**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Fri Oct 09 03:00:00 2009
Oct 09 03:26:34 <zerojay> GAN800: http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3514/3994767226_9716c01e08.jpg
Oct 09 03:26:36 <zerojay> :D
Oct 09 03:31:30 <GeneralAntilles> Woo
Oct 09 03:31:40 <GeneralAntilles> Making it a set was a good plan.
Oct 09 03:32:12 <zerojay> Yeah, I think so. :)
Oct 09 03:32:25 <zerojay> Lemme up it somewhere fast.
Oct 09 03:32:36 <GeneralAntilles> Damn autobuilder. :(
Oct 09 03:33:32 <zerojay> Does it really have to be built to get into Extras?
Oct 09 03:33:55 <GeneralAntilles> Well, you COULD dput it to non-free
Oct 09 03:34:00 <GeneralAntilles> But free has to go through the builder.
Oct 09 03:34:04 <GeneralAntilles> We need sources. ;)
Oct 09 03:35:14 <zerojay> Well... I'm not sure there's any to give, honestly. lol
Oct 09 03:35:38 <zerojay> The deb was pretty much created by hand.
Oct 09 03:36:05 <zerojay> Since I couldn't really use any .deb creation shit on my PC for a million reasons.
Oct 09 03:36:17 <zerojay> And scratchbox suddenly stopped working even though I haven't touched it in weeks.
Oct 09 03:39:50 <GeneralAntilles> lol
Oct 09 03:40:44 <zerojay> http://zerojay.com/misc/classic-gaming-wallpapers_1.1-1maemo0.deb if anyone's interested. :)
Oct 09 03:43:46 * GeneralAntilles loves his Quake terminal.
Oct 09 03:44:18 <zerojay> Hell yeah. amazing how useful it is. Surprised no one thought of it before.
Oct 09 03:45:34 * GeneralAntilles goes with Donkey Kong Country.
Oct 09 03:45:44 <GeneralAntilles> I don't even want to think about how many hours of that game I plaid.
Oct 09 03:45:51 <GeneralAntilles> s/plaid/played/
Oct 09 03:45:51 <infobot> GeneralAntilles meant: I don't even want to think about how many hours of that game I played.
Oct 09 03:47:31 <GeneralAntilles> Ah, that's beautific.
Oct 09 03:48:45 <zerojay> It's really gorgeous on the N900 screen. Every little detail pops. You can still see a seam.. hopefully I can fix it tomorrow.
Oct 09 03:49:35 <GeneralAntilles> Looks really awesome with parallax.
Oct 09 03:50:21 <zerojay> I love how the color fades to blue at the top perfectly with the status bar.
Oct 09 03:50:25 <zerojay> Which wasn't planned.
Oct 09 03:50:35 <GeneralAntilles> Yeah, it looks planned.
Oct 09 03:50:40 <GeneralAntilles> Perfect
Oct 09 03:50:46 <doc|home> zerojay: how did you get one?
Oct 09 03:50:53 <zerojay> doc|home: Get one what?
Oct 09 03:51:00 <doc|home> an n900
Oct 09 03:52:00 <zerojay> doc|home: Two years of voluntarily giving my time to helping people, bug testing packages and setting up things for tablet owners. You?
Oct 09 03:52:20 <doc|home> zerojay: was the attitude really necessary?
Oct 09 03:52:50 <zerojay> doc|home: There's no attitude in my words. Just telling you the truth.
Oct 09 03:53:27 <GeneralAntilles> doc|home, it's a long hard road. ;)
Oct 09 03:53:27 <zerojay> It didn't simply fall into my lap. Nokia sent me one to help get software ready for launch.
Oct 09 03:53:51 <zerojay> doc|home: And really, no offense intended.
Oct 09 03:54:22 <doc|home> GeneralAntilles: I'm not arguing that for a second. But asking how a person in Canada got one, possibly bought, in the hope that maybe I could learn how I could buy one doesn't seem like it deserves a response that seemed not very ... nice
Oct 09 03:55:42 <zerojay> doc|home: Wasn't bought. They're still not available to the public yet. If my answer was crass... sorry. I'm getting quite a few people asking me how I got mine daily. lol
Oct 09 03:55:55 <doc|home> ok
Oct 09 03:56:03 <GeneralAntilles> Haha
Oct 09 03:56:05 * GeneralAntilles isn't.
Oct 09 03:56:10 <GeneralAntilles> Clearly they believe me more deserving than you. :P
Oct 09 03:56:17 <zerojay> Clearly. lol
Oct 09 03:56:54 <zerojay> I got interogated by some French dude over IM yesterday over it.
Oct 09 03:56:59 <doc|home> sadly, every fido/rogers rep I talk to says something along the lines of "never going to happen" when I ask about the n900 "
Oct 09 03:57:02 <doc|home> :(
Oct 09 03:57:20 <zerojay> doc|home: I'm using mine on Rogers. Getting EDGE at best kind of sucks.
Oct 09 03:57:28 <doc|home> zerojay: yep :/
Oct 09 03:57:34 <GeneralAntilles> Indeed. :(
Oct 09 03:57:42 * GeneralAntilles doesn't know what Nokia was thinking.
Oct 09 03:58:04 <zerojay> This French guy was all over me going "how the fuck did you get yours? Why don't I have mine, blah blah blah..."
Oct 09 03:58:11 <doc|home> they say it more because it's a high end phone, not because of the network
Oct 09 03:58:15 <zerojay> So I thought he preordered.
Oct 09 03:58:23 <zerojay> And was still waiting.
Oct 09 03:58:26 <doc|home> like, the fido guy literally said "they're idiots"
Oct 09 03:58:53 <zerojay> But NO... he had a huge sense of entitlement... "if you got one given to you, I should have one given to me too".
Oct 09 03:58:59 <doc|home> heh
Oct 09 03:59:09 <GeneralAntilles> Ah, ah "journalist", then? :P
Oct 09 03:59:09 <zerojay> Yeah... okay buddy. You hadn't even heard of Maemo before yesterday.
Oct 09 03:59:55 <zerojay> GeneralAntilles: I wish I knew. He ended up sending me harassing IMs for the next 4 hours.
Oct 09 03:59:58 <zerojay> Pure comedy gold.
Oct 09 04:00:12 <GeneralAntilles> freejazz from Bugzilla is still my favorite.
Oct 09 04:00:23 <zerojay> And just when he stopped for 10 minutes, I simply said "lol" once and he went back typing for another 2 hours.
Oct 09 04:01:07 <zerojay> It was wonderful. My n900 was like a box of goodies giving me a new line to smile and laugh about all day long.
Oct 09 04:01:52 * zerojay starts looking at Aladdin and Final Fight.... hmm...
Oct 09 04:02:20 * GeneralAntilles chuckles reading old emails.
Oct 09 04:02:47 <GeneralAntilles> Ah, Andre cleaned it out. Too bad http://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=3683
Oct 09 04:03:41 <GeneralAntilles> I think he's had 3 accounts closed on b.m.o now.
Oct 09 04:03:47 <GeneralAntilles> Andre is more forgiving than I. ;)
Oct 09 04:04:19 <zerojay> Hahaha
Oct 09 04:06:47 <GeneralAntilles> and the redacted replies: http://pastebin.com/d46300a68
Oct 09 04:06:48 <GeneralAntilles> Fun guy.
Oct 09 04:08:59 <microlith> I can only imagine he's a riot in person...
Oct 09 04:10:00 <GeneralAntilles> He signed up for the 2008 Summit but never showed.
Oct 09 04:17:15 <zerojay> Are you fucking serious? lol
Oct 09 04:18:55 <GeneralAntilles> Karel did, too.
Oct 09 04:19:10 <GeneralAntilles> sjgadsby has some pictures of their nametags on Flickr.
Oct 09 04:20:58 <zerojay> What happened to him anyways? Finally run off to Pandora?
Oct 09 04:23:21 <GeneralAntilles> No, he hates Pandora too.
Oct 09 04:23:24 <GeneralAntilles> Dunno where he ended up.
Oct 09 04:24:02 <zerojay> He hates it too now? Wow... I remember that was his baby.
Oct 09 04:24:15 <GeneralAntilles> Yeah
Oct 09 04:38:37 <zerojay> Oh wow.
Oct 09 04:40:03 <zerojay> GeneralAntilles: http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2500/3994142751_56e437d684.jpg - Cave of Wonders from Aladdin.
Oct 09 04:40:39 <GeneralAntilles> lol
Oct 09 04:41:19 <zerojay> Poor fiferboy's getting more facetime in my previews than he's probably had in his life. ;)
Oct 09 04:42:08 <GeneralAntilles> Ha
Oct 09 04:56:22 <user__> any good way for lock and delock second panel on the statut bar ?
Oct 09 04:58:26 <ArtVanda1ae> Hm... I wonder if Ubuntu's "integration" of Android into Linux will eventually make its way into Maemo. It definitely wouldn't hurt to have all those Android apps available to the platform.
Oct 09 04:59:36 <GeneralAntilles> Oooh, Big Lebowski in HD on Netflix.
Oct 09 05:20:40 <Macer> wow Stskeeps
Oct 09 05:20:46 <Macer> you weren't kidding with the network manager plague
Oct 09 05:20:48 <Macer> all of them suck :)
Oct 09 05:25:27 <ArtVanda1ae> yeah :(
Oct 09 06:01:00 <sulx> bleh...got HW related problem during installing nokia-binaries and now /var/lib/dpkg/status is full of garbage and dpkg --configure -a gives parse error...suggestions how to fix/reset things?
Oct 09 06:14:25 <Stskeeps> morning
Oct 09 06:18:12 <Stskeeps> morn wazd
Oct 09 06:18:27 <wazd> Stskeeps: heya
Oct 09 06:18:37 <wazd> hey all
Oct 09 06:20:24 <Stskeeps> how is stuff? amsterdam seems to have okay weather today
Oct 09 06:25:09 <wazd> Stskeeps: looks like all good weather is in Amsterdam now :)
Oct 09 06:26:28 <wazd> Stskeeps: what's up with that devices slide, should I do it?
Oct 09 06:30:08 <Stskeeps> too late to change now sadly
Oct 09 06:30:15 <Stskeeps> no laptop here
Oct 09 06:30:27 <wazd> Stskeeps: damn
Oct 09 06:31:01 <wazd> Stskeeps: send it to me - I'll edit :P
Oct 09 06:32:36 <Stskeeps> hehe.. slides on a usb stick somewhere and no usb host
Oct 09 06:32:47 <Macer> man does this touchbook os need some damn work :)
Oct 09 06:32:55 <Macer> Stskeeps: make a mer for a touchbook
Oct 09 06:32:56 <Macer> heh
Oct 09 06:33:15 <wazd> Stskeeps: damn, that suck :D
Oct 09 06:33:20 <Macer> i'd order you one but by the time you get it the touchbook5 would be out
Oct 09 06:33:28 <Macer> and the n980
Oct 09 06:33:37 <wazd> Stskeeps: I'm sure there is someone with a laptop there
Oct 09 06:33:59 <wazd> Stskeeps: you can kill him and steal it!
Oct 09 06:34:31 <Stskeeps> Macer: told you, i think
Oct 09 06:34:42 <Corsac> ahaha I love the “return the phone to make it silent” stuff
Oct 09 06:35:06 <wazd> Corsac: this idea is kinda 3 yo :)
Oct 09 06:35:11 <Corsac> oh :(
Oct 09 06:35:16 <Macer> ?
Oct 09 06:35:23 <wazd> Corsac: fitst it was an app for n95
Oct 09 06:35:28 <Corsac> Macer: http://www.youtube.com/maemo5uiteam#p/u/0/3eZu3nku2uM
Oct 09 06:35:47 <wazd> Corsac: well, first time I saw it in action
Oct 09 06:35:47 <Macer> no flash on touchbook yet
Oct 09 06:35:48 <Macer> :)
Oct 09 06:36:00 <Corsac> Macer: but you should have a download stuff for youtube
Oct 09 06:37:03 <Macer> Corsac: yeah?
Oct 09 06:37:51 <Corsac> yeah
Oct 09 06:37:53 <wazd> Macer: use Greasemonkey, Luke ;)
Oct 09 06:37:58 <Corsac> don't know how to use it though
Oct 09 06:38:04 <Corsac> but if you send me your TB I'll know
Oct 09 06:38:19 <wazd> greasemonkey + userscripts.org
Oct 09 06:42:18 <tigert> use a bookmarklet
Oct 09 06:42:31 <tigert> works fine on n900 too
Oct 09 06:42:55 <tigert> javascript:if(document.location.href.match(/http:\/\/[a-zA-Z\.]*youtube\.com\/watch/)){document.location.href='http://www.youtube.com/get_video?fmt='+(isHDAvailable?'22':'18')+'&video_id='+swfArgs['video_id']+'&t='+swfArgs['t']}
Oct 09 06:43:11 <tigert> bookmark that
Oct 09 06:43:40 <tigert> and select the bookmark when on the youtube page
Oct 09 06:54:08 <wazd> http://my-symbian.com/other/grafika/n900_6.jpg <- hihihi
Oct 09 06:57:54 <tru> anyone done any qt development on maemo5? is it qt4.5 or qt4.6 that is available in the sdk? I would like to work with the animation framework.
Oct 09 06:58:13 <adeus> 4.5.3
Oct 09 06:58:13 <ensi> tru: qt is available
Oct 09 06:58:29 <tru> adeus: to bad :/
Oct 09 06:58:59 <adeus> you can compile 4.6 to it if you want
Oct 09 06:59:25 <Shapeshifter> "HildonSetPasswordDialog is deprecated and should not be used in newly-written code." So, what should I do instead. I don't see how hildon_entry can obfuscate what one is typing...
Oct 09 06:59:47 <tru> of course, but it seems like nokia have patched the included qt to handle hildon. if I compile it myself will all that be included?
Oct 09 07:00:16 <adeus> if think there's a 4.6 branch for maemo
Oct 09 07:00:31 <kimitake> tru: not yet
Oct 09 07:00:48 <kimitake> now I'm working for 4.6 of diablo
Oct 09 07:01:48 <tru> Ok.
Oct 09 07:02:13 <adeus> I'm guessing it won't have any hildon stuff in it?
Oct 09 07:03:05 <tru> Should I consider using Qt on Maemo at all btw? I prefer Qt over GTK+, but I don't want to waste my time writing it with something that is not going to work fine.
Oct 09 07:03:30 <adeus> Qt works just fine
Oct 09 07:03:41 <adeus> and the next Maemo is Qt
Oct 09 07:04:40 <tru> very hard to find documentation for Qt on Maemo though, or rather, I couldn't find it.
Oct 09 07:05:30 <kimitake> how about http://wiki.maemo.org/Qt4Hildon ?
Oct 09 07:06:29 <tru> alright. thanks
Oct 09 07:06:41 <kimitake> and http://wiki.maemo.org/Qt4_Hildon/Qt_Hildon_Widgets for Maemo 5
Oct 09 07:08:17 <tru> kimitake: and Qt4.6 will be available for maemo later? I really think I could do some really nice UI's for maemo with the animation framework.
Oct 09 07:10:20 <kimitake> at least, there are some Hildon patch for 4.5 now, so I'm merging them to 4.6-stable based and I will release diablo pkg first
Oct 09 07:10:36 <kimitake> Nokia guys work for fremantle
Oct 09 07:11:15 <tru> oh ok.
Oct 09 07:18:25 <Myrtti> Stskeeps: poing?
Oct 09 07:18:35 <johnx> hey Myrtti :)
Oct 09 07:19:25 <rm_you> hey Myrtti
Oct 09 07:19:30 <rm_you> hey johnx
Oct 09 07:27:51 <Shapeshifter> if I want to save a password in my app, or other settings, where do I put them? gconf? And does someone know a nice tutorial for gconf on maemo? The API introduction alone isn't really enough.
Oct 09 07:28:41 <johnx> I'd think a gconf is pretty much the same on maemo as on gnome
Oct 09 07:32:02 <Myrtti> ohai johnx, rm_you
Oct 09 07:34:15 <Shapeshifter> and I would just save the password in cleartext in gconf?
Oct 09 07:34:22 <Shapeshifter> do apps usually do that?
Oct 09 07:35:40 <tigert> depends
Oct 09 07:38:24 <johnx> Shapeshifter: depends on the value of the password and whether you want to keep it from other people who have local access to the device.
Oct 09 07:38:46 <johnx> the next step up is using some type of "keychain" (like the gnome keychain) but I don't know if that's available on maemo
Oct 09 07:38:57 <johnx> seems like a useful thing to port though..
Oct 09 07:40:03 <Hoxzer> Wondering if it is possible to make a phone call over bluetooth with N770 - N810 devices ?
Oct 09 07:40:37 <Shapeshifter> johnx: yeah I was thinking of that. but well, a phone usually is not shared with other people
Oct 09 07:44:19 <jsmanrique> hi!
Oct 09 07:45:21 <ototo> Good morning from Amsterdam. The event is about to begin in 15 mins. :)
Oct 09 07:45:49 <johnx> ototo: headed there now
Oct 09 07:46:19 <Shapeshifter> now I'm looking at http://wiki.forum.nokia.com/index.php/Maemo:_Using_GConf and there's this example gconf_client_set_int(gconfClient, GCONF_DIR "mykey", value, NULL). Now, "mykey" is the path in the gconf tree? so, for my app, the path would need to be "/apps/myapp", so that it is in /apps, or does gconf do that by itself?
Oct 09 07:47:03 <aSIMULAtor> morning
Oct 09 07:47:04 <tru> kimitake: this just hit the net: http://labs.trolltech.com/blogs/2009/10/09/qt-on-the-n900/
Oct 09 07:47:11 <aSIMULAtor> OMG HAI
Oct 09 07:47:20 <aSIMULAtor> are we all ircing sitting in the N900 conference room? :P
Oct 09 07:48:16 <Macer> haha
Oct 09 07:48:46 <jsmanrique> something has changed from last year if Peter is wearing a jacket
Oct 09 07:49:13 <jsmanrique> good morning from Gijon (Asturias/Spain) :D
Oct 09 07:49:24 <Macer> blah. going to go do stuff... night
Oct 09 07:49:26 <ototo> :)
Oct 09 07:49:47 <wazd> Just for the mote, I hate you all in Amsterdam :D
Oct 09 07:49:59 <wazd> s/mote/note/
Oct 09 07:49:59 <infobot> wazd meant: Just for the note, I hate you all in Amsterdam :D
Oct 09 07:50:58 <ototo> Don't please - someone will have to record and report all the stuff happening here for you :)
Oct 09 07:51:52 <wazd> My Jabber contacts are all offline - Summit time :)
Oct 09 07:53:36 <wazd> let's gamble!
Oct 09 07:53:58 <wazd> I bet skyp guy will announce that n900 will be the fist phone to support skype video call
Oct 09 07:55:34 <mavhc> no other phone does that yet? weird
Oct 09 07:56:09 <wazd> mavhc: skype video codec is really CPU hungry
Oct 09 07:56:36 <wazd> mavhc: and I think the only phone with OMAP3 and front camera is n900 :)
Oct 09 07:58:04 <ototo> wazd: Would be nice to hear that :)
Oct 09 07:59:28 <ototo> Somewhone has set up a webcam looking at the stage on teh first row :)
Oct 09 07:59:40 <jsmanrique> anyboyd using Qik for summit video streaming?
Oct 09 07:59:43 <Stskeeps> Myrtti: pong
Oct 09 07:59:50 <Myrtti> Stskeeps: you've met Pasi, right?
Oct 09 08:00:27 <Stskeeps> yes, three times now and once in bar yesterday
Oct 09 08:00:54 <Myrtti> Stskeeps: would you mind being a fairy godfather and making sure lcuk meets him? I'll buy you a beer
Oct 09 08:01:35 <Stskeeps> Myrtti: i havent seen lcuk yet but i assume he is here
Oct 09 08:16:22 <mgedmin810> "tablet is something you eat when you are sick" -- ari jaaksi
Oct 09 08:16:26 <ccooke> huh, nobody else here at the summit?
Oct 09 08:16:31 <ccooke> ah, yes :-)
Oct 09 08:16:40 <StsN810> lo ccooke
Oct 09 08:16:49 <ccooke> eat a NIT and you *will* be sick...
Oct 09 08:16:49 <Jucato> probably too busy listening or tweeting or liveblogging :)
Oct 09 08:16:54 <ccooke> fair
Oct 09 08:17:09 <ototo> About 400 nobodies ;)
Oct 09 08:17:28 <mgedmin810> n in front of the n800 was a big deal internally -- corporate started to believe in maemo then
Oct 09 08:17:40 <mgedmin810> n series = crown jewels of nokia
Oct 09 08:20:00 <mgedmin810> demoing a white 770 prototype from early 2005?
Oct 09 08:20:15 <StsN810> yeah
Oct 09 08:21:00 <onion> looks nice the white 770 model :)
Oct 09 08:21:21 <ccooke> except without a battery cover
Oct 09 08:21:48 <onion> well, that
Oct 09 08:22:31 <ccooke> hmm. flash-based ui prototyping used for the n900
Oct 09 08:22:56 <StsN810> of course
Oct 09 08:23:04 <ototo> It's a common practice in Nokia for early stages of product development.
Oct 09 08:23:14 <ototo> AFAIK at least :)
Oct 09 08:23:30 <StsN810> always prototype before implementing
Oct 09 08:24:20 <ccooke> StsN810: of course. but it's not always done in flash
Oct 09 08:28:30 <mgedmin810> tracker scares ari
Oct 09 08:28:31 <ototo> Tracker was a nightmare at some point for Rover.
Oct 09 08:28:42 <ototo> Not only him :)
Oct 09 08:29:16 <rm_you> tracker?
Oct 09 08:29:22 * rm_you is really out of the loop apparently
Oct 09 08:29:34 <mgedmin810> the file indexing engine
Oct 09 08:29:37 <ccooke> indexing
Oct 09 08:29:37 <rm_you> oh
Oct 09 08:29:41 <rm_you> yeah
Oct 09 08:29:42 <ccooke> from gnome
Oct 09 08:29:50 <rm_you> i always killed that thing on n800
Oct 09 08:30:00 <rm_you> thought it was called something different
Oct 09 08:30:02 <ototo> http://projects.gnome.org/tracker/
Oct 09 08:30:03 <mgedmin810> that was metalayer-crawler
Oct 09 08:30:05 <rm_you> yeah
Oct 09 08:30:14 <ccooke> n800 didn't use tracker
Oct 09 08:30:14 <mgedmin810> tracker is a new thing
Oct 09 08:30:15 <rm_you> right, that was it
Oct 09 08:30:23 <rm_you> metalayer-crawler scared me
Oct 09 08:30:29 <rm_you> cause it ate my CPU and power
Oct 09 08:30:32 <rm_you> hrm
Oct 09 08:30:51 <ccooke> huh. if I hold my n810 lower than my waist, it loses wifi
Oct 09 08:30:53 <Corsac> is there a live coverage of the summit?
Oct 09 08:31:01 <rm_you> lol
Oct 09 08:31:08 <ototo> wondering, do they have torrent trackers at nokia? :)
Oct 09 08:31:20 <Jaffa> Morning all
Oct 09 08:31:24 <rm_you> morning Jaffa
Oct 09 08:31:27 <ototo> morning
Oct 09 08:31:28 <rmt> ccooke, I suggest you hold your n810 higher than your waist, then. :)
Oct 09 08:31:32 <rmt> Morning all. :)
Oct 09 08:31:50 <mgedmin810> "how many songs do you have?"  "10 thousand"  "ok, i've been testing with 20"
Oct 09 08:31:53 <ccooke> rmt: you're a genius!
Oct 09 08:32:01 <ototo> xynopsis is posting something on qik
Oct 09 08:32:12 * rm_you wonders about downloading/installing Maemo5 SDK on the summit wireless O_o
Oct 09 08:32:38 <ccooke> rmt: try it. latency and speed seem good
Oct 09 08:32:49 <ototo> rm_you: If you have an USB stick I can copy it to you :)
Oct 09 08:33:04 <rm_you> ototo: i do
Oct 09 08:33:15 <mgedmin810> grr ctrl+i = close tab in xchat, wtf?
Oct 09 08:33:30 <ccooke> mgedmin810: irssi.
Oct 09 08:33:31 <ototo> 3rd row, right side, right near the walkway
Oct 09 08:33:35 <ototo> tall guy :)
Oct 09 08:33:35 <ccooke> :-)
Oct 09 08:33:40 <mgedmin810> how do I complete nicknames?
Oct 09 08:33:56 <ccooke> mgedmin810: in what?
Oct 09 08:34:07 <mgedmin810> xchat
Oct 09 08:34:27 <ototo> rm_you: near the central walkway :)
Oct 09 08:34:33 <ccooke> it ought to be tab, which *is* ctrl-i
Oct 09 08:34:36 <rm_you> heh will deal with it in a bit :P
Oct 09 08:34:51 <mgedmin810> ccooke only in xterm, apparently...
Oct 09 08:35:27 <zgold> Just discovered that non-english languages in the  SDK break things pretty badly
Oct 09 08:35:38 <ccooke> mgedmin810: yeah. You're basically screwed then :-/
Oct 09 08:36:08 * ccooke suggests a non-gui irs app
Oct 09 08:36:10 <ccooke> irc
Oct 09 08:36:16 <crashanddie> yo
Oct 09 08:36:21 <crashanddie> who's at the summit here?
Oct 09 08:36:30 <ali12341> o/
Oct 09 08:36:31 <Jaffa> crashanddie: me
Oct 09 08:36:32 * ototo is @ summit
Oct 09 08:36:33 * mgedmin810 is
Oct 09 08:36:33 * zgold raises hand
Oct 09 08:36:38 * ccooke  
Oct 09 08:36:40 * timsamoff tries to finish my presentation in the 2nd row. ;)
Oct 09 08:36:46 <crashanddie> and being bored to death by ari
Oct 09 08:36:51 <crashanddie> (jk)
Oct 09 08:36:55 <timsamoff> :p
Oct 09 08:37:00 <ototo> :)
Oct 09 08:37:02 <Corsac> and no one has a webcam?
Oct 09 08:37:02 <zgold> :)
Oct 09 08:37:08 <crashanddie> Jaffa: where you at dawg?
Oct 09 08:37:09 * ccooke is carefully at the back, where he won't spoil anyone's view
Oct 09 08:37:20 <crashanddie> ccooke: whereabouts? I'm on the right at the back
Oct 09 08:37:29 <ccooke> ditto.
Oct 09 08:37:31 <ototo> There's a webcam on the first row. Have no idea what it is used for though :)
Oct 09 08:37:38 <Jaffa> crashanddie: about 10 rows back, on right nr. mixer desk
Oct 09 08:37:51 <crashanddie> staring at the blue and black screen?
Oct 09 08:37:59 <mgedmin810> there are two cameras and a n900 recording video in first row
Oct 09 08:38:06 <Corsac> and no url?
Oct 09 08:38:07 <Corsac> :)
Oct 09 08:38:22 <Jaffa> There was talk of trying to stream to Qik off N900
Oct 09 08:38:34 <crashanddie> anyone got a spare n810 battery? I'll buy it off you right this instand (if it hold its charge for more than 2 hours, like mine)
Oct 09 08:38:36 <ccooke> Jaffa: hope they did
Oct 09 08:38:51 <ccooke> crashanddie: I nhave a charger :-)
Oct 09 08:38:55 <ccooke> one moment
Oct 09 08:38:56 <crashanddie> well, I'll buy the battery if I can't put my hands on an n900
Oct 09 08:39:03 <crashanddie> ccooke: the battery's dead
Oct 09 08:39:12 <crashanddie> ccooke: charging doesn't help
Oct 09 08:39:17 <ccooke> ahh
Oct 09 08:39:50 <crashanddie> thanks though
Oct 09 08:40:00 <ccooke> heh
Oct 09 08:40:03 <crashanddie> btw, lol at the manual charger
Oct 09 08:40:18 <crashanddie> I should rig something like that on my bike
Oct 09 08:40:21 <crashanddie> pedal and charge
Oct 09 08:40:22 <ccooke> they admit to being surprised at the response to the n900
Oct 09 08:40:33 <ccooke> crashanddie: it's a 4 aa battery one
Oct 09 08:40:42 <crashanddie> ccooke: oh, right
Oct 09 08:41:13 <rm_you> i could stream to Qik from my Android device O_o
Oct 09 08:41:14 <crashanddie> ari is surprised at the quotes appearing on his slide :)
Oct 09 08:41:17 <rm_you> would that be sacreligious? :P
Oct 09 08:42:03 <crashanddie> Ari's daughter, talking about the n900: "Daddy, is this the only thing you can do at work?"
Oct 09 08:43:41 <crashanddie> timsamoff: getting there?
Oct 09 08:44:06 <ccooke> portait browsing soon
Oct 09 08:44:13 <crashanddie> "First generation of the devices"
Oct 09 08:44:19 <mgedmin810> xmas 2009
Oct 09 08:44:20 <ccooke> s/soon/"soon"/
Oct 09 08:44:21 <infobot> ccooke meant: portait browsing "soon"
Oct 09 08:44:41 * jsmanrique searching frade :D
Oct 09 08:44:58 <crashanddie> browsing in the subway? With what connectivity?
Oct 09 08:45:03 <ototo> currently it's only phone and phonebook which are supporting portrait mode
Oct 09 08:45:41 <mgedmin810> ari had "multitouch" for 2 weeks
Oct 09 08:46:08 <mgedmin810> broken screen required pressing one corner really hard to register presses elsewhere
Oct 09 08:46:19 <crashanddie> mgedmin810: lmao
Oct 09 08:46:25 <Jucato> hahah :)
Oct 09 08:46:39 <crashanddie> mgedmin810: child lock
Oct 09 08:46:43 <ccooke> strong implicagtion that maemo6 will have multitouch hw. n900 doesn't.
Oct 09 08:47:10 <zgold> !!!!1
Oct 09 08:47:16 <zgold> N900s for Summit participants
Oct 09 08:47:20 <ototo> and that means it will be a capacitive touch screen
Oct 09 08:47:29 <crashanddie> Am I hearing this correctly?
Oct 09 08:47:30 <onion> sweet
Oct 09 08:47:34 <mgedmin810> ooh preproduction n900 free for all of us!
Oct 09 08:47:39 <crashanddie> free n900 for everyone in the audience
Oct 09 08:47:42 <Myrtti> :-<
Oct 09 08:47:44 <ccooke> bloody hell
Oct 09 08:47:47 <mgedmin810> only lent for 6 monnths
Oct 09 08:47:56 <ototo> WOW!
Oct 09 08:48:01 <crashanddie> GAN800_: I'll take care to have one delivered to you
Oct 09 08:48:15 <rm_you> lol wow
Oct 09 08:48:25 <Jaffa> hell yeah
Oct 09 08:48:30 <crashanddie> Jaffa: hahaha :D
Oct 09 08:48:35 * Myrtti pouts
Oct 09 08:48:39 <mgedmin810> nokia's never done thnat before
Oct 09 08:48:40 <Myrtti> stupid weddings
Oct 09 08:48:50 * Myrtti feels bitter
Oct 09 08:48:53 <crashanddie> mgedmin810: actually, they did
Oct 09 08:48:58 <crashanddie> mgedmin810: they gave n810's at MIT
Oct 09 08:49:26 <aSIMULAtor> hehe eveyrone have a boner?
Oct 09 08:49:33 <mgedmin810> preproduction devices?
Oct 09 08:49:36 <Robot101> *crap* went to the wrong summit :(
Oct 09 08:49:43 <ototo> hard to think about summit now ;)
Oct 09 08:49:46 <Jucato> 6 months?
Oct 09 08:49:54 <crashanddie> mgedmin810: no, not preprod, but just "freebies"
Oct 09 08:50:11 <mgedmin810> first time they're handing out preprods
Oct 09 08:50:13 <crashanddie> funny thing is, hotel + flight, I paid more than the price of an n900 :D
Oct 09 08:50:21 <Jaffa> mgedmin810: *No-one*'s ever done that before
Oct 09 08:50:53 <ccooke> it's a good move
Oct 09 08:50:53 <rm_you> funny thing is, hotel + flight, THEY paid more than the price of an n900 :D
Oct 09 08:51:07 <rm_you> but yes, excellent move
Oct 09 08:51:09 <wjt> Robot101: srsly :(
Oct 09 08:51:12 <ccooke> rm_you: they like you :-)
Oct 09 08:51:27 <rm_you> price of 300 devices compared to all of the developers loyalty + more apps at launch... yes
Oct 09 08:51:32 <etrunko> yay
Oct 09 08:51:33 <Myrtti> meh
Oct 09 08:52:26 <ccooke> rm_you: yes, but it takes confidence and an understanding of the people involved to do it
Oct 09 08:52:38 <crashanddie_> London Exchange just said they were moving to LInux
Oct 09 08:52:47 <crashanddie_> anyone else having wifi disconnections?
Oct 09 08:52:54 <StsN810> nop
Oct 09 08:53:00 <ccooke> crashanddie_: some
Oct 09 08:53:03 <ccooke> not much
Oct 09 08:53:21 <ccooke> message: "linux is everywhere in everything"
Oct 09 08:53:25 <rm_you> well it's been a couple years but it does seem they understand us by now :)
Oct 09 08:53:57 <crashanddie> Jaffa: where's luck?
Oct 09 08:54:04 <crashanddie> s/luck/lcuk/
Oct 09 08:54:04 <infobot> crashanddie meant: Jaffa: where's lcuk?
Oct 09 08:54:16 <crashanddie> Jaffa: and simon?
Oct 09 08:54:27 <keesj> Next to me
Oct 09 08:54:44 <mgedmin810> gps coords pls ;)
Oct 09 08:54:49 <StsN810> ah
Oct 09 08:54:53 <crashanddie> keesj: which one is that?
Oct 09 08:54:56 <StsN810> i think i see lcuk
Oct 09 08:55:12 <keesj> lcuk
Oct 09 08:55:16 <StsN810> next to gcobb too?
Oct 09 08:55:26 <crashanddie> keesj: hold your hand up plz
Oct 09 08:55:29 * rm_you looks around for lcuk
Oct 09 08:55:40 <keesj> at 5 o clock
Oct 09 08:55:54 <mavhc> before the next conference write a wifi triangulation/friend location sharing app
Oct 09 08:55:57 <range> And now all please stand up and introduce yourself!
Oct 09 08:56:07 <range> Is there a stream to that room? :)=
Oct 09 08:56:18 <rm_you> mavhc: was working on that...
Oct 09 08:57:05 <mgedmin810> jim zemlin loves the maemo snes emulator
Oct 09 08:57:12 <Jaffa> crashanddie: lcuk and lardman and gcobb and jeremiah and baloo next to me
Oct 09 08:57:13 <rm_you> almost had it done for copenhagen but then switched APIs <_<
Oct 09 08:57:46 <ccooke> hmm, wonder how we can keep the economy bad ;-)
Oct 09 08:57:57 <mgedmin810> bad economy = good year for linux adoption
Oct 09 08:58:02 <mgedmin810> the price is right
Oct 09 08:58:26 <mgedmin810> Jaffa: left or right half? which row?
Oct 09 08:58:29 <rm_you> did this guy speak at OSiM?
Oct 09 08:58:29 <Corsac> rah
Oct 09 08:58:30 * timsamoff wonders what the percentage of actual active maemo.org people are here compared with press and others.
Oct 09 08:58:38 <mgedmin810> I'm in row 2 near the center aisle
Oct 09 08:58:45 <Corsac> there were openmoko at debconf, now n900 at maemo summut
Oct 09 08:58:50 <crashanddie> Jaffa: guessing there's no seat available close to you guys?
Oct 09 08:58:50 <Corsac> and I'm not in either
Oct 09 08:58:51 <Corsac> ><
Oct 09 08:59:08 <StsN810> corsac, no free devices at debconf afaik
Oct 09 08:59:09 <Jaffa> mgedmin810: About 10 rows from front on right
Oct 09 08:59:17 <mgedmin810> jim complains that nobody gave him a n900
Oct 09 08:59:20 <crashanddie> News: "Nokia bribes Linux Foundation VP"
Oct 09 08:59:23 <Jaffa> mgedmin810: you two back on left?
Oct 09 08:59:30 <mgedmin810> peter runs up and hands one
Oct 09 08:59:34 <timsamoff> crashanddie Sorry, I missed your context... I was typing typing... ;)
Oct 09 08:59:58 <crashanddie> timsamoff: I was asking if you were getting somewhere?
Oct 09 09:00:40 <timsamoff> Yeah yeah. ;)
Oct 09 09:02:21 <Jaffa> crashanddie: a few mid-row in front
Oct 09 09:02:39 <ototo_at_ms2009> Using a car from BMW a s Linux terminal sounds funny ;)
Oct 09 09:02:39 <Jaffa> mgedmin810: I'm at your 4 o'clock
Oct 09 09:06:11 * timsamoff rocks around the clock.
Oct 09 09:07:55 <rm_you> anyone else think that slide was kind of confusing? >_>
Oct 09 09:08:06 <StsN810> someone forgot the hw vendors for parts/cpus/gpus and periprials(sp) in that diagram before
Oct 09 09:09:14 <ccooke> nice example: guy from nokia submits a patch to improve battery life, supercomputer in paris benefits
Oct 09 09:09:18 <crashanddie> lol: Linux Foundation: "I don't need to convince this crowd that software should be free"
Oct 09 09:09:24 <ototo_at_ms2009> HW might be free soon as well.
Oct 09 09:09:26 <crashanddie> well, mate, you might ;)
Oct 09 09:10:03 <mgedmin810> prediction: sw = $0, hw = $0, service fees = $$$
Oct 09 09:10:12 * timeless arrives @ams
Oct 09 09:10:35 <crashanddie> timeless: get your ass here before lunch
Oct 09 09:10:49 <ccooke> timeless: quick! before your n900 kis given away!
Oct 09 09:10:57 <crashanddie> timeless: you owe me a beer
Oct 09 09:11:02 <timeless> ok
Oct 09 09:11:13 <timeless> where do i buy 3day tram passes?
Oct 09 09:11:28 <crashanddie> inside the station IIRC
Oct 09 09:11:36 <mgedmin810> jim shows ms ad with frankenpenguins
Oct 09 09:11:50 <mgedmin810> 'need for standards'
Oct 09 09:12:06 <ototo_at_ms2009> timeless: central station or tourist information points
Oct 09 09:12:21 <ccooke> timeless: you might not be able to use cards in the machines, but the ticket desk inn the station has one desk that can sell them
Oct 09 09:12:23 <crashanddie> "One day you will have to give back -- not because you are nice, but because it too expensive to do otherwise."
Oct 09 09:12:30 <mgedmin810> timeless: my hotel had them @ the reception, but this is probably not useful for you now
Oct 09 09:12:39 * StsN810 doesn't agree with this guy
Oct 09 09:12:40 <StsN810> yeah, he might as to
Oct 09 09:12:40 <ensi> if doing a GUI for maemo with Qt are there are any special design contraints to be taken into account?
Oct 09 09:12:42 <StsN810> ototo, no.. environment isnt for it yet
Oct 09 09:12:46 <StsN810> welcome timeless
Oct 09 09:12:52 <crashanddie> ccooke: cards work. Just select "credit card" and insert visa/mastercard
Oct 09 09:12:54 <ensi> or can one just use standard Qt components and the framework takes care of proper layout?
Oct 09 09:12:56 <timeless> which ticket desk
Oct 09 09:13:02 <ccooke> StsN810: ditto, on t least a  few points
Oct 09 09:13:16 <timeless> thanks stskeep
Oct 09 09:13:18 <timeless> s
Oct 09 09:13:23 <ccooke> crashanddie: you can't use credit cards for some things
Oct 09 09:13:39 <StsN810> ccooke, on the other hand you need to be a bit delusional for his job
Oct 09 09:13:45 <ccooke> yeah
Oct 09 09:13:50 <rm_you> hrmrm, did finally get dropped from wifi for a min
Oct 09 09:13:56 <rm_you> timeless: lol finally
Oct 09 09:14:02 <ccooke> he's broadly right, but very optimistic
Oct 09 09:14:02 <rm_you> timeless: you may only need one ticket...
Oct 09 09:14:06 <rm_you> timeless: we only bought the one ticket to our hotel, the rest is all walking (the city is pretty small, or the area we need to be in is, at least
Oct 09 09:14:06 <crashanddie> ccooke: lol... When you're in the UK, you can't use debit cards for some things, and here it's the opposite? Sod it.
Oct 09 09:14:07 <mgedmin810> Jim pimps LSB
Oct 09 09:14:25 <StsN810> its cos you are using android, rm_you
Oct 09 09:14:42 <ccooke> crashanddie: and their debit cards are only maestro. no visa debit works
Oct 09 09:14:50 <rm_you> StsN810: lol, i am on my laptop currently in ubuntu :P
Oct 09 09:14:56 <StsN810> hehe
Oct 09 09:15:01 <mgedmin810> walking from centraal station to westerpark = 30 mins?
Oct 09 09:15:07 <crashanddie> ccooke: good to know, my company might have some business here then :P
Oct 09 09:15:28 <timsamoff> mgedmin810 more like 20.
Oct 09 09:15:45 <timeless> ok, is there a url for how to get there
Oct 09 09:15:58 <crashanddie> timeless: maps.google.com
Oct 09 09:16:00 <mgedmin810> timeless google maps has a map
Oct 09 09:16:09 <mgedmin810> custom map for maemo summit
Oct 09 09:16:12 <mgedmin810> with pois
Oct 09 09:16:38 <crashanddie> So why would you want to protect your idea if it's not a patent?
Oct 09 09:17:04 <ccooke> ooh, he *is* an optimist
Oct 09 09:17:06 <crashanddie> Either you want to protect it and you file a patent, or you don't want to protect it, and you don't patent it
Oct 09 09:17:18 <rm_you> not really protect your idea, but protect your idea from being protected against you
Oct 09 09:17:36 <ccooke> "fit&finish: I think linux is very good at this, but we can always get better"
Oct 09 09:17:44 <rm_you> because annoying people take your idea that you are trying to give away, and then protect it for themselves, from you :P
Oct 09 09:17:56 <StsN810> ccooke, heck, even i have to be a bit delusional wrt mer ;)
Oct 09 09:17:57 <mgedmin810> I thought he said *not* very  good
Oct 09 09:18:01 <crashanddie> rm_you: then you just patent it and don't enforce it
Oct 09 09:18:12 <rm_you> crashanddie: T_T
Oct 09 09:18:20 <glass__> you publish it somewhere and make it clear on which date it was published
Oct 09 09:18:28 <mgedmin810> he named fit&finish as his 3rd challenge
Oct 09 09:18:39 <ccooke> mgedmin810: I heard it as it *is* good. amyone else?
Oct 09 09:18:45 <crashanddie> glass__: prior art doesn't protect from patent trolls, and lawyer fees will bring down a lot of people very quickly
Oct 09 09:18:52 <rm_you> thats essentially what that defense of patent thing he's talking about IS. it's just the official way of doing that
Oct 09 09:18:52 <ccooke> one of us must have misheard :-)
Oct 09 09:18:53 <Myrtti> so the hell has frozen over couple of times today
Oct 09 09:18:57 <glass__> crashanddie: nothing protects you from trolls
Oct 09 09:19:04 <rm_you> and making it clear at the same time that you aren't going to be protecting a patent
Oct 09 09:19:06 <Myrtti> nokia gives out free phones, and obama wins the peace prize.
Oct 09 09:19:12 <Myrtti> let me go fill my lottery ticket.
Oct 09 09:19:13 <crashanddie> ccooke: heard the same, he said "linux is pretty good at this"
Oct 09 09:19:17 <ototo> :D
Oct 09 09:19:24 <ccooke> right
Oct 09 09:19:30 <crashanddie> or maybe it's just sound distortion in the back
Oct 09 09:19:33 <crashanddie> :D
Oct 09 09:19:40 * mgedmin810 has high standards, linux fails to meet them
Oct 09 09:19:53 <ccooke> he's making good points about the valuje of upstream testing
Oct 09 09:19:54 <crashanddie> ccooke: the chick next to you looks pretty hawt, go for it
Oct 09 09:19:58 <StsN810> reality distortion field in place
Oct 09 09:20:05 <mgedmin810> pls no sexism
Oct 09 09:20:21 <crashanddie> it's not sexism
Oct 09 09:20:28 <crashanddie> she's good looking, dasall
Oct 09 09:20:39 <mgedmin810> go read
Oct 09 09:21:07 <timsamoff> Co-Creation Day pics: http://www.flickr.com/photos/iskosalminen/sets/72157622423097193/
Oct 09 09:21:14 <crashanddie> haha, ccooke just typed /clear so the girl wouldn't read my ranting :P
Oct 09 09:21:46 <mgedmin810> apple: free vs fabulous
Oct 09 09:21:52 <rm_you> lol
Oct 09 09:21:53 <ccooke> crashanddie: nope, you're still at risk
Oct 09 09:21:53 <mgedmin810> jim: we can be both
Oct 09 09:22:08 <Myrtti> *sigh*
Oct 09 09:22:08 <crashanddie> ccooke: don't think she'll map my nickname to my face...
Oct 09 09:22:10 <mgedmin810> invites human interaction designers
Oct 09 09:22:18 <crashanddie> ccooke: crap... my nickname is written in bright orange on my name tag
Oct 09 09:22:22 * rm_you thoroughly /agrees with this slide
Oct 09 09:22:24 <Myrtti> please don't be dicks
Oct 09 09:22:25 <ccooke> crashanddie: quite
Oct 09 09:22:56 <rm_you> Myrtti: this is why programmers / computer nerds stereotypically don't do well with the opposite gender >_>
Oct 09 09:23:04 <crashanddie> Jaffa: sounds like odz
Oct 09 09:23:16 <crashanddie> Jaffa: assimilate the designers into our community
Oct 09 09:23:21 <aSIMULAtor> hi can i join your ecosystem
Oct 09 09:23:24 <aSIMULAtor> i can totally irc
Oct 09 09:23:27 <aSIMULAtor> i'm already doing it
Oct 09 09:23:31 <aSIMULAtor> please let me in your group pls pls
Oct 09 09:23:45 <crashanddie> aSIMULAtor: sorry?
Oct 09 09:23:54 <crashanddie> aSIMULAtor: weren't you supposed to be at the summit?
Oct 09 09:23:54 <StsN810> asim; hehe
Oct 09 09:23:58 <aSIMULAtor> i'm in the summit :P
Oct 09 09:24:00 <timsamoff> aSIMULAtor :D
Oct 09 09:24:01 <aSIMULAtor> i'm commenting on his comment
Oct 09 09:24:09 <crashanddie> aSIMULAtor: ah, ol
Oct 09 09:24:10 <aSIMULAtor> about being integrated into the community with the geek developers :P
Oct 09 09:24:12 <aSIMULAtor> we has to hold hands
Oct 09 09:24:14 <aSIMULAtor> and be friends
Oct 09 09:24:21 <crashanddie> aSIMULAtor: stick your hand up
Oct 09 09:24:22 <mgedmin810> and sing
Oct 09 09:24:33 <aSIMULAtor> lol look to the right side, 3rd row
Oct 09 09:24:41 <aSIMULAtor> you just stared at me i think
Oct 09 09:24:43 <crashanddie> in the front?
Oct 09 09:24:46 <aSIMULAtor> i'm in back of you
Oct 09 09:25:02 <aSIMULAtor> yeah i' in the front
Oct 09 09:25:04 <crashanddie> lolwut? I'm in the back of the room
Oct 09 09:25:10 <aSIMULAtor> oh who just stared at me lol
Oct 09 09:25:46 * timsamoff breaks.
Oct 09 09:25:54 <aSIMULAtor> yz break time
Oct 09 09:25:55 <ototo> break for 15 mins now
Oct 09 09:25:56 * mgedmin810 was trying to spot aSIM...
Oct 09 09:26:07 <mgedmin810> grrr want tab completion
Oct 09 09:26:27 <mgedmin810> 15 min break
Oct 09 09:27:22 <rm_you> alright I suppose i could use that SDK now :P
Oct 09 09:27:31 <rm_you> ototo: you still around? :P
Oct 09 09:27:35 <ototo> yeah
Oct 09 09:27:41 <ototo> sitting in the 3rd row
Oct 09 09:27:48 <rm_you> sitting in fourth row on the left
Oct 09 09:27:58 <tigert> this is like geeks playing with "physical reality" for the first time ;)
Oct 09 09:28:18 <ototo> I' right on the edge of the central passage
Oct 09 09:28:25 <rm_you> seeing whats on my flashdrive
Oct 09 09:28:27 <mavhc> "where's the search button"
Oct 09 09:28:32 <ototo> :)
Oct 09 09:28:35 <mavhc> I keep saying then when I stop in real shops
Oct 09 09:28:38 <rm_you> how big is everything
Oct 09 09:28:55 <ototo> well, less then 100M
Oct 09 09:29:04 <ototo> but it's not everything
Oct 09 09:29:23 <ototo> no nokia specific binaries onboard - you have to apt-get them yourself ;)
Oct 09 09:29:28 <rm_you> alright, deleted the season premier episode of Bones, have room now :P
Oct 09 09:29:39 <mgedmin810> coffee access problematic
Oct 09 09:29:50 <mgedmin810> lots of people per meter squared
Oct 09 09:29:53 <ototo> now just find 2 guys sitting in the 3rd row
Oct 09 09:30:16 <rm_you> look left, and catch
Oct 09 09:30:47 <timeless> aww
Oct 09 09:30:54 <timeless> but i wanted to see that
Oct 09 09:31:17 <rm_you> timeless: still have it on my laptop ;P no worries
Oct 09 09:31:35 <rm_you> well, i hope i do O_o
Oct 09 09:33:27 <Shapeshifter> my app works but it feels a bit dodgy because the button animation stays on "pressed" while the function connected to the clicked signal is run. I also tried using the released signal instead, but it's the same. How can I accomplish that the button gets visually released while the rest happens in the background?
Oct 09 09:33:48 <timeless> ok
Oct 09 09:33:50 * mgedmin810 is defeated by the packaging of a milky way bar
Oct 09 09:33:52 <timeless> help!
Oct 09 09:33:59 <timeless> where precisely do i go
Oct 09 09:34:06 <timeless> and don't make me use the web
Oct 09 09:34:20 <mgedmin810> timeless: have a map?
Oct 09 09:34:28 <timeless> no
Oct 09 09:34:38 <mgedmin810> what street are you on?
Oct 09 09:34:39 <timeless> should i buy one?
Oct 09 09:34:48 <timeless> ams central train station
Oct 09 09:34:52 * mgedmin810 uses maemo mapper and downloads maps
Oct 09 09:35:11 <timeless> i just bought a pass
Oct 09 09:35:21 <timeless> and i have lugagar
Oct 09 09:35:32 <timeless> until someone gibes me a  roo
Oct 09 09:35:36 <timeless> no walking
Oct 09 09:35:51 <timeless> extreemely frustrated and hungry
Oct 09 09:36:24 <mgedmin810> timeless: looking for hotel then?
Oct 09 09:36:33 <mgedmin810> ibis is right next to the station
Oct 09 09:36:43 <Shapeshifter> timeless: there's an awesome thai restaurant near the read light district, cheap as well.
Oct 09 09:36:46 <mgedmin810> exit south, turn west
Oct 09 09:36:47 <Shapeshifter> aww I want to go there now
Oct 09 09:36:59 <Shapeshifter> but I'm not in amsterdam :|
Oct 09 09:37:14 <aSIMULAtor> timeless where are you :)
Oct 09 09:37:38 <timeless> at the railway station
Oct 09 09:37:52 <timeless> vvv wasting money on a map
Oct 09 09:37:55 <mgedmin810> and where do you want to go?
Oct 09 09:38:03 <mgedmin810> food, hotel, summit?
Oct 09 09:38:07 <timeless> the event
Oct 09 09:38:30 <mgedmin810> it's by the westerpark
Oct 09 09:38:48 <timeless> uhuh
Oct 09 09:38:56 <timeless> by tram?
Oct 09 09:38:59 <mgedmin810> I walked, sorry, dunno which bus to take
Oct 09 09:39:24 <mgedmin810> openstreetmap has no bus stations
Oct 09 09:40:21 <timeless> 21\us
Oct 09 09:40:40 <mgedmin810> westerpark is straight west, about 2km
Oct 09 09:42:27 <aSIMULAtor> hurry up and get here we're on break :P
Oct 09 09:42:28 * mgedmin810 oom again
Oct 09 09:43:19 <Shapeshifter> so there is free wlan at the summit?
Oct 09 09:43:25 <mgedmin810> yes
Oct 09 09:43:41 <mgedmin810> oh maemo mapper, so hungry
Oct 09 09:45:42 * mgedmin810 hasn't noticed lcuk yet
Oct 09 09:46:40 <tigert> didint he miss his passport?
Oct 09 09:46:46 <SpeedEvil> that was GeneralAntilles
Oct 09 09:46:47 <tigert> or was it someone else
Oct 09 09:46:50 <tigert> ah right, duh
Oct 09 09:46:55 <tigert> bummer anyhow
Oct 09 09:46:58 <aSIMULAtor> lcuk is here
Oct 09 09:47:00 <aSIMULAtor> just saw him outside
Oct 09 09:47:05 <SpeedEvil> Well - his passport got missed for him.
Oct 09 09:47:06 <Mek> lcuk definately is here, we share a hotel room
Oct 09 09:50:05 <ccooke> break over
Oct 09 09:50:23 <ccooke> now getting the nseries pov
Oct 09 09:50:56 <ototo> me managed to get an apple :)
Oct 09 09:51:02 <ototo> fruit one, not company
Oct 09 09:51:19 <ccooke> hmm, mer on iphone
Oct 09 09:51:24 <wazd> anything hot?
Oct 09 09:51:27 <ccooke> that would amuse
Oct 09 09:51:43 <onion> heh
Oct 09 09:51:48 <rm_you> lol
Oct 09 09:52:14 <wazd> Too lowres imo
Oct 09 09:52:34 <mgedmin810> adoption curve: innovators, early adopters, early majority, late majority, laggards
Oct 09 09:52:37 <ccooke> agreed
Oct 09 09:54:47 <mgedmin810> coverage at coveritlive.com = good, I can see what I missed while I was concentrated on typing
Oct 09 09:55:09 <mgedmin810> but fixed 320px width? wtf?
Oct 09 09:55:21 <ccooke> er, what?
Oct 09 09:55:56 <mgedmin810> planet.maemo.org, late last night, blog post about live coverage
Oct 09 09:56:19 <mgedmin810> http://www.coveritlive.com/mobile.php?option=com_mobile&task=viewaltcast&altcast_code=b1272d4ae4
Oct 09 09:56:21 <rm_you> all these slides with charts are very.... interesting (read: abstract / confusing)
Oct 09 09:56:25 <rm_you> maybe it's just me
Oct 09 09:56:45 <mgedmin810> whee, slides don't fit on screen
Oct 09 09:56:52 <mgedmin810> text cut off
Oct 09 09:56:56 <ccooke> rm_you: dunno, can't read them from here
Oct 09 09:57:06 <StsN810> this better get adjusted :P
Oct 09 09:57:08 <rm_you> heh
Oct 09 09:57:19 <rm_you> i don't think theres MUCH cut off... <_<
Oct 09 09:57:22 * mgedmin810 has bad eyesight, therefore sits *near the stage*
Oct 09 09:57:57 <StsN810> i DEMAND the i back in internet
Oct 09 09:58:14 <mgedmin810> um, sts you are
Oct 09 09:58:19 * ototo uses glasses to drive a car, left those in the car, sitting on the 3rd row :D
Oct 09 09:58:26 <Jaffa> StsN810: So much for the full Internet experience ;-)
Oct 09 09:58:45 <StsN810> hehe
Oct 09 09:58:48 <rm_you> yeah my glasses are pretty far away currently <_<
Oct 09 09:58:53 <rm_you> like, halfway around the globe
Oct 09 09:58:53 <StsN810> n-ternet
Oct 09 09:59:09 <rm_you> thus i sat in the third row :P
Oct 09 09:59:35 <mgedmin810> talking about maemo 6 now
Oct 09 09:59:42 <mgedmin810> "the fifth step"
Oct 09 09:59:45 <timeless> ok, i gave up, left my stuff and am  walking
Oct 09 10:00:00 <ototo> timeless: run! :)
Oct 09 10:00:00 <Corsac> was there any update about release date?
Oct 09 10:00:11 <ototo> nope, no updates
Oct 09 10:00:26 <timeless> not in this shoe
Oct 09 10:00:27 <jjardon> seems that Qt will be offcially suppported in fremantle:  http://labs.trolltech.com/blogs/2009/10/09/qt-on-the-n900/
Oct 09 10:00:27 <zgold> Difference between 4th step and 5th step is 'mainstream'
Oct 09 10:01:10 <mgedmin810> 'iconic user experience'
Oct 09 10:01:28 <mgedmin810> users ought to go 'woooow'
Oct 09 10:01:33 <ototo> Nokia is an Aikon if rou read it backwards ;)
Oct 09 10:01:38 <wazd> Steve Jobs in da house?))
Oct 09 10:01:42 <ototo> Aikonik ;)
Oct 09 10:02:06 <jjardon> sn�t it then maemo 6?
Oct 09 10:02:07 <mgedmin810> integrated Internet services
Oct 09 10:02:24 <mgedmin810> not sure what he means
Oct 09 10:02:49 <mgedmin810> true challenge: aesthetics
Oct 09 10:03:24 <wazd> VDVsx: fuck! I've completely screwed up, I'm soo sorry(((
Oct 09 10:03:33 <ototo> "widgets everywhere" :)
Oct 09 10:03:39 <VDVsx> wazd, what ?
Oct 09 10:04:01 <VDVsx> what did you did that time ? :P
Oct 09 10:04:16 <ototo> reminds old java's "write once, run everywhere"....
Oct 09 10:04:20 <wazd> Vdvsx: I forgot to send you buttons((
Oct 09 10:04:27 <Jaffa> "Canvas-style UX"?
Oct 09 10:04:40 <VDVsx> wazd, np :)
Oct 09 10:04:46 <mgedmin810> ui: large pannable canvas, widgets everywhere (i.e. more than one app, iiuc)
Oct 09 10:04:49 <ccooke> "multi-tasking simpple"
Oct 09 10:05:07 <rm_you> is a2dp included this time? :P
Oct 09 10:05:18 <StsN810> fixedinfremantle
Oct 09 10:05:22 <rm_you> lol
Oct 09 10:06:17 <VDVsx> fixedinInverna :P
Oct 09 10:06:40 <zgold> *looks around* There are 5+ irssi windows within my field of view
Oct 09 10:06:49 <mavhc> zooming user interface?
Oct 09 10:07:07 <wazd> Eeek
Oct 09 10:07:07 <ccooke> zgold: and many more out of it :-)
Oct 09 10:07:21 <mgedmin810> the talk is low on specifics, more about general ideas
Oct 09 10:07:28 * rm_you is using xchat
Oct 09 10:07:31 <mgedmin810> 24/7 connectivity etc
Oct 09 10:07:38 <aSIMULAtor> young world explorers etc
Oct 09 10:07:46 <aSIMULAtor> *yawn*
Oct 09 10:07:51 <mgedmin810> fresh look at user experience paradigms, etc
Oct 09 10:07:57 <ccooke> rm_you: well, we can't all be right :-)
Oct 09 10:08:22 <mgedmin810> localization
Oct 09 10:08:27 * rm_you could switch to irssi :P
Oct 09 10:08:36 <mgedmin810> locally relevant services
Oct 09 10:08:44 <mgedmin810> change the world
Oct 09 10:09:08 <mgedmin810> yes we can, together
Oct 09 10:09:20 <ccooke> mgedmin810: :-)
Oct 09 10:09:43 <zgold> It would be fantastic if there was a second screen/projector with the irc channel
Oct 09 10:09:45 <StsN810> save the cheerleader, save the world
Oct 09 10:09:49 <rm_you> hey, maybe now that obama won the nobel peace prize, i can stop apologizing to people for being american? :P
Oct 09 10:09:52 <StsN810> or something
Oct 09 10:10:00 <SpeedEvil> And WTF.
Oct 09 10:10:03 <rm_you> zgold: no, that would be SCARY
Oct 09 10:10:21 <SpeedEvil> You don't give it to a president in their first year until you work out they're not going to end up their term invading shit.
Oct 09 10:10:34 <tigert> zgold: we did that in the early guadecs I think
Oct 09 10:10:34 <SafPlusPlus> I have seen a presentation with a screen with IRC once... I didn't pay much attention to the presentation... so that was kinda bad.
Oct 09 10:10:36 <SpeedEvil> (the peace prize)
Oct 09 10:10:41 <tigert> but yeah
Oct 09 10:10:47 <tigert> it draws attention from the presentation
Oct 09 10:10:57 <tigert> but it could work in the hackroom wall
Oct 09 10:10:57 <mgedmin810> yep, irc *distracts*
Oct 09 10:11:03 <glass> the semi-annual global warming prize
Oct 09 10:11:08 <rm_you> lol
Oct 09 10:11:09 <SafPlusPlus> Yeah, very much so
Oct 09 10:11:10 <rm_you> "grilling" the user experiences guy
Oct 09 10:11:37 <mgedmin810> back to n900 and maemo 5
Oct 09 10:11:50 * rm_you gets out his barbeque tools
Oct 09 10:12:27 <mgedmin810> janne heikkinen
Oct 09 10:12:42 <mgedmin810> smells of lunch distract
Oct 09 10:13:16 <rm_you> anyone know what lunch *is*?
Oct 09 10:13:29 * rm_you is strangely not very hungry yet
Oct 09 10:13:48 <mgedmin810> lunch is food eaten in the  middle of the day
Oct 09 10:13:54 <mgedmin810> get a dictionary
Oct 09 10:13:58 <xnt14> ~seen lcuk
Oct 09 10:14:00 <infobot> lcuk <i=lcuk@cpc3-oldh7-0-0-cust590.manc.cable.ntl.com> was last seen on IRC in channel #maemo, 2d 14h 17m 9s ago, saying: 'gnite folks'.
Oct 09 10:14:02 <rm_you> thanks mgedmin :P
Oct 09 10:14:08 <mgedmin810> ;)
Oct 09 10:14:58 <mgedmin810> sharing plugins
Oct 09 10:15:08 <mgedmin810> for things like uploading photos
Oct 09 10:15:21 <mgedmin810> write support for your website
Oct 09 10:15:26 <rm_you> so did they like, pay the facebook people to get an app ready? or are they just talking about m.facebook.com? >_>
Oct 09 10:15:31 <mgedmin810> chat protocol: plugins
Oct 09 10:15:42 <rm_you> cause the android facebook app just came out like this month
Oct 09 10:15:43 <mgedmin810> browser plugins
Oct 09 10:15:54 <mgedmin810> this talk about what developers can do
Oct 09 10:16:03 <mgedmin810> not about what is shipped
Oct 09 10:16:25 <mgedmin810> 'most powerful innovation platform yet'
Oct 09 10:16:27 <SafPlusPlus> Where is the lunch held, btw?
Oct 09 10:16:53 <mgedmin810> I expect they'll tell us after the talk
Oct 09 10:17:10 <zgold> Any speculation on when/hjow they're giving out the devices?
Oct 09 10:17:12 * mgedmin810 is very far from the exit, will end up @ end of queue...
Oct 09 10:17:30 <mgedmin810> I expect at the end of the day
Oct 09 10:17:52 <mgedmin810> so we don't start playing during talks
Oct 09 10:17:59 <rm_you> the queue is going to be ridiculous
Oct 09 10:18:06 <mgedmin810> 400 ppl
Oct 09 10:18:10 <rm_you> 300
Oct 09 10:18:28 <mgedmin810> they extended the limit, I heard
Oct 09 10:18:38 <rm_you> yeah but they said 300 devices
Oct 09 10:18:43 <rm_you> so prolly only the original batch
Oct 09 10:18:53 <mgedmin810> because nokian's won't be getting them
Oct 09 10:19:07 <mgedmin810> and 20% of ppl here are nokians
Oct 09 10:19:22 <mgedmin810> hm
Oct 09 10:19:39 <rm_you> yeah and i guess like 100 people here already have them
Oct 09 10:19:39 <ccooke> and some already have an n900
Oct 09 10:19:48 <rm_you> there were a LOT of hands up earlier when he asked
Oct 09 10:19:50 * SafPlusPlus grins.
Oct 09 10:19:55 <SafPlusPlus> Indeed.
Oct 09 10:20:01 <timeless> ok, found big sign
Oct 09 10:20:05 <timeless> now where?
Oct 09 10:20:27 <ccooke> timeless: where are you?
Oct 09 10:20:27 <mgedmin810> big sign which?
Oct 09 10:20:28 <rm_you> timeless: the big sign for what?
Oct 09 10:20:37 <timeless> maemolorg
Oct 09 10:20:37 <mgedmin810> welcome/registration?
Oct 09 10:20:54 <rm_you> yeah look for a bunch of streetsign looking signs on a pole
Oct 09 10:20:58 <rm_you> they are maemo signs
Oct 09 10:21:01 <mgedmin810> go west, northwest, west, north
Oct 09 10:21:07 <rm_you> they pretty much all point the same way
Oct 09 10:21:25 <mgedmin810> but you need a badge
Oct 09 10:21:31 <rm_you> go to registration and then out of that room and sort of leftish
Oct 09 10:21:32 <timeless> ah
Oct 09 10:21:42 <timeless> cute
Oct 09 10:21:44 <rm_you> there is a map inside your badge
Oct 09 10:21:50 <mgedmin810> yep
Oct 09 10:21:52 <rm_you> so once you get that, head to the N900 room
Oct 09 10:21:54 <mgedmin810> and timetable
Oct 09 10:22:01 <mgedmin810> and wpa pwd
Oct 09 10:22:14 <ccooke> w
Oct 09 10:22:18 <ccooke> oops
Oct 09 10:22:21 <timeless> very cute
Oct 09 10:22:31 <mgedmin810> q1 2010 official qt for n900
Oct 09 10:22:41 <mgedmin810> today: alpha version
Oct 09 10:23:08 <tru> good stuff.
Oct 09 10:23:21 <etrunko> see the video on qt labs http://labs.trolltech.com/blogs/2009/10/09/qt-on-the-n900/
Oct 09 10:23:52 <Jaffa> BTW, N900 Flash player stills play sound if you're on the silent profile
Oct 09 10:25:06 <mgedmin810> probably feature?
Oct 09 10:25:22 <mgedmin810> silent = no system sounds != mute
Oct 09 10:25:44 <zerojay> Dammit.
Oct 09 10:26:00 <mgedmin810> does media player play sound in the silent profile?
Oct 09 10:26:53 <Jaffa> "Maemo Extras" and "Maemo.org Extras Testing"
Oct 09 10:27:20 <StsN810> havoc ensues
Oct 09 10:27:25 * mgedmin810 attacked by sunlight coming through a crack
Oct 09 10:27:44 <Jaffa> mgedmin810: You're on a mission from God
Oct 09 10:27:56 <ototo> :)
Oct 09 10:28:30 * timsamoff is ready to see some flips down the center isle.
Oct 09 10:29:36 <waz1> looks like it's time for n800 reflash :)
Oct 09 10:29:39 * Jaffa has just promted Hermes to extras-testing
Oct 09 10:29:50 * zerojay updates.
Oct 09 10:30:19 <mgedmin810> 'ogg support' mentioned as an app that's available on day 1
Oct 09 10:30:25 <mgedmin810> and fbreader too
Oct 09 10:30:35 <ccooke> that's a change
Oct 09 10:30:42 <mgedmin810> also facebook widget + photo uploader
Oct 09 10:30:52 <zerojay> Not available from Nokia.
Oct 09 10:31:05 <mgedmin810> maemo extras I think
Oct 09 10:31:06 <waz1> Omweather is available from day -36)
Oct 09 10:31:09 <zerojay> Yes.
Oct 09 10:31:26 <VDVsx> timeless, I'm here now :)
Oct 09 10:31:42 <rm_you> heh
Oct 09 10:32:02 <mgedmin810> maemo 6 device
Oct 09 10:32:19 <mgedmin810> omap 3, open gl es, wvga resolution --- stay same
Oct 09 10:32:34 <Jaffa> Sounds like it'll run on N900 perhaps
Oct 09 10:32:35 <mgedmin810> multitouch, capacitive
Oct 09 10:32:43 <ototo> good
Oct 09 10:33:08 <ccooke> "multitouch in capacitive displays" - sounds like they won't have to be capacitive
Oct 09 10:33:28 <Jaffa> ccooke: s/in/on/
Oct 09 10:33:31 * ototo is wondering, when multicore omap will be available
Oct 09 10:34:11 <Jaffa> PlayReady DRM
Oct 09 10:34:24 <zerojay> Reading the scrollback... I feel like I've been kicked in the chest.
Oct 09 10:34:30 <StsN810> interesting
Oct 09 10:34:32 <mgedmin810> want to support mainstream content (for-pay), drm
Oct 09 10:34:43 <ccooke> zerojay: oh?
Oct 09 10:34:56 <Jaffa> timeless: nice shades!
Oct 09 10:35:16 <zerojay> ccooke: Because I *should* be there right now.
Oct 09 10:35:25 <mgedmin810> xplatform frameworks: qt, nokia web runtime
Oct 09 10:35:28 <ccooke> zerojay: ah :-/
Oct 09 10:35:29 <Jaffa> zerojay: you're not?
Oct 09 10:35:31 <rm_you> timeless: lol you finally here?
Oct 09 10:35:34 <mgedmin810> what's that?
Oct 09 10:35:49 <waz1> zerojay, relax, imagine how I feel))
Oct 09 10:36:06 <StsN810> wb johnx
Oct 09 10:36:24 <waz1> Zerojay: I should be there. Twice.)
Oct 09 10:36:31 <Khertan_maesum> Hi guys !
Oct 09 10:36:40 <zerojay> Jaffa: Work said "we need you here for something important" at the last second... and what really pisses me off is that there's NOTHING important to do. :/
Oct 09 10:36:40 <Jaffa> hi Khertan_maesum!
Oct 09 10:36:44 <waz1> Heya
Oct 09 10:36:53 <Jaffa> Khertan_maesum: Not seen you yet
Oct 09 10:37:05 <zerojay> Jaffa: And believe me, if I was there, you'd know right away. I'm very hard to miss.
Oct 09 10:37:07 <Khertan_maesum> hehé i m near
Oct 09 10:37:08 <Jaffa> zerojay: bastards
Oct 09 10:37:14 <Khertan_maesum> arrived a bit in late
Oct 09 10:37:14 <timeless> arrived n900 room
Oct 09 10:37:20 <StsN810> phew, schedules
Oct 09 10:37:28 <mgedmin810> tech preview for maemo 6 ui: q4 2009
Oct 09 10:37:31 <timeless> where are people
Oct 09 10:37:32 <ccooke> uui preview of harm today
Oct 09 10:37:41 <Khertan_maesum> i arrived when they announce the loan device for participants :)
Oct 09 10:37:46 <waz1> Oooh, nice
Oct 09 10:37:53 <mgedmin810> qt for maemo *6* sdk alpha: q1 2010
Oct 09 10:37:55 <waz1> Footage allowed?
Oct 09 10:38:03 <mgedmin810> beta q2
Oct 09 10:38:11 <timeless> jaffa: where are you?
Oct 09 10:38:13 <rm_you> timeless: all over
Oct 09 10:38:22 <Khertan_maesum> ouch the concept !
Oct 09 10:38:23 <Jaffa> timeless: look right, two rows back
Oct 09 10:38:31 <mgedmin810> ui concept sketch
Oct 09 10:38:39 <timeless> oops
Oct 09 10:38:56 <timeless> copyright violation: zelda
Oct 09 10:38:56 <mgedmin810> panning over a large virtual desktop (canvas)
Oct 09 10:39:02 <Jaffa> left
Oct 09 10:39:02 <Jaffa> letiMaemo 6 is liqbase....
Oct 09 10:39:15 <Jaffa> xxx
Oct 09 10:39:17 <rm_you> roflcopter
Oct 09 10:39:31 <ccooke> Jaffa: quite a bit, yeah
Oct 09 10:39:37 <Khertan_maesum> does in the game i see zelda ?
Oct 09 10:39:38 <waz1> or palm pre :D
Oct 09 10:39:38 <jeremiah> Harmattan in liqbase with Qt
Oct 09 10:39:46 <johnx> hey. the x11 virtual desktop is back ;p
Oct 09 10:39:49 <ccooke> (why isn't lcuk working for nokia yet?)
Oct 09 10:39:56 <Khertan_maesum> on the sketch near the tetris clone ...
Oct 09 10:40:00 <ccooke> :-)
Oct 09 10:40:05 * Jaffa thought Harmattan 3Q10
Oct 09 10:40:16 <rm_you> yeah srsly lcuk
Oct 09 10:40:29 <Khertan_maesum> lol yes it s look like liqbase :)
Oct 09 10:40:31 * rm_you wonders why lcuk isnt in channel
Oct 09 10:40:45 <mgedmin810> I think he applied, now waits for nokia's response?
Oct 09 10:40:48 <jeremiah> Oh yeah, Nokia bought Dopplr, I forgot about that
Oct 09 10:40:53 <ccooke> portrait&landscape
Oct 09 10:41:07 <Jaffa> Tech preview on gitorious?
Oct 09 10:41:10 <johnx> that concept art demands a theme
Oct 09 10:41:11 <mgedmin810> portrait and landscape ui
Oct 09 10:41:14 <StsN810> technical preview out on maemo.gitor
Oct 09 10:41:22 <mgedmin810> hm
Oct 09 10:41:26 <johnx> really digging the sketxh style art
Oct 09 10:41:37 <Khertan_maesum> hum ... why not
Oct 09 10:41:39 <jeremiah> "Technical preview out today on maemo.gitorious.org"
Oct 09 10:42:13 <tru> will maemo 6 work on the n900 as well? or will it be a new hardware again?
Oct 09 10:42:26 <waz1> Vlad told that everyone gon a n900 =)
Oct 09 10:42:27 <Jaffa> tru: H/w platform soounds similar
Oct 09 10:42:28 <ccooke> tru: sounds like it'll run
Oct 09 10:42:29 <rm_you> doubt they'll do new hardware that soon
Oct 09 10:42:31 <Khertan_maesum> maemo six support omap3
Oct 09 10:42:32 <rm_you> it should work find
Oct 09 10:42:32 <waz1> got
Oct 09 10:42:40 * Jaffa is betting it'll be available
Oct 09 10:42:42 <johnx> tru, no one knows. not even nokia
Oct 09 10:42:45 <Khertan_maesum> so look like it could run on n900
Oct 09 10:42:50 <ccooke> tru: they said they're sticking to omap3, opengl and wvga
Oct 09 10:42:51 <jeremiah> waz1: Yeah, they are giving out 300 N900's for a six month loan
Oct 09 10:42:54 <Jucato> except for the multitouch stuff
Oct 09 10:42:56 * timeless moves back
Oct 09 10:42:58 <StsN810> there is always mer
Oct 09 10:43:20 <Khertan_maesum> héhé
Oct 09 10:43:24 <timeless> jeremiah, can i leach power from you?
Oct 09 10:43:33 * Jaffa == excited
Oct 09 10:43:41 <waz1> French detected!!11
Oct 09 10:43:52 <Khertan_maesum> where too ?
Oct 09 10:43:59 <Khertan_maesum>  -o
Oct 09 10:44:03 <Khertan_maesum> :)
Oct 09 10:44:27 <timeless> clap: it's over
Oct 09 10:44:40 <Khertan_maesum> haha
Oct 09 10:44:42 <mgedmin810> ooh n900 handouts explained now?
Oct 09 10:44:46 <Khertan_maesum> the interesting parts :)
Oct 09 10:44:48 * jeremiah starts r00ting timeless' N900
Oct 09 10:44:49 <waz1> Now skype?
Oct 09 10:44:50 <johnx> ain't over to the fat lady sings
Oct 09 10:45:06 <mgedmin810> 300 != 400 . . .
Oct 09 10:45:07 <timeless> that's a slightly older flash
Oct 09 10:45:18 <VDVsx> should I 'apply' for a newer device ? :P
Oct 09 10:45:20 <timeless> but it has rotation support for the browsr
Oct 09 10:45:21 <jeremiah> Suddenly got quiet here
Oct 09 10:45:23 <waz1> I'm sure bout videocalls :)
Oct 09 10:45:24 <timeless> aww
Oct 09 10:45:47 <mgedmin810> 'we should be fine' if nokian's and contractors stay away
Oct 09 10:45:54 <timeless> may not
Oct 09 10:46:00 <timeless> does that mean may?
Oct 09 10:46:02 <Khertan_maesum> lol
Oct 09 10:46:09 <timeless> fingrish
Oct 09 10:46:13 <jeremiah> eh?
Oct 09 10:46:22 <timeless> he meant must not
Oct 09 10:46:27 <zerojay> timeless:  I should be there with you so we could correct them in realtime.
Oct 09 10:46:28 <jeremiah> I'm gonna fight tooth and claw for one of them - I don't have one.
Oct 09 10:46:34 <jeremiah> :(
Oct 09 10:46:47 <timeless> jeremiahh: turn it on
Oct 09 10:46:48 <jeremiah> what?
Oct 09 10:46:52 <mgedmin810> return on april 30
Oct 09 10:46:52 <timeless> open browser
Oct 09 10:47:11 <jeremiah> "Nokia employeses and Nokia subcontractors may not participate"
Oct 09 10:47:18 <timeless> who pays shipping?
Oct 09 10:47:22 <jeremiah> >:|
Oct 09 10:47:51 <waz1> What about dev program?
Oct 09 10:48:01 <johnx> yay. washing machine!
Oct 09 10:48:02 <waz1> Any news?
Oct 09 10:48:06 <Khertan_maesum> oh ! mean get it today ?
Oct 09 10:48:12 <timeless> they'll be mobbed
Oct 09 10:48:12 <mgedmin810> no mention yet
Oct 09 10:48:12 <jeremiah> I think you are chatting on the dev program
Oct 09 10:48:28 <jeremiah> *clapping*
Oct 09 10:48:38 <timeless> that mostly means local maps
Oct 09 10:49:22 * timeless watches jeremiah search for the power key
Oct 09 10:49:32 <timsamoff> Free device time.
Oct 09 10:49:33 <mgedmin810> hardest decision: lunch or device?
Oct 09 10:50:02 <Jucato> hahah device first! lunch can always wait :)
Oct 09 10:50:13 <Khertan_maesum> go go go :)
Oct 09 10:51:05 <Khertan_maesum> what a jaffa look like ?
Oct 09 10:52:03 <LoCusF> I got ramzez modules for N900 ready, PM me if you want to try it?
Oct 09 10:52:14 <LoCusF> s/ramzez/ramzswap
Oct 09 10:53:25 <waz1> Haha, everyone is out for lunch)
Oct 09 10:57:55 <javispedro> naaaaaa na na na na naaaaaaaaa
Oct 09 10:57:58 <javispedro> morning.
Oct 09 10:58:41 <zerojay> http://zerojay.com/misc/classic-gaming-wallpapers_1.1-1maemo0.deb if anyone's interested. Let me know what you think. :)
Oct 09 10:58:53 <javispedro> hi zerojay
Oct 09 10:58:57 <zerojay> hey.
Oct 09 10:59:01 <javispedro> was wondering
Oct 09 10:59:05 <javispedro> do you have the src pkg for that?
Oct 09 10:59:52 <zerojay> qwerty gave me probably everything needed for it.. but since none of the deb package tools wanted to work for me and scratchbox is suddenly fucked, I just made the package manually.
Oct 09 11:00:00 <javispedro> aps.
Oct 09 11:00:09 <zerojay> hmm?
Oct 09 11:00:22 <javispedro> np. gan asked me to do a web app where input=4 image files and output=src pkg
Oct 09 11:00:22 <javispedro> s/gan/GAN
Oct 09 11:00:33 <javispedro> and I might have a bit of time tonight.
Oct 09 11:00:51 <cosmo> zerojay: are those for fremantle?
Oct 09 11:00:51 <zerojay> Yeah, that would be awesome. I'll help test it out for you if you'd like.
Oct 09 11:00:55 <zerojay> cosmo: Yes.
Oct 09 11:01:55 <zerojay> cosmo: You can also get them from n900wallpapers.com... but the package allows you to apply all four as a set instead of one at a time.
Oct 09 11:03:02 <zerojay> Next up, finishing off DKC's Jungle Hijinx, finishing off Aladdin's Cave of Wonders, starting work on stage 1 of Streets of Rage, stage 4 of Final Fight...
Oct 09 11:03:30 <rmt> Hmm.. anything like SideShow for Linux + Maemo?  I'm actually thinking along the lines of easily accessible mini-VNC windows for remote controls etc.
Oct 09 11:03:30 <javispedro> :)
Oct 09 11:03:44 <javispedro> I'd said lircd.
Oct 09 11:03:46 <javispedro> err...
Oct 09 11:03:47 <javispedro> lcdd.
Oct 09 11:03:50 <zerojay> And whatever else anyone would be interested in.
Oct 09 11:03:58 <cosmo> hm, the app manager doesn't install the deb. i'm not sure it should
Oct 09 11:03:59 <javispedro> lcdproc or whatever is called.
Oct 09 11:04:21 <rmt> So I can have applications running on a remote system, but controllable on the device..
Oct 09 11:04:45 <javispedro> rmt: LCDproc was designed for simpler devices though (Lcd screens with 4-8 buttons only)
Oct 09 11:05:21 <rmt> Hmm.
Oct 09 11:06:28 <jospoortvliet> so who are in the westergasfabriek and who can tell me what my chances are to get in if I just show up ;-)
Oct 09 11:06:42 <jospoortvliet> (was too late to apply)
Oct 09 11:06:47 <javispedro> ow, maesum started already?
Oct 09 11:06:58 * javispedro checks clock. uff.
Oct 09 11:07:54 <javispedro> ah well, "step 5" will have capacitive screen. unsurprising.
Oct 09 11:10:21 <cosmo> zerojay: works, thanks!  you could add some c64 games to the pack also :-)
Oct 09 11:16:55 <zerojay> cosmo: Find me maps and I'll gladly do so.
Oct 09 11:19:35 * zerojay puts on his Zelda shirt and heads to work.
Oct 09 11:20:52 <zerojay> jospoortvliet: zero, as far as I've heard.
Oct 09 11:21:28 <jospoortvliet> zerojay: that sucks... I'm gonna try anyway, I think :D
Oct 09 11:21:39 <jospoortvliet> It's only a 45 min drive so...
Oct 09 11:21:52 <zerojay> jospoortvliet: Needed to register to get the badge.. only badges get in.
Oct 09 11:22:12 <zerojay> But I'm not there, so... that's just what I was told.
Oct 09 11:22:37 <jospoortvliet> zerojay: I heard from somebody the main area is open. I can do without the talks, besides, I can find somebody to get me a badge :D
Oct 09 11:22:40 <SpeedEvil> http://www.national.com/mpf/LM/LM3914.html
Oct 09 11:22:41 <SpeedEvil> oops
Oct 09 11:22:43 <jospoortvliet> zerojay:  tnx anyway
Oct 09 11:23:15 <zerojay> Heh.. ok.
Oct 09 11:26:23 <wazd> I'm standing in a line again
Oct 09 11:26:31 <wazd> WAAAAAAIIIII!!
Oct 09 11:27:09 <Corsac> gnagnagna
Oct 09 11:27:38 <rmt> Hmm.. so, Remote Buddy (for MacOS/X) is the closest I've found.. but this is basically what I'd like..
Oct 09 11:30:06 <rmt> Maybe mini-applications with basic scripting support (eg. lua) .. define individual GUIs, and use AJAX (or whatever) calls to communicate with the server(s)..
Oct 09 11:30:46 <rmt> Throw in some zeroconf stuff to have local services automatically detected, and it could really be something.
Oct 09 11:31:19 <wazd> Damn, I'm sooo pissed off
Oct 09 11:33:13 <javispedro> I'm pissed too. what a day :P ;)
Oct 09 11:44:40 <wazd> And another line
Oct 09 11:45:02 <kr1shnak> a line?
Oct 09 11:45:14 <javispedro> waiting line.
Oct 09 11:45:17 <javispedro> people queue.
Oct 09 11:45:19 <javispedro> etc.
Oct 09 11:45:56 * wazd cries
Oct 09 11:47:23 <wazd> Any sensations at the summit?)
Oct 09 11:48:00 <kr1shnak> wish I could have gone to the summit
Oct 09 11:48:11 <kr1shnak> found out about it way too late though
Oct 09 11:48:28 <rmt> I could've, if only I'd reserved a place. :-P
Oct 09 11:48:53 <rmt> Would've even had free accommodation with my choice of friends and strangers.
Oct 09 11:48:56 <kr1shnak> so is the N900 actually out yet?
Oct 09 11:49:03 <kr1shnak> like anywhere
Oct 09 11:49:31 <kr1shnak> I'm tempted to get one, even though my N800 didnt get much use
Oct 09 11:49:49 <wazd> No, it will be out on q3 2010 with Harmattan
Oct 09 11:50:00 <kr1shnak> ah right
Oct 09 11:50:16 <Stskeeps> woo n900
Oct 09 11:50:28 <kr1shnak> q3 2010? Really?
Oct 09 11:50:41 <kr1shnak> damn, thats ages
Oct 09 11:50:42 <wazd> Kiddin )
Oct 09 11:50:46 <kr1shnak> heh
Oct 09 11:50:50 <range> Yeah, didn't you see that the preorder status changed again? :)
Oct 09 11:51:16 <kr1shnak> I havent been tracking it that closely. I had a bad experience with customer support with my N800
Oct 09 11:51:29 <kr1shnak> so it kind of soured me on Nokia
Oct 09 11:51:46 <tru> do anyone know when the n900 is shipping yet?
Oct 09 11:53:06 <Corsac> tru: for the moment the only news I saw is “end of october”
Oct 09 11:53:18 <tru> ok.
Oct 09 11:53:25 <SpeedEvil> 2010
Oct 09 11:53:32 <SpeedEvil> (hopefully not)
Oct 09 11:53:34 <kr1shnak> heh
Oct 09 11:53:44 <kr1shnak> oh check out mr N900 here
Oct 09 11:53:44 <wazd> 2012 muhaha)
Oct 09 11:53:51 <khertan_n900> hi again :)
Oct 09 11:53:55 <kr1shnak> hello
Oct 09 11:54:02 <wazd> Ffffuuuuu)
Oct 09 11:54:18 <kr1shnak> I take it you are at maesum khertan_n900?
Oct 09 11:54:21 <khertan_n900> hum  where is fremantle extras devel
Oct 09 11:54:30 <khertan_n900> can t reach it
Oct 09 11:55:04 <khertan_n900> is it the sme thimgs than extras testing ?
Oct 09 11:55:38 <wazd_n920_harm> Take that, loosers :D
Oct 09 12:05:18 <ccooke> and connected via the n900
Oct 09 12:05:32 <ccooke> and diablo's dropbear
Oct 09 12:06:52 <kr1shnak> did anyone here go to the Nokia developer day in London, a few weeks ago?
Oct 09 12:06:59 <crashanddie_n900> hey
Oct 09 12:09:58 <crashanddie_n900> anyone got the url of the fremantle extras devel repo?
Oct 09 12:11:53 <hendry> after a fresh install of diablo, easier there an easier way of seeing the IP besides typing in `/sbin/ifconfig`?
Oct 09 12:13:12 <ototo1> lunch and devices were in the same area - not really a hard decision to make ;)
Oct 09 12:14:23 <hendry> crashanddie_n900: http://repository.maemo.org/extras-devel/pool/fremantle/
Oct 09 12:14:38 <hendry> are n900 avail to buy in the UK now?
Oct 09 12:15:17 <kr1shnak> nope
Oct 09 12:15:33 <kr1shnak> listed as a preorder for £499.00 on the nokia site
Oct 09 12:16:06 <hendry> can i assume the maemo5 sdk has a better emulator than maemo4? i was to test webkit builds, though since i don't have the device ...
Oct 09 12:19:03 <javispedroiPhone> take that, losers.
Oct 09 12:19:23 <javispedroiPhone> :P MUAHAHA.
Oct 09 12:24:39 <Ceron^> ffs!
Oct 09 12:24:41 <Ceron^> damn you all
Oct 09 12:24:44 <Ceron^> who attended maemo summit
Oct 09 12:24:50 <Ceron^> you all got your own n900 there :(
Oct 09 12:24:59 <Pavlov> shoulda come!
Oct 09 12:25:11 * range rings a bell
Oct 09 12:25:19 <Ceron^> i was going to but did not get invite
Oct 09 12:26:04 <timeless> i didn't get one
Oct 09 12:26:20 <timeless> and the people will have to return them
Oct 09 12:26:32 <aSIMULAtor> i didn't get one either :( :(
Oct 09 12:26:53 <Ceron^> life is unfair!
Oct 09 12:26:59 <ototo> why so? contracting issues?
Oct 09 12:28:07 <Corsac> timeless: I guess they'll be offered to buy it?
Oct 09 12:28:56 <timeless> no
Oct 09 12:29:00 <ccooke> this keyboard is much nicer than the n810
Oct 09 12:29:05 <timeless> the hardware afaik isn't final
Oct 09 12:29:28 <timeless> yeah, contractors/employees aren't elligible
Oct 09 12:29:57 <timeless> they're supposed to get them from managers, not via a community portal
Oct 09 12:30:30 <crashanddie> timeless: hey man o/
Oct 09 12:31:04 <timeless> hi,  where are yah?
Oct 09 12:31:16 <crashanddie> timeless: you were sitting not far from me this morning... didn't know it was you
Oct 09 12:31:30 <timeless> oops
Oct 09 12:32:03 <crashanddie> you're the one with the fancy sunglasses :D
Oct 09 12:32:08 <timeless> yep
Oct 09 12:32:22 <aSIMULAtor> fancy sunglasses oooo :P
Oct 09 12:33:00 <crashanddie> i'll catch up with you at the break... i'm the limping guy wearing a suit
Oct 09 12:33:11 <StsN810> dr house?
Oct 09 12:33:24 <timeless> heh
Oct 09 12:33:36 <crashanddie> popping pills too, forgot the cane though
Oct 09 12:33:56 <timeless> because we need a bad ui we control :)
Oct 09 12:34:15 <Stskeeps> what closed ui..
Oct 09 12:34:17 <aSIMULAtor> hey hey :P
Oct 09 12:34:49 <crashanddie> i can't get the fremantle extras devel to work
Oct 09 12:34:58 <timeless> notes is closed, right?
Oct 09 12:35:05 <crashanddie> asim: where you at girl?
Oct 09 12:35:09 <timeless> crashanddie: try red pill
Oct 09 12:35:14 <aSIMULAtor> right next to timeless
Oct 09 12:35:15 <StsN810> who needs notes when you have conboy
Oct 09 12:35:28 <timeless> ham was complaining about a signature or something
Oct 09 12:35:38 <Jaffa> re
Oct 09 12:35:40 <aSIMULAtor> look at everyone clutching their devices
Oct 09 12:35:49 <timeless> she's at the far right edge
Oct 09 12:35:58 <timeless> 4th  row from the front
Oct 09 12:36:05 <aSIMULAtor> next to that linux foundation dude
Oct 09 12:36:15 <crashanddie> asim: on a room level? we didn't manage to activate the chip inside timeless' brain yet
Oct 09 12:36:26 <aSIMULAtor> hehe
Oct 09 12:36:38 <Jaffa> aSIMULAtor: nr timeless?
Oct 09 12:36:52 <crashanddie> next to the no smoking sign?
Oct 09 12:36:53 <timeless> two seats right of me
Oct 09 12:36:57 <Jaffa> aSIMULAtor: Were you at the bar with danielwilms last night?
Oct 09 12:37:11 * Jaffa seees. Big laptop. Twitter
Oct 09 12:37:16 <timeless> yes, a bit behind that
Oct 09 12:37:26 <aSIMULAtor> no i didn't go to the bar...i was with mox do u know him?
Oct 09 12:37:26 <timeless> heh
Oct 09 12:37:30 <aSIMULAtor> he just went home cause he's feeling sick
Oct 09 12:37:40 <aSIMULAtor> we had a really posh dinner that made him and another friend sick :/
Oct 09 12:37:42 <aSIMULAtor> i'm ok though
Oct 09 12:37:46 <aSIMULAtor> i have a steel gut
Oct 09 12:38:02 <timeless> are those mails NSFW ? :)
Oct 09 12:38:18 <aSIMULAtor> hehehe IM NOT CHECKING WORK EMAIL HURRAH
Oct 09 12:38:22 <aSIMULAtor> i got a lot to check though :/
Oct 09 12:38:22 <ccooke> hmm. getting used to the new layout already.
Oct 09 12:38:29 <aSIMULAtor> ccooke: u like?
Oct 09 12:38:40 <ccooke> very much
Oct 09 12:38:49 <Jaffa> aSIMULAtor: OK. /me waves at the back of you head (4 rows behind, next to jamiebennet)
Oct 09 12:38:55 * timeless syncs MfE
Oct 09 12:39:04 <aSIMULAtor> i'm going to turn around
Oct 09 12:39:14 <aSIMULAtor> hihi! :)
Oct 09 12:39:18 <Jaffa> X-Fade: the devel problems are also affect HAM updates
Oct 09 12:39:26 <Jaffa> 'lo :-)
Oct 09 12:39:48 <ccooke> it's a hell of a lot faster tol type on than any system I've had skince the zaurus
Oct 09 12:39:56 <aSIMULAtor> we all should definitely hang out before this weekend ends
Oct 09 12:40:50 <Jaffa> definitely
Oct 09 12:41:05 <Jaffa> an IRC get together with no verbal communication
Oct 09 12:41:20 <ccooke> heh
Oct 09 12:43:43 <aSIMULAtor> :D
Oct 09 12:45:09 <keesj> i really wonder about a gplv3 v.s. drm statement
Oct 09 12:45:26 <StsN810> no gplv3 in maemo
Oct 09 12:46:20 <StsN810> and it is perfectly possible to make a open drm device imho
Oct 09 12:46:43 * Jaffa guesses DRM will just be a package which DRM-requiring sw will depend on
Oct 09 12:46:43 <StsN810> similar way you have locked down cell parts
Oct 09 12:48:24 <timeless> we need to ship an insecure browser
Oct 09 12:48:37 <Jaffa> Hmm, qwerty12 hasn't promoted Droid Fonts to extras-testig
Oct 09 12:48:45 <timeless> please keep that in mind now that you all have devices
Oct 09 12:49:48 <rikshot> whats with the corrupt packages coming from the final SDK installer?
Oct 09 12:50:02 <timeless> those are trivially solvable
Oct 09 12:50:12 <timeless> he could ask me
Oct 09 12:50:24 * timsamoff is getting nervous. Ay ay ay.
Oct 09 12:50:59 <ccooke> timeless: why?
Oct 09 12:51:29 <jeremiah> timsamoff: Peter looks like he wants to ask you a question
Oct 09 12:51:38 <jeremiah> heh
Oct 09 12:51:48 <timsamoff> :p
Oct 09 12:51:49 <jeremiah> He's got a mic in his hand
Oct 09 12:52:22 <Jaffa> timsamoff: You two rows in front of aSIMULAtor?
Oct 09 12:52:26 <timsamoff> He's going to break out in some freestyle rhymes in a minute. Yo.
Oct 09 12:52:38 <timsamoff> Jaffa: Yes.
Oct 09 12:53:03 <jeremiah> timsamoff: Yeah! You should start doing a beat box and he'll start throwin' down!
Oct 09 12:53:25 <timsamoff> jeremiah: If he did, I would dance to it.
Oct 09 12:53:30 <jeremiah> qole: Open schematics!
Oct 09 12:53:34 <jeremiah> heh
Oct 09 12:53:52 * timsamoff bids over and out for a while.
Oct 09 12:54:11 <Jaffa> "Large outcry" about non-phone
Oct 09 12:54:14 <Jaffa> Pfft.
Oct 09 12:55:08 <Jaffa> "Screw 'em," should be Ari's answer. And open source h/w wouldn't involve non-technical people from tmo.
Oct 09 12:55:27 <jeremiah> true
Oct 09 12:57:06 * suihkulokki finds mafw-lastfm in extras-devel
Oct 09 12:57:32 <suihkulokki> apart from the fact that it is a yet-another-allways-running-daemon, pretty cools stuff
Oct 09 12:58:14 <timeless> hardware in volume is how nokia has decent prices
Oct 09 12:58:31 <timeless> customizing hardware would mushroom costs
Oct 09 12:58:37 <jeremiah> jaffa!
Oct 09 12:58:40 <jeremiah> that's you!
Oct 09 12:59:35 <Jaffa> That wasn't my point tho
Oct 09 12:59:50 <Jaffa> I was"'t talking about UIs at all
Oct 09 13:00:54 <aSIMULAtor> ok i believe you :)
Oct 09 13:01:01 <aSIMULAtor> :D
Oct 09 13:02:42 <jeremiah> I'm going to the N800 :P
Oct 09 13:26:30 * tigert boots his N810
Oct 09 13:26:36 <tigert> this feels like a laptop :-o
Oct 09 13:31:44 <frals> god been stuck paper prototyping and doing user tests all day, completlty missed everything from the summit!
Oct 09 13:33:39 <javispedro> if you find a page with nice briefings, please tell :)
Oct 09 13:34:13 <frals> reading the liveblog at http://www.coveritlive.com/index2.php?option=com_altcaster&task=viewaltcast&altcast_code=b1272d4ae4&width=800&height=600 atm, bit messy but does the trick
Oct 09 13:34:34 <javispedro> outdated.
Oct 09 13:34:46 <javispedro> aws, wait.
Oct 09 13:34:51 <javispedro> nm.
Oct 09 13:35:11 <frals> had to allow a lot of hosts in my adblocker to load it properly thou :(
Oct 09 13:36:54 <javispedro> same.
Oct 09 13:38:05 <Pavlov> X-Fade: hey, can you help me later push fennec b4 to maemo extras?
Oct 09 13:38:06 <javispedro> *yawn*
Oct 09 13:38:18 <javispedro> nothing serious so far...
Oct 09 13:38:27 <Pavlov> (and extras-testing, maybe?)
Oct 09 13:38:44 <tigert> Pavlov: you are the pavlov from gimp days?
Oct 09 13:38:47 <Pavlov> yep
Oct 09 13:38:50 <Pavlov> :)
Oct 09 13:38:53 <tigert> :)
Oct 09 13:38:53 <Pavlov> sup
Oct 09 13:38:59 <tigert> small world
Oct 09 13:39:03 <Pavlov> are you here in amsterdam?
Oct 09 13:39:09 <tigert> unfortunately not this year:/
Oct 09 13:39:10 * maswan waves from old #gimp days too :)
Oct 09 13:39:14 <Pavlov> alas :(
Oct 09 13:39:15 <tigert> sitting at my work desk in helsinki
Oct 09 13:39:22 <tigert> maswan: :)
Oct 09 13:40:10 <hendry> i don't understand the maemo5 SDK guide. there is no `af-sb-init.sh start` and after adding the Nokia apt line, what package do i need to install for the Nokia bins?
Oct 09 13:40:26 <javispedro> hendry: nokia-binaries and nokia-apps .
Oct 09 13:40:30 <tigert> should do an free-software-class-from-1996 reunion :)
Oct 09 13:40:47 <Pavlov> ha, yeah
Oct 09 13:42:25 <hendry> javispedro: i did that, but i get http://static.natalian.org/2009-10-09/nokia-depends.txt
Oct 09 13:42:59 <javispedro> hendry: run apt-get update, apt-get install maemo-sdk-debug, and apt-get -f install
Oct 09 13:43:33 <hendry> javispedro: Couldn't find package maemo-sdk-debug ?
Oct 09 13:43:35 <javispedro> prefix everything with "fakeroot"
Oct 09 13:43:59 <hendry> javispedro: oh are the packages installed in scratchbox??
Oct 09 13:44:26 <javispedro> yes... notice the prompts in the guide.
Oct 09 13:46:04 <hendry> javispedro: the process is a bit horrid let's be honest. i can't see the prompts in the guide.
Oct 09 13:46:14 <hendry> javispedro: though thanks for helping :)
Oct 09 13:46:47 <javispedro> http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo5_Final_Installation
Oct 09 13:47:09 <javispedro> hendry^^^: if you can find a single command without the prompt, tell me.
Oct 09 13:47:30 <zgold> anybody else having a horrendous time actually using the email app without it  crahing?
Oct 09 13:48:48 <frals> if you cant find af-sb-init make sure you installed nokia-binaries in the right target
Oct 09 13:49:06 <frals> x86/arm
Oct 09 13:49:08 <hendry> javispedro: couldn't the shell script alter sources.list and install the rest after prompting you for the API code?
Oct 09 13:49:26 <crashanddie> anyone fancy helping me install fremantle extras devel? I keep getting 404s
Oct 09 13:49:28 * hendry looks in horror as the 100s of deb packages are downloaded. bloooatt
Oct 09 13:49:49 <qwerty12> crashanddie: http://repository.maemo.org/extras/install/extras-devel-fremantle.install
Oct 09 13:49:57 <javispedro> hendry: but then who is going to tell you that sbox is like a chroot? ;)
Oct 09 13:50:02 <javispedro> actually, like two chroots.
Oct 09 13:50:09 <javispedro> (or more if you have older sdks)
Oct 09 13:50:28 <hendry> javispedro: how does a chroot prevent you from scripting it up?
Oct 09 13:50:43 <javispedro> hendry: what I mean is that now you know that sbox is a chroot
Oct 09 13:51:41 <hendry> javispedro: i know what scratchbox is... ? it's a chroot from cross compiling AFAIK
Oct 09 13:51:42 * mgedmin810 tired
Oct 09 13:51:54 <hendry> s/from/for
Oct 09 13:52:36 <mgedmin810> howto make n900 crawl: install an app
Oct 09 13:52:49 <mgedmin810> during installation the ui is not smooth
Oct 09 13:52:51 <javispedro> hendry: in which case, don't mind.
Oct 09 13:53:05 <crashanddie> qwerty: doesn't work
Oct 09 13:53:08 <ccooke> mgedmin810: just seen that myself
Oct 09 13:53:18 <ccooke> still, it
Oct 09 13:53:26 <qwerty12> It's the opposite for me
Oct 09 13:53:26 <mgedmin810> apps: where's fbreader for fremantle?  where's openssh?
Oct 09 13:53:29 <ccooke> s smooth the rest of the time
Oct 09 13:53:33 <mgedmin810> xchat would be nice too
Oct 09 13:53:35 <hendry> ok, now i need network
Oct 09 13:53:36 <javispedro> mgedmin810: aw. they already renice the dpkg process, I guess they should've iorenice'd it too.
Oct 09 13:54:07 <hendry> how do i get network running after `af-sb-init.sh start
Oct 09 13:54:33 <rikshot> hildon-desktop[7446]: GLIB WARNING ** ClutterX11 - Failed to get XImage of pixmap: 600055, removing <- whats with this?
Oct 09 13:54:36 <mgedmin810> facebook applet: if network is flaky and it can't validate, forgets your password
Oct 09 13:54:47 <ccooke> mgedmin810: I grabbed the dropbear client from diablo
Oct 09 13:54:52 <rikshot> no images are showing in the window when I open up applications
Oct 09 13:55:19 <mgedmin810> sync contacts/calendar via bt from nokia series 40 phone: utter and instant fail, no diagnostics
Oct 09 13:55:45 <crashanddie> qwerty12: that .install doesn't work. "No hash entry in release file"
Oct 09 13:56:01 <qwerty12> crashanddie: extras-devel is fucked-up then. *shrug*
Oct 09 13:56:10 <crashanddie> hmm damn
Oct 09 13:56:28 <qwerty12> Let me see if it updates here
Oct 09 13:57:01 <qwerty12> Nope
Oct 09 13:57:47 <crashanddie> ihmm, i'll have to slap dneary then
Oct 09 13:57:52 <hendry> are there any webkit fremantle builds i can play with?
Oct 09 13:58:13 <qwerty12> hendry: http://repository.maemo.org/extras-devel/pool/fremantle/non-free/w/webkit/
Oct 09 13:58:18 <qwerty12> (Uploaded by Bundyo)
Oct 09 13:58:43 <timeless> ok, I'm gone, see people tomorrow afternoon
Oct 09 14:00:39 <qwerty12> Oh, if any of you see Bundyo, please tell him that I expect money from him
Oct 09 14:00:45 <Jaffa> qwerty12: you need to promote Droid Fonts to extras-testing
Oct 09 14:00:47 * timsamoff phews.
Oct 09 14:01:10 <qwerty12> Jaffa: maemo-optify refuses to touch it and I've been busy with other stuff to optify it manually
Oct 09 14:01:55 <qwerty12> Blame Bundyo for the latest thing keeping me busy
Oct 09 14:02:15 <Jaffa> qwerty12: Post to -devlopers/m-vo if maemo-oprify's being crap
Oct 09 14:02:52 <Jaffa> There's a session this weekend about /opt so if you send me details, I'll raise it
Oct 09 14:03:08 <mgedmin810> email client kinda rules
Oct 09 14:03:23 <mgedmin810> japanese spam looks very pretty
Oct 09 14:03:45 <javispedro> hehe
Oct 09 14:04:13 <qwerty12> Jaffa: Not sure if it's maemo-optify's fault. From what I can see from its README, at least, it appears to be working correctly (expects files beginning with package's name (ttf-droid) but finds other named files instead (DroidSomething.ttf))
Oct 09 14:05:13 <Jaffa> qwerty12: Hmm
Oct 09 14:06:20 <qwerty12> I'll bring myself to read the CDBS documentation sometime, or just replace the rules file
Oct 09 14:06:48 <javispedro> cdbs! bring in the bibles!
Oct 09 14:06:51 <hendry> so i can't emulate armel binaries? `[sbox-FREMANTLE_ARMEL: ~] > af-sb-init.sh start` does not work by X86 does
Oct 09 14:07:15 <javispedro> hendry: known. according to nokia "armel is only for building".
Oct 09 14:07:21 <qwerty12> I'd rather have a multitude of VDs rather than use CDBS.
Oct 09 14:07:32 <qwerty12> *instead of using
Oct 09 14:08:12 <hendry> qwerty12: i want to try webkit builds http://repository.maemo.org/extras-devel/pool/fremantle/non-free/w/webkit/ ... but there are no X86 builds right?
Oct 09 14:08:16 <qwerty12> Nope
Oct 09 14:08:19 <javispedro> qwerty12: to part packages I've found using cdbs, it was usually easier to repackage than to try to fix them...
Oct 09 14:08:23 <javispedro> s/part/port
Oct 09 14:08:25 <hendry> javispedro: that's awful :(
Oct 09 14:08:37 <hendry> cdbs is god awful too
Oct 09 14:08:40 <qwerty12> hendry: Not for lack of trying; the X86 builder can't handle it...
Oct 09 14:08:45 <qwerty12> javispedro: same
Oct 09 14:08:49 <Mek> the problem with that mainly is that maemo uses horribly old versions of lots of debian package tools...
Oct 09 14:08:57 <javispedro> yes.
Oct 09 14:09:00 <hendry> qwerty12: so i need to buy a N900 :/
Oct 09 14:09:06 * javispedro remembers he needs to file dh_gconf bug someday.
Oct 09 14:09:22 <tor2_> cdbs works reasonably well for non-complex stuff. When I port stuff I can mostly get away with a rules file with 3 or 4 include lines, and some simple .install files.
Oct 09 14:09:38 <javispedro> qwerty12: does webkit x86 buid with fremantle's gcc version?
Oct 09 14:10:12 <qwerty12> javispedro: No idea, Bundyo does the building... But the WebKit ARMEL doesn't build with Fremantle's gcc
Oct 09 14:10:29 <javispedro> how cool.
Oct 09 14:10:56 <javispedro> and to think I once tried to build webkit with palm's arm compiler...... thank god I stopped trying and kept my sanity.
Oct 09 14:11:14 <qwerty12> In retrospect, his hacking of the source to make it build for Diablo may have something to do with that...
Oct 09 14:11:29 <mgedmin810> no way to select multiple msgs?
Oct 09 14:11:46 <qwerty12> hendry: It's worth it :p
Oct 09 14:12:35 <qwerty12> Need to finish off the packaging on Bundyo's Tear before I can try WebKit using it on an N900, myself...
Oct 09 14:13:23 <javispedro> this sudden craze for n900 webkit is because you finally found microb is still slow? :)
Oct 09 14:13:57 * qwerty12 grins with a self-satisfaction knowing he has never pressed 'c' in dh_make 
Oct 09 14:14:30 <mgedmin810> bug with imap folders: I see a list of msgs, can't open them
Oct 09 14:14:32 <javispedro> as in --copyright? :P
Oct 09 14:15:08 <qwerty12> javispedro: Err, yeah, I mean 'b'... Shows how much I use that option :p
Oct 09 14:15:16 <mgedmin810> hm,  works now
Oct 09 14:15:24 <javispedro> qwerty12: hehe
Oct 09 14:15:35 <mgedmin810> nope, msg not available on server
Oct 09 14:15:47 <qwerty12> javispedro: I like Tear, still use it on an N810, even. Curious to see how it works on an N900 :)
Oct 09 14:16:37 <mgedmin810> blaming packet loss
Oct 09 14:16:51 <mgedmin810> works now, really
Oct 09 14:17:40 <javispedro> blame magic.
Oct 09 14:18:11 <qwerty12> javispedro: put your voodoo doll away
Oct 09 14:18:19 <javispedro> you got me.
Oct 09 14:18:28 * javispedro hides n900 voodoo doll.
Oct 09 14:20:17 <javispedro> ah, sts must have done first mer talk by now.
Oct 09 14:20:55 <jeremiah> javispedro: Yeah, that one is over
Oct 09 14:21:13 <javispedro> know if there's anything planned for on-demand video?
Oct 09 14:21:20 <mgedmin810> srsly, modest confuses tapping and panning
Oct 09 14:21:24 <javispedro> i mean, was it recorded?
Oct 09 14:21:26 <mgedmin810> custom control?
Oct 09 14:21:37 <tor2_> Hmm, Maemo to be run on Zoom2, to be done by TI (quim gil twitter)
Oct 09 14:21:55 <javispedro> tor2_, a TI employee was on this channel yesterday for that reason.
Oct 09 14:22:01 <mgedmin810> am I releasing too quickly?
Oct 09 14:22:22 <tor2_> Ah, I wasn't in yesterday. Maybe I'll check the archives. Interesting in any case.
Oct 09 14:22:55 <Jaffa> tor2_: Interesting
Oct 09 14:23:29 <tor2_> If Zoom2 can do it then possibly my poor Beagle can too
Oct 09 14:23:42 <javispedro> tor2_, "maemo on beagle" project already exists.
Oct 09 14:23:56 <javispedro> beagleboard, of course.
Oct 09 14:24:15 <tor2_> javispedro: Is taht still alive? I thought it was superseded by Mer on beagle.. but then I could be wrong.
Oct 09 14:24:37 <Jaffa> tor2_: Nokians still interested in it, dunno about anyone else
Oct 09 14:24:48 <tor2_> IC
Oct 09 14:24:49 <Jaffa> RISC OS on beagle too
Oct 09 14:24:52 <javispedro> i don't know the specifics, but that was a Nokia project.
Oct 09 14:25:49 <qwerty12> Jaffa: lol
Oct 09 14:25:56 <mgedmin810> ah, there is a way to delete multiple apps
Oct 09 14:26:00 <mgedmin810> awesome
Oct 09 14:26:07 * tor2_ only gets the timeout whale when refreshing twitter for #maesum
Oct 09 14:30:10 <ccooke> interesting. the map has got me in the right building
Oct 09 14:32:06 <jedlhl> This is gunna sound a littl n00b-ish & I am tired LOL
Oct 09 14:32:13 <jedlhl> But  does anyone know of any work being done to port maemo to dell axim x50/1v or is maemo purely arm focused?
Oct 09 14:32:42 <t_s_o> i dont think there is much work to port maemo anywhere...
Oct 09 14:33:15 <tor2_> jedlhl: Axim is arm too, but I haven't heard about any maemo-on-axim project.
Oct 09 14:33:40 <jedlhl> its intel xscale (which i guess ias arm)
Oct 09 14:33:51 <tor2_> xscale is arm.
Oct 09 14:34:48 <jedlhl> is there alit of devices maemo is centred around mostly?
Oct 09 14:35:01 <jedlhl> 'list'
Oct 09 14:35:20 <jeremiah> Maemo is centered on Nokia's N770, N800, N810 and N900
Oct 09 14:35:30 <jeremiah> Mer is 'Maemo REloaded'
Oct 09 14:35:35 <tor2_> jedlhl: Maemo5 needs some heavy-duty 3D support (opengl etc.) and, just possibly, also newer Arm versions (e.g. cortex A8). Which the x50 won't have.
Oct 09 14:35:53 <Stskeeps> GLES for omap2 will be in few weeks from TI
Oct 09 14:35:59 <tor2_> So, Mer on Axim is a better possibility, presumably.
Oct 09 14:36:31 <jedlhl> oh i see never heard of MER, thanks
Oct 09 14:36:47 <tor2_> Stskeeps: That's good news for my N800 :-)
Oct 09 14:37:15 <jedlhl> im hop gto use the axim but ive found nothing so far some im startging to resign myself to the n900, i really dont want to spend cash but i am in neend of a mobile anyway
Oct 09 14:37:15 <tor2_> jedlhl: http://wiki.maemo.org/Mer IIRC
Oct 09 14:37:16 <Stskeeps> i am just happy my roadmap holds up
Oct 09 14:38:01 <tor2_> Stskeeps: You just did a talk at the summit, as I understand?
Oct 09 14:38:21 <Stskeeps> yes
Oct 09 14:38:39 <tor2_> Went well? Lots of folks interested in Mer, I presume?
Oct 09 14:38:47 <mgedmin810> shame about it taking forever
Oct 09 14:38:53 <Stskeeps> full room
Oct 09 14:38:57 <tor2_> :-)
Oct 09 14:39:04 <Stskeeps> not difficult
Oct 09 14:40:51 <jedlhl> @tor2: thanks i hang about MER to see if there's any interest brewing there, else i'll prolly be back here discussing my n800/900
Oct 09 14:49:16 <t_s_o> Stskeeps: so your saying one could potentially get maemo5 eyecandy going on N8x0?
Oct 09 14:50:56 <Stskeeps> not potentially, for sure
Oct 09 14:51:09 <luke-jr_> Stskeeps: is GLES really from TI?
Oct 09 14:51:25 <luke-jr_> I read something the other day suggesting the chipset was in fact from an outside company
Oct 09 14:51:29 <luke-jr_> just licensed by TI
Oct 09 14:52:05 <tor2_> luke-jr_: It's the driver/software that's currently missing for omap2, which is what TI will make available (as I understand it)
Oct 09 14:53:09 <luke-jr_> tor2_: I understand that
Oct 09 14:53:35 <Ceron^> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=muCPjK4nGY4
Oct 09 14:54:19 <tor2_> luke-jr_: The PowerVR chipset is from imgtec.
Oct 09 14:58:00 <coldboot> Does anyone know how to get ncurses for python installed on the Nokia n810?
Oct 09 14:58:20 <coldboot> This page says "curses is deprecated": http://pymaemo.garage.maemo.org/documentation/pymaemo_tutorial/python_maemo_howto.html
Oct 09 15:01:31 <coldboot> Why does /proc/$PID/io not exist on the Nokia n810?
Oct 09 15:03:14 <lizardo> coldboot: why do you need ncurses in python, just in case? :)
Oct 09 15:04:04 <lizardo> coldboot: ncurses support was disabled on PyMaemo until Maemo 4.x , for size restrictions
Oct 09 15:04:13 <lizardo> coldboot: on Fremantle it is enabled again
Oct 09 15:13:53 <ShadowJK> coldboot, io? never heard of it before, must be a very new feature :)
Oct 09 15:17:54 <Sargun_screen> What is this PyMaemo thing?
Oct 09 15:18:14 <Jaffa> Sargun_screen: Python port & bindings for Maemo
Oct 09 15:18:32 <Jaffa> jeremiah: I've got a URL for you from timeless
Oct 09 15:19:00 <lizardo> Sargun_screen: http://pymaemo.garage.maemo.org/
Oct 09 15:19:02 <rob-bo> Anyone knows how to compile a Qt4 app for Maemo?
Oct 09 15:19:12 <rob-bo> i have it running under debian i386
Oct 09 15:19:31 <rob-bo> But now have to build it for arm
Oct 09 15:20:02 <rob-bo> There's no qt4-make in scratchbox
Oct 09 15:21:36 <rob-bo> Hmm
Oct 09 15:21:38 <rob-bo> qmake
Oct 09 15:21:52 <Sargun_screen> Jaffa: so, that one could write a Python program wfor MAemo?
Oct 09 15:22:36 <tor2_> Sargun_screen: Many popular Maemo graphical apps are written in Python.
Oct 09 15:24:03 * Sargun_screen has abandoned his N810 since it was too slow, and the hardware was crappy. I'm going to upgrade to the new, stronger, manlier n900!
Oct 09 15:24:12 <Sargun_screen> So, I haven't ran Maemo in months.
Oct 09 15:24:38 <qwerty12> PyMaemo has been around for years...
Oct 09 15:24:41 <Sargun_screen> I wish there was a CDMA/EV-DO/WiMAX Nokia device.
Oct 09 15:24:41 <Sargun_screen> erm, nokia maemo.
Oct 09 15:27:41 * luke-jr_ wonders if it's legal to run your own WiMAX AP
Oct 09 15:28:16 <Sargun_screen> luke-jr_: Why not?
Oct 09 15:28:25 <luke-jr_> Sargun_screen: FCC?
Oct 09 15:28:29 <ShadowJK> luke-jr_, on the ISM band, sure
Oct 09 15:28:41 <Sargun_screen> Just make sureyour powerr levels are reasonable, and on the right bands.
Oct 09 15:28:47 <ShadowJK> right.
Oct 09 15:29:01 <Sargun_screen> You obviously can't run a 500 Watt AP on GSM bands.
Oct 09 15:29:07 <Sargun_screen> They might nuke you from orbit.
Oct 09 15:29:11 <ShadowJK> Or even 1 Watt
Oct 09 15:29:16 <Sargun_screen> Which would be bad.
Oct 09 15:29:24 <Sargun_screen> ShadowJK: On GSM bands? or unlicensed?
Oct 09 15:29:31 <ShadowJK> on gsm bands
Oct 09 15:29:36 <Sargun_screen> You could probably get away with ~5 watts on 2.5
Oct 09 15:29:40 <Sargun_screen> erm, 2.4
Oct 09 15:29:50 <luke-jr_> Sargun_screen: I think most people would disagree with my being nuked as bad
Oct 09 15:30:00 <ShadowJK> probably
Oct 09 15:30:14 <Sargun_screen> luke-jr_: Don't worry, you won't feel a thing.
Oct 09 15:30:18 * ShadowJK wonders how much power you can put out as CW in some of the lower HAM bands these days
Oct 09 15:30:39 <luke-jr_> ShadowJK: as long as you don't melt the CHEESE
Oct 09 15:30:39 <tor2_> 5 watts is quite a lot. You may not get away with it. IIRC 20dBM or lower will leave you out of any problems (that's not very much)
Oct 09 15:30:43 <Sargun_screen> Actually, considering how fast a nuclear asplosion is, depening on how close to it you are, it wont hurt.
Oct 09 15:30:56 <coldboot> lizardo: I wrote a Perl script to filter the output from iotop, but iotop needs curses for Python.
Oct 09 15:31:00 <Sargun_screen> tor2_: (I say this because I've gotten away with it)
Oct 09 15:31:24 <coldboot> ShadowJK: It's at least as old as hard drives, in this context. ;)
Oct 09 15:31:33 <luke-jr_> Sargun_screen: you've gotten away with a nuclear explosion?
Oct 09 15:31:40 <coldboot> But seriously, why is the /proc/$PID/io file missing? Anyone have any idea?
Oct 09 15:31:48 <tor2_> Heh, no inspector in your area :-) (you know, those guys in the vans full of antennas.. I had a visit once.)
Oct 09 15:31:50 <Sargun_screen> luke-jr_: No, but that'd be damn cool.
Oct 09 15:31:56 <ShadowJK> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ISM_band
Oct 09 15:32:04 <luke-jr_> coldboot: it's a relatively new feature, and Maemo uses a relatively old Linux
Oct 09 15:32:17 <coldboot> luke-jr_: ah ok
Oct 09 15:32:32 <lizardo> coldboot: are you using Fremantle ?
Oct 09 15:32:38 <lizardo> AKA Maemo 5
Oct 09 15:33:07 <Guest36234> hi all
Oct 09 15:33:12 <Sargun_screen>  No, Maemo 5 is actually using you.
Oct 09 15:33:26 <Sargun_screen> Maemo 5 assimilates its users.
Oct 09 15:33:35 <ccooke> join us
Oct 09 15:33:36 <luke-jr_> so true
Oct 09 15:33:37 <coldboot> lizardo: No, Diablo.
Oct 09 15:33:43 <coldboot> lizardo: I'm on a n810.
Oct 09 15:34:04 <mtc> is the summit being streamed (audio/video) ?
Oct 09 15:34:15 <Sargun_screen> ccooke: I will, once my N900 ships.
Oct 09 15:34:15 <lizardo> coldboot: well, I'm sorry to tell you that indeed Python on Diablo does not have ncurses support :(
Oct 09 15:34:21 * Sargun_screen wonders what Nokia is doing.
Oct 09 15:34:34 <Sargun_screen> IS it here yet? No.
Oct 09 15:34:42 <coldboot> lizardo: It seems like Maemo really doesn't want me to measure IO...
Oct 09 15:34:45 <lizardo> coldboot: doesn't iotop have a "non-interactive" mode that doesn't require ncurses
Oct 09 15:34:57 <lizardo> coldboot: because ncurses is more a GUI thing AFAIK
Oct 09 15:35:00 <coldboot> lizardo: It won't run, compile or install without it.
Oct 09 15:35:07 <Guest36234> i have openmoko freerunner neo. I want to install mer on it. I couldnt find image file at http://wiki.maemo.org/Mer/Releases/0.15 and i downloaded somewhere else. but It doesnt work. Can anyone help me please? I really want to use mer...
Oct 09 15:35:09 <coldboot> lizardo: It does, but I'd have to prune the code.
Oct 09 15:35:11 <JosefAssad> erm. Fremantle does have ncurses, no? /me likes his temrinal apps
Oct 09 15:35:20 <coldboot> lizardo: I'm guessing I can find some equivalent of /proc/$PID/io in the meantime.
Oct 09 15:35:28 <lizardo> coldboot: isn't iotop in Python (I might be thinking on another tool)
Oct 09 15:35:32 <lizardo> ?
Oct 09 15:35:36 <coldboot> lizardo: I just need to find how much writing/reading is done to a volume for a certain program.
Oct 09 15:35:56 <coldboot> lizardo: It is written in Python, but it needs curses to execute.
Oct 09 15:36:02 <coldboot> lizardo: curses for Python, that is.
Oct 09 15:36:29 <Guest36234> coldboot can you please help me also?
Oct 09 15:37:36 <Guest36234> ?
Oct 09 15:38:17 <Guest36234> can anyone help me?
Oct 09 15:38:41 <lizardo> coldboot: this page might help you: http://maemo.org/development/tools/diablo/
Oct 09 15:39:46 <lizardo> coldboot: specially: http://maemo.org/development/tools/doc/diablo/sysstat/
Oct 09 15:40:05 <Guest36234> lizardo i dont have maemo(mer) installed on my freerunner...
Oct 09 15:40:32 <qwerty12> Guest36234: #mer . Knock yourself out.
Oct 09 15:40:47 <Guest36234> ok
Oct 09 15:40:50 <Guest36234> thanks
Oct 09 15:41:20 <mgedmin810> 200 megs of swap used, slowdown barely noticeable
Oct 09 15:41:23 <mgedmin810> nokia guys did a great job with the n900
Oct 09 15:41:25 <coldboot> lizardo: Thanks
Oct 09 15:45:38 <user_> was kate's presentation recorded?
Oct 09 15:51:57 <jeremiah> user_: Yeah.
Oct 09 15:52:13 <jeremiah> I'm not sure where it is, but I am certain it was recorded.
Oct 09 15:52:27 <lopz> hi ;)
Oct 09 15:52:28 <jeremiah> I think nearly everything here is being recorded.
Oct 09 15:54:10 <jeremiah> Cold here in the N800 rooms
Oct 09 15:54:15 <jeremiah> or room rather
Oct 09 15:54:29 <coldboot> lizardo: So I've got the amount of blocks written with iostat, do you know how to find out the size per block?
Oct 09 15:54:32 <jeremiah> Going to work on my presentation in the hangout lounge.
Oct 09 15:55:40 <lizardo> coldboot: well, I never used this tool, I just remembered of the site :)
Oct 09 15:57:18 <mgedmin810> coldboot: typically 1 block is 1 kb
Oct 09 15:58:08 * mgedmin810 still kinda overwhelmed by the summit
Oct 09 15:58:10 <lizardo> coldboot: but, if the filesystem is ext2/3, you can get it using e.g. : sudo dumpe2fs /dev/sda1 | grep 'Block size:'
Oct 09 15:58:16 <coldboot> lizardo: vfat
Oct 09 15:58:24 <mgedmin810> unrelated
Oct 09 15:58:38 <mgedmin810> iostat reports in 1kb units always
Oct 09 15:58:42 <coldboot> ah ok
Oct 09 15:59:06 <mgedmin810> I think
Oct 09 15:59:10 <coldboot> And iostat seems to accumulate these numbers.
Oct 09 15:59:14 <mgedmin810> ;)
Oct 09 16:01:40 <tor2_> Damn, someone stole sjgadsby's N900 box from under his chair (twitter)
Oct 09 16:02:08 <lizardo> coldboot: well, you could also try "stat -f /some/file" where some file is a file on that filesystem, and look at the "Block size:"  (not tested with a vfat partition)
Oct 09 16:02:42 <Shapeshifter> So, at this summit, is everyone walking around looking down on an N8x0 constantly walking into each other while talking on irc?
Oct 09 16:03:06 <mgedmin810> nope, some of us look down on an N900
Oct 09 16:03:14 <Shapeshifter> lucky
Oct 09 16:05:31 <mtc> no info on summit streaming?  guess we'll have to wait for the recordings to be published
Oct 09 16:05:54 <mtc> hope the talks have the microphones set up near the speakers - not like last year
Oct 09 16:06:10 <mtc> rather, earlier this year ;)
Oct 09 16:06:56 <mtc> the maemo/mozilla recordings were rough
Oct 09 16:09:10 * ShadowJK wonders if assuming 512 byte block size would "just work"
Oct 09 16:09:44 <frals> i know what assumption is the mother to.. ;)
Oct 09 16:10:06 <frals> s/to/of maybe
Oct 09 16:26:19 <frals> cant wait to see some footage of q3 running on the n900
Oct 09 16:29:49 <johnsq> Hi
Oct 09 16:39:45 <iDialekt> Sweet Jesus
Oct 09 16:39:55 <iDialekt> Is this channel really that popular?
Oct 09 16:40:00 <Shapeshifter> tis
Oct 09 16:40:05 <iDialekt> Or are we all bots posing?
Oct 09 16:40:16 <iDialekt> Guess so lol
Oct 09 16:40:20 <Shapeshifter> I am.
Oct 09 16:40:39 <iDialekt> So what's the latest? Are we still excited for the n900?
Oct 09 16:40:43 <SpeedEvil> most people lurk.
Oct 09 16:40:50 <SpeedEvil> We're all waiting for the n920.
Oct 09 16:41:02 <Shapeshifter> well yeah. but there aren't many people here now actually because they're all hanging out in amsterdam
Oct 09 16:41:04 <iDialekt> Yeah with AT&T support right?
Oct 09 16:41:05 <SpeedEvil> It will be thinner, lighter, smaller, and have a 17" monitor.
Oct 09 16:41:55 <iDialekt> It's so hard for me to ever switch devices anymore
Oct 09 16:42:02 <iDialekt> Used to be hardcore symbian fan
Oct 09 16:42:17 <SpeedEvil> You mean as you lose all your stuff?
Oct 09 16:42:19 <iDialekt> But they lost me after the 5800
Oct 09 16:42:34 <iDialekt> No as in im finally content
Oct 09 16:42:40 <iDialekt> With the iPhone 3gs.
Oct 09 16:42:40 <SpeedEvil> ah
Oct 09 16:42:46 <Shapeshifter> >.>
Oct 09 16:42:50 <SpeedEvil> If you like it, stick with that.
Oct 09 16:42:55 <iDialekt> Really takes a lot to want to ever switch
Oct 09 16:43:08 <Guest58058> clearly never tried the Pre
Oct 09 16:43:10 <Guest58058> ^_^
Oct 09 16:43:14 <SpeedEvil> We don't really care that other people use other things.
Oct 09 16:43:21 <iDialekt> Because there will be devices with more features but less than what the entire package consists of
Oct 09 16:43:41 <Guest58058> lol ig'nant
Oct 09 16:43:51 <iDialekt> Ease of use and app support.. And intuitiveness is big to me
Oct 09 16:44:06 <iDialekt> I tried the pre but maybe too early
Oct 09 16:44:11 <Guest58058> maemo and webos have both of those things over iphone
Oct 09 16:44:24 <Guest58058> astroturfer/
Oct 09 16:44:30 <iDialekt> How so ?
Oct 09 16:44:41 <Guest58058> who comes pimpin' apple inna nokia channel?
Oct 09 16:44:50 <iDialekt> Trust me I've owned more devices than one can imagine
Oct 09 16:44:56 <iDialekt> Im not pimping anything
Oct 09 16:45:01 <SpeedEvil> iDialekt: Well - go away and don't bother us, and when you get your hands on a n900 to try, report back and say if you like it.
Oct 09 16:45:02 <Guest58058> i can imagine an awful lot --Han Solo
Oct 09 16:45:28 <iDialekt> Oh come on. Please don't be zealots.
Oct 09 16:45:31 <SpeedEvil> Wandering into random channels saying you like your iphone isn't really productive for anyone, if you haven't experienced the alternative.
Oct 09 16:45:40 <Guest58058> ...said the iphone fanboi
Oct 09 16:45:48 <Guest58058> i'm not a zealot, i love maemo AND webos over iphone
Oct 09 16:45:57 <iDialekt> Ok which is fine
Oct 09 16:46:06 <iDialekt> But I come here to find out why
Oct 09 16:46:11 <Guest58058> and i tell them both that. you don't see me in #apple talking trash ;)
Oct 09 16:46:19 <Guest58058> then hush, and lurk, no trolling
Oct 09 16:46:20 <iDialekt> I come from a long list of symbian phones
Oct 09 16:46:25 <iDialekt> Favorite was the e90
Oct 09 16:46:26 <mtc> everytime I see that word zealot used, my bloodpressure goes up...
Oct 09 16:46:28 <Guest58058> ew, symbian is bleh
Oct 09 16:46:35 <Guest58058> no wonder you're jaded
Oct 09 16:46:39 <SpeedEvil> symbian and maemo have relatively little.
Oct 09 16:47:12 <SpeedEvil> ^to to with each other
Oct 09 16:47:15 <iDialekt> the little of maemo I experinced was an old n8""
Oct 09 16:47:22 <iDialekt> 800
Oct 09 16:47:33 <iDialekt> It was nothing close to a phone
Oct 09 16:47:40 <Mousey> because it WASN'T a phone
Oct 09 16:47:42 <Mousey> to begin with
Oct 09 16:47:44 <iDialekt> But I don't think that was it's intention
Oct 09 16:48:11 <Shapeshifter> iDialekt: you asked "why" (we/I like maemo): open, easy to port to, easy to code for, familiar, free, feature rich, flexible. And why I find the n900 appealing: brilliant resolution, keyboard, loads of tech gadgets, power.
Oct 09 16:48:24 <iDialekt> But the user interface was a bit clunky but it was probably too early
Oct 09 16:48:29 <Mousey> all the things the iphone ain't
Oct 09 16:48:50 <Shapeshifter> iDialekt: have you watched any n900 clips on youtube, or have you read any reviews?
Oct 09 16:48:55 <iDialekt> Ah. What makes the iPhone hard to code for?
Oct 09 16:48:59 <Mousey> nobody's gonna kick google voice apps off the nseries
Oct 09 16:49:02 <iDialekt> Objective c?
Oct 09 16:49:12 <iDialekt> Mouse : true lol
Oct 09 16:49:24 <Shapeshifter> iDialekt: I didn't say it was hard to code for the iphone.
Oct 09 16:49:26 <iDialekt> Shapeshifter: And yes I nearly wet my pants
Oct 09 16:49:38 <Shapeshifter> iDialekt: I said it was easy to code for maemo ;)
Oct 09 16:49:40 <iDialekt> It's like everything I wanted in an e90
Oct 09 16:49:52 <jeremiah> And, don't forget what jzemlin said today: Apple takes 30% of your gross revenue!
Oct 09 16:49:55 <jeremiah> FAIL
Oct 09 16:49:56 <iDialekt> And 580"
Oct 09 16:50:00 <iDialekt> 5800
Oct 09 16:50:25 <Mousey> apple takes 30% of revenue for code they didn't even write?
Oct 09 16:50:34 <Mousey> like it's some kinda PRIVILEDGE to write for iphone?
Oct 09 16:50:37 <Mousey> lol
Oct 09 16:50:38 <Shapeshifter> here's a reason http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/9/93/OpenOffice_Writer_in_Maemo_5.jpg (not because it's OO, but proof of conecpt, show-off of portability and flexibility)
Oct 09 16:50:42 <luke-jr> Mousey: wow, fail
Oct 09 16:50:55 <iDialekt> Nokia has been a favorite because they always have high quality hardware
Oct 09 16:51:07 <luke-jr> iDialekt: they do? :p
Oct 09 16:51:12 <luke-jr> depends on what you compare with
Oct 09 16:51:12 <iDialekt> Cameras were pretty much untouchable and unseen on any other crappy smartphone
Oct 09 16:51:30 <iDialekt> Well yeah not compared to Sony or some lgs maybe
Oct 09 16:51:34 <Mousey> except treo >700
Oct 09 16:51:36 * luke-jr notes at least the N810's camera totally sucks
Oct 09 16:51:52 <iDialekt> But generally there wasn't any popular PDAs with great cameras ever
Oct 09 16:51:59 <Mousey> except the Zire
Oct 09 16:52:11 <ShadowJK> the n810 has a webcam not a camera :-)
Oct 09 16:52:12 <Mousey> oh wait, no their cameras sucked too
Oct 09 16:52:25 <Mousey> ShadowJK: except that video had to be hacked in
Oct 09 16:52:26 <luke-jr> ShadowJK: no difference in my mind
Oct 09 16:52:32 <ShadowJK> N900 has both webcam and video
Oct 09 16:52:37 <ShadowJK> uh both webcam and camera
Oct 09 16:52:42 <range> Ignore
Oct 09 16:53:05 <ShadowJK> the front camera on N900 is probably same quality as N810 ;-)
Oct 09 16:53:08 <range> Well, that went well :) Sorry.
Oct 09 16:53:18 <Mousey> lol
Oct 09 16:53:45 <iDialekt> Wow.
Oct 09 16:54:25 <iDialekt> I seriously didn't come here closed minded. Sheesh. Thanks for your responses shape an mousey
Oct 09 16:54:27 <Mousey> yah that was fun.. now on to #webos-internals to figure out how to upgrade Preware, before i get my replacement n810.. oh, or n900.. maybe.. jury's still out
Oct 09 16:54:29 <Shapeshifter> iDialekt: did I mention multitasking? X-D
Oct 09 16:54:54 <Mousey> Shapeshifter: yes, in a massively multitasking way
Oct 09 16:54:56 <GeneralAntilles> Ah, qwerty12, you're my hero. :P
Oct 09 16:55:02 <iDialekt> Im concerned with something minor like portrait mode
Oct 09 16:55:07 <iDialekt> On the n900
Oct 09 16:55:09 <qwerty12> GeneralAntilles: hehe
Oct 09 16:55:52 <Shapeshifter> iDialekt: if you can bear using both hands most of the time, it shouldn't be an issue. and if you're lucky, your favorite app gets portrait support by community
Oct 09 16:56:21 <Mousey> listen to pandora and use google maps and have 3 web pages open at the same time? NOT BLOODY LIKELY
Oct 09 16:56:29 <Mousey> lol apple
Oct 09 16:56:41 <iDialekt> Well that's good to know.
Oct 09 16:56:50 <GeneralAntilles> qwerty12, how do I get a system beep over dbus?
Oct 09 16:56:56 <iDialekt> What is the pre based off of?
Oct 09 16:57:02 <Mousey> linux, just like maemo is
Oct 09 16:57:02 <GeneralAntilles> I lost it for a little while last night and didn't have mplayer to start playing music. :D
Oct 09 16:57:07 <iDialekt> Like what Os? Is it unix?
Oct 09 16:57:09 <iDialekt> Oh wow
Oct 09 16:57:12 <Shapeshifter> iDialekt: to tell you what my biggest concerns are with the phone yet: 1. screen scratches easily 2. battery life 3. no compas (gadget, but would be nice) 4. keyboard to small / bad (I don't like the one on the n97)
Oct 09 16:57:12 <qwerty12> GeneralAntilles: Sorry?
Oct 09 16:57:12 <GeneralAntilles> Linux kernel
Oct 09 16:57:19 <GeneralAntilles> Palm proprietary userspace.
Oct 09 16:57:26 <Mousey> no, only luna is proprietary
Oct 09 16:57:38 <GeneralAntilles> iDialekt, whereas Maemo is Linux kernel and mostly open userspace.
Oct 09 16:57:44 <ShadowJK> Yeah but you can't access the regular userland, right?
Oct 09 16:57:46 <GeneralAntilles> iDialekt, X11/GTK/Qt
Oct 09 16:57:49 <Mousey> yes you can
Oct 09 16:57:57 <iDialekt> Shapeshifter: Probably the same things i was worried about
Oct 09 16:57:58 <ShadowJK> I thought it was closed
Oct 09 16:58:03 <iDialekt> Especialy the screen scratching
Oct 09 16:58:05 <Mousey> its not closed
Oct 09 16:58:15 <ShadowJK> but no X, right?
Oct 09 16:58:16 <iDialekt> And reading about maemo 6 makes me angry lol
Oct 09 16:58:22 <Mousey> ShadowJK: that's correct, luna
Oct 09 16:58:23 * ccooke wonders
Oct 09 16:58:35 <Mousey> but underneath you'll find all the same packages you'd find at the CLI on maemo
Oct 09 16:58:36 <Shapeshifter> iDialekt: I'll buy it anyway as I can't stand the iphone. Mainly because of iTunes and the fact that you can't share data between apps. it's soo stupid. Can't open an attachment from mail in an editor app or something
Oct 09 16:58:40 <ShadowJK> I guess there's nothing like an xterm there?
Oct 09 16:58:45 <ShadowJK> or similar
Oct 09 16:58:46 <Shapeshifter> iDialekt: imo the iphone OS is insanely stupid.
Oct 09 16:58:48 <Mousey> bash, ssh, dropbear, binutils
Oct 09 16:58:57 <Mousey> Shapeshifter: ditto
Oct 09 16:59:01 <ShadowJK> Mousey, I thought that stuff was locked out
Oct 09 16:59:02 <qwerty12> Shapeshifter: IMO? :)
Oct 09 16:59:03 <iDialekt> Capacitive multitouch on maemo 6
Oct 09 16:59:06 <Mousey> ShadowJK: not even close
Oct 09 16:59:16 <Shapeshifter> ^^
Oct 09 16:59:28 <Mousey> i use my old nokia n810 microusb cable to charge my pre, and also to get a terminal window,
Oct 09 16:59:49 <ShadowJK> ah well, pre and n900 are same category right now: unavailable :)
Oct 09 16:59:57 <Mousey> i'm telling you, between the pre and the n810, there's no better mobile solution combination
Oct 09 17:00:00 <ShadowJK> but n900 will hopefulyl be available in a few weeks :)
Oct 09 17:00:12 <iDialekt> Hmm good point Shapeshifter but I've become blinded by all the workarounds and jailbreaking community
Oct 09 17:00:14 <Mousey> ShadowJK: huh? pre's been out since august
Oct 09 17:00:22 <iDialekt> Which make the device tolerable in my every day life
Oct 09 17:00:25 <ShadowJK> Mousey, in "select" markets like N900
Oct 09 17:00:28 <Shapeshifter> iDialekt: ah. maybe jailbroken it is any good.
Oct 09 17:00:33 <Shapeshifter> no idea about that.
Oct 09 17:00:38 <Mousey> no need to jailbreak the n8xx, n900, or pre.. the vendors WANT you to have full access
Oct 09 17:01:00 <ccooke> nnevening, all
Oct 09 17:01:05 <Mousey> ShadowJK: check this out:
Oct 09 17:01:06 <iDialekt> I used to do the whole custom rom thing on android and windows mobile but it just got exhausting
Oct 09 17:01:06 <Mousey> root@castle:/# uname -a
Oct 09 17:01:06 <Mousey> Linux castle 2.6.24-palm-joplin-3430 #1 175.1.23.1.1.1.1 armv7l unknown
Oct 09 17:01:21 <Mousey> good thing that's not needed for nokia or palm
Oct 09 17:01:27 <coldboot> Did you have to jailbreak the Apple Newton?
Oct 09 17:01:37 <qwerty12> Mousey: 2.6.28 on this N900
Oct 09 17:01:46 <iDialekt> Android still seems like it has potential given better hardware but it feels like a glorified blackberry
Oct 09 17:01:52 <ShadowJK> hm
Oct 09 17:01:55 <Shapeshifter> iDialekt: hardware?
Oct 09 17:02:10 <Mousey> qwerty12: yea, you're awesome, i don't have one yet, so i can't brag about THAT yet. =(
Oct 09 17:02:12 <iDialekt> Yeah the g1 is trash
Oct 09 17:02:19 <Shapeshifter> iDialekt: anyway, imo android is too closed. It's too much of a bother.
Oct 09 17:02:23 <iDialekt> And the hero ain't too shabby but week
Oct 09 17:02:25 <Shapeshifter> iDialekt: ah yes, of course.
Oct 09 17:02:31 <iDialekt> Lol really too closed?
Oct 09 17:02:32 <qwerty12> Mousey: I just wanted a version war :p
Oct 09 17:02:34 <GeneralAntilles> coldboot, lol, jailbreak to get to what? ;)
Oct 09 17:02:35 <Mousey> Shapeshifter: yah, webos is way more open than android
Oct 09 17:02:43 <GeneralAntilles> coldboot, wasn't really a lot to the Newton.
Oct 09 17:02:46 <Mousey> qwerty12: =P apples and oranges =)
Oct 09 17:02:48 <ShadowJK> wtf
Oct 09 17:02:51 <GeneralAntilles> coldboot, but you could install any application you wanted.
Oct 09 17:02:54 <ShadowJK> I can't even find pre on amazon
Oct 09 17:03:10 <Mousey> hell, the pre even has pulseaudio
Oct 09 17:03:15 <iDialekt> I understand being open and etc but for a phone OS im sure there has to be some kind of standards and etc
Oct 09 17:03:18 <Mousey> not that that's a bragging point, i hate pulseaudio
Oct 09 17:03:26 <Shapeshifter> iDialekt: you have to root it. that's too much already. and now custom roms can't be distributed anymore because of binary stuff and they aren't organized for cutomization. Unlike the maemo repo system which makes everything real easy, even with the proprietary stuff.
Oct 09 17:03:27 <coldboot> I'm guessing someone in here must have had a Newton.
Oct 09 17:03:27 <ShadowJK> and there was a news article about europe availability, and that only mentione selling through operators...
Oct 09 17:03:34 <Mousey> oh, i have a question
Oct 09 17:03:37 <ShadowJK> I guess general availability is a few months (or years) off then :/
Oct 09 17:03:38 <qwerty12> Mousey: Damn, I was gonna say that the N900 uses it too..
Oct 09 17:03:39 <iDialekt> Im sure none of you use a mac right? Id assume not from your responses so far lol
Oct 09 17:03:46 <Mousey> will the n900, or rather Maemo finally have java?
Oct 09 17:04:08 <ShadowJK> It does not have java
Oct 09 17:04:14 <iDialekt> Oh yeah that c guy just got hit with a terminate or fail notice I think
Oct 09 17:04:14 <Shapeshifter> iDialekt: By court ruling, I can get nearer then 20ft to a mac >.>
Oct 09 17:04:19 <ccooke> Mousey: not by default, but sun has an arm build now
Oct 09 17:04:20 <ShadowJK> as for "will", that depends whether someone will do it
Oct 09 17:04:20 <iDialekt> Cynogen
Oct 09 17:04:25 <GeneralAntilles> coldboot, two.
Oct 09 17:04:33 <Shapeshifter> *can't
Oct 09 17:04:39 <iDialekt> Shapeshifter: What do you use?
Oct 09 17:04:41 <coldboot> lizardo: Block sizes are 2052 per megabyte
Oct 09 17:04:47 <coldboot> lizardo: Done experimentally.
Oct 09 17:04:47 <GeneralAntilles> iDialekt, lots of Mac users in here.
Oct 09 17:05:02 <Mousey> freetype, fuse, ext3, dosfsutils, curl, alsa, bzip, busybox, (bash too in my case), gnutls, sysvinit.. i'm tryna figure out how webos isn't just another linux distro
Oct 09 17:05:07 <iDialekt> GeneralAntilles: Sorry was just curious
Oct 09 17:05:20 <iDialekt> I feel like maybe some were anti apple
Oct 09 17:05:28 <Mousey> i'm anti apple
Oct 09 17:05:29 <Shapeshifter> iDialekt: linux. on my laptop I have XP in virtualbox for emergencies and it runs very fast.
Oct 09 17:05:30 <iDialekt> Maybe it's just anti JesusPhone lol
Oct 09 17:05:30 <GeneralAntilles> Some of the Mac users are, even. ;)
Oct 09 17:05:40 <qwerty12> Mousey: Does its balls hang low? If not, then it isn't another Linux distro
Oct 09 17:05:50 <GeneralAntilles> Personally, I've become very dissatisfied with the moves they've been making in their mobile division.
Oct 09 17:05:52 <Mousey> qwerty12: i think it's a girl
Oct 09 17:06:16 <ShadowJK> the lack of X makes it harder to bring new software to it
Oct 09 17:06:18 <qwerty12> Mousey: That's what they want you to think
Oct 09 17:06:18 <iDialekt> It's weird because I may have different views on the apple iPhone
Oct 09 17:06:21 <ShadowJK> but since there's presumably framebuffer, getting mplayer to run on it should be easy :)
Oct 09 17:06:26 <Mousey> personally, i think they create shiny polished garbage and sell it to unsuspecting untechnical consumers
Oct 09 17:06:29 <Shapeshifter> the window manager of OS X is totally unusable.
Oct 09 17:06:36 <iDialekt> Onlybecause im looking at it from a consumer perspective
Oct 09 17:06:38 <Shapeshifter> main reason why I don't like macs. And there's no replacement WM
Oct 09 17:06:48 <Mousey> qwerty12: its got nice boobs
Oct 09 17:06:53 <iDialekt> WM?
Oct 09 17:06:58 <Shapeshifter> iDialekt: window manager
Oct 09 17:07:02 <iDialekt> oh
Oct 09 17:07:14 <qwerty12> Mousey: Sometimes, "nice" boobs are not just common to women...
Oct 09 17:07:21 <Mousey> after using kde4+compiz, there's no way in hell apple or microsoft will beat the linux desktop user interface
Oct 09 17:07:21 <iDialekt> I guess that's beyond me
Oct 09 17:07:35 <Mousey> qwerty12: woah.. well i try not to frequent that part of town. ;)
Oct 09 17:07:35 <Shapeshifter> Mousey: compiz standalone :)
Oct 09 17:07:42 <iDialekt> My biggest gripe with Linux is popularity, compatibility
Oct 09 17:07:50 <iDialekt> Im all about standards
Oct 09 17:07:51 <qwerty12> zerojay: <3 Streets of Rage
Oct 09 17:07:57 <Mousey> if popularity is a gripe, i question your standards
Oct 09 17:08:17 <iDialekt> Popularity = consumer support
Oct 09 17:08:19 <Mousey> neither maemo or webos are all that popular, but they're head and shoulders above anything apple's ever made
Oct 09 17:08:36 <iDialekt> Head and shoulders in terms of features etc
Oct 09 17:08:42 <Mousey> and stability
Oct 09 17:08:50 <Mousey> and not-fscking-you-in-the-ass-ity
Oct 09 17:08:50 <ShadowJK> my biggest gripe with Windows is compatibility and software availability. I end up installing Msys, Mingw, coreutils, an X server, and then I realize I've basically spent a week installing linux userland tools on windows before getting any work done, and might just as well go back to a linux distro ;p
Oct 09 17:08:56 <Mousey> and not outrageously expensive
Oct 09 17:08:59 <Mousey> well.. the n900 maybe
Oct 09 17:09:01 <Mousey> ;)
Oct 09 17:09:10 <iDialekt> Lol
Oct 09 17:09:12 <Shapeshifter> iDialekt: well, to break down what I find wrong with the OS X WM: can't resize windows from edges, have to aim for lower right corner. Shouldn't be neccessary anway as Alt-Middleclick should also resize but that is lacking as well. Maximumize button does random resizing. Alt-Tab doesn't switch between windows but tasks and every app uses a different hotkey for in-task window switching. Stupid dock wastes space on both sides.
Oct 09 17:09:17 <ShadowJK> bah, N900 is cheap ;)
Oct 09 17:09:34 <Shapeshifter> iDialekt: oh, and for some insane reasoning, <ENTER> renames files
Oct 09 17:09:37 <Shapeshifter> >.> !! wtf
Oct 09 17:09:46 <Shapeshifter> enter?? why?? why not F2 as any other sane system
Oct 09 17:09:46 <iDialekt> Shapeshifter: Fair enough
Oct 09 17:09:51 <iDialekt> Lol
Oct 09 17:09:51 <Shapeshifter> enter should open the dir/file, not rename it
Oct 09 17:09:54 <Mousey> here's how you know apple's a sham. 2009? still one mouse button
Oct 09 17:10:01 <iDialekt> I love my mac unfortunately
Oct 09 17:10:17 <Mousey> you should cheat on your mac with ubuntu
Oct 09 17:10:25 <iDialekt> I miss windows at times
Oct 09 17:10:32 <Mousey> ubuntu runs faster on your mac than osx does
Oct 09 17:10:34 <iDialekt> especially with windows 7 nearing
Oct 09 17:10:46 <iDialekt> But steve balmer makes me angry
Oct 09 17:10:55 <Shapeshifter> Mousey: though, ubuntu is about the slowest linux to install ;)
Oct 09 17:11:10 <Mousey> heh, good thing you won't have to reinstall it every 6 months like with windows
Oct 09 17:11:11 <iDialekt> Mousey watched my roomate Struggle with ubuntu
Oct 09 17:11:14 <iDialekt> No way
Oct 09 17:11:40 <Mousey> thats right, not popular enough for you..
Oct 09 17:11:55 * qwerty12 gives Shapeshifter Windows 2000 to install
Oct 09 17:11:57 <Mousey> its all clearchannel stations for you, and network tv, too
Oct 09 17:12:09 <iDialekt> Didn't mean it like that
Oct 09 17:12:10 <Mousey> if it's not in the top 40 it must be crap
Oct 09 17:12:18 <iDialekt> More about community support maybe
Oct 09 17:12:21 <Mousey> lol
Oct 09 17:12:25 * Shapeshifter puts CD into paper shredder
Oct 09 17:12:25 <Mousey> ubuntu not about community support?
Oct 09 17:12:29 <Mousey> that's hilarity
Oct 09 17:12:33 <iDialekt> Im sure it's huge
Oct 09 17:12:39 <Mousey> that's ALL it is
Oct 09 17:12:44 <iDialekt> If you know where to look
Oct 09 17:12:50 <Mousey> ok this was fun.. i'm out of troll food..
Oct 09 17:12:51 <iDialekt> What about hardware.
Oct 09 17:12:55 * Mousey goes off for coffee
Oct 09 17:12:58 <GeneralAntilles> crashanddie, I'm going to end up with a half-dozen of these things I have to return and no real ones. :P
Oct 09 17:13:14 <Mousey> what about hardware??
Oct 09 17:13:17 <Shapeshifter> iDialekt: ubuntu is okay for a linux noob. does many things out of the box. any other linux would probably be even more worrying.
Oct 09 17:13:21 <Mousey> everybody knows linux has better hardware support than windows
Oct 09 17:13:22 <Mousey> sheesh
Oct 09 17:13:27 <Shapeshifter> iDialekt: hardware suuport ain't bad.
Oct 09 17:13:48 <Shapeshifter> Mousey: "better"?
Oct 09 17:14:03 <iDialekt> Jesus why is every channel so different but all end up with the same quick to call troll comments
Oct 09 17:14:05 <Mousey> Shapeshifter: no, officially better
Oct 09 17:14:16 <iDialekt> People inquiring blindfolded doesn't mean trolling
Oct 09 17:14:18 <GeneralAntilles> xterm does not handle not having a tty well.
Oct 09 17:14:23 <Mousey> its taken me half an hour to call you a troll
Oct 09 17:14:26 <Mousey> that's hardly quick
Oct 09 17:14:37 <Mousey> but saying things like "quick to call troll" especially after half an hour
Oct 09 17:14:43 <Mousey> that's trollin'
Oct 09 17:14:44 <Shapeshifter> I don't really see iDialekt trolling >.>
Oct 09 17:14:56 <Mousey> Shapeshifter: my standards are higher i guess
Oct 09 17:15:04 <Mousey> which is funny, cuz i'm such a loudmouth myself
Oct 09 17:15:16 <iDialekt> Im just trying to find out more information outside of a forum or etc
Oct 09 17:15:17 <GeneralAntilles> iDialekt, it's an easy out when somebody doesn't feel like discussing something anymore. :P
Oct 09 17:15:29 <Mousey> GeneralAntilles: touche'
Oct 09 17:15:38 <iDialekt> I like hearing it from an irc perspective, instant feedback etc
Oct 09 17:15:45 * Mousey still hasn't gotten coffee or updated preware
Oct 09 17:16:10 <iDialekt> Every channel is so different but similar in defending their OS lol
Oct 09 17:16:10 <Mousey> i do like that Maemo uses X
Oct 09 17:16:13 <mtc> some slides and comments from the summit : http://ur1.ca/d9hx  (Maemo5 is "DRM-ready"!)
Oct 09 17:16:13 <Shapeshifter> iDialekt: well, the feedback being: n900 > pre > android > * > iphone
Oct 09 17:16:27 <Mousey> Shapeshifter: i'm withya
Oct 09 17:16:30 <iDialekt> That makes sense
Oct 09 17:16:40 <Mousey> i think i'm mostly high on webos right now cuz i don't have my n810 anymore =(
Oct 09 17:16:49 <Mousey> i'm not convinced i need two phones
Oct 09 17:16:52 <solarion> I just wanna know why I'm getting a floating point exception when running my code. :(
Oct 09 17:16:54 <iDialekt> That's a solid assessment
Oct 09 17:17:03 <Mousey> but i'm gonna take GeneralAntilles's advice and wait for the n900 before i go bargin hunting
Oct 09 17:17:10 <GeneralAntilles> qwerty12, WTF did Nokia do to the layouts?
Oct 09 17:17:20 <Mousey> but not having my tablet is REALLY hampering my ability to sysadmin my home network =(
Oct 09 17:17:22 <iDialekt> The pre screen is too small for my tastes
Oct 09 17:17:32 <Mousey> iDialekt: then you'd hate the Pixi
Oct 09 17:17:41 <iDialekt> And the pixi looks like
Oct 09 17:17:46 <qwerty12> GeneralAntilles: What layouts? (Sorry, I'm really quite tired)
Oct 09 17:17:47 <iDialekt> Yeah you beat me
Oct 09 17:17:48 <iDialekt> Lol
Oct 09 17:17:55 <GeneralAntilles> qwerty12, xmodmap seems to just be breaking keys.
Oct 09 17:18:06 <Mousey> still, you're missing a lot dissing it outright without even using it
Oct 09 17:18:17 <Mousey> ESPECIALLY compared to the friggin' ipwn
Oct 09 17:18:17 <iDialekt> No not dissing
Oct 09 17:18:34 <iDialekt> Just saying I don't like the hardware currently
Oct 09 17:18:40 <qwerty12> GeneralAntilles: Ah. Dunno, I still haven't remapped my keys and in the rare times that I've done so (on an N810), I've resorted to modifying the layout file directly :)
Oct 09 17:18:45 <iDialekt> I don't knownwhats in store
Oct 09 17:19:11 <iDialekt> But android is spitting out phones but more useless hardware all using the dame CPU speeds
Oct 09 17:19:12 <iDialekt> Yawn
Oct 09 17:19:23 <iDialekt> Same*
Oct 09 17:19:44 <iDialekt> Snapdragon anyone?
Oct 09 17:20:05 * GeneralAntilles isn't a Qualcomm fan.
Oct 09 17:20:11 <iDialekt> I wish nokia had a wider American audience
Oct 09 17:20:26 <qwerty12> GeneralAntilles++. Fuck those CDMA wankers
Oct 09 17:20:54 <GeneralAntilles> Their lack of NAM sales is entirely deserved, iDialekt.
Oct 09 17:20:55 <Mousey> that's nonsense, CDMA's data network is so much more faster than GSM in america
Oct 09 17:21:02 <Mousey> and no cdma means no asian markets like japan
Oct 09 17:21:04 <GeneralAntilles> The 5800 proved that point rather soundly.
Oct 09 17:21:10 <GeneralAntilles> Mousey, er, yeah.
Oct 09 17:21:11 <iDialekt> Their marketing here blows donkey
Oct 09 17:21:32 <GeneralAntilles> iDialekt, no OTA updates for NAM units, flashed updates are WAY behind Europe.
Oct 09 17:21:40 <GeneralAntilles> Support is basically non-existent.
Oct 09 17:21:57 <iDialekt> Yeah
Oct 09 17:22:04 <iDialekt> I can 100 % agree
Oct 09 17:22:19 <iDialekt> I had to always phoniex my crap
Oct 09 17:22:40 <GeneralAntilles> OK, xmodmap totally doesn't work.
Oct 09 17:22:47 * GeneralAntilles wants his pipe/escape/tab.
Oct 09 17:22:51 <iDialekt> So what's going to change with the n900. Does it have exchange support
Oct 09 17:22:57 <GeneralAntilles> Yes
Oct 09 17:22:57 <qwerty12> GeneralAntilles: "Behind Europe" - I wouldn't limit this to just phones ;P
Oct 09 17:23:08 <iDialekt> Im holding off on paying for another year of mobile me lol
Oct 09 17:23:10 * qwerty12 cackles
Oct 09 17:23:16 <GeneralAntilles> qwerty12, yes, we're behind you in our crushing march towards socialism. ;)
Oct 09 17:23:31 <kr1shnak> towards socialism?
Oct 09 17:23:41 <kr1shnak> I thought Europe was already there
Oct 09 17:23:44 <iDialekt> I want some pop tarts
Oct 09 17:23:58 <iDialekt> You know something silly?
Oct 09 17:24:24 <iDialekt> I think it's weird that you have a tiny thumbnail pic for contacts on that huge maemo screen on the n900
Oct 09 17:24:36 <iDialekt> Why not full screen caller id out the box?
Oct 09 17:24:52 <ShadowJK> GeneralAntilles, one thing that's awesome about maemo is that there's just one OS version for the entire world
Oct 09 17:24:57 <iDialekt> And hopefully obnoxious video ringtones lol
Oct 09 17:25:08 <GeneralAntilles> ShadowJK, yeah, that's helpful.
Oct 09 17:25:34 <ShadowJK> On the S60 side there were a gazillion hardware revisions with a gazillion localization versions, and by murphy's law you always get the firmware for YOUR particular setup LAST :-(
Oct 09 17:25:37 <iDialekt> I wonder if the screen scratching is gonna incite a recall.
Oct 09 17:25:41 * microlith watches video from the summit
Oct 09 17:26:00 <GeneralAntilles> What screen scratching?
Oct 09 17:26:11 <iDialekt> N900
Oct 09 17:26:19 <Shapeshifter> iDialekt: oh btw, to be fair, clear upside of os x is that it's a pretty rock solid unix-like system _and_ supports lots of proprietary production software (adobe, music stuff, CG....)
Oct 09 17:26:25 <iDialekt> But the units they tried aren't final right?
Oct 09 17:26:32 <microlith> all screens scratch if handled badly, why would the N900 be special?
Oct 09 17:26:51 <iDialekt> microlith:  but it's been said like way too easily
Oct 09 17:26:58 <iDialekt> Could be wrong
Oct 09 17:27:01 <qwerty12> Shapeshifter: I was starting to like you until you said that :(
Oct 09 17:27:15 <jwatt> does anyone know how to force wireless connection to use pre-shared key rather than Wi-Fi Protected Setup?
Oct 09 17:27:16 <range> Great. There is *ONE* review on preview hardware stating that it *might* scratch easily and now all screens scratch badly.
Oct 09 17:27:24 <Mousey> qwerty12: lol
Oct 09 17:27:35 <iDialekt> Oh geeze
Oct 09 17:27:37 <Shapeshifter> qwerty12: it's true. Though even if I had to use such software I'd rather resort to virtualbox or even wine before having to use that awful WM
Oct 09 17:27:46 <Shapeshifter> and they messed up some of the unix stuff pretty bad
Oct 09 17:27:47 <iDialekt> Sorry I was misnformed
Oct 09 17:28:14 <GeneralAntilles> iDialekt, yeah, take that particular point with a grain of salt. ;)
Oct 09 17:28:17 <iDialekt> Someone in hear repeated the screen scratching thing so I assumed it might have been a well known problem
Oct 09 17:28:29 <microlith> GeneralAntilles: preferrably with said grain not on the screen :)
Oct 09 17:28:29 <Shapeshifter> range: I've read it repeatedly.
Oct 09 17:28:50 <Shapeshifter> but I'll treasure it anyway
Oct 09 17:29:01 <Shapeshifter> it will be dressed in finer cloth then me
Oct 09 17:29:13 <iDialekt> I really don't want to jump carriers for a device
Oct 09 17:29:23 <range> Shapeshifter: Everytime I read it, the my-symbian preview is cited.
Oct 09 17:29:27 <iDialekt> I love my NAM AT&T 3g
Oct 09 17:29:39 <Shapeshifter> range: eldar said the same thing
Oct 09 17:29:52 <iDialekt> At least it's good to know I didn't make it to ignore with range lol
Oct 09 17:29:59 <iDialekt> Got scared for a moment :)
Oct 09 17:30:24 <range> Shapeshifter: Funny, he didn't in his first "review".
Oct 09 17:30:24 * GeneralAntilles hasn't had a single scratch.
Oct 09 17:30:36 <GeneralAntilles> Unless they're carrying them in their keys pocket.
Oct 09 17:31:04 <iDialekt> When is the n900 slated to arrive by the way?
Oct 09 17:31:05 <DocScrutinizer> GeneralAntilles: that's exactly the point
Oct 09 17:31:23 <iDialekt> I wonder what's in store for other maemo devices. Please announce a nam unit at the summit please
Oct 09 17:31:33 <iDialekt> With AT&T 3g
Oct 09 17:31:34 <GeneralAntilles> DocScrutinizer, would anybody expect mobile devices not to be scratched in a keys pocket? ;)
Oct 09 17:31:46 <GeneralAntilles> I mean, you have two pockets, fragile stuff goes in one, sharp stuff goes in the other.
Oct 09 17:31:50 <DocScrutinizer> nah, not me
Oct 09 17:31:59 <Zlatan> juego de boxeo online http://www.kobox.org/kobox-fande-Nourine.html
Oct 09 17:32:05 <glass> i don't give my 5800 any safeguarding treatment.. worked fine so far
Oct 09 17:32:14 <iDialekt> Glass!!!!
Oct 09 17:32:18 <iDialekt> Hey buddy
Oct 09 17:32:19 <DocScrutinizer> though I didn't care too much when my OMNIA had first scratch after 1 week
Oct 09 17:32:20 <Shapeshifter> GeneralAntilles: ah of course >.> Are there people who mix keys and phones?!
Oct 09 17:32:21 <glass> ey
Oct 09 17:32:25 <iDialekt> Someone familiar
Oct 09 17:32:29 <iDialekt> Awesome possum
Oct 09 17:32:34 <GeneralAntilles> Shapeshifter, apparently. <_<
Oct 09 17:32:34 <Shapeshifter> blasphemers!
Oct 09 17:32:52 <iDialekt> Yeah my 5800 didn't need a screen protector ever
Oct 09 17:32:53 <SpeedEvil> I want a proper touchscreen.
Oct 09 17:33:03 <ShadowJK> I sometimes mix alot of stuff in pocket, but I always use the pouch for my phone and N810 then
Oct 09 17:33:09 <SpeedEvil> They have diamond coated glass that's used for barcode scanner touchscreens.
Oct 09 17:33:10 <DocScrutinizer> My "soft" pocked is overfilled
Oct 09 17:33:10 <iDialekt> The x6 looks weird like an abomination
Oct 09 17:33:21 <SpeedEvil> over which you slide cans and stuff all day
Oct 09 17:33:27 <SpeedEvil> that + SAW = FTW
Oct 09 17:33:46 <ShadowJK> why does barcode scanner have touchscreen...
Oct 09 17:33:52 <GeneralAntilles> I hope Boxwave releases a protector soon.
Oct 09 17:34:05 <GeneralAntilles> The anti-glare is really helpful in adverse lighting conditions.
Oct 09 17:34:17 <iDialekt> The good thing is I can sell my iPhone for s minimum of 650 and grab a n900 quick as hell
Oct 09 17:34:26 <SpeedEvil> ShadowJK: they don't
Oct 09 17:34:40 <SpeedEvil> ShadowJK: they have a diamond coated _really_ robust anti-scratch window
Oct 09 17:34:43 <iDialekt> I wonder if I could pre order and have it before my birthday?
Oct 09 17:34:49 <ShadowJK> right
Oct 09 17:34:51 <iDialekt> November 8tg
Oct 09 17:35:02 <iDialekt> When is the n900 supposed to be here?
Oct 09 17:35:08 <SpeedEvil> ShadowJK: which if you put a surface accoustic wave detector on, and a screen behind would be a very, very abuse resistant display.
Oct 09 17:35:12 <GeneralAntilles> iDialekt, should ship this month, according to most sources.
Oct 09 17:35:23 <Shapeshifter> I read that it will be delayd into november
Oct 09 17:35:42 <cars> Sorry if I've missed it, but does the n900 have the anti-glare screen like the n810 does?
Oct 09 17:35:47 <iDialekt> I think the smart thing would be to use it and wait to switch carriers
Oct 09 17:35:50 <ccooke> there are abojut fifteen dates I've seen
Oct 09 17:35:50 <DocScrutinizer> shop says 10/30
Oct 09 17:35:57 <ShadowJK> I read that small shipments will arrive w44, a slightly bigger one w45, and "normal" quantities w46 onward
Oct 09 17:36:05 <iDialekt> My friend works for nokia and is getting his unit next week
Oct 09 17:36:13 <ccooke> but the ones actually from the maemo team say "october"
Oct 09 17:37:20 <ShadowJK> (iirc that's what nokia's reps told one operator in .fi)
Oct 09 17:37:27 <ccooke> (I'mclassing the nokia store
Oct 09 17:37:58 <ccooke> s as unlikely to know the real date in advance)
Oct 09 17:38:03 <cars> I suppose I should ask that after it's actually been released..
Oct 09 17:38:04 <Mousey> the thing that pisses me off is if i get an n900 it won't be because i want a phone
Oct 09 17:38:05 <Shapeshifter> I wonder if I should order now, or if the price will drop when its released. Any experiences how prices usually go with new devices. up or down?
Oct 09 17:38:09 <Shapeshifter> I think up? >.>
Oct 09 17:38:09 <Mousey> that was the genius of the n810, imho
Oct 09 17:38:23 <ShadowJK> I'm considering continuing to use my E75 as my phone
Oct 09 17:38:37 <ccooke> hmm, still need to get better ith this keyboard
Oct 09 17:38:38 <Mousey> i'm used to having multiple devices for multiple purposes
Oct 09 17:38:44 <Mousey> but apparently i'm the freak
Oct 09 17:38:54 <ccooke> Shapeshifter: where do you live?
Oct 09 17:38:59 <ccooke> countrywise
Oct 09 17:39:01 <Shapeshifter> ccooke: Switzerland
Oct 09 17:39:40 <ccooke> wasn't there an operator doing a sbsidy there?
Oct 09 17:39:46 <ccooke> subsidy
Oct 09 17:39:49 <Shapeshifter> since the announcement, the price at the cheapest seller dropped twice, from 900 to 790 to 716 chf
Oct 09 17:39:51 <GeneralAntilles> Shapeshifter, it probably wont go down significantly until about 6 months down the road.
Oct 09 17:39:54 <kr1shnak> you cant run the latest version of maemo on an N800 can you?
Oct 09 17:40:14 <GeneralAntilles> cars, yes, it has a transflective screen, no, neither device has an anti-glare one.
Oct 09 17:40:20 <Shapeshifter> 716chf being 470 euros
Oct 09 17:40:25 <GeneralAntilles> kr1shnak, you want Mer.
Oct 09 17:40:26 <GeneralAntilles> ~mer
Oct 09 17:40:27 <infobot> methinks mer is http://wiki.maemo.org/Mer, or on #mer
Oct 09 17:40:32 <GeneralAntilles> But the short answer is, no.
Oct 09 17:40:47 <kr1shnak> so I couldnt use an N800 to develop apps to run on an N900?
Oct 09 17:40:55 <kr1shnak> thats what I am really interested in
Oct 09 17:41:18 <kr1shnak> and maybe checking out liqbase, which I think looks freaking awesome
Oct 09 17:41:43 <Shapeshifter> ccooke: well, all 3 major operators do subsidy if you sign a contract
Oct 09 17:42:01 <Mousey> ...so i'm EXTRA screwed if i don't want it for use as a phone?
Oct 09 17:42:12 <ccooke> liqbase looks very like the wireframes they demo'd of harmattan
Oct 09 17:42:22 <kr1shnak> yeah?
Oct 09 17:42:25 <kr1shnak> cool
Oct 09 17:42:31 <ccooke> Mousey: how do you make that out?
Oct 09 17:42:35 <kr1shnak> what exactly is harmattan? Maemo 6?
Oct 09 17:42:56 <iDialekt> The n810 commercials were so awesome lol
Oct 09 17:43:03 <iDialekt> The marketing in Europe is stellar
Oct 09 17:43:10 <iDialekt> Looked so high budget lol
Oct 09 17:43:10 <GeneralAntilles> kr1shnak, yes.
Oct 09 17:43:23 <GeneralAntilles> N810 marketing?
Oct 09 17:43:31 <range> In Europe?
Oct 09 17:43:39 <GeneralAntilles> iDialekt, you've seen http://maemo.nokia.com right?
Oct 09 17:43:57 <Mousey> ccooke: where would i just by the standalone n900 in america a) without a contract, and b) while justifying the increased cost since i want it for a tablet and not a phone?
Oct 09 17:44:13 <kr1shnak> I'm so tempted to preorder an N900
Oct 09 17:44:13 <GeneralAntilles> Mousey, costs aren't entirely due to the radio.
Oct 09 17:44:28 <GeneralAntilles> Considering how much more hardware you're getting with the N900, it's pretty comparable to the N810 price-wise.
Oct 09 17:44:32 <GeneralAntilles> Also considering inflation.
Oct 09 17:44:39 <ccooke> Mousey it's a €500 device. some operators offer a subsidy, but you will always pay about the same
Oct 09 17:44:42 <Mousey> no, but they're subject to those costs in american markets BECAUSE of that radio, it'll never be sold as another type of device but a phone
Oct 09 17:45:12 <Mousey> i could get the n810 at best buy once upon a time, because they're a generic electronics retailer
Oct 09 17:45:18 <SpeedEvil> err 'in american markets' ?
Oct 09 17:45:19 <GeneralAntilles> The N810 went for about $479 new
Oct 09 17:45:19 <ccooke> Mousey: buy it on contract. throw away the sim and say "I got it on credit"
Oct 09 17:45:36 <GeneralAntilles> The N900 is MSRP $650 and priced more around $580 retail.
Oct 09 17:45:38 <Mousey> but there's no way the n900 will be found on shelves at stores, they'll be available from carriers
Oct 09 17:46:00 <ccooke> or pay it all in advance and buy without a sim
Oct 09 17:46:06 <SpeedEvil> Mousey: I wouldn't bet on it soon
Oct 09 17:46:11 <GeneralAntilles> $100 or so isn't a big price to pay for a much nicer screen, accelerometers, a nicer keyboard, 32GB of internal storage, OMAP3, vibra, etc.
Oct 09 17:46:15 <SpeedEvil> Mousey: at least direclty through retailers
Oct 09 17:46:18 <Shapeshifter> how are prices in your countries? With 1gb per month, 30mins free talk time to all networks + europe + US, and 3 numbers of this network or fixed lines always free, I'll pay roughly 660 euros after 12 months including the n900.
Oct 09 17:46:40 <Mousey> well this is my whole point. because of the gsm radio, it makes it harder and more expensive for me, regardless of how much better it might be.. i'm just kinda mad the n810 isn't available anymore because of this
Oct 09 17:46:42 <SpeedEvil> Shapeshifter: It's of that order in the UK
Oct 09 17:46:58 <range> Shapeshifter: So how is Switzerland cheaper than Germany? :)
Oct 09 17:47:02 <Mousey> i get unlimited data
Oct 09 17:47:17 <Mousey> and more minutes than i'll ever use, for us$129
Oct 09 17:47:22 <ccooke> Mousey: yes, because nobody would ever sell a phone without a contract. it just doesn't happen, huh?
Oct 09 17:47:23 <SpeedEvil> Mousey: err - how does the radio make it more expensive for you? Other than it adding a little to the price
Oct 09 17:47:33 <Mousey> ccooke: not in this country
Oct 09 17:47:35 <Shapeshifter> range: it is? well often the devices themselves are cheaper because of lower sales tax
Oct 09 17:47:43 <Shapeshifter> 8% isntead of 19%
Oct 09 17:47:47 <Mousey> SpeedEvil: because where can i buy a cellphone without a contract?
Oct 09 17:47:53 <range> Shapeshifter: Okay, that might be the reason
Oct 09 17:47:59 <Shapeshifter> Mousey: per month?
Oct 09 17:48:09 <Mousey> Shapeshifter: i want a tablet computer, not a phone
Oct 09 17:48:12 <ccooke> Mousey: right, so the huge array of unlocked simfree phones on amazon.com was an illusion?
Oct 09 17:48:14 <GeneralAntilles> Mousey, pretty much anywhere?
Oct 09 17:48:15 <Mousey> the n810 was the perfect tablet computer
Oct 09 17:48:19 <SpeedEvil> Mousey: nokia.com
Oct 09 17:48:22 <GeneralAntilles> Mousey, you don't even have to pay tax with Amazon. <_<
Oct 09 17:48:31 <Shapeshifter> Mousey: no i mean, 129 usd per month?
Oct 09 17:48:34 <Mousey> GeneralAntilles: well i hope it's available right away then
Oct 09 17:48:40 <Mousey> Shapeshifter: for my phone, yah
Oct 09 17:48:42 <ccooke> SpeedEvil: also at nokia stores
Oct 09 17:48:43 <wazd> Any shocking details?)
Oct 09 17:48:49 <range> Shapeshifter: Cheapest retailer I'd trust is at 519,-
Oct 09 17:48:49 <Mousey> no nokia stores in wa
Oct 09 17:48:49 <SpeedEvil> ccooke: that too
Oct 09 17:48:50 <Shapeshifter> Mousey: ah, including the contract
Oct 09 17:48:54 <Mousey> Mousey: yah
Oct 09 17:49:01 <SpeedEvil> Mousey: so order it online
Oct 09 17:49:03 <Mousey> s/Mousey/Shapeshifter/
Oct 09 17:49:03 <infobot> Mousey meant: Shapeshifter: yah
Oct 09 17:49:12 <Mousey> i guess so
Oct 09 17:49:16 <Shapeshifter> range: cheapest here is 471 euros
Oct 09 17:49:22 <range> Well.
Oct 09 17:49:23 <Mousey> and pay for shipping, and overpriced
Oct 09 17:49:26 <Mousey> but yah
Oct 09 17:49:31 <range> That is EUR 500 - something :)
Oct 09 17:49:37 <luke-jr> seriously, what do people who like the N810 use it for? :/
Oct 09 17:49:44 <SpeedEvil> Mousey: so wait until it's available through carriers in some months
Oct 09 17:49:47 <ccooke> a littl while ago you could get it for £399 ish
Oct 09 17:49:54 <Mousey> i use it for sshing into devices, and in datacenters to manage machines
Oct 09 17:49:58 <Mousey> without having to bust out a whole laptop for it
Oct 09 17:49:59 <ccooke> with a pay as you go sim, no less
Oct 09 17:50:03 <luke-jr> Mousey: from where?
Oct 09 17:50:12 <Mousey> luke-jr: sprint. fastest data network in th us
Oct 09 17:50:18 <luke-jr> ah, tethering
Oct 09 17:50:22 <luke-jr> but Sprint forbids it
Oct 09 17:50:26 <Mousey> nope
Oct 09 17:50:27 <luke-jr> so N810 is useful if you violate ToS only
Oct 09 17:50:44 <Mousey> they just forbid it on paper, i've tethered with sprint since the QualcommPDQ
Oct 09 17:51:02 <luke-jr> "on paper" is still forbidden
Oct 09 17:51:04 <Mousey> i don't know anybody who DOESN'T tether
Oct 09 17:51:13 <range> I am so happy *not* to be in the american phone market ...
Oct 09 17:51:19 <Mousey> nor who's ever gotten grief for it.. hell sprint store employees tether
Oct 09 17:51:46 <luke-jr> Mousey: and go over 5 GB per month?
Oct 09 17:52:03 <frals> range: same here lol
Oct 09 17:52:08 <Shapeshifter> "tethering"?
Oct 09 17:52:12 <range> Forbidden tethering.
Oct 09 17:52:27 <Shapeshifter> what's that?
Oct 09 17:52:28 <range> Although that happens right here right now with t-mobile and the iphone.
Oct 09 17:52:35 <range> Shapeshifter: Using your phone as a modem.
Oct 09 17:52:49 <Shapeshifter> and why is that forbidden?
Oct 09 17:52:50 <Mousey> if i have to go over 5GB in a month, i'm not using a mobile network, no matter how fast
Oct 09 17:53:11 <range> Shapeshifter: Ask Sprint/AT&T/whoever does that :)
Oct 09 17:53:11 <GeneralAntilles> Shapeshifter, Bluetooth DUN.
Oct 09 17:53:12 <Shapeshifter> and how do they inforce this?
Oct 09 17:53:15 <SpeedEvil> That's only 150M/day
Oct 09 17:53:22 <Shapeshifter> *enforce
Oct 09 17:53:23 <Mousey> Shapeshifter: it's not forbidden so much as discourgaed
Oct 09 17:53:30 <luke-jr> Mousey: even 56K dialup goes over 5 GB per month
Oct 09 17:53:39 <iDialekt> My nokia contact is getting his n900 today
Oct 09 17:53:48 <luke-jr> Shapeshifter: greedy companies
Oct 09 17:53:50 <Mousey> luke-jr: oh. well i never tallied it..
Oct 09 17:53:54 <iDialekt> At least that will be a world of a difference to try before buying
Oct 09 17:53:55 <iDialekt> Lol
Oct 09 17:54:07 <SpeedEvil> For example, 3h of streaming radio will eat 150M/day
Oct 09 17:54:27 <luke-jr> I would want to do VoIP
Oct 09 17:54:36 <Mousey> well unlimited so far has been pretty unlimited, and i stream pandora every day all day mostly
Oct 09 17:54:45 <Mousey> oh, yea, skype
Oct 09 17:54:47 <Mousey> i've used it for that
Oct 09 17:54:50 <Mousey> video too
Oct 09 17:55:06 <Mousey> mind you not from my n810 =(
Oct 09 17:55:14 <SpeedEvil> And the contract saying you can't, and they can come and enforce that at any time at all, legally doesn't worry you?
Oct 09 17:55:48 <Mousey> still tho, the n810 by far made me the most productive admin for linux boxes evar when i had it, i could connect to any machine i had access to, and do stuff i could only do from a laptop before..
Oct 09 17:55:59 <Mousey> my productivity is down 26% since it was losted. =(
Oct 09 17:56:03 <iDialekt> I hope the battery life is as stellar as the 5800 on the n900.. What ae
Oct 09 17:56:09 <iDialekt> What are the chances?
Oct 09 17:56:15 <luke-jr> Mousey: I want an upgraded SL-C3100
Oct 09 17:56:24 <range> Yeah, the n800 really was missing a keyboard. But as that was the only real change in the N810 I didn't buy one ...
Oct 09 17:56:58 <Mousey> yah, the n800 has those two SD slots tho.. n800 + n810 + USB/OTG = solid state win!
Oct 09 17:57:32 <javispedro> 3D DRIVERS!!!!!!!!!!
Oct 09 17:57:35 <javispedro> 3D DRIIIIIIIIIVEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEERS
Oct 09 17:57:37 <Mousey> what? where?!
Oct 09 17:57:52 <luke-jr> javispedro: and DRM
Oct 09 17:57:55 <javispedro> during my briefly skim trough the irc logs I could only notice the GLES keyword.
Oct 09 17:57:58 <range> But now the display in the n800 goes kaputt and the battery isn't the best either anymore. So ship it already! Nokia!
Oct 09 17:58:05 <javispedro> <Stskeeps>	GLES for omap2 will be in few weeks from TI
Oct 09 17:58:13 * javispedro wants.
Oct 09 17:58:27 <wazd> Cool
Oct 09 18:00:12 <Mousey> mer suddenly got a lot more attractive
Oct 09 18:02:47 <javispedro> Mousey: if you say that because of the transitions, well, I'll doubt they'll work. But who knows.
Oct 09 18:03:02 <Mousey> ^_^
Oct 09 18:03:25 <Mousey> well i just don't know about that right-handed-centric spacebar
Oct 09 18:03:56 <ShadowJK> 3h and only 150M? what's that, 160x120? :)
Oct 09 18:04:30 <SpeedEvil> ShadowJK: mp3
Oct 09 18:04:33 <SpeedEvil> 128k
Oct 09 18:04:38 <ShadowJK> oh, audio
Oct 09 18:04:44 <ShadowJK> for some reason I read "video"
Oct 09 18:05:13 <ShadowJK> I suspect 3h-4h is about how long hte battery will last streaming audio
Oct 09 18:05:22 <ShadowJK> my E70 and E75 did about that
Oct 09 18:05:28 <ShadowJK> and N810 over wifi is similar
Oct 09 18:06:40 <Mousey> oh, this is probably unlikely, but will the n900 be microusb charged?
Oct 09 18:06:59 <javispedro> it's the only way to charge it, why you ask?
Oct 09 18:07:33 <range> I like the UI team videos.
Oct 09 18:08:42 <Mousey> javispedro: cuz the n810 wasn't..
Oct 09 18:08:58 <Mousey> i seem to remember the EU standardizing on uUSB for charging..
Oct 09 18:09:08 <Mousey> anyway, that's a point in the n900's favor
Oct 09 18:13:06 <range> Mousey: Well, the EU told the manufacturers to standardize on something.
Oct 09 18:13:15 <SpeedEvil> Actually, it was china
Oct 09 18:13:20 <range> So they chose µ-USB
Oct 09 18:13:20 <SpeedEvil> china mandated it first
Oct 09 18:13:33 <SpeedEvil> and after that, it diddn't really make sense to go with anything else.
Oct 09 18:13:56 <johnsq> SpeedEvil: i hope m$ and apple heared you
Oct 09 18:14:04 <SpeedEvil> ?
Oct 09 18:14:07 <Mousey> i for one welcome our µUSB charging overlords
Oct 09 18:14:12 <Mousey> especially the OTG types
Oct 09 18:14:20 <johnsq> SpeedEvil: they don't like standards
Oct 09 18:14:21 <javispedro> of which the N900 isn't.
Oct 09 18:14:41 <Mousey> n900 isn't OTG?
Oct 09 18:14:41 <ShadowJK> N900 has that other µUSB port
Oct 09 18:14:45 <ShadowJK> no it isn't
Oct 09 18:14:49 <Mousey> gah!!
Oct 09 18:14:59 <Mousey> that's a point against! how am i supposed to plug in an n800 to an n900??
Oct 09 18:15:07 <Mousey> i used to plug my external drives into my n810!
Oct 09 18:15:12 <Mousey> it was HANDY
Oct 09 18:15:30 * Mousey tilts back towards n810
Oct 09 18:15:36 <ShadowJK> There were hardware bugs in omap3. It might've been possible to fix it in software in the future, but the USB Consortium doesn't allow you to ship OTG hardware without software support, so Nokia had to use the non-OTG port
Oct 09 18:15:45 <javispedro> it has no mms, no universal portrait mode support, etc. etc.
Oct 09 18:15:48 <javispedro> didn't you get the memo?
Oct 09 18:16:30 <qwerty12_N810> javispedro: How do you keep your sanity when using osso-games-startup? It's so heavily oriented against <insert INDT/shipped game here> with its hardcoding of values...
Oct 09 18:16:56 <javispedro> qwerty12_N810: you removed the last part of my sanity yesterday when telling me those horrible stories about your palm .
Oct 09 18:17:24 <javispedro> anyway, just plain curiosity, what are you doing? :D
Oct 09 18:17:41 <javispedro> qwerty12_N810: also, at least they don't use a GtkFixed for the whole dialog anymore... :P
Oct 09 18:18:39 <qwerty12_N810> javispedro: I'm a stickler for being able to open files from the File manager, and seeing how osso-games-startup handles it...
Oct 09 18:19:11 <javispedro> ah, good stuff. I'll need to read on that to handle opening of rom files.
Oct 09 18:20:48 <javispedro> I wonder if you can do a horrible hack and pop msgs from the dbus connection before osso-games-startup gets to it.
Oct 09 18:21:18 <javispedro> because I guess opening files in maemo is done through d-bus (never read about it)
Oct 09 18:23:02 <qwerty12_N810> javispedro: Wanna hear the sad thing? Because the handler is in osso-games-startup with its hardcoded values, saves the filename to /apps/osso/chess/save_file...
Oct 09 18:23:26 <javispedro> ah, it even has code already for that? even more fun.
Oct 09 18:25:35 <javispedro> qwerty12_N810: apart from the evident race conditions, any reason you can just read the filename from that key?
Oct 09 18:25:41 <javispedro> s/can/cant
Oct 09 18:25:45 <wazd> http://www.slashgear.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/10/nokia_maemo_6_1-540x327.jpg <-- eeeeeh
Oct 09 18:25:47 * GeneralAntilles gets depressed watching the UMPC Portal unboxing.
Oct 09 18:26:32 * javispedro notices "Zelda" icon.
Oct 09 18:26:38 * solarion beats his head against a well
Oct 09 18:26:41 <solarion> wall, even
Oct 09 18:27:15 <solarion> how is floating point handled on the n810?
Oct 09 18:27:24 <javispedro> solarion: by default, softfp.
Oct 09 18:27:28 <qwerty12_N810> javispedro: Not sure how that key relates to Chess itself (can it be unset easily?) and you also need to be watching the key, too, for the times when DrNokSnes is open
Oct 09 18:27:40 <Mousey> will the n900 have an accelerometer?
Oct 09 18:28:05 <javispedro> qwerty12_N810: you're doing that for DrNokSnes? heh :)
Oct 09 18:28:18 <wazd> that's kinda lame concept imo :)
Oct 09 18:28:28 <javispedro> Mousey: it has one.
Oct 09 18:28:51 <javispedro> wazd: continue reading right until the part where it says it'll have a capacitive screen :)
Oct 09 18:28:52 <qwerty12_N810> javispedro: Oh, yeah, sorry, it's awesome and I lack the ability to do anything of my own :)
Oct 09 18:28:52 <solarion> javispedro: but it should at least execute it?
Oct 09 18:29:11 * solarion 's app is crashing with floating point exception
Oct 09 18:29:30 <javispedro> solarion: execute what? gcc will emit softfp calls for floating point operations.
Oct 09 18:29:36 <wazd> javispedro: no, seriously, desktop as one big mess of something is bad :)
Oct 09 18:29:39 <javispedro> solarion: probably your fault unless you're doing something weird.
Oct 09 18:29:45 <qwerty12_N810> javispedro: Doing this for Transmission was somewhat easier when I could attach my own handler. It's the same thing with CDBS; I hate anything that takes away control from me :)
Oct 09 18:29:46 <Mousey> ooo
Oct 09 18:30:01 <solarion> javispedro: it works on the my laptop's metal
Oct 09 18:30:22 <javispedro> well, solarion, gdb it.
Oct 09 18:31:01 <solarion> is what I'm working on
Oct 09 18:31:06 <javispedro> qwerty12_N810: i'd give it a try but I'm a bit busy this weekend. Well, kinda. I should be doing the backgrounds web app...
Oct 09 18:31:26 <solarion> as long as I know it's my problem, that simplifies things enormously. :)
Oct 09 18:31:59 <qwerty12_N810> javispedro: Yeah, I'll have a crack, submit my efforts to you and hope a future release has a sane way of doing it :)
Oct 09 18:32:22 <javispedro> hehe. Thanks!
Oct 09 18:33:29 <solarion> javispedro: is the gdb tutorial at http://maemo-sdk.garage.maemo.org/sdk-plus-debugging-guide.html up to date?
Oct 09 18:33:36 * solarion isn't finding some of the commands listed
Oct 09 18:34:06 <javispedro> sorry, up so far I've only debugged in device.
Oct 09 18:34:29 <solarion> ah
Oct 09 18:34:46 <solarion> is on-device easier?
Oct 09 18:35:10 <javispedro> at least for me. But I mount the src code folder using NFS.
Oct 09 18:35:27 <javispedro> btw solarion, if you're doing a lot of FP in n8x0, pass -mfpu=vfp -mfloat-abi=softfp to gcc call.
Oct 09 18:35:47 <javispedro> that will use the VFP coprocessor, and it's faster for most operations in n8x0.
Oct 09 18:35:55 <solarion> that's a good idea for home (I'm on a busy wifi network on campus)
Oct 09 18:35:59 <solarion> what is VFP?
Oct 09 18:36:10 <javispedro> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ARM_architecture#VFP
Oct 09 18:36:15 <javispedro> ~VFP
Oct 09 18:36:16 * solarion has thought about using the DSP, but that's yet another thing to learn
Oct 09 18:36:21 <javispedro> VFP is http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ARM_architecture#VFP
Oct 09 18:36:27 <javispedro> infobot: VFP is http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ARM_architecture#VFP
Oct 09 18:36:28 <infobot> okay, javispedro
Oct 09 18:37:03 <solarion> javispedro: do you work for nokia?
Oct 09 18:37:09 <javispedro> nope.
Oct 09 18:37:17 <solarion> just know a ton, eh? :)
Oct 09 18:37:29 <javispedro> know my things, not a ton :)
Oct 09 18:37:44 <GeneralAntilles> Lot of the people here know more than most Nokians. :P
Oct 09 18:38:06 <solarion> heh
Oct 09 18:38:13 <solarion> so the n810 has a VFP?
Oct 09 18:38:37 <qwerty12_N810> javispedro: If you wanna test the mime_open behaviour of o-g-s: http://qwerty12.qole.org/mimeopentestdnk (Built under Fremantle ARMEL, works on Diablo)
Oct 09 18:38:47 <javispedro> solarion: yes. and don't ask me why only few components in the device base image use it.
Oct 09 18:38:56 <solarion> I could fix that problem. :)
Oct 09 18:39:07 <solarion> much eaiser to tell gcc to use it than try to figure out the dsp gateway
Oct 09 18:39:09 <qwerty12_N810> javispedro: argv[1] is a path to a file. Notice how it gets set in GConf :)
Oct 09 18:39:14 <solarion> cell is enough fun for now. :)
Oct 09 18:39:19 <wazd> no skype video?! Are they idiots? :)
Oct 09 18:39:37 <solarion> GeneralAntilles: are you familiar with ARMEL target qemu debugging?
Oct 09 18:39:49 * GeneralAntilles points anywhere but here.
Oct 09 18:39:55 <javispedro> aw, tablet out of battery :(
Oct 09 18:40:50 <solarion> heh, k
Oct 09 18:41:02 <solarion> the n810 doesn't charge over usb, does it?
Oct 09 18:41:08 <wjs_ltop> no
Oct 09 18:41:12 <solarion> is too bad
Oct 09 18:41:17 <solarion> maybe I should file a bug on it. :)
Oct 09 18:41:23 <solarion> charger at home, usb at work, would be nice
Oct 09 18:41:38 <wjs_ltop> are the MMX instructions supported too?
Oct 09 18:41:59 <javispedro> MMX instructions? this is an ARM.
Oct 09 18:41:59 <GeneralAntilles> solarion, N900 charges over USB.
Oct 09 18:41:59 <solarion> wjs_ltop: ARM has MMX?
Oct 09 18:42:09 <luke-jr> lol
Oct 09 18:42:11 <wjs_ltop> Look at the page javispedro referenced..
Oct 09 18:42:12 <wjs_ltop> iwMMXt
Oct 09 18:42:20 <javispedro> wjs_ltop: my old Palm supported that.
Oct 09 18:42:28 <javispedro> it's Intel/Marvell XScale only.
Oct 09 18:42:32 <javispedro> and it only does integer ops.
Oct 09 18:42:47 <solarion> GeneralAntilles: dangit
Oct 09 18:42:59 <wjs_ltop> ah, so not the AMD enhancements
Oct 09 18:43:04 * solarion has little hope to get one
Oct 09 18:43:05 <luke-jr> javispedro: I wonder if the Sheeva supports it?
Oct 09 18:43:07 <GeneralAntilles> solarion, Nokia sells a USB adaptor, anyway.
Oct 09 18:43:08 <wjs_ltop> original MMX
Oct 09 18:43:23 <javispedro> luke-jr: dunno, sorry.
Oct 09 18:43:30 <solarion> I suspect for hardcore fp, the dsp would be the way to go
Oct 09 18:43:33 <suihkulokki> wjs_ltop: there are NEON extensions for ARM that N900 support
Oct 09 18:43:35 <solarion> or offload it to another box
Oct 09 18:43:42 <wjs_ltop> I've seen cables that will split a power connector off a usb cable.
Oct 09 18:44:12 <wjs_ltop> NEON was added in the Cortex A8, right?
Oct 09 18:45:03 <javispedro> yes, N900.
Oct 09 18:45:27 <wjs_ltop> yes, just double checked.. NEON and ThumbEE is not on the ARM11 in the N810
Oct 09 18:45:51 <javispedro> on the other side, VFP and Jazelle were dumbed down.
Oct 09 18:45:51 <wjs_ltop> Stuck with the never documented Jazelle
Oct 09 18:45:53 <solarion> aww
Oct 09 18:46:41 <iDialekt> MAaaaaaaaaeeeemmmmo
Oct 09 18:46:46 <wjs_ltop> That's because the ThumbEE takes over most of the Jazelle functions from what I've read.
Oct 09 18:46:54 <iDialekt> It makes me feel like dancin
Oct 09 18:46:55 <javispedro> actually, not necessarily.
Oct 09 18:47:21 <javispedro> Jazelle is suited for interpreters, ThumbEE for JIT compilers.
Oct 09 18:47:55 <wjs_ltop> Anybody here know if the stuff that QGil is working on with TI will include IVA access, Jazelle, as well as the MBX?
Oct 09 18:48:17 <javispedro> wjs_ltop: I'd wish.
Oct 09 18:48:19 <wjs_ltop> I think it was QGil and not Qole
Oct 09 18:48:27 <javispedro> As for Jazelle, I have it somewhat working.
Oct 09 18:48:36 <wjs_ltop> hmm??
Oct 09 18:48:52 <javispedro> got it to run most of the simple java opcodes.
Oct 09 18:48:58 <slonopotamus> javispedro, how?
Oct 09 18:49:05 <solarion> hmm. the debugging evironment seems to not have access to the network. :(
Oct 09 18:49:17 <javispedro> slonopotamus: I even published some source code.
Oct 09 18:49:19 <GeneralAntilles> He's got a couple of TI engineers chained up in his basement.
Oct 09 18:49:43 <javispedro> I just continued on lardman's work.
Oct 09 18:49:52 <slonopotamus> GeneralAntilles, ah, that's what i thought
Oct 09 18:50:05 <javispedro> http://svn.javispedro.com/view/jaz/trunk/jaz.s
Oct 09 18:50:08 <slonopotamus> actually that doesn't matter
Oct 09 18:50:22 <javispedro> agreed.
Oct 09 18:50:28 <slonopotamus> java is too memory-hungry
Oct 09 18:50:48 <slonopotamus> believe me, i'm java developer
Oct 09 18:50:53 <javispedro> I do.
Oct 09 18:51:04 <javispedro> however, that's why I liked jazelle.
Oct 09 18:51:09 <javispedro> an interpreter should use a bit less memory,
Oct 09 18:51:14 <javispedro> while jazelle "promised" fast interpreters.
Oct 09 18:51:25 <qwerty12_N810> slonopotamus: Some, but not me, would call you a traitor ;P
Oct 09 18:51:27 <johnsq> slonopotamus: icu 4.0.1 compiled,l webkit compile run out of space
Oct 09 18:51:36 <javispedro> but not worth the effort, at least with the jamvm I tried.
Oct 09 18:51:42 <wjs_ltop> Any chance of integrating into the Redhat OpenJDK?
Oct 09 18:51:43 <slonopotamus> johnsq, qt-webkit on device?
Oct 09 18:51:55 <javispedro> wjs_ltop: not by me.
Oct 09 18:52:01 <johnsq> slonopotamus: normal webkit, for midori
Oct 09 18:52:34 <slonopotamus> johnsq, build in qemu. 128mb isn't good for gcc + c++
Oct 09 18:52:37 <Mousey> is the n900 ipv6 compliant?
Oct 09 18:53:00 <luke-jr> ...
Oct 09 18:53:08 <Mousey> s/n900/maemo/
Oct 09 18:53:09 <infobot> Mousey meant: is the maemo ipv6 compliant?
Oct 09 18:53:09 <qole> at the amsterdam maemo party!
Oct 09 18:53:12 <slonopotamus> Mousey, if you build ipv6 support in kernel, yes
Oct 09 18:53:16 <johnsq> slonopotamus: i will see added more swap
Oct 09 18:53:19 <Mousey> k
Oct 09 18:53:26 <luke-jr> my N810 has IPv6
Oct 09 18:53:28 <javispedro> qole heh, enjoy :)
Oct 09 18:53:29 <slonopotamus> johnsq, no. luke tried
Oct 09 18:53:34 <luke-jr> 64 bytes from 2002:62b3:1d4c:0:21d:6eff:fed5:9425: icmp_seq=1 ttl=64 time=2.41 ms
Oct 09 18:53:40 <Mousey> ty
Oct 09 18:54:07 <wnd> diablo has ipv6 out of the box, you just need to enable it
Oct 09 18:54:30 <frals> qole: go around whisper "mms..." to everyone, ok? ;)
Oct 09 18:54:38 <javispedro> qwerty12_N810: sorry, how I'm supposed to use mimeopentestdnk?
Oct 09 18:54:45 <slonopotamus> johnsq, it gets rebooted under high swap usage 'cause wd doesn't get kicked fast enough
Oct 09 18:54:56 <javispedro> I've run it and it does not seem to spawn/activate osso-games-startup
Oct 09 18:54:57 <qole> heheheh
Oct 09 18:55:16 <qwerty12_N810> javispedro: Hmm, odd, you do have DrNokSnes installed? :p
Oct 09 18:55:21 <luke-jr> johnsq: midori/gtk ftl
Oct 09 18:55:27 <qole> i am the dealbreaker!
Oct 09 18:55:44 <frals> :D
Oct 09 18:55:47 <qwerty12_N810> javispedro: It brings up DrNokSnes on both the N810 and N900 here
Oct 09 18:56:01 <slonopotamus> qwerty12_N810, traitor? why?
Oct 09 18:56:19 <javispedro> anyone remember the syntax for dbus-monitor everything out of head?
Oct 09 18:56:42 <qwerty12_N810> javispedro: Oh, and argv[1] should be a path to a file :)
Oct 09 18:56:45 <johnsq> luke-jr: ftl?
Oct 09 18:56:51 <luke-jr> johnsq: FOR THE LOSE
Oct 09 18:56:52 <javispedro> qwerty12_N810: ah, that may explain it lol.
Oct 09 18:57:14 <luke-jr> johnsq: you can use my webkit binpkg, but it requires KDE :p
Oct 09 18:57:37 <qwerty12_N810> slonopotamus: You calling Java slow and saying to trust you because you're a Java dev :D
Oct 09 18:57:40 <johnsq> luke-jr: ok. no thanks
Oct 09 18:57:59 <luke-jr> johnsq: if you want, I can try to build you one in my chroot if it doesn't have too many deps
Oct 09 18:58:28 <slonopotamus> qwerty12_N810, i didn't say it's slow
Oct 09 18:58:36 <johnsq> luke-jr: i need only remove the sd card and put it in the laptop.
Oct 09 18:58:45 <luke-jr> johnsq: lol
Oct 09 18:58:51 <luke-jr> johnsq: I don't like to shutdown ;)
Oct 09 18:58:51 <qwerty12_N810> slonopotamus: Erm, yeah, you didn't. Sorry, that's my thinking...
Oct 09 18:58:59 <solarion> man, I just need gdb working, but it's not. :(
Oct 09 18:59:04 <luke-jr> and my N810 is pretty much my only SD reader
Oct 09 18:59:14 <luke-jr> well, N810, C760, and A630
Oct 09 18:59:18 <slonopotamus> qwerty12_N810, it's just ~3-4 times slower than C if coded properly. but memory usage...
Oct 09 18:59:19 <javispedro> solarion: enable sdk repo on device, pull gdb (NOTHING MORE), disable sdk repo.
Oct 09 18:59:52 <johnsq> luke-jr: i have got the hame micro sdhc card reader and use it as micro usb stick.
Oct 09 19:00:09 <ShadowJK> hm
Oct 09 19:00:11 <solarion> javispedro: yeah; I'm gonna have ot use the device, I guess
Oct 09 19:00:15 <solarion> will suck for n900 dev, tho
Oct 09 19:00:15 <Firebird> http://img38.imageshack.us/img38/3876/wthf.png , any ideas [on the unthemedness]?
Oct 09 19:00:37 <ShadowJK> I have this in my startup scripts:
Oct 09 19:00:37 <slonopotamus> johnsq, setup separate qemu chroot and build binpkgs there
Oct 09 19:00:39 <ShadowJK> echo 8 > /sys/block/mmcblk0/queue/nr_requests
Oct 09 19:00:39 <javispedro> Firebird: missing run-standalone.sh?
Oct 09 19:00:44 <ShadowJK> (and for mmcblk1)
Oct 09 19:01:09 <ShadowJK> When I made it, it was on the theory that reducing queue size should make it more interactive so that the watchdog gets kicked often enough
Oct 09 19:01:10 <Firebird> javispedro, ah, I thought I had that >_>, thanks
Oct 09 19:01:18 <johnsq> slonopotamus: why, i just mount the sdhc card per nfs and compile on the pc
Oct 09 19:01:52 <Firebird> hildon 2.0 isn't gtk 2.16?
Oct 09 19:02:09 <slonopotamus> Firebird, maemo gtk != gtk
Oct 09 19:02:16 <slonopotamus> != kde 4 :D
Oct 09 19:02:24 <Firebird> != windows, != a cow
Oct 09 19:02:44 <slonopotamus> luke-jr, emerge moo
Oct 09 19:02:47 <Firebird> gtk libraries should still run, just inquiring what version it is
Oct 09 19:02:48 <solarion> what if we approximated the cow with a sphere?
Oct 09 19:03:20 <slonopotamus> solarion, in vacuum?
Oct 09 19:03:33 <solarion> slonopotamus: I dunno; what's the cow in?
Oct 09 19:03:58 <solarion> a cow in vacuum has a tendency to rapidly become mere meat
Oct 09 19:04:00 <slonopotamus> that's common joke here, spheric horse in vacuum
Oct 09 19:04:07 <johnsq> ShadowJK: I will try it, tnx
Oct 09 19:04:10 <solarion> slonopotamus: where is here?
Oct 09 19:04:11 <Firebird> hm, seems it is 2.14, (judging from the glade-3 version 2.16 files not displaying)
Oct 09 19:04:48 <slonopotamus> solarion, russia. it means smth totally unrelated to reality
Oct 09 19:05:29 <solarion> aaah
Oct 09 19:05:35 <solarion> slonopotamus: physics?
Oct 09 19:06:49 <solarion> need to get a new ssh key
Oct 09 19:06:56 <javispedro> ".game" extension for chess games....
Oct 09 19:12:36 <Firebird> woa, a double split
Oct 09 19:12:57 <javispedro> heh. we start seeing weird GlibQt things.
Oct 09 19:13:17 <javispedro> the "DirectUI" library (aka maemo6) requiring both Qt 4.6, Gconf, and Gstreamer.
Oct 09 19:14:24 <Firebird> hm, is the maemo5 SDK supposed to be laggy and look like it lacks hardware acceleration in any sense?
Oct 09 19:14:28 <johnsq> javispedro: and this all for unneeded gimmicks
Oct 09 19:14:53 <Firebird> ...or is that a consequence of running it on 64bit directly
Oct 09 19:15:09 <javispedro> Firebird: interesting. why you say that (64bit)?
Oct 09 19:15:16 <qwerty12_N810> Firebird: They added that feature for you
Oct 09 19:15:21 <javispedro> cause I experience some slowness too and I'm running it on 64bit.
Oct 09 19:15:37 <javispedro> Firebird: also, do you experience the wrong colors bug?
Oct 09 19:15:41 <Firebird> well, just apparently does not have hardware 3d accel
Oct 09 19:15:47 <Firebird> on mine at least
Oct 09 19:15:54 <Firebird> yea, the wrong colors bug is still there
Oct 09 19:16:08 <javispedro> is there someone who has 100% good colors on fremantle sdk?
Oct 09 19:16:39 <wazd> javispedro: nope)
Oct 09 19:16:51 <wazd> javispedro: I have rave party sometimes
Oct 09 19:17:02 <Firebird> eh, maybe scratchbox just doesn't want to use my nvidia drivers :/
Oct 09 19:17:04 <javispedro> lol
Oct 09 19:17:10 <javispedro> Firebird: 64bit, nvidia.
Oct 09 19:17:35 <javispedro> well, for this "codebugging" season we need at least someone who has working colors...
Oct 09 19:17:48 <qwerty12_N810> goodluckfindingthat :)
Oct 09 19:17:57 <javispedro> btw, first maemo  6 app: http://qt.gitorious.org/maemo-6-ui-framework/framework-technical-preview/blobs/master/examples/calculator/calculator.cpp
Oct 09 19:18:35 <Firebird> aww, no mesa-utils in the SDK
Oct 09 19:20:57 * javispedro worries.
Oct 09 19:21:19 <javispedro> how can someone said "step 5" of a 5 step process is "throw everything we haved coded until today and start again"
Oct 09 19:22:22 <Firebird> javispedro, learn from your mistakes?
Oct 09 19:22:33 <javispedro> I smell second-system effect instead.
Oct 09 19:22:36 <Firebird> plenty of programs have been re-written from scratch at high version numbers
Oct 09 19:24:08 <SpeedEvil> javisask OpenMoko
Oct 09 19:25:04 <solarion> I've rewritten scdataviz entirely too much
Oct 09 19:25:17 <solarion> that, with lack of time, is why it's currently useless to everyone
Oct 09 19:26:18 <solarion> so let that be a lesson to you: perfection is much, much less improtant than JFDI
Oct 09 19:26:32 <jeez_> does anyone know how to disable composite from hildon, on maemo 5 ?
Oct 09 19:26:51 * Firebird would also like to know
Oct 09 19:27:06 <qwerty12_N810> jeez_: In one application or system-wide?
Oct 09 19:27:13 <jeez_> both ?!
Oct 09 19:27:49 <qwerty12_N810> Dunno how it's done system-wide
Oct 09 19:29:12 <jeez_> qwerty12_N810: and in one application ?
Oct 09 19:29:40 <qwerty12_N810> To get it disabled while a certain application is running, set the _HILDON_NON_COMPOSITED_WINDOW Atom which requests compositing to be turned off
Oct 09 19:32:45 <solarion> frickin' A
Oct 09 19:32:54 <solarion> my app works beautifully on the tablet
Oct 09 19:32:58 <SpeedEvil> :)
Oct 09 19:33:09 <solarion> much work to do, but it doens't crash like it does on qemu
Oct 09 19:33:35 * solarion beats his chest and does a Tarzan yell and goes to forage for coffee
Oct 09 19:50:37 <kirma> good God! who selected red text for this? http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo_5_Developer_Guide/Architecture/Top_Level_Architecture
Oct 09 19:51:04 <GeneralAntilles> What's the problem?
Oct 09 19:52:14 <ShadowJK_> seems hard to read on my monitor too
Oct 09 19:52:15 <javispedro> that it does not seem 80% open that way. must use a lighter font, much harder for the human eye to distinguish the closed components then ;)
Oct 09 19:52:17 <kirma> at least on my eyes, that red text is very hard to read on it.
Oct 09 19:52:30 <GeneralAntilles> Bigger: http://wiki.maemo.org/images/9/94/Top_level_architecture.png
Oct 09 19:52:31 <javispedro> s/lighter/darker
Oct 09 19:52:54 <kirma> might be better on some monitor with less intense red or something
Oct 09 19:54:01 <kirma> generalantilles: better, but still, red is the color of text in that thing that requires continuous attention to comprehend
Oct 09 19:58:43 <frals> anyone got any idea how to simulate an incoming sms on the sdk? :)
Oct 09 19:59:50 <Firebird> does the SDK even have phone facilities?
Oct 09 20:00:32 <GeneralAntilles> lol, Nokia can't win.
Oct 09 20:00:44 <GeneralAntilles> http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=342869&postcount=10
Oct 09 20:01:10 <frals> yeah gotta hate companies who are developing new stuff
Oct 09 20:01:34 <javispedro> TMO is starting to burn me off lately too.
Oct 09 20:01:48 <GeneralAntilles> That's the big advantage to Apple's method.
Oct 09 20:02:00 <GeneralAntilles> Don't talk about stuff that people can't buy.
Oct 09 20:02:06 <till-> will maemo 6 not run on the n900?
Oct 09 20:02:12 <GeneralAntilles> Focus is never taken off what you're currently selling.
Oct 09 20:02:16 <frals> the the signal:noise ratio has gone wild since i started lurking tmo :(
Oct 09 20:02:20 <GeneralAntilles> till-, nobody really knows at this point.
Oct 09 20:02:33 <till-> hope it will be like the n800
Oct 09 20:03:37 * Firebird wonders why SDL is under toolkit
Oct 09 20:03:48 <GeneralAntilles> javispedro, worse this weekend since all of the useful people are huddled together in Amsterdam laughing at us sad sacks. :(
Oct 09 20:03:48 <GeneralAntilles> Idoicy is, sadly, increases logarithmically.
Oct 09 20:03:55 <GeneralAntilles> Idiocy drives useful people out, so there's more idiocy so more useful people are driven out and so on.
Oct 09 20:03:55 <javispedro> Firebird: used by blocks game. thus part of platform...
Oct 09 20:04:00 <Firebird> ah
Oct 09 20:04:15 <javispedro> GeneralAntilles: :(
Oct 09 20:04:30 <javispedro> GeneralAntilles: "useful <-> politically correct" slider again :(
Oct 09 20:04:51 <GeneralAntilles> I've been through a lot of churn periods in itT.
Oct 09 20:04:57 <GeneralAntilles> Hopefully we'll come out of the other side OK.
Oct 09 20:05:11 <kirma> till-: I think what they talked of multi-touch as only major hardware feature change on direction of maemo 6 (most importantly, omap3 was being talked about even with it), so it'd seem relatively reasonable to expect maemo 6 to work on n900...
Oct 09 20:05:37 <kirma> unless they start to use multitouch gestures for everything or are plain lazy. ;)
Oct 09 20:05:39 <GeneralAntilles> Capacitive will suck at WVGA and 3.5"
Oct 09 20:05:42 <javispedro> that remembers me, GeneralAntilles, did you saw the capacitive screen
Oct 09 20:05:47 <javispedro> scrap that, I see you did :)
Oct 09 20:06:03 <till-> can't the screen be replaced? :)
Oct 09 20:06:07 <GeneralAntilles> Too bad they aren't using the Stantum resistive multitouch.
Oct 09 20:06:17 <till-> what about an hw-upgrade-kit :)
Oct 09 20:06:36 <Firebird> Stantum multitouch would be nice
Oct 09 20:07:03 <javispedro> time to switch to another hw manufacturer when that happens....... oh, there won't be any :(
Oct 09 20:07:04 <kirma> I think multitouch technologies aren't trivially switchable ;)
Oct 09 20:07:08 <GeneralAntilles> Capacitive seems like a marketdroid move.
Oct 09 20:07:23 <GeneralAntilles> javispedro, we'll see if they don't ship devices with both.
Oct 09 20:07:37 <GeneralAntilles> javispedro, I hate trying to read between the lines with Nokia stuff.
Oct 09 20:07:38 <wazd> GeneralAntilles: they have sponsored Engadget show and caught that fever :)
Oct 09 20:07:41 <Firebird> in fact stantum multitouch could be a PUSH project... especially with their ready made 3.5" panel - too bad there's no USB host
Oct 09 20:07:50 <javispedro> GeneralAntilles: I doubt that, because, as you said, it seems like a marketdroid move
Oct 09 20:07:54 <GeneralAntilles> 'cause half of the conclusions you might be able to draw are just because the Nokia execs can't speak English. <_<
Oct 09 20:07:59 <javispedro> and marketdroids dislike multiple models.
Oct 09 20:08:12 <GeneralAntilles> javispedro, we'll see.
Oct 09 20:08:24 <GeneralAntilles> Multiple models is always something that Nokia people have talked about.
Oct 09 20:08:41 <javispedro> I imagined today another model would be announced.
Oct 09 20:08:52 <javispedro> Guess I was wrong with that prediction.
Oct 09 20:09:12 <SpeedEvil> It was only announced to the cabal.
Oct 09 20:09:41 <GeneralAntilles> Like I said, laughing at us sad sacks.
Oct 09 20:09:48 <frals> hmm, is it just me, or is this link broken? https://oucmswww.nmp.nokia.com:58443/document_browser/ccm_wa/GIF_SPECS/
Oct 09 20:09:54 <Firebird> did anyone ever figure out what the "surprise" in the N900 screen was? or am I imagining that there is a surprise..
Oct 09 20:10:25 <ShadowJK_> what, the "surprise" is now in the screen?
Oct 09 20:10:29 <ShadowJK_> when did it become the screen?
Oct 09 20:10:49 <Firebird> I read something on TMO, maybe I was half asleep
Oct 09 20:10:55 <ShadowJK_> I thought it was the FM radio
Oct 09 20:11:25 <javispedro> I think it's the ir port.
Oct 09 20:11:34 <ShadowJK_> oh yeah, maybe that
Oct 09 20:11:55 <ShadowJK_> is it a dedicated port or is it just abusing the proximity sensor's emitter?
Oct 09 20:11:58 <GeneralAntilles> Ugh
Oct 09 20:12:04 <GeneralAntilles> "Maemo Extras" "http://Maemo.org Extras Testing"
Oct 09 20:12:07 * GeneralAntilles hits Peter.
Oct 09 20:12:17 <ShadowJK_> hm?
Oct 09 20:12:26 <GeneralAntilles> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XxjfRE7GLno
Oct 09 20:12:27 <javispedro> from what I know (not much) it's a CIR TX only.
Oct 09 20:12:29 <GeneralAntilles> 7:45 or so
Oct 09 20:12:41 <GeneralAntilles> It's a real port.
Oct 09 20:12:45 <GeneralAntilles> It's on the top to the right side.
Oct 09 20:12:52 <GeneralAntilles> Next to the camera button.
Oct 09 20:12:54 <kirma> shadowjk?
Oct 09 20:13:06 <Firebird> quoting from talk.maemo "At mobile-review there is a talk about Eldar talking something about N900's screen having a "surprise" with it but I just can't bring myself to believe it is "stantum technology" or something multitouch related. "
Oct 09 20:13:16 <kirma> you mean radio receiver would be using the proximity sensor emitter as antenna?
Oct 09 20:13:56 <ShadowJK_> kirma, no I mean that irreco would be using the proximity sensor emitter for making TVs do weird shit
Oct 09 20:14:40 <kirma> ehm
Oct 09 20:14:53 <kirma> sounds too exotic to say the least to me
Oct 09 20:15:08 <GeneralAntilles> It is, it's a real IR port.
Oct 09 20:15:12 <kirma> what that description even means :)
Oct 09 20:15:21 <Firebird> GeneralAntilles, any comment on that quote?
Oct 09 20:15:27 <GeneralAntilles> Firebird, I have no idea.
Oct 09 20:15:36 <javispedro> only without a receiver (i was already dreaming about getting my m130 to the internet again ;) )
Oct 09 20:15:46 <GeneralAntilles> It certainly behaves like a normal resistive screen.
Oct 09 20:15:51 <GeneralAntilles> Sensitivity is really good.
Oct 09 20:16:05 * GeneralAntilles is so glad they handed out N900s. ;)
Oct 09 20:16:13 <ShadowJK_> kirma, well as I understand it, the proximity sensor is basically just sending out some IR and looking for return signal anyway... I thought it'd been a cool hack if the emitter was modulated at 38kHz so you could bitbang some remote control into it from software :-)
Oct 09 20:16:22 <javispedro> without NDAs. Wonder who will publish the first benchmark ;)
Oct 09 20:17:09 <ShadowJK_> There's one problem I battle with in getting an N900...
Oct 09 20:17:19 <GeneralAntilles> ShadowJK_, I'm sure somebody could do it.
Oct 09 20:17:20 <kirma> I thought proximity sensor is simply similar to capacitive "buttons"
Oct 09 20:17:24 <Firebird> well, it certainly can't be a stantum touch surface, as the screen vectors
Oct 09 20:17:42 <GeneralAntilles> kirma, no, it's like those dbeams you get on some synths and keyboards.
Oct 09 20:17:43 <ShadowJK_> I know I'll be spending so much time hacking/breaking it, that it probably wont even work as phone most of the time...
Oct 09 20:17:49 <GeneralAntilles> It's an IR emitter and a receiver.
Oct 09 20:18:23 <kirma> thought there's entirely separate IR part...
Oct 09 20:19:20 <kirma> but well. it's pretty irrelevant as long as it does what it claims
Oct 09 20:19:22 <ShadowJK_> so it'd seem the device actually has two IR emitters then? :)
Oct 09 20:19:32 <ShadowJK_> One for proximity sensor and one for irreco
Oct 09 20:19:36 <ShadowJK_> I wonder if it can receive too?
Oct 09 20:22:59 <SpeedEvil> the camera can prolly pick up IR
Oct 09 20:24:38 <ShadowJK_> Supposedly someone talked about capacitive multitouch at summit?
Oct 09 20:24:49 <ShadowJK_> SpeedEvil, camera has only like 30fps though at best?
Oct 09 20:27:23 <ShadowJK_> I hope they can get it as accurate as current screens :(
Oct 09 20:27:27 <SpeedEvil> ShadowJK_: it may well be possible to set it for faster - with a smaller frame
Oct 09 20:27:56 <SpeedEvil> ShadowJK_: however - this is based solely on datasheets of similar imagers
Oct 09 20:28:14 <ShadowJK_> you'd need something like 600
Oct 09 20:31:00 <SpeedEvil> yeah
Oct 09 20:31:32 <SpeedEvil> In principle, you could get more if you jam it up to the lens - then you get 1/rollingshutterwidth
Oct 09 20:31:45 <SpeedEvil> but...
Oct 09 20:32:00 <javispedro> what about the proximity sensor ir receiver? ;)
Oct 09 20:35:30 <SpeedEvil> I can't meaningfully speculate on that.
Oct 09 20:35:45 <SpeedEvil> The camera, I have read lots of datasheets on broadly similar ones.
Oct 09 20:35:51 <SpeedEvil> at least the little camera
Oct 09 20:36:03 <javispedro> I guess it can capture nowhere near the required speeds.
Oct 09 20:36:07 <javispedro> s/can/cant
Oct 09 20:36:50 <javispedro> I'm thinking IrDA, not consumer IR.
Oct 09 20:37:27 <SpeedEvil> CIR probably will generally require something that can do over 1KHz or so
Oct 09 20:37:48 <SpeedEvil> Then again, you only need one remote to copy
Oct 09 20:37:55 <SpeedEvil> and anyone else can download it
Oct 09 20:38:20 <javispedro> there's already the remote database, that use case is covered.
Oct 09 20:39:24 <Stskeeps> mooo
Oct 09 20:39:44 <javispedro> hello Stskeeps, how did things go?
Oct 09 20:39:54 <Stskeeps> good
Oct 09 20:39:59 <Stskeeps> a great day
Oct 09 20:40:00 <wazd> Stskeeps: drunk? :D
Oct 09 20:40:05 <Stskeeps> not much
Oct 09 20:42:50 <Stskeeps> happy about gl drivers and n900
Oct 09 20:43:08 <wazd> Stskeeps: yeah, drivers are promissing
Oct 09 20:43:20 <javispedro> :)
Oct 09 20:43:39 <javispedro> got any info apart from the "estimate" schedule (of course that's good enough!!) :)
Oct 09 20:43:41 <javispedro> ?
Oct 09 20:44:28 <Stskeeps> 2 weeks
Oct 09 20:44:39 <javispedro> 2 weeks only?
Oct 09 20:44:41 <javispedro> O.o
Oct 09 20:45:11 <Stskeeps> i was surprised too
Oct 09 20:45:24 <qwerty12_N810> 2 weeks?! For that, Stskeeps, I'll milk a cow of your choice and turn it into beer
Oct 09 20:45:31 <wazd> It's like "Oh yes, drivers were released yesterday" :)
Oct 09 20:45:40 <javispedro> qwerty12_N810++
Oct 09 20:45:54 <Stskeeps> and they tested on the devices already
Oct 09 20:46:34 <qwerty12_N810> But, anyway, hey Stskeeps, how's the Summit going?
Oct 09 20:47:13 <Stskeeps> great imho
Oct 09 20:47:37 <ShadowJK_> any details whether they're stuck on .21 or have opensource wrapper-type thing?
Oct 09 20:48:05 <Stskeeps> open source kernel driver
Oct 09 20:51:17 <Stskeeps> i just wonder how many people will contribute to mer now that god and everyone has a n900
Oct 09 20:52:07 <SmackPotat> whats with maemo 6
Oct 09 20:52:21 <SmackPotat> what hardware
Oct 09 20:52:43 <Stskeeps> no clue
Oct 09 20:54:59 <javispedro> Stskeeps: same answer as question "what are n810 3d drivers for" I guess.
Oct 09 20:55:20 <SmackPotat> where
Oct 09 20:55:48 <SmackPotat> makebelieve
Oct 09 20:56:00 <javispedro> werewolve.
Oct 09 21:03:18 <GeneralAntilles> Stskeeps, ready for your talks? ;)
Oct 09 21:05:16 <Stskeeps> GeneralAntilles: did one today
Oct 09 21:06:56 <GeneralAntilles> Went well?
Oct 09 21:15:32 <GeneralAntilles> Stskeeps, see if you can get somebody to figure out xmodmap.
Oct 09 21:15:36 <GeneralAntilles> It's not participating for me here.
Oct 09 21:43:15 * zerojay yawwwwwns.
Oct 09 21:43:28 * GeneralAntilles stabs xmodmap.
Oct 09 21:43:58 * xmodmap shanks GeneralAntilles 
Oct 09 21:44:14 * GeneralAntilles bleeds out.
Oct 09 21:44:43 <GeneralAntilles> Anything I try to change with xmodmap seems to die.
Oct 09 21:44:47 <GeneralAntilles> What the hell did Nokia do?
Oct 09 21:45:25 <zemm29> fail?
Oct 09 21:45:29 <zerojay> qwerty12_N810: I'm going to have to give the source for my wallpapers package if I want it in Extras, apparently. I ended up just manually creating the .deb though. :/
Oct 09 21:46:11 <GeneralAntilles> sucksucksuck
Oct 09 21:46:13 <zerojay> So I'm not exactly sure what to give them. :)
Oct 09 21:46:58 <zerojay> GeneralAntilles: Once I have the source for the package... what do I do to get it into extras-testing/extras-devel?
Oct 09 21:47:07 <GeneralAntilles> Throw it at the builder
Oct 09 21:47:12 <GeneralAntilles> Using dput or the Extras assistant.
Oct 09 21:47:14 <qwerty12_N810> zerojay: The point is to just use the source package given; grab the tar.gz, fill up the data folder with your backgrounds, and dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot for a deb :p
Oct 09 21:47:32 <zerojay> qwerty12_N810: Yeah, the problem is I can't run anything having to do with dpkg.
Oct 09 21:47:49 <zerojay> I guess I'll just have to reinstall the SDK.
Oct 09 21:48:05 <GeneralAntilles> vmware!
Oct 09 21:48:06 <qwerty12_N810> Ah, I thought you still had it installed
Oct 09 21:48:10 <zerojay> I did.
Oct 09 21:48:16 * frals bashes his head against the lack of documentation on sms handling in fremantle
Oct 09 21:48:31 <zerojay> And sometime between now and the last time I ran it a few weeks ago... something got fucked up, I guess. I can't login to scratchbox anymore.
Oct 09 21:49:30 * qwerty12_N810 wonders what was done to osso-chess-ui for Nokia to close-source it in Fremantle
Oct 09 21:49:37 <zerojay> They did?
Oct 09 21:49:39 <GeneralAntilles> http://pastebin.com/df09f53b
Oct 09 21:49:42 <javispedro> osso-chess-ui was open source?
Oct 09 21:50:02 <javispedro> lmao http://repository.maemo.org/pool/diablo/free/o/osso-chess-ui/
Oct 09 21:50:17 <GeneralAntilles> Do I need to do something different to get another level with fn+shift+
Oct 09 21:50:20 <GeneralAntilles> ?
Oct 09 21:50:21 <zerojay> qwerty12_N810: By the way, glad you liked Streets of Rage. I was checking the IRC log for #maemo at work when I came across what you said. :)
Oct 09 21:50:36 <qwerty12_N810> javispedro, zerojay: The Diablo one is open, the Fremantle one is not
Oct 09 21:50:57 <javispedro> I even have source code for a osso-games-startup plugin.
Oct 09 21:51:03 <javispedro> here, readily available at my own fingers!
Oct 09 21:51:06 * javispedro is stuuupid.
Oct 09 21:51:28 <qwerty12_N810> zerojay: Thanks, I've been wanting one for ages :)
Oct 09 21:51:49 <zerojay> I had to make it taller, so I made the middle area larger.
Oct 09 21:52:29 * qwerty12_N810 needs to find a way to run XChat in college... probably result in my ass getting banned, but I'ma #maemo addict
Oct 09 21:52:30 <zerojay> Best thing about classic games is that everything's based on tiles, so you can throw a grid on the image and copy and paste tiles.
Oct 09 21:53:18 <ShadowJK_> qwerty12_N810, xchat on n900? ;-)
Oct 09 21:53:44 <qwerty12_N810> ShadowJK_: I don't know the College's WEP (Yes, WEP) key :/
Oct 09 21:53:58 <SpeedEvil> WEP. Lollerskates.
Oct 09 21:54:07 <zerojay> Anything on how to uninstall the current beta2 SDK?
Oct 09 21:54:31 <javispedro> at least it's not unusable-without-my-plugin eduroam wpa2 with pap auth.
Oct 09 21:55:00 <frals> thank god my university is using peap-mschapv2 on eduroam
Oct 09 21:55:31 <qwerty12_N810> I guess it would be a nice opportunity to see if packet injection works on it...
Oct 09 21:56:53 <qwerty12_N810> javispedro: Oh, do you have the osso-games-startup source code at hand?
Oct 09 21:56:59 <javispedro> yeah.
Oct 09 21:57:15 <javispedro> for nearly any version you want.
Oct 09 21:57:16 <javispedro> so shoot.
Oct 09 21:57:19 * GeneralAntilles stabs xmodmap again.
Oct 09 21:57:21 <ShadowJK_> n900 has gprs, wcdma and hspa though ;D
Oct 09 21:57:23 <javispedro> (diablo, fremantle beta2, fremantle final...)
Oct 09 21:57:52 <qwerty12_N810> javispedro: Open src/startup_gamemanager.c and look at the retardiness that is game_mime_open()
Oct 09 21:58:27 <qwerty12_N810> ShadowJK_: Not on a contract... I had 60p taken out and I was connected to GPRS for 0 seconds...
Oct 09 21:58:44 * javispedro looks at someone using GConf as a lock, something which is usually frowned upon.
Oct 09 21:59:00 <qwerty12_N810> javispedro: The applets do it all the time
Oct 09 21:59:17 <javispedro> I guess that means "welcome to maemo" again :)
Oct 09 21:59:20 <qwerty12_N810> Look at the applet_active boolean keys in GConf
Oct 09 21:59:47 <javispedro> well, active is one. "IN_PROGRESS" sounds like a more intense lock.
Oct 09 22:00:24 <qwerty12_N810> Maybe because it's easy to watch for changes
Oct 09 22:01:10 <javispedro> so the plugin never gets the filename unless it looks at the gconf key in the MA_LOAD_MIME "callback".
Oct 09 22:01:18 <GeneralAntilles> xmodmap is loading the map weird
Oct 09 22:01:50 <javispedro> at least it takes care of setting game state to running. Currently I do this in drnoksnes by a nice hackely way.
Oct 09 22:02:09 <GeneralAntilles> OK, somebody look at this: http://pastebin.com/d745d441f
Oct 09 22:02:25 <qwerty12_N810> It takes care of setting Chess' game state to running...
Oct 09 22:02:44 <javispedro> nah, unless it boots the chess game (which would suck)
Oct 09 22:02:54 <qwerty12_N810> Err, yeah, you're right
Oct 09 22:03:11 <javispedro> w.t.f. then.
Oct 09 22:04:19 <qwerty12_N810> osso-games-startup is totally for stock/INDT games only. The functions are written, and hardcoded, for a certain game that happens to be needing it :)
Oct 09 22:04:37 <javispedro> and chess is the only one using save files.
Oct 09 22:04:42 <javispedro> heh.
Oct 09 22:05:05 <qwerty12_N810> I wanna see javispedro-game-startup, a saner version
Oct 09 22:05:12 <javispedro> it was forked from maemo-games-startup why ago, and I've been already thinking quite a few times about reviving the orig version (which even had multiplayer)
Oct 09 22:05:19 <javispedro> s/why/quite a while
Oct 09 22:06:20 <javispedro> of course, nokia couldn't care less since they don't plan to use it for anything, and I doubt anybody would "port" it to Qt.
Oct 09 22:06:23 * GeneralAntilles gives up.
Oct 09 22:09:10 <javispedro> well, so far, I think something could be done out of it.
Oct 09 22:09:24 <javispedro> without any time consuming forks.
Oct 09 22:10:12 <javispedro> Hopefully nobody will  play Chess and DrNokSnes at the same time :)
Oct 09 22:10:23 * zerojay raises hand.
Oct 09 22:10:52 <qwerty12_N810> Make DrNokSnes kill Chess :p
Oct 09 22:10:55 <zerojay> I had chess, marbles, the other two built-in games, Bounce, DrNokSNES and every other app running at the same time. :)
Oct 09 22:11:22 <zerojay> 39 total.
Oct 09 22:11:39 <qwerty12_N810> lol, I still haven't grasped multitasking: most programs I've had open on here has been 4 :)
Oct 09 22:11:55 <javispedro> well, don't complain when drnoksnes gets confused and writes your chess game in PGN all over the emulated RAM.
Oct 09 22:12:02 <qwerty12_N810> Well, "heavy-duty" multitasking
Oct 09 22:12:12 <zerojay> I deleted the picture at Quim's request... time to take a new one, I guess. :P
Oct 09 22:12:13 <GeneralAntilles> Ah, Talk.
Oct 09 22:12:21 <GeneralAntilles> Rehashing the same tired arguments over and over and over.
Oct 09 22:12:40 <javispedro> pft.
Oct 09 22:13:05 <javispedro> now that the Transmission thread has been revived I can't wait for "OMG I CAN RUN TRAMSSIONSOENS ON THIS THING !! ONE ONE"
Oct 09 22:13:25 <Stskeeps> javispedro: saw drnoksnes was featured by a nokian on summit?
Oct 09 22:13:37 <javispedro> was it tim with zeemote?
Oct 09 22:14:00 <Stskeeps> no, product manager
Oct 09 22:14:02 <Stskeeps> sec
Oct 09 22:14:31 <zerojay> PM for a project that isn't his. ;)
Oct 09 22:14:47 <javispedro> heh :)
Oct 09 22:15:11 <Stskeeps> ah no
Oct 09 22:15:16 <qwerty12_N810> So, really, javispedro has been working in his' basement
Oct 09 22:15:17 <Stskeeps> linux foundation guy
Oct 09 22:15:34 <Stskeeps> http://twitter.com/#search?q=%23maesum%20snes
Oct 09 22:15:48 <javispedro> qwerty12_N810: yes, unfortunately some people would frown If they find me playing Kirby's Dream Course in UNI ;)
Oct 09 22:16:18 <qwerty12_N810> I'd frown at anyone playing any Kirby game, anywhere
Oct 09 22:16:28 <GeneralAntilles> lol
Oct 09 22:16:43 <GeneralAntilles> So, who's going to analyze my pastebin? :P
Oct 09 22:16:59 * Stskeeps is really looking forward to GLES on n8x0
Oct 09 22:17:06 <javispedro> last time I touched Xmodmap I nearly ended ditching up GNU/Linux.
Oct 09 22:17:27 <GeneralAntilles> Bleh
Oct 09 22:17:31 <GeneralAntilles> What are my alternatives? :P
Oct 09 22:17:39 <GeneralAntilles> It seems to ignore changes to the symbols file.
Oct 09 22:17:46 <javispedro> I still have a Xsessionerrors file that grows a few megabytes every logon.
Oct 09 22:18:07 * javispedro needs to upgrade^W mkfs and install Squeezy some day
Oct 09 22:18:23 <qwerty12_N810> "I hate javispedro. Print 20 ASCII goatses"
Oct 09 22:18:35 <GeneralAntilles> C'mon, qwerty12_N810, you must want tab too. :P
Oct 09 22:19:00 <qwerty12_N810> GeneralAntilles: I still use XChat from my N810 :p
Oct 09 22:19:37 <javispedro> because he made the N900 an appendix of his own body, and now he can't take the device out of him.
Oct 09 22:19:49 <zerojay> I know I can't.
Oct 09 22:20:11 <qwerty12_N810> ...and the N900 has no � key I can replace with Tab :/
Oct 09 22:20:11 <zerojay> Feel like a fucking crack addict.
Oct 09 22:20:20 <qwerty12_N810> lol
Oct 09 22:20:34 <GAN800_> You're all freaking useless.
Oct 09 22:20:34 <zerojay> So glad I only have to give it back after a year.
Oct 09 22:20:45 <javispedro> why I feel that way too when they ask me "what do you use that thing for again?"
Oct 09 22:20:58 <qwerty12_N810> zerojay: Think they'll accept my N800 instead? :/
Oct 09 22:20:59 <microlith> anyone know if there's a listing of packages that will be in the maemo 5 repository on release?
Oct 09 22:21:02 <zerojay> lol.
Oct 09 22:21:05 <javispedro> if only I could say "life-support".
Oct 09 22:21:20 <zerojay> microlith: Why don't you just check out the repository yourself on release day?
Oct 09 22:21:21 <qwerty12_N810> GAN800_: We are Maemo.
Oct 09 22:21:24 <zerojay> microlith: Or even... no.
Oct 09 22:21:25 <zerojay> now.
Oct 09 22:21:31 <microlith> :o
Oct 09 22:21:42 <zerojay> With the karma system in place, it's hard to predict, honestly.
Oct 09 22:22:04 <javispedro> go vote fms' apps, I want my GBA emulator damnit.
Oct 09 22:22:12 <zerojay> Yeah, no kidding.
Oct 09 22:22:23 * javispedro is decent enough not to vote for it, cause he STILL Doesn't have an N900.
Oct 09 22:22:52 <qwerty12_N810> What happened to GTA: N900?
Oct 09 22:22:59 <javispedro> not enough karma.
Oct 09 22:23:01 <qwerty12_N810> Bulldozer gave up?
Oct 09 22:23:09 <qwerty12_N810> Ah
Oct 09 22:23:18 <javispedro> it reincarnated into a iphone game because of low karma.
Oct 09 22:23:35 <zerojay> qwerty12_N810: lol, wha...?
Oct 09 22:23:41 <GeneralAntilles> qwerty12_N810, you have backspace, enter, all of the arrow keys, fn-shift on the whole keyboard.
Oct 09 22:23:56 <qwerty12_N810> zerojay: Mine and javispedro's plan to steal lcuk's N900 :p
Oct 09 22:23:56 <GeneralAntilles> qwerty12_N810, as soon as somebody can get it working there's lots of keys to bind.
Oct 09 22:24:04 <zerojay> lol
Oct 09 22:24:10 * javispedro didn't know the plan either.
Oct 09 22:24:27 <javispedro> but it looks good enough.
Oct 09 22:24:41 <javispedro> even tho I have a better plan now.
Oct 09 22:25:08 <javispedro> get a "n900-loan" and then spent siz months trying to reverse engineer it and make a similar device, then return the similar shit device instead.
Oct 09 22:25:29 <zerojay> Glad you're being productive. :)
Oct 09 22:26:10 <qwerty12_N810> javispedro: OpenPandoraClone?
Oct 09 22:26:28 <javispedro> I said six months, not eternity, damnit.
Oct 09 22:26:44 <qwerty12_N810> You also said "similar shit device"
Oct 09 22:27:09 <javispedro> hum.
Oct 09 22:31:24 <javispedro> I wonder if someone has a copy of the Jim's slide about DrNokSnes?
Oct 09 22:32:53 <javispedro> or video...
Oct 09 22:54:44 <zerojay> Tonight on Unsolved Mysteries... what the fuck is wrong with the average Talk user?
Oct 09 22:54:59 <zerojay> UPDATE - http://zerojay.com/misc/classic-gaming-wallpapers_1.2-1maemo0.deb for Maemo 5 users.
Oct 09 22:55:27 <zerojay> 4 new panoramic wallpapers added.
Oct 09 22:55:38 <GeneralAntilles> lots and lots is wrong
Oct 09 22:55:51 <qwerty12_N810> yay, thanks zerojay
Oct 09 22:55:59 <GeneralAntilles> This is what happens when you sequester all of the normal people away in a foreign country.
Oct 09 22:56:29 <frals> bet theyve all spent the times since the announcement of n900 reading the MMS spec
Oct 09 22:56:40 <javispedro> they've gone insane.
Oct 09 22:56:44 <javispedro> INSANE! INSANE!
Oct 09 22:56:47 * frals bashes head against the desk and goes to bed
Oct 09 22:57:31 <zerojay> MMS is for pussies.
Oct 09 22:57:35 <zerojay> Real men use smoke signals.
Oct 09 23:00:08 <ShadowJK_> it's funny how n900 declares 3g video calls obsolete before they've taken off
Oct 09 23:01:02 <GeneralAntilles> Considering they want to charge $15 a month for the privilege. . . .
Oct 09 23:01:02 <zerojay> Uh.. it does?
Oct 09 23:01:29 <ShadowJK_> well it doesn't "declare", it's in same category as mms
Oct 09 23:01:51 <GeneralAntilles> I don't know a single person who's ever used it.
Oct 09 23:01:56 <GeneralAntilles> I doubt that'll change in the next year.
Oct 09 23:02:13 <zerojay> Same here.
Oct 09 23:02:16 <zerojay> Dinner time.
Oct 09 23:02:22 <ShadowJK_> i think on package contracts here it gets included in minutes
Oct 09 23:04:58 <GeneralAntilles> Ah, crap, forgot to take a picture of my spaghetti.
Oct 09 23:06:34 <rmt> MMS - because otherwise people have to send your pictures of their penises or tits in a mirror by email..
Oct 09 23:09:51 * rmt went through a lot of MMSs when there was a security issue at a telco in Oz .. about 50% was exactly that .. and for all the women out there, your pictures of tits in a mirror are always forwarded to your boyfriends friends, but don't let that put you off.
Oct 09 23:11:47 <SpeedEvil> And any telco people investigating 'security' issues.
Oct 09 23:21:10 <lcukx41> hey ho maemo o\
Oct 09 23:21:13 <lcukx41> o/ even
Oct 09 23:22:54 <qwerty12_N810> javispedro: osso_rpc_set_cb_f() appears to be called after load_plugin(), so trying to get the value of the GConf key doesn't get me the value for the latest file to be opened, and my cb set with osso_mime_set_cb (osso_rpc_set_cb_f(), unfortunatly, not being available) doesn't ever get called :/
Oct 09 23:23:04 <qwerty12_N810> lcukx41: hi, how's De Wallen?
Oct 09 23:23:13 <javispedro> hello lcuk
Oct 09 23:23:56 <javispedro> qwerty12_N810: so, the problem you're trying to solve now is what happens if you double tap on a file when the gui is already up?
Oct 09 23:24:03 <lcukx41> hi qwerty12_N810 i tried but the nice ladies told me to send you over instead
Oct 09 23:24:07 <lcukx41> hiya javispedro
Oct 09 23:24:57 <qwerty12_N810> javispedro: I can't even get it working when it's not running...
Oct 09 23:25:07 <qwerty12_N810> lcukx41: Nonsense!
Oct 09 23:25:43 <lcukx41> they did, either they were covered up through the cold, or i was in the wrong end of town
Oct 09 23:25:55 <javispedro> for that I'd write some MA_MIME_OPEN callback code, look at the chess gconf key, know i've just been opened, and just select that rom file.
Oct 09 23:26:00 <lcukx41> Mek, ahhh you are here
Oct 09 23:26:05 <lcukx41> does your irc ever go off
Oct 09 23:26:11 <Mek> :) no, it doesn't
Oct 09 23:26:44 <lcukx41> qwerty12_N810 i had a lovely cup of coffee tho
Oct 09 23:26:51 <qwerty12_N810> javispedro: I haven't the slightest on how o-g-s works, it's already pissing me off
Oct 09 23:26:55 <qwerty12_N810> lcukx41: heh
Oct 09 23:27:10 <javispedro> then don't worry, that's on my todo list after all.
Oct 09 23:27:18 <lcukx41> how are you javis
Oct 09 23:27:34 <javispedro> doing fine :) u? :)
Oct 09 23:27:56 <lcukx41> am a little bit stressed
Oct 09 23:28:10 <lcukx41> tis ok tho
Oct 09 23:28:13 <qwerty12_N810> javispedro: Cool, I will steal your eventual code and send you a SNES ROM of your choice to say thanks
Oct 09 23:28:24 <lcukx41> mek is gonna fight off the zombies
Oct 09 23:28:29 <lcukx41> and let me finish my code in time
Oct 09 23:28:50 <lcukx41> only 1 hours to get it working :|
Oct 09 23:28:53 <lcukx41> 11
Oct 09 23:28:59 <javispedro> qwerty12_N810: $REFERENCE_TO_QWERTY'S_EVILNESS
Oct 09 23:29:22 <javispedro> either way, "better grab a chair" :)
Oct 09 23:29:43 <qwerty12_N810> Evilness? Me? I'm all cream and peaches
Oct 09 23:29:45 <javispedro> fight off the zombies?
Oct 09 23:30:08 <javispedro> you have vampires and zombies in that maesum? pretty complete.
Oct 09 23:30:14 <qwerty12_N810> Mek: Oh, do you smoke too? :p
Oct 09 23:30:27 <Mek> qwerty12_N810: no, I don't
Oct 09 23:31:26 <lcukx41> javispedro, the first night was like something out of a horror thriller
Oct 09 23:31:38 <lcukx41> it was horrid deep strong rain
Oct 09 23:31:53 <qwerty12_N810> Mek: Ah, I was imagining lcuk smoking in the room
Oct 09 23:31:58 <lcukx41> and i was wandering completely alone in a strange city soaking wet trying to get a fix
Oct 09 23:32:02 <lcukx41> on the gps
Oct 09 23:32:22 <lcukx41> and a big tram came screeching ast
Oct 09 23:32:24 <lcukx41> past
Oct 09 23:32:33 <javispedro> ah, yes, that echoes my first trip to München too.
Oct 09 23:32:33 <lcukx41> and the electric lines arced and sparked
Oct 09 23:32:38 <lcukx41> and i jumped about 10foot
Oct 09 23:33:11 <lcukx41> and outside this bloody window is a strange alien woman
Oct 09 23:33:43 <qwerty12_N810> You were in the Blue Light District?
Oct 09 23:34:11 <lcukx41> blue?
Oct 09 23:34:15 <lcukx41> i saw red and green
Oct 09 23:34:25 <lcukx41> blue lights are the tech crowd who can buy cool gadgets?
Oct 09 23:35:18 <qwerty12_N810> I thought blue lights were associated with alien abductions
Oct 09 23:35:35 <qwerty12_N810> Then again, they wouldn't take their own kind
Oct 09 23:37:20 <MaceTB> heh
Oct 09 23:37:29 <MaceTB> finally found out why the damn touchbook network manager was messed up
Oct 09 23:37:34 <MaceTB> was a bad python script
Oct 09 23:38:28 <lcukx41> qwerty12_N810, heh.
Oct 09 23:38:54 * lcukx41 goes back to hacking. 
Oct 09 23:38:56 <MaceTB> this touchbook is pretty awesome once you fix a couple things on it
Oct 09 23:39:10 <MaceTB> even though i was expecting the omap3 to be a tad bit quicker
Oct 09 23:40:44 <ShadowJK_> same cpu as N900 basically :)
Oct 09 23:44:34 <MaceTB> yeah
Oct 09 23:44:45 <MaceTB> with more to do than an n900
Oct 09 23:44:51 <MaceTB> higher res on the gpu i suppose
Oct 09 23:45:13 <MaceTB> a lot of the pkgs seem to be made for an omap2.. would that make a difference?
Oct 09 23:45:24 <MaceTB> i mean ddi they add new omap3 instructions to make it faster?
Oct 09 23:48:18 <ShadowJK_> I suspect instruction scheduling might give more benefit than new instructions
Oct 09 23:48:24 <ShadowJK_> gcc is crap at NEON type things anyway :)
Oct 09 23:49:28 <MaceTB> i was just curious because most of theh pkgs are for an older arm
Oct 09 23:49:32 <MaceTB> they are bin pkgs
Oct 09 23:49:43 <MaceTB> where's luke-jr when you need him ? :)
Oct 09 23:49:46 <luke-jr> ...
Oct 09 23:49:57 <MaceTB> "use gentoo and waste half your life"
Oct 09 23:49:59 <MaceTB> :)
Oct 09 23:50:09 <luke-jr> Gentoo wastes nothing much really
Oct 09 23:50:18 <luke-jr> my N810 upgrades when I'm using my desktop
Oct 09 23:51:04 <luke-jr> hey, xorg-server 1.7.0 built
Oct 09 23:51:08 <luke-jr> now Fn should work!
Oct 09 23:54:45 <MaceTB> woop
Oct 09 23:54:52 <MaceTB> fn key!!!
Oct 09 23:54:53 <MaceTB> haha
Oct 09 23:55:07 <MaceTB> i haven't used my n810 since i got the touchbook
Oct 09 23:55:09 <MaceTB> :)
Oct 09 23:55:21 <MaceTB> which is just more so like a laptop than anything else
Oct 09 23:58:50 <GeneralAntilles> Macer, you need an N900.
Oct 09 23:59:37 <luke-jr> ...
Oct 09 23:59:42 <luke-jr> Macer doesn't need anything
Oct 09 23:59:45 <luke-jr> he has a ton of devices
Oct 10 00:09:11 <crashanddie> for anyone who cares
Oct 10 00:09:16 <crashanddie> http://www.flickr.com/photos/43419012@N04/?savedsettings=3996134435#photo3996134435
Oct 10 00:09:38 <crashanddie> i'm off to bed, bye
Oct 10 00:10:23 <lmoura> is anyone having problems to checkout from garage's svn?
Oct 10 00:10:54 <lmoura> I'm getting svn: REPORT request failed on '/svn/pymaemo/!svn/vcc/default'
Oct 10 00:10:54 <lmoura> svn: Can't find a temporary directory: Internal error
Oct 10 00:12:07 <crashanddie> lmoura: that looks like it's the client complaining
Oct 10 00:14:38 <lmoura> crashanddie, somehow it started working again
Oct 10 00:14:41 <lmoura> thatnks
Oct 10 00:15:59 <GAN800> Hate you, crashanddie.
Oct 10 00:17:25 <zerojay> GAN800: Just going down the checklist, eh? lol
Oct 10 00:18:47 <zerojay> javispedro: The guy behind n900wallpapers.com wants to know if he can collaborate with you on autogenerating .debs for wallpapers.
Oct 10 00:18:54 <zerojay> He just doesn't know it yet.
Oct 10 00:19:35 <javispedro> actually, I'm generating src pkgs here already.
Oct 10 00:20:00 <zerojay> Oh nice.
Oct 10 00:20:19 <javispedro> it's an easy job so far since I assume the server has the usual debian tools... just a matter of sanitizing input (heh), filling in appropiate templates and calling dpkg-source.
Oct 10 00:20:46 <zerojay> And the resulting source can be upped to maemo extras then?
Oct 10 00:20:59 <javispedro> yeah.
Oct 10 00:21:12 <javispedro> lemme see if I can get it to build a sample one.
Oct 10 00:21:41 <zerojay> Great. Feel free to use my wallpapers for tests or whatever. I want them in ASAP.
Oct 10 00:26:07 <zerojay> I said that I ran 39 apps at the same time on my N900 on Twitter and I get back a reply that some guy had 50 running on his N95.
Oct 10 00:26:18 <zerojay> Don't make me laugh. Mine would start shitting itself with three.
Oct 10 00:27:51 <lmoura> and now is the wiki down?
Oct 10 00:28:25 <lmoura> I mean a postgre error
Oct 10 00:32:42 <sp3000> ah, garage says it's having a maint break
Oct 10 00:32:53 <sp3000> perhaps that explains why I can't login to the general sire
Oct 10 00:32:55 <sp3000> site even
Oct 10 00:35:18 <GAN800> zerojay, what 'apps'? ;)
Oct 10 00:38:32 * GeneralAntilles wonders when these people decided that it was fun to show up unannounced.
Oct 10 00:43:22 <GeneralAntilles> lmoura, pieces of http://maemo.org seem to be falling off this week.
Oct 10 00:43:28 <GeneralAntilles> Not great considering the amount of press. <_<
Oct 10 00:44:10 <Firebird> woa, the maemo.nokia site changed
Oct 10 00:45:09 <GeneralAntilles> Since when?
Oct 10 00:45:16 <MaceTB> heh
Oct 10 00:45:35 <GeneralAntilles> Ah, indeed.
Oct 10 00:49:35 <Firebird> GeneralAntilles, when you hit fullscreen on the browser, there are no transitions on the top and bottom bars right?
Oct 10 00:50:28 <MaceTB> the n900 will come out soon.. and 2 years later tmob will be selling it
Oct 10 00:50:29 <MaceTB> heh
Oct 10 00:50:43 <GeneralAntilles> Firebird, right.
Oct 10 00:51:07 <Firebird> ah, the flash demo says otherwise on maemo.nokia
Oct 10 00:51:23 * GeneralAntilles is a few versions behind.
Oct 10 00:51:27 <Firebird> hm, why in the world does the portrait mode dialer have letters
Oct 10 00:51:33 <GeneralAntilles> Could've changed, or could be changing for the final.
Oct 10 00:51:39 <Firebird> ah
Oct 10 00:51:39 <GeneralAntilles> Why wouldn't it have letters?
Oct 10 00:51:45 <GeneralAntilles> My 5800 dialer doesn't have letters
Oct 10 00:51:48 <GeneralAntilles> It pisses me off so much
Oct 10 00:52:20 <GeneralAntilles> Means I have to do a Google image search to figure out the letters.
Oct 10 00:52:59 <Firebird> I would imagine phone numbers are numerical and that the letter positions would be stored in your head
Oct 10 00:53:13 <zerojay> The letters need to be there.
Oct 10 00:53:27 <MaceTB> wtf is up with this whole cancer side story in law and order
Oct 10 00:53:36 <MaceTB> i don't want to see some bitch crying about her cervical cancer
Oct 10 00:54:05 <Firebird> harsh
Oct 10 00:54:18 <zerojay> GeneralAntilles: We gotta get some of the guys there to send us the updated firmware and Q3. :)
Oct 10 00:55:11 <Firebird> zerojay, its not over the air yet?
Oct 10 00:55:58 <zerojay> Not until release, anyways.
Oct 10 00:56:03 <zerojay> Though that may have changed today.
Oct 10 00:56:33 <zerojay> We had to flash both the firmware and the emmc.
Oct 10 00:56:42 <zerojay> Which end users will never need to do, generally speaking.
Oct 10 00:56:56 <Firebird> ah, on the side note oh look, a 48GB microSD: http://maemo.nokia.com/images/uploads/entry-media/sd-card-icon.png
Oct 10 00:57:19 <zerojay> lol
Oct 10 00:57:27 * SpeedEvil can tell by the pixels.
Oct 10 00:57:30 <zerojay> I've got 48GB total on my N900.
Oct 10 00:57:46 <zerojay> 32GB internal + 16GB microSD.
Oct 10 00:57:56 <Firebird> they seem to be suggesting you can get up to 80GB there with the image
Oct 10 00:58:34 <zerojay> Well, the max they are claiming is 48GB... so I think the image was just made to say "total memory".. but who knows.
Oct 10 00:58:35 <SpeedEvil> Never attribute to malice what can be adequately explained by a marketing monkey that knows photoshop.
Oct 10 00:59:42 <iDialekt> http://www.boygeniusreport.com/2009/10/09/t-mobiles-rumored-project-black-handsets/
Oct 10 00:59:43 <iDialekt> Hmm
Oct 10 01:01:43 <GAN800> zerojay, I don't want anything from them. They all suck. :P
Oct 10 01:02:06 <zerojay> lol
Oct 10 01:02:27 * Firebird wonders how to get the transparent top bar effect like in ovi maps
Oct 10 01:03:16 <javispedro> zerojay: http://depot.javispedro.com/n900wall/
Oct 10 01:03:53 <javispedro> even though i'm not sure if I can keep generating binary packages (i wouldn't like my ISP to see "dpkg-buildpackage" high on their CPU usage logs ;P)
Oct 10 01:04:08 <zerojay> lol.
Oct 10 01:04:12 <zerojay> Good shit though.
Oct 10 01:04:56 <ShadowJK_> I think people outside of the US have no idea why there are letters on the dialer :)
Oct 10 01:05:08 <ShadowJK_> they'd probably think it's for some unfinished sms-portrait support
Oct 10 01:05:30 <zerojay> Really?
Oct 10 01:05:41 <jaska> the yanks have something like 1-800-DIAL-GOD style numbers?
Oct 10 01:06:00 <zerojay> Some.
Oct 10 01:06:01 <Firebird> well, I'm in the US, but have never dialed a number with letters in it
Oct 10 01:06:06 <zerojay> Not people though.
Oct 10 01:06:12 <zerojay> Firebird: REALLY?
Oct 10 01:06:16 <Firebird> yes, really
Oct 10 01:06:22 <zerojay> 1800-call-att?
Oct 10 01:06:32 <Firebird> if I ever encounter one, I just convert it on the spot, not on the phone
Oct 10 01:06:34 <GAN800> What about computers that want me to spell things over the phone.
Oct 10 01:06:43 <zerojay> Exactly.
Oct 10 01:08:22 <Firebird> javispedro, did you ever make any progress on an animated OGL test
Oct 10 01:08:49 <javispedro> I did not try, but I know there quite a few people with things in the making right now
Oct 10 01:09:20 <Firebird> ah, I started porting SDL1.3 with OGLES this afternoon, was wondering how the performance was
Oct 10 01:09:35 <javispedro> from pandora or upstream?
Oct 10 01:09:46 <javispedro> if upstream, get my sample to get some of the egl parameters.
Oct 10 01:09:55 <Firebird> the upstream one from github
Oct 10 01:09:58 <javispedro> else the device does weird things.
Oct 10 01:10:01 <Firebird> ah
Oct 10 01:10:14 <ShadowJK_> GAN800, those don't exist outside US (and other?) countries that have letters on dialpad :)
Oct 10 01:10:54 <ShadowJK_> They actually  tried to introduce it here once. Gave out free stickers and all. People were mostly "wtf I don't want to put stupid stickers on my phone's keys"
Oct 10 01:11:16 <javispedro> Firebird: there was (for example) quite a weird bug documented in -developers: the surface is RGB565 but trying to specify the number of bits fails, even if you say 5-6-5.
Oct 10 01:11:26 <GAN800> ShadowJK_, weird.
Oct 10 01:11:49 <Firebird> hm, odd
Oct 10 01:12:46 <Firebird> there's a SDL1.2 with GLES, wonder if it has the same bug
Oct 10 01:13:07 <javispedro> that's probably the pandora one
Oct 10 01:13:15 <javispedro> and it was designed for powervr in mind, so I'd say no.
Oct 10 01:15:51 <Firebird> well the 1.3 has a specific video driver for pandora
Oct 10 01:16:28 <Firebird> it does directfb, what does the stock SDL use? X11?
Oct 10 01:16:37 <GAN800> I hope we get a discount program soon.
Oct 10 01:17:12 <Firebird> GAN800, why? You already have a device don't you?
Oct 10 01:17:45 <GAN800> I wonder if delays turned the Summit program into a loaner program.
Oct 10 01:18:10 <GAN800> Yeah, but we need more people with devices.
Oct 10 01:18:35 <GAN800> Then I can wait for other people to do things for me instead of doing them myself. :P
Oct 10 01:18:38 <javispedro> Firebird: X11 of course.
Oct 10 01:18:50 <javispedro> the PowerVR as described by the Pandora guys is usually a mess.
Oct 10 01:19:13 <javispedro> (no opinion since I don't have a device)
Oct 10 01:19:26 <ShadowJK_> a mess?
Oct 10 01:19:30 <javispedro> for example, they say it integrates badly and with horrible performance with X11
Oct 10 01:19:52 <ShadowJK_> I've heard that so far nobody has managed to make it do anything useful :-)
Oct 10 01:19:59 <Firebird> I'll just go ahead and build the 1.2 version for now to avoid any issues
Oct 10 01:20:04 <zerojay> Hmm.. I see sid in the list of gstreamer-ugly plugins... heh.
Oct 10 01:20:12 <javispedro> Firebird: i'd suggest the oposite, the 1.3 version is way more useful.
Oct 10 01:20:30 <GAN800> OK, round two of layout modding failed.
Oct 10 01:20:33 <Firebird> aren't there api breaks in 1.3?
Oct 10 01:20:33 <javispedro> just you may need to change egl settings if it works in x86 emul but not device.
Oct 10 01:20:47 <javispedro> Firebird: yes, there's some compat wrapper tho.
Oct 10 01:20:49 <GAN800> Nothing seems to have an effect, and when it does it's a bad one.
Oct 10 01:20:54 <javispedro> I don't know if it's any good.
Oct 10 01:20:59 <Firebird> they've been working on it for an awfully long time
Oct 10 01:21:08 <javispedro> and it's still not done :)
Oct 10 01:21:14 <Firebird> seems like its been at 1.2 since the beginning of time
Oct 10 01:22:59 * GAN800 is still way faster on the finger keyboard.
Oct 10 01:23:17 * javispedro builds another wallpaper package :P
Oct 10 01:23:50 <javispedro> they don't look as good in the sdk.
Oct 10 01:24:16 <zerojay> no?
Oct 10 01:24:31 <javispedro> sometimes I can see the divisions.
Oct 10 01:24:46 <zerojay> Which wallpaper are you looking at?
Oct 10 01:24:50 <javispedro> and at least here there's no weird effect with the widgets.
Oct 10 01:24:59 <javispedro> i think it's a gfx problem I have.
Oct 10 01:25:05 <javispedro> at least the wallpaper didn't turn yellow.
Oct 10 01:25:07 <Firebird> ack, can't even test opengl... since my SDK clearly lacks any opengl support
Oct 10 01:25:20 <javispedro> Firebird: libgles2-dev, extras-devel.
Oct 10 01:25:21 <GAN800> Why is it that when iTunes can't find album art it for a song it always defaults to $RANDOM Disney movie. . . .
Oct 10 01:25:31 <javispedro> Firebird: ah, you mean host openGL?
Oct 10 01:25:32 <Firebird> javispedro, as in, there's no hardware accel at all
Oct 10 01:25:40 <javispedro> what are you using?
Oct 10 01:25:44 <javispedro> a vm?
Oct 10 01:25:45 <Firebird> I have it outside of scratchbox but not inside
Oct 10 01:25:53 <Firebird> native
Oct 10 01:26:28 <javispedro> Xlib:  extension "GLX" missing on display ":2.0".
Oct 10 01:26:30 <javispedro> hm.
Oct 10 01:26:58 <javispedro> maybe that's the reason my SDK is dead slow too.
Oct 10 01:27:02 <Firebird> I see no errors on my end, just that it isn't acceled at all
Oct 10 01:27:41 <Firebird> might go grab a x86 box from upstairs and install the SDK on it
Oct 10 01:27:52 <javispedro> Firebird: you said you don't have glxinfo in sbox, but you can just point your host's glxinfo to display :2
Oct 10 01:28:05 <Firebird> ah, right
Oct 10 01:28:29 <Firebird> dun, dun, dun: "direct rendering: No (If you want to find out why, try setting LIBGL_DEBUG=verbose)"
Oct 10 01:28:36 <javispedro> maybe lenny's xephyr hasn't any GLX accel
Oct 10 01:30:44 <Firebird> lenny? I have whatever version of Xephyr that comes with xorg-server 1.6.3.901-r1
Oct 10 01:31:00 <MaceTB> hm
Oct 10 01:34:51 <javispedro> Firebird: do you use Xinerama?
Oct 10 01:36:04 <Firebird> javispedro, no
Oct 10 01:38:14 <lcukx41> hey javispedro
Oct 10 01:38:33 <javispedro> hi lcukx41
Oct 10 01:38:59 <GAN800> lcukx41, isn't it bed time?
Oct 10 01:39:06 <lcukx41> javispedro, you got the new sdk
Oct 10 01:39:11 <lcukx41> not tonight gan
Oct 10 01:39:12 <javispedro> yep :)
Oct 10 01:39:17 <lcukx41> ive got code i need to write
Oct 10 01:39:23 <lcukx41> :) good
Oct 10 01:39:33 <lcukx41> got your book yet?
Oct 10 01:39:45 <javispedro> nope
Oct 10 01:39:50 <lcukx41> damn you! lol
Oct 10 01:40:09 <lcukx41> i couldnt get into the gaming session but vdv said it was cool
Oct 10 01:40:29 <javispedro> =) no video I guess.
Oct 10 01:40:30 <lcukx41> GAN800, arent you meant to tell me that in person \@/
Oct 10 01:40:40 <lcukx41> not from me
Oct 10 01:40:45 <lcukx41> check #maesum tags
Oct 10 01:40:51 <GAN800> :(
Oct 10 01:41:05 <lcukx41> yu yuhhh i actually wanted to meet u
Oct 10 01:41:33 <lcukx41> the X on the summit flyer looks like xchat icon
Oct 10 01:41:39 <GAN800> Watching videos and browsinf Flickr is just depressing me.
Oct 10 01:41:45 <lcukx41> (only cos its an x)
Oct 10 01:41:55 <lcukx41> yeah understandably gan, thats rly crap
Oct 10 01:42:01 <GAN800> Anybody see my nametag on the table? :P
Oct 10 01:42:07 <lcukx41> damn!
Oct 10 01:42:09 <lcukx41> ill check
Oct 10 01:42:15 <lcukx41> and we should post it to you
Oct 10 01:42:21 <lcukx41> tshirt too
Oct 10 01:42:26 <GAN800> Quite a souvenir. :P
Oct 10 01:42:44 <lcukx41> hell yeah "i didnt fly over the atlantic, and all i got was this lousy tshirt
Oct 10 01:43:11 <GAN800> Take pictures of it like sjgadsby got of Karel's in 2008? :D
Oct 10 01:43:22 <lcukx41> ok ill try to remember
Oct 10 01:43:28 <lcukx41> but my head is screwed already
Oct 10 01:44:36 <GAN800> lol
Oct 10 01:45:10 <GAN800> They've stuck you in a box to write Qt apps haven't they? :P
Oct 10 01:45:10 <lcukx41> ive merged the graffiti walls :) without a database
Oct 10 01:45:23 <lcukx41> well mek just spent last 2 hours compiling new qt
Oct 10 01:45:29 <lcukx41> whilst i  was happy hacking lol
Oct 10 01:45:44 <lcukx41> he has gone to bed tho
Oct 10 01:45:50 <lcukx41> i need to get presentation done
Oct 10 01:45:57 <lcukx41> 12.30 tomorrow
Oct 10 01:46:18 <Firebird> oh, that's why, Xpehyr doesn't support direct rendering yet...
Oct 10 01:47:50 <javispedro> Firebird: that's not true, where are you reading that?
Oct 10 01:48:54 <Firebird> javispedro, the freedesktop page
Oct 10 01:48:57 <Firebird> http://www.freedesktop.org/wiki/Software/Xephyr
Oct 10 01:49:36 <javispedro> but I'm looking at the GLX code right now.
Oct 10 01:51:14 <lcukx41> o_O
Oct 10 01:51:45 <lcukx41> javispedro, i just realised, i can do the layout
Oct 10 01:51:57 <javispedro> uh?
Oct 10 01:52:16 <lcukx41> since arriving here ive been trying to suss out how to make a presentation
Oct 10 01:52:28 <lcukx41> i havent got vb over here, and you are the only one whos done it in linux
Oct 10 01:53:12 <javispedro> heh.
Oct 10 01:55:18 <javispedro> i don't remember about everything...
Oct 10 01:56:03 <javispedro> lcukx41: but those say it works flawlessly: http://appdb.winehq.org/objectManager.php?sClass=version&iId=1325
Oct 10 01:56:25 <lcukx41> i havent got wine or anything so im  not bothering tonight
Oct 10 01:56:55 <lcukx41> not that path anyway
Oct 10 01:57:10 <lcukx41> i just realised i can vnc into my home machine now i have a little internet
Oct 10 01:57:25 * lcukx41 is well past the ballmer peak
Oct 10 01:58:15 <javispedro> heh
Oct 10 01:58:19 <javispedro> well, good night.
Oct 10 02:09:35 <GAN800> zerojay, ping?
Oct 10 02:18:11 <smackpotato> .
Oct 10 02:18:16 <zerojay> GAN800: Pong.
Oct 10 02:18:31 <GeneralAntilles> zerojay, go create a Maemo EATS! group on Flickr?
Oct 10 02:18:38 <zerojay> lol
Oct 10 02:21:27 <zerojay> GeneralAntilles: Done: http://www.flickr.com/groups/1281847@N22/
Oct 10 02:22:05 <GeneralAntilles> I'd be tempted to change the tagline to "with Maemo"
Oct 10 02:22:10 <GeneralAntilles> But then it's not really THAT specific. :D
Oct 10 02:22:29 <GeneralAntilles> Haha
Oct 10 02:22:32 <Firebird> shouldn't it be "will be eaten" no one wants to see eaten food
Oct 10 02:22:46 <GeneralAntilles> My Dvorak keyboard is slowly failing in its purpose as an extra barrier to entry to using my computer.
Oct 10 02:23:00 <zerojay> When you start taking pics of food with your N900, you can have a say, Firebird. ;)
Oct 10 02:23:08 <GeneralAntilles> Haha
Oct 10 02:25:15 <zerojay> This has to be the most retarded meme. lol
Oct 10 02:25:32 <GeneralAntilles> Memes are retarded by their very definition.
Oct 10 02:25:39 <GeneralAntilles> Think of it as a grass roots marketing campaign.
Oct 10 02:25:45 <GeneralAntilles> (NOT VIRAL!)
Oct 10 02:26:24 <zerojay> lol
Oct 10 02:27:13 * GeneralAntilles is gonna make fried chicken tomorrow night.
Oct 10 02:29:04 <zerojay> I invited about 5 other people and posted the group to my flickr using #maemo and #n900 tags. Heh.
Oct 10 02:41:55 <lcukx41> zerojay, GeneralAntilles great - yes, pics of food is good
Oct 10 02:42:05 <lcukx41> better to have pics of receipts tho ;)
Oct 10 02:42:14 <lcukx41> so you can do ocr on it later
Oct 10 02:42:27 * lcukx41 writes a baconscan tool
Oct 10 02:42:52 <GeneralAntilles> Okaaaay, lcuk. :P
Oct 10 02:44:00 <lcukx41> how would you make a machine identify bacon
Oct 10 02:44:13 <lcukx41> found it be on smell, or on color or texture or what
Oct 10 02:44:25 <lcukx41> would
Oct 10 02:44:46 <GeneralAntilles> Taste
Oct 10 02:44:47 <GeneralAntilles> in my mouth.
Oct 10 02:45:31 <lcukx41> its a photo
Oct 10 02:45:40 <lcukx41> it will taste of paper
Oct 10 02:45:46 <lcukx41> mind you, american bacon is a bit crap
Oct 10 02:46:23 <GeneralAntilles> How would you know? :P
Oct 10 02:46:34 <GeneralAntilles> and Oscar Meyer doesn't count. :P
Oct 10 02:47:53 <lcukx41> heh
Oct 10 02:48:06 <lcukx41> all the coffee shops closed hours ago
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Sat Oct 10 02:59:56 2009