**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Mon Mar 15 02:59:57 2010 Mar 15 03:01:24 for those interested in the fullscreen issues. It is sufficient to call gtk_window_fullscreen and gtk_window_unfullscreen. The fullscreen button is seem as a standard button in the system. Mar 15 03:11:52 Hi, I'm currently trying to get some apps from devel and testing and those repositories seem offline... Is there any outage on the servers that host them? Mar 15 03:12:18 maemo carage Mar 15 03:14:04 zenjr: I am seeing the same thing.. Mar 15 03:14:22 tableteer repos and repositories.maemo.org Mar 15 03:14:37 I need minigpsd after a reflash. Mar 15 03:15:14 both are out right? I can't also install the SDK because of this... Mar 15 03:15:44 has it been out for a long time? I'm trying for 6 hrs Mar 15 03:16:00 I'm not sure how it affects the SDK.. but installing normal packages is broken.. Mar 15 03:16:03 yeah.. Mar 15 03:16:07 same here.. Mar 15 03:16:38 I reflashed this morning and am waiting for them to come back up.. Mar 15 03:17:24 the repos really need to be cleaned up and organized.. Mar 15 03:17:37 there are too many and they are all over the place.. Mar 15 03:17:40 For the SDK apparently the EULA (end user license agreement) is hosted on this domain, and it doesn't show up Mar 15 03:18:19 oh man.. I'm sorry.. I really love my n810.. I'd hate for community support for it to grow stale.. Mar 15 03:18:25 are there more than repository.maemo.org/extras extras-devel and extras testing? Mar 15 03:19:03 yeah.. but they are not as complete as those.. Mar 15 03:19:21 there is a site that lists the big ones.. Mar 15 03:19:31 yeap, me too... I wanna start having a look on the SDK for my n900 Mar 15 03:19:41 really? do you have that link? Mar 15 03:19:44 http://www.gronmayer.com/it/ Mar 15 03:20:00 I am not sure if that has n900 repos.. Mar 15 03:20:15 but it lists n770, n800, and n810 Mar 15 03:20:32 back in a sec.. Mar 15 03:20:47 i had a n800... I liked it so much that I sold it to buy the 900 :) Mar 15 03:21:07 after all I would carry a cellphone + the 800 Mar 15 03:21:13 thanks anyway Mar 15 03:22:39 yeah.. I carry cell+n810.. maybe I'll upgrade too.. :) congrats.. Mar 15 03:23:12 personnally i won't Mar 15 03:23:33 its worth it.. and the ui is sleeker and way faster than the n800 Mar 15 03:23:43 I prefer my phone to be DUMB so that it has an awesome battery life and did not crash because of that funny wallpaper Mar 15 03:23:58 which wallpaper? Mar 15 03:25:28 I must agree with the battery life though... If you use it constantly downloading content with 3G it lasts way less that I would like... Mar 15 03:27:03 it still has to be better than the iphone.. Mar 15 03:27:51 best phone on earth: nokia 1208 Mar 15 03:27:57 hehe Mar 15 03:28:13 7 day with no calls, 5 hours in call Mar 15 03:28:24 never crashed Mar 15 03:29:01 or the 1100 Mar 15 03:30:53 well after the last jan firmware update the n900 hasn't crashed once Mar 15 03:32:11 my experience with computers and software is that the question is not whether it will crash but when. And the most complex the system is the earliest the crash will be. Mar 15 03:33:54 yeap that is true... The more complex the system more chances it has on crashing... Mar 15 03:34:12 gotta take off.. be good, guys.. Mar 15 04:26:27 i find it very stable Mar 15 04:30:35 testing Mar 15 04:30:38 weird. Mar 15 04:32:05 hi everyone Mar 15 04:33:17 im chatting from my n900. :) Mar 15 04:33:26 nice! Mar 15 04:34:06 :) Mar 15 04:34:12 whats up? Mar 15 04:34:57 Socialism. it's all the rage. Mar 15 04:35:00 everyone's doing it. Mar 15 04:36:23 lol Mar 15 04:36:32 quit accident Mar 15 04:36:50 you say socialism is the rage? Mar 15 04:36:55 oh yeah. Mar 15 04:36:57 all the kids are doing it. Mar 15 04:37:13 lol Mar 15 04:37:18 oh, wait, sorry, I'm being told I don't mean socialism, I mean DANCE MUSIC. Mar 15 04:37:20 my bad. Mar 15 04:37:36 Socialism is apparently bad. Makes people healthy and ends homelessness, CLEARLY BAD. Mar 15 04:37:59 jX, find a different forum for the off-topic, thanks. Mar 15 04:38:09 dance music sucks Mar 15 04:38:13 put it away, general, it was a joke. Mar 15 04:38:33 besides, it's not like the channel is overflowwing at the moment. Mar 15 04:38:45 a little levity might wake everyone up! Or maybe... WAFFLES. Mar 15 04:39:00 we are only allowed to talk maemo related content in this channel? Mar 15 04:39:14 ahsm, no, but obviously off-topic stuff is discouraged. Mar 15 04:39:17 fins a way to speed up apt-get update Mar 15 04:39:22 find Mar 15 04:39:31 ahsm: he was just afraid I was going political. Mar 15 04:39:41 The military doesn't liek politicians. Mar 15 04:39:45 ok i understand :) Mar 15 04:40:04 the n900 is amazi Mar 15 04:40:29 oh btw who saw the start of formula 1 today? Mar 15 04:41:01 Formula 1? Meh. :P Mar 15 04:41:04 ALMS is where the fun is. Mar 15 04:41:28 le mans Mar 15 04:41:35 a racing game based on OSM roads... Mar 15 04:41:50 Dakar! Mar 15 04:41:51 have you seen truth in 24? Mar 15 04:42:24 pupnik, OK, you're the 3rd person to mention a Maemo racing game in the past 2 days. Mar 15 04:42:52 there is nspeed already for example Mar 15 04:43:25 ahsm, no, I haven't, I will, though. Mar 15 04:43:30 pupnik, something with more realism. ;) Mar 15 04:43:35 i have contacted a couple of game devs i want to see release their thing for n900 also Mar 15 04:43:57 publishers Mar 15 04:44:12 general you really should its very good Mar 15 04:44:20 underwhelming respponse Mar 15 04:44:21 anyways Mar 15 04:44:30 nice meeting you lot Mar 15 04:44:45 goodnight :) Mar 15 04:44:47 stop by again ahsm Mar 15 04:44:56 for sure Mar 15 04:45:00 peace Mar 15 04:45:21 * GeneralAntilles stocks up on ebooks. Mar 15 04:45:26 i suppose no-one else does Mar 15 05:51:32 povbot: ping Mar 15 05:53:17 GeneralAntilles: /mode #maemo -q $~a Mar 15 05:54:20 povbot: ping Mar 15 05:54:20 pong Mar 15 05:54:29 :-) Mar 15 05:54:32 Stupid ircd seven. Mar 15 05:54:48 stupid crashanddie Mar 15 05:55:33 sorry but it's actually not ird-7's fault Mar 15 05:56:53 I didn't say it was its fault Mar 15 05:57:01 just that it's stupid because I need to learn new stuff. ;) Mar 15 05:57:02 ahh Mar 15 05:57:09 nm then Mar 15 06:01:28 GeneralAntilles, did you file the font kerning bug when you were talking about it? if not someone did for you https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=9550 Mar 15 06:01:31 Bug 9550: Font Kerning hard to read when zoomed in web browser Mar 15 06:01:40 if o, whats the number of yours ill mark it as a dupe Mar 15 06:01:43 s Mar 15 06:02:56 lcuk, don't remember. Mar 15 06:02:58 Don't think so. Mar 15 06:03:11 Tim Samoff may have filed something, though. Mar 15 06:04:18 cant see anything specific, nm theres a bug there now Mar 15 06:08:41 Latest issue of Maemo Weekly News out now: http://www.mwkn.net/ Mar 15 06:08:50 Many thanks to GeneralAntilles Mar 15 06:09:04 Thanks to you, Jaffa! ;) Mar 15 06:09:09 :) Mar 15 06:09:21 * Jaffa breaks up the mutual appreciation society and goes to get ready for work. Mar 15 06:26:54 morning Mar 15 06:27:26 mornin' Mar 15 06:30:35 anyone have anyidea how i get microb and other gui apps to recognize an internet connection that is not wifi or bluetooth? i.e. its coming through usb Mar 15 06:31:15 just keeps trying to connect to a wifi connection even though it already has a internet connection Mar 15 06:31:29 via what? Mar 15 06:33:40 well i'm using a 3g expresscard. i've already managed to get it recognized and connecting to the internet Mar 15 06:34:35 but microb and presence and others just keep asking for a net connection. i can apt-get and ping via the command line just fine Mar 15 06:34:36 you're using the usbnet, but the other way round most people would expect, right? Mar 15 06:34:58 usbnet? Mar 15 06:35:12 well, the "get my internets over usb" Mar 15 06:35:24 and without using ppp Mar 15 06:35:34 i'm using ppp Mar 15 06:35:47 uhm Mar 15 06:35:51 with a 3g card hooked up to the usb Mar 15 06:35:53 on the N900? Mar 15 06:35:59 nope n810 Mar 15 06:36:06 :-P Mar 15 06:36:12 hm Mar 15 06:36:20 i think i get it Mar 15 06:36:55 i made a quick write up of what i did here: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=47174 Mar 15 06:36:58 n810->usb/expresscard adapter->3g expresscard <| right? Mar 15 06:37:00 hard to establish for N900 - no hostmode :-D Mar 15 06:37:17 @arachnist yeah thats right Mar 15 06:37:37 I saw some application for N900 that supposedly enables using usb mass storages, etc. Mar 15 06:37:48 It was in extras-devel I think. Mar 15 06:37:56 MiXu-: it's borked Mar 15 06:37:57 cedar: there was a way to enable a "dummy" internet connection in the ICD Mar 15 06:37:59 bogus Mar 15 06:38:00 youtube or it didna happin! :) Mar 15 06:38:17 DocScrutinizer: Alright :) Mar 15 06:38:30 cedar: but it's been long since i don't have an n800 (which also had maemo4) Mar 15 06:39:12 ICD? Mar 15 06:39:49 internet connection daemon Mar 15 06:40:00 pupnik: http://people.openmoko.org/joerg/unsorted/FR+UMTS.jpg Mar 15 06:40:02 ah ok i'll check it out thanks Mar 15 06:40:03 :-D Mar 15 06:41:13 cool Mar 15 06:41:14 Does Eclipse work okay with GCJ? Mar 15 06:43:26 @arachnist maybe this? gconftool-2 -s -t string /system/osso/connectivity/IAP/DEFAULT/type DUMMY Mar 15 06:45:29 cedar: maybe Mar 15 06:45:39 cedar: i honestly, don't remember Mar 15 06:47:36 @arachnist cool thanks Mar 15 06:50:53 morning Mar 15 06:52:48 hmmm aparently dummy connections are broken in diablo Mar 15 07:02:32 DocScr,is thar some kind of ancient geek hammer? Mar 15 07:03:59 inz: hypermodern teawarmer ;-) Mar 15 07:05:27 and here http://people.openmoko.org/joerg/unsorted/impressions-of-25C3/ are the crackers for teatime Mar 15 07:06:34 really crunchy ;-P Mar 15 07:14:32 crunchy frog Mar 15 07:19:48 mmh, how do i disable rd mode on n900 ? :) Mar 15 07:20:16 there was a way to do it with the flasher Mar 15 07:20:36 well i'm trying to --disable-rd-mode, but either I cant get the exact moment of bootup, or... Mar 15 07:23:32 while loop rules Mar 15 07:23:38 bruteforce ftw Mar 15 07:26:45 hmm, it wasnt .profile after all. Mar 15 08:37:50 ffs, esbox is giving me headaches. Mar 15 08:38:07 Trying to follow the SDK installation guide(s), but bleh. Mar 15 08:39:59 help Mar 15 08:40:06 my hardware keyboard is giving me hebrew Mar 15 08:40:10 how do i fix this? Mar 15 08:40:28 tried fixing the keybord layout? Mar 15 08:40:33 s/fixing/changing/ Mar 15 08:40:33 Wolfie meant: tried changing the keybord layout? Mar 15 08:50:53 Wolfie: text input says US English (in too many words, because someone was stupid) Mar 15 08:51:53 but yeah, changing languages temporarily fixes it Mar 15 08:51:57 this isn't the first time i've hit it Mar 15 08:53:08 sounds fun Mar 15 08:53:48 turns out i have 'hebrew-keymap' installed Mar 15 08:54:05 didn't that come along with the latest maemo update? Mar 15 08:54:24 i'd remember that there was some hebrew-keyboard-fix-thingie... Mar 15 08:54:36 can't say that my layout would've changed, however Mar 15 08:55:44 it seems to be in fremantle repository, by a Matan Ziv-Av, so i guess it isn't nokia's Mar 15 08:56:01 there must be some magic keystroke that randomly changes the hardware keyboard layout Mar 15 08:56:15 because it only provides two files, an Xsession.post and the keyboard Mar 15 09:16:55 Morning, all Mar 15 09:17:24 Morning Mar 15 09:17:50 Hi guys! Im trying to sort my contacts on Availability, perhaps I misunderstand the meaning of the word, but my offline contacts are shown at the top, in alpha order. Mar 15 09:17:59 how can I make it sort by "availability" for real? Mar 15 09:18:23 Coke: Are you actually signed in to the services? Mar 15 09:18:31 yeah Mar 15 09:18:38 how can I tell? Mar 15 09:18:53 Green dot. Mar 15 09:19:00 morning Mar 15 09:19:01 i guess no then Mar 15 09:19:38 I have two jabber accounts, both are marked as "enabled" Mar 15 09:20:56 Ohh, I get it. Mar 15 09:55:20 hm. nokia guys last commit for qt was 10 march Mar 15 09:56:44 * Stskeeps sits down and tries to process the BME licensing change bug Mar 15 09:57:56 Stskeeps: wontifx? Mar 15 09:58:14 hrw: not this simple sadly Mar 15 09:58:28 as in, maybe not fix the original request, but it's a forth and back discussion on how to deal with it Mar 15 09:58:30 Stskeeps: bmo or internal? Mar 15 09:58:35 bmo Mar 15 09:58:40 i do these things in public, so Mar 15 09:58:48 bug#? Mar 15 09:59:16 * Shapeshifter released another version of his alarmd frontend. Now supports relative event setting à la "tomorrow", "next friday" or "in 15 minutes". :) Mar 15 09:59:18 9314 , but no evaluation from me there yet Mar 15 09:59:44 bug #9314 Mar 15 09:59:45 Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=9314 relicense BME Mar 15 10:02:23 interesting Mar 15 10:06:11 Shapeshifter: I definitely want to give that a try Mar 15 10:07:56 DocScrutinizer: next thing on my list is the cli interface :) Mar 15 10:08:29 great. Still is the current version in *devel ? Mar 15 10:08:33 yeah. Mar 15 10:08:43 * DocScrutinizer fires up HAM Mar 15 10:09:14 I hope it's hildonized? or not so greedy Mar 15 10:09:36 DocScrutinizer: greedy? it uses pyside so it's slow, but looks nice Mar 15 10:09:40 nicer then pyqt for that matter Mar 15 10:09:54 Shapeshifter: only a 22MB left on / here Mar 15 10:09:57 ah Mar 15 10:10:06 its optified Mar 15 10:10:23 gahh, s/hildonized/oftified/ Mar 15 10:10:27 a freudian Mar 15 10:10:30 ^^ Mar 15 10:11:11 see? I can't even spell it :P Mar 15 10:11:31 Oh that's what optifying means? :) Mar 15 10:11:43 ~optification Mar 15 10:11:44 from memory, optification is a botch to reclaim space in fs root, done due to the fact the partitioning is FUBAR, or http://wiki.maemo.org/Free_up_rootfs_space Mar 15 10:12:04 infobot is cute Mar 15 10:12:14 ~infobot Mar 15 10:12:15 infobot is probably The coolest, or a decepticon Mar 15 10:12:35 decepticon? xD Mar 15 10:13:18 DocScrutinizer: when doing the cli interface I'll also seriously restructure the code. It's a total mess by now ;) it just "grew" ^^ Mar 15 10:14:37 ~but optification is a botch to reclaim space in fs root, done due to the fact the partitioning is FUBAR, or http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo_5_Developer_Guide/Packaging,_Deploying_and_Distributing/Installing_under_opt_and_MyDocs Mar 15 10:14:38 DocScrutinizer: what are you talking about? Mar 15 10:14:56 I see Mar 15 10:15:04 ~forget optification Mar 15 10:15:04 i forgot optification, DocScrutinizer Mar 15 10:15:13 ~optification is a botch to reclaim space in fs root, done due to the fact the partitioning is FUBAR, or http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo_5_Developer_Guide/Packaging,_Deploying_and_Distributing/Installing_under_opt_and_MyDocs Mar 15 10:15:14 okay, DocScrutinizer Mar 15 10:15:47 ~optification Mar 15 10:15:48 optification is, like, a botch to reclaim space in fs root, done due to the fact the partitioning is FUBAR, or http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo_5_Developer_Guide/Packaging,_Deploying_and_Distributing/Installing_under_opt_and_MyDocs Mar 15 10:17:10 Shapeshifter: hehe, a quite commonly seen problem on sw development Mar 15 10:17:44 supposedly small augments collide with a flawed or 'grown' structure Mar 15 10:19:15 usually a major refactoring is ok in such a case Mar 15 10:21:48 wtf?? "installing alarmed needs 39MB of system storage" Mar 15 10:21:53 * DocScrutinizer scared Mar 15 10:22:40 huhh Mar 15 10:23:00 libqt, libboost (eeeeek) - no surprise Mar 15 10:23:07 DocScrutinizer: ah. Mar 15 10:23:14 indeed Mar 15 10:23:30 * Shapeshifter is still looking forward to shiboken Mar 15 10:23:54 I'd not give a shit if only I knew all those hogs go to /opt Mar 15 10:24:09 DocScrutinizer: they don't? Mar 15 10:24:27 actually I don't dare to try and install Mar 15 10:24:45 Shapeshifter: dunno Mar 15 10:24:50 DocScrutinizer: Pulls in Qt4? Mar 15 10:24:51 qt is optified apparently. ls /opt/qt4-maemo5/lib/ Mar 15 10:24:57 HAM is so... uhh verbose Mar 15 10:25:05 DocScrutinizer: Then it is safe. Mar 15 10:25:46 X-Fade: HAM at least tell it's pulling libqt-maemo5-* Mar 15 10:26:05 DocScrutinizer: Yeah, that is is ok. Mar 15 10:26:26 Is the rootfs a physically faster media, than rest of the eMMC or what's the logic behind having such a small drive as rootfs? Mar 15 10:26:36 so I'll gibe it a go. Hide if I need to reflash after this enterprise Mar 15 10:26:42 ;-) Mar 15 10:26:52 MiXu-: it's on the same chip as the RAM. Mar 15 10:27:00 DocScrutinizer: ^^ Mar 15 10:27:03 hmm, ok Mar 15 10:27:06 Makes sense Mar 15 10:27:08 MiXu-: the other one is easily replacable (at design time anyway) Mar 15 10:27:18 * dottedmag wonders why there is tracker in firmware while there are no reverse-deps for it Mar 15 10:27:34 well, except "whole image" package Mar 15 10:27:43 MiXu-: And it is slightly faster. Mar 15 10:28:29 DocScrutinizer, can you change the "botch" to "inventive duct tape workaround" Mar 15 10:28:36 I wonder when flash memories will actually become fast on embedded devices. Mar 15 10:28:44 http://images.4chan.org/b/src/1268647567823.jpg - internationalisation. (mostly worksafe) Mar 15 10:28:55 MiXu-: it's 13 megabytes/s - that's not exactly slow Mar 15 10:28:56 ~forget optification Mar 15 10:28:56 i forgot optification, DocScrutinizer Mar 15 10:29:25 MiXu-: and 24 or so if you read from the mmc and the ubifs at the same time Mar 15 10:29:39 ~optification is a inventive duct tape workaround to reclaim space in fs root, done due to the fact the partitioning is FUBAR, or http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo_5_Developer_Guide/Packaging,_Deploying_and_Distributing/Installing_under_opt_and_MyDocs Mar 15 10:29:40 okay, DocScrutinizer Mar 15 10:30:00 :D thanks! Mar 15 10:30:01 SpeedEvil: I guess that's sufficient for an embedded device then :) Mar 15 10:30:13 SpeedEvil: lol, jewish Mar 15 10:31:11 yipeee, not a single 0.1MB lost in / :-))) Mar 15 10:37:50 Shapeshifter: cool. You'd be interested in extending the selection of period for recurring events by a custom setting, so user could create things like "every 27 minutes" ? Mar 15 10:38:53 DocScrutinizer: I wanted to do that yesterday, but unfortunately the pymaemo libalarm bindings don't support that :( Only the mask-type-of recurring events (hourly, weekly...) but not every x minutes. Mar 15 10:39:16 friggin python bindings Mar 15 10:40:36 DocScrutinizer: I reported a bug a month ago including a fix for a very simple and obvious bug, but it's not been fixed until now Mar 15 10:41:06 because of that bug I can't enable dbus events in alarmed. Everything is already there but the event creation is broken because of that bug Mar 15 10:41:15 usually you can bet, if it's not the original API messing the functionality by "simplifying" things too much, then for sure it's the bindings doing a great job on this Mar 15 10:42:19 DocScrutinizer: well, even the official apps don't seem to use the "every x minutes" feature in alarmd. modest for example creates a new event every time it has checked the mail Mar 15 10:42:39 you can see this happening in /var/cache/alarmd/alarm_queue.ini Mar 15 10:42:42 eeeewww Mar 15 10:43:12 but I'm not sure. because the event does have recur_secs: 900. and in the python bindings exactly this I can't set Mar 15 10:43:34 so Mar 15 10:43:36 but still, the event is recreated everytime with a new cookie. anyway, alarmd is a bit weird. I still don't get why they didn't just go with cron Mar 15 10:43:43 repo.m.o is still down? Mar 15 10:43:53 + Mar 15 10:43:56 thresh: Should not? Mar 15 10:44:32 Shapeshifter: (cron) probably it's been a bit daunting to integrate the RTC wakeup to crond Mar 15 10:45:07 DocScrutinizer: rtc wakeup? is that the thing where the phone turns itself on upon an event? Mar 15 10:45:26 yep Mar 15 10:47:59 it's hard to tell if it's better to have a alarmd based on crond which in turn is patched to meet the mobile environment idiosyncrasies, or have a crond using alarmd for the actual timekeeping Mar 15 10:48:10 X-Fade: oh well, nevermind. Mar 15 10:48:28 of course, it's still nokia's fault that i failed to set up usb networking properly. Mar 15 10:48:38 thresh: If you notice a problem, please let me know though. Mar 15 10:48:44 X-Fade: sure. Mar 15 10:49:50 Shapeshifter: anyway I hope your alarmed cmdline interface will make a viable substitute for cron Mar 15 10:50:27 DocScrutinizer: we'll see Mar 15 10:50:39 as well as for at Mar 15 10:50:50 maybe even for batch? Mar 15 10:50:57 ;-) Mar 15 10:54:03 Shapeshifter: suuuuper. One of my top ten useful apps Mar 15 10:54:19 DocScrutinizer: :) thanks. Mar 15 10:54:38 right, evaluated the BME bug Mar 15 10:55:01 BME bug?? Mar 15 10:55:09 https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=9314 Mar 15 10:55:11 Bug 9314: relicense BME Mar 15 10:55:26 aah Mar 15 10:55:37 my stack has glitches :-P Mar 15 10:57:13 Stskeeps: that one for sure a special one - regarding product liability / waranty of Nokia. I pretty much can see why the're particularly reluctant on that one Mar 15 10:57:34 DocScrutinizer: i fully understand why they are choosing this, but let's try to limit the damage of it being closed :P Mar 15 10:57:45 ack Mar 15 10:58:06 'leaking' would be a possible path to approach it Mar 15 10:58:06 i mean, OK, if you want to reverse engineer it and make your pants catch fire in an airport, you're welcome to do that, but i'm not going to help you Mar 15 10:58:10 :P Mar 15 10:59:29 :) Mar 15 10:59:33 Stskeeps: (catch fire in airport) usually won't happen as you rarely are going to massively overcharge the cell during your stay at airport :-) Mar 15 11:00:59 DocScrutinizer: battery charger on plane comes to mind, if there's electric plugs Mar 15 11:00:59 :P Mar 15 11:01:11 Stskeeps: aah yes Mar 15 11:01:49 * DocScrutinizer wonders if BL-5J has a protection chip anyway Mar 15 11:01:51 "airbus a300 catches fire due to nokia battery charging algorithm reverse engineering by DocScrutinizer" Mar 15 11:02:03 LOL Mar 15 11:02:47 now let's push this nice lil nasty :-P Mar 15 11:04:17 ^^ Mar 15 11:04:59 * Arif_ yawns Mar 15 11:05:42 backcover open/close always gives me goosepimples - *CRRACKKK* *shudder* Mar 15 11:05:55 DocScrutinizer: only way this situation would have been better would have been if a community had been the ones developing the charging in the first place :P Mar 15 11:06:16 (how does law deal with a community causing someone's pants to catch fire anyway?) Mar 15 11:06:47 I think GPL is pretty clear on that one as well Mar 15 11:07:06 Yeah. You have to offer the fire to others for a nominal cost. Mar 15 11:07:10 heh Mar 15 11:07:39 "is supplied as is... may eat your cat... no liability taken in whatever form..." Mar 15 11:08:12 well maybe that'S not core GPL but the salt Mar 15 11:09:47 gpl and community-delivered or not, nokia wont want even the risk of "bl-5j battery blows up, toddler dies" headlines :p Mar 15 11:10:36 I think Nokia should consider leaking as a way of dealing with stuff like that Mar 15 11:11:09 DocScrutinizer: then there's the issue of them not suing the pants off people implementing stuff based on the leaked materials.. Mar 15 11:11:19 trade secrets etc.. Mar 15 11:12:51 why should the be interested in doing so. And in the end of the day there's absolutely ZERO secret stuff inside BME Mar 15 11:14:55 The main issue is, and will always be, the lipo hazard. Mar 15 11:15:00 * SpeedEvil nods. Mar 15 11:15:01 Having briefly looked at some of the nokia-produced kernel code I would say a publically reviewed version would hardly be more likely to cause an incident... Mar 15 11:15:04 X-Fade: which is irrelevant Mar 15 11:15:12 X-Fade: as that's in kernel or hardware Mar 15 11:15:34 At least - if the kernel driver doesn't do sanity checking, it's _COMPLETELY_ broken. Mar 15 11:15:35 We recently had an example again in the RC community, with someone actually burning his house down with a simple lipo+charger. Mar 15 11:16:00 neglecting the fact that there may be hardware safeguards. Mar 15 11:16:45 This all stems from the issue that people want to get 'info' from BME. Not actually drive the thing. Mar 15 11:17:10 aren't you supposed to charge lipo batteries inside fireproof bags? Mar 15 11:17:16 oh yeah Mar 15 11:17:27 i finally found out what was causing my device to reboot on start Mar 15 11:17:47 X-Fade: I want to control charging Mar 15 11:17:52 and the winner was libdui0 Mar 15 11:17:58 X-Fade: I want to set a lower maximum limit - 4.1, not 4.2V Mar 15 11:18:07 which added /etc/X11/Xsession.post/13duithemedaemon without adding /usr/bin/duithemedaemon Mar 15 11:18:10 X-Fade: As I never run out of battery, and want my battery to last longer. Mar 15 11:18:17 so DSME was sending the machine to reboot Mar 15 11:19:10 heh, the fire in my last flat is missing explanation of the cause yet Mar 15 11:19:22 :) Mar 15 11:19:39 DocScrutinizer: freerunner battery fire? ;) Mar 15 11:19:42 Is there any app to schedule reboots for N900? Mar 15 11:19:44 nope Mar 15 11:20:06 there were no FR around at that time Mar 15 11:20:33 was before I even started my job at OM - I visited TPE with all my face burnt Mar 15 11:20:59 s/visited/first time visited/ Mar 15 11:21:00 DocScrutinizer meant: was before I even started my job at OM - I first time visited TPE with all my face burnt Mar 15 11:22:18 I suspect the NiMH in a mini vacuum cleaner Mar 15 11:22:34 nokia should just do what we tell them on the bug tracker :> Mar 15 11:22:39 problem solved Mar 15 11:23:01 if they did, we'd have hello kitty cases. Mar 15 11:23:40 that's a fair price to pay ;) Mar 15 11:24:00 I actually want one of those now Mar 15 11:24:22 oh well -- "" Mar 15 11:24:24 - Change charging algorithms (trickle-charge if it's likely to be on AC Mar 15 11:24:25 overnight anyway?) Mar 15 11:24:27 "" Mar 15 11:24:28 :-(( Mar 15 11:24:54 http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Battery_Questions_and_Answers Mar 15 11:25:26 doesn't it already trickle charge if it's at 100%? :P Mar 15 11:25:52 I really hope it doesn't Mar 15 11:26:21 well, 90% Mar 15 11:26:22 dunno Mar 15 11:26:22 :P Mar 15 11:27:52 MiXu-: see Shapeshifter's alarmed. I think a cmdline event kicking off a 'sudo shutdown -r now' will do Mar 15 11:28:09 Hmm, nice. I'll look into it. Mar 15 11:54:40 *Sigh* Mar 15 11:54:53 I can't get nokia map loader to do anything with my N900, advice? Mar 15 11:55:29 find jaffa's guide Mar 15 11:55:34 get an iphone Mar 15 11:55:42 I was wondering why my battery went down a _lot_ while playing mp3 while gardening. Mar 15 11:55:43 Stskeeps: (9314) sigh, it's really difficult. I know patents might be insane, but honestly I can't see any valid patents in charging LiPo - it's ancient technology and algos are wellknown prior knowledge Mar 15 11:55:47 Clickety, no thanks. Mar 15 11:56:00 it's shame to nokia to have uncompatible software. ovi suite, map loader Mar 15 11:56:06 Turns out I was in range of my wifi, and the rsync to backup my laptop had kicked off. Mar 15 11:56:12 both are advertised as "for n900" :( Mar 15 11:56:24 DocScrutinizer: i'm not happy about 9314 either, but just stating objective facts :P Mar 15 11:56:24 SpeedEvil: muhaha Mar 15 11:56:30 testing 10mw range today Mar 15 11:56:42 DocScrutinizer: (personally i wouldn't mind seeing it OSS'ed, but i also have to be realistic) Mar 15 11:56:59 rmrfchik, my OVI suite seems to be working no problem, just the map loader keeps telling me to put it into mass storage mode, and then it tells me to put it into PC suite mode. Mar 15 11:57:01 SpeedEvil: pulseaudio probably Mar 15 11:57:34 TigerTael: Ovi Suite claims "no compatible device" or similar Mar 15 11:57:41 PC Suite works well Mar 15 11:58:13 Mine suggests starting 'maps' once, although I've used it several times. It's obviously not checking for the maps directory/cache properly. Mar 15 11:58:46 Stskeeps: ""Differentiation: Negative, there are probable Nokia patents in there"" - I humbly doubt that's actually the case Mar 15 11:59:09 right, i'm not a patent attorney Mar 15 11:59:18 :P Mar 15 11:59:39 DocScrutinizer: feel free to prove me otherwise in the bug report, my opinion isn't the only valid one :) Mar 15 11:59:54 LOL how could I?? Mar 15 12:00:17 as in, showing that i'm making an assumption, which i will grant, i am :P Mar 15 12:00:31 the idea is to have an honest discusson in the process to move things ahead, so :P Mar 15 12:00:39 just claiming the CC/CV charging of LiPo is prior knowledge, incl all its variations Mar 15 12:00:45 Where do I add/remove repos? Mar 15 12:00:57 just edit the sources.list? Mar 15 12:01:23 DocScrutinizer: :nod: Mar 15 12:02:13 Okay, I'll just do it manually. Mar 15 12:02:14 Stskeeps: I can't prove nonexistence of anything - it's a mission impossible as you may learn from scientific basics Mar 15 12:02:30 :nod: Mar 15 12:02:45 so how could I prove there's no patents inside closed code Mar 15 12:03:02 I just have STRONG doubts Mar 15 12:03:32 Ohh, they call it "application catalogue" Mar 15 12:03:36 yes, that what i'm asking to note in the bug :) Mar 15 12:03:36 way to be inconsistant Mar 15 12:04:18 Stskeeps: *sigh* eventually I might drop a comment Mar 15 12:06:35 http://www.impactlab.com/2010/03/09/nokia-patents-cell-phone-that-recharges-itself-by-harvesting-energy-from-motion Mar 15 12:06:40 missed that Mar 15 12:07:54 looking forward to that if they can get meaningful amounts of power from it Mar 15 12:08:10 I doubt that they ever will. Mar 15 12:08:31 It would require a lot of movement. Mar 15 12:08:57 they could get 'meaningful' amounts of energy, if energy consumption was lowered drastically Mar 15 12:09:08 True Mar 15 12:09:12 I don't really see why not, a single rotary arm in a watch will keep it running forever, if nokia are intending to embed piezoelectric crystals throughout all the spare cavities in the bodies of their phones, that'd be a fairly hefty lifespan increase Mar 15 12:09:35 nidO: The current that a watch draws is measured using something much smaller than "mA" :) Mar 15 12:09:48 ;] Mar 15 12:09:53 lo afb Mar 15 12:10:06 ofc it is, and it's kept charged by a single horridly inefficient rotary arm, not a set of crystals embedded throughout a frame much larger than the watch Mar 15 12:12:11 I could imagine that you'd be able to charge a phone if you're running. Mar 15 12:12:17 or if you shake it Mar 15 12:12:43 they could use a perpetual motion device to extract energy from it Mar 15 12:12:56 hell, i'd be happy if walking/running movement could provide even a reasonable amount of the phone's idle power usage to partially maintain the battery, let alone charge it Mar 15 12:13:38 Right, I'm in: http://lists.maemo.org/pipermail/maemo-community/2010-March/004118.html Mar 15 12:14:08 woop Mar 15 12:14:19 but now i have to decide who to order for, and in which order Mar 15 12:14:20 :P Mar 15 12:14:37 * VDVsx is tempted to paste jaffa's questions in jaffa's email :D hihi Mar 15 12:15:08 how about piezo keyboard switches? Mar 15 12:16:44 VDVsx: feel free ;-) Mar 15 12:17:26 Jaffa, nah, it's your questions, but would be fun :D Mar 15 12:17:51 VDVsx: I *think* I've answered all of them ;-) Mar 15 12:18:03 yeah :) Mar 15 12:18:32 http://www.treehugger.com/files/2007/10/piezoelectric_b.php Mar 15 12:19:05 We're really not talking about major charging energies with those piezoelectric thingies =) Mar 15 12:19:34 But I'm happy if they actually make something feasible out of them. Just sceptical. Mar 15 12:21:20 For african markets it might even make sense Mar 15 12:21:38 "They walk to school, walk to work, walk to the river to fetch water, etc., they don’t need to walk to the man with a car batter strapped to the back of a bicycles, charging for electricity anymore." Mar 15 12:22:50 i'll vote for anyone who will push for stronger moderation at talk.maemo.org Mar 15 12:22:53 :P Mar 15 12:23:12 current state makes the community look like monkeys on crack Mar 15 12:23:19 lol Mar 15 12:24:48 Stskeeps, I whole-heartedly agree. Mar 15 12:25:57 compared to what Stskeeps Mar 15 12:26:22 pupnik_: monkeys on dope, obviously Mar 15 12:26:57 i think to your hopes Mar 15 12:27:09 not to forums in general Mar 15 12:27:31 compared to a anything-goes attitude Mar 15 12:27:31 :P Mar 15 12:27:36 Stskeeps: auto-ban all members with a thanks/posts ratio of less then 0.5? Mar 15 12:27:49 mmmm... Mar 15 12:28:10 Shapeshifter: nah, don't be silly Mar 15 12:28:11 :P Mar 15 12:28:39 i was thinking people visiting troublesome forum users and beating them ;) Mar 15 12:29:41 :D Mar 15 12:29:46 I believe at leat 50% of internet users have the tendency to look like complete idiots (or monkeys on crack) on forums. Mar 15 12:30:05 *least Mar 15 12:32:47 make it 99% when referring to youtube commenter's :D Mar 15 12:34:26 mytube works great on pc btw. lets me uninstall flash Mar 15 12:35:47 okay. got n900 from repair back (pulled out usb connector, you know). they just replaced whole motherboard. Mar 15 12:36:18 yep, no surprise Mar 15 12:36:34 and it took them 4 weeks :/ Mar 15 12:37:02 I had my 6110 Navigator serviced a while back. They changed everything except the camera and the frame. :D Mar 15 12:37:11 Oh and the display Mar 15 12:37:37 And the reason for service was that it was acting funny. Sometimes not ringing at all etc. Mar 15 12:38:16 i have a 6110 navigator too Mar 15 12:38:25 MiXu-, and what did you want them to fix? Mar 15 12:38:32 work like a toilet of a train Mar 15 12:38:52 slonopotamus: The funny behavior. (Not ringing, shutting down by itself, etc) Mar 15 12:39:06 allthough it does sometimes shut down by itself Mar 15 12:39:20 not regularily though Mar 15 12:39:40 Mine got fixed. Doesn't shut down on it's own anymore. Mar 15 12:39:50 Not that I use it much anymore since I have an N900. Mar 15 12:39:59 It's in my car and I use it for navigation only. Mar 15 12:40:00 i use both Mar 15 12:40:18 6110 for actually talking to people, n900 for everything else Mar 15 12:40:34 allthough my n900 is trashed for the moment Mar 15 12:40:49 O_o trashed how? Mar 15 12:40:51 6110 for navigation also Mar 15 12:41:00 much better than n900 Mar 15 12:41:09 Appiah, gave it a bath in a toilet bowl Mar 15 12:41:16 >_> Mar 15 12:41:20 oh god ... Mar 15 12:41:20 I refuse to acknowledge that N900 would even have navigation. Mar 15 12:41:24 Appiah, indeed Mar 15 12:41:26 It's so bad. Mar 15 12:41:30 confusingly they have reused model numbers, the 6110 i remember is a pre-symbian phone :) Mar 15 12:41:45 visz: you could have recovered by immediately removing the battery and gently drying it Mar 15 12:41:45 I only had my n900 for a week now, cant say I'm to happy about the navigation so far Mar 15 12:41:49 jaska: They've been doing that for a while Mar 15 12:41:58 there's also 3110 classic etc. Mar 15 12:42:08 :( Mar 15 12:42:24 DocScrutinizer, or i could have _not_ dropped it Mar 15 12:43:25 visz: actually giving device (disassembled though) a thorough dousche is a method to *fix* certain issues, which I use frequently Mar 15 12:43:52 The Maps on N900 looks and feels like it was designed by someone who's blind and has never seen map software. Mar 15 12:44:00 haptic maps? Mar 15 12:44:25 cool Mar 15 12:44:31 visz: Mar 15 12:56:53 ehm no it dont Mar 15 13:04:57 MiXu-, what a wonderful statement Mar 15 13:04:58 :-D Mar 15 13:05:12 kamui: Have you seen the icons? :D Mar 15 13:05:24 They could as well be in chinese Mar 15 13:06:07 It would -look- impressive, if the performance was good enough. Mar 15 13:06:48 But the logic in the UI eludes me. Mar 15 13:21:09 hi Mar 15 13:22:01 hi Mar 15 13:22:01 hi Mar 15 13:22:07 hi Mar 15 13:22:08 hi Mar 15 13:22:08 hi Mar 15 13:22:08 hi Mar 15 13:22:15 hi Mar 15 13:22:15 hi Mar 15 13:22:16 hi Mar 15 13:22:16 hi Mar 15 13:22:17 hi Mar 15 13:22:17 hi Mar 15 13:22:18 hi Mar 15 13:22:18 hi Mar 15 13:22:19 hi Mar 15 13:22:19 hi Mar 15 13:22:20 sigh Mar 15 13:22:20 hi Mar 15 13:22:21 hi Mar 15 13:22:21 hi Mar 15 13:22:21 hi Mar 15 13:22:21 hi Mar 15 13:22:22 hi Mar 15 13:22:22 retards Mar 15 13:22:58 any op in? Mar 15 13:23:03 yeah Mar 15 13:23:03 yeah Mar 15 13:23:05 me Mar 15 13:23:05 me Mar 15 13:23:10 me Mar 15 13:23:10 me Mar 15 13:23:11 me Mar 15 13:23:11 me Mar 15 13:23:11 me Mar 15 13:23:11 me Mar 15 13:23:12 me Mar 15 13:23:12 me Mar 15 13:23:12 me Mar 15 13:23:12 me Mar 15 13:23:12 me Mar 15 13:23:12 me Mar 15 13:23:14 lol? Mar 15 13:23:16 woo? Mar 15 13:23:30 any1 watch the super bowl? Mar 15 13:23:37 me Mar 15 13:23:44 me Mar 15 13:23:44 fuck yeah bro! Mar 15 13:23:44 me Mar 15 13:23:44 me Mar 15 13:23:45 me Mar 15 13:23:45 me Mar 15 13:23:45 me Mar 15 13:23:45 me Mar 15 13:23:45 me Mar 15 13:23:45 me Mar 15 13:23:45 me Mar 15 13:23:47 was amazing! Mar 15 13:23:59 man i wank over all those large black men running around Mar 15 13:24:27 dash Mar 15 13:24:36 hmm Mar 15 13:24:40 from an artistic perspective the banding effect is quite calming Mar 15 13:25:13 lcuk: lol Mar 15 13:25:47 /mode +q Guest* Mar 15 13:26:41 VDVsx, X-Fade, +b *!~dash*@* .. or just ban *!*@adsl-83-100-232-162.karoo.KCOM.COM and *!*@den-69-171-160-141.evdo.leapwireless.net Mar 15 13:26:44 :P Mar 15 13:26:45 wtf is with the spam? Mar 15 13:26:52 savetheinternet: Yeah yeah. Mar 15 13:27:00 ehm Stskeeps ^^ Mar 15 13:27:03 (that was a very lame attack :P) Mar 15 13:27:32 That was just a lamer, yes. Mar 15 13:27:58 X-Fade: reported to staff already btw Mar 15 13:28:49 hmm, trying http://wiki.maemo.org/Phone_control Mar 15 13:29:00 $ dbus-send --system --type=method_call --dest=com.nokia.mce /com/nokia/mce/requestcom.nokia.mce.request.req_led_pattern_activate string:PatternCommunicationIM Mar 15 13:29:03 Must use org.mydomain.Interface.Method notation, no dot in "string:PatternCommunicationIM" Mar 15 13:29:08 * DocScrutinizer suggests getting dropegg with spammer-autokick Mar 15 13:29:33 what I do wrong? Mar 15 13:34:59 oo Mar 15 13:35:03 spam in the morning Mar 15 13:36:08 napalm Mar 15 13:48:36 Hi. Does anyone get ConIC work correctly in SDK of Maemo5? Mar 15 13:54:52 hi Mar 15 13:55:45 battery saving tip - i am getting same effective range dropping n900 xmit power from 100mw to 10mw Mar 15 13:56:51 Jaffa: i'll send out a reply to your questions today. I need to look into a way to access Mailing Lists from Work. I don't have access to gmail web client here. Mar 15 13:56:57 does that actually save any meaningful amount of power? I thought it is just some regulation type thing for some countries Mar 15 13:57:42 pupnik_: Any you get less than 1% of battery saving with that ;) Mar 15 13:57:51 s/Any/And/ Mar 15 13:57:51 X-Fade meant: pupnik_: And you get less than 1% of battery saving with that ;) Mar 15 13:57:55 ah Mar 15 13:58:03 bummer Mar 15 13:58:24 pupnik_: Nokia knows powersaving. If it mattered, it would have been dynamic or so. Mar 15 13:58:55 woo, moomin on polish tv Mar 15 13:59:20 i will run some tests when i have a lappy again Mar 15 14:00:37 andrewfblack: Cool, thanks. Mar 15 14:00:47 andrewfblack: I'm not as impartial now as I was when I wrote them, though ;-) Mar 15 14:02:07 Jaffa: thats good, now to find a way to access my email from work Mar 15 14:03:51 jaffa, some random community member asked a load of questions to the candidates - have you answered all of them :p Mar 15 14:04:23 jaffa kree! Mar 15 14:04:43 lcuk: I believe I've answered them. Would it be too noisy to restructure my manifesto into the Q&A format? Mar 15 14:05:07 studying for exam is pretty boring if anyone was curious Mar 15 14:05:38 jaffa if everyoneelse is formatting their statments to wrap around your q&a then it makes sense for you to do likewise Mar 15 14:05:46 lcuk: Fair enough Mar 15 14:06:07 Jaffa: your questions scare me! Mar 15 14:07:48 frals: guess you stay home from kth today? :P Mar 15 14:07:54 w00t: In what way? Mar 15 14:08:04 WHAT YOU SAY? Mar 15 14:08:19 Jaffa: kidding, mostly, it was just a lot of text to read at 2am when I first came across them Mar 15 14:08:30 ALL YOU BARSE ARE... Mar 15 14:08:35 (base, too) Mar 15 14:08:36 tybollt: i stayed home until after lunch... best excuse for sleeping in ever ;) Mar 15 14:08:38 tybollt, haha, nice. Mar 15 14:08:43 w00t: :) Mar 15 14:09:43 frals: Did you take it seriously though? I used to work at su.se and we had all sorts of weird shit go on there (like pimps selling hookers on campus etc) but never something like that. Mar 15 14:17:04 This guy --- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mohammed_Reza_Taheri-azar_SUV_attack --- "turned himself in" by parking his SUV next to the house I was living in and calling the cops. Mar 15 14:17:09 X-Fade, ping are you around Mar 15 14:18:09 lcuk: Always. Mar 15 14:21:27 Usually you just rent them. Mar 15 14:21:48 lo, everyone :) Mar 15 14:22:30 tybollt: yeah, wa suppose todo a presentation this morning but postpooned it Mar 15 14:22:41 Has anyone ever experienced getting "Reinstallation of kernel is not possible, it cannot be downloaded." when trying to run apt-get install --reinstall kernel? Mar 15 14:23:44 or well, didnt expect anything to happen but id feel pretty stupid if i went and it ended up happening smth :P Mar 15 14:24:25 derf: there was a story in the newspapers about a van with presumed explosives and stuff in it, that was suspicious, here.... Mar 15 14:24:41 frals: or... if you went and the place was empty due to everyone other than you TAKING it seriously ;) Mar 15 14:24:49 derf: it was seen, but not located, and people were asked to look out for it... Mar 15 14:25:11 Veggen: typical fear mongering Mar 15 14:25:33 ^^ Mar 15 14:25:46 derf: that very day or the day after, I saw a bunch of middle-east-looking men walking in and out of the (very cheap) hairdresser) I usually go to, and iraqui guy... Mar 15 14:26:06 carrying propane bottles and stuff in and out of exactly such a van. Mar 15 14:26:28 Did you do your civic duty? Mar 15 14:26:46 derf: "civil" Mar 15 14:26:57 "civic" is a type of Honda car. Mar 15 14:27:16 civic duty is more accurate.. Mar 15 14:27:19 nah. tho I was pondering for quite a while. But the day after, the case was more or less rolled up to be some other stuff, and not related to him ;) Mar 15 14:27:29 http://www.thefreedictionary.com/civic+duty Mar 15 14:28:09 ;) Mar 15 14:28:37 I still remember everyone here looking for a "white van"... no other more detailed description... during this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beltway_sniper_attacks Mar 15 14:29:18 the Honda civic name came from the late 70s or early 80s Honda CVCC Mar 15 14:29:20 Not only was their vehicle not white, it wasn't a van. Mar 15 14:29:38 cool little cars but underpowered.. Mar 15 14:38:17 God I love nokia. Mar 15 14:38:37 They make a Linux coffee maker, but forbid N900 to have MeeGo >_> Mar 15 14:39:39 ?! did you see any devices running MeeGo yet? did you think maybe it might need quite a lot of work still? :) Mar 15 14:39:46 forbid? Mar 15 14:39:55 Constant Velocity Critical Control? Mar 15 14:40:34 LuciusMare: HUH? Mar 15 14:41:19 Well, at least not officially Mar 15 14:41:38 and unofficially ? Mar 15 14:41:40 ;) Mar 15 14:41:48 Heh Mar 15 14:42:16 Well, there is always this posibility Mar 15 14:42:52 I seem to recall a statement like "N900 is reference platform for meego" Mar 15 14:43:23 he's probably referring to this: http://asia.cnet.com/crave/2010/03/15/nokia-n900-not-upgradeable-to-meego/ Mar 15 14:46:58 N900 should not get Moogo ... Mar 15 14:47:09 why not? Mar 15 14:47:21 gives me a reason to buy a new device :D Mar 15 14:47:29 :O Mar 15 14:47:44 can i have your n900 for free then? Mar 15 14:47:44 :P Mar 15 14:47:47 lol Mar 15 14:47:55 xD Mar 15 14:48:12 I wonder how will the meego turn out Mar 15 14:48:23 VDVsx: it's amazing that people listen to an article on cnet over a blog from one of the guys on the TSG.. Mar 15 14:48:24 i hope it will be better then moblin Mar 15 14:48:42 well ""Maemo on Nokia N900 is not upgradeable to MeeGo" sounds just about inherently correct statement Mar 15 14:48:44 I hope it'll have a usable media player Mar 15 14:48:53 DocScrutinizer: SSU'ing to MeeGo is insane though Mar 15 14:49:13 SSU? Mar 15 14:49:27 DocScrutinizer: well opensuse i7 s not upgradeable to debian squeeze also :o Mar 15 14:49:28 w00t: I got from a "local" blog, it is trustable, and i found also the cnet article, so i didnt search more, even because i kinda expected it Mar 15 14:49:31 *7 Mar 15 14:49:37 click a item in your application manager to update to meego Mar 15 14:49:53 w00t, and without any source(like a VP, Manager), like Nokia told us , who's Nokia ? :D Mar 15 14:49:53 LuciusMare: http://meego.com/community/blogs/valhalla/2010/towards-day-one Mar 15 14:49:59 VDVsx: exactly Mar 15 14:50:00 summel: so what? Mar 15 14:50:09 VDVsx: they spoke to NOKLA instead Mar 15 14:50:10 i want meamo/meego/iphoneos/android quadboot! :P Mar 15 14:50:14 lolol Mar 15 14:50:15 summel: isn't that exactly what I said? Mar 15 14:50:32 summel: you forgot ubuntu Mar 15 14:50:37 DocScrutinizer: yes :) and its just logical that is not possible to upgrade from one distribution to another Mar 15 14:50:41 LuciusMare: ewww :O Mar 15 14:50:42 summel, don't forget winmo, BBOS, and S60! Mar 15 14:50:48 * VDVsx asks Qwerty12 about Meego in the Nokla devices Mar 15 14:50:49 yay S60 Mar 15 14:50:50 Arif_: MSDOS! Mar 15 14:50:56 yay Mar 15 14:50:56 s60 could be possible :) Mar 15 14:51:04 Stskeeps, that's also false, Nokla will run meego ;) Mar 15 14:51:07 S60v5, Symbian^3, Symbian^4! Mar 15 14:51:14 * LuciusMare pants at the idea of having original UNIX on his n900 Mar 15 14:51:15 all one one device! Mar 15 14:51:22 android already works afaik Mar 15 14:51:30 openDarwin :O Mar 15 14:51:35 ORLY? Mar 15 14:51:36 who wants android? Mar 15 14:51:39 Oh, well... :) Mar 15 14:51:49 LuciusMare: impossible Mar 15 14:51:53 well Mar 15 14:51:58 android has more games..:D Mar 15 14:52:11 * w00t burns Arif_ with fire Mar 15 14:52:18 i dont like android Mar 15 14:52:23 * Arif_ 's already hot :P Mar 15 14:52:39 Me neither, but it seems to be spreaded more than maemo/meego Mar 15 14:52:52 At least its not winmo, it is still linux :) Mar 15 14:52:56 why settle for second best? Mar 15 14:52:59 neither are Linux really Mar 15 14:53:02 just Linux-based Mar 15 14:53:22 Heh Mar 15 14:53:34 It's still UN*X. Mar 15 14:53:42 lets port Win7 to the N900! Mar 15 14:53:42 I don't know a single modern handheld device that real Linux can run on :/ Mar 15 14:53:49 * LuciusMare stabs Arif_ Mar 15 14:53:51 let's lynch Arif_ Mar 15 14:53:54 :D Mar 15 14:54:04 so much hate for mikrofost :( Mar 15 14:54:15 Also, i wonder how can you *port* something closed-source Mar 15 14:54:20 Unless you work at MS, ofc :) Mar 15 14:54:26 LuciusMare: emulators Mar 15 14:54:29 see b-man|laptop Mar 15 14:54:41 Emulation != porting Mar 15 14:54:43 luke-jr: me does Mar 15 14:54:51 DocScrutinizer: ??? Mar 15 14:54:55 luke-jr: it's called freerunner Mar 15 14:55:09 DocScrutinizer: key word "modern" Mar 15 14:55:18 DocScrutinizer: Freerunner is at least a generation obsolete now Mar 15 14:55:24 luke-jr: definition please Mar 15 14:55:38 DocScrutinizer: Cortex-A8 or newer Mar 15 14:55:50 256 MB RAM minimum Mar 15 14:56:04 luke-jr: how come? N900 is ARM, so with a little tweaking, it should be able... Mar 15 14:56:09 whatever Mar 15 14:56:16 as long as it plays my pr0n in HD Mar 15 14:56:18 I'm good Mar 15 14:56:22 it doesn't! Mar 15 14:56:34 It doesn't!? outrageous! Mar 15 14:56:36 LOL Mar 15 14:56:40 XD Mar 15 14:56:49 you must convert it to stamp size files! Mar 15 14:56:57 How deep thoughts... Mar 15 14:57:05 'pr0n' should be illegal Mar 15 14:57:50 luke-jr: dude, IT IS Mar 15 14:58:47 Go to Koala Lumpur and read a pr0n mag on the sidewalk... or saudi arabia by all means.. Mar 15 15:00:00 lcuk: Manifesto restructured and questions answered :-p Mar 15 15:19:45 Shapeshifter: expired "once" events not removed Mar 15 15:20:11 Shapeshifter: dunno if that's a flaw or a feature Mar 15 15:49:03 are there any news about the SDK's? can't install the one for maemo5 and maemo4, but need them to work.. Mar 15 15:49:10 wanna help? Mar 15 15:49:49 or do you have any solution for downloading the rootstrap for diablo? Mar 15 15:50:02 this isn't working atm Mar 15 15:52:06 * satmd dropped all mail accounts on his n900 and made his server forward subject lines via jabber Mar 15 15:53:37 thopiekar, why can't you install them? Mar 15 15:53:59 satmd, interesting idea :) Mar 15 15:54:00 satmd: webmailer ;-P Mar 15 15:57:43 andre__: can't install the maemo4 sdk because the rootstrap can'T be installed and the maemo5 sdk can't be installed because a package is missing in apt... Mar 15 15:57:55 and the package is? Mar 15 15:58:05 is this a known issue / filed bug? Mar 15 15:58:25 theme-config Mar 15 15:58:29 dunno Mar 15 15:59:27 ...or a talk.maemo.org thread? Mar 15 15:59:30 thopiekar, is it missing because of random network problem Mar 15 15:59:35 well, issues don't magically vanish ;-) Mar 15 15:59:44 or because of real actual missing gone not available from anywhere kind of problem Mar 15 16:00:13 so, lcuk, how to fix? Mar 15 16:00:30 andre__: sometimes they do ;-D Mar 15 16:00:42 thopiekar, retry Mar 15 16:00:57 unlessyou know its a specific problem Mar 15 16:01:18 because people can generally still do both Mar 15 16:01:32 unless you are the first to try either and now have found a new problme Mar 15 16:01:35 http://maemo.org/packages/package_instance/view/fremantle_extras-testing_free_armel/mdbus2/2.0.0-3/ anyone? Mar 15 16:02:00 hrw: huh? Mar 15 16:02:29 DocScrutinizer: hunting for thumbupers Mar 15 16:02:41 ohh, of course!! Mar 15 16:03:35 hrw does it use the shell icon thing that was posted around recently Mar 15 16:03:43 ERROR: Scratchbox is not properly set up! -- o.O?! Mar 15 16:03:52 im sure some additional stuff was indicated to highlight console apps Mar 15 16:04:06 lcuk: it does not iirc - was produced before that stuff appeared Mar 15 16:04:12 Jaffa, can you recall where the console app support page was Mar 15 16:04:22 yeah hrw Mar 15 16:04:31 ok didnt know if you knew Mar 15 16:04:40 * DocScrutinizer curses multiple account mess :-(( Mar 15 16:05:21 what the hell is now not properly set up?! Mar 15 16:05:57 lcuk: Hang on, got it to hand Mar 15 16:06:13 there is even no verbose or debug mode for additional output.. all packages are installed.. Mar 15 16:06:31 lcuk: http://wiki.maemo.org/Extras-testing/Command_line_applications Mar 15 16:07:13 heh thanks jaffa Mar 15 16:07:18 I will add those bloody icon in next version of package. but I will not make new package just for icon Mar 15 16:07:21 and "register" button even is dead. coooool :-S Mar 15 16:07:25 would it be doubly evil to remove command line apps from ham altogether ;) Mar 15 16:07:42 hrw i know im just jesting i wasnt sure whrether there was anything else Mar 15 16:08:04 "to install command line utilities you must use the command line" Mar 15 16:11:18 * javispedro is now, for some reason, running for the council :) Mar 15 16:11:44 lcuk: networking is in comparison to yesterday faster, but theme-config is still not available.. Mar 15 16:12:56 javispedro: Rock on. Mar 15 16:13:09 GAN900 needs to run and then I can see an ideal lineup :) Mar 15 16:15:09 Hopefully with some more n900-era nominees; I wouldn't want to be the greenest newbie candidate :) Mar 15 16:15:18 jaffa good job this isnt real elections, you cant be a media mogul and counciller at same time in real life afaik :p Mar 15 16:15:33 garage JS is pretty fucked up. Konqueror goes nuts, asking two time "save password for this page" and none of both works... etc Mar 15 16:16:04 javispedro, you have a technical background and desire to make the most of hte hardware past and present Mar 15 16:16:48 thopiekar, :S i dunno Mar 15 16:16:51 *future* Mar 15 16:17:05 "page 6ef50c66221c11dfb170b731e256a4dca4dc has been commented by Marcin Juszkiewicz (hrw)" - can someone fix maemo.org website to give *INFO* not crap? Mar 15 16:17:15 yes please Mar 15 16:17:25 those sha1sums in subject lines are pretty silly Mar 15 16:17:32 lolwut? Mar 15 16:17:48 and midgard-permalink stuff is next crap Mar 15 16:18:09 mgedmin, those urls are important Mar 15 16:18:23 its just as important as knowing the ip address lol Mar 15 16:18:26 note that I plan to make one of my council campaign promises to try to get as many top maemo.org applications as possible in transifex Mar 15 16:18:36 link to page: http://maemo.org/midcom-permalink-SOMECRAPWHICHWILLENDINNSFWOROTHERCRAPWHICHYOUDONOTKNOWANDWILLNOTKNOWUNTILCLICK Mar 15 16:18:37 hrw: I remeber someone asking for help desparately as he gave a thumb-up to his own package, and for this was somewhat locked out from his own project Mar 15 16:19:17 DocScrutinizer: factor in that to demote your project you have to thumb down it and you have some real fun Mar 15 16:19:25 s/down it/it down Mar 15 16:19:26 DocScrutinizer: thumbing up your own package is okay. Doing it through fake accounts isn't Mar 15 16:19:28 DocScrutinizer: so far I do not care too much will my pacakge be available for users or not Mar 15 16:20:02 well maybe I got something wrong Mar 15 16:20:12 just thought I'd mention it Mar 15 16:20:13 DocScrutinizer: so far I decided to end development of my not-even-released-as-binary app for maemo Mar 15 16:20:38 Hello all ! Mar 15 16:21:19 lcuk: Doesn't seem to have hindered Berlosconi! However, hopefully MWKN is suitably distributed that such shenanigans won't be possible. Mar 15 16:21:39 lcuk: However, next issue will have subliminal Vote Jaffa text. Mar 15 16:21:57 nahhh Mar 15 16:22:03 you need web 2.0 server side blink ;) Mar 15 16:22:06 MWKN already sounds like some politic debates network Mar 15 16:22:26 sorry, 2.1 Mar 15 16:22:27 http://cheese.blartwendo.com/web21-demo.html Mar 15 16:23:10 a few of these "2.1 " would be enough to destroy all bandwidth and human civilization Mar 15 16:23:12 http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y282/hypno-toad/hypnotoad.jpg Mar 15 16:23:29 is what i think of with subliminal advertising Mar 15 16:23:31 lcuk: you mean http://r33b.net/ Mar 15 16:24:18 wow Jaffa, that site is fant ALL GLORY TO THE HYPOTOAD! Mar 15 16:24:25 :D Mar 15 16:34:14 @.@ Mar 15 16:35:53 see? I-hate-the-N900 posts come in batches to tmo. Mar 15 16:39:53 javispedro: surprised? Mar 15 16:40:27 people watched commercials which told them how great n900 phone is and they got something other Mar 15 16:41:28 they didn't got a n900? =) Mar 15 16:41:46 the problem is that they got n900 Mar 15 16:41:54 instead of promised great phone Mar 15 16:45:53 ah, seems like the Maemo Silverlight client is no longer in the works Mar 15 16:46:16 (if it ever was I leave as an exercise to the reader) Mar 15 16:46:37 hehe Mar 15 16:47:03 javispedro: Going for the MeeGo client instead? Mar 15 16:47:17 * slonopotamus kicks zyb.com for not sending sms with settings Mar 15 16:47:19 they dropped the symbian client from their download center so I guess not Mar 15 16:47:34 maybe they're going for iphone instead :P Mar 15 16:48:21 javispedro: Awww; source? Mar 15 16:48:46 http://www.google.com/search?q=Silverlight+symbian+site%3Amicrosoft.com Mar 15 16:48:53 if the first result is the MS download page, click it Mar 15 16:50:25 well it was available and got pulled, cant imagine that after finally getting it ready they make it available then just ditch it entirely, probably someone overeagre putting it online before waiting for the big PR event Mar 15 16:50:50 maybe they don't want symbian phones to get all the hot and exclusive silverlight content like... (does anyone actually use silverlight?) Mar 15 16:50:59 nidO: what was available and got pulled?? Mar 15 16:51:05 nidO: yes, that's a valid point Mar 15 16:51:10 silverlight for s60 Mar 15 16:51:12 google cache says it was put on the 9th Mar 15 16:51:14 tybollt - the silverlight client for s60 Mar 15 16:51:26 is silverlight - at all - important? Mar 15 16:51:34 (it isn't needed. same as adobe air) Mar 15 16:51:39 it is to microsoft Mar 15 16:51:41 silverlight is next to useless Mar 15 16:51:49 I find microsoft shoving it down my throat - not once did I actually need it though Mar 15 16:52:00 only place I saw it was on TRT's streaming site Mar 15 16:52:12 :D Mar 15 16:52:33 the winter olympics was streamed with silverlight Mar 15 16:52:48 Arif_, why not just stream wmv directly if you're on ms-side? Mar 15 16:53:10 it was an alternative to wmv streams Mar 15 16:53:11 =} Mar 15 16:53:17 wmv only doesn't allow you to do funky stuff like flash does (ads etc.) Mar 15 16:53:40 * Arif_ uses whatevers available :) Mar 15 16:54:05 Arif_, yeah, but every windoze box has wmv support. but it doesn't have silverlight. Mar 15 16:54:09 but most web streaming is done with flash, silverlight will always be a niche Mar 15 16:54:25 slonopotamus, thats why I think its useless Mar 15 16:54:36 * slonopotamus kicks zyb.com again Mar 15 16:54:40 Let's hope HTLM5 video will get sane at some point. Mar 15 16:55:06 yeah, we'll get google and moozilla fighting over the codec :( Mar 15 16:55:25 X-Fade: it will not Mar 15 16:55:38 X-Fade: as video is inherently busted. Mar 15 16:55:52 Arif_, i fail to see why they can't just stream to ffmpeg _whatever_ they're given in