**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Thu Oct 07 02:59:56 2010 Oct 07 03:55:03 Hi! What is the default size (in pixels) of the icons in the desktop of Fremantle? Oct 07 03:56:59 if no one else has an idea , I think they're in /usr/share/icons/ Oct 07 03:57:11 johnx: OK Oct 07 03:58:17 johnx: That, I think, doesn't answer the question since there are icons of multitude of sizes in that directory. Oct 07 03:59:33 hmm, I guess I was thinking you could view the icon on the device and see if it's the same size as the icons you're interested in Oct 07 03:59:53 johnx: OK. Oct 07 04:00:04 Nevertheless, I think it's 65px Oct 07 04:00:19 my guess would be 64px or 48px Oct 07 04:00:31 65px just seems a bit "weird" somehow Oct 07 04:04:33 Hmm. Anyway, what is the "proper" or community-advised way of opening URLs on the command line? Oct 07 04:05:01 Open in the sense that it would load the default web browser Oct 07 04:05:49 my bet would be dbus send Oct 07 04:07:27 Is it documented somewhere? Are you referring to the one at http://wiki.maemo.org/Phone_control Oct 07 04:08:13 that looks like a good reference :) Oct 07 04:08:46 so nice their terminal app launches urls now Oct 07 04:08:47 if we had xdg-open like on a linux desktop, I think you might be able to use that, but since we don't have it the right answer is probably dbus-send Oct 07 04:09:27 that gives people who want a different browser a chance to intercept it with browser-switchboard (or whatever it's called) and run their own browser when you send that dbus message Oct 07 04:09:39 anyways, taking an early night Oct 07 04:09:43 'night all Oct 07 04:10:11 cy Oct 07 04:47:48 Hello Oct 07 04:48:32 n810: successfully using the internal 2GB flash as root partition!! (and the 256mb as backup) Oct 07 04:52:29 thanks to pb/pbeasy scripts by uh... pb =) Oct 07 04:59:36 so... do we have working howto for uboot on n8x0? Oct 07 05:02:13 slonopotamus: you're extinct since the cretaceous period. You're almost as obsolete as the N770 Oct 07 05:02:41 ... Oct 07 05:03:54 uh.... hello bye welcomeback Oct 07 05:04:54 swc|666: if we were on ##c, you would've been already autobanned for join flood. Oct 07 05:05:16 * swc|666 shrugs Oct 07 05:05:24 questions abot the boot loader: grey screen, black (pixelized) text BOOT MENU ... this is "nolo" right? Oct 07 05:05:30 s/abot/about/ Oct 07 05:05:30 delt meant: questions about the boot loader: grey screen, black (pixelized) text BOOT MENU ... this is "nolo" right? Oct 07 05:05:56 as in "nokia loader"? Oct 07 05:07:43 wash your screen, that aint grey, it's white Oct 07 05:08:01 just before saying "BOOT MENU" it flashes something about holding the "menu" key for advanced boot menu. The menu key is the thick line with a bunch of thin, shorter lines below it, right? Oct 07 05:08:37 4 shorter and thinner lines to be more exact Oct 07 05:10:06 delt: like this? http://labs.vivi.eng.br/blog/images/dualbootmenuonN800-small.jpg Oct 07 05:10:27 it is (surprise!) bootmenu Oct 07 05:12:08 something like that, yes, but with different boot partition names... + at the bottom (under Press UP/DOWN) it also says: "Press HOME key for USB network recovery mode" (even when usb is not connected) Oct 07 05:13:49 that's bootmenu (shell hackish thing installable to initfs that allows to choose what partition to boot from + some nice features) Oct 07 05:15:54 ah ok. thanks for that info =) Oct 07 05:16:13 btw sorry about the obsolete/dinosaur thing, was jk Oct 07 05:18:12 delt: np. living since cretaceous period allowed learning lots of stuff Oct 07 05:18:26 okie, so now that i have this boot menu, my first question (apart from holding menu key does nothing) .... how do i put the N810 in "USB mode" (which was previously done with holding the "home" key (2 overlapping squares on the n810) during boot Oct 07 05:18:42 hehe =) wisdom in person Oct 07 05:19:19 oh, s/during boot/during boot with the USB cord plugged/ Oct 07 05:19:25 uh..... Oct 07 05:19:29 s/during boot/during boot with the USB cord plugged/ Oct 07 05:20:05 you/get/the/idea/ Oct 07 05:21:41 that "hold menu thing" is needed because you could setup the thing to automatically boot from some partition _without_ showing boot choices _unless_ some activity from you (holding menu key) Oct 07 05:22:25 oh, aforementioned "home key" thing puts up a telnet server with fixed address 192.168.10.1 ...... i'm looking for the normal "usb mode" with the nokia logo and the blue USB logo in the upper right corner Oct 07 05:22:48 that's not a mode Oct 07 05:22:51 it's the bootloader Oct 07 05:22:54 think of it as of ubuntu's grub "press ESC to choose boot options, otherwise i'll start booting default thing ib 3 seconds" Oct 07 05:23:08 s/ ib / in / Oct 07 05:23:08 slonopotamus: that was my other question =) how do i change the delay before it auto-selects which partition to boot? Oct 07 05:23:08 slonopotamus meant: think of it as of ubuntu's grub "press ESC to choose boot options, otherwise i'll start booting default thing in 3 seconds" Oct 07 05:23:45 .... or turns off, which i noticed it does after a few minutes, which is cool so it won't hang there until the screen is burned Oct 07 05:24:19 re Oct 07 05:24:25 did you get: 01:23 < delt> .... or turns off, which i noticed it does after a few minutes, which is cool so it won't hang there until the screen is burned Oct 07 05:24:25 meh, network issues Oct 07 05:24:35 that "hold menu thing" is needed because you could setup the thing to automatically boot from some partition _without_ showing boot choices _unless_ some activity from you (holding menu key) Oct 07 05:24:41 think of it as of ubuntu's grub "press ESC to choose boot options, otherwise i'll start booting default thing in 3 seconds" Oct 07 05:24:55 ah, that was the last 2 lines you wrote before getting flushed =) Oct 07 05:25:03 personally im more familiar with lilo Oct 07 05:25:05 than grub... Oct 07 05:25:06 strange Oct 07 05:25:32 and "usb mode"... actually i have no idea wtf it is :) Oct 07 05:25:35 so, shift or ctrl in lilo when the delay is set to zero, right? Oct 07 05:26:45 LILO has been obsolete for years Oct 07 05:26:47 :p Oct 07 05:27:28 or windoze F8 Oct 07 05:27:32 before changing boot stuff, connecting to the PC's usb port and holding "home" (2 squares in diagonal) would show the white screen w/ a blue nokia logo and a blue-grayish usb icon on the top right corner Oct 07 05:27:51 s/"home"/"home" while turning on the n810/ Oct 07 05:27:51 delt meant: before changing boot stuff, connecting to the PC's usb port and holding "home" while turning on the n810 (2 squares in diagonal) would show the white screen w/ a blue nokia logo and a blue-grayish usb icon on the top right corner Oct 07 05:28:27 thanks, bot Oct 07 05:29:02 delt: _maybe_ that launches usb recovery mode (usb networking is set up on tablet and ssh damon is started so you can connect from pc and do some hackery if you broke os boot) Oct 07 05:29:03 or, any other way to access the 2GB internal flash over usb? Oct 07 05:29:55 slonopotamus: telnet here, but i read some versions/impl/options/whatever have a ssh server... Oct 07 05:30:11 and yeah, puts itself in usb-network with address 192.168.10.1 Oct 07 05:30:32 tcp/usb/ip heh. Oct 07 05:31:38 luke-jr_: so lilo no longer works with my mobo and hdd partitions? =) (i don't remember buying that stuff from microsoft) Oct 07 05:31:57 delt: shrug Oct 07 05:32:10 that's like asking if DOS runs on them Oct 07 05:32:20 it might, but that doesn't make it any less obsolete Oct 07 05:32:29 or telnet. doesn't matter, some remote access thingie Oct 07 05:32:41 lilo works fine for me, just like it has for the past 15 years or so Oct 07 05:33:47 slonopotamus: yeah.... the other week my n810 was bricked, had to reflash it (kept rebooting at the white nokia screen) Oct 07 05:34:40 only thing i could do is plug the USB and press "home" (2 squares overlapping in diagonal)... that made at least the internal 2gb accessible as usb storage device Oct 07 05:34:56 s/is/was/ Oct 07 05:34:57 delt meant: only thing i could do was plug the USB and press "home" (2 squares overlapping in diagonal)... that made at least the internal 2gb accessible as usb storage device Oct 07 05:35:55 thanks again, smart bot -) Oct 07 05:36:16 usb network recovery is intended for cases when you know what exactly broke and can fix it but need access to rootfs contents for that Oct 07 05:37:18 slonopotamus: ie. the thing where i press home on the BOOT MENU, that starts up a telnet server? Oct 07 05:38:15 you just said yourself that it starts up usb network Oct 07 05:38:31 no point starting usb network if nothing is listening :P Oct 07 05:38:55 yes, tcp/ip over some weird "usb network" thing... then starts a telnet (or apparently ssh) server over that Oct 07 05:39:27 i just want the 2GB internal flash to be accessible to the PC as a storage device. Oct 07 05:39:29 it's just "tcp/ip over usb" Oct 07 05:39:59 afaik, undoable while os is running because it can't unmount it Oct 07 05:40:13 with the unmodified boot sequence, this was done simply by holding "home" and turning on the n810, while plugged to usb Oct 07 05:40:38 white screen with a blue nokia logo, and blue usb thing in the upper right corner. Oct 07 05:41:23 i know (or strongly suspect) that functionality is independent of whatever content of whatever flash/memory/whatever, internal or not Oct 07 05:41:32 "weird" usb network? Oct 07 05:41:40 just setup sshd/samba/whatever in maemo and access _any_ partition over network Oct 07 05:42:07 luke-jr_: see slonopotamus's reply =) Oct 07 05:42:21 delt: my point is that it's pretty standard Oct 07 05:42:41 delt: you said "weird", not me Oct 07 05:42:42 ah. havent been keeping up lately Oct 07 05:42:55 delt: it's been standard for about 6+ years now Oct 07 05:43:33 indeed i did.... and by "lately" well.... thats relative :/ (health issues) Oct 07 05:43:45 :/ Oct 07 05:44:35 time travel troubles? Oct 07 05:45:06 just the other day a very good friend of mine told someone (about me) "this guy's a computer expert" or something.... i heard it and said "yeah, i was 10-15 years ago" Oct 07 05:48:04 slonopotamus: ... Oct 07 05:48:24 so, back to topic.... you know what i mean by "normal usb mode", ie. white "nokia" screen, blue USB logo in the upper right corner? Oct 07 05:48:59 let's assume yes :) Oct 07 05:49:02 I think so Oct 07 05:49:11 AFAIK the only way to make that remain is flasher Oct 07 05:49:25 and internal 2gb showing up over USB as a storage device Oct 07 05:49:38 agreed Oct 07 05:49:41 possible, but I doubt anyone has noticed it Oct 07 05:50:18 heh i did =) Oct 07 05:50:56 i luv my little logger thing at the bottom of the screen :D Oct 07 05:51:01 I've noticed lately that my N900 has at times shown up as Mass Storage even though I never tell it to Oct 07 05:51:03 might be during boot Oct 07 05:56:41 ok.... next possibility is to boot from the 256MB jffs2, which would normally let the 2GB memory (and all partitions on it) show up over USB? Oct 07 05:57:15 hey Oct 07 05:57:43 whats up with talk.maemo.org? Oct 07 05:58:39 Pillum: outrage ensued so Nokia shut it down permanently Oct 07 05:58:54 the rest of maemo.org to follow since Maemo is dead Oct 07 05:59:12 (no, not really) Oct 07 06:00:30 :/ Oct 07 06:00:54 someone got a link to the latest EFF script? Oct 07 06:00:55 Pillum: general practice here it to read TMO once a month Oct 07 06:01:01 right now, just booted from the 256MB jffs2, nothing on the n810 accessing any partition on the internal 2GB flash. i should normally be able to access it over USB? Oct 07 06:02:00 delt: srsly, just buy a cheap USB drive… Oct 07 06:02:20 uh.... what for? Oct 07 06:02:41 sounds like that's what you want Oct 07 06:03:32 umm no, i want to be able to access this linux (ext2) partition from the PC and fix it if some shit like 2 weeks ago ever happens again Oct 07 06:04:24 s/ext2/ext3/ Oct 07 06:04:24 delt meant: umm no, i want to be able to access this linux (ext3) partition from the PC and fix it if some shit like 2 weeks ago ever happens again Oct 07 06:04:25 sorry Oct 07 06:04:35 s/ext3/ext2 Oct 07 06:05:25 delt: so use flasher to lock the NOLO USB mode Oct 07 06:05:38 lock...? Oct 07 06:05:53 yeah, unless you specify -b it leaves it in USB mode Oct 07 06:06:04 so just do --get-rd-flags or smth Oct 07 06:07:27 yeah, i suspect bootmenu must pass some commandline args to the kernel (root=/dev/blah....?) Oct 07 06:07:41 … Oct 07 06:07:43 no Oct 07 06:07:57 kernel runs bootmenu. not the other way. Oct 07 06:08:03 bootmenu is just a bash script Oct 07 06:08:26 the NOKIA logo and stuff before bootmenu is the real bootloader Oct 07 06:08:39 but it's closed source and irreplacable Oct 07 06:08:39 ie. "nolo"? Oct 07 06:08:43 yes Oct 07 06:09:49 so, "bootmenu.sh" is somewhere on the root filesystem or on an initrd image, then? Oct 07 06:10:02 N8x0 has an initrd partition Oct 07 06:10:14 N900 just has it in the rootfs Oct 07 06:10:14 the 256mb one? Oct 07 06:10:27 the 256 MB NAND has many partitions Oct 07 06:10:51 ok.... the main one (largest) being what is normally the rootfs Oct 07 06:10:57 right Oct 07 06:11:00 initfs is another one Oct 07 06:11:04 ah ok.... Oct 07 06:11:35 so normally there is NO way to mount these as USB storage from a PC right? Oct 07 06:11:49 nope, they're not block devices Oct 07 06:11:54 USB storage is for block devices Oct 07 06:13:14 for contrast: Oct 07 06:13:23 ok..... so, when you boot with the 255.9999mb jffs partition as root, the 2gb internal chip is normally accessible through usb right? Oct 07 06:13:32 block dev = read, write; bad block = defective Oct 07 06:13:42 mtd dev = read, erase, write; bad block = normal Oct 07 06:13:54 no idea. Oct 07 06:14:24 haven't used Maemo on N8x0 in ages Oct 07 06:15:05 ok.... last question: how do i change the delay bootmenu waits before booting its default partition? Oct 07 06:15:10 someone got a link to the latest EFF script? Oct 07 06:15:40 im pretty sure i selected "1 second" in pb/pbeasy scripts, but now it just stays there for several minutes Oct 07 06:15:51 (if i dont touch anything) Oct 07 06:16:40 you mentioned the kernel runs this.... someone told me that before on this channel, which i didn't (and still don't) understand...... Oct 07 06:17:26 so if / isn't mounted yet (we are choosing WHAT to use as / )..... Oct 07 06:18:38 ahaha.. just read (in russian) "while nokia developed n8, samsung anounces galaxy, sold 5'000'000 units and abandoned it Oct 07 06:18:41 " Oct 07 06:18:43 ;) Oct 07 06:19:19 are they unhappy about the lack of 2.2? Oct 07 06:19:55 hi. is talk.maemo.org down? i cant seem to connect.. Oct 07 06:20:03 heh Oct 07 06:20:08 yay http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vwDAIUyVP7g Oct 07 06:20:25 TheJ: it seems so, was looking for it too :/ Oct 07 06:21:09 ok. thanks :) so it wasnt just me :) Oct 07 06:24:30 delt: initfs is of course / until a real rootfs is chosen Oct 07 06:28:49 luke-jr_: ok, makes sense (so far) :3 Oct 07 06:28:52 tired need sleep Oct 07 06:29:00 be back sometime tomorrow Oct 07 06:29:16 once again, thanks for all the help & useful info everyone Oct 07 07:24:03 tmo down? Oct 07 07:24:08 yes Oct 07 07:24:24 yipee Oct 07 07:24:33 yeah, just saved you 20 minutes Oct 07 07:24:54 20 minutes? MY WHOLE LIFE YOU MEAN! I am freeeeeeeeeee, FREEEEEEEEEEEE I TELL YOU Oct 07 07:25:17 haha there's like a million other things to waste my time on Oct 07 07:25:21 stupid internet Oct 07 07:26:10 TheJ:  yes cant reached either Oct 07 07:27:01 talk.maemo.org is online again...... Oct 07 07:27:08 WHAT Oct 07 07:27:10 .......NOT Oct 07 07:27:11 nooooooooooooooooooooooooo Oct 07 07:27:13 xD Oct 07 07:27:21 i refuse to test Oct 07 07:27:59 CreamyG, you don't have to: http://downforeveryoneorjustme.com/ Oct 07 07:28:18 no i refuse to go there if its working Oct 07 07:28:22 its like 1:30am Oct 07 07:28:28 lol :D Oct 07 07:28:32 and i gotta work at 9am Oct 07 07:28:33 so.... Oct 07 07:28:43 but why isnt it online= Oct 07 07:28:45 ? Oct 07 07:28:53 there was no warning or something like that Oct 07 07:29:05 no idea, probably malfunction Oct 07 07:29:07 maybe nokia had no money to pay the server :/ Oct 07 07:30:00 Yeah right Oct 07 07:30:12 you do realise that most big companies run on massive credit lines, yeah? Oct 07 07:30:40 yeah big companies don't need money Oct 07 07:30:44 just like the government Oct 07 07:30:51 You do realise Nokia is worth more than you'll ever earn as well right? Oct 07 07:31:11 You'll go bankrupt before Nokia Oct 07 07:31:22 hmmm i dunno, with the right patents, i could be worth more Oct 07 07:31:48 man you wouldnt recognise irony even if it would holding a sign reading "I am irony" Oct 07 07:31:50 :/ Oct 07 07:32:04 y'all suck Oct 07 07:33:32 I have been called much worse things than being told I suck, so. Oct 07 07:33:55 TermanaN900: where are u from? Oct 07 07:33:56 TermanaN900, how terribly insulting, maybe I make $1790410 every day! Oct 07 07:34:03 Heya derf, all Oct 07 07:34:12 TermanaN900, which, after 60 years, would make my net earnings around the same as Nokia's income. Oct 07 07:34:18 err, s/income/worth/ Oct 07 07:34:40 crashanddie, lol Oct 07 07:34:48 morning RST38h Oct 07 07:37:57 well i'm going to bed, gnight :P Oct 07 07:38:12 gnight sweety Oct 07 07:46:31 why isn't the topic "yes, talk is dead, don't ask" ? Oct 07 07:46:45 because nobody cares? Oct 07 07:46:51 touche Oct 07 07:47:35 omg, talk is dead Oct 07 07:53:27 OMG OMG OMG where can we troll now? :'( Oct 07 07:53:35 why is it dead? Oct 07 07:53:36 :P Oct 07 07:54:06 Stskeeps: the evil meego (hello!) people shut it down? Oct 07 07:54:55 tybollt: i'm not evil :( Oct 07 07:55:23 which btw _is_ an interesting topic - seeing as things are what they are how long will nokia support maemo community? At some point they'll go all in Meego - right? Oct 07 07:55:39 forum.meego.com is down too, fwiw Oct 07 07:55:49 heh ok. Oct 07 07:56:06 Stskeeps: suppose you don't care to make a prediction, then? Oct 07 07:56:25 tybollt: there's some chatter somewhere about the topic Oct 07 07:56:36 Morning, all Oct 07 07:56:37 nokia releases binary blobs for meego on n900, we all move to meego Oct 07 07:56:43 "community edition" Oct 07 07:56:50 kerio: url? Oct 07 07:56:57 it was just a hunch Oct 07 07:57:03 :( Oct 07 07:57:12 no hunches here, only pure facts Oct 07 07:57:44 kerio: we did already Oct 07 07:57:45 to some extent - meego may not be all binary blawbs Oct 07 07:58:00 that's what gpl is for Oct 07 07:58:09 i'm not talking about harmattan + meegohandset Oct 07 07:58:14 i'm talking meego Oct 07 07:58:18 and all that rpm shit Oct 07 07:58:30 kerio: ? There will be a harmattan? Oct 07 07:59:05 wasn't that going to be essentially meego? Man I'm outdated... Oct 07 08:00:33 there will be a harmattan, it'll probably have the meego ui Oct 07 08:00:38 but it will be maemo, internally Oct 07 08:00:42 ~messybox Oct 07 08:00:42 messy... err busybox is meant for lean scripting. Regarding all the missing options and immanent limitations (see su) it's not really the interactive shell of choice. A lot of people hate busybox because a lot of system integrators don't understand the difference between busybox and a decent user interactive shell plus unix utils Oct 07 08:04:25 i'm somehow expecting nokia to actually make a real (ie forceful) push for the maemo community to integrate into meego, and expecting a lot of sore feelings out of it Oct 07 08:04:51 is meego better than maemo, except for rpm? Oct 07 08:05:13 from what i've seen, i'd say that it can be better Oct 07 08:06:29 does it use pulseaudio? Oct 07 08:06:46 the libmeegotouch solves a lot of bs, the UI itself seems more polished, and with an actual standard to guarantee what libs be present on the system, it's going to be better in theory Oct 07 08:06:51 yeah, pulseaudio is still there :( Oct 07 08:07:09 but then, what can it be realistically replaced with? Oct 07 08:07:40 i've had the misfortune of dealing with the pulseaudio api, and i know exactly how ugly it is.. but it does get the job done with the least system resources Oct 07 08:07:54 least system resources? Oct 07 08:07:56 wtf am i reading Oct 07 08:08:17 versus other servers? unless you wanted to just run alsa with dmix :P Oct 07 08:09:04 hy, talk.maemo.org down? Oct 07 08:09:54 flexxxv: yes, and there's nothing but rumour as to why Oct 07 08:10:47 ok thx. Just wanted to find out how to use wpa2 enterprise... Oct 07 08:20:28 Talk is up again Oct 07 08:23:25 but for how long! Oct 07 08:28:09 i get a db error when i load it Oct 07 08:28:16 "MySQL Error : Error writing file '/tmp/MYMjJjGj' (Errcode: 28)" Oct 07 08:30:20 haha, that means it's out of disk space Oct 07 08:51:25 "Bondage Stories is now following you on Twitter!" <- I'm doing something right :D Oct 07 08:51:44 ~grab mece Oct 07 08:52:08 Crap, infobot, you need some features enhancements Oct 07 08:52:18 hahaha Oct 07 09:30:30 is there mono on n900? Oct 07 09:36:05 the mic is mono. Oct 07 09:36:18 :D Oct 07 09:36:40 I'm sure there is no mono on N900, but there might be mono for N900. Oct 07 09:36:48 (except for the mic) Oct 07 09:45:00 can mono even be compiled on arm? Oct 07 09:45:30 yep Oct 07 09:45:34 there is mono for n810 Oct 07 09:45:40 but no info about n900 Oct 07 09:45:51 huh, interesting Oct 07 09:45:57 well, it's not standard i'm sure Oct 07 09:46:05 http://www.mono-project.com/Maemo Oct 07 09:47:03 heh, i get a 403 when i try to hit the referenced http://go-mono.com/maemo/ url Oct 07 09:48:02 directory listing is probably forbidden Oct 07 09:50:10 ah, indeed Oct 07 09:50:33 well, there is no fremantle dir just the same Oct 07 09:51:02 might be a deb floating around, or there are instructions there on how to compile Oct 07 10:12:04 thp: Around? Oct 07 10:16:02 RST38h: indeed Oct 07 10:17:19 Hey all, can I write and compile C programs on N900? Oct 07 10:17:45 I guess in principle you could install the same tools used in scratchbox to N900? Oct 07 10:20:17 I have gcc on mine Oct 07 10:20:20 though in a chroot Oct 07 10:20:32 It can be installed on / - but that uses most of the free space Oct 07 10:21:13 ah okay, thats another question, why is the application space so limited compared to the overall space? Oct 07 10:21:35 because the root device is 256M - this is one limit Oct 07 10:21:55 the other limit is due to the fact that the main part of the space must be VFAT to enable it to plug into things Oct 07 10:22:10 From a consumer POV anyway Oct 07 10:22:11 so it's a power specification thing Oct 07 10:22:27 ? Oct 07 10:22:31 no - nothing to do with power Oct 07 10:22:34 VFAT to plug into things Oct 07 10:22:37 plug into power things? Oct 07 10:22:40 no Oct 07 10:22:42 oh Oct 07 10:22:58 printers to read and print photos, windows computers to drag on/off files Oct 07 10:23:02 ... Oct 07 10:23:08 oh the usb thing Oct 07 10:23:14 okay cool Oct 07 10:24:52 Please don't write nor compile C code if you don't understand what SpeedEvil is talking about Oct 07 10:27:45 if you mean on the N900 you're protecting me from screwing things up, if you're talking about in general you're being not nice Oct 07 10:27:58 so? Oct 07 10:28:06 so thanks or no thanks? Oct 07 10:28:08 you have no idea what are we talking about Oct 07 10:28:19 and you want to write programs Oct 07 10:28:19 and what were you talking about? Oct 07 10:28:39 the only think I read you say was so Oct 07 10:28:41 goodbye Oct 07 10:29:02 ragequits and don't come back Oct 07 10:29:54 :p Oct 07 10:33:51 u bad people :/ Oct 07 10:34:27 2 down a whole forum to go Oct 07 10:38:11 Besides I did say please Oct 07 10:38:23 :p Oct 07 10:49:44 Myrtti: you emoquit! Oct 07 10:50:15 re all Oct 07 10:51:23 hmm Oct 07 10:51:37 is operators blockign SIP common practice? Oct 07 10:53:56 tybollt: some of them do, I heard Oct 07 10:54:58 tybollt: vodafone in the uk do Oct 07 10:57:41 tybollt: different providers block different things, here I can only use http and the phone Oct 07 11:00:16 that's unfortunate Oct 07 11:00:40 my provider doesn't block it, but somehow i'll bet money they forbid it in their terms of service Oct 07 11:01:36 ieatlint: I can do irc in feeenode on 8000 sometimes ;) Oct 07 11:01:48 can you do 22? Oct 07 11:02:05 just change provider if they dont provide the service you need Oct 07 11:02:16 heh, not always an option Oct 07 11:02:17 ieatlint: nope Oct 07 11:02:32 no-one else here with coverage Oct 07 11:02:35 jpinx-eeepc: that's pretty shitty Oct 07 11:02:46 cehteh: check my whois... Oct 07 11:03:00 yeah, here i have my choice between just two carriers, and one of the two has an incompatible 3g network... so i have 1 choice if i want 3g Oct 07 11:03:52 I gave up with 3g - it's just gprs here Oct 07 11:04:05 edge i hope Oct 07 11:04:11 gprs is too painful... Oct 07 11:04:15 I can possibly get 3g in the capitol, but not around the country Oct 07 11:08:02 my carrier claims there is 3g roaming there on "true move", but isn't clear on its map where it's 2g and where it's 3g Oct 07 11:08:58 Hope PR1.3 comes with Qt Mobility 1.1 Oct 07 11:10:03 thp: Sorry for delay, got an idea Oct 07 11:10:28 thp: As you are hackinghildon-desktop anyway, would you consider adding launcher icons rotation by 90 degrees when in portrait orientation? Oct 07 11:10:43 thp: (notice that it is not the full portrait mode, just rotated icons) Oct 07 11:11:18 And there is a clear spot in the source code where this can be added Oct 07 11:15:28 how do you guys solve the OTA contacts sync problem w/ your N900? Oct 07 11:15:49 by not having any contacts Oct 07 11:15:53 * maybeWTF runs & hides Oct 07 11:16:32 tybollt: what issue? Oct 07 11:18:09 tybollt: got a link to a bug or something Oct 07 11:22:28 hi guys, anyone having issues login to yahoo IM via conversation with the telepathy haze plugin? Oct 07 11:22:38 on the N900 of cause :p Oct 07 11:25:46 Might write a share via ssh service plugin, would be cool for uploading to webspace etc. Oct 07 11:28:28 alterego: i've heard others ask for a script based plugin for that ... for instance, you just have it execute a user-defined script with the files being the arguments Oct 07 11:28:54 an scp script would be an easy feat, and the plugin could be more versatile .. just an idea :P Oct 07 11:29:24 or i could finally get off my ass and implement that myself, heh Oct 07 11:30:35 Yeah, not a bad idea, might be even better to write a python based sharing plugin api Oct 07 11:30:50 More flexible and you can have full access to progress etc. Oct 07 11:31:03 not a bad idea Oct 07 11:31:52 Would be a nice sunday project Oct 07 11:32:13 if you could find a way to work in a password prompt, it'd be even cooler Oct 07 11:32:30 might be able to throw up a modal dialogue without completely changing focus Oct 07 11:33:16 hrm, i'm suddenly getting a rush of ideas, perhaps i should get off my ass and try to do something like this Oct 07 11:41:14 hi all, Oct 07 11:41:19 anyone from France here? Oct 07 11:41:27 need some local related info Oct 07 11:41:40 can someone help me in that Oct 07 11:43:15 Khertan was the one from France here and now he isn't logged in Oct 07 11:43:20 ~seen Khertan Oct 07 11:43:24 khertan <507da5b5@gateway/web/freenode/ip.80.125.165.181> was last seen on IRC in channel #maemo, 5d 18h 27m 38s ago, saying: 'RST38h, but yes it s possible has we have many electricals problem on the electrical network many out of power every day. And when i start electrical device i can see light blinking'. Oct 07 11:52:50 * timeless_mbp reaches 11 days ago! Oct 07 11:55:08 vkvraju, crashanddie is french I believe. Oct 07 11:55:45 Oh ok, Thanks mecel Oct 07 11:55:53 but looks like he is inactive now Oct 07 11:56:09 ~seen crashanddie Oct 07 11:56:12 crashanddie is currently on #maemo (4h 58m 37s). Has said a total of 12 messages. Is idling for 3h 4m 2s, last said: 'Crap, infobot, you need some features enhancements'. Oct 07 11:58:59 All time low for tracker, seems to have indexed some images in my browser cache .. Oct 07 11:59:31 alterego: nice Oct 07 12:06:03 RST38h: so just rotating each icon by 90 degrees, keeping their position? Oct 07 12:07:02 thp: yep Oct 07 12:07:11 thp: it is basically one clutter call in the right place Oct 07 12:07:16 hi rooomies Oct 07 12:08:16 RST38h: neat Oct 07 12:56:40 hrm Oct 07 12:56:56 "software updaed" or "update complete"? Oct 07 12:57:26 s/ae/ate/ Oct 07 12:57:27 timeless_xchat meant: "software updated" or "update complete"? Oct 07 12:58:12 is the update complete? Oct 07 12:58:38 probably Oct 07 12:58:41 the user may find upgrades for things that he wouldn't immediately recognize as software Oct 07 12:58:45 overkill software successfully updated! ;) Oct 07 12:58:55 kerio : yeah Oct 07 12:58:58 "update completed" tells the user that *something* has been updated Oct 07 12:59:08 that's why i'm considering switching Oct 07 12:59:16 since you understand, i think i will Oct 07 12:59:40 bonus points if you use a voice synthesizer to read it to the user Oct 07 12:59:45 ... Oct 07 12:59:47 in a really robotic voice Oct 07 12:59:50 this is ham Oct 07 12:59:59 good point, it's already bloated and slow enough Oct 07 13:00:08 without adding the overhead of the synth *and* of pulseaudio Oct 07 13:00:11 i'm not changing software Oct 07 13:00:56 this update would fit into "update complete" but arguably not "software updated" Oct 07 13:01:48 * timeless_xchat eyes centos, linux Oct 07 13:02:35 RST38h: why not try it yourself? ;) Oct 07 13:03:16 thp: thanks for the publicity btw :) Oct 07 13:03:35 Stskeeps: np. thanks for the packages ;) Oct 07 13:05:09 woohoo Oct 07 13:05:34 in a minute, i'll no longer need to take my passport with me to the bank Oct 07 13:05:52 getting a citizens card? Oct 07 13:05:52 :P Oct 07 13:06:03 national id Oct 07 13:06:08 http://www.gsmarena.com/nokia_n8_vs_samsung_pixon12_vs_sony_dsc_hx5v-review-519.php Oct 07 13:06:14 * SpeedEvil forgets where timeless is. Oct 07 13:06:16 .nl? Oct 07 13:06:19 "good enough for government work" Oct 07 13:06:19 <|R> http://maemo.org/packages/package_instance/view/fremantle_extras-testing_free_armel/lugdulov/0.2.2-2/ <- can some of you vote for this? I've been using it for a while and it's a wonderful bike sharing app, it'd be great to see it in extra :-) Oct 07 13:07:31 speedevil : when i'm on my n900 (as now), whois tends to give me away Oct 07 13:07:47 ah Oct 07 13:09:14 ok, next: get approval to take pre funded trips in november Oct 07 13:10:35 anyone in town for a limited time only? Oct 07 13:11:06 free thursday is today Oct 07 13:12:22 aahhhhhhhhhhhhhh! engadget i hate you Oct 07 13:12:50 heh, y? Oct 07 13:13:21 no meegos until next year Oct 07 13:13:31 blah. Oct 07 13:13:39 toggles: that's intel saying it Oct 07 13:13:40 I guess i'll need to get a nexus one Oct 07 13:13:54 Stskeeps: yeah yeah ;-) Oct 07 13:14:00 * timeless_xchat chuckles Oct 07 13:14:00 i mean, what would intel know? Oct 07 13:14:02 :P Oct 07 13:15:28 that just means you can't get MePad from Intel this ar :) Oct 07 13:15:33 s/ar/year/ Oct 07 13:15:33 timeless_xchat meant: that just means you can't get MePad from Intel this year :) Oct 07 13:19:17 if it's not possible to upload packages to the SDK repos, and it's only possible to upload a library to extras-devel (which is only ARMEL), then how am I supposed to test my programs on scratchbox if the UI doesn't work on the ARMEL target ? Oct 07 13:21:02 err Oct 07 13:21:07 devel accepts both archs Oct 07 13:21:12 X86 and ARMEL Oct 07 13:22:11 but then it doesn't support the same version of both targets if I had uploaded one already. Can I used dpkg-buildpackage to build both targets at the same time with a new version ? Oct 07 13:23:27 it supports archs of the same version Oct 07 13:24:32 yes but I had already uploaded ARMEL before, I'm trying to upload i386 now and it's rejecting the package complaining that it already exists. Oct 07 13:25:19 bump version number? Oct 07 13:26:03 would it be right to have different versions for different targets if it's exactly the same code ? Oct 07 13:26:06 jacktheripper, make the source build both armel and x86 Oct 07 13:26:21 build-dep: in debian/rules Oct 07 13:26:40 build-indep: for stuff like icons, changelogs, non arch dependant stuff Oct 07 13:26:53 Architecture: all in debian/control Oct 07 13:27:00 read debian packaging documentation Oct 07 13:32:34 alterego: like oh... say doing it _at all_ w/ the N900? Oct 07 13:36:03 Isn't it just my lucky day! I can create a FREE :* account at a web cam site, because it's been offered to me because I am such a sweetie. The person who is offering it is magically able to change faces as well, displaying a new picture everytime I visit the same great sign up link Oct 07 13:36:18 And ALL I need to do is add my information to the form, COMPLETELY FREE Oct 07 13:36:35 Just as long as I add my credit card information, which WONT be charged :* Oct 07 13:36:39 thp: I would (even located file and function) but I do not have time even to maintain my own stuff nowadays =( Oct 07 13:39:53 vkvraju, how can I help? Oct 07 13:40:46 thp: And building hildon-desktop in SB2 is bound to be ..mm... fun Oct 07 13:57:39 lol: http://5z8.info/facebook-of-sex_o7y0n_IE-exploiter Oct 07 14:34:44 alterego: ping Oct 07 14:35:42 oops Oct 07 14:35:47 * timeless_mbp confuses weeks Oct 07 14:35:52 free thursday is next week :o Oct 07 14:36:09 eat your pea soup and get to work Oct 07 14:36:59 Anyone knows when Qt 4.7 is coming to Maemo 5? Oct 07 14:37:18 hopefully Oct 07 14:44:37 Venemo_N900, I'm saying between today and today + 2^64 days. Oct 07 14:45:26 crashanddie: haha! Oct 07 15:24:27 venemo_n900: qt4.7 is coming to meego, and nokia wants the n900 to be the dev platform for meego Oct 07 15:24:54 does this mean they'll give n900s to people at meego summit? Oct 07 15:24:57 no wait :) Oct 07 15:25:10 didn't they do that last time? Oct 07 15:25:28 where's the originality in that? Oct 07 15:31:49 timeless_xchat: they're simply not going to appear there at all ! that's one thing that has never been done before... Oct 07 15:33:29 lcukn900: ping Oct 07 15:41:28 Quick question, is PyQwt available in one of the repos? Oct 07 15:49:00 lardman: if you are referring to PyQt, then yes Oct 07 15:49:14 no, pyqwt Oct 07 15:50:07 i.e. http://qwt.sourceforge.net/ Oct 07 15:50:25 oops, or even http://pyqwt.sourceforge.net/ Oct 07 15:53:06 hmm, seems not, nor even numpy Oct 07 16:01:18 sorry, I just went away Oct 07 16:01:30 crashanddie: you there? Oct 07 16:01:49 ~seen crashanddie Oct 07 16:01:52 crashanddie is currently on #maemo (9h 4m 16s). Has said a total of 15 messages. Is idling for 1h 17m 14s, last said: 'Venemo_N900, I'm saying between today and today + 2^64 days.'. Oct 07 16:02:20 Anybody see the story on Engadget? Oct 07 16:02:46 which one? Oct 07 16:02:49 'not until 2011'? Oct 07 16:02:53 Anybody want to bet the whole MeeGo-MeeGo/vendor-MeeGo doesn't make statements like that so much more complicated. Oct 07 16:02:56 Yeah Oct 07 16:03:12 i sense some VP got an angry call from another EVP Oct 07 16:04:19 especially cos 'why the fuck is intel the one being all-knowing if there'll be a meego handset' Oct 07 16:04:55 The Intel-handset/ARM-handset point makes it even more interesting Oct 07 16:10:52 yes, was a bit of a direct answer, I expected more dancing around Oct 07 16:17:45 I read wine 1.3.4 has arm-support, does that mean it' doesn't need qemu anymore to emulate? Oct 07 16:18:31 http://www.winehq.org/announce/1.3.4 Oct 07 16:20:34 pog: i doubt that Oct 07 16:20:42 RST38h: apt-get source hildon-desktop && apt-get build-dep hildon-desktop && cd hildon-desktop-* && dpkg-buildpackage -b isn't that hard ;) Oct 07 16:20:52 my guess is that you can recompile windows apps for arm now Oct 07 16:21:04 pog: It means that wine can run WinCE applications now Oct 07 16:21:53 WinCE... Oct 07 16:24:10 hi folks, i just read that flash 10.1 needs 800 mhz cpu minimum? is this the same for the mobile version cause then it wont be working on N900 or? Oct 07 16:25:01 10.1 is not on the N900 for other reasons Oct 07 16:25:16 ghostcube: MHz mean nothing without mentioning exact cpu arch it's relating to Oct 07 16:25:52 i just read in ct and they were talking about an htc smartphone with 600 mhz android that wont run flash 10.1 Oct 07 16:26:03 MAD MHz != Intel MHz, so guess how much it means for Arm MHz Oct 07 16:26:07 dont know what arch is behind the htc Oct 07 16:26:10 chances are that's running a terrible ARM11 based CPU Oct 07 16:26:16 AMD* Oct 07 16:29:54 hi everyone do you know if theres any way to get a faster internet connection thru the n900 right now im conecting thru the nokia pcsuite on windows vista and its giving me a connection of 460 kbps Oct 07 16:44:14 Still no way to enable java in browser on n900? Oct 07 16:45:27 rodald: It would seem to be a problem with windows - I'm regularly getting >460K through USB. Oct 07 16:45:39 tethering with 'pc suite' mode in linux. Oct 07 16:45:56 I vaguely remember there is a generic solution ot make it faster for all broadband modems Oct 07 16:46:11 but I don't remember what it is, as I diddn't bother remembering Oct 07 16:47:23 hmm too bad thank you any way Oct 07 16:51:23 ghostcube: http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=835547&postcount=1292 Oct 07 16:51:49 SpeedEvil: how does tethering with pc suite mode work? Oct 07 16:52:39 SpeedEvil: how does tethering with pc suite mode work? Oct 07 16:53:14 SpeedEvil: sorry for repeating, got confused from playing with network connections and thought i was offline Oct 07 16:53:35 i get the n900 appearing as a USB ethernet adaptor, but it doesn't seem to act as a gateway Oct 07 16:53:40 Stskeeps: thx so it works heh Oct 07 16:53:51 (and i can't see how it could with the stock, netfilterless, kernel) Oct 07 17:06:05 * Stskeeps watches the lemmings go wild: http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=835556&postcount=1293 Oct 07 17:08:42 meh, gpsjinni update wants to install new libillumination 2.7MB - WTF? Oct 07 17:11:13 I feel like nuking gpsjinni, for such nonsense shoving down my throat without proper WARNING Oct 07 17:14:11 sigh Oct 07 17:15:13 Stskeeps: Meego on an x86 netbook? Oct 07 17:17:26 RST38h: n900, meego Oct 07 17:19:49 meh hooray gpsjinni freezing when hitting "Diagrams" - cpu 100. sure I want a new 2.7MB lib to implement such great feature Oct 07 17:20:05 * DocScrutinizer51 removes gpsjinni Oct 07 17:27:12 Stskeeps: Won't work on Maemo5, I assume? Oct 07 17:31:07 BCMM: I just setup pppd on the linux box, then pppd call t-mobile after pluggin in the phone, and clicking 'pc suite' mode Oct 07 17:31:30 SpeedEvil: oh, i don't know anything about ppp Oct 07 17:32:04 SpeedEvil: presumably, one could also use netfilter from kernel-power and a DHCP server on the device? Oct 07 17:32:17 it's ctrl-shift-p to take screenshots, right? Oct 07 17:34:38 yep Oct 07 17:40:15 RST38h: http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=835588&postcount=1297 Oct 07 17:40:17 moin Oct 07 17:40:38 stskeeps: wowowow Oct 07 17:40:54 RST38h: no gpu acceleration though Oct 07 17:40:59 Stskeeps: I doner if the lemmings will understand the significance of these screenshots :) Oct 07 17:41:09 Ah, screw gpu acceleration.... Oct 07 17:41:17 s/doner/wonder/ Oct 07 17:43:29 so all you did was replace the flashplayer .so? Oct 07 17:44:05 all hedid was find or compile a new flashplayer.so ;) Oct 07 17:44:15 find Oct 07 17:44:27 now, where he got it, tht is a good question Oct 07 17:44:45 ah Oct 07 17:44:46 RST38h: it's referred further up in the thread Oct 07 17:44:58 aha Oct 07 17:45:05 cfh11's post Oct 07 17:47:08 * RST38h goes off to order a copy Oct 07 17:48:08 U.S. Government export approval Oct 07 17:48:12 hmmm Oct 07 17:54:26 * wmarone wonders how long it will be until TI cuts off the ability to request it Oct 07 17:56:50 I just realized that the N900 is still missing some toys, e.g. no DECT module builtin, ... Oct 07 18:02:22 k, i've just discovered that n900's headphones have a button on the microphone bit Oct 07 18:02:41 i wonder if it is possible to use it to pause the media player Oct 07 18:03:18 I have just found the laser hidden behind the N900's "ir port" Oct 07 18:03:54 Wonder if I can use it to incribe obscenities on large buildings Oct 07 18:04:11 uea, sure Oct 07 18:04:12 or to blind plane pilots? Oct 07 18:04:14 yea* Oct 07 18:04:15 hmm Oct 07 18:04:22 ir port you say? Oct 07 18:04:55 some tv remote emulator software out there? Oct 07 18:06:00 Besides connecting sftp from PC, is there an app to view Owner/Group of files from N900? Oct 07 18:08:08 ls -l Oct 07 18:09:24 Hi Oct 07 18:10:12 dRbiG, there is qtirreco, tho i couldnt get it to work Oct 07 18:13:10 but maybe you have more luck :) Oct 07 18:15:46 moo wazd Oct 07 18:15:49 how is life? Oct 07 18:17:51 ssdd Oct 07 18:18:59 hi Oct 07 18:20:31 dRbiG: irreco Oct 07 18:21:04 opdf2: mc Oct 07 18:21:09 TY Oct 07 18:21:11 thx Doc! Oct 07 18:21:45 irreco works ok for me )(and my TV :-P ) Oct 07 18:22:13 dunno about qtirreco Oct 07 18:24:01 ah somehow i thought irreco was deprecated... Oct 07 18:26:04 qtirreco is meh Oct 07 18:28:46 there is an irreco-based desktop widget that is relatively good Oct 07 18:29:05 Mohammad, are you going to use thp's patches? Oct 07 18:29:23 already did RST38h, see page 2 of his post Oct 07 18:29:42 using the single column one right now Oct 07 18:29:45 coooooooool Oct 07 18:29:54 is it configurable, anyway? Oct 07 18:30:28 sadly, nope Oct 07 18:30:40 have to read on gconf Oct 07 18:30:49 or read matan's sources Oct 07 18:30:52 oh Oct 07 18:31:54 is the widget all i need to install for irreco? Oct 07 18:32:49 you'll for sure need proper description file for a particular remote emu matching your TV Oct 07 18:33:09 the n900 ir ledis too weak anyway Oct 07 18:33:10 so I guess you'll want the full irreco suite Oct 07 18:33:25 well,the applet handles description fileloading Oct 07 18:33:27 RST38h: I doubt that Oct 07 18:33:50 it does Oct 07 18:33:53 check it out Oct 07 18:34:00 I more suspect it's using a wrong frequency Oct 07 18:34:19 is it adjustable? :) Oct 07 18:34:33 somewhere for sure Oct 07 18:34:47 hw is adjustable Oct 07 18:34:59 dunno how lircd handles that Oct 07 18:37:15 RST38h: the IR LED is driven via 55R series from VBAT Oct 07 18:39:52 doesn't exactly sound like a wimpy glowing Oct 07 18:39:53 hm where do i find the widget once its installed? Oct 07 18:40:14 nox-: in desktop-gear add widget menu? Oct 07 18:41:51 hm didnt see it there, tho irreco-core wasnt installed so maybe ill get it after that Oct 07 18:42:22 .oO(program manager really is slow...) Oct 07 18:45:15 Isn't there a way to make password entry? http://maemo.org/api_refs/5.0/5.0-final/hildon/HildonEntry.html Oct 07 18:46:28 hm nope Oct 07 18:46:35 * timeless_mbp ponders Oct 07 18:46:42 can someone here please load http://www.nokia.com/about-nokia/contacts/nokia-offices Oct 07 18:46:46 oh sorry that was to irreco Oct 07 18:46:53 in select location, select United States of America Oct 07 18:46:57 not to you laasonen Oct 07 18:46:58 then look at the phone numbers Oct 07 18:47:26 nox-:ok Oct 07 18:49:08 Tel: 18 588 315 000 Oct 07 18:49:09 Fax: 18 588 316 500 Oct 07 18:49:12 looks unlikely Oct 07 18:50:36 is the author of the gstreamer camerabin element around? Oct 07 18:50:43 SpeedEvil: the numbers do work Oct 07 18:50:48 they're just idiots (as usual) Oct 07 18:51:19 1-858? Oct 07 18:51:21 haha Oct 07 18:51:48 oh - right Oct 07 18:53:52 timeless_mbp: aren't Americans always when it comes to sensible formats for commonly used values, like e.g. date? Oct 07 18:54:44 * DocScrutinizer really is amazed every time he runs ito brainfsckd mm-dd-yy or yy-dd-mm Oct 07 18:55:07 DocScrutinizer: i don't think i've ever seen yy-dd-mm Oct 07 18:55:11 and i never hope to see it Oct 07 18:55:18 i'm quite happy w/ mm/dd/yyyy Oct 07 18:55:29 idiocy Oct 07 18:55:46 DocScrutinizer: it's a matter of Row Major v. Column Major Oct 07 18:55:54 when you try to schedule events using a calendar Oct 07 18:55:54 doesn't sort, doesn't read (except maybe in america), doesn't make any sense Oct 07 18:56:16 do you sort things by day Oct 07 18:56:21 so first you find the 31st Oct 07 18:56:38 then you look at events from jan, mar, … ? Oct 07 18:56:50 yyyy-mm-dd hh:mm:ss,ccc Oct 07 18:57:03 DocScrutinizer: yeah, that's the proper sort Oct 07 18:57:13 the way to think about mm/dd/yyyy is really: Oct 07 18:57:18 (yyyy) mm/dd Oct 07 18:57:25 since the yyyy is generally fixed Oct 07 18:57:33 it doesn't make sense to have it wasting valuable leading digits Oct 07 18:57:36 it hurts scanning Oct 07 18:57:37 exactly, mindboggling Oct 07 18:57:46 so, …. instead, it's hidden 6 places later: Oct 07 18:57:51 mm/dd[/yyyy] Oct 07 18:58:01 FFS Oct 07 18:58:13 that's why it's done, and it really does make sense Oct 07 18:58:37 oh yes! date of posting 09-07-09 Oct 07 18:58:50 or 10-07-09 Oct 07 18:59:02 HOORAY, fsckU! Oct 07 18:59:04 us dates should really use /'s not -'s :) Oct 07 18:59:26 doesn't fix the idiocy Oct 07 18:59:27 and we wouldn't use a leading 0 Oct 07 18:59:35 so you can pretty much assert that it wasn't a us date :) Oct 07 18:59:45 thus, that must be some idiotic european date Oct 07 18:59:53 muhahaha Oct 07 18:59:53 10, july, 09 Oct 07 19:00:16 go tmo, enjoy, cry Oct 07 19:00:17 we'd write 7/10/09 Oct 07 19:00:40 note that years are special and *do* get a leading zero Oct 07 19:00:55 because they're only *part* of a year, not the whole number Oct 07 19:01:03 Old 09-23-10, 12:15 PM Oct 07 19:01:27 timeless_mbp: corresponds to pronounciation, ofc Oct 07 19:01:38 timeless_mbp: listen to what you're spreading here please. Don't hurt my brain! Oct 07 19:02:24 wow, a riot really -is- starting about this flash thing Oct 07 19:02:52 Stskeeps: what flash thing? Oct 07 19:03:56 BCMM_: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=835547#post835547 and down Oct 07 19:04:32 meh Oct 07 19:05:38 * DocScrutinizer wonders if he actually *wants* flash10 at all (if it weren't for fixing vulnerabilities, and I guess nobody even thought about that particular aspect, not to think about proper evaluation) Oct 07 19:06:22 lemmings doing lemming things Oct 07 19:07:00 DocScrutinizer: there are some sites that require flash10 Oct 07 19:07:07 it gives some better codecs and stuff Oct 07 19:07:18 I don't give a flying F... Oct 07 19:07:41 i'd suggest collecting it Oct 07 19:07:52 because you might find yourself visiting sites which don't serve you w/o it Oct 07 19:07:59 no requirement that you use it otherwise Oct 07 19:08:05 just a tool to keep in case of emergencies Oct 07 19:08:11 ack Oct 07 19:08:13 * timeless_mbp needed flash 10 last month Oct 07 19:08:17 * timeless_mbp grumbles Oct 07 19:11:15 if it had hw acceleration it might've been more interesting Oct 07 19:12:45 timeless_mbp: but that'd mean I'd have to dig thru all that BS at tmo, to pick up the pieces Oct 07 19:12:57 ? Oct 07 19:13:06 there's a link to the registration form right there Oct 07 19:13:10 * timeless_mbp just applied Oct 07 19:13:22 WTF? registration form??? Oct 07 19:13:36 * DocScrutinizer runs to bathroom, throwing up Oct 07 19:14:37 timeless_mbp, it didnt work with tweak flash either? Oct 07 19:15:46 funny why the TI page needs a company name. Is the registration only for business users? Oct 07 19:16:14 trumee: they're trying to sell stuff to companies Oct 07 19:16:17 * Stskeeps actually does have a legal company so he could do it Oct 07 19:16:20 it isn't for end users to get a better product Oct 07 19:16:35 i wonder if pages that do that pay any attention to the information they collect Oct 07 19:16:52 BS Oct 07 19:17:04 "hmm, about half the downloads were for the CIA...) Oct 07 19:17:07 BCMM_: easy to find out Oct 07 19:17:07 ~lart TI Oct 07 19:17:08 * infobot blasts TI with a huge firehose then strangles TI with it Oct 07 19:17:33 Stskeeps: does it any kind of approval from TI. garbage company name wont help? Oct 07 19:17:40 trumee: i have no idea what they check Oct 07 19:17:51 trumee: it took 1-2 days for me to get it Oct 07 19:17:54 infobot, you forgot Adobe and flash Oct 07 19:18:05 ~lart Adobe and fsckng flash Oct 07 19:18:05 * infobot blasts Adobe and fsckng flash with a huge firehose then strangles Adobe and fsckng flash with it Oct 07 19:18:08 trumee: and please read http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=835663&postcount=1312 before dumping in garbage Oct 07 19:18:51 timeless_mbp, what are these better codecs? I thought it was aac+h264 already in 9? Oct 07 19:18:52 Stskeeps: is that code by Adobe or by TI? Oct 07 19:19:25 Although maybe it was for 10 that they switched to CoreAVC instead of whatever they used before? That'd be pretty dog slow on ARM though I think.. Oct 07 19:19:36 trumee: adobe naturally, maybe with TI stuff on top Oct 07 19:20:12 yay, back to the bathroom... Oct 07 19:20:43 DocScrutinizer: too much indian food? Oct 07 19:20:44 Stskeeps: any idea whether it will be support hardware accel ? Oct 07 19:20:53 to much texas food Oct 07 19:20:54 trumee: no GPU acceleration as far as i could tell Oct 07 19:21:14 I think TI wants extra money for the full h264 accel? Oct 07 19:21:22 I mean in general, not specificly flash Oct 07 19:21:23 \o/ Oct 07 19:21:39 ShadowJK: dunno, but the DSP codecs are downloadable Oct 07 19:22:13 The free ones like the ones on N900 only do h264 baseline though? Oct 07 19:22:28 yep, that's what I heard Oct 07 19:22:29 ShadowJK: dunno Oct 07 19:23:02 timeless_mbp should know exactly Oct 07 19:23:09 And since youtube >480p uses h264 main (or high?) profile instead of baseline, I imagine flash wants full h264 codecs Oct 07 19:23:30 Well we already know that N900 codecs only does h264 baseline Oct 07 19:24:02 ok got the widget after reboot, but it doesnt seem to know my pvr Oct 07 19:24:50 ShadowJK: please don't quite me Oct 07 19:24:58 nox-: I suggest you go for irreco app first. Use widget when full app is correctly configured Oct 07 19:25:16 i'd have to find someone who has publicly provided useful info Oct 07 19:25:38 i think there's also the minor problem that even though 9.x already supports some stuff from 10 Oct 07 19:25:47 some content producers just check for 10 Oct 07 19:25:56 (content producers are stupid) Oct 07 19:26:14 and I'm not inclined to support stupidity Oct 07 19:26:20 stupid stupid flash detection scripts Oct 07 19:26:55 one popular one always declares konqueror to not support flash at all Oct 07 19:27:12 timeless_mbp, afaik I did not quote you on anything Oct 07 19:27:17 send a semptex package! Oct 07 19:28:01 hmm, i don't see packages for netcat or telnet - am i missing something? Oct 07 19:28:29 apt-get install netcat? Oct 07 19:28:55 E: Couldn't find package netcat Oct 07 19:28:59 guess what ;) Oct 07 19:29:26 ShadowJK: that's a preemptive request :) Oct 07 19:29:30 IroN900:~# apt-cache search netcat Oct 07 19:29:31 socat - multipurpose relay for bidirectional data transfer Oct 07 19:29:33 netcat - TCP/IP swiss army knife Oct 07 19:29:37 DocScrutinizer: works for telnet, no netcat Oct 07 19:29:49 DocScrutinizer: you have devel repo added? Oct 07 19:29:53 sure Oct 07 19:29:58 dRbiG: you probably don't have enough repos enabled... Oct 07 19:30:05 can you explain why the default repo should have netcat? Oct 07 19:30:07 what's socat? Oct 07 19:30:09 and tools Oct 07 19:30:21 it comes up for apt-cat search netcat Oct 07 19:30:24 DocScrutinizer: 'and tools' - some other repo? Oct 07 19:30:39 dRbiG: please keep in mind that large repositories seriously hurt HAM's ability to do anything Oct 07 19:30:44 timeless_mbp, I think the "tweak flash" crowd already discovered the thing about flash 9 working for most sites "requiring" 10 :) Oct 07 19:30:50 i have extras-devel and extras-testing and no netcat Oct 07 19:30:51 timeless_mbp: that's why i didn't add devel repo Oct 07 19:31:08 tools is a relatively small repo Oct 07 19:31:11 i usually just wget the .deb i want and install by hand Oct 07 19:31:14 (but quite useful) Oct 07 19:31:17 timeless_mbp: where can i find it? Oct 07 19:31:24 :) Oct 07 19:31:35 i may just build the debs myself but why waste time Oct 07 19:31:48 dRbiG: http://lmgtfy.com/?q=maemo+5+tools Oct 07 19:32:11 … why waste *my* time? Oct 07 19:32:20 :-ÃœP Oct 07 19:32:28 err -Ãœ Oct 07 19:34:41 timeless_mbp: i mean, if someone actually did bild it for maemo and it's got its way to a repo then most probably it will be more suited for maemo than my own rough builds :) Oct 07 19:35:29 hmm, like i see screen in the tools Oct 07 19:35:41 so i basically wasted time compiling it Oct 07 19:35:47 but i still haven't seen lftp Oct 07 19:35:49 :) Oct 07 19:35:52 tools has screen! Oct 07 19:36:18 hm `new button' always wants to replace the previous button... Oct 07 19:36:32 screen in tools has some quirks Oct 07 19:36:40 for your convenience: http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/devtools/maemo5 Oct 07 19:36:50 you need to start it as root once per boot to make it work smoothly as user Oct 07 19:37:07 errmm Oct 07 19:37:13 weird Oct 07 19:37:46 ah yeah bc it needs to create a dir in /var Oct 07 19:38:15 nox-: that's odd, it shouldn't fail on that, no? Oct 07 19:38:48 well as user it does Oct 07 19:39:03 bc the parent dir at least is owned by root Oct 07 19:39:07 to be precise the dir shouldn't vanish once it's created (preferably by postinstall script of screen) Oct 07 19:39:24 oh right thats true ofc Oct 07 19:39:46 i guess screen just wasnt made for boxen with `temporary' /var... Oct 07 19:39:53 hehe Oct 07 19:40:12 the temporary parts in /var should probably be world writable Oct 07 19:41:15 sorry, can't keep myself from... Oct 07 19:41:20 ~optification Oct 07 19:41:20 i heard optification is a inventive duct tape workaround to reclaim space in fs root, done due to the fact the partitioning is FUBAR, or http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo_5_Developer_Guide/Packaging,_Deploying_and_Distributing/Installing_under_opt_and_MyDocs, or ""OMG - I wish somebody had looked into FHS and moved /usr to eMMC"", or http://www.pathname.com/fhs/pub/fhs-2.3.html#PURPOSE2 bullet1,2 and fhs-2.3.html#PURPOSE16 sentence3 Oct 07 19:42:00 applies for /var as well of course Oct 07 19:43:49 ~seen lcuk Oct 07 19:43:58 lcuk was last seen on IRC in channel #meego, 19h 47m 9s ago, saying: 'to a degree'. Oct 07 19:44:03 wtf is up with ibot? Oct 07 19:44:33 laggy as hell Oct 07 19:44:47 ~botsnack Oct 07 19:44:48 DocScrutinizer: aw, gee Oct 07 19:45:39 lcuk2: ping Oct 07 19:46:15 * nox- still problems with irreco, can only add a single button, and using it gives `irreco backend error' Oct 07 19:46:38 code 8 Oct 07 19:46:40 /etc/init.d/irreco start Oct 07 19:46:48 oh :) Oct 07 19:46:49 or boot Oct 07 19:47:48 Hi, what is the right way to log messages from my C++ application in maemo? Is there some QT logger I should use? Oct 07 19:48:15 log to where? Oct 07 19:48:28 syslog preferably Oct 07 19:49:08 I guess there's a well established standard c way to do that Oct 07 19:49:29 got netcat, telnet and tcpdump, very good Oct 07 19:49:32 lirtex =~ s/QT/Qt/g Oct 07 19:50:49 man 3 syslog Oct 07 19:51:20 timeless_mbp: won't happen again :) Oct 07 19:51:24 DocScrutinizer: Thanks. Oct 07 19:51:29 yw Oct 07 19:51:54 hm id be surprised if qt didnt have something for that too... Oct 07 19:53:59 nox-: why? just for the fun in it? Oct 07 19:54:45 nox-: it'd have to offer any improved functionality to qualify for a Qt function, no? Oct 07 19:55:00 a) bc it has `all kinds of stuff' b) bc it tries to be `cross-platform'? :) Oct 07 19:55:28 maybe Qt offers a wrapper to use qstrings instead of const char * Oct 07 19:55:45 that too Oct 07 19:55:56 nox-: x-platform is a point, yes Oct 07 19:57:01 * DocScrutinizer muses about windows system event log, and shudders Oct 07 19:57:24 yeah Oct 07 19:57:59 irreco-for-n900 is the one to install? seems i didnt get an irreco init.d script... Oct 07 19:58:01 Qt has qDebug which is convenient, but I'm not sure if it's possible to redirect it's output to syslog. Oct 07 19:58:12 nox-: yep Oct 07 19:59:17 lirtex: sorry, nfc. Not a real Qt-using developer here Oct 07 19:59:37 s/Qt-using// :-) Oct 07 20:00:54 Evening Oct 07 20:00:59 lo Jaffa Oct 07 20:01:03 evening jaffa Oct 07 20:01:20 Evening, Jaffa Oct 07 20:03:11 Jaffa: have you noticed lcuk's request as of yesterday evening? Oct 07 20:03:23 Jaffa: ...regarding backup-menu Oct 07 20:03:48 is that in extras? Oct 07 20:03:48 :P Oct 07 20:03:51 DocScrutinizer: I saw something but didn't have time to fully mine scrollback. Shock: email is better :-p Oct 07 20:04:04 :-D Oct 07 20:04:20 Stskeeps: nope, it's killing N900s from devel Oct 07 20:04:57 * Jaffa would want a) documented proof; b) an email to maemo-developers or maemo-community and c) an answer to the question "what does the maintainer say?" Oct 07 20:05:11 Jaffa: it's trashing raw NAND and it's really bad. Oct 07 20:05:34 Jaffa: I won't deliver proof of it killing a N900 :-P Oct 07 20:05:38 Jaffa: MohammadAG has seen it's effect and it was only possible to rescue with nanderase from a initrd/second os Oct 07 20:06:31 Stskeeps: I still feel puzzled why NOLO doesn't cope with that properly Oct 07 20:06:52 DocScrutinizer: erase blocks Oct 07 20:07:02 Stskeeps: isn't NOLO supposed to do a proper nanderase prior to flashing rootfs? Oct 07 20:07:26 Is there no nice dumpubifs/ Oct 07 20:08:10 SpeedEvil: the problem is the missing nice restoreubifs though Oct 07 20:08:18 ah Oct 07 20:08:26 ugh Oct 07 20:08:43 any idea why chmod +x doesn't add executable flag to a file? Oct 07 20:08:57 NOLO is non-free/non-oss I presume? Oct 07 20:09:00 dRbiG: maybe cos it's VFAT? Oct 07 20:09:09 lindi-: exactly Oct 07 20:09:52 anyone remember which package the irreco init.d script is in? i wonder if it didnt get installed... Oct 07 20:10:00 wtf? Oct 07 20:10:07 DocScrutinizer: yhh, yes, and not only - it also has noexec option Oct 07 20:10:07 net.split :-( Oct 07 20:10:19 stupid kids :( Oct 07 20:10:23 (i guess) Oct 07 20:10:29 :nod: Oct 07 20:10:46 * DocScrutinizer reverting to "hide join/quit" Oct 07 20:11:27 ok have to charge now, looking at irreco later Oct 07 20:11:41 nox-: :-D Oct 07 20:12:30 DocScrutinizer, can you do a dpkg -S for the init.d script or what that command was? Oct 07 20:13:19 okey, thttpd works, nice Oct 07 20:13:23 nox-: /etc/init.d/lirc Oct 07 20:13:34 hm that one i have... Oct 07 20:13:48 wonder why it didnt start Oct 07 20:14:05 pkg lirc Oct 07 20:16:21 yeah lirc i have running, iireco still fails Oct 07 20:17:34 hmm, weird. I remeber I had problems initially with it too. Maybe really just boot Oct 07 20:17:54 hmm hmm Oct 07 20:18:10 (tho i already did that too... :) Oct 07 20:18:32 nox-: lirc is controlled via a socket iirc. maybe this fails when you start up lirc 'too late' Oct 07 20:19:11 well iireco config talks about using telnet... Oct 07 20:19:20 err wut? Oct 07 20:19:45 or at least it has a hostname and port Oct 07 20:19:53 whatever, you need to download some description file matching your appliance. You did? Oct 07 20:20:49 i had to do the `new remote' thing and get an lirc definition file, the original menu didnt have my pvr Oct 07 20:21:15 also I seem to have installed THREE irreco pkgs. Maybe not all of them needed Oct 07 20:21:15 i also havent found out how to add more than one button yet... o_O Oct 07 20:21:50 which ones you have Oct 07 20:21:52 with proper description file for a remo emu there shall be several buttons already Oct 07 20:21:58 tho i think i now have all of them too... Oct 07 20:22:19 yes as i said i have to config one myself Oct 07 20:23:31 hmm, you can not completely config by yourself, basically. The IR parameters / datapatterns need to be prerecorded on a different machine which has IR RX Oct 07 20:24:19 yes i was able to have it download an lirc definition file from the net Oct 07 20:25:30 only irreco's own config archive didnt have one Oct 07 20:25:56 irreco says "Irreco 0.8.11" Oct 07 20:26:24 yep here too Oct 07 20:27:26 irreco-backend-internal-lirc, irreco-core, irreco-for-n900 Oct 07 20:27:57 have those too Oct 07 20:28:47 hmm, what else? Oct 07 20:29:29 what means "still fails"? Oct 07 20:30:34 iireco backend error, code 8 Oct 07 20:30:42 weird Oct 07 20:31:25 http://irreco.garage.maemo.org/documentation.html#documentation Oct 07 20:31:26 i'd guess you need to download a proper "Remote" Oct 07 20:31:40 this docs dont even mention the internal ir led... Oct 07 20:32:46 sure, n800 doesn't have any Oct 07 20:33:24 irreco on N800 and "PC with lirc" are the same device for N900 Oct 07 20:34:00 ooh Oct 07 20:34:07 irreco talking to lirc@localhost Oct 07 20:34:13 so i need to tell lirc to listen on the notwork :) Oct 07 20:34:16 via a socket Oct 07 20:34:28 notwork, yes :-) Oct 07 20:34:37 127.0.0.1 Oct 07 20:34:40 yes Oct 07 20:34:49 but lirc on N900 does that ootb afaik Oct 07 20:34:53 hm Oct 07 20:36:27 I'm quite sure I haven't done any special edits to put the whole thing to work Oct 07 20:37:59 install, start up, ignore errors, load remote, boot(?), edit remote for size/number/type of buttons, save remote, enjoy Oct 07 20:40:13 ome/user/.irreco/backend_lib_backend_internal_lirc_la_1.config: Oct 07 20:40:17 [internal_lirc] Oct 07 20:40:19 host=localhost Oct 07 20:40:20 port=8765 Oct 07 20:41:20 /home/user/.irreco/backends.conf: [instance-1] library=lib_backend_internal_lirc.la config=backend_lib_backend_internal_lirc_la_1.config name=Internal Lirc 1 Oct 07 20:41:59 -rw-r--r-- 1 user users 0 2010-10-07 22:23 lircd.conf Oct 07 20:42:24 found the problem in the lirc log: `this remote config cannot be used to transmit'... Oct 07 20:43:30 mhm Oct 07 20:45:02 and btw lircd listens on *:8765 here by default Oct 07 20:45:17 guess ill have to look at the config Oct 07 20:47:15 guess, you'll have to download a proper remote Oct 07 20:47:35 'cept there isnt one for my hw :) Oct 07 20:48:17 then use any similar one. In the end there's a limited number of (3..12) ir-control chips on this planet Oct 07 20:49:16 no matter what the buttons are labled and the brand name on the case, the chances there's the same chip inside is rather high Oct 07 20:49:26 ok but the codes are all different, right? Oct 07 20:49:40 nope, a chip always uses same codes Oct 07 20:50:00 oh? Oct 07 20:50:49 i thought there are a limited number of encoding (like rc5), but the actual codes are `configurable' and differ per device? Oct 07 20:51:32 else there'd be confusion quickly when someone has more than a few remotes... Oct 07 20:52:25 you got like 32 different device addresses and 64 keycodes Oct 07 20:52:33 for example Oct 07 20:52:56 the device addr are assigned to appliance classes usually Oct 07 20:54:40 odds are you'll get a somewhat working config for your particular appliance when you download a remote file for any arbitrary appliance of same type and manufacturer Oct 07 20:55:18 and you find nice new functions of your tv Oct 07 20:55:31 yep, sometimes :-D Oct 07 20:55:58 well from this manuf there only is stuff in the lirc archive Oct 07 20:56:04 not in irreco's own one Oct 07 20:57:04 then use another manuf, that's listed in same category in any arbitrary user manual of any arbitrary 'programmable universal IR remote' Oct 07 20:58:05 hmm hmm Oct 07 21:05:38 hi all Oct 07 21:06:11 euuuuhh ... fresh news on PR 1.3 ?:D Oct 07 21:06:36 nox-: there are those lengthy lists in the universal remote manuals, like "Sony TV777UX: 430, 431; Samsung SuperVideoXL3: 431" if you got a samsung you'll probably also can use the remote for Sony (both 431) Oct 07 21:07:27 boozetime, cheers Oct 07 21:07:35 cheers Oct 07 22:20:52 hello Oct 07 22:45:18 * ShadowJK is trying to familiarize himself with using symbian again before swnding n900 for repair Oct 07 22:45:33 maemo sure is lightyears more userfriendly :) Oct 07 22:48:04 ShadowJK: ._. Oct 07 22:51:06 kerio, that's sad for several reasons, isn't it? Oct 07 22:51:43 nah, just for the fact that he has to send his n900 to repairs Oct 07 22:51:52 which is something *i* will have to do too, eventually Oct 07 22:51:56 what broke ShadowJK Oct 07 22:52:09 (my usb port is *still* broken) Oct 07 22:53:34 :/ Oct 07 22:53:49 What broke? Oct 07 22:53:54 it's been... what, 2 months? Oct 07 22:54:54 00:43 * ShadowJK is trying to familiarize himself with using symbian again before swnding n900 for repair Oct 07 23:00:57 * Chani wonders if there's a suse package for madde... Oct 07 23:09:15 cellular modem only works when device isn't moving Oct 07 23:09:49 the moment i put it in my pocket and walk/jog/run, it starts disconnecting and crap Oct 07 23:10:01 sometimes it pops up sim dialog Oct 07 23:10:17 sometimes just putting it down on a table makes it glitch Oct 07 23:13:00 it works perfectly as a tablet though, so I've been procrastinating repairs sice it'll be gone a few weeks I bet Oct 07 23:14:59 have you tried new SIM/ Oct 07 23:35:58 yes Oct 07 23:36:08 I've tried 3 different ones Oct 07 23:41:20 I need to do the same - but I'm getting a new SIM to testr with first Oct 07 23:41:26 getting towards that 12mo Oct 08 00:18:37 * nox- now knows why lirc couldnt send... the `irman' in the filename should have been a clue :/ Oct 08 02:01:34 \join #maemo **** ENDING LOGGING AT Fri Oct 08 02:59:57 2010