**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Tue Jan 18 02:59:57 2011 Jan 18 03:02:56 tbh I absolutely don't get it why Nokia missed on the great opportunity to position N900/maemo for emergency management special usecase. Given the prperties of the device and OS it'd be optimal for developing special software for usage in such scenarios. Like CBSMS with postprocessing, OSM earthquake, etc Jan 18 03:04:38 a rarely know fact is GSM specs even support closed user groups, to implement sth like VPN for calls Jan 18 03:05:24 at least that's my take on it - never digged into it Jan 18 03:05:36 me, all I care about is being able to see the cell tower ID/name so I can tell if the tower I am talking to is close or further away :) Jan 18 03:06:15 :nod: Jan 18 03:08:07 I followed a similar purpose when asking tekojo about service mode interface to modem, to get a full set of GSM network info parametrs. See http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/openmoko-kernel/2008-June/002987.html Jan 18 03:08:28 alas this didn't lead anywhere in the end Jan 18 03:09:09 jonwil: you could tell distance to BTS by a resolution of 550m, my inspecting TimeAdvance Jan 18 03:12:18 the depressing part of that story is: really ancient phones like Nokia 6210 supported service monitor mode, but only way to exploit it was connecting phone to a PC via service cable (or IrDA). Now that we have a N900 that can run all kinds of apps exploiting this data, like GSM "triangulation" positioning, the modem is missing all but the most basic features Jan 18 03:13:31 it's a shame Jan 18 03:13:40 yeah it is Jan 18 03:18:26 Obvously Nokia's mantra had been "it's no phone, it's a NIT. We want GSM data, and phone is a nice to have". Which is a really bad notion, to define implementation goals for a new potentially powerful device Jan 18 03:21:14 and now they are developing meego based on the same paradigm, and claim that's their fundation for all their future high end smartPHONES - isn't it roaring obvious there's something terribly odd in this concept? Jan 18 03:22:49 Yeah there is no reason MeeGo cant support all the GSM/UMTS/cellmo features that Android, WinMo, Symbian etc are supporting Jan 18 03:24:33 except MTSG not even thinking about "niche usecases" like CBSMS and whatnot. SSC is just another topic that comes to mind Jan 18 03:26:24 but isn't that outside MeeGo's scope? Wouldn't that be better placed in the Ofono layer, or be vendor specific? Jan 18 03:27:36 they are still specifying product requirements for a netbook, rather than a high end smartphone. And a netbook doesn't need to deal with CBSMS, not even with power conservation that much like a cellphone needs to do - that's why nobody feels sensorfw is doing wrong when *polling* sensors that have an IRQ hw line Jan 18 03:28:54 yeah that's part of the problem, MeeGo is being driven too much by Intel that wants it for ATOM tablets and netbooks Jan 18 03:30:11 it needs a fundamentally different mindset of engineers specifying system architecture of a smartphone, than that you usually find and accept for engineers developing a new desktop/laptop/netbook OS Jan 18 03:32:07 If Nokia doesnt step up and make MeeGo a better OS for smartphones, Nokia's leadership in mobile phones (whats left of it) will disappear Jan 18 03:32:38 I think that's damage done - nothing to recover here Jan 18 03:34:07 Nokia quite obviously lost or paralyzed inhouse smartphone OS competence Jan 18 03:35:04 Symbian was never that good for smartphones IMO Jan 18 03:35:57 but a few Nokia devels for maemo were savvy. Alas it seems they either left or got devoiced Jan 18 03:36:17 I remember when I first read about MeeGo, I got all excited and then stopped and went "Wait...you're giving up a debian-based system for WHAT now?" Jan 18 03:37:04 I disagree, jonwil. From my experience with my n85, I think Symbian was pretty darn good for smartphones...until, well, iOS, Android, and Maemo 5... Jan 18 03:37:35 It's not so much that it was bad as that it stopped being as good, if you see what I mean. Jan 18 03:38:26 it's not about what it's based on - it's all about where it abandons blind following of a desktop centric mainstream and implements custom tailored yet free and extensible own solutions Jan 18 03:39:07 Oh, it's not so much the basis that bothered me, I suppose. Jan 18 03:39:24 It's more the fact that I don't like the idea of giving up apt for anything but pacman or conary. Jan 18 03:41:56 BAD example: adopting pulseaudio for maemo. Good example: Nokia's maemo driver for lis302 accelerometer is IRQ based and much better than the "mainstream" polling driver they use in meego now Jan 18 03:43:30 Kilroo1: I give no flying sh*t about apt/rpm. I'm using the app manager maybe once a week, so what? it's the core apps and kernel, that run all the time which bothers me Jan 18 03:44:34 DocScrutinizer: Very valid point. But I still don't much care for the idea of something I see as a downgrade in package management. Jan 18 03:45:06 example? you want an app that starts an alarm as soon as the device gets moved. Shout "HAIL meego polling accel driver" Jan 18 03:46:20 Then again, at least if T-Mobile ever gets 3G+ in my area, I'm probably going to be happy enough with my n900 for quite a while that I won't likely do more than experiment with Meego unless a new Meego phone comes out that just gives me nerdgasms...and works on a network with better local coverage. Jan 18 03:46:49 That reminds me, I should take another crack at bluetooth tethering the n900 to the n85 again sometime. Jan 18 03:47:07 yeah, and has a battery life of what? 2h? Jan 18 03:48:08 ...Are you talking about the mythical Meego phone or the n85? Jan 18 03:48:09 let me put it the harsh way: meego devels have no clue how to design a decent smartphone OS Jan 18 03:48:15 Ah, okay. Jan 18 03:48:33 Good thing I like maemo, then. Jan 18 03:52:07 Random thoughts of the moment: I wonder if there's a way to tell rotatedaemon that I actually only want it to give me upside-down landscape mode. I also wonder why my phone doesn't seem to find pocketsphinx in extras-devel. Jan 18 03:52:17 * Kilroo1 goes to research these things. Jan 18 03:52:41 if they had, they wouldn't ask "is it upstream" whenever you suggest a better alternative. They would cheer "it's better for smartphone usecase! \o/" Jan 18 03:53:50 they never wrapped their heads around the reasons why e.g Android not even is a Linux anymore Jan 18 03:55:45 What I want is a smartphone with the good stuff from Android AND the good stuff from Maemo. Jan 18 03:57:05 I like the openess and native code of Maemo Jan 18 03:58:16 and I like some of the hardware from Android developers like HTC and Motorola (plus the fact that Android is designed to be a cellphone OS from day one) Jan 18 04:01:53 I'd be tickled pink if the answer to all the folks who have asked "what about porting Dalvik to Maemo instead of using NITDroid" became "Sure, here it is." But then, most of what I like better about Android than Meego tends to be games Maemo doesn't have yet. Jan 18 04:03:01 Davlik to regular linux is supposedly kinda painful to actually accomplish Jan 18 04:03:24 Didn't say I thought it would happen, said I'd be tickled. :) Jan 18 04:04:07 I was reading an interesting thread recently from a guy who doesn't like the n900's contacts and conversations. I thought it was kinda neat to get a different perspective, since I like Telepathy a lot and about the only thing I miss from contacts is voice dialing. Jan 18 04:04:08 yeah. I really liked the thought of it for a long time ... but it looks like portability was really not a concern that the android guys had Jan 18 04:05:31 actually, I played with an android 2.2 device the other day and came away not hugely impressed. I always have this tendency to assume that Linux is less usable than whatever the mainstream thing-of-the-day is Jan 18 04:05:44 Heh. Jan 18 04:06:09 After using Arch Linux on my home PC for this long and loving it, I...er...don't. Jan 18 04:06:25 ... then I go try the latest mainstream thing and when it isn't hugely more usable I'm always weirded out Jan 18 04:23:51 * jonwil wonders if anyone important will ever read bugs like 11794... Jan 18 04:24:34 they n900 sudoers file looks quite complex, is there any trick to adding another user to it? Jan 18 04:27:52 nevermind Jan 18 04:39:28 bug #11749 Jan 18 04:39:30 Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/11749 as-daemon uses lots of RAM and CPU Jan 18 04:40:00 wtf is as-daemon? Jan 18 04:48:43 its not 11949 I was referring to, its 11794 Jan 18 04:48:47 bug #11794 Jan 18 04:48:48 Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/11794 Open Fremantle's MCE Jan 18 04:51:40 aah Jan 18 05:31:25 so, how does one ssh into easydebian running on n900? Jan 18 05:31:48 ssh into normal n900 and start a debian shell? Jan 18 05:31:50 do you have to install ssh server in easydebian then run it on a different port to the maemo ssh Jan 18 05:32:25 how do you start a debian sheel? Jan 18 05:32:31 *shell Jan 18 05:33:57 debbie-sue Jan 18 05:34:45 DocScrutinizer51, had an alarm set to 6, apparently I woke up, unplugged the N900 from the charger, stopped the alarm and went back to bed, yet I can't remember doing that Jan 18 05:35:09 haha Jan 18 05:35:29 thanks, debbie-sue worked Jan 18 05:38:41 MohammadAG51: moo - and sorry, my daily reconnect hit at 6:30:00 Jan 18 05:39:07 so everything after your wake up story got lost Jan 18 05:39:27 actually after psi's haha Jan 18 05:40:21 heh Jan 18 05:50:42 nice, got samba working Jan 18 05:52:58 however im a bit confused why samba is still working even tho ive shutdown LXDE Jan 18 06:04:13 lxkde isn't in the habbit of killing system daemons Jan 18 06:04:59 thought as much - morning ShadowJK Jan 18 06:05:14 morn Jan 18 06:05:45 * ShadowJK ponders finding the N810 gps bug and reopening it now that Nokia agps servers reject N810 Jan 18 06:06:53 * ShadowJK yawns and goes back to sleep Jan 18 06:06:58 WUT? Jan 18 06:10:36 * jonwil has identified the items he would want in order to support cbsms on maemo the "right" way by plugging into the telephony stack Jan 18 06:14:13 jonwil: could you add a comment to https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=8347 Jan 18 06:14:15 Bug 8347: Cell Broadcast Feature not available Jan 18 06:17:52 need to sign up for bugzilla first :( Jan 18 06:17:54 :) Jan 18 06:30:05 Moorning. Jan 18 06:37:18 DocScruitinizer, are you suggesting I should mention the stuff I want in the bugzilla comment? Jan 18 06:37:35 yes Jan 18 06:37:44 ok, will do Jan 18 06:38:49 also why you need them, what's your concept etc Jan 18 06:40:20 then hope for andre__ to maybe propagate this request to whom it may concern inside Nokia Jan 18 06:51:45 jonwil: tekojo is online Jan 18 06:53:30 tekojo: morning :-) jonwil is about to add a comment to bug 8347, about data he needs to fix the bug. Could you have a look at it and see what's possible? Jan 18 06:53:32 Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/8347 Cell Broadcast Feature not available Jan 18 06:53:55 DocScrutinizer: sure, will take a look Jan 18 06:54:05 fine :-D many thanks Jan 18 07:05:40 what is telepathy and why would wiring cbsms up to it be of value? Jan 18 07:10:41 jonwil: well, pretty much anything Jan 18 07:10:48 jonwil: just question what is needed Jan 18 07:10:59 telepathy is the undelying messaging framework Jan 18 07:14:18 jonwil: seen above? tekojo will support your request, as soon as you add it to sms-cb bug. Jan 18 07:14:26 I am adding it now Jan 18 07:14:37 the info on what I need and what would be nice to have Jan 18 07:15:15 the better detail this comment can give, the higher the chances somebody inside Nokia knows how to deal with it Jan 18 07:16:26 jonwil, DocScrutinizer - actually the best way to deal with a limitation is to file a bug with the information in, most of my scrollback is gone but for the pings and I am not reading more. Jan 18 07:16:55 ok, I am providing all the info I can Jan 18 07:17:00 no problem, thanks and good morning Jan 18 07:17:05 * lcuk beds again Jan 18 07:17:14 lcuk: it's about bug 8347 Jan 18 07:17:15 Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/8347 Cell Broadcast Feature not available Jan 18 07:17:48 jonwil is tackling it, but needs some *.h and related stuff to implement a fix Jan 18 07:18:11 comment added Jan 18 07:18:29 lcuk: we all thought it would be nice this fix goes to telepathy Jan 18 07:19:44 basically the intent is to build a low-level library and plugin for the CSD daemon (so a libcbsms and a csd-cbsms) and then an upper level telepathy plugin/interface talking to that Jan 18 07:20:03 And then after that, a suitable UI plugin to display the Cell Broadcast messages Jan 18 07:20:09 e.g. status bar plugin Jan 18 07:21:26 it would be possible to write something that bypasses the telephony stack and does everything manually or to reverse engineer the telephony stack but it would be better if it can be done the "right" way Jan 18 07:23:27 Since the relavent area is open-source in MeeGo (via ofono) the chances of getting what I want seem greater than with things like BME that remain closed. Jan 18 07:25:02 and as SMS-CB would/should get handled similar to normal point-to-point SMS (except when flag "popup" is set for the particular cell broadcast SMS) it's quite natural to implement it into the existing stack Jan 18 07:26:56 CBSMS (specifically the cell tower name/ID stuff) was supported on my moms old Nokia with B&W screen, its embarrasing that one of Nokia's flagship smartphones doesn't support it :) Jan 18 07:27:14 Although there are those that would debase the "flagship" comment :P Jan 18 07:29:13 agreed - actually I was about to push out a similar comment Jan 18 07:31:40 Having this info would presumably also let other things be done to the SMS stack (for example, code to detect incoming SMSs from certain numbers and block them so the UI level never even knows the SMS arrived) Jan 18 07:32:12 which was IIRC a request in bug 10870 Jan 18 07:32:13 it's almost fraud to sell a Nokia phone at more than twice the price of my y2k Nokia 6210, and it doesn't support things that were standard on that old featurephone. Just for a 'we don't need that' and without any rationale why N900 can't support them Jan 18 07:32:13 Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/10870 Open source libsms and libsms-utils Jan 18 07:32:27 mornin' Jan 18 07:33:14 DocScrutinizer51, ? Jan 18 07:33:30 DocScrutinizer51, that doesn't sound like you... Jan 18 07:33:42 mece: huh? Jan 18 07:33:52 DocScrutinizer51, the rant. Jan 18 07:34:07 nah I'm famous for my rant Jan 18 07:34:08 DocScrutinizer51, was rather unlike you. Did I miss something interesting? Jan 18 07:34:53 DocScrutinizer51, yeah you rant, but that one sounded strangely non-technical Jan 18 07:34:56 :) Jan 18 07:35:01 mece: check bug 8347 Jan 18 07:35:03 Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/8347 Cell Broadcast Feature not available Jan 18 07:35:52 we don't need cbsms Jan 18 07:36:15 Lots of people want that feature Jan 18 07:36:19 including me Jan 18 07:36:29 well I dont know about "lots" Jan 18 07:36:32 but people want it Jan 18 07:36:35 what for Jan 18 07:36:35 DocScrutinizer51, interesting. Jan 18 07:36:35 jacekowski: you don't need electricity Jan 18 07:36:40 LOL Jan 18 07:36:49 i still don't see any real use case for cbsms Jan 18 07:37:05 My mobile network uses CBSMS to broadcast a tower ID/name Jan 18 07:37:12 jacekowski, spam? Jan 18 07:37:22 all 3 of my previous phones supported displaying this tower ID/name on the home screen Jan 18 07:37:34 as well as phones owned by my family Jan 18 07:37:36 jacekowski: home zone notification, desaster alerts Jan 18 07:37:59 Yeah the government around here was talking about using SMS alerts for disaster notifications for fires and floods and stuff Jan 18 07:38:11 for evacuations etc Jan 18 07:38:24 hee sounds like something that would be fun to hack :D Jan 18 07:39:23 mece: as hard to hack as the obscure free calls on GSM Jan 18 07:40:25 of course you can set up your own BTS tower and override the 'official' one Jan 18 07:40:44 point is CBSMS is not as useless as many people claim :P Jan 18 07:40:49 DocScrutinizer51, My own tower, with blackjack, and hookers! Jan 18 07:41:40 Wow I haven't been to bugs.maemo.org in ages it appears. Jan 18 07:41:57 yeah, talk to Harald welte about openBB Jan 18 07:42:11 I bet he likes the hookers idea Jan 18 07:42:40 DocScrutinizer51, well the next bit in that quote would be "in fact forget the blackjack and the tower" Jan 18 07:42:41 :) Jan 18 07:42:44 bender Jan 18 07:42:44 One operator here offered cheap rates in your home zone, and cell broadcast was used (I think?) to indicate what zone you are in Jan 18 07:43:19 exactly Jan 18 07:43:24 Well, perhaps it will get fixed :) Jan 18 07:43:36 somehow Jan 18 07:43:37 O2 Germany does exactly that Jan 18 07:44:12 Let me add a comment with some of the "use cases" for CBSMS and why it would be good to havde Jan 18 07:44:47 wtf .ico files? Stupid windows. Jan 18 07:45:55 ShadowJK: that's why they broadcast Gauss-Wegener coords of the BTS on CBC221. That's used to calculate if terminat is inside homezone - calculation for display done in SAT Jan 18 07:46:57 Grr, why doesn't qt creator respect my authoritah Jan 18 07:47:13 good morning Jan 18 07:47:30 hey Jan 18 07:47:46 Mornin' Termana Jan 18 07:47:48 are there any tweaks to further speed up the n900? Jan 18 07:47:52 hi Jan 18 07:48:21 phrearch, what kind of speed are we talking about? Jan 18 07:48:25 im running chromium on the n900 with a websocket app im working on. wondering whether i can speed it up a bit for a demo Jan 18 07:48:52 Yeah, don't use javascript ;-) Jan 18 07:49:02 hahaha Jan 18 07:49:02 besides optimalisations on the webpart, the first thing im thinking of is to increase cpu speed Jan 18 07:49:05 yea :) Jan 18 07:49:13 bit difficult with websockets though Jan 18 07:49:21 can you afford another n900? Jan 18 07:49:30 if you can, overclock this one Jan 18 07:49:34 not really :) Jan 18 07:49:40 then you're screwed Jan 18 07:49:42 use a computer Jan 18 07:50:31 phrearch, well, you can disable stuff like automagical email checking so it won't interrupt you. But other than that, I dunno really. Jan 18 07:50:42 Posted some use-cases for CBSMS Jan 18 07:50:45 in the bug Jan 18 07:50:46 phrearch, remove widgets Jan 18 07:50:47 i always used some queen baecon script in combination with kernel-power, but thats not working anymore Jan 18 07:51:13 phrearch, so you already oveclocked it? Jan 18 07:51:14 ehm, i only have some desktop icons Jan 18 07:51:23 mece: before the upgrade to 1.3 yes Jan 18 07:51:31 cant help it :) Jan 18 07:52:07 i installed swappolube which made the animations go a bit faster. Jan 18 07:52:35 phrearch, well people are still overclocking so just search tmo for help on that. Jan 18 07:53:06 increasing CPU clock for a demo is evil cheeting. You should DEcrease CPU clock for demos, to prove your app is not putting too much load on the system Jan 18 07:53:36 phrearch, if you just want ui to be quicker (as opposed to applications) just install transition control or whatever it's called and set everything to 0 or close to it. Jan 18 07:54:27 mece: thanks for the tip. ill check the repos for it Jan 18 07:54:51 ah found it Jan 18 07:55:17 phrearch, just try some settings. You'll find ui feels a lot faster with fewer blur cycles. Jan 18 07:58:27 aah, and of course Jan 18 07:58:36 ~omap-oc Jan 18 07:58:36 well, omap-oc is http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog/%23maemo.2010-08-01.log.html#t2010-08-01T22:16:05 read that! Jan 18 07:58:37 hm, it doesnt end up in my app list Jan 18 07:59:54 heh, yea i probably should leave it as it is Jan 18 08:04:56 phrearch: checked settings? Jan 18 08:05:24 i couldnt find the transition control app Jan 18 08:05:56 phrearch: checked settings? Jan 18 08:07:01 ow, ehm, which ones? Jan 18 08:07:16 the settings app Jan 18 08:07:52 Lets hope someone can respond to my comment on bug 8347 :) Jan 18 08:07:53 Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/8347 Cell Broadcast Feature not available Jan 18 08:08:18 or if not that someone can reverse engineer the needed interfaces :) Jan 18 08:08:26 yea, i went through the settings some times. what should i look for? Jan 18 08:08:43 tekojo said he'll look into it and see what can be done, jonwil Jan 18 08:08:47 ok, great Jan 18 08:09:16 phrearch: I thought the transitions might show up there Jan 18 08:09:32 for a wild guess Jan 18 08:10:28 Let's all go and vote for bug 8347! Jan 18 08:10:37 Creating a bugzilla account is fun! Jan 18 08:10:40 voted already Jan 18 08:11:15 I said creating a bugzilla account is fun. Jan 18 08:11:18 :) Jan 18 08:11:25 LOL Jan 18 08:11:29 voted Jan 18 08:11:31 * mece is slow Jan 18 08:11:54 hm, brb Jan 18 08:28:05 hm couldnt find it in settings Jan 18 08:28:26 ah found it Jan 18 08:34:57 phrearch: yeah, needs a reboot or whatever to show up in applauncher Jan 18 08:35:40 ok, ive set all of those settings in there to 5. seems a bit more responsive Jan 18 08:36:27 btw thanks, I managed to install it finally, and so speeded up my mhd flying windows in taskswitcher a bit Jan 18 08:38:30 ow, that swappolube app also makes some difference Jan 18 08:39:19 i also tried qcpufreq to speed up to 1000, just for this chromium webapp demo Jan 18 08:39:39 its quite a difference, but i wont make it default Jan 18 08:42:34 trick is to make a theme that shows fine on both a 5 inch screen and a 24 inch Jan 18 08:43:49 doesnt the n900 send an iphone user agent? Jan 18 08:45:28 nope Jan 18 08:45:36 not afaik Jan 18 08:45:44 at least microb doesn't Jan 18 08:46:39 hm, checking Jan 18 08:47:09 but honestly, if that webapp needs OC to not suck, then it sucks nevertheless Jan 18 08:47:43 Well - OC can be viable to prove something as a POC. Jan 18 08:47:55 But if it needs it permenantly Jan 18 08:48:28 yea, i want to show that a websocket cms can run fine on a mobile as well Jan 18 08:48:52 chromium is the only browser that supports it atm, and i need it to be a bit responsive for the poc Jan 18 08:49:45 you can't expect users to OC just to run a silly webapp. If that's a stopgap to show off a PoC and you plan to improve it later, then it might be OK (tgough you should be very clear about why it's that slow now and what can be done to speed it up later that can't be done now) Jan 18 08:50:07 sure, its just for a demo Jan 18 08:50:53 users want to have something visual. it doesnt do much if i say that it could run in theory on a mobile phone Jan 18 08:51:17 afaik, only the iphone supports websockets besides n900 chromium Jan 18 08:51:57 your OC'd PoC is cheating nevertheless, unless you *know for sure* you can speed it up by at least factor 3 later Jan 18 08:52:50 websockets? Jan 18 08:52:53 the mobile version is just for the eyecandy :p Jan 18 08:53:10 its meant for desktops in the first place Jan 18 08:53:29 but its cool to see it works fine, even without oc Jan 18 08:54:17 fennec doesn't support websockets? Jan 18 08:55:30 i think mozilla is a bit cautious with websockets atm. there was a proxy security problem with websockets Jan 18 08:55:33 hmm Jan 18 08:55:36 read proxy problem Jan 18 08:55:36 firefox sucks as i said Jan 18 08:55:59 yea, i prefer webkit based browsers Jan 18 08:56:00 Jan 18 08:56:05 HELO gentlemen Jan 18 08:56:33 EHLO Jan 18 08:58:47 moin RST38h Jan 18 09:05:47 * SpeedEvil continues to be annoyed at the lack of biweekly alarms Jan 18 09:10:32 SpeedEvil, nonono, the problem is not the device, but you, who require such unruly alarm times. You should change your schedule instead :P Jan 18 09:19:22 Actually, my bin collection times. Jan 18 09:21:34 sync a calendar event that is biweekly and has a reminder set ;D Jan 18 09:25:01 the database allegedly supports biweekly Jan 18 09:25:16 DocScrutinizer, seen my questions in mhd? Jan 18 09:25:21 alarmed also should Jan 18 09:25:34 yep, but thinking about it Jan 18 09:26:07 I see the purpose, but I'm still pondering the exact requirements Jan 18 09:27:19 i was thinking of a state file first Jan 18 09:27:25 but that's stupid Jan 18 09:27:37 (if file is present, hostmode is active) Jan 18 09:27:54 then i thought of a_host and a_idle, only states with hostmode atm Jan 18 09:28:17 not really, given the fact h-e-n will go jrbme to manage hostmode in kernel Jan 18 09:28:31 when? Jan 18 09:28:45 26? Jan 18 09:28:55 ah, so jrbme is ready? Jan 18 09:29:26 kinda Jan 18 09:30:07 it's a collection of pieces that need integration Jan 18 09:31:57 hi Jan 18 09:32:09 how do I report bugs with titans power kernel? Jan 18 09:32:15 and when that's done then h-e-n gui should actually search for a var/run/jrbme file Jan 18 09:32:19 poke titan Jan 18 09:32:30 How do I do that mo? Jan 18 09:32:49 is he here? Jan 18 09:32:50 or simply invoke >jrbme status Jan 18 09:33:58 perhaps you pros could suggest the reason for the bug... Jan 18 09:34:19 I am runnning power kernel v42, it is great Jan 18 09:34:24 however... Jan 18 09:34:37 hey... one of my conversations shows not delivered icon.. and has been showing it for months.. i know the receiver gets my messages so id like to clear the status... any hints how to do so without clearing the conversation? Jan 18 09:35:30 With the -kernel power settings package installed the number of hardware wakeups goes insane and the kernel process bridge_work-que never goes to sleep. This anihalates battery power Jan 18 09:35:38 haj: same here. Seems a flaw in conversations app Jan 18 09:35:50 haj: nothing you can do Jan 18 09:35:59 haj: I found no solution Jan 18 09:36:15 without kernel power settings package installed the number of wakeups is normal Jan 18 09:36:36 so one is forced to conclude that there is an error with kernel powersettings package Jan 18 09:36:56 haj: you should open a bug ticket against conversations Jan 18 09:37:14 i still think we should rewrite it Jan 18 09:37:39 okay.. annoying.. ill do that later. Jan 18 09:37:57 you might be able to edit the sqlite3 database manually Jan 18 09:38:00 MohammadAG: what? Jan 18 09:38:08 conversations? Jan 18 09:38:09 Conversations Jan 18 09:38:11 yes Jan 18 09:38:16 ack Jan 18 09:38:48 it's telepathy Jan 18 09:39:07 which is documented a lot Jan 18 09:39:08 let's see what 8347 will yield. Maybe we see conversations to open up enough to fix things Jan 18 09:39:33 bug 8347 Jan 18 09:39:35 Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/8347 Cell Broadcast Feature not available Jan 18 09:39:41 that? Jan 18 09:39:47 yep Jan 18 09:39:53 bug 8347 Jan 18 09:40:00 read last comment by jonwil Jan 18 09:40:02 already requested Jan 18 09:40:48 remind me why notifications in microB aren't parented again... Jan 18 09:41:03 err wut? Jan 18 09:41:17 MohammadAG: because microB is a bastard? Jan 18 09:41:36 (actually, it's overall a good browser, I'm impressed) Jan 18 09:42:06 DocScrutinizer51, when notifications are parented to the window, they don't show outside it Jan 18 09:42:20 I got "bugs.maemo.org verified by VeriSign..." in XChat Jan 18 09:42:27 should only show in microB Jan 18 09:42:30 anyway Jan 18 09:42:37 hahahaha Jan 18 09:42:57 that happens when a parent is NULL or 0 Jan 18 09:43:25 how would you set the parent window for a dbus notification call? Jan 18 09:44:04 it shouldn't be using dbus, that's shit coding if it does :P Jan 18 09:44:10 it should use libhildon1.h Jan 18 09:44:22 or whatever the notification header's called Jan 18 09:44:36 hmm, ok. anyway my question was honest Jan 18 09:44:49 hermes does it :) Jan 18 09:44:52 I know ;) Jan 18 09:45:11 I think notifications are parented in h-e-n Jan 18 09:45:15 might be mistaken Jan 18 09:45:22 I guess the answer is 'you can't' ? Jan 18 09:45:32 with dbus, nope Jan 18 09:45:38 with the .h, yep Jan 18 09:46:09 k, time for breakfast, err brinner Jan 18 09:46:17 heh Jan 18 09:47:49 Morning, all Jan 18 09:47:56 GeneralAntilles: pong. Hmm interesting question. Jan 18 09:51:15 hi Jaffa Jan 18 10:06:28 DocScrutinizer51, btw, I noticed the stock mediaplayer does have keyboard shortcuts to seek Jan 18 10:06:36 hold the left/right arrow Jan 18 10:10:52 hah, since when? in movies at least this doesn't work for me Jan 18 10:11:19 all it does is skip next/prev in playlist Jan 18 10:11:39 What bits of telepathy code is not open? Jan 18 10:11:45 or whatever that may be for movies Jan 18 10:11:51 Only important one I can find is telepathy-ring Jan 18 10:11:58 which I guess is the important one :) Jan 18 10:12:26 hmm, yes it's important. But I never knew it's not open Jan 18 10:12:33 bbl Jan 18 10:12:54 its probably closed because it talks to closed things lower in the telephony stack Jan 18 10:13:22 ugh Jan 18 10:13:39 why does everyone have to use windows Jan 18 10:13:48 its such a pain to develop for Jan 18 10:14:01 Is there some kind of diagram of which parts of the maemo stack are open and which aren't? Jan 18 10:14:10 dotblank: do you have to use raw win32 or .net or something? Jan 18 10:14:28 by which i mean, it is a Qt platform after all... Jan 18 10:14:31 BCMM, raw win32 Jan 18 10:14:44 BCMM, but I wan't to use serial ports Jan 18 10:14:59 http://stskeeps.subnetmask.net/maemo.org/openness/pr1.1/ Jan 18 10:15:00 BCMM, and I want my code in native c.. no c++ Jan 18 10:15:08 That list might help a bit Jan 18 10:15:14 in terms of whats open and whats not Jan 18 10:15:32 dotblank: ah Jan 18 10:15:45 and i wrote it using autotools Jan 18 10:15:56 so my progarm will not run on windows it seems Jan 18 10:16:11 depends on glib Jan 18 10:16:19 dotblank: it's not the "right" answer, but cygwin? Jan 18 10:16:31 nah Jan 18 10:16:36 I know Jan 18 10:16:37 good luck getting glib to work on win32 Jan 18 10:16:44 dotblank: also, surely there is glib for windows? there is GTK for windows! Jan 18 10:16:48 glib should do fine on win32 Jan 18 10:16:50 or was that a typo for glibc? Jan 18 10:17:02 glibc would hard Jan 18 10:17:22 Really? http://gnuwin32.sourceforge.net/packages/glibc.htm Jan 18 10:17:25 its just setting up cross compiling can be hard with autotools Jan 18 10:17:25 DocScrutinizer51, I actually tried it in a video Jan 18 10:17:32 well, that's what cygwin is for. but glib and GTK can run natively Jan 18 10:17:36 you should hold the keys to seek, press to skip/prev Jan 18 10:17:52 And I need my laptop, figured something out and need to try it :/ Jan 18 10:20:37 ffs can't WoL :/ Jan 18 10:20:51 so I was all like "pssh crosscompiling programs in qt to windows will be easy in linux" Jan 18 10:21:08 Right... Jan 18 10:21:09 that didn't go so well Jan 18 10:21:16 I spent two hours recompiling Qt on windows Jan 18 10:21:35 so I'm like "I'll just install a windows VM" then the XP vm bluescreens on install.... Jan 18 10:21:38 to use static linking, since windows has nothing like debs Jan 18 10:21:51 don't feel too bad Jan 18 10:22:04 I got a BSOD on a new out-of-the-box netbook Jan 18 10:22:08 building window targets is such a pain Jan 18 10:22:10 first boot too Jan 18 10:22:42 i wonder if groove would build for the N8... Jan 18 10:23:04 its easier for me to cross compile to linux on arm and sparc and ppc then it is to compile code for windows Jan 18 10:23:24 well as long os Qt works and phonon Jan 18 10:23:25 same :P Jan 18 10:23:35 you use phonon? Jan 18 10:23:48 yea but I had to kinda hack it a bit Jan 18 10:24:01 was thinking of sticking native pulse support Jan 18 10:24:05 or use libao Jan 18 10:24:30 heh Jan 18 10:24:37 phonon apps have a lib Jan 18 10:24:41 so it would compile Jan 18 10:24:46 but there's no backend Jan 18 10:25:05 gstreamer? Jan 18 10:25:14 on S60 Jan 18 10:25:36 hmm I wonder if libao would work with that Jan 18 10:25:57 maybe I should actually qrite it for Qt::multimedia Jan 18 10:27:52 my laughably simple c program is the most pain in the world to port Jan 18 10:27:56 http://dotblank.selfip.com:7405/ Jan 18 10:28:04 thats it running Jan 18 10:33:18 dotblank: either you have a horrible upstream, or most of ##maemo is really, really interested in that link Jan 18 10:33:22 cause it doesn't load Jan 18 10:33:39 lol Jan 18 10:35:16 where did i get that extra # from? Jan 18 10:36:27 thankfully we dont need the source code to the messaging app (rtcom-messaging-ui) to implement Cell Broadcast, god that thing has a LOT of dependancies :P Jan 18 10:38:07 hi all. anyone can help me to setup pulseaudio in N900 to support multiple sounds at one time? Jan 18 10:39:33 oh why oh why does maemo (and everything else) use pulse? Jan 18 10:41:57 everything else can have pulse replaced Jan 18 10:42:00 maemo can't Jan 18 10:42:23 I don't know, but I can't complain Jan 18 10:42:37 jonwil, we might rewrite conversations, if you're interested Jan 18 10:43:22 MohammadAG: why is maemo more stuck with pulse than other distros are? Jan 18 10:43:25 conversations being the messaging app? Jan 18 10:43:41 maemo cant have pulse replaced because of all the binaries that link to pulse Jan 18 10:44:16 same with plenty of distros, surely? Jan 18 10:44:17 BCMM, cause it's 53% closed Jan 18 10:44:23 ah, i see Jan 18 10:44:37 jonwil, yes Jan 18 10:44:42 my first goal anyway is to implement a CSD plugin for cbsms Jan 18 10:44:49 somehow Jan 18 10:45:00 good luck :) Jan 18 10:45:10 i'm not sure those other distros can have pulse removed without basically creating a derivative distro with everything built without it Jan 18 10:45:29 they'd switch to alsa afaik Jan 18 10:45:51 There is bug 8347 and if that doesn't go anywhere then someone did offer to reverse engineer some things for me... Jan 18 10:45:52 Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/8347 Cell Broadcast Feature not available Jan 18 10:46:12 jacekowski, saw that Jan 18 10:46:22 dumb question: What's wrong with pulse? Jan 18 10:46:40 it's retarded on maemo, waste of resources Jan 18 10:47:32 I think we are more likely to succeed with 8347 than with other opening requests like GPS or BME that are genuinely sensitive. Jan 18 10:47:44 telephony stack is not sensitive AFAIK, not with ofono out there Jan 18 10:47:48 what's it even for on maemo? aren't the headphones socket and big speakers and not-hands-free speakers all outputs of the same card which you can switch between by fiddling with a mixer anyway? Jan 18 10:48:17 oh, overkill way of ensuring a smooth switchover to bluetooth? Jan 18 10:48:37 no, somebody said the bluetooth chip does that in hardware, and is also fed from the same sound card Jan 18 10:50:00 It is Jan 18 10:51:17 so what does pulse do that plain ALSA (with dmix) wouldn't? Jan 18 10:51:48 Has controls for routing between the different possible outputs. Jan 18 10:51:55 maemo doesn't even seem to use per-app volume control much, since i've noticed music getting louder when it turns the speaker up to play a "new email" alert Jan 18 10:51:57 Manages volume levels Jan 18 10:52:00 And can send audio over the network. Jan 18 10:52:11 alterego: yeah, i mean what is it doing, on maemo, that plain ALSA wouldn't? Jan 18 10:52:20 And does all sorts of cool stuff that has been ignored in maemo Jan 18 10:52:25 call audio compression Jan 18 10:52:33 given that the n900 appears to have hardware for routing between all the outputs Jan 18 10:53:25 alterego: christ, surely there are tiny, cheap chips that do that for 1/10th of the power consumption? Jan 18 10:53:42 I figured it out. Pulseaudio @ N900 supports multiple sounds @ one time, but default player disable this feature to not disturb during music listening. Playing music by terminal mplayer is not disabling other sounds Jan 18 10:54:01 Probably, and don't call me Shierley :P Jan 18 10:54:03 alsa supports multiple streams at once too... Jan 18 10:55:03 alterego: did you actually mean that pulse is responsible for encoding stuff to GSM codecs? Jan 18 10:55:33 why doesn't the cell modem thing do that for itself? Jan 18 10:56:44 I think it's offloaded to dsp, actually handled in gstreamer Jan 18 10:58:10 still, that isn't a good reason to put everything through pulse Jan 18 10:58:24 and it's still gonna use cycles just... being pulseaudio Jan 18 10:58:35 err - no Jan 18 10:58:41 the cellmo does the GSM coding Jan 18 10:58:58 It takes in digitised audio Jan 18 11:03:28 ~flashing Jan 18 11:03:29 hmm... flashing is http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware Jan 18 11:03:42 chem|st: thanks for the pimping on tmo ;) Jan 18 11:12:14 * jonwil suspects the answer from Nokia for anything to do with telephony on the N900 is going to be "use ofono" even though its not possible to use ofono without loss of functionality Jan 18 11:12:51 jonwil: but that is your problem not Nokia's Jan 18 11:13:00 alterego: you mean linking from brainstorm and stuff? Jan 18 11:13:52 chem|st: yeah :) Jan 18 11:13:59 Thats why they invented IDA pro :P Although I wish I could afford that fancy version with the ARM decompiler... Jan 18 11:14:12 alterego: I got a few minutes spare as I am waiting for a technician and thought I might use that to clean up a bit too, still stuck at points where I got no access to I requested a year ago Jan 18 11:14:38 chem|st: what points are those? Jan 18 11:14:43 alterego: brainstorm Jan 18 11:14:51 I've got a spare day, I was actually going to work on Columbus Jan 18 11:15:12 alterego: have you got a source for nautical maps? Jan 18 11:15:39 No, they're all closed as far as I can ascertain :/ Jan 18 11:15:53 yeah same here Jan 18 11:17:01 I'll look into it in more detail when v1 is out of the door. Jan 18 11:17:17 As v2 is the version that will integrate maps/charts Jan 18 11:19:34 I navigated through shallows by sonar only as the maps I had available where printed and quiet outdated (the satcom maps were far off up to date too), having the sonar change from 25m to 4m in a few seconds made me change course in seconds and you never know if it was the right direction to turn to... Jan 18 11:19:55 Yeah :/ Jan 18 11:20:44 loosing the bottom weight is about 200eur so I'd love to keep it :) Jan 18 11:21:26 "from 25m to 4m in a few seconds"? did you find the mast of a wreck? Jan 18 11:22:06 BCMM: clifflines Jan 18 11:22:42 chem|st: presumably, that's a regular cliff, but underwater? Jan 18 11:23:35 BCMM: steepcoasts is another name Jan 18 11:25:07 there are reefs underwater and if they are already mapped good but does not help if your maps are outdated Jan 18 11:26:04 lcuk, alterego http://bugreports.qt.nokia.com/browse/QTBUG-16323?focusedCommentId=138019#comment-138019 Jan 18 11:27:18 the underwater landscape on clifflines change everyday, there is a 10m line about 50m off the cliff where it is very dangerous but in some cases the not even 100m are enough safety distance Jan 18 11:29:20 Also - you have to beware of the kraken. Jan 18 11:29:24 10m line means on the map is I line drawn showing there is less than 10m distance to ground Jan 18 11:29:28 SpeedEvil: anytime Jan 18 11:30:56 MohammadAG: did you install the *correct* debug symbols? should give a prettier backtrace ;o Jan 18 11:31:58 frals, hmm, Venemo traced it back to QApplication so I got libqt4-core-dbg Jan 18 11:32:02 hmm Jan 18 11:32:07 should try libqt4-gui-dbg Jan 18 11:32:10 thanks Jan 18 11:32:16 yeah Jan 18 11:32:23 since its in gui.so id go for gui-dbg Jan 18 11:32:35 yeah, but QApplication is in core afaik Jan 18 11:32:39 I could be wrong Jan 18 11:32:52 * MohammadAG starts chroot Jan 18 11:32:55 libs don't fit on / Jan 18 11:33:03 QApplication is QtGui Jan 18 11:33:05 qapp is gui i think, qcoreapp or smth is core Jan 18 11:33:09 QCoreApplication is QtCore Jan 18 11:33:16 :) Jan 18 11:33:17 what he said ^^^ Jan 18 11:33:29 ah Jan 18 11:33:35 btw, weird thing I noticed Jan 18 11:33:53 installing 109MBs takes ages on / Jan 18 11:34:01 or /opt Jan 18 11:34:05 yet in a chroot it's quick Jan 18 11:34:35 Interesting Jan 18 11:34:40 very Jan 18 11:34:49 the device doesn't even hang Jan 18 11:35:13 * chem|st is missing his little battlestar... Jan 18 11:35:13 also I'm getting a download speed of 400+ kbps in the chroot, while I get 30kbps outside it Jan 18 11:35:25 not sure how that's even related Jan 18 11:35:34 my apt cache lives in MyDocs Jan 18 11:36:35 Freaky Jan 18 11:37:05 and there goes my chroot Jan 18 11:37:11 failed in buffer_write(fd) (9, ret=-1): backend dpkg-deb during `./usr/lib/debug/opt/lib/libQtGui.so.4.7.0': No space left on device Jan 18 11:39:58 Hah, gutted :P Jan 18 11:41:44 Setting up libqt4-gui-dbg (4.7.0~git20100909-0maemo1+0m5) ... Jan 18 11:41:44 real 1m21.591s Jan 18 11:41:53 1m21s isn't that bad, considering it's 109MBs Jan 18 11:43:41 alterego, when installing -dbg packages, shouldn't running the app in gdb be enough? Jan 18 11:45:17 yeah Jan 18 11:45:28 (gdb) bt Jan 18 11:45:29 #0 0x407d41a8 in ?? () from /usr/lib/libQtGui.so.4 Jan 18 11:45:29 #1 0x407d41a8 in ?? () from /usr/lib/libQtGui.so.4 Jan 18 11:45:29 Backtrace stopped: previous frame identical to this frame (corrupt stack?) Jan 18 11:45:30 :P Jan 18 11:45:56 I dunno, I'm not that great with gdb to be honest :P Jan 18 11:46:01 hmm Jan 18 11:46:23 neither am I, Qt creator's debugger ftw Jan 18 11:46:24 any option to test the hardware of the N900? i have randrom crashes and cannot explain it to me Jan 18 11:46:32 memtest or so?! Jan 18 11:46:48 overclocked? Jan 18 11:47:00 nope Jan 18 11:47:11 ThreeM: what sort of crashes? Jan 18 11:47:15 yesterday i faleshed the stock firmware again to prevent it Jan 18 11:47:36 nokia logo apperas and hildon desktop is loading (4 animated dots) Jan 18 11:48:40 sometimes on mp3 playack happen. sometimes when i move to anoter desktop Jan 18 11:48:52 mean, i cannot repoduce the crash Jan 18 11:49:53 you mean it reboots? Jan 18 11:50:01 yes Jan 18 11:50:01 Funny, Qt coding competition, port your Qt app to MeeGo or Symbian to win cash blah Jan 18 11:50:15 There's apps in there that were written for mobile from scratch, maybe I should enter Columbus Jan 18 11:50:18 LOL Jan 18 11:50:21 but the device dont ask fo pincode again. just restart Jan 18 11:50:42 Also, how are they targetting MeeGo Handset when there's nothing proper to target yet :D Jan 18 11:50:59 cat /proc/bootreason when it happens Jan 18 11:51:36 olny one entry: 32wd to Jan 18 11:51:37 alterego, they expect you to have leaks duh Jan 18 11:51:57 alterego: meego handset 1.1 is released, no? ;) Jan 18 11:52:02 that's the watchdog Jan 18 11:52:11 Yes Jan 18 11:52:16 Not exactly the point, Jan 18 11:52:24 ahem Jan 18 11:52:28 it sucks :) Jan 18 11:52:39 We don't have Qt Components and Qt doesn't have a meego theming backend. Jan 18 11:53:08 In theory this wouldn't effect an app that used it's own custom widgets, but for things like menubars etc. Jan 18 11:53:14 What do they expect us to dop. Jan 18 11:53:22 MohammadAG Watchdog = the deamon to log reboots? Jan 18 11:53:29 no Jan 18 11:53:38 it's a hardware watchdog Jan 18 11:53:55 if you're on PR1.3 and it happens Jan 18 11:54:06 I suggest getting a replacement Jan 18 11:54:16 for the device? Jan 18 11:54:22 yes Jan 18 11:54:25 damn Jan 18 11:54:35 it's the CPU Jan 18 11:54:56 sure you never OC'd to some ridiculously large number? Jan 18 11:55:10 I wonder if they'll accept a Maemo application as an entry that is written in Qt Jan 18 11:55:24 With the promise, I promise to port it to MeeGo when it becomes viable :D Jan 18 11:55:25 of course they will Jan 18 11:55:25 never touched the hardware. stock clocktime, nothing overclocked Jan 18 11:55:47 I'd vote for columbus :) Jan 18 11:57:06 alterego: supposedly they should just work (TM) Jan 18 11:57:13 Also, the runner up prizes are N900s Jan 18 11:57:17 Which seems odd. Jan 18 11:57:26 hmm, I need one of those, perhaps I should put mBarcode in :) Jan 18 11:57:37 But if Quim is going to take an age replying to my email, it might be a good solution ;) Jan 18 11:57:37 i wonder if fmms qualifies? Jan 18 11:57:56 need a new n900, this one is flimsy :< Jan 18 11:57:59 it's not Qt :P Jan 18 11:58:05 fmms certainly should! Jan 18 11:58:11 frals: probably, but they say MeeGo/Symbian and fMMS is only useful on Maemo really :P Jan 18 11:58:17 ah doh, needs to be Qt... Jan 18 11:58:22 Yes, needs to be Qt Jan 18 11:58:36 you could always rewrite it and hope for faster startup time :P Jan 18 11:58:39 should maybe do a QML UI Jan 18 11:58:42 yeah... no Jan 18 11:58:46 lol Jan 18 11:58:58 i read something iabout pyqt and qml working nicely Jan 18 11:59:03 but maybe that waas just me dreaming? Jan 18 11:59:19 QML = loss of consistency in the UI :/ Jan 18 11:59:32 QML = supermeganice to write ui in Jan 18 11:59:32 (OS & app) Jan 18 12:00:24 frals: depends what nicely means. Jan 18 12:00:39 frals: probably nice to code, but startup times for PyQt are horrendous. Jan 18 12:00:57 doh :) Jan 18 12:01:33 hell everybody Jan 18 12:01:48 indeed Jan 18 12:01:56 I'd stay away from PyQt :P Jan 18 12:02:19 * MohammadAG ponders a C/GTK fMMS UI Jan 18 12:02:35 can anybody help me plz ? Jan 18 12:02:44 ~ask Jan 18 12:02:45 Questions in the channel should be specific, informative, complete, concise, and on-topic. Don't ask if you can ask a question first. Don't ask if a person is there; just ask what you intended to ask them. Better questions more frequently yield better answers. We are all here voluntarily or against our will. Jan 18 12:03:01 MohammadAG: unfortunately the UI is coupled to lower layers of the stack atm Jan 18 12:03:14 i was planning to decouple it for real so i could write a qt ui but well Jan 18 12:03:16 nice sentence at the end there infobot Jan 18 12:03:28 i got a paying job instead and havent had time since :P Jan 18 12:03:32 frals, you're here against your will then? :P Jan 18 12:03:40 "We are all here voluntarily or against our will." :P Jan 18 12:03:41 i am trying us sflphon with tls Jan 18 12:03:54 but after tls setting it just crash Jan 18 12:03:58 ? Jan 18 12:03:58 MohammadAG: yeah, damn irssi autojoins here on connect still Jan 18 12:04:00 ;-) Jan 18 12:04:20 :P Jan 18 12:04:41 reminds me of an efnet(?) channel, I think it was #itsatrap Jan 18 12:04:49 you can't /part it Jan 18 12:05:42 is it configurable on n900 with maemo5 ? Jan 18 12:12:38 is what configurable? Jan 18 12:12:53 hmm Jan 18 12:13:04 does sflphon not give you any output in the terminal? Jan 18 12:13:10 * MohammadAG wonders how to convert seconds to minutes with a XX:XX output Jan 18 12:13:23 61 = 1:01 etc Jan 18 12:13:29 01:01 actually Jan 18 12:13:51 mod Jan 18 12:14:11 Mohammad: Minutes = round(origSeconds /60); Seconds = origSeconds-(Minutes*60) Jan 18 12:14:23 MohammadAG: QTime has functions for that. Jan 18 12:14:36 alterego, that's for current time no? Jan 18 12:14:36 does round default to floor? Jan 18 12:14:43 MohammadAG: nope. Jan 18 12:14:44 Oh, wait. Jan 18 12:14:45 RobbieThe1st, hmm Jan 18 12:14:48 Yea, floor is what I want Jan 18 12:15:09 ffs Jan 18 12:15:17 I googled QTime and got forwarded to apple.com Jan 18 12:15:39 I've been using that for day/hour/minute/second output by doing that once for each output - Day=86400 seconds, Hour = 3600, Minute = 60 etc.. Jan 18 12:16:25 QTime t(0, 0); t.addSecs(60 * 61); t.toString("hh:mm"); Jan 18 12:16:46 lardman:sflphone for maemo5 Jan 18 12:16:57 no Jan 18 12:17:01 whichever version you're talking about Jan 18 12:17:06 its works fine without tls Jan 18 12:17:21 I'm assuming hh:mm is just a format and doesn't matter even if I'm using mm:ss? Jan 18 12:17:25 I understand, what do you get if you start it from the term? Jan 18 12:17:26 but after setting tls and certificates , it just crashed on next startup Jan 18 12:17:32 MohammadAG: exactly. Jan 18 12:17:47 and what's with the 60*61? :P Jan 18 12:18:28 didn't tried , starting from terminal Jan 18 12:18:32 let me try Jan 18 12:18:46 * MohammadAG tests Jan 18 12:20:03 I hate how the device suffocates when it receives a call Jan 18 12:20:10 yea Jan 18 12:20:16 yeah Jan 18 12:20:21 its pretty annoying Jan 18 12:20:22 esp if the call comes in while HAM is doing something ;) Jan 18 12:20:24 but a regular reboot fixes it Jan 18 12:20:39 nice thing is i get a few seconds response time before it starts making noise ;D Jan 18 12:20:42 isn't every 4h regular? Jan 18 12:20:52 sounds regular enough Jan 18 12:20:58 and you are still getting hiccups? Jan 18 12:21:24 I think something's wrong with my device Jan 18 12:22:31 hmm Jan 18 12:23:55 Hi all, sorry for a flamebait, but it's meant honestly: are there any hints how open MeeGo will be?? Jan 18 12:24:45 Interesting, is AGPS still working for everyone? Jan 18 12:24:59 edheldil: ask in #meego Jan 18 12:25:59 QTime t(0, 0); Jan 18 12:26:00 t.addSecs(position); Jan 18 12:26:00 ui->currentPositionLabel->setText(t.toString("hh:mm")); Jan 18 12:26:02 shouldn't that work fine? Jan 18 12:26:07 edheldil: more so than Maemo Jan 18 12:26:12 well, since my friend (I too, but $$$ ..) is considering buying n900 with Maemo, I deem it appropriate here as well :) Jan 18 12:26:23 MohammadAG: what isnt working? Jan 18 12:26:30 I always get 00:00 Jan 18 12:26:41 hmm, I'd probably wait as the N900 won't meet the Meego requirements re memory Jan 18 12:27:05 lardman: ? Jan 18 12:27:06 it should run, but one won't get official support Jan 18 12:27:11 is the snippet you pasted actually executed at some point? ;o Jan 18 12:27:13 lardman: works fine what are you taking about? :P Jan 18 12:27:20 alterego: Meego? Jan 18 12:27:23 frals, every 1s Jan 18 12:27:25 Did you hear that Jan 18 12:27:25 lardman: yeah :P Jan 18 12:27:30 Can of worms opening Jan 18 12:27:53 well my N900 is broken, so perhaps it's all fixed now...? Jan 18 12:27:55 alterego, technically the N900 no longer is compatible with the official requirements for MeeGo Jan 18 12:27:56 Let me just say that the N900 - even with Maemo - Is an -excellent- device. A few tweaks, and it will run -very- nicely, loads of performance and good Debian-based apps. Jan 18 12:27:57 MohammadAG: sorry, addSecs returns a new QTime Jan 18 12:28:09 ah Jan 18 12:28:25 t = t.addSecs() should do Jan 18 12:28:29 RobbieThe1st: it's a good device, but I would personally wait, that's all Jan 18 12:28:31 Yes Jan 18 12:28:49 I wouldn't, if you can afford it, get it! :D Jan 18 12:28:53 I mean... Any device that can handle -me- disassembling it and reassembling it more than once without breaking gets my vote. Jan 18 12:29:01 The new device is at least 1/2 a year away imo Jan 18 12:29:06 RobbieThe1st: yes, that's the reason I love it. But the sad fact is that from a commercial development viewpoint it's a dead platform :((( Jan 18 12:29:15 That doesn't really mean it won't run though, even if it isn't compatible with the official requirements Jan 18 12:29:22 edheldil: who cares about commercial development? :P Jan 18 12:29:26 You've got us :D Jan 18 12:29:27 ^^ Jan 18 12:29:35 alterego, lol :P Jan 18 12:29:53 As we speak developers are working right now on apps for your beloved N900 Jan 18 12:29:59 Also, write your app in PyQt, and you'll have a nice portable app. Jan 18 12:30:00 I am for one, I know MohammadAG is. Jan 18 12:30:12 But last I checked we were the only two active Maemo developers (jk) Jan 18 12:30:30 [Desperation sets in] Jan 18 12:30:40 alterego, weren't we? Jan 18 12:30:44 actually Jan 18 12:30:49 isn't the dev count under 15? Jan 18 12:30:55 Dunno Jan 18 12:31:02 active devs that is Jan 18 12:31:03 Depends on who you consider a developer Jan 18 12:31:10 There are a few active devs. Jan 18 12:31:15 Who are still releasing apps. Jan 18 12:31:23 the only 2 devs, but OS or app devs? Jan 18 12:31:24 I was, until my N900 broke Jan 18 12:31:25 I don't consider an overclocking script or an aircracking script an app :P Jan 18 12:31:30 RobbieThe1st: people that are still releasing projects. Jan 18 12:31:34 there are no OS devs :p Jan 18 12:31:47 for M5 at least Jan 18 12:32:07 Actually, there still are devs in Nokia working on M5 OS stuff Jan 18 12:32:18 alterego: there are? Jan 18 12:32:23 So I heard. Jan 18 12:32:25 well, the author of Dorian has released new update only recently Jan 18 12:32:31 Well, I mean... I'm -technically- a dev, having released my own script/app which is in extras-devel. But I'm doing it for fun, not for money(etc) Jan 18 12:32:34 Though nothing official so don't quote me :P Jan 18 12:32:59 RobbieThe1st, alterego and MohammadAG haven't released/done anything for money yet either Jan 18 12:33:02 i think ovi suite is for windows too Jan 18 12:33:02 I'm not doing anything for money :P Jan 18 12:33:10 No one has the balls enough Jan 18 12:33:18 I'm doing it for fame and glory Jan 18 12:33:22 MohammadAG: lucky, I have to work :) Jan 18 12:33:23 And chicks Jan 18 12:33:23 Termana, that'll be $100 Jan 18 12:33:28 :P Jan 18 12:33:30 :p Jan 18 12:33:30 alterego, wrong platform Jan 18 12:33:35 * lardman does it for the pleasure of making something useulf Jan 18 12:33:37 There is a thread: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=33974 Jan 18 12:33:42 please? $50 over IRC? Jan 18 12:33:42 Rubbish, the N900 has more sex appeal than an iPhone :P Jan 18 12:33:54 I see chicks checking me and my N900 out all the time. Jan 18 12:33:57 yeah, you can echo 255 into sysfs to start a vibrator Jan 18 12:34:04 XD Jan 18 12:34:08 alterego, plus, it's 100x easier getting into the Top 10 apps Jan 18 12:34:09 (it has probably been invaded by lemmings by now, but anyway) Jan 18 12:34:12 Either that or they're thinking, "He's to cheap for an iPhone, maybe that's why he's getting the bus everywhere" Jan 18 12:34:37 alterego, lol some people think I don't have an iPhone cause it's expensive Jan 18 12:34:44 Heh Jan 18 12:34:48 alterego: Not metrosexual enough to own an iPhone! Jan 18 12:34:57 given that, the N900 did cost me 800 bucks... Jan 18 12:35:04 OMG Jan 18 12:35:10 .IL taxes? Jan 18 12:35:13 RST38h: kind of, I guess I'm to hetro for Steve Jobs. Jan 18 12:35:17 yes Jan 18 12:35:21 tax was 34% Jan 18 12:35:25 I want "Steve Jobs" to be a verb. Jan 18 12:35:28 ouch Jan 18 12:35:33 I was optimistic to think they'd count it as a computer :P Jan 18 12:35:37 MohammadAG: 800USD? Jan 18 12:35:39 Heh; the only person I actually showed my N900 too simply shook his head and said "Devices these days...." when I pulled up a webpage, zoomed in on one part, and showed it to him. Jan 18 12:35:42 yes frals Jan 18 12:35:45 payed 600€ for mine thou Jan 18 12:35:46 just to pop several pushed stack frames, is MeeGo going to be open, compared to Maemo? Jan 18 12:35:46 Or "Steve Job", I don't want a "Steve Job" Jan 18 12:35:53 PCs have a 17% tax, mobiles have a 34% one Jan 18 12:36:02 edheldil: yes, much more open, though still with a few closed areas. Jan 18 12:36:04 frals, from amazon.com, it was 530 bucks I think Jan 18 12:36:07 Mohammad: + the VAT, right? Jan 18 12:36:09 the rest was for the government Jan 18 12:36:17 yes Jan 18 12:36:18 600€ from nokia.se ;( Jan 18 12:36:27 you didn't pay tax frals :p Jan 18 12:36:38 I'm just glad I paid $315 shipped...(Used, admittedly) Jan 18 12:36:39 lardman:its failing Jan 18 12:36:52 I got my one for $600 AUD Jan 18 12:36:52 saying Error: org.sflphone.gtk Jan 18 12:36:59 Now they are $350 AUD on Amazon Jan 18 12:37:01 (new) Jan 18 12:37:01 do I get to call myself a dev if I am working on cell broadcast support? :P Jan 18 12:37:06 EsEhAr: pastebin the output Jan 18 12:37:09 edheldil: and a few unknowns at the moment, as a vendor can in theory release a very "closed" device, but all the OS middleware has to be compatible with official meego APIs so there's nothing stopping you from implementing replacements for anything, and the meego community (edition) is completely FOSS except for a few closed device drivers. Jan 18 12:37:10 ~pastebin Jan 18 12:37:10 BTW, anyone knows if 3G will work if only one of two frequencies is supported by the provider? Jan 18 12:37:10 [~pastebin] A "pastebin" is a web-based service where you should paste anything over 3 lines so you don't flood the channel. Here are links to a few : http://www.pastebin.com , http://pastebin.ca , http://channels.debian.net/paste , http://paste.lisp.org , http://bin.cakephp.org/ , http://asterisk.pastey.net/ , or install pastebinit with yum or aptitude. Jan 18 12:37:18 jonwil, yes, you seem here to stay :p Jan 18 12:37:20 jonwil, no, you get to call yourself a crazy man Jan 18 12:37:26 I.e. 2100MHz supported but not the second frequency (1700 or 1900) Jan 18 12:37:26 that too Jan 18 12:37:46 bbiafm Jan 18 12:38:08 RST38h, of course Jan 18 12:38:50 Having just spent $500 on my new N900, I dont plan on buying another phone anytime soon. So I intend to stay here for quite a while doing software dev for this beast :P Jan 18 12:38:54 I.e. one band is enough? Jan 18 12:39:00 RST38h, yes Jan 18 12:39:12 thank you for the info. Jan 18 12:39:48 I just wish I had the ARM assembly and linux-eabi knowledge to reverse engineer stuff :( Jan 18 12:39:56 I suppose I was considering it only as a piece of hw rather than a phone to be used, I guess I might well buy one to use day to day as Android is really annoying Jan 18 12:40:03 sometimes, I feel like introducing the N900 to a brick wall Jan 18 12:40:09 jonwil: what are you using atm? Jan 18 12:40:23 Alternatives are still worse. Jan 18 12:40:29 What do you mean what am I using? My N900 is my primary phone. Jan 18 12:40:42 no I mean to reverse engineer Jan 18 12:40:44 MohammadAG, you could make it a part of a wall Jan 18 12:40:45 objdump? Jan 18 12:40:50 IDA is what I have Jan 18 12:40:58 IDA is nice Jan 18 12:41:03 although I wish I had the fancy new $$$$$$$$$$ ARM decompiler tool Jan 18 12:41:06 MohammadAG, Brick vs N900 - makes no difference to the wall Jan 18 12:41:26 there was a piece of Python code which would convert into pseudo code to interface with that Jan 18 12:41:47 or rather would interface with IDA and convert the assembly into pseudo code Jan 18 12:41:58 Termana, I want a new N900 in the shower, care to donate one? Jan 18 12:42:34 MohammadAG, just hold on a second while I go grab some money off my money tree that's growing out the back Jan 18 12:43:14 * lardman wonders what that code was called, had something to do with swimming I thought Jan 18 12:43:16 get me a money seed Jan 18 12:45:15 lardman, ever worked with mafw? Jan 18 12:47:44 * MohammadAG wonders how to get song length Jan 18 12:52:41 MohammadAG: nope Jan 18 12:52:44 MohammadAG: Check gpodder source. Jan 18 12:53:12 mmmm, bacon roll for lunch Jan 18 12:53:54 X-Fade, isn't that python? Jan 18 12:54:12 MohammadAG: Yes, but functions should be the same? Jan 18 12:54:52 800$? Hell, I paid 620EUR Jan 18 12:56:02 I still paid more, given the exchange rate at that time :P Jan 18 12:56:09 X-Fade, true that Jan 18 12:57:22 MohammadAG: mafw.py :) it's all d-bus, so you could just "translate" it into whatever dbus binding you use Jan 18 12:57:42 I'm using mafw headers :P Jan 18 12:58:43 MohammadAG: on metadata changed signal with "duration" as key Jan 18 12:59:03 oh so it's part of duration Jan 18 12:59:05 cool :D Jan 18 12:59:08 thanks Jan 18 12:59:18 s/duration/metadata-changed Jan 18 12:59:27 * MohammadAG slaps self, 5 hours of sleep don't do well Jan 18 12:59:43 MohammadAG: next h-e-n gui needs a donate button in the menu ;-) Jan 18 13:00:12 btw 5h are just enough Jan 18 13:04:51 * MohammadAG reboots N900, practically unusable Jan 18 13:06:09 jonwil: so anyway, what problems do you have with IDA Pro? Jan 18 13:06:20 lardman: this is the output Jan 18 13:06:24 1. Jan 18 13:06:26 SFLphone 0.9.7 Jan 18 13:06:26 nothing, its a great disassembler Jan 18 13:06:27 2. Jan 18 13:06:29 Copyright (c) 2005 2006 2007 2008 2009 Savoir-faire Linux Inc. Jan 18 13:06:30 3. Jan 18 13:06:32 This is free software. You may redistribute copies of it under the terms of Jan 18 13:06:33 4. Jan 18 13:06:35 the GNU General Public License Version 3 . Jan 18 13:06:35 EsEhAr: no! Jan 18 13:06:35 :/ Jan 18 13:06:36 5. Jan 18 13:06:38 There is NO WARRANTY, to the extent permitted by law. Jan 18 13:06:39 6. Jan 18 13:06:41 Jan 18 13:06:42 NO NO! Jan 18 13:06:42 7. Jan 18 13:06:44 [stdout] ERROR org.sflphone.gtk - Failed to call register() on instanceProxy: Message did not receive a reply (timeout by message bus) Jan 18 13:06:45 8. Jan 18 13:06:47 [stdout] ERROR org.sflphone.gtk - Error while calling get_account_list: Message did not receive a reply (timeout by message bus) Jan 18 13:06:47 lardman, too late Jan 18 13:06:48 9. Jan 18 13:06:50 [stdout] ERROR org.sflphone.gtk - Error while calling get_ip2_ip_details: Message did not receive a reply (timeout by message bus) Jan 18 13:06:51 10. Jan 18 13:06:53 [stdout] ERROR org.sflphone.gtk - Failed to call get_codec_list() on ConfigurationManager: Message did not receive a reply (timeout by message bus) Jan 18 13:06:54 DocScrutinizer51, quiet ^ Jan 18 13:06:54 11. Jan 18 13:06:56 [stdout] ERROR org.sflphone.gtk - Failed to call get_active_codec_list() on ConfigurationManager: Message did not receive a reply (timeout by message bus) Jan 18 13:06:57 12. Jan 18 13:06:59 [stdout] ERROR org.sflphone.gtk - Error while calling get_account_list: Message did not receive a reply (timeout by message bus) Jan 18 13:07:00 13. Jan 18 13:07:01 or kick :) Jan 18 13:07:02 [stdout] ERROR org.sflphone.gtk - Error while calling get_ip2_ip_details: Message did not receive a reply (timeout by message bus) Jan 18 13:07:03 14. Jan 18 13:07:05 [stdout] ERROR org.sflphone.gtk - Error while calling get_account_list: Message did not receive a reply (timeout by message bus) Jan 18 13:07:06 15. Jan 18 13:07:08 [stdout] ERROR org.sflphone.gtk - Error while calling get_ip2_ip_details: Message did not receive a reply (timeout by message bus) Jan 18 13:07:09 16. Jan 18 13:07:11 [stdout] ERROR org.sflphone.gtk - Error while calling get_account_list: Message did not receive a reply (timeout by message bus) Jan 18 13:07:12 17. Jan 18 13:07:13 O_O Jan 18 13:07:14 [stdout] ERROR org.sflphone.gtk - Error while calling get_ip2_ip_details: Message did not receive a reply (timeout by message bus) Jan 18 13:07:15 18. Jan 18 13:07:17 this channel needs more ops Jan 18 13:07:17 [stdout] ERROR org.sflphone.gtk - Error while calling get_account_list: Message did not receive a reply (timeout by message bus) Jan 18 13:07:18 19. Jan 18 13:07:20 [stdout] ERROR org.sflphone.gtk - Error while calling get_ip2_ip_details: Message did not receive a reply (timeout by message bus) Jan 18 13:07:21 20. Jan 18 13:07:23 [stdout] ERROR org.sflphone.gtk - Error while calling get_account_list: Message did not receive a reply (timeout by message bus) Jan 18 13:07:25 * Robot101 would volunteer... Jan 18 13:07:26 21. Jan 18 13:07:26 dude, quit Jan 18 13:07:26 [stdout] ERROR org.sflphone.gtk - Error while calling get_ip2_ip_details: Message did not receive a reply (timeout by message bus) Jan 18 13:07:27 22. Jan 18 13:07:29 [stdout] ERROR org.sflphone.gtk - Error while calling get_account_list: Message did not receive a reply (timeout by message bus) Jan 18 13:07:30 * alterego too Jan 18 13:07:30 23. Jan 18 13:07:32 [stdout] ERROR org.sflphone.gtk - Error while calling get_ip2_ip_details: Message did not receive a reply (timeout by message bus) Jan 18 13:07:33 who has ops? DocScrutinizer51? Jan 18 13:07:33 24. Jan 18 13:07:35 [stdout] ERROR org.sflphone.gtk - Error while calling get_account_list: Message did not receive a reply (timeout by message bus) Jan 18 13:07:35 * MohammadAG would request Jan 18 13:07:37 25. Jan 18 13:07:38 EsEhAr: STOP IT°!!! Jan 18 13:07:39 [stdout] ERROR org.sflphone.gtk - Error while calling get_ip2_ip_details: Message did not receive a reply (timeout by message bus) Jan 18 13:07:40 DocScrutinizer, DocScrutinizer51 ! Jan 18 13:07:40 26. Jan 18 13:07:42 [stdout] ERROR org.sflphone.gtk - Error while calling get_account_list: Message did not receive a reply (timeout by message bus) Jan 18 13:07:44 DocScrutinizer: just +q him Jan 18 13:07:44 27. Jan 18 13:07:44 [stdout] ERROR org.sflphone.gtk - Error while calling get_ip2_ip_details: Message did not receive a reply (timeout by message bus) Jan 18 13:07:46 28. Jan 18 13:07:46 DocScrutinizer, he can't, started paste Jan 18 13:07:48 [stdout] ERROR org.sflphone.gtk - Error while calling get_account_list: Message did not receive a reply (timeout by message bus) Jan 18 13:07:49 29. Jan 18 13:07:50 [stdout] ERROR org.sflphone.gtk - Error while calling get_ip2_ip_details: Message did not receive a reply (timeout by message bus) Jan 18 13:07:52 30. Jan 18 13:07:52 EsEhAr: I specifically said to pastebin the output Jan 18 13:07:54 [stdout] ERROR org.sflphone.gtk - Error while calling get_account_list: Message did not receive a reply (timeout by message bus) Jan 18 13:07:55 31. Jan 18 13:07:57 [stdout] ERROR org.sflphone.gtk - Error while calling get_ip2_ip_details: Message did not receive a reply (timeout by message bus) Jan 18 13:07:58 32. Jan 18 13:07:59 [stdout] ERROR org.sflphone.gtk - Error while calling get_account_list: Message did not receive a reply (timeout by message bus) Jan 18 13:08:01 nothing wrong with IDA other than the fact that I cant afford the version with the ARM decompiler Jan 18 13:08:01 33. Jan 18 13:08:03 [stdout] ERROR org.sflphone.gtk - Error while calling get_ip2_ip_details: Message did not receive a reply (timeout by message bus) Jan 18 13:08:04 34. Jan 18 13:08:05 dude Jan 18 13:08:06 [stdout] ERROR org.sflphone.gtk - Error while calling get_account_list: Message did not receive a reply (timeout by message bus) Jan 18 13:08:06 +q Jan 18 13:08:07 35. Jan 18 13:08:09 [stdout] ERROR org.sflphone.gtk - Error while calling get_ip2_ip_details: Message did not receive a reply (timeout by message bus) Jan 18 13:08:10 36. Jan 18 13:08:11 jonwil: ah I see Jan 18 13:08:12 DocScrutinizer: its not +m, you can't -v him Jan 18 13:08:12 [stdout] ERROR org.sflphone.gtk - Error while calling get_account_list: Message did not receive a reply (timeout by message bus) Jan 18 13:08:19 thats the one Jan 18 13:08:19 :D Jan 18 13:08:20 right Jan 18 13:08:24 Heh Jan 18 13:08:29 phew, thanks chaps Jan 18 13:08:36 lardman, he did pastebin Jan 18 13:08:37 WTF! Jan 18 13:08:42 then he copied the paste from pastebin Jan 18 13:08:46 lol Jan 18 13:08:49 fail concept of pastebin Jan 18 13:08:50 :D Jan 18 13:08:56 that's why there are line numbers Jan 18 13:09:03 Still no closer to understanding the blackbox that is the csd daemon :P Jan 18 13:09:15 jonwil, channel logs won't help Jan 18 13:09:18 ;) Jan 18 13:09:43 Morning everyone ! Jan 18 13:09:46 btw I knew it's +q, but I didn't know what konversation meant with context menu "unvoice" Jan 18 13:10:02 lol Jan 18 13:10:07 Hero of the day: jonwil, for finding meego-mce sources <<< huhu nice Jan 18 13:10:13 yeah that was me Jan 18 13:10:26 There is now an open bug asking for the Fremantle MCE sources Jan 18 13:10:31 no response from anyone yet though Jan 18 13:10:31 :) Jan 18 13:10:34 the day's over, pleas leave now, you're no longer our hero Jan 18 13:10:43 next hero please Jan 18 13:10:46 jonwil: that will take weeks at least Jan 18 13:10:46 :P Jan 18 13:10:58 s/weeks/decades/ Jan 18 13:11:14 jonwil: will takes month ... time to be upscale to lawyer ... and go down Jan 18 13:11:38 no hero for the day? pfft Jan 18 13:11:39 * jonwil puts "corporate lawyers" on the list of things that should never have been invented Jan 18 13:12:11 I wonder if EsEhAr is quiet now Jan 18 13:12:17 i.e stopped pasting Jan 18 13:12:26 or send them to another planet, just before the big space goose is eating the earth Jan 18 13:13:05 http://pastebin.com/Se17YgpU Jan 18 13:13:14 lardman, see? that's the paste P Jan 18 13:13:17 :P* Jan 18 13:13:35 EsEhAr, you're supposed to copy the link, not the contents Jan 18 13:14:13 anyways, I think he's done pasting Jan 18 13:14:29 hmm, not very enlightening those error messages Jan 18 13:15:10 MohammadAG: btw, before I close mafw.py -> there's also "is-seekable" that gets sent as metadata when the string is seekable (at this point, the client app can send seek requests, e.g. from the slider) Jan 18 13:15:34 EsEhAr: no idea, I'd grab the source and see if you can track back to work out where the error is generated Jan 18 13:15:53 thp, seen that, no idea how to handle it with the current mafw C++ class Jan 18 13:16:49 MohammadAG: if the user wants to seek, and is-seekable is false, wait a bit until is-seekable turns to true Jan 18 13:17:06 (and while is-seekable is true, you can seek directly) Jan 18 13:17:18 yeah, but I mean, how do I check if it's seekable with the class I have Jan 18 13:17:21 need to read it more Jan 18 13:21:21 wolle mer ne reilasse? Jan 18 13:23:24 EsEhAr: ulimit pastelines soft: 3, hard: 6 Jan 18 13:23:27 I would hgave just kicked him .. Jan 18 13:23:58 I would've glined, but he's not on our server :P Jan 18 13:24:21 meh. be nice to noobs Jan 18 13:25:08 he didn't paste a URL to his livecam ;-D Jan 18 13:25:59 Robot101: any comments to bug 8347 ? Jan 18 13:26:02 Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/8347 Cell Broadcast Feature not available Jan 18 13:26:17 Robot101: esp regarding telepathy Jan 18 13:27:21 am not sure it fits for telepathy tbh Jan 18 13:27:38 Robot101: who's doing SMS-PP ? Jan 18 13:28:12 SMS-CB is mostly identical Jan 18 13:29:10 what is SMS-PP? I don't speak cellular very well Jan 18 13:29:24 http://meego.gitorious.org/meego-cellular/telepathy-ring (the oFono port) is open Jan 18 13:30:03 Robot101: ShortMessageService-Point2Point (the usual well known SMS) Jan 18 13:30:24 are there other sms services? Jan 18 13:30:33 SMS-CB Jan 18 13:30:36 yeah, sms-cb Jan 18 13:30:57 well - yes :) Jan 18 13:30:58 Point2Many Jan 18 13:31:30 they are rather similar, in protocol and way to handle them Jan 18 13:32:26 esp normal SMS-CB as well should be dealt with by conversation app Jan 18 13:32:47 one thread per CBChannel Jan 18 13:33:45 * DocScrutinizer wonders idly if maemo already deals correctly with SMS-PP that have popup flag set Jan 18 13:37:07 DocScrutinizer, any idea whether ofono supports these features or are in the roadmap> Jan 18 13:37:17 ie the current codebase Jan 18 13:37:21 jonwil says they do Jan 18 13:37:30 aiui Jan 18 13:37:30 There is code in ofono that claims to support Cell Broadcast Jan 18 13:37:31 DocScrutinizer: unlikely it'll support PP :P Jan 18 13:38:25 n900.c calls ofono_cbs_create Jan 18 13:38:25 lcuk: so do you know who's involved in processing 'regular' SMS, in maemo? Jan 18 13:38:38 DocScrutinizer: in maemo, it's csd -> telepathy-ring Jan 18 13:38:40 closed, closed Jan 18 13:38:46 in meego, it's ofono -> telepathy-ring Jan 18 13:38:47 yes Jan 18 13:38:48 open, open Jan 18 13:39:07 telepathy ring isn't closed .. Jan 18 13:39:13 the csd one is Jan 18 13:39:16 the ofono one is open Jan 18 13:39:19 Robot101: the jonwil's comment on 8347 was absolutely to the point Jan 18 13:39:21 Hmm Jan 18 13:39:25 then Jan 18 13:39:31 csd implements telepathy-ring no? Jan 18 13:39:39 that means nothing Jan 18 13:39:46 in soviet russia, csd implements you? Jan 18 13:39:58 It means a lot actually. Jan 18 13:40:07 csd is a system bus daemon which talks an ISI modem protocol over a phonet kernel interface Jan 18 13:40:11 telepathy-ring is a service name. Jan 18 13:40:27 it exports a very low-level d-bus API to send/receive stuff through the cellmo Jan 18 13:40:28 Yes, and probably exposes the telepathy-ring dbus api Jan 18 13:40:34 telepathy-ring is a daemon, not an API Jan 18 13:40:37 Robot101: could you help with the *.h et al jonwil asked for in 8347? Jan 18 13:40:39 it lives on the session bus Jan 18 13:40:45 It's both Jan 18 13:40:46 and exports the telepathy API Jan 18 13:40:54 Exactly .. Jan 18 13:40:57 IMO the "right" way to do this is to produce a CSD plugin for cbsms Jan 18 13:41:05 or to add cbsms support to csd-sms plugin Jan 18 13:41:14 CSD has plugin support now? Jan 18 13:41:20 csd was always made of plugins Jan 18 13:41:33 and always had plugins Jan 18 13:41:34 either way, such code would talk to the cellmo via libisi (and hence to the kernel driver) Jan 18 13:41:42 I reckon use ofono, and write a csd replacement. Jan 18 13:41:52 what the 6&!^*(& Jan 18 13:42:09 ofono is a csd replacement (semantically) but will never have a compatible d-bus API Jan 18 13:42:21 Yes, my point. Jan 18 13:42:24 telepathy-ring had a lot of code deleted to port it from csd to ofono because the ofono API is much much higher level Jan 18 13:42:36 We need CSD to keep dialer et al working Jan 18 13:43:10 * SpeedEvil sighs. Jan 18 13:43:26 Anyhow, I couldn't care less about this tbh, if it's in meego .. Jan 18 13:43:29 Who cares :P Jan 18 13:43:37 unfortunately if you just want to do this in Maemo 5, ie the N900, just forget about telepathy Jan 18 13:43:42 well Jan 18 13:43:54 you could write a stub CM which went alongside tp-ring Jan 18 13:43:59 and exposed just CB channels Jan 18 13:44:07 then they would appear through normal conversation UI, etc Jan 18 13:44:10 as another "account" Jan 18 13:44:18 but really, you could just write a little UI which exposed them Jan 18 13:44:19 sounds good enough Jan 18 13:44:27 well the main thing is writing the low level bits Jan 18 13:44:27 and spoke directly to csd / plugin / whatever you do Jan 18 13:44:34 i.e. a CSD plugin Jan 18 13:44:41 in meego, what you want to do is support it in ofono and patch it into telepathy-ring Jan 18 13:44:53 meego ofono already supports it Jan 18 13:45:01 we're talking about maemo though Jan 18 13:45:04 no clue if the upper levels handle it or not Jan 18 13:45:23 meego refs just because things of maemo are more foss in meego than here Jan 18 13:45:58 For maemo we need a csd plugin. Jan 18 13:47:24 If we try and talk to the cell modem directly without going through CSD and stuff we would probably conflict with the existing CSD stuff Jan 18 13:47:47 but thats a guess based on what I see in the ofono sources and how it does things Jan 18 13:47:59 jonwil: ah, I remembered, it was something to do with swimming :) - http://svn.assembla.com/svn/daebrain/Aqualung/aqualung.py Jan 18 13:48:06 (which btw is a rather impolite and insulting behaviour, to open up maemo sources to meego, while maemo community left down) Jan 18 13:48:12 hello again to all ! I was having issues yesterday with battery. now it seems better after i logged out skyep Jan 18 13:49:25 yeah its annoying/insulting that the MeeGo repos get source code for some unknown version of the MCE daemon (even though aparently MeeGo isnt even USING MCE) yet Maemo gets nothing :( Jan 18 13:49:55 same for telepathy-ring Jan 18 13:50:12 same for PA Jan 18 13:50:33 whats PA? Jan 18 13:50:50 polypaudio, errr pulseaudio Jan 18 13:51:00 whats closed source about it in Maemo? Jan 18 13:51:11 quite some bits Jan 18 13:51:23 essential bits Jan 18 13:51:26 quite some important bits Jan 18 13:51:59 if you do not submit yourself to the evil closed source pulseaudio modules you can make your speakers stop working Jan 18 13:52:16 meego however just needs to mumble "might get difficult" and Nokia opens up all they want Jan 18 13:52:25 if(name == "is-seekable") Jan 18 13:52:25 emit static_cast(user_data)->mediaIsSeekable(true); Jan 18 13:52:28 ffs what's wrong with it Jan 18 13:52:44 and what's with the casts Jan 18 13:52:46 The only bits I can see that are closed are module-policy-enforcement, module-nokia-voice, module-nokia-record and module-nokia-music Jan 18 13:52:51 * MohammadAG pokes alterego Jan 18 13:53:07 Anyone knows how to send SMS from N900 using X-Terminal? Jan 18 13:53:07 and bluetooth I think Jan 18 13:53:07 MohammadAG: wouldn't that be strcmp() rather than == Jan 18 13:53:23 hmm Jan 18 13:53:36 My guess is that its the "module-nokia" bits that are the "important" bits being referred to Jan 18 13:53:37 or is that another overloaded shit Jan 18 13:53:41 of qt Jan 18 13:53:52 Qt* :P Jan 18 13:54:07 OkropNick: yes, see wiki Jan 18 13:54:11 and tmo Jan 18 13:54:22 DocScrutinizer: thx Jan 18 13:54:38 phonecontrol might be a start Jan 18 13:57:01 heh, something else that I just found that seems to be closed in Maemo and open in MeeGo, tone-generator Jan 18 13:57:26 that's known :-) Jan 18 13:58:07 Although like other bits, it was probably opened up because the telephony stack was now open so it is possible to open up things that talk to the telephony stack Jan 18 13:59:05 DocScrutinizer, ta, strcmp worked Jan 18 13:59:27 but yeah I see what you mean about pulseaudio, all the closed bits appear to have been opened up in MeeGo Jan 18 13:59:52 not all but a lot Jan 18 14:00:08 which bits weren't opened then? Jan 18 14:00:18 it's fsckng embarrassing Jan 18 14:00:26 xprot afaik Jan 18 14:01:09 though I guess they will open up that one as well, not to kill speakers of N900 with meego -bad publicity ;-P Jan 18 14:02:40 I think AFAIK the only closed piece required to get a booting system with MeeGo is BME Jan 18 14:02:53 yep Jan 18 14:02:55 you need BME to boot? Jan 18 14:03:08 you need it to get a usable system that wont wreck your hardware Jan 18 14:03:10 :) Jan 18 14:03:14 basically not, for the first time :-P Jan 18 14:03:19 DocScrutinizer: heh. Jan 18 14:03:49 Interesting: "please enter your paypal email address if you wish to receive donations or charge for applications Jan 18 14:04:19 you'll love to have it (or jrbme bit they seem reluctant to touch it with a 10 feet pole) when your battery runs flat and meego is your main system Jan 18 14:04:22 qt-apps.org is more like facebook .. Jan 18 14:06:29 (reluctant about jrbme) no wonder, as it's neither Nokia genuine crap nor UPSTREAM :-S Jan 18 14:07:34 lol alterego Jan 18 14:07:34 wb GeneralAntilles Jan 18 14:08:00 GeneralAntilles: what's your take on 8347? Jan 18 14:08:39 looks like my efforts may be a kickstarter towards more general discussions regarding telephony on the N900 :) Jan 18 14:08:50 yes Jan 18 14:08:51 andre__: poke about Bugzilla best practice re: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=923017#post923017 Jan 18 14:09:29 jonwil: absolutely. You made things move quite a bit during few days. Much appreciated Jan 18 14:09:50 I have a habit of comming into forums and communities and doing cool stuff :) Jan 18 14:09:52 * andre__ takes a look Jan 18 14:10:02 jonwil: hehehe Jan 18 14:10:11 jonwil: good! :-D **** BEGIN LOGGING AT Tue Jan 18 14:13:58 2011 Jan 18 14:14:09 I have lost count of the number of file formats (mostly game related) I have reverse engineered (or helped reverse engineer) in my time Jan 18 14:14:18 I hate small netsplits Jan 18 14:14:22 it's the big ones that matter Jan 18 14:14:27 :-D Jan 18 14:14:52 * lolcat reverse ingeneers jonwil Jan 18 14:15:46 I wonder how many ended in ##overflow Jan 18 14:16:00 Heh Jan 18 14:16:03 http://qt-apps.org/content/show.php?content=137559 Jan 18 14:16:07 Vote for my app plox Jan 18 14:16:09 kthxbye Jan 18 14:16:16 foff Jan 18 14:16:18 :P Jan 18 14:16:20 * DocScrutinizer kicks alterego Jan 18 14:16:20 alterego: arrgh! Jan 18 14:16:40 alterego, vote up or down? Jan 18 14:16:47 lol Jan 18 14:16:50 :) Jan 18 14:16:59 You vote up, because I'm sure DocScrutinizer will vote down :P Jan 18 14:17:11 hahahahaha, nooooway Jan 18 14:17:29 DocScrutinizer, it lacks a symlink to /usr/bin Jan 18 14:17:36 you should know me by now, I don't klick random URLs Jan 18 14:17:38 <-- uber asshole Jan 18 14:20:35 is it possible for init to start another instance of init e.g. use init in a initramfs to start init on a flash partition? Jan 18 14:20:51 I'm thinking of exec'ing the second init so that the first blocks Jan 18 14:21:52 qt-apps also has integrated donate .. Jan 18 14:22:28 DocScrutinizer: http://qt-apps.org/content/donate.php?content=137559 Jan 18 14:22:42 Donate and I'll add proper platform support for PATH and ld.so.conf Jan 18 14:22:48 * alterego chuckles Jan 18 14:23:37 * MohammadAG pokes alterego with a 10 foot pole Jan 18 14:23:51 Has it got a 100 dollar bill on the end? Jan 18 14:23:54 Otherwise I'm not interested. Jan 18 14:24:06 no, but it has a painful end Jan 18 14:24:11 * MohammadAG giggles Jan 18 14:24:17 Damnit you Jan 18 14:24:34 * lardman imagines MohammadAG is also wiggling the stick as he giggles Jan 18 14:24:46 lardman, perv Jan 18 14:24:46 :p Jan 18 14:24:49 I might write an app and sell it on there. Jan 18 14:24:56 qt-apps allows you to sell apps to btw. Jan 18 14:24:59 alterego, nah Jan 18 14:25:04 alterego, sell it on ebay Jan 18 14:25:34 sometimes, I feel Nokia rm -rf'd Maemo5's source code Jan 18 14:25:47 so that's why they're closing bugs about opening components Jan 18 14:25:56 wtf is going on .. Jan 18 14:26:07 kids + scripts = retarded IRC Jan 18 14:26:23 MohammadAG: I was thinking more along the lines of a Yari, but each to his own interpretation Jan 18 14:26:38 lardman, I know xP Jan 18 14:27:01 MohammadAG: Gitorious stuff disappearing? Jan 18 14:27:10 uh? Jan 18 14:27:17 what's wrong with IRC? Jan 18 14:27:19 nope Jan 18 14:27:25 MohammadAG: Doesnt matter :-) Jan 18 14:27:25 netsplits Jan 18 14:27:32 meh Jan 18 14:27:33 kinky Jan 18 14:27:38 indeed Jan 18 14:28:30 ho \o/ Jan 18 14:28:50 MohammadAG, have you bricked your ps3 with wanikoko's CFW btw? =) Jan 18 14:29:01 nope Jan 18 14:29:07 \o/ konqui segfailted on maps.google Jan 18 14:29:12 the scene is retarded, I'm staying away from it Jan 18 14:29:36 MohammadAG: Do you play zombies? Jan 18 14:30:19 nope Jan 18 14:31:38 hmm Jan 18 14:31:42 how do I make a lib? Jan 18 14:32:05 I could keep on including the .h files in each source but it's not practical for more than 2 sources Jan 18 14:32:17 TEMPLATE = lib Jan 18 14:32:40 look at librxsopport or libcolumbus Jan 18 14:32:51 s/sopport/support/ Jan 18 14:32:51 alterego meant: look at librxsupport or libcolumbus Jan 18 14:36:19 hah, segailted is a nice new word :-P Jan 18 14:36:24 OMG Jan 18 14:36:35 segfailted Jan 18 14:37:24 No one is voting :( Jan 18 14:37:47 you got no symlink to /usr/bin :-P Jan 18 14:37:51 can they put the app on their devices easily? Jan 18 14:38:10 form the link you specified Jan 18 14:38:18 and are people voting at maemo.org downloads? Jan 18 14:38:21 :) Jan 18 14:39:53 lcuk: it's not in downloads because it's not in extras yet. Jan 18 14:40:09 lcuk: the download link I should set to an .install file when v1 is released and in extras Jan 18 14:40:23 But there are a few little creases that need ironing out before that. Jan 18 14:40:33 :) Jan 18 14:40:34 * lcuk gets iron Jan 18 14:40:45 At the moment the download link just links to the packages page. Jan 18 14:41:06 you are not the only one alterego :) Jan 18 14:41:25 theres many apps currently not rollered from -devel onwards Jan 18 14:41:39 lcuk: in the competition? Jan 18 14:41:53 alterego, which competition? Jan 18 14:42:21 http://blog.qt.nokia.com/2010/12/23/porting-your-qt-app-to-a-phone-win/ Jan 18 14:42:26 * lardman knows the feeling of not moving on from -devel Jan 18 14:42:27 That's why I've stuck it on there :) Jan 18 14:42:47 Well, I've got my other apps into extras :P Jan 18 14:42:55 But I try to keep strict functional requirements. Jan 18 14:43:25 So I have landmark releases, I've pushed to -testing a stable version though, which leaves -devel open for more bleeding edge brokenness. Jan 18 14:43:47 lardman, yeah theres lots of hard tweaking time required Jan 18 14:44:14 lcuk: I'm pretty much ready, but can't test atm, so waiting to see what the warranty people say Jan 18 14:49:00 lardman, yeah Jan 18 14:49:20 I must check they've picked it up actually Jan 18 14:54:19 promoting system is fubar for updates Jan 18 14:56:59 otoh this got discussed ad nauseum and there seems to be no general solution to the problem. Only devel knows (or should know) if the fixes applied might have major impact or not, and voting is all about supervising the devels Jan 18 14:57:26 what's a unit32 in C? Jan 18 14:57:44 an unsigned 32bit integer Jan 18 14:58:06 0..2^32 Jan 18 14:58:59 ( -1 ) Jan 18 15:00:25 unsigned nokia internet tablet 32bit actually Jan 18 15:00:46 DocScrutinizer, I think, means means a _uint32_ Jan 18 15:03:35 ooh, my bad Jan 18 15:07:15 umm Jan 18 15:07:19 dbus-send --print-reply --type=method_call --dest=com.nokia.mafw.renderer.Mafw-Gst-Renderer-Plugin.gstrenderer /com/nokia/mafw/renderer/gstrenderer com.nokia.mafw.extension.get_extension_property string:volume Jan 18 15:07:24 can someone try that? Jan 18 15:07:49 * alterego has a funny idea, Jan 18 15:07:59 I could implement taht steam wankers applications and charge him for it. Jan 18 15:08:04 Well, charge for the application. Jan 18 15:08:30 don't use steam, so sure, why not Jan 18 15:08:40 Yeah, I don't use it either. Jan 18 15:08:42 but I get 70% for coming up with the idea Jan 18 15:08:52 I use steam, but not the chat thing Jan 18 15:09:09 It's not chat he wants, he wants a widget/app to monitor his statistics. Jan 18 15:09:17 someone's presumably reversed the protocol for an iPhone app, so go for it Jan 18 15:09:20 you might be thinking I didn't come up with the idea Jan 18 15:09:21 oh right Jan 18 15:09:21 And find out if his mates are currently playing and what/where they are playing. Jan 18 15:09:36 but if I wasn't here, who knows how the fabric of time would've went Jan 18 15:09:37 same difference really Jan 18 15:09:45 I can't be arsed with implementing chat. Jan 18 15:09:46 isnt that info available from the steamcommunty user page? Jan 18 15:09:53 I thought so Jan 18 15:09:55 But if I did it'd be a telepathy plugin obviously :) Jan 18 15:09:55 MohammadAG: what's that dbus cruft supposed to do? Jan 18 15:10:05 DocScrutinizer, print volume level Jan 18 15:10:10 ooh Jan 18 15:10:10 frals: http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=923047&postcount=114 Jan 18 15:10:13 perhaps wrap a html display widget in a Qt app and display that page :D Jan 18 15:10:22 Error org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.ServiceUnknown: The name com.nokia.mafw.renderer.Mafw-Gst-Renderer-Plugin.gstrenderer was not provided by any .service files Jan 18 15:10:27 think I fucked something up Jan 18 15:10:34 string "volume" Jan 18 15:10:35 variant uint32 86 Jan 18 15:10:45 then I did fuck something up Jan 18 15:10:46 * MohammadAG sighs Jan 18 15:11:41 lol alterego, 100 pounds, seriously? :P Jan 18 15:12:18 try one of the advanced dbus tools, e.g mdbus2 Jan 18 15:12:26 it has tab-completion Jan 18 15:12:34 Yup Jan 18 15:12:34 I guess it'll take acouple of hours. Jan 18 15:12:54 you should charge more per hour Jan 18 15:12:57 :) Jan 18 15:13:36 DocScrutinizer, it worked for you Jan 18 15:13:41 and probably for anyone who'd try it Jan 18 15:13:42 (I heard mdbus2 is currently broken, so dunno what's state of things for maemo) Jan 18 15:13:50 I just borked something on my device Jan 18 15:14:08 and whenever someone mentions something breaking, javispedro pops in Jan 18 15:14:14 morning javispedro Jan 18 15:14:31 * javispedro breaks MohammadAG Jan 18 15:14:36 ooh, I got it as you've replaced com.nokia.mafw.renderer.Mafw-Gst-Renderer-Plugin.gstrenderer by your own implementation Jan 18 15:14:36 moo. Jan 18 15:14:49 nope Jan 18 15:14:53 I broke it, somehow Jan 18 15:15:00 I just called watch on the dbus command Jan 18 15:15:13 MohammadAG: id Jan 18 15:16:02 MohammadAG: I've sent this as root, though I gather it's session bus Jan 18 15:16:07 so I dunno Jan 18 15:16:35 should have failed for me :-P Jan 18 15:17:05 root's not supposed to access session bus per se Jan 18 15:17:18 it would fail if you use sudo gainroot ;) Jan 18 15:17:26 yep Jan 18 15:17:57 actually I learnt that from venemo yesterday Jan 18 15:18:15 my boston script failed, as he used sudo gainroot Jan 18 15:18:22 booston Jan 18 15:18:25 not Boston Jan 18 15:19:31 that's another minor detail that needs urgently get cleaned in h-e-n Jan 18 15:19:50 and jrbme will actually clean that Jan 18 15:20:03 so the GUI can run without root priv Jan 18 15:33:29 how do I reverse a commit? Jan 18 15:35:03 MohammadAG, afaik you do not delete history, merely revert to before the bad commit and repush or some sort of combination thereof Jan 18 15:35:19 I know, that's what I'm asking Jan 18 15:35:24 there's a git reverse command or whatever Jan 18 15:35:29 so checkout the previous commit Jan 18 15:35:30 git revert I think Jan 18 15:35:39 I think you might have to rebase off the commit beforehand Jan 18 15:35:49 but I'm not a git guru Jan 18 15:37:41 git revert is enough Jan 18 15:37:51 it even auto commits :D Jan 18 15:37:52 ah I must be thinking of svn then Jan 18 15:43:23 hey Jan 18 15:43:37 I got myself a powered usb hub Jan 18 15:43:54 but didn't find a usb-to-vga adapter :( Jan 18 15:45:07 usb to vga? :-o Jan 18 15:45:34 It's called DisplayLink :P Jan 18 15:46:36 yeah, and it's a crap concept Jan 18 15:46:37 umm Jan 18 15:46:41 what's "bora" Jan 18 15:46:46 isn't that diablo Jan 18 15:47:12 and harldy an adapter in my book Jan 18 15:48:01 bora bora bora - japans 'jeronimo' of WW2 Jan 18 15:48:30 or was that banzai Jan 18 15:49:37 anyway, 8 f'ing MB TX during 7h, for nothing but HAM and IRC Jan 18 15:49:52 RX 4MB Jan 18 15:50:20 ow Jan 18 15:51:02 I guess it's time for tcpdump Jan 18 15:56:49 MohammadAG: read the code names wiki page I linked yesterday Jan 18 15:57:26 I'm just amazed bora is in debian/changelog for the fremantle vte Jan 18 15:57:33 shows how much they care about debian packaging Jan 18 15:58:00 MohammadAG: bora is some old maemo codename, I think Maemo 3.0 maybe Jan 18 15:58:18 MohammadAG: 4.0 is chinook and 4.1 is diablo Jan 18 15:58:52 Somethings don't change much :P Jan 18 15:58:53 ah right Jan 18 16:00:42 MohammadAG i installed your .deb from here http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=922360&postcount=8 it works great but i lost that ability to open keyboard and start typing and it would open contacts Jan 18 16:01:05 left/right arrows change screens tho Jan 18 16:01:51 read mhd's documentation Jan 18 16:01:52 is there a way to get that back without uninstalling the .deb? Jan 18 16:01:58 ok Jan 18 16:02:14 http://my.arava.co.il/~matan/repo/Modified_Hildon_Desktop.html Jan 18 16:02:26 Bollocks, I have to submit Columbus to Ovi to get into the competition. Jan 18 16:02:28 you SHOULD NOT uninstall system debs Jan 18 16:02:48 alterego, I'd rather stay out of the competition if that's the case, but that's just me :) Jan 18 16:03:09 10k possible prize though .. Jan 18 16:03:11 MohammadAG tnx for the tip Jan 18 16:03:19 Or an N900 for the top 5 runner ups Jan 18 16:03:45 I'd resist Jan 18 16:03:51 this is Ovi we're talking about :) Jan 18 16:04:19 Heh Jan 18 16:05:14 still waiting for my testers surprise package... Jan 18 16:09:15 Oh happy day: http://pastebin.com/bkc5hg0E Jan 18 16:19:19 jaffa: indeed! Jan 18 16:24:57 I'm going to wait for lollo to write his steam app, then I'm going to do it better. Jan 18 16:25:00 * alterego chuckles Jan 18 16:27:10 damn, UPS turned up before the office opened at work Jan 18 16:27:33 That's lame Jan 18 16:27:37 Was it your N900? :D Jan 18 16:27:42 yeah Jan 18 16:27:46 waiting to go Jan 18 16:28:19 * lardman has rescheduled for tomorrow, I do hope they turn up early as I have to invigilate an exam in the afternoon Jan 18 16:28:59 why do I get pastbin.com server not found? Jan 18 16:30:12 DocScrutinizer51: because it's pastebin.com Jan 18 16:30:34 pastbin.com sounds like something from the 90s Jan 18 16:30:36 pastie.org is meh :P Jan 18 16:30:45 there's no pastieit script ;) Jan 18 16:31:04 ping: bad address 'pastebin.com' Jan 18 16:31:31 DocScrutinizer51: can you ping google.com Jan 18 16:31:34 Because it works for me :P Jan 18 16:31:43 I can ping ct.de Jan 18 16:32:10 but nor google.com Jan 18 16:32:15 not Jan 18 16:32:57 fsckng dnsmasq or whatever it's called is screwed up again Jan 18 16:33:27 second time in a few days - I wonder how to investigate and fix this for good Jan 18 16:33:58 http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=2h83Z59h :) Jan 18 16:34:38 now that I think about it, HAM said all catalogs weren't available prior to my last boot some 8h ago Jan 18 16:34:44 so actually 3ed time Jan 18 16:34:48 :-/ Jan 18 16:35:24 shit Jan 18 16:37:37 sth with my wlan is severely fsckd up Jan 18 16:38:04 bunch of pirates Jan 18 16:38:06 * javispedro sighs Jan 18 16:38:30 switching to 3G, ping google.com ok, switching back to wlan, google.com bad address Jan 18 16:38:54 nevertheless it works on my laptop in same LAN Jan 18 16:38:57 DocScrutinizer: time to lose the uptime record? :) Jan 18 16:39:15 heh Jan 18 16:39:17 [2011-01-18 17:29:23] now that I think about it, HAM said all catalogs weren't available prior to my last boot some 8h ago Jan 18 16:39:29 that is uptime record Jan 18 16:39:36 you seriously expected more on maemo? Jan 18 16:39:36 :P Jan 18 16:39:45 yes. mine is 3 minutes larger. Jan 18 16:40:31 Heh Jan 18 16:40:37 fsck, that doesn't help at all Jan 18 16:40:41 My uptime is 15:22 Jan 18 16:40:48 So, not even a day :D Jan 18 16:41:04 Okay, added an "About" dialog to columbus Jan 18 16:41:11 Now finishing of the routing infrastructure. Jan 18 16:41:30 *sigh* Jan 18 16:41:38 thanks for the help Jan 18 16:41:41 DocScrutinizer: it's weird, sure it's a dnsmasq FAIL? can you ping the dns server and all that? Jan 18 16:44:51 DocScrutinizer: you can also check /var/run/resolv.conf.wlan0 Jan 18 16:46:06 alterego, screenshot of about? :P Jan 18 16:46:18 * javispedro twitches slightly while reading how dnsmasq decides which server to forward queries to Jan 18 16:46:30 It's just four labels, hang on Jan 18 16:47:57 hello Jan 18 16:48:26 MohammadAG: http://stage.rubyx.co.uk/columbus/Screenshot-20110118-164129.png Jan 18 16:48:35 I just wanted a dialog to show the version tbh Jan 18 16:48:35 spreak german pls? Jan 18 16:48:56 ananas: No, this is an English channel sorry. Jan 18 16:49:05 lemme guess, you're using QApplication to show those? :) Jan 18 16:49:08 Ich sprechen nicht Deutsch. Jan 18 16:49:19 Yes Jan 18 16:49:35 So I only have to worry about two places to enter version information. Jan 18 16:49:50 make the website part clickable Jan 18 16:49:58 there's debian/changelog :P Jan 18 16:50:08 MohammadAG: yes, I'm counting that idiot :P Jan 18 16:50:17 ok alterego darf ich dir eine frage stellen ? Jan 18 16:50:20 That's the second place. Jan 18 16:50:26 lmao Jan 18 16:50:34 ananas: English please :P Jan 18 16:50:38 ananas: go for it Jan 18 16:50:39 Sprechen sie English! Jan 18 16:50:49 bitte Jan 18 16:50:51 ok Jan 18 16:51:03 alterego, you speak dutch since when exactly? :P Jan 18 16:51:11 or german, whatever Jan 18 16:51:17 ........ Jan 18 16:51:18 double-dutch Jan 18 16:51:24 MohammadAG: Since about, erm, 15 years ago? Jan 18 16:52:04 Crap, I should probably think about getting dinner and such ready. Jan 18 16:52:46 ananas: was ist deine Frage? Jan 18 16:53:20 b-ananas Jan 18 16:53:44 it actually means pineapple Jan 18 16:53:47 :) Jan 18 16:54:24 Teeheehee Jan 18 16:54:26 hey, that's the same as arabic :P Jan 18 16:55:15 MohammadAG: well you guys have been around for a while and I guess pineapples didn't develop in northern Europe too Jan 18 16:55:41 bbiafm Jan 18 16:56:01 * MohammadAG wonders what "f" means Jan 18 16:56:10 few ? Jan 18 16:56:14 few, or you're starting to swear a lot Jan 18 16:56:19 :D Jan 18 16:58:33 ok have a problem with my nokia n900 and i would like to reinstall meamo for application storage memory combine with the nokia n900 is the possible? Jan 18 17:00:09 you want to reinstall Maemo, I don't quite get the application storage part, do you want to overwrite this? Jan 18 17:01:24 ananas: do you want to restore it to the state it was when you bought it? Losing all data? Jan 18 17:01:47 mom pls Jan 18 17:08:28 no. i would like to delete everything and a swap and a root partition and no application memory Jan 18 17:09:50 I want more than 2gb can install programs.so Jan 18 17:10:28 is that possible Jan 18 17:10:39 i would like lots of app memory and no swap Jan 18 17:10:43 swap is slow Jan 18 17:12:03 * pahartik watches "Drone" being operated in "Tampere MeeGo network" meeting Jan 18 17:13:19 * lcuk watches pahartik watching drone being operated in the wrong irc channel --->>> #meego me thinks ;) Jan 18 17:13:23 ananas: you need to repartition to get more application space Jan 18 17:14:41 lcuk: But I am at meeting because of Maemo, not because of MeeGo... Jan 18 17:15:20 pahartik, is there meeting info on website somewhere? or is this adhoc? Jan 18 17:15:57 ananas: you cannot flash rootfs without it loosing all information on installed applications even with the data still available in the 2GB storage Jan 18 17:16:37 * lardman heads off to try booting Meego on his Tab Jan 18 17:16:41 bbiab Jan 18 17:17:57 lcuk: Document at "http://demola.fi.ipv6.sixxs.org/events/5th-tampere-meego-network-meetup" Jan 18 17:18:12 such an easy to remember url Jan 18 17:18:17 just rolls off the tongue :P Jan 18 17:18:50 Unable to connect Jan 18 17:18:51 Firefox can't establish a connection to the server at demola.fi.ipv6.sixxs.org. Jan 18 17:18:51 * The site could be temporarily unavailable or too busy. Try again in a few Jan 18 17:18:51 moments. Jan 18 17:18:59 hmm Jan 18 17:19:03 so I can't change volume Jan 18 17:19:11 lcuk: Maybe your IPv6 routing failed Jan 18 17:19:21 and the mediaplayer lacks the now playing icon and saying "Unable to perform operation" Jan 18 17:19:55 pahartik, probably because I do not have ipv6 routing on this machine Jan 18 17:20:31 WFM... Jan 18 17:21:03 lcuk: At moment I do not have IPv4 routing on my workstation... Jan 18 17:21:32 ok thanks Jan 18 17:22:15 lcuk: http://www.demola.fi/events/5th-tampere-meego-network-meetup Jan 18 17:26:28 huhu Jan 18 17:26:30 ree Jan 18 17:27:01 sms service buggy? Jan 18 17:28:27 hi again ! Jan 18 17:28:38 I am not receiving sms :-( Jan 18 17:28:52 I can confirm today that skype really kills the battery Jan 18 17:29:28 someone tested with its n95, it killed its battery. I tested yesterday and got about 5h of autonomy, today, without skype, I have already 9h and am still at 50% Jan 18 17:29:34 Jarock: basic info such as provider might help tracking down. At least in my part of the world SMS system has not collapsed yet. Jan 18 17:29:35 lcuk: MeeGo is interesting mostly because I assume new non-wintel devices to run Debian GNU/Linux may appear as result of that... Also, porting applications of Meego to Maemo is most likely future of Maemo... Jan 18 17:29:42 too bad skype doesnt fix that Jan 18 17:30:04 or at least offer a low network usage mode or whatever Jan 18 17:30:59 it depends on skype's network mood Jan 18 17:31:16 pahartik: except that MeeGo has pretty much nothing to do with Debian Jan 18 17:31:41 My provider is "Debitel" and I receive no sms :-( Jan 18 17:32:35 Corsac: Agreed... But if devices are open enough, Debian GNU/Linux can be installed Jan 18 17:36:03 Hey, is it possible to get an older kernel for N900 than current 2.6.28-omap1? I have random sw_rst-crashes with "PC is at eventpoll_release_file+0x1c/0x78" Messages in /dev/mtd2 Jan 18 17:36:37 Corsac: On side note, I might be tempted to buy Android device if I was convinced that Debian GNU/Linux runs on it reasonably well, even though Android is not interesting to me Jan 18 17:41:36 google.com ping solved. Primary DNS in router is a pile of... Jan 18 17:42:54 is there any push notification for n900 ? Jan 18 17:43:26 allegedly yes, though nobody explained to me yet how that's supposed to work Jan 18 17:43:37 something able to push notifications and use less battery Jan 18 17:43:44 but still have connected IM and Voip Jan 18 17:43:58 you can't push thru a NAT Jan 18 17:44:13 GSM GPRS is usually NATted Jan 18 17:44:26 DocScrutinizer: good reason to upgrade to ipv6! :) Jan 18 17:44:28 DocScrutinizer:I do have a real ip apparently right now Jan 18 17:44:43 kpoman: who is your provider? Jan 18 17:45:06 DocScrutinizer: do you know if there is a server app I could install on my gateway to act as a push notification server ? I mean an opensource app or whatever compatible with maemo ? :p Jan 18 17:45:15 Claro.br Jan 18 17:46:03 allegedly nokia messaging does push Jan 18 17:46:25 I never even tested it Jan 18 17:47:41 DocScrutinizer: it would be very interesting as an opensourced application Jan 18 17:48:09 so anyone can install on its gateway or trust some serious service provider, compatible with many protocols Jan 18 17:49:08 sigh Jan 18 17:49:12 I broke mafw Jan 18 17:49:18 reflashing Jan 18 17:52:20 how i create finger-sized check buttons as in preferences->profiles? Jan 18 17:52:38 which UI? Jan 18 17:52:50 hildon, of course Jan 18 17:53:21 hildon_check_button_new(HILDON_SIZE_AUTO) results in smaller one Jan 18 17:54:44 to be more exact, i get buttons that look like ones in pygtkeditor preferences Jan 18 17:57:21 anyone? Jan 18 18:00:30 <_berto_> slonopotamus: HILDON_SIZE_FINGER_HEIGHT Jan 18 18:01:34 _berto_, \o great that igalia and claudio are expanding on hildon Jan 18 18:01:36 http://blogs.gnome.org/foundation/2011/01/17/gtk-meego-handset-bidders-selected/ Jan 18 18:01:41 _berto_: will try... Jan 18 18:02:26 <_berto_> lcuk: thanks :) Jan 18 18:04:32 lcuk: thanks for the news! Jan 18 18:08:02 Cool Jan 18 18:09:20 * alterego contemplates his database schema. Jan 18 18:09:33 * MohammadAG cries over lost unsaved modifications Jan 18 18:09:46 I want to use a foreign key, but will QtSql handle this how I want it to handle it :/ Jan 18 18:09:50 why! why! did I save them to /root Jan 18 18:12:51 Hrm, this modification is going to require a schema change in the current version. Jan 18 18:13:19 Which means I'll have to add this into my packaging, or, have people lose any waypoints they currently have set. Jan 18 18:19:09 fuck Jan 18 18:19:34 alterego, too possibilities, you either break now, or later Jan 18 18:19:37 think about it :P Jan 18 18:21:44 alterego, systems have been upgrading local data stores to new versions for as long as app have data. learning how to migrate said data is something all developers have to do at some point or other. Jan 18 18:22:17 that or have been calling their products "beta" for years =) Jan 18 18:22:59 javispedro, even those have similar requirements Jan 18 18:23:05 it just depends upon utility Jan 18 18:23:34 javispedro, also, an extra magic trick is backwards compatible data creation ;) Jan 18 18:23:51 I'm fully familiar with migrations :P Jan 18 18:23:59 get it right the first time and even with whole generations of apps inbetween the data format remains resiliant enough to operate with older apps Jan 18 18:24:00 I'm just used to doing them with a nice framework like rails ^.^ Jan 18 18:27:28 DocScrutinizer: opinion? As in how likely I believe Nokia will even bother to read it? Jan 18 18:41:56 GeneralAntilles: well, even that. tekojo said he'll look at it and see what he can do. So there are chances Jan 18 18:42:48 just seen you commented that ticket with a good URL Jan 18 18:45:15 DocScrutinizer, weren't you sending me a resume? :P Jan 18 18:46:08 hmm, I made up my mind I don't like work on oil drilling stations Jan 18 18:52:15 DocScrutinizer51: so long ago I don't even remember. *g* Jan 18 19:04:20 oooh, starbucks is bringing out a new 916ml cup size here Jan 18 19:11:03 uhhh, is this a bug? my n900 is shwing the "slider-lock" screen, but when i use test-input i can type and also send it Jan 18 19:11:17 i mean when i input text via the keyboard Jan 18 19:17:27 frals, hey. i've got fmms crashing on start, do you have any tips on how to figure out what's wrong? Jan 18 19:17:36 korhojoa: Run from terminal Jan 18 19:17:53 if i want to upload a package to the extras-devel, do the binaries have to be built using the autobuilder(does autobuilder just build packages or compiles too?)? Jan 18 19:17:54 I've done that, it doesn't print any output Jan 18 19:18:15 it does run then though, but it just has the spinning 'something going on'-wheel Jan 18 19:23:37 ieatlint: that is a looooot of coffee Jan 18 19:23:45 DocScrutinizer51: that's convenient, we don't do production, just refining and transport :P no drilling here Jan 18 19:24:20 trx: building == compiling Jan 18 19:24:32 trx: but it all depends how you write rules for it Jan 18 19:24:48 FUCKING FAPMAN Jan 18 19:24:48 lardman: yeah, a paper decided to give info about the human stomach when posting the news of it... apparently the average human stomach can hold 900ml (but expands to 2l-4l, depending on person, or probably 5l for americans ;) Jan 18 19:24:53 2GBs of debs, cleared! Jan 18 19:25:00 fap fap fap Jan 18 19:25:11 * MohammadAG cries Jan 18 19:25:14 that's why I use the builtin ham! Jan 18 19:26:04 jacekowski my app is compiled with fpc (pascal), i doubt that autobuilder has it... the only way for me is to include the binary... is that allowed? Jan 18 19:26:14 i created a working .deb Jan 18 19:26:22 MohammadAG: i have 34G /home/maemo/mirror Jan 18 19:26:27 korhojoa: run from terminal and pastebin output Jan 18 19:26:29 MohammadAG: 34G of debs Jan 18 19:26:35 trx: it has Jan 18 19:26:47 trx: autobuilder can have anything you want Jan 18 19:26:52 trx: just write rules for it Jan 18 19:27:02 trx: Build-Depends: fpc Jan 18 19:27:04 trx: for example Jan 18 19:27:12 jacekowski, those aren't on your N900 Jan 18 19:27:19 but you can install them Jan 18 19:27:20 I had 2GBs on my N900 Jan 18 19:27:24 jacekowski oh, tnx for the tip Jan 18 19:27:31 trx: as long as it's in repo Jan 18 19:27:36 trx: you can use it in autobuilder Jan 18 19:27:42 trx: if it isn't up it to repo first Jan 18 19:27:47 http://www.engadget.com/2011/01/18/exclusive-hp-palms-webos-tablets-pictures-plans-and-mor/ Jan 18 19:28:18 buuuuuuuuuuu Jan 18 19:28:21 i want HP slate Jan 18 19:28:42 Hi Jan 18 19:28:43 frals, wtf? i ran it over ssh, and now it spat out text? Jan 18 19:29:06 oO Jan 18 19:29:09 it didn't do this earlier. anyway, it complained about not having permissions for /tmp/fmms.log and when i chmod'd that to 777, now it works fine Jan 18 19:29:09 they released it Jan 18 19:29:16 i was thinking that hp slate is abandoned Jan 18 19:31:09 jacekowski: yeah, on the expensivish side though Jan 18 19:31:21 yeah Jan 18 19:31:35 i think i'll go for archos tablet in that case Jan 18 19:31:45 but i'm not sure what i would use it for Jan 18 19:32:00 but i want it just for coolnes factor of it Jan 18 19:33:00 * javispedro nods Jan 18 19:35:56 hmm, jacekowski im not sure i understand, i can upload fpc to repos, and autobilder will use it to compile my source? (fpc is a compiler like gcc) Jan 18 19:37:19 moin Jan 18 19:38:59 yes Jan 18 19:39:08 but i think fpc is already in repository Jan 18 19:39:17 trx: you just have to tell autobuilder to install it Jan 18 19:39:29 trx: because what happens during building is Jan 18 19:39:38 trx: autobuilder unpacks fresh os image Jan 18 19:39:46 trx: then install all stuff from your build-depends Jan 18 19:39:56 then starts building Jan 18 19:40:22 thats cool Jan 18 19:40:33 thank you Jan 18 19:47:15 * javispedro still ponders if Nokia is going to keep with the schedule of releasing an omap3630 handset this year Jan 18 19:47:40 engadget would pan it just for being on omap3 Jan 18 19:50:32 pan? Jan 18 19:51:26 well, or maybe not. Jan 18 19:51:36 javispedro: The rumours for an MWC release (or, rather, announce) seem to be growing Jan 18 19:51:53 javispedro: They would, cos it's not an "A8" like the iPhone 5 Jan 18 19:52:14 hehe Jan 18 19:52:21 Apple is probably going to call it the A5 Jan 18 19:52:36 or some other blogger-confusing name. Jan 18 19:54:07 javispedro: I'd be very impressed if, in the time available, they@ve not just uber-simplified the UI, but also changed the fundaments of the h/w Jan 18 19:55:10 aha! a rumour about Apple going for Qualcomm too. Jan 18 19:55:25 let's count... rumours about Nokia, about Palm... Jan 18 20:07:46 jacekowski: pondering what I learned about how autobuilder works, I'm of course immediately starting to figure how to make it run into an endless dependency circle :-D Jan 18 20:08:57 just like >A Build-Depends: B; B Build-Depends: A Jan 18 20:09:36 meh, seems I'm bored Jan 18 20:11:33 nope Jan 18 20:11:44 it will just fail Jan 18 20:11:58 because that package will not be in repository Jan 18 20:12:00 errr, my N900 has a tag "ARM cortex A8" Jan 18 20:12:02 so it can't install it Jan 18 20:12:10 err Jan 18 20:12:12 yest Jan 18 20:12:13 yes Jan 18 20:12:18 since day it was manufacture Jan 18 20:12:19 d Jan 18 20:12:38 re: javispedro: They would, cos it's not an "A8" Jan 18 20:13:11 bbl Jan 18 20:15:29 DocScrutinizer: slashdot and other newssites confused Apple's "A4" marketing with ARM's Cortex series naming Jan 18 20:15:44 mayhem ensued Jan 18 20:15:51 and a lot of laughs Jan 18 20:15:55 and jokes :) Jan 18 20:17:54 I always knew that'd blow up in their faces. Jan 18 20:18:25 well, as long as they don't mix it up with Audi cars Jan 18 20:18:32 http://www.gifsoup.com/webroot/animatedgifs/319539_o.gif \o/ sup Jan 18 20:20:31 X-Fade, ping Jan 18 20:26:37 * javispedro ponders what to do with a BD-RE unit Jan 18 20:35:46 javispedro, I can haz it? Jan 18 20:37:07 javispedro: webos tsblet renders out Jan 18 20:37:17 saw it on engadget, RST38h Jan 18 20:37:23 both 7-inch and 9-inch Jan 18 20:37:36 unknown specs, assumed qualcomm Jan 18 20:37:44 *rumoured Jan 18 20:43:23 hi. is the current version 20.2010.36-2 for N900? Jan 18 20:43:58 yes Jan 18 20:44:06 hm Jan 18 20:44:13 i thought it supported wpa2 oO Jan 18 20:44:20 but i dont have that in the list Jan 18 20:44:28 and it does not even see my wpa2 network Jan 18 20:44:29 oO Jan 18 20:45:24 http://txpad.devbin.org/ <-- if anyone is in need of such an app Jan 18 20:45:25 that is weird, it does support wpa Jan 18 20:45:27 2 Jan 18 20:45:36 i thought so too Jan 18 20:45:39 later i intend to "link" it with compilers... Jan 18 20:45:50 because i remember using it on the wpa2 enterprise network of the university Jan 18 20:45:51 oO Jan 18 20:46:16 i try turning it off and on again :o Jan 18 20:48:08 btw does anybody want to buy an N900? Jan 18 20:48:09 :D Jan 18 20:48:15 (german keyboard layout) Jan 18 20:48:22 summel try to create a connection manually, and in its advanced options/other there is something like "wpa2 only" Jan 18 20:48:37 trx: i did but i only have none, wep and wpa Jan 18 20:48:38 never tried that, just saw it there.. Jan 18 20:48:39 no wpa2 Jan 18 20:48:40 * alterego looks for a useful xml resource to wrap in QML Jan 18 20:48:41 :( Jan 18 20:48:48 choose wpa Jan 18 20:48:54 and test that option.. Jan 18 20:49:00 but it is wpa2 :O Jan 18 20:49:02 If anyone has any suggestions ;) Jan 18 20:49:04 but i will try Jan 18 20:49:18 i have a randomly generated 20 character long password though :S Jan 18 20:49:23 it will take a time to try :D Jan 18 20:50:45 alterego, maraxim did, sec Jan 18 20:51:34 marxian*, whatever :P Jan 18 20:51:47 ok i added the connection manually Jan 18 20:51:56 hrm? Jan 18 20:52:06 alterego, http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=923127&postcount=124 Jan 18 20:52:10 how do i tell it to use it? Jan 18 20:52:16 it still does not show up in the list Jan 18 20:52:22 if I understood you correctly :p Jan 18 20:52:26 and there is no "connect" button in the connections list Jan 18 20:52:26 :o Jan 18 20:52:46 pfft Jan 18 20:52:59 I've already done all the research for that Jan 18 20:53:11 Didn't you read my posts? :P Jan 18 20:53:16 no :) Jan 18 20:53:36 Well, they've all stolen my work :P Jan 18 20:53:42 any ideas? :( Jan 18 20:54:15 before they add steam I want xfire :D Jan 18 20:54:21 is it a problem that i dont have a sim installed atm? Jan 18 20:56:51 Do we have any amazon apps Jan 18 20:56:54 ? Jan 18 20:57:21 a homescreen widget only Jan 18 20:57:28 Hrmm, lame Jan 18 20:58:27 hah Jan 18 21:17:09 :S i want my wifi Jan 18 21:17:21 how am i supposed to do software updates/install software? :( Jan 18 21:17:50 Hey, does someone here uses the QtMobility Framework? I try to use the "geo" feature. I wanted to use the QGeoAddress. How can i convert my QGeoPosition from onPositionUpdated into QGeoAddress? Jan 18 21:25:50 oh my Jan 18 21:25:56 i know what the problem is Jan 18 21:25:56 :S Jan 18 21:26:13 my wifi is 5GHz only Jan 18 21:26:16 hi all, my scratchbox says "apt-get" is not a command. What have I messed? Jan 18 21:26:21 is that a problem? :o Jan 18 21:26:27 not root? :) Jan 18 21:27:44 root doesn't matter, apt-get is in /usr/bin Jan 18 21:28:24 MohammadAG, Appiah inside scratchbox that is. I need to update/upgrade scratchbox Jan 18 21:28:33 yes :( Jan 18 21:29:28 when I started settin up, i could use apt-get but it was complaining CPUTRANS was not set. Jan 18 21:29:32 bug 11798 Jan 18 21:29:33 :) Jan 18 21:29:34 Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/11798 agps no longer works due to server changes Jan 18 21:29:47 What? Really? Jan 18 21:30:06 (N810) Jan 18 21:30:07 Ah, that is poor little N810 Jan 18 21:30:16 N900 is next! Jan 18 21:30:22 Forgotten by its evil parents Jan 18 21:30:27 :( Jan 18 21:30:32 That's just bad enough Jan 18 21:30:43 ShadowJK: Doesn't Google provide an alterntive agps server? Jan 18 21:30:52 RST38h, doesn't work with google Jan 18 21:31:49 I'd still use my N810 if it still worked :) Jan 18 21:32:02 I imagine if you're in the US somewhere you'd get served that one working nokia server :) Jan 18 21:32:22 (they probably forgot US exists again, and didn't upgrade the server to new incompatible version) Jan 18 21:32:45 Jan 18 21:33:08 Nobody has established a third party server so far? Jan 18 21:33:48 * DocScrutinizer checks if his spare N810 still is covered by warranty Jan 18 21:33:49 RST38h, 429 users here, how many of them are active ;) Jan 18 21:34:11 29 i would guess ;) Jan 18 21:34:21 :) Jan 18 21:34:24 <_trine> present Sir Jan 18 21:34:29 Not even that :P Jan 18 21:34:42 I'd still be using N810 gps if my wayfinder license hadn't expired Jan 18 21:34:43 :( Jan 18 21:34:49 yeah, alterego doesn't talk a lot, make that 28 Jan 18 21:34:57 :P Jan 18 21:39:53 US exists again? :-D Jan 18 21:40:58 i'm still here! technically Jan 18 21:41:17 ah, helo rm_work Jan 18 21:51:08 PR1.3's hildon-desktop is from July 13th :/ Jan 18 22:04:16 <_trine> since I upgraded to pr1.3 I have had little or no updates, prior to upgrading when I was on pr1.2 updates were frequent. Are there less updates now or do I have something wrong? Jan 18 22:05:10 nope, some devs got pissed off, that's it Jan 18 22:05:28 <_trine> I see Jan 18 22:19:56 So much code ... Jan 18 22:20:50 could any one help me with installing keyring? im gettin GPG error while apt-get update Jan 18 22:24:30 I get "No keyring installed in /etc/apt/trusted.gpg.d/." Jan 18 22:29:10 jacekowski: ping Jan 18 22:29:21 jonwil: pong Jan 18 22:29:48 You said you could reverse engineer some stuff for me? Jan 18 22:32:15 hm, is the 'unlock-slider'-screen kind of broken? while it is on i can happily type in an opened xterm... Jan 18 22:33:06 possibly Jan 18 22:33:10 jonwil: yeah Jan 18 22:34:17 hm... i hope nokia will still make another update which has some crucial bugixes... or did they state otherwise? Jan 18 22:38:50 has pithos been ported to Maemo? Jan 18 22:40:18 mikki-kun, you wish :p Jan 18 22:41:15 how to wire a usb a-a adaptor? only cross d+ and d-? Jan 18 22:43:06 sid_ you mean female <--> female ? Jan 18 22:43:15 trx: yes Jan 18 22:43:25 i did no crossing here Jan 18 22:43:32 just connected them by color Jan 18 22:43:33 http://img137.imageshack.us/img137/572/20101209001.jpg Jan 18 22:44:06 @sid_ pin to pin 1 to 1 , 2 to 2 , ... Jan 18 22:44:31 1:1 thanks; still have some plugs from a "usb power cable" Jan 18 22:45:15 MohammadAG: did they ever state pr1.3 will be the last? Jan 18 22:45:57 mikki-kun, it's staring you in the face on bugs.maemo.org :P Jan 18 22:53:01 hm, they sure have many unsolved :) Jan 18 22:55:16 I'd look at WONTFIX Jan 18 23:00:32 but TMO said 1.4 was tomorrow! Jan 18 23:00:37 (on several occasions) Jan 18 23:08:38 BCMM: now is tomorrow, where is it? :> Jan 18 23:10:28 hi everybody Jan 18 23:11:02 i'm trying to set up iptables on my nokia n900 Jan 18 23:11:29 but i don't understand how get to work the nat table Jan 18 23:11:39 sorry for my english Jan 18 23:11:47 ed209: do you have the power kernel? Jan 18 23:11:48 ed209: which kernel do you use? Jan 18 23:11:52 MrBawb: you win :) Jan 18 23:11:56 :) Jan 18 23:12:08 the default kernel Jan 18 23:13:01 there is'nt a package from the extra devel repository with iptables nat working? Jan 18 23:13:11 ed209: the default kernel doesn't include NAT. i didn't think it included iptables at all. Jan 18 23:13:22 ed209: kernel-power does NAT Jan 18 23:13:56 there are various caveats about kernel-power, read the wiki Jan 18 23:14:07 mostly, don't uninstall it carelessly or you'll have to reflash Jan 18 23:14:29 http://maemo.org/packages/view/iptables/ Jan 18 23:14:39 here say iptables with nat Jan 18 23:15:07 iptables is a userspace application that interfaces with netfilter in the kernel Jan 18 23:15:16 the default kernel doesn't have netfilter, as pointed out Jan 18 23:15:16 i was wondering if there was a way to get this working without the kernel power Jan 18 23:15:27 so yes, you can run iptables, but it can't do anything without kernel support Jan 18 23:15:51 realistically, the only way to do nat is through the power kernel Jan 18 23:16:11 ed209: my emphasis: "These are the *user-space* administration tools for the Linuxkernel's netfilter and iptables" Jan 18 23:16:26 not just realistically... the only way is with a new kernel Jan 18 23:16:27 you still need kernel support Jan 18 23:16:52 ed209: kernel-power isn't a problem, really Jan 18 23:16:55 ok, than i just type apt-get install kernel-power-settings? Jan 18 23:17:10 "kernel-power-settings"? Jan 18 23:17:20 yes Jan 18 23:17:29 http://wiki.maemo.org/Kernel_Power#Installation_of_the_stable_kernel_from_extras Jan 18 23:17:34 i'm reading this Jan 18 23:17:45 installing "kernel-power-settings" is the way the wiki recommends, which will pull in the dependencies required like "kernel-power" Jan 18 23:18:02 so yes, that should work without any issue, but best to perform a backup anyway Jan 18 23:18:47 i have an n900. Jan 18 23:18:55 there is the risk to brick the nokia? Jan 18 23:19:03 no Jan 18 23:19:26 but in the *unlikely* event of failure, you will need a computer to reflash the kernel Jan 18 23:19:37 ok Jan 18 23:20:01 however, your device won't be dead, and even if you do need to do that, it shouldn't even delete your files Jan 18 23:20:39 http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_firmware#Flashing_only_the_kernel_from_a_FIASCO_image is what is involved in fixing a bad kernel on the phone Jan 18 23:20:54 ieatlint: oh, sorry Jan 18 23:21:09 BCMM: nah, it's not that intuitive.. :P Jan 18 23:21:14 shockingly... Jan 18 23:21:26 the stable kernel power package from the extra repository includes the nat features or i have to install the package from the extra-devel? Jan 18 23:21:37 ed209: it's pretty hard to "brick" the n900 properly, at least without using overclocking. it is, however, easy to get it in a state in which you need to reflash from a PC (which is sometimes called "bricking") Jan 18 23:21:49 ed209: stable will work just fine for you Jan 18 23:21:57 (but imho should not be) Jan 18 23:22:12 thanks to everybody Jan 18 23:22:29 np Jan 18 23:25:40 ed209: always go for version from devel Jan 18 23:25:51 ed209: version from stable are old Jan 18 23:27:24 i don't care i just need nat Jan 18 23:27:26 wow, someone promoting devel :o Jan 18 23:27:36 heh, he doesn't need anything that new Jan 18 23:27:45 stable is stable, and gets the job done without issue Jan 18 23:27:58 yep Jan 18 23:28:47 which version is in extras? Jan 18 23:28:54 latest Jan 18 23:29:05 devel is stable as well Jan 18 23:29:13 i never had any problems with stuff from devel Jan 18 23:29:52 i think i had once or twice... Jan 18 23:30:05 but devel is getting way more stable these days Jan 18 23:30:22 well, the package maintainer seems to disagree, having not promoted it to extras-testing Jan 18 23:33:50 42 seems to be in extras.... Jan 18 23:35:56 ieatlint: or doesn't care Jan 18 23:37:30 * ieatlint doubts this debate will lead anywhere worthwhile Jan 18 23:43:24 hi Jan 18 23:44:02 what could be making the Photos program not see any picture unless i tell it to look into an specific folder? Jan 18 23:44:27 -devel apps will break one thing for sure, restorability of a 1.2 backup Jan 18 23:44:59 TiagoTiago: config of trackerd Jan 18 23:45:40 what can i do to help narrow down the cause? Jan 18 23:46:40 check the config file, restore the original config file Jan 18 23:47:26 do you got the path to that file by heart or i'll have to google for it? Jan 18 23:49:37 check my /tools page in wiki Jan 18 23:49:57 k, thx Jan 18 23:50:13 or use that app, called trackercontrol or whatever Jan 18 23:50:53 that will also affect the Photos prog? Jan 18 23:51:36 media, photos, everything related to tracker Jan 18 23:51:43 use tracker-cfg from the repos Jan 18 23:52:26 though it might use different configs for photos and for other media. At least there's also a "tool" called thumbnailerd Jan 18 23:52:38 do i click "Rebuild databases" ? Jan 18 23:53:11 I mean, should i? Jan 18 23:53:59 i already tried restore original and restart tracker Jan 18 23:55:53 well, i'll see what happens then Jan 18 23:56:16 DocScrutinizer, tracker calls that Jan 18 23:56:19 (afaik) Jan 18 23:57:06 still "(no images)" :( Jan 18 23:58:03 overclocked? Jan 18 23:58:16 * MohammadAG pokes javispedro with a stylus Jan 18 23:58:25 not recently Jan 18 23:58:46 corrupt /home? Jan 18 23:58:51 * javispedro pokes MohammadAG with a sausage Jan 18 23:59:21 aka capacitive styles Jan 18 23:59:40 i can browse to it just fine, and telling Photos to open a folder inside MyDocs shows the images in that folder Jan 18 23:59:43 * MohammadAG feeds sausage to random dog in the streets Jan 19 00:02:33 hm, Media Player now also doesn't see anything :( Jan 19 00:02:47 i did it Jan 19 00:02:54 it works like a charm Jan 19 00:03:05 tahnks to everyone Jan 19 00:03:42 well Jan 19 00:03:48 either your /home is full, or corrupt Jan 19 00:03:55 so tracker can't regenerate files Jan 19 00:04:16 or trackerd gone on vacation or sanity health care Jan 19 00:04:35 if /home is corrupt, I suggest you don't try to be a smartass (like I did once), backup what you have nicely, then flash eMMC Jan 19 00:04:42 fsck just... fskced it up Jan 19 00:04:43 but a full ~ sounds good Jan 19 00:05:25 poking a corrupt /home resulted in stale NFS handles for me Jan 19 00:05:40 well, /home could be corrupt and mount R7O Jan 19 00:05:43 r/o Jan 19 00:06:13 which would have same effect as a full /home, for trackerd Jan 19 00:07:53 114mb free on home, is that too little or enough? Jan 19 00:11:49 how do i check if /home is r/o? Jan 19 00:12:17 touch /home/somefilename Jan 19 00:12:27 would be the easiest way Jan 19 00:13:29 rm -rf /home, if it reports errors, it's read-only Jan 19 00:13:32 (not really) Jan 19 00:14:13 Think I'm going to scrap routing infrastructure in the v1 roadmap. Jan 19 00:14:20 I've decided it's pointless without maps. Jan 19 00:15:06 it probably is Jan 19 00:15:13 anyone here know anything about Telepathy or know of any documentation on how it works (i.e. the upper level interface used by the apps to talk to it)? Jan 19 00:15:18 unless you want to compete with navit and that other KDE app. Jan 19 00:15:34 jonwil: Telepathy is a GNOME project. There's surely thousands of docs on the web. Jan 19 00:15:39 I've moved it to the v2 road map, which, to be honest only really has mapping to add to it. Jan 19 00:16:06 alterego: I think what's missing right now is an app doing "all subpages on a Garmin GPS != map" Jan 19 00:16:24 javispedro: that's my goal. Jan 19 00:16:31 if i create and delete a folder inside /home then it isn't r/o? Jan 19 00:17:12 alterego: :D Jan 19 00:17:17 javispedro: have you used my app? Jan 19 00:17:28 not yet =) Jan 19 00:17:32 javispedro: if you think that's what is missing, then you're the perfect user for me to get input ;) Jan 19 00:17:37 the other day I made a roadtrip but decided to take the N810 instead Jan 19 00:17:45 to find the agps server stopped working =( Jan 19 00:18:03 in panic I even made a duplicate thread on tmo :P Jan 19 00:18:53 do you use columbus to make your roadmap? :3 Jan 19 00:19:03 That and your technical knowledge would be appreciated as it's some what lacking in my current user base. Jan 19 00:19:28 heh Jan 19 00:19:29 javispedro: you've seen the screenshots though right? Jan 19 00:19:38 I should probably write some documentation too tbh. Jan 19 00:19:38 yep Jan 19 00:19:55 I miss nav4all. Jan 19 00:20:32 Routing is not pointless without maps! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PDPrFJazD3Q&feature=channel Jan 19 00:24:20 * javispedro goes waste some time, like ensuring his apps are 64 bits safe. arm64, who knows! Jan 19 00:27:10 Don't forget multithreading too! Jan 19 00:27:26 16 core ARM is going to be in phones in ac ouple of years. Jan 19 00:28:04 good point. I wonder If I should also consider quantum computing. Jan 19 00:28:27 quantum computing = enum bool { FALSE, TRUE, FILE_NOT_FOUND } Jan 19 00:28:39 Jan 19 00:30:06 ARM 64 is a _looong_ way off. Jan 19 00:30:18 Though there was talk about having ARM powered server machines last year. Jan 19 00:31:28 seems the issue really was not enough free space in /home Jan 19 00:32:37 does the database need any of the fancy features of linux filesystems or can i place it on MyDocs? Jan 19 00:33:13 I resized mydocs down to 4G, and added another ext3 partition Jan 19 00:34:07 MohammadAG: you'll be pleased to know I've made my about dialog open email when my email address is pressed and open the web browser when the webpage is pressed :) Jan 19 00:34:16 I'll add the donate button tomorrow, g'night folks. Jan 19 00:35:29 cya alterego Jan 19 00:35:57 alterego: night! Jan 19 00:37:23 does lack of space at /home causes any issues besides the photos and media outage and not being able to install more stuff? Jan 19 00:37:37 yeah, lack of space at /home causes not being able to install stuff Jan 19 00:38:37 ah, grammar ambiguity. sorry. Jan 19 00:38:47 well, it possibly causes extra issues. Jan 19 00:39:38 what else? Jan 19 00:39:43 navit is the only map tool, which can handle osm vektor data, isn't it? Jan 19 00:39:55 TiagoTiago: dunno, it could seem random failures. Jan 19 00:40:58 i see Jan 19 01:00:01 well, i'm heading to bed, thanx for the assistance, cya Jan 19 01:05:23 Hey guys. Can anyone run a 20kb ARM binary in an emulator for me and tell me the output? Jan 19 01:55:35 anyone here know of a spec for the linux ARM ABI? Jan 19 01:59:09 never mind, found it **** ENDING LOGGING AT Wed Jan 19 02:59:57 2011