**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Mon Jul 13 02:59:57 2009 Jul 13 03:08:59 ~nuke boredom Jul 13 03:09:10 * infobot prepares 100 missle silos, and targets them at boredom ... B☢☢M! Jul 13 03:10:00 b-man16, I have many maemo-related problems you could try to solve to alleviate boredom. Jul 13 03:10:45 ok :) - but i dont have access to my tablet atm :( Jul 13 03:11:10 it's being repaired Jul 13 03:11:57 I have AGPS installed at it works pretty well, but don't have a cellphone data connection. If I know I'm going somewhere, can I download the assist data beforehand and then use it when I get there? Jul 13 03:13:12 i think so Jul 13 03:13:41 hi! Jul 13 03:13:48 hi!!! :D Jul 13 03:17:54 jason__, the assist data is valid for a certain general location for about 30 minutes or so :P Jul 13 03:18:04 if I've understood it correctly Jul 13 03:19:17 I don't suppose I can get the orbit data for the GPS satellites and compute my own assist data for a (location,time) Jul 13 03:22:23 well... Jul 13 03:22:51 Some parts of the data do remain valid for longer periods of time Jul 13 03:23:07 but we don't know how long the GPS chip/drivers cache it Jul 13 03:23:19 and if it doesn't, then it'll download the data from the satellites themselves Jul 13 04:26:12 ...illegally brewed or "country-made liquor", as it is called in India, is made with jaggery [unrefined palm sugar], alum and aluminium chloride. Jul 13 04:29:50 delicious Jul 13 04:32:10 someone needs to make a google video chat app for an n800/n810 Jul 13 04:32:12 heh Jul 13 04:33:16 Can the camera be used from /dev/video0 as a normal V4L device? Jul 13 04:33:24 no Jul 13 04:42:15 RST38h, yes Jul 13 04:42:23 it's a normalish v4l2 device IIRC Jul 13 04:42:48 Macer, is there even one for desktop linux? Jul 13 04:43:43 johnxx: i doubt it haha Jul 13 04:43:57 but it would be awesome :) Jul 13 04:44:26 it works amazingly well in xp and osx Jul 13 04:44:45 last time I looked, they didn't have one for mac even, but I'm not sure if that's still the case Jul 13 04:56:09 guys are there docs on how to write a control panel applet? Jul 13 04:57:13 Macer: wtf? Jul 13 04:57:20 xnt14, here maybe? http://maemo-sdk.garage.maemo.org/maemo-control.html Jul 13 04:57:23 Diablo's thing did video Jul 13 04:57:27 thanks :) Jul 13 04:57:34 eep Jul 13 04:57:38 sorry, I read too quickly Jul 13 04:57:45 that's not it at all ... Jul 13 04:57:53 I swear I saw it somewhere Jul 13 04:58:01 its ok :P Jul 13 04:58:51 Luke-Jr: wtf? Jul 13 04:58:55 wtf? Jul 13 04:59:00 is it possible to write hildon home panel applets in python? Jul 13 04:59:28 xnt14, I was under the impression that homeip did this Jul 13 04:59:42 ill get the source ;) Jul 13 04:59:53 or the "binary" :) Jul 13 05:00:00 xD Jul 13 05:00:03 yup Jul 13 05:01:20 I assume you've seen this page? http://maemo.org/development/documentation/ Jul 13 05:02:56 not that exact page, but the subsections. yes ;) Jul 13 05:03:18 :) http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=18705 Jul 13 05:03:20 the pdf here has references to control panel applets, desktop applets: http://maemo.org/maemo_release_documentation/maemo4.1.x/ Jul 13 05:05:39 hmm Jul 13 05:08:03 http://maemo.org/maemo_release_documentation/maemo4.1.x/node7.html#SECTION00770000000000000000 :) Jul 13 05:08:08 but thats c :/ Jul 13 05:08:20 C pwns u Jul 13 05:08:28 well I know a little c, but I prefer python.... Jul 13 05:08:32 fail Jul 13 05:08:34 hmm, trying to remember which plugin does it in python though.. Jul 13 05:08:37 luke-jr, stfu Jul 13 05:08:42 xnt14++ Jul 13 05:08:46 im not int the mood Jul 13 05:08:49 xD Jul 13 05:08:52 xnt14: FAIL Jul 13 05:09:40 /opt/xs/bin/setvar luke-jr = "FAIL" Jul 13 05:09:50 omg, extra fail 4 u Jul 13 05:09:58 setvar? O_o; Jul 13 05:10:45 my set of tools im working on ;) Jul 13 05:10:47 unity Jul 13 05:10:54 FAIL Jul 13 05:11:02 http://xceleo.org/unity/ Jul 13 05:11:26 luke-jr, Please Kindly STFU, Thank you. xD Jul 13 05:11:34 NO U Jul 13 05:11:45 xnt14, woo! that is noble effort indeed Jul 13 05:11:49 rm -rf luke-jr Jul 13 05:11:57 :) Jul 13 05:12:28 xnt14: 404 Jul 13 05:12:33 its not stable yet, so no release xD Jul 13 05:13:17 and this code is old xD, I need to update it :P http://github.com/xnt14/Unity/tree/master Jul 13 05:13:21 VAPOURWARE! Jul 13 05:13:32 xnt14: lrn2scm! Jul 13 05:14:09 just stfu k? Jul 13 05:14:13 NO U!! Jul 13 05:14:32 hmm http://www.mail-archive.com/maemo-developers@maemo.org/msg14686.html Jul 13 05:17:27 ok guys i have to go to sleep, see you all tomorrow Jul 13 05:17:52 'night xnt14 Jul 13 05:17:58 good luck with the project Jul 13 07:36:04 morning qwerty12 Jul 13 07:36:14 g'morning Stskeeps Jul 13 07:39:47 mornin' qwerty12 Jul 13 07:39:51 how's your summer going? Jul 13 07:40:10 hey johnx, where you been? I'm good thanks, how is yours? Jul 13 07:40:29 pretty good Jul 13 07:40:38 lots of work, lots of real life Jul 13 07:40:42 not much hacking as of late Jul 13 07:40:48 compiling a new kernel on my wii though Jul 13 07:41:34 Lol, my Wii stays unused. I should try Linux on it though at least :) Jul 13 07:42:23 well, I'll tell you where I get to :) Jul 13 07:42:33 the latest developments on it are quite interesting Jul 13 07:43:24 The last thing I installed on it was that dodgy version of The Homebrew Channel that didn't support SDHC cards :) Jul 13 07:44:28 if you're not up to the latest nintendo firmware update than I think it's really easy to install the newer hbc with sdhc support and bootmii Jul 13 07:46:50 My Wii is too new to install BootMii as boot2 so I had to install the IOS (which makes it good as a flash dumper, and not for much else to be honest) but I couldn't use the power/reset keys to control BootMii Jul 13 07:47:13 :( Jul 13 07:47:31 so the newest wiis can't run linux at all? Jul 13 07:48:32 Oh, they can (I used BannerBomb to downgrade to 3.2), just not BootMii. (Technically, they can run BootMii but not really as a recovery solution) Jul 13 07:48:56 ah, got it Jul 13 07:49:16 Which kinda makes it pointless, but good to have if anyone ever makes programs that uses the full control of the hardware that BootMii can give :) Jul 13 07:49:32 I think that's mini... Jul 13 07:49:40 that's what the newer wii-linux kernels are using Jul 13 07:49:51 they still support IOS though it seems Jul 13 07:50:08 Ah, good, otherwise I'd be left out in the cold :) Jul 13 07:52:30 moo all wii hackers Jul 13 07:52:38 m00f RST38h Jul 13 07:52:49 lol, m0() RST38h Jul 13 07:53:05 did they make you president of all intel after your incredible managing? Jul 13 07:53:06 moo RST38h Jul 13 07:56:22 johnx: No, but at least they did not fire me. Jul 13 07:57:17 so it went that well? :) Jul 13 07:57:31 reminds me of the first UPS-test at my current work... Jul 13 07:59:39 Morning, all Jul 13 07:59:51 morn jaffa Jul 13 08:00:12 g'morning Jaffa Jul 13 08:00:17 jeremiah_: ping? Jul 13 08:01:04 johnx: Worked out ok, although it was busy like hell Jul 13 08:01:57 heh, so not exactly like my case. :P lesson learned: if a UPS says it can run 9 minutes on battery given the current load it is not safe to assume it can run for at least 4 minutes Jul 13 08:04:06 If UPS says *anything*, it means "save and shutdown" Jul 13 08:04:14 hm Jul 13 08:04:21 can someone explain the concept of a vpn to me? Jul 13 08:04:21 And it does not really matter what your UPS says Jul 13 08:04:42 Macer: it is a tunnel, a secure point to point connection Jul 13 08:04:48 RST38h, yeah, well getting the core servers down in an orderly fashion proved to take longer than 4 minutes Jul 13 08:04:55 does it run off one port? Jul 13 08:05:02 well.. i mean does it use an inbound tcp port Jul 13 08:05:07 Macer: That serves to route all your traffic to the other end of the connection Jul 13 08:05:15 Yes, it uses an inbound port Jul 13 08:05:15 and this is encrypted? Jul 13 08:05:20 can be Jul 13 08:05:22 it is encrypted Jul 13 08:05:23 most VPNs are Jul 13 08:05:26 hm Jul 13 08:05:31 i think i need to make one :) Jul 13 08:05:33 Otherwise there is no reason to have vpn Jul 13 08:05:36 it's kind of silly to *not* encrypt it Jul 13 08:05:37 heh.. i've never done it before Jul 13 08:05:43 johnx: i figured Jul 13 08:05:50 how is the vpn treated on the client side? Jul 13 08:05:54 as a part of the local network? Jul 13 08:06:08 it looks like a network driver Jul 13 08:06:13 a network device really Jul 13 08:06:15 meaning i'd be able to use smb while being connected to the vpn over the internets Jul 13 08:06:16 johnx: ipv6 tunnelling? Jul 13 08:06:16 :P Jul 13 08:06:17 yeah, it has a route set for it Jul 13 08:06:26 Macer: yea Jul 13 08:06:27 hm Jul 13 08:06:30 ok.. that makes sense Jul 13 08:06:35 :) let me see if i can set this crap up Jul 13 08:06:43 the ipv6 reachable internet is your own private network? Jul 13 08:06:45 although i'm sure it would be easier if i were at the house Jul 13 08:06:57 * RST38h can't get a real IP address because the provider insists on the VPN Jul 13 08:07:07 johnx: if you're megaloninac(sp) enough Jul 13 08:07:14 well.. let me see about setting it up on the xp netbook first Jul 13 08:07:29 then i wil have to open the port when i get home and set it up on the other end Jul 13 08:08:04 what about using a dns? Jul 13 08:08:14 can you set the vpn to use the local dns that you would use on site? Jul 13 08:08:42 yeah, of course Jul 13 08:08:45 meaning would the vpn look at the local ip dns over the vpn and allow you to connect "locally" in order to access servers on the other end as though they were on a local subnet? Jul 13 08:09:02 you just perfectly described the purpose of a good VPN Jul 13 08:09:03 ok. thanks for the help :) Jul 13 08:09:11 johnx: haha sorry Jul 13 08:09:15 i honestly never used one before Jul 13 08:09:30 i have no idea of the concept at all Jul 13 08:09:37 Macer, it's as if you plugged in to a network cable at the target network. Jul 13 08:09:38 well, you seem to get it Jul 13 08:09:58 jason__: yeah.. that's what i was wondering actually Jul 13 08:09:59 :) Jul 13 08:10:21 that's what i need actually Jul 13 08:10:22 but it has all the weirdness of having 2 network cables plugged in to 2 different networks Jul 13 08:10:32 johnx: yeah that's what i was wondering also Jul 13 08:10:52 i would be on a vpn/local subnet while using my phone tethered to tmobs internets Jul 13 08:11:00 that is where i get a little confused as to how things work on the client Jul 13 08:11:30 johnx, true, although generally the vpn client sets the routes so that everything that leaves the computer that would go over the interface that made the vpn connection goes through the vpn connection. Jul 13 08:11:48 fair enough Jul 13 08:12:04 yeah. because i don't think xforwarding over ssh is meant to go high speed Jul 13 08:12:09 because ff hardly runs Jul 13 08:12:17 figured i could just set up a vpn to use vnc "locally" Jul 13 08:12:20 ff is pretty bad at remote display Jul 13 08:12:26 and still keep it encrypted Jul 13 08:12:35 nx might be better really Jul 13 08:12:43 cuts down on round trips or somesuch Jul 13 08:12:44 i was thinking of setting up ssh tunnels Jul 13 08:13:02 but then figured why bother doing that when i can just treat it as though it were local Jul 13 08:13:17 and not require the ssh connection if i set up a vpn? Jul 13 08:13:25 My impression is that ssh -X performance is CPU-limited at least as much as it is bandwidth-limited. Jul 13 08:13:37 jason__: well. i'm doing this over a tethered phone Jul 13 08:13:45 so i think my problem is bandwidth more so than cpu Jul 13 08:13:54 I was under the impression that the biggest problem was latency Jul 13 08:13:58 locally the xp netbook and server work fine Jul 13 08:14:13 that too i suppose Jul 13 08:14:16 I did not mean to give the impression I knew what I was talking about. I should probably go to sleep. Jul 13 08:14:18 with my 400ms phone haha Jul 13 08:14:25 jason__: lol Jul 13 08:14:27 good night Jul 13 08:14:37 jason__, nah, you're mostly right :) Jul 13 08:14:41 good night though :) Jul 13 08:15:16 either CPU speed or latency or bandwidth might be the bottleneck in different parts of the same remote X session Jul 13 08:15:54 well. this is something that a vpn+vnc might be able to fix ;) Jul 13 08:16:07 or nx Jul 13 08:16:08 and keep my data safe while using unencrypted vnc Jul 13 08:16:12 never used nx Jul 13 08:16:36 but for now i have to figure out how to set up the vpn stuff in xp Jul 13 08:16:38 :) Jul 13 08:17:03 nx is an x server designed to improve the experience of running X11 applications over slow/high latency links Jul 13 08:18:06 oh Jul 13 08:29:13 http://www.demo.com/demonstrators/demo2009/165388.html Jul 13 08:29:24 theys how a little bit of the "revolutionary os" on the touch book Jul 13 08:30:48 as well as the actual device insides Jul 13 08:32:58 Macer, nice catch :) Jul 13 08:33:16 isn't it just xfce with compiz or something? :P Jul 13 08:33:26 sshhh...don't spoil it Jul 13 08:33:38 yes they use xfce Jul 13 08:33:40 well, he Jul 13 08:33:56 seriously though, I couldn't care less which linux comes on it to start with Jul 13 08:34:08 just as long as it's hackable? ;) Jul 13 08:34:18 johnx: we have Mer on http://yourfamily.o2.co.uk/o2familyjoggler now too Jul 13 08:34:24 the pre-orders are open if you want Jul 13 08:34:42 my rule is to only have one omap3 device pre-ordered at a time Jul 13 08:34:50 :)) Jul 13 08:34:56 that's a good rule Jul 13 08:35:12 that joggler thing's kinda interesting Jul 13 08:35:27 but probably not for me Jul 13 08:36:38 it's basically EFI bootload Jul 13 08:36:38 er Jul 13 08:37:07 on x86 Jul 13 08:37:26 aah Jul 13 08:38:22 hm Jul 13 08:38:29 i think i need to set up an ssh tunnel right now Jul 13 08:38:30 damnit Jul 13 08:38:31 :) Jul 13 08:38:53 and i think i accidently left compiz on.. maybe i can just rm my .gnome config Jul 13 08:38:57 johnx: so we finally got tested if touchscreen detection works on x86 Jul 13 08:39:01 johnx: , and it does Jul 13 08:39:04 oh wait. no i don't heh Jul 13 08:39:25 Stskeeps: yeah haha Jul 13 08:39:32 well.. actually i don't think it's compiz Jul 13 08:39:47 it looked a little more choppy in its movement than i thought though Jul 13 08:39:56 but we'll see when i get my vaporbook Jul 13 08:40:02 Stskeeps, ahaha. I should get back and fix that ugly hack though *cough* Jul 13 08:40:48 I'll pay up as soon as I have the $400 kicking around and *after* at least one 3rd party is holding a final device Jul 13 08:41:30 anyways, going on 2AM here. 'night Jul 13 08:41:33 nini Jul 13 08:44:38 well Jul 13 08:44:45 setting up the xp client for a vpn was retardedly easy Jul 13 08:44:46 haha Jul 13 08:45:00 now i just have to get home and hope my comcast router can do this crap for me Jul 13 08:45:11 or if i have to forward it somewhere that can Jul 13 08:55:47 hm Jul 13 09:00:32 morning andre__ Jul 13 09:00:38 heja Jul 13 09:00:49 how's it going? Jul 13 09:01:21 quite okay... gran canaria desktop summit, long weekend, now catching up with lotsa mail :-/ Jul 13 09:01:53 mm, i'm preparing slowly for debconf and cleaning up the house before the miss comes home Jul 13 09:03:36 there's a couple of bug reports we fixed in Mer now, you can probably mark them as fixed then I guess Jul 13 09:07:06 jeremiah_: ping Jul 13 10:23:31 "It is also Dual Core so a 1.5Ghz Atom should (in theory) run about the same as a 3.75GHz P4." Jul 13 10:23:53 emphasis on the word theory?:) Jul 13 10:23:55 Ah, those Internet theorists... Jul 13 10:24:29 Atom vs P4 is still an interesting comparison though Jul 13 10:27:45 2.4GHz P4 has a PassMark=329. 1.6MHz N270 has PassMark=306 Jul 13 10:28:20 Mhz? Jul 13 10:29:21 which p4 variant... Jul 13 10:29:28 or atom for that matter Jul 13 10:30:09 glass: N270 for the Atom, P4 type not stated Jul 13 10:30:47 RST38h: you know the type that make those comparisions on forums? cheapasses who've lusted after a p4 for 5 years Jul 13 10:31:11 glass: This data is not from the forums. See http://www.cpubenchmark.net/common_cpus.html Jul 13 10:31:12 but fast cpu's are nice. i recently digged up moray and povray :) Jul 13 10:31:48 glass: I am just considering replacing P4 based mdia box with an Atom based one Jul 13 10:32:38 coupled with which gpu solution? Jul 13 10:33:06 glass: Current one has S3 video, so you can safely say "no GPU" Jul 13 10:33:11 hehe Jul 13 10:33:26 glass: It manages to play videos though...well, mostly Jul 13 10:33:27 for non-hd stuf.. even a xbox1 does a fine job Jul 13 10:34:03 glass: I do want it to play up to 1280x768 though Jul 13 10:34:34 you should get something better than s3, perhaps we could send you a CGA adapter Jul 13 10:34:48 lcuk: yeah cga! digital baby! just like dvi! Jul 13 10:34:56 i have a mda somewhere... but its integrated into the mobo Jul 13 10:35:21 jaska, but its integrated because its SO fast you will never need to upgrade Jul 13 10:35:30 how much room does the 16kb of memory take? Jul 13 10:35:44 2.4 sq ft Jul 13 10:36:06 wow, you got double density stuff! Jul 13 10:36:09 that musta costalot Jul 13 10:36:33 glass: ferrite cores? Jul 13 10:36:49 RST38h: hmm. bumps on a wax cylinder Jul 13 10:37:24 bumps? you have a thermal writer? most use scratches and chips Jul 13 10:37:57 lots of nose goblins Jul 13 10:38:33 would make for an intresting art project i suppose Jul 13 10:38:39 delay lines filled with whisky Jul 13 10:38:54 lol Jul 13 10:39:06 memory loss would occur Jul 13 10:39:17 in more than one way Jul 13 10:40:06 But it gives "core dump" a whole new meaning... Jul 13 10:46:13 jummy core dumps Jul 13 10:46:19 now that's an interesting take to it Jul 13 10:53:06 RST38h, glass ;) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UZLYBGPU_c0 Jul 13 10:56:54 Cthulhu rising: http://img-fotki.yandex.ru/get/3614/info-flot.2d/0_33923_d2a22782_orig Jul 13 10:57:54 Wow. After all the terrifying descriptions of him, I'd have never expected to see such a sweet looking thing. Jul 13 10:59:07 early stage of development, all babies are cute you know... Jul 13 11:32:05 i heard mainline kernels will support n8x0 devices, but when? Jul 13 11:36:16 hello all, Can i use clutter library for open GL support for "Desktop Widget" development? Jul 13 11:41:09 thux http://kvalo.wordpress.com/2009/07/13/n800n810-support-to-mainline-kernels/ Jul 13 11:42:15 sarower, dunno, certianly not for n8x0 Jul 13 11:46:00 then where i can use that? Jul 13 11:46:17 lcuk: in normal application? Jul 13 11:47:58 you can use it on any device that has fremantle on it Jul 13 11:48:04 sarower: ^ Jul 13 11:49:00 And before you have on in your hands (many of us have protos), you can develop on the fremantle SDK Jul 13 11:49:27 konttori__: That means i can use for "Desktop Widget" (Home screen applet) development...! Jul 13 11:49:35 sure. Jul 13 11:50:06 konttori__: do you have any sample or source? Jul 13 11:50:17 Of clutter -> homescreen applet? Jul 13 11:50:36 konttori__: yes Jul 13 11:50:48 nope. I would really want to make one too. Jul 13 11:50:56 Hmm.. perhaps I can experiement a bit. Jul 13 11:51:18 konttori__: but how you are sure about that... Jul 13 11:51:21 Any python devs here? Anyone tried making clutter app to home screen? Jul 13 11:51:21 ? Jul 13 11:51:41 well, at wors you can render the clutter to offscreen buffer and replicate that to the applet Jul 13 11:51:51 so, there is at least a workaround. Jul 13 11:52:02 you would loose quite a bit of fps on that though Jul 13 11:52:41 Dunno if this could be used: http://pymaemo.garage.maemo.org/documentation/python_hildon_manual/html/hildonobjects.html#remotetexture Jul 13 11:53:38 would be really nice to have someone make an example of using that. Jul 13 11:55:20 sarower: do you have the time to experiement on that? Jul 13 11:57:52 i am thinking... Jul 13 12:02:26 remote texture is of course also available exactly the same on c side. Jul 13 12:07:51 konttori__, it would help people i think if there were some maemo oriented clutter examples that people could tinker with on their desktop Jul 13 12:08:13 sure. otoh, you should be able to use clutter as-is. Jul 13 12:08:24 but yeah, there should definitely be something to help to get started. Jul 13 12:08:32 yes, i know the library is the same on desktop and tablet, but having something they can pull in as "fremantle clutter test" helps to put context to that before they create an overloaded masterpiece Jul 13 12:08:43 sure. Jul 13 12:09:03 I want to test it out myself (never done it), so if/when I get the hello world done, I'll make a post Jul 13 12:09:22 and only you guys know the practical limits and can give a reasonable boundary for what can and cannot be feasibly achieved with the horsepower Jul 13 12:10:02 * lcuk makes a 27 layer HD ready super clutter app and wonders why it crawls on anything slower than a 4ghx Jul 13 12:11:03 what ports does vpn use? Jul 13 12:11:24 my comcast business router doesn't have built in vpn Jul 13 12:11:38 but i'm guessing maybe i can forward it to my ddwrt wifi router Jul 13 12:11:44 and do it that way. should go fast enough to handle it Jul 13 12:11:47 hey konttori__ i found out at weekend, my lenovo thinkpad has accelerometers built in! Jul 13 12:11:57 lcuk: cool Jul 13 12:11:57 yeah, the harddisk Jul 13 12:12:04 I suppose most do these days Jul 13 12:12:10 Stskeeps, yeah well i didnt know lol Jul 13 12:12:41 but on ubuntu there is a driver which maps the accel data into the standard joystick input device Jul 13 12:12:58 rather than having a specific custom /dev api Jul 13 12:13:11 i mean will i have to make an actual vpn server or something to get this working? Jul 13 12:13:14 that would kind of suck :) Jul 13 12:13:17 i wonder if something would be possible with maemo - that way we could just use games as is Jul 13 12:13:25 or put some type of vpn stuff on my shell box? Jul 13 12:13:45 Macer, dunno, never messed with vpn Jul 13 12:14:25 wonderful. there are not python bindings yet available for clutter in maemo repository Jul 13 12:17:28 It's listed here: http://pymaemo.garage.maemo.org/documentation_fremantle.html Jul 13 12:17:38 I need to nudge those guys Jul 13 12:17:52 Hello, I have a question. Regarding my pidgin. It keeps disconnecting my MSN account. And -most of the times- it doesn't connect again. Is this a known problem, with a solution? Or am I the only one that has those problems. Jul 13 12:18:12 I'm using pidgin 2.5.1 Jul 13 12:18:12 konttori__: It is in extras-devel Jul 13 12:18:37 konttori__: python-clutter 0.8.0-1maemo1 Jul 13 12:20:14 hmm... refreshing now. Jul 13 12:21:34 cannot find it using apt. odd. Jul 13 12:25:28 X-Fade: it's there only for i386 architecture Jul 13 12:25:57 konttori__: Yeah, that is where you can test it? ;) Jul 13 12:26:21 konttori__: There are officially no devices yet, so ;) Jul 13 12:29:10 well. i dont like testing on anything but on a real device Jul 13 12:30:12 especially when doing something 3d, how else to test perf. Jul 13 12:30:49 konttori__: Well, we all would like to test on the real device too ;) Jul 13 12:31:48 well... you can... soon enough Jul 13 12:32:34 konttori__: It is never soon enough.. Jul 13 12:33:04 heya everyone Jul 13 12:33:42 Probably never at this rate Jul 13 12:33:49 hmmph. if you would work on the os, it's never late enough... Jul 13 12:34:28 Hehe Jul 13 12:35:02 power management and tuning takes a lot of time. getting things polished. Jul 13 12:35:51 * Jaffa wants to test his Horizon app with some real accelerometers. Jul 13 12:36:07 jaffa lenovo x41 Jul 13 12:36:13 powersave mode is 600mhz Jul 13 12:36:15 use some usb accelo on n810 Jul 13 12:36:17 and its got clutter Jul 13 12:36:23 its just a big daddy tablet Jul 13 12:38:28 hmm.. I'll make something else then until the clutter stuff is available Jul 13 12:49:03 heh konttori__ i said that last year :p liqbase is lookin nice and slick on just about everything i try it on Jul 13 12:49:24 (too fast infact, i had to implement framerate limiting on the x41! Jul 13 12:55:19 lcuk konttori__: you provide me USB accelerometers on an N810, or an X41, and I'll do that. Otherwise I'll semi-patiently whine about getting a new device ;-) Jul 13 12:58:31 damnit Jul 13 13:00:59 jaffa, my point about hte laptop is *many* laptops have them built in now (hard drive thingy) its not just the one specific model Jul 13 13:01:09 your existing one might already have it.. Jul 13 13:04:57 what tool from the command line takes screenshots on the display? Jul 13 13:11:00 lcuk: I thought they were very crude ones to detect inertial shocks; not user-land exposed accelerometers. Jul 13 13:11:55 they're pretty good ones really :P Jul 13 13:12:05 i was impressed with accuracy of my gf's laptop Jul 13 13:12:08 Depends on the laptop. Jul 13 13:12:23 (ibm) Jul 13 13:12:26 Either way, they're hardly convenient for that sort of thing. Jul 13 13:14:43 better to have *something* usable and testable in your hands than nothing, i was genuinely hsocked to find out they existed at weekend when kotczarny told me Jul 13 13:16:25 Can't find any info on how Dells expose the ones from the HDD. Suggestion seems to be that it's entirely within the HDD controller Jul 13 13:16:28 /disk Jul 13 13:30:22 is there maemo package for libwebkit-1.0-1 somewhere? Jul 13 13:30:46 i think bundyo's may count Jul 13 13:30:48 Jaffa: theres very good sensors in some macs and lenovos Jul 13 13:31:01 Jaffa: it's to detect free fall to send the hd to sleep Jul 13 13:31:12 well/not sleep, heads off the discs Jul 13 13:31:14 park.com Jul 13 13:31:33 Jaffa: they can be used to play games like neverball (monkeyball clone) Jul 13 13:31:45 "Apple's biggest challenge will be convincing its huge installed base of iPhone owners that they need a MacPad too." Jul 13 13:31:59 biggest challenge, hehe Jul 13 13:32:14 RST38h: notice how they don't even think that someone without an iphone would buy one Jul 13 13:32:17 RST38h: They've announced a MacPad, or is this theoretical windblowing? Jul 13 13:33:00 windblow Jul 13 13:33:24 though engagdet has some rumors too: Jul 13 13:33:25 http://www.engadget.com/2009/07/13/apples-9-7-inch-netbook-to-debut-in-october-for-800/ Jul 13 13:33:30 * Jaffa sees it on /. Jul 13 13:33:34 s/gd/dg/ Jul 13 13:33:41 yep Jul 13 13:34:21 Jaffa: another leak Jul 13 13:34:51 glass: ah they do not mention it because they do not doubt it :) Jul 13 13:44:26 coldboot: Hi Jul 13 13:51:48 hi fiferboy Jul 13 13:51:57 hey, lbt Jul 13 13:52:20 I'm waiting to see the raster performance after the latest build completes (ARM is done building) Jul 13 13:52:20 you don't know any debian packaging gurus do you? Jul 13 13:53:02 I think jeremiah_ is the Maemo deb guy, but there might be some others in this channel Jul 13 13:53:29 he is. He's not around atm though Jul 13 13:53:51 What's the packaging problem? Jul 13 13:54:22 trying to build cross-compile system for Mer/OBS Jul 13 13:56:22 the Qt git tree looks a bit of a mess Jul 13 13:57:08 lbt: I don't pretend to understand it Jul 13 13:57:12 3 commits have the same patch+message: The original code assumes 24bit color, but NIT is 16bit Jul 13 13:58:03 3 separate commits? Or the same commit being applied to three different branches? Jul 13 13:58:37 a commit is contextual Jul 13 13:58:46 same patch to 3 branches Jul 13 13:59:11 But do they have different commit numbers? Jul 13 13:59:14 commit sha depends on the sha of the parent... Jul 13 14:00:19 Ah, gotcha Jul 13 14:00:55 Is the issue that it was applied to more than one branch? Jul 13 14:01:06 yes Jul 13 14:01:16 it should have been applied to one branch Jul 13 14:01:28 Right, I can see that. Jul 13 14:01:30 and then merged into each of the 'distro' branches Jul 13 14:02:17 this way there may as well be 3 seperate repos which have the same patches applied to them Jul 13 14:02:37 I see your point... Jul 13 14:08:28 ugh Jul 13 14:08:31 i'm on hold with comcast Jul 13 14:08:47 because of their stupid router/modem/firewall Jul 13 14:08:50 that totally sucks ass Jul 13 14:20:54 hm Jul 13 14:21:39 well Jul 13 14:22:30 this is going to totally screw me short term haha Jul 13 14:39:15 what version of maemo is 5.2008.43-7 ? Diablo? Jul 13 14:39:44 It's one of the Diablo releases, yes. Jul 13 14:40:19 I asked that person to try Webkit, however this link doesn't work http://repository.maemo.org/extras-devel/dists/diablo/install/libwebkit-1.0-1.install Jul 13 14:40:26 am I missing something? Jul 13 14:45:24 hendry, define "doesn't work" Jul 13 14:46:41 andre__: "Application package not found" error Jul 13 14:46:54 i can't find the deb package on search either Jul 13 14:47:10 use apt-get Jul 13 14:47:10 This boils down to categories. Bottom line: apt-get install. Jul 13 14:47:10 probably because it's a library and not an application Jul 13 14:56:45 Hehe, they want to deorbit ISS in 2015 Jul 13 14:57:13 An unusual way to solve the crew delivery problem, indeed... Jul 13 14:58:43 iss is in a stupid orbit :) Jul 13 14:59:18 ugh Jul 13 14:59:19 wtf Jul 13 14:59:27 why can't this stupid vpn let me browse the web Jul 13 14:59:30 using a local dns Jul 13 14:59:42 actually Jul 13 14:59:48 it's not the dns.. it's getting the ips Jul 13 14:59:55 it's almost like it doesn't want me to use the gateway or something Jul 13 15:01:59 hm Jul 13 16:10:19 Is there any way to get diffs mailed to me every time a MediaWiki page is changed, instead of simply a notification that it's changed once, which I won't get again until I re-visit the page? Jul 13 16:28:49 dneary: Click the "watch" tab on the page. Jul 13 16:29:08 dneary: Making sure that you're logged in and have your email address set properly. Jul 13 16:29:26 coldboot: That will send me one mail, the first time someone changes the page, with a notification of time & person - no diff. Jul 13 16:29:41 And it doesn't send anything for subsequent changes before I go back Jul 13 16:29:47 dneary: That's retarded. Jul 13 16:29:53 dneary: What a useless feature. Jul 13 16:30:13 The idea is to let you know that there are changes - then you go back & look & see what they are. Jul 13 16:30:20 Maybe you can configure it in your account, or perhaps it's a global MediaWiki setting. Jul 13 16:30:39 dneary: Yeah that's lame and insufficient, why would anyone want that redundant step when they've already had to read an email? Jul 13 16:30:56 coldboot: ask mediawiki... Jul 13 16:30:58 I hate it when stupid Facebook makes you go to the page to reply. Similar thing. Jul 13 16:34:57 VDVsx: Ping? Jul 13 16:36:46 jo florian Jul 13 16:37:38 dneary, pong Jul 13 16:37:56 VDVsx: Just wondering what your timezone is Jul 13 16:38:37 dneary, UTC -1, in the summer Jul 13 16:39:21 OK - Portugal time? Jul 13 16:39:28 dneary, yup Jul 13 16:39:40 dneary, same as in UK Jul 13 16:39:53 I'm in France, UTC+2 (I believe you're UTC+1, not -1) Jul 13 16:39:59 Cool Jul 13 16:40:10 How does 9am Thursday suit you for a proposals chat, then? Jul 13 16:40:15 * RST38h moos at whoever he hasn't mooed today Jul 13 16:40:17 mediawiki is crap at notifications Jul 13 16:40:25 dneary, yah that's it, my bad Jul 13 16:40:33 I want "mail me whenever anything changes" Jul 13 16:40:46 lbt: The changes in 4.5.2-1maemo2 make fingerscrolling smooth again Jul 13 16:41:01 I was looking at merging them into Mer Qt Jul 13 16:41:16 fiferboy yes the bad commit was found Jul 13 16:41:33 Mental Note: ldrsh != ldrhs, and the one that DOES NOT sign-extend is actually ldrsh Jul 13 16:41:39 dneary, I only arrive at home at the noon :(, but let me see Jul 13 16:42:04 lbt: Me too, that's what I want Jul 13 16:42:06 I am trying coldboot's flicker fix (but OSK break) to see if that affect table view scrolling performance Jul 13 16:42:06 Mental Note 2: GNU ARM Assembler sucks moose balls, may the Tentacled One brainfuck its creators. Jul 13 16:42:28 rst????? Jul 13 16:42:28 Is there something way better than MediaWiki that's free? Jul 13 16:42:32 VDVsx: Well, we could do it by email, but generally resolving conflicts like this requires real-time Jul 13 16:42:35 dokuwiki is nice Jul 13 16:42:35 dneary: I think you have to write your own... I think the problem is that many mediawiki installs are mega-installs Jul 13 16:42:36 rst arm assembler is nice Jul 13 16:42:46 coldboot: MediaWiki's pretty darn good in other ways Jul 13 16:43:09 agreed ... MW is the best on aggregate Jul 13 16:43:10 fiferboy: When I left work on Friday I was still compiling. Getting segfaults now, which is odd, because I have qDebug() statements that won't print, before any changed code I wrote... Jul 13 16:43:15 dneary: Yeah that is true. Jul 13 16:43:25 dneary, 11am or 2 pm onwards would be better for me, not sure if I will have internet access at the morning :) Jul 13 16:43:54 I'll be in crunch time - flying out at 7am Friday for OSCON Jul 13 16:44:00 coldboot: That is strange. git bisect? Jul 13 16:44:02 woglinde: Except that there is no ARM SDT for Unix that would integrate with GCC toolchain Jul 13 16:44:16 I'll make myself available - co-ordinate a time with Baloo that suits you both, I'll try to work around it. Jul 13 16:44:18 woglinde: And GNU GAS is an atrocity Jul 13 16:44:50 Hi, I just installed a fresh install of OS2008 on my N800, and I can't connect to the repositories Jul 13 16:44:51 dneary, what about tonight ? Jul 13 16:45:01 fiferboy: Well I'm using the svn version for 4.5.0-maemo2, but it's such a small amount of code, I'm binary searching now. Jul 13 16:45:05 Jamie's cooking dinner for wife & kids now Jul 13 16:45:13 But later would be good for me Jul 13 16:45:25 dneary, me too Jul 13 16:45:46 VDVsx: Ask away, I'll work around the time if you're both about for a while later Jul 13 16:45:57 I can do late dneary as in 30 minutes? Jul 13 16:46:13 later Jul 13 16:46:23 OK - let's say 30 mins here Jul 13 16:46:32 OK, back then Jul 13 16:46:35 ok fine for me Jul 13 16:46:42 Nokia Surge (aka Mako) is out on AT&T network Jul 13 16:46:57 RST38h, ugly thing :) Jul 13 16:47:06 If you want to see what N900 SHOULD be like (but never will) take a look Jul 13 16:47:30 VDV: Ugly, yes, but perfectly usable Jul 13 16:48:14 VDV: Dpad, 4-row keyboard with real space bar and real keys, no silvery crap that chips, and it only costs $80 subsidized Jul 13 16:49:06 RST38h, however I think is a very suitable design for the US market Jul 13 16:49:20 VDV: It is a very suitable design for ANY market Jul 13 16:49:39 VDV: Most likely not done by N-series team though Jul 13 16:50:08 how does one create shortcuts in xterm? C-a for example Jul 13 16:51:03 VDV: (I do not mean the feature set of course, just the physical appearance) Jul 13 16:52:08 RST38h, I don't like very much the row of special buttons near to the screen, maybe I can change my opinion when I see one live :P Jul 13 16:54:23 What's the real price? Jul 13 16:55:52 I bet around $200 Jul 13 16:56:19 is this a s60 device? how much cpu and ram? Jul 13 16:57:15 yeah is a S60 Jul 13 16:57:33 ShadowJK, http://www.engadgetmobile.com/2009/07/13/nokias-surge-official-on-atandt-ships-july-19-for-79-99/ Jul 13 16:57:39 is there anything other than formatting that I can do in order to get a SD card working over USB? Jul 13 16:58:30 can't find the specs on it Jul 13 16:58:30 RST38h: if keyboard is anything to go by on the devel device, i like the keyboard on the devel device over that device Jul 13 16:59:22 Does it have any "normal" nokia model number too? Jul 13 16:59:55 ShadowJK, Nokia 6790 according to engadget Jul 13 17:00:30 nothing about that on forum nokia either :/ Jul 13 17:01:35 ShadowJK, Symbian S60 3.2 on board and the side slider also packs a 2.6 inch QVGA display, a QWERTY keyboard, aGPS and 128MB of on board memory. Jul 13 17:01:46 SDRAM? Jul 13 17:01:54 And I'd much rather have an N810 keyboard in front of me compared to the one on that 6790 (and that is saying something). Jul 13 17:02:10 * ShadowJK has gotten used to N810 keyboard now Jul 13 17:07:40 dneary, VDVsx I'm around now Jul 13 17:08:58 JamieBennett, me too :) Jul 13 17:09:58 JamieBennett, VDVsx: Cool Jul 13 17:10:03 omelette devoured :) Jul 13 17:10:55 jeremiah_: PING Jul 13 17:11:10 anyone know how to send a really loud ping? Jul 13 17:11:31 kick him through the cable Jul 13 17:11:35 *g* Jul 13 17:12:04 OK - the ones we disagree on: Jul 13 17:12:15 Go-to market opportunities Jul 13 17:12:25 I feel like we have to say yea or nay here Jul 13 17:12:46 I'm leaving towards yea, only because it's a subject we're not likely to see treated better by anyone else Jul 13 17:12:57 lbt: Try Jabber? Jul 13 17:13:08 I'm OK with saying yes as long as there is a good portion of the talk devoted to Maemo Jul 13 17:13:12 He's off-line now Jul 13 17:13:20 VDVsx: ? Jul 13 17:13:23 agree to Jamie Jul 13 17:13:29 *with Jul 13 17:14:00 I don't like VI - what other editors are there, that I can use when I ssh into my NIT? Jul 13 17:14:14 Maybe get some assurances that Maemo is indeed a part of the talk Jul 13 17:15:00 a *good* part in that case Jul 13 17:15:40 Jamie: OK Jul 13 17:15:51 You saw the mail he sent back (added to the talk page)? Jul 13 17:16:51 Yes although that didn't say much about Maemo Jul 13 17:16:55 unixSnob look at the package list Jul 13 17:17:47 I like the idea of the talk its just that from a Maemo perspective I want to see the other platform experiences not only talked about but also compared with the Maemo offerings to make it more relevant e.t.c. Jul 13 17:18:32 JamieBennett: I don't have a problem with opening it a *bit* beyond Maemo Jul 13 17:18:52 and Fring's a company successfully making money selling mobile applications, so - maybe some insights to be had Jul 13 17:19:06 * xnt14 wakes up Jul 13 17:19:21 dneary, yup,I like the topic, and seems a interesting presentation for mobile dev's, at least Jul 13 17:19:41 hmm Jul 13 17:19:54 Agreed and at the the first summit Jay gave a great Mozilla talk so although I would like to see more Maemo in the talk I will say yes Jul 13 17:21:56 dneary, JamieBennett , after the stated arguments, from me is a yes Jul 13 17:22:50 OK Jul 13 17:22:55 Let's say yes to that, then Jul 13 17:23:07 damn.. the latest updates broke the openvpn gui tool.. did anyone else notice that? Jul 13 17:23:11 Second: Canola Jul 13 17:23:16 Does every call to qDebug() flush the output buffer? Jul 13 17:23:16 Let's skip that for a sec Jul 13 17:23:32 Evangelising Mer Jul 13 17:23:40 Can we agree on "wait & see"? Jul 13 17:23:40 dneary: Fring doesn't sell apps, right? Jul 13 17:23:42 woohoo Jul 13 17:23:46 dneary: They sell minutes? Jul 13 17:23:50 X-Fade: They sell time, yes Jul 13 17:23:56 dneary: Yes Jul 13 17:24:08 I wouldn't mind buying a couple of days from them this week, actually Jul 13 17:24:08 dneary, agreed Jul 13 17:24:11 OK Jul 13 17:24:32 Hildon toolkit for Fremantle: application developers or platform? Jul 13 17:24:48 dneary: did you say : Evangelising Mer......Can we agree on "wait & see"? in which case can you explain? Jul 13 17:24:55 /usr/bin/python2.5 Jul 13 17:24:59 argh! Jul 13 17:25:00 lbt: Yes, I did Jul 13 17:25:03 I wonder why Fring still doesn't have a blackberry client. Jul 13 17:25:05 * xnt14 hates synergy Jul 13 17:25:16 lbt: argumentation in Talk:Maemo_Summit_2009/Submissions Jul 13 17:25:17 dneary, changing my opinion, app dev's Jul 13 17:25:18 (afaik) Jul 13 17:25:23 lbt: There's a proposal for a Maemo Summit talk with the title "Evangelizing Mer, and Tips on Promoting Your Own Project" Jul 13 17:25:25 reheya Maemo :) Jul 13 17:25:43 np :) Jul 13 17:26:02 lbt: we agree that a subject like that might be interesting for the Summit (how best to evangelise products you're involved with) but I think that a better presentation or presenter might come along Jul 13 17:26:19 VDVsx: OK - agreed on app devs, then Jul 13 17:26:39 OK, I am expecting to put together a talk based on the one I'm doing for the UK Open Systems Group in August. Jul 13 17:26:47 I'm not missing a deadline am I? Jul 13 17:26:48 the angle is also "get maemo out there, how to use maemo.org grassroots, present at lugs, local activism", etc :) Jul 13 17:26:55 JamieBennett: Mer: A year after. Do you still think lighhtning talk? Jul 13 17:27:04 dneary, after saw the GCDS presentation, I changed my angle of view, about that one Jul 13 17:27:10 http://summer2009.ukuug.org/Talks (search 'Touching Linux') Jul 13 17:27:41 I expect to be able to enrich it with some Moblin content too ;) Jul 13 17:27:44 VDVsx: You were in GCDS? We must have met, but I don't remember you introducing yourself Jul 13 17:28:01 dneary, no, just saw the slides, lol Jul 13 17:28:08 dneary: I'd like to see a definate Mer presence but I'm not sure a full presentation would be appropriate for the subject. Maybe if I saw more of an outline of what is going to be in the talk Jul 13 17:28:13 Stskeeps: OK, thanks for the info Jul 13 17:28:34 *the subject* not meaning Mer but the talk subject title Jul 13 17:28:46 JamieBennett: Mer's been one of the most important community projects in Maemo over the past year - I'd expect there to be at least 2 presentation slots in there Jul 13 17:28:55 I understand, though Jul 13 17:28:58 Yes me too Jul 13 17:29:22 The subject seems to me like your typical "overview of Mer" abstract, which sopunds good to me Jul 13 17:29:34 I'm not adverse to saying yes to this Jul 13 17:29:49 nevermind... tunnel gui app works.. I just had to remove all applets, and add the openvpn applet FIRST, then the others Jul 13 17:30:06 JamieBennett: OK Jul 13 17:30:13 I'll say yes (although as you two have also said yes it makes no difference to the vote ;)) Jul 13 17:30:36 Jamie: It's not a vote Jul 13 17:30:41 It's all or nothing Jul 13 17:30:47 Unanimous, or we talk about it Jul 13 17:30:54 Any one person might have a veto vote Jul 13 17:31:07 Next: speeding up Maemo development Jul 13 17:31:08 OK, I'll say yes. Jul 13 17:31:21 Wait & see? Jul 13 17:31:30 JamieBennett, dneary , I vote for a presentation, a LT is too short to recap a full year of an project like mer Jul 13 17:31:39 Seems like there's some interest, but no-one saying "Yes!" Jul 13 17:31:57 dneary: No, I'll say yes to the talk (Mer) Jul 13 17:32:11 JamieBennett: Yes, got it. Moved on already :) Jul 13 17:32:55 :) I like the idea of a ESbox and Pluthon talk Jul 13 17:33:42 seems interesting to me from a dev POV, but let's wait a bit more Jul 13 17:35:36 JamieBennett, dneary , done ? Jul 13 17:35:53 wait and see is fine from me Jul 13 17:36:14 OK Jul 13 17:36:24 What's ESbox and Pluthon? Jul 13 17:36:28 VDVsx: Done! Jul 13 17:36:31 Thanks guys Jul 13 17:36:46 dneary: Alternative GUI development from Nokia. Jul 13 17:36:47 JamieBennett, we must wait for a reply to your comment Jul 13 17:36:52 dneary: Eclipse integration. Jul 13 17:36:55 Ah, forgot one Jul 13 17:36:58 Canola Jul 13 17:37:21 VDVsx: What comment? Jul 13 17:37:55 We have 7 yes, 1 no, 2 wait and see, and 1 proposed "Stars" session, and 1 session we haven't talked about yet Jul 13 17:38:01 JamieBennett, pluthon and esbox talk Jul 13 17:38:10 I said wait and see Jul 13 17:39:15 OK, what about the Canola talk(s) Jul 13 17:39:35 JamieBennett, I'm talking about the comment in the wiki :P Jul 13 17:39:46 Ah OK :D Jul 13 17:40:26 JamieBennett, dneary , I would like to see a presentation around the canola framework Jul 13 17:41:34 JamieBennett: What do you think? Jul 13 17:41:51 * xnt14 wonders where home panel applets are stored in the filesystem...... Jul 13 17:41:54 I know the indt guys have some cool projects that I'm sure use the Canola framework. It would be nice to see a talk along the lines of 'how to use the Canola framework to make graphically rich applications" Jul 13 17:41:54 and maybe a LT + app developers presentation will be the best suit here Jul 13 17:41:56 * xnt14 pokes around Jul 13 17:43:50 hmm Jul 13 17:45:17 qwerty12, any ideas? Jul 13 17:45:41 I would be fine with the LT and full talk proposal Jul 13 17:45:55 I found /usr/share/applications/hildon-home, those are .desktop files Jul 13 17:46:06 dneary, your thoughts? Jul 13 17:46:19 xnt14: /usr/lib/hildon-home/ Jul 13 17:47:07 OK - so approve it as a framework talk, and encourage a second talk about the application, is what I'm hearing? Jul 13 17:47:16 I will go along with that. Jul 13 17:47:25 dneary: Yes IMO Jul 13 17:47:30 qwerty12, thanks :) Jul 13 17:47:33 We're going to start running out of developer slots before user track slots, that's for sure Jul 13 17:47:43 thats my worry at the moment Jul 13 17:47:54 JamieBennett, dneary second talk == LT IMO Jul 13 17:48:28 We need the indt guys to show us Canola, the OpenGL ES Fremantle version ;) Jul 13 17:49:08 JamieBennett, they are now working with Qt, afaik Jul 13 17:52:53 dneary, JamieBennett , I've to go guys (football time :)), any final thoughts ? Jul 13 17:53:17 VDVsx: wear shinguards, break legs Jul 13 17:53:28 Looks like a wait and see then, maybe propose some options to the Canola guys? Jul 13 17:53:30 VDVsx: Or don't break legs, but just break spirits Jul 13 17:53:44 JamieBennett: I'm happy to go with what ye said for the Canola talk Jul 13 17:54:01 Yes for framework, ask them to submit a canola the applicatioon talk Jul 13 17:54:13 OK Jul 13 17:54:18 ok Jul 13 17:56:16 dneary, JamieBennett, cya later Jul 13 17:56:22 OK bye Jul 13 17:56:55 Don't change qwidget.h before compiling unless you have something else to do for... forever. Jul 13 17:57:59 VDVsx, have you found out what the other fm stars are doing, cos i will need to arrange myself accordingly Jul 13 17:58:05 hi lcuk Jul 13 17:58:06 ie if you give me a little slot i hold back Jul 13 17:58:13 hiya woglinde \o Jul 13 17:59:45 woglinde, are you through your exams now Jul 13 17:59:49 * lcuk hopes it was you Jul 13 18:00:38 lcuk hm nope Jul 13 18:00:45 not through exams Jul 13 18:00:52 then it wasnt you lol Jul 13 18:00:57 * lcuk must remember to drink less Jul 13 18:01:05 and diploma thesis at head Jul 13 18:02:24 ahhh, how long is left Jul 13 18:02:51 didnt register it yet Jul 13 18:02:54 then 6 months Jul 13 18:04:50 are there any carpenters around Jul 13 18:05:12 or should i ask in #gentoo? Jul 13 18:05:15 jesus Jul 13 18:05:29 hes on irc? Jul 13 18:05:45 i've burnt a lot of wood and planted couple of thousand trees, do i qualify?-D Jul 13 18:06:03 heh not really Jul 13 18:06:26 im wondering how i could make something Jul 13 18:06:44 lcuk: i know a bit of woodworking/whats cheap in a hw store Jul 13 18:07:30 heh Jul 13 18:07:45 well im thinking about the smartq7 Jul 13 18:07:55 http://www.iconocast.com/B000000000000206_Korea/S3/News5_1.jpg Jul 13 18:08:47 currently, i have my 810 in this: http://img522.imageshack.us/img522/7308/810crateinkx8.jpg Jul 13 18:08:59 and it sits nicely t 45deg Jul 13 18:09:06 ah something like that Jul 13 18:09:11 the stand on that smartq5 is flimsy Jul 13 18:09:15 or looks it Jul 13 18:09:20 no stand on a q5 Jul 13 18:09:24 76 Jul 13 18:09:26 7 Jul 13 18:09:34 photo up there sts Jul 13 18:09:38 i know the 5 has no stand Jul 13 18:09:40 lcuk: lots of plastic-like stuff on sale that hardens as to plastic Jul 13 18:09:42 its a square brick tho Jul 13 18:09:44 * xnt14 fires up gimp and works on his theme Jul 13 18:09:49 im not worried about technical ability Jul 13 18:09:58 lcuk: and dremel clones cost something like 40 bucks now Jul 13 18:10:12 a dremel wont really make the shape i need Jul 13 18:10:19 which is nearly flat but not quite Jul 13 18:10:25 lcuk: Do you need to make something out of plastic? Jul 13 18:10:26 the putty type stuff sounds good tho Jul 13 18:10:45 coldboot, i prefer wood really, but this one will be more for wall based Jul 13 18:10:50 lcuk: A guy I worked with makes a robot that makes stuff out of plastic. Jul 13 18:10:51 so it doent really matter Jul 13 18:11:01 lcuk: dremel has plenty of accessories :) it's just handier tool than getting saws and shit.. Jul 13 18:11:03 cnt machine Jul 13 18:11:23 glass, i have dremel, but this is 7inches of precision depth required Jul 13 18:11:30 i actually tihnk some sort of putty would work Jul 13 18:11:34 put bag round device Jul 13 18:11:35 press in Jul 13 18:11:37 lcuk: you might like www.hackedgadgets.com Jul 13 18:11:39 and get a really good form Jul 13 18:12:10 im just thinking ahead - i wouldv prefered the smartq7 to have a wall hanger Jul 13 18:12:26 * xnt14 has a dremel o.0 xDDDD Jul 13 18:12:31 but its shape would leave it unstable around the edges Jul 13 18:12:40 no im serious xD Jul 13 18:12:45 http://makerbot.com/ Jul 13 18:13:28 heh, so ive gotta make the bot so it can make the stand Jul 13 18:13:33 thats like chicken and egg Jul 13 18:13:52 i would be quicker encouraging luke to do woodwork and send him through college lol Jul 13 18:14:34 * xnt14 misses compiz....... Jul 13 18:14:43 glass, thanks for putty idea, at first impression it would work Jul 13 18:14:45 hmm Jul 13 18:14:49 and could be used for any principle Jul 13 18:15:02 device ^ Jul 13 18:16:21 Is it possible to use my n810 as a bluetooth adapter for my computer? Jul 13 18:17:55 qwerty12_N810: ping? Jul 13 18:21:26 X-Fade: pong Jul 13 18:26:51 qwerty12_N810: can you upload a new version of a package of yours? Jul 13 18:27:05 qwerty12_N810: I want to test an autobuilder log import feature ;) Jul 13 18:27:11 coldboot: I have a fix for the flicker issue Jul 13 18:27:57 X-Fade: Sorry, I can't do that as I'm on a tablet :( Jul 13 18:28:26 fiferboy: Really? Jul 13 18:28:29 fiferboy: What did you do? Jul 13 18:28:40 This compiling of Qt is killing me, it takes forever. Jul 13 18:28:51 There is no flicker, and OSK is working with the widgets I tested Jul 13 18:29:04 fiferboy: What's the fix, do you have a diff? Jul 13 18:29:58 fiferboy: You're from Hamilton? Jul 13 18:31:06 coldboot: http://pastebin.com/m7ee69c97 Jul 13 18:31:17 coldboot: Yes, I'm from Hamilton Jul 13 18:32:00 Pretty simple change, works in the cases I can find Jul 13 18:38:19 fiferboy: Just that one return condition in that one file? Jul 13 18:38:30 coldboot: Yep Jul 13 18:39:00 It basically decides the keyboard doesn't need to popup for that widget and doesn't do the unessesary conversion Jul 13 18:39:20 fiferboy: Yeah, it's still going to convert text fields, though. Jul 13 18:40:09 True, it is not a perfect solution, but it fixes our case (the only case that has been noticed AFAIK) and doesn't break anything that I can find. Jul 13 18:40:28 Maybe not ideal, but better than our current situation Jul 13 18:40:37 Yeah it's definitely good enough. Jul 13 18:40:45 Very convenient function there, canUseIM(). Jul 13 18:41:11 I'm still compiling my previous fix. Jul 13 18:41:15 One case I can't test right now is an editor in an itemview. My app doesn't use that Jul 13 18:41:17 Don't know if it works yet. Jul 13 18:41:25 Use shopper Jul 13 18:41:45 But I never got flashing with text fields anyway, only tables and drop downs. Jul 13 18:41:47 coldboot: I tried some focusProxy code, but still couldn't get the keystroke to go to the widget Jul 13 18:42:32 I have tested line edits and editable combo boxes with no problem, and my tableview which used to flash doesn't flash anymore Jul 13 18:42:51 I just wonder what would happen if you have an editable cell in a table, whether it would cause the flash Jul 13 18:43:22 fiferboy: It probably would. Jul 13 18:43:36 fiferboy: But, for now, this is great, because we don't have any editable anything in our app! :) Jul 13 18:43:52 Unless it only converts the editor widget itself, I'm not sure how that works Jul 13 18:44:17 I'd suggest this for cutting down on lines: if (!w || !canUseIM(widget)) {\n return\n} Jul 13 18:44:55 coldboot: I was just following the code, it is done in two separate blocks elsewhere in that file Jul 13 18:45:06 ah ok Jul 13 18:50:51 fiferboy: heya Andrew :) Jul 13 18:51:22 hey wazd, how's it going? Jul 13 18:51:44 fiferboy: spent 3 days with my friend that was telling me that Qt rocks :D Jul 13 18:51:56 He is right! Jul 13 18:52:01 fiferboy: :) Jul 13 18:52:24 It even has a good tool for you - a GUI designer so you don't have to mock things up in PS Jul 13 18:53:16 fiferboy: yep, I've played with it :) Jul 13 18:53:32 fiferboy: looked awesome :) But to be fair, GTK has Glade ;) Jul 13 18:54:00 wazd: I could probably find a few dialogs that could use a good UI tweaking Jul 13 18:57:00 fiferboy: he told me that Designer is available even for Windows which is really good Jul 13 18:57:43 wazd: Yep, it works great in Windows Jul 13 18:59:36 fiferboy, does windows qt have all the maemoisms enabled Jul 13 18:59:42 ie does it know about the maemo specific classes Jul 13 19:00:39 lcuk: For my programming I haven't needed to change anything in order to switch between a Windows compile, Linux compile, and Maemo compile Jul 13 19:01:11 you have a bird watching db application dont you Jul 13 19:01:27 Except for some install locations in the pro file, I don't think I use HILDON defs at all Jul 13 19:01:50 lcuk: Yes, using sqlite Jul 13 19:02:37 and does entire thing work nicely and suit being ran wherever, or have you had to make alterations to get it workable in maemo itself Jul 13 19:02:46 ie dialog sizes and locations etc Jul 13 19:03:38 I designed the dialogs to be no bigger than 480x640 so it could run at different resolutions, but gui design has definitely been the biggest challenge Jul 13 19:03:47 or did you write it specifically for maemo in the first place Jul 13 19:04:26 maemo was my primary thought, but it runs equally well in Windows or Linux Jul 13 19:04:37 yeah - you came the right way :) Jul 13 19:04:40 I don't think the UI is hampered much by being designed for a small screen Jul 13 19:04:50 theres 10x more problems trying to squash something down Jul 13 19:04:59 It would DEFINITELY be harder to adapts a desktop app to a NIT Jul 13 19:05:20 * lcuk nods Jul 13 19:06:04 I have all my dialogs contained in a scroll area so when the keyboard pops up you can still view and access all the fields Jul 13 19:06:27 heh, no doubt you made that kinetic too :D Jul 13 19:06:38 does the kb pop, or slide on? Jul 13 19:06:47 At first, but now it is kinetic all on it's own Jul 13 19:07:19 It pops up, same as regular Jul 13 19:07:21 cool Jul 13 19:07:54 It is VERY cool to use the exact same code for three platforms Jul 13 19:08:02 heh im just rebuilding the dialog stuff in lb, for the elements that dont zoom in they need selectable start point Jul 13 19:08:20 qwerty12_N810: vagalume is awesome Jul 13 19:08:27 yeah fiferboy ;) but then again, native c code can be quite cross platform too Jul 13 19:08:35 kkrusty: Agreed. :) Jul 13 19:08:45 qwerty12_N810: thanks for telling me about it Jul 13 19:08:51 Yep, but the GUI portion is usually the toughest Jul 13 19:10:32 the only thing i can see qt cross platform as winning at is symbian/maemo Jul 13 19:10:53 most of the time, you wouldnt really use the same app on desktop as on handheld Jul 13 19:11:52 has qt got multitouch support, or even twotouch that gtk has? Jul 13 19:12:22 lcuk: I think it is being worked on by the qt-kinetic team Jul 13 19:13:18 cool Jul 13 19:13:57 * lcuk has a really nice simple effect in mind Jul 13 19:15:46 Hi Jul 13 19:16:24 fiferboy, did you write your bird app to take otu with you, or just as something to playwith Jul 13 19:17:04 lcuk: I originally wanted something to take along with me, but it is equally useful to look things up later Jul 13 19:17:34 will be better with the next device when you can take a picture directly Jul 13 19:17:56 its a bit crap using n8x0 camera lol Jul 13 19:21:03 Just need to be able to zoom to a 35mm equivalent of 300mm :) Jul 13 19:21:11 where i find documentation for Maemo 5 and QT ? Jul 13 19:22:27 fiferboy, you lost me there lol, not a camera head, but know having one on the back will be better than none ;) Jul 13 19:22:48 I was hoping the back camera would let me do bird photography ;) Jul 13 19:24:11 i like to go to the beach and photograph all the boobys Jul 13 19:24:20 lcuk: Blue-footed? Jul 13 19:24:35 depends if they have flipflops on Jul 13 19:25:21 wow Jul 13 19:25:36 theres actually loads of different kinds of boobys Jul 13 19:26:31 lcuk: *cough* blue tit *cough* Jul 13 19:26:53 dont see many bluetits round here Jul 13 19:26:55 qwerty12_N810: Great Tit Jul 13 19:27:01 when i was on holiday tho, there were loads of great tits Jul 13 19:28:23 "The Great Tit is a popular garden bird due to its acrobatic performances when feeding on nuts" Jul 13 19:29:03 watch out tho, they build their nests within a hole in some wood Jul 13 19:29:42 i darent click the link on wikpedia: Great Tit videos Jul 13 19:29:58 * fiferboy laughs Jul 13 19:30:18 fiferboy, so, your database contains info about each of these: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Birds_of_Europe Jul 13 19:30:30 or is it a worldwide factbook? Jul 13 19:31:11 or is it just entries you have collected and inserted manually Jul 13 19:31:22 There are 10331 species in the database, and 701 different locations to select from Jul 13 19:31:46 i gather you have filtering and searching tools in there Jul 13 19:32:08 I create a list with a suitable location (as specific as possible to limit the number of species) and record sightings Jul 13 19:32:24 Lots of filtering and searching Jul 13 19:32:50 The tablet handles most local database operations pretty well, although a list with 10000 entries will take some time Jul 13 19:32:53 you have been to the 701 locations? or is this an evolving database thats existed BQ (before qt..)( Jul 13 19:33:01 yeah no doubt Jul 13 19:33:22 i found a nice optimization for my lists when i started looking at optimizations Jul 13 19:33:28 <_Mayito_> who can help me to flash my tablet n810 please ? Jul 13 19:33:29 doh Jul 13 19:33:42 _Mayito_, i think theres a really simple wiki page Jul 13 19:33:44 ~flash Jul 13 19:33:45 hmm... flash is For an EEPROM (flash) programmer that can handle any chip except +12V ones, go to http://fly.hiwaay.net/~jfrohwei/circuit/, or a proprietary format for online animations by Macromedia. However "GPL Flash" has now been released @ http://www.swift-tools.com/Flash/, or wget http://www.macromedia.com/software/flashplayer/special/beta/installers/linux/plugin/install_flash_player_6_linux.tar.gz, or ap Jul 13 19:33:46 ~flashing Jul 13 19:33:47 somebody said flashing was http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware Jul 13 19:34:03 (the second one) Jul 13 19:34:10 luck: A global list of locations each with their own species checklist Jul 13 19:34:15 <_Mayito_> lcuk, thank you ... I did it, but I did something wrong ... that is why I need help Jul 13 19:34:41 speak up then, try to be as clear as possible (and concise) and if someone knows they will try to help : Jul 13 19:34:42 ) Jul 13 19:35:13 fiferboy, have you put all 700 locations in Jul 13 19:35:24 I haven't spent much time optimizing yet Jul 13 19:35:27 or did you find the db already populated/convert it from another source? Jul 13 19:35:32 lcuk: Yes, they are all in the database Jul 13 19:35:48 http://avibase.bsc-eoc.org/ Jul 13 19:36:01 _Mayito_: I helps if you explain what the actual problem is. Jul 13 19:36:10 _Mayito_: Instead of saying I need help. Jul 13 19:36:33 <_Mayito_> X-Fade, I am trying to flash my tablet to boot from the external SDCard Jul 13 19:37:12 _Mayito_: Yes? And? Jul 13 19:37:20 <_Mayito_> I did follow the little wiki document web page about how to boot from a flash card Jul 13 19:37:44 <_Mayito_> although ... I did endup flashing the internal card (2Gb) Jul 13 19:38:01 <_Mayito_> and I dont know what I did wrong to be honest Jul 13 19:38:19 <_Mayito_> I just reset from factory my tablet Jul 13 19:38:21 fiferboy, cool, are you planning on integrating with the webservice to push up reports? Jul 13 19:38:28 <_Mayito_> and I dont want to screw up again Jul 13 19:38:55 luck: There is an eBird webservice that records sighting locations and frequencies, but I haven't looked in to integration yet Jul 13 19:39:07 <_Mayito_> x-fade: I already made my partitions in my external SDCard again Jul 13 19:39:27 at least you have something to build towards in future if you desire :) Jul 13 19:39:33 <_Mayito_> x-fade: so, from there I think I will need someone to guide me Jul 13 19:39:34 I would also like to scrape updates from the checklists at avibird, but I haven't looked at that yet either Jul 13 19:40:11 im just interested because having a good fully capable data driven qt app on the devices would be great. it also gives people ideas for other markets and subjects using similar engine Jul 13 19:41:36 have you written it (or attempted) in any other toolkits before? Jul 13 19:41:45 or was this something to get your teeth into on qt specifically Jul 13 19:42:58 When I had my Zaurus I used a locally server MySQL, PHP solution Jul 13 19:43:14 When I first got my N810 I wrote a Gtk, XML solution Jul 13 19:43:21 Now I have my Qt, sqlite solution Jul 13 19:43:53 So javascript/html, c, c++ so far... Jul 13 19:43:59 seems like we all do the same thing :) Jul 13 19:44:05 its kindof your hello world then Jul 13 19:44:29 david has evolved in same way with his shopper, ive done liqbase in anything with a cpu lol Jul 13 19:44:32 Yep. This is the most refined solution so far Jul 13 19:44:46 we all evolve :) Jul 13 19:45:01 That's true Jul 13 19:45:06 i keep wanting to put together pages showing evolution of apps Jul 13 19:45:35 That would be cool. I could contribute screen shots Jul 13 19:46:17 you would show the evolution of your bird app - and what would add is some words about the difficulties and improvements you made and what facilitated them Jul 13 19:46:59 we would need somewhere proper for it, its just something that keeps popping back into my head - one day.. Jul 13 19:47:29 Toolkit selection, data backend selection, primary factor being mobile and portable... Jul 13 19:48:22 well, you have mobile apps in your blood :) Jul 13 19:48:23 fiferboy: simple gtk, sqlite and ready. Jul 13 19:49:10 For some reason I never tried the Gtk/sqlite combination Jul 13 19:49:25 johnsq, i actually think the php solution fiferboy came up with was more novel Jul 13 19:49:39 I felt like there should be some Gtk API to dump a select statement directly into a table display (like there is with Qt) Jul 13 19:49:56 how fast was it rendering wise on the zaurus - did it compare speed wise with maemo desktop apps for instance Jul 13 19:49:59 or was it nowhere near Jul 13 19:50:08 lcuk: I was just going to stick with that, but I couldn't find a decent LAMP stack when I came to Maemo Jul 13 19:50:30 its not just lamp though for local Jul 13 19:50:38 lcuk: I just thought the same http with cgi should be also fine Jul 13 19:50:40 you need a good local html renderer too Jul 13 19:50:48 lcuk: Speed was fine, I never noticed a problem. but I only displayed 30 records per page. Jul 13 19:50:57 johnsq, if you have a hammer, everything is a nail Jul 13 19:51:30 hhh no continuous list Jul 13 19:51:36 thats always my hatred of web Jul 13 19:51:45 but i cant blame them really Jul 13 19:52:14 ^ahhh Jul 13 19:52:21 I used the list for a different purpose, and I am pretty sure I made the "records/page" configurable Jul 13 19:53:06 yeah, but sitll its paged Jul 13 19:53:19 i have had to make same compromise Jul 13 19:53:25 lcuk: Any idea which package section an artificial horizon would fit best into? http://wiki.maemo.org/Task:Package_categories#New_list_for_Diablo Probably one of graphics/navigation/science or utilities? Jul 13 19:53:29 i decided to only show the next 2 years in calendar lol Jul 13 19:53:41 Actually, my father-in-law uses my PHP/MySQL list on his Windows computer Jul 13 19:53:53 I'll have to install my Qt list for him one of these days... Jul 13 19:54:22 jaffa, user/kickasscoolstuff or if thats not there, user/graphics is a high traffic zone for cool stuff Jul 13 19:55:16 jaffa, we dont have /user/techdemo yet Jul 13 19:55:19 what is horizon? Jul 13 19:55:19 but we should Jul 13 19:55:21 screenshots? Jul 13 19:55:34 konttori_: http://bleb.org/software/maemo/horizon.png Jul 13 19:55:53 heh konttori_ perking at the thought of missing something cool Jul 13 19:55:55 konttori_: Little accelerometer playground Jul 13 19:56:15 konttori_ has been playing with the accelerometer as well Jul 13 19:56:27 Jaffa. nice Jul 13 19:56:49 yeah. I just converted ukmp to switch between portrait/landscape with it Jul 13 19:57:07 konttori_: nice Jul 13 19:57:16 * lcuk is waiting for shake to shuffle tracks Jul 13 19:57:31 Hmm... could do. Jul 13 19:57:40 Hmm.. nice idea Jul 13 19:57:48 smack on right side for next track Jul 13 19:57:54 smack to left side for previous Jul 13 19:57:56 hope nokia supply a wrist strap lol Jul 13 19:58:12 make it disablable Jul 13 19:58:21 or joggers wont be able to use it Jul 13 19:58:26 konttori_: and while you walk you hear only clicks Jul 13 19:59:01 theres so many uses for an accelerometer Jul 13 19:59:16 "doofus, hold the camera still, you are trying to take a picture" Jul 13 19:59:18 johnsq: lol. good point Jul 13 19:59:36 hey, any good idea how to get the next and previous button events from bt headset? Jul 13 20:00:06 dont they get mapped by the driver to left/right or something? Jul 13 20:00:20 konttori_: you should get them over input / event -> x11 -> app Jul 13 20:00:38 sure, while it's in foreground Jul 13 20:00:43 how about when it's not? Jul 13 20:00:48 global hotkey Jul 13 20:01:06 ? Jul 13 20:01:57 http://www.google.co.uk/#hl=en&q=x11+global+hotkey&fp=WFTqpVMKRTw Jul 13 20:03:19 thanks. I'll need X11 packages now for python. Jul 13 20:03:54 http://jaredforsyth.com/content/linux-global-hotkeys Jul 13 20:21:11 By the way, what is the way to get to task switcher from an application? Jul 13 20:21:32 As in, I have a button in ukmp that I want to use to get the user back to switcher. Jul 13 20:21:56 we don't know much about task switching in fremantle yet :P Jul 13 20:22:01 usually we use home button Jul 13 20:22:06 oh. Jul 13 20:24:35 If this was diablo... "dbus-send --type=signal --system /com/nokia/mce/signal com.nokia.mce.signal.sig_home_key_pressed_ind" Jul 13 20:35:30 hm Jul 13 20:52:42 wtf Jul 13 20:52:53 do i have to do something special in order to browse the web over a vpn? Jul 13 20:52:58 i can seem to do everything but that Jul 13 20:53:00 it kind of sucks Jul 13 20:54:03 Macer, there shouldn't be any problems browsing the web - can you ping/telnet internet servers? Jul 13 20:55:12 yeah Jul 13 20:55:14 it's not a dns thing Jul 13 20:55:20 oh wait... Jul 13 20:55:37 oh.. i guess not Jul 13 20:55:48 wtf... is it not using a gateway or something? :( Jul 13 20:56:04 Request timed out. Jul 13 20:56:10 but i can use my internal network Jul 13 20:56:18 like the smb stuff and everything works Jul 13 20:56:28 and it is gettign ip numbers off the local dns Jul 13 20:56:31 So you can get out to the internet using ping? I'm not clear on your situation Jul 13 20:57:50 no i can't Jul 13 20:58:00 192.168.1.255 255.255.255.255 192.168.1.201 192.168.1.201 50 Jul 13 20:58:08 wtf.. it is using itself as a gateway Jul 13 20:58:39 how the hell do i change that? :) i want it to use 192.168.1.1 and can't find an option under the vpn connection to change the gateway Jul 13 20:59:46 what does `route` give you? Jul 13 20:59:57 that is what route gives me Jul 13 21:00:07 and it is using the default gateway of 192.168.1.201 Jul 13 21:00:10 which is the ip of the client Jul 13 21:00:22 when i need it to use 192.168.1.1 Jul 13 21:02:31 Woohoo! fiferboy's fixed the flickering bug. Jul 13 21:02:55 well, you can add a new route with the correct gateway, but you might want to find somebody who better knows how to do that to advise you. Jul 13 21:03:01 It's a workaround, and won't completely fix it, but in most cases it simply skips Input Method code on things that can't accept input from an IM. Jul 13 21:03:11 So for tables and dropdowns it works great. Jul 13 21:03:37 coldboot: sounds good Jul 13 21:03:51 It also sounds like we need to fix HIM Jul 13 21:04:42 Yeah Jul 13 21:04:50 I couldn't get the setProxy() idea working. Jul 13 21:05:06 It simply doesn't forward text to a text field, similar problem I had before. Jul 13 21:05:07 coldboot: do you have a branch though? Jul 13 21:05:37 lbt: I have been working in the 4.5.0-maemo2 subversion repo, since we're using that at my office. Jul 13 21:05:48 lbt: I'll make a branch on the main one soon. I've saved my code. Jul 13 21:06:16 I've been caught up so not had chance to look - if you could do a personal gitorious repo clone and make a branch there Jul 13 21:06:40 git (and gitk) makes this so nice Jul 13 21:06:51 have you looked at git-svn too Jul 13 21:07:00 I haven't played with it yet. Jul 13 21:07:25 bidirectional git<>svn.... I've found a few people use it when they have svn repos Jul 13 21:07:58 However, the fix is one line: void QHildonInputContext::sendHildonCommand(/*...*/) { if (!canUseIM(widget)) { return; } /* ... */ } Jul 13 21:08:05 Is there irssi for maemo? Jul 13 21:08:20 lbt: I no longer use SVN. If I have to interact with it, I use git-svn to do so Jul 13 21:09:07 erik___: we'll get coldboot onto it with patience... (and maybe an intervention!) Jul 13 21:09:28 coldboot: how heavy is canUseIM(widget) Jul 13 21:09:34 lbt: Oh don't worry, I'm already a git convert. Jul 13 21:09:51 lbt: I don't know, actually, it seems to run just fine on our slowass program on the tablet. Jul 13 21:09:54 ah, I thought you were having probs the other night Jul 13 21:10:16 maybe it was fiferboy though - buried in the backlog Jul 13 21:10:30 Yeah it was him, I actually went outside all weekend. Jul 13 21:10:40 sensible Jul 13 21:11:24 lbt: canUseIM has two qobject_cast<> calls in it... Jul 13 21:11:51 lbt: And two inputMethodQuery() calls... Jul 13 21:12:48 lbt: I can refactor it to make it faster. Jul 13 21:12:51 lbt: ping Jul 13 21:13:09 dl9pf: hi... I read your explanation Jul 13 21:13:19 coldboot: I think that would be welcome Jul 13 21:13:43 lbt: Is there a way to see if something is a QLineEdit, QTextEdit, and QPlainTextEdit without casting? Also, what kind of cast is a qobject_cast? Jul 13 21:14:30 http://doc.trolltech.com/4.5/qmetaobject.html#className Jul 13 21:14:44 well Jul 13 21:14:52 the problem is that for some reason or another xp is not using the right gateway Jul 13 21:16:22 coldboot: http://doc.trolltech.com/4.5/qobject.html#inherits Consider using qobject_cast(object) instead. The method is both faster and safer. Jul 13 21:17:54 the nice thing is that the code is so readable... I love that about Qt; I always felt I was lost in twisty passages with "the other one" Jul 13 21:18:21 lbt: Yeah it's pretty well put together. And the documentation is some of the best I've ever seen. Jul 13 21:18:39 you're not a perl coder then :) Jul 13 21:19:51 "the other one" makes it sound like its the only competition - how clean does it look in comparison to coding for iphone? Jul 13 21:19:52 lbt: Some of the best, the Perl documentation is better. Jul 13 21:20:40 That sucks that Q*Edit don't multiply-inherit from some editable thing... Jul 13 21:20:49 lcuk: I have never seen windows C/C++ code either (and VB doesn't count as code ;) ) Jul 13 21:21:09 MFC was a mess. Jul 13 21:21:12 coldboot: yes, there are some inheritance things I wonder about Jul 13 21:21:12 its as much code as python or php or java ;) Jul 13 21:21:16 mfs was horrible Jul 13 21:21:23 its the reason i chose vb over anything Jul 13 21:21:24 c Jul 13 21:21:55 I wrote a RISK and Axis and Allies simulator in VB as my first ever program. Jul 13 21:22:00 It was really handy for a kid. Jul 13 21:22:53 omfg this is going to drive me nutty Jul 13 21:37:01 SOLET Jul 13 21:37:05 wrong window Jul 13 21:41:14 Il fais bon. Jul 13 21:41:34 beau Jul 13 21:43:19 yeah it's the comcast router Jul 13 21:43:24 for some reason it won't let me set the gateway Jul 13 21:43:27 and i don't know why Jul 13 21:59:46 <_hc> so I am running an n810 with Diablo and the RTCOMM update and it seems that default email client won't show my IMAP folders, only the inbox. It did orginally, but no more. I can create an imap folder fine, and then I can see that. Jul 13 22:00:00 <_hc> I've been searching around a bunch but haven't found any leads Jul 13 22:43:19 fg Jul 13 22:43:21 bah Jul 13 22:47:20 <_hc> anyone using OTR encryption with RTCOMM? Jul 13 22:59:26 https://monteledwards.com/extra/christel-abuse.html Jul 14 00:21:16 _hc, is OTR with rtcomm possible? because there is an open bug report about it Jul 14 00:22:54 <_hc> andre__: ah right, there is an upstream bug report with Telepathy about it: http://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=16891 Jul 14 00:23:05 yeah Jul 14 00:38:05 wasn't the Rover supposed to come in July? how come I find no ETA? Jul 14 00:39:22 andre__, _hc: we much prefer to implement an open standard for encryption like the XMPP extensions, than to try and hack encryption onto closed protocols with OTR Jul 14 00:39:53 it doesn't make much sense to me at least to go to such effort to send encrypted content over a proprietary network, when to use OTR you need an open client in the first place Jul 14 00:40:11 so we'll do XMPP encryption before we do OTR, but we've not got time to work on either at the moment Jul 14 00:40:26 we're happy to discuss how to approach it with people who are interested however Jul 14 00:41:48 Why not simply implement a plugin architecture and let someone else implement OTR? Jul 14 00:41:56 "unsupported" Jul 14 00:46:09 telepathy is already a component architecture Jul 14 00:46:19 we've explained how we'd add otr into it Jul 14 00:46:47 nobody who knows/cares enough has done it yet Jul 14 01:37:56 Helo Jul 14 01:39:37 Can someone possibly help me set up my n810's microphone to go thought the speakers/stereo jack so that I can use it as a microphone for my laptop. Jul 14 01:54:11 howdy Jul 14 01:54:26 is this the irc channel for the nokia n810? Jul 14 01:56:12 esaym: yes Jul 14 01:56:30 as well as 770, N800, N900, and N915 Jul 14 02:03:33 Luke-Jr: you look familiar ???? Jul 14 02:04:07 esaym: #Jesus Jul 14 02:04:10 ;) Jul 14 02:04:48 Luke-Jr: what are the price ranges for the 9xx series? Jul 14 02:04:54 esaym: good question Jul 14 02:04:59 hmm Jul 14 02:05:40 I was hearing stuff like $700... Jul 14 02:06:15 esaym: at that price it had better be a lot better than N810 Jul 14 02:06:19 and actually open Jul 14 02:06:37 anyway, my question... I am wondering about how functional the xterminal is on the 810? I have some console/text apps that I want to run on it... Jul 14 02:06:56 Luke-Jr: apparently the 9xx series is going to be some kind of gsm phone? Jul 14 02:06:58 esaym: honestly, raw console mode is all I've found to work well Jul 14 02:07:18 Luke-Jr: what is "raw console mode" Jul 14 02:07:30 Luke-Jr: outside of X? Jul 14 02:08:14 esaym: yes Jul 14 02:08:26 esaym: KDE doesn't run too well Jul 14 02:08:30 hmm Jul 14 02:08:41 I don't plan on using kde Jul 14 02:08:58 IIRC, slono said GNOME is even worse Jul 14 02:09:04 which is to be expected, as GNOME sucks :þ Jul 14 02:09:07 I just need a small device to put my console software one Jul 14 02:09:09 on* Jul 14 02:09:20 it is for taking notes in church and bible studies Jul 14 02:09:26 I see. Jul 14 02:09:36 I wouldn't want to do a ton of typing on N810 either Jul 14 02:09:49 esaym: might see what you can pickup a Zaurus for Jul 14 02:10:04 I could do a gui for it but I don't know if it would be worth the trouble Jul 14 02:10:26 Zaurii only have 64 MB RAM, but they have a nice keyboard Jul 14 02:10:26 Luke-Jr: yes I looked at the zaurus, several of them Jul 14 02:10:29 the clamshell models anyhow Jul 14 02:10:38 the N810's keyboard kinda sucks Jul 14 02:10:54 Luke-Jr: no wifi, not sure if that would be good for me Jul 14 02:11:02 ah Jul 14 02:11:06 I have a CompactFlash wifi card Jul 14 02:11:08 ☺ Jul 14 02:11:14 Can someone help me set my n810 up so that what the microphone picks up is then sent through the speakers/stereo jack so that I can use it as a line in on my computer? Jul 14 02:11:16 I could do without Jul 14 02:11:17 but what good is wifi w/o GUI? Jul 14 02:11:53 Luke-Jr: well I didn't plan on not using a gui Jul 14 02:12:03 My app won't have a gui Jul 14 02:12:03 I see. Jul 14 02:12:17 so I can either use the xterminal or the raw terminal like you said Jul 14 02:12:24 what is wrong with the xterminal? Jul 14 02:12:39 esaym: nothing, but the GUI in general sucks Jul 14 02:12:44 are the keys on the 810 just too small or flat? Jul 14 02:12:57 the only thing I have found tolerable is KDE, and 128 MB RAM doesn't cut the bill Jul 14 02:12:59 oh...hmm. What is wrong with it? Jul 14 02:13:02 esaym: too flat I guess Jul 14 02:13:10 bad feedback Jul 14 02:13:14 too easy to hit the wrong key, etc Jul 14 02:13:22 yea Jul 14 02:13:25 also, no number keys Jul 14 02:13:41 numbers are useful :/ Jul 14 02:13:46 oh, is there like a fn key for the numbers? Jul 14 02:15:03 ok I see a good pic of the keyboard now... Jul 14 02:17:14 hmm Jul 14 02:17:45 Luke-Jr: what all don't you like about the standard os2008 that is comes with? Too slow or something? Jul 14 02:19:06 esaym: unmaintained, poor design, etc Jul 14 02:19:36 hmm that sucks Jul 14 02:19:47 unmaintained? Jul 14 02:19:52 yeah, unmaintained Jul 14 02:19:58 full of bugs or something? Jul 14 02:20:23 not overly usable Jul 14 02:21:00 Luke-Jr: hmm sounds like you really don't like this thing... Jul 14 02:21:22 esaym: I wouldn't have bought it if I knew what I know now. Jul 14 02:21:37 Luke-Jr: do you want to sell it? rofl Jul 14 02:21:42 one of the major features I bought it for was the GPS, which might as well not exist Jul 14 02:21:55 esaym: no, I can't find a suitable alternative either :? Jul 14 02:21:56 Luke-Jr: yea I read that it was slow Jul 14 02:21:57 :/ Jul 14 02:22:00 not just slow Jul 14 02:22:04 undocumented Jul 14 02:22:09 proprietary blob driver Jul 14 02:22:11 full of bugs Jul 14 02:22:16 :-/ Jul 14 02:22:26 hmm Jul 14 02:22:49 really, I wish I could get its features in a Zaurus clamshell with open docs Jul 14 02:23:00 *that* would be usable Jul 14 02:23:37 Well I have been looking for 2 days on the net for something that I can carry around in my pocket, that will let me make my own console app for taking bible notes Jul 14 02:23:54 I am going to do with the 810 unless you can think of anything else better and not over $300 Jul 14 02:24:07 really $250 is more than I wanted to spend... Jul 14 02:24:37 $200 you mean Jul 14 02:24:55 all pda's today don't really let you install software and are like $500+ Jul 14 02:25:11 esaym: if all you want is console, I'm sure the N810 can pull it off-- exception only to the sucky keyboard Jul 14 02:25:12 Luke-Jr: yes $200 would be nice... Jul 14 02:25:23 if you don't care for wifi, a clamshell Z would probably be better Jul 14 02:25:38 esaym: I wouldn't pay over $200 for a N810. Jul 14 02:26:07 well, I wouldn't pay over $25, but not over $200 in any circumstances :P Jul 14 02:26:27 Luke-Jr: seems the 810 seems to be in slow production and the online prices have gone through the roof. Just last month they were going for $210 or so, not they are like $280. They are $220 on nokia.com but they are backordered.. Jul 14 02:26:57 esaym: N810 is out of production in prep for N900 I think Jul 14 02:27:04 ebay should have decent prices Jul 14 02:27:30 also, you'll need a decent size SD card (4 GB min, 8 GB ideal) if you want to run Gentoo ;) Jul 14 02:27:40 Luke-Jr: I really won't mind buying a new one, just to support nokia (for their excellnet product you know) Jul 14 02:28:08 I would hate to see nokia give up on these devices... Jul 14 02:28:40 As you said, there really is no alternative... Jul 14 02:28:55 everyone making chessy pda's and closing them up Jul 14 02:29:02 esaym: from my perspective, Nokia isn't a company deserving support yet Jul 14 02:29:22 at least not that department ☺ Jul 14 02:29:38 These would be cool if they weren't all closed up: http://www.zipitwireless.com/ Jul 14 02:29:49 actually Jul 14 02:32:17 esaym: probably can find something more appropriate if you look enough, I would hope Jul 14 02:32:24 maybe not shipping with Linux, but easily supported Jul 14 02:32:43 I looked Jul 14 02:34:23 I doubt there's anything as far along as the N810 in that form factor that has a more open, more complete linux install available Jul 14 02:34:51 look for devices based on the S3C6410 chip Jul 14 02:35:00 full spec docs are leaked to the community for that Jul 14 02:35:22 so that's the smart q5 and q7, yes? Jul 14 02:35:30 yeah, but those don't have keyboards Jul 14 02:35:46 no keyboard, no warranty in the US+EU, and pretty questionable construction Jul 14 02:35:49 but the price is right for sure Jul 14 02:35:55 OpenMoko too I think Jul 14 02:36:09 too as in "also doesn't have a keyboard"? :) Jul 14 02:36:13 johnx: his problem is keyboard ☺ Jul 14 02:36:22 otherwise N810 would probably be fine Jul 14 02:36:35 Hi, johnx. Jul 14 02:36:58 allo GeneralAntilles Jul 14 02:37:03 how's the weather? Jul 14 02:37:40 The Zaurus keyboard is nice, and if you aren't using it for X11 or web browsing I could highly recommend almost any of them Jul 14 02:37:48 Hot and rainy. Jul 14 02:37:54 every last one has a better keyboard for console stuff than the N810 Jul 14 02:37:54 How's life on the other coast? Jul 14 02:38:12 GeneralAntilles, gorgeous weather overall, but today was cloudy and coolish Jul 14 02:48:46 hmm, yea I don't know what to do Jul 14 02:49:30 so how is os2008 unmaintained? Did nokia move devlopers off of it or something? **** ENDING LOGGING AT Tue Jul 14 02:59:57 2009