**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Mon Jun 01 02:59:57 2009
Jun 01 03:02:39 <Bobbe> morning
Jun 01 03:03:44 <b-man16> hello Bobbie
Jun 01 03:03:54 <b-man16> *Bobbe
Jun 01 03:04:05 <Bobbe> hey b-man
Jun 01 03:04:19 <Bobbe> did that sound like a doll name or was that just me?
Jun 01 03:04:46 <b-man16> b-man or Bobbe? XD
Jun 01 03:04:50 <Bobbe> lol
Jun 01 03:04:54 <Bobbe> "Bobbie"
Jun 01 03:04:55 <Bobbe> anyways
Jun 01 03:05:02 <Bobbe> I'm kinda flabbergasted at Google Wave
Jun 01 03:05:05 <Bobbe> u guys seen the demo?
Jun 01 03:05:42 <b-man16> i haven't yet, stskeeps might have though
Jun 01 03:06:13 <Bobbe> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v_UyVmITiYQ
Jun 01 03:06:23 <Bobbe> 1:20h of your time, worth every second
Jun 01 03:06:54 <luke-jr> um no
Jun 01 03:06:56 <luke-jr> it's Google
Jun 01 03:07:10 <luke-jr> they get about 30 seconds
Jun 01 03:07:27 <luke-jr> when have they ever done anything that wasn't crap?
Jun 01 03:07:51 <EdLin> luke-jr: www.google.com ?
Jun 01 03:07:52 <b-man16> luke-jr: why so negative tonight? XD
Jun 01 03:08:19 <luke-jr> EdLin: it sucks lately, since Google had to change their algorithms
Jun 01 03:08:28 <luke-jr> EdLin: try finding out what tokokyohi means with it
Jun 01 03:08:38 <luke-jr> b-man16: people bringing up crap a lot tonight?
Jun 01 03:08:57 <Bobbe> luke-jr, resist man. gps is coming
Jun 01 03:09:00 <Bobbe> hang in there
Jun 01 03:09:09 <luke-jr> Bobbe: it is?
Jun 01 03:09:16 <luke-jr> how do you know? <.<
Jun 01 03:09:26 <Bobbe> I don't, but I hope man
Jun 01 03:09:30 <luke-jr> you have no Nokia or TI hostmask XD
Jun 01 03:09:40 <Bobbe> that's what keeps me going
Jun 01 03:09:46 <luke-jr> heh
Jun 01 03:09:54 <Bobbe> I wake up everyday and I look at the mirror, I point at it and say "GPS IS COMING!"
Jun 01 03:12:41 <luke-jr> anyone want to start a new DE project?
Jun 01 03:13:33 <hub> luke-jr: GNOME?
Jun 01 03:13:51 <z4chh> luke-jr, ask lcuk ;p
Jun 01 03:16:59 <luke-jr> hub: GNOME is GTK, it doesn't count
Jun 01 03:17:14 <hub> GNOME != GTK
Jun 01 03:17:26 <luke-jr> you know of a non-GTK GNOME?
Jun 01 03:17:39 <hub> still does not make equality
Jun 01 03:17:42 <Bobbe> lol
Jun 01 03:17:44 <luke-jr> if libglib is a dependency, I want nothing to do with it
Jun 01 03:17:45 <kfx> yeah it's called kde
Jun 01 03:18:10 <luke-jr> kfx: in KDE's case, the MySQL dependency is killing it
Jun 01 03:18:14 <luke-jr> plus Plasma
Jun 01 03:18:23 <hub> luke-jr: CDE?
Jun 01 03:18:28 <kfx> plus a decade of bad design decisions and half-finished projects
Jun 01 03:18:30 <luke-jr> does CDE even exist anymore?
Jun 01 03:18:37 <kfx> still ships with solaris
Jun 01 03:18:49 <luke-jr> anyhow, I want something based on Qt4
Jun 01 03:18:49 <kfx> lots of radiation therapy software runs under openmotif or cde
Jun 01 03:18:52 <kfx> I have no idea why
Jun 01 03:19:05 <hub> kfx: legacy or Java/AWT
Jun 01 03:19:14 <kfx> new work but not java
Jun 01 03:19:40 <kfx> I think it's because there's a sunos certified platform for the electron gun?  dunno
Jun 01 03:21:51 <hub> no idea
Jun 01 03:22:16 <hub> luke-jr: your argument does not stand at all anyway
Jun 01 03:22:31 <luke-jr> what argument?
Jun 01 03:24:58 <cmug> What is GPS?
Jun 01 03:25:04 <cmug> that was referred to earlier
Jun 01 03:25:23 <cmug> (I know of the positioning system)
Jun 01 03:26:35 <hub> luke-jr: "glib"
Jun 01 03:29:12 <Bobbe> cmug, luke-jr wants Nokia to release control over the N810 gps core components
Jun 01 03:29:30 <luke-jr> hub: …
Jun 01 03:29:34 <cmug> Bobbe, ah ok. Sounded like it was some new device or something
Jun 01 03:29:59 <Bobbe> stskeeps1e says Nokia is right now working with Texas Instruments to release the core components for the 3d hardware acceleration drivers, irrc
Jun 01 03:30:10 <Bobbe> luke-jr says GPS is much more important than lame 3d drivers
Jun 01 03:30:20 <Bobbe> stskeeps1e disagreed
Jun 01 03:30:21 <hub> I'd rather the whole software stack being freed
Jun 01 03:30:25 <Bobbe> luke-jr disagreed further
Jun 01 03:30:27 <hub> including the media player
Jun 01 03:30:32 <cmug> :)
Jun 01 03:30:37 <Bobbe> stskeeps1e wanted to hit him with a shovel at times
Jun 01 03:30:37 <cmug> "All should be free"
Jun 01 03:30:46 <cmug> That is understandable
Jun 01 03:30:47 <Bobbe> it is always a blast to watch
Jun 01 03:30:50 <Bobbe> yeap
Jun 01 03:30:57 <Bobbe> I agree that it's understandable
Jun 01 03:31:04 <Bobbe> I also know that we don't live in Lintopia
Jun 01 03:31:06 <luke-jr> 3D would be new
Jun 01 03:31:14 <Bobbe> 3D would be cool, probably
Jun 01 03:31:22 <luke-jr> my argument is that the current features should get higher priority than new stuff
Jun 01 03:31:45 <Bobbe> why?
Jun 01 03:43:56 <ShadowJK> 3d drivers would not be open anyway ;)
Jun 01 03:46:57 <Bobbe> true
Jun 01 03:47:02 <Bobbe> honestly I'd be happy with the binaries
Jun 01 03:55:36 <hub> but the tablet does not have 3D GPU
Jun 01 03:55:37 <hub> does it?
Jun 01 03:56:38 <luke-jr> ShadowJK: if not, it's a wasted effort
Jun 01 03:56:41 <luke-jr> hub: it does
Jun 01 03:57:44 <ShadowJK> hub: it does
Jun 01 03:57:55 <hub> the N8x0?
Jun 01 03:58:01 <ShadowJK> yes
Jun 01 03:58:12 <hub> wow. the documentation say it does not
Jun 01 03:58:22 <hub> or did I mis-read
Jun 01 03:58:24 <hub> could be
Jun 01 03:58:39 <luke-jr> PowerVR stuff
Jun 01 03:58:47 <ShadowJK> well it's not mentioned because there are no drivers
Jun 01 03:58:52 <hub> ah
Jun 01 03:59:01 <hub> crippled because of the vendor?
Jun 01 03:59:15 <Bobbe> yeap
Jun 01 03:59:22 <Bobbe> TI, making our lives crappier
Jun 01 03:59:38 <hub> reason #1 why the driver should be open WITH doc
Jun 01 03:59:46 <ShadowJK> if you go to the manufacturer's website they have drivers for linux for newer gpus
Jun 01 03:59:52 <hub> because the vendor can't be trusted anyway
Jun 01 04:00:10 <ShadowJK> unfortunately there are no gpus with open 3d drivers :(
Jun 01 04:00:24 <ShadowJK> oh i guess intel's desktop stuff.
Jun 01 04:01:30 <hub> but Pulsbo
Jun 01 04:01:38 <hub> aka PowerVR
Jun 01 04:01:53 <hub> (GMA 5000 or something like that)
Jun 01 04:02:12 <kfx> whatever happened to that opengpu project
Jun 01 04:02:13 <ShadowJK> closed drivers afaik
Jun 01 04:02:14 <RST38h> moo all
Jun 01 04:02:17 <kfx> did that cave in or what
Jun 01 04:02:28 <hub> kfx: I think it still goes
Jun 01 04:02:39 <ShadowJK> opngraphics? they're going to produce a few cards soon
Jun 01 04:02:43 <hub> kfx: that does not mean it is usable or reasonably priced
Jun 01 04:02:46 <ShadowJK> trying to source parts
Jun 01 04:02:47 <kfx> that plus an opensparc would make a nice laptop
Jun 01 04:02:58 <kfx> one day, when I'm six hundred years old
Jun 01 04:02:59 <hub> ShadowJK: worse: broken drivers
Jun 01 04:03:07 <hub> ShadowJK: hence the "but"
Jun 01 04:03:27 <ShadowJK> opengraphics has at most framebuffer driver now
Jun 01 04:03:31 <hub> ATI is open now, but the driver take time
Jun 01 04:03:54 <hub> the last generation have day support direct from ATI
Jun 01 04:04:08 <hub> but for something like a device, it is a no go
Jun 01 04:04:12 <ShadowJK> not that open really.. only parts of the gpu, only for older gpus?
Jun 01 04:04:40 <hub> ShadowJK: the last generation has driver direct from ATI into Xorg
Jun 01 04:04:50 <ShadowJK> opensource?
Jun 01 04:04:56 <ShadowJK> unobfuscated?
Jun 01 04:05:06 <kfx> yep
Jun 01 04:05:11 <ShadowJK> cool
Jun 01 04:05:20 <hub> ShadowJK: http://www.botchco.com/agd5f/?cat=3
Jun 01 04:05:24 <hub> ShadowJK: REAL driver
Jun 01 04:05:40 <ShadowJK> is it as stable, or unstable really, as the ati binary drivers have been?
Jun 01 04:05:57 <hub> ShadowJK: it is still work in progress, but that's because it is a lot of work
Jun 01 04:06:06 <hub> ShadowJK: but it is not the binary junk
Jun 01 04:06:46 <ShadowJK> im using nvidia binary on desktop, and it's been rock solid and even supports hw accel of h264 :)
Jun 01 04:06:57 <hub> rock solid? not really
Jun 01 04:08:41 <ShadowJK> never had a crash/oops with them :)
Jun 01 04:29:40 <rkirti> What happens to 'unassigned' maemo bugs ?
Jun 01 04:32:29 <tank-man> im guessing unfixed
Jun 01 04:32:50 <hub> rkirti: nothing happens
Jun 01 04:33:20 <GAN800> rkirti, don't read into it.
Jun 01 04:35:01 <GAN800> rkirti, b.m.o's triage process is, unfortunately, not perfectly rigorous lacking real dedication from Nokia.
Jun 01 04:35:34 <rkirti> GAN800:  yeah, I may sound paranoid here..but the reason I am keen to see them attended to is because they are essential things - about base library builds that break - and given the pace at which 'assigned' bugs move,I am concerned about what fate meets the unassigned ones
Jun 01 04:36:18 <GAN800> Thet're frequently resolved faster than the assigned ones.
Jun 01 04:36:24 <hub> rkirti: there is aslo the option of providing a patch
Jun 01 04:36:31 <GAN800> Just make sure somebody knows they're there.
Jun 01 04:36:34 <hub> that should speed things up, at least I hope
Jun 01 04:36:57 <GAN800> Nokians aren't particularly rigorous about following their bugmail, unfortunately.
Jun 01 04:38:26 <rkirti> hub: true, and its the best option. But I am not a proper hacker and definitely not level enough in this case - since the bugs are related to Hildon changes/definitions being moved to gtk+ headers and other things - decisions already controversial from what I see on the net/mailing lists.
Jun 01 04:42:52 <hub> the other option is to hire somebody to do it
Jun 01 04:45:26 <radic__> hmm
Jun 01 04:45:41 <radic__> the maemo-mapper makes a lot of CPU load
Jun 01 06:47:33 <rm_you> X-Fade: need to get you to reset the pyshop mailing list thing, lol
Jun 01 06:47:35 <thux> morning
Jun 01 06:52:44 <Macer> how much overhead does xfering via ssl use?
Jun 01 07:05:06 <johnx> Macer: prolly about the same as scp/sftp
Jun 01 07:23:06 <Myrtti> btw, black laptop = fail
Jun 01 07:23:22 <Myrtti> utter, imcomprehable fail
Jun 01 07:34:47 <Macer> Myrtti: something wrong with black laptops? :)
Jun 01 07:35:34 <Myrtti> working in the summertime
Jun 01 07:36:00 <hub> I have a black laptop
Jun 01 07:36:17 <hub> and given that it is a thinkpad, I'd not get anything else
Jun 01 07:36:27 <hub> (albeit this specific model surely not)
Jun 01 07:38:09 <hub> but I miss the X60 I had
Jun 01 07:38:15 <inz> Myrtti, sunshine + touchpad == good reason to learn to use the keyboard
Jun 01 07:38:32 <hub> inz: I have a "clit"
Jun 01 07:38:39 <hub> instead of a touch pad
Jun 01 07:39:27 <inz> hub, I do have both, but prefer touchpad
Jun 01 07:40:21 <Corsac> yurk
Jun 01 08:48:39 <lcuk> lbt, \o mornin
Jun 01 08:48:47 <lbt> hi
Jun 01 08:49:07 <lcuk> when did you get back
Jun 01 08:49:15 <lbt> midnight
Jun 01 08:49:33 <lcuk> heh i hope you slept well
Jun 01 08:49:50 <lcuk> with actual room to stretch your legs and roll over lol
Jun 01 08:49:54 <lbt> I did
Jun 01 08:49:59 <lbt> yeah - nice
Jun 01 08:50:04 <lbt> I was looking for you yesterday to get the dsc to OBS-ify liqbase
Jun 01 08:50:13 <lbt> don't forget
Jun 01 08:50:30 <lcuk> yeah i had "issues" on my way home
Jun 01 08:51:08 <lbt> ?
Jun 01 08:51:09 <lcuk> i got on the plane and my mmc is corrupt, no code lost (backups..) and keesj has the package stuff on his github
Jun 01 08:51:22 <lbt> good
Jun 01 08:51:24 <lcuk> ive lost all the sketches and notes i took over the weekend tho
Jun 01 08:51:25 <lcuk> :(
Jun 01 08:51:29 <lbt> aw
Jun 01 08:51:40 <lcuk> first time ive got a hole in my stream
Jun 01 08:51:54 <lbt> when you say corrupt...
Jun 01 08:52:01 <lcuk> i have managed to take a dd of the entire card and it looks like i might extract from there
Jun 01 08:52:05 <lcuk> the superblock is dead
Jun 01 08:52:05 <lbt> good
Jun 01 08:52:10 <lcuk> and it wont use any of the others
Jun 01 08:52:12 <lbt> fs?
Jun 01 08:52:16 <lcuk> ext2
Jun 01 08:52:25 <lbt> good, lots of tools
Jun 01 08:52:59 <lcuk> yeah but all of em moan and wont get further than a cursory glance
Jun 01 08:53:30 <lcuk> i tried with all the listed backups and it just wont fireup
Jun 01 08:55:36 <lcuk> as long as the sketches themselves are contigious in the memory space i should get the raw data - though chronological order will be a problem
Jun 01 08:55:50 <lcuk> hi andre__ \o
Jun 01 08:55:57 <andre__> heja
Jun 01 08:57:10 <Stskeepie> 'lo andre__
Jun 01 08:57:20 <andre__> hej hej
Jun 01 08:57:33 <lcuk> hey Stskeepie \o
Jun 01 08:57:36 <lbt> 'lo andre__
Jun 01 08:57:40 <lbt> ;)
Jun 01 08:58:38 <andre__> heidiho
Jun 01 08:59:00 * andre__ starts another computer to say hello to him too
Jun 01 09:00:30 <lbt> http://homepage.smc.edu/morgan_david/cs40/analyze-ext2.htm
Jun 01 09:03:53 <lcuk> thanks lbt, that makes heavy reading this morning heh
Jun 01 09:04:31 <Stskeepie> lcuk: take SD card, dd if=/dev/mmcblkWHATEVER of=sd.img, so you can rescue on that
Jun 01 09:04:52 <lcuk> yes Stskeepie ive got a 1gb backup on mmc2 at the moment
Jun 01 09:05:02 <Stskeepie> k
Jun 01 09:05:31 <lcuk> and i got half over it over to my pc (when i tried it bailed out half way through with a wifi thing - diff issue not a prob)
Jun 01 09:05:39 <lbt> actually lcuk you should have a backup, and then copy the backup and work on the copy
Jun 01 09:05:46 <lcuk> and ive looked inside and it contains lots of things and sketches are one of them
Jun 01 09:05:50 <lbt> also you should use ddrescue, not dd
Jun 01 09:06:01 <lcuk> yeah im not touching the card itself now
Jun 01 09:09:24 <lcuk> can i try to mount that file itself as a live ext2 partition and use the tools on it?
Jun 01 09:11:22 <lbt> yes
Jun 01 09:11:27 <lbt> loopback
Jun 01 09:11:32 <lbt> mout -oloop ...
Jun 01 09:11:34 <lbt> man mount
Jun 01 09:12:13 <lcuk> heh, in my case its googling for man mount
Jun 01 09:13:36 <lcuk> thanks lbt ill do more once i get back from the park
Jun 01 09:14:04 * lcuk knows its not the end of the world
Jun 01 09:14:16 <lcuk> but it does make me re-evaluate a few things
Jun 01 09:14:52 <lcuk> lbt, how long does obs take - supposing i wanted same package available for maemo and mer and x86
Jun 01 09:22:56 <lcuk> :O the mapping widget adjustments i made with rm_you are gone :O:O
Jun 01 09:25:05 <Macer> hm. the star wars cartoon isn't that bad
Jun 01 09:25:14 <Macer> it's better than the movies :) that's kind of sad
Jun 01 09:26:37 <lbt> lcuk: OBS takes very little time if the packaging is right
Jun 01 09:26:56 <lbt> however it only makes Mer images
Jun 01 09:27:44 <lbt> but we're going to work with X-Fade so you can submit once and have both
Jun 01 09:40:44 <sanjay6976> can any body help with the following error: qmake-qt4 -d mmap: No such device or address
Jun 01 09:47:47 <Stskeepie> morning qwerty12
Jun 01 09:47:57 <qwerty12> hey Stskeepie
Jun 01 10:26:53 <wazd> heya maemo
Jun 01 10:26:57 <Stskeeps> lo wazd
Jun 01 10:48:47 <lardman> morning chaps
Jun 01 10:52:46 * lardman just saw one of those WinCE HTC smart phones, 3.5" screen isn't too bad
Jun 01 10:53:00 * lardman tries to persuade himself ;)
Jun 01 10:53:21 <lardman> but really, comparing with non-full screen on my n810, it's not far off
Jun 01 10:53:29 <lardman> sure this has already been discussed to death mind you
Jun 01 10:53:57 <aquatix> morning all
Jun 01 10:54:05 <lardman> hi aquatix
Jun 01 10:55:59 <aquatix> heh, just found a bash.org quote from here (i think): http://bash.org/?884782
Jun 01 11:22:36 <lardman> lcuk: ping
Jun 01 11:25:20 <Macer> wow.  there is just no sane method to stream videos to a wii huh?
Jun 01 12:06:25 <wolfo> hi room
Jun 01 12:07:12 <wolfo> does anyone have the .deb package for maemo-drac? ;)
Jun 01 12:07:41 <wolfo> the repository at "indt" seems to have vanished
Jun 01 12:07:54 <qwerty12> It's in Extras: http://repository.maemo.org/extras/pool/diablo/free/m/maemodrac/
Jun 01 12:12:06 <wolfo> not for bora
Jun 01 12:12:19 <wolfo> a bora version existed before...
Jun 01 12:13:36 <X-Fade> 'lo
Jun 01 12:13:47 <Stskeeps> 'lo X-Fade :)
Jun 01 12:15:59 <lardman> hi X-Fade
Jun 01 12:16:06 * lardman is late for Spanish, bbl
Jun 01 12:16:42 <wolfo> the installer says repo_deb_3  = deb http://openbossa.indt.org.br/games bora games
Jun 01 12:16:57 <wolfo> but there's nothing there, so i guess it was deleted
Jun 01 12:17:28 <qwerty12> wolfo: Try browsing http://openbossa.indt.org.br/games/pool/games/ ;)
Jun 01 12:17:49 <qwerty12> 'ello X-Fade
Jun 01 12:18:15 <wolfo> lol thanks
Jun 01 12:19:11 <X-Fade> So, I think we should do more of these developer meetings :)
Jun 01 12:20:25 <GeneralAntilles> Macer, MPlayer works OK.
Jun 01 12:20:55 <GeneralAntilles> X-Fade, wonder if Nokia's got the money ready for it.
Jun 01 12:21:23 <Stskeeps> i'm amazed of how calming effect some simple statements had
Jun 01 12:21:40 <X-Fade> GeneralAntilles: No idea, but at least it was a very productive weekend.
Jun 01 12:22:04 <X-Fade> And it gave us ideas to work on for the next months :)
Jun 01 12:22:15 <GeneralAntilles> I'm worried about infrastructure.
Jun 01 12:22:29 <GeneralAntilles> I know 5 people who are planning on buying.
Jun 01 12:22:52 <X-Fade> I think this meeting helped a lot for Mer: http://twitpic.com/6902l
Jun 01 12:23:09 <GeneralAntilles> I suspect that the increase in users is going to be just as big (if not bigger) as Nokia expected.
Jun 01 12:23:46 <X-Fade> GeneralAntilles: I'm pretty sure Nokia knows what to expect.
Jun 01 12:23:58 <Stskeeps> GeneralAntilles: i was sold after a minute.
Jun 01 12:24:07 <GeneralAntilles> X-Fade, but we're not Nokia. ;)
Jun 01 12:24:15 <X-Fade> GeneralAntilles: True.
Jun 01 12:24:26 <Stskeeps> X-Fade: well, yeah, but it was also a official talk on getting things moving that has been in the planning for ages.
Jun 01 12:24:41 <GeneralAntilles> The last thing we need is an OVI Store-style failure. Or, worse, a November 2007-style one.
Jun 01 12:24:44 <Stskeeps> X-Fade: i have scripts to do the tricks with making images on maemo.og already and such,so
Jun 01 12:25:08 <Stskeeps> it's on the wiki somewhere.. sec
Jun 01 12:25:43 <Stskeeps> yeah, http://wiki.maemo.org/Mer/Proposals/Community_Firmware :P
Jun 01 12:26:34 <Stskeeps> some of the stuff was pre-nokia-binaries
Jun 01 12:27:02 <GeneralAntilles> I think we'll probably be mostly OK if r.m.o is ready to handle things.
Jun 01 12:27:02 <X-Fade> Yeah, I had seen that page before.
Jun 01 12:27:08 <qwerty12> Stskeeps: once BME Free matures, is your plan to switch to that?
Jun 01 12:27:47 <Stskeeps> qwerty12: yes, i just haven't gotten around to packaging it
Jun 01 12:27:54 <qwerty12> ah
Jun 01 12:28:02 <X-Fade> qwerty12: One of the things to think about is that we want to make absolutely sure that this thing is not doing anything funky ;)
Jun 01 12:29:36 <qwerty12> Yeah... fair point; but, that said, 412b's advanced-power works well for me (but, of course, that's just getting values broadcasted by hald-addon-bme)
Jun 01 12:30:20 * GeneralAntilles shudders to think of the liabilities. . . .
Jun 01 12:30:52 <GeneralAntilles> Think of the damage that would happen to Nokia's image if Engadget or somebody got wind of something.
Jun 01 12:30:57 <X-Fade> Personally, I'd rather not run the risk. But yeah..
Jun 01 12:31:35 <GeneralAntilles> I don't think it's something I'd ever want to see bundled. . . .
Jun 01 12:32:08 <X-Fade> But then again, I don't care too much about blobs. As long as they are allowed to be redistributed and don't cause too much upgrade problems ;)
Jun 01 12:32:46 <Stskeeps> major difference: distributed vs redistributable
Jun 01 12:32:46 <Stskeeps> :P
Jun 01 12:33:22 <qwerty12> Stskeeps: I guess Deblet SVN compared to your firmware image plan shows that difference :P
Jun 01 12:33:27 <qwerty12> *'s
Jun 01 12:33:29 <X-Fade> Stskeeps: Yeah, well I'm thinking about maemo.org being a separate entity from Nokia. So redistributing?
Jun 01 12:34:34 <GeneralAntilles> andre__, ping?
Jun 01 12:34:36 <Stskeeps> yeah, redistributing from nokia but the bits aren't redistributable by people ;)
Jun 01 12:34:51 <X-Fade> Stskeeps: True.
Jun 01 12:35:06 <Stskeeps> lawyer talk is funny
Jun 01 12:35:26 <X-Fade> Stskeeps: At least the lawyers gave us some good news for Mer ;)
Jun 01 12:35:46 <Stskeeps> yeah
Jun 01 12:36:00 <GeneralAntilles> I hope we can get some review of the Fremantle docs before the device launches.
Jun 01 12:36:47 <X-Fade> GeneralAntilles: Which ones?
Jun 01 12:36:55 <GeneralAntilles> X-Fade, any and all.
Jun 01 12:37:27 <GeneralAntilles> An alpha release-style release note quality would be really bad on the final.
Jun 01 12:38:39 * GeneralAntilles isn't sure how johnkzin made the brainstorm mod list.
Jun 01 12:40:49 <X-Fade> GeneralAntilles: I seem to recall that it was the idea to have the docs available for us before launch, but I'd have to check.
Jun 01 12:47:27 <GeneralAntilles> andre__, ping timeout. ;)
Jun 01 12:47:31 * GeneralAntilles goes to work.
Jun 01 13:35:03 <RST38h> reMoo
Jun 01 13:35:12 <rm_you> lol
Jun 01 13:35:17 <Stskeeps> moo RST38h
Jun 01 13:36:07 <RST38h> How are things? I see (on ITT) that someone has already started salivating over arrow keys on that developer unit? =)
Jun 01 13:36:18 <johnx> allo RST38h
Jun 01 13:37:13 <johnx> weeell, the fact that they showed arrow keys on one keyboard layout on a dev device doesn't necessarily mean we'll see them on shipping hardware
Jun 01 13:38:35 <RST38h> johnx: the location does not sound all that good to me too =(
Jun 01 13:38:49 <Stskeeps> honestly the entire keyboard can act like a dpad
Jun 01 13:38:51 <Stskeeps> it's soft like that
Jun 01 13:39:16 <RST38h> johnx: Maybe we should hint to Nokia devs to request those four buttons SNES-style on the back panel, where they can act as camera controls too? =)
Jun 01 13:39:25 <derf> So they've fixed the horrible stiffness problems the N810 keyboard has?
Jun 01 13:39:36 <RST38h> Sts: It can't, lot more goes into a good dpad than just buttons unfrotunately
Jun 01 13:39:46 <RST38h> Sts: N810 had a dpad and what good was it?
Jun 01 13:40:02 <Stskeeps> derf: well. this isn't a final device or even one they'll ship. i liked it's keyboard though.
Jun 01 13:40:14 <derf> You practically had to hit the buttons with a mallet to depress them.
Jun 01 13:40:29 <RST38h> derf: You obviously never used BK0010 =)
Jun 01 13:40:36 <derf> With that the case, it doesn't matter if they're arranged in a d-pad form.
Jun 01 13:40:36 <johnx> somehow the N810 buttons felt stuck or something
Jun 01 13:40:42 <johnx> this keyboard feels a lot better
Jun 01 13:40:47 <derf> Good.
Jun 01 13:40:52 <derf> RST38h: And no, I haven't.
Jun 01 13:41:04 <RST38h> derf: http://www.jocys.com/evaldas/images/Elektronika_BK-0010_Large.jpg (and yes, it is as painful as it looks)
Jun 01 13:45:49 <Stskeeps> interesting fact: n900 specs thread died completely
Jun 01 13:45:56 <lcuk> mr lardman, wtf are you doing online now - aren't you meant to be on honeymoon?
Jun 01 13:46:30 <mib_8w4x7q> hello
Jun 01 13:47:13 <cosmo> is there any solution or known cause for N810 slowness problem?
Jun 01 13:47:20 <Stskeeps> which one? :P
Jun 01 13:47:34 <lcuk> n810 isnt slow, its your perception of reality thats been sped up
Jun 01 13:47:43 <cosmo> locking screen takes a long time and eventually the device reboots
Jun 01 13:48:05 <mib_8w4x7q> maybe you clogged it up with apps
Jun 01 13:48:20 <lcuk> a slow device is indicative of bad apps running
Jun 01 13:48:21 <cosmo> i'm even suspecting it's hardware failure, as it kept happening after i flashed the device
Jun 01 13:48:39 <lcuk> did you flash and test, or flash, restore apps, then test..
Jun 01 13:48:46 <mib_8w4x7q> how many apps are installed on it
Jun 01 13:49:06 <cosmo> i flashed, installed a couple off apps (openss, owm etc) and then noticed it still happens
Jun 01 13:49:21 <lcuk> then try it without installing apps..
Jun 01 13:49:30 <RST38h> cosmo: I your N810 did not have any amphetamines, give it some. Otherwise, stop taking them yourself.
Jun 01 13:49:32 <lcuk> then you have a small set of apps that it might be related to
Jun 01 13:49:33 <cosmo> i'll have to do that next
Jun 01 13:49:35 <RST38h> =)
Jun 01 13:50:06 <cosmo> well, the only 'daemon' app is openssh server. disabling owm didn't help
Jun 01 13:50:07 <mib_8w4x7q> are you running windows?
Jun 01 13:50:59 <mib_8w4x7q> you guys on this chat are computer savvy so i have a question
Jun 01 13:51:25 * lcuk isnt computer savvy
Jun 01 13:51:32 <mib_8w4x7q> can professional sites like youtube fall victim to cookie stealing
Jun 01 13:51:54 <mib_8w4x7q> so if i logg into youtube and somebody tries to steal my cookies would it work
Jun 01 13:51:55 <lcuk> seseme street has a problem with cookie stealing
Jun 01 13:51:57 * RST38h steals a cookie from mib_* then eats it
Jun 01 13:52:20 <cmug> for some reason I saw those comments coming far, far away
Jun 01 13:52:25 <fiferboy> lbt: ping?
Jun 01 13:52:32 <lbt> hi fiferboy
Jun 01 13:52:34 <lcuk> lol cmug
Jun 01 13:52:48 <fiferboy> Hey David, how was Copenhagen?
Jun 01 13:52:51 <mib_8w4x7q> or am i safe using youtube and then getting the cookies stolen
Jun 01 13:52:57 <cmug> It's like waving a bone to a dog
Jun 01 13:53:11 <lcuk> mib_8w4x7q, if you keep your cookies in a lockable jar on the top shelf no1 will steal them
Jun 01 13:53:20 <lbt> mib_8w4x7q: soak them in milk... makes them harder to pick up
Jun 01 13:53:28 <mib_8w4x7q> honestly can i please have an answer
Jun 01 13:53:31 <cmug> eat them all ?
Jun 01 13:53:33 <lbt> it was good ...
Jun 01 13:53:35 <lcuk> you have many answers
Jun 01 13:53:53 <lcuk> infact, you have had more answers for this topic than anything else
Jun 01 13:54:00 <lbt> managed to run Qt on the new device
Jun 01 13:54:03 <lcuk> do you worry about cookie stealing on your desktop?
Jun 01 13:54:12 <mib_8w4x7q> yes
Jun 01 13:54:14 <cmug> What is defined as a cookie
Jun 01 13:54:22 <lcuk> lbt, and wasted a wonderful opportunity to scare the pants of the nokia guys
Jun 01 13:54:28 <lcuk> mib_8w4x7q, why?
Jun 01 13:54:29 <lbt> <sigh>
Jun 01 13:54:30 <rm_you> mib_8w4x7q: i wouldn't worry
Jun 01 13:54:34 * lcuk never worries about cookies
Jun 01 13:54:48 <lbt> we had bounce and everything...
Jun 01 13:54:53 <mib_8w4x7q> well because somebody could hack into my youtube account
Jun 01 13:54:55 <cmug> I would rather worry about people having access to my desktop firt
Jun 01 13:54:59 <cmug> first*
Jun 01 13:55:04 <lcuk> now, my penguins - thats a different story
Jun 01 13:55:19 <lcuk> mib_8w4x7q, for what gain?
Jun 01 13:55:23 <lcuk> financial reward?
Jun 01 13:55:26 <lbt> fiferboy: they were impressed enough that I won a trip to Holland out of it :)
Jun 01 13:55:31 <lcuk> or just to watch dodgy videos
Jun 01 13:55:33 <mib_8w4x7q> well ive protected my desktop
Jun 01 13:55:37 <fiferboy> lbt: Nice!
Jun 01 13:55:42 <lcuk> and have them linked to related stuff when you post new ones
Jun 01 13:55:46 <lbt> now I need to let them know you were on the team and see what they say...
Jun 01 13:55:48 <mib_8w4x7q> im using youtube as an example
Jun 01 13:55:51 <cmug> lbt, who from Nokia was there?
Jun 01 13:55:52 <lcuk> mib_8w4x7q, how did you protect your desktop?
Jun 01 13:55:58 <mib_8w4x7q> any professional website
Jun 01 13:56:25 <fiferboy> lbt: What's this about running on a new device?
Jun 01 13:56:25 <lbt> quim, neils, sonia, johannes... loads of other
Jun 01 13:56:28 <lcuk> "no cookies are left in this computer overnight"
Jun 01 13:56:37 <lbt> sdk people for gtk though
Jun 01 13:56:39 <cmug> None ring a bell :)
Jun 01 13:56:47 <lbt> yeah... need irc handles
Jun 01 13:56:53 <mib_8w4x7q> i have a firewall and such
Jun 01 13:57:06 <lcuk> mib_8w4x7q, a software firewall?
Jun 01 13:57:07 <lbt> no Qt people
Jun 01 13:57:11 <cmug> mib_8w4x7q, ahha, but you're connected to the Internet! There is your caveat
Jun 01 13:57:12 <mib_8w4x7q> yes
Jun 01 13:57:17 <lcuk> oooooh thats worse
Jun 01 13:57:20 <cmug> I have a trolltech cap
Jun 01 13:57:21 <lcuk> false sense of security
Jun 01 13:57:30 <lbt> but they were clear about the Qt mid-term future
Jun 01 13:57:35 <lbt> cmug... :D
Jun 01 13:57:48 <mib_8w4x7q> argh im getting nowhere slowly
Jun 01 13:57:51 <lcuk> have you got a hardware router with proper IDS?
Jun 01 13:58:00 <mib_8w4x7q> yeah why not
Jun 01 13:58:03 <fiferboy> lbt: What's the plan for Qt?
Jun 01 13:58:04 <lbt> Qt is available in fremantle
Jun 01 13:58:13 <cmug> How about physical access to the firewall, is it secure enough?
Jun 01 13:58:14 <lbt> and supported in harmattan (sp?)
Jun 01 13:58:35 <cmug> lbt, what does that mean in practice
Jun 01 13:58:41 <mib_8w4x7q> i just want to know about cookie stealing for no
Jun 01 13:58:42 <mib_8w4x7q> w
Jun 01 13:58:47 <lbt> and it has leaked that the new device has 256 RAM so we'll be easier to dual-toolkit
Jun 01 13:58:49 <cmug> they're switching totally to QT?
Jun 01 13:58:56 <lbt> I doubt it
Jun 01 13:59:03 <lbt> not in harmattan
Jun 01 13:59:10 <lbt> too much community gtk
Jun 01 13:59:16 <fiferboy> Maybe harmattan + 1...
Jun 01 13:59:21 <cmug> k
Jun 01 13:59:52 <lbt> and hildonised Qt moving to mobile space
Jun 01 14:00:13 <fiferboy> Too bad nobody from Qt was there
Jun 01 14:00:26 <Pavlov> it was a good weekend
Jun 01 14:00:29 <lbt> yeah... they tried apparently
Jun 01 14:00:32 <fiferboy> I assume your trip to Holland will have a lot of Qt people, though?
Jun 01 14:00:36 <lbt> I hope so
Jun 01 14:01:30 <lbt> I think it was nice to see the theming in Shopper though... it looked very cool on the new device
Jun 01 14:01:36 <lbt> and the bounce was great
Jun 01 14:02:23 <lbt> it actually looked very integrated
Jun 01 14:02:26 <cmug> bounce?
Jun 01 14:02:35 <lbt> overshoot on fingerscrolling
Jun 01 14:03:00 <lbt> cmug: you know I implemented fingerscroll (kinetic) on QAbstractScrollArea
Jun 01 14:03:10 <cmug> I do now
Jun 01 14:03:21 <lbt> and then added the hildon (iphone) overshoot/bounce effect
Jun 01 14:03:40 <lbt> and am trying to get it accepted as a community contribution to Hildon-Qt
Jun 01 14:03:43 <cmug> Ah that
Jun 01 14:03:46 <lbt> yeah
Jun 01 14:03:48 <lbt> that
Jun 01 14:04:01 <cmug> the wow is strong in that
Jun 01 14:04:23 <fiferboy> lbt: Did you get to do any hacking on Qt?
Jun 01 14:04:32 <lbt> cmug:    ? the bounce..... or doing it in Qt
Jun 01 14:04:34 <lcuk> lbt, you never saw just how super speedy liqbase was on the new device did you
Jun 01 14:04:43 <lbt> fiferboy: lcuk: no
Jun 01 14:04:48 <lcuk> i thought it was slick before - this really is running on baconfat
Jun 01 14:04:53 <lbt> heh
Jun 01 14:04:55 <Pavlov> heh
Jun 01 14:04:55 <lcuk> and goes on and on and on
Jun 01 14:05:08 <cmug> lbt, the bounce effect
Jun 01 14:05:11 <cmug> in general
Jun 01 14:05:11 <lbt> post-departure we all reckon you should port to Gl
Jun 01 14:05:34 <lbt> I thought it was eye candy
Jun 01 14:05:40 <lbt> but it's good ui feedback
Jun 01 14:06:11 <cmug> Never thought of it that way, but I agree
Jun 01 14:06:15 * lbt prostrated himself in abject apology to all those he slighted
Jun 01 14:06:54 <Pavlov> lbt: is your patch for the qt stuff up anywhere?
Jun 01 14:06:55 <cmug> I understood 7 of those words
Jun 01 14:07:06 <lbt> still it's nice that I got "1 up" on the gtk crowd
Jun 01 14:07:28 <fiferboy> Ah, toolkit wars :)
Jun 01 14:07:34 <lbt> my fingerscroll is native... you don't need a special pannable area
Jun 01 14:07:42 <lbt> Pavlov: gitorious
Jun 01 14:08:37 <lbt> http://gitorious.org/qt-maemo
Jun 01 14:09:29 <Pavlov> cool
Jun 01 14:09:40 <Pavlov> i've written a lot of similar code for fennec
Jun 01 14:09:41 <lbt> http://gitorious.org/+qt-maemo-developers/qt/qt-maemo
Jun 01 14:10:09 <lbt> ah... fiferboy helped find some edge cases ... like nested scrollareas
Jun 01 14:10:19 <Pavlov> yeah, those are kind of a pain
Jun 01 14:10:29 <lbt> I allow passthrough of clicks and click-drag to child widgets
Jun 01 14:10:33 <Pavlov> although not too bad
Jun 01 14:10:38 <lbt> which is kinda neat
Jun 01 14:10:45 <lardman> hey lcuk, am off on Friday, work to get finished before I go
Jun 01 14:10:46 <lcuk> fiferboy, toolkit wars arent that bad as long as good code is written, the results can be shared and percolated
Jun 01 14:10:50 <lbt> (well, uber-cook actually)
Jun 01 14:10:57 <lcuk> and linux is a great place to allow everthing
Jun 01 14:11:00 <fiferboy> lbt: Do you have any plans on how to treat text areas?
Jun 01 14:11:16 <lbt> ?
Jun 01 14:11:21 <fiferboy> lcuk: I agree, but you have to admit they are fun to watch
Jun 01 14:11:32 <lbt> you mean the virt keyboard issue?
Jun 01 14:11:47 <fiferboy> lbt: Yes
Jun 01 14:11:51 <lbt> SEP
Jun 01 14:12:07 <lbt> I need to put another hat on and kick myself <sigh>
Jun 01 14:12:07 <lcuk> fiferboy, im in the middle of it myself lol
Jun 01 14:12:54 <lcuk> lbt, im going to totally rebuild my dev env - losing the comfort of the memory card might have been a good thing
Jun 01 14:13:02 <lcuk> though its really gonna slow me down!
Jun 01 14:13:17 * lbt nods
Jun 01 14:13:28 <lcuk> rm was shocked when he saw me build and run and CTRL C from the program to make changes
Jun 01 14:13:41 <RST38h> Ehhehehe
Jun 01 14:13:53 <lbt> shocked or stunned
Jun 01 14:13:59 <lbt> <grin>
Jun 01 14:14:03 <lcuk> shocked
Jun 01 14:14:16 <lcuk> dev for me is such a low level thing
Jun 01 14:14:26 <lcuk> its really quick and simple to design and test
Jun 01 14:14:51 <lcuk> AND - extra bonus now i have a lib :: its essentially just ssh+gcc+libliqbase-dev ;)
Jun 01 14:15:07 <lcuk> and you can make liq* apps on device
Jun 01 14:15:33 <lcuk> not really wasting mega tonnes of space, cos loads of things are encapsulated within libliqbase
Jun 01 14:15:42 <lardman> where's your new code then lcuk, we want to play :)
Jun 01 14:15:43 * lcuk cant wait for it to be in extras :)
Jun 01 14:16:04 <lcuk> lardman, search google for libliqbase, keesj has a public git branch
Jun 01 14:16:10 <lcuk> of the library with packaging stuff
Jun 01 14:16:12 <lardman> cool
Jun 01 14:16:20 <lcuk> its still not in extras yet obviously lol
Jun 01 14:16:25 <lcuk> but we got it running
Jun 01 14:16:54 <lcuk> the actual vworld main liqbase app is there as well, but the package is a bit more messy, that will take some reshaping first
Jun 01 14:18:09 <Pavlov> lbt: heh, every single kinetic scrolling impl i've seen is done differently
Jun 01 14:18:22 <lcuk> Pavlov, and they are all inferior to mine :D
Jun 01 14:18:28 <Pavlov> uh huh ;)
Jun 01 14:18:28 <Bobbe> lol
Jun 01 14:18:32 <Bobbe> modesty is a virtue
Jun 01 14:18:43 <Bobbe> but i do feel lcuk's is faster than anything else I've used
Jun 01 14:18:48 * lcuk wrote the simplest implementation
Jun 01 14:19:04 * fiferboy is the most modest person here
Jun 01 14:19:09 <Bobbe> canola's pretty good, tho
Jun 01 14:19:10 <Pavlov> we used to have a crazy complicated version
Jun 01 14:19:12 <lcuk> Bobbe, its not just fastest, its the actual working, i see huge jumps happen with others
Jun 01 14:19:15 * lbt is just awesome
Jun 01 14:19:21 <lcuk> heh
Jun 01 14:19:25 <Pavlov> i threw it out made it simple heh
Jun 01 14:19:28 <Bobbe> lol
Jun 01 14:19:34 <lcuk> good
Jun 01 14:19:36 <lbt> and has a prize to prove it <gloat>
Jun 01 14:19:59 <Bobbe> lbt, if it's your daughter's Dad of the Year mug it doesn't count
Jun 01 14:20:03 <Bobbe> Biased awarder
Jun 01 14:20:06 <lcuk> lbt, your expansion of existing qt stuff is really really really beneficial
Jun 01 14:20:55 <lbt> Pavlov: I wrote mine and it was very similar to the Qt guy who did flickcharm
Jun 01 14:21:10 <lbt> then he suggested I make it state based
Jun 01 14:21:24 <lbt> and at that point it was almost identical
Jun 01 14:21:29 <Pavlov> yeah, the state based for clicks vs drags is useful
Jun 01 14:21:59 <fiferboy> FlickCharm has some major problems compared to lbt's
Jun 01 14:22:16 <lbt> yeah... it was proof of concept
Jun 01 14:22:27 <lbt> and made assumptions (as you do)
Jun 01 14:22:39 <lbt> so it bulked up a fair bit...
Jun 01 14:22:45 <lbt> then even more to handle bounce
Jun 01 14:22:54 <lbt> and that's still a pig-ugly hack
Jun 01 14:51:10 <minra-> pretzel stick makes a good stylis
Jun 01 14:52:37 <Ave> and you can eat it too
Jun 01 14:52:50 <Mouser__> hello
Jun 01 14:56:21 <minra-> can someone tell me where to turn off word-prediction popup?  or search terms||?
Jun 01 14:57:35 <Mouser__> It's in the control panel under Text Input Settings, minra-
Jun 01 14:59:33 <Mouser__> minra-, specifically, under the languages tab and then under Settings...
Jun 01 14:59:41 <minra-> hmm
Jun 01 15:00:07 <Mouser__> minra-, do you see it?
Jun 01 15:00:20 <minra-> no
Jun 01 15:00:32 <minra-> ooohh
Jun 01 15:00:59 <minra-> somehow my eye didnt pick that up as a button
Jun 01 15:01:18 <Mouser__> minra- , glad you found it. :)
Jun 01 15:01:32 <minra-> thank you!
Jun 01 15:01:44 <Mouser__> You're welcome!
Jun 01 15:01:45 <fiferboy> lbt: I found out why your latest changes don't work for me
Jun 01 15:01:57 <lbt> good...
Jun 01 15:02:33 <fiferboy> It is calling setFingerScrollable in an infinite loop in the DynamicPropertyChange event
Jun 01 15:02:47 <lbt> hmm.. that'll slow it down
Jun 01 15:03:07 <fiferboy> Yes, it has a hard time getting past that.
Jun 01 15:03:38 <fiferboy> It takes so long to count to infinity on an N810, it's really a hardware problem
Jun 01 15:03:49 <lbt> quantum tablet...
Jun 01 15:04:01 <fiferboy> Is that fixed in the next hardware revision?
Jun 01 15:04:24 <lbt> shh.... but yes... and there's a flux capacitor too.
Jun 01 15:04:32 <lbt> see what happens!
Jun 01 15:04:45 <lbt> their grandparents just died!
Jun 01 15:05:19 * lbt returns from his trip into history
Jun 01 15:05:24 <fiferboy> Now I have to find out why it keeps calling it.  I think that the setting the property is calling the dynamic property change to set the property
Jun 01 15:05:41 <lcuk> rx-52: added flux capacitor
Jun 01 15:05:48 <lcuk> rx-51: removed it again
Jun 01 15:06:04 <Mouser__> I'm having some problems with the built-in Media Player.  It is constantly refreshing the library, making it impossible to play local files unless it is invoked externally.   I have tried to reconfigure mediaplayer-110-ptbr, but I can't find the package if I were to reinstall.  Is there a way to reconfigure this without reflashing?
Jun 01 15:06:38 <lbt> lcuk: I just got up of the floor ;)
Jun 01 15:06:46 <lcuk> Mouser__, is there anything unusual in your file system which might trip it up (like links from places)
Jun 01 15:07:17 <lcuk> lbt, causality is a bitch ;)
Jun 01 15:09:38 <Mouser__> lcuk, That's possible, but not that I'm aware of.  I am running the OS cloned to SD, but it was working before.
Jun 01 15:10:49 <lcuk> i dunno mouser, sorry
Jun 01 15:11:52 <Mouser__> lcuk, is there a way to search for broken or irregular links on the device?
Jun 01 15:12:36 <lcuk> there probably is, but my knowledge is limited
Jun 01 15:16:56 <Mouser__> I know they are available online, but it would be nice if the manpages were ported.  If it's not already done, I would like to give it a try if it's not too hard (my knowledge with the console is limited)
Jun 01 15:20:47 <fiferboy> lbt: Hmm, it's not the setFingerScrollable that is triggering all the dynamic property changes...
Jun 01 15:21:01 <lbt> not looked yet
Jun 01 15:21:22 <fiferboy> I'll work it out, it just might take a little while
Jun 01 15:21:27 <fiferboy> Just talking the problem through
Jun 01 15:21:53 <lbt> ah
Jun 01 15:22:00 <lbt> my laptop woke up
Jun 01 15:22:44 <lcuk> lbt, \o in cph, you opened a console with some funny vulcan pinch, which key combo was it?
Jun 01 15:23:12 <lbt> ctrl-shift-n
Jun 01 15:23:20 <lardman> re
Jun 01 15:23:21 <lcuk> thx
Jun 01 15:23:29 <lcuk> hey lardman \o
Jun 01 15:23:38 <lardman> hi lcuk
Jun 01 15:23:44 * lcuk loves how shiny and slick liqbase runs on new hardware
Jun 01 15:24:01 <lcuk> lardman, ive started to describe it as literally runnin on baconfat :D
Jun 01 15:24:08 <lardman> :) very cool
Jun 01 15:24:32 <lardman> when was the European release date? October?
Jun 01 15:25:11 <lopz> hola
Jun 01 15:25:18 <fiferboy> lcuk: You should have used the old grade 10 programming trick of using processor loops to limit framerate so it would run 10x too fast on new hardware...
Jun 01 15:26:34 <lcuk> it doesnt run 10x too fast
Jun 01 15:26:49 <lcuk> its super duper smooth at the framerate practical for the device
Jun 01 15:27:00 <fiferboy> I know, but it would if you put in processor loops
Jun 01 15:27:13 <lcuk> and framerate drops to 0 when nothing is in motion or changing :)
Jun 01 15:28:09 * Pavlov kinda wants to see how liqbase would work as a web app
Jun 01 15:28:29 <lcuk> a web app? i gather the framerate would drop
Jun 01 15:28:37 <fiferboy> Shouldn't you put in a bunch of extra overhead so that it barely runs on the current device to make everyone but the new device?
Jun 01 15:28:39 <Pavlov> dunno
Jun 01 15:28:44 <lcuk> theres a new fennec extension which won for drawing and sending to twitpics
Jun 01 15:28:57 <Pavlov> yeah it is cool
Jun 01 15:29:30 <lcuk> fiferboy, not at all - i want the best experience possible on the current device - the code i use scales - the new device will simply allow more visible usable interactive tiles
Jun 01 15:29:35 <lcuk> the 810 is better with fewer
Jun 01 15:29:52 <fiferboy> lbt: Fixed the problem
Jun 01 15:30:03 <lcuk> when i get it on my big wall mounted touch panel and a fast processor i can have even more
Jun 01 15:30:05 <lbt> :)
Jun 01 15:30:51 <lcuk> fiferboy, and on that score - new libliqbase code *is* slower than the old original liqbase, that was purely superiorly optimized specifically for the device
Jun 01 15:30:57 <lcuk> and specifically for what it does
Jun 01 15:31:02 <lcuk> but it was not reusable really
Jun 01 15:31:23 <fiferboy> lcuk: Sounds great!
Jun 01 15:32:29 <fiferboy> lbt: It was the qabstractscrollarea->setProperty("FingerScrollable", true); call in qabstractscrollarea->setProperty("FingerScrollable", true);
Jun 01 15:32:30 <timeless_mbp> anyone here familiar w/ sb2? :)
Jun 01 15:32:41 <fiferboy> Fingerscrolling is working without it, so I assume I didn't break anything.
Jun 01 15:32:57 <lbt> line?
Jun 01 15:33:00 <timeless_mbp> Pavlov: personally, i want to see someone make a licqbase output method for Gecko
Jun 01 15:33:10 <VDVsx> lcuk, btw, who was the winner of the dev contest in the mozmae event ?
Jun 01 15:33:13 <timeless_mbp> so that we could get reasonable performance on n800s :)
Jun 01 15:33:17 <fiferboy> lbt, oops I meant in QAbstractAreaPrivateScroller
Jun 01 15:33:40 <timeless_mbp> VDVsx: the twitter sketcher thing and the qt shopper
Jun 01 15:33:41 <fiferboy> line 1442 in my code, but it is slightly different from yours (with the different legal header, etc)
Jun 01 15:34:13 <Pavlov> VDVsx: one of the ffennec addon devs for https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/fennec/addon/12191 and lbt for his qt finger panning stuff
Jun 01 15:35:27 <VDVsx> timeless, Pavlov , thanks, didn't know that FF/fennec extension are so powerful/resourceful :P
Jun 01 15:35:33 <lbt> fiferboy: hmm
Jun 01 15:36:18 <fiferboy> lbt: I don't know why that line is causing problems, and I'm not even sure it should be working without it, but it fixed the problem I was having.
Jun 01 15:36:18 <wazd__> lcuk: are you talking bout beagleboard or *something else*?)
Jun 01 15:36:20 <Pavlov> VDVsx: yeah it was pretty sweet
Jun 01 15:36:34 <Pavlov> VDVsx: the same guy built https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/fennec/addon/12118 the week before
Jun 01 15:36:42 <Pavlov> he's on a pretty good roll i'd say
Jun 01 15:36:50 <lbt> fiferboy: it'll work... but it's needed to be flexible
Jun 01 15:37:36 <lcuk> wazd__, we had access to hardware this weekend
Jun 01 15:37:40 <fiferboy> lbt: I think it might not be the root cause of the problem, I have just taken out the call to the property change, but if the application code changes the property it will probably freeze too
Jun 01 15:37:44 <lcuk> didnt you see or read anything?
Jun 01 15:38:08 <lbt> wazd http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=29270
Jun 01 15:38:20 <wazd__> lcuk: oh, I thought you've taken home one :)
Jun 01 15:41:38 <lcuk> nop wazd__ keesj and jeremiah_ and i (me less so) sweated and strained to get a couple of packages built
Jun 01 15:41:48 <lcuk> then went through a whole convoluted path to get it on device
Jun 01 15:50:36 <rm_you> whatever happened to telepathy-haze?
Jun 01 15:50:43 <rm_you> need AIM support >_>
Jun 01 15:53:18 <rm_you> ah found it on garage (rtcomm)... anyone know if it will still brick my tablet? :P
Jun 01 15:55:30 <Myrtti> has anyone actually managed to get telepathy-haze to work? I've not managed to get it work, ever
Jun 01 15:55:53 <rm_you> lol it used to, and then one release it bricked everyone's tablets...
Jun 01 15:56:24 <qwerty12> rm_you: try it and let us know if it still does it :p
Jun 01 15:56:36 <rm_you> lol k
Jun 01 15:56:41 <rm_you> i will be sad >_>
Jun 01 15:57:02 <Stskeeps> you peeps better be sitting in the couch in SIH and talking to people too ;)
Jun 01 15:57:11 <jaska> sih?
Jun 01 15:57:12 <qwerty12> rm_you: Lol, if you want, I'll install rtcomm and see if it bricks mine; I've got a backup of my flash
Jun 01 15:57:13 <GAN800> rm_you, install the beta, then add the Collabora repo from gronmayer to finish it.
Jun 01 15:57:19 <Stskeeps> sleep in heaven, the hostel they're at :P
Jun 01 15:57:28 <GAN800> It's a mess, but it works fine once installed.
Jun 01 15:57:31 <jaska> was just wondering, my laptops are always named sih
Jun 01 15:57:46 <rm_you> i'm just doing it :P
Jun 01 15:57:55 <rm_you> Stskeeps: i'm on the couch :P
Jun 01 15:57:58 <fiferboy> lbt: Does this make any sense; when a new QAbstractScrollAreaPrivateScroller is created it sets the FingerScrollable property to "true" which creates a new QAbstractScrollAreaPrivateScroller
Jun 01 15:58:01 <rm_you> johnx is ASLEEP on the couch... lol
Jun 01 15:58:06 <rm_you> I want to be asleep <_< very tired
Jun 01 15:58:08 <fiferboy> That's where the loop is coming from.
Jun 01 15:59:01 <lbt> lemme see (sounds v. plausible)
Jun 01 16:00:41 <lbt> shouldn't....
Jun 01 16:00:43 <lbt> 		if (! fingerScroller)
Jun 01 16:00:45 <lbt> 			fingerScroller = new QAbstractScrollAreaPrivateScroller(viewport, q, this);
Jun 01 16:00:57 <lbt> only creates one if there isn't one
Jun 01 16:01:34 <lbt> although....
Jun 01 16:02:15 <fiferboy> Initialization, maybe?
Jun 01 16:02:31 <lbt> yeah.. it creates it and loops before the member is set
Jun 01 16:04:37 <timeless_mbp> right, so anyone here familiar w/ sb2? :)
Jun 01 16:05:29 <lbt> timeless_mbp: suihkulokki may be when he's about
Jun 01 16:05:44 <timeless_mbp> he's s bit idle :(
Jun 01 16:05:52 <timeless_mbp> suihkulokki: all i want to be able to do is use apt-get update :)
Jun 01 16:05:59 <Stskeeps> sb2 -e apt-get update? :P
Jun 01 16:10:37 <timeless_mbp> it says read only filesytem
Jun 01 16:10:40 <timeless_mbp> (typos mine)
Jun 01 16:10:46 <Stskeeps> ah, -R
Jun 01 16:16:21 * GAN800 wonders how Maemo Devices is doing.
Jun 01 16:17:31 <Stskeeps> party? ;)
Jun 01 16:22:09 <GAN800> Maybe they're fighting over territory with paper shuriken and cardboard tube swords.
Jun 01 16:22:22 <fiferboy> lbt: Would adding a boolean variable to check against instead of the object itself solve this?
Jun 01 16:23:33 <lbt> no... the constructor can't use signals..
Jun 01 16:23:37 <lbt> well it can
Jun 01 16:23:41 <lbt> but it won't work
Jun 01 16:24:22 <lbt> nah, they tried the prototype hardware compiler and it blew up... <eek>
Jun 01 16:24:34 <lbt> ^^ @ GAN800
Jun 01 16:25:10 <fiferboy> lbt: Is the solution then to set the FingerScrollable property somewhere outside of the constructor?
Jun 01 16:25:12 <Stskeeps> i still believe that was a countdown
Jun 01 16:25:18 <Stskeeps> too much activity => blow up
Jun 01 16:25:33 <Stskeeps> which is what the accelerometers are for
Jun 01 16:25:33 <Stskeeps> :P
Jun 01 16:25:41 <lbt> fiferboy: mmm dunno.... busy on something else ATM ... nag me though
Jun 01 16:26:14 <fiferboy> lbt: Okay.  I'll try to figure it out and fall back on pestering you if that fails.
Jun 01 16:26:28 <lbt> sure
Jun 01 16:36:45 <Stskeeps> seriously, why are people working on the maemo matchbox-window-manager (v1)
Jun 01 16:37:48 <lcuk> cos you are watching
Jun 01 16:39:01 <methods> are there any generalized voip programs that let me connect to a sip provider that work nicely ?
Jun 01 16:50:41 <wazd_n800> damn, so hot in Moscow...
Jun 01 16:56:37 <wjs_ltop> ping lcuk
Jun 01 17:00:03 <ciroip> oh, moskow and hot in same sentece is an oxymoron
Jun 01 17:00:32 <lcuk> ciroip, its a really nice summer blast over northern europe as a whole
Jun 01 17:00:37 <lcuk> wjs_ltop, pong
Jun 01 17:00:48 <ShadowJK> the mer helsinki weather screenshot is probably accurate now
Jun 01 17:01:01 <fiferboy> wazd_n800: My wife and I were watching the news and she said "How is it hotter in Moscow than it is here?!"
Jun 01 17:01:07 <wjs_ltop> lcuk: You mentioned keesj might have newer liqbase packages, but I haven't been able to locate...
Jun 01 17:01:09 <lcuk> heh
Jun 01 17:01:16 <lcuk> google libliqbase
Jun 01 17:01:19 <qwerty12> fiferboy: You're in Canada, get used to it :P
Jun 01 17:01:23 <lcuk> its got the stuff we did at weekend
Jun 01 17:01:36 <fiferboy> qwerty12: Southern Canada!
Jun 01 17:02:06 <qwerty12> There's a difference? :P
Jun 01 17:02:31 <Myrtti> polar bears, moose and lumberjacks
Jun 01 17:02:33 <lcuk> qwerty12, its similar to north/south england divide ;)
Jun 01 17:02:46 <lcuk> and fifer is on the crap side ;P
Jun 01 17:02:55 <qwerty12> lcuk: Oh, yes, I can see fiferboy is located in the better part then
Jun 01 17:03:13 <fiferboy> lcuk: Hey!  South is where it is at, Canada or England!
Jun 01 17:03:30 <qwerty12> fiferboy: I've been telling him that for so long :(
Jun 01 17:03:48 <fiferboy> They just don't listen in the North
Jun 01 17:03:49 <GAN800> Hot. Psh.
Jun 01 17:04:04 <lcuk> hehehehehe
Jun 01 17:04:07 <wjs_ltop> lcuk, are the debs in git?  or do I have to compile?
Jun 01 17:04:16 <lcuk> you would have to compile for now
Jun 01 17:04:17 <GAN800> Get back to me when it's 95F in the shade and 140% hummidity. :p
Jun 01 17:04:27 <lcuk> im sorting out a few isms in it and specifics
Jun 01 17:04:38 <lcuk> but the packages exist and can be worked on
Jun 01 17:04:42 <wjs_ltop> lcuk: ok, just checking..
Jun 01 17:04:50 <lcuk> infact the vworld app itself is gonna be shaped properly now
Jun 01 17:04:57 <|R> hehe, south canada... like 99% of the population :P
Jun 01 17:05:15 <lcuk> yeah wjs_ltop :) ive gone from having no way at all to package it, now its feasible to run on multi oses
Jun 01 17:05:17 <lcuk> :)
Jun 01 17:05:46 <lcuk> after ive done what im doing this afternoon i will be applying for a new garage account for the library itself
Jun 01 17:07:36 <wazd_n800> ciroip: well, we don't have winter 365 days a year)
Jun 01 17:07:45 <lcuk> apart from now
Jun 01 17:07:48 <lcuk> are you melting wazd?
Jun 01 17:08:04 <wazd_n800> yeah(
Jun 01 17:08:09 <lcuk> heh me too
Jun 01 17:08:19 <lcuk> i need aircon
Jun 01 17:09:10 <wazd_n800> according to omweather we have fricking 32ºC
Jun 01 17:10:13 <wazd_n800> heading to my country underground bunker))
Jun 01 17:10:23 <lcuk> yeah it gets a bit stuck sometimes, give it a shake and it will finish going up
Jun 01 17:11:16 <lcuk> hehehehe :D what a wicked app for device
Jun 01 17:11:23 <lcuk> a barometer you have to tap like a real one
Jun 01 17:14:28 <wazd_n800> btw, was there an accelerometer support in those device prefabs at the weekend?
Jun 01 17:14:48 <wazd_n800> or screen rotation
Jun 01 17:15:25 <lcuk> didnt see either but that doesnt mean it wasnt there - we had the sme apps as on the sdk basically
Jun 01 17:15:41 <lcuk> just running on real omap3 hardware
Jun 01 17:15:47 * lcuk drools when saying that
Jun 01 17:17:07 * wazd_n800 drools when thinking of «final beta» SDK
Jun 01 17:17:16 <cmug> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maemo_Platform#Maemo_SDK has broken links :(
Jun 01 17:17:28 <lcuk> fix em then
Jun 01 17:17:50 <cmug> :)
Jun 01 17:18:06 <Myrtti> {{sofixit}}
Jun 01 17:18:08 <lcuk> http://maemo.org/development/sdks/
Jun 01 17:18:19 <lcuk> is the starting point for maemo based sdk documentation
Jun 01 17:18:26 <lcuk> you should be able to find whatever you need from there
Jun 01 17:18:52 <cmug> yes. I was just browsing around generally and noticed a dead link
Jun 01 17:19:04 <cmug> trying to find the correct target..
Jun 01 17:19:07 <lcuk> you sure it wasn't just sleeping?
Jun 01 17:19:25 <cmug> http://maemo.org/development/training/maemo_technology_overview_content/ is what I think is correct
Jun 01 17:19:50 <cmug> http://maemo.org/maemo_training_material/maemo4.x/html/maemo_Technology_Overview/index.html is the link in Wikipedia that is broken
Jun 01 17:20:40 <wazd_n800> and what about screen type, was it reflective/transflective/OLED/AMOLED/Monochrome?
Jun 01 17:21:03 <lcuk> didnt have enough lighting variation to tell
Jun 01 17:21:06 <lcuk> it was color of course
Jun 01 17:21:19 * ciroip want a monochrome device
Jun 01 17:21:19 <Stskeeps> greyscale!
Jun 01 17:21:28 <lcuk> 3x resolution for greyscale
Jun 01 17:21:30 * lcuk would love that
Jun 01 17:21:40 <lcuk> REALLY love it
Jun 01 17:22:15 <lcuk> 2400*480 or 800*1440 depending on orientation of pels
Jun 01 17:22:26 <ciroip> we are freaks: I wonder how Nokia still listen the maemo community
Jun 01 17:22:40 <lcuk> ciroip, which part are you noticing now
Jun 01 17:23:46 <ciroip> just a generic realization
Jun 01 17:25:56 <fiferboy> lbt: Got it working.
Jun 01 17:27:04 <GAN800> wazd_n800, transflective.
Jun 01 17:27:24 <wazd_n800> lbt: btw, have you done any of my suggestions for Shopper?)
Jun 01 17:28:54 <wazd_n800> GAN800, nice
Jun 01 17:28:56 <lcuk> yes wazd_n800 he has made vodka a default item on a new shopping list :p it should save you some time lol
Jun 01 17:29:15 <lcuk> cheese, bacon, vodka
Jun 01 17:29:21 <lcuk> that should keep us going for a while
Jun 01 17:29:31 <GAN800> wazd_n800, from what I hear, it's way clearer than the N810's.
Jun 01 17:29:35 <wazd_n800> lcuk: vodka. eeeww >.<
Jun 01 17:30:25 <wazd_n800> lcuk: bring out Tequilla!)
Jun 01 17:30:27 <lcuk> lol ok
Jun 01 17:30:56 <ShadowJK> I want a holographic screen
Jun 01 17:31:11 <lbt> wazd yes... hit some bugs in Qt and then got sidetracked onto Mer though
Jun 01 17:31:22 <lbt> so no functional changes yet
Jun 01 17:31:54 <ShadowJK> Not to make things jump out of the device, but to make a "flat" screen apper deep inside the device.. Imagine if could put it 5cm infront of your eyes but focus eyes like it was a 50" screen a few metres away
Jun 01 17:32:35 <wazd_n800> ShadowJK, that's easy:)
Jun 01 17:32:53 <ShadowJK> oh?
Jun 01 17:33:36 <wazd_n800> ShadowJK, use accelerometer and camera to track device position and move it around imaginary huge screen :)
Jun 01 17:33:52 <Stskeeps> yeah, AR would be nice :
Jun 01 17:33:53 <Stskeeps> P
Jun 01 17:34:33 <ShadowJK> wazd_n800, oh but I'd want all of the screen visible at the same time :)
Jun 01 17:34:54 <wazd_n800> ShadowJK, and zoom in/out with some optical distortion effect)
Jun 01 17:35:37 <wazd_n800> ShadowJK, $250 and you'll have video glasses then)
Jun 01 17:35:51 <ShadowJK> I wonder if nokia is spending any money on some crazy lunatic in a nokia building's basement somewhere experimenting with holographics
Jun 01 17:36:01 <ShadowJK> yeah but all the video glasses are lowres :/
Jun 01 17:36:03 <fiferboy> lbt: I'm going to see if I can find out why horizontal bounce isn't working, then look at the overshoot function
Jun 01 17:36:04 <Stskeeps> i'm almost willing to say they probably do
Jun 01 17:36:20 <Stskeeps> maemo sw seems quite vibrant at least
Jun 01 17:36:54 <wazd_n800> ShadowJK, i don't think that nokia develops screens or other low-level hardware
Jun 01 17:38:56 <wazd_n800> jesus christ
Jun 01 17:39:07 <wazd_n800> http://research.nokia.com/research/mobile3D
Jun 01 17:39:30 <Stskeeps> ais this new?
Jun 01 17:39:44 <Pavlov> is that a n800?
Jun 01 17:40:09 <RST38h> well n800 with stuff flying out of the screen is new
Jun 01 17:40:30 <cmug> I hear they use them in Nokia offices all day long
Jun 01 17:40:30 <Pavlov> how do i take advantage of the flying-out-of-the-screen tech in my app?
Jun 01 17:40:31 <luke-jr> ö
Jun 01 17:40:32 <ShadowJK> "modified N800"
Jun 01 17:40:39 <wazd_n800> It's an n800 with stereoscopic screen)
Jun 01 17:40:53 <RST38h> ohmygod
Jun 01 17:41:10 <lcuk> whoa! that device has powervr working!
Jun 01 17:41:32 <ShadowJK> lcuk, naah...
Jun 01 17:41:41 <ShadowJK> I don't think powervr is useful for this :)
Jun 01 17:41:48 <wazd_n800> lcuk: that's everything you've noticed?))
Jun 01 17:41:55 <Pavlov> too bad about the h.264 part
Jun 01 17:42:34 <lcuk> theres more?
Jun 01 17:42:48 <lcuk> ShadowJK, you need some extra horse power to run anything realtime lol
Jun 01 17:44:06 <RST38h> it is just a way to compress stereoscopic video in some special efficient way
Jun 01 17:44:07 <ShadowJK> Well they didn't specify resolution :)
Jun 01 17:44:14 <ShadowJK> RST38h, yep :-)
Jun 01 17:44:23 <RST38h> no actual 3d involved although looks cool
Jun 01 17:45:13 <lcuk> so no 3d apps
Jun 01 17:45:20 <ShadowJK> It could be two 176 x 144 videos :)
Jun 01 17:46:00 <ShadowJK> or two 176x144 video streams... the thing is to find ways to take advantage of the similarities between the two streams, and encode them efficiently
Jun 01 17:46:37 <ShadowJK> lcuk, well if you had these modifications they did, you might be able to do 3D in liqbase ;-)
Jun 01 17:47:27 <ShadowJK> probably needs 3D shutter glasses or something..
Jun 01 17:47:54 <lcuk> i will do 3d in liqbase once i get net syncing working
Jun 01 17:48:04 <lcuk> having almost identical stuff on 2 different devices ;)
Jun 01 17:48:58 <fiferboy> lbt: Fixed horizontal bounce :)
Jun 01 17:48:59 * lcuk can see the tunneling effect of liq* screens working really well
Jun 01 17:49:11 <lcuk> and since its multiple layers deep (as far as the designer specifies..)
Jun 01 17:52:30 <fiferboy> brb, coffee
Jun 01 17:53:59 <lbt> fiferboy: did it have horiz/vert swapped?
Jun 01 17:54:03 <lbt> bbiab ..food
Jun 01 17:54:20 <fiferboy> lbt: Yes, vsh references in horizontal code
Jun 01 17:55:57 <fiferboy> /s/vsh/vsb
Jun 01 18:13:49 <sb2victim> hello world
Jun 01 18:14:04 <sb2victim> $ sb2-show
Jun 01 18:14:08 <sb2victim> sb2-show: error while loading shared libraries: libsb2.so.1: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory
Jun 01 18:14:23 <sb2victim> is that supposed to happen? :)
Jun 01 18:14:49 <sb2victim> oh awesome
Jun 01 18:14:51 <cmug> Did the Sports Tracker for Maemo ever see the light of day?
Jun 01 18:14:54 <sb2victim> 'sb2-show' must be executed inside sb2 sandbox (see the 'sb2'command)
Jun 01 18:15:18 <sb2victim> cmug: beyond being presented at MozMae?
Jun 01 18:16:07 <cmug> sb2victim, http://search.maemo.org/search?q=sports&btnG=Search&site=maemo-org&client=maemo-org&proxystylesheet=maemo-org&output=xml_no_dtd has an archived news "First preview of Sports Tracker for Maemo available!" but that leads nowhere and is the only clue on the subject that I can find
Jun 01 18:16:36 <cmug> I can dig up about MozMae
Jun 01 18:16:59 <cmug> was that the event this weekend in Cph?
Jun 01 18:17:02 <Stskeeps> yup
Jun 01 18:17:11 <cmug> It was demoed there?
Jun 01 18:17:12 <Stskeeps> wasnt it ecoach?
Jun 01 18:17:21 <sb2victim> isn't that the same thing?
Jun 01 18:17:40 <sb2victim> if it quacks like a duck
Jun 01 18:18:07 <cmug> well Sports Tracker also has a community on the website
Jun 01 18:18:08 <sb2victim> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Duck_test
Jun 01 18:18:22 <cmug> ecoach doesn't appear to be compatible
Jun 01 18:18:28 <sb2victim> the picture btw is quite nice
Jun 01 18:22:02 <sb2victim> sp3000: whatever this window manager is, it sucks. i want my OQO r2, it has a tinier screen and an eraser pointer, but at least i can move windows around, whereas this large screen and real mouse+keyboard manage to make such basic operations incredibly difficult
Jun 01 18:22:34 <sp3000> really?
Jun 01 18:22:42 <sb2victim> yep
Jun 01 18:22:53 <Stskeeps> what device is that?
Jun 01 18:23:19 <sb2victim> this? it's a full dell workstation w/ widescreen lcd, ibm keyboard, dell usb wheel mouse, and ubuntu 9.04
Jun 01 18:23:59 <Stskeeps> ah
Jun 01 18:25:38 <StOrM_NW> anyway to kill the Connection Manager?
Jun 01 18:26:29 <qwerty12_N800> /etc/init.d/icd2 stop - if I understand your question properly
Jun 01 18:27:48 <sb2victim> sb2-init: Host architecture is 'i[3456]86'
Jun 01 18:27:53 * sb2victim applauds sb2
Jun 01 18:29:03 <jaem> hey folks
Jun 01 18:29:53 <jaem> should Midori bugs (on Maemo) go to the Midori bugtracker, or the maemo.org bugtracker?
Jun 01 18:30:09 <sb2victim> jaem: if you know they're upstream, send them upstream
Jun 01 18:30:18 <sb2victim> if you want to show that we're talking to upstream
Jun 01 18:30:31 <sb2victim> file them in maemo and andre or someone (e.g. you) can refile them upstream
Jun 01 18:30:43 * sb2victim returns to cursing sb2
Jun 01 18:31:09 <jaem> sb2victim: it seems to be upstream to me, but I wasn't entirely sure what the maemo maintainer had done with it
Jun 01 18:31:24 <sb2victim> in that case, feel free to file it in maemo
Jun 01 18:31:25 <jaem> the issue is that it seems to accept n-1 chars in a textbox limited to n chars
Jun 01 18:31:28 <qwerty12_N800> jaem: not much...
Jun 01 18:31:37 <StOrM_NW> ok my problem is that using the Connection Manager, the icon  at top conner ... i can connect to an AP, but if i execute i get this
Jun 01 18:31:42 <jaem> sb2victim: okay, sure
Jun 01 18:31:53 <qwerty12_N800> jaem: that's a webkit bug pertaining to Bundyo's build
Jun 01 18:31:56 <sb2victim> although, i don't think i've created a midori product
Jun 01 18:31:58 <StOrM_NW> wlan0     NOT READY  ESSID:off/any  
Jun 01 18:31:59 <StOrM_NW>           Mode:Auto  Channel:0  Access Point: Not-Associated  
Jun 01 18:31:59 <StOrM_NW>           Link Quality:0  Signal level:0  Noise level:0
Jun 01 18:31:59 <StOrM_NW>           Rx invalid nwid:0  invalid crypt:0  invalid misc:0
Jun 01 18:32:03 <jaem> qwerty12_N800: ah, okay
Jun 01 18:32:07 <jaem> so it's already known?
Jun 01 18:32:07 <sb2victim> i can create one now if you need it
Jun 01 18:32:10 <andre__> jaem: there is no Midori project in bugs.maemo.org. Hence preferably upstream :)
Jun 01 18:32:28 <jaem> andre__: okay
Jun 01 18:32:37 <sb2victim> andre__: awww, just because you don't want more work :)
Jun 01 18:32:41 <qwerty12_N800> sb2victim: don't bother - i'm the (unofficial) maintainer and newer versions are not possible to build
Jun 01 18:32:52 <qwerty12_N800> jaem: yep
Jun 01 18:32:52 <sb2victim> qwerty12_N800: ok
Jun 01 18:32:55 <jaem> it caused me some grief when I was trying to pay bills/other stuff
Jun 01 18:32:56 <jaem> :P
Jun 01 18:33:01 <andre__> sb2victim, if the maintainer wants it, i can add it, sure
Jun 01 18:33:26 <jaem> for some reason, they make me enter the *whole* credit card number, when they're going to star out half of it anyways...
Jun 01 18:33:28 <jaem> just kidding
Jun 01 18:34:19 <StOrM_NW> i m using the cx3110x driver
Jun 01 18:34:55 <jaem> qwerty12_N800: is that one of the issues that the Mer team is waiting on a new build of libwebkit for? (as mentioned in the sprints)
Jun 01 18:35:09 <Stskeeps> ah, no, we got the new libwebkit (bundyo's)
Jun 01 18:35:17 <StOrM_NW> anything that can explain why i cant set wifi parameters using any tool like iwconfig for example?
Jun 01 18:35:46 <Stskeeps> StOrM_NW: wireless extensions weren't up to date when the driver was made, probably
Jun 01 18:36:41 <jaem> thanks for the info - I'm off to do useful stuff
Jun 01 18:37:23 <StOrM_NW> so any recommendation? flash the device with newest version of maemo? reinstall any tool or other tips that i can get?
Jun 01 18:40:30 <luke-jr> StOrM_NW: upgrade to a maintained driver
Jun 01 18:40:43 <luke-jr> like stlc45xx or, if you like bleeding edge, p54spi
Jun 01 18:43:37 <johnx> StOrM_NW: there's a version of the wifi driver with the WEXT stuff patched in
Jun 01 18:45:29 <StOrM_NW> any of these maintained driver is stable to use to ad hoc networks? where can i find this version johnx?
Jun 01 18:47:05 <minra-> is there an alternate, lightwright media player?  diablo MP wont let me skip forward/back accurately
Jun 01 18:47:25 <johnx> minra-: check out mplayer
Jun 01 18:47:32 <minra-> need to search in a 2hr mp3
Jun 01 18:47:42 <luke-jr> StOrM_NW: I've never seen anyone use ad-hoc
Jun 01 18:47:51 <minra-> mplayer stopped outputting sound here :(
Jun 01 18:48:02 <johnx> StOrM_NW: let's see if I can find a binary package you can unpack and use
Jun 01 18:48:25 <StOrM_NW> k
Jun 01 18:48:46 <lcuk> johnx, why are you not out enjoying copenhagen
Jun 01 18:48:56 <lcuk> its a travesty
Jun 01 18:49:02 <johnx> lcuk: cause I did all freaking day
Jun 01 18:49:07 <johnx> and now I'm beat :P
Jun 01 18:49:11 <lcuk> then do it all freaking night!
Jun 01 18:49:21 <johnx> I will in a moment actually
Jun 01 18:49:23 <johnx> :D
Jun 01 18:49:27 <luke-jr> …
Jun 01 18:49:33 <johnx> adam is taking a nap
Jun 01 18:49:43 <lcuk> lol aww poor thing
Jun 01 18:49:47 <johnx> once he gets up we're gonna head out and find dinner and ... who knows :)
Jun 01 18:49:49 <lcuk> hows the digs?
Jun 01 18:49:56 <johnx> heh, little crowded
Jun 01 18:50:11 <lcuk> are you taking everything with you or have you got a locker
Jun 01 18:51:47 <johnx> we've got a locker
Jun 01 18:51:48 <s33k3rgr> i have a problem with my n810
Jun 01 18:51:59 <s33k3rgr> i cant install stardict
Jun 01 18:52:00 <johnx> lcuk, wouldn't be able to do much without one
Jun 01 18:52:19 <s33k3rgr> Application packages missing: libhildondesktop0(=1:2.0.18-1)
Jun 01 18:52:19 <s33k3rgr> libhildonfm2(=1:2.0.5)
Jun 01 18:52:19 <s33k3rgr> libhildonwm0(1:2.0.18-1) "
Jun 01 18:52:30 <s33k3rgr> it gives me that message
Jun 01 18:52:36 <s33k3rgr> can anyone help
Jun 01 18:52:38 <s33k3rgr> ?\
Jun 01 18:53:21 <qwerty12_N800> ~flashing
Jun 01 18:53:23 <infobot> somebody said flashing was http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware
Jun 01 18:53:24 <lcuk> s33k3rgr, i guess you have to find a source for libhildondesktop0!
Jun 01 18:53:31 <qwerty12_N800> time to update.
Jun 01 18:53:59 <s33k3rgr> how can i do that?
Jun 01 18:54:04 <qwerty12_N800> ~flashing
Jun 01 18:54:05 <infobot> flashing is probably http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware
Jun 01 18:54:05 <johnx> StOrM_NW: still tracking it down ...
Jun 01 18:54:17 <s33k3rgr> ill try
Jun 01 18:54:26 * RST38h moos gleefully
Jun 01 18:54:26 <lcuk> backup first
Jun 01 18:54:37 <lcuk> lol RST38h enjoying the sun or new batch of vodka?
Jun 01 18:54:40 <s33k3rgr> my version is 4.2008.30-2
Jun 01 18:54:55 <qwerty12_N800> moo RST38h
Jun 01 18:55:44 <johnx> s33k3rgr: that's not the latest version
Jun 01 18:56:07 <johnx> you should be able to update with the application manager to a later version, but if that doesn't work you'll just want t flash
Jun 01 18:56:09 <RST38h> lcuk: enjoying the evening breeze rather
Jun 01 18:56:10 <s33k3rgr> and that has to do with the installation of the stardict?
Jun 01 18:56:17 <lcuk> RST38h :)
Jun 01 18:56:37 <RST38h> qwerty: frozen bubble was cool =)
Jun 01 18:56:41 <lcuk> johnx, go to christiana and enjoy the atmosphere and see if they will take you in for a couple of days
Jun 01 18:56:44 <lcuk> offer code for a home
Jun 01 18:56:51 <johnx> s33k3rgr: well run this in X Terminal:
Jun 01 18:56:56 <johnx> apt-cache policy libhildondesktop0
Jun 01 18:57:00 <johnx> see what version you get
Jun 01 18:57:04 <RST38h> qwerty: there is S60 version done in pure C/C++ too, it should be way smaller but more difficult to port
Jun 01 18:57:05 <s33k3rgr> ok
Jun 01 18:57:09 <s33k3rgr> wait
Jun 01 18:57:09 <qwerty12_N800> RST38h: you actually installed it? perl deps are huge :)
Jun 01 18:57:26 <RST38h> qwerty: no :) but I like playing it on the phone or pc
Jun 01 18:57:46 <qwerty12_N800> RST38h: heh :)
Jun 01 19:01:22 <johnx> s33k3rgr: where are you trying to install stardict from?
Jun 01 19:02:30 <s33k3rgr> from application manager offcourse
Jun 01 19:02:42 <s33k3rgr> is there any other way??
Jun 01 19:04:02 <johnx> some people download random files from the internet intended for different versions of Maemo/OS2008
Jun 01 19:04:22 <s33k3rgr> where can i find those three?
Jun 01 19:04:32 <johnx> those are three core libraries
Jun 01 19:04:41 <johnx> you probably have them installed but have different versions
Jun 01 19:05:21 <s33k3rgr> can i check with the same command you gave me above?
Jun 01 19:05:38 <johnx> yup
Jun 01 19:05:46 <johnx> you know how to read the results, right?
Jun 01 19:06:02 <s33k3rgr> i ll tell you
Jun 01 19:06:04 <johnx> StOrM_NW: Mer recently reorganized their repository a little bit
Jun 01 19:06:15 <johnx> I didn't forget you, but I'm still looking :)
Jun 01 19:06:19 <StOrM_NW> lol
Jun 01 19:06:20 <StOrM_NW> ok
Jun 01 19:07:04 <StOrM_NW> but this version that ya are looking for is the one that is the cx3110x modified?
Jun 01 19:07:15 <s33k3rgr> ok for libhildondesktop0 it is installed as i can see here
Jun 01 19:07:28 <johnx> StOrM_NW, exactly
Jun 01 19:07:36 <johnx> s33k3rgr: it needs exactly the right version
Jun 01 19:07:43 <StOrM_NW> because i guess its the one that is installed atm
Jun 01 19:07:50 <s33k3rgr> it is the right
Jun 01 19:07:55 <StOrM_NW> that i m having some troubles
Jun 01 19:08:03 <johnx> StOrM_NW: ah, no ideas then
Jun 01 19:08:07 <johnx> anyways, got to head off for now
Jun 01 19:08:12 <Stskeeps> have fun!
Jun 01 19:08:13 <StOrM_NW> thanks anyway
Jun 01 19:08:13 <johnx> need to eat before it gets too late :)
Jun 01 19:08:18 <johnx> 'night all
Jun 01 19:08:34 <StOrM_NW> night
Jun 01 19:12:55 <s33k3rgr> it seems that all three files are insalled
Jun 01 19:13:01 <s33k3rgr> installed
Jun 01 19:13:10 <s33k3rgr> with the right versions
Jun 01 19:14:07 <hub> what version of Xephyr do you guys use?
Jun 01 19:14:33 <s33k3rgr> anyone any ideas?
Jun 01 19:17:21 <s33k3rgr> should i make an update?
Jun 01 19:19:39 <s33k3rgr> ??
Jun 01 19:22:10 <s33k3rgr> guys?
Jun 01 19:30:17 <fiferboy> lbt: I've got overshoot to obey the bounds and work like you had it, and the scrollbar squishes when you are in the overshoot area (assuming it is not already at the minimum)
Jun 01 19:36:49 <lbt> fiferboy: very nice...
Jun 01 19:37:32 <lbt> did you change the paint event handler?
Jun 01 19:37:38 <lbt> or just go out of bounds still?
Jun 01 19:38:18 <fiferboy> lbt: It is actually very similar to your solution, only it changes the minimum/maximum value as well so the value is always in bounds.
Jun 01 19:38:30 <lbt> ah...
Jun 01 19:38:31 <fiferboy> This provides the squish to the scrollbars
Jun 01 19:38:58 <lbt> hmm
Jun 01 19:39:03 <fiferboy> But it still has the disadvantage of a somewhat undefined behaviour when minimum is less than 0
Jun 01 19:40:15 <fiferboy> I was looking at how h-p-a does it, by inserting an overshoot rectangle
Jun 01 19:43:48 <jamiebennett> Any garage admins around that want to approve an upload request to Maemo Extra's?
Jun 01 19:46:52 <VDVsx> jamiebennett, -> X-Fade
Jun 01 19:47:16 <jamiebennett> VDVsx: I know X-Fade I meant around as in available ;)
Jun 01 20:08:00 <s33k3rgr> can anyone help me installing stardict ??
Jun 01 20:08:18 <s33k3rgr> i just updated my n810 to the latest diablo version
Jun 01 20:09:14 <Bobbe> Man, ircing on an E71 sucks
Jun 01 20:09:14 <Bobbe> Anyways, just a question
Jun 01 20:09:14 <Bobbe> Are there videos of fremantle running? If so, where?
Jun 01 20:10:20 <Stskeeps> only the sdk stuff i think
Jun 01 20:11:59 <Bobbe> Ah those vm videos running?
Jun 01 20:14:24 <Bobbe> Ok then. somebody mentioned it in the forum and I thought it was something more revealing
Jun 01 20:22:14 <VDVsx> Bobbe, http://www.youtube.com/results?search_type=&search_query=maemo+5&aq=f
Jun 01 20:22:43 <VDVsx> the first 3 show the sdk running
Jun 01 20:28:44 <fiferboy> lbt: I'll look at changing the painter at some point in the next day
Jun 01 20:38:46 <hub> how long does it take to be approved to upload to extras?
Jun 01 20:39:11 <hub> the website seems to say "a few hours"...
Jun 01 20:40:00 <zakkm> hub: its done manually, so its up to them i believe
Jun 01 20:40:16 <hub> yeah but then the "a few hours" is misleading :-)
Jun 01 20:40:42 <zakkm> most time stuff is :P
Jun 01 20:40:45 <hub> "so don't be alarmed if it takes a few hours before you get an anwser."
Jun 01 20:41:12 <hub> and I wonder if that's the reason why I have no option to upload my ssh key
Jun 01 20:41:33 <zakkm> if you add to extras, it will put in extras repository
Jun 01 20:41:44 <zakkm> you couldnt add your own server to that through ssh
Jun 01 20:43:03 <hub> I don't understand. I was talking about http://wiki.maemo.org/Uploading_to_Extras#Setting_up_SSH_to_upload_to_extras
Jun 01 20:43:36 <lcuk> This step is unnecessary if you are only going to use the web-based Extras Assistant wizard to upload.
Jun 01 20:44:07 <hub> lcuk: but necessary if you don't want
Jun 01 20:44:24 <lcuk> yeah but can be done at a later date
Jun 01 20:44:33 <lcuk> i think the interface is only open once you have been accepted
Jun 01 20:44:40 <qwerty12_N800> ^
Jun 01 20:44:49 <hub> ok
Jun 01 20:44:59 <hub> it is just unclear
Jun 01 20:45:01 <jamiebennett> having a torrid time with extra's at the moment :(
Jun 01 20:45:17 <hub> as any other "forge" based system allow uploading ssh keys from start
Jun 01 20:45:27 <hub> and then give permission when needed
Jun 01 20:45:54 <lcuk> some key people went to copenhagen this weekend, there might be a bit of a backlog
Jun 01 20:46:11 <hub> ah right
Jun 01 20:46:21 <lcuk> mozilla / maemo hackfest (H)
Jun 01 20:46:45 <jamiebennett> anyone packaged or packaging debhelper > 7.0?
Jun 01 20:47:01 <lcuk> jamiebennett, i see you are doing entertainer for device
Jun 01 20:47:07 <lcuk> have you actually run it on it yet?
Jun 01 20:47:30 <jamiebennett> lcuk: Just trying to satisfy the dependancies and upload them. Hit a brick wall at the moment
Jun 01 20:47:34 <hub> is there any way to test the "hildon input method" with free software?
Jun 01 20:47:36 <andre__> ....copenhagen, plus today is holiday in some countries
Jun 01 20:47:43 <hub> or am I up to a huge disappointement....
Jun 01 20:48:26 <jamiebennett> lcuk: need a few packages that aren't in extra's and getting some weird build errors
Jun 01 20:49:16 <VDVsx> GeneralAntilles, ping
Jun 01 20:51:27 <lcuk> jamiebennett, that doesnt answer my question lol
Jun 01 20:52:34 <jamiebennett> lcuk: I need to satisfy the dependencies before I can install it in scratchbox :P (and get a developer device before it see's proper hardware)
Jun 01 20:53:13 <zakkm> jamiebennett: care to show the build log that failed, i might be able to have some insight why it might have
Jun 01 20:53:32 <lcuk> jamiebennett, ahhh yeah it wont even try to run on this device
Jun 01 20:53:41 <qwerty12_N800> jamiebennett: newer debhelper was uploaded one but it broke every build sent :p
Jun 01 20:53:54 <qwerty12_N800> *once
Jun 01 20:54:04 <jamiebennett> [sbox-FREMANTLE_ARMEL: ~/debhelper] > vi dh_auto_
Jun 01 20:54:04 <jamiebennett> dh_auto_build      dh_auto_clean      dh_auto_install
Jun 01 20:54:05 <jamiebennett> dh_auto_build~     dh_auto_configure  dh_auto_test
Jun 01 20:54:05 <jamiebennett> [sbox-FREMANTLE_ARMEL: ~/debhelper] > vi dh_auto_clean
Jun 01 20:54:05 <jamiebennett> [sbox-FREMANTLE_ARMEL: ~/debhelper] > vi dh_auto_
Jun 01 20:54:05 <jamiebennett> dh_auto_build      dh_auto_clean      dh_auto_configure  dh_auto_test
Jun 01 20:54:07 <jamiebennett> dh_auto_build~     dh_auto_clean~     dh_auto_install
Jun 01 20:54:09 <jamiebennett> [sbox-FREMANTLE_ARMEL: ~/debhelper] > vi dh_auto_configure
Jun 01 20:54:11 <jamiebennett> [sbox-FREMANTLE_ARMEL: ~/debhelper] > vi dh_auto_install
Jun 01 20:54:11 <zakkm> ...
Jun 01 20:54:13 <jamiebennett> [sbox-FREMANTLE_ARMEL: ~/debhelper] > dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot -sa -S -i
Jun 01 20:54:14 <lcuk> ....
Jun 01 20:54:15 <jamiebennett> dpkg-buildpackage: source package is debhelper
Jun 01 20:54:16 <lcuk> STOP
Jun 01 20:54:17 <jamiebennett> dpkg-buildpackage: source version is 7.2.14
Jun 01 20:54:19 <jamiebennett> dpkg-buildpackage: source changed by Joey Hess <joeyh@debian.org>
Jun 01 20:54:21 <jamiebennett> dpkg-buildpackage: source version without epoch 7.2.14
Jun 01 20:54:21 <qwerty12_N800> ~pastebin
Jun 01 20:54:23 <jamiebennett>  fakeroot debian/rules clean
Jun 01 20:54:23 <infobot> [~pastebin] A "pastebin" is a web-based service where you can paste anything over 3 lines without flooding the channel. Here are links to a few : http://www.pastebin.com , http://pastebin.ca , http://channels.debian.net/paste , http://paste.lisp.org , http://www.rafb.net/paste
Jun 01 20:54:23 <qwerty12_N800> ~pastebin
Jun 01 20:54:24 <qwerty12_N800> ~pastebin
Jun 01 20:54:24 <VDVsx> pastebin :P
Jun 01 20:54:25 <jamiebennett> ./run dh clean
Jun 01 20:54:27 <jamiebennett> Unknown option: w
Jun 01 20:54:27 <qwerty12_N800> ~pastebin
Jun 01 20:54:29 <jamiebennett> dh: unknown option; aborting
Jun 01 20:54:29 <zakkm> jamie, quit channel
Jun 01 20:54:31 <jamiebennett> make: *** [clean] Error 1
Jun 01 20:54:32 <qwerty12_N800> ~pastebin
Jun 01 20:54:33 <jamiebennett> ignore the vi bit :)
Jun 01 20:54:33 <infobot> [~pastebin] A "pastebin" is a web-based service where you can paste anything over 3 lines without flooding the channel. Here are links to a few : http://www.pastebin.com , http://pastebin.ca , http://channels.debian.net/paste , http://paste.lisp.org , http://www.rafb.net/paste
Jun 01 20:54:35 <lcuk> hehehe
Jun 01 20:54:38 <jamiebennett> :P
Jun 01 20:54:39 <lcuk> hes gonna get the boot
Jun 01 20:54:39 <zakkm> omg okay
Jun 01 20:54:41 <hub> ffs
Jun 01 20:54:42 <zakkm> not what i meant
Jun 01 20:55:05 <jamiebennett> hey whats a few lines between friends ;)
Jun 01 20:55:20 <lcuk> explain that to the other 275 people over there lol >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Jun 01 20:55:30 <lcuk> 274
Jun 01 20:55:51 <jamiebennett> lcuk: its educational ;)
Jun 01 20:56:22 <lcuk> yeah they now have you on autoignore for 15 minutes :d
Jun 01 20:56:35 <zakkm> heh
Jun 01 20:56:58 <jamiebennett> OK OK for the pastebin crowd - http://pastebin.com/m549f0eb1
Jun 01 20:58:14 <jamiebennett> qwery12_N800 so it looks like debhelper is being packaged by someone else at the moment?
Jun 01 20:58:46 <qwerty12_N800> Nope :)
Jun 01 20:59:49 <jamiebennett> qwerty12_N800: mmm, damn I need it  (why me ;))
Jun 01 21:00:24 <Macer> well. my n95 got old quick
Jun 01 21:00:30 <Macer> other than using the camera it kinda sucks
Jun 01 21:00:30 <Macer> :)
Jun 01 21:00:38 <qwerty12_N800> jamiebennett: Though I'm curious as to where it's getting "w" from clean. What does run.sh consist of? (pastebin ;))
Jun 01 21:00:38 <Macer> think i'm going to ebay it
Jun 01 21:01:09 <Macer> unless someone learns how to hack the radio in it so i can get on tmob 3G
Jun 01 21:01:18 <Macer> which i am sure is more a physical problem
Jun 01 21:01:54 <jamiebennett> qwerty12_N800: http://pastebin.com/m56e21ed7
Jun 01 21:01:57 <jamiebennett> ;)
Jun 01 21:05:55 <qwerty12_N800> Hmm, looks sane enough imo... :/
Jun 01 21:06:58 <jamiebennett> qwerty12_N800: Giving up on debhelper at the moment and trying to package the other dependencies until I figure it out.
Jun 01 21:12:32 <lcuk> jamiebennett, isnt there rumblings that clutter wont be available for user apps
Jun 01 21:12:47 <jamiebennett> lcuk Don't say that!!!!
Jun 01 21:13:07 <jamiebennett> lcuk: where did you hear that?
Jun 01 21:13:59 <lcuk> http://maemo.org/community/maemo-developers/clutter_in_fremantle-alpha_sdk/
Jun 01 21:17:44 <jamiebennett> lcuk: Just read the thread and I'm not overly clear on the stance. I see there is a bit of hoop jumping to be done but it doesn't rule out clutter based user apps.
Jun 01 21:18:20 <lcuk> heh @ a bit of hoop jumping
Jun 01 21:18:41 <jamiebennett> lcuk: Killing the hildon-desktop
Jun 01 21:18:48 <zakkm> jamiebennett: your planning it for fremantle?
Jun 01 21:19:10 <zakkm> the OS that will only works on the new N900, which nobody seems to like so far from the leaked specs? ;p
Jun 01 21:19:10 <jamiebennett> zakkm: No as it uses clutter and 3d effect's heavily.
Jun 01 21:19:32 <lcuk> zakkm, its much loved actually
Jun 01 21:19:46 <lcuk> theres many folks who are behind it wholeheartedly :) me included
Jun 01 21:19:53 <roope> Well, I've heard from somewhere that the new device is actually rather nice.
Jun 01 21:19:54 <roope> ;)
Jun 01 21:20:03 <zakkm> when the leaked specs thingy came out, i remember alot of people complaining
Jun 01 21:20:05 <lcuk> hiya roope
Jun 01 21:20:15 <kkrusty> briefly what are the specs?
Jun 01 21:20:17 <roope> Hi.
Jun 01 21:20:23 <kkrusty> I recall the screen is smaller
Jun 01 21:20:35 * jamiebennett wonders why my scratchbox refuses to play ball. Permission denied now for installing new packages :(
Jun 01 21:20:49 <zakkm> is it chmod +x'd ?
Jun 01 21:20:55 <lcuk> but then a lot of people would moan about anything right now
Jun 01 21:20:57 <zakkm> it might not be set as executable
Jun 01 21:21:12 <zakkm> oh hah didnt read it all
Jun 01 21:21:23 <lcuk> zakkm, your name does not have a capital letter.  ALL NAMES MUST HAVE A CAPITAL LETTER AND ITS WRONG THAT THEY DO NOT
Jun 01 21:21:38 <zakkm> whatt?
Jun 01 21:21:41 <Macer> k9 is friggin broken
Jun 01 21:21:43 <Macer> argh
Jun 01 21:21:49 <Zakkm> :D
Jun 01 21:21:54 <Zakkm> lcuk ^
Jun 01 21:22:00 * jamiebennett should probably give up for the night
Jun 01 21:22:23 <lcuk> Zakkm, thats the mindset tho
Jun 01 21:22:55 <lcuk> roope, enjoying the sunshine?
Jun 01 21:23:07 <lcuk> and why werent you in copenhagen
Jun 01 21:23:34 <roope> lcuk: Yes, nice sunshine. I wasn't invited there. :) But I'm probably (?) in Amsterdam then.
Jun 01 21:23:44 <lcuk> balls :(
Jun 01 21:23:48 <lcuk> i hope you are!
Jun 01 21:24:06 <roope> So did you go there?
Jun 01 21:24:28 <lcuk> yeah and i came away with a skeleton package for libliqbase
Jun 01 21:24:47 <lcuk> did you see my wicked search for liqbase? :D
Jun 01 21:24:52 <Zakkm> lcuk: whats with all the new stuff people are adding to extras? anthing nice?
Jun 01 21:24:57 <roope> probably not yet.
Jun 01 21:25:07 <lcuk> Zakkm, i dunno
Jun 01 21:25:12 <lcuk> theres good stuff i know :)
Jun 01 21:26:00 <lcuk> roope, its really cool, the principle allows a screenful of widgets with lots of contents to be boiled down to a single item or set of matching items with very few keypresses
Jun 01 21:26:16 * lcuk is really impressed with it
Jun 01 21:26:22 <Zakkm> lcuk: browser support ?:D
Jun 01 21:26:44 <lcuk> its v raw at the moment but im in love with the idea and it fits with my global ops
Jun 01 21:26:48 <lcuk> Zakkm, ?
Jun 01 21:26:55 <Zakkm> for liqbase? :P
Jun 01 21:27:01 <Zakkm> in libliqbase
Jun 01 21:27:24 <lcuk> not yet :) i still have to make people use limited html for it to work best
Jun 01 21:27:46 <lcuk> webkit etal expect to render a big hard fast screenshot which is RGB
Jun 01 21:27:49 <jamiebennett> maybe a silly question but how to you do anything as root in scratchbox environment?
Jun 01 21:27:50 <lcuk> it would need converting
Jun 01 21:28:01 <lcuk> to yuv
Jun 01 21:28:16 <Zakkm> oh
Jun 01 21:28:27 <Zakkm> starting to use liqbase nightly :P
Jun 01 21:28:30 <lcuk> Zakkm, but each cell in liqbase can have its own color and font and background and the system can dynamically load images on demand..
Jun 01 21:28:40 <Zakkm> heh
Jun 01 21:28:43 <lcuk> and i can layout as many as required
Jun 01 21:28:44 <Zakkm> image viewer ? :D
Jun 01 21:28:47 <lcuk> easy
Jun 01 21:28:51 <lcuk> if you have the nightly theres a few
Jun 01 21:29:01 <Zakkm> that reads from .images?
Jun 01 21:29:09 <lcuk> fullscreen kinetics or zooming ones like i show in the videos
Jun 01 21:29:12 <Zakkm> theres a nightly?
Jun 01 21:29:13 <lcuk> .images?
Jun 01 21:29:19 <Zakkm> images folder on nokia
Jun 01 21:29:31 <lcuk> it scans /home/user/ and /media/mmc1 /media/mmc2
Jun 01 21:29:41 <Zakkm> .. /home/MyDocs/.images
Jun 01 21:29:42 <lcuk> and just shows everything it finds
Jun 01 21:29:52 <Zakkm> ahh /home/user/MyDocs
Jun 01 21:29:54 <lcuk> Zakkm, scan is recursive
Jun 01 21:29:56 <Zakkm> ah cool
Jun 01 21:30:04 <lcuk> thats just a simple example
Jun 01 21:30:19 <lcuk> theres about 40 or so things built up like that
Jun 01 21:31:00 <Zakkm> lcuk: could it be built into a deb, the nightlys?
Jun 01 21:31:04 <lcuk> if you wanna have a play around you can either find the public github repo or signup for a codebasehq account
Jun 01 21:31:16 <lcuk> Zakkm, the very first package was created over the weekend
Jun 01 21:31:25 <Zakkm> deb package?
Jun 01 21:31:33 <lcuk> its gonna take a bit more time to iron out the problems with it, but yeah i see that happening v soon
Jun 01 21:31:35 <lcuk> yeah
Jun 01 21:31:48 <lcuk> its not published tho lol, its the framework for the package thats important
Jun 01 21:31:57 <lcuk> the package breaks many things
Jun 01 21:31:58 <Zakkm> i was thinking if it could, i would take your git and make daily debs out of it and add to repo
Jun 01 21:32:18 <Zakkm> like help you out with that
Jun 01 21:32:22 <lcuk> ill be making that a standard part of my routine :)
Jun 01 21:32:34 <lcuk> but your help would be appreciated cos no doubt ill forget lol
Jun 01 21:32:47 <Zakkm> i couldnt help like actually coding, i dont know C or anything
Jun 01 21:32:56 <lcuk> Zakkm, #liqbase is where most stuff is discussed now
Jun 01 21:33:14 <Zakkm> but getting git, maknig deb, uploading , i could do
Jun 01 22:32:49 <Macer> blah
Jun 01 23:33:00 <GeneralAntilles> VDVsx, pong?
Jun 01 23:35:14 <VDVsx> GeneralAntilles, did you tried to install the ovi store app in your 5800
Jun 01 23:35:24 <GeneralAntilles> VDVsx, yes, it worked
Jun 01 23:35:31 <GeneralAntilles> But it's slow to browse and the selection sucks.
Jun 01 23:36:26 <VDVsx> on my device I got a lot of WRT/java error in the startup screen, lol
Jun 01 23:40:08 <GeneralAntilles> Nice
Jun 01 23:41:13 <VDVsx> GeneralAntilles, I'm not the only one, lol: http://discussion.forum.nokia.com/forum/showthread.php?p=592631
Jun 02 00:26:49 <Noma> does anybody know if Despotify has been ported to maemo?
Jun 02 00:29:03 <Noma> apparently yes
Jun 02 00:30:04 <Zakkm> Noma: http://unntaket.net/gspotify/ <-- need premium though apparently
Jun 02 00:30:32 <Noma> Yep, just found it myself also:)
Jun 02 00:31:48 <Noma> if it works well, the premium account is not a problem - that amount of music "in my pocket" for 9,90e/month sounds good
Jun 02 00:32:06 <Zakkm> you'd still need wifi though
Jun 02 00:32:16 <Zakkm> your better off with vagalume for free? :P
Jun 02 00:32:56 <Noma> bluetooth+3g on phone:)
Jun 02 00:33:08 <Noma> what's vagalume?:)
Jun 02 00:33:09 <Zakkm> heh 3g is expensive
Jun 02 00:33:19 <Zakkm> vagalume is a nice gtk player on the tablet.. uses last.fm
Jun 02 00:33:23 <Zakkm> which is free
Jun 02 00:33:37 <Noma> well, 10e/month for unlimited 3g ain't that expensive from my point of view :p
Jun 02 00:33:44 <Noma> sounds interesting
Jun 02 00:33:53 <Zakkm> wow
Jun 02 00:33:55 <Zakkm> where do you live?
Jun 02 00:34:01 <Zakkm> and that allows tethering to nokia?
Jun 02 00:34:10 <Noma> Finland
Jun 02 00:34:24 <Noma> yep
Jun 02 00:34:40 <Zakkm> cool
Jun 02 00:36:16 <Noma> E71 and N810 work very well together anyway, N810 is always immediately connected to internet when in range with E71:)
Jun 02 00:36:40 <Zakkm> wow
Jun 02 00:42:07 <hub> Noma: for 10EUR we get 1MB here
Jun 02 00:42:23 <Zakkm> you get about 200mb with that here
Jun 02 00:42:32 <Zakkm> 10eur a month
Jun 02 00:42:40 <Zakkm> and im in toronto, canada -.-
Jun 02 00:42:56 <hub> Zakkm: that's what I meant
Jun 02 00:43:19 <Zakkm> its ridicious
Jun 02 00:43:25 <hub> it is monopoly
Jun 02 00:43:56 <Zakkm> have a friend that pays like 70-80euro and he gets like 5gb
Jun 02 00:43:59 <Noma> normal price for 384kbps speed with unlimited data is 9,90e/month in finland with every operator
Jun 02 00:44:15 <Zakkm> i wonder if lcuk uses that :P
Jun 02 00:44:25 <Noma> unlimited speed and unlimited data is like 30e/month
Jun 02 00:45:08 <Noma> but i've managed to get over 1mbps speeds with that 384kbps also, their limiters are not working very well :p
Jun 02 00:46:53 <hub> here it cost you $60 for a 6GB plan and that requires you to have "bought" the locked phone
Jun 02 00:47:42 <hub> and because they are a monopoly there is no choice
Jun 02 00:47:47 <Noma> how much do the not-mobile broadbands cost there?
Jun 02 00:48:17 <hub> 45$ for 4Mbit ADSL with caps
Jun 02 00:48:23 <hub> from 60 to 200GB
Jun 02 00:48:30 <hub> and very bad service
Jun 02 00:48:38 <Zakkm> hub: where are you living?
Jun 02 00:48:39 <hub> (ADSL is controlled by another monopoly)
Jun 02 00:48:42 <hub> Zakkm: in canada
Jun 02 00:48:47 <Zakkm> where abouts?
Jun 02 00:48:55 <hub> Zakkm: how does that matter?
Jun 02 00:49:09 <Zakkm> nunavut has very different internet than edmonton :P
Jun 02 00:49:16 <hub> it is the same cross-country
Jun 02 00:49:20 <Noma> I've got 30Mbit adsl with no caps and i pay 40e/month for that
Jun 02 00:49:25 <Zakkm> :O
Jun 02 00:49:27 <Zakkm> 30mbit
Jun 02 00:49:32 <Zakkm> 30!
Jun 02 00:49:42 <Zakkm> i have 3mbit at home :)
Jun 02 00:49:47 <Zakkm> with 60gb a monnth cap
Jun 02 00:49:49 <hub> Zakkm: neither. I'd not live in Texas or in the frakkin' middle of nowhere
Jun 02 00:49:56 <lcuk> Zakkm, i dont live in finland
Jun 02 00:49:58 <hub> Zakkm: thanks to Bell
Jun 02 00:50:04 <Zakkm> lcuk: where do you live?
Jun 02 00:50:07 <lcuk> england
Jun 02 00:50:10 <Zakkm> ohh
Jun 02 00:50:13 <Zakkm> whos in finland then?
Jun 02 00:50:23 <hub> even england has a better service than here
Jun 02 00:50:30 <Zakkm> england has amazing service :)
Jun 02 00:50:34 <hub> and they don't seem to be lucky with BT
Jun 02 00:50:45 <lcuk> nokia.* employees (ok a few exceptions lol)
Jun 02 00:50:52 <Zakkm> lcuk: you know if you switch your user agent to sfari, your suppose to get free wifi in the uk?
Jun 02 00:51:14 <lcuk> not in my neighbourhood i wont
Jun 02 00:51:33 <Zakkm> ah
Jun 02 00:51:38 <Zakkm> its suppose to be highly over-the-air though
Jun 02 00:51:59 <lcuk> yeah wifi has that property
Jun 02 00:54:15 <Noma> a friend of mine has 100/100Mbit connection at home for just 25e/month
Jun 02 00:54:38 <lcuk> i have 55mbit wifi at home for free
Jun 02 00:54:44 <lcuk> connecting to the internet costs more tho
Jun 02 00:55:08 <Noma> :)
Jun 02 00:55:24 <Zakkm> 55mbit!?
Jun 02 00:55:26 <Zakkm> how you guys so lucky
Jun 02 00:55:31 <Zakkm> i only have 3mbit
Jun 02 00:55:48 <lcuk> i dont know how fast the internet connection is
Jun 02 00:56:02 <lcuk> i think its 50
Jun 02 00:56:04 <Noma> www.speedtest.net is good for finding that out
Jun 02 00:56:17 <Zakkm> thats bad
Jun 02 00:56:52 <luke-jr> Zakkm: that sucks
Jun 02 00:56:53 <lcuk> anyway gnite
Jun 02 00:57:02 <luke-jr> even in the USA, which has crap for broadband, we have 12mbit for $45/mo
Jun 02 00:57:21 <Zakkm> well we only pay like $20 a month mind you
Jun 02 00:57:28 <Zakkm> lcuk: 12quid? :P
Jun 02 00:57:57 <Zakkm> but yeah its not so bad, it lets me download what i want
Jun 02 00:58:00 <hub> luke-jr: canada is badly influenced by the southern neighbour
Jun 02 00:58:12 <Zakkm> nooo ;p
Jun 02 00:58:15 <Zakkm> theres no influence :D
Jun 02 00:58:19 <luke-jr> Canada is simply a lost cause in general
Jun 02 00:58:33 <Zakkm> luke-jr: what are you talking about, do you live here?
Jun 02 00:58:36 <hub> Zakkm: there is, all the bad things
Jun 02 00:58:43 <luke-jr> Zakkm: I wouldn't live there if you paid me
Jun 02 00:58:49 <Zakkm> Canada???
Jun 02 00:58:52 <luke-jr> as terrible as the USA is, Canada is worse
Jun 02 00:58:53 <Zakkm> you'd rather live in the US?
Jun 02 00:58:55 <hub> Zakkm: including the cons, the corporate monopolies. etc
Jun 02 00:59:07 <Zakkm> i would never want to live in the US right now
Jun 02 00:59:10 <hub> luke-jr: at least canada does not treat their visitors like criminals
Jun 02 00:59:22 <hub> luke-jr: and at least try to take care of their people
Jun 02 00:59:29 <Zakkm> the recession has destroyed the US
Jun 02 00:59:33 <luke-jr> Canada will put people in jail for speaking out against perversion
Jun 02 00:59:37 <Zakkm> all my US buddies are screwed right now looking for work
Jun 02 00:59:38 <hub> Zakkm: like it didn't hurt here
Jun 02 00:59:49 <hub> Zakkm: same here mind you
Jun 02 00:59:57 <hub> Zakkm: unless you work for the govt
Jun 02 01:00:07 <luke-jr> bbl
Jun 02 01:00:15 <hub> luke-jr: ahah. and the US execute people
Jun 02 01:00:29 <|R> heh
Jun 02 01:00:33 <luke-jr> hub: not nearly enough
Jun 02 01:00:39 <hub> that's fortunately something they didn't pick here
Jun 02 01:00:40 <Zakkm> i have to goto philidephia in august, and i fear for my life when i go there
Jun 02 01:00:57 <hub> Zakkm: why do you go then?
Jun 02 01:01:06 <Zakkm> cause i have to visit someone
Jun 02 01:01:15 <hub> "have to"?
Jun 02 01:01:19 <Zakkm> hah
Jun 02 01:01:22 <Zakkm> want to / have to..
Jun 02 01:01:35 <hub> then don't complain if you made the choice
Jun 02 01:01:37 <Noma> but both US and Canada have at least one priviledge compared to Finland - you don't have to watch NHL games in the middle of the night :p
Jun 02 01:01:47 <Zakkm> im making the choice, but it doesnt mean im not scared
Jun 02 01:01:52 <Zakkm> ?
Jun 02 01:01:57 <Zakkm> i have never seen a NHL game in my entire life
Jun 02 01:02:02 <hub> Noma: given the lenght of Finland's nights, it is not a reference
Jun 02 01:02:02 <Zakkm> i dont even know how to play
Jun 02 01:02:03 <|R> lucky you
Jun 02 01:02:07 <|R> :)
Jun 02 01:02:15 <|R> I'm in Montreal, it's hard to escape hockey fever
Jun 02 01:02:20 <Zakkm> :D
Jun 02 01:02:23 <Zakkm> i was there in march :D
Jun 02 01:02:27 <Zakkm> sweet 18th birthday hah
Jun 02 01:02:28 <hub> Noma: and FWIW, it is usually night when they start
Jun 02 01:02:32 <Zakkm> can legally drink there :p
Jun 02 01:02:37 <Zakkm> went to some sick ass casino too
Jun 02 01:02:39 <hub> |R: it is gold season now for you
Jun 02 01:02:47 <Noma> hub: it's 4 am now here, and it's very bright outside :p
Jun 02 01:02:57 <Zakkm> heh i love that :P
Jun 02 01:03:01 <|R> hub: Gold season? :)
Jun 02 01:03:06 <Zakkm> i always wanted 24/7 of darkness :D
Jun 02 01:03:16 <hub> |R: oops, I meant GOLF
Jun 02 01:03:27 <|R> Zakkm: yeah, it's pretty funny to meet americans in bars at 18 killing their brain and brafing in the street à 20h
Jun 02 01:03:27 <hub> |R: what they do after being finished with hocker
Jun 02 01:03:31 <|R> s/à/at/ ;P
Jun 02 01:03:46 <|R> haha :)
Jun 02 01:03:49 <Zakkm> yeah my two brothers took me, one of them knew the area well though, my other never been
Jun 02 01:04:00 <Zakkm> im not american, im canadian :P
Jun 02 01:04:01 <Zakkm> im in toronto
Jun 02 01:04:07 <hub> Zakkm: see, you even pick up the "american way" of "drinking age"
Jun 02 01:04:08 <Zakkm> american is a insult :P
Jun 02 01:04:13 <|R> Zakkm: it's 19 there right?
Jun 02 01:04:17 <Zakkm> yeah
Jun 02 01:04:22 <Zakkm> 18 in quebec, 19 in ontario :D
Jun 02 01:04:25 <|R> hehe :)
Jun 02 01:04:25 <hub> |R: and they have to go to a beer store
Jun 02 01:04:33 <hub> I just go to the gas station
Jun 02 01:04:37 <Zakkm> yeah
Jun 02 01:04:42 <hub> (when I have money)
Jun 02 01:04:45 <Zakkm> heh
Jun 02 01:04:47 <|R> hub: in ontario?
Jun 02 01:04:49 <Zakkm> i have friends and such :P
Jun 02 01:04:51 <|R> hehe, not in quebec :)
Jun 02 01:04:52 <Zakkm> yeah
Jun 02 01:04:57 <Zakkm> in ontario, its only 3 stores you can get beer ;p
Jun 02 01:04:59 <hub> |R: beer store, in ontario
Jun 02 01:05:00 <|R> but fuck do we pay taxes!
Jun 02 01:05:10 <Zakkm> in montreal, you can get everywhereee
Jun 02 01:05:12 <hub> |R: if Quebec had to go through beer store, nobody would drink
Jun 02 01:05:16 <|R> when i go to europe and you get 1.5L sangria bottle for 2E... here it's 20$
Jun 02 01:05:29 <|R> haha :)
Jun 02 01:05:35 <Zakkm> heh
Jun 02 01:05:37 <Zakkm> cheap alcohol
Jun 02 01:05:38 <hub> |R: don't get me started
Jun 02 01:05:48 <Zakkm> usually a bottle here is like $1.20 ?
Jun 02 01:05:49 <Noma> |R: that depends on country:)
Jun 02 01:05:56 <|R> Noma: yeah i know :)
Jun 02 01:06:01 <Zakkm> also have to think about money and such
Jun 02 01:06:05 <Zakkm> wages, living expenses and such
Jun 02 01:06:35 <|R> i've got family in .fr and .cz and there it's quite cheap (as well in spain and germany i think)
Jun 02 01:06:50 <Zakkm> dont drink that much to make it matter
Jun 02 01:07:21 <Noma> we were once on a school trip to poland, and our one night bar budget was the same as average students one month income
Jun 02 01:07:29 <Noma> in poland
Jun 02 01:07:46 <Zakkm> heh expensive :P
Jun 02 01:07:52 <|R> Are you in Helsinki?
Jun 02 01:07:56 <Noma> nope, in Tampere
Jun 02 01:08:10 <|R> Haven't been north yet in europe, next time... :)
Jun 02 01:08:12 <Noma> Zakkm: a pint of beer costs like 0,4 euros there
Jun 02 01:08:29 <Noma> or at least it did four years ago
Jun 02 01:08:35 <hub> Prague with cheap beer... mmmm
Jun 02 01:08:40 <hub> that was awesome
Jun 02 01:08:41 <|R> yeah, 1$ per pint :)
Jun 02 01:08:45 <hub> exactly
Jun 02 01:08:52 <hub> had a team meeting there in 2007
Jun 02 01:09:09 <|R> I'm going 3 weeks this summer (among other places) and, yeah, woohoo! ;)
Jun 02 01:09:14 <Noma> in Finland it's 2,5e at cheapest
Jun 02 01:09:35 <|R> in Montreal, for a pint, uhm... 5$ ?
Jun 02 01:09:50 <|R> (at best, usually more around 6)
Jun 02 01:11:18 <Zakkm> you guys saying bar or buying for home?
Jun 02 01:11:39 <|R> bars
Jun 02 01:11:48 <|R> home is around 1-1.5$/bottle
Jun 02 01:11:58 <|R> unless you go extravaganza of course :)
Jun 02 01:12:00 <Zakkm> ;o
Jun 02 01:12:13 <Zakkm> pint = big glass right?
Jun 02 01:12:17 <|R> 0.5L
Jun 02 01:12:20 <Zakkm> like theres bottle then pint?
Jun 02 01:12:25 <|R> bottle = 341 ml
Jun 02 01:12:26 <Zakkm> sorry im new at this
Jun 02 01:12:29 <Noma> for home it's about 1e/0,33l bottle in finland
Jun 02 01:12:32 <Zakkm> ahh
Jun 02 01:12:36 <Zakkm> maybe $2.99 here?
Jun 02 01:12:40 <|R> 33cl for europeans :P
Jun 02 01:12:49 <hub> |R: 22$ for a 24
Jun 02 01:12:56 <Zakkm> that just means ayou guys drink more eh?
Jun 02 01:12:58 <|R> (we have stupid units here, it's metric but based on deprecated imperial standards (/me ducks))
Jun 02 01:13:13 <hub> |R: that because of the americans
Jun 02 01:13:17 <hub> |R: they can'
Jun 02 01:13:25 <|R> yeah, or the english, depending how far you go back :)
Jun 02 01:13:28 <hub> |R: the can't re-learn it
Jun 02 01:13:40 <Zakkm> so you guys drink alot?
Jun 02 01:13:49 <|R> when i can :P
Jun 02 01:13:54 <|R> hehe, it all depends ;)
Jun 02 01:14:02 <hub> |R: no. it is still somewhat mapped in the american units because of uniformisation of containers and products
Jun 02 01:14:13 <|R> hub: yep
Jun 02 01:14:15 <hub> |R: officially canada use A4 paper. but nobody sells it...
Jun 02 01:14:33 <Zakkm> a4 = 8.5x11 ?
Jun 02 01:15:35 <|R> well, they use it for government paper in quebec i think and for legal papers (lawyers)
Jun 02 01:15:36 <|R> 8.5x14
Jun 02 01:15:36 <Zakkm> eww
Jun 02 01:15:36 <|R> but you can buy it anywhere
Jun 02 01:15:36 <Zakkm> nobody uses that
Jun 02 01:15:36 <|R> FutureShop or BureauEnGros has them
Jun 02 01:15:36 <Zakkm> 8.5x11 = everythingg
Jun 02 01:15:36 <Zakkm> you can get bigger of course
Jun 02 01:15:36 <Zakkm> but you dont see it
Jun 02 01:15:36 <|R> it's the european standard
Jun 02 01:15:36 <Noma> in finland a4 is everywhere
Jun 02 01:15:36 <Noma> if you want any other size, you really have to search
Jun 02 01:15:36 <|R> which actually is a lot more intelligently conceived
Jun 02 01:15:36 <Zakkm> like obviously if you go paper shopping you will see it.. but if someone hands you a flyer, or you get a sheet in school... its ALWAYS 8.5x11
Jun 02 01:15:38 <|R> A3 = 2 * A4
Jun 02 01:15:39 <hub> no
Jun 02 01:15:39 <hub> A4 = 210x297mm
Jun 02 01:15:39 <hub> A3 is 420x297
Jun 02 01:15:39 <hub> and so on
Jun 02 01:15:39 <hub> A0 is one square meter
Jun 02 01:15:39 <hub> with the same ratio in demensions
Jun 02 01:15:46 <|R> A2 = 2 * A3
Jun 02 01:15:47 <|R> etc
Jun 02 01:15:48 <hub> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ISO_216
Jun 02 01:16:00 <hub> |R: it is an ISO standard
Jun 02 01:16:06 <Noma> 1:sqrt(2) is the width/length ratio
Jun 02 01:16:12 <Zakkm> yeahhh A4 = 8.5x11 pretty much
Jun 02 01:16:17 <Noma> of the A4 -paper
Jun 02 01:16:21 <hub> |R: legal is not A4
Jun 02 01:16:23 <Noma> and all that standard papers
Jun 02 01:16:25 <hub> legal is a long letter
Jun 02 01:16:34 <hub> Zakkm: no.
Jun 02 01:16:42 <hub> Zakkm: A4 is NOT the same size
Jun 02 01:16:51 <Zakkm> says 8.3x11.7
Jun 02 01:16:59 <Zakkm> thats the closet ;p
Jun 02 01:17:03 <|R> uhm oops
Jun 02 01:17:06 <Noma> A4 is 210x297mm
Jun 02 01:17:31 <Noma> 8.3x11.7 in inches
Jun 02 01:17:44 <hub> Zakkm: closest does not mean the same
Jun 02 01:17:54 <hub> Zakkm: try to feed that to your printer
Jun 02 01:17:59 <hub> PC Load Letter
Jun 02 01:18:19 <|R> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:A_size_illustration2_with_letter_and_legal.svg
Jun 02 01:19:14 <Firebird> :O what consumer grade printer accepts A0
Jun 02 01:19:56 <|R> big plotters i guess hehe
Jun 02 01:20:27 <hub> Firebird: none. people use A4 :-)
Jun 02 01:20:34 <hub> some support A3
Jun 02 01:20:43 <Firebird> I'd love to do poster printing at home
Jun 02 01:21:32 <Noma> I have a big home made poster on my wall, it just consists of 12 A4's :p
Jun 02 01:22:22 <Noma> Rasterbator is very good program for that: http://homokaasu.org/rasterbator/
Jun 02 02:08:45 <wsuetholz> Every so often the desktop disappears, is this a known issue with the current release?
Jun 02 02:08:55 <Zakkm> release of what?
Jun 02 02:09:30 <wsuetholz> Maemo OS2008
Jun 02 02:09:41 <Zakkm> it disappears?
Jun 02 02:09:43 <Zakkm> 43-7?
Jun 02 02:10:34 <wsuetholz> Yes the icons on the left disappear and the task switcher doesn't work
Jun 02 02:12:09 <CutMeOwnThroat> where does it go?
Jun 02 02:12:41 <wsuetholz> Think it's  43-7 if thats the latest from Nokia
Jun 02 02:24:08 <GeneralAntilles> wsuetholz, desktop crash.
Jun 02 02:24:20 <GeneralAntilles> Either one of the applets you're using it is bringing it down or you're using a Bluetooth keyboard
Jun 02 02:26:13 <Zakkm> GeneralAntilles: bluetooth keyboards kill it, wouldnt that defeat the purpose?
Jun 02 02:26:28 <GeneralAntilles> Zakkm, only rarely upon reconnect.
Jun 02 02:26:40 <Zakkm> thats terrible
Jun 02 02:26:47 <Zakkm> and i was thinking of geting a bt one too
Jun 02 02:28:56 <GeneralAntilles> Meh
Jun 02 02:34:04 <Zakkm> GeneralAntilles: i hatee n800 osk, well more than all other devices but i purely love physical keyboards and i need for school
Jun 02 02:34:58 <hub> Zakkm: that's why I use a Thinkpad: the keyboard
Jun 02 02:39:54 <luke-jr> I miss the Zaurus keyboard :<
Jun 02 02:40:17 <hub> I have a N800 and I get furstrated everytime
Jun 02 02:40:39 <hub> and no brownie point for whoever decided to surround the screen with a bezel
Jun 02 02:40:44 <hub> bevel I mean
Jun 02 02:45:12 <ljp> protects the screen from scratches
Jun 02 02:46:24 <hub> and protect the fingers from touching the edges
Jun 02 02:46:26 <hub> ....
Jun 02 02:46:37 <hub> making the finger keyboard unusable
Jun 02 02:48:13 <Firebird> isn't the small keyboard the stylus keyboard and not the finger keyboard?
Jun 02 02:48:28 <Firebird> the fullscreen finger keyboard is totally usable with the bevel
Jun 02 02:49:45 <Zakkm> stylus keyboard sucks, finger is aweseome, but i cant use it for long
Jun 02 02:49:48 <Zakkm> some strange OCD :P
Jun 02 02:52:48 <hub> Firebird: it is not for me
Jun 02 02:53:01 <hub> Firebird: but obviously you don't have my fingers
Jun 02 02:53:28 <hub> also most of the action could be done with fingers
Jun 02 02:53:34 <hub> including closing windows...
Jun 02 02:53:39 <hub> if the bevel wasn't here
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Tue Jun 02 02:59:57 2009