**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sat May 29 02:59:57 2010 May 29 03:12:26 Yo yo. May 29 03:13:05 Now that its out, is the new patch all its cracked up to be? May 29 03:13:33 Buggered if I can tell much difference. May 29 03:14:54 Browser zooming isn't broken as shit. May 29 03:15:50 although the cueing up of browsers scrolls with the dpad is sort of (very) annoying May 29 03:15:56 for us arrow key scrollers May 29 03:24:54 why oh why TWO successful communication backup before upgrade to 1.2 result in TWO corrupted db files !!?? May 29 03:25:17 ROFL May 29 03:27:51 Anyone else not liking the 'new' menu? May 29 03:28:52 better than the old one May 29 03:29:57 I kinda liked the 2 stage setup. I keep going into the settings out of habit now. Any way it can be reverted? May 29 03:32:27 Proteous, yeah, filled a bug. May 29 03:33:04 LOL May 29 03:40:44 GeneralAntilles: http://tinyurl.com/agspa9 May 29 03:45:24 Cabletwitch, install Catorise. May 29 03:47:25 where does modest keep its settings? May 29 03:51:30 Hi May 29 03:51:44 I'm wondering if its possible to change the default command executed by osso-xterm? May 29 03:52:02 maher, gconf May 29 03:52:38 GeneralAntilles: what's wrong with a text file i can edit by hand... May 29 03:53:24 can i copy my old email settings over to the new firmware somehow? May 29 03:53:52 neat, they got rid of search on the applicatoin manager... May 29 03:54:18 maher, it's centralized and standardized. May 29 03:54:18 You can start typing things and it searches the list May 29 03:54:22 pronto, just start typing. . . . May 29 03:54:26 not same thing of course :( May 29 03:54:45 maher, you don't have a bunch of arbitrarily formatted text files hanging around. May 29 03:54:46 oh? before they acutaly had a seach button xD May 29 03:55:08 maher, it also doesn't require reloading the config file everytime a setting changes. May 29 03:55:18 pronto, lists have live search now. May 29 03:56:15 GeneralAntilles: why did the email settings disappear when i upgraded to 1.2? was that meant to happen or did something go wrong? May 29 03:56:25 maher, how did you upgrade? May 29 03:57:16 anyone know a program that will share directly to your own ftp server, not to that pixelpipe? May 29 03:57:29 GeneralAntilles: flasher May 29 03:57:36 maher, why didn't you install OTA? May 29 03:57:45 maher, flasher is like formatting your hard drive and reinstalling. May 29 03:57:56 So if you didn't create and restore a backup, of course it's not going to retain your settings. May 29 03:58:36 GeneralAntilles: what is ota? May 29 03:58:45 maher, Over the Air May 29 03:58:50 SSU May 29 03:58:59 Installing the system update through the application manager. May 29 03:59:17 GeneralAntilles: i didn't realise you could do that - otherwise i would of course have done that May 29 03:59:41 maher, well, The More You Know. May 29 04:00:34 GeneralAntilles: for future reference how do i do that? May 29 04:00:52 maher, you know how it flashes update notifications at you from the statusbar? May 29 04:01:01 GeneralAntilles: yes May 29 04:01:17 maher, same as that, except it says Maemo Update instead of 3rd party. May 29 04:01:30 GeneralAntilles: i don't think it did that May 29 04:02:05 maher, what region are you in? May 29 04:02:15 Not all regions get the OTA update pushed at the same time. May 29 04:02:25 GeneralAntilles: i'm in the us May 29 04:02:36 maher, yeah, I think we got it yesterday. May 29 04:02:38 Not sure, though. May 29 04:02:47 General: I tried catorise, but I prefer the old 2-tier system of menus, tbh. May 29 04:03:05 Cabletwitch, Catorise is two-tier. :P May 29 04:03:12 Cabletwitch, well, feel free to futz with the .desktop files. May 29 04:03:19 They're reasonably easy to organize. May 29 04:03:36 Oh? May 29 04:03:51 Hmm, something else to mess with, whee :O) May 29 04:03:51 GeneralAntilles: i fact last couple of times i tried to update it was stuck because of conflicts due to lack of availability of the firmware - i didn't realise if i just waited it would eventually find it... May 29 04:03:53 Hello May 29 04:03:54 Cabletwitch, actually, I think it's configurable in PR1.2 May 29 04:03:58 Cabletwitch, tap'n'hold. May 29 04:04:25 maher, Nokia does staggered releases like it's 2004 for some reason. May 29 04:04:42 I can move them about, sure. But I want the old 'More' icon back :O) May 29 04:05:36 well that justed wasted an hour of my life for no reason May 29 04:05:59 the wireless on the n900 is somewhat screwy :( May 29 04:06:19 maher, any experience is worth having, no? ;) May 29 04:06:30 jscinoz, how so? May 29 04:06:51 GeneralAntilles: it associates fine, and gets an IP address, but i cant actually do anything, cant ping the router or any other hosts on the network May 29 04:06:57 and its not just my own wlan, but any network i've tried it on May 29 04:07:06 jscinoz, mmm, powersaving may be being weird. May 29 04:07:13 GeneralAntilles: any suggestions? May 29 04:07:20 You can try reducing it a bit in settings. May 29 04:07:31 No problems with wifi so far here. May 29 04:07:46 ill try that May 29 04:08:09 i had to reflash it because the thing spontaneously decided it didnt want to boot... and i dont want to reinstall all the packages i had over hsdpa May 29 04:08:39 GeneralAntilles: where are the wireless power saving settings located? May 29 04:08:42 i am now unbelievably bitter May 29 04:09:22 jscinoz, under the networking/connectivity/whatever settings in the control panel. May 29 04:09:49 GeneralAntilles: only relevent thing there is internet connections, and it has no mention of powersaving May 29 04:09:58 GeneralAntilles: perhaps a config file i can edit? or a gconf key i can set manually? May 29 04:10:04 Bitter? Whyfor, maher? May 29 04:10:31 he used nsu without realizing it's a reformat May 29 04:10:57 good thing the command line flasher doesnt touch the other stuff unless you ask it to May 29 04:11:19 n900 likes to spontaneously brick (at least mine does) and thankfully i dont lose contacts or calendar when i reflash it May 29 04:11:34 ShadowJK: i new it nuked / - i didn't realise if i just waited there was another way May 29 04:12:06 Fingers crossed, not bricked thnis one yet. But I dont play with unstabke stuff, so thats a good reason why. May 29 04:12:08 Also there's a backup/restore app on every n900 ;-) May 29 04:12:26 * ShadowJK has never had to flash his n900 May 29 04:12:46 * TheVirtualVortex flashed once to install PR1.2 because OTA didn't work May 29 04:13:08 * ShadowJK hasnt tried to upgrade to 1.2 yet May 29 04:13:39 * TheVirtualVortex wonders what ShadowJK is waiting for May 29 04:13:42 ;-) May 29 04:14:07 reports on what's broken May 29 04:14:20 I didn't have any particular issues so far May 29 04:14:21 it'd suck to lose something I use May 29 04:14:29 for example ? May 29 04:14:31 especially as downgrading could be hard May 29 04:14:39 yes, that's true May 29 04:15:00 or lose performance from the optification May 29 04:15:19 * ShadowJK just last week figured out how to make gpodder not be uberslow D: May 29 04:15:28 Optification? You making up words now? XD May 29 04:15:31 I see May 29 04:16:02 Is there a way to re-enable support for Imap-idle in modest on the n900? May 29 04:16:05 the moving of stuff from the 256meg nand to the 32gig emmc May 29 04:16:09 other than recompiling it May 29 04:16:13 This morning I woke up because the shortcut to media player started running a music stream May 29 04:16:37 I noticed there was a missed call too but why did it start playign radio i have no idea May 29 04:17:22 maybe the ghost in my room learned how to use touch screen? May 29 04:17:30 the media player widget is known to unpause after calls.. May 29 04:17:40 lol. interesting May 29 04:19:34 my connection drops after a about 10 seconds of inactivity when tethering using 3g but stays up fine when using GSM May 29 04:19:50 this is using wvdial on linux May 29 04:21:16 mine doesn't drop, but there's a large delay before data starts moving after a period of inactivity May 29 04:21:27 so I keep a ping running May 29 04:21:29 mine actualy stops working May 29 04:21:38 if I keep ping or something running it stays up May 29 04:21:54 wonder if I can change some of the timeouts in the ppp config files May 29 04:23:51 is there some way i can increase the smtp timeout in modest? May 29 04:24:04 GeneralAntilles: turning powersaving off does not help May 29 04:24:19 GeneralAntilles: I still get an IP, but i cant actually connect to any hosts on my local network May 29 04:27:57 has anyone else had issues with sudo in pr1.2? May 29 04:28:30 whee i have absolutely no wireless connectivity May 29 04:28:55 so i have to fuck around with usbnet if i want to do an update and not get charged over $9000 by my carrier for using hsdpa too much. May 29 04:29:25 fun fun. u May 29 04:30:04 you have no radios at all?? bt/wifi/etc May 29 04:31:47 my sudoers file is blank, idk if thats correct in meamo May 29 04:33:21 what is the default dhcp client in pr1.2, i thought it was dhcpcd as it was before, but thats apparently not there anymore May 29 04:35:54 Ooh, thats nifty... May 29 04:35:58 ? May 29 04:36:10 * Cabletwitch figures out the volume rocker switches channels in xchat May 29 04:36:17 o= May 29 04:36:19 really? May 29 04:36:29 The things you find out by accident, eh? May 29 04:36:30 thats new May 29 04:36:36 you on pr1.2? May 29 04:36:41 Yah. May 29 04:36:42 that didnt use to happen May 29 04:36:53 But it did it before that, I think. May 29 04:36:57 really? May 29 04:37:02 oh well, either way \o/ May 29 04:37:06 I'm pretty sure. May 29 04:37:18 that makes things better \o/ May 29 04:37:24 I only found out by accident, when I hit the rocker. May 29 04:37:28 Hi. May 29 04:37:32 just wait till you are in xchat and the porn site you have open in the browser starts playing loud sounds right when your GF walks by May 29 04:37:38 What Is The DHCP Client On The N900. May 29 04:37:39 and all you can do is fastly switch windows May 29 04:38:04 its probably you know, like what? 10 characters to answer? Wouldn't be that difficult. considering the collossal fuckup PR1.2 is there is little information. May 29 04:38:06 if you're watching porn on a phone. ... :s May 29 04:38:18 Buddy, porn makes you squint enough as is. On the N900, you'd go blind for sure XD May 29 04:38:20 oh crap it does May 29 04:38:37 jscinoz, maybe we dont' know May 29 04:38:40 go look May 29 04:38:47 nevermind i found it May 29 04:38:53 ... May 29 04:38:53 udhcpc if anyone else if interested May 29 04:38:57 see kids sharing information is not that hard. May 29 04:39:07 cya, don't let the door hit you May 29 04:39:10 Someone is having their period... May 29 04:39:11 lol ass May 29 04:39:31 theres jsut one last thing i want, a way to share images directly via scp/ftp with out going though pixelpipe x.x May 29 04:40:24 open terminal client > send picture via scp using "scp name@server:path/to/picture" > profit May 29 04:40:48 easier to just do it via the gui on a phone May 29 04:40:53 anyone know how i can get my sudo working for user? root (and sudo gainroot) work fine May 29 04:41:13 not sure May 29 04:41:50 because with the gui, i can add a name to the photo, so my script will rename it on my server May 29 04:42:13 I think its broken because I went pr1.1.1>leaked1.2>offical 1.2 all without a mmc flash May 29 04:52:50 May 29 04:56:36 morning RST38h May 29 04:56:48 mourning. May 29 04:59:38 mourning? May 29 04:59:44 mouring May 29 04:59:51 ahoy! May 29 04:59:53 mooring? May 29 04:59:59 tiver me shimbers May 29 05:00:21 savoy mare latey! May 29 05:07:58 i wonder if it'll save battery by using 3 desktops rather then four May 29 05:55:15 I noticed the twitter widget completely kills battery May 29 06:16:11 it's weird, the tethered 3g connection doesn't die. I am still connected to the "modem" but it just doesn't let me out to the interwebs. May 29 06:16:37 although if i load a webpage on the phone the tethered 3g connection starts working again once the page is finished loading May 29 06:16:41 well now. pr1.2 installed via apt-get upgrade and it reboots too. nice May 29 06:17:54 my hacked solution is to start a ssh connection with a serveraliveinterval of 5 seconds May 29 06:25:53 Proteous: ping works also May 29 06:27:29 sure, but who wants to be pinged every 5 seconds May 29 06:29:19 doesnt bother me May 29 06:30:30 is the new ovi store supposed to be out already? May 29 06:30:35 hey May 29 06:30:49 Proteous: uh, ping is going to be less than your serveraliveinterval May 29 06:31:03 i thow that maemo and ibm were merge in a new os system May 29 06:31:30 ibm? May 29 06:31:35 you mean Nokia and Intel May 29 06:31:38 luke-jr: well, my ssh is usefull May 29 06:31:39 yea yea May 29 06:31:40 sorry May 29 06:31:44 and that's in #MeeGo May 29 06:31:49 so May 29 06:31:49 for doing sshy things May 29 06:31:50 :P May 29 06:31:53 and half this room hates MeeGo May 29 06:31:57 and the other half loves it May 29 06:31:57 why May 29 06:32:08 I'm not sure the haters have a consensus on reason why May 29 06:32:09 meego sucks or what??? May 29 06:32:24 meego uses rpm May 29 06:32:31 any idea how can we test a maemo app without N900 ? May 29 06:32:41 arachnist, bingo - number one reason that people hate it for some reason May 29 06:32:46 but to hell with it May 29 06:32:49 Haters gonna hate May 29 06:33:03 i actually hate dpkg/deb more than rpm May 29 06:33:30 (mainly due to the fact, that rpm spec files are easier to write) May 29 06:40:40 tar would have been best. ;) May 29 06:41:12 no added complexity May 29 06:42:45 how to test maemo without N900 May 29 06:42:46 ? May 29 06:45:01 http://www.scratchbox.org/ May 29 06:46:33 http://maemo.org/news/announcements/maemo_fremantle_and_diablo_sdk_virtual_image_final_version_released/ May 29 07:07:35 Hallo all! May 29 07:07:47 huhu May 29 07:08:47 ’have installed Easy Debian on N900: works fine, only there are three submenus to Synaptic, and… I don’t know the default root password, can anyone…? May 29 07:10:07 Bilaw, open the menu, then click Debian chroot May 29 07:10:16 then change the password using passwd May 29 07:12:33 cheers, MohammadAG — I realise I can’t do it right now (have updated the firmware, and of course all programs erased), but I’ll do it soon May 29 07:13:16 Bilaw, the image should still be there, unless you flashed the eMMC May 29 07:16:07 which part of pr1.2 is supposed to fix duplicate MyDocs folders bug? I still have dupes May 29 07:17:03 ahh that is the fault of catorise nm May 29 07:17:57 MohammadAG: so all I need to do is to launch the image, no need to type some command specific in the terminal?? May 29 07:18:14 Bilaw, there's a shortcut for everything May 29 07:18:25 just install easy debian and easy chroot May 29 07:18:35 and you're done, no need to redownload May 29 07:18:46 Ok, so were agreed. May 29 07:18:54 cheers, mate! May 29 07:19:10 yw :) May 29 07:24:21 another question: If I want to install an alternative OS on my tablet, which d’you think is best for me, who have no knowlegde in computing? May 29 07:24:34 — there is a page on maemo, May 29 07:25:00 but it doesn’t state the level of completion of the works… May 29 07:25:26 i would just stick with easy deb May 29 07:25:53 Don't try that at home folks! May 29 07:26:34 My monitor plug was half way out, I tried pushing it in, and got some nice blue sparks May 29 07:26:39 funny question Bilaw - i would suggest "none" May 29 07:26:56 i say that because of the driver issue May 29 07:27:08 Humpfle, ear0wax & pupnik… May 29 07:27:48 does any fremantle browser have socks support? May 29 07:27:56 (humpfle meaning that I feel bad hearing that) May 29 07:30:41 Bilaw: other oses are for hacking and development. Maemo is stable May 29 07:34:49 does any fremantle browser have socks support? May 29 07:40:33 mc_teo, does any fremantle browser have feet? NO - so no use for socks May 29 07:41:21 mc_teo, :P in all seriousness try this - http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=550991&postcount=12 May 29 07:47:11 does microb support mozilla weave ? May 29 07:47:30 or you need fennex? May 29 07:48:08 fennec May 29 07:50:10 "The 1mhz 6809 can do 4000 ADD cycles in one frame (1/60 second) of Robotron." May 29 07:50:20 that was game programming :) May 29 07:51:29 pupnik: your talking of the old robotron from german democratic republic? May 29 07:51:56 no williams Robotron 2084 May 29 07:52:04 heh ic May 29 07:52:31 possibly runnable on some robotron system. did any have bit-addrressable graphics? May 29 07:53:53 well am no expert there .. i was just wondering if you meant the same .. they produced quite robust technology .. meaning robust in the mechanical sense ;) May 29 07:54:08 like printers made the ground shake when operated robust May 29 07:57:19 # Adam made up a "NOP NOP" joke. "Who's there?" "NOBODY". May 29 08:07:11 does any fremantle browser have socks support? May 29 08:07:14 ... May 29 08:16:28 * MohammadAG pokes frals May 29 08:16:43 you got MMS working, when's 3G video calling coming? :) May 29 08:27:28 I've tried to make skype video calls and my local camera picture goes live, but other end doesn't see that I have a webcam, and I can't receive their webcam, anyone successfully got that working? May 29 08:27:39 i video call with gtalk on edge. EDGE May 29 08:27:54 no one can recive skype video atm May 29 08:28:22 ear0wax: hm, so I should try gtalk as well... interesting. May 29 08:29:55 * frals slaps MohammadAG around a bit with a large trout May 29 08:30:11 hm, but google talk client for linux seems to be lacking. May 29 08:30:19 MohammadAG: ill let someone else tackle that one, i can't have all the fun... ;) May 29 08:30:32 use gmails built in gtalk May 29 08:31:53 hi all, I'm trying to install the mobilehotspot according to instructions at http://mobilehotspot.garage.maemo.org/ but the link to hotspot-kernel-flasher is dead May 29 08:32:46 also, if I do apt-get install mobilehotspot (dry run) then it exists and will download required packages - Can I just do it that way or should I follow instructions on the mobilehotspot garage page? (which I need hotspot-kernel-flasher) May 29 08:33:24 misc--: i just installed it and it worked May 29 08:34:18 pupnik: which method did you use? Just install mobilehotspot via apt-get ? May 29 08:35:22 yes May 29 08:36:20 cool will give it a shot. Thanks May 29 08:39:03 did you install hotspot-kernel-modules and hotspot-kernel by any chance? May 29 08:39:40 didnt touch kernel May 29 08:39:48 ah ok May 29 08:39:49 am running titan's atm May 29 08:40:03 maybe it includes all the fun you need May 29 08:40:34 yeah maybe...I'm just running stock one May 29 08:48:11 socks5 proxy support anyone? May 29 08:49:17 use the internet settins May 29 08:49:21 there's proxy stuff in there May 29 08:51:59 Hi, the skype client on fremantle does not support conference calls? May 29 08:53:00 and ive been using the pecain msn protocol plugin, but now they contacts dont appear in new im? May 29 08:56:00 and maemo seriously needs a porn button May 29 09:01:12 porn? May 29 09:07:16 Hi, the skype client on fremantle does not support conference calls? it does May 29 09:10:24 MohammadAG: oh? When I tried to add another call, the previous one got held... May 29 09:10:49 tap the title menu and merge calls May 29 09:13:26 There is no such thing as "merge calls", only "end held call" May 29 09:13:53 n900-dk: well more a hide porn button May 29 09:15:58 LuciusMare, there is one here May 29 09:16:08 :( May 29 09:16:09 LuciusMare, make a call, make another call, then merge them May 29 09:16:22 There is no "merge" button May 29 09:16:26 mind you if it's a voip call you can't merge a landline call with it May 29 09:16:28 uhh May 29 09:16:36 and why the hell does app manager have a search anymore? May 29 09:17:22 Do I need to make a screenshot? May 29 09:17:45 mc_teo: start typing, its live filter May 29 09:24:07 i dont want to use pidgin :( May 29 09:47:07 zaheerm, ping May 29 10:03:15 lo BaTmAn May 29 10:04:54 mc_teo: it has a search, just start typing May 29 10:05:18 i know? May 29 10:05:41 I don't know if you know May 29 10:05:54 i know! May 29 10:06:29 i know if i know, and i definately know that i know! May 29 10:06:38 good :) May 29 10:07:38 n900 doesnt have an Alt key, how would i switch tabs in irssi? May 29 10:08:53 s/windows/tabs/ May 29 10:09:07 n900 doesnt have an Alt key, how would i switch tabs in irssi? May 29 10:09:11 s/tabs/windows/ May 29 10:09:11 mc_teo meant: n900 doesnt have an Alt key, how would i switch windows in irssi? May 29 10:09:23 /window next May 29 10:09:26 It does too have an alt key May 29 10:09:26 ctrl n ctrl p May 29 10:09:28 or ctrl+n May 29 10:10:21 and why is nokia suite associated with .jars May 29 10:10:23 In xchat, I have shift-numbers (shift-blue-toprow-letters) bound to switch cannels May 29 10:10:33 thats pretty retarded May 29 10:10:45 SpeedEvil: not you, btw May 29 10:10:50 nokia May 29 10:11:32 Regrettably, much of the nokia sw is. May 29 10:11:50 mc_teo: because it can install jars on some phones May 29 10:15:49 mc_teo: esc+number also changes tabs in irssi May 29 10:18:57 one more column of keys, or another row. bring back the "Esc" key! May 29 10:19:29 Whoever is anti-esc at nokia, yer wrong! :) May 29 10:19:54 * pupnik stamps foot like 4 year old May 29 10:19:55 I want shift-blue to be configurable May 29 10:20:05 As with shift-z and blue-a May 29 10:20:13 So you can setup blue-a to be alt May 29 10:20:16 or tab May 29 10:42:43 SpeedEvil: blue-a? May 29 10:42:51 Ho ho ho, "I am so angry/sad/disappointed" party is in the full swing at tmo! May 29 10:43:01 SpeedEvil: you can bind alt to blue-a. May 29 10:43:44 you can? May 29 10:45:08 SpeedEvil: well yes. Edit /usr/share/X11/xkb/symbols/nokia_vndr/rx-51 and your keyboard layout, put in something like key { \[a,A,Alt_L,Alt_L] }; May 29 10:45:17 I am guessing it should work. I mean, why shouldn't it. May 29 10:45:23 it works with other keys, so why not with Alt_L May 29 10:46:09 neat! May 29 10:46:29 actually - you may get chording issues - I don't recall the key layout well May 29 10:51:07 SpeedEvil: meh, well it doesn't seem to work just yet. but I'm certain it's a matter of configuration May 29 10:53:24 good morning May 29 10:54:37 after upgrade, my conversation history is 'broken', so new calls or messages wouldn't be stored... any ideas to fix it? May 29 10:56:33 I don't undestand what an eight level layout is, anyway ._. May 29 10:57:15 hello. just stopping by to complain that the nokia update yet again wants me to wipe and reflash. what's the point of having a poackage manager if you're not going to use it? May 29 10:58:06 Go to your led pattern editor. set the color of missed call notofication to purple, click test, it appears in nice purple. now apply it, and miss call the phone, the notification appears as pink. Any idea what's wrong here? May 29 10:58:45 chadi reboot? May 29 10:58:53 even if I apply it manually, ie color rb, same result May 29 10:59:05 TheGerman I indeed did reboot May 29 10:59:25 renamed the fgenerated file? May 29 11:00:23 if you want, assume I don't have led pattern editor. I edit the file manually, changing the color to rb. Now I run led pattern editor, I test, it apears as purple, but when i miss call myself, it appears pinkish May 29 11:00:47 I'm also what business /usr/share/X11/xkb/symbols/nokia_vndr/rx-44 has on the n900. May 29 11:00:57 hmh no idea May 29 11:01:19 Shapeshifter: There may be 8 'rows' on the keyboard - split into columns May 29 11:01:32 TheAppleMan: do you have LED pattern editor? can you try it yourself? May 29 11:01:33 but whats with my database problem? ^^ May 29 11:01:50 TheGerman* sorry May 29 11:02:29 SpeedEvil: but with a 4 level layout you have nothing+button, shift+button, blue+button, blue+shift+button. that way you get 4 ways. But with 8 levels? How'd you ever reach them? May 29 11:02:37 i cant try it because my calling database is broken May 29 11:02:42 you'd need an additional modkey, May 29 11:03:36 like: nothing+button, shift+button, blue+button, green+button, shift+blue+button, green+blue+button, shift+green+button May 29 11:03:50 which is only 7 May 29 11:04:19 I don't understand how they get to 8 May 29 11:04:35 Shapeshifter: I mean 8 electrical May 29 11:04:45 SpeedEvil: huh? May 29 11:05:09 SpeedEvil, is it possible for the device to record in 720p? May 29 11:05:14 the russian and norsk layout use these 8-level things. but they don't have electrically different n900s May 29 11:05:15 MohammadAG: Unsure May 29 11:05:18 SpeedEvil, with the size of the lens May 29 11:05:35 MohammadAG: The lens can easily resolve 720p May 29 11:05:46 ah, you can of course switch modes. May 29 11:05:50 that gives you 2*4 May 29 11:05:50 I'm unsure if the video recorder will do it May 29 11:06:01 no ideas? May 29 11:06:04 SpeedEvil, so it's a software limitation? May 29 11:06:04 oh - right Shapeshifter. I was being confused. May 29 11:06:34 MohammadAG: I'm unsure if the hardware has the capacity to take 720p video. May 29 11:06:42 MohammadAG: At full rate that is May 29 11:16:30 samsung omnia hd has the very same cortex a8 and it records 720p video at 24fps so I guess it is just a software issue May 29 11:18:01 There are several problems to this: 1) maximum cpu encoding speed, 2) transfer rate to emmc for caching unencoded data and or saving encoded data. May 29 11:18:19 caching is probably impossible because it's just too slow May 29 11:20:32 * Arkenoi has strange feeling that pr1.2 is much less "stable" than 1.1.1. I see too many minor glitches. May 29 11:22:45 Arkenoi: 1.2.1 May 29 11:23:32 Shapeshifter: it's not the CPU which does the encoding May 29 11:23:51 cortex a8 is not a CPU May 29 11:23:55 It's a CPU core. May 29 11:24:00 The peripherals can vary. May 29 11:24:16 Including - for example - video encoder units and scalers. May 29 11:25:34 Or rather - it's not a SoC - it's a CPU core May 29 11:30:17 ah May 29 11:38:11 GBA remakes, ROMs and source: http://sites.google.com/site/gbaremakes/home/downloads May 29 11:41:35 could use a vsync-driven game loop demo May 29 11:44:32 1) give pupnik vsync signal 2) pupnik swaps framebuffer 3) lcd controller updates screen May 29 11:44:46 how hard is that :( May 29 11:49:43 has anyone had problems booting up from a damn ubuntu disc? May 29 11:54:36 it's mr butcher! May 29 12:13:57 im an expert at uploading my package ~3minutes after the autobuilder starts importing May 29 12:14:42 You should be by now. May 29 12:14:46 :) May 29 12:17:09 can anybody confirm bug 10304 ? May 29 12:17:10 Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=10304 Contacts not being recognised in Phone or SMS Conversations May 29 12:17:32 or has an idea how to fix this May 29 12:18:24 works here. open contacts, send sms May 29 12:18:41 i think revdkathy got that bug as well, but not seen her on irc lately May 29 12:18:47 MohammadAG: Maybe they use grub and not isolinux with your mobo not being able to boot from cd-grub May 29 12:19:29 Shapeshifter, it can boot from both May 29 12:19:38 and they use ISOlinux May 29 12:20:46 It seems to stop @ run level 5 May 29 12:21:55 chem|st: that sounds like what I had - it was due to one nnmber being in multiple contacts May 29 12:22:13 chem|st: I merged the two contacts - presto no more problems May 29 12:22:29 anyone who gets me jeff bertolucci's email address gets a cookie. May 29 12:22:30 presto? prstost? :S May 29 12:28:42 MohammadAG: maybe this is a good moment to try another distro? :> May 29 12:29:30 Shapeshifter, my experience with Debian hasn't been that great, it couldn't detect any of my drives May 29 12:30:44 MohammadAG: depending on what kind of user you are: www.archlinux.org May 29 12:30:56 Shapeshifter, hell no! May 29 12:32:06 wow, pr1.2 sucks my battery May 29 12:33:05 Mine improved by a noticeable amount. May 29 12:33:26 Same May 29 12:33:28 * n900-dk dont understand why I have to confirm installation of every update, after I pressed "update all".. May 29 12:33:29 (as GAN) May 29 12:33:44 n900-dk, cause if you don't some smartass might sue May 29 12:33:48 :) May 29 12:33:48 my phone is so responsive now having done a full reflash May 29 12:33:56 had tons of garbage on it tho May 29 12:34:22 "MeeGo phone will be capacitive, more stylish and more beautiful with simpler UI that average users will find as equally compelling as tech leaders." May 29 12:34:25 Nokia can go die in a fire. May 29 12:34:42 GeneralAntilles++ May 29 12:35:00 GeneralAntilles: where you at reading this? May 29 12:35:06 http://mynokiablog.com/2010/05/29/video-meego-qa-with-alberto-torres-nokia-evp-meego-computers-at-openmobile/ May 29 12:35:14 Nokia marketing is a hateful operation. May 29 12:35:17 Business moreso. May 29 12:37:29 tybollt: I got not a single contact with number dupplets, well maybe gran'pa but thats about it May 29 12:38:17 tybollt: I got that for some of the call-history and I dont have cell douplets May 29 12:39:15 some entries show up with the name but if I tap on them they show like a unknown number May 29 12:41:09 GeneralAntilles: I think this is my last nxxx then! well maybe I buy a new N900 in 3 years... May 29 12:42:46 pupnik: its not about that I am not able to call or text, its just that after a reflash it looks like something of the pattern engine messed up May 29 12:43:00 I need a way to trigger it by hand or something May 29 12:44:14 sup May 29 12:49:36 aah newer sgx drivers in harmattan to fix memory corruption and perhaps give vsync https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=9320#c6 May 29 12:49:37 Bug 9320: opengl-es2 rendering bugs May 29 12:50:06 GeneralAntilles: heh. May 29 12:58:51 hai thar May 29 12:59:05 my accu isn't loading May 29 12:59:37 wat to do? reboot doesn't work May 29 13:00:39 your what? May 29 13:00:40 :P May 29 13:00:48 battery May 29 13:02:14 vanadismobile: USB or wall charger May 29 13:02:54 i tried the wall charger and the old nokia charger with adapter May 29 13:03:29 have you tried to charge it after removing the battery with the wall charger (not boot) May 29 13:03:40 no May 29 13:03:53 brb testing this May 29 13:04:14 remove the bat put it back in and dont power up May 29 13:05:06 joppu: ping :) May 29 13:05:16 hello people btw May 29 13:05:18 lo wazd May 29 13:05:47 chem|st, hoping they'll still do a loaner program May 29 13:06:04 yurgh, tinymail embeds a camel-lite library which provides the same symbols as libcamel from evolution-data-server May 29 13:06:06 I can't ever see myself paying for a capacitive device. May 29 13:06:23 wazd hola May 29 13:06:26 holla* May 29 13:06:48 "N900+1 -- More closed, less useful" May 29 13:07:06 \o/ May 29 13:07:12 * Stskeeps just hopes it can run meego 1.1 and have it's own keys vault May 29 13:07:23 GAN900 what is N900+1 May 29 13:07:36 Stskeeps: I can make a community meego theme btw if you're interested :P May 29 13:07:57 wazd: hmm, i might be for the harmattan on n900 project, but i'll poke you later.. May 29 13:08:29 * wazd 's totally confused now :) May 29 13:08:30 wazd, there is no UX anyway =) May 29 13:08:43 wazd, or you want to make for maemo5 ? May 29 13:08:45 ZogG: *yet* :) May 29 13:09:06 wazd, maybe it wouldn't be out, maybe WW3 will strike =) May 29 13:09:11 ZogG: no, for Community Meego release May 29 13:09:22 wazd it's far from there anyway May 29 13:09:28 Stskeeps: so harmattan is not meego 1.0 in the end? :) May 29 13:09:48 GAN900: same here, capa sucks May 29 13:09:59 wazd, there is no handset UX till 1.1 as i understand May 29 13:10:08 actually, that's not entirely true May 29 13:10:11 they say 1.1 trunk, not 1.1 May 29 13:10:18 ZogG: just install xfce May 29 13:10:24 Stskeeps when trunk is out? May 29 13:10:40 chem|st wouldn't have phone functions anyway =) May 29 13:10:57 ZogG: i don't know what the plans are. May 29 13:10:59 re May 29 13:11:03 ZogG: sure not but what you need phone functions for? May 29 13:11:08 knowing things well, before summer, and everyone goes on holiday May 29 13:11:08 :P May 29 13:11:14 doesn't work properly May 29 13:11:29 vanadismobile: means doesn't charge? May 29 13:11:41 got this yellow blinking for about two sec May 29 13:11:54 but then it stopped May 29 13:12:12 Stskeeps, pics.livejournal.com/athirn_eleidan/pic/00005bqh/s320x240 - something like that May 29 13:12:18 does it start again with light pressure on the cable? May 29 13:12:37 chem|st, i want to communicate with people at least on phone =((( May 29 13:12:42 tried that, but doesn't work May 29 13:12:59 vanadismobile: then its not a broken plug though May 29 13:13:03 Is it possible to set the background just to a colour? May 29 13:13:16 Stskeeps, what holidays, it's school holidays =) May 29 13:13:17 ZogG: well you got sound and internet make yourself at home! May 29 13:13:31 i'm trying to connect it to pc right now May 29 13:13:49 chem|st, i want real life and want to take phone numbers from chicks =( May 29 13:14:21 ZogG: you wont ever get phone numbers from chicks May 29 13:14:37 you are a geek, geeks dont have a RL May 29 13:15:02 chem|st that's the problem, i don't have life and i'm not geek =( makes me loser May 29 13:15:28 chem|st actually i just don't take numbers - cause not gonna call - i give my number =) May 29 13:15:41 ZogG: Cheer up - you always have your N900 ;) May 29 13:15:46 * chem|st holds his hand in "L" shape at his forehead May 29 13:16:11 n900-dk, it's buggy, there is no meaning in life May 29 13:16:12 connecting by usb doesn't work May 29 13:16:25 chem|st, how dare you to laugh at me May 29 13:16:25 ZogG: Sooo sad May 29 13:16:29 will reflashing do something? May 29 13:16:38 * chem|st starts pointing fingers! May 29 13:16:45 * ZogG cries May 29 13:16:53 vanadismobile: not if it cannot connect... May 29 13:17:02 vandis does it charge? May 29 13:17:16 * ZogG throws wazd at chem|st May 29 13:17:20 ZogG: Remember, beer can fix any thing :) May 29 13:17:38 n900-dk, yeah, that's why i don't have money as well =) May 29 13:17:41 ZogG: why me? :( :) May 29 13:17:43 ~rocket ZogG May 29 13:17:51 haha May 29 13:17:54 fail May 29 13:18:05 ~punch chem|st May 29 13:18:06 * infobot lets fly with a wild haymaker which catches chem|st right on the nose May 29 13:18:11 n900-dk: since when does beer fix everything? May 29 13:18:21 Xenon|XZ, no May 29 13:18:28 ~blow ZogG May 29 13:18:29 * infobot blows ZogG May 29 13:18:30 mikki-kun, you are right, absent does May 29 13:18:34 >.< May 29 13:18:35 mikki-kun: since the beer invention? May 29 13:18:39 ~blowjob ZogG May 29 13:18:48 ok that doesnt work May 29 13:18:51 chem|st, ~blowjob ZogG* May 29 13:18:55 i thought wd-40 and ductape would fix everything... May 29 13:18:56 haha May 29 13:19:16 mikki-kun: thats for mechanical stuff May 29 13:19:47 it's wierd i went to sleep with full batt and in 5 hours it was over, no program running =\ May 29 13:19:49 as well as for software... never heard of /dev/ductape and /sys/dev/wd-40 ? May 29 13:20:24 ZogG: had that with PR1 back in february May 29 13:20:29 MohammadAG, haha, say it to ovi May 29 13:20:30 battery is loading now May 29 13:20:40 vandis - what was it? May 29 13:20:46 chem|st first time happened May 29 13:21:00 ZogG: I had that day after day May 29 13:21:05 chem|st, i heard of different bugs i didn't have till pr1.2 =) May 29 13:21:18 loose connection May 29 13:21:25 it stopped now... May 29 13:21:29 :( May 29 13:21:33 MohammadAG, are you going again to get whores and drugs from PT? May 29 13:21:55 vanadismobile, you don't need connection, internet is not real May 29 13:21:55 ZogG, they don't have those afiak, IL is for those ;) May 29 13:22:12 MohammadAG, yeah, that's why you need to bring them here =) May 29 13:22:52 MohammadAG, you know you don't have to suffer at board everytime May 29 13:23:03 ZogG, I don't lol May 29 13:23:08 you just can dig up tunnel from your house :D May 29 13:23:14 sssh May 29 13:23:23 >_> May 29 13:23:25 <_< May 29 13:23:48 have i blown your secret? =( May 29 13:24:05 stylo is a good song May 29 13:24:07 * ZogG xmms2> Gorillaz - Stylo (feat. Bobby Womack and Mos Def) ["Plastic Beach" 2010] May 29 13:24:30 wazd, have you done any maemo5 theme? May 29 13:24:39 ZogG: yes May 29 13:24:44 link May 29 13:24:58 http://tabletui.wordpress.com/2010/02/01/marina-theme/ May 29 13:25:46 not bad May 29 13:26:02 nice May 29 13:26:12 anyway i wonder why the speaker icon in statusbar's popup is not used as mute? May 29 13:26:17 it's anyway there May 29 13:26:37 wow May 29 13:26:48 small things — that's what makes me happy May 29 13:27:09 so i watched wolfmnan yesterday, what was gorlum doing there? May 29 13:27:13 wazd: excellent work :) May 29 13:27:38 b-man17: thanks, I'm trying to update it for 1.2 May 29 13:27:40 and did Mark Benard from FlashForward died or not? May 29 13:27:52 b-man17: but I can't find proper template May 29 13:28:33 hmm May 29 13:29:04 has anyone noticed that the Personal Dataplan monitor (v0.5-5) doesnt work in PR1.2 ? May 29 13:30:26 does launch but ignores data count May 29 13:30:43 Does someone know where I can get tput from? is it in some gnu package or something? May 29 13:30:48 www.youtube.com/watch?v=kkNxbyp6thM&feature=related - HAHAHA May 29 13:32:33 * DocScrutinizer mooes at the sun May 29 13:33:24 DocScrutinizer, sup May 29 13:33:39 when connected by usb -> the device starts, then the yellow led ist lighting for ~2 secs, then gets green and shuts off May 29 13:33:40 fu internet, i don't have any life cause of you May 29 13:33:48 without tput, I could run this highly entertaining cellular automata script May 29 13:34:02 ZogG: welcome to the club May 29 13:34:02 vanad1s bad karma May 29 13:34:15 DocScrutinizer is it party today? \o/ May 29 13:34:31 internet party :-S May 29 13:34:46 ZogG, gonna reflash the device now May 29 13:35:20 hey DocScrutinizer May 29 13:35:28 hey May 29 13:35:37 vanad1s do it May 29 13:35:58 internet party :-S May 29 13:36:01 drinks are on me May 29 13:36:04 |~_ ← kinda nike symbol =) May 29 13:36:11 * MohammadAG passes lcuk's 99 bottles of beer May 29 13:36:15 * Termana tips his drink on MohammadAG May 29 13:36:17 literally May 29 13:36:20 ON him May 29 13:36:21 vanad1s: (green off) that's really strange May 29 13:36:34 suitable device not found -.- May 29 13:36:51 vanad1s: or what do you mean by "shuts off"? May 29 13:36:53 www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yptlm8h198o - best adv ever May 29 13:36:53 has anyone seen the n900 boot to the SIM card PIN entry, then the top part above the dialog turns white and the phone reboots May 29 13:36:56 ? May 29 13:37:06 not me May 29 13:37:21 vanad1s: the green light -> black off? May 29 13:37:29 DocScrutinizer, yes May 29 13:37:41 vanad1s: or green stays on and screen goes black? May 29 13:38:07 does 1.2 have a way to set the default call type on the dialpad? May 29 13:38:11 1. i put the usb in May 29 13:38:26 2. the device vibrates and the yellow leds starts blinking two times May 29 13:38:38 3. the led changes to green May 29 13:38:39 Anyone unable to connect to a network with cisco wpa-leap auth? May 29 13:38:56 vanad1s green is ok, red is pregnant (would do you expect of putting you *usb* plug in? ) May 29 13:39:17 what? May 29 13:39:23 is there any way so that when I try to uninstall something it doesn't try to upgrade my system? May 29 13:39:32 ~trout ZogG May 29 13:39:33 * infobot slaps ZogG around a bit with a large trout! May 29 13:39:35 vanad1s, then the display goes off May 29 13:39:42 any idea how i can regain control of the phone? May 29 13:39:43 exactly May 29 13:39:44 that's soft power off May 29 13:40:07 the device is just charging May 29 13:40:13 madduck sudo :D May 29 13:40:14 hold the power button and it powers on May 29 13:40:23 no it's not, that's the problem May 29 13:40:32 ~nuke Nouveau native support in Ubuntu May 29 13:40:33 * infobot prepares 100 missle silos, and targets them at Nouveau native support in Ubuntu ... B☢☢M! May 29 13:40:34 ZogG: if it won't boot? May 29 13:40:36 vanad1s hold for a long time till the led is white May 29 13:40:42 madduck sudo boot May 29 13:40:51 madduck have you upgraded or what? May 29 13:41:04 MohammadAG use nvidia, Luke May 29 13:41:07 vanad1s: well, my N900 has a broken power switch May 29 13:41:21 vanad1s: somewhat similar problem May 29 13:41:29 no, there was some application upgrades last night, and the personal dataplan monitor could not be upgraded due to a conflict with hildon-something May 29 13:41:39 DocScrutinizer, okay, and what did you do? May 29 13:41:48 and then suddenly, there were internal errors and e.g. the Phone application wouldn't start anymore May 29 13:41:51 so i rebooted May 29 13:41:58 and now it's power-cycling endlessly May 29 13:42:16 madduck flash it May 29 13:42:18 theer's always R&... no May 29 13:42:37 for now it works occasionally. but I could et a parameter in flasher r&d mode so it stays on when plugging in to usb May 29 13:42:41 MohammadAG shhh, don't you see grownups are talking May 29 13:42:42 it starts, vibrates, shows Nokia on white, then the little busy dots, then black, then again the busy dots, then white led and nokia on white, then black, then restart. May 29 13:42:55 ZogG: the OS, eh? May 29 13:43:13 madduck, a video could help :) May 29 13:43:17 madduck yes, prob hildon or X is brokne =) May 29 13:43:20 oh nvm May 29 13:43:30 MohammadAG: really? May 29 13:43:30 sorry I thought vanad1s said that May 29 13:43:35 MohammadAG phone can't log in into X prob =) May 29 13:43:46 ZogG: okay, so i will flash May 29 13:44:03 NOLO should have a framebuffer option May 29 13:44:11 that doesn't need a kernel reflash May 29 13:44:32 ideally fbcon would be toggled by holding the F button May 29 13:44:32 vanad1s: you should test with just battery in, if you can power it up or at least make led shine by pressing powerbutton May 29 13:45:03 DocScrutinizer, that works properly May 29 13:45:12 the device is normaly booting May 29 13:45:26 madduck have a backup? May 29 13:45:49 ZogG: of the data? May 29 13:45:58 vanad1s: sorry then I'm out of ideas May 29 13:46:11 not a recent one, but it doesn't matter much May 29 13:46:19 i thought flashing didn't erase the data May 29 13:46:34 cheers May 29 13:46:37 vanad1s: what happens when you plug in the charger on a working system? May 29 13:46:47 madduck apps and contacts and calendar May 29 13:46:54 the charger is working May 29 13:46:59 vanad1s: then lock the screen with the sliding switch May 29 13:47:26 ZogG: i have the contacts elsewhere, the apps i'll just reinstall, and i don't use the calendar, so… May 29 13:47:29 should show green led and black screen May 29 13:47:31 lol hildon-desktop is such a fail app. May 29 13:47:35 i assume my conversations (SMS) will be gone too May 29 13:47:56 DocScrutinizer, no it's not showing the green led May 29 13:48:47 Shapeshifter, dpkg -r it (seriously, don't do that) May 29 13:48:49 madduck so you are good. do know how to flash? May 29 13:49:19 ZogG: http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware? May 29 13:49:41 MohammadAG: btw, do you know a way of restarting it in PR1.2? since I updated, a pkill hildon-desktop reboots the n900. May 29 13:49:50 before, it just restarted hildon-desktop May 29 13:49:58 only problem is that I am on amd64, and the flasher tool seems to be i386 only May 29 13:50:12 Shapeshifter, pkill? May 29 13:50:12 madduck yeap May 29 13:50:23 Shapeshifter, killall hildon-desktop works for me May 29 13:50:34 ah nevermind, I found dsmetool -k May 29 13:50:38 how bout "reboot" May 29 13:50:38 madduck windows? May 29 13:51:24 ZogG: no, debian. May 29 13:51:51 madduck it works under 64 May 29 13:51:59 MohammadAG, do you use fmms? May 29 13:52:01 it does? May 29 13:52:02 % sudo flasher-3.5 #10088 May 29 13:52:05 flasher-3.5: error while loading shared libraries: libusb-0.1.so.4: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory May 29 13:52:15 ZogG, yeah May 29 13:52:15 madduck i dunno i used it under gentoo 64 May 29 13:52:19 i have libusb installed, but 64bit. May 29 13:52:27 MohammadAG any special options? May 29 13:52:34 oh, i have chroots! ;) May 29 13:52:36 ZogG, ? May 29 13:52:53 madduck i use multilib but anyway it's not the problem imo May 29 13:53:15 MohammadAG can it screw up configs of internet or something? you just run it and that's all? May 29 13:53:30 ZogG, yep, it works perfectly after installation May 29 13:53:44 now it works in the chroot May 29 13:53:48 (except the part where IL Oragne f'd it, but that's not frals's fault) May 29 13:54:26 MohammadAG il orange what May 29 13:54:44 f'd, short for fsck'd May 29 13:54:58 MohammadAG yeah i understand that part May 29 13:55:02 in which way i mean? May 29 13:55:08 ZogG, I can't receive MMS May 29 13:55:18 ZogG, it goes into some obox album crap May 29 13:55:33 MohammadAG haha May 29 13:55:43 do you use polite hovac or third option? May 29 13:55:59 * lcuk kicks python for its date handling May 29 13:56:00 Havoc, which is the third option afaik May 29 13:56:07 ZogG: it's flashing. thanks May 29 13:56:13 * MohammadAG kicks lcuk for kicking python May 29 13:56:19 MohammadAG does it screw the internet connection? last time it did May 29 13:56:31 * ZogG kicks MohammadAG for joy May 29 13:56:32 ValueError: time data 'Thu, 25 Feb 2010 16:18:34' does not match format '%a, %d %m %Y %H:%M:%S' May 29 13:56:34 Nope, no problems here May 29 13:56:46 MohammadAG do you use fapn or else? May 29 13:57:00 What's %a? May 29 13:57:12 ZogG, nope, it autocreates the apn now May 29 13:57:12 day of the week May 29 13:57:13 afaik May 29 13:57:25 abbreviated or full name May 29 13:57:56 MohammadAG and it switches every x minuts? May 29 13:58:00 lcuk, it obviously hates you May 29 13:58:02 lcuk: %m != feb ? May 29 13:58:08 ZogG: it's booting again. but it really just put it back to factory default. May 29 13:58:15 oh no! May 29 13:58:15 ZogG, MMS is a push service May 29 13:58:20 it even kept my background! May 29 13:58:28 and calendar! May 29 13:58:29 DocScrutinizer, that would be it :) ta May 29 13:58:39 * lcuk is goin blind with python May 29 13:58:47 i have had a function which just does this for years May 29 13:58:55 and all conversations May 29 13:59:55 madduck told ya May 29 13:59:56 how does one get started programming for maemo? May 29 14:00:05 ZogG, MMS is a push service ? May 29 14:00:11 (if one already knows C) May 29 14:00:35 BCMM you get QT creator SDK and here you goes May 29 14:00:39 go/* May 29 14:01:08 * lcuk changes it to %b and fixes up the other things May 29 14:01:10 i thought there was a maemo-specific SDK?# May 29 14:01:20 lcuk: strptime! May 29 14:01:50 anyone uses the java (icedtea6/microemulator) on the n900? May 29 14:02:01 frals ill strangeptime May 29 14:02:03 ZogG, it doesn't need to check at set intervals - that's what frals told me May 29 14:02:06 strangle May 29 14:02:29 yes mms is a push service (mostly) May 29 14:02:39 all because i want to format a list of items by frikkin date May 29 14:02:42 there is a protocol for checking mmbox but its ... bah May 29 14:03:06 MohammadAG haha got new fmms, now don't have 3G connection at all May 29 14:03:09 lcuk: yeah, ive tried inserting everything in the same format in my db in fmms.. i gave up :p May 29 14:03:21 now im doing ~2 strptime each time i need to show a date :/ May 29 14:03:24 thats actually bad frals :P May 29 14:03:45 okay, gonna bring the device to the vendor, fuck this shit May 29 14:03:50 iirc MMS does something a bit weird like send an SMS with the URL of the message May 29 14:03:57 then the phone downloads the actual message May 29 14:04:11 lcuk: i know May 29 14:04:30 lcuk: but if you get every operator to agree on one time format ill fix my code ;) May 29 14:04:40 * lcuk looks to the sky and says GIVE ME VISUAL BASIC BACK May 29 14:04:44 mms is a sms with a URL inside May 29 14:04:54 :-P May 29 14:04:58 frals so the notification release still is not in devel? May 29 14:05:05 * MohammadAG drops a visual basic crate at lcuk May 29 14:05:13 :D supply drop May 29 14:05:14 MohammadAG send me mms May 29 14:05:16 frals: why did you decide to center-align the mms message input? May 29 14:05:24 MohammadAG NOW!!! =) May 29 14:05:33 Wolfie: because nokia ux experts suggested it ;) May 29 14:05:34 lcuk, enemy care package actually :P May 29 14:05:43 frals: wtf... that makes no sense May 29 14:05:45 ZogG, yeah... sure May 29 14:05:47 ZogG: its been in devel for a while May 29 14:05:50 ~lart lcuk for mentioning VB May 29 14:05:50 * infobot throws lcuk's poor little doggy off a cliff for mentioning VB May 29 14:06:01 did they also suggest to cut words in the middle when the line changes? May 29 14:06:21 what kernel parameter allows me to boot into runlevel 3? May 29 14:06:37 frals don't see it in statusarea popup as in your screenies May 29 14:06:40 though actually, it *kinda* worked May 29 14:06:53 MohammadAG srs, can you send me mms? May 29 14:06:56 back in 2000 when I touched it last time May 29 14:07:31 DocScrutinizer, :( May 29 14:07:45 ZogG, I'm missing something, your damn number May 29 14:07:45 ZogG: anything in the log? May 29 14:07:45 * lcuk installs visual basic on DocScrutinizer's computer May 29 14:08:19 * DocScrutinizer starts fsck to remove the 'bad blocks' May 29 14:08:21 Wolfie: does it do that? May 29 14:08:22 MohammadAG: appending 3 should be enough May 29 14:08:51 frals log? does fmms has a log, didn't know May 29 14:08:57 Shapeshifter, should I just put that in the kernel line? May 29 14:08:58 frals, using amazing gitorious line numbers where abouts is your str formatting code May 29 14:09:05 so i can see how a pro does it :P May 29 14:09:12 MohammadAG: yeah. just "3" May 29 14:09:24 MohammadAG orange May 29 14:09:35 frals where i check the log? May 29 14:09:39 zaheerm, ping May 29 14:10:01 frals btw i started fmms and than upgraded, do i need to kill the process to restart it? May 29 14:10:15 ZogG: restart fmms is probably good after upgrading May 29 14:10:20 ZogG: /tmp/fmms.log May 29 14:10:38 frals process name? May 29 14:10:42 ciao a tutti May 29 14:10:44 fmms_gui.py May 29 14:10:47 lcuk: http://gitorious.org/fmms/fmms/blobs/master/controller.py#line76 May 29 14:10:54 !list May 29 14:10:55 lcuk: disclaimer: its ugly as hell ;D May 29 14:10:55 frals the gui is killed May 29 14:11:09 lcuk: and probably doesnt handle all cases, add try/except as suitable... ;D May 29 14:11:14 frals, perfect thanks May 29 14:11:22 * RST38h wonders if he should haunt tmo tonight May 29 14:11:23 :)_ May 29 14:11:27 -_ May 29 14:11:41 Find some vulnerable soul and help it on the way to the asylum May 29 14:11:49 heheh May 29 14:11:51 hi, all maemo programs is free ? May 29 14:11:59 no May 29 14:12:04 but many May 29 14:12:42 MohammadAG, got sms =) May 29 14:12:56 to see the pict go blahblah site May 29 14:13:11 ZogG, told ya May 29 14:13:22 ZogG, give them a call, if it works I'll do it :P May 29 14:13:50 frals: i think it does... don't have my phone with me, but i think the line wrap doesn't take word boundaries into account May 29 14:14:39 ops, youre right, ive set it to wrap_char instead of word May 29 14:14:43 Stskeeps: what happens if i try to download one of them ? maybe the cost can be counted as my phone operator bill? May 29 14:14:48 Shapeshifter, it still tries to run X May 29 14:14:56 MohammadAG your number? May 29 14:14:59 PM me May 29 14:15:04 Juozapas: some things come through ovi store, not sure if it goes over your phone bill. May 29 14:15:09 but data transfer might cost May 29 14:15:14 ZogG, umm, shouldn't you have got it? May 29 14:15:16 1-800-DONTCALLMEMOSSAD May 29 14:15:23 ok one more question May 29 14:15:42 MohammadAG: you could also try "single". do you know if the cd uses grub 1 or 2? because if it's grub 2 you can't "e" (edit), "esc" and then "b". you have to "e", append whatever to the kernel line, and then ctrl-x to boot May 29 14:15:54 as opposed to the e, esc, b in grub1 May 29 14:15:55 ooooh, PR 1.2 is out May 29 14:16:08 Shapeshifter, using ISOLinux May 29 14:16:08 but basically, I should be able to install 1.1.1 and upgrade, right? May 29 14:16:14 this *is* debian after all ;) May 29 14:16:14 MohammadAG: oh right xD May 29 14:16:15 how to keep off my operator interner (it's very expensive). I want to use only wifi and if there isn't wifi spot just dont connect to web or something May 29 14:16:51 MohammadAG: then it doesn't matter I guess. in any case, try "single" and I thought there was an ubuntu cli installer May 29 14:16:54 Juozapas: isn't there a setting that makes the phone always ask you for connection before it does that May 29 14:16:56 "simple installer" or something May 29 14:17:14 Shapeshifter, I cba to download another image May 29 14:17:15 MohammadAG: also, I'm guessing you're having a driver problem? ATI card by chance? May 29 14:17:48 frals, it's ok. May 29 14:17:54 Wolfie: yeah, it ask for password be i even know that password but it still connect if i type some rando pass May 29 14:18:03 *random May 29 14:18:16 it there is icon and all the stuf when i send, i thought it works always as i run it May 29 14:18:19 maybe there'is some more powerful option ? May 29 14:18:42 Shapeshifter, nope, they added kernel support for nouveau, it shouldn't cause any problems with intel cards yet my laptop doesn't boot up May 29 14:19:28 MohammadAG: what now, intel or nvidia? May 29 14:19:46 MohammadAG got it? May 29 14:19:53 MohammadAG: what I'm trying to say is that you could try disabling KMS. May 29 14:20:07 ZogG, nothing yet May 29 14:20:09 by the way, make a video call with skype it's still impossible ? May 29 14:20:12 MohammadAG hmm May 29 14:20:12 Juozapas: remove the connection in internet in setup May 29 14:20:18 Shapeshifter, my lappy's chipset is intel May 29 14:20:30 I read “lady” … May 29 14:20:31 :/ May 29 14:20:35 Shapeshifter, I uninstalled xserver-xorg-video-nouveau May 29 14:20:42 wonder if that will actually work... May 29 14:20:58 MohammadAG: I still don't understand what you'r trying to do where. Aren't you trying to boot an install CD? May 29 14:21:03 Juozapas: honestly I can't see how it works without you configuring it first instance May 29 14:21:18 and what are you doing with nouveau on an intel chipset? May 29 14:21:23 Shapeshifter, yeah, it boots up properly but when GDM loads up the laptop just hangs May 29 14:21:29 DocScrutinizer: cant delete operator's connection May 29 14:21:36 Shapeshifter, it's built into the stock Ubuntu kernel now May 29 14:21:37 it blanks delete' button May 29 14:21:42 Juozapas: you always need to set up AP name for GPRS connection May 29 14:21:45 MohammadAG: ... May 29 14:22:04 Juozapas: then change AP name to random crap May 29 14:22:06 MohammadAG: uhm, still, nouveau has nothing to do with intel cards. if you have an intel card, you can foget about nouveau May 29 14:22:16 ZogG, same SMS crap May 29 14:22:21 MohammadAG: you can use i915.modeset=0 on the kernel line to disable KMS May 29 14:22:25 if you have intel May 29 14:22:33 Shapeshifter, I added nomodeset May 29 14:22:39 if you have nvidia, as you're talking about nouveau all the time, it would be modeset=0 May 29 14:23:31 MohammadAG, btw do they work at shabes? May 29 14:23:43 ZogG, who? May 29 14:23:51 oh, orange? May 29 14:23:53 they should May 29 14:23:59 DocScrutinizer: ok, it helped thx ;) May 29 14:24:18 hi, I've downloaded opera mini and it's great, one of the features stands out, the virtual keyboard that is visible when the physical is not. I wonder whether something similar could be done with the default maemo keyboard? I would want to use korean keyboard, not some romanization input May 29 14:24:47 failsafe x worked \o/ May 29 14:24:58 WTF is 'delete' not enabled for GPRS interent connection??? May 29 14:25:17 ! May 29 14:25:18 DocScrutinizer, no, you have to use WAIT FOR IT... GCONF! May 29 14:25:35 hey what about skype video calling ? May 29 14:25:42 MohammadAG: wut? May 29 14:26:29 DocScrutinizer, gconf May 29 14:26:46 DocScrutinizer, ask frals, he knows about this stuff more than I do (fAPN) May 29 14:26:47 ge ce oh en ef May 29 14:26:51 yeah what? May 29 14:26:57 ? May 29 14:27:04 wut? May 29 14:27:10 frals, how can DocScrutinizer delete an APN? May 29 14:27:13 default one May 29 14:27:24 fAPN allows deletion of new ones only afaik May 29 14:27:29 gconftool-2 -R /system/osso/connectivity/IAP/ May 29 14:27:29 frals there is port number in setting? is it for proxy? May 29 14:27:37 or it's for connection? May 29 14:27:44 and then gconftool-2 --recursive-unset /system/osso/connectivity/IAP/ May 29 14:27:48 DocScrutinizer, there you go, go have some gconf love :P May 29 14:27:49 ZogG: for proxy May 29 14:27:51 MohammadAG iandroid.co.il/dr-iandroid/archives/608 May 29 14:28:05 fuggit May 29 14:28:40 why can't I delete the default GPRS connection in settings-internetconnections ? May 29 14:29:08 because then a normal user would do it, and then thered be chaos ;) May 29 14:29:11 that's mean May 29 14:29:28 frals i found android configuration for mms, they have MMC and MNC as well, any idea what is that/ May 29 14:29:45 no need for those, they are related to operator and not needed May 29 14:29:53 its identifiers for oprator pretty much afaik May 29 14:30:08 frals jsut we got sms that we have mms instead mms =) May 29 14:30:24 frals, DocScrutinizer thanks :) May 29 14:30:39 err? May 29 14:30:41 np (?) May 29 14:31:02 I did nothing! ( (c) bart simpson) May 29 14:31:03 frals portrait mode looks okay btw =) May 29 14:31:32 DocScrutinizer, you spotted the bug in default format i was using and frals showed me about exception handling :P May 29 14:31:37 frals nope only when writting not at the mms list =) May 29 14:31:42 once i get the energy im going to make the qwerty keyboard i made for vertsms into a proper module and try to get portrait mode mms composing May 29 14:31:44 without even realising it :) May 29 14:31:58 frals the ctrl+shift+r is ok =) May 29 14:32:13 the mainview shouldnt be as the widths are hardcoded there ;) May 29 14:32:43 hm May 29 14:32:55 microb seems broken after updating May 29 14:32:58 * wazd curses nokia for no portrait media player once again May 29 14:33:03 like.. some pages seem to hang May 29 14:33:11 MohammadAG remindme tomorrow to call them May 29 14:33:21 ZogG, call them, NOW May 29 14:33:22 somehow pixelpipe authorize always fail, any ideas ? May 29 14:33:27 wazd make the voodoo dance May 29 14:33:30 im using mastory May 29 14:33:31 MohammadAG meh May 29 14:33:32 GRRR May 29 14:33:39 wazd: i agree May 29 14:33:43 Windows has the partition locked cause of an unclean shutdown May 29 14:33:47 the no portrait media player is lame May 29 14:33:52 damn bastards May 29 14:33:57 ZogG: it doesn't work properly even with ctrl+shift+r May 29 14:34:02 i made n900 reboot instantly and reproducably last night o_O May 29 14:34:05 MohammadAG: frals: now ponder that - I got an APN/GPRS connection that 'expires' some certain date in month and I want to change the APN at that very moment *automatically* as otherwise each MB costs me 14.99$ May 29 14:34:11 ZogG: height is hardcoded May 29 14:34:32 DocScrutinizer, make a daemon for it :) May 29 14:34:43 DocScrutinizer, on a more serious note, use alarmed and run that command May 29 14:35:12 MohammadAG: "normal user will get confused" May 29 14:35:41 Macer: it's just too tricky to switch tracks on the go in landscape May 29 14:35:45 DocScrutinizer, use root :) May 29 14:36:10 got no root to use. No plants here :-P May 29 14:36:43 [2010-05-29 16:29:08] because then a normal user would do it, and then thered be chaos ;) May 29 14:36:54 waz i know May 29 14:36:54 it sucks May 29 14:36:55 wazd i know May 29 14:37:07 Want government management of network services? What are the negative consequences? http://mises.org/daily/4432 May 29 14:37:10 MohammadAG tring to play with configs now May 29 14:37:24 heh May 29 14:39:13 quite honestly, for everything but a single standard usecase (= customer has a dataplan incl flatrate) the internet connection settings seem quite retarded May 29 14:41:14 I'd not recommend to get a N900 anyway, if you're not willing to get a decent dataplan. But nevertheless this feels totally fubar May 29 14:42:38 oh if only i could select multiple applications to download and install, rather than going through them one by one… May 29 14:43:20 no way to define precedence of particular connections over others, no way to disable particular connections, no way to delete GPRS packet connection AT ALL - W*T*F?! May 29 14:44:32 DocScrutinizer: gprs connection name changes name with SIM as well, that's fun. May 29 14:45:52 DocScrutinizer, yeah, Nokia people get tunnel vision May 29 14:46:07 What with their company-paid dataplans and whatnot. May 29 14:46:33 usecase: I have a private wifi AP with low range, a GPRS flatrate with a faraway basestation so I get flaky connect, and a local hotspot with rather high fee. how the hell am I supposed to config that like prio1:local wifi, prio2:GPRS, prio3:hotspot ? May 29 14:48:14 SwedeMike: yep May 29 14:48:42 SwedeMike: not to think about roaming May 29 14:49:21 is there really no way to install multiple apps at once? May 29 14:49:59 GAN900: quite fine the whole connectivity management is totally FOS then - nah wait, is it? :-o May 29 14:51:29 DocScrutinizer: well, I actually don't think it's a major problem, only time it annoyed me was when I wanted to look at the maps in "offline mode" which doesn't seem to exist. May 29 14:53:07 SwedeMike: It becomes a problem for me once a month, as the above described situation isn't fictive (dataplan expires, MB costs $$$ over same APN then) May 29 14:54:35 SwedeMike: I'd like to switch to a different GPRS paccket connection (APN) then, by simply changing something in "conections" like I do when I select a wifi AP May 29 14:55:12 DocScrutinizer: what are you solving by changing APN? that it won't connect at all? May 29 14:55:15 I *really* don't get wth hildon-desktop thinks it is doing. Why it will *almost* always launch an application only once. I tried adding X-Multiple=true and X-Multiple-Instances=true and same with false and combinations of it, and for some inane reason, it *seemingly* works with 'X-Multiple=true', if done in exactly this sequence: have an open window (no matter what app), edit .desktop file to add this line, run application from menu or ... May 29 14:55:21 ... desktop shortcut - several times. It opens fine. but as soon as you close all of them, and rerun the same shortcut again and again, it yet again only opens it once! May 29 14:55:25 it's insane. it just doesn't work. It's broken. May 29 14:55:35 but I can not create a 2nd packet connection, I can NOT disable the single one default one, only thing I can do is step thru the settings and enter the whole crap from top of my head May 29 14:55:55 fapn? May 29 14:56:22 I was about to mention that too May 29 14:56:27 DocScrutinizer: I have turned off that mine autoconnects to GPRS, isn't that what you want to accomplish? May 29 14:56:49 SwedeMike: I change my bill, as the other APN only charges $/MB instead of $$$/MB May 29 14:57:26 DocScrutinizer: wow, your mobile provider really tries to screw you. May 29 14:57:33 SwedeMike: no, I want to have 2 or more preconfigured APN to choose from May 29 14:57:42 hm, my n900 has deadlocked itself :/ May 29 14:57:58 ShadowJK: security feature :-P May 29 14:58:21 it heard about APN madness May 29 14:58:42 Filing a bug is probably a good idea. May 29 14:58:54 SpeedEvil: yes May 29 14:58:57 Explain your telcos data services, and why you want to do this May 29 14:59:46 I'd imagine that is not a bug, it's a feature request. In most countries/companies it doesn't really make sense to have multiple APNs. May 29 15:00:04 SpeedEvil: anyway, the setup and functionality as is, it's quite braindamaged, isn't it? May 29 15:00:14 basically May 29 15:00:45 speaking of which, I'd like to reset my "dataplan monitor" counters every month, I haven't been able to find a way to do that? May 29 15:00:53 does ps3 supports ext2? May 29 15:01:03 I LOL'd ZogG May 29 15:01:03 I can't even get precedence of GPRS connection over WLAN May 29 15:01:34 MohammadAG whaT? May 29 15:01:53 I sometimes want that too. May 29 15:02:02 I normally want to roam onto wifi if I can. May 29 15:02:03 SwedeMike: I do it with a crontab entry May 29 15:02:07 ZogG, no, but then again what OS other than linux/unix supports ext2 May 29 15:02:09 SpeedEvil: otoh that's a 1000% sure WONTFIX for maemo until PR17.4 May 29 15:02:13 ZogG, got a PS3? May 29 15:02:24 SwedeMike: But I might be able to hack a little UI around it and package it May 29 15:02:27 MohammadAG yes May 29 15:02:28 so what's the use in filing a bug? May 29 15:02:33 ZogG, PSN ID? May 29 15:02:34 MohammadAG, got a deal May 29 15:02:36 Unless I've expicitly disconnected from wifi as it's broken, and I want to connect to GPRS. May 29 15:02:54 MohammadAG TheZogG i think - but didn't upgraded it to last fw i think = May 29 15:03:23 MohammadAG i use my flashusb on winxp at work with ext2 =) May 29 15:03:28 ZogG, if you're waiting for the Geohot stuff don't hold your breath :) May 29 15:03:51 MohammadAG i know he has no interest in it. just connection in israel crappy anyway May 29 15:04:07 Ikarus; would be nice if you could add a history too to the UI, so you can compare months May 29 15:04:46 Trizt: hrm, should be doable May 29 15:04:48 MohammadAG i bought NEW ps3 with 2 new joypads with cabel and 2 games from yad2 and it has bug.co.il garantee and it was 1900 or somethink like that, maybe even less May 29 15:04:55 Trizt: I'll see May 29 15:05:08 I didn't quite need that detail myself May 29 15:05:08 Ikarus: that would be nice, lot's of people at http://maemo.org/downloads/product/Maemo5/personal-gprs-mon/?org_openpsa_qbpager_net_nehmer_comments_comment_page=2 seems to want it, but then again, that might be a different one from the one I'm using, because that reset method there doesn't seem to work May 29 15:05:15 MohammadAG your ID is MohammadAG as i assume May 29 15:05:22 my data plan just involves after blowing 2GB through I get demoted in speed May 29 15:05:31 * Trizt nods May 29 15:05:37 Even if I do Exec=/bin/ash -c urxvt , which is of course insane, it only launches it once May 29 15:05:58 ZogG, how'd you guess? :P May 29 15:06:07 And also if I use urxvtd + urxvtc May 29 15:06:16 ... It's black magic, bad magic. May 29 15:06:59 http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_AQm2-lLOkvw/StwoFok8UlI/AAAAAAAABIE/tYntsEBRVqc/s400/IMG_3110.JPG May 29 15:07:03 SpeedEvil: the sad thing is, I have a nice requirements spec and architecture design inside my head for this, but it's a waste of time writing it down as it will get binned for "too complex, don't need that" May 29 15:09:17 * madduck dies of boredom installing dozens of apps ONE AFTER THE OTHER May 29 15:10:01 madduck: apt-get install x y z May 29 15:10:18 my major complaint about n900 is standby time, sometimes it seems to gobble juice like there is no tomorrow. May 29 15:10:34 slonopotamus: i was told one should not use apt-get directly because the app manager does extra magic. May 29 15:11:24 oh my... /me deinstall all aps he installed with apt-get on maemo during last three years May 29 15:13:47 Is it possible to use Facebook,MSN,Ovi or anything else without merging contacts with Contacts app? It's frustrating to see lots of contacts on list when I don't even need them on my mobile. May 29 15:18:12 SpeedEvil: "type=wlan; name=athome; baseprio=5; on signal <50 prio-=50; on exec="if ping -c 1 ct.de; then false; else true; fi" prio-=50; on flightmode prio-=50 May 29 15:19:00 hey interesting May 29 15:19:26 does thatm help keep your connection up? May 29 15:19:54 that would help keep my mood towards N900 connection handling up May 29 15:19:55 Aranel: afaik no and I find it quite annoying as well May 29 15:20:09 but hey, pretty much all the nokia made apps suck big time. May 29 15:21:47 Aranel: well designed services allow you to select which contacts are actually visible May 29 15:22:10 Aranel: for example you can do it in google (and the contacts list in the phone updates in real time as you edit your contacts on the google website) May 29 15:22:38 i have not yet figured out how you do it with facebook May 29 15:23:23 lol @ /tmp/hildon-welcome-is-finished May 29 15:24:37 ali1234: I think Groups would do it, It's possible to show a group (for ex, Facebook) but It's not possible to hide a group, which we need to do. May 29 15:25:04 it's possible to show/hide grounds in the facebook web chat thingy, it just doesn't carry over to the maemo plugin unfortunately May 29 15:25:18 i was trying to do this about half an hour ago May 29 15:25:27 playing with the video calling atm May 29 15:25:29 its quite good May 29 15:25:51 although the camera seems to stop adapting to light conditions once you start making a call May 29 15:26:03 which will suck if you start out in the sun and then go indoors during a call May 29 15:26:07 other person will only see black May 29 15:26:36 it does adapt, but it takes too long, is what I found out May 29 15:27:25 video call over irc yet? :P May 29 15:27:29 doubt it May 29 15:27:40 is there a plugin like bonjour which supports video? ie lan only? May 29 15:27:58 dunno lets search May 29 15:28:10 i had a search, didn't help much May 29 15:28:22 i think bonjour might support video using a mac-only protocol May 29 15:29:42 eeeek, bonjour May 29 15:32:39 ~lart avahi May 29 15:32:39 * infobot gives avahi a good seeing to May 29 15:33:30 ~poke DocScrutinizer May 29 15:33:31 * infobot cuts down a small tree, sneaks up behind DocScrutinizer, pokes DocScrutinizer repeatedly, hilarity ensues. May 29 15:33:55 i just flashed windows onto my n900 May 29 15:33:58 ! May 29 15:35:29 icculus.org/cdogs-sdl/files/cdogs-sdl-current.tar.bz2 game port candidate May 29 15:35:51 i joke, i joke! May 29 15:35:59 no windows for me May 29 15:36:29 no X Windows? what went wrong? May 29 15:36:46 mc_teo win is rulez May 29 15:36:53 ... May 29 15:37:00 why is you here? May 29 15:37:10 mc_teo why not? May 29 15:37:35 I wonder if there's *anything* to sync contacts, maybe even calendar, to ovi or webdav or my local vcard fatabes, which works ootb now on pr1.2, without going thru install&config hell May 29 15:38:02 DocScrutinizer: export? May 29 15:38:06 s/fatabes/database/ May 29 15:38:07 DocScrutinizer meant: I wonder if there's *anything* to sync contacts, maybe even calendar, to ovi or webdav or my local vcard database, which works ootb now on pr1.2, without going thru install&config hell May 29 15:38:19 scp, then import May 29 15:38:43 that's not exactly what I call sync May 29 15:38:58 BCMM: x windows is ok, i was speaking about ms windows May 29 15:39:09 mc_teo: what's MS windows? May 29 15:39:28 ZogG: actually windows fails quite spectacularly May 29 15:39:36 Windows are for people stuck behind walls. May 29 15:40:01 you could always just use some Gates? May 29 15:40:43 I hate the gates way May 29 15:44:36 oh god. hildon-desktop *really* keeps a list of apps launched using it >.< May 29 15:44:38 incredibly daft May 29 15:44:42 hardcoded in C May 29 15:44:56 wth?! May 29 15:46:03 http://maemo.gitorious.org/fremantle-hildon-desktop/hildon-desktop/blobs/master/src/launcher/hd-app-mgr.c#line756 May 29 15:46:28 mc_teo it's not. windows is cool. linux is not working out of box May 29 15:46:57 why is that bad Shapeshifter May 29 15:47:16 pupnik: because you can't launch multiple instances of the same app using the menu or the desktop shortcuts? May 29 15:47:21 obviously? May 29 15:47:45 i made a terminal app shortcut that gives multiple xterms May 29 15:48:11 would that help? May 29 15:48:13 pupnik: can you share that? May 29 15:48:17 pupnik: yes. May 29 15:48:22 hey chaps May 29 15:48:36 where to share.. t.m.o? May 29 15:48:41 hi May 29 15:48:46 hi pupnik May 29 15:49:27 pupnik: pastie.org May 29 15:49:31 i wonder what keeps launching intellisyncd with the -a parameter, like in osso-backup restore scripts May 29 15:50:04 normally intellisyncd shouldnt start if its disabled in /home/user/.intellisyncd/disabled May 29 15:51:52 Shapeshifter: shift-ctrl-x starts a new xterm? May 29 15:52:12 the hildon launcher is designed as if it was some sort of iphone/android concept where you just have one instance of every app and wake it, and put it to hibernate etc. May 29 15:52:19 DocScrutinizer51: I want to launch multiple urxvt May 29 15:54:13 Shapeshifter: well, there's quite obviously an option missing in .desktop files spec. like sameinstance=no May 29 15:54:40 very slow pastie.org.. Shapeshifter http://paste.debian.net/75331 May 29 15:54:52 think Imve seen such parameter in enlightenment .desktop files May 29 15:55:30 it only bothers me with xerm May 29 15:55:38 DocScrutinizer51: there should be X-Multiple-Instances=true, there supposedly is the wrong X-Multiple=true, but none of this works May 29 15:55:39 xterm May 29 15:55:57 pupnik: thanks May 29 15:56:10 * pupnik is happy to be useful May 29 15:56:20 Shapeshifter: that's what I meant, yes May 29 15:56:54 * lardman looks at Dell Streak and thinks it's an ideal size, but needs a kb and maemego May 29 15:57:10 Shapeshifter: fil a ticket :-) May 29 15:57:26 DocScrutinizer51: hopeless May 29 15:57:36 yep May 29 15:58:07 so patch the hildon launcher and attach the patch May 29 15:59:49 pupnik: heh. doesn't work. it works exactly as you pasted it, but if I replace osso-xterm by /usr/bin/urxvt, it only opens one of them. May 29 16:00:45 pupnik: you know I even made some silly detour script like temp=$(cat /tmp/foobar); urxvt -name $temp &; temp=$((temp+1)); echo $temp > /tmp/foobar which launches every subsequent term with a differen X name (0, 1, 2, 3...) May 29 16:00:50 even that launches only once. May 29 16:01:07 meh May 29 16:01:10 * Shapeshifter goes for beers. May 29 16:01:18 Shapeshifter: btw for xterm and especially things like mc that's a total pita. mc won't start on clicking the icon, if there's a xtern instance running already May 29 16:01:58 what's the deal with the nmap package creating an icon for itself? May 29 16:02:18 probably same as for mc May 29 16:02:31 all it does is run nmap with no arguments and then dump you at a shell May 29 16:02:45 exec='xterm nmap' May 29 16:02:59 i expect that the package only creates an icon because of some braindead QA rules May 29 16:03:46 maybe they messed it up? should call nmap-fe? May 29 16:03:48 the whole architecture is flawed. It wants to be somewhat androidish while actually there is no sandboxing and task handling like on android May 29 16:04:05 it's fake android May 29 16:04:44 let beat up the UX guys ;-) May 29 16:05:12 nmap-fe isn't installed May 29 16:07:10 the nmap launcher is weird May 29 16:07:16 plenty of other CLI apps just don't have a link on the menu May 29 16:08:56 mc has May 29 16:09:12 equally useless, as mentioned above May 29 16:09:44 mc does at least keep on running until you quit it May 29 16:09:48 that makes slightly more sense May 29 16:10:04 when you click the nmap icon you get the last few lines of the short usage, and a shell prompt May 29 16:10:27 what i mean is mc is interactive May 29 16:10:31 nmap is not May 29 16:11:53 now that's really silly, for nmap May 29 16:12:04 im reporting a bug now May 29 16:14:19 "launcher MUST support X-Multiple-Instances=true" May 29 16:14:51 the nmap launcher seems to support that, in that it works even if there is already an terminal open May 29 16:15:37 bug 5839 May 29 16:15:37 Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=5839 Modest gets stuck updating POP3 mailboxes May 29 16:15:41 hum May 29 16:16:16 no, this 5839: https://garage.maemo.org/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=5839&group_id=1367&atid=5044 May 29 16:16:44 ali1234: now that's weird May 29 16:17:43 (the "nmap launcher seems to support that" part) May 29 16:18:02 ali1234: mind pastbin the .desktop? May 29 16:18:07 maybe you can only run one "nmap" xterm May 29 16:18:14 sure hang on May 29 16:18:43 no, seems you can run as many as you want from the icon May 29 16:19:49 http://pastebin.com/CmB2iDpf May 29 16:20:06 thanks May 29 16:20:41 whats the deal with ovi chat? May 29 16:20:48 does it work? May 29 16:20:55 heh, the script it runs instead of nmap directly just does: nmap; echo Use \'sudo nmap\' to run nmap with root privileges. ; sh May 29 16:21:20 i can't believe someone actually went to the trouble of making that May 29 16:21:56 ZogG: ubuntu is free, they will even send you a free cd, it takes minutes to install, and works perfectly out of the bo May 29 16:21:59 box* May 29 16:22:10 dont like ubuntu :( May 29 16:22:17 :p May 29 16:22:21 ok works for mc as well. probably fixed in pr1.0.1 May 29 16:23:10 mc_teo: yes May 29 16:23:36 mc_teo no it's not May 29 16:23:59 ubuntu used to work perfectly out of the box, then they filled it up with mono crap and vendor moneysinks May 29 16:24:06 luckily it's trivial to remove that stuff May 29 16:24:16 mc_teo, ubuntu sucks May 29 16:24:39 ubuntu is shitimacos =) May 29 16:24:46 shitty* May 29 16:24:49 Gentoo ;-) May 29 16:24:58 ZogG: i installed 10.04 a fews days ago, and it was fully working out of the box May 29 16:25:12 mc_teo, windows works out of box too May 29 16:25:16 mac os too May 29 16:25:20 no it doesnt May 29 16:25:24 yes it is May 29 16:25:33 mac os is closed source linux btw May 29 16:25:38 mc_teo, what distro do you use? May 29 16:25:48 vista normally May 29 16:25:51 mc_teo, do i care about close or not =) May 29 16:25:57 xp on my desktop May 29 16:26:09 mc_teo, and you advertising me linux? May 29 16:26:10 mc_teo, it's not Linux May 29 16:26:15 HAHA May 29 16:26:28 its eyecandyized openstep May 29 16:26:30 mc_teo, are you trying to troll me? May 29 16:26:31 im just saying that for out of the box compatability, ubuntu owns May 29 16:26:36 Hai. May 29 16:26:36 :D May 29 16:26:43 mc_teo, noooope =) May 29 16:26:51 I have an iPhone. Jailbroke it. It's still not fun enough. :( May 29 16:27:06 Out of the box compatibility - linux-from-scratch owns. May 29 16:27:11 nikki93, get android on it =) May 29 16:27:13 It just takes longer to open the box. May 29 16:27:23 SpeedEvil, \o/ May 29 16:27:28 rofl May 29 16:27:46 mc_teo, you don May 29 16:27:57 I made an LFS once. May 29 16:27:59 you don't know to convince peoplel man May 29 16:27:59 Great fun. May 29 16:28:11 * ZogG sys Linux 2.6.33-gentoo [965P-S3; x86_64 Desktop] May 29 16:28:14 mc_teo, ^ May 29 16:28:15 Is n900 kewl? May 29 16:28:17 distro[Gentoo Linux (stable)] May 29 16:28:34 Xenon|XZ, meh, stable is not fun anymore May 29 16:28:50 lol May 29 16:28:52 Shapeshifter: so you looked into what's happening with xterm.desktop, and mc.desktop ? May 29 16:28:54 I heard n900 is very hack-friendly. May 29 16:29:13 nikki93 yesm yu take hammer and you hack it May 29 16:29:15 OK guys, we get it, you and the A-team are awesome. Now how about we stop talking about each and everyone's super awesome OS? May 29 16:29:26 no May 29 16:29:32 nikki93, you can build wals or even bridge with n900s May 29 16:29:38 ZogG: zomg May 29 16:29:45 walls* May 29 16:29:47 We know you built it yourself, you compiled your own kernel and everything, woohoo, big deal, get over it. May 29 16:29:52 crashanddie, whats your favorite OS? May 29 16:29:58 ZogG: But what about wals then? D: May 29 16:30:05 mc_teo: ubuntu ->http://xkcd.com/424/ May 29 16:30:05 lcuk: Maemo, obviously. May 29 16:30:11 +100000 May 29 16:30:13 :D May 29 16:30:18 haha May 29 16:30:33 Damn I envy you guys with your n900s May 29 16:30:48 random RT @lcuk May 29 16:30:48 May 29 16:30:48 @wonderhelm if you combine the 2 sports, the goalie can score points for doing somersaults whilst diving for the ball! May 29 16:30:50 crashanddie, let's talk about iphoneos May 29 16:31:01 maemo isn't an OS, maemo is a flavour of linux May 29 16:31:06 ZogG: let's not, unless you want to be removed from the channel. May 29 16:31:17 crashanddie, why would i? May 29 16:31:20 DocScrutinizer: Linux is a kernel May 29 16:31:36 nikki93, okay GNu/Linux May 29 16:31:37 because an op just asked you to remain on-topic, and iphone discussions tend to lead to flame wars May 29 16:31:38 so GNU linux if you prefer May 29 16:31:42 DocScrutinizer, a yummy chocolate and banana flavour with 100s and 1000s ontop May 29 16:31:50 DocScrutinizer: Better. :P May 29 16:32:15 crashanddie, if you would follow discussions here for last weeks you would stay alone on chan May 29 16:32:37 and there is no such thing as flame wars =) May 29 16:32:47 holywars maybe =) May 29 16:33:18 anyway it's all jokes, you should relax, i know how hard is life nowdays =( May 29 16:33:21 ZogG: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flaming_(Internet) May 29 16:33:31 So most Qt apps would work outofthebox? May 29 16:33:31 "Flamewar redirects here" May 29 16:33:33 In Maemo? May 29 16:33:35 crashanddie so? May 29 16:33:46 ZogG: don't correct my nerd terms. May 29 16:33:57 lol May 29 16:34:10 crashanddie there is flame and wars, you can combine these words - but doesn't sound right May 29 16:34:26 you can say maemo wars and make a wiki page =) May 29 16:34:32 * DocScrutinizer envisions crashanddie and timeless sitting in pub arguing about nerd terms May 29 16:34:50 ontological debate May 29 16:35:15 ZogG: just shut the hell up, I know I am. May 29 16:35:35 crashanddie love you too May 29 16:35:40 ~kiss crashanddie May 29 16:35:41 * infobot forces crashanddie to give sr71 a big kiss on the lips May 29 16:35:48 DocScrutinizer: actually, we just discuss the differences between English and the bastardised version he speaks. May 29 16:36:00 rotfl May 29 16:36:06 crashanddie, i'm the internetz =) May 29 16:36:09 DocScrutinizer: the yank actually demanded that I tag my blog as "en-GB" May 29 16:36:44 i heard people who have small penis can kick on chans =))) May 29 16:37:01 indeed, we even have special meetings each year May 29 16:37:06 * DocScrutinizer gasps May 29 16:37:08 ZogG: just let it go now, please. May 29 16:37:11 can i check in? May 29 16:37:18 ban him May 29 16:37:22 i dont like him May 29 16:37:28 cr-ASH May 29 16:37:31 mc_teo: stfu, you're the troll around here, he's just being daft because he's bored. May 29 16:37:39 crashanddie, man, as i said before i'm joking. you just take it too srs and it makes fun =) May 29 16:37:45 crashanddie: how am i troll May 29 16:37:46 mc_teo, haha May 29 16:37:51 * Arkenoi -> switching my primary desktop os May 29 16:37:56 ZogG: see reply to mc_teo May 29 16:37:59 secondary lang nd-IE May 29 16:38:18 i use windows 97% of the time May 29 16:38:24 i <3 IRC May 29 16:38:45 but i enjoy that 3% that i use ubuntu more than the rest May 29 16:38:52 crashanddie, i think i can sacrifice myself for the best of the maemo future and you can ban me ) |i'm stopping, just really was bored =( May 29 16:39:00 never really used windows, tried a bit and found out that it sucks May 29 16:39:18 mc_teo, srsly, if you like linux - go for it, what stopping you? May 29 16:39:24 ZogG: work? May 29 16:39:25 <3 crashanddie's foul moods May 29 16:39:25 i had 98 on libretto in pre-netbook era as it was too weak for any other os May 29 16:39:43 Windows sucks, but thats good because otherwise I wouldnt have a job May 29 16:40:01 crashanddie, dual boot as he has but primary is linux, vmbox or wine May 29 16:40:15 ... May 29 16:40:22 * Arkenoi is switching from hp-ux to solaris actually ;-) May 29 16:40:24 his primary os is wine? May 29 16:40:35 (and it is solaris/sparc) May 29 16:40:43 now gonna study at school C and don't know how can i do it with no windows at home =( May 29 16:40:48 ZogG: nha, actually, if you work in specific corp environments, you don't even have the password to the bios, can't install to boot sector, whatev' (plus, it's not your laptop so you're not allowed to) May 29 16:41:06 ZogG: err what? May 29 16:41:29 ZogG: I got my ass kicked for installing a newer version of Office on my laptop, imagine if I changed the OS... May 29 16:41:45 crashanddie i was talking about home desktop, as well if you work at IT where i want to work - i hope i get personal laptop or they all use linux May 29 16:41:56 what's the problem in staying away from redmond crap for studying C ? o.O May 29 16:42:00 @Mossy May 29 16:42:10 crashanddie where do you work - if it's not a secret? May 29 16:42:10 DocScrutinizer: visual C, obviously :) May 29 16:42:20 c# May 29 16:42:23 :) May 29 16:42:28 fis-minor May 29 16:42:32 I don't think redmond has a C99 compiler yet May 29 16:42:36 ZogG: I don't work there anymore, but it was for a security company, mainly on-site in what basically amounts to bunkers. May 29 16:42:38 DocScrutinizerbecaue teachers would prob have everything in windows May 29 16:42:44 ZogG: would you descibe yourself as a winfag? May 29 16:42:48 and homework would be for windows May 29 16:42:59 friggin ODD May 29 16:43:17 mc_teo lol =) when you have nothing to say - just stfu =) May 29 16:43:28 I'd beat them to using OS neutral formats May 29 16:43:36 crashanddie i can understand them anyway May 29 16:43:59 ZogG: for everything there's a usage. When you're at work, you don't need to mess with the OS, you just need to use the apps. Which is email (outlook), firefox, putty, filezilla, and putty. If you're good with documents and writing crap, you'll have to deal with Visio and Word too. May 29 16:44:22 liveUSB ftw? May 29 16:44:51 ZogG: honestly, it's too much of a bother to try and fight the system in that way. You can spend 2 years flaming everyone in the company, trying to convince the company that they could be running Linux, or you just get on with your job, and do what you're being asked. Guess which one will earn you a promotion. May 29 16:44:58 crashanddie, if you can manage to upgrade office a lot of people don't , so adminisstrators have to fix all these shit people are doing when they think they are hackers(not about you). at my work some peopl think they know computer and got all apps with viruses. i'm tierd of fighting with them May 29 16:45:05 Tootoot222: depending on company policy, the sysop may beat the shit out of you May 29 16:45:10 The loud obnoxious ass doesn't get a promotion, he gets put in the closet where noone can hear him. May 29 16:45:56 if the company forces linux devs to use windows on work machines then im in the wrong company :) May 29 16:46:03 or sent off to australia ;) May 29 16:46:06 jaska: obviously May 29 16:46:16 lcuk: shush May 29 16:46:19 crashanddie that's why i agree, but back to the question. if mc_teo enjoys linux and i assume he has comp at home, he can set linux there and use it not 3% but 24/7 May 29 16:46:23 :P May 29 16:46:32 i would of thought more people here would of used linux, considering maemo is May 29 16:46:44 lcuk canada =) May 29 16:46:54 ZogG: there is already crapware for Linux, and spyware too. It's only a matter of time before corporations start using $DISTRO, and the same assholes you have to deal with will be running botnets and spyware on their Linux installs. May 29 16:47:10 mc_teo: "would have" May 29 16:47:28 examples? May 29 16:47:32 mc_teo here maybe, but most people who buy n900 don't as most people don't understadn the difference, they use what they got and don't mind to ask what is it =) May 29 16:47:37 crashanddie: doesnt change the msg May 29 16:47:39 i bought an N900 because I heard it ran Linux May 29 16:47:45 jaska: well it's like if Nokia hands balckberrys to their employees May 29 16:48:03 I bought a N900 because I herd it liked mudkipz. May 29 16:48:11 crashanddie: that's exactly why you only install programs that are maintained by your distro, and open source May 29 16:48:16 so you know what is a botnet and what is not May 29 16:48:23 crashanddie it's not about secure, it's about policy, though i use flash and closed drivers, i prefer free software when you have choice. May 29 16:48:44 Tootoot222: and you think half the windows installs are infected because people downloaded shit religiously from windows.com? May 29 16:48:54 Tootoot222: people want titties, spyware gives them titties May 29 16:49:00 SpeedEvil, i bought it because pr1.2 chuck norris thread was awesome May 29 16:49:03 O_o May 29 16:49:04 crashanddie: if you only downloaded from windows.com you end up with nothing May 29 16:49:14 Tootoot222: people want happy bunnies, spyware gives them happy bunnies May 29 16:49:17 ZogG, +10 May 29 16:49:29 crashanddie: Are you trolling? May 29 16:49:35 i believe he is May 29 16:49:38 lcuk, Norris or choise? May 29 16:49:39 probably May 29 16:49:44 Then lets ignore him and get on with life. May 29 16:49:52 (blackberry) btw I know of a company that was in building phones and didi exactly that May 29 16:50:04 nikki93, haha. welcome to the IRC May 29 16:50:05 :-P May 29 16:50:06 ZogG, with chuck norris on your side, you have all the choices you want May 29 16:50:17 crashanddie: even if you downloaded an infected video that uses a buffer overflow of some sort, those bugs get fixed very fast (if they're even present at all) May 29 16:50:17 ZogG: I've been here a long time, thank you. ;) May 29 16:50:19 it just astonishes me that people think Linux will be the be-all end-all solution to spyware and botnets May 29 16:50:37 ZogG: Just learnt enough to not waste time with trolls. May 29 16:50:37 lcuk, yeah, you know if chuck has n900 and you have n900, chuck norris has better phone May 29 16:50:39 nahhh the honour virus shows that May 29 16:50:40 crashanddie: Linux is a kernel. May 29 16:50:52 spyware will not infect a linux system unless you run everything as root May 29 16:51:01 wth May 29 16:51:06 nikki93, you are stubborn May 29 16:51:15 you can run things in the user environment without being root May 29 16:51:18 that's enough for a botnet May 29 16:51:21 Xenon|XZ, but to install anything normally dont most distros sudo the process? May 29 16:51:22 ._. May 29 16:51:23 ZogG: I just tell the truth D: May 29 16:51:25 so many people May 29 16:51:29 nikki93, the thing is that lang is changing and igff everyone name GNU/Linux is Linux it's linux May 29 16:51:44 yes, but unless ur a troll u will be fine May 29 16:51:58 nikki93 and no crashanddie is not trolling, he is discussing with little sarcasm maybe sometimes |truth May 29 16:52:00 ZogG: Still, I don't see how a distro could be 'the final solution'. It's all a matter of people using it you know. May 29 16:52:06 Tootoot222: mate, have you looked at spyware or a botnet system lately? They don't require any hacks or exploits. They ask the user "Do you want to see boobies? If so, click on "Install"", and guess what, people click on "install" May 29 16:52:06 ZogG: mkay May 29 16:52:10 do .install files exist for other distros, or is it a maemoism? May 29 16:52:22 * satmd confirms crashanddie May 29 16:52:26 ie browse to random website and do a one click install of random file from untrusted repo May 29 16:52:29 sad but true May 29 16:52:32 nikki93, what do you mean by final solution? May 29 16:52:38 crashanddie: I've been using Linux for a while, haven't had such problems. May 29 16:52:40 lcuk, i think buntu May 29 16:52:48 ZogG: Solution to botnet and spyware in this context. May 29 16:52:49 * DocScrutinizer /kicks nikki93 to ##RMS May 29 16:53:05 nikki93, but you could use windows for same duration and not have problems May 29 16:53:07 DocScrutinizer: root mean square? D: May 29 16:53:12 lcuk: .deb auto installs (pretty much), .bin files usually run and get user access May 29 16:53:15 crashanddie, well, on my previous job out it department sabotaged providing and magaging linux machine for me with any possible effort, so it ended up with them giving me passwords to access corporate resources and setting the system up by myself May 29 16:53:20 lcuk: Yup. Never said otherwise really. May 29 16:53:31 Anybody else having gprs problems with enhanced power-user linux kernel? May 29 16:53:32 nikki93, oh, as i said i discuss linux not as global solution but the choise f my use. and if person is stupid he got viruses even at calculator =) May 29 16:53:34 nikki93: well, dunno if he's mean, but for sure he's square May 29 16:53:35 I'm curious regarding standby time people have on their N900, so I created a survey. It's just a single question, if you feel like participating, please go to May 29 16:53:40 though we had rhel desktop as officially supported workstation system May 29 16:53:41 * Dassu can't seem to get a connection across May 29 16:53:49 lcuk: if you sugarcoat it enough, I'm pretty sure you could get people to chmod +x filename and sudo ./filename it anyway May 29 16:53:54 nikki93, the operator of the computer usually has their own level of concern about their system and wont do things if they smell wrong May 29 16:54:01 lcuk, nope, until you don't check pr0n sites May 29 16:54:07 I have to study for a chemistry test. D: May 29 16:54:08 cya May 29 16:54:14 bye May 29 16:54:33 SwedeMike: it depends and most strongly depends on having packet on/off and how bad the reception o it is :) May 29 16:54:46 crashanddie, actually it's not install files do the thing but app manager knows to run them? May 29 16:54:52 Ikarus: well, that's the kind of feedback I would like as well, because I've done quite a lot of testing and for me it's inconclusive. May 29 16:54:57 ZogG: aye May 29 16:55:09 SwedeMike: I can confirm this pretty well May 29 16:55:11 as example if i write program that would open .ebuild and emerge automagicly =) May 29 16:55:16 SwedeMike, i rarely use my devices "lightly" May 29 16:55:33 SwedeMike: given I do alot of train travel with good maps on HSDPA reception along the routes May 29 16:55:35 Ikarus: for instance, in my testing it seems that just the fact of having my headset plugged in uses a heap of juice, don't know if it's the app that detectsthat and supposed to turn off the volume when I take it out that uses the juice. May 29 16:55:55 ZogG: except that there are some permission foo going on, allowing the app manager to use dpkg, without root status or something. You'd need to find a workaround that May 29 16:55:59 dyou think that ovi maps will get voice guided navigation someday? May 29 16:56:11 Ikarus: but yes, running 2G without packet up and running on a freshly rebooted unit makes the standby time much better. May 29 16:56:16 SwedeMike, headphone deamon on extra rep? May 29 16:56:20 ZogG: yes. May 29 16:56:31 SwedeMike: also running wifi or a solid 3G packet connection works alot better May 29 16:56:35 wifi beating 3G May 29 16:57:06 SwedeMike, why isnt there an option for "over 9000 hours"? May 29 16:57:07 SwedeMike: my juice is being drank May 29 16:57:17 crashanddie you can do it, or with dirty hack or with udev rules(or what thing can give you permission) as for example it gives user permission to reboot May 29 16:57:34 SwedeMike and it doesn't work? May 29 16:57:54 SwedeMike: since i installed pr1.2 my battery last half as long May 29 16:58:02 i can make n900 shutdown in a fraction of a second by calling xrandr something May 29 16:58:07 ZogG: it does work, but it seems I double the power consumption with my headset plugged in. May 29 16:58:10 wifi with xchat (on a dozen or so channels) and jabber on lasts around 10 hours, on packet with a stable connection between 6 and 8 hours and with a dodgy 3G connection which requires alot of reconnects I can blow through it in 3 hours May 29 16:58:40 mc_teo, thats odd, most things have better battery consumption due to numerous combinational tweaks May 29 16:58:40 SwedeMike hm, you mean even if you don't use them and they are in battery dies faster? May 29 16:58:56 what is the easiest way of saving screenshots, I can show you some interesting differences in batterygraph May 29 16:59:05 lcuk [pr1.2 is a pie, i mean a lie =) May 29 16:59:09 SwedeMike, CTRL+p i think May 29 16:59:11 ZogG: yes, just having the plugged in. May 29 16:59:17 SwedeMike ctrl+shift+p May 29 16:59:20 pr1.2 hasn't influenced battery life at all for me May 29 16:59:20 maybe shift too May 29 16:59:23 lol May 29 16:59:23 SwedeMike that's wierd May 29 16:59:23 2G is lots better than 3G if you can use it. May 29 16:59:34 SpeedEvil: not the case for me May 29 16:59:45 SpeedEvil: 2G and 3G where about equal May 29 16:59:49 SpeedEvil, i go for 1G May 29 16:59:49 with people doing xchat on n900 and noticing power draining faster May 29 16:59:51 hm, cltr-shift-p doesn't say anything, but it saves it somewhere silently? May 29 16:59:56 perhaps its because the channels are busier May 29 17:00:02 this week maemo and meego have been buzzing May 29 17:00:07 SwedeMike, yes May 29 17:00:15 actually sending packet on 3G take a lot of power. May 29 17:00:16 SwedeMike, images → screenshots May 29 17:00:36 lcuk: ive noticed that yes May 29 17:00:43 sure SwedeMike but if the channel is busier, its doing a lot of the same May 29 17:00:53 well mc_teo both had released this week May 29 17:00:57 releases May 29 17:01:02 lurking on #maemo drains your battery faster May 29 17:01:08 mc_teo: heh May 29 17:01:15 haha May 29 17:01:19 mc_teo: mine lasts 6 - 8 hours doing that May 29 17:01:25 or 10 if I am on wifi May 29 17:01:32 mc_teo, thats obvious, try lurking on ##c or #ubnutu or something too May 29 17:01:35 i am always on wifi May 29 17:01:38 your battery will drain even faster May 29 17:01:45 let's make test: 2 N900 with xchat one on meego and one on maemo chans, which one die faster May 29 17:01:55 maemo - we gossip more May 29 17:01:55 lol May 29 17:02:13 lcuk: questionable May 29 17:02:20 i think meego May 29 17:02:23 meego goes practically silent outside "office hours" May 29 17:02:30 lcuk: there's a 'saturation' level reached quite quickly May 29 17:02:34 as N900 jealous and hates meego May 29 17:02:37 apart from occasional May 29 17:02:44 * tumbleweed rolled through channel May 29 17:02:50 =) May 29 17:02:57 let's go to meego now May 29 17:03:03 and continue there May 29 17:03:06 DocScrutinizer, ? May 29 17:03:13 but if theres 10k lines being processed by xchat May 29 17:03:20 thats nothing to do with the wireless level May 29 17:03:31 3G stays 'online' for some (10s) seconds after each packet May 29 17:03:49 so additional packets come "for free" during that period May 29 17:04:14 apart from the work done to add the data to the channel object May 29 17:04:23 bah May 29 17:05:55 Ikarus: Yeah - I should have qualified that with 'in my case' May 29 17:06:27 DocScrutinizer: actually there are two modes, and full idle is 30 seconds without any packets. May 29 17:06:33 In my measurements, 2G - flat out - was about the same as 3G sending a packet every few seconds. May 29 17:06:45 * lcuk grabs popcorn May 29 17:06:58 DocScrutinizer: first you have HS, which timeouts quite quickly (around a second), then you get your 64kilobit/s channel, that timeouts after 30 seconds. May 29 17:07:28 SwedeMike: :-) May 29 17:07:30 ~curse MMS May 29 17:07:31 May you be reincarnated as a Windows XP administrator, MMS ! May 29 17:07:48 what was the rationale for bumping ld-linux.so.3 on Maemo5 ? May 29 17:07:52 SwedeMike: What is the transition between 3 and 3.5g? May 29 17:07:52 hm, I really can't find my screenshots... I mounted my N900 as mass storage device from my linux, can't find anything, also looking in xterm on the n900, ... any hints? May 29 17:07:56 says the author of fmms May 29 17:08:01 SwedeMike: Or is 3.5G - HS cnannel active? May 29 17:08:13 SpeedEvil: 3.5G is HS resource allocated, yes. May 29 17:08:21 DocScrutinizer: not my fault operators are stupid when implementing it :( May 29 17:08:29 SpeedEvil: it can take 1-2 seconds to get that up and running. May 29 17:08:46 SwedeMike: Hmm - I need to check 60s pings and 90s I guess too. May 29 17:09:00 http://wiki.maemo.org/N900_Hardware_Power_Consumption - as well as make that page better. May 29 17:09:05 does ovi chat account thingy use your ovi.com account? May 29 17:09:20 SwedeMike: Thanks. May 29 17:09:52 SwedeMike: check for hidden folders May 29 17:10:13 I work for a mobile phone operator, did some tests regarding that... you can try it yourself by checking the time it takes to get packets in/out after those intervals, it takes the longest after 30s of idle (it's settable by the mobile operator though, but I think 30s is default) May 29 17:10:37 SwedeMike: Hmm - yeah - that's an easy thing to test. May 29 17:10:43 ah, .images of course May 29 17:10:55 * SpeedEvil needs to setup a reverse SSH tunnel. May 29 17:11:16 SwedeMike: you know about 3G-2G handover? May 29 17:11:27 DocScrutinizer51: a little. May 29 17:11:37 SpeedEvil: what do mean reverse? May 29 17:11:37 hey all May 29 17:11:44 SwedeMike: Does the 3G network inform the 2G side of the available 2G towers? May 29 17:11:47 wouldnt it just be the same? May 29 17:12:00 just in the opposite direction May 29 17:12:14 mc_teo: No - you can't typically take inbound connections on mobile internet May 29 17:12:30 anyone know if there is a PSX emu for the N900 with decent performance? May 29 17:12:31 heh May 29 17:12:32 mc_teo: So you need a ssh session tunneled by the phone to a server which lets you push in that direction May 29 17:12:33 SpeedEvil: you need to swap ome 2 with e in there May 29 17:12:33 wtf is ovi? only time i even thought about ovi was when i tried the crappy maps May 29 17:12:40 well maybe not where your from May 29 17:12:42 PhonicUK: noooooo May 29 17:13:01 but im using mobile broadband all the time May 29 17:13:03 PhonicUK: you won't be playing any games full speed, unless they are really simple May 29 17:13:20 i have a usb mobile modem, plugged in to my router May 29 17:13:22 mc_teo: you can connect from outside to your phones IP? May 29 17:13:28 SpeedEvil: you need to swap one 2 with 3 in there May 29 17:13:48 DocScrutinizer: I don't think so. May 29 17:13:52 I know, its a shame because there is a PSX emu for the Pandora (same CPU, etc) which gets full speed emulation May 29 17:13:54 SpeedEvil: i use hspda or w/e as my fixed line broadband May 29 17:14:04 ~curse flash May 29 17:14:05 May the fleas of a thousand camels infest your most sensitive regions, flash ! May 29 17:14:07 PhonicUK: you can get to about 80-90% of real PSX speed if you disable compositing and pulseaudio May 29 17:14:09 DocScrutinizer: I was meaning - does the 2G modem need to search for them - or is itnformed if it has an active 3G connection May 29 17:14:20 i know :P May 29 17:14:22 PhonicUK: pandora uses neither of those (actually it uses raw framebuffer, even faster) May 29 17:14:22 mc_teo: But does it accept inbound connections. May 29 17:14:27 yes May 29 17:14:37 SwedeMike: Does the 3G network inform the 2G side of the available THREE- G towers? May 29 17:14:37 i used to run a webserver May 29 17:14:37 it doesn't use the framebuffer anymore actually :P May 29 17:14:38 SpeedEvil: yes, both 2G and 3G network advertises "neighbours" that should be considered for handover. May 29 17:14:39 mc_teo: Many don't. May 29 17:14:40 but even then it can't do full speed in all games May 29 17:14:45 they got decent speed under X May 29 17:14:50 ah May 29 17:14:55 psx4all does on pandora port May 29 17:15:01 mc_teo: Which is a good thing for moile battery case. May 29 17:15:03 SpeedEvil: and i use for ssh tunnelling when im in school May 29 17:15:08 oki, so some of my batterygraph screenshots are available at http://swm.pp.se/n900/ , this one is very agressive for instance: http://swm.pp.se/n900/Screenshot-20100529-190133.png May 29 17:15:11 I don't think psx4all for maemo has been kept up to date with the other versions though May 29 17:15:18 psx4all does on pandora port May 29 17:15:26 it has a GPU plugin May 29 17:15:31 SpeedEvil: but its not really a mobile May 29 17:15:32 SpeedEvil: even more interesting: Does the 2G network inform the 3G side of the available 2G towers? May 29 17:15:33 there's a huge thread about it on tmo May 29 17:15:38 psx4all for maemo is up to date with psx4all public source release May 29 17:15:53 no idea what the original developer is cooking up internally May 29 17:15:54 ali1234, the pandora plugin isn't open source - yet May 29 17:16:04 ah May 29 17:16:07 GPU plugin May 29 17:16:15 MohammadAG: you mean the "new" pandora plugin May 29 17:16:15 maybe we'll get something better eventually May 29 17:16:22 maybe we'll get Ari64 :) May 29 17:16:24 because there is one in the public source, but it uses FB May 29 17:16:27 i can not recieve dsl or adsl or anything through land line May 29 17:16:40 so i have a Three data modem May 29 17:16:53 SpeedEvil: SwedeMike: and are here clearly specified criteria when to "roam" 2G<->3G? May 29 17:17:07 anyway i dont think the cpu is fast enough personally, despite what pandora appears to do May 29 17:17:10 uses hspda, with edge, and gprs as fallbacks May 29 17:17:12 mc_teo: I know. May 29 17:17:30 mc_teo: I'm just saying that having an open connection onto the internet for most phones is bad. May 29 17:17:35 i get upto 7.4Mb/s May 29 17:17:43 SpeedEvil: SwedeMike: are carriers usually setting up their services to handover the DHCP lease? May 29 17:18:08 mc_teo: As it will keep the modem much of the time active recieving probes from botnets May 29 17:18:17 ali1234, if the pandora can do it, theres no reason for the N900 not to May 29 17:18:18 DocScrutinizer: I'm sure a mobile phone engineer would call it clear, I don't understand it well enough to do it :) May 29 17:18:28 exactly the same SoC May 29 17:18:40 DocScrutinizer: normally you move the IP, yes. Usually DHCP isn't used, it's PPP. May 29 17:18:41 if people used iphb we'd probably be having more 3g efficient applications May 29 17:18:48 PhonicUK: i don't believe the pandora can do it well enough to be worth it May 29 17:18:49 aaah yes May 29 17:19:00 DocScrutinizer: it's called a GTP carrier, and it's media independant. May 29 17:19:02 the pandora gets full speed :\ May 29 17:19:07 even at 500MHz instead of 600MHz May 29 17:19:09 also, i don't believe the SoC can do it and still be in a mode where you can receive incoming calls May 29 17:19:17 DocScrutinizer: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GPRS_Tunnelling_Protocol May 29 17:19:21 SwedeMike: thanks a lot :-) May 29 17:19:24 PhonicUK, http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=53087 (cc ali1234) May 29 17:19:27 it's not about the CPU May 29 17:19:32 ali1234: The CPU and the modem are completely independant May 29 17:19:35 the pandora uses the DSP/GPU May 29 17:19:43 ali1234: I have woken the n900 from suspend-RAM with calls May 29 17:19:51 SpeedEvil: oh really? so i can make a phone call while pulseaudio is not running? May 29 17:20:01 SpeedEvil: and answer a call while hildon-desktop is not running? May 29 17:20:01 ali1234: That's not quite what I said. May 29 17:20:04 i think not May 29 17:20:39 ali1234: Since when was hildon-desktop and pulseaudio part of the SoC? May 29 17:20:43 i don't believe that N900 can run a PSX emulator full speed while compositing and pulse are running May 29 17:20:59 so i choose between being able to receive calls, and playing a PSX emulator May 29 17:21:05 What you believe =! What will happen May 29 17:21:06 that's no choice at all May 29 17:21:11 or pause the psx emu while calling? .. May 29 17:21:11 :P May 29 17:21:18 lol May 29 17:21:48 Stskeeps: you mean: pause the psx-emulator, restart hildon, restart pulse... 30 seconds later, the person ringing you has hung up, and the "answer" button has only just finished repainting May 29 17:21:56 But.. why? May 29 17:22:09 hildon shouldn't interfere with an emulator May 29 17:22:14 or pulseaudio May 29 17:22:16 shouldn't May 29 17:22:19 but they do May 29 17:22:21 won't* May 29 17:22:28 how'd you check/prove that May 29 17:22:41 try running any emulator with them enabled. pulse will use 25% CPU, hildon will use 25% CPU May 29 17:22:54 and the DSP will be @ 0 load May 29 17:23:01 emulators by nature update the whole screen at a high rate, and send lots of small audio packets May 29 17:23:02 (well not 0, but you get the point) May 29 17:23:08 both worst case for compositing/sound server May 29 17:23:17 ali1234: 25% of which cpuclock freq? May 29 17:23:39 DocScrutinizeri assume max since it was 25% -> pulse, 25% -> hildon, 50% -> psx4all May 29 17:23:51 ali1234: not arguing in favour of PA - I hate it. But those figures are quite meaningless May 29 17:24:03 i rather like PA on desktop May 29 17:24:29 pulseaudio isn't tied to hildon-desktop May 29 17:24:40 i never said it was May 29 17:24:52 anyway, got to go - there's RL needs to obey. cya #maemo May 29 17:24:57 i said you need both pulse and hildon running if you want to be able to answer an incoming call before the person hangs up May 29 17:25:17 Fuck yeah May 29 17:25:23 fixed my gprs0 not working problemo May 29 17:25:55 now back to the serious business: Getting mobilehotspot to work while breaking gprs again May 29 17:27:06 ali1234: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=43605 - claims that since 1.1 - any fullscreen app bypasses the compositor May 29 17:27:24 Hi May 29 17:27:37 it's been possible to "bypass the compositor" by setting WM hints since forever, but it doesn't actually improve the speed in any way May 29 17:27:46 i said you need both pulse and hildon running if you want to be able to answer an incoming call before the person hangs up May 29 17:27:47 not quite May 29 17:27:50 just tested it May 29 17:27:54 the only way to get an actual speedup is to killall hildon-desktop May 29 17:27:57 hildon desktop is not needed to answer a call May 29 17:28:05 or reject it May 29 17:28:09 how do you press the answer button with no wm running? May 29 17:28:23 you look at the device and click answer May 29 17:28:37 buttons dont respond to input if no wm in running May 29 17:28:38 Android has this nice program that'll estimate every application power consumption, wish there was a similar one for the N900. May 29 17:28:41 they do May 29 17:28:47 they didn't on the old firmware May 29 17:28:51 they did May 29 17:28:55 don't spread BS facts May 29 17:30:43 some buttons work, many dialogs do not May 29 17:30:54 all call buttons work May 29 17:30:59 terminal history works for user and not just root now. I am so happy May 29 17:31:52 killing HD or PA would not necessary if PSX4ALL had the GPU plugin May 29 17:32:44 dont forget that without PA you cannot mix the sound from that incoming call even if you can answer it May 29 17:32:56 GPU plugin is not going to help you with that May 29 17:32:56 Well duh May 29 17:33:00 it is May 29 17:33:33 you either use PA, or the emulator locks the sound device and no other app can make sound until you quit May 29 17:34:07 I don't think I need the person calling me to hear my PSX games, when a call comes the phone apps gets priority May 29 17:34:08 hi, anyone else having issues with the orientation of the phone screen? seems its mostly in landscape May 29 17:34:15 ali1234: Also - I notice that media player playing fullscreen turns compositor off totally - no CPU usage May 29 17:34:35 ali1234: mplayer - fullscreen - CPU usage of hildon desktop is in the 3% range. May 29 17:34:40 anyway i'm not going to argue about this any more, if you think i am wrong, then prove it. make an emulator that runs full speed May 29 17:35:01 Wait for ZodTTD... May 29 17:35:13 even the snes emulator cannot manage 50fps last time i tried it May 29 17:35:16 I don't see why the pandora can do it May 29 17:35:21 (unless you kill hildon and pulse) May 29 17:35:26 the picodrive emu runs at 60fps locked May 29 17:35:29 with no frame drops May 29 17:35:37 the pandora can do it because 1. it does not use hildon, 2. it does not use pulse May 29 17:35:51 * pupnik_ laughs May 29 17:35:54 and 3. because zod wrote some better plugins for the hw May 29 17:35:54 ty ali1234 May 29 17:36:04 1. hildon is switched off in fullscreen mode 2. uh... May 29 17:36:08 Oops - my bad. May 29 17:36:12 3. which is what we're waiting for... May 29 17:36:50 see the thing is that 1. gives a 25% speed increase, 2. gives 25%, and 3. gives about 5% May 29 17:37:10 without 1 and 2, 3 won't make much difference, you'll still be stuck at about 70% full speed May 29 17:37:12 ali1234: Hildon desktop - with mplayer fullscreen - and xterm in the background not scrolling furiously - uses 0.2% of CPU May 29 17:37:12 how did you actually check with 3 May 29 17:37:21 but what do i know. prove me wrong, i would love to have a good emulator May 29 17:37:26 ali1234: So I'm pretty sure your point about hildon desktop is bogus. May 29 17:37:32 zaheerm, ping May 29 17:37:38 and about the plugin part May 29 17:37:46 It may not have been bogus in the past - but now. May 29 17:37:51 TomaszD, pong May 29 17:38:56 SpeedEvil: mplayer just is not a good test because it can buffer the audio/video streams May 29 17:39:15 SpeedEvil: a good test is an emulator of some ooooooold machine running fullscreen May 29 17:39:17 ali1234: I don't care. May 29 17:39:22 ali1234: I am looking at top May 29 17:39:25 an emulator that by rights really should run at fullspeed with ease May 29 17:39:38 ali1234: hildon-desktop is using ~0.2% CPU with mplayer fullscreen May 29 17:39:57 SpeedEvil: mplayer just is not a good test because it can buffer the audio/video streams May 29 17:40:01 and that proves what? May 29 17:40:04 it's not "good" because it loads the CPU May 29 17:40:09 it proves you wrong :) May 29 17:40:23 mplayer loads the CPU not the graphics hardware May 29 17:40:30 ali1234: you were earlier claiming that hildon-desktop was eating lots of CPU. May 29 17:40:40 yes May 29 17:40:42 ali1234: Due to compositing windows that were high-motion. May 29 17:40:52 because it is compositing, and the graphics hardware is not fast enough May 29 17:40:58 You don't get much more high-motion than the video I was using to benchmark with -benchmark May 29 17:41:02 the bottleneck is not CPU May 29 17:41:06 trooooooolllllll May 29 17:41:08 mplayer loads the CPU not the graphics hardware <-- so does PSX4ALL May 29 17:41:11 you do if that video is only 25fps May 29 17:41:17 what frame rate is your video? hmm? May 29 17:41:23 ali1234: 84. May 29 17:41:27 ali1234: -benchmark May 29 17:41:52 MohammadAG: no, psx4all loads the graphics hardware May 29 17:42:06 because it uses it in an extremely inefficient way May 29 17:42:22 ali1234, last I checked it only used the CPU May 29 17:42:34 which is why they need the GPU plugin May 29 17:42:35 oh? you didn't notice it drawing things on the screen? May 29 17:42:45 ... May 29 17:42:46 how do you think that stuff gets there? May 29 17:43:26 It doesn't use it to emulate the PSX games May 29 17:43:40 anyways, this discussion is boring since it was based on wrong facts to begin with May 29 17:43:53 you were proven wrong twice - which says quite a lot May 29 17:44:23 ali1234: May 29 17:44:42 i must have missed the point where you produced a psx emulator that runs at full speed on n900 - twice May 29 17:44:54 Hildon-desktop is using no CPU in the case of fullscreen high-motion video. Are you claiming it's using some other resource? May 29 17:44:57 (with mplayer) May 29 17:45:08 T R O L L May 29 17:45:23 Indeed May 29 17:45:40 how do i use ovi chat? May 29 17:46:00 Add an account in settings and use the Contacts app May 29 17:46:36 you have to have collected at least 2 magical unicorns first May 29 17:46:36 ah May 29 17:49:55 SpeedEvil: what mplayer version are you using? May 29 17:50:34 because when i use mplayer -benchmark Nokia_N900.avi i see mplayer 50% CPU, Xorg 32% CPU, and pulseaudio 20% CPU May 29 17:51:24 ali1234: and where is hildon-desktop in that list? May 29 17:51:42 SpeedEvil: xorg cpu usage drops down to ~2% if you stop hildondesktop May 29 17:51:49 the overhead of compositing shows under xorg cpu usage May 29 17:54:16 ali1234, which version of mplayer are YOU using May 29 17:54:26 i'm using the one from extras (command line) May 29 17:54:29 ali1234: mplayer -fs/ May 29 17:54:33 ? May 29 17:54:50 45, 31, 9 May 29 17:56:35 864 720 root S < 13060 5.3 17.2 /usr/bin/Xorg -logfile /tmp/Xorg.0.log <-- hildon-desktop off May 29 17:56:44 so again, wrong May 29 17:56:59 -benchmark does not affect the framerate, i stil have idle time in both cases May 29 17:57:09 so, neither the CPU nor the graphics are loaded by this test May 29 17:57:10 wonder why your PA is twice as high as mine running that mplayer -benchmark May 29 17:57:44 864 720 root S < 16472 6.6 17.1 /usr/bin/Xorg -logfile /tmp/Xorg.0.log <-- hildon-desktop running May 29 17:57:57 Ok - hildon-desktop dead. May 29 17:57:58 assuming I'm not an idiot, 17.1 < 17.2 May 29 17:58:06 X is still using the same amount of CPU in either case. May 29 17:58:22 ah -nosound too May 29 17:58:25 third time proven wrong May 29 17:58:28 holy crap, the next iphone is going to have a 960x640 screen May 29 17:58:34 what does nosound have to do with X! May 29 17:58:39 nohup mplayer -nosound -benchmark -fs May 29 17:58:52 MohammadAG: it means that it goes as fast as it can decode frames May 29 17:59:17 killing its control process did it, bash is already working again :) it may have hung because I did a restore and forcaweather config files already exit (well that what I am telling myself) May 29 17:59:42 actually May 29 17:59:52 umm May 29 18:00:00 same load with hildon-desktop dead May 29 18:00:18 /etc/rc0.d/K20hildon-desktop stop May 29 18:00:23 to stop it safely May 29 18:00:27 I just used dsmetool May 29 18:00:29 without the dog barking May 29 18:00:30 or that May 29 18:00:37 My dog's dead May 29 18:00:41 I killed it last week May 29 18:01:45 results: http://pastebin.com/5EsnxGxa May 29 18:02:27 ali1234, how did you stop hd? May 29 18:02:32 That's not exactly a very huge result. May 29 18:02:38 /etc/init.d/hildon-desktop stop May 29 18:02:47 SpeedEvil: yes it is smaller than on previous firmwares May 29 18:02:53 ali1234, and you restarted mplayer after that? May 29 18:02:57 SpeedEvil: and when running windowed the difference is much bigger May 29 18:03:01 MohammadAG: yes May 29 18:03:16 ali1234, well, those figures look BS, mplayer has the same PID for both jobs May 29 18:03:29 PPIDs* May 29 18:03:36 no it doesn't May 29 18:03:43 1805 vs 1819 May 29 18:03:49 PPIDs... May 29 18:04:01 um so what? May 29 18:04:11 i ran it from the same shell each time May 29 18:04:37 Also - how are you getting those numbers May 29 18:04:41 they bounce around considerably May 29 18:04:41 from top May 29 18:04:51 you have to average - you can't do it like that May 29 18:04:53 this is true May 29 18:05:00 ok, so what should i do? just time it maybe? May 29 18:05:03 I take the mean of ten values May 29 18:06:05 this is with and without benchmark output from mplayer: http://pastebin.com/Pfrfdtth May 29 18:06:12 first is with, second is without May 29 18:06:15 ty May 29 18:06:22 i don't know what it means but it looks like it was almost exactly the same May 29 18:06:30 about 21 with hildon-desktop running May 29 18:07:43 this should give a speed boost then May 29 18:08:03 but bare in mind that you're still give ~20% CPU to Xorg even with hildon disabled May 29 18:08:17 15.87s without hildon-desktop to 18.0 without isn't exactly a huge boost May 29 18:08:34 It's not useless, no. May 29 18:08:42 where'd you get those nmbers from? May 29 18:09:14 OK, so whatever they didto fullscreen rendering, it is certainly an improvement over the previous firmware May 29 18:09:15 time mplayer -quiet -nosound -benchmark Babylon\ 5\ -\ 1x06\ Mind\ War May 29 18:09:23 it is ali1234 May 29 18:10:05 I would flash to PR1.1.1 to show that it's actually similar, but it's not worth the argument since I know it's true May 29 18:10:28 haven't checked PR1.1, but this states it's been there since then ali1234: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=43605 - claims that since 1.1 - any fullscreen app bypasses the compositor May 29 18:10:31 Actually - I ran it when hildon was booting May 29 18:10:58 When it's warm - it's 16.1s with hildon, 15.8 without May 29 18:11:44 now let's do a real test May 29 18:12:58 an emu? May 29 18:13:58 Ok - I repeated the test, with an emu (and Rod Hull) - and the results are the same. May 29 18:15:27 frals, how are you handling contributing translations to fmms? May 29 18:15:31 transifex? May 29 18:15:46 I can't find your project May 29 18:17:34 got to enable extras-* May 29 18:17:37 hmm -vo fbdev is a bit faster than going through X. May 29 18:17:42 It does have issues though. May 29 18:17:44 * SpeedEvil reboots. May 29 18:17:45 not at all yet, still not figured out how to dit 'right' yet May 29 18:17:53 yeah like the X display flickering through at 50hz May 29 18:18:14 what is the screen refresh rate really? May 29 18:18:15 is it possible to access to yahoo rooms in coneresation or anywhere ? May 29 18:18:25 TomaszD: the strings used so far all are shipped with the device, but ill try to get some system up for the remaining strings (ie error messages) May 29 18:18:44 all shipped? nice May 29 18:19:22 frals, but packaging translation is also needed (debian/control) May 29 18:19:36 yeah May 29 18:19:52 ill have a look at how others do it unless you have any idea May 29 18:19:59 either way i have to run now, bbl o/ May 29 18:20:12 * MohammadAG wishes for a trout message in MMS May 29 18:20:15 * b-man updates his on-device sdk and gets swamped in packages - didn't upgrade in 3 months lol May 29 18:20:33 b-man, bootstrap didn't work :) May 29 18:20:40 double tapping telephone button on BT headset doesnt redial the sip number. anybody aware of the bug report for this? May 29 18:20:52 b-man, I also find ssh + scratchbox + scp to transfer builds quite faster :) May 29 18:21:06 it only dials the last mobile number. May 29 18:21:14 MohammadAG: i'm guessing you tried building lucid? lol May 29 18:21:21 how to select text from pdf? swipe is enable for pdf reader too? May 29 18:21:26 * frals chucks a whale at MohammadAG May 29 18:21:29 lucid fails to bootstrap May 29 18:21:29 b-man, yeah lol May 29 18:21:38 i will file a bug if no bug report exists. May 29 18:21:40 try karmic ;) May 29 18:21:44 * MohammadAG throws a white whale at frals May 29 18:21:52 b-man, does it matter? May 29 18:22:02 yes May 29 18:22:05 anybody using BT headset? May 29 18:22:19 very much so xD May 29 18:22:52 hey b-man :D May 29 18:22:56 http://www.brighthand.com/assets/13229.jpg May 29 18:22:58 hahaha May 29 18:23:06 that keyboard looks almost like the N900's May 29 18:23:11 MohammadAG: they did some funky things to their arm distro that causes it to fail on the N900 May 29 18:23:22 with lucid May 29 18:23:25 b-man, actually it doesn't chroot lol May 29 18:23:37 i know lol May 29 18:23:38 b-man, lucid doesn't run on N900? May 29 18:23:49 copying playstation iso... May 29 18:24:06 still no pipe-character :P May 29 18:24:41 LiraNuna: it really should - it's built for OMAP3 - but they did something to vfp May 29 18:24:50 shift+ is pretty good for pipe May 29 18:24:57 usually it's available and doesn't conflict May 29 18:25:09 which causes some stuff to crash randomly May 29 18:25:36 (hence the chroot issue) May 29 18:25:43 LiraNuna, yeah, that was my thought when I saw it. May 29 18:25:52 I'd rather have the | etc than $EUR May 29 18:26:04 ^ May 29 18:26:06 it works fine on BeagleBoard and Pandora May 29 18:26:08 are you kidding? how would I type variables in sh without a $? May 29 18:26:28 HTML5 claims I moved http://i50.tinypic.com/hvvyna.jpg May 29 18:27:18 i think it's because they use OMAP3530, not OMAP3430 - which has some differences with vfp May 29 18:28:26 johnx: I don't really do shell scripting on my N900, so I'm fine without it... but EUR could go away anyway. May 29 18:28:42 crap it is a WONTFiX, https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=8299 May 29 18:28:43 agreed May 29 18:28:43 Bug 8299: Can't control the VoIP call (skype, sip) from bluetooth accessory (heatdest, etc.) May 29 18:28:44 johnx: still planning on getting a pandora? :) May 29 18:28:55 I'm happy to type EUR or UKP or whatever May 29 18:29:00 b-man, mine shipped :> May 29 18:29:06 :D May 29 18:29:11 sweet!!! May 29 18:29:18 b-man: N900 is more than OMAP3 May 29 18:29:20 SwedeMike: ack. but what about just remapping keys? May 29 18:29:34 luke-jr: yeah May 29 18:29:59 mine shipped before pandorapress.net had the news item they were starting to ship :D might have something to do with ordering as soon as I heard the word on IRC and not waiting for the emailed announcement :> May 29 18:30:12 b-man, W: Failure trying to run: chroot /media/mmc1/ubuntu-chroot/. mount -t proc proc /proc May 29 18:30:20 is it possible to open microb pages in the background? May 29 18:30:35 MohammadAG: karmic? May 29 18:31:08 DocScrutinizer: sure, it's not a huge problem, I'm just questioning why a nerd phone like this would have EUR on the physical keyboard, but not | May 29 18:31:11 * b-man is a bit jelous of johnx May 29 18:31:44 b-man, no, lucid, but I missed your earlier message xD May 29 18:31:50 LOL k May 29 18:32:16 I'll probably get a 2nd batch pandora ;) May 29 18:32:18 b-man, heh. only had to wait a couple years :) I forgot, did you order in the first batch? May 29 18:32:22 ah May 29 18:32:41 johnx: i was, but then the N900 came xD May 29 18:32:57 yep, psx4all now runs faster in fullscreen too May 29 18:33:05 it's still nowhere near full speed though May 29 18:33:20 aaah. the N900 is awesome, but I'm really looking forward to absolutely hacking up my pandora without worrying about missing calls May 29 18:33:37 not possible? May 29 18:33:51 trumee, I don't know of a way May 29 18:33:59 but that doesn't really mean much :) May 29 18:34:11 johnx: so, meego or mer on the pandora? ;p May 29 18:34:25 debian and windowmaker May 29 18:34:32 (at least half serious there) May 29 18:34:38 hehe May 29 18:34:48 johnx: the best part about the pandora is about it being 100% open - no legal issues with firmware/drivers :) May 29 18:35:13 pulse cpu usage is down too May 29 18:35:17 and that it should have a more "normal" init sequence May 29 18:35:20 only hovering around 10% May 29 18:35:32 b-man: except that's bullshit when it comes to 3d drivers.. May 29 18:35:32 and that it's not my phone :) May 29 18:35:38 johnx: and that it uses u-boot xDD May 29 18:35:52 Stskeeps: very true May 29 18:35:54 i'm getting 80/10/10 for psx/xorg/pulse May 29 18:36:00 that's a huge improvement May 29 18:36:36 Stskeeps: but i don't thing you can get arount that 100% unless imagination technologys thinks otherwise May 29 18:36:54 heh. even my desktop uses closed source video drives (nvidia) May 29 18:38:22 *think May 29 18:38:43 lol, damn kb xDD May 29 18:38:57 video drives? WTH is that? some kind of holographic storage? May 29 18:40:15 heh. even my desktop uses closed source video drives (nvidia) May 29 18:40:24 my desktop doesn't use drivers xD May 29 18:40:29 (uninstalled nouveau) May 29 18:40:55 * johnx tries to think about how that would work May 29 18:41:21 lol May 29 18:41:34 sooo, you sit there and flip little switches to deliver perfectly timed electrical pulses to the video chip? May 29 18:41:45 I think even in that case it would (de facto) make *you* the driver May 29 18:41:52 at the speed of light? :) May 29 18:42:04 haha May 29 18:42:07 my desktop doesn't use drivers xD May 29 18:42:09 YAY FRAMEBUFFER May 29 18:42:14 ^ hardcore May 29 18:42:15 xDDDDD May 29 18:42:15 ali1234: looking better here too May 29 18:42:28 YAY FRAMEBUFFER <-- indeed May 29 18:42:42 the main reason is because the card is f'd May 29 18:42:50 ah May 29 18:42:58 it said something like GPU lockup, switching to FBcon May 29 18:42:59 fill in the blanks: to display pictures on the framebuffer x.org uses the fbdev ______ :) May 29 18:43:21 how do i see the current CPU clock frwquency? May 29 18:43:27 well, even framebuffer console needs a driver (fbcon) May 29 18:43:39 VESA - Because letting the CPU work extra is a good thing May 29 18:43:40 that isn't for the GPU is it May 29 18:44:03 im sure this should be running faster than it is when using 80% CPU May 29 18:44:55 /proc/cpuinfo indicates it sorrta May 29 18:45:16 249 bogomips at 250mhz afaik May 29 18:45:25 598.90 May 29 18:45:30 i guess thats full speed May 29 18:46:08 well.. ctrl C doesn't work for CHKDSK May 29 18:46:38 hmm i see a problem.. the settings gui of psx4all doesn't actually affect anything May 29 18:50:47 since 1.2 is lost the search ability in the package manager May 29 18:50:52 I lost* May 29 18:51:21 select a catalogue May 29 18:51:24 start typing May 29 18:52:09 Hello May 29 18:52:46 ty May 29 18:53:27 b-man, W: Failure trying to run: chroot /home/mohammad/chroot/. mount -t proc proc /proc May 29 18:53:27 lol May 29 18:56:04 shunt it be mount -t proc none /proc ? May 29 18:56:46 nah May 29 18:56:50 'none' is lame May 29 18:56:55 ok, so i confirm that hildon no longer eats CPU when doing fast graphics. it seems faster even in windowed mode/compositing enabled May 29 18:57:05 cd /;mount proc{,,} May 29 18:57:07 ftw May 29 18:57:09 none is lame? - fair enough :( May 29 18:57:21 err May 29 18:57:30 mount -t {,,/}proc May 29 18:57:33 :D May 29 18:57:52 so then, who is voting for what country tonight, in the euro-vision ? who do you represent ? May 29 18:57:59 UK May 29 18:58:18 me UK as well May 29 18:58:26 anobody here using mobilehotspot? May 29 18:58:47 it's still not enough to get psx emulator even close to playable though May 29 18:58:49 odin_: wtf? May 29 19:00:37 look like the UK is gonna win then ! May 29 19:01:00 if they win i will eat my own sh*t May 29 19:01:09 :) May 29 19:01:45 Denmark should win :) May 29 19:03:16 don't tell me you're watching eurovision May 29 19:03:22 I want to watch the bloody roland garros May 29 19:03:49 * ShadowJK us watching the ota upgrade's progress bar on n900... May 29 19:04:29 scratch that, I'm watching that May 29 19:04:53 * crashanddie love VLC May 29 19:05:44 Nokia-N900:~# uptime May 29 19:05:44 22:04:49 up 12:05, load average: 10.36, 7.62, 5.22 May 29 19:06:29 MohammadAG: whoa! May 29 19:06:44 MohammadAG: what have you been doing? May 29 19:06:59 debootstrap's unpacking packages lol May 29 19:07:06 ah, silly people May 29 19:07:13 didn't you learn to do it cross yet? :P May 29 19:07:20 crashanddie, sucker. May 29 19:07:29 Stskeeps, scratchbox is borked by design to be able to chroot :) May 29 19:07:34 GAN900: why? May 29 19:07:56 22:07:13 up 41 days, 22:31, load average: 1.86, 0.70, 0.30 May 29 19:07:56 crashanddie, because May 29 19:08:00 my N810 May 29 19:08:04 GAN900: that's not enough of a reason May 29 19:08:06 crashanddie, my buddy bought a Panasonic GH1 May 29 19:08:09 Insanity May 29 19:08:17 The HD video looks like film. May 29 19:08:23 Stskeeps, May 29 19:08:24 [sbox-FREMANTLE_ARMEL: ~/chroot] > chroot ./ May 29 19:08:24 [sbox-FREMANTLE_ARMEL: ~/chroot] > fakeroot chroot ./ May 29 19:08:24 [sbox-FREMANTLE_ARMEL: ~/chroot] > sudo chroot ./ May 29 19:08:26 sudo: must be setuid root May 29 19:08:28 uhh May 29 19:08:42 /scratchbox/tools/bin/chroot.bin: cannot change root directory to ./: Operation not permitted <-- for the first two May 29 19:08:55 MohammadAG: no, not that May 29 19:08:56 :P May 29 19:09:11 Stskeeps, then what? :) May 29 19:09:48 MohammadAG: ask me between 7.30 and 13.30 polish time monday-friday :P May 29 19:09:51 ;) May 29 19:09:58 * Stskeeps goes back to hacking on his joggler May 29 19:09:58 meh, 960 x 640 3.5" is an absolute overkill May 29 19:10:00 Stskeeps, screw you :) May 29 19:10:17 GAN900: yeah, GH1 and LX3 are seriously good cameras May 29 19:10:34 MohammadAG: run it in a qemu instance May 29 19:10:45 GAN900: I have a TC-80N3 remote control now for the 40D May 29 19:10:46 Stskeeps, bah, I hate that crap :P May 29 19:11:22 why do I need both maemo.org account AND forum account? May 29 19:11:38 cos someone has taken ass long time to get SSO working May 29 19:12:01 you don't *need* a forum account May 29 19:13:56 ali1234, yes I do, it asked me to register and told me my garage username/pass is invalid May 29 19:14:09 MohammadAG: that, or look into how rootstock works May 29 19:14:17 LiraNuna: no, he meant you don't need to be on the forum May 29 19:14:27 why? May 29 19:14:37 I just wanted to thank someone May 29 19:14:48 see, you "want", not "need" May 29 19:15:12 oh, so we're getting *that* picky are we May 29 19:15:20 i think they should allow anonymous thanks May 29 19:15:42 ali1234: queue every post with 2000000000+ thanks in 5... 4... 3... 2... 1 May 29 19:15:47 i think anonymous posting should be acceptable too May 29 19:15:49 so? May 29 19:16:24 crashanddie, worried about inflation in the thanks-oconomy May 29 19:16:26 ? May 29 19:16:26 but the moderation and thread viewing tools arent upto sniff May 29 19:16:42 i wouldn;t go as far as anon posting May 29 19:16:43 snuff even May 29 19:16:55 lcuk, actually they can be done, but the mods would have to start approving a lot of threads May 29 19:16:56 but the whole point of thanks button is so people don't have to reply with a one word post May 29 19:17:00 LMAO, someone just got on stage at Eurovision, and security took him down May 29 19:17:14 MohammadAG, sure, hence my comment May 29 19:17:30 crashanddie: considering how bad most of the participants that should happen more often, being taken out by security :) May 29 19:17:36 lcuk, just restating what was said ~ Captain Obvious May 29 19:18:35 jaska: haha May 29 19:18:53 What's omap-previewer? May 29 19:18:55 uh... May 29 19:19:10 did OTA upgrade throw themes on emmc May 29 19:19:19 yes May 29 19:19:27 because the sim prompt is themeless and fontless.. May 29 19:19:32 a May 29 19:19:39 sim? May 29 19:19:53 pin code May 29 19:20:00 some themes are broken May 29 19:20:03 like Carbon May 29 19:20:14 there's a lot of junk on some parts of it May 29 19:20:19 I had digital nature May 29 19:20:58 ok, anyone got eurosport or something May 29 19:21:08 i have May 29 19:21:26 the local channel just stopped showing the match between henin and some russian chick, Sharapova May 29 19:21:39 lol May 29 19:21:46 everything is broken :( May 29 19:21:57 last I saw, it was 6-2 3-6 May 29 19:22:01 ShadowJK, did you just reflash? May 29 19:22:24 no May 29 19:22:26 ssu May 29 19:22:30 just? May 29 19:22:38 yes May 29 19:22:58 now it crashed and died May 29 19:23:01 and reset May 29 19:23:18 hmm... the ibm website says "play suspended" May 29 19:23:28 the pin dialog is up whilst you locked during update? May 29 19:23:32 or the update had completed May 29 19:23:38 and had rebooted afterwards May 29 19:23:49 it completed afaik May 29 19:24:05 rebooted, progress bar at reboot, then normal boot May 29 19:24:33 * SpeedEvil likes tennis. May 29 19:24:40 I don't really pay attention to the scores though. May 29 19:25:17 man, that's how bad the coverage is May 29 19:25:24 * ShadowJK sighs. May 29 19:25:24 I had to check twitter to find out what happened May 29 19:25:26 "Sharapova v Henin tied at 1-set all (1st set Henin 6-2, 2nd set Sharapova 6-3) when play halted due to bad light. #frenchopen" May 29 19:26:12 ShadowJK, what happens when it gets to desktop May 29 19:26:16 is the theme totally dead May 29 19:26:22 or cant you even get to desktop May 29 19:26:26 yes May 29 19:26:43 there's a purple rectangle instead of task switcher May 29 19:26:47 no icons May 29 19:26:52 no fonts May 29 19:26:57 default gtk theme May 29 19:27:02 IIRC a couple of people hitting that May 29 19:27:10 one last night May 29 19:27:26 bah May 29 19:27:30 it's popping up dialogs and wanting me to answer stuff but I dont know the question May 29 19:27:38 and don't know what the buttons are May 29 19:28:09 if I touch stuff it crashes.. May 29 19:29:40 ShadowJK, looks like you will have to reflash :( May 29 19:34:17 hello anyone know whats the deal with MSN on N900? the port is defaulted to 0 after setting to 1863 the login still doesnt happen but the signing in dialog closes immediately. May 29 19:36:36 ensi: I don't believe MSN is supported out-of-the-box, so you may want to contact the maintainer for that application you're talking about. May 29 19:37:20 crashanddie: i have the telepathy plugin installed May 29 19:39:09 jaska: serbia deserved to get their asses kicked in the war considering what they've sent to eurovision May 29 19:39:23 ow May 29 19:39:23 :P May 29 19:39:29 hi May 29 19:39:41 im on my n900 May 29 19:39:48 using xchat May 29 19:39:54 well, im skipping eurovision till the year 22000 or so, doubt .fi will win for a few millennia after lordi :) May 29 19:40:22 n900 is so buggy :/ May 29 19:40:31 it is ? May 29 19:40:37 yes May 29 19:40:43 what kind of bugs May 29 19:41:02 lol May 29 19:41:14 Depends heavily on you usecas May 29 19:41:15 e May 29 19:41:20 wlan dropping stuff jams up May 29 19:41:34 bad usability in a lot of cases May 29 19:41:46 i dont face wlan problems May 29 19:41:59 i have some odd PSM problems atm May 29 19:41:59 good for you May 29 19:42:23 my n900 drops wlan every so often May 29 19:42:46 if you mess with system files a lot May 29 19:42:53 ensi, weird router? May 29 19:42:59 ensi, its not good you feel that, if these are long term problems for you, have you checked the bug lists (and if capable potentially reproduce/diagnose/even repair) them because we are mostly a community distribution with many components on your machine coming direct from oss May 29 19:43:01 GAN900: no May 29 19:43:23 lcuk, minus networking. :) May 29 19:43:53 lcuk: nokia outsourced the testing to users? May 29 19:43:53 hi all May 29 19:44:20 hi May 29 19:44:36 ensi, can any entity test every combination of the entire system? May 29 19:45:22 bugs happen, but without people doing something about them (minus moaning) the developers dont know theres a problem May 29 19:45:22 lcuk: do i care? for something i pay 500€ i expect it to work May 29 19:45:57 ensi: please be helpful, this is a community channel,and we're not here to take any heat on Nokia's part May 29 19:46:08 so have you been onto nokia care about your issue? May 29 19:46:11 ensi, I think it's more a matter of how early features are released; Nokia wanted to make a developer friendly device, and it does/did have a lot of features before other similar devices. The cost is sometimes stability May 29 19:46:30 anyways May 29 19:46:41 my n900 drops wlan about twice a year at this rate :D May 29 19:46:43 ensi, did you come here to complain or to get help troubleshooting? May 29 19:46:54 (honest question) May 29 19:46:58 is it possible to manage your SIM May 29 19:47:04 * crashanddie waves at johnx May 29 19:47:13 mine hasnt dropped wlan yet, and seems to work with the old wrt-54gl + tomato ok May 29 19:47:20 so it stays psm most of the time May 29 19:47:32 I tried doing ping yahoo.com and playing a stream using 3g but it still stops playing after a few minutes of idel May 29 19:47:33 allo crashanddie :) May 29 19:47:48 yeah true its not the maemo communitys fault per se that the end product is rubbish May 29 19:48:14 ( i think anonymous posting should be acceptable too) And I think deleting post/threads should be enabled for all registered users May 29 19:48:38 ensi, by and large we're in the same boat as you. there have been cases of even normal routers interacting poorly with the N900s wifi power savings mode May 29 19:48:45 and there are workarounds/ways to test May 29 19:49:08 and if you can reproduce the test case with a certain router, it's possible Nokia can code around it for the next release May 29 19:49:10 is it possible to manage your SIM like we can on the N97 , there is no option on n900 to manage the SIM May 29 19:49:14 However - that's simply due to the fact that some routers are broken with powersave. May 29 19:49:15 DocScrutinizer, ill defend your anonymous right to say what you like. i will gladly give you a threshhold however because you should not be forced to read them May 29 19:49:17 lcuk: at very least get a 'blame' button in addition to the 'thanks' May 29 19:49:20 DaReaper: NO May 29 19:49:31 My laptop is broken the same way with one of my routers May 29 19:49:32 DaReaper: explain the features you want, we don't know the N97 May 29 19:49:54 look @ slashdot, everyone can comment but the default reading of articles only shows the upvoted items May 29 19:50:16 a user has to change settings to see/read all comments May 29 19:50:47 btw is the maemo communit going to transition to a lego community now? May 29 19:50:58 one of the very reasons i don't post on talk.maemo.org anymore is because of the overflow of complaint posts/threads and little effort in improving the whole issue - too many people are relying on noka than doing it their sefl, lol May 29 19:51:01 crashanddie : like the ability to get information from you network provider like news , weather etc May 29 19:51:06 ensi, :D May 29 19:51:29 DaReaper: as far as I'm aware, no May 29 19:51:41 *self May 29 19:51:58 will this be available in future releases May 29 19:52:07 DaReaper, does the net provider send this information? May 29 19:52:15 first ive heard about it May 29 19:52:22 could be wap stuff May 29 19:52:25 yes it does as an sms May 29 19:52:26 lcuk: yeah, it's quite popular May 29 19:52:35 well thats data not just stored on the sim? May 29 19:52:40 lcuk, no, but Nokia, unfortunately, doesn't manage to provide enough to test a reasonable minimum. May 29 19:52:50 ahh right, if its an sms does it come in list? May 29 19:53:02 it's software on the SIM probably May 29 19:53:06 GAN900, ? May 29 19:53:07 lcuk, PR1.2, like nearly every Maemo update before it, is regression city. May 29 19:53:09 and N900 doesn't run that May 29 19:53:44 and also all gprs and access point information is sent by them that way May 29 19:53:46 well GAN900 give list of regressions, i only know of 1 to date (please give MB#) May 29 19:54:19 ShadowJK, ? the sim has a cpu May 29 19:54:31 lol May 29 19:54:31 My N900 is able to receive configuration data from my operator... but the correct option is to reject it anyway, as my operator's system sends incorrect configs trying to sabotage me :) May 29 19:55:07 lcuk, there's software stored on it atleast, and I the phone is supposed to execute it inside a virtual machine or something May 29 19:55:07 well i need to receive info from my oper5or May 29 19:55:23 lcuk, two of my latest are. May 29 19:55:37 lcuk, I have others that I haven't gotten around to filing yet. May 29 19:55:38 no good without numbers gan you know that May 29 19:56:38 "This bug is uselss without #s" is the new "This thread is useless without pics" :) (see also: "bug #s or it's not reproducible") May 29 19:56:47 :D May 29 19:56:48 how will i receive the access point configurations now from my network provider ? May 29 19:56:48 i wish i could run another terminal... May 29 19:56:59 do I have to flash both rootfs and emmc.. May 29 19:57:09 DaReaper: how do you request the information if it comes through an SMS? May 29 19:57:13 ensi, menu -> new terminal May 29 19:57:15 ensi, ?on the terminal menu open a new one May 29 19:57:17 lcuk, have been filed. May 29 19:57:28 lcuk, and sp3000 has already looked at it. May 29 19:57:37 lcuk, please don't accuse me of laziness. May 29 19:57:45 johnx: omg heh thanks! May 29 19:57:50 * Stskeeps headdesks May 29 19:57:55 LOL May 29 19:58:25 ensi: also shift + arrow + x May 29 19:58:37 im not GAN900 May 29 19:58:56 well there is an option when i was using my n73 to get info from my network provider , they send us sms.s as a setting to save and restart the phone and then the access points get saved May 29 19:59:17 GAN900, do you know of any typing speed tests you could run on n900 - i am interested to see how fast you actually burn through messages May 29 19:59:34 you have girl thumbs :P May 29 19:59:47 lcuk, 60 wpm or so on the Flash one I tried a few weeks ago. May 29 19:59:57 ensi, for the wifi dropping, go into settings -> internet connections -> connections -> -> Edit -> Next -> Next -> Next -> Advanced -> Other -> Power saving: On (intermediate) || Off -> Save -> Finish May 29 19:59:57 heh cool May 29 20:00:02 lcuk, pianist's fingers. :) May 29 20:00:06 I'd try Off first IIWU May 29 20:00:16 GAN900: http://www.calculatorcat.com/typing_test/ May 29 20:00:17 GAN900, thats a reasonable analogy :) May 29 20:00:34 lcuk, the rest of them are slightly less consistently reproducible. May 29 20:00:50 Has anyone encountered this before? I did this: apt-get remove libqt4-phonon to free up rootspace (it was recommended here: http://wiki.maemo.org/OTA_to_PR1.1_troubleshooting#Not_Enough_Free_Space, of course I tried all the other things first), but something went wrong there: now my N900 won't boot. It seems to be stuck in a loop, it only gets to the dialog for entering the PIN and then it keeps starting again and again. Hope this can May 29 20:00:50 somehow? :-( May 29 20:01:00 crashanddie did u read my above meaaage ? May 29 20:01:05 sure, copying prewritten tests isnt the same May 29 20:01:10 Like the weird SGX/HD bug I encountered after I first flashed where the dashboard got stuck halfway between each transition. May 29 20:01:10 DaReaper: I did May 29 20:01:13 oh May 29 20:01:16 perhaps a live WPM meter for your normal x11 input would be cool May 29 20:01:32 so did you get an idea of what i was saying ? May 29 20:01:33 bennypr0fane, do you have a linux box to hook the N900 into? May 29 20:01:49 i think the reason why msn is not working has something to do with the configuration errors May 29 20:01:50 try turning off lifequard reset and see if you can get in far enough to reinstall the package May 29 20:02:05 GAN900: do you see any logic in me doing good for n8x0's using meego, and not making sure the posts and forum stuff is done in the right place, ie, in meego? May 29 20:02:07 DaReaper: I do, however this is not supported by the N900 as said before. There is no word on whether such features will be supported in the future. May 29 20:02:14 GAN900: i had that too with SGX reseting on each touchscreen click after flash May 29 20:02:28 oh okay ty anyways May 29 20:02:32 GAN900: instead of being ass backwards and posting it on talk, where it literally disappears May 29 20:02:37 johnx no, win xp May 29 20:03:00 bennypr0fane, actually, there's a CLI flasher for WinXP as well now that I think of it May 29 20:03:16 what is a cli flasher? May 29 20:03:44 DaReaper: this being said, provided enough user demand for it, this may be a feature pushed forward, or some community member may pick up the task (however, considering it's manipulating the SIM, this may be difficult as that part isn't open source). Please check the brainstorm and bugtracker to find some information regarding it May 29 20:03:44 it's a "CommandLine Interface" version of the firmware updater, but it can change other settings May 29 20:04:16 You can use it to disable a feature that causes the N900 to automatically reboot if a core program dies May 29 20:04:18 GAN900, frals hmmmf May 29 20:04:22 crashanddie: More than that. The SIM is connected to a completely different CPU, running a closed-source signed blob. May 29 20:04:26 johnx i already downloaded Maemo flasher 3.5 May 29 20:04:36 GAN900: not been able to reproduce after rebooting though May 29 20:04:42 crashanddie: So if it does not support it, your only option is to convince the devs of that module to supply a patch May 29 20:04:48 right, you should use flasher 3.5 with the no lifeguard reset option May 29 20:04:53 look through the help for the program May 29 20:04:54 SpeedEvil: so highly unlikely May 29 20:05:01 anyone having video playback issues? May 29 20:05:04 btw, after a 'real' reboot dmesg counterthing resets doesnt it? May 29 20:05:18 johnx just not sure how to use it. help contains a few terms i'm not familiar with May 29 20:05:19 what the hell is happening tonight, is it a n900 support sprint? May 29 20:05:34 crashanddie: eurovision and n900 support sprint in one May 29 20:05:34 because after ota update to pr1.2 dmesg counter/timestamp thingy was still way high for a fresh boot May 29 20:05:35 has been all week crashanddie :) May 29 20:05:43 crashanddie: serbia is obviously a iphone user ;p May 29 20:05:51 Stskeeps: turkey is a total muse ripoff May 29 20:05:52 lots of people examining parts of the system they dont normally May 29 20:06:03 okay crashanddie ill check it over there May 29 20:06:07 rofl Stskeeps May 29 20:06:10 bennypr0fane, one sec, I'll find you a reference May 29 20:06:10 crashhanddie is this channel not where to do that? May 29 20:06:13 thanks for the support May 29 20:06:16 DaReaper: np May 29 20:06:32 i put my nose everywhere on the system, but i used to do embedded linux for a living so its not unexpected May 29 20:06:40 swedish commentators called turkeys band "the turkish linkin park" May 29 20:06:54 more like turkish system of a down May 29 20:07:04 I'm considering selling my iPhone 'cuz it ain't fun enough. May 29 20:07:10 What's the best thing to get? May 29 20:07:15 'droid or n900? May 29 20:07:27 (cost doesn't matter) May 29 20:07:34 nikki93, do you like hacking around in linux? May 29 20:07:39 johnx: I <3 it. May 29 20:07:43 N900 May 29 20:07:50 Okay. May 29 20:07:54 easy May 29 20:08:07 johnx: I've heard bad things about n900 touchscreen though. Is it taht bad? May 29 20:08:24 it's different than the capacitive screens May 29 20:08:28 requires a bit firmer push May 29 20:08:33 Yeah. May 29 20:08:36 but it's just about the best resistive screen I've ever used May 29 20:08:37 How's it with a stylus? May 29 20:08:41 fine May 29 20:08:41 Good to hear. May 29 20:08:42 still not reaaly a push tho May 29 20:08:46 it's also fine with a finger nail May 29 20:08:50 but it allows using your nails, fingers, pens, stylus May 29 20:08:59 it's still defintiely "touch" May 29 20:09:04 i tap everything with fingernail now and have become very accurate May 29 20:09:05 i believe some people can use it with other body parts too May 29 20:09:11 not to mention, you can put it in a protective cover (e.g. for using in the rain) May 29 20:09:13 lcuk: lawl May 29 20:09:22 brendans: Aha nice idea. May 29 20:09:25 bennypr0fane, http://wiki.maemo.org/R%26D_mode May 29 20:09:31 Hmm, so name some ultrageekykewl stuff to do with N900. May 29 20:09:36 lcuk: we know your penis is as fine as a stylus, but please, keep the channel PG May 29 20:09:37 bennypr0fane, flasher-3.5 --set-rd-flags=no-lifeguard-reset May 29 20:09:42 Stskeeps, sounds reasonable. May 29 20:09:42 yeah, we use it to time jogs May 29 20:09:48 ziplock FTW May 29 20:09:49 I think that's your best shot unless someone has a better idea May 29 20:09:52 crashanddie: Dude, he never mentioned it. you brought it up first. May 29 20:09:52 * GAN900 is at work. May 29 20:09:52 crashanddie, i meant ears actually May 29 20:10:04 So excuse the long ping times. ;) May 29 20:10:21 Lets say you were stuck in a room for a month. May 29 20:10:22 nikki93: actually, for his sake I hope he didn't bring anything "up" May 29 20:10:23 has anyone modded a bottle opener onto n900 yet May 29 20:10:25 With n900 with infinite battery. May 29 20:10:28 And lotsa food. May 29 20:10:30 What would you do? May 29 20:10:35 (wifi is available) May 29 20:10:40 i like to share my 3g connection over the easyHotSpot app May 29 20:10:54 nikki93, is the battery charged? May 29 20:10:56 nikki93: google maps and put clues as to where I am May 29 20:11:01 flux: Yep. :D May 29 20:11:06 nikki93: "cold" "cold" "cold" "warmer" May 29 20:11:10 n900 buffy edition should be released - replace the stylus with a wooden stake May 29 20:11:13 nikki93, I've been thinking about tapping into dbus for a whole bunch of stuff, but I keep putting it off May 29 20:11:15 nikki93, well, I'd solve the world energy problems and make buttloads of money while doing it! May 29 20:11:15 lcuk: cant you just use the bezel? ;D May 29 20:11:28 frals im just trying now with the back cover May 29 20:11:41 nikki93: Probably continue per usual; I do most things on my N900 anyway May 29 20:11:53 actually, I wonder if it mattered if there was actually such a battery.. because you cannot draw infinite wattage from it without it breaking down May 29 20:12:01 johnx could you give me just the command to enter into the flasher? do i leave the N900 power off? May 29 20:12:08 honestly, most of the hacks you could do on the N900 can be done on a droid, but the N900 has a more comfortable Linux environment, I beleive May 29 20:12:23 flux, is your last name capacitor? May 29 20:12:26 Is it possible to get a normal gnome ui running if you wanna May 29 20:12:55 bennypr0fane, I did. and just follow whatever normal instructions you'd use for flashing the N900, except instead of flashing an image do the no-lifeguard-reset thing May 29 20:13:04 search up in your scrollback for the exact line May 29 20:13:08 so you guys have any idea about this problem May 29 20:13:08 MohammadAG, May 29 20:13:08 is it just me or have there been less on device OS ports since the n900? May 29 20:13:12 http://pastebin.com/MMrHS6gT May 29 20:13:23 nikki93, people are playing around chrooting into "normal" linux distros May 29 20:13:36 is it because of the rootfs/emmc layout? May 29 20:13:42 dunno if anyone has put much effort into getting something "normal" booting on the N900 May 29 20:13:56 or just because years of 770/8x0 gained the experience necessary May 29 20:14:09 small fragments over time etc May 29 20:14:25 johnx thanks. but doesn't the n900 have to be on in order to do it? May 29 20:14:26 ie: has anyone managed to get fremantle booting from mmc? May 29 20:14:27 lcuk, well, if the N900 is your phone, it gives you more incentive to actually having it in a state where it can accept calls :) May 29 20:14:44 johnx: calls, from whom? May 29 20:14:47 sure johnx thats potentially something May 29 20:15:07 johnx: you're not seriously saying that GSM thingy you speak of will take off one day? May 29 20:15:09 bennypr0fane, basically, you start the flasher running, turn the N900 off, then hold u and plug it into usb May 29 20:15:18 Stskeeps, did you try fremantle on mmc or mer May 29 20:15:19 i know meego does May 29 20:15:25 is the N900 safe from viruses ? May 29 20:15:27 lcuk: some people did May 29 20:15:40 nikki93, there's a project in the standard "extras" repository that lets you install a chroot of Debian in the MyDocs space May 29 20:15:41 DaReaper, which viruses? May 29 20:15:41 some people being? any blogs posts sources we can track down May 29 20:15:44 for guidelines May 29 20:16:02 well any kind of malware seen on the internet May 29 20:16:05 DaReaper, two questions there: 1) is it safe from any virus out there now? 2) Is it safe from all future viruses automatically? May 29 20:16:07 DaReaper, it runs linux on a different cpu arch May 29 20:16:07 or rootkits May 29 20:16:08 nikki93, i.e. full Debian Linux running in parallel on the same system May 29 20:16:12 1) yes 2) no May 29 20:16:16 until viruses start specifically targeting it May 29 20:16:22 babe alert, ukraine chick Stskeeps May 29 20:16:49 hmmm ok so there r no viruses yet that can target the phone May 29 20:16:55 ZogG, ? May 29 20:16:59 not yet, anyhoo May 29 20:17:08 plus, technically it's probably slower on baseutils updates than a desktop distro May 29 20:17:11 but still malwares are poaaible to target May 29 20:17:13 DaReaper, we did have an outbreak of thehonour virus after someone left it on their sig May 29 20:17:14 n900 has a dedicated gfx chip right May 29 20:17:16 MohammadAG where have you got all those games? May 29 20:17:18 so old exploits are probably still live May 29 20:17:24 took us months to clear it off May 29 20:17:32 MohammadAG, btw can you share with me paradise city? May 29 20:17:35 brendans: baseutils? May 29 20:17:43 brendans: or do you mean busybox? May 29 20:17:46 oh was the virus fixed May 29 20:17:55 no it lies dormant May 29 20:18:23 ill find a link, make sure your virus checker is enabled May 29 20:18:26 crashanddie: well, I said baseutils, but I suppose I just mean the common GNU/Linux components... I misspoke May 29 20:18:27 it can pass via irc May 29 20:18:35 Please delete all the files on your hard disk, May 29 20:18:35 then forward this message to everyone you know. May 29 20:18:35 Thank you for your cooperation. May 29 20:18:51 send to iPad owner May 29 20:19:15 ZogG: gnr version, slash vs fergie or axl rose version? :) May 29 20:19:27 crashanddie: Still, things like X are going to tend to lag behind the desktop versions, since it takes so long to push things through to the tablets May 29 20:19:29 midas_ say what May 29 20:19:33 ok, I got the n900 plugged into the usb powered off, Flasher runnning. Now i'll enter this command into the flasher: --set-rd-flags=no-lifeguard-reset Is that it? May 29 20:19:41 crashanddie: and other misc system services, etc. May 29 20:19:41 paradise city ;) May 29 20:19:48 midas_ burnout? May 29 20:19:49 bennypr0fane, looks good May 29 20:20:05 old song? May 29 20:20:11 bennypr0fane, sorry, usb *unplugged* n900 off, run flasher, plug n900 in May 29 20:20:16 flasher will wait for the N900 May 29 20:20:22 you know, axl rose, guns n roses? May 29 20:20:25 Stskeeps, only problem is that you're going to start pulling THAT crowd to meego.com. :P May 29 20:20:41 brendans: I'm pretty sure that critical fixes can be backported and pushed through quickly. May 29 20:22:10 has nokia worked to design an anti virus ? just incase May 29 20:22:17 crashanddie: fair enough, I guess I'm just thinking in general terms as a response to the vulnerability question May 29 20:22:54 DaReaper, nope May 29 20:23:12 is the flasher supposed to react when i plug in? it's not doing anything May 29 20:23:14 well they better do May 29 20:23:25 DaReaper, Are you going to create a virus? May 29 20:23:31 Hey fellas, I'm trying to stream some music via mplayer I get AO OSS audio_setup: Can't open audio device /dev/dsp: No such file of directory May 29 20:23:33 lol no May 29 20:23:40 DaReaper: why would Nokia do such a thing? May 29 20:23:53 DaReaper, so, how do you think an anti-virus program works typically? May 29 20:23:55 i am worried of internet malwares May 29 20:24:00 no oss Dima202 May 29 20:24:04 DaReaper: don't worrie - maemo isn't that popular yet ;P May 29 20:24:06 And I keep getting Write ERROR: Broken Pipe May 29 20:24:11 DaReaper: there are anti viral solutions for Linux, it would just be a matter of porting it May 29 20:24:26 oh okay May 29 20:24:29 Dima202, try with pulse output? May 29 20:24:53 crashanddie, and all those do right now is scan for files infected with windows viruses :) May 29 20:24:55 DaReaper: As it stands though, it's not even the same architecture as most desktops; it'd have to be a virus written for phones or wireless routers, etc. May 29 20:25:18 (though a large number of linux routers are MIPS, not ARM) May 29 20:25:27 (true) May 29 20:25:35 hmmm okay so maemo is still untouched May 29 20:25:42 flasher says the command wasn't found May 29 20:25:47 for now May 29 20:25:55 and there has been few viruses for linux in general thus far May 29 20:26:00 That doesn't mean it couldn't be done, but virus writers these days are typically worried about making money, and it's not a very big market May 29 20:26:07 bennypr0fane, pastebin an exact copy of what you typed and the output May 29 20:26:24 Not like the bad old days of the '90s when people would open an attachment and have their motherboard voltage adjusted May 29 20:26:30 but that may change in the future if linux gets as mainstream as linux May 29 20:26:45 *windows May 29 20:26:48 LOL May 29 20:26:56 * b-man|n900 needs coffee May 29 20:27:08 * johnx hands b-man some (coldish) coffee May 29 20:27:24 with creamed trout on top May 29 20:27:29 how do i pastebin? May 29 20:27:35 I see that mplayer is generally slow for most stuff on n900 :( default media player does a better job May 29 20:27:42 pastebin.com (or pastebin.ca) May 29 20:27:46 then drop the link here May 29 20:27:51 bennypr0fane never uses commandlines... May 29 20:28:01 is it just me? May 29 20:28:21 Dima202, mplayer could be better optimized for ARM May 29 20:28:27 the default Nokia player is May 29 20:29:56 sorry, i have no idea how to use this. May 29 20:30:19 i typed exactly the command you gave, double-checked it May 29 20:30:48 since you're on windows, make sure you have a .exe on the end of flasher May 29 20:31:30 it might need to say flasher-3.5.exe --set-rd-flags=no-lifeguard-reset May 29 20:32:09 * GAN900 needs to remember to remember to do mwkn tomorrow. May 29 20:32:19 * Stskeeps needs to remember to ban talk.maemo.org from his weekends May 29 20:32:20 :P May 29 20:33:40 all these mysterious quiet .fi chatters... May 29 20:34:01 hi! May 29 20:34:11 hallo spectre- May 29 20:34:22 xchattin on mah n900 May 29 20:34:39 :D May 29 20:35:06 beagleboard channel is like a ghost town... May 29 20:35:22 pupnik: sshhh! May 29 20:36:59 jonhx it's not working May 29 20:37:22 spectre, that is an unusual location. working for cellphone co? May 29 20:37:28 bennypr0fane, I can't tell what's happening unless you give me more of a clue than that... May 29 20:37:45 so. anyone got videocalling working with skype? May 29 20:38:03 midas_, yeah. works good here May 29 20:38:17 i cant get it to work :P May 29 20:38:23 ok May 29 20:41:41 ill just reflash it with the emmc May 29 20:41:57 so it's completely clean May 29 20:42:14 I did that and the person I was testing with (rm_you) had done the OTA upgrade May 29 20:42:28 i couldnt update ota May 29 20:42:45 anyone else gets reversed application list on application manager? May 29 20:42:48 too many unsupported software :p May 29 20:43:19 when I show 'all', the list starts with a z May 29 20:43:30 johnx http://www.4shared.com/photo/gbhTrwlG/scrnshot_flasher_3-5.html May 29 20:43:33 you might want to change the sorting May 29 20:43:38 I can't May 29 20:43:51 there's no such option anymore May 29 20:44:02 i also tried with .exe, same result May 29 20:44:07 bennypr0fane, ah. thank you. that makes more sense. May 29 20:44:21 jesus May 29 20:44:26 internet here is worse than uganda May 29 20:44:33 LiraNuna: i use catorise and have no probs with sort May 29 20:44:43 application manager May 29 20:44:45 bennypr0fane, type exactly this: May 29 20:44:46 flasher-3.5.exe --set-rd-flags=no-lifeguard-reset May 29 20:44:47 i.e add/remoe May 29 20:45:22 congrats on your connection spectre- May 29 20:45:54 LiraNuna, o_O May 29 20:46:43 when I go to Download -> All May 29 20:46:51 I get the list from Z to A May 29 20:46:53 thx May 29 20:47:59 johnx http://www.4shared.com/photo/UyiiCgYI/scrnshot_2_flasher_3-5.html see any typos? May 29 20:48:09 still nothing... May 29 20:48:20 need a space May 29 20:49:31 argh, overlooked that May 29 20:51:14 it says "suitable usb device not found, waiting" May 29 20:51:51 now plug in the usb May 29 20:51:57 while holding u May 29 20:52:08 bennypr0fane good now make sure the device is powered off then hold u and plug in the usb May 29 20:53:37 done. windows says errror while installing new hardware May 29 20:53:55 64 bit? May 29 20:53:59 no, 32 May 29 20:54:45 a tabbed term would be nice May 29 20:55:59 there's enough wasted vertical space already :) May 29 20:56:46 tabs on the right (or left) May 29 20:57:07 or in the menu May 29 20:57:08 actually, would be cool to switch tabs by moving your finger in from the left or right May 29 20:57:50 I'm stumped. now what? May 29 20:58:03 me too. I don't know how to use windows :/ May 29 20:58:08 I agree gesture based terminal tabbing would be an improvement May 29 20:58:36 bennypr0fane: yeah I'm a linux user as well May 29 20:58:39 LiraNuna, I'm looking at some of the hildon-application-manager options, and there's a program called hildon-application-manager-config that allows you to dump the configuration information to terminal May 29 20:58:56 mmmm...or just make the "swipe in from the left send a ctrl-a ctrl-space May 29 20:59:05 LiraNuna, might be worth taking a look... there are some sort options in the XML that I haven't had a good look at yet May 29 20:59:33 it gives an XML May 29 20:59:50 so is nokia sdk qt is only for c++ devs or i can use pyqt? May 29 20:59:57 bennypr0fane: you could download and burn a linux live cd and then use it to flash...I May 29 20:59:57 nothing related to sorting, brendans May 29 21:00:09 windows always said that when i plug in the n900 - everything used to work normally though. it's recognized as mass storage May 29 21:00:12 brendans, there's sort-weight, but I don't know what it means (it's a number) May 29 21:00:13 I'll walk you through it if you want May 29 21:00:26 i have a linux live cd May 29 21:00:33 Puppy i think May 29 21:00:35 which one May 29 21:00:37 bennypr0fane, well, in this case the N900 isn't acting like a mass-storage device, so windows treats it differently May 29 21:00:42 LiraNuna, yeah, I think it may be that it controls the sorting in the update screen (i.e. if you tap the orange exclamation mark) May 29 21:00:44 or ubuntu May 29 21:00:54 LiraNuna, so that SSU is on the top, for example May 29 21:01:12 i wouldn't know how to get back here on Linuy though May 29 21:01:19 frals, yes she was singing about a big arse May 29 21:01:20 how do I take a screenshot? May 29 21:01:24 yeah slap in that ubuntu cd and we'll get you reflashed in time May 29 21:01:28 lcuk: :D May 29 21:01:36 i wasnt listening at the time May 29 21:01:50 just had to reflash my n900. things suck at the moment. May 29 21:01:54 xchat is a nice and easy to use linux irc client May 29 21:02:01 reliving the nightmare before bash and catorise May 29 21:02:09 and hundreds of other tweaks May 29 21:02:27 so once you boot ubuntu, use the ubuntu software center thing to install xchat, get back here and we'll run you through the rest May 29 21:02:38 frals, voting for Armenia May 29 21:02:58 she has the best chest in the competition May 29 21:02:59 how do I take a screenshot? May 29 21:03:18 LiraNuna, on the N900? May 29 21:03:35 yes May 29 21:03:48 xchat? will it let me install anything when i'm running ubuntu from a cd? May 29 21:03:56 LiraNuna, first google result for maemo screenshot: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=35730 May 29 21:03:57 I know there's a shortcut, but I don't know it May 29 21:04:07 lcuk: lol May 29 21:04:12 I tried ctrl+shift+P already May 29 21:04:17 lcuk: germany was best imo May 29 21:04:26 anyways afk now, gnight all :) May 29 21:04:26 germany was best song May 29 21:04:36 LiraNuna, and you looked in the images/screenshots dir afterwards? May 29 21:04:40 yeah nothing May 29 21:04:51 then you're SOL I guess May 29 21:05:07 :| May 29 21:05:14 bennypr0fane yes you will be able to install programs while running the live cd May 29 21:05:41 oh, it's .images May 29 21:05:42 LiraNuna, order matters. has to be shift then ctrl then p May 29 21:05:53 Screenshot-20100529-230453.png May 29 21:05:57 works here May 29 21:06:12 it's dot images, not images May 29 21:06:19 ok, thanks a lot you guys, see back here in few May 29 21:06:38 cheers May 29 21:08:44 my app manager's "All" -> http://liranuna.com/junk/zsort.png May 29 21:08:59 and there's no config for sorting, either -> http://liranuna.com/junk/zsort-no-option.png May 29 21:09:16 keen. when did it start doing that? May 29 21:09:31 after PR1.2 OTA May 29 21:10:51 I've been trying to look through the ham source, to see if there's a gconf setting or something, LiraNuna May 29 21:11:02 does anyone else get the same thing? May 29 21:11:05 http://maemo.gitorious.org/hildon-application-manager/mainline/trees/HEAD/src May 29 21:11:12 no, but I reflashed May 29 21:11:31 how does it look for you? May 29 21:11:36 I'm also missing version on the side May 29 21:14:02 does anyone else experience it? May 29 21:15:09 I know there has been updates to the app manager, and everyone said it's better now - but for me it looks worse May 29 21:15:09 LiraNuna, have you rebooted since you saw this effect? May 29 21:15:17 lcuk, yes, many times May 29 21:15:25 thats rly bizarre May 29 21:15:25 in fact, let me reboot once more May 29 21:15:50 can anyone screenshot their app manager? May 29 21:17:10 LiraNuna, mine's identical except for theme and sorting differences (and the catalogues, of course) May 29 21:17:18 same elements, placement, etc. May 29 21:17:39 I think that would be controlled by http://maemo.gitorious.org/hildon-application-manager/mainline/blobs/HEAD/src/package-info-cell-renderer.c May 29 21:18:34 so they removed version on the right side? May 29 21:18:46 I remember a version displayed on the right side May 29 21:20:04 LiraNuna, disable all your repositories and refresh and reenable them? May 29 21:20:09 do other lists also come up wrong? May 29 21:20:12 let's try May 29 21:20:19 lcuk, yes May 29 21:20:25 ahh.. May 29 21:21:04 Laptop HDD has a bad sector :( May 29 21:21:09 LiraNuna, http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=1oofpv&s=6 May 29 21:22:15 this is what I see in the ened May 29 21:22:17 but reversed May 29 21:24:10 lcuk, tried that, no go May 29 21:24:12 same output May 29 21:24:18 afk for a while May 29 21:24:22 so outside of HAM you get inverted lists? May 29 21:24:26 ahh May 29 21:25:00 OT: In johnx's link, what's the widget making up the list? May 29 21:25:33 i would install catorise May 29 21:26:37 if anyone else is looking at the source, I'm trying to find make_install_apps_package_list... seems like that's what's actually rendering the list that's been reversed May 29 21:27:34 ah.... May 29 21:28:05 something tells me I should be looking in package-info-cell-renderer.c ... duh. May 29 21:28:26 lol TheFaioli was just about to say that :p May 29 21:29:57 anyone watching the eurovision May 29 21:30:09 ireland ftw May 29 21:30:12 application manager needs to be able to install things many at a time May 29 21:30:54 yeah. it also needs a command line interface. and that interface should be called apt-get. and it should get ported to debian. May 29 21:30:59 yeah bulk installing is the feature I would most like to see in the next revision of the app manager May 29 21:31:31 I've been working on the same path, TheFaioli... I think eventually you're going to find yourself at util.cc, looking at "make_global_package_list" May 29 21:31:45 My best guess is that it's something to do with the new live search functionailty May 29 21:32:07 Hmmm... yeah... May 29 21:32:46 does microb have an refresh shortcut May 29 21:33:59 LiraNuna, if you're around, what happens if you do a live search in the application list? Is it still sorted in reverse? May 29 21:35:18 Where are the sms records kept? May 29 21:37:09 uh, was the way to search for apps in the application manager changed from 1.1 to 1.2? May 29 21:38:15 yes just enter a category (or all) and start typing May 29 21:39:00 is there a way to search by description and name? May 29 21:39:07 search is on name and description May 29 21:39:45 typing "ren" brings back results including: xplanet:planetary body renderere May 29 21:40:25 word...well last night I was trying to install MGutenberg and I typed in ebook but got no results May 29 21:40:29 maemo support Nokia n73? May 29 21:41:06 no May 29 21:41:13 ah ok, thx lcuk May 29 21:41:38 would be cool if that "start to type" approach to search was used in more apps May 29 21:41:47 or less May 29 21:42:33 jophish, did you find them yet? May 29 21:44:22 maybe /home/user/.rtcom-eventlogger/el-v1.db May 29 21:44:26 which is a sqlite3 db May 29 21:46:10 johnx, I hadn't looked actually ;) May 29 21:46:20 if they are easy to graft into a new flash, then great May 29 21:46:24 otherwise no bother May 29 21:46:36 just use the backup tool, then the restore tool :) May 29 21:46:58 only reason to go poking around in the .db is if you wanted to ... go poking around in the db :) May 29 21:47:00 cure`, most gtk lists support it around the os now May 29 21:47:28 my favorite typeahead find implementation is in omweather though May 29 21:58:56 johnx, thunderfest u still here? May 29 21:59:29 yup May 29 21:59:38 oh great May 29 21:59:58 took me a while, ubuntu seems to dislike my pc May 29 22:00:35 so i guess i'll need to download the linux flasher? May 29 22:01:05 yup May 29 22:01:32 get the ubuntu package here: http://tablets-dev.nokia.com/d3.php May 29 22:01:39 i'm on ubuntu 8.04 now, 9.10 didn't start the gui.... May 29 22:01:57 will this work? May 29 22:02:26 one sec May 29 22:02:31 gave you the wrong download link May 29 22:02:35 I'm here May 29 22:03:20 http://tablets-dev.nokia.com/maemo-dev-env-downloads.php May 29 22:03:26 that's the right download link May 29 22:06:51 debian based or not debian based? May 29 22:07:15 debian based May 29 22:07:26 maemo_flasher-3.5_2.5.2.2_i386.deb May 29 22:10:24 does the enhanced kernel actually make a diff on battery life? May 29 22:10:27 i installed the flasher, but now i don't know how to start it May 29 22:10:45 its command line only May 29 22:11:19 oh, so terminal? May 29 22:11:35 sorry kernel-power-settings aswel obviously May 29 22:11:58 yeah click applications->accessories->terminal May 29 22:12:16 sudo flasher-3.5 --set-rd-flags=no-lifeguard-reset May 29 22:13:49 DocScrutinizer: no, I had beer instead. What do you mean mc.desktop? Is it possible to open multiple mc instances? May 29 22:13:54 johnx what do those flags do? May 29 22:13:56 What's 'meego'? May 29 22:14:17 thunderfest, he's stuck in a reboot loop. this should prevent the watchdog from rebooting the device May 29 22:14:23 Is there a way to disable the camera app starting when opening the lens cover May 29 22:14:31 ah May 29 22:14:36 I use the lens cover more to start the flashlight May 29 22:14:47 it might let him get far enough into the desktop to backup his stuff, or if he's lucky far enough to replace the package he removed that caused this May 29 22:15:05 I plan on trying to split off the LEDs into their own LED driver May 29 22:15:15 And having the camera driver use this. May 29 22:15:32 With the aid of this, and two drilled holes, you won't need to open up. May 29 22:15:50 nikki93: meego is another mobile OS made through a partnership between nokia and intel....it will be on the n920 (and other new devices ) instead of maemo May 29 22:15:56 wont that accelerate dust gathering on lens? May 29 22:16:02 unless you put something transparent there May 29 22:16:08 thunderfest: It any good? May 29 22:16:20 its not really out yet May 29 22:16:27 jaska, a clear piece of scotch tape should prevent that May 29 22:16:39 thunderfest: But gimme an opinion. May 29 22:17:08 I thought the Meego 1.0 was released for N900? May 29 22:17:15 idk I have not used it at all May 29 22:18:00 nikki93: v1.0 probably has it's share of issues. I'd wait for youtube vids to surface. May 29 22:18:25 I thought the meego 1.0 release was just a developer release and just barely get you to a terminal May 29 22:19:50 my understanding is that the meego mobile device UI hasn't been created yet, just the netbook version May 29 22:20:04 but the n900 is a devel device for the mobile UI May 29 22:22:38 yeah thats right I think...but the mobile UI is going to be designed for capacitance based multi-touch screens not the single touch resistive screen of the n900 so when the mobile version of meego does official come out there will no official support for the n900 ...even though that is what they are testing on right now May 29 22:23:56 but it should be fairly easy to port applications between meego and maemo May 29 22:27:26 Stskeeps: will meego guarantee the same UI in every device type or can UI differ wildly depending on type of device? May 29 22:29:25 rumors have said both I'm not sure anyone is sure about that right now May 29 22:31:48 bah, I have to actually change gparted's source to add a damn parameter May 29 22:33:14 so sorry, but could I have that command again? ubuntu crashed when i plugged in the n900 the first time, i had to reboot and reinstall.... May 29 22:33:24 which command? May 29 22:33:34 sudo flasher-3.5 --set-rd-flags=no-lifeguard-reset <-- this one? May 29 22:33:37 sudo make me sammich May 29 22:33:44 I was close May 29 22:33:47 yes, thanks May 29 22:35:08 wow, didn't think this would actually work May 29 22:35:22 what? May 29 22:35:35 peeing on his toes to kill the atheletes foot May 29 22:35:55 man, I am in a strange mood May 29 22:36:01 I think I need more coffee May 29 22:36:06 indeed, I suggest /part :P May 29 22:36:12 :P May 29 22:37:08 it's doing something! flasher recognized the device! May 29 22:37:52 it's telling me the fw-version May 29 22:38:10 now how do i get the new one on there? May 29 22:38:47 first of all, why did you go into R&D mode? May 29 22:39:08 he's stuck in a reboot loop May 29 22:39:28 bennypr0fane_, I actually gave you the command to to try and get it to boot. you might want to just unplug it, and see if it starts up May 29 22:39:38 ok May 29 22:39:52 oh, that makes sense then May 29 22:39:58 I thought you wanted to reflash May 29 22:40:16 in fact, i do May 29 22:40:29 after i get it back up and running May 29 22:40:35 oh May 29 22:40:40 * thunderfest is getting some more coffee brb May 29 22:40:48 i downloaded pr 1.2 May 29 22:40:55 bennypr0fane_, do you have stuff you need to backup before you reflash? May 29 22:41:14 hey thunderfest, how do you make your coffee? May 29 22:41:27 johnx i made 2 backups May 29 22:41:43 ah, well you didn't need that r&d mode stuff I guess :) May 29 22:41:49 one on n900 and one on the pc with nokia pc suite May 29 22:42:01 my phone is back! May 29 22:42:24 yay! May 29 22:42:40 * MohammadAG wonders why the SW watchdog was rebooting it May 29 22:43:03 he removed libqt4-phonon May 29 22:43:16 SW watchdog? May 29 22:43:27 in a coffee pot May 29 22:43:34 the one you just killed with that command May 29 22:44:12 yeah if you already made you backups you can just reflash May 29 22:44:44 i removed liqt4-phonon, that went wrong, I tried to reboot, got caught in a loop May 29 22:45:01 sudo flasher-3.5 -F -f -R May 29 22:45:28 with an italian espresso can, with filters, or with a tabs machine? May 29 22:45:38 bennypr0fane_, are you on 1.1 right now or 1.2? May 29 22:45:45 1.1 May 29 22:45:55 you need to flash the emmc as well then May 29 22:46:03 go download both May 29 22:46:19 done May 29 22:46:37 italian espresso can, with filters....my wife was a barista for a few years May 29 22:47:21 i have: RX-51_2009SE_10.2010.13-2.VANILLA_PR_EMMC_MR0_ARM.bin and RX-51_2009SE_10.2010.19-1_PR_COMBINED_MR0_ARM.bin May 29 22:47:47 these the right files? May 29 22:47:52 You only NEED to flash the 2nd one May 29 22:48:00 the 1st one will clear the eMMC May 29 22:48:12 (32GB eMMC) May 29 22:48:24 MohammadAG, even going 1.1 to 1.2? May 29 22:48:34 yeah you only need to do the second one May 29 22:48:36 oops, i don't want that i guess May 29 22:48:38 johnsq, no need to reflash the eMMC May 29 22:48:53 flash "RX-51_2009SE_10.2010.19-1_PR_COMBINED_MR0_ARM.bin" first without the -R to reboot May 29 22:48:53 I stand corrected :) May 29 22:48:58 flasher-3.5 -F RX-51_2009SE_10.2010.19-1_PR_COMBINED_MR0_ARM.bin -f -R May 29 22:49:03 odin_, why... May 29 22:49:18 the -R isn't needed when reflashing the eMMC, which he doesn't want May 29 22:49:22 to do May 29 22:49:24 damn enter key May 29 22:49:52 bennypr0fane listen to what MohammadAG is saying May 29 22:49:56 ok I misunderstood, if you are not doing EMMC as well you can use -R to reboot (or just unplug when you know its done) May 29 22:50:07 if i do that, everything's gone right? pictures, documents.... May 29 22:50:13 no May 29 22:50:19 if you reflash the eMMC yes May 29 22:50:29 i mean, if i reflas the eMMC May 29 22:50:43 bennypr0fane_, yes, the whole 32GB flash will be erased May 29 22:50:56 no, defintiely don't want that. May 29 22:50:57 which has MyDocs (Nokia N900 in File Manager), /opt, and swap May 29 22:51:14 then the command I typed should be enough May 29 22:51:16 oh wait May 29 22:51:28 flasher-3.5 -F RX-51_2009SE_10.2010.19-1_PR_COMBINED_MR0_ARM.bin -f --disable-rd-mode -R May 29 22:53:21 you shouldn't stay in RD mode May 29 22:53:21 so this means: undo what i did first, than flash, than reboot? May 29 22:53:21 if you use this command --> flasher-3.5 -F RX-51_2009SE_10.2010.19-1_PR_COMBINED_MR0_ARM.bin -f --disable-rd-mode -R it should just reflash the firmware and leave your files alone May 29 22:53:22 ok May 29 22:53:22 bennypr0fane_, nope, just run the command and reboot the device when it says device not found May 29 22:53:22 (hold down the power button with the USB cable connected) May 29 22:53:22 but how does flasher find the image? May 29 22:53:22 Windows? May 29 22:53:22 no hes on an ubuntu live cd May 29 22:53:25 oh, cool May 29 22:53:27 8.04 May 29 22:53:36 copy the image into /home/ubuntu May 29 22:53:39 then run the command May 29 22:54:03 worst OS install in my life, Ubuntu 10.04 on my laptop, from 12 PM till 1 AM May 29 22:54:14 (I should blame CHKDSK for 7 of those hours) May 29 22:54:48 the image file needs to be in the directory where your terminal is at .... by default the terminal starts in /home/ubuntu May 29 22:54:57 could be worse May 29 22:55:29 well, Windows still boots up May 29 22:55:38 that means I didn't f up gparted by editing the source May 29 22:56:24 you can check if it is there with the command "ls" (list) and you can change directories with the command "cd" (change directory) May 29 22:56:56 http://xkcd.com/349/ May 29 22:57:09 now if only someone explained those basic commands to me three years ago... May 29 22:57:56 lol May 29 22:58:18 so if the firmware image is on your desktop you can get to it in the terminal by typing cd ~/Desktop May 29 22:58:41 then typing ls you should see it listed May 29 22:58:42 Linux is case sensitive, as everything should be May 29 22:58:50 then your flasher can see it May 29 22:58:51 took me a day to find that on my own three years ago May 29 22:59:11 i moved the image to home/ubuntu May 29 22:59:12 wohoo May 29 22:59:17 Windows boots up May 29 22:59:24 and... Ubuntu doesn't (GRR) May 29 22:59:56 is there a way to copy and paste commands into the terminal? May 29 23:00:05 ctrl c to copy from here May 29 23:00:06 edit -> paste May 29 23:00:11 ctrl+shift+v to paste May 29 23:00:25 ah, it's the shift i was missing! May 29 23:00:25 or shift + Insert May 29 23:01:10 bennypr0fane_, it's cause CTRL ^C has a function on its own May 29 23:01:36 I wouldn't do it while reflashing (I did it once but it was after I actually flashed the bootloader part) May 29 23:02:02 do i need the n900 power off or on for flashing? May 29 23:02:20 yeah do not hit CTRL + anything while it is reflashing May 29 23:02:26 with the USB cable connected power down May 29 23:02:35 MohammadAG, it took me months to get my isa pnp modem and isa pnp soundcard to work at the same time in linux. looking back I was somewhat masochistic ... May 29 23:02:35 it should power on and kick into flashing mode on its own May 29 23:02:47 yay gdm doesn't start May 29 23:03:14 Right now I'm not sure if it's my GFX card that's f'd up or Ubuntu May 29 23:03:39 MohammadAG: did your windows install overwrite your master boot record and not grub is not loading. .is that why you cannot get ubuntu to boot? May 29 23:04:07 oh your getting past grub May 29 23:04:08 thunderfest, Ubuntu 'boots', but X crashes May 29 23:04:15 going into failsafeX May 29 23:04:23 ah what kind of card do you have May 29 23:04:41 Intel May 29 23:04:43 video card that is May 29 23:04:54 852/855 chipset I think May 29 23:05:11 hrm those are usually fairly well supported May 29 23:05:26 out with the new, in with the old I guess May 29 23:05:31 * MohammadAG removes nouveau May 29 23:06:05 can you get to a terminal and check the contents of the /etc/X11 directory? May 29 23:06:20 got into failsafeX and gdm started May 29 23:06:27 removing nouveau May 29 23:06:30 removed May 29 23:06:31 umm May 29 23:06:44 wasn't the whole xorg.conf thing dumped in Ubuntu 10.04? May 29 23:06:59 it's used if present May 29 23:07:23 a lot of times, the easiest fix is to move it out of the way May 29 23:07:34 it's saying usb device not found again May 29 23:07:44 hmm May 29 23:07:49 pop out the battery May 29 23:07:51 connect the cable May 29 23:07:55 keep the command running May 29 23:08:01 then insert the battery May 29 23:08:18 do i need to push u while plugging it in? May 29 23:08:35 if you remove the battery no May 29 23:09:05 bennypr0fane you could just unplug it make sure it is powered all the way down and try holding down u and pluging it back in before you try removing hte battery May 29 23:09:36 or that, but 10.04 broke that too :) May 29 23:09:54 there's a an application called f-spot launching itself whenever i plug in May 29 23:10:10 are you sure you're holding u? May 29 23:10:20 f-spot only launches if a Mass Storage device is connected May 29 23:10:25 ubuntu thinks it a camera then May 29 23:10:26 particularly one with photos May 29 23:10:56 if you powered it down while connected it might not of shut all the way off May 29 23:11:12 it makes a lot of u's in the terminal or chat, am i doing it wrong? May 29 23:11:22 u on the N900, not the PC May 29 23:11:29 oh May 29 23:11:41 I just filed a bug for "my location" in the status area for IM. it doesn't update after a while. anyone got this? https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=10415 May 29 23:11:41 Bug 10415: "My location" in chat status hangs and doesn't get updated May 29 23:11:43 so unplug it start it all the up and then all the way down again unpluged .. then hold down the u key and plug it back in May 29 23:12:02 hold the button with the phone switched off? that's weird... May 29 23:12:14 while the terminal is saying waiting for device or whaterver it says May 29 23:12:15 And does someone know how I can restart the messaging thing? May 29 23:12:40 yeah hold down u with the device off and plug it in May 29 23:12:48 ok May 29 23:13:59 MohammadAG, what did you upgrade from? May 29 23:14:15 brendans, 9.10 May 29 23:14:26 A few versions ago there were changes to the way that non-standard resolutions were handled, and I remember that the 8xx series was handled differently from the 9xx series May 29 23:14:29 ah, probably not that then May 29 23:15:08 (i.e. 915resolution) May 29 23:15:19 dpkg: failed to open package info file `/var/lib/dpkg/updates/0143' for reading: Stale NFS file handle May 29 23:15:19 <-- huh May 29 23:15:35 ... :| May 29 23:15:43 rm: cannot remove `/var/lib/dpkg/updates/0143': Stale NFS file handle May 29 23:16:04 is your /var on a remote server? May 29 23:16:24 NFS is network file system May 29 23:16:33 it says error claiming usb device, operation not permitted May 29 23:16:47 no, to both questions May 29 23:16:47 already said so the first time.... May 29 23:16:50 bennypr0fane_, sudo... May 29 23:17:10 sudo flasher-3.5 -F RX-51_2009SE_10.2010.19-1_PR_COMBINED_MR0_ARM.bin -f --disable-rd-mode -R May 29 23:17:17 oh May 29 23:18:07 MohammadAG, not sure what's wrong on your system... is this on the system, or a live CD? May 29 23:18:13 chroot May 29 23:18:26 adding sudo tells your command to run with a higher set of permissions (root) May 29 23:18:41 MohammadAG, check dmesg | tail May 29 23:18:49 I feel like unionfs has some NFS mechanics in it in the newer versions... could be related to the union on a ubuntu live cd's / May 29 23:19:02 but this is a chroot May 29 23:19:13 fsck'ing it May 29 23:19:15 /dev/mmcblk1p1: recovering journal May 29 23:19:20 ah May 29 23:19:59 oh, shoot, I thought this was a desktop system; I must have missed the beginning May 29 23:20:22 nope, I'm working on two systems May 29 23:20:26 3 actually :P May 29 23:20:48 bennypr0fane how is it going? May 29 23:21:12 Does the xmpp-muc client do anything about history control? May 29 23:21:26 http://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0045.html#enter-managehistory May 29 23:21:49 what's vesa? May 29 23:22:13 MohammadAG: aka VGA May 29 23:22:17 the standard linux video driver May 29 23:22:20 standard software driver May 29 23:22:22 actually, I think Vesa was a step up from VGA May 29 23:22:32 i.e. no hardware acceleration May 29 23:22:58 it works using that in xorg.conf May 29 23:23:06 any ideas what the intel driver is called? May 29 23:23:06 yeah, VGA is 640x480 and VESA is 800x600 May 29 23:23:19 running @ 1024x768 here May 29 23:23:22 "intel" I believe May 29 23:23:44 Wikipedia says they've issued numerous standards since the original 800x600 May 29 23:24:02 VGA is a video mode, VESA incorporates a ton of video standards May 29 23:24:06 someone needs to standardize OpenVG and OpenGL acceleration ;) May 29 23:24:15 Hi all, I just upgraded my n900 and the Converstions app doesn't save the history any more? May 29 23:24:18 and what's MESA? (I remember helping someone compile it) May 29 23:24:20 any ideas? May 29 23:24:27 MohammadAG: Mesa is basically OpenGL for Linux May 29 23:24:35 oh May 29 23:24:42 Ceriand|desktop, there's a thread about it on tmo May 29 23:24:45 including bits of hw accel for various cards May 29 23:24:50 MohammadAG: link? May 29 23:24:53 you'll need to delete the new file I think May 29 23:24:57 Ceriand|desktop, search :P May 29 23:25:05 my wife just yelled, "The dishwasher is leaking!" May 29 23:25:07 brb May 29 23:25:08 sec I'll see if Firefox's awesome bar has it May 29 23:25:08 MohammadAG: already tried May 29 23:25:18 didn't find anything relevant May 29 23:25:50 Ceriand|desktop, you didn't try hard enough http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=678939&postcount=14 May 29 23:25:54 :) May 29 23:26:13 MohammadAG: thx :) May 29 23:26:21 np :) May 29 23:26:50 I think my lappy needs some repairs May 29 23:26:57 it keeps dropping wifi for 2 seconds May 29 23:27:06 doesn't cause anything major, but I hate it when the LED blinks May 29 23:28:41 heh May 29 23:28:59 i want true su8w bt keyboard support May 29 23:29:02 :( May 29 23:30:29 back(ish) May 29 23:31:23 brendans, dishwasher fail? May 29 23:31:55 I think there was dish soap on something, not sure... lots of foam May 29 23:32:27 One of the ones with a mysteriously unmarked dial (I may or may not have found "Drain") May 29 23:32:37 wow, dell's tablet looks pretty descent May 29 23:33:17 it doesn't even have appleish look :) May 29 23:33:24 wazd, did you see engadget stab it with a pen? May 29 23:33:35 johnx: yeah :) May 29 23:33:48 yeah, that looked awful, but I was suitably impressed May 29 23:34:17 is this the XT2? May 29 23:34:33 johnx: my first pda's touchscreen died after one summer of playing Snails :D May 29 23:34:44 johnx: that's WM Worms clone :) May 29 23:34:53 or the Streak? May 29 23:34:59 brendans, streak May 29 23:35:38 though it's a heluva spade :) May 29 23:35:47 ah, k May 29 23:36:21 even HD2 will look small near that monster :) May 29 23:36:43 seems like the screen is about the size of the n800 body? May 29 23:37:07 brendans: something like that May 29 23:38:22 I hope there once will be a capacitive touchscreen with same accuracy as resistive May 29 23:38:57 that would be the end of resistive era :) May 29 23:39:11 * SpeedEvil is mind-boggled by the insanity of end-users caring. May 29 23:39:17 I'll admit, I kind of like the n900's resistive LCD... sunlight readable, and it works with anything you touch it with May 29 23:39:50 brendans: well, first of all sun readibility has nothing to do with touchscreen type :) May 29 23:39:58 no, I mean LCD vs. AMOLED May 29 23:40:13 brendans: ah, yeah, n900's LCD is superb May 29 23:40:21 but I see the two decisions (resistive, LCD) as coming from the same design philosophy May 29 23:40:31 brendans: it's even better than e63 May 29 23:41:00 wazd: i.e. there should never be a normal use situation where you can't use the device because of silly reasons (gloves, sunlight) May 29 23:41:30 brendans: AMOLED is overrated May 29 23:41:51 brendans: I compared Nexus One next to n900 - nothing really that special May 29 23:42:07 brendans: slightly brighter, that's all May 29 23:42:28 brendans: though it's more energy eficcent May 29 23:42:58 wazd: yeah, I guess my concern is that if you don't have a transflective screen, there are a lot of situations where it can't be used May 29 23:43:28 brendans: well, looks like Super-AMOLED fixes the situation a bit May 29 23:43:38 wazd: oh? May 29 23:43:39 brendans: but still nothing close to transflective May 29 23:44:16 brendans: well, it's even more brighter, that's why it's more readable on the sunlight May 29 23:44:36 N9xx with pixel qi yet? May 29 23:44:38 ah, k May 29 23:44:46 zash, I wish May 29 23:44:55 who doesn't? May 29 23:44:57 zash: who knows May 29 23:45:11 zash: I feel like that's the endpoint of what we were just talking about May 29 23:45:33 are we ranting about what features we want? good. I want something in the Zaurus SL-5500 form factor May 29 23:45:36 zash: pixel Qi + that fancy resistive multitouch tech + my secret weapon = death to all handhelds :) May 29 23:45:43 something e-ink like on one end of the spectrum, and some kind of LED matrix on the other... May 29 23:45:49 or both May 29 23:45:51 johnx: lame May 29 23:45:55 C760 form ftw May 29 23:46:16 luke-jr, one handed text entry. nuff said May 29 23:46:52 http://creativetech.inn.leedsmet.ac.uk/staff/rb/RBwearable.jpg May 29 23:47:06 'nuff said May 29 23:47:20 johnx: keyboard is fancy, but trackball? :D May 29 23:47:24 the flasher got stuck and my keyboard went dead. somehow the phone is still alive May 29 23:47:24 UGH May 29 23:47:30 brendans, hey, where'd you dig up the picture of me? May 29 23:47:50 bennypr0fane_, what did it say when it got stuck? May 29 23:47:53 lol, third hit on a google image search for "wearable computing" May 29 23:48:03 btw, who here has a Pandora already? May 29 23:48:16 luke-jr, mine is in the mail :) May 29 23:48:33 johnx: to me? May 29 23:48:36 it said: "sending cmt-algo image (507kB)" May 29 23:48:59 luke-jr, to my parents house I think May 29 23:49:04 or maybe somewhere in east asia May 29 23:49:07 I'm a little unclear May 29 23:49:47 im watching west wing again May 29 23:49:48 http://blogspace.exjoburger.com/treo_and_sharp.jpg May 29 23:49:50 love this show May 29 23:50:06 square icons, matrix, total iPhone ripoff May 29 23:50:29 wazd, and that button in the bottom center? yup. definitely a rip May 29 23:50:36 even has the multiple desktop thing going on May 29 23:50:42 johnx: I tell ya May 29 23:50:54 johnx: home button! May 29 23:51:02 iphones have multiple icons? May 29 23:51:09 I just pasted http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n8zBC2dvERM in another channel May 29 23:51:30 * GeneralAntilles sighs at all of the capacitive bullshit coming out of Nokia. May 29 23:51:35 it finished sending xloader img, secondary img, flashing bootloader, sending cmt-2nd img and got stuck while sending cmt-algo May 29 23:51:48 er May 29 23:51:49 wow. lucky lucky May 29 23:51:51 desktops May 29 23:51:54 oops May 29 23:52:02 speaking of which, is Pandora capacitive or resistive? May 29 23:52:08 resistive May 29 23:52:23 I guess bullshit would have a certain capacitance...hadn't really thought about it May 29 23:52:32 haha May 29 23:52:33 wonder if you could use it as an iphone stylus May 29 23:52:43 isnt pandora vaporware? May 29 23:53:01 Macer, yes. the pandora is the most elaborate vaporware scam ever May 29 23:53:02 :) May 29 23:53:07 haha May 29 23:53:08 Macer: no, it shipped May 29 23:53:17 luke-jr: liar May 29 23:53:19 :) May 29 23:53:21 they even sent some people real devices just to keep people believing May 29 23:53:25 Macer: johnx has a tracking code ;) May 29 23:53:32 hahahha May 29 23:53:32 nope. sending out real devices is part of the scam May 29 23:53:44 does anyone have an explanation for this? should i keep trying? May 29 23:53:51 * Macer is reminded of the touchbook May 29 23:53:53 ugh May 29 23:53:58 a piece of me dies May 29 23:54:02 also, as predicted, it sounds like there's no shortage ;) May 29 23:54:04 luke-jr, actually. I got a sent notification, but not tracking info May 29 23:54:14 noticed a number of "I just ordered and I'm #10xx" May 29 23:54:14 hahahahaha May 29 23:54:27 slightly random: I wish openmosix still worked with 2.6... I could offload work from my phone to my beagleboard wirelessly May 29 23:54:28 so if they're doing 4000, plenty of time to buy May 29 23:54:33 maybe the price will drop soon :p May 29 23:54:37 bennypr0fane_, uhm. if it died out once I'm a little worried about telling you to try again May 29 23:54:55 do you have another computer you could flash from? May 29 23:55:01 and just use the nokia gui flasher? May 29 23:55:04 not right here May 29 23:55:19 well, gdm starts correctly using vesa May 29 23:55:23 hm. isnt a pandora using the same ti hw as this n900? May 29 23:55:28 Macer: no May 29 23:55:29 except for those compiz effects :( May 29 23:55:34 similar, I think May 29 23:55:37 Macer, virtually the same May 29 23:55:38 but no computer with linux, however May 29 23:55:38 they're both OMAP3, but IIRC Pandora's is slightly better May 29 23:55:39 #IPv6 on the Nokia #N900 and #Facebook May 29 23:55:48 I think it's on the 3530 and the n900 is the 3430 May 29 23:55:55 #fuck #you #, #twitter May 29 23:56:00 bennypr0fane_, if your phone is booting again, you shouldn't need anything special May 29 23:56:12 i might try again on windows with nokia software updater May 29 23:56:17 ah.. awesome May 29 23:56:30 yeah. I'm worried that it's something about the USB hardware on your desktop though May 29 23:56:38 at this point, they've probably go the same 720 MHz chips the new rev beagleboards have though May 29 23:56:40 so is the next ota update going to actually be over the air? May 29 23:56:48 do you think you might have done anything to upset it during the flash? touched the USB cable? kicked the computer? May 29 23:56:52 they were calling 1.2 ota haha May 29 23:56:56 OMAP3430 - 600 MHz ARM Cortex A8 + PowerVR SGX 530 GPU + 430MHz C64x+ DSP + ISP (Image Signal Processor) May 29 23:56:59 OMAP3530 - 720 MHz ARM Cortex A8 + PowerVR SGX530 GPU + 520 MHz C64x+ DSP + ISP (Image Signal Processor) May 29 23:57:04 no, i kept all nice and quiet May 29 23:57:33 luke-jr: yeah, but only in the newer revs of the 3530... the earlier ones were at 500 or 600 MHz IIRC May 29 23:57:37 luke-jr, IIRC, also a difference in the packaging of the chip May 29 23:57:43 the wierd thing was that not only did the flasher get stuck, but the key board stopped responding May 29 23:57:46 e.g. beagleboard.org May 29 23:57:49 brendans, was it a change or just a re-rating? May 29 23:57:53 luke-jr: cant you just oc the 3430? May 29 23:57:56 mouse was still working May 29 23:57:56 :) May 29 23:58:01 Macer: OC is stupid May 29 23:58:01 bennypr0fane_, USB keyboard? May 29 23:58:05 yes May 29 23:58:21 didnt work for you? May 29 23:58:34 johnx: not sure on that aspect of it. I have a C4 beagleboard and it runs at 720 MHz, but I think the C3 was 600 MHz May 29 23:58:40 yeah, I wouldn't reflash your N900 from that computer May 29 23:58:42 something is up May 29 23:58:44 ive been running at 1GHz May 29 23:58:51 why? May 29 23:59:08 Macer: fail May 29 23:59:24 not really.. maybe in 2 years when the cpu melts May 29 23:59:29 bennypr0fane_, you had problems in windows. you have problems in linux. if your flash had died out 3 seconds earlier your N900 would have been bricked probably. why risk it? May 29 23:59:33 johnx: but my impression is that it was an upstream supplier thing... that may just be that they bought in to a higher quality bin May 29 23:59:36 but by then i will be getting an n910 May 29 23:59:51 ;) May 30 00:00:01 GAN900: "Providing both resistive and capacitive options for their customers is precluded neither by cost, technology, nor software requirements." Are you sure bout that? :) May 30 00:00:02 right. so i better get it to a service station, huh? May 30 00:00:08 * GeneralAntilles is feeding trolls on Talk. May 30 00:00:16 wazd, i.e., shipping two devices. May 30 00:00:18 brendans, yeah. for some reason I was under the impression that they retroactively re-rated the chips, but I couldn't tell you why I think that :) May 30 00:00:29 bennypr0fane_, or just reflash with a different computer May 30 00:00:42 johnx: do you feel it in your DNA? May 30 00:00:49 * tybollt is trying out meego but the installer says the 10GB partition I made for it is insufficient... hrrm :S May 30 00:00:52 (rearrange the letters to make a popular contract) May 30 00:00:54 johnx regardless of the os? May 30 00:00:55 GeneralAntilles: they should order two types of touchscreens and two assembly lines for that May 30 00:01:00 So, open source projects Nokia pushes: BlueZ, Mozilla, GTK, Qt, kernel, ConMan, oFono, Telepathy, GStreamer, … ? May 30 00:01:00 SpeedEvil, my sysadmin sense is tingling May 30 00:01:03 johnx: could be, I don't have any special info on it May 30 00:01:11 wazd, they already make both types of devices. May 30 00:01:11 brendans, me neither :) May 30 00:01:14 GeneralAntilles: and 2 types of software too May 30 00:01:19 bennypr0fane_, yes May 30 00:01:19 GeneralAntilles: kernel May 30 00:01:31 GeneralAntilles: but not two types of one device May 30 00:01:37 GeneralAntilles: that's different May 30 00:01:47 johnx: either way, it doesn't really make a ton of difference, there's a safe operating range, and it just produces more heat and uses more power at 720 MHz, I suspect May 30 00:01:49 Macer: 1 GHz, it'll probably fry in a few monhts May 30 00:01:51 wazd, yeah, but it means they wont be jettisoning large swaths of their market. May 30 00:02:00 luke-jr: maybe May 30 00:02:05 i will see May 30 00:02:05 The n900 back should just slide off May 30 00:02:09 GeneralAntilles: the main reason IMO is marketing. Capacitive = cool now May 30 00:02:10 huh, so i guess i sort of lucked out... May 30 00:02:12 wazd, if MeeGo is really going to be the flagship platform, then they can certainly afford to ship at least two devices. May 30 00:02:12 and leave you with a slim phone May 30 00:02:16 i can buy a new one ;) May 30 00:02:17 wazd, I agree 100%. May 30 00:02:26 macer: second that May 30 00:02:35 * shinkamui runs at 250-900mhz May 30 00:02:37 thanks for your help johnx, MohammadAG and everyone May 30 00:02:40 GeneralAntilles: and you won't prove anything to engadget or something May 30 00:02:47 Barring unexpected riches - I'm keeping my n900 for some years. May 30 00:02:47 bennypr0fane_, good luck May 30 00:02:50 wazd: ,capacitive,pinch zoom, May 30 00:03:00 and good night ;-) May 30 00:03:00 GeneralAntilles: brainwashing has done it's job very well May 30 00:03:01 wazd: I think it's easier (possible?) to do multitouch with capacitive, isn't it? May 30 00:03:14 brendans: today it's equal May 30 00:03:21 wazd, I have a couple of righteous emails from Ziegler in my inbox to prove that. ;) May 30 00:03:21 wazd: k May 30 00:03:32 No more open source projects? May 30 00:03:45 brendans: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bv3X5y-ajtc May 30 00:04:11 wazd: nice May 30 00:04:35 brendans: now the only advantage of cap. ts is durability May 30 00:04:55 because it works under glass/ceramic, I suppose May 30 00:05:01 hmmm May 30 00:05:11 brendans: you can't make glass resistive ts for example May 30 00:05:21 glass can crack.. May 30 00:05:24 wazd, hehe. May 30 00:05:31 wazd: makes sense May 30 00:05:33 wazd, you don't know how many cracked-screen iPhones I've seen. May 30 00:05:36 luke-jr: see gorilla glass demo :D May 30 00:05:49 http://www.engadget.com/2010/05/29/dell-streaks-gorilla-glass-screen-torture-tested-for-your-amus/ May 30 00:06:13 GeneralAntilles, haven't seen any at work, but maybe people just take care of them May 30 00:06:35 GeneralAntilles: well, you can crack resistive ts with ease too :) May 30 00:06:46 wazd, true enough. May 30 00:06:56 GeneralAntilles: but glass ts is still more scratch proof and stuff May 30 00:07:22 wazd: screen protector May 30 00:07:30 I want SAW with diamond glass coated face. May 30 00:07:42 my C760 still has its original screen protector May 30 00:07:46 luke-jr: well, you can use steel plate to cover it if you like :) May 30 00:07:50 honestly, though, that's because I can't figure out hwo to remove it :) May 30 00:07:58 not diamond afaik, it was ruby or something wasnt it SpeedEvil - they shot crossbow at it May 30 00:08:02 http://www.thomasnet.com/products/windows-barcode-scanner-71275358-1.html May 30 00:08:14 wazd: that made me think of the phrase, "But does it blend?" May 30 00:08:59 are we talking about diamond-covered ts now? May 30 00:09:01 :/ May 30 00:09:21 lcuk: corundum (ruby) is pretty hard... also much easier/cheaper to make than synthetic diamond; could very well be May 30 00:09:23 I suppose paired with diamond case, that would be pretty durable May 30 00:09:34 is synthetic diamond expensive? May 30 00:09:42 ceramic would be more than enough May 30 00:09:50 with sapphiere glass May 30 00:09:52 brendans: can ruby be non-red? :p May 30 00:09:54 http://www.blendtec.com/willitblend/videos.aspx?type=unsafe&video=ipad May 30 00:09:58 luke-jr: yes May 30 00:10:01 luke-jr: Well - no May 30 00:10:04 LOL May 30 00:10:14 shotting monitor with crossbow -> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AAdku9YhSCI&feature=player_embedded May 30 00:10:16 both materials almost impossible to scratch May 30 00:10:18 shooting too May 30 00:10:21 ruby and sapphire are both the same mineral, just different chemical inclusions May 30 00:10:24 luke-jr: But the fundamental materlial is identical for sapphire - blue, corundum - clear - and ruby - red May 30 00:10:34 i c May 30 00:10:50 how do all these things react to fingerprints? May 30 00:11:04 luke-jr: They burn off the prints from fingers that touch them. May 30 00:11:20 they have nano ridges that silently chop off the fingertips May 30 00:11:59 * GeneralAntilles would to see Nokia above Google in the LF membership page. May 30 00:12:50 http://www.faceters.com/rough/synthetics/corundum/ceylon_blue.shtml May 30 00:12:51 http://acejewelers.files.wordpress.com/2008/08/rado_152_0347_3_022_lores.jpg <- ceramic case, sapphiere glass, droolworthy :) May 30 00:13:06 I have some sapphire boule. May 30 00:13:16 for those interested, minor geology digression: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mohs_scale_of_mineral_hardness May 30 00:15:10 damn, someday I'll buy rado... May 30 00:15:21 ... or steal :) May 30 00:17:53 Damn May 30 00:18:03 iPhone 4G may be 960 x 640 IPS May 30 00:18:57 GeneralAntilles: overkill :) May 30 00:19:51 GeneralAntilles: still, that toshiba g800 had higher dpi I think May 30 00:20:12 g900* May 30 00:21:09 I think the high dpi will end up being more useful a few years from now if this 3D fad brings autostereoscopic displays May 30 00:21:18 no, iPhone's is slightly higher :) May 30 00:21:32 329 vs 313 May 30 00:21:40 the cheapest / easiest ways to do that involve halving the horizontal resolution for each eye... May 30 00:22:15 Many people cannot see autostereograms. May 30 00:22:18 Me, for example. May 30 00:23:07 SpeedEvil: Yeah, I'm not really all that sure I like the trend even if that wasn't an issue, but it's unlikely that everything is going to move that way May 30 00:23:29 anyway, Quisda pwns all with insane 1280x600 4" 353 DPI screen May 30 00:23:38 japaneese are crazy May 30 00:24:01 Ok guys lets petition May 30 00:24:27 Ok guys lets petition to have nokia install a "Meeeegooooo" start screen like SEGA had on the megadrives some years ago =) May 30 00:24:37 The 1280 x 1024 pixels display of QCM-330 measures 4 inches. The phone also features HSDPA, Wi-Fi, accelerometer and a 3MP camera. The handset has a home key which suggests that it might run Android – but we can’t confirm this yet. May 30 00:24:45 409 DPI May 30 00:24:51 O_o May 30 00:24:52 wazd: ... May 30 00:25:01 That's taking the fucking piss. May 30 00:25:14 I want a 1280*1024 12" display May 30 00:25:23 as it'd be a boost on my current DU May 30 00:25:46 DPI May 30 00:25:47 my old laptop had a 1400x1050 12" display (wacom based tablet PC too) May 30 00:25:48 SpeedEvil: in japan they have quad full HD in their 9" netbooks :D May 30 00:25:57 netbooks are stupid May 30 00:26:13 I want a decent small laptop May 30 00:26:32 SpeedEvil: terrible contrast though, particularly with a big chunk of plastic in front for the pen to work on May 30 00:26:39 I currently have an x60s - thinkpad 12" - and other than the 1024*768 screen, it's damn near perfect May 30 00:26:40 wazd at that dpi on a 12inch monitor it would be awesome May 30 00:26:52 but i doubt graphics cards can drive them properly still May 30 00:27:01 lcuk: I doubt it May 30 00:27:06 not normal level ones May 30 00:27:12 lcuk: You really can't see much beyond maybe 200dpi May 30 00:27:30 Or at least - the returns are very sharply dropping off - at 'normal' viewing distances May 30 00:27:30 sure, but the 96 or whatever on most large format displays May 30 00:27:31 heh May 30 00:27:38 yeah - 96 is silly May 30 00:27:43 96? May 30 00:27:47 I'm pretty sure mine is like 110 May 30 00:27:48 its ok if its distance from you May 30 00:27:53 but for a 12" slate or something May 30 00:28:09 * lcuk likes to lie on bed and draw stuff May 30 00:28:15 lcuk: yeah May 30 00:28:25 they have 4" phone with higher resolution than 9" iPad May 30 00:28:29 I need a drink May 30 00:28:35 hmm May 30 00:28:40 X says it's 96x96 DPI May 30 00:28:48 lcuk: yeah, I used mine for notetaking a lot too... May 30 00:28:48 so either I recall wrong, or my X is misconfigured :( May 30 00:28:51 * SpeedEvil blends an ipad, and adds coke. May 30 00:28:59 if you lie to x standard apps fail May 30 00:29:02 * SpeedEvil passes wazd his drink. May 30 00:29:07 no luke-jr you arent recalling wrong May 30 00:29:29 X always says it's 96x96 though; strange things happen if you correct it May 30 00:29:33 err - no May 30 00:29:36 its just people designing for number of dots rather than dpi May 30 00:29:50 screen #0: May 30 00:29:51 print screen: no May 30 00:29:51 dimensions: 1024x768 pixels (246x185 millimeters) May 30 00:29:51 resolution: 106x105 dots per inch May 30 00:30:01 huh May 30 00:30:03 I stand corrected May 30 00:30:05 mine used to report right May 30 00:30:08 SpeedEvil, at n900 scale the differences become apparantly May 30 00:30:13 -lt May 30 00:30:14 -ly May 30 00:30:15 does mymenu work with 1.2? May 30 00:30:16 If you paypal me $2, I will even get out of bed, and measure it to see if that's right May 30 00:30:17 * lcuk gives up May 30 00:30:20 I think I have 21" widescreen monitor May 30 00:30:38 1680x1050 May 30 00:30:42 anyone care to do the math? May 30 00:30:45 are widescreen monitors cheaper for the companies to make May 30 00:30:49 lcuk: I'm unsure I can tell the diffference between 800*480 and 640*400 though. May 30 00:30:52 lcuk: On text May 30 00:30:57 SpeedEvil, sure May 30 00:30:58 lcuk: reportedly, yes. May 30 00:30:59 luke-jr: http://theile.net/~sven/dpi.html May 30 00:31:07 but between 96 and 215 or 235 May 30 00:31:15 lcuk: the price is set by the minimum dimension of the screen May 30 00:31:26 lcuk: the price of the fabrication line that is May 30 00:31:31 lcuk: widescreen is easier for humans IMO May 30 00:31:36 once you get to a certain height May 30 00:31:43 I want 4:3 May 30 00:31:43 easier to look left/right than up/down May 30 00:31:51 I have a 20" 4:3 monitor. May 30 00:31:56 It is not tall enough May 30 00:32:02 yeah but a lot of the widescreens have < pixels than average was heading May 30 00:32:18 luke-jr: yeah, I tried to use my 21.5" LCD in portrait mode May 30 00:32:21 lol luke-jr i have a stack of screens May 30 00:32:24 luke-jr: that's weird :D May 30 00:32:29 To get to the equivalent of - say - a 24" 4:3 monitor - you need a _stupidly_ wide display May 30 00:32:37 big monitor sat ontop of laptop screen May 30 00:32:38 Also - widescreen fails in portrait mode. May 30 00:32:52 SpeedEvil: not quite May 30 00:32:56 it doesnt fail May 30 00:33:00 hm, my ruler says it's 20" diagonal May 30 00:33:04 depending on task it works well May 30 00:33:08 so 99 DPI May 30 00:33:11 I actually want something like a 28" 1:1 monitor May 30 00:33:11 SpeedEvil: PDF reading / layout creating is cool May 30 00:33:16 it's particularly bad when you're working with software that's designed for old workstations (often 1600x1200) May 30 00:33:46 So I can watch a widescreen movie in the bottom, full width, and have some usable display area left May 30 00:33:52 big, multi-level vertical menus, etc. May 30 00:33:53 jeees 1600*1200 was the bizniz before all these wide jobbies hit May 30 00:34:27 we havent actually increased max res a whole lot in last few years have we May 30 00:34:36 its like cpus getting slower now May 30 00:34:38 And DPI not at all May 30 00:34:52 lcuk: yeah, you can still get decent ones last I checked; I've got a Dell 20" IPS in my office that runs 1600x1200 May 30 00:34:57 2007FP or something like that May 30 00:35:13 brendans: >20" in 4:3 is basically unavailable though May 30 00:35:18 Which is annoying May 30 00:35:23 well my 23" is 1920*1080 May 30 00:35:28 and the remaining lines are dying. May 30 00:35:33 but i would still prefer 16*12 May 30 00:35:45 SpeedEvil: yeah, it's tough at >20", and they aren't cheap May 30 00:36:11 !! ahhh that would explain the widescreen fetish May 30 00:36:18 merging the assembly lines with regular tvs May 30 00:36:20 even the 20" ones aren't cheap (though they usually are decent panels at least) May 30 00:36:53 SpeedEvil, at a glance I probably can't. May 30 00:37:00 SpeedEvil, but I can when I'm reading for a couple of hours. May 30 00:37:03 i have a 22" S-PVA 1920x1200 at home May 30 00:37:24 quite a nice screen, but it was quite expensive May 30 00:37:47 http://www.xkcd.com/732/ May 30 00:37:57 GeneralAntilles: At some point you just can't tell when AA is on or off May 30 00:38:06 GeneralAntilles: that's probably where the limit kicks in May 30 00:38:06 brendans: yes, we know. May 30 00:38:11 arachnist: now you can tell me where you live and when you're not at home :P May 30 00:38:29 arachnist: lol, fair enough May 30 00:38:42 SpeedEvil, and that's a good place to be. May 30 00:38:45 brendans: and i'd also like to have a >200ppi >22" screen May 30 00:38:53 you would have to find a mechanism to deliver 3gazzilion pixels per frame May 30 00:39:06 wazd: not home... right now May 30 00:39:22 GeneralAntilles: Sure - But going higher than that doesn't buy you much May 30 00:41:21 part of me wonders if this move towards auxiliary displays is going to slow things down again (e.g. pico projectors, etc.) since it's going to mean graphics hardware tied up in other tasks May 30 00:41:35 assuming it's not a clone, of course May 30 00:46:47 hi, how to get korean virtual keyboard, and more options to switch language? May 30 00:46:59 O.o May 30 00:47:03 Korean is cool May 30 00:47:46 there are only 2 options for language switching is there a way to add more? May 30 00:49:14 talk.maemo.org does not work for me :( May 30 00:51:19 good morning May 30 00:51:33 only asian language really supported at the moment is chinese May 30 00:52:20 microlith: is there an input method for chinese? May 30 00:52:49 sobczyk: iirc, there's a free one in the repositories and there's one only available on HK edition N900s May 30 00:53:33 johnx: [19:50:04] luke-jr: with the game controls being a keyboard / mouse on kernel level and not a joystick like you'd expect, this is anything but a gaming device - also with rubbish shoulder buttons and rather bad nubs[19:50:04] luke-jr: with the game controls being a keyboard / mouse on kernel level and not a joystick like you'd expect, this is anything but a gaming device - also with rubbish shoulder May 30 00:53:35 buttons and rather bad nubs May 30 00:54:05 greetings all May 30 00:54:29 luke-jr, ok May 30 00:55:37 later all May 30 01:04:09 Has anyone had problems installing gnuplot? May 30 01:04:22 Adding `diversion of /opt/maemo/usr/bin/gnuplot to /opt/maemo/usr/bin/gnuplot-nox by gnuplot-x11' May 30 01:04:22 dpkg-divert: rename involves overwriting `/opt/maemo/usr/bin/gnuplot-nox' with May 30 01:04:22 different file `/opt/maemo/usr/bin/gnuplot', not allowed May 30 01:12:48 doh, i wish there's a way to undo a merge contact May 30 01:26:18 hello everyone May 30 01:30:25 * pigeon grrs at no new ovi store... :( May 30 01:31:22 pigeon: restore contacts from backup :P May 30 01:31:44 greetings May 30 01:32:01 cehteh: too late ;) May 30 01:33:11 i also wish it would ask me to choose which avatar to use for a contact merge May 30 01:33:58 what is the password for sdk meamo's user login ? May 30 01:34:06 I have a n N800 running Diablo what are my choices to get a more current environment running on it? May 30 01:34:52 unohu62, you can wait for MeeGo on n8x0 to be ready? May 30 01:35:12 or hell freezing over May 30 01:35:13 are there any examples of hildon input method? (working source code) ? May 30 01:35:25 anybody running meego on it now? May 30 01:35:30 unohu62, or some people are using Gentoo on n8x0. You could run Ubuntu or Debian. May 30 01:35:44 yeah debian .. or how about mer? May 30 01:36:25 is mer being depreciated in favour of meego? May 30 01:36:40 cehteh, personally, I wouldn't recommend Mer. Its a great project etc. - but I could never get mine to connect to the internet. So... maybe just me, but not useful for others if it can't May 30 01:36:55 Mind you, I was trying with Bluetooth May 30 01:36:57 i never tried, and i only have a n900 May 30 01:37:22 unohu62, yes - Mer efforts are now going into MeeGo May 30 01:37:47 considering the memory and resource limitations you prolly happy to have an old rusty distro on the n8x0 May 30 01:38:33 cehteh, I think you'll find MeeGo will run fine on n8x0, even with its "memory and resource limitations" May 30 01:38:35 what runs the best on the N800 now? May 30 01:38:36 well and n8x0 still needs the fucked up nokia kernel or? May 30 01:39:05 cehteh, or... no? Several people including luke-jr and myself have made an effort to get a working .33 kernel May 30 01:39:22 and got it working? May 30 01:39:33 cehteh, mostly yes May 30 01:39:41 asi saied i dont have the device May 30 01:40:25 ok just than dman azerty and qwerty keyboard May 30 01:48:16 Termana: mostly no -.- May 30 01:54:51 is it possible to run fremantle in VM ? May 30 01:55:28 I want to test apps before to install into n900 May 30 01:55:56 to check how an application looks like May 30 01:56:47 cehteh, or... no? Several people including luke-jr and myself have made an effort to get a working .33 kernel May 30 01:56:50 O_O May 30 01:56:53 what doesn't work? May 30 01:58:34 LiraNuna: GPS, at least May 30 01:58:36 LiraNuna, well, power management is a little shotty, and GPS is not there May 30 01:58:58 LiraNuna: and what does "work" is far from suitable for mainline merging May 30 01:59:16 I see May 30 01:59:28 because some people *cough* Termana *cough* can't bother to use git properly May 30 01:59:33 <.< May 30 01:59:39 will GPS "ever" work? May 30 01:59:39 *rolls eyes* May 30 01:59:51 luke-jr, I'm working on it, I'm working on it :P May 30 01:59:52 LiraNuna: unlikely unless Nokia releases some code May 30 01:59:54 i.e, are there efforts to RE/aquire kernel? May 30 01:59:59 +driver* May 30 02:00:14 LiraNuna: Stskeeps has NDA'd code. No idea how much time he will spend on it. May 30 02:00:30 I imagine he'll get it "working" to the extent it did with the Diablo kernel May 30 02:00:30 oh wow May 30 02:00:51 in Stskeeps we trust May 30 02:00:53 but debugging all the glitches it had even then are probably not going to happen May 30 02:01:00 unless Nokia actually releases the code May 30 02:01:08 or I manage to reverse engineer enough of it May 30 02:01:11 and someone reimplements it May 30 02:01:33 Is GPS really that big of a deal anyway? :P May 30 02:01:41 currently, I am hand decompiling a function that both parses the GPS packet and sets lat/lon internally May 30 02:01:50 Termana: GPS is pretty much why I bought a N810 May 30 02:02:41 well, not the ONLY reason, but a KEY one May 30 02:02:53 is the GPS chip on N8x0 the same as N900's? May 30 02:02:55 no May 30 02:03:03 or at least, if it is, it's interfaced differently May 30 02:03:12 N900's GPS is connected to the modem May 30 02:03:18 ah May 30 02:03:19 N810 has no modem, so the GPS is connected to the system May 30 02:03:35 in the N810, the system does all the GPS calculations May 30 02:04:01 luke-jr, why not just use the .21 kernel for your purposes then? Your only running Gentoo anyway... May 30 02:04:08 the changelog hints at some HyPE library May 30 02:04:12 but I can't find anything on Google May 30 02:04:19 Termana: "only" May 30 02:04:24 Termana: because 128 MB RAM is too little for KDE May 30 02:04:29 2.6.33 has ramzswap May 30 02:04:34 also, cx3110x doesn't support PPI May 30 02:04:36 p54spi does May 30 02:04:46 p54spi also lets me run kismet while I'm connected to my AP May 30 02:04:58 cx3110x is? May 30 02:05:05 cx3110x is the blob wifi driver in Diablo May 30 02:05:08 ah May 30 02:05:15 p54spi is the OSS one May 30 02:05:18 p54spi is the mainline implementation included in 2.6.33 May 30 02:05:59 how does p54spi performs in terms of power management? May 30 02:06:04 perform* May 30 02:06:09 no clue May 30 02:06:19 hi i want to replace the digitizer on my n900. found one on ebay May 30 02:06:20 my N810 won't charge its battery May 30 02:06:23 unless I boot Maemo May 30 02:06:41 is it easy to do? May 30 02:06:51 skynets: the what? May 30 02:06:55 there was a forum thread about that May 30 02:07:01 luke-jr, the touch screen layer May 30 02:07:25 its scratched May 30 02:07:46 5$2 May 30 02:07:48 $52 May 30 02:08:07 for only 7 times that, you could get a new Pandora! :p May 30 02:08:24 pandora has no 3G May 30 02:08:25 sadly May 30 02:08:32 shrug May 30 02:08:35 3G is useless to me May 30 02:08:50 it's the main reason I got N900 May 30 02:08:53 even if I could afford the ridiculous prices, they don't have coverage where I am May 30 02:09:00 Also, luke-jr owns an iPad May 30 02:09:04 Termana: liar May 30 02:09:05 first I got N810WE because it was promised that SF will get WiMAX in 2009 May 30 02:09:14 Termana: now you need to buy me one to make it true May 30 02:09:16 pandora needs a slim card slot otherwise its just another useless game console that takes space in my pockets May 30 02:09:24 so I now got both N810WE and N900 May 30 02:09:26 luke-jr, are you saying you WANT one? :P May 30 02:09:32 skynets: slim card? May 30 02:09:36 sim* May 30 02:09:42 Termana: I'll take anything for free. won't run Apple s/w tho May 30 02:09:44 pandora is a failure May 30 02:09:54 it wont be released by 2011 May 30 02:10:02 skynets: it's already shipping May 30 02:10:12 johnx's Pandora is in the mail May 30 02:10:22 when where how? May 30 02:10:22 luke-jr, there is no Linux running on the iPad :P yet anyhow May 30 02:10:32 Termana: so maybe I'll be the first May 30 02:10:32 finally May 30 02:10:36 hypePad May 30 02:10:47 luke-jr, right, just after I get the iPad in the mail May 30 02:10:51 :P May 30 02:11:17 Termana: I'd gladly take a WePad instead May 30 02:11:24 you can call your lie a typo May 30 02:11:26 :D May 30 02:11:34 :D May 30 02:11:44 luke-jr, I thought you weren't a fan of Android May 30 02:11:47 nope May 30 02:11:51 won't run its shipped OS either May 30 02:11:53 :p May 30 02:12:16 no matter what I get, it's pretty inevitable I'll put Gentoo on it XD May 30 02:12:34 luke-jr, can you imagine that situation. People surrounding you having Android on theirs and people having their iPad May 30 02:12:40 and you say "I'm running Gentoo" May 30 02:12:45 exactly? May 30 02:12:46 * Termana bird sounds May 30 02:12:54 peer pressure scares me away May 30 02:12:55 *bird sounds* * May 30 02:13:16 heh .. if you want to be l33t intall nixos May 30 02:13:30 I don't May 30 02:13:38 I know how to use Gentoo May 30 02:13:49 luke-jr is secretly a BSD fan May 30 02:14:01 maybe May 30 02:14:07 haha .. how about hurd on the n8x0? May 30 02:14:09 GNU/k*BSD May 30 02:14:15 cehteh: as if May 30 02:14:21 Richard Stallman will turn over in his grave! (err... when he gets there) May 30 02:14:49 * LiraNuna confused May 30 02:14:51 Stallman won't care in his grave May 30 02:14:54 BSD is rather lack luster in the ARM support department May 30 02:15:37 Compared to x86, pretty much everything is. May 30 02:15:51 Which is too bad, I really would like to have BSD running just for shits and giggles May 30 02:16:31 luke-jr, in .33, everything is functional? (aside of GPS) May 30 02:16:38 bluetooth, sound? May 30 02:16:39 LiraNuna: doubt it May 30 02:16:43 not sound May 30 02:16:53 p54spi has some bugs still May 30 02:16:59 you can be happy when it doesnt fry the cpu May 30 02:17:16 no clue on Bluetooth May 30 02:17:20 I don't use BT May 30 02:17:20 LiraNuna, bluetooth works... that was my nice hackish job - you only have a single bluetooth address for every n8x0 out there using .33 May 30 02:17:34 how can you support maemo and hate android... sounds like you're too biased :P May 30 02:17:38 Termana: can you set it from userspace? May 30 02:17:43 skynets: I hate Maemo too May 30 02:18:18 luke-jr, I don't think so. I never got it to load the firmware properly and left my address hardcoded May 30 02:18:29 LiraNuna: http://elinux.org/N800 May 30 02:18:50 hey put android on the n8x0 .. that will be slow like molasses and shocking to the nokianigans May 30 02:18:59 cehteh: #NITdroid May 30 02:19:12 cehteh, n8x0 does run Android, and it runs fine, not slow. May 30 02:19:13 ^ May 30 02:19:26 The nerve of preassumptions :\ May 30 02:20:22 http://cgi.ebay.ca/DIGITIZER-LCD-Touch-Screens-lens-for-nokia-N900-N-900_W0QQitemZ170462944386QQcmdZViewItemQQptZPDA_Accessories?hash=item27b0621c82#ht_2208wt_911 May 30 02:20:26 hehe ok May 30 02:20:27 should i order this May 30 02:21:46 do you need it? May 30 02:21:49 yes May 30 02:21:51 well May 30 02:22:02 no but the scratches are so annoying May 30 02:22:22 no screen protector? May 30 02:22:42 ive learnt my lesson May 30 02:22:52 :> May 30 02:23:02 didnt know the screen was so cheap May 30 02:23:27 resistive screen must have a plastic front to sense pressure May 30 02:24:01 im gonna change the digitizer, the whole body and sell it for 500 bucks May 30 02:24:04 get rid of that shit May 30 02:24:13 heh May 30 02:24:13 lol May 30 02:24:34 im not going back to nokia again May 30 02:24:36 who will pay 500$ for a used one? May 30 02:24:46 500 cdn May 30 02:24:49 they dont sell them here May 30 02:24:56 hope it happens before the iphone comes out May 30 02:24:57 how much is that in euro? May 30 02:25:16 in europe its overpriced and still you get it for 480Eur May 30 02:25:23 387 euro May 30 02:25:39 i've had mine for many months and dont have scratches May 30 02:25:48 386.6378 EUR May 30 02:25:49 yeah May 30 02:25:52 depends how you handle it May 30 02:26:03 its not just that May 30 02:26:33 the OS had bad support in general. its pretty much a nerd phone. May 30 02:26:38 mine is almost always in a protective case and has a screen protector since i unpacked it May 30 02:26:53 nokia figured out that the community could support the phone May 30 02:26:57 well .. you should have known that before you ordered it May 30 02:27:12 man, i just throw mine around since it isnt really mine :) May 30 02:27:18 cehteh, you're right, but their ads showed different phone May 30 02:27:18 skynets: which we can't, since Nokia won't open it May 30 02:27:19 well nokia forgot/doesnt support that well enough May 30 02:27:37 Nokia seems good at false advertising :/ May 30 02:27:53 luke-jr, out of interest which are you a fan of - resistive or capacitive? May 30 02:27:59 resistive May 30 02:28:04 cehteh check this May 30 02:28:04 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kYnx0PUX7Do May 30 02:28:08 iphone ads dont show that you have to kiss steve jobs ass, wipe it after that, cant exchange the batteries and getting locked into a expensive contract May 30 02:28:09 it's what i thought it was May 30 02:28:13 never trust ads May 30 02:28:27 cehteh i trusted nokia... owned a n95. May 30 02:28:33 at the time it was the shit May 30 02:28:44 well i am moderately happy with the n900 May 30 02:28:59 so far for me the only alternative would be not to have such a toy May 30 02:29:20 cehteh have you seen the droid shadow May 30 02:29:26 leaked specs May 30 02:29:40 i dont want droid May 30 02:30:03 I wish companies just stuck to hardware May 30 02:30:09 i want some native os where i can easily port existing apps too May 30 02:30:20 then other companies could buy the hardware and write software May 30 02:30:25 and brand the final product May 30 02:30:26 luke-jr: ack! ... and open the specs May 30 02:30:31 cehteh: obviously May 30 02:30:34 android has a bright future May 30 02:30:44 cool to be part of it May 30 02:30:49 Android sucks May 30 02:30:50 skynets: i dont care about future May 30 02:30:58 what does it give to me? May 30 02:30:59 skynets: Android was just kicked out of Linux basically May 30 02:31:24 i want something what i can use for what i like *now* May 30 02:31:31 cehteh: that's what Android is May 30 02:31:33 what do you like May 30 02:31:36 hacks to make it work *now* May 30 02:31:44 skynets: I don't like anything. I use Gentoo. May 30 02:31:50 lol May 30 02:32:04 no emacs on android :) May 30 02:32:26 with KDE May 30 02:32:34 gentoo... if i was into that i would still bed a virgin :P May 30 02:32:38 be* May 30 02:32:45 I'm married w/ 4 kids May 30 02:33:03 marriage with an os doesnt count :/ May 30 02:33:23 luke-jr, good for you May 30 02:33:24 hmm May 30 02:33:45 luke-jr, Android drivers just got kicked out of mainline, but now its going the other way May 30 02:34:07 luke-jr, wakelocks got in as well (they are called suspend blockers now) May 30 02:34:20 luke-jr, what do u think of ubuntu May 30 02:34:26 2.6.34 appears to have merged USB, MMC, and Menelaus for N8x0 May 30 02:34:42 skynets: GNOME sucks May 30 02:34:50 lol May 30 02:35:02 cant you install kde May 30 02:35:08 then it's called Kubuntu May 30 02:35:26 Also skynets can use normal Linux apps on Android if he buys a Droid Shadow anyway May 30 02:35:33 Little something called chroot May 30 02:35:57 nice May 30 02:36:06 i wonder who will buy my n900 May 30 02:36:13 with the iphone coming soon May 30 02:37:15 You can run Debian alongside Android by chrooting into Debian on your SD card May 30 02:37:15 iPhone sucks more May 30 02:37:22 i think there is no much overlap in potential customers May 30 02:38:08 even if the n900 would have turned out utterly crap i would never consider a iphone and all people i know who have n900 think the same May 30 02:38:44 The iPhone runs a unix base. You can also run Linux on the 2G and 3G May 30 02:38:52 +1 for iphone is crap May 30 02:38:55 Just sayin May 30 02:39:05 you should rather fear the next nokia meego device, but nothing really seen yet May 30 02:39:17 iphone doesn't run a unix base, it runs a hybrid base May 30 02:39:17 fear? May 30 02:39:34 why should I fear something I'm likely to buy? May 30 02:39:50 ive learnt 1 thing... never buy a product when it just comes out May 30 02:39:52 Termana: there's nothing unix about iPhone May 30 02:39:54 especially phones May 30 02:39:58 the iphone hardware is not that great compared to the n900 in features May 30 02:40:08 skynets, so pre-ordering games is bad? :D May 30 02:40:15 pre-ordering is stupid May 30 02:40:19 except starcraft May 30 02:40:21 2 May 30 02:40:24 lol May 30 02:40:26 luke-jr, you poor linux brainwashed soul. May 30 02:40:28 and there's nothing good about buying a hardware with the founder being agnostic in its approaches to its `app marketplace' and `leaked iphone' May 30 02:40:48 Termana: you're just brainwashed by the "OS X is FreeBSD" myth May 30 02:40:56 like the pandora for example May 30 02:41:02 ppl have been waiting for months :P May 30 02:41:09 promised so many times May 30 02:41:13 I'm not saying I'm in favour of the iPhone May 30 02:41:16 theyre still not shipped May 30 02:41:30 Though I do like some of the games that are iPhone exclusive May 30 02:41:31 you jump in the boat and can't get out May 30 02:41:32 :P May 30 02:41:47 skynets: but they ARE shipped May 30 02:42:14 * LiraNuna would love it if he could run maemo on a Motorola Droid May 30 02:42:29 luke-jr, i checked and it's not confirmed yet :P maybe for some ppl but most haven't even been built yet (based on the status in the site) May 30 02:42:54 LiraNuna, wtf lol May 30 02:42:56 LiraNuna, you COULD, potentially. May 30 02:43:01 I know May 30 02:43:10 I think the Droid has better hardware design May 30 02:43:12 By why bother really, I mean the Droid is just like the n900 :P May 30 02:43:19 especially the keyboard May 30 02:43:32 I don't like the N900's keyboard much May 30 02:44:21 the N810's keyboard was perfect May 30 02:45:00 the droid/milestone has a shitty keyboard May 30 02:45:20 The Droid 2 is coming with the same kind of keyboard as the n900 May 30 02:45:28 Termana, I've noticed :\ May 30 02:46:38 Termana: you won't be able to get the droid 2 without agreeing to a 2 year contract though May 30 02:46:53 so? May 30 02:47:02 if you're going to have it 2 years, why not May 30 02:47:35 microlith, I won't be able to get the Droid 2 anyway - I'm not in the US. We dumped normal EV-DO in Australia May 30 02:47:50 Termana: well, whatever they call the GSM version May 30 02:48:10 microlith, if there is a GSM version, they will probably lock it down in the same fashion as the Milestone May 30 02:48:26 Termana: thusly why I don't really give a damn about motorola hardware May 30 02:50:31 was the motorola milestone really locked down? May 30 02:51:09 it had some features, at least the european version, that the droid lacked (at least initially), like multitouch May 30 02:51:16 it was, I think an update that disabled the lockout May 30 02:51:26 all non-Milestone/Droid devices are locked down hard though May 30 02:51:31 arachnist, yes, in contrast to the Droid, they used the OMAP3's TPM to sign everything May 30 02:51:45 except the system partition May 30 02:51:45 ouch May 30 02:52:00 That means, no changing the kernel for instance, which is possible on the Droid May 30 02:52:37 This locked out overclockers, until they found a sneaky way to make a kernel module do their dirty work for them May 30 02:53:58 way to violate the GPL May 30 02:54:06 arachnist, but as microlith said, mostly all other device are locked down too. The Nexus One is the exception to the rule since you can unlock its bootloader May 30 02:54:14 luke-jr: only if it's GPLv3 May 30 02:54:16 luke-jr, the kernel is still on GPL2 May 30 02:54:18 microlith: nope May 30 02:54:24 GPLv2 is even stricter than GPLv3 in that area May 30 02:54:26 no May 30 02:54:30 it's TIVOization May 30 02:54:32 GPLv3 just adds an exception for unnecessary keys May 30 02:54:36 which is why the GPLv3 May 30 02:54:41 with GPLv2, the keys are ALWAYS considered source code May 30 02:54:50 no May 30 02:54:52 yes May 30 02:54:57 if that was true they'd have had a case for years May 30 02:55:01 they do May 30 02:55:07 Linux developers just refuse to sue May 30 02:55:10 oh right, the FSF can't sue May 30 02:55:19 luke-jr, I think you'll find GPLv2 was found unenforceable in regards to Tivoisation, which is why GPLv3 came around May 30 02:55:21 since if anyone did people would flock away from linux May 30 02:55:34 Termana: I'm not aware of it going to any courts May 30 02:55:55 I suppose that's a big part of why there's no GNU in Android May 30 02:56:01 anyone know where 2.6.35 is being put together? May 30 02:56:08 or does that not even start until 2.6.34 is released? May 30 02:56:16 it doesn't start until .34 is released May 30 02:56:19 lame May 30 02:56:23 are you not on LKML? May 30 02:56:30 I hope not May 30 02:56:31 too spammy May 30 02:56:43 that's what filters are for! May 30 02:57:12 microlith, theres no GNU is Android because they wanted to have the whole thing licensed under the Apache license in order to allow proprietary code May 30 02:57:23 Also .34 has been released already May 30 02:57:26 Termana: minus the kernel? May 30 02:57:35 luke-jr, right, minus the kernel. May 30 02:57:36 Termana: what?? it's not tagged in Linus' tree May 30 02:58:05 luke-jr, do you need a mential institution? May 30 02:58:21 ... May 30 02:58:23 http://git.kernel.org/?p=linux/kernel/git/torvalds/linux-2.6.git;a=summary May 30 02:58:31 Look in the tags May 30 02:58:50 "13 days ago v2.6.34 Linux 2.6.34 tag | commit | shortlog | log" May 30 02:59:19 .35 work has already started May 30 02:59:29 * luke-jr stabs git **** ENDING LOGGING AT Sun May 30 02:59:56 2010