**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Mon Feb 08 02:59:57 2010 Feb 08 03:02:16 * qole walks away again... will return in 5 minutes to see if he's been kicked... Feb 08 03:03:09 zerojay, my dsl often dies for over 3 and under 9 mins Feb 08 03:03:57 qole: you're not being kicked. Feb 08 03:05:27 luke-jr, thanks for making my N900 buzz and beep so I came back before 5 minutes ;) Feb 08 03:05:39 qole: ... Feb 08 03:05:52 yeah. Like that. Feb 08 03:06:05 qole: qole qole Feb 08 03:07:04 luke-jr, cut it out! Feb 08 03:07:18 hello, Feb 08 03:07:50 luke-jr, you are interfering with SCIENCE! Feb 08 03:08:04 qole: lies Feb 08 03:08:14 should i installed just scratchbox or maemo sdk to compile some cli applications for the n900 ? Feb 08 03:08:23 install* Feb 08 03:10:06 * ShadowJK has a openvpn setup to his server to make irc cope with n900 changing from wifi to gprs etc Feb 08 03:11:33 my wrt54gl seems to have okay powersaving, but it has srsly crappy range (less than 10m) Feb 08 03:11:52 N900evil: Your DSL is completely fucked then. Feb 08 03:21:43 * qole got kicked again... :( Feb 08 03:21:52 [21:16:18] <-- qole has left this server (Ping timeout: 248 seconds). Feb 08 03:23:20 qole: no, not kicked, your connection sucks Feb 08 03:23:23 * qole is embarrassed. .. hit the close button accidentally... Feb 08 03:23:39 lulz Feb 08 03:24:00 but what's going on with the ping? Feb 08 03:24:12 it sucks Feb 08 03:24:36 qole: when I say "Ping", you reply "pong" as fast as possible, k? Feb 08 03:24:57 what? ok Feb 08 03:25:00 ping Feb 08 03:25:09 I will pretype pong... Feb 08 03:25:14 qole: FAIL Feb 08 03:25:28 ok ready to pong Feb 08 03:25:31 ping Feb 08 03:25:32 pong Feb 08 03:25:35 ping Feb 08 03:25:36 pong Feb 08 03:25:36 26 seconds Feb 08 03:25:37 ping Feb 08 03:25:39 pong Feb 08 03:25:40 ping Feb 08 03:25:41 pong Feb 08 03:25:42 ping Feb 08 03:25:43 pong Feb 08 03:25:44 ping Feb 08 03:25:45 pong Feb 08 03:25:49 ping Feb 08 03:25:49 pinf Feb 08 03:25:49 pong Feb 08 03:25:53 ponf Feb 08 03:25:55 pinf? Feb 08 03:25:57 poof? Feb 08 03:26:01 ping Feb 08 03:26:09 ¬ping Feb 08 03:26:10 qole: SLOW! Feb 08 03:26:13 ~ping Feb 08 03:26:14 ~pong Feb 08 03:26:23 ~burn qole Feb 08 03:26:24 * infobot pours gasoline all over qole, ignites the fire, and then enjoys some toasty marshmallows with the glorious blaze Feb 08 03:26:24 yah and what does this prove exactly? Feb 08 03:26:27 ~kill qole Feb 08 03:26:28 * infobot shoots a magneto-ionized anti-graviton gun at qole Feb 08 03:26:38 ~freeze qole Feb 08 03:26:43 ~fail Feb 08 03:26:45 somebody said fail was what happens to you when you follow gamespot's game advice. standing in the fire. Feb 08 03:26:45 neat Feb 08 03:27:06 ~slap crashanddie Feb 08 03:27:07 * infobot slaps crashanddie, keep your grubby fingers to yourself! Feb 08 03:27:13 eheheheh Feb 08 03:27:22 ~kick qole Feb 08 03:27:23 * infobot kicks qole Feb 08 03:27:42 ~punch infobot Feb 08 03:27:43 * infobot lets fly with a wild haymaker which catches infobot right on the nose Feb 08 03:28:11 out for lunch, bbl Feb 08 03:28:20 how do you do the trout one? Feb 08 03:28:32 ~trout infobot Feb 08 03:28:33 * infobot slaps infobot around a bit with a large trout! Feb 08 03:28:41 ha yes! Feb 08 03:29:27 ~fun Feb 08 03:29:28 from memory, fun is what I'm not, or what I am missing Feb 08 03:29:46 ~beauty Feb 08 03:29:48 well, beauty is in the eye of the beer holder... Feb 08 03:29:58 ~maemo Feb 08 03:29:59 [maemo] http://maemo.nokia.com/ http://maemo.org/ http://www.forum.nokia.com/Technology_Topics/Device_Platforms/Maemo.xhtml Feb 08 03:30:17 ~n900 Feb 08 03:30:18 n900 is, like, a wooden box with stained cans inside Feb 08 03:30:26 huh? Feb 08 03:30:48 ~n800 Feb 08 03:30:57 ~qole Feb 08 03:31:10 What, no snappy insult? ;/ Feb 08 03:31:11 infobot is dead. Feb 08 03:31:30 ~trout zerojay Feb 08 03:31:31 ~burn himeself Feb 08 03:31:32 * infobot slaps zerojay around a bit with a large trout! Feb 08 03:31:32 * infobot pours gasoline all over himeself, ignites the fire, and then enjoys some toasty marshmallows with the glorious blaze Feb 08 03:31:52 ~zerojay Feb 08 03:32:21 huh. Just stays silent if it doesn't know Feb 08 03:32:22 Any packaging geniuses awake? Feb 08 03:32:44 I know how to use py2deb! Feb 08 03:33:00 ui know dpkg-#3/@?k Feb 08 03:33:03 woops Feb 08 03:33:08 gah Feb 08 03:33:17 damn n900 kb Feb 08 03:33:30 i know dpkg-dev Feb 08 03:33:32 py2deb is for packaging things that don't need to be compiled. Feb 08 03:33:59 damn nopp keyboard Feb 08 03:34:13 I've got an adblocking/flashblocking CSS file that I want to package to replace the disappearing adblock plus... and I'm lazy. Feb 08 03:34:40 py2deb would be perfect for a css file. Feb 08 03:34:45 Something's actually not working in my scratchbox anymore and it's late and I don't feel like fucking with it. Feb 08 03:34:53 py2deb isn't just meant for python packages? Feb 08 03:35:28 yeah I use it for all my packages, they're shell scripts and such. Feb 08 03:35:44 Oh, cool.. and you just run it on your device? Feb 08 03:36:46 yes Feb 08 03:38:03 sweet Feb 08 03:38:47 does the n900 by default support m4v videos? Feb 08 03:39:13 see my git repo for an example of how to set up a project folder... https://garage.maemo.org/plugins/ggit/browse.php/?p=easy-deb-chroot;a=tree;f=fremantle/easy-deb-chroot;h=1f4aa7f114340ca9abfb2ab63e0876b5dcde36d3;hb=dab6b987af82acf4a4c93bf02418bc725c537bc5 Feb 08 03:39:21 O_o Feb 08 03:39:22 yikes! Feb 08 03:39:29 tinyurl plz Feb 08 03:39:34 * zerojay browser explode. Feb 08 03:39:42 Now THAT is a big URL Feb 08 03:40:39 lol Feb 08 03:40:55 that fills up half my screen xD Feb 08 03:42:19 http://tinyurl.com/ycobxts Feb 08 03:44:18 zerojay, did you see http://tinyurl.com/ycobxts Feb 08 03:49:21 ~test Feb 08 03:49:22 Failed! Feb 08 03:51:11 ~coin Feb 08 03:51:12 extra, extra, read all about it, coin is flipped... heads or tails? Feb 08 03:51:26 ~heads Feb 08 03:52:12 ~tails Feb 08 03:52:25 qole: Yeah, thanks. Feb 08 03:53:01 hey it didn't hang up on me! Feb 08 03:54:25 ~botsnack Feb 08 03:54:25 DocScrutinizer: :) Feb 08 03:55:28 ~blow up Feb 08 03:55:29 * infobot blows up Feb 08 03:55:41 tzzz Feb 08 03:55:45 ~die Feb 08 03:55:46 * infobot takes two shots to the head and crumples to the ground, lifeless. Feb 08 03:55:55 LOL Feb 08 03:59:23 ~night Feb 08 03:59:24 G'night docscrutinizer, get out of here. Feb 08 04:01:14 ~attack DocScrutinizer Feb 08 04:01:16 * infobot grabs a pen, screams like she's possessed, and begins chasing DocScrutinizer Feb 08 04:01:45 duh, never knew infobot is a female Feb 08 04:02:00 she isn't Feb 08 04:02:07 lol Feb 08 04:02:08 lol Feb 08 04:03:08 welcome to the internet, where men are men, women are men, and 8 year olds are fbi agents Feb 08 04:05:33 ...and drunken spanish dudes fail to pass the turing test Feb 08 04:07:27 and qole pings users and chats with bots Feb 08 04:07:43 woohoo, 200th post on tmo! Feb 08 04:10:49 xnt14: hi troll Feb 08 04:10:55 Vcongratulations xD Feb 08 04:11:44 reading tmo? how do you manage to do so? Feb 08 04:11:59 crashanddie, I'm such a spammer. Feb 08 04:12:30 GAN900: did you use my email address for porn sites again? Feb 08 04:12:39 crashanddie: lol Feb 08 04:12:41 xnt14 is a troll ? - i talk to him all the time :/ Feb 08 04:12:43 GAN900: at least try abstinence while you're in the hospital Feb 08 04:12:59 crashanddie, nah, just breached 5000 posts on tmo months ago. Feb 08 04:13:07 crashanddie: btw I saw your edit on the hak5 wiki. heh :P Feb 08 04:13:25 on the community projects section Feb 08 04:13:43 what toolchain should i use with scratchbox for the n900? Feb 08 04:14:01 scratchbox-toolchain-arm-gcc3.3-glibc2.3? Feb 08 04:14:08 or scratchbox-toolchain-arm-gcc3.2-uclibc20040229? Feb 08 04:14:55 5 UNCONFIRMED crit+ bugs in the past 24 hours Feb 08 04:14:56 bleh Feb 08 04:16:04 sorry, I probably missed some stuff Feb 08 04:16:06 * GAN900 rubs temples at http://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=8896 Feb 08 04:16:08 Bug 8896: Microphone is dead Feb 08 04:16:10 heh, maemo stabilizes :-P Feb 08 04:16:25 Is he opening a support ticket there? Feb 08 04:17:08 djeezus Feb 08 04:17:44 that's what you get for using webchat over ssh over vpn Feb 08 04:18:26 * DocScrutinizer cackles Feb 08 04:26:43 how's mic connected to GSM technically? Feb 08 04:27:08 Telepathy and Pulse Feb 08 04:27:31 so the codec is on AP? Feb 08 04:28:03 or I2S to GSM, plain audio? Feb 08 04:29:26 guys, what toolchain should be used with scratchbox for the n900 ? Feb 08 04:30:54 and btw im installingg just scratchbox not the maemo SDK, i would need the sdk to compile some cli software , correct? Feb 08 04:31:32 wouldnt* Feb 08 04:35:41 When I use my TV out the output is extremely dim and oversaturated. Anyone else have this problem? My googling is not helpful. :( Feb 08 04:37:59 !ISO Feb 08 04:38:09 o_O Feb 08 04:38:17 BalSak: looking for something? Feb 08 04:38:48 is there an ISO or live image I cvan use for an into to maemo, please. wanna load it on an SD card to test on my netbook Feb 08 04:38:56 maemo doesn't work like that Feb 08 04:39:13 you could grab one of the SDK VM images though Feb 08 04:39:39 microlith: really. a while back I had an image (v3 I think) that I loaded in a x86-based VM Feb 08 04:39:44 ak Feb 08 04:39:46 ah' Feb 08 04:39:48 thnx Feb 08 04:40:11 no clue, didn't use it until maemo 5 myself Feb 08 04:41:23 so, what? do I use the SDK to build an image to use? (excuse my ignorance) Feb 08 04:41:56 all the instructions are on the maemo wiki Feb 08 04:41:58 The SDK includes an "Emulator" Feb 08 04:42:00 wiki.maemo.org Feb 08 04:42:04 or you can google for it Feb 08 04:42:08 'install maemo 5' Feb 08 04:42:19 the VM environment is called scratchbox. Feb 08 04:42:58 sweet. thanks Feb 08 04:43:09 Essentially there is no installable "maemo distro", and there is no emulator. There is the SDK environment, which is a bare-minimum for developers to test their own GUI apps. Feb 08 04:43:50 embedded-device approach? similar to the droid? Feb 08 04:44:18 I've only started getting into embedded recently (ALIX), so it's a bit fresh to me Feb 08 04:45:44 I don't understand your question Feb 08 04:46:02 BalSak: you can compile your app to run on x86 and test it on your desktop. scratchbox provides the needed libs Feb 08 04:46:24 I heard it's a bit slow because the SDK does OpenGL ES in software Feb 08 04:47:01 scratchbox is new to me..... already running VM env, so will have to check if it's all ok Feb 08 04:47:18 BalSak: think of it like running win-apps under wine Feb 08 04:47:44 userspace dev env? chrooted & all? Feb 08 04:48:31 yes Feb 08 04:48:35 chrooted and all. Feb 08 04:48:39 cool Feb 08 04:48:51 seems like a mix of chroot and qemu-powered arm->x86 interpeter Feb 08 04:49:15 and you use all the regular linux tools like fakeroot, apt-get, autotools, the GNU toolchain and so on Feb 08 04:50:13 and the Debian toolchain Feb 08 04:51:20 think I'll try & get it working in a VM & then port it to an SD for use as a bootable distro for my netbook Feb 08 04:51:32 * BalSak hopes Feb 08 04:51:40 hey guys, do you have a good source of backgrouns/wallpapers for the N900? Feb 08 04:51:56 *backgrounds Feb 08 04:52:08 www.n900wallpapers.com Feb 08 04:52:11 mk Feb 08 04:52:11 you might also want to check out Mer Feb 08 04:52:13 ~mer Feb 08 04:52:15 well, mer is http://wiki.maemo.org/Mer, or on #mer Feb 08 04:52:16 thnx guys Feb 08 04:52:18 c ya l8r Feb 08 04:52:59 thanks Feb 08 04:56:19 Anyone with access to the packages awake? Feb 08 04:56:26 *sigh* it sucks having to waitt for a new n900 x.x Feb 08 04:56:59 btw newegg is awesome, they're replacing a broken n900 ^_^ Feb 08 04:57:07 Agreed. Waited a few months after my prototype broke to get a replacement retail. Feb 08 04:57:11 lol Feb 08 04:57:18 my retail onoe broke Feb 08 04:57:24 luckly in less then 30days Feb 08 04:57:35 and newegg is replacying it Feb 08 04:57:39 The micro USB? Feb 08 04:57:45 yep Feb 08 04:57:49 pronto: bet you had to pay shipping again tho Feb 08 04:57:52 nope Feb 08 04:57:56 newegg did Feb 08 04:58:01 both ways Feb 08 04:58:02 ? Feb 08 04:58:04 yep Feb 08 04:58:07 interesting Feb 08 04:58:18 Yeah, when I told them what happened and said that I hope that this problem didn't make it into retail... they told me not to worry. Feb 08 04:58:18 well its still in transit Feb 08 04:58:19 but will the new one survive? :P Feb 08 04:58:22 Plenty worried now. Feb 08 04:58:32 lol Feb 08 04:58:45 luke-jr: i'm going to file down those hooks of doom on the charger Feb 08 04:58:48 zerojay: it appears someone figured out a workaround tho Feb 08 04:59:06 * luke-jr doesn't get why the hooks make the difference, but whatever :) Feb 08 04:59:13 they latch on Feb 08 04:59:22 fileing them down allows the cable to slip out easy Feb 08 04:59:31 so it's not that the port is weak, but that the hooks don't detach properly? Feb 08 04:59:31 incase there is any pressure on it Feb 08 04:59:40 the port is weak as well Feb 08 04:59:58 hm Feb 08 05:00:14 man i was pissed when that happned though Feb 08 05:00:28 since money wise me being that phone probally was a really bad idea Feb 08 05:00:57 * microlith ponders why mount is not accepting the user parameter Feb 08 05:01:52 hello, Feb 08 05:03:13 i already have scratchbox installed, would i need to use these install scripts that are provided in the wiki ? Feb 08 05:04:09 as in, does it do more than just install scratchbox ? for example , configure it ? Feb 08 05:08:14 * TRX_ looks around Feb 08 05:08:23 where are all the gurus today? Feb 08 05:08:35 Yes, it's configures it. Feb 08 05:08:52 -'s Feb 08 05:09:05 oh, thats too bad Feb 08 05:10:22 scribblej, you think i'd need the full sdk even if i dont need emulation ? Feb 08 05:10:33 What do you need? Feb 08 05:10:40 I'd say yes. Feb 08 05:10:48 as in, im not going to doing any gui applications Feb 08 05:11:03 So... how do you plan on compiling your non-gui applications? Feb 08 05:11:23 custom make script + arm compiler Feb 08 05:11:24 :) Feb 08 05:11:32 ScribbleJ : isnt that what scratchbox is for ? Feb 08 05:12:30 you see, i was reading this http://blogs.gnome.org/tthurman/2009/09/03/writing-apps-for-the-n900-part-1/ Feb 08 05:12:52 and it reads that i need scratchbox , so i installed it :D Feb 08 05:13:06 Ah. Feb 08 05:13:11 Well, good luck continuing then. Feb 08 05:13:29 That tutorial obviously assumes that you have installed the SDK and are using the scratchbox environment it provides. Feb 08 05:16:00 I didn't know about Mer Feb 08 05:16:04 does Mer run on N900? Feb 08 05:16:08 I mean, using all its devices Feb 08 05:16:46 ScribbleJ : the guy is saying that the desktop environment inside scratchbox isnt needed to just compile applications, thats not correct ? Feb 08 05:16:52 TRX_: that's what a *configured* scratchbox is for, yes... Feb 08 05:17:15 TRX, who cares about the desktop environment? Feb 08 05:17:36 I don't, you don't. YOu coudl have installed the SDK in the amount of time you've been worrying abotu whether you shoudl install it. Feb 08 05:17:50 not really mate Feb 08 05:18:24 There's a lot of other shit that goes into it, like the proper glibc version, kernel headers, apt packages, standard libraries to link against, yadda. Feb 08 05:18:28 running on 256k connections, 400mb takes a lot of time. Feb 08 05:18:30 You do what makes you happy. Feb 08 05:18:41 When you fail, you can go back and try the SDK. Feb 08 05:18:48 lol Feb 08 05:19:11 you'll be downloading a ton of stuff either way Feb 08 05:22:49 does the N900 (or busybox?) respect /etc/fstab? Feb 08 05:23:09 http://i.imgur.com/hi6Lf.jpg the only photo of the super bowl you need >.> Feb 08 05:23:15 Yes and no Feb 08 05:23:53 /etc/fstab is "respected" but you'll have to edit one of the default boot scripts in order to stop it from being overwritten; by default n900 creates new fstab on boot. Feb 08 05:23:59 oh Feb 08 05:24:29 ScribbleJ: do you know if busybox's mount command respects the "user" parameter, or is that somewhere else down the line? Feb 08 05:24:39 That I do not know. Feb 08 05:24:43 ok Feb 08 05:24:52 thanks for the warning about fstab though Feb 08 05:28:14 "Need to get 375MB/425MB of archives!" Feb 08 05:28:17 :( Feb 08 05:29:34 what country are you from? Even here in Brazil we have bigger speeds Feb 08 05:30:02 lebanon. Feb 08 05:30:53 ScribbleJ : so, this configured scratchbox alone would allow me to compile cli applications ? Feb 08 05:31:04 Yes, easy as pie. Feb 08 05:31:38 http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo_5_Developer_Guide Feb 08 05:31:39 great. Feb 08 05:34:04 nice. Feb 08 05:35:28 ScribbleJ : would i also need to install maemo-sdk-install_5.0.sh to endup with a configured scratchbox ? Feb 08 05:35:53 I'm not completely sure... I used the GUI installer. Feb 08 05:35:53 Heh Feb 08 05:36:13 But there are detailed instructions on maemo.org Feb 08 05:36:14 :S Feb 08 05:36:15 ok Feb 08 05:39:10 X-Fade: Awake? Feb 08 05:43:43 * RST38h moos in the dawn Feb 08 05:47:38 * microlith moves off to build nls_utf8 for cifs Feb 08 05:48:24 hi, can anyone else download the firefox mobile browser using their site on the n900? i try but it never downloads properly from the regular browser, maybe it just "knows" :) Feb 08 05:53:13 hm Feb 08 05:53:19 does make menuconfig not work in scratchbox? Feb 08 06:13:18 yay, utf8 works Feb 08 06:22:14 * microlith jabs modprobe Feb 08 06:45:52 ah, modules.dep Feb 08 07:06:54 morning RevdKathy Feb 08 07:25:26 * microlith grumbles at fstab Feb 08 07:31:09 Next issue of Maemo Weekly News out: http://www.mwkn.net/ Feb 08 07:33:27 Morning, all, BTW Feb 08 07:33:43 * microlith wonders what he's missing Feb 08 07:34:12 is there anything beyond the "user" parameter required in an fstab entry to allow users to initiate a mount? Feb 08 07:38:36 How's the maemonian revolution going? We taken up arms yet? Feb 08 07:39:34 I guess not. Feb 08 07:39:50 oh Feb 08 07:40:08 so, lest people think that only people who work on Maemo can't spell Feb 08 07:40:12 http://mxr-test.konigsberg.mozilla.org/symbian/source/badwords.txt Feb 08 07:41:53 moroning Feb 08 07:42:12 yeah Feb 08 07:42:16 "symbian" is on that list Feb 08 07:42:18 excellent Feb 08 07:42:35 timeless_mbp: "acception" is pretty bad :( Feb 08 07:43:03 adeus: it's a proper noun Feb 08 07:43:13 'microsoft' and 'intel' will be on another list from another corner Feb 08 07:44:09 obviously i don't claim that i'm catching 100% of all errors while reading through this Feb 08 07:44:23 you're free to browse the two corners of the source tree, they're exposed via mxr Feb 08 07:44:31 that list is from the first corner Feb 08 07:44:50 i'm working backwards from the 'k's in the second corner right now Feb 08 07:45:41 i think my favorite 'word' fwiw is "pleaseletmelive" which won't appear on the wordlist Feb 08 07:45:56 timeless_mbp: How apt for Symbian ;-) Feb 08 07:46:45 * microlith tries to threaten mount into doing its thing, but it resists as only software can Feb 08 07:50:40 is it busybox or the kernel telling me that the "user" parameter for an fstab entry is invalid? Feb 08 07:53:39 thank you busybox, for being a roadblock Feb 08 07:57:53 is it just me or the openarena-data is present on the repositories but openarena isn't? Feb 08 08:00:49 it's probably more fun like that Feb 08 08:00:52 just you Feb 08 08:00:53 bring your own game engine :) Feb 08 08:05:11 I am using scratchbox Feb 08 08:07:48 Conflicts: openarena (<< 0.7.6) Feb 08 08:07:54 they even don't like each other :) Feb 08 08:08:00 you do have openarena on your repositories? Feb 08 08:08:07 no Feb 08 08:08:09 can you do a apt-cache policy openarena Feb 08 08:08:18 oh Feb 08 08:09:15 apt-cache shows openarena on my device. are you using the x86 repo? Feb 08 08:09:47 yes Feb 08 08:09:55 if you do apt-cache policy openarena Feb 08 08:09:59 you can see where it comes from Feb 08 08:10:00 yeah the pkg is available in arm repo Feb 08 08:10:07 not on the x86? Feb 08 08:10:12 seems so Feb 08 08:10:22 I'll change to the arm repo as soon as I finish some download here Feb 08 08:10:24 thanks Feb 08 08:12:27 there's no 'arm' repo Feb 08 08:12:38 there's merely a client expressing a preference for the 'arm' architecture Feb 08 08:12:54 (you can actually ask your client to express a preference for an architecture you don't have) Feb 08 08:13:21 my opensolaris-nexenta-intel client often expressed a preference for linux-maemo-arm Feb 08 08:14:48 I used the wrong word Feb 08 08:14:51 s/arm repo/arm target/ Feb 08 08:14:53 sorry. Feb 08 08:23:26 GeneralAntilles: what tool do you use for your pictures? Feb 08 08:23:56 GeneralAntilles: iPhoto is pretty ridiculous, Aperture wasn't any better (no RAW support for my camera), I'm trying Lightroom now Feb 08 08:29:41 Morning Feb 08 08:35:17 morning X-Fade, wb from vacation Feb 08 08:36:06 hi Stskeeps, thanks ;) Need coffee when looking at the email backlog... Feb 08 08:36:21 Morning! Feb 08 08:36:33 Mourning X-Fade Feb 08 08:36:59 X-Fade: Once you get through your coffee, Maemo5 Downloads page is stuck at Vulture's Eye again. Feb 08 08:37:58 RST38h: I'll have a look. Feb 08 08:39:53 What's wrong with Vulture's Eye ;) Feb 08 08:42:29 * asj_ listens to the shuttle launch Feb 08 08:43:38 asj_: Yeah, always cool to watch. Feb 08 08:43:51 good time for us here this time Feb 08 08:48:59 GeneralAntilles: Feb 08 08:49:00 line 38 -- has been retrieved. It also implementeds the MGenericTimerClient Feb 08 08:50:18 * timeless_mbp makes a mental note to kill file bugs against xerces Feb 08 08:50:26 implementational Feb 08 08:50:44 implementeds, nice Feb 08 08:51:20 timeless_mbp: Does the browser put temp downloads on rootfs? Feb 08 08:51:42 X-Fade: i'm not really sure Feb 08 08:51:51 in general, we're mostly screwed Feb 08 08:51:53 timeless_mbp: I got an out of diskspace error. Feb 08 08:51:56 /tmp has no space Feb 08 08:52:01 so it's possible we used /tmp :) Feb 08 08:52:09 timeless_mbp: While downloading a 35MB podcast with my browser ;) Feb 08 08:52:10 MyDocs doesn't exist often enough Feb 08 08:52:23 timeless_mbp: /home/user/ ? Feb 08 08:52:29 X-Fade: my bet is on /tmp Feb 08 08:52:37 timeless_mbp: That is where apt puts it's cache. Feb 08 08:52:38 just download to /dev/null, there's plenty of room Feb 08 08:52:42 right, we could use /home/user Feb 08 08:52:55 Corsac: sadly the results for a user aren't better than /tmp Feb 08 08:53:16 good point Feb 08 08:53:18 timeless_mbp: Seems silly that I can't download multiple larger files while I have a massive amount of space left everywhere else ;) Feb 08 08:53:22 X-Fade: /home/user might be ok, of course we'd pay a penalty later when we move it Feb 08 08:53:31 it's 10am Feb 08 08:53:42 none of us are really awake this early on a monday Feb 08 08:53:42 11 Feb 08 08:53:50 @work Feb 08 08:54:02 ???? Feb 08 08:54:12 11am @work. Feb 08 08:54:19 * Corsac confirms 1000 Feb 08 08:54:20 i think most are @school or @work ;) Feb 08 08:54:29 well, technically 0954 Feb 08 08:54:44 tea -> Feb 08 08:55:06 Corsac's right I meant: "it isn't even 10 am...." Feb 08 08:55:16 and 'us' = my browser team, not 'us #maemo people' Feb 08 08:55:26 that just means it's even less possible for people to be awake at that time on monday Feb 08 08:55:56 X-Fade: for kicks, change /tmp to be a symlink to /home/user/tmp Feb 08 08:55:58 what happens? Feb 08 08:56:05 now, time for C8H10N4O2 Feb 08 08:56:10 probably havoc, timeless_mbp Feb 08 08:56:15 as dsmesock and friends are in there Feb 08 08:56:15 :P Feb 08 08:56:32 X-Fade: i think we were historically ordered not to write to /home/user because people were afraid we'd ruin the file system Feb 08 08:56:38 (same reason we didn't have disk cache...) Feb 08 08:57:13 Corsac: is that caffeine? because it isn't sugar Feb 08 08:57:22 indeed Feb 08 08:57:41 timeless_mbp: Yeah, but it can't be much worse than filling up rootfs ;) Feb 08 08:57:53 X-Fade: /tmp isn't the rootfs Feb 08 08:58:02 it's memfs or something wonky Feb 08 08:58:22 df -h Feb 08 08:58:29 * timeless_mbp is lazy Feb 08 08:58:51 ok 'tmpfs' Feb 08 08:58:52 picky Feb 08 08:59:04 Ah, yes. Feb 08 08:59:08 basically a ramdisk Feb 08 08:59:30 memfs, ramfs, ramdisk, whatever Feb 08 08:59:38 :) Feb 08 08:59:41 timeless_mbp: Nah, that seems weird. That is very small. Feb 08 08:59:45 timeless_mbp: I usually take sugar with my caffeine though Feb 08 08:59:49 timeless_mbp: Can't imagine that you use that. Feb 08 09:00:13 X-Fade: well, we have lsof, you can verify fairly easily :) Feb 08 09:00:36 timeless_mbp: Only 1MB? Feb 08 09:01:01 well makes sense to,/tmp implies that files could be written there alot, as you dont want todo needless writes to flash, then do it to ram Feb 08 09:02:01 X-Fade: how'd you download the file? Feb 08 09:02:10 * timeless_mbp doesn't want to invent steps to reproduce Feb 08 09:02:21 fwiw in Gecko there are something like 7 different 'download' paths Feb 08 09:02:43 so asking me to guess your steps to reproduce is a recipe for fail Feb 08 09:03:09 timeless_mbp: Go to http://twit.tv and download a few podcasts there. Feb 08 09:03:19 timeless_mbp: 2 at the same time will do nicely. Feb 08 09:03:19 use wget ? Feb 08 09:03:31 Hiya, does anybody know where to get that N900 Windows 7 x64 RNDIS driver? I downloaded it on my laptop, but can't find it on the internet anymore Feb 08 09:04:03 rndis? Feb 08 09:04:33 yeah, like normal windows .inf file Feb 08 09:04:43 there is one for the old tablets Feb 08 09:04:47 rndis has nothing to do with .inf files Feb 08 09:04:51 what is rndis? Feb 08 09:04:51 so I can do USB networking Feb 08 09:04:58 Remote Network something Feb 08 09:05:15 it was on some forum and uploaded to megaupload Feb 08 09:05:30 X-Fade: pretend i'm totally unfamiliar w/ this 'podcast' stuff Feb 08 09:05:32 for use with MADDE and all Feb 08 09:05:40 i clicked your http://twit.tv link Feb 08 09:05:43 now I get "RNDIS/Ethernet Gadget" no driver found Feb 08 09:05:45 timeless_mbp: urls in pm. Feb 08 09:10:33 X-Fade: i'm not seeing any /tmp or other interesting paths Feb 08 09:10:45 it's just supposedly saving in .documents which is where i told it to Feb 08 09:11:19 and they're both growing at reasonable rates Feb 08 09:11:26 timeless_mbp: Hmm weird. Ok will try to find out what happened exactly. Feb 08 09:11:35 i'm not using 1.1 ... Feb 08 09:11:41 and i do have a disk cache in theory Feb 08 09:12:00 my device was flashed on thursday before i flew to Paris Feb 08 09:12:13 timeless_mbp: Mine a week before that. Feb 08 09:13:34 i'm fairly certain nothing interesting has changed in that interval Feb 08 09:13:46 i have 23mb free on / Feb 08 09:13:55 900k on /tmp Feb 08 09:14:06 1.6g on /home Feb 08 09:14:16 24.8g on /home/user/MyDocs Feb 08 09:14:22 no microSD Feb 08 09:18:39 X-Fade: Welcome back! Feb 08 09:19:34 Jaffa: Thanks Feb 08 09:25:47 jo Feb 08 09:27:32 hi guys Feb 08 09:34:17 hello Feb 08 09:40:12 Good morning all Feb 08 09:40:17 mornin Feb 08 09:40:30 all back from fosdem? Feb 08 09:40:48 Ello how are you? Feb 08 09:41:32 is fosdem over already? Feb 08 09:41:39 yeah Feb 08 09:41:47 fosdem is only sat/sun Feb 08 09:44:51 hi Feb 08 09:45:09 Hey! Feb 08 09:45:36 wait Feb 08 09:45:44 what time zone am i in? Feb 08 09:45:47 is there supposed to be two hildon-home processes running? Feb 08 09:46:01 timeless_mbp, EET? Feb 08 09:46:11 my mac thought i was in paris Feb 08 09:46:16 and my n900 thought i was in berlin Feb 08 09:46:25 that's the same timezone Feb 08 09:46:29 CET Feb 08 09:46:35 is there a pdf reader out which allows vertical reading? Feb 08 09:46:44 yeah, but you're right, i'm not in CET, i'm physically in HEL=EET Feb 08 09:47:05 * timeless_mbp grumbles Feb 08 09:47:10 * timeless_mbp needs to file a bug about calendar Feb 08 09:47:37 mece: can you test something for me? Feb 08 09:47:41 sure. Feb 08 09:47:47 I'm in Tku, so EEt here too. Feb 08 09:47:48 ok, just finished installing scratchbox! Feb 08 09:47:50 EET even Feb 08 09:47:51 create an event for 12pm-1pm (assuming you're in EET) Feb 08 09:47:58 at last, after 3 hours on this sucky connection! Feb 08 09:48:00 today? Feb 08 09:48:03 yes Feb 08 09:48:10 set the reminder for 5mins in advance Feb 08 09:48:12 then change your time zone to Berlin Feb 08 09:48:20 when the alarm rings, click view Feb 08 09:48:34 (oh do close the calendar once you've created the event w/ its reminder) Feb 08 09:48:44 timeless calendar is tricky, even why you are flight a lot Feb 08 09:48:46 anyone knows about how much MB maemo-scratchbox-install_5.0.sh will get ? Feb 08 09:48:48 args wehn Feb 08 09:48:51 then tap the system area and change your time zone back to HEL Feb 08 09:49:09 personally, i expect the calendar event to update its times to match local time Feb 08 09:49:27 hmm how do I change timezone? I have to turn of automagically update? Feb 08 09:49:32 yes Feb 08 09:49:42 perfectly logical, if you're a finn, right? Feb 08 09:49:51 hehe yes Feb 08 09:50:18 sorry, i meant /maemo-sdk-install_5.0.sh Feb 08 09:50:26 iirc you also have to save the changes before turning automatic updates back on Feb 08 09:50:33 or your manual timezone fix will be ignored Feb 08 09:50:38 GeneralAntilles: about? Feb 08 09:50:43 trx with rootstraps 1-2 gig Feb 08 09:50:45 heya crashanddie Feb 08 09:50:49 this script isnt using apt, anyone knows around how much mbs its going to get! ? Feb 08 09:50:49 GAN900: or still at the hospital? Feb 08 09:50:54 timeless_mbp, ok done.. waiting... Feb 08 09:51:15 my calendar widget says the event is now at 11:00 Feb 08 09:51:32 trx with rootstraps in the end you need 1-2 gig Feb 08 09:51:35 so it stayed at the sime place in time... Feb 08 09:51:41 yo asj_ Feb 08 09:52:02 perhaps I should have removed the widget first... Feb 08 09:52:39 Has anyone had trouble with twitter rss feeds? Feb 08 09:52:56 vallhalla811: you, by the sound of it Feb 08 09:53:00 vallhalla811: twitter's failw whale Feb 08 09:53:27 Yes only on my n900 Feb 08 09:53:38 shit, food shop is about to close Feb 08 09:53:39 later Feb 08 09:56:44 timeless_mbp, everything worked as it should have IMO Feb 08 09:56:48 mece: did you get the alarm? Feb 08 09:56:57 yes Feb 08 09:57:01 and you clicked 'view'? Feb 08 09:57:06 and you left that window open? Feb 08 09:57:22 timeless_mbp, right.. Apparently I'm not so good at taking instructions. Feb 08 09:57:45 try again, 12:10pm alarm at 12:05pm? Feb 08 09:58:44 oh oh.. I actually found a bu gnow... Feb 08 09:58:48 bug now Feb 08 09:59:23 in calendar or elsewhere? Feb 08 09:59:51 timeless_mbp, when changeing the time. tho i might not have saved timezone correctly.. Feb 08 09:59:57 ok.. should ring in 1 minute... Feb 08 10:00:06 I'll check this bug first. Feb 08 10:00:18 err your bug. Feb 08 10:00:44 tekonivel, free wlan at lasipalatsi? Feb 08 10:01:36 mece: yeah Feb 08 10:01:43 mece: but i'm not using it atm Feb 08 10:02:14 mece: but such exists. i'm actually logged in lasipalatsi.fi host Feb 08 10:02:48 tekonivel: is this near the cafe by the post office Feb 08 10:02:56 or the cafe by sokos Feb 08 10:03:32 perhaps i should say the parliament and forum Feb 08 10:05:16 tii'm actually elsewhere, but lasipalatsi is just next to sokos, head post office, sokos and not too far from the parliament either Feb 08 10:07:04 timeless_mbp, looks like it's not going to ring... oh there it goes... LOL Feb 08 10:07:19 ok now I have the "view" open. Feb 08 10:07:44 timeless_mbp, what did you want to know? Feb 08 10:08:03 so, when it rings it shows you a time for the event, which is correct, right? Feb 08 10:08:09 now change your time zone +/- 1 Feb 08 10:08:16 without closing the event which you 'view'ed Feb 08 10:08:40 is the time for the event still correct or is it now wrong because it didn't correct for your time zone change Feb 08 10:09:46 well it didn't in the view part... but it did change in the calendar. I think it's perfectly acceptable that it doesn't change the view display. Feb 08 10:09:59 why? Feb 08 10:10:18 or is the answer "because I'm a Finn" Feb 08 10:10:28 * timeless_mbp grumbles Feb 08 10:10:33 timeless_mbp, I think of it as a "static page" or something. I didn't expect it to change. Feb 08 10:10:50 it was loaded when I pressed view, and I didn't expect it to change. Feb 08 10:11:08 so, i wouldn't mind if it listed a time zone next to the times Feb 08 10:11:28 but... i don't think we actually have many 'static' pages on our platform Feb 08 10:12:10 timeless_mbp, I think it's mostly because having an event open like this is something I rarely do. Well i guess it's a bug, just not one I would care about enough to even mention. Feb 08 10:12:29 mece: yeah, sorry Feb 08 10:12:39 the problem i have is that i haven't met many Finns who travel Feb 08 10:12:48 i've met a number of finns who refuse to travel Feb 08 10:12:56 timeless_mbp, that is true. And now that you mention it, it actually could be a problem. Feb 08 10:13:13 well, it just screwed me out of lunch / a meeting Feb 08 10:13:13 timeless_mbp, I'm going to norway on thursday, via sweden. Feb 08 10:13:19 heh Feb 08 10:13:38 anyway, since you appreciate the problem, can i convince you to file the bug? :) Feb 08 10:13:49 remember there could be at least a shirt in it for you ;-) Feb 08 10:14:06 timeless_mbp, sure, I'll have some lunch first. Feb 08 10:14:23 sounds reasonable to me Feb 08 10:14:30 Hi Feb 08 10:15:13 timeless_mbp, you can also just click an event to view it, then change timezone to see the bug. The whole waiting for an alarm is a bit overkill :) Feb 08 10:15:32 mece: sure, feel free to use the simpler steps when filing Feb 08 10:15:56 i generally try to report precisely what i did in case there's some stupid quirk related to my exact steps Feb 08 10:15:56 is this applications or platform? Feb 08 10:16:02 I understand that X-51_2009SE_2.2009.51-1_PR_COMBINED_MR0_ARM.bin is the OS but what is RX-51_2009SE_1.2009.41-1.VANILLA_PR_EMMC_MR0_ARM.bin? Feb 08 10:16:03 yep Feb 08 10:16:04 apps/calendar Feb 08 10:16:12 optimizing steps to reproduce comes later Feb 08 10:16:34 MortimeR_: do you understand the device file systems? Feb 08 10:16:48 there are roughly 3: System, User Home, USB Mass Storage Feb 08 10:16:55 timeless_mbp: I am familiar with Linux and embedded systems Feb 08 10:17:05 timeless_mbp: I understand Feb 08 10:17:09 the combined image is for System Feb 08 10:17:16 EMMC is for User Home + USB Mass Storage Feb 08 10:17:17 ok Feb 08 10:17:25 Vanilla means "no regional maps" among other things Feb 08 10:17:33 I do not understand the later Feb 08 10:17:38 i think the user home part is probably entirely empty Feb 08 10:18:04 I expect user home to be nearly empty and what is USB Mass storage. This is only supposed to be mode accessing the users data Feb 08 10:18:08 but the USB Mass Storage part comes with a couple of files that make your n900 look shinier when plugged into a computer as usb mass storage Feb 08 10:18:50 I have been hit by the reboot bug agian anbody know how to relate my details to nokia so someone who can talk engineer with me might solve this problem Feb 08 10:18:52 well, if you prefer, /, /home, /home/user/MyDocs Feb 08 10:18:59 but i don't really think that's easier to understand or explain Feb 08 10:19:08 timeless_mbp: but the size of the image is 246951288 which cannot be explained with a nearly empty home and some shiny look Feb 08 10:19:42 for which? vanilla? Feb 08 10:19:50 the us one is something like 1.6gb Feb 08 10:19:51 timeless_mbp: yes .... Feb 08 10:19:53 I once unFIASCOed the eMMC image and found a 1 GB VFAT filesystem Feb 08 10:20:00 it was mostly empty, IIRC Feb 08 10:20:02 maybe it has some mp4s included? Feb 08 10:20:14 and a movie or two typically Feb 08 10:20:30 "mostly empty" is well... "mostly" not "entirely" Feb 08 10:20:32 mybe it contains garbage in the image. In this case it should be zeroed and compressed Feb 08 10:20:41 snostorm: the watchdog one? that was fixed for me in the latest version Feb 08 10:20:56 MortimeR_: maybe you shouldn't speculate? Feb 08 10:21:01 it's a waste of everyone else's time Feb 08 10:21:04 anyway reflashing the OS just helped me to unbrick my n900 ;-) Feb 08 10:21:19 vanilla doesn't mean "empty" Feb 08 10:21:31 it means "not specifically regionalized or vendorized or customized" Feb 08 10:21:35 just mostly ;) Feb 08 10:21:50 250 megs out or 28 gigs is pretty empty-ish, when you think about it Feb 08 10:21:55 * mgedmin should stop wasting time Feb 08 10:22:25 timeless_mbp: thx. I think I now have an impression what this is about. E.g. a network provider could customize/brand using this image... it is not required to boot/run the device Feb 08 10:23:01 MortimeR_: well, n900s don't usually come with vanilla Feb 08 10:23:09 if you're in the us, you get the us version which has us maps Feb 08 10:23:27 if you're in the nordic countries you probably get the nordic version which probably has nordic maps Feb 08 10:23:39 <-- is currently connected via "expensive" 3G and I wanted to know if I also need to download the EMMC image after successfully flashing the PR_COMBINED image Feb 08 10:23:47 'no' Feb 08 10:23:57 but you could have just asked and saved a lot of trouble :) Feb 08 10:24:04 timeless_mbp: ;-) Feb 08 10:25:04 line 48 -- * Messages having warning level greated than this Feb 08 10:29:18 timeless_mbp: can you provide me a hint where to start (URL) when I want to do some Qt4 coding. E.g. shall I use scratchbox or some other method? Feb 08 10:29:31 no :) Feb 08 10:29:41 mxr.maemo.org/ has qt and fremantle sources Feb 08 10:29:49 there's a #maemo-qt or something iirc Feb 08 10:30:00 and how-to-write-qt-apps is left as an exercise Feb 08 10:30:17 timeless_mbp: thx anyway Feb 08 10:30:28 http://wiki.forum.nokia.com/index.php/Qt_for_Maemo_Developers_Guide is decent Feb 08 10:30:41 vikuuri: that's kinda shocking Feb 08 10:34:35 timeless_mbp, Bug 8915 Feb 08 10:34:40 Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=8915 When having an event open, a timezone change will not alter the time in the event being viewed as it should Feb 08 10:34:40 thanks Feb 08 10:35:46 Jaffa: MWKN is on planet now. Feb 08 10:35:56 hi x-fade Feb 08 10:37:19 hi woglinde Feb 08 10:43:16 where does the sdk installation script put the files it downloads ? Feb 08 10:43:18 hmm Feb 08 10:43:20 strange Feb 08 10:43:39 got disconnected and now its trying to resume and fails Feb 08 10:44:16 let me put it this way, HEEEELPPPP!! :P Feb 08 10:44:19 everything is failing for me right about now... Feb 08 10:44:19 and what to delete those files it downloaded, WHERE ARE THEY! Feb 08 10:44:52 and yes this scratchbox is damn weird Feb 08 10:45:05 gives you errors in one terminal and works perfectly in another Feb 08 10:45:10 makes no sense at all :P Feb 08 10:47:27 Trox: look into mirror :) Feb 08 10:48:47 ifreq : ok ok i also dont make sense sometimes :P Feb 08 10:49:47 ifreq : any idea where the sdk installation script puts the files it downloads ? Feb 08 10:52:26 Trox: nope. I use the virtual SDK img Feb 08 10:52:35 so i dont hafty waste time on installing SDK separately Feb 08 10:54:09 ifreq : well , to me downloading 2gb is a waste of time. Feb 08 10:54:34 and near impossible with this 256k download speed Feb 08 10:54:38 you mean tou can solve the SDK problems faster than dl 2Gb f stuff? Feb 08 10:54:39 ok Feb 08 10:55:03 yes, in less than a few days. Feb 08 10:55:03 ! Feb 08 10:57:35 Trox: okay. ill ask you after few days :) Feb 08 11:02:11 Heya all Feb 08 11:03:22 morning wazd Feb 08 11:03:30 hi stskeep Feb 08 11:03:36 hi wazd Feb 08 11:03:42 Stskeeps: seen my tabbl Feb 08 11:03:52 Stskeeps: table mockup?) Feb 08 11:04:00 Woglinde: hey Feb 08 11:04:11 wazd: nop? Feb 08 11:06:40 hello, Feb 08 11:07:05 Stskeeps: oooh Feb 08 11:07:11 Stskeeps: waitasec Feb 08 11:07:29 wazd: didn't see you mention it before so :) Feb 08 11:08:21 wazd_, maePad ? :p Feb 08 11:08:40 X-Fade: Hey, welcome back. Feb 08 11:08:58 Stskeeps: http://s006.radikal.ru/i214/1002/d4/90561280964c.png Feb 08 11:09:15 Vdvsx: nope :) Feb 08 11:09:26 :( Feb 08 11:09:28 Vdvsx: that's not my work :) Feb 08 11:09:45 Anyone besides X-Fade can pull down a package from the repos? Feb 08 11:10:00 zerojay: yes. Feb 08 11:10:06 wazd: and it's physically possible in html? :P Feb 08 11:10:18 Stskeeps: sure Feb 08 11:11:29 wazd: :nod: looks good, just wondering if it motivates people to actually click the contents though Feb 08 11:11:43 X-Fade: I want to have my Adblock Plus package removed from the repository completely. Microb's got too many issues with plugins/extensions.. and I have a new pacakge that will replace it with a different way of doing things that does work 100% of the time. Feb 08 11:11:57 Stskeeps: is it clickable? :D Feb 08 11:12:10 wazd: the 50% Feb 08 11:12:13 | 5 stuff yes Feb 08 11:13:21 zerojay: Is the new one in place already? Feb 08 11:13:22 STSkeeps: ah, haven't even thought about it actually :D Feb 08 11:13:34 as the stuff that's interesting is in those fields :P Feb 08 11:13:40 as numbers will just cause people to argue Feb 08 11:14:01 X-Fade: Yeah, a new package named adflashblock-css has already been uploaded last night. Feb 08 11:14:23 Stskeeps: well, I guess I can come up with something Feb 08 11:14:32 zerojay: You can use Replaces and Conflicts to make the switch for current users better? Feb 08 11:14:50 X-Fade, any possibility of getting .sh uploads allowed on wiki.maemo.org (sent you a mail about this a few mins ago)? Feb 08 11:15:02 X-Fade: I hadn't thought about that. Interesting idea. Feb 08 11:15:22 X-Fade: I'll add that in tonight I guess. Feb 08 11:15:32 zerojay: We can remove it of course after a while. But think of your exising users ;) (like me) Feb 08 11:15:47 timeless_mbp: the firefox on maemo, how does one get a mouse pointer for text selections? keep activating the tab view. Feb 08 11:16:13 irc.mozilla.org #mobile :) Feb 08 11:16:14 X-Fade: Heh.. I thought most of my existing users wanted to throw spears at me. :P Feb 08 11:16:17 Stskeeps: I guess I can make a layout with div's, not the tables, it's more flexible Feb 08 11:16:46 timeless_mbp: mece1: you're doing some calendar development? Feb 08 11:17:07 dazo: if by that you mean calendar developer terrorism Feb 08 11:17:07 wazd: only requirement i have is that i have to be able to print one 'table line' out at a time Feb 08 11:17:20 or terrorizing Feb 08 11:18:12 timeless_mbp: heh ... well, do you provide patches to devels? I'd like to look into the proper code .... (Admittedly, I've not spent much time going through all "getting the source code details" on m.o) Feb 08 11:18:27 dazo: it's closed Feb 08 11:18:34 :( :( :( Feb 08 11:18:39 mxr.maemo.org/fremantle has the open stuff, which doesn't include calendar Feb 08 11:20:03 timeless_mbp: ugh ... the calendar and a hope that it was open was one particular reason why I got a N900 - so that I could help fixing annoyances .... as my SE-K800i calendar drove me crazy :-P Feb 08 11:20:26 dazo: well, the frameworks are open Feb 08 11:20:33 eds and friends Feb 08 11:20:41 mairas: Hmm let me see if I can change that. Feb 08 11:21:07 timeless_mbp: yeah ... do you know if there are plans to open the calendar code? Feb 08 11:21:25 i'm sure there's a wiki page that answers that question Feb 08 11:21:29 X-Fade, it should be a config option in the MediaWiki config files, IIRC Feb 08 11:21:39 timeless_mbp: oki .... thx ... I'll look for it Feb 08 11:21:41 http://maemo.gitorious.org/calendar-backend/calendar-backend/blobs/master/debian/control Feb 08 11:21:44 X-Fade: ... Feb 08 11:21:57 28 Description: Calendar backend developer's files Feb 08 11:21:57 29 This package contains calendar backend developer's files. Feb 08 11:21:58 mairas: Yes, added it there just now. Feb 08 11:22:06 X-Fade, \o/ Feb 08 11:22:07 * timeless_mbp loves the 'multiline' description Feb 08 11:22:27 :) Feb 08 11:22:44 Stskeeps: no problem Feb 08 11:23:03 timeless_mbp: thx a lot! I'll dig into things ... and start the developer terrorising myself :P Feb 08 11:23:12 timeless_mbp: First line is short desc, second and onwards is the detailed one? Feb 08 11:23:13 good luck Feb 08 11:23:24 X-Fade: not a particularly detailed one Feb 08 11:23:35 but that's the theory, yes Feb 08 11:23:44 X-Fade, hmm, now it's marked as an image Feb 08 11:23:46 timeless_mbp: Sure, but developers don't mind probably. Feb 08 11:24:02 mairas: need to set mimetypes somewhere I think. Feb 08 11:24:27 grr argh! The interwebs keep getting away from me! Someone's messing with my cables! Feb 08 11:24:30 X-Fade, I don't think it's about that Feb 08 11:24:43 it's just that MediaWiki thinks .sh files are images Feb 08 11:25:04 Hmm. N900 creates duplicate contacts because of IM accounts. :/ Feb 08 11:25:07 mairas: why not paste sh content? Feb 08 11:25:10 as the uploaded file ended up as http://wiki.maemo.org/Image:Icecc_create_env_sbox.sh Feb 08 11:25:17 MiXu-: You can merge them. Feb 08 11:25:39 X-Fade: And then it will create new duplicates if I disable and re-enable an IM account. :P Feb 08 11:25:48 MiXu-: No? Feb 08 11:25:50 nope Feb 08 11:25:54 ifreq, could do that but the script is a bit long and would be nicer to just provide it as a file Feb 08 11:26:07 Well I guess some buggy devel im software might do that though... Feb 08 11:26:11 mairas: mv file.sh > file.sh.txt Feb 08 11:26:13 *g* Feb 08 11:26:33 mv? Feb 08 11:26:33 For me it's creating duplicates :P Feb 08 11:26:37 move Feb 08 11:26:45 you dont speak *nix?? Feb 08 11:26:49 ifreq, but the > Feb 08 11:26:55 ah yeah Feb 08 11:26:57 ifreq, why would that help? text file uploads aren't supported any better Feb 08 11:27:07 mairas: sure? dang Feb 08 11:27:20 then your ool Feb 08 11:28:01 I'm using the default IM software with some additional protocols. Feb 08 11:28:22 MiXu-, which one is making duplicates? Feb 08 11:28:35 can anyone reproduce bug 8920? it wfm w/ my more recent verion Feb 08 11:28:38 Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=8920 MicroB loses first keystroke Feb 08 11:28:44 mece: MSN and Facebook at least. Feb 08 11:28:59 whats the MSG plugin youre using? Feb 08 11:29:02 MiXu-, as I said, (1:26:07 PM) mece: Well I guess some buggy devel im software might do that though... Feb 08 11:29:02 MSN* Feb 08 11:29:11 mece: Yep. I'll try another one. Feb 08 11:29:16 im using felipes MSN pecan Feb 08 11:29:19 it works nicely Feb 08 11:29:29 I think pecan is the preferred one, but none is bug free Feb 08 11:29:38 pecan is most fixed one imo :P Feb 08 11:29:41 err patched one Feb 08 11:29:49 is pecan in the extras? Feb 08 11:29:58 doubt it Feb 08 11:29:59 no. Feb 08 11:30:51 Hmm. Apparently the dupes disappear when I disconnect from MSN/Facebook. Feb 08 11:31:11 But I'll try the pecan Feb 08 11:31:46 MiXu-, see this thread: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=39015&highlight=pecan&page=5 for possible issues or fixes. Feb 08 11:31:58 Alrighty. Thanks. Feb 08 11:38:10 is there a one liner that I can type instead of "make install && tar cf blah.tar /opt/blah" to leave me with a .deb I can hand to people? Feb 08 11:40:12 Damion2: dpkg-buildpackage ? Feb 08 11:42:10 py2deb? Feb 08 11:42:23 Not exactly a one-liner, but simple. Feb 08 11:42:32 hai Feb 08 11:43:37 Damion2: doubt it. Feb 08 11:43:54 Damion2: just do as jebba has documented: google "jebba package maemo" Feb 08 11:45:04 hand optified is mostly better Feb 08 11:46:09 LANG_NAME { id = ELangFinlandSwedish; Feb 08 11:47:26 33 * purchase interface functions should be used first to finnish Feb 08 11:47:27 34 * purcahse operations before downloading the node content. Feb 08 11:47:29 * timeless_mbp sighs Feb 08 11:48:08 lol Feb 08 11:48:14 Hmm. Ok. Looks better with pecan MSN plugin. Feb 08 11:48:49 zerojay: and here i was going to give the language a free pass for being written by idiots who don't understand English rules on proper names Feb 08 11:49:19 zerojay: have you read part one of my list? Feb 08 11:50:44 timeless: is that crappy locale reinvention followed by gibberish? Feb 08 11:51:11 http://mxr-test.konigsberg.mozilla.org/symbian/ident?i=ELangFinlandSwedish Feb 08 11:51:42 http://mxr-test.konigsberg.mozilla.org/symbian/source/MCL/sf/mw/appinstall/secureswitools/swisistools/source/sisxlibrary/sislanguage.h#45 Feb 08 11:51:57 49 /** UK English. */ Feb 08 11:51:57 50 ELangEnglish = 1, Feb 08 11:52:01 76 /** American. */ Feb 08 11:52:01 77 ELangAmerican = 10, Feb 08 11:52:09 American isn't English Feb 08 11:52:27 lest you think i'm joking, c.f. Feb 08 11:52:27 106 /** Australian English. */ Feb 08 11:52:27 107 ELangAustralian = 20, Feb 08 11:52:38 do they have 4 variants of sami or none Feb 08 11:52:47 139 /** Peoples Republic of China's Chinese. */ Feb 08 11:52:59 note that they can't spell People's correctly... Feb 08 11:53:18 ShadowJK: well they have 'Yoruba', but unless Sami has another spelling, i don't see it Feb 08 11:53:28 timeless_mbp: No, I haven't. Feb 08 11:53:28 come on, the file won't bite ;-) Feb 08 11:53:36 http://mxr-test.konigsberg.mozilla.org/symbian/source/badwords.txt Feb 08 11:54:17 I had perfect blood pressure last checkup. I think I'll pass on clicking anything with "symbian" in it Feb 08 11:54:17 Not so much in the way of bad words as much as they are common misspellings. Feb 08 11:55:03 :D Feb 08 11:55:05 Good call Feb 08 11:55:10 wtf... Feb 08 11:55:32 (wanting to stay in a situation where I don't need to listen to the 1hour rant about excercise and fruit) Feb 08 11:55:34 Flemish? Feb 08 11:55:55 zerojay: sorry, in badwords? Feb 08 11:57:05 timeless_mbp: No, in sislanguage.h Feb 08 11:57:30 Language = 19 Feb 08 11:58:13 hm, isn't flemish correct spelling? or are you supposed to call it something else? Feb 08 11:58:29 i think most Americans would call it Dutch Feb 08 11:58:45 I've never once heard of Flemish. Feb 08 11:59:15 ShadowJK: I think that's correct Feb 08 11:59:41 AFAIK flemish is a slightly different dialect that is spoken in northern belgium Feb 08 12:00:03 I love interfaces that appear in a foreign (to you) language, but offer your own language too as long as you can guess what it is called in the foreign language first Feb 08 12:00:14 :D Feb 08 12:00:28 * timeless_mbp ponders "exteraction" Feb 08 12:00:49 ShadowJK: yeah, that's always nice Feb 08 12:00:56 it's better in Maemo Feb 08 12:01:03 after you've properly found the place which has your language Feb 08 12:01:07 ShadowJK: haha, totally Feb 08 12:01:13 it then asks you a very long question in a language you *don't* speak Feb 08 12:01:30 which you have to answer correctly in order for it to start speaking your language Feb 08 12:01:59 lol Feb 08 12:02:39 atleast you *can* switch language more than once :) Feb 08 12:03:03 and don't need to make a permanent choice at first boot like certain other system Feb 08 12:03:06 Would you like to switch langauges? Oui/Nyet Feb 08 12:03:56 Permanen choice at first boot <3 Feb 08 12:04:00 ShadowJK: it's not like you can officially switch to a better language :) Feb 08 12:04:08 * timeless_mbp offers MiXu- a 't' Feb 08 12:04:19 Thanks, I'm out. Feb 08 12:04:53 a hint that something's wrong: Feb 08 12:04:53 http://mxr-test.konigsberg.mozilla.org/symbian/search?string=exeplar Feb 08 12:05:06 I assume maemo bases it on LANG? You could have different apps in different languages if you felt really adventurous Feb 08 12:05:08 @param _foo_ where _foo_ doesn't appear in the subsequent lines Feb 08 12:05:22 Remosi: one of those env vars, and yes Feb 08 12:05:30 in scratchbox people will do that once in a while Feb 08 12:05:52 yeah, thats the advantage of building on something as large as linux Feb 08 12:05:53 the reason you need a reboot is that there are too many daemons to usefully do anything with, each of which has an env var for the language Feb 08 12:06:02 yup Feb 08 12:06:06 Remosi: or the disadvantage of building on something as lame as linux Feb 08 12:06:10 depends how you look at it :) Feb 08 12:06:24 s40 doesn't require a reboot Feb 08 12:06:27 I say tomato, you say tomato :) Feb 08 12:06:35 telinit 1; telinit 2 Feb 08 12:06:43 should do it, although that's almost a reboot :) Feb 08 12:06:53 if my phone call drops while you do that, i'm not happy :) Feb 08 12:06:58 Remosi: that's based on the assumption maemo is reasonably sane Feb 08 12:06:58 :P Feb 08 12:07:13 ~ping Feb 08 12:07:14 ~pong Feb 08 12:07:20 Stskeeps, maemo's been reasonably sane every other time I've tried to do something silly :) Feb 08 12:07:42 line 146 -- EXPORT_C void CTaskManager::ExecuteRecoveryTasksL() Feb 08 12:07:47 line 78 -- * In order to recover from fatal error, please use ExecutelRecoveryTasksL. Feb 08 12:07:56 * timeless_mbp is glad to see the comment suggests a functin that doesn't exist Feb 08 12:08:57 Howdy all Feb 08 12:08:58 * ShadowJK would have assumed both existed, first did something bad, and second did something proper but was hidden somewhere comletely unrelated Feb 08 12:09:19 http://mxr-test.konigsberg.mozilla.org/symbian/search?string=ExecutelRecoveryTasksL Feb 08 12:10:44 if it's hidden, it isn't in one of the two modules i cloned Feb 08 12:11:20 What is the procedure on porting cli applications to Fremantle? If I have compiled the program for ARMEL and it works flawlessly on Fremantle, what's the next step if i want to share it with people. Presumable put it in the garage, and then what? Feb 08 12:12:07 extras-devel? Feb 08 12:12:50 OK, thanks ShadowJK. How quickly do things get moved up to testing or extras? Feb 08 12:13:19 to testing: your choice Feb 08 12:14:06 then it needs a few random people to test it and give it thumbs up before you can promote it to extras Feb 08 12:14:10 Probably as soon as possible. Just a ported application, so already feature complete. Feb 08 12:14:22 Sounds good. Thanks Feb 08 12:14:44 look up extras-testing on wiki.maemo.org Feb 08 12:15:06 line 87 -- * Equar or greater than -operator Feb 08 12:15:31 hmm fun... need to reflash again Feb 08 12:24:31 don't you hate it when you just need to download 30 megs, but the ISP has a dodgy backbone? Feb 08 12:24:48 nah Feb 08 12:24:58 nowhere near as bad as when you need to top off a 60gb rsync Feb 08 12:25:07 and your employer's gateway makes it impossible Feb 08 12:25:27 i've tried 3 or 4 times Feb 08 12:25:37 at least you'll get more data each time? Feb 08 12:26:10 no Feb 08 12:26:25 it rolls back? Feb 08 12:26:29 @all does anybony knows how to activate the N900' front camera? Feb 08 12:26:30 i think it's spending mb's on overhead not actually making any progress Feb 08 12:26:39 carloscesa: install an app that uses it Feb 08 12:26:42 carloscesa: with the mirror app? Feb 08 12:26:45 or get a video call w/ google talk Feb 08 12:27:33 the software-stack wasn't ready enough for the first release so video call wasn't really exposed Feb 08 12:28:15 <_berto_> garage.maemo.org is down ??? Feb 08 12:28:33 _berto_: It is up, but I see some irq storms there. Feb 08 12:28:39 _berto_: Really weird. Feb 08 12:28:42 _berto_: you say that like it's a surprise Feb 08 12:28:54 X-Fade: waiting for garage.maemo.org.... Feb 08 12:29:12 <_berto_> timeless_mbp: maybe I was being ironic Feb 08 12:29:40 _berto_: no, you were being sarcastic, timeless_mbp was being ironic Feb 08 12:30:09 <_berto_> heh Feb 08 12:30:11 i like garage. I find it soothing. Feb 08 12:30:11 <_berto_> :) Feb 08 12:30:37 There's simply no point in hurrying things in garage, so one is forced to slow down. Feb 08 12:30:41 good therapy. Feb 08 12:30:55 mece: i like the blank white page i get from it :) Feb 08 12:31:11 garage is zen Feb 08 12:34:22 timeless_mbp: for a jew, you're strangely ego-centric Feb 08 12:34:46 * RST38h moos thoughtfully Feb 08 12:34:48 * timeless_mbp ponders Feb 08 12:35:25 <17SAACSFJ> hy everybody Feb 08 12:35:26 timeless, crashanddie I will try mirror app and other apps too. Thanks guys! Feb 08 12:35:40 17SAACSFJ: turing test Feb 08 12:36:17 17SAACSFJ: what does your nickname mean? Feb 08 12:37:32 was the red led lit when video recording prior pr1.1? i cant remember Feb 08 12:37:47 am I supposed to have 2 hildon-home running? Feb 08 12:37:50 yes Feb 08 12:37:58 <17SAACSFJ> crashanddie: damn. guess my normal nicknames have all been taken. how do I change it now? Feb 08 12:38:19 crashanddie, yes mece or yes cehteh? Feb 08 12:38:34 17SAACSFJ: /nick username Feb 08 12:38:41 mece: yes cehteh Feb 08 12:38:58 cehteh: it's supposed to be Feb 08 12:39:03 it's the "privacy led" Feb 08 12:39:10 it means "i'm watching your panties" Feb 08 12:39:16 :D Feb 08 12:39:16 heheheh Feb 08 12:39:28 damn you, red LED Feb 08 12:39:32 because every woman has eyes in the back of her panties, just looking for that red led... Feb 08 12:39:38 you foiled my plans to embed an n900 into my shoes Feb 08 12:39:43 lol Feb 08 12:39:59 timeless_mbp: eyes in the ba- thanks for that mental picture... Feb 08 12:40:09 wizcoder: congrats, you passed the test ;) Feb 08 12:40:22 timeless: i hate it .. filming close objects gives a red tint, its way to bright Feb 08 12:40:23 aquatix: sorry Feb 08 12:40:27 so does anyone else have 2 hildon-home running? Could you please confirm or deny? (ps | grep hildon-home) Feb 08 12:40:32 timeless_mbp: :) Feb 08 12:40:37 By the way, whoever is affected by this vote: https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=8890 Feb 08 12:40:38 Bug 8890: Device becomes unlocked when plugged into charger Feb 08 12:41:04 Showed up in 51.1 Feb 08 12:41:08 and on every other camera you can turn off the red recording light Feb 08 12:41:10 crashanddie: Better this way. don't want to have a name like r2d2 or other robots :-) Feb 08 12:41:29 cehteh: only makes sense if it can work in ir Feb 08 12:41:37 cehteh: yeah well... when you have a daughter who is saved from embarrassment by it, you'll ... i dunno, probably break the n900 because it's probably being held by a boy ... Feb 08 12:41:52 cehteh: there's laws that make it mandatory Feb 08 12:42:03 cehteh: i think some black tape works Feb 08 12:42:07 not here in germany .. despite we have strange laws here too Feb 08 12:42:14 stab the LED out! Feb 08 12:42:15 :P Feb 08 12:42:19 cehteh: you are not the rest of the world Feb 08 12:42:20 timeless: that would oover the flash leds too Feb 08 12:42:23 Yesterday I tried to sync my N900 with Google Caldender. It puts all the appointments in my calender and then gives me an error. Which means I can't save the session. Feb 08 12:42:42 can people please make some effort in writing "Calendar" properly? Feb 08 12:42:44 Via Exchange Mails Feb 08 12:43:37 wizcoder: "Exchange server is not responding. Verify that account settings are correct."? Feb 08 12:43:52 ~ # ps ax | grep hildon-home Feb 08 12:43:53 7220 user 3936 S /usr/bin/hildon-home Feb 08 12:43:53 7221 user 58896 S /usr/bin/hildon-home Feb 08 12:43:53 8118 root 2092 S grep hildon-home Feb 08 12:43:55 mece: ^^^ Feb 08 12:44:02 dazo: please use a pastebin Feb 08 12:44:08 ok thanks. Feb 08 12:44:10 It communicates with the server. And I get all appointments inserted correctly Feb 08 12:44:12 dazo, same for me. Feb 08 12:44:27 But no todo's. And then the error Feb 08 12:44:33 crashanddie: just install emacs :P Feb 08 12:44:33 crashanddie: yeah, I usually do that ... I thought 4 lines was safe enough here Feb 08 12:44:36 dazo: maemo is full of strange forking Feb 08 12:44:38 you get used to it Feb 08 12:44:49 cehteh: just gtfo? Feb 08 12:44:53 :) Feb 08 12:45:09 wizcoder: so... Feb 08 12:45:14 timeless_mbp: I'm not the one who wondered ... I just did what mece asked for :) Feb 08 12:45:14 dazo: as long as it doesn't happen too often Feb 08 12:45:21 i don't think google is officially supported by MfE Feb 08 12:45:29 dazo, I guess you don't have comic-widget installed? Feb 08 12:45:31 crashanddie: no, no! I'll behave nicely! :) Feb 08 12:45:36 mece: correct Feb 08 12:46:00 dazo, ok. good. I was kinda worried that the widget was messing with hildon-home Feb 08 12:46:17 mece: no prob :) Feb 08 12:47:24 wizcoder: how many days are you syncing? Feb 08 12:48:43 timeless_mbp: I think 14. Have some appointments that get repeated every week Feb 08 12:48:56 wizcoder: try the shortest interval :) Feb 08 12:49:03 "think baby steps" Feb 08 12:50:34 timeless_mbp: Trying... Feb 08 12:50:36 Is there any way to align icons on the N900 desktop? Feb 08 12:50:45 MiXu-: TweakR Feb 08 12:50:56 or was it Tweakr? Feb 08 12:50:58 * timeless_mbp shrugs Feb 08 12:51:02 I'll try that Feb 08 12:51:16 wizcoder: somewhere in talk.m.o there's a post by the MfE owner Feb 08 12:51:26 he explains how to get logs if you want help Feb 08 12:51:38 also, are you using 51-1 or something older? Feb 08 12:51:47 (older = much less interesting to everyone) Feb 08 12:52:11 timeless_mbp: 2 weeks is the shortest interval. searching for that post Feb 08 12:52:16 hi florian Feb 08 12:52:22 good morning Feb 08 12:52:31 florian took you the blanket with you? Feb 08 12:52:38 oh, ops Feb 08 12:52:44 woglinde: sure Feb 08 12:52:44 it's mail where you can do a 3 day window :) Feb 08 12:52:45 ups false channel Feb 08 12:52:53 florian okay fine Feb 08 12:54:05 http://www.google.com/support/forum/p/Google+Mobile/thread?tid=056294b3ae70852e&hl=en Feb 08 12:54:13 the last comment suggests 'syncevolution' Feb 08 12:57:15 hmmh, how often is karma refreshed? Feb 08 12:58:08 ~karma Feb 08 12:58:08 Corsac: Should be once per 2 days, but something is stuck. Feb 08 12:58:08 woglinde has neutral karma Feb 08 13:05:47 X-Fade: Thanks for sorting the blog feed. I'll have to sort the titles to be slightly more descriptive. Feb 08 13:06:04 Jaffa: It should update when you do that. Feb 08 13:06:22 Jaffa: A good source for karma it seems :) Feb 08 13:06:28 X-Fade: Oh, cool Feb 08 13:06:43 X-Fade: Excellent :-) Feb 08 13:07:05 timeless_mbp: I read all the posts on that page. And deleting the calender on my n900 and syncing again worked. Feb 08 13:07:27 Jaffa: But I think it is a cool thing, you're off to a good start it seems. Feb 08 13:07:29 wizcoder: see, google is your friend :) Feb 08 13:08:53 personally, i'd probably consider the commercial thing that's listed somewhere in the thread. 25usd/year is not a big deal Feb 08 13:10:07 X-Fade: Ta muchly Feb 08 13:12:40 it's snowing! Feb 08 13:13:15 sup guys Feb 08 13:13:22 any new apps Feb 08 13:13:42 mediatomb Feb 08 13:13:56 now I can view my photos on my ps3 with ease and no syncing required Feb 08 13:14:30 Damion2: It's been snowing here (Rugby) for a few hours, getting heavier but not sticking. Feb 08 13:16:30 oh, you're where time comes from Feb 08 13:17:18 * Stskeeps ponders what drug-induced trauma caused people to create Xorg. Feb 08 13:17:23 Damion2: Not anymore :-( Feb 08 13:17:36 Stskeeps: do you remember Xfree? Feb 08 13:17:37 Damion2: A couple of years ago it moved to, errr, Cumbria. Feb 08 13:17:45 timeless_mbp: yes, Xorg is following in it's proud steps Feb 08 13:19:04 * timeless_mbp wonders what possessed someone to name a variable: http://mxr-test.konigsberg.mozilla.org/symbian/ident?i=distinsuiName Feb 08 13:19:53 yesterday my battery was draining like the clappers and I saw a 75% cpu job in top which I'd started the day before (my mistake). I killed it but it dawned on me that it might be good for some sort of warning/alarm if the battery discharge rate is higher than a configurable threshold Feb 08 13:21:20 Damion2: "you're using flash" Feb 08 13:21:54 Damion2: roughly, while the problem is indeed interesting Feb 08 13:21:57 solving it is painful Feb 08 13:22:10 because on average a runaway process happens while you aren't looking Feb 08 13:22:18 if you aren't looking (or aren't even physically close) Feb 08 13:22:28 then most notifications are a further waste of cpu resources Feb 08 13:22:54 now, there is a cpu meter you can install Feb 08 13:22:59 but it of course uses cpu resources :) Feb 08 13:23:21 the best proposal i had for this was roughly: Feb 08 13:23:43 1. the system calculates how much life it gets on your first couple of charges Feb 08 13:23:48 timeless_mbp: but this cpu meter doesn't use resources when the screen is locked isn't it. Feb 08 13:23:53 2. it takes that as a baseline Feb 08 13:24:11 marmoute: does that help when there's a runaway process in the background? :) Feb 08 13:24:24 lala Feb 08 13:24:29 timeless_mbp: no I had a task I started, it was my fault Feb 08 13:24:43 alarm could be audible Feb 08 13:24:45 Damion2: sure, you can use the cpu meter Feb 08 13:24:53 but mostly what will happen is "you're using flash" Feb 08 13:24:58 yeah that would have been red, but I've not instaleld that Feb 08 13:25:01 hi! can i send mms via fmms from contacts? Feb 08 13:25:04 after watching a few movies, you'll quickly turn it off Feb 08 13:25:20 timeless_mbp: if the screen turns off, and there's still a task chomping away? Feb 08 13:25:28 timeless_mbp: that seems like a better category for alarms Feb 08 13:25:31 I don't tend to leave browser running, does flash get in a state and stay running as an orphaned daemon sometimes? Feb 08 13:25:45 Damion2: not generally Feb 08 13:25:56 yeah this might only help me Feb 08 13:25:57 but the point is that if you actually set an alarm for strictly "high cpu usage" Feb 08 13:26:05 it'd trigger everytime you watched any movie Feb 08 13:26:06 I could do some shell script reading the hardware battery settings Feb 08 13:26:12 which should obviously be fairly useless Feb 08 13:26:19 and incredibly annoying Feb 08 13:26:27 w00t: not a bad idea Feb 08 13:26:35 screen blank = shouldn't be churning Feb 08 13:26:48 there are still exceptions to that Feb 08 13:26:52 but nowhere near as many Feb 08 13:27:00 Damion2: but again, if you aren't nearby, do you really want it complaining? Feb 08 13:27:01 probably enough to make it a usable case Feb 08 13:27:12 timeless_mbp: are you ever away from your n900? :P Feb 08 13:27:13 the watchdog you write can be more expensive and annoying than the process you dislike Feb 08 13:27:16 I pondered having a bg job to ffmpeg my .mp4 videos I've just taken, in to something more compatible with stuff Feb 08 13:27:18 w00t: yes Feb 08 13:27:23 mine hasn't left my side, ever, since I got it Feb 08 13:27:30 Mine neither ;) Feb 08 13:27:33 even in the shower! (ok, that's a joke) Feb 08 13:27:36 timeless_mbp: like I said this might only work for me, but personally I'm _never_ away from my n900 Feb 08 13:27:48 i sometimes leave it at the office (charging)overnight because we're in a hurry to get dinner and i forget to grab it Feb 08 13:27:52 ignoring oncall rota, I don't tend to have it further than a shelf if taking a shower Feb 08 13:28:02 Damion2: same Feb 08 13:28:16 you guys are strange :) Feb 08 13:28:17 timeless_mbp: you don't receive phonecalls? Feb 08 13:28:27 not typically :) Feb 08 13:28:30 hi! can i send mms via fmms from contacts? Feb 08 13:28:30 ah Feb 08 13:28:35 between 10pm and 10am? Feb 08 13:28:44 roshenia: I don't know if it's integrated, perhaps not. I dont' know Feb 08 13:28:46 besides, i have 2 phones for the same line Feb 08 13:28:51 so i can use the other one :) Feb 08 13:28:52 timeless_mbp: yes Feb 08 13:29:08 Damion2, yes. i think it now not integrate Feb 08 13:29:32 how can I detect the screen shut? I'm pretty sure I was able to cat /sys/somethingorother/state and get open/closed Feb 08 13:29:39 but that doesn't work now like it does the keyboard slider Feb 08 13:29:50 s/shut/blanked Feb 08 13:29:54 timeless_mbp: i use my n900 -a lot- :P Feb 08 13:30:09 w00t: my phone bill's bigger than yours :-v Feb 08 13:30:26 timeless_mbp: undoubtedly, but that's because I use wifi most of the time, and all my texts are free Feb 08 13:30:44 (actually, I don't even pay my phonebill, my employer does \o/) Feb 08 13:30:47 you don't text internationally? Feb 08 13:30:55 (which is great, as I accidentally ran up a £100 3G bill recently) Feb 08 13:30:56 my employer objected to my last 3 phone bills :( Feb 08 13:31:15 I *used* to text internationally, but now that I'm living with the person I used to text, not so much, no Feb 08 13:31:35 my worst bill ever: gbp1800 Feb 08 13:31:46 let that be a lesson about the possible side effects of texting Feb 08 13:31:48 at what exchange against the eur? :) Feb 08 13:31:49 for what period? Feb 08 13:31:54 1month of course Feb 08 13:31:55 one month Feb 08 13:31:57 jeez Feb 08 13:32:13 all my friends got an iphone on o2 and my calls to o2 are free Feb 08 13:32:15 i'm pretty sure my bill trumps crashanddie 's :( Feb 08 13:32:19 timeless_mbp wins. Feb 08 13:32:20 :P Feb 08 13:32:29 Damion2: typically when you get high bills, you're roaming Feb 08 13:32:37 e.g. i roamed for a month w/ a pair of plans/n900s Feb 08 13:32:41 I'm about to spend 3 weeks abroad Feb 08 13:32:48 pick up local sim's Feb 08 13:32:52 hi guys, can someone point me to a plugin (or something which works over dbus) which enables last.fm scrobbiling on the default media-player on the n900? Feb 08 13:32:55 I spent a month in the Ukraine Feb 08 13:33:04 I plan on getting PAYG out there as only a fool would pay roaming ;) Feb 08 13:33:08 crashanddie: i only spent a week there and my bill was bigger than yours Feb 08 13:33:32 Damion2: well, some of us fools have employers Feb 08 13:33:43 timeless_mbp: i reiterate my point from earlier Feb 08 13:33:56 * timeless_mbp is stupid ? Feb 08 13:34:01 about ego Feb 08 13:34:19 oh, i normally don't get into pissing contests Feb 08 13:34:36 well, you've been doing that all night as far as I can tell Feb 08 13:34:36 it's just that when people get distracted, i'd rather finish things and move them along Feb 08 13:39:49 people getting distracted during pissing contests is indeed bad. Feb 08 13:40:17 hey Feb 08 13:40:33 what happens if you press the <= icon in the browser toolbar today (51-1)? Feb 08 13:40:47 ? Feb 08 13:40:53 you get a bunch of thumbnails Feb 08 13:40:55 ok Feb 08 13:41:01 is it real to write programs in windows for maemo? Feb 08 13:41:19 eh? Feb 08 13:41:27 I wish there was an on screen button in the microB for "back". Feb 08 13:41:28 timeless_mbp: (which frankly pisses me off, I want to be able to go straight backwards and not have to deal w/ the thumbnails, but meh) Feb 08 13:41:38 tybollt: backspace key on the keyboard Feb 08 13:41:41 :-) Feb 08 13:41:44 tybollt: that's changing Feb 08 13:41:51 hence my needing to ask what it does today Feb 08 13:41:53 \o/ Feb 08 13:41:59 heck, where is it on your toolbar? Feb 08 13:42:14 i wanna write software for maeo Feb 08 13:42:15 maemo Feb 08 13:42:17 backspace works, sure, but you don't always have the keyboard out when surfing Feb 08 13:42:17 next to stop, timeless_mbp Feb 08 13:42:19 but i havent linux Feb 08 13:42:21 timeless: shows current page - in the event that there is only one page in the current session - or the current page and last page on a scrolly Feb 08 13:42:28 stop, arrow back, fullscreen button Feb 08 13:42:30 roshenia: get the vmware image Feb 08 13:42:32 timeless_mbp: second to the bottom right Feb 08 13:42:33 w00t: thanks Feb 08 13:42:54 koala_man, hm. its sux =( Feb 08 13:43:10 roshenia: develope in python on windows Feb 08 13:43:21 roshenia: you can always use Qt to develop on windows, and then test later in the VM Feb 08 13:43:37 (either via pyside/pyqt or directly via Qt creator in C++) Feb 08 13:43:37 eheh Feb 08 13:43:44 There's something called MADDE that you can use to cross compile Qt in windows environment. Feb 08 13:43:54 hi ;> Feb 08 13:43:58 Haven't tried it though. Feb 08 13:44:47 MADDE is great, but it won't make it easy unless you have a device to put the binaries on Feb 08 13:44:56 (I use MADDE) Feb 08 13:46:41 I haven't got around to installing MADDE yet. Feb 08 13:46:55 w00t: Do you know of a good howto for it? Feb 08 13:47:04 MiXu-: MADDE? it's very, very easy Feb 08 13:47:34 take a look at http://wiki.maemo.org/MADDE Feb 08 13:47:40 Ok, thanks Feb 08 13:47:47 if you're using Qt, also see http://wiki.maemo.org/MADDE/Qt_Example Feb 08 13:52:21 why is ovi maps free now Feb 08 13:52:27 and why are ppl downloading it Feb 08 13:52:34 when are ppl gonna find out it doesnt work Feb 08 13:52:47 acidjazz fo symbian its working Feb 08 13:52:56 why is it so fail on maemo Feb 08 13:54:04 why is ovi maps so sluggish with click drag scrolling? Feb 08 13:54:08 acidjazz: 42 Feb 08 13:54:21 Damion2: 42 Feb 08 13:54:43 :) Feb 08 13:54:45 it's otherwise a quite okay app for maemo and s60, but it feels awful compared to google maps for your low attention span 5min check out of the app Feb 08 13:55:03 wazd_: lol wat Feb 08 13:55:25 he's answering all questions with the answer to the meaning of life the universe and everything Feb 08 13:55:25 acidjazz: that's why Ovi maps for maemo are "so fail" Feb 08 13:55:28 acidjazz: 42 Feb 08 13:55:37 blue 42? Feb 08 13:55:48 it's from a dull book by douglas adams Feb 08 13:55:49 acidjazz: http://www.google.nl/search?q=the+answer+to+life+the+universe+and+everything Feb 08 13:55:53 which people rave about Feb 08 13:56:17 is that gonna be the quote from conan the barbarian aquatix Feb 08 13:56:29 oh Feb 08 13:56:36 ;) Feb 08 13:56:49 hitchhikers guide to the whatnot Feb 08 13:56:54 i need to see that again Feb 08 13:57:00 better read the book Feb 08 13:57:04 it's funnier Feb 08 13:57:23 I didn't like the movie :P Feb 08 13:57:35 movie was disappointing indeed Feb 08 13:57:43 I haven't read the book, so stuff just felt totally random. Feb 08 13:58:49 FOSDEM is great! Feb 08 13:59:54 pupnik: Are you still drunk from the beer event? >:) Feb 08 13:59:59 <- recovering. Feb 08 14:00:17 heh missed it Feb 08 14:00:34 was it fu Feb 08 14:00:43 n? Feb 08 14:01:13 I thought the new H2G2 film was better than the radio show which was better than the tv show, all of which were better than the book Feb 08 14:01:16 but that's just me Feb 08 14:01:19 tybollt: do you get bugmail for 7002? Feb 08 14:01:23 what were your favorite points? Feb 08 14:01:41 line 145 -- // the total number of didits Feb 08 14:02:02 DIDITS Feb 08 14:02:14 pupnik: Parts of it. Mostly it was too crowded (especially as there were loads of people not connected with Fosdem at all in the bar). Feb 08 14:02:24 timeless_mbp: Pardoinez moi? Feb 08 14:02:33 tybollt: if you don't, you don't :) Feb 08 14:02:38 DUDDITS Feb 08 14:02:39 tybollt: "Pardonnez-moi?" Feb 08 14:02:57 crashanddie: jajaja Feb 08 14:03:03 is there a central fosdem sire for the lectures i missed? Feb 08 14:03:10 video Feb 08 14:03:12 yes sire Feb 08 14:03:13 * tybollt nods to timeless_mbp - it would seem I do not. Feb 08 14:03:35 tybollt: i just need to ensure that my final comment is clear as mud to everyone Feb 08 14:03:42 i do not want to see another comment in that bug Feb 08 14:03:54 clear as mud, roger that wilco Feb 08 14:05:02 thanks :) Feb 08 14:05:08 timeless_mbp: hell yes, that is exactly it, cool. Feb 08 14:05:20 * tybollt reading now Feb 08 14:06:06 pupnik: http://fosdem.org/2010/media/video eventually. Feb 08 14:06:15 fact is the "swipe left" one is so intuitive I actually tried that (however in vain :) Feb 08 14:06:48 pupnik: But not all were recorded afair. Feb 08 14:07:11 tybollt: glad to hear you approve of the ui designer's view Feb 08 14:07:17 Anyone online with experienceon using MADDE? Feb 08 14:07:29 if i see him this week and remember, i'll mention that someone agreed Feb 08 14:07:33 "so we're going to try to do what you Feb 08 14:07:33 he should smile for a moment :) Feb 08 14:07:34 (the real customers) want" Feb 08 14:07:36 o_O Feb 08 14:07:50 a developer actually working on something _the customer_ want!? Feb 08 14:07:54 well, we (babu, myself) tried Feb 08 14:08:12 but in this case, the ui designer prevailed, and i think it turns out for the right reasons Feb 08 14:08:12 I agree with the designer as well, actually Feb 08 14:08:13 (No no, I'm not cynical and bitter , not at all ;) Feb 08 14:08:36 w00t: yeah, when i'm not sick/exhausted, i do too Feb 08 14:08:43 the rest of the time it's too complicated for me Feb 08 14:08:46 * w00t pats timeless_mbp Feb 08 14:09:09 * timeless_mbp taps forhead (eHOT) and pats stomach (eUPSET) Feb 08 14:09:23 * tybollt thanks timeless - that was an exhaustive reply to that Feb 08 14:09:37 yawn Feb 08 14:09:43 what did I miss? Feb 08 14:09:48 i was asked to do it wednesday or thursday Feb 08 14:09:53 timeless telling us that he's hot, apparantly Feb 08 14:09:55 but thursday i was on my way to paris Feb 08 14:10:02 and friday i was sick in paris Feb 08 14:10:08 RST38h: back button in microb actually taking you back instead of going to thumbnailmode Feb 08 14:10:49 not here Feb 08 14:11:07 why dont we have ovi maps racing Feb 08 14:11:53 N900evil: we're talking about the future Feb 08 14:11:57 it's on mine Feb 08 14:12:01 tybollt: it does? Feb 08 14:12:14 re Feb 08 14:12:17 ah Feb 08 14:12:34 RST38h: future tense... it _will_ (hopefully) do... Feb 08 14:12:44 sick, i only get connection problem when i try to rdc to my workstation, i can do rdc from home to my workstation. I even tried thru my wifi and by 3g, get connection problem everytime i try to connect with rdesktop. real weird. Feb 08 14:14:14 how do I enable extre-devel. site seems to be down. (googled it :-) ) Feb 08 14:14:32 http://marcin.juszkiewicz.com.pl/2010/02/08/fosdem-x/ Feb 08 14:15:34 btw timeless_mbp - I will make sure to take you up on the offer offered in the final post in that bug... I mean you do start "feel free to" ;-) Feb 08 14:15:37 Conboy is good tool to write blog posts Feb 08 14:15:48 fine w/ me :) Feb 08 14:15:53 s/start/state Feb 08 14:16:01 http://marcin.juszkiewicz.com.pl/2010/02/08/maemo5-and-lack-of-navigation/ is next one written during fosdem trip Feb 08 14:16:20 infobot's dead Feb 08 14:16:31 (that's what methinks) Feb 08 14:16:33 oh I thought it just hated me ;) Feb 08 14:16:38 \ Feb 08 14:16:43 https://wiki.maemo.org/Extras-devel. Feb 08 14:16:45 tybollt: ah it won't Feb 08 14:16:46 https://wiki.maemo.org/Extras-devel Feb 08 14:16:56 wizcoder: ^^ Feb 08 14:17:01 RST38h: why do you say that? Feb 08 14:17:05 Hi there, Feb 08 14:17:06 * RST38h wonders when MicroB will memorize his Ctrl+Shift+I setting though Feb 08 14:17:10 https://wiki.maemo.org/Extras-devel#How_to_activate_Extras-devel Feb 08 14:17:14 tybollt: empyrical data Feb 08 14:17:27 ~curse closed source software Feb 08 14:17:28 May you be reincarnated as a Windows XP administrator, closed source software ! Feb 08 14:17:43 RST38h: tssk tssk, have a little faith in timeless now :) Feb 08 14:17:50 Updating extras-testing and the normal maemi repositories time out for me. Anything known there? shall I use the espejo-mirror? Feb 08 14:17:52 So I got my n900 today - happy I am. But I can't use 3G internet for some reason. It shows me full bars on 3G, and my SIM is brand new. when I want to connect to 3G (or any cellular I mean), it says "Internet connection failed. Try again?" Feb 08 14:18:00 tybollt: meh. Feb 08 14:18:22 Shapeshifter: wha tservice Feb 08 14:18:25 what service* Feb 08 14:18:29 Shapeshifter, APN wrong? Feb 08 14:18:34 apesh: can you make calls? Feb 08 14:18:48 Shapeshifter: sounds like your carrier or apn Feb 08 14:18:57 MohammadAG: the syntax is s/x/b/ the trailing slash is mandatory Feb 08 14:18:59 Chiming in on the "Got my N900 today" tune :) I'm trying to add another GPRS APN, but if i hit "NEW" in the Internet connection settings it let's me only add another WiFi AP. Feb 08 14:19:00 Shapeshifter: lock to 2g in phone settings, if that works your carried is being lame Feb 08 14:19:01 That sums up Maemo Mapper pretty well: "Worked good in OS2008 but newer version totally broken." Feb 08 14:19:10 sadly Feb 08 14:19:12 timeless_mbp: regarding "back is dangerou"... well why should my phone be any "safer" than my computer? :) Feb 08 14:19:22 derf: Maep Feb 08 14:19:22 RST38h: what the heck is ctrl-shift-i? Feb 08 14:19:29 okay thanks guys I'll check the settings Feb 08 14:19:33 I blame Google for hiring gunite. Feb 08 14:19:34 Arkenoi: Here? Feb 08 14:19:44 timeless_mbp: capital tab? Feb 08 14:19:50 tybollt: your computer is safer because things are more spread out Feb 08 14:20:05 derf: honestly Maemo Mapper has been having problems since switching to sqlite Feb 08 14:20:13 RST38h: According to that post Maep has no pre-downloaded maps, so it's useless to me. Feb 08 14:20:47 derf: it seems to have pre downloaded maps, at least it does not download map until I go out of shown range Feb 08 14:21:25 RST38h: Can I download a given area in advance and tell it not to use the network after that? Feb 08 14:21:41 derf: I think you can, by zooming/scrolling Feb 08 14:21:52 derf: there is no dedicated UI for this though Feb 08 14:21:53 RST38h: That's a non-starter. Feb 08 14:21:53 i feel a good poo comin along Feb 08 14:22:08 I am not zooming and scrolling through an entire city. Feb 08 14:22:09 RST38h: ctrl+shift+i? Feb 08 14:22:12 tangogps can do that Feb 08 14:22:19 download Feb 08 14:22:23 hrw: enables reflow-on-zoom Feb 08 14:22:46 hrw: a good replacement to fit-to-width option from Maemo4, but not saved in the config like Ctrl+Shift+O Feb 08 14:23:03 * ifreq waits for gl es navi for n900 Feb 08 14:23:20 derf: make a patch Feb 08 14:23:35 Stskeeps: I have my own projects, thanks. Feb 08 14:23:36 * RST38h doubts Maep author will accept a patch Feb 08 14:23:52 Damion2: oh, my carrier doesn't do 2g ;) Feb 08 14:24:12 acidjazz: orange switzerland. I checked the settings and they're okay. Feb 08 14:24:14 I submitted patches for maemo-mapper, but that was because I knew the author personally. Feb 08 14:24:17 There are real issues with swamping the OSM tileservers with a popular app that doenloads stuff Feb 08 14:24:31 top story of "tomshardware" "VIDEO: Duke Nukem 3D Meets Wiimote, N900 " Feb 08 14:24:32 >:) Feb 08 14:24:40 The right way is to setup your own tileserver - but this is non-trivial Feb 08 14:24:57 And because I'd been using it for a year until he broke it during the sqlite conversion. Feb 08 14:26:26 rst38h: yep Feb 08 14:26:44 ok this is weird, I added extras-devel to my list of repos, but before I even had a chance to download or install anything, it broke my app manager Feb 08 14:27:14 hmm, Is it just me, or is garage.maemo.org inaccessible? Feb 08 14:27:33 ah.5th version of conversation inbox. i preferred the second one. Feb 08 14:27:44 jophish: kernel issue, working on it. Feb 08 14:28:00 Sure. thanks very much Feb 08 14:28:19 according to the log, apt-worker exits because it cannot truncate /var/lib/hildon-application-manager/apt-worker-lock: Read-only file system Feb 08 14:28:43 rebooting the phone doesnt help Feb 08 14:28:53 / full? Feb 08 14:28:54 even if I take the battery out Feb 08 14:29:00 no, filesystems have lots of space Feb 08 14:29:08 dnaumov, have you moved /var/lib/ anywhere? Feb 08 14:29:21 memory management says I have 1,75gb of space available for apps and over 26gb for other stuff Feb 08 14:29:27 and no I havent moved or changed fs layout Feb 08 14:29:42 RST38h: ah. that Feb 08 14:29:53 I guess you could try to remove that file in the terminal Feb 08 14:29:58 Shapeshifter: you're not with "3" are you ? Feb 08 14:33:28 hello, can you point me to a guide how to change the video that is played on booting? Feb 08 14:33:50 its on tmo Feb 08 14:34:05 dnaumov: / full! Feb 08 14:34:31 ifreq: oh, thanks Feb 08 14:34:34 dnaumov: root is only <250MB Feb 08 14:34:52 dnaumov: /var resides on / by default Feb 08 14:35:36 LuciusMare: try the top link on : http://www.google.co.uk/webhp#hl=en&source=hp&q=hello%2C+can+you+point+me+to+a+guide+how+to+change+the+video+++++++++++++++++++++that+is+played+on+booting%3F+maemo+n900&btnG=Google+Search&meta=&aq=f&oq=hello%2C+can+you+point+me+to+a+guide+how+to+change+the+video+++++++++++++++++++++that+is+played+on+booting%3F+maemo+n900&fp=33a9a577caa4e7cb Feb 08 14:36:02 Damion2: bitly... tinyurl... etc :) Feb 08 14:36:07 DocScrutinizer: my / is 75% in use Feb 08 14:36:11 goo.gl Feb 08 14:36:13 over 56mb available Feb 08 14:36:21 yet, it seems to be readonly for some reason Feb 08 14:36:31 dnaumov: ooh. then it's not full evidentally Feb 08 14:37:00 tybollt: also the whole point would have been missed, of directly c+p the question and the top answer being the guide... Feb 08 14:37:03 that's rather strange Feb 08 14:37:05 I cant write anything to /var/lib Feb 08 14:37:45 I'd say run fsck on on it. But then wait, fsck the / ? :-/ Feb 08 14:37:58 and, what format should it be? Feb 08 14:38:34 dnaumov: you did switch to root user? Feb 08 14:38:37 yes Feb 08 14:38:40 it'll probably play anything the normal media player can play Feb 08 14:38:44 sudo gainroot'ed Feb 08 14:38:54 let's hope i don't screw up with avi Feb 08 14:38:57 LuciusMare: basic h264 aac Feb 08 14:39:14 what could happen if it gone wrong? it wont render my tablet unbootable,right? Feb 08 14:39:18 avi if h263/4 with mp3 /may/ work if DIVX tagged Feb 08 14:39:19 dnaumov: a plain "root" is better afaik. but wouldn't make for your error Feb 08 14:39:35 LuciusMare: I can't guarentee it wouldn't prevent booting Feb 08 14:39:42 :O Feb 08 14:39:44 however it's highly unlikely, much more likely it;ll skip it and carry on Feb 08 14:39:51 make sure it plays in the media player Feb 08 14:40:04 LuciusMare: put 90min porn movie on boot Feb 08 14:40:10 ROFL Feb 08 14:40:29 dnaumov: check 'mount'. is the fs ro ? Feb 08 14:41:21 and dmesg to see if it remounted ro on errors Feb 08 14:41:27 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nT4yW8Vy94s seems nice Feb 08 14:41:48 Damion2: that's the conclusion then, yes Feb 08 14:42:12 fstab says that rootfs is mount RO in case of an error Feb 08 14:42:25 so I am guessing I have some fs error that forces it to mount it in RO mode Feb 08 14:42:37 though usually that part will have left the buffer of dmsg most likely Feb 08 14:42:39 that's worrying Feb 08 14:42:39 echo fish >/root/foo Feb 08 14:42:44 see if it's in fact RO Feb 08 14:42:44 Jaffa: ping? Feb 08 14:42:50 SpeedEvil: it is Feb 08 14:42:52 k Feb 08 14:43:05 LuciusMare: you can sit and wait 10 seconds? Feb 08 14:43:26 In all the examples for developing applications, they tend to repeat all the commands. first for i386, then for armel. why is this? Feb 08 14:43:31 when you do the echo what error do you get and what does dmesg show? Feb 08 14:43:34 dnaumov: use 'mount', not fstab Feb 08 14:43:46 Damion2: but it looks cool ^^ Feb 08 14:43:56 jophish: sensible, testable good development. Me I knock up an arm and run it on my phone ;) Feb 08 14:44:01 LuciusMare: it's nice Feb 08 14:44:19 ehh Feb 08 14:44:20 Damion2, exactly what I am doing at the moment Feb 08 14:44:24 dmesg isnt pretty Feb 08 14:44:30 i am actually worried about the size of 2.2 mb Feb 08 14:44:49 LuciusMare: better than the paedophile snatching the little girls hand Feb 08 14:45:13 dnaumov: dmesg uses a buffer slightly larger than 512 bytes :-/ Feb 08 14:45:43 wtf Feb 08 14:45:48 I guess the daily mail doesn't spread it's hype to Finland Feb 08 14:45:55 also obviously I cant edit fstab Feb 08 14:46:00 since its on / which is RO Feb 08 14:46:03 fun times Feb 08 14:46:11 You pervert, it was supposed to be...nevermind. Feb 08 14:46:18 how do I force a remount in readwrite mode? Feb 08 14:46:25 dnaumov: probably your best bet is to copy all the files from / to backup. then reflash root, then copy back the backup Feb 08 14:46:25 dnaumov: I think you're screwed, reflash necessary Feb 08 14:46:48 dnaumov: I don't know (and doubt) whether there is a fsck for it Feb 08 14:46:55 wtf? nice Feb 08 14:47:03 I didnt even install any -devel software Feb 08 14:47:13 if you want to risk playing, you can try mount -o remount,rw / Feb 08 14:47:25 dnaumov: shit happens Feb 08 14:48:05 our *great* ubifs, eh? Feb 08 14:48:17 or he has a faulty chip? Feb 08 14:48:30 that'd be rally nasty Feb 08 14:48:34 really Feb 08 14:48:57 which? forcing remount or finding a bad chip? he's got a warrenty Feb 08 14:49:07 It would be nice perhaps if you could zip up a raw ubifs image and send it to the fs peeps. Feb 08 14:49:16 but I'm not sure there is a onennanddump Feb 08 14:49:17 dd and netcat Feb 08 14:49:19 bad chip Feb 08 14:49:31 dd won't get you the raw chip Feb 08 14:49:34 it's not a block device Feb 08 14:49:35 DocScrutinizer: actually it's better for us as it means ubifs isn't flakey Feb 08 14:49:36 Damion2: the manual remount did nothing Feb 08 14:49:45 hehe Feb 08 14:49:47 dnaumov: what did dmesg |tail show ? Feb 08 14:49:57 SpeedEvil: oh yes Feb 08 14:50:00 SpeedEvil: point Feb 08 14:50:11 SpeedEvil: okay tar cf - / |nc ;) Feb 08 14:50:21 with various params for not leaving the filesystem Feb 08 14:50:33 Damion2: that doesn't tell you anything interesting about the fs Feb 08 14:50:38 doh, sorry yes Feb 08 14:50:47 you sure there isn't a dd able block ? Feb 08 14:51:03 As far as I understand, no. Feb 08 14:51:20 what about that thing which has a 2MB partition with NILO at the start ? Feb 08 14:51:22 the end of dmesg shows a lot of errors like "UBIFS error (pid 1509) ubifs_create and ubifs_reservation both complain about being unable to reserve xxx bytes in jhead 1, error -30 Feb 08 14:51:27 there should be a number of ubitools though, no? Feb 08 14:51:45 It is of course really a block device - but the sectors are not a power of 2, and there is out-of-band data that's potentially important Feb 08 14:51:52 dnaumov: odd, as I've completely filled mine and saw no ill effect Feb 08 14:52:27 is it actually full? Feb 08 14:52:48 dnaumov: anyway that dmesg errors probably help a lot for a ticket Feb 08 14:52:52 SpeedEvil: it says no Feb 08 14:53:08 75% Feb 08 14:53:36 so *plenty* of room Feb 08 14:53:38 Damion2: nah, I'm with orange. Feb 08 14:53:52 So, is there something like ifconfig on the n900? I need to know my wlan IP. Feb 08 14:53:57 and ifconfig is missing. Feb 08 14:53:59 orange without 2g data ? Feb 08 14:54:09 /sbin/ifconfig Feb 08 14:54:18 Shapeshifter: ifconfig Feb 08 14:54:21 Damion2: orange switzerland only offers 3g Feb 08 14:54:55 you can also install personal ip address from app manager Feb 08 14:55:08 Damion2: ah, sbin is not in path.... Feb 08 14:55:11 yup, quite handy Feb 08 14:55:25 for root, nope Feb 08 14:55:40 err "for user" Feb 08 14:55:46 for root yes it is Feb 08 14:56:41 DocScrutinizer: yep, thanks Feb 08 14:58:40 who asked for a "deadly laser" in N920 yesterday? I killed a moth with my deadly green laserpointer ;-P Feb 08 14:59:12 wtf??? 86% of / filled! Feb 08 14:59:16 :o Feb 08 14:59:23 normal Feb 08 14:59:30 ugh Feb 08 14:59:32 oh this is so sweet. Feb 08 14:59:35 as much fun as that is.. Feb 08 14:59:40 LuciusMare: move /var/cache/apt and /var/lib/apt/ to somewhere else Feb 08 14:59:41 Or maybe it's surprising that it isn't full :) Feb 08 14:59:50 apparently the green lasers is becomming a real problem Feb 08 14:59:51 ssh'ing into my servers within minutes. how brilliant Feb 08 14:59:54 * Shapeshifter hugs his n900. Feb 08 14:59:59 w/ kids lasering traffic airliners... Feb 08 14:59:59 huh Feb 08 15:00:11 Shapeshifter: how do you do that? it is kinda hard, because n900 is so small... Feb 08 15:00:21 tybollt: ack. idiots Feb 08 15:00:30 DocScrutinizer: indeed... Feb 08 15:00:37 LuciusMare: what do you mean? 1. install ssh, 2. ? 3. profit! Feb 08 15:00:41 hrw: what about optifying? Feb 08 15:00:44 Shapeshifter: i meant the hugging Feb 08 15:00:48 LuciusMare: ah xD Feb 08 15:01:17 Shapeshifter: you know, full body hug is pretty hard, because the n900 tends to fall down your arms Feb 08 15:01:20 i have tried Feb 08 15:01:20 <3 Feb 08 15:01:36 ye me too, it drops too easily :( Feb 08 15:01:40 ^^ Feb 08 15:01:59 n900 -> shirt pocket; lean down to tie your shoelaces -> n900 on the floor :( Feb 08 15:02:12 fail Feb 08 15:02:58 mgedmin: you do that once in your live. or you're retarded ;-) Feb 08 15:02:59 mgedmin: bend over can to hurl -> (at the time) nokia 8110 in the toilet ;D Feb 08 15:03:08 (literally) Feb 08 15:03:10 ouch Feb 08 15:03:24 well, unless you lean with your legs fully stretched, it was not that high Feb 08 15:03:28 a similar accident taught me to never use phone cases that clip onto your belt Feb 08 15:03:37 ouch...ew. Feb 08 15:03:47 yup, when I told my boss the next they he said (and I quote) "Huh, what the fuck, I ought to punch you right on the nose!" Feb 08 15:04:03 LuciusMare: do however you want Feb 08 15:04:09 was it his phone? Feb 08 15:04:28 mgedmin: company paid for my phones at the time :) Feb 08 15:04:42 mgedmin: (clip to belt) mine has an additional securing flap Feb 08 15:05:03 <_berto_> garage still down ? :) Feb 08 15:05:19 woot Feb 08 15:05:26 _berto_, not to me Feb 08 15:05:29 hrw: what is in /var/lib/apt/ ? Feb 08 15:05:51 LuciusMare: lists dir which keeps informations about repositories contents Feb 08 15:05:55 tybollt: water usually isn't any harmful, if you remove bat *immediately* and then gently dry the device for days/weeks Feb 08 15:06:02 <_berto_> jophish: ah, now it worked Feb 08 15:06:11 great Feb 08 15:06:35 DocScrutinizer: friend of mine once dropped his (playing) phone into the pool... Feb 08 15:06:47 _berto_: It is very slow, with a load of 0.2.. Something is going on there, trying to find out what. Feb 08 15:06:49 He just sat and listened to it playing underwater Feb 08 15:06:49 DocScrutinizer: an 8110 soaking in a can full of whatever-I-ate-that-day mixed w/ quantities of beer, wine and kosken? Dude you could not pay me to use that thing again ;) Feb 08 15:07:16 lol Feb 08 15:07:28 not a technical issue Feb 08 15:08:28 LuciusMare: yup. normal. but it will get stained traces and contacts very quickly, if you don't remove any voltage Feb 08 15:08:53 Falling N900 issues, eh Feb 08 15:08:59 I was very disappointed not to get a lanyard with my N900 >:I Feb 08 15:09:07 Or I might have lost it before I even found it from the packaging Feb 08 15:09:09 ooooh Feb 08 15:09:27 Hi Feb 08 15:09:29 there was no lanyard Feb 08 15:09:38 why does the app manager "update" everytime you load it. does it do apt-get update everytime? Feb 08 15:09:41 and other stuff Feb 08 15:09:45 what else than DNS can go wrong in the Scratchbox to not have DNS? Feb 08 15:09:52 Nobody ever uses the cheap lanyards that come with devices but if it has a hole for one it damn well better come with one! Feb 08 15:09:54 my resolv.conf is correct Feb 08 15:09:59 and I have network Feb 08 15:10:01 optifying /var/lib/apt/ and /var/cache/apt/ = WIN Feb 08 15:10:11 Shapeshifter, afaiu it reads the apt database (which is a bunch of flat text files and takes a looong time to load) Feb 08 15:10:14 on 73 Feb 08 15:10:16 cvandonderen: virtual sdk olr oure owsystem? Feb 08 15:10:16 er Feb 08 15:10:17 maybe computes dependencies and stuff Feb 08 15:10:21 on 73% Feb 08 15:10:25 optifying /var = WIN^2 Feb 08 15:10:27 wtf Feb 08 15:10:31 I'm probably wrong about the bunch of flat text files thing -- apt has a bunch of binary caches Feb 08 15:10:32 / on 73 Feb 08 15:10:35 i mean. Feb 08 15:10:36 ifreq: Windows -> VBox image -> scratchbox Feb 08 15:10:38 that don't seem to speed things up very much ... Feb 08 15:11:08 The app manager takes srs ages to start up with anything besides the default repos Feb 08 15:11:14 (Which have about 50 packages) Feb 08 15:11:22 mgedmin: humm okay Feb 08 15:11:53 ifreq: any idea? Feb 08 15:12:41 hm, do you think that symlinking the boot video located in mydocs to /usr/share/hildon-welcome/media is a good idea? Feb 08 15:12:46 ifreq: got it Feb 08 15:12:50 :-P Feb 08 15:13:06 The boot video is in MyDocs? o_O Feb 08 15:13:12 er Feb 08 15:13:16 my custom boot video Feb 08 15:13:17 Oh, the other way round Feb 08 15:13:59 LuciusMare: symlinking the luke video to something really cool is a better idea ;-P Feb 08 15:13:59 cvandonderen: good. Feb 08 15:14:32 aah obviously that's what you're about to do Feb 08 15:14:54 rebooting Feb 08 15:14:56 wish me luck Feb 08 15:15:08 * DocScrutinizer crosses fingers Feb 08 15:15:33 Shapeshifter: apart from the fact that it was telnet with the 9000 and 1998 and 9110 for the next few years, I've been sshing in to servers for _many_ years. If anything the n900 is a slight step back frmo the e90/n97 Feb 08 15:15:47 wee Feb 08 15:15:53 ^^ Feb 08 15:15:56 mydocs is mounted by the time the video plays? Feb 08 15:15:58 :-) Feb 08 15:16:01 well Feb 08 15:16:04 i just copied it Feb 08 15:16:04 great, Nokia in its great wisdom has apparently decided to make the root filesystem "ubifs" instead of ext2/ext3 and there is no fsck for ubifs... Feb 08 15:16:05 :D Feb 08 15:16:30 ubifs is more flash memory friendly, isn't it? Feb 08 15:16:42 dnaumov: that's what we told you Feb 08 15:16:47 dnaumov: nokians are creatures trying to bring down any tries to use their products Feb 08 15:16:50 AGH Feb 08 15:16:54 are NOT creatures Feb 08 15:16:58 i meant, they have their reasons Feb 08 15:17:35 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-IrlhLF1c3k Feb 08 15:17:52 there's areason to have ubifs rather than ext2/3 on NAND Feb 08 15:18:15 Damion2: I've used ssh on SE P series since P800 days so =) Feb 08 15:18:15 NAND is a bitch Feb 08 15:18:21 acidjazz: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oHg5SJYRHA0 Feb 08 15:18:38 no I quite like Nan(d) actually Feb 08 15:18:43 way better than popadums Feb 08 15:19:13 LuciusMare: your startup video? Feb 08 15:19:24 that'll take a while and people around will laugh at the audio Feb 08 15:19:26 LOL Feb 08 15:19:45 well, better than the acidjazz Feb 08 15:19:47 's Feb 08 15:20:20 tybollt: 2003? Feb 08 15:20:40 sp3000: yes? Feb 08 15:20:44 Hello! Feb 08 15:21:04 timeless_mbp: the tone was imo uncalled for Feb 08 15:21:11 at least in any visible context Feb 08 15:21:18 I'm not the only one who was confused by it Feb 08 15:21:27 Damion2: sorry no, our exchange server is 2007 to the best of my knowledge Feb 08 15:21:38 oh Feb 08 15:21:42 you mean the P800 Feb 08 15:21:44 yeah Feb 08 15:21:45 sure Feb 08 15:21:47 thereabouts Feb 08 15:22:00 * DocScrutinizer envisions "DONT PANIC" fading from red to "friendly letters" in orange Feb 08 15:22:31 alas no idea how to create a mp4 for that Feb 08 15:24:05 I think you can do that with mencoder and a text subtitle file Feb 08 15:24:21 or kino with kinoplus plugins even easier Feb 08 15:25:14 never used those Feb 08 15:26:14 where's the best place to put compiled applications for n900 ? Feb 08 15:26:35 - /opt Feb 08 15:26:46 alas :-S Feb 08 15:26:52 as in should i move the files as if dpkg was installing a debian package Feb 08 15:26:57 like etc and bin. Feb 08 15:27:00 oh ok. Feb 08 15:27:20 you need symlinks from /bin Feb 08 15:27:31 ln ? Feb 08 15:27:31 etc Feb 08 15:27:40 I built with --prefix=/opt/mypkgname but then /opt/mypkgname/bin needs a symblink in /usr/bin Feb 08 15:28:18 thanx a lot. Feb 08 15:28:24 ~optify Feb 08 15:28:35 but wait, you're compiling using your n900 ? Feb 08 15:28:42 errr Feb 08 15:28:48 ~optification Feb 08 15:28:49 it has been said that optification is a botch to reclaim space in fs root, done due to the fact the partitioning is FUBAR Feb 08 15:29:42 sp3000: *sigh* Feb 08 15:29:52 i just don't want further 'contributions' in that bug Feb 08 15:30:03 sp3000: who else was confused/ Feb 08 15:30:07 babu Feb 08 15:30:26 :( Feb 08 15:31:34 ~FUBAR Feb 08 15:31:35 fubar is F*cked Up Beyond Any Recognition, e.g. "This whole operation is fubar, soldier" (gay lisp included), or a bar addon like Titan Panel and Telo's InfoBar. and everything. Feb 08 15:32:02 oh, i always thought it is like foo bar... Feb 08 15:32:03 I have no problems with / being 256M, it's plenty for a base OS as long as you have larger installed apps else where Feb 08 15:32:12 personally I'd have gone for /usr/local Feb 08 15:32:39 which is default if people compile with a plain ./configure Feb 08 15:33:02 Damion2: it is a step back? Feb 08 15:33:37 Shapeshifter: the e90 with the last revisions of s2putty were a very comfy experience sshing to remote hosts Feb 08 15:33:44 n97 with my patches was also very very nice Feb 08 15:33:55 the n900 terminal and ssh need some work to catch up Feb 08 15:34:12 xterm and openssh? Feb 08 15:34:16 I can't get the screen tty size the way I like it, missing keys are a pain, etc... Feb 08 15:34:16 riight Feb 08 15:34:26 Damion2: mhh. how can ssh need work? It feels pretty standard Feb 08 15:34:30 lol Feb 08 15:34:35 I don't want 4lines of font taken up with huge rarely used buttons Feb 08 15:34:45 Shapeshifter: UI and RSI avoidance Feb 08 15:34:51 I use tab all the time. I think I need to map it to some hardware button Feb 08 15:34:56 Damion2: and you can resize xterm with volume buttons.. or via menu Feb 08 15:34:57 lack of sticky Ctrl was a pain until i found away to make Ctrl sticky Feb 08 15:35:18 Damion2: yeah I believe the UI is far from perfect Feb 08 15:35:28 use the zoon buttons to change font size Feb 08 15:35:30 ifreq: yeah but latest ubuntu screen sometimes crashes on SIGWINCH and I've spent weeks leaving a debug compile running to see if I could track it down to no end Feb 08 15:35:40 I want fricking 80x24 Feb 08 15:35:42 :) Feb 08 15:35:53 not 79x22 Feb 08 15:35:55 freak :) Feb 08 15:36:06 ubuntu :| Feb 08 15:36:08 Damion2: what, 80×25 or gtfo Feb 08 15:36:09 my xterm at work and home are that size and everything has to rejig on the phone Feb 08 15:36:09 its not easy for you i see :-) Feb 08 15:36:19 gtfo? Feb 08 15:36:23 let me look that up Feb 08 15:36:30 * ShadowJK has 133 x 23 Feb 08 15:36:42 how to force tracker to reindex photos? Feb 08 15:36:44 zash: 80x25 is what DOS stuff used to use Feb 08 15:36:53 I domn't use hardstatus in screen(1) Feb 08 15:36:58 sorry, 133 x 27 Feb 08 15:36:59 widescreen screen :/ Feb 08 15:37:03 hrw: Does touching them work? Feb 08 15:37:03 I use 154x68 terminal in this moment Feb 08 15:37:09 X-Fade: good idea Feb 08 15:37:10 ~$ echo $COLUMNS×$LINES Feb 08 15:37:10 127×36 Feb 08 15:37:16 Shapeshifter: it's the corp standard, I'm a slackware man myself Feb 08 15:37:21 hrw: on n900 Feb 08 15:37:22 ? Feb 08 15:37:29 ShadowJK: yes Feb 08 15:37:32 Damion2: how'd you make ctrl sticky? I tried lemon curd, didnät work :( Feb 08 15:37:32 Damion2: I see. Feb 08 15:37:41 tybollt: xkbset st Feb 08 15:37:42 Damion2: still it's insane to have /usr, /var on a 256MB / Feb 08 15:37:54 DocScrutinizer: they're not stopping people export Feb 08 15:37:55 DocScrutinizer++ Feb 08 15:38:01 and /usr is /okay/ if a little filling Feb 08 15:38:04 I-N-S-A-N-E in the membrane Feb 08 15:38:09 I did some photos during fosdem trip and gallery does not show them Feb 08 15:38:13 var can be kept small if you keep tabs on it, but okay yeah Feb 08 15:38:14 how, I only get 133x31 in fullscreen and it says "already at minimum fontsize" :/ Feb 08 15:38:49 submitted my problem: https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=8926 Feb 08 15:38:51 Bug 8926: rootfs stuck in readonly mode Feb 08 15:38:53 hrw: Are they inside MyDocs? Feb 08 15:38:55 ShadowJK: ah, sorry - I thought about tracker. no I have such size on desktop. on n900 I do not care too much about terminal size Feb 08 15:39:04 Shapeshifter: basically I _just_ got n97 s2putty the way I like it, I've had 80x24 font on 9000, 9110. 9210*, 9500, 9300, e90, n97 and now aim to get it working on n900 Feb 08 15:39:07 X-Fade: yes, were done with internal camera Feb 08 15:39:14 dnaumov: you can't just remount it w/ read flag? Feb 08 15:39:31 *9210 didn't have ssh at first and lame versions came about with 80x11 and 80x22 until s2putty Feb 08 15:40:05 80x24 is going to have a very wide font :) Feb 08 15:40:06 Damion2: you know *why* /usr was invented back in the ancient *nix days? Exactly ho give it an own partition/drive Feb 08 15:40:11 osso-xterm nabs the left line for some reason, I need to compile a version that doesn't Feb 08 15:40:25 DocScrutinizer++ Feb 08 15:40:28 DocScrutinizer: I know it was shared via nfs in many places Feb 08 15:40:32 Damion2: never wondered why there's /bin and /usr/bin? Feb 08 15:40:44 bin - static Feb 08 15:40:53 /bin is guarenteed to be part of / but /usr isn't Feb 08 15:40:54 /usr/bin/ - ld.so Feb 08 15:41:46 * tybollt tillber anders_gud Feb 08 15:41:52 dnaumov: someone else had probs with ubifs too http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=434452 Feb 08 15:42:00 tackar ;-) Feb 08 15:42:04 same thing with /var, which is considered a mass dump device for spooler jobs etc pp Feb 08 15:42:06 amen Feb 08 15:43:08 DocScrutinizer: I read somet doco over at mo saying the 256mb for everything and then opt for the rest was a -temporary- solution and not for the long run... Feb 08 15:43:11 yeah... Feb 08 15:43:13 very temporary :S Feb 08 15:44:20 tybollt: I honestly doubt they ever manage to do the clean cut and move to a sane partitioning. You know there's nothing as durable as a botch Feb 08 15:44:35 I know some of the archaic history, however having lasted years on a 120MB disk which mostly has all in / I think even by todays standards 256M is okay, it's actually a bit less and yet most people have 50MB of so free if they've not install insane stuff Feb 08 15:45:10 DocScrutinizer: :-D Feb 08 15:45:44 somebody sshed in do a du -sk /* ? Feb 08 15:45:48 Damion2: actually that's not the point Feb 08 15:46:11 it is NOT the point indeed Feb 08 15:46:40 hello Feb 08 15:47:25 iirc someone said on Maemo6 the OS will sit on the same big device as the swap and the user's files... joy :( Feb 08 15:47:47 yeah, or maybe maemo7 Feb 08 15:47:55 * tybollt is entirely backseat-arguing today, but then, DocScrutinizer is clearly on a roll here ;) Feb 08 15:48:20 ./configure --prefix=/opt/maemo ;D Feb 08 15:48:48 ShadowJK: I can see that being the thing they will put forth as the key to why the dev is not backwards compatible >:D Feb 08 15:48:50 if they'd made the 32GB more flexible, ie umountable mounts while booted and resizeable filesystems, then it would have been handy. Feb 08 15:49:25 damion2 lvm? :) Feb 08 15:49:39 anyway Feb 08 15:49:59 having /home after /home/user/MyDocs/ physically is a pain as you can't shrink the fat andedit the partition table easily Feb 08 15:50:19 yes Feb 08 15:50:28 many of us would need to shrink the fat :( Feb 08 15:50:35 it's currently non trivial to have /var and /usr external, even for hackers Feb 08 15:50:37 my missus keep telling me every day you know :( Feb 08 15:50:45 you have to do it in scripts on boot Feb 08 15:51:07 Damion2: caused by maemo devels' madness Feb 08 15:52:08 if it started with, say 5-10GB of ext2 and then part2,3 were unused and part4 was fat we could resize2fs and use part3,4 labelwise and sort stuff by hand Feb 08 15:52:14 you can just repartition emmc,, make static fstab and all works Feb 08 15:52:31 tybollt: pass it over, mate. BMI 17 here Feb 08 15:52:52 * ShadowJK 'd actually want a bigger nand, or that LogFS or nilfs2 were usable, instead of a bigger ext* partition... Feb 08 15:52:56 DocScrutinizer: ;) Feb 08 15:53:03 btw, what is less io intensive, ext2 or ext3? Feb 08 15:53:17 "intensive"? Feb 08 15:53:45 does anyone have a recommendation on how to either provide a prompt at boot to mount an encrypted volume, or a way to get a truecrypt session to persist after a restart of X? Feb 08 15:54:13 i have ext3 right now and when i install bigger packages, system changs sometimes Feb 08 15:54:15 "Device memory - Total is only 27GB!?" <- ah what threads the existing ext3 partition causes... Feb 08 15:54:50 i will chwck ext2 next Feb 08 15:55:12 Maromader: I doubt that's caused by ext3 Feb 08 15:55:33 ext2 isn't going to be any better Feb 08 15:56:10 Maromader: check swap usage Feb 08 15:56:16 hi all Feb 08 15:56:18 how about journal, isnt that just writing twice? Feb 08 15:56:19 ext4 slightly better maybe, by an immeasurably small margin... btrfs slightly better, but it's not stable, nilfs2 pretty good but not stable, LogFS even better but not even in mainline kernel yet... Feb 08 15:56:24 swapping takes ages Feb 08 15:56:56 Maromader: it's likely something like trackerd or something indexing the new files you've installed Feb 08 15:57:06 I've been wanting to try make an ext3 filesystem with massively large journal, and the filesystem set to journal data too, not just metadata... Feb 08 15:57:34 i see... Feb 08 15:57:50 so, better to stick to ext3? Feb 08 15:57:56 ok wtf, now I am seeing "mount" show "rootfs on /" and "ubi0:rootfs on /" both shown as RW Feb 08 15:58:09 yet, writing still doesnt work, still complains its readonly Feb 08 15:58:15 Maromader, yes it survives unexpected reboots better Feb 08 15:58:26 dnaumov, how much free space? Feb 08 15:58:33 ShadowJK: over 50mb Feb 08 15:59:03 hm :/ Feb 08 15:59:26 cant browse installed packaged, because apt cant write to / Feb 08 15:59:47 Out of interest. Has Nokia provided any insights into why they partitioned the n900 the way they did? Feb 08 15:59:48 dnaumov: you definitely can't remount rw? Feb 08 16:00:00 going out, see you Feb 08 16:00:06 bye Feb 08 16:00:10 Damion2: mount says it IS rw Feb 08 16:00:11 bye Feb 08 16:00:26 cos you /may/ be able to work out which files/dirs to remove to make it work? Feb 08 16:00:27 jophish: root is a different chip. Feb 08 16:00:30 this should be in a faq, the n900 partitioning question gets asked in here and in t.m.o every day Feb 08 16:00:34 jophish: see mailing list Feb 08 16:00:35 jophish smaller flash is quicker Feb 08 16:00:57 jophish, well the hardware is 256M/32G. 2G was chosen because based on some average song size, so that the tracker database would fit if user has 32 (27) gigs of songs on internal memory and 16 gigs on external memory card... Feb 08 16:01:20 Ah Feb 08 16:01:26 Supposedly the 256M chip was chosen in order to not make the developers too lazy so that they would not add too much bloat. Feb 08 16:01:27 maybe risk taking noexec from MyDocs ? Feb 08 16:01:30 Or so someone said Feb 08 16:01:43 ShadowJK: Blah ;) Feb 08 16:01:51 ShadowJK: It is just a 256 PoP. Feb 08 16:01:55 are people seriously filling their 2GB ? Feb 08 16:02:00 thanks for the answers Feb 08 16:02:02 ShadowJK: Ram and flash are in once package. Feb 08 16:02:08 X-Fade, Yeah I know :) Feb 08 16:02:09 * jophish still thinks it's crazy though Feb 08 16:02:16 I've neither tried reflashing nor repartitioning my device yet and I'm happy so far with the hackability Feb 08 16:02:18 the 256m also forces us to change packages, ensuring a split between maemo and debian Feb 08 16:02:20 X-Fade, I suspect there isn't much choice really Feb 08 16:02:22 ShadowJK: the 256MB is a SoC standard package Feb 08 16:02:35 obviously thuings like my q3a .PAK files are on MyDocs Feb 08 16:02:47 When the N900 was being built, that was the biggest size available in quantity. Feb 08 16:03:02 ooh, I should upload my video of tower toppler (Nebulous) working on x86 against arm Feb 08 16:03:13 it looks almost 90% of the speed! Feb 08 16:03:16 thats qhy i prefer repartitioning over optification - debian compatibility Feb 08 16:03:17 Flash really shows its ugly side, the performance difference is so noticeable when an app is located on emmc and is also writing to emmc (gpodder) Feb 08 16:03:35 Damion2: ukki already maintains tower topppler Feb 08 16:03:48 pupnik: yeah, I found that out when I was about to try and compile it Feb 08 16:03:52 pupnik: how annoying :) Feb 08 16:04:05 anyway I can run the native x86 version and it looks about 90% of the speed Feb 08 16:05:00 ShadowJK: you'd think the writes should go to cache anyway Feb 08 16:05:48 DocScrutinizer, yeah but whenever they go to disk they block reads for awhile Feb 08 16:05:57 Damion2: want unmaintained games? Feb 08 16:06:01 is whatever laptop mode is called, enabled ? that can do things like not bother flushing for minutes so writes can seem very fast Feb 08 16:06:03 mmmh blocking I/O Feb 08 16:06:27 ShadowJK: so everything except apps that read/write large amounts of data, should not suffer too much from lower flash speed Feb 08 16:06:32 pupnik: I hope to get wine running ut it segv's Feb 08 16:06:47 wine Feb 08 16:06:50 on the n900? Feb 08 16:06:53 DocScrutinizer: Think about libs. Feb 08 16:06:56 Sir are you ... ? Feb 08 16:06:56 kobo deluxe, pingus, technoballz need a maintainer Feb 08 16:06:56 huh? :) Feb 08 16:07:11 hehe wine for wince? :) .. thats arm at least Feb 08 16:07:13 ShadowJK: and those apps had no other location to store their large amounts of data Feb 08 16:07:13 tybollt: yeah. I think it's a threading/mutex issue Feb 08 16:07:34 DocScrutinizer, dunno, I was seeing a pretty constant 20-50k of reads from the emmc, probably executable pages getting dropped/paged in as I was using the browser Feb 08 16:07:35 I can run loads of other stuff, like toppler and xrandr and chroot Feb 08 16:07:48 X-Fade: that's load aka startup lag Feb 08 16:07:50 stuff that forks doesn't work Feb 08 16:08:26 DocScrutinizer: Yes, but quite significant ;) Feb 08 16:08:51 k, I can live with an app taking even twice as long to startup Feb 08 16:08:55 So are libs/etc read-ahead when you launch an app? I thought it was all on-demand pagein Feb 08 16:09:00 I think I need to chroot in to my nfs export of my x86 laptop and run (arm) /var/tmp/ld-linux.so.3 --library-path=/var/tmp/ /var/tmp/qemu-i386-2 /bin/dash Feb 08 16:09:07 DocScrutinizer: See Maps as an example ;) Feb 08 16:09:12 all apps nokia thinks shoiuld pop up snappy are preloaded anyway Feb 08 16:09:55 then when I run stuff /lib/ld-linux.so.2 is in the right place and isthe right arch (x86) so it should work slightly better Feb 08 16:10:00 X-Fade: maps could handle precaching of the next tile needed in a much smarte way Feb 08 16:10:25 the write speed of the emmc is something like 200k/sec for random write :/ Feb 08 16:10:43 ovi maps shouldn't be so awfully sluggish looking when I drag it a centermetre with the stylus. It looks pretty awful Feb 08 16:11:11 hm, let me start it and try Feb 08 16:11:53 kinda looks like google maps in firefox on Quad core CPU, except a bit faster ;-) Feb 08 16:12:00 howe much swap do you people have in use commonly? Feb 08 16:12:12 Damion2: it'll be slightly better in the next version Feb 08 16:12:22 cehteh, 100 - 150 megs Feb 08 16:12:23 cehteh: few Feb 08 16:12:28 cehteh: varies depending on stuff Feb 08 16:12:35 Damion2: but ovi maps has an incredibly convoluted design Feb 08 16:12:53 where they basically intentionally defeat all the rendering advantages of a working web browser Feb 08 16:12:54 New MyPaint version out with some Fremantle UI love http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=515945&postcount=23 Feb 08 16:12:55 /dev/mmcblk0p3 partition 786424 95460 -1 Feb 08 16:13:06 at least, that's why one of the guys from services told me about how it worked Feb 08 16:13:13 i tweaked some things 100mb here with 4h uptime, webradio, nothing else Feb 08 16:13:19 (not from maps, just a guy in services) Feb 08 16:13:44 cehteh: swap use doesn't mean the pageisn't also in RA< Feb 08 16:13:48 M Feb 08 16:13:52 anders_gud: um Feb 08 16:13:54 i know Feb 08 16:13:55 hold on a sec? Feb 08 16:14:00 lots of people with n900s at FOSDEM Feb 08 16:14:03 SpeedEvil: huh? Feb 08 16:14:11 yep lots of n900s at fosdem Feb 08 16:14:13 SpeedEvil: i rather like if it swaps aggressively Feb 08 16:14:31 anders_gud: 1. don't use ellipsis in menus Feb 08 16:14:33 outnumbered all other phone models from my observation Feb 08 16:14:49 About 60M out of 140M swap is copied in ram for me Feb 08 16:14:51 you were there zaheerm? sorry i missed you. what presentations were best for you? Feb 08 16:14:52 cehteh: swapping takes ages Feb 08 16:14:55 11 day uptime Feb 08 16:15:04 braggard Feb 08 16:15:06 zaheerm: probably a nonrepresentative sample :) Feb 08 16:15:11 pupnik, evil was the best one Feb 08 16:15:28 DocScrutinizer, I had 30 days but then wifi died Feb 08 16:15:29 evil on the internet? misssed it Feb 08 16:15:30 DocScrutinizer: yeah 756mb is prolly way to huge 256 should be enouhg Feb 08 16:15:32 anders_gud: 2. what does 'Layer' do? do you mean 'Layers'? Feb 08 16:15:40 pupnik, i missed michael meeks's one and the facebook one unfortunately, which other people told me were good Feb 08 16:15:46 but here it seems to work fine Feb 08 16:15:49 256 may be tight for some workloads Feb 08 16:15:55 512 is probably not insane Feb 08 16:16:20 timeless ellipsis ? Feb 08 16:16:21 ram * 2 is a good rule of thumb Feb 08 16:16:29 '...' Feb 08 16:16:31 nowadays Feb 08 16:16:38 is there a syncing program to sync music from rhythmbox to my n900? Feb 08 16:16:46 SpeedEvil: just calculate how fast it swaps .. with 5mb/sec (and thats prolly much faster than it actually swaps) anything high would be very slow Feb 08 16:16:51 512 is not insane - with a sane swap-out algorithm that swaps out in linear blocks Feb 08 16:16:55 zaheerm: i filmed the tor talk but n900 crashed writing the video Feb 08 16:16:56 puritan :-) Feb 08 16:17:04 the current one does not as I understand it Feb 08 16:17:09 anders_gud: free good advice has to be worth something Feb 08 16:17:18 pupnik, :( Feb 08 16:17:37 well anyways having some more space there ensures that there are enough free blocks for wear leveling so i just leave that as is it wont hurt Feb 08 16:17:50 ok guys, please tell me if im doing things that right/safe/healthy way. Feb 08 16:18:03 ok now this is getting interesting... a few reboots and attempts to remount / as RW later... the phone boots... but both "df" and "mount" show NOTHING Feb 08 16:18:05 im compiling stuff using scratchbox sending the files using scp moving them /opt/myapps and creating ln -s for every file Feb 08 16:18:05 barebox is a very interesting bootloader - based on uboot - maybe a candidate for tablets Feb 08 16:18:09 wear leveling reportedly only acts on small areas - ~several meg Feb 08 16:18:22 thats the way things should be done? Feb 08 16:18:29 thanks timless! Try It out... Feb 08 16:18:51 http://www.mail-archive.com/linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org/msg170028.html is interesting WRT wear leveling Feb 08 16:18:54 dnaumov: your / fs is fscked up Feb 08 16:19:07 anders_gud: hrm, is it in extras or something? Feb 08 16:19:10 DocScrutinizer: "oh really" ;: Feb 08 16:19:12 :p Feb 08 16:19:14 nah not yet Feb 08 16:19:27 DocScrutinizer : is this the correct way to do things ? Feb 08 16:19:55 and btw axel runs perfectly, all we need now is some sexy gui for it ;) Feb 08 16:19:57 I don't think I've ever seen the emmc manage more than 1megabyte/s in "real life" swapping... In certain circumstances it can do it, like if you just rebooted and start microb+flash... Feb 08 16:19:59 Tex: aiui yes Feb 08 16:20:05 * timeless_mbp sighs Feb 08 16:20:10 SpeedEvil: i've set commit-interval for the fs and laptop_mode to 3600 .. holding back writes Feb 08 16:20:12 but after that it's rare to see it manage over .5 meg/sec... flash is too slow :) Feb 08 16:20:22 or rather the way mmc/sd works.. Feb 08 16:20:26 ShadowJK: it's not Feb 08 16:20:31 ShadowJK: used right Feb 08 16:20:39 great! Feb 08 16:20:40 yes yes, but it's not used right Feb 08 16:20:42 ShadowJK: it's just it doesn't use it right. Feb 08 16:21:15 shit. feedburner do not handle my maemo/nokia feed ;( Feb 08 16:21:29 Unfortunately all the people that could code kernel are rich enough to buy RAM or get free Intel SSDs Feb 08 16:21:33 ;) Feb 08 16:22:03 can anyone tell me how to use the fmms from the garage? Feb 08 16:22:07 what file to download? Feb 08 16:22:25 ShadowJK: LOL Feb 08 16:22:43 (or can't afford N900) Feb 08 16:23:08 anyhelp here? Feb 08 16:23:15 at least they still have their freedoms :P Feb 08 16:23:20 I'd check out the fmms thread on talk.maemo.org Feb 08 16:23:26 I believe it has instructions Feb 08 16:23:26 medo : not really :D Feb 08 16:24:12 Bye! Feb 08 16:24:17 ok, about any deb file if have many versions, do i have to download all? Feb 08 16:26:35 I'd be inclined to say, that if you ask such a question, you're better off not downloading deb files. It's better to use application manager Feb 08 16:29:02 timeless_mbp: any chance of kinetic scrolling? Feb 08 16:29:21 why? Feb 08 16:29:32 what page are you visiting where you want it? Feb 08 16:29:39 and what do you expect it to do? Feb 08 16:32:05 * ShadowJK noticed pages with frames are a bit funny sometimes Feb 08 16:32:40 anyone knows how to sync/transfer music using a music program to the n900? Feb 08 16:32:51 webshops with shopping basket status are at bottom for example verkkokauppa.com Feb 08 16:33:00 timeless_mbp: if I want to view far to the right I swipe and it slowly jerkingly moves right a bit, I then have to let go and do it again Feb 08 16:33:34 in googlemaps (s60) it moves as my finger moves which is nicer, on the iphone it smoothly scrolls with slow decelleration Feb 08 16:34:06 Damion2: how are you swiping? Feb 08 16:34:18 imagine the n900 is a football field Feb 08 16:34:28 the non touch regions are the end zones Feb 08 16:34:35 the center is the 50yd line Feb 08 16:34:41 yd? Feb 08 16:34:45 football?? Feb 08 16:34:49 I'm english, is this american football? Feb 08 16:34:51 you're going to need to look it up anyway Feb 08 16:34:55 u mean american football? Feb 08 16:34:56 lol Feb 08 16:35:01 the saints just won the superbowl Feb 08 16:35:03 hi Feb 08 16:35:08 the what? Feb 08 16:35:12 you win a super bowl ? Feb 08 16:35:13 surely that would have made news even on your tiny island Feb 08 16:35:19 I have a strange problem... my n900 says it is fully charged, but when I look at the percentage I only have 7Y4% Feb 08 16:35:19 nope Feb 08 16:35:23 74% Feb 08 16:35:31 someone knows how I can get back to 100 % Feb 08 16:35:31 ? Feb 08 16:35:32 we just are happy JT has finally been shown the door ;) Feb 08 16:35:38 do you swipe from your 10yd line to your opponent's 10yd line? Feb 08 16:35:38 timeless_mbp: I put my fingernail on the screen and move it to the side and let go and go back to the middle for the next movement Feb 08 16:35:38 I think I went half my life thinking superbowl was a bowling competition :) Feb 08 16:36:00 jon1012: what's voltage? Feb 08 16:36:04 my local bowling alley was called superbowl Feb 08 16:36:07 timeless_mbp: typically more from a centre Feb 08 16:36:18 no wait, I must use the edge to the other edge Feb 08 16:36:28 * DocScrutinizer deja vu Feb 08 16:36:38 bing.com says a yard is a little less than a metre Feb 08 16:36:40 Damion2: see.... Feb 08 16:36:42 ShadowJK: voltage.current => 4141 Feb 08 16:36:56 * dazo just swipes the finger 2-4cm on the screen, from either right to left ... or left to right ..... don't understand the football talk .... Feb 08 16:37:09 if you use 50yd to 10yd, which you initially claimed, then you can easily repeat the stroke w/o pain Feb 08 16:37:12 jon1012: ok it's full Feb 08 16:37:13 * timeless_mbp just tested Feb 08 16:37:24 jon1012, short story: the meter lies Feb 08 16:37:26 if you swipe from 10yd to 10yd, then yeah, you're going to be unhappy Feb 08 16:37:42 let me test Feb 08 16:37:52 ShadowJK: the nokia level shows full, but the percentage says 74% Feb 08 16:37:54 jon1012: so you *are* at 100%. Just the stupid guestimate gets it wrong Feb 08 16:37:54 dazo: ever given people instructions based on a clock Feb 08 16:37:55 oksy started to load it. Feb 08 16:38:03 "boggie 4 oclock" Feb 08 16:38:03 ShadowJK: strange Feb 08 16:38:18 right it's almost started... Feb 08 16:38:22 okay Feb 08 16:39:18 repporting.design = 1245, reporting.current => 933 Feb 08 16:39:24 it's not as bad as I remember, in the cold trying to get satelite lock yesterday Feb 08 16:39:25 that's strange Feb 08 16:39:39 but it's still not the same as googlemaps s60 Feb 08 16:39:43 hmm. The foto viewer says No Images. Howto get it to open folder? Feb 08 16:39:44 jon1012: the charger and meter don't really talk to eachother Feb 08 16:39:47 timeless_mbp: very very very seldom ... as most of the times people get confused .... and look at their watch instead, realising their watch is on the mobile phone instead :-P Feb 08 16:39:50 jon1012: see above comments Feb 08 16:39:55 ... Feb 08 16:40:34 jon1012: if in doubt, just replug the charger. 60min later bat *is* fully charged Feb 08 16:41:23 4.1V is pretty full considering screen and all is on when that value is obtained Feb 08 16:42:11 4V14 is pretty full for a LiIon Feb 08 16:42:23 timeless_mbp: this will sound like "Dr Dr my arm hurts when I hold it like " sort of comment, but if I move my finger from the centre, to left, then to right and left taking about 1second, so not that fast, there is a visible sluggishness. Not to mention it doesn't redraw roadnames and stuff Feb 08 16:43:01 Damion2: is this ovi maps? Feb 08 16:43:04 * Trizt can't understand why WPA-PSK connections should suddenly stop working after been working for weeks flawlessly Feb 08 16:43:13 if so "yeah, i know, so does everyone else" Feb 08 16:43:23 tbh, once I get the next keyboarded maemo6 device in N years, ovi will have navigation and I'll probably not touch it as it just directs me where I need. Feb 08 16:43:33 This is just an initial look+feel issue for people I show the device to Feb 08 16:43:38 timeless_mbp: yes ovi maps on the n900 Feb 08 16:43:44 Damion2: don't show people ovi maps! Feb 08 16:43:47 timeless_mbp: I don't recall it being any good on the s60 either Feb 08 16:43:48 seriously Feb 08 16:43:48 ~tell jon1012 about batteryfaq Feb 08 16:43:51 timeless_mbp: heh Feb 08 16:44:00 show them Bounce Feb 08 16:44:03 show them Angry Birds Feb 08 16:44:07 timeless_mbp: well after staring at the loading bar for a minute they normally walk off anyway Feb 08 16:44:07 show them Google Maps Feb 08 16:44:10 show them Maep Feb 08 16:44:13 there is no googlemaps yet Feb 08 16:44:14 jon1012: that might help a little as well Feb 08 16:44:21 Damion2: google maps works nicely in the browser Feb 08 16:44:22 maep isn't brillian Feb 08 16:44:29 just install the geolocation addon Feb 08 16:44:41 (and then you can use it w/ facebook and friends too...{) Feb 08 16:44:50 reflashing the N900 doesnt wipe the user data on the 32gb disk right? Feb 08 16:44:52 fsvo nicely. Okay it's impressive enough to demo that it works, including gears style gps, and hover mouse interaction, but it's not great Feb 08 16:45:01 dnaumov: depends on _what_ you reflash Feb 08 16:45:15 google docs is impressive too, but not exactly that useable Feb 08 16:45:18 dnaumov: if you reflash the root partition, your user data is safe Feb 08 16:45:39 timeless_mbp: and this is the only thing which you can *reflash* Feb 08 16:45:43 but if you reflash your eMMC then you'll certainly lose all of your eMMC's data (which is where your user data lives) Feb 08 16:46:05 hrw: well given that one uses 'flasher' to reflash both pieces Feb 08 16:46:13 they're all flash memory underneath Feb 08 16:46:32 it's just a matter of one having write/wear-leveling and being considerably bigger+slower than the other Feb 08 16:46:35 timeless_mbp: sure, but eMMC is not exposed as flash but as block device Feb 08 16:46:56 * timeless_mbp shrugs Feb 08 16:47:08 to this confused user, he has to understand that he needs to reflash the right thing Feb 08 16:47:19 because otherwise he could reflash the wrong thing and be very unhappy Feb 08 16:48:46 soeey got disconnected by my 3g provider Feb 08 16:48:49 sorry* Feb 08 16:50:18 hrw: to usb eMMC *is* exposed as a flash Feb 08 16:52:05 anyone know if there are plans to allow to use more than one skype account at the same time? Feb 08 16:52:28 what happens if you enable two at the same time now ? Feb 08 16:52:44 Damion2; the first one is diconnected Feb 08 16:52:58 ~nuke skype Feb 08 16:52:59 * infobot prepares 100 missle silos, and targets them at skype ... B☢☢M! Feb 08 16:53:30 nooooo, skype is cool :) Feb 08 16:53:35 and useful :) Feb 08 16:53:36 Trizt: it might be an issue of limited details passed around (dbus?) to notify the im/voip client of things like incoming calls Feb 08 16:53:39 skype is crap Feb 08 16:53:44 not cool but useful Feb 08 16:54:00 misserable piece of shit Feb 08 16:54:02 ~nuke skype haters Feb 08 16:54:03 * infobot prepares 100 missle silos, and targets them at skype haters ... B☢☢M! Feb 08 16:54:06 * VDVsx hides Feb 08 16:54:10 but sicne no free alternative -> what you use :) Feb 08 16:54:12 skype is evil, in typically sandal wearing treehugging debian using fashion. But it's actually very usable and nice :-p Feb 08 16:54:36 ja Feb 08 16:54:43 google talk is okay and allows video on the n900 Feb 08 16:54:44 at some point you have to be pragmatic Feb 08 16:54:55 proprietary crap, which don't dare to play with open cards ..... SIP is cool .... the idea behind skype is cool ... the skype closedness and proprietary part is not cool Feb 08 16:54:56 Damion2; not sure, as I haven't seen the source code, but they do limit one account/client in desktop versions too, so I tend to run skype as different users to get around the problem Feb 08 16:55:03 well one could set up some asterisks everyone for himself and his friends or so (gating into mobile and landline telephoen networks is a bit expensive) Feb 08 16:55:22 * dazo would like to see ekiga working though Feb 08 16:55:26 you don't get to diss skype while shutting up about the sgx poarts in your device :) Feb 08 16:55:28 but after all some fair share p2p systen accounting dit for dat would be nice Feb 08 16:55:37 cehteh: it's far too much hassle, and skype's firewall traversal is reliable and desktop friendly Feb 08 16:55:54 cehteh: wrooong Feb 08 16:56:00 Damion2: skypes firewall traversal is not black magic Feb 08 16:56:03 cehteh: you don't need * Feb 08 16:56:10 no but it's already set up and works Feb 08 16:56:19 and gateway is cheaper than skype Feb 08 16:56:21 there is nothing to setup Feb 08 16:56:38 DocScrutinizer: huh? Feb 08 16:56:50 * mgedmin has objections to a single company controlling the world's phone infrastructure Feb 08 16:56:53 DocScrutinizer: imagine i want to call some landline in chile? Feb 08 16:57:05 from my german internet Feb 08 16:57:11 cehteh: there's a million SIP providers out there Feb 08 16:57:17 cehteh: stun servers and stuff Feb 08 16:57:18 DocScrutinizer; and does it offer phone numbers abroad for a low cost? Feb 08 16:57:22 mgedmin: but you are fine w/ google controlling ... just about fucking everything? Feb 08 16:57:38 tybollt: MS already control most stuff Feb 08 16:57:47 no Feb 08 16:57:53 yes but well these may be better than skype for technicall reasons but from political view its the same bullshit Feb 08 16:57:55 not traffic ona intarwebz Feb 08 16:58:02 or information ona intarwebz Feb 08 16:58:03 tybollt: everyone uses bing Feb 08 16:58:05 there is the googlers Feb 08 16:58:17 Damion2: dern it, I knew I forgot about that :-D Feb 08 16:58:17 I stopped using cuil when bing came around Feb 08 16:58:20 google doesn't control anything but the internet advertising market, and poersonally i don't care if a bunch of marketing wonks are getting screwed Feb 08 16:58:29 Trizt: go find out Feb 08 16:58:45 tybollt, google doesn't control _my_ mail Feb 08 16:58:46 yeah, click on the links and all you do is cost some advertiser money Feb 08 16:58:51 * tybollt using Jeeve's myself ;) Feb 08 16:59:01 although google try hard to at least make the links relevant Feb 08 16:59:30 twould be better if people stopped assuming the worst, wearing tin foil hats and balking at stuff like personallised ads. Feb 08 16:59:39 mgedmin: chances are fifty fifty (if in US) at some point your mail will traverse googlers infratructure and as you don't pgp your email - they own you =)) Feb 08 16:59:43 I'm looking forward to only seeing ads for gadgets even if looking at porn Feb 08 16:59:55 * mgedmin actually pgp-signs his every mail Feb 08 17:00:04 mgedmin: what are you hiding? Feb 08 17:00:16 * mgedmin wonders if Damion2 knows what "signature" means Feb 08 17:00:27 not my identity, obviously Feb 08 17:00:33 168 // : child entity has been finished. store it as a Feb 08 17:00:33 I'm looking forward to google figuring out I dont live in holland Feb 08 17:00:33 169 // a childen to the node this parser is parsing. Feb 08 17:00:34 mgedmin: Blimey thar mate-y. What when old grandma mgedmin opens up a mail and ol she gets is hashes? :) Feb 08 17:00:44 I *am* hiding my PGP passphrase, though ;) Feb 08 17:00:45 can someone please help me divine the meaning of 'childen' there? Feb 08 17:00:52 http://mxr-test.konigsberg.mozilla.org/symbian/source/MCL/sf/mw/appinstall/ncdengine/provider/protocol/src/ncd_parser_pp_subscriptionreport.cpp#169 Feb 08 17:01:08 mgedmin: oh, authenticity Feb 08 17:01:24 soo, why is hildon-home at the top of powertop's activity list even though the screen is off?-) (2400 wakeups) Feb 08 17:01:35 flux, some plugin? Feb 08 17:01:38 yeah but nobody looking at your email knows whether the random string of hex at the bottom is yours unless they're using a client that will check Feb 08 17:01:43 flux, try disabling them one by one? Feb 08 17:01:51 umm, is there a way to get alt/meta in the terminal to be able to switch windows n irssi? Feb 08 17:01:54 most people see your pgp signature and just ignore it as noise at the bottom Feb 08 17:01:58 flux, my n900 doesn't show hildon-desktop when I run powertop Feb 08 17:02:01 mgedmin: nah, better to turn them all off first to get a sane baseline Feb 08 17:02:04 Shapeshifter: escape 1 .. 4 Feb 08 17:02:14 Shapeshifter, esc followed by a letter/number == alt+letter/number in a terminal Feb 08 17:02:27 mgedmin, good point, actually now I recall enabling pedometer on the day :) Feb 08 17:02:37 timeless_mbp, flux, actually, why not turn half of them and bisect? Feb 08 17:02:48 mgedmin: yeah well Feb 08 17:02:54 flux: pedo meter? don't hold that near gary glitter ;) Feb 08 17:03:01 twould go off the scale Feb 08 17:03:04 answer: because it's too hard to keep the intermediate steps in my mind ;) Feb 08 17:03:05 sorry everyone Feb 08 17:03:05 better to start from off and add half than try bisecting only to discover the baseline sucks Feb 08 17:03:06 thanks. Feb 08 17:03:49 yeah, that was it :) Feb 08 17:03:50 timeless, so they've been "open sourcing" symbian for what, a year or two now, where "open sourcing" means hiding the most embarassing bits... imagine what it was like before :-) Feb 08 17:03:57 Shapeshifter: if like me you've removed the bottom bar as you can do pretty much everything without it, you need Ctrl-A:stuff ^[ Feb 08 17:04:06 it's sort of annyoing that the hildon widgets aren't separate processes, but I suppose this is more efficient Feb 08 17:04:08 I use ^C in vim which works as esc Feb 08 17:04:15 ShadowJK: the two modules i indexed didn't seem to have any obvious curse words Feb 08 17:04:32 Jaffa, this weeks issue looks good. Thanks for picking up the slack. :) Feb 08 17:04:40 flux: s/hildon widgets/hildon home applets/ Feb 08 17:04:53 hildon widgets are by definition ... widgets, and part of the hildon widget toolkit :) Feb 08 17:05:51 is it possible somehow to have the same widget on more than one desktop? Feb 08 17:06:08 no :) Feb 08 17:06:11 :( Feb 08 17:06:19 but it's possible to only have one desktop :) Feb 08 17:06:37 yes, but one desktop is too small for all widgets Feb 08 17:06:44 can they overlap Feb 08 17:06:45 ? Feb 08 17:06:52 sure Feb 08 17:07:26 * ShadowJK has one widget Feb 08 17:08:07 * DocScrutinizer thinks it should be possible to have similar widgets on even one desktop Feb 08 17:08:13 * Damion2 pretty much only runs osso-terminal Feb 08 17:08:17 anyone help me transferring/syncing music... Feb 08 17:08:35 * DocScrutinizer wonders how that'll help to solve the missing-space issue though Feb 08 17:08:41 x-terminal, browser and xchat :) Feb 08 17:08:58 and media player occasionally Feb 08 17:09:32 if you can't install a widget multiple times, then that's an issue of the widget Feb 08 17:10:38 see cmdline-execution-widget, which has learnt to install multiple instances recently Feb 08 17:12:11 ShadowJK: same here Feb 08 17:14:50 ShadowJK: just type xchat& from osso-terminal ;) Feb 08 17:15:33 A long time ago, xchat had a terminal tab :) Feb 08 17:15:49 lol Feb 08 17:16:05 Oh, something I miss with widgets are the possibility to resize them as in KDE4 Feb 08 17:16:18 what do i do if i get a hash sum failure while reloading the Development Repository Feb 08 17:17:04 Konversation still has Feb 08 17:17:49 DocScrutinizer51: Some people like to have their MUD clients in the same window as their IRC client Feb 08 17:18:01 adalal: try again later Feb 08 17:18:10 k Feb 08 17:18:54 * SpeedEvil backstabs Sho_ with the blessed +5 noodle. Feb 08 17:19:14 SpeedEvil: :) Feb 08 17:19:35 hai thar Feb 08 17:19:42 how do i install libgles? Feb 08 17:22:25 * SpeedEvil is not going anywhere near MUDs. I lost a year or two to them. Feb 08 17:24:35 Vanadis in scratchbox? Feb 08 17:24:49 propably Feb 08 17:24:50 i think i just found a bug... when my phone is connected to my computer in charging-only mode, it doesn't receive the proper wlan dhcp configurations on connection :S Feb 08 17:25:10 Vanadis ????? Feb 08 17:25:18 ? Feb 08 17:25:34 Vanadis please give me 50 euros I deserve it Feb 08 17:25:43 lolwut Feb 08 17:25:44 Does n900 email client have any type of attachment size limites /email size limits? I'm trying to send about 6MB email through gmail. (Maximum supported message size by gmail = 25MB ) Feb 08 17:25:49 ? Feb 08 17:26:01 shouldn't Feb 08 17:26:08 Vanadis you see please explain your problem in a proper manner Feb 08 17:26:15 okay Feb 08 17:26:38 well, i tried to install openArena, but there was an error ("you need libgles") Feb 08 17:26:40 okay xroar (dragon32) emulator built Feb 08 17:26:42 brussels is the lair of the beast :) Feb 08 17:27:00 got a website Damion2 ? Feb 08 17:27:16 mail messages get inflated by base64 encoding, usually about 1/3 of size Feb 08 17:27:22 if that's helping anyone Feb 08 17:29:08 good afternoon Feb 08 17:29:22 yay! Garage team approved my blender project! Feb 08 17:29:24 :) Feb 08 17:30:11 I submitted blender for the n900 a while ago Feb 08 17:30:12 err Feb 08 17:30:15 n900 to the blender Feb 08 17:30:18 pupnik: pretty much, but syncing to it isn't trivial. I can upload the binary, but tbh I aught to just put it in extras-devel Feb 08 17:30:25 http://www.willitblend.com/suggestions.aspx Feb 08 17:30:36 which if I understand, is easy to do? Feb 08 17:30:37 man, thats messy Feb 08 17:31:14 blending an N900 would be as sacrilegious as calling an iPhone a smart device Feb 08 17:31:46 speaking of which, I picked my 3gs up after not having looked at it for a month Feb 08 17:31:49 the last time my parents visited they showed me their £15 PAYG cheapo crap phones Feb 08 17:32:04 the interface is pretty damn smooth (the scrolling) but after about 5 minutes I remembered why I had abandoned it Feb 08 17:32:18 both could browse the web, one was touchscreen and fancy the other a nokia S40 with all the mod cons Feb 08 17:32:33 I'm not entirely show what phone today _isn't_ a smart phone Feb 08 17:33:09 shinkamui: I got my 3yo a 2nd hand iphone for xmas, it's good for 3yo Feb 08 17:35:50 http://shop.nokia.co.uk/nokia-uk/product.aspx?sku=3762322&culture=en-GB ? Feb 08 17:35:51 :) Feb 08 17:36:04 nokia 6500 is actually excellent Feb 08 17:36:18 I think that's the one Feb 08 17:36:38 my dads wasn't £15quid Feb 08 17:36:43 he has the 6500 Feb 08 17:36:49 my mum's was Feb 08 17:36:52 * ruskie goes back to figuring out a decent unbreaking procedure... Feb 08 17:37:28 hms touchbook is worser as n900 Feb 08 17:37:48 wow the 1208 has loads of technical specs Feb 08 17:38:18 anyone knows how to get the upnp working on MediaBox? Feb 08 17:39:08 the flasher does work on 64bit operating systems, right? Feb 08 17:39:20 * hrw -> off Feb 08 17:42:58 dnaumov: as everyone is quiet I'll answer that I don't know, but I have seen loads of people ask that, you might need to run it 32bit, presumably your kernel has support? Feb 08 17:43:05 it might be a bit of an issue Feb 08 17:45:26 I couldn't get it to work on 64 myself Feb 08 17:45:30 but I have no 32bit userspace Feb 08 17:45:40 only the 32bit support in the kernel Feb 08 17:46:13 you probably only need a tiny bit of 32bit userspace Feb 08 17:46:20 and could ld.so spawn it Feb 08 17:46:33 well I have a Win7 desktop Feb 08 17:46:42 shh don't say that here! Feb 08 17:46:46 ;) Feb 08 17:46:53 surely that can run 32bit stuff? Feb 08 17:47:07 well thats what I'd figured, 98% of my software is 32bit Feb 08 17:47:35 its just that 64bit versions of windows seems to normally run 32bit software, but 32bit Windows doesnt run 64bit apps Feb 08 17:47:54 so I was just curious if the fact that the flasher is branded as 32bit makes any difference Feb 08 17:48:00 I learnt vmware can run 64bit stuff on a 32bit host if your cpu supports it Feb 08 17:48:41 I don't know about windows Feb 08 17:48:46 not recently, I can't help sorry Feb 08 17:49:00 I used win3.11, win98 and stopped about there Feb 08 17:49:12 and those were just infrequent chance uses Feb 08 17:57:19 zerojay: http://mxr-test.konigsberg.mozilla.org/symbian/source/appinstall-badwords.txt part 2 :) Feb 08 17:57:27 it's slightly longer :) Feb 08 18:01:26 timeless_mbp: where is that collected from and how? Feb 08 18:02:52 #/j linux-ph Feb 08 18:05:35 dnaumov, I have been using the flasher on a 64bit debian installation with no problems Feb 08 18:06:07 fragment: symbian code repos Feb 08 18:06:20 do a search in the directory for a word and it'll show you Feb 08 18:06:30 using aspell and manual pruning Feb 08 18:06:38 (i had time to kill flying home from paris) Feb 08 18:08:08 fragment: there are something like 150..450 hg repos from symbian.org Feb 08 18:08:14 and i picked the first two for kicks Feb 08 18:08:24 next step is writing an algorithm to 'fix' the strings Feb 08 18:08:40 is it common that evince produces some kind of graphical 'lag' effect with kinetic scrolling? Feb 08 18:10:27 jebba@mas:/var/www/repository.maemo.org$ mkdir /var/www/timeless Feb 08 18:10:27 jebba@mas:/var/www/repository.maemo.org$ sudo chown timeless:timeless /var/www/timeless Feb 08 18:10:44 timeless_mbp Feb 08 18:11:27 timeless_mbp: so many different ways to write capabilities <3 Feb 08 18:12:03 fragment: impressive isn't it? Feb 08 18:12:10 jebba: thanks Feb 08 18:12:12 timeless_mbp: yes. Feb 08 18:12:15 timeless_mbp: hehe, on your mission to save the world from fingrish? Feb 08 18:12:27 DocScrutinizer: we'll see Feb 08 18:12:42 in case people are curious 'finnish' is in the list because in one case they meant 'finish' not Finnish Feb 08 18:12:52 (yes, i had to check) Feb 08 18:12:56 ok, off to dinner Feb 08 18:13:07 bon apetit Feb 08 18:14:12 hmm Feb 08 18:14:38 * RST38h sacrifices a kitten Feb 08 18:15:17 * SpeedEvil scarifies a kitten. Feb 08 18:16:11 * sp3000 knits a sacrifice Feb 08 18:16:17 RST38h: SpeedEvil: got Rottweilers? Feb 08 18:16:38 no. Feb 08 18:16:53 just dead koi. Feb 08 18:17:25 won't scare a kitten ;-P Feb 08 18:18:12 will if it ate them Feb 08 18:18:47 man bites dog? Feb 08 18:19:28 ice covering pond. pond airpump broke. fvish died. not got them out yet Feb 08 18:19:58 kitten will love them anyway Feb 08 18:20:18 DocS: Got the Tentacled One's altar. Feb 08 18:21:10 hehe, SOurceForge gave in Feb 08 18:21:36 made exports control user-selectable Feb 08 18:27:34 can someone point out where images are stored on the n900? Feb 08 18:27:50 like the default backgrounds, and also the sample music tracks Feb 08 18:28:47 X-Fade: pong Feb 08 18:29:05 adalal, in /home/user/MyDocs/.images Feb 08 18:29:16 and /home/user/MyDocs/.sounds Feb 08 18:31:24 thanks Feb 08 18:32:11 no problem Feb 08 18:34:58 is there some way to make album art not show up in the picture browser? Feb 08 18:37:55 jophish: are there any syncing methods for music? or is it through usb file-by-file transfer only? Feb 08 18:39:37 You could easily do it through usb transfer. Feb 08 18:39:50 must be loads of syncing programs just for that Feb 08 18:40:11 rsync comes to mind. Feb 08 18:40:23 not gui but effieicnt. :) Feb 08 18:40:27 also amarok or banshee should do it Feb 08 18:40:34 mtnbkr, the best kind Feb 08 18:40:59 jophish: yep. Feb 08 18:41:20 at the moment I'm porting mpc to Maemo. Feb 08 18:41:45 it's me or maesheep is not available for download? Feb 08 18:42:11 i've read about it on the maemo.org front page and i got curious Feb 08 18:45:43 guys, i have installed qt in scratchbox. If i run designer i get a segmentation fault. anybody knows what is going on. http://pastebin.com/m6a2c498e Feb 08 18:46:05 is this not the way an application needs to be run in maemo5? Feb 08 18:51:47 trumee, you need to run-standalone.sh your_app Feb 08 18:52:05 mikhas: ah! thanks Feb 08 18:52:10 run-standalone.sh setups the env vars Feb 08 18:52:38 mikhas: i am still getting a core dump Feb 08 18:52:57 the same? Feb 08 18:53:16 mikhas: yes exactly the same Feb 08 18:53:17 well, you are probably not supposed to run designer inside of sbox anyway Feb 08 18:54:04 oh, let's move to qt-maemo Feb 08 18:56:34 pupnik, you using Madde or the Scratchbox Feb 08 19:03:47 uhm. I must be blind, but I can't see how to change the sim pin. Feb 08 19:03:56 on the n900. Feb 08 19:04:09 settings Feb 08 19:04:30 ShadowJK: well it's not settings->general->device lock Feb 08 19:04:36 settings -> phone Feb 08 19:04:51 ahh there at the bottom. thanks :) Feb 08 19:06:50 does anyone here use Madde yet for development? Feb 08 19:13:31 So now when there were beagleboards at fosdem playing 1080p onto a 3840x2160 or something big videowall, how long until t.m.o is full again of "1080p should be peanuts!"-threads? :P Feb 08 19:14:35 it was 1024x3 + 768*2 :) Feb 08 19:14:51 :) Feb 08 19:14:58 ssshhh Feb 08 19:14:59 and it played 1080p with 2.35 ar among all three, so it was more like SD on each BB Feb 08 19:15:19 pretty cool though indeed, ffmpeg guys rule Feb 08 19:15:32 yes but the tmo crowd doesn't care about stuff like facts Feb 08 19:15:40 I'm trying to do ctrl-r in x-terminal (search back), but it just writes a blankspace. Feb 08 19:17:45 They'd surely think that if a beowulf cluster of beagleboards can play something at 3*1024 x 2*768, then a single beagleboard should be able to play 1400p@60fps h264-lossless ;-) Feb 08 19:17:54 or a single n900 Feb 08 19:21:00 ShadowJK: It depends on how many Oct2009ers visit FOSDEM Feb 08 19:23:35 * ioeee saluda o/ Feb 08 19:25:01 <_Jozeph_> Hello! Feb 08 19:25:45 <_Jozeph_> Anyone knows some AR application available for N900? Feb 08 19:26:43 <_Jozeph_> Hello? Feb 08 19:26:54 hi Feb 08 19:26:58 <_Jozeph_> Hi Realcomix Feb 08 19:27:24 _Jozeph_: AR application? Feb 08 19:27:26 <_Jozeph_> I think there is no one here... Feb 08 19:27:38 <_Jozeph_> Xisdibik, yes man. Augmented Reality Application. Feb 08 19:27:40 i just got here Feb 08 19:27:46 <_Jozeph_> Like acrossair for iPhone. Feb 08 19:27:58 _Jozeph_: I havnt actively look for one in the repos, so dunno Feb 08 19:28:05 <_Jozeph_> try acrossair on youtube. Feb 08 19:28:14 <_Jozeph_> no problem. Feb 08 19:28:25 _Jozeph_: i know what augmented reality is.. i just didnt link AR > AUgmented Reality ;P Feb 08 19:28:26 <_Jozeph_> Everything is recent... Feb 08 19:28:38 <_Jozeph_> ahh, sorry man Feb 08 19:28:47 <_Jozeph_> Many people does't. Feb 08 19:28:52 <_Jozeph_> So sorry!!! Feb 08 19:29:01 its fine :p Feb 08 19:29:15 <_Jozeph_> Xisdibik, do you develop? Feb 08 19:29:45 <_Jozeph_> Do you know some ide/environment for maemo developers on desktop? Feb 08 19:29:56 <_Jozeph_> I'm downloading that maemovm... Feb 08 19:30:02 _Jozeph_: nope I just use ;) Feb 08 19:30:41 <_Jozeph_> I will try to help the RS project. Feb 08 19:31:06 ok Feb 08 19:31:21 <_Jozeph_> improving more features, basically features available on 'Remote Tracker' for Windows Mobile. Feb 08 19:31:47 <_Jozeph_> http://remotetracker.sourceforge.net/ Feb 08 19:32:07 <_Jozeph_> Alguém fala Português aqui? Feb 08 19:32:22 <_Jozeph_> Algum brasileiro? ;-D Feb 08 19:32:53 <_Jozeph_> I don't think so... Feb 08 19:33:37 <_Jozeph_> infobot, hello! Long time that I use IRC... Feb 08 19:33:53 <_Jozeph_> infobot, I just don't belive that you still alive! ;-D Feb 08 19:33:54 You just don't belive that you still alive! ;-D? Feb 08 19:34:21 <_Jozeph_> infobot, do you know augmented reality? Feb 08 19:34:23 yes, I know augmented reality. Feb 08 19:34:29 were you asking if i was brazilian _Jozeph_ ? Feb 08 19:34:30 _Jozeph_: awkward question, did you use to frequent either unrealircd or l4ka? :P Feb 08 19:35:07 <_Jozeph_> Xisdibik, sorry. I'm just ask if someone present is brazilian. Feb 08 19:35:14 <_Jozeph_> Stskeeps, !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! IT'S ME! Feb 08 19:35:16 ah ok Feb 08 19:35:18 :p Feb 08 19:35:22 _Jozeph_: scary :P Feb 08 19:35:26 <_Jozeph_> Stskeeps, Long, long, long, long time!!!! Feb 08 19:35:37 <_Jozeph_> ehaueahaeu Feb 08 19:35:39 ill leave you two to... reunite ;) Feb 08 19:35:43 <_Jozeph_> I'm still alive! Feb 08 19:35:56 me too, much to my own surprise Feb 08 19:36:08 <_Jozeph_> Xisdibik, Stskeeps is a very very very old friend. Feb 08 19:36:30 i dont doubt it ;) Feb 08 19:36:40 <_Jozeph_> Stskeeps, are you still developing unrealircd? Feb 08 19:37:03 _Jozeph_: nop, moved on and now my job is maemo.org distmaster Feb 08 19:37:14 which is a lot better for my sanity Feb 08 19:37:32 <_Jozeph_> Unfortunately after finish university my priorities has changed... Feb 08 19:37:47 <_Jozeph_> Oh man! Feb 08 19:37:56 <_Jozeph_> I'm very happy for you! Feb 08 19:39:23 <_Jozeph_> Nokia passed so for away from here with N900... But... Globalization helps to obtain some facilities, like N900. Feb 08 19:39:35 <_Jozeph_> I've purchased one US version a few days ago. Feb 08 19:40:06 <_Jozeph_> and I just don't belive all the possibilities that this device can provide. Feb 08 19:40:38 It's awesome :) Feb 08 19:40:49 <_Jozeph_> Stskeeps, are you one of that famous guys on youtube presenting maemo? Feb 08 19:44:36 _Jozeph_: dunno, maybe :) Feb 08 19:45:46 <_Jozeph_> http://video.golem.de/handy/2320/nokia-n900-praesentation-von-jussi-maekinen.html Feb 08 19:45:55 <_Jozeph_> Stskeeps, http://video.golem.de/handy/2320/nokia-n900-praesentation-von-jussi-maekinen.html Feb 08 19:46:56 <_Jozeph_> Are you still committing your code files with stskeeps, or it's just an irc nickname? ;D Feb 08 19:47:03 http://www.johanpaul.com/blog/2010/02/nokia-ui-extensions-for-mobile-compiled-in-ubuntu-and-maemo-5-sdk/ Feb 08 19:47:12 what are these urls Feb 08 19:47:18 too old Feb 08 19:47:43 <_Jozeph_> acidjazz, I know that... You need to read history to understand... :D Feb 08 19:48:12 MEH Feb 08 19:48:52 so, I see there's claws mail for OS2008, but I can't find one for maemo5. Can anyone recommend a different mail client to the one builtin? Also, I added extra but midori is not in it. I'm kinda confused as I thought it was pretty far in progress. Isn't it in there? Feb 08 19:49:58 Shapeshifter: let me check which one they are in Feb 08 19:49:59 * SpeedEvil just uses google. Feb 08 19:50:35 _Jozeph_: carsten munk / stskeeps Feb 08 19:50:35 * Xisdibik uses MfE Feb 08 19:51:14 Shapeshifter: claws-mail = extras-devel Feb 08 19:51:24 Xisdibik: ahh, thanks Feb 08 19:51:25 <_Jozeph_> Stskeeps, I'm very happy to see you after so long time. Feb 08 19:51:52 and midori is extras-devel as well Feb 08 19:52:00 Xisdibik: in MfE real imap is impossible right? also, ymmv, right? Feb 08 19:52:12 at least for google I mean Feb 08 19:52:14 gmail. Feb 08 19:52:42 gmail is a hoe for MfE, so i went ahead and paid the $25 for 1 year of NeuvaSync (mighta spelled that wrong) Feb 08 19:52:45 which works with gmail flawlessly Feb 08 19:52:49 for everything except task Feb 08 19:52:51 tasks* Feb 08 19:53:19 although multiple calenders are not supported as the n900 software doesnt support it yet Feb 08 19:53:34 its already supported neuvasync wise Feb 08 19:53:49 theres a 5 day free trial if u wanna test it out Feb 08 19:54:01 and its free for calender/contact syncing, only the mail is $25 a year Feb 08 19:54:45 nah, I'm not even sure I like the n900's mail app Feb 08 19:54:58 claws is fine if it looks good, I'm messing with the repo atm ;) Feb 08 19:54:59 sofar with Neuvasync its been epic win Feb 08 19:55:08 <_Jozeph_> Xisdibik, have you tried 'Conduit' ? Feb 08 19:55:14 nope Feb 08 19:55:16 <_Jozeph_> Xisdibik, are you use Windows or Linux on PC? Feb 08 19:55:24 Both ;) Feb 08 19:55:28 <_Jozeph_> Great! Feb 08 19:55:33 <_Jozeph_> Xisdibik, try conduit. Feb 08 19:55:52 whats conduit? Feb 08 19:56:33 <_Jozeph_> Xisdibik, a very nice sync software. Feb 08 19:56:43 <_Jozeph_> free Feb 08 19:56:58 ah Feb 08 19:57:00 <_Jozeph_> Stskeeps, now I'm following you on tw. Feb 08 19:57:02 it syncs with a PC though Feb 08 19:57:09 NeuvaSync is an exchange server Feb 08 19:57:13 _Jozeph_: yeah, it's not very interesting ;) Feb 08 19:57:14 bbl Feb 08 19:57:18 <_Jozeph_> Xisdibik, sync with many things... Feb 08 19:57:36 does it have an exchange server, so i can sync my phone with my gmail account? Feb 08 19:57:41 using MfE Feb 08 19:57:53 anyways, class is over, i need to nom nom some lunch Feb 08 19:57:55 <_Jozeph_> Stskeeps, no problem. I just would like to keep you in my contacts. :D It's not everyday that I found a old friend. Feb 08 19:57:56 ill be back later Feb 08 20:03:31 Does anybody here use mpd/mpc Feb 08 20:03:44 haye it when the n900 gets stuck in portrait mode Feb 08 20:03:51 * MohammadAG kills hildon-desktop Feb 08 20:04:02 fvwm++ Feb 08 20:09:34 lol it's stuck in half portrait mode Feb 08 20:09:40 might have to kill systemui Feb 08 20:10:18 killall -FIRE * Feb 08 20:12:57 <_Jozeph_> Stskeeps, did you receive pvt msgs? Feb 08 20:13:32 The researchers found that people who reported feeling a great deal of boredom were 37 per cent more likely to have died by the end of the study. Feb 08 20:15:36 <_Jozeph_> See you later... I will connect from home. Feb 08 20:15:51 Easy cure for boredom. Feb 08 20:15:58 * SpeedEvil gets out the flamethrower. Feb 08 20:16:30 excessive Feb 08 20:17:41 True. Thumbscrews work too. Feb 08 20:18:31 http://johny.sk/n900/he2.jpg Feb 08 20:19:19 Don't be silly. Feb 08 20:19:23 helium is monatomic. Feb 08 20:20:26 niekt0, portrait mode terminal? Tricky to use the keyboard Feb 08 20:22:28 my friend just take n900, contact list was vertical, rotated phone, and killed contact list app before it can rotate. Now whole desktop is vertical;) Feb 08 20:22:53 xrandr -o left works too Feb 08 20:24:15 niekt0: i had the option enabled to start the phone app when rotated. after this i got the rotated desktop/applications multiple times when rotated at the "wrong" time Feb 08 20:27:13 stupid race condition, but it's funny;) Feb 08 20:50:24 In the garage autobuilder, is there any way to get it to use debhelper7? Feb 08 20:50:29 here is the error: https://garage.maemo.org/builder/fremantle/libmpdclient_2.1-1maemo1/armel.root.log.FAILED.txt Feb 08 20:51:15 there is also this error https://garage.maemo.org/builder/fremantle/mpc_0.19-2maemo1/armel.root.log.FAILED.txt Feb 08 20:51:38 to compile that package, the -dev deb of the previous package is needed Feb 08 20:52:09 presumably once the previous one compiles correctly, the second one will too. Feb 08 20:52:16 when is ovi-maps navigation coming to the n900/maemo? Feb 08 20:54:18 would it help to put debhelper7 into the build dependencies? Feb 08 20:54:42 tripzero: a question without a (public) answer. Feb 08 20:55:14 * tripzero cries Feb 08 20:56:02 * SpeedEvil dries tripzeros tears. Feb 08 20:56:07 * SpeedEvil puts away the flamethrower. Feb 08 20:56:43 thanks, and ouch Feb 08 20:57:11 * tripzero wonders why it's being held back... Feb 08 20:57:39 It's probably rather expensive to license. Feb 08 20:57:58 nokia owns it tho, don't they? Feb 08 20:58:14 I guessed that it would take developer time better spent elsewhere Feb 08 20:58:21 oops - I forgot that, yes. Feb 08 20:58:29 navigation is a killer app Feb 08 20:58:34 though I'm unsure how integrated the internal accounting is. Feb 08 20:58:44 seems like resources for it would be crucial Feb 08 20:58:58 the buisness structure may work so that nokia-phone has to pay nokia-maps money Feb 08 20:59:27 oh, is it because n900 is unlocked? Feb 08 20:59:30 wow, that would be crazy Feb 08 20:59:45 so they don't have a carrier deal to make reoccuring money off it? Feb 08 21:01:50 hi guys, do you guys know any way to sync tasks in the n900, to thunderbird? Feb 08 21:02:15 I tried syncing with google calendar as it interoperates with both exchange and caldav, but it turns out they don't sync tasks Feb 08 21:02:45 tripzero: it's a seperate issue - though yes it is genreally unlocked Feb 08 21:03:04 jophish: You expected corporate accounting to make sense? Feb 08 21:03:25 A fraction of a percent, yes Feb 08 21:03:26 It may have done before the turn of the millenium (999->1000) but not since. Feb 08 21:03:31 nokia has almost always been focused on unsubsidised handsets though Feb 08 21:03:33 hahahah Feb 08 21:05:18 hmm... looks like it will be available for the n900? http://www.electricpig.co.uk/2010/01/21/nokia-n900-to-get-nokia-ovi-maps-free-navigation/ Feb 08 21:05:31 "eventually" Feb 08 21:06:00 free? really? Feb 08 21:06:01 ? Feb 08 21:06:08 or just gratis? -.- Feb 08 21:06:15 tripzero, the quote was for maemo, not for the n900 Feb 08 21:06:15 I used ovi-maps navigation and i haven't paid anything Feb 08 21:06:15 probably just gratis Feb 08 21:06:32 n1000 Feb 08 21:06:37 lol Feb 08 21:06:38 most likely for Maemo 6 Feb 08 21:06:50 maemo 6 better work on the n900 Feb 08 21:06:55 or i'm going to cry more Feb 08 21:07:05 tripzero: unlikely. Feb 08 21:07:12 boo Feb 08 21:07:24 go crying now Feb 08 21:07:25 why the heck not Feb 08 21:07:35 ps aux Feb 08 21:07:37 oops Feb 08 21:07:53 tripzero: because Nokia has no interest in supporting devices you've already paid for? Feb 08 21:07:56 tripzero, the same reason that Fremantle doesn't run on the n810 Feb 08 21:07:58 next device better have usb host Feb 08 21:08:12 jophish, i thought that was a hardware difference Feb 08 21:08:21 ie, opengl support is lacking on the n8x Feb 08 21:08:32 tripzero hm not really Feb 08 21:08:38 n900 runs opengl like a champ Feb 08 21:08:56 tripzero: Nokia stopped supporting N8x0 almost a year before N900 was released Feb 08 21:09:22 they're still better then sharp, they didn't support the zaurus line at all Feb 08 21:09:23 longer, for some parts Feb 08 21:09:37 wirelessdreamer: true Feb 08 21:09:39 and at least there is a sane base to start with in maemo Feb 08 21:09:53 well . . . semi-sane Feb 08 21:09:55 hey, i have downloaded the maemo sdk from the forums.nokia.com .. the simulator works fine.. now want start writing some apps.. what is the best IDE for this? Feb 08 21:09:57 python needs help Feb 08 21:09:58 and N900 is better than N8x0 Feb 08 21:09:59 but still Feb 08 21:10:09 wirelessdreamer: Python needs help period. that's not Nokia's fault ;:p Feb 08 21:10:21 mak89k: Qt Creator? Feb 08 21:10:46 is there a maemo plugin for it? Feb 08 21:10:47 but they patially packages 2.3 and 2.5 Feb 08 21:10:54 mak89k: the key thing is to write the app on your main system, and just be aware that the screen will be smalelr Feb 08 21:10:58 its a real pain to get any real python app running Feb 08 21:11:00 mak89k: maybe test it with 640x480 windows Feb 08 21:11:25 s/packages/packaged/ Feb 08 21:11:29 mak89k: once it works locally, then worry about cross-compiling it Feb 08 21:12:26 luke-jr: ok il keep it in mind.. so how do i go abt using qt for maemo Feb 08 21:13:05 ? Feb 08 21:13:19 mak89k: http://wiki.forum.nokia.com/index.php/Getting_started_with_Qt_for_Maemo Feb 08 21:13:33 mak89k: writing platform-specific software is bad by design Feb 08 21:13:34 :) Feb 08 21:15:14 luke-jr: ok :) i have installed the sdk 5 using gui installer.. is there anything else i should configure? Feb 08 21:15:36 wirelessdreamer: thanks !! Feb 08 21:16:34 coarse accuracy means using the cell tower Feb 08 21:16:35 what's fine accuracy Feb 08 21:16:57 GPS Feb 08 21:17:07 i get the sbox-FREMANTLE_X86: prompt.. Feb 08 21:18:30 ty SpeedEvil, just making sure Feb 08 21:18:52 Whater' you trying. Feb 08 21:20:42 hai Feb 08 21:20:53 i'm having a really strange problem with my n900 Feb 08 21:21:35 umpossible Feb 08 21:22:24 http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=493104&postcount=190 Feb 08 21:22:40 the upper is my keyboard-layout Feb 08 21:22:45 Vanadis: Is it causing you to have disturbing dreams of palaces of ice filled with dusky maidens with antlers? Feb 08 21:22:49 If I promote a package to testing, is it necessary to promote the dbg, dev and doc packages? Feb 08 21:23:25 and it seems, i have changed the "." and "," button to left-button Feb 08 21:23:56 oh wait Feb 08 21:24:04 all other buttons are changed too -.- Feb 08 21:24:26 greetings. attempting to get palm bluetooth keyboard 3245ww working with n900. It pairs fine, but not much else. Opening up memo, typing on keyboard doesn't do anythign. obviously I'm missing a step. can someone point out where I configure bluetooth keyboard options? thanks. Feb 08 21:24:49 Vanadis: did you recently install anything that has to do with ketymapping? Feb 08 21:25:00 *key Feb 08 21:25:17 not particularly, but i guess this is the problem Feb 08 21:25:22 merp: hid is disabled in bluez config, you need to enable it. Feb 08 21:25:54 ok, so follow this then: http://wiki.maemo.org/Fremantle_Unsupported_Bluetooth_profiles ? Feb 08 21:26:00 is there any good way to see, which keyboard-settings are used? Feb 08 21:26:03 merp: Yes. Feb 08 21:26:09 thanks X-Fade Feb 08 21:26:18 Vanadis: what was the last thing you installed before this happened? Feb 08 21:27:04 i guess it was qtirreco Feb 08 21:30:10 or changed Feb 08 21:30:42 dunno, i think i'm just going to reflash it Feb 08 21:34:31 is there a way to start osso_notes with a file of my choice? like in, "gedit/vim/nano mytextfile.txt" Feb 08 21:34:59 osso_notes mytextfile.txt always starts with the last modified file Feb 08 21:41:07 how long does reflashing usually goes on N900? Feb 08 21:42:46 Vanadis: 20 seconds? Feb 08 21:43:40 too long -.- Feb 08 21:43:52 lol Feb 08 21:44:32 reflash probably takes a minute or two Feb 08 21:44:47 the progress indicators are reliable Feb 08 21:44:50 don't need to reflash, resetting in the "settings-menu" did it Feb 08 21:45:16 which reminds me Feb 08 21:45:39 does anyone know if there's a maemo-targeted of the util-linux-ng package? Feb 08 21:45:47 busybox's mount command is pissing me off Feb 08 21:46:14 maemo-targeted package* Feb 08 21:51:02 How often does the testing repository update promoted packages? Feb 08 21:55:50 once an hour i think. Feb 08 21:56:29 1800 seconds for it to be visible on the repository (worst case) Feb 08 22:01:11 the following command "Xephyr :2 -host-cursor -screen 800x480x16 -dpi 96 -ac -kb &" launches the blank window.. and the "[sbox-FREMANTLE_X86: ~] >af-sb-init.sh start: give me errors.. any ideas? Feb 08 22:01:27 X-Fade, I'm going to get pretty close to that. Uploaded two packages seconds apart, one made it, the other didn't Feb 08 22:01:46 mak89k: have you set the DISPLAY=:2 environment variable? Feb 08 22:01:51 yes Feb 08 22:02:22 mak89k: past your error to pastie.org Feb 08 22:02:23 jophish: Upload != in repository ;) Feb 08 22:02:27 ~paste .. Feb 08 22:02:31 promoted* Feb 08 22:02:38 jebba: thanks again for your work building all the etch packages, and with #7707 Feb 08 22:03:24 jebba: if it gets all sorted out might I impose on you for an account on your community build machine? I've some small packages of my own plus gcc that I'd like to build Feb 08 22:05:22 jophish: caching network ;) Check the http header to see how long it will cache for. Feb 08 22:05:39 ah, thanks Feb 08 22:06:16 mtd: gimme your email addr and i'll set you up on SDK box. Feb 08 22:06:41 X-Fade, follow the instructions. removed "input" from the main.conf DisablePlugins list. saved, restarted bluetoothd. re-paired keyboard. still no typing. any further suggestions on debug, logging, or something else to check? thanks. Feb 08 22:07:04 he javis Feb 08 22:07:14 moo woglinde Feb 08 22:07:41 javis did you attend fosdem? Feb 08 22:07:57 seems optification is still missing /usr/bin/* link. Feb 08 22:07:59 woglinde: uh, nope. Feb 08 22:09:16 heya Feb 08 22:11:25 alterego: http://pastie.org/815353 Feb 08 22:11:52 guys anyone is not sleeping and maybe wants to explain me some things ? Feb 08 22:13:10 anpr, what did you want to know? I'm not sure I'm the right person to answer, but I can give it a shot Feb 08 22:14:00 mtd: why do you need your own gcc? Feb 08 22:14:50 this is the Palm 3245ww bluetooth keyboard I am attempting to get working under n900. I have followd directions here: http://wiki.maemo.org/Fremantle_Unsupported_Bluetooth_profiles and enabled the input profile and restarted the daemon and successfully paired. but when I open xterm or Notes. typing on the keyboard does not do anything. Anyone have any additional suggestions? thanks. Feb 08 22:16:45 I have built gcc 4.4.3 (+other langs) but the programs compiled with it often crash qemu :-( Feb 08 22:17:00 (10:46:51 PM) ***kakashi runs Feb 08 22:18:38 t-tan: none existed a few days ago, AFAIK. If that's changed, great! Feb 08 22:18:45 t-tan: what repo is it in? Feb 08 22:19:04 mtd: I can upload it to my repo. it's optified Feb 08 22:19:12 jebba: thanks! Feb 08 22:19:24 alterego: any ideas? Feb 08 22:19:31 t-tan: that'd be cool Feb 08 22:19:49 t-tan: I just noticed that gcc-4.2-base has appeared from some repo (perhaps jebba's?) Feb 08 22:19:59 alterego: http://pastie.org/815361 Feb 08 22:20:26 mtd: you could also install gcc-4.2 from SDK but it's not optified Feb 08 22:20:31 mak89k: sorry no, not sure what's going wrong there. Feb 08 22:20:40 t-tan: ah yes well I won't be doing that on my n900 then :) Feb 08 22:21:08 t-tan: now I remember this conversation. Yeah, so that's why I want my own gcc: so I can optify it (and its dependencies) Feb 08 22:21:17 alterego: i did the gui install .. and the maemo launche is working.. i mean i can run the simulator Feb 08 22:21:22 t-tan: according to #7707, optification has a ways to go though :( Feb 08 22:21:35 t-tan: it's making progress. Feb 08 22:22:20 mtd: one can optifiy existing deb packages without recompiling them Feb 08 22:23:09 binfmt_misc works of x86 binaries now :) Feb 08 22:23:14 t-tan: oh? Feb 08 22:23:24 t-tan: that's what i'm doing, but it's still got problems. bug 7707 Feb 08 22:23:25 Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=7707 maemo-optify-deb produces recursive symlink for plugins in derivative packages Feb 08 22:23:29 nite all, sweet dreams Feb 08 22:23:32 t-tan: are there instructions somewhere? Feb 08 22:23:40 mtd: maemo-optify-deb Feb 08 22:23:41 I can execute x86 or arm randomly now on the phone Feb 08 22:23:51 t-tan: thanks Feb 08 22:24:09 sorry. i was to slow Feb 08 22:25:13 where can I download the source for maemo packages? Feb 08 22:25:45 jebba: does it only affect symlinks? Feb 08 22:25:47 apt-get source ? Feb 08 22:25:48 are you talking applications or the whole system? Feb 08 22:26:05 specific packages Feb 08 22:26:29 like, osso-xterm, for example Feb 08 22:26:55 t-tan: before it was breaking plugins. Right now it's not making /usr/bin links at all (well, in some packages). He's doing the symlinking in the .post* files, which is a bit frightening perhaps. Feb 08 22:27:44 jebba: and did it also happen when you run it during the build process (after gencontrol)? I didn't have problems so far with version 0.2.1 Feb 08 22:28:02 wat is rootstrap and is it necessary while running applications Feb 08 22:28:04 ? Feb 08 22:32:17 t-tan: this is all maemo-optify-deb Feb 08 22:32:53 mak89k: rootstrap is for the software development kit Feb 08 22:33:46 jebba: ok, thanks. I'm just adding an option to debhelper7 to optify during gencontrol Feb 08 22:33:48 i did the gui install in the forums.nokia site.. but i cannot see a rootstrap package in the /scratchboz/packages... does tht mean it is not isntalled Feb 08 22:34:21 scratchbox* Feb 08 22:35:58 help Feb 08 22:36:04 * timeless_mbp looks for a finnish speaker Feb 08 22:36:11 http://mxr-test.konigsberg.mozilla.org/symbian/source/MCL/sf/mw/accesssec/eapol/eapol_framework/eapol_common/type/aka/include/eap_type_aka_types.h#471 Feb 08 22:36:11 * This option selects the AKA algorithm used in akaulation. Feb 08 22:36:24 can someone please suggest what that last word is? Feb 08 22:38:17 timeless perhaps it's similar to antively? Feb 08 22:38:31 ? Feb 08 22:38:51 "On Debian-based Linux systems the Maemo SDK can be installed antively to the host PC" Feb 08 22:39:04 akaulation calculation? Feb 08 22:39:11 that was my guess Feb 08 22:39:21 since you picked it too, i'm happy Feb 08 22:39:38 hi Feb 08 22:40:09 mtd: sent you email Feb 08 22:40:11 mtd: gcc 4.4 is now in http://wiki.maemo.org/User:Tanner#experimental_packages Feb 08 22:40:30 sorry guy, but the maemo sdk is scratchbox 1 or scratchbox 2? Because looking here ( http://maemo-sdk.garage.maemo.org/ ) seems to be scratchbox2 but I'm installing it now and the GUI installer put the scratchbox-core1.0.16 .... Feb 08 22:40:46 mtd: I haven't tried it on the device yet... Feb 08 22:41:00 so, which version of scratchbox I need to use? And where I can download it? Feb 08 22:42:55 jebba: you might know, are you aware of a maemo package for the util-linux-ng utilities? Feb 08 22:43:20 good night everyone Feb 08 22:45:37 hi all Feb 08 22:47:25 microlith: not certain of that one. It seems a number of the main gnu tools are getting rebuilt Feb 08 22:47:48 jebba: thanks! Feb 08 22:47:52 t-tan: thanks Feb 08 22:48:09 mk8: ya, that's scratchbox2 at garage there I think. It's a bit messy. Perhaps some info here will help http://wiki.maemo.org/User:Jebba/SDK Feb 08 22:48:23 hello , i am new to maemo can i trust the gui installer or do i go for the manual install Feb 08 22:48:25 ? Feb 08 22:49:32 thanks jebba Feb 08 22:49:51 sb2/maemo-sdk dont works with optified packages Feb 08 22:50:02 text installer is probably best Feb 08 22:50:05 jebba:i am on ubuntu , i wanna install the sdk .. i tried the gui install for maemo5 but many packages did not isntall. Feb 08 22:50:08 help Feb 08 22:50:56 have u writtten a guide for ubuntu install? Feb 08 22:50:59 http://repository.maemo.org/stable/fremantle/maemo-scratchbox-install_5.0.sh Feb 08 22:51:00 then Feb 08 22:51:09 http://repository.maemo.org/stable/fremantle/maemo-sdk-install_5.0.sh Feb 08 22:51:54 thts it? i jsut run the files.. ? Feb 08 22:53:25 hi all. pls help me , I can't ping repository.maemo.org from my N900 , yet I can from my desktop Feb 08 22:54:19 should /etc/resolv.conf only have 127.0.0.1 ? Feb 08 22:55:43 yes that's normal Feb 08 22:55:50 if I start developing an application today: should I use hildon/gtk or qt? Feb 08 22:55:52 it has a resolver Feb 08 22:56:15 Damion2: thanks Feb 08 22:56:22 ptl: don't ask me, I'd say curses ;) Feb 08 22:56:30 Damion2: where can I see the real dns servers? Feb 08 22:56:34 termcap! Feb 08 22:57:20 cityLights: not sure Feb 08 22:57:30 Damion2: curses? on a mobile? Feb 08 22:57:56 ptl: yup Feb 08 22:58:21 * Fixes: NB#140490 (XTerminal icon missing) Feb 08 22:58:22 what's NB? Feb 08 22:58:53 ptl: if you need fancy graphics you can add asciiart Feb 08 22:58:59 latin I think for "note" Feb 08 22:59:33 ptl: and for color libcaca :) Feb 08 22:59:39 nota bene Feb 08 22:59:47 please note Feb 08 22:59:50 Damion2: it's probably a bug tracker Feb 08 22:59:59 Damion2: I know about nota bene ;) Feb 08 23:00:19 ptl: have you seen mplayer -vo caca ? it's great Feb 08 23:00:34 ah, maybe nokia bugs, or something Feb 08 23:00:40 NotBaplicable ? Feb 08 23:01:40 oh wait: asciiart and libcaca are not yet ported?? Feb 08 23:03:02 ahh. xchat works much better as an irc client on the n900 compared to pidgin. Feb 08 23:03:27 who needs porting. I have binfmt_misc working and can execute arbitrary x86 linux binaries now :) Feb 08 23:03:33 jebba: maemo-sdk-install .. not able to run Feb 08 23:03:48 Damion2: in one word... scrollbars? Feb 08 23:04:09 simoneb_: for? Feb 08 23:04:40 Damion2: scrollbars are really painful to use, touchscreen usually rely on other methods for scrolling Feb 08 23:05:25 ctrl-F and B work well for me, also / for search Feb 08 23:05:27 mak89k: sh maemo-scratchbox-install_5.0.sh Feb 08 23:05:51 or pgup/dn can be sent with up/dn swipes Feb 08 23:05:52 Damion2: how often do you need to recharge the battery to start a program? Feb 08 23:06:13 t-tan: recharge? Feb 08 23:06:21 hi everyone Feb 08 23:06:31 oh you assume it's slow Feb 08 23:06:34 Howdy sinclair Feb 08 23:06:38 Damion2: yes Feb 08 23:06:42 jebba: package installation ? minimal or runtime or + dev packages ..which one Feb 08 23:06:43 it's not Feb 08 23:07:00 Damion2: so you're using qemu? Feb 08 23:07:05 yeah Feb 08 23:07:32 has anyone successfully flashed the N900 with the latest firmware? i've tried linux, windows xp, vista, 7 all without any luck flashing the device Feb 08 23:07:33 Damion2: did you need any special patches to get it running? Feb 08 23:07:38 nope Feb 08 23:08:00 Damion2: are you going to upload it to extras*? Feb 08 23:08:07 sinclair, what's the problem? Feb 08 23:08:16 t-tan: probably Feb 08 23:08:52 atm I'm kludgingl doing it with symblinks to binaries and libs skattered all over the phone Feb 08 23:10:02 shld i choose the minimal rootstrap option for sdk installation? Feb 08 23:10:11 jophish: when i run the flasher it just sits there... Suitable USB device not found, waiting Feb 08 23:11:01 have you read the wiki page on flashing the device Feb 08 23:11:07 perhaps you missed something out Feb 08 23:11:47 jophish, yes i've read the wiki step by step for all operating systems with no luck at all Feb 08 23:13:52 might be worth double checking that Feb 08 23:14:02 or perhaps there is a problem with the device Feb 08 23:15:04 yeah i'm beginning to suspect the device... double checked, triple checked on 4 different operating systems with the same result... Feb 08 23:17:07 pressed u on the device? Feb 08 23:17:12 yup Feb 08 23:17:28 the device wakes up with dimmed screen and the usb icon Feb 08 23:17:32 but then nothing happens Feb 08 23:18:03 could be the cable perhaps Feb 08 23:18:53 i'll try a beta version of the software updater now... Feb 08 23:26:53 jebba: thanks for the heads up Feb 08 23:29:53 OK, I'm off now guys Feb 08 23:30:03 I hope you get things worked out sinclair Feb 08 23:31:14 ~seen luck Feb 08 23:31:17 luck was last seen on IRC in channel #debian, 711d 2h 8m 6s ago, saying: 'thanks'. Feb 08 23:31:25 args Feb 08 23:31:29 ~seen lcuk Feb 08 23:31:30 lcuk was last seen on IRC in channel #maemo, 3d 12h 45m 22s ago, saying: '\o/'. Feb 08 23:32:35 always gleeful, isn't he? Feb 08 23:33:45 I was asked to provide a "complete syslog" for my bugreport, what does that actually mean? obviosly not output of "syslog" since there is no such command Feb 08 23:36:10 can you help me with py2deb ? Feb 08 23:37:12 btw any comparison between energy comsamption between python and c++? Feb 08 23:37:35 It depends. Feb 08 23:37:51 It's almost a meaningless question. Feb 08 23:38:01 :grrr Feb 08 23:38:20 dude like caculate pi for example Feb 08 23:38:26 If you're doing compute intensive tasks that are going to take a while (minutes) to complete - then C++ is clearly the better solution Feb 08 23:39:03 total execute time is a not-bad proxy for battery life. Feb 08 23:39:14 oke what about webpage parsing and simple qt ui? Feb 08 23:39:32 If something uses .1s of CPU everh 60s say - it's not an issue Feb 08 23:39:40 If it uses .1s every .5s - it is Feb 08 23:39:57 strace and ps is your friend Feb 08 23:39:59 okies. Feb 08 23:40:16 Ideally you want something to be idle - using no CPU at all - when the user isn't interacting with it. Feb 08 23:40:43 If it's - for example - updating a clock and doing sums every second, that can kill your battery life Feb 08 23:41:03 strace and ps or htop can give you a very good insight into the likely battery effects Feb 08 23:41:19 Run it for a couple of hours - look at the total elapsed CPU time. Feb 08 23:41:37 Also - it may be irrelevant. Feb 08 23:42:19 alternatively; run it for a couple of hours and look at battery depletion Feb 08 23:42:29 If your thingy is - for example - to ping a site over 3G - then you have to pin the CPU for quite a while to actually be noticable against the 3g drain Feb 08 23:42:32 that's problematic. Feb 08 23:42:36 the battery meter is shit. Feb 08 23:42:52 anybody can help me to build a package, i make one (masstransit) but it doesnt work Feb 08 23:42:54 Run to depletion is better. Feb 08 23:43:18 or if you've got a DMM - charge for a couple of hours, run for an hour, pull the battery, leave 1 min, measure volts Feb 08 23:45:53 k thanks for the tips SpeedEvil gtg Feb 08 23:46:02 wave Feb 08 23:47:08 ok what am I doing wrong, the manuals say that to type special chars in terminal, you have to press the blue arrow and then Sym Feb 08 23:47:13 except that does nothing Feb 08 23:47:39 (you need to press them together) Feb 08 23:47:44 tried doing it via "hold blue arror and press sym" and also tried pressing them in succession Feb 08 23:49:51 SpeedEvil: batlevel in the etch repo works pretty well Feb 08 23:52:05 does anyone have bc compiled? Feb 08 23:56:09 ./b/bc/bc_1.06-20_armel.deb Damion2 in my etch repo Feb 08 23:56:38 Damion2: uh, also in main main main repo. Feb 08 23:57:05 could you put a wgetgetable url? Feb 08 23:57:33 is there any way to control the media player from the terminal? Feb 08 23:59:54 Damion2: just install it from the main repo. Dont have url to that handy. Feb 09 00:00:09 not even extras. like the main repo ;) Feb 09 00:00:31 apt-cache search bc lets me down Feb 09 00:01:01 has anyone managed to get google calendar to sync using mfe? Yeah, I know it's not supported. Still, maybe this sounds familiar: Entered everything correctly, but at the end it says "error. either exchange server requires secure connection or account is disabled". A google search reveiled a possible problem with certificates. Feb 09 00:01:31 and by "anyone", I guess I mean "anyone lately" as apparently it worked for lots of folks. Feb 09 00:01:48 btw my calendar is currently emtpy. Feb 09 00:03:06 Shapeshifter, works fine for me at the moment. Feb 09 00:04:16 yo bitches Feb 09 00:05:52 Jophish_n900: humm. Feb 09 00:06:26 where do I check if I have PR1.1? in "about product" there's 2.2009.51-1 Feb 09 00:06:39 hi there Feb 09 00:08:07 and 2009 sounds like PR1.0 to me Feb 09 00:08:15 2009.51 is PR1.1 Feb 09 00:08:20 2009.42 would be 1.0 Feb 09 00:08:24 ah Feb 09 00:08:25 and I thnk 48 was 1.0.1 Feb 09 00:08:26 okay Feb 09 00:08:29 thanks Feb 09 00:09:02 i'm unable to sign into aim with the telepathy packages due to a validation check on the oscar protocol however I believe aim allows for name spaces in the screen name, can this be considered a bug? Feb 09 00:10:49 mh, where are certs supposed to be in this version? I see things on the bugtracker that they are in /home/user/.activesync/certs but I don't have an .activesync folder Feb 09 00:11:43 ah found them Feb 09 00:11:48 .maemosec-certs Feb 09 00:20:47 native bc takes 3.9 seconds, x86 bc takes 25.8 seconds, 1Ghz x86 takes 1.24sec. echo 99999^9999 Feb 09 00:21:08 x86 qemu seems to be about 6 times slower than native Feb 09 00:22:06 how many times did you test Feb 09 00:22:13 only about 3-4 Feb 09 00:22:18 up arrow return Feb 09 00:22:23 running that on my local fairly-idle Sempron 140 varies from 0.4s to 1.1s - quite a range Feb 09 00:22:24 it was generally the same times within .1 Feb 09 00:22:48 Caesium: my work desktop is dual 3Ghz 686 of sorts, and 64bits Feb 09 00:23:05 under vmware my 32bit ubuntu with scratchbox runs arm bc in 6 seconds for that Feb 09 00:23:13 Sempron 140 is 2.7 iirc Feb 09 00:23:32 when you say native bc 3.9s, you mean on N900? that's not half bad Feb 09 00:23:46 how to get extras-testing repository? Feb 09 00:23:55 yeah, actually it's faster than my qemu arm thing Feb 09 00:23:59 always fail when i try to type it in in the package manager Feb 09 00:24:06 I suspect diskio is the slow thing Feb 09 00:24:36 600Mhz Arm cortex thingy8 is obviously quite good? Feb 09 00:24:47 guess so :) Feb 09 00:24:54 better than I expected :) Feb 09 00:24:57 Damion2: Or qemu blows Feb 09 00:25:11 SpeedEvil: it could be vmware, hold on... Feb 09 00:25:35 it's 0.48 on native Feb 09 00:26:17 oh okay it's 0.51 repeatadly under vmware Feb 09 00:26:25 yeah qemu running arm blows Feb 09 00:26:49 quelle surprise :) Feb 09 00:27:09 what's it roughly comparable to then, say P60? :) Feb 09 00:27:18 arm qemu running x86 is usable, note that loads of stuff like kernel syscalls are running natively Feb 09 00:49:59 Damion2, how usable is usable Feb 09 00:50:57 usable as in could boot dos and run full speed at the 8086 level, or usable like boot dos and win3.1 and run full speed at the 80386 level Feb 09 01:23:17 this is linux specific, xeyes was fast toppler was about aqs fast as native arm Feb 09 01:23:34 dosbox, ppl claim is fast enough for old dos games Feb 09 01:40:16 jeebus Feb 09 01:40:41 i really need a better way to optify via relink packages Feb 09 01:40:56 dare i write a new optify script? Feb 09 01:40:59 :) Feb 09 01:42:32 where are the environment variables stored in maemo 5? do I need to create /home/user/.profile or..? Feb 09 02:28:28 Brainstorm is such a sad joke. Feb 09 02:29:49 Der General Feb 09 02:29:51 greets Feb 09 02:30:10 Hi Feb 09 02:30:30 If you do write a new script, please submit your improvements to maemo-developers. Feb 09 02:30:44 I will certainly make it public Feb 09 02:30:50 but its likely to be an after the fact script Feb 09 02:30:59 eg, optify packagename Feb 09 02:31:09 maybe even with a gui frontend if I get around to caring Feb 09 02:31:20 but I'm tired of constantly being on the verge of a reflash :) Feb 09 02:31:34 kamui__: that already exists Feb 09 02:31:40 packagescan? Feb 09 02:31:44 aye Feb 09 02:31:49 naah, that takes at least 10 minutes to become useable Feb 09 02:32:05 I want something where I can run it from the cmd line, as I KNOW I just installed an app and its eating x megs of root Feb 09 02:32:20 GeneralAntilles: it's not for nothing that Brainstorm has the same initials as bullshit Feb 09 02:32:51 btw, who are the garage admins Feb 09 02:32:58 crashanddie, I guess the idea was going to be that we were actually going to be getting a time investment from Maemo Devices managers. Feb 09 02:33:03 kamui__, X-Fade's in charge. Feb 09 02:33:09 I wanted to say thank you for approving my blender project Feb 09 02:33:19 Im publishing my current build tonight Feb 09 02:33:22 blender on the N900? Feb 09 02:33:29 a ton of email requests keep pouring in Feb 09 02:33:31 crashanddie, unfortunately the tool seems to be the worst parts of Bugzilla and the lists all rolled up into one awful package Feb 09 02:33:32 even though its still a bit slow Feb 09 02:33:34 with no management investment. Feb 09 02:33:36 ftw! Feb 09 02:33:44 GeneralAntilles: who could blame management Feb 09 02:33:45 crashanddie, yep, my first day with the N900 I ported b lender 2.5 alpha Feb 09 02:33:52 GeneralAntilles: they don't have time to deal with whining cunts Feb 09 02:33:58 if you'll pardon the language Feb 09 02:33:59 crashanddie, I constantly blame management. :D Feb 09 02:34:03 Just not for this. Feb 09 02:34:05 but the opengl dep makes it a little slow, currently working on a gl to gles wrapper Feb 09 02:34:15 but is it even useable? Feb 09 02:34:29 oh ok. Feb 09 02:34:32 interface latency is about 1 - 2 seconds Feb 09 02:34:35 so yes and no Feb 09 02:34:49 yes it's a proof of concept, no it's not usable for any real work Feb 09 02:34:53 yes, it can be played with, no I wouldn't try and use it on a even a moderately serious recreational project Feb 09 02:35:11 kamui__: you the dutch guy who presented blender at the summit? Feb 09 02:35:20 that would be a no Feb 09 02:35:21 :) Feb 09 02:35:38 kamui__: shoot him an email Feb 09 02:36:54 you know what we need? some sexy GUI for Axel. Feb 09 02:37:12 kamui__: Ton Roosendaal Feb 09 02:37:22 the n900 needs a good download manager! Feb 09 02:37:42 a good gui for it at least. Feb 09 02:37:52 kamui__: he presented Blender at the Summit, he was pretty enthused about the whole community side of things, pretty sure he'd be stoked about seeing blender run on the n900 Feb 09 02:38:19 Ill look him up and send him an email Feb 09 02:38:26 pm Feb 09 02:39:29 anyone willing to help write a gui for Axel? Feb 09 02:40:53 LB1938, a download manager would be good however what would really make it good is if it handled im transfers and irc ones too Feb 09 02:42:03 that has nothing to do with things Feb 09 02:42:20 openstandards: you can't just piggyback on an IRC connection like that. xChat needs to implement it Feb 09 02:43:12 couldn't an api be made and then merged into the main tree? Feb 09 02:43:22 no Feb 09 02:43:32 why would anyone want that? Feb 09 02:43:44 I mean... A download manager made sense in the 90s Feb 09 02:43:46 it doesn't today Feb 09 02:44:16 get a TCP stream, dump to disk. Done. IRC doesn't support download resume (or very badly, anyway) Feb 09 02:44:27 frals: how was .fi ? Feb 09 02:45:44 it does make sense to those on slow internet connections crashanddie Feb 09 02:46:18 crashanddie, it also makes sense to group various tasks together Feb 09 02:47:23 if you guys use your n900 to downloads gigs worth of data, you have something else coming Feb 09 02:47:59 what do you mean? Feb 09 02:48:41 I tend to agree with crash here Feb 09 02:48:46 I was looking at that and thinking Feb 09 02:49:00 why wouldn't I just use wget for the 1 or 2 times in a lifetime I might need a manager Feb 09 02:49:31 not that Im discouraging you from making it Feb 09 02:50:17 n900 is the bst device i had Feb 09 02:50:20 my use =! everyone elses use Feb 09 02:50:21 bst* Feb 09 02:50:27 and I had a lot of them ;d Feb 09 02:50:28 != even Feb 09 02:50:37 killed work BB 9700 Feb 09 02:50:42 killed nokia e90 Feb 09 02:50:48 killed Nexus One ;) Feb 09 02:50:51 well in my case using axel and not wget on a 128k connection speeds things a lot. Feb 09 02:50:55 e90 is to obscure Feb 09 02:50:58 Maps is what im looking for! :) Feb 09 02:50:59 blackberry sucks Feb 09 02:51:04 android is ok, but too limiting Feb 09 02:51:20 too obscure Feb 09 02:51:24 i've found the n900 to be portable enough and powerful enough to be a proper computer Feb 09 02:51:31 openstandards: yeah Feb 09 02:51:36 no change Feb 09 02:51:38 no chance Feb 09 02:51:43 its a great mobile device Feb 09 02:51:51 but no way should you be saying that Feb 09 02:51:57 must still be in the infatuation phase Feb 09 02:52:19 crashanddie: If you can for example convince tcp/ip apps to bunch their comms - so they all send at once - you get some benefit in battery life. Feb 09 02:53:01 kamui__, why not alot will be doing things they are doing on their netbooks such as network auditing Feb 09 02:53:11 SpeedEvil: I doubt it... TCP keepalive can't be high enough to warrant battery savings Feb 09 02:53:14 I'll ask vint to sort it out Feb 09 02:53:47 theres this problem im facing from time to time Feb 09 02:54:07 openstandards: I did my first presentation on Friday from my n900 Feb 09 02:54:16 when i click more in the first menu thes apps are shown Feb 09 02:54:35 but the first menu is also still showing Feb 09 02:54:41 nice Feb 09 02:54:47 I just miss editing office documents. Feb 09 02:54:51 openstandards, beauty is in the eye of the beer holder Feb 09 02:55:00 could this be a bug? Feb 09 02:55:13 openstandards, but as much as I love the "N900, its still too slow and limting to facilitate my general use Feb 09 02:55:21 LB1938: did you try turning it on and off? Feb 09 02:55:21 especially when building apps onboard Feb 09 02:55:22 are there any personal bits of information on maemo5 that end up somewhere other than /home/user? Feb 09 02:55:41 specifically things like the widgets and shortcuts on your desktop? Feb 09 02:55:47 not that I don't already expect and accept it, however it just doesn't qualify to me as a full pc Feb 09 02:56:01 kamui__, true you can't run apps such as openoffice but it does alot of the things you'd need to do on the go Feb 09 02:56:02 I consider it a similar statement to the crapple fanboys calling the iPad a tablet Feb 09 02:56:03 mathew: it goes away if i do that but will come back randomly Feb 09 02:56:18 kamui__: PC: a small digital computer based on a microprocessor and designed to be used by one person at a time Feb 09 02:56:20 openstandards, irony, you CAN run openoffice, and it runs pretty smoothly after the 2 minute boot Feb 09 02:56:27 (priceton definition) Feb 09 02:56:43 Matthew-, kiss me, I must be dreaming Feb 09 02:56:57 kamui__, i was reading that you needed to run debby then openoffice.... Feb 09 02:57:08 openstandards, that would be correct Feb 09 02:57:25 kamui__: lmao about that beer holder Feb 09 02:57:25 yeah, OO boots like 15million years Feb 09 02:57:30 openstandards, however, it creates a link for openoffice that runs without running lxde first Feb 09 02:57:35 ~kamui__++ Feb 09 02:58:02 btw. any mac users? Feb 09 02:58:11 I have a mac Feb 09 02:58:16 macbook Feb 09 02:58:24 collecting dust on my bedside table Feb 09 02:58:26 :) Feb 09 02:58:28 kamui__: how do you sinc ? Feb 09 02:58:30 sync* Feb 09 02:58:30 personal mbp here as well Feb 09 02:58:31 ah Feb 09 02:58:32 ok Feb 09 02:58:35 lol Feb 09 02:58:36 I don't sync Feb 09 02:58:39 I sync via exchange Feb 09 02:58:49 i've got the plugin, but im thinking of doing it via exchange also. Feb 09 02:59:01 I've got my blackberry for my calendar and corporate email, no use for it personally Feb 09 02:59:02 no contest Feb 09 02:59:02 But should i run exchange on my personal laptop ? Feb 09 02:59:09 or get a dedicated server for it L/ Feb 09 02:59:14 Matthew-: neither Feb 09 02:59:15 lol Feb 09 02:59:31 Matthew-: you're seriously going to pay hundreds of dollars, if not thousands for mail? Feb 09 02:59:38 Matthew-: just use GMail Feb 09 02:59:43 either get a real exchange account, or use google + nuevasync **** ENDING LOGGING AT Tue Feb 09 02:59:56 2010