**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Tue Jun 08 02:59:56 2010 Jun 08 04:14:07 anybody else having problems with skype continously reconnecting when the wifi power save is set to high? Jun 08 04:15:13 known issue Jun 08 04:15:26 :( Jun 08 04:15:46 rumour has it it depends on your particular AP Jun 08 04:16:19 Pretty sure thats the case since I have no problems in my school Jun 08 04:16:22 tcpdump it Jun 08 04:16:50 swc|666: won't help. That's protocol layer Jun 08 04:17:08 what's protocol layer Jun 08 04:17:10 beacons and shit Jun 08 04:17:53 hmm Jun 08 04:18:19 still a pcap would be my first instinct ;) Jun 08 04:18:35 in monitor mode yes Jun 08 04:18:46 maybe Jun 08 04:19:38 Dassu, insall tcpdump and upload the cap file Jun 08 04:19:56 but then you won't see the same behavior when you put N900 wifi into monitor mode :-P Jun 08 04:20:54 you'd need to listen to the OTA with a separate protocol device, so N900 goes to powersave mode Jun 08 04:21:11 which in monitor it obviously doesn't Jun 08 04:21:32 dump it from the AP Jun 08 04:21:48 that's a valid way, if AP can do that Jun 08 04:22:05 openWRT probably can Jun 08 04:22:23 it can Jun 08 04:22:32 but then openWRT probably also has no problems with N900 PSM Jun 08 04:23:35 Dassu, when you say itpower save was set to high, you meant high powersave or vice versa? Jun 08 04:23:43 nah, you'll have to use your laptop, and a wifi dongle with monitor mode supported, and then start ethereal Jun 08 04:23:51 s/itpower/power Jun 08 04:24:56 there's a few ways to debug it Jun 08 04:25:41 no idea what he means about the continous reconnecting though, haven't seen the bug report Jun 08 04:29:20 maybe the wlan kernel driver has a debug parameter? Jun 08 04:29:36 swc|666: powersave yes Jun 08 04:30:16 wl12{xx,51} is ugly Jun 08 04:30:28 swc|666: this started happening to me after PR 1.2 but skype was already unusable before it. (The calls would stutter) Jun 08 04:30:45 hence i'm contracting a driver dev for packet injection Jun 08 04:30:46 However with powersave set to medium or low would fix the problem Jun 08 04:32:18 * swc|666 has 2 spare batteries and doesnt believe in saving power Jun 08 04:34:37 DocScrutinizer, ah now i put 2+2 together Jun 08 04:34:42 = joerg Jun 08 04:34:44 :) Jun 08 04:35:30 maybe the wlan kernel driver has a debug parameter? Jun 08 04:35:34 though I guess even that woulldn't help much. Probably on powersave active N900 just ignores queries from AP which results in AP disconnecting the client Jun 08 04:35:37 this won't show up directlyin a kernel driver log Jun 08 04:38:05 you could spot easily though when e.g. dissecting a airodump full packet trace, done from a 3rd machine Jun 08 04:38:14 there are debug params Jun 08 04:38:35 DocScrutinizer51: I don't buy that Jun 08 04:39:00 asj: what exactly? Jun 08 04:39:36 DocScrutinizer51: the AP knows the station is doing power-save poll and won't wake up till a beacon goes out with data waiting set Jun 08 04:40:02 (and can ignore many beacons) Jun 08 04:40:15 hmm. on sane AP for sure Jun 08 04:40:24 keyword = sane Jun 08 04:40:27 DocScrutinizer51: there are no sane APs Jun 08 04:40:42 heh Jun 08 04:41:19 well, maybe it's all muuuuuuch more complex and nasty. WLAN is a bitch Jun 08 04:43:53 but basically you got exactly 2 vectors to tackle it: either compare all parameters of a working and a borked AP. Or analyze the tarffic between N900 an borked AP Jun 08 04:45:04 1. is the easy way, 2nd should always solve the problem Jun 08 04:45:17 i vote for traf analysis Jun 08 04:45:58 although i have to say, wl1251 has been nice for me on eap-ttls Jun 08 04:46:20 sometimes i have to rmmod/modprobe the driver after a couple of days though Jun 08 04:47:04 kvalo is a nice guy and all, but i think wl12xx was a "rush job" Jun 08 04:47:30 hence there are other issues with it Jun 08 04:57:35 'evening Jun 08 04:58:10 morn Jun 08 04:59:28 One of our N900s was acting flaky the other night, and now it seems fine :/ Jun 08 04:59:48 It /would/ figure that as soon as we ask Nokia about it, it starts working agin. Jun 08 04:59:51 s/agin/again/ Jun 08 04:59:52 jaem meant: It /would/ figure that as soon as we ask Nokia about it, it starts working again. Jun 08 05:00:23 Has anyone else had random un/locking or booting happen when applying pressure on the left side of the bezel? Jun 08 05:01:13 Since we got it from the local office, they'll take care of it, but I can't prove it's broken. Heh. Jun 08 05:07:21 shouldn't Jun 08 05:08:13 tbh sounds like a severe hw bug Jun 08 05:11:31 jaem: hw is sneaky, it never exhibits symptoms when you are ready to do away with it Jun 08 05:14:47 RST38h, Heh, yeah. Jun 08 05:14:55 It didn't act up before that, either, which is odd. Jun 08 05:15:04 I don't know where exactly it came from, though... Jun 08 05:15:19 carry a ritual screwdriver when around it! Jun 08 05:15:28 It's a retail unit, given to us by the local office, with a stupid European plug. Jun 08 05:15:39 RST38h, any suggestions on brand? ;) Jun 08 05:17:08 european pugs are NOT stupid >:-( Jun 08 05:17:50 torx T6 always looks megacool Jun 08 05:18:54 DocScrutinizer51, Who would design a plug that needs an adaptor to fit into a socket? They're /obviously/ crazy. ;) Jun 08 05:19:36 :-P it only fits into smart sockets Jun 08 05:20:15 DocScrutinizer51, Torx are fun... but then there are those other ones... "torK" or some such, which look similar, but aren't. Jun 08 05:20:18 Heh. Jun 08 05:21:22 jaem: no specific brand preferences, but of course it has to be made of titanium =0 Jun 08 05:22:05 * RST38h prefers European plugs. US/japan ones are too flimsy, and the UK one looks like it has been made for electric chairs Jun 08 05:25:17 RST38h: ack Jun 08 05:26:43 japan's are worse Jun 08 05:26:47 they rarely have ground pins :/ Jun 08 05:27:15 taiwan same: US w/o PE Jun 08 05:31:58 Russian ones rarely have ground pins too. Otherwise, they are just like European ones Jun 08 05:32:06 so you frequently have the flimsy US plug, with an equaly flimsy adapter which just extends the 2 main contacs, sitting 8 in a row in a megaflimsy multiple socket abot 30mm wide Jun 08 05:32:24 Except maybe an older version, not suited for recessed sockets Jun 08 05:32:49 and trying to unplug them is really hazardous Jun 08 05:34:41 well it is 110V Jun 08 05:35:21 It isn't the voltage that kills you, it's the amps. Jun 08 05:36:50 derf: But the amps are a function of the voltage and your skin resistance Jun 08 05:37:16 So, given the same skin, higher voltage will kill you better. Maybe even roast you a bit, in the process. Jun 08 05:37:30 RST38h, thank you. derf's statement is a common line that annoys me. :S Jun 08 05:37:37 derf, No offence meant. Jun 08 05:37:37 does anyone know which imap server(s) work with modest with showing only subscribed imap folders? Jun 08 05:37:42 jaem: derf is essentially correct though Jun 08 05:38:09 jaem: One thing that follows from his statement is that you should never work with high voltage when drunk or tired Jun 08 05:38:35 RST38h, well, yes, but the statement usually implies a lack of knowledge about the laws involved. Jun 08 05:38:38 jaem: even 24V may be enough in those cases Jun 08 05:38:39 And yes, I agree. :P Jun 08 05:38:44 Heh... yes. Jun 08 05:40:52 bah, static.maemo.org still borked Jun 08 05:41:36 indeed Jun 08 05:41:52 in Germany, 42V are considered safety limit Jun 08 05:42:03 Ethernet is 50V btw ;) Jun 08 05:42:04 iirc Jun 08 05:42:40 X-Fade: static.maemo.org seems borked Jun 08 05:42:43 * frals goes back to bed Jun 08 05:43:01 RST38h: ethernet is most certainly not 50v Jun 08 05:43:16 I may be mistaking it for something then, a moment Jun 08 05:43:39 true IEEE PoE is ~40 some Jun 08 05:44:32 Ah, I know where I got it Jun 08 05:44:47 48V is the telephone network signaling voltage Jun 08 05:45:42 pots lines, those still exist? Jun 08 05:46:00 96v on ring, hold onto a ringing phonel line for a thrill Jun 08 05:46:51 that's Vpp though Jun 08 05:47:18 yes, and at 10hz it sucks Jun 08 05:47:30 (us ringing, no clue about the rest of world) Jun 08 05:47:38 isn't it 25Hz? Jun 08 05:48:20 you wouldn't feel 25hz like this I would expect... Jun 08 05:53:30 POE is 48V, safety limit is 50V Jun 08 05:55:24 asj: 96V when ringing? Ah, come on, it got higher than that =) Jun 08 05:56:00 RST38h: that was the spec I thought Jun 08 05:56:33 asj: Except that granny's telephone made god-knows-when never complied with the spec =) Jun 08 05:56:33 RST38h: just like it's not 48, it's 50 upto 60v, since 48v is just 4*12v for the lead acid batteries and they are sitting on charge Jun 08 05:56:50 asj: (at least in USSR, I guess they might have had better telephones in the US :)) Jun 08 05:56:51 RST38h: it's no the phone that provides the power, it's the telco co Jun 08 05:57:06 asj: Don't forget about the feedback Jun 08 05:57:13 RST38h: can't speak for russian phone, I thought in soviet russia the phone's rang you ;) Jun 08 05:57:29 asj: The ringer is basically a coil. When rininging, it creates feedback Jun 08 05:57:59 asj: So, yes, the voltage could easily get higher than 2*48. Jun 08 05:58:34 RST38h: don't know how russian phones worked, but that's not how north american phones did Jun 08 05:58:55 asj: Somehow, I suspect that all phones worked the same :) Jun 08 05:59:30 RST38h: with that logic you would assume all TV standards would be same too ;) Jun 08 05:59:56 asj: Not really, but then I *know* TV standards are different Jun 08 06:00:14 asj: The phone network standards are worldwide though. Jun 08 06:00:53 RST38h: umm, E1 vs T1 would prove that wrong, so would the whole OC vs SDH system Jun 08 06:01:27 RST38h: if they can't even agree on ulaw vs alaw for voice I'm not sure local loop would be better Jun 08 06:03:00 That came much much later though ;) Jun 08 06:03:42 * RST38h sighs and goes to work. Jun 08 06:03:50 SELV (Safety Extra Low Voltage) where no isolation needed, is <25V AC, <60V DC. For sensitive areas there is a special protective Voltage of 42V defined. Jun 08 06:03:56 RST38h: yeah after they invented a way to talk to each other they couldn't agree on a standard, could it be much better when they had to write letters? ;) Jun 08 06:04:01 http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kleinspannung Jun 08 06:04:59 First time Git user here. Can anyone help? Jun 08 06:05:55 Scifi: whacha need? Jun 08 06:08:02 asj: error "unable to chdir or not a git archive" when i run the command "git push ssh://drop.maemo.org/git/vicar/" Jun 08 06:08:25 vicar is my project and I have the ssh keys set up (i think) Jun 08 06:09:27 and is /git/vicar a git repo? Jun 08 06:10:51 During project creation i selected Git if thats what you are asking Jun 08 06:10:58 (never used drop.maemo.org) Jun 08 06:11:04 https://garage.maemo.org/scm/?group_id=1586 Jun 08 06:11:25 this is the project page, it says git too (as opposed to svn for some projects) Jun 08 06:11:28 and 600Ohm POTS was sufficently alike all over the world so a phond would work everywhere Jun 08 06:11:49 asj: what do u use generally? http to push to git rep? Jun 08 06:12:04 Scifi: just different localtions Jun 08 06:12:13 Scifi: did the git clone ssh://.... work? Jun 08 06:12:48 first time it creates an empty repository with branch master only Jun 08 06:13:24 I mean yest, git clone ssh:// works Jun 08 06:13:48 and then you copied in files, commited them, then tried to push and it failed? Jun 08 06:15:12 (pots) major diffs: pulse/pause ratio of rotary dial, allowable ringer equivalence, frequency of ring signal, and later flash/hook duration Jun 08 06:17:41 DocScrutinizer51: changing the pulse/pause ratio isn't a small change Jun 08 06:18:20 asj: Small confusion here, git clone ssh:// failed with the same error (not a git archive) Jun 08 06:18:22 it's marginal though, exchanges work with both standards usually Jun 08 06:18:34 DocScrutinizer51: ok Jun 08 06:18:51 (not like anyone uses pulse dialing anymore) Jun 08 06:18:51 asj: but git clone https://vcs.maemo.org/git/vicar worked Jun 08 06:19:10 Scifi: ah, perhaps the ssh keys are wrong? Jun 08 06:19:20 hi how to install midnight commander? i can't found it on extras repositories Jun 08 06:19:31 asj: something like 1:1 vs 1.1:0.9 Jun 08 06:19:48 iirc Jun 08 06:20:05 asj: earlier it was giving public key error, so i created the file ~/.ssh/config and entered the details as per the instructions in garage Jun 08 06:20:10 DocScrutinizer51: kind of amazing they are so similar considering how many different telcos and everything sprung up. You have to consider this started in the 20s Jun 08 06:20:30 asj: I don't need to ssh. Even https: is fine if it works Jun 08 06:20:31 yeah Jun 08 06:22:35 intersting, ovi chat takes less power that google talk Jun 08 06:22:37 hmm, that n900 usb host mode thing is interesting... how does it work? Jun 08 06:22:45 Scifi: no clue Jun 08 06:23:15 asj: i think i am getting somewhere, dropped the whole ssh thing. Now trying https only Jun 08 06:23:48 got a different error, master -> master (non-fast-forward) Jun 08 06:23:56 Scifi: pull first Jun 08 06:24:06 asj:ok Jun 08 06:24:27 Scifi: on a push most repos won't allow a non ff merge since that could be bad Jun 08 06:25:44 * Scifi frantically googles what fast forward merge means Jun 08 06:26:14 scifi -a helps :) Jun 08 06:26:45 Mece: blame the spelling suggestions :) Jun 08 06:27:28 pigeon: still a lot of patches in kernel missing for a reliable operation Jun 08 06:27:35 Scifi: everything is in a nice straight line, esentially Jun 08 06:27:36 asj: tried pull and doing push now, it is doing something which is good Jun 08 06:27:58 pigeon all we got so far is a proof it's possible Jun 08 06:28:05 ok Jun 08 06:28:22 so it's done at software level? what about the hardware? Jun 08 06:29:10 asj: i did a local git init, add and commit before the remote pull and push, will my changes be pushed? Jun 08 06:29:29 Scifi: what makes you think you can do that? Jun 08 06:29:52 Scifi: keep things simple, just clone the remote repo Jun 08 06:30:05 luke-jr: general noobness :) Jun 08 06:30:21 pigeon: hw is 'fine' basically Jun 08 06:30:37 so the hw does support usb host to start with? Jun 08 06:30:39 asj: i was getting some error Jun 08 06:30:46 will try again Jun 08 06:30:47 yes Jun 08 06:30:53 right, ok Jun 08 06:31:56 Scifi: and yes you most certainly can do that, but your life is more complicated since you have multiple, oh what's the git term, well locations. Which is fine, but it defaults to using "origin" for many things, otherwise you have to specicy which one you want and that's just going to confuse you Jun 08 06:33:19 asj: git pull and push failed anyway. So I take that git clone is the way to go (to avoid unnecessary headaches later) Jun 08 06:33:38 Scifi: you have to init the repo, you can't pull into an empty directory Jun 08 06:33:44 Scifi: git clone does that Jun 08 06:34:28 asj, is there something in the remote repo? Jun 08 06:34:40 Mece: no it's empty...should be fine no? Jun 08 06:34:42 err sorry scifi is what I meant. Jun 08 06:34:58 Mece: it is empty, i am trying push for the first time Jun 08 06:35:04 ok. Jun 08 06:35:31 Scifi: just do this: git clone ; add files; git add ...; git commit -a; git push; Jun 08 06:36:29 asj: cloned, "git add ." is not working. How do I add multiple files? I have multiple sub-folders and files Jun 08 06:36:46 Scifi: git add --help Jun 08 06:37:11 scifi git add . adds everything under current dir. Jun 08 06:37:41 give a man a fish and you feed him for a day, set a man on fire and he's warm for the rest of his life Jun 08 06:37:52 LOL Jun 08 06:42:53 asj: "git add ." --> fatal: Not a git repository (or any of the parent directories): .git Jun 08 06:43:01 this is where i started of :) Jun 08 06:43:09 Scifi: what did the git clone say? Jun 08 06:44:09 git clone was successful, it created vicar/.git/ folder structure under my current folder Jun 08 06:44:24 Scifi: then you did "cd vicar" right? Jun 08 06:45:21 asj: yes but if i am in ./vicar I am not able to access my code which is in the parent directory Jun 08 06:45:31 Scifi: move your code.... Jun 08 06:45:40 Scifi: everything must be in the repo Jun 08 06:46:59 asj: sorry confused, /home/scifi/vicar/vicar-0.2 is my current folder which has all the code Jun 08 06:47:07 (of course it's git so there's other options for the nit pickers on how to do the clone, but this is easy. Clone creates a dir, but everything under that dir, which is the local repo) Jun 08 06:47:40 ok then will move the code to the subdirectory created by clone Jun 08 06:48:07 scifi, copy instead ;) Jun 08 06:48:27 yeah copy, safer Jun 08 06:48:42 ok Jun 08 06:49:04 though I'm thinking rm might be safer for the world ;) Jun 08 06:49:19 hehhe Jun 08 06:49:52 Scifi: git can be confusing...though have you ever dealt with any source control? Jun 08 06:50:13 damn, modest and imap folder subscription is quite annoying :( Jun 08 06:50:42 ask: Rational ClearCase :) Jun 08 06:50:49 *asj Jun 08 06:51:17 I am from windows world Jun 08 06:51:17 not sure how git compares, I don't think it compares to anything... Jun 08 06:51:37 asj:nope not at all, but the concepts commit, branch etc are same Jun 08 06:51:49 scifi, well git works fine in windows too. it's exactly the same. Jun 08 06:51:50 Scifi: any linux experience? Jun 08 06:53:18 asj: U mean development? started one month ago, released a Qt app to extras-devel :) Jun 08 06:53:47 have end-user experience on Solaris, Ubuntu :) Jun 08 06:54:12 scifi, git is special because the repo is local, so you can work with local version control and push to server when you feel like it. Jun 08 06:54:59 Scifi: ok, it would be big learnign curve to jump into linux fresh from windows and start devel Jun 08 06:55:33 scifi so how is the git doing now? making progress? Jun 08 06:55:58 Mece: I think i'll like it once i get it working for the first time. Same with developement too. Git is pushing the code now Jun 08 06:56:12 Scifi: sounds like you got the hang of it Jun 08 06:56:28 asj: Was/am a Java, from eclipse to gcc was indeed a big jump :) Jun 08 06:56:38 Scifi: have you looked at madde? Jun 08 06:57:26 asj: Yes but didn't quite like it as much as Qt Creator + Scratchbox on Ubuntu Jun 08 06:57:46 I am used to Ubuntu and I am not scared by command line :) Jun 08 06:58:29 Scifi: ok Jun 08 06:58:56 yes hello Jun 08 06:59:01 asj: git says it is successful Jun 08 06:59:06 let me check on server Jun 08 06:59:08 Scifi: congrats Jun 08 06:59:46 yes I see it in garage. Jun 08 06:59:53 asj: Thank you very much Jun 08 07:00:01 Mece: Thanks alot :) Jun 08 07:07:00 git it, git it good :) Jun 08 07:14:47 bah, annoying modest doesnt show if ppl are cc'd on the mail unless you hit reply all Jun 08 07:14:56 need to use that button by default ;[ Jun 08 07:16:24 or check message details Jun 08 07:16:50 thats how I do it Jun 08 07:17:33 wouldn't hurt with a To: / cc: field Jun 08 07:19:51 .me winges Jun 08 07:19:59 * noobmonk3y even Jun 08 07:20:00 meh Jun 08 07:20:04 my n900 is fooked Jun 08 07:20:22 noobmonk3y: Wuut? Jun 08 07:20:24 just woken up and it won't turn on :( - white light, nokia screen, then long fading yellow led Jun 08 07:20:36 noobmonk3y: Reflash ;-P Jun 08 07:20:48 meh 40 Jun 08 07:20:51 minutes till work Jun 08 07:20:55 not around tonight Jun 08 07:20:57 noobmonk3y: Or kickstart it with a wall-charger Jun 08 07:20:59 pants pants pants Jun 08 07:21:08 * noobmonk3y has no wall charger - girlfriend stole it Jun 08 07:21:18 so last 2 nights been charging of laptop Jun 08 07:21:20 :P Jun 08 07:21:21 noobmonk3y: Slap her with a trout. Jun 08 07:21:26 * noobmonk3y will Jun 08 07:21:39 grrr and i really dont like my e71 Jun 08 07:24:03 ayone seen the long yellow led before? Jun 08 07:24:08 anyone* Jun 08 07:24:59 charge it some more! Jun 08 07:25:01 Anyone know of a good alternative for xterm on the N900? Jun 08 07:25:49 * noobmonk3y slaps frals with Duckboot Jun 08 07:25:56 Duckboot, nope :( Jun 08 07:26:08 but then i only just understand what x-term is :P Jun 08 07:26:26 noobmonk3y: ;-P Jun 08 07:27:18 Hmmm - Might have to port some shit then - But I'm a real N00b when it comes to GUI-shit. Jun 08 07:27:40 :P Jun 08 07:27:58 frals, do you ever sleep? Jun 08 07:28:56 i slept almost all night! Jun 08 07:29:09 wow Jun 08 07:29:47 hmmm would leaving my phone plugged into my turned off n900 last night, actually sucked the juice out of it? still confused..... Jun 08 07:30:06 meh Jun 08 07:30:07 *laptop Jun 08 07:30:14 *laptop plugged into my turned off n900 Jun 08 07:30:19 Gonna try out rxvt for a Terminal app Jun 08 07:30:51 oooo got nokia hands Jun 08 07:31:01 yay and a desktop! Jun 08 07:31:11 told you to charge it! Jun 08 07:31:16 * noobmonk3y hasnt Jun 08 07:31:28 but yeah 1% battery lol Jun 08 07:31:43 went to sleep with 80% :| :| :| Jun 08 07:31:46 noobmonk3y: Yes, the usb port needs to be powered up, which takes power ;) Jun 08 07:32:12 X-Fade: static.maemo.org acting up! incase you missed my previous x highlights ;D Jun 08 07:32:15 lol and battery eye hasn't recorded anything since midnight last night Jun 08 07:32:15 If the port doesn't supply more than x mAh, it will drain more than it adds. Jun 08 07:32:21 X-Fade: You got anything to do with maemo.org? Jun 08 07:32:27 noobmonk3y: you fail! :( Jun 08 07:32:28 frals: server is booting. Jun 08 07:32:36 frals, :( - true...... :( Jun 08 07:32:37 X-Fade: alright, ta :) Jun 08 07:32:50 back up now. Jun 08 07:32:51 * frals goes back to refreshing mail and hoping some kind of flight info lands soon Jun 08 07:33:19 holy fcukamoly!!! - my battery went from 82% at 20:00 - and at 22:00 it was 13% Jun 08 07:33:28 hey frals, thanks for your comments to www2sms in talk.maemo.org Jun 08 07:33:42 hey, np! Jun 08 07:33:52 noobmonk3y: nice , what apps were you running O_o Jun 08 07:33:58 not sure what it was but i generally say smart things! ;) Jun 08 07:34:00 Appiah_, nothing - was a sleep Jun 08 07:34:08 asleep* Jun 08 07:34:09 but why I am here: http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=704616&postcount=18 Jun 08 07:34:11 lies noobmonk3y Jun 08 07:34:23 * noobmonk3y goes to work :( Jun 08 07:34:26 you were reencoding your homemade pron and seeding it as a torrent Jun 08 07:34:31 lols!!! Jun 08 07:34:38 :D Jun 08 07:34:46 hi all. i have tried to make a touch to speech application and for the touch part i used the code available for the raw input. the same one used to calibrate the screen. right now i am able to access only the window i create. how do i get access to the desktop? i know i have to use the window manager but not much luck with any documentation. can anybody here help put Jun 08 07:34:54 sorry help out* Jun 08 07:35:08 frals: you pointed me the the cpython code which inserts SMS into conversation Jun 08 07:35:27 so does anyone know how to "poll" a file in /sys/? Jun 08 07:35:28 the code makes use of X11/Xlib Jun 08 07:36:07 another doubt . is there anyway to make a window transparent in Xlib? Jun 08 07:36:25 I tried with pyinotify but since these filese seem to be opened-accessed-closed all the time this makes no sense Jun 08 07:37:01 in particular I want to read the ambient light intensity and when a treshold is reached execut something Jun 08 07:37:03 blub: ah, np. :) Jun 08 07:38:03 Nice - rxvt upp and running on my N900 Jun 08 07:42:21 Hmmm - Wasn't that useful really - But the default xterm seems to have crippled UTF-8 support. Jun 08 07:42:43 I need an XTerm with _full_ UTF8 support Jun 08 07:43:02 err Jun 08 07:43:07 half UTF-8 Support? Jun 08 07:43:12 what's that like Jun 08 07:43:44 Appiah: You know like inverted question-marks. Jun 08 07:44:04 that's font problem Jun 08 07:44:33 jacekowski: So? Make xterm use another font? Jun 08 07:44:48 that's an option Jun 08 07:44:51 I haven't really touch any font-settings for my xterm Jun 08 07:44:51 uxterm? Jun 08 07:45:14 Damnit - My spelling is crap this morning. Jun 08 07:45:14 the xterm on my n900 seems fine with utf-8 Jun 08 07:45:31 chinese japanese for instance are fine Jun 08 07:45:35 pigeon: Probs some font-problem then. Jun 08 07:46:06 xterm->ssh->screen->irssi = Fucked UTF-8 Jun 08 07:46:20 pigeon: well, Jun 08 07:46:33 Duckboot: nope Jun 08 07:46:42 Duckboot: screen -U? Jun 08 07:46:58 Duckboot: that's locales problem Jun 08 07:46:58 -U is useless Jun 08 07:46:59 you need working locales Jun 08 07:47:35 ٩(-̮̮̃-̃) ٩(͡๏̯͡๏)۶ ٩(̾●̮̮̃̾•̃̾)۶ ٩(-̮̮̃•̃)۶ ٩͡[๏̯͡๏]۶ Jun 08 07:47:44 who saw that? Jun 08 07:47:51 o/ Jun 08 07:47:58 correctly? Jun 08 07:47:59 wat ? Jun 08 07:48:05 i assume so Jun 08 07:48:15 ascii dudes waving and whatnot Jun 08 07:48:35 what is the charset , so I can set it on chatzilla ? Jun 08 07:48:44 utf-8 Jun 08 07:48:59 frals: they are not ascii dudes Jun 08 07:49:04 frals: they are unicode dudes Jun 08 07:49:08 well, charcater dudes! ;P Jun 08 07:49:11 jacekowski: I though as much - I really hates locales - All should use UTF8 - period Jun 08 07:49:23 Duckboot: unicode is inefficient Jun 08 07:49:30 once more paste ? ;) Jun 08 07:49:44 Duckboot: these dudes are 101k long Jun 08 07:49:47 ٩(-̮̮̃-̃) ٩(͡๏̯͡๏)۶ ٩(̾●̮̮̃̾•̃̾)۶ ٩(-̮̮̃•̃)۶ ٩͡[๏̯͡๏]۶ Jun 08 07:50:03 arabic or something ? ... Jun 08 07:50:08 no Jun 08 07:50:17 〠 Jun 08 07:50:18 jacekowski: Me using manhours in getting this to work from different systems is inefficient. Jun 08 07:50:36 besides, locales can be set per user Jun 08 07:50:41 take a look at your bashrc Jun 08 07:53:03 jacekowski: Bah - I think .bash_profile is a better place. Jun 08 07:55:20 hmm Jun 08 07:55:27 that file doesn't exist Jun 08 07:55:31 it's either .profile Jun 08 07:55:32 or .bashrc Jun 08 07:55:38 there is no .bash_profile Jun 08 07:55:45 but you are free to use it anyways Jun 08 07:55:47 I used .profile Jun 08 07:57:36 ��� Jun 08 07:57:39 Bah Jun 08 07:58:16 brb - testing Jun 08 07:59:19 mhm Jun 08 08:02:09 http://i48.tinypic.com/ipclfm.png phone beeing shipped on repair tomorrow :/ Jun 08 08:02:21 Finally - screen -U did the trick Jun 08 08:02:29 ^_^ Jun 08 08:02:43 mhmh: hmm Jun 08 08:02:50 may i say "told you so" now? ;D Jun 08 08:02:50 I read about that beeing a common problem Jun 08 08:03:06 defutf8 in the .screenrc did not do the trick Jun 08 08:03:12 hope my usb port does not fail Jun 08 08:03:51 mmm.. just hope i get it fixed on the warranty.. they could easily claim it's damagedbecause of all the large scratched i got on it :) Jun 08 08:04:49 Netsplit (Rejoins)? Jun 08 08:08:31 hello people :) Jun 08 08:10:59 any Londoners in here? Jun 08 08:11:29 you going? Jun 08 08:11:53 Stskeeps: no, not me yet :) Jun 08 08:12:03 Stskeeps: my sister :) Jun 08 08:12:06 hehe Jun 08 08:12:10 Stskeeps: o/ btw :) Jun 08 08:12:17 lo wazd Jun 08 08:16:19 Hello Jun 08 08:22:52 hi mece alone in a sea of lurkers Jun 08 08:25:17 Not lurking - Trying to work on my other PC. Jun 08 08:30:38 Hmmm - I was wondering - Last evening there was some mumbling about a "Community Driven Appstore" - That was actually a very good idea. Jun 08 08:32:11 So that Dev could get a small token of gratitude for their work - Not much, but a small sum - It would surely make it more attractive to develop software for the N900. Jun 08 08:32:47 maybe something flattr-ish? Jun 08 08:33:01 http://flattr.com/ Jun 08 08:33:31 Hmmm - Not bad - *BRB* meeting. Jun 08 08:37:21 * wazd still looking for londoners Jun 08 08:44:51 anyone got maemo specific answere to this: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/2995664/how-to-poll-a-file-in-sys Jun 08 08:45:35 Appiah, flattr could be pretty sweet for maemo people actually. Jun 08 08:46:57 pupnik, heh so alone that I zoned out a bit there :D Jun 08 08:49:12 wazd, check the n900 map thing. Jun 08 08:49:19 regarding flattr: http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=524623&postcount=13 Jun 08 08:49:55 mece: For what? :) Jun 08 08:51:13 wazd: lists n900 / maemo peeps in various locations Jun 08 08:53:32 mece: Stskeeps: aaah, *that* map :) Jun 08 08:56:27 I used dpu to upload a package to the builder last night, it's built okay, how do I push it to devel? Jun 08 08:58:29 alterego: To testing you mean? Jun 08 08:58:38 packages submitted to builder should get auotimported to devel :o Jun 08 08:58:43 Well, it's not showing up in extras-devel .. Jun 08 08:58:54 alterego: package name? Jun 08 08:59:00 media-im-status-updater Jun 08 08:59:07 X-Fade, oh and maemo.org was down yesterday Jun 08 08:59:16 or the static.maemo.org part of it Jun 08 08:59:19 I used dput during the downage .. Jun 08 08:59:27 MohammadAG51: Yeah, static had issues. Jun 08 08:59:28 Though I'm sure that's not the problem :P Jun 08 08:59:47 Thought it was that bloody cache :P Jun 08 08:59:58 MohammadAG51: you get about as much sleep as I do it seems :) Jun 08 09:00:08 alterego: https://garage.maemo.org/pipermail/extras-cauldron-builds/2010-June/023261.html Jun 08 09:00:18 alterego: Pretty sure that that was not a complete build. Jun 08 09:00:19 alterego, maybe this a PEBUCK too :P Jun 08 09:00:32 X-Fade: you know, I thought it looked odd. Jun 08 09:00:51 alterego: I'll resubmit and see what happens. Jun 08 09:00:53 Shall I resumbit? Jun 08 09:00:55 Okay Jun 08 09:01:18 alterego, well, slept at 4, woke up at 10 Jun 08 09:01:34 :) Jun 08 09:01:39 6 hours is pretty good. Jun 08 09:01:56 I stayed up for 2 days once Jun 08 09:01:58 xD Jun 08 09:01:59 I've ben awake about 3 hours :/ Jun 08 09:02:29 grr still no sign of my talk karma. I need my KARMAAAAAAAA Jun 08 09:02:54 mece: why? :P Jun 08 09:03:00 infobot, karma MohammadAG Jun 08 09:03:01 mohammadag has neutral karma Jun 08 09:03:05 fu Jun 08 09:03:07 lol Jun 08 09:03:13 infobot, karma mece Jun 08 09:03:13 mece has karma of 1 Jun 08 09:03:16 woo! Jun 08 09:03:28 infobot, karma Appiah Jun 08 09:03:28 appiah has karma of 1 Jun 08 09:03:33 infobot, racist Jun 08 09:03:38 infobot, karma MohammadAG51 Jun 08 09:03:38 LOOOOL Jun 08 09:03:39 yay this means I'm better then you MohammadAG51 ! Jun 08 09:03:55 Appiah, nah, it's just racist Jun 08 09:03:58 alterego: build looks a lot better now. Jun 08 09:03:58 lol Jun 08 09:04:02 infobot, fsck infobot Jun 08 09:04:06 anyway, Jun 08 09:04:13 X-Fade: thanks, Ithought it looked a bit funky last night .. Jun 08 09:04:16 see? now it's ignoring me Jun 08 09:04:26 rumour has it, racist is http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eYcDP9Wl7so Jun 08 09:04:26 mohammadag51 has neutral karma Jun 08 09:04:27 e2fsck /dev/infobot : warning! filesystem contains helpdesk workers! Jun 08 09:04:37 can anybody explain to me how to make a program a daemon on maemo 4 (diablo) . i have read the documentation but its a little overwhelming for me. i have found two python scripts for daemonizing a process. one is the start, stop, restart main file. the other has to be overloaded to execute my process. i can't make head or tail of where to install these files. any help will be appreciated. please.:) Jun 08 09:05:24 alterego, I was looking at the testing votes, and noticed that a friend of mine had almost 3 times the karma, and I couldn't figure out why. I've always felt really noobish when everywhere I look people have more karma than me. Well turns out one has to connect the dots between maemo.org and talk. Which I hadn't done. So that's why my karma wasn't going anywhere. Jun 08 09:05:26 isnt there a maemo development channel? Jun 08 09:05:48 #maemo-devel, but most of the users there are here Jun 08 09:05:54 oh Jun 08 09:06:06 mece: yeah, I found that out a few days ago, not bothered doing it yet though :D Jun 08 09:06:11 I gave up trying to write a app yesterday Jun 08 09:06:22 the "SDK" is so confusing Jun 08 09:06:32 appiah, yeah, but all you see there are tumbleweed Jun 08 09:06:33 it's piss easy to use Jun 08 09:06:57 nothing I launched showed up Jun 08 09:07:21 ~seen qwerty12 Jun 08 09:07:23 qwerty12 was last seen on IRC in channel #maemo, 186d 14h 43m 23s ago, saying: 'Khertan: "As of hildon 2.2, HildonDialog has been deprecated in favor of GtkDialog. "'. Jun 08 09:07:43 Hmm what happened to him ;) Jun 08 09:07:59 X-Fade: He bought an iPhone? Jun 08 09:08:00 X-Fade, I doubt he's coming back, already asked him :( Jun 08 09:08:08 X-Fade, perhaps Khertan got angry and threw him out? Jun 08 09:08:12 lol Jun 08 09:08:53 I thought he just changed his name .. Jun 08 09:08:56 MohammadAG51, wait what? are we talking #maemo or the community in general? Jun 08 09:09:04 #maemo Jun 08 09:09:17 MohammadAG51, oh porque? Jun 08 09:09:26 pourquoi Jun 08 09:09:27 xD Jun 08 09:09:31 heh Jun 08 09:09:36 why? Did he say why? Jun 08 09:09:45 How do I find out when the next extras-devel import will occur? Jun 08 09:09:48 and I'm not even french Jun 08 09:09:56 alterego, by waiting :) Jun 08 09:09:59 alterego, :5 and :35 Jun 08 09:10:00 Heh Jun 08 09:10:06 Ah, 25 minute sthen Jun 08 09:10:09 mece, nothing you can't guess :) Jun 08 09:10:23 yep, you missed it again Jun 08 09:10:30 :P Jun 08 09:11:28 alterego: I was wondering about ruby1.8, can we get it in a promotable shape? Jun 08 09:11:35 alterego: I see your name in there too ;) Jun 08 09:11:49 Sure, I'll work on it Jun 08 09:12:40 It seems debian/optify -> auto needs to be added and a bugtracker url, or change section to development. Jun 08 09:13:33 X-Fade, that only works for python apps right? Jun 08 09:13:45 MohammadAG51: No? Jun 08 09:14:04 last time I tried it with a C app it failed Jun 08 09:15:34 MohammadAG51: It should just work. Jun 08 09:15:44 X-Fade, well it didn't :) Jun 08 09:15:48 X-Fade, MohammadAG51, Current wesnoth has that, and fails to optify. I've actually (poorly) packaged a new version that uses /opt/wesnoth/ as prefix. But haven't uploaded yet. am a little unsure about how to do it wisely. Jun 08 09:15:53 i used maemo-optify in debian/rules Jun 08 09:16:09 see X-Fade? :) Jun 08 09:16:14 Well that is another option. Jun 08 09:16:34 MohammadAG51, no wait, wesnoth has a file containing the word auto. Jun 08 09:16:35 For simple things it should work, otherwise file a bug ;) Jun 08 09:24:10 ~ping Jun 08 09:24:11 ~pong Jun 08 09:24:17 man, gotta love static IPs Jun 08 09:24:53 router lost connection, rebooted, restarted wifi, and no disconnection from IRC. WIN! Jun 08 09:25:21 my life is awesome. Jun 08 09:25:41 hehheh, sounds great ;) Jun 08 09:26:07 man, gotta love static IPs Jun 08 09:26:10 except for IP bans Jun 08 09:26:35 why would you get banned MohammadAG51 ? are you doing bad stuff on ze internetz? Jun 08 09:27:04 Appiah, cause most users are racist, take infobot for example Jun 08 09:27:06 :) Jun 08 09:27:11 :) Jun 08 09:27:33 or if I piss off crashanddie Jun 08 09:31:35 http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=55531 <- Discuss Jun 08 09:32:07 whats wrong with the Ovistore? Jun 08 09:32:11 (have not used it Jun 08 09:32:12 ) Jun 08 09:32:31 Duckboot: you don't need the ovi store Jun 08 09:32:44 Duckboot: paypal + licence key works great, you know. Jun 08 09:33:25 morning all Jun 08 09:33:36 Duckboot: I don't see how another small time appstore would help Jun 08 09:34:03 Duckboot: publish your app as non-free on Maemo Extras + do the paypal thingie Jun 08 09:34:15 MohammadAG51: fancy having a look at this release and seeing if you think it's in a fine state to go to testing? Not sure if I've missed any control fields or sommat. Jun 08 09:34:37 http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1309/1442790483_ba50f3f8b2.jpg Jun 08 09:34:39 I've successfully bought stuff from Ovi on N900. I don't see the problem Jun 08 09:35:12 Please ppl - I don't develop anything. I tought of this as a way of making the interest of making apps greater. Jun 08 09:35:45 Does someone know how I can make an application grab the keyboard explicitely? I'm running ssh -X to my desktop, where I launch nxclient. For some reason, I can't do any keyboard input in all of nxclient. meaning the configuration and login dialog as well as the remote session. Jun 08 09:35:48 I don't understand the problem with OVI store as well. Jun 08 09:36:10 sivang: No python apps - Just as an example. Jun 08 09:36:13 mouse presses however do work. Jun 08 09:36:17 sivang: they only accept companies as developers, no python apps, etc.. Jun 08 09:36:53 Does Apple accept other than companies? Jun 08 09:36:58 MiXu-_: Yes Jun 08 09:37:00 well yes Jun 08 09:37:02 thp: I'm sure that if someone would have approached them to get to publish there, as a sole developer, he'd get it. They are quite kind and helpful. Jun 08 09:37:08 Which is odd, with them wanting LGPL for PySide Jun 08 09:37:29 I think PySide stuff would eventually get accepted into OVI, it is a matter of time as I see it. Jun 08 09:37:40 do apple accept Python apps onto the stoe? Jun 08 09:37:44 Python is not a supported runtime, so no Ovi for you. Jun 08 09:37:49 I'm just wondering if it might have something to do with source availability. Jun 08 09:38:04 sivang: well we don't want to compare ovi store with apple's app store here ;) Jun 08 09:38:20 is there an app store that accpets python apps? Jun 08 09:38:28 this is important to the argument. Jun 08 09:38:56 they don't support writing python apps for their platform Jun 08 09:39:46 thp: so it is a Coincidence that they fund PySide development? Jun 08 09:40:12 sivang: well, i hope they support it in harmattan times. there was a thread about this on the pymaemo mailing list some days ago Jun 08 09:40:28 thp: and have people on the Nokia payroll doing hardwork and sprinting to make it better and more Qt following? Jun 08 09:40:46 thp: for example, in the latest release you can now use proper qt style slots and signals. Jun 08 09:40:51 thread starts here: https://garage.maemo.org/pipermail/pymaemo-developers/2010-June/001479.html and the reply from a nokia employee https://garage.maemo.org/pipermail/pymaemo-developers/2010-June/001482.html Jun 08 09:41:06 thp: something that was done (together with bug squashing spree) in the last sprint or so. Jun 08 09:41:09 * sivang looks Jun 08 09:41:49 thp: right, so Matti just said this is the case for Maemo, doesn't mean that it will stay that way. Jun 08 09:42:08 thp: the forum are VERY responsive to us as a community (talking from my personal contribution experience) Jun 08 09:42:17 thp: expect good things :) Jun 08 09:42:40 thp: for Maemo, use extras Jun 08 09:42:43 I guess Jun 08 09:42:47 i do. just saying ovi store *right now* doesn't accept python apps ;) Jun 08 09:43:08 alterego, oh, an "enabled" button Jun 08 09:43:15 X-Fade, do the package maintainer request go through you? Jun 08 09:43:20 MohammadAG51: :P Jun 08 09:43:34 mece: Yes, if there is not a maintainer for the package already. Jun 08 09:43:34 Something wrong with my button?! Jun 08 09:44:31 thp: btw, if you demonstrate substantial contribution, you can get accepted to publish apps on OVI, given your app ideas are interesting and mix up with the OVI approach and scope. Jun 08 09:44:41 X-Fade, well there is.It's for wesnoth-data, I was wondering if you could make it so right away since I'm already maintainer of wesnoth Jun 08 09:44:56 mece: refresh ;) Jun 08 09:44:58 MohammadAG51: there are other items in the change log :P Jun 08 09:45:02 thp: not being a company, I wonder if that's the same for Apple. (Should be for their sake :-)) Jun 08 09:45:29 alterego, well I'm currently installed a s***load of python dependencies Jun 08 09:45:35 X-Fade, cheers :) Jun 08 09:45:40 sivang: they (ovi) are in the process of changing it, i think. just not there yet. Jun 08 09:45:47 not sure what ecactly frals/noobmonk3y added in their new updates... Jun 08 09:46:07 2 upgraded, 17 newly installed, 0 to remove and 13 not upgraded. Jun 08 09:46:09 thp: yep, infrastructural things take time. Jun 08 09:46:27 thp: But even then you need to adhere to the preferred api. Plain Qt or qtm, nothing more. Jun 08 09:46:30 that made my day: http://it.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=1678268&cid=32492456 Jun 08 09:46:37 too bad there isn't anything that does NOT fall under that category with Ovi :D Jun 08 09:46:50 X-Fade: that's why I love maemo.org extras so much :) apart from the very personal support I can get there ;) Jun 08 09:47:49 new Knots2 multimedia streaming package in testing. try it and vote! Jun 08 09:47:50 crashanddie, I dun geddit. What does the first C&C refer to? Jun 08 09:48:01 mece: read the summary Jun 08 09:48:05 command and conquer? Jun 08 09:48:09 X-Fade: you have to admit that leaving out PySide *is* a hefty 12 gauge shot in one's foot Jun 08 09:48:11 extras is a nice idea, but there's so much stuff that if you have extras, extras-testing and extras-devel repos active it takes frigging ages to do anything in the app manager. Jun 08 09:48:19 apt is pants if you ask me. Jun 08 09:48:27 rpm sucks Jun 08 09:48:27 For a phone at least Jun 08 09:48:29 * MohammadAG51 hides Jun 08 09:48:40 :) Jun 08 09:48:49 achipa: Only supported runtime on all platforms is Qt ;) Jun 08 09:48:52 but seriously Jun 08 09:48:59 apt is much faster than rpm Jun 08 09:49:06 I don't know rpm, so no idea how that would work. Jun 08 09:49:10 MiXu-_: there are caching/front-end apps to solve that, but they didn't think we'll have this much packages :) Jun 08 09:49:33 yeah, I suppose so Jun 08 09:49:38 MohammadAG51: ? Jun 08 09:49:40 X-Fade: Is there any way to break out repos from stats? http://maemo.org/download-stats/index.php?unixname=fmms&os=Maemo5&repo=extras - for an arbitrary example. That is not only - as the tag at the end might lead you to expect - extras. It includes testing, and devel. Jun 08 09:49:46 achipa: But that's just dumb design if you ask me Jun 08 09:49:50 crashanddie, LOOOOL Jun 08 09:49:59 SpeedEvil: Extras* :) Jun 08 09:50:08 SpeedEvil: Everything extras.. Jun 08 09:50:10 X-Fade: I mean, it kind of defeats the purpose to rewrite a bindings because of licensing, and then treat it equally as the other binding that had the 'problematic' license :) Jun 08 09:50:24 alterego, nope, still have to clear it myself (status) Jun 08 09:50:31 achipa: Python is not, and never has been a supported runtime. Jun 08 09:50:42 X-Fade: Indeed - it quite ignores the repo - 'repo=fish' ifives the same Jun 08 09:50:54 X-Fade: then why bother with a LGPL python binding ? Jun 08 09:50:56 frals nvm, it was prolly noobmonk3y Jun 08 09:51:06 (when you already have a GPL one) Jun 08 09:51:14 MohammadAG51: 1 new is prolly statusmenu-fmms unless you had it, rest is noobmonk3s fault im sure! Jun 08 09:51:28 lol Jun 08 09:51:31 achipa: Haven't seen anything in MeeGo about python runtime support. Jun 08 09:51:52 X-Fade: it's nowhere nearly certain yet, from what I gather Jun 08 09:51:55 achipa: But I guess it is just a nice to have atm. Jun 08 09:52:16 achipa: did you read the whole licensing thing? Jun 08 09:52:21 frals, he switched to 4.7.3... Jun 08 09:52:27 just checked the control file Jun 08 09:52:38 tekojo: for Ovi, for PySide or for PyQt ? Jun 08 09:52:44 4.7.3 ftfw! Jun 08 09:52:49 yeah he didnt know which version was the proper one because ppl had problems with older so i told him to just take the newest :P Jun 08 09:52:52 pyside pyqt Jun 08 09:52:52 MohammadAG51: can you tell me exactly what you're doing? Jun 08 09:53:19 alterego, my life is non of your business Jun 08 09:53:19 also, bah at 20kg max weight when traveling Jun 08 09:53:22 in all seriousness Jun 08 09:53:29 i'm pausing the song :) Jun 08 09:53:31 LOL Jun 08 09:53:49 MohammadAG51: and you're waiting five seconds? :P Jun 08 09:53:56 tekojo: errm... I wish to believe I have :) If you mean the LGPL vs commercial license thing Jun 08 09:53:56 * mece looks on, as suddenly the #maemo discussions take a turn for the weird. Jun 08 09:54:04 frals: Just buy more weight then? Jun 08 09:54:15 frals: Usually cheaper when you do that in advance. Jun 08 09:54:17 X-Fade: yeah, but still, bah! Jun 08 09:54:21 pyqt is gpl + commercial, which is kind of a pain if you are a company Jun 08 09:54:34 ok if you are an individual Jun 08 09:54:50 right, but if you want to developer something propreitary Jun 08 09:54:51 ... Jun 08 09:54:54 tekojo, so does a one man army count as a individual or company? Jun 08 09:55:03 alterego, yeah Jun 08 09:55:08 * mece has trouble being serious, it appears. Jun 08 09:55:09 tekojo: not at all sure. My feedback tells the opposite. Most companies are far more fond of a cheap commercial license than LGPL Jun 08 09:55:13 mece: depends whether it's a .com army Jun 08 09:55:18 lol Jun 08 09:55:26 but then again I might have just talked to the wrong people :) Jun 08 09:55:30 achipa: how come? Jun 08 09:55:34 mece: One man can be a company. Jun 08 09:55:46 mece: You just need to file the papers. Jun 08 09:55:50 right Jun 08 09:55:55 achipa: well, it's about choices isn't it? Jun 08 09:55:56 In some cases, you don't even need to file papers. Jun 08 09:55:58 SpeedEvil, I know I know. Jun 08 09:56:10 MohammadAG51: well, I don't know what you're doing, but it's working fine for me :P Jun 08 09:56:14 SpeedEvil, it was a failed attempt at humor. Jun 08 09:56:18 SpeedEvil: there are places like this :) Jun 08 09:56:39 alterego, another example of racism Jun 08 09:56:54 Hahah Jun 08 09:56:55 tekojo: sure. though both pyside and pyqt getting the cold shoulder for ovi certainly does not help overall choices Jun 08 09:56:58 MohammadAG51: hehe Jun 08 09:57:05 mece: I'm sorry, humor not found. Jun 08 09:57:06 alterego, yeah, stop being racist... wait what? Jun 08 09:57:11 * SpeedEvil insmods coffee.ko Jun 08 09:57:20 EPARSE Jun 08 09:57:43 ZOMBIES! RUN!! Jun 08 09:57:44 * MohammadAG51 rmmods sugar.ko Jun 08 09:57:50 * mece goes to lunch. Jun 08 09:57:52 achipa: Ovi will learn in time Jun 08 09:57:55 tataa Jun 08 09:58:26 alterego, i demand a refund Jun 08 09:58:29 your app is broken Jun 08 09:58:36 Didn't they promise that there will be some new stuff in Ovi soon? Jun 08 09:58:39 MohammadAG51: when did you change your status? Was it during a song? Jun 08 09:58:46 sivang: long story short, with commercial they feel safe, plus they can count on support. With LGPL there is a lot of FUD which makes them uneasy, regardless of the actual situation Jun 08 09:58:49 I've just noticed a bug :P Jun 08 09:59:05 man this behaviour of windows not getting focus unless explicity doing XSetInputFocus() is so god damn annyoing. I can't even get the window to get keyboard focus using wmctrl. Jun 08 09:59:10 alterego, I just paused the song, and waited, and waited... and waited Jun 08 09:59:24 tekojo: I really-really hope that will be the case (not just python, but in general approach) otherwise all is for naught :) Jun 08 09:59:35 Should be instantaneous. Jun 08 09:59:41 If you really want to put an app in ovi store starting a company isn't really a big deal Jun 08 09:59:46 And like I said, works for me :P Jun 08 09:59:50 Are you sure you're using 0.2 ? Jun 08 10:00:00 alterego, and like i said, you're racist Jun 08 10:00:02 :) Jun 08 10:00:10 MohammadAG51: oh, wait, did you do an upgrade? Jun 08 10:00:12 no, i'm using PR1.2 Jun 08 10:00:14 XP Jun 08 10:00:16 playing the racecard all day Jun 08 10:00:17 achipa: First priority is to make python a supported runtime then. Jun 08 10:00:17 yeah Jun 08 10:00:24 MohammadAG51: you might have to stop and start the daemon .. Jun 08 10:00:39 If you're using one of the older versions whilst we were messing with 0.1 .. Jun 08 10:00:45 X-Fade: doesn't pr1.2 come with pyside runtime? Jun 08 10:00:51 alterego, how user friendly... Jun 08 10:00:59 MohammadAG51: extras-devel :P Jun 08 10:01:01 i.e. one of the upgrade features? Jun 08 10:01:05 sivang: Maemo has never come with python. Jun 08 10:01:08 * sivang might be confused. Jun 08 10:01:13 X-Fade: I see. Jun 08 10:01:14 ~flash alterego Jun 08 10:01:20 X-Fade: that's what I mean by general approach - if we're all open source friendly, there has to be a clear way of introducing such libraries/runtimes into Ovi Jun 08 10:01:26 * infobot starts a firmware update on alterego, then pulls the plug halfway through Jun 08 10:01:30 Other than some SDK dependencies which made it a bit unclear. Jun 08 10:01:32 :D Jun 08 10:01:36 (again, not just python, that goes for anything lib* in Extras, too) Jun 08 10:01:44 infobot: hehe Jun 08 10:01:46 hmm... hehe is eheh Jun 08 10:01:52 achipa: Set your goals small. Jun 08 10:01:55 achipa: go ahead and suggest it Jun 08 10:02:12 achipa: python first, if you get that in then continue. Jun 08 10:02:29 sivang: I have no Ovi contacts. All Nokians generally agree but Ovi seems like a high tower in the distance, nobody goes there Jun 08 10:02:30 achipa: but I do think that things like that should remain to the scrunity of the store provider, as is probably for any other big vendor. Jun 08 10:03:20 alterego, using ovi or some other crap? Jun 08 10:03:25 X-Fade: sure, but the only real solution is for this not to happen on a 'fiat lux' base. But I agree, baby steps and all Jun 08 10:03:31 MohammadAG51: ? Jun 08 10:03:34 i wouldn't doubt that it's telepathy's UI that's stuck Jun 08 10:04:15 achipa: First get it in the official sdk, which for MeeGo is still a bit of an unknown. Jun 08 10:05:12 Has anyone ever tried a different WM on the n900? Jun 08 10:05:17 like say, a tiler? Jun 08 10:05:33 Tiler would be for most apps - poor Jun 08 10:06:05 Having said that - I really want the ability for hildon-desktop to 'swallow' apps Jun 08 10:06:16 swallow? Jun 08 10:06:21 i want non full windows Jun 08 10:06:41 So that if I have an app that would work well at widget size - I can create a widget with that app window. Jun 08 10:07:03 The app starts. The window manager sets the size to (say) 200*200 and puts it on the desktop. Jun 08 10:07:10 Well, I'm going to have a shower. Jun 08 10:07:25 This happens at wm startup Jun 08 10:08:10 jrHD Jun 08 10:08:33 X-Fade: matti says he's championing in getting it in for harmattan, I ensured him of our full community/council/commercial support :) Jun 08 10:08:48 SpeedEvil: so you can see progress at the same time without needing to switch between apps? Jun 08 10:09:01 sivang: no. Jun 08 10:09:10 achipa: I'm all for it, most of Extras* apps are python based it seems. Jun 08 10:09:12 sivang: I mean yes Jun 08 10:09:32 sivang: basically - if you want a 10*10 char xterm on the desktop, it can just be there. Jun 08 10:09:39 SpeedEvil: like on a desktop Jun 08 10:09:40 right Jun 08 10:09:47 X-Fade: it makes perfect sense as it has the lowest entry barrier Jun 08 10:09:50 sivang: It won't perhaps accept keyboard input. Jun 08 10:10:09 SpeedEvil: focus needs to be determined like in a regular deskotp Jun 08 10:10:11 Low entry barriers can be bad. Jun 08 10:10:11 I reckon Jun 08 10:10:16 * SpeedEvil was never very good at limbo. Jun 08 10:10:22 sivang: That depends. Jun 08 10:10:46 sivang: If you just say that this sort of widget can only take taps/clicks for example. Jun 08 10:11:07 Does any widget ever get keyboard focus? Jun 08 10:11:10 SpeedEvil: right so you can full screen it when you see something new arrived Jun 08 10:11:31 SpeedEvil: good question, I guess it gets it with the rest of the widgets of the main program window Jun 08 10:11:47 sivang: I've never seen a widget that takes keyboard input. Jun 08 10:12:12 SpeedEvil: you mean mobile widgets? Jun 08 10:12:22 sivang: I mean the n900 widgets Jun 08 10:14:57 http://maemo.org/packages/package_instance/view/fremantle_extras-testing_free_armel/knots2/0.3.2-1?net_nemein_favourites_execute=fav&net_nemein_favourites_execute_for=2b75cbf86f4011dfb543ebc9809c2b712b71&net_nemein_favourites_url=/json/fav/org_maemo_packages_package_instance/2b75cbf86f4011dfb543ebc9809c2b712b71/ knots2 in testing again Jun 08 10:15:05 urgh Jun 08 10:15:45 pupnik: Evil paste ;) Jun 08 10:16:11 Letting people directly vote up is not really nice. Jun 08 10:16:37 oh hehe it is Jun 08 10:17:08 don't click that Jun 08 10:25:38 any londoners in here? :) Jun 08 10:25:50 sorry for spam :) Jun 08 10:28:00 http://steamunpowered.eu/valve-to-release-duke-nukem-forever/ Jun 08 10:28:37 pupnik: I was not logged at least :) Jun 08 10:28:42 pupnik: but I clicked Jun 08 10:29:05 * SpeedEvil is about 500 miles from being a londoner. Jun 08 10:29:20 Hmmm - The ball is rolling? http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=55531 Jun 08 10:30:25 the main problem is who hosts the incoming money. ie, trust. Jun 08 10:30:30 and that gets difficult over time Jun 08 10:30:46 Stskeeps: Get a agreement with paypal? Jun 08 10:30:55 s/a/an Jun 08 10:31:25 except paypal is notoriously known for fucking you over :) Jun 08 10:31:37 one credit card dispute and your store could be stalled Jun 08 10:31:48 sivang: knots2 deserves promotion imo. check it out sometime Jun 08 10:32:36 Stskeeps: Well - there must be othere similar services. Jun 08 10:33:02 never had problems with paypal Jun 08 10:33:31 and imagine the uproar if transfers from that guy handling the money gets delayed.. Jun 08 10:33:49 Stskeeps: I know, I know. Jun 08 10:34:01 I saw something on planet. Jun 08 10:34:02 not saying it is a bad idea. Jun 08 10:34:09 A couple of weeks ago. Jun 08 10:34:19 Is tehre an archive of links? Jun 08 10:34:24 i kinda hope someone (personally) would be doing a similar concept, it's just hard to do in practice Jun 08 10:34:32 and then there's the whole liability issue.. Jun 08 10:35:12 Stskeeps: Mmmm - That's why there must be something like a council running things. Jun 08 10:35:34 It was the '10 million apps' post - anyone have a link? Jun 08 10:35:43 also, can you trust the stuff people to upload things they actually have copyright for? Jun 08 10:35:49 pupnik: media streaming server on the N900? Jun 08 10:35:49 err Jun 08 10:35:52 and who pays the bills if the site gets sued? :P Jun 08 10:35:57 1M downloads I believe. Jun 08 10:36:05 Stskeeps: Clearly, put it on freenet. Jun 08 10:36:15 SpeedEvil: Wonder what's that obsession people have with London :) Jun 08 10:36:26 SpeedEvil: surely a nice place, well, very nice Jun 08 10:36:33 SpeedEvil: if someone is a money handling point, they're a target.. Jun 08 10:36:56 SpeedEvil: oh okay, I love london Jun 08 10:36:59 :) Jun 08 10:37:05 Stskeeps: There, there - You must take your happy pills - No, seriously - I know there is several issues which have to be ironed out before even thinking about launching something like it, but it's doable I think. Jun 08 10:37:20 Duckboot: nah, just giving friendly advise, as i had this conversation already with someone :) Jun 08 10:37:52 cool, mobilehotspot works on the n900, though i'm a bit puzzled that i need to manually set ip for the other device, is it supposed to be like that? Jun 08 10:37:55 Argh - this is annoying. Jun 08 10:38:24 what's the problem with ovi store? they have been very slow starting but at least they are now selling stuff Jun 08 10:39:26 http://blog.gsmarena.com/apple-shares-down-after-the-iphone-4-announcement/ lol Jun 08 10:40:00 Stskeeps: The company which I work work makes Varnish. And we've split out a part of the company, making a separate company which is living of revenue from software with a BSD-license - I have been in the business for a while, and have some ppl around me, whom I can seek for advice. Jun 08 10:40:28 Duckboot: fair enough Jun 08 10:40:36 Trewas: Only companies as allowed into their store Jun 08 10:40:49 MohammadAG51: that's normal... it was the same with the ipad, speculation always drives upwards Jun 08 10:41:27 Hi all Jun 08 10:41:29 How can I make an app grab the keyboard? Jun 08 10:41:39 achipa, shares went down Jun 08 10:42:04 using wmctrl -a didn't work, the "trick" with the powerbutton that works with easy debian didn't work. Jun 08 10:42:33 MohammadAG51: that's what I'm saying, in case od apple products, speculation drives share price up, and then they fall back on the announcement Jun 08 10:42:48 it's a pattern, really Jun 08 10:52:49 >:( Jun 08 10:57:16 can n900 send files via IR? Jun 08 10:59:00 * mece has a full tommy, the food was yummy. Now back to acting like a dummy. *afternoonpoetry* Jun 08 11:03:37 Damnit - I cannot seem to get any work done today - My head is spinning around with ideas on the store thingy for Maemo/Meego. Jun 08 11:04:10 eat some food Jun 08 11:04:24 for those not really selling apps, I would love to see http://flattr.com or something similar used on maemo.org Jun 08 11:04:32 ljsdofuynsdfufuh: Just ate lunch, so that's not a problem. Jun 08 11:04:36 Chrome__: No Jun 08 11:04:37 does the same n900 work in all countries? Jun 08 11:04:42 ljsdofuynsdfufuh: no Jun 08 11:04:51 Duckboot, cuppajoe! Jun 08 11:04:59 ljsdofuynsdfufuh: There is different firmware - for example - in india - the FM transmitter is disabled. Jun 08 11:05:00 lsjwhatever, yes. Jun 08 11:05:02 oh, what should I look out for if I'm buying one in the US and then traveling? Jun 08 11:05:23 ljsdofuynsdfufuh: I'm unsure if it differs in hardware - probbaly not. As I understand it, the hardware is the same globally Jun 08 11:05:23 I'll mostly be in europe Jun 08 11:05:43 So I'll be able to us 3g everywhere that has it? Jun 08 11:05:48 mece: Hehe - Got a Espresso Machine 5m from my desk. Jun 08 11:05:56 Duckboot, make me some!½ Jun 08 11:06:22 mece: Ristretto, Lungo.... What is your choice? Jun 08 11:06:35 Duckboot, Lungo. Damn. Now I'm jealous. Jun 08 11:06:37 ljsdofuynsdfufuh: no Jun 08 11:06:43 Or, hey I think we have one here too.. Jun 08 11:06:45 oh, why not? Jun 08 11:06:49 ljsdofuynsdfufuh: It does not support some 3G networks due to their frequency Jun 08 11:06:54 ljsdofuynsdfufuh: just the european 3G standard Jun 08 11:06:59 mece: You see - seek it out. Jun 08 11:07:14 so there is the US3g, euro3g, and what else? Jun 08 11:07:17 ljsdofuynsdfufuh: For example, much of US and canada cannot do 3G with the n900 - or cannoy do it with some carriers. Jun 08 11:07:19 in the US, there are several other "standards" that are not compatible with anything else in the world Jun 08 11:07:24 ljs... , T-Mobile US works. Jun 08 11:07:29 ljsdofuynsdfufuh: Japan too. It won't work in japan Jun 08 11:07:38 (AIUI) Jun 08 11:07:44 2g will work anywhere though. Jun 08 11:07:44 yeah, Japan has its own standards, too Jun 08 11:07:50 mece: Not in japan Jun 08 11:07:57 SpeedEvil, damn. Jun 08 11:07:58 is tmo the best provider for the n900 in the US? Jun 08 11:08:13 SpeedEvil, so this phone will never work anywhere in Japan? Jun 08 11:08:17 well, it *may* work in Japan if you find a carrier that uses SIM cards Jun 08 11:08:22 mece: I believe that to be so. Jun 08 11:08:33 ljs..., the only one that supports 3g on N900. Jun 08 11:08:39 mece: I haven't really investigated very hard, as I do not imagine going to japan any time soon. Jun 08 11:09:08 SpeedEvil, I remember hearing that there is one carrier that supports... might be bs though. Jun 08 11:09:10 hmmmmmm Jun 08 11:09:19 so how much should I be paying for a n900? Jun 08 11:09:23 Though I am quite willing to test it for you mece if you paypal me the cash for a round-trip. Jun 08 11:09:40 spend only as much as you don't regret Jun 08 11:09:42 SpeedEvil, well, let me think about it. Jun 08 11:09:45 SpeedEvil, no. Jun 08 11:10:01 if you don't mind used stuff, the best choice would be that Jun 08 11:10:15 there are several WTS threads in TMO Jun 08 11:10:46 speaking of US and 3G, what kind of dl/ul speeds do they have there? Jun 08 11:11:06 yeah, is the 3g on n900 much slower than the rest? Jun 08 11:11:08 Hey I read that an iPhone is "$199" or something in the usa. But if I understand correctly, that is not the actual price. Which means that the N900 is "0€" here in finland. Pretty cool huh? Jun 08 11:11:20 mece: It's OK - any other moeny transfer service would work too, if you have a problem with paypal :) Jun 08 11:11:21 or the same as the rest of Tmo - which is about the same Jun 08 11:11:27 ......as the rest Jun 08 11:11:47 As a useless datapoint, I get 150kbytes/s from the sofa in the UK on t-mobile. Jun 08 11:11:54 ljs..., umm? N900 on T-mobile is as fast as other phones on T-Mobile. Jun 08 11:12:11 ljsdofuynsdfufuh: it supports the best current HSPA standard Jun 08 11:12:18 so it mostly depends on the network you choose Jun 08 11:12:30 hmm, mece, how is it free? Jun 08 11:12:41 I'm going to be around finland soon, might actually stop by there Jun 08 11:12:55 I live in Chicago though Jun 08 11:13:12 err - I think mece is confused. Jun 08 11:13:19 ljs, because iPhone fee is a subsidized price. AKA you pay that, and then something per month for x amounts of months. Apparently everyone forget to mention this. Jun 08 11:13:33 I believe he's referring to the fact that iphone has a subsidised cost. Jun 08 11:13:42 Iphone is _not_ free in finland. Jun 08 11:13:57 I didn't think the iPhone wasa free anywhere :P Jun 08 11:14:08 The contract may not subsidise the cost of the phone, but the phone hardware is therefore much more expensive as an up-front cost. Jun 08 11:14:18 is the n900 cheaper in europe? Jun 08 11:14:31 Much cheaper in the US Jun 08 11:14:35 SpeedEvil, if you calim tha tthe iphone cost $199 in the USA, then by the same logic the N900 cost 0€ in Finland. Jun 08 11:14:35 ah Jun 08 11:14:42 wow Jun 08 11:14:45 good typing there. Jun 08 11:14:55 :) Jun 08 11:15:29 alterego, where's my bugfix you racist $SWEARWORD Jun 08 11:15:40 total cost for iphone in .fi is about 550€, if you buy the subsidized iphone from the operator on cheapest contract, then after 6 months switch to a cheap phone and chep contract and pay the remaining monthly fees for iphone (18 * something). 6 months and 550€ for unlocked iphone Jun 08 11:15:50 MohammadAG51: just uninstall it, make sure it's not still running Jun 08 11:15:54 Then reinstall it :P Jun 08 11:16:17 alterego, Jun 08 11:16:25 shove a stop in prerm Jun 08 11:16:32 can someone recommend me a decent IRC client for Windows? Jun 08 11:16:35 MohammadAG51: I have now :P Jun 08 11:16:35 okay, well the n900 is going to be about $400 unless you think there is a better place to get it Jun 08 11:16:41 It's in 0.2, it just wasn't in 0.1 Jun 08 11:16:46 Venemo: no , use a shell Jun 08 11:16:46 Which is why it's not working for you :P Jun 08 11:16:48 ShadowJK, yes exactly, but the iphone is claimed to cost $199, which is what you have to pay for it to get it in the first place apparently. And 0€ is what you have to pay to get an N900 in Finland. :) Jun 08 11:16:49 Venemo: or mIRC Jun 08 11:17:04 ljs..., $400 is a great price! Jun 08 11:17:07 tmo users, what plan do you recommend for the n900? Jun 08 11:17:19 Of course, you could just stop and start the service .. Jun 08 11:17:20 one with unlimited data Jun 08 11:17:34 ljs, unlimited data. All else is redundant imo. Jun 08 11:17:41 mece, it just seems like such a device shouldn't be more than a good netbook (my top model eee pc was only $350) Jun 08 11:17:49 I'm using 1G/mo data with t-mobile UK Jun 08 11:17:51 I'm currently using mIRC, but it seems that it is properitary crap Jun 08 11:18:06 There is BitchX for windows I belive Jun 08 11:18:10 Venemo, I use pidgin. Works fine. Jun 08 11:18:16 so Tmo will cover all 3g in europe that the n900 can pickup anyway? Jun 08 11:18:17 ljsdofuynsdfufuh: the hardware is somewhat more costly to make. The assembly is quite expensive at these scales. Jun 08 11:18:26 there is also irssi for windows.. Jun 08 11:18:34 1G/mo data with t-mobile.co.uk for 20 quid for 6 months. Jun 08 11:18:36 :) Jun 08 11:18:56 ljsdofuynsdfufuh, coverage-wise N900 supports every operator in europe, 3g and 2g. Jun 08 11:19:24 But tmobile usa is probably going to make you a very poor man if you use tmobile germany or tmobile uk. Jun 08 11:19:26 ah, so what does that mean I should purchase in terms of tmo plans, Jun 08 11:19:45 SpeedEvil, a few years back a phone company called me and asked if I was interested in a data plan. I told them I had unlimited. They said, well it might be cheaper to have a limited if you don't use that much. I asked how do I know how much I use? Jun 08 11:19:48 well speedevil just said tmo uk is cheap as hell Jun 08 11:19:52 * Duckboot got a Unlimited dataplan atm - If I pass 3Gb, I get restrained to 128kbits Jun 08 11:20:03 SpeedEvil, they told me to do this and that (Nokia N95) and I checked. Jun 08 11:20:12 wow... unlimited Jun 08 11:20:15 and then restrained Jun 08 11:20:22 SpeedEvil, then I asked, so what do you have that's cheaper than unlimited that covers 9Gb /month? Jun 08 11:20:28 mece: :) Jun 08 11:20:45 SpeedEvil, turns out it was cheaper with the unlimited. who knew? Jun 08 11:20:52 okay, thx everyone about the recommendations Jun 08 11:20:56 ljsdofuynsdfufuh, yeah sure, I'm just warning you not to expect that Tmobile USA will be as cheap to use in the UK as Tmobile UK is to use in UK... Jun 08 11:21:17 mece: I completely agree. If you are out and about all the time with the phone, then 1G/mo would be hard. But for me - for most of the time I'm in wifi range. Jun 08 11:21:21 If you get a tmobile UK plan im the UK, sure.. Jun 08 11:21:33 shadowJK, why would tmo UK charge so much when speedevil says his bill is only 20/6mo for 1g/mo in the UK? Jun 08 11:21:49 oh Jun 08 11:21:57 ljsdofuynsdfufuh: To be dair - that plan is very well hidden on the website. Jun 08 11:22:03 another question: Jun 08 11:22:08 ljsdofuynsdfufuh: It's only also available on pay-as-you-go Jun 08 11:22:13 Venemo, shoot Jun 08 11:22:20 * SpeedEvil shoots mece. Jun 08 11:22:30 SpeedEvil, wait, not you! Jun 08 11:22:31 I followed the steps at http://wiki.maemo.org/Customizing_Maemo#Disabling_Auto_Updates_Check and still, my N900 disregards the value I set Jun 08 11:22:33 so, maybe it would be cheaper to use Sims from euro providers when visiting? Jun 08 11:22:40 Yes Jun 08 11:22:42 "I shot the Sheriff......" Jun 08 11:22:45 ljsdofuynsdfufuh: Certainly. Jun 08 11:22:51 it still updates itself on every connection Jun 08 11:22:59 ljsdofuynsdfufuh: However - rates within the EU may be bad. Jun 08 11:23:07 Using foreign SIMs is financial suicide Jun 08 11:23:11 ljsdofuynsdfufuh: You likelly need to use each countries SIM Jun 08 11:23:19 Venemo, did you reboot? Jun 08 11:23:24 If you plan on using lots of data Jun 08 11:23:26 yes, several times since then Jun 08 11:23:43 Venemo, interesting. I haven't really tested that though. Jun 08 11:24:25 ljsdofuynsdfufuh: Are you visiting one or two countries, or are you doing a grand tour or something? Jun 08 11:24:26 hmm, it seems like kind of a hastle to find a new sim everytime I'm in a new country Jun 08 11:24:44 I'll mostly be in sweden, but I'll probably be in about 5 other countries Jun 08 11:24:46 too Jun 08 11:24:51 at least* Jun 08 11:25:04 ljsdofuynsdfufuh: There is generally very little roaming. Jun 08 11:25:28 ljsdofuynsdfufuh: Some providers provide a 'generous' roaming data plan for extra. But it tends to be around 50 meg a month. Jun 08 11:25:45 Anything over that may be in the region of 5 euros a meg Jun 08 11:25:48 meaning... you need a different sim for every euro country? Jun 08 11:25:51 yes Jun 08 11:26:01 interesting Jun 08 11:26:12 every country, period Jun 08 11:26:24 whether it's in europe or not makes little difference Jun 08 11:26:28 Pretty much. Jun 08 11:26:37 hmmm, so I should get a pay as you go tmo plan in the US, then when going to each euro country get the cheapest sim-based provider therein Jun 08 11:26:54 ljsdofuynsdfufuh: seems to be a good idea to me Jun 08 11:26:59 (so I'm not paying for US tmo while Im gone for 2months) Jun 08 11:27:02 In at least the vast majority of countries - using mobile data on a foreign SIM is for the rich only. Jun 08 11:27:03 whenever your phone is roaming, the operators switch to the "bleed 'em dry and then some"-pricelist Jun 08 11:27:28 ljsdofuynsdfufuh: you'll have to buy an unlocked N900 for that, though Jun 08 11:27:38 thought they were all unlocked Jun 08 11:27:40 mhm Jun 08 11:27:45 at least in the US Jun 08 11:27:53 I dunno Jun 08 11:27:58 just pointing it out Jun 08 11:28:01 the one sold in austria, too Jun 08 11:28:05 Errors were encountered while processing: Jun 08 11:28:14 /var/cache/apt/archives/libxss1_1%3a1.1.3-1maemo1_armel.deb Jun 08 11:28:15 I've never been to the US, so I can't really tell Jun 08 11:28:15 E: Sub-process /usr/bin/dpkg returned an error code (1) Jun 08 11:28:17 the n900 *has* a unlock function Jun 08 11:28:22 venemo, so you're saying which part of that requires unlocked? Jun 08 11:28:24 That doesn't really make sense for me Jun 08 11:28:27 hidden in the settings panel's dropdown menu Jun 08 11:28:28 FIQ, close ham..? Jun 08 11:28:30 having multiple sims? Jun 08 11:28:39 ljsdofuynsdfufuh: I mean that it should not be locked to a single carrier Jun 08 11:28:46 oh yeah Jun 08 11:28:53 ljsdofuynsdfufuh: For example - http://www.t-mobile.co.uk/services/going-abroad/using-the-internet-abroad/ Jun 08 11:28:55 Venemo, ljsdofuynsdfufuh, N900 is always unlocked. Jun 08 11:28:58 aren't you lucky... never been to the US, lol Jun 08 11:29:07 mece - okay, thx Jun 08 11:29:17 ljsdofuynsdfufuh - why am I lucky for that? :P Jun 08 11:29:32 partial joke Jun 08 11:29:32 $10/MB for outside of the EU rates. Jun 08 11:30:01 any recommendation for a map application that can import .kml (or .netxml/.gpsxml?) Jun 08 11:30:33 hm Jun 08 11:30:36 outside EU? meaning everywhere inside of europe has sensible rates? Jun 08 11:30:39 and what is the best IRC client for the N900? Jun 08 11:30:51 Venemo, xchat Jun 08 11:30:51 ljsdofuynsdfufuh: Well - If you consider $2/MB sensible. Jun 08 11:30:55 is "IRC protocol plugin for Conversations and Contacts" good? Jun 08 11:31:15 ouch, so I'll have to figure out when i get there which provider in each country i should use Jun 08 11:31:50 Venemo: the messages of nickserv/global & co can be annoying after a while Jun 08 11:31:54 ljsdofuynsdfufuh: Pretty much. If you're staying with friends, you may be able to get 'free' SIMs sent to them for you to pickup. Jun 08 11:31:57 that's why I don't use the contacts plugin Jun 08 11:32:25 that's interesting Jun 08 11:33:17 ljsdofuynsdfufuh: or simply ask them to buy you the cheapest prepaids, as they probably know best which provider has the best/cheapest coverage in that area Jun 08 11:34:24 ljsdofuynsdfufuh: http://www.t-mobile.co.uk/shop/free-pay-as-you-go-sim-cards/ + http://www.t-mobile.co.uk/services/payg/boosters/ boosters - internet boosters - and then you can have a gig a month for the rate I mentioned above Jun 08 11:34:35 great, thanks Jun 08 11:34:47 only if im in the UK, though, right Jun 08 11:34:51 yes Jun 08 11:35:20 satmd - still, is it buggy or bad? I think I would prefer conversations integration to a separate app Jun 08 11:35:49 no, it's fine Jun 08 11:35:56 there's just no way to filter messages Jun 08 11:36:11 why would I want to filter them? Jun 08 11:36:16 sorry, I'm new to IRC :) Jun 08 11:36:28 well, e.g. global will message you each time you connecz Jun 08 11:36:31 -z+t Jun 08 11:37:33 satmd - thx for the info Jun 08 11:38:01 so will also maybe antispam systems and nickserv Jun 08 11:44:51 hey Jun 08 11:44:57 ljsdofuynsdfufuh: but if you have the option, ALWAYS buy local SIMs, combine maybe with SkypeIn & redirects and you are in cheap-call nirvana. Jun 08 11:45:16 is it possible to create my own image with Flasher? Jun 08 11:45:34 How stable is host mode now? And how user "friendly"? Jun 08 11:45:48 so that I can create an image, go crazy with stuff from devel, and then reflash with my own image? Jun 08 11:45:51 not user friendly at all Jun 08 11:45:57 Heh :) Jun 08 11:46:07 thanks achipa Jun 08 11:46:07 ljsdofuynsdfufuh: but there are also special travel SIMs that are universal, for example I got http://www.airbalticcard.com/ for free. Rids me of roaming for incoming calls on airports at least :) Jun 08 11:46:08 alterego: it isn't. it is coming very quickly, though Jun 08 11:46:19 (you still need a custom kernel) right? Jun 08 11:46:22 right Jun 08 11:46:32 Venemo: is there a summary of steps involved now? Jun 08 11:46:40 * mfayzull brays, for a change Jun 08 11:46:51 I'll check it out - you'd think the n900 would have dual sim Jun 08 11:46:52 everything is documented on talk.maemo.org... Jun 08 11:47:03 I've even seen quad sim, which looks pretty 'l33t' Jun 08 11:47:07 ljsdofuynsdfufuh: Dual SIM is rare on 3G phones Jun 08 11:47:15 ljsdofuynsdfufuh: Simply as the radios are expensive Jun 08 11:47:18 can you even use the sims at the same time on dual sim? Jun 08 11:47:22 dont you have to reboot? Jun 08 11:47:23 alterego: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=31921&page=106 Jun 08 11:47:51 achipa, awesome work with 4.7.3. Very happy that it's in extras now :) Jun 08 11:48:11 mece: thx, glad to hear :) Jun 08 11:48:30 we should have QtMobility soon, too, and then we can really party :) Jun 08 11:49:30 achipa, are you waiting for upstream? Jun 08 11:49:59 mece: yep Jun 08 11:50:08 achipa, got an eta? Jun 08 11:52:15 does anyone here use ovi store? Jun 08 11:52:30 timeless_mbp, I've downloaded a few apps. What's up? Jun 08 11:52:34 I dont want to register on nokia for some reason Jun 08 11:52:57 bug 10600 Jun 08 11:52:58 Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=10600 Link from Ovi Store only works the second time Jun 08 11:53:03 Conservations have warned that the World Cup could finish off a rare South African vulture because locals believe smoking the beasts' brains will help them win big in footie-related bets Jun 08 11:53:04 Appiah: i haven't and refuse Jun 08 11:53:05 timeless_mbp: I entered my username and put in a bogus email and phone, not realising it would require it. Jun 08 11:53:15 SpeedEvil: heh Jun 08 11:53:23 timeless: and now I can't delete the account. Jun 08 11:53:28 so now the account is reserved? Jun 08 11:53:29 cool Jun 08 11:53:39 timeless_mbp, never tried that. Jun 08 11:53:50 mece: could you? Jun 08 11:53:51 mece: not really... but I have seen 'first signs' in the VCS so it's not years off certainly Jun 08 11:53:51 SpeedEvil: haha Jun 08 11:53:54 his steps suck Jun 08 11:54:01 there should be about 20 steps Jun 08 11:54:06 including specifying an actual application Jun 08 11:54:09 timeless: yes. I have considered being annoying, and using the provisions of the data protections act to get them to correct my data. Jun 08 11:57:09 Anyone here using OpenGLES??? Jun 08 11:58:15 RST38h: for what Jun 08 11:58:18 everybody Jun 08 11:58:29 i've been playing a lot of OpenGLES games Jun 08 11:58:33 does it count? Jun 08 11:58:55 RST38h: I tried, and failed :P Jun 08 11:59:11 I think I might have another go sohortly though, as I'm pretty f*cking bored ^.^ Jun 08 11:59:41 jacekowski, sure :) Jun 08 11:59:42 On a side note, are there any problems with me using Nokia maps maps? :) Jun 08 12:00:02 alterego, problems how? Jun 08 12:00:07 Legally Jun 08 12:00:13 timeless_mbp: The thingy with "you must link twice to make a download from a link in the OVI store" - I can confirm it - I tried it, and I had to use the link twice - Last with WeatherBug. Jun 08 12:00:21 If I want to write an application that uses Nokias maps .. Jun 08 12:00:34 Or am I best using openstreet or something. Jun 08 12:00:37 alterego: It will - likely - be impossible. Jun 08 12:00:39 Duckboot: so... Jun 08 12:00:45 alterego: Map licensing is _horribly_ frought. Jun 08 12:00:50 i've used an internal nokia service which uses an sms for delivery Jun 08 12:00:52 and it worked fine Jun 08 12:00:53 noone answered, so I'll ask again: Jun 08 12:00:54 SpeedEvil: Yeah, that's what I was thinking. Jun 08 12:00:54 alterego: OSM is some orders of magnitude easier. Jun 08 12:00:57 Appiah: For graphics Jun 08 12:01:02 is the link to a .install file or a web page? Jun 08 12:01:13 RST38h: developing apps or what? Jun 08 12:01:14 is it possible to create a custom Flasher image from the current state of my N900? Jun 08 12:01:17 alterego: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tile_usage_policy see also Jun 08 12:01:21 timeless_mbp: web page (URL) Jun 08 12:01:24 Appiah: Developing apps Jun 08 12:01:29 ok Jun 08 12:01:37 Venemo: In principle, yes. In practice, I don't think anyones done that. Jun 08 12:01:45 and how to do it? Jun 08 12:01:56 it would be a very easy way to make backups Jun 08 12:02:13 Duckboot: if someone sends you a normal url via sms and you click on it, does that work? Jun 08 12:02:18 I'd like that too Venemo Jun 08 12:02:22 timeless_mbp: First time it opens the front page - Second time it goes to the actual download page. Jun 08 12:02:23 " http://google.us " Jun 08 12:02:26 timeless_mbp: Yes Jun 08 12:02:33 Duckboot: so this is a problem with Ovi, not the browser Jun 08 12:02:40 you guys all suck Jun 08 12:02:48 Venemo: Figure out how to extract the ubifs root filesystem - and archive it on your computer. Then work out how to put that together with FIASCO into a flashable image. Jun 08 12:02:48 timeless_mbp: Mmm - Atleast I think so, yes. Jun 08 12:02:55 timeless_mbp: ?? Jun 08 12:02:57 google voice and google maps work on maemo? Jun 08 12:03:07 Venemo: i usually rsync -aHx / to a sd card with ext3 Jun 08 12:03:07 Duckboot: if clicking the link in the sms opens a page Jun 08 12:03:09 and remake from there Jun 08 12:03:10 then you have to say that Jun 08 12:03:14 voice work, and maps in browser work. Jun 08 12:03:15 and you have to say what page it opens Jun 08 12:03:23 you can't just say "nothing works unless i click it twice": Jun 08 12:03:27 timeless_mbp: I did right now? Jun 08 12:03:39 14:02 < Duckboot> timeless_mbp: First time it opens the front page - Second time it goes to the actual download page. Jun 08 12:03:42 Duckboot: timeless_mbp: The thingy with "you must link twice to make a download from a link in the OVI store" - I can confirm it - I tried it, and I had to use the link twice - Last with WeatherBug. Jun 08 12:03:47 it's annoying how QUADS don't exist in gles. Jun 08 12:03:57 your initial comment to me was as unhelpful as the bug reporter's Jun 08 12:04:00 speaking of gles Jun 08 12:04:03 Stskeeps: this is interesting. Still, is there any easy solution for Windows? Jun 08 12:04:07 note that i am quite thankful that you eventually clarified Jun 08 12:04:10 but i'm still annoyed Jun 08 12:04:29 can you please try reproducing and actually record the location you're sent to the first time you click the link? Jun 08 12:04:55 Stskeeps: Doesn't Flasher have the option to do this? Jun 08 12:05:01 mece: quads are just two triangles :P Jun 08 12:05:03 Venemo: no Jun 08 12:05:13 Stskeeps: :( Jun 08 12:05:16 Sec - gonna try to download an app by sending a SMS with the link (from OVI-store) Jun 08 12:05:19 alterego, I know, but they are used. Alot. Jun 08 12:05:27 Stskeeps: so, no trivial solution? Jun 08 12:05:38 Venemo: no trivial solution Jun 08 12:05:40 mece: I actually think triangles are more efficient anyway? Jun 08 12:05:50 ljsdofuynsdfufuh, "mece: voice work, and maps in browser work." was meant for you. Jun 08 12:06:07 Stskeeps: thx for the info Jun 08 12:06:15 alterego, yes, but that doesn't help if it's someone else who's made the thing. Jun 08 12:06:26 Duckboot: thank you very much Jun 08 12:06:45 alterego, besides, quads are convenient if you want just that. much less work than making 2 triangles. Jun 08 12:07:25 I dunno, use a triangle strip :P Jun 08 12:07:35 That'd make quads easy, almost the same as actually making quads. Jun 08 12:07:56 alterego, for efficient, well made gl stuff, gles is nice and should work pretty straignt up, since they have that much in common, but for quick fixes it's annoying. Jun 08 12:08:16 Yeah Jun 08 12:08:22 yeah, thanks mece, i caught it Jun 08 12:08:28 I'm sorry if I'm going to be a troll Jun 08 12:08:35 but damn, the iPhone 4 looks sexy. Jun 08 12:08:51 crashanddie: no, it looks disgusting Jun 08 12:08:57 alterego, I'm very inexperienced in gl programming. My brother is playing with making old school space shooters with gl, and I try to port them to n900, and fail. Jun 08 12:09:06 crashanddie, I know, I hate it too! Jun 08 12:09:17 mece: I don't hate it :) Jun 08 12:09:21 mece: hah, tell him to use triangles! :P Jun 08 12:09:29 timeless_mbp: Tried to send "Alarm Maemo" to myself - Got link http://store.ovi.mobi/content/36033 - Clicked on it in conversations - Ended up on http://store.ovi.mobi/home - switched back to conversation - click on the link again - Ended up in the correct location. Jun 08 12:09:33 crashanddie, I don't hate it, I hate it that the iphone is sexy. Jun 08 12:10:19 duckboot, timeless_mbp, sounds like a cookie monster. Sets cookie first time, reads cookie second time. they should have a redirect after setting cookie. Jun 08 12:10:52 duckboot, timeless_mbp, I actually had that exact same problem with this project at work yesterday :D Jun 08 12:11:12 Duckboot: can you do me a favor and comment in bug 10600? Jun 08 12:11:13 Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=10600 Link from Ovi Store only works the second time Jun 08 12:11:25 timeless_mbp: Consider it done Jun 08 12:11:29 alterego, ye.. will do. Jun 08 12:11:49 :) Jun 08 12:11:52 alterego, but there's also the problem with... erm I forget what it's called. vertexf3d? Jun 08 12:12:17 mece: you mean floating point values? Jun 08 12:12:36 alterego, no the whole function is missing from gles- Jun 08 12:12:44 Oh, Jun 08 12:13:06 * timeless_mbp wanders off Jun 08 12:13:47 hey there Jun 08 12:14:16 does anyone knows where to find this apps for n900 : http://videos.wittysparks.com/id/833911081 Jun 08 12:14:16 alterego, I forget what it's actually called though. Jun 08 12:14:30 Sleepy Pattern w/ Timelapse features Jun 08 12:14:36 or other timelapse application Jun 08 12:16:32 wtf... has app manager's search feature been pulled? Jun 08 12:16:39 is there an alternative for Modest (except claws...)? Jun 08 12:16:40 no Jun 08 12:16:41 Wolfie: no Jun 08 12:16:45 start typing in the app-list Jun 08 12:16:48 Wolfie: it's just, ackward now Jun 08 12:17:21 Treibholz: mutt? Jun 08 12:18:05 thp: mutt is not really better on smartphone than modest... Jun 08 12:18:34 * Treibholz is dreaming of an "Xmutt" for years now... Jun 08 12:19:00 mutt is perfect - you can control it fully with the keyboard, obviously Jun 08 12:19:04 SpeedEvil, Ikarus: bah... there should be some kind of indication for that (like a textfield or something). Very unintuitive Jun 08 12:19:10 massoud: https://garage.maemo.org/projects/sleeppy/ Jun 08 12:19:16 but thanks for your corrections Jun 08 12:19:43 Treibholz: but if you want to go graphical, muttator might be for you. maybe not on the n900, though.. Jun 08 12:20:16 thp: muttator doesn't work on TB3, just on it's betas... Jun 08 12:20:32 ah, there is a textfield, once you start writing... it'd be great if it would start visible, and fade/scroll out Jun 08 12:20:41 mece: http://doc.trolltech.com/4.4/opengl-hellogl-es.html#using-opengl-es-rendering-commands Jun 08 12:20:46 *musings of a starting UX guy* Jun 08 12:20:53 mece: has some helpers on an issue which I think is similar to yours Jun 08 12:20:58 thp: on the Workstation I use 3 Mailclients in parallel because they all suck! Jun 08 12:20:59 aSIMULAtor: https://store.ovi.mobi/login — i just saw it and it reminded me of a conversation we had earlier Jun 08 12:21:23 thp: mutt, thunderbird and Outlook via RDP (because of the calendar) Jun 08 12:23:03 interesting. Jun 08 12:23:11 oh well. got to head out. Jun 08 12:23:31 tataa. Jun 08 12:23:50 I'm playing around with davmail, whoch gives me a CalDAV-Interface to Exchange, so I can see my calendar in lightning. Jun 08 12:23:57 another bug I guess will never be fixed is bug 10608 Jun 08 12:23:58 Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=10608 WM doesn't give focus to some apps, hence they don't receive keyboard input Jun 08 12:24:09 and it's so damn impairing. Jun 08 12:25:09 Duckboot: thanks. bug burried Jun 08 12:26:52 well, this seems to be just another "WONTFIX for Maemo 5" bug Jun 08 12:32:45 timeless_mbp: No probs Jun 08 12:36:49 Restoring factory settings deletes applications and converstaions? Jun 08 12:37:34 morning all Jun 08 12:37:40 moanin Jun 08 12:44:52 frals, hildon uses gtk 2.x right? Jun 08 12:48:06 gtk 1.x is still in used ? Jun 08 12:50:54 E0x: not on Maemo Jun 08 12:51:25 E0x, well, it's on pygtk.org so I was just wondering Jun 08 12:51:42 pygtk use 2.x Jun 08 12:51:47 also, I'd rather have a book than a pdf Jun 08 12:52:05 so i'm printing all 412 pages Jun 08 12:52:11 just need to be sure :) Jun 08 12:52:29 * Treibholz would love to have both. a PDF for every book! Jun 08 12:52:29 * b-man|laptop yawns Jun 08 12:52:47 infobot, attack b-man|laptop Jun 08 12:52:49 * infobot grabs a pen, screams like she's possessed, and begins chasing b-man|laptop Jun 08 12:52:58 * b-man|laptop runs like crazy Jun 08 12:54:06 any date for the rollercoaster game? Jun 08 12:54:50 ~shooot MohammadAG51 Jun 08 12:54:55 err Jun 08 12:55:00 ~shoot MohammadAG51 Jun 08 12:55:01 haha Jun 08 12:55:01 * infobot shoots MohammadAG51 in the foot with a quantum singularity weapon! Jun 08 12:55:04 ghostcube, asap! Jun 08 12:55:09 heh :) Jun 08 12:55:10 C would've done the same Jun 08 12:55:10 * lcuk wants to play also Jun 08 12:55:18 same Jun 08 12:55:26 hey, let's crack the ovi store Jun 08 12:55:28 :P Jun 08 12:55:29 C does always what everything else can and faster Jun 08 12:55:45 yeah ... so where to start fuzzing o.o Jun 08 12:55:52 MohammadAG51, pygtk is quite reasonable, and yes gtk on our device is 2.14.x Jun 08 12:56:17 hmmm android 2.2 anyone seen the new features Jun 08 12:56:23 looks cool Jun 08 12:57:22 baaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah Jun 08 12:57:26 * frals goes back to reading mail Jun 08 12:57:47 can n900 run WebOS? Jun 08 12:57:49 * b-man|laptop would consider plying with porting 2.2 to the N900, but the development tools necessary take too much disk space lol Jun 08 12:57:55 possibly Jun 08 12:58:04 i've ran parts of in in a chroot Jun 08 12:58:12 most probably, if you add water Jun 08 12:58:15 b-man|laptop: ++ Jun 08 12:58:23 what is missing? Jun 08 12:58:27 the Plm Pre's cpu is identical to the N900's Jun 08 12:58:32 well Jun 08 12:58:41 execution environment? Jun 08 12:58:50 i (think) it needs a 32bit framebuffer Jun 08 12:59:03 but Jun 08 12:59:13 i haven't tested the ui Jun 08 12:59:51 can you pls take notes in a thread, blog or wiki? Jun 08 13:00:10 sure lol Jun 08 13:00:51 if meego thinks it can compete for mindspace at this stage it needs to bring a compelling compatibility case Jun 08 13:01:13 * b-man|laptop will take notes on the maemo wiki - tmo is too negative and violent atm lol Jun 08 13:01:19 yes Jun 08 13:02:13 i'm 87% certain that with modifications, we can get it running ;) Jun 08 13:02:40 Stskeeps made a brief attempt at running it on his N900 Jun 08 13:03:06 but was not very successful Jun 08 13:03:25 * GAN900 wonders why Apple can manage not to drop their old customers like rocks yet Nokia can't pull it off. Jun 08 13:03:45 * b-man|laptop wonders the saame Jun 08 13:03:50 *same Jun 08 13:04:11 what maemo-derived thing was announced to compete with webOS? Jun 08 13:04:19 forgot the name Jun 08 13:06:43 MeeGo? Jun 08 13:06:45 great, my pr 1.1 phone won't boot because something in the phone app corrupted Jun 08 13:06:50 any suggestions? Jun 08 13:06:58 i think limited resources may be best spend doing the low-level work needed to run existing app catalogues, whatever reverse engineering that involves is a solid investment Jun 08 13:07:02 it keeps rebooting itself Jun 08 13:07:16 flux: why not just reflash it? Jun 08 13:07:23 asj_, and lose all the data? Jun 08 13:07:31 pupnik, the web runtime stuff? Jun 08 13:07:34 flux: don't flash the emmc Jun 08 13:07:38 yeah web runtime Jun 08 13:07:42 asj_, oh. well, gotta try that then. Jun 08 13:08:05 asj_, it will get rid of all my /etc stuff though? Jun 08 13:08:08 so what if meego is a Borg OS. at this stage it has to be Jun 08 13:08:24 flux: yes, everything but /home will be reset Jun 08 13:08:24 is there a way to make it boot so that it doesn't as easily autoreboot itself? Jun 08 13:08:25 i would prefere someone port android 2.2 to the n900 Jun 08 13:08:26 :D Jun 08 13:08:34 asj_, I actually think /home is the culprit Jun 08 13:08:45 asj_, so what would reflashing help? Jun 08 13:09:06 damn stupid of me not to backup the data especially before rebooting it after it was acting weird :( Jun 08 13:09:25 there is no good reason for android to require a custom kernel ghostcube ... but maybe future mobile cpus will support virtualization Jun 08 13:09:27 wow, my N900 feels so thin after I swapped in the original battery Jun 08 13:09:35 :) Jun 08 13:09:59 flux: you can flash the emmc first if you want...up to you..look at flashing online Jun 08 13:10:11 ShadowJK: you have the 3000mah monster? Jun 08 13:10:13 pupnik: hmmm but if meego isnt running so far maybe android can help us getting the device back to live :D Jun 08 13:10:19 pupnik: it's kinda sad that HP is going to dump WebOS phones and start producing "WebOS fax/printers/scanners" instead :P Jun 08 13:10:22 asj, 2400mAh, I don't know of any 3000mAh Jun 08 13:10:32 ShadowJK: ah, close enogh ;) Jun 08 13:10:58 damn I should go to bed, too wired on ice cream and M&Ms Jun 08 13:11:44 it's moaning here Jun 08 13:11:48 ghostcube: well, i've spent some time porting dalvik to glibc Jun 08 13:11:54 moaning? Jun 08 13:12:00 gah Jun 08 13:12:15 ghostcube: so at some point n900 might run android apps Jun 08 13:12:21 oh cool Jun 08 13:12:27 i hate autocomplete :P Jun 08 13:12:35 ghostcube: but as far as i know there will be problem with google parts of api Jun 08 13:12:42 ghostcube: that are missing from sources Jun 08 13:12:59 *morning Jun 08 13:13:01 ghostcube: so that would have to be done in illegal way which is pulling them out of firmware for normal android phone Jun 08 13:13:22 like gui api for android apps Jun 08 13:14:07 hmmm, may we should finance chinese hackers :P Jun 08 13:14:09 which is what most people really want Jun 08 13:14:50 i'd rather support community based projects Jun 08 13:17:46 i think google will release the code Jun 08 13:19:34 not Jun 08 13:19:42 * MohammadAG51 goes back to lurking Jun 08 13:20:55 ghostcube: google relased code of everything Jun 08 13:21:04 ghostcube: except api for their services and stuff Jun 08 13:21:59 papo Jun 08 13:22:03 "The sms is being generated correctly when there is a missed call however it as it is not reaching your handset our supplier is requesting that you test on a different handset and confirm as they are unable to see any problems at their end." Jun 08 13:22:18 that sound like an issue someone else was/is having with their n900? Jun 08 13:22:30 jacekowski: hmmm, thats bad Jun 08 13:24:09 ghostcube: that can be just copied and pasted Jun 08 13:24:22 ghostcube: and i think it would be legal if it would be done by end user Jun 08 13:24:52 flailingmonkey: afaik, the Google closed parts of the Dalvik libs is pretty limited and easily reimplemented Jun 08 13:26:51 Ikarus: frankly there is no good reason for android apps to be tied to one OS, imo Jun 08 13:27:18 i would like to see that wall knocked down Jun 08 13:27:29 Ikarus: it's licensing problem Jun 08 13:27:47 you would first need a working JRE on Maemo, then the Google specific libs Jun 08 13:27:51 pupnik: So - There is a good possibility of x-compiling Android Apps to Maemo/Meego? Jun 08 13:28:01 Venemo: it's not jre Jun 08 13:28:07 jacekowski: no it isn't Jun 08 13:28:09 Duckboot: no Jun 08 13:28:09 Flandry, ping Jun 08 13:28:14 jacekowski: the dalvik vm itself can be ported Jun 08 13:28:20 jacekowski: the libraries can be reimplemented Jun 08 13:28:35 Duckboot: these apps are not compiled as such Jun 08 13:28:39 Duckboot: it's very similiar to java Jun 08 13:28:44 jacekowski: Ok? Is the Dalvik VM the culprit? Jun 08 13:28:53 yes Jun 08 13:29:00 Mmm - Ok. Jun 08 13:29:02 ltimately the DRM may be the roadblock Jun 08 13:29:04 everything runs on dalvik Jun 08 13:29:17 and there are 3 problems Jun 08 13:29:21 fucked up build system Jun 08 13:29:26 JRE for N900? i would be glad to have an working flash 10.x Jun 08 13:29:26 dependence on bionic Jun 08 13:29:37 ghostcube: i disabled flash Jun 08 13:29:43 and google libs Jun 08 13:29:56 lets encourage sites to adopt alternatives to flash Jun 08 13:30:06 bionic can be worked around Jun 08 13:30:08 particularly for video Jun 08 13:30:14 that would never arrive too Jun 08 13:30:14