**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sun Dec 20 02:59:56 2009
Dec 20 03:00:26 <Arkenoi> btw we were wrong, there _is_ /usr/bin/maemo_recorder in maemo-recorder package
Dec 20 03:00:31 <Arkenoi> i just overlooked that
Dec 20 03:00:48 <Arkenoi> jebba: both. that's what i am trying now.
Dec 20 03:01:23 <jebba> Hmm. build server hasn't advanced for at least 2 hours.  looks very wedged. doh.
Dec 20 03:02:17 <jebba> Arkenoi: not in the version i have  dpkg -L maemo-recorder  doesn't have anything in bin
Dec 20 03:02:41 <jebba> dpkg wouldnt let two packages install to the same file either, if i understand it correctly
Dec 20 03:02:49 <jebba> (rpm wouldnt at least)
Dec 20 03:03:27 <Arkenoi> jebba: mine was 2.3.0 as well, from the repo
Dec 20 03:03:44 <Arkenoi> running recorder for 2:30 min so far, still no crash
Dec 20 03:03:44 <jebba> and you see something in /usr/bin when you dpkg -L it ???
Dec 20 03:03:51 <Arkenoi> yep
Dec 20 03:04:36 <stevenhong> ask a question? how to do the hibernate in the maemo?
Dec 20 03:04:42 <jebba> I had version 3.0 of maemo-recorder
Dec 20 03:05:12 <Arkenoi> b00m
Dec 20 03:05:16 <Arkenoi> crash :-(
Dec 20 03:05:19 <jebba> Arkenoi:   http://pastebin.ca/1720957
Dec 20 03:05:55 <jebba> stevenhong: i dont know of a hibernate mode in maemo/n900 fwiw
Dec 20 03:06:11 <jebba> strace it
Dec 20 03:06:38 <stevenhong> my machine is n810
Dec 20 03:06:59 <jebba> actually make that 3.5 hours apparently (or more) for build box stoppage  :(
Dec 20 03:08:53 <stevenhong> another question? have any sources like ubuntu, can add to the sources.list?
Dec 20 03:10:26 <timeless_mbp> jz
Dec 20 03:10:29 <timeless_mbp> use .d/
Dec 20 03:11:19 <GAN900> stevenhong, hibernation serves little purpose.
Dec 20 03:11:30 <Arkenoi> jebba: http://pastebin.ca/1720962 8-)
Dec 20 03:11:50 <GAN900> Maemo is loosely based on Debian
Dec 20 03:12:04 <stevenhong> just for curious
Dec 20 03:12:22 <Arkenoi> (i installed recorder via gui after dpkg -P maemo-recorder and before dpkg -L recorder)
Dec 20 03:12:30 <GAN900> You can often recompile Debian source packages with some success but binaries aren't useful.
Dec 20 03:13:04 <jebba> heh weird, Arkenoi...
Dec 20 03:13:19 * timeless_mbp chuckles
Dec 20 03:13:30 <timeless_mbp> this guy in a movie i'm watching just mentioned building a Chinese Junk
Dec 20 03:13:45 <jebba> Arkenoi: i would guess that having both installing to that spot may cause the problem.  I'd purge them both, then install only recorder and try.
Dec 20 03:14:00 <jebba> timeless_mbp: you dont have access to build server by any chance do you?
Dec 20 03:14:07 <timeless_mbp> nope :)
Dec 20 03:14:16 <jebba> anyone else we can bug?  ;)
Dec 20 03:14:32 <Arkenoi> jebba, that's what i have done as you see
Dec 20 03:14:37 <jebba> i'm guessing just killing off whatever is hanging there will let things move on.
Dec 20 03:14:41 <Arkenoi> and it did not help :-(
Dec 20 03:15:08 <jebba> Arkenoi: where do i see that?
Dec 20 03:15:10 <jebba> anyway.
Dec 20 03:17:44 <Arkenoi> well, i removed recorder before that but did not purge with -P. will try now, though i doubt it helps :-(
Dec 20 03:19:48 <pupnik_> RST38h: serializing states of mind is like piping a painting through morse code
Dec 20 03:21:44 <crashanddie_mbp> jet-lag SUCKS
Dec 20 03:22:02 <Arkenoi> hehe. ran until 2:20, then stopped eating up cpu
Dec 20 03:22:14 <Arkenoi> not responding to anything
Dec 20 03:22:35 <stevenhong> someone knows the GUI software  can view the file system in n810?
Dec 20 03:22:48 <Arkenoi> run again == immediate crash
Dec 20 03:28:39 <swc|666> jebba.. w00t, think i got your modules to load :p
Dec 20 03:29:24 <jebba> cool  :)
Dec 20 03:29:30 <jebba> not the NAT ones though, did you?
Dec 20 03:29:49 <jebba> swc|666
Dec 20 03:30:05 <swc|666> working on it .. they should work
Dec 20 03:31:32 <swc|666> jebba, where is dmesg's log file @ .. i need to tail it to finsih this on the n900
Dec 20 03:31:57 <odin_> is there a way to make the microSD card the visible card via USB in Mass Storage Mode ?
Dec 20 03:32:09 <swc|666> odin_, mount it?
Dec 20 03:32:16 <crashanddie_mbp> swc|666: there is no dmesg log file
Dec 20 03:32:20 <swc|666> dont knwo it that works
Dec 20 03:32:31 <swc|666> crashanddie_mbp, k.. i figured as mich - no worries
Dec 20 03:32:47 <odin_> swc|666,  well attach it
Dec 20 03:32:57 <crashanddie_mbp> swc|666: still, you can always dmesg | grep
Dec 20 03:32:58 <crashanddie_mbp> err
Dec 20 03:33:02 <crashanddie_mbp> dmesg | tail
Dec 20 03:33:44 <swc|666> yepyep
Dec 20 03:33:55 <swc|666> tee even
Dec 20 03:34:15 <derf> odin_: What's CONFIG_SCSI_MULTI_LUN in your kernel config?
Dec 20 03:34:28 <odin_> copying stuff to eMMC to then move to microSD is a pain
Dec 20 03:34:50 <crashanddie_mbp> odin_: you mean you don't see the microSD via USB?
Dec 20 03:34:52 <odin_> my linux workstation with host-mode-usb kernel ? (i.e. not my N900 kernel)
Dec 20 03:34:58 <derf> odin_: Yes.
Dec 20 03:35:37 <odin_> CONFIG_SCSI_MULTI_LUN=y (I have SCSI controller in workstation), but its an older linux install
Dec 20 03:36:06 <derf> Well, that exhausts my knowledge.
Dec 20 03:36:23 <jebba> swc|666: if you figure out the NAT thing, definitely post to this thread how youdid it: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=30916
Dec 20 03:36:52 <derf> You could always mount via sshfs.
Dec 20 03:36:55 <swc|666> yep ..
Dec 20 03:37:46 <odin_> you are right there is a SCSI address "scsi 10:0:0:0: Direct-Access     Nokia    N900              031 PQ: 0 ANSI: 2" and also "scsi 10:0:0:1: Direct-Access     Nokia    N900              031 PQ: 0 ANSI: 2"
Dec 20 03:38:28 <Arkenoi> http://gizmodo.com/5427058/apple-gestapo-how-apple-hunts-down-leaks wow, apple is practicing anal slavery among its employees.. no surprise, actually
Dec 20 03:39:01 <swc|666> jebba, do u have the newly compile ip_tables.ko ? i dont see it on http://www.freemoe.org/users/jebba/kernel/modules/2.6.28-omap1/
Dec 20 03:39:07 <swc|666> ah nm
Dec 20 03:39:09 <swc|666> :p
Dec 20 03:43:09 <odin_> I guess somethig in my kernel of usb-storage is broken (it is an old install, FC4 !)  FC12 doesn't work for me just yet
Dec 20 03:44:01 <odin_> heh unplug and replug and retry did it...
Dec 20 03:44:36 <odin_> no I lie, it just added it again as /dev/sdd (the next in sequence)
Dec 20 03:45:51 <odin_> maybe I need some kind of flip LUNs or include/exclude control to work around a broken host
Dec 20 03:46:55 <odin_> in "PC Suite Mode" is looks like: usb0: register 'cdc_ether' at usb-0000:00:1d.7-6, CDC Ethernet Device, 9a:8b:bc:84:ee:ac
Dec 20 03:47:07 <odin_> can I transfer files over IP ?
Dec 20 03:47:29 <luke-jr_> scp...
Dec 20 03:47:46 <odin_> you mean via WLAN ?  or cable ?
Dec 20 03:47:53 <luke-jr_> who cares? same thing
Dec 20 03:48:37 <dmj726_n9001> Can the n900 be used as a wifi acess point?
Dec 20 03:48:53 <luke-jr_> I would imagine so
Dec 20 03:50:35 <jebba> FC4, yikes
Dec 20 03:50:44 <jebba> dmj726_n9001: see:   http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=30916
Dec 20 03:50:58 <odin_> indeed  (64bit FC4 at that)
Dec 20 03:55:09 <jebba> woo hoo. I set up a SIP client and can call s@localhost with asterisk  :) this fkn rules  :)
Dec 20 03:55:29 <jebba> PBXing with the N900  :)
Dec 20 03:56:09 <jebba> man this is ridiculous though.  Asterisk uses 5%, which is reasonable, but pulseaudio uses 33%.... wtf.
Dec 20 03:56:10 <luke-jr_> jebba: rules how?
Dec 20 03:56:57 <luke-jr_> of course it's *possible*, the reason it's not done is *why*
Dec 20 04:00:22 <swc|666> damnit, one or more of these modules makes it reboot
Dec 20 04:02:09 <luke-jr_> XD
Dec 20 04:02:51 <jebba> swc|666: did you get nat module to even load?
Dec 20 04:03:06 <swc|666> i cam close
Dec 20 04:03:09 <swc|666> came*
Dec 20 04:03:33 <jebba> heh
Dec 20 04:03:41 <swc|666> i got a lot of the xt_*'s to load
Dec 20 04:04:01 <swc|666> some of the ipt_*'s as well
Dec 20 04:04:11 <swc|666> it doesnt like the ip_tables.ko module tho
Dec 20 04:04:18 <swc|666> = !important
Dec 20 04:04:22 <swc|666> :/
Dec 20 04:04:44 <jebba> ok, well good luck. I'm outta here for the night.  I got my asterisk package all queued up and ready to go as soon as build box comes back online.  Bummed i didnt get it out, but at least it WORKSFORME  ;)    same story with burgerspace. Oh well.      have fun.  :)
Dec 20 04:04:47 <swc|666> actually...
Dec 20 04:04:51 <swc|666> do this real quick
Dec 20 04:04:57 <jebba> hwat
Dec 20 04:04:59 <jebba> what
Dec 20 04:05:17 <swc|666> i dont think the ip_tables.ko on the site is the smae as the others that were built
Dec 20 04:05:36 <swc|666> can yu send me the one u built or uplaod it somewhere?
Dec 20 04:05:40 <swc|666> upload*
Dec 20 04:06:01 <swc|666> actually i could try mine too if its an inconvenience
Dec 20 04:06:13 <jebba>  /lib/modules/2.6.28-omap1/ip_tables.ko            comes by default with stock kernel
Dec 20 04:06:35 <swc|666> right, but i think there are extra symbols needed in the new one
Dec 20 04:06:38 <jebba> swc|666: but i have one I built here too:   http://www.freemoe.org/users/jebba/kernel/modules/2.6.28-omap1/ip_tables.ko
Dec 20 04:07:07 <swc|666> ok
Dec 20 04:07:14 <swc|666> thx .. i'll keep trying
Dec 20 04:07:20 <jebba> later !   :)
Dec 20 04:08:51 <swc|666> cya!
Dec 20 04:27:36 <swc|666> weird :/
Dec 20 05:31:30 <dmj726_n900> I'm having a hard time installing otr for pidgin.  Can somebody help me find it?
Dec 20 06:23:47 <oscillik> is anyone else having a problem accessing the extras-testing repo?
Dec 20 06:37:17 <sivang> morning all
Dec 20 06:37:19 <oscillik> hello
Dec 20 06:37:26 <sivang> garage is kind'of slow today
Dec 20 06:37:29 <sivang> hey oscillik
Dec 20 06:37:56 <oscillik> have you had any trouble accessing the extras-testing repo? i've been unable to access it all night
Dec 20 06:38:19 <sivang> I'll try, what's on it?
Dec 20 06:38:35 <sivang> oscillik: could you send me a link to how to set it up into the maemo desktop ?
Dec 20 06:38:52 * sivang prefers that than dogin direct to scratchbox for the sake for thorough testing.
Dec 20 06:38:55 <sivang> oscillik: ^
Dec 20 06:39:24 <oscillik> erm, i can't remember the site that i used for instructions....lemme see if i can find them again
Dec 20 06:39:43 * sivang fires scratchbox and the Maemo
Dec 20 06:40:18 <oscillik> Application manager --> Application catalogs --> New
Dec 20 06:40:18 <oscillik> Catalog name: maemo.org extras-testing
Dec 20 06:40:18 <oscillik> Web address: http://repository.maemo.org/extras-testing
Dec 20 06:40:18 <oscillik> Distribution: fremantle
Dec 20 06:40:18 <oscillik> Components: free non-free
Dec 20 06:40:27 <oscillik> there's the instructions :)
Dec 20 06:40:53 <sivang> cool, thanks
Dec 20 06:40:55 * sivang adds
Dec 20 06:45:45 <sivang> oscillik: there's that minor image corruption when updating, I should report that.
Dec 20 06:46:41 <oscillik> sivang: i can't get it to refresh at all, keeps coming up with "Application list partially refreshed. Some catalogs unavailable. Check catalogue details"
Dec 20 06:47:08 <oscillik> and then when i press Details, it is the extras-testing repo that it's not connecting to, giving a 404 not found
Dec 20 06:48:14 <sivang> oscillik: have you tried to connect to it using plain http / ftp from the terminal ? using wget for example ?
Dec 20 06:48:31 <sivang> It seems I can't update openssh server for some odd reason, are they on the same repo?
Dec 20 06:48:38 <oscillik> i believe so
Dec 20 06:49:42 <sivang> hmm, I removed the extras and still no go, oddly enough it reports the update is being of 0kb
Dec 20 06:49:46 * sivang is confused
Dec 20 06:49:52 <sivang> timeless_mbp: ^^ around ?
Dec 20 06:50:13 <oscillik> yeah i'm confused too, because when i use my EeePC to go to the same directory, i can see everything
Dec 20 06:50:39 <oscillik> and when i run a tracert on repository.maemo.org i get a different IP address than what my N900 is reporting
Dec 20 06:50:40 <sivang> we have to run the update manager or app manager in debug mode, let me see if I can find the flag
Dec 20 06:51:08 <sivang> oscillik: maybe something is scrwed ith your resolving? see if the resolve.conf has the same NSs as your host OS does
Dec 20 06:51:17 <sivang> I've had a similar problem with network manager screwing my NSs
Dec 20 06:51:31 <oscillik> NSs?
Dec 20 06:52:10 <sivang> name servers.
Dec 20 06:53:10 <sivang> so the name servers in /etc/resolv.conf in the scratchbox did not reflect the true ones in the hos OS
Dec 20 06:53:11 <sivang> host OS
Dec 20 06:53:11 <sivang> barr, it's hard to type with frozen fingers.
Dec 20 06:53:39 <oscillik> how can i get that fixed?
Dec 20 06:53:41 <oscillik> :-s
Dec 20 07:02:29 <sivang> oscillik: make sure that the same values for resolve.conf in your scratchbox appear in the host OS resolve.conf
Dec 20 07:13:16 <sivang> oscillik: okay, I'm getting the same rror
Dec 20 07:13:23 <sivang> oscillik: same thing exactly.
Dec 20 07:13:25 * sivang debugs
Dec 20 07:13:53 <oscillik> the ip address it gives me is....
Dec 20 07:13:55 * oscillik checks it again
Dec 20 07:15:22 <oscillik> http://repository.maemo.org/extras-testing/dists/freemantle/free/binary-armel/Packages 404 Not Found [IP: 84.53.132.32 80]
Dec 20 07:15:39 <oscillik> http://repository.maemo.org/extras-testing/dists/freemantle/non-free/binary-armel/Packages 404 Not Found [IP: 84.53.132.32 80]
Dec 20 07:16:37 <swc|666> http://repository.maemo.org/extras-testing/dists/fremantle/free/\
Dec 20 07:16:40 <swc|666> http://repository.maemo.org/extras-testing/dists/fremantle/free/
Dec 20 07:16:41 <swc|666> ++
Dec 20 07:17:07 <swc|666> http://repository.maemo.org/extras-testing/dists/fremantle/free/binary-armel/Packages
Dec 20 07:17:21 <swc|666> freemantle != fremantle
Dec 20 07:17:28 <sivang> right
Dec 20 07:17:37 <swc|666> oscillik, ^
Dec 20 07:17:37 <sivang> so there was a typo, it works here now
Dec 20 07:17:40 <sivang> oscillik: ^^^
Dec 20 07:17:47 <swc|666> LoL
Dec 20 07:17:50 <oscillik> ahhhhh
Dec 20 07:18:00 <oscillik> picard
Dec 20 07:18:02 <oscillik> where are you
Dec 20 07:19:08 * sivang should get some coffee for the morning
Dec 20 07:20:26 <oscillik> am i the only one who thinks having conky on an n900 is gonna waste battery life?
Dec 20 07:20:31 * swc|666 grabs another brew
Dec 20 07:20:44 <swc|666> oscillik, +1 for me
Dec 20 07:21:22 <swc|666> oscillik, the battery already sucks
Dec 20 07:21:34 <oscillik> swc|666: at least it's not an ADP1
Dec 20 07:21:35 <oscillik> ;)
Dec 20 07:21:53 <swc|666> althoug, in the ~28 hrs i've had it, i dont think its left my usb data cable fro more than ~5 hrs 9when i slept) :p
Dec 20 07:22:05 <swc|666> s/athoug/although/
Dec 20 07:22:07 <oscillik> hah
Dec 20 07:22:12 * swc|666 fails
Dec 20 07:22:37 <oscillik> yeah i've not really let mine charge for a very long time, i got mine today after taking a trip to Manchester
Dec 20 07:22:41 <oscillik> i got sick of expansys
Dec 20 07:23:04 <swc|666> expan$y$$$$$
Dec 20 07:23:14 <swc|666> expensive
Dec 20 07:23:44 <swc|666> yet i can't talk .. i overpaid for my n900
Dec 20 07:23:48 <oscillik> lol, i preordered last tuesday and the price was £499.99, then on Thursday the price went up to £504.99
Dec 20 07:23:50 <slonopotamus> morning
Dec 20 07:24:07 * swc|666 paid $810
Dec 20 07:24:52 <ShadowJK> what :)
Dec 20 07:25:07 <oscillik> i paid £499.99 at the Nokia store in Manchester. i'm glad i did cancel the expansys order, as they've pushed the stock back by another 4 or 5 days again
Dec 20 07:25:16 * arachnist paid 2475pln which equals, roughly, 850 usd
Dec 20 07:26:36 <oscillik> i do have a slight dead pixel though :( luckily it's in the app-switcher area, so it's not that noticable
Dec 20 07:27:24 <sivang> is there a list somewhere of all the available software sources that one can use on maemo ?
Dec 20 07:27:47 <sivang> (So far I found only Extras which is an additional to the stock preset ones coming from the installer)
Dec 20 07:28:00 <oscillik> oh, something i've been meaning to ask....does anyone know where to get hold of the maemo theme that is shown in the official Nokia videos? you know, with the angular polygons
Dec 20 07:29:02 <oscillik> :-o
Dec 20 07:29:05 <oscillik> VNC server
Dec 20 07:29:19 <DocScrutinizer51> sivang: check wiki
Dec 20 07:30:27 <timeless_mbp> sivang: afaict ham caches stuff in ~/MyDocs/.apt-cache or something
Dec 20 07:30:31 <timeless_mbp> and uses it a bit too eagerly
Dec 20 07:35:09 <DocScrutinizer51> sivang: http://wiki.maemo.org/Downloading_apps
Dec 20 07:36:28 <sivang> DocScrutinizer51: k, thanks, so there's just ovi / extras and "commercial apps" which seems to be hidden somewhere
Dec 20 07:36:30 <DocScrutinizer51> sivang: and mainpage topics under "beginners" and "power users"
Dec 20 07:38:52 <sivang> this is nice, I thought of developing an app like that but figured havng the GPS reciever working throughout a trip would kill the battery
Dec 20 07:38:55 <sivang> http://maemo.nokia.com/maemo-select/applications/ecoach/
Dec 20 07:39:19 <sivang> It was more of an organizing assitant, so to remind you where you've been today if you loose something and want to backtrack to find it.
Dec 20 07:39:36 <sivang> timeless_mbp: eheh
Dec 20 07:39:43 <sivang> timeless_mbp: let me check that
Dec 20 07:40:42 <sivang> OVI is configuerd as a regular apt source?
Dec 20 07:41:37 <DocScrutinizer51> ovi store for maemo is vaporware afaik
Dec 20 07:44:25 <sivang> okay then.
Dec 20 07:44:30 <sivang> DocScrutinizer51: thanks dude.
Dec 20 07:46:13 <DocScrutinizer51> sivang: I know of extras, extras-testing, extras-devel, and tools. you'll find all of them in wiki
Dec 20 07:47:11 <sivang> DocScrutinizer51: k thanks, when an installation attempt fails, how I can debug what happend in apt to see where the problem lays ?
Dec 20 07:47:17 <sivang> (irssi failed to install)
Dec 20 07:47:55 <DocScrutinizer51> no idea
Dec 20 07:48:20 <timeless_mbp> the title menu has a log item]
Dec 20 07:49:24 <sivang> timeless_mbp: right, but I want to run the app manager in debug mode altogether
Dec 20 07:50:21 <timeless_mbp> did you read the log?
Dec 20 07:51:10 <timeless_mbp> red pill mode is the only way to tweak ham
Dec 20 07:53:00 <sivang> what do you mean red pill mode? :)
Dec 20 07:53:10 <timeless_mbp> ~red pill
Dec 20 07:53:27 <timeless_mbp> oh well, ask google
Dec 20 07:53:59 <sivang> right, so you can't see beyond the matrix :)
Dec 20 07:54:16 <sivang> I Know, just didn't know that's the only way, surely I can rebuild ham with DEBUG=1 or something ?
Dec 20 08:06:29 <Italodance> who's persian here?
Dec 20 08:06:47 <swc|666> my rug
Dec 20 08:06:49 <swc|666> j/k
Dec 20 08:06:57 <Italodance> hehe lol
Dec 20 08:07:01 <swc|666> :D
Dec 20 08:13:25 <sivang> I also want a persian rug! I had one but it was too old :/
Dec 20 08:13:46 <sivang> just like the one GNR has in their appetite for descruction album cover
Dec 20 08:13:59 <Italodance> lol guys
Dec 20 08:14:09 <Italodance> :D
Dec 20 08:14:48 <sivang> hey Italodance
Dec 20 08:15:22 <Italodance> ?
Dec 20 08:18:22 <sivang> Italodance: was just saying hello :)
Dec 20 08:19:26 <Italodance> sivang nice to meet you
Dec 20 08:21:14 <SpeedEvil> sivang: ebay
Dec 20 08:21:36 <sivang> SpeedEvil: right :)
Dec 20 08:22:12 <SpeedEvil> http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Persian-Rug-bought-in-India-approx-1947_W0QQitemZ290380996143QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_Home_Garden_Rugs_SM?hash=item439c0e5e2f
Dec 20 08:22:16 <SpeedEvil> forex
Dec 20 08:22:26 <SpeedEvil> got several
Dec 20 08:22:28 <swc|666> Italodance, your english is good .. sup?
Dec 20 08:23:03 <Italodance> swc|666 hehe what's this funny question?
Dec 20 08:23:13 <arachnist> what's up
Dec 20 08:23:42 <Italodance> well maybe old guys knew me hee
Dec 20 08:23:50 <Italodance> here lolzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
Dec 20 08:24:04 <swc|666> Italodance, hehe, nothing .. just that u asked if there werw any persians here, but your english is good, so i thought maybe u have a question in regards to maemo/nokia device
Dec 20 08:25:00 <Italodance> nono
Dec 20 08:25:17 <Italodance> 1 persian guy needed me for solve a problem
Dec 20 08:25:30 <Italodance> i hate forums and just want to help him here
Dec 20 08:26:10 <Italodance> plus hate nokia too
Dec 20 08:33:29 <sivang> Italodance: you a maemo developer ?
Dec 20 08:33:42 <sivang> Italodance: how's your wonderful landscapred country this fine morning ?:)
Dec 20 08:33:52 <Macer> ugh
Dec 20 08:33:58 <Macer> i have no idea wtf is going on with this pptp in dd-wrt
Dec 20 08:34:01 <Macer> it's driving me up the wall
Dec 20 08:34:16 <Macer> i can connect locally but i can't when i'm trying to connect from the outside
Dec 20 08:35:20 <sivang> hmm, mediaplayer is playing up :)
Dec 20 08:35:31 <sivang> and seems the UI doesn't like rapid cliking and switching\
Dec 20 08:37:38 <slonopotamus> -_-
Dec 20 08:42:19 <PaulFertser> slonopotamus: hey, have you managed to mount initfs?
Dec 20 08:42:44 <PaulFertser> I see in #mer :)
Dec 20 08:42:51 <slonopotamus> k
Dec 20 08:51:36 <arachnist> hmm
Dec 20 08:51:39 <arachnist> something's wrong
Dec 20 08:51:59 <arachnist> i can't connect to my wifi, even though i'm sure my wifi is up and running
Dec 20 08:52:11 <arachnist> (my laptop's connected over it)
Dec 20 08:55:25 <sivang> DarwinSurvivor: you've survived Apple's darwin ? :)
Dec 20 08:57:42 <SpeedEvil> The one in australia I'd think
Dec 20 08:57:56 <sivang> hehe
Dec 20 08:58:03 <sivang> hmm, mediaplery won't close
Dec 20 08:58:12 <sivang> is there a "kill app" widget ?
Dec 20 08:58:30 <SpeedEvil> go to task manager, hit close
Dec 20 08:58:43 <SpeedEvil> or power button ->; end task
Dec 20 08:58:46 <DarwinSurvivor> sivang: as in "Darwinian Theory"
Dec 20 08:58:56 <sivang> DarwinSurvivor: right :)
Dec 20 08:59:08 <sivang> SpeedEvil: how do you open the task manager?
Dec 20 08:59:14 <DarwinSurvivor> never actually used the Apple Darwin
Dec 20 08:59:34 <DarwinSurvivor> judging by your comment, that's probably a good thing :P
Dec 20 08:59:40 <sivang> it is :)
Dec 20 09:00:00 <DarwinSurvivor> lol
Dec 20 09:00:35 <DarwinSurvivor> sivang: n810 or n900?
Dec 20 09:01:25 <SpeedEvil> sivang: tap the selector in the top right of the titlebar if it's visible
Dec 20 09:02:03 <sivang> I'm on the SDK :)
Dec 20 09:02:38 <DarwinSurvivor> ah
Dec 20 09:02:50 <sivang> isn't the task amanger available on the SDK ?
Dec 20 09:03:04 <DarwinSurvivor> i was thinking "wait, my n810 doesn't have a kill option when you hit the power button!"
Dec 20 09:04:24 <sivang> :)
Dec 20 09:04:28 <sivang> so plain o' kill ?
Dec 20 09:04:31 <sivang> from the terminal ?
Dec 20 09:04:46 <sivang> HOw am I to create educational videos if I don't have everything on the SDK ?....
Dec 20 09:05:19 <SpeedEvil> The SDK is not an emulator
Dec 20 09:05:22 <SpeedEvil> it's a SDK
Dec 20 09:06:19 <ShadowJK> You know, all these questions could be avoided if they left out the xephyr stuff and just gave you the compiler+tools, libs and headers... ;-)
Dec 20 09:07:02 <sivang> SpeedEvil: what's the way to install the emulator ?
Dec 20 09:07:13 <SpeedEvil> sivang: there is no emulator
Dec 20 09:07:22 <sivang> ah :/
Dec 20 09:09:25 <Jaffa> morning, all
Dec 20 09:09:31 <SpeedEvil> morning.
Dec 20 09:19:46 <sivang> so, is osso-xterm THE terminal app for n900 ?
Dec 20 09:19:58 <sivang> are there any others? is there a nokia recommended / official one ?
Dec 20 09:21:58 <SpeedEvil> sivang: not currently
Dec 20 09:22:14 <SpeedEvil> osso-xterm is the only one available on the device as it ships
Dec 20 09:24:15 <sivang> SpeedEvil: okay, and is there a good one to isntall ? I added the -extras and couldn't find any while searching for a teminal program
Dec 20 09:25:15 <SpeedEvil> as far as I know, there isn't an alternative
Dec 20 09:25:42 <arachnist> rxvt should be available somewhere
Dec 20 09:25:52 <arachnist> i remember using it on the N800
Dec 20 09:25:53 <SpeedEvil> A port of a nice terminal would be good
Dec 20 09:26:03 <sivang> okay, I will try fix us something.
Dec 20 09:26:10 <arachnist> but what's wrong with osso-xterm?
Dec 20 09:26:26 <SpeedEvil> arachnist: no way to do fullscreen
Dec 20 09:26:30 <arachnist> no?
Dec 20 09:26:47 <SpeedEvil> arachnist: sure the bar with tab/pgup/down is nice - but occasionally I'd like to lose it
Dec 20 09:26:56 <arachnist> oh
Dec 20 09:27:06 <arachnist> well, i prefer to have it
Dec 20 09:27:08 * sivang searches for the source package
Dec 20 09:27:20 <SpeedEvil> arachnist: have it - but not there all the time - with no choice
Dec 20 09:27:22 <Stskeeps> osso-xterm is openly developed, too
Dec 20 09:28:01 <SpeedEvil> arachnist: for example - a button on the left of the bar to pop it down, and a slide up from the bottom right corner gesture to pull it back
Dec 20 09:28:25 <arachnist> hmm
Dec 20 09:29:05 <arachnist> that'd make two fullscreen modes. confusing for the user
Dec 20 09:29:23 <SpeedEvil> I don't bloody care.
Dec 20 09:29:39 <SpeedEvil> Users that are easily confused shouldn't be using terminals.
Dec 20 09:29:49 <arachnist> nokia UI designers do care
Dec 20 09:30:16 <SpeedEvil> Trying to pretend that a shell application can be user friendly is bloody insane.
Dec 20 09:30:47 <arachnist> with enough alcohol, i would get confused by it too
Dec 20 09:31:15 <SpeedEvil> Which is why n920 should have a blood alcohol sensor.
Dec 20 09:31:24 <SpeedEvil> There are so many good reasons for that.
Dec 20 09:31:43 <arachnist> (then again, one shouldn't touch his cellphone while drunk. except for calling for a cab)
Dec 20 09:33:30 <Vratha> don't worry, if you're drunk, you won't be able to get around the interface
Dec 20 09:33:36 <Vratha> so there won't be any drunk dialing
Dec 20 09:33:50 <Stskeeps> you'd be surprised how much i was able to use my n8x0 while drunk
Dec 20 09:33:50 <Stskeeps> :P
Dec 20 09:33:55 <arachnist> Vratha: thing is, i am able to
Dec 20 09:34:18 <Vratha> i chalk that up to a series of coincident keystrokes that all lead to a phone call
Dec 20 09:34:26 <Vratha> because the UI isn't the greatest for dialing
Dec 20 09:34:58 <SpeedEvil> Especial skill if you can dial from the 8x0 :)
Dec 20 09:35:11 <Vratha> :)
Dec 20 09:35:28 <Milo-> 8x0 had no physical keyboard?
Dec 20 09:36:00 <arachnist> Vratha: i once fired-up midpssh, tapped in 14-character password using the number pad on my old SE K800i and rebooted a machine, while drunk
Dec 20 09:36:09 <arachnist> Milo-: n800 had not. n810 had
Dec 20 09:36:14 <Milo-> arachnist okay
Dec 20 09:36:24 <SpeedEvil> 8x0 had no phone
Dec 20 09:36:25 <Vratha> arachnist: i had sex while drunk
Dec 20 09:36:30 <Vratha> i thought that was pretty cool :)
Dec 20 09:36:48 <Stskeeps> SpeedEvil: no, but i did have irc and tethering
Dec 20 09:36:52 <arachnist> Vratha: (only to realize that the machine had a screwed-up grub config and didn't get back up)
Dec 20 09:37:01 <Vratha> heh
Dec 20 09:37:38 <Milo-> I once changed my root's passwd while drunk, from 28 char to 48
Dec 20 09:37:47 <Milo-> and for some reason, I had written down the new password on paper :D
Dec 20 09:38:16 <Vratha> well, while drunk one time, i just went home and fell asleep
Dec 20 09:38:19 <Milo-> that wasn't for phone.
Dec 20 09:38:37 <Milo-> Vratha tells the most amazing while drunk stories
Dec 20 09:38:43 <Milo-> I think he's an absolutist :o
Dec 20 09:38:56 <Vratha> absolutist?
Dec 20 09:39:05 <Vratha> i mean, i know what that is
Dec 20 09:39:10 <Vratha> but i'm not making the connection
Dec 20 09:44:39 <RST38h> "Personnel must respect a twenty meter (20 m) safe zone around the currently established Red (No Entry) Zone at all costs. Any individual, civilian or not, who enters the established Red Zone is to be terminated immediately by sniper fire."
Dec 20 09:46:19 <SpeedEvil> ambiguous
Dec 20 09:46:44 <SpeedEvil> does not explicitly state groups
Dec 20 09:46:59 <SpeedEvil> or large animals
Dec 20 09:49:03 <sivang> SpeedEvil++ re usability for a terminal application
Dec 20 09:49:31 <arachnist> http://qdb.mit.edu/199
Dec 20 10:00:57 <sivang> I got married once when drunk, and ever since trying to devorce :)
Dec 20 10:01:15 * sivang listens to Shine On You Crazy Diamon, Pink Floyd
Dec 20 10:01:21 <sivang> any bill bailey fans here?
Dec 20 10:02:42 <LeoD> that is one awesome song
Dec 20 10:02:57 <sivang> LeoD: indeed. it makes me cry everytime I hear it.
Dec 20 10:03:00 <sivang> and think of Sid
Dec 20 10:03:03 <LeoD> :<
Dec 20 10:03:18 <sivang> Who dies of that dredful diseas
Dec 20 10:03:22 <sivang> died
Dec 20 10:04:02 <sivang> it is actually used for me to reach rock bottom of mood, and then come up from there again, sort'a like watching Requiam For A Dream
Dec 20 10:04:13 <LeoD> hah
Dec 20 10:04:20 <crashanddie_mbp> Requiam?
Dec 20 10:04:23 <sivang> now the drums are kicking in!
Dec 20 10:04:30 <LeoD> music doesn't affect my mood at all.. listening to this song rather makes me happy because of how awesome it is
Dec 20 10:04:32 <sivang> crashanddie_mbp: yep. please forgive my non nativeness
Dec 20 10:04:43 <crashanddie_mbp> I forgive you
Dec 20 10:04:44 <sivang> LeoD: I've always been an emotional listener
Dec 20 10:04:48 <LeoD> :)
Dec 20 10:04:51 <sivang> :)
Dec 20 10:04:57 <sivang> LeoD: do you play an instru,ent ?
Dec 20 10:05:03 <sivang> *instrument
Dec 20 10:05:09 <LeoD> i used to play the trumpet when i was younger
Dec 20 10:05:18 <LeoD> gave it up because i was too lazy to practice :/
Dec 20 10:05:20 <sivang> so you should be able to emote when listening
Dec 20 10:05:30 <sivang> anyone who plays has to have this ability
Dec 20 10:05:35 <LeoD> maybe
Dec 20 10:05:37 <sivang> or else he wouldn't be able to put soul in the  music
Dec 20 10:05:47 <sivang> try to feel the guitar's cry if you listen to this song next time
Dec 20 10:05:53 <LeoD> yeah i know what you mean
Dec 20 10:05:55 <sivang> and the change of the chords as their express dispair
Dec 20 10:06:16 <sivang> (moving from major and minor scales, interchangeably)
Dec 20 10:06:25 <LeoD> will do
Dec 20 10:06:38 <sivang> we need to get some cool apps for musician on the maemo :)
Dec 20 10:06:44 <LeoD> yeah
Dec 20 10:06:49 <sivang> and no, not meaning just a tuner app! :-p
Dec 20 10:06:52 <LeoD> :P
Dec 20 10:07:35 <sivang> crashanddie_mbp: I'm ssh'd to my server , and the latency is a bit bigger right now
Dec 20 10:07:42 <sivang> crashanddie_mbp: that's why so many typos
Dec 20 10:07:50 * sivang waits for 9.10 for finish its update
Dec 20 10:08:18 <crashanddie_mbp> sivang: congrats for the geekness, demote for the fact you couldn't drop the subject at the right time
Dec 20 10:08:34 <timeless_mbp> > Metro will be operating on its normal schedule Saturday, from 7 a.m. - 3 a.m.
Dec 20 10:08:37 * timeless_mbp sighs
Dec 20 10:08:52 <timeless_mbp> compare that w/ Helsinki's Metro which stops @something like 10 or 11pm
Dec 20 10:09:01 <Stskeeps> which is very annoying
Dec 20 10:09:07 <Stskeeps> came with plane and assumed i could use metro.. no no
Dec 20 10:09:08 <Stskeeps> :P
Dec 20 10:09:24 <sivang> oh, that's almost as bad as in Israel
Dec 20 10:09:40 <sivang> although we have one train that goes at 2:30am for those who come late through the airport
Dec 20 10:09:42 <Stskeeps> timeless_mbp: is the central metro station still fubar?
Dec 20 10:09:45 <timeless_mbp> yep
Dec 20 10:09:53 <timeless_mbp> they plan to be open in feb or apr or something
Dec 20 10:09:58 <Stskeeps>  k
Dec 20 10:10:08 <timeless_mbp> i should post more photos
Dec 20 10:10:13 <sivang> crashanddie_mbp: which subject should I have dropped at the right time?
Dec 20 10:10:20 <sivang> timeless_mbp: you should :)
Dec 20 10:10:37 <timeless_mbp> sivang: have you seen the ones i have posted? :)
Dec 20 10:11:19 <timeless_mbp> "Drivers are advised not to <> unless vital"
Dec 20 10:11:36 <timeless_mbp> vital? what kind of stupid ... .... .... BBC
Dec 20 10:12:13 <sivang> timeless_mbp: I have :)
Dec 20 10:12:15 <sivang> timeless_mbp: nice
Dec 20 10:13:16 <sivang> crashanddie_mbp: ah, the fact that I remnetioned my typos :)
Dec 20 10:13:30 <sivang> crashanddie_mbp: sorry about that, I'm a bit of a late catcher
Dec 20 10:13:42 <sivang> so, what's up with the af-... not starting after one start ?
Dec 20 10:13:50 <sivang> through the scratchbox , that is
Dec 20 10:14:02 <LeoD> gah, i want a n900 so i can do ssh+screen+irssi too :P
Dec 20 10:14:06 * sivang searches for the dbus killing in the xephyr_start.sh script
Dec 20 10:14:46 <timeless_mbp> sivang: actually, i've got something you might be able to help me w/ :)
Dec 20 10:14:49 <sivang> LeoD: yeha, that's cool, I've done that with the forums people were here in Tel Aviv, we even got on video doing that but the local representative still hasn't put the videos online
Dec 20 10:14:55 <sivang> timeless_mbp: shoot!
Dec 20 10:15:01 <timeless_mbp> it's unfinished, and i haven't looked in a couple of months
Dec 20 10:15:14 <LeoD> sivang: nice :>
Dec 20 10:15:34 <LeoD> though how do you manage to press alt? :P
Dec 20 10:15:38 <sivang> I wish NOkia had chosen a more professional local representative, or would have started a branch here.
Dec 20 10:15:57 <sivang> LeoD: there was an odd key comb that I forgot, using ESC in the terminal
Dec 20 10:16:03 <LeoD> i see
Dec 20 10:16:04 <sivang> so like readline ESC sequences
Dec 20 10:16:10 * sivang tries to look for that.
Dec 20 10:16:17 <sivang> it took us a while to find the right combo
Dec 20 10:16:17 <LeoD> well i'll be remapping a lot of keys anyway
Dec 20 10:16:25 <sivang> right, you better do :)
Dec 20 10:16:25 <LeoD> as i'm from germany :/
Dec 20 10:16:35 <sivang> And I thought it was a proper qwerty
Dec 20 10:16:51 <LeoD> we don't even get all the arrow keys in germany
Dec 20 10:17:15 <sivang> oh ?
Dec 20 10:17:28 <LeoD> yeah, as they need space for the umlauts.. öäüß
Dec 20 10:17:32 <sivang> ah right
Dec 20 10:17:50 <sivang> anyon managed to run irssi on the SDK ?
Dec 20 10:17:54 <sivang> the pakcage seems to be hosed
Dec 20 10:19:27 <sivang> LeoD: I'm actually listening to the whole Pulse here, I got the original show case with the two discs and the nice booklet
Dec 20 10:19:50 <LeoD> wow sweet
Dec 20 10:20:31 <PaulFertser> sivang: C-[ can be used as Esc.
Dec 20 10:20:49 <sivang> PaulFertser: k
Dec 20 10:20:57 <sivang> LeoD: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pulse_(album)
Dec 20 10:21:31 <LeoD> yeah i know it
Dec 20 10:21:40 <LeoD> didn't ever listen to it though
Dec 20 11:01:43 <wazd_n800> hello everyone
Dec 20 11:01:50 <Stskeeps> morning wazd
Dec 20 11:02:29 <wazd_n800> Stskeeps, had a rest?)
Dec 20 11:06:13 <RST38h> heya wazd
Dec 20 11:06:16 <Stskeeps> wazd_n800: feeling sick like hell :(
Dec 20 11:06:16 <RST38h> moo Stskeeps
Dec 20 11:06:32 <wazd_n800> RST38h, heya
Dec 20 11:06:54 <wazd_n800> Stskeeps, yeah, that trips are really exhausting
Dec 20 11:09:25 <thresh> you tell me
Dec 20 11:09:39 <thresh> i left moscow to have some nice weather at paris
Dec 20 11:10:10 <thresh> and it's snowing here. the most powerful snowstorm in last 8 years, they say.
Dec 20 11:17:24 <wazd_n800> Stskeeps, well, if you'll have something to say bout UI  - go on)
Dec 20 11:18:35 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Winter loves to throw out wonderfully paradoxical days
Dec 20 11:18:37 <Stskeeps> wazd_n800: blarrrrghhh or something. sec :P
Dec 20 11:19:02 <Gadgetoid_mbp> The sun is shining, the sky is a clear blue... yet everything is draped in a couple of inches of snow
Dec 20 11:19:47 <Stskeeps> wazd_n800: interesting first boot wizard
Dec 20 11:20:24 <timeless_mbp> http://www.erh.noaa.gov/lwx/winter/storm-pr.htm is quite informative
Dec 20 11:21:06 * timeless_mbp geopings thresh 
Dec 20 11:21:10 <siriusnova> so
Dec 20 11:21:12 <Stskeeps> wazd_n800: how would icon hot spots be? the gtk menu issue is my primary concern
Dec 20 11:21:15 <siriusnova> anyone here have an android device?
Dec 20 11:21:19 <siriusnova> as wel?
Dec 20 11:21:20 <siriusnova> well?
Dec 20 11:21:37 <timeless_mbp> siriusnova: each model is different
Dec 20 11:21:37 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Yes
Dec 20 11:21:49 <timeless_mbp> i've used the g1 and the hero (?)
Dec 20 11:21:50 <Gadgetoid_mbp> siriusnova: I've got the Droid on me at the moment
Dec 20 11:21:56 <siriusnova> oh good
Dec 20 11:22:09 <siriusnova> i just acquired a used HTC Hero for like $50 from a seller who didnt know what it was
Dec 20 11:22:12 <siriusnova> :D
Dec 20 11:22:17 <siriusnova> what can i do with this thing
Dec 20 11:22:18 <Gadgetoid_mbp> nice!
Dec 20 11:22:22 <Stskeeps> siriusnova: or it was stolen, one of those :P
Dec 20 11:22:25 <siriusnova> no
Dec 20 11:22:28 <siriusnova> i dunno
Dec 20 11:22:30 <siriusnova> lol
Dec 20 11:22:34 <siriusnova> it was from a used tech shop
Dec 20 11:22:37 <timeless_mbp> probably
Dec 20 11:22:37 <siriusnova> he had it sitting here
Dec 20 11:22:39 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Everyone seems to like the Hero, I guess it deserves a little recognition for being one of the first
Dec 20 11:22:42 <wazd_n800> Stskeeps, they have fine sizes  now
Dec 20 11:22:54 <siriusnova> but anyway so what can i do with this thing
Dec 20 11:22:57 <siriusnova> custom firmware or whatever
Dec 20 11:22:59 <wazd_n800> Stskeeps, no enlarged hotspots needed
Dec 20 11:23:18 <Gadgetoid_mbp> siriusnova: grab a MotoBLUR enabled firmware for the shinies
Dec 20 11:23:37 <siriusnova> do i have to get this phone "unlocked" or "jailbroken" like in iphones?
Dec 20 11:23:44 <siriusnova> im totally new to android
Dec 20 11:24:00 <Gadgetoid_mbp> unlocked is a concept that applies to all phones that are network locked
Dec 20 11:24:22 <siriusnova> well its unlocked
Dec 20 11:24:24 <Gadgetoid_mbp> I suggest you partake liberally of xda-developers.com
Dec 20 11:24:24 <siriusnova> then jailbroken
Dec 20 11:24:27 <siriusnova> herm
Dec 20 11:25:17 <Gadgetoid_mbp> And Android doesn't need jailbreaking, you've got some pretty solid emulators already available on the store and who could want for more!
Dec 20 11:25:22 <SplasPood> Anyone know what's up with ruby gtk2 support on the N900 (aka on fremantle)
Dec 20 11:25:31 <siriusnova> what about "rooting"
Dec 20 11:25:43 <siriusnova> im reading on xda-developers about rooting
Dec 20 11:25:44 <siriusnova> what does it do
Dec 20 11:26:15 <timeless_mbp> siriusnova: so, this is #maemo
Dec 20 11:26:21 <timeless_mbp> #android is somewhere else
Dec 20 11:26:23 <siriusnova> i have an N900 too
Dec 20 11:26:24 <siriusnova> :P
Dec 20 11:26:27 <siriusnova> thats why im here
Dec 20 11:26:28 <siriusnova> hehe
Dec 20 11:26:33 <Poser> hey guys whats the latest news on portrait mode for the N900?
Dec 20 11:26:36 <timeless_mbp> yeah, and if you ask a question about it, you'll get an answer
Dec 20 11:26:51 <timeless_mbp> Poser: browser portrait mode will be a hidden feature in the first service release
Dec 20 11:26:52 <siriusnova> well i was talking to Gadgetoid_mbp since he had the phone
Dec 20 11:26:56 <siriusnova> :p
Dec 20 11:26:56 <timeless_mbp> and hopefully enabled in the second
Dec 20 11:27:02 <Gadgetoid_mbp> http://theunlockr.com/2009/08/27/how-to-root-your-htc-hero-in-one-click/
Dec 20 11:27:07 <Poser> hidden? damn
Dec 20 11:27:13 <siriusnova> nice thanks Gadgetoid_mbp
Dec 20 11:27:18 <timeless_mbp> Poser: ctrl-shift-o, once per session
Dec 20 11:27:27 <Gadgetoid_mbp> I'm in #android, too, siriusnova
Dec 20 11:27:32 <siriusnova> oh LOL
Dec 20 11:27:36 <Gadgetoid_mbp> I'm open minded... biphonual
Dec 20 11:27:40 <siriusnova> me too
Dec 20 11:27:43 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Not that I actually own an android phone
Dec 20 11:27:50 <Poser> cant be that hard to enable portrait mode across the board considering it almost worked due to a glitch
Dec 20 11:28:03 <timeless_mbp> Poser: um
Dec 20 11:28:09 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Android hasn't convinced me to pay money for it yet, although I'd take a free Droid if someone were tossing them from the back of a lorry
Dec 20 11:28:21 <timeless_mbp> there's a difference between enabling something
Dec 20 11:28:23 <timeless_mbp> and getting it shiny
Dec 20 11:28:33 <timeless_mbp> nokia for unknown reasons wants things to work right
Dec 20 11:28:41 <timeless_mbp> it's ok for there to be hidden unpolished features
Dec 20 11:28:48 <Gadgetoid_mbp> hear hear to that timeless_mbp!
Dec 20 11:28:50 <timeless_mbp> but it isn't really ok for things to look bad out of the box
Dec 20 11:29:08 <timeless_mbp> getting portrait mode right for the browser is more than rendering a web page in portrait
Dec 20 11:29:11 <timeless_mbp> we had that months ago
Dec 20 11:29:14 * RST38h quietly reminds of Modest.
Dec 20 11:29:16 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Unfortunately, as a web programmer, I'm usually driven towards the "enabling" side of things until the very last minute
Dec 20 11:29:20 <Poser> not being able to use the device 1 handed is way worse
Dec 20 11:29:28 <timeless_mbp> mostly it's getting all of the dialogs to do something non sucky
Dec 20 11:29:42 <timeless_mbp> for the first service release, we've mostly disabled the dialogs
Dec 20 11:30:00 <timeless_mbp> some dialogs will appear in portrait
Dec 20 11:30:02 <Gadgetoid_mbp> In fact, I "enabled" my way through an enterprise reporting platform based upon OLAP... the result was like a house of cards that someone had lit on fire.. in an earthquake.. during a rainstorm
Dec 20 11:30:06 <timeless_mbp> and some will force a rotation
Dec 20 11:30:15 <timeless_mbp> Gadgetoid_mbp: fun
Dec 20 11:30:24 <timeless_mbp> our general approach is to do the main stuff
Dec 20 11:30:31 <timeless_mbp> then be ordered to try really hard for the next candy
Dec 20 11:30:36 <timeless_mbp> then we show we're almost done
Dec 20 11:30:43 <timeless_mbp> management panics and says 'no'
Dec 20 11:30:46 <Poser> are you a nokia employee/contractor timeless?
Dec 20 11:30:55 <timeless_mbp> and by the time they say 'no', we've basically gotten it working
Dec 20 11:30:58 <timeless_mbp> but their no stands
Dec 20 11:31:04 <timeless_mbp> Poser: i am
Dec 20 11:31:11 <timeless_mbp> and i have a profile on maemo.org
Dec 20 11:31:15 <timeless_mbp> like all good community members
Dec 20 11:31:20 <timeless_mbp> so you could read it instead of asking here
Dec 20 11:31:24 <Poser> good to hear that you are working on it
Dec 20 11:31:38 * timeless_mbp goes to read spam
Dec 20 11:31:38 <Gadgetoid_mbp> timeless_mbp: I'd love management to say no once in a while... in my last position it was usually "yes yes yes, and can we have it yesterday?"
Dec 20 11:31:49 <timeless_mbp> heh
Dec 20 11:31:50 <killefiz> is the service release still planned for 2009?
Dec 20 11:31:59 <timeless_mbp> killefiz: it's still planned to be a surprise
Dec 20 11:32:07 <timeless_mbp> we don't want management to leak the date
Dec 20 11:32:08 <wazd_n800> oooh, here we go
Dec 20 11:32:08 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Fortunately now i'm pretty much lord of my own schedule
Dec 20 11:32:21 * killefiz doesn't like surprises ... ;)
Dec 20 11:32:32 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Christmas day, killefiz
Dec 20 11:32:36 <timeless_mbp> killefiz: management doesn't like disappointing people or missing deadlines
Dec 20 11:32:44 <timeless_mbp> personally, i wouldn't gamble on it
Dec 20 11:32:48 <wazd_n800> timeless_mbp, when will Jesus  come for the second time??
Dec 20 11:33:01 <timeless_mbp> wazd_n800: he's some dead carpenter, right?
Dec 20 11:33:09 <Gadgetoid_mbp> They'll release a buggy service release via timed release on Christmas day, and nobody will be able to get support for bricked phones until the new year
Dec 20 11:33:23 * timeless_mbp chuckles @support
Dec 20 11:33:24 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Oh wait... Nokia != Microsoft... sorry
Dec 20 11:33:33 <timeless_mbp> someday in the future, ask me to tell a story about support
Dec 20 11:33:40 <timeless_mbp> (give it at least a year before you ask)
Dec 20 11:33:47 <wazd_n800> yyeeah, microsoft)
Dec 20 11:33:59 <wazd_n800> windows sucks!
Dec 20 11:34:15 <Gadgetoid_mbp> timeless_mbp: rest assured I will, I've never had to encounter Nokia from a support perspective nor do I ever wish to... if my N900 packs in, it's my problem for haxxoring it
Dec 20 11:34:36 <timeless_mbp> Gadgetoid_mbp: actually, all things considered
Dec 20 11:34:42 <timeless_mbp> i'd much prefer you pretend to be a normal customer
Dec 20 11:34:55 <timeless_mbp> call support, treat them the way you'd normally treat support as an end user
Dec 20 11:34:57 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Actually, that might make for a good article
Dec 20 11:34:59 <timeless_mbp> don't try to outsmart them
Dec 20 11:35:10 <timeless_mbp> be just as patient as you normally would
Dec 20 11:35:32 <timeless_mbp> Care is a very important metric
Dec 20 11:35:43 <timeless_mbp> so i don't want people to bypass it
Dec 20 11:35:58 <timeless_mbp> it hurts management's ability to gather comparative data
Dec 20 11:36:15 <Gadgetoid_mbp> I'm doing a comparative review of the Droid/N900 at the moment... maybe I should try and get support on both
Dec 20 11:36:20 <timeless_mbp> heh
Dec 20 11:36:23 <timeless_mbp> that could be fun
Dec 20 11:36:37 <Gadgetoid_mbp> The trouble with the Droid... is Android
Dec 20 11:37:04 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Nokia, at the moment, are a bit like Apple. If something goes wrong with the hardware or the software then they'd better god damned know how to fix it, or they're taking the piss
Dec 20 11:37:33 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Motorola can go: DUUHHHRRR We didnt rite android.... errrr... hav u turned it off and on again?
Dec 20 11:41:01 <mavhc> they can do, but then they won't sell any phones
Dec 20 11:41:27 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Tell that to Dell
Dec 20 11:41:39 <timeless_mbp> dell is telling you to talk to moto?
Dec 20 11:41:42 <timeless_mbp> that seems wrong
Dec 20 11:41:59 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Hahaha
Dec 20 11:42:37 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Dell told me to seek Christ and, in him, find the answer
Dec 20 12:03:36 <ShadowJK> did that help?
Dec 20 12:05:01 <jebba900> hmm. Build box hasnt made anything since 21:21 UTC yesterday.
Dec 20 12:05:57 <ShadowJK> it dies every weekend..
Dec 20 12:06:01 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Wow, there's no saving Motorola Droid fanbois
Dec 20 12:06:18 <ShadowJK> well, something dies every weekend
Dec 20 12:06:21 <Gadgetoid_mbp> I just want to facepalm for the next ten minutes
Dec 20 12:08:14 <Gadgetoid_mbp> I don't understand why people buy the Droid for snapdragon
Dec 20 12:08:35 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Give it two months, and a beautiful, gorgeous, awe inspiring snapdragon powered phone will come out
Dec 20 12:08:45 <Gadgetoid_mbp> And lo, all will be merry
Dec 20 12:08:48 <jebba900> ShadowJK, i bet its just wedged on some hung process that a simple kill would resolve. The problem is finding that person....
Dec 20 12:09:40 <ShadowJK> I suspect they only show up on monday, and go sleep when the basementgeeks wake up
Dec 20 12:10:30 <jebba900> which sucks because should be 24/7/365 operation that pages them on outage....
Dec 20 12:10:56 <Arkenoi> Gadgetoid, it has qwerty and big screen
Dec 20 12:11:07 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Arkenoi: the keyboard is diabolically awful
Dec 20 12:11:20 <Gadgetoid_mbp> I mean... it's HORRIFIC, painful, insulting...
Dec 20 12:11:36 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Motorola made the freaking DEXT for crying out loud, which has one of the best keyboards I've used since the Psion5
Dec 20 12:11:57 <Gadgetoid_mbp> And then they throw that away to fart out the goddamn steamrolled ZX Spectrum abortion that is the Droid's keyboard
Dec 20 12:12:01 <ShadowJK> snapdragon is described as "A8-like", I'd like to see a more indepth comparison
Dec 20 12:12:09 <Gadgetoid_mbp> ShadowJK: So would I
Dec 20 12:12:25 <Gadgetoid_mbp> It was many years ago that the megahertz myth was dispelled
Dec 20 12:12:37 <Gadgetoid_mbp> And yet now we're fighting for Gigahertz in the mobile arena again!?
Dec 20 12:13:32 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Yay, geeks, you've come full circle from going "my 1ghz is better than your 800mhz, to my 800mhz is better than your 1ghz, to my 1ghz is better than your 800mhz"
Dec 20 12:13:51 <ShadowJK> I should benchmark my sheevaplug's 1.2GHz vs N900's 600 :)
Dec 20 12:14:24 <Gadgetoid_mbp> I should benchmark  my lowly 2.8Ghz Core i7 versus a beastly powerful clearly much faster 3.2ghz netburst Pentium 4
Dec 20 12:14:38 <ShadowJK> lol
Dec 20 12:14:48 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Fscking megahertz
Dec 20 12:14:56 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Snapdragon feels snappy though, to be fair
Dec 20 12:15:21 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Anyhow, got to dash, time for a pub lunch
Dec 20 12:15:26 <Gadgetoid_mbp> if we can get to a pub in this weather
Dec 20 12:15:34 <lcuk> bah, my 7mhz amiga felt as slick as these computers with orders of magnitude moar horsepower.
Dec 20 12:15:43 <ShadowJK> liqbase on omap2 feels snappy
Dec 20 12:15:53 <ShadowJK> that too :)
Dec 20 12:16:06 * ShadowJK had amiga too :D
Dec 20 12:16:18 <lcuk> liqbase on omap3 feels better
Dec 20 12:16:45 <lcuk> i wonder what liqbase on omap4 could do
Dec 20 12:17:04 <lcuk> i dragged out my 810 yesterday actually
Dec 20 12:17:49 <Arkenoi> Gadgetoid, at least it has more keys and bigger than n900's :-(
Dec 20 12:19:09 <DocScrutinizer51> only kickstart kicked
Dec 20 12:20:30 <DocScrutinizer51> and RAM expansion 5 layer piggyback - lol
Dec 20 12:23:05 <DocScrutinizer51> those were EE, whole team and dog signed inside of A1000 lid
Dec 20 12:50:08 <wazd_n800> back again
Dec 20 12:51:17 <Bilby> heyho
Dec 20 13:08:37 <jebba> Is there any place where infrastructure outages are to be reported?
Dec 20 13:10:19 <lcuk> jebba, what happens if the infrastructure outage reporting system has an outage?
Dec 20 13:10:35 <bigbrovar> hi guys I find any time try my carrier code for loadning credit and stuff #556* it says invalid number
Dec 20 13:11:12 <bigbrovar> same code works on every cell phone i have ever used . Am I missing something ?
Dec 20 13:13:04 <ShadowJK> known bug
Dec 20 13:13:34 <ShadowJK> I might remember wrong, but I think it's coming in a firmware upgrade
Dec 20 13:13:38 <jebba> lcuk: well, supposedly there are these people called "system administrators" who carry devices that notify them when their servers go out. Apparently there aren't any of those here.
Dec 20 13:14:24 <jebba> seriously, how can they not know their servers are down? W.T.F.
Dec 20 13:14:57 <Stskeeps> jebba: maemork channel on qaiku
Dec 20 13:15:22 <jebba> oh, obviously.
Dec 20 13:15:51 <ShadowJK> wtf is qaiku :)
Dec 20 13:16:11 <ShadowJK> sounds like the kind of name angsty finnish teens would invent ;)
Dec 20 13:16:48 <Shadikka> naah, it doesn't have the ring
Dec 20 13:17:44 <ShadowJK> kaiku = echo, and if you're cool you use q instead of k
Dec 20 13:18:18 <jebba> perhaps they should let people know they are using some obscure channel.  Why not announce these things like in maemo-devel or something?
Dec 20 13:18:24 <Shadikka> Very aware of that. But it would probably be more along the lines of "itqaiku"
Dec 20 13:19:24 <lcuk> bigbrovar, bug 5357 would be where you need to be looking i believe
Dec 20 13:19:28 <povbot> Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=5357 Does not accept GSM (USSD) Codes starting with *#
Dec 20 13:20:56 <bigbrovar> povbot: thanks .. glad am not the only one affected .. sould have to switch to my e72 when i need to recharge
Dec 20 13:20:57 <povbot> bigbrovar: Error: "thanks" is not a valid command.
Dec 20 13:21:02 <bigbrovar> thanks
Dec 20 13:21:35 <bigbrovar> lcuk: bet u know that was for u :)
Dec 20 13:21:41 <bigbrovar> lcuk: thanks
Dec 20 13:22:39 * lcuk has horrid headache today
Dec 20 13:25:39 * RST38h moos at the moon
Dec 20 13:25:55 <lcuk> RST38h, moo quieter today
Dec 20 13:26:02 <Termana> RST38h: Why not moon at the moon?
Dec 20 13:26:15 <SpeedEvil> Termana: too cold
Dec 20 13:26:22 <SpeedEvil> Termana: things may fall off.
Dec 20 13:26:32 <Termana> pen 15?
Dec 20 13:26:34 <RST38h> <ok, SpeedEvil answered it for me>
Dec 20 13:26:34 <Termana> :P
Dec 20 13:27:34 * lcuk slept in room with heating on and window closed and feels like donkeypoop
Dec 20 13:29:09 * SpeedEvil slept with no heating on, and feels the same.
Dec 20 13:29:18 <SpeedEvil> ~4C when I woke up.
Dec 20 13:29:25 <Italodance> .
Dec 20 13:29:36 <SpeedEvil> electric blanket ++
Dec 20 13:29:55 <lcuk> bleugh SpeedEvil
Dec 20 13:29:59 <Termana> Its summer time here - really hot every day at the moment.
Dec 20 13:30:06 <lcuk> i normally sleep iwth no extra warning
Dec 20 13:30:11 <lcuk> warming
Dec 20 13:30:23 <lcuk> Termana, thats almost as bad
Dec 20 13:30:35 <Termana> sleep with no extra warning? Its good that you don't snore :P
Dec 20 13:30:37 <lcuk> if not worse actually, cos you can always wrapup to get warm
Dec 20 13:30:43 * ShadowJK has a quad core computer running distributed.net
Dec 20 13:30:50 <RST38h> heating is easier to do than cooling
Dec 20 13:30:57 <lcuk> mrs lcuk snores but she tells me she will hit me if i gather evidence
Dec 20 13:31:05 <Termana> lol
Dec 20 13:31:06 <RST38h> especially considering that your body is pretty much one big heater
Dec 20 13:31:09 <SpeedEvil> Gather earplugs.
Dec 20 13:31:23 <Termana> Either way - really cold or really hot, both suck
Dec 20 13:31:28 <SpeedEvil> RST38h: hey - I'm getting thinner - not so much of the big.
Dec 20 13:31:29 <lcuk> then i dont hear alarm clock
Dec 20 13:31:32 <thresh> it isnt really cold now in europe
Dec 20 13:31:40 <SpeedEvil> -4C outside
Dec 20 13:31:42 <RST38h> Really?
Dec 20 13:31:55 <thresh> 5 days ago it was -25C in Moscow
Dec 20 13:31:59 <thresh> i would call that cold
Dec 20 13:32:00 <RST38h> -13C outside, up from -25C
Dec 20 13:32:07 <SpeedEvil> 'europe' varies somewhat
Dec 20 13:32:11 <thresh> -1 here now, so no, Europe is not exactly cold
Dec 20 13:32:14 <thresh> well, i'm in Paris now
Dec 20 13:32:40 <thresh> will check how it's in Moscow in a few hours :)
Dec 20 13:32:43 <Termana> Its funny. Here in Australia I think its pretty rare to EVER get anything under 5C let alone go into the minuses.
Dec 20 13:32:44 <frals> only -3 here in stockholm, but we got lots of snow :DD
Dec 20 13:32:46 <lcuk> is it cold enough to make the eifel tower shrivel up
Dec 20 13:32:48 <SpeedEvil> moscow isn't europe
Dec 20 13:32:51 <ShadowJK> only -10 where I am in finland
Dec 20 13:33:04 <Shadikka> Some -15 here
Dec 20 13:33:07 <thresh> SpeedEvil: of course it is, you geographically-challenged person :P
Dec 20 13:33:12 <ShadowJK> only enough snow to make everything white
Dec 20 13:33:15 <SpeedEvil> http://www.yr.no/place/Europa/
Dec 20 13:33:23 <Termana> We don't get snow here either
Dec 20 13:33:43 <lcuk> can we ban Termana from the channel on the grounds of smugness?
Dec 20 13:33:45 <thresh> there is something fundamentally broken if you get no snow in the winter :)
Dec 20 13:33:50 <Roaziel> Hi guys. I've had some trouble with my N900 and I kinda want to reset it to factory default. I heard that it's relatively easy and quick (is that true). However, since I lack the general knowledge of linux and things like commands and stuff I'm scared I might screw something up, so I'm wondering if anyone has some spare time to help guide me through it? by PM mossibly?
Dec 20 13:34:00 <RST38h> SpeedEvil: Russia is mentioned at the bottom of that page
Dec 20 13:34:01 <Termana> Moscow is in Russia thresh....
Dec 20 13:34:04 <RST38h> So, yes, Europe.
Dec 20 13:34:08 <SpeedEvil> thresh: |Not part of EU
Dec 20 13:34:10 <thresh> Termana: Yeah, i know.
Dec 20 13:34:18 <Termana> Russia is in Europe though I guess
Dec 20 13:34:25 <thresh> EU is a big joke anyway too:)
Dec 20 13:34:26 <Stskeeps> Roaziel:
Dec 20 13:34:28 <Stskeeps> ~flashing
Dec 20 13:34:30 <infobot> flashing is probably http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware
Dec 20 13:34:35 <RST38h> Since when has EU become equivalent to Europe though?
Dec 20 13:34:54 <ShadowJK> roaziel: what kind of trouble?
Dec 20 13:35:14 <Roaziel> Well for one thing the calendar is broken
Dec 20 13:35:24 <SpeedEvil> Look at the right-hand edge of russia.
Dec 20 13:35:28 <SpeedEvil> That's not in europe
Dec 20 13:35:33 <Termana> lmao
Dec 20 13:35:34 <lcuk> Termana where abouts are you
Dec 20 13:35:39 <thresh> Yeah, that's why they say Russia spans across Europe and Asia.
Dec 20 13:35:45 <Termana> lcuk - South Australia
Dec 20 13:35:46 <lcuk> ahhh oz
Dec 20 13:36:01 <Termana> Land down underrrr yeah
Dec 20 13:36:15 <lcuk> you up for hosting the next maemo summit @ your house?
Dec 20 13:36:37 <Termana> lol wut?
Dec 20 13:36:57 <Termana> 300 or so people in my house?
Dec 20 13:37:07 <lcuk> probably more next year
Dec 20 13:37:11 <lcuk> but, yeah
Dec 20 13:37:15 <RST38h> SpeedEvil: Do you see Moscow there, at the right hand edge?
Dec 20 13:37:31 <RST38h> SpeedEvil: Thought so.
Dec 20 13:37:32 <Termana> umm.... sure... I'll see what I can do
Dec 20 13:37:35 * Termana rolls eyes
Dec 20 13:37:37 <Termana> :P
Dec 20 13:37:58 * RST38h idly considers downloading the whole DrWho season
Dec 20 13:38:10 <Termana> Dr Who?
Dec 20 13:39:16 <Termana> Hmm... don't look for an LED light when you have your finger over it....
Dec 20 13:40:07 <SpeedEvil> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Europe
Dec 20 13:40:41 <thresh> uhm, yeah?
Dec 20 13:41:01 <RST38h> SpeedEvil: And what are you trying to prove with this link again?
Dec 20 13:41:10 <SpeedEvil> borders of europe - not including all of russia
Dec 20 13:42:11 <RST38h> have you read the text though?
Dec 20 13:42:16 <DocScrutinizer51> moscow is europe like android is linux
Dec 20 13:42:25 <SpeedEvil> yeah
Dec 20 13:42:39 <SpeedEvil> To RST38h and DocScrutinizer51
Dec 20 13:42:56 <thresh> DocScrutinizer51: been there yet? :)
Dec 20 13:43:09 <DocScrutinizer51> no :-)
Dec 20 13:43:16 * RST38h sighs: so many people have no idea what they are talking about...
Dec 20 13:43:23 <Termana> thresh - to android?
Dec 20 13:43:27 <Termana> :P
Dec 20 13:43:28 <thresh> Termana: sure, where else?!
Dec 20 13:44:53 <lcuk> http://liqbase.net/snowcat.jpg
Dec 20 13:45:08 <DocScrutinizer51> actually the above was a statement about a common perception of moscow in western EU countries. Not claiming the final truth about any particualr state in moscow itself
Dec 20 13:45:19 <jeremiah_> X-Fade: Can you set up a key log in for me on stage?
Dec 20 13:45:29 <jeremiah_> Ferenc doesn't seem to be around
Dec 20 13:45:41 <jeremiah_> and I am still getting Permission denied (publickey).
Dec 20 13:45:41 <RST38h> Ah here he is
Dec 20 13:45:48 <jeremiah_> hi RST38h
Dec 20 13:45:54 <RST38h> jeremiah: Do not go anywhere.
Dec 20 13:45:56 <thresh> on a side note: http://www.flickr.com/photos/thresh/4199922780/ couple of hours ago on VDD'09 here in Paris :)
Dec 20 13:46:06 * RST38h hastily searches for tar and feathers
Dec 20 13:46:57 <RST38h> jeremiah: since about thursday, I promoted total of three packages from extras-testing to extras. None of them appeared in extras. Any ideas?
Dec 20 13:47:04 <Termana> lcuk - Snowcat, snowed in.
Dec 20 13:47:16 <jeremiah_> RST38h: X-Fade wrote that software.
Dec 20 13:47:45 <RST38h> jeremiah: which brings us to the second issue: I have not been able to contact X-Fade during all that time
Dec 20 13:47:45 <jeremiah_> RST38h: Why don't you 1. ask him? 2. File a bug.
Dec 20 13:47:54 <RST38h> jeremiah: see above
Dec 20 13:47:54 <jeremiah_> Yeah.
Dec 20 13:47:55 <lcuk> Termana, indeed, hes an outside cat and wants to be out there to play but has to stay in and be terrorised by the kitten
Dec 20 13:47:57 <jeremiah_> Nor I.
Dec 20 13:48:08 <jeremiah_> Nor can I contact ferenc
Dec 20 13:48:20 <RST38h> jeremiah: <facepalm>
Dec 20 13:48:36 <jeremiah_> Maemo (as you well know) is not really an 'open' project.
Dec 20 13:48:39 <RST38h> jeremiah: it is a large project, financed by a huge international corporation
Dec 20 13:48:42 <jeremiah_> It is beholden to Nokia
Dec 20 13:48:52 <RST38h> jeremiah: does not have to be "open", "large" is enough
Dec 20 13:49:06 <jeremiah_> So, when Nokia hides their head in the sand, or does not want help, they piss off.
Dec 20 13:49:38 <DocScrutinizer51> :_/
Dec 20 13:49:40 <RST38h> jeremiah: how come the whole software promotion mechanism in this project depends on a single person?
Dec 20 13:49:52 <jeremiah_> RST38h: I will try to contact X-Fade
Dec 20 13:49:55 <RST38h> jeremiah: mind you, this has nothing to do with oss
Dec 20 13:50:00 <jeremiah_> Throug the chaneels I have
Dec 20 13:50:04 <RST38h> thanks
Dec 20 13:50:07 <rdorsch> Has anybody tried to build navit for Maemo 5?
Dec 20 13:50:18 <swc|666> jeremiah_, i guess kernel modules are scracy for .fi dev team, idk
Dec 20 13:50:57 <jeremiah_> RST38h: If it were open, more people would have access to the software on the machines
Dec 20 13:51:03 <jeremiah_> So yeah, it makes a difference
Dec 20 13:51:21 <RST38h> jeremiah: well, Niels isn't the only guy who has access, right?
Dec 20 13:51:44 <RST38h> jeremiah; so why not designate a backup, like all corporations do?
Dec 20 13:51:46 <jeremiah_> To what?
Dec 20 13:51:52 <jeremiah_> Access to the builder?
Dec 20 13:52:03 <RST38h> jeremiah: to repository promotion mechanisms, to the web interface, to the builder
Dec 20 13:52:05 <jeremiah_> or some other squirelled away server?
Dec 20 13:52:19 <jeremiah_> I have no idea where that code lives, what it does and how to access it.
Dec 20 13:52:24 <RST38h> As I understand, promotion of a package has nothing to do with the builder
Dec 20 13:52:33 <jeremiah_> So as far as practical concerns, only X-Fade has access
Dec 20 13:52:41 <jeremiah_> And that is the way he likes it
Dec 20 13:52:44 * RST38h starts hitting his head against the wall
Dec 20 13:52:52 <RST38h> (methodically)
Dec 20 13:53:14 <jeremiah_> There is a reason debian uses teams
Dec 20 13:53:16 <RST38h> jeremiah: At least ask HIM to choose and designate a backup :)
Dec 20 13:53:29 <jeremiah_> RST38h: I think that will be your job. :)
Dec 20 13:53:37 <jeremiah_> Or the coucnil's
Dec 20 13:53:46 <swc|666> s/scacy/scary/
Dec 20 13:53:53 <RST38h> jeremiah: Well, I can make it very noisy, but is it really necessary to make a scandal out of it?
Dec 20 13:54:02 <jeremiah_> RST38h: I have no idea.
Dec 20 13:54:12 <jeremiah_> I am really on the periphery.
Dec 20 13:54:23 <jeremiah_> I don't work for a 'trusted Nokia partner'
Dec 20 13:54:27 <jeremiah_> I am not part of Nokia
Dec 20 13:54:36 <jeremiah_> I am just not in the loop
Dec 20 13:54:37 <swc|666> sure
Dec 20 13:54:44 <RST38h> it feels like common sense to me that Niels should simply choose himself a backup, show him what to do, and leave it at that
Dec 20 13:54:48 <jeremiah_> Which makes it hard to get anything done
Dec 20 13:54:53 <lcuk> RST38h, i bet this has already been considered and to some degree being implemented, but its not he sort of thing that could go smoothly overnight
Dec 20 13:55:15 <RST38h> lcuk: It has been months since Maemo5 repos became operational
Dec 20 13:55:29 <RST38h> so, "overnight" argument is getting kinda soily
Dec 20 13:55:36 <lcuk> bu tthe promotion stuff isnt
Dec 20 13:55:47 <RST38h> also not introduced yesterday
Dec 20 13:56:00 <lcuk> of course, and i totally understand
Dec 20 13:56:19 <lcuk> when x-fade went on his well deserved holiday i think a lot of this was realised
Dec 20 13:56:45 <RST38h> lcuk: he came back a little while ago too, not yesterday
Dec 20 13:57:15 * lcuk nods
Dec 20 13:57:18 <jeremiah_> I like X-Fade too, he has done so much for the project.
Dec 20 13:57:21 <RST38h> the only remaining explanation is "christmas time, everything is snowed over and sleepy"
Dec 20 13:57:35 <jeremiah_> But let's face it, you cannot have only have one person in control.
Dec 20 13:57:45 <RST38h> but...mmm...I somehow doubt anything will change after Christmas is over
Dec 20 13:58:09 <RST38h> jeremiah: in fact, no coporation I know ever allows that
Dec 20 13:58:15 <jeremiah_> Indeed.
Dec 20 13:58:18 <RST38h> you always have a backup
Dec 20 13:58:28 <jeremiah_> It is the professional way to do it.
Dec 20 13:58:40 <RST38h> who may be a bit out of the current situation, but always ready to replace you
Dec 20 13:58:49 <jeremiah_> I don't see why he just doesn't put the promotion code in a repo somewhere
Dec 20 13:59:02 <jeremiah_> So anyone can hack on it.
Dec 20 13:59:55 <EvilGuru> I currently own an N810 but am considering treating myself to a new N900. However, does anyone know the max power that the USB OTG can provide?
Dec 20 14:00:24 <SpeedEvil> EvilGuru: none
Dec 20 14:00:28 <SpeedEvil> EvilGuru: it's not OTG
Dec 20 14:00:35 <SpeedEvil> EvilGuru: nobody has gotten host mode to work
Dec 20 14:00:51 <EvilGuru> Interesting, I could've sworn that my N810 supported it
Dec 20 14:00:56 <SpeedEvil> EvilGuru: there are indications that it may be possible, but at best it requires someone with both a kernel and electronic clue
Dec 20 14:01:01 <SpeedEvil> EvilGuru: none on trhe n900
Dec 20 14:01:22 <RST38h> jeremiah: I think he did put it somewhere (seen parts of it before)
Dec 20 14:01:26 <jeremiah_> okay
Dec 20 14:01:27 <jeremiah_> Good
Dec 20 14:01:34 <jeremiah_> URL?
Dec 20 14:01:40 <RST38h> jeremiah: but it is useless unless someone reviews it and does the management part
Dec 20 14:01:42 <RST38h> a moment
Dec 20 14:02:43 <EvilGuru> SpeedEvil: Wow, that seems a little odd, is it a hardware or software limitation?
Dec 20 14:02:58 <SpeedEvil> EvilGuru: yes
Dec 20 14:03:42 <RST38h> no, can't find it anywhere =(
Dec 20 14:03:43 <SpeedEvil> EvilGuru: it's at least a software limitation. The lack of power is a hardware limitation - if it can or cannot do usb host with an external powered hub and special cable is unclear atm
Dec 20 14:05:00 <RST38h> oh wait here it is, I think
Dec 20 14:05:01 <flux> techically I suppose someone could implement a usb host, that would provide usb master-capability into a device that's hooked as a slave into it
Dec 20 14:05:15 <RST38h> jeremiah: https://garage.maemo.org/projects/maemo2midgard/
Dec 20 14:05:23 <jeremiah_> RST38h: Thanks
Dec 20 14:05:38 <EvilGuru> USB OTG without some -- even just a few mA -- of power is not all that useful
Dec 20 14:05:40 <flux> but I wonder if that kind of device 1) could be certified as a USB device 2) it'd need special driver support 3) is there a market big enough for that kind of a device :)
Dec 20 14:06:05 <flux> evilguru, if it'd be only a few mA and it'd need an adapter, it could always use a battery..
Dec 20 14:06:24 * RST38h out for a walk in the snow
Dec 20 14:07:18 <EvilGuru> On an unrelated note how does the screen/keyboard on the 900 compare to the 810
Dec 20 14:07:39 <flux> it's much better. even if it is only a 3-row one.
Dec 20 14:07:58 <ShadowJK> screen is smaller. touchscreen is insanely sensitive compare to n810
Dec 20 14:08:39 <ShadowJK> it took a month or sp tp get used to the n810 keyboard. took me 3 days to get used to the n900 keyboard
Dec 20 14:08:59 <ShadowJK> I still do some typos, ' vs , and - vs _
Dec 20 14:09:06 <w00t> same
Dec 20 14:09:16 <flux> the touch feeling in the n810 is so much heavier
Dec 20 14:09:23 <flux> the keyboard, that is
Dec 20 14:09:34 <EvilGuru> I guess the screen is more finger friendly
Dec 20 14:09:36 <ShadowJK> and fn vs shift when going back to n810 from n900 or other way around
Dec 20 14:10:00 <ShadowJK> yes, i'm a stylus fan and find I almost never use it
Dec 20 14:10:03 <flux> I've been thinking of swapping the upper-left and bottom-left buttons..
Dec 20 14:10:06 <ShadowJK> on n900
Dec 20 14:10:18 <flux> hm, actually no, that wasn't it
Dec 20 14:10:38 <flux> I want shift and control to be next to each other, and ctrl to be bottom left
Dec 20 14:10:58 <flux> but perhaps the longer it takes me to modify the keymap, the more accustomed I will be to the current layout :)
Dec 20 14:11:03 <EvilGuru> Hmm, I guess I can justify the £500 price
Dec 20 14:12:44 <wazd_n800> Stskeeps, maybe you can consider shifting Mer priority to running ubuntu apps as comfortable as possible?)
Dec 20 14:13:04 <Stskeeps> wazd_n800: it is already quite comfortable
Dec 20 14:13:28 <wazd_n800> Stskeeps, :)
Dec 20 14:14:52 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Fff ff fffrooozeeen
Dec 20 14:17:36 <Stskeeps> wazd_n800: but the problem is really desktop apps assume everyone has 1024x768
Dec 20 14:18:12 <w00t> what? they don't?!
Dec 20 14:18:16 <w00t> that's unpossible!
Dec 20 14:19:10 <jeremiah_> I have 768x1024
Dec 20 14:19:44 <Termana> 800x480 here
Dec 20 14:20:04 <Stskeeps> well, everyone has >= 1024x768 :P
Dec 20 14:21:03 <wazd_n800> Stskeeps, well, I have some sollutions for it :)
Dec 20 14:22:25 <Stskeeps> wazd_n800: will be interesting to read them
Dec 20 14:22:39 <Lantizia> does anyone know how i can get frozen bubble to install properly
Dec 20 14:23:24 <Lantizia> it says it wants perl modules.... but apt says that package was replaced by perl which is installed
Dec 20 14:24:33 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Stskeeps: 1024x600*
Dec 20 14:25:50 <SpeedEvil> EvilGuru: topcashback.com has some rebates for nokia.com
Dec 20 14:27:05 <Gadgetoid_mbp> http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertainment/8418158.stm
Dec 20 14:27:07 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Brilliant!
Dec 20 14:27:13 <PaulFertser> SpeedEvil: btw, for testing hostmode a y-cable would be preferred, adding an external hub can make it more complex due to driver limitations, somehow musb doesn't like hubs according to the driver source.
Dec 20 14:27:28 <SpeedEvil> yes, I used the word hub - as it was more likley to be understood
Dec 20 14:27:57 <Gadgetoid_mbp> On one hand, BBC Radio 5 are pretending to be interested in and supportive of RATMs bizarre campaign... on the other hand they turn into a bunch of whiney apologetic fucktards when RATM stick it to them and drop the f-bomb on Radio 5 live
Dec 20 14:28:19 <DocScrutinizer51> and we didn't see any results on messing around with hostmode today
Dec 20 14:29:39 <DocScrutinizer51> btw any other externally powered device like usb harddrive should do
Dec 20 14:30:25 <Gadgetoid_mbp> SpeedEvil: my topcashback is still showing as confirmed, despite nokia forcing me to re-order over the phone... *fingers crossed*
Dec 20 14:31:07 <PaulFertser> SpeedEvil: yep, due to castrated dmesg buffer we're even unable to understand if the driver is compiled with necessary options or not :/
Dec 20 14:32:11 <Stskeeps> just compile a new one :P
Dec 20 14:32:27 <DocScrutinizer51> 16k of dmesg buffer - really very small
Dec 20 14:32:41 <SpeedEvil> DocScrutinizer51: maybe - some peripherals I've found won't talk without vbus
Dec 20 14:33:14 <Stskeeps> lo vdvsx
Dec 20 14:33:15 <DocScrutinizer51> Stskeeps: that's our next point on todo list ;)
Dec 20 14:33:19 <PaulFertser> Stskeeps: can you tell me for sure if the source present at repository.maemo.org ... freemantle ... kernel diff.gz is the same used to build production kernels? Because it has rx51_defconfig in debian/rules.
Dec 20 14:33:33 <Stskeeps> PaulFertser: yes, to my knowledge it is the right one
Dec 20 14:33:38 <Stskeeps> go for *4102*
Dec 20 14:33:46 <VDVsx> hey Stskeeps
Dec 20 14:34:16 * VDVsx freezes :(
Dec 20 14:34:17 <DocScrutinizer51> SpeedEvil: hmm. maybe. how would we check?
Dec 20 14:35:02 <SpeedEvil> DocScrutinizer51: try it
Dec 20 14:35:13 <SpeedEvil> DocScrutinizer51: pull vbus from a cable,  plug into hub
Dec 20 14:35:20 <SpeedEvil> or pc
Dec 20 14:35:29 <DocScrutinizer51> SpeedEvil: ;-D
Dec 20 14:35:30 <PaulFertser> SpeedEvil: the driver refuses to switch away from peripheral mode.
Dec 20 14:35:44 <PaulFertser> SpeedEvil: for no apparent reason, i.e. no messages in dmesg.
Dec 20 14:35:50 <SpeedEvil> PaulFertser: yes - there is that
Dec 20 14:36:09 <SpeedEvil> PaulFertser: I started reading the kernel drivers to understand it, and I got a headache.
Dec 20 14:36:29 <DocScrutinizer51> hehe
Dec 20 14:36:36 <DocScrutinizer51> same here
Dec 20 14:36:40 <PaulFertser> SpeedEvil: first of all i'd make sure the driver is compiled with host mode support. Then i'd enable debugging etc.
Dec 20 14:36:54 <SpeedEvil> There seem to be quite a few things supported under the rx51 platform, which diddn't make it into the device
Dec 20 14:36:56 <SpeedEvil> yeah
Dec 20 14:37:23 <SpeedEvil> I need to get the toolchain setup and stuff - but I've been feeling really, really crap for the past month.
Dec 20 14:37:47 <PaulFertser> SpeedEvil: notable musb driver somewhat changed between .28 used on the device and current omap-kernel...
Dec 20 14:38:19 <PaulFertser> SpeedEvil: toolchain is the easiest step in fact, emdebian gives you a very simple way.
Dec 20 14:38:23 <SpeedEvil> Also - a phone to take apart would make this somewhat easier in some ways
Dec 20 14:38:31 <SpeedEvil> s/some/many/
Dec 20 14:38:32 <infobot> SpeedEvil meant: Also - a phone to take apart would make this manywhat easier in some ways
Dec 20 14:38:41 * SpeedEvil stabs infobot.
Dec 20 14:39:47 <DocScrutinizer51> shit. gimme schematics
Dec 20 14:39:53 <SpeedEvil> that too
Dec 20 14:39:59 <SpeedEvil> and firmware dumps
Dec 20 14:40:05 <SpeedEvil> Also sdks.
Dec 20 14:41:10 <DocScrutinizer51> I mean... I got the most detailed accurate description of the hw right in my hands right now. I just find the reader needed is a little unconvenient
Dec 20 14:42:05 <DocScrutinizer51> also the lead filled clothes needed while it is running
Dec 20 14:42:17 <Lantizia> does anyone know how i can get frozen bubble to install properly
Dec 20 14:42:17 <ShadowJK> oh dear
Dec 20 14:42:26 <Lantizia> please?
Dec 20 14:42:31 <SpeedEvil> Lantizia: also diddn't work for me - though I haven't investigated
Dec 20 14:42:33 <Stskeeps> DocScrutinizer51: you remind me of chinese in smartq forums friggen x-raying the q5
Dec 20 14:42:33 <ShadowJK> touchscreen calibration totally ruined calibration for me.. like.. it's perfect in the middle, but the edges are terrible now
Dec 20 14:42:36 * ShadowJK wonders how to revert
Dec 20 14:42:51 <Lantizia> i lovel frozen bubble!
Dec 20 14:43:11 <SpeedEvil> yeah
Dec 20 14:43:17 <Lantizia> is perl-modules meant to exist?
Dec 20 14:43:27 <SpeedEvil> frozen bubble with accel pointing and prox fire would be very cool
Dec 20 14:43:35 <Stskeeps> Lantizia: where are you trying to install it?
Dec 20 14:43:50 <Lantizia> fremantle
Dec 20 14:43:53 <DocScrutinizer51> Stskeeps: well my last job started with a similar statement :-P
Dec 20 14:43:57 * Gadgetoid_mbp tries to install frozen bubble 2
Dec 20 14:44:29 <Lantizia> i think it's in the devel repo
Dec 20 14:44:35 * Gadgetoid_mbp notes "Application packages missing: perl-modules (>= 5.8.3-3osso10)
Dec 20 14:45:05 <Lantizia> yeah but when you try and install that it says its been replaced  by perl
Dec 20 14:45:07 <Stskeeps> Lantizia: on n900 ou mea
Dec 20 14:45:09 <Stskeeps> n
Dec 20 14:45:13 <Lantizia> and perl is installed
Dec 20 14:45:27 <Lantizia> yeah im on my n900 now on xchat
Dec 20 14:46:07 <DocScrutinizer51> Lantizia: heh
Dec 20 14:46:21 <DocScrutinizer51> xchat ftw ;-)
Dec 20 14:46:40 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Colloquy ftw :)
Dec 20 14:47:26 <DocScrutinizer51> let's agree on "pidgin sucks"
Dec 20 14:47:38 <Gadgetoid_mbp> See what you mean Lantizia
Dec 20 14:47:40 <DocScrutinizer51> at least for irc
Dec 20 14:47:44 <Gadgetoid_mbp> perl-base and perl
Dec 20 14:47:57 <Lantizia> yeah
Dec 20 14:48:01 <DocScrutinizer51> broken dependency?
Dec 20 14:48:17 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Yes, DocScrutinizer51
Dec 20 14:48:32 <Gadgetoid_mbp> might be able to install with apt-get force
Dec 20 14:48:34 <DocScrutinizer51> maybe try --force
Dec 20 14:48:36 <Lantizia> anyone got the power to fix the dependancy?
Dec 20 14:48:43 <DocScrutinizer51> or whatever its called
Dec 20 14:48:49 <Lantizia> dont think apt has force
Dec 20 14:48:52 <Lantizia>  i checked
Dec 20 14:49:22 <Lantizia> wow this radio works well :)
Dec 20 14:49:57 * Lantizia wonders if he can tune into the N900 lol
Dec 20 14:50:39 <Gadgetoid_mbp> hmm
Dec 20 14:50:41 <Lantizia> nah lol
Dec 20 14:50:42 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Innteresting
Dec 20 14:50:52 <Gadgetoid_mbp> I'm going to grab the package and try to install it with dpkg
Dec 20 14:51:32 <DocScrutinizer51> Lantizia: I guess FM TX and RX are mutually exclusive. Not tested though
Dec 20 14:52:09 <Lantizia> the transmitter wont turn onm while headphones are in
Dec 20 14:52:19 <Lantizia> headphones are needed to tune in lol
Dec 20 14:52:33 <DocScrutinizer51> for antenna yes
Dec 20 14:52:38 <Lantizia> yeah
Dec 20 14:53:29 <Lantizia> i was reading a feature request earlier in the year for fremantle that was approved adding support for album art as jpgs in the same dir
Dec 20 14:54:01 <DocScrutinizer51> btw the power converters or whatever starts when powered via USB really spoil FM RX
Dec 20 14:54:06 <Lantizia> so ive put cover.jpg files in my albums dirs as per the gnome heuristics docs rthat were linked to
Dec 20 14:54:16 <VDVsx> Testers: one more vote to go: http://maemo.org/packages/package_instance/view/fremantle_extras-testing_non-free_armel/fmsx/3.5.7-1/
Dec 20 14:54:19 <Lantizia> but the album art still doesnt show
Dec 20 14:54:20 <VDVsx> please help :)
Dec 20 14:54:49 * Lantizia plugs in charger to test
Dec 20 14:55:25 <Lantizia> sounds fine
Dec 20 14:56:48 <PaulFertser> DocScrutinizer51: any other option in kernel you would like to change?
Dec 20 14:56:59 <wazd_n800> VDVsx, mm?
Dec 20 14:57:10 <DocScrutinizer51> PaulFertser: not now
Dec 20 14:57:12 <wazd_n800> VDVsx, ah
Dec 20 14:57:16 <VDVsx> wazd_n800, hey
Dec 20 14:58:00 <DocScrutinizer51> PaulFertser: maybe format of timestamps?
Dec 20 14:58:11 <PaulFertser> DocScrutinizer51: i do not think it's tunable.
Dec 20 14:58:17 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Ugh even my hurt hurts
Dec 20 14:58:18 <DocScrutinizer51> yeah
Dec 20 14:58:19 <ShadowJK> tx and rx at the same time would be sort of awesome, use the rx to find open frequencies, and your car radio would automatically hop to the new frequency thanks to rds
Dec 20 14:59:03 <DocScrutinizer51> ShadowJK: wow
Dec 20 14:59:18 <Gadgetoid_mbp> No matter how hot the girls are you're roping in with a feather boa, stop dancing or it'll bring the pain for the rest of the week!
Dec 20 14:59:48 <Lantizia> how did it go gagetoid?
Dec 20 14:59:57 <Lantizia> with frozen bubble.
Dec 20 15:01:15 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Lantizia:  I realised that I don't know what the fuck I'm doing, whilst manually browsing through the repository
Dec 20 15:01:40 <VDVsx> afaik frozen bubble doesn't work on the device, unless it is complied without GL support
Dec 20 15:02:20 <Lantizia> well its in the repo
Dec 20 15:03:29 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Trouble is, it's in devel, which means nobody is inclined to rush and fix the dependancy
Dec 20 15:04:57 <VDVsx> Lantizia, the package was imported a long ago, before the maintainer got a device, and its in -devel not extras
Dec 20 15:05:39 <Lantizia> i know its in devel
Dec 20 15:06:44 <DocScrutinizer51> anybody a clue what happened to numptyphysics for maemo4 ?
Dec 20 15:06:45 <VDVsx> and the problem is not only that dependency for sure, otherwise it will be done already
Dec 20 15:13:02 <DocScrutinizer51> or is it just me not finding it anymore
Dec 20 15:15:49 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Already installed?
Dec 20 15:16:20 <Gadgetoid_mbp> I'd check on my n810, but that means getting up, and I'm all danced out baby!
Dec 20 15:16:42 <SpeedEvil> vnc
Dec 20 15:16:51 * SpeedEvil is also in bed.
Dec 20 15:17:02 <Gadgetoid_mbp> vnc might work if it were turned on :(
Dec 20 15:17:16 <SpeedEvil> You turn computers off?
Dec 20 15:17:19 <SpeedEvil> Wierd.
Dec 20 15:17:27 <Gadgetoid_mbp> the n810, yup
Dec 20 15:17:36 <Gadgetoid_mbp> I think the battery ran out
Dec 20 15:17:45 <Gadgetoid_mbp> No, wait, turned it off to USB connect
Dec 20 15:18:14 <Gadgetoid_mbp> As USB host from N810 to N900 failed
Dec 20 15:18:33 <SpeedEvil> you mean 810 as host?
Dec 20 15:18:37 <Gadgetoid_mbp> yes
Dec 20 15:18:52 <DocScrutinizer51> well I had numpty some months ago. dunno if I deinstalled and forgot or it simply vanished. Anyway it's not in appmanager anymore.
Dec 20 15:18:56 <Gadgetoid_mbp> I suspect a powered USB hub between the two might help
Dec 20 15:19:20 <DocScrutinizer51> And garage direct install link appmngr says file not found
Dec 20 15:19:26 <lcuk> DocScrutinizer51, if you have it installed it isnt listed in the apps to install
Dec 20 15:19:44 <lcuk> ie check the other areas in app manager
Dec 20 15:19:55 <lcuk> failing that, you may have simply screwed up your repos
Dec 20 15:20:00 <DocScrutinizer51> lcuk: but it,s also not listed in removable
Dec 20 15:20:44 <PaulFertser> DocScrutinizer51: https://paulfertser.is-a-geek.org/files/n900/zImage-paul-2.6.28-20dec
Dec 20 15:21:15 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Is anyone working on a Ubuntu image for the N900?
Dec 20 15:21:40 <oldtang> hi
Dec 20 15:21:52 <DocScrutinizer51> lcuk: so how could I check if the repos are ok? simply compare the source URL ec settings? or is there a way to check/clean/repairlocal database?
Dec 20 15:21:57 <oldtang> i can't run maemo 5 example on vmware image
Dec 20 15:22:24 <oldtang> anyone help ?
Dec 20 15:23:58 <lcuk> DocScrutinizer51, the apt/dpkg databases should be self curing, before anything so drastic, check you have the extras repository?
Dec 20 15:24:07 <lcuk> and disable other repositories too
Dec 20 15:24:11 <lcuk> cos they can conflict
Dec 20 15:24:41 <DocScrutinizer51> lcuk: tripple checked
Dec 20 15:25:09 <DocScrutinizer51> ahh ok. I'll try to disable the other repos
Dec 20 15:27:57 <PaulFertser> DocScrutinizer51: have you noticed the link to a recompiled kernel i made from maemo sources?
Dec 20 15:30:58 <DocScrutinizer51> PaulFertser: I tried to dl. need to find the file to verify its there :-P
Dec 20 15:33:20 <BluesLee> hi, is there a command to see which package is installed from which repo?
Dec 20 15:35:16 <DocScrutinizer51> PaulFertser: file is here
Dec 20 15:36:50 <PaulFertser> DocScrutinizer51: cool. I made dmesg buffer 4x times larger and disabled MODVERSIONS (hoping it would allow to load modules from the kernel you have). Only that.
Dec 20 15:37:57 <DocScrutinizer51> PaulFertser: will take a while until I read how to actually flash kernel and setup my PC for that purpose
Dec 20 15:38:25 <DocScrutinizer51> aiui there is mainly windoze support for nokia suite
Dec 20 15:38:41 <woglinde> ~flasher
Dec 20 15:38:43 <infobot> somebody said flasher was http://wiki.maemo.org/Flasher
Dec 20 15:38:56 <PaulFertser> DocScrutinizer51: sure, take your time. My guess was that it's the same as with n810, i.e. you copy proprietary flasher from somewhere and just flash with it while booted to BL.
Dec 20 15:39:19 <DocScrutinizer51> yep. my guess as well
Dec 20 15:39:29 <DocScrutinizer51> woglinde: thnx
Dec 20 15:41:50 <wazd_n800> err, how to make a poll at t.m.o.?
Dec 20 15:41:57 <wazd_n800> nm
Dec 20 15:42:46 <VDVsx> wazd_n800, there's a option there
Dec 20 15:43:06 <VDVsx> :p
Dec 20 15:43:37 * SpeedEvil ponders a 'nokia should release schematics' brainstrorm.
Dec 20 15:44:20 <VDVsx> SpeedEvil, good luck with that :p
Dec 20 15:45:04 * SpeedEvil wishes there was a way to advertise for broken n900s.
Dec 20 15:46:20 <DocScrutinizer51> SpeedEvil: advertise?
Dec 20 15:46:35 <SpeedEvil> contact users who have them
Dec 20 15:46:42 <DocScrutinizer51> aah
Dec 20 15:47:53 <DocScrutinizer51> I'd hope there wasn't that many of them ;-)
Dec 20 15:48:17 <wazd_n800> http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=37866
Dec 20 15:48:26 <SpeedEvil> I mean ones not covered by warranty
Dec 20 15:48:35 <SpeedEvil> say treading on them
Dec 20 15:54:03 <Lantizia> according to this bug... https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2686
Dec 20 15:54:15 <povbot> Bug 2686: Media player album art support
Dec 20 15:54:22 <Lantizia> support for cover.jpg was added (album art in same dir as music files on media player) ... but it doesn't work
Dec 20 15:54:37 <Lantizia> oh and I'm on an N900... any ideas on what I may be doing wrong?
Dec 20 15:55:50 <fnordianslip> Lantizia: Most bug-fixes for fremantle are in an unreleased future firmware update or SSU
Dec 20 15:56:05 <jebba> Builder is back online
Dec 20 15:56:19 <Lantizia> fnordianslip, but this was closed like back in february
Dec 20 15:56:26 <fnordianslip> oh ok
Dec 20 15:56:40 <fnordianslip> too lazy to look
Dec 20 15:56:59 * DocScrutinizer51 away (dinner)
Dec 20 16:08:50 <yuizy> is it possible to have "mouse gestures" in xterm?
Dec 20 16:12:57 <SpeedEvil> yuizy: in principle, yes, but nobody has implemented
Dec 20 16:13:15 <SpeedEvil> I'm unsure if the terminal supports 'mouse mode'
Dec 20 16:13:33 <yuizy> ok
Dec 20 16:13:38 <yuizy> that would be very useful
Dec 20 16:13:46 <yuizy> i.e. for irssi
Dec 20 16:13:56 <jebba> ffmpeg, coming up!  :)
Dec 20 16:15:48 <yuizy> draw line up = pageup, draw line to right = alt+right
Dec 20 16:17:18 <RST38bis> ehlo all
Dec 20 16:18:36 <matan> 250-PIPELINING
Dec 20 16:19:14 <RST38bis> As they only say that 'the bulk' is running PHP, let's assume this to be 25,000 of the 30,000. If C++ would have been used instead of PHP, then 22,500 servers could be powered down (assuming a conservative ratio of 10 for the efficiency of C++ versus PHP code), or a reduction of 49,000 tons of CO2 per year.
Dec 20 16:19:32 <RST38bis> heh, poor php, cant get a break...
Dec 20 16:24:37 <manuelse> Hello is gpodder author in chat
Dec 20 16:25:10 <manuelse> Somewhere i want to play the new podcasts
Dec 20 16:25:27 <weatherhead> hi, does anyone know anything about facebook chat support it pidgin
Dec 20 16:25:29 <manuelse> but they are all in their categories and i must play each one
Dec 20 16:25:52 <manuelse> is facebook irc?
Dec 20 16:26:44 <stevenhong> how to see the swap in n810
Dec 20 16:27:09 <manuelse> top, free
Dec 20 16:27:13 <manuelse> mount
Dec 20 16:28:44 <stevenhong> use top command I just see the ram
Dec 20 16:29:09 <manuelse> ok, sorry
Dec 20 16:29:25 <SpeedEvil> Hmm. video with flashlight is a bit iffy.
Dec 20 16:29:29 <SpeedEvil> As expected really
Dec 20 16:29:29 <manuelse> on pc top show Swap:
Dec 20 16:29:40 <SpeedEvil> http://www.flickr.com/photos/14560445@N08/4200558860/
Dec 20 16:29:41 <ShadowJK> maemo has busybox top
Dec 20 16:30:03 <ShadowJK> if nothing else, grep Swap /proc/meminfo
Dec 20 16:30:06 <stevenhong> have you succeed in boot the system in the mmc
Dec 20 16:30:19 <Lantizia> Could anyone else make a dir, put some music files in it, and a cover.jpg picture, and see if Media Player (on N900) actually uses it as Album Art?
Dec 20 16:30:29 <Lantizia> it's meant to according to the bug tracker, but doesn't for mne
Dec 20 16:30:57 <stevenhong> busybox?
Dec 20 16:31:00 <stevenhong> what for?
Dec 20 16:31:43 <stevenhong> how much is the n900 price in USA?
Dec 20 16:31:43 <manuelse> busybox takes very little space on the filesystem
Dec 20 16:31:57 <Lantizia> a file system of 32gb's
Dec 20 16:32:02 <Lantizia> thats like SUCH a concern
Dec 20 16:32:04 <johnq> Hi! Is there some upstart-event that is fired when the internal flash (MyDocs) is mounted?
Dec 20 16:32:09 <manuelse> 256MB
Dec 20 16:32:15 <manuelse> do not be fooled
Dec 20 16:32:25 <stevenhong> how to install
Dec 20 16:33:11 <manuelse> johnq: see /etc/events.d for events on n900
Dec 20 16:33:49 <manuelse> Lantizia: i give you permission to install replacement applications for busybox
Dec 20 16:34:22 * Lantizia feels honered
Dec 20 16:34:37 <stevenhong> busybox is that means the shell in the maemo?
Dec 20 16:35:01 <manuelse> i think it is time for teh goggling :)
Dec 20 16:36:45 <johnq> so the events in /etc/event.d are all events that are emitted, or do some other system daemons also emit signals?
Dec 20 16:37:19 <GiantTalkingCow> Any n900 owners in the US that might be using a T-Mobile dataplan? (I know it's rather a long shot.)
Dec 20 16:37:31 <Khertan> Hello !
Dec 20 16:37:35 <Lantizia> Hello !
Dec 20 16:37:41 <lcuk> hey Khertan :D
Dec 20 16:37:54 <SpeedEvil> GiantTalkingCow: I recall threads on that on talk
Dec 20 16:38:03 <SpeedEvil> GiantTalkingCow: and I'm using t-mobile in the UK
Dec 20 16:38:04 <Khertan> heya lcuk
Dec 20 16:38:20 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Can someone port KDE to the N900 plz
Dec 20 16:38:25 <Lantizia> Voda on N900 on UK works great, nothing is blocked on my unlimited web/text + 600 min plan from nokiaretail.co.uk
Dec 20 16:38:30 <DocScrutinizer51> help fr mail setup N900 please.  How to send a mail with a mailaddr alias?
Dec 20 16:38:43 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Shouldn't it be CDE? Or do they spell Crappy with a K these days?
Dec 20 16:38:43 <Lantizia> openvpn, irc, skype, sip, ssh... all on 3G/3.5G
Dec 20 16:38:53 <lcuk> Gadgetoid, KDE DE?
Dec 20 16:39:05 <Lantizia> t-mobile blocks all kinds of stuf
Dec 20 16:39:35 <cosmo_> isn't debian already ported to n900? it has KDE
Dec 20 16:39:37 <Gadgetoid_mbp> luck: Debian in a box would be nice, ala the N810 but obviously not with KDE
Dec 20 16:40:04 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Not really looked into Debian yet, though
Dec 20 16:40:11 <Lantizia> Gadgetoid, common desktop environment? isn't that dead?
Dec 20 16:40:22 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Although I'm guessing it's how everyone is rocking ALSA Mixer on the N900
Dec 20 16:40:33 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Lantizia: you assume it was alive in the first place
Dec 20 16:40:38 <lcuk> Gadgetoid, ive seen kde on n810
Dec 20 16:40:43 <Lantizia> omg was it frankenstein
Dec 20 16:40:50 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Really, lcuk?
Dec 20 16:40:57 <lcuk> and kde widgets (plasmoids?) were running on n900 at the summit
Dec 20 16:41:10 <lcuk> yeah, Mek both times actually, both summits
Dec 20 16:41:11 <Gadgetoid_mbp> I thought KDE was too bloated for a bleedin' desktop much less anything else
Dec 20 16:41:22 <lcuk> he has been able to run kde on nokia devices
Dec 20 16:41:23 <Gadgetoid_mbp> I'm actually mildly impressed
Dec 20 16:41:36 <Lantizia> why would you want something as bloaty as kde on it?
Dec 20 16:41:44 <Lantizia> LXDE is the nice ness :D
Dec 20 16:41:47 <Gadgetoid_mbp> It's like trying to run Windows Vista on a ZX Spectrum... but still cool
Dec 20 16:41:51 <weatherhead> are you mistaking KDE with Qt ?
Dec 20 16:42:04 <DocScrutinizer51> (mail alias) Is there a way to setup an account that has SMTP only, *no* POPE or whatever mailfetch?
Dec 20 16:42:10 <GiantTalkingCow> Personally, I feel that both KDE and Gnome have pretty much scuttled Linux's desktop chance for the near future.
Dec 20 16:42:35 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Aww ome on GiantTalkingCow, Gnome isn't THAT bad
Dec 20 16:42:42 <Lantizia> GiantTalkingCow, XFCE hasn't done much to help it either
Dec 20 16:43:00 <GiantTalkingCow> No, the current version of Gnome is so-so. But looking at v3, especially with Gnome-Shell....
Dec 20 16:43:05 * GiantTalkingCow shrugs.
Dec 20 16:43:06 <weatherhead> will I get instantly massive flamed for being a KDE user?
Dec 20 16:43:06 <Gadgetoid_mbp> The only way linux will have an honest to god chance on consumer desktops is to look exactly like Windows
Dec 20 16:43:14 <Lantizia> weatherhead, yes lol
Dec 20 16:43:17 <weatherhead> ok
Dec 20 16:43:17 <Gadgetoid_mbp> And, apparently, that didn't work for it either
Dec 20 16:43:31 <Lantizia> hehe the KDE way
Dec 20 16:43:34 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Although I guess not being sued by MS would help
Dec 20 16:43:34 <lcuk> i want a flying car running linux on its desktop with dukenukem as a pre installable
Dec 20 16:44:00 <GiantTalkingCow> Gadgetoid_mbp: Not at all, all it has to do is work smoothly and have a fair amount of native app support.
Dec 20 16:44:02 <weatherhead> lcuk: it's coming in KDE 5
Dec 20 16:44:02 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Would you settle for duke nukem 2d, lcuk?
Dec 20 16:44:04 <weatherhead> lol
Dec 20 16:44:04 <Lantizia> doom on n900 would be nice to see
Dec 20 16:44:08 <Lantizia> as would duke 3d
Dec 20 16:44:19 <Shadikka> hmm
Dec 20 16:44:29 <Shadikka> Doom could actually be worth doing.
Dec 20 16:44:38 <Lantizia> dukenukem3d has a linux installer too
Dec 20 16:44:43 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Trust me, GiantTalkingCow, it definitely has to look exactly identical to windows... I've met folks who accidentally drag icons on their desktop around and panic
Dec 20 16:44:51 <lcuk> Gadgetoid_mbp, if the only way is to look like windows then its not going to work, theres no point in trying to clone identically, you dont change market share that way, you go at things differently
Dec 20 16:44:54 <Lantizia> Shadikka, could use PR Boom ... or Vanilla Doom (thats a very good example)
Dec 20 16:45:22 <Lantizia> Shadikka, http://www.chocolate-doom.org <-- I meant this one lol
Dec 20 16:45:26 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Oh well, I guess all the people who are mortally afraid of computers will be dead in a few years anyway
Dec 20 16:45:52 <GiantTalkingCow> Gadgetoid_mbp: Yes, but those people are idiots, and frankly aiming anything at them would be a waste. I'd aim Linux at the intermediate user market. The low end has a ton of trouble with Windows as is, and would be better served using an internet appliance.
Dec 20 16:46:07 <Shadikka> Lantizia: I wonder how hard would it actually be to get those running on N900
Dec 20 16:46:08 <SpeedEvil> Lantizia: Awww - dissapointing. I hoped for a chocolate themed wad.
Dec 20 16:46:17 <Lantizia> hehe
Dec 20 16:46:21 <DocScrutinizer51> Gadgetoid_mbp: what a nonsense. Anybody needing windows like desktop should use windows
Dec 20 16:46:35 <Lantizia> you have to prodive the wad's yourself for obvious reasons... like you do with ioquake3
Dec 20 16:46:36 <GAN900> Linux makes a good Internet appliance
Dec 20 16:46:59 <Gadgetoid_mbp> DocScrutinizer51: Or euthanised
Dec 20 16:47:10 <GAN900> I've installed Ubuntu as a Windows replacement on a lot of inexperienced users' machines.
Dec 20 16:47:19 * SpeedEvil has a doom II CD somewhere
Dec 20 16:47:23 <Lantizia> im happy with openttd, scummvm, wormux, quake3, openarena, etc... for now ... but I do want FROZEN BUBBLE.... NEEED MY FIXXXXX!
Dec 20 16:47:29 <lcuk> GAN900, do you followup on the maint?
Dec 20 16:47:35 <SpeedEvil> Lantizia: enigma is good too
Dec 20 16:47:37 <lcuk> or just fire/forget changing the game for them
Dec 20 16:47:42 <SpeedEvil> Lantizia: it can drive you crazy though
Dec 20 16:47:47 * Lantizia installs
Dec 20 16:47:56 <GAN900> lcuk, there's very little maintenance
Dec 20 16:48:04 <lcuk> but who does it
Dec 20 16:48:10 <GAN900> Tell them to update it when it bugs them about it
Dec 20 16:48:18 <GAN900> They do, so far.
Dec 20 16:48:19 <jebba> for ffmpeg, the Depends: is like this:    "Depends: ${shlibs:Depends}, ${misc:Depends}"     But that didn't do any of the depends (e.g. i can install ffmpeg without bringing in and deps).  Is this because those are debhelper 7 variables or something?
Dec 20 16:48:21 <lcuk> thats the same advice you give to windows users
Dec 20 16:48:39 <DocScrutinizer51> anybody around to help me with that mail shit please?
Dec 20 16:48:43 <lcuk> but they get annoyed when flash or something is outdated
Dec 20 16:48:45 <DocScrutinizer51> (mail alias) Is there a way to setup an account that has SMTP only, *no* POPE or whatever mailfetch?
Dec 20 16:48:49 <lcuk> or their game wont play
Dec 20 16:48:52 <GAN900> Except for the anti-virus/spyware/malware/trojan lecture you have to give.
Dec 20 16:49:10 <GAN900> Meh, haven't had any of those issues.
Dec 20 16:49:11 <Lantizia> runing windows?  hahahaaaa you fail
Dec 20 16:49:14 <Lantizia> please don't ctcp me
Dec 20 16:49:37 <jebba> ah, missing dpkg-shlibdeps   http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-sharedlibs.html
Dec 20 16:49:59 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Who needs anti-virus, just stretch a condom over the keyboard and everything is good
Dec 20 16:50:06 <lcuk> GAN900, i get a "uber_farmworld_Facebookapp" thing wont run
Dec 20 16:50:15 <wazd_n801> tmo's  down?(
Dec 20 16:50:16 <lcuk> but it works from your computer upstairs
Dec 20 16:50:17 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Specially if it's a used one, they wont touch their computers then... and lack of user intervention is a pretty good preventative
Dec 20 16:50:19 <lcuk> whats the difference
Dec 20 16:50:29 <GAN900> Anyway, lcuk, not at all interested in Win vs Lin discussion.
Dec 20 16:51:09 <GiantTalkingCow> Frankly, I feel that in terms of a decent UI, both OSes are sadly lacking. Actually, all modern OSes are.
Dec 20 16:52:20 <jebba> gah, but dh_shlibdeps is being called. hrmm
Dec 20 16:53:18 <Lantizia> SpeedEvil, lol ... that enigma game has taken sound effect from Worms 2
Dec 20 16:53:22 <Lantizia> *effects
Dec 20 16:53:28 <Lantizia> odd game tho
Dec 20 16:54:54 <johnsq> Hi
Dec 20 16:55:51 <DocScrutinizer51> damn mailclient is such a *PITA*. Obviously you can't even set up mail download interval on a per-server basis
Dec 20 16:57:37 <jebba> is johnsq the same as johnq?  :)    I got evopedia working with spanish wiki.  Some problems though in that articles would have sections of other entries that had nothing to do with the subject (e.g. Borges article has stuff about Tampico, Mexico for it's top half)
Dec 20 16:58:10 <johnsq> jebba: no johns is the normal nick, but already taken
Dec 20 16:59:44 <DocScrutinizer51> so there's no way to handle a mail account with multiple mailaddr and minpoll. even if I set poll interval to 2 * minpoll, it still polls the account twice in a moment
Dec 20 17:00:28 <DocScrutinizer51> if a createed two accounts for the two mailaddr on same server
Dec 20 17:00:58 <ShadowJK> oooh
Dec 20 17:01:06 * ShadowJK finds tscalibrate on gitorious
Dec 20 17:01:15 <DocScrutinizer51> so selecting "from" means editing setup
Dec 20 17:03:05 <jebba> anyone know offhand which of these optimizations would be good for n900?   ARMv5TE ARMv6 ARMv6T2 "ARM VFP" IWMMXT NEON
Dec 20 17:03:42 <Stskeeps> neon, i hik
Dec 20 17:03:43 <Stskeeps> think
Dec 20 17:04:27 <jebba> swp half thumb fastmult vfp edsp neon vfpv3
Dec 20 17:04:31 <jebba> from /proc/cpuinfo
Dec 20 17:04:37 <jebba> gives some hints ;)
Dec 20 17:04:37 <Stskeeps> looks about right
Dec 20 17:06:35 <alekseiko> hi all
Dec 20 17:08:22 <johnq> jebba: I'm here
Dec 20 17:08:54 <johnq> jebba: The problems you describe seem very strange.
Dec 20 17:09:04 <lcuk> help!   how do i optify liqbase?    http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=37878
Dec 20 17:09:44 <ShadowJK> jebba, what are you compiling?
Dec 20 17:10:26 <jebba> ShadowJK: ffmpeg.   Gonna try:  --enable-neon --enable-armvfp --enable-armv5te --enable-armv6 --enable-armv6t2
Dec 20 17:10:29 <ShadowJK> oh wow, downloaded fremantle-hildon-desktop-osso-applet-screencalibration, compiled it in scratchbox, dumped the binary onto my device in $HOME, ran it, and ts calibration is good again
Dec 20 17:10:35 <ShadowJK> jebba, good luck :)
Dec 20 17:10:53 <ShadowJK> jebba, I recommend -mcpu=cortex-a8 -mfloat-abi=neon -mfpu=neon
Dec 20 17:11:00 <ShadowJK> uh
Dec 20 17:11:05 <ShadowJK> jebba, I recommend -mcpu=cortex-a8 -mfloat-abi=softfp -mfpu=neon
Dec 20 17:11:12 <ShadowJK> softfp not neon as abi..
Dec 20 17:11:19 <jebba> ShadowJK: actually, i got it built already ok.  It didn't automate the dependencies though, via dh_shlibdeps for some reason though
Dec 20 17:11:35 <ShadowJK> did you get it built with neon enabled?
Dec 20 17:11:36 <jebba> ShadowJK: the options above are ./configure optoins to ffmpeg, not CCFLAGS
Dec 20 17:11:42 <ShadowJK> Yes, I know
Dec 20 17:12:21 <jebba> no, no neon in the build I did. Adding it now.
Dec 20 17:12:26 <ShadowJK> with MPlayer, the difference between plain and v5te+v6+v6te+vfp+neon is about 20%
Dec 20 17:12:41 <ShadowJK> so it should be the same with ffmpeg too..
Dec 20 17:13:22 <Lantizia> if rootfs shows as full on df -h is that bad? lol
Dec 20 17:13:27 <jebba> yes, i would think big difference...
Dec 20 17:13:41 <jebba> Lantizia: DON'T REBOOT, until you get it fixed or you may brick your device.
Dec 20 17:13:55 <Lantizia> ooo k
Dec 20 17:14:10 <Lantizia> I was trying to install perl-modules and perl from the SDK to get frozen bubble working
Dec 20 17:14:19 <Lantizia> and it said no space left on device
Dec 20 17:14:27 <Lantizia> I take it I've filled the 256mb portion?
Dec 20 17:14:47 <ShadowJK> where "bricked" really means you'll be in for a reflash (and lose anything stored on rootfs)
Dec 20 17:15:04 <Lantizia> I've reflashed before so that doesn't bother me
Dec 20 17:15:13 <Lantizia> can I have apps install to the 32gb area tho?
Dec 20 17:15:33 <jebba> ShadowJK:
Dec 20 17:15:34 <jebba> vfp_build_confflags += --extra-cflags="-mfpu=vfp -mfloat-abi=softfp"
Dec 20 17:16:03 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Incidentally my rootfs is also at 99%
Dec 20 17:16:21 <Lantizia> I mean, whats the fix here?  I want what I've got install to stay installed
Dec 20 17:16:46 <jebba> ShadowJK: ok, gonna add:   --extra-cflags="-mcpu=cortex-a8 -mfloat-abi=softfp -mfpu=neon"     thx  :)
Dec 20 17:16:55 <ShadowJK> jebba, I think you want -mfpu=neon for n900?
Dec 20 17:17:17 <ShadowJK> Lantizia, the SDK repo isn't meant for use on N900
Dec 20 17:17:18 <jebba> ya ^^
Dec 20 17:17:36 <jebba> ShadowJK: to clarify, this looks ok, right?   --extra-cflags="-mcpu=cortex-a8 -mfloat-abi=softfp -mfpu=neon"
Dec 20 17:17:37 <Lantizia> ShadowJK, this implies it can be... http://wiki.maemo.org/Perl
Dec 20 17:18:29 <Lantizia> I just want proper perl installed then I'll remove the repo
Dec 20 17:18:36 <ShadowJK> it's too big :)
Dec 20 17:18:44 <Lantizia> well can I move usr to home?
Dec 20 17:18:51 <ShadowJK> Some perl knowledgeable would need to repackage it so it doesn't consume rootfs space
Dec 20 17:19:00 <ShadowJK> home isn't mounted early enough, so boot will fail
Dec 20 17:19:07 <Lantizia> but opt is in home
Dec 20 17:19:26 <Lantizia> why not usr?
Dec 20 17:19:41 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Does libwebkit still chug rootfs space?
Dec 20 17:19:53 <ShadowJK> Lantizia, I'm told that /usr is needed in order to mount /home
Dec 20 17:20:15 <Lantizia> ok this royally sucks balls... 32gb of space and I can't even use it!
Dec 20 17:20:30 <Gadgetoid_mbp> It's a Maemo feature Lantizia
Dec 20 17:20:32 <Lantizia> if I wanted to store removal files like music/video I'd use the SD card!  not the 32gb
Dec 20 17:20:43 <Lantizia> I want the 32gb for my filesystem
Dec 20 17:21:00 * Stskeeps should try to debug cloning fremantle
Dec 20 17:21:00 <DocScrutinizer51> Lantizia: (opt) I suggested that as well
Dec 20 17:21:19 <Lantizia> DocScrutinizer51, suggest what?
Dec 20 17:21:26 <ShadowJK> Atleast people seem to have (mostly) solved python now
Dec 20 17:21:26 <johnq> jebba: hey, I got the startup script working - it seems that the N900 uses only upstart without system-v-compatibility, although there are plenty of links in the /etc/rc?.d/-directories
Dec 20 17:21:31 <ShadowJK> bind mounts :)
Dec 20 17:21:48 <Gadgetoid_mbp> I can't fathom what's eating my rootfs up, but it doesn't seem to be preventing the installation of further apps
Dec 20 17:21:52 <Lantizia> ShadowJK, I know how to use them - can I some how use them to get past the 256mb limits?
Dec 20 17:22:01 <DocScrutinizer51> move /usr /var to eMMC (or /(9'3@-94@+8'0:3@+9:7589"j
Dec 20 17:22:06 <DocScrutinizer51> sorry
Dec 20 17:22:20 <jebba> Gadgetoid_mbp: probably the icon cache!  It will free up the space after power cycle
Dec 20 17:22:24 <ShadowJK> I don't know what perl expects
Dec 20 17:22:30 <DocScrutinizer51> (or /home for simple solution)
Dec 20 17:22:47 * ShadowJK has power cycled his n900 twice so far (soon a month)
Dec 20 17:22:54 <Lantizia> DocScrutinizer51, well /opt is actually /home/opt
Dec 20 17:23:03 <Lantizia> DocScrutinizer51, but thats just a symlink
Dec 20 17:23:06 <DocScrutinizer51> yep
Dec 20 17:23:08 <Gadgetoid_mbp> jebba: you could be right... I'm sure the n810/Maemo4 had precomputed icon caches and that I managed to adjust them down in size considerably
Dec 20 17:23:20 <Lantizia> DocScrutinizer51, are you saying make /usr a mount bind to /home/usr and put it in fstab?
Dec 20 17:23:32 <jebba> ug, 91 patches to pulseaudio...
Dec 20 17:24:07 <DocScrutinizer51> Lantizia: basically yes
Dec 20 17:24:17 <Lantizia> DocScrutinizer51, and I won't screw anything up? lol
Dec 20 17:24:18 <DocScrutinizer51> Lantizia: var as well
Dec 20 17:24:38 <Lantizia> fstab has a comment saying it's autogenerated - will something else overwrite my changes?
Dec 20 17:24:50 <DocScrutinizer51> dunno. should work if done correctly (early mount)
Dec 20 17:25:11 <Lantizia> well fstab should be early enough... ShadowJK what do you think?
Dec 20 17:25:59 <ShadowJK> I guess you can try... got flasher ready and data backed up? :)
Dec 20 17:26:06 <Lantizia> lol yes
Dec 20 17:26:14 <Lantizia> only had this n900 a week
Dec 20 17:26:19 <Lantizia> I can afford another reflash hehe
Dec 20 17:26:30 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Hmm, reboot leaves 17mb free on rootfs
Dec 20 17:26:31 <DocScrutinizer51> Lantizia: also consider doing the mounts via a initscript
Dec 20 17:26:38 <Gadgetoid_mbp> What's the free space on a virgin rootfs like?
Dec 20 17:27:00 <Lantizia> DocScrutinizer51, you'll have to guide me on which file and what to put
Dec 20 17:27:44 <Lantizia> /home/usr /usr bind defaults,bind 0 0
Dec 20 17:27:44 <Lantizia> /home/var /var bind defaults,bind 0 0
Dec 20 17:27:48 <ShadowJK> /sbin/preinit looks like interesting reading :)
Dec 20 17:27:53 <jebba> wow, tons of pulseaudio fixes from 0.9.15 (current in n900)  to 0.9.21 (current pulseaudio version). Including goodies like:  "arm: implement ARM cpu detection"  "svolume: add ARM optimized volume scaling"   and probably a million other optimizations....
Dec 20 17:28:04 <Gadgetoid_mbp> And why oh why has this stupid problem persisted to Maemo 5? It's pretty much a given that everyone will want to spam non optified shit from dev onto their devices
Dec 20 17:28:31 <Stskeeps> jebba: nokia does contribute upstream often :P
Dec 20 17:28:49 <jebba> Stskeeps: cool. /me waits for it to hit downstream ;)
Dec 20 17:29:10 <jebba> i was thinking of rebuilding it, but i'm a bit taken aback by 92 freaking patches...
Dec 20 17:29:15 <jebba> that will be a lot to sort thru
Dec 20 17:29:32 <Lantizia> ok copying both var and usr to /home
Dec 20 17:29:53 <Lantizia> ShadowJK, I should pop something in there?
Dec 20 17:30:13 <ShadowJK> oh I just saw stuff for mmc and usb boot (funny, the n900 has no usb host mode)
Dec 20 17:30:35 <Lantizia> see thats the only thing I don't like about the N900... not usb host mode
Dec 20 17:30:36 <jebba> debian sid has only one patch to pulseaudio 0.9.21.
Dec 20 17:30:37 <DocScrutinizer51> Lantizia: seen ShadowJK comment?
Dec 20 17:30:40 <Lantizia> unless someone has a work around
Dec 20 17:30:45 <Lantizia> DocScrutinizer51, which one?
Dec 20 17:30:54 <ShadowJK> I wouldn't move /var
Dec 20 17:31:01 <DocScrutinizer51> 182749 <ShadowJK> /sbin/preinit looks like interesting reading :)
Dec 20 17:31:02 <Lantizia> oh how come?
Dec 20 17:31:09 <Lantizia> yeah I'm in that file
Dec 20 17:31:12 <ShadowJK> rcS starts touching /var very early on
Dec 20 17:31:59 <Lantizia> hmm
Dec 20 17:32:13 <Lantizia> starting to find the limits of this phone now
Dec 20 17:32:16 <Lantizia> :(
Dec 20 17:32:27 <Lantizia> it looked unstoppable
Dec 20 17:32:28 <Stskeeps> limits? nothing's stopping you from moving entire OS to SD :P
Dec 20 17:32:40 <Lantizia> well thats what I did with my Zaurus!
Dec 20 17:32:51 <Lantizia> I loved that :D
Dec 20 17:32:59 <Stskeeps> ah, a zaurus user
Dec 20 17:33:03 <Lantizia> yeeeah :P
Dec 20 17:33:06 <DocScrutinizer51> so which limits?
Dec 20 17:33:07 <ShadowJK> jebba, how goes ffmpeg compiling?
Dec 20 17:33:20 <woglinde> hm
Dec 20 17:33:23 <Lantizia> DocScrutinizer51, the 256mb limit, no "out-of-box" way of using 32gb as filesystem
Dec 20 17:33:26 <woglinde> jebba isnt on #ffmpeg
Dec 20 17:33:26 <Lantizia> no usb host mode
Dec 20 17:33:58 <DocScrutinizer51> Lantizia: OOTB is a rather soft limit
Dec 20 17:34:20 <SpeedEvil> And will pretty much go away in a month or so when everyone works out that opt is a good idea
Dec 20 17:34:29 <Lantizia> ok then someone explain how I shift the ENTIRE OS to the 32gb?
Dec 20 17:34:36 <Lantizia> lol... sod the 256mb part
Dec 20 17:35:05 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Easier said than done Lantizia
Dec 20 17:35:17 <SpeedEvil> It will happen. It's not going to be tomorrow.
Dec 20 17:35:17 <DocScrutinizer51> Stskeeps should be able to help
Dec 20 17:35:18 <Gadgetoid_mbp> And USB mode will no longer work I suspect
Dec 20 17:35:42 <Stskeeps> http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=372885&postcount=22
Dec 20 17:35:45 <Stskeeps> -> Lantizia
Dec 20 17:36:02 <Lantizia> damn it I can't receive sms messages now... device is full
Dec 20 17:36:24 <GAN900> Lantizia, eMMC is way slower.
Dec 20 17:36:47 <Lantizia> then Nokia has done a shit job with this phone
Dec 20 17:36:57 <Lantizia> 256mb is no where near enough... not when some phones have 2gb built in
Dec 20 17:37:46 <Stskeeps> 256mb NAND is pretty much the norm.
Dec 20 17:37:51 <DocScrutinizer51> GAN900: what's 'way slower' in numbers?
Dec 20 17:38:20 <odin_> is it 256Mb or 1.5Gb OneNAND ?  since there is 256Mb RAM, 768Mb SWAP, 256Mb rootfs
Dec 20 17:38:25 <GAN900> Lantizia, that's why /opt is there.
Dec 20 17:38:41 <GAN900> odin_, swap is on the eMMC.
Dec 20 17:38:41 <Lantizia> GAN900, yeah but that doesn't fix everything tho!
Dec 20 17:39:20 <GAN900> Lantizia, well, be aware that moving to the eMMC is going to slow things down noticeably. :)
Dec 20 17:39:33 <GAN900> DocScrutinizer51, don't have any benchmarks, sorry.
Dec 20 17:39:48 <SpeedEvil> It's not slower - really for read
Dec 20 17:39:50 <SpeedEvil> ~10%
Dec 20 17:39:52 <SpeedEvil> IIRC
Dec 20 17:39:52 <infobot> 0.1
Dec 20 17:39:52 <Lantizia> well I'm going to try moving /usr anyway!
Dec 20 17:39:54 <Lantizia> WEEEEE!
Dec 20 17:40:00 <ShadowJK> SpeedEvil, that random 4k reads?
Dec 20 17:40:11 <ShadowJK> because sequential read speed means absolutely nothing
Dec 20 17:40:14 <Lantizia> and sod that script... just gonna plonk a bind mount in the fstab
Dec 20 17:40:27 <ShadowJK> considered a symlink?
Dec 20 17:40:29 <SpeedEvil> ShadowJK: sequential or asequential read is approximately the same speed
Dec 20 17:40:40 <SpeedEvil> ShadowJK: it's asequential write that blows.
Dec 20 17:40:41 <ShadowJK> no it's not :)
Dec 20 17:40:44 <Lantizia> ShadowJK, well /opt does it that way - do you think a symlink is all it needs?
Dec 20 17:41:06 <odin_> I only moved /var/lib/dpkg to /opt/maemo/var/lib/dpkg (and now Im happy with 32Mb free)
Dec 20 17:41:18 <SpeedEvil> (approximately - to within a factor of two - small block random write performance can be way under 10% of max)
Dec 20 17:41:21 <Lantizia> true I should run apt-get clean
Dec 20 17:41:21 <ShadowJK> I wouldn't do it before reading the init scripts and figuring out what gets executed when, and where it lives
Dec 20 17:41:23 <DocScrutinizer51> Lantizia: sure
Dec 20 17:41:40 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Lantizia: it wont help
Dec 20 17:41:46 <Lantizia> what wont?
Dec 20 17:41:52 <Gadgetoid_mbp> apt-get clean
Dec 20 17:41:57 <GAN900> Lantizia, get ready for a reboot loop.
Dec 20 17:41:58 <Lantizia> it gave me 7mb lol
Dec 20 17:42:08 <Lantizia> GAN900, why?
Dec 20 17:42:08 <ShadowJK> SpeedEvil, I would've thought the mmc command overhead along would give it a bigger difference than that :)
Dec 20 17:42:11 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Sheeesh, all right for some
Dec 20 17:42:17 <jebba> if you have a foo.deb, how can you  check what dependencies it needs (e.g. if it's not in a repo/installed).  Like with dpkg -c you can see the contents. But i want to see it's dependencies (and yes, I RTFManpages but didnt see that)
Dec 20 17:42:24 <odin_> is there much of a performance diff between 1k, 2k, 4k, 8k, 16k, ... upto native flash blocksize, reads ?
Dec 20 17:43:02 <johnq> is the gypsy running on the N900 the "standard" one?
Dec 20 17:43:04 <jebba> ah -I will do it  ;)  (just doesnt say so!)
Dec 20 17:43:11 <johnq> how can I find out the dbus methods available?
Dec 20 17:43:11 <Gadgetoid_mbp> odin_: just a straight move and symlink?
Dec 20 17:43:24 <odin_> I make a script... let me find it
Dec 20 17:43:37 <woglinde> johnq n900 runs gypsy not gpsd?
Dec 20 17:43:46 <Lantizia> rm usr -Rf
Dec 20 17:43:52 <Lantizia> that isnt' going so well - lol
Dec 20 17:43:57 <Lantizia> YAY lets BRICK it!
Dec 20 17:44:00 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Hahaha
Dec 20 17:44:02 <Lantizia> oh shit it restarted
Dec 20 17:44:25 <Lantizia> and I didn't get chance make the symlink lol
Dec 20 17:44:27 <Gadgetoid_mbp> You're kidding about the rm usr -Rf, Lantizia?
Dec 20 17:44:30 <Lantizia> nope
Dec 20 17:44:40 <Lantizia> I copied usr to /home... then thought I'd remove it and symlink it
Dec 20 17:44:50 <johnq> woglinde: erm, at least the dbus interfaces are there
Dec 20 17:44:54 <odin_> but lots of libraries are in /usr/lib/*
Dec 20 17:45:00 <johnq> woglinde: I don't really know what's on the other side
Dec 20 17:45:06 <GAN900> lol. . . .
Dec 20 17:45:12 <odin_> you needed to make the change atomically, copy, replace with symlink THEN delete
Dec 20 17:45:22 <johnq> woglinde: but yeah, some /usr/libexec/gypsy-daemon is running
Dec 20 17:45:28 <Lantizia> odin_, as in... atomically?
Dec 20 17:45:30 <Gadgetoid_mbp> I was exhaustively selective about the bits and bobs I moved around on the N810
Dec 20 17:45:55 <odin_> Lantizia, atomically as in, there is no moment of time in which any application will see any part of /usr missing (especially unable to find and load libraries)
Dec 20 17:46:14 <SpeedEvil> ShadowJK: the mmc overhead isn't totally trivial - but it's not really huge for writes
Dec 20 17:46:14 <Lantizia> odin_, so what your saying is.... i tcan't be done
Dec 20 17:46:15 <odin_> but I would not recommed moving /usr, weed out the not so important stuff
Dec 20 17:46:19 <SpeedEvil> ShadowJK: err - read
Dec 20 17:46:39 <ShadowJK> The worst is probably random reads mixed with some writes ;)
Dec 20 17:47:19 <Lantizia> damn it - it won't start up
Dec 20 17:47:49 <ShadowJK> heh.
Dec 20 17:48:03 <Lantizia> gotta call the bf too!
Dec 20 17:48:15 <Lantizia> crap crap cap
Dec 20 17:48:18 <GAN900> lol
Dec 20 17:48:31 <DocScrutinizer51> without /usr.  hmm it at best gets you a shell
Dec 20 17:48:33 * ShadowJK wonders if fstab is even parsed at all :)
Dec 20 17:48:43 <ShadowJK> DocScrutinizer51, but not X to display it? ;)
Dec 20 17:48:57 <Lantizia> a bind mount would have been less painful
Dec 20 17:48:59 <ShadowJK> and no framebuffer console in nokia kernel i think?
Dec 20 17:49:03 <Lantizia> can do that without getting rid of the old usr
Dec 20 17:49:21 <odin_> but you cant see it to remote it after :(
Dec 20 17:49:23 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Lantizia: you have failed
Dec 20 17:49:27 <odin_> s/remote/remove/
Dec 20 17:49:27 <Lantizia> I HAVE FAILED
Dec 20 17:49:27 <DocScrutinizer51> ShadowJK: yep. probably
Dec 20 17:49:28 <infobot> odin_ meant: but you cant see it to remove it after :(
Dec 20 17:49:44 <odin_> infobot Lantizia is a failure
Dec 20 17:49:46 <infobot> odin_: okay
Dec 20 17:49:51 <Lantizia> gonna reflash both the rootfs and the eemc
Dec 20 17:49:56 <Gadgetoid_mbp> I like to suck blood
Dec 20 17:49:56 <Lantizia> so it's FRESH!
Dec 20 17:49:57 <odin_> ~Lantizia
Dec 20 17:49:58 <infobot> i heard lantizia is a failure
Dec 20 17:50:00 <Gadgetoid_mbp> s/blood/penis
Dec 20 17:50:02 <Lantizia> SHH!
Dec 20 17:50:08 <Lantizia> someone say penis?
Dec 20 17:50:09 <Gadgetoid_mbp> No fun =/
Dec 20 17:50:29 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Yes Lantizia, penis and body glitter
Dec 20 17:50:33 <GAN900> eMMC flash
Dec 20 17:50:37 <Lantizia> wooo yippy!
Dec 20 17:50:46 <Lantizia> yeah that one
Dec 20 17:50:49 <GAN900> Was only supposed to be for protos. <_<
Dec 20 17:51:12 <Lantizia> the emmc?
Dec 20 17:51:30 <Sir_Lancelot> hi guys
Dec 20 17:51:34 <GAN900> Yes
Dec 20 17:51:36 <odin_> a single-user-mode / recovery-console would not hurt :)  "init 1" with a statically linked /bin/sh (or busybox)
Dec 20 17:51:43 <jebba> ShadowJK: correct. There is no framebuffer console in default nokia n900 kernel
Dec 20 17:51:50 <Lantizia> GAN900, well I noticed theres a copy of it available... your saying I shouldn't use it?
Dec 20 17:52:26 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Hmm, 27mb give or take of dpkg nonsense
Dec 20 17:52:46 <GAN900> Lantizia, I'm saying it's interesting how it being made available for proto users resulted in many people adding it to the reflash steps. ;)
Dec 20 17:52:48 <Sir_Lancelot> xchat ftw!!!¡¡¡¡!!!
Dec 20 17:52:52 <jebba> ShadowJK: ffmpeg all packaged up.  Uploading to builder  :)
Dec 20 17:53:00 <ShadowJK> jebba, with neon?
Dec 20 17:53:11 <GAN900> odin_, talk to fanoush.
Dec 20 17:53:12 <jebba> yes
Dec 20 17:53:12 <Lantizia> GAN900, well without it you'd have to weed out all the shit you installed to opt
Dec 20 17:53:14 <ShadowJK> hm, wow
Dec 20 17:53:16 <rashed2020> Is the phone app on the N900 replaceable? Can I compile my own version?
Dec 20 17:53:43 <ShadowJK> I should check again if I can make mplayer compile without replacing scratchbox binaries
Dec 20 17:53:48 <jebba> ShadowJK: http://pastebin.ca/1721480
Dec 20 17:53:49 <odin_> its on my list to "look into" once I have reinstalled my workstation (FC12 or something) and got the SDK running, all in the near year, as in a few hours I get on a plane, weeeeeeeee!
Dec 20 17:53:54 <Stskeeps> rashed2020: not open source but make a good argument..
Dec 20 17:54:02 * SpeedEvil is lost in a twisty maze of dbus messages.
Dec 20 17:54:16 <Stskeeps> rashed2020: but it should be possible to use the telepathy stuff through another app
Dec 20 17:54:54 <DocScrutinizer51> GAN900: what's eMMC flash?
Dec 20 17:55:22 <rashed2020> Stskeeps: Not for telepathy. I just want it to append the country code to all incoming numbers even if they were local so they'd properly resolve to my saved contacts since I have all numbers with country codes prefixed. When I look at the call log *some* numbers resolve correctly. I can't find a pattern though.
Dec 20 17:55:50 <Gadgetoid_mbp> I just deleted Xorg, useless rubbish was using up all of my bin dir
Dec 20 17:55:55 <Stskeeps> rashed2020: ah, make a brainstorm
Dec 20 17:56:00 <GAN900> DocScrutinizer51, image to flash to the eMMC
Dec 20 17:56:00 <Stskeeps> Gadgetoid_mbp: ...
Dec 20 17:56:20 <DocScrutinizer51> GAN900: containing?
Dec 20 17:56:23 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Sheet, xchat.launch and mediaplayer.launch are pretty close to the top spots for size in there
Dec 20 17:56:28 <xorAxAx> timeless_mbp: google seems to imply that qtopia has STK support
Dec 20 17:56:30 <Sir_Lancelot> is there a way to explore pc's inside my network?
Dec 20 17:56:31 <Gadgetoid_mbp> And, oh dear, FBReader
Dec 20 17:56:34 <DocScrutinizer51> GAN900: the defualt?
Dec 20 17:56:39 <timeless_mbp> stk?
Dec 20 17:56:39 <jebba> odin_: i can give you an acct on a box with the SDK if you want
Dec 20 17:56:45 <Gadgetoid_mbp> And QTIrreco
Dec 20 17:56:56 <GAN900> DocScrutinizer51, approximately the out of box image
Dec 20 17:57:02 <GAN900> Minus regional stuff
Dec 20 17:57:08 <DocScrutinizer51> k
Dec 20 17:57:09 <xorAxAx> timeless_mbp: Sim application ToolKit
Dec 20 17:57:28 <xorAxAx> timeless_mbp: the stuff i would like to see on maemo
Dec 20 17:57:31 <Sir_Lancelot> is there a way to explore pc's inside my network?
Dec 20 17:57:50 <timeless_mbp> Sir_Lancelot: if they support UPnP :)
Dec 20 17:58:08 <odin_> jebba, that would be useful
Dec 20 17:58:15 <Sir_Lancelot> with which app?
Dec 20 17:58:52 <Gadgetoid_mbp> What the hell is intellisyncd
Dec 20 17:58:56 <Sir_Lancelot> i have a pc with xp sharing a folder with music and stuff inside
Dec 20 17:59:11 <PaulFertser> DocScrutinizer51: eMMC is a special kind of flash designed to be embedded. Provides host with MMC-like interface.
Dec 20 17:59:13 <Sir_Lancelot> and i want to access that folder inside that pc
Dec 20 17:59:36 <Gadgetoid_mbp> you should be using something like twonky media server Sir_Lancelot
Dec 20 17:59:40 <DocScrutinizer51> PaulFertser: that's known. thanks
Dec 20 17:59:55 <Macer> hm
Dec 20 17:59:56 <woglinde> now working on navit
Dec 20 17:59:59 <woglinde> jo maer
Dec 20 18:00:01 <woglinde> args macer
Dec 20 18:00:48 <Aranel> How can I compile sth @ my n900? Without SDK ofc. Someone suggested me to chroot, but i didnt manage to find any man pages about it.
Dec 20 18:01:21 <Sir_Lancelot> i have a pc with xp sharing a folder with music and stuff inside
Dec 20 18:01:26 <Sir_Lancelot> and i want to access that folder inside that pc
Dec 20 18:01:31 <Sir_Lancelot> ????
Dec 20 18:01:42 <Stskeeps> Aranel: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=32772&highlight=qole+chroot+rootstrap
Dec 20 18:01:51 <SpeedEvil> I seem to have misunderstood proc output. ls -l /proc/*/fd/*|grep 124245
Dec 20 18:01:57 <Sir_Lancelot> how can i do it on my n900?
Dec 20 18:01:57 <SpeedEvil> produces one socket mention
Dec 20 18:02:07 <SpeedEvil> aren't sockets in pairs, with the same node on both sides?
Dec 20 18:02:39 * SpeedEvil is looking for where hte GPS data is coming from.
Dec 20 18:04:10 <Aranel> Thanks Stskeeps, anyway Im just curious, why its not possible to use "configure > make > make install" way with Maemo?
Dec 20 18:04:50 <SpeedEvil> Aranel: it is.
Dec 20 18:05:04 <SpeedEvil> Aranel: in principle - it's just nobodies setup an image for it to 'just work'
Dec 20 18:05:06 <SpeedEvil> AIUI
Dec 20 18:05:14 <Stskeeps> Aranel: it is in SDK, but on device you use busybox etc
Dec 20 18:05:29 <Stskeeps> and that breaks -most- autotools based stuff
Dec 20 18:06:24 <izzox1> Hey
Dec 20 18:07:06 <izzox1> I need assistance in intallting ubuntu-N8X0
Dec 20 18:07:11 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Hmm, pretty much everything at this stage likes to live in /usr/bin, yay fun!
Dec 20 18:07:24 <DocScrutinizer51> Lantizia: copy /usr. then 'ln /usr /usr-del; ln -s /home/usr /usr'  Then reboot, pray, and eventually rm -r /usr-del
Dec 20 18:07:28 <izzox1> May somebody help me pliz
Dec 20 18:07:45 <izzox1> ?
Dec 20 18:08:49 <izzox1> Pliz help me people
Dec 20 18:09:26 <Stskeeps> izzox1: chase down b-man and ask him.
Dec 20 18:09:27 <DocScrutinizer51> eeeks
Dec 20 18:10:07 <Aranel> Stskeeps: I think Maemo'll be much more great when this problem and rootfs full problem gone.
Dec 20 18:10:22 <Aranel> Stskeeps: So easy-chroot is the way, isnt it?
Dec 20 18:12:31 <Stskeeps> Aranel: well yeah but you need a special rootstrap
Dec 20 18:13:20 <Shapeshifter> Mh. I can't find what lib to use to get info on battery charge :| looked everywhere. At one point, a "hal battery addon" is mentioned but it's nowhere to be found
Dec 20 18:13:24 <Shapeshifter> Any clues?
Dec 20 18:13:25 <FoggeR> hi!
Dec 20 18:13:32 <FoggeR> i have n900 and today i bought the nokia dc-11 charger..
Dec 20 18:13:43 <FoggeR> and it doest work..
Dec 20 18:13:50 <Sir_Lancelot> i have a pc with xp sharing a folder with music and stuff inside
Dec 20 18:13:54 <Sir_Lancelot> and i want to access that folder inside that pc
Dec 20 18:13:58 <Sir_Lancelot> how can i do it on my n900?
Dec 20 18:14:02 <Sir_Lancelot> ????
Dec 20 18:14:08 <FoggeR> i checked the dmesg and it says "regulator_disable: not in use by this consumer"
Dec 20 18:14:11 <Shapeshifter> Can't find it in libhal, or dbus...
Dec 20 18:14:47 * wazd_n801 thinks we definitely need some #maemo-support channel
Dec 20 18:14:54 <Proteous> lol
Dec 20 18:15:25 <izzox1> Thanks Shapeshifter
Dec 20 18:15:39 <FoggeR> do anyone else have n900 and nokia DC-11 ?..
Dec 20 18:15:41 <Shapeshifter> wazd_n801: usually its easier to move development questions to maemo-dev and leave maemo as the support channel^^
Dec 20 18:15:45 <Shapeshifter> izzox1: what did I do.
Dec 20 18:15:52 <wazd_n801> Sir_Lancelot, n900 automaticaly picks up shared folders via wifi
Dec 20 18:15:53 <oscillik> sorry for the abrupt request, but i'm in need of some help. i'm trying to reflash my n900 (as i'm coming across some problems with Skype) and neither my Windows 7 install, nor my Windows XP install will install the device driver for the N900 (USB ROM) device
Dec 20 18:15:54 <jebba> isn't this maemo-support?  :)
Dec 20 18:15:58 <oscillik> what can i do? :(
Dec 20 18:16:03 <jebba> gnulinux!
Dec 20 18:16:07 <wazd_n801> Sir_Lancelot, just like n8*0
Dec 20 18:16:08 <izzox1> For refering to the rigth person
Dec 20 18:16:29 <MrTratta> hello
Dec 20 18:16:49 <izzox1> I don't see b-man anyways
Dec 20 18:16:57 <Proteous> lol
Dec 20 18:17:01 <izzox1> But  thx for trying to help
Dec 20 18:17:03 <wazd_n801> MrTratta, helloo and welcome!
Dec 20 18:17:20 <redeeman> wazd_n801: shared how?
Dec 20 18:17:29 <wazd_n801> MrTratta, how can we help you this lovely evening?
Dec 20 18:17:42 <MrTratta> I'm happy user of the N900 (and N800)- just lurking around :)
Dec 20 18:17:48 <wazd_n801> redeeman, you know, "shared"
Dec 20 18:17:58 <MrTratta> at first I read lonely evening :)
Dec 20 18:18:03 <redeeman> shared by what? what protocol etc?
Dec 20 18:18:10 <matan> eMMC is much faster than UBIFS for reading. For a 20MB zip file: UBIFS, 1.62s real 1.55s sys    eMMC (ext2): 1.04s real 0.44 sys
Dec 20 18:18:25 <Shapeshifter> this is actually starting to aggravate me >.> Why can't I find any info on how to retrieve battery life using some maemo lib?
Dec 20 18:18:30 <MrTratta> what's hot ?
Dec 20 18:18:32 <Shapeshifter> Can't find any API where it's mentioned
Dec 20 18:18:42 <wazd_n801> redeeman, xp can share folders only one way
Dec 20 18:18:50 <Proteous> SMB
Dec 20 18:18:53 <redeeman> ah so samba?
Dec 20 18:18:56 <Stskeeps> Shapeshifter: hal-device bme
Dec 20 18:18:59 <matan> For a 20MB text file (compresses to 10MB by UBIFS) 1.44 real 1.34 sys
Dec 20 18:19:08 <izzox1> I made some widgets using qtdesigner that i believe could be use to port pidgin to n900
Dec 20 18:19:12 <Proteous> and you have to have the permissions open
Dec 20 18:19:28 <izzox1> But i don't know how to got further
Dec 20 18:19:32 <Stskeeps> matan, weird - performance does seem a bit worse though when mmc is involved
Dec 20 18:19:44 * RST38h moos again
Dec 20 18:19:52 <RST38h> ehlo, Sts, wazd
Dec 20 18:19:56 <wazd_n801> RST38h, remoo
Dec 20 18:20:10 <RST38h> wazd: if you are in the city, should have gone for a walk, it rules
Dec 20 18:20:26 <wazd_n801> RST38h, country)
Dec 20 18:20:28 <RST38h> ah
Dec 20 18:20:48 <wazd_n801> RST38h, Yeah, weather is wonderful
Dec 20 18:20:48 <izzox1> Is anybody familliar with qt ??
Dec 20 18:21:03 <Shapeshifter> Stskeeps: and where's this "hal-device"? googling for things like bme api or things like that yields nothing. And here there's only libhal and libhal-storage and both don't include anything about batteries... http://maemo.org/development/sdks/maemo_5_api_documentation/
Dec 20 18:21:19 <matan> Stskeeps, Did not try on N900 yet, but on N810 boot from internal mmc feels faster.
Dec 20 18:21:31 <wazd_n801> RST38h, http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=37866
Dec 20 18:21:56 <oscillik> please can anyone help?
Dec 20 18:22:07 <Stskeeps> Shapeshifter: try it in root
Dec 20 18:22:15 <Stskeeps> god, we need #maemo-support..
Dec 20 18:22:38 <wazd_n801> oscillik, x64?
Dec 20 18:22:56 <Shapeshifter> Stskeeps: "in root"? I don't even have the device. I just want to read the API for the lib which gives out this info. What do you mean with "in root"?
Dec 20 18:23:08 <oscillik> wazd_n801: i've tried it on my x64 Win7 desktop, and i've just tried it on my 32bit Win7 EeePC - still won't install device drivers
Dec 20 18:23:15 <wazd_n801> oscillik, you need virtual x86 machine to  flash then
Dec 20 18:23:18 <Stskeeps> Shapeshifter: i meant x terminal. either way, lshal | grep battery on your laptop.
Dec 20 18:23:26 <Shapeshifter> Stskeeps: well I know that.
Dec 20 18:23:33 <oscillik> wazd_n801: i just tried it on a real x86 machine
Dec 20 18:23:37 <RST38h> wazd: well, you have got 10 potential customers
Dec 20 18:23:38 <oscillik> still the same thing
Dec 20 18:23:40 <MrTratta> I recently had a look at pymaemo on my n900 - quite cool. I was wondering what thing, I'm I the only one having problems with the module abook (i.e. missing from the repositories/pymaemo bindings) ?
Dec 20 18:23:40 <Shapeshifter> Stskeeps: but when writing something in C or so it hardly makes sense to use external shell commands
Dec 20 18:23:42 <Stskeeps> and if you want battery info, ask HAL
Dec 20 18:23:54 <RST38h> wazd: convertion rates from potential to real hover somewhere in 2-5% range
Dec 20 18:24:14 <wazd_n801> RST38h, ehehe :(
Dec 20 18:24:33 <RST38h> wazd: And the number is taken from my site logs
Dec 20 18:24:37 <Sir_Lancelot> i have a pc with xp sharing a folder with music and stuff inside
Dec 20 18:24:41 <Sir_Lancelot> and i want to access that folder inside that pc
Dec 20 18:24:45 <Sir_Lancelot> how can i do it on my n900?
Dec 20 18:24:47 <Sir_Lancelot> ????
Dec 20 18:24:59 <wazd_n801> RST38h, damn, that sucks(
Dec 20 18:25:23 <RST38h> besides, for $5/apiece user support becomes prohibitively expensive
Dec 20 18:25:28 <rashed2020> Sir_Lancelot: My N900 found my Tversity server and streamed perfectly if that's what you want to do.
Dec 20 18:25:40 <Proteous> Sir_Lancelot: you have to have the permissions set to be read by everyone
Dec 20 18:26:04 <wazd_n801> RST38h, ok, gamedev sucks)
Dec 20 18:26:06 <Proteous> the filebrowser will find it if you are connected to the network
Dec 20 18:26:14 <dev> Sir_Lancelot: not all things get better by repeating - install an UPnP server on your PC and you are done
Dec 20 18:26:16 <Sir_Lancelot> but my n900 can't even see the pc with sahred folders
Dec 20 18:26:39 <Sir_Lancelot> filebrowser????
Dec 20 18:26:52 <Stskeeps> Sir_Lancelot: no samba in fremantle.
Dec 20 18:27:08 <Sir_Lancelot> it's already installed, dev
Dec 20 18:27:20 <Stskeeps> as in, it's not included in the default UI
Dec 20 18:27:45 <jebba> no SMB/CIF in kernel either
Dec 20 18:27:50 <wazd_n801> RST38h, but at least it was romantic idea)
Dec 20 18:28:07 <Stskeeps> jebba: not sure it ever was though
Dec 20 18:28:08 <RST38h> wazd: there are several semi-solution to that
Dec 20 18:28:15 <FoggeR> .. where hell are the "edit" button @forums?...
Dec 20 18:28:17 <RST38h> solutions, sorry
Dec 20 18:28:29 <dev> Sir_Lancelot: then there are several options - no multicast routing on your network, a firewall on your xp,...
Dec 20 18:28:32 <wazd_n801> RST38h, ad support?)
Dec 20 18:28:35 <RST38h> wazd: 1) as at least $9.99 per copy
Dec 20 18:28:46 <RST38h> ask, shit, I can no longer tupe right
Dec 20 18:28:52 <oscillik> can anyone offer any help please?
Dec 20 18:28:53 <Sir_Lancelot> is there an explorer that would let broswse through all pc,s shared inside my personal local network?
Dec 20 18:28:57 <jebba> Stskeeps: i have no clue pre-fremantle. I've only had this thing 18 days so far  ;)
Dec 20 18:29:11 <RST38h> wazd: 2) make an engine, then start releasing games based on the same engine, only changing artwork and some logic
Dec 20 18:29:20 <GAN900> #maemo-support indeed. Yeesh
Dec 20 18:29:31 <wazd_n801> RST38h, yeah, that was my idea)
Dec 20 18:29:31 <dev> Sir_Lancelot: http://coherence-project.org/wiki/UPnP-Inspector
Dec 20 18:29:41 <RST38h> wazd: 3) start selling in-game items
Dec 20 18:29:46 <jebba> oscillik: try with gnulinux.
Dec 20 18:30:09 <jebba> odin_: SDK set up for you.  I emailed details.
Dec 20 18:30:09 <wazd_n801> RST38h, well,  that will work for online games
Dec 20 18:30:10 <matan> smbfs module here: http://my.arava.co.il/~matan/770/n900/smbfs.ko mount still missing.
Dec 20 18:30:25 <wazd_n801> RST38h, like shooters
Dec 20 18:30:31 <RST38h> wazd: not necessarily
Dec 20 18:30:53 <wazd_n801> RST38h, everything else can be cracked)
Dec 20 18:30:54 <odin_> back in a few hours going mobile
Dec 20 18:30:57 <RST38h> wazd: See, what you sell is basically an integer that is a solution to some equation, differing from one user to the other
Dec 20 18:31:07 <RST38h> wazd: Do not need online for that
Dec 20 18:31:15 <jebba> matan: that module won't work either though:  "FATAL: Error inserting smbfs (/lib/modules/2.6.28-omap1/smbfs.ko): Unknown symbol in module, or unknown parameter (see dmesg)"     most likely at least. You tried it?
Dec 20 18:31:37 <RST38h> wazd: of course everything can be cracked, but as long as it is not easily cracked, you have got some market for it
Dec 20 18:31:43 <FoggeR> really, does that community site have edit button for posts?...
Dec 20 18:31:52 <matan> jebba: It inserted on my N900.
Dec 20 18:32:15 <matan> jebba: What symbols are missing?
Dec 20 18:32:16 <Gadgetoid_mbp> http://forums.internettablettalk.com/showpost.php?p=428137&postcount=167 hum
Dec 20 18:32:32 <jebba> matan: were you using the stock kernel or one you rebuilt?
Dec 20 18:35:25 <wazd_n801> RST38h, my thought was: or super-simple puzzles for 1-2 bucks or real console-grade rpg/arcades for 10-20-30 bucks
Dec 20 18:35:28 <MrTratta> I got a upnp server running on my computer (coherence [-python]) and I don't think my n900 can see it either
Dec 20 18:35:42 <matan> jebba: One that I rebuilt, but only changes in config are in network area, should not affect file systems. This kernel was compiled with smbfs disabled, and the module was enabled and compiled later.
Dec 20 18:36:01 <wazd_n801> RST38h, you can also sell addons
Dec 20 18:36:16 <RST38h> wazd: As I said, anything <$10 does not pay off =(
Dec 20 18:36:29 <RST38h> You have to sell hundreds of these
Dec 20 18:36:49 <jebba> matan: if you try that module in a stock kernel it won't insert and will give the error pasted above.
Dec 20 18:36:59 <RST38h> wazd: As to console-grade rpg or arcade, who is going to have time to work on this?
Dec 20 18:37:03 <wazd_n801> RST38h, well, noone will buy tetris for 10 bucks)
Dec 20 18:37:34 <jebba> matan: same is true for modules like NAT.
Dec 20 18:37:34 <Lantizia> matan, I love you... I love you so much
Dec 20 18:37:43 <Lantizia> matan, how new is that module? lol - been after that
Dec 20 18:37:44 <matan> jebba: I am not sure you are correct. What are the errors displayed in dmesg?
Dec 20 18:37:45 <dev> MrTratta: I've 'only' a 810, but that's working fine here
Dec 20 18:37:47 <RST38h> wazd: true
Dec 20 18:37:55 <RST38h> wazd: so it should be something new, not another tetris
Dec 20 18:38:06 <RST38h> something addictive and with cool graphics
Dec 20 18:38:19 <wazd_n801> RST38h, pentetris! :D
Dec 20 18:38:39 <matan> jebba: nat is very different. Enabling it changes the kernel ABI (some structs that modules use become larger) so you can't mix. There is no such problem with smbfs or cifs.
Dec 20 18:39:14 <wazd_n801> RST38h, what about that multitask game?
Dec 20 18:39:23 <RST38h> wazd: which ones?
Dec 20 18:39:24 <jebba> matan: ok, try it with stock kernel.
Dec 20 18:39:38 <SpeedEvil> wazd_n801: As I noted on talk - I'm unlikely to purchase many games. A decent port of nethack maybe :)
Dec 20 18:39:44 <matan> I just found that included mount works with cifs: http://my.arava.co.il/~matan/770/n900/cifs.ko
Dec 20 18:39:48 <jebba> matan: see: http://www.freemoe.org/users/jebba/kernel/modules/TESTS/modprobe-test.log
Dec 20 18:40:18 <wazd_n801> SpeedEvil, vulture's eye, free
Dec 20 18:40:30 <jebba> matan:  those tests are done against a stock kernel
Dec 20 18:40:41 <jebba> with those modules enabled
Dec 20 18:40:59 <wazd_n801> RST38h, http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&ct=res&cd=1&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.kongregate.com%2Fgames%2FIcyLime%2Fmultitask&ei=n28uS6mKGZrumgPx6Yz1CA&usg=AFQjCNFl1yVxeACslxAP-56hocUWAQ5x3A&sig2=EYp5-TWSsGTmw3Wb4rxGHQ
Dec 20 18:41:06 <wazd_n801> meh
Dec 20 18:41:13 <wazd_n801> sorry)
Dec 20 18:41:58 <SpeedEvil> wazd_n801: I hate it, it's useless.
Dec 20 18:42:08 <matan> jebba: The messages tell you "see dmesg", where there are more verbose error messages. And those modules are different. Enabling those modules changes the kernel image as well. Enabling cifs does not change the kernel.
Dec 20 18:42:23 <wazd_n801> SpeedEvil, VE?
Dec 20 18:42:32 <SpeedEvil> yes
Dec 20 18:42:41 <SpeedEvil> I find it utterly unsuable, compared to text
Dec 20 18:42:56 <wazd_n801> SpeedEvil, meh :D
Dec 20 18:43:28 * ShadowJK whines whine whines: garage is slow
Dec 20 18:43:42 <SpeedEvil> This may or may not make me somewhat strange.
Dec 20 18:43:53 <jebba> matan: cifs and smbfs were tested too.  I'm just suggesting you try them with a stock kernel.....
Dec 20 18:44:03 <Proteous> ohb it does
Dec 20 18:44:20 <Aranel> E: Scratchbox login found but not executable by user.
Dec 20 18:44:32 <Lantizia> wazd_n801, i love that game :D you've got me hooked
Dec 20 18:44:44 <Aranel> i did adduser -G sbox aranel
Dec 20 18:44:45 <wazd_n801> Lantizia, yeah
Dec 20 18:44:49 <matan> jebba: I don't have a second N900, so changing to a kernel I can't use is out of the question.
Dec 20 18:44:49 <Aranel> so it should work :/
Dec 20 18:44:51 <Lantizia> so do either of these smbfs/cifs.ko modules work with stock N900?
Dec 20 18:45:01 <Proteous> Lantizia was eaten by a grue
Dec 20 18:45:09 <Lantizia> I'd test it on mine but I bricked mine an hour ago lol
Dec 20 18:45:13 <Lantizia> need to reflash hehe
Dec 20 18:45:17 <matan> Lantizia: Try cifs.ko and tell me.
Dec 20 18:45:20 <jebba> matan: ok. Just letting you know  ;)
Dec 20 18:45:22 <wazd_n801> RST38h, see?) Proper port will rock)
Dec 20 18:45:28 <Lantizia> matan, ok will in a bit when I've reflashed
Dec 20 18:45:39 <Lantizia> matan, is it -meant- to work with it?  i.e. was it compiled for the right kernel?
Dec 20 18:45:40 <jebba> anyone got a stock kernel that can test matan's .kos?
Dec 20 18:46:08 <wazd_n801> RST38h, with shiny visuals and powerups)
Dec 20 18:48:46 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Well I've started by symlinking off icons as it's always a fatty and is currently bugged
Dec 20 18:49:32 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Not too bad, just a little sluggish reading the icon cache
Dec 20 18:49:41 <SpeedEvil> wazd_n801:
Dec 20 18:49:55 <SpeedEvil> i think apps are probably better for most sole devs than games
Dec 20 18:50:10 <matan> Lantizia: It is supposed to work with a standard kernel.
Dec 20 18:50:12 <Gadgetoid_mbp> A game is a lot of work
Dec 20 18:50:33 <wazd_n801> SpeedEvil, you think wrong :D
Dec 20 18:50:34 <SpeedEvil> Unless it's a really trivial game
Dec 20 18:50:58 <SpeedEvil> wazd_n801: I mean from a time in to cash out ratio
Dec 20 18:51:37 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Icons dir go boom, from 88% of munched root to  85%
Dec 20 18:52:10 <Gadgetoid_mbp> microb-engine tut tut :D
Dec 20 18:53:28 <timeless> does anyone here have stopish installed (from testing)?
Dec 20 18:53:50 <wazd_n801> SpeedEvil, will not work for linux
Dec 20 18:54:07 <wazd_n801> SpeedEvil, 99%  apps are free
Dec 20 18:54:08 <RST38h> wazd: could you give me direct url? (can't cut&paste multilines)
Dec 20 18:54:33 <Stskeeps> wazd_n801: maemo's a different ballgame though.. not that many people will be oss freaks
Dec 20 18:54:53 <SpeedEvil> wazd_n801: yes, and no.
Dec 20 18:55:04 <wazd_n801> RST38h, http://www.kongregate.com/games/IcyLime/multitask
Dec 20 18:55:17 <RST38h> aha
Dec 20 18:55:34 <SpeedEvil> wazd_n801: deliver polished app for my desires, and
Dec 20 18:55:36 * timeless is going to miss the beginning of spiderman3 :(
Dec 20 18:55:43 <SpeedEvil> I may be wqilling to pay.
Dec 20 18:56:02 * Gadgetoid_mbp does mv microb-engine /home/reclaim/usr/share
Dec 20 18:56:04 <SpeedEvil> wazd_n801: even if there is a free alternative that sort-of-works
Dec 20 18:56:38 <timeless> gadgetoid: you understand it's used by conversations and friends, right?
Dec 20 18:57:01 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Yes, I had the sense to symlink it
Dec 20 18:57:07 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Microb still works
Dec 20 18:57:09 <SpeedEvil> i may be unique of course.
Dec 20 18:57:20 * timeless shrugs
Dec 20 18:57:22 <Lantizia>   why not just symlink the entirity of /usr !?
Dec 20 18:57:25 * SpeedEvil is currently typing with gloveslk so suffe3ring intermitternt re3turn
Dec 20 18:57:30 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Things are just a little bit sluggish
Dec 20 18:57:32 <Lantizia> ln -s /home/usr /usr
Dec 20 18:57:42 <dreamer_> look what I just found :) http://www.maemonokian900.com/maemo-news/ogre-3d-with-opengles-render-system/
Dec 20 18:57:44 <Gadgetoid_mbp> MIght esplode Lantizia, I'm playing it safe
Dec 20 18:57:53 <Gadgetoid_mbp> The phone can boot without microb-engine :D
Dec 20 18:57:55 <Lantizia> lol ok
Dec 20 18:58:00 <timeless> lantizia: some parts of usr are *probably* needed before /home is mounted
Dec 20 18:58:08 <Lantizia> timeless, like?
Dec 20 18:58:10 <Gadgetoid_mbp> But, by god, canola is essential
Dec 20 18:58:15 * timeless shrugs
Dec 20 18:58:20 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Who the fuck knows, Lantizia, linux is a mess
Dec 20 18:58:24 <Lantizia> hehe
Dec 20 18:58:35 <Lantizia> well when I reflash I'm trying to move usr again - the whole thing lol
Dec 20 18:58:46 <Gadgetoid_mbp> You've moved the whole thing then?
Dec 20 18:58:55 <Lantizia> I will try once I reflash
Dec 20 18:59:03 <Gadgetoid_mbp> I find that moving things to /home introduces a performance hit on first load
Dec 20 18:59:06 <Lantizia> i did things in the wrong order before hehe
Dec 20 18:59:18 * timeless looks for the reflect themer
Dec 20 18:59:31 <Gadgetoid_mbp> OF apps, that is, not the system itself
Dec 20 18:59:35 <Lantizia> how can I test the front camera?
Dec 20 18:59:52 <timeless> lantizia: "mirror"
Dec 20 18:59:52 <Gadgetoid_mbp> camwhore :P
Dec 20 19:00:03 <SpeedEvil> Lantizia: 'mirror'] in extrras-devel
Dec 20 19:00:08 <Lantizia> theres an app called mirror eh?
Dec 20 19:00:08 <timeless> but don't expect stellar results
Dec 20 19:00:09 <Lantizia> ok
Dec 20 19:00:10 <SpeedEvil> Lantizia: or mp0layer -tv
Dec 20 19:00:13 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Nao! It might not be optified
Dec 20 19:00:19 <SpeedEvil> ; mp
Dec 20 19:00:24 <SpeedEvil> mplayer tv
Dec 20 19:00:27 <SpeedEvil> argh
Dec 20 19:00:56 <SpeedEvil> mplayer tv:// -tv device=/dev/video1 -fps 25
Dec 20 19:01:02 <SpeedEvil> or similar
Dec 20 19:03:13 <RST38h> wazd: for some reason, I am not impressed with the game =(
Dec 20 19:03:21 <RST38h> maybe simply not my type...
Dec 20 19:03:31 <wazd_n801> RST38h, maybe)
Dec 20 19:03:50 <Lantizia> im hungry... anyone fancy pizza?
Dec 20 19:04:02 <wazd_n801> RST38h, looks like we've found the engine)
Dec 20 19:04:13 <RST38h> wazd: Ogre?
Dec 20 19:04:19 <ShadowJK> wtf doesn't tmo allow .patch files
Dec 20 19:04:21 <wazd_n801> RST38h, yep
Dec 20 19:04:29 <RST38h> wazd: well, dunno...
Dec 20 19:04:33 * timeless is enjoying chinese food
Dec 20 19:04:54 <RST38h> afaik, ogre is some very oss engine that nobody ever wrote a playable game with
Dec 20 19:04:58 <RST38h> may be worng of course
Dec 20 19:06:04 <wazd_n801> RST38h, well, at least we can try to make some super simple sokoban for test
Dec 20 19:06:46 <RST38h> 3d sokoban?
Dec 20 19:06:47 * timeless is enjoying chinese food
Dec 20 19:08:17 <wazd_n801> RST38h, why not?)
Dec 20 19:08:35 <wazd_n801> timeless_mbp, you've already said that)
Dec 20 19:08:37 <siriusnova> you know after playing with an android phone for the day
Dec 20 19:08:39 <Gadgetoid_mbp> timeless: I envy you, I wanted to order a curry
Dec 20 19:08:40 <siriusnova> its amazing how locked down it is
Dec 20 19:08:44 <siriusnova> and how open my N900 feels
Dec 20 19:08:56 <jebba> matan: if you get an answer from someone running a stock kernel can you let me know how it goes either way? thx  :)
Dec 20 19:09:17 <Gadgetoid_mbp> siriusnova: android can be rooted to, but it's not quite so simple as sudo gainroot
Dec 20 19:09:34 <Gadgetoid_mbp> s/to/penis
Dec 20 19:09:39 <timeless> wazd: finger slipped on my n900
Dec 20 19:09:44 <joppu> timeless_mbp: I am the reflect themer
Dec 20 19:09:44 <siriusnova> Gadgetoit - yeah
Dec 20 19:09:46 <SpeedEvil> n900 has many closed parts. But the 'normal' dev doesn't really hit them.
Dec 20 19:09:53 <RST38h> wazd: dunno...
Dec 20 19:09:54 <timeless> up and enter are too close together
Dec 20 19:10:06 <Gadgetoid_mbp> true timeless
Dec 20 19:10:11 <timeless> joppu: install stopish
Dec 20 19:10:16 <Gadgetoid_mbp> but at least it's not a Motorola droid
Dec 20 19:10:22 <wazd_n801> RST38h, well, snake?)
Dec 20 19:10:24 <timeless> gadgetoid: it hits me at least once per irc session
Dec 20 19:10:37 <joppu> timeless: on my nonexistent N900?
Dec 20 19:10:40 <siriusnova> you know with a google android phone the amount of data i give to google is kid of scary
Dec 20 19:10:47 <siriusnova> if google turned evil, id be in a world of hurt
Dec 20 19:10:49 <siriusnova> :O
Dec 20 19:10:56 <Gadgetoid_mbp> timeless: could be worse in a terminal session
Dec 20 19:11:03 <RST38h> wazd: Nokia already has 3d snake =)
Dec 20 19:11:23 <timeless> nope
Dec 20 19:11:29 <timeless> erp
Dec 20 19:11:29 <wazd_n801> RST38h, not on n900 :)
Dec 20 19:11:40 <timeless> erp
Dec 20 19:11:46 <Gadgetoid_mbp> erp
Dec 20 19:11:59 <RST38h> wazd: well maybe...
Dec 20 19:12:03 <wazd_n801> bark
Dec 20 19:12:16 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Sometimes I wonder if you actually play a part in MicroB other than overseeing the thousand monkeys and keeping their typewriter ribbons up to scratch
Dec 20 19:12:58 <joppu> timeless: It should be on the way from the repairs, I have the package tracking code and all
Dec 20 19:13:17 <joppu> but what's up with all these macbook users?
Dec 20 19:13:39 <Gadgetoid_mbp> joppu: 13" mbp is god
Dec 20 19:13:47 <timeless> it's the only good hardware out there
Dec 20 19:13:58 <fnordianslip> ou can tell i'm using a macbookpro due to the missing characters :)
Dec 20 19:14:13 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Also, paying 5x more for a laptop makes me feel better about myself
Dec 20 19:14:43 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Anyone who thinks Macs are expensive need only witness the gloriousness of the 27" iMac
Dec 20 19:14:44 <wolf^> RST38h, torchlight uses ogre and is very playable
Dec 20 19:14:56 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Shit, am I arguing with myself again?
Dec 20 19:14:58 <naxxatoe> well, i love my mbp, its a beautiful maschine, very slim and lightweight with decent hardware
Dec 20 19:14:59 <wazd_n801> RST38h, it's 3d, it's simple and  I WANT REVENGE!!!
Dec 20 19:15:08 <naxxatoe> and ever since the intel switch, i can run what i want on it
Dec 20 19:15:11 <joppu> *insert the obligatory argument about overpricing*
Dec 20 19:15:12 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Do you cuddle it naxxatoe?
Dec 20 19:15:27 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Cheers joppu... I almost feared for my sanity again there
Dec 20 19:15:30 <timeless> employer pays
Dec 20 19:15:39 <wazd_n801> I want to make snake game for free!
Dec 20 19:15:42 <naxxatoe> if i wouldnt care about the looks, i would have gotten a thinkpad as they have decent hardware
Dec 20 19:15:44 <Gadgetoid_mbp> alright for some
Dec 20 19:15:45 <wazd_n801> haaaahaha!
Dec 20 19:15:46 <naxxatoe> and are robust aswell
Dec 20 19:15:46 <luke-jr_> wazd_n801: so do it
Dec 20 19:15:50 <naxxatoe> Gadgetoid_mbp: only when i get cold
Dec 20 19:16:01 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Hahaha naxxatoe, too right
Dec 20 19:16:08 <naxxatoe> ;)
Dec 20 19:16:12 <joppu> timeless: so, did you have anything else to say to me, other than installing stopish?
Dec 20 19:16:22 <Gadgetoid_mbp> I don't honestly believe they get hotter than any other brand of laptops, though, it's just a matter of fact that aluminium is more thermally conductive than plastic
Dec 20 19:16:35 <naxxatoe> yup
Dec 20 19:16:40 <Gadgetoid_mbp> And I've had my bollocks burnt by plenty a windows laptop anyway
Dec 20 19:16:43 <naxxatoe> i was crunching some numbers yesterday
Dec 20 19:16:45 <wazd_n801> luke-jr_, as you can see - we're working on thatt)
Dec 20 19:16:54 <naxxatoe> 85 degrees on cpu+gpu
Dec 20 19:17:01 <naxxatoe> its a nice compact heater
Dec 20 19:17:03 <naxxatoe> ;)
Dec 20 19:17:05 <Gadgetoid_mbp> That'll see you through winter
Dec 20 19:17:15 <naxxatoe> also: you can cook when you turn it upside down
Dec 20 19:17:26 <naxxatoe> something like eggs on the unibody ones
Dec 20 19:17:27 <wazd_n801> RST38h, also, gamedev is a good reason for me to learn goddammn 3d  modellg :)
Dec 20 19:17:32 <Gadgetoid_mbp> We took the radiator out of one end of our living room and replaced it with an iMac
Dec 20 19:17:41 <naxxatoe> nice one
Dec 20 19:18:10 <Gadgetoid_mbp> wazd_n801: trying to take on both programming and content creation might learn ya something, but you'll never finish a game :D
Dec 20 19:18:11 * sivang uses cold and  silent AMD machines. Votes for non lockdown solutions
Dec 20 19:18:24 <timeless> just install it
Dec 20 19:18:25 <naxxatoe> i bought myself a new mbp 13" for christmas, the one with 4gig ram and ssd 09
Dec 20 19:18:28 <timeless> you'll see
Dec 20 19:18:29 <naxxatoe> =)
Dec 20 19:18:29 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Unless you make Sphere Racer, in which case the player models are... uh... spheres
Dec 20 19:18:45 <Gadgetoid_mbp> I want 8gb RAM in my mbp, it pages out like a motherfscker
Dec 20 19:18:51 <naxxatoe> Gadgetoid_mbp: bounce  (from ovi store)
Dec 20 19:18:57 <naxxatoe> Gadgetoid_mbp: true
Dec 20 19:19:11 <RST38h> wazd: not a good idea to learn it on n900
Dec 20 19:19:13 <naxxatoe> Gadgetoid_mbp: since i run linux on mine, this is bearable
Dec 20 19:19:19 <RST38h> wazd: it is not powerful enough for decent 3d
Dec 20 19:19:26 <RST38h> but will do some
Dec 20 19:19:48 <Gadgetoid_mbp> 24 days uptime, 68.02gb of page outs
Dec 20 19:19:52 <sivang> so which repo should I enable to have that damn osso-xterm available for install on the SDK ? :)
Dec 20 19:20:20 <joppu> timeless: but my N900 is on the way from the repairs so I currently do not have it in my hands.
Dec 20 19:20:35 <wazd_n801> RST38h, well, low-poly modelling is a good start I guess
Dec 20 19:20:45 <timeless> on my > in my
Dec 20 19:20:50 <johnq> is someone willing to port this debian package to the n900: http://packages.debian.org/de/lenny/sgt-puzzles ?
Dec 20 19:21:00 <johnq> these are really cool games
Dec 20 19:21:08 <luke-jr_> I want 1 GB RAM on a handheld <.<
Dec 20 19:21:09 <naxxatoe> iodine would be a nice port aswell
Dec 20 19:21:14 <naxxatoe> for dns tunneling ;)
Dec 20 19:21:27 <phreck> heh
Dec 20 19:21:31 <johnsq> luke-jr_: use better software
Dec 20 19:21:40 <joppu> timeless: ok, whatever, I'll install it once I have the actual device.
Dec 20 19:21:47 <luke-jr_> johnsq: better software does not exist
Dec 20 19:21:51 <phreck> aircrack-ng seems to be working
Dec 20 19:22:03 <naxxatoe> phreck: nice one
Dec 20 19:22:07 <melmoth> sivang: one of those http://pastebin.com/m63f0f60c
Dec 20 19:22:23 <luke-jr_> johnsq: it will be a decade before I have enough children trained to program capable of writing replacements for everything sucky
Dec 20 19:22:25 <phreck> if we can get msf going it would be pretty awesome
Dec 20 19:22:27 <Gadgetoid_mbp> I want 1 GB RAM in a handheld
Dec 20 19:22:51 <phreck> so get an N900
Dec 20 19:22:55 <sivang> Gadgetoid_mbp: use better software, see google-chrome :)
Dec 20 19:23:00 <johnsq> luke-jr_: lol, make more childs. with 12 they are good developers
Dec 20 19:23:02 <luke-jr_> phreck: N900 has 256 MB RAM, 1/4 of that
Dec 20 19:23:10 <luke-jr_> johnsq: like I said, that will take a decade.
Dec 20 19:23:13 <sivang> it turned my netbook back to a development machine ! :)
Dec 20 19:23:16 <Gadgetoid_mbp> sivang: I use too much software
Dec 20 19:23:21 <phreck> ahaha dont forget about the vram
Dec 20 19:23:25 <luke-jr_> johnsq: and even in a decade, probably only 7 or so will be decent enough coders
Dec 20 19:23:34 <luke-jr_> phreck: swap is not RAM
Dec 20 19:23:36 <phreck> im on my n900@now. i know the specs
Dec 20 19:23:36 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Wrong phreck  is wrong
Dec 20 19:23:54 <naxxatoe> Gadgetoid_mbp: actually he is right
Dec 20 19:23:57 <naxxatoe> swap is not ramm
Dec 20 19:24:02 <phreck> oh. trolls. nm.
Dec 20 19:24:03 <naxxatoe> no matter how you twist and turn it
Dec 20 19:24:08 <luke-jr_> naxxatoe: phreck is the one saying it is RAM
Dec 20 19:24:25 <phreck> lolsauce
Dec 20 19:24:28 <Gadgetoid_mbp> *facepalm*
Dec 20 19:24:29 <naxxatoe> unless your swap is a partition in your ram (using ramfs or so)
Dec 20 19:24:31 <phreck> calm down girls
Dec 20 19:24:32 <naxxatoe> but i dont see that
Dec 20 19:24:41 <Gadgetoid_mbp> naxxatoe: wouldn't that be the most irrelevant thing ever?
Dec 20 19:24:47 <naxxatoe> true
Dec 20 19:24:51 <Gadgetoid_mbp> swap in RAM, for extra fast swap...
Dec 20 19:24:52 <naxxatoe> but it would be good fun ;)
Dec 20 19:24:54 <luke-jr_> while calling it 'memory' might avoid the false advertising lawsuit, calling it 'RAM' is blatently false advertising
Dec 20 19:25:01 <luke-jr_> Gadgetoid_mbp: actually, no
Dec 20 19:25:09 <luke-jr_> Linux 2.6.33 adds support for swap in RAM
Dec 20 19:25:13 <Gadgetoid_mbp> What happens if your RAM gets swapped into swap, does your swap get swapped into swap because it's in ram?
Dec 20 19:25:13 <luke-jr_> compressed
Dec 20 19:25:25 <naxxatoe> true
Dec 20 19:25:34 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Ooo, compressed... RAM + multicore + compression > disk
Dec 20 19:25:36 <naxxatoe> but that cuts performance
Dec 20 19:25:43 <Stskeeps> RAM is random access memory, no matter if it's virtual or not
Dec 20 19:25:43 <Stskeeps> :P
Dec 20 19:25:45 <phreck> o other phones use swap?
Dec 20 19:26:03 <luke-jr_> Stskeeps: per that literal definition, every hard disk is RAM
Dec 20 19:26:09 <sivang> just for those with the craving for the hardware, could you believe this is my development machine? http://www.netbookchoice.com/2009/09/07/hp-compaq-mini-311c-ion-powered-11-6�-netbook/
Dec 20 19:26:18 <sivang> and I do Zope/Plone development on it as well...
Dec 20 19:26:25 <phreck> no, every hard disk can be usedc as such
Dec 20 19:26:27 <Gadgetoid_mbp> sivang: Pain, pain, PAIN
Dec 20 19:26:31 <naxxatoe> i develop on a eeepc 8(first generation)
Dec 20 19:26:33 <sivang> Gadgetoid_mbp: why pain ?
Dec 20 19:26:33 <naxxatoe> look that up
Dec 20 19:26:35 <luke-jr_> sivang: obviously it depends on how much swap you configure
Dec 20 19:26:38 <naxxatoe> should be the 701 model
Dec 20 19:26:45 <naxxatoe> no more comments ;)
Dec 20 19:26:52 <jebba> hmm, the pulseaudio site doesn't have a mention of portaudio and the portaudio site doesn't have a mention of pulseaudio....  Anyone know if portaudio can be a happy client of pulseaudio on n900?
Dec 20 19:26:52 <Gadgetoid_mbp> sivang: I envy your tolerance for pain, but I can barely work on a 1920x1200 display much less anything else
Dec 20 19:27:01 <luke-jr_> sivang: swap is not hardware, you can configure it however you want on any device
Dec 20 19:27:07 <Gadgetoid_mbp> I even find 2560*1440 small now
Dec 20 19:27:11 <sivang> luke-jr_: i know :)
Dec 20 19:27:17 <phreck> with the amount of physical ram in most machines now, swap doesnt get used.
Dec 20 19:27:25 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Then again, I'm patently unorganised and my desktop looks like linux sneezed on it
Dec 20 19:27:26 <sivang> Gadgetoid_mbp: hehe, I have no problems with small displays, I dig you man.
Dec 20 19:27:34 <sivang> phreck++
Dec 20 19:27:35 <naxxatoe> 6** by 480
Dec 20 19:27:38 <naxxatoe> no more comments
Dec 20 19:27:38 <luke-jr_> phreck: not true
Dec 20 19:27:41 <sivang> I have 2gigs ram on this baby
Dec 20 19:27:49 <luke-jr_> 2 GB RAM is nothing
Dec 20 19:27:49 <naxxatoe> 1 gig on my eee
Dec 20 19:27:53 <luke-jr_> I regularly use 5 GB memory
Dec 20 19:28:02 <sivang> luke-jr_: what are you doing ?
Dec 20 19:28:07 <luke-jr_> sivang: just usual stuff
Dec 20 19:28:07 <phreck> for a desktop nix machine 2gigs is fine
Dec 20 19:28:09 <naxxatoe> but my linux from scratch runs fast as hell
Dec 20 19:28:10 <Gadgetoid_mbp> My biggest gripe with the 13" MBP was its slightly smaller display resolution
Dec 20 19:28:11 <eitreach> using Windows.
Dec 20 19:28:21 <luke-jr_> sivang: my system is 64-bit tho
Dec 20 19:28:25 <eitreach> ..alright, that was cheap. I'ma leave again.
Dec 20 19:28:26 <luke-jr_> so everything uses 2x as much
Dec 20 19:28:39 <sivang> luke-jr_: define "useful stuff"
Dec 20 19:28:51 <phreck> lol
Dec 20 19:28:53 <luke-jr_> sivang: browsers, text editors, IRC, etc
Dec 20 19:28:54 <sivang> luke-jr_: I can assure you the SDK runs beautifully on this little machine
Dec 20 19:28:55 <johnsq> luke-jr_: use 64bit pointer compression
Dec 20 19:29:05 <luke-jr_> 160 processes atm
Dec 20 19:29:09 <luke-jr_> johnsq: joke?
Dec 20 19:29:14 <phreck> you use five gigs on that trash?
Dec 20 19:29:14 <sivang> luke-jr_: I see
Dec 20 19:29:26 <luke-jr_> phreck: it would help if I stopped using Facebook and paying bills
Dec 20 19:29:28 <johnsq> luke-jr_: no really is a llvm project
Dec 20 19:29:30 <sivang> luke-jr_: how much ram can vim take ? :)
Dec 20 19:29:33 <luke-jr_> Firefox alone uses 200 MB
Dec 20 19:29:39 <phreck> heh
Dec 20 19:29:46 <phreck> whatever.
Dec 20 19:29:52 <luke-jr_> wait, no
Dec 20 19:29:53 <luke-jr_> 388 MB
Dec 20 19:29:54 <jebba> dont feed the troll
Dec 20 19:29:55 <phreck> later kids. idle time
Dec 20 19:30:04 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Hungry troll is hungry
Dec 20 19:30:09 <sivang> luke-jr_: use chrome :) firefox used to bring this netbook down, but when I tossed it switched to chrome all my problems are solved and it is functioning as a desktop replacement
Dec 20 19:30:21 * luke-jr_ wonders wtf knotify4 is doing with 238 MB memory
Dec 20 19:30:34 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Chrome is somewhat lacking Firebug
Dec 20 19:30:35 <luke-jr_> sivang: I use Konqueror. But Facebook and bill sites are too broken :(
Dec 20 19:30:36 <lcuk> notifying you about LOTS of things
Dec 20 19:30:50 <phreck> lcuk haha
Dec 20 19:30:56 <sivang> oh well, I guess i'm just for minimalistic computing :)
Dec 20 19:31:02 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Chrome isn't so hot for debugging ajax
Dec 20 19:31:06 <luke-jr_> sivang: Chrome isn't that minimal
Dec 20 19:31:15 <sivang> Gadgetoid_mbp: true
Dec 20 19:31:23 <phreck> neither is konq...
Dec 20 19:31:23 <luke-jr_> Chrome uses GTK. :(
Dec 20 19:31:25 <sivang> Gadgetoid_mbp: there's nothing like firebug, and it's still only a firefox thing.
Dec 20 19:31:27 <SpeedEvil> FF is potentially getting better - for a _LONG_ time there has been no way at all for entry-level devs to check memory use
Dec 20 19:31:34 <sivang> luke-jr_: so is Maemo :)
Dec 20 19:31:36 <Gadgetoid_mbp> I tend to use Safari and Firefox simultaneously, with Chrome sitting in my dock ready for action
Dec 20 19:31:39 <luke-jr_> phreck: I'm not sure it uses much more RAM than Arora.
Dec 20 19:31:50 <luke-jr_> sivang: that bug is being fixed for Maemo 6
Dec 20 19:32:00 <naxxatoe> arora is nice
Dec 20 19:32:03 <naxxatoe> but no firebug there
Dec 20 19:32:03 <lcuk> Gadgetoid, multitouch display?
Dec 20 19:32:07 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Then I've got to restart mysql GUI tools about 40,000 times a day because they're unstable bollocks
Dec 20 19:32:15 <lcuk> or dual wielding keyboard
Dec 20 19:32:20 <hcarrega> damn error on extra-devel
Dec 20 19:32:25 <phreck> i hope maemo6 hit the n900.
Dec 20 19:32:27 <luke-jr_> Firebug is not useful to me
Dec 20 19:32:35 <Gadgetoid_mbp> lcuk: Haha, more like just running at the same time doing various different things
Dec 20 19:32:39 <naxxatoe> to me it is very useful
Dec 20 19:32:44 <SpeedEvil> In principle, you can swap out the resistive touch-panel on the n900 for a capacitive one
Dec 20 19:32:51 <SpeedEvil> but that is probably silly.
Dec 20 19:32:51 <Gadgetoid_mbp> I normally use different browsers to separate work from doss, makes it easier to window manage them
Dec 20 19:32:56 <luke-jr_> SpeedEvil: but resistive is better
Dec 20 19:33:03 <SpeedEvil> luke-jr_: in some aspects
Dec 20 19:33:07 <sivang> luke-jr_: fixed? AFAIK there's is going to remain support for GTK, the introduction of Qt is for the platforms that can't run GTK.
Dec 20 19:33:21 <lcuk> i quite like the idea of adding a capacitive top layer :)
Dec 20 19:33:26 <SpeedEvil> luke-jr_: I'm not really having many problems with the resistive personally.
Dec 20 19:33:28 <Gadgetoid_mbp> In practice the N900 would have none of the intelligence required to make sense of capacitive input, or is that all built into the panel?
Dec 20 19:33:29 <cehteh> better would be a adaption of both technologies
Dec 20 19:33:37 <luke-jr_> sivang: AFAIK they're providing backward compat w/ GTK, but Maemo6 itself will be Qt4
Dec 20 19:33:42 <sivang> anyway, enough wit this trolling. Back to work.
Dec 20 19:33:46 <SpeedEvil> Gadgetoid: there are generally ways round it - it depends on the exact details.
Dec 20 19:33:49 <timeless> speedevil: by swao out, you mean replace the entire top cover
Dec 20 19:33:53 <luke-jr_> SpeedEvil: I'd rather have a non-touch LCD than resistive
Dec 20 19:34:06 <SpeedEvil> timeless: yes - I was looking at the price list of parts - the touch panel is 55 euro
Dec 20 19:34:21 <cehteh> precision of resistive, proximity and sensitivity of a capacitative
Dec 20 19:34:24 <luke-jr_> I still say best is RGBA glasses <.<
Dec 20 19:34:27 <lcuk> resistance is futile
Dec 20 19:34:41 <Gadgetoid_mbp> I find the resistive screen on the N900 to be shockingly sensitive
Dec 20 19:34:48 <lcuk> +9000
Dec 20 19:34:50 <luke-jr_> defaulting to 0% opacity of course
Dec 20 19:35:01 <SpeedEvil> It gets lots less sensitive with a screen protector on at 5C ambient
Dec 20 19:35:05 <Gadgetoid_mbp> As scrolling in MicroB is beautifully smooth it far outdoes the Motorola Droid when finger scrolling
Dec 20 19:35:31 <SpeedEvil> Gadgetoid: I found the mention that killing pulse makes stuff even smoother interesting
Dec 20 19:35:52 <cehteh> what browser does android use? some java vm thing or native?
Dec 20 19:36:04 <Gadgetoid_mbp> SpeedEvil: I find that unsurprising
Dec 20 19:36:14 <woglinde> cehteh webkit
Dec 20 19:36:20 <luke-jr_> cehteh: obviously Chrome?
Dec 20 19:36:28 <timeless> luke: no
Dec 20 19:36:44 <luke-jr_> Google made a browser and then didn't use it? O.o
Dec 20 19:37:09 <Gadgetoid_mbp> They've barely ported it to fucking OSX yet luke-jr_
Dec 20 19:37:10 <timeless> more like they made a few related ones
Dec 20 19:37:14 <cehteh> webkit answers my question partially .. means yes native .. but it needs more than webkit to build a browser
Dec 20 19:37:39 <luke-jr_> but V8's site claims it's part of Android, I think
Dec 20 19:37:40 <luke-jr_> ...
Dec 20 19:37:46 <timeless> cehteh: there's a nice understatement
Dec 20 19:37:54 <Gadgetoid_mbp> cehteh: it's built from Webkit and the juice from an old washerwomans eye boiled for 3 days
Dec 20 19:37:58 <phreck-> i hope maemo6 hits the n900.
Dec 20 19:38:13 <Stskeeps> phreck-: otherwise help making it happen by contributing to mer :P
Dec 20 19:38:23 <timeless> v8 is a js engine
Dec 20 19:38:26 <phreck-> roger
Dec 20 19:38:32 <Gadgetoid_mbp> I hope maemo6 hits a platform infinitely more awesome than the n900 that I'll just HAVE to go out and buy
Dec 20 19:38:59 <timeless> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Android_(operating_system)
Dec 20 19:39:14 <sivang> Gadgetoid_mbp: like a successor, yes, the scrolling is a bit sluggish and iPhone folks of mine are not sure why they should try it yet..:/
Dec 20 19:39:25 <Gadgetoid_mbp> I'm dropping eggs like an incontinent chicken, my farts taste bad, they're not finger lickin'
Dec 20 19:39:30 <timeless> Web browser The web browser available in Android is based on the open-source WebKit application framework. The browser scores a 93/100 on the Acid3 Test.
Dec 20 19:40:03 * lcuk doesnt have a problem with scrolling on n900
Dec 20 19:40:06 <sivang> I like the chrome's snappiness on weak machines.
Dec 20 19:40:18 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Ahhh Acid3... it's a bit like a 120x60 W3C validated graphic for browsers
Dec 20 19:40:20 <SpeedEvil> lcuk: It's generally smooth, but can block occasionally.
Dec 20 19:40:23 <lcuk> mind you, i didnt have a problem with scrolling on n810 either
Dec 20 19:40:24 <sivang> lcuk: maybe we were demoed and old version of it at the Tel Aviv Developer Day
Dec 20 19:40:37 <SpeedEvil> lcuk: It clearly needs a multcore processor, with one core devoted to scrolling :)
Dec 20 19:40:37 <lcuk> sivang, mmm?
Dec 20 19:40:44 * lcuk giggles
Dec 20 19:40:50 <Gadgetoid_mbp> rofl SpeedEvil
Dec 20 19:41:10 <SpeedEvil> Gadgetoid: you know it's gonna happen soon though.
Dec 20 19:41:11 <lcuk> SpeedEvil, that exists now, its called powervr
Dec 20 19:41:15 <sivang> lcuk: we got some N900's not sure which software version it had on, and finger scrolling was very sluggish, people also complained the UI is unintuitive.
Dec 20 19:41:35 <SpeedEvil> The UI has some issues.
Dec 20 19:41:38 <lcuk> i dunno sivang ive had quite a few versions of maemo for a while
Dec 20 19:41:44 <lcuk> when was tel aviv stuff?
Dec 20 19:41:56 <SpeedEvil> But I'm not sure you can have any meaningful completely intuitive interface
Dec 20 19:42:15 <Stskeeps> the nipple.
Dec 20 19:42:15 <Stskeeps> :P
Dec 20 19:42:23 <SpeedEvil> yes, that.
Dec 20 19:42:25 <sivang> lcuk: not long ago, the problem is that the local representative was the one doing the demos and providing the machines
Dec 20 19:42:31 <SpeedEvil> But the n900 has no nipple.
Dec 20 19:42:44 <lcuk> the n910 will have one
Dec 20 19:43:04 <SpeedEvil> More seriously, I would like a device that's popularly known as another bodypart.
Dec 20 19:43:06 <DocScrutinizer51> apropos scrolling. Is there a config somewhere to adjust the "friction" that's determining how long balistic scroll will continue?
Dec 20 19:43:11 <SpeedEvil> The trackpoint(tm)
Dec 20 19:43:16 <lcuk> lol DocScrutinizer51
Dec 20 19:43:22 <lcuk> it should last as long as you move it
Dec 20 19:43:24 <DocScrutinizer51> heh?
Dec 20 19:43:28 * lcuk wants things sliding on baconfat
Dec 20 19:43:41 <SpeedEvil> lcuk: it lasts longer than that
Dec 20 19:43:49 <SpeedEvil> lcuk: open a long list, flick finger across it
Dec 20 19:43:54 <SpeedEvil> lcuk: it carries on
Dec 20 19:44:09 <sivang> lcuk: http://investing.businessweek.com/research/stocks/news/article.asp?docKey=600-200912031948KRTRIB__BUSNEWS_17393-17UJ49HHRP9V86EVI8EVDK4JI6&params=timestamp||12/03/2009%207:48%20PM%20ET||headline||Nokia%20seeks%20application%20developers%20in%20Israel:%20Nokia's%20applications%20strategy%20focuses%20on%20its%20huge%20number%20of%20customers%20compared%20with%20Apple's%20iPhone%20and%20Google's%20Android%20customers.%20[Globes,%20Tel%20Aviv,%20Israe
Dec 20 19:44:11 <lcuk> yeah SpeedEvil i know
Dec 20 19:44:11 <DocScrutinizer51> lcuk: I,m talking about balistic scrolling on N900
Dec 20 19:44:18 <lcuk> and yeah so am i
Dec 20 19:44:24 <sivang> my god, bussinessweek need to get shorter URLs!
Dec 20 19:44:49 <lcuk> i wonder when i became a n00b again
Dec 20 19:45:31 <lcuk> DocScrutinizer51, SpeedEvil i was doing fullscreen kinetics when the n900 was just a glimmer in someones eye ;)
Dec 20 19:45:49 <DocScrutinizer51> so...??
Dec 20 19:46:31 * SpeedEvil was doing fullscreen kinetics in 1993?
Dec 20 19:46:43 <SpeedEvil> Though it was a text reader
Dec 20 19:46:47 <DocScrutinizer51> lcuk: I guess you can tell me then where to adjust
Dec 20 19:46:54 <phreck-> they had screens back then?? OMG.
Dec 20 19:47:05 <phreck-> =P
Dec 20 19:47:16 <sivang> where the hack did they put the slides, the videos and so on...
Dec 20 19:47:19 <sivang> god help them.
Dec 20 19:47:26 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Nokia seeks application developers to hang out in IRC
Dec 20 19:47:38 <phreck-> haha
Dec 20 19:48:14 * SpeedEvil is slightly dissapointed in video+flashlight performance.
Dec 20 19:48:35 <SpeedEvil> It's not useless, but at under a meter it peters out.
Dec 20 19:48:53 <SpeedEvil> may be tweakable to lower fps, or maybe not
Dec 20 19:49:00 <lcuk> DocScrutinizer51, theres not just one place to change for the entire system and no option yet because the metrics arent all the same between kinetic implementations
Dec 20 19:49:34 <kaudio> hi
Dec 20 19:49:57 <DocScrutinizer51> lcuk: well for now I was happy with a way to tune it for microb
Dec 20 19:50:01 <sivang> Gadgetoid_mbp: heh
Dec 20 19:50:09 <kaudio> im happy owner n810
Dec 20 19:50:12 <kaudio> but
Dec 20 19:50:35 <kaudio> i need wvdial in it
Dec 20 19:50:47 <oscillik> looks like i'm going to have to take my N900 back to the Nokia Store
Dec 20 19:50:48 <oscillik> :(
Dec 20 19:51:06 <Gadgetoid_mbp> oscillik: ?
Dec 20 19:51:27 <lcuk> DocScrutinizer51, then file a bug, theres no way for developers to know what users consider wrong unless they monitor every communication channel, so help them out and give them a report that might actually end up being seen by someone who can do something about it
Dec 20 19:51:29 <RST38h> "A magocracy is a form of government in which society is ruled by such magi, wizards, or witches."
Dec 20 19:51:34 <RST38h> hm
Dec 20 19:51:48 <SpeedEvil> oscillik: why?
Dec 20 19:51:49 <bongo|kup> hey, i would like to develop an app during christmas so i don't have to spend much time with my family :D maybe a diary ... would someone use such an app?
Dec 20 19:52:04 <oscillik> i can't get anything to see the handset when i try to reflash it
Dec 20 19:52:12 <kaudio> anyone know install wvdial in n810
Dec 20 19:52:12 <Stskeeps> oscillik: 64-bit windows?
Dec 20 19:52:23 <Gadgetoid_mbp> bongo|kup: a diary... OF PORN?
Dec 20 19:52:24 <oscillik> Windows 7 32bit, Windows 7 64bit, Ubuntu 9.10
Dec 20 19:52:30 <oscillik> none of them will see it
Dec 20 19:52:42 <sivang> Gadgetoid_mbp: I take it you are also a Nokian ?
Dec 20 19:52:43 <lcuk> bongo|kup, i use a diary, i write in it every day
Dec 20 19:52:59 <Stskeeps> oscillik: and the "plug usb into computer, plug usb into device, plug in battery" doesn't work?
Dec 20 19:53:03 <DocScrutinizer51> lcuk: thanks for the warm word. My question was a simple 'is there a config setting' though
Dec 20 19:53:13 <oscillik> Stskeeps: what?
Dec 20 19:53:14 <lcuk> no, file a bug
Dec 20 19:53:19 <lcuk> same answer
Dec 20 19:53:30 <kaudio> anyone know install wvdial in n810
Dec 20 19:54:22 <lcuk> oscillik, remove the battery from n900,   connect the usb to computer and to the n900, open up the flasher and get it so its saying "no device found. checking.."   then plug battery into n900
Dec 20 19:54:27 <lcuk> see how well that works
Dec 20 19:55:03 <lcuk> oh, and make sure you run flasher with sudo
Dec 20 19:55:07 <lcuk> or as root
Dec 20 19:55:07 <oscillik> lcuk: plug the USB cable into the N900 without the battery in?
Dec 20 19:55:11 <DocScrutinizer51> lcuk: what,s that bug? 'there is no place I accidentally dropped by mentioning that config I was lookin for' ??
Dec 20 19:55:14 * lcuk cursed that damned thing for a while
Dec 20 19:55:25 <sivang> btw guys, would you believe that - (it's 5 minutes walk from my apartment)
Dec 20 19:55:27 <lcuk> yes oscillik
Dec 20 19:55:28 <sivang> http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.sportpalace.co.il/Pics/nokia/history/NewNokia1.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.sportpalaces.co.il/data_eng.asp%3Fid%3D2%26status%3D13&usg=__Q_GE8kHFdGU5yMMSi0h5Zcgccok=&h=480&w=640&sz=74&hl=en&start=4&sig2=wEwRb3U1scroRVNIhqsTmA&tbnid=9b2TAxkuOMJGUM:&tbnh=103&tbnw=137&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dnokia%2Bhall%2Btel%2Baviv%26gbv%3D2%26hl%3Den&ei=34AuS9KQDcP3-AbPj4SPBg
Dec 20 19:55:37 <sivang> ;)
Dec 20 19:55:38 <kaudio> anyone know install wvdial in n810
Dec 20 19:55:43 <hcarrega> extra-dev is with problms today?
Dec 20 19:55:45 <lcuk> DocScrutinizer51, ok, enhancement request
Dec 20 19:55:45 <oscillik> lcuk: thanks, i'll try that. i'm hoping i don't have to spend the train fare to get to Manchester again, it's not exactly cheap :(
Dec 20 19:55:50 <hcarrega> no hash error
Dec 20 19:55:56 <lcuk> oscillik, manchester uk?
Dec 20 19:56:01 <oscillik> lcuk: yep
Dec 20 19:56:01 <sivang> kaudio: sudo apt-get install wvdial ?
Dec 20 19:56:06 <lcuk> where are you now
Dec 20 19:56:11 <oscillik> Widnes, Cheshire
Dec 20 19:56:13 <timeless_mbp> oops, it was spiderman 2, not 3
Dec 20 19:56:22 <RST38h> "Described as humanoid hedgehogs who ride giant roosters, the hotchi live primarily in the great forest outside New Crobuzon called Rudewood."
Dec 20 19:56:24 * timeless_mbp watches him tumble
Dec 20 19:56:24 <lcuk> heh theres not quite so much snow over htere
Dec 20 19:56:27 <RST38h> eek
Dec 20 19:57:04 <kaudio> sivang apt dont install wvdial
Dec 20 19:57:11 <oscillik> lcuk: yeah, we had some ice this morning but that's all gone now. my day has just been made infinitely fail due to my friend essentially killing my N900 though :(
Dec 20 19:57:30 <lcuk> bah
Dec 20 19:57:39 <lcuk> i was meant the drive over your way earlier
Dec 20 19:57:46 <lcuk> but the m60 was closed o_O
Dec 20 19:58:14 <kaudio> anyone know install wvdial and smbfs in n810
Dec 20 19:58:18 <oscillik> oh great, i never thought about that - i'm probably not even going to be able to get into Manchester because the trains might be cancelled :(
Dec 20 19:58:20 * lcuk didnt fancy the idea of spending night in the car
Dec 20 19:58:49 <lcuk> kaudio, the dialer no, and smbfs no
Dec 20 19:59:00 <lcuk> but i use sshfs from my laptop iwth great effect
Dec 20 19:59:21 <Lantizia> great it's bricked, now an uber geek is coming over to see it
Dec 20 19:59:27 <lcuk> errr thats the other way round than you need, damn
Dec 20 20:00:37 <kaudio> lcuk thanx. and what about the dialer
Dec 20 20:06:15 <oscillik> lcuk: it seems that did the trick, i owe you a pint
Dec 20 20:07:09 <lcuk> reasonable enough
Dec 20 20:07:17 <lcuk> ~flashing
Dec 20 20:07:19 <infobot> [flashing] http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware
Dec 20 20:07:23 <SplasPood> Anyone fammilar with the state of ruby (specifically /w gnome support) under Maemo5/N900?
Dec 20 20:07:44 <Shadikka> Dunno, I'm more Python people myself
Dec 20 20:08:22 <SplasPood> Shadikka: Yea, I did some python stuff to use pyS60 at one point.. Considering jumping into it again
Dec 20 20:08:31 <Shadikka> Brb
Dec 20 20:08:48 <lcuk> GAN900, can the flashing page be looked at as part of the documentation changes?
Dec 20 20:09:01 <lcuk> cos i was just gonna update the 900 section
Dec 20 20:09:07 <lcuk> but its all mixed in together
Dec 20 20:09:11 <lcuk> and harder to use
Dec 20 20:10:08 <RST38h> "Animal lovers were in for a second shock when instead of a mass funeral for the reindeer, Norweigian Protein Corporation volunteered to make biofuel from their carcasses."
Dec 20 20:10:37 <luke-jr_> mwaha
Dec 20 20:10:38 <jebba> "E: Package libgl-dev has no installation candidate"     in SDK.   Is this because it is closed?  hmm.
Dec 20 20:10:56 <RST38h> libgles maybe?
Dec 20 20:11:33 <jebba> E: Couldn't find package libgles
Dec 20 20:11:58 <jebba> "Package libgl-dev is not available, but is referred to by another package."   woe
Dec 20 20:12:09 <woglinde> there is no libgl-dev
Dec 20 20:12:15 <jebba> i think i ran into this same issue the very first day i was trying to do a package.
Dec 20 20:12:32 <jebba> woglinde: ya. exactly. Didn't you hit that too? Or someone was trying to do some GL stuff. Hmm.
Dec 20 20:12:45 <woglinde> yeah i tried
Dec 20 20:12:55 <RST38h> hmm
Dec 20 20:12:57 <RST38h> "Tapping into drones' video feeds was just the start. The U.S. military's primary system for bringing overhead surveillance down to soldiers and Marines on the ground is also vulnerable to electronic interception."
Dec 20 20:13:09 <woglinde> but egl conversion is to hard for me
Dec 20 20:13:20 <jebba> so basically if we need GL we're hosed?
Dec 20 20:13:31 <woglinde> mostly yeah
Dec 20 20:13:41 <RST38h> yep
Dec 20 20:13:45 <ml-mobile> espn.com
Dec 20 20:13:56 <ml-mobile> doh, wrong window
Dec 20 20:14:15 <RST38h> On the other hand, GLES headers should be pretty standard
Dec 20 20:14:19 <woglinde> rst lol
Dec 20 20:14:20 <jebba> http://maemo.org/packages/view/libgl-dev/
Dec 20 20:15:21 <pupnik> Thank you unnamed hero at Nokia!  Thank you for upgraded pulseaudio-utils!!!!
Dec 20 20:15:40 <wazd_n801> RST38h, lets make rude chineese clone called "Snacke" :D
Dec 20 20:15:52 <woglinde> pupnik lol
Dec 20 20:16:10 <Lantizia> Everyone loves Debian
Dec 20 20:16:14 <Lantizia> Love the Debian, Love It
Dec 20 20:16:14 * pupnik so happy
Dec 20 20:16:28 <woglinde> pupnik whats noe cool?
Dec 20 20:16:38 <pupnik> i think you can guess!
Dec 20 20:16:52 <woglinde> only 10% proc ?
Dec 20 20:16:58 <RST38h> wazd: Snack
Dec 20 20:17:07 <RST38h> wazd: Where you eat humans
Dec 20 20:17:09 <pupnik> got to work on christmas presents
Dec 20 20:17:17 <wazd_n801> RST38h, :D
Dec 20 20:17:26 <pupnik> got a pot of coffee and a toefull of jam
Dec 20 20:17:36 <wazd_n801> RST38h, Dune worm sim :D
Dec 20 20:17:43 <RST38h> wazd: Tremors sim, yes
Dec 20 20:17:48 <GiantTalkingCow> wazd_n801: You know, I've never understood the point of cloning phones. They don't fool anyone, and they don't work as well as what they're imitating. Why not put that same effort into making your own phone that'll sell on its own merits?
Dec 20 20:18:13 <wazd_n801> GiantTalkingCow, they fool everyone in  China
Dec 20 20:18:43 <wazd_n801> GiantTalkingCow, and non techie old people
Dec 20 20:18:51 <RST38h> wazd: Where you get to be the graboid, the shrieker, and the ass-blaster!
Dec 20 20:19:22 <GiantTalkingCow> wazd_n801: Not in my experience. The chinese prefer to buy certain non-brandname phones not because they're knockoffs, but because they have some cool features built in that major carriers ignore.
Dec 20 20:19:23 <wazd_n801> RST38h, difficulty levels :D
Dec 20 20:19:33 <sivang> hmm, so I'm trying to install osso-xterm on the SDK, and can't find it in the utilities section of the app-manager, I believe I Have the required repos configured in sources.list
Dec 20 20:20:55 <melmoth> sivang: worked for me
Dec 20 20:20:57 <wazd_n801> RST38h, damn, that's a nice idea bout sandworms :D
Dec 20 20:20:58 <wazd_n801> RST38h, and you're eating harvesters)
Dec 20 20:21:13 <sivang> melmoth: odd
Dec 20 20:21:46 <RST38h> wazd: you are eating FARMERS *with* harvester
Dec 20 20:21:49 <RST38h> s
Dec 20 20:21:58 <pupnik> sivang: when i cant find things i usually hit http://gronmayer.com/it
Dec 20 20:22:02 <melmoth> sivang: what about run-standalone.sh osso-xterm ?
Dec 20 20:22:12 <RST38h> wazd: Sometimes, a farmer may get away, then you eat his harvester first and run after him
Dec 20 20:22:47 <wazd_n801> RST38h, hehee, now we have a concept :D
Dec 20 20:23:22 <melmoth> sivang: ahhh, got it, you do not have problem laucnihng it but installing it.... i just did apt-get install osso-xterm
Dec 20 20:23:30 <jebba> I don't see any pulseaudio updates (?)
Dec 20 20:23:41 <sivang> melmoth: yes, but it seems I am missing plain 'extras'
Dec 20 20:23:51 <sivang> I had extras-devel and confused ti for 'extras'
Dec 20 20:23:53 <sivang> thanks folks
Dec 20 20:23:57 <sivang> pupnik: you specifically
Dec 20 20:23:58 <sivang> :)
Dec 20 20:24:14 <sivang> is there a tool to configure software sources altogether ?
Dec 20 20:24:15 <jebba> ah just -utils ?
Dec 20 20:24:26 <sivang> (instead of adding them manually)
Dec 20 20:24:44 <wazd_n801> RST38h, damn, now I'm excited :)
Dec 20 20:24:46 <woglinde> sivang download manager you can edit stuff
Dec 20 20:24:54 <pupnik> yw
Dec 20 20:25:13 <RST38h> wazd: There was a game called Battalion, it had the shortest user manual I have avere seen
Dec 20 20:25:29 <GiantTalkingCow> Here's an interesting question: has anyone ever seen a Nokia knockoff phone in person?
Dec 20 20:25:36 <RST38h> wazd: went like this: "You are a giant fire breathing monster. You know what to do."
Dec 20 20:25:37 <rashed2020> I have
Dec 20 20:25:38 <wazd_n801> RST38h, pew-pew?)
Dec 20 20:26:02 <pupnik> There was that phone-in-person in Batman
Dec 20 20:26:10 <GiantTalkingCow> Batman?
Dec 20 20:26:19 <sivang> jebba: that's my sources.list http://pastie.org/751023
Dec 20 20:26:23 <pupnik> yeah the joker sewed one into this guy
Dec 20 20:26:43 <sivang> jebba: is there a authoritative page for the different available repos one can add per release?
Dec 20 20:26:47 <wazd_n801> RST38h, we sould definitely work it out
Dec 20 20:27:12 <GiantTalkingCow> Oh yeah, I remember that. Never really paid attention to the phone brand, though.
Dec 20 20:27:52 <sivang> jebba: if that's missing let's create one.
Dec 20 20:28:03 <sivang> jebba: the page I found on the wiki did not mention those.
Dec 20 20:28:28 <sivang> jebba: had only mentioned the stock ones that come with the SDK, which is not that useful.
Dec 20 20:29:12 <jebba> sivang: i'm not quite sure what you're talking about actually.
Dec 20 20:29:20 <jebba> if what's missing?
Dec 20 20:29:45 <sivang> jebba: several repos urls :)
Dec 20 20:30:27 <jebba> ah, you mean nokia binaries for GL? or somethign?
Dec 20 20:31:08 <sivang> jebba: everything, we should have a page that lists every repo and what it contains.
Dec 20 20:31:11 <woglinde> jebba for gles stuff you need a personalized deb line in sources.list
Dec 20 20:31:40 <Lantizia> anyone got the wiki link for the guide on reflashing?
Dec 20 20:31:45 <jebba> ya, i just build with free software though, so kind of a no-go for me....
Dec 20 20:31:50 <woglinde> ~flasher
Dec 20 20:31:51 <Lantizia> and that page has the link to the page where you type your IMEI
Dec 20 20:31:52 <infobot> methinks flasher is http://wiki.maemo.org/Flasher
Dec 20 20:31:58 <Lantizia> no thats not it, been there
Dec 20 20:32:07 <woglinde> ~flashing
Dec 20 20:32:09 <wazd_n801> RST38h, as a "tail" we can have dust clouds)
Dec 20 20:32:09 <infobot> [flashing] http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware
Dec 20 20:32:13 <Lantizia> aha!
Dec 20 20:32:19 <woglinde> *g*
Dec 20 20:32:21 <Lantizia> thanks!
Dec 20 20:32:46 <woglinde> ~curse slowness fo maemo.org
Dec 20 20:32:48 <infobot> May the fleas of a thousand camels infest your most sensitive regions, slowness fo maemo.org !
Dec 20 20:33:07 <sivang> hmm maemo.org got terribly slow suddenly
Dec 20 20:33:24 <redeeman> its always slow
Dec 20 20:33:35 <woglinde> redeeman hm today is terrible
Dec 20 20:33:57 <RST38h> wazd: well, there are other sources of proteion
Dec 20 20:34:00 <RST38h> protein
Dec 20 20:34:27 <sivang> ? http://maemo.org/downloads/search/application.html?org_openpsa_products_search[1][property]=title&org_openpsa_products_search[1][constraint]=LIKE&org_openpsa_products_search[1][value]=osso-xterm&org_openpsa_products_search[2][property]=os&org_openpsa_products_search[2][constraint]=LIKE&org_openpsa_products_search[2][value]=Maemo5&fetch=Search
Dec 20 20:34:30 <RST38h> wazd: policemen (with cars), cattle, picnic goers (with tables)
Dec 20 20:34:39 * sivang gives up
Dec 20 20:34:42 <rashed2020> Is there a list of what parts of Maemo are open source and parts aren't?
Dec 20 20:36:54 <pupnik> hehe apt-get install needs a pty to write logfile
Dec 20 20:37:16 <RST38h> and ptys are currently scarce?
Dec 20 20:37:31 <pupnik> 4 terminals open on n900 is default
Dec 20 20:37:32 <woglinde> jebba you can try http://opensource.dylogic.com/DOGLESS/Articles/About.html
Dec 20 20:37:36 <pupnik> 4 ptys rather
Dec 20 20:37:59 <Lantizia> Hey I want to TOTALLY erase my N900... I have downloaded the UK combined flash... and the vanilla eMMC ... what do I need to rescue from my existing eMMC that doesn't come with the vanilla one?!
Dec 20 20:38:07 <RST38h> btw, I have just figured it that the ugly "playing" animation in Media Player can be easily changed
Dec 20 20:38:08 <pupnik> our library situation is a good deal better than 2007
Dec 20 20:38:13 <Lantizia> is there perhaps a complete list of what the vanilla eMMC is missing?
Dec 20 20:38:29 <jebba> libhildon_lgpl   anyone know if there is a new replacement for that?
Dec 20 20:38:32 <RST38h> wazd: got any nice little animation to show that the music is playing?
Dec 20 20:39:10 <wazd_n801> RST38h, beating speaker?)
Dec 20 20:39:38 <Stskeeps> rashed2020: will publish one in the new year
Dec 20 20:40:12 <jebba> woglinde: will take a look at it, thx  (later)
Dec 20 20:40:14 <RST38h> wazd: will do
Dec 20 20:40:26 <woglinde> jebba I will try it too
Dec 20 20:40:30 <woglinde> for performous
Dec 20 20:40:33 <RST38h> wazd: has to have 3 phases (+ 1 for paused), 64x64
Dec 20 20:40:44 <woglinde> jebba I just forgot there exist such thinks
Dec 20 20:40:50 <wazd_n801> RST38h, animated?
Dec 20 20:40:56 <RST38h> yea, in 3 phases
Dec 20 20:40:57 <AakashPatel> Hey whats different about the 	Maemo 5 Global release for Nokia N900  compared to US and middle east
Dec 20 20:41:03 <wazd_n801> RST38h, oh
Dec 20 20:41:24 <wazd_n801> RST38h, that's kinda lame animmation :D
Dec 20 20:41:25 <RST38h> it is a replacement for that stupid ugly animated media player icon on n900
Dec 20 20:41:28 <GiantTalkingCow> AakashPatel: Language support, perhaps?
Dec 20 20:41:31 <jebba> woglinde: ok you go for it, i'm queueing up a few things now ;)
Dec 20 20:41:45 <RST38h> wazd: well does not have to be fancy, small and unobtrusive rather
Dec 20 20:42:08 <wazd_n801> RST38h, I  thouught it was a real spectrum analyser
Dec 20 20:42:31 <RST38h> no, it is a stupid animated icon
Dec 20 20:42:38 <RST38h> and an ugly one for that
Dec 20 20:43:49 <kejiaj1> Hello
Dec 20 20:44:43 <DocScrutinizer51> AakashPatel: wifi policy
Dec 20 20:44:53 <AakashPatel> Oh
Dec 20 20:45:03 <AakashPatel> Does Global let you do more shiz then the others then?
Dec 20 20:46:25 <DocScrutinizer51> AakashPatel: just a guess
Dec 20 20:46:34 <AakashPatel> oh
Dec 20 20:51:19 * melmoth wonders what the _mpg suffix stand for.
Dec 20 20:51:31 <rashed2020> megapigsel
Dec 20 20:51:51 <melmoth> gruble, i menat the _mbp one that people put at the end of their nick
Dec 20 20:52:25 <rashed2020> macbook pro
Dec 20 20:52:41 <melmoth> ahhh.
Dec 20 20:52:49 <melmoth> all those people use mac book pro ? :)
Dec 20 20:53:07 <rashed2020> How many are there??
Dec 20 20:53:39 <melmoth> i dont know exactly but i keep seeing the _mbp suffix now and then
Dec 20 20:53:54 <melmoth> enough to make me wonder what it was anyway
Dec 20 20:54:46 <wazd_n801> maemo bug  pwner
Dec 20 20:55:12 <AakashPatel> <-haz mbp
Dec 20 20:55:36 <AakashPatel> but im too cool for mbp suffix
Dec 20 20:55:39 <AakashPatel> hehe
Dec 20 20:56:28 <PaulFertser> Man Bear Pig that is.
Dec 20 20:56:45 <woglinde> lol
Dec 20 20:56:54 <wazd_n801> macbook automaticaly adds _mbp to your nick
Dec 20 20:56:55 <wazd_n801> lol
Dec 20 20:57:11 * wazd_n801 rofls
Dec 20 20:57:35 <wazd_n801> bingo)
Dec 20 20:57:54 <wazd_n801> AakashPatel, so you don't own one obviously
Dec 20 20:58:03 <wazd_n801> sent from my iphone
Dec 20 20:58:07 <Aakash_mpb> dammit
Dec 20 20:58:20 * AakashPatel needs to lrn2spl
Dec 20 21:00:57 <wazd_n801> AakashPatel, fail)
Dec 20 21:01:19 <wazd_n801> AakashPatel, you have mmbp ripoff :D
Dec 20 21:01:59 <AakashPatel> haah
Dec 20 21:04:54 <AakashPatel> waiting for rashed2020 to brick is n900
Dec 20 21:04:58 <AakashPatel> erm
Dec 20 21:04:59 <AakashPatel> wrong window
Dec 20 21:05:09 <woglinde> lol
Dec 20 21:05:19 <rashed2020> Bastard
Dec 20 21:05:41 <AakashPatel> Heheh
Dec 20 21:10:25 * pupnik bounces on fnordianslippers 
Dec 20 21:10:33 <pupnik> what's the word?
Dec 20 21:10:47 <oscillik> bird
Dec 20 21:11:06 <fnordianslip> huh?
Dec 20 21:11:13 <oscillik> oooma mow mow, oooma ooom mow mow mow
Dec 20 21:11:18 <fnordianslip> lol
Dec 20 21:11:45 <DocScrutinizer51> ok. I'll give roaming and xchat speed reconnect another try...
Dec 20 21:12:10 <AakashPatel> what does the EMMC file on the download page have in it?
Dec 20 21:12:20 <RST38h> stuff
Dec 20 21:12:34 <AakashPatel> maps and crap?
Dec 20 21:19:07 <woglinde> ags
Dec 20 21:19:09 <woglinde> args
Dec 20 21:19:14 <woglinde> no git in fremantle
Dec 20 21:19:50 <lcuk> woglinde, the diablo one works
Dec 20 21:19:56 <lcuk> and i saw something from autobuilder about it
Dec 20 21:19:57 <lcuk> hold on
Dec 20 21:20:10 <GAN900> lcuk, the same instructions apply to all devices, really.
Dec 20 21:20:17 <GAN900> Which is why they're mixed
Dec 20 21:20:32 <GAN900> At least last time I updated it it was appropriate.
Dec 20 21:20:49 <lcuk> yeah, but the intructions about removing battery work nicely for everyone who fails that
Dec 20 21:22:43 <sivang> so it appears the tem is only available from diablo, was that so hard to say? :)
Dec 20 21:22:52 <lcuk> http://maemo.org/packages/search/?org_maemo_packages_search[1][property]=name&org_maemo_packages_search[1][constraint]=LIKE&org_maemo_packages_search[1][value]=git
Dec 20 21:23:10 <sivang> porting it to fremantle could be helpful? I\m in for it as my first package
Dec 20 21:23:11 <lcuk> woglinde, those are the git items in fremantle atm, not sure how stable, at least git-core seems empty right now
Dec 20 21:23:25 <sivang> (well, not first deb package, but first maemo package)
Dec 20 21:23:39 <lcuk> and git itself has just finished building (its in the recent builds list)
Dec 20 21:24:01 <lcuk> the problem with diablo git-core (which is what i use) is it cannot update https
Dec 20 21:24:17 <lcuk> hopefully that limitation will be cure
Dec 20 21:24:21 <sivang> lcuk: missing a transpport plugin ?
Dec 20 21:24:25 <lcuk> yeah
Dec 20 21:24:39 <lcuk> cos of other dependency problems with it
Dec 20 21:25:33 <wazd_n801> RST38h, I think we'll need some place to discuss details of the project
Dec 20 21:25:48 <wazd_n801> RST38h, forum or something
Dec 20 21:26:14 <timeless_mbp> heh
Dec 20 21:26:31 <timeless_mbp> the Finnish news service showed a guy in New York who was happy about the snow because... "and I get to ski"
Dec 20 21:26:55 <woglinde> hi timeless
Dec 20 21:27:01 <johnq_> I packaged "Simon Tantham's Puzzles": http://fractalmind.de/stuff/sgt-puzzles_8605-1ubuntu1_armel.deb
Dec 20 21:27:05 <timeless_mbp> hello
Dec 20 21:27:13 <woglinde> johnq cool
Dec 20 21:27:18 <woglinde> I like them
Dec 20 21:27:29 <johnq_> If anybody wants to try out. They could be optified, but actually I don't really know how to do that...
Dec 20 21:27:44 <woglinde> when I have imagemagick in extras-testing I will make 3 crosses
Dec 20 21:27:56 <woglinde> johnq_ read the wiki entry
Dec 20 21:27:58 <woglinde> its simple
Dec 20 21:28:42 <woglinde> gogogo maemo.org
Dec 20 21:29:16 <hcarrega> i got erro on hash in extra-devel
Dec 20 21:29:19 <hcarrega> no hash file\
Dec 20 21:29:25 <fnordianslip> bugger.  autobuilder failed on conky with this:
Dec 20 21:29:26 <fnordianslip> Failed to fetch http://osso.stage.dmz/dists/fremantle/tools/non-free/binary-i386/Packages.gz  Could not connect to osso.stage.dmz:80 (10.5.1.102), connection timed out
Dec 20 21:29:59 <woglinde> fnordianslip yeah
Dec 20 21:30:02 <woglinde> slow slow
Dec 20 21:30:09 <woglinde> ->  connection timed out
Dec 20 21:30:33 <fnordianslip> at least i have another version queued up already :) hopefully it gets faster by then
Dec 20 21:30:49 <jebba> Stskeeps: for all the git archives here: http://maemo.gitorious.org/maemo-gnome-essentials   I can't clone cuz I get:  "warning: remote HEAD refers to nonexistent ref, unable to checkout."   I can clone all the other archives (e.g. maemo-af).  How do I do these?
Dec 20 21:31:00 <woglinde> jebba -> http://www.imgtec.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=354
Dec 20 21:34:18 <johnq_> woglinde: yeah, seems simple. thanks :-)
Dec 20 21:37:53 <sivang> timeless_mbp: it suddenly became very cold in here as well, if that is of some comfort :)
Dec 20 21:38:08 <sivang> oh darn, the qt-mamemo-example is also uninstallable :/
Dec 20 21:38:29 <slonopotamus> so
Dec 20 21:39:06 <timeless_mbp> sivang: my family got 16" of snow
Dec 20 21:39:16 <sivang> timeless_mbp: I would switch
Dec 20 21:39:16 <timeless_mbp> we have perhaps 3" here
Dec 20 21:39:28 <sivang> timeless_mbp: in NYC ?
Dec 20 21:39:29 <timeless_mbp> my sister even got a snow day today
Dec 20 21:39:35 <sivang> cool!
Dec 20 21:39:36 <timeless_mbp> DC metro area
Dec 20 21:39:44 * timeless_mbp shrugs
Dec 20 21:39:52 <johnq_> Is there some standard place where I can put (small) changes to a debian package so that it works under maemo? should I register a garage project?
Dec 20 21:39:54 <timeless_mbp> she had to shovel snow off her car
Dec 20 21:40:11 <timeless_mbp> johnq_: garage seems to be the standard approach
Dec 20 21:40:26 <sivang> I got some sand storms, acid rain, air pollution, angry people and very aggresive bus drivers and no metro
Dec 20 21:40:35 <sivang> (or light train)
Dec 20 21:40:42 <timeless_mbp> heh
Dec 20 21:40:47 <timeless_mbp> acid rain sucks
Dec 20 21:41:02 <johnq_> timeless_mbp: but wouldn't it be better to just store some diff somewhere?
Dec 20 21:41:02 <GAN900> It's even cold in FL!
Dec 20 21:41:05 <sivang> my hometown is next to a refinery
Dec 20 21:41:54 <lcuk> johnq_, think beyond single use, fire and forget
Dec 20 21:41:57 <lcuk> setup a garage project
Dec 20 21:43:08 <johnq_> lcuk: it's just a small hack I don't want to be responsible for in the future ;-)
Dec 20 21:43:41 <lcuk> so who should be responsible for it?
Dec 20 21:44:05 <timeless_mbp> you could contact your upstream :)
Dec 20 21:44:37 <lcuk> indeed, make the patch a generic
Dec 20 21:44:54 <johnq_> hm, optification seemed to work but there is still a (regular) file in /usr/lib/sgt-puzzles/. The same file is in /opt/maemo/usr/lib/sgt-puzzles. Shouldn't the first be a symlink to the second or am I getting something wrong here?
Dec 20 21:45:01 <johnq_> lcuk: what do you mean?
Dec 20 21:45:03 <fnordianslip> so, as the autobuilder is failing to build anything, do we have to up-version our packages to get another go?
Dec 20 21:45:34 <RST38h> no
Dec 20 21:45:43 <derf> Not unless the autobuilder succeeds.
Dec 20 21:45:56 <fnordianslip> how to we requeue our packages?
Dec 20 21:46:03 <fnordianslip> justdput them again?
Dec 20 21:46:07 <derf> Yes.
Dec 20 21:46:09 <timeless_mbp> sure
Dec 20 21:46:10 <fnordianslip> cheers
Dec 20 21:46:12 <lcuk> mmm i thought every run through autobuilder needs new versions!
Dec 20 21:46:27 <derf> You have to delete the .upload file.
Dec 20 21:46:29 <RST38h> thumbnailer is a bitch
Dec 20 21:46:36 <derf> lcuk: Surprise.
Dec 20 21:46:37 <fnordianslip> ah. ok
Dec 20 21:46:39 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Guh I hate cost/time estimates
Dec 20 21:46:41 <lcuk> i use the web interface
Dec 20 21:46:49 <lcuk> never seen a .upload file
Dec 20 21:46:55 <RST38h> you make a photo, and it hangs your device so that the next photo takes 5-10 seconds to take
Dec 20 21:47:24 <derf> lcuk: You would have if you used dput like fnordianslip.
Dec 20 21:47:39 <sivang> lcuk: you should :)
Dec 20 21:47:43 <sivang> lcuk: it's fun
Dec 20 21:48:06 <DocScrutinizer51> RST38h: nice it?
Dec 20 21:48:34 * sivang morns the loss of cinamon for his quaker oats.
Dec 20 21:48:42 <lcuk> "fun" and the console are never involved in the same activity
Dec 20 21:48:52 <sivang> hehe
Dec 20 21:48:58 <derf> That's just your Windows-user bias showing.
Dec 20 21:49:08 <sivang> for me , a conslole is part of feeling at home on a computer
Dec 20 21:49:08 <derf> I think the same thing about web interfaces.
Dec 20 21:49:13 <sivang> wihout it, I'm lost
Dec 20 21:49:31 * Arkenoi tries to think out *what* causes recorder to crash on my n900. must  be a software conflict of some kind. 
Dec 20 21:49:47 <derf> A thousand times more things to go wrong, and no way to get feedback about most of them.
Dec 20 21:50:36 <sivang> derf: "red pill" debugging, as timeless_mbp so wonderfully noted.
Dec 20 21:51:20 <lcuk> derf, using the console is like looking at a map with only a pinhole view, you know theres a whole world to explore, but you havent got a clue how to access it.
Dec 20 21:51:52 <sivang> lcuk: you've got if you are a true explorer :)
Dec 20 21:52:04 * sivang stops the trolling
Dec 20 21:52:25 <RST38h> Arkenoi: Why not make it drop a core and debug?
Dec 20 21:53:56 <RST38h> lcuk: Well, I can rotate that pinhole view way faster than you can move your graphical one
Dec 20 21:54:10 <johnq_> Ah, of course. The whole directory is symlinked to /opt
Dec 20 21:54:12 <DocScrutinizer51> lcuk: using the console usually is for *moving* things, not looking at them
Dec 20 21:54:15 <RST38h> So, pinhole is not that bad, if you know what to do with it
Dec 20 21:54:36 <RST38h> And if I feel like I need a wider fov, there is midnight commander and htop :)
Dec 20 21:54:57 <derf> sivang: I meant with using web interfaces.
Dec 20 21:55:15 <johnq_> http://fractalmind.de/stuff/sgt-puzzles_8605-1ubuntu1_armel.deb is now optified.
Dec 20 21:55:17 <Arkenoi> rst38h: will try. is there on-device gdb package?
Dec 20 21:55:33 <RST38h> Arkenoi: I think there is
Dec 20 21:55:35 <lcuk> yes
Dec 20 21:55:38 <AakashPatel> If i'm in scratchbox
Dec 20 21:55:44 <AakashPatel> hwo would i add the extras-devel repo?
Dec 20 21:55:51 <lcuk> 6.8.5.0.something in the sdk reposityory i believe
Dec 20 21:56:04 <lcuk> 6.8.50 even
Dec 20 21:56:32 * RST38h goes to watch DrWho
Dec 20 21:56:47 <lcuk> RST38h, enjoy, and yeah i see the pov
Dec 20 21:57:10 <RST38h> If any of you see X-Fade, please, ask him to look why Speccy, Vultures, and MasterGear have not been promoted to Extras
Dec 20 21:57:16 <lcuk> DocScrutinizer51, console is for everything
Dec 20 21:57:22 <oscillik> sorry, i was busy installing all my apps again
Dec 20 21:59:27 <woglinde> rst is promotion auto,atic
Dec 20 22:00:52 <Macer> ugh. i am lost
Dec 20 22:01:09 <worluk_> hm, stupid question, is there anything i could forget after installing the openvpn applet, causing it to not show up on my N900?
Dec 20 22:01:22 <Macer> i can connect to the pptp vpn on my dd-wrt wifi router from the outside. but i can't ping anything else on teh local subnet other than the router
Dec 20 22:01:25 <Macer> anybody have any ideas?
Dec 20 22:01:37 * lcuk giggles @ the droid forums
Dec 20 22:02:06 <lcuk> the topic "what are the first things you are gonna do with your droid" brings about normal crappy responsed
Dec 20 22:02:07 <lcuk> s
Dec 20 22:03:02 <lcuk> Macer,
Dec 20 22:03:06 <DocScrutinizer51> Arkenoi: http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/devtools/maemo5/gdb
Dec 20 22:03:35 <Macer> lcuk: heh. sorry. was just hoping someone here was having similar vpn problems
Dec 20 22:03:37 <Macer> :)
Dec 20 22:03:41 <Macer> i already asked in dd-wrt heh
Dec 20 22:03:52 <lcuk> can you ping the router once you are on the vpn
Dec 20 22:04:18 <lcuk> damn
Dec 20 22:04:24 <lcuk> its ok missed your last thing
Dec 20 22:04:24 <lcuk> lol
Dec 20 22:13:51 <AakashPatel> whats the arg's to add to make to make it use the scratchbox compiler?
Dec 20 22:15:56 <lcuk> theres usually no changes required to build inside scratchbox
Dec 20 22:16:13 <AakashPatel> :/
Dec 20 22:16:15 <lcuk> and i call "make" whether im inside, outside or on device
Dec 20 22:16:22 <AakashPatel> Yeah Im doin that but i get...
Dec 20 22:16:43 <AakashPatel> make: i686-pc-linux-gnu-gcc: Command not found
Dec 20 22:17:05 <AakashPatel> I'm tryin to compile the new version of pidgin-facebookchat
Dec 20 22:17:13 <Macer> AHHHH
Dec 20 22:17:21 <Macer> AakashPatel: tell me why i can't ping anythign other than the router
Dec 20 22:17:31 <Macer> when connected to a dd-wrt pptp vpn :(
Dec 20 22:17:36 <Macer> it's killing me .. i don't know what i'm missing here
Dec 20 22:17:38 <AakashPatel> lolol
Dec 20 22:18:09 <AakashPatel> lcuk: in the make  file the compiler is set has
Dec 20 22:18:10 <AakashPatel> LINUX32_COMPILER = i686-pc-linux-gnu-gcc
Dec 20 22:18:12 <AakashPatel> as*
Dec 20 22:19:07 <lcuk> AakashPatel, urg, mine simple calls gcc
Dec 20 22:19:20 <woglinde> ~lart maemo for not containing automake.10
Dec 20 22:19:21 * infobot takes a rusty axe and swings it violently, taking maemo's head off for not containing automake.10
Dec 20 22:19:24 <woglinde> args 1.10
Dec 20 22:20:31 <Corsac> hmhm, is there a way to adjust jabber priority?
Dec 20 22:20:35 <Macer> omg
Dec 20 22:20:41 <AakashPatel> wtf
Dec 20 22:20:46 <AakashPatel> i intsalled purple0
Dec 20 22:20:52 <Corsac> ha, #2141
Dec 20 22:21:00 <AakashPatel> but it still doesnt have /usr/include/libpurple and stuff
Dec 20 22:21:12 <AakashPatel> OH
Dec 20 22:21:13 <AakashPatel> haha
Dec 20 22:21:18 <AakashPatel> i needed libpurple0
Dec 20 22:21:20 <AakashPatel> >.<
Dec 20 22:21:37 <AakashPatel> ...which is already installed
Dec 20 22:21:38 <AakashPatel> :/
Dec 20 22:21:39 <Corsac> This WILL NOT be fixed for Maemo5/Fremantle.
Dec 20 22:21:41 <Corsac> mpf.
Dec 20 22:22:09 <jebba> ShadowJK: ffmpeg failed on builder but works locally. Trying to get to the logs to find out why, but looking at a spinning cursor:  https://garage.maemo.org/builder/fremantle/ffmpeg_0.5+svn20090706-4/
Dec 20 22:23:22 <woglinde> jebba I wonder why you arent in #ffmpeg
Dec 20 22:25:32 <fnordianslip> jebba: probably buggered set up phase  - there's a timeout in my logs
Dec 20 22:26:01 <AakashPatel> ahhh
Dec 20 22:26:02 <AakashPatel> wtf is up
Dec 20 22:26:04 <AakashPatel> with this
Dec 20 22:26:41 <woglinde> poor maemo.org
Dec 20 22:27:43 <fnordianslip> someone should put it out of its misery
Dec 20 22:27:47 <jebba> heh
Dec 20 22:28:12 <jebba> woglinde: i can barely keep up with all the windows i have open already ;)
Dec 20 22:28:30 <woglinde> *g*
Dec 20 22:28:32 <woglinde> heh
Dec 20 22:29:02 <AakashPatel> ahh
Dec 20 22:29:11 <AakashPatel> someoen try compilng pidgin-facebookchat :P
Dec 20 22:30:58 <woglinde> jebba -> --extra-cflags="-mcpu=cortex-a8 -mfloat-abi=softfp -mfpu=neon"
Dec 20 22:31:03 <woglinde> not good with i386
Dec 20 22:31:13 <woglinde> try harder
Dec 20 22:31:21 <woglinde> to fix the debian package
Dec 20 22:31:50 <fnordianslip> ooh.  fail :)
Dec 20 22:32:24 <jebba> gah, ShadowJK, the build went fine for armel, failed for i386  haha.,    cuz of the cflags i suppose....
Dec 20 22:32:25 <sivang> woglinde: FPUless machine?
Dec 20 22:32:39 <woglinde> hm I see many debian packages are in ugly state as many autotools software is
Dec 20 22:32:48 <jebba> man, i hope the builder is running ccache  ;)
Dec 20 22:32:49 <woglinde> both is failure of maintainers
Dec 20 22:33:42 <jebba> gah, will fix that for ffmpeg.  kinda spaced the i386 thing...
Dec 20 22:34:09 <woglinde> no
Dec 20 22:34:23 <woglinde> your rules file is wrong
Dec 20 22:35:44 <LuciusMare> hi
Dec 20 22:35:51 <LuciusMare> is n900 getting the maemo 6 ?
Dec 20 22:36:04 <ml-mobile> unknown
Dec 20 22:36:18 <LuciusMare> :(
Dec 20 22:36:44 <hcarrega> n900 its now out
Dec 20 22:36:46 <jebba> woglinde: ya, i see the thing, i fixed it.  I put it in the if armel section
Dec 20 22:36:54 <woglinde> hm anyone familiar with liblocation?
Dec 20 22:37:00 <hcarrega> i maemo 6 apear like the delay off n900
Dec 20 22:37:03 <hcarrega> u will w8
Dec 20 22:37:09 <jebba> i edited the two at the same time, but was thinking i had it under there and didn't do a i386 build shame on me.
Dec 20 22:37:28 <LuciusMare> i know
Dec 20 22:37:34 <LuciusMare> i mean, you cant update,right?
Dec 20 22:37:39 <woglinde> or with gypsy stuff in fremantle?
Dec 20 22:37:50 <sivang> woglinde: you should see the mips port...
Dec 20 22:37:59 <sivang> woglinde: almost everything is broken there in cross compile
Dec 20 22:38:13 <sivang> woglinde: (debian, that is)
Dec 20 22:38:52 <woglinde> hm okay
Dec 20 22:38:59 <woglinde> gispy is only used for bt-mice
Dec 20 22:40:33 <LuciusMare> ooh
Dec 20 22:40:43 <LuciusMare> You can connect a BT keyboard to the device?
Dec 20 22:41:18 <woglinde> hm maybee the fremantle developer guide has somethin
Dec 20 22:41:23 <woglinde> LuciusMare sure
Dec 20 22:41:33 <woglinde> LuciusMare you could do that even with diablo
Dec 20 22:41:41 <LuciusMare> ^^
Dec 20 22:41:51 <woglinde> ~lart poor maemo.org
Dec 20 22:41:52 * infobot farts in poor maemo.org's general direction
Dec 20 22:41:53 * LuciusMare digs in this crate of unused hardware
Dec 20 22:42:25 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Where the hell is Flash in Android?
Dec 20 22:42:31 <LuciusMare> There is not
Dec 20 22:42:37 <Gadgetoid_mbp> I'm doing browser speed comparisons between the Droid and N900
Dec 20 22:42:55 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Droid is slower to load the same page without flash, or tends toward the mobile version
Dec 20 22:43:11 <LuciusMare> then you fail at this,afaik droid does not have and is not capable of playing flash
Dec 20 22:43:21 <oscillik> lol
Dec 20 22:43:27 <Gadgetoid_mbp> But but but
Dec 20 22:43:29 <Gadgetoid_mbp> It says Flash 10!
Dec 20 22:43:34 <LuciusMare> Hm
Dec 20 22:43:52 <LuciusMare> okay,wrong
Dec 20 22:43:56 <woglinde> damn seems I have to write an liblocation plugin for navit
Dec 20 22:44:03 <LuciusMare> I stopped caring about droid when the g1 came out
Dec 20 22:44:09 <LuciusMare> it seems like they already got it
Dec 20 22:44:14 <LuciusMare> then,i do not the hell know
Dec 20 22:44:16 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Oh fscking hell, no flash until 2010?
Dec 20 22:44:21 <LuciusMare> haha
Dec 20 22:44:36 <LuciusMare> There you are,androids!
Dec 20 22:44:48 <Gadgetoid_mbp> jQuery cycle works like balls on Android, too
Dec 20 22:44:55 <LuciusMare> I guess you will have to do the test without flash
Dec 20 22:45:06 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Well, I call it in the N900s favour
Dec 20 22:45:20 <Gadgetoid_mbp> timeless: good job on MicroB, you win, pat yourself on the back
Dec 20 22:45:27 <timeless_mbp> :)
Dec 20 22:45:35 <LuciusMare> aw,crap
Dec 20 22:45:38 <Gadgetoid_mbp> And by win, I mean fscking pwn
Dec 20 22:45:38 <LuciusMare> what day is it?
Dec 20 22:45:39 <timeless_mbp> i'll try to remember to tell my coworkers tomorrow
Dec 20 22:45:42 <sivang> Gadgetoid_mbp: Driod as in Andriod ?
Dec 20 22:46:01 <LuciusMare> I just accidentally reseted all my clock
Dec 20 22:46:03 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Droid as in Android on the Motorola Droid which is confusingly and infrigingly named thus
Dec 20 22:46:09 <LuciusMare> it says 1.1.2000
Dec 20 22:46:15 <LuciusMare> And i dont know what day is it.
Dec 20 22:46:42 <LuciusMare> hm
Dec 20 22:46:44 <LuciusMare> what does mbp mean?
Dec 20 22:46:55 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Macbook Pro
Dec 20 22:47:03 <Gadgetoid_mbp> MacBook Pro, even
Dec 20 22:47:05 <LuciusMare> oh
Dec 20 22:47:05 <sivang> I already asked :)
Dec 20 22:47:18 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Or Most Bodacious Penis
Dec 20 22:47:25 <LuciusMare> timeless_mbp: you puttle apple sheeple!
Dec 20 22:47:37 <Gadgetoid_mbp> IIt's very telling that all I can come up with on short notice tends to involve penis
Dec 20 22:48:01 <LuciusMare> Gadgetoid_mbp: Suck it,lets just blow the problems.
Dec 20 22:48:16 <Gadgetoid_mbp> I need another heavy website to test this shiznit
Dec 20 22:48:21 <Gadgetoid_mbp> ah yes PORN!
Dec 20 22:48:29 <LuciusMare> what the hell was that
Dec 20 22:48:35 <LuciusMare> i heard a scream by my window
Dec 20 22:48:37 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Oh damn, no Flash *facepalm*
Dec 20 22:48:40 * LuciusMare goes over to look
Dec 20 22:48:51 * LuciusMare curses the winter
Dec 20 22:48:58 <LuciusMare> its freakin frozen
Dec 20 22:49:02 <LuciusMare> and i dont dare to open it
Dec 20 22:49:24 <timeless_mbp> Gadgetoid_mbp: fwiw, pr0n on the n900 is generally not going to work
Dec 20 22:49:30 <sivang> Gadgetoid_mbp: www.williamhillpoker.com :)
Dec 20 22:49:32 <timeless_mbp> the standard for pr0n testing is you pr0n
Dec 20 22:49:35 <Gadgetoid_mbp> timeless_mbp: I wish MicroB had google's find-as-you-type integrated though
Dec 20 22:49:47 <timeless_mbp> and it requires more cpu power than we have
Dec 20 22:49:53 <Gadgetoid_mbp> timeless_mbp: video porn sites work like a dream on the n900
Dec 20 22:49:56 <timeless_mbp> google's find as you type?
Dec 20 22:50:09 <Shapeshifter> guys, could somone please just quickly tell me how people launch the terminal on the n900, how the user prompt looks like, and how the root prompt looks like?
Dec 20 22:50:12 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Sorry, I mean "suggest"
Dec 20 22:50:14 <timeless_mbp> you mean chrome? android? other?
Dec 20 22:50:17 <timeless_mbp> oh
Dec 20 22:50:30 <timeless_mbp> do you mean just for the urlbat
Dec 20 22:50:32 <sivang> Shapeshifter: you want to launch it? you have the device ?
Dec 20 22:50:34 <timeless_mbp> s/at/ar/
Dec 20 22:50:35 <LuciusMare> Shapeshifter: what are you running,right now on your desktop?
Dec 20 22:50:35 <infobot> timeless_mbp meant: do you mean just for the urlbar
Dec 20 22:50:37 <oscillik> i really don't understand why people are complaining in reviews about the "heft" of the N900 - it's not that big at all, my E90 is longer and thicker than the N900
Dec 20 22:50:37 <Gadgetoid_mbp> When you type something into the browser address bar it pops up lovely suggestions
Dec 20 22:50:43 <Shapeshifter> sivang: no I don't have it, that's why I'm asking
Dec 20 22:50:44 <timeless_mbp> ok
Dec 20 22:50:47 <timeless_mbp> yeah well...
Dec 20 22:50:50 <Gadgetoid_mbp> oscillik: oh come on, the N900 is a fatty!
Dec 20 22:50:55 <oscillik> it isn't
Dec 20 22:50:58 <LuciusMare> it looks just like a normal prompt
Dec 20 22:50:58 <Shapeshifter> LuciusMare: archlinux both machines, I consider myself an expert by now ;)
Dec 20 22:51:03 <LuciusMare> okay
Dec 20 22:51:07 <Shapeshifter> LuciusMare: yeah but how exactly
Dec 20 22:51:07 <LuciusMare> so it looks like a bash.
Dec 20 22:51:07 <Gadgetoid_mbp> And so is the E90!
Dec 20 22:51:10 <sivang> Shapeshifter: you need to install it
Dec 20 22:51:11 <LuciusMare> er
Dec 20 22:51:13 <Shapeshifter> bla@n900 # or what
Dec 20 22:51:15 <LuciusMare> What?
Dec 20 22:51:21 <LuciusMare> I expected it being preinstalled
Dec 20 22:51:23 <Shapeshifter> I mean, what does it say.
Dec 20 22:51:31 <GAN900> Shapeshifter, tap the menu button, tap More...  tap X Terminal
Dec 20 22:51:40 <LuciusMare> someone@something $:
Dec 20 22:51:42 <SpeedEvil> or add it to desktop
Dec 20 22:51:44 <oscillik> Gadgetoid_mbp: well, if you want to flash your phone in front of some girls in the hopes of gettin' some, then by all means go for another phone :p
Dec 20 22:51:46 <LuciusMare> er
Dec 20 22:51:53 <LuciusMare> someone@something:~$ i guess
Dec 20 22:51:55 <GAN900> Or press ctrl-shft-x
Dec 20 22:51:57 <Shapeshifter> LuciusMare: yeah but, on the n900, what exactly ;)
Dec 20 22:51:57 <timeless_mbp> http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/gallery/2009/12/20/GA2009122001750.html?hpid=topnews ??
Dec 20 22:52:08 <Shapeshifter> GAN900: thanks
Dec 20 22:52:17 <LuciusMare> badass@n900:~$
Dec 20 22:52:31 <Gadgetoid_mbp> oscillik: I don't need to whip my phone out for that, just a feather boa and a shiny glittered plastic hat
Dec 20 22:52:37 <GAN900> Shapeshifter, or add a shortcut to Home.
Dec 20 22:52:48 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Oh and they also have to be very, very drunk
Dec 20 22:53:23 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Woah browser bugorama!
Dec 20 22:53:28 <jebba> woglinde: ok, building ok i386. /me facepalm...    btw, i think we're going to need some more space for /scratchbox it appears!  That thing is filling up fast.  I have lots more space on another drive (360G free), but it's currently on a RAID-0 SCSI system, which is much faster of course... ;)
Dec 20 22:53:32 <Arkenoi> e90 impressed girls much more ;-)
Dec 20 22:53:45 <woglinde> jebba *g*
Dec 20 22:53:56 <Shapeshifter> LuciusMare: and the root shell?
Dec 20 22:54:07 <Shapeshifter> and what does it use as "badass"?
Dec 20 22:54:09 <sivang> jebba: fakeroot apt-cache clean ?
Dec 20 22:54:10 <Gadgetoid_mbp> JESUS CHRIST ANDROID I JUST WANT TO CLICK A FUCKING LINK
Dec 20 22:54:12 <Shapeshifter> name you give at the beginning?
Dec 20 22:54:21 * Gadgetoid_mbp headbuts Droid
Dec 20 22:54:24 <sivang> Gadgetoid_mbp: hehe
Dec 20 22:54:27 <zash> Gadgetoid_mbp: LOL WUT?
Dec 20 22:54:29 <woglinde> sivang we compile a lot of stuff
Dec 20 22:54:31 <LuciusMare> Shapeshifter: chucknorris@n900:~$
Dec 20 22:54:31 <jebba> sivang: more like rm -rf ~/kernel  ;)
Dec 20 22:54:38 <Gadgetoid_mbp> fuckfuckfuckfuck!N AEEOEOO
Dec 20 22:54:38 <sivang> jebba: eh :)
Dec 20 22:54:41 <woglinde> jebba I could delete some stuff from me
Dec 20 22:54:44 <jebba> it's only 20G there now.
Dec 20 22:54:44 <Shapeshifter> LuciusMare: I'm not sure you understand my question.
Dec 20 22:54:48 <sivang> jebba: or make clean ?
Dec 20 22:54:50 <sivang> :)
Dec 20 22:55:01 <GAN900> Shapeshifter, or add a systemui.xml entry to add a shortcut to the power menu.
Dec 20 22:55:10 <Shapeshifter> LuciusMare: on the n900, how exactly is the prompt made up? what does it say before the @. Where does it take the username from
Dec 20 22:55:19 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Okay, now I know why the 5-way nav on the Droid selects links... it's fucking impossible to tap on a specific link when there are several in close proximity
Dec 20 22:55:28 <zash> Gadgetoid_mbp: Maemo > Android?
Dec 20 22:55:29 <jebba> woglinde: i think i may move my /home/jebba dir on the host system to the fat partition, and then dedicate that whole partition to /scratchbox, which would bring us from 20G to 55G
Dec 20 22:55:29 <AakashPatel> wtf
Dec 20 22:55:33 <LuciusMare> no idea,hell
Dec 20 22:55:37 <AakashPatel> is up with extras-devel
Dec 20 22:55:45 <jebba> woglinde: anyway, no real big hurry, still go 3G left...
Dec 20 22:55:51 <LuciusMare> i guess it takes the username from the user that is just logged in
Dec 20 22:55:53 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Nah zash, resistive kicking capacitives ass
Dec 20 22:55:56 <LuciusMare> just as any shell
Dec 20 22:56:06 <Shapeshifter> So, can anyone else tell me what the n900 shell prompts for user and root look like?
Dec 20 22:56:08 <zash> Gadgetoid_mbp: what does that have to do with the os?
Dec 20 22:56:09 <AakashPatel> i try to use it but get some No Hash entry in Release file error
Dec 20 22:56:14 <Shapeshifter> LuciusMare: yeah but the n900 is hardly a multi user env ;)
Dec 20 22:56:24 <Shapeshifter> and the username has to come from somewhere
Dec 20 22:56:27 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Sod all zash :) I'm talking about the Droid, not Android
Dec 20 22:56:33 <LuciusMare> THEY typed it.
Dec 20 22:56:38 <Shapeshifter> LuciusMare: when
Dec 20 22:56:42 <Shapeshifter> LuciusMare: first setup?
Dec 20 22:56:48 <sivang> Shapeshifter: when creating the user
Dec 20 22:57:00 <Gadgetoid_mbp> High resolution + capacitive really doesn't work :(
Dec 20 22:57:02 <Shapeshifter> sivang: on the n900, when you buy it you first create a user?
Dec 20 22:57:05 <LuciusMare> holy crap
Dec 20 22:57:08 <LuciusMare> no
Dec 20 22:57:13 <LuciusMare> the nokia developers set it
Dec 20 22:57:15 <Shapeshifter> LuciusMare: dude I'm not talking about "any" prompt
Dec 20 22:57:18 <zash> Gadgetoid_mbp: install maemo on it! :P
Dec 20 22:57:24 <LuciusMare> i know
Dec 20 22:57:26 <Shapeshifter> LuciusMare: but _the n900_ as you're holding it in your hands
Dec 20 22:57:33 <Gadgetoid_mbp> zash: That wont make it not suck, sadly
Dec 20 22:57:35 <sivang> Shapeshifter: I would assume so, when you do your first setup, or not, the others would be more knowledgable as I don't own a one :)
Dec 20 22:57:49 <Shapeshifter> sivang: me neither else I'd just look for myself xD
Dec 20 22:58:03 <sivang> timeless_mbp: ^^
Dec 20 22:58:04 <sivang> ?
Dec 20 22:58:33 * timeless_mbp is confused
Dec 20 22:58:39 <sivang> Shapeshifter: there's probably a default user which you can modify the real name or something.
Dec 20 22:58:49 <Shapeshifter> timeless_mbp: I was asked how the shell prompts for user and root look like on the n900
Dec 20 22:59:08 <timeless_mbp> ~ $
Dec 20 22:59:09 <sivang> Shapeshifter: that's the same as on any other linux box that's running a shell
Dec 20 22:59:10 <infobot> from memory, $ is a dollar sign
Dec 20 22:59:11 <Shapeshifter> *asking
Dec 20 22:59:18 <timeless_mbp>  /home/user #
Dec 20 22:59:30 <sivang> Shapeshifter: and you can configure it, as you can in bash
Dec 20 22:59:31 <Shapeshifter> timeless_mbp: thank you!!
Dec 20 22:59:39 <Shapeshifter> timeless_mbp: I think you're the first who got my question.
Dec 20 22:59:49 <Shapeshifter> sivang: yeah but I was asking how it is out of the box nothing touched for any user
Dec 20 22:59:55 <Shapeshifter> sure you can make it anything
Dec 20 22:59:56 <sivang> Shapeshifter: ah, I see.
Dec 20 23:00:10 <timeless_mbp> Shapeshifter: all things considered, your original questions were confusing
Dec 20 23:00:26 <Shapeshifter> timeless_mbp: :( I'm sorry I should have been more clear
Dec 20 23:01:06 <timeless_mbp> philipl: oh, you exist
Dec 20 23:01:07 <LuciusMare> oh,crap
Dec 20 23:01:11 <LuciusMare> 00:01
Dec 20 23:01:18 <LuciusMare> i am going to freaking work tommorow
Dec 20 23:01:20 <LuciusMare> er,today
Dec 20 23:01:26 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Hmm, from "Medical Emergency" to "Naked Angels In Beach Paradise" .... whew, ARGH NAKED MEN!
Dec 20 23:01:42 <jebba> asterisk 1.6.2.0-3 OK   :)
Dec 20 23:01:44 <Shapeshifter> timeless_mbp: mh, and the root prompt?
Dec 20 23:01:57 <Shapeshifter> I spotted this on the forums: Nokia-N900-42-11:~#
Dec 20 23:02:31 <timeless_mbp> Shapeshifter: i'm using 'rootsh'
Dec 20 23:02:42 <timeless_mbp> out of the box, you can't really get a root shell
Dec 20 23:02:48 <timeless_mbp> you need to do one of the following:
Dec 20 23:02:51 <timeless_mbp> enable-rd-mode
Dec 20 23:02:58 <timeless_mbp> install rootsh or something like it
Dec 20 23:03:00 <timeless_mbp> install sshd
Dec 20 23:03:29 <Shapeshifter> I assume most novices will use rootsh? If you're using rootsh, how will the root prompt look like?
Dec 20 23:03:37 <timeless_mbp> it's not that the device is locked, it's just that... you don't need root and pretty much all you can do is break your device with it
Dec 20 23:03:41 <timeless_mbp> i used rootsh
Dec 20 23:03:49 <timeless_mbp> and there should be no 'novices' :)
Dec 20 23:03:58 <timeless_mbp> i gave 2 prompts
Dec 20 23:04:08 <timeless_mbp> the first was user, the second was immediately after sudo gainroot
Dec 20 23:04:26 <timeless_mbp> (the user prompt is incredibly boring, since you start in ~)
Dec 20 23:04:34 <sivang> timeless_mbp: what's enable-rd-mode ?
Dec 20 23:04:37 <Shapeshifter> timeless_mbp: oh, I'm sorry I missed the first one
Dec 20 23:05:09 <timeless_mbp> Shapeshifter: you have to get used to how prompts look
Dec 20 23:05:17 <timeless_mbp> # is typically reserved for root
Dec 20 23:05:20 <jebba> sivang: an option you can pass to the n900 using the flasher-3.5 program.  R&D  research & development.  But you really dont want to run it that way.
Dec 20 23:05:34 <sivang> jebba: ah, I see thanks
Dec 20 23:05:35 <AakashPatel> What the dir  for Documents?
Dec 20 23:05:43 <timeless_mbp> sivang: r&d mode is basically "give me as many ways as possible to ruin my battery life"
Dec 20 23:05:44 <Shapeshifter> timeless_mbp: I use zsh and just > ;)
Dec 20 23:05:50 <sivang> timeless_mbp: hehe
Dec 20 23:05:52 <gomiam> AakashPatel: /home/usr/.documents?
Dec 20 23:05:55 <timeless_mbp> AakashPatel: ~/MyDocs/.documents/
Dec 20 23:06:08 <timeless_mbp> gomiam: your spelling is awful :)
Dec 20 23:06:15 <sivang> jebba: why is not osso-xterm listed in app manager even when the respective repo is enabled ?
Dec 20 23:06:18 <timeless_mbp> the user account is 'user', not 'usr'
Dec 20 23:06:25 <AakashPatel> HH
Dec 20 23:06:28 <gomiam> timeless_mbp: don't worry, my mind is even worse :P
Dec 20 23:06:28 <AakashPatel> ahh
Dec 20 23:06:33 <AakashPatel> i had my usb plugged in lol
Dec 20 23:06:45 * sivang is trying to install the terminal app for the last 3 hours. Congrats. It is nearly to impossible on the SDK :)
Dec 20 23:06:53 <timeless_mbp> AakashPatel: yeah well... if you do that, ~/MyDocs will be exported...
Dec 20 23:09:02 <jebba> sivang: probably doesn't have  Section: user/foo  in it's debian/control file.
Dec 20 23:09:50 <sivang> jebba: can I fix it then and dupload ?
Dec 20 23:10:56 <Shapeshifter> timeless_mbp: I could have just looked at the screenshot for the rootsh package -.-
Dec 20 23:11:39 <jebba> sivang: well, they probably left it out intentionally as it is considered a core package.
Dec 20 23:15:05 <Shapeshifter> now these questions might all seem weird, but I'm just writing a quick intro into the shell and it's a bit hard without having the actual device :| Could someone please post the output of uname -a for demonstration purposes?
Dec 20 23:15:58 <timeless_mbp> surely google can answer that?
Dec 20 23:16:08 <woglinde> sivang write bug report there paid nokia emplyoees
Dec 20 23:16:46 <timeless_mbp> http://wiki.maemo.org/User:Jebba
Dec 20 23:16:48 <Shapeshifter> timeless_mbp: mh, you're right. Is this correct: Linux Nokia-N900-42-11 2.6.28-omap1 #1 PREEMPT Wed Oct 28 15:32:55 EET 2009 armv7l unknown
Dec 20 23:16:50 <timeless_mbp> has it under 'kernel'
Dec 20 23:17:03 <timeless_mbp> dunno
Dec 20 23:17:08 <timeless_mbp> i'm not running sales
Dec 20 23:17:08 <Shapeshifter> ah well thanks.
Dec 20 23:17:49 <timeless_mbp> hrm, the maemo-org theme is odd
Dec 20 23:17:58 <timeless_mbp> sadly, the orange does not contrast well against the gray
Dec 20 23:18:29 <bleader> Shapeshifter: Linux Nokia-N900-42-11 2.6.28-omap1 #1 PREEMPT Wed Oct 28 15:32:55 EET 2009 armv7l unknown
Dec 20 23:18:34 <jebba> ok, a very nice burgerspace has finally made it into the repo  :)
Dec 20 23:18:37 <Shapeshifter> bleader: thank you so much.
Dec 20 23:19:03 <jebba> i'd a told ya Shapeshifter but my uname -a would give you something different  ;)
Dec 20 23:19:10 <philipl> timeless: for some values of exist :-)
Dec 20 23:19:27 <timeless_mbp> philipl: with a genuine @maemo.org address?
Dec 20 23:19:40 <timeless_mbp> and packaging the bluetooth dun thing to at least extras-testing
Dec 20 23:19:44 <woglinde> I wonder when 2.6.32 will come
Dec 20 23:19:44 <Shapeshifter> jebba: well, different timezone, different time, possibly different version
Dec 20 23:19:51 <timeless_mbp> i tried my hand at packaging it myself...
Dec 20 23:20:32 <timeless_mbp> philipl: an icon for you: http://timeless.justdave.net/maemo/bluetooth-dun-upstart-0.1/icon.png
Dec 20 23:20:42 <timeless_mbp> (if you want it)
Dec 20 23:21:02 <an0therb0x1> help i can't use my camera on the nokia n900 will on a call
Dec 20 23:21:04 <AakashPatel> okay i moved libfacebook.so to /usr/lib/purple-2/
Dec 20 23:21:09 <jebba> i built up a 2.6.32-omap1 using the rx51_defconfig from the 2.6.28-omap1 kernel  and it built but the very last step it failed linking due to missing symbols in some mmc thing IIRC.  Lots was missing from that kernel though that's in nokias 2.6.28....
Dec 20 23:21:10 <AakashPatel> but it still doesnt show up in teh protocals list
Dec 20 23:21:11 <AakashPatel> any dieas?
Dec 20 23:21:13 <AakashPatel> ideas
Dec 20 23:21:15 <an0therb0x1> interesting issue
Dec 20 23:21:32 <sivang> woglinde: I would or create a depatch or something
Dec 20 23:21:34 <woglinde> jebba hm
Dec 20 23:22:51 <jebba> sivang: you talking about it not appearing the the app manager? If you want it there, open a bug report saying it's not there and they probably need to add  Section: user/foo to the debian/control file. done.
Dec 20 23:22:56 <AakashPatel> Oh my god
Dec 20 23:23:01 <AakashPatel> i got facebook chat workin in pidgin
Dec 20 23:23:03 <jebba> heh
Dec 20 23:23:04 <jebba> nice
Dec 20 23:23:15 <jebba> well, maybe not nice. i can't stand facebook  :P
Dec 20 23:23:23 <AakashPatel> hah
Dec 20 23:23:24 <sivang> jebba: will do
Dec 20 23:23:24 <jebba> but still, nice job ;)
Dec 20 23:23:27 <woglinde> lol socialnetworks are evil anyway
Dec 20 23:24:11 <jebba> uh, ok, so *ASTERISK* is in the repo now. A very fine version, i might add.  :)
Dec 20 23:24:21 <SpeedEvil> repotastic.
Dec 20 23:24:35 <jebba> fone localhost  :)
Dec 20 23:24:37 <SpeedEvil> Does it take calls from 3G and auto-answer?
Dec 20 23:24:39 <woglinde> jebba hm n900 as voip-machine
Dec 20 23:24:39 <philipl> timeless_mbp: it's a genuine maemo.org address, but that comes with the garage account.
Dec 20 23:24:44 <SpeedEvil> :)
Dec 20 23:24:55 <woglinde> SpeedEvil should be possible
Dec 20 23:24:57 <philipl> Thanks for the icon. I'll use it :-)
Dec 20 23:25:03 <jebba> would be rad to tie it into the GSM hardware for damn sure, but for now just does SIP & IAX2
Dec 20 23:25:19 <jebba> oh, but ya, over 3G it would work fine.
Dec 20 23:25:25 <woglinde> jebba you have to package lcr now
Dec 20 23:25:27 <jebba> same as any data connection.
Dec 20 23:25:30 <SpeedEvil> yeah - I meant GSM
Dec 20 23:25:31 <jebba> heh.
Dec 20 23:25:34 <SpeedEvil> :)
Dec 20 23:25:57 <woglinde> most users use asterisk with lcr now
Dec 20 23:26:07 <woglinde> or a lot of
Dec 20 23:26:08 <jebba> least cost routing?  Is there such a package for it though? I've set up (crude) LCR in the past. very crude...
Dec 20 23:26:17 <woglinde> jupp
Dec 20 23:26:38 <jebba> woglinde: pointer to what you're talking about? like a package of it???  asterisk lcr google is going to give me abillion random hits.
Dec 20 23:26:59 <woglinde> yeah I am searching
Dec 20 23:27:03 <sivang> jebba: so how does a n900 user installs it the first time if it does not appear in the app manager?
Dec 20 23:27:19 <jebba> i see a perl module, but yikes.
Dec 20 23:27:27 <sivang> errr, perl
Dec 20 23:27:36 <jebba> sivang: the terminal *comes* with the device.
Dec 20 23:27:44 <GAN900> Woo, Avatar 3D time.
Dec 20 23:28:03 <jebba> sivang:  so probably really not needed a Section:  they'll likely close WONTFIX or INVALID
Dec 20 23:28:32 <woglinde> jebba -> http://www.linux-call-router.de/
Dec 20 23:29:35 <jebba> woglinde: uh, that's all ISDN stuf....
Dec 20 23:29:36 <woglinde> jebba hm I am seeing its german specfig
Dec 20 23:29:40 <woglinde> because of isdn
Dec 20 23:29:45 <sivang> jebba: ah, and I thought they wanted to hide it...
Dec 20 23:29:46 <woglinde> he you can connect a usb-isdn card
Dec 20 23:29:48 <sivang> jebba: oh well
Dec 20 23:29:50 <woglinde> to n900
Dec 20 23:29:50 <jebba> that's a totally different thing than Least Cost Routing
Dec 20 23:29:55 <woglinde> jebba right
Dec 20 23:30:04 <jebba> which is what i assume you wanted with LCR
Dec 20 23:30:13 <jebba> http://search.cpan.org/~jhiver/Asterisk-LCR-0.03/lib/Asterisk/LCR.pm   that one seems possible
Dec 20 23:30:14 <woglinde> no
Dec 20 23:30:17 <jebba> oh
Dec 20 23:30:37 <woglinde> but its okay
Dec 20 23:31:01 <jebba> ah, well least cost routing would be very cool too ;)
Dec 20 23:31:15 <jebba> but the other LCR will have to wait until the fone gets a PCI slot.
Dec 20 23:31:32 <SplasPood> yay, found proper ruby packages for the N900
Dec 20 23:31:54 <LuciusMare> ^^
Dec 20 23:32:00 <LuciusMare> but what is it for?
Dec 20 23:32:13 <jebba> LuciusMare: what is what for?
Dec 20 23:32:44 <LuciusMare> ruby
Dec 20 23:32:50 <LuciusMare> ruby packages at n900
Dec 20 23:32:54 <jebba> ah, it's like python, but japanese
Dec 20 23:33:01 <AakashPatel> hey guys
Dec 20 23:33:05 <pwnguin> heh
Dec 20 23:33:12 <AakashPatel> who should i give this lib to?
Dec 20 23:33:16 <AakashPatel> for facebook chat for pidgin
Dec 20 23:33:21 <AakashPatel> the one in the repos are outdated
Dec 20 23:33:31 <SplasPood> LuciusMare: so I can write stuff in ruby
Dec 20 23:33:36 <jebba> LuciusMare: see:  http://mislav.uniqpath.com/poignant-guide/
Dec 20 23:33:37 <LuciusMare> oh
Dec 20 23:33:41 <LuciusMare> okay,okay
Dec 20 23:33:50 <LuciusMare> i just thought that ruby...
Dec 20 23:33:52 <LuciusMare> actually
Dec 20 23:34:10 <LuciusMare> ruby is something like php
Dec 20 23:34:15 <LuciusMare> mainly web technology
Dec 20 23:34:26 <SplasPood> I wouldn't directly equate the two
Dec 20 23:39:59 <sivang> thanks jebba , you've been most helpful. I wish the wiki was as such :)
Dec 20 23:40:46 <jebba> sivang: I AM THE WIKI
Dec 20 23:40:59 <sivang> jebba: heheh, he wished :)
Dec 20 23:41:03 <sivang> or "it" wished
Dec 20 23:41:14 <jebba> LuciusMare: ruby on rails is web. Ruby is used for whatever. Like python. But Japanese.
Dec 20 23:41:15 <sivang> jebba: Nokia should hire you
Dec 20 23:41:27 <jebba> heh
Dec 20 23:41:35 <AakashPatel> okay pidgin sucks on maemo
Dec 20 23:41:53 <sivang> AakashPatel: isn't it better to use other preseance clients?
Dec 20 23:42:12 <AakashPatel> preseance?
Dec 20 23:42:23 <sivang> hrm
Dec 20 23:42:34 <sivang> how'd ya spell it ?
Dec 20 23:43:08 <AakashPatel> chat?
Dec 20 23:43:11 <AakashPatel> idk lol
Dec 20 23:43:16 <AakashPatel> conversation
Dec 20 23:43:30 <AakashPatel> presence?
Dec 20 23:43:39 <sivang> yeah, I should get to sleep :)
Dec 20 23:43:48 <sivang> night all
Dec 20 23:43:50 <AakashPatel> night
Dec 20 23:43:51 <sivang> thanks again jebba
Dec 20 23:44:50 <jebba> np
Dec 20 23:44:55 <jebba> sleep well
Dec 20 23:47:32 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Ha ha ha
Dec 20 23:47:40 <Gadgetoid_mbp> "I'm a PC, and easier wireless was my idea"
Dec 20 23:48:16 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Nothing to do with the paltry few seconds it takes a Mac to acquire a wireless signal when woken from sleep, then? Nothing to do with Mac's wake on wireless? Pfft
Dec 20 23:49:31 <pwnguin> wake on wireless?
Dec 20 23:49:46 <pwnguin> as in "wake me up if any network traffic comes in?"
Dec 20 23:50:21 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Yup pwnguin
Dec 20 23:50:31 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Me likey wake on wireless
Dec 20 23:50:41 <AakashPatel> o.o
Dec 20 23:50:42 <pwnguin> that sounds like a battery drain
Dec 20 23:50:44 <AakashPatel> it can do that?
Dec 20 23:50:46 <AakashPatel> :0
Dec 20 23:50:52 * AakashPatel is on a mbp irght now 
Dec 20 23:51:05 <pwnguin> aakash: preliminary linux support: http://lwn.net/Articles/333075/
Dec 20 23:51:09 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Mine certainly can, AakashPatel... I tried it with ftp once
Dec 20 23:51:27 <Gadgetoid_mbp> But now I don't use my laptop much outside work
Dec 20 23:51:47 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Doesn't WOL if I've brought it back from work sleeping in my bag
Dec 20 23:51:49 <AakashPatel> thats sweet
Dec 20 23:51:53 <pwnguin> so if you sleep with adium or pidgin on
Dec 20 23:51:57 * AakashPatel needs to try it out soon
Dec 20 23:52:15 <Gadgetoid_mbp> That would be WAN, pwnguin, so it wouldn't wake up
Dec 20 23:52:30 <AakashPatel> aww D:
Dec 20 23:52:41 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Although you can, in theory, do it
Dec 20 23:52:44 <pwnguin> Wide area network?
Dec 20 23:53:01 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Yeah traffic coming in from yonder tinternet doesn't wake it up, methinks, but I could be wrong
Dec 20 23:53:06 <Gadgetoid_mbp> That I have not tried
Dec 20 23:53:26 <pwnguin> you'd also have traffic going out to mantain TCP connections
Dec 20 23:53:27 <AakashPatel> i think it would be bad ifi t idid
Dec 20 23:53:55 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Gawd knows how it works, but it does
Dec 20 23:54:03 <AakashPatel> lol
Dec 20 23:54:07 <AakashPatel> bbiab
Dec 20 23:54:16 <pwnguin> you said you tried it out once? you have to enable it?
Dec 20 23:54:50 <pwnguin> if its not on by default, it probably doesn't work intelligently as one hopes
Dec 20 23:56:12 <Gadgetoid_mbp> I don't think so, pwnguin
Dec 20 23:56:13 <pwnguin> oh, http://www.macrumors.com/2009/08/28/a-closer-look-at-snow-leopards-wake-on-demand-feature/
Dec 20 23:56:26 <Gadgetoid_mbp> I just tried to FTP into it
Dec 20 23:56:46 <pwnguin> apparently you need an apple base station
Dec 20 23:56:58 <pwnguin> so it can offload advertising
Dec 20 23:57:35 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Yeah I've got one, because OSX doesn't fscking work well at all with any other make
Dec 20 23:57:41 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Or at least, not with Belki
Dec 20 23:57:43 <pwnguin> hah
Dec 20 23:57:53 <pwnguin> it works with our campus Cisco just fine
Dec 20 23:58:02 <Gadgetoid_mbp> I made the mistake of buying a shitty glossy consumer draft N router
Dec 20 23:58:07 <pwnguin> and nobody's complianed about my linksys
Dec 20 23:58:10 <Gadgetoid_mbp> It, and OSX, did not get on well at all
Dec 20 23:58:32 <Gadgetoid_mbp> so I just thought "fuck it", took it back, and replaced it with the Airport Extreme
Dec 20 23:58:42 <pwnguin> so basically, it's not a generic wake on tcp
Dec 20 23:58:44 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Shame about the lack of DynDNS support
Dec 20 23:59:02 <pwnguin> it's a wake on magic wlan packet
Dec 20 23:59:10 <pwnguin> with special airport sauce
Dec 20 23:59:14 <pwnguin> for specific services
Dec 20 23:59:15 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Hahaha
Dec 21 00:00:56 <pwnguin> its more for light load servers than your macbook
Dec 21 00:01:17 <pwnguin> or i suppose its a way to get at your macbook files with less hassle
Dec 21 00:01:58 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Aye, I use FTP to grab stuff off my mbp to my N810/900
Dec 21 00:02:08 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Too lazy for USB
Dec 21 00:02:19 <pwnguin> i just use my NAS
Dec 21 00:02:47 <pwnguin> interestingly, the NAS supports upnp, which the n900 sees
Dec 21 00:03:20 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Yeah, me needs a Buffalo Linkstation
Dec 21 00:04:19 <pwnguin> ive seen some hardware that runs debian quite well
Dec 21 00:04:30 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Wait a minute, the Droid is a 550mhz ARM Cortex A8!?!?!?!?
Dec 21 00:04:37 <pwnguin> yes
Dec 21 00:05:06 <Gadgetoid_mbp> I thought it was Snapdragon....
Dec 21 00:05:12 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Wow....
Dec 21 00:05:28 <pwnguin> http://www.cyrius.com/debian/
Dec 21 00:05:51 <pwnguin> i thought snapdragon was MIPS. must have confused it with something else
Dec 21 00:05:59 <pwnguin> either way, sounds like a power hog
Dec 21 00:06:55 <pwnguin> sadly, most of the videos on my NAS can't be played by the default n900 player
Dec 21 00:07:04 <LuciusMare> nooo
Dec 21 00:08:33 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Yeah and mplayer eats root like a starving rabbit
Dec 21 00:09:25 <eitreach> pwnguin, have you installed the extra decoders support?
Dec 21 00:09:29 <Macer> wow
Dec 21 00:09:36 <pwnguin> eitreach: i installed ogg
Dec 21 00:09:37 <Macer> i have been trying to find out wtf is wrong with this damn pptp setup
Dec 21 00:09:41 <Macer> Linksys WRT54G V4 with factory firmware (or DD-WRT firmware) cannot forward GRE 47 protocol from WAN-to-LAN
Dec 21 00:09:50 <pwnguin> eitreach: not sure about the rest; what's the package name?
Dec 21 00:09:55 <eitreach> pwnguin, you can install a whole bunch of extras.. So far I haven't found anything I can't play afterwards.
Dec 21 00:10:05 <eitreach> pwnguin, "decoders support", I believe.
Dec 21 00:10:06 <pwnguin> (also, these are like 720p or 1080)
Dec 21 00:10:30 <eitreach> It's in extras-testing, as far as I remember.
Dec 21 00:10:43 <eitreach> oh. I haven't tried HD-movies yet.
Dec 21 00:10:53 <eitreach> only with strange and obscure encodings.
Dec 21 00:11:02 <pwnguin> its mostly anime
Dec 21 00:11:33 <pwnguin> lemme get some stats on an example
Dec 21 00:11:50 <jebba> <chant>bur-ger-space bur-ger-space bur-ger-space</chant>  All install it now! <chant>bur-ger-space bur-ger-space bur-ger-space</chant>
Dec 21 00:12:15 <jebba> burgerspace, now in extras-testing           :)
Dec 21 00:12:31 <eitreach> pwnguin, http://repository.maemo.org/extras-testing/pool/fremantle/free/d/
Dec 21 00:12:48 <pwnguin> Stream #0.0(und): Video: h264, yuv420p, 848x480, 29.97 tbr, 29.97 tbn, 59.94 tbc Stream #0.1(und): Audio: aac, 48000 Hz, stereo, s16
Dec 21 00:12:50 <Gadgetoid_mbp> I wonder how long I'll remain banned from #android, I just wanted to let them all know how much the Droid sucks
Dec 21 00:12:54 <T7g> I take it the dosbox in the repos isn't hildonized? (or keymapped correctly) - I got syndicate running on it earlier, the only real issue I had was not having a true mouse, it sort-of worked but you could never really get a "fix" on the pointer, it would always be an inch away from where you were pointing.
Dec 21 00:14:02 <jebba> hah
Dec 21 00:14:04 <pwnguin> eitreach: already installed
Dec 21 00:14:19 <pwnguin> im surprised dosbox works on arm
Dec 21 00:15:04 <eitreach> then I'm stumped.
Dec 21 00:15:14 <pwnguin> im not surprised
Dec 21 00:15:21 <Gadgetoid_mbp> syndicate, T7g, nice!
Dec 21 00:15:22 <pwnguin> h264 is cpu heavy
Dec 21 00:15:24 <eitreach> gadgetoid-mbp, is the droid that bad?
Dec 21 00:15:31 <Gadgetoid_mbp> eitreach: yes, yes, and yes
Dec 21 00:15:40 <pwnguin> without DSP support it's probably a nogo
Dec 21 00:15:54 <pwnguin> even if it's nearly the right size for the screen
Dec 21 00:16:00 <eitreach> gadgetoid_mpb, I had a HTC Magic.. It was nice for Google-stuffs, but with multimedia it sucked bad. Same thing about the droid?
Dec 21 00:16:02 <T7g> I was pretty amazed when the syndicate movie played nearly perfectly, perhaps I should get a tiny bluetooth mouse to take along with me.
Dec 21 00:16:09 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Here's what it has going for it: an 856*480 resolution screen
Dec 21 00:16:15 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Here's what it doesn't: everything else
Dec 21 00:16:39 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Well it has almost no internal storage,and you can't swap MicroSD cards in and out without first removing the battery... sucky enough for you?
Dec 21 00:17:18 <eitreach> that's bad, yeah.
Dec 21 00:17:21 <Gadgetoid_mbp> I WANT to love it, I want an excuse to waste £50 getting one with a phone contract for my N900, I WANT to love it
Dec 21 00:17:23 <Gadgetoid_mbp> But it's shit
Dec 21 00:18:08 <T7g> it's motorola, they make pretty phones (like razr) but I haven't seen them make any truly useful phones
Dec 21 00:18:48 <Gadgetoid_mbp> The Droid is definitely not pretty
Dec 21 00:18:50 <Gadgetoid_mbp> The DEXT is, though
Dec 21 00:20:27 <T7g> heh, make you take the battery out to switch sd cards, ewww
Dec 21 00:20:59 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Yeah, that's tragic combined with no internal storage
Dec 21 00:21:16 <Gadgetoid_mbp> basically kills the Droid dead if you like to hot swap out absurd amounts of media
Dec 21 00:22:18 <pwnguin> meh. just grab a ridiculusly large microsdhc
Dec 21 00:24:00 <toggles_2> hmm.. http://twitter.com/daedaluz/statuses/6875457945  really?
Dec 21 00:25:26 <eitreach> Meh. That's telling me a little too late.
Dec 21 00:25:39 <pwnguin> or too early
Dec 21 00:26:05 <zash> toggles_2: hm, pricedrop on n900? *hopeful*
Dec 21 00:26:17 <toggles_2> lol too late for me too
Dec 21 00:26:38 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Ha, I got mine for £350 anyway
Dec 21 00:26:47 <Gadgetoid_mbp> £50 less if my TopCashBack ever gets paid... which is unlikely
Dec 21 00:26:53 <jebba> pfft. twitter knows, ya right,.
Dec 21 00:27:04 <toggles_2> lol
Dec 21 00:27:23 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Haha, that Twitter smells like bullshit
Dec 21 00:28:05 <jebba> pricedrop when they can make enough of them. Hell seems amazon is raising the price.  It's more now than when i ordered it.
Dec 21 00:28:25 <Gadgetoid_mbp> I can just imagine Nokia execs saying "Let's alienate our entire fanbase, render our current OS obsolete and render our current hardware obsolete before we've even opened up a commercial store for it!"
Dec 21 00:29:42 <jebba> well, simple fact is that maemo 6 just isnt going to be there by then i seriously doubt.  But go get the git tree and check it out if you really want to know
Dec 21 00:30:25 <mikhas> just check the other twitter posts of that account ... this is just a hoax
Dec 21 00:31:04 <jebba> got anymore BS for us toggles_2?
Dec 21 00:31:15 * mikhas feels cheated for wasting time on twitter ... again!
Dec 21 00:31:25 <Milo-> maemo5 wasn't ready for normal users so why would maemo6 be?
Dec 21 00:31:37 <jebba> toggles_2 is trolling methinks.....
Dec 21 00:31:44 <toggles_2> lol, not me the rss app poped it up on me n900
Dec 21 00:31:47 <T7g> dude talks about getting banned from 4chan on his twitter, he's obviously a troll :p
Dec 21 00:31:57 <SpeedEvil> I see nothing wrong with 5 for normal users that don't enable extras-dev
Dec 21 00:32:14 <jebba> SpeedEvil: ?
Dec 21 00:32:27 <SpeedEvil> ->milo
Dec 21 00:32:33 <Milo-> SpeedEvil not enough applications, no store, and no manual comes with n900
Dec 21 00:32:37 <jebba> ah. ya.
Dec 21 00:32:50 <Milo-> it wasn't made for end users
Dec 21 00:32:57 <Milo-> n900 is toy for developers
Dec 21 00:33:02 <jebba> Milo-: not enough apps cuz everyone is tired of looking at spinning cursors on the website.  You can't even give a package in -testing good karma.
Dec 21 00:33:10 <jebba> great toy  :)
Dec 21 00:33:19 <Milo-> jebba exactly
Dec 21 00:33:30 <Milo-> and extras isn't enabled by default
Dec 21 00:33:40 * jebba hits ctrl-5  (reload) on browser pointed at maemo.org/packages for 50th time....
Dec 21 00:33:46 <Milo-> and normal user won't stumble upon _how to_ enable extras by accident
Dec 21 00:34:06 <jebba> well, extras they could. It is there already, they just need to uncheck it. THey could stumble upon that.
Dec 21 00:34:06 <SpeedEvil> not enough apps - yet
Dec 21 00:34:16 <SpeedEvil> It's been a month
Dec 21 00:34:16 <jebba> they ain't gonna add extras-testing accidentally
Dec 21 00:34:38 <jebba> and if the website stays like this there's only gonna be like 30 more apps by next month.
Dec 21 00:34:38 <SpeedEvil> In 3 I'd expect to see a fair number more apps
Dec 21 00:34:41 <Milo-> SpeedEvil yes but as for 'end users'
Dec 21 00:34:52 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Sheesh, Expansys have put the N900 up by £5, haha
Dec 21 00:34:54 <Milo-> apps and store is necessary for real end users to feel comfortable
Dec 21 00:35:00 <villager> Milo-: I think extras got enabled for me when I installed something from maemo select
Dec 21 00:35:16 <jebba> here's a great one for endusers :)  install burgerspace and if it works for you give it karma++  http://maemo.org/packages/package_instance/view/fremantle_extras-testing_free_armel/burgerspace/1.8.3-17/
Dec 21 00:35:35 <Milo-> jebba end users don't want to have anything to with the community websites
Dec 21 00:35:38 <Milo-> community = communism
Dec 21 00:35:48 <jebba> Milo-: they dont' have to have anythign to do with community websites
Dec 21 00:36:01 <Milo-> if they have to vote, then they do :)
Dec 21 00:36:04 <jebba> what the hell do they know about maemo. They just see "oh extra apps" <CHECK> done.
Dec 21 00:36:24 <Milo-> jebba but they won't be able to _see_ that button anywhere
Dec 21 00:36:25 <jebba> Milo-: they don't have to, just if enough devs do. But plenty users would to IF IT FUCKING WORKED.
Dec 21 00:36:35 <fnordianslip> end users shouldn't be trusted to vote.  look who they elect into governements.
Dec 21 00:36:42 <jebba> Milo-: sure, it's not that buried. Users will find that one for sure eventually.
Dec 21 00:36:44 <pupnik> ++
Dec 21 00:37:07 <Milo-> jebba I wouldn't have any faith in the end users on that matter
Dec 21 00:37:09 <jebba> wooo! I got my page to load!
Dec 21 00:37:11 <pupnik> alright, who has experience with sdl->alsa and grotty sound
Dec 21 00:37:25 <Milo-> even I had trouble finding that checkbox
Dec 21 00:37:39 <jebba> Milo-: its just a freaking checkbox. It's not like they have to open a terminal or enter any URL or anything.
Dec 21 00:37:41 <Milo-> though, finnish is confusing in technical terms
Dec 21 00:37:57 <pupnik> i can get 4 seconds of clean sound if i output at 48khz, start alsamixer and exit it
Dec 21 00:38:00 <pupnik> maybe 6
Dec 21 00:38:10 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Jesus Christ I hate PC World adverts
Dec 21 00:38:16 <zeenix> Milo-: finnish is confusing anyways :)
Dec 21 00:38:21 <Milo-> zeenix ._·
Dec 21 00:38:31 <jebba> Milo-: you make no sense. What's finnish got to do with it?
Dec 21 00:38:59 <zeenix> jebba: his phone speaks finnish to him
Dec 21 00:39:13 <jebba> ah, well if you have it set to that language....
Dec 21 00:39:25 <Milo-> finnish doesn't describe technical terms as you would expect
Dec 21 00:39:44 <Milo-> and if you set your phone's language to english, the date format is all messed up
Dec 21 00:39:56 <jebba> you can change date format even in english
Dec 21 00:40:01 <jebba> iirc
Dec 21 00:40:03 <SpeedEvil> jebba: no, you can't
Dec 21 00:40:05 <zeenix> Milo-: it is?
Dec 21 00:40:08 <Milo-> jebba you can't
Dec 21 00:40:13 <Milo-> it's a known bug
Dec 21 00:40:18 <SpeedEvil> jebba: there is a fixed date format displayed in settings per language
Dec 21 00:40:22 <Milo-> zeenix uses mm/dd/yyyy :/
Dec 21 00:40:23 <SpeedEvil> Milo-: number?
Dec 21 00:40:35 <zeenix> Milo-: even with british enlish?
Dec 21 00:40:51 <jebba> ah, just decimal separator and stuff.
Dec 21 00:41:14 <Milo-> oh actually it's dd/mm/yy for uk
Dec 21 00:41:17 * zeenix agrees with Milo- that american date format is just non-sense
Dec 21 00:41:17 <Milo-> but that's still wrong
Dec 21 00:41:34 <zeenix> yes, it certainly is :)
Dec 21 00:41:43 <Milo-> dd.mm.yyyy > everything else
Dec 21 00:42:02 <zeenix> even yyyy.mm.dd makes sense
Dec 21 00:42:37 <SpeedEvil> zeenix: but sorts
Dec 21 00:42:46 <Milo-> SpeedEvil https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=6363 and https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=463
Dec 21 00:42:48 <povbot> Bug 6363: Date format should be defined by Regional Settings, not Device Language
Dec 21 00:42:49 <povbot> Bug 463: Date format should be user defined
Dec 21 00:43:44 <zeenix> at least it's better than google speaking to me in the lang of the place i happen to be at that time
Dec 21 00:44:47 <zeenix> i was in spain the other day and it showed me the temperature of helsinki in spanish :)
Dec 21 00:45:27 <Milo-> heh
Dec 21 00:46:57 <Gadgetoid_mbp> http://www.gadgetoid.com/2009/12/21/nokia-n900-versus-motorola-droidmilestone/ ahh, nothing like a rant thinly veiled as journalism
Dec 21 00:47:40 <Gadgetoid_mbp> First page of google for "nokia n900 versus motorola droid" ... for now at least
Dec 21 00:49:11 <gtessier00> Hi everybody, anyone here has the Nokia N900?
Dec 21 00:49:17 <Gadgetoid_mbp> <--
Dec 21 00:49:23 <henningms> <--
Dec 21 00:49:39 <yuizy> <--
Dec 21 00:49:40 <lcuk> <--<--<-
Dec 21 00:50:16 <luke-jr_> for the sake of reducing spam, you should probably ask who *doesn't*
Dec 21 00:50:38 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Obligatory troll is obligatory
Dec 21 00:50:52 <gtessier00> hahaha alright... I have a small concern about it, and I'd like to have your advice... I'm from canada and tomorrow I will get one. Did any1 of you received it DOA? I know there are a lot of problems concerning the MIC
Dec 21 00:51:06 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Mine was fine
Dec 21 00:51:28 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Haven't bricked it yet, either, fingers crossed
Dec 21 00:51:38 <luke-jr_> gtessier00: more likely that has to do with which batch it came from ;)
Dec 21 00:51:47 <Gadgetoid_mbp> My iMac was fine too
Dec 21 00:51:51 <ml-maemo> anyone see my question earlier?
Dec 21 00:52:00 <Gadgetoid_mbp> I obviously have a courier that doesn't drive all their parcels around in a large cement mixer
Dec 21 00:52:01 <T7g> Anyone know an easy way to force a fsck on a filesystem at boot? not /forcefsck or the shutdown command, n900 doesn't like either.
Dec 21 00:52:37 <T7g> I switched app/mydocs and mounting it via usb leads to two linux systems mounting the same filesystem and that's kinda caused some data loss.
Dec 21 00:52:47 <Gadgetoid_mbp> ml-maemo: nope
Dec 21 00:53:59 <Milo-> <--
Dec 21 00:54:00 <ml-maemo> ok
Dec 21 00:54:14 <ml-maemo> is the vim package optified?
Dec 21 00:54:51 <Milo-> yes
Dec 21 00:55:20 <Milo-> if it wasn't, it would have a bug report
Dec 21 00:55:32 <Milo-> and I can clearly see it in the /opt/maemo/usr/*/vim
Dec 21 00:55:39 <ml-maemo> cool
Dec 21 00:55:43 <Gadgetoid_mbp> NOOO NOO NAEO an article calling the Snapdragon "Far superior" than Arm A8, and looking only at raw megahertz values!
Dec 21 00:55:58 <SpeedEvil> loltards.
Dec 21 00:56:21 <Gadgetoid_mbp> I wish there was an informed article out there
Dec 21 00:56:30 <Milo-> Gadgetoid_mbp I can make one
Dec 21 00:56:31 <Gadgetoid_mbp> I don't want to write it myself, it'll be ill informed
Dec 21 00:56:35 <SpeedEvil> It's the internet!
Dec 21 00:56:47 <Milo-> just cat few thousand characters from /dev/urandom
Dec 21 00:56:59 <luke-jr_> Milo-: I'm not sure that has anything to do with the CPU <.<
Dec 21 00:57:06 <luke-jr_> please do it based on calculating pi
Dec 21 00:57:07 <luke-jr_> kthx
Dec 21 00:57:22 <Milo-> Who says random characters isn't informal?
Dec 21 00:57:34 <Milo-> made up numbers are just as useful as calculated numbers
Dec 21 00:57:43 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Haha
Dec 21 00:57:46 <Milo-> so why wouldn't the same thing apply to informal text?
Dec 21 00:58:00 <luke-jr_> Milo-: no, random will bottleneck on the RNG
Dec 21 00:58:17 <Milo-> potato tomato
Dec 21 00:58:30 <luke-jr_> random data is hardware-generated, not CPU-generated
Dec 21 00:58:59 <Milo-> and I never said I was going to give accurate data about the CPU
Dec 21 01:00:18 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Milo-: Face it, you need to be dumb to troll
Dec 21 01:00:31 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Smart troll is too smart
Dec 21 01:00:42 <Milo-> I wasn't trolling ._·
Dec 21 01:01:21 <Milo-> you obviously missed the Dilbert reference, so let me point it out for you: http://u.meelo.org/dilbert/AccurateNumbers.png
Dec 21 01:01:27 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Subtle troll is subtle
Dec 21 01:01:47 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Dilbert troll is dilbert
Dec 21 01:01:55 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Sorry, I read too much Garfield
Dec 21 01:04:15 <Gadgetoid_mbp> I clearly need to study more Dilbert
Dec 21 01:04:59 <pupnik> ok i really need to know this.  what program/process in maemo5 keeps touching the mixer?  i need to suspend that
Dec 21 01:05:09 <Gadgetoid_mbp> HTC Sense UI, which is based on the principles: "Make it mine," "Stay Close" and "Discover the Unexpected,"
Dec 21 01:05:16 <Gadgetoid_mbp> *vomit*
Dec 21 01:12:17 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Oh dear, a review favouring a capacitive touchscreen over resistive because "it's more responsive"
Dec 21 01:13:00 <T7g> eh, let the people buy shit, they'll just always continue to be jealous of the real gadget geeks ;p
Dec 21 01:13:25 <Gadgetoid_mbp> True T7g, but it's a sign of terrible things to come
Dec 21 01:13:26 * SpeedEvil ponders how to sell inductive touchscreens to the unwashed.
Dec 21 01:13:40 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Can you imagine a future when we have absurdly high definition screens... coupled with horribly inaccurate finger-only input?
Dec 21 01:14:16 <SpeedEvil> finger input that could track which finger - and the orientation could be stupidly powerful
Dec 21 01:14:23 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Those of us with working eyes would be doomed forever to prod and poke hopelessly at tiny URLs with our nacho-fattened fingers, or constantly zoom in and out
Dec 21 01:14:42 <Gadgetoid_mbp> SpeedEvil: the only solution I want is a combination of btoh
Dec 21 01:14:45 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Or both
Dec 21 01:15:01 <Gadgetoid_mbp> BTOH... almost BOFH... dun dun DUN
Dec 21 01:16:44 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Well the one article i actually bothered to finish reading turned out in favour of the N900. Conclusive evidence that my viewpoint is, indeed, the correct one
Dec 21 01:17:19 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Believe me, if the Droid was better than the N900 I'd be ebaying my N900 for a profit and buying a Droid on contract a couple of days ago
Dec 21 01:17:30 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Preaching to the choir... whee!
Dec 21 01:20:51 <jebba> got wxwidgets2.6 to build on armel  :)
Dec 21 01:21:12 <Gadgetoid_mbp> I'd say I love you, if I knew what the hell that was
Dec 21 01:21:45 <jebba> cross-platform toolkit.  Not sure how it's gonna look on maemo thoguh.   But lots of applications need it to build.
Dec 21 01:21:47 <gtessier00> IMO, maemo is 10x better than android
Dec 21 01:22:02 <jebba> they did have a ./configure --enable-hildon at one point, but back in the 710 era AFAICT
Dec 21 01:22:03 <Gadgetoid_mbp> I can't quite come to terms with Android
Dec 21 01:22:15 <jebba> android is java crap.   n900 is debian.
Dec 21 01:22:19 <jebba> no comparison
Dec 21 01:23:25 <gtessier00> n900 has flash support, a GREAT thing
Dec 21 01:24:00 <jebba> proprietary flash...
Dec 21 01:24:14 <Gadgetoid_mbp> The Droid will have Flash support, but the browser is already a deal slower than the N900s
Dec 21 01:24:20 <luke-jr_> N900 is *not* Debian
Dec 21 01:24:21 <Gadgetoid_mbp> So I can only wince at the thought of flash in it
Dec 21 01:24:38 <Gadgetoid_mbp> If Maemo isn't a Debian derivative, what the hell is apt doing in it?
Dec 21 01:24:57 <luke-jr_> key word: derivative
Dec 21 01:25:01 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Haha, touche
Dec 21 01:25:08 <jebba> i'm still really impressed at how fast the n900/maemo5 is.   I have a sharp netwalker running ubuntu--roughly the same spec (but more memory in netwalker) and the netwalker is a DOG by comparison.
Dec 21 01:25:11 <luke-jr_> huge difference
Dec 21 01:25:12 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Everything's a sodding Debian derivative these days anyway
Dec 21 01:25:24 <jebba> Gadgetoid_mbp: it is a debian derivative.
Dec 21 01:25:26 <Gadgetoid_mbp> It's the grandaddy of all relevant linux
Dec 21 01:25:40 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Errr, apart from CentOS
Dec 21 01:25:41 <jebba> well, fedora/rh pretty relevant...
Dec 21 01:25:43 <gtessier00> http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=435924#post435924
Dec 21 01:25:49 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Pfff, redshat
Dec 21 01:25:52 <Gadgetoid_mbp> I mean hat
Dec 21 01:25:54 <gtessier00> oops sorry I didn't to put this here, hehe :P
Dec 21 01:25:55 <luke-jr_> jebba: not really
Dec 21 01:26:09 <luke-jr_> but even still, I bet RedHat is derived from Debian somehow
Dec 21 01:26:33 <Milo-> it's not.
Dec 21 01:26:43 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Lies, damn lies, and statistics
Dec 21 01:27:15 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Forums, being the go-to place for all complaints, create some of the most inaccurate "statistics" I've ever laid eyes upon
Dec 21 01:27:47 <luke-jr_> Milo-: IIRC, Debian is the first Linux-based OS... kinda hard to *not* derive from it when starting one
Dec 21 01:28:13 <Milo-> red hat came roughly at the same time
Dec 21 01:28:25 <Gadgetoid_mbp> red hat sounds like the tip of a penis...
Dec 21 01:28:48 <luke-jr_> ...
Dec 21 01:28:59 <Milo-> uhm, yes..
Dec 21 01:29:08 <Gadgetoid_mbp> I whipped out my red had for a bit of gentoo, and she thought it was a bit debian and said she only likes mandriva and corel.... uuhh
Dec 21 01:29:19 <Gadgetoid_mbp> And a bit of yellow dog
Dec 21 01:29:22 <Milo-> My Gentoos are awesome
Dec 21 01:29:25 <jebba> hah
Dec 21 01:29:28 <jebba> yikes.
Dec 21 01:29:36 * jebba used to work at yellow dog
Dec 21 01:29:41 <jebba> well, terrasoft
Dec 21 01:29:43 <luke-jr_> actually, now that you mention it...
Dec 21 01:29:56 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Turquoise Dog
Dec 21 01:30:03 <luke-jr_> RedHat is the only Linux-based desktop OS I've used that is missing the tempfile command
Dec 21 01:30:16 <jebba> 9 years ago now. yowza
Dec 21 01:30:30 <luke-jr_> which turns out to be part of debianutils pkg
Dec 21 01:30:31 <luke-jr_> <.<
Dec 21 01:30:38 <Milo-> Gentoo is the only distro that makes sense.
Dec 21 01:30:49 <Gadgetoid_mbp> Sheesh, 9 years ago I thought work was something people made up to scare me
Dec 21 01:31:06 <luke-jr_> ...
Dec 21 01:31:30 * luke-jr_ would get so much flak if he logged on as luke-jr_mbp...
Dec 21 01:31:41 <Gadgetoid_mbp> And on that note, I should probably sleep because I've got work tomorrow and am still physically hungover from Friday night
Dec 21 01:31:55 <luke-jr_> Stskeeps: wouldn't I? :P
Dec 21 01:32:03 <Gadgetoid_mbp> In future, I'll binge drink instead of dancing... the side effects last for significantly less time
Dec 21 01:32:10 <T7g> Well, we'll see if inserting this /sbin/fsck -y /dev/mmcblk0p1 before mounting /home in rcS-late keeps my n900 from booting ;P I really couldn't think of any other easier way
Dec 21 01:32:20 <Gadgetoid_mbp> You cannot physically strain yourself by lying unconscious on the floor
Dec 21 01:32:33 <jebba> T7g: give it a -v too
Dec 21 01:32:41 <Milo-> I should install gentoo on N900
Dec 21 01:32:49 <Milo-> but I don't think it could handle all the compiling :(
Dec 21 01:32:54 <jebba> wow. DONT give it a -v
Dec 21 01:32:54 <jebba> sry
Dec 21 01:33:04 <T7g> a lil late fer that now but I'm sure that won't stop it from booting if it's gonna.
Dec 21 01:33:04 <jebba> was thinking that was verbose T7g ...
Dec 21 01:33:10 <pupnik> cat /proc/asound/card0/pcm0p/sub0/status yields about 12 seconds of workin, then state: XRUN happens and sound gets sdistorted
Dec 21 01:33:19 <jebba> that would just give version heh
Dec 21 01:33:32 <T7g> hm, does -y say yes in your output?
Dec 21 01:33:37 <T7g> I was consulting my gentoo's manpage
Dec 21 01:33:44 <jebba>  -V is verbose -v is version  (at least in teh "real" one)
Dec 21 01:34:00 <jebba> all bets are off on the busybox fsck, check it carefully
Dec 21 01:34:05 <Milo-> that kind of breaks the GNU standards :P
Dec 21 01:34:10 <luke-jr_> Milo-: my N810 runs Gentoo
Dec 21 01:34:14 <luke-jr_> or did anyhow
Dec 21 01:34:19 <Milo-> heh
Dec 21 01:34:20 <jebba> oh wait, it may be a real one
Dec 21 01:34:27 <Milo-> luke-jr_ how did that work out?
Dec 21 01:34:36 <jebba> ya, it's from e2fsprogs
Dec 21 01:34:41 <luke-jr_> Milo-: the only problems are Nokia's fault <.<
Dec 21 01:34:53 <Milo-> really?
Dec 21 01:34:54 <Milo-> :o
Dec 21 01:34:56 <luke-jr_> Milo-: N810 is too closed
Dec 21 01:35:07 <luke-jr_> N900 in theory should be slightly better
Dec 21 01:35:22 <Milo-> though, you would still be using binary packages
Dec 21 01:35:27 <luke-jr_> ...
Dec 21 01:35:33 <Milo-> not sources
Dec 21 01:35:44 <luke-jr_> no, Gentoo is from source :p
Dec 21 01:35:53 <Milo-> even the maemo packages?
Dec 21 01:35:56 <luke-jr_> Nokia gifted slonopotamus a N900, but he doesn't have time to do this stuff anymore I think
Dec 21 01:36:00 <luke-jr_> Milo-: I don't run Maemo.
Dec 21 01:36:06 <luke-jr_> Gentoo is Gentoo, not Maemo
Dec 21 01:36:35 <luke-jr_> I ran console mode and, on occasion, KDE 4.3
Dec 21 01:36:55 <Milo-> were you able to make calls with it?
Dec 21 01:37:04 <luke-jr_> um
Dec 21 01:37:08 <luke-jr_> no
Dec 21 01:37:09 <Milo-> :D
Dec 21 01:37:21 <luke-jr_> I didn't bother
Dec 21 01:37:27 <luke-jr_> I can just pick up my hard phone while at home
Dec 21 01:37:43 <luke-jr_> and there's not enough Wifi here to make it worth the effort to setup a softphone
Dec 21 01:38:03 <luke-jr_> Milo-: don't forget Nxx0 are not phones, they're handhelds.
Dec 21 01:38:12 <luke-jr_> N900 is the first model to even *support* cellular frequencies
Dec 21 01:38:29 <luke-jr_> N810 is strictly 802.11bg
Dec 21 01:38:35 <Milo-> oh, did not know that
Dec 21 01:42:01 <pupnik> ah, our libsdl src/audio/alsa/SDL_alsa_audio.c is simply not recovering from XRUN state
Dec 21 01:43:34 <pupnik> and when i run alsamixer, that gets fixed for a while
Dec 21 01:45:37 <jebba> [2009-12-21 03:39:16] ffmpeg 4:0.5+svn20090706-5 has been queued for loading into fremantle extras-devel repository     :)
Dec 21 01:49:48 <pupnik> nice jebba
Dec 21 01:53:25 <T7g> hm, it's still sitting here displayin' nothin' and I would imagine that the fsck would be done by now.
Dec 21 01:54:34 <jebba> T7g: you need a kernel with a console...
Dec 21 01:54:54 <T7g> that's pretty crappy that it wasn't included.
Dec 21 01:55:16 <T7g> but I assume when it sits and doesn't show the graphical dot thing that it's still doing something on the console
Dec 21 01:55:42 <T7g> unless, it's literally hanging there because I pretty much couldn't do the fsck like that
Dec 21 01:57:44 <T7g> Suppose I'll give it until the reflash images download;p
Dec 21 01:59:25 <jebba> well, if its not hung at the dots, that's actually a better sign
Dec 21 01:59:37 <jebba> what size and what exactly are you fscking anyway?
Dec 21 02:00:06 <T7g> Well, I switched the partition type flags on apps and mydocs
Dec 21 02:00:34 <T7g> The bad thing was, my linux system was automounting apps (/home) instead of mydocs because of it being mmcblk0p1
Dec 21 02:01:03 <T7g> Soo I was basically concurrently using a filesystem, I tried fscking it a couple times before I realized I was fscking a live system.
Dec 21 02:01:19 <T7g> It worked fine but the used space total was very wrong and I had random corruption issues
Dec 21 02:02:01 <T7g> I resolved to just not use it via usb anymore however I figured I'd fsck it now and get all my data over wifi and not worry about the corruption.
Dec 21 02:02:20 <pupnik> http://mxr.maemo.org/fremantle/source/libsdl1.2/src/audio/alsa/SDL_alsa_audio.c  Lines 326 - 348 - there must be some way to recover from underrun
Dec 21 02:02:38 <T7g> I take it, there is no way to fsck /home (or mmcblk0p1) without doing it before it boots
Dec 21 02:11:58 <jebba> T7g: not that i know of
Dec 21 02:12:44 <T7g> I feel better knowing I had no other choice :P
Dec 21 02:13:23 <T7g> On the other hand, is there any way I can tweak the n900 to export a device over usb other than mmcblk0p1?
Dec 21 02:14:04 <SpeedEvil> pupnik: there isn't - other than to play fake data
Dec 21 02:14:22 <SpeedEvil> pupnik: underrun means you ran out of audio data when the DAC needed some.
Dec 21 02:14:27 <SpeedEvil> pupnik: there is no way back.
Dec 21 02:14:33 <pupnik> SpeedEvil: when i run alsamixer and exit, the sound gets fixed
Dec 21 02:14:50 <pupnik> while playing
Dec 21 02:16:27 <pupnik> i guess i'll look at what alsamixer does on exit
Dec 21 02:16:44 <SpeedEvil> pupnik: sorry - not reading code at this time - migrane, and can't get to sleep.
Dec 21 02:17:01 <pupnik> np, it's nice to have someone to chat with
Dec 21 02:17:06 <pupnik> my eyes are starting to go
Dec 21 02:17:13 <cehteh> anyone working on bringin bash3 to maemo?
Dec 21 02:17:28 <SpeedEvil> Does it support multitouch?
Dec 21 02:17:52 <arachnist> how would bash3 support multitouch?
Dec 21 02:18:12 <T7g> jebba, you said that it not freezing on the dots was better than it freezing before, is there some keycombo I can hit to get into interactive mode or something to skip this fsck I put in before mount /home in event.d/rcS-late?
Dec 21 02:18:48 <jebba> T7g: the only thing i can think of is trying to put it into r&d mode
Dec 21 02:18:59 <AakashPatel> what was tha app that lets me control the tv over ir?
Dec 21 02:19:07 * cehteh tries to compile bash4 .. :P
Dec 21 02:19:10 <jebba> T7g: with the flasher:   ./flasher-3.5 --enable-rd-mode
Dec 21 02:19:12 <T7g> Well I have the reflasher and images now.
Dec 21 02:19:15 <jebba> then fix it, then disable it.
Dec 21 02:19:23 <jebba> T7g: try r&d mode first i guess
Dec 21 02:19:36 <T7g> What does r&d mode give me access to?
Dec 21 02:19:59 <jebba> just makes the device weird and half broken.  But it does skip fscks  ;)
Dec 21 02:20:11 <T7g> This is a manual one I put in myself :p
Dec 21 02:20:17 <jebba> but again, it skips nokia's fscks, not sure about it skipping your fsck  ;)
Dec 21 02:20:32 <jebba> worth a shot. One freaking line. Easier than a flash.
Dec 21 02:21:01 <T7g> yeah, you're right, if not I'm due for a flash. Since I don't have to debrand the phone I guess I owe it one :p
Dec 21 02:21:24 <AakashPatel> aircrack lets me crap wep passwords, right?
Dec 21 02:21:50 <AakashPatel> yeh
Dec 21 02:21:51 <AakashPatel> sweet
Dec 21 02:23:21 <T7g> To be clear, nothing I can do to the files in /etc could make the device unflashable right? It's all the same nand and the nokia bootloader can reflash as long as I don't mess with wherever it is?
Dec 21 02:23:53 <jebba> ya, you can rm -rf /etc  and still reflash ok
Dec 21 02:24:15 <jebba> you LOSE all / on reflash, except /home which also contains /opt
Dec 21 02:24:49 <T7g> Shouldn't be an issue that I flagged that partition ext3 and it is ext3?
Dec 21 02:25:03 <jebba> it'll just blow that out and overwrite it
Dec 21 02:25:20 <jebba> the flash doesn't write it like it's a file system, it does it more like "dd", if you get what i mean
Dec 21 02:25:20 <T7g> So /home will be destroyed regardless?
Dec 21 02:25:30 <T7g> I know what ya mean
Dec 21 02:25:34 <jebba>  /home WON't be destroyed.  Just the 256M gets destroyed
Dec 21 02:25:52 <jebba> ah, but it may have a hard time mounting it if it's formatted ext3.  Not sure there. hehe
Dec 21 02:26:08 <T7g> I basically just want to come up with a plan to have a non-corrupted ext3 filesystem (even if I can't mount it over usb)
Dec 21 02:26:09 <jebba> worst case you ahve to blow out /home too
Dec 21 02:26:21 <T7g> yeah that's not an issue, made a backup of phone settings before
Dec 21 02:27:12 <jebba> T7g:   you may want to try this free one for kicks too:  http://www.nopcode.org/0xFFFF/
Dec 21 02:27:34 <cehteh> [sbox-FREMANTLE_X86: ~/bash-4.0] > /usr/local/bin/bash --version
Dec 21 02:27:35 <cehteh> GNU bash, version 2.05b.0(1)-release (i686-pc-linux-gnu)
Dec 21 02:27:39 <jebba> you'll need the latest mercurial code with it though:
Dec 21 02:27:39 <jebba> hg clone http://hg.youterm.com/0xFFFF
Dec 21 02:27:45 <jebba> nice
Dec 21 02:27:48 <cehteh> eww does scratchbox something specual there? :)
Dec 21 02:27:52 <T7g> I was having weird stuff happen like icons disappearing from the desktop and video file corruption on reboot. I'm almost sure it was because both the n900 and my gentoo box had mounted the partition at the same time, to make it worse I fsck'd it a ton
Dec 21 02:28:17 <jebba> ah, i thought you had bash4 built
Dec 21 02:28:36 <jebba> haha, ya, fscking live filesystems ....
Dec 21 02:28:43 <T7g> I went well enough
Dec 21 02:29:03 <T7g> here's the issue, it always said I had something like 16777775T used in df -h
Dec 21 02:29:12 <T7g> and as I said, stuff disappeared here and there.
Dec 21 02:29:39 <T7g> it let me write to it but I didn't want the uncertainty, I had a disappearing wiiload icon that was there at the start and then deleted itself when the desktop finished opening
Dec 21 02:29:59 <SplasPood> hrm.. libc6-dev is mia
Dec 21 02:30:05 <cehteh> jebba: well yes so i thought
Dec 21 02:31:27 <cehteh> ./bash --version
Dec 21 02:31:27 <cehteh> GNU bash, version 4.0.0(2)-release (i486-pc-linux-gnu)
Dec 21 02:31:34 <cehteh> strange things
Dec 21 02:32:38 <T7g> jebba, What exactly activates nokia's fscks? 34 mounts?
Dec 21 02:32:54 <jebba> seems to fsck a lot more than that.
Dec 21 02:36:56 <jebba> ffmpeg is now in the extras-devel repo  :)
Dec 21 02:38:59 <T7g> how do ya know it's fscking jeb?
Dec 21 02:39:13 <T7g> I would've left rcS-late alone if I thought it was gonna fsck sooner!
Dec 21 02:40:45 <T7g> Is the whole partition flag switching and remaking the fs's a worse idea than say running an ext in a loopback? eghh. I just don't like vfat and all the systems I use around here are all linux (they can mount vfat but..) so it's not as if I needed vfat
Dec 21 02:40:49 <jebba> dont really know how you know witout a console enabled kernel
Dec 21 02:41:05 <jebba> ya, exact same here. I dont need vfat at all
Dec 21 02:41:57 <cehteh> what i saied .. reformat, disable the storage thing, run networking, sshfs or samba when you need to transfer files
Dec 21 02:42:03 <T7g> What is your solution? Did you just resist the temptation and leave it as vfat?
Dec 21 02:42:06 <T7g> yeah
Dec 21 02:42:22 <T7g> I agree sir, I think that's where I am headed after the reflash-- there is an option to disable usb mass storage mode?
Dec 21 02:42:57 <cehteh> would be cool if nokia would support/develop/sponsor some kind of virtual fat driver
Dec 21 02:43:12 <cehteh> looks like a vfat storage device but is just a file-server
Dec 21 02:43:52 <cehteh>  ... PASSED 125 TESTS, 0 SKIPPED
Dec 21 02:43:54 <T7g> indeed, but it would be so much easier if we had some config file where we could simply specify what partition was exported over USB when it was connected in mass storage mode.
Dec 21 02:44:07 <cehteh> yay .. that was fremantle x86
Dec 21 02:44:17 <cehteh> now lets try with armel
Dec 21 02:46:42 <T7g> ehh... I almost wonder if I could hexedit the flasher image to change the partition table to better resemble a normal linux system and flash that, like keep the partition designations but change the cylinder starts and finishes since the image obviously won't flash to the entire device at once..
Dec 21 02:47:20 <cehteh> in theory yes, but it certainly has some checksum to be corrected too
Dec 21 02:47:28 <T7g> ahh yeah, durr
Dec 21 02:47:33 <cehteh> and if something goes wrong you may brick your device
Dec 21 02:47:48 <T7g> What do you have to do to make an n900 unflashable?
Dec 21 02:48:04 <T7g> Where is the flasher bootloader stored? on nand? in rom?
Dec 21 02:48:08 <cehteh> dunno if it reflashes the firmware needed on the device side to handle flashing
Dec 21 02:48:25 <cehteh> iirc the device has no rom, only flash/nand
Dec 21 02:48:39 <T7g> eghh, that's not so great
Dec 21 02:48:49 <cehteh> call it flexible and cheap :P
Dec 21 02:48:57 <cehteh> but i am not sure about that
Dec 21 02:49:09 <T7g> neither am I
Dec 21 02:49:45 <T7g> Would be nice imho if we had a how to brick an n900 permanently so we know what steps not to do.
Dec 21 02:49:58 <T7g> I mean obviously, don't disconnect the usb cable or power off while reflashing but
Dec 21 02:50:12 <T7g> Other things that could cause you to be screwed without a crazy solder job
Dec 21 02:50:26 <cehteh> grr .. bash4 doesnt compile on arm
Dec 21 02:50:37 <jebba> T7g: you can extract the flasher image using the flasher-3.5 program
Dec 21 02:50:52 <cehteh> or maybe sdk bug ..
Dec 21 02:51:36 <jebba> what's the error?
Dec 21 02:51:39 <T7g> Well, I can roll with the more hackish ways to do it
Dec 21 02:51:46 <T7g> I really don't need to use the USB function
Dec 21 02:51:49 <jebba> T7g: then check out 0xFFFF  :)
Dec 21 02:52:09 <T7g> emerging hg atm ;p
Dec 21 02:52:31 <jebba> T7g: did you get latest hg of it?
Dec 21 02:53:29 <T7g> haven't even tried since I didn't have hg, but if you're asking about my hg version I run ~amd64 so I assume it's the best without going into ~x86
Dec 21 02:53:31 <jebba> cuz the latest tarball of it 100% for sure doesn't have n900 code, but the latest hg 100% does.
Dec 21 02:53:50 <jebba> you'll definitely need hg of 0xFFFF, not tarball.
Dec 21 02:54:06 <T7g> Oh yeah, just cloned it
Dec 21 02:54:16 <jebba> ah ok
Dec 21 02:54:44 <jebba> cool, git is now in the repo too :)
Dec 21 02:55:14 <T7g> I'm not a linux newbie, but I'm not an expert, I'm not a coder, but I can code- just not well. I kinda just do good on doing general things. Last project I did was bringing Gentoo to the Wii
Dec 21 02:56:29 <jebba> sounds like me
Dec 21 02:56:47 <cehteh> configure bash4 with --disable-readline .. what a shame :P
Dec 21 02:56:53 <jebba> i just poke at it and beat the code until it worksforme
Dec 21 02:57:09 <jebba> cehteh: there is readline4-dev btw
Dec 21 02:57:24 <jebba> if it wanted readline5 you may just be able to downgrade it
Dec 21 02:57:32 <kaudio> hello
Dec 21 02:57:42 <cehteh> i only need a more recent bash for a test script
Dec 21 02:57:54 <cehteh> and i got linker errors so prolly not a dev package problem
Dec 21 02:58:02 <T7g> okay, well, this n900 looks like this fsck won't get done anytime soon since it's been an hour and a half, and I did a whole badblock test in 35 minutes. I'll try the r&d mode
Dec 21 02:58:03 <cehteh> worked on x86 but not on armel
Dec 21 02:58:48 <cehteh> fsck over vfat?
Dec 21 02:59:17 <T7g> nope, ext3, I did the vfat/ext partition switch thing with sfdisk
Dec 21 02:59:47 <T7g> so I inserted... /sbin/fsck -y /dev/mmcblk0p1 right before /bin/mount /home in /etc/event.d/rcS-late
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Mon Dec 21 02:59:57 2009