**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sat Oct 23 02:59:58 2010 Oct 23 03:07:21 Hi Oct 23 03:09:07 hi Oct 23 03:20:27 does anybody know, how can i change type 5-8 symbols on the key if i use eight-level keyboard layout? Oct 23 04:31:55 agggh dont ever get gorilla glue on your hand :( Oct 23 05:47:33 guys , i dont get my dummy connection appeared when N900 asks to choose an internet connection ? what could be the reason Oct 23 05:59:27 Hi . I'm faced with a problem building armel packages in scratchbox. Not sure what`s the root of issue , but, dpkg-buildpackage generated deb. files contains no binary, while code compiles fine both for x86/ARM Oct 23 05:59:59 any hint where should I look for mistakes? Oct 23 06:01:23 anyone know what the pkg name is for the ap that makes the phone buttons shily? i saw it last week but didnt have the phone on me at the time to snag it? Oct 23 06:01:33 *shiny Oct 23 06:02:10 or like theme for the phone dialer Oct 23 06:02:48 or what area it would be under i have been looking on and aff allday Oct 23 06:04:29 DangerMaus, do you have any comments on my issue? Oct 23 06:04:38 issue Oct 23 06:04:40 hmmm Oct 23 06:05:03 generated .deb contains just doc , no binary. Oct 23 06:05:05 no havent played that deeply yet Oct 23 06:55:23 hi everyone Oct 23 08:41:18 Hm, got a question for anyone that knows: I have a script for the N900 that runs in a maemo-based ramdisk chroot. X is not running, as is almost anything else. Is there some sort of stand-alone terminal "client" that I can run to provide the user access to a shell? Oct 23 08:43:08 Like how desktop linux(including Debian) provide a BusyBox rescue shell in the kernel that provides a user-accessable terminal... I know I can run SSH, or just run commands directly in a shell-script, but is there any way to get a proper prompt/terminal etc.? Oct 23 08:44:09 Stskeeps - Might you have an idea? Oct 23 08:44:22 you should look at the meego n900 initrd Oct 23 08:44:27 wiki.meego.com/ARM/N900 Oct 23 08:44:38 Thanks Oct 23 08:56:04 Stskeeps: Ok, one small question. I have the "initrd.img-rescue-*ver*-n900" file, but I can't figure out how to extract it. It doesn't seem to be a gzip or gzip-cpio file..? Oct 23 08:56:21 rpm2cpio *.rpm | cpio -id Oct 23 08:57:01 Stskeeps: Yea, I already got the file(initrd.img) out of the rpm package... But I want to extract -that- file Oct 23 09:01:51 should be a cpio Oct 23 09:01:57 oh wait Oct 23 09:02:00 no, it's a cramfs Oct 23 09:02:43 TY Oct 23 09:06:04 ... That solves that, then. A simple "/bin/sh" ought to do the trick Oct 23 09:13:38 Hm.... This makes things complicated. I'm sure it'd work fine with a framebuffer kernel... But I don't have one of those... Hm... Oct 23 09:15:07 shouldn't be hard to make a framebuffer kernel :) Oct 23 09:15:50 No, it's not. But the whole purpose of my program is to work on "stock" N900s... asking everyone to install a framebuffer kernel seems overkill Oct 23 09:15:56 except he's running a chroot environment Oct 23 09:16:19 plus a framebuffer could push the kernel size too big Oct 23 09:16:24 a 2mb limit as i understnad Oct 23 09:17:16 kernel's fine - There's already a good framebuffer kernel out there, which works. In my case though, I'm using bootmenu-n900 to launch a script which copies important files to a ramdisk, then chroots into that Oct 23 09:18:09 i'm curious though.. if you're not entering x, and just want a shell, you shouldn't need anything graphical Oct 23 09:18:17 Correct Oct 23 09:18:37 Currently, I'm using the text2screen application to interface with the user Oct 23 09:18:44 and so you should edit the bootloader to initialise command line Oct 23 09:19:09 Uh... what? Oct 23 09:19:38 nevermind Oct 23 09:19:38 i think he means init=/bin/sh type deal Oct 23 09:19:47 ah Oct 23 09:20:19 Well, I already -have- a good chroot environment, I'm just trying to add a proper terminal to my application Oct 23 09:21:11 ..I suppose I could try redirecting the output to a file/fifo, then read that and display it on screen using text2screen... Oct 23 09:22:56 that can be a nasty hack Oct 23 09:23:32 buffering issues, and it may not handle any non-printable chars well (such as backspace) Oct 23 09:24:02 Yea Oct 23 09:24:11 i'm not familiar with text2screen.. Oct 23 09:24:39 I can't find much documentation on it, really Oct 23 09:25:11 hah, a google search has your tmo post as top hit Oct 23 09:25:23 :P Oct 23 09:26:10 I've found it used in a couple of scripts, and ended up figuring out enough to make it work Oct 23 09:27:06 try and see if you can print something to the screen with it, and then issue backspace chars Oct 23 09:27:24 if so, you can work out a nasty hack :P Oct 23 09:27:56 Well, I'd have to handle that myself, by clearing that line, then writing it back with the new text. Oct 23 09:28:48 But heck, even doing that'd be easier than capturing each keystroke, making a line out of them, then running the command through a pair of ``'s.. Oct 23 09:29:40 there's a reason there's an awesome lib called readline, heh Oct 23 09:30:04 Accessable through a shell-script? Oct 23 09:30:18 c lib Oct 23 09:30:43 I wrote my entire darn program - all 857 lines - in BusyBox ash script. <_< Oct 23 09:31:28 Yes, I suppose I could have used python, but that would have required loading those libs. C... I have never used, and at this point would be kind of silly to learn just for this. Oct 23 09:32:45 brb, beer Oct 23 09:34:34 mm, delicious beer Oct 23 09:35:03 RobbieThe1st: so basically you're going to have to do something ghetto, or hope someone here has a more elegant solution Oct 23 09:35:41 Basically, yes. I was hoping for something like "Oh, just run this program with these arguments, and it automatically creates a framebuffer, and everything else you need" Oct 23 09:40:20 if you can find the text2screen source, it may show you how it does it such that you can bypass it Oct 23 09:42:54 Well, I don't think that's -too- much of a problem; with a framebuffer kernel, the console text'd just overwrite any bits of screen not actively being written to Oct 23 11:06:32 Anyone here tried the leaked PR 1.3 ? Oct 23 11:06:58 can i know if there's some changes in the looks and stuff of the OS ? or some additions and bug fixes logs Oct 23 11:08:40 xDaReaperx: does it matter? Oct 23 11:09:04 The bug tracker will have everything you need to know about the official 1.3 release Oct 23 11:09:08 no i just want to see what all bugs are fixed and any additions made Oct 23 11:10:03 Like I said, bug tracker has all the fixed bugs for official 1.3 Oct 23 11:10:34 when did you say that before ? Oct 23 11:10:37 =/ Oct 23 11:11:52 he said it about 59s before Oct 23 11:12:41 I wasn't here probably Oct 23 11:13:51 repent your sins, and you may be forgiven Oct 23 11:14:17 xDaReaperx: well if you weren't here then who else was I replying to :P Oct 23 11:14:53 i wasn't here the time you said this 59 times before Oct 23 11:15:13 59 seconds, not 59 times Oct 23 11:15:27 okay i thought you mean 59 times Oct 23 11:16:37 too hard to explain ... -_- Oct 23 11:16:41 nvm Oct 23 11:17:32 xDaReaperx: I said it in reply to your question 5 minutes ago Oct 23 11:17:40 So you were here, I was saying it to you. Oct 23 11:17:42 yeah, we're simple folk.. complicated topics are beyond our understanding Oct 23 11:18:42 alterego: Okay Oct 23 11:20:59 Looks like Cptn Obvious has left the channel Oct 23 11:51:09 mhh Oct 23 12:06:43 in case there was an update like PR 1.3 and i update to it from PR1.2 will i loose all my installed apps ? Oct 23 12:07:53 xDaReaperx: no, you do a backup that saves all your personal data and the list of apps you had and it restores it once you run it after the update Oct 23 12:08:03 xDaReaperx: there's somewhere on the wii docs for that, quite good if I may say Oct 23 12:08:05 xDaReaperx: :) Oct 23 12:08:41 Okay so before update Maemo reminds you to back up and later restores it automatically ? Oct 23 12:09:10 it's not the same in the case of reflashing a bricked N900 , i backup'd and restored after reflash my apps were not there , not even a single one Oct 23 12:09:41 xDaReaperx: that is actually what did, and all the apps got back Oct 23 12:09:44 xDaReaperx: strage Oct 23 12:09:47 strange Oct 23 12:09:59 yes thats what happend Oct 23 12:10:05 maybe a bug. Oct 23 12:10:07 I don't kno. Oct 23 12:10:12 so i worry i may loose the apps installed Oct 23 12:10:29 will them modifications done to hildon-desktop go away ? Oct 23 12:11:24 well it's long back when i had installed aircrack-ng , it needed a custom kernel ... but i did not install kernel for power users , so it could not restore back nokia's kernel ... and then when i restarted it wont boot Oct 23 12:11:37 so after than i had made a backup before all the reflashing Oct 23 12:11:45 and restored it as far as i remember Oct 23 12:14:16 xDaReaperx: this is WAY BEYOND what the normal backup would support, Oct 23 12:14:39 xDaReaperx: so there's no gurnatee. but if you just backup for reflash for a newer version, I don't think there should be probples Oct 23 12:14:45 xDaReaperx: ofcourse there's a disclaimer Oct 23 12:14:56 xDaReaperx: for me, it just worked following strictly the instructions. Oct 23 12:15:01 Difficult-to-read fonts make for better learning, according to scientists. Oct 23 12:15:36 yeah i did follow every instruction before reflashing at first ... i wont be able to do it on my own as far as i know .. Oct 23 12:15:53 Does this mean, TV ads in gothic are not that far ahead? Oct 23 12:16:29 the PR1.2 update was released the next day after i bought my N900 , so i had no apps installed that time except the ones that came with my N900 ... so i really did not know if i would loose any apps installed or not Oct 23 12:16:41 i just updated it instantly Oct 23 13:03:06 SSU isn't supposed to 'lose any apps' Oct 23 13:03:21 flashing of course is Oct 23 13:05:04 but after flashing the normal backup app running a restore will do exactly that: restore your apps, contacts, settings... whatever you enabled for restore and what's also in the backup archive Oct 23 13:05:51 modulo app installed via apt-get and not properly announcing themselves to backup Oct 23 13:06:22 s/ app/ all apps/ Oct 23 13:06:22 DocScrutinizer meant: modulo all apps installed via apt-get and not properly announcing themselves to backup Oct 23 13:09:06 afaict PR1.3 will be a really 'gentle' upgrade which isn't replacing 'everything'. It most likely will go almost unnoticed, fixing a bug here and a bug there by replacing a few modules and libs - the worst thing you'll notice probably is the reboot needed Oct 23 13:12:15 s/PR1.3/the next PR version SSU/ Oct 23 13:12:15 DocScrutinizer meant: afaict the next PR version SSU will be a really 'gentle' upgrade which isn't replacing 'everything'. It most likely will go almost unnoticed, fixing a bug here and a bug there by replacing a few modules and libs - the worst thing you'll notice probably is... Oct 23 13:19:23 hey DocScrutinizer :) Oct 23 13:19:32 heyhey Oct 23 13:20:00 DocScrutinizer: you told me you live in germeny right? Oct 23 13:20:05 yep Oct 23 13:20:19 DocScrutinizer: I visited Munich last week, really nice Oct 23 13:20:22 though I'm unsure about the 'live' part Oct 23 13:20:31 DocScrutinizer: hehe, why ? Oct 23 13:20:36 I really liked it. Oct 23 13:20:40 don't ask Oct 23 13:22:33 hmm, I don't particularly like Munich - too expensive, too big, too Bavaria (I'm Franconian, the occupied country :-P), too much stupid people who think they are VIP Oct 23 13:24:42 you ought've traveled ~150km to the North from Munich, to visit a few breweries in Franconia, the area with world's most breweries and pubs / resident Oct 23 13:25:20 I guess we got better beer and more breweries here than all the rest of the world together Oct 23 13:27:01 except for Pilsener beer Oct 23 13:27:19 would you like me to quote what you said 5 minutes ago about people who think they are VIP? Oct 23 13:27:57 jacekowski: err, don't see any relation Oct 23 13:28:14 15:21 < DocScrutinizer> I guess we got better beer and more breweries here than all the rest of the world together Oct 23 13:28:26 fact, so what Oct 23 13:28:48 nvm Oct 23 13:28:57 switch on Discovery channel, they will tell you the same :-P Oct 23 13:29:10 15:21 < DocScrutinizer> I guess we got better beer and more breweries here than all the rest of the world together Oct 23 13:29:14 ehh Oct 23 13:29:16 misclick Oct 23 13:29:26 i don't have discovery Oct 23 13:29:43 does it play on n900? Oct 23 13:29:56 nfc Oct 23 13:30:48 how the hell does one manage to be able to work in chroot environment with n900 when they need to upgrade a whole bunch of packages? shouldn't scratchbox be able to handle that somehow? Oct 23 13:32:00 you should have up to date system Oct 23 13:33:21 and if you don't inside the chrooted environment? i.e. in the case of debian images from qole.org? Oct 23 13:33:46 I copied / to /home/user/chroot Oct 23 13:33:57 then I just use that for wirrd stuff Oct 23 13:35:11 jacekowski: http://www.franconiabeerguide.com/ Oct 23 13:36:10 hmm I don't understand how would that help let alone work.. if one needs to do apt-get upgrade for example under a debian chroot.. its easy to do that on n900 albeit it would incur lots of reads and writes on the flash drive (not ideal) however its not even remotely possible (afaik) for scratchbox Oct 23 13:36:53 if i set an eight-level layout with setxkbmap, how can access symbols from 5 to 8? Oct 23 13:37:07 half the issue is that scratchbox won't allow root access, so the init script for scratchbox needs to be hacked somehow Oct 23 13:37:38 and no MADDE is not a choice.. I've tried that... really really laggy interface Oct 23 13:39:45 Hello Oct 23 13:40:09 Is ther anyway to retrieve various password stored by the N900 as my jabber one for the example Oct 23 13:41:02 guys, i have an question. Is there an application for n900, to switch on and off with timer function?? for example daily at 8.00clock switch wifi on and on 10.00clock switch wifi off! sry for my english, hope you understand me? Oct 23 13:41:25 fecub, there's alarmed Oct 23 13:41:33 *to switch wifi on and off with timer function? Oct 23 13:41:36 alarmed Oct 23 13:42:08 to execute any command Oct 23 13:42:20 probably not in a fancy UI sort of setup but you can set it to use a custom command line and from there set it to enable/disable wifi Oct 23 13:42:22 ah ok i see it! i intall it Oct 23 13:42:55 thank you very very much! Oct 23 13:46:46 fecub: alarmed is great - thanks to Shapeshifter Oct 23 13:47:37 psycho_oreos: command execution! must i write an dbus command! i don't know what command i can write! Oct 23 13:48:01 splendid! Oct 23 13:48:11 and mood, javispedro Oct 23 13:48:26 fecub, maybe `sudo ifconfig wifi0 down' Oct 23 13:48:28 hello RST38h Oct 23 13:51:54 DocScrutinizer: Are there interesting open source jobs there? Oct 23 13:52:55 hmm, Nuernberg is where Suse is located, Erlangen is Siemens town. But open source jobs, hmm... Oct 23 13:53:15 DocScrutinizer: well, not open source- Suse is good enough :) Oct 23 13:53:20 DocScrutinizer: I mean, related to Oct 23 13:56:27 DocScrutinizer: Next time I'm in Germany, I will make sure to visit Franconia Oct 23 13:56:51 DocScrutinizer: I really liked it so there's a good chance I will come again, also, there's that KDE/GNOME event coming soon and it will be in Berlin or so Oct 23 13:56:53 DocScrutinizer: more breweries maybe ... but we still have most beers :P Oct 23 13:56:54 fine :-) leave me a notice if you drop by at Nuernberg Oct 23 13:57:02 belgian beers rule :P Oct 23 13:57:14 Gh0sty: Germen is better, in my taste. Oct 23 13:57:27 you have a bad taste then ;) Oct 23 13:57:38 open source jobs here however suck :( Oct 23 13:57:53 been thinking to go to germany or something to try my luck elsewhere ... Oct 23 13:58:20 Gh0sty: abnd it is all french, I can learn Germen (I sortof heard some of it when I Was young from grandparents) but French is too hard for me. Oct 23 13:58:23 :) Oct 23 13:58:44 my idea - but that could be wrong - in germany open source has a larger use base (also in companies?) Oct 23 13:58:52 Gh0sty: it does. Oct 23 13:58:55 it is a fact. Oct 23 13:59:23 only problem i might have is ... Oct 23 13:59:27 my german is not so good :p Oct 23 13:59:32 i can read it fluently Oct 23 13:59:36 but speaking ... :p Oct 23 13:59:41 Gh0sty: you can learn :) Oct 23 14:00:00 well since i'm dutch most looks the same :p Oct 23 14:00:05 but it's not that easy :) Oct 23 14:00:10 Best way to learn is by emersing you're self in the language ... apparently. Oct 23 14:00:11 I already do 3 languages :p Oct 23 14:00:25 alterego: no finding a girlfriend ... :P Oct 23 14:00:55 however that could also be considered "emersing yourself" :p Oct 23 14:01:05 Erm, yeah, sure .. Oct 23 14:01:48 should do some more trips to germany ... Oct 23 14:01:54 not been there too much Oct 23 14:02:03 despite the fact it's so close Oct 23 14:04:29 tmo is getting mighty boring. Oct 23 14:04:37 ITU Rules That WiMax, LTE Don't Qualify As 4G Oct 23 14:04:43 * alterego sighs Oct 23 14:05:19 * sivang goes back to his key/value store python exersize Oct 23 14:07:34 ~tmo Oct 23 14:07:35 hmm... tmo is http://talk.maemo.org, or too much off-topic Oct 23 14:07:58 or t-mobile Oct 23 14:09:43 argh Oct 23 14:09:58 MohammadAG: what now? :P Oct 23 14:09:59 ~tmo Oct 23 14:09:59 i guess tmo is http://talk.maemo.org, or too much off-topic, or not ~t-mo Oct 23 14:10:37 when I set Qt::WA_Maemo5AutoOrientation to true on the MainWindow, it sets the same flag for all other windows under it Oct 23 14:10:48 this is expected, but there's no way to override it Oct 23 14:11:12 can't you force the flag on every other window, manually? Oct 23 14:11:36 RST38h, the flag is set for all other windows, I want to force one of the 5 windows into landscape mode Oct 23 14:11:43 since it doesn't work well in portrait Oct 23 14:11:46 I tried Oct 23 14:11:47 setAttribute(Qt::WA_Maemo5AutoOrientation, false); Oct 23 14:11:47 setAttribute(Qt::WA_Maemo5LandscapeOrientation, true); Oct 23 14:12:19 :nod: Oct 23 14:12:37 should work I'd guess Oct 23 14:12:51 should = doesn't in this case Oct 23 14:12:53 This is supposed to work, logically Oct 23 14:12:53 "should" work Oct 23 14:13:14 But Qt4.6+Maemo5+orientation is screwed :P Oct 23 14:13:20 Ok, Mohammad, let us try it another way Oct 23 14:13:30 use another main window Oct 23 14:13:42 *Remove* autootientation from the parent window, set it explicitely to all the other windows but then one which you do not want to rotate Oct 23 14:14:53 MohammadAG: build a new kernel! Oct 23 14:15:00 for hostmode :-) Oct 23 14:16:08 hehe Oct 23 14:16:16 MohammadAG: or do you really need me to supply a proper diff generated patch instead if a per line suggestion how to fix the bugs? Oct 23 14:16:18 but what RST38h said should really do the ting Oct 23 14:16:20 thing Oct 23 14:16:34 DocScrutinizer, no, a per line one worksforme Oct 23 14:17:31 RST38h, it's a stacked window Oct 23 14:17:40 Kind of a waste of both your lives though isn't it? Oct 23 14:17:42 :P Oct 23 14:18:15 alterego, Qt 4.7 isn't any better Oct 23 14:18:17 MohammadAG: https://garage.maemo.org/pipermail/h-e-n-devel/2010/000032.html Oct 23 14:18:41 MohammadAG51: *shrugs* :P Oct 23 14:20:05 alterego, so there's no way to set forced landscape mode? Oct 23 14:20:07 grr Oct 23 14:21:12 Sure, you can force landscape mode if you want. Oct 23 14:21:37 Baring in mind that, well, you can only see one window at a time. So does it matter that the root window is in charge of orientation? ... Oct 23 14:22:33 stacked windows are like inide an MDI ? Oct 23 14:23:48 ( Baring in mind that, well, you can only see one window at a time) that's why I suggested to instantiate a new top level window, without parent Oct 23 14:24:31 MohammadAG: like, onSlidTo(3) -> window.setAttribute(Qt::WA_Maemo5LandscapeOrientation, true) etc. Oct 23 14:25:19 I do however think mixing up landscape/portrait like this is a bad idea. Oct 23 14:25:33 Forcing a a single view in an app to be landscape will just annoy people. Oct 23 14:26:22 * DocScrutinizer remarks every window is forced into landscape as soon as focus is set to a text input field Oct 23 14:26:33 Yes, there is that. Oct 23 14:27:22 bored bored bored .. Oct 23 14:27:23 alterego, stretching an image into landscape mode isn't any better Oct 23 14:28:06 DocScrutinizer: indeed, very irritating Oct 23 14:28:38 Don't stretch then :P Oct 23 14:28:54 maintain aspect and set the background. Oct 23 14:28:57 Or, redo the image. Oct 23 14:29:11 very logical, as the kbd *is* designed for landscape. Hard to change that, at least for hw kbd :-P Oct 23 14:30:58 A rotating keyboard would be lovely. Oct 23 14:31:09 I'd actually like a fully detachable one. Oct 23 14:31:18 But that may be a little mechanically complex. Oct 23 14:34:12 SpeedEvil: hehe could be Oct 23 14:34:20 anyway, I haveto logoff irc to get focused Oct 23 14:34:22 see you all Oct 23 14:34:36 although this is #maemo, tryto cheer up :) Oct 23 14:34:41 wave Oct 23 14:34:44 #meego is all hope :) Oct 23 14:34:48 yeah! Oct 23 14:34:49 wave Oct 23 14:36:01 alterego, all the images can't be stretched Oct 23 14:43:30 3WHY UNOT>?!?! Oct 23 14:43:43 God, I'm so freain' bored. Oct 23 14:43:48 ~freakin' .. Oct 23 14:44:25 * SpeedEvil cures alteregos boredome. Oct 23 14:44:37 * SpeedEvil puts away the cryogenic tuna, the peanut butter, and the mallet. Oct 23 14:44:57 That sounds somewhat horrible :P Oct 23 14:45:04 Maybe I should do the washing up or something .. Oct 23 14:46:12 Oh cool, Stellerium was released into Ovi, that is somewhat, erm, interestingly timed ^.^ Oct 23 14:47:27 :/ Oct 23 14:48:16 I don't like how he has a load of donate buttons on his site, but he's charging for his app on Ovi Oct 23 14:48:20 greedy punk Oct 23 14:50:34 whom are we talking about? Oct 23 14:50:49 the author Oct 23 14:50:59 link to said website? Oct 23 14:51:06 alterego: and that he won the innovators contest :P Oct 23 14:51:06 fdff Oct 23 14:51:11 google :P Oct 23 14:51:19 Yeah, that too! :D Oct 23 14:51:21 alterego: gimme the fucking link, bitch. Oct 23 14:51:28 well, somebody at tmo has already exercised his rights given by the gpl Oct 23 14:51:38 15.7M omfg Oct 23 14:51:46 wolf^: good Oct 23 14:52:03 btw, someone should exercice his GPL-rights on this website: www.sportmag.fr Oct 23 14:52:18 (I helped debugging some really horrible code) Oct 23 14:52:44 as in, the guy uses Django, so an MVC framework, yet _everything_ is in the views. Oct 23 14:53:15 alterego, cause they're 800x480? :P Oct 23 14:53:23 crashanddie: http://stellarium-mobile.org/ Oct 23 14:55:38 ohhh. nice to have it finally available Oct 23 14:55:47 the website doesn't look like much Oct 23 14:56:24 tbh, that GPL is bullshit Oct 23 14:56:40 He wrote Stellarium, he can release closed versions of it if he wants. Oct 23 14:56:41 alterego: why so angry? Oct 23 14:56:58 That guy that just uploaded it is well out of order. Oct 23 14:57:12 SpeedEvil: detachable keyboard -> http://www.alwaysinnovating.com/touchbook/ Oct 23 14:57:45 alterego: suposedly other people contributed to stellarium. Oct 23 14:57:58 javispedro: well - yes. Oct 23 14:58:04 (touchbook) Oct 23 14:58:10 javispedro: well, we can't guess at what arrangements they may have come to :P Oct 23 15:01:28 how can you say tmo is boring? "MeeGo will be a tragedy!" Oct 23 15:01:37 =) Oct 23 15:01:47 javispedro: that's actually what spurred me .. Oct 23 15:02:20 I think I'm having a moody day, but I'm seriously thinking of severing from maemo.org and the whole community and just jumping to meego now .. Oct 23 15:02:47 Which will be a shame, because I like talking to a lot of you and helping the hackers here :/ Oct 23 15:02:49 SpeedEvil: detachable penis -> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=byDiILrNbM4 Oct 23 15:03:59 alterego: imho the geekiness in meego.com is already on the way down. Oct 23 15:05:50 am i right that, considering "inofficial" modest fixes not addressing the issue, modest usability is not widely accepted as terminal disaster? Oct 23 15:06:46 So for some reason I can no longer connect to IRC on my tmobile 3g on my n900 any ideas? Oct 23 15:07:10 Arkenoi: modest's problems can't be solved by a patch Oct 23 15:07:27 nothing short of nuking it from orbit can Oct 23 15:08:26 * ShadowJK would blame tmob Oct 23 15:09:20 Jef91: wait til t-mo NAT IP and sessions get discarded Oct 23 15:09:45 Any idea how long that talkes? Oct 23 15:10:33 usually a reconnect every 60s succeeds after some (dozen) tries Oct 23 15:10:35 ghey, for some reason my card isn't being accepted by Ovi :/ Oct 23 15:10:49 kerio, well, having ONE click to reach the inbox instead of 4 should be possible, isn't it? Oct 23 15:10:53 Oh well, I guess I'll have to hold off buying it .. Oct 23 15:11:12 thats a pain in the ass Oct 23 15:11:16 never done that before Oct 23 15:11:33 Jef91: also going offline and back online on 3G helps Oct 23 15:11:34 "T-Mobile" and "pain in the ass" often go togheter Oct 23 15:11:39 Don't think it's happened to be before either. Oct 23 15:11:48 Maybe there's something wrong with my account :S Oct 23 15:13:27 alterego: if you get a NAT IP that's been blocked by feenode prviously then you're out of luck Oct 23 15:13:53 DocScrutinizer51: I was talking about my card not being accepted at ovi :P Oct 23 15:14:01 ooh Oct 23 15:14:09 Not Jef91's IRC t-mo woes Oct 23 15:14:46 alterego: they heard your maemo/meego heresy Oct 23 15:14:52 Heh Oct 23 15:15:05 There has been none :P Oct 23 15:15:09 I'm an avid supporter. Oct 23 15:15:19 I just the the community has gone to scht. Oct 23 15:15:20 Exactly. Oct 23 15:15:38 And I'm not getting any fun from it anymore. Oct 23 15:15:54 :-/ Oct 23 15:16:10 might telling a joke help? Oct 23 15:16:35 i can't receive mms with fmss Oct 23 15:16:38 If you look at tmo right now, and the active topics bar, can anyone say that they're even remotely interested in any of the subjects? Oct 23 15:16:57 *fmms Oct 23 15:17:15 tmo aside, but it's not like this channel has been particularly riveting over the past few months .. Oct 23 15:18:09 i set the provider settings but without success Oct 23 15:18:17 alterego: hack something interesting to keep it alive =) Oct 23 15:18:35 javispedro: was pondering to answer sth similar Oct 23 15:18:54 all the useful projects are in dire need of man-hours Oct 23 15:18:59 e.g. host mode Oct 23 15:19:09 life is boring at large, until you put some sense in it Oct 23 15:19:12 I was hacking on a few interesting projects, but now I'm thinking the apps are going to have to be quite radically changed to work under MeeGo, so I figure I'll just target meego touch framework and forget about maemo. Oct 23 15:19:52 That way my apps will be ready for the next device and I get to work in MeeGo, which is still in the fun phase :)) Oct 23 15:20:04 That and there's no politics, well, not much politics. Oct 23 15:20:07 and by the time the n900+1 is released, you will have to retarget your projects again because they will work with a debian-like distro like Harmattan instead of Meego =) Oct 23 15:20:13 if THAT is true, then honestly meego needs some love, ti *fix that issue* Oct 23 15:20:16 (or viceversa) Oct 23 15:20:36 javispedro: packing isn't a problem :P Oct 23 15:20:46 not only packing. Oct 23 15:20:56 DocScrutinizer51: we can have meego touch framework on maemo, and do in the Qt meego examples I believe. Oct 23 15:21:00 well, unless you use only qt apis :P Oct 23 15:21:23 I think most of the APIs I'm interested in are the same. Oct 23 15:22:07 In fact, from my two apps perspective, there's nothing different from the application code. Just radically different UI code Oct 23 15:22:25 I could probably whittle it down to 1 UI for symbian/maemo and 1 UI for meego Oct 23 15:22:32 But I can't be bothered anymore. Oct 23 15:22:47 Call me lazy I guess :P Oct 23 15:23:01 my recent knowledge is "you can migrate properly written maemo apps by push of a button" - if that doesn't deliver then meego did something *really* BAD Oct 23 15:23:33 Sure, but then I'm not taking advantage of the cool stuff in meego Oct 23 15:23:41 lol Oct 23 15:24:05 btw I requested meego doing a prototypical implemetation of this migration path some months ago, and I still don't see it Oct 23 15:24:15 Heh Oct 23 15:24:35 Probably because the handset ux can't handle non meego-touch apps. Oct 23 15:24:57 It'll run Qt apps, they just don't get handled properly. Oct 23 15:24:57 then nuke meego-touch, not abandom maemo Oct 23 15:25:06 DocScrutinizer, :rolleyes: Oct 23 15:25:07 Kind of just get overlayed ontop of the ui Oct 23 15:25:18 meego touch is evolution though. Oct 23 15:25:25 Marketing shouldn't pretend to know about stuff like that. Oct 23 15:25:26 And it's a really cool framework .. Oct 23 15:25:30 It never ends well. Oct 23 15:25:38 FSCKIT! Oct 23 15:26:38 Well, you do what you want to do, I'll do what I want to do and maybe one day we'll meet again ;) Oct 23 15:27:00 honestly, what noobs are developing meego, if they don't even know how to properly implement a compatibility layer, as they are supposed to and promised :-((( Oct 23 15:27:17 I don't remember that promise Oct 23 15:27:20 Or declaration Oct 23 15:27:37 meh Oct 23 15:27:37 Unless you're getting confused with the Qt "write once, run everywhere" ... Oct 23 15:27:59 DocScrutinizer: this to imply again you cannot really "code once, deploy everywhere?" :) Oct 23 15:28:06 alterego: sorry, that's mega-lame Oct 23 15:28:11 hehe Oct 23 15:28:27 I see the level of cheer up is dropping to new records :) Oct 23 15:29:10 :) Oct 23 15:29:25 sivang: you can't even do that across diferent releases of the same os :( Oct 23 15:29:45 jpinx-eeepc: bad :/ Oct 23 15:29:53 jpinx-eeepc: you mean between different maemos? Oct 23 15:30:33 Does someone have a little spare time to help me with getting MMS to work? Oct 23 15:30:42 sivang: I tell lies - there is a .deb for downloading from youtube which will install almost anywhere 'cos it's just a pythin script Oct 23 15:31:04 pyfat Oct 23 15:31:13 alterego: so basically you say you don't like to remember this promise just because you don't care, and you are joining meego and leave maemo, just *because* you like this incompatibility. Well, thanks for the time you spent here, I'm sure meego needs more of your kind Oct 23 15:31:50 * DocScrutinizer pissed. Bye Oct 23 15:32:43 alterego: being a dick? Oct 23 15:34:18 No, DocScrutinizer is being a drama queen Oct 23 15:34:51 I don't remember those promises because I obviously didn't read them, do you have a source? Oct 23 15:36:05 jpinx-eeepc: could you please add your findings and thoughts here http://wiki.meego.com/Qt_across_MeeGo_%26_Symbian or comment abou the endeavor on a meego ml? Oct 23 15:36:14 DocScrutinizer: ^^ Oct 23 15:36:25 I don't promise to go anywhere with that, but I'm trying :) Oct 23 15:36:34 anyway,bbab Oct 23 15:37:24 who was it that said it is egos that drive open source forward :) Oct 23 15:37:43 DocScrutinizer: let's try and get hildon to be a first party framework for harmattan again =) Oct 23 15:38:12 yay? Oct 23 15:38:38 javispedro, you do that, I'll send a donation your way if you get it working :P Oct 23 15:39:10 MohammadAG: if I did that, there's a $50,000 gnome foundation "donation" =) Oct 23 15:39:36 I'll send one more buck :P Oct 23 15:53:05 what does X-HildonDesk-ShowInToolbar mean Oct 23 15:53:45 mxr does not return hits, other than nokia .desktop files Oct 23 15:54:13 could be leftovers from diablo Oct 23 15:54:20 I think Nokia doesn't know how to use .desktop files Oct 23 15:55:43 I believe that the minimal set of required fields on a desktop file is: Encoding, Type, Name, and X-Osso-Service Oct 23 15:56:17 (Exec instead of X-Osso-Service if app does not link with libosso) Oct 23 16:03:05 http://wiki.maemo.org/Desktop_file_format Oct 23 16:03:17 courtesy dneary Oct 23 16:03:28 I am actually trying to understand and fill it =) Oct 23 16:04:54 well, fremantle has no toolbar, so... Oct 23 16:05:14 Diablo hadn't, either.... hm.. Oct 23 16:05:17 so MohammadAG's suggestion is quite sound Oct 23 16:05:25 err, it hadn't Oct 23 16:05:27 ? Oct 23 16:05:48 well, none where all apps where shown Oct 23 16:06:35 :-P Oct 23 16:06:56 no, only those with X-HildonDesk-ShowInToolbar=true Oct 23 16:08:02 javispedro, X-Osso-Service isn't needed Oct 23 16:08:09 DocScrutinizer: virtually all of them Oct 23 16:08:13 only needed if you have a .service file Oct 23 16:08:14 so, no idea :( Oct 23 16:08:33 MohammadAG: note I didn't put "Exec" in the set, so without a service file it won't even launch =) Oct 23 16:09:04 ah Oct 23 16:09:08 the idea is: either you do it the dbus way (X-Osso-Service, libosso, .service file) or the unix way (Exec:) Oct 23 16:10:37 X-Osso-Service=gpe_todo Oct 23 16:10:39 X-HildonDesk-ShowInToolbar=true Oct 23 16:10:52 (from my N810) Oct 23 16:11:05 and does gpe_todo show in any toolbar? Oct 23 16:11:12 there's been another one with X-HildonDesk-ShowInToolbar, just one though Oct 23 16:11:29 weirdo, so it's a fremantle thing then. Oct 23 16:11:31 is there anything like nokia n900 but with host usb? Oct 23 16:11:31 nope, not that I know of Oct 23 16:11:44 and good battery life? 8+ hours ? Oct 23 16:11:53 the N810? :P Oct 23 16:11:58 (no phone) Oct 23 16:11:59 a laptopmaybe? Oct 23 16:12:01 ~hostmode Oct 23 16:12:01 extra, extra, read all about it, hostmode is http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=824197#post824197 Oct 23 16:13:07 i'm basically looking for a tiny portable computer with usb hostmode.. it doesn't even need a screen or anything, just checking around, i noticed someone suggested n900 for wearable computer type stuff Oct 23 16:13:29 no screen? Oct 23 16:13:37 javispedro: honestly I think I don't get it - the most obvious explanation for X-HildonDesk-ShowInToolbar seems doesn't fit at all Oct 23 16:13:38 What do you need it for? Oct 23 16:13:42 pandaboard for OMAP4, beagleboard for OMAP3 Oct 23 16:14:05 MohammadAG++ Oct 23 16:14:11 yo Oct 23 16:14:11 Shadikka: i want to plug in a webcam and capture everything i see during the day (lifelogging) Oct 23 16:14:25 even though for OMAP3 you might want to goog for IGEP, as the beagleboard doesn't have wifi Oct 23 16:14:26 lol Oct 23 16:14:31 hmm, I can't think of anything then. Oct 23 16:14:44 Shadikka: kind of like http://www.viconrevue.com/home.html but i'd like to do it for significantly cheaper Oct 23 16:15:02 Mhm,Ballmer promised a revolutionary new Windows8 Oct 23 16:15:11 * RST38h is scared now Oct 23 16:15:13 RST38h: already? =) Oct 23 16:15:27 http://www.engadget.com/2010/10/23/ballmer-next-release-of-windows-will-be-microsofts-riskiest-p/ Oct 23 16:15:31 it's approx $800 Oct 23 16:16:32 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KMU0tzLwhbE Blamer Oct 23 16:16:38 err Balmer Oct 23 16:16:48 lol Oct 23 16:16:59 DocScrutinizer: http://www.engadget.com/2010/09/15/stephen-elop-chants-developers-developers-developers-to-clos/ Oct 23 16:17:08 Blamer indeed Oct 23 16:19:10 javispedro: do you think putting together a beagleboard + battery + usb webcam would be a good affordable way to get a wearable webcam to capture what i see during the day? Oct 23 16:19:33 foucist: If I had such a need that'd be the first I'd try. But i never did it, so understand me :) Oct 23 16:20:02 i think i'd like to find a cheaper alternative to beagleboard Oct 23 16:20:10 lo room Oct 23 16:20:10 $150 is perhaps a little too much for my simple needs Oct 23 16:20:26 anyone know what program the maemo chat app is based on Oct 23 16:20:34 it's being a dick, not syncing chat history like pidgin does Oct 23 16:21:00 is it based on emphathy? Oct 23 16:21:00 soo, has anyone written a tool that allows one to neatly browse incoming sms messages on a linux desktop, + send them as well? Oct 23 16:21:23 flux, not sure, browsing them should be easy, sending them a different story all together Oct 23 16:23:06 RST38h: how could you possibly *not* be scared when such a guy is announcing anything Oct 23 16:24:37 famicom, empathy, logs are in sqlite3 Oct 23 16:24:46 chances are if it isn't saving logs, it's failing silently Oct 23 16:24:53 either: Oct 23 16:25:00 1) /home is corrupt/mounted ro Oct 23 16:25:01 RST38h: you know I'm German, here we are especially sensible to detect such kind of BS on a stage talking to a large undiscriminating audience Oct 23 16:25:08 2) sqlite3 db is corrupt Oct 23 16:25:27 is there a way to mount the root FS to be browsed over USB Oct 23 16:25:54 famicom: NFS, sshfs Oct 23 16:26:13 aye, to be honest, the DB works fine, it's just not accepting a "push" like si done on pidgin Oct 23 16:26:35 famicom, by easy you mean I use sqlite command line client or that there is a working solution for that?-) Oct 23 16:27:00 flux yeah, something like that :) Oct 23 16:28:54 DocScrutinizer: Wenn ist das Nunstruck git und Slotermeyer? Ja! Beiherhund das Oder die Flipperwaldt gersput! Oct 23 16:29:15 aaaah, i see now :) Oct 23 16:29:20 it's based on telepathy i think Oct 23 16:29:27 famicom, do you remember where the sms messages were? Oct 23 16:29:56 nope, trawling through repos and docs to find out what precise architecture is :) Oct 23 16:30:04 javispedro: your /dev/random has a strange bug in entropy Oct 23 16:30:12 DocScrutinizer: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Funniest_Joke_in_the_World ;) Oct 23 16:30:31 (just testing your bullshit filter :D ) Oct 23 16:30:44 http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo_5_Developer_Guide/Architecture/RTCOM Oct 23 16:31:06 is there a reasonably sane/safe way to compile Qt stuff on the actual device? Oct 23 16:31:31 I think you should look at easychroot for that Oct 23 16:32:04 javispedro: there's at least 6 words in it that are mere BS as they don't exist in German language Oct 23 16:32:50 Wenn ist das Nunstruck git und Slotermeyer? Ja!... Beiherhund das Oder die Flipperwaldt gersput! Oct 23 16:32:51 or - if those are names - I never heard of them Oct 23 16:33:12 probably meant as a non sequitor Oct 23 16:33:25 DocScrutinizer: exactly -- it's plain bullshit. some old british joke. Oct 23 16:34:09 famicom, hmph, I have ~/.rtcom-eventlogger/el.db, but the mos recent message in it is from Mon Jun 7 15:54:13 EEST 2010 Oct 23 16:34:21 well, if British think it's funny to talk BS that sounds like German... I always knew British are mad dogs Oct 23 16:34:28 (according to events.start_time) Oct 23 16:34:35 Doc: You seem to be forgetting that I am Russian... :) Oct 23 16:34:56 nope, I didn't Oct 23 16:35:25 I'm well aware you got similar celebrities Oct 23 16:35:35 Doc: Then you should probably remember that there were 70 years of pure smelly bullshit from every possible public orifice... :) Oct 23 16:35:39 blah, i finally pulled this thing apart Oct 23 16:38:19 finally get what i'm working with, took me a month, but i got it, it's an ARM tablet computer, with some specialized GSM hardware, plugged in on the side, probably supported within the kernel, then on top, it's really just a linux install, with rather than just the usual "gnome desktop" a different type of environment setup Oct 23 16:39:16 with all of the "phone" functionality provided by RTCOM framework running in userspace, which accesses low level hardware through D-BUS Oct 23 16:39:21 but ofcourse, i could be wrong........ Oct 23 16:40:30 pretty much the classical "Linux Distro" concept Oct 23 16:40:36 RST38h: btw to me it seems you (russia) are up for another few decadesor Oct 23 16:40:54 -or Oct 23 16:41:17 Doc: No, that's different Oct 23 16:41:48 Doc: The previous one was grand. This one is more like a traveiling circus performance. Oct 23 16:49:11 i asked a question about compilers a few minutes ago, around the time that maemo switched to a broken wireless network and i got disconnected. did my question actually get through, and did anyone respond? Oct 23 16:51:06 BCMM: yes, you got easychroot for answer Oct 23 16:51:15 and I agree (a chroot is the only sane way) Oct 23 16:51:57 unless what you want to build is very simple; then a plai-ly optified gcc might work. Oct 23 16:53:26 there is gcc in the tools repo. Oct 23 16:53:33 You _can_ install gcc onto the rootfs Oct 23 16:53:41 but you end up with little space left. Oct 23 16:53:47 And a chroot is the better way Oct 23 16:55:38 SpeedEvil: so a whole second copy of the qt libs? Oct 23 16:56:06 i seem to have a 150 second ping here over rural 2g... Oct 23 16:56:25 BCMM: yes Oct 23 16:56:36 BCMM: you copy all of / into a chroot Oct 23 16:56:48 then apt-get whatever in that chroot, so it doesn't screw with / Oct 23 16:57:08 wasn't there some hack involving installing stuff from the sdk repo, then disabling that repo before everything breaks? is that basically a bad idea? Oct 23 16:59:56 SpeedEvil: what about building qt apps? is there a qmake package? Oct 23 17:01:16 dunno Oct 23 17:01:34 sdk stuff is not optified. Oct 23 17:01:40 GCC is ~50M Oct 23 17:01:49 / has 80M or so free when virgin Oct 23 17:01:52 hence... Oct 23 17:04:06 SpeedEvil: how hard would it be for me to manually play with symlinks? Oct 23 17:04:06 BCMM: you enable the SDK repo _on a chroot_ Oct 23 17:04:17 BCMM: then, when it eventually breaks, your device is safe. Oct 23 17:04:34 also, chances are it won't even break as you don't have to "boot" the chroot, just run commands from it. Oct 23 17:05:35 The issue is that most stuff with a GUI doesn't work properly, without screwing with stuff. Oct 23 17:06:02 oh, it works, but themes won't be applied, etc. Oct 23 17:06:16 so when the resulting binary is done just run it from outside the chroot et voila. Oct 23 17:06:28 yeah Oct 23 17:07:11 * javispedro had a working SDK chroot on his n810 a year ago, and I used it to build some demo Qt apps back then Oct 23 17:08:27 anybody remembers the name of the app which can read the calendar and change profile to silent. Oct 23 17:08:55 it can read wlan ssid and gps location and perform some action. Oct 23 17:09:36 "calendar" string in fapman is not bringing it up. Oct 23 17:12:35 found it N9profile! Oct 23 17:16:38 okey, put some stuff here http://www.drbig.one.pl/n900.html Oct 23 17:17:09 http://felipec.wordpress.com/2010/10/23/why-maemo-downloads-are-screwed/ Oct 23 17:17:22 still have more to add there; anyway maybe someone will find sth useful there Oct 23 17:22:37 felipec: popular != good Oct 23 17:22:56 DocScrutinizer: so? Oct 23 17:23:31 nothing more, just saying Oct 23 17:23:49 felipec, "popularity" ratings can also be abused. All that an author has to do is setup a bunch of fake accounts to rate his app Oct 23 17:23:57 guys, the hildon porting offer is to make sure maemo legacy apps use the same L&F on meego? Oct 23 17:24:09 I was not really able to understand what it tries to achieve from the email, to be honest Oct 23 17:24:21 if that is so, is it our interest to make it succedd? Oct 23 17:24:26 I mean, I think it is Oct 23 17:24:51 sivang: to make sure they run in a sane way. right now, they won't even have a titlebar. Oct 23 17:24:56 so no way to close them. Oct 23 17:25:32 and hildon offers quite a lot of features that depend on hooks in the window manager Oct 23 17:25:34 DocScrutinizer: but if you have thousands of apps, you need ways to sort them out, and popularity is a good starting point to find good ones Oct 23 17:25:36 so those have to be ported over too Oct 23 17:26:16 tank-man: that can be done right now Oct 23 17:26:23 no, it's a good starting point to find popular ones. The new brilliant ones never get a chance Oct 23 17:26:36 tank-man: in fact, right now it's easier to abuse the system... all you have to do is make many releases Oct 23 17:26:39 felipec: I'd argue about needing a "sort by download count" option, but I do believe that popularity!=downloadcount Oct 23 17:26:56 javispedro: so this is the wa to cater for cross platformness, and not Qt. We must have this communicated properly Oct 23 17:27:06 what should we do? Oct 23 17:27:22 sivang: elaborate? Oct 23 17:27:29 javispedro: aiui there *sIS* a sort-by-dlcount Oct 23 17:27:31 javispedro: I'm not saying that, I'm just saying that right now there's no way to sort by popularity Oct 23 17:27:47 javispedro: So, a while a go I decided to try and help make the corss platorm developer experience beter Oct 23 17:27:52 javispedro: just it's not called "popular" Oct 23 17:27:59 how to measure popularity is another issue, but most probably would be a function of all the fields I mentioned Oct 23 17:28:04 javispedro: that page being a brainstromgin page and attempet to collect resources Oct 23 17:28:21 Hi. I'm a brand new n810 user (yea!) .... version 5.2008.43-7 .... wondering which repositories (catalogs) I should have in the application manager. Oct 23 17:28:21 javispedro: and I would like tocome up with guidelines for streamlined porting of apps Oct 23 17:28:42 javispedro: http://wiki.meego.com/Qt_across_MeeGo_%26_Symbian Oct 23 17:29:01 sivang: so your opinion is to force Gtk+ devs to use Qt? Oct 23 17:29:03 I have repository.maemo.org/extras/ but it isn't version specific Oct 23 17:29:22 DocScrutinizer: sort by download count? where? Oct 23 17:29:22 javispedro: so we should make it clear that pure qt apps are not thr gith way to go (yet) for that, since to achieve the we need to use the MeeGo framework Oct 23 17:29:27 javispedro: no! :) Oct 23 17:30:06 javispedro: I am just trying to devise a proper guide that describes the available options. given there are also NOkia efforts to make things easier through QML or Qt Components Oct 23 17:30:10 sivang: I understand what you want to do, but there's a bunch of Gtk+ apps and even plain Xlib apps out there that might never get ported -- and it is quite interesting if those run. Oct 23 17:30:32 s/interesting if those run/desirable to run those Oct 23 17:30:52 javispedro: right, so one of the ways is to "if you app is not supported by the current runtime on meego, see if you ca help the hildon porting initiative with a patch a fix relevant for your usage" Oct 23 17:31:10 felipec: http://maemo.org/downloads/Maemo5/system/ looks quite sorted by dl-count Oct 23 17:31:40 javispedro: well, rewriting an app should never be required. this is plain hard and a discouragement for developers Oct 23 17:32:59 felipec: you just have to decide which category you want to look at - obviously there's no category 'all' Oct 23 17:33:07 back Oct 23 17:33:17 wich honestly seems fair enough Oct 23 17:33:34 DocScrutinizer: right, that's a bit helpful, but there should be a way for all Oct 23 17:34:19 I couldn't bother less how many downloads a lib got, when I'm searching for "good" (as in your def) games, for example Oct 23 17:34:42 preferably taking into account the stars and votes, which would be a sensible to measure popularity Oct 23 17:35:05 * DocScrutinizer shrugs Oct 23 17:35:20 DocScrutinizer: some people are not looking for games, but for good apps Oct 23 17:35:30 something they might have not tried yet Oct 23 17:35:48 maybe not you, but some people Oct 23 17:37:19 good != dl-count either, ans as mentioned 2 lines above, who'd be interested in testing eithe powerkernel or N900fly depending on which is "better"? o.O Oct 23 17:38:42 is it possible to sort by download count atm? Oct 23 17:38:43 sounds to me like you're asking for a hall of fame, for the pkg with most ever downloads. Users are hardly interested in such number bragging Oct 23 17:39:07 trumee: apparently only by category Oct 23 17:39:22 seems so, that should be fixed. Oct 23 17:39:22 DocScrutinizer: not true Oct 23 17:40:31 felipec: i selected a category on maemo.org but dont see a sort option? Oct 23 17:40:51 trumee: they seem to be sorted by downloads by default Oct 23 17:40:53 trumee: what option WTF? Oct 23 17:41:01 felipec: ah, i see Oct 23 17:41:14 trumee: read backscroll Oct 23 17:41:53 Heh. Watching a 'rescue chopper' thing on tv. The doctor onthe chooper has a Nokia N97, and is watching the patient's EEG on it while enroute to a heart attack patient Oct 23 17:42:48 Not fiction :-) Oct 23 17:42:59 javispedro: true, we should maybe consult the community to see which sort of app sets are in wish to get ported. Oct 23 17:43:12 hehe, nobody told him GSM is not allowed on airplane? Oct 23 17:43:30 Her :P Oct 23 17:43:50 javispedro: some more discussion on the subject more from the comunity of Maemo would help, but I wasn't ale to get much attention from ourselves so far, I might cross post to meego and maemo to get more feedback andreal words needs. Oct 23 17:45:13 sivang: tbh I'm not used to this paperwork :) Oct 23 17:45:23 ShadowJK: and aircraft Oct 23 17:46:20 javispedro: I'm not sure how much Nokia are aware of theissues, I at least want to get more idea from the community so hopfuly this will end up being porting bugs and will get fixed eventually Oct 23 17:46:35 javispedro: I also wonder for the amount of offered MeeGo apps given porting is sonot trivial Oct 23 17:46:39 i guess it's allowed on their ambulance eurocopter :) Oct 23 17:46:40 and most of our apps are hildon... Oct 23 17:47:03 anyway, I'm straying again- back to my assignment Oct 23 17:47:09 and hanks for listening to my noise :) Oct 23 17:47:13 *thanks Oct 23 17:47:17 :P :) Oct 23 17:48:04 * ShadowJK wonders if meego will have a podcast app Oct 23 17:48:18 I might be too blank, but then again that would mean I have still energy to try and push things forward until I wear out :) Oct 23 17:49:15 the problem for me is that I did not do too much hildon developent on Maemo, and so do ot have the findings of the hardship of porting and te current state , and would be happy to hear more about that from the community Oct 23 17:49:47 and with qt, I thought this is in the past- but since you still need to use MTF or MAF to build apps, it is not a real and immediate solution Oct 23 17:50:27 I'm now really off, although this is very important I think and I would need to spend more time on this. Oct 23 17:51:39 ShadowJK, afaik gpodder works on it Oct 23 17:52:06 MohammadAG: using the gtk runtime builtin? Oct 23 17:52:18 MohammadAG: no porting was required? Oct 23 17:52:39 sivang, Qt rewrite afaik Oct 23 17:52:49 MohammadAG: I see :/ Oct 23 17:52:59 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cWtMLs3j09U Oct 23 17:53:06 MohammadAG: who's the author? can I bug him to write about his experience ? Oct 23 17:53:10 not completely true -- the stock+ version also run http://thpmaemo.blogspot.com/2010/08/gpodder-running-in-meego-handset-ux-for.html Oct 23 17:53:23 s/stock/stock gtk+/ Oct 23 17:53:24 javispedro meant: not completely true -- the stock gtk++ version also run http://thpmaemo.blogspot.com/2010/08/gpodder-running-in-meego-handset-ux-for.html Oct 23 17:53:58 sivang, no, you can't bug him :P Oct 23 17:54:08 I'm guessing it's thp Oct 23 17:54:16 ah! thp already wrote on thepage :) Oct 23 17:54:20 about the rabbot game Oct 23 17:54:29 "wrote once, #ifdef everywhere" Oct 23 17:54:52 I hate it when someone pushes 10 updates every second to devel Oct 23 17:55:09 memscanner in https://garage.maemo.org/pipermail/extras-cauldron-builds/2010-October/ :/ Oct 23 17:55:44 gpodder seems nice on that video Oct 23 17:57:10 right, the stock version runs Oct 23 17:57:25 we need an automatic UI adopter for that, since it does look like the old gtk apps from the 90s Oct 23 17:57:36 and I guess this is what the 50$ prize is about Oct 23 17:57:40 MohammadAG: nothing more creepy than emailing them with the solution to whatever problem they had Oct 23 17:57:58 1*09/vvvvvv Oct 23 17:58:09 sivang: agreed -- porting gtk-qt-style to qt4 should be part of it Oct 23 18:00:29 alterego, ? Oct 23 18:01:55 javispedro: what do you mean by gtk-qt style? Oct 23 18:02:44 sivang: there was a gtk+ plugin back in qt3 days that rendered gtk+ widgets with qt theme (basically, inverse of QGtkStyle) Oct 23 18:03:17 javispedro: right, exactly okay, I knew something like this had to be made to support the hildon looks with qt apps Oct 23 18:03:27 javispedro: so we need an inverse Oct 23 18:03:31 * sivang adds to the wiki Oct 23 18:03:56 javispedro: there's one for qt4 as well Oct 23 18:04:17 Corsac: does it work? Oct 23 18:04:25 javispedro: a GTK+ engine using Qt oxygen widgets Oct 23 18:04:27 no idea Oct 23 18:04:30 I don't use Qt stuff Oct 23 18:04:32 http://kde-look.org/content/show.php?content=129715 Oct 23 18:04:57 but it's limited to oxygen-themes I guess. Oct 23 18:05:08 and I doubt most Meego themes are going to be oxygen-based. Oct 23 18:05:17 just for the hell of it; compilation times to zImage on autobuilder: Oct 23 18:05:17 real 3m36.658s Oct 23 18:05:17 user 12m13.786s Oct 23 18:05:17 sys 0m42.251s Oct 23 18:05:25 javispedro: no idea Oct 23 18:05:26 s/to/of/ Oct 23 18:05:43 * MohammadAG sneaked in a "time" before the make Oct 23 18:06:05 (hmhm, wrong, I do use Qt for vlc) Oct 23 18:06:17 (but anyway I use QGTKStyle) Oct 23 18:06:30 https://garage.maemo.org/builder/fremantle/psfreedom_0.4/armel.build.log.OK.txt :D Oct 23 18:06:52 * MohammadAG should stop using v in tar, makes logs long Oct 23 18:08:24 X-Fade, ping? Oct 23 18:11:51 javispedro, Corsac : added to the notes at that page. Thanks guys. Oct 23 18:12:01 yw Oct 23 18:12:21 sivang: thanks to you too. Oct 23 18:15:53 I wonder how the porting guide does not really talk about this issues. Hnce I think our brainstorming is useful Oct 23 18:16:00 is there a debug option in (2) *exec*/*fork* etc? Purpose: get a syslog line for every newly started process Oct 23 18:16:03 I mean, there is a page on the wiki for meego porting guide Oct 23 18:17:59 ah, it is a hardware porting guide, that's why! Oct 23 18:18:16 dear god, I'm always drawn to meego/maemo stuff and can't concetrnate on my stuff :) Oct 23 18:19:29 anyway - back to my stuff. Thanks all, cheers. Oct 23 18:21:46 DocScrutinizer: no. But you could use strace. Oct 23 18:22:53 on *all* existing processes? mmmpf Oct 23 18:24:06 I'd probably better replace the .ko function spawning a new process Oct 23 18:24:59 err, scratch .ko, it's obviously a core kernel function :-P Oct 23 18:27:39 I just hate the idea of >while true; do ps | sort | tail | unique | logger; done< Oct 23 18:28:01 you forgot |fsck | fsck | fsck Oct 23 18:28:35 will slow down things even more :-P Oct 23 18:29:27 and btw uniq won't work like expected, when used this way - but you get the idea I think Oct 23 18:30:27 while true; do ps | sort | tail; done | unique | logger; Oct 23 18:40:07 btw I keep it as an execise to reader why above concept never can work as expected Oct 23 18:44:01 (except on messybox X-P ) Oct 23 18:47:12 * RST38h yawns Oct 23 18:47:20 Anything new and exciting in the world? Oct 23 18:54:48 if i did "dpkg --set-selections < previously_installed_packages" then how can i actually install packages? apt-get install? Oct 23 18:55:35 * MohammadAG releases his PSFreedom C++/Qt rewrite, http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=848872&postcount=388 Oct 23 18:55:38 free at last Oct 23 18:56:28 naah, no PS3 here. Oct 23 18:59:55 * DocScrutinizer throws r33b.net at RST38h Oct 23 19:16:11 hmm is low call quality on skype a known problem? Oct 23 19:17:20 jacekowski: yes Oct 23 19:17:49 jacekowski: it goes over IP. IP does not guarantee you timely packet delivery (hell, UDP does not event guarantee you the delivery) Oct 23 19:18:03 but i mean it works fine on PC Oct 23 19:18:09 connected to same wireless Oct 23 19:18:14 Same network link? Oct 23 19:18:18 yep Oct 23 19:18:31 Well, different WiFi hardware, to be fair Oct 23 19:18:37 and wifi works fine as well Oct 23 19:18:50 SIP works fine Oct 23 19:18:52 then weird Oct 23 19:18:56 it's just skype + n900 Oct 23 19:19:00 ESPECIALLY if SIP works fine Oct 23 19:19:27 When your connection is bad, SIP is the first to go unusable, only then Skype Oct 23 19:19:44 Is the other side using speakerphone? Oct 23 19:20:08 laptop Oct 23 19:35:31 Hello,Could anyone install gAnyremote? Oct 23 19:55:08 moin Oct 23 20:02:30 heh, while testing this .desktop file stuff I've broken hildon-desktop enough that tapping on any app results in it trying to activate the foreca weather app. Oct 23 20:02:57 thank god I have ssh, cause now I cannot launch xterm :) Oct 23 20:08:31 hmmm someone post the link to stellarium deb i shared here from my box :) Oct 23 20:19:35 http://lovenacky.endofinternet.org/~id/stellarium_mobile_1_0_3_113373.deb Oct 23 20:19:46 can someone verify that i put some message? Oct 23 20:19:59 to replace the deb. Oct 23 20:22:25 I am not Matan btw Oct 23 20:22:40 good. Oct 23 20:23:02 didn't know the link i posted here would pop up on tmo like that Oct 23 20:23:44 Matan, it's okay BTW, if you are around. Oct 23 20:26:32 seems that you do need "Exec" even if X-Osso-Service is specified. Oct 23 20:36:41 i'm connected from my n900 to pc (linux) via usb, i've enabled usb networking, i can ping and ssh in both directions, now the question is how can i redirect traffic from n900 to ethernet on my pc (and also in other direction)? Oct 23 20:40:36 tiy neab tiy wabt ti yse youe n900 to actr as a modem to get to the internet? Oct 23 20:44:15 SpeedEvil: don't drink and derive Oct 23 20:45:33 vdv, you have to do routing or masquerading on your PC to make your PC act like gateway for the N900 Oct 23 20:45:44 on the vice-versa I think you need power-kernel Oct 23 20:46:29 no, he doesn't need power kernel for that Oct 23 20:46:41 on the n900 itself, you just need to set the route Oct 23 20:46:45 ieatlint, can default kernel do masquerading? Oct 23 20:47:00 or ip forwarding? Oct 23 20:47:01 no, it can't, but the masquerading occurs on the pc in that configuration Oct 23 20:47:26 no i was talking about vice-versa ie PC->n900->internet Oct 23 20:47:50 or i use wrong word? Oct 23 20:48:16 not native english speaker sorry. Oct 23 20:48:21 well, to "redirect traffic from n900 to ethernet on my pc" would be n900->pc->internet Oct 23 20:48:38 although he does specify also in the other direction, in which case he would indeed need the power kernel Oct 23 20:48:50 n900->pc->internet would never need any kernel. Oct 23 20:49:03 i mean, it still need default kernel. Oct 23 20:49:12 :) Oct 23 20:49:15 yeah, that was my comment Oct 23 20:49:21 ok Oct 23 20:49:25 the masquerading would be on the pc Oct 23 20:49:34 stock kernel on n900 would work for that Oct 23 20:49:53 yeah, we're both saying the same thing, just misunderstanding each other :P Oct 23 20:49:58 heheeh Oct 23 20:57:33 mh Oct 23 21:42:11 hey, is easy debian how i get traceroute and all of those other useful terminal apps? Oct 23 21:45:13 <`0660> it should be Oct 23 21:46:00 okay, cause nmap is native on maemo, but most of the apps someone who uses nmap would use don't show up in the repos - so I'm assuming people are using them via easy debian Oct 23 21:46:05 uh, no, you shouldn't need to install debian to get basic tools Oct 23 21:47:08 where is traceroute then? Oct 23 21:47:25 it's generally not its own package Oct 23 21:47:43 what is it? Oct 23 21:47:53 but you're talking about installing an entire chroot to get access to a basic utility... that's excessive Oct 23 21:48:03 i don't know off-hand Oct 23 21:48:54 but 5s on google tells me you want the package iputils-tracepath (use tracepath instead of traceroute) Oct 23 21:49:21 why do I have to be root to use ping? Oct 23 21:49:51 heh Oct 23 21:49:59 because you touch yourself Oct 23 21:50:15 I shouldve expected that Oct 23 21:50:51 i believe sending icmp packets is restricted to root on maemo, which isn't a bad policy Oct 23 21:51:20 okay, I guess I should expect maemo-specific priv behavior Oct 23 21:51:55 It's busybox. Oct 23 21:52:28 Expecting gnu-like behaviour from busybox utils will lead to trouble. Oct 23 21:52:45 thanks Oct 23 21:53:11 careful, that's getting awfully close to complementing gnu Oct 23 21:54:06 gnu utilities are perhaps not optimal. Oct 23 21:54:25 But they are generally - for good or bad - a standard of sorts over much of linux space. Oct 23 21:54:36 Busybox hasa number of surprises. Oct 23 21:54:46 yeah, well, they beat solaris.. i'll give them that Oct 23 21:55:02 It is not again inherently bad - but it is surprising if you are expecting gnuisms. Oct 23 21:55:19 For example - find having almost no options is surprising. Oct 23 21:55:40 i get send failed resume pmtu 65535 when trying to use tracepath Oct 23 21:56:36 nice Oct 23 21:57:08 yeah, I've never used tracepath before, just traceroute Oct 23 22:01:36 oh wtf! Oct 23 22:01:45 nmap HAS traceroute (nmap --traceroute host)! Oct 23 22:03:26 how can i solve "two battery icons" problem, which is appear with "advanced power" app Oct 23 22:03:42 anybody here using advanced power? :) Oct 23 22:08:21 * oshin causes 2000 copies of stellariumobile pirated :P Oct 23 22:11:05 oshin: you counted them? :) Oct 23 22:19:06 javispedro, just pipe the log through wc :) Oct 23 22:22:09 oshin, isn't it GPL... Oct 23 22:23:06 MohammadAG, it is GPL as the about stated. Oct 23 22:23:07 MohammadAG, just the impressions from the tmo made it feel like I want to tag it with piracy word :) Oct 23 22:24:09 but I doubt that their developer didn't know about this, since he probably made that GPL in the about box themselves. Oct 23 22:24:11 meh Oct 23 22:24:15 tmo people don't know shit Oct 23 22:24:27 i just dropped my N900 Oct 23 22:24:30 it crossed out the sim Oct 23 22:24:33 * MohammadAG oh shit-s Oct 23 22:24:44 true. Oct 23 22:24:47 hah, that's what you get for messing with tmo. Oct 23 22:25:32 * MohammadAG does a semi battery hotswap and replaces sim in under 30 secs Oct 23 22:25:33 brb Oct 23 22:26:03 not going to test if it's still working? :) Oct 23 22:27:01 yeah, but I don't want to reboot Oct 23 22:27:09 took out the battery, then removed the sim and put it in again Oct 23 22:27:12 hehe Oct 23 22:27:16 put battery back in, started bme Oct 23 22:27:19 no reboot, sim works Oct 23 22:27:31 thus proving the sim can be replaced at runtime on maemo 5 :P Oct 23 22:27:49 * MohammadAG thanks DocScrutinizer Oct 23 22:28:06 hmm Oct 23 22:28:07 I wonder Oct 23 22:28:08 wait.. killing bme allows hotswap battery? Oct 23 22:28:18 just a sec Oct 23 22:28:27 you Oct 23 22:28:34 you'll need a power source (damn enter key) Oct 23 22:28:36 http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=57734 Oct 23 22:28:45 basically Oct 23 22:28:48 plug in wall charger Oct 23 22:28:51 remove battery cover Oct 23 22:28:57 stop bme, remove battery Oct 23 22:29:00 you have 30 secs etc Oct 23 22:29:03 do whatever you want Oct 23 22:29:07 awesome Oct 23 22:29:08 MohammadAG: pah, re-inserting same sim doesn't mean a thing Oct 23 22:29:11 didnt know that :-) Oct 23 22:29:29 DocScrutinizer, I have a small script actually Oct 23 22:30:10 MohammadAG: you powered down cellmo? or are you suggesting sim can be chabged without cellmo reboot? Oct 23 22:30:28 I just removed the sim module Oct 23 22:30:34 ssi_mcsaab_imp.ko Oct 23 22:30:43 modprobe -r ssi_mcsaab_imp Oct 23 22:30:51 the sim will get crossed out Oct 23 22:30:57 modprobe it, it will get detected Oct 23 22:31:08 hah. What makes you think cellmo internal datastructures were properly initialized to new sim ? Oct 23 22:31:10 sometimes my N900 loses the sim for some reason, and crosses it out on its own Oct 23 22:31:23 nothing really Oct 23 22:31:41 but DocScrutinizer Oct 23 22:31:46 for example , does reinserting module cause it to reprompt pin? Oct 23 22:31:50 I've experimented with your hotswap Oct 23 22:31:54 javispedro, sec Oct 23 22:32:25 I don't have to power off display/wlan/3G etc Oct 23 22:32:34 I replaced my battery while on 3.5G Oct 23 22:33:31 javispedro, no Oct 23 22:33:48 anywho Oct 23 22:34:01 DocScrutinizer, is there a way to detect if a battery is in or not when bme is not running? Oct 23 22:34:32 err sure, read out twl4030-ADC1(?) Oct 23 22:34:41 don't ask me how :-P Oct 23 22:35:00 * MohammadAG asks ShadowJK :P Oct 23 22:42:53 MohammadAG: ADC4 Oct 23 22:53:12 MohammadAG: maybe you want to probe for VBAT from bq27200 ? Oct 23 22:53:56 the big advantage of this: we know how to do it :-P Oct 23 22:55:26 hmm, maybe you better probe for IBAT - regarding what you probably want to do Oct 23 22:57:29 MohammadAG: also notice there's a direct wire from battery BSI to rapuyama, so cellmo will notice removed battery anyway Oct 23 22:59:04 nfc what it actually does with this info, but aiui it's supposed to *immediately* shut down, so main system might gain a few more ms to power down 'gracefully' from buffer capacitors Oct 23 23:01:31 or it uses this to rescue itself (and SIM) by a emergency shutdown. Probably SIM and rapuyama internal flash also aren't exactly amused to see VDD brownout during a write operation Oct 23 23:03:13 (guess why the BSI contact blade is a few MIL shorter than the actual power contacts) Oct 23 23:04:16 by EE that's called a make-last_break-first contact Oct 23 23:07:15 and the big tragedy is EE never bother to write down all these little details for the SW guys, and the SW guys never realize they might ask as usually they think they know everything. And I'm sitting in the middle and and wonder who's prudent enough to see a job for me on this particular topic Oct 23 23:10:39 morning Oct 23 23:12:02 DocScrutinizer, I was thinking of making a hotswap app for you Oct 23 23:12:13 the result of any missing intermediary like me are abominations like e.g. bme Oct 23 23:13:27 MohammadAG: LIES! it's for you, I *know* you :-P Oct 23 23:13:54 and you're the only one swapping a new bat in, 3 times a day Oct 23 23:14:01 4* Oct 23 23:14:05 the only one I know Oct 23 23:14:37 sometimes 5, I charge batteries externally Oct 23 23:14:46 one goes empty, put in new one, charge old one Oct 23 23:14:49 cycle Oct 23 23:14:49 etc Oct 23 23:15:23 plain evil. Oct 23 23:16:19 o_O so you prefer rebooting on dead battery to keeping the thing on charger overnight? Oct 23 23:16:48 nox-: nobody's rebooting, that's the point Oct 23 23:17:06 take battery out w/o rebooting? Oct 23 23:17:14 [2010-10-24 01:08:22] DocScrutinizer, I was thinking of making a hotswap app for you Oct 23 23:17:20 oh hah Oct 23 23:17:22 [2010-10-24 00:24:56] http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=57734 Oct 23 23:18:33 DocScrutinizer, so Oct 23 23:18:39 I can get charger status (i.e is one connected?) Oct 23 23:18:42 then stop bme Oct 23 23:18:44 ask user to change battery Oct 23 23:18:51 detect battery out/battery in Oct 23 23:18:54 start bme Oct 23 23:19:06 lock and unlock screen Oct 23 23:19:06 close app Oct 23 23:19:17 :nod: Oct 23 23:19:31 hm Oct 23 23:19:38 hey DocScrutinizer :) Oct 23 23:19:38 * alterego starts to feel very schleepy Oct 23 23:20:11 twl4030-ADC4? Oct 23 23:20:19 I guess original Doc's instructions guaranteed that bme was pinged when you plugged in charger, thus starting 30s watchdog _then_? Oct 23 23:20:37 MohammadAG: I'm going to sleep now, there should be some example transparent tool buttons in that source blobl I gave you the otherday :) Oct 23 23:20:44 I-BAT (aka current-now) from bq27200 Oct 23 23:21:15 alterego, I'll figure it out, thanks :) Oct 23 23:21:16 where i can edit that the conversation mail client the sendet mails moved into my 'sent' folder from my mailserver? Oct 23 23:21:26 so.. how do I read bq27200? Oct 23 23:21:36 modest? Oct 23 23:21:38 np, fullscreen and menubutton classes, sage example is maemo5mainwindow Oct 23 23:21:55 DocScrutinizer, /sys // /proc? Oct 23 23:22:08 MohammadAG: noob! we're doing it since ages, see wiki for example Oct 23 23:22:14 g'night folks Oct 23 23:22:18 I2Cget Oct 23 23:22:34 night alterego Oct 23 23:22:41 and ty Oct 23 23:23:17 DocScrutinizer, i2cget isn't really helpful, I need signals :P Oct 23 23:23:19 http://wiki.maemo.org/N900_Software_Power_management Oct 23 23:23:19 containsascriptthatreadseitherbq*kernelmoduleorhardware Oct 23 23:23:19 lol Oct 23 23:23:19 alsomyspacebarisbrokenagainandneedsvacuumingout Oct 23 23:23:21 Thereisnoframeworkexposedtousersthatemitssignals Oct 23 23:23:36 heh, SpeedEvil been faster than my bookamrk searching :-D Oct 23 23:24:00 Awesomebar is awesome. Oct 23 23:24:11 Though it has its issues if I react too fast. Oct 23 23:26:18 people believe the artifact where you "quickly" scroll hildon-desktop is an actual "feature"? Oct 23 23:26:18 *quickly scroll using two fingers, that is. Oct 23 23:26:18 * DocScrutinizer throws a Norten and a "-"at SpeedEvil Oct 23 23:26:18 damn, kornbluth.freenodenet is lagging Oct 23 23:26:18 ~ping Oct 23 23:26:18 or I would be probing the value Oct 23 23:26:18 ~ping Oct 23 23:26:19 ~pong Oct 23 23:26:30 ~ping Oct 23 23:26:31 ~pong Oct 23 23:26:31 nice lag Oct 23 23:26:32 I think the network's falling down, I get nearly 20s lag according to X-Chat lol Oct 23 23:26:38 friggin shit Oct 23 23:26:56 back to normal it seems Oct 23 23:27:00 ~ping Oct 23 23:27:01 ~pong Oct 23 23:27:04 yep Oct 23 23:27:13 same here, plus dropouts Oct 23 23:27:30 sorry, had a few misses during last 3 minutes Oct 23 23:28:26 MohammadAG: you read out current_now as in SpeedEvil 's script and check if current is != 0, this means battery is inserted. poll frequencies shorter 5s are useless Oct 23 23:28:49 discard first non-zero sample after removing battery Oct 23 23:34:55 okay... i can move the messages from the local sent folder to the server folder Oct 23 23:44:36 hello Oct 23 23:48:42 UNF Oct 23 23:54:10 any of you guys tried making a chrooted environment inside a scratchbox or some other way apart from using n900 directly? Oct 23 23:54:43 to do what? Oct 23 23:55:02 to do for example setup debian, ubuntu, etc Oct 23 23:55:15 ah Oct 23 23:55:21 I once setup a gentoo target Oct 23 23:55:41 inside scratchbox? Oct 23 23:55:42 the hard part is to ensure to keep everything compatible with the devkit Oct 23 23:56:07 psycho_oreos, never worked for me inside scratchbox Oct 23 23:56:19 as everything will need to run with the glibc from sbox Oct 23 23:56:21 which is quite old Oct 23 23:56:21 psycho_oreos, you should be able to do it outside scratchbox with qemu Oct 23 23:56:28 * MohammadAG pokes Stskeeps Oct 23 23:56:42 javispedro, it's not that, chroot fails with fakeroot, sudo doesn't work Oct 23 23:56:47 do you see a pattern :P Oct 23 23:57:01 MohammadAG: who needs chroot when you can set up an alternate target Oct 23 23:57:02 MohammadAG, yeah that's that I thought, I've tried hacking sbox login but have failed Oct 23 23:57:20 MohammadAG: scratchbox itself is a oversized chroot() call Oct 23 23:57:26 javispedro, tried that, borked my scratchbox Oct 23 23:57:27 MohammadAG, hmm qemu, in other words MADDE type? :) Oct 23 23:57:50 qemu on its own should be enough Oct 23 23:58:00 MohammadAG: setting another target borked your scratchbox? what did you create it with, a hammer? :) Oct 23 23:58:23 javispedro, a dremel, does it matter? Oct 23 23:59:44 after that it would really be a scratchedbox =) < /bad joke> Oct 24 00:01:44 lol Oct 24 00:03:03 hmm Oct 24 00:03:32 yodawg, heard you like chroots, so we put a chroot in your chroot in your chroot Oct 24 00:04:03 and we wrapped all that into a vm to make you really happy Oct 24 00:04:27 Could one of you plz tell me what hildon-desktop, hildon-home and modest versions/mods you use on your N900 with PR1.2. and where I can find the actual files to download. Oct 24 00:04:53 hehe Oct 24 00:06:07 hi Oct 24 00:06:14 i uninstalled modest Oct 24 00:06:21 can i reset dsp from cmdline? Oct 24 00:06:25 other than reboot? Oct 24 00:06:41 on n800 to be exact Oct 24 00:07:19 apt-cache search might help, NightShift79 Oct 24 00:07:44 ot for modest though, possibly Oct 24 00:08:08 mh Oct 24 00:08:58 'modest' is the mail client? Oct 24 00:09:34 yes Oct 24 00:10:28 so is MohammadAG's hildon-desktop_2.2.138-1+0m5_armel.deb the one to go with untill PR1.3? Oct 24 00:10:41 That depends on what you want. Oct 24 00:10:58 * MohammadAG suggests http://mohammadag.xceleo.org/public/maemo/debfiles/matan/thp/hildon-desktop_double_2.2.138-1+0m5_armel.deb Oct 24 00:10:59 i search a solution to save transmitted messages directly on the server... Oct 24 00:11:12 MohammadAG: :-o Oct 24 00:11:24 Hey, whatever happened to my 3-task patch? :P Oct 24 00:11:44 hawaii_, was too busy on psfreedom Oct 24 00:11:51 and its 2AM in the morning Oct 24 00:12:01 This is me not caring. Oct 24 00:12:06 j/k mate. Oct 24 00:12:07 what happend to the hostmode kernel? Oct 24 00:12:26 too tired really :P Oct 24 00:12:29 Im just looking for you Gurus that found time to fix some of the bugs in hildon Oct 24 00:12:35 can't even watch south park properly Oct 24 00:12:43 we didn't really fix them Oct 24 00:12:48 we only backported them Oct 24 00:12:57 I see.. Oct 24 00:13:03 heh? backported?? Oct 24 00:13:09 PR1.3 has a fix for mce it seems Oct 24 00:13:14 fix for* Oct 24 00:13:23 1707.h madness has no backportable fix Oct 24 00:13:43 the portrait flag works properly now, placing the phone flat does not return the app into landscape mode Oct 24 00:13:59 hoooray Oct 24 00:14:13 which fixes Facebrick, PSFreedom, my modest and settings patch Oct 24 00:14:26 instrinctiv, and whatever uses the flag with stacked windows Oct 24 00:14:28 given the fact lis302dl driver is somewhat borked, that'S a great news actually Oct 24 00:14:38 instintiv* Oct 24 00:14:53 DocScrutinizer, so the driver might've been fixed? Oct 24 00:14:56 * DocScrutinizer cackles Oct 24 00:15:29 instrintivly I'd say "maybe, maybe not" Oct 24 00:15:46 anyways, it behaves, unlike in PR1.2 Oct 24 00:15:57 hmm.. where can I find the download of your newest hildon-home, hildon-desktop, modest, pulseaudio files ? Oct 24 00:16:04 I always thought it was a coding problem, since microB's rotation just works Oct 24 00:16:28 my pulseaudio package needs kernel-power, it reduces but doesn't prevent stuttering Oct 24 00:16:54 the PR1.3 pulseaudio reduces stuttering a lot (but I've encountered it twice under very very heavy load) Oct 24 00:17:00 for the rest, #maemo-ssu Oct 24 00:17:57 I'm working on a solution for that "hardware call buttons" thread right now. Oct 24 00:18:12 hw call what? Oct 24 00:18:23 hawaii_, which is? Oct 24 00:18:28 Ah. okay. thanks so far. I just wanna test your stuff out. but don't know where to download... I'll check #maemo-ssu Oct 24 00:18:34 DocScrutinizer, http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=64254 Oct 24 00:18:37 fix for thread: delete it Oct 24 00:18:44 LOL Oct 24 00:18:59 You posted in the thread recently, MohammadAG Oct 24 00:19:09 with a split screen window overlay solution. Oct 24 00:19:11 hawaii_, I know :) Oct 24 00:19:22 hawaii_, yes yes, what's your solution? Oct 24 00:19:49 volume keys. Oct 24 00:19:58 dudes, I think I don't wanna know what you're after Oct 24 00:20:28 DocScrutinizer, someone's complaining the answer/reject keys are two small Oct 24 00:20:28 using hardware keys for answer/hangup Oct 24 00:20:43 I suggested a whole window only for answer/reject Oct 24 00:20:44 accelerometer to answer Oct 24 00:20:47 aren't them just FX keys? Oct 24 00:20:48 well, you got my suggestion for this since months Oct 24 00:20:50 hawaii_, wants to use the volume keys Oct 24 00:20:50 shake to answer Oct 24 00:21:04 korhojoa, never works in real practice Oct 24 00:21:05 just listen for keys from x events Oct 24 00:21:16 accelerometers don't work for this stuff Oct 24 00:21:32 well. at least i tried Oct 24 00:21:42 volume keys is the best option. I am sh-scripting it right now. Oct 24 00:21:43 write accelerometer daemon that will be spawned, listens for shakes, then generates proper keys Oct 24 00:21:44 MEH Oct 24 00:21:46 solved Oct 24 00:21:55 hawaii_, C, please! Oct 24 00:21:56 send me n900 then i'll write a patch Oct 24 00:22:01 :D Oct 24 00:22:01 ohyeah! nice while jogging Oct 24 00:22:04 F C. Oct 24 00:22:08 windmills do not work that way Oct 24 00:22:16 hawaii_, F U :P Oct 24 00:22:44 accelerometers fail for stuff like this Oct 24 00:22:49 BS Oct 24 00:22:56 the concept sucks Oct 24 00:23:01 a lot Oct 24 00:23:05 lis302 is just fine with that Oct 24 00:23:18 write a feature, make it configurable Oct 24 00:23:20 problem solved Oct 24 00:23:31 which problem??? Oct 24 00:23:38 the problem of jogging? Oct 24 00:23:39 we are on open platform (kind of) Oct 24 00:24:07 The accel has a hardware mechanism to detect taps. Oct 24 00:24:19 This is not implementedinthekernel driver Oct 24 00:24:19 tRaps Oct 24 00:24:23 btw we got just one accelerometer, though 3-axis Oct 24 00:24:53 well, you could do some simple gestures with the accelerometer that would be unlikely to suffer false triggers Oct 24 00:24:56 SpeedEvil: even double-taps Oct 24 00:25:15 such as inverting an axis for just half a second Oct 24 00:25:29 and the feature is *easily* to integrate int lis302 driver Oct 24 00:25:57 * MohammadAG is off Oct 24 00:25:58 night Oct 24 00:26:04 anyone knows how to reset dsp? Oct 24 00:26:17 not even Nokia it seems Oct 24 00:26:25 but trying to write anything in an sh-script is more of a joke than reality :P Oct 24 00:27:02 ieatlint: eh? Oct 24 00:27:42 just strikes me to write a daemon to monitor accelerometer data in an sh script is a joke Oct 24 00:28:06 then write it in c Oct 24 00:28:20 and generat x events Oct 24 00:28:23 or dbus events Oct 24 00:28:24 i've no interest in it Oct 24 00:28:26 or anything Oct 24 00:28:42 that's actually BS, as g-meter has *hardware* to do this. Monitoring is really *BAD*, eats lots of cpu cycles and battery, and is slow Oct 24 00:28:53 It's not a daemon. Oct 24 00:29:14 if hardware supports it, use it Oct 24 00:29:18 :) Oct 24 00:29:29 I don't want to use the accelerometer. Oct 24 00:29:30 mine doesn't Oct 24 00:29:47 That's automation that I don't want. Oct 24 00:30:36 * KotCzarny wrote a visualizer Oct 24 00:30:51 as mentioned before, lis302dl driver doesn't support all the nice features of g-meter chip, but it's *simple* to fix that Oct 24 00:40:23 i want to create a new social networking service and call it misanthropy Oct 24 00:42:00 ^^ Oct 24 00:43:33 is it easy? Oct 24 00:44:12 honestly, a proper g-meter based orientation sensor framework needs a central instance servicing process, that propagates state changes aka events e.g via dbus, much like e.g. liblocation does (though not via dbus, regrettably). It seems mce has control over lis302, but how do you ask mce about orientation events? Oct 24 00:44:41 it works the way you're describing it. Oct 24 00:44:52 watch the system bus :) Oct 24 00:45:36 eeew, watch means you can't specify which class of events you're interested in Oct 24 00:45:57 no, not really Oct 24 00:46:21 _watch is actually the ubercomplex sniffer method where you can add all-crazy filters that nobody uses save for debugging/monitoring Oct 24 00:46:25 i.e. you can't tell mce wich moves and shocks to ignore and save power, and which to report Oct 24 00:46:34 oh, that's true. Oct 24 00:46:45 but that's a quite high level of filtering. Oct 24 00:47:14 you can subscribe for orientation change events, or you can subscribe for full accelerometer data at whatever freq it is these days Oct 24 00:47:51 hmm, which means "devels were too bored or too lacy to come up with a proper concept and API spec" Oct 24 00:48:00 for some reason these days I know the freq the Pre polls the accel but not the freq the N900 polls the accel =) Oct 24 00:48:14 4Hz, with a flag goes up to 30Hz. Oct 24 00:48:21 lazy* Oct 24 00:49:03 hehe, because lis302 isn't supposed to be polled. It's IRQ driven, that's the whole trick of it Oct 24 00:49:14 DocScrutinizer: If you try to spec this it quickly gets the size of the wiimote gesture detection middleware Oct 24 00:49:28 you set threshold and filter parameters and get an IRQ when those are tripped Oct 24 00:50:04 and that's exactly what I'd expect from a mce bbus resource query method as well Oct 24 00:51:02 well, I do agree in that if the hardware has some kind of gesture detection feature it should be exposed at least Oct 24 00:51:15 then mce just does a logical AND of all those parameters, and filters out the mire sensible ones to not signal them to the clients that called for coarse ones Oct 24 00:52:38 but lis302dl kernel driver as is now not even makes use of differential mode, means it detects *absolute* position changes, and it does it in a relatively silly way Oct 24 00:53:11 * javispedro notes his beloved thread about palm pre games is going to convert into yet another thread about flash Oct 24 00:53:35 ~tmo Oct 24 00:53:36 rumour has it, tmo is http://talk.maemo.org, or too much off-topic, or not ~t-mo Oct 24 00:54:01 * javispedro will fire his ICBMs to the next poster who talks about flash on that thread Oct 24 00:54:03 I am trying to create a new custom welcome video and for some reason I can never get the image to work. Sounds works fine but the screen stays black. Any idea how I should be encoding the videos? Oct 24 00:54:18 quanttrom: the builtin media player should be able to play it Oct 24 00:54:31 * DocScrutinizer hands over the remote for the MTHELs to javispedro Oct 24 00:54:39 javispedro: kk I will check if it can Oct 24 00:56:10 from http://wiki.maemo.org/User:Joerg_rw/tools : >>/etc/X11/Xsession.d/10hildon_welcome = shaking-hands-video<< Oct 24 00:56:43 I used the source code of that application to try and understand gstreamer yesterday Oct 24 00:56:49 quite a powerful tool Oct 24 00:57:22 javispedro: works like a charm in the built in media player .. Oct 24 00:57:39 quanttrom: then, no idea. check if size is 800x480, etc. Oct 24 00:57:44 tzz, /usr/bin/maemo-invoker Oct 24 00:57:54 no, not that one Oct 24 00:57:59 hildon-welcome iirc Oct 24 00:58:22 maemo-invoker is just some maemo-launcher specific workaround Oct 24 00:58:28 Nokia-N900-02-8:/sys/class/backlight/acx565akm# file /usr/bin/hildon-welcome Oct 24 00:58:30 /usr/bin/hildon-welcome: symbolic link to `/usr/bin/maemo-invoker' Oct 24 00:58:43 DocScrutinizer: actual binary is in hildon-welcome.launch Oct 24 00:58:44 javispedro: VIDEO: [XVID] 800x480 12bpp 29.970 fps 718.6 kbps (87.7 kbyte/s) Oct 24 00:58:50 looks like it Oct 24 00:58:59 meh Oct 24 00:59:23 WTF is maemo-invoker doing? Oct 24 00:59:23 DocScrutinizer: maemo-inovker/launcher is evil, I know. but someone here told me "the speedup is worth it" Oct 24 00:59:37 ooh, lol Oct 24 00:59:56 fork wizardry Oct 24 01:00:01 yep Oct 24 01:00:05 and preloaded .so Oct 24 01:00:30 ouch that hurts Oct 24 01:00:35 and the reason all stock applications inherit the environment of the maemo-launcher daemon instead of that of the current shell Oct 24 01:00:48 BLAAARGH Oct 24 01:01:30 so run-standalone.sh is actually a maemo-invoker killer? XP Oct 24 01:01:52 nah, not exactly Oct 24 01:01:55 nope Oct 24 01:02:08 * DocScrutinizer feels sick Oct 24 01:02:13 it gets proper env vars for non-launcher applications specially on sdk Oct 24 01:05:33 * DocScrutinizer wonders how much speedup we could get from reducing swapping by freeing ram from all those speedup abominations Oct 24 01:06:44 bbl Oct 24 01:06:52 * DocScrutinizer waves at nox- Oct 24 01:07:02 bye DocScrutinizer Oct 24 01:13:17 javispedro: I bet hildon-welcome has a pretty couple of ugly hacks Oct 24 01:13:42 #1: it doesn't playback the video when called from a rootshell Oct 24 01:14:00 possibly doesn't coexist with matchbox Oct 24 01:16:21 * DocScrutinizer takes notice to get a bottle of good wodka on monday Oct 24 01:16:35 DocScrutinizer, it was in water long enough to cause discolouration to the screws Oct 24 01:16:54 eeeer WHAT? Oct 24 01:17:17 Well, I thought I'd take the back screws out Oct 24 01:17:21 you got screws that are painted by water colors? Oct 24 01:17:23 They are partially green Oct 24 01:17:36 No, I mean. No. Oct 24 01:17:36 eeeeeeeeeeeeeeewwwwewwwwwwwww Oct 24 01:18:03 Isn't water suppose to turn the metal a different colour before it rusts? Oct 24 01:18:59 those screws are all black finish, some kinda chemical treatment. They shouldn't change color in water Oct 24 01:20:00 I seem to remember some green or blue loctite on the threads though Oct 24 01:21:39 partially green - if it's not loctite - means severe electrolytic corrosion Oct 24 01:22:03 or it wasn't water but maybe battery acid :-P Oct 24 01:23:09 in which case you should have rinsed it with clear clean water (preferably demineralized) some days ago, not now Oct 24 01:24:13 Sliders making a strange noise as well Oct 24 01:24:32 this definitely wasn't clear water Oct 24 01:24:40 Well I mean Oct 24 01:24:43 Don't kill me Oct 24 01:24:55 I had it in rice, so I think it's just rice caught in there Oct 24 01:25:04 you'll do that youraself it seems :-P Oct 24 01:25:15 idi** Oct 24 01:25:30 rice, what a nonsense Oct 24 01:26:41 are you rubbing your burns with oil? Oct 24 01:27:03 and read future from tealeafs? Oct 24 01:27:06 Well, I know you said it doesn't work Oct 24 01:27:12 But desperation does this to a man Oct 24 01:27:43 I suggest you try a sledgehammer Oct 24 01:27:49 *might* work Oct 24 01:27:54 heh Oct 24 01:28:29 or sacrifice a virgin Oct 24 01:28:39 that works actually Oct 24 01:29:00 but, will the rice and the n900 blend? Oct 24 01:29:07 DocScrutinizer, at least I haven't chucked it in the oven Oct 24 01:29:23 But I suppose you're going to tell me that's a great idea Oct 24 01:29:28 oven @ 60° C is just fine Oct 24 01:29:38 hehe Oct 24 01:29:39 microwave it! =) Oct 24 01:29:45 YEAH!!!! Oct 24 01:29:48 do that! Oct 24 01:29:53 Ok brb Oct 24 01:29:54 take a video of it Oct 24 01:29:56 grab your camera first thought! Oct 24 01:29:58 yeah! Oct 24 01:30:03 haha Oct 24 01:30:17 HOLY FUCKING SHIT, IT EXPLODED, WTF YOU BASTARDS!!!11111 Oct 24 01:30:20 :p Oct 24 01:30:26 but is the water gone? Oct 24 01:30:34 Termana: that's because you DID NOT GET THE CAMERA!!! Oct 24 01:30:42 plus you got a nice video now, don't you? Oct 24 01:31:34 DocScrutinizer, before I didn't have video on my n900 because the water stopped it all working. Now I have video on my n900... being fried in a microwave. Oct 24 01:32:05 Can't I sue you guys for not saying that you disclaim all liability? Oct 24 01:32:07 :P Oct 24 01:32:23 I can get over 9000 n900s! Oct 24 01:32:28 Termana: see, the gap between a chip and PCB is0.00xx mm. if there's some water in there, it takes ages to evaporate, and it will not give a flying F if there's some rice outside the case or next room or where else Oct 24 01:32:29 sure Oct 24 01:33:06 lol DocScrutinizer Oct 24 01:33:53 DocScrutinizer, so why does everyone recommend rice? Oct 24 01:34:08 a vacuum with mild heat over the course of a month perhaps :) Oct 24 01:34:10 because everone's always been an idiot Oct 24 01:34:28 I know him for long, so I can tell Oct 24 01:34:49 heh Oct 24 01:35:13 a lot of areas in these devices have wicking-action to water, pulling it into crevices, afaik Oct 24 01:35:30 So how can I speed up the evaporation? Oct 24 01:35:38 yep, exactly my point pupnik_ Oct 24 01:35:49 heat to 60° C Oct 24 01:36:21 So how long do I bake it for Chef DocScrutinizer? Oct 24 01:36:25 this will both speed up the evaporation of water and reduce realtive humidity of the air Oct 24 01:36:38 2 weeks as I told ya before Oct 24 01:36:45 TWO WEEKS Oct 24 01:36:55 to be sure yes Oct 24 01:36:55 twice the heat, half the time Oct 24 01:37:01 lol Oct 24 01:37:03 this is quite interesting cuisine Oct 24 01:37:03 TWO FUCKING WEEKS, IN AN OVEN? Oct 24 01:37:13 works for cooking Oct 24 01:37:16 Is it just me that isn't feeling good about this? Oct 24 01:37:19 :[p Oct 24 01:37:22 :p* Oct 24 01:37:24 no, place it on your heating, monitor, TV or whatever Oct 24 01:37:36 Even my emoticons aren't feeling good Oct 24 01:37:37 Termana: clearly we don't understand fine cuisine Oct 24 01:38:07 javispedro, Shall I ask if I need to shove some stuffing up it's arse? Oct 24 01:38:12 hm.. Oct 24 01:38:28 Termana: chinese eggs take much longer, ans see you don't need to eat your N900 :-P Oct 24 01:38:30 N900 + fines herbes Oct 24 01:38:32 yummy Oct 24 01:38:49 Termana: aside from the time, the fact that metal elements in the oven could exceed the 60c or similar would worry me :P Oct 24 01:38:50 that's it Oct 24 01:38:59 I have a nice idea to make myself a million bucks Oct 24 01:39:06 start a "Will it bake?" youtube channel Oct 24 01:39:18 lol Oct 24 01:39:31 ieatlint: I actually didn't suggest oven Oct 24 01:39:47 bah, you're too nice then Oct 24 01:40:15 DocScrutinizer, TV/monitor, like the CRT types? Oct 24 01:40:18 http://haste.4saken.org/pics/baked8800gtx/8800baked3.jpg Oct 24 01:40:21 you got an electric pad? Oct 24 01:40:34 http://haste.4saken.org/pics/baked8800gtx/8800baked.jpg Oct 24 01:40:43 I had an old laptop that zapped you when you had it plugged in Oct 24 01:40:51 Does that count as an electric pad? Oct 24 01:41:10 dude, that guy needs to degrease that pan Oct 24 01:41:22 hey, I also had a laptop with that problem Oct 24 01:41:27 actually a PC at ventilator outlet counts as a nice gentle heat source Oct 24 01:41:27 * javispedro goes see if oven is big enough Oct 24 01:41:47 i kind of wish they could seal these electronics in goop before assembly Oct 24 01:42:08 paint, whatever.. Oct 24 01:42:22 * DocScrutinizer grumbles Oct 24 01:43:05 well, from an engineering pov it's nice. From a RE pov it's W*T*F?!?! Oct 24 01:43:24 we still wouldn't know about bq24150 Oct 24 01:43:43 Anything important said after the PC ventilation? Oct 24 01:43:49 nope Oct 24 01:45:16 Knocked my 3g stick and got disconnected :p Oct 24 01:45:36 I wish they just would build better cases that aren't virually open Oct 24 01:46:48 the upper half of kbd part - the one that is always covered by the screen, is completely open to the chips and PCB Oct 24 01:47:49 I actually wonder how long it'll take until case is completely filled with dust, lint and all kinds of debris Oct 24 01:49:12 ;) Oct 24 01:49:26 and quite obviously water intrudes easily there Oct 24 01:50:10 if you hold the device right, you can collect rain on kbd and it will sore up in case Oct 24 01:50:19 sTore* Oct 24 01:51:09 just get enough debris into the case until the debris makes it completely water-proof Oct 24 01:51:19 good point Oct 24 01:53:13 * javispedro is tempted to post "there's no salvation! abandon ship!!" in one of these "meego will be a tragedy" threads Oct 24 01:53:28 will be?? Oct 24 01:54:29 don't worry; OS/2 still lives. Oct 24 01:54:52 oscar-half :-D \o/ Oct 24 01:54:57 haha anyone ported amiga-os to the n900 yet?. .. not the emulators i mean :) Oct 24 01:55:19 cehteh: impossible Oct 24 01:55:21 i think it's funny that the first meego device was a tablet, and there isn't even announced plans to have a tablet ux for meego Oct 24 01:55:23 mhm wasnt riscOS on arm? :) Oct 24 01:55:35 haiku on the n900!! Oct 24 01:55:40 jacekowski: not impossible, but hard to do Oct 24 01:55:57 impossible Oct 24 01:55:59 javispedro: i think there was actually some basic discussion of that one Oct 24 01:56:01 different cpu Oct 24 01:56:04 apps will not run Oct 24 01:56:07 even if you port kernel Oct 24 01:56:16 i saied 'port' not recompile Oct 24 01:56:18 ieatlint: there was a gsoc project actually Oct 24 01:56:22 and emulation as you said is out of the question Oct 24 01:56:24 jacekowski: partypooper Oct 24 01:56:37 linux does not have a kernel, it has a group of bearded midgets working in concert within the old a500 box Oct 24 01:56:45 errr amiga Oct 24 01:56:48 google wasted money on that? :P Oct 24 01:56:59 * javispedro hides Oct 24 01:56:59 acquire the source, write a BCPL compiler from scratch to get the low amiga system ported Oct 24 01:57:12 apps will not run Oct 24 01:57:20 what apps? ... Oct 24 01:57:22 unless you add other cpu emulation Oct 24 01:57:23 all apps Oct 24 01:57:28 cehteh, problem with original amiga is less cpu - its more the chipset Oct 24 01:57:30 lo lcuk_mob Oct 24 01:57:44 flashmob? Oct 24 01:57:52 lcuk_mob: yeah you have to port some things rather hardcore Oct 24 01:58:12 DocScrutinizer, mobile, i have spent today out and about Oct 24 01:58:34 i could have REALLY done with maps Oct 24 01:58:53 agnus, denise, copper - \o/ Oct 24 01:59:10 blitter Oct 24 01:59:39 yeah Oct 24 02:00:06 does the n900 have some reprogrammable logic? dsp maybe? Oct 24 02:00:16 or all etchd in silicon? Oct 24 02:00:37 dsp makes for a nice copper/blitter I guess Oct 24 02:00:55 yes, of course needs really heavy lifting Oct 24 02:01:03 yo Oct 24 02:01:15 * lcuk_mob misses maps from n810 Oct 24 02:01:28 errr Oct 24 02:01:56 I nver considered those particularly useful Oct 24 02:02:18 navicore is at least _complete_ Oct 24 02:02:28 unlike ovi maps for the n900 Oct 24 02:02:30 (grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr) Oct 24 02:02:37 DocScrutinizer, it would have rerouted me to where I needed instead of following the wrong diversion after a motorway closure earlier Oct 24 02:02:45 javispedro: i think it's complete Oct 24 02:02:52 and above all, its driver oriented mapping Oct 24 02:02:53 javispedro: they don't plan to implement any more features Oct 24 02:02:57 a complete disaster, that is. Oct 24 02:03:03 (ovi maps :) ) Oct 24 02:04:02 I want my tangoGPS, no navi but at least decent maps and direction Oct 24 02:04:11 and tracking Oct 24 02:04:26 and POS Oct 24 02:04:33 POI Oct 24 02:05:35 anybody noticed contacts Address is linked to ovi maps (now?) Oct 24 02:05:56 since PR1.2 iirc Oct 24 02:06:06 I seem to recall pr1.1 didn't do this Oct 24 02:06:08 previously, it had a maps icon but you tapping on it did nothing Oct 24 02:06:15 yep Oct 24 02:07:10 so maybe with pr1.5 we get lat/lon fields in contacts even :-P Oct 24 02:08:09 wow, the eMMC _is_ slow Oct 24 02:08:39 maemo/meego resembles KDE3 vs 4. When it starts getting reliable and useful, it's abandoned Oct 24 02:08:50 DocScrutinizer: same thought Oct 24 02:11:24 javispedro: the eMMC isn't slow, I got sustainable writes @ 12MB/s Oct 24 02:11:39 the driver sucks Oct 24 02:12:20 like my laptops hdd :P Oct 24 02:12:51 ext4 gives a noticeable performance boost btw Oct 24 02:13:36 hmm, ass rage mode worked great, even on VFAT (what else :-P) Oct 24 02:15:02 but concurrently accessing eMMC and uSD locked my device Oct 24 02:15:18 both via ass rage and by direct cp Oct 24 02:16:12 i had that on my first device, extremely high io loads make it stuck and eventually reboot by watchdog Oct 24 02:16:26 didnt tried with the current one Oct 24 02:16:48 usually i just use rsync with --bwlimit and be patient Oct 24 02:17:16 has the benefit that the device still runs smooth while doing some bulk copy/backup Oct 24 02:17:27 meh, I jus bufferd the whole pile'o'shit on external media, and that worked Oct 24 02:17:50 hi Oct 24 02:17:59 so either 20 minutes unusable device which may eventually crash or 1 hour without noticeable interruption .. make your choice Oct 24 02:18:36 hmm, I copied 13GB of mp3 to eMMC in like 25min Oct 24 02:18:52 this is without prev read from uSD though Oct 24 02:19:32 and you can look up my bitching when I tried to do this on device by a cp -a Oct 24 02:19:41 in chan logs Oct 24 02:20:08 heeh Oct 24 02:20:15 brother, I was pissed Oct 24 02:20:24 use rsync :P Oct 24 02:20:44 * cehteh should symlink 'cp' to 'rsync' :) Oct 24 02:21:18 vim /usr/share/local/bin/cp Oct 24 02:21:27 :) Oct 24 02:22:30 well and VFAT is the next nail on the coffin Oct 24 02:22:58 anyone of you tried how btrfs behaves on meego/n900? Oct 24 02:23:17 i dont expect too much yet, but still Oct 24 02:23:24 heard it acts up somewhat, on #meego-arm Oct 24 02:23:39 (what kernel does the meego build use?) Oct 24 02:23:48 * DocScrutinizer shrugs Oct 24 02:24:05 think they got even two flavours Oct 24 02:24:26 i tested btrfs sometimes.. nice features, reasonable but not completely stable, has some weak spots stoll Oct 24 02:24:29 still Oct 24 02:24:31 or was this shr Oct 24 02:25:27 but ehm you really dont need btrfs for its features on a smartphone Oct 24 02:25:47 * DocScrutinizer feels like shouting at the TV, for chillout Oct 24 02:25:58 :) Oct 24 02:26:45 99 chan of BS to choose from **** ENDING LOGGING AT Sun Oct 24 02:59:58 2010