**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Fri Apr 02 02:59:57 2010
Apr 02 04:45:52 * RST38h yawns widely
Apr 02 04:46:03 * derf inserts a cat into the void.
Apr 02 04:46:13 <Ken-Young>   
Apr 02 04:46:56 <RST38h> moo derf
Apr 02 04:47:58 <RST38h> Gizmodo seems to have gone absolute bonkers about iPad. Not sure if it is still worth keeping in the rss feed =)
Apr 02 04:48:39 <Ken-Young> I've yet to see a bad review of the iPad by someone who actually used it.
Apr 02 04:49:02 <RST38h> Those get shot by Apple's ninja commandos
Apr 02 04:56:19 <RST38h> ...in related news, Saudis are beheading a popular Lebanese TV figure, for *sorcery*.
Apr 02 04:58:32 <Ken-Young> RST38h, Yeah, I saw that.   Apparently he made predictions about the future on TV.
Apr 02 04:58:56 <Ken-Young> He said pr1.2 would be out tomorrow.
Apr 02 04:59:25 <RST38h> Well he is a shitty fortune teller if he has gone to Saudi Arabia...
Apr 02 04:59:42 <Ken-Young> He was on a religious pilgrimage.
Apr 02 04:59:57 <Ken-Young> SOme sort of demi-haaj.
Apr 02 05:00:29 <RST38h> Oh, he has sacrificed himself to the Allah!
Apr 02 05:00:36 <RST38h> Awesome.
Apr 02 05:24:27 <crashanddie> Ken-Young: I have to say I wouldn't mind having one in the living room
Apr 02 05:24:39 <crashanddie> Ken-Young: it is quite a social device in the end
Apr 02 05:24:47 <Ken-Young> crashanddie, You mean an iPad?
Apr 02 05:24:50 <crashanddie> aye
Apr 02 05:25:00 <crashanddie> not a beheaded saudi tv figure
Apr 02 05:25:08 <Ken-Young> Yes, I'm planning on getting one for my mother.
Apr 02 05:25:27 <Ken-Young> (iPad, not beheaded TV journalist)
Apr 02 05:25:47 <crashanddie> "Happy Birthday mom" <drop corpse>
Apr 02 05:26:15 <crashanddie> I mean, it's not expensive, I don't care about 3G or tons of storage -- everything is on the wifi anyway
Apr 02 05:26:20 <RST38h> one gadget too many
Apr 02 05:26:23 <crashanddie> it's just a device to easily access contextual information
Apr 02 05:26:48 <RST38h> it is a devic for consuming iTunes content
Apr 02 05:26:57 <Ken-Young> RST38h, Only if you don't drop a gadget.
Apr 02 05:27:02 <crashanddie> no need to turn on the whole projector/soundsystem, no need to go to the computer room, and a screen large enough to share with friends
Apr 02 05:27:02 <RST38h> not interested in iTunes.
Apr 02 05:27:41 <Ken-Young> Those of us on IRC are not the intended market.
Apr 02 05:27:46 <Surfa> i can' figure out a single thing that could be done conveniently with ipad
Apr 02 05:28:06 <Surfa> simply energonomic apple junk.. again
Apr 02 05:28:14 <Surfa> unergonomic
Apr 02 05:28:17 <ptl_wants_PR12> me too
Apr 02 05:28:34 <Ken-Young> Surfa, I'm sure it offers a nicer web browsing experience than any phone, including our beloved Nokias.
Apr 02 05:28:34 <ptl_wants_PR12> the worst part is knowing that all this  buzz is just because it's apple
Apr 02 05:28:52 <ptl_wants_PR12> if it were another company, no one would pay that amount of lip service
Apr 02 05:28:57 <Surfa> i can browse with other devices if i want to
Apr 02 05:28:58 <ptl_wants_PR12> nobody would care actually
Apr 02 05:28:59 <Ken-Young> ptl_wants_PR12, No argument there.
Apr 02 05:29:23 <Surfa> ipad i by no means mobile device
Apr 02 05:29:27 <Surfa> is
Apr 02 05:29:45 <Surfa> too big and too uncomfy
Apr 02 05:29:51 <Ken-Young> Surfa, It is if you carry a pocket book, like many women do.
Apr 02 05:30:11 <Surfa> there's limit in them too
Apr 02 05:30:31 <Ken-Young> It'll fit in my mom's pocket book, which borders on gym-bag size.
Apr 02 05:30:35 <Surfa> even that they appear to have infinite storage amount, they don't
Apr 02 05:31:07 <crashanddie> Surfa: pictures is one
Apr 02 05:31:16 <crashanddie> Surfa: browsing through pictures -- that is
Apr 02 05:31:21 <Ken-Young> Surfa, Apparently the battery life is quite long.   It would be a fun thing to have on a plane.
Apr 02 05:31:37 <Ken-Young> Laptops are miserable if you don't fly first class.
Apr 02 05:31:47 <crashanddie> Ken-Young: depends what kind of laptop :P
Apr 02 05:32:06 <Surfa> i prefer reading a book on a plane
Apr 02 05:32:19 <Surfa> much easier than electronic devices
Apr 02 05:32:21 <crashanddie> Ken-Young: I've yet to find a long haul where the stewardess didn't allow me to charge my laptop (even if it means giving it away for an hour or two)
Apr 02 05:32:42 <crashanddie> Surfa: I really imagine having an iPad on my coffee table in the living room
Apr 02 05:32:59 <crashanddie> I know a lot of you don't spend time with human beings in the living room, but still
Apr 02 05:33:26 <Surfa> hey, there is a reason why tablets didn't make break through last time
Apr 02 05:33:37 <Surfa> have you forgot it already?
Apr 02 05:33:47 <crashanddie> you're in a channel that promotes tablets
Apr 02 05:33:50 <Ken-Young> It's not just the battery life.   On a US domestic flight, there just isn't enough room to use a laptop in coach comfortable.   Not even a netbook.
Apr 02 05:34:00 <crashanddie> Ken-Young: really?
Apr 02 05:34:02 <crashanddie> wow
Apr 02 05:34:07 <Surfa> really?
Apr 02 05:34:27 <Ken-Young> crashanddie, Gosh yes.   US domestic flying has become torture.
Apr 02 05:34:28 <crashanddie> I don't remember that last time I was flying from LAX to TFW
Apr 02 05:34:31 <RST38h> iPad is bigger than a pocket book
Apr 02 05:34:39 <Surfa> i can't see how ipad fans are related to meego :)
Apr 02 05:34:46 <RST38h> It restricts the kind of content you can watch
Apr 02 05:34:50 <crashanddie> Surfa: wrong channel
Apr 02 05:34:57 <crashanddie> Surfa: #meego, this is #maemo
Apr 02 05:35:17 <crashanddie> Surfa: but yes, the N8x0 were tablets, the N900 is essentially a tablet
Apr 02 05:35:30 <Surfa> but anyway, i've seen better tablets too.. ipad is something with wonder steves wonderpowder
Apr 02 05:35:32 <crashanddie> they're portable, self contained units
Apr 02 05:35:33 <RST38h> The battery life is like in a subnotebook, but less than in N900
Apr 02 05:35:44 <crashanddie> RST38h: you don't know that
Apr 02 05:35:54 <crashanddie> RST38h: most people don't even know what the battery life of the N900 is
Apr 02 05:36:04 <RST38h> crashanddie: Gizmodo fanatics report 8.5 hours
Apr 02 05:36:14 <RST38h> crashanddie: I do.
Apr 02 05:36:15 <crashanddie> of continuous usage?
Apr 02 05:36:17 <Ken-Young> Surfa, Yes, but the hype-magic is real.   I don't think you can deny that both the iPod and iPhone revolutionized their niches.
Apr 02 05:36:24 <Surfa> n900 is not comparable to ipad imo
Apr 02 05:36:30 <MiXu-> battery life@depends on a million things
Apr 02 05:36:34 <RST38h> crashanddie: 10 hours of reading books and playing a few games
Apr 02 05:36:37 <Surfa> it has keypad that makes the ux much better
Apr 02 05:36:37 <crashanddie> Surfa: and I don't think anyone said such a thing
Apr 02 05:36:46 <MiXu-> widgets on desktop have a huge effect
Apr 02 05:36:54 <RST38h> crashanddie: 15 hours in normal daily usage
Apr 02 05:37:16 <RST38h> crashanddi: something like 24-30 hours with all networking off
Apr 02 05:37:23 <crashanddie> RST38h: seems reasonable to me -- again, I don't believe it would be used for continuous usage
Apr 02 05:37:58 <Surfa> crashhandie,so it's better keep those devices out of this discussion :P
Apr 02 05:38:04 <MiXu-> I get about 30 hours in my use
Apr 02 05:38:38 <Surfa> if you want to be constantly staring your n900 of course it drains battery
Apr 02 05:38:39 <MiXu-> email checking and weather widget are the ones that use network
Apr 02 05:39:22 <Surfa> i've seeen many people that have more than 48h battery lifetime in their typical use
Apr 02 05:39:45 <Surfa> it's just how much you want too see what's happening around you
Apr 02 05:41:07 <RST38h> correct
Apr 02 05:41:10 <Surfa> but for the ipad still.. I still don't see it anything else than oversized ipod touch
Apr 02 05:41:16 <RST38h> a movie will drain n900 battery in 3.5-5 hours
Apr 02 05:41:17 <Ken-Young> Is it possible for an app on the N900 to specify to the OS that it domped up even if the app goes CPU bound?es not want the CPU speed to be bu
Apr 02 05:41:47 <Ken-Young> oops
Apr 02 05:42:31 <Ken-Young> Is it possible for an app on the N900 to specify to the OS that it does not want the  CPU speed to be bumped up even if the app goes CPU bound?es not want the CPU speed to be bu
Apr 02 05:43:07 <Ken-Young> Sorry about my poor typing.   I'm on an unfamiliar keyboard.
Apr 02 05:47:24 <crashanddie> Surfa: please don't tell me what to keep or not keep in a discussion
Apr 02 05:47:33 <crashanddie> FYI, I'm the abusive operator here
Apr 02 05:48:12 <Stskeeps> uhm, a bit of power tripping there crashanddie?
Apr 02 05:48:31 <crashanddie> not power tripping, just saying things as they
Apr 02 05:48:37 <crashanddie> are
Apr 02 05:48:49 <Stskeeps> statements like that don't really cause a sane discussion environment.
Apr 02 05:48:49 <crashanddie> (that wasn't a dramatic pause, just forgot a word)
Apr 02 05:49:07 <crashanddie> I don't think IRC ever was sane
Apr 02 05:49:13 <MiXu-> Ken-Young: afaik what you're asking is not possible. It's possible to force cpu freq upwards, but not down.
Apr 02 05:49:30 <Stskeeps> operator powers should be for removing abusive users, not be an abusive operator.
Apr 02 05:49:45 <Ken-Young> MiXu-, I was hoping it was possible to tell the OS not to change the CPU speed at all.
Apr 02 05:49:55 <crashanddie> Stskeeps: and abusive have I been?
Apr 02 05:50:02 <crashanddie> like, immediately?
Apr 02 05:50:19 <crashanddie> I know I've been abusive previously, which is why I told the guy not to tell me what to do
Apr 02 05:50:34 <Ken-Young> MiXu-, But thanks for the info.
Apr 02 05:50:35 <Stskeeps> crashanddie: it seemed more like a threat.
Apr 02 05:50:44 <crashanddie> nha
Apr 02 05:51:08 <Stskeeps> well then.
Apr 02 05:51:16 <MiXu-> Ken-Young: the last time I tried the setting was not respected. Eg. I was able to set cpu to 125MHz but when load increased, it goues up.
Apr 02 05:51:17 <crashanddie> more like a sign "Rocks may fall off cliff"
Apr 02 05:51:44 <Ken-Young> MiXu-, OK, that's what I needed to know.
Apr 02 05:51:51 <MiXu-> yup
Apr 02 05:55:58 <rmrfchik> hey ya
Apr 02 05:56:02 <rmrfchik> wazzup
Apr 02 05:56:32 <thresh> whaaaaazuuuuuuuuup
Apr 02 06:08:32 <Surfa> FF
Apr 02 06:09:40 <Surfa> crashanddie, ok? should i be worried or what now?
Apr 02 06:10:55 <Surfa> i just can't see how it's reasonable to talk about cheese and sausages at the same time if you want to keep the conversation in hands
Apr 02 06:12:06 <timeless> anyone here have time to install a web server on :80 on their n900?
Apr 02 06:13:49 <crashanddie> timeless: what does the port have to do with the installation time?
Apr 02 06:15:01 <crashanddie> Surfa: my point was only that the discussions in #maemo are seriously broad, I don't recall anyone being removed for being off-topic to be honest. Saying that "tablets didn't work last time" is a narrow-minded and stupid statement, especially considering that you're in #maemo, which is a channel that has been promoting tablets for the past 5 years
Apr 02 06:15:04 <timeless> crashanddie: there shoudl be a hard coded hack which is aware of only well, the default portd
Apr 02 06:17:02 <timeless> crashanddie: tmee is that i'm in  ahurry to leave for a while
Apr 02 06:17:13 <timeless> and won't be back until sunday and then only for a bit
Apr 02 06:17:35 <SpeedEvil> why MiXu- IIRC setting max_cpu_goverfnor_speed or something in /sys worked
Apr 02 06:17:54 <SpeedEvil> timeless, wave.
Apr 02 06:18:19 <timeless> ? hi?
Apr 02 06:18:28 <stuffwork> hi
Apr 02 06:18:55 <SpeedEvil> errordeveloper, you said you were leaving.
Apr 02 06:19:01 <SpeedEvil>  err,
Apr 02 06:19:39 <stuffwork> guys anyone tried that extra decoder application, it still doesnt play flv after installation in mplayer.
Apr 02 06:19:53 <crashanddie> timeless: just opened a socket on 80 in python
Apr 02 06:19:55 <crashanddie> timeless: no problems
Apr 02 06:20:08 <timeless> crashanddie: go offline, disable autoconnect (change to prompt)
Apr 02 06:20:18 <timeless> close the web browser. open it and try to load http://localhost/
Apr 02 06:20:22 <Surfa> crashanddie, ok, so you just have missed the whole point of my line :)
Apr 02 06:21:03 <timeless> (probally best to have your python script print: 200 OK\r\n\\rnhi or somethingo
Apr 02 06:21:12 * timeless is typing on a high latency link
Apr 02 06:21:14 <crashanddie> aye
Apr 02 06:21:49 <timeless> basically: does the web browser actually prompt you for a network? or does it just load the page?
Apr 02 06:23:23 <stuffwork> and i tried to install grease monkey webaddon that didnt work either.
Apr 02 06:23:53 <stuffwork> it didnt appear in browser addon at all
Apr 02 06:24:28 <stuffwork> even though it clearly shows installed in application manager
Apr 02 06:27:01 <stuffwork> anyone
Apr 02 06:27:33 <timeless> file a bug against the greasemonkey packager
Apr 02 06:27:57 <stuffwork> what about extra decoders then
Apr 02 06:28:07 <timeless> patience?
Apr 02 06:28:18 <stuffwork> ok
Apr 02 06:28:21 <timeless> it's 9:30am for some people, and it's the middle of the night for others?
Apr 02 06:28:21 <timeless> it's 8:30am here
Apr 02 06:28:28 <timeless> and i want to go be a tourist
Apr 02 06:28:33 <crashanddie> timeless: yup, got the GET / HTTP 1.1
Apr 02 06:28:52 <crashanddie> timeless: with wifi and 3g disconnected
Apr 02 06:29:58 <crashanddie> timeless: it's 16:40 here
Apr 02 06:30:02 <crashanddie> err, 16:30
Apr 02 06:30:06 <timeless> alright
Apr 02 06:30:31 <crashanddie> want me to pastebin it?
Apr 02 06:30:33 <timeless> thanks
Apr 02 06:30:49 <timeless> nah, if you want to comment in 1767 indicating that it works that's ok
Apr 02 06:31:01 <crashanddie> #1767
Apr 02 06:31:02 <timeless> qgil is slightly confused and could be straightened out (w/ effort)
Apr 02 06:31:06 <crashanddie> bug #1767
Apr 02 06:31:07 <povbot> Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1767 Not able to connect to "localhost" while offline/disconnected
Apr 02 06:31:22 <stuffwork> this sucks n900 is awesome but it lacks features, cant even video call using skype or gtlk and there is no msn messnger either officialy from nokia wtf!!!!
Apr 02 06:31:59 <stuffwork> no news about next fw or its features.
Apr 02 06:32:04 <Surfa> that's why we have open source
Apr 02 06:32:22 <Surfa> you're free and encouraged to contribute
Apr 02 06:32:55 <stuffwork> i know no jack about programmin
Apr 02 06:33:16 <crashanddie> stuffwork: MSN messenger is proprietary protocol
Apr 02 06:33:37 <crashanddie> stuffwork: the reason Skype works is because Skype provided the implementation on the N900/n8x0
Apr 02 06:33:49 <crashanddie> and the reason GTalk works is because it's an open protocol (jabber)
Apr 02 06:34:00 <crashanddie> get MSN to publish their protocol specifications, and you'll have your client
Apr 02 06:34:19 <timeless> video call is coming in 1.2
Apr 02 06:34:25 <timeless> which is being tested /now/
Apr 02 06:34:37 <Surfa> ..or just use plugins that are in repos..
Apr 02 06:34:52 <Surfa> or amsn or whatever
Apr 02 06:35:03 <Tobarja> timeless: i just stepped in so i might have missed it, but 1.2 of what?
Apr 02 06:35:10 <stuffwork> now that is a good news, ain it ..... finally something to look forward to.
Apr 02 06:35:23 <Surfa> Tobarja, pr1.2 for n900
Apr 02 06:35:34 <timeless> did you miss the part where i said i want to play tourist?
Apr 02 06:35:34 <timeless> *my n900 is alarming now)
Apr 02 06:35:57 <Stskeeps> have fun
Apr 02 06:36:07 <Surfa> timeless, it's time to be offline as it happens
Apr 02 06:36:24 <Surfa> there must be switch that turns off your network connection :P
Apr 02 06:36:50 <timeless> bye
Apr 02 06:37:07 <openstandards> stuffwork, msn = evil protocol and theres 3 different ways of handling msn on the n900
Apr 02 06:37:27 <stuffwork> the reason im not using repo sw cuz what if they got some stupid command hidden to copy all yr info and send to creators email address or keylogger stuff such as for msn and next thing u know yr effed.
Apr 02 06:37:59 <openstandards> lmao
Apr 02 06:38:13 <Stskeeps> .. :P
Apr 02 06:38:39 <openstandards> its now the 2nd not the 1st may i point that out
Apr 02 06:38:48 <Stskeeps> 1st april, too
Apr 02 06:38:55 <Surfa> stuffwork, :D perhaps n900 is totally wrong device for you then?
Apr 02 06:39:24 <pgas> maybe his n900 shows him the wrong date too
Apr 02 06:39:32 <openstandards> sounds like he'd be better off with a windows mobile device
Apr 02 06:40:05 <Stskeeps> stuffwork: same kind of problem with any software, at some point you just have to trust it
Apr 02 06:40:06 <openstandards> if he wants msn that badly then a microsoft product would be better
Apr 02 06:40:12 <Surfa> but you can run 3rd party programs on winmo devices too?
Apr 02 06:40:55 <openstandards> Surfa, clearly doesn't care about running other stuff...
Apr 02 06:41:31 <Surfa> sure, but i thought that some rich feature phone would be better :)
Apr 02 06:41:55 <Surfa> with no practical possibilities to run anything outside the box
Apr 02 06:42:41 <openstandards> Surfa, why not i'm sure winmo has some sort of sdk to it
Apr 02 06:43:17 <Surfa> mm yes, but i thought that opposite was desired?
Apr 02 06:43:36 <openstandards> what do you mean?
Apr 02 06:43:43 <crashanddie> timeless: updated bug #1767
Apr 02 06:43:43 <povbot> Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1767 Not able to connect to "localhost" while offline/disconnected
Apr 02 06:44:05 <Surfa> never mind
Apr 02 06:44:22 <bullet`> this web base client seems nice
Apr 02 06:45:11 <crashanddie> stuffwork: you do realise that there is a QA process, and that most software is open source, right?
Apr 02 06:47:15 <stuffwork> nope i didnt know that, but qa panel consist of nokia officially appointed members or just community fellas.
Apr 02 06:47:54 <crashanddie> community "members"
Apr 02 06:48:32 <stuffwork> thats sucks hard then .... doent it
Apr 02 06:48:34 <crashanddie> stuffwork: put your N900 on eBay, you'll get a decent price for it. Next time, do some research before buying something. Stop moaning, too
Apr 02 06:48:46 <stuffwork> hahaaaaa
Apr 02 06:49:38 <Surfa> stuffwork, you do understand that people doing that on their personal time do actually better work there than overburdened engineers from a global company?
Apr 02 06:49:57 <Surfa> it's just do you get someone there to do it without paying
Apr 02 06:49:58 <SpeedEvil> sometimes.
Apr 02 06:50:14 <Surfa> most of the time :)
Apr 02 06:50:18 <SpeedEvil> other times you get cod explosions.
Apr 02 06:50:29 <SpeedEvil> code explosions.
Apr 02 06:50:39 <crashanddie> Surfa: hardly, really
Apr 02 06:50:44 <Surfa> that's rare, but do you think that company engineers would have spotted it any better?
Apr 02 06:51:44 <crashanddie> Surfa: it's more common in OS projects to have very loosely defined guidelines and absolutely no general architecture documents, meaning that QA's role is very hard to complete, and sloppy programming gets more and more common as devs have to interpret their own views/ideas.
Apr 02 06:52:31 <crashanddie> sure, it can happen that other developers go back and fix it, but that's more of an exception than a rule
Apr 02 06:52:55 <Surfa> you don't quality with documents and guidelines, it's about experienced people doing the work with enough time available
Apr 02 06:53:05 <Surfa> +get
Apr 02 06:53:15 <crashanddie> actually, you do.
Apr 02 06:53:44 <Surfa> actually you don't
Apr 02 06:54:06 <Surfa> of course you do get better quality if people aren't qualified to do what they are supposed to
Apr 02 06:54:35 <Surfa> then checkbox type of qa is better than nothing
Apr 02 06:56:00 <crashanddie> funny that the most vocal contenders of proper engineering are those who can only reply by a != b, and not actually articulate their ideas in anything more than a 5 word sentence ;)
Apr 02 06:56:31 <crashanddie> bonus points for those who got the movie reference.
Apr 02 06:56:57 <Surfa> and other side is those people writing 30+ words lines with personal insults, but it's only kind of pathetic
Apr 02 06:57:04 <SpeedEvil_> proper software engineering - of large projects - requires that anyone can be hit by a bus without destroyhing the project.
Apr 02 06:57:47 <SpeedEvil_> this brings in commenting, code standards, ... requirements
Apr 02 06:57:56 <Surfa> lengths of the lines don't give any more information, typically just make senteces too complicated and typically they are used to hide something
Apr 02 06:58:33 <Surfa> SpeedEvil_, qa of course includes a lot of other things than coding practices :)
Apr 02 06:58:45 <Surfa> or at least it should
Apr 02 07:07:28 <crashanddie> Surfa: definitely, QA isn't anything about coding practices
Apr 02 07:07:42 <crashanddie> Surfa: in my mind, QA shouldn't even be looking at the code, realistically
Apr 02 07:08:10 <crashanddie> QA should be looking at the specifications, and test the software at hand to make sure it matches those specifications
Apr 02 07:08:44 <cehteh> well a secondary look what ill workarounds make the tests pass would be nice sometimes :P
Apr 02 07:09:12 <cehteh> besides well written and documented code is a cornerstone for maintainable and thus quality code
Apr 02 07:10:20 <crashanddie> Said specifications come in different flavours, shapes and forms, but in Maemo's case, they would be making sure that a specific piece of software doesn't drain the battery, prevent base features to work, or do anything that may violate privacy, UI controls etc. That is what I call the "base contract". In addition to this, there should also be what the program aims to achieve.
Apr 02 07:13:59 <SpeedEvil> the camera violates this! It sometimes shows my shadow. Fix pls.
Apr 02 07:15:58 <marmoute> SpeedEvil: and it drain the battery
Apr 02 07:16:41 * SpeedEvil sighs.
Apr 02 07:17:05 <SpeedEvil> I should code some shit. I need to get up the energy though.
Apr 02 07:17:49 <SpeedEvil> I want to split the flashlight led out into the LED driver too.
Apr 02 07:18:01 <Surfa> qa should use all possible methods to improve quality
Apr 02 07:18:22 <SpeedEvil> so flashlight does not need v4l open.
Apr 02 07:18:46 <Surfa> qa should be process throughout the dev from design to testing
Apr 02 07:18:50 <SpeedEvil> Surfa: shooting bad coders?
Apr 02 07:19:03 <Surfa> for example :)
Apr 02 07:19:09 <Surfa> and test engineers too
Apr 02 07:19:26 <Surfa> they are equally important
Apr 02 07:20:10 <Surfa> i think qa is often misinterpreted and used as a synonym to testing
Apr 02 07:20:10 <SpeedEvil> Specifying what processes must be can also kill a project.
Apr 02 07:20:22 <Surfa> agreed
Apr 02 07:20:30 <Surfa> and make them inefficient
Apr 02 07:20:43 <SpeedEvil> If it puts off enough coder that you don't have a viable commjunity.
Apr 02 07:21:09 <Surfa> what is nowadays perhaps biggest problem in sw programs
Apr 02 07:22:21 <SpeedEvil> Is there a hack to open youtube urls in zoutube?
Apr 02 07:24:03 <pupnik> SpeedEvil: try just the yourube code in search
Apr 02 07:24:04 <SpeedEvil> I'd say the biggest problem is overabstraction.
Apr 02 07:24:17 <SpeedEvil> code reuse is great!!!!!!!!!
Apr 02 07:24:41 <pupnik> not the full url
Apr 02 07:25:07 <SpeedEvil> So I'll just add this 18megabyte library nothing else on the system uses, rather than write 20 lines.
Apr 02 07:25:33 <SpeedEvil> and of course that lib drags in 14 others and blender.
Apr 02 07:29:29 <talmai> Hello maemo people! Any news on that homedir issue? Is it already possible to commit packages to extras repository?
Apr 02 07:29:45 <Stskeeps> what homedir issue?
Apr 02 07:33:24 <pupnik> that was a funny user up there
Apr 02 07:35:47 <Arkenoi> is there a way to switch theme fast via command line? say, i have high contrast theme and i want to activate it if there is enough light via script
Apr 02 07:54:02 <Jaffa> Morning, all
Apr 02 07:55:22 <Stskeeps> morn jaffa
Apr 02 07:57:41 <X-Fade> Morning
Apr 02 07:58:27 <X-Fade> talmai: Can you try if it is working for you now? The issue should have been fixed yesterday.
Apr 02 08:09:10 <crashanddie> yo Jaffa
Apr 02 08:13:35 <madduck> is there really no proper open-source syncml server for linux?
Apr 02 08:13:49 <madduck> i am not talking about this 170M funambol binary blob with source
Apr 02 08:28:31 <MiXu-> SpeedEvil: Oh, ok. They must have changed it then at some point. (max_cpu_governor_speed)
Apr 02 08:28:50 <SpeedEvil> don't recall exact name
Apr 02 08:28:58 <pupnik> Stskeeps: any interest in doing a quick talk at debconf, berlin on mer, maemo, meego and your overview of the portable oses?
Apr 02 08:29:01 <MiXu-> I know the one you mean :)
Apr 02 08:29:33 <MiXu-> But it's still a bad idea for an app to change that. :)
Apr 02 08:29:36 <Stskeeps> pupnik: 'berlin'? it's in US this time
Apr 02 08:30:54 <pupnik> uh?
Apr 02 08:31:05 <pupnik> minidebconf at end of linuxtag
Apr 02 08:31:11 <Veggen> mmm...can you find a cleartext wpa2 key  somewhere?
Apr 02 08:31:35 <pupnik> http://lists.debian.org/debian-events-eu/2010/03/msg00034.html
Apr 02 08:32:08 <Veggen> my n900 supported wps, my ubuntu laptop didn't, at least not in a simple way.
Apr 02 08:32:13 <pupnik> i know some debianisti who were asking about it Stskeeps
Apr 02 08:32:28 <Veggen> so I thought just to dig out the key.
Apr 02 08:32:39 <Stskeeps> pupnik: i'm a little worried about rotten tomatoes when i say that the rpm tools actually help
Apr 02 08:33:02 <Jaffa> crashanddie: thanks for the git repo
Apr 02 08:33:11 <crashanddie> np
Apr 02 08:35:02 <pupnik> Stskeeps: well i know one of the linuxtag muftis and i think the topic of #mer should be part of it.  if i can help lemme know
Apr 02 08:35:59 <Stskeeps> pupnik: Mer's a bit of a dead end in terms of mobile platforms at the moment.
Apr 02 08:36:51 <pupnik> a good time to get ppl thinking and talking perhaps
Apr 02 08:37:24 <Stskeeps> mm
Apr 02 08:37:33 <Stskeeps> i'll keep it in mind, berlin is just a train trip from warsaw, so
Apr 02 08:37:44 <pupnik> "this project is inactive and heres why"
Apr 02 08:38:03 <pupnik> ok
Apr 02 08:44:04 <cehteh> MerGo :)
Apr 02 08:45:12 <cehteh> Well it would be great when Mer dies for a reason .. that is MeeGo will be really free and make it not necessary to have an alternative .. but prolly hell freezes over before we see that
Apr 02 08:46:30 <talmai> X-Fade: no, it's not working, i still get the "Permission denied (publickey)." error
Apr 02 08:47:58 <Stskeeps> cehteh: for all purposes, MeeGo is exactly same goals
Apr 02 08:48:27 <cehteh> lets see if it hits the target :)
Apr 02 08:49:48 <DocScrutinizer> (<SpeedEvil> code reuse is great!!!!!!!!!)  libboost
Apr 02 08:52:03 <X-Fade> talmai: ok, let me try one thing. Just a moment.
Apr 02 08:53:41 <X-Fade> talmai: Ok, can you try now?
Apr 02 08:54:14 <rmrfchik> I wonder, why LED didn't show me that battery is charging?
Apr 02 08:55:52 <talmai> X-Fade: same error
Apr 02 08:57:15 <X-Fade> talmai: and now?
Apr 02 08:58:42 <talmai> does not work
Apr 02 08:59:10 <X-Fade> talmai: I do not see a connection now, did see your last 2 attempts.
Apr 02 09:06:50 <talmai> It just wont work, and I'm 100% sure that the key in account settings is identical to id_rsa.pub I use
Apr 02 09:09:09 <X-Fade> talmai: I found the issue, key export script sets incorrect rights.
Apr 02 09:17:07 <crashanddie> rmrfchik: sometimes it doesn't work, unplug and plug-in again
Apr 02 09:18:55 <crashanddie> talmai: what files do you have in ~/.ssh?
Apr 02 09:19:08 <crashanddie> talmai: make sure you didn't copy id_dsa.pub rather than id_rsa.pub
Apr 02 09:19:53 <talmai> id_rsa  id_rsa.pub  known_hosts
Apr 02 09:20:12 <X-Fade> talmai: The issue is at our end.
Apr 02 09:20:43 <X-Fade> talmai: Don't mess up your config at your end while trying to debug ;)
Apr 02 09:21:03 <talmai> ok, i'm not touching it until said otherwise :)
Apr 02 09:21:04 <crashanddie> talmai: echo 0 > ~/.ssh/id_rsa
Apr 02 09:21:05 <crashanddie> :D
Apr 02 09:21:16 * X-Fade slaps crashanddie 
Apr 02 09:21:17 <crashanddie> (don't do that)
Apr 02 09:21:42 * crashanddie throws Lachende Paus at X-Fade 
Apr 02 09:22:13 <talmai> haha, reminds me of old times on IRC, giving bad advices with rm command to n00bs :D
Apr 02 09:22:51 <pupnik> :)
Apr 02 09:24:01 <crashanddie> it's even funnier when you do it on #ubuntu
Apr 02 09:24:11 <crashanddie> but you actually help them, then give them completely wrong commands
Apr 02 09:24:33 <kynky> the whole /join #2,000 was funny years ago too
Apr 02 09:24:45 <SpeedEvil> wow.
Apr 02 09:24:54 <crashanddie> there's still the DCC SEND one
Apr 02 09:24:58 <SpeedEvil> running ff remotely over x is good
Apr 02 09:25:06 <crashanddie> SpeedEvil: it is?
Apr 02 09:25:10 <SpeedEvil> but it doesn't half drain baw
Apr 02 09:25:13 <SpeedEvil> bat
Apr 02 09:25:17 <kynky> run ff over xvfb ?
Apr 02 09:25:20 <SpeedEvil> crashanddie: yes.
Apr 02 09:25:22 <SpeedEvil> no
Apr 02 09:26:08 <SpeedEvil> ssh -X lily firefox -no-remote
Apr 02 09:26:53 <kynky> i use nx for all my remote X needs
Apr 02 09:28:11 <crashanddie> Jesus is amongst a crowd, and the crowd is stoning a poor woman
Apr 02 09:28:35 <crashanddie> Jesus stops the angry mob, and tries to calm them down by yelling: "That those who have never sinned throw the first stone"
Apr 02 09:28:42 <crashanddie> And a bunch of stones come flying
Apr 02 09:29:05 <crashanddie> Jesus turns around to see who's throwing the stones, and says: "Mum, you're really starting piss me off..."
Apr 02 09:31:05 <kapu> amen
Apr 02 09:35:11 <pupnik> haha
Apr 02 09:36:55 <X-Fade> talmai: Can you try again?
Apr 02 09:40:14 <talmai> still not working
Apr 02 09:40:46 <bigon> hi, is there any doc on the values returned by Phone.Net.get_registration_status dbus call?
Apr 02 09:50:53 <crashanddie> X-Fade: what's the issue?
Apr 02 10:00:07 <sECuRE> say, if i want to compile for an n900, i need to use an old version of a lot of packages (i use fremantle/sdk). is there an easy way to add a pinning to apt for the versions necessary for the n900 of *all* packages?
Apr 02 10:00:33 <sECuRE> at the moment i pinned the necessary packages for my application manually, but there should be a better way, right?
Apr 02 10:01:08 * DocScrutinizer sighs
Apr 02 10:04:32 <crashanddie> sECuRE: "pinning"
Apr 02 10:05:59 <sECuRE> crashanddie: as i said, i pinned them. but i did not have a nice way to pin them, other than by their specific version
Apr 02 10:06:09 <sECuRE> crashanddie: what i would like is something like release=n900
Apr 02 10:06:18 <crashanddie> pinning? wtf is pinning?
Apr 02 10:07:17 <sECuRE> pinning means to tell apt to use a specific version of the available debian packages
Apr 02 10:07:19 <DocScrutinizer> ~pinning
Apr 02 10:07:20 <infobot> i heard pinning is 'man apt_preferences', or add testing and unstable lines to sources.list, create /etc/apt/preferences containing "Package: *\nPin: release a=testing\nPin-Priority: 900\n\nPackage: *\nPin: release o=Debian\nPin-Priority: -10\n", then apt-get install foo/unstable, or at http://www.debian.org/News/weekly/2002/4/mail#1, or read http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2002/debian-devel-200212/msg00659.html
Apr 02 10:07:30 <sECuRE> right
Apr 02 10:07:57 <sECuRE> but instead of using it for testing/unstable/…, i would like to pin the n900 versions of all packages
Apr 02 10:08:37 <DocScrutinizer> release=N900 won't work though, as the new pkgs in conflict are for N900 as well ;-P
Apr 02 10:09:29 * DocScrutinizer is begging Nokia not to break API ever again, without proper new repos
Apr 02 10:09:51 <sECuRE> so it is a known unsolved problem?
Apr 02 10:10:05 <DocScrutinizer> it's called 1.2
Apr 02 10:10:18 <sECuRE> 1.2 of what exactly?
Apr 02 10:10:33 <Arkenoi> so p1.2 was said to be out within q1 and now it is already behind the date?
Apr 02 10:10:45 <noobmonk3y> Arkenklo, who said q1?
Apr 02 10:11:14 <noobmonk3y> Arkenoi,
Apr 02 10:11:15 <noobmonk3y> lol
Apr 02 10:11:19 <noobmonk3y> damn auto tabbing
Apr 02 10:12:41 * DocScrutinizer suggests intelligent autocompletion tabbing, by sorting priority of used completions on a most recently used base
Apr 02 10:13:18 <DocScrutinizer> of course in whole channel text
Apr 02 10:14:23 <DocScrutinizer> and of course excluding own nick
Apr 02 10:14:54 <sECuRE> sorry to ask again, but version 1.2 of what did you mean?
Apr 02 10:15:12 <DocScrutinizer> of N900 "firmware"
Apr 02 10:15:41 <noobmonk3y> sECuRE, PR 1.2 - version 1.2 of the maemo OS
Apr 02 10:15:43 <sECuRE> isn’t the n900 firmware called maemo 5 or do you mean something different?
Apr 02 10:15:52 <noobmonk3y> ie n900 frimware ;) as DocScrutinizer  said ;)
Apr 02 10:15:56 <DocScrutinizer> it's in SDK but not on the devices yet, and it breaks the whole thing for prety much everybody
Apr 02 10:16:01 <noobmonk3y> yup but it still has versions :D
Apr 02 10:16:07 <sECuRE> ah, i get it, thanks
Apr 02 10:17:34 <MohammadAG> I installed gcc-4.2 yesterday, optified and all, but it's either 1. not working or 2. not in my $PATH
Apr 02 10:18:24 <DocScrutinizer> though the real bugger isn't the SDK, you have control over that in the end. It's the autobuilder on buildhost that doesn't know how to build pkgs for 1.1.1 aiui
Apr 02 10:19:08 <sECuRE> urghs, ok
Apr 02 10:19:09 <DocScrutinizer> MohammadAG: I'd not so much surprised optification failed for gcc
Apr 02 10:21:09 <DocScrutinizer> sECuRE: so if you bother to upload a new version of your pkg * to buildhost, you'd damn sure better rename it to *-1.2 otherwise kill your 'old' pkg for all users
Apr 02 10:21:38 <sECuRE> yep, thanks for the hint
Apr 02 10:21:56 <sECuRE> different question: in the emulator, which key do i need to use to get a 'return' in the x terminal?
Apr 02 10:22:12 <sECuRE> it worked using ctrl+return before, but it doesn’t work now (cursor just blinks once)
Apr 02 10:23:11 <sECuRE> ah, if i press the ctrl button using the mouse, it works
Apr 02 10:23:15 <sECuRE> strange though
Apr 02 10:24:07 <pupnik> in vmware sECuRE ?
Apr 02 10:24:18 <lbt> any reson <nowiki> doesn't work on the maemo wik ?
Apr 02 10:24:33 <sECuRE> pupnik: yes
Apr 02 10:27:06 <MohammadAG> DocScrutinizer, expected you'd say that
Apr 02 10:27:16 <bigon> mmm is GPS_DEVICE_STATUS_NO_FIX supposed to work with location python binding?
Apr 02 10:27:22 <MohammadAG> my current workaround for compiling something when i'm not home is ssh
Apr 02 10:27:27 <MohammadAG> slow, but it works
Apr 02 10:27:29 <DocScrutinizer> MohammadAG: :-P
Apr 02 10:27:55 <bigon> because it seems it's not set even if it has not the fix yet (it returns the last known location and used sat is 0)
Apr 02 10:29:32 <pupnik> sECuRE: vmplayer gives me all  kinds of problems with usb keyboard.  for e.g. numblock is a.ways active,  cannot type in vmware window - need to ssh-in to sdk
Apr 02 10:29:42 <DocScrutinizer> bigon: I heard it's not
Apr 02 10:29:46 <pupnik> either that or i run the vmware player in vnc
Apr 02 10:30:52 <DocScrutinizer> bigon: (dunno about the 'supposed' bit though) use horizontal precision to determine if the location is 'good enough'
Apr 02 10:31:23 <sECuRE> pupnik: i’m not using an usb keyboard. and inside the vm it works normal, just not in the xephyr running the emulator inside the vm
Apr 02 10:32:46 <bigon> DocScrutinizer: well the documentation talk about GPS_DEVICE_STATUS_NO_FIX (which is not working) but GPS_DEVICE_STATUS_FIX seems to work...
Apr 02 10:32:59 <bigon> not sure why both exists
Apr 02 10:34:45 <DocScrutinizer> bigon: I'd guess it is related to the 5 some different types of location reporting modes you can select liblocation use (cell, gps, any, assisted-*)
Apr 02 10:35:12 <DocScrutinizer> bigon: the behaviour to report last known good location is described there
Apr 02 10:35:37 <bigon> yeah I know but I want the real position
Apr 02 10:35:49 <bigon> so I'm not sure what's correct
Apr 02 10:35:53 <sECuRE> hm, how comes i get the message from gobject: 'invalid cast from econtact to OssoABookContact' but OssoABookContact inherits from EContact?
Apr 02 10:36:03 <DocScrutinizer> AGNNS
Apr 02 10:36:10 <DocScrutinizer> ?
Apr 02 10:36:40 <DocScrutinizer> (mompls, still searching the wikipage)
Apr 02 10:37:16 <DocScrutinizer> LOCATION_METHOD_AGNSS - Assisted Global Navigation Satellite System
Apr 02 10:37:58 <DocScrutinizer> or LOCATION_METHOD_GNSS - Global Navigation Satellite System | LOCATION_METHOD_AGNSS - Assisted Global Navigation Satellite System
Apr 02 10:38:06 <bigon> DocScrutinizer: horizontal precision should be bad if it's not the real position?
Apr 02 10:38:26 <DocScrutinizer> I'd guess yes, unless it's totally broken
Apr 02 10:39:30 <bigon> any idea who's working on py-location so I can ask
Apr 02 10:39:31 <bigon> ?
Apr 02 10:39:38 <DocScrutinizer> Method CWP  Typ Accuracy 1km-1000km
Apr 02 10:40:57 <bigon> the accuracy will be for the last position
Apr 02 10:41:07 <bigon> I guess?
Apr 02 10:41:34 <DocScrutinizer> An application receiving a fix cannot know if the fix is a result from location method it requested. Therefore application should study whether fix is accurate enough to satisfy application's needs.
Apr 02 10:42:12 <DocScrutinizer> http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo_5_Developer_Guide/Using_Connectivity_Components/Using_Location_API#LocationGPSDevice_and_LocationGPSDeviceFix
Apr 02 10:42:30 <bigon> yep and bellow
Apr 02 10:42:31 <bigon> Liblocation sends a "changed" signal also after locationing is started or stopped, in which case a last known fix is sent if such exists. Application can differentiate these fixes from real ones by inspecting device->status field which equals LOCATION_GPS_DEVICE_STATUS_NO_FIX if the fix is not real.
Apr 02 10:43:08 <DocScrutinizer> you say this doesn't work?
Apr 02 10:44:52 <bigon> right, my real question was if it's was a bug in the documentation or in the code (or the python binding)
Apr 02 10:45:11 <DocScrutinizer> anyway, file a ticket
Apr 02 10:45:57 <bigon> I will see if the accuracy can gives me the information I want
Apr 02 10:45:59 <bigon> thx
Apr 02 10:47:02 <DocScrutinizer> bigon: please don't forget to open a bugtracker ticket so the issue gets sorted eventually :-)
Apr 02 10:48:19 <SpeedEvil> or find out, and fix the docs
Apr 02 11:00:06 <pupnik> so is qt reasonably fast versus hildon/gtk?
Apr 02 11:00:31 <Stskeeps> qite
Apr 02 11:00:32 <Stskeeps> quite
Apr 02 11:01:32 <pupnik> cool ty
Apr 02 11:11:13 <Arif_> :yawn:
Apr 02 11:15:26 <MohammadAG> ~curse NVidia closed drivers
Apr 02 11:15:28 <infobot> May the fleas of a thousand camels infest your most sensitive regions, NVidia closed drivers !
Apr 02 11:15:57 <joga> :D
Apr 02 11:19:38 <sylarpowa> hi, I want to join the GSOC with a project on the n900, so what I have to do to make my proposal?
Apr 02 11:25:34 <Arif_> why isn't pr1.2 out yet
Apr 02 11:25:35 <Arif_> :\
Apr 02 11:25:52 <MohammadAG> Arif_, to make you suffer
Apr 02 11:26:13 <bigon> DocScrutinizer: https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=9824
Apr 02 11:26:14 <povbot> Bug 9824: GPS_DEVICE_STATUS_NO_FIX is never set
Apr 02 11:26:45 <Arif_> today's a holiday anyway
Apr 02 11:26:47 <Arif_> can't be released
Apr 02 11:26:48 <Arif_> :D
Apr 02 11:27:04 <haltdef> :(
Apr 02 11:27:18 <Arif_> hm
Apr 02 11:27:22 <Arif_> wormux got an updat
Apr 02 11:27:23 <Arif_> e
Apr 02 11:27:24 <haltdef> I don't need pr1.2, already been blown away
Apr 02 11:27:58 <Arif_> you're easily pleased :P
Apr 02 11:28:38 <haltdef> what's wrong with 1.1 exactly?
Apr 02 11:29:00 <thresh> phone being unusable after 6 days of uptime?
Apr 02 11:29:15 <haltdef> :o
Apr 02 11:29:20 <Arif_> the user experience sucks?
Apr 02 11:29:35 <haltdef> only had it 4 days, and as a user I've had a good experience
Apr 02 11:29:42 <MohammadAG> Arif_, UI sucks?
Apr 02 11:29:50 <Arif_> that too
Apr 02 11:29:58 <MohammadAG> Arif_, :/
Apr 02 11:30:17 <haltdef> :/
Apr 02 11:30:27 <haltdef> will 1.2 fix all of that?
Apr 02 11:30:40 <MohammadAG> no
Apr 02 11:30:42 <Arif_> no ;(
Apr 02 11:30:44 <MohammadAG> cause it doesn't suck
Apr 02 11:30:51 <haltdef> :|
Apr 02 11:30:53 <MohammadAG> if it's not broken don't fix it
Apr 02 11:35:09 <DocScrutinizer> Arif_: (why isn't pr1.2 out yet) because each time you ask aout 1.2 they postpone it another 3 days to make you angry
Apr 02 11:35:36 <Arif_> I only get angry whent he media player decides to not work again :(
Apr 02 11:35:55 <ea_suter> hi folks
Apr 02 11:36:09 <DocScrutinizer> thresh: not here
Apr 02 11:40:21 <thresh> DocScrutinizer: it starts to swap out a lot
Apr 02 11:40:30 <thresh> suppose something is leaking.. like desktop?
Apr 02 11:41:17 <DocScrutinizer> thresh: that seems to be caused by other processes, not exactly phone-related ones. Seen browser to cause that, esp when using flash
Apr 02 11:41:50 <thresh> DocScrutinizer: i'm not running browser all the time
Apr 02 11:42:06 <DocScrutinizer> also desktop widget unknown comes to mind
Apr 02 11:42:35 <uhsf> how to type a | vertical bar on a n900?
Apr 02 11:42:49 <DocScrutinizer> Fn+Ctrl
Apr 02 11:44:42 <uhsf> that means the onscreen virtual keyboard?
Apr 02 11:44:51 <DocScrutinizer> yep
Apr 02 11:45:17 <pupnik> i pray the next nokia linux phone has competitive battery life
Apr 02 11:45:22 <DocScrutinizer> unless you remap the hw-keys
Apr 02 11:45:49 <lcukn900> fsckingbleeryyydfffnnnkvirginyintergrrrryfail
Apr 02 11:46:05 <DocScrutinizer> pupnik: sure, they simply prohibit multitasking :-P
Apr 02 11:46:06 <uhsf> usb networking works with my notebook but not with my workstation. what configuration files should i try to edit so it works?
Apr 02 11:47:24 <ShadowJK> my battery is at 50% and bq27200 says I'd get 2400 minutes standby if I closed xchat and internets :p
Apr 02 11:48:04 <DocScrutinizer> that's fair enough, no?
Apr 02 11:48:10 <ShadowJK> and 54 minutes at maximum load :D
Apr 02 11:48:56 <lcukn900> shadow, with screen on?
Apr 02 11:49:16 <ShadowJK> no standby is screen off
Apr 02 11:49:46 <lcukn900> what are you running to drop battery that fast?
Apr 02 11:50:54 * lcukn900 kicks virgins ass
Apr 02 11:51:19 <ShadowJK> The battery gas gauge chip has some preprogrammed info for maximum load, and it also has some heuristics to adapt in case user finds way to use more power than nokia engineers anticipated
Apr 02 11:51:54 <DocScrutinizer> lcukn900: the 27200 reports calculated time-to-empty for max-load it seen. So this might be a transient caused by e.g massive UMTS-data traffic
Apr 02 11:52:15 <ShadowJK> a 5.12 second long transient
Apr 02 11:52:33 <DocScrutinizer> yep
Apr 02 11:53:00 <DocScrutinizer> average over a window of that length, to be exact
Apr 02 11:53:21 <ShadowJK> it's such a round number I suspect I've never managed to use that much
Apr 02 11:53:31 <lcukn900> ahh doc so ive seen something like that in the past.  getting the battery dying death rolls, then still being able to continue for hours after changing use profile
Apr 02 11:53:57 <ShadowJK> maybe I need screen at full brightness, bluetpoth wlan and hspa all active and transmitting, fm tx and rx all active, etc
Apr 02 11:54:26 <lcukn900> bluetooth too and a big disk copy as well
Apr 02 11:54:44 <DocScrutinizer> fm rx/tx won't cost much, as does BT. CPU load cost a lot though
Apr 02 11:55:29 <DocScrutinizer> CPU, screen backlight, and Modem TX being worst powerhogs
Apr 02 11:55:44 <DocScrutinizer> and speakers on high volume
Apr 02 11:55:49 * lcukn900 is saddened by lack of internet again
Apr 02 11:56:37 <ShadowJK> I've seen bt at 150mA on n810
Apr 02 11:57:09 <DocScrutinizer> duh, hefty
Apr 02 11:57:42 <ShadowJK> but that's a "bug" condition that fixed itself with bt on/off cycle
Apr 02 11:57:44 <nidO> morning
Apr 02 11:58:15 <ShadowJK> (then the nokia phone i tethered to ate that much extra instead)
Apr 02 11:58:20 <ShadowJK> gotta love bt
Apr 02 11:58:26 <DocScrutinizer> lol
Apr 02 12:02:17 <ShadowJK> lcukn900, n900 tethers nicely ;)
Apr 02 12:02:19 * SpeedEvil is very glad of screen protector.
Apr 02 12:02:33 <SpeedEvil> putting seccateurs in wrong pocket + hour of digging, bending down and up.
Apr 02 12:02:34 * ShadowJK has the 3M vikuiti one now
Apr 02 12:02:44 <SpeedEvil> thing  is damn near opaque.
Apr 02 12:02:49 <SpeedEvil> Also.
Apr 02 12:02:54 <SpeedEvil> Prodigy - invaders must die - is a bad album to do manual labour to, unless you want to end up wrecked.
Apr 02 12:03:28 <lcukn900> shadowjk only to my linux box.  not to my gateway machine with all my irc and secure stuff
Apr 02 12:04:16 <ShadowJK> gateway machine: route del default; route add default gw linuxbox
Apr 02 12:04:25 <ShadowJK> linuxbox: echo 1 > /proc/sys/net/ipv4/ip_forward
Apr 02 12:04:34 <SpeedEvil> ShadowJK: are you putting results of this in wiki somewhere?
Apr 02 12:04:38 <ShadowJK> iptables -A POSTROUTING -o ppp0 -j MASQUERADE
Apr 02 12:04:40 <ShadowJK> ;D
Apr 02 12:04:43 <lcukn900> E:notlinux
Apr 02 12:04:48 <ShadowJK> SpeedEvil, not really
Apr 02 12:05:13 <ShadowJK> There was someone else on tmo's N900 forum that was talking to bq27200 through the kernel driver
Apr 02 12:05:18 <SpeedEvil> power peaks I think may be over 5w
Apr 02 12:05:25 <ShadowJK> I posted my intial impressions there
Apr 02 12:05:27 <DocScrutinizer> EREDMOND
Apr 02 12:05:31 <SpeedEvil> with it all going
Apr 02 12:06:11 <DocScrutinizer> SpeedEvil: easily
Apr 02 12:06:12 <bigon> is liblocation opensource?
Apr 02 12:06:43 <game_over> can somebody help me with the ssh key for uploading ? do i need to copy everything from the id_rsa.pub  ?
Apr 02 12:07:41 <DocScrutinizer> SpeedEvil: modems usually rated at 2A@3.5V
Apr 02 12:07:48 <SpeedEvil> yeah
Apr 02 12:08:06 <DocScrutinizer> that's peak though
Apr 02 12:08:45 <DocScrutinizer> but GPRS should create a quite sustained power consumption like that, on highest bandwidth
Apr 02 12:09:15 <ShadowJK> hspa seems to create more sustained power consumption
Apr 02 12:10:00 <DocScrutinizer> I'm subsumming all cellphone data transfer under GPRS here
Apr 02 12:10:30 <ShadowJK> per byte edge uses more of course ;p
Apr 02 12:10:34 <SpeedEvil> also - turning powersave off on wlan wants huge amounts.
Apr 02 12:10:58 <SpeedEvil> not-of-course huge compared...,  but quite large
Apr 02 12:10:58 <DocScrutinizer> I heard of a guy literally melting his motorola phone by doing filesharing all during the night
Apr 02 12:10:59 <lcukx200> :D
Apr 02 12:11:17 <ShadowJK> DocScrutinizer, all my nokias have survived that :)
Apr 02 12:12:23 <DocScrutinizer> ShadowJK: decent modem chips reduce datarate by dropping slots, on overtemp
Apr 02 12:12:24 <marmoute> DocScrutinizer: I spend a night rsync my music directory over 3G no issue
Apr 02 12:12:58 <ShadowJK> downloading at ~20kbyte/s on edge: 250-300
Apr 02 12:13:15 * ShadowJK switches to 3g
Apr 02 12:13:15 <DocScrutinizer> also I'm not sure if that's a true story, though the guy swore it happened to him
Apr 02 12:13:34 <pupnik> cheap home tablet for 50pounds http://www.slashgear.com/o2-joggler-home-media-tablet-price-slashed-0180022/
Apr 02 12:13:59 <DocScrutinizer> btw that was a WCDMA phone
Apr 02 12:14:43 <ShadowJK> ~450mA downloading on hspa... 3Mbit/s or so
Apr 02 12:15:05 <pupnik> total drain ShadowJK ?
Apr 02 12:15:11 <ShadowJK> yes
Apr 02 12:15:41 <ShadowJK> oh now it has updated max load to 685mA ;p
Apr 02 12:15:49 * lcukx200 chceks virgin status
Apr 02 12:15:51 <lcukx200> checks too
Apr 02 12:15:58 * Arif_ yawns
Apr 02 12:16:01 <pupnik> how do you monitor current battery drain?
Apr 02 12:16:16 <Arif_> I want a 3Mb connection too...
Apr 02 12:18:06 <ShadowJK> hm... gpodder seems to have downloaded a bunch of html instead of videos :/
Apr 02 12:18:43 <Arif_> ascii videos? =P
Apr 02 12:19:43 <DocScrutinizer> ShadowJK: upload will suck considerably more power than download
Apr 02 12:19:57 <SpeedEvil> 'show me your "o" face'
Apr 02 12:22:38 <ShadowJK> oh right, youtube has broken all third party youtube apps
Apr 02 12:22:47 <SpeedEvil> :/
Apr 02 12:23:56 <style> Is there somewhere tutorials for maemo developement (written in python)
Apr 02 12:24:35 <iksaif> do you think a python gpx library and a pyqt gpx viewer would be an acceptable gsoc for meego/maemo (I know, there is eCoach, but a python gpx library would be great)
Apr 02 12:29:12 <Backtrack> hi all.
Apr 02 12:30:42 <Backtrack> one question people... i need to extract the image from maemo firmware file (vanilla etc.bin) can you help  me???
Apr 02 12:31:41 <Backtrack> people i need some help
Apr 02 12:31:42 <Backtrack> one question people... i need to extract the image from maemo firmware file (vanilla etc.bin) can you help  me???
Apr 02 12:34:48 <DocScrutinizer> Backtrack: please try to study netiquette first
Apr 02 12:35:09 <Backtrack> doc i did... :)
Apr 02 12:35:41 <DocScrutinizer> so, was there written "enter irc chan and repost your question every 60 seconds" ?
Apr 02 12:37:11 <Backtrack> docs i dont care what u think goodbye and have a nice day
Apr 02 12:39:15 <Arif_> why don't you all just use /cs kick
Apr 02 12:39:17 <Arif_> it's faster :D
Apr 02 12:39:23 <nidO> guess he didnt notice
Apr 02 12:39:50 <DocScrutinizer> abuse? he said goodbye ;-P
Apr 02 12:39:52 <pupnik> heh
Apr 02 12:39:56 <crashanddie> 22:39 <crashanddie> kick #maemo Arif_
Apr 02 12:39:56 <crashanddie> 22:39 -ChanServ(ChanServ@services.)- Invalid command. Use /msg ChanServ help for a command listing.
Apr 02 12:40:06 <Arif_> aw
Apr 02 12:40:13 <crashanddie> that's why
Apr 02 12:40:16 <crashanddie> this isn't efnet
Apr 02 12:40:23 <Arif_> efnet doesn't have services
Apr 02 12:40:31 <crashanddie> quakenet then
Apr 02 12:40:32 <nidO> efnet has no chanserv
Apr 02 12:40:33 <crashanddie> or undernet
Apr 02 12:40:35 <nidO> you mean quakenet
Apr 02 12:40:37 <nidO> :p
Apr 02 12:41:05 <Arif_> efnet has chanfix though \o/
Apr 02 12:42:34 <crashanddie> regardless
Apr 02 12:42:39 <crashanddie> don't be a smartass unless you're right
Apr 02 12:43:46 <Arif_> don't blame me for features not working here :(
Apr 02 12:44:11 <DocScrutinizer> smartass implies to be right XP
Apr 02 12:44:23 <DocScrutinizer> otherwise != smart
Apr 02 12:44:41 <crashanddie> Arif_: it's not a feature, it caused more abuse than anything
Apr 02 12:44:53 <bigon> is liblocation opensource? I can't find where to download the sources
Apr 02 12:44:57 <Stskeeps> bigon: no
Apr 02 12:45:24 <DocScrutinizer> bigon: that's why the ticket was double important
Apr 02 12:45:40 <Jaffa> GAN900: ping
Apr 02 12:45:57 <Jaffa> Or, anyone else, what's the MediaWiki syntax for a link which goes below a title and says "Main article: ..."?
Apr 02 12:46:49 <crashanddie> {{main|Articlename}}
Apr 02 12:46:53 <Jaffa> ta
Apr 02 12:47:07 <bigon> DocScrutinizer: I open it for the pymaemo component
Apr 02 12:47:15 <bigon> as A
Apr 02 12:47:25 <bigon> as I did'nt try with the C version
Apr 02 12:48:24 <DocScrutinizer> bigon: so odds are the python bindings are introducing the problem
Apr 02 12:50:44 <jatt> hi I'm running emacs on the n900 but only one thing is not working, gnus requires starttls to send mail, does anybody know where can I find a starttls package?
Apr 02 12:53:19 <kynky> debian repo ?
Apr 02 12:53:32 <lcuk> morning dneary
Apr 02 12:53:50 <dneary> morning???
Apr 02 12:53:55 <dneary> lcuk: You in the states?
Apr 02 12:54:26 <lcuk> no dneary :) you just arrived and its holidays :p
Apr 02 12:54:51 <lcukx200> which damn machine am i using :*
Apr 02 12:55:07 <lcukn900> gah!
Apr 02 12:55:14 <lcuk> eep!
Apr 02 12:57:18 <crashanddie> lcuk: where you at?
Apr 02 12:57:36 <lcuk> home
Apr 02 12:57:45 <lcuk> but virgin have been shit this morning
Apr 02 12:58:10 <lcuk> so i connected from 3g and stuff all my machines started binging once it came back
Apr 02 12:58:19 <nidO> virgin were having lots of problems yesterday too
Apr 02 12:58:21 <dneary> lcuk, Not holidays here
Apr 02 12:58:28 <lcuk> ahhh dneary
Apr 02 12:58:29 <dneary> I just rebooted & hadn't restarted IRC
Apr 02 12:58:36 <crashanddie> dneary: easter is fucked up in france
Apr 02 12:59:00 <dneary> crashanddie, Nah. Easter is a sucky holiday anyway
Apr 02 12:59:15 <crashanddie> hey, 4 day weekend, doesn't suck from where I'm standing
Apr 02 13:00:14 <nidO> still only a 2 day weekend for me :(
Apr 02 13:07:56 <bullet`> hi all
Apr 02 13:08:00 <bullet`> its 2nd april now 1!
Apr 02 13:08:07 <bullet`> how much more wait for 1.2 ?
Apr 02 13:08:34 <haltdef> 3 years
Apr 02 13:08:53 <dneary> crashanddie, Celebrating some guy faking his death?
Apr 02 13:10:27 <crashanddie> If religion did anything, it was give us excuses to give each other gifts and provide us with opportunities to get drunk and chill out
Apr 02 13:11:02 <user`> how do i enable the facebook widget?
Apr 02 13:13:27 <viraptor> bullet': it wil be right after perl6 and a bit before duke nukem forever
Apr 02 13:16:47 <RST38h> http://www.lsd.ic.unicamp.br/~oliva/fun/prog/resign-patterns
Apr 02 13:16:58 <_bella_> •hi•
Apr 02 13:17:12 <lcuk> hiya _bella_
Apr 02 13:24:35 <V13> hello... I want to add a screenshot in a program in maemo/Downloads but the "Edit" option is inactive. I'm the one who created/uploaded the program, I'm already logged in and I believe that I'm doing exactly the same thing I did with another program (where it worked).
Apr 02 13:24:40 <V13> any ideas/hints ?
Apr 02 13:24:49 <mst> hokay. is there a sane way to flash just the root partition?
Apr 02 13:25:03 <mst> I appear to have Upset the OS install but if I can hang onto /home/user it would make me happy
Apr 02 13:25:04 <V13> yes... flasher
Apr 02 13:25:34 <mst> will that flatten the OS without touching address books etc.?
Apr 02 13:25:36 <V13> when flashing you flash either the 256M rootfs or the internal mmc
Apr 02 13:25:40 <V13> yes.
Apr 02 13:25:45 <V13> most of your options are under /homt
Apr 02 13:25:50 <V13>  /home
Apr 02 13:26:15 <V13> but you should also backup
Apr 02 13:26:40 <mst> I have an old-ish backup. I've screwed it over enough I don't think I can manage to make another one.
Apr 02 13:26:49 <mst> this is, as they say, my own stupid fault.
Apr 02 13:27:00 <V13> well... most probably it work
Apr 02 13:27:09 <V13> ...will work
Apr 02 13:27:53 <V13> why can't you make a backup ?
Apr 02 13:28:00 <jacekowski> [Slashdot]  Intel and Nokia Provide First MeeGo Release (linux) - http://linux.slashdot.org/story/10/04/02/1228249/-Intel-and-Nokia-Provide-First-MeeGo-Release?from=rss
Apr 02 13:28:33 <Arif_> is that the fancy cli version?
Apr 02 13:28:50 <mst> V13: because I've upset it sufficiently I can't manage to get it into PC Suite mode
Apr 02 13:29:06 <mst> V13: X doesn't appear to be coming up properly
Apr 02 13:29:24 <RurouniJones> hmmm, they mention N900 in the slashdot article
Apr 02 13:29:24 <V13> well.. you could enable r&d mode before flashing
Apr 02 13:29:33 <V13> just to be able to get a shell
Apr 02 13:29:39 <V13> (haven't done this myself)
Apr 02 13:29:53 <mst> ooh
Apr 02 13:30:01 <mst> what am I googling to try that?
Apr 02 13:30:56 <V13> http://wiki.maemo.org/R&D_mode
Apr 02 13:31:18 <jacekowski> RurouniJones: there is n900 image avaliable
Apr 02 13:31:19 <RurouniJones> so anyone brave enough to install meegoin their n900?
Apr 02 13:31:48 <mst> V13: hmm. I think I already put mine into that mode
Apr 02 13:31:58 <jacekowski> mst: that kills power managment
Apr 02 13:32:01 <jacekowski> mst: a lot of it
Apr 02 13:32:17 <V13> mst: I guess it should give you a shell when it starts
Apr 02 13:32:29 <mst> I'm not that lucky.
Apr 02 13:32:29 <crashanddie> jacekowski: shame bunch of those comments are misinformed
Apr 02 13:32:44 <crashanddie> RurouniJones: you can install meego on the n900
Apr 02 13:32:53 <mst> jacekowski: I dunno, it's blue pill'ed
Apr 02 13:32:54 <jacekowski> crashanddie: that was info from wiki
Apr 02 13:33:04 <mst> mostly I just need to flatten the / partition
Apr 02 13:33:07 <crashanddie> jacekowski: what was?
Apr 02 13:33:25 <mst> since I attempted to update the system, it ran out of space on /, and everything went downhill from there
Apr 02 13:33:57 <jacekowski> crashanddie: thatone of r&d options breaks power management
Apr 02 13:34:10 <crashanddie> jacekowski: so? why are you telling me that?
Apr 02 13:34:27 <jacekowski> Note: As R&D mode has other side effects beyond simply enabling root access (including several that may negatively impact battery life), it is not the recommended method for gaining root access. Use rootsh instead.
Apr 02 13:34:43 <V13> hey guys.. he can't boot.
Apr 02 13:34:47 <crashanddie> jacekowski: I was just saying that it's a shame a lot of the comments on the slashdot story are misinformed
Apr 02 13:34:53 <jacekowski> oh
Apr 02 13:35:00 <crashanddie> sorry, should have specified
Apr 02 13:36:11 <jacekowski> crashanddie: any specific one
Apr 02 13:36:31 <crashanddie> jacekowski: rpm vs deb
Apr 02 13:36:48 <jacekowski> msi ftw
Apr 02 13:36:54 <crashanddie> lol, aye
Apr 02 13:37:00 <crashanddie> let's dump this linux crap
Apr 02 13:37:05 <crashanddie> I want WinCE on my N900
Apr 02 13:37:49 <jacekowski> i would really like to get serial port on n900
Apr 02 13:37:52 <jacekowski> like i had on iphone
Apr 02 13:38:03 <jacekowski> it was very usefull for testing modbus devices
Apr 02 13:41:22 <V13> so, any ideas on how to add a screenshot to a project ?
Apr 02 13:41:40 <mst> hrm. image list is showing a 1.2009 and a 3.2010
Apr 02 13:41:53 <V13> 3.2010 ?
Apr 02 13:42:04 <V13> ah.. yes.. 1.1.1
Apr 02 13:42:06 <mst> RX-51_2009SE_3.2010.02-8.203.1_PR_COMBINED_203_ARM.bin 171136705 PR 1.1.1 version 3.2010.02-8
Apr 02 13:42:25 <mst> I guess I'm safer getting the 2009 one and upgrading once it's happy again?
Apr 02 13:42:34 <V13> i'd go for 1.1.1
Apr 02 13:42:45 <V13> if it fails, rollback to 1.0
Apr 02 13:42:46 <nidO> you're better still getting the global variant
Apr 02 13:42:47 <nidO> not uk
Apr 02 13:42:47 <V13> or 1.1
Apr 02 13:42:53 <Treibholz> has anyone tried to write something like a CalDAV-Connector for the calendar?
Apr 02 13:43:11 <V13> be sure to use the rootfs image only
Apr 02 13:43:39 <V13> btw, if you plug n900 with usb when it is turned off, you may be able to see your files
Apr 02 13:43:42 <V13> just in case.
Apr 02 13:43:44 <mst> these all appear to be "combined"
Apr 02 13:43:45 <ShadowJK> Oh fuckers
Apr 02 13:43:53 <ShadowJK> Mugen put a thermistor on BSI instead of a resistor
Apr 02 13:43:57 <mst> V13: I've already backed up the stuff in MyDocs that way, but thanks
Apr 02 13:44:08 <nidO> they wat.
Apr 02 13:44:24 <mst> V13: I guess "combined" means I have to tell the flasher to only flash / ?
Apr 02 13:44:25 <nidO> why the hell did they do that
Apr 02 13:44:27 <ShadowJK> so battery design capacity as reported by bme will vary depending on the battery temperature at boot :)
Apr 02 13:44:31 <V13> mst: dunno
Apr 02 13:44:35 <ShadowJK> nidO, fuck knows :)
Apr 02 13:44:40 <V13> :))))))))
Apr 02 13:44:57 <mst> nidO: why global rather than UK?
Apr 02 13:45:10 <nidO> because nokia struggle to remember the uk exists
Apr 02 13:45:22 <nidO> and generally gets updates anytime between ages after the rest of the world, and never
Apr 02 13:45:23 <ShadowJK> because the UK variant is made by a team that doesn't exist, since they don't exist they can be pretty slow at updating it
Apr 02 13:47:09 <mst> hokay
Apr 02 13:47:14 * mst grabs the global release
Apr 02 13:48:58 <mst> aha
Apr 02 13:49:07 <mst> flasher can unpack a fiasco image and then install bits separately
Apr 02 13:49:12 <mst> so ... if I unpack the kernel and rootfs
Apr 02 13:49:18 <mst> then splat those over onto the device
Apr 02 13:49:30 <mst> that should, in theory, give me an unf*cked n900
Apr 02 13:49:40 <V13> it is possible to only flash the rootfs... I did it the 2nd day i got n900 because I bricked it :)
Apr 02 13:50:00 <V13> don't remember how exactly but it is the first thing you'll do so you can't miss it
Apr 02 13:50:37 <mst> V13: right, but my phone is presumably a 1.0 UK so a 1.1.1 global image I probably want to do the kernel as well, no?
Apr 02 13:50:52 <V13> i believe it does it altogether.
Apr 02 13:50:55 <V13> don't remember
Apr 02 13:50:59 <mst> oki
Apr 02 13:51:16 <mst> I do like the fact that nokia have clearly expected people like us to do stupid things to our phones and brick them :)
Apr 02 13:51:16 <nidO> it does
Apr 02 13:51:22 <nidO> you just need the firmware image
Apr 02 13:51:30 <nidO> that unbricks the device and reflashes it entirely
Apr 02 13:51:36 <nidO> without touching the emmc
Apr 02 13:51:40 <mst> right. I'm trying to keep /home/user intact as well though
Apr 02 13:51:59 <nidO> home/user or /home/user/MyDocs?
Apr 02 13:52:17 <V13> both
Apr 02 13:52:35 <mst> MyDocs I have backed up; there's a few files of notes in /home/user/ I'd like to keep
Apr 02 13:52:59 <nidO> i didnt really see the start of this, is your phone bricked atm then to prevent you just moving them?
Apr 02 13:53:13 <mst> nidO: it somewhat boots but not sufficiently for me to get an xterm
Apr 02 13:53:59 <pupnik> dont mean to be a pest but can someone tell me what to search for to get current battery consumption on n900?
Apr 02 13:54:01 <mst> I attempted to apt some stuff onto it, filled /, tried to clean up after myself, screwed up somewhere
Apr 02 13:54:33 <MohammadAG_> /home/user, /home/user/MyDocs, and /opt are only cleared by flashing the eMMC
Apr 02 13:54:53 <nidO> the firmware flash keeps /home/user as well?
Apr 02 13:54:58 <MohammadAG_> (or till the next firmware is released, should start clearing /home and /opt when a reflash is done)
Apr 02 13:55:08 <MohammadAG_> nidO, yes, config files and the like are kept
Apr 02 13:55:35 <MohammadAG_> My XChat settings stay, as well as logs
Apr 02 13:55:42 <nidO> yeah does it just internally backup and restore config files it knows are there though, or will it keep the entire folder?
Apr 02 13:55:48 <MohammadAG_> do a backup to be sure, but I reflashed three times yesterday
Apr 02 13:56:05 <MohammadAG_> nidO, it won't touch it if you don't reflash the vanilla eMMC image
Apr 02 13:56:18 <mst> ah, the homedir is on the memory card?
Apr 02 13:56:26 <mst> I can see that making total sense actually
Apr 02 13:56:27 <Jaffa> X-Fade: Are you following up with achipa's email failure; or do you want me to?
Apr 02 13:56:34 <mst> then MyDocs is just a FAT chunk of homedir?
Apr 02 13:56:38 <nidO> I thought /home/user was on the rootfs and would get wiped
Apr 02 13:57:37 <V13> mst: the emmc has two partitions: A 2GB partition that holds /home and a 30GB partition that holds MyDocs
Apr 02 13:58:06 <ShadowJK> and a third partition for swap
Apr 02 13:58:09 <V13> right
Apr 02 13:58:15 <nidO> ah yeah course it is
Apr 02 13:58:27 <V13> and the 30G is in fact 28G
Apr 02 13:58:40 <nidO> /dev/mmcblk0p2            2.0G    239.2M      1.6G  13% /home
Apr 02 13:58:56 <V13> it's 2G ext3, 28G vfat and 768M swap
Apr 02 13:59:11 <mgedmin> 28.3 GB or 27.0 GiB
Apr 02 13:59:30 <V13> Jaffa: ping
Apr 02 13:59:48 <mgedmin> the whole eMMC is 31.2 GB or 29.8 GiB
Apr 02 14:00:11 <mst> V13: RAH
Apr 02 14:00:22 <mst> ok. I like this design.
Apr 02 14:00:29 <mst> it accomodates nicely for me being a complete idiot.
Apr 02 14:00:29 <mgedmin> I suppose the remaining 2.1 GiB are used for write leveling?
Apr 02 14:00:32 <mst> I approve of this :)
Apr 02 14:00:41 <mgedmin> do flash memory chips come in powers of two?
Apr 02 14:01:23 * V13 thinks for a number of jokes for mgedmin's expression
Apr 02 14:03:03 * noobmonk3y waves
Apr 02 14:03:22 <nidO> just got up?
Apr 02 14:03:25 <V13> so.. any help on uploading a screenshot for a project in maemo extras ?
Apr 02 14:03:48 <mgedmin> V13, log in
Apr 02 14:04:00 <V13> did
Apr 02 14:04:01 <MohammadAG_> <mst> ah, the homedir is on the memory card?
Apr 02 14:04:01 <mgedmin> then at the top of the page you'll see a floating midgard menu
Apr 02 14:04:06 <mgedmin> it's under Page -> Edit, I think
Apr 02 14:04:23 <V13> mgedmin: Yes... that's what I'm trying to do. By "Edit" is grayed
Apr 02 14:04:28 <mgedmin> hm
Apr 02 14:04:29 <MohammadAG_> /home is on a 2GB partition on the eMMC, /opt is in home (/home/opt) and symlinked back to /opt
Apr 02 14:04:40 <noobmonk3y> lol been out all day :D
Apr 02 14:04:41 <noobmonk3y> car cleaning
Apr 02 14:04:47 <V13> mgedmin: And another project where I already did this and already has a screenshot, it doesn't work too.
Apr 02 14:05:06 <V13> mgedmin: That's why i pinged Jaffa
Apr 02 14:05:38 <V13> mgedmin: Or I'm doing something really stupid that I'm not aware of.
Apr 02 14:05:51 <mgedmin> it doesn't work for me either
Apr 02 14:06:12 <mgedmin> isn't it X-Fade's job to oversee the website?
Apr 02 14:06:18 * MohammadAG_ hits noobmonk3y with a proximity mine
Apr 02 14:06:31 <V13> mgedmin: Dunno :)
Apr 02 14:06:37 <nidO> all day to clean a car?
Apr 02 14:06:42 * noobmonk3y blinks
Apr 02 14:06:43 <V13> X-Fade: ping
Apr 02 14:06:45 <V13> :-)
Apr 02 14:07:01 <mgedmin> http://maemo.org/profile/view/xfade/ --> "I'm the maemo.org webmaster"
Apr 02 14:07:13 <b-man17>  /ping  X-Fade
Apr 02 14:07:15 <b-man17> ;)
Apr 02 14:07:48 <V13> b-man17: I'm betting on him using x-chat or another client that blinks when his nickname is mentioned :)
Apr 02 14:08:12 <MohammadAG_> member since 1970?
Apr 02 14:08:15 * noobmonk3y farts
Apr 02 14:09:03 <nidO> good old epoch timing
Apr 02 14:09:04 * MohammadAG_ sees how noobmonk3y fills up the IRC logs with some weird stuff :P
Apr 02 14:09:13 <noobmonk3y> yup ;)
Apr 02 14:09:18 <mgedmin> ah, attention-seekers
Apr 02 14:09:28 * mgedmin hides
Apr 02 14:10:09 * noobmonk3y is gonna update another version of healthcheck into dev ..... nothing else to do
Apr 02 14:10:15 * lcuk waves @ mgedmin 
Apr 02 14:11:30 <nidO> start pushing to testing as well tbh
Apr 02 14:12:15 * b-man17 listens to some music
Apr 02 14:12:39 <Jaffa> V13: Not tried it recently
Apr 02 14:13:09 <V13> Jaffa: I thought you're the right one to contact for this. sorry.. it's X-Fade as mgedmin mentioned.
Apr 02 14:13:14 <MohammadAG_> noobmonk3y, proximity included
Apr 02 14:13:16 <MohammadAG_> ?
Apr 02 14:13:26 * MohammadAG_ readies a quad barrel shotgun
Apr 02 14:13:26 <noobmonk3y> naaaa not yet - still focusing on menu bar and apps area
Apr 02 14:13:31 <noobmonk3y> its in my todo's :D
Apr 02 14:13:36 * MohammadAG_ fires
Apr 02 14:13:42 <noobmonk3y> lol
Apr 02 14:15:13 <MohammadAG> Frozen bubble's good, why didn't I install it when I saw it in the repos
Apr 02 14:15:35 <noobmonk3y> w000p uploaded
Apr 02 14:15:35 <Jaffa> V13: That's OK; glad to be thought of :-)
Apr 02 14:17:33 <mst> MohammadAG: ftw
Apr 02 14:17:38 <mst> and there's active development on it again
Apr 02 14:18:04 <johnsu01> oh, does it install now? it's been missing libraries every time I've tried
Apr 02 14:18:17 <mst> of course, as soon as this works again
Apr 02 14:18:24 <mst> I'm going to break it with apt again, most likely
Apr 02 14:19:26 <MohammadAG> johnsu01, got the libraries and optified perl-modules
Apr 02 14:19:34 <MohammadAG> they're still not in the repos, not sure if I should up them
Apr 02 14:20:17 <MohammadAG> plus I don't have the source (and don't want to rebuild them for maemo from scratch) so if I up them I'll put them in non-free
Apr 02 14:22:24 <mst> MohammadAG: if you talk to the sdl.perl.org guys
Apr 02 14:22:30 <mst> MohammadAG: I think they'd really love to help
Apr 02 14:22:51 <MohammadAG> optification?
Apr 02 14:23:12 <mst> MohammadAG: building packages for FB in general
Apr 02 14:23:28 <MohammadAG> they're already built
Apr 02 14:23:46 <MohammadAG> but they're not optified
Apr 02 14:23:58 <MohammadAG> I was able to optify the perl-modules package
Apr 02 14:27:10 <MohammadAG> does anyone know of a good hosting service?
Apr 02 14:27:26 <MohammadAG> Using ucoz for free at the moment, but it doesn't allow +15MB files
Apr 02 14:34:49 <talmai> when you put package to extras non-free repository, do you get any feedback on email or something.. how do you track what's happening with the package
Apr 02 14:40:44 <mgedmin> the N900 camera is too damn slow
Apr 02 14:41:02 <pronto> not really o.O
Apr 02 14:41:03 <SpeedEvil> you mean shitter lag?
Apr 02 14:45:41 <user_> hey guys
Apr 02 14:46:16 <user_> how are u doing
Apr 02 14:46:58 <user_> hi ganopp
Apr 02 14:48:20 <user_> hi
Apr 02 14:48:37 * mst tries to work out what account-plugin-haze does that telephay-haze doesn't
Apr 02 14:48:51 <user_> is anyone here
Apr 02 14:49:02 <user_> i got a problem
Apr 02 14:50:00 <mst> this is IRC. nobody's going to reply unless you say something useful.
Apr 02 14:50:21 <lcuk> mst, you broke the rules then
Apr 02 14:51:53 <user_> ok, can u copy your /etc/apt/source.list for my referenece?
Apr 02 14:52:20 <lcuk> /etc/apt/source.list is blank on device
Apr 02 14:52:48 <lcuk> /etc/apt/sources.d folder has a list of repos updated
Apr 02 14:52:49 <user_> .d
Apr 02 14:52:55 <MohammadAG> it's /etc/apt/sources.list.d/hildon-application-manager.list
Apr 02 14:52:57 <mgedmin> SpeedEvil, I mean "see cat sitting on laptop, pull n900 from pocket, open lens shutter, wait for camera app to start ... damn, the cat ran away"
Apr 02 14:52:59 <MohammadAG> lcuk, beat me to it
Apr 02 14:53:10 <mgedmin> it takes 2-3 seconds for the camera app to start up
Apr 02 14:53:33 <MohammadAG> how long does it take a normal camera to work from a pocket
Apr 02 14:53:38 <lcuk> mgedmin, downgrade your cat
Apr 02 14:53:49 <user_> i meant this, you know it
Apr 02 14:53:56 <SpeedEvil> ah
Apr 02 14:54:00 <user_> end wit .d
Apr 02 14:54:10 <lcuk> i would like to open shutter and take instant pics also
Apr 02 14:54:31 <SpeedEvil> lock camera-ui in RAM
Apr 02 14:54:53 <MohammadAG> SpeedEvil, it's already in RAM I think
Apr 02 14:55:02 <SpeedEvil> not all of it
Apr 02 14:55:40 <user_> i just need a repository address that have ettercap
Apr 02 14:55:47 <user_> can u help me
Apr 02 14:57:11 <MohammadAG> SpeedEvil, oh I see
Apr 02 14:57:17 <MohammadAG> ShadowJK, ping
Apr 02 14:58:14 <user_> help
Apr 02 14:58:30 <user_> SOS
Apr 02 14:59:08 <lcuk> is ettercap  in the maemo repository?
Apr 02 14:59:18 <MohammadAG> Nope
Apr 02 14:59:23 <ShadowJK> åpomg
Apr 02 14:59:25 <ShadowJK> pong
Apr 02 14:59:34 <MohammadAG> ShadowJK, hi
Apr 02 14:59:41 <mst> user_: http://lmgtfy.com/?q=n900+ettercap
Apr 02 14:59:41 <MohammadAG> just need to ask about the Mugen battery
Apr 02 14:59:49 <user_> in what repo, then
Apr 02 15:00:06 <MohammadAG> does it get rid of the blue haze problem in images?
Apr 02 15:00:41 <ShadowJK> MohammadAG, the entire cover is more or less the same black matte finish as the N900 cover.. so there's no blue and no chrome parts near the camera
Apr 02 15:00:46 <ShadowJK> it doesn't have a camera lens cover
Apr 02 15:01:19 <MohammadAG> did you find a workaround for the SD card problem?
Apr 02 15:01:39 <ShadowJK> I haven't really looked at it
Apr 02 15:01:48 <ShadowJK> but I imagine you could glue a magnet to the inside of the cover
Apr 02 15:02:10 <MohammadAG> I meant a software workaround :)
Apr 02 15:02:18 <MohammadAG> anyways, thanks mate :)
Apr 02 15:02:52 <SpeedEvil> isn't the case switvch IR
Apr 02 15:03:04 <SpeedEvil> so a white thingy
Apr 02 15:03:09 <MohammadAG> that's for the camera
Apr 02 15:03:43 <MohammadAG> I'm assuming flashlight won't work, as well as shortcutd/camkeyd
Apr 02 15:04:29 <MohammadAG> camkeyd might actually go into the dashboard if the camera key is pressed, it does that without the cover
Apr 02 15:04:59 <ShadowJK> Yeah the mugen cover works the same as N900 without any cover at all
Apr 02 15:05:11 <mst> nidO: cheers for the advice, all good now.
Apr 02 15:05:20 <mst> V13: cheers to you as well, mate.
Apr 02 15:05:27 * mst vanishes into the aether
Apr 02 15:11:14 <madduck> http://rss.slashdot.org/~r/Slashdot/slashdot/~3/lpm0jLfgpwk/-Intel-and-Nokia-Provide-First-MeeGo-Release
Apr 02 15:17:54 <ech0Asus> meego is out for n900?
Apr 02 15:18:05 <nidO> yes
Apr 02 15:18:17 <ech0Asus> aww man i just got meamo configured how i want :(
Apr 02 15:18:24 <nidO> so?
Apr 02 15:18:38 <ech0Asus> isn't it a replacement os?
Apr 02 15:18:43 <nidO> uh#
Apr 02 15:18:45 <nidO> no.
Apr 02 15:18:52 <nidO> this is the first meego code drop
Apr 02 15:19:00 <ech0Asus> ah ok so just for dev
Apr 02 15:19:07 <nidO> its like a 0.0.0.1alpha version
Apr 02 15:19:19 <nidO> no ui, no working user features, nothing
Apr 02 15:19:21 <nidO> its just a shell
Apr 02 15:19:37 <ech0Asus> well at least a shell now lol
Apr 02 15:19:43 <SpeedEvil> bash?
Apr 02 15:19:56 <nidO> yep
Apr 02 15:20:43 <iksaif> do anyone tried localepurge on n900 ?
Apr 02 15:20:57 <iksaif> I wonder how much space it could free ..
Apr 02 15:22:17 <ech0Asus> bbl guys need to study some :(
Apr 02 15:34:59 <MohammadAG> http://pastebin.com/0qHNm59p any ideas?
Apr 02 15:50:04 <iksaif> localepurge not working due to busybox :/
Apr 02 15:50:09 <iksaif> but deborphan is :)
Apr 02 15:55:08 <corecode> MohammadAG: on?
Apr 02 15:55:38 <MohammadAG> corecode, compiling wol in scratchbox, autogen doesn't seem to making the Makefile.in file
Apr 02 15:55:43 <MohammadAG> or the init directory
Apr 02 15:59:06 * noobmonk3y waves
Apr 02 15:59:41 <Arif_> soupmonk3y \o
Apr 02 16:03:48 <noobmonk3y> soupmonkey? lol
Apr 02 16:07:19 * SpeedEvil wants to see a monkey on a segway with a bowl of soup.
Apr 02 16:07:54 <b-man17> that was completely random xD
Apr 02 16:11:08 * lcuk returns with beer
Apr 02 16:11:47 <thresh> :(
Apr 02 16:12:35 * MohammadAG sees a flashing !, expects PR1.2, finds out it's healthcheck
Apr 02 16:17:17 <Jaffa> X-Fade: ping
Apr 02 16:17:22 <Jaffa> lcuk: good plan
Apr 02 16:17:52 * lcuk is going to kfc instead actually, beer will wait
Apr 02 16:18:34 * SpeedEvil ponders fried beer.
Apr 02 16:19:16 * noobmonk3y should be packing, grrrrrrrrr
Apr 02 16:20:00 <nidO> regular expressions are srsly the worst things ever /wrists
Apr 02 16:21:05 <SpeedEvil> na+h.
Apr 02 16:21:09 <dmj726_n900> Arif: have you tried any n900 themes?
Apr 02 16:23:47 <dmj726_n900> Arif_: actually
Apr 02 16:31:37 <Arif_> yes
Apr 02 16:31:43 <Arif_> I'm using dark sky
Apr 02 16:32:42 <RST38h> MOO.
Apr 02 16:32:51 <Arif_> OOM
Apr 02 16:32:57 <style> could you tell me fun g-sensor games
Apr 02 16:33:08 <Arif_> tuxrace
Apr 02 16:33:13 <Arif_> quake 3
Apr 02 16:33:25 <RST38h> Does g-sensor have anything to do with g-spots?
Apr 02 16:33:27 <MohammadAG> G-sensor, haven't heard that in some time
Apr 02 16:33:46 <Arif_> RST38h, you need to hold the phone in a specific spot for a while
Apr 02 16:33:48 <MohammadAG> RST38h, LOL I was gonna say that but thought it might not be appropriate
Apr 02 16:34:35 <SpeedEvil> also, it's not waterproof.
Apr 02 16:35:18 <RST38h> MohammadAG: You mean, it did not mention PR1.2? =)
Apr 02 16:35:29 <MohammadAG> haha
Apr 02 16:35:56 <Arif_> oo
Apr 02 16:35:59 <Arif_> a new !
Apr 02 16:36:03 <Arif_> and it's wormux
Apr 02 16:37:14 <dmj726_n900> does dark sky make it easier to read for you?
Apr 02 16:37:39 <Arif_> I set all font sizes below 18 to 18
Apr 02 16:38:28 <thresh> every time someone mentions PR1.2, god kills a kitteh
Apr 02 16:38:44 <Arif_> I do find it hard to read those yellow bars, though...={
Apr 02 16:39:05 * RST38h kills a hampster, preemptively
Apr 02 16:39:54 <DrGrov> Good evening, Happy Easter to all =)
Apr 02 16:40:10 <Arif_> happy rabbit/egg day
Apr 02 16:41:37 <DrGrov> thanks Arif_
Apr 02 16:41:48 <Arif_> as that's the only thing left of it ;(
Apr 02 16:42:51 * MohammadAG wonders why no one came up with a PS3 controller attachment for the N900
Apr 02 16:43:21 <Arif_> everyone loves the zeemote
Apr 02 16:43:33 <Arif_> or they got hte pandora :)
Apr 02 16:43:37 <MohammadAG> no attachments for that either
Apr 02 16:43:39 <MohammadAG> :P
Apr 02 16:47:57 <MohammadAG> RST38h, any idea where the icon for the task bar notification of xchat should be?
Apr 02 16:48:25 <dmj726_n900> I think I may have to make a theme since gray buttons probably suck for a11y.
Apr 02 17:00:08 <Seiya> hi
Apr 02 17:04:13 <ShadowJK> arithmetic is so fun in sh script :D
Apr 02 17:04:33 <Seiya> i want to update psx4all 0.3.7 but i need 2 packets (libhildon1, libhildonmime0), where i can do this?
Apr 02 17:05:11 <RST38h> Seiya: /msg X-Fade Please, fix autobuilder to build for the OS version everyone has
Apr 02 17:09:10 <slonopotamus> RST38h: does that help? :)
Apr 02 17:16:23 <uhsf> i tried everything from the wiki to set up usb networking but it still doesn't work. what is wrong with usb networking on the n900?
Apr 02 17:28:07 <uhsf> it may not be a problem with the n900, i suspect a problem with my linux workstation, what could be preventing usb network from connecting?
Apr 02 17:31:54 <MohammadAG> <Seiya> i want to update psx4all 0.3.7 but i need 2 packets (libhildon1, libhildonmime0), where i can do this?
Apr 02 17:32:06 <MohammadAG> I have the old file that works
Apr 02 17:32:30 <Seiya> 0.3.8 sry
Apr 02 17:33:27 <MohammadAG> Seiya, I have the old one
Apr 02 17:34:01 <Seiya> can you say me the version number
Apr 02 17:34:18 <MohammadAG> <Seiya> i want to update psx4all 0.3.7 but i need 2 packets (libhildon1, libhildonmime0), where i can do this?
Apr 02 17:34:19 <MohammadAG> oops
Apr 02 17:34:25 <MohammadAG> psx4all_0.3.1_armel.deb
Apr 02 17:35:04 <MohammadAG> you can try http://repository.maemo.org/extras-devel/pool/fremantle/free/p/psx4all/psx4all_0.3.3_armel.deb
Apr 02 17:35:05 <Seiya> i have 0.3.7 and it runs to but i hope the update brings better performence
Apr 02 17:35:17 <MohammadAG> Seiya, then wait for PR1.2 :)
Apr 02 17:35:55 <itdock> omg
Apr 02 17:35:57 <itdock> when is 1.2
Apr 02 17:35:58 <itdock> :P
Apr 02 17:36:02 <itdock> been waiiting forever
Apr 02 17:36:04 <itdock> :P:P:P
Apr 02 17:37:31 * itdock runs around in circles
Apr 02 17:38:03 <Seiya> give it a release date?
Apr 02 17:38:44 <MohammadAG> 2010
Apr 02 17:39:04 <Seiya> ahh
Apr 02 17:41:49 <b-man17> no, 2110
Apr 02 17:41:51 <b-man17> xDD
Apr 02 17:42:37 <Arif_> which one looks less crappy? http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.27621 http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.18994
Apr 02 17:43:26 <itdock> you shopping DX too?
Apr 02 17:43:31 <itdock> :P
Apr 02 17:43:33 <Arif_> yes :D
Apr 02 17:43:39 <Arif_> maybe they have PR1.2 for sale
Apr 02 17:43:44 <itdock> lol
Apr 02 17:44:15 <itdock> im buying more flashlights
Apr 02 17:44:31 <itdock> http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.33549
Apr 02 17:44:34 * noobmonk3y needs beer
Apr 02 17:44:59 <Arif_> those Chinese flashlights are awesome
Apr 02 17:45:32 <itdock> i have one already, this one has the latest R5 emitter
Apr 02 17:52:42 <itdock> i got this too
Apr 02 17:52:42 <itdock> http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.2041
Apr 02 17:52:48 <itdock> for no particular reason lol
Apr 02 17:55:29 <Proteous> heh
Apr 02 17:59:40 <Arif_> oo,snowball
Apr 02 18:01:09 <itdock> lol
Apr 02 18:03:25 <jacekowski> have anybody tried meego?
Apr 02 18:03:32 <Stskeeps> yes, shiny xterm
Apr 02 18:03:44 <jacekowski> in meego?
Apr 02 18:03:50 <Stskeeps> yes
Apr 02 18:03:55 <Stskeeps> it's supposed to be like that
Apr 02 18:04:01 <jacekowski> screenshot
Apr 02 18:04:21 <Stskeeps> it's an xterm
Apr 02 18:04:24 <Stskeeps> i am not kidding
Apr 02 18:04:24 <Stskeeps> :P
Apr 02 18:04:34 <itdock> and thats all you get
Apr 02 18:04:35 <itdock> no other interface
Apr 02 18:04:50 <jacekowski> no way?
Apr 02 18:04:59 <itdock> just imagine a black part of the screen that is 2/3 of the screen with some text on it
Apr 02 18:05:00 <itdock> thats it
Apr 02 18:05:01 <jacekowski> 1st april was yesterday
Apr 02 18:05:02 <nidO> why would you expect more?
Apr 02 18:05:13 <nidO> its what was announced would be there a while ago
Apr 02 18:05:24 <itdock> meego is released
Apr 02 18:05:28 <Stskeeps> it is not a release
Apr 02 18:05:29 <Stskeeps> :P
Apr 02 18:05:33 <Stskeeps> it's a codedrop
Apr 02 18:05:35 <itdock> for developers only
Apr 02 18:05:46 <itdock> it is not usable as a phone OS
Apr 02 18:05:51 <nidO> meego day1 code drop = UX for netbooks, and none for anything else, with them being added over time between day1 and the May 1.0 intended release
Apr 02 18:06:03 <Stskeeps> nidO: intel images boot into a console
Apr 02 18:06:24 <nidO> whered the netbook ux go then
Apr 02 18:06:34 <Stskeeps> think the ux isn't entirely settled yet
Apr 02 18:06:44 <SpeedEvil> I had ux.
Apr 02 18:06:53 <SpeedEvil> But I eated it.
Apr 02 18:07:23 <RST38h> go extract it, quick
Apr 02 18:07:43 <RST38h> before it finishes transformation into symbian ux
Apr 02 18:07:45 * itdock gives heimlich maneuver
Apr 02 18:08:19 <KMFDM> use of rpm's is a bit disappointing
Apr 02 18:08:46 <itdock> ya, i want my super cow powers
Apr 02 18:08:46 <Stskeeps> sigh, we had this discussion
Apr 02 18:08:47 <Stskeeps> :P
Apr 02 18:09:17 * SpeedEvil fails to understand why people get all excited over packace formats.
Apr 02 18:09:49 <RST38h> gives them something to fight over
Apr 02 18:09:50 <lcuk> because many people use one format or another
Apr 02 18:09:51 <nidO> because puritan geeks who've made their choice on what they prefer become irrational in believing their way is best.
Apr 02 18:10:00 <lcuk> i have same format on laptop and on device at the moment
Apr 02 18:10:11 <ds3> bah packaging
Apr 02 18:10:14 <RST38h> because fighting over the right to keep your shoes on in the airport is hard.
Apr 02 18:10:14 <nidO> rather than understanding that for something like a package format, it doesnt make the slightest bit of damn difference
Apr 02 18:10:16 <lcuk> bah indeed
Apr 02 18:10:31 * lcuk still strongly advocates installshield
Apr 02 18:10:42 <SpeedEvil> pkgtool
Apr 02 18:10:51 <itdock> ew
Apr 02 18:10:53 * RST38h sticks lcuk with the Microsoft Clippy
Apr 02 18:11:13 <V13> nid0 or perhaps because most of all who used deb (plus all extra tools like the builder, apt, repositories, plus all the nice things like common arch packages, multi-arch, etc) liked them very much :P
Apr 02 18:11:19 * lcuk installs Norton AntiVirus on RST38h's computer
Apr 02 18:11:31 <lcuk> gor is it called something else now
Apr 02 18:11:36 * V13 flamed
Apr 02 18:12:18 <itdock> i want this under my desk
Apr 02 18:12:18 <itdock> http://www.supermicro.com/a_images/banner/banner_xeon_7500.jpg
Apr 02 18:12:22 <nidO> yes, they do like them, just like lots of people that use rpm like that, yet when all is said and done, which ultimately gets used doesnt matter in the least
Apr 02 18:12:40 <nidO> I prefer nano over vi or emacs, but at the end of the day whichever I use, the file still gets edited.
Apr 02 18:12:59 <RST38h> itdock: would you prefer a woman instead, though?
Apr 02 18:13:07 <V13> lets summarize to this: Will it be possible to do SSUs with RPM?
Apr 02 18:13:14 <Stskeeps> of course
Apr 02 18:13:14 <lcuk> +1 RST38h
Apr 02 18:13:24 <V13> Stskeeps: The whole system?
Apr 02 18:13:24 <Stskeeps> it might even be saner
Apr 02 18:13:29 <Stskeeps> V13: yes, why not
Apr 02 18:13:32 <nidO> ofc
Apr 02 18:13:32 <Stskeeps> also
Apr 02 18:13:39 <Stskeeps> yum or zypper vs apt-get
Apr 02 18:13:43 <Stskeeps> not rpm vs apt-get
Apr 02 18:13:45 <lcuk> pacman!
Apr 02 18:13:45 <V13> dunno.. last time i checked rpm (some years ago) couldn't do that
Apr 02 18:13:54 <V13> wait.. that's not all..
Apr 02 18:13:55 <Stskeeps> V13: of course, rpm is comparable to dpkg
Apr 02 18:14:00 <nidO> yeah and thats the problem V13
Apr 02 18:14:04 <V13> i didn't ask for an automated package download tool.
Apr 02 18:14:14 <Stskeeps> apt-get's one
Apr 02 18:14:15 <Stskeeps> :P
Apr 02 18:14:18 <nidO> a lot of people bemoaning rpm are comparing what deb can do now with what rpm could do a decade ago
Apr 02 18:14:26 <V13> I'm not talking about apt but about deb
Apr 02 18:14:29 <nidO> because thats the last time they used it
Apr 02 18:14:41 <V13> will it be possible to upgrade the system with rpm, without a reflash?
Apr 02 18:14:45 <nidO> yes
Apr 02 18:14:55 <V13> i.e. handle all package upgrades
Apr 02 18:14:58 <nidO> yes
Apr 02 18:15:04 <V13> then it's ok
Apr 02 18:20:39 <itdock> RST38h: already have one, need machine now
Apr 02 18:21:01 <RST38h> get the second one, forget about that machine
Apr 02 18:21:09 <itdock> lol
Apr 02 18:21:28 <Chiku|dc> PR 1.2 is not relaesed yet? :(
Apr 02 18:21:43 <V13> it did
Apr 02 18:21:48 * V13 runs
Apr 02 18:22:29 <thresh> every time someone mentions PR1.2, god kills a kitteh
Apr 02 18:22:38 <Arif_> PR1.3 is due next week
Apr 02 18:22:41 <Arif_> who needs PR1.2
Apr 02 18:23:01 <Chiku|dc> need to reflash my n900
Apr 02 18:23:13 * SpeedEvil is waiting for PRsqrt(2)
Apr 02 18:23:50 <nidO> im sure we'll get to 1.4.1 sooner or later
Apr 02 18:24:03 <V13> the real question is: Is pr1.2 released for testing yet?
Apr 02 18:24:08 <Arif_> or Moogo
Apr 02 18:35:57 <marcus> Heya guys
Apr 02 18:36:36 <marcus> DocScrutinizer: Appearently that trouble I had with accelerometer yesterday, was fixed by a simple reboot. (: Works perfect now.
Apr 02 18:36:37 <lcuk> yo! marcus
Apr 02 18:36:51 <V13> marcus: it was reporting nonsense?
Apr 02 18:37:29 <marcus> V13: Nah, but acting annoying. When I was in Bounce Evolution (the game) it went straight to the right. And the flip to start phone app didnt work
Apr 02 18:37:32 <marcus> But after reboot it did.
Apr 02 18:38:09 <V13> there is an open bug report for something similar. It becomes unusable and gets fixed when you turn-off and on
Apr 02 18:38:21 <V13> a reboot did not fix it for me. I had to turn n900 off
Apr 02 18:39:28 <marcus> V13: Sounds like the problem I had. (I just said reboot instead of turn off -> Start)
Apr 02 18:39:32 <lcuk> wheres the bug for accelerometer
Apr 02 18:40:46 <V13> https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=6996
Apr 02 18:40:48 <povbot> Bug 6996: Accelerometer uncalibrated after reboot
Apr 02 18:42:30 <marcus> and I finally got it updated using my GFs network... lawl
Apr 02 18:45:30 <marcus> If I install extras-devel, do I then see the apps like normal via program manager? Or do I need to use apt-get
Apr 02 18:45:39 <V13> see
Apr 02 18:45:42 <lcuk> thanks V13
Apr 02 18:45:46 <V13> yw
Apr 02 18:48:08 <marcus> Do you guys use built-in browser or firefox? and why?
Apr 02 18:48:59 <nidO> microb's better
Apr 02 18:49:15 <DrGrov> wtf? PR 1.2 out for download?
Apr 02 18:49:26 <thresh> every time someone mentions PR1.2, god kills a kitteh
Apr 02 18:49:40 <thresh> i should probably put that in auto-reply
Apr 02 18:50:02 * RST38h mentions PR1.2 in vain, again and again, just to watch poor kitten ghosts rise to the skies from all around
Apr 02 18:50:55 <lcuk> whack-a-kitty: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q_udqEp_YR4
Apr 02 18:51:33 <DrGrov> thresh: sounds like a challenge. i wonder if there is enough kittens around for me to keep mentioning PR 1.2
Apr 02 18:52:44 * lcuk hopes the poor kittens get brought back to life as lions and tigers
Apr 02 18:54:01 <RST38h> lcuk: The dirty little secret is, everyone gets brought back to life as an insect, to conserve space.
Apr 02 18:54:36 <lcuk> what about insects themselves?
Apr 02 18:55:01 <lcuk> and you cannot discount leprechauns
Apr 02 18:56:38 <Arif_> hmm
Apr 02 18:56:43 <Arif_> since Monday is a holiday too
Apr 02 18:56:48 <Arif_> don't expect it then either :D
Apr 02 18:56:56 <RST38h> lcuk: insects just die, sorry
Apr 02 18:57:01 <nidO> no holiday here :(
Apr 02 18:57:03 <Stskeeps> every time someone mentions PR1.2, it gets delayed a day
Apr 02 18:57:04 <Stskeeps> :P
Apr 02 18:57:28 <Arif_> /timer 0 1 msg #maemo pr1.2
Apr 02 18:57:29 <Arif_> :D
Apr 02 18:58:09 <SpeedEvil> microb is doing odd shit for me
Apr 02 18:58:28 <Arif_> its working? :O
Apr 02 18:58:32 <MohammadAG> lol
Apr 02 18:58:35 <SpeedEvil> afgter using it heavily, it will start not loading pages
Apr 02 18:58:53 <MohammadAG> happened on the SDK (PR1.2) too
Apr 02 18:58:56 <Arif_> oh yeas
Apr 02 18:58:58 <Arif_> I have that too
Apr 02 18:58:59 <MohammadAG> had to restart the SDK
Apr 02 18:59:03 <Arif_> the blue bar fills
Apr 02 18:59:09 <Arif_> but the page stays blank
Apr 02 18:59:10 <SpeedEvil> reboot fixes
Apr 02 18:59:12 <SpeedEvil> yes
Apr 02 18:59:15 <SpeedEvil> that
Apr 02 18:59:29 <Arif_> you're not alone :>
Apr 02 19:01:12 <marcus> Anyone know how to make python set the screen brightness on maemo 5?
Apr 02 19:04:46 <SpeedEvil> how do I record the screen?
Apr 02 19:05:02 <SpeedEvil> I want to add a video of bugs in blocks
Apr 02 19:05:31 <lcuk> SpeedEvil, theres x11vnc afaik, and you can then do the recording off device
Apr 02 19:05:34 <marcus> dunno if RecordMyDesktop works for n900, works for ubuntu though :P
Apr 02 19:05:37 <SpeedEvil> hmm
Apr 02 19:05:42 <lcuk> but simplest and the thing most people do is just record using camera
Apr 02 19:06:10 <joga> using a camera has the benefit of documenting also how you use the device ;)
Apr 02 19:06:22 <SpeedEvil> my other camera broke, and I need to jigsaw 3 other cams to get it working again
Apr 02 19:06:25 <nidO> hm, there is a really easy obvious way to record whats onscreen
Apr 02 19:06:30 <nidO> I just cant remember what it is
Apr 02 19:06:35 <joga> I remember some prog in the repos
Apr 02 19:06:47 <marcus> do an endless loop of screenshots and then make a gif :3
Apr 02 19:07:03 <SpeedEvil> it's an action sxhot
Apr 02 19:07:15 <joga> or, hmm, maybe it was just xnee
Apr 02 19:07:21 <SpeedEvil> blocks does collision detection wrong
Apr 02 19:07:43 <SpeedEvil> take a zigzag block
Apr 02 19:08:10 <SpeedEvil> and a zigzag shaped hole, constrained on both sides
Apr 02 19:08:17 <Arif_> report a bug!
Apr 02 19:08:24 <SpeedEvil> you can slide the block into the hole
Apr 02 19:08:29 <joga> SpeedEvil: that's awesome!
Apr 02 19:08:30 <joga> ;)
Apr 02 19:08:46 <SpeedEvil> if you go fast
Apr 02 19:09:08 <SpeedEvil> blocks is strangely addictive.
Apr 02 19:09:21 <SpeedEvil> 10100 top.
Apr 02 19:10:45 <nidO> ah, is it load-applet that has an option to record screencasts?
Apr 02 19:13:53 <marcus> anyone know if urllib is on the n900 python?
Apr 02 19:15:28 <johnsu01> marcus: yes, at least in the python that's on mine :)
Apr 02 19:15:39 <marcus> johnsu01: Perfect! (:
Apr 02 19:29:59 * microlith wonders what process is killing his N900's responsiveness
Apr 02 19:30:09 <Stskeeps> browser, probably
Apr 02 19:30:57 <microlith> need something that logs processes when they exceed 50% usage for more than a few seconds
Apr 02 19:31:31 <lcuk> what happens when the logging process takes up >50% cpu?
Apr 02 19:31:54 <MaikB> The phone implodes :P
Apr 02 19:31:59 <microlith> Irony
Apr 02 19:34:21 <MohammadAG> <SpeedEvil> how do I record the screen?
Apr 02 19:34:34 <MohammadAG> very late reply, but the load-applet should have a screencast function
Apr 02 19:34:56 <MohammadAG> it will also use the microphone to record your audio, so be sure you don't have anything that you don't want heard :)
Apr 02 19:34:56 <SpeedEvil> wtf
Apr 02 19:35:16 <MohammadAG> what?
Apr 02 19:35:27 <_llll_> a load applet that records things?
Apr 02 19:35:42 <MohammadAG> weird, don't you think?
Apr 02 19:35:42 <lcuk> _llll_, feature creep
Apr 02 19:35:42 <SpeedEvil> I get 99% of the way through the bug - and the banner from xchat killed the entry somehow
Apr 02 19:35:51 * SpeedEvil sighs
Apr 02 19:35:59 * MohammadAG hits himself
Apr 02 19:36:06 <MohammadAG> sorry :(
Apr 02 19:36:14 * lcuk opens a beer and maliciously pours it down his own throat
Apr 02 19:36:28 <microlith> lcuk: what did you liver ever do to you?
Apr 02 19:36:32 <SpeedEvil> odd
Apr 02 19:36:45 <MohammadAG> SpeedEvil, sorry
Apr 02 19:36:47 <SpeedEvil> somdehow it instantly skipped back a page
Apr 02 19:36:50 <lcuk> microlith, its having a party
Apr 02 19:36:52 <SpeedEvil> forward worked
Apr 02 19:36:58 <MohammadAG> RST38h, when are you removing the banner?
Apr 02 19:38:58 * Arif_ yawns
Apr 02 19:39:35 * MohammadAG repartitions his microSD
Apr 02 19:39:38 * SpeedEvil wonders if bug 9826 is the silliest.
Apr 02 19:39:39 <povbot> Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=9826 Blocks collision detection bug
Apr 02 19:39:58 <Arif_> lol
Apr 02 19:40:19 <Arif_> fixed in harnmattan!
Apr 02 19:40:58 <_llll_> someone should make uptimed available
Apr 02 19:41:02 <SpeedEvil> RST38h: the banner is fine. I would like to be able to click urls in banners tho
Apr 02 19:41:52 <MohammadAG> SpeedEvil, there is a built in one, but it's like the SMS ones rather than a banner
Apr 02 19:42:10 <MohammadAG> the banner seems to "kill" multitasking (it blurs the button)
Apr 02 19:44:01 <SpeedEvil> what button
Apr 02 19:44:17 <MohammadAG> the dashboard button
Apr 02 19:44:18 <SpeedEvil> I like the banners - on balance
Apr 02 19:44:39 <MohammadAG> SpeedEvil, go to settings and enable the task bar notification, when you do I'll highlight you
Apr 02 19:44:48 <MohammadAG> (if you want to see if that's better)
Apr 02 19:47:06 <SpeedEvil> where in settings
Apr 02 19:47:35 <MohammadAG> Settings > Preferences > Alerts
Apr 02 19:47:54 <TheOne> hi @all
Apr 02 19:48:13 <style> hi
Apr 02 19:48:21 <MohammadAG> SpeedEvil, "Show tray balloons on"
Apr 02 19:48:24 <MohammadAG> hi TheOne
Apr 02 19:48:33 <TheOne> i have installed rootsh, so i can type root and get root priviliges
Apr 02 19:48:35 <style> tell me some fun apps for n900 :P
Apr 02 19:48:43 <SpeedEvil> hmm
Apr 02 19:48:46 <TheOne> can i set a root pw too?
Apr 02 19:48:56 <SpeedEvil> I like the modality
Apr 02 19:49:00 <TheOne> maybe with passwd ?
Apr 02 19:49:10 <_llll_> why not, TheOne ?
Apr 02 19:49:11 <TheOne> or does it only work with root
Apr 02 19:49:36 <TheOne> what would be the behaviour if i set a root pw and type root?
Apr 02 19:49:44 <MohammadAG> TheOne, you can set the pass by using passwd
Apr 02 19:49:44 <TheOne> would he ask me first?
Apr 02 19:49:55 <MohammadAG> for both root and user
Apr 02 19:56:00 <Lynoure> Whee, my little package, all optified and in the hands of the first tester :)
Apr 02 19:57:49 <TheOne> is it possible to use the n900 umts inet connectino via usb as a network device for my laptop?
Apr 02 19:58:06 <TheOne> if yes, can someone paste a howto link?
Apr 02 19:58:24 <_llll_> i googled for that the other day and found a link
Apr 02 19:58:37 <TheOne> i searched the wiki but i found only the bluetooth way
Apr 02 19:58:44 <_llll_> it wasnt very well written, but someone with time probably could have followed it
Apr 02 19:59:01 <_llll_> link was on maemo wiki iirc, but google worked quickly
Apr 02 19:59:38 <MohammadAG> TheOne, joikuspot
Apr 02 19:59:44 <MohammadAG> or MobileHotspot
Apr 02 20:00:03 <Tuxprobe> hiya, anyone knows about XMLTV grabbers for Maemo Fremantle??
Apr 02 20:01:11 <ptl_wants_PR12> gwibber is being ported to the N900
Apr 02 20:01:12 <ptl_wants_PR12> nice
Apr 02 20:01:12 <ptl_wants_PR12> :D
Apr 02 20:01:40 <tripzero> w00t
Apr 02 20:08:03 <TheOne> MohammadAG: the 2 apps work only via wifi
Apr 02 20:08:17 <TheOne> i want to use my mobile inet connection via usb
Apr 02 20:08:29 <TheOne> the n900 as a usb modem
Apr 02 20:09:06 <TheOne> so that i only have to enable 2G/3G and turn off bluetooth and wifi
Apr 02 20:09:17 <TheOne> to save a little more battery
Apr 02 20:09:45 <MohammadAG> TheOne, not sure but maybe you might be able to use Nokia PC suite
Apr 02 20:09:50 <MohammadAG> it should work as a modem
Apr 02 20:10:12 <MohammadAG> be wary that your operator might make you pay more to tether via Bluetooth or USB
Apr 02 20:10:23 <TheOne> i found that http://wiki.maemo.org/N900_USB_networking
Apr 02 20:10:32 <MohammadAG> so?
Apr 02 20:11:12 <TheOne> but thats excat the other direction
Apr 02 20:11:40 <TheOne> to connect to the n900 and use the laptop inet
Apr 02 20:12:13 <MohammadAG> http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=35680
Apr 02 20:12:18 <MohammadAG> umm
Apr 02 20:12:27 <MohammadAG> you want to use your laptop's internet on the N900?
Apr 02 20:13:28 <TheOne> no, i want my n900 internet at my laptop
Apr 02 20:13:35 <Arif_> Joikuspot
Apr 02 20:13:43 <Arif_> its 10 USD
Apr 02 20:14:08 <TheOne> exactly like Joikuspot, but not via wifi - i want it via usb
Apr 02 20:14:21 <Arif_> Nokia PC Suite
Apr 02 20:14:28 <TheOne> under linux?
Apr 02 20:14:38 <Arif_> no
Apr 02 20:15:17 <TheOne> i can not imagine i am the first one who ask for something like that
Apr 02 20:16:14 <TheOne> okay i think i have to figure it out otherwise, thx ;)
Apr 02 20:17:15 * Arif_ shrugs
Apr 02 20:22:23 * ptl_wants_PR12 facepalms
Apr 02 20:23:41 <ShadowJK> under linux I just changed /dev/rfcomm0 to /dev/ttyUSB0 or something like that iirc ;p
Apr 02 20:23:49 <ShadowJK> and intarwebs worked
Apr 02 20:23:56 <ShadowJK> with usb
Apr 02 20:24:49 <Arif_> ptl_wants_PR12, stop wanting stuff you know you'll never get
Apr 02 20:25:55 <ShadowJK> my silly bq27200.sh is up to 120 lines now :D
Apr 02 20:25:57 <ptl_wants_PR12> Arif_ :(
Apr 02 20:26:08 <ptl_wants_PR12> Arif_: not even if I fight for it?
Apr 02 20:26:19 <Arif_> never!
Apr 02 20:26:25 <Arif_> be happy with what you have now!
Apr 02 20:26:28 <ptl_wants_PR12> ShadowJK: is that the script for getting status/info from the battery?
Apr 02 20:26:33 <ShadowJK> yes
Apr 02 20:26:54 <ptl_wants_PR12> cool. Will you make some app out of it?
Apr 02 20:26:54 <ptl_wants_PR12> Arif_: that would be conformism!
Apr 02 20:27:05 <Arif_> ;p
Apr 02 20:27:11 <ptl_wants_PR12> ok, what about that: instead of fighting for it, I'll troll for it
Apr 02 20:27:20 <ShadowJK> ptl_wants_PR12, I want to make a script in the style of vmstat/sysstat/iostat for my own use
Apr 02 20:27:41 <Arif_> I'm already trolling enough for the whole channel
Apr 02 20:27:41 <Arif_> <3
Apr 02 20:27:59 <style> tell me some fun apps for n900 :P
Apr 02 20:28:40 <ptl_wants_PR12> ShadowJK: please share when you are done, that would be very interesting to me too, I use vmstat and iostat all the time at my job and would sure have some use for such a utility that queries the battery
Apr 02 20:28:51 <Arif_> style, define "fun"
Apr 02 20:29:20 <style> Arif_: well, something useful/games (maybe from extras-devel)
Apr 02 20:29:41 <Arif_> you're in the wrong place for that
Apr 02 20:29:51 <Arif_> #iphone is over there
Apr 02 20:29:57 <ptl_wants_PR12> style: gnumeric, abiword, quickpanorama (maemo select), AppWatch, burgerface, Duke Nukem 3D CD Edition, Numpty Physics
Apr 02 20:29:58 <style> ... :D
Apr 02 20:30:07 <evilrob> ShadowJK: where are you getting the battery info from?  I notice there isn't /proc/acpi/*
Apr 02 20:30:10 <style> ptl_wants_PR12: jeh tjanks
Apr 02 20:30:24 <ShadowJK> evilrob, straight from the battery chip
Apr 02 20:30:43 <ShadowJK> It will no doubt brick my N900 one day since bme also talks over i2c to the same script
Apr 02 20:30:51 <ShadowJK> to the same chip.-
Apr 02 20:31:04 <ptl_wants_PR12> ShadowJK: how's that? /dev/bme0 or something similar?
Apr 02 20:32:03 <ShadowJK> no through /dev/i2c-2
Apr 02 20:32:29 <ShadowJK> I'm using i2cget from i2c-tools to request arbitrary data from arbitrary addresses on i2c bus
Apr 02 20:33:25 <ShadowJK> this the data I currently dump and parse: http://pastebin.com/xpGzaHHE
Apr 02 20:33:26 <ShadowJK> :)
Apr 02 20:34:18 <MohammadAG> umm
Apr 02 20:34:30 <MohammadAG> does the N900 support multiple partitions on the microSD?
Apr 02 20:34:37 <ptl_wants_PR12> you stop bme, read it then restart, ShadowJK?
Apr 02 20:34:53 <ShadowJK> ptl_wants_PR12, -STOP signal to bme, read data, -CONT signal to bme
Apr 02 20:34:58 <ShadowJK> I don't want bme to access the chip at the same time
Apr 02 20:35:17 <ptl_wants_PR12> have you ever tried doing that to see what happens?
Apr 02 20:35:28 <ptl_wants_PR12> maybe there is no race condition, it's just a read, isn't it?
Apr 02 20:35:32 <ShadowJK> yeah dunno
Apr 02 20:35:43 <ShadowJK> bme only does a read every 10-30 secs or something anyway
Apr 02 20:35:49 <ptl_wants_PR12> MohammadAG: yes, it does, I've seen some reports of people making it work
Apr 02 20:35:59 <ShadowJK> so actually reading at the same time is a small probability to begin with
Apr 02 20:36:14 <MohammadAG> ptl_wants_PR12, not out the box then eh?
Apr 02 20:36:17 <ptl_wants_PR12> ShadowJK: might be but it would be very interesting to see what happens!
Apr 02 20:37:06 <ptl_wants_PR12> MohammadAG: I think it does out of the box, why wouldn't it? You'd just have to format it with a suitable FS then maybe changing some of the init scripts like mmc-mount and mmc-umount
Apr 02 20:37:07 <MrGoose> maemo 4 used to be semi-free (as in speech). Is maemo 5 too? Also are there any closed source components on the n900?
Apr 02 20:37:18 <evilrob> ShadowJK: I don't see how you could cause any problems since you're not writing back to the file (even dev entries are just files in unix)
Apr 02 20:37:19 <ptl_wants_PR12> MrGoose: yep, some thing.
Apr 02 20:37:29 <MrGoose> like what?
Apr 02 20:37:32 <MohammadAG> ptl_wants_PR12, I said multiple partitions :)
Apr 02 20:37:38 <ptl_wants_PR12> MrGoose: like the battery (bme)
Apr 02 20:37:39 <MohammadAG> not one ext3 partition
Apr 02 20:37:44 <ShadowJK> evilrob, some registers are 16bit and they have special behaviour
Apr 02 20:37:54 <MrGoose> and the wireless driver?
Apr 02 20:37:57 <MohammadAG> there doesn't seem to be a /dev/mmcblk1p2
Apr 02 20:38:05 <ShadowJK> If I read the first half of the register, and BME reads something else, and I try read second half, the chip might throw an error
Apr 02 20:38:16 <ptl_wants_PR12> MrGoose: I think the wireless driver is free
Apr 02 20:38:22 <ptl_wants_PR12> as in free speech
Apr 02 20:39:00 <MohammadAG> ptl_wants_PR12, umm AFAIK it's closed, since installing Mer requires that you copy the bin file from /lib/firmware
Apr 02 20:39:05 <evilrob> the i2c tools should handle that error.  spew the proper return code, fail your read perhaps, but not cause any hardware issues
Apr 02 20:39:34 <evilrob>  <-- old unix geek
Apr 02 20:39:56 <evilrob> concurrent read-only access shouldn't be a problem.
Apr 02 20:40:01 <ShadowJK> evilrob, I think "recovery" would be to read the failed register pair again, but if it was bme that did it and failed, I wouldn't know which one...
Apr 02 20:40:03 <ptl_wants_PR12> MohammadAG: then I am wrong, thanks for correcting me. :)
Apr 02 20:40:07 <ShadowJK> I just think it's safer this way :)
Apr 02 20:40:23 <MohammadAG> ptl_wants_PR12, np :p
Apr 02 20:40:34 * MohammadAG goes back to search for multiple partitions in fremantle
Apr 02 20:40:53 <ptl_wants_PR12> I thought it was free because it works so well in Mer and easy-debian
Apr 02 20:41:05 <ptl_wants_PR12> forgot that it could be because they use the binary drivers.
Apr 02 20:41:18 <evilrob> ShadowJK: fix the perms on /dev/i2c* to be 664 instead of 660, then run the program as non-root user, can't possibly write back to it then
Apr 02 20:41:53 <ShadowJK> evilrob, no no, what I'm saying is: reads have side-effects
Apr 02 20:43:11 <evilrob> a read should never cause a side-effect.  if it does, the i2c tools are broken.  it's possible that a read could fail if it's not atomic, and something changed the data being read, but there should be no side-effects of a pure read
Apr 02 20:43:59 <evilrob> I can fopen() with the read only flags and cruise through /dev/kmem all day and while I might get some read errors, not effect any running processes
Apr 02 20:44:28 <ShadowJK> evilrob, it's a common issue with i2c stuff
Apr 02 20:44:38 <evilrob> wow...  that's broken then
Apr 02 20:44:45 <ptl_wants_PR12> you guys are getting me curious
Apr 02 20:44:47 <ptl_wants_PR12> wellllllllllll
Apr 02 20:44:48 <ptl_wants_PR12> try it
Apr 02 20:44:55 <ptl_wants_PR12> try to read in a closed loop, ShadowJK
Apr 02 20:45:02 <ptl_wants_PR12> see if it gets some error or something
Apr 02 20:45:08 <ptl_wants_PR12> without stopping bme
Apr 02 20:45:08 <ShadowJK> Like, on the PC side, there are some hw monitoring chips that interpret reads as commands, and you actually give commands by reading addresses in certain order ;p
Apr 02 20:46:12 <ptl_wants_PR12> that seems lame, why they didn't do that with writes?
Apr 02 20:46:20 * ShadowJK shrugs
Apr 02 20:46:44 <evilrob> monitoring stuff usually sits between the bus and the chip.  I have a friend that writes mem testers
Apr 02 20:46:45 <ptl_wants_PR12> it's like using an input device for doing output, e.g. using your eyes to shoot laser beams.
Apr 02 20:46:58 <SpeedEvil> evilrob: the hardware - the I2C chips are not built to work that way always
Apr 02 20:47:32 <SpeedEvil> evilrob: A read can - and often does - change the state of the device.
Apr 02 20:47:45 <evilrob> so you can't write to the tester or read from it, but it will monitor certain ranges for read commands.  he explained that to me over beer long time ago....
Apr 02 20:48:03 <ShadowJK> As far as I can tell, reading the first part of a 16 bit register means "return lo byte, copy hi byte into comm buffer for transmission on next read"
Apr 02 20:48:53 <ShadowJK> the other 8 bits are copied from ram into comm buffer, so that the value isn't modified in between reads
Apr 02 20:49:02 <SpeedEvil> evilrob: fine - that at least requires writing a shim i2c driver
Apr 02 20:49:08 <evilrob> well the unix geek in me feels that's broken implementation.  but in any case, I'm going home.  everyone else has already left the office
Apr 02 20:49:18 <SpeedEvil> evilrob: the hardware - the I2C chips are not built to work that way always
Apr 02 20:49:34 <SpeedEvil> the designers don't care what you think.
Apr 02 20:49:35 <evilrob> SpeedEvil: yes.  I read that the last time you wrote it
Apr 02 20:49:49 <evilrob> wow.. arrogant much?
Apr 02 20:50:01 <ShadowJK> evilrob, it's not something that can be fixed in software without a driver that sits as arbitrator enforcing the hardware's limitations on software :)
Apr 02 20:50:33 <MrGoose> ptl_wants_PR12: right thanks
Apr 02 20:50:39 <SpeedEvil> a per-device driver that knows all devices quirks.
Apr 02 20:50:46 <ShadowJK> yes
Apr 02 20:50:47 <SpeedEvil> magically.
Apr 02 20:51:01 <evilrob> there's no magic in writing device drivers
Apr 02 20:51:02 <ShadowJK> i2c-tools is just a way to send arbitrary read or write requests onto i2c bus
Apr 02 20:51:06 <SpeedEvil> as some have no public docs
Apr 02 20:51:17 <ShadowJK> bq27200 has public docs
Apr 02 20:53:36 <ShadowJK> And a kernel driver, that's not used in mameo
Apr 02 20:53:37 <ShadowJK> maemo*
Apr 02 20:55:34 <SpeedEvil> does bme use the bq?
Apr 02 20:58:00 <ShadowJK> SpeedEvil, we know of two chips on i2c-2 that do not have a /sys node. bme has opened /dev/i2c-2 twice. I do not consider this a coincidence :)
Apr 02 20:58:26 <SpeedEvil> ah
Apr 02 20:58:45 <SpeedEvil> bq* and gaia?
Apr 02 20:59:58 <ShadowJK> no gaia has many sysfs nodes :)
Apr 02 21:00:34 <ShadowJK> battery charger (bq24150?) and battery gas gauge (bq27200)
Apr 02 21:01:19 <ShadowJK> I haven't confirmed it's actually talking to those two, but the schematics has nothing else on i2c-2 that doesn't also have a /sys node..
Apr 02 21:02:54 <TheOne> hi, me again
Apr 02 21:02:58 <ptl_demands_PR12> hello
Apr 02 21:03:16 <TheOne> is iptables avaible for maemo?
Apr 02 21:03:17 <ptl_demands_PR12> solved your doubt?
Apr 02 21:03:20 <ptl_demands_PR12> yes
Apr 02 21:03:22 <ptl_demands_PR12> but
Apr 02 21:03:40 <ptl_demands_PR12> the stock kernel does not have NAT/masquerading
Apr 02 21:03:43 <ptl_demands_PR12> you'll have to recompile a new one if you plan to use that.
Apr 02 21:03:58 <TheOne> f**k
Apr 02 21:03:59 <ptl_demands_PR12> you can get the one from the mobile hotspot app
Apr 02 21:04:19 <uhsf> i follow the wiki to the letter to set up usb networking but why is it still impossible to ping my linux workstation from my n900?
Apr 02 21:04:25 <TheOne> if i install mobile hotspot i get an iptables too?
Apr 02 21:04:28 <C-S-B-N900> ouch, stuck on 2g.
Apr 02 21:04:28 <C-S-B-N900> is thay gprs?
Apr 02 21:04:50 <ptl_demands_PR12> no, you'll have to do it manually, because that's tinkering with very basic software. The instructions are on the page, TheOne
Apr 02 21:05:24 <C-S-B-N900> ptl_demands_PR12: nice nick, lol
Apr 02 21:05:26 <TheOne> ohh what a pain to get this working
Apr 02 21:05:39 <C-S-B-N900> ptl_demands_PR12: wouldn't make any sense in another chan.
Apr 02 21:06:11 <ptl_demands_PR12> TheOne: hopefully they'll finish the userland NAT implementation (it seems to be barely working) and we'll be able to do it more easily.
Apr 02 21:06:29 <ptl_demands_PR12> C-S-B-N900: yes, but my life is stalled due to this delay
Apr 02 21:07:00 <ptl_demands_PR12> I will get back to programming as soon as PR1.2 is out. So, yes, I am not exaggerating. My vacation starts today
Apr 02 21:07:52 <ptl_demands_PR12> It's already a disrespect. If they don't plan to release it in a timely manner, fine, but at least lend the base software bugs to the community.
Apr 02 21:08:03 <TheOne> ptl_demands_PR12: before i compile something, do you think my plan would work
Apr 02 21:08:04 <TheOne> http://wiki.maemo.org/N900_USB_networking
Apr 02 21:08:08 <uhsf> anyone here can use usb networking with a n900?
Apr 02 21:08:20 <TheOne> i try to reverse the masquerading
Apr 02 21:08:55 <TheOne> but there you see that needs nat/masquerading
Apr 02 21:09:00 <ptl_demands_PR12> TheOne: what you want precisely? I forgot
Apr 02 21:09:07 <ptl_demands_PR12> TheOne: isn't that what you want? ---> http://anidel.blogspot.com/2009/10/n900-as-modem-for-ubuntu-910.html
Apr 02 21:09:17 <TheOne> n900 internet via usb on my laptop
Apr 02 21:10:57 <TheOne> ptl_demands_PR12: that looks good, but without any hard config changes ?
Apr 02 21:11:15 <ptl_demands_PR12> TheOne: it seems so, I haven't tried it myself.
Apr 02 21:12:25 <TheOne> i will try that, looks much easier ^^
Apr 02 21:12:31 <PhonicUK> hey all, anyone really good at trig maths?
Apr 02 21:14:08 <godrik> PhonicUK: I guess it depends what you mean by really good
Apr 02 21:14:12 <godrik> just ask your question
Apr 02 21:14:49 <PhonicUK> Take a scene where you have a small flat plane, you are looking at it slightly off the ground so you can see all 4 corners
Apr 02 21:15:39 <PhonicUK> knowing the 2D position of the 2 opposite corners, I need to work out what angle the camera position and angle would be
Apr 02 21:15:56 <PhonicUK> in 3 dimentional space
Apr 02 21:16:05 <godrik> it also depend what kind of projection you are using
Apr 02 21:16:05 * Arif_ blinks
Apr 02 21:16:39 <PhonicUK> perspective projection
Apr 02 21:17:18 <SpeedEvil> #nats
Apr 02 21:17:22 <SpeedEvil> #maths
Apr 02 21:17:33 <PhonicUK> is empty :P
Apr 02 21:17:44 <PhonicUK> ah #math is not
Apr 02 21:18:04 <godrik> PhonicUK: it also depends at which height you want to be
Apr 02 21:18:19 <PhonicUK> well thing is im not sure what height i will be in
Apr 02 21:18:40 <PhonicUK> basically i've got an algorithm that can find the corners of a chess board in an image
Apr 02 21:18:56 <PhonicUK> and i want to render things on that chess board at the correct angle + size
Apr 02 21:19:07 <PhonicUK> so that it looks like they are on top
Apr 02 21:24:26 * noobmonk3y blinks
Apr 02 21:24:51 <Arif_> moo
Apr 02 21:24:53 * lcuk glues noobmonk3y's eyes shut
Apr 02 21:24:54 <uhsf> i've been trying to use usb networking since early january. nobody seems to know how to set up usb networking on the n900
Apr 02 21:24:58 <PhonicUK> so far I can locate the 4 corners, but dunno how to find out the 3D equivalent space
Apr 02 21:25:03 <lcuk> uhsf, theres a wiki page
Apr 02 21:25:19 <DocScrutinizer> PhonicUK: doesn't compute.
Apr 02 21:25:21 * noobmonk3y attempts to blink and rips his eyelids open.......
Apr 02 21:25:26 <noobmonk3y> eveil feckers in here i say
Apr 02 21:25:37 <PhonicUK> DocScrutinizer, Imagine I am looking at a picture of a chess board
Apr 02 21:25:41 <lcuk> uhsf, http://wiki.maemo.org/N900_USB_networking
Apr 02 21:25:48 <PhonicUK> if the 4 corners form a perfect square, I know I am looking directly down upon it
Apr 02 21:25:51 <uhsf> like i said, i followed the wiki to the letter and it's still impossible to ping my linux workstation
Apr 02 21:26:05 <PhonicUK> and the distance between the 4 corners lets me know how far away from it i am
Apr 02 21:26:20 <noobmonk3y> right gotta be up for a 5 hours drive early - speak to you all from the other side of the country tomorrow :D
Apr 02 21:26:32 <lcuk> gnite noobmonk3y
Apr 02 21:26:34 * noobmonk3y will be testing joikuspot :|
Apr 02 21:26:42 <DocScrutinizer> yep. with 3 corners it's solvable, not with 2
Apr 02 21:26:54 <PhonicUK> typo, i meant 3/4
Apr 02 21:27:08 <PhonicUK> i can locate all 4
Apr 02 21:27:26 <ds3> has anyone written a power usage meter for the status bar/area?
Apr 02 21:27:27 <PhonicUK> i take it you understand what im up to at this point
Apr 02 21:28:01 <DocScrutinizer> yup
Apr 02 21:28:28 <PhonicUK> any idea how to solve it?
Apr 02 21:29:09 <DocScrutinizer> Idea yes, nerves to solve it for you, no. Sorry really pissed as my fav phone is borked
Apr 02 21:29:14 <lcuk> uhsf, i hadnt read the scrollback
Apr 02 21:29:21 <PhonicUK> oh dear, what happened?
Apr 02 21:29:29 <lcuk> which linux distro are you running and is your desktop network configured strangely
Apr 02 21:29:50 <uhsf> doing exactly like in the wiki does not enable usb networking
Apr 02 21:30:12 <trumee> guys, i want to install portmap on my N900.
Apr 02 21:30:27 <trumee> apt-get install portmap
Apr 02 21:30:30 <lcuk> yeah, but the wiki does not know every single configuration or networking option checked etc
Apr 02 21:30:35 <trumee> E: Couldn't find package portmap
Apr 02 21:30:52 <uhsf> i have edited /etc/network/interfaces exactly like in the wiki
Apr 02 21:30:56 <lcuk> so, start with basics, whats your system - would there be a reason why normal instructions wouldnt work
Apr 02 21:30:59 <trumee> where can i find portmap? i want to mount some nfs folders
Apr 02 21:31:02 <ptl_demands_PR12> DocScrutinizer: what happened to your N900 (considering it's your favorite phone)?
Apr 02 21:31:08 <uhsf> then i did ifup usb0
Apr 02 21:31:17 * lcuk always has networking issues because im on a manual config
Apr 02 21:31:31 <DocScrutinizer> not entirely sure
Apr 02 21:31:46 <uhsf> then it's still impossible to ping ping 192.168.2.15
Apr 02 21:31:59 <lcuk> uhsf, we get that the steps didnt work - we get you followed the instructions, saying the same instrucitons again doesnt help
Apr 02 21:33:05 <uhsf> i don't know what else to do than hope for someone here to lead me on another hint because i've tried for so long now
Apr 02 21:33:43 <trumee> anybody?
Apr 02 21:33:44 <uhsf> the most important basic thing that the n900 should be able to do is totally broken and no one seems to notice
Apr 02 21:33:49 <lcuk> <lcuk> which linux distro are you running and is your desktop network configured strangely
Apr 02 21:33:59 <trumee> am i missing some repository?
Apr 02 21:34:00 * lcuk will stop trying soon
Apr 02 21:34:24 <SpeedEvil> DocScrutinizer: :/ It diddn't work on reassembly?
Apr 02 21:34:25 <uhsf> i'm using arch linux
Apr 02 21:34:39 <ptl_demands_PR12> trumee: I guess you'll have to port it using scratchbox. It's easy
Apr 02 21:34:42 <lcuk> trumee, use the maemo packages interface or google to find out if portmap is available and which repository its in
Apr 02 21:34:49 <ptl_demands_PR12> wait
Apr 02 21:34:50 <ptl_demands_PR12> no
Apr 02 21:34:56 <ptl_demands_PR12> there is a portmap already available.
Apr 02 21:35:07 <trumee> ptl_demands_PR12: where?
Apr 02 21:35:30 <ptl_demands_PR12> trumee: extras-devel and the tools repository. Both have it
Apr 02 21:35:59 <lcuk> ok uhsf thank you, now when you plug the n900 into usb - is it detected properly
Apr 02 21:36:03 <lcuk> is it on usb0 etc
Apr 02 21:36:03 <trumee> ptl_demands_PR12: thanks
Apr 02 21:36:10 <ptl_demands_PR12> yw
Apr 02 21:36:38 <lcuk> are you switching the n900 into its correct mode once you plug into usb
Apr 02 21:36:39 <ali1234> uhsf: pastebin output from dmesg and "ifconfig -a" on your workstation pls
Apr 02 21:37:20 <DocScrutinizer> SpeedEvil: screen dead
Apr 02 21:37:26 <uhsf> usb0: register 'cdc_ether' at usb-0000:00:1d.7-1, CDC Ethernet Device, 5e:25:a5:ec:e6:65
Apr 02 21:37:37 <DocScrutinizer> SpeedEvil: funny thing Ididn't touch screen
Apr 02 21:37:43 <SpeedEvil> DocScrutinizer: bugger.
Apr 02 21:38:00 <SpeedEvil> DocScrutinizer: did you try it before reassembly?
Apr 02 21:38:07 <ptl_demands_PR12> DocScrutinizer: hope you get your device back soon.
Apr 02 21:38:34 <DocScrutinizer> SpeedEvil: how??
Apr 02 21:39:08 <SpeedEvil> DocScrutinizer: bare pcb with lcd plugged - don't know
Apr 02 21:39:14 <uhsf> usb1: register 'cdc_ether' at usb-0000:00:1d.0-2, CDC Ethernet Device, 0e:01:5e:ec:b1:bd
Apr 02 21:39:35 <DocScrutinizer> nah, that's basically reassembled state
Apr 02 21:40:00 <uhsf> usb1      Link encap:Ethernet  HWaddr 0E:01:5E:EC:B1:BD inet addr:192.168.2.14  Bcast:192.168.2.255  Mask:255.255.255.0
Apr 02 21:40:03 <ali1234> uhsf: to pastebin.com, then give us the link
Apr 02 21:40:13 <DocScrutinizer> that's lower half with kbd and bare pcb, and upper half which wasn't tampered with
Apr 02 21:40:19 <SpeedEvil> ah
Apr 02 21:41:10 <DocScrutinizer> anf a F***NG FRI**N BLOODY FPC plus B2B connector :-(((
Apr 02 21:41:55 <Arif_> hmm
Apr 02 21:42:00 <Arif_> I found another media player bug
Apr 02 21:42:10 <Arif_> the song information stayst he same when a song switches sometimes....
Apr 02 21:44:28 <SpeedEvil> DocScrutinizer: Sorry. Thanks.
Apr 02 21:47:40 <uhsf> the output from dmesg and ifconfig -a is at http://pastebin.com/ZqcCSEmB
Apr 02 21:48:20 <ali1234> uhsf: why do you have two usbnet interfaces?
Apr 02 21:48:34 <ali1234> i suspect you are using the wrong one
Apr 02 21:51:30 <DocScrutinizer> SpeedEvil: thanks??
Apr 02 21:52:22 <uhsf> i have an open moko plugged in also
Apr 02 21:52:42 <SpeedEvil> DocScrutinizer: for the pics.
Apr 02 21:53:02 <DocScrutinizer> hmm, somewhat expensive pics
Apr 02 21:53:04 <uhsf> i will unplug my freerunner and troubleshoot only the n900
Apr 02 21:53:13 <DocScrutinizer> hoory netsplit
Apr 02 21:53:18 <ali1234> well, as long as you're sure you know which is which it should not matter
Apr 02 21:53:52 <uhsf> n900 was usb1
Apr 02 21:54:00 <SpeedEvil> yes. :/
Apr 02 21:54:17 <Arif_> ohwow
Apr 02 21:54:31 <ali1234> do you have tcpdump installed? try running it on desktop/usb1 and ping from n900
Apr 02 21:55:02 <trumee> can kmplayer access upnp server (mediatomb) like Media player
Apr 02 21:55:18 <trumee> i want to play some mkv files but media player refuses to play them
Apr 02 21:55:20 <ali1234> also try the reverse if you can get tcpdump on n900
Apr 02 21:55:32 <DocScrutinizer> SpeedEvil: wonder if a dmsg might help. but honestly I think I'm fsckd
Apr 02 21:55:47 <SpeedEvil> DocScrutinizer: sounds unlikely
Apr 02 21:56:14 <SpeedEvil> DocScrutinizer: static precautions i assume?
Apr 02 21:56:53 <DocScrutinizer> <20% humidity ;-/
Apr 02 21:57:15 <trumee> installed portmap and nfs-common, restarted the device. But /etc/init.d/nfs-common doesnt want to run
Apr 02 21:57:26 <ShadowJK> waaah, why is there no do...while construct in sh script
Apr 02 21:58:59 <DocScrutinizer> for ((;; while>0)); do decr while; done
Apr 02 21:59:09 <DocScrutinizer> bash
Apr 02 21:59:26 <trumee> rpcbind: server localhost not responding, timed out
Apr 02 21:59:30 <trumee> what does that mean
Apr 02 21:59:47 <trumee> RPC: failed to contact local rpcbind server (errno 5)
Apr 02 22:00:00 <trumee> i guess portmap is borking out
Apr 02 22:00:56 <trumee>  /etc/init.d/portmap restart  returns "Starting portmap daemon...Already running.."
Apr 02 22:01:24 <trumee> anybody got any idea why this might be happening. or is portmap broken in the repo?
Apr 02 22:03:11 <trumee> do i need to resort to samba now to mount my media!!!!
Apr 02 22:03:14 <trumee> crap!!!!
Apr 02 22:03:55 <uhsf> i don't know what command to use with tcpdump
Apr 02 22:04:04 <ali1234> tcpdump -n -i usb1
Apr 02 22:04:55 <uhsf> tcpdump: Can't open USB bus file /sys/kernel/debug/usbmon/0t: No such file or directory
Apr 02 22:05:04 <ali1234> hmm
Apr 02 22:05:17 <ali1234> it thinks you want to dump usb packets, not from usbnet
Apr 02 22:05:23 <ali1234> that kind of sucks
Apr 02 22:05:29 <ptl_demands_PR12> trumee: on talk.maemo.org some guy said: got it working using -o nolock,udp.
Apr 02 22:06:07 <ptl_demands_PR12> On the N900 the are some problems though:
Apr 02 22:06:07 <ptl_demands_PR12> - The portmap daemon won't ever start because for some reason, the init script detects "pidof portmap" as portmap itself so it says "Already running." To get it to start I had to edit the lauch script commenting that line out.
Apr 02 22:06:12 <uhsf> now since i switched the n900 to usb0 it seems i can ping but not ssh
Apr 02 22:06:34 <ali1234> well that's progress of a sort
Apr 02 22:07:02 <ali1234> apparently the usb issue with tcpdump is a known bug, you need to find the interface number with tcpdump -D then give the number as parameter to -i
Apr 02 22:07:21 <ali1234> but looks like packets are being sent now anyway
Apr 02 22:08:33 <uhsf> tcpdump -D says nothing
Apr 02 22:08:44 <trumee> ptl_demands_PR12: you are the man
Apr 02 22:08:53 <trumee> ptl_demands_PR12: -o nolock,udp worked
Apr 02 22:09:00 <ptl_demands_PR12> trumee: cool :D
Apr 02 22:09:08 <DocScrutinizer> SpeedEvil: the whole device is 8KV HBM
Apr 02 22:09:19 <uhsf> i still get the ssh: connect to host 192.168.2.14 port 22: Connection refused problem i have for many months
Apr 02 22:09:21 <ali1234> uhsf: try sudo tcpdump -D
Apr 02 22:09:35 <ali1234> tcpdump needs root access to dump packets
Apr 02 22:10:24 <ali1234> uhsf: if you can ping but get connection refused for ssh, it is probably a firewall issue
Apr 02 22:10:25 <uhsf> it gives 3 choices but none is usb0
Apr 02 22:10:40 <FredrIQ> here comes the netsplitmaker!
Apr 02 22:11:00 <uhsf> sshd is running on the n900 of course. and i have no firewall on my system
Apr 02 22:11:28 <lcuk> can you ssh into n900 from n900
Apr 02 22:11:53 <ali1234> perhaps sshd does not bind to the usb interface when it comes up
Apr 02 22:12:31 <trumee> is mplayer on N900 accelarated?
Apr 02 22:12:59 <lcuk> trumee, its got fast forward option
Apr 02 22:13:02 <trumee> i am playing a 1586Kbps mkv (mpeg4) file and it is struggling
Apr 02 22:13:20 <uhsf> lcuk: yes i can ssh to n900 from n900
Apr 02 22:13:24 <trumee> lcuk: 60% cpu
Apr 02 22:13:40 <lcuk> trumee, dunno
Apr 02 22:14:13 <trumee> lcuk: not cool.
Apr 02 22:14:26 <trumee> i guess i need to encode in mpeg1
Apr 02 22:15:52 <ptl_demands_PR12> mkv is resource-intensive even in desktop mplayer
Apr 02 22:16:00 <lcuk> trumee, i dunno what the normal bitrate is
Apr 02 22:16:07 <lcuk> or what res you are pushing
Apr 02 22:16:46 <trumee> lcuk: http://pastebin.ca/1855321
Apr 02 22:17:08 <ShadowJK> DocScrutinizer, time for, what was it called, kollekt ansamlen? :-(
Apr 02 22:17:30 <trumee> lcuk: that is mediainfo dump of the file
Apr 02 22:18:52 <ali1234> uhsf: well i don;t see anythin gfunny with sshd config...
Apr 02 22:19:51 <ali1234> can you ssh from n900 to desktop?
Apr 02 22:19:54 <uhsf> non
Apr 02 22:24:49 <uhsf> correction, i can ssh from n900 to pc now.
Apr 02 22:25:00 <uhsf> maybe things are progressing
Apr 02 22:25:45 <ali1234> uhsf: well, beats me. if you can ping both ways then the transport is working. and you must have a working transport to get back "connection refused" messages.
Apr 02 22:26:14 <ali1234> n900 to PC works... n900 to n900 works, pc to n900 does not work
Apr 02 22:26:27 <ds3> uhsf: can you do this on the n900: netstat -ant | grep 22
Apr 02 22:26:48 <ech0Asus> transfering what alil?
Apr 02 22:28:16 <uhsf> netstat: no kernel support for AF INET6 (tcp)
Apr 02 22:28:28 <ds3> any other output?
Apr 02 22:28:36 <uhsf> tcp 0 0 0.0.0.0:22 0.0.0.0:* LISTEN
Apr 02 22:28:51 <ds3> then ssh is setup
Apr 02 22:29:04 <ds3> what OS is your PC?
Apr 02 22:29:27 <ali1234> that indicates sshd should listen on all interfaces
Apr 02 22:29:32 <ali1234> very odd
Apr 02 22:30:06 <trumee> N900 cannot play dvd quality video (VOB). that is a bit of shame
Apr 02 22:30:20 <trumee> i tried kmplayer to play some VOB files.
Apr 02 22:30:25 <trumee> but it really struggled.
Apr 02 22:30:31 <uhsf> what ssh config file should i check?
Apr 02 22:30:42 <ds3> uhsf: what OS is on the PC?
Apr 02 22:30:48 <Arif_> who broke the ınternet
Apr 02 22:30:50 <ali1234> ds3: it;s arch linux
Apr 02 22:30:51 <uhsf> i don't remember editing any ssh file on the n900
Apr 02 22:30:52 <ShadowJK> intersting, my N900 had stopped charging while on charger and me sending SIGSTOP and SIGCONT to bme and reading bq27200 registers..
Apr 02 22:30:55 <uhsf> arch linux
Apr 02 22:30:58 * ShadowJK removes the STOP/CONT..
Apr 02 22:30:59 <trumee> this seems a bit bizaare to me. is that processer that weak or is it my nfs connection (over wifi)?
Apr 02 22:31:25 <DocScrutinizer> ShadowJK: well, maybe
Apr 02 22:31:45 <ali1234> uhsf: there's /etc/default/ssh and /etc/ssh/sshd_config
Apr 02 22:32:01 <trumee> anybody else played video files on N900?
Apr 02 22:32:02 <ali1234> but i don't think either one is going to help
Apr 02 22:33:03 <ds3> can you telnet to port 22 on the n900 from the PC?
Apr 02 22:36:45 <V13> you try to connect from pc to n900 over wifi and after some time it says host unreachable ?
Apr 02 22:37:08 <V13> (or no route to host)
Apr 02 22:37:54 <uhsf> ok i got it now, i can ssh from pc to n900 with usb network
Apr 02 22:38:48 <ds3> what was the problem?
Apr 02 22:39:18 <trumee> ok i copied the mkv to the device itself. mplayer does struggle to play it. so it is not my wifi connection then.
Apr 02 22:39:35 <V13> ds3: he didn't solve it. he just bypassed it using usb network
Apr 02 22:39:35 <trumee> next i need to try a dvd (mpeg2) quality vob file.
Apr 02 22:39:47 <ali1234> using usb network was the whole point
Apr 02 22:40:00 <V13> oh.. sry
Apr 02 22:40:28 <ShadowJK> trumee, what video codec and resolution is the mkv?
Apr 02 22:41:00 <lcuk> ShadowJK, (pasted a couple of minutes ago) http://pastebin.ca/1855321
Apr 02 22:41:24 <trumee> ShadowJK: http://pastebin.ca/1855346
Apr 02 22:41:31 <DocScrutinizer> ShadowJK: alas I don't see that happen
Apr 02 22:41:38 <ShadowJK> 720x576 h264 is slightly higher than what MPlayer can do
Apr 02 22:42:04 * ShadowJK wonders how much a new N900 costs these days
Apr 02 22:42:10 <DocScrutinizer> except if stskeeps maybe manages to send me a devel lendout
Apr 02 22:42:16 <trumee> ShadowJK: what should i reduce this to?
Apr 02 22:42:33 <trumee> ShadowJK: bought mine today 440 pounds in the UK
Apr 02 22:42:41 <V13> XXX x 480 ?
Apr 02 22:42:49 <V13> (not to exceed 800x480)
Apr 02 22:43:13 <ShadowJK> Well I'd rather not feed any h264 to MPlayer at all
Apr 02 22:43:46 <ShadowJK> But the default media player can play h264 baseline (which this file is not), at 800x480 just fine.. maybe even from .mkv with extra-decoders package
Apr 02 22:44:02 <ShadowJK> for MPlayer I'd just use mpeg4 asp (xvid) and stay under 800x480
Apr 02 22:45:48 <trumee> ShadowJK: bit disappointed with that. i was hoping to watch DVD vob rips on this. it cant replace my laptop now :(
Apr 02 22:46:08 <ShadowJK> might work if they're NTSC ;-)
Apr 02 22:46:19 <trumee> ShadowJK: will this work, http://pastebin.ca/1855352?
Apr 02 22:46:35 <trumee> ShadowJK: it a VOB file of a DVD.
Apr 02 22:46:53 <ShadowJK> it'd be interesting to see how MPlayer performs on it
Apr 02 22:47:06 <ShadowJK> mplayer -vo xv:ck-method=auto -quiet file.vob
Apr 02 22:48:22 <V13> fwiw, some test i did showed that xv is slow when resizing down
Apr 02 22:48:28 <uhsf> now, i can ssh from pc to n900 with usb network, but i can't ping google.com
Apr 02 22:48:48 <uhsf> or visit any website
Apr 02 22:48:49 <ptl_demands_PR12> might be a route problem
Apr 02 22:48:52 <V13> i.e. if you do the scaling with mplayer, and not let xv do it it plays faster (not enjoyable though)
Apr 02 22:48:54 <ptl_demands_PR12> adjust your default route
Apr 02 22:50:42 <trumee> ShadowJK: tried it. video is struggling
Apr 02 22:50:42 <ds3> uhsf: is your PC proxying?
Apr 02 22:51:26 <trumee> ShadowJK: i am playing the file over nfs.
Apr 02 22:52:02 <ShadowJK> you know on N8x0 playing stuff over wifi left only 60% CPU for MPlayer..
Apr 02 22:52:21 <ShadowJK> It's somewhat better on N900 but still significant
Apr 02 22:52:29 <trumee> ShadowJK: so it is best to copy the file locally and then trying?
Apr 02 22:52:48 <ShadowJK> Yeah I'd copy atleast the start of it to the device and then try
Apr 02 22:53:17 <uhsf> not proxying. i tried route del default
Apr 02 22:53:37 <ShadowJK> also, you can bypass pulseaudio and gain 5-15% or so by adding -ao alsa:device=hw=0.0
Apr 02 22:53:39 <trumee> ShadowJK: copying it.
Apr 02 22:53:40 <uhsf> like in the wiki. but still no outside ping
Apr 02 22:55:27 <trem> nite all, sweet dreams
Apr 02 22:55:33 <uhsf> how would you change route?
Apr 02 22:55:52 <ShadowJK> DocScrutinizer, so a new one seems to be about 500. I'll contribute 250 of that, taking a share in the disassembly risk
Apr 02 22:56:03 <uhsf> i tried adding nameserver 8.8.8.8 to /etc/resolv.conf
Apr 02 22:56:23 <DocScrutinizer> ShadowJK: no kidding?
Apr 02 22:56:37 <ShadowJK> No kidding.
Apr 02 22:56:41 <DocScrutinizer> deal
Apr 02 22:56:59 <DocScrutinizer> that's incredible, mate
Apr 02 22:57:07 <ds3> uhsf: is your workstation proxying?
Apr 02 22:57:15 <ds3> oops
Apr 02 22:57:28 <ds3> uhsf: you need to make your workstation proxy for you
Apr 02 22:57:39 <ds3> either through socks or NAT
Apr 02 22:57:58 <ds3> that or you can turn routing on there and tell your router about the new subnet reachable via the workstation
Apr 02 22:58:25 <uhsf> this wasn't necessary before
Apr 02 22:58:30 <DocScrutinizer> ShadowJK: best thing, you bought us a 'working' R&D device, and even some valuable spare parts
Apr 02 22:58:35 <ds3> uhsf: before?
Apr 02 22:59:37 <uhsf> i had it all set up already in early january, but after some update i never got usb networking to work again until now
Apr 02 23:00:02 <ds3> okay
Apr 02 23:00:13 <uhsf> i was able to browse the web without proxy or nat
Apr 02 23:00:14 <ds3> then *shrug* and off to the big blue yonder I go :D
Apr 02 23:00:26 <ShadowJK> DocScrutinizer, so, paypal or SEPA/IBAN?
Apr 02 23:01:50 <lcuk> uhsf, so we can mark this now as resolved?
Apr 02 23:02:19 <uhsf> as soon as i can ping google.com
Apr 02 23:02:58 * lcuk hides
Apr 02 23:04:46 <ShadowJK> DocScrutinizer, well "half" of a device, you'll still have to find the missing amount from somewhere ;-)
Apr 02 23:05:59 <uhsf> ty for helping, i tried to rush this troubleshoot today cause it bothered me for months and only now with the holiday i had time to go through this
Apr 02 23:06:00 <DocScrutinizer> I'll happily sell all the crap I got here, will suffice for the other half. (some FR, OMNIA, M800 ;-P )
Apr 02 23:06:33 <ali1234> uhsf: you can't do it without proxyarp or nat unless you have all public IP addresses, not to mention that if you want to access the internet on PC thru the N900 you should use the supported method for doing so, which is to use ppp on the cdc-acm device that also appears in pc suite mode
Apr 02 23:07:18 <uhsf> so, can you all confirm pinging the outside world through usbnetwork requires proxy?
Apr 02 23:07:19 <jacekowski> it would be nice to have AP in ad-hoc or master mode
Apr 02 23:07:58 <uhsf> i don't need the web through the n900. only the opposite.
Apr 02 23:08:49 <V13> uhsf: you mean without doing nat at the pc, using proxy-arp or adding a route for the usb-net subnet to the next router (most probably your adsl router)?
Apr 02 23:08:51 <ali1234> i see, well in that case, you still need either NAT or proxyarp
Apr 02 23:09:12 <ali1234> and i'm not sure if usbnet supports proxyarp
Apr 02 23:09:38 * lcuk is certain wifi would just hve been 100x simpler ;)
Apr 02 23:09:45 <V13> ali1234: i don't believe proxyarp can substitute nat.
Apr 02 23:09:49 <uhsf> "adding a route" to my router like V13 said seems the most logical. how to do this?
Apr 02 23:10:02 <lcuk> set gateway, add a route, bish bash bosh?
Apr 02 23:10:02 <V13> uhsf: you use linux ?
Apr 02 23:10:06 <V13> (at the pc)
Apr 02 23:10:11 <uhsf> yes
Apr 02 23:10:20 <ali1234> V13: it can in certain situations where you are already doing NAT... it can save you from dreaded double-nat
Apr 02 23:10:39 <V13> ali1234: don't think so. it will only 'substitute' the default route
Apr 02 23:10:43 <V13> or a wrong subnet mask
Apr 02 23:11:05 <uhsf> i use up route add default gw  192.168.2.14
Apr 02 23:11:12 <V13> uhsf: the easiest way is to do: iptables -A POSTROUTING -o eth0 -s USB-NET-WITH-PREFIX -j MASQUERADE
Apr 02 23:11:23 <V13> will result in double-nat but it won't cause problems
Apr 02 23:11:55 <V13> "iptables -A POSTROUTING -o eth0 -s 192.168.2.0/24 -j MASQUERADE" I guess
Apr 02 23:12:30 <ali1234> V13: for example if you have a lan, gateway at 192.168.0.1, a pc at 192.168.0.2, then a third PC can dial up on ppp to 192.168.0.2 and it will appear on the lLAN as 192.168.0.3 and be able to directly access the gateway with no magic routing
Apr 02 23:12:41 <ali1234> this could be applied here, perhaps, if usbnet supports it
Apr 02 23:12:59 <ali1234> so that instead of being 192.168.2.14 the N900 would get a LAN ip address
Apr 02 23:13:02 <V13> that will only work with ppp
Apr 02 23:13:26 <V13> unless you setup a host-route (/32) yourself for the 0.3
Apr 02 23:13:35 <ali1234> http://www.handhelds.org/hypermail/familiar/1/0123.html
Apr 02 23:13:35 <V13> which ppp does by itself
Apr 02 23:13:45 <ali1234> how to do it on usbnet ^
Apr 02 23:14:31 <ali1234> or so it claims, i have not tried it, or even read the instructions to deeply :)
Apr 02 23:14:49 <V13> add routing entry for ipaq only (on pc):
Apr 02 23:15:03 <V13> the next line after that should have /32, which is what i just described :)
Apr 02 23:15:20 <ali1234> yeah, i guess ppp does do that autoatically
Apr 02 23:15:28 <ali1234> still, you are using proxy-arp
Apr 02 23:15:36 <V13> yes
Apr 02 23:15:47 <V13> but all this is hocus-pocus
Apr 02 23:16:05 <V13> you can achieve the same thing by bridging eth0 and usb0
Apr 02 23:16:13 <ali1234> good point
Apr 02 23:16:14 <ds3> proxy-arp requires the device to be on the same subnet; per the pastebin, they are not
Apr 02 23:16:33 <ali1234> bridging is probably an even better idea
Apr 02 23:16:39 <trumee> ShadowJK: mplayer -vo xv:ck-method=auto  -ao alsa:device=hw=0.0   -quiet  file.vob, video is very smooth but no audio
Apr 02 23:16:50 <V13> ds3: they're on 192.168.0.0/24
Apr 02 23:16:55 <ShadowJK> trumee, is your device set to silent? :P
Apr 02 23:16:59 <trumee> ShadowJK: i think it is the AC3 audio which is killing N900
Apr 02 23:17:06 <trumee> ShadowJK: no it is not
Apr 02 23:17:14 <ShadowJK> was there audio without -ao alsa?
Apr 02 23:17:43 <uhsf> V13: in my network startup script on my pc, i have iptables -t nat -A POSTROUTING -o eth0 -s 192.168.2.15 -j MASQUERADE ; echo 1 > /proc/sys/net/ipv4/ip_forward. it that correct?
Apr 02 23:18:00 <V13> i believe yes
Apr 02 23:18:04 <V13> doesn't it work ?
Apr 02 23:18:17 <uhsf> i can't ping google.com with this
Apr 02 23:18:17 <trumee> ShadowJK: yes there is audio without -ao alsa
Apr 02 23:18:22 <V13> assuming that 192.168.2.15 is the address of n900
Apr 02 23:18:22 <ds3> V13: per the pastebin - eth0 is 192.168.1.0/24 and usb1 is 192.168.2.0/24
Apr 02 23:18:27 <ds3> is that no longer valid?
Apr 02 23:18:32 <DocScrutinizer> (<ShadowJK> intersting, my N900 had stopped charging while...) exceeded the 32sec safeguard watchdog timer?
Apr 02 23:18:47 <V13> ds3: sorry.. my wrong. I thought you were refering to the mail pointed by ali1234...
Apr 02 23:18:55 <jacekowski> DocScrutinizer: 32sec what?
Apr 02 23:19:02 <trumee> ShadowJK: it seems there  is audio/video sync problem
Apr 02 23:19:04 <V13> ds3: what's the pastebin that shows that ?
Apr 02 23:19:14 <ShadowJK> DocScrutinizer, maybe
Apr 02 23:19:26 <trumee> ShadowJK: video and audio seem to be playing ok
Apr 02 23:19:38 <trumee> ShadowJK: but with a massive out of sync
Apr 02 23:19:42 <ShadowJK> -framedrop
Apr 02 23:19:53 <jacekowski> just press letter d
Apr 02 23:19:57 <ShadowJK> or that
Apr 02 23:20:04 <jacekowski> but it's suboptimal solution
Apr 02 23:20:17 <jacekowski> way framedrop works is realy bad on n900
Apr 02 23:20:24 <jacekowski> i had like 0.2 fps with it
Apr 02 23:20:31 <jacekowski> and 15 without it
Apr 02 23:20:33 <trumee> ShadowJK: yup, d worked
Apr 02 23:20:52 <trumee> ShadowJK: very smooth
Apr 02 23:20:57 <trumee> ShadowJK: this works
Apr 02 23:21:05 <ShadowJK> In general it has to decode everything anyway, and only part it can skip is the display part, which isn't a big part of total CPU...
Apr 02 23:21:13 <ShadowJK> So it tends to either work or not work :)
Apr 02 23:21:16 <V13> uhsg: the address of your n900 is 192.168.2.15, the usbnet is up and running and you have the masquerading and routing enabled and you can't ping oogle ?
Apr 02 23:21:31 <V13> uhsf that is
Apr 02 23:21:47 <ds3> http://pastebin.com/ZqcCSEmB
Apr 02 23:22:40 <ali1234> yeah but that's not set in stone, you know...
Apr 02 23:23:01 <V13> uhsf: what "route -n" shows on n900 ?
Apr 02 23:23:25 <V13> ds3: thanks
Apr 02 23:24:04 <trumee> ShadowJK: over wifi the trick doesnt work. so the file needs to always locally present.
Apr 02 23:24:13 <uhsf> V13: 192.168.2.0     0.0.0.0         255.255.255.0   U     0      0        0 usb0
Apr 02 23:24:24 <V13> only this ?
Apr 02 23:24:43 <trumee> ShadowJK: top says that mplayer is using 14% but Xorg 60%
Apr 02 23:24:53 <uhsf> Destination     Gateway         Genmask         Flags Metric Ref    Use Iface
Apr 02 23:24:59 <uhsf> yes only this
Apr 02 23:25:03 <V13> do this:
Apr 02 23:25:11 <trumee> ShadowJK: why is Xorg eating away the cpu when i play the file via nfs
Apr 02 23:25:13 <V13> route add default gw 192.168.2.14
Apr 02 23:25:22 <V13> in n900
Apr 02 23:25:47 <ShadowJK> trumee, no idea :)
Apr 02 23:26:08 <uhsf> V13: ping google.com works now after this command
Apr 02 23:26:43 <DocScrutinizer> jacekowski: LOL, so dropping frames is more epensive than trying to render them?
Apr 02 23:26:46 <V13> you were missing the route via the pc. someone mentioned it already
Apr 02 23:27:50 <trumee> ShadowJK: when i play the file locally, it is the opposite mplayer is at 54.4% and Xorg at 6.1%
Apr 02 23:28:02 <trumee> ShadowJK: which makes sense.
Apr 02 23:28:19 <ShadowJK> What's total USR and SYS CPU use?
Apr 02 23:28:22 <ShadowJK> in both cases
Apr 02 23:28:34 <uhsf> V13: i would have suspected this because for a reason i ignore, the line "gateway 192.168.2.14" is commented out in /etc/network/interfaces do you know why?
Apr 02 23:28:36 <ptl_demands_PR12> 20:02 <ptl_demands_PR12> might be a route problem
Apr 02 23:28:38 <ptl_demands_PR12> 20:02 <ptl_demands_PR12> adjust your default route
Apr 02 23:29:00 <trumee> ShadowJK: on local playback CPU: 83.5% usr 15.8% sys  0.0%
Apr 02 23:29:23 <V13> well.. the default route is a thing that can cause you trouble
Apr 02 23:29:38 <uhsf> V13: this line is commented out automatically and the file is write protected?
Apr 02 23:29:54 <V13> dunno.. don't remember. I had mine changed very early :)
Apr 02 23:30:02 <trumee> ShadowJK: on nfs, CPU: 76.3% usr 21.8% sys  0.0% nice
Apr 02 23:30:17 <DocScrutinizer> makes sense
Apr 02 23:30:35 <V13> ptl_demands_PR12: that one :)
Apr 02 23:30:43 <uhsf> i think it happens since i installed pc-connectivity. maybe i shouldn't've installed this but it seems to be the only way to start usb network
Apr 02 23:30:55 <trumee> ShadowJK: Xorg doesnt like nfs
Apr 02 23:31:07 <acidjazz> i need an odd favor
Apr 02 23:31:15 <acidjazz> anyone in the USA have an n900 i can send them a text message?
Apr 02 23:31:34 <trumee> ShadowJK: atleast i am happy to know that hardware is capable of playback. software issues could all be sorted out. We have meego for that :)
Apr 02 23:32:00 <DocScrutinizer> acidjazz: you can send SMS to yourelf (no kidding or pun)
Apr 02 23:32:30 <acidjazz> i dont have my n900 w/ me
Apr 02 23:32:33 <V13> uhsf: you can type: "ifup usb0" as root
Apr 02 23:32:34 <acidjazz> its at home and dead
Apr 02 23:32:35 <DocScrutinizer> aah
Apr 02 23:33:02 <DocScrutinizer> acidjazz: sorry, EU here
Apr 02 23:33:24 <ShadowJK> trumee, that reminds me I should try update MPlayer for maemo and see if I can get the packager to push an updated version :)
Apr 02 23:33:52 <uhsf> ifup: interface usb0 already configured
Apr 02 23:34:01 <uhsf> did you mean ifconfig usb0?
Apr 02 23:34:18 <DocScrutinizer> ShadowJK: beware of 1.2 madness
Apr 02 23:34:59 <DocScrutinizer> or is that sorted by now?
Apr 02 23:35:39 <ds3> speaking of network configs... is there a deb that will setup and maintain a dummy0 interface across boot?
Apr 02 23:36:02 <ptl_demands_PR12> acidjazz: send it to me, brazil!!! +55 19 9116 3949 :D I'll answer you back
Apr 02 23:36:48 <ShadowJK> DocScrutinizer, bah, silly debian/deb.. MPlayer eats dependencies for breakfast
Apr 02 23:36:55 <acidjazz> i guess US isnt required but wouldnt that cost u guys $$?
Apr 02 23:37:02 <V13> ds3: What's the use of dummy0 ?
Apr 02 23:37:25 <ptl_demands_PR12> acidjazz: I guess the price is negligible
Apr 02 23:37:31 <ds3> V13: I am using slirp as the DUN backend and I need a presistant address on the N900 to target DNS requests to
Apr 02 23:37:41 <V13> hm..
Apr 02 23:37:49 <V13> you can always add an entry in /etc/interfaces
Apr 02 23:38:48 <ds3> not in the stock kernel
Apr 02 23:39:04 <V13> what? the dummy interface ?
Apr 02 23:39:12 <ds3> yes
Apr 02 23:39:17 <V13> you can add another loopback
Apr 02 23:39:25 <V13> or a second address to the loopback. will it do it ?
Apr 02 23:40:00 <ds3> let me try that
Apr 02 23:41:21 <uhsf> i got my synergy setup working again now, i haven't lost my hopes on my n900 yet
Apr 02 23:42:27 <trumee> goodnight all. ShadowJK, thanks for help.
Apr 02 23:42:46 <uhsf> ty for helping i will try to make these settings stable and reliable now
Apr 02 23:43:33 <ds3> nope
Apr 02 23:44:02 <ds3> it is too early in the life of a device to be flashing custom kernels :/
Apr 02 23:44:45 <V13> it didn't work ?
Apr 02 23:44:58 <ds3> nope
Apr 02 23:45:14 <V13> what exactly are you trying to do?
Apr 02 23:45:27 <V13> (I haven't tried DUN)
Apr 02 23:45:30 <ds3> I am trying to be able to use DNS on the remote end of SLiRP
Apr 02 23:45:58 <ds3> it works fine if I put in real dns servers but that won't work if I roam to different networks
Apr 02 23:46:02 <V13> so you want to make dnsmasq listen to an address accessible via the slirp ?
Apr 02 23:46:26 <ds3> yes, that'd be another way of phrasing it
Apr 02 23:46:29 * MohammadAG_ asks again, can anyone recommend good cheap (not dirt cheap obviously) hosting services?
Apr 02 23:46:48 <tripzero> http://rackbyte.com
Apr 02 23:46:49 <V13> you can remove the "-a 127.0.0.1" if that is. It will most probably result in listening to all addresses (0.0.0.0)
Apr 02 23:47:01 <V13> so it will be accessible from the remote end of the slirp
Apr 02 23:47:09 <V13> ... just a guess
Apr 02 23:47:15 <tripzero> MhammadAG_ http://rackbyte.com
Apr 02 23:47:22 <V13> oh.. remove the "-i lo" too
Apr 02 23:47:50 <ds3> I don't want to make it wide open
Apr 02 23:48:08 <V13> you can start a second one :)
Apr 02 23:48:13 <ds3> I'll revisit this again later... I don't like the solutions
Apr 02 23:48:22 <V13> is there an "up" script for when starting the slirp ?
Apr 02 23:48:27 <ds3> I need a dummy0 or some other address first
Apr 02 23:48:39 <ds3> I can catch it before slirp runs
Apr 02 23:48:52 <ds3> and I am patching slirp already to do what I want
Apr 02 23:48:56 <V13> the problem is that you want to use the dnsmasq which only listens to 127.0.0.1
Apr 02 23:49:06 <MohammadAG_> tripzero, thanks will check that out :)
Apr 02 23:49:24 <V13> you won't be able to use that unless you make it listen to other interface, start a second dnsmasq or redirect data to it with iptabels
Apr 02 23:49:38 <V13> do i understand what you're trying to do correctly ?
Apr 02 23:50:01 <ds3> yes, you are very correct but I also don't want it wide open so I need another address
Apr 02 23:50:09 <V13> look:
Apr 02 23:50:18 <ds3> the secondary address on lo seems to die for other reasons, i.e. ping won't work to it either
Apr 02 23:50:18 <V13> you can start a second dnsmasq to only listen to the slirp interface
Apr 02 23:50:31 <ds3> slirp doesn't generate an interface on the N900 side!!!
Apr 02 23:50:36 <V13> oh...
Apr 02 23:50:47 <ds3> if it were like pppd, life would be simple
Apr 02 23:50:48 <V13> mumble mumble
Apr 02 23:50:59 <MohammadAG_> tripzero, seems more expensive than ixwebhosting, they have unlimited for 59
Apr 02 23:52:09 <tripzero> MohammadAG, I personally know the guy who runs it.  That's why i use it
Apr 02 23:52:09 <V13> how's dun working?
Apr 02 23:52:23 <ds3> other then this hitch, this flavor of DUN works great
Apr 02 23:52:26 <V13> ds3: is the phone connecting first and the pc connect to the phone ?
Apr 02 23:52:38 <V13> ds3: or the pc does the dialup ?
Apr 02 23:52:45 <ds3> V13: PC? what PC? :D
Apr 02 23:52:55 <V13> ?
Apr 02 23:53:03 * V13 doesn't get it
Apr 02 23:53:10 <tripzero> MohammadAG, i've got a couple domains on there and he sponsors one of my favorite open source projects as well (OpenICE).  really good guy.
Apr 02 23:53:15 <ds3> let me describe
Apr 02 23:53:15 <V13> you use n900 as a modem via bluetooth... right ?
Apr 02 23:53:36 <ds3> V13: Treo 650 (no data other then BT to N900) - N900 - <WORLD>
Apr 02 23:53:37 <V13> yes please
Apr 02 23:53:47 <V13> oh
Apr 02 23:53:55 <ds3> V13: so no PC whatsoever
Apr 02 23:54:25 <MohammadAG_> tripzero, well I'm still looking at offers atm, so I'm not gonna buy it till at least next month
Apr 02 23:54:26 <V13> the n900 - world link is with gprs/3g or with anything (including wifi) ?
Apr 02 23:54:34 <ds3> yep
Apr 02 23:54:50 <V13> yep as in "anything" ?
Apr 02 23:54:53 <ds3> the normal DUN in the repo use pnatd which, AFAIK, only works with 3G
Apr 02 23:55:16 <ds3> anything that the N900 can connect to - wifi, other BT, 3G/GPRS/EDGE, USB, etc
Apr 02 23:56:14 <V13> do you enable ip forwarding in order to make this work? or it works without it ?
Apr 02 23:56:25 <ds3> works w/o it
Apr 02 23:56:39 <ds3> SLiRP takes PPP in and acts as a normal application on the N900
Apr 02 23:59:49 * V13 puzzled
Apr 03 00:00:00 <V13> is slirp doing a kind of port redirection ?
Apr 03 00:00:03 <ds3> V13: think of it as a userland network stack
Apr 03 00:00:22 <V13> yes.. i believe i've used slirp about 15 years ago
Apr 03 00:00:43 <V13> and i've just read some docs about it.. but i don't get it...
Apr 03 00:00:51 <V13> it seems like it does a kind of port redirection.
Apr 03 00:01:00 <ds3> it effectively does that
Apr 03 00:01:01 <V13> it says it runs in user-space.
Apr 03 00:01:12 <ds3> so what it does is reads/writes PPP frames on STDIO
Apr 03 00:01:18 <V13> well..
Apr 03 00:01:30 <V13> one alternative is to use google dns (8.8.8.8) :)
Apr 03 00:01:40 <ds3> then it parses the frames to get TCP or UDP connections... for each one, it gets, it does a connectio or a send
Apr 03 00:02:46 <V13> massive port forwarding :)
Apr 03 00:02:55 <V13> don't you like the open-dns approach ?
Apr 03 00:03:07 <ds3> which open dns are you talking about?
Apr 03 00:03:12 <V13> google's dns
Apr 03 00:03:15 <V13> 8.8.8.8
Apr 03 00:03:18 <ds3> no, I don't
Apr 03 00:03:26 <V13> lol :)
Apr 03 00:03:39 <V13> you said you're hacking slirp.. right ?
Apr 03 00:03:47 <ds3> yes
Apr 03 00:03:59 <V13> you can add a small exception.
Apr 03 00:04:17 <V13> for udp segments with destination port 53 to set the destination address to 127.0.0.1
Apr 03 00:04:32 <ds3> that's not the problem
Apr 03 00:04:34 <V13> and vice-versa
Apr 03 00:04:47 <V13> it should work if I understand it correctly
Apr 03 00:04:48 <ds3> the problem is the treo seems to think 127.0.0.0/8 is really local
Apr 03 00:04:53 <ds3> i.e. it never hits the wire
Apr 03 00:04:57 <V13> no...
Apr 03 00:05:06 <V13> i didn't said that.
Apr 03 00:05:14 <V13> hack slirp on n900's end to do this
Apr 03 00:05:33 <V13> so all udp datagrams for a dns server would be redirected to n900's dnsmasq
Apr 03 00:05:44 <V13> the 127.0.0.1 will be n900's 127.0.0.1
Apr 03 00:05:52 <ds3> Or map *:53 to 127.0.0.1:53?
Apr 03 00:05:54 <V13> you'll have to also handle the reverse i believe
Apr 03 00:05:58 <V13> er.. yes
Apr 03 00:05:58 <ds3> s/Or/Oh/
Apr 03 00:05:59 <infobot> ds3 meant: Oh map *:53 to 127.0.0.1:53?
Apr 03 00:06:11 <ds3> that could work
Apr 03 00:06:14 <V13> or just a specific address: 1.2.3.4:53
Apr 03 00:06:23 <V13> and user that address ass dns
Apr 03 00:06:28 <V13> (With one s :)
Apr 03 00:06:38 <ds3> there are hooks in there to do that already... telnets to a magic address can be used to configure slirp remotely
Apr 03 00:07:59 <ds3> this seems more solveable then other options
Apr 03 00:16:08 <jX> so, is PR 1.2 dead, or what? This MeeGo situation has me confused, mostly because I haven't been paying attention, waiting for the dust to settle.
Apr 03 00:17:37 <ShadowJK> MeeGo makes no difference for PR1.2
Apr 03 00:18:06 <V13> yes... it is still not released :)
Apr 03 00:18:16 <ptl_demands_PR12> shame on Nokia for that.
Apr 03 00:18:23 <V13> lol :)
Apr 03 00:18:41 <V13> the silent observer who reacts on PR1.2 conversations :)
Apr 03 00:18:55 <ptl_demands_PR12> you bet!
Apr 03 00:19:32 * V13 demands that maemo-extras download be fixed to be able to upload a screenshot
Apr 03 00:19:39 <ptl_demands_PR12> I've not paid the equivalent of US$ 1000 (with taxes and such) to be abandoned like that
Apr 03 00:19:43 <ptl_demands_PR12> bugs are fixed. Release the fixes, dammit. :(
Apr 03 00:19:57 <jX> agreed.
Apr 03 00:20:18 * V13 find n900 a great toy even with pr 1.1.1
Apr 03 00:20:29 <jX> the more time passes the less satisfied with my 900 I become. I somehow thought Nokia was really going to put effort into this one.
Apr 03 00:20:39 <jX> it's too fuckign expensive to be a toy.
Apr 03 00:20:52 <jX> it's supposed to be a tool, a competitor to the iphone and android.
Apr 03 00:20:53 <V13> it surely isn't a phone
Apr 03 00:21:01 <jX> and while it is, there are things they're failing to do right.
Apr 03 00:21:01 <V13> an alternative i'd say
Apr 03 00:21:08 <jX> it sure as hell IS a phone.
Apr 03 00:21:11 <haltdef> is it just me completely blown away by the n900?
Apr 03 00:21:14 <V13> it is also supposed to be stop 4 of 5
Apr 03 00:21:33 <jX> Oh, step 4 of 5, so I should forgive spending $500 and getting a half assed device.
Apr 03 00:21:43 <jX> haltdef: I was, but the rough edges start to irritate.
Apr 03 00:21:48 <MohammadAG_> No one forced you to spend 500 bucks on it
Apr 03 00:21:53 <haltdef> like what
Apr 03 00:22:02 <V13> they released it as a "beta" device it seemed. even now they don't have enough production
Apr 03 00:22:03 <jX> That is correct, I didn't say anyone did, let's not go reductio ad absurdum
Apr 03 00:22:28 <jX> They also made promises about the MAemo roadmap that are no lnoger true.
Apr 03 00:22:33 <V13> noone expected n900 to sell that much.
Apr 03 00:22:37 <MohammadAG_> what promises?
Apr 03 00:23:24 <ptl_demands_PR12> I disagree with the extended implications. I am disappointed but I don't think Nokia has completely blown away. I think the case in point it simple and solvable. Just release the damn update.
Apr 03 00:23:47 <jX> Maemo 6, for one, regular updates to maemo 5 for two, features lacking at launch to come later for three.
Apr 03 00:23:48 <ptl_demands_PR12> Nokia has to adapt to the open-source way. Release early, release often.
Apr 03 00:24:02 <ptl_demands_PR12> And don't mark something as fixed if you're not willing to release the fix.
Apr 03 00:24:13 <MohammadAG_> ptl_demands_PR12, they kinda over-learnt from the N97, they released a FW that made it worse once
Apr 03 00:24:42 <V13> I've got mine 4 months ago and now it is more expensive than then !!!
Apr 03 00:24:43 <MohammadAG_> V20 - added kinetic scrolling, made the browser crash
Apr 03 00:24:44 <jX> bah, that may be but they were never fast with updates to previous Maemo devices either
Apr 03 00:25:52 <ptl_demands_PR12> Well, it's making worse for the N900 right now, MohammadAG_. There are broken packages on the repositories due to the long wait.
Apr 03 00:26:06 <_llll_> you talk about "the open source way" yet you expect an external company to do all the work for you.  i predict disappointment
Apr 03 00:26:11 <MohammadAG_> ptl_demands_PR12, it was a stupid move to update the autobuilder imo
Apr 03 00:26:32 <V13> llll: has a point
Apr 03 00:27:02 <jX> _llll_: But it was so successful with Netscape! ;)
Apr 03 00:27:11 <_llll_> hehe
Apr 03 00:28:06 <ahynes1> So, who here has done any interesting development or bug fixing?
Apr 03 00:28:09 <ptl_demands_PR12> _llll_: no, not all the work, but since they DID some work (fixing some bugs, marked as such in bugzilla), RELEASE it. I can't mess with system packages because updates break what I do.
Apr 03 00:28:10 <ptl_demands_PR12> _llll_: in other words, the problem is that, I have to rely on them and they let me waiting.
Apr 03 00:28:59 <jX> oh, another reason I'm irritated today, I discovered the back cover magnetic switch. How? Because the magnet somehow came off my back case, rendering the camera lense door and microSD reader useless.
Apr 03 00:29:11 <jX> I called Nokia, they're sending me out a new back case.
Apr 03 00:29:23 <jX> but why mount that magnet so poorly, and on the OUTSIDE?
Apr 03 00:29:36 <ptl_demands_PR12> jX: ugh!
Apr 03 00:30:00 <ptl_demands_PR12> ahynes1: I'm about to. Waiting for PR1.2... I delayed until now because I had my master's dissertation to finish first.
Apr 03 00:30:01 <V13> how exactly did it break the microsd reader ?
Apr 03 00:30:12 <_llll_> why not mess with the stuff and re-flash when/if they update
Apr 03 00:30:14 <jX> the OS dismounts the SD card when it detects the door is open
Apr 03 00:30:34 <MohammadAG_> (and that's doine by the magnet)
Apr 03 00:30:36 <jX> so without that magnet, my back cover is always sensed as being off, thus it won't mount the SD card
Apr 03 00:30:54 <jX> UNLESSI hold a magnet to the back, that's how I verified that was it.
Apr 03 00:30:57 <V13> you mean the magnet that's holding the stand ?
Apr 03 00:31:04 <jX> yes, dual purpose magnet.
Apr 03 00:31:12 <V13> wtf...
Apr 03 00:31:19 <jX> although the stand stays shut fine without the magnet, too.
Apr 03 00:31:22 <V13> and i wandered how it was done :)
Apr 03 00:31:35 <V13> ah.. there is a plus on that :)
Apr 03 00:31:57 <jX> they should have put the magnet on the inside, the stand (useless as it is) stays shut fine without the magtnet.
Apr 03 00:32:14 <V13> if you open the lens cover it just lights the display..
Apr 03 00:32:17 <jX> the stand, god, how retarded. it's fine if you can get the device on a level surface and have no intention of tapping on the right side of it.
Apr 03 00:32:20 <V13> it won't start the camera
Apr 03 00:32:23 <jX> right
Apr 03 00:32:27 <jX> with the magnet, that works
Apr 03 00:32:33 <jX> (too)
Apr 03 00:32:41 <jX> without, the display comes on but the camera app won't launch
Apr 03 00:32:58 <V13> you've lost the magnet ?
Apr 03 00:33:17 <jX> yeah, it fell out sometime last week, I didn't even know it was there till today
Apr 03 00:33:51 <jX> my theory is that while the door sensor still works (the black/white panels on the inside of the camera door slide are detected) the door sensor says "you only see the white part because of outside light, don't bother turning on the camera app."
Apr 03 00:34:10 <MohammadAG_> jX, try holding the camera key
Apr 03 00:34:17 <V13> i'd say it's a software bug.
Apr 03 00:34:21 <MohammadAG_> it should turn on the camera without a cover
Apr 03 00:34:23 <V13> you can have the same effect using your hand
Apr 03 00:34:45 <jX> meh, I jsut launch teh camera app, taht's a minor detail to me
Apr 03 00:34:49 <V13> if you remove the back-cover and move your fingers across the camera, it will light the display at some points
Apr 03 00:35:01 <jX> V13: That's what I'm saying
Apr 03 00:35:06 <jX> look at the inside fo the camera slide
Apr 03 00:35:14 <jX> there's a black patch and a white one for when it's open
Apr 03 00:35:15 <V13> not exactly.
Apr 03 00:35:16 <MohammadAG_> V13, if you put your hand on the IR emitter it will light the display
Apr 03 00:35:33 <V13> MohammadAG: at the top?
Apr 03 00:35:35 <jX> there's a sensor that looks for light from the white patch, BUT if the case is open, that will be a false positive
Apr 03 00:35:42 <V13> jx: it only works with *some* parts of the hand/finger
Apr 03 00:35:43 <jX> so open case + light == no camera app
Apr 03 00:35:45 <MohammadAG_> V13 it's next to the camera
Apr 03 00:35:47 <V13> jx: the hard parts.
Apr 03 00:35:52 <V13> ah.. so it's ir :)
Apr 03 00:35:58 <MohammadAG_> left side
Apr 03 00:36:10 <V13> that's why it doesn't work with the end of the fingers :)
Apr 03 00:36:19 <jX> covering the IR sensor does nothing for me
Apr 03 00:36:23 <MohammadAG_> odd enough, it works for me
Apr 03 00:36:29 <V13> jx: use other parts of your fingers
Apr 03 00:36:40 <jX> I jsut used an aluminum business card case, still nada
Apr 03 00:36:42 <V13> the hard parts, with the bone
Apr 03 00:36:55 <V13> bottom side of the finger.. hold it close
Apr 03 00:37:01 <V13> (press a bit)
Apr 03 00:37:18 <V13> for me it works with the points the finger bends
Apr 03 00:37:25 <MohammadAG_> jX, remove the battery cover, lock the screen, put your finger on the IR part then remove it, it should light up the display
Apr 03 00:37:25 <V13> which are hard
Apr 03 00:37:55 <V13> ok... that's the problem of not releasing pr 1.2
Apr 03 00:38:00 <jX> nope
Apr 03 00:38:05 <V13> instead of talking about pr 1.3 why talk about this :)
Apr 03 00:38:13 <jX> ooohhhh
Apr 03 00:38:14 <jX> THAT one
Apr 03 00:38:15 <V13> jx: try using other parts of your hand
Apr 03 00:38:16 <V13> :)
Apr 03 00:38:22 <jX> I thought you meant the IR port
Apr 03 00:38:25 <jX> not the camera door sensor
Apr 03 00:39:05 <MohammadAG_> so it works with my finger but not my desk
Apr 03 00:39:21 <V13> it works with my desk
Apr 03 00:39:35 <MohammadAG_> Matte/glossy?
Apr 03 00:39:44 <V13> but not  the outside of the back-cover
Apr 03 00:39:49 <V13> glossy is shinny right?
Apr 03 00:39:58 <MohammadAG_> yeah
Apr 03 00:40:04 <V13> yes.. glossy and white
Apr 03 00:40:14 <MohammadAG_> matte and black :P
Apr 03 00:40:21 <V13> :P
Apr 03 00:40:32 <MohammadAG_> V13, not being racist but are you white?
Apr 03 00:40:34 <V13> am i the only one that finds n900 much thinner without the back cover ?
Apr 03 00:40:40 <V13> MohammadAG: yes...
Apr 03 00:40:46 <MohammadAG_> V13, lol I noticed that when I first got it
Apr 03 00:40:54 <MohammadAG_> it's thicker than the screen
Apr 03 00:41:12 <MohammadAG_> V13, I wonder if it'd work with a dark-coloured person
Apr 03 00:41:16 <MohammadAG_> again not being racist
Apr 03 00:41:30 <V13> i don't believe it's the color
Apr 03 00:41:34 <V13> but lets try
Apr 03 00:41:43 <MohammadAG_> so the IR (if it's even) IR detects colour
Apr 03 00:41:52 <MohammadAG_> so the IR (if it's even IR) detects colour*
Apr 03 00:42:05 <V13> yes it works with color
Apr 03 00:42:20 <V13> i've a cover that has black and white and it lights-up when passing over the white part
Apr 03 00:42:29 <V13> (cover from a note book)
Apr 03 00:42:35 <MohammadAG_> interesting
Apr 03 00:43:11 <V13> lol... indians will also do it :)
Apr 03 00:43:15 <V13> it works with red too :)
Apr 03 00:43:38 <MohammadAG_> works with red here too
Apr 03 00:43:48 * V13 notes
Apr 03 00:43:51 <V13> "too much free time"
Apr 03 00:43:55 <V13> all of us
Apr 03 00:44:01 <MohammadAG_> I think it's safe to assume that any colour other than black would turn it on
Apr 03 00:44:11 <MohammadAG_> (RACISTS) :p
Apr 03 00:44:38 <V13> indeed
Apr 03 00:44:46 <DocScrutinizer> heh, proximity sensor works as well, and there's no paragraph in manual saying 'stick a white batch to your ear if you're colored' :-P
Apr 03 00:44:49 <MohammadAG_> V13, it's 3:44 AM and I have nothing else to do :P
Apr 03 00:44:55 <MohammadAG_> LOL
Apr 03 00:45:18 <ptl_demands_PR12> it's 21:45 here
Apr 03 00:45:29 <ptl_demands_PR12> I'll soon take a bath and go to the disco, get some chicks and such
Apr 03 00:45:29 <V13> it's 3.44 here too...
Apr 03 00:45:37 <V13> and i'm going to sleep... so gn8
Apr 03 00:45:45 <ptl_demands_PR12> it's just too warm
Apr 03 00:45:46 <MohammadAG_> ptl_demands_PR12, see if you can find PR1.2 with the DJ
Apr 03 00:45:51 <ptl_demands_PR12> lol
Apr 03 00:45:59 <MohammadAG_> nn V13
Apr 03 00:46:02 <uhsf> weird time you have ptl_demands_PR12
Apr 03 00:46:05 <ptl_demands_PR12> I can't dance, too bad at dancing
Apr 03 00:46:10 <ptl_demands_PR12> uhsf: Brazil!
Apr 03 00:46:14 <DocScrutinizer> 2:46 here, considering a coffee
Apr 03 00:46:35 <MohammadAG_> for some reason, I'm assuming you're from Germany?
Apr 03 00:46:35 <ptl_demands_PR12> friday night... come on, people! get some fun :)
Apr 03 00:46:43 <uhsf> i thought i was the latest american in quebec
Apr 03 00:46:47 <ptl_demands_PR12> impress some girls at the local bar with your N900 and get laid
Apr 03 00:46:54 <uhsf> i guess brazil is later
Apr 03 00:47:09 <MohammadAG_> ptl_demands_PR12, that's not usually the case with a linux device :P
Apr 03 00:48:05 <ptl_demands_PR12> it is, really, it is, trust your buddy linux
Apr 03 00:48:06 <crashanddie> for all its qualities, the N900 is *not* cool
Apr 03 00:48:30 <ptl_demands_PR12> use liqflow, mirror, whatever
Apr 03 00:48:33 <MohammadAG_> ptl_demands_PR12, it might get you a date with tux
Apr 03 00:48:47 <MohammadAG_> :P
Apr 03 00:49:01 <crashanddie> something where you have to explain "Do you know Linux? It's an operating system written by individuals all over the world, and it's completely free, and it runs on this device <insert big lame self-contempt-smile here>"
Apr 03 00:49:03 <ptl_demands_PR12> trust it
Apr 03 00:49:07 <crashanddie> just isn't cool.
Apr 03 00:49:11 <ptl_demands_PR12> crashanddie: never do that, lol
Apr 03 00:49:28 * DocScrutinizer always gets puzzled when it comes to comparativ 'late' regarding TZ. The later ones have earlier in the day, or ... ?
Apr 03 00:49:41 <crashanddie> yup
Apr 03 00:49:48 <ptl_demands_PR12> just show your cellphone, slide the keyboard open, close it and show a few cute apps like liqflow and mirror
Apr 03 00:49:55 <crashanddie> DocScrutinizer: it's 10:49 for me here, so 12:49 in NZ
Apr 03 00:50:02 <ptl_demands_PR12> crashanddie: that's enough to start a conversation and that's all you need, if you know how to talk
Apr 03 00:50:08 <ptl_demands_PR12> starting it is the hardest part
Apr 03 00:50:13 <MohammadAG_> ptl_demands_PR12, if you have a Symbian phone then you could show them the Vibrate app
Apr 03 00:50:13 <crashanddie> ptl_demands_PR12: please don't give me advice on datng
Apr 03 00:50:16 <crashanddie> dating**
Apr 03 00:50:27 <ptl_demands_PR12> crashanddie: why not?
Apr 03 00:50:30 <MohammadAG_> (I really don't know why that was made available on the Ovi Store)
Apr 03 00:50:42 <crashanddie> ptl_demands_PR12: because I *really* don't need it?
Apr 03 00:50:44 <ptl_demands_PR12> MohammadAG_: what does it do?
Apr 03 00:50:56 <MohammadAG_> it turns on the vibrator :P
Apr 03 00:50:59 <ptl_demands_PR12> crashanddie: you're are too angry, everything I said makes you mad :P
Apr 03 00:51:03 <MohammadAG_> err, the motor
Apr 03 00:51:05 <ptl_demands_PR12> MohammadAG_: doh... lol
Apr 03 00:51:07 <DocScrutinizer> crashanddie: so in NZ it's earlier late, so they're early :-P
Apr 03 00:51:17 <crashanddie> DocScrutinizer: eh?
Apr 03 00:51:25 <DocScrutinizer> as they're late while we in EU are early
Apr 03 00:51:49 * MohammadAG_ is slightly confused
Apr 03 00:51:56 <crashanddie> ptl_demands_PR12: just ask Jaffa, he still can't figure out how I got 3 phone numbers at a Nokia flagship store evening.
Apr 03 00:51:58 <DocScrutinizer> hehe me too
Apr 03 00:52:27 <cehteh> any news in meego land? :)
Apr 03 00:52:34 <crashanddie> cehteh: probably in #meego
Apr 03 00:52:47 * ahynes1 is going to have to create an Etchings app....
Apr 03 00:53:01 <MohammadAG_> never knew women visited flagship stores :P
Apr 03 00:53:03 <uhsf> yes big news fuck meego we're fed up with that already
Apr 03 00:53:07 <cehteh> jk .. just rhymes on lego land :)
Apr 03 00:53:13 <MohammadAG_> but then again we don't have any (flagship stores that is)
Apr 03 00:53:41 <crashanddie> MohammadAG_: well, it was the N900 events, so there was a bunch of Nokia-marketing chicks. And waitresses, too.
Apr 03 00:53:53 <ahynes1> The #meego channel is pretty quiet.  I installed MeeGo on my N900 earlier today... yawn...
Apr 03 00:54:03 <MohammadAG_> crashanddie, thought they were customers :p
Apr 03 00:54:19 <cehteh> meand you have an not useable n900 now? :)
Apr 03 00:54:26 <ahynes1> I'm finding Mer much more interesting right now...  I'll check Meego again sometime later.
Apr 03 00:54:41 <uhsf> wow, your n900 must be unusable for the next few months at least now good move
Apr 03 00:54:45 <crashanddie> cehteh: your english sounds to me like a teacher running her nails over the blackboard
Apr 03 00:55:16 <ahynes1> cehteh: Actually, its very usable...  I can boot Maemo or Mer and can chroot to Fedora or MeeGo
Apr 03 00:55:17 <cehteh> crashanddie: thats ok, i thought its worse
Apr 03 00:55:45 <crashanddie> cehteh: it's just that sometimes it sounds fine, and I couldn't even detect you're a foreigner (maybe a slow/lazy teen)
Apr 03 00:55:52 <MohammadAG_> Mer is quite good, if only it had LXDE as the default desktop manager it would've saved me a lot of trouble
Apr 03 00:56:06 <crashanddie> and then sometimes it's like you get a bunch of word, and throw them together, not caring about the order they fall in
Apr 03 00:56:26 <cehteh> crashanddie: lol ... i was very bad at school in english but thats long ago :)
Apr 03 00:56:45 <ahynes1> MohammadAG_: Have you gotten LXDE to work with Mer?  I loaded it, but now it brings in an LXDE login prompt and won't accept the Return Key
Apr 03 00:57:26 <MohammadAG_> ahynes1, try using an external keyboard, the return key on the N900 is actually the numpad return key
Apr 03 00:57:31 <DocScrutinizer> cehteh: all depends on whether you improved meanwhile, or even forgot the few you learnt
Apr 03 00:57:45 <cehteh> possibly
Apr 03 00:58:23 <ahynes1> MohammandAG_: I was hoping I could figure out some way to change the default modmap for the N900 return key
Apr 03 00:58:33 <DocScrutinizer> good pigin you not learn in school
Apr 03 00:59:12 <cehteh> ahynes1: you mean from kp-enter to real return?
Apr 03 00:59:41 <ahynes1> cehteh: Yeah, I think so
Apr 03 01:00:18 <cehteh> iirc that will break some maemo5 apps .. but you can easily try there is a config .. moment
Apr 03 01:02:12 <cehteh> bah forgotten where the config is
Apr 03 01:03:08 <MohammadAG_> /usr/share/X11/xkb/symbols/nokia_vndr/rx-51?
Apr 03 01:03:12 <ahynes1> cehteh:  Yeah, I've been looking but haven't found what I'm looking for...
Apr 03 01:03:23 <cehteh> backup/usr/share/X11/xkb/symbols/nokia_vndr/rx-51
Apr 03 01:03:26 <cehteh> yes
Apr 03 01:03:34 <ahynes1> Especially, since I want to do it in Mer
Apr 03 01:04:10 <cehteh> mer should install the keytables in a similar location .. doesnt it?
Apr 03 01:04:22 <ahynes1> Yeah... That's what I'm thinking...
Apr 03 01:04:26 <ahynes1> I'm checking right now.
Apr 03 01:04:45 <ahynes1> If I can change it there, I may be in good shape
Apr 03 01:05:15 <cehteh> as long you can ssh to the device you are not lost at least when making an error :P
Apr 03 01:05:41 <ahynes1> Yeah, I do more of my work from ssh than any other way on my device
Apr 03 01:06:33 <MohammadAG_> why is there an rx-44 keymap on the N900?
Apr 03 01:06:48 <cehteh> they prolly put all they found on it :P
Apr 03 01:11:33 <ahynes1> Well, I made the change.  However, I started installing Easy_Deb on Maemo a while ago, so my machine is pegged unpacking the files.   I'll boot to Mer sometime later and see if the change to the keymap fixes my problem
Apr 03 01:14:22 <ds3> hmm crazy idea for a USB host proxy - use a 770 or N800 and have that act as the USB host and then use that to tether back to the N900 via BT
Apr 03 01:15:31 <Proteous> but.... why?
Apr 03 01:15:40 <MohammadAG_> what's the > key called?
Apr 03 01:15:49 <Proteous> wacka
Apr 03 01:15:54 <MohammadAG_> ds3, it was already posted
Apr 03 01:15:57 <ds3> some of us need/strongly desire to being able to read USB devices on the OTG
Apr 03 01:16:00 <Proteous> sorta looks like pacman
Apr 03 01:16:00 <MohammadAG_> or suggested
Apr 03 01:16:08 <MohammadAG_> o.o
Apr 03 01:16:08 <ds3> MohammadAG: sorry... I am behind on the forums
Apr 03 01:16:09 <ml-mobile> usb over IP :)
Apr 03 01:16:31 <MohammadAG_> I really need to kill the other me
Apr 03 01:16:41 <Proteous> kill kill kill
Apr 03 01:17:31 <ds3> MohammandAG: does the suggest have a package suitable for the 770 or 800?
Apr 03 01:18:23 <MohammadAG> ds3, not really sure, I think it was only suggested
Apr 03 01:21:23 <ds3> ah
Apr 03 01:22:39 <ahynes1> MohammadAG: I believe in the xkb symbol table it would be  'greater'
Apr 03 01:27:48 <ds3> anyone got the link to the page that describes how you get characters like '|' from the keyboard on the N900?
Apr 03 01:28:38 <uhsf> i installed pc-connectivity to see if it could solve my usb networking problem and now i want to get rid of it completely. what's the command to remove maemo-pc-connectivity and all dependency packages that were installed at the same time?
Apr 03 01:29:07 <uhsf> ds3: fn+ctrl, but i don't know the page
Apr 03 01:29:33 <ds3> is that the only way? that pops up a soft keyboard
Apr 03 01:29:52 <uhsf> that's what i was told earlier today
Apr 03 01:30:09 <uhsf> or remapping another key
Apr 03 01:30:25 <ds3> hmmm
Apr 03 01:31:08 <ds3> okay, how does one add a soft key to the Xterm on the 900? it isn't there in the menu anymore
Apr 03 01:31:31 <MohammadAG_> ds3 it's called remapping n900 keys, it's in wiki.maemo.g
Apr 03 01:31:33 <MohammadAG_> org*
Apr 03 01:31:54 <MohammadAG_> fn + up = | for me :)
Apr 03 01:32:28 <ds3> not in xterm
Apr 03 01:32:40 <uhsf> how to remove a package completely with all it's dependencies?
Apr 03 01:32:51 <MohammadAG_> ds3, i remapped my keys
Apr 03 01:33:15 <MohammadAG_> uhsf, assuming the dependencies aren't need by others apps, apt-get autoremove (appname)
Apr 03 01:33:32 <MohammadAG_> s/need/needed/
Apr 03 01:33:32 <infobot> MohammadAG_ meant: uhsf, assuming the dependencies aren't needed by others apps, apt-get autoremove (appname)
Apr 03 01:33:51 <DocScrutinizer> MohammadAG_: /msg nickserv ghost MohammadAG
Apr 03 01:34:08 <MohammadAG_> DocScrutinizer, other client :)
Apr 03 01:34:21 <DocScrutinizer> yes, exactly
Apr 03 01:34:23 <MohammadAG_> i use /ns btw, it's much shorter :)
Apr 03 01:34:31 <uhsf> MohammadAG_: you mean this command safely keeps packages that are required by others? or do i need to be sure of this by myself?
Apr 03 01:34:38 <MohammadAG_> DocScrutinizer, i'm on the N900
Apr 03 01:34:47 <ds3> what about adding other soft keys to the xterm like it is possible with the N800?
Apr 03 01:35:01 <MohammadAGN900> uhsf, it safely removes stuff
Apr 03 01:35:13 <MohammadAGN900> apt-get doesn't break dependencies, dpkg otoh...
Apr 03 01:35:35 <DocScrutinizer> MohammadAGN900: you said you wanted to kill the 'other me'. Well that's exactly the cmd to do that
Apr 03 01:35:46 <MohammadAGN900> DocScrutinizer, i killed it :)
Apr 03 01:36:06 <MohammadAGN900> (then i reconnected since I needed to leave the PC
Apr 03 01:36:34 <frosty`> anyone using IRC plugin for Conversations and Contacts?
Apr 03 01:36:45 <MohammadAGN900> never liked it
Apr 03 01:36:54 <uhsf> how to kill pc-connectivity? killing the process number doesn't work
Apr 03 01:37:11 <MohammadAGN900> DocScrutinizer, just wondering, if anything goes wrong on the channel can anyone kick/kill/gline?
Apr 03 01:37:29 <MohammadAGN900> kill -9?
Apr 03 01:37:45 <DocScrutinizer> MohammadAGN900: huh?
Apr 03 01:38:01 <DocScrutinizer> only chanops can kick
Apr 03 01:38:15 <MohammadAGN900> what about kills?
Apr 03 01:38:32 <MohammadAGN900> (kills force the client to disconnect)
Apr 03 01:38:33 <DocScrutinizer> what's 'kill' on IRC?
Apr 03 01:38:46 <MohammadAGN900> thought you were going to say that :)
Apr 03 01:38:49 <DocScrutinizer> that's ghost
Apr 03 01:38:58 <MohammadAGN900> nomis, it's kill :)
Apr 03 01:39:03 <ds3> n/m found the thread
Apr 03 01:39:12 <MohammadAGN900> ghost is to be used by a user to ghost himself
Apr 03 01:39:20 <MohammadAGN900> kill is used to make someone disconnect
Apr 03 01:39:25 <ptl_demands_PR12> I hope not
Apr 03 01:39:32 <ptl_demands_PR12> I am always the first one to be kicked/killed/whatever
Apr 03 01:39:42 <MohammadAGN900> umm, /kill DocScrutinizer would just disconnect you from freenode
Apr 03 01:39:43 <DocScrutinizer> nope, it's used to ghost other nicks registered to same account
Apr 03 01:40:11 <DocScrutinizer> MohammadAGN900: I'd doubt you could do that
Apr 03 01:40:26 <DocScrutinizer> (/kill)
Apr 03 01:40:27 <MohammadAGN900> DocScrutinizer, well not on this server
Apr 03 01:40:51 <MohammadAGN900> i'm not an oper
Apr 03 01:41:01 <MohammadAGN900> was asking if anyone was an oper
Apr 03 01:41:21 <DocScrutinizer> see /cs access #maemo list
Apr 03 01:42:00 <MohammadAGN900> that only lists channel ops :)
Apr 03 01:42:18 <DocScrutinizer> and what's been your question?
Apr 03 01:42:31 <MohammadAGN900> * [MohammadAG] is a Network Administrator
Apr 03 01:42:36 <MohammadAGN900> that ^
Apr 03 01:43:17 <DocScrutinizer> no, I don't know if we got any freenode staff here
Apr 03 01:44:52 <MohammadAGN900> ah kk :)
Apr 03 01:46:29 <DocScrutinizer> see /stats p, or /join #freenode
Apr 03 01:48:26 <uhsf> bash on the n900 remembers so few history commands it's ridiculous, i wonder who decided this default
Apr 03 01:50:46 <Funnyface> grr my N900 has begun to randomly restart
Apr 03 01:50:55 <Funnyface> and I think it is running the latest firmware
Apr 03 01:54:38 <uhsf> is it just me or ~/.bash_history on the n900 is ~/.ash_history?
Apr 03 02:01:15 <uhsf> it seems maemo uses ash and not bash that explains why the terminal is so dumb
Apr 03 02:01:31 <uhsf> i need to edit /etc/profile i guess now
Apr 03 02:02:16 <Funnyface> hmm right now it is updating Wormux at around 80KB/s peak, and 25KB/s average (normally I can expect a speed of like 250 bytes per second with a horrible packet loss), yet web browsing and anything else isn't working like normal.. :\
Apr 03 02:02:46 <DocScrutinizer> uhsf: you're sure you're not talking bout messybox history?
Apr 03 02:03:41 <uhsf> i'm talking about the ~/.ash_history file in my /home/directory
Apr 03 02:03:48 <uhsf> i just noticed that
Apr 03 02:14:01 <luke-jr> uhsf: /etc/profile doesn't control shell
Apr 03 02:14:14 <luke-jr> you *could* just install bash and change your shell, tho
Apr 03 02:21:37 <uhsf> luke-jr: so, adding export HISTSIZE="5000" won't increase history size?
Apr 03 02:22:46 <uhsf> ash seems to be enough for my phone, i'd just like the shell to remember more than 10 commands
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Sat Apr 03 02:59:57 2010