**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Fri Jul 10 02:59:57 2009 Jul 10 03:06:28 ShadowJK: thanks for the tips. I think I'll just buy a new battery. Jul 10 04:45:24 hello Jul 10 05:59:50 Hi, what does the recent move of nokia towards Qt mean? Does it mean that all the official apps will be in Qt? Jul 10 06:00:04 or only that Qt based apps could run on maemo? Jul 10 06:03:47 more like the ui will be qt but gtk is installable Jul 10 06:05:02 why?? what's wrong with gtk? Jul 10 06:07:12 don't get me started.. :P Jul 10 06:07:47 besides that, they want to be able to easily port symbian qt to maemo qt etc Jul 10 06:08:07 at least fremantle will still be gtk and harmatan is definitely not close Jul 10 06:08:08 :> Jul 10 06:10:07 if it is only a port matter - does it mean, that once the transition is over they still can get back to gtk? Jul 10 06:11:05 and will the current official apps still be maintained? Jul 10 06:11:20 what official apps? :P Jul 10 06:20:24 Stskeeps: like modest? Jul 10 06:26:34 ah, yeah Jul 10 06:27:30 so the community will continue to maintain a parallel gtk version of UI? Jul 10 06:27:39 is it probable? Jul 10 06:27:56 not of ui, of hildon and gtk Jul 10 06:29:08 and community is an interesting word here Jul 10 06:30:30 is it still worth to invest money in the next tablet for someone (me) who doesn't like Qt? Jul 10 06:31:22 zeev: you don't like to *use* qt or you don't like to *code* qt? Jul 10 06:31:24 of course. the hw is delicious. and after spending a week with gobject, i'm sure you'll like qt. either way, next version is gtk based Jul 10 06:31:35 I don't think it's relevant for user-only Jul 10 06:31:55 I don't like qt look and feel, and really like gtk ones, but I don't think it'll really matter on the device Jul 10 06:32:20 the look&feel is already quite different on a device atm Jul 10 06:32:34 qt look and feel depends on target anywayh Jul 10 06:32:35 so I don't think it'll be that painful to use a qt-based ui Jul 10 06:32:47 (if all apps are correctly integrated though) Jul 10 06:32:59 but all third party apps will be in qt later Jul 10 06:33:11 but if they use qt4 with the gtkstyle or gtk with the qt engine it should be quite consistent Jul 10 06:33:28 (I guess the latter) Jul 10 06:33:34 zeev: so what? Jul 10 06:33:55 skype's already qt on x86 i think Jul 10 06:34:10 vlc too Jul 10 06:34:14 I don't like the way it looks... and I used to write apps using gtk Jul 10 06:34:27 yeah but gtk doesn't look the same on the tablet anyway Jul 10 06:34:40 looks is theming Jul 10 06:34:46 I really think you shouldn't worry Jul 10 06:34:52 ok Jul 10 06:34:55 :) Jul 10 06:35:06 it'll look different from your plain desktop, but hey, it's different anyway :) Jul 10 06:35:24 they can mess the ui in gtk too, btw Jul 10 06:35:51 what will happen to all the current projects? they will continue to write gtk or change to qt? Jul 10 06:36:46 depends, I guess Jul 10 06:36:48 they can still use gtk, like we can use qt atm Jul 10 06:49:33 zsss Jul 10 06:52:34 ]seen bbb770 Jul 10 07:23:38 Morning, all Jul 10 07:30:30 moo all Jul 10 07:32:26 moo jaffa, RST38h Jul 10 08:09:43 morning all Jul 10 08:11:48 hey folks Jul 10 08:13:05 wello jaem Jul 10 08:13:29 how're things? Jul 10 08:16:38 I just finished working on some desktop themeing a little while ago :D Jul 10 08:16:56 http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2511/3706694676_6761d2425b_o.png Jul 10 08:17:17 they're okay Jul 10 08:18:26 you have a SmartQ 5, right? Jul 10 08:21:44 yeah Jul 10 08:29:07 Stskeeps: how's the battery life on it? Jul 10 08:29:42 decent i'd say Jul 10 08:29:48 better once we have backlight control etc under contro Jul 10 08:29:49 l Jul 10 09:07:06 oh no Jul 10 09:08:11 i have just been told about a casualty :( my work days are not gonna be the same again for a while Jul 10 09:08:26 my beloved big cup got broked :'( Jul 10 09:08:51 :( Jul 10 09:09:16 i brought it all the way back from berlin at the summit Jul 10 09:10:15 i hope amsterdam have good replacements lol Jul 10 09:14:22 Okey.. even without AppCache (but with local storage), I can use document.domain to set the context, then do some things online and some things offline in webkit under maemo. Jul 10 09:14:49 Just have to store the scripts on the device itself. Jul 10 09:15:00 ehlo lcuk Jul 10 09:22:09 So .. what this means is that the current Tear (with svn webkit, as found in the forums) can be used for offline web apps. Jul 10 09:24:25 not bad Jul 10 09:24:28 a usual way? Jul 10 09:26:00 The proper way is for Tear to support WebKit's AppCache functionality .. I think it has to be compiled into webkit (may already be), and then Tear has to initiate the saving of the app. Jul 10 09:26:15 And provide info such as online/offline to it Jul 10 09:26:33 Opened a feature request on tear. Jul 10 09:27:59 *nod* Jul 10 09:30:51 Cool Jul 10 09:35:20 hiya RST38h Jul 10 09:35:30 jaffa, are you a qualified pilot yet? Jul 10 09:38:27 Not yet; need to look into appmenus over the weekend Jul 10 09:38:30 And fix the sysfs parsing Jul 10 09:38:53 * Jaffa might play with something to do a Cube Racer-style game. Jul 10 09:39:01 Separate project, I think. Jul 10 09:40:41 "Censorship of written material is off the agenda for now: and for that we may need to thank Lord Falconers intense interest in suicide." Jul 10 09:44:33 timeless_mbp: tell me about nanojit Jul 10 09:44:40 um Jul 10 09:44:57 irc.mozilla.org has people better suited to such a task :) Jul 10 09:45:17 i presume you've read https://developer.mozilla.org/En/Nanojit ? Jul 10 09:45:43 <|thunder> 3 needed in #urtpu Jul 10 09:45:47 <|thunder> 3 needed in #urtpug Jul 10 09:45:52 thats the kind of page i was looking for, thanks Jul 10 09:48:29 suihkulokki: i'm hungry Jul 10 09:48:53 timeless_mbp: meritähti? Jul 10 09:49:17 yeah, i could do that. i'm at home, so it'll take me about 25mins assuming i go now (which i should) Jul 10 09:49:55 ok Jul 10 09:50:22 * timeless_mbp looks for clothing Jul 10 09:51:31 suihkulokki: having issues with networking in qemu Jul 10 09:51:42 "Unsupported ancillary data: 1/29" Jul 10 09:51:48 do you know anything :) Jul 10 09:52:14 http://pastebin.com/d6c63627c Jul 10 09:52:30 arh.. don't tell me my charging pin broke in my n810 Jul 10 09:53:22 Stskeeps: my charging pin broke in my e61i Jul 10 09:53:29 a friend used his teeth to remove it for me :) Jul 10 09:54:16 another friend's e61's pin receptor failed, so i've loaned him my 770 as a dedicated charger :) Jul 10 09:54:34 lbt: feel free to provide a patch, I've never used raw sockets/icmp on linux-user :) Jul 10 09:55:05 use a neodymidium magnet... it works in cartoons. Jul 10 09:56:03 lbt, magnets dont stick to teeth Jul 10 09:56:11 but they can be used to shatter them Jul 10 09:56:21 warning: do not insert magnets into mouth ;) Jul 10 09:56:29 suihkulokki: OK... it seems to work; wasn't sure if there was a known issue or a common problem (like not having /proc) Jul 10 09:59:41 suihkulokki: ok, i'm off to meri Jul 10 09:59:52 i should be there in 15mins or so Jul 10 10:00:12 you'll spot me? Jul 10 10:00:29 I presume so Jul 10 10:05:09 Gah, phone rebooted Jul 10 10:09:12 heads out -> Jul 10 10:09:28 GAN800, in case you didn't noticed yet: http://www.engadgetmobile.com/2009/07/09/nokia-5800-xpressmusic-gets-america-flavored-firmware-update/ Jul 10 10:12:06 Passing nokia now Jul 10 10:51:33 timeless_mbp: remove pin or pull a tad out? :P Jul 10 10:51:42 it wasn't entirely in Jul 10 10:51:49 he managed to get it out Jul 10 10:51:51 ah Jul 10 10:52:02 * Stskeeps suspects his pin got pushed in so Jul 10 11:06:12 * man_in_pda waves Jul 10 11:26:28 anyone use tear? i'm wondering if it normally asks for username and password when required Jul 10 11:26:42 normally - it fails on some pages i think Jul 10 11:27:05 man_in_pda: I have to use http://user:pass@site Jul 10 11:27:36 ty qwerty12_N810 Jul 10 11:27:46 and Stskeeps Jul 10 11:43:56 wiretapped: do you have a voltmeter/multimeter? do you know how to use it? would be interested in battery voltage of your deadish battery Jul 10 11:45:59 which is better - bacon or lemon cheesecake (or include your own) Jul 10 11:48:53 that's a trick question Jul 10 11:49:25 lcuk: second. Jul 10 11:49:27 * RST38h hides Jul 10 11:50:40 you start with the cheesecake. when you start feeling ill from all the sugar you balance it with the bacon Jul 10 11:51:00 overbalabce it rather, so then you need the cheesecake again Jul 10 11:51:55 * RST38h strikes both off the list Jul 10 11:55:38 ShadowJK, really, i would eat bacon till im nearly bursting, then some lemon drizzle cake to top it off Jul 10 11:55:50 RST38h, whats your problem with those suggestions, and whatsbetter Jul 10 11:56:33 lcuk: Dunno, neither feels healthy or tasty =) Jul 10 11:56:57 then what do you suggest Jul 10 11:57:03 what is your feelgood munchable Jul 10 11:57:10 incase you cant tell, im hungry Jul 10 11:57:40 lo all Jul 10 11:58:04 lcuk: cheese in various forms usually does the job Jul 10 11:58:07 moo wazd Jul 10 11:58:28 hiya wazd Jul 10 11:58:42 RST38h, you and lbt need to talk, he likes his cheese too Jul 10 11:59:10 Edam and salami on a baguette at the moment Jul 10 12:00:16 anyone worked with qt plugins? Jul 10 12:00:19 freshly cut, or packet purchase? Jul 10 12:00:22 youre making me hungry Jul 10 12:00:35 adeus, plugins for where Jul 10 12:00:46 in generic Jul 10 12:00:51 developing them Jul 10 12:00:52 ShadowJK, thats the idea :) talking about food is good for your health Jul 10 12:01:09 fresh baked baguette with butter. Still nice and warm actually Jul 10 12:01:18 yeah but to plugin you need a socket with its own special requirements Jul 10 12:01:36 adeus: qt 'plugin' ? for what? Jul 10 12:01:44 i used to love hot crusty muffins from somerfield with butter melting Jul 10 12:02:08 each app that has a plugin arch whas its own api for what a plugin requires Jul 10 12:02:12 Stskeeps: so... Jul 10 12:02:19 suihkulokki and i talked a bit about locale switching Jul 10 12:02:19 yes Jul 10 12:02:30 and I have define my own plugin api Jul 10 12:02:31 we suspect it might be possible to get locale switching to work a bit better Jul 10 12:02:32 defined Jul 10 12:02:45 for instance, liqbase expects its plugins to complete a function with the same name as the plugin itself and to return a new instance of the app Jul 10 12:02:51 if we could enhance the dbus daemon and maemo launcher to be able to switch the LANG var Jul 10 12:02:56 but anyway the question was that can I load the same plugin library file twice Jul 10 12:03:09 adeus: do you mean shared libraries? Jul 10 12:03:18 but this would only work if gtk and friends don't do anything w/ LANG Jul 10 12:03:24 why load same plugin library twice? Jul 10 12:03:31 just make sure your API has a constructor method Jul 10 12:03:31 I change it in between? Jul 10 12:03:40 then call that constructor multip[le times per instance required Jul 10 12:04:07 otherwise we'd probably need to setup a secondary dbus/launcher and have the original one chain/become dormant to the replacement Jul 10 12:04:22 anyway... it's something someone could research :) Jul 10 12:04:51 liqcell_quickcreatevis("liqbrightness1", "liqbrightness", 0,0,100,100); maps to call the liqbrightness_create(); function inside the plugin Jul 10 12:05:01 the issue is that when I call pluginloader.load() and instance(), the changes to the file are not seen Jul 10 12:05:11 timeless_mbp, how often does lang change under normal situation? Jul 10 12:05:35 adeus: you probably want #qt for pure Qt issues Jul 10 12:05:51 lcuk: depends on what a normal situation is :) Jul 10 12:06:02 yeah, this isnt a specifically maemo issue Jul 10 12:06:04 if the device is only used for demos or in large groups where it's shared a lot Jul 10 12:06:04 yeah I'll do that Jul 10 12:06:07 then it's often Jul 10 12:06:18 timeless_mbp, i dont think regular users often change languages multiple times a day Jul 10 12:06:19 if the device is only used by one person, then it's never Jul 10 12:06:33 lcuk: i haven't met many regular users :) Jul 10 12:07:01 lcuk: but mostly, it's incredibly gross that a system would have to restart to change languages Jul 10 12:07:06 neither OS X nor Windows require it Jul 10 12:07:09 i know, but your special case could be handled differently to the normal process Jul 10 12:07:30 (nor does S40, and as it happens i've seen non nokia Symbian phones which can too) Jul 10 12:08:25 what happens to all the other apps whene you change Jul 10 12:08:30 do most just respond properly Jul 10 12:08:34 or do they need restarting Jul 10 12:09:33 I can't even figure out how to change language in windows Jul 10 12:10:08 i thought you needed a new cd to change language Jul 10 12:10:18 I think they only sell it for one language and you need their mui shit Jul 10 12:10:23 would be handy though, to be able to set language to the same used buy whoever is badgering me on the phone for techsupport Jul 10 12:11:32 * lcuk calls ShadowJK from outer mongolia Jul 10 12:11:47 though most computers in "real life" in use by "normal people" end up trilingual anyway Jul 10 12:12:39 no wonder people think computers are hard to use and understand :) Jul 10 12:12:42 ShadowJK, rly? Jul 10 12:12:54 yes Jul 10 12:12:58 oh man this quitting smoking Jul 10 12:13:02 i seriously feel like shit now Jul 10 12:13:08 my computer has been set to UK/Northern since i got it Jul 10 12:13:11 its not had any problems Jul 10 12:13:35 Ok imagine you were welsh and the languages was more... alive Jul 10 12:13:35 macer its tough. Jul 10 12:13:45 * lcuk sits on fence smoking watching macer struggle Jul 10 12:14:06 im sorry, i cannot imagine im welsh Jul 10 12:14:39 you might insist in the shop to get windows in welsh, or they might just have it ask which version to install when you boot it first time (this is done by ms currently) Jul 10 12:14:44 but even if so, "welsh and english" are bilingual Jul 10 12:15:02 * RST38h always sets his computers to US/English and forgets about it Jul 10 12:15:29 RST38h: You are being tricked! That is not English. Jul 10 12:15:40 (oh, also setting default charset to cp1251 Cyrillic, Windows thankfully makes it separate from the language) Jul 10 12:15:45 then you want to play a game, and install english language latest directx because it's the only one you can find Jul 10 12:16:05 soon it's a mishmash Jul 10 12:16:47 lcuk: haha Jul 10 12:17:03 in the case here, people first pick their own language if available, then the other domestic language, and then fall back to english Jul 10 12:17:27 qwerty12_N810: our nuclear arsenal says it is the right english! Jul 10 12:17:33 :) Jul 10 12:17:34 after a year or two the first dialogs where computer uses 3 languages in a single sentence appear :P Jul 10 12:17:44 Yes, folks, fight it out in the Ring of Death =) Jul 10 12:17:45 Macer: :P Jul 10 12:17:56 macer, my brolley and bowler hat will protect me if you strike Jul 10 12:18:10 Bonus points to the side that uses its nukes first =) Jul 10 12:18:12 * lcuk has a stiff upper lip and an unlimited supply of tea and biscuits Jul 10 12:18:27 haha Jul 10 12:18:42 RST38h: too late. we already did ;) Jul 10 12:19:04 Macer: Let us label that one time a medical test =) Jul 10 12:21:59 lcuk: most apps on our system have historically supported a mode where they serialized their state and quit Jul 10 12:22:20 so, those apps would be sent the signal to do so, and then would be woken up again but with the new LANG Jul 10 12:22:29 there aren't many exceptions... Jul 10 12:22:49 (browser is one, but it tends to restart often enough anyway) Jul 10 12:24:10 timeless_mbp, fair enough then Jul 10 12:24:25 VDVsx, yeah, too little too late. Jul 10 12:24:29 Requires Windows. Jul 10 12:24:35 does microb have the crash-resume code inside it Jul 10 12:24:41 (the one that restores your tabs..) Jul 10 12:24:50 it has its own crash resume Jul 10 12:24:54 which restores much less Jul 10 12:25:13 but yes, try killing the right browserd w/ a signal Jul 10 12:25:17 and watch Jul 10 12:25:17 I've also found that Nokia Maps will occasionally arbitrarily decide to direct you to a different address than the one you entered. Jul 10 12:25:22 fair enough, can you just listen for the supported shutdown now mode Jul 10 12:25:39 isnt that watchdog thingy Jul 10 12:25:44 the browser could be enhanced to deal w/ the lang change thing, yeah Jul 10 12:25:48 * lcuk turned all that off for other reasons Jul 10 12:25:49 General: It is stimulating your curiosity Jul 10 12:26:05 * RST38h ducks Jul 10 12:26:25 bringing out the explorer in you and checking if you are actually senile or not Jul 10 12:26:38 if you dont notice it sent you wrong it detects this and calls a doctor Jul 10 12:26:55 GeneralAntilles, yeah that's shame, they have to rewrite the update tool in Qt ;),I usually use a windows VM for that. Jul 10 12:27:01 lcuk: calls doctor to the original address, due to a programming error Jul 10 12:27:27 VDVsx, I don't have the time or energy to deal with bullshit like that. Jul 10 12:27:29 sod that, sends current gps to the doctors device Jul 10 12:27:33 so he can do the test himself.. Jul 10 12:29:10 VDVsx: Wasn't original Nokia PC Suite written in Java? Jul 10 12:31:42 RST38h, dunno, but the new tool (Ovi) is written in Qt Jul 10 12:32:42 deep breaths Jul 10 12:32:44 heh Jul 10 12:33:09 * Macer HEE HEE WHOOOO Jul 10 12:33:11 GeneralAntilles, I'm obligated to deal with that crap, there's no good symbian tools for linux, so I need a windows vm :( Jul 10 12:33:30 The determination that I've come to is that there's no good Symbian. Jul 10 12:33:59 hmhm, that means nokia phones should be avoided? Jul 10 12:34:21 Yes. Jul 10 12:34:26 Not all run Symbian Jul 10 12:34:59 the non symbian ones are not crap? Jul 10 12:35:07 Until Nokia manages to do a better job at delivering a quality, well-supported product than Nokla, yes. Jul 10 12:35:27 General <-- obviously never played with Nokla Jul 10 12:35:33 (anyway, I'll take a n9xx when it'll come, so I have PIM *and* phone) Jul 10 12:36:16 VDVsx: Never really needed any of Nokia's PC tools, it works as a USB mass storage and that is all it has to do Jul 10 12:37:10 RST38h, and the frw updates ? Jul 10 12:37:33 well, I like my symbian phones, but really hate the developers tools :( Jul 10 12:38:15 well who doesn't.. Jul 10 12:38:32 they're sooo from the 90s Jul 10 12:40:42 VDVsx: I managed to install a lobotomized piece of the PC Suite for that Jul 10 12:41:06 VDVsx: Actually, deleting it after updating firmware as it install multiple background programs Jul 10 12:41:39 * RST38h got almost used to Symbian dev tools Jul 10 12:42:06 RST38h, it works in other OS's or only win ? Jul 10 12:42:23 VDVsx: Windoze only Jul 10 12:47:19 and barely in that Jul 10 12:48:32 Yes, it makes you think people who write their own build systems (as opposed to make) should be moved up in the hitlist Jul 10 12:49:13 But at least they did not use Java and did not mandate use of Eclipse Jul 10 12:49:48 they have carbide now.. Jul 10 12:49:59 Which I never used and not going to Jul 10 12:53:57 I' Jul 10 12:54:06 try to avoid it as much as I can Jul 10 12:54:15 Well it can be safely ignored Jul 10 12:54:16 but very soon I have to play around with qt tower Jul 10 12:54:35 hopefully the console compiler is enough.. Jul 10 12:54:41 I would also LOVE to ignore the build system but it does not seem to be possible Jul 10 12:58:17 eureka is back Jul 10 12:58:18 :) Jul 10 12:58:24 * Macer loves eureka Jul 10 12:58:26 at least i did Jul 10 12:58:54 it started to get shitty after teh strike. then again a lot of shows did. guess all the good writers got their cut and the world was left with the scrubs Jul 10 13:03:21 Macer, back as in new episodes to watch? or in production? Jul 10 13:04:49 lcuk: new ones Jul 10 13:04:54 new one comes on tonight :) Jul 10 13:05:07 they are picking up season3 Jul 10 13:05:20 where the writers strike left them off Jul 10 13:05:34 instead of starting a new season thus ruining dvd sales Jul 10 13:05:35 haha Jul 10 13:05:52 they'd have to charge less for a season3 dvd/bray box set Jul 10 13:05:53 :) Jul 10 13:06:24 i'm gonig to have to go to work today Jul 10 13:06:26 bastards Jul 10 13:06:40 i will just go in at night when nobody is there and disappear into the shadows at dawn :) Jul 10 13:06:52 and leave notes Jul 10 13:06:53 haha Jul 10 13:10:30 !seen andre_ Jul 10 13:11:00 could someone help me? :) Jul 10 13:11:07 ~seen andre_ Jul 10 13:11:08 andre_ was last seen on IRC in channel #maemo, 59d 13m 47s ago, saying: 'andrewfblack: actually I think he came here first....'. Jul 10 13:14:24 ~seen andre__ Jul 10 13:14:25 andre__ was last seen on IRC in channel #maemo, 1d 4h 19m 11s ago, saying: 'caoticM, yeah, that's the latest'. Jul 10 13:15:02 qwerty12_N810: anyway, i need help now :).... Macer would you be my helper? Jul 10 13:16:37 timeless_mbp: depends on what, I don't exactly have the best resources available to me being on a tablet :P Jul 10 13:16:53 i just need someone to find upstream for "sofia sip" Jul 10 13:24:41 * Stskeeps ponders if he has small enough tweezers to get out the charging pin Jul 10 13:29:27 "They call it fuel versatility, as gasoline, diesel, and solar power may also be used if available, yet we'll offer no prizes for predicting which energy source these chainsaw-equipped robots will prefer." Jul 10 13:42:07 chainsaw equipped robots? Jul 10 13:42:14 uhm Jul 10 13:42:25 are they having a prize to see who can make the best tree chopping robot? Jul 10 13:43:01 i would say to make one that sends its sawdust into a bin that burns and creates steam with a long hose hooked up to a tank full of distilled water Jul 10 13:43:34 it's a shame the only way we can make power is by using steam and turbines still :) Jul 10 13:43:46 well.. realistic power that is haha Jul 10 13:44:00 Well there is quite a few other ways Jul 10 13:44:17 nothing that can realistically be used on large scales at a practical cost though Jul 10 13:44:34 On large scales you can just as well skip on electricity Jul 10 13:45:01 (see internal combustion engine =)) Jul 10 13:45:13 heh Jul 10 13:45:32 that isn't a practical method :) Jul 10 13:45:37 it uses fuel too quickly Jul 10 13:45:50 [looking outside] Looks pretty practical to me =) Jul 10 13:45:55 haha Jul 10 13:46:11 still sucks to keep refueling ice generators Jul 10 13:46:24 especially if you're the poor bastard that has to do it Jul 10 13:46:32 why, do you have trouble finding cadavers? Jul 10 13:46:46 heh Jul 10 13:47:02 they make excellent fuel Jul 10 13:47:11 the majority of power on the planet is made from steam still though Jul 10 13:47:21 you would think that by now we would find a better way to accelerate electrons Jul 10 13:48:10 wtf. like it's the 1920s or something still :) Jul 10 13:49:31 abusing the expansion and low hanging fruit of boiling off water is still a reasonable thing to do Jul 10 13:50:54 i just wish more power stations supplied runoff water for nearby homes though - cooling towers are so wasteful Jul 10 13:51:23 I want the barcode reader already. Jul 10 13:51:43 I'm tired of typing in a bunch of crap to get reviews of stuff Jul 10 13:53:29 lcuk: i'm in chicago Jul 10 13:53:37 we have a huge water supply and could care less haha Jul 10 13:54:14 we just dont understand the concept of saving water Jul 10 13:54:19 i'm personally pondering how much of a mental shift it'll be to have to move to a city where tap water isn't drinkable Jul 10 13:54:42 Stskeeps: i agree. i hear nyc has bad water. as do most of the southern states in the US Jul 10 13:54:54 I guess it is difficult to make water in the desert :) Jul 10 13:55:17 a lot of california has their water pumped from hundreds of miles away over mountains by giant pumps Jul 10 13:55:28 talk about a crappy place to live haha Jul 10 13:55:42 Sts: Which city? Jul 10 13:55:54 RST38h: moving to warsaw in september Jul 10 13:56:18 Sts: I would guess it is drinkable, just not when done regularly :) Jul 10 13:56:33 i think the comedian sam kinison said it best when he said "Don't send people money who live in the desert because they're poor. Send them luggage. You see this? This is sand. You know what it is going to be in a million years? IT'S GOING TO BE FUCKING SAND!" Jul 10 13:56:49 Sts: Is it *officially* undrinkable or is it just a word of mouth? Jul 10 13:57:21 RST38h: well sufficient that people fetch ground water from stations around the city Jul 10 13:57:25 Stskeeps: don't move to poland Jul 10 13:57:25 poles get no respect Jul 10 13:57:40 Macer: a bit too late for redeciding by now :) Jul 10 13:57:47 and i'm a dane, not a pole :P Jul 10 13:57:47 heh Jul 10 13:57:53 doesn't matter Jul 10 13:57:58 your children will be poes Jul 10 13:58:00 poles Jul 10 13:58:12 Sts: They do it all the time here too, because the ground water is considered cleaner and tastier Jul 10 13:58:46 we have a huge pole population in chicago Jul 10 13:58:58 i think only 2nd to warsaw Jul 10 13:59:22 macer, im talking about making use of the heat and energy available in water Jul 10 13:59:29 the stuff they cannot use for power generation Jul 10 13:59:46 you mean providing free heating for homes nearby? :) Jul 10 13:59:55 by running hot water lines into radiators ? Jul 10 13:59:59 Sts: Generally, if you do not want to drink tap water, just boil it and keep it in the kettle Jul 10 14:00:00 yeah, some do it Jul 10 14:00:12 heh. no because then the power company would get sued Jul 10 14:00:19 by some idiot that burns himself on the provided radiator Jul 10 14:00:22 boiling water and keeping it in the kettle does NOT give you pure water Jul 10 14:00:25 you have to distill it Jul 10 14:00:31 and of course they would lose because they are big industry Jul 10 14:00:39 RST38h: yeah, i know - it's just weird coming from a place where we have sane tap water :) Jul 10 14:00:40 lcuk: Drinking distilled water is bad for your health Jul 10 14:00:40 and courts love to beat up big industry for some reason Jul 10 14:00:55 like the dumb bitch that sued mcdonalds because she burned herself with the mcdonalds coffee Jul 10 14:01:04 i would rather do that than drink impure water Jul 10 14:01:14 macer, it happens, some places use it Jul 10 14:01:14 no shit capt. mensa.. the coffee is hot.. how about you be a little careful with it Jul 10 14:01:19 Sts: I am almost sure Warsaw has reasonably sane tap water, just check what their sanitary control organization says Jul 10 14:01:20 i just wish it was more Jul 10 14:01:22 heh Jul 10 14:01:47 RST38h, put seawater in your kettle, boil it and then drink it Jul 10 14:01:56 will it be clean or will it still be salty? Jul 10 14:01:56 she was probably on her cell while putting on makeup and changing the radio with hot coffee sitting in her lap Jul 10 14:02:06 lcuk: depends on how you cook it Jul 10 14:02:13 lcuk: no idea: I have never had seawater nearby :) Jul 10 14:02:19 at the right temp the vapor should be only water Jul 10 14:02:25 which you can collect if you are hardcore Jul 10 14:02:36 the pure water will boil off, leaving the residue as a HIGHER concentration of crap Jul 10 14:02:37 even better would be to add a little vacuum to it :) Jul 10 14:02:43 lcuk: Also, I doubt there is seawater in Warsaw water mains Jul 10 14:02:44 to drop the boiling temp of the water Jul 10 14:03:18 RST38h: in warsaw.. i would probably more likely boil the water just to make sure tehre wasn't disease Jul 10 14:03:21 ok, put sewage into your kettle and boil it Jul 10 14:03:27 then drink Jul 10 14:03:33 lcuk: same effect :) Jul 10 14:03:44 Macer: Why should there be? Jul 10 14:03:56 you just need the proper vacuum and temp to distill the water Jul 10 14:03:57 Stskeeps, just buy a filter of some kind and be done with it. Jul 10 14:04:05 Macer: They ain't third world. They should have proper facilties Jul 10 14:04:08 we shit in our water here.. it is constantly recycled by our water treatment Jul 10 14:04:08 heh Jul 10 14:04:30 RST38h: tell that to nyc and southern california Jul 10 14:04:38 not to mention well water in other southern states that ruins teeth Jul 10 14:04:40 Macer: These guys are not NYC Jul 10 14:04:47 why do you think yokels all have bad teeth? Jul 10 14:04:51 bad well water Jul 10 14:04:51 GAN800: ah, i'm not whining about it :) just a mental shift Jul 10 14:05:03 Stskeeps: so hey... Jul 10 14:05:12 i need someone who can help me figure out where the heck sofia sip lives Jul 10 14:05:13 Macer: They are a relatively small former socialist country. They should have water treatment faciltiies Jul 10 14:05:37 RST38h: heh. after the nazis left it all went to crap in eastern europe Jul 10 14:05:37 timeless_mbp: freshmeat? Jul 10 14:06:03 russia took over and it was all down hill from there. so they probably have the same water treatment from ww2 Jul 10 14:06:07 in a horrible state of affairs Jul 10 14:06:25 Stskeeps, that's why you gotta get an undersink filter. Jul 10 14:06:38 Don't even need to think about it. Jul 10 14:07:18 Macer: that's another common mistake Jul 10 14:07:53 Macer: They are a little backward, but not that badly Jul 10 14:08:45 RST38h: :) Jul 10 14:08:46 Situated in 56 hectares of the Bialol.ka borough in northeast Warsaw, Czajka WWTP was completed in 1991, after a building programme that took 17 years to come to a close. The lengthy construction meant that much of the technology and equipment was outdated by the time the plant came online, forcing the almost immediate start of a series of modernisations. Jul 10 14:09:07 case closed Jul 10 14:09:08 haha Jul 10 14:09:56 Macer: 17 years means the techology is no older than 1974 Jul 10 14:10:13 Macer: Not a lot changed in water treatment since then. Jul 10 14:10:14 the point is that it took poland 17 years to build a waste water treatement plant Jul 10 14:10:22 Macer: And? Jul 10 14:10:39 you don't see anything wrong with that? :) Jul 10 14:11:17 No. It is normal for an Estearn European socialist country. Jul 10 14:11:46 it managed to produce respectable quality effluent by the standards of the time and represented a big advance on the previous arrangements . the discharge of untreated wastewater into the Vistula. Jul 10 14:12:03 so for 17 years they were just sending untreated water into the Vistula Jul 10 14:12:05 :) Jul 10 14:12:19 Actually for a much longer time :) Jul 10 14:12:25 yeah haha Jul 10 14:12:52 i'm sorry but poland just does not sound like a place where i would just simply put faith in its water Jul 10 14:12:53 So do a lot of other cities in the world though Jul 10 14:13:15 sure. underdeveloped cities Jul 10 14:13:37 it's ok. it's europe though Jul 10 14:13:48 i'm sure it just flows into a neighboring country and kills them instead Jul 10 14:13:48 :) Jul 10 14:13:57 Mmm...When you say "Europe" you obviously mean "Germany" or "UK"? Jul 10 14:14:36 yeah. i don't think it's wise to include easter europe into the realm of europe Jul 10 14:14:59 Well, it has been done before you have got a chance to decide :) Jul 10 14:15:00 maybe there should be a conference to go ahead and split europe at Germany's eastern border and turn anything east of that into asia Jul 10 14:15:27 oh wait Jul 10 14:15:32 Yes, Moscow would absolutely LOVE that :) Jul 10 14:15:32 pfft. Jul 10 14:15:33 :P Jul 10 14:15:40 we might have to jerrymander a few countries Jul 10 14:15:40 :) Jul 10 14:15:42 Hehe Jul 10 14:15:51 Stskeeps: hahaha Jul 10 14:16:22 Macer: the stuff that greenpeace complains about pales in comparision to soviet era(and thereafter) environment catastrophes Jul 10 14:16:38 like chernobyl? Jul 10 14:16:39 :) Jul 10 14:16:45 bigger stuff Jul 10 14:16:53 bigger, yes Jul 10 14:16:56 haha Jul 10 14:16:56 in lost lives, lost livelihoods, pure stupidity etc Jul 10 14:17:07 what made the soviet union so bad during the good old communist days Jul 10 14:17:11 lost lakes Jul 10 14:17:18 is they never asked for help nor ever admitted anything was wrong Jul 10 14:17:29 why is it surprising? Jul 10 14:17:30 pretty much Jul 10 14:17:33 it isn't Jul 10 14:17:37 government rarely admits it's wrong Jul 10 14:17:43 exactly Jul 10 14:17:47 Stskeeps: true.. but chernobyl? :) Jul 10 14:17:55 it's not like russians were free pre-soviet either Jul 10 14:17:55 "EVERYTHING'S FINE" Jul 10 14:18:11 glass: i guess that's true Jul 10 14:18:15 :) Jul 10 14:18:20 Macer: that, again, is totally predictable Jul 10 14:18:35 You want to keep the lid on the problem for as long as possible Jul 10 14:18:53 RST38h: thats a drunkards fix Jul 10 14:19:02 RST38h: haha.. yeah because everybody knows that a huge radioactive fire needs time to get the PR things smooth Jul 10 14:19:10 Macer: economic crisis.. Jul 10 14:19:10 :P Jul 10 14:19:24 yeah economic crisis were far bigger Jul 10 14:19:31 glass: Yet, it is always done this way Jul 10 14:19:32 and they happened of stupid management etc Jul 10 14:19:32 while it's pumping thousands of metric tons of radioactive debris into the atmosphere across all of europe :) Jul 10 14:19:35 hahaha Jul 10 14:19:44 glass: On all levels, from lower level management all the way to the top Jul 10 14:19:45 RST38h: bleh.. it's not always done so crappily Jul 10 14:20:05 glass: Well, THAT particular time they have just got too big a problem :) Jul 10 14:20:07 problem is they've never had free press Jul 10 14:20:13 and after they have that, it takes 50y+ Jul 10 14:20:25 Stskeeps: did they seriously think nobody would find out they had a huge nuclear plant catostraphe? Jul 10 14:20:30 glass: How would free press help preventing chernobyl? Jul 10 14:20:38 i wonder how many people actually died because of it Jul 10 14:20:48 Macer: fewer than you think Jul 10 14:20:50 considering russia only reported the numbers of the workers who were stuck running into it Jul 10 14:20:52 RST38h: fuck chernobyl, plants live there Jul 10 14:21:06 glass: mutated plants :-D Jul 10 14:21:12 maybe life's next step Jul 10 14:21:13 haha Jul 10 14:21:16 RST38h: so? they created huge salt flats Jul 10 14:21:19 RST38h: elsewehre Jul 10 14:21:28 and because of that, ran out of food and stuff etc etc Jul 10 14:21:39 realistically Jul 10 14:21:45 free press would have been able to inspect the plant Jul 10 14:21:50 and comment on its ability to run Jul 10 14:21:54 glass: you mean the Aral sea? Jul 10 14:21:57 and the abilities of its workers Jul 10 14:22:05 raising questions about how certain things are done Jul 10 14:22:09 RST38h: it's just one of the well knowns and biggest Jul 10 14:22:13 Macer: Have you ever seena live journalist? Jul 10 14:22:15 RST38h: so free press could very well have possibly prevented it :) Jul 10 14:22:22 RST38h: sure. all the time Jul 10 14:22:27 glass: Actually not the biggest Jul 10 14:22:43 glass: Check out rocket fuel pollution in .KZ Jul 10 14:22:46 we had them following us around in iraq a lot of the time.. which for us kind of sucked because we had to make sure they didn't get shot Jul 10 14:23:03 but then again all that pales in comparision to what stalin did just for kicks, or keeping civil unrest from happening or whatever Jul 10 14:23:15 glass: he was worse than hitler Jul 10 14:23:19 well.. almost maybe Jul 10 14:23:20 Macer: Can you honestly say that a typical (or smarter than typical) journalist has enough brain matter to inspect ANYTHING bigger than his navel? Jul 10 14:23:30 RST38h: some do Jul 10 14:23:30 Macer: well difference with him and hitler is that hitler lost Jul 10 14:23:41 glass: haha.. i guess that's true Jul 10 14:23:57 Ahha, we have finally got an obligatory Hitler reference Jul 10 14:24:02 RST38h: do you think that if there was a report on a power plant here in the US and its inability to run that was reported in a newspaper Jul 10 14:24:13 glass: This is really comparing apples and oranges Jul 10 14:24:18 that some govt agency because of the bad PR wouldn't run to it and start inspecting it head to toe ? :) Jul 10 14:24:44 RST38h: well, not really. both were insane,didn't trust anyone and killed people so much that they wouldn't have been able to hold position with free press Jul 10 14:24:55 glass: You compare Stalin's social crap with later environmental crap (systemic) with an isolated incident of Chernobyl Jul 10 14:25:11 of course this is all pretty useless chitchat Jul 10 14:25:15 glass: And then you for some reason compare them all to Hitler, just for kicks Jul 10 14:25:32 RST38h: impossible to talk about stalin without talking about hitler Jul 10 14:25:41 glass: Quite possible for me :) Jul 10 14:25:42 RST38h: ww2 was essential Jul 10 14:25:50 RST38h: i think hitler was awesome. and not because he was a murdering bastard.. but realistically. he proved that fascism works Jul 10 14:25:52 glass: Essential for what? Jul 10 14:25:56 he was just the wrong guy leading the charge :) Jul 10 14:26:02 RST38h: for stalin to stay in power even Jul 10 14:26:12 Macer: Only proved that fscism works for a limited amount of time Jul 10 14:26:14 RST38h: stalins biggest shit was post-ww2 Jul 10 14:26:23 glass: Absolutely unessential Jul 10 14:26:26 RST38h: that is out for debate Jul 10 14:26:34 glass: And his biggest shit was BEFORE ww2, sorry Jul 10 14:26:38 no it wasnt Jul 10 14:26:54 glass: ok, give an example Jul 10 14:26:54 RST38h: fascism does not have to be a cruel dictatorship Jul 10 14:27:06 which it always winds up being Jul 10 14:27:13 RST38h: all eastern europe and soviet plight Jul 10 14:27:22 if there was a proper fascist leader then it would work (i think) very well Jul 10 14:27:27 RST38h: it's not fun. have you ever talked to normal people who lived through it? Jul 10 14:27:28 glass: For eastern europe, it may have been the biggest shit Jul 10 14:27:42 the millions and millions Jul 10 14:27:45 glass: For Russians the biggest shit was 1937, sorry Jul 10 14:28:04 lol! Jul 10 14:28:06 haha Jul 10 14:28:07 * Macer goes away now Jul 10 14:28:08 oh man Jul 10 14:28:14 high five macer Jul 10 14:28:21 i'm gonna continue my holiday Jul 10 14:28:25 glass: And believe me, eastern europe had it relatively easy Jul 10 14:28:58 glass: Easier than if they had Hitler instead, most likely. Jul 10 14:39:37 o.0 Jul 10 14:39:44 * xnt14 likes the look of the new sf Jul 10 14:39:47 :) Jul 10 14:41:16 fiferboy: If I don't call XSendEvent() in QHildonInputContext::sendHildonCommand(), the keyboard doesn't show up. Jul 10 14:41:30 Right Jul 10 14:42:06 And it is the XSendEvent that causes the flicker? Jul 10 14:42:31 It's the call to msg->input_window = widget->winId(); that causes the widget in question to be converted to a native X window on the fly. Jul 10 14:42:48 Which is needed to put the winId() in the XEvent. Jul 10 14:43:10 If I take out the winId() call, then the keyboard shows up fine, but doesn't transfer keys to the text field. Jul 10 14:43:32 Right. Do you still get the message containing the keycode in that case? Jul 10 14:45:05 Yeah the message gets sent, but it won't get routed to the right widget since it doesn't have a winId(). Jul 10 14:45:27 Can we re-route it ourselves without using winId? Jul 10 14:45:31 That's why I'm trying to call x11ClientMessage directly, since it's the highest-level call that takes a QWidget*. Jul 10 14:45:40 But it simply doesn't work... Jul 10 14:46:54 did it work before you messed with it? Jul 10 14:46:55 Do you know who wrote the hildon input method? Jul 10 14:47:05 does anyone know you messed with it? Jul 10 14:47:10 can you get away with it? Jul 10 14:47:26 lcuk: It worked fine before I messed with it, but it flashes... Jul 10 14:47:32 lcuk: What do you mean get away with it? Jul 10 14:47:43 did you try the fix for your one special case? Jul 10 14:47:59 coldboot, amusing flowchart about fucking with things and breaking em ;) Jul 10 14:49:44 http://danielfranklingomez.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/01/problemsolving.jpg Jul 10 14:49:47 lcuk: I'm trying to filter out the key events specifically (HILDON_IM_UPP and HILDON_IM_LOW), and call qApp->x11ClientMessage() in that case, and call the usual XSendEvent() in all other cases. Jul 10 14:50:03 haha, I've seen this. Jul 10 14:50:29 yes, its not new Jul 10 14:50:46 so your flickering has expanded beyond just one tiny area Jul 10 14:51:12 The flickering is always as it was. Jul 10 14:51:20 might i give you the number of a good cork factory as well as my contact at the rubber glove facility Jul 10 14:51:25 ha Jul 10 14:52:32 changing deep behaviour and rerouting messages here there and everywhere will lead to a massive game of whackamole, good luck with it Jul 10 14:52:57 It's the only idea I've got right now... Jul 10 14:58:32 Who wrote qhildoninputcontext_x11.cpp ? Jul 10 15:00:13 An evil man. Jul 10 15:00:35 Is there some subversion visualization like Trac setup for Maemo's svn repo? Jul 10 15:00:55 there's viewcvs somewhere Jul 10 15:00:59 doesnt git have a blame function Jul 10 15:01:08 Did git import the history? Jul 10 15:01:22 i dunno Jul 10 15:01:36 i thought qt was around for longer than its maemo involvement Jul 10 15:01:45 and that part of dev mustv had revision history Jul 10 15:02:05 it doesnt make sense for the maemo bit to have none.. Jul 10 15:02:39 Git blame shows it all from Antonio who just pushed the files into git in June. Jul 10 15:03:32 Oh wait, I think Antonio wrote it... Jul 10 15:03:45 Whatever history internal Qt svn had before, I do not see why they should publish it for everyone Jul 10 15:03:48 coldboot: Antonio probably did write it Jul 10 15:05:05 lcuk: coldboot isn't changing HIM itself, just the way Qt is using it Jul 10 15:07:12 Does Antonio work for Nokia? Jul 10 15:07:37 Yep he does. Jul 10 15:13:26 fiferboy, whackamole Jul 10 15:13:36 lcuk: ?? Jul 10 15:13:51 i never thought he was changing it - its the interactions it has been tied into Jul 10 15:14:04 Ah, but why whackamole? Jul 10 15:14:07 changing how those interactions work will cause new bugs to pop up in unexpected places Jul 10 15:14:38 Well, maybe Jul 10 15:15:04 coldboot: Reading about qinputcontext, it doesn't look like we should need to convert widgets into x11 windows Jul 10 15:15:27 There are methods for sending a raw xevent to the widget to be interpreted Jul 10 15:15:34 What are they? Jul 10 15:15:43 That would definitely help. Jul 10 15:16:32 x11FilterEvent is supposed to do that, and I think the re-implementation Antonio did just handles some special keys from HIM Jul 10 15:17:17 I tried calling x11FilterEvent() directly and it didn't work. Jul 10 15:33:17 coldboot: x11FilterEvent is an override function, so it gets called when the inherited function needs it. Jul 10 15:34:17 coldboot: So, when you have the winid line commented out it still pops up the keyboard and receives the keycode Jul 10 15:34:29 coldboot: Where do you get the code? What function? Jul 10 15:34:37 where do bluez bugs live? Jul 10 15:34:46 in the ether Jul 10 15:36:19 fiferboy: When I have the winid line commented out, it still pops up the keyboard, but the key doesn't get sent to the Qt text box. Jul 10 15:36:30 This is in: QHildonInputContext::sendHildonCommand Jul 10 15:36:54 But the key code is still received somewhere, right? Jul 10 15:38:27 No wonder people think you need dedicated ebooks readers. The page turning mechanisms in most software are awful. Jul 10 15:39:02 fiferboy: It must be received somewhere, yeah. I turned on HIM_DEBUG, there will be lots of prints I can see. Jul 10 15:39:18 Thank god for +/- Jul 10 15:39:50 coldboot: Can you put a qDebug() in x11FilterEvent and see if it is getting called when you press a key on the OSK? Jul 10 15:40:38 https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=4775 Jul 10 15:41:01 fiferboy: Yeah, doing that now. Jul 10 15:58:02 fiferboy: With HIM_DEBUG #defined, here is the transcript of me playing with shopper: http://pastie.org/541472 Jul 10 16:05:19 fiferboy: Ah, interesting. x11FilterEvent() is called before sendHildonCommand(). Jul 10 16:27:44 lizardo, are you there? Jul 10 16:33:39 Luke-Jr: http://www2.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.26366 Jul 10 16:35:30 Stskeeps: cool; I'll get around to that $100 deal thing someday... :þ Jul 10 16:35:49 Luke-Jr: i just poked them yesterday for sources and updates on the stuff Jul 10 16:36:30 still, 152$ with free shipping is darn cheap Jul 10 16:37:29 not sure 99$ + shipping would beat that Jul 10 16:43:15 We have a SmartQ 5 and 7 at our office. Jul 10 16:43:31 oh, neat - where do you work? Jul 10 16:43:41 Wireless Generation in Brooklyn, New York. Jul 10 16:43:57 * Stskeeps got a q5 donated by the peeps who make them Jul 10 16:44:40 Nice Jul 10 16:45:04 How did you swing that? Jul 10 16:45:24 we got two donated to Mer, - we simply mailed them a bit out of the blue through a chinese contact :) Jul 10 16:45:34 the product manager is a N800 owner himself and he knew of the Mer project Jul 10 16:48:24 Where do you work? Jul 10 16:48:54 me? at a university, until september, but regarding Mer i'm just a private person Jul 10 16:50:42 hmm Jul 10 16:51:53 YAY it works :) https://gni06.xceleo.org/ Jul 10 16:52:17 * xnt14 installs the certs on his nit and ipod.......... Jul 10 16:52:45 hmmm Jul 10 16:53:32 Is there some diff paste service? Jul 10 16:53:42 Where you can paste two files, and it'll show the diff? Jul 10 16:55:08 With pastebin, you can post a "follow up" and see the differences but you won't get a diff that you can apply with "patch" Jul 10 16:55:49 mail.app on my ipod it utter crap on cert files....... Jul 10 16:56:09 pastebin.com? Jul 10 16:56:15 yep Jul 10 16:56:38 Oh cool. Jul 10 16:56:43 Doesn't do side by side, though. Jul 10 16:58:10 the nit email + cert system is way better :P the ipod has to open settings.app to install a cert...... Jul 10 16:58:28 qwerty12_N810: http://www.daimi.au.dk/~cvm/tearfreerunner.png :> Jul 10 16:58:35 (it's bloody bloody fast.) Jul 10 16:59:04 Stskeeps: hehe, awesome Jul 10 16:59:21 stskeeps: awesome ;) Jul 10 16:59:49 Hmm, anybody know how to properly detect window visibility to stop updates when hidden? http://lists.maemo.org/pipermail/maemo-developers/2009-July/019911.html - thp's suggestion of window-state-event just doesn't work for me on Diablo Jul 10 17:00:15 Given the drum Nokia's been banging about making apps well behaved and save battery power, I'm surprised I can't find more info on doing this properly. Jul 10 17:00:36 Jaffa: people forget how to do it really - the wiki page sounds like a very good idea Jul 10 17:01:06 * Jaffa 'd write it happily, once he found a method which actually worked :-/ Jul 10 17:01:18 * xnt14 wonders what jackass at apple thought that it was a good idea to not allow the user to set his own ca certs as trusted...... Jul 10 17:01:21 Jaffa: window-state-event seemed to be borken for me too; at least fullscreen event worked but I wouldn't get one when the program was iconified (at least with a test pygtk program under diablo) Jul 10 17:02:44 coldboot: That transcript is with the keyboard popping up and chars being sent back to the Qt widget properly? Jul 10 17:04:03 fiferboy: Yeah, without a code change. Jul 10 17:04:10 So still flickering. Jul 10 17:04:53 fiferboy: I have a transcript with the winId() removed, and then with the winId() removed and calling x11FilterEvent() instead of XSendEvent(). Jul 10 17:05:01 coldboot: Are you trying to diff the log after the flicker fix to see what changes? Jul 10 17:05:15 fiferboy: Yeah Jul 10 17:05:24 fiferboy: Trying to see the code flow to see what breaks when you remove the winId. Jul 10 17:05:30 That should be enlightening Jul 10 17:06:06 qwerty12_N810: It could be a pygtk problem. Which'd be annoying. Jul 10 17:07:26 Jaffa: ukki says he had the same problem with a gtk ruby app and a vala one Jul 10 17:10:34 fiferboy: All three cases: http://pastie.org/541570 http://pastie.org/541571 http://pastie.org/541572 Jul 10 17:10:47 I'm gonna go eat free lunch, be back late.r Jul 10 17:14:39 Jaffa, don't tell me you're surprised. ;) Jul 10 17:19:29 jaffa, in diablo its normal x11 handling isnt it Jul 10 17:19:41 or rather mostly normal gtk handling Jul 10 17:23:50 back Jul 10 17:30:50 Hi Jul 10 17:32:19 Stskeeps: Good to see that you guys make other projects better ;) https://git.maemo.org/projects/gitweb?p=modest;a=commit;h=0accfeb5924067ead7f1aa48f7883fe2a6cea63c Jul 10 17:33:44 hehe Jul 10 17:34:10 seriously, the crap laying about and assumptions.. Jul 10 17:37:36 :) https://gni06.xceleo.org/core/ Jul 10 17:37:44 core using cgi Jul 10 17:38:39 guys try not to hammer that "server" I'm hosting it on my router, apparently port 80 is blocked but port 443 (https) isn't xD Jul 10 17:39:30 slashdot him quick! =) Jul 10 17:39:55 yes post it on /. Jul 10 17:40:20 oh wow xD Jul 10 17:40:59 why would a ssl page hosted on a router be accepeted at /.? Jul 10 17:41:16 *accepted Jul 10 17:41:37 Put it on digg under the guise that it's for "testing" the server Jul 10 17:42:12 well, I could just revoke the cname record from dh.... Jul 10 17:44:11 qwerty12_N810: http://www.daimi.au.dk/~cvm/transmbkbd.png (confusing, i know) Jul 10 17:45:12 Stskeeps, wtf? jk, that looks cool xD Jul 10 17:45:27 (it's the principle of it i like) Jul 10 17:45:38 hehe Jul 10 17:46:13 get that osso-xterm mod with the overlayed keyboard Jul 10 17:46:47 ffs, why - no how does microb manage to suck so much dick Jul 10 17:46:48 possibly, i'm just thinking what else we could abuse this for :P Jul 10 17:50:19 brb, guys don't screw up my router... Jul 10 17:57:06 36 hours of no cigarettes Jul 10 17:57:41 xnt14: What is this web 2.0 stuff? =) Jul 10 17:59:54 lcuk: Normal GTK stuff is working fine on Ubuntu, but doesn't get any window-state-event at all on Diablo Jul 10 18:24:27 Jaffa, indications of a bug then.. Jul 10 18:27:43 Why the heck is git so confusing for me? Jul 10 18:27:58 I feel like I am missing something ovbious that would make everything clear... Jul 10 18:28:44 fiferboy: git is easy, i only miss the rcsclean function. Jul 10 18:29:43 I get lost trying to figure out when to use "git checkout" "git fetch" "git merge" "git pull" the names all seem to imply the same basic functionality to me... Jul 10 18:30:04 I can't even use the documentation as an excuse, it seems good Jul 10 18:30:32 fiferboy, http://zrusin.blogspot.com/2007/09/git-cheat-sheet.html Jul 10 18:30:35 fiferboy: git checkout is local, git pull is extern, git merge is something total different, it combines multiple versions Jul 10 18:30:38 print it out, put it on wall near you Jul 10 18:30:45 or just write the few things you do often Jul 10 18:32:40 lcuk, johnsq thanks. I thikn what I want to do is checkout a branch and merge another branch on it. Jul 10 18:33:52 There's nothin' like free food at work. Jul 10 18:34:42 the wife of one of my co workers sometimes goes on a random mission to feed the entire building Jul 10 18:34:51 he comes in with tonnes of food :D Jul 10 18:35:12 Every second Friday is bagel and muffin day for me Jul 10 18:35:27 I'd love to work for Google and get fed all day. Jul 10 18:36:16 does google feed you all day? or just at designated meal times Jul 10 18:36:29 * lcuk can imagine serge sitting on a recliner having grapes peeled for him Jul 10 18:36:30 Just at the designated meal times, I think. Jul 10 18:36:39 But I would just store food at my desk. Jul 10 18:36:43 And eat whenever I like. Jul 10 18:36:57 haha squirrel hoarding is good Jul 10 18:37:02 I think they have breakfast early, and dinner late, to encourage you to live at work. Jul 10 18:37:03 until you forget where you put a stash Jul 10 18:37:12 I would forage daily. Jul 10 18:37:27 and that haddock you left in the filing cabinet (neatly filed under 'f' for fish) will soon get you a pink slip lol Jul 10 18:37:33 haha Jul 10 18:37:40 coldboot: Lines 10 to 24 are missing from the second pastie, and they come from the switch statement in x11FilterEvent Jul 10 18:37:46 Actually, I've often found that you can leave meat out for 36 hours and eat it just fine. Jul 10 18:38:07 fiferboy: That's because nothing was printed when that happened. Jul 10 18:38:15 oi! if i leave meat out for 36 hours and you come along and eat it i would be pissed Jul 10 18:38:19 The pastes are complete. Jul 10 18:38:38 Also the expiry date on yoghurt is a lie. Jul 10 18:38:43 coldboot: No, I know that. I'm saying that is what is not being processed because of the changes Jul 10 18:38:57 yeah Jul 10 18:39:12 Now to figure out why x11FilterEvent is not being applied... Jul 10 18:39:46 Probably because whatever captures the X event at the highest level, dispatches it to the proper widget based on the widget's winId(). Jul 10 18:40:23 if a widget has its own winid (and hence x11 window) will have its own event handler wont it? Jul 10 18:40:30 I'm going to put some prints in x11FilterEvent to see if it gets called at all. Right now it just prints if it hits a certain if branch. Jul 10 18:40:37 I'd like to see where x11FilterEvent is being called or installed as an event filter Jul 10 18:40:44 lcuk: I think so. Jul 10 18:40:57 coldboot: That's what I was going to do if my virtualbox network stayed up long enough to git clone Jul 10 18:41:45 fiferboy: What's a virtualbox? Jul 10 18:41:57 im back Jul 10 18:42:00 Let's me run Linux inside Windows cleanly Jul 10 18:42:13 RST38H, its a jquery based admin panel Jul 10 18:42:20 i hate people starting counting with 1 Jul 10 18:42:22 brb again, going to work Jul 10 18:42:30 Why not just use VMware Server 2.0? Jul 10 18:43:00 I used to have better luck with virtualbox, but version 3 is dropping the network connection and freezing the VM Jul 10 18:43:39 Does VirtualBox let you install the OS on a hard drive, so you can track it in Git, or does it have some sort of disk image file like VMware does? Jul 10 18:43:57 Hmm, QApplication has its own x11FilterEvent function Jul 10 18:44:05 coldboot: disk image Jul 10 18:44:50 I think Win4Lin is the only thing that would let you put the OS on your hard drive. Jul 10 18:45:05 Nice, so you can git reset if you got a virus in Windows. Jul 10 18:45:24 I like the separate image so I can just blow it away cleanly if I need to Jul 10 18:45:58 Oh I mean put it in a subdirectory, as if the subdirectory was the disk-image, but you'd still be able to see the individual files with your host os. Jul 10 18:46:20 Or if VMware had some Linux program that let you mount the disk image analogous to how you mount an iso. Jul 10 18:49:21 VMWare comes with a script that lets you mount the VMDK and browse it from your host, providing the VM isn't using the VMDK. I just run sftp inside the guest (usually Linux for me and run sshfs from the host. Jul 10 18:49:50 Can you write to it? Jul 10 18:50:39 Tracking the Windows hard drive with git through the network wouldn't be practical. Jul 10 18:50:59 Pretty sure, at least it has an explict option for a RO mount Jul 10 18:51:03 I used git to track all of scratchbox 2 so when it fucked up I could just revert it, saved me so much time. Jul 10 18:51:12 Cool. Jul 10 18:51:31 I'm old fashioned: I tarred up my targets :) Jul 10 18:52:00 You should try using git for it, it's so good. Jul 10 18:52:23 You'll find yourself setting more frequent backup points, by running git commit every time you do something as root. Jul 10 18:52:38 I installed fakeroot, which ruins scratchbox 2. Jul 10 18:52:47 coldboot: What file is that winId line that causes the flicker? Jul 10 18:53:56 http://qt.gitorious.org/qt/nhooey-qt-maemo-bugfixes/blobs/1bdac2e41b137fd106493630dc1a553b66d21338/src/gui/inputmethod/qhildoninputcontext_x11.cpp#line1427 Jul 10 18:55:06 coldboot: When you changed that, did you change line 408 to use the widget->window()->winId too? Jul 10 18:58:39 fiferboy: I just commented them both out originally, then set them to both use widget->window()->winId(), this time I've just commented out the line at 1427. Jul 10 18:59:12 No luck when they were both widget->window()->winId(), I suppose Jul 10 18:59:17 Nope. Jul 10 18:59:20 lcuk: thp's comment on maemo-developers suggests it's a problem one can workaround; and I can't believe that no-one else has encountered it in the last 4 years of Maemo development. Jul 10 18:59:44 is it a problem in diablo? Jul 10 18:59:55 its quite easy to expect no1 to encounter it Jul 10 19:00:18 coldboot: I suppose that makes sense, since that is called from x11FilterEvent that is not getting processed Jul 10 19:00:41 it was only late last year you yourself started offering very good solid advice on performance and ensuring code was run minimally Jul 10 19:01:02 prior to that, i think everyone was just directed back to the docs Jul 10 19:03:54 coldboot: Where do you set the HIM_DEBUG flag? Jul 10 19:04:06 I just threw it in the src/gui/Makefile manually. Jul 10 19:04:11 coldboot, fiferboy could you : msg->input_window = proxy->winId(); proxy->setTarget(widget); Jul 10 19:04:52 Where does proxy come from? Jul 10 19:05:11 it's a minimal widget Jul 10 19:05:33 How do I get it in the sendHildonCommand function? Jul 10 19:05:47 it's a qApp singleton Jul 10 19:05:51 , reboot Jul 10 19:05:55 brb, that is Jul 10 19:06:15 msg->input_window = aApp->proxy->winId(); aApp->proxy->setTarget(widget); ? Jul 10 19:06:17 it *could* be qApp->mainwindow() or similar Jul 10 19:06:24 coldboot: yes Jul 10 19:07:29 make sense? Jul 10 19:07:33 Yeah. Jul 10 19:07:44 Do you not want to set the target before setting the input_window? Jul 10 19:07:46 my work here is done. Jul 10 19:07:53 meah Jul 10 19:08:04 implementation detail ;) Jul 10 19:08:28 Global variables save the day. Jul 10 19:08:41 wash your mouth. Jul 10 19:08:50 haha Jul 10 19:08:53 OO has singletons, not global variables Jul 10 19:09:08 It doesn't seem to have ::proxy... Jul 10 19:09:28 ? Jul 10 19:09:44 QApplication has no member named 'proxy'. Jul 10 19:09:53 lcuk: It is a problem in diablo. Point taken, I just imagined - given the fuss made by Nokia - that a) it'd work; b) it'd be well documented and c) everyone would be doing it. Jul 10 19:10:05 I've not ruled out me being really stupid and all three of those being true :) Jul 10 19:10:11 people took their hints from you good sir :) Jul 10 19:10:23 coldboot: I know.... more implementation .... Jul 10 19:10:30 lbt: ... Jul 10 19:10:48 well Jul 10 19:11:00 X ev propagation via qapp fails Jul 10 19:11:15 so we can't send keystrokes to the mainwin Jul 10 19:11:20 lbt: Are you saying to make a proxy variable, and a setTarget method? Jul 10 19:11:29 if we make every widget win native it flickers and is crap Jul 10 19:11:35 yep Jul 10 19:11:36 so we make a single widget native Jul 10 19:11:43 and tiny and invisible Jul 10 19:11:49 maybe even hidden() Jul 10 19:12:07 and we give it a method to hold a proxy widget ID Jul 10 19:12:27 Is there not a simpler way to do this? Jul 10 19:12:33 and we send its X-native-Id to HIM Jul 10 19:12:34 By just not using X events? Jul 10 19:12:48 the keyboard is not Qt Jul 10 19:12:52 You have to use xevents somewhere along the line Jul 10 19:12:58 HIM send them as xevents Jul 10 19:13:03 it could send dbus events Jul 10 19:13:06 that'd be sane Jul 10 19:13:11 but it doesn't Jul 10 19:13:32 So where would you construct this blank, invisible widget? Jul 10 19:13:36 heh Jul 10 19:13:46 inside an #ifdef Jul 10 19:13:48 in qapp Jul 10 19:13:49 .cpp Jul 10 19:14:00 qapplication_x11.cpp? Jul 10 19:14:04 no Jul 10 19:14:47 actually we may be able to add the proxy method to QMainWindow Jul 10 19:15:00 then if mainwindow gets an X key event Jul 10 19:15:04 and proxy is set Jul 10 19:15:17 it sends the event as a Qt event to the right widget Jul 10 19:15:28 no invisible widgets Jul 10 19:15:52 need to review X11 event handling in the main loop Jul 10 19:15:54 Modifying QMainWindow directly in src/gui/widgets/qmainwindow.{h,cpp}? Jul 10 19:15:58 yes Jul 10 19:17:55 we need an X11 window - no choice. There is only 1 X11 window in a Qt app using raster. Either use it or make another Jul 10 19:18:45 Where is this window? Jul 10 19:18:55 QMainWindow Jul 10 19:19:10 I should say guaranteed Jul 10 19:19:19 since any popup has a top-level window too Jul 10 19:19:31 hmm Jul 10 19:19:49 actually put it in qwidget Jul 10 19:21:03 and msg->input_window = Search_upwards_for_a_top_level_widget->winId Jul 10 19:21:32 widget->search_upwards->winId() Jul 10 19:21:59 search_upwards would be a local algorithm Jul 10 19:22:22 So we want all widgets to be a parent of this top level widget? Jul 10 19:22:26 I mean children. Jul 10 19:22:43 that is how Qt works already Jul 10 19:22:49 I mis-spoke earlier Jul 10 19:23:00 And QMainWindow is that widget. Jul 10 19:23:02 every widget must at some level sit inside an x11 window, whether it is directly itself, or one of its parents Jul 10 19:23:02 There is only 1 X11 window in a Qt app using raster. Jul 10 19:23:06 isn't true Jul 10 19:23:29 each popup (file dialog etc) has one too Jul 10 19:23:32 So what is widget->window() ? Jul 10 19:24:20 http://doc.trolltech.com/4.5/qwidget.html#nativeParentWidget Jul 10 19:24:40 http://doc.trolltech.com/4.5/qwidget.html#effectiveWinId Jul 10 19:25:12 so actually no need for algorithm :) Jul 10 19:26:28 we send effectiveWinId() to HIM and we use nativeParentWidget() of the textInput to get the widget to 'setHIMProxy(textinput)' Jul 10 19:26:28 its nice to do that though david, to find the existing api works the same way you deduce it to Jul 10 19:27:10 yeah, I had no idea those functions existed... but I know how Qt heirarchy works Jul 10 19:27:32 more familiar everyday Jul 10 19:27:47 setHIMProxy() then has to get involved in the QWidget event handling loop Jul 10 19:28:11 and if set, it steals X Key events and sends them to the right widget Jul 10 19:32:40 setMyProxy() Jul 10 19:32:46 that sounds dandy Jul 10 19:33:05 "Hey lcuk, would you feel like setting my proxy tonight?" Jul 10 19:34:08 as i told you last week, you can set your own proxy Jul 10 19:35:30 ow man Jul 10 19:35:38 I've been fiddling with my proxy for weeks now Jul 10 19:35:41 I need some help Jul 10 19:35:47 setHIMProxy() is going to be a member function of what? Jul 10 19:36:07 crashanddie_: look in a telephone box... Jul 10 19:36:22 a telephone box? Jul 10 19:36:33 British name for a phone booth. Jul 10 19:36:58 coldboot, I live in London, I know that Jul 10 19:37:42 I guess you're wondering why a proxy would be in there, then. Jul 10 19:37:45 qwerty12_N810, unless you're referring to those overtaxed numbers you've been abusing? Jul 10 19:38:01 coldboot, but it's not any proxy, it's MINE Jul 10 19:38:05 :D Jul 10 19:38:11 * crashanddie_ loves playing dumb Jul 10 19:38:30 coldboot: setHIMProxy() is going to be a member function of qwidget Jul 10 19:38:32 crashanddie_: indeed, I thought they could help you with your proxy like how they helped me with mine Jul 10 19:38:39 crashanddie_: does it come easy? Jul 10 19:38:49 lbt, oh yeah Jul 10 19:38:54 I can tell Jul 10 19:39:32 sorry, I'll stop interrupting Jul 10 19:44:50 crashanddie_: np, I've done my "scribble on a whiteboard and leave it to the experts" piece now :D Jul 10 19:45:15 jeremiah_: hey.... you up for helping us on 18th July (sat) Jul 10 19:45:25 lbt, remind me where you work? Jul 10 19:45:44 I don't :) used to be a solution architect at BT Jul 10 19:45:51 wtf? Jul 10 19:46:07 lbt, you didn't go for an interview, today, did you? Jul 10 19:46:20 lbt, around waterloo? Jul 10 19:46:21 C&W ? Jul 10 19:46:26 It seems like QWidget doesn't really initialize much in construction, except it calls d_func()->init(). Jul 10 19:46:27 hello? I have an n800 and it seems to automatically turn on... any ideas? Jul 10 19:46:29 no... know of a job? Jul 10 19:47:09 lbt, no, but I just told off an interviewee for interrupting a whiteboard session saying "Mind leaving the whiteboard to the experts?" Jul 10 19:47:30 heh :) Jul 10 19:47:37 crashanddie_: Who'd he say that to? Jul 10 19:47:54 coldboot, I said that Jul 10 19:48:06 oh ok Jul 10 19:49:32 does anyone have a suggestion to keep my n800 from automatically turning on? Jul 10 19:49:58 define "automatically turning on" Jul 10 19:50:03 putting in charger is normal behaviour Jul 10 19:50:20 at night, it starts itself Jul 10 19:50:29 just started happening Jul 10 19:52:20 this happens without being connected to the charger Jul 10 19:52:39 maybe it's just waking up for alarm? Jul 10 19:53:12 OK we're going to try and get a native cross-compile system working on OBS on 15th or 19th july ... who would like to help. We need package people and cross compile experience Jul 10 19:53:15 I have checked the alarms, and even created and deleted one, but still does it. Jul 10 19:54:14 retutime -a displays nothing Jul 10 19:56:27 lbt: write better programs, which compile faster, than you didn't need to crosscompile Jul 10 19:56:41 pfft Jul 10 19:56:55 Typical Gentoo user statement :P Jul 10 19:57:15 write it in C# Jul 10 19:58:07 hi, Jul 10 19:58:16 how is it possible to get the GPS working? Jul 10 19:58:37 I tried it outdoors, but it just keeps searching for satelites and finds nothing Jul 10 19:58:50 parrot86: sometimes it take quite a while Jul 10 19:58:57 Especially if you -funrollloops Jul 10 19:58:59 even up to an hour or more Jul 10 19:59:03 heh Jul 10 19:59:14 parrot86: get AGPIS Jul 10 19:59:15 AGPS Jul 10 19:59:24 also don't cover the antenna, not even for a second Jul 10 19:59:39 http://funroll-loops.info/ Jul 10 19:59:40 there was something that the GPS had to update and for the life of me i can't remember what it is Jul 10 19:59:52 Macer: how long is quite a while? I'm sure I've waited more than 5 minutes Jul 10 19:59:55 we had to set our govt GPSes out all the time.. some old relic called a PLGR Jul 10 20:00:02 Stskeeps: thanks, I'll try that Jul 10 20:00:07 parrot86: 1/2 hour Jul 10 20:00:10 Macer: almanac? Jul 10 20:00:12 Today my phone wouldn't get a GPS lock... waited half an hour.. restarted gps and it got first fix in a moving car in about 10 seconds.. heh :/ Jul 10 20:00:12 parrot86: like i said. to update about half an hour to an hour Jul 10 20:00:14 Stskeeps: yeah Jul 10 20:00:17 there it is ;) the aqlmanac Jul 10 20:00:19 haha Jul 10 20:00:31 almanac updating seems to take a while Jul 10 20:00:40 well AGPS downloads the almanac from internet Jul 10 20:00:49 ShadowJK: oh Jul 10 20:01:02 maybe we should issue AGPS and n810s to military personel Jul 10 20:01:03 haha Jul 10 20:01:17 instead of from the slow transfer from the satellite Jul 10 20:01:31 it's like 30 bits per second or something silly :P Jul 10 20:01:34 ouch Jul 10 20:01:39 imagine what happens if you cover the antenna and it misses some of them ;) Jul 10 20:01:46 lol Jul 10 20:01:50 i'm guessing it's broadcasted Jul 10 20:01:51 and loops? Jul 10 20:01:58 yes Jul 10 20:02:02 so it's "error.. wait for next time" Jul 10 20:02:05 "start over" Jul 10 20:02:06 haha Jul 10 20:02:26 man i am going on a hunger binge Jul 10 20:02:31 because of this smoking quitting Jul 10 20:02:42 thank god i'm not fat nor ever have been Jul 10 20:02:43 haha Jul 10 20:02:51 I'm like pavlov's dog when it comes to smoking Jul 10 20:02:59 ? Jul 10 20:03:28 ShadowJK: so you can't smoke a cigarette because you're dribbeling all over it? Jul 10 20:03:33 oh only times I ever tried to smoke was when I was severely drunk. The epic killer hangovers made my brain associate smoking == puke Jul 10 20:04:02 lol Jul 10 20:04:04 lucky you Jul 10 20:04:21 i'm sitting here trying to stop from sitting in a corner rocking back and forth crying Jul 10 20:05:04 ever see new jack city when pooky is trying to quit crack? Jul 10 20:05:11 nop Jul 10 20:05:52 the gps on n810 is damn strange Jul 10 20:05:55 lbt: So to get this right, in sendHildonCommand, I'd set widget->nativeParentWidget()->setHIMProxy(widget);, then msg->input_window = widget->effectiveWinId(); Jul 10 20:06:01 anecdotally I've had better luck with maemo-mapper Jul 10 20:06:08 than, for example, the speedometer Jul 10 20:06:28 although iirc when I wrote a logger in python that worked fine too.. hm :/ Jul 10 20:06:45 lbt: Have QWidget::setHIMProxy(QWidget*) store the QWidget*, and use it for later when intercepting key commands, passing them on to QWidget*? Jul 10 20:07:01 coldboot: bbiab Jul 10 20:07:06 lbt: k Jul 10 20:10:27 lbt, coldboot: What's the plan going forward? Jul 10 20:11:22 I think lbt's solution is pretty good. Jul 10 20:11:33 I'm trying to implement it now. Jul 10 20:11:49 Although I'm not sure where the key event interception would happen, exactly. Jul 10 20:12:19 Also, it seems that QWidget's constructors are all empty, so I'm not sure where a sensible place to initialize him_proxy would be. Jul 10 20:17:25 coldboot: yes, sounds right :) Jul 10 20:18:02 don't forget to zero setHIMProxy() when the keyboard closes... don't want a segfault Jul 10 20:18:14 yep Jul 10 20:18:21 lbt: So where should I intercept these key events? Jul 10 20:18:47 * lbt pulls up the code Jul 10 20:20:49 I guess when you sendHildonCommand with msg->input_window = effectiveWinId(), sendKeyEvent(QWidget* = widget->nativeParentWidget(), ...) will get called, so you do the checking for the proxy there, and forward accordingly. Jul 10 20:21:40 Or maybe not, since sendKeyEvent just sends another XEvent... Jul 10 20:22:00 we need to find where qt handles X key events Jul 10 20:22:14 eg qApp->x11ProcessEvent Jul 10 20:25:24 I think x11FilterEvent receives the event and sendKeyEvent processes it Jul 10 20:32:47 So somewhere in x11ProcessEvent we have to forward the event to the proxy widget? Jul 10 20:34:47 Here? http://qt.gitorious.org/~nhooey/qt/nhooey-qt-maemo-bugfixes/blobs/1bdac2e41b137fd106493630dc1a553b66d21338/src/gui/kernel/qapplication_x11.cpp#line3312 Jul 10 20:38:37 Now I just need a place to reset the HIMProxy. Jul 10 20:57:28 what irc server do you guys reccomend? Jul 10 20:57:38 wait Jul 10 20:57:58 didn't Stskeeps dev for a irc server project before? Jul 10 20:59:37 load averages: 5.42, 5.46, 5.07 Jul 10 20:59:47 irc server? Jul 10 20:59:49 er... ircd? :) Jul 10 20:59:50 heh Jul 10 21:00:34 * xnt14 googles Jul 10 21:00:44 for different server comparison Jul 10 21:03:50 http://www.dell.com/content/topics/topic.aspx/global/products/adamo/topics/en/us/adamo?c=us&l=en&s=dhs&cs=19&ST=dell%20adamo%20notebook&dgc=ST&cid=41842&lid=1071914&acd=53067,8,0,75308835,705838122,1247259746,,14917556,2874775 Jul 10 21:03:55 wow what a piece of crap Jul 10 21:04:04 what ever happened to good laptops? :) Jul 10 21:04:14 or maybe a laptop that can actually play a real game or two? Jul 10 21:04:33 Macer: get a console Jul 10 21:04:53 hmm Jul 10 21:05:58 unrealircd seems good Jul 10 21:06:33 a console? :) Jul 10 21:06:33 heh Jul 10 21:06:43 xnt14: sounds like the renegade of ircd Jul 10 21:06:45 :) Jul 10 21:06:54 well I'm not sure Jul 10 21:06:55 xD Jul 10 21:07:11 im just testing....:P Jul 10 21:07:28 Macer: xbox, psp, nds Jul 10 21:07:42 don't forget ps3 ;) Jul 10 21:08:01 oh Jul 10 21:08:08 i have a wii Jul 10 21:08:09 good enough Jul 10 21:08:13 i don't really play games tah tmuch :) Jul 10 21:08:18 :P Jul 10 21:08:21 at the very most i'd play nba live Jul 10 21:08:27 I use my xps to play nexuiz and fg Jul 10 21:11:41 wow.... Colour Inkjet Photo Printer 1.8" LCD Screen 9-in-1 Card Reader. Dye sublimation. ...... for £23 Jul 10 21:11:51 that's just wrong Jul 10 21:12:07 http://www.redstore.com/SAGPRI012 Jul 10 21:13:08 oh, right, the printer downstairs is a SD card reader Jul 10 21:13:12 * Stskeeps has to remember that Jul 10 21:14:55 lbt: Wait until you see the financing deals they have for ink, though. Jul 10 21:15:04 lbt: 3.9% interest for a limited time only. Jul 10 21:15:19 heh I can imagine Jul 10 21:16:11 I'm not sure how worried to be about removing the proxy... Jul 10 21:16:20 I think the Qt build actually goes slower when you do multiple jobs. Jul 10 21:16:30 how many cores? Jul 10 21:16:53 I have two, I set it to three jobs. Jul 10 21:17:01 ah... 2 jobs Jul 10 21:17:35 When I had 4 cores at my other job, setting it to -j5 was optimal, but using your computer was hard while building. Jul 10 21:17:39 unless you have very slow disk you're mainly cpu bound Jul 10 21:17:54 Yeah I'm definitely cpu bound in this case, the disk is barely working. Jul 10 21:25:32 musicbot: Mizuki Nana | Ultimate Diamond: 悦楽カメリア Jul 10 21:25:44 I herald you, my supreme master! Lead us into the light of your wisdom and power Jul 10 21:25:59 infobot: botsnack Jul 10 21:26:00 RichiH: thanks Jul 10 21:28:13 * Luke-Jr only has 1-core systems Jul 10 21:28:14 coldboot: did you see http://wiki.maemo.org/Qt4_Hildon#Maemo_Qt_API_Reference Jul 10 21:28:31 Looking now. Jul 10 21:28:37 why is Hildon obsessed with not working with standard apps? Jul 10 21:28:48 Luke-Jr: multi core is fine, have it since 10 years :) Jul 10 21:29:00 johnsq: uh, multi-core hasn't existed for 10 years Jul 10 21:29:04 Luke-Jr, cos most standard desktop apps would overwhelm the tablet Jul 10 21:29:19 Luke-Jr: dual cpu, is the same Jul 10 21:29:20 lcuk: pfft, nonsense Jul 10 21:29:26 johnsq: not exactly Jul 10 21:29:36 Antonio wrote that documentation, didn't he? Jul 10 21:30:03 I can tell it's him from the way he types grammar, it's interesting. Jul 10 21:30:23 he's italian Jul 10 21:30:24 Luke-Jr: make no big difference, 10 years ago, cache was extern Jul 10 21:38:58 lbt: To some degree I think you can guess what someone's first language is based on how their mistakes in English are. Jul 10 21:39:34 hmm, northener? Jul 10 21:39:49 haha Jul 10 21:41:05 Halloh, ah 'ad two pints, then me mate gave me anova, now ahv got free. Jul 10 21:41:25 manchester Jul 10 21:41:32 Bang on. Jul 10 21:41:45 coldboot: not even mistakes, just accent Jul 10 21:41:52 I'm Canadian, and grew up there. But my mom and the rest of her family are from Manchester. Jul 10 21:42:19 Luke-Jr: Yeah, in this case, but still when someone types you can map grammar mistakes to primary language. Jul 10 21:42:27 I started out manchester way... down south now Jul 10 21:44:27 coldboot: my point is they don't need to make mistakes Jul 10 21:44:39 people type with different accents depending on original language too Jul 10 21:45:18 Luke-Jr: Accents usually don't get typed in to a computer unless it's intentional, though. Jul 10 21:45:25 http://esr.ibiblio.org/?p=1058 Jul 10 21:47:35 Luke-Jr: they're grammatical... we're in agreement :) Jul 10 21:47:57 well, you two are... I never agree with Luke-Jr on principal Jul 10 21:50:07 lbt: Esteemed sir, please do not imply that this sentence is not gramattically correct. Jul 10 21:50:35 you spelt gramattically wrong Jul 10 21:50:49 spelling isn't grammar, idiot Jul 10 21:51:04 and you spelled it the same way Jul 10 21:51:14 well, you spelt gramattically write, you spelt grammatically wrong Jul 10 21:53:48 hello all. I think permissions just went fubar on my internal memory card on my n810. Jul 10 21:54:05 I can't connect via USB, and it fails when I try to send anything over bluetooth. Jul 10 21:56:48 look with the filenmanager. otherwise gainroot and check what is wrong. Jul 10 21:57:17 tds5016: what does that have to do with permissions? Jul 10 21:57:39 it gave me an access denied error. Jul 10 21:57:53 I just chmodded it to 777 and now bluetooth works. Jul 10 21:57:59 but usb won't mount the drive :-/. Jul 10 21:58:00 That was a really funny conversation about grammar. Jul 10 21:58:13 Luke-Jr: Are you a maemo developer as well? Jul 10 21:59:03 no Jul 10 22:05:25 lol Jul 10 22:06:14 musicbot: Mizuki Nana | Ultimate Diamond: 蒼き光の果て -ULTIMATE MODE- Jul 10 22:06:26 Ultimate Diamond FTW! XD Jul 10 22:07:01 * xnt14 wonders if he can use ssl on apache on his n810...... Jul 10 22:11:12 xnt14: … Jul 10 22:12:49 Someone's listening to anime music... Jul 10 22:13:30 xD Jul 10 22:13:46 anyone with fremantle sdk on their hands and osso-xterm? Jul 10 22:13:57 Stskeeps, ... Jul 10 22:14:08 Stskeeps, I have the SDK on a CD in my hand... Jul 10 22:14:24 and no cd-rom drive? ;) Jul 10 22:14:25 wtf is it with everyone saying stuff like fdsfdsf,..... or just ...... Jul 10 22:14:32 ah well Jul 10 22:14:42 i might as well join in xD Jul 10 22:14:43 xnt14: same spectrum as b-man saying "shure" Jul 10 22:14:44 -.- Jul 10 22:14:50 xnt14, you say only "xD" as well Jul 10 22:15:01 ok then Jul 10 22:15:11 It's a picture of an anime character smiling while closing their eyes. Jul 10 22:15:56 isn't (^_^) or ^_^ the anime character smiling with closed eyes? :P Jul 10 22:16:07 xnt14, "..." usually means frustration or is a textual representation of the look when you cock your head at a 20 degree angle right/back, look at your mate and go "seriously... DUDE" Jul 10 22:16:40 xnt14: I guess they're both similar. Jul 10 22:16:57 ok then :P Jul 10 22:17:24 "xD" could be "too much rice" Jul 10 22:17:49 I thought ... was "and?" Jul 10 22:18:12 no thats like Jul 10 22:18:17 Jul 10 22:18:28 im bored.....again xD Jul 10 22:18:30 lbt, 'seriously... DUDE was "and?"' ? Jul 10 22:18:38 * +> Jul 10 22:18:54 just ... Jul 10 22:19:07 my brain needs larger stack frames Jul 10 22:19:10 ... in the middle is a pause Jul 10 22:19:16 xnt14: ^_^ I guess could be some silly giant cat or hamster smiling after smacking its friend who's eyes are way too big. Jul 10 22:19:33 lol Jul 10 22:19:40 Here's Superpoop's interesting take on anime: http://www.superpoop.com/102708/anime-map.jpg Jul 10 22:19:59 so... waiting for that to sink in you ^_^ (giant hamster) Jul 10 22:20:55 musicbot: Mizuki Nana | Ultimate Diamond: Trickster Jul 10 22:20:59 argh Jul 10 22:21:12 * xnt14 kills musicbot Jul 10 22:21:30 Jul 10 22:21:36 xD -> could also be some pixelated robot laughing at a school girl who has fallen over and has a giant tear drop on the side of her head, while exposing her panties underneath as her knees meet, immediately before she starts crying obnoxiously. Jul 10 22:21:41 not found Jul 10 22:21:44 Jul 10 22:21:45 :P Jul 10 22:21:47 Just a couple of patterns you might notice in anime. ;) Jul 10 22:22:16 coldboot: we discussed grammar and location.... your sentence leads to a different kind of analysis.... Jul 10 22:22:58 coldboot, girl: -_-' Jul 10 22:23:31 lbt: hahaha Jul 10 22:23:40 coldboot, http://www.ted.com/index.php/talks/rives_tells_a_story_of_mixed_emoticons.html Jul 10 22:28:06 Funny Jul 10 22:29:20 is osso-addressbook closed? Jul 10 22:29:43 AFAIK Jul 10 22:29:48 but not sure Jul 10 22:30:00 what does osso stand for? Jul 10 22:30:27 a really ironic name Jul 10 22:30:36 Jul 10 22:30:57 well modest gets as far as compiling ... error: tny-stream-cache.h: No such file or directory Jul 10 22:30:59 (open source software operations) Jul 10 22:31:09 tinymail update maybe Jul 10 22:31:18 (I know ;) ) Jul 10 22:31:46 I thought I'd gotten the latest tinymail Jul 10 22:33:01 hmm, shouldn't we have the telepathy stuff in Mer too? Jul 10 22:33:26 correct Jul 10 22:33:33 i think it might already be in ubuntu though Jul 10 22:33:56 has maemo versions.... eg 0.0.6-0maemo3+0m5.dsc Jul 10 22:34:15 http://repository.maemo.org/pool/fremantle/free/t/ Jul 10 22:35:01 mmm Jul 10 22:35:13 bbl Jul 10 22:35:25 bed now Jul 10 22:35:27 night all Jul 10 22:37:32 .site add newpost "blog moving back to wordpress" Jul 10 22:37:40 crap wrong channel XD Jul 10 22:49:55 I'm out, see you all on Monday. Jul 10 22:50:02 The flicker solution is still compiling, I'm outta here. Jul 10 22:51:32 coldboot, cool Jul 10 22:51:47 Are your changes on gitorious? Jul 10 22:51:53 In your clone? Jul 10 23:13:31 * xnt14 goes home Jul 11 00:14:36 can I do the equivalent of "int3" in armel? Jul 11 01:38:12 0 Jul 11 02:20:43 * xnt14 beats the shit out of his pos windows laptop ( which isn't linux compat ) Jul 11 02:21:10 this piece of crap bsod'ed on me while installing drivers Jul 11 02:21:25 and now it bsods on me every time i boot Jul 11 02:22:24 brb **** ENDING LOGGING AT Sat Jul 11 02:59:57 2009