**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Mon May 25 02:59:57 2009
May 25 04:02:07 <xnt14> btw everyone, im working on this webdeb framework, and I plan to make it nit compatible
May 25 04:02:09 <xnt14> http://code.google.com/p/graphiure/
May 25 04:03:19 <xnt14> *webdev
May 25 04:03:32 <EdLin> hello, if you had a choice between keeping a dell netbook, an iPod touch, or a N810, which would you pick and why? Not at troll, I'm interested in getting an N810.
May 25 04:04:24 <xnt14> EdLin: well,  have a eeepc 701, a ipod touch , and a n810, it all depends on what you want to do
May 25 04:04:29 <xnt14> *I
May 25 04:04:29 <Bobbe> depends on what you'll need to do with it
May 25 04:04:40 <acydlord> yeah, i have an aspire one, and an n810
May 25 04:05:03 <Bobbe> between an Ipod Touch and an N800, it's a no-brainer, at least for me
May 25 04:05:14 <xnt14> Netbool if you want to browse the web and have a regular pc platforkm
May 25 04:05:18 <xnt14> *platform
May 25 04:05:27 <Bobbe> now if you don't mind have to carry a netbook everywhere, u should get the dell
May 25 04:05:32 <Bobbe> *having
May 25 04:05:43 <Bobbe> I do, that's why I got an n800
May 25 04:05:55 <EdLin> xnt14: I want mostly to browse, youtube, RSS, music, but also to tether it to a phone when neccesary.
May 25 04:06:09 <Bobbe> and of course my n800 was 1/3 of the price of a (good for anything) netbook
May 25 04:06:24 <xnt14> ipod can rss/youtube/music fine, but the ipod can't tether
May 25 04:06:24 <Bobbe> EdLin, what do u mean by tethering to a phone?
May 25 04:06:45 <xnt14> n810 can tether but some phone it doesn't tether(blackberry)
May 25 04:06:55 <EdLin> I have a sprint palm centro, I hear it can tether to it and provide a better internet experience....
May 25 04:06:57 <xnt14> Bobbe: getting internet from a phone
May 25 04:07:04 <Bobbe> ah, ok
May 25 04:07:07 <xnt14> oh yeah
May 25 04:07:11 <Bobbe> does the ipod do that at all?
May 25 04:07:16 <EdLin> and the centro has PIM, which it lacks, making it complement.
May 25 04:07:20 <Bobbe> i thought it was wifi only
May 25 04:07:24 <EdLin> the iPod does not, the dell mini 9 does.
May 25 04:07:33 <xnt14> christefano has a centro , and he said the it works like a charm
May 25 04:08:06 <xnt14> hes away right now
May 25 04:08:27 <acydlord> i have my n810, aao, and phone all in an urbantools slotbar bag
May 25 04:08:36 <EdLin> aao?
May 25 04:08:41 <acydlord> acer aspire one
May 25 04:08:42 <xnt14> aao?
May 25 04:08:47 <xnt14> oh lol xD
May 25 04:09:23 <EdLin> I'd love to keep the dell mini 9 and have this too, but I'm not like that palm investor with the utility belt, I only have room for so many gadgets.
May 25 04:09:55 <xnt14> well, how good are you with linux?
May 25 04:10:09 <acydlord> i cant wait till i get my palm pre
May 25 04:10:10 <EdLin> I've used Linux since 1991, though currently I use OS X a lot.
May 25 04:10:17 <xnt14> oh ok then
May 25 04:10:24 <xnt14> well, it all depends
May 25 04:10:25 <GAN800> EdLin, wait a few months for the new tablet.
May 25 04:10:27 <acydlord> slotbar is pretty close to a utility belt
May 25 04:10:46 <GAN800> ~rx-51
May 25 04:10:47 <infobot> it has been said that rx-51 is http://maemo.org/community/council/community_highlights_for_december_2008-part_i-january_2009-part_ii/ http://www.linuxdevices.com/news/NS9093153240.html
May 25 04:11:35 <xnt14> acydlord: im stuck between iphone 3rd Gen, palm pre, g1/2/3
May 25 04:11:37 <EdLin> GAN800: when's it coming out? Does it need a new cell plan other than sprint?
May 25 04:11:53 <GAN800> EdLin, it's not a cellphone.
May 25 04:11:55 <xnt14> Edlin: its a tablet not a phone
May 25 04:12:06 <xnt14> you don't need a plan
May 25 04:12:10 <EdLin> yes, but it mentioned HSPA connectivity.
May 25 04:12:12 <GAN800> EdLin, not been announced, but it should be relatively soon.
May 25 04:12:28 <GAN800> You can put a SIM in there or not.
May 25 04:12:49 <GAN800> it's about equivalent to the Mini 9 with HSPA.
May 25 04:12:59 <EdLin> will they break tethering as part of the deal?
May 25 04:13:10 <acydlord> it's the pre for me, not a fan of the iphone at all, and not happy with android yet
May 25 04:13:16 <GAN800> By the way, I'd recommend the HP netbook over the Dell.
May 25 04:13:23 <GAN800> EdLin, er, no.
May 25 04:13:28 <EdLin> GAN800: too late, I have the dell.
May 25 04:13:45 <GAN800> EdLin, the system isn't closed enough for them to manage that.
May 25 04:13:49 <EdLin> cool
May 25 04:13:51 <acydlord> some of the hp netbooks are pure fail
May 25 04:14:16 <GAN800> Besides, Nokia doesn't get your money when you get a plan so they'd have no incentive.
May 25 04:14:23 <EdLin> the mini 9 is excellent in terms of hardware hackability, in terms of keyboard though it's a bit of a loss.
May 25 04:15:04 <acydlord> the aspire one is quite hackable from the hardware end
May 25 04:15:32 <acydlord> solderless touchscreen mod FTW
May 25 04:15:43 <EdLin> neat
May 25 04:15:45 <GAN800> Anyway, the next tablet will be closer to netbook performance than iPod/N810 performance.
May 25 04:16:07 <EdLin> GAN800: what will the price be like?
May 25 04:16:08 <acydlord> that and the itouch is just a toy
May 25 04:17:22 <GAN800> EdLin, about where the N810 was new.
May 25 04:17:53 <EdLin> GAN800: I need it to be sub-$300, because that's about what I'd be selling the mini 9 for at a minimum.
May 25 04:18:32 <GAN800> Then I'd recommend buying the N810 now and then upgrading once the prices drop on the next tablet sometime next year.
May 25 04:18:53 <acydlord> my n810 was only $140 shipped =x
May 25 04:19:09 <EdLin> from where?
May 25 04:19:24 <acydlord> from nokia
May 25 04:19:33 <EdLin> that's US dollars?!
May 25 04:19:39 <acydlord> yeah
May 25 04:19:48 <EdLin> OK, how. :-)
May 25 04:19:49 <acydlord> developers discount for the win
May 25 04:19:54 <EdLin> ah....
May 25 04:20:06 <EdLin> well, I'm an admin more than a developer.
May 25 04:20:45 <EdLin> though I'm semi-fluent in several programming languages.
May 25 04:21:16 <EdLin> IOW I know enough to get me into trouble, and not enough to get me out of it.
May 25 04:22:55 <GAN800> They're contributor discounts now
May 25 04:23:20 <GAN800> Also apply to doc writers, bug filers, and general community contributors.
May 25 04:23:21 <acydlord> they gave a couple for adding documentation didnt they?
May 25 04:23:26 <acydlord> yeah
May 25 04:23:50 <EdLin> well, I can't write too many docs for it without ever having seen one. :-)
May 25 04:27:04 <EdLin> OK, it looks like everyone is going to sleep. I guess I'll have a midnight snack and maybe do the same.
May 25 04:27:33 <EdLin> thanks for the help, it's a friendly channel.
May 25 04:59:04 <rm_you> if I'm using g_debug() to do debug output, where does that GO?
May 25 04:59:20 <rm_you> i used to use it and now i've forgotten >_>
May 25 05:00:35 <Stskeeps> mer? .xsession-errors
May 25 05:00:42 <rm_you> not mer :/
May 25 05:06:46 <rm_you> like, where does ALL of the debug text from all of the statusbar applets and home applets and stuff GO? what logfile or whatever do i need to be looking at?
May 25 05:13:11 <Stskeeps> i think dev null when in maemo. might bee wrong
May 25 05:13:28 <LiraNuna> launch your program from osso-term ?
May 25 05:14:15 <thux> morning
May 25 05:16:27 <Macer> i swear to god
May 25 05:16:34 <Macer> if i can find the asshole that decided to use hfs+
May 25 05:16:38 <Macer> i would shoot him
May 25 05:16:51 * Macer marks another thing he utterly hates about osx
May 25 05:16:57 <|R> haha
May 25 05:16:58 <johnx_> Macer: for what? there are linux drivers for it
May 25 05:17:07 <rm_you> LiraNuna: is a statusbar-applet
May 25 05:17:10 <Macer> because it forks
May 25 05:17:17 <Macer> over network filesystems
May 25 05:17:24 <Macer> and makes these ._filename files
May 25 05:17:31 <Macer> and for the life of me i can't figure out a way to stop it from doing that
May 25 05:17:39 <johnx_> oh noes. so stop using a mac
May 25 05:17:44 <Macer> so if you say copy foo over a samba share
May 25 05:17:46 <Macer> it makes foo
May 25 05:17:50 <Macer> and ._foo
May 25 05:18:17 <Macer> it sends forked data over as a ._ file
May 25 05:18:25 <Macer> johnx_: i think you're right
May 25 05:18:34 <Macer> i should sell it on ebay and get a netbook or something
May 25 05:18:46 * johnx_ uses a ._macbook
May 25 05:18:47 <Macer> i put debian on it... but the damn wifi wouldn't connect adhoc
May 25 05:18:52 <johnx_> well, right now at least
May 25 05:18:53 <Macer> haha
May 25 05:19:04 <Macer> me too.. got it for $500
May 25 05:19:12 <johnx_> work gave me one for free
May 25 05:19:15 <Macer> which prevented me from getting another laptop
May 25 05:19:18 <johnx_> and a copy of vmware fusion
May 25 05:19:25 <Macer> maybe that's what i should do
May 25 05:19:30 <Macer> just run fusion full screen the entire time
May 25 05:19:35 <johnx_> meh
May 25 05:19:42 <johnx_> waste of CPU power for most things
May 25 05:19:45 <johnx_> mac os x isn't bad
May 25 05:19:52 <johnx_> you have to choose to not let it annoy you
May 25 05:19:56 <Macer> well.. i'm going to hunt down a way to get rid of the ._ files
May 25 05:20:07 <Macer> there has to be a way so it doesn't do that
May 25 05:20:11 <johnx_> once I have cash, I'm getting a thinkpad x200 (no matter what RST38h says)
May 25 05:20:24 <Macer> do they still make thinkpads?
May 25 05:20:24 <Stskeeps> morning
May 25 05:20:32 <Macer> i thought lenovo bought ibm out
May 25 05:20:40 <johnx_> Macer: IBM, no, Lenovo, yes
May 25 05:20:40 <Macer> or bought their laptop division
May 25 05:20:49 <Macer> oh screw that :)
May 25 05:20:51 <johnx_> Stskeeps: morning. :)
May 25 05:20:59 <Macer> you should be ashamed :) thinkpads were awesome when ibm made them
May 25 05:21:03 <Macer> i don't know about lenovo tho
May 25 05:21:13 <johnx_> Macer: you never even used one ...
May 25 05:21:22 <johnx_> I've had some hands on time, read plenty of reviews
May 25 05:21:23 <Macer> i know but still
May 25 05:21:27 <johnx_> they seem like a nice machine
May 25 05:21:28 <Macer> toshiba laptops used to be pretty good
May 25 05:21:33 <Macer> now they seem like crap
May 25 05:21:41 <Macer> all the pc brandnames seem like crap
May 25 05:21:56 <Macer> there is one thing i can say about macs.. minus the optical drive ....
May 25 05:21:57 <johnx_> plastic macbooks are much more cheap feeling than a thinkpad
May 25 05:22:03 <Macer> they don't seem to be so shitty
May 25 05:22:08 <johnx_> they stain, they crack
May 25 05:22:13 <johnx_> their chargers catch on fire
May 25 05:22:19 <Macer> lol?!
May 25 05:22:20 <Macer> what? :)
May 25 05:22:28 <Macer> i got one of those clear cases that snap onto it
May 25 05:22:32 <johnx_> my work has like 20+ of these things
May 25 05:22:38 <johnx_> I would know :)
May 25 05:22:40 <Macer> if i take it off it's like brand new minus the wear on the mouse
May 25 05:22:55 <Macer> the case has been brutalized though :)
May 25 05:22:57 <johnx_> anyways, back to hacking :)
May 25 05:23:09 <Macer> lol
May 25 05:23:11 <Macer> yeah me too
May 25 05:23:21 <Macer> i'm hax0ring osx so it isn't as gay without replacing it
May 25 05:23:33 <Macer> like the christian camps that try to pray the gay away
May 25 05:23:58 <Macer> actually.. i'm copying cover art over to the wii
May 25 05:23:59 <Macer> :)
May 25 05:24:06 <Macer> i got the usb loader to work and it works awesome like
May 25 05:24:12 <Macer> there's also another app i wanted to try out
May 25 05:24:24 <Macer> it turns isos into wads and you install games on the external hd as channels in the wii menu
May 25 05:24:24 <sisto> hi!
May 25 05:24:44 <Macer> i've been running into ntsc/pal issues i suppose
May 25 05:24:46 <Macer> :-\
May 25 05:24:48 <sisto> I wanna talk about maemo 5 a bit
May 25 05:25:13 <Macer> some get forced and others do not... punch out is pretty entertaining though. couldn't get madworld working tho :-\
May 25 05:25:15 <sisto> I've been reading about it and can't see any new major features to look forward to
May 25 05:25:24 <sisto> what are you looking forward to?
May 25 05:26:14 <sisto> i was expecting something like java support
May 25 05:27:34 <sisto> but any major new feature would do
May 25 05:27:41 <sisto> *will
May 25 05:29:06 <sisto> I've just read about hsdpa. ok that's big
May 25 05:29:54 <sisto> I would love to have opengl on the upcoming tablet
May 25 05:30:11 <sisto> hopefully they'll stick it in
May 25 05:31:30 <sisto> it would be nice if instead of being an internet tablet it was more like an all purpose device
May 25 05:31:39 <sisto> and have better support for multimedia and games
May 25 05:32:45 <sisto> faster video acceleration would cover those two points
May 25 05:34:49 <johnx_> sisto: it will have those things and a 5 mega pixel camera
May 25 05:35:22 <GAN800> ~rx-51
May 25 05:35:23 <infobot> hmm... rx-51 is http://maemo.org/community/council/community_highlights_for_december_2008-part_i-january_2009-part_ii/ http://www.linuxdevices.com/news/NS9093153240.html
May 25 05:35:24 <sisto> johnx_: are you kidding me?
May 25 05:35:31 <sisto> that's awesome
May 25 05:36:28 <johnx_> yeah, GPS+decent camera+celluar inet connection= lots of cool projects to do
May 25 05:37:24 <Macer> johnx_: :)
May 25 05:37:26 <Macer> you realize
May 25 05:37:32 <Macer> you guys are going to get a hold of one of those things
May 25 05:37:35 <Macer> and forget about mer
May 25 05:37:36 <Macer> haha
May 25 05:37:44 <Stskeeps> neat, http://www.mobilecrunch.com/2009/05/24/exclusive-everything-there-is-to-know-about-nokias-next-tablet/
May 25 05:38:14 <johnx_> Macer: still haven't forgotten about my zaurus :)
May 25 05:38:30 <johnx_> Macer: also, who says I'll be running maemo 5 on the rx-51
May 25 05:38:30 <Macer> how does it feel being the last one? :-D
May 25 05:38:31 <Macer> haha
May 25 05:38:49 <thux> Stskeeps: is it true that .dk is bicycle friendly country where almost everybody use bicycle?
May 25 05:38:49 <Macer> johnx_: you don't really know what to expect on maemo 5.. you might be stuck with it for a while
May 25 05:38:56 <Stskeeps> thux: quite a lot of people do
May 25 05:39:03 <thux> cool
May 25 05:39:08 <Macer> go green!
May 25 05:39:18 <Stskeeps> (you people want to see the url i just posted)
May 25 05:39:26 <Stskeeps> even though there's nothing -that- new
May 25 05:39:38 <Macer> ironically enough. all those people riding bikes probably shop at stores for their food
May 25 05:39:42 <johnx_> Macer: we know verywhat's in maemo 5. we've been basing mer on it for a while now :)
May 25 05:39:50 <thux> just red about .dk bicycling in newspaper
May 25 05:39:54 <Macer> so technically the bikes are also run from fossil fuels even if people are riding them
May 25 05:40:17 <Macer> johnx_: until you get a hold of the hardware tho.. ;)
May 25 05:40:23 <Macer> you never know what to expect
May 25 05:40:46 <Macer> so in a way you're doing it all with one eye open
May 25 05:40:52 <johnx_> Macer: hmm? I am looking forward to new hardware, but mer is pretty cross platform...
May 25 05:40:58 <thux> but from here .fi you have to drive through .se to get in .dk and newspaper said that .se isn't bicycle friendly :P
May 25 05:41:11 <Macer> that it is.. and i'm sure you have worked hard for that.. but....
May 25 05:41:24 <Macer> how many people run windows 3.11 on an i7 :)
May 25 05:41:41 <Macer> although i'm sure you will have a good base to work with
May 25 05:42:16 <Macer> kind of like when you have a 2 bedroom apartment... you fill it up with furniture....
May 25 05:42:31 <Macer> then move to a 4 story townhouse and realize you really don't have much since there is so much more space to work with
May 25 05:42:53 <johnx_> Macer: Mer uses the Maemo 5 versions of most software you know...
May 25 05:43:01 <johnx_> only the WM is different
May 25 05:43:10 <Stskeeps> i'd run mer on my rx-51 :ÆP
May 25 05:43:17 <Stskeeps> hm
May 25 05:43:21 <Macer> heh.. i'm just saying
May 25 05:43:25 <Stskeeps> how big is the current tablet screen, 4.3"?
May 25 05:43:44 <Macer> you will find that after you fill up the n800.. the new tablet is going to open up a lot of space
May 25 05:43:49 <johnx_> 4.3" on the N800 and 4.1" (?) on the N810 I think
May 25 05:43:51 <Macer> that will require much more work
May 25 05:44:03 <Stskeeps> johnx_: hm, i wonder why 3.5" in the leaked info
May 25 05:44:16 <johnx_> Stskeeps: to pull it down to phone size
May 25 05:44:22 <Macer> is it possible to hook up a usb keyboard onto an n800s usb port?
May 25 05:44:25 <Stskeeps> some of the specs are a bit awkward
May 25 05:44:26 <johnx_> I already suspected 3.5" based on the LCD part number
May 25 05:44:33 <Stskeeps> such as 1320 mAh battery
May 25 05:44:45 <Stskeeps> no mention of bluetooth, fm tx/rx etc
May 25 05:45:01 <johnx_> if it doesn't have bluetooth I will be completely confused
May 25 05:45:06 <Macer> haha
May 25 05:45:16 <johnx_> and 1320 is only slightly less than we have currently, isn't it?
May 25 05:45:22 <Stskeeps> 2000mAh
May 25 05:45:24 <Stskeeps> er
May 25 05:45:25 <Stskeeps> yeah
May 25 05:45:27 <Stskeeps> true, it is
May 25 05:45:32 <Stskeeps> 1500 mAh or something
May 25 05:45:48 <Stskeeps> still, 32gb internal storage sounds neat
May 25 05:46:10 <RST38h> So, gentlemen, have you all been salivating at that leaked N900 data? =)
May 25 05:46:15 <Macer> how big is base maemo5?
May 25 05:46:17 <Stskeeps> RST38h: in progress, but it seems to be lacking
May 25 05:46:25 <Stskeeps> Macer: not that big
May 25 05:46:26 <johnx_> RST38h: knew most of it already
May 25 05:46:44 <johnx_> nice to have my guess on screen size confirmed :>
May 25 05:47:01 <johnx_> also nice to see what looks like t-mobile (US) friendly 3G (woo!)
May 25 05:47:02 <RST38h> johnx: yes but they have got an image!
May 25 05:47:45 <Macer> heh
May 25 05:47:47 <Stskeeps> RST38h: eh, i only see a render
May 25 05:47:51 <Macer> you sure that is a real image?
May 25 05:48:10 <johnx_> RST38h: it looks like vector art I do while trying to follow a gimp tutorial
May 25 05:48:21 <Macer> haha
May 25 05:48:23 <Stskeeps> Cellular voice or VOIP both supported
May 25 05:48:28 <Stskeeps> hah, knew it
May 25 05:48:29 <Macer> woah
May 25 05:48:30 <RST38h> johnx: They say they had to render it by hand being afraid of watermarks in the original images
May 25 05:48:33 <Macer> now that's awesome
May 25 05:48:37 <RST38h> NO DPAD THOUGH
May 25 05:48:40 <Macer> Stskeeps: what about tmob support? :)
May 25 05:48:50 <Stskeeps> Macer: read the article about that
May 25 05:48:58 * RST38h cries, weeps, starts scaling walls whle tearing his hair out
May 25 05:49:02 <johnx_> makes me feel happy about my pandora order actually
May 25 05:49:11 <Macer> # T-Mobile USA: August/September 2009
May 25 05:49:12 <Macer> woah
May 25 05:49:18 <Macer> ok. i'm impressed
May 25 05:49:27 <johnx_> lots of battery, full sized USB, nice big screen, and a ... D-pad
May 25 05:50:01 <Macer> hm
May 25 05:50:07 <Macer> looking for the price
May 25 05:50:24 <|R> so uhm no GPS ?
May 25 05:50:31 <RST38h> 256MB RAM, good
May 25 05:50:35 <RST38h> Macer: $700.
May 25 05:50:36 <johnx_> with 256MB of RAM, mer will fly, I kind of bet maemo 5 is gonna be a bit sluggish
May 25 05:50:40 <Macer> ouch!
May 25 05:50:45 <Macer> 700?! :)
May 25 05:51:00 <RST38h> They all start at $700 nowadays :)
May 25 05:51:08 <Macer> well that won't last long
May 25 05:51:24 <Macer> but looking at the gigabyte atom thing that looks like a clone
May 25 05:51:27 <RST38h> July-September, heh
May 25 05:51:32 <Macer> of an n900.... :)
May 25 05:51:35 <Macer> er.. n800
May 25 05:51:39 <Macer> n810 (damnit)
May 25 05:51:49 <Stskeeps> RST38h: back to yghb and so on as dpad ;)
May 25 05:51:49 <RST38h> Shit, why no DPAD? =(
May 25 05:51:51 <Macer> i suppose they do price things like that
May 25 05:52:23 <RST38h> will be smaller than N810 too...
May 25 05:52:29 * johnx_ does the pandora dance, wonders if it might ship the same year as the n900
May 25 05:52:37 <RST38h> johnx: You mentioned something about screen size, is it smaller than N810?
May 25 05:52:56 <Stskeeps> i wonder if this phone mentioned is rx-51 or rx-71
May 25 05:53:13 <RST38h> what phone?
May 25 05:53:26 <sisto> it's a lot smaller than the n810
May 25 05:53:29 <johnx_> RST38h: the leak calls the n900 as having a 3.5" screen
May 25 05:53:30 <sisto> neat
May 25 05:53:52 <johnx_> based on sony part numbers turned up on the web, that looks accurate
May 25 05:54:00 <|R> i think i'll like the new format better than an n810
May 25 05:54:15 <johnx_> though I could never find that specific part number mentioned inthe kernel, it certainly seems to fall closely in the lineup
May 25 05:55:24 <RST38h> johnx: What is n810 screen size?
May 25 05:55:48 <Stskeeps> RST38h: after trying fremantle stuff on non-dpad machines i can understand why they did away with it and sized the tablet down though
May 25 05:55:54 <|R> RST38h: 4.1"
May 25 05:55:57 <Stskeeps> as it's fully navigatable without
May 25 05:55:57 <sisto> what they say might be a proximity sensor could also be the light sensor
May 25 05:56:09 <Stskeeps> sisto: it's most likely the light sensor
May 25 05:56:39 <RST38h> Here goes ebook reading....
May 25 05:56:55 <RST38h> Sts: Can't play games without dpad.
May 25 05:57:08 <RST38h> Sts: Does not matter how navigatable it is.
May 25 05:57:20 <|R> wasd ?
May 25 05:57:27 <sisto> yeah we'll miss the d-pad
May 25 05:57:28 <inz> hjkl?
May 25 05:57:37 <|R> hehe :)
May 25 05:58:14 <sisto> or not
May 25 05:58:19 <sisto> we'll have to see
May 25 05:58:52 <RST38h> Smaller display definitely isn't good. Hopefully, it is some kind of mistake
May 25 05:59:46 <johnx_> RST38h: I'm gonna bet no mistake.
May 25 05:59:49 <|R> is it a (what's that iPhone screen tech name again?) screen ?
May 25 06:00:50 <RST38h> johnx: yea, betting on the worst outcome has never failed me too.
May 25 06:00:54 <sisto> multitouch?
May 25 06:01:16 <|R> transductive or something like that?
May 25 06:01:16 <sisto> i'm betting for smaller screen considering the device itself is a lot smaller
May 25 06:01:30 <sisto> capacitive?
May 25 06:01:42 <johnx_> RST38h: well, in the kernel is an LCD name, and on parts sites are similar names that refer to transflective 3.5" displays
May 25 06:01:57 <johnx_> BTW, I was right that Nokia would find a way to make the D-pad worse than the N810 :>
May 25 06:03:05 <|R> sisto: probably :)
May 25 06:04:17 <sisto> it's very similar to the n97
May 25 06:04:42 <Stskeeps> what are the n97 launch dates again? if they line up, that's frightening :P
May 25 06:04:47 <sisto> except the n97's specs are a lot lower
May 25 06:05:05 <sisto> I hope Nokia does a good job marketing the n900
May 25 06:05:29 <RST38h> johnx: hehe
May 25 06:05:29 <luke-jr> I hope SmartQ puts out a model w/ keyboard so I don't need to consider a N900
May 25 06:06:18 <RST38h> johnx: right now, all things point out that I will end up with a 5800 or its successor as my main device
May 25 06:06:30 <|R> Can the N900 really be cell phone data only or is adding voice just a software (ofono) issue?
May 25 06:06:53 <johnx_> RST38h: that would be a bummer to a lot of us that would love the hell out of your emulators on faster hardware
May 25 06:07:24 <RST38h> johnx: well, if Nokia gives me developer discount, I will port all these
May 25 06:07:28 <johnx_> |R: I'm thinking phone capabilities were always a part of it, but Nokia didn't want to tip their hand
May 25 06:07:41 <RST38h> johnx: By "main device" I mean something I carry daily
May 25 06:08:10 <johnx_> I also assume that "main device" would see more dev time though ;)
May 25 06:08:13 <|R> johnx_: hopefully :)
May 25 06:08:35 <RST38h> johnx: All my stuff is portable
May 25 06:08:46 <sisto> was the accelerometer confirmed?
May 25 06:08:58 <RST38h> johnx: Most changes happen to the portable core code
May 25 06:08:58 <sisto> i guess it's just a rumor for now
May 25 06:09:04 <Stskeeps> sisto: yeah, MCE states that
May 25 06:09:10 <Stskeeps> it doesn't work without an accelerometer to tell it
May 25 06:09:11 <RST38h> all right, work time.
May 25 06:09:48 <RST38h> poor little E70 has got sick dpad but I can still use it for IRC =)
May 25 06:10:21 <|R> I wonder if the device will be able to run I2P
May 25 06:11:08 <sisto> Stskeeps: MCE?
May 25 06:12:01 <Stskeeps>  .. machine control entity
May 25 06:12:04 <Stskeeps> i gotta run to the bus though
May 25 06:12:12 <sisto> thx
May 25 06:15:40 <Timix> I'am new user on maemo garage. we have a little project in there. I would like to know where I can get an address to my project folders for subversion control.
May 25 06:45:17 <rm_you> wow, failing at figuring out how to get GPS location, thought it was supposed to be really easy >_<
May 25 06:52:11 <Jaffa> http://www.mobilecrunch.com/2009/05/24/exclusive-everything-there-is-to-know-about-nokias-next-tablet/ has some things which make it sound reasonable
May 25 06:56:18 * Jaffa reads the scrollback a little.
May 25 06:56:30 <Jaffa> Hmm, much smaller than an N810 but significantly thicker.
May 25 06:57:30 <Jaffa> Heh, "Nokia intends... Jaiku/Twitter app called 'Mauku'"
May 25 07:01:19 <johnx> nice to have independent confirmation, but ... they could have written this whole article from one itt/t.m.o thread
May 25 07:04:33 <Sts|office> mm, i love work sometimes
May 25 07:04:48 <Sts|office> "we need this debian package updated, and these rootfs's made"
May 25 07:47:50 <aquatix> hm, 3.5" touchscreen for that n900?
May 25 07:48:25 <Corsac> seems si
May 25 07:48:27 <Corsac> so
May 25 07:49:33 <aquatix> hm
May 25 07:50:06 <aquatix> that's 0.7" smaller than the n810 right?
May 25 07:50:09 <aquatix> :/
May 25 07:51:00 <johnx> a little smaller than the zaurus clamshells
May 25 07:51:05 <johnx> it's not *that* small
May 25 07:51:08 <johnx> hey wazd :)
May 25 07:51:17 <wazd> hola everybody!
May 25 07:51:20 <wazd> http://www.engadget.com/2009/05/25/nokias-n810-successor-coming-later-this-year-with-3g-and-maemo/
May 25 07:53:09 <mavhc> if your n800/n810 broke today, what would you do?
May 25 07:54:19 <Stskeeps> ask for donations
May 25 07:54:20 <Stskeeps> :P
May 25 07:54:20 <wazd> mavhc: it won't :)
May 25 07:55:43 <RST38h> wazd: Yea. No dpad. Smaller screen.
May 25 07:56:00 <wazd> RST38h: wait what?)
May 25 07:56:15 <wazd> RST38h: why smaller screen?(
May 25 07:56:32 <wazd> aaaw
May 25 07:56:38 <wazd> missed that row(
May 25 07:57:25 <Stskeeps> the specs don't seem complete though
May 25 07:58:13 <johnx> some things we can take for granted
May 25 07:58:38 <mavhc> I don't see them going with a smaller screen
May 25 07:58:40 <johnx> I don't think anyone would release a smartphone without gps and bt at this point
May 25 07:58:57 <johnx> mavhc: bet you dollars to donuts it's 3.5"
May 25 07:59:56 <mavhc> how much are donuts?
May 25 08:00:07 <johnx> like 50c to 75c here
May 25 08:00:55 <johnx> and they taste better than money anyways
May 25 08:02:03 <mavhc> money can be exchanged for goods and services
May 25 08:02:27 <johnx> donuts can do *overly emphatic wink*
May 25 08:03:31 <johnx> s/do/too/
May 25 08:03:31 <infobot> johnx meant: toonuts can do *overly emphatic wink*
May 25 08:03:38 <johnx> fail
May 25 08:11:27 <Macer> lol omg
May 25 08:11:35 <Macer> house of the dead overkill's intro made me just bust out laughing
May 25 08:11:42 <Macer> it was like a sam l jackson moment
May 25 08:12:23 <Macer> "he'll cut your balls" "i'm gonna cut your motha fuckin balls!"
May 25 08:12:32 <Macer> it was like the mexican preview in grindhouse
May 25 08:49:30 <Sho_> so I assume http://www.mobilecrunch.com/2009/05/24/exclusive-everything-there-is-to-know-about-nokias-next-tablet/ is already the talk of the town
May 25 08:49:49 <Stskeeps> yeah
May 25 08:50:30 <aquatix> yep
May 25 08:50:46 <aquatix> but if it's real, and thus a phone, i might just want it :)
May 25 08:50:50 <Stskeeps> nothing new honestly though
May 25 08:51:03 <Stskeeps> except for the obvious phone-ness
May 25 08:51:31 <RST38h> too phoney, indeed
May 25 08:51:52 <Stskeeps> well there's talk of rx-51 and rx-71 so
May 25 08:51:56 <Sho_> Yeah, screen's too small
May 25 08:52:03 <Sho_> 3.5" (vs. 4.1" for the N810)
May 25 08:52:17 <Stskeeps> on the other hand
May 25 08:52:17 <Sho_> Same screen res, but physiclaly smaller
May 25 08:52:18 <Stskeeps> a maemophone?
May 25 08:52:28 <aquatix> screen is too small for a tablet, but if it's a phone, the whole thing becomes more... phoney
May 25 08:52:36 <aquatix> Stskeeps: yep :)
May 25 08:52:37 * aquatix likes
May 25 08:54:05 <RST38h> Maybe if it is indeed a phone, I can carry it instead of a phone...
May 25 08:55:18 <Sho_> hm well, my primary application for the N810 has actually been reading, so I'm unhappy about the smaller screen
May 25 08:55:33 <Stskeeps> Sho_: i still think there'll be multiple models
May 25 08:55:57 <johnxx> I'm betting 3.5" will represent the biggest screen though
May 25 08:55:58 <rm_you> i need a phone... O_o
May 25 08:55:59 <RST38h> Sho: Same here
May 25 08:56:15 <RST38h> johnx: Biggest among what?
May 25 08:56:42 <johnxx> I bet the rx-51 with a 3.5" screen represents the biggest physical screen size of the maemo 5 lineup
May 25 08:56:45 * johnxx will bump the font size and cope
May 25 08:56:49 * RST38h wonders if this screen will be well protected
May 25 08:57:06 <RST38h> N800 and N810 have exposed screens that are difficult to clean and scary to touch
May 25 08:57:33 <johnxx> and yet, my n800 is just fine after more than two years of banging on it
May 25 08:57:56 <RST38h> My N810 protector is all scratched now
May 25 08:58:08 <rm_you> gphone has exposed screen and has not had any problems afaict, same with 99% of phones with open screens
May 25 08:58:21 <RST38h> BTW, why so many people complain about supposed carrier lockin of N900? Who said anything abut carrier lockin?
May 25 08:58:44 <RST38h> rm_you: 5800 has protected screen, feels way better
May 25 08:59:01 <johnxx> well, judging from t-mobile's past I find it hard to believe that the t-mobile branded version will actually have all the features enabled out of the gate
May 25 08:59:22 <johnxx> RST38h, is it capacitive?
May 25 08:59:27 <RST38h> johnx: nope
May 25 08:59:40 <johnxx> huh, just a harder plastic?
May 25 08:59:42 <RST38h> just covered with cheap sturdy plastic
May 25 09:00:17 <RST38h> Nokia's cheaper generic line of devices is actually way better built than N-series devices (and E-series too lately)
May 25 09:01:31 <atharva> hi friend s i m tring to run gui appliication in scratchbox .. I tried to start xephyr from command line outside srcatchbox but it is giving error : Could not init font path element /usr/share/fonts/X11/cyrillic, removing from list!
May 25 09:01:47 <atharva> please help me how to resolve it
May 25 09:01:49 <johnxx> that should just be a warning
May 25 09:01:51 <johnxx> does it crash?
May 25 09:01:55 <RST38h> that's a warning
May 25 09:01:55 <atharva> no
May 25 09:01:59 <RST38h> then ignore it
May 25 09:02:22 <atharva> but when i run gtkhelloworld it says problems with font
May 25 09:02:39 <atharva> Could not init font path element /usr/share/fonts/X11/cyrillic, removing from list!
May 25 09:02:57 <atharva> sorry the error isNo fonts found; this probably means that the fontconfig
May 25 09:02:57 <atharva> library is not correctly configured. You may need to
May 25 09:02:57 <atharva> edit the fonts.conf configuration file. More information
May 25 09:02:57 <atharva> about fontconfig can be found in the fontconfig(3) manual
May 25 09:03:22 <atharva> what's the problem?
May 25 09:04:26 <Corsac> maybe fontconfig library is not correctly configured?
May 25 09:06:12 <atharva> do i hv to configure it inside scratchbox?
May 25 09:06:25 <RST38h> atharva: this directory is supposed to contain cyrillic X11 fonts
May 25 09:06:40 <RST38h> atharva: Unless you are trying to use cyrillic fonts, you can safely ignore the warning
May 25 09:07:42 <atharva> ok thanks i will try again
May 25 09:07:45 <atharva> :)
May 25 09:08:44 <danielwilms> atharva: this warning is a xephyr thing...here are some hints to get rid of it...haven't tested it by myself though
May 25 09:08:47 <danielwilms>  http://www.debianhelp.org/node/1218
May 25 09:09:12 <ifvoid> hello!
May 25 09:09:20 <danielwilms> but it shouldnt be a problem in general as the others said
May 25 09:09:28 <ifvoid> how do I find out which Maemo version is running on my N800?
May 25 09:09:33 <RST38h> Install cyrillic fonts or remove path from config file
May 25 09:09:37 <RST38h> And you will get rid of it
May 25 09:10:32 <atharva> ok thanks guys
May 25 09:10:44 <johnxx> ifvoid, main menu -> settings -> control panel -> about
May 25 09:10:49 <amr> is it normal for the n810s screen to stay on after i've switched it to lock?
May 25 09:10:57 <ifvoid> johnxx: yeah, that says "unknown"
May 25 09:10:57 <amr> like my 770 used to turn off the screen
May 25 09:11:18 <amr> its like the backlight is still on very very very faintly
May 25 09:11:20 <aquatix> amr: it stays on for a little bit, then switches off here
May 25 09:11:26 <amr> hmm, mine didn't
May 25 09:11:30 <amr> i've just had it away for a few hours
May 25 09:11:32 <aquatix> it should :/
May 25 09:11:34 <aquatix> odd
May 25 09:11:36 <johnxx> ifvoid, I think that was a bug in an older version, so I can probably say "you don't have the latest version"
May 25 09:11:50 <amr> maybe a reboot would help
May 25 09:11:53 <johnxx> amr, is it plugged in to power?
May 25 09:11:56 <amr> no
May 25 09:12:01 <ifvoid> johnxx: isn't there an other way to check (from the command lien for example)?
May 25 09:12:01 <amr> its just been charged
May 25 09:12:24 <amr> the procedure to put it away for a bit is just simply to slide the lock button, isn't it?
May 25 09:12:30 <amr> and put it in that sleeve if you want
May 25 09:13:17 <johnxx> ifvoid,  apt-cache policy osso-software-version-rx34
May 25 09:13:20 <amr> when i slide the lock, it says touch screen & keys locked, the backlight dims and it looks like its off
May 25 09:13:29 <amr> but if i hold it under my desk, you can tell the backlight is still on
May 25 09:13:32 <amr> very faintly, but still there
May 25 09:16:10 <ifvoid> johnxx: that package doesn't exist
May 25 09:16:33 <amr> hmmms
May 25 09:16:37 <amr> most puzzlin
May 25 09:16:38 <amr> g
May 25 09:17:19 <johnxx> ifvoid, might explain the <unknown> then
May 25 09:17:46 <johnxx> is it just saying "installed: (none)" or is it really saying something like no such package?
May 25 09:18:00 <johnxx> errr, oops
May 25 09:18:05 <johnxx> n810, right
May 25 09:18:27 <johnxx> try this: apt-cache policy osso-software-version-rx44
May 25 09:18:32 <johnxx> (44 instead of 34)
May 25 09:18:37 <johnxx> 34 is the n800 ;)
May 25 09:19:16 <rm_you> hrm
May 25 09:19:26 <rm_you> punching through my firewall from this side could be difficult...
May 25 09:19:32 <amr> johnxx, who is that for?
May 25 09:19:51 <johnxx> amr, it's for ifvoid
May 25 09:19:54 <amr> my bad
May 25 09:20:04 <rm_you> need to poke a hole for mysql and can't get any commandline browser to work on my router's conf page (w3m, elinks, links2)
May 25 09:20:08 <rm_you> suggestions?
May 25 09:20:13 * lcuk wakes
May 25 09:20:24 <amr> hello lcuk, solve my sleeping issue :p
May 25 09:20:25 <johnxx> rm_you, no ideas. why are you stuck in the CLI?
May 25 09:20:28 <rm_you> currently trying to install X and firefox on my server to use firefox over ssh X forwarding >_>
May 25 09:20:38 <johnxx> why not forward an ssh port and tunnel in
May 25 09:20:46 <lcuk> you cant sleep amr?
May 25 09:21:11 <johnxx> amr, in the display section, try setting dim and turn off to be the same number (ie, both 1 minute)
May 25 09:21:13 <rm_you> johnxx: my server does not as of yet have any graphical anything
May 25 09:21:25 <johnxx> rm_you, <johnxx> why not forward an ssh port and tunnel in
May 25 09:21:44 <amr> lcuk, my tablet cant :P
May 25 09:21:47 <rm_you> johnxx: tunnel what in?
May 25 09:21:48 <amr> johnxx, ill try that now
May 25 09:22:05 <rm_you> johnxx: vnc? still requires X?
May 25 09:22:37 <amr> right, lets see if that works
May 25 09:22:45 <johnxx> nope, just uses it like a cheap vpn so you can use your desktop browser
May 25 09:22:49 <amr> thats probs why my battery is only lasting just a day :p
May 25 09:23:02 <amr> and it worked, you bloody star johnxx
May 25 09:23:03 <amr> thanks :)
May 25 09:23:08 <johnxx> amr, cool beans :)
May 25 09:23:23 <johnxx> it still should be timing out after a while though and actually turning off the backlight
May 25 09:23:36 <johnxx> might be hard to tell on the n810 since the screen is transflective
May 25 09:23:37 <amr> yeah, i set dim to be 10 secs, off to be 30
May 25 09:23:46 <amr> ill try it normally now
May 25 09:24:16 <rm_you> eh got midori running over X11 forwarding :)
May 25 09:24:28 <amr> yep :) woowoo
May 25 09:24:45 <johnxx> yay. everyone's happy
May 25 09:24:47 * johnxx sleeps
May 25 09:25:20 <lcuk> amr, take the battery out :)
May 25 09:25:50 <atharva> hi friends , I am runnign xephyr outside sracthbox , and then i m trying to execute command  "run-standalone.sh ./example_hildonprogram" . Now i m getting this msg "AF Warning: '/etc/osso-af-init/keyboard.defs' not found AF Warning: '/etc/osso-af-init/sdl.defs' not found" plz help
May 25 09:26:16 <amr> lcuk, heh :p
May 25 09:26:43 <rm_you> johnxx: ok so i think i have a better idea
May 25 09:27:13 <johnxx> rm_you, then letting me get some sleep? :P let's hear it
May 25 09:27:14 <rm_you> johnxx: curl is easier to use and lighter weight that mysql, i'll just write up some quick PHP pages to do the submit and pull
May 25 09:27:24 <rm_you> and use CURL tabletside
May 25 09:27:27 <rm_you> easier for everyone
May 25 09:27:35 <johnxx> <_<
May 25 09:27:44 <Stskeeps> do i dare to ask what you're working on? :P
May 25 09:27:46 <rm_you> yes? no? :P
May 25 09:28:13 <atharva> :(
May 25 09:28:22 <lcuk> web 2.0 advanced backlight with remote dimming using AJAX :p
May 25 09:28:42 <rm_you> :P
May 25 09:29:27 <johnxx> Stskeeps, a little app that displays your location on a map as well as the location of other people
May 25 09:29:37 <johnxx> emphasis on quick, easy and lightweight
May 25 09:29:44 <Stskeeps> ah
May 25 09:29:46 <Stskeeps> neat
May 25 09:29:50 <RST38h> atharva: Please, stop asking us about all these warnings
May 25 09:29:51 <Stskeeps> for cph? ;)
May 25 09:29:51 <rm_you> and their status... and also hopefully on-the-fly shared POIs
May 25 09:29:54 <rm_you> yes
May 25 09:29:58 <RST38h> atharva: Only complain if your app does not work
May 25 09:30:03 <Stskeeps> hehe
May 25 09:30:13 <amr> that sounds cool rm_you
May 25 09:30:15 <RST38h> Because yes, Scratchbox is a bitch, and it complains like a bitch, and it is broken
May 25 09:30:15 <johnxx> rm_you, though, if you're going to do that you might as well use the jabber xml format for location info
May 25 09:30:29 <atharva> it is not working RST38h
May 25 09:30:32 * johnxx is really sleeping now, won't respond anymore
May 25 09:30:39 <RST38h> atharva: Then what is the error message?
May 25 09:30:39 <rm_you> this still won't require jabber though <_<
May 25 09:31:08 <amr> there need to be more pretty apps
May 25 09:31:12 <amr> and easy to use :p
May 25 09:31:34 <atharva> i dont understand which is error n which is warning
May 25 09:31:41 <amr> ive noticed lots of great programming & ideas
May 25 09:31:49 <amr> just their interfaces are u-g-l-y
May 25 09:32:20 <atharva> is this error or warning  ? "/home/atharva/.osso/current-gtk-key-theme:1: Unable to find include file: "keybindings.rc"
May 25 09:32:22 <atharva> ?
May 25 09:33:27 <rm_you> amr: many programmers are not artists, and take a functional over aesthetic approach to GUI design
May 25 09:34:03 <rm_you> also, some are just complete retards when it comes to UI design in general, and can't even achieve a functional UI regardless of aesthetic T_T
May 25 09:34:58 <RST38h> Ehehehe
May 25 09:35:33 <RST38h> N76 is back with a vengeance
May 25 09:35:40 <lcuk> you can also get an evolutionary design coming out of nowhere :P
May 25 09:36:02 * RST38h finds it ironic how Nokia is occupying poor Motorola's niche now
May 25 09:36:43 <wazd> everything properly functional is always aeshetic
May 25 09:37:07 <wazd> I don't know anything that worked like a charm but looked shitty
May 25 09:37:36 <amr> its a shame that so many potentially good things are let down by a god awful UI
May 25 09:38:05 <amr> youd have thought with the tablet being an on-the-go type of device that design would be pretty important to everyone
May 25 09:38:35 <RST38h> wazd: aluminium crates used to carre milk packs back in .SU
May 25 09:38:42 <RST38h> s/carre/carry
May 25 09:39:06 <RST38h> wazd: were ugly like shit, worked like a charm
May 25 09:39:22 <lcuk> wazd \o hi, have you seen the new video
May 25 09:39:44 <wazd> lcuk: heya, nope :)
May 25 09:40:04 <wazd> RST38h: well, .su design school is an exception xD
May 25 09:40:20 <wazd> RST38h: Some mutation or something :)
May 25 09:40:38 <lcuk> oooh you are in for a treat then :D
May 25 09:40:42 <lcuk> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vt7qB37sLLo
May 25 09:40:55 <RST38h> wazd: That and anything made by IBM
May 25 09:45:26 <amr> bloody HELL its warm!
May 25 09:46:47 <wazd> lcuk: looks impressive, awesome tech demo, still no sense for me :(
May 25 09:47:03 <amr> anyone fancy teaching me graph theory before my exam tomorrow?
May 25 09:47:17 <RST38h> lcuk, it really has to DO something to make sense
May 25 09:50:34 * rm_you sleeps
May 25 09:52:26 <lcuk> wazd, its much more than a demo, its just being built from the inside out :)  there are numerous apps that it can be used for. i was speaking to vlad and he would like to see omweather in there, i can see the user pics being able to send messages its an image/media viewer its like my brain.  its got a complete calendar which works just like the one on my wall...  and theres about 30 plugins there already
May 25 09:53:00 * lcuk should make a calculator to make rst happy
May 25 09:55:19 <wazd> lcuk: why not just use native environment for all these apps?)
May 25 09:56:11 <roope> craigslist looks like shit but works like a charm. :)
May 25 09:56:25 <amr> lol
May 25 09:56:30 <amr> same with ebay
May 25 09:56:31 <roope> As did ICQ. and Napster. And all those back in the days.
May 25 09:56:35 <wazd> lcuk: what's the point of having two OMW's on one device, one native and one inside liqbase?)
May 25 09:56:57 <wazd> roope, well, I don't see any shit in ICQ)
May 25 09:57:07 <roope> I think there's a huge number of examples of things that work like a charm but look like shit. :)
May 25 09:57:09 <amr> canola is a nice app tho
May 25 09:57:12 <RST38h> ICQ depends on what client you are using
May 25 09:57:14 <amr> you can tell thought went into the design
May 25 09:57:38 <RST38h> Their server infrastructure started like shit but it is now in much better shape
May 25 09:58:30 <roope> well, the ICQ UI was a horrorfest back in the days. Like in 2000.
May 25 09:58:31 <wazd> I've noticed that canola spends a lot of time to load battery and wlan status
May 25 09:58:39 <amr> can the tablets access wpa-enterprise networks?
May 25 09:59:02 <amr> wazd, my point was that its pretty :p
May 25 09:59:54 <lcuk> wazd, wouldnt there be 2 versions of omweather anyway one gtk and one clutter
May 25 10:00:25 <wazd> lcuk: they are for different devices
May 25 10:00:30 <lcuk> or even one flash if we look at your site
May 25 10:00:45 <wazd> lcuk: no, no flash OMWeather :D
May 25 10:00:46 <lcuk> but the gtk one would work on the new device wouldnt it
May 25 10:01:14 <wazd> lcuk: I really don't see any reason to use old versions on the new hardware
May 25 10:01:27 <lcuk> heheh :)
May 25 10:01:44 <lcuk> so its ok to redesign something if you see the point, but not if others do ;)
May 25 10:01:49 <wazd> lcuk: right now we're concentrated on making new version look and feel mindblowing :)
May 25 10:02:13 <lcuk> of course, as we all are
May 25 10:02:26 <amr> new version of what?
May 25 10:02:33 <wazd> amr: OMWeather
May 25 10:02:36 <amr> oic
May 25 10:02:51 <amr> i use that :)
May 25 10:03:32 <rm_you> i like Mer's "it's 34 degrees in helsinki" app. it satisfies all of my weather needs :)
May 25 10:05:05 <wazd> Right now I'm working on settings menu concept
May 25 10:05:15 <RST38h> 40 foot poster includes over 1,000 versions of 150 different types of Unix.
May 25 10:05:32 <wazd> I want it to be usable both portrait and landscape
May 25 10:05:58 <rm_you> RST38h: i printed something like that four years ago and unfurled it across the entire length of the classroom for my presentation on UNIX :P
May 25 10:06:15 <rm_you> it was very dramatic :)
May 25 10:06:44 <RST38h> rm_you: yes but this stuff is better, it weights 10 pounds and is weatherproof =)
May 25 10:06:53 <RST38h> You can literalyl wrap buildings in it
May 25 10:07:09 <rm_you> lol
May 25 10:08:08 <rm_you> god I love opera link sooo much
May 25 10:08:27 <rm_you> opera sync, whatever it is exactly
May 25 10:08:28 <rm_you> <3
May 25 10:09:55 <thux> do somebody know will turion go to sempron socket? can i replace my sempron with turion?
May 25 10:14:56 <amr> quake is pretty damn cool
May 25 10:14:59 <amr> and works surprisingly well
May 25 10:15:30 <Stskeeps> morning timeless_mbp
May 25 10:15:40 <timeless_mbp> 1:15pm :(
May 25 10:15:56 <amr> if it makes you feel better it's only 11:10 in the UK :)
May 25 10:17:08 <thux> timeless_mbp: where are you? you got same zone than .fi
May 25 10:17:18 <timeless_mbp> HEL
May 25 10:17:46 <timeless_mbp> for this time, there aren't many choices
May 25 10:17:53 <timeless_mbp> i could be in .il, but that wouldn't be particularly logical
May 25 10:18:26 <timeless_mbp> btw, /whois timeless_mbp is your friend
May 25 10:21:52 <Stskeeps> neat, the freerunner can act as a bluetool gps
May 25 10:22:31 <Stskeeps> th
May 25 10:23:43 <thux> isn't same timezone go north to south so many possibilities where to be in every zone
May 25 10:24:50 <timeless_mbp> thux: technically yes, practically, no
May 25 10:26:02 <timeless_mbp> if i'm in UTC-12
May 25 10:26:14 <timeless_mbp> how many major locations are actually there?
May 25 10:26:43 <timeless_mbp> for EEST, there are very few civilized countries
May 25 10:27:13 <amr> hmm, i installed that accounts-haze plugin
May 25 10:27:15 <timeless_mbp> i mean, sure, i could be in Egypt (or Israel as I already mentioned), but would you think i was in Sudan? :)
May 25 10:27:26 <thux> i also thought that meizi_irkki is only other fi in this channel, but good to hear that more people from hell :)
May 25 10:27:26 <amr> and added an MSN account but it still said "no accounts" mm
May 25 10:27:27 <amr> hmm*
May 25 10:27:41 <timeless_mbp> oh there can be a bunch of us
May 25 10:27:46 <timeless_mbp> qgil comes in at times
May 25 10:27:46 <suihkulokki> thux: hehe
May 25 10:27:57 <timeless_mbp> suihkulokki of course
May 25 10:29:02 <suihkulokki> run /who #maemo and you'll see this channel infested by people in finland
May 25 10:29:52 <timeless_mbp> and some people from .nokia.com
May 25 10:29:57 <timeless_mbp> which is always more disturbing
May 25 10:30:26 <thux> suihkulokki: ok you just use exellent english i thought you are americans
May 25 10:30:35 * timeless_mbp cries
May 25 10:30:52 <timeless_mbp> if their names are funny, they probably aren't Americans
May 25 10:31:08 <timeless_mbp> that said, suihkulokki's English is relatively good
May 25 10:31:26 <jumpula> only relatively? :p
May 25 10:31:50 <timeless_mbp> jumpula: localized compliment
May 25 10:32:12 <jumpula> hehe
May 25 10:32:49 <timeless_mbp> 2009-05-24 (Sunday):
May 25 10:32:49 <timeless_mbp> suihkulokki	a "accident" that makes lots of profit?
May 25 10:32:57 * timeless_mbp kicks irc client
May 25 10:33:04 <timeless_mbp> 2009-05-24 (Sunday): <suihkulokki> a "accident" that makes lots of profit?
May 25 10:33:41 <timeless_mbp> points for trying to use an article. but only partial credit (failure to use 'an' to match the vowel starting the following word)
May 25 10:35:00 <timeless_mbp> jumpula: oddly a quick look shows that the only Finnish trait you have is not talking enough ;-)
May 25 10:35:01 <thux> timeless_mbp: but you are native speaker aren't you?
May 25 10:35:08 <timeless_mbp> thux: indeed I am
May 25 10:35:27 <suihkulokki> bah, my english is still better than timeless_mbps finnish :P
May 25 10:35:40 <timeless_mbp> joo
May 25 10:35:54 <timeless_mbp> but I'd hope that you could distinguish between a native speaker and a non native speaker
May 25 10:36:20 <timeless_mbp> whereas you said "i thought you are americans"
May 25 10:36:56 <suihkulokki> it's easier to detect native speakers when listening, many native speakers are terrible writers
May 25 10:37:35 <timeless_mbp> fwiw, you should have written "were Americans" (thought is past tense, so were is the proper verb for agreement, and note that in English all proper nouns are capitalized -- yes, I'm making a point of capitalizing them in these sentences.)
May 25 10:37:48 <jumpula> how much is enough when it comes to talking? :)
May 25 10:38:05 <timeless_mbp> suihkulokki: they are, yes, however the mistakes that Finns make are not the same as the mistakes that native speakers make
May 25 10:38:13 <thux> true it is easier unfortunately no sound in irc yet
May 25 10:38:55 <timeless_mbp> jumpula: to be confused for someone who isn't a Finn?
May 25 10:40:08 <timeless_mbp> jumpula: compare the amount and length of your sentences to suihkulokki's (and yes, I'm aware he's a Finn, but I'm merely comparing wrt quietness )
May 25 10:40:45 <jumpula> now i'm just confused :p
May 25 10:41:02 <suihkulokki> that's a common state for you :)
May 25 10:41:09 <jumpula> suihkulokki could be mistaken for a native english speaker but i couldn't?
May 25 10:41:27 <amr> ok, im trying to install rtcomm
May 25 10:41:36 <jumpula> if i understood correctly, that is :)
May 25 10:41:41 <amr> it errored saying it can't find telepathy-haze, i've added a few more repositories
May 25 10:41:53 <amr> and uninstalled the old installer, which installer do i want to use?
May 25 10:41:59 <amr> the one linked on the rtcomm.garage.maemo.org site?
May 25 10:42:12 <timeless_mbp> jumpula: you couldn't be confused for an American because you don't talk enough
May 25 10:42:43 <timeless_mbp> suihkulokki talks enough, but what he says almost immediately indicates he isn't a native speaker
May 25 10:42:58 <thux> since so many from hell, local link http://www.puhelinvertailu.com/uutiset.cfm/2009/05/25/nokian_ensimmainen_maemo_kannykka_vuosi_nettiin_jo_kesalla_myyntiin
May 25 10:43:24 <timeless_mbp> gah, stupid web site
May 25 10:43:30 <timeless_mbp> it has a British flag
May 25 10:43:39 <timeless_mbp> but the flag takes me to http://www.afterdawn.com/
May 25 10:44:05 <jumpula> you'd rather have the link take you to her majesty's home page?
May 25 10:44:18 <amr> god save the queen
May 25 10:44:23 <timeless_mbp> i'd rather a translation...
May 25 10:44:30 <jumpula> :)
May 25 10:44:42 <timeless_mbp> http://translate.google.com/translate?prev=hp&hl=en&js=n&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.puhelinvertailu.com%2Fuutiset.cfm%2F2009%2F05%2F25%2Fnokian_ensimmainen_maemo_kannykka_vuosi_nettiin_jo_kesalla_myyntiin&sl=fi&tl=en&history_state0=
May 25 10:44:44 <timeless_mbp> vaguely works
May 25 10:45:15 <timeless_mbp> oh wow, now i know someone is lying
May 25 10:46:06 <timeless_mbp> Puhelimen ominaisuudet ovat lähes identtiset N97 :n kanssa, erona ainoastaan tarkempi näyttö ja Maemo-alusta, josta kuvissa esiintyy MobileCrunchin mukaan viides sukupolvi.
May 25 10:46:14 <timeless_mbp> could someone contribute a better translation of that?
May 25 10:46:28 <Stskeeps> timeless_mbp: if you see mobilecrunch that article seems 1:1 to that article
May 25 10:47:18 <slonopotamus> uh... anyone figured out where's mac address in /dev/mtd1? :)
May 25 10:47:19 <jumpula> the phone's features are nearly identical with N97, the differences are larger display and maemo platform from which a 5th generation is displayed in the image
May 25 10:47:38 <Stskeeps> slonopotamus: i thought luke did?
May 25 10:48:00 <jumpula> as there's no picture in the display in the image, the statement is a bit confusing one
May 25 10:48:41 <thux> and for sale in summer?
May 25 10:48:42 <jumpula> hmm. i think i did a non-native speaker mistake above :p
May 25 10:49:05 <jumpula> on the display?
May 25 10:49:24 <timeless_mbp> "shown"
May 25 10:49:32 <timeless_mbp> and "picture"
May 25 10:49:35 <Mikho_> what's the difference between launching an application from the command line, inside maemo, and DBus launching it with the information contained in the corresponding .service file?
May 25 10:49:37 <thux> soon is summertime then we can buy new maemo
May 25 10:49:38 <amr> hmms, my msn account adds but doesnt connect now ive installed rtcomm
May 25 10:49:44 <jumpula> aye, better that way
May 25 10:49:54 <Mikho_> why does my program work when it's launched by DBus, and never when it's run from the command line?
May 25 10:50:02 <jumpula> thux: assuming the source is reliable
May 25 10:50:15 <timeless_mbp> > The phone features are almost identical with N97's, the only difference between an accurate display and the Maemo platform from which the images occur MobileCrunchin the fifth generation.
May 25 10:50:18 <timeless_mbp> is what google gave me
May 25 10:50:32 <amr> anyone had msn(haze) problems when using rtcomm?
May 25 10:50:40 <timeless_mbp> which as you can tell is Garbage Out
May 25 10:50:48 <jumpula> accurate in this case mean has a larger resolution
May 25 10:50:54 <amr> when pressing the presence icon in the status bar i get "Disconnected, Network error"
May 25 10:51:18 <timeless_mbp> jumpula: could you load my translate link and try to improve google's translation of the sentence?
May 25 10:51:21 <timeless_mbp> don't fix it too much
May 25 10:51:28 <slonopotamus> Stskeeps, btw. you said it isn't a block device. what kind of a device it is then?
May 25 10:51:32 <amr> and with irc
May 25 10:51:33 <amr> :(
May 25 10:51:34 <timeless_mbp> just teach it the bit for larger resolution
May 25 10:52:00 * timeless_mbp runs to hunt food
May 25 10:52:10 <timeless_mbp> sp3000: i don't suppose you're around to grab lunch for me in advance?
May 25 10:52:41 <jumpula> timeless_mbp: i'd have to rewrite the entire page. the translation is awful.
May 25 10:53:58 <jumpula> and the finnish part is bit poorly written with respect to terms used
May 25 10:54:25 <jumpula> exact translation would be "more accurate display" like google suggests
May 25 10:54:33 <timeless_mbp> oh
May 25 10:54:36 <timeless_mbp> ok, then don't touch it
May 25 10:55:46 <timeless_mbp> wow, so this article is even after the Italian article
May 25 10:56:11 <timeless_mbp> an italian coworker pointed to it and said that's the last place to get a translation
May 25 10:56:22 <timeless_mbp> and then he ran off to enjoy a vacation
May 25 10:56:36 * timeless_mbp runs off to get lunch
May 25 11:00:58 <Mikho_> does anyone know if DBus does anything else than execute the file specified in the service file, when it autostarts an application?
May 25 11:02:48 <Stskeeps> slonopotamus: mtd? :P
May 25 11:23:41 <RST38h> Mikho: It does
May 25 11:24:23 <RST38h> Mikho: DBus is supposed to send your program a specific DBus message to which you have to answer. If you do not, DBus will consider your app hung and kill it off in a while
May 25 11:30:40 <Mikho_> ok
May 25 11:30:59 <Mikho_> how would it differ from me starting the executable from the command line?
May 25 11:32:33 <RST38h> starting stuff from command line does not require DBus
May 25 11:32:36 <Mikho_> the executable does call osso_initialize properly
May 25 11:32:43 <RST38h> In fact, you do not need to use .service file
May 25 11:33:02 <RST38h> You canstart executables directly from .desktop file
May 25 11:33:15 <Mikho_> also, even if I start it from the command line, I'm able to receive dbus messages ok
May 25 11:33:40 <Mikho_> but still, the program doesn't work properly
May 25 11:33:47 <Mikho_> it won't get shut down or anything
May 25 11:34:39 <RST38h> This is too vague description
May 25 11:35:06 <Mikho_> it's because I have no idea what's wrong exactly
May 25 11:35:30 <Mikho_> i'm just trying to find out, by first finding out how starting the program from DBus and from command line differ
May 25 11:36:36 * slonopotamus wonders, wtf is 'starting the program from DBus'
May 25 11:37:45 <timeless_mbp> slonopotamus: technically you can
May 25 11:37:56 <timeless_mbp> if you try to use dbus to talk to something which isn't there, dbus has provisions to make it happen
May 25 11:38:01 <timeless_mbp> not that it's important
May 25 11:38:20 <matzenh> hi, the maemo repository have problem? Temporary failure resolving 'repository.maemo.org'
May 25 11:38:40 <timeless_mbp> matzenh: wfm :)
May 25 11:38:44 <slonopotamus> timeless_mbp, oh my. is it used in practice?
May 25 11:38:49 <timeless_mbp> sadly
May 25 11:38:52 <timeless_mbp> (yes)
May 25 11:39:12 <timeless_mbp> it's an interesting feature of the dbus "bus" design
May 25 11:39:19 <timeless_mbp> ouch
May 25 11:39:29 <timeless_mbp> my w7 is currently Dumping physical memory to disk: 30
May 25 11:39:31 <Mikho_> somehow the two starting methods differ, and something in the commandline method causes my program to not work properly
May 25 11:39:45 <X-Fade> matzenh: http://downforeveryoneorjustme.com/repository.maemo.org
May 25 11:40:51 <slonopotamus> http://downforeveryoneorjustme.com/downforeveryoneorjustme.com hehe
May 25 11:41:32 <timeless_mbp> slonopotamus: awesome
May 25 11:41:51 <Stskeeps> X-Fade: http://downforeveryoneorjustme.com/garage.maemo.org
May 25 11:42:04 <X-Fade> Stskeeps: That one is just slow.
May 25 11:42:08 <Stskeeps> ah
May 25 11:42:16 <X-Fade> Stskeeps: Very very slow.
May 25 11:42:21 <timeless_mbp> and uses https
May 25 11:42:23 <Stskeeps> wasn't me! ;)
May 25 11:42:28 <timeless_mbp> and very very very slow
May 25 11:42:35 <timeless_mbp> you sure it isn't down?
May 25 11:42:42 <timeless_mbp> it's doing a very good impression of down
May 25 11:43:01 <X-Fade> timeless_mbp: Yes, because I'm logged in via ssh. But it is very slow.
May 25 11:43:03 <Stskeeps> it's crawling ;)
May 25 11:43:30 <timeless_mbp> is it being DoS'd?
May 25 11:43:38 <timeless_mbp> oh wow, i got the page!
May 25 11:43:52 <timeless_mbp> it's not quite dead yet
May 25 11:45:06 <timeless_mbp> someone should tell Pauli Kauppinen that "New release available" is a bad news headline
May 25 11:45:13 <timeless_mbp> New release available
May 25 11:45:13 <timeless_mbp> Pauli Kauppinen - 2009-05-14 11:21
May 25 11:45:19 <timeless_mbp> --- new release of *what*? :(
May 25 11:45:31 <timeless_mbp> (and yes, i could _eventually_ figure it out, but it took too long)
May 25 13:13:21 <RST38h> EXTZV! CMPZV! INSV!
May 25 13:15:45 <Paavo> garage seems a bit slow today
May 25 13:16:40 <Stskeeps> RST38h: gone mad? :P
May 25 13:16:50 <zap> there is a burst of rumours about N900 on russian websites. Is this related to something real, or it's just rumours?
May 25 13:17:10 <Stskeeps> zap: http://www.mobilecrunch.com/2009/05/24/exclusive-everything-there-is-to-know-about-nokias-next-tablet/
May 25 13:17:53 <zap> omg, is this a real photo or just a 3D design?
May 25 13:18:08 <jaska> if thats a photo i am jebus
May 25 13:18:12 <Stskeeps> 3d rendering
May 25 13:18:13 <Stskeeps> :P
May 25 13:18:14 <aquatix> that's a 3D design they did themselves
May 25 13:18:21 <Stskeeps> based on alleged photos
May 25 13:18:24 <aquatix> as they couldn't publish the images from the documents
May 25 13:18:25 <zap> the keyboard is awful
May 25 13:18:32 * aquatix misses the dpad
May 25 13:19:03 <Stskeeps> recall that that is probably a rx34
May 25 13:19:04 <jaska> o.O no d-pad?
May 25 13:19:06 <zap> I wonder how one is supposed to play games on it
May 25 13:19:17 <Stskeeps> err
May 25 13:19:18 <Stskeeps> rx71
May 25 13:19:21 <zap> buy a wiimote :
May 25 13:19:28 <jaska> wasd?:P
May 25 13:22:30 <RST38h> Sts: Just invoking the spirit of VAX
May 25 13:22:44 <RST38h> zap: They could not post photos
May 25 13:22:51 <RST38h> zap: Saying that photos may be watermarked
May 25 13:23:14 <RST38h> zap: 3.5" screen instead of 4.3"
May 25 13:23:28 <RST38h> zap: So book reading is also kinda problematic
May 25 13:23:34 <zap> yes, downsize is questionable solution
May 25 13:23:52 <zap> on other hand, I'll be able to throw out my phone at last, and use just one device instead of two
May 25 13:24:15 * aquatix has read books on 2.8" :)
May 25 13:24:22 <RST38h> zap: IF it is a full phone
May 25 13:24:24 <aquatix> zap: yep
May 25 13:24:33 * RST38h read books on E70 but it does not mean a thing
May 25 13:24:39 <zap> and much less problems with finding screen film for it
May 25 13:24:43 <RST38h> heh
May 25 13:25:00 <RST38h> zap: I secretly hope they covered the screen 5800-style
May 25 13:25:11 <aquatix> i love reading books on my n810 though
May 25 13:25:17 <zap> look at N95/96, they aren't
May 25 13:25:40 <zap> to read books you can buy a plastic Frenel lens :)
May 25 13:25:44 <aquatix> RST38h: wel, they say it looks a lot like the n97, which - i think - uses the same protection as the 5800
May 25 13:26:25 <RST38h> aquatix: Not guaranteed given that N97 is N-series
May 25 13:26:28 <aquatix> zap: i read at my sony ericsson m600i; not much text at once on the screen, but it has a jogdial, which is awesome for scrolling/reading
May 25 13:26:33 <aquatix> RST38h: hm
May 25 13:26:51 <RST38h> aquatix: 5800 looks kinda cheap in comparison but once you start using it, it feels way better than fragile N-stuff
May 25 13:27:26 <RST38h> Hehe, FBReader guys will finally have to implement autoscrolling :)))
May 25 13:27:35 <RST38h> Tie it up to the tilt sensor or something
May 25 13:28:39 <aquatix> heh
May 25 13:28:47 * aquatix doesn't really like autoscrolling
May 25 13:28:48 * zap secretly hopes that N900 will have more controls accessible without sliding out the keyboard
May 25 13:28:49 <aquatix> but that's personal
May 25 13:28:55 <aquatix> zap: yeah
May 25 13:29:01 <aquatix> zap: at least some dpad-like thing
May 25 13:29:17 <zap> judging by 3d model, there isn't any :(
May 25 13:29:29 <aquatix> that'd suck majorly
May 25 13:29:40 <aquatix> but the n97 has some dpad-like thing in a corner
May 25 13:30:01 <wazd> news bout 3.5" screen suck
May 25 13:30:39 <Stskeeps> wazd: well if you are doing clever marketing, you release a phone first, then the tablet version
May 25 13:31:05 <Stskeeps> (we do have rx-51 and rx-71)
May 25 13:31:16 <Stskeeps> the phone they talk about sounds like a rx-71
May 25 13:43:11 <wazd> Stskeeps: I still don't think that it would be a phone
May 25 13:43:47 <wazd> Cause why Intel and Nokia would develop linux phone stack if Nokia already have one?)
May 25 13:45:55 <doc|work> wazd: nokia owns maemo, qte and symbian
May 25 13:46:17 <wazd> doc|work: thanks Cap :D
May 25 13:46:33 <doc|work> wazd: sorry, just saying, redundancy doesn't seem to bother them too much
May 25 13:47:51 <wazd> doc|work: well, I think they have just enough stuff to support all of their various hardware
May 25 13:48:24 <wazd> doc|work: Nokia doesnt own Bentley, Manchester United and McDonalds :)
May 25 13:49:06 <doc|work> I think you might have missed my point :)
May 25 13:54:56 <mavhc> I'd assume they'd make s60 their entry level phones, and maemo their new smartphone
May 25 13:55:26 <inz> I hope they killall S60 and linux everything ;)
May 25 13:55:58 <inz> (I'm sure there are full pleothra of 3rd parties that would die because of that, but nevermind them.
May 25 13:56:01 <inz> +)
May 25 13:56:29 <mavhc> you just transition, old entry level phones die, smartphones become entry level, new smartphones appear
May 25 13:56:34 <fiferboy> lbt: ping
May 25 13:56:38 <fiferboy> Hey wazd
May 25 13:57:51 <aquatix> mavhc: no, not new smartphones, multimedia/pocket computers ;)
May 25 13:58:01 <inz> mavhc, but I want S60 dead. now. ;)
May 25 13:58:14 <aquatix> symbian^2 then?
May 25 13:58:15 <mavhc> why?
May 25 13:59:10 <inz> mavhc, because any Symbian code makes my want to cleanse my eyes... ...with sandpaper
May 25 13:59:18 <inz> mavhc, and I don't want to
May 25 14:00:56 <mavhc> ignore it?
May 25 14:08:41 <inz> mavhc, I've coded in symbian "C++" once, it will haunt me for the rest of my life... ;)
May 25 14:11:26 <lbt> fiferboy: pong
May 25 14:11:39 <fiferboy> lbt: How's it going?
May 25 14:11:55 <lbt> not bad... checked in the branch to gitorious
May 25 14:12:05 <lbt> and building locally under qemu
May 25 14:12:54 <fiferboy> I am going to text using Fremantl SDK to see if it looks okay, but I have to start a Qt rebuild
May 25 14:13:14 <fiferboy> That might take a while.  If there are any changes I will send them to you or check them into git.
May 25 14:18:23 <luke-jr> fiferboy: how do you get Qt to build?
May 25 14:19:16 <fiferboy> luke-jr: Check out the source, mv either "debian.diablo" or "debian.fremantle" to "debian" then "dpkg -rfakeroot -nc -b" and wait six days
May 25 14:19:45 <Stskeeps> 4 works too
May 25 14:19:46 <Stskeeps> :P
May 25 14:20:24 <luke-jr> fiferboy: don't want to use Debian/Mer, just want to build Qt w/o running out of RAM :p
May 25 14:20:57 <fiferboy> I'm building in scratchbox using a virtualbox session on an extremely underpowered laptop
May 25 14:21:31 <luke-jr> o
May 25 14:21:35 <luke-jr> cross-compiling
May 25 14:21:36 <fiferboy> I have never waited long enough for it to complete (if it does complete with this setup), but I just need one .so file less than halfway through the build
May 25 14:21:37 <luke-jr> <.<
May 25 14:26:25 <lbt> luke-jr: that's how I do it for Diablo too... you can add -j<n> too if you have multiple cores
May 25 14:26:40 <luke-jr> afaik, the N810 has only one core
May 25 14:27:00 <lbt> you want to build Qt on the tablet
May 25 14:27:15 <luke-jr> yep
May 25 14:27:18 <lbt> sure
May 25 14:27:25 <lbt> make sure you have some swap
May 25 14:27:38 <luke-jr> lbt: 1 GB, but watchdog won't let it swap that much
May 25 14:27:58 <luke-jr> tbh, I have cross-distcc setup, so compiling isn't too big a problem
May 25 14:27:59 <lbt> let us know how it goes ;)
May 25 14:28:03 <luke-jr> it's linking that runs out of RAM
May 25 14:28:17 <lbt> yep...
May 25 14:29:10 <lopz> hola
May 25 14:30:23 <fiferboy> luke-jr: linking seems to run out of memory in my setup, too.  Swaps like crazy but never gets anywhere
May 25 14:30:57 <luke-jr> fiferboy: really? hmm
May 25 14:31:12 <luke-jr> fiferboy: is your linker a cross-linker, or native-built?
May 25 14:31:22 <luke-jr> maybe it's an ARM bug?
May 25 14:31:31 <luke-jr> GCC ARM*
May 25 14:31:34 <fiferboy> luke-jr: I can only assign about 500 MB to my virtualbox session, that is likely why
May 25 14:32:42 <luke-jr> oh crap
May 25 14:32:56 <luke-jr> apparently ld requires 1.3 GB of memory for qt webkit
May 25 14:33:30 <lbt> should be fine on an N810... just what they're designed for ;)
May 25 14:34:35 <fiferboy> luke-jr: :O That would do it!
May 25 14:34:59 <luke-jr> fiferboy: some bug report mentioned it loading *.o before even starting
May 25 14:41:40 * RST38h luuuurves coding for Symbian in C++!
May 25 14:42:05 <RST38h> It is suuuuch a pretty minefield, and it blows up at different spots on each phone too! Variety!
May 25 14:43:25 <RST38h> Besides, once you get this experience, you have basically made yourself employable for foreseeable future =)
May 25 14:43:29 <nomis> Oh, I'd guess that you don't even need Symbian for this  :)
May 25 14:43:42 <nomis> (for the minefield)
May 25 14:43:51 <RST38h> nomis: *I* don't, but your mileage may vary =)
May 25 14:44:03 <Stskeeps> RST38h: so the appeal of maemo is that it is actually saner than symbian? :P
May 25 14:45:05 <RST38h> Sts: Yea, Unix-derived platforms are way saner
May 25 14:46:57 <k-s> eh
May 25 14:46:59 <nomis> ...unless you look at the socket API...  :)
May 25 14:47:08 <RST38h> nomis: It's ok
May 25 14:47:17 <RST38h> nomis: The biggest PITA is audio
May 25 14:47:46 <nomis> RST38h: well, the problem with sockets is, that you suddenly have no documentation if you want to use e.g. netlink.
May 25 14:47:55 <RST38h> Anyone who even expresses a desire to design a new audio framework for Linux has to be immediately hospitalized and given daily aminazin shots
May 25 14:47:56 <nomis> for networking it is kind of OK.
May 25 14:48:16 <RST38h> nomis: Plenty of examples around
May 25 14:48:57 <nomis> RST38h: I know, still having a hard time to figure out all the things you can do with it.
May 25 14:49:02 <fiferboy> Yay Fire Drills.
May 25 14:49:17 <Stskeeps> famous last wors
May 25 14:49:18 <Stskeeps> +d
May 25 14:50:06 <fiferboy> Stskeeps: Nah, it's done already
May 25 14:51:33 <Jaffa> "BeagleBoard and maemo" thread on -developers makes interesting reading.
May 25 14:52:26 <xnt14> c/join #liqbase
May 25 14:52:30 <xnt14> oh opps xD
May 25 14:52:42 <Stskeeps> Jaffa: yeah, it'll definately make the weekend interesting
May 25 14:54:13 <GAN800> Smaller battery and smaller screen . . . urgh
May 25 14:54:32 <Stskeeps> morning GAN800, welcome to hell! :)
May 25 14:54:40 <Stskeeps> also, i think that's a rx-71.
May 25 14:55:21 <xnt14> rofl
May 25 14:55:33 <zakkm> Stskeeps: new n900 news is out?
May 25 14:55:43 <Stskeeps> zakkm: yeah, some leak
May 25 14:55:48 * xnt14 checks maemo.org
May 25 14:55:48 <zakkm> :o
May 25 14:55:50 <GAN800> Stskeeps, I agree.
May 25 14:55:59 <zakkm> Stskeeps: link please
May 25 14:56:04 <Meizirkki> garage.maemo.org down..?
May 25 14:56:10 <Stskeeps> Meizirkki: just very slow
May 25 14:56:17 <Meizirkki> k
May 25 14:56:23 <Stskeeps> zakkm: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=29151 has a lot of discussion
May 25 14:56:52 <zakkm> wow
May 25 14:56:58 <zakkm> july? thats earlier
May 25 14:57:17 <xnt14> ahhh, that sorta looks like a kirf knockoff
May 25 14:57:22 <zakkm> Browser: Firefox 3 with support for Flash 9.4
May 25 14:57:26 <zakkm> no flash 10? :P
May 25 14:57:28 <Stskeeps> xnt14: ignore the rendering
May 25 14:57:35 <xnt14> oh ok :P
May 25 14:57:58 <zakkm> 32GB internal storage, expandable up to 48GB via external memory
May 25 14:58:02 <zakkm> that must cost alot ;p
May 25 14:58:03 <xnt14> same cpu as palm pre? webos port?
May 25 14:58:21 * xnt14 hopes for a better gps
May 25 14:58:23 <zakkm> its the omap3520 isnt it?
May 25 14:58:28 <zakkm> the n900
May 25 14:58:30 <xnt14> yay, 5mp camera
May 25 14:58:47 <xnt14> 32gb storage
May 25 14:58:58 <Jaffa> Stskeeps: RX-71 had more keys, according to the kernel
May 25 14:59:20 <xnt14> well, now theres one more device I HAVE to buy :P
May 25 14:59:39 <Jaffa> GAN800: Yeah, smaller device and smaller screen not good. Will feel very thick next to N810. Keyboard looks a bit naff.
May 25 14:59:47 <xnt14> well, yay, t-mobile!
May 25 14:59:53 <Jaffa> Oh well. TV time. tmo can wait for later.
May 25 14:59:53 <xnt14> but...
May 25 15:00:17 <zakkm> it seems really bad, im sure that "leak" is fake :)
May 25 15:00:31 * xnt14 will get a tmo plan after he gets an iphone...
May 25 15:01:04 * xnt14 wonders why everyone is worrying over the small screen :P
May 25 15:02:39 <zakkm> maemo is small enough in 4.3"
May 25 15:02:55 <zakkm> so now they are doing 3.5" in 800x480? :P
May 25 15:04:42 <GAN800> OMAP3430
May 25 15:04:52 <GAN800> 4.1"
May 25 15:05:14 <Meizirkki> it's gonna be 4.1"?
May 25 15:05:39 <xnt14> it hits engadget: http://www.engadget.com/2009/05/25/nokias-n810-successor-coming-later-this-year-with-3g-and-maemo/
May 25 15:05:56 * xnt14 doesn't mind
May 25 15:07:41 * mgedmin tried browsing the web on his N810 today, and remembered why he never does that
May 25 15:08:06 <zakkm> it sucks, browsing on tablet
May 25 15:08:26 <xnt14> well, it all depends on the site...
May 25 15:08:42 <zakkm> mplayer/ pidgin is really nice in maemo
May 25 15:08:49 <xnt14> although 95% of all sites are crap in microb
May 25 15:08:54 <zakkm> i had no pc at night yesterday, so i used my tablet
May 25 15:08:59 <zakkm> heh dont you use Tear?
May 25 15:09:29 * RST38h browses web on an E70, so N810 does not feel that bad
May 25 15:09:57 <zakkm> e70 has wifi?
May 25 15:10:18 <RST38h> Has wifi, egprs, and 3g
May 25 15:10:25 <xnt14> 0.0
May 25 15:10:27 <xnt14> :P
May 25 15:10:43 <RST38h> http://www.thebestpageintheuniverse.net/c.cgi?u=iphone
May 25 15:11:25 <zakkm> why would you diss the iphone
May 25 15:11:28 <zakkm> its a great project
May 25 15:11:52 <zakkm> product*
May 25 15:12:07 <xnt14> although apple screwed up on the sdk, and the appstore
May 25 15:12:17 <xnt14> other than that its great
May 25 15:12:28 <RST38h> zakkm: fallomorphing as many Apple nuts as possible is a kind of a sport
May 25 15:13:03 <RST38h> zakkm: As in "how many can you enrage with one post"
May 25 15:13:31 <xnt14> and a haptic touch plugin is on cydia
May 25 15:13:39 <zakkm> heh im planning on making ipod apps ;p
May 25 15:14:23 <xnt14> yeah, but objective-c = impossible syntax
May 25 15:14:53 <RST38h> ObjC isn't that bad
May 25 15:16:21 <zakkm> good money potential ;p
May 25 15:16:32 <zakkm> i learned im recently broke
May 25 15:17:01 <xnt14> sadly apple also screwed up with the sdk, mac only
May 25 15:17:16 <zakkm> i only use Mac OSX :P
May 25 15:17:17 <xnt14> brb
May 25 15:17:22 <zakkm> they didnt screw it up?
May 25 15:17:31 <zakkm> its part of Xcode
May 25 15:19:29 <xnt14> xD, I still need to buy a mac, and i don't have a hackint0xsh compatible computer :(
May 25 15:19:46 <EdLin> xnt14: get a mac mini, it's fairly affordable. :-)
May 25 15:20:03 <zakkm> heh
May 25 15:20:09 <zakkm> hackintosh compatible isnt hard ;p
May 25 15:20:21 <EdLin> unless it's an AMD system
May 25 15:20:22 <zakkm> id sell you my dg31pr motherboard for $40 usd?
May 25 15:20:32 <zakkm> 100% support
May 25 15:21:16 <zakkm> if you have a system and try, sometimes it is trial and error, but if your looking to buy, its not hard at all
May 25 15:21:22 <EdLin> I'd sell you my dell mini 9 for $300, it's also hackintoshable, though I'd get a larger SSD if I wanted to run xcode on it. :-)
May 25 15:21:37 <zakkm> wish i had $300 :P
May 25 15:21:40 <xnt14> :)
May 25 15:21:40 <GeneralAntilles> andre__, ping?
May 25 15:21:51 <EdLin> zakkm: so do I, hence the offer.
May 25 15:22:08 <zakkm> id sell you my overclocked 50% to 3.0ghz... hugee ass heatsink , full mac osx support, on it now .. for your dell mini :P
May 25 15:22:09 <xnt14> I wish my parents would let me buy stuff from people from irc X(
May 25 15:22:19 <zakkm> heh
May 25 15:22:29 <xnt14> they are like, only buy from a trusted source
May 25 15:22:34 <EdLin> zakkm: not interested in another desktop.
May 25 15:22:54 <zakkm> xnt14: people would most likely put on ebay, and then link you and you click "buy now"
May 25 15:23:00 <zakkm> so it goes through ebay safely
May 25 15:23:09 <xnt14> although I asked my dad if I can build my own desktop, and he said yes...
May 25 15:23:19 <zakkm> makes sure your the only one that clicks it, by messing with keywords and such
May 25 15:23:35 <zakkm> EdLin: what is your motherboard?
May 25 15:23:38 <xnt14> so, now im in the market to get parts for a destop
May 25 15:23:41 <timeless_mbp_> hey, how do i find out if i have a wiki.maemo.org account? :)
May 25 15:23:58 <EdLin> zakkm: I have a mac mini and a dell mini 9, I have no idea what my motherboard is. ;-)
May 25 15:24:12 <GeneralAntilles> timeless_mbp, Garage.
May 25 15:24:14 <zakkm> dell mini 9 has mac support?
May 25 15:24:16 <xnt14> :P
May 25 15:24:23 <EdLin> zakkm: unofficial of course.
May 25 15:24:28 <zakkm> ohh
May 25 15:24:35 <zakkm> xnt14: whats yours? hehh been reading wrong
May 25 15:24:45 <zakkm> officially..
May 25 15:24:48 <GeneralAntilles> Oops, Rover leak on the lists. . . .
May 25 15:24:54 <xnt14> my main desktop is a dell xps 600, nvidia/dell mb
May 25 15:25:08 <zakkm> xnt14: i was looking for exact motherboard model
May 25 15:25:14 <EdLin> zakkm: the dell mini 9 is the most hackintoshable netbook... Mine is right now running Windows 7 RC for the heck of it though, I'm probably going to hackintosh it again - especially if I want to sell it.
May 25 15:25:33 <xnt14> my server is a dell precision 360, which runs tiger perfectly
May 25 15:25:39 <xnt14> but
May 25 15:25:46 <xnt14> tiger = no iphone sdk
May 25 15:25:49 <zakkm> lol the only thing that makes it the most hackintosh is that it has a nice wifi card
May 25 15:25:58 <zakkm> so run leopard on it? :P
May 25 15:25:58 <xnt14> lol
May 25 15:26:04 <xnt14> I tried
May 25 15:26:11 <zakkm> try harder ;p
May 25 15:26:12 <xnt14> it didn't work
May 25 15:26:33 <EdLin> zakkm: everything's supported, not just the wifi. Only thing that doesn't work now reportedly is MMC support for the SD card slot, which otherwise is supported.
May 25 15:26:36 <xnt14> and I tried 5 different distros on my xps, but none of them would boot
May 25 15:27:06 <zakkm> EdLin: i meant, in all netbooks its just the wifi thats missing unless you swap it... thats the only think that makes the dell mini 9 the best
May 25 15:27:11 <xnt14> iatkos would boot the installer, but after install it would jusk kernel panic
May 25 15:27:19 <zakkm> xnt: boot with a different kernel ;p
May 25 15:27:21 <EdLin> zakkm: yeah, you're probably right.
May 25 15:27:37 * xnt14 googles if a asus eee pc 701 would run osx XD
May 25 15:27:46 <zakkm> yeah it should
May 25 15:27:56 <EdLin> zakkm: I mostly got it because it was a netbook, decent looking, and expandable.
May 25 15:28:07 <EdLin> zakkm: oh yes, and runs Ubuntu well
May 25 15:28:08 <zakkm> wish i could afford one :)
May 25 15:28:15 <zakkm> eww ubuntu
May 25 15:28:19 <zakkm> at least use the newest moblin 2.0
May 25 15:28:29 <EdLin> zakkm: moblin is nice, but no wifi support.
May 25 15:28:34 <xnt14> I already tried that, the only thing I didn't try was efi pc
May 25 15:28:41 <zakkm> EdLin: did you see the new 2.0 beta?
May 25 15:28:47 <zakkm> nice new UI and all
May 25 15:28:53 <zakkm> not crappy xfce, they made their own
May 25 15:29:00 <EdLin> zakkm: I saw it, I was just looking at it yesterday online.
May 25 15:29:11 <zakkm> xnt14: you need the efi bootloader.
May 25 15:29:26 <EdLin> zakkm: I started to download it, but when I  saw no wifi I aborted.
May 25 15:29:32 <zakkm> thats weird
May 25 15:29:34 <zakkm> cant install ?
May 25 15:29:37 * xnt14 's dad has a laptop which is with his uncle right now, which runs 10.5.6 almost flawlessly
May 25 15:29:40 <zakkm> its fedora-based i believe
May 25 15:29:50 <xnt14> sadly thats my dads laptop
May 25 15:29:54 <zakkm> heh
May 25 15:30:03 <zakkm> 701 should run it
May 25 15:30:06 <xnt14> so its win7 rc only :(
May 25 15:30:12 <xnt14> it would?
May 25 15:30:13 <xnt14> :)
May 25 15:30:28 <xnt14> it has a celeron 900
May 25 15:30:32 <zakkm> yeah i know
May 25 15:30:34 <zakkm> i was going to buy one
May 25 15:30:37 <xnt14> I thought it wouldn't work
May 25 15:30:45 <xnt14> xD
May 25 15:30:46 <zakkm> yeahh it does work
May 25 15:30:55 <EdLin> xnt14: the 701 will run it, but not too well I guess since it has such a small screen, OS X likes to have some screen real-estate.
May 25 15:31:16 <zakkm> yeah youd run into resolution/screensize troubles on a 7"
May 25 15:31:20 <xnt14> external screen?
May 25 15:31:28 <zakkm> but support wise, its perfectly fine
May 25 15:31:36 <xnt14> so...
May 25 15:31:46 <xnt14> usb vga card?
May 25 15:31:48 <xnt14> :P
May 25 15:31:55 <zakkm> it doesnt have a builtin one?
May 25 15:32:02 <EdLin> run Linux on it. What kind of Linux hacker are you anyway? ;-)
May 25 15:32:18 <xnt14> it does but when I put ubuntu on it, it wouldn't go above 800x600
May 25 15:32:32 <zakkm> ubuntu sucks :)
May 25 15:32:36 <zakkm> learned that years ago
May 25 15:32:45 <xnt14> :P
May 25 15:32:46 <zakkm> fedora is worse but still
May 25 15:32:49 <xnt14> not that much
May 25 15:32:54 <xnt14> fedora is a real pos
May 25 15:32:57 <EdLin> I love Slackware.
May 25 15:33:04 <EdLin> too bad they dropped GNOME
May 25 15:33:04 <zakkm> i love gentoo :)
May 25 15:33:05 <xnt14> it screwed up my xps's grub,
May 25 15:33:15 <zakkm> theres still dropline gnome? or can compile it
May 25 15:33:17 * xnt14 has gentoo on his ps3
May 25 15:33:24 <zakkm> how well does that run?
May 25 15:33:29 <EdLin> zakkm: compiling GNOME by hand is a real bear.
May 25 15:33:29 <zakkm> friend wanted to try it on his ps3
May 25 15:33:37 <xnt14> pretty good, just no 3d gfx
May 25 15:33:45 <zakkm> full keyboard/mouse support?
May 25 15:33:49 <xnt14> yeah
May 25 15:33:50 <zakkm> internet?
May 25 15:33:59 <xnt14> I had ubuntu on my ps3 before gentto
May 25 15:34:02 <xnt14> *gentoo
May 25 15:34:04 <xnt14> yeah
May 25 15:34:05 <zakkm> does it screw up ps3?
May 25 15:34:07 <xnt14> full internet
May 25 15:34:16 <xnt14> no
May 25 15:34:17 <EdLin> zakkm: linux is officially supported on the PS3.
May 25 15:34:30 <xnt14> fedora screwed up my xps's bl
May 25 15:34:32 <xnt14> *grub
May 25 15:34:35 <fiferboy> lbt: After I clone the qt-maemo git repo, how do I get your fingerscroll branch?
May 25 15:34:36 <xnt14> yeah
May 25 15:34:37 <zakkm> i dont own a ps3 ;p or any console for that matter except a ps1
May 25 15:34:44 <EdLin> I have an xbox 360
May 25 15:34:53 <andre__> GeneralAntilles, pong
May 25 15:34:58 <zakkm> i cant afford anything :p
May 25 15:35:08 <GeneralAntilles> andre__, OK, I've got some stuff ready.
May 25 15:35:25 <nomis> fiferboy: I don't know specifically, but try "git branch -a" and see if there is something that resembles the branch you're looking for.
May 25 15:36:34 <andre__> GAN8001, nice... still busy with some bugmail here... want to send me a patch or how to proceed? can't promise that i will have time later today (appointment) but definitely by tomorrow
May 25 15:36:48 <fiferboy> nomis: Thanks, there is a branch "origin/fingerscroll" but I can't check it out ("is ambiguous")
May 25 15:36:58 <xnt14> zakkm: http://howto.wired.com/wiki/Run_Mac_OS_X_on_an_Eee_PC ?
May 25 15:37:33 <fiferboy> nomis: Oops, because I created a duplicate branch in my local repo
May 25 15:37:45 <GAN8001> andre__, I can send a patch.
May 25 15:37:49 <nomis> fiferboy: try git checkout -b my-fingerscroll-branch origin/fingerscroll
May 25 15:37:56 <GAN8001> andre__, it's largely guesswork since I can't test it.
May 25 15:38:07 <zakkm> xnt14: thats really old.
May 25 15:38:14 <xnt14> oh xD
May 25 15:38:16 <lbt> fiferboy: git checkout fingerscroll
May 25 15:38:45 <zakkm> you know how to make a bootable usb drive?
May 25 15:38:53 <lbt> unetbootin
May 25 15:38:58 <fiferboy> nomis: Thanks, that worked!
May 25 15:39:20 <zakkm> xnt14: that follows a real mac disc.
May 25 15:39:21 <fiferboy> lbt: Whenever I did that it created a new branch, but didn't have the changes of your branch
May 25 15:39:31 <andre__> GAN8001, send me mail
May 25 15:39:54 <lbt> what I think you just did is create a new branch based on the origin branch
May 25 15:40:02 <lbt> did you do a git clone?
May 25 15:40:31 <fiferboy> lbt: Yes.  I really don't understand git (good thing I didn't have anything to do with the maemo git branch!)
May 25 15:40:48 <fiferboy> lbt: I did a git clone based on the URI on the qt-maemo page
May 25 15:41:16 <fiferboy> lbt: git clone git://gitorious.org/+qt-maemo-developers/qt/qt-maemo.git
May 25 15:41:31 <lbt> when?
May 25 15:41:39 <lbt> before I created my branch?
May 25 15:41:51 <fiferboy> lbt: About 30 minutes ago.
May 25 15:41:52 <GeneralAntilles> andre__, done.
May 25 15:41:57 <fiferboy> Your branch was there.
May 25 15:41:57 <lbt> ah :)
May 25 15:42:06 <fiferboy> Wasn't it?
May 25 15:42:10 <lbt> yes
May 25 15:42:10 <andre__> thanks
May 25 15:42:27 <GeneralAntilles> dneary, geneven doesn't remember the first election.
May 25 15:42:52 <fiferboy> lbt: But when I run git branch -a it shows me:
May 25 15:42:54 <dneary> GeneralAntilles: Ah - explains things
May 25 15:42:57 <fiferboy>   master
May 25 15:42:57 <fiferboy>   origin/4.5
May 25 15:42:57 <fiferboy>   origin/HEAD
May 25 15:42:57 <fiferboy>   origin/fingerscroll
May 25 15:42:57 <fiferboy>   origin/master
May 25 15:43:10 <GeneralAntilles> dneary, really, he generally doesn't understand much. ;)
May 25 15:43:17 <nomis> fiferboy: -a also shows the remote branches.
May 25 15:43:42 <GeneralAntilles> There's still the whole Maemo/maemo.org confusion.
May 25 15:44:00 <GeneralAntilles> A lot of these people seem to think that itT has been absorbed by Nokia.
May 25 15:44:12 <fiferboy> nomis: What I don't unserstand is why git checkout fingerscroll didn't work as I expected
May 25 15:44:39 <lbt> it really should have
May 25 15:44:58 <GeneralAntilles> I like how Kate's head seems to show up in a lot of the Maemo-related Engadget posts.
May 25 15:45:01 <nomis> uh, is the "origin/" supposed to be optional?
May 25 15:45:10 <dneary> GeneralAntilles: Well, you know my feelings on that
May 25 15:45:23 <dneary> If there's confusion, it's bacuse the whole thing isn't clear
May 25 15:45:28 <GeneralAntilles> dneary, different issue. Different understandings.
May 25 15:45:39 <GeneralAntilles> Their view basically amounts to conspiracy theory.
May 25 15:45:48 <xnt14> wait, how do I uninstall scratchbox?
May 25 15:46:07 <dneary> Who's "their"?
May 25 15:46:26 <GeneralAntilles> dneary, most of the people in that "Open Letter" thread.
May 25 15:46:26 <fiferboy> lbt: I notice Antonio hasn't put the debian directories in there yet.
May 25 15:47:05 <lbt> I hadn't ;)
May 25 15:47:31 <fiferboy> lbt: In fact, none of the maemo-releated changes have been commited yet, other than yours.
May 25 15:47:33 <dneary> GeneralAntilles: There's a definite need for more diplomacy when dealing with a group that are suspicious of Nokia to begin with and pretty cynical
May 25 15:47:49 <GeneralAntilles> dneary, you haven't been reading enough Talk.
May 25 15:47:53 <lbt> yes, he's working on setting them up as branches
May 25 15:47:59 <fiferboy> That was a waste of time, I can't build from git yet.  Oh well.
May 25 15:48:01 <dneary> GeneralAntilles: I think I said that :)
May 25 15:48:06 <fiferboy> Back to SVN for the moment
May 25 15:48:06 <GeneralAntilles> It starts there, but then they start flinging personal attacks whenever they get the chance.
May 25 15:48:15 <GeneralAntilles> dneary, well, my point is, there's a lot of history here.
May 25 15:48:40 <Stskeeps> GeneralAntilles: 90% of the opinions are fairly sane though in that thread.. it's time to back off a bit for all involved :P
May 25 15:48:41 <dneary> Seems like there definitely is a "them & us" then
May 25 15:49:04 <GeneralAntilles> Stskeeps, sane, thinly veiled personal attacks.
May 25 15:49:46 <GeneralAntilles> Stskeeps, anyway, I'm not involving myself.
May 25 15:49:50 <Stskeeps> k
May 25 15:51:43 <thux> thinly veiled too fine words for bad english like me :p
May 25 15:52:27 <GeneralAntilles> thux, lightly disguised.
May 25 15:52:54 <thux> ah
May 25 15:54:44 * Stskeeps watches mer try to boot on his freerunner
May 25 15:57:06 * lbt watches Ubuntu fail to login on his laptop
May 25 15:58:30 <Stskeeps> bizarre.
May 25 16:01:01 * GeneralAntilles is burnt out.
May 25 16:01:38 * lcuk sandblasted
May 25 16:01:41 <lcuk> is ^
May 25 16:03:03 <z4chh> automake/autoconfig avaliable for the tablets?
May 25 16:36:53 <lcuk> guys,   scratchbox - if i have installed scratchbox and the fremantle sdk into it, do i have to reinstall everything including scratchbox to do some dev on diablo
May 25 16:37:01 <lcuk> or can i just add the diablo devkit into it
May 25 16:37:23 <Stskeeps> merphone: http://bsd.tspre.org/~stskeeps/100_3187.JPG ;p
May 25 16:37:40 <lcuk> (H) thats hot
May 25 16:38:05 <GAN8001> We need to buy Stskeeps a real camera.
May 25 16:38:18 <Stskeeps> it was just shaking :P
May 25 16:38:21 <Stskeeps> from the excitement
May 25 16:41:08 <xnt14> awesome mer phone :)
May 25 16:41:27 <xnt14> but I agree new camera
May 25 16:41:41 <xnt14> :P
May 25 16:42:04 <xnt14> and...
May 25 16:42:14 * xnt14 needs a new hdd, stupid server...
May 25 16:42:21 <timeless_mbp> GAN8001: ping
May 25 16:47:11 <timeless_mbp> Stskeeps: ping
May 25 16:57:33 <Stskeeps> timeless_mbp: pong
May 25 17:06:39 <timeless_mbp> sorry, my ping timed out :)
May 25 17:06:46 <timeless_mbp> i was hunting for a pretty picture
May 25 17:12:41 <GAN8001> timeless_mbp, pong?
May 25 17:21:13 * xnt14 installs gentoo
May 25 17:47:34 <slonopotamus> muahaha
May 25 17:47:50 <slonopotamus> got segfault in close() :D
May 25 17:48:43 <Stskeeps> evening qwerty12_N800, howøw is it going?
May 25 17:48:49 <Stskeeps> -ow
May 25 17:49:29 <qwerty12_N800> Stskeeps, hi, all good. Got a week off. :)
May 25 17:53:20 <RST38h> moo qwerty
May 25 17:53:30 <Stskeeps> qwerty12_N800: hehe, much needed. exams ahead or?
May 25 17:53:39 <qwerty12_N800> hi RST38h
May 25 17:53:48 <qwerty12_N800> Stskeeps, yep
May 25 17:54:18 <Stskeeps> qwerty12_N800: i have a nasty nasty linear algebra exam coming up - and the copenhagen weekend :P
May 25 17:55:04 <qwerty12_N800> Stskeeps, hehe, which one is the most challenging? :P
May 25 17:55:19 <Stskeeps> qwerty12_N800: one can totally fuck up my life, .. i guess the second one can too? ;)
May 25 17:56:45 <qwerty12_N800> Stskeeps, hehe
May 25 17:58:38 <Stskeeps> the weird things you have to do for a thesis
May 25 17:58:49 <Stskeeps> right now i'm watching videos of some woman doing exersises..
May 25 18:00:30 <Corsac> Stskeeps: you call it that way?
May 25 18:00:44 <qwerty12_N800> I think that is a trait shared by many (men)...
May 25 18:00:55 <Stskeeps> Corsac: it's not porn nor is it very interesting to watch :P
May 25 18:01:05 <florian> re
May 25 18:01:22 <kfx> I should get a degree in watching women in exercise video
May 25 18:02:21 <Stskeeps> my specialization will be in pervasive healthcare, so
May 25 18:05:06 <oDuda> hello ! i wanna remove gizmo icon from maemo menu... somebody?
May 25 18:06:00 <qwerty12_N800> as root: rm /usr/share/applications/hildon/gizmo-project.desktop
May 25 18:08:33 <RST38h> all right, so, what's cooking?
May 25 18:09:08 <Stskeeps> Peter@Marketing responded in N900 specs
May 25 18:10:05 * lcuk Stskeeps link
May 25 18:10:09 <lcuk> -me
May 25 18:10:21 <Stskeeps> http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=29151&page=13
May 25 18:11:41 <oDuda> qwerty12_N800 thank you ! too much !
May 25 18:12:03 <oDuda> qwerty12_N800 rooth is needed, so ?
May 25 18:12:18 <oDuda> said rootsh
May 25 18:12:22 <RST38h> Sts: Alas, his answer does not take into account fbreader users running it full screen
May 25 18:13:00 <qwerty12_N800> oDuda, yep, whatever is your favourite way of becoming root :)
May 25 18:13:01 <Stskeeps> RST38h: yeah, i thught the exact same thing
May 25 18:13:07 <Stskeeps> +o
May 25 18:13:19 <Stskeeps> qwerty12_N800: docpurge with your change works perfectly btw, much appreciated.
May 25 18:13:34 <qwerty12_N800> oh, cool :)
May 25 18:13:55 <Stskeeps> goshawk made new packaging for it as there were license doubts of the old one
May 25 18:14:09 <Stskeeps> (and it used some non-debhelper thing)
May 25 18:15:41 <oDuda> qwerty12_N800 one more: is a way to gain root withouth any installing ?
May 25 18:15:50 <qwerty12_N800> Stskeeps, did you go for the dd method, or decide to use 'touch', out of curiosity?
May 25 18:16:14 <qwerty12_N800> oDuda, by enabling rd-mode but you don't wanna go there...
May 25 18:16:52 <oDuda> qwerty12_N800 thank you ! :-)
May 25 18:16:53 <RST38h> Anyone knows if FBreader author is on IRC?
May 25 18:17:12 <oDuda> rd mode is by flasher ?
May 25 18:17:14 <GAN8001> qwerty12_N800, fuck you. :P
May 25 18:17:38 <qwerty12_N800> ~seen MishaS
May 25 18:17:40 <infobot> mishas <n=MishaS@a91-154-119-97.elisa-laajakaista.fi> was last seen on IRC in channel #maemo, 247d 9h 7m 38s ago, saying: 't_s_o, it seems to have minor severity and low priority... i wouldn't have high hopes...'.
May 25 18:17:45 <qwerty12_N800> oDuda, yes...
May 25 18:17:52 <oDuda> ty
May 25 18:18:01 <qwerty12_N800> GAN8001, muhahaha, hello to you too :p
May 25 18:18:24 <Stskeeps> qwerty12_N800: i used whatever you pasted on that post in qole's thread
May 25 18:19:02 <RST38h> qwerty: Ehhh
May 25 18:20:03 <qwerty12_N800> RST38h, it may be faster dropping an e-mail :>
May 25 18:20:18 <RST38h> too early for that yet
May 25 18:20:31 * RST38h has got a few ideas on how to deal with the smaller screen in n900
May 25 18:20:55 <Stskeeps> tv out? ;p
May 25 18:21:10 <qwerty12_N800> x11vnc?
May 25 18:21:15 <Stskeeps> miniprojector?
May 25 18:21:25 <qwerty12_N800> voodoo? cursing nokia?
May 25 18:21:47 <Stskeeps> buying a smartq7? :P
May 25 18:22:23 <RST38h> Sts: No, a little zoom tied to the touch spot
May 25 18:22:45 <RST38h> Sts: i.e. you touch the screen and it shows a zoom of what you have just touched right above your finger
May 25 18:22:48 <Stskeeps> ah
May 25 18:23:04 <RST38h> Sts: And, when you press at the top/bottom of the screen, it will slowly scroll
May 25 18:23:14 <RST38h> while maintaining zoom of course
May 25 18:23:59 <GAN8001> qwerty12_N800, where did you crawl off to?
May 25 18:25:24 <GAN8001> Peter's explanation is idiotic.
May 25 18:25:30 <GAN8001> They really don't get their users or soething.
May 25 18:25:41 <RST38h> I am surprised he gave an explanation at all
May 25 18:25:42 <qwerty12_N800> GAN800, had (and still do have) exams but I've got this week off. Plus, I was having fun making  my Wii run homebrew (amongst other things, *cough*) :P
May 25 18:26:31 <GAN8001> I find it hilarious that they're trying to analyze my post.
May 25 18:26:43 <GAN8001> I have access to nothing more interesting than what they have.
May 25 18:27:33 <Stskeeps> on the other hand
May 25 18:27:56 <Stskeeps> the people coming out of the woodwork does confirm this was a real leak, even though most of these things were already known :P
May 25 18:28:00 <qwerty12_N800> GAN8001, I thought, you being a maemo.org council member, had access to all of Nokia's workings? </sarcasm> :p
May 25 18:28:31 <GAN8001> qwerty12_N800, well, apparently, I'm evil now.
May 25 18:28:45 <Stskeeps> "now"? :P
May 25 18:28:59 <Stskeeps> ;)
May 25 18:29:10 <GAN8001> and it's reasonable to masquerade an "Open Letter" thread as a "let's attack GA" thread.
May 25 18:29:24 <qwerty12_N800> :(
May 25 18:29:50 <GAN8001> I need to block Talk with a proxy or something
May 25 18:30:17 <lcuk> that never works
May 25 18:30:29 <GAN8001> qwerty12_N800, you out of school yet?
May 25 18:30:34 <Stskeeps> i tried that with slashdot
May 25 18:30:36 <lcuk> get one of the moderators to REALLY block you
May 25 18:30:37 <Stskeeps> failed miserably
May 25 18:30:50 <lcuk> heh sts ditto
May 25 18:30:55 <lcuk> timesink
May 25 18:31:31 <RST38h> GAN: Just let 'em be
May 25 18:31:34 <GAN8001> Stskeeps, this damn insanity better blow over soon or I'm just going to have to walk out completely.
May 25 18:31:36 <RST38h> Nobody is after you
May 25 18:31:52 <GAN8001> Just aint worth it.
May 25 18:32:06 <RST38h> It is just that the transfer to talk.maemo.org has not been handled properly
May 25 18:32:13 <Stskeeps> GAN8001: actually i read it as a message to several personalities, but that's how it is
May 25 18:32:22 <qwerty12_N800> GAN8001, for all practical purposes, yes. Just got to go back for exams.
May 25 18:33:42 <Stskeeps> GAN8001: because it's been attack-counterattack-countercounterattack etc in some of the threads and that's just noise, from both "sides"
May 25 18:33:56 <Stskeeps> so it's more of a call to calm the fuck down :P
May 25 18:34:43 <GAN800> Stskeeps, there's a non-public history to Texrat's blow-up.
May 25 18:35:13 <Stskeeps> probably, but i honestly think it's time to get back to business :P
May 25 18:37:38 <GAN800> Piece of shit Modest
May 25 18:37:51 <GAN800> Who the fuck came up with the save to drafts dialog
May 25 18:37:52 <oDuda> qwerty_N800 - can you translate this "apt-get remove skype-installer" to gizmo please ?
May 25 18:38:04 <GAN800> That UI designer needs bamboo under his nails.
May 25 18:38:04 <Stskeeps> i personally haven't been able to see any community work through all the noise lately so i'm just looking forward to getting good community info again :P
May 25 18:39:13 <Stskeeps> right, tea
May 25 18:39:26 <kfx> man, if maemo had an sdk more like mer's my life would be way easier
May 25 18:39:45 <Stskeeps> kfx: me throwing a massive fit over scratchbox is part reason why mer exists
May 25 18:40:17 <qwerty12_N800> oDuda, 'dpkg -S /usr/share/applications/hildon/gizmo-project.desktop' says: gizmo-installer but, thanks to osso-software-version, you don't want to remove it... dpkg -L gizmo-installer if neeeded and delete the files manually
May 25 18:40:42 <qwerty12_N800> s/neeeded/needed/
May 25 18:40:42 <infobot> qwerty12_N800 meant: oDuda, 'dpkg -S /usr/share/applications/hildon/gizmo-project.desktop' says: gizmo-installer but, thanks to osso-software-version, you don't want to remove it... dpkg -L gizmo-installer if needed and delete the files manually
May 25 18:40:47 <kfx> scratchbox is like a well-researched, carefully-planned, cunningly-crafted set of tools designed to make easier the difficult task of interefering with everything I try to do
May 25 18:41:41 <Stskeeps> kfx++
May 25 18:41:56 <lcuk> lol kfx
May 25 18:42:06 <kfx> it's quite comprehensive
May 25 18:42:21 <oDuda> qwerty_N800 ty
May 25 18:42:30 <kfx> if I somehow stumble into accidentally making something work right scratchbox promptly crashes in a last-ditch effort to confound me
May 25 18:43:41 <lcuk> i have to say, it does work normally on the rare occasions i tried it - but then again that was for small amounts of simple
May 25 18:44:31 <qwerty12_N800> My biggest scratchbox annoyance is its fuck up of autotools. I've ended up passing extra libs as ldflags all because scratchbox bolloxes up an autoreconf
May 25 18:45:16 <lcuk> its not even practical to do a vmk of diablo+sdk libraries is it
May 25 18:45:41 <lcuk> i know mer is designed and can work like that already
May 25 18:46:23 <lcuk> mmmm
May 25 18:46:29 <lcuk> thats a great tagline
May 25 18:46:50 <GAN8001> qwerty12_N800, by the way, we kind of assume you left for good. :P
May 25 18:46:52 <lcuk> "liqbase :: northern powered"
May 25 18:47:38 <Stskeeps> yeah, we divided your developer rebate rx-51's amongst us
May 25 18:47:38 <Stskeeps> :P
May 25 18:47:52 <qwerty12_N800> GAN8001, qwerties don't die, we multiply! (your keyboard is the proof :p)
May 25 18:48:12 * lcuk thinks qwertys rebate should be subsidised by community kitty as well
May 25 18:48:15 <qwerty12_N800> Meh, I'll hold out for the -71. the rx-51 is a joke
May 25 18:48:33 <GAN800> we were talking about taking up a collection to get you a device so you'd come back but lardman blew it on booze and hookers.
May 25 18:48:43 <lcuk> and bacon
May 25 18:49:18 <Stskeeps> microsd is too friggen small.
May 25 18:49:26 <lcuk> fingernail sized
May 25 18:49:31 * lcuk takes his off and shows you
May 25 18:50:00 <lcuk> the side stitching has healed more or less now!
May 25 18:50:12 * RST38h cackles at the thought that RX-71 may well end up being a standard flip-cover cell phone
May 25 18:52:21 * Stskeeps curses over openmoko casing
May 25 18:52:25 <GAN800> RST38h, there's always Pandora and Mer I guess.
May 25 18:52:41 <RST38h> GAN: Pandora isn't.
May 25 18:52:56 <RST38h> GAN: SmartQ 7 looks like an interesting idea though
May 25 18:53:05 <lcuk> Stskeeps, are the accel units accessible in the moko
May 25 18:53:07 <Stskeeps> yeah
May 25 18:53:10 <Stskeeps> they're excellent
May 25 18:53:13 <Stskeeps> better than the nokia ones
May 25 18:53:29 <lcuk> how can you tell?
May 25 18:53:33 <Stskeeps> specs
May 25 18:53:44 <Stskeeps> 35hz nokia ones, 100 or 400hz openmoko ones
May 25 18:53:46 <lcuk> are they accessible using the same api
May 25 18:53:52 <lcuk> ahh does that matter?
May 25 18:53:59 <Stskeeps> hz = amount of samples per second
May 25 18:54:04 <lcuk> yeah i know that lol
May 25 18:54:14 <lcuk> but if you only show x fps what does it really matter?
May 25 18:54:42 <lcuk> its like the difference between a normal mouse and a super gaming high res mouse
May 25 18:54:50 <lcuk> both will get the pointer around the screen
May 25 18:55:06 <lcuk> and you have to be an mouseophile to notice the difference
May 25 18:55:15 <mgedmin> hm
May 25 18:55:18 * lcuk is used to compromise
May 25 18:55:30 <mgedmin> actually, the thing with mice, you'll notice when you reach the end of the mouse pad, I think
May 25 18:55:42 <lcuk> mgedmin, not the same thing really
May 25 18:55:51 <lcuk> super gaming mice have extreme silly dpi
May 25 18:55:58 <lcuk> and transmission speeds beyond anything needed
May 25 18:56:00 <mgedmin> which is different from hz :)
May 25 18:56:05 <mgedmin> the dpi thing is noticeable
May 25 18:56:09 <lcuk> sampling frequency
May 25 18:56:33 * lcuk thinks mgedmin is a mousophile
May 25 18:56:36 <lcuk> :P
May 25 18:57:00 <mgedmin> observe this traditional trackpoint, how smooth the motion, how close to the home row, how red the cap
May 25 18:57:33 <lcuk> heh
May 25 18:57:42 <kfx> mmmm trackpoints
May 25 18:58:00 <lcuk> i work at about 1/10 speed using a computer nipple
May 25 18:58:11 <kfx> I'm so conflicted about netbooks.  Sony makes one with a trackpoint!  But then I'd be giving money to Sony!  augh
May 25 18:58:37 <lcuk> i just got a 12" lenovo
May 25 18:58:48 <lcuk> smaller than normal but not cut down
May 25 18:59:08 <Corsac> the s12?
May 25 18:59:15 <Corsac> or a real thinkpad?
May 25 18:59:21 <lcuk> x41 touch
May 25 18:59:21 <GAN800> 'thanks to the Mer team and qole and PB' Ehehe
May 25 18:59:26 <Corsac> tablet :)
May 25 18:59:47 <Stskeeps> GAN800: mm? :P
May 25 18:59:51 <kfx> I'm leaning toward getting one of the last x61s that has 1400x1050
May 25 18:59:51 <lcuk> yeah
May 25 19:00:06 <Corsac> kfx: no x61s has 1400x1050
May 25 19:00:10 <Corsac> kfx: only x61t
May 25 19:00:12 <lcuk> the higher res would be nice
May 25 19:00:18 <lcuk> but for what i need its ok
May 25 19:00:28 <kfx> sorry, the s was a pluralization sigil there :)
May 25 19:00:43 <GAN800> Stskeeps, you got lumped in. :p
May 25 19:00:45 <Corsac> no x61 has 1400x1050 either :)
May 25 19:00:50 <Corsac> you'll have to take a tablet
May 25 19:00:56 <kfx> works for me
May 25 19:01:01 <Stskeeps> GAN800: in what now
May 25 19:01:04 <kfx> as long as it's a ~12" screen
May 25 19:01:33 <GAN800> http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=289948&postcount=136
May 25 19:02:32 <Corsac> if you don't hate widescreen as much as me, you may want to look at x200s, 1440×900
May 25 19:03:20 <kfx> I don't mind widescreen, but I can get the older model way cheaper
May 25 19:05:03 <Corsac> yeah but x200s might be cheaper than a tablet (not sure about second hand though)
May 25 19:06:39 <Stskeeps> GAN800: yeah.. my usual mantra "there's no Mer without Maemo."
May 25 19:14:17 <CutMeOwnThroat> is there a simple way to compile debian packages for maemo, then?
May 25 19:17:02 <minra> bundyo,  gemrb 0.4.0 just released
May 25 19:17:05 <lbt> CutMeOwnThroat: you mean port from Debian to Maemo?
May 25 19:18:24 <xnt14> im back
May 25 19:19:14 * lcuk lobs a custard pie @ xnt14
May 25 19:19:22 * xnt14 dodges
May 25 19:19:32 <xnt14> ~attack lcuk
May 25 19:19:33 * infobot grabs a pen, screams like she's possessed, and begins chasing lcuk
May 25 19:19:38 <xnt14> xD
May 25 19:20:00 <xnt14> hold on a sec
May 25 19:20:03 <lcuk> i need an anti attack attacking irc bot of my own!
May 25 19:20:14 <lcuk> bacon
May 25 19:20:16 <lcuk> :D
May 25 19:20:27 <lbt> lcuk: just don't get bman started too... they had a hell of a skirmish the other night....
May 25 19:20:34 <lcuk> lol lbt
May 25 19:20:35 <kfx> is there a matching ~retreat command
May 25 19:20:44 <lcuk> the liqirc bots respond to bacon :$
May 25 19:20:52 <lcuk> they get kicked out of the chan if they start
May 25 19:21:12 <xnt14> well
May 25 19:21:18 <lcuk> kfx, it doesnt understand french :O
May 25 19:21:26 <xnt14> $mayhem
May 25 19:21:32 * xntbot causes mayhem
May 25 19:22:01 <lcuk> hahah
May 25 19:22:21 <xnt14> $remove(from="userdb",value="lcuk")
May 25 19:22:24 <xntbot> done
May 25 19:22:28 <xnt14> :)
May 25 19:22:41 <xnt14> now lcuk can't use my bot against me
May 25 19:23:08 <lbt> $remove(from="userdb",value="xnt14")
May 25 19:23:12 <qwerty12_N800> oh, I thought that was its 'people to be stalked' list
May 25 19:23:34 <xntbot> lcuk, sorry, my owner has blocked you
May 25 19:23:35 <lcuk> xnt14, i wrote my bot originally to do sketching over irc
May 25 19:23:50 <xnt14> oh so, I can
May 25 19:23:57 <xnt14> $draw box
May 25 19:24:04 <lcuk> it got kicked for flooding
May 25 19:24:15 * xntbot draws a box on liqbase's sketch function
May 25 19:24:40 <xnt14> yeah
May 25 19:24:45 <xnt14> so make it one way
May 25 19:24:59 <lcuk> you mean in a pm
May 25 19:25:07 <xnt14> maybe
May 25 19:25:23 <lcuk> i like what you did there tho
May 25 19:25:37 <xnt14> just make is so you type "%draw box 0,0" and it would draw a box
May 25 19:25:52 <xnt14> and maybe give feedback
May 25 19:25:59 <lcuk> yeah - the graphics library is simple enough to handle the syntax
May 25 19:26:00 <xnt14> hold on a second
May 25 19:26:02 <lcuk> ive got a parser somewhere
May 25 19:26:42 <xnt14> $add(draw, from="/dv/xntbot/draw.bp")
May 25 19:27:15 <lcuk> you know the search box in liqbase
May 25 19:27:20 <xnt14> yeah
May 25 19:27:24 <lcuk> i was thinking of allowing command syntax in there too
May 25 19:27:54 <xnt14> so...
May 25 19:27:57 <xnt14> like this
May 25 19:28:08 <xnt14> $simulate(draw.bp);
May 25 19:28:09 <lcuk> just like the console :)
May 25 19:28:21 <lcuk> i dont see anything you do btw
May 25 19:28:31 <xnt14> $draw circle 15,15
May 25 19:28:34 <lcuk> or are those just examples
May 25 19:28:39 <xnt14> its just a simulation
May 25 19:28:53 <xntbot> Circle Drawn
May 25 19:28:59 <lcuk> lotta lag
May 25 19:29:00 <lcuk> :P
May 25 19:29:03 <xnt14> :P
May 25 19:29:25 <xnt14> wait was that public?
May 25 19:29:35 * lardman pours a beer
May 25 19:29:37 <lcuk> you should know lol
May 25 19:29:44 <lcuk> hey lardman \o
May 25 19:29:49 <lardman> hi lcuk
May 25 19:29:57 <xnt14> ...
May 25 19:30:00 <xnt14> kvm
May 25 19:30:03 <xnt14> *nvm
May 25 19:30:11 * xnt14 watches
May 25 19:30:15 <qwerty12_N800> ello lardman
May 25 19:30:51 <lardman> hey qwerty12_N800
May 25 19:30:58 <lardman> did I see you say you have a week off?
May 25 19:31:23 <qwerty12_N800> yep, your eyes do not trick you ;)
May 25 19:31:36 <lardman> but you're a student, so what's new?! ;)
May 25 19:32:35 * lardman browses the n900 revelaed thread on Talk once again, in the vague hope that someone's discovered the screen size was reported wrongly
May 25 19:34:25 * xnt14 is bored (again...)
May 25 19:34:33 <xnt14> $unbored
May 25 19:34:44 <xntbot> get unbored
May 25 19:34:47 <xnt14> :P
May 25 19:34:51 <xnt14> that was random
May 25 19:34:52 <lardman> $unboard=TRUE
May 25 19:35:02 <xnt14> board? xD
May 25 19:35:16 <xnt14> im board xD
May 25 19:35:45 <lardman> I'm getting married in a few days, no time for boredom in amongst the stuff to be done! ;)
May 25 19:35:53 <xnt14> yeah...
May 25 19:36:03 <xnt14> no time for boredom :P
May 25 19:36:19 <lardman> yep, I'm looking forward to some next week :)
May 25 19:36:33 <xnt14> :)
May 25 19:37:16 <lcuk> takin your tablet on honeymoon?
May 25 19:37:30 <lardman> of course
May 25 19:37:32 <lardman> !
May 25 19:37:34 <lcuk> hahaha
May 25 19:37:54 <lcuk> tracy would ban mine
May 25 19:38:03 <rm_you> lol
May 25 19:38:07 <GAN800> lardman, still another model.
May 25 19:38:16 <lardman> I'll probably only use it to look at photos mind you
May 25 19:38:26 <GAN800> But I can't believe how fucking thick and retarded Nokia is.
May 25 19:38:29 <lardman> GAN800: the "n900" stuff? Fingers crossed then
May 25 19:38:55 <GAN800> 'How can we best fuck this up?' must be the question they asl themselves every day
May 25 19:39:17 <GAN800> 'How can we ruin your day today?'
May 25 19:39:23 <rm_you> GAN800: ?
May 25 19:39:30 <lardman> probably a Boolean operation along the lines of: design = !(community design ideas)
May 25 19:39:51 <rm_you> something else after the leak? or just referring to that
May 25 19:39:56 <GAN800> design == whatever the worst ideas we can come up with are
May 25 19:39:59 <lcuk> actually community design has shown itself to be not universally great
May 25 19:40:04 * rm_you just woke up
May 25 19:40:22 <lardman> rm_you: there was supposed to be an RX-51 and a -71 iirc from the kernel patch
May 25 19:41:16 <mavhc> community can't design, it can only evolve
May 25 19:41:41 <rm_you> ... and why is that making GA rant? :P
May 25 19:41:50 <lardman> ok so not designs, but in terms of wishes, I think most power users would like a screen as large (and I'd like one a little larger in fact)
May 25 19:41:51 <minra> if true, looks great - 32gB internal
May 25 19:41:57 <mavhc> if they're going to announce an actual tablet they'd better do it quickly now
May 25 19:42:09 <mavhc> 256MB ram still seems small to me
May 25 19:42:11 <minra> why mavhc
May 25 19:42:20 <mavhc> because everyone's freaking out
May 25 19:42:21 <minra> whats the rush
May 25 19:42:24 <Stskeeps> mavhc: 256mb + swap is more than enough for maemo like things
May 25 19:42:36 <rm_you> i was hoping they'd do it at the hackfest next weekend
May 25 19:42:43 <Stskeeps> heck, mer is bloated in comparison to maemo, and it actually fits nicely in 100mb :P
May 25 19:42:44 <minra> awxd make a better dpad anyway
May 25 19:43:20 <GAN800> rm_you, Talk has put me in a bad fucking mood.
May 25 19:43:33 <rm_you> ah
May 25 19:43:36 <mavhc> the recent announcement of this intel/nokia phone stack is odd, considering the timing
May 25 19:43:43 <minra> i think it is smart to make smaller
May 25 19:43:55 <GAN800> rm_you, read the open letter insanity for funtimes.
May 25 19:43:59 <minra> less bezel would have been nice
May 25 19:44:06 <rm_you> GAN800: linky?
May 25 19:44:09 <GAN800> mavhc, 512MB would impact battery life.
May 25 19:44:13 <mavhc> the n810 is too big to hold by your ear anyway
May 25 19:44:27 <GAN800> http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=289967
May 25 19:44:30 <lardman> hmm, confirmation from Mara too
May 25 19:44:39 * lardman reads the Talk thread backlog
May 25 19:45:02 <Jaffa> lardman: ditto
May 25 19:45:08 <lcuk> http://johndyer.name/lab/pv3d/sizer/
May 25 19:45:22 <lcuk> add dimensions to this from ages ago someone did for n810 and iphone and stuff
May 25 19:45:27 <minra> n810 just doesnt have enough dpi :)
May 25 19:45:38 <lardman> It's not making me overly happy mind you, but at least I can head off on honeymoon not worrying that I'll miss the release of something exciting
May 25 19:45:39 <lcuk> (unboxing thread for n810!)
May 25 19:46:09 <lardman> I do need a new phone though....
May 25 19:46:19 <xnt14> yeah
May 25 19:46:22 <xnt14> so do I
May 25 19:46:22 <Jaffa> Bit bulky for a primary phone
May 25 19:46:27 <Jaffa> (for me, anyway)
May 25 19:46:32 <xnt14> stuck with a blackberry
May 25 19:46:49 <lardman> I need to draw it out on paper and see how big, how does it compare to an iPhone?
May 25 19:47:03 <lcuk> lardman, as i say
May 25 19:47:04 <lcuk> http://johndyer.name/lab/pv3d/sizer/
May 25 19:47:06 <lcuk> add to that
May 25 19:47:08 <lcuk> and see
May 25 19:47:14 <lardman> lcuk: sorry, missed that line
May 25 19:47:17 <GAN800> iPhone is 3.5" LCD
May 25 19:47:28 <CutMeOwnThroat> lbt, yes .. although I'd not call it porting if it's already compiled for the same architecture
May 25 19:47:45 <Jaffa> iPhone is thinner than an N810 (11mm vs. 14mm). 18mm is fscking huge
May 25 19:47:57 <lardman> and compared to the new model?
May 25 19:48:12 * lbt struggles to recall CutMeOwnThroat's precise question
May 25 19:48:16 <Jaffa> "N900" is, allegedly, 18mm
May 25 19:48:24 <mavhc> why make it thicker?
May 25 19:48:32 <lardman> to fit the gubbins in
May 25 19:48:40 <mavhc> which gubbins?
May 25 19:48:42 <CutMeOwnThroat> <CutMeOwnThroat> is there a simple way to compile debian packages for maemo, then
May 25 19:48:44 <Jaffa> mavhc: smaller width & height mean more depth needed for the similar/more amount of hardware
May 25 19:48:49 <Jaffa> (also explains smaller battery?)
May 25 19:48:57 <lardman> yeah
May 25 19:49:08 * Stskeeps ponders why noone has pointed out that if people hate the n900 ui so much, they can easily change it
May 25 19:49:13 <Jaffa> mavhc: FM RX/TX, accelerometers, HSPA chip
May 25 19:49:13 <lardman> and I guess the omap3 + power saving has moved on too, so it may even have better life
May 25 19:49:23 <lbt> more than install scratchbox and type dpkg-buildpkg -b  ??
May 25 19:49:55 <CutMeOwnThroat> sounds easy enough :)
May 25 19:50:01 <Meiz_n810> FM TX?
May 25 19:50:01 <lbt> I used to apt-get source locally
May 25 19:50:01 <mavhc> tbh I've no idea where the gubbins are on the n810, there's the back section, with the battery, kb, aerials, and the top section, with the screen. no idea where the gubbins fit
May 25 19:50:09 <lbt> then move it into sbox and do that...
May 25 19:50:15 <lbt> got ddd working....
May 25 19:50:22 <lardman> Meiz_n810: yeah, with RDS too
May 25 19:50:49 * Meiz_n810 think Fm transmitter is useless 
May 25 19:50:50 <lbt> you often have to chase down dependencies since Maemo is a bit sparse...
May 25 19:51:03 <lardman> Meiz_n810: in car?
May 25 19:51:04 <lbt> you may want to consider Mer if that gets heavy
May 25 19:51:06 <mavhc> rds is apparently easy to hack
May 25 19:51:15 <CutMeOwnThroat> lbt, brb, phone
May 25 19:51:19 <lardman> in general, or this particular chipset?
May 25 19:51:21 <lbt> although usually in Mer your package is also there
May 25 19:51:23 <qwerty12_N800>  Meiz_n810: think of the prank possibilities!
May 25 19:51:26 <Meiz_n810> lardman: i don't have a car :P
May 25 19:51:30 <xnt14> :P
May 25 19:51:45 <lardman> regarding RDS, and the fact it can also receive, think of traffic info (TMC)
May 25 19:52:12 <lardman> Hmm, from Peter: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=29151&page=13
May 25 19:52:16 <lardman> sounds like that's official then
May 25 19:52:19 <mavhc> seems odd that at the same time as everyone wants to add a 3.5mm audio input to their car stereo the car stereos have become so integrated into the dashboard it's much more difficult than 10 years ago
May 25 19:53:15 <Stskeeps> lardman: i honestly think it's quite a brilliant marketing move
May 25 19:53:32 <Stskeeps> release a phone to attract new people, release a tablet afterwards
May 25 19:53:50 <Stskeeps> heck, release a 7" version.. :P
May 25 19:54:12 <Stskeeps> it's a well laid path suckering people into using maemo on more things
May 25 19:54:12 <mavhc> first, wait for apple to release whatever they're going to do, then respond
May 25 19:54:14 <lardman> well perhaps, we'll have to see what happens
May 25 19:54:33 * Jaffa thinks a massively popular phone-style device would be fantastic for Maemo. It'll just end up being a different Maemo and device to the ones we've grown with.
May 25 19:54:50 <lardman> yep
May 25 19:54:50 <Stskeeps> i would love a open maemophone
May 25 19:54:57 <Stskeeps> especially after spending some time with the freerunner..
May 25 19:54:58 * Meiz_n810 wants Cortex-A9 based netbook
May 25 19:54:58 <Stskeeps> :P
May 25 19:55:06 <Stskeeps> Meiz_n810: touch book
May 25 19:55:17 <Meiz_n810> Stskeeps: Cortex-A9?
May 25 19:55:20 <lardman> I want a kb though!
May 25 19:55:40 <Stskeeps> Meiz_n810: fair enough, a8
May 25 19:55:52 <Meiz_n810> A9 would be nice
May 25 19:56:04 <Meiz_n810> 1GHz 4-core
May 25 19:56:17 <Meiz_n810> and still a long battery life :)
May 25 19:56:45 * lcuk doesnt even run his laptop at 1ghz
May 25 19:56:59 <mavhc> what don't you like about the freerunner Stskeeps?
May 25 19:57:25 <Stskeeps> mavhc: armv4t, for starters, their mini sd slot, the awkward position of buttons, the software(s)
May 25 19:57:30 <Stskeeps> i kinda like their gps and accelerometer though
May 25 19:57:39 * xnt14 runs his laptop at 2.11Ghz
May 25 19:58:00 <mavhc> the microsd slot is badly placed?
May 25 19:58:00 <Stskeeps> evening johnx
May 25 19:58:03 <timelys> Stskeeps, ping
May 25 19:58:09 <Stskeeps> timelys: pong
May 25 19:58:29 <Stskeeps> mavhc: nah, that one is okay, it's just a bitch to get up
May 25 20:00:38 <GeneralAntilles> Meiz_n810, wait until next year.
May 25 20:01:08 <Meiz_n810> Cortex-A9 will come 2010?
May 25 20:01:13 <Meiz_n810> great
May 25 20:01:14 <GeneralAntilles> Yes
May 25 20:01:18 <lardman> so, is the n810 screen actually smaller than that on the n800?
May 25 20:01:25 <GeneralAntilles> ES units are just being produced.
May 25 20:01:35 <GeneralAntilles> lardman, no, they're all the same size.
May 25 20:01:39 <GeneralAntilles> 4.13"
May 25 20:01:48 <lardman> I thought so
May 25 20:02:07 <lardman> but the Pandora screen is slightly larger then, at 4.3"
May 25 20:02:56 <minra> i am getting the 2453rd one
May 25 20:03:33 <johnx> morning :)
May 25 20:03:44 <minra> hope n900 gets sold at retail stores
May 25 20:03:51 <minra> hi
May 25 20:03:56 <lardman> I will have to send an email and see if they are taking the Google checkout orders
May 25 20:04:11 <rm_you> god, why is everyone freaking out? just wait for Nokia to tell you what the actual device is, THEN freak out, I hate rumors and speculation <_<
May 25 20:04:36 <qwerty12_N800> hi johnx
May 25 20:04:54 <johnx> morning qwerty12_N800 :D
May 25 20:04:57 <lardman> rm_you: not enough news :)
May 25 20:05:40 <lardman> lol @ http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=290000&postcount=176
May 25 20:06:38 <mavhc> who's this texrat, and why does he want the sarcasm to stop, doesn't he realise some of us are british?
May 25 20:06:56 <lardman> he was a Nokia employee
May 25 20:07:06 <Jaffa> USian.
May 25 20:07:06 <GAN800> The he had a meltdown
May 25 20:07:09 <johnx> the funny thing is, I already assumed those were the specs months ago and was still looking forward to it
May 25 20:07:10 <Jaffa> Laid-off.
May 25 20:07:27 <Jaffa> johnx: didn't share the screen part number joy ;-)
May 25 20:07:58 <johnx> GA and I were talking about it on here
May 25 20:08:01 <johnx> it's in the logs
May 25 20:08:16 <Jaffa> Ah well
May 25 20:08:39 <johnx> that was like 6 months ago and all I came up with was a hunch, nothing I could really be certain of
May 25 20:08:40 <Jaffa> A post on tmo would hopefully distract from such things as "Open letter to the Maemo community"
May 25 20:08:40 <lardman> at least Peter's last comment leaves room for there to be a proper 'tablet' device
May 25 20:09:03 <Stskeeps> johnx: the question is if it's in rx51 or rx71 config
May 25 20:09:12 <johnx> that's the rx51
May 25 20:09:22 <johnx> the rx71 won't have a qwerty pad I think
May 25 20:09:30 * Jaffa breathes deeply, as Texrat exhorts, as his "letter" of pleading to stop the sniping is nothing but full of sniping.
May 25 20:09:44 <johnx> also, any zaurus users have known that a 3.5" to 3.8" screen is totally usable
May 25 20:10:07 <lardman> johnx: I disagree, I was more than happy to go up the scale
May 25 20:10:21 <lardman> well usable perhaps, but not ideal for anything I wanted to use it for
May 25 20:10:50 <johnx> I was too, but going down by .8" of screen size in exchange by tons more power I'll take it
May 25 20:10:57 * Meiz_n810 will use his broken n810 until Cortex-A9 jumps out
May 25 20:11:08 <lardman> videos on the Zaurus were always painful, the size that is
May 25 20:11:16 <mavhc> can't we just make a stretchy screen?
May 25 20:11:24 <lardman> and reading stuff, webpages, docs, etc. were equally so
May 25 20:11:40 * johnx shrugs
May 25 20:11:51 <GAN800> 4.1", 1024x600
May 25 20:11:56 <GAN800> make my year
May 25 20:11:57 <lardman> It was a cool device to hack with, but not to be productive with (imho), for that I need something more like the Psion 5
May 25 20:11:59 <johnx> I still use my zaurus from time to time. biggest with the zaurus for me was lack of RAM
May 25 20:12:17 <johnx> GAN800: I bet they're still hilariously tied to 800x480 in some way :>
May 25 20:12:29 <mavhc> seeing as the n810 can't actually play 800x480 videos...
May 25 20:12:32 <lardman> GAN800: res is really of little interest to me, actual size of words on the screen is
May 25 20:12:49 <Stskeeps> i wonder if you can make a touchscreen magnifying glass
May 25 20:12:56 <Stskeeps> as in, touchscreen surface on it
May 25 20:13:00 <Proteous> heh
May 25 20:13:04 <lardman> like the ones you get in the back of an atlas :)
May 25 20:13:38 * lardman heads to watch TV
May 25 20:13:53 * Proteous TVs to watch some head
May 25 20:14:03 <Proteous> er
May 25 20:14:07 <qwerty12_N800> haha
May 25 20:14:39 <johnx> Stskeeps: I wonder if that was the idea behind the palm pre's curved screen...
May 25 20:15:20 <Stskeeps> johnx: heck, i'd go for retina overlay..
May 25 20:15:21 <Stskeeps> :P
May 25 20:15:36 <Proteous> not sure how the touchscreen would work on that though
May 25 20:15:39 <Proteous> sounds painfull
May 25 20:16:06 <kfx> I hate cisco cleanaccess so much
May 25 20:16:57 <johnx> kfx: I just hate cisco so much
May 25 20:17:06 <kfx> excellent point
May 25 20:18:15 * Stskeeps glances oddly at his freerunner
May 25 20:18:15 <johnx> I've had far too much interaction with them to have any warm and fuzzy feelings towards them
May 25 20:18:23 <Stskeeps> why does it claim it signed on to a network..
May 25 20:18:34 <Stskeeps> (i put in a hong kong FCCW card)
May 25 20:18:35 <GAN800> HAXERS
May 25 20:18:46 <johnx> Stskeeps: the CIA is tracking you
May 25 20:19:13 <Stskeeps> johnx: i have one of the most predictable patterns, heck, they dont even need to track me, just follow me for a day
May 25 20:19:17 <Stskeeps> :P
May 25 20:20:16 <kfx> "connected to network ECHELON"
May 25 20:20:18 <johnx> you ascribe fairly optimistic levels of competency ...
May 25 20:21:16 <mavhc> top secret things are competant, no oversight to tell you to do something stupid
May 25 20:22:13 <CutMeOwnThroat> lbt, I'm not sure how scratchbox works... I see I can install it on in i386 system, tough...
May 25 20:23:06 <minra> the new talk.maemo.org works great on tablet.  good job!   fast...
May 25 20:23:09 <Stskeeps> bbl sleep
May 25 20:23:33 <GAN800> looks like a really shitty kickstand, too.
May 25 20:23:48 <GAN800> http://www.cellpassion.com/news/2009/05/25/nokia-rover-is-an-n97-killer-internet-tablet.aspx
May 25 20:24:00 <GAN800> Nokia sure knows how to screw the pooch
May 25 20:24:02 <minra> scratchbox lets you build programs for maemo CutMeOwnThroat
May 25 20:24:03 <johnx> 'night Stskeeps
May 25 20:24:27 <minra> it compiles to arm or x86
May 25 20:24:56 <johnx> minra: you can do either
May 25 20:25:09 <minra> or
May 25 20:25:09 <CutMeOwnThroat> ok, but it can't contain all the libraries one needs ...
May 25 20:25:56 <minra> you need to download missing ones into scratchbox environment
May 25 20:26:43 <CutMeOwnThroat> mm, no README.Debian
May 25 20:27:05 <johnx> CutMeOwnThroat: check out the guide online
May 25 20:27:39 <CutMeOwnThroat> checking the regular readme now
May 25 20:28:00 <lbt> CutMeOwnThroat: what do you actually want to do?
May 25 20:28:19 <CutMeOwnThroat> lbt, just get some simple packages that I miss (e.g. less)
May 25 20:28:20 <Jaffa> GAN800: That photo looks very odd - a Diablo-ish screenshot?
May 25 20:28:44 <GAN800> Jaffa, yeah, looks like Maemo 3 icons on Chinook.
May 25 20:30:09 <CutMeOwnThroat> lbt, perhaps some less-simple stuff somewhat lateron :)
May 25 20:30:13 <|R> #
May 25 20:30:24 <|R> Bands: GSM Quad-Band 850, 900, 1800, 1900. WCDMA 900, 1700/2100, 2100 <- does that mean ... all at the same time?
May 25 20:30:31 <lbt> In that case sbox is what you want
May 25 20:31:14 <CutMeOwnThroat> I'd seen it mentioned... was just hesitant, so thanks for the kick :)
May 25 20:32:05 <johnx> though, just so you know, I think less is available from somewhere
May 25 20:33:01 <CutMeOwnThroat> apropos... what's doing the job of iwconfig? that network-manager itself?
May 25 20:33:01 <lbt> what's the latest fremantle dev env?
May 25 20:33:04 <lbt> http://maemo.org/development/sdks/pre_alpha_installation/
May 25 20:34:09 <GAN800> beta
May 25 20:34:50 <lbt> <sigh>  http://maemo.org/development/sdks/maemo_5-0/  gives ^^ link
May 25 20:35:40 <minra> any way to get hidef youtubes playing back without hiccups on mplayer (via mytube)?
May 25 20:36:04 <CutMeOwnThroat> lbt, last 3 sentences you were not talking to me, were you?
May 25 20:36:14 <lbt> no :)
May 25 20:36:18 <CutMeOwnThroat> good :)
May 25 20:36:23 <johnx> minra: what resolution and video/audio codecs are they?
May 25 20:36:28 <lbt> Need to setup sbox on a laptop for the Danish weekend though
May 25 20:36:42 <minra> i dont know
May 25 20:36:49 <minra> flash video
May 25 20:37:20 <minra> even if i hide mplayer, the audio hiccups
May 25 20:37:35 <minra> maybe i try -vo null
May 25 20:38:51 <Stskeeps> timeless_mbp: ooo impress
May 25 20:39:00 <timeless_mbp> i'm sorry :)
May 25 20:39:11 <qwerty12_N800> minra, -novideo - vo null just stops it from being outputted, not decoded
May 25 20:39:41 <minra> meh
May 25 20:40:10 <CutMeOwnThroat> minra, -novideo
May 25 20:40:25 <qwerty12_N800> there's a difference, believe me, even more  o when regarding the tablet ;)
May 25 20:41:30 <kfx> 3.5" screen?  ugh
May 25 20:41:35 <Stskeeps> timeless_mbp: at least it antialiases text
May 25 20:42:21 <johnx> heh, screen size is the same as the touch ...
May 25 20:43:03 <rm_you> timeless_mbp: so i see you're going to be at CPH?
May 25 20:44:35 <CutMeOwnThroat> johnx, and you guys were right, the media-player that comes with the N818 shows better performance than mplayer.... although that's strange, thinking how obsessed the mplayer guys are with good performance :)
May 25 20:44:45 <timeless_mbp> :)
May 25 20:45:06 <johnx> CutMeOwnThroat: depends on the codec used
May 25 20:45:25 <johnx> nokia has a better ARM AAC decoder I believe, which makes a huge difference
May 25 20:45:49 <CutMeOwnThroat> hehe... weelll... too true, I installed mplayer because the other player couldn't decode the 1st video I tried at all :)
May 25 20:45:53 <johnx> also, keep in mind that mplayer for x86 and for ARM will have different levels of optimization
May 25 20:46:18 <johnx> the mp3 decoder in mplayer-arm is *fast* for example
May 25 20:47:13 <CutMeOwnThroat> easy to imagine, I found lots of discussions on it
May 25 20:48:00 <CutMeOwnThroat> they probably didn't put too much effort into other architectures than x86
May 25 20:48:39 <GeneralAntilles> There's a lot of room for opts in MPlayer
May 25 20:48:56 <johnx> the "they" for mplayer x86 and mplayer arm are different people
May 25 20:49:28 <GeneralAntilles> 3.5" . . . I'm inclined to be really pissed at Nokia for making me waste a ton of time and effort on a platform they're going to hamstring.
May 25 20:49:42 <johnx> the people (person?) optimizing mplayer for ARM put in a lot of work, but in the end ran out of energy since they weren't getting much help
May 25 20:50:08 <johnx> GeneralAntilles: yeah, just like everyone looked at the iphone and said "3.5", I'll stick to the Newton."
May 25 20:50:20 <minra> phone customers dont buy n810 sized appliances GeneralAntilles
May 25 20:50:24 <GeneralAntilles> johnx, that's exactly what I did.
May 25 20:50:36 <johnx> GeneralAntilles: you're not the "core market" :)
May 25 20:50:41 <GeneralAntilles> I don't want a phone, I want an internet tablet.
May 25 20:50:54 <lbt> Mer
May 25 20:50:54 <johnx> phones sell, ipods sell, tablets don't
May 25 20:51:12 <GeneralAntilles> and unfortunately I've wasted years of my life on a platform that's going in a direction that doesn't work for me.
May 25 20:51:35 <johnx> GeneralAntilles: come to the dark side. We'll be supporting some pretty interesting hardware
May 25 20:51:40 <lbt> You mean the next device doesn't work
May 25 20:51:43 <johnx> s/dark/light/
May 25 20:51:44 <infobot> johnx meant: GeneralAntilles: come to the light side. We'll be supporting some pretty interesting hardware
May 25 20:51:46 <GeneralAntilles> johnx, I'm burnt out.
May 25 20:51:55 <minra> i think maemo will have life on larger devices
May 25 20:52:16 <kfx> 15:40 < johnx> GeneralAntilles: you're not the "core market" :)
May 25 20:52:33 <kfx> there is no "core market" for a $700 pocket-sized linux tablet
May 25 20:53:11 <minra> i say johnx old chap you wouldnt happen to have any more ui tweaks for exult?
May 25 20:53:45 <lbt> GeneralAntilles: now I suggest : ask not what you can do for Maemo, but what Maemo can do for you...
May 25 20:53:56 <CutMeOwnThroat> kfx, you mean it's like... all spread out?
May 25 20:54:06 <Jaffa> lbt: :-)
May 25 20:54:21 <Jaffa> GeneralAntilles: There's always some recoup to be made from device programmes & ebay.
May 25 20:54:41 <GeneralAntilles> lbt, not much.
May 25 20:54:47 <GeneralAntilles> Jaffa, sounds like a worthwhile blog post.
May 25 20:54:47 <Jaffa> Though looking at the timescales at mobilecrunch, a European device programme in October (post-summit?) would not be fun
May 25 20:55:28 <CutMeOwnThroat> johnx, ok, I never bothered with mplayer enough to know that... I just liked how well it worked on x86 and read a bit on the fights the authors picked with debian and others
May 25 20:55:48 <GeneralAntilles> Let's home there's something in the RX-71
May 25 20:56:00 <kfx> I spend a looot of time picking fights with debian
May 25 20:56:09 <johnx> minra: I never even played exult ...
May 25 20:56:18 <kfx> about as much time as they spend patching software until it stops working
May 25 20:56:23 <GeneralAntilles> If not, I suspect I'll be moving on.
May 25 20:56:43 <johnx> GeneralAntilles: it'd be a shame to have you head off right when Mer is starting to come together
May 25 20:57:00 <CutMeOwnThroat> kfx, hehe, well, they probably got good reasons to do so :)
May 25 20:57:20 <minra> johnx sorry, nm
May 25 20:57:50 <lbt> GeneralAntilles: and that's what I meant... Mer is using the maemo stuff (and contributing back!)
May 25 20:58:00 <johnx> especially since the smartq 7 would fit a lot of people's wants/needs
May 25 20:58:19 <minra> maybe you should wait to try the n900 b4 judging it
May 25 20:58:37 <GeneralAntilles> minra, 3.5" doesn't leave me with a lot of hope.
May 25 20:58:42 <lbt> minra: sacrilige!!
May 25 20:58:49 <GeneralAntilles> My two big use cases are basically torpedoed by that size.
May 25 20:58:56 <GeneralAntilles> johnx, SmartQ is slow.
May 25 20:59:02 <kfx> CutMeOwnThroat: yeah, they generally do: http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=363516
May 25 20:59:03 <sanjay6976> hi
May 25 20:59:09 <GeneralAntilles> Cheap Chineses non-upgrade to my N800.
May 25 20:59:11 * GeneralAntilles sighs.
May 25 20:59:11 <minra> i am typing in a 3.5 window now
May 25 20:59:20 <johnx> GeneralAntilles: well, it's no cortex a8 to be sure, but it seems faster than the n8x0
May 25 20:59:38 <minra> left side is hildon menu bar.  bottom side is the text assist
May 25 20:59:59 <minra> which i cannot seem to turn off
May 25 21:00:13 <CutMeOwnThroat> kfx, well, he asked upstream about that...
May 25 21:00:23 <sanjay6976> on installing Qt over maemo 4.1.2 my qmake is not working in ARMEL
May 25 21:00:48 <CutMeOwnThroat> kfx, and got a "I dunno, but I guess it's ok" back and none of the guys who knew contradicted
May 25 21:01:31 <sanjay6976> any idea
May 25 21:01:33 <johnx> back in a sec
May 25 21:01:34 <sanjay6976> :)
May 25 21:01:56 <lbt> sanjay6976: "not working"... blue smoke?
May 25 21:02:35 <CutMeOwnThroat> kfx, and so he went ahead... what more do you expect of a maintainer?
May 25 21:02:48 <kfx> CutMeOwnThroat: I expect him not to mess with things he doesn't understand
May 25 21:03:01 <CutMeOwnThroat> kfx, that's why he asked before he messed with it...
May 25 21:03:18 <kfx> ...and didn't get a reliable answer, and charged on
May 25 21:03:29 <CutMeOwnThroat> a maintainer can't know the code as well as the authors
May 25 21:03:32 <kfx> anyway that's one instance which represents the whole of the Debian Failosophy
May 25 21:04:01 <kfx> my job got far easier when I moved critical services to slackware hosts
May 25 21:04:18 <CutMeOwnThroat> kfx, he got an "ok" on a list that was read by all the people who should have known and none of them flinched...
May 25 21:04:25 <CutMeOwnThroat> kind of a peer-reviewed answer
May 25 21:04:38 <kfx> I've spent the last week trying to figure out exactly how they wrecked grub so it fails on poweredge r805s, and the week before working out what they did to ocfs2
May 25 21:04:41 <sanjay6976> lbt:: on running qmake it gives me "mmap: No such device or address'
May 25 21:05:10 <kfx> CutMeOwnThroat: he got an "okay for debugging" response iirc, not a "ship that code"
May 25 21:05:51 <lbt> ah... that's been on the ml recently
May 25 21:06:07 <kfx> but still, if he has to ask, he's not qualified to make code changes, period
May 25 21:06:17 <minra> flapping castles
May 25 21:06:20 <mavhc> all problems are caused by lack of information dissemination
May 25 21:06:55 <lbt> sanjay6976: and it was you asking...
May 25 21:06:57 <CutMeOwnThroat> kfx, only someone how doesn't do anything doesn't make any mistakes - but then he doesn't improve anything either so if they get a 10:1 or 50:1 or 100:1 or even a 1000:1 or whatever rate of improvements:mistakes, there will always be mistakes... doesn't mean that the benefit isn't bigger
May 25 21:07:06 <lbt> I'd guess the wrong qemu ?
May 25 21:07:09 <sanjay6976> yeah
May 25 21:07:28 * kfx revels in the benefit of a severely reduced pool of encrpytion keys
May 25 21:07:42 <CutMeOwnThroat> you're childish
May 25 21:07:46 <sanjay6976> what should i set
May 25 21:07:52 <sanjay6976> qemu as
May 25 21:08:17 <CutMeOwnThroat> *being
May 25 21:08:18 <kfx> I do this crazy thing called regression testing, in a sandbox lab so my mistakes don't, for instance, get disseminated to every one of my users
May 25 21:08:30 <sanjay6976> this is my setting now "CPU-transparency: /scratchbox/devkits/cputransp/bin/qemu-arm-cvs-m"
May 25 21:08:35 <mavhc> ssl was broken for years too
May 25 21:08:47 <lbt> sanjay6976: sorry... I don't have that up at the moment
May 25 21:09:10 <CutMeOwnThroat> and in that sandbox you'd have noticed that a newly created keys were compromised?
May 25 21:09:28 <kfx> if I patch openssl, I spend days testing everything
May 25 21:09:28 <sanjay6976> does Qt 4.5 works on maemo 4.1.2 ARMEL
May 25 21:09:47 <kfx> automated tests, of course, but I bet I would have picked up a huge reduction in entropy like that
May 25 21:10:11 <CutMeOwnThroat> maybe you would, or you wouldn't
May 25 21:10:22 <kfx> the Debian Way is a particularly sensitive issue for me, since it wouldn't be an exaggeration to say most of my job entails cleaning up after debian/ubuntu packagers
May 25 21:10:46 <sanjay6976> lbt::does Qt 4.5 works on maemo 4.1.2 ARMEL
May 25 21:10:53 <lbt> it should
May 25 21:11:01 <lbt> I'm on Mer now :)
May 25 21:11:20 <CutMeOwnThroat> well, so what do you suggest to improve that?
May 25 21:11:34 <sanjay6976> its doin fine on X86 on the same setup but not on ARMEL
May 25 21:11:44 <CutMeOwnThroat> stop adding patches to fix bugs
May 25 21:11:45 <CutMeOwnThroat> ?
May 25 21:11:50 <kfx> yes, actually
May 25 21:11:52 <kfx> exactly that
May 25 21:11:57 <kfx> submit patches upstream
May 25 21:12:15 <CutMeOwnThroat> then you can't have debian stable
May 25 21:12:18 <kfx> but they don't just patch for bugs
May 25 21:12:26 <CutMeOwnThroat> and you don't need a bugtracking system
May 25 21:12:28 <timeless_mbp> CutMeOwnThroat: sounds like a good idea
May 25 21:12:40 <kfx> they patch functionality, they patch configuration, they patch documentation, etc etc
May 25 21:12:42 <timeless_mbp> you could work on testing products against shipped stuff
May 25 21:12:47 <timeless_mbp> and report when there are problems
May 25 21:12:58 <timeless_mbp> but if the newer released software works, you could make it available to your customers
May 25 21:13:01 <CutMeOwnThroat> not to me, I like the stableness of stable
May 25 21:13:02 * timeless_mbp shrugs
May 25 21:13:13 <timeless_mbp> well, i hope you enjoy 0 entropy
May 25 21:13:19 <timeless_mbp> because it's nice and stable
May 25 21:13:26 <CutMeOwnThroat> you're also being stable
May 25 21:13:27 <kfx> the stableness of stable is completely useless when you're running a big install
May 25 21:13:28 <CutMeOwnThroat> errr
May 25 21:13:31 <CutMeOwnThroat> childish
May 25 21:13:37 <CutMeOwnThroat> see how mistakes happen :)
May 25 21:13:46 <timeless_mbp> you didn't ask me for a review
May 25 21:13:48 <timeless_mbp> not my fault
May 25 21:13:57 <timeless_mbp> Stskeeps: is the string i flagged really in mer?
May 25 21:14:33 <kfx> timeless_mbp: clearly anyone who disagrees with CutMeOwnThroat and/or debian packagers is just being childish
May 25 21:14:36 <CutMeOwnThroat> and actually, afaik bugs do get forwarded to upstream, so do patches
May 25 21:14:47 <kfx> obviously there is no other way to have a mature, reasoned opinion
May 25 21:14:56 <CutMeOwnThroat> kfx, no, only people who don't use arguments but squibs like that
May 25 21:15:02 <johnx> the entropy in this channel would be a nice pool to draw from ...
May 25 21:15:09 <StsN800> timeless, network manager
May 25 21:15:10 <timeless_mbp> johnx: :)
May 25 21:15:11 <kfx> johnx: it would save us having to wiggle mice
May 25 21:15:18 <timeless_mbp> StsN800: hrm
May 25 21:15:23 <kfx> I'm just going to start piping irclogs to generate keys
May 25 21:15:38 <johnx> I'll do a NMU for ssl/ssh right now then :D
May 25 21:15:39 * johnx ducks
May 25 21:15:43 <kfx> hahah
May 25 21:15:55 <CutMeOwnThroat> I mean, everytime you run out of real arguments you come up with some joke about that entropy bug... with WAS a kind of worst-case
May 25 21:16:11 <timeless_mbp> well, i sure hope that wasn't the best case!
May 25 21:16:14 <StsN800> timeless_mbp, but it got cut off oddly in mer 0.6
May 25 21:16:31 <timeless_mbp> StsN800: it ended a sentence with a preposition
May 25 21:16:33 <minra> i see a gay allah/santa riding a translucent green hemp bicycle at 40,000 feet spraying anthrax out of his nipples
May 25 21:16:45 <minra> more entropy
May 25 21:17:02 <kfx> I haven't run out of any real arguments ?:(
May 25 21:17:21 <kfx> 1) debian patches things they don't need to patch
May 25 21:17:24 <kfx> 2) they should stop
May 25 21:17:36 <minra> kfx has a point
May 25 21:17:55 <CutMeOwnThroat> yeah? where is it?
May 25 21:18:08 <minra> some of that is just graffitti
May 25 21:18:10 <kfx> 3) there are ways to create stable environments without adding functionality to calendar(1)
May 25 21:18:36 <timeless_mbp> kfx: wtf?
May 25 21:18:37 <GeneralAntilles> The only reasonable solution is for us to all run abacuses.
May 25 21:18:52 <kfx> 4) debian has a terrible, horrible, no-good, very-bad testing apparatus that doesn't take into account many, many variables
May 25 21:19:05 <CutMeOwnThroat> it's called "sid", I think
May 25 21:19:24 <mavhc> what are these ways?
May 25 21:19:27 <minra> sidux.com  debian hot and spicy
May 25 21:19:38 <sanjay6976> any idea of my problem
May 25 21:20:15 <timeless_mbp> sanjay6976: most of us don't spend gobs of time using qt4.5 on armel
May 25 21:20:46 <sanjay6976> k
May 25 21:21:29 <CutMeOwnThroat> obviously, if nobody felt the patches aren't needed, the things would never get patched
May 25 21:21:45 <timeless_mbp> CutMeOwnThroat: can you try to avoid using negatives?
May 25 21:21:50 <timeless_mbp> you're doing a terrible job
May 25 21:21:51 <kfx> I can't parse that sentence
May 25 21:22:03 <kfx> but I think you're saying the patches they apply are seen as necessary
May 25 21:22:19 <mavhc> what are these ways to create stable environments without adding functionality to calendar(1)?
May 25 21:22:30 <kfx> in that case I refer you to calendar(1), which isn't even the most bizarre mangling I've seen debian do
May 25 21:22:40 <CutMeOwnThroat> kfx, time to patch your parser :-P
May 25 21:22:41 <kfx> mavhc: slackware, for one example, does quite nicely
May 25 21:22:59 <mavhc> how does it differ?
May 25 21:23:15 <kfx> apt-get --purge remove brain && apt-get update && apt-get install brain
May 25 21:23:36 <CutMeOwnThroat> ouch, that must have hurt
May 25 21:23:46 <kfx> CutMeOwnThroat: I was in the army; I'm used to that procedure
May 25 21:24:01 <CutMeOwnThroat> kfx, I noticed your discussing style :-P
May 25 21:24:31 <kfx> mavhc: once a distro version is released, only security updates are applied.  Patches etc that come out later (the equiv. of -updates and -backports) are placed in /patches, and must be explicitly specified
May 25 21:25:00 <kfx> the most invasive patches you'll see from slackware involve symlinks for compatibility and one to set the default x11 background to black instead of stippled grey
May 25 21:25:26 <Corsac> but slackware sucks anyway :)
May 25 21:25:35 <kfx> touche
May 25 21:25:37 <CutMeOwnThroat> hehe
May 25 21:25:40 <mavhc> the other question is: who's forcing you to use debian?
May 25 21:25:44 <kfx> however, it sucks less than debian
May 25 21:25:50 <timeless_mbp> mavhc: so...
May 25 21:25:58 <timeless_mbp> the fact that debian manages to hurt the rest of the world
May 25 21:26:05 <kfx> mavhc: I made the terrible mistake of allowing the faculty at the school I work for to select a distro
May 25 21:26:08 <timeless_mbp> is precisely why it isn't simply sufficient to ignore it
May 25 21:26:45 <kfx> all the vms are hosted by slackware installs, but everything they actually interact with is either debian or ubuntu
May 25 21:26:48 <mavhc> after I paid all that licencing money to debian I can't switch now
May 25 21:27:03 <johnx> s/#maemo/#distroflamewar/ :)
May 25 21:27:03 <timeless_mbp> mavhc: after someone contributed a stupid patch to debian
May 25 21:27:09 <timeless_mbp> i lost a portion of my keyspace
May 25 21:27:20 <timeless_mbp> the contribution was free, the cost was priceless
May 25 21:27:28 <mavhc> so switch
May 25 21:27:41 <kfx> mavhc: no, none of those keys are safe for anyone at all to use now
May 25 21:27:42 <timeless_mbp> the only way to switch is to remove debian from the planet
May 25 21:27:48 <rm_you> or remove the patch, recompile the app, and move on
May 25 21:27:55 <timeless_mbp> rm_you: that doesn't work
May 25 21:28:01 <rm_you> oh, right
May 25 21:28:07 <rm_you> you're talking about, ssh key fiasco?
May 25 21:28:07 <timeless_mbp> worse, everyone else has to install extra code to detect this broken bits
May 25 21:28:11 <kfx> yeah
May 25 21:28:18 <rm_you> bleh
May 25 21:28:23 <timeless_mbp> it's an explanation of why it isn't safe to ignore stupid distros
May 25 21:28:27 <mavhc> if you kill every OS with a security flaw you'll be left flipping switches on a pdp-11
May 25 21:28:28 <timeless_mbp> because they really can hurt *everyone*
May 25 21:28:40 <mavhc> you're ignoring windows
May 25 21:28:44 <timeless_mbp> not really
May 25 21:28:47 <timeless_mbp> i'm running windows
May 25 21:28:50 <Corsac> at the moment, you're hurting *us*, so please, give us a break
May 25 21:29:06 <timeless_mbp> StsN800: so...
May 25 21:29:13 <timeless_mbp> Missing resources
May 25 21:29:20 <mavhc> windows causes much bigger problems, 50 million zombie computers for a start
May 25 21:29:21 <timeless_mbp> (-) The NetworkManager applet could not find some
May 25 21:29:25 <rm_you> qwerty12_N800: finally applied one of your patches
May 25 21:29:29 <timeless_mbp>     required resources. It cannot continue. [OK]
May 25 21:29:45 <qwerty12_N800> rm_you, yep, got an email :)
May 25 21:29:52 <rm_you> :P
May 25 21:30:00 <rm_you> not sure about the other, honestly
May 25 21:30:07 <rm_you> i mean, the code is super-useful for later, thanks
May 25 21:30:13 <rm_you> not sure i want to do it now tho :p
May 25 21:30:18 <kfx> http://www.nizkor.org/features/fallacies/red-herring.html
May 25 21:30:49 <qwerty12_N800> rm_you, I'll be awaiting your cpl applet :P :)
May 25 21:31:31 <timeless_mbp> what's the current Mer apt thingy?
May 25 21:31:50 <timeless_mbp> i'm using repository.mer.tspre.org alpha
May 25 21:34:16 <CutMeOwnThroat> kfx, pm?
May 25 21:34:24 * timeless_mbp pokes StsN800 
May 25 21:35:17 <StsN800> timeless, we switched to obs so 0.13 from scratch upgrade is needed :/
May 25 21:35:26 <timeless_mbp> "obs"?
May 25 21:35:57 <StsN800> opensuse build service
May 25 21:36:08 <timeless_mbp> ok, url me?
May 25 21:36:16 <keesj> StsN800: are you at least trying to be CO2 neutral?
May 25 21:36:24 <johnx> http://wiki.maemo.org/Mer/Build
May 25 21:36:41 <johnx> or http://en.opensuse.org/Build_Service
May 25 21:40:35 * timeless_mbp kicks BBC for writing "busines"
May 25 21:40:48 <timeless_mbp> johnx: i don't care about obs, i want a working version of mer
May 25 21:40:59 <timeless_mbp> http://wiki.maemo.org/Mer/Releases
May 25 21:41:04 <StsN800> timeless, wiki.maemo.org/Mer/Releases/0.13
May 25 21:41:44 <timeless_mbp> i want http://stskeeps.subnetmask.net/mer/0.13/mer-x86-generic-image-v0.13.vmdk.zip ?
May 25 21:41:49 <StsN800> yep
May 25 21:42:54 <minra> should users switch to mer?  if so, why?
May 25 21:43:33 <timeless_mbp> minra: because it will get software updates
May 25 21:43:57 <mavhc> if so, when?
May 25 21:44:01 <kkrusty> what is mer?
May 25 21:44:22 <Jaffa> kkrusty: http://wiki.maemo.org/Mer
May 25 21:44:48 <Jaffa> kkrusty: A community-developed Linux distribution based on the best bits of Maemo (incl. Maemo 5) and Ubuntu
May 25 21:45:44 <kkrusty> Jaffa: right. but aside from encouraging stuff what else does it accomplish?
May 25 21:46:15 <timeless_mbp> kkrusty: it'll have bug fixes
May 25 21:46:18 <minra> actively developed software
May 25 21:46:27 <timeless_mbp> in practice, you will not find that in Diablo
May 25 21:47:05 <Jaffa> kkrusty: If you want any bits of Maemo 5 on an existing device, Mer is your best bet.
May 25 21:47:17 <kkrusty> and its out?
May 25 21:47:25 <Jaffa> IOW, it's the last best hope for people who like Internet Tablets :-/
May 25 21:47:51 <kkrusty> Jaffa: no kidding. Im actually considering a netbook now
May 25 21:48:03 <Jaffa> kkrusty: Mer? It's at 0.13 so probably not ready yet for *very* end-users, but it's a non-destructive install and new releases every 4 weeks.
May 25 21:48:18 <kkrusty> Jaffa: cool
May 25 22:04:04 <timeless_mbp> how do i mount a hard drive in Mer?
May 25 22:04:19 <lcuk> how do you install a harddrive into your tablet?
May 25 22:04:32 <timeless_mbp> VirtualBox Media Manager
May 25 22:04:45 <qwerty12_N800> usb host & enclosure? :>
May 25 22:04:46 <lcuk> heh ahhh images.  i dunno then
May 25 22:04:48 <timeless_mbp> it's actually drag and drop capable
May 25 22:05:09 * lcuk empties sand onto the chanfloor
May 25 22:05:16 <timeless_mbp> mount /dev/sdb1 /media/old
May 25 22:05:18 <timeless_mbp> worked
May 25 22:07:06 <lcuk> cool
May 25 22:09:29 * GeneralAntilles sighs again.
May 25 22:10:04 <kfx> CutMeOwnThroat: pm me any time
May 25 22:10:40 <GeneralAntilles> Stskeeps, I'd recommend just lifting the S60 5th finger keyboard wholesale.
May 25 22:10:49 <GeneralAntilles> The virtual arrow buttons work really well.
May 25 22:12:04 <timeless_mbp> Stskeeps: so, i have two XTerminal windows
May 25 22:12:09 <timeless_mbp> in mer0.13
May 25 22:12:15 <timeless_mbp> if i click on the xterm icon at the top
May 25 22:12:24 <timeless_mbp> i get a menu that appears under my "finger"
May 25 22:12:47 <timeless_mbp> if i click the perl then i get a menu that appears safely not under my "finger"
May 25 22:13:02 * timeless_mbp frowns
May 25 22:14:34 <johnx> timeless_mbp: yup, appears to be problem with placement in the icon menu placement. seeing it here too
May 25 22:17:02 <lardman|tv> night all
May 25 22:22:16 <Macer> :)
May 25 22:22:23 <Macer> just finished downloading like 40 more wii games
May 25 22:22:23 <Macer> lol
May 25 22:23:04 <mavhc> first person to turn their n900 into a wii controller wins
May 25 22:23:40 <Bobbe> lol
May 25 22:24:03 <mavhc> has anyone considered connecting these usb monitors to a tablet, now there are linux drivers?
May 25 22:24:34 <lcuk> pvanhoof, you around
May 25 22:24:44 <Jaffa> mavhc: It's been mentioned somewhere, I believe.
May 25 22:24:49 <Jaffa> Perhaps in the USB VGA thread on tmo?
May 25 22:24:55 <qwerty12_N800> Macer, bah, i've only done 4 :/
May 25 22:25:40 <acydlord> you guys seen this yet? http://www.cellpassion.com/news/2009/05/25/nokia-rover-is-an-n97-killer-internet-tablet.aspx
May 25 22:25:57 <lcuk> mavhc, its more than just sending out the accel data surely
May 25 22:26:40 <johnx> acydlord: yup, it's been the topic for the last day or so :)
May 25 22:26:53 <johnx> mobilecrunch had the scoop yesterday it looks like
May 25 22:26:59 <acydlord> ahh
May 25 22:27:09 <pvanhoof> lcuk, yes
May 25 22:27:18 <acydlord> too bad i'm not gonna be in the financial situation to afford a new NIT for awhile :(
May 25 22:28:59 <Bobbe> acydlord, there's a huge thread on itt on it. It seems the smaller screen made was quite depressing for a lot of people
May 25 22:29:23 <acydlord> i havent checked itt in awhile, i should probably catch up
May 25 22:30:29 <Macer> qwerty12_N800: 4?
May 25 22:30:37 <Macer> wii games? :)
May 25 22:30:46 <Macer> i've gone on a wii game binge
May 25 22:30:47 <Macer> lol
May 25 22:30:53 <qwerty12_N800> Macer, yep. My connection is shit :p
May 25 22:31:12 <Bobbe> Macer, have you seen this? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_SXNAtwYMBw
May 25 22:31:33 <rm_you> johnx: add_poi about done, starting on get_poi, going to dump an XML thing for you, that sound good? or would you rather just have CSV?
May 25 22:32:03 <johnx> rm_you: are you using the jabber xml thing?
May 25 22:32:11 <johnx> otherwise you might as well just use csv
May 25 22:32:12 <rm_you> johnx: still just my DB for now
May 25 22:32:15 <rm_you> i don't know how jabber works
May 25 22:32:27 <Macer> hahahahah
May 25 22:32:32 <johnx> rm_you: it's just a format thing. I don't care about the jabber protocol
May 25 22:32:33 <rm_you> dunno which is easier for you to parse through
May 25 22:32:42 <rm_you> do you have a link to the RFC?
May 25 22:32:55 <Macer> suckend life! hahahah
May 25 22:33:03 <johnx> http://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0080.html
May 25 22:33:08 <rm_you> thx
May 25 22:33:20 <Bobbe> lol
May 25 22:33:36 <Macer> Bobbe: oh man that crap was funny
May 25 22:33:37 <rm_you> johnx: ok i can prolly do this... of course we will be ignoring many fields
May 25 22:33:40 <johnx> basically it's just a matter with lining up to their terms or having terms/variables that are synomnyms for one of theirs
May 25 22:33:45 <johnx> of course
May 25 22:33:49 <Bobbe> Macer, lmao every time I see it
May 25 22:34:05 <rm_you> lat/lon/alt
May 25 22:34:08 <rm_you> we're good
May 25 22:34:16 <Bobbe> Macer, the part the girl swallows just kills me
May 25 22:34:16 <lcuk> time
May 25 22:34:17 <Macer> Bobbe: yeah that was pretty good :)
May 25 22:34:19 <rm_you> and text / timestamp
May 25 22:34:26 <rm_you> yes lcuk :P
May 25 22:34:37 <rm_you> and uri for image?
May 25 22:34:47 <rm_you> oh, not text... description
May 25 22:34:58 <rm_you> but yeah, k.
May 25 22:35:29 <rm_you> anyone know about XML spec, if i can just leave out those fields and have it be compatible, or do i have to make them and have them blank?
May 25 22:35:39 <rm_you> the fields i don't use
May 25 22:35:40 <johnx> yup, should line up with using jabber as a data source or sink in the future
May 25 22:35:43 <Macer> Bobbe: yeah :-D
May 25 22:35:51 <rm_you> kk will do that out
May 25 22:36:02 <johnx> rm_you: there are examples on the page I linked
May 25 22:36:11 <acydlord> my girlfriend managed to halt production of my geolocation project of 3 years :(
May 25 22:36:21 <acydlord> at least till i can afford a new gps unit
May 25 22:36:26 <lcuk> what, she found you?
May 25 22:36:26 <rm_you> johnx: oh ok will read more, i just went straight to the data spec
May 25 22:36:31 <rm_you> ROFL
May 25 22:36:44 <rm_you> oh, she break your gps? :P
May 25 22:36:50 <johnx> rm_you: 4.1 Entity publishes location via PEP
May 25 22:36:53 <lcuk> she ran away with it
May 25 22:36:55 <lcuk> and hid it
May 25 22:37:02 <acydlord> she broke one of them
May 25 22:37:11 <acydlord> and the other fell in the lake
May 25 22:37:16 <rm_you> ack
May 25 22:37:21 <lcuk> at least you know where the lake is
May 25 22:38:29 <acydlord> yes, and i also now know that the part of the lake it fell in is 160ft deep
May 25 22:39:01 <rm_you> lol
May 25 22:39:10 <lcuk> see, altitude is important
May 25 22:39:16 <lcuk> just make sure it can do -ve values
May 25 22:39:16 <rm_you> i suppose renting scuba gear is more expensive than the GPS unit :P
May 25 22:40:08 <acydlord> brb
May 25 22:40:10 <lcuk> acydlord, without gps local folks would just say "aye, tis a bottomless pit"   now thanks to your clever work, you know its 160ft deep
May 25 22:41:13 <Bobbe> lol
May 25 22:41:24 <Bobbe> that's sure to make him feel better lcuk
May 25 22:41:39 <Bobbe> acydlord, how much to get a new gps?
May 25 22:42:04 <acydlord> i think 80 for the better of the units i had
May 25 22:42:04 <lcuk> lol
May 25 22:42:21 <lcuk> maybe spend a bit more and get an inflatable unbreakable one ;)
May 25 22:43:18 <Bobbe> it's not that much, is it? I mean i live in Brazil, have no idea how much is expensive for a gps unit
May 25 22:43:23 <acydlord> i'm gonna get a couple otter boxes
May 25 22:43:30 <acydlord> nah, 80 isnt bad
May 25 22:44:02 <Bobbe> yeap, especially depending on how willing your gf is willing to make up to ya
May 25 22:44:12 <Bobbe> might actually be worth the replacemente/bother
May 25 22:44:15 <acydlord> haha, she has no job at the moment
May 25 22:44:30 <Bobbe> I didn't mean money man. Work with me here ;)
May 25 22:44:36 <acydlord> i'm gonna see if ASU will tack another one onto my research project
May 25 22:44:50 <acydlord> since they funded me for the purchase of about 300 routers =x
May 25 22:45:07 <Bobbe> woah. Why did you need 300 routers?
May 25 22:45:25 <rm_you> probably for some heavy duty routing :)
May 25 22:45:43 <Bobbe> you don't saaaaaaaaay lol
May 25 22:46:14 <Bobbe> http://www.amazon.com/Sony-PEG-UX50-U-Clie-Handheld/dp/B0000AQFZ9 -> how bizarre must it be to type on one of those
May 25 22:46:53 <johnx> I think I got to hold one at one point
May 25 22:46:56 <johnx> it's only marginally weird
May 25 22:46:58 <acydlord> building a giant wireless mesh with solar routers
May 25 22:46:59 * Jaffa sold his UX50 Clie a month or so ago
May 25 22:47:22 <Jaffa> My only PalmOS device. No multitasking: major suckage. Regular crashing: major suckage.
May 25 22:47:29 <Jaffa> Nice small form factor, though
May 25 22:47:44 <Bobbe> this guy was running mac os 10 on it. Freaking FAST
May 25 22:47:48 <rm_you> acydlord: you somewhere that actually gets sun, i hope? :P
May 25 22:47:55 <acydlord> yeah, arizona
May 25 22:48:03 <rm_you> :P
May 25 22:48:18 <Bobbe> yeap, sun enough there
May 25 22:48:35 <acydlord> yup, which is why we have one of the worlds largest solar test facilities
May 25 22:48:37 <johnx> Bobbe: different sony handheld :)
May 25 22:48:45 <rm_you> sounds like a cool project then. how much does a solar powered router run you? $$$
May 25 22:48:48 <mavhc> odd that noone's yet asked why your gf hid your gps
May 25 22:49:09 <johnx> probably a vaio ux50, not a PEG-UX50
May 25 22:49:11 <acydlord> she broke it
May 25 22:49:14 <acydlord> ran it over
May 25 22:49:16 <Bobbe> johnx, is there more than one model with the same number?
May 25 22:49:21 <acydlord> and the other i dropped in the lake
May 25 22:49:27 <Bobbe> ah, ok
May 25 22:49:59 <johnx> that PEG-UX50 probably wouldn't really run linux
May 25 22:50:09 <johnx> let alone mac os x
May 25 22:50:17 <Bobbe> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=weo6fBdDqWs&e
May 25 22:50:22 <Bobbe> indeed, a different model
May 25 22:51:04 <Bobbe> looks a lot cooler, though the kb keys are like 10% of my finger size, probably
May 25 22:51:31 <johnx> haha, i like all the cuts in the video as he boots
May 25 22:51:38 <Bobbe> yeap
May 25 22:52:03 <Bobbe> and the apple MAGICALLY APPEARS! lol
May 25 22:53:47 <Bobbe> acydlord, sorry to insist, but how did she run over your gps? It just happened to be on the garage floor?
May 25 22:54:25 <acydlord> probably fell out of the car, its one of the small units you pair to a computer or what have you
May 25 22:55:41 <Bobbe> ouch
May 25 22:56:11 <Bobbe> too bad man
May 25 22:58:21 <acydlord> indeed
May 25 22:58:53 <Macer> hm
May 25 23:03:22 <GAN8001> We just gotta co-opt maemo.org away from Nokia for Mer.
May 25 23:03:58 <johnx> GAN8001: maemo.org is controlled by the community
May 25 23:04:03 <Macer> sound the trumpets
May 25 23:04:34 <johnx> anyways, if the majority of the info on maemo.org is about mer stuff it will just kind of happen on its own
May 25 23:04:45 <GAN8001> johnx, right, which is why we're migrating it all to Mer. ;)
May 25 23:04:47 <johnx> until that point, maemo has a place I think :)
May 25 23:05:14 <johnx> eventually, instead of wiki.maemo.org/Mer we'll have wiki.maemo.org/oldMaemo :)
May 25 23:05:34 <GAN8001> I wish Nokia would just make a goddamn announcement already.
May 25 23:05:48 <GAN8001> I'm tired of changing my device expectations with each new tidbit.
May 25 23:05:55 <GAN8001> I want it settled one way or the other.
May 25 23:06:10 <Macer> wow. there really aren't that many good movies are there?
May 25 23:06:20 <Bobbe> lol
May 25 23:06:37 <Macer> i think i have like 50 movies.. and i've been lookign for something good and they all suck
May 25 23:06:45 <Bobbe> GAN8001, it feels they're just as confused as us
May 25 23:06:50 <lcuk> why dont you try getting movies from the 50s
May 25 23:06:54 <GAN8001> Macer, nah, you're just looking in the wrong place.
May 25 23:07:01 <Macer> GAN8001: the wrong place? :)
May 25 23:07:15 <GAN8001> Macer, i.e., genre, time period, whatever.
May 25 23:07:18 <Bobbe> Macer, name your top 3 kick-assest movies ever
May 25 23:07:38 <Macer> hm. fight club. snatch. 5th element
May 25 23:07:45 <mavhc> people who hated this movie might also hate...
May 25 23:07:48 <Bobbe> 5th element?
May 25 23:07:58 <GAN8001> Seen 12 Angry Men?
May 25 23:07:58 <Macer> oh yeah. i love 5th element :)
May 25 23:07:58 <Bobbe> lol mavhc
May 25 23:08:25 <Bobbe> Snatch and Fight Club are in my top three too
May 25 23:08:26 <mavhc> he likes movies with numbers in the title?
May 25 23:08:39 <mavhc> lock stock good, snatch boring
May 25 23:08:47 <Macer> snatch was probably the most funny thing i have every seen
May 25 23:08:58 <Macer> those 3 black dudes had me in tears
May 25 23:09:09 <Bobbe> the fatzo guy who saves their asses all the time
May 25 23:09:11 <Bobbe> "bets"
May 25 23:09:13 <Bobbe> "are"
May 25 23:09:14 <Bobbe> "off"
May 25 23:09:16 <Macer> lock stock was boring :)
May 25 23:09:19 <mavhc> maybe I just watched it when I was asleep, because it sent me to sleep
May 25 23:09:20 <Macer> Bobbe: yah :-D
May 25 23:09:23 <Macer> that was probably the best part
May 25 23:09:32 <qwerty12_N800> the fat one trying  to get in the car...
May 25 23:09:33 <GAN8001> Macer, how about L4yer Cake?
May 25 23:09:34 <Macer> where she takes his gun and shoots at him then sticks him in the security gate
May 25 23:09:42 <Macer> GAN8001: never saw it
May 25 23:09:44 <Bobbe> lol
May 25 23:09:46 <GAN8001> Do so.
May 25 23:10:01 <Macer> only good part on lock stock was the part where the girl on the couch comes out of nowhere and just starts letting loose with the machine gun
May 25 23:10:14 <johnx> chocolate was good. only thing I've seen recently
May 25 23:10:21 <Bobbe> I wanna watch cgi-loaded films which will add absolutely NOTHING to my life
May 25 23:10:27 <Bobbe> like the transformers sequel or something
May 25 23:10:37 <lcuk> terminator looks good
May 25 23:10:42 <Bobbe> yeap
May 25 23:10:53 <Macer> Bobbe: i thought that was the latest rambo movie
May 25 23:11:04 <Bobbe> Macer, lol
May 25 23:11:13 <Macer> the last rambo movie was good. same mindless killing and lies from 2 and 3
May 25 23:11:20 <Bobbe> how old is stallone now? 75?
May 25 23:11:23 <Macer> like when john j gets hit with a bullet while killing hundreds
May 25 23:11:28 <Macer> and just jumps right back up :)
May 25 23:11:40 <Macer> i don't think hollywood understands how much getting shot hurts
May 25 23:11:45 <Bobbe> dude
May 25 23:12:06 <Bobbe> there's this movie where the guy has a bullet hole and cauterizes it by BURNING POWDER ON IT.
May 25 23:12:10 <Bobbe> He goes like 'ungh'
May 25 23:12:16 <Macer> hell yeah haha
May 25 23:12:16 <Bobbe> and keeps going
May 25 23:12:31 <Macer> the best part of rambo was when he crawls through the mind field stabbing at the ground with his rambo k-bar
May 25 23:12:37 <Macer> and rips a land mine right up out the ground
May 25 23:12:38 <Macer> hahaha
May 25 23:12:49 <Bobbe> lmao
May 25 23:13:02 <Bobbe> man that's nothing
May 25 23:13:03 <Macer> omg i was crying .. we were watching that in iraq and couldn't stop laughing
May 25 23:13:41 <Bobbe> hey, one thing I always wanted to know
May 25 23:13:42 <Macer> or when the reservists don't want to go into the cave and were like "Screw that bob.. i just do this on the weekends!"
May 25 23:13:57 <Jaffa> Right, sleep time.
May 25 23:13:59 <Bobbe> the farenheit 9/11 thing where you guys hear bloodhound gang through your helmets. that true?
May 25 23:13:59 <Jaffa> tmo is a time sink
May 25 23:14:04 <GeneralAntilles> Shit hole
May 25 23:14:18 <Macer> Bobbe: uhm. what helmets?
May 25 23:14:19 <Macer> :)
May 25 23:14:33 <Jaffa> Although, all the Rover threads have made the community self-destruction threads fade in my mind :)
May 25 23:14:34 <lcuk> jaffa +irc
May 25 23:15:02 <Macer> i don't know. haven't seen the movie in a long time.. but when i flew on helos and military planes i didn't have a helmet
May 25 23:15:03 <Bobbe> he says that soldiers had audio streamed to their helmets through the tank or sth, playing music while they fought
May 25 23:15:10 <Jaffa> lcuk: IRC's more ignorable - once a tab goes bold, it stays bold (until it goes red & bold). tmo email notifications keep drawing me back in
May 25 23:15:10 <Macer> hahaha!
May 25 23:15:15 <Macer> maybe the army did :)
May 25 23:15:18 <Macer> i was in the USMC
May 25 23:15:25 <Bobbe> what's usmc?
May 25 23:15:27 <Macer> and i know we didn't have streaming audio haha
May 25 23:15:31 <jaska> united states muppet corps
May 25 23:15:32 <kfx> Macer: did I just hear you imply you don't wear your k-pot on patrol
May 25 23:15:36 <lcuk> jaffa, i have gmail and keep the browser closed unless i want stuffs
May 25 23:15:36 <kfx> this is going in your aar mister
May 25 23:15:37 <Macer> Marine Corps
May 25 23:15:42 <Macer> jaska: haha
May 25 23:15:43 <lcuk> none of this bug me whilst i work
May 25 23:15:48 <Bobbe> lol
May 25 23:15:49 <kkrusty> Macer: whats the difference?
May 25 23:15:50 <lcuk> apart from irc flashes annoyingly
May 25 23:15:50 <Macer> quiet you with your communist propaganda
May 25 23:16:01 <Bobbe> I just pictures Miss Piggy raging war in Iraq
May 25 23:16:04 <Bobbe> *pictured
May 25 23:16:04 <Macer> kkrusty: the army is weaker :)
May 25 23:16:08 <lcuk> but if it doesnt flash people and conversations are missed
May 25 23:16:10 <Macer> lol
May 25 23:16:20 <kfx> kkrusty: the marines are more delusional
May 25 23:16:32 <Macer> lol... kfx maybe.. but the army was horrible
May 25 23:16:47 * kfx already took part in a distro war in #maemo today; next up: military in-fighting
May 25 23:16:53 <Macer> i was watching army recruits at ft gordan one day and it was like.. wtf?
May 25 23:16:58 <kfx> Macer: I was a cav scout for a long time :)
May 25 23:17:05 <kfx> dude, ft gordon is signal crap
May 25 23:17:06 <Macer> the drill sgt took them to chow.. and gave them 45 mins to eat?
May 25 23:17:07 <Macer> wtf?
May 25 23:17:12 <jaska> i bet the locals would like fighting a pig (ms. piggy)
May 25 23:17:17 <kfx> ---> signal corps <---
May 25 23:17:23 <Macer> kfx: i know. i had to go there to train on sat comm :)
May 25 23:17:32 <Bobbe> and lose, since they would probably send a suicide bomber to kill the pig
May 25 23:17:41 <kfx> you are on a base full of skinny soldiers with huge glasses and no-running profiles
May 25 23:17:41 <Macer> which was awesome because the first time in iraq i got to hang out at al asad
May 25 23:17:45 <Bobbe> there are more pigs than suicide bombers in the world, I guess
May 25 23:17:47 <Macer> lol!
May 25 23:17:51 <Macer> well. that explains it
May 25 23:17:58 <Macer> they couldn't drill that well either
May 25 23:18:02 <kfx> no, they can't
May 25 23:18:12 <kfx> the army tries really hard to baby the tech guys
May 25 23:18:19 <Macer> 2nd time i got attached to the meu. then to a grunt unit.. and was running around dodging shit with a radio on my back
May 25 23:18:20 <kfx> because otherwise the tech guys would all join the air force
May 25 23:18:22 <Macer> wow did that suck :)
May 25 23:18:35 * kfx <3 his bradley
May 25 23:18:37 <Macer> why is it they can't come up with something that doesn't have a 20ft antenna?
May 25 23:18:40 <Macer> kfx: !
May 25 23:18:44 <Macer> i rode in one
May 25 23:18:51 <kfx> *plink* *plink* aw, are they shooting at us again?
May 25 23:18:59 <kfx> *wham* no, they're done now
May 25 23:19:01 <Macer> some army cats gave us a ride into ramadi
May 25 23:19:16 <Macer> the damn back of it was horrible
May 25 23:19:20 <Macer> i'm 6'3
May 25 23:19:24 <kfx> welcome to the club
May 25 23:19:27 <kfx> I'm 6'5"
May 25 23:19:28 <Macer> so i had to keep my neck to the side the entire time haha
May 25 23:19:31 <kfx> the whole thing is horrible
May 25 23:19:42 <Macer> because the ceiling was like... so damn low
May 25 23:19:46 <kfx> until you realize that outside the wire, a giant armored box isn't a bad place to be
May 25 23:19:58 <Macer> kfx: depends on what you roll over
May 25 23:20:09 <Macer> i loved the army had that ied thing that used to roll around getting blasted
May 25 23:20:16 <kfx> when I drove them I had to take a plasma cutter to the seat and "fix" it so I could fit
May 25 23:20:23 <Macer> one guy got hit like 10 times in 1 night hahah
May 25 23:20:30 <kfx> Macer: which one?  the giant chainwhip thing?
May 25 23:20:41 <Macer> it looked more like a digger
May 25 23:20:54 <kfx> oh ok
May 25 23:20:56 <Macer> it had some attachment on the front of it that would get blown up
May 25 23:21:04 <kfx> yeah those make better minesweepers than the five-ton trucks
May 25 23:21:06 <Macer> over and over :) it was funny
May 25 23:21:23 <Macer> the guy would get hit.. then just kind of keep on rolling haha
May 25 23:21:31 <kfx> let me tell you
May 25 23:21:40 <Macer> ramadi was pretty bad
May 25 23:21:45 <kfx> the guys who drive those are either article 15 cases or else very weird people
May 25 23:21:51 <Macer> hahaha
May 25 23:21:54 <Macer> i'd hope so
May 25 23:21:59 <Macer> anybody in eod has to be nuts
May 25 23:21:59 <kfx> one of the guys in my bradley unit voluntarily transferred to drive one of those things
May 25 23:22:09 <kfx> he was a profoundly strange individual
May 25 23:22:29 <kfx> I never went to iraq; I hung out in kabul mostly
May 25 23:22:43 <Macer> we had a guy on the roof manning a 50cal and we set up a sandbag post with some half broken balistic glass in front of it
May 25 23:22:49 <kfx> hahahah
May 25 23:22:50 <Macer> and the guy took a shot right in front of his face :)
May 25 23:22:51 <Macer> hahahha
May 25 23:23:05 <Macer> i mean like the glass spidered right in front of his forehead hhahaa
May 25 23:23:11 <kfx> lmao
May 25 23:23:23 <Macer> i told him i would be on the 5th page of the thank you letter to the company that makes the glass :)
May 25 23:23:26 <kfx> "congratulations on living now go guard the gate"
May 25 23:23:55 <Macer> we were fucking with him pretty bad after that because he started tracing an entire building trying to get the guy with a 50 cal
May 25 23:24:11 <kfx> ahahahahah
May 25 23:24:14 <Macer> i don't think he understood those rounds were probably going through 3 city blocks
May 25 23:24:17 <Macer> :)
May 25 23:24:20 <Macer> hahaha
May 25 23:24:47 <Macer> and you know how a 50 cal sounds like a damn grenade going off when you're enclosed in a building
May 25 23:25:10 <kfx> you'd think that'd be enough to get someone to stop him from wailing on it
May 25 23:25:10 <Bobbe> how many ppl are still in iraq now?
May 25 23:25:14 <Macer> so we were all in there half deaf.. and in between pauses he would scream "i could see him!" bam bam bam
May 25 23:25:19 <Macer> "there he is" bam bam bam
May 25 23:25:20 <Macer> hahahah
May 25 23:25:22 <kfx> aaahahahahah
May 25 23:25:43 <Macer> i mean it sucked at the time but afterwards it was pretty funny :)
May 25 23:26:05 <Macer> i asked him if he saw the flash of white light telling him it wasn't his time
May 25 23:26:22 <kfx> couldn't see it through the muzzle flash
May 25 23:26:34 <Macer> damn we were just wrong :)
May 25 23:26:50 <amr> we need a spotify client! :D
May 25 23:26:57 <Macer> we had to go house sweeping one night and some dude tried to shoot the door open with a shotgun and before i got a chance to tell him it was too late.
May 25 23:27:03 <Macer> he shrapneled his own foot :)
May 25 23:27:10 <kfx> XD
May 25 23:27:35 <kfx> there was some reservist on gate guard at camp phoenix with no magazine in his rifle
May 25 23:27:52 <Macer> lol
May 25 23:28:01 <kfx> my xo hired three locals to rush the guy and take his weapon
May 25 23:28:12 <Macer> HAHHAHA!!
May 25 23:28:21 <Macer> that's just wrong :)
May 25 23:28:34 <kfx> one of them brought the rifle back to the lieutenant and the other two just sat on the reservist until we got there
May 25 23:28:35 <Macer> one night we had to house sweep and came across a house with a huge steel door on it
May 25 23:29:05 <Macer> we knocked.. tried to bust it open. tried shooting it open.. and it wouldn't budge and the fuckers wouldn't answer.. so we blew it up and this woman got totally shrapneled
May 25 23:29:33 <Macer> the funny part was that we couldn't get a medevac for her because there were ieds everywhere so 3 fuckers had to carry her and she was a whale
May 25 23:29:47 <Macer> my buddy was the guy that films stuff.. the cameraman
May 25 23:29:50 <kfx> ouch
May 25 23:29:56 <lcuk> :S
May 25 23:30:01 <Macer> so they're carrying her for a whole click
May 25 23:30:09 <Macer> while he's filming and then they all bust out laughing
May 25 23:30:13 <Macer> "damn dude. you dropped her"
May 25 23:30:35 <Macer> amazing what you find funny in iraq
May 25 23:30:41 <Bobbe> lmao
May 25 23:31:02 <Bobbe> I know it's wrong, but I find that perfectly amusing meself ;P
May 25 23:31:04 <Macer> i used to love it when the new guys would come in... and they were so scary
May 25 23:31:21 <Macer> and they got hit with rockets and we're just sitting around eating ramen noodles while they're running around like the world was ending
May 25 23:31:25 <kfx> you can tell the new guys because they scramble when they hear mortars
May 25 23:31:26 <Bobbe> Macer, how did u guys communicate with the locals?
May 25 23:31:30 <Macer> kfx: yeah hahaha
May 25 23:31:47 <Macer> kfx: ever see someone jump under the plastic chow hall table?
May 25 23:31:50 <Macer> :)
May 25 23:31:53 <kfx> Bobbe: dunno about iraq but we had native interpreters
May 25 23:31:58 <kfx> Macer: hahaha yeah or their cots
May 25 23:32:07 <Macer> yup :) that shit would make me die laughing
May 25 23:32:11 <Bobbe> kfx, during house sweeping?
May 25 23:32:21 <kfx> nothing funnier than twenty guys in a gp medium hiding from mortars under cots
May 25 23:32:21 <Macer> especially when we were at the forward post
May 25 23:32:31 <Macer> with the hooches that were surrounded by huge hesco barriers
May 25 23:32:36 <kfx> Bobbe: I wasn't a door-kicker, I dunno how they handled that
May 25 23:32:47 <Macer> Bobbe: ye
May 25 23:32:49 <Macer> yes
May 25 23:32:53 <kfx> Macer: did iraqis make houses out of conexes too?
May 25 23:32:56 <Macer> we had a translator
May 25 23:33:05 <Macer> conexes?
May 25 23:33:15 <Macer> the metal shipping boxes?
May 25 23:33:20 <kfx> yeah
May 25 23:33:27 <Macer> we had a different nme for them but i can't remember
May 25 23:33:28 <Bobbe> man, that must have been bizarre. This guy shoots his way into your place and you keep having to wait for somebody to translate
May 25 23:33:29 <Macer> but yes :)
May 25 23:33:31 <Macer> some of them did
May 25 23:33:32 <kfx> afghanis would stack those things like legos and cut doors and windows in them
May 25 23:33:43 <Macer> Bobbe: we lost ours once
May 25 23:33:54 <Macer> fucker couldn't get his piece of crap ak47 working when we were stepping off
May 25 23:34:03 <Macer> and he got lost :)
May 25 23:34:04 <Macer> hahaha
May 25 23:34:11 <mavhc> put a google datacentre container in the middle of the pile for heat and youtube
May 25 23:34:11 <kfx> I could get by some without a terp because I speak a little russian
May 25 23:34:12 <Macer> another platoon picked him up though
May 25 23:34:25 <Bobbe> ow
May 25 23:34:37 <Bobbe> when you say we lost one you mean you didn't know where he was
May 25 23:34:40 <kfx> but I don't think as many iraqis speak russian as afhgans do
May 25 23:34:51 <kkrusty> kfx: probably arabic
May 25 23:34:53 <Macer> Bobbe: yeah. he got lost. another platoon picked him up. we were on a time schedule
May 25 23:35:02 <Bobbe> geez
May 25 23:35:02 <Macer> and didn't care too much for the guy who can translate :)
May 25 23:35:03 <Macer> haha
May 25 23:35:18 * Bobbe is a translator, thankuverymuch
May 25 23:35:22 <Macer> lol
May 25 23:35:27 <Bobbe> I'm glad to know you'd let me die out there
May 25 23:35:27 <kkrusty> kfx: afghans speak russian? neat
May 25 23:35:43 <Macer> Bobbe: well.. if you were an american translator we probably wouldn't have left you
May 25 23:35:47 <kfx> kkrusty: the russians occupied them for roughly a billion years
May 25 23:35:49 <Bobbe> kkrusty, probably part of the 'lets-be-happy-and-overthrow-america' plan of the 80s
May 25 23:35:50 <Macer> but we didn't care much for the iraqi translator
May 25 23:36:04 <kfx> afghanistan was like russia's vietnam
May 25 23:36:10 <Macer> especially when one day their platoon didn't do a patrol because they didn't get paid on time
May 25 23:36:11 <Bobbe> Macer, I get it
May 25 23:36:22 <kfx> a native terp can survive on his own, an american terp would probably die
May 25 23:36:29 <kkrusty> kfx: have you ever went close to the border with Pakistan?
May 25 23:36:30 <Macer> that's like the US Army saying "No. we are on strike"
May 25 23:36:35 <Macer> lol
May 25 23:36:48 <Macer> kfx: naw. actually they would murder the iraqi one
May 25 23:37:08 <Macer> but we wouldn't have let an american die out there :) or left him
May 25 23:37:13 <Bobbe> Macer, it just wasn't personal for them I guess. Also accounts for why casualties on outsourced forces were higher, usually
May 25 23:37:15 <kfx> kkrusty: not really
May 25 23:37:18 <kfx> I was mostly in kabul
May 25 23:37:36 <Macer> Bobbe: they had a post in the middle of the city one day and got shot at by a sniper and just started shooting everywhere
May 25 23:37:51 <Macer> like they went into a 360 and just shot at everything. they were absolutely horrible
May 25 23:37:59 <rm_you> johnx: http://flux.myvnc.com/get_poi.php
May 25 23:38:02 <rm_you> johnx: ?
May 25 23:38:04 <Bobbe> how much training did they have?
May 25 23:38:08 <kkrusty> kfx: what are the general sentiments about Pak in there?
May 25 23:38:08 <kfx> I had a much better time working for blackwater than I did working for the army
May 25 23:38:13 <Macer> Bobbe: enough to get them out there
May 25 23:38:14 <johnx> rm_you: looking
May 25 23:38:17 <Macer> very little
May 25 23:38:24 <kfx> kkrusty: I don't think there are any
May 25 23:38:26 <johnx> looks very cool, did that actually come from an upload? or is it a sample?
May 25 23:38:31 <Macer> i think they had guys training for 2-4 weeks and that was it
May 25 23:38:37 <Macer> and most of them only did it for a paycheck
May 25 23:38:38 <kfx> afghanistan isn't what you'd call a homongenous nation
May 25 23:38:38 <Bobbe> how about u guys
May 25 23:38:44 <rm_you> johnx: came from DB
May 25 23:38:47 <rm_you> johnx: it's done
May 25 23:38:51 <rm_you> if that is acceptable
May 25 23:39:04 <Macer> Bobbe: Marines trainf or 3 months for boot camp.. then depending on what you do... maybe another 2-3 afterwards
May 25 23:39:04 <kkrusty> kfx: Im just thinking that whatever happens there ends up getting blamed on Pak.
May 25 23:39:09 * kkrusty is from Pak
May 25 23:39:23 <Macer> and if you have an advanced specialty .. even longer
May 25 23:39:26 <rm_you> johnx: the upload app isn't actually doing the uploads yet, but the url for that is pretty much done too, just gotta implement libcurl
May 25 23:39:30 <kfx> kkrusty: mostly whatever happens there gets blamed on whoever happens to be standing nearby at the time
May 25 23:39:35 <Macer> i think the army is 9 weeks
May 25 23:39:51 <kfx> yeah army is 9 weeks
May 25 23:40:13 <Macer> kfx: does the army get liberty during their basic ?
May 25 23:40:16 <kfx> subsequent trainig in the army varies from two/three weeks (mortarman lmao) to well over two years (for a linguist or something)
May 25 23:40:18 <johnx> rm_you: I think it looks good, but I'm in over my head by a little :)
May 25 23:40:19 <kfx> Macer: no
May 25 23:40:28 <rm_you> anyone here who actually works on jabber/xml/geolocation/whatever want to tell me if that's ACTUALLY what my xml is supposed to look like? :P (http://flux.myvnc.com/get_poi.php)
May 25 23:40:30 <Macer> i thought you guys get weekends :)
May 25 23:40:33 <kfx> nope
May 25 23:40:47 <rm_you> johnx: lol well when i finish the upload app ima take a break for a bit and then i can help you
May 25 23:40:49 <kfx> if your AIT is longer than like six months you start getting weekends then
May 25 23:41:03 <Macer> did you have to fill out the pre made letter when you got there?
May 25 23:41:14 <Bobbe> I see
May 25 23:41:16 <Macer> we had drill instructors screaming at us telling us what to write haha
May 25 23:41:30 <kfx> nope, I never did
May 25 23:41:35 <Macer> "Dear _enter name here_, I have arrived and am in good health..."
May 25 23:41:37 <rm_you> johnx: is it just the C++ that's giving you issues?
May 25 23:41:38 <Macer> hahaha it was a riot
May 25 23:41:40 <kfx> yeah
May 25 23:41:43 <Bobbe> the outsourced guys were like the Chef in the South Park movie
May 25 23:41:57 <Macer> Bobbe: believe it or not. the best chow halls are in iraq :)
May 25 23:42:07 <Macer> there was one that was like eating at denny's every day
May 25 23:42:11 <johnx> rm_you: I've been working on the start-hildon run-parts thing still
May 25 23:42:18 <kfx> I disagree
May 25 23:42:20 <johnx> and also slacking off :>
May 25 23:42:25 <kfx> the best chow halls are on blackwater qrf bases :)
May 25 23:42:30 <Bobbe> lol
May 25 23:42:36 <Macer> kfx: usaf :)
May 25 23:42:44 <kfx> oh, yeah
May 25 23:42:44 <Macer> they had chow halls where you order at the table
May 25 23:42:45 <Macer> hahaha
May 25 23:42:55 <kfx> there's something surreal about eating pork chops in a muslim nation
May 25 23:42:58 <Macer> and someone picks up your stuff for you that you leave there
May 25 23:43:09 <Bobbe> chow hall is the term for all forces, or just USMC?
May 25 23:43:09 <kfx> freaking air force
May 25 23:43:14 <Macer> kfx: i had to go eat an an air force base and had no idea
May 25 23:43:27 <Macer> i picked my stuff up and was walking around for 5 minutes trying to figure out where to put the stuff
May 25 23:43:40 <Macer> until some airman said "Sergeant.. what are you doing?"
May 25 23:43:51 <Macer> "I'm looking for the place to put this stuff."
May 25 23:43:56 <kfx> on ft gordon we weren't allowed to call cadence marching past af barracks (they call them 'dorms') because we were waking them up
May 25 23:44:00 <Macer> "No Sergeant..... just leave it. Someone comes and gets it."
May 25 23:44:03 <kfx> hahahah
May 25 23:44:07 <Macer> kfx: ! us too!!
May 25 23:44:21 <Macer> hahaha we were up at like 5am running and screaming and a drill sgt told our CO to shut up
May 25 23:44:24 <kfx> most ridiculous thing I ever heard in the military
May 25 23:44:26 <kfx> yeah
May 25 23:44:28 <Macer> hahahah i guess he didn't realize a major was running us
May 25 23:44:31 <Bobbe> lmao
May 25 23:44:42 <Macer> so he told us to scream louder :)
May 25 23:44:43 <Macer> hahahahah
May 25 23:44:45 <Bobbe> "Shut up, soldiers! Captain needs his beauty sleep!"
May 25 23:44:55 <Macer> that shit was idiotic
May 25 23:45:00 <rm_you> johnx: ah ok then, i did a bit of the slacking this morning too, and going to return to it some tonight :)
May 25 23:45:00 <kfx> we'd make sure to be marching past at like 7:01 or whenever they were 'awake' so we could scream our heads off
May 25 23:45:26 <kfx> also we used to start fights in mess halls and tell the mps we were usaf
May 25 23:45:28 <Macer> ft gordan was great over by the marine attachment
May 25 23:45:36 <Bobbe> brb
May 25 23:45:42 <kfx> augusta is a terrible town
May 25 23:45:55 <Macer> and the class was a joke.. we would get off at noon and be drunk by 1230 :)
May 25 23:45:58 <kfx> hahah
May 25 23:46:07 <kfx> barton field
May 25 23:46:11 <Macer> and i think the army guys weren't allowed to look at us or something
May 25 23:46:20 <kfx> I think you could land a plane in barton field
May 25 23:46:23 <Macer> because they always seemed to turn away when we were exiting :) it was wierd
May 25 23:46:31 <kfx> Macer: 90% of the army guys on that base were ait kids
May 25 23:46:43 <kfx> they were probably just terrified of strangers
May 25 23:46:47 <Macer> wtf is ait? :)
May 25 23:46:55 <kfx> advanced individual training
May 25 23:46:59 <Macer> infantry training?
May 25 23:47:00 <kfx> job training after basic
May 25 23:47:01 <Macer> oh
May 25 23:47:06 <Macer> oh.. mos
May 25 23:47:09 <kfx> dunno what marines call it
May 25 23:47:13 <kfx> yeah it's where you learn your mos
May 25 23:47:36 <Macer> they had like
May 25 23:47:41 <Macer> little gold chevrons on their pockets
May 25 23:47:50 <kfx> no idea
May 25 23:47:55 <kfx> that might be rotc crap or something
May 25 23:47:55 <Macer> :) i think the worst part of the army is that you guys use those patches for rank
May 25 23:48:00 <mavhc> so how realistic was Generation Kill?
May 25 23:48:08 <kfx> no idea what generation kill is
May 25 23:48:12 <Macer> me neither
May 25 23:48:21 <Macer> it was hard to tell who the officers were :)
May 25 23:48:27 <kfx> Macer: we don't any more!  now the patches are velcroed to their chests
May 25 23:48:39 <Macer> and you have like. different patches on each collar
May 25 23:48:39 <kfx> which made it hard to check rank on female soldiers without getting an equal opportunity complaint
May 25 23:48:46 <Macer> for officers.. wtf was that about? :)
May 25 23:48:55 <kfx> patch for rank, one for branch
May 25 23:49:03 <Macer> branch?
May 25 23:49:07 <kfx> so you could tell the admin pukes and not accidentally listen to or respect them
May 25 23:49:13 <Macer> hahahahah!
May 25 23:49:15 <kfx> infantry, cavalry, aviation, hq, etc
May 25 23:49:39 <Macer> i think the funniest thing at ft gordan was that when we eat we put our covers on the table
May 25 23:49:42 <kfx> they only wear them on class a and b uniforms now though
May 25 23:49:53 <Macer> and some sgt first class said "I KNOW MARINES DON'T EAT WITH THEIR HEADGEAR ON THE TABLE!"
May 25 23:50:01 <kfx> hahaha hwhat
May 25 23:50:05 <Macer> and i was like.. "Uhm. Sorry Sergeant First Class... but we do."
May 25 23:50:09 <kfx> I never ran into that crap
May 25 23:50:11 <Macer> lol
May 25 23:50:12 <kfx> yeah that's what I would have said
May 25 23:50:21 <jaem_N810> hey folks
May 25 23:50:24 <Macer> they had "Headgear racks"
May 25 23:50:26 <Macer> :-D
May 25 23:50:28 <Macer> wtf?
May 25 23:50:30 <kfx> what the hell
May 25 23:50:33 <kfx> never saw that
May 25 23:50:35 <Macer> i know! that's what i said!
May 25 23:50:48 <Macer> we had a USAF instructor too
May 25 23:50:52 <jaem_N810> has anyone gotten qtnx working without massive amounts of corruption?
May 25 23:50:53 <Macer> tech sergeant earl
May 25 23:50:57 <Macer> lol
May 25 23:51:04 <Macer> he called his cover a hat and his blouse a jacket :)
May 25 23:51:04 <kfx> tech sergeant
May 25 23:51:09 <kfx> that's like e6 or something right
May 25 23:51:14 <Macer> i think
May 25 23:51:17 <Macer> e6 or e7
May 25 23:51:22 <kfx> yeah I called my cover a hat too
May 25 23:51:30 <kfx> I could never take that crap seriously
May 25 23:51:34 <Macer> if we called our cover a hat we would get thrashed
May 25 23:51:39 <kfx> I also refer to m16s and m4s "guns"
May 25 23:51:50 <Macer> lol.. that's another one we would get thrashed for
May 25 23:51:57 <kfx> because if it fires a damn bullet with gunpowder it's a gun ok :)
May 25 23:52:01 <Macer> hahaa
May 25 23:52:12 <Macer> we had to call a rifle or pistol a weapon or rifle or pistol
May 25 23:52:18 <kfx> oh, I got in trouble for it all the time
May 25 23:52:24 <kfx> counseling statement after counseling statement
May 25 23:52:26 <kfx> didn't care
May 25 23:52:48 <Macer> kfx: well. in the USMC doing stuff like that over and over.. they would make your life miserable so it was alwasy best to just do it
May 25 23:52:55 <Macer> like wearing a seat belt :)
May 25 23:52:55 <kfx> "you need to call your headgear 'cover' or 'headgear'"
May 25 23:53:03 <kfx> "are you going to give me an article 15 about it?"
May 25 23:53:05 <kfx> "of course not"
May 25 23:53:11 <kfx> "okay then, give me my hat back"
May 25 23:53:21 <Macer> we got yelled at for not saluting indoors!
May 25 23:53:23 <Macer> :)
May 25 23:53:26 <kfx> hahaha what
May 25 23:53:28 <Macer> army salutes indoors i guess
May 25 23:53:32 <Macer> lol
May 25 23:53:34 <kfx> no, they don't
May 25 23:53:42 <kfx> only time you salute indoors is when you're reporting for pay
May 25 23:53:45 <kfx> which nobody does, ever
May 25 23:53:52 <kfx> because of direct deposit
May 25 23:53:55 <Macer> well. some butterbar told us that crap
May 25 23:53:56 <kfx> I think someone was screwing with you
May 25 23:54:00 <Macer> :)
May 25 23:54:00 <kfx> oh a butterbar
May 25 23:54:02 <rm_you> lol
May 25 23:54:06 <kfx> he was just a moron then
May 25 23:54:16 <Macer> sure was
May 25 23:54:20 <Bobbe> wth is a butterbar?
May 25 23:54:23 <Macer> our capt was there
May 25 23:54:27 <Macer> and started yelling at him
May 25 23:54:28 <Macer> hahahah
May 25 23:54:32 <kfx> my commander used to call our butterbar 'temp to hire'
May 25 23:54:43 <Macer> "You ever tell my Marines what they should and shouldn't do then I'm going to let them fuck you up!"
May 25 23:54:51 <Macer> that shit was a riot
May 25 23:55:00 <kfx> Bobbe: 1st lieutenant
May 25 23:55:05 <kfx> lowest officer rank there is
May 25 23:55:11 <jaem_N810> can someone with Tear/Midori installed do me a quick favour?
May 25 23:55:12 <kfx> a private with too much brasso and not enough basic
May 25 23:55:27 <Macer> good times :)
May 25 23:55:32 <Macer> if i didn't have my son i would have stayed in
May 25 23:55:33 <Bobbe> jaem_N810, I don't have but I can install it. just a sec
May 25 23:55:38 <jaem_N810> sure, thanks
May 25 23:55:44 <Bobbe> kfx, thx. Urban Dictionary had it too
May 25 23:55:46 <Macer> especially after i went on a float and did all the things i thought the recruiter lied to me about
May 25 23:55:54 <Macer> lol
May 25 23:56:07 <Macer> got to do the whole see the world thing right before goign to iraq the 2nd time and getting extended twice
May 25 23:56:18 <jaem_N810> the Telus accounts website is having issues; knowing Telus, it's probably their fault, but...
May 25 23:56:40 <Macer> i think india was the worst country in existance.. what a disgusting place
May 25 23:57:18 <Bobbe> jaem_N810, what's qole's repo again? the one that has tear and dependencies?
May 25 23:57:25 <kfx> Macer: I'm the same way
May 25 23:57:33 <jaem_N810> it was at .maemobox.org
May 25 23:57:34 <kfx> when it came time to reup I found out my wife was pregnant
May 25 23:57:45 <jaem_N810> I think it's repo(sitory).qole.org now
May 25 23:57:50 <kfx> so I did one job with blackwater and got out of the whole game
May 25 23:58:20 <Bobbe> jaem_N810, distro?
May 25 23:58:20 <Macer> isn't blackwater a merc company?
May 25 23:58:25 <kfx> yeah
May 25 23:58:26 <Macer> :)
May 25 23:58:32 <Macer> how is that out f the whole game?
May 25 23:58:34 <kfx> they're called 'xe' now because of all the lawsuits
May 25 23:58:48 <kfx> no I got out of the game after the blackwater deal
May 25 23:58:51 <jaem_N810> Bobbe: ...Maemo?
May 25 23:58:54 <jaem_N810> not Mer
May 25 23:58:56 <Macer> oh
May 25 23:59:26 <Macer> ah well... i'm off to grab some food.. was nice talking to you
May 25 23:59:37 <Bobbe> jaem_N810, got it
May 25 23:59:40 <Bobbe> just a sec
May 25 23:59:50 <jaem_N810> okay
May 26 00:00:34 <jaem_N810> when you're ready, go to http://mytelusmobility.com/ , click " British Columbia", and see if the login page redirects you back to the region chooser
May 26 00:00:50 <Bobbe> Macer, the war may have been for bizarre reasons or not, but I do respect the ppl who put their lives in front of the bullets, man.
May 26 00:01:03 <Bobbe> jaem_N810, OK. taking forever to update the repos, kinda weird
May 26 00:07:36 <jaem_N810> Bobbe: how's it coming?
May 26 00:07:54 <Bobbe> jaem_N810, opening the page now
May 26 00:08:54 <Bobbe> it asked me to put my account info... and after 2 and 3 seconds later brought me back to the region chooser
May 26 00:10:11 <Bobbe> same thing has happened for any other place I chose, jaem_N810
May 26 00:10:37 <jaem_N810> okay, thanks
May 26 00:10:42 <jaem_N810> just wanted to make sure
May 26 00:10:47 <Bobbe> np
May 26 00:10:56 <jaem_N810> I was trying to pay my bills XD
May 26 00:11:18 <Bobbe> what's telus?
May 26 00:11:23 <jaem_N810> my laptop is boxed and waiting for the courier
May 26 00:11:51 <jaem_N810> telus?
May 26 00:11:53 <jaem_N810> hmm
May 26 00:11:59 * Bobbe brazilian
May 26 00:12:06 * jaem_N810 tries to think of something that wouldn't be considered libel
May 26 00:12:20 <jaem_N810> they're a cell phone provider
May 26 00:12:36 <Bobbe> lol
May 26 00:12:37 <jaem_N810> in that they provide (severely crippled) cell phones
May 26 00:12:47 <jaem_N810> not so much providing service, though
May 26 00:13:17 <jaem_N810> they gave me 60 "free" minutes last fall, because they dropped most of my calls
May 26 00:13:34 <jaem_N810> and tech support is worse than MS or HP
May 26 00:13:38 <jaem_N810> *far* worse
May 26 00:14:16 <Bobbe> jaem_N810, it open fine in chrome tho. u have a windows box nearby?
May 26 00:14:28 <Bobbe> *opens
May 26 00:14:28 <jaem_N810> Bobbe: I try not to ;)
May 26 00:14:52 <jaem_N810> The only box I have has no net access, due to wiring constraints
May 26 00:14:58 <Bobbe> so do I, but my 3g modem's a piece of crap no-go in Linux so far.
May 26 00:15:03 <Bobbe> you wanna vnc into mine?
May 26 00:15:36 <Bobbe> would it help?
May 26 00:16:15 <jaem_N810> well, thanks for the offer, and no offense, but paying bills on someone else's computer isn't very good security practice
May 26 00:16:17 <jaem_N810> lol
May 26 00:16:23 <Bobbe> makes sense
May 26 00:16:28 <jaem_N810> but thanks, though
May 26 00:16:31 <Bobbe> np
May 26 00:16:41 <jaem_N810> I was trying to use qtnx to get to my friend's box
May 26 00:16:48 <jaem_N810> but it has major corruption issue
May 26 00:16:54 <jaem_N810> issues*
May 26 00:17:59 <qwerty12_N800> get x11vnc running on the computer and use the vncviewer Maemo port
May 26 00:18:10 <jaem_N810> yeah, I could
May 26 00:18:28 <Bobbe> do you have a computer?
May 26 00:19:11 <jaem_N810> but at that point, going to the bank seems more convenient
May 26 00:19:24 <jaem_N810> Bobbe: 2x desktops with no Internet at the moment
May 26 00:19:30 <jaem_N810> and a borked laptop
May 26 00:19:34 <Bobbe> lol
May 26 00:19:36 <Bobbe> bizarre
May 26 00:19:42 <jaem_N810> and an N810
May 26 00:19:44 <Bobbe> the microb did the same thing the first time
May 26 00:19:51 <jaem_N810> only the first time?
May 26 00:20:03 <Bobbe> but if I tried loading http://www.telusmobility.com/en/BC/home/ again it worked
May 26 00:20:08 <jaem_N810> oh
May 26 00:20:09 <wazd> http://www.engadget.com/2009/05/25/nokia-next-gen-rover-tablet-unveiled/
May 26 00:20:11 <wazd> oh?
May 26 00:20:22 <Bobbe> no, if I just cliked on british it kept coming back
May 26 00:20:27 <Bobbe> but if I reloaded the page it worked
May 26 00:20:32 * jaem_N810 slaps himself with the try-the-obvious stick
May 26 00:21:21 <jaem_N810> thanks, Bobbe
May 26 00:21:30 <Bobbe> glad I helped =)
May 26 00:22:12 <Bobbe> which reminds me I have to pay my freaking phone bill
May 26 00:22:17 <wazd> wait, sidebar?!
May 26 00:22:22 <Bobbe> it's in my ex-gf's name
May 26 00:22:26 <wazd> noway, its fake
May 26 00:22:40 <jaem_N810> wazd: running Diablo? XD probably
May 26 00:22:52 <Bobbe> wazd, probably a mock-up, yeah, but the specs are apparently reliable
May 26 00:23:05 <wazd> jaem_N810: and no kickstand, fail
May 26 00:23:12 <jaem_N810> :O
May 26 00:23:15 <Bobbe> no one from Nokia denied them in itt at least
May 26 00:23:20 <jaem_N810> that would be a horrible thing
May 26 00:23:24 <jaem_N810> NOOO!
May 26 00:23:29 * jaem_N810 wants a kickstand
May 26 00:23:33 <wazd> Bobbe: it's 3 AM, c'mon :D
May 26 00:23:36 <qwerty12_N800> talk.maemo.org has a nice ppage on why it sucks
May 26 00:23:39 <jaem_N810> the N810 kickstand is awesmoe
May 26 00:23:41 <jaem_N810> hah
May 26 00:24:16 <Bobbe> I dunno about the kickstand, it wasn't in the mockup, but form factor is highly speculative atm
May 26 00:24:21 <Bobbe> the specs are more certain
May 26 00:24:30 <jaem_N810> it looks interesting, anyhow
May 26 00:24:36 <Bobbe> honestly enough, what killed my was flash 9.4 support only
May 26 00:24:48 <jaem_N810> have they given definitive word on the touchscreen tech?
May 26 00:24:59 <jaem_N810> capacitive would be a deal-breaker for me
May 26 00:25:02 <wazd> If only it will have same kickstand as n95 or something
May 26 00:25:07 <Bobbe> I mean, all the rest could change for the next maemo device. but if freemantle is not flash-10 enabled, then what, we'll have to wait for Harmattan?
May 26 00:25:24 <wazd> that will pop out from the camera place
May 26 00:25:42 <wazd> Bobbe: why so?
May 26 00:26:01 <wazd> Bobbe: Maemo is dynamicly updated system since diablo
May 26 00:26:23 <wazd> Bobbe: you even wouldn't have to reflash
May 26 00:26:46 <Bobbe> I know
May 26 00:28:51 <Bobbe> I just mean the speed of how updating is going. If this is a sign of how things are progressing...
May 26 00:28:53 <minra> could adobe stop making cpu thrashing crap please.  a god damn "pause" button would be nice
May 26 00:29:08 <Bobbe> but hey, I know nothing about coding. I could be utterly wrong here
May 26 00:29:19 <Bobbe> minra, lol pause where?
May 26 00:29:42 <minra> longtap on a flash element should pause it
May 26 00:29:53 <GAN8001> jaem_N810, kernel says resistive.
May 26 00:30:05 <zakkm> hey jaem :)
May 26 00:30:18 <jaem_N810> GAN8001: woot!
May 26 00:30:22 <jaem_N810> zakkm: hey
May 26 00:30:22 <Bobbe> minra, makes sense
May 26 00:30:43 <Bobbe> resistive is the one that works on pressure, capacitive's the one in the iphone, right?
May 26 00:30:50 <wazd> minra: in fact long tap = rightclick
May 26 00:31:00 <wazd> minra: everywhere in the system
May 26 00:31:10 <jaem_N810> Bobbe: yes
May 26 00:31:13 <zakkm> GAN8001: you try the new adium 1.4b4 that just came out like a hour ago, the irc is working alot nicer
May 26 00:31:14 <wazd> Bobbe: right
May 26 00:31:22 <jaem_N810> capacitive doesn't work as well with stylii
May 26 00:31:32 <jaem_N810> and you need a special stylus, at that
May 26 00:31:50 <zakkm> is the qtablet still around?
May 26 00:31:54 <zakkm> the nokia app
May 26 00:32:28 <wazd> btw I think that top part of that mockup is too thick, even n810 is thinner
May 26 00:32:31 <rm_you> anyone happen to know an easy way to get the wireless MAC in a C program?
May 26 00:33:06 <zakkm> can you run terminal commands in C?
May 26 00:34:02 <Bobbe> wazd, the dimensions seem to indicate a thicker device, I guess
May 26 00:34:38 <rm_you> yes, but parsing that crap is a PITA
May 26 00:34:41 <zakkm> that pic just looks like a n810.. covered cause they didnt want to show what it actually looked like
May 26 00:34:50 <zakkm> and then it doesnt show buttons and such that way too
May 26 00:35:00 <zakkm> but it shows its a slide out keyboard tablet.
May 26 00:35:02 <jaem_N810> hmm
May 26 00:35:14 <jaem_N810> so they claim it has 3G voice?
May 26 00:35:16 <jaem_N810> win!
May 26 00:35:18 <zakkm> thats not the tablet.. they just blanked out a 810 ..
May 26 00:35:32 <minra> lol
May 26 00:35:42 <minra> read
May 26 00:36:15 <minra> it is an artist's rendition - not nokia's
May 26 00:36:15 <Bobbe> http://wmpoweruser.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/05/htcfortresslg.jpg
May 26 00:36:23 <Bobbe> how cool would it be if it had this kb
May 26 00:37:04 <amr> i dont like the numpad
May 26 00:37:09 <jaem_N810> If it's subsidized by a cell carrier, I might just be able to afford it... :P
May 26 00:37:23 <Bobbe> I love the numpad on the side
May 26 00:37:34 <Bobbe> that's the most annoying part of typing on my e71
May 26 00:37:43 <Bobbe> i can even type the numbers without looking now, but it's cumbersome
May 26 00:38:12 <amr> speaking of tablets
May 26 00:38:16 <amr> time to read the internet on mine in bed
May 26 00:38:17 <amr> nn
May 26 00:38:22 <jaem_N810> night
May 26 00:38:41 <Bobbe> cya
May 26 00:39:10 <zakkm> heh
May 26 00:39:16 <wazd> http://devicegadget.ru/wp-content/uploads/2009/02/nokia-e75-05.jpg
May 26 00:39:19 <zakkm> my bro has a phone like that
May 26 00:39:24 <zakkm> the htc one
May 26 00:39:27 <wazd> even such a small device has a better keyboard
May 26 00:39:32 <jaem_N810> the battery capacity is terrible, though
May 26 00:39:49 <jaem_N810> 1320mAh? Seriously?!
May 26 00:39:55 <zakkm> lol
May 26 00:39:59 <zakkm> it depends on power consumption
May 26 00:40:04 <zakkm> and its a phone, may not even have wifi
May 26 00:40:18 <jaem_N810> yeah, but methinks omap3>omap2 for consumption
May 26 00:40:18 <zakkm> and you dont do massive cpu usage such like video playing
May 26 00:40:28 <jaem_N810> and it does have wifi, according to the article
May 26 00:40:38 <jaem_N810> it had darn well better have wifi
May 26 00:40:40 <jaem_N810> lol
May 26 00:41:39 <zakkm> omap3 is nice :)
May 26 00:42:13 <b-man16> indeed :)
May 26 00:42:16 <Bobbe> yeap
May 26 00:42:25 <Bobbe> it says 500-600mhz
May 26 00:42:34 <Bobbe> which one is it? or is it both?
May 26 00:42:51 <Bobbe> like it can be oc'ed like nokia did from the 770 to the 800?
May 26 00:43:00 <Bobbe> (at least from what i understood from itt)
May 26 00:43:35 <GAN8001> jaem_n810_afk, OMAP3 will be less than OMAP2 on average
May 26 00:43:38 <GAN8001> Smaller backlight, too.
May 26 00:43:56 <GAN8001> Bobbe, 600
May 26 00:44:59 <Bobbe> thanks GAN8001
May 26 00:45:25 <Bobbe> GAN8001, you didn't say what you thought (not that I've seen anyway). Are you buying it?
May 26 00:45:53 <GAN8001> Bobbe, I'm in a bad way re Maemo this week.
May 26 00:46:15 <GAN8001> There's looting and rioting on Talk
May 26 00:46:47 <GAN8001> 3.5" really doesn't suit my use case
May 26 00:46:50 <Bobbe> lmao, I've read it
May 26 00:47:03 <Bobbe> not all the 312
May 26 00:47:04 <Bobbe> I mean
May 26 00:47:11 <GAN8001> I'm feeling spiteful enough right now to want to buy it with a discount code and turn it around on ebay.
May 26 00:47:16 <Bobbe> 313 rants entirely, but I got the digest
May 26 00:47:20 <GAN8001> Open Letter thread.
May 26 00:47:24 <Bobbe> ah ok
May 26 00:48:53 <Proteous> maybe if we all complain and nash our teeth enough Nokia will scrap all their work and remake the device with a bigger screen
May 26 00:49:11 <Proteous> it could happen!
May 26 00:50:20 <GAN8001> Proteous, I just want a second device.
May 26 00:50:35 <Proteous> heh
May 26 00:50:52 <GAN8001> Movies, ebooks.
May 26 00:51:23 <Proteous> maybe all the leaked specs are wrong
May 26 00:51:31 <Proteous> and it will really be a 5.2in screen
May 26 00:51:34 <Proteous> !!
May 26 00:51:55 <GAN8001> Proteous, then I'll also be pissed.
May 26 00:52:10 <jaem_n810_afk> GAN8001: re: omap3... I didn't know that
May 26 00:52:12 <Proteous> it will come with a sewing kit and supplies to make a bigger pocket in your pants
May 26 00:52:27 <GAN8001> jaem_n810_afk, basically zero power at idle.
May 26 00:52:32 <GAN8001> jaem_n810_afk, race to idle, too.
May 26 00:52:35 <jaem_n810_afk> the screen and the battery are really the only things I'd complain about
May 26 00:52:37 <jaem_n810_afk> nice
May 26 00:52:49 <jaem_n810_afk> and they're not enough to deter me if I can afford it
May 26 00:53:10 <jaem_n810_afk> at least they kept it at WVGA
May 26 00:53:28 <jaem_n810_afk> if they'd lowered the resolution, it would have been a lot worse
May 26 00:55:41 <zakkm> anyone here know if qtablet still works well/how i could obtain?
May 26 00:56:01 <jaem_n810_afk> zakkm: I saw a recent-ish demo of it running on Mer
May 26 00:56:09 <jaem_n810_afk> but more than that, I can't say
May 26 00:56:51 <zakkm> thats amazing i want to try it
May 26 00:57:32 <Macer> man this hacked wii is awesome
May 26 00:57:40 <zakkm> hacked wii?
May 26 00:58:14 <Macer> yah
May 26 00:58:19 <Macer> put homebrew on it
May 26 00:58:25 <Macer> some of the games don't work
May 26 00:58:31 <Macer> but like 85% of them do
May 26 00:59:25 <Macer> like so far
May 26 00:59:31 <Macer> madworld and prince of persia don't play
May 26 01:05:16 <tonyyarusso> Anyone know how to install some variety of fdisk on an N810, or otherwise partition it?  My mom's managed to ship without the internal memory card formatted, so she only has the 250MB to work with.
May 26 01:06:08 <zakkm> tonyyarusso: you can use the builtin "format memory card"
May 26 01:06:20 <zakkm> ohh
May 26 01:06:27 <zakkm> tonyyarusso: you can do sfdisk? its already in maemo
May 26 01:06:38 * tonyyarusso looks
May 26 01:06:43 <zakkm> tonyyarusso: http://linux.die.net/man/8/sfdisk
May 26 01:06:52 <zakkm> its already on the tablet like installed
May 26 01:07:25 <zakkm> tonyyarusso: you can also get gparted in maemo?
May 26 01:08:01 <tonyyarusso> sfdisk would be fine if it's here - booting now
May 26 01:08:32 <zakkm> you can also get console-tools and it will have fdisk in it
May 26 01:09:44 <tonyyarusso> 'sfdisk' says "-sh: sfdisk: not found"
May 26 01:10:15 <Macer> wtf
May 26 01:10:25 <Macer> how does this sonc game go from hardcore anime cgi
May 26 01:10:31 <Macer> to some voiced still crap
May 26 01:10:48 <zakkm> tonyyarusso: did you run as root?
May 26 01:10:56 <zakkm> sfdisk requires root
May 26 01:10:59 <zakkm> i believe
May 26 01:11:49 <tonyyarusso> zakkm: trying to, but sudser is confusing me
May 26 01:11:55 <zakkm> sudser?
May 26 01:11:59 <zakkm> type "sudo gainroot"
May 26 01:12:40 <tonyyarusso> "cal_read_block(r&d_mode): size zero, block not found?  Enable RD mode to gain root privileges"
May 26 01:13:01 <zakkm> ah
May 26 01:13:05 <zakkm> do you have rootsh installed?
May 26 01:13:08 <zakkm> just type root
May 26 01:13:09 <tonyyarusso> no
May 26 01:13:22 <tonyyarusso> looking for those other options now
May 26 01:13:55 <zakkm> go into application manager and get rootsh or something ;p
May 26 01:14:14 <tonyyarusso> there we go
May 26 01:22:07 <tonyyarusso> wtf
May 26 01:22:21 <zakkm> ?
May 26 01:22:26 <tonyyarusso> After running that the keyboard no longer works, but the touchscreen does.
May 26 01:22:41 <tonyyarusso> partitioning, that is
May 26 01:23:11 <tonyyarusso> methinks I'm re-flashing this thing
May 26 01:23:27 <zakkm> heh
May 26 01:23:31 <zakkm> just reboot nokia
May 26 01:23:44 <tonyyarusso> I already rebooted.
May 26 01:23:47 <zakkm> tonyyarusso: the tablet has a "restore to factory settings" in control panel..
May 26 01:23:52 <zakkm> you dont actually have to reflash
May 26 01:23:54 <tonyyarusso> o rly?
May 26 01:23:56 * tonyyarusso tries
May 26 01:24:05 <zakkm> its in the menu of contrl panel
May 26 01:25:17 <tonyyarusso> I found it, but it's asking for a lock code, and we didn't set one.
May 26 01:25:33 <Firebird> what did you use to partition?
May 26 01:25:35 <zakkm> so try like 0000 0123 1234.?
May 26 01:26:17 <tonyyarusso> Firebird: sfdisk
May 26 01:26:32 <Firebird> eh, the file browser formatter didn't work?
May 26 01:26:41 <tonyyarusso> nope
May 26 01:26:46 <zakkm> what did the file browser one say?
May 26 01:26:53 <zakkm> you use the one in menu not "repair" button
May 26 01:26:56 <tonyyarusso> None of the usual lock codes work either - this must have been previously used and returned.
May 26 01:27:13 <zakkm> tonyyarusso: you know that right?
May 26 01:27:24 <zakkm> menu - tools - format memory card..
May 26 01:27:43 <tonyyarusso> zakkm: trying that also.
May 26 01:28:14 <tonyyarusso> zakkm: It seems like it's tries something for like three seconds and goes away, but it still shows up as corrupted.
May 26 01:28:34 <zakkm> from menu?
May 26 01:28:54 <tonyyarusso> yes
May 26 01:29:13 <zakkm> cant do over computer?
May 26 01:29:21 <tonyyarusso> over computer what?
May 26 01:29:26 <Firebird> try plugging it in (USB to computer) and using gparted on it
May 26 01:29:28 <zakkm> format sd card
May 26 01:29:30 <tonyyarusso> great, now xterm won't open either.
May 26 01:29:34 <Firebird> hmm
May 26 01:29:38 <tonyyarusso> Firebird: I already tried that - it wasn't detected.
May 26 01:29:42 <Firebird> ah
May 26 01:29:49 <zakkm> what OS on pc?
May 26 01:29:51 <tonyyarusso> Perhaps we should just send it back to Amazon?
May 26 01:29:54 <tonyyarusso> zakkm: Ubuntu
May 26 01:30:01 <Firebird> did it say, "internal memory in use" on the device after you plugged it in?
May 26 01:30:06 <zakkm> did you check /dev folder?
May 26 01:30:15 <tonyyarusso> Firebird: It didn't seem to say anything.
May 26 01:30:29 <tonyyarusso> zakkm: /dev/mmcblk0 exists, but /dev/mmcblk0p1 did not.
May 26 01:30:52 <Firebird> how about on your computer after plugging it in
May 26 01:31:04 <tonyyarusso> Firebird: what about on the computer?
May 26 01:31:09 <zakkm> forget nokia, just plug it into pc
May 26 01:31:20 <Firebird> plug in the device and see if anything appears in /dev or dmesg
May 26 01:31:29 <zakkm> tonyyarusso: you sure the write protection isnt turn on.. on the SD?
May 26 01:31:34 <zakkm> the little arrow thingy in corner
May 26 01:32:17 <Firebird> I thought we were talking about a N810
May 26 01:32:34 <zakkm> Firebird: his SD card wont format on the n810
May 26 01:32:50 <tonyyarusso> zakkm: It's an internal card....
May 26 01:32:54 <Firebird> ah, I thought by internal memory he meant the actual internal memory
May 26 01:33:06 <tonyyarusso> The internal 2GB thing.
May 26 01:33:11 <zakkm> oh
May 26 01:33:15 <Firebird> heh
May 26 01:33:22 <zakkm> what are you trying to do with it?
May 26 01:33:28 <oich> Hi, I'm trying to flash my n800 to upgrade the OS. I used the command line flasher from the command line on macosx, it printed messages saying it was transferign things and then said it was done. Tne n800 is sitting their with the nokia startup screen. Does it take a long time, or did I do something wrong?
May 26 01:33:44 <zakkm> oich: how long did you wait?
May 26 01:33:47 <Firebird> oich, did you make it reboot?
May 26 01:34:00 <oich> "make it reboot"? As in, turn it off?
May 26 01:34:08 <zakkm> oich: it should take like a minute, and then show progress bar and all
May 26 01:34:09 <Firebird> did you give the flasher the -R option?
May 26 01:34:24 <zakkm> oich: what was the command?
May 26 01:34:25 <oich> yes -F image -f -R. it's been about 10 minutes
May 26 01:34:29 <Firebird> hmm
May 26 01:34:40 <oich> ./flassher-2.0.macosx -F RX.....bin -f -R
May 26 01:34:44 <zakkm> oich: you should use 770 flasher
May 26 01:34:55 <zakkm> its what i use.. you just run the app , click on bin file.. and it does it
May 26 01:35:00 <tonyyarusso> When I connect it to the PC, dmesg tells me it's there as /dev/sde.  fdisk /dev/sde says "Unable to open /dev/sde"
May 26 01:35:19 <zakkm> oich: http://www.bleb.org/software/maemo/770Flasher-2.0.dmg
May 26 01:35:20 <Firebird> tonyyarusso, then the card might be really trashed
May 26 01:35:41 <zakkm> tonyyarusso: check dmesg
May 26 01:35:43 <tonyyarusso> Firebird: Okay, I'll just tell mom to have Amazon replace it then.  If neither I nor anywhere here can figure it out.... :S
May 26 01:35:48 <oich> zakkm if I turn the n800 off, is that going to cause a problem, since it was in the process of flashing, I assume?
May 26 01:36:04 <tonyyarusso> zakkm: I'm looking at it right now - everything looks normal.  "Attached SCSI removable disk, generic sg5 type 0"
May 26 01:36:06 <zakkm> oich: yeah, that would,
May 26 01:36:24 <zakkm> oich: download that, run it.. have nokia attached.. the program will ask for bin file.. select the 43-7
May 26 01:36:36 <zakkm> and let it go .. and just leave it plugged in and all
May 26 01:37:02 <zakkm> nokia will get flashed , reboot etc.. your get a menu asking questions... unplug nokia from pc.. and do it
May 26 01:37:12 <zakkm> (question asking = on nokia itself)
May 26 01:37:31 <oich> aren't I normally supposed to start with it turned off though. it's not going to cause a problem that it's on?
May 26 01:38:01 <Firebird> oich, just unplug it, not much you can do now
May 26 01:38:05 <Firebird> pull the battery
May 26 01:38:18 <Firebird> it should still flash
May 26 01:38:24 <zakkm> ...
May 26 01:38:28 <zakkm> you have nokia off
May 26 01:38:36 <zakkm> run program... select bin file.. plug in nokia
May 26 01:38:37 <Firebird> oich, actually, try booting before you flash
May 26 01:38:38 <zakkm> leave it
May 26 01:38:46 <oich> I have the battery unplugged already, as the instructions said
May 26 01:39:02 <Firebird> have you determined if the hanging flash was a failure yet?
May 26 01:39:08 <oich> no
May 26 01:39:48 <zakkm> why you unplugging battery
May 26 01:40:20 <oich> Battery charger. the instructions said unplug battery charger, turn off n800, run flasher, pluging usb. that's what I did
May 26 01:40:42 <zakkm> oich: listen.. have nokia turned off battery in... run 770flasher and select the bin file ... plug nokia by usb... turn nokia on if it didnt turn it on.. .LEAVE everything the way it is
May 26 01:40:48 <zakkm> let the computer/nokia do the magic on its own
May 26 01:40:54 <zakkm> wait like 5min while it does it
May 26 01:41:01 <zakkm> nokia will ask for questions... unplug from usb
May 26 01:41:03 <zakkm> and use nokia
May 26 01:41:11 <zakkm> no battery unplug, no nothing
May 26 01:41:13 <Firebird> zakkm, his tablet was frozen in the on state so he had to pull the battery to turn it off
May 26 01:41:29 <zakkm> ah ah
May 26 01:41:30 <oich> no, It's still on. the battery charger was already unplugged
May 26 01:41:37 <Firebird> or not...
May 26 01:42:02 <oich> so,.. I guess, I either turn it off to flash it, or I wait for the battery to die
May 26 01:42:26 <Firebird> just turn it off
May 26 01:42:51 <zakkm> oich: what tablet?
May 26 01:42:55 <oich> n800
May 26 01:42:58 <zakkm> ohh
May 26 01:43:04 <zakkm> k just unplug battery
May 26 01:43:08 <oich> The above url gets 404 not found
May 26 01:43:08 <zakkm> just take it out, and stick it back in
May 26 01:43:17 <oich> the actual battery?
May 26 01:43:25 <zakkm> yes
May 26 01:43:31 <zakkm> of course
May 26 01:43:39 <zakkm> when it says battery unplug, it means actual battery
May 26 01:43:51 <oich> no, it says battery charger, in the instructions
May 26 01:44:03 <Firebird> it says that to make sure its totally dead and off
May 26 01:45:05 <oich> ... if I'm going to turn it off, why take the battery out, instead of just pressing the off button?
May 26 01:45:23 <zakkm> cause it wont work
May 26 01:45:26 <zakkm> in most cases
May 26 01:45:39 <zakkm> off button relies on initfs, which you might not of got passed/cant
May 26 01:46:31 <oich> heh... it just rebooted after I unplugged the usb cable
May 26 01:48:38 <Firebird> nice
May 26 01:49:11 <oich> it's upgraded. The instructions say to unplug the usb after it reboots... I guess they mean, before it reboots
May 26 02:04:45 <Maior> can I just confirm, http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog/%23maemo.2009-02-26.log.html is fairly up to date with the described solution for kismet; specifically that there's no convenient application manager-y method of installing kismet, it'll involve (e.g.) red pill mode on an n810 or the like?
May 26 02:05:19 <zakkm> red pill mode isnt that difficult ;p
May 26 02:05:36 <Maior> correct
May 26 02:05:43 <zakkm> it could of changed by then though
May 26 02:05:58 <Maior> indeed, hence my asking
May 26 02:06:07 <zakkm> heh i dont actually know ;p
May 26 02:13:39 <luke-jr> Maior: Gentoo supports kismet :p
May 26 02:14:01 <zakkm> so does mer i bet ;p
May 26 02:14:15 <oich> I imagine this is a FAQ, but I'm not finding it. How do I get at files from an x terminal, that I can use then see in the os2008 file manager?
May 26 02:15:20 <ShadowJK> /media/mmc1 /media/mmc2 are the memory cards, /home/user/MyDocs has the "internal memory" stuff
May 26 02:15:45 <ShadowJK> /home/user/MyDocs/.documents .images .sounds .videos etc
May 26 02:16:06 <z4chh> yep ^^
May 26 02:16:40 <Maior> luke-jr: yes, but I don't fancy installing gentoo on this
May 26 02:17:45 <ShadowJK> I guess "after it reboots" means when it begins to reboot, as opposed to "after it has rebooted", which would mean that it has completed the boot part of reboot :)
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Tue May 26 02:59:57 2009