**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Tue Nov 23 02:59:57 2010
Nov 23 03:00:21 <DocScrutinizer-8> xp means extreme discipline to reduce to the bare minimum needed for the task
Nov 23 03:01:14 <BCMM> nox-: worse: Linux was basically the result of license problems with BSD (that are now solved)
Nov 23 03:01:18 <BCMM> oh, he's gone
Nov 23 03:01:35 <DocScrutinizer-8> haha
Nov 23 03:01:52 <BCMM> it's more-or-less true...
Nov 23 03:01:56 <BCMM> doesn't matter now
Nov 23 03:02:20 <DocScrutinizer-8> yes
Nov 23 03:03:09 <DocScrutinizer-8> I started considering unix when bsd became available for some k$
Nov 23 03:03:49 <DocScrutinizer-8> then I thought MEH and looked into minix
Nov 23 03:05:33 <BCMM> "In short, XFree86 is the premier open source X11-based desktop infrastructure."
Nov 23 03:06:03 <DocScrutinizer-8> which was extremely bare bones and iirc refused to work on the Amiga moto CPU which had no MMU
Nov 23 03:06:16 <BCMM> i know that's way offtopic (found while looking up what that X licensing thing was all about)
Nov 23 03:06:26 <BCMM> but it's funny, since that is from the xf86 website, NOW
Nov 23 03:07:34 <DocScrutinizer-8> they meant "the first"
Nov 23 03:10:43 <BCMM> hmm
Nov 23 03:10:49 <BCMM> is that a valid usage in modern english?
Nov 23 03:11:19 <BCMM> also, pretty sure it wasn't
Nov 23 03:11:57 <DocScrutinizer-8> NFC. I practice pidgin since school
Nov 23 03:15:49 <BCMM_> i hear too much french to judge...
Nov 23 03:18:47 <pupnik> wish i could read and listen to audio at once without blurring one or the other
Nov 23 03:20:42 <BCMM_> "it sucks that i have multiple senses, but only one language center in my brain"
Nov 23 03:21:43 <BCMM_> the problem is that the n900 has both an fm tuner and a web browser
Nov 23 03:24:56 <pupnik> wish it had a compass
Nov 23 03:26:46 <BCMM_> live somewhere less cloudy.
Nov 23 03:27:02 <Choom> not exactly the same as a compass
Nov 23 03:27:02 <BCMM_> (during daytime only)
Nov 23 03:27:21 <BCMM_> yeah, it would be sort of neat
Nov 23 03:27:34 <BCMM_> i wonder how big a compass is?
Nov 23 03:27:49 <Choom> a compass along with the accelerometer would allow people to do pretty neat things with prboom, for example
Nov 23 03:28:08 <BCMM_> i'm not sure i follow you
Nov 23 03:28:29 <Choom> control an FPS by moving your cell phone around
Nov 23 03:29:03 <BCMM_> use the compass to work out rotational acceleration?
Nov 23 03:29:14 <Choom> yes
Nov 23 03:30:21 <BCMM_> talking of rotation, anyone else got that 3d "earth" app?
Nov 23 03:30:36 <SpeedEvil> Compass + accelerometer gives you absolute orientation.
Nov 23 03:30:44 <SpeedEvil> (well - sortof)
Nov 23 03:31:20 <SpeedEvil> Accel only gives you which direction 'down' is in
Nov 23 03:31:26 <SpeedEvil> sort-of
Nov 23 03:31:29 <BCMM_> has anyone ever used dead reckoning to improve gps?
Nov 23 03:31:37 <SpeedEvil> Yes.
Nov 23 03:31:45 <pupnik> there's an iphone game where you look around the game by rotating the device, and you can rotate 360 and arrive at the same view
Nov 23 03:31:48 <BCMM_> i mean, in the very short term, it's more accurate
Nov 23 03:32:12 <BCMM_> SpeedEvil: is it feasible on the n900, with no real orientation information?
Nov 23 03:32:17 <SpeedEvil> You basically can't do it with the accel, unless you know something about the environment.
Nov 23 03:32:33 <SpeedEvil> For example - if you know the n900 is strapped into a car-mount
Nov 23 03:32:50 <SpeedEvil> That gives you a good idea of what lateral accelleration 'means'
Nov 23 03:33:02 <SpeedEvil> otherwise, you have no clue, because the orientation of the phone can vary
Nov 23 03:33:07 <pupnik> amazing miniturization.
Nov 23 03:33:13 <BCMM_> you mean, if you know where "forwards" is?
Nov 23 03:33:17 <SpeedEvil> yes
Nov 23 03:33:20 <SpeedEvil> sort-of
Nov 23 03:33:28 <BCMM_> yeah, i figured that
Nov 23 03:33:33 <SpeedEvil> In a car, you also know about the kinematics
Nov 23 03:33:34 <Choom> can also do it with the camera
Nov 23 03:33:44 <pupnik> you'll always get drift with just accelometers
Nov 23 03:33:46 <Choom> by tracking the environment around the player
Nov 23 03:34:02 <SpeedEvil> For example - that any lateral acceleration is precisely correlated with turning.
Nov 23 03:34:05 <Choom> but that's a little too complex to implement
Nov 23 03:34:15 <SpeedEvil> And that gives you course.
Nov 23 03:34:26 <SpeedEvil> (unless drifting)
Nov 23 03:34:29 <BCMM_> does the gps subsystem use some sort of blind dead-reckoning to smooth stuff out?
Nov 23 03:34:32 <SpeedEvil> No
Nov 23 03:34:40 <SpeedEvil> Well - sort-of-implicit
Nov 23 03:35:06 <SpeedEvil> It uses a kalman filter or similar which the psuedoranges to the satellites and the current motion vector is fed to
Nov 23 03:35:11 <BCMM_> i'm almost sure i've seen the positoon on the map "overshoot" a turning slightly, then correct itself
Nov 23 03:35:53 <SpeedEvil> It's not as simple as explicit dead-reckoning.
Nov 23 03:36:12 <SpeedEvil> It's weighting the current course over the poor signals it's recieving from the antennas.
Nov 23 03:36:35 <BCMM_> that is sort-of what i meant
Nov 23 03:36:42 <SpeedEvil> Once the GPS signal becomes clearly different from the esitmated position, it will correct
Nov 23 03:36:57 <SpeedEvil> http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Accuracy
Nov 23 03:37:00 <SpeedEvil> may be of use
Nov 23 03:37:11 <BCMM_> i mean, it does, under some circumstances, guess that you're still moving?
Nov 23 03:37:17 <SpeedEvil> yes
Nov 23 03:37:22 <SpeedEvil> Well - no.
Nov 23 03:37:29 <BCMM_> ?
Nov 23 03:37:45 <SpeedEvil> It's not as defined typically as a guess - yes or no.
Nov 23 03:38:08 <SpeedEvil> It's weighting different inputs to different ways - it's rarely as binary as yes/no
Nov 23 03:38:49 <BCMM_> yeah, i didn't mean that
Nov 23 03:39:28 <SpeedEvil> Sorry - I'm probably overthinking this - it's closing on 4AM
Nov 23 03:39:37 <SpeedEvil> And I should probably go to sleep.
Nov 23 03:40:00 <BCMM_> i am in the same timezone...
Nov 23 03:48:00 <DocScrutinizer-8> lateral acceleration is worthless for detecting turns. you can't distinguish it from slight tilts of the device (plus car)
Nov 23 03:53:02 <DocScrutinizer> a compass chip is really small, but not exactly a plug&play add-on for N900
Nov 23 03:55:08 <DocScrutinizer> also don't expect too pleasant results from a compass, more often than you might think the magnetic field of earth is massively disturbed by magnets or steel in a few meters distance
Nov 23 03:55:30 <SpeedEvil> DocScrutinizer: yes you can - for most roads, they are pretty level.
Nov 23 03:55:59 <SpeedEvil> There are issues, eys
Nov 23 03:56:53 <SpeedEvil> It's about the only place where you can meaningfully use the accel for positioning - over a period of several seconds
Nov 23 04:11:39 <pupnik> http://www.micron.com/products/flcos_microdisplays/lcos_history/1973_1983_DV.html
Nov 23 04:12:04 <pupnik> The world's first liquid-crystal-on-silicon (LCOS) device was built in 1973 by a team at Hughes Aircraft.   By 1981, teams at Toshiba and at Suwa Seikosha (now known as Seiko Epson) were developing direct-view LCOS televisions.
Nov 23 04:15:02 * Jay_BEE waves hi
Nov 23 05:43:17 <DocScrutinizer> ~moo
Nov 23 05:43:18 * infobot mooooooooo! I am cow, hear me moo, I weigh twice as much as you. I am cow, eating grass, methane gas comes out my ass
Nov 23 05:45:57 <johnx> <_<
Nov 23 06:12:57 <vivekg> Hi I am having a strange problem with my n900. its in production mode(cleared RD mode). but whenever i m putting the battery in the device, its automatically powered on... i have set the flag force-power-key but still its not working so any help ?
Nov 23 06:13:17 <lucent> vivekg: not familiar with this.
Nov 23 06:15:46 <DocScrutinizer> force-power-key is ENabling this behaviour
Nov 23 06:16:07 <DocScrutinizer> unset it
Nov 23 06:18:00 <vivekg> after clearing this force-power-key also my device is booting as soon as i put the battery
Nov 23 06:18:45 <ds3> does the current host mode enablement software catch the case where I plug in a charger with the hostmode enabled?
Nov 23 06:18:55 <ds3> or will it happily start a fire?
Nov 23 06:23:21 <lucent> ds3: I had a charger plugged in when I enabled host mode, no fires and widget mode still works
Nov 23 06:23:38 <lucent> ds3: hostmode seems to drain power and continue draining power until you reboot though
Nov 23 06:23:51 <ds3> oh
Nov 23 06:24:03 <ds3> glad I didn't try it when I was away from a charger
Nov 23 06:24:12 <lucent> additionally, I do not posess the correct connectors to verify whether or not usb host mode is functional here
Nov 23 06:24:48 <ds3> the included cable + a female to female adapter should do it
Nov 23 06:25:00 <DocScrutinizer> ds3: hostmode is safe
Nov 23 06:25:04 <ds3> but what you are describing sounds like my experiences with the 770
Nov 23 06:25:18 <lucent> ds3: where to obtain female to female adapter?
Nov 23 06:25:30 <ds3> DocScrutinizer: what about less dramatic stuff like do I loose the ability to charge?
Nov 23 06:25:38 <ds3> lucent: where are you?
Nov 23 06:25:41 <DocScrutinizer> you don't
Nov 23 06:25:44 <lucent> USA located
Nov 23 06:26:06 <DocScrutinizer> and it would be just dramatic enough if you did
Nov 23 06:26:29 <lucent> I mail order just about everything
Nov 23 06:26:38 <ds3> well, things frying and self destructing a whole different class then losing a "feature"
Nov 23 06:26:57 <lucent> side note, I'm also looking for USBA-M to USBA-F compact adapter with a switch to tie the data lines for high power charging
Nov 23 06:26:58 <ds3> so if I am correct, the biggest risk is leaving the charge pump running and having hostmode drain the batteries?
Nov 23 06:27:12 <ds3> lucent: do you have a big lots near you?
Nov 23 06:27:20 <DocScrutinizer> lucent: actually hostmode uses battery for vbus and musb-core, but this should stop as soon as you close the h-e-n GUI window
Nov 23 06:27:44 <lucent> hm, no. I mail order everything. I'm in a ski resort town a hundred miles from anything
Nov 23 06:28:33 <DocScrutinizer> ds3: (risk) exactly
Nov 23 06:29:35 <lucent> and Doc, any command line voodoo to verify if it is or not?
Nov 23 06:30:35 <DocScrutinizer> what, vbus?
Nov 23 06:30:42 <ds3> DocScrutinizer: got it, think I am up to speed on it then. wasn't sure if the way the N900 is setup is electrically safe wrt to Vbus
Nov 23 06:31:14 <DocScrutinizer> lucent: ?
Nov 23 06:31:41 <lucent> DocScrutinizer: to verify if H-E-N UI is cleaning up after exit
Nov 23 06:32:04 <lucent> I'm not sure about the specifics here, it's above what I know about the technical things
Nov 23 06:32:27 <DocScrutinizer> check ps|grep vboost I guess, for making sure VBUS got disabled
Nov 23 06:32:35 <ds3> lucent: http://www.amazon.com/Emerge-Tech-ETCABLEKIT3-Universal-Cable/dp/B00070IOK6/ref=sr_1_37?ie=UTF8&qid=1290493359&sr=8-37
Nov 23 06:32:44 <ds3> that kit contains a F-F adapter, IIRC
Nov 23 06:32:55 <lucent> slick
Nov 23 06:33:08 <DocScrutinizer> ps|grep bme to make sure bme-rx51-foo got started (important for charging)
Nov 23 06:33:40 <ds3> does the stock kernel have USB mass storage drivers in place?
Nov 23 06:34:04 <DocScrutinizer> if you find anything odd there, you can killall vboost (or just kill vboost process), and you can `start bme`
Nov 23 06:34:16 <DocScrutinizer> ds3: sure
Nov 23 06:34:24 <DocScrutinizer> passive ones
Nov 23 06:34:46 <ds3> nifty
Nov 23 06:35:03 <ds3> now to find a suitable power user kernel
Nov 23 06:35:04 <DocScrutinizer> otherwise selecting "Mass Storage Mode" on that menu wouldn't really make sense ;-D
Nov 23 06:35:35 <ds3> actually, do I need a power user kernel for h-e-n?
Nov 23 06:41:52 <lucent> DocScrutinizer: no vboost in ps output, when h-e-n is running and I've selected "Low Speed hostmode" ; "VBUS boost on"
Nov 23 06:42:33 <DocScrutinizer> check the name of that script then, it might be named differently
Nov 23 06:43:16 <lucent> oh, it's a script, sorry.   I think it is now "/opt/h-e-n/hostmod" ?
Nov 23 06:43:29 <DocScrutinizer> in htop you can spot it easily, as it's a child of h-e-n GUI
Nov 23 06:43:41 <lucent> my question to you was more about checking the things from a sysfs or proc interface
Nov 23 06:44:23 <DocScrutinizer> there are sysnodes called vbus iirc
Nov 23 06:45:11 <DocScrutinizer> and there's /proc/driver/musb_hdrc which has a lot of info (though not exactly self explanatory)
Nov 23 06:45:19 <lucent> thanks, perfect
Nov 23 06:45:30 <lucent> ds3: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000BSN4UY
Nov 23 06:45:40 <lucent> $5usd-
Nov 23 06:47:08 <DocScrutinizer> also a look into tail -n 50 /var/log/syslog is never a bad idea
Nov 23 06:47:43 <DocScrutinizer> (given you installed syslogd, otherwise you'll need dmesg|tail -n 50)
Nov 23 06:48:58 <lucent> interesting, how to emulate 'F5' for Tree view on htop from maemo terminal?
Nov 23 06:49:20 <DocScrutinizer> click the hotkey
Nov 23 06:49:32 <DocScrutinizer> though ESC-5 also should work
Nov 23 06:49:45 <lucent> oh!
Nov 23 06:50:39 <DocScrutinizer> :-)
Nov 23 06:51:32 <lucent> DocScrutinizer: for  your reference I think the process name is "/usr/sbin/booston"
Nov 23 06:51:46 <lucent> it's a child of /sbin/init
Nov 23 06:51:46 <DocScrutinizer> aah yes
Nov 23 06:51:54 <DocScrutinizer> o.O
Nov 23 06:52:46 <DocScrutinizer> interesting, seems I have to have a look at MohammadAG's source. He's doing a few funny things it seems
Nov 23 06:53:49 <pupnik> holy handgrenades, Batman!  look how small a gps reciever is now http://www.robotshop.com/eu/sfe-12-micro-gr-10-gps.html
Nov 23 06:56:33 <DocScrutinizer> nothing extraordinary
Nov 23 06:56:53 <DocScrutinizer> the problem is the antenna though
Nov 23 06:57:25 <DocScrutinizer> if they were smart they would build a patch antenna with that chip in socket
Nov 23 06:58:09 <DocScrutinizer> otoh who's using patch antennae nowadays - except openmoko ;-P
Nov 23 06:58:52 <lucent> an antenna from copper traces on the board it's attached to is more cost effective, no?
Nov 23 06:59:31 <DocScrutinizer> mhm. Or brass stripes gold plated, like e.g. in N900
Nov 23 07:01:17 * lucent :)
Nov 23 07:01:22 <DocScrutinizer> or just printed to plastic parts, like there: http://www.engadget.com/photos/nokias-qwerty-slidin-n9-shows-up-in-the-wilds-of-china/#3277333
Nov 23 07:01:58 <lucent> next hunt for me is a data-tie switch for USB-A
Nov 23 07:03:17 <DocScrutinizer> HAHAHA am I crazy or... look at the screw hole lower right on the N9 photo linked above :-D
Nov 23 07:03:20 <lucent> at the moment I have hacked apart an USB-A-M to microUSB-M data cable and tied the data lines together forming a charge cable that works always
Nov 23 07:04:25 <DocScrutinizer> :nod:
Nov 23 07:06:55 <DocScrutinizer> upper right hole seems has same funny helix
Nov 23 07:07:57 <lucent> ha, yeah
Nov 23 07:08:43 <lucent> wow, this is resourceful... salvage a 2-port USB connector from an old PC motherboard and wire it into a female-female adapter for host mode
Nov 23 07:09:16 <DocScrutinizer> err, please reword resourceful
Nov 23 07:09:26 <ds3> Now if there was only a source for a 6inch adapter micro B to female A
Nov 23 07:09:37 <lucent> DocScrutinizer: "using things I have around my tech shop"
Nov 23 07:09:44 <DocScrutinizer> aah
Nov 23 07:11:16 <pupnik> the keys on that will be mushy, not clicky like N900
Nov 23 07:11:18 <pupnik> oh well
Nov 23 07:11:33 <DocScrutinizer> lcuk: using one with cable is even a soldering free solution. Just use paperclips to connect the pins of the connector, or jumpers when there's a number of posts on the board
Nov 23 07:13:46 <lucent> lcuk: that was for me ;)
Nov 23 07:17:36 <DocScrutinizer> oops yeah
Nov 23 07:17:40 <DocScrutinizer> lcuk: sorry
Nov 23 07:20:54 <pupnik> i'd really like an 100x40 ascii terminal in one eye
Nov 23 07:21:48 <lucent> http://shop.brando.com/mini-usb-to-micro-usb-adapter-w-on-off-switch_p04160c0006d001.html  something like that
Nov 23 07:22:07 <lucent> ...except usbA-F to usbA-M
Nov 23 07:24:07 <chx> why does that thing have a switch???????
Nov 23 07:24:24 <lucent> chx: tie the data pins together or not; for fast charge detection
Nov 23 07:24:34 <chx> OH
Nov 23 07:24:42 <chx> rly?
Nov 23 07:24:50 <lucent> my N900 does *NOT* charge when connected by cable to a belkin USB mini car charge adapter
Nov 23 07:24:52 <chx> I was looking for something like this then for ever.
Nov 23 07:25:23 <lucent> I had to hack apart a cable and tie the data pins together
Nov 23 07:25:41 <chx> lucent: you suer that's what the switch does?
Nov 23 07:25:50 <lucent> certain, yes
Nov 23 07:25:53 <DocScrutinizer> I usually fix that inside the charger, with iron + solder
Nov 23 07:26:15 <chx> Thank you! Your order has been completed.
Nov 23 07:26:19 <chx> :)
Nov 23 07:26:22 <lucent> :)
Nov 23 07:26:59 <chx> that will allow me to use standard miniusb cables with all the usb ports i have
Nov 23 07:27:17 <chx> i have a small travel outlet with 3 three power and 1 usb
Nov 23 07:27:35 <chx> and i have the belkin brick with also three power and 2 usb but it does not work on 220v.
Nov 23 07:27:46 <chx> and, the n900 does not charge from any of those
Nov 23 07:27:56 <chx> interestingly enough, it charges from the charger of the nook.
Nov 23 07:28:00 <lucent> ah, yes that is the exact symptom of what I described
Nov 23 07:28:07 <chx> i know
Nov 23 07:28:09 <chx> it's in the wiki
Nov 23 07:28:11 <korhojoa> hm?
Nov 23 07:28:16 <lucent> mine does not charge from my nook charger, funny though
Nov 23 07:28:22 <chx> but since i immigrated i no longer have a multimeter
Nov 23 07:28:24 <DocScrutinizer> heh, I could offer a software fix. Interested?
Nov 23 07:28:27 <chx> neither a soldiering post.
Nov 23 07:28:31 <chx> DocScrutinizer: what????
Nov 23 07:28:38 <lucent> DocScrutinizer: what's the command?
Nov 23 07:28:41 <chx> DocScrutinizer: this can be fixed in *software*?
Nov 23 07:28:46 <DocScrutinizer> yes
Nov 23 07:28:53 <DocScrutinizer> but not with a simple command
Nov 23 07:29:01 <chx> DocScrutinizer: knowing you :) does it include installing a hacked kernel?
Nov 23 07:29:15 <DocScrutinizer> no, not that sophisticated
Nov 23 07:29:19 <chx> phew
Nov 23 07:29:37 <chx> I am using Linux since before it was 1.0 but i am NOT comfy with installing a custom kernel on a device like this.
Nov 23 07:29:51 <DocScrutinizer> hehe
Nov 23 07:29:57 <korhojoa> just something with the charging daemon?
Nov 23 07:30:04 <chx> it lacks a floppy drive ;)
Nov 23 07:30:07 <korhojoa> :D
Nov 23 07:30:16 <DocScrutinizer> korhojoa: exactly
Nov 23 07:30:18 <korhojoa> it's got a microusb slot
Nov 23 07:30:31 <korhojoa> usb... sd, i mean.
Nov 23 07:30:33 <lucent> microusb is the "new" floppy drive
Nov 23 07:30:38 <korhojoa> :D
Nov 23 07:30:50 <lucent> wow you got me, microsd is the new floppy drive
Nov 23 07:31:00 <chx> DocScrutinizer: so ... what do we need to do to the charging daemon and how come i couldnt find this in the forum or the wiki?
Nov 23 07:31:04 <lucent> microusb on the brain here
Nov 23 07:31:14 <chx> microsd is the new floppy dirve, wow, that's one small, small floppy :D
Nov 23 07:31:23 <korhojoa> because it's undocumented and experimental, i guess
Nov 23 07:31:40 <korhojoa> now i'm just left wondering what a dirve is
Nov 23 07:31:47 <lucent> I could not find this information about changing N900 charging modes on the wiki or forums
Nov 23 07:31:50 <DocScrutinizer> chx: you can't find it because I mentioned it first time 3 minutes ago. And it's not like doing anything to bme, it's about replacing it
Nov 23 07:32:18 <chx> DocScrutinizer: oh you just figured it out :) ? tell us more :D
Nov 23 07:32:22 <korhojoa> ah, how is the replacement coming along?
Nov 23 07:32:35 <lucent> ...that would be why ; how are the efforts to replace bme?
Nov 23 07:32:36 <chx> DocScrutinizer: you reverse engineered bme???????
Nov 23 07:32:58 <DocScrutinizer> we got bme-free charging since ~6 months now
Nov 23 07:33:25 <DocScrutinizer> I posted a draft on tmo ages ago
Nov 23 07:33:43 <chx> wow
Nov 23 07:33:44 <lucent> good work then :)
Nov 23 07:33:50 <korhojoa> does it involve typing a command every time you want to charge your phone?
Nov 23 07:34:09 <DocScrutinizer> ShadowJK hasn't started bme since months afaik
Nov 23 07:34:22 <chx> is that when his phone last worked :P ?
Nov 23 07:34:27 <DocScrutinizer> korhojoa: for now yes it does
Nov 23 07:34:29 <chx> Sorry :)
Nov 23 07:34:29 <korhojoa> :DD
Nov 23 07:34:44 <korhojoa> okay
Nov 23 07:34:59 <chx> DocScrutinizer: so , now you type a command and it charges and D- D+ short be damned?
Nov 23 07:35:15 <DocScrutinizer> though you know you can "type commands" with a desktop icon
Nov 23 07:35:37 <korhojoa> no! it requires a cli! don't ruin my illusion!
Nov 23 07:36:06 <chx> haha
Nov 23 07:36:12 <korhojoa> what happens when you unplug in the middle of charging?
Nov 23 07:36:51 <DocScrutinizer> well, I'll register a paypal account :-D So when I can buy a few donuts for breakfast I'll publish the virtual D+- short X-P
Nov 23 07:37:03 <DocScrutinizer> korhojoa: It stops
Nov 23 07:37:22 <chx> http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=29051 this is the only thing i found for free-bme
Nov 23 07:38:29 <DocScrutinizer> umm
Nov 23 07:39:07 <DocScrutinizer> jrbme.garage.maemo.org   -  not much to see there, but that'S where it will be
Nov 23 07:39:47 <DocScrutinizer> cya
Nov 23 07:39:55 <DocScrutinizer> me away for breakfast
Nov 23 07:40:31 <lucent> thanks DocScrutinizer
Nov 23 07:46:11 <chx> is there http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.27230 anything like this for HID profile?
Nov 23 07:53:18 <Jay_BEE> does any of the irc clients for maemo (xchat or pidgin or ???) support connecting to irc.freenode.net?
Nov 23 07:54:27 <phellarv> Jay_BEE: Use irssi
Nov 23 07:54:35 <phellarv> The best one there is
Nov 23 07:55:12 <Jay_BEE> if memory serves me, irssi is console based eh?
Nov 23 07:57:03 <phellarv> Correct
Nov 23 07:57:46 <Jay_BEE> my console based irc app of choice is bitchx... wonders if that was ever ported...
Nov 23 07:58:54 <mveplus> Jay_BEE: Xchat also work well on N900
Nov 23 08:04:16 <jbtest> hmm
Nov 23 08:05:47 <jbtest> i sit corrected... perhaps it was pidgin that did not work with freenode as xchat seems to be fine
Nov 23 08:06:19 <jbtest> thanks
Nov 23 08:08:50 <Jay_BEE> good night and good day to all
Nov 23 08:13:57 <lolloo> is there a way to make Xchat work change to portiet mode?
Nov 23 08:16:41 <psycho_oreos> what use would xchat be if it were to be portrait when the physical keyboard is on the other side of the screen? have virtual keyboard like iphones?
Nov 23 08:17:31 <lolloo> mmm
Nov 23 08:18:04 <lolloo> good point, let me check
Nov 23 08:30:24 <cos^> any ermining devs here? i'd like to whine about it :-)
Nov 23 08:30:59 <lolloo> what is it cos^ ?
Nov 23 08:32:00 <cos^> lolloo: i have 2 calendars enabled at google. it always selects the wrong one in settings
Nov 23 08:32:24 <cos^> if i change it, it always resets to the wrong one
Nov 23 08:32:55 <lolloo> ok, I will try it on my side.
Nov 23 08:33:07 <lolloo> it shouldn't change
Nov 23 08:40:16 <yacc> psycho_oreos, no insult meant, but xchat is rather useless on the small n900 display anyway, ..
Nov 23 08:41:14 <Surfa> oh well, as useless as irssi and other irc clients imo
Nov 23 08:42:15 <psycho_oreos> yacc, indeed but when you're on the go and with most apps are designed to be mostly to be run in landscape mode.. some things people say makes you ponder the useful-ness of so and so app in portrait mode when the app originally has difficulty squeezing its functionality into landscape mode
Nov 23 08:43:37 <gyerot> Surfa: terminal irc clients make more sense, at least you can turn off most of the interface and make font smaller
Nov 23 08:45:46 <psycho_oreos> great for people with short sightedness.. you can see who would be squinting at their device trying to make sense of each word as its displayed on the minuscule font.. and probably be laughed at by iphone owners
Nov 23 08:46:39 <gyerot> which incidentally has half the screen capacity...
Nov 23 08:47:16 <psycho_oreos> indeed, space at a premium, lets sacrifice our eyes in the process of saving some screen's `white areas'
Nov 23 08:47:51 <psycho_oreos> s/areas/spaces/
Nov 23 08:47:51 <infobot> psycho_oreos meant: indeed, space at a premium, lets sacrifice our eyes in the process of saving some screen's `white spaces'
Nov 23 08:49:49 <gyerot> ok, I connected here on n900 using weechat, and I can see just ine using default font size
Nov 23 08:52:51 <jacekowski> weechat isn't the best thing for irc
Nov 23 08:53:36 <gyerot> what do you suggest then, irssi?
Nov 23 08:54:41 <Termana> xchat
Nov 23 08:55:14 <Termana> That's what jacekowski recommends as well
Nov 23 08:55:41 <gyerot> can you use it over ssh so your irc session isn't depenedent on your shitty gprs connection?
Nov 23 08:56:23 <Termana> gyerot, i guess you could with X11 forwarding (?) - or you know, set up a bouncer
Nov 23 08:57:13 <gyerot> and pay triple for X11 data transfer :-)
Nov 23 09:01:48 <sjk> irssi is fine on the n900
Nov 23 09:01:50 <Termana> gyerot, well then you could set up psybnc on your server
Nov 23 09:01:54 <Termana> sjk, LIES
Nov 23 09:01:56 <Termana> :p
Nov 23 09:02:03 <sjk> I'm using it as we speak :)
Nov 23 09:02:41 <DocScrutinizer51> bip or znc FTW
Nov 23 09:02:58 <sjk> But then again, I've used it for years and cannot really be arsed to try something new. :)
Nov 23 09:15:15 <pupnik_> someone should name their kid 'doctor'
Nov 23 09:16:59 <yacc> psycho_oreos, yeah, but for irc I've found that installing the irc modules into pidgin works much better for me. Enough IRC support, NickServ support with some tricks, and overall a better experience on a 800x480 display than xchat.
Nov 23 09:17:28 <yacc> psycho_oreos, but then pidgin has had a basic workover for the n900/maemo I think ;)
Nov 23 09:19:10 <DocScrutinizer> hah
Nov 23 09:19:17 <DocScrutinizer> what's wrong with xchat?
Nov 23 09:19:56 <DocScrutinizer> (... at least you can turn off most of the interface and make font smaller) sounds like xchat to me
Nov 23 09:39:53 <summel> The website at meego.com contains elements from the site thenokiablog.com, which appears to host malware
Nov 23 09:39:58 <summel> :o
Nov 23 09:42:09 <timeless_mbp> summel: wrong channel
Nov 23 09:42:24 <summel> yes
Nov 23 09:42:24 <summel> :D
Nov 23 09:45:12 <Venemo_N900> hi
Nov 23 09:45:28 <Venemo_N900> is there an FTP client for Maemo?
Nov 23 09:46:08 <RobbieThe1st> Google search "ftp maemo" first result: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=55336
Nov 23 09:49:00 <Venemo_N900> RobbieThe1st: thanks! :)
Nov 23 09:49:29 <RobbieThe1st> np
Nov 23 09:50:04 <timeless_mbp> RobbieThe1st: you should use lmgtfy
Nov 23 09:50:17 <timeless_mbp> the n900 supports it :)
Nov 23 09:50:28 <RobbieThe1st> True, but that takes too long.
Nov 23 09:51:03 <RobbieThe1st> I have Google in my firefox bar; easier to just google it than to google it, paste it into lmgtfy, then post it in here acting like a smartass
Nov 23 09:57:52 <Jaffa> Morning, all
Nov 23 09:59:22 <Venemo_N900> morning Jaffa
Nov 23 10:03:29 <Venemo_N900> ~seen MohammadAG
Nov 23 10:06:41 <Venemo_N900> where is infobot?
Nov 23 10:07:45 <psycho_oreos> pinged out
Nov 23 10:09:11 <Venemo_N900> :(
Nov 23 10:26:23 <tybollt>  RobbieThe1st> I have Google in my firefox bar; easier to just google it than to google it
Nov 23 10:26:26 <tybollt> I like that
Nov 23 10:30:06 <RobbieThe1st> You know what I meant.. But that -was- a good find
Nov 23 10:37:45 <timeless_mbp> teach a man to fish
Nov 23 10:38:54 <sivang> morning all
Nov 23 10:40:03 <lolloo> hahaha timeless_mbp
Nov 23 10:40:21 <lolloo> the quote from the meego conference
Nov 23 10:40:28 <timeless_mbp> ?
Nov 23 10:40:40 <lolloo> teach a man to fish
Nov 23 10:40:56 <lolloo> they said it on meeGo conference
Nov 23 10:41:11 * timeless_mbp decides lolloo isn't a native speaker
Nov 23 10:41:18 <lolloo> hehehe
Nov 23 10:41:22 <timeless_mbp> http://www.quotationspage.com/quote/2279.html
Nov 23 10:41:42 <lolloo> I know but it reminded me of the conference
Nov 23 10:41:45 <lolloo> hehehe
Nov 23 10:41:48 <timeless_mbp> heck, the UK even has a program named after it: www.teachamantofish.org.uk/
Nov 23 10:41:54 <lolloo> hehehe
Nov 23 10:42:01 <lolloo> awesome
Nov 23 10:49:48 <crashanddie> timeless_mbp, it's a pretty common saying even in other languages
Nov 23 10:49:58 <timeless_mbp> crashanddie: to be fair, it's a chinese proverb
Nov 23 10:50:08 <timeless_mbp> so it probably works better in the original chinese :)
Nov 23 10:50:13 <crashanddie> damn chinese
Nov 23 10:50:25 <crashanddie> they export their proverbs by the metric ton
Nov 23 10:50:27 <timeless_mbp> curses upon ancient civilizations!
Nov 23 10:50:40 <timeless_mbp> they have an unfair advantage!
Nov 23 10:50:53 <lolloo> hehehe
Nov 23 10:50:58 <timeless_mbp> they can say "First Post" first
Nov 23 10:52:00 <alterego> Weird, two dreams about my N900 in as many nights.
Nov 23 10:52:16 <alterego> The first one it got snapped in half and last nikght the usb fell out.
Nov 23 10:53:59 <chem|st> alterego: no dream... thursday it got splashed with 0.5L wheat-beer-coke mix
Nov 23 10:54:34 <alterego> Hah :)
Nov 23 10:54:41 <chem|st> is there some kind of glue or heatsink liquid on top of the omap housing?
Nov 23 10:54:42 <alterego> Oh dear, is it okay?
Nov 23 10:55:05 <chem|st> alterego: fine apart of the louder part of the wip
Nov 23 10:55:49 <chem|st> alterego: and putting the keyboard back in place is a pain!
Nov 23 10:58:47 <alterego> microbs' auto complete definitely feels quicker in 1.3 I've not had to clear history since I flashed it.
Nov 23 10:59:41 <sivang> crashanddie: heh
Nov 23 10:59:56 <timeless_mbp> alterego: glad to hear you finally upgraded
Nov 23 11:00:04 <sivang> alterego: I had a dream it got sick and died ;-)
Nov 23 11:00:27 <timeless_mbp> alterego: fwiw, w/ nokia products, i think you're better served by backing up and upgrading early
Nov 23 11:00:32 <DocScrutinizer-8> chem|st: no heat conducting spread on any part
Nov 23 11:00:38 <alterego> timeless_mbp: I upgraded the day it was released, I think I was one of the first to get it from tablets-dev :P
Nov 23 11:00:48 <timeless_mbp> oh
Nov 23 11:01:13 <timeless_mbp> the way you wrote your sentence made me interpret it differently
Nov 23 11:01:15 <chem|st> DocScrutinizer-8: glue or kind of?
Nov 23 11:01:23 <DocScrutinizer-8> chem|st: no
Nov 23 11:01:27 <alterego> sorry, I get that alot :P
Nov 23 11:01:37 <sivang> timeless_mbp: I heard fishinig is popular in Finland
Nov 23 11:01:38 <sivang> ;)
Nov 23 11:01:39 <DocScrutinizer-8> btw you opened the cans?
Nov 23 11:01:41 <chem|st> DocScrutinizer-8: ok then it must be wheat-beer remains
Nov 23 11:01:59 <timeless_mbp> sivang: fishing, maybe. teaching to fish, dunno
Nov 23 11:02:00 <ieatlint> wheat beer and coke?
Nov 23 11:02:01 <sivang> DocScrutinizer-8: the NOLO boot threshold featured on the talk ;)
Nov 23 11:02:07 <chem|st> Ian--: yeas
Nov 23 11:02:14 <timeless_mbp> if it involves talking, probably not
Nov 23 11:02:20 <chem|st> Ian--: sry wrong guy
Nov 23 11:02:21 <sivang> timeless_mbp: heh
Nov 23 11:02:25 <chem|st> ieatlint: yes
Nov 23 11:02:26 <DocScrutinizer-8> sivang: eh?
Nov 23 11:02:39 <ieatlint> chem|st, that actually tastes good?
Nov 23 11:02:42 <chem|st> DocScrutinizer-8: with "cans" you talked to me?
Nov 23 11:02:44 <timeless_mbp> DocScrutinizer: excuse his typo :)
Nov 23 11:02:52 <DocScrutinizer-8> chem|st: yes
Nov 23 11:03:09 <sivang> oh, right, treshold
Nov 23 11:03:12 <chem|st> DocScrutinizer-8: no did not open them, but as it was on top I should I guess
Nov 23 11:03:12 <sivang> err no
Nov 23 11:03:32 <DocScrutinizer-8> yes
Nov 23 11:04:02 <DocScrutinizer-8> then rinse thoroughy with tap water, then demineralized water
Nov 23 11:04:14 <DocScrutinizer-8> then dry for 2 weeks
Nov 23 11:04:48 <chem|st> ieatlint: depends on your taste, light wheat beer isnt sweet so banana-juice or coke is favoured with girls (or sissies)
Nov 23 11:04:57 <sivang> sounds like brewing instructions
Nov 23 11:05:08 <DocScrutinizer-8> maybe put a patch of scotch on mic prior to rinsing
Nov 23 11:05:19 <chem|st> DocScrutinizer-8: there wont be water at my n900, I work in a labratory
Nov 23 11:05:27 <ieatlint> chem|st, :P
Nov 23 11:05:54 <DocScrutinizer-8> chem|st: so use demineralized water
Nov 23 11:06:38 <DocScrutinizer-8> no use in things like alcohol to solve things that were solved in water
Nov 23 11:06:57 <chem|st> DocScrutinizer-8: I used refined propanol
Nov 23 11:07:14 <DocScrutinizer-8> will it solve sugar?
Nov 23 11:07:29 <chem|st> DocScrutinizer-8: polar solves polar
Nov 23 11:07:38 <DocScrutinizer-8> yep
Nov 23 11:07:51 <DocScrutinizer-8> ethanol is nonpolar, no?
Nov 23 11:08:12 <chem|st> it is polar
Nov 23 11:08:13 <FIQ|n900> it is polar
Nov 23 11:08:22 * FIQ|n900 is slow as always
Nov 23 11:08:27 <chem|st> anything mixing with water is polar
Nov 23 11:08:37 <DocScrutinizer-8> hmm
Nov 23 11:08:41 <DocScrutinizer-8> k
Nov 23 11:08:52 <chem|st> oil petrol and so on is unpolar
Nov 23 11:09:25 <FIQ|n900> lol, i've a test about interatomic bindings tomorrow. :D
Nov 23 11:09:25 <DocScrutinizer-8> anyway, open as many cans as you manage to
Nov 23 11:09:28 <chem|st> nonpolar sry hanging in german... not used to english in a lab anymore
Nov 23 11:09:35 <FIQ|n900> random coincidence that you're talking about it lol
Nov 23 11:09:56 <chem|st> FIQ|n900: what you study then?
Nov 23 11:10:24 <chem|st> FIQ|n900: sounds like highschool
Nov 23 11:10:27 <FIQ|n900> I'm just 16 atm, so in highschool, nature science
Nov 23 11:10:29 <FIQ|n900> yeah
Nov 23 11:10:30 <DocScrutinizer-8> so is ethanol electrically conductive?
Nov 23 11:10:40 <FIQ|n900> anyway, afk lesson
Nov 23 11:11:02 <chem|st> DocScrutinizer-8: kind of
Nov 23 11:11:31 <chem|st> DocScrutinizer-8: polar and nonpolar do not give any conclusion about condutivity
Nov 23 11:11:34 <DocScrutinizer-8> will it decombinate like water?
Nov 23 11:12:24 <DocScrutinizer-8> (conclusion) tnought as much
Nov 23 11:12:24 <korhojoa> hm?
Nov 23 11:13:01 <korhojoa> decombinate?
Nov 23 11:13:02 <chem|st> not in the same way but yes, decombination of water is one of the natures phenomena, like its density point at 277K
Nov 23 11:14:00 <korhojoa> i like the smell of methyl benzoate
Nov 23 11:14:14 <korhojoa> just synthesized some two weeks ago
Nov 23 11:14:32 <chem|st> I use isopropanol as it is an ingredient in most elect. conductivity sprays
Nov 23 11:14:41 <DocScrutinizer-8> chem|st: anyway, virtually all PCBA will survive a bath in coke and rinsing, if you do rinse and dry thoroughly, prior to applying any voltage
Nov 23 11:15:10 <chem|st> korhojoa: we call that after a sweets brand as it smells just like it
Nov 23 11:15:33 <korhojoa> heh
Nov 23 11:15:34 <chem|st> DocScrutinizer-8: it is running fine ;)
Nov 23 11:16:19 <DocScrutinizer-8> how long it will depends on proper cleaning and drying though
Nov 23 11:16:24 <chem|st> korhojoa: that was that icy smell like chewinggum?
Nov 23 11:16:37 <DocScrutinizer-8> electric corrosion is slow but ongoing
Nov 23 11:17:03 <korhojoa> chem|st, urr, xylitol or menthol?
Nov 23 11:17:17 <chem|st> DocScrutinizer-8: will get a replacement anyway, but I will try to clean it up properly
Nov 23 11:17:27 <korhojoa> chem|st, what happened?
Nov 23 11:18:10 <chem|st> korhojoa: it smells like the feeling you get when you chew one of those gums
Nov 23 11:18:31 <DocScrutinizer-8> this coke candy even has phosphoric acid and is hygroscopic
Nov 23 11:18:42 <korhojoa> ookay. i just think it smells good
Nov 23 11:18:47 <chem|st> korhojoa: a german brand (storck) made a so called ice-bonbon
Nov 23 11:19:12 <korhojoa> also it annoys my uncle, he works for customs and has a drug-sniffing dog
Nov 23 11:19:29 <korhojoa> ah bonbons
Nov 23 11:19:54 <chem|st> korhojoa: everything smells like it for days...
Nov 23 11:21:02 <korhojoa> true
Nov 23 11:21:12 <alterego> chem|st: if you get a replacement, can you send the busted one to me? :D
Nov 23 11:21:18 <korhojoa> also drug-sniffing dogs are trained to detect it as cocaine
Nov 23 11:21:43 <chem|st> alterego: you wish
Nov 23 11:21:53 <alterego> :(
Nov 23 11:21:54 <alterego> rawr
Nov 23 11:22:56 <korhojoa> he'll send it to me
Nov 23 11:23:01 <korhojoa> postage to finland is cheaper
Nov 23 11:23:21 <chem|st> alterego: I will build a wifi NAS-mediacenter if I can keep it
Nov 23 11:23:55 <alterego> chem|st: well, if you can deal with the tin sound and bubbles fine :P
Nov 23 11:24:17 <chem|st> tin sound and bubbles?
Nov 23 11:24:27 <alterego> (The sound of it submerged) :P
Nov 23 11:31:34 <chem|st> alterego: I won't put it in an aquatank
Nov 23 11:45:07 <jase21> what webhost is good to have an ssh proxy?
Nov 23 11:45:40 <jase21> May told that they use ssh to get into irc.
Nov 23 11:46:19 <FauxFaux> Nearly any shell provider will do that; pick any of the cheapish ones on google that don't have process time limits.
Nov 23 11:47:28 <jase21> But it seems that they have rules which states that using ssh other than maintaining website is against TOS (eg: nearlyfreespeech.net)
Nov 23 11:47:46 <jase21> Do you have any suggestions?
Nov 23 11:51:13 <jase21> Do I have to get a media temple account to do that? (I'm a newbie)
Nov 23 11:59:25 <jacekowski> is there any map and routing ( just routing ) software that is standalone?
Nov 23 12:01:53 <lbt> barisione: here rather than msg please
Nov 23 12:23:10 <BCMM> i put someone else's microSD card (from a camera) in my n900 so we could show pictures on a TV, and when the camera was later mounted from windows, i saw that it had a .modest directory next to DCIM
Nov 23 12:23:24 <BCMM> with a directory structure and no files
Nov 23 12:23:32 <BCMM> any idea why?
Nov 23 12:27:03 <DocScrutinizer> because modest is braindamaged
Nov 23 12:29:19 <jacekowski> DocScrutinizer: i have to disagree
Nov 23 12:29:31 <jacekowski> DocScrutinizer: it's not so bad since pr1.3 and since i've started using MfE
Nov 23 12:30:20 <chem|st> jacekowski: BRAINS
Nov 23 12:30:46 <chem|st> jacekowski: are you looking for a routing solution or for code?
Nov 23 12:31:12 <jacekowski> open source stuff
Nov 23 12:31:22 <jacekowski> or whatever is avaliable
Nov 23 12:31:32 <chem|st> code then
Nov 23 12:31:44 <DocScrutinizer> jacekowski: creating a directory on uSD is qualifying modest for the title "braindamaged"
Nov 23 12:33:46 <jacekowski> chem|st: well, i'm just looking for what is avaliable
Nov 23 12:34:24 <jacekowski> chem|st: as i'm thinking about creating some simple voice synthesis engine supporting tomtom voices
Nov 23 12:34:28 <RST38h> More crazy tmo people: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=66058
Nov 23 12:35:01 <derf> jacekowski: The only one I know is Maemo Mapper.
Nov 23 12:35:20 <RST38h> MAPPERO from now on, and hello derf
Nov 23 12:35:28 <derf> It's not "really" stand-alone, as it requires Google Maps to do the routing.
Nov 23 12:35:41 <derf> RST38h: That is a different program, and one I've never gotten to work.
Nov 23 12:35:41 <RST38h> Mapper uses Flite for voice
Nov 23 12:35:58 <RST38h> derf: Same thing. The new maintainer renamed it for some reason.
Nov 23 12:36:11 <chem|st> jacekowski: http://linuxappfinder.com/package/routeplanner-gnome
Nov 23 12:36:19 <derf> Well, the trademark issue with "Maemo *", I assume.
Nov 23 12:36:21 <chem|st> jacekowski: that sounds like engine
Nov 23 12:36:34 <RST38h> Quite possible
Nov 23 12:36:35 <derf> I know it started from the same codebase, but it is not the same thing.
Nov 23 12:36:38 <derf> One works. The other doesn't.
Nov 23 12:36:52 <chem|st> derf: that has no on-board routing
Nov 23 12:36:54 <RST38h> derf: Mappero works for me.
Nov 23 12:37:05 <RST38h> derf:You must have some unlucky local config issue
Nov 23 12:37:14 <jacekowski> hmm,
Nov 23 12:37:24 <jacekowski> so going back to maps
Nov 23 12:37:35 <jacekowski> i could write my own stuff from scratches
Nov 23 12:37:40 <jacekowski> but what about search
Nov 23 12:37:47 <jacekowski> because i want it to be offline
Nov 23 12:37:51 <jacekowski> and that's where problem starts
Nov 23 12:38:05 <CutMeOwnThroat> jacekowski, there's a voice synthesis ... thingy meant for routing in the repo - and I guess there's "navit", but I haven't tried that much - only seen there's also an openstreetmap converter... there seem to be quite a lot of mapping software around but most of them are tile-based(?)
Nov 23 12:38:26 <jacekowski> yep
Nov 23 12:38:36 <jacekowski> i want proper working navigation
Nov 23 12:40:04 <SpeedEvil> OSM has vector based offline routers.
Nov 23 12:40:23 <SpeedEvil> The data quality is regrettably often an issue in many places though
Nov 23 12:40:29 <derf> Offline routing would be totally awesome.
Nov 23 12:41:06 <derf> But getting access to high-quality routing data seems... problematic.
Nov 23 12:41:48 <jacekowski> well, problems are
Nov 23 12:41:52 <jacekowski> offline map
Nov 23 12:42:07 <jacekowski> solution: copy of osm data for specific country somewhere on phone
Nov 23 12:42:22 <derf> Yeah, Maemo Mapper already lets you download map tiles.
Nov 23 12:42:30 <CutMeOwnThroat> SpeedEvil, right, I guess so - the places I was living at were pretty well mapped, though... but I bet if you're outside Europe/US/Canada and some others quality drops dramatically
Nov 23 12:42:34 <jacekowski> tiles are useless for routing
Nov 23 12:42:39 <derf> I agree.
Nov 23 12:42:52 <jacekowski> offline routing: cpu intensive ( but tomtom can do it in seconds )
Nov 23 12:42:56 <derf> Routing data != maps.
Nov 23 12:43:03 <jacekowski> well, routing data == maps
Nov 23 12:43:11 <jacekowski> if you have streets as vectors
Nov 23 12:43:17 <jacekowski> then you can generate maps based on it
Nov 23 12:43:46 <jacekowski> search is a problem
Nov 23 12:44:18 <CutMeOwnThroat> I've still not tried all map-applications in the repos... one problem is that each downloads their own maps... quite a drain on space
Nov 23 12:44:49 <CutMeOwnThroat> would be good to write up a comparison, though... I'm also looking for something that is standalone...
Nov 23 12:44:54 <lcuk> cloudgps is AWESOME.  it has the fastest smoothest slickest rendering of all mapping apps I have seen on the n900
Nov 23 12:45:07 <CutMeOwnThroat> well, the pre-installed one on the N900 seems to be mostly standalone
Nov 23 12:45:08 * lcuk spent a lot of time talking with Damion at the conf :)
Nov 23 12:45:19 <jacekowski> lcuk: java?
Nov 23 12:45:30 <CutMeOwnThroat> but it's still trying to connect to the network every 5 minutes, which is pretty annoying
Nov 23 12:45:42 <lcuk> jacekowski, c with intelligent gl handling :)
Nov 23 12:45:45 <lcuk> works really well
Nov 23 12:45:52 <lcuk> REALLY well
Nov 23 12:46:49 <jacekowski> hmm, tile based
Nov 23 12:47:09 <jacekowski> backend would have to be redone to base it on vectors
Nov 23 12:49:05 <lcuk> jacekowski, its also got the slickest landscape/portrait transition I have seen to date :)
Nov 23 12:49:52 <jacekowski> well, if you are using opengl hardware for it
Nov 23 12:50:12 <jacekowski> then you just move camera and hardware deals with it
Nov 23 12:50:55 <jacekowski> but i'm looking at osm data
Nov 23 12:51:04 <jacekowski> and it's still too incomplete for routing purposes
Nov 23 12:51:13 <CutMeOwnThroat> heh, with camera and gps the N900 wouldn't be too bad a device for steering cars
Nov 23 12:51:30 <jacekowski> i'm not talking about that camera
Nov 23 12:51:39 <jacekowski> i'm talking about virtual camera in opengl
Nov 23 12:51:46 <CutMeOwnThroat> i know... the word just triggered the thought
Nov 23 12:53:49 * SpeedEvil wonders if any cars have the power steering on the CAN bus.
Nov 23 12:54:02 <chem|st> jacekowski: http://www.luckygps.com/
Nov 23 12:54:33 <jacekowski> SpeedEvil: it's mechanical stuff mostly
Nov 23 12:54:37 <jacekowski> SpeedEvil: but you can get data out of it
Nov 23 12:55:20 <CutMeOwnThroat> jacekowski, "cachetts" was meant to create speech for routing - if you try it, tell me what it does :)
Nov 23 12:55:26 <SpeedEvil> jacekowski: yeah
Nov 23 12:56:34 <chem|st> SpeedEvil: newer cars variate the vacuum used to support brakeing and trim the powerstearing
Nov 23 12:56:51 <SpeedEvil> yeah
Nov 23 12:58:17 * MohammadAG wants a non-power steering car
Nov 23 13:00:11 * SpeedEvil passes MohammadAG a model-T rex.
Nov 23 13:09:58 <jacekowski> MohammadAG: i don't have power steering
Nov 23 13:14:34 <luke-jr> how do you drive w/o power steering? :/
Nov 23 13:14:49 <Surfa> luke-jr, easily
Nov 23 13:15:13 <Surfa> one can drive huge russian off-road truck without one (done that)
Nov 23 13:15:15 <luke-jr> easier than on a power-steering-vehicle with broken power steering?
Nov 23 13:15:36 <luke-jr> (which in my experience is fairly difficult)
Nov 23 13:17:49 <crashanddie> DocScrutinizer, summon infobot
Nov 23 13:18:51 <MohammadAG> jacekowski, how old?
Nov 23 13:20:01 * alterego is quite pround of his telemetry streaming framework.
Nov 23 13:20:47 <alterego> It now handles UDP unicast or broadcast, TCP client or server configurations, and now I'm gonna fix my bluetooth implementation so it can handle bluetooth slave & master roles.
Nov 23 13:21:01 <alterego> I think that should satisfy everyones need.
Nov 23 13:21:32 * MohammadAG wants to use the N900 as a BT headset
Nov 23 13:21:41 <alterego> MohammadAG: for what? :P
Nov 23 13:21:51 <alterego> I wanted to use my laptop as a headset for my N900 ..
Nov 23 13:22:01 <MohammadAG> stuff that needs a quick BT mic
Nov 23 13:22:20 <MohammadAG> PS3 would be one
Nov 23 13:23:22 <alterego> It would be nice.
Nov 23 13:23:39 <alterego> To have a swiss army knife, oh yes, it would be nice.
Nov 23 13:24:32 <MohammadAG> nohands - Makes the N900 act as HFP bluetooth
Nov 23 13:24:48 <MohammadAG> not sure what that is tbh, haven't seen any threads about it
Nov 23 13:38:14 <Appiah> MohammadAG: me too
Nov 23 13:38:37 <Appiah> I tried messing with bluez but dont remeber where I left it
Nov 23 13:39:17 * Appiah adds it to the long todo list
Nov 23 13:39:37 <chem|st> luke-jr: driving a car without native powerstearing is much easier than a car with broken powerstearing!
Nov 23 13:44:27 <RST38h> http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/11/23/symbian_history_part_one_dark_star/
Nov 23 13:50:30 <niq> I'm trying and failing to install EasyDebian on maemo
Nov 23 13:51:01 <niq> Is there a way to get error messages from it?
Nov 23 13:52:28 <alterego> Anyone here know what 'vrace' means in wireshark in relation to: 'Dst Port: vrace (9300)' ?
Nov 23 13:57:23 <ieatlint> it's port 9300, with a description of "vrace" as the common service that uses that port
Nov 23 13:57:33 <alterego> Ooo, right :)
Nov 23 13:57:42 <ieatlint> a search on google says "Virtual Racing Service" ... dunno wtf that is
Nov 23 13:57:51 <alterego> Maybe I should use a different port ^.^
Nov 23 13:58:09 <alterego> Or not, I don't care, it's configurable by the user anyway ^.^
Nov 23 13:58:56 <RST38h> It is a special service for racing conditions!
Nov 23 13:59:03 <alterego> Heh
Nov 23 13:59:09 <alterego> Perfect for what I have in mind then :D
Nov 23 13:59:34 <RST38h> You want to create some racing conditions and...eh...race them?
Nov 23 13:59:41 <alterego> You can use my app in a race, during your journey it'll send GPS telemetry over the network.
Nov 23 13:59:51 <alterego> ;)
Nov 23 13:59:55 <RST38h> Ah
Nov 23 14:00:05 * RST38h remembers working on a project like that
Nov 23 14:00:22 <RST38h> The vehicles have been...a bit unconventional though
Nov 23 14:00:49 * niq developed an app like that back in 1988/9 ...
Nov 23 14:07:27 <niq> but it was only for big-budget clients back then ... and we had to get the software into a 128k ROM :)
Nov 23 14:19:12 <jacekowski> MohammadAG: 11 years
Nov 23 14:19:31 <jacekowski> MohammadAG: but you can disable power steering in any modern car
Nov 23 14:31:33 <ieatlint> yeah, just go to the top of a hill, put it in neutral, turn off the engine and have fun
Nov 23 14:31:34 <ieatlint> :P
Nov 23 15:01:18 <Corsac> hmhm, does someone know about a sharing plugin for zimagez?
Nov 23 15:25:03 <crashanddie> "put it in neutral" gnarf gnarf gnarf
Nov 23 15:41:09 <DocScrutinizer> ~status
Nov 23 15:41:09 <infobot> Since Mon Nov 22 23:32:45 2010, there have been 6 modifications, 26 questions, 0 dunnos, 0 morons and 37 commands.  I have been awake for 16h 56s this session, and currently reference 117490 factoids.  I'm using about 20208 kB of memory. With 0 active forks. Process time user/system 144.5/3.55 child 0/0
Nov 23 15:48:39 <kerio> infobot: what is foobar
Nov 23 15:48:39 <infobot> $$%$%
Nov 23 15:48:43 <kerio> hmm
Nov 23 15:48:47 <kerio> infobot: what is asdjhajgh
Nov 23 15:48:48 <infobot> kerio: I think you lost me on that one
Nov 23 15:48:51 <kerio> ~status
Nov 23 15:48:51 <infobot> Since Mon Nov 22 23:32:45 2010, there have been 6 modifications, 28 questions, 0 dunnos, 0 morons and 39 commands.  I have been awake for 16h 8m 38s this session, and currently reference 117490 factoids.  I'm using about 20208 kB of memory. With 0 active forks. Process time user/system 146.64/3.73 child 0/0
Nov 23 15:48:57 <kerio> how's that not a dunno?
Nov 23 15:55:05 <johnsq> Hi
Nov 23 16:22:02 <mikki-kun> 0 morons? lol :D
Nov 23 16:23:34 <crashanddie> ~moron mikki-kun
Nov 23 16:23:41 <mikki-kun> :(
Nov 23 16:24:03 <mikki-kun> /ignore crashanddie
Nov 23 16:24:03 <crashanddie> ~nickometer RST38h
Nov 23 16:24:05 <infobot> 'RST38h' is 52.000% lame, crashanddie
Nov 23 16:24:24 <crashanddie> ~nickometer w00t_
Nov 23 16:24:26 <infobot> 'w00t_' is 37.000% lame, crashanddie
Nov 23 16:25:45 <X-Fade> Hehe, that bot really does a lot of things :)
Nov 23 16:26:16 <crashanddie> but some of them are expressly...
Nov 23 16:26:18 <crashanddie> ~useless
Nov 23 16:26:19 * infobot starts crying and hides from crashanddie in the darkest corner of the room. :(
Nov 23 16:27:06 <WakiMiko> ~version
Nov 23 16:27:06 <infobot> [version] Kernel: uname -r.  Debian: cat /etc/debian_version. and: dpkg -l libc6 | tail -1.  Package: dpkg -l _pkgname_.  Miscellaneous: try --version on the command. check /etc/apt/sources.list; run apt-cache policy <packagename>, or lsb_release -d
Nov 23 16:27:11 <mikki-kun> hey, out of my corner infobot!
Nov 23 16:30:01 <crashanddie> I love applications that segfault when you ask them to exit
Nov 23 16:30:14 <crashanddie> It's like they really take their job at heart, trying to do everything really in depth
Nov 23 16:34:44 <septiq> Hello, can i download somewhere old packages "cleaned by repository management" ? actually I need old kernel-power packages as new ones break the camera :(
Nov 23 16:36:39 <DocScrutinizer51> ~uptime
Nov 23 16:37:49 <septiq> maybe someone who has not updated still have kernel-power-flasher_2.6.28-maemo40_armel.deb, kernel-power_2.6.28-maemo40_armel.deb and kernel-power-modules_2.6.28-maemo40_armel.deb in his apt cache ?
Nov 23 16:40:09 <korhojoa> hey guys
Nov 23 16:40:17 <korhojoa> does the n900 require a sim card to be updated?
Nov 23 16:43:29 <DocScrutinizer51> mo
Nov 23 16:44:57 <korhojoa> DocScrutinizer51, is that a 'no' ?
Nov 23 16:45:04 <BCMM> korhojoa: depends if you have wifi :)
Nov 23 16:45:25 <DocScrutinizer51> oops, it's not?
Nov 23 16:45:28 <korhojoa> i don't understand why everyone keeps asking if i have wifi
Nov 23 16:45:46 <korhojoa> i'm trying to flash it with the NSU
Nov 23 16:45:51 <korhojoa> but it won't find my damn phone
Nov 23 16:45:54 <DocScrutinizer51> haha
Nov 23 16:46:10 <korhojoa> the cli flasher doesn't work under 7-x64
Nov 23 16:46:18 <korhojoa> and virtual pc is of no help
Nov 23 16:46:24 <korhojoa> cli flasher works under virtual pc
Nov 23 16:46:34 <DocScrutinizer51> general advice: remove sim and uSD before flashing
Nov 23 16:46:40 <korhojoa> but getting it to do it's thing requires multiple retries of plugging it in and out and waah
Nov 23 16:46:51 <korhojoa> okay, well. they're out
Nov 23 16:46:56 <DocScrutinizer51> flashing is not updating though
Nov 23 16:46:58 <korhojoa> i didn't remove my sim last time
Nov 23 16:47:06 <korhojoa> i know. i'm doing it because it bricked itself while updating
Nov 23 16:47:34 <korhojoa> urgh
Nov 23 16:47:47 <korhojoa> fuck this, that thing isn't working. virtual pc and bothersome flasher it is
Nov 23 16:48:02 <korhojoa> why is that thing so bad? it wouldn't flash my E61 either
Nov 23 16:49:13 <cybe> anyone here know where this n900 part belongs? http://dl.dropbox.com/u/838458/Screen%20shot%202010-11-23%20at%2018.24.32%20PM.png I believe it has something to do with the pen holder
Nov 23 16:49:30 <DocScrutinizer51> USB access thru virtualzation layer ->trouble
Nov 23 16:49:56 <korhojoa> DocScrutinizer51, well. what's a user going to do?
Nov 23 16:50:19 <DocScrutinizer51> use a live linux CD :-P
Nov 23 16:50:29 <ed-eddy> Hi, when I switch my n800 to adhoc mode it only works on 11Mbps speed
Nov 23 16:50:37 <MOUD> Hello
Nov 23 16:50:42 <ed-eddy> is there some way to change the speed
Nov 23 16:51:01 <ed-eddy> like iwconfig wlan0 rate 54M
Nov 23 16:51:10 <MOUD> Is there a way to install J2ME on nokia n900?
Nov 23 16:51:14 <ed-eddy> pupnik_: Hi
Nov 23 16:52:10 <thp> MOUD: http://wiki.maemo.org/Microemulator
Nov 23 16:52:51 <pupnik_> i don't know ed-eddy
Nov 23 16:53:08 <MOUD> thp: thanks, ill check
Nov 23 16:53:43 <ed-eddy> pupnik_: sorry had to change my nick, I am sougata
Nov 23 16:55:19 <pupnik_> hope you're having a nice day ed-eddy
Nov 23 16:56:29 <mykhal> i'm still not too clear on how a sim card works. how much do i have to pay for one? will it cost me to use internet/phone/sms on the nokia n900. can anyone explain all of this to me in laymans terms?
Nov 23 16:56:35 <ed-eddy> pupnik_: thank you, and I wish the same from you. Did you try to play with iwconfig in nx00 maemo devices
Nov 23 16:58:08 <pupnik_> http://www.google.de/search?sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8&q=ad-hoc+mode+limited+to+11mbps
Nov 23 16:58:11 <pupnik_> ed-eddy:
Nov 23 16:58:21 <pupnik_> normal behavior
Nov 23 16:59:41 <ed-eddy> pupnik_: I have installed iwconfig into my n800 tablets and I have connected a couple of them in adhoc mode, but when I see the connection, its 11mbps
Nov 23 17:00:37 <DocScrutinizer51> mykhal: nothying is for free. On currency and amount  check the website of your favourite SIM provider
Nov 23 17:00:38 <ed-eddy> pupnik_: that is working in 802.11b specf, but the wifi interface supports 802.11bg , so I am trying to change the rate to 54Mbps
Nov 23 17:00:55 <korhojoa> hmm, guys, does the n900 accept power over usb while flashing?
Nov 23 17:01:12 <mykhal> DocScrutinizer51: thank you
Nov 23 17:03:03 <pupnik_> ed-eddy: let us know if you have any success
Nov 23 17:03:18 <ed-eddy> pupnik: sure
Nov 23 17:03:49 <Tscheesy_> korhojoa: i did once a reflash with a nearly empty  akku.. did not feel comfotrable while dooing it.. i guess it doesn't
Nov 23 17:06:19 <DocScrutinizer51> it does not
Nov 23 17:07:18 <korhojoa> it does not?
Nov 23 17:07:19 <DocScrutinizer51> NOLO does no charging, no matter if in flashing mode or anything else
Nov 23 17:07:20 <korhojoa> okay
Nov 23 17:07:33 <korhojoa> so i guess i'll have to wait a while to let it charge up
Nov 23 17:07:58 <DocScrutinizer51> yes, on a working system
Nov 23 17:08:21 <pupnik> http://e2e.ti.com/support/dsp/omap_applications_processors/f/307/p/55300/196610.aspx   ed-eddy Texas Instruments omap3 WIFI FAQ
Nov 23 17:08:24 <korhojoa> you know your phone is a bit messed up when you press the power button and don't get the slide-to-unlock screen
Nov 23 17:08:25 <DocScrutinizer51> I.E *flashing* amber LED
Nov 23 17:08:27 <korhojoa> :D
Nov 23 17:09:13 <MohammadAG> stuck fixing a windows laptop
Nov 23 17:09:32 <MohammadAG> does windows log start ups, at all....
Nov 23 17:09:36 <korhojoa> 20% should be fine, right?
Nov 23 17:09:37 * MohammadAG stabs Windows
Nov 23 17:09:54 <korhojoa> doesn't take that long to flash it.
Nov 23 17:09:56 * MohammadAG flashed on 2-5% give or take a few
Nov 23 17:10:00 <korhojoa> haha
Nov 23 17:10:04 <Tscheesy_> korhojoa: the more the better for your nerves
Nov 23 17:10:20 <korhojoa> so update time!
Nov 23 17:10:51 <korhojoa> hm
Nov 23 17:10:54 <korhojoa> i pulled out the battery
Nov 23 17:10:58 <korhojoa> at a very opportune time?
Nov 23 17:11:02 <korhojoa> and now the phone is booting
Nov 23 17:11:04 <korhojoa> without the battery
Nov 23 17:11:06 <korhojoa> how did this happen
Nov 23 17:11:14 <korhojoa> over usb, even
Nov 23 17:11:16 <MohammadAG> broken kernel probably
Nov 23 17:11:36 <MohammadAG> i've had it before, eventually it'll turn off
Nov 23 17:11:53 <MohammadAG> the screen pulls more power than the USB cable can provide (or so I've guessed)
Nov 23 17:11:58 <korhojoa> well, not really
Nov 23 17:12:01 <korhojoa> it works just fine :D
Nov 23 17:12:10 <MohammadAG> o_O
Nov 23 17:12:16 <korhojoa> my motherboard is funky
Nov 23 17:12:23 <korhojoa> i've noticed it allowing ~3A over a usb port
Nov 23 17:12:24 * MohammadAG throws a banana at NooBmonk3y 
Nov 23 17:12:49 <korhojoa> will it go bad if i uh, pull the plug?
Nov 23 17:12:53 <korhojoa> or what's the best option here
Nov 23 17:13:01 <MohammadAG> do you have children? :P
Nov 23 17:13:09 * NooBmonk3y waves
Nov 23 17:13:13 <NooBmonk3y> oooo nana's
Nov 23 17:13:28 <korhojoa> MohammadAG, i sure hope not
Nov 23 17:13:31 <Tscheesy_> did anyone try on the n900 kubuntu-mobile ? http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-netbook/ports/releases/10.10/release/ubuntu-netbook-10.10-preinstalled-netbook-armel+omap.img.gz
Nov 23 17:13:39 <MohammadAG> nothing to worry about then
Nov 23 17:13:59 <korhojoa> haha oh wait
Nov 23 17:14:07 <korhojoa> it wasn't plugged in to the computer
Nov 23 17:14:16 <korhojoa> i forgot i switched to the charger
Nov 23 17:14:22 <korhojoa> so apparently the charger was booting the phone??
Nov 23 17:15:43 <Tscheesy_> Wrong link - i meant this one: http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/kubuntu-mobile/ports/releases/10.10/release/kubuntu-mobile-10.10-preinstalled-mobile-armel+omap.img.gz
Nov 23 17:15:53 <DocScrutinizer51> korhojoa: bloody charge your battery and stop wondering why it booted
Nov 23 17:15:57 <cybe> sorry guy, asking one more time: anyone here know where this n900 part belongs? http://dl.dropbox.com/u/838458/Screen%20shot%202010-11-23%20at%2018.24.32%20PM.png I believe it has something to do with the pen holder
Nov 23 17:16:36 <DocScrutinizer51> korhojoa: I strongly recommend you *completely* charge your battery prior to flashing
Nov 23 17:16:48 <korhojoa> eh. it flashed fine :>
Nov 23 17:16:59 <Tscheesy_> ^^
Nov 23 17:17:18 <korhojoa> i forgot it was that quick
Nov 23 17:17:23 <korhojoa> that was like 1½ minute
Nov 23 17:17:57 <korhojoa> also, now no more r&d mode, and the booting dots move at a normal pace, not jumping back and forth
Nov 23 17:18:14 <DocScrutinizer51> meh, nobody cares
Nov 23 17:19:54 <DocScrutinizer51> even your 'flashed fine' staement is rather... [beeep] as obviously you didn't verify it boots. So how do you know?
Nov 23 17:21:31 <korhojoa> DocScrutinizer51, i said that after that it had booted
Nov 23 17:22:08 <ed-eddy> pupnik: Thank you, http://processors.wiki.ti.com/index.php/OMAP35x_Wireless_Connectivity_FAQ#How_to_configure_Auto.2FManual_connection_mode_in_tiwlan.ini_file.3F
Nov 23 17:22:25 <lpjhjdh> trying to run sb2-init and I'm getting an error about bash being of the wrong elf class (64).  Seems to execute ok but then when I run sb2 -e I get an error that /bin/sh is not found
Nov 23 17:22:45 <ed-eddy> I guess need to figure  out tiwlan.ini file
Nov 23 17:24:20 <pupnik> ed-eddy: are you sure that 54mbps ad-hoc is possible to achieve?
Nov 23 17:24:27 <DocScrutinizer51> korhojoa: and what would you have done if flashing had aborted half way?
Nov 23 17:24:43 <korhojoa> taken it to be flashed?
Nov 23 17:26:05 <ed-eddy> pupnik: no I am not sure, I just that there is a 802.11bg card , and it operates on 54mbps in infrastructure more when connecting with an Acess point , was just curious why its not working in the same for adhoc mode
Nov 23 17:26:20 <DocScrutinizer51> yeah. So you understand we're simply not interested on whatever 'flashing succeeded on xy percent low battery' stories
Nov 23 17:27:42 <DocScrutinizer51> there's a reason why everywhere there are warnings you must charge battery prior to flashing
Nov 23 17:29:40 <GeneralAntilles> crashanddie, the IRS is going to be contacting me imminently now. :P
Nov 23 17:30:22 <pupnik> ed-eddy: but the ad-hoc spec only defines 11mbps
Nov 23 17:30:47 <DocScrutinizer51> when MohammadAG says 'flashed on 5%' then he omits he got an external charger to recovr from a failed flash
Nov 23 17:31:26 <ed-eddy> pupnik: Ahaa, can you please give me the link of the spec. WHY ? :(
Nov 23 17:31:33 <ed-eddy> pupnik: i am heart broken
Nov 23 17:34:17 <MohammadAG> DocScrutinizer51, no, i was just on "battery low"
Nov 23 17:34:23 <MohammadAG> as bme reports
Nov 23 17:35:14 <ed-eddy> pupnik: Ya I read in a paper that they only support 11Mbps in adhoc mode, :( . Did you read it from the specks ?
Nov 23 17:36:25 <NooBmonk3y> hmmmmmm is it possible to trim an integer?
Nov 23 17:36:45 <NooBmonk3y> i'm reading the pointer x and y position and they are being read into an int as " xx " and " yy "
Nov 23 17:37:12 <DocScrutinizer51> MohammadAG: eh? how does that chane the fact you got an external battery charger at your disposal?
Nov 23 17:37:39 <pupnik> ed-eddy: i don't know if the N900 chip can do 54mbps
Nov 23 17:37:59 <thp> NooBmonk3y: trim an integer?
Nov 23 17:38:09 <NooBmonk3y> well it's giving me spaces
Nov 23 17:38:11 <ed-eddy> pupnik: i think they should, when the hardware supports it
Nov 23 17:38:20 <thp> NooBmonk3y: which language?
Nov 23 17:38:23 <NooBmonk3y>  a = QString::number(event->globalX());
Nov 23 17:38:24 <ed-eddy> pupnik: Thank you for the help gain
Nov 23 17:38:25 <NooBmonk3y> qt
Nov 23 17:38:27 <NooBmonk3y> c++ i assume
Nov 23 17:38:33 <ed-eddy> pupnik: *again
Nov 23 17:38:36 <pupnik> np
Nov 23 17:38:37 <NooBmonk3y> a seems to equal " x "
Nov 23 17:38:42 <NooBmonk3y> rather than "x"
Nov 23 17:38:50 <NooBmonk3y> oh
Nov 23 17:38:51 <NooBmonk3y> ffs
Nov 23 17:38:53 <NooBmonk3y> hang on
Nov 23 17:39:00 <NooBmonk3y> c = event->globalX();
Nov 23 17:39:05 <NooBmonk3y> (ignore the string one)
Nov 23 17:39:19 <NooBmonk3y> c = " x " rather than "x"
Nov 23 17:39:22 <thp> what's the return type of globalX ?
Nov 23 17:39:28 <thp> (and the type of c)
Nov 23 17:39:29 <NooBmonk3y> void pixelWindow::mouseMoveEvent( QMouseEvent *event)
Nov 23 17:39:54 <NooBmonk3y> so when you press a co-ordinate i'm trying to read it in to an int :)
Nov 23 17:40:17 <NooBmonk3y> i then do some maths on the int and want to draw a circle round the pointer position
Nov 23 17:40:30 <NooBmonk3y> so eventually it is - painter.drawEllipse(c, d, 40, 40);
Nov 23 17:40:42 <thp> event->globalX() already returns an int.. there can be no spaces in an int :p
Nov 23 17:40:48 <NooBmonk3y> but instead of sending (0,0,40,40) it sends ( 0 , 0 , 40,40)
Nov 23 17:40:54 <NooBmonk3y> hmmmmmm
Nov 23 17:40:57 <NooBmonk3y> okies, brb
Nov 23 17:41:00 <NooBmonk3y> will try again
Nov 23 17:42:38 <thp> NooBmonk3y: maybe you want x() and y() instead of globalX() and globalY()
Nov 23 17:42:50 <DocScrutinizer51> I just can't believe the compiler won't throw warnings on that
Nov 23 17:43:06 <NooBmonk3y> ahhh ok :)
Nov 23 17:43:58 <NooBmonk3y> hmm no member X and Y, hold on will pastebin it
Nov 23 17:44:11 <DocScrutinizer51> NooBmonk3y: you can't trim an integer as an integer can't hold any chars you could trim
Nov 23 17:44:25 <NooBmonk3y> DocScrutinizer,  you're behind the times :P
Nov 23 17:44:35 <DocScrutinizer51> uhuh
Nov 23 17:44:56 <NooBmonk3y> ;)
Nov 23 17:44:58 <NooBmonk3y> but thank you
Nov 23 17:45:01 <NooBmonk3y> thp http://pastebin.com/HABzVPBy
Nov 23 17:45:12 <NooBmonk3y> i'm using global variables to transfer but probably not a sensible way
Nov 23 17:45:21 * DocScrutinizer51 bows down for NooBmonk3y and his superior coding skills
Nov 23 17:45:33 <NooBmonk3y> DocScrutinizer, when that happens, hell will freeze over i'm sure ;)
Nov 23 17:45:50 <thp> NooBmonk3y: how do you declare a, b, c and d? (which type)
Nov 23 17:46:01 <NooBmonk3y> QString a;
Nov 23 17:46:01 <NooBmonk3y> QString b;
Nov 23 17:46:01 <NooBmonk3y> int c;
Nov 23 17:46:01 <NooBmonk3y> int d;
Nov 23 17:46:06 <CaCO3> Hi all
Nov 23 17:46:12 <NooBmonk3y> hi CaCO3
Nov 23 17:47:06 * DocScrutinizer51 suggests "C for dummies"
Nov 23 17:47:24 <CaCO3> I have a question to the auto builder. When I use architecture=armel, then my app runs fine, but it will not compile a version for i386 (obviously). But when i use architecture=all, it builds for both architectures, but it will not run on armel
Nov 23 17:47:35 <NooBmonk3y> CaCO3, use any
Nov 23 17:47:46 <CaCO3> :) ok thank
Nov 23 17:47:47 <NooBmonk3y> :)
Nov 23 17:47:56 <NooBmonk3y> omg i think i knew something, i can see hell freezing over
Nov 23 17:48:07 <CaCO3> i saw that other apps use "all", so i copied that
Nov 23 17:48:28 <thp> NooBmonk3y: http://pastebin.com/2NKL1XKG
Nov 23 17:48:59 <thp> NooBmonk3y: you also might not want to call QWidget::paintEvent() after your drawings (but before), so your drawings do not get overdrawn
Nov 23 17:49:11 <NooBmonk3y> they need to get over drawn :)
Nov 23 17:49:40 <NooBmonk3y> thank you very much thp
Nov 23 17:50:07 <thp> NooBmonk3y: does it work?
Nov 23 17:50:12 <NooBmonk3y> just testing :)
Nov 23 17:50:38 <NooBmonk3y> hmmm its drawing the circle but at 0,0
Nov 23 17:50:55 <NooBmonk3y> not wher ethe pointer was :|
Nov 23 17:51:00 <NooBmonk3y>  / is
Nov 23 17:51:26 <NooBmonk3y> but the label is working :)
Nov 23 17:51:26 <thp> NooBmonk3y: is the label filled with the correct coordinates?
Nov 23 17:51:29 <NooBmonk3y> yup
Nov 23 17:52:24 <thp> NooBmonk3y: do qDebug() << c; in the paintEvent and see if the value is still okay there
Nov 23 17:53:23 <NooBmonk3y> thp http://img5.imagebanana.com/img/3f2vakel/Selection_005.png
Nov 23 17:54:32 <NooBmonk3y> c = 459 d=190
Nov 23 17:54:36 <NooBmonk3y> looks fine to me, hmmmmmmmmm
Nov 23 17:54:48 <NooBmonk3y> (neither have spaces, sorry i put that in)
Nov 23 17:55:55 <thp> NooBmonk3y: what you could try is translate the coordinate system using -c and -d and then draw the ellipse at (0,0)
Nov 23 17:56:15 <NooBmonk3y> hmmmmmm
Nov 23 17:58:06 <user____> does fmms work?
Nov 23 17:58:17 <luke-jr> user____: no
Nov 23 17:58:53 <user____> luke-jr: not even a little?
Nov 23 17:59:01 <luke-jr> maybe if you're lucky
Nov 23 17:59:06 <luke-jr> and the stars are in alignment
Nov 23 17:59:29 <user____> I really want this mms
Nov 23 18:00:11 <NooBmonk3y> lol luke
Nov 23 18:00:15 <NooBmonk3y> works fine for me :)
Nov 23 18:01:16 <lolcat-> NooBmonk3y: you can recive mms?
Nov 23 18:01:29 <NooBmonk3y> yup
Nov 23 18:01:33 <NooBmonk3y> automatically too :)
Nov 23 18:02:25 <luke-jr> lolcat-: MMS is lame
Nov 23 18:02:50 <lolcat-> my gf sent me one of herself
Nov 23 18:03:17 <lolcat-> I miss her and she isn't smart enough to use a real protcoll
Nov 23 18:12:43 <NooBmonk3y> thp, cheated a bit and did it a different way, but works :) http://pastebin.com/v6gwMuh0
Nov 23 18:12:53 <NooBmonk3y> draw the disc and then technically drag it :P
Nov 23 18:16:39 <thp> NooBmonk3y: looking good :) gotta go, have fun
Nov 23 18:16:50 <NooBmonk3y> thank you
Nov 23 18:16:52 <NooBmonk3y> have a good evening :)
Nov 23 18:21:53 <lpjhjdh> anyone good with scratchbox2?  I'm getting a bizarre issue trying to run in emulation mode
Nov 23 18:22:32 <RST38h> lpjh: what issue?
Nov 23 18:23:19 <lpjhjdh> sb2 -e bash gives: /bin/bash: No such file or directory \n /bin/bash: Success
Nov 23 18:23:41 <lpjhjdh> is there some way to get more interesting information?
Nov 23 18:24:05 <lpjhjdh> looking through a strace log it does find the cross compiled copy of bash
Nov 23 18:25:00 <alterego> Well, pretty much certain I don't want to use Ovi to distribute my app
Nov 23 18:25:09 <alterego> And I'm going to put IMEI locking into it ..
Nov 23 18:25:13 <alterego> Does this make me evil? :D
Nov 23 18:28:55 <DocScrutinizer> alterego: I honestly prefer that to whatever security framework based copy protection
Nov 23 18:31:53 <alterego> DocScrutinizer: yeah
Nov 23 18:32:07 <alterego> Might have to account for multiple devices
Nov 23 18:32:38 <alterego> For those with multiple N900s, do I make them buy it n times or trust them to not be getting free copies for peers :)
Nov 23 18:33:24 <SpeedEvil> How do you tell IMEI is from a n900?
Nov 23 18:34:37 <MohammadAG> damn my N900 is dusty on the inside
Nov 23 18:34:49 <MohammadAG> probably compare it against tablets-dev
Nov 23 18:35:14 <alterego> Doesn't matter, it's not going to run on anything else ;)
Nov 23 18:35:34 <MohammadAG> lol
Nov 23 18:35:58 <SpeedEvil> Also - I'd be somewhat hesitant about giving out my IMEI
Nov 23 18:36:17 <SpeedEvil> Though I'm not aware of any current attacks that use it.
Nov 23 18:36:25 * MohammadAG has DocScrutinizer's IMEI :P
Nov 23 18:37:17 <alterego> SpeedEvil: I understand that completely, if there was another way ..
Nov 23 18:37:25 <lolcat-> where do the fmms go?
Nov 23 18:37:28 <alterego> I could ask for your wlan mac, but that's dodgy :P
Nov 23 18:37:43 <lolcat-> i recived something:@Push something
Nov 23 18:37:51 <SpeedEvil> alterego: I forget - what is this app?
Nov 23 18:38:21 <MohammadAG> alterego, you know, one could make a dbus faker that sends out a different IMEI
Nov 23 18:38:27 <MohammadAG> ala qwerty12's fmtx-faker
Nov 23 18:38:47 <alterego> SpeedEvil: it's a GPS app that has features like handheld GPS', no mapping or routing, just positional information, track log rendering, logging, statistics and data streaming over bluetooth or network.
Nov 23 18:38:52 <lolcat-> and I can't find my push-something i recived
Nov 23 18:39:04 <alterego> SpeedEvil: and it's purdy :D
Nov 23 18:39:23 <SpeedEvil> ah.
Nov 23 18:39:43 <SpeedEvil> alterego: Does it do fixing the accuracy of the geotags on photos?
Nov 23 18:41:50 <alterego> No, doesn't do anything with geotags :P
Nov 23 18:41:56 <alterego> Or photos
Nov 23 18:45:37 <pupnik> oh look, i invented perlin noise in 1987
Nov 23 18:45:54 <pupnik> too late again
Nov 23 18:46:35 <SpeedEvil> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hedy_Lamar#Frequency-hopping_spread-spectrum_invention
Nov 23 18:46:45 <MohammadAG> alterego, got a beta perhaps? :P
Nov 23 18:47:07 <MohammadAG> I'll be buying it anyways, kinda like the interface
Nov 23 18:47:47 * MohammadAG uploads 21MBs of dusty disassembly photos
Nov 23 18:48:03 <MohammadAG> taken with N8, so feel free to zoom in on the dust.... err, details
Nov 23 18:48:29 <kerio> you have a n8?
Nov 23 18:48:30 <kerio> nice
Nov 23 18:48:33 <kerio> how's it?
Nov 23 18:48:41 <kerio> is symbian bearable?
Nov 23 18:49:01 <RST38h> Mohammad: OMG you got an N8!
Nov 23 18:49:05 <MohammadAG> (also, why are there scratched parts in my N900?)
Nov 23 18:49:28 <RST38h> Mohammad: it is cocroaches, they infiltrate your N900 at night
Nov 23 18:49:30 <MohammadAG> I've had it for a month...
Nov 23 18:49:39 <MohammadAG> or over a month
Nov 23 18:49:46 <MohammadAG> kerio, it's bearable
Nov 23 18:49:50 <MohammadAG> more than Symbian^1
Nov 23 18:50:00 <MohammadAG> and the UI's smoother than the iPhone's (weird, isn't it...)
Nov 23 18:50:42 <MohammadAG> http://mohammadag.xceleo.org/n900-disassembly/
Nov 23 18:51:57 <SpeedEvil> Why're you taking it apart?
Nov 23 18:52:13 <MohammadAG> was kinda bored, and checked the GPS antenna
Nov 23 18:52:43 <MohammadAG> I need a new B-cover apparently
Nov 23 18:53:02 <SpeedEvil> You saw that link to the spares site?
Nov 23 18:53:12 <SpeedEvil> I dunno if the 'dummy n900' would work for you
Nov 23 18:54:03 <SpeedEvil> http://www.ownta.com/compatible-nokia-n900-cell-phone-fullset-housing.html
Nov 23 18:56:17 <MohammadAG> nah, doesn't look like a full B cover
Nov 23 18:57:05 <MohammadAG> SpeedEvil, I might ignore it, save the money for something else, it's nothing serious
Nov 23 19:04:28 <DocScrutinizer> dn't see the issue with back-cover. But it seems you got a broken screw there
Nov 23 19:05:15 <ds3> p
Nov 23 19:05:24 <DocScrutinizer> which is especially nasty for the part of the thread still sitting in the slider mech
Nov 23 19:07:38 <MohammadAG> DocScrutinizer, which pic?
Nov 23 19:09:09 <DocScrutinizer> err, closed them. It's (barely) visible on all pic anyway
Nov 23 19:09:47 <MohammadAG> oh, that
Nov 23 19:10:03 <MohammadAG> I took it out, it wasn't broken, but it doesn't seem to screw in tightly
Nov 23 19:11:29 <DocScrutinizer51> compare closely to the other screws
Nov 23 19:13:34 <DocScrutinizer51> also test what's with the threaded hole in slide mechanism, try to turn in a screw right now when disassembled. unlock latches and remove antenna assembly
Nov 23 19:13:44 <MohammadAG> I'd say the next disassembly they'd all break
Nov 23 19:16:53 <MohammadAG> I removed it when I disassembled it
Nov 23 19:17:20 <MohammadAG> basically removed everything, except the AV plug and the speakers
Nov 23 19:39:34 <Juozapas> hi
Nov 23 19:39:45 <Juozapas> how to change stand by clock background picture ?
Nov 23 19:39:54 <disco_stu> Juozapas, hi
Nov 23 19:40:59 <Juozapas> any ideas
Nov 23 19:41:03 <Juozapas> ?
Nov 23 19:42:09 <GAN900> Juozapas, it's a theming thing.
Nov 23 19:42:21 <GAN900> Juozapas, not sure where the bitmap is, though.
Nov 23 19:42:35 <piggz> woo, my phone has been up for >21 hours, its some kind of accomplishment after this weekend!
Nov 23 19:43:59 <Juozapas> it will be nice just to put another image file with the same name instead
Nov 23 19:47:24 <DocScrutinizer> http://wiki.maemo.org/Customizing_Maemo#Where_are_the_slider_screen_files_located.3F
Nov 23 19:48:03 <DocScrutinizer> usr/share/themes/alpha/backgrounds/lockslider.png
Nov 23 19:56:50 <Juozapas> DocScrutinizer: thx, man
Nov 23 19:59:03 <DocScrutinizer> http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=491060&postcount=403 :-D
Nov 23 20:00:38 <Juozapas> ;]]
Nov 23 20:37:24 <mece> whoa! Wine in qemu. Mind officially boggled.
Nov 23 20:37:34 <mece> (Didn't see that thread before)
Nov 23 20:39:25 <kerio> yo dawg etc. etc.
Nov 23 20:40:43 <mece> umm..
Nov 23 20:40:57 <mece> kerio, hello to you too :)
Nov 23 20:44:00 <kerio> ...
Nov 23 20:44:02 <kerio> i meant...
Nov 23 20:44:07 <kerio> nevermind
Nov 23 20:44:12 <kerio> how's it going, mece?
Nov 23 20:50:51 <mece> kerio, it's ok. I'm wondering if I want to try running wine on my n900
Nov 23 20:51:01 <mece> seems like a lot of work.
Nov 23 20:51:17 <kerio> i bet it runs smoothly once you get rid of tracker and pulseaudio
Nov 23 20:51:32 <mece> hm
Nov 23 20:51:52 <mece> I think I'll look into it tomorrow.
Nov 23 20:53:54 <trumee> I have this strange problem in Vim. If i select any text, the mode automatically changes to 'Visual' and i lose anyway to copy the text.
Nov 23 20:54:10 <trumee> The status bar shows 'Paste' rather than 'Copy'.
Nov 23 20:54:38 <trumee> This is not the busybox vi rather the full vim.
Nov 23 20:54:54 <trumee> anybody come across this?
Nov 23 20:55:42 <Choom> select the text in visual mode
Nov 23 20:55:45 <Choom> then press 'y'
Nov 23 20:56:13 <Choom> and then 'p' to paste ahead of the cursor or shift+p to paste at the cursor
Nov 23 20:56:54 <trumee> Choom: yes, but i want to copy text from Vim and paste it into Micro-b
Nov 23 20:57:10 <trumee> y and p will only work inside Vim.
Nov 23 20:58:26 <Choom> ah, I see
Nov 23 20:59:11 <trumee> Choom: can you replicate that on your device?
Nov 23 20:59:53 <Choom> well you can always disabled xterm recognition in .vimrc by disabling ttymouse
Nov 23 21:00:02 <Choom> *disable
Nov 23 21:00:10 <Choom> don't know, checking
Nov 23 21:02:27 <Choom> no
Nov 23 21:02:52 <Choom> on my phone vim does not recognize the mouse on xterm
Nov 23 21:03:10 <Choom> so I can copy/paste stuff normally
Nov 23 21:03:27 <trumee> hmm. how does your vimrc look like?
Nov 23 21:03:32 <Choom> you can, however, shift+select stuff on an xterm to disable the xterm mouse functionality
Nov 23 21:04:36 <trumee> Choom: thanks. Shift select works fine.
Nov 23 21:07:03 <trumee> Choom: how can i disable ttymouse?
Nov 23 21:07:18 <trumee> Choom: set ttymouse=  ?
Nov 23 21:08:06 <Choom> :set ttym= should do the trick
Nov 23 21:08:10 <Choom> or ttymouse
Nov 23 21:08:30 <Choom> ttym is the abbreviated name
Nov 23 21:10:22 <trumee> Choom: if i specity "set ttym=" in .vimrc it doesnt work. However if i do :set ttym= in an open vim session, it works.
Nov 23 21:11:49 <Choom> works here, don't know, perhaps its being reset later in the script
Nov 23 21:12:37 <Choom> it's*
Nov 23 21:12:41 <trumee> Choom: ah now it works. i had to get rid of set mouse=a
Nov 23 21:15:20 <trumee> Choom: thanks for your help
Nov 23 21:15:28 <Choom> np
Nov 23 21:25:58 <johnsq> Hi
Nov 23 21:27:15 <NooBmonk3y> heya
Nov 23 21:46:24 <thp> NooBmonk3y: how's your little app progressing?
Nov 23 21:46:33 <NooBmonk3y> little? lol :P
Nov 23 21:46:39 <NooBmonk3y> its a redesign of healthcheck :)
Nov 23 21:46:46 <alterego> Awwww :)
Nov 23 21:46:50 <NooBmonk3y> ok little compared to the big boys :p
Nov 23 21:47:00 <NooBmonk3y> but very well thank you! :)
Nov 23 21:47:10 <NooBmonk3y> i keep hitting qmobility bugs though :(
Nov 23 21:47:15 <thp> like?
Nov 23 21:47:22 <NooBmonk3y> ie accelerometer etc does not work on maemo yet :(
Nov 23 21:47:30 <thp> it does, afaik
Nov 23 21:47:33 <NooBmonk3y> http://bugreports.qt.nokia.com/browse/QTMOBILITY-326
Nov 23 21:47:36 <thp> at least one axis
Nov 23 21:47:39 <NooBmonk3y> ahhh
Nov 23 21:47:43 <NooBmonk3y> one is better than none :P
Nov 23 21:47:47 <NooBmonk3y> i'm getting 0 atm
Nov 23 21:48:41 <MohammadAG> what's a good C IDE?
Nov 23 21:48:45 <alterego> Sensors API is not in 1.0.0
Nov 23 21:48:53 <alterego> MohammadAG: erm .. Qt Creator? ^.^
Nov 23 21:49:04 <thp> "Note that Qt Mobility 1.0.1 somewhat alleviates this problem by not setting the data rate or output range by default."
Nov 23 21:49:06 <MohammadAG> C, not C++/Qt :P
Nov 23 21:49:12 <steinex> MohammadAG, eclipse with plugin
Nov 23 21:49:15 <alterego> Same different :P
Nov 23 21:49:21 <alterego> God no, don't use Eclipse ..
Nov 23 21:49:43 <Corsac> geany?
Nov 23 21:49:46 <MohammadAG> alterego, Qt Creator gives me those red/green underlines on C code
Nov 23 21:49:52 <steinex> ehm... whats wrong with eclipse?
Nov 23 21:49:57 <alterego> It sucks
Nov 23 21:50:04 <MohammadAG> lol
Nov 23 21:50:04 <NooBmonk3y> alterego, using 1.1
Nov 23 21:50:06 <alterego> It's slow, stodgy and messy
Nov 23 21:50:14 <Corsac> and java
Nov 23 21:50:18 <alterego> NooBmonk3y: it's not available in 1.1?
Nov 23 21:50:26 <NooBmonk3y> well, not working
Nov 23 21:50:26 <alterego> eesh
Nov 23 21:50:33 <NooBmonk3y> but it may be me
Nov 23 21:50:38 <MohammadAG> NooBmonk3y, actually, pr1.3 has 1.0.2
Nov 23 21:50:42 <alterego> NooBmonk3y: you'll have to use the native sysfs interface then :/
Nov 23 21:50:45 <NooBmonk3y> MohammadAG, it may do
Nov 23 21:50:51 * NooBmonk3y is beating the rush so to speak lol
Nov 23 21:51:02 <MohammadAG> alterego, so, any other IDEs?
Nov 23 21:51:04 <alterego> MohammadAG: GNU/Linux right? Or windows IDE?
Nov 23 21:51:20 <MohammadAG> GNU/Linux
Nov 23 21:51:31 <MohammadAG> preferably not a K* app :P
Nov 23 21:51:31 <alterego> tbh, when I'm coding in C, I just use gedit with a crap load of plugins installed ^.^
Nov 23 21:51:53 <NooBmonk3y> hehe :P
Nov 23 21:51:57 <NooBmonk3y> i wish i was that confident
Nov 23 21:51:59 <steinex> MohammadAG, http://www.eclipse.org/downloads/packages/eclipse-ide-cc-developers/heliossr1
Nov 23 21:52:00 <NooBmonk3y> but still learning :P
Nov 23 21:52:02 <MohammadAG> i use gedit at the moment, but Qt Creator got me thinking of getting an IDE :P
Nov 23 21:52:02 <steinex> try it.
Nov 23 21:52:27 <NooBmonk3y> if qtcreator was polished i'd be happier but if i get stuck i move on to the next bit, things allways work after a break :)
Nov 23 21:52:54 <thp> i just hope FakeVim mode gets extended in Qt Creator.. so that it's more useful
Nov 23 21:53:09 <NooBmonk3y> lol :P true! :)
Nov 23 21:53:21 <NooBmonk3y> thp,  did you ever see the old healthcheck? (Well current one?)
Nov 23 21:53:54 <MohammadAG> don't cat the code, it's safer that way
Nov 23 21:53:54 <thp> no, why?
Nov 23 21:53:56 <MohammadAG> :P
Nov 23 21:54:11 <NooBmonk3y> the new one is actually quick, works, and so far is about 60-70% there, and i started 2 weeks ago, (having never done c++/qt properly) :) - the old one was created in under 1 month, with never having done python :)P
Nov 23 21:54:12 <MohammadAG> steinex, on N900, will try it tomorrow
Nov 23 21:54:14 <pupnik> 21:48 < mru> sw always makes hw look more complicated
Nov 23 21:54:14 <pupnik> 21:48 < mru> I think it's called "abstraction"
Nov 23 21:54:23 <NooBmonk3y> allthough much to doc's dismay i use this place to teach me :)
Nov 23 21:54:34 <NooBmonk3y> its really just a system information display
Nov 23 21:54:58 <NooBmonk3y> but came from the idea that the average joe, like me just dont understand terminal, so basically printed out all the info
Nov 23 21:55:08 <alterego> NooBmonk3y: it's what I'd do if I was in a similar situation :)
Nov 23 21:55:12 <NooBmonk3y> hehehe :)
Nov 23 21:55:29 <NooBmonk3y> alterego, i have to admit, to credit of this place and tmo.... i learnt ;) - and and i'm impressed
Nov 23 21:55:39 <thp> i know i have one pixel that is the opposite of a dead pixel, but the rest is working fine, so i didn't really have a use case for it i guess
Nov 23 21:55:56 <NooBmonk3y> it may be an odd may, but along a full time job, i managed to publish 4 or 5 extras apps  lol
Nov 23 21:56:02 <thp> NooBmonk3y: you can write quick code in python, too
Nov 23 21:56:45 <NooBmonk3y> hehehe thp,  the idea is to be a bit more then that, but again, aimed at people who dont know how to do it themselves, like me :P
Nov 23 21:56:55 * MohammadAG hates python, at least on maemo :P
Nov 23 21:57:02 <thp> MohammadAG: why?
Nov 23 21:57:05 <alterego> NooBmonk3y: that's more than me without a job at all ;)
Nov 23 21:57:10 <NooBmonk3y> thp true, but was very slow getting all the terminal calls, and also, didnt have an easy gui like qtcreator at the time
Nov 23 21:57:13 <alterego> I have one published maemo app in extras ..
Nov 23 21:57:16 <MohammadAG> thp, sorta slowish
Nov 23 21:57:22 <NooBmonk3y> the fx are awfull in the current devel/testing/extras healthcheck
Nov 23 21:57:29 <NooBmonk3y> lol alterego  :P
Nov 23 21:57:36 <MohammadAG> thp, compare PSFreedom's python and C++ versions
Nov 23 21:57:45 <MohammadAG> 12s vs 4s startup time
Nov 23 21:57:51 <NooBmonk3y> the new one has 9 stackedwidgets, and shoots through
Nov 23 21:57:51 <thp> i'm already on 3.50 :p
Nov 23 21:57:56 <alterego> And that's if you're lucky ...
Nov 23 21:58:06 <NooBmonk3y> albeit very messy code ;)
Nov 23 21:58:07 <Dassu> vitutukseni.
Nov 23 21:58:24 <NooBmonk3y> darn i need to figure out git so i can show how i'm doing lol
Nov 23 21:58:37 <korhojoa> Dassu, häh
Nov 23 21:58:52 <NooBmonk3y> some sod *cough* pursuaded me to move from win 7 to ubuntu to develop easier, have to admit it helps, but the GF hates me :p
Nov 23 21:58:57 <thp> once it's up and running, it's quite fast for ui-driven apps. startup speed is a little slow, yes.
Nov 23 21:59:21 <NooBmonk3y> yeah good point thp, not great for all the terminal calls :P
Nov 23 21:59:28 <NooBmonk3y> load up the extras healthcheck and you will see ;)
Nov 23 21:59:34 <NooBmonk3y> its also uuuuuugleeeeeey :P
Nov 23 21:59:34 <Arkenoi> NooBmonk3y, why?
Nov 23 21:59:37 <MohammadAG> thp, i never tested half of my app
Nov 23 21:59:45 <alterego>  NooBmonk3y you could have virtualised ;)
Nov 23 21:59:54 <MohammadAG> thp, i only jailbroke my PS3 twice or three times
Nov 23 21:59:55 <Arkenoi> i mean why does she hate you :-)
Nov 23 21:59:57 <NooBmonk3y> Arkenoi, why to what?
Nov 23 21:59:59 <alterego> That's what I do when I develop for windows, have a nice VM ^.^
Nov 23 22:00:05 <NooBmonk3y> alterego, pc just couldnt handle it
Nov 23 22:00:06 <thp> NooBmonk3y: is there a source repo that i can check out directly or do i have to grab the source from the tarball?
Nov 23 22:00:13 <MohammadAG> PS3 has an uptime of 00:00:00 :P
Nov 23 22:00:33 <NooBmonk3y> thp, erm, is in extras, testing and devel, no other places (old one)
Nov 23 22:00:34 * MohammadAG told NooBmonk3y to get a git repo
Nov 23 22:00:36 <jacekowski> thp: apt-get source app-name
Nov 23 22:00:39 <NooBmonk3y> new one, erm, i need to figur eout igt
Nov 23 22:00:47 <NooBmonk3y> figure our git*
Nov 23 22:00:53 <NooBmonk3y> and drink less wine lol
Nov 23 22:00:53 <MohammadAG> jacekowski, not yet in devel
Nov 23 22:01:05 <MohammadAG> NooBmonk3y, you're on ubuntu right?
Nov 23 22:01:07 <NooBmonk3y> MohammadAG, told but didnt walk me through it ;)
Nov 23 22:01:12 <NooBmonk3y> MohammadAG, darn you! yes
Nov 23 22:01:26 <MohammadAG> i'm assuming your source is in /home/greg/healthcheck
Nov 23 22:01:29 <MohammadAG> amiright?
Nov 23 22:01:32 <NooBmonk3y> nope
Nov 23 22:01:41 <MohammadAG> i hate you
Nov 23 22:01:43 <NooBmonk3y> it's on an external hdd
Nov 23 22:01:44 <Arkenoi> my GF uses windows, i gave her one notebook with ubuntu and another one with macos, she barely noticed the difference except qip vs pidgin vs audium which she found irrelevant anyways
Nov 23 22:01:45 <MohammadAG> :P
Nov 23 22:01:54 <NooBmonk3y> Arkenoi, my missus is blonde.......
Nov 23 22:02:07 <alterego> My fg uses ubuntu desktop on a Dell Mini 9
Nov 23 22:02:11 <alterego> ~gf ..
Nov 23 22:02:12 <infobot> .. and gf sitting in a tree k-i-s-s-i-n-g
Nov 23 22:02:14 <MohammadAG> racist
Nov 23 22:02:16 <NooBmonk3y> alterego,  futureego? fg?
Nov 23 22:02:21 <alterego> ;)
Nov 23 22:02:21 <MohammadAG> LOL
Nov 23 22:02:34 <MohammadAG> fg, try it in terminal :P
Nov 23 22:02:36 <NooBmonk3y> lol
Nov 23 22:02:50 <GAN900> Ubuntu irritated me on the Mini 9
Nov 23 22:02:51 <korhojoa> :D
Nov 23 22:02:53 <MohammadAG> NooBmonk3y, anyways
Nov 23 22:02:55 <GAN900> Like OS X on it more.
Nov 23 22:03:00 <NooBmonk3y> thp, the source of the old healthcheck will burn your eyeballs
Nov 23 22:03:01 <MohammadAG> NooBmonk3y, make a repo on gitorious.org
Nov 23 22:03:07 <MohammadAG> go to your source dir
Nov 23 22:03:13 <NooBmonk3y> MohammadAG,  a new one? or just overwrite the old one?
Nov 23 22:03:34 <RST38h> Moo, GAN.
Nov 23 22:03:41 <MohammadAG> NooBmonk3y, idk lol, probably a new one inside your old one
Nov 23 22:03:43 <thp> NooBmonk3y: "os.popen('cat /sys/devices/platform/gpio-switch/cam_shutter/state').read()" -> ...
Nov 23 22:03:51 <MohammadAG> anyways, follow the instructions
Nov 23 22:03:57 <MohammadAG> git init
Nov 23 22:04:01 <NooBmonk3y> lol thp ;)
Nov 23 22:04:07 <MohammadAG> (instructions from gitorious.org)
Nov 23 22:04:08 <NooBmonk3y> thp if it works why not ;)
Nov 23 22:04:16 <MohammadAG> then git commit and git push
Nov 23 22:04:41 <thp> NooBmonk3y: needs to fork a process, which is slow. you should open and read the file directly, obviously. don't blame python for slowness there :p
Nov 23 22:04:43 <NooBmonk3y> from the right directory i assume?
Nov 23 22:04:50 <NooBmonk3y> heheh :P
Nov 23 22:04:52 <MohammadAG> NooBmonk3y, cause you're spawning a shell each time you do that, thus wasting memory :P
Nov 23 22:05:04 <NooBmonk3y> that bit wasnt the slow bit ;)
Nov 23 22:05:10 <NooBmonk3y> but yeah
Nov 23 22:05:12 <NooBmonk3y> i agree
Nov 23 22:05:29 <MohammadAG> NooBmonk3y, yep, source directory
Nov 23 22:05:48 <thp> NooBmonk3y: what was the slow bit?
Nov 23 22:05:58 <MohammadAG> or just use tools / git in Qt Creator
Nov 23 22:06:07 <NooBmonk3y> MohammadAG,  how do i cd to a directory with a space? :P
Nov 23 22:06:13 <NooBmonk3y> darn external HDD
Nov 23 22:06:37 <MohammadAG> cd /this\ is\ a\ dir\ with\ spaces/
Nov 23 22:06:51 <korhojoa> :D
Nov 23 22:06:55 <thp> or easier: cd "/this is a dir with spaces/"
Nov 23 22:06:57 <korhojoa> i hate escaping
Nov 23 22:06:58 <MohammadAG> or use cd "/this is a dir with spaces"
Nov 23 22:07:10 <MohammadAG> i love escaping :P
Nov 23 22:07:21 <NooBmonk3y> greg@zingelspc:/media$ cd "/FreeAgent Drive"
Nov 23 22:07:21 <NooBmonk3y> bash: cd: /FreeAgent Drive: No such file or directory
Nov 23 22:07:34 <MohammadAG> ze fuck?
Nov 23 22:07:37 <korhojoa> probably under /media
Nov 23 22:07:39 <NooBmonk3y> ahaaaaaaaa
Nov 23 22:07:40 <korhojoa> or something
Nov 23 22:07:40 <NooBmonk3y> gottit
Nov 23 22:07:41 <thp> NooBmonk3y: no / at the beginning
Nov 23 22:07:43 <MohammadAG> yep
Nov 23 22:07:44 <korhojoa> not /
Nov 23 22:09:24 <NooBmonk3y> hmmmmmmm
Nov 23 22:10:42 <NooBmonk3y> greg@zingelspc:/media/FreeAgent Drive/QTHealthcheck/Healthcheck$ git push origin master
Nov 23 22:10:42 <NooBmonk3y> Permission denied (publickey).
Nov 23 22:10:42 <NooBmonk3y> fatal: The remote end hung up unexpectedly
Nov 23 22:10:49 <NooBmonk3y> this is why i dont like git :p
Nov 23 22:11:45 <MohammadAG> did you do git init and all that stuff?
Nov 23 22:12:00 <NooBmonk3y> nope
Nov 23 22:12:04 <MohammadAG> and put your ssh key on gitorious.org
Nov 23 22:12:06 <NooBmonk3y> the instructions didnt say that lol
Nov 23 22:12:08 <MohammadAG> ...
Nov 23 22:12:10 <jacekowski> i just don't understand why people like git so much
Nov 23 22:12:11 <NooBmonk3y> erm nope lol
Nov 23 22:12:14 <jacekowski> svn is so much better
Nov 23 22:12:17 <NooBmonk3y> lol
Nov 23 22:12:17 <jacekowski> and so much easier to use
Nov 23 22:12:21 <NooBmonk3y> gui? :)
Nov 23 22:12:35 <MohammadAG> cat ~/.ssh/id_rsa.pub
Nov 23 22:12:44 <MohammadAG> post that on gitorious.org
Nov 23 22:12:49 <MohammadAG> in add ssh keys
Nov 23 22:13:52 <MohammadAG> then git init; git add .; (instructions from repo on gitorious.org); git commit; git push origin master;
Nov 23 22:14:13 <MohammadAG> you only have to repeat the last two steps each time you change files
Nov 23 22:14:20 * MohammadAG goes to bed, gnite :)
Nov 23 22:15:17 <NooBmonk3y> meh
Nov 23 22:15:18 <NooBmonk3y> MohammadAG,
Nov 23 22:15:20 <NooBmonk3y> noooooooooo
Nov 23 22:15:24 <NooBmonk3y> i'm almost there!
Nov 23 22:15:29 <NooBmonk3y> added keys
Nov 23 22:15:32 <pupnik> http://babycage.net/babycage.php   BabyCage.net, Infant Confinement Specialists since 2001
Nov 23 22:16:44 <thp> NooBmonk3y: so i assume you're not interested in improvement suggestions to the "old" healthcheck code anymore?
Nov 23 22:17:14 <NooBmonk3y> erm, well, kinda ... but realistically, i'm so close to the new one, and it looks better, best to stick with one :)
Nov 23 22:17:24 <NooBmonk3y> as i'm aiming this one to be a bit more multi-platform
Nov 23 22:17:31 <NooBmonk3y> (eventually)
Nov 23 22:17:54 <thp> does the new one already have all the features of the old one?
Nov 23 22:17:54 <NooBmonk3y> allthough always interested where i went wrong ;)
Nov 23 22:17:59 <NooBmonk3y> almost all + some new
Nov 23 22:18:19 <NooBmonk3y> it's about 70% of old + more :)
Nov 23 22:18:33 <NooBmonk3y> so i'm just going through and adding sensor checks and camera checks atm
Nov 23 22:19:15 <thp> not "wrong" per se, but i can understand why things are slow
Nov 23 22:19:30 <NooBmonk3y> ahhhhhh :P
Nov 23 22:19:47 <NooBmonk3y> dare i ask, i went for the "it works approach" over the correct approach?
Nov 23 22:20:53 <thp> just wanted to clarify that python isn't slow :p
Nov 23 22:21:09 <NooBmonk3y> lol i'm not disagreeing :)
Nov 23 22:21:20 <NooBmonk3y> i actually like python, but stuggled for a while :)
Nov 23 22:21:35 <NooBmonk3y> my version may have been slow, though :p
Nov 23 22:21:42 <NooBmonk3y> probably due to lack of knowledge :)
Nov 23 22:22:02 <Funnyface> meh for some reason my phone won't pick up HSDPA these days, only UMTS
Nov 23 22:22:44 <NooBmonk3y> aghhhhhhhhhhhh
Nov 23 22:22:48 <Funnyface> if I use the 3g/2g/dual applet to switch it to GSM only, then back to auto, it normally picks up a HSDPA connection for a while, but then sooner or later it falls back to 3G :>
Nov 23 22:22:57 <NooBmonk3y> missus on her way back and 15 mins to wash, clean tidy n sober lol
Nov 23 22:23:06 <thp> NooBmonk3y: there's just a lot of os.popen with pipes and awk/sed/... in there where you could either open files directly for reading or do the text processing (grep/sed/awk) more efficiently in python
Nov 23 22:23:08 <alterego> Just spent an hour doing a configuration dialog ..
Nov 23 22:23:13 <NooBmonk3y> ahhhhhh
Nov 23 22:23:13 <alterego> Think I'm losing it ..
Nov 23 22:23:27 <alterego> It's only 5 widgets ..
Nov 23 22:23:31 <NooBmonk3y> thp,  os.popen i thought opened the file?
Nov 23 22:23:43 <NooBmonk3y> although i understand awk etc reads them and plays with them to get the bits i need
Nov 23 22:23:55 <NooBmonk3y> lol alterego
Nov 23 22:24:20 <thp> NooBmonk3y: it opens a process ("p"open)
Nov 23 22:25:21 <thp> and if you have a pipe, you open a new process for every part of the pipe (cat ... | grep ... | awk ...)
Nov 23 22:26:00 <thp> erm.. actually, the "p" in popen stands for pipe according to the docs..
Nov 23 22:26:36 <thp> but yeah, it still opens a process, which is slow
Nov 23 22:28:25 <alterego> python startup times on maemo are horrible as soon as you start using hildon/gtk or Qt bindings.
Nov 23 22:28:39 <alterego> python actually starts up pretty quickly if you're not importing any of that ..
Nov 23 22:29:19 <mikhas> so python import is actually slow?
Nov 23 22:30:00 <thp> yes, it loads the libraries
Nov 23 22:30:11 <alterego> No, python importing gtk is slow
Nov 23 22:30:20 <alterego> It's more likely in the gtk/hildon bindings than it is python import
Nov 23 22:30:27 <thp> ..which loads the gtk libraries
Nov 23 22:30:29 <alterego> Some crazy crap in their initialization.
Nov 23 22:30:32 <alterego> thp indeed.
Nov 23 22:30:37 <mikhas> well yes, sure loads the libs ;-) but other apps have to do that, too
Nov 23 22:31:49 <mikhas> alterego, you easily verify that by trying to import different libs/different parts of GTK (doesnt python have this "import foo from blah"?), and measure it
Nov 23 22:32:05 <mikhas> *you could easily verify that
Nov 23 22:32:24 <thp> "import foo from blah" still needs to load the whole library - it only affects what gets imported into the local namespace
Nov 23 22:33:06 <thp> and you should run a profiler if you really want to know where the loading time is going, i don't know :p
Nov 23 22:33:21 <mikhas> well, I kinda doubt it's the lib loading per se ...
Nov 23 22:33:37 <thp> loading + initialization
Nov 23 22:34:36 <alterego> mikhas: that's just handling namespace.
Nov 23 22:34:47 <alterego> That and gtk is one module ..
Nov 23 22:34:48 <pexi> http://pdadb.net/index.php?m=specs&id=2481&c=zte_v7
Nov 23 22:34:56 <alterego> Well, and gdk
Nov 23 22:35:09 <mikhas> oh, you can use import inside functions ...
Nov 23 22:35:17 <mikhas> python is funky
Nov 23 22:35:25 <alterego> Sure, you could do it asynchronously ^.^
Nov 23 22:36:04 <mikhas> http://wiki.python.org/moin/PythonSpeed/PerformanceTips#ImportStatementOverhead
Nov 23 22:36:06 <alterego> It'll bever be as good as native code though.
Nov 23 22:36:24 <alterego> And C++ is easy enough to become dangerous in with little effort.
Nov 23 22:36:40 <mikhas> err
Nov 23 22:37:00 <mikhas> good for you if you feel that C++ is easy
Nov 23 22:37:18 <mikhas> you must be a natural talent ;-)
Nov 23 22:37:22 <alterego> I don't think it's easy,
Nov 23 22:37:34 <alterego> I think it's easy to learn and become dangerous in ;)
Nov 23 22:37:57 <alterego> To learn it fully, well, that's something else.
Nov 23 22:38:12 <mikhas> I dont think I get your point
Nov 23 22:38:33 <alterego> Well, nevermind.
Nov 23 22:39:03 <alterego> I have one more dialog to refactor.
Nov 23 22:39:12 <alterego> Waypoints and POI
Nov 23 22:50:43 <alterego> In Qt Mobility we can inhibit screen lock, which is good for my app because you want it to stay on, but I was thinking, I'd like to be able to explicitly lock the device and not have it unlock it next time it polls the screensaver inhibit procedure.
Nov 23 22:51:48 <alterego> "org.freedesktop.Gypsy.Device"
Nov 23 22:51:49 <alterego> neat
Nov 23 22:52:42 <alterego> So something sends out events through dbus when the GPS is on :D
Nov 23 22:52:55 <alterego> For position information, satellite status etc, that's cool.
Nov 23 23:21:29 <pupnik> javispedro not around eh
Nov 23 23:21:31 <pupnik> hi SpeedEvil1
Nov 23 23:21:42 * SpeedEvil1 sighs.
Nov 23 23:21:48 <pupnik> what's the news
Nov 23 23:32:08 <jacekowski>  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t32VQ2HeELA
Nov 23 23:35:52 <BCMM> will maemo mind if i edit /etc/hostname?
Nov 23 23:36:00 <BCMM> also, will it stay edited?
Nov 23 23:36:27 <jacekowski> no, yes
Nov 23 23:36:29 <jacekowski> what's the point
Nov 23 23:36:42 <jacekowski> most of stuff there is based on bluetooth name anyways
Nov 23 23:36:53 <BCMM> the stuff where?
Nov 23 23:37:55 <BCMM> well, for a start it would distinguish mine on router config screens
Nov 23 23:38:31 <jacekowski> on phone
Nov 23 23:39:23 <BCMM> i mean, what stuff? you mean things like the filemanager?
Nov 23 23:39:28 <jacekowski> yds
Nov 24 00:24:35 <dolp> lasipalatsi.. mmm :D
Nov 24 00:39:19 <pupnik> very nice, the meego conferences are playable without flash - just view page source ans search for .flv
Nov 24 00:39:28 <pupnik> mplayer http://meego_conference2010.s3.amazonaws.com/meego_conference2010_357.flv
Nov 24 00:39:29 <pupnik> for example
Nov 24 00:39:47 <pupnik> http://conference2010.meego.com/program/schedule
Nov 24 00:41:17 <alterego> cool
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Wed Nov 24 02:59:58 2010