lcuk> heh rst
May 17 19:20:53 <lbt> it's no secret <grin>
May 17 19:21:43 <lcuk> i thought about asking the dentist people downstairs to take a new xray of my finger to see where my bone is
May 17 19:21:56 <lcuk> do you think they will object lol
May 17 19:22:02 <RST38h> lcuk: not afraid to find out it has grown teeth?
May 17 19:22:17 <lcuk> heh they will detect cavities
May 17 19:22:21 <lcuk> and try to drill it
May 17 19:22:33 <RST38h> A moment, there is an SCP object for that
May 17 19:22:49 <lcuk> im sure there is about lots of things
May 17 19:23:36 <RST38h> lcuk: http://scp-wiki.wikidot.com/scp-542
May 17 19:23:44 <RST38h> nice bedtime reading too
May 17 19:24:48 <slonopotamus> wooo!
May 17 19:25:08 <slonopotamus> open-wlan-cal learned to set tx tuned values
May 17 19:25:52 <soap> mmm, teratoma
May 17 19:28:11 <Stskeeps> slonopotamus: did you manage to microwave chicken with it yet?
May 17 19:28:37 <slonopotamus> hehe
May 17 19:33:53 * Macer gets back to his ncis marathon
May 17 19:33:54 <Macer> lol
May 17 19:41:34 <slonopotamus> craaazy. 13 items, 42bytes each + 6bytes header. and for some reason it must write 550 instead of 552.
May 17 19:46:30 <luke-jr> why hello everyone
May 17 19:46:42 <luke-jr> slonopotamus: how should we deal with Nokia's GPL violation in NOLO? ;)
May 17 19:47:13 <ShadowJK> there's a GPL violation there?
May 17 19:47:13 <slonopotamus> luke-jr, hello. please be more specific :)
May 17 19:47:21 <luke-jr> ShadowJK: jffs2
May 17 19:47:39 <luke-jr> http://sources.redhat.com/jffs2/jffs2-licence.html
May 17 19:47:53 <luke-jr> in theory, RedHat may have sold a proprietary license
May 17 19:47:57 <luke-jr> so I guess we need to ask them
May 17 19:49:21 <keesj> the FORMAT should be free (when not talking in terms of code)
May 17 19:49:37 <luke-jr> keesj: it uses the code
May 17 19:49:55 <luke-jr> I have string matches in the blob
May 17 19:49:58 <Stskeeps> eh
May 17 19:50:05 <Stskeeps> why on earth is that a gpl violation?
May 17 19:50:19 <luke-jr> Stskeeps: jffs2 is GPL; NOLO does not provide source nor offer
May 17 19:50:28 <Stskeeps> yes, but NOLO doesn't need jffs2
May 17 19:50:29 <luke-jr> NOLO contains jffs2 code
May 17 19:50:31 <Stskeeps> nolo just loads a kernel
May 17 19:50:41 <luke-jr> dump the mtdblock for NOLO
May 17 19:51:04 <Stskeeps> if you're right, nokia messed up :)
May 17 19:51:12 <luke-jr> whether it uses it or not, I don't care :p
May 17 19:51:15 <luke-jr> the code is in there
May 17 19:51:32 <luke-jr> along with a bunch of debugging tools it seems
May 17 19:51:47 <luke-jr> I suspect NOLO may be capable of booting a kernel on a jffs2 partition
May 17 19:52:23 <GeneralAntilles> luke-jr, assume good faith and contact the maintainer.
May 17 19:52:47 <luke-jr> GeneralAntilles: since it's RedHat's code, I don't have any authority to represent them..
May 17 19:53:33 <GeneralAntilles> I really don't get what rose-tinted glasses these Symbian fans got ahold of.
May 17 19:54:03 <luke-jr> suppose I could file a bug like "hey, just noticed this…" any see how they respond before bothering to mention it to RH
May 17 19:54:19 <luke-jr> but simply beginning to comply doesn't get Nokia out of the hole
May 17 19:54:31 <luke-jr> their GPL license is now void, if they didn't get a proprietary one
May 17 19:55:38 <ShadowJK> GeneralAntilles, I'd like to get a hold of the happypills they've been eating
May 17 19:55:39 <keesj> luke-jr: So what are you hoping for?
May 17 19:56:15 <Stskeeps> luke-jr: well, isn't there always the option to ask for the source? :P
May 17 19:56:17 <luke-jr> keesj: I'm hoping for compliance. But at least legally, they need to deal with RedHat to get a new GPL license.
May 17 19:56:28 <luke-jr> Stskeeps: that doesn't make them compliant
May 17 19:56:51 <Stskeeps> luke-jr: what strings are you thinking of btw?
May 17 19:57:02 <Stskeeps> it is entirely plausible they did their own mini jffs2 though
May 17 19:57:09 <Stskeeps> i mean, they did do ubifs..
May 17 19:57:13 <luke-jr> "Erasing JFFS2 blocks %d-%d…"
May 17 19:57:25 <luke-jr> err
May 17 19:57:27 <luke-jr> maybe not that one
May 17 19:57:46 <luke-jr> no, that's one
May 17 19:57:53 <luke-jr> I think
May 17 19:57:58 <Stskeeps> .. doesn't confirm it's jffs2 though
May 17 19:58:16 <luke-jr> Googling for the string returns Linux kernel code
May 17 19:58:28 <Stskeeps> yeah, but it's not an accurate matc
May 17 19:58:28 <luke-jr> but apparently Google decided to ignore my "" around it
May 17 19:58:54 * luke-jr wonders what the purpose of "" are if not to insist on a literal match
May 17 19:58:55 <luke-jr> sigh
May 17 19:59:07 <luke-jr> oh well
May 17 19:59:17 <luke-jr> NOLO's not in my scopes yet
May 17 19:59:27 <luke-jr> I just hit it looking for the config partition
May 17 19:59:31 * luke-jr goes on with what he was doing
May 17 19:59:41 <luke-jr> false alarm this time I guess
May 17 20:00:52 <slonopotamus> can someone send me output of 'strace -s600 chroot /mnt/initfs/ /usr/bin/wlan-cal  1>/dev/null 2> wlan-cal-strace'  please?
May 17 20:01:05 <slonopotamus> need strace installed
May 17 20:02:14 <slonopotamus> tx limits & rx tuned values look constant but i need to compare
May 17 20:02:45 <Stskeeps> yeah, i concur, luke-jr
May 17 20:02:48 <Stskeeps> it's a self-made jffs reader
May 17 20:03:27 <ShadowJK> slonopotamus, dunno but the service manual says they're tuned per device by measuring the RF output?
May 17 20:03:50 <slonopotamus> RF output - ?
May 17 20:04:11 <mavhc> if you're searching code use google code search
May 17 20:05:28 <mavhc> RST38h: the 50% tax only applies to money >£100k, if you earn 100001 you're only taxed 50% on the 1
May 17 20:07:21 <RST38h> mavhc: Ah, nice
May 17 20:07:48 <RST38h> mavhc: Better than I thought, anyway
May 17 20:08:38 <RST38h> <sleep> though
May 17 20:09:06 <jaem_N810> hello folks
May 17 20:09:26 <GeneralAntilles> Goddamn computer was done 5 days ago, but Apple didn't bother to try telling me.
May 17 20:09:58 <x29a> hm, how would i get screen on my n810?
May 17 20:10:04 <slonopotamus> ShadowJK, we can know that for sure if you show me your results :) from what i see in strace, it doesn't read that info from anywhere
May 17 20:10:27 <jaem_N810> x29a: thanks for inadvertently reminding me of something ;)
May 17 20:10:40 <Stskeeps> x29a: installing it?
May 17 20:10:40 <x29a> jaem_N810: hehe, sorry ;)
May 17 20:10:46 <x29a> Stskeeps: apt-get?
May 17 20:10:54 <x29a> maybe it needs an update
May 17 20:11:04 <x29a> E: Couldn't find package screen
May 17 20:12:56 <ShadowJK> slonopotamus, dunno, but there's a troubleshooting flowchart for how to write new values to device if oscilloscope attached to the antenna output of the wlan shows that it's transmitting with wrong power and/or wrong frequency :)
May 17 20:13:34 <slonopotamus> ShadowJK, have a link?
May 17 20:13:53 <ShadowJK> it was on itt somewhere..
May 17 20:13:56 <x29a> openvpn is already the newest version. <<<--- meeh (built on Jul 31 2008)
May 17 20:15:16 <jaem_N810> oops... qtnx took out my desktop
May 17 20:18:01 <jaem_N810> darn
May 17 20:18:23 <jaem_N810> is there a way  to bring back a window that isn't shown in the window list?
May 17 20:18:31 <jaem_N810> or do I have to kill it?
May 17 20:18:44 <Stskeeps> it's gone, jim
May 17 20:19:21 <jaem_N810> -grin-
May 17 20:19:53 <jaem_N810> has anyone else tried qtnx in extras-devel?
May 17 20:20:38 <x29a> Stskeeps: is screen available in some package? or would i have to build it myself?
May 17 20:21:53 <Stskeeps> x29a: i got a package i think
May 17 20:21:57 <Stskeeps> not sure where from
May 17 20:22:01 <Stskeeps> try packrat?
May 17 20:22:41 <Macer> ok
May 17 20:22:45 <Macer> i give up on second life
May 17 20:22:46 <Macer> wtf
May 17 20:22:46 <x29a> no clue what packrat would be
May 17 20:22:48 <Macer> :)
May 17 20:22:56 <slonopotamus> gimme strace! :)
May 17 20:22:57 <Macer> fucking site has a problem with its registration page
May 17 20:23:19 <Macer> it fucks up yesterday and says its unavailable and today says that i had too many registrations from my household
May 17 20:23:32 <Macer> they should find the disgusting coder that made that reg page and fire him :)
May 17 20:23:46 <jaem_N810> Macer: I've never used SL, but my uni has a campus there
May 17 20:23:47 <x29a> i bet hes busy playing second life
May 17 20:23:57 <Stskeeps> and having virtual sex with his creations
May 17 20:24:01 <x29a> bah
May 17 20:24:05 <Macer> jaem_N810: lol well.. their registration is broken
May 17 20:24:11 <Macer> not only that.. there is no way to contact them
May 17 20:24:29 <Macer> the only place you can contact is "billing" go figure
May 17 20:24:45 <jaem_N810> well, not a campus per se, but they lease an island, and have a lecture hall and a few other things, and the building is inspired by one of our campii
May 17 20:24:48 <Macer> i wonder how many thousands of probable users they are losing
May 17 20:24:55 <jaem_N810> huh
May 17 20:25:13 <Macer> jaem_N810: their site has no way to contact them without an account
May 17 20:25:17 <jaem_N810> maybe it's like the ISP tech support that tells you to go online
May 17 20:25:27 <Macer> so what do you do if their registration site is broken and you can't create an account? :)
May 17 20:25:37 <jaem_N810> register, of course :P
May 17 20:25:46 <Macer> lol
May 17 20:25:52 <Macer> with the broken registration page?
May 17 20:26:04 <jaem_N810> exactly
May 17 20:26:09 <Macer> that says "unavailable" then tells you "you have too many accounts in your household"
May 17 20:26:21 <Macer> which i'm guessing is because the attempts yesterday went through halfass
May 17 20:26:29 <jaem_N810> lol
May 17 20:26:30 <Macer> because of a poorly coded registration page
May 17 20:26:32 <jaem_N810> probably
May 17 20:26:37 <jaem_N810> yay bad code
May 17 20:26:54 <Macer> it probably logs the ip and now i probably have 4 accounts
May 17 20:27:07 <Macer> that i can't use :) lol
May 17 20:27:14 <jaem_N810> we need a poster campaign: "Bad Code Costs Lives"
May 17 20:27:40 <Macer> haha
May 17 20:27:40 <jaem_N810> and have a gruesome video, like the workplace safety videos they show people
May 17 20:27:45 <Macer> costs money at the least :)
May 17 20:27:53 <Macer> right now i could be checking out second life buying stuff on it
May 17 20:27:56 <jaem_N810> guy getting mauled by a malfunctioning shrinter
May 17 20:28:08 <Macer> so i was kind of serious when i said someone should be fired
May 17 20:28:27 <Macer> i will forget about it and wait a few days and try again and see what happens
May 17 20:29:07 <mavhc> code monkey say maybe manager wanna write goddamn login page himself
May 17 20:29:18 <jaem_N810> a friend of a friend once won a contest, because he noticed a hidden field: "win="false""
May 17 20:29:24 <jaem_N810> that's bad code
May 17 20:29:42 <jaem_N810> mavhc: XD
May 17 20:33:16 <jaem_N810> has anything been hinted about a Skype update for Fremantle?
May 17 20:35:05 <lcuk> mavhc, jc is an exceptional artist :)
May 17 20:35:25 <Jaffa> jaem_N810: Nope - nothing hinted third-party s/w wise at all, AFAICR
May 17 20:36:58 <jaem_N810> Jaffa: darn... the current client is... lacking
May 17 20:37:50 <jaem_N810> I'm surprised they didn't include SMS functionality, as you'd think that N810 users would like that, anyway
May 17 20:38:24 <jaem_N810> I know on the desktop Linux client, SMS is not exposed, but can be accessed through the API
May 17 20:38:26 <Jaffa> MMS/SMS might very well be built in to Fremantle, what with the HSPA stack
May 17 20:38:36 <jaem_N810> ah, right
May 17 20:39:20 <jaem_N810> any idea if the current client has SMS available internally?
May 17 20:39:45 <jaem_N810> I've seen a python app for the desktop that adds a GUI for that
May 17 20:40:00 <Jaffa> No idea
May 17 20:40:37 <Stskeeps> try? :P
May 17 20:40:43 <Stskeeps> there's python-skype so
May 17 20:40:56 <jaem_N810> okay, I will then
May 17 20:41:11 <jaem_N810> I hadn't had time to look into it - it was a passing thought :P
May 17 20:41:40 <jaem_N810> it's a pity the Skype subscriptions don't (last I checked) include SMS
May 17 20:42:03 <luke-jr> Skype ftl
May 17 20:43:06 <jaem_N810> luke-jr: it's not perfect, but it's a lot cheaper for me than getting a long-distance plan
May 17 20:43:14 <jaem_N810> and it works on all my devices
May 17 20:48:44 <luke-jr> … or he could just get a standard VoIP service
May 17 21:03:06 <x29a> hm, how would i get curl?
May 17 21:03:27 <x29a> somehow my apt-get doesnt know about too many packages
May 17 21:05:15 <lcuk> add moar repositories
May 17 21:07:46 <x29a> lcuk: which ones?
May 17 21:10:13 <mavhc> isn't curl built in, just with an odd name?
May 17 21:11:27 <x29a> mavhc: tell me more!
May 17 21:23:47 <tank-man> x29a, have you enabled the extras repo?
May 17 21:23:53 <x29a> yes
May 17 21:34:44 <mavhc> maemo-mini-curl perhaps
May 17 21:51:30 <x29a> mavhc: hm, true, but it doesnt support what i need, bummer
May 17 21:51:43 <x29a> in principle itd be all fine if openvpn was more up2date
May 17 21:59:33 <pupnik_> can ext3 storee files bigger than 1.2GB?
May 17 21:59:47 <pupnik_> my vmware image download died at 1.2GB twice
May 17 22:06:29 <mikkov_> pupnik_: yes it can
May 17 22:06:50 <pupnik_> k
May 17 22:06:55 <pupnik_> 3rd attempt
May 17 22:31:36 <jaem> do we have Mono support for Maemo, or do I have to wait for Mer?
May 17 22:31:50 <jaem> also, does it run well enough to be useful?
May 17 22:42:40 <yandere> http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=287709&postcount=119    -- hahahahaha!!!!!!!
May 17 23:06:30 <mavhc> managed code + 128MB ram = fail
May 17 23:06:57 <pupnik_> hohoho
May 17 23:13:33 <jaem> mavhc: that's kind of what I figured
May 17 23:15:29 <jaem> huh... some crazy physicists figure they can make something to see through a virtual hole in the wall, with cloaking technology
May 17 23:15:37 <jaem> http://arxiv.org/abs/0905.1484
May 17 23:25:30 <GeneralAntilles> jaem, sipphone.com is a better VoIP solution if you don't have a lot of other people using Skype.
May 17 23:25:34 <GeneralAntilles> Open standards.
May 17 23:26:26 <jaem> GeneralAntilles: I fully agree on the Open Standards part, but I do have a bunch of Skype contacts, and although some of them would be sympathetic to that point, their contacts may not
May 17 23:26:48 <jaem> does sipphone.com have cheap calling to real phones?
May 17 23:29:32 <GAN800> jaem, marginally cheaper than Skype.
May 17 23:29:45 <GAN800> You can use rtcomm which is a big plus.
May 17 23:29:50 <jaem> yeah, that's what I was thinking
May 17 23:30:04 <jaem> when you say cheaper, are you referring to per-minute billing, or do they have subscriptions, too?
May 17 23:30:17 <GAN800> Per-minute
May 17 23:30:21 <jaem> darn
May 17 23:30:25 <jaem> that's out, then
May 17 23:30:32 <GAN800> Don't think they have subscriptions but I'm not sure.
May 17 23:30:44 <jaem> I already pay too much for my cell, and I can only afford Skype as well because of the subscriptions
May 17 23:31:02 <GAN800> You use that many minutes?
May 17 23:31:18 <jaem> I use enough on average that it's still significantly cheaper
May 17 23:31:25 <GAN800> Ah
May 17 23:31:30 <jaem> but nowhere near the 10,000 minute/month limit
May 17 23:32:34 <jaem> what I had thought of doing was setting one of the unlimited calling numbers on my cell (plan feature) to my dorm landline, and then routing calls through Skype
May 17 23:32:52 <jaem> but I don't have the PSTN hardware, and I couldn't find a free Skype gateway
May 17 23:33:02 <jaem> (in software, that is)
May 17 23:33:34 <jaem> lol @ http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2072/3531235979_c1508edcf8_o.png
May 17 23:34:49 * jaem is rebooting, and will be back after these messages
May 17 23:35:05 <jaem> Message from our sponsors: System is going down for reboot NOW
May 17 23:44:30 <jaem> gah - my touchpad is acting up
May 17 23:45:07 <jaem> conveniently, this laptop is technically on loan, so if it is actually borked, I won't have to pay for a replacement
May 17 23:47:03 <jaem> I've been discussing Todo apps over at #tasque on irc.gnome.org... I haven't found anything yet that I like
May 17 23:47:13 <jaem> DoneIt for maemo seems promising
May 17 23:47:38 <jaem> but DoneIt isn't Done
May 17 23:47:44 <kfx> I've been banging my head against finding useful groupware that can sync with maemo apps
May 17 23:48:03 <kfx> almost got it working with funambol+citadel and the pimlico apps
May 17 23:48:18 <kfx> ...but not reliably or well :/
May 17 23:48:44 <jaem> hrm
May 17 23:48:50 <jaem> Pimlico is pretty barebones...]
May 17 23:48:56 <jaem> otherwise it would be okay
May 17 23:49:07 <jaem> but the calendar app can't even do repeating events :S
May 17 23:49:24 <jaem> is development on Pimlico still happening?
May 17 23:49:39 <kfx> no idea
May 17 23:49:54 <kfx> I can't find a whole lot that's been worked on in a year or two
May 17 23:50:03 <kfx> I'd use gpe if it integrated at all with anything else on the device
May 17 23:50:09 <jaem> same here
May 17 23:50:15 <jaem> but it just doesn't
May 17 23:50:52 <kfx> on the other hand, pimlico stuff is GPL
May 17 23:51:11 <jaem> there are so many PIM suites out there, and aside from a few desktop-oriented suites, and a few individual programs, everything seems half-finished, abandoned, or just not what I'm looking for
May 17 23:51:25 <jaem> kfx: true, but I'm not up to that atm
May 17 23:51:48 <kfx> jaem: neither am I but I'm getting there fast
May 17 23:52:00 <jaem> I learned coding on useless languages of the MS variety, and haven't had nearly enough experience with anything else to do much on Linux yet
May 17 23:52:06 <kfx> I'll probably wrench calendar source out of jpilot and cram it into dates
May 17 23:52:17 <jaem> speaking of, I need to get some studying done in that area ;)
May 17 23:52:17 <kfx> then make the sync backend speak something more modern, like ical 2.0
May 17 23:52:17 <jaem> lol
May 17 23:55:19 <torkiano> hello, I get this error when ./configure:
May 17 23:55:19 <jaem_afk-ish> kfx: you should use bogobogosort in it somewhere
May 17 23:55:22 <torkiano> Makefile.am:6: HAVE_GNOME_DOC_UTILS does not appear in AM_CONDITIONAL
May 17 23:55:49 <jaem_afk-ish> kfx: the author of that algorithm said a 7-element array didn't finish sorting when he left it overnight
May 17 23:55:53 <jaem_afk-ish> XD
May 17 23:55:58 <jaem_afk-ish> torkiano: which app?
May 17 23:56:25 <torkiano> jaem_afk-ish, is a personal app
May 17 23:56:35 <jaem_afk-ish> kfx: http://www.dangermouse.net/esoteric/bogobogosort.html
May 17 23:57:01 <jaem_afk-ish> torkiano: I'm not the one to ask, sorry
May 17 23:57:23 <torkiano> jaem_afk-ish, no problem
May 17 23:57:31 * jaem_afk-ish is pingable, but not fully here
May 18 00:06:05 <kfx> jaem_N810: if I did that then I'd more likely parallelize it and run it on the university cluster
May 18 00:06:14 <kfx> ...which is why I don't code a lot these days.
May 18 00:15:09 <pupnik_> talk is cheap
May 18 00:21:16 <jaem_N810> kfx: I don't know about your uni, but I don't think mine would give me time on one of their clusters to run recursive bogosort
May 18 00:21:22 <jaem_N810> lol
May 18 00:22:34 <jaem_N810> apparently there are long waits and short usage times as it is
May 18 00:22:34 <jaem_N810> pupnik_: except on cell phones in Canada
May 18 00:23:01 <pupnik_> ok
May 18 00:23:09 <pupnik_> o/
May 18 00:23:26 <pupnik_> some talk isn't cheap
May 18 00:24:39 <kfx> jaem_N810: oh, they'd get cranky about it, but I run the cluster
May 18 00:26:38 <GAN800> I don't know why Intel has to be evil by bringing the x86 blight to mobile devicres.
May 18 00:27:40 <GAN800> s/cres/ces/
May 18 00:27:41 <infobot> GAN800 meant: I don't know why Intel has to be evil by bringing the x86 blight to mobile devices.
May 18 00:28:13 <samueldr> s/a/
May 18 00:28:18 <samueldr> s/a//
May 18 00:28:19 <infobot> samueldr meant: s//
May 18 00:28:26 <samueldr> heyhey, nice
May 18 00:28:28 <jaem_N810> nice
May 18 00:28:36 <samueldr> s/*/bacon/
May 18 00:28:44 <kkrusty> hello, does anyone know a good working application for rememberthemilk or any other task management site?
May 18 00:28:50 <jaem_N810> that has advantages ;)
May 18 00:29:09 <kkrusty> zutun doesnt install and Doneit doesnt run
May 18 00:29:35 <jaem_N810> now we need *distributed* recursive bogosort
May 18 00:30:00 <kkrusty> anyone?
May 18 00:30:06 <jaem_N810> so that people all over the world can help us reach the ultimate goal of sorting a 100-element array before the universe ends
May 18 00:30:31 <jaem_N810> okay, that number was pulled out of thin air, but the time complexity of bogobogosort is painful
May 18 00:30:44 <samueldr> if we're lucky, the first iteration will be sorted
May 18 00:32:11 <jaem_N810> kkrusty: DoneIt is in its early stages
May 18 00:32:19 <jaem_N810> hence it being in extras-devel
May 18 00:32:58 <jaem_N810> aside from those two, I think there is an app that allows task entry only on the Garage, but I can't think of the name
May 18 00:33:05 <jaem_N810> I'd hold out for DoneIt
May 18 00:33:36 <kkrusty> jaem_N810: okay. I'll hold out for it then
May 18 00:34:01 <kkrusty> jaem_N810: by task entry you mean that you cant view the tasks?
May 18 00:35:35 <kkrusty> jaem_N810: uh nevermind. Thanks for answering my question
May 18 00:53:56 <ShadowJK> hm, when did ctrl-l stop working in xchat in maemo...
May 18 00:55:03 <jaem_N810> is Maemo Garage built from scratch, or running a prexisting engine of some sort?
May 18 00:55:08 <jaem_N810> it looks SF.net-ish
May 18 00:59:16 <GAN8001> jaem_N810, GForge
May 18 00:59:32 <GAN8001> and it's maemo.org Garage. :P
May 18 01:04:50 <derf> http://blogs.sun.com/CoreJavaTechTips/entry/superduper_slow_jar
May 18 01:08:03 * b-man starts to play around in getting fedora booting on his tablet
May 18 01:12:07 <b-man> so far everything is working fine, allthough yum is driving me crazy because i haven't figured out how to add repos to /etc/yum.repos.d/ :P
May 18 01:13:44 <b-man> it's a bit complicated - but i'll figure it out :)
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Mon May 18 02:59:57 2009