**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Wed Feb 16 02:59:57 2011 Feb 16 04:00:29 asd Feb 16 04:01:18 dsa Feb 16 04:01:52 hi psycho_oreos Feb 16 04:01:55 what's new Feb 16 04:02:15 pupnik_, nothing new on me n900 front, you? Feb 16 04:02:34 tired Feb 16 04:02:52 however i have some juice + cola + water and that tastes wonderful Feb 16 04:03:08 lol that might keep you buzzing for a bit Feb 16 04:03:14 till the sugar wears out :) Feb 16 04:03:20 mhm Feb 16 04:05:16 I still can't get over the fact they've killed n9 Feb 16 04:05:51 maybe I might just buy another n900, so I have two to play with Feb 16 04:07:37 too bad the german ones here don't have 4 arrow keys Feb 16 04:07:53 a replacement keymat is only like 20 euro Feb 16 04:08:36 is the keymat easy to replace? Feb 16 04:08:45 well. i don't know Feb 16 04:08:50 and why not 4 arrows? which key is it missing? lol Feb 16 04:09:06 two of the arrows are on function keys Feb 16 04:09:16 because the german alphabet has some additional characters Feb 16 04:09:30 I may need to replace mine sometime soon. My backspace key is the worst struck Feb 16 04:09:35 yeah omleaut iirc Feb 16 04:09:48 omlaut* Feb 16 04:10:06 have you worn through yours? Feb 16 04:10:26 i have an early version that got worn-through fast Feb 16 04:10:37 and the speakers blew out Feb 16 04:10:47 for the backspace, yeah its about 1/4 chunk missing Feb 16 04:10:49 ouch Feb 16 04:11:04 how did the speakers blew out? Feb 16 04:11:16 i bypassed the speaker protection Feb 16 04:11:45 should have implemented that filter in the mp3 player Feb 16 04:11:46 ahh lol Feb 16 04:12:15 i had mp3 playback down to using like 4% cpu or so Feb 16 04:12:18 down from 15% Feb 16 04:12:59 lower quality? Feb 16 04:13:10 s/quality/bitrate/ Feb 16 04:13:11 psycho_oreos meant: lower bitrate? Feb 16 04:13:13 no Feb 16 04:13:23 o.O Feb 16 04:13:33 different codecs? heh Feb 16 04:14:40 no. bypassing pulseaudio Feb 16 04:14:50 and using mplayer Feb 16 04:15:15 ahh Feb 16 04:15:37 mplayer + alsa I presume? Feb 16 04:16:33 yes Feb 16 04:16:51 mplayer -quiet (so it doesn't spit out text constantly) Feb 16 04:17:14 and mp3 decoding can do multi-band eq for 'free' cpu wise Feb 16 04:17:27 so i should have just dropped low frequences Feb 16 04:18:22 there are also arm-specific players Feb 16 04:24:50 psycho_oreos: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=36555&highlight=pulse+cpu Feb 16 04:30:12 Does anyone know if theres a Qvernote for the n810? Feb 16 04:35:54 is there one for n900? Feb 16 04:36:28 qvernote :) Feb 16 04:37:03 Buddy: [Consoling Laura about missing husband] Maybe Rob got drunk? Feb 16 04:37:07 Laura: Oh you know Rob never gets drunk. Feb 16 04:37:10 Buddy: Well maybe tonight he made it? Feb 16 05:10:13 hey all Feb 16 05:13:26 moo Feb 16 05:14:01 baaah Feb 16 05:15:11 four legs good! two legs baaaad! Feb 16 05:17:26 n900 has no legs :o Feb 16 05:17:32 >: Feb 16 05:42:17 Does anyone use tear on diablo? Feb 16 05:57:49 mwahaha :) Feb 16 05:58:42 1. take lenny debhelper-7. 2. drop dependencies on man-db and coreutils (since they're useless) 4. upload to builder 5. ??? 6. profit Feb 16 06:02:55 i wonder why noone did that yet Feb 16 06:03:46 hey slonopotamus nice to see you again Feb 16 06:04:10 pupnik: uh? i didn't go away :) Feb 16 06:04:30 what's debhelper for? Feb 16 06:05:18 no idea. some dark debian voodoo Feb 16 06:05:48 oh right Feb 16 06:06:08 dh-everything Feb 16 06:06:19 there are several posts outside like "oh noes, maemo's debhelper is sooo slow, it's 5.x, but we need 7.x to use lenny packages easily" Feb 16 06:06:48 and actually i'm running it on n900 currently :) Feb 16 06:07:20 like this: http://maemo.org/community/maemo-developers/re-debhelper_7-001/?org_openpsa_qbpager_net_nemein_discussion_posts_page=1 Feb 16 06:09:54 i don't rememebr frustrations with debhelper Feb 16 06:10:32 w/e, looks like it just works Feb 16 06:11:11 * slonopotamus thinks about mass-upload of lenny packages to extras-devel and seeing what'll build :) Feb 16 07:12:02 gah.. for some reason fmms has forced that by default anything trying to connect will try using the MMS connection instead of the internet one.. :( Feb 16 07:12:32 the cell phone connection? Feb 16 07:14:43 yeah... I have internet connection and mms... if I open a browser it will try to connecting using MMS Feb 16 07:19:12 http://www.limofoundation.org/en/Press-Releases/limo-foundation-unveils-limo-4.html another linux-on-mobiles to get confused by Feb 16 07:19:30 LiMo is nothing new really Feb 16 07:19:43 and apparently people seem to be able to hack them rather easily as well Feb 16 07:22:24 what's hacked ruskie ? Feb 16 07:29:34 LiMo based phones Feb 16 07:37:04 wow, I cant believe how much better my n900 + new carrier is. I get service in places I never used to get service :) Feb 16 07:40:39 hehe Feb 16 07:44:50 ha Feb 16 07:46:44 Does anyone know where the code for that circular progress indicator lives? Feb 16 07:47:03 probably one of the Hildon libraries but I dont know where Feb 16 07:51:49 how much scratchbox needs space on hdd? Feb 16 07:52:19 cause it takes about 5 gibs and i have only 10 on system one and /opt is not separate =( Feb 16 08:00:09 I think meego should be given to HTC to release several phones with it, than it would make good for meego =) Feb 16 08:00:23 5,6G scratchbox Feb 16 08:02:49 ruskie, damn i need to reinstall funtoo on my laptop than as i can't even reformat hdd =( Feb 16 08:03:06 anyway i wanted 64 bit and set 32 by mistake =( Feb 16 08:03:19 * ruskie is trying to reclaim some rootfs space on his n900... Feb 16 08:03:36 rootfs 228M 217M 6,7M 98% / <-- kinda not really happy with this... Feb 16 08:03:50 ruskie started to make simple xmms2 client, for now i managed to make only control buttons as API is simple but Qt is new to me Feb 16 08:04:03 well I'm more than happy with contorl buttons ;) Feb 16 08:04:16 atm I simply pop-open a terminal to control it ;) Feb 16 08:04:25 ruskie just put 1T SSD inside =) Feb 16 08:04:31 for display I have that widget that can display term output Feb 16 08:04:53 ruskie i can make simple app with only control buttons if you want =) Feb 16 08:05:04 desktop widget would be nicer Feb 16 08:05:31 or for instance i can try to make widget with control buttons and take your code for song info =) Feb 16 08:06:34 ruskie, my aim to make it able to connect to local(n900 xmms2) or server (computer over local network and maybe later over bluetooth) to control computer as well =) Feb 16 08:06:40 :) Feb 16 08:07:04 ruskie, you would be first tester but it would take some time =) Feb 16 08:10:32 yaay for xmms2 Feb 16 08:11:04 ruskie can you put to git your code for widget? Feb 16 08:11:16 ZogG, I'm using an already existing widget Feb 16 08:11:23 cmd line thingy Feb 16 08:11:26 don't recall the name Feb 16 08:11:29 pupnik, don't say you use xmms2 as well =) Feb 16 08:11:40 ruskie, what app do you use for it on desctop btw? Feb 16 08:11:45 nothing Feb 16 08:11:54 since there is no client that works :( Feb 16 08:11:56 ruskie, ok - than never midn =) Feb 16 08:12:25 ruskie, i can share with you my friends simple client Feb 16 08:12:53 I just need something that pops up a whats playing thingy... Feb 16 08:13:09 http://gtk-apps.org/content/show.php/Splean?content=116605 Feb 16 08:13:11 hell I'd be happy with a client that can trigger an external command on status change Feb 16 08:13:31 ruskie, this one my friend wrote after i forced him to switch to xmms2 from mpd =) Feb 16 08:13:44 hehe Feb 16 08:13:47 I'll take a look at it Feb 16 08:13:56 I miss some of the older clients myself... Feb 16 08:14:03 xmms2_jump and gx2osd Feb 16 08:14:05 i have one more that on my computer from other friend Feb 16 08:14:22 but he left it and started new one with no medialib =( Feb 16 08:14:57 ok, turns out that running hildon-theme-recache-all (that and switching themes and then switching back again) fixed the glitching of my circular progress indicator Feb 16 08:14:59 ruskie splean has popup on it's tray icon and controls on tray icon Feb 16 08:14:59 frankly I could live without the medialib Feb 16 08:15:04 no tray icons Feb 16 08:15:07 and it's gtk Feb 16 08:15:08 or libnotify based crap ;) Feb 16 08:15:10 i'm gtk guy =) Feb 16 08:15:17 atleast not on my desktop Feb 16 08:15:19 gtk I like ;) Feb 16 08:15:30 I'm one of those rare ppl that prefer the gtk UX to others Feb 16 08:15:49 rootfs 228M 214M 11M 96% / <-- yay... optified libruby1.8 and got some hdd back... Feb 16 08:15:59 ruskie, no it's client, just it has in addition controls over trayicon as well Feb 16 08:16:16 ruskie, i can share one without popup and tay icon just client Feb 16 08:19:28 morning Feb 16 08:20:42 MohammadAG \o/ Feb 16 08:20:56 MohammadAG, is cssu repo down as well as extras? Feb 16 08:21:09 ruskie, http://i.imgur.com/5LjbP.png - this one Feb 16 08:21:13 hmm hopefully I'll be able to switch to cssu today... Feb 16 08:21:29 ZogG, if extras is down, the cssu is down Feb 16 08:22:36 MohammadAG both are down for me from yesterday =( Feb 16 08:23:54 btw is there any bug releated to alarm? as for past days i didn't woke up and there is no way i didn't here alaram, everytime i woke up alarm was on ( the window with snoze and stop) but i didn't hear anything Feb 16 08:24:05 no way i sleep so hard for past 3-4 days not to wake up =) Feb 16 08:24:11 <-- does always Feb 16 08:24:34 MohammadAG btw i got extra nokia phone too Nokia 1616 =) Feb 16 08:24:43 ruskie does always what? Feb 16 08:24:56 sleep so hard that anything I try to set as alarm has no effect Feb 16 08:25:49 ZogG, the only bug I encountered was me waking up (only partially), turning off the alarm, then going back to sleep Feb 16 08:26:08 MohammadAG lol, cause you need to go to sleep ewarlier =) Feb 16 08:26:21 MohammadAG, btw i think i got job at elbit =))) Feb 16 08:26:46 well, I decided not to go to school today, so I guess I'll be productive now Feb 16 08:27:45 MohammadAG, not good, you have to study as well Feb 16 08:28:09 MohammadAG, do you get israeli bagrut? or how does it work? Feb 16 08:28:34 * ruskie wonders if he can remove all the locale data he doesn't need in share/microb-engine/chrome... Feb 16 08:29:13 ruskie just rm -R / Feb 16 08:29:38 o_O Feb 16 08:29:48 ZogG, GCEs Feb 16 08:29:51 Naughty boy Feb 16 08:30:20 ruskie lol, the screenshot i sent u, i just opened chromium with it and tried to switch song, took me time to realize why it doesn't work as it's screenshot =() Feb 16 08:30:30 rofl Feb 16 08:30:31 MohammadAG GCEs? Feb 16 08:32:19 14M freed... Feb 16 08:32:41 removed everything I don't use from /usr/share/locale ;) Feb 16 08:33:02 Has someone done any research why N900 is so slow and jerky all the time? Is it the disk I/O or the lack of ram? Feb 16 08:33:16 technically, both Feb 16 08:33:35 Figured as much :/ Feb 16 08:33:37 low ram = swap = IO and the eMMC is slow so :P Feb 16 08:33:45 Metallikettu: edit /etc/powervr.d/hildon-desktop.ini and set the value to 1 Feb 16 08:33:54 Reboot. Transitions will be a lot smoother Feb 16 08:33:55 no, don't Feb 16 08:33:56 I really like the device but the usability is horrid sometimes. Feb 16 08:34:05 it was disabled for a reason Feb 16 08:34:06 Works perfectly for me... Feb 16 08:34:23 I took transitions off long time ago :) Feb 16 08:34:23 crashes my device Feb 16 08:34:28 helped alot Feb 16 08:34:37 Worst case, you need to disable it again Feb 16 08:34:45 But I've had absolutely no trouble with it Feb 16 08:34:55 yeah, but rebooting to fix it is annoying :/ Feb 16 08:35:17 To enable/disable it? Yea... Two minutes to see how you like it Feb 16 08:35:25 I really hope intel gets meego going or Mee will go :) Feb 16 08:35:49 I will keep N900 as an car computer though. Feb 16 08:36:40 heh Feb 16 08:36:50 Hm... Y'know, I wonder why my n900 works when Mohammad's doesn't. Could it be OC/UC settings or say GPU frequency or something? Feb 16 08:37:24 'course, I -know- I got lucky with my sample. Feb 16 08:38:07 Not sure, or my device's trolling me Feb 16 08:38:15 oc is bad for you Feb 16 08:38:26 i love my new keyboard Feb 16 08:38:30 it makes better sound Feb 16 08:38:34 and feels better Feb 16 08:38:36 morning jacekowski Feb 16 08:38:45 MohammadAG: aren't you supposed to be at school? Feb 16 08:38:47 jacekowski: Of course it is. But it also makes things -very- nice. We all know OC'd devices will die sooner or later. Feb 16 08:38:55 jacekowski, wic one i want to buy mac keyboard or something simuliar Feb 16 08:39:07 jacekowski, supposed to, indeed Feb 16 08:39:12 ZogG: i have mac keyboard to use with my n900 Feb 16 08:39:23 slim separete keys good material and easy on pushing buttons Feb 16 08:39:31 ZogG: and even then it's not much more comfortable to use than builtin keyboard Feb 16 08:39:35 jacekowski, i want for desctop =) Feb 16 08:39:49 real keyboard for n900 is for pussies =) Feb 16 08:40:21 i'm just saying that n900 keyboard is about at same comfort level as apple keyboard Feb 16 08:40:28 and it has strange keymap Feb 16 08:40:35 so you have to fuck around with it to make it work Feb 16 08:41:10 Speaking of strange keymap, I -just now- learned that shift+up/down works as home/end in the browser <_< Feb 16 08:41:40 RobbieThe1st, jumps to top/bottom? Feb 16 08:41:45 Yea Feb 16 08:41:46 o_O Feb 16 08:42:13 RobbieThe1st, wow.. testing... Feb 16 08:42:23 * mece gasps Feb 16 08:42:24 I dunno why I didn't figure it out until someone talked about shifted keys that hadn't been bound Feb 16 08:42:33 and I went "hm..." *click* Cool. Feb 16 08:42:39 * mece hugs and cuddles his beloved N900 Feb 16 08:42:51 wow Feb 16 08:42:55 amazing Feb 16 08:43:07 I like how the N900 is the only device that can run angry birds in portrait mode :P Feb 16 08:43:08 It's actually quite useful :D Feb 16 08:43:17 awsome Feb 16 08:43:20 MohammadAG, it can run angry birds in portrait? Feb 16 08:43:29 RobbieThe1st i knew it =) Feb 16 08:43:59 hehe' Feb 16 08:44:20 mece, CTRL+SHIFT+R, the game lays out properly Feb 16 08:44:28 = awesome coding by rovio Feb 16 08:44:36 morning javispedro Feb 16 08:44:40 MohammadAG i'm gonna tweet it =) Feb 16 08:44:52 * mece is also Feb 16 08:44:55 tweet tweet Feb 16 08:45:18 morning folks Feb 16 08:45:26 * javispedro is at the ms wp7 event Feb 16 08:45:39 KILL THEM ALL! Feb 16 08:45:39 hmm..it hung when i tried it.. Feb 16 08:45:42 front row obviously Feb 16 08:45:51 mece, try it again Feb 16 08:45:51 Eew Feb 16 08:45:56 javispedro, did you bring eggs and rotten fruit? Feb 16 08:46:01 ^^ Feb 16 08:46:12 I don't have portrait mode with any application :( Feb 16 08:46:12 woohoo! Feb 16 08:46:12 javispedro, I packed in an M4 carbide, let's see your excuse now Feb 16 08:46:16 omgomgomg Feb 16 08:46:20 More like rotten KIN phones! :P Feb 16 08:46:51 javispedro: So, have they got you under their...errrr...spell? Feb 16 08:47:11 RST38h, he said he liked something about windows phone 7 yesterday Feb 16 08:47:16 RobbieThe1st: I enabled the setting no crashing so far Feb 16 08:47:24 Transitions are a bit smoother Feb 16 08:47:26 so theyre obviously showing the 3 other ecosystems Feb 16 08:47:30 javispedro: BTW, the front row may not be a good idea, in case Ballmer starts throwing chairs Feb 16 08:47:37 apple mblackberry hp Feb 16 08:47:40 Metallikettu, open/close some dialogs :P Feb 16 08:47:44 No Android? :) Feb 16 08:47:47 no sign of android or nokia ;) Feb 16 08:47:51 Metallikettu: That's sort of what I found, though they are slightly slower due to it rendering all frames Feb 16 08:48:12 I'm gonna have to build a hacked-up transitions.ini file with fewer frames... Feb 16 08:48:28 just change radius and radius_more to 0 Feb 16 08:49:06 Already did it; it's fast, but things like zooming -still- take almost .1s... Feb 16 08:49:43 I'm so used to near instant response on my Compiz-enabled desktop; transitions are so short and it runs beautifully. Feb 16 08:51:05 thp's forced portrait patch is awesome Feb 16 08:52:03 forced portrait??? why does everyone want portairat mode so badly? Feb 16 08:52:18 For one hand use? Feb 16 08:52:19 it's useful to have Feb 16 08:53:24 apparently rovio is at the intel applab Feb 16 08:53:35 Hm... and why would you want to use it with one hand? Cause your other is "busy"? *wink wink nudge nudge* :P Feb 16 08:53:43 LOL Feb 16 08:54:02 :) And you dont? are you a weirdo RobbieThe1st ? Feb 16 08:54:08 MohammadAG i don;t think forced portrait is awesome actully, as not all apps written properly to support portrait Feb 16 08:54:18 Certainly not on my phone :\ Feb 16 08:54:47 rootfs 228M 207M 18M 93% / <-- well not so bad... I'd still like to figure out what's abusing the space so much... time to start digging through var Feb 16 08:54:52 ZogG, it can be taken forth later on to include a whitelist Feb 16 08:55:07 I haven't checked my rootfs in ages... Feb 16 08:55:11 contacts app for example supports proper portrait mode Feb 16 08:55:44 but why is it forced? Feb 16 08:55:50 or.. Feb 16 08:55:56 is it forced or autorotated? Feb 16 08:57:07 difference? Feb 16 08:57:14 all windows are rotated by h-d Feb 16 08:57:22 h-d = hildon-desktop Feb 16 08:57:29 is angry birds in repo or just ovi? Feb 16 08:57:45 well forced sounds like it's always in portrait mode. Feb 16 08:57:49 lloft306, just ovi Feb 16 08:57:59 how could I force rotation ? web browser doesn't do Feb 16 08:58:04 k thnx Feb 16 08:58:59 amazing chat Feb 16 08:59:45 b004n, huh? Feb 16 09:00:00 i just like to see maemo fans Feb 16 09:00:06 nokia n900 Feb 16 09:00:10 b004n, :D Feb 16 09:00:14 MohammadAG, http://s3.amazonaws.com/twitpic/photos/full/242462267.png?AWSAccessKeyId=0ZRYP5X5F6FSMBCCSE82&Expires=1297847760&Signature=lTSyA5NlySWyAX4NOqh9ciCQyUQ%3D Feb 16 09:00:15 i luv the device Feb 16 09:00:28 ZogG, :) Feb 16 09:01:13 ZogG, could you link the twitpic page? Feb 16 09:01:19 so I can tweet it too Feb 16 09:01:20 guys what do u think will we see meego from nokia at all? Feb 16 09:01:44 b004n, well they said they were releasing a device, so I guess they are. Feb 16 09:01:56 mece, thx Feb 16 09:02:10 ms showing the nokia wp7 phone renders Feb 16 09:02:37 Cue "YOU SUCK", "UGLY" etc. Feb 16 09:02:43 LOL Feb 16 09:02:48 "BOOO!!" Feb 16 09:03:04 b004n, i love you Feb 16 09:03:13 just upset that nokia is not putting all efforts into maemo/meego as many of u, i see great potential from the device like n900 Feb 16 09:03:15 cto of nokia on stage Feb 16 09:03:22 Meh; My view is if it doesn't have a root *nix terminal, it's not worth having Feb 16 09:03:44 ZoG, luv u 2 ;-) Feb 16 09:04:56 rovio says porting angry birds to meego from maemo is a piece of cake (naturally) Feb 16 09:05:23 "big companies partnershipping" "big mass required to build a succesfull ecosystem" Feb 16 09:05:25 mece, it should be... enough of proprietary apis... Feb 16 09:05:47 "wp7 is brilliant" Feb 16 09:05:51 thought i just saw it in the appup Feb 16 09:06:02 LOOOOL Feb 16 09:06:15 lloft306, are you at the appup event? Feb 16 09:06:23 no Feb 16 09:06:34 lloft306, is there a stream or something? Feb 16 09:06:47 is MWC2011 still going on or what event you're talking about? Feb 16 09:06:59 no i was just on the angry birds page and saw a link to appup Feb 16 09:07:06 to get it Feb 16 09:07:25 guys does anybody upgraded n900 battery to a bigger one? is it worth it? i didnt overclock but it eats up the battery quickly Feb 16 09:07:48 b004n: Mugen's the only option Feb 16 09:08:11 Unless you want to make a custom one with two standard batteries and a soldering iron <_< Feb 16 09:08:24 RobbieThe1st, gotcha thx Feb 16 09:08:25 b004n: a spare battery and charger is probably as good or better Feb 16 09:08:33 fun... just found out where a lot of my rootfs space was hidding... /lib/modules/... forgot I made a backup copy of some modules... Feb 16 09:08:47 javispedro: so, are they simply bullshitting on stage, or do they have something to show? Feb 16 09:09:00 rootfs 228M 170M 55M 76% / that's more livable Feb 16 09:09:27 rst38h: bullshit, answering the "what if i am nokia developer" question now Feb 16 09:09:27 pupnik, chargers i have everywhere i go already... ;-) Feb 16 09:09:52 javispedro, can you ask what they were smoking when they made the partnership? Feb 16 09:09:57 ^^ Feb 16 09:10:02 "symbian not dead os, lots of phones shipping, more to ship" Feb 16 09:10:05 Probably something highly illegal Feb 16 09:10:14 lol Feb 16 09:10:26 MeeWant MeeGo Feb 16 09:10:43 mece, i saw what you did there =) Feb 16 09:10:45 hmm, Mee(Want + Go) Feb 16 09:11:06 "will you port qt to wp7?" "NO" Feb 16 09:11:13 mece, http://twitpic.com/40ct2z and it's @ZogG =) Feb 16 09:11:16 Elop is the 7th largest noninstitutional investor in MS, isnt it a conflict of interest in finn laws? Feb 16 09:11:28 that's it, I'm coming to Barcelona Feb 16 09:11:31 MohammadAG: Nah, nah, nah. /Mee[Want|Go]/ IIRC Feb 16 09:11:41 "build an ecosystem requires focus, ...., blah blah Feb 16 09:11:49 the model of wp7 is different Feb 16 09:11:55 rquires different framework Feb 16 09:11:58 so basically Feb 16 09:12:07 they switched all devs from gtk to Qt to .NET Feb 16 09:12:09 Yeah annoying times Feb 16 09:12:20 they dont want to bring another framework into the mix Feb 16 09:12:28 necause they think itll suck Feb 16 09:12:29 they already did Feb 16 09:12:33 No product has ever caused me to feel like this :D Feb 16 09:12:35 .NET??? Feb 16 09:12:38 not because qml is bad Feb 16 09:12:43 blah blah Feb 16 09:12:44 javispedro what is msqt.com ? =) Feb 16 09:13:05 javispedro can you say to them hello from us? =) Feb 16 09:13:12 no :) Feb 16 09:13:15 javispedro, seriously, can you ask about MeeGo or something? Feb 16 09:13:48 Oh well, I guess Nokia doesn't need my buisness. .NET's horrible, and I refuse to use it. Feb 16 09:13:59 ZogG, I'm guessing they're reading this channel backstage then whispering what should be said Feb 16 09:14:13 he akes questions Feb 16 09:14:16 MohammadAG, LOL! Feb 16 09:14:19 any question? Feb 16 09:14:39 when will we see MeeGo device? Feb 16 09:14:48 If I was there I'd shout "MEEGO FFS, WHERE'S MY N9" Feb 16 09:14:49 so, meego moves on, hooray! Feb 16 09:14:53 mece, http://twitpic.com/40cy9h another one =) Feb 16 09:15:02 javispedro, can u ask that? definite dates? Feb 16 09:15:09 MohammadAG, ^ Feb 16 09:15:42 any interestiiing question ;) Feb 16 09:15:52 "First 100 developers that have their app published in the #intel store get a cash prize !!!!!! #AppUpMWC" Feb 16 09:16:03 * MohammadAG looks for fart sounds on the internet Feb 16 09:16:23 heh Feb 16 09:16:35 javispedro, I'm pretty sure we're all not interested in WP7, so guess not :) Feb 16 09:16:50 well Feb 16 09:16:56 "Will it blend?" Feb 16 09:17:56 ^^ Feb 16 09:18:06 MohammadAG =) Feb 16 09:18:26 "First 100 developers that have their app published in the #intel store get a cash prize !!!!!! #AppUpMWC" / OMG OMG OMG OMG Feb 16 09:18:32 javispedro: Let me guess, they are both smiling like they are cats and just eaten a mouse? Feb 16 09:18:53 I don't think cats smile when they eat a mouse :p Feb 16 09:19:08 they smile when they talk about how they're been working together =) Feb 16 09:19:24 javispedro if the meego device succeed would it make Nokia to rethink the strategy ? Feb 16 09:19:37 RST38h, so far I haven't seen those smiles on either faces from the various photos I've seen Feb 16 09:20:09 javispedro ask about dual boot, if there is chance to have same device with option to choose WP7 or meego Feb 16 09:20:17 http://www.amnesty.si/files/images/Zoran Jankovic.preview.JPG <-- this guy on the other hand(our Mayor)... has that smile constantly ;) Feb 16 09:20:24 "nokia doesnt really see the need to innovate on the ui, they will center on hw & services" Feb 16 09:20:34 ruskie: Here is your first time: http://static2.businessinsider.com/image/4d55266accd1d5c33a150000/elop-ballmer-nokia.png Feb 16 09:20:51 seriously I can't say they have that smile... Feb 16 09:20:57 mece, MohammadAG i wouldn't be pissed off if you unfollow me, cause i write a lot in russian and less in english but i'm trying my best =) Feb 16 09:21:07 they actually look like idiots with those smiles Feb 16 09:21:10 now if only Ansii and friends could form a new small company Feb 16 09:21:27 ruskie: Consider the possibiilty of removing "like" Feb 16 09:21:35 MohammadAG, i would need laetr help on Qt and maemo SDK, started to make some app, if you don't mind =) Feb 16 09:21:48 RST38h, hehe ;) Feb 16 09:22:58 http://static2.businessinsider.com/image/4d55266accd1d5c33a150000/elop-ballmer-nokia.png should it be "smile and wave hand" as in madagascar with pinguins scene or should it be "hahaha nailed them@ Feb 16 09:23:28 Sigh, I really need libqtm-12-connectivity Feb 16 09:24:02 I guess for nokia and microsoft it's not a bad move anyway Feb 16 09:24:13 for nokia it is Feb 16 09:25:00 microsoft gets a huge hardware manufacturer, nokia doesn't need to care that much about innovation anymore, a thing which they weren't good at for years, and the possibly sell more hardware. Feb 16 09:25:40 They actually were pretty good at innovation Feb 16 09:25:42 I love my n900, but be honest, nokia has been a sleeping giant for years now Feb 16 09:25:51 And Microsoft has been pretty bad at innovation Feb 16 09:26:03 RST38h: agree with that second thing.. Feb 16 09:26:09 So, it leaves a question what kind of "innovation" we can expect as result of this quasi-merger Feb 16 09:26:14 but what innovative things has nokia released in the past years? Feb 16 09:26:15 microsoft really hasn't innovated on anything relevant in the last decade Feb 16 09:26:23 who is "ansii and friends"? Feb 16 09:26:56 possible planb ? Feb 16 09:27:00 erm possibly the planb guys? Feb 16 09:27:08 ruskie: only under its own definition of the word. Which is, "take something, glorify it, and sell it to the unsuspecting public". Feb 16 09:27:12 Shapeshifter: Smartphone. Mobile Internet. Gaming phone. Feb 16 09:27:30 Shapeshifter: Non-MIDI ringtones. Feb 16 09:27:38 Need more? Feb 16 09:27:39 there is no need for plan b Feb 16 09:27:40 Veggen_, actually take something... copy it exactly... merge with that other thing we coppied from those other guys... and sell it... Feb 16 09:27:42 RST38h: true, but that's years in the past Feb 16 09:27:54 RST38h: for the last 5 years at least, there hasn't been much coming from nokia Feb 16 09:27:55 Elop's strategy is correct Feb 16 09:28:04 his logic is sound Feb 16 09:28:13 problem with all those innovations is that nokia fucked them up Feb 16 09:28:15 jatt: Do you have a mathematical proof of correctness? Feb 16 09:28:20 absolutely Feb 16 09:28:24 I will publish it soon Feb 16 09:28:27 jatt: Please, demonstrate Feb 16 09:28:39 like with ngage, they went around talking to game developers asking them what they'd require to be able to make games for such a phone Feb 16 09:28:45 and then nokia ignored it all Feb 16 09:28:57 jarkkom_: right, ngage could have been huge Feb 16 09:29:01 Elop will bring nokia to a new level Feb 16 09:29:03 it almost took off, even Feb 16 09:29:24 but then, it was nothing but a fad Feb 16 09:29:37 Buying Nokia shares now wouldn't probably be a too shabby idea. Feb 16 09:30:00 shares will go up Feb 16 09:30:11 Shapeshifter, i agree ;-) Feb 16 09:30:39 http://i.imgur.com/MO36D.png Feb 16 09:31:04 what is this image Feb 16 09:31:10 is safe? Feb 16 09:31:15 jatt: maybe for a short term, but strategically value of Nokia will be diminished because they will loose its competitive advantage and unique value proposition Feb 16 09:31:24 yes Feb 16 09:31:31 jatt, yes Feb 16 09:31:38 RST38h: don't you agree? Feb 16 09:31:39 RST38h, ^ Feb 16 09:32:20 * ZogG xmms2> Wilco - Solitaire ["Wilco (The Album)" 2009] Feb 16 09:32:26 b004n: are you talking about Symbian? Feb 16 09:32:55 Shapeshifter: ? Feb 16 09:33:09 i just could not believe that a decison by Nokia will affect me and some of mh friends in such a way as an idiological failure ... Feb 16 09:33:10 RST38h: for at least 5 years, nokia has had no innovation. Feb 16 09:33:34 Shapeshifter maemo was kinda inovation Feb 16 09:33:37 b004n: Nokia's competitive advantage is their hardware. Now together with Microsoft they will also have a competitive advantage in their software Feb 16 09:33:38 jatt: Symbian included... but its more Feb 16 09:33:52 software is Microsoft's business Feb 16 09:33:58 if they add phone abilities from n700 it would be different Feb 16 09:33:59 hardware is Nokia's business Feb 16 09:34:13 jatt: disagree.. their uvp is the end product soft+hardware Feb 16 09:34:14 as all pads and tablets are now all about it Feb 16 09:34:17 ZogG: yeah, but it's never been marketed properly, it has been marketed the wrong way (leading to unhappy customers), and it's not been continued, right at the point where it started emerging beyond a geek gadget Feb 16 09:34:45 Shapeshifter coz they didn't think it would be the thing of 2011 =) Feb 16 09:35:09 they fail. now tablets are taking off Feb 16 09:35:19 and they had like a 3 year advantage Feb 16 09:35:20 or even more Feb 16 09:35:44 they started with the n700 or what it was called years ago, and now that tablets are taking off, they're killing it... seriously... Feb 16 09:36:08 i just could not believe that a decison by Nokia will affect me and some of mh friends in such a way as an idiological failure ... the problem instead of focusing bfinging meego first and then pushing it hard to create ecosystem around it will make a greater sense. Feb 16 09:36:23 there is no accountability in meego Feb 16 09:36:30 b004n the life is unfair Feb 16 09:36:55 you cannot say, as a manager, we need a release this date or that date Feb 16 09:36:58 wth is a cloud client Feb 16 09:36:59 the answer will be Feb 16 09:37:05 we will release it when it's ready Feb 16 09:37:15 such a nerdy response is useless for corporations Feb 16 09:37:22 ZogG, life is very fair. i see balance in many things. ;-) Feb 16 09:37:26 you can but it wouldn't work you know =) Feb 16 09:37:47 like it can work if you have enuf resources and people, but your release date should be logical Feb 16 09:38:11 no Feb 16 09:38:22 RST38h yes Feb 16 09:38:32 jatt: please stop now. Microsoft releases their software when its alpha and then releases service packs to get it to beta. Just please stop, ok? Feb 16 09:38:52 Per_n900: tru dat Feb 16 09:38:57 but you have a release date Feb 16 09:39:00 good call, Per_n900!!! Feb 16 09:39:05 ZogG: In reality, the management sells the non-existent, badly defined product to clients, then tels developers that they have to deliver it yesterday Feb 16 09:39:06 javispedro for phones i think it's client that help you to sync phone bookmrks photos with desktop or any other device Feb 16 09:39:07 with meego you don't Feb 16 09:39:12 jatt: huh? you forgot about how late vista was, already? Feb 16 09:39:16 like, 5 years late? Feb 16 09:39:16 you get "when it's ready" Feb 16 09:40:01 jatt: Meego has a release schedule Feb 16 09:40:02 Shapeshifter and it was shitty Feb 16 09:40:10 very Feb 16 09:40:13 well it was too late Feb 16 09:40:21 If you have not bothered to see it, does not mean it is not there Feb 16 09:40:22 release end of 2011? Feb 16 09:40:24 Shapeshifter but on other hand they fixed it with w7 pretty quick Feb 16 09:40:37 jatt: vista, do you remember it? Feb 16 09:40:47 jatt: sigh. YHou do not know what you are talking about. Feb 16 09:40:50 jatt look at any selfrespectfull opensource they do release on time Feb 16 09:40:52 or should I call it "longhorn" Feb 16 09:40:58 ubuntu / xfce4 e.g. Feb 16 09:41:29 so does microsoft everything wrong? Feb 16 09:41:33 I don't think so Feb 16 09:42:30 before it was how good you are in convincing people to buy your product, today people search for support and longterm support, they prefer to wait for something good than just jump in Feb 16 09:42:45 so promissing without delivering is mistake of nokia Feb 16 09:43:05 jatt: what have they done right?? Feb 16 09:43:10 ZogG: well in case of the n900, they delivered but it didn't do what they advertised Feb 16 09:43:21 their deal with nokia Feb 16 09:43:32 their ecosystem Feb 16 09:43:38 listen to Elop's words Feb 16 09:45:01 jatt: ok. You are right. All will be good. sigh. Feb 16 09:45:28 I still like intel though :< Feb 16 09:46:10 you are right Feb 16 09:46:18 the microsoft ui designer works pretty much like flash Feb 16 09:47:23 Shapeshifter jatt maybe it will be good with wp7 and Nokia will get profit and phones would be awesome, but it would make Nokia just another phone brand that has nothing special, it wouldn't be competitor to others as it would be the same phones as others =) Feb 16 09:48:07 I don't really know wp7, but microsoft products have a track record of disappointing me badly Feb 16 09:48:27 well n900 wasn't like anything else and only nerds bought it (I bought one) Feb 16 09:48:47 and nokia's strength is his hardware Feb 16 09:48:53 that's his business Feb 16 09:49:33 Nokia tried to be "something special" but then meego releases were damn to slow and they decided to go to the professionals Feb 16 09:49:58 nokia did not try to be special, it was special i.e. different from other offerings Feb 16 09:50:12 now it is not. do you think someone will by its devices? Feb 16 09:50:26 also check the sales of wp7 devices in 4q2010 and make conclusions Feb 16 09:50:34 I rather go for iPhone then a nokia with wp7. im afraid Feb 16 09:50:35 P Feb 16 09:50:36 jatt: professionals... Are you serious?????? Feb 16 09:50:40 well, anyway, considering that there still is competition e.g. on the android market, nokia has no worries Feb 16 09:50:41 absolutely Feb 16 09:51:04 microsoft are professionals and they provide accountability Feb 16 09:51:04 jatt: Frankly, you are either trolling or your head is stuck where sun does not shine Feb 16 09:51:08 if nokia makes better wp7 phones than other brands, they will have success. I don't see much of a problem for nokia. Feb 16 09:51:11 jatt: you are just a troll. Feb 16 09:51:25 jatt: Out of academic curiosity, which one it is? Feb 16 09:52:19 I love nokia I own a n900 myself, but open source has his flaws, and is a big pain in the neck for corporations to interact with their communities Feb 16 09:52:22 ms: "no plans to talk about native apps today" Feb 16 09:52:43 * MohammadAG translates to: we don't have any native apps yet Feb 16 09:53:08 i mean native as in non .net Feb 16 09:53:09 jatt: So, is it #2 then? Feb 16 09:53:39 Mohammad: They also do not have: localization, cut&paste, multitasking, and sd card support Feb 16 09:53:48 wat. Feb 16 09:53:56 no copy paste? Feb 16 09:54:00 no Feb 16 09:54:03 is this iOS3? Feb 16 09:54:09 that is horrible Feb 16 09:54:10 hmm some ukraine guy just made 4g modem driver for linux for Sagem f@st 9520 and Seowon SWU-3220A =) Feb 16 09:54:10 no, it is WP7. happy now? Feb 16 09:54:11 it has smart copy & paste Feb 16 09:54:12 no sd card support?? Feb 16 09:54:19 the kinda that decides you only want to copy numbers Feb 16 09:54:21 No. Feb 16 09:54:23 it has copy paste Feb 16 09:54:28 phone numbers that is Feb 16 09:54:31 it WILL have copy paste Feb 16 09:54:31 what do you mean, no multitasking... Okay I haven't had a single look at wp7 Feb 16 09:54:34 Not HAS Feb 16 09:54:35 the microsoft guy also said they invented copy paste!! Feb 16 09:54:45 microsoft also invented bash scripts Feb 16 09:54:50 well, at least they have the patent Feb 16 09:54:50 (on the desktop that is ;) ) Feb 16 09:54:51 javispedro: "We invente copypaste. Again." Feb 16 09:54:53 xD Feb 16 09:55:02 jorma ollila will talk on a finnish tv program today Feb 16 09:55:16 never heard of that bum Feb 16 09:55:19 who is he Feb 16 09:55:27 ah wait, not bash, sudo Feb 16 09:55:28 jatt what is th problem to interact, when users just say what they expect and even give you ready for use solution ( for example nokia could built in fmms in pr1.3) =) Feb 16 09:55:34 microsoft patented sudo Feb 16 09:55:51 jatt, troll Feb 16 09:56:02 javispedro did they invent blue color? Feb 16 09:56:16 ZogG: they invented rainbows Feb 16 09:56:19 Shapeshifter seriously they patented sudo? Feb 16 09:56:21 but no gold at the end Feb 16 09:56:30 ZogG: http://www.groklaw.net/article.php?story=20091111094923390 Feb 16 09:56:41 ZogG: pretty much, yes. Feb 16 09:56:44 "if you want to develop for wp7 on a mac, just install windows on it!" (audience laughs) Feb 16 09:56:53 it's liek kamasutra, thousands of people were sweating and trying hard and some guy just made a book and got all attention =) Feb 16 09:56:53 RST38h: they have sd card support Feb 16 09:57:01 RST38h: there was a thing about htc hd2 Feb 16 09:57:03 javispedro, oh god Feb 16 09:57:06 javispedro hahah =) Feb 16 09:57:12 RST38h: there is sd card inside Feb 16 09:57:23 jacekowski: Does not count Feb 16 09:57:26 RST38h: phone is just not made to be user replaceable Feb 16 09:57:37 ehm Feb 16 09:57:39 not a phone Feb 16 09:57:42 /ignore jatt Feb 16 09:57:43 card itself Feb 16 09:57:43 jacekowski: to be fair they do require sd connectors on devices BUT force OEMs to block them from usage Feb 16 09:57:59 jacekowski; apparently got plans to swap to sd card, based on some info Feb 16 09:58:03 I'll need to try one of these wp7 things some day. sounds like a horrible OS Feb 16 09:58:10 Shapeshifter: not really Feb 16 09:58:14 Shapeshifter: it's quite nice os Feb 16 09:58:23 way better than first iphone os Feb 16 09:58:26 Ah, wait, have I forgotten that WP7 comes with CGA-like colors? Feb 16 09:58:28 but he just said "no multitasking and no copy/paste" Feb 16 09:58:32 but still bit behind Feb 16 09:58:38 jacekowski: well that comparison is a bit unfair Feb 16 09:58:42 the first ios was horrible Feb 16 09:58:53 actually, ios was laughable until ios4 imo Feb 16 09:58:58 now it's not so bad Feb 16 09:59:31 Shapeshifter: Based on previous experience with Windows, I am sure that WP will be laughable to the very end Feb 16 09:59:46 :> Feb 16 09:59:59 rst38h: according to ui guy here, wp7 colors inspired by "public transportation systems" Feb 16 10:00:07 lol Feb 16 10:00:12 jacekowski, i bet it's nice but once again not for 2011, in 2011 people do know computer and want to configurate it as they want, they want choice. maybe back in 90 not everyone knew what is what and they just used what they had, today most of people know how to handle computer and everyone want to work as it's comfy for him Feb 16 10:00:13 Shit, I am still laughing every time Win7 decides to take a 40-second break from work Feb 16 10:00:15 (thats why the call the ui "metro" seemingly) Feb 16 10:00:22 javispedro: OMG Feb 16 10:00:39 well i would even say better than iphone os 2.0 i had Feb 16 10:00:46 javispedro: Those Redmond mushrooms must have been really bad Feb 16 10:01:23 RST38h: i never had problems with windows 7 Feb 16 10:01:26 javispedro: I do think they have chosen the wrong kind Feb 16 10:01:33 jacekowski: Lucky, lucky guy Feb 16 10:01:35 RST38h, i think you are too negative and fan boy, i don't like windows as well but i have nothing against it, it's just doesn't suit my requirements Feb 16 10:02:07 one thing i hate about windows that they choose standarts =( Feb 16 10:02:13 ZogG: You do not become positive after having to do work on something that barely works Feb 16 10:02:36 ZogG: And of course you have to keep in mind that it is not Win7 in general but a particular corporate install of it Feb 16 10:03:09 corporate installs of windows are making me choke myself Feb 16 10:03:47 i have windows at work at computer for browsing and fun and it's enuf to surf web and watch a movie. but it would be enuf to do what i do daily with my computer Feb 16 10:04:44 RST38h Shapeshifter it was just the thought that something free can't be better, but now for making contract with MS any guy in corporation who is responsible for it just get a lot of money Feb 16 10:04:55 it's the same not only in computers Feb 16 10:04:57 "enuf"? Feb 16 10:05:00 http://hyperboleandahalf.blogspot.com/2010/04/alot-is-better-than-you-at-everything.html related Feb 16 10:05:44 and is wp7 so bad? Feb 16 10:05:48 what are the issues? Feb 16 10:05:50 too slow? Feb 16 10:07:05 jatt: No Xterm Feb 16 10:07:27 I mean for normal users Feb 16 10:07:30 no geeks Feb 16 10:08:27 ie as default browser =) Feb 16 10:08:58 so those are the issues? Feb 16 10:09:08 no issues Feb 16 10:09:14 move along, please, nothing to see here Feb 16 10:09:41 jatt: oh not you again ._. Feb 16 10:09:46 symbian > wp7 Feb 16 10:09:49 and symbian is *bad* Feb 16 10:10:14 maemo > * Feb 16 10:10:44 maemo is a pretty bad distro though Feb 16 10:10:51 still awesome for a mobile Feb 16 10:10:57 http://twitpic.com/40clee Feb 16 10:10:57 but it's so broken :| Feb 16 10:11:13 what does ld: cannot find -lQtConnectivity Feb 16 10:11:15 collect2: ld returned 1 exit status mean? Feb 16 10:11:16 why is it bad? and why is it broken Feb 16 10:11:39 achipa, I can confirm it's a packaging issue btw Feb 16 10:11:55 achipa, but I'm unable to build libqtm, so can't fix it Feb 16 10:12:03 anyway, I only need the headers and bluetooth libs Feb 16 10:12:46 ZogG: oh please Feb 16 10:12:49 the problem of maemo was that it was meant to be for one device only so it's not that customizable and have bad framework e.g. most of UI parts are built in and you can install 3rd party apps but not really change them as system default at least not everywhere Feb 16 10:12:49 ZogG: too much deviation from standard linux practices. Things like busybox, too much hacking in the init process, weird useless stuff like BME etc. Feb 16 10:12:52 ~messybox Feb 16 10:12:53 messy... err busybox is meant for lean scripting. Regarding all the missing options and immanent limitations (see su) it's not really the interactive shell of choice. A lot of people hate busybox because a lot of system integrators don't understand the difference between busybox and a decent user interactive shell plus unix utils Feb 16 10:12:56 ~optification Feb 16 10:12:56 methinks optification is a inventive duct tape workaround to reclaim space in fs root, done due to the fact the partitioning is FUBAR, or http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo_5_Developer_Guide/Packaging,_Deploying_and_Distributing/Installing_under_opt_and_MyDocs, or ""OMG - I wish somebody had looked into FHS and moved /usr to eMMC"", or http://www.pathname.com/fhs/pub/fhs-2.3.html#PURPOSE2 bullet1,2 and fhs-2.3.html#PURPOSE16 sentence3 Feb 16 10:13:10 exactly Feb 16 10:13:22 maemo is very messy Feb 16 10:13:56 Maemo 5 is messier than the rest Feb 16 10:14:02 I mean, great think that we actually have a pretty cool linux phone now, instead of some hacked-up community project running on an iphone or something, but it's still messy Feb 16 10:14:10 Shapeshifter Nokia just don't know how to work with opensource, they wanted devs to develop but not change or control, they wanted to be in cioontrol of everything system releated Feb 16 10:14:10 s/think/thing Feb 16 10:14:48 oh and the one thing they *should* have changed is package management. having the index offline and using apt is inane Feb 16 10:14:53 takes years to do anything in HAM Feb 16 10:15:08 ??? Feb 16 10:15:47 apt is awesome, shut up Feb 16 10:15:48 so you're on one hand complaining about diverging, and on the other you request diverging from apt? Feb 16 10:15:55 it's HAM's fault for being a sluggy fat elephant Feb 16 10:15:57 People, why is everyone suddenly an armchair analyst who knows everything about Nokia, its capacities and business strategy? Feb 16 10:16:08 does "hal-device bme" show an exact battery info? cause i full charged the battery and it shows 95% only and after 2 hours, the output percentage didn't change Feb 16 10:16:08 RST38h: no we're just complaining about nerd stuff now Feb 16 10:16:11 we can do that Feb 16 10:16:14 javispedro: the index should be on the server. the server should perform searches, the handset shouldn't need to reload the entire database everytime I click on "download" in HAM. Feb 16 10:16:22 javispedro: do you think HAM is good? Feb 16 10:16:23 fully* Feb 16 10:16:35 HAM is good Feb 16 10:16:36 I mean, I don't care much about jatt or other lesser known candidates for /ignore, but I thought much better about a lot of other people Feb 16 10:16:37 compengi: the percentage indicator is *at best* a fair estimate Feb 16 10:16:37 on an i5 Feb 16 10:16:56 javispedro, HAM != apt :) Feb 16 10:17:08 well. apt is a different story... Feb 16 10:17:15 kerio, why then doesn't it change constantly Feb 16 10:17:27 compengi: because it's usally a bad estimate Feb 16 10:17:28 :) Feb 16 10:18:15 i'd only trust the... hmm... first decimal digit? Feb 16 10:18:46 MohammanAG: Ham is a frontend to apt. Feb 16 10:19:12 javispedro, no, it's a frontend to apt-worker Feb 16 10:19:18 Mohammad: Could you also add the author of each change to the changelog? Feb 16 10:19:20 apt-worker is a frontend to apt Feb 16 10:19:30 Mohammad: And if it has been fixed by Nokia, just say "Nokia" Feb 16 10:19:37 RST38h, hmm? Feb 16 10:20:07 So, what linux distros do you guys use these days? Feb 16 10:20:14 Slackware Feb 16 10:20:20 *cue in the holy war* Feb 16 10:20:26 Mohammad: In the CSSU changelog, it would be useful to know who made which change Feb 16 10:20:33 Shadikka: :) Feb 16 10:20:41 Arch and Debian. :P Feb 16 10:22:34 RST38h, I see, it's all on gitorious so shouldn't be hard Feb 16 10:22:42 I use Ubuntu Vista Feb 16 10:22:53 who uses Debian 7? Feb 16 10:23:00 Probably me Feb 16 10:23:04 I use Fedora XP Feb 16 10:23:20 it's much better than Slackware ME Feb 16 10:23:24 what about Red Hat ME? Feb 16 10:23:49 is that a service pack to Red Hat 98plus! ? Feb 16 10:24:41 yeah, it's service pack 2! Feb 16 10:24:50 you forgot about Red Hat 98SE Feb 16 10:36:24 http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/news/2026587/plan-b-uprising-nokia-leadership-dies-death Feb 16 10:36:38 hi all :) Feb 16 10:37:11 nine shareholders lol Feb 16 10:37:28 does N900 support CDMA EVDO REV A, CDMA 2000 1X? Feb 16 10:37:33 absolutely Feb 16 10:37:34 jatt: well, you too could be a shareholder, for under 10dol'u Feb 16 10:37:44 also, does it take an R-UIM card? Feb 16 10:37:50 Sicelo: n900 only does gsm Feb 16 10:38:02 yeah but 9? and why they didn't speak up when the _majority_ of shareholders agreed with Elop's strategy? Feb 16 10:38:14 ahh, thanks timeless Feb 16 10:38:27 jatt: they probably weren't asked Feb 16 10:38:43 jatt: did the majority of shareholds agree? Feb 16 10:39:09 oh yeah Feb 16 10:39:45 Nokia can't do anything without its shareholder's agreement Feb 16 10:40:16 and that is subject to manipulations... Feb 16 10:40:27 http://www.thedailymash.co.uk/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=3537&Itemid=74 Feb 16 10:40:42 are you saying Elop's election as CEO was manipulated? Feb 16 10:40:42 * RST38h sighs and /ignores the troll Feb 16 10:40:43 ruskie: you mean bribes? Feb 16 10:40:52 :) Feb 16 10:42:08 alterego, no... you don't need those if you know how to manipulate people Feb 16 10:42:16 there is no proof Feb 16 10:42:19 Elop is legit Feb 16 10:42:38 Meh, who cares? Feb 16 10:42:51 who cares what? Feb 16 10:43:14 How Elop became CEO Feb 16 10:43:20 Can't change it. Feb 16 10:43:30 there are ways to change it Feb 16 10:43:30 I say we just wait and see Feb 16 10:43:38 but I'd rather not say them out loud Feb 16 10:43:50 Elop comes in, share goes down - never a miscommunication Feb 16 10:43:55 you can't explain that! Feb 16 10:43:58 Why don't we have a silent protest Feb 16 10:44:20 share will go up Feb 16 10:44:38 alterego, because silence == acceptance Feb 16 10:44:42 the new phone with wp7 will be a revolution Feb 16 10:45:00 and then stocks will rise Feb 16 10:45:01 It'll be shit, because WP7 is crap Feb 16 10:45:37 the Elop hate here is unbelievable Feb 16 10:45:38 "We'll do all your software, you just do what you're good at, cameras and hardware" Feb 16 10:46:01 jatt: selecting Elop doesn't select a strategy, it selects a CEO Feb 16 10:46:04 Wp7's not gonna be any better than Windiows Feb 16 10:46:08 CEO then picks a strategy Feb 16 10:46:20 Which is mainly used because of the legacy software problem Feb 16 10:46:33 RobbieThe1st: except without legacy software Feb 16 10:47:26 ok, maybe you are right, I see some pictures of wp7 and it looks like zune, that sucks Feb 16 10:47:40 alterego: the WP7 phone will be a total flop, they'll kick Elop in the butt, nokia will go back to making awesome phones with a mediocre OS like it did, and everything will stay the same Feb 16 10:47:45 jatt, I've used it, it's just boring Feb 16 10:47:49 discussion of wp7 should be banned, it has nothing to do wih maemo Feb 16 10:47:56 it looks boring all black and white Feb 16 10:48:02 wtf Feb 16 10:48:30 trolls should be banned... Feb 16 10:48:34 indeed Feb 16 10:48:38 but then /ignore helps Feb 16 10:48:40 Boring and lacking key functions that you expect from a device, things that S60 always had and Maemo always had. Feb 16 10:48:42 where's the ops when you needed them? Feb 16 10:48:55 alterego: sorry, maemo was missing Feb 16 10:49:08 timeless: so? does wp7 have that? :D Feb 16 10:49:18 it was also missing Snakes! Feb 16 10:49:20 * ruskie never used sound recorder on any phone he had... Feb 16 10:49:25 timeless: easy app that was released after about two months :P Feb 16 10:49:55 I'm not going to buy a phone that doesn't have multitasking and copy & paste Feb 16 10:49:57 Also - sim toolkit just got a lot more vital. Feb 16 10:50:02 http://www.theregister.co.uk/2011/02/14/facebook_sim/ Feb 16 10:50:18 holy crap.. Feb 16 10:50:32 alterego: oddly, c+p isn't really that necessary Feb 16 10:50:32 * ruskie tries to figure out how fecesbook on sim is actually vital... Feb 16 10:50:33 I recall DocScrutinizer said something about SIM toolkit, something dreaded about them iirc Feb 16 10:50:34 you nikiaplan? people have been busy Feb 16 10:51:06 timeless, I've used c+p more often than sms ;) Feb 16 10:51:09 toggles: have you seen http://www.nokiaplanx.com/ Feb 16 10:51:26 most people use facebook Feb 16 10:51:29 of course is vital Feb 16 10:51:47 Sim toolkit + facebook is a way of letting _really_ cheap phones use it. Ones without internet Feb 16 10:52:12 SpeedEvil: yeah that was a wierd coincidence Feb 16 10:52:25 wonder how well would that work Feb 16 10:52:44 I thought Facade-book already had sms options. Feb 16 10:53:10 I thought that was pay service :) Feb 16 10:53:16 alterego: sure, but that doesn't make it easy to use Feb 16 10:53:30 it sounds like this gives you access to more than just status updates Feb 16 10:53:57 Yeah, the basic sim menu system sounds cool Feb 16 10:54:15 Though I wouldn't personally use it, it's just a cool basic tech :) Feb 16 10:54:45 is there a way to use the maemo flasher with libusb 0.1.3? Feb 16 10:55:16 Oh now you're cross posting :P Feb 16 10:55:28 wow sounds ancient that version Feb 16 10:55:30 bash`: does it not work for you? What OS are you running? Feb 16 10:56:06 alterego: I'm using Arch Linux, and libusb version is 0.1.3, if I downgrade to 0.1.12 it works Feb 16 10:56:35 Interesting, and what does it say when it's not working? Feb 16 10:57:06 ZogG, That's why I implemented translate in tweed suit :) (regarding you tweeting in russian that you mentioned some hours ago) Feb 16 10:57:08 alterego: Unable to enumerate USB buses Feb 16 10:58:05 bash`: is that dmesg output? Feb 16 10:58:12 alterego: no, that's flasher output Feb 16 10:58:21 Hrm, weird Feb 16 10:58:34 some talk about different "ecosystems", can't we just make one? Feb 16 10:59:10 ketas: where's the fun and drama in that? And what ecosystem would you suggest? Feb 16 10:59:10 microsoft already has a great ecosystem Feb 16 10:59:28 no need to make a new one Feb 16 10:59:39 jatt: I admit, MSDN is very good and the tools are extremely good. Feb 16 10:59:45 But so is Qt Feb 16 10:59:52 And Qt is more fun Feb 16 11:00:02 And portable Feb 16 11:00:13 why microsoft doesn't rule the world then? Feb 16 11:00:32 but qt has no ecosystem Feb 16 11:00:43 jatt: it has a great ecosystem, Feb 16 11:00:46 is just a bunch of hackers Feb 16 11:00:54 most in basements Feb 16 11:00:57 no accountability there Feb 16 11:01:03 qt.nokia.com is brilliant. Feb 16 11:01:10 http://tabulacrypticum.wordpress.com/2011/02/15/a-tech-ecosystem-for-the-rest-of-us/ Feb 16 11:01:19 then there's the qt developer site. Feb 16 11:01:25 #qt Feb 16 11:01:43 Skype uses Qt Feb 16 11:01:53 and last I checked, Skype isn't a bunch of hackers Feb 16 11:01:55 alterego: is there a way to get maemo-flasher sources? Feb 16 11:02:00 bash`, no Feb 16 11:02:29 since when bunch of hackers became insult Feb 16 11:02:29 bash`: why are you loading kernel anyway? use uboot. Feb 16 11:02:45 ketas, it's not an insult Feb 16 11:03:00 bash`: enable the extras-devel repo on your N900 and install the uboot kernel. Feb 16 11:03:02 s/insult/something bad/ Feb 16 11:03:02 ketas meant: since when bunch of hackers became something bad Feb 16 11:03:02 alterego: right, uboot is a solution Feb 16 11:03:14 what ketas said. MohammadAG I think he was referring to jatt's comment. Feb 16 11:03:20 Then it'll load meego auto magically if you have the microsd inserted. Feb 16 11:04:21 bash`: you can also get it to boot maemo manually by interrupting the timeout on boot and typing "run noloboot" Feb 16 11:04:22 alterego: the last time I used it (a couple of months ago) I was not able to edit the default boot, I'd like to run Maemo as default Feb 16 11:04:44 bash`: which is generally what I do when I can't be bothered to take out the sd card Feb 16 11:05:06 ok Feb 16 11:05:11 I'd also want it to default to noloboot Feb 16 11:05:13 bash`: yeah, it's a shame you can't change the default. but meh, how often to you reboot :P Feb 16 11:05:26 uboot is oss afaict Feb 16 11:05:47 mece: should be quite easy to do, but I don't know off hand how, maybe have a chat with stskeeps in #meego-arm Feb 16 11:05:53 alterego: never :P but once it rebooted because of a "kernel error" or something like that Feb 16 11:06:27 bash`: :) Well like I said, if you interrupt the boot count down you can type "run noloboot" to get it to go to maemo Feb 16 11:06:50 yes I know that...installing uboot :) Feb 16 11:07:14 * bash` needs to buy a microSD class 6! Feb 16 11:07:30 bash`: also, you can always download the uboot kernel package and install it and uninstall it when you don't plan on using meego for a while. Feb 16 11:07:42 bash`: my class 4 works great tbh :P Feb 16 11:07:51 alterego: class 2, too slow! Feb 16 11:08:05 emmc ftw Feb 16 11:08:06 yeah that is probably quite bad :d Feb 16 11:09:00 btw, Meegons are awesome :D Feb 16 11:09:25 alterego: wrong channel again :P Feb 16 11:09:32 Is a MeeGone what they call us after the MS deal? :D Feb 16 11:09:36 jk Feb 16 11:09:43 :D Feb 16 11:10:02 Or is a MeeGon what the LHC are looking for? Feb 16 11:10:26 alterego, oh yeah, I thought it sounded familiar Feb 16 11:11:05 MeeGon could be a cool name for a game :P Feb 16 11:11:17 With the little meego characters Feb 16 11:11:23 hee Feb 16 11:11:25 :D Feb 16 11:11:50 they run around a labyrinth and eat heads of people called stephen or steve? Feb 16 11:12:06 alterego: www.meegos.com :P Feb 16 11:12:28 MeeGo - MeeGos - MeeGon Feb 16 11:12:40 wtf? Feb 16 11:13:19 gh Feb 16 11:16:53 Morning Feb 16 11:19:14 huhu Feb 16 11:19:21 Aloha Feb 16 11:38:12 mece what is tweed suit and you prob don't have it on n900 =) Feb 16 11:41:22 RST38h, http://www.newmoldova.com/node/489 Feb 16 11:42:51 actually anyone who interested it's interesting review of CS championship in club with gentoo on computers without harddrives =) Feb 16 11:45:07 hi there Feb 16 11:45:23 I have seen that the kernel used by the n900 is quite old Feb 16 11:45:48 is not possible to use the mainline kernel? Feb 16 11:46:04 MeeGo uses 2.6.37 Feb 16 11:47:26 <_nicolai_> Hi, anyone had time to look at my patch for bug 11933 (Community SSUs hildon-home)? Feb 16 11:47:27 Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/11933 desktop edit menu can not handle additional desktops (5-9) Feb 16 11:47:30 Someone know what mean the fast blinking orange led ? Feb 16 11:47:46 MohammadAG, so what's the difference between maemo and meeGo? Feb 16 11:47:55 vanezy: unfortunately not, as a lot of closed components are unupgradeable to new versions ov kernel. Feb 16 11:47:59 ok ... low battery Feb 16 11:48:03 didn't charge via usb Feb 16 11:48:15 alterego, for instance? Feb 16 11:48:31 _nicolai_, it'll be in the next update (haven't updated git/bmo yet) Feb 16 11:48:56 vanezy: sgx, bme, mce, libisi, the list is probably quite long. Feb 16 11:49:11 Also sysfs has a habit of changing and screwing other stuff. Feb 16 11:49:32 alterego, shouldn't you be the one talking about MeeGo? Feb 16 11:49:33 So I wouldn't be suprised if there was a lot of stuff that needs tweaking both open and closed. Feb 16 11:49:40 <_nicolai_> ah, ty. I wasn't sure if this patch is working.(Don't have much experience with git) Feb 16 11:49:55 MohammadAG: when necessary :P Feb 16 11:50:00 Go MeeGo Go! Feb 16 11:50:14 alterego, got it.. do you know if MeeGo is better than Maemo? Feb 16 11:50:28 vanezy: depends what you mean by "better" :P Feb 16 11:50:30 alterego, it uses a newer kernel compared to Maemo Feb 16 11:50:58 It's not user ready if that's what you mean, but it is technically better and certainly on the leading edge of software versions. Feb 16 11:51:04 alterego, ok you're right.. the question then is: what are the advantages of using maemo instead of MeeGo? Feb 16 11:51:38 vanezy: everything works? :P Feb 16 11:52:08 Currently MeeGo is only good for platform developers and app devs that want to get a headstart. Feb 16 11:52:13 alterego, uhm.. not everything because it uses an old kernel Feb 16 11:52:31 That's MeeGo handset. MeeGo netbook I hear is very good. Feb 16 11:52:37 but for example do you know if is possible to use usb-host mode with n900 in MeeGo? Feb 16 11:52:46 And the new tablet UX looks very cool. Feb 16 11:52:49 cool Feb 16 11:53:05 vanezy: no, it's not possible to use usb host in MeeGo Feb 16 11:53:11 ah ok Feb 16 11:53:18 that's not good.. do you know why? Feb 16 11:53:30 And like maemo, you'll need a custom/non-official kernel. Feb 16 11:53:39 alterego, got it Feb 16 11:54:07 BTW, what prevents using the MeeGo kernel in Maemo? Presumably closed source connections between modules and/or user-land and the kernel? Feb 16 11:54:20 * alterego is suprised his thumbs don't ache the ammount he types on his N900 Feb 16 11:54:29 :D Feb 16 11:54:40 I donmt think I've used my laptop in about a week except to watch a dvd .. Feb 16 11:54:52 Jaffa: i suspect people haven't tried Feb 16 11:55:37 if the meego kernel supports all of the components which the maemo kernel had to hack in, then in theory it should work Feb 16 11:55:57 uhm ok Feb 16 11:55:57 offhand, i suspect the meego kernel doesn't offer the watermark stuff Feb 16 11:56:06 timeless: watermark? Feb 16 11:56:07 watermark? Feb 16 11:56:09 but that didn't actually work in maemo5 so not having it might not be a big deal Feb 16 11:56:18 watermark? Feb 16 11:57:22 timeless: It seems no-one knows what "the watermark stuff" is ;-) Feb 16 11:57:33 ... Feb 16 11:57:55 hum ... strange battery problem on my n900 Feb 16 11:58:10 moo Feb 16 11:59:14 bbl Feb 16 12:00:38 http://mxr.mozilla.org/mozilla1.9.2/source/xpcom/base/nsMemoryImpl.cpp#137 Feb 16 12:00:43 for lack of a better reference Feb 16 12:01:06 Jaffa, I tried it Feb 16 12:01:37 it failed somewhere after loading the kernel Feb 16 12:01:44 I don't have sources though Feb 16 12:02:19 http://mxr.maemo.org/diablo/search?string=watermark <- slow search Feb 16 12:02:23 http://mxr.maemo.org/diablo/source/glibc-2.5.0/glibc-2.5/sysdeps/unix/bsd/bsd4.4/bits/ioctls.h#139 <- libc bits Feb 16 12:04:26 http://mxr.maemo.org/diablo/source/kernel-source-diablo-2.6.21/kernel-source/security/lowmem.c#40 <- is /probably/ the right part of the kernel Feb 16 12:05:33 http://mxr.maemo.org/fremantle/source/kernel/security/lowmem.c <- is the equivalent bits in fremantle Feb 16 12:10:34 hi there Feb 16 12:10:53 I'm watching the debian/patches/series file Feb 16 12:11:23 you (the usb host mode team) have modified it with strings like: Feb 16 12:11:35 #usbhostmode.diff Feb 16 12:11:44 stuff... Feb 16 12:11:50 usbhostmode.diff Feb 16 12:11:56 #usbhostmode.diff Feb 16 12:12:00 sorry Feb 16 12:12:05 bt-mice.diff Feb 16 12:12:15 why have you put those #? Feb 16 12:12:43 HI folks Feb 16 12:13:09 Would it be masochistic to port meego-touch on maemo? :D Feb 16 12:14:26 KevinB: it is already ported afaik. Feb 16 12:14:29 KevinB: should work Feb 16 12:15:02 hooo yep, its demo is widget gallery is that it? Feb 16 12:15:17 KevinB: something like that, yes Feb 16 12:15:41 so what about creating a full meego-touch UI for maemo Feb 16 12:15:48 vanezy: eh? sorry, please elaborate Feb 16 12:16:03 vanezy: and this chan isn't the hostmode-team Feb 16 12:16:25 yep you're right Feb 16 12:16:34 some users here in are memers of h-e-n Feb 16 12:16:47 members* Feb 16 12:16:54 it's better to go in the other chan then Feb 16 12:17:10 I doubt Feb 16 12:17:31 I think t-tan kept all patches in there Feb 16 12:17:39 the old non-working ones, and the working ones by paul Feb 16 12:17:43 he also kept the egoshin patches Feb 16 12:17:45 but they're commented out Feb 16 12:17:52 aaah Feb 16 12:17:55 anyway I'm trying to patch the kernel manually Feb 16 12:18:01 with quilt Feb 16 12:18:34 MohammadAG, ah ok Feb 16 12:18:49 cool Feb 16 12:19:48 the problem is that when I patch it patches just to the nokia-20094803.3+0m5.diff Feb 16 12:19:51 that's the first Feb 16 12:19:55 I never wrapped my head around how titan is handling that powerkernel stuff, just heard a lot of devels moaning and swearing Feb 16 12:19:55 I got Applied patch nokia-20094803.3+0m5.diff Feb 16 12:20:28 I did: export QUILT_PATCHES=/usr/src/kernel-power-2.6.28/debian/patches Feb 16 12:20:41 export QUILT_SERIES=/usr/src/kernel-power-2.6.28/debian/patches/series Feb 16 12:20:46 quilt push Feb 16 12:20:55 it should be ok this command to patch all Feb 16 12:21:02 shouldn't? Feb 16 12:21:05 it? Feb 16 12:21:30 quilt push -a Feb 16 12:21:56 why don't you just use fakeroot dpkg-buildpackage -b btw Feb 16 12:22:00 uhm I did it but I got: The topmost patch nokia-20094803.3+0m5.diff needs to be refreshed first. Feb 16 12:22:14 I used quilt refresh but it goes in "tilt" Feb 16 12:22:27 MohammadAG, because I want to create another patch Feb 16 12:22:38 then put it in debian/patches :P Feb 16 12:22:40 and so I need the last version of the code Feb 16 12:22:52 yep but in order to create it I need the code :P Feb 16 12:23:03 ~lart titan for not using git Feb 16 12:23:03 * infobot keeps mailing titan free America Online CDs until he drowns for not using git Feb 16 12:27:23 doing quilt refresh nokia-20094803.3+0m5.diff Feb 16 12:27:34 I get: Patch nokia-20094803.3+0m5.diff is not applied Feb 16 12:31:35 bah, i really wonder why the OS that came with my N810 seemed to be different from what i reflashed it with. another thing i realized now is that, when i'd disconnect the power, it'd show me a popup saying that i should remember to unplug the charger. now it doesn't. Feb 16 12:32:09 o.O Feb 16 12:33:05 do your devices do that? Feb 16 12:34:17 mine frequently does, even double - with some weird tana-fi-charger-notify nonsense - since I installed some applet I guess Feb 16 12:35:35 drives me mad, I'd consider it a major bugfix when it finally shut up on charger plug removal :-D But that's no answer to your question, sorry Feb 16 12:37:11 question: how much CPU power (and therefore electricity) does it consume to show all those warnings? :P Feb 16 12:37:24 little Feb 16 12:37:41 yeah i know, not enough irony Feb 16 12:39:38 well, at least I can say I had no major OS update since maybe 2 years on N810, so no idea what's happening if you do that nowadays Feb 16 12:40:32 well, the mystery is this: the seller told me that he had flashed the device with the latest version (he gave me the link he used) before shipping it to me. that's the same version that i used, and reflashing it i don't get back the things that i had initially. Feb 16 12:40:41 * DocScrutinizer makes mental note in RED to finally update spare N810 from what it shipped with Feb 16 12:41:06 so the only explanation i can think of right now is that i had immediately installed some app that modified the system's behavior, but i can't think which... Feb 16 12:41:21 or, the seller is lying and he modified stuff :P but he seems like a very careful fellow Feb 16 12:42:30 LjL: maybe he flashed rootfs but not the user settings? but then I don't see ho that shall work out on N810/diablo, with /home on NAND Feb 16 12:42:53 LjL: maybe he had something installed. Feb 16 12:43:32 i don't recall seeing anything special in application manager though Feb 16 12:43:55 the funny stuff doesn'T show up in HAM Feb 16 12:44:04 i don't really complain, as if i want to, i think i can replicate those behaviors... Feb 16 12:44:09 i'm just puzzled Feb 16 12:45:53 LjL: btw, are you happy with your N810? :) Feb 16 12:47:15 Venemo: not very, but i'm not entirely unhappy either. as to software availability and ease of use, Android would have seemed a better choice for my sister. i'm not sure about the Archos 5 though, since it's stuck on 1.6 and apparently can't use Flash... but i suspect it'd have been a better choice Feb 16 12:47:35 LjL: not necessarily Feb 16 12:47:45 LjL: and what does your sister think? Feb 16 12:47:49 at the same time, the N810 does what i meant it to do - reading ebooks, browsing the web, communicating, and some little games - if not exceptionally well, so i can't say it let me down entirely Feb 16 12:47:58 Venemo: haven't given it to her yet, her birthday is in march Feb 16 12:48:08 still got time to tweak it :P Feb 16 12:48:15 oh. so you're playing with it for yourself now :P Feb 16 12:48:19 yes ;) Feb 16 12:48:23 right now i'm trying to get some sort of wifi geolocation to work on it Feb 16 12:49:42 it's certainly a cool device to tinker with, although the motivation for that is scarce now that the OS is abandoned Feb 16 12:49:52 you know what I really miss on my N900? Feb 16 12:50:08 LjL: well you could work on the MeeGo hw adaptation if you want to Feb 16 12:50:13 pffff battery seems dead Feb 16 12:50:19 or charger or usb port Feb 16 12:50:49 ctrl-alt-F1 and those. Feb 16 12:51:01 Venemo: i don't think i'm up to that, i mostly tend to work with just scripts or maybe i can port some programs from the N900 (haven't tried yet), but systems developing is likely out of my reach Feb 16 12:51:14 hmm, guys, I've just watched a maemo video and I thought it looks pretty nice. based on debian, wow. nokia probably shouldn't have started the whole meego stuff Feb 16 12:51:45 treebeen: tru Feb 16 12:51:50 and then stopped it ;( Feb 16 12:52:16 still, Maemo is half closed source, i'd be glad - in theory - they switched to something almost fully open Feb 16 12:52:28 exactly Feb 16 12:52:30 LjL: also tru Feb 16 12:52:40 although I would also prefer debian based. Feb 16 12:52:50 me too, but *shrug* Feb 16 12:53:01 but doesn't really make that much difference Feb 16 12:53:03 who wouldn't? Feb 16 12:54:20 i don't understand, they had brought maemo pretty far, then the practically abandon it for meego in a time where they knew they don't have time... Feb 16 12:54:44 transforming maemo into debian-mobile or something would be a neat thing Feb 16 12:54:47 i have high hopes for Cordia :) I would actually like to contribute to that. Feb 16 12:55:47 treebeen, probably some microsoft agent infiltred in Nokia to kill the project Feb 16 12:55:54 Mece_: #cordia Feb 16 12:56:18 khertan: or just some stupid managers... Feb 16 12:57:08 Someone know what mean a really fast orange led blinking on n900 Feb 16 12:57:23 and what mean the always power on led with orange color Feb 16 12:58:21 khertan: I'm guessing a weird bug from what I've witnessed myself :) Feb 16 12:59:02 alterego, and which can be resolv how ? Feb 16 12:59:18 alterego, device didn't charge Feb 16 12:59:24 didn't boot up Feb 16 12:59:58 oh, eek :/ Feb 16 13:02:34 Hrm, so your N900 is off, and when you try to charge with mains adapter what happens exactly? Feb 16 13:04:33 nothing Feb 16 13:04:46 ok hum ... seems to be the battery Feb 16 13:04:54 i ve put the battery in an other n900 Feb 16 13:05:03 at least it start Feb 16 13:05:13 but while connected to usb Feb 16 13:05:20 led is blinking fast in red now Feb 16 13:06:10 I vaguely recall seeing LED blinking red. Feb 16 13:06:17 I don't recall it though. Feb 16 13:06:59 red? Feb 16 13:07:12 never seen it red Feb 16 13:07:18 only yellow and green Feb 16 13:07:27 and white :) Feb 16 13:07:32 and red Feb 16 13:07:44 PatternError = blinking red Feb 16 13:07:53 hum ... now the second battery is charging over usb Feb 16 13:07:58 hum ... really strange Feb 16 13:08:01 some critical error occured Feb 16 13:08:19 does N900 support usb printers? Feb 16 13:08:37 you can't install cups on it I think? Feb 16 13:08:46 I think printing is unsupported Feb 16 13:08:55 bash`: In principle, yes, with hostmode. Feb 16 13:09:06 and wireless printers Feb 16 13:09:07 bash`: But that's the hardware, not the software. Feb 16 13:09:07 SpeedEvil: hostmode, what that means? Feb 16 13:09:13 The default software does not Feb 16 13:09:16 are they supported? Feb 16 13:09:43 bash`: The software does not support it, and you would need considerable effort and knowledge to get it working. Though it's in principle possible. Feb 16 13:10:17 jatt, you can install cups Feb 16 13:10:26 some critical error occured <<< hum ... Feb 16 13:10:32 MohammadAG, how to know Feb 16 13:10:36 nice, will try Feb 16 13:10:48 khertan, no idea, I just know blinking red = error Feb 16 13:10:57 my wireless printer is an epson and I had to install some proprietary drivers on ubuntu to make it work Feb 16 13:11:06 MohammadAG, yep error occurs ... no charging :) Feb 16 13:11:09 PatternError=0;5;0;r;9d8040007f007f0040ff7f007f000000;9d800000 Feb 16 13:11:53 jatt: I think that even if you install cups, you can print only using 'lp'...none software does not support it as SpeedEvil said Feb 16 13:12:43 And I have a wireless printer too. Feb 16 13:12:55 I am currently using it with my n900. Feb 16 13:13:13 ok, so it will work with lp to print a txt file to a fancy wireless printer? Feb 16 13:13:17 (open n900 back cover, get microSD, slide into holder, plug into printer) Feb 16 13:13:21 maybe a future-proof solution would be to set it up to print all emails from a certain mailbox fitting a certain criteria Feb 16 13:13:27 meh, openoffice should print, no? Feb 16 13:13:29 :-D Feb 16 13:13:32 Alas, that is a very, very silly way to print. Feb 16 13:13:51 Especially documents, that need converted to jpeg. Feb 16 13:14:23 this wp7 panel is funny. half of the answers are "no, we don't support that. yet." Feb 16 13:14:34 lol Feb 16 13:14:45 multitasking? not supported Feb 16 13:15:00 \o/ VB migration job offer Feb 16 13:15:01 alterego: dd ended, time: real 107m14.271s :S Feb 16 13:15:13 *cough* Feb 16 13:15:34 they do not have anything against opengl or webgl seeemingly Feb 16 13:15:56 bash`: eek, did you do that on device? Feb 16 13:16:00 which is a surprise, considering I already saw dx11mobile on the slides =) Feb 16 13:16:04 alterego: no, on my pc Feb 16 13:16:32 Crikey, takes mine about 5 minutes :/ Feb 16 13:16:44 alterego: told you not to instruct people to dd dev/urandom to their sda!! Feb 16 13:17:02 you did wht Feb 16 13:17:03 what Feb 16 13:17:04 alterego: I passed the option bs=4096 to dd Feb 16 13:17:05 < they do not have anything against opengl yet ... but is it available ? :) Feb 16 13:17:11 I'd have expected maybe 15m on a class 2 Feb 16 13:17:15 bash`: muhahaha Feb 16 13:17:15 oh Feb 16 13:17:21 bash`: yeah, should be fine. Feb 16 13:17:35 DocScrutinizer: what? :P Feb 16 13:17:43 4096k would've been faster Feb 16 13:18:31 kerthan: "no, we don't support that yet" ;) Feb 16 13:18:55 lol Feb 16 13:19:25 * DocScrutinizer ponders to declare WP7 a ban'able subject Feb 16 13:20:22 YES Feb 16 13:21:35 heh, like PRs used to be? "anyone know when will nokia release WP7 for the n900?" Feb 16 13:22:14 hey, asking about pr1.5 is still bannable iirc Feb 16 13:22:19 infobot: pr1.5? Feb 16 13:22:19 * infobot beats timeless with a Nostradamus papercopy 25.3 times. "That's your PR1.5!" Feb 16 13:22:28 * DocScrutinizer shakes the banhammer Feb 16 13:22:35 lol Feb 16 13:23:19 should be banned in general, afterall nokia abandoned maemo for meego before pretty much ditching most of the support status on meego to focus on microsoft partnership Feb 16 13:23:35 timeless: 1.5? what about 1.4? Feb 16 13:24:22 * Mece_ shakes DocScrutinizer who is shaking the banhammer. Feb 16 13:24:22 BCMM: i just got beaten up w/ a papercopy of nostradamus, you ask! Feb 16 13:24:22 still, mocking it is good for morale Feb 16 13:26:28 ~pr1.4 Feb 16 13:26:29 PR1.4 has always been a ban'able subject Feb 16 13:26:30 meh, if i wanted to see linux users complaining about Windows while somebody waves the banhammer unheaded, i'd troll ##linux Feb 16 13:26:45 ~pr1.3.3.7 Feb 16 13:27:34 ~pr1.3.3.7 Feb 16 13:27:59 hmm. Feb 16 13:28:08 ~pr1.3.3.7 Feb 16 13:28:08 well, pr1.3.3.7 is CSSU as leet as MohammadAG Feb 16 13:28:09 did the bot just die, or does it not report when it doesn't know stuff? Feb 16 13:28:11 oh Feb 16 13:28:25 cssu should change the version in "About Product" Feb 16 13:28:53 CSSU should translate the entire About Product screen to 1337speak Feb 16 13:29:01 * BCMM opens a bug Feb 16 13:29:24 Mece_, ovi store shouldn't be checking that version Feb 16 13:29:27 that too. but more importantly it should inform the user that cssu is being used. Feb 16 13:29:30 ~frondlpfartz Feb 16 13:29:30 yet, it does Feb 16 13:29:33 ah true. Feb 16 13:29:43 ~factinfo frondlpfartz Feb 16 13:29:43 DocScrutinizer: there's no such factoid as frondlpfartz Feb 16 13:29:57 I still can't figure out strings in C Feb 16 13:30:03 MohammadAG: what about them? Feb 16 13:30:49 MohammadAG: i mean, they don't exist of course, but that isn't a problem Feb 16 13:31:24 http://pastebin.com/hp3mPyYt Feb 16 13:31:34 Venemo: N810 is growing on me though, because if you look quite hard, eventually you find that some things you thought weren't available, are. for instance, i wanted a Boggle game, and thought there was only one for the N900... but then, in Garage there is a Diablo .deb, which doesn't work through Application Manager, but installs and works fine with dpkg Feb 16 13:31:58 LjL: :) Feb 16 13:32:10 LjL: I would bet that you won't want to give it to your sister :P Feb 16 13:32:53 * SpeedEvil sighs at stupid hardware. Feb 16 13:32:57 My radio is bootlooping. Feb 16 13:33:18 It has an internal battery, so I can't easily stop it. Feb 16 13:33:19 MohammadAG: path is a char pointer, right? Feb 16 13:33:27 does n900 supports fm radio, to listen to fm broadcasts? Feb 16 13:33:30 Venemo: oh that's for sure, i definitely want to keep stuff like this... but part of the "present" idea is to part with it :P Feb 16 13:33:42 jatt: yes Feb 16 13:33:49 MohammadAG: a string in C is an array of characters that ends with the 0 character Feb 16 13:33:52 char path[1035]; Feb 16 13:33:53 MohammadAG: were you hoping to get the length of the string from sizeof? Feb 16 13:33:56 do I need to install an application for it? Feb 16 13:34:06 MohammadAG: any string function in C will iterate through the array until it finds 0 Feb 16 13:34:13 BCMM, idk, it was an example :P Feb 16 13:34:56 MohammadAG: a string is just a character array. a function knows it's finished when it gets to a null char. there is no way to determine it's size other than reading it till you get to a null, or storing the size in a separate int or something Feb 16 13:35:34 MohammadAG: so path is just a char pointer to the start of the character array Feb 16 13:36:20 MohammadAG: i think sizeof() is supposed to be called on a *type*, e.g. sizeof(char) returns 1, since a char occupies one byte Feb 16 13:36:43 BCMM: no, sizeof(something) tells the size of a variable too Feb 16 13:36:49 Venemo: oh, ok Feb 16 13:37:01 BCMM: however it doesn't know of dynamic allocations Feb 16 13:37:14 MohammadAG: nevertheless, that will give you the size of a pointer in memory, not the length of the string Feb 16 13:38:27 it's generally when allocating stuff, so if you want an array of ten integers you can malloc(10*sizeof(int)) so your code doesn't break on a platform where integers are a different size Feb 16 13:38:29 BCMM: right Feb 16 13:38:37 ^generally used when Feb 16 13:38:42 BCMM: also, sizeof() can return the size of an array, but not a dynamically allocated array Feb 16 13:38:45 printf("%s", path); VS printf(path, version); Feb 16 13:38:49 brb Feb 16 13:39:39 Venemo: oh, it can return the size of an array? when passed a pointer to the start of it? Feb 16 13:39:42 how does that work? Feb 16 13:39:58 my N900 is super fast today. I wonder what is the cause is Feb 16 13:40:00 BCMM: NO, not dynamic arrays Feb 16 13:40:07 BCMM: just static arrays Feb 16 13:40:13 BCMM: eg. int i[5]; Feb 16 13:40:16 Venemo: still, how does it do taht? Feb 16 13:40:18 oh i see Feb 16 13:40:58 BCMM: if you just do int *i = malloc(5*sizeof(int)); then of course it won't return the size of the 'array' Feb 16 13:41:10 Venemo: hang on, after doing int i[5]; sizeof(i)==sizeof(int)*5? Feb 16 13:41:41 BCMM: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sizeof#Using_sizeof_with_arrays Feb 16 13:41:47 even though i is just an int pointer to the start of the array? Feb 16 13:41:55 also, why don't i have a sizeof man page ffs? Feb 16 13:41:57 int printf(const char *format, ...); The functions in the printf() family produce output according to a format as described below Feb 16 13:42:12 printf(path, version); path = format?? Feb 16 13:42:27 BCMM: int* is in fact different from int[] Feb 16 13:42:32 BCMM: "When sizeof is applied to an array, the result is the size in bytes of the array in memory." Feb 16 13:42:40 DocScrutinizer: hadn't even seen that yet... Feb 16 13:43:27 Venemo: ok, looks like i don't know how static arrays work. sorry Feb 16 13:43:37 holy crap that's a long conversation Feb 16 13:43:45 was my question answered? :P Feb 16 13:43:48 BCMM: as far as the language is concerned, int* is not an array and int[] is not a pointer. although the latter _can_ be implicitly converted to a pointer Feb 16 13:43:50 Venemo: i take it that a dynamic array really is just a pointer to the start of the array? Feb 16 13:43:52 http://pastebin.com/2pr0Pyks Feb 16 13:44:12 BCMM: correct. a 'dynamic array', according to the language, is NOT an array. Feb 16 13:44:34 Venemo: ah, ok - i feel a little less clueless now Feb 16 13:44:47 BCMM: a dynamic array is just a pointer pointing to some chunk of memory that you have. the language doesn't know its size or anything Feb 16 13:44:50 i've had little reason to use static arrays, and assumed they were a special case of dynamic arrays Feb 16 13:45:08 BCMM: however the size of a static array is known at compile time, thus the language can know about it Feb 16 13:45:32 Venemo: yeah, i was wondering how it wors Feb 16 13:45:52 ^"works", but i guess sizeof() is evaluated at compile-time anyway Feb 16 13:46:36 BCMM: read http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sizeof#Using_sizeof_with_arrays Feb 16 13:46:41 Venemo: thanks Feb 16 13:46:57 BCMM: "C99 also allows variable length arrays where the length is specified at runtime [2]. In such cases the sizeof operator is evaluated in part at runtime to determine the storage occupied by the array." Feb 16 13:50:27 anyway, I have to go now Feb 16 13:55:16 MohammadAG: line 29,30 look weird to me Feb 16 13:56:14 i was thinking that... are you trying to append to or replace "Version: "? Feb 16 13:58:21 the way i read that, it will replace "Version: " with an equal number of characters taken from fp Feb 16 13:58:41 cssu feature request: display status bar (or just clock) in task switcher Feb 16 13:59:25 that's a good idea, actually - i find myself switching from a fullscreen app to the desktop just to check the time Feb 16 13:59:35 i hate it when I need to go to desktop or un-fullscreen the browser to find out what time it is. Feb 16 14:01:23 BCMM set everything but need to reinstall funtoo as have only 10 gibs on / and /opt is the same partition =) Feb 16 14:01:34 no way to repartition it =) Feb 16 14:02:08 not sure i understand - did you install with a funny partition scheme? Feb 16 14:02:39 MohammadAG: check libqtm-12-[newest] Feb 16 14:03:34 i didn't think scratchbox would take more than 5 gibs =) Feb 16 14:03:43 and i have only 10 even less on / Feb 16 14:04:11 as scratchbox in /opt and i have no separete partition for it it uses / space =) Feb 16 14:04:15 anyway i have to go Feb 16 14:04:21 talk to you all later =) Feb 16 14:08:26 MohammadAG: 19 const char *version = NULL; /* allocates one word for storing pointer*/ 27 version = "Version: "; /* will segfault as version points to addr NULL */ 29 //sizeof(version) isn't doing what you think it is Feb 16 14:08:55 ZogG: why not just use on large partition? Feb 16 14:09:18 ZogG: also, you could do something nasty with symlinks, just like maemo :) Feb 16 14:09:49 DocScrutinizer: err Feb 16 14:10:01 DocScrutinizer: surely that will only segfault if you're lucky?... the rest of the time, it'll just do undefined stuff Feb 16 14:10:03 "Version: " is a pointer to a constant area with value "Version: \0" Feb 16 14:10:19 so const char * version = NULL; version = "Version: "; is perfectly ok Feb 16 14:10:29 oh, he's right Feb 16 14:10:32 timeless: ok, yeah Feb 16 14:10:45 timeless: the bit i don't understand is that it's possible to re-assign a const char* Feb 16 14:10:59 what does the const do? Feb 16 14:11:01 sizeof(version) otoh is equivalent to sizeof(const char*) Feb 16 14:11:02 still while (fgets(version, sizeof(version), fp) != NULL) looks fishy Feb 16 14:11:18 BCMM: consider const char const * const version = NULL; Feb 16 14:11:27 * timeless can't remmeber if you can do that, but... Feb 16 14:11:49 roughly [const char] [const *] version = "hello"; Feb 16 14:12:02 the first const modifies char and says "you can't write on this char" Feb 16 14:12:20 as version is pointing to const area of program text Feb 16 14:12:32 that's unrelated :) Feb 16 14:12:34 you must not write to it Feb 16 14:12:36 you can be evil Feb 16 14:12:37 BCMM: there's a trick to "read it backwards" Feb 16 14:12:51 char * version = (char*)"Version: "; Feb 16 14:13:01 you will probably crash when you do version[0]='v'; Feb 16 14:13:06 so "const char * version" -> "version is a pointer to a character constant" Feb 16 14:13:26 whereas "char * const version" -> "version is a constant pointer to a character" Feb 16 14:13:41 there's a rule: "const refers to the object to the left, except unless there is no such thing, then to the object on the right" :) Feb 16 14:13:46 i don't understand the "while" at all... Feb 16 14:14:45 surely he just wants to fgets once, with a buffer that is sufficiently large to contain the entire version string? Feb 16 14:15:06 yes Feb 16 14:15:19 and there's no sense in printf Feb 16 14:15:28 to stdout Feb 16 14:15:38 DocScrutinizer: i presumed that was for debugging? Feb 16 14:15:46 yeah, maybe Feb 16 14:16:03 seems to me like that would run fgets, which returns non-NULL, do the loop contents, then pointlessly run fgets again, which returns NULL Feb 16 14:16:27 well, that's what it would do if the buffer was sufficient anyway Feb 16 14:17:10 but the buffer is an address actually ? Feb 16 14:17:19 DocScrutinizer: ? Feb 16 14:18:38 am i right in thinking that the objective of lines 29-31 is to put a string like "20.2010.36-2maemo11" in version, then printf it just for debugging? Feb 16 14:21:00 achipa, [sbox-FREMANTLE_ARMEL: ~] > cat /var/lib/dpkg/info/libqtm-12-dev.list | grep QtConnectivity Feb 16 14:21:00 [sbox-FREMANTLE_ARMEL: ~] > Feb 16 14:25:17 BCMM: 35 gtk_text_buffer_insert_at_cursor (buffer, version, -1); Feb 16 14:26:31 BCMM: I think it's planned to hold "Version: 20.2010.36-2maemo11" - that's overly complex in itself Feb 16 14:27:50 the constant "Version: " should get an own gtk_text_buffer_insert_at_cursor (buffer, cVersionlabel, -1) line Feb 16 14:29:03 MohammadAG: fwiw, there is an api variant of dpkg, you should consider using it Feb 16 14:29:11 (using Awk is gross) Feb 16 14:29:50 MohammadAG: also, should really be split from the list of which should be read from a file or something Feb 16 14:30:38 oh, and don't forget to add _()s :) Feb 16 14:32:19 WTF _()s Feb 16 14:37:24 MohammadAG: line 62,65,66,70,71 also look weird Feb 16 14:38:09 DocScrutinizer: http://mxr.maemo.org/fremantle/search?string=%23define.*gettext®exp=on&find=&findi=\.h%24&filter=_\%28&hitlimit=&tree=fremantle Feb 16 14:38:32 fsck Feb 16 14:38:39 where is the lockcode stored? Feb 16 14:39:04 if width less than 800, set width=480 height=500. if width >=800 set width=480 height=360 Feb 16 14:39:13 CAL Feb 16 14:39:19 chem|st: ^^ Feb 16 14:39:36 DocScrutinizer: don't! Feb 16 14:39:54 device isn't locked but yet I'd like to recover! Feb 16 14:40:23 http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=524522#post524522 Feb 16 14:46:49 crap thing... Feb 16 14:47:41 is there any way to just reset it? Feb 16 14:49:50 I realy should not use phone numbers for lock codes Feb 16 15:04:39 hmm Feb 16 15:04:40 mohammad@mohammad-i5laptop:~$ john -format:DES -i:digits lockcode Feb 16 15:04:40 No password hashes loaded Feb 16 15:04:49 chem|st: factory setting is "12345" (sic!), means the routine checking the entered lockcode to the CAL value has a special procedure for this value that doesn't use the encoding. IF CAL="12345" AND lockcode_entered="12345" THEN unlock() Feb 16 15:04:51 MohammadAG: hm, it seems it's an upstream thingy, it doesn't mark itself... Feb 16 15:05:03 as in 'make install' doesn't work Feb 16 15:05:46 achipa, compiling libQtConnnectivity on its own worked though Feb 16 15:06:27 doing a make install in src/connectivity/ does Feb 16 15:06:30 MohammadAG: yeah, I added that in the update I pushed this afternoon, but the missing include is actually not my fault :) Feb 16 15:06:54 achipa, I couldn't find it Feb 16 15:07:03 MohammadAG: find what ? Feb 16 15:07:18 the headers Feb 16 15:08:01 cat /var/lib/dpkg/info/libqtm-12-dev.list | grep QtConnectivity returns no hits Feb 16 15:08:17 MohammadAG: I know, as said, make install doesn't put them in the right place. Feb 16 15:09:25 any chance you could fix that? Feb 16 15:09:43 (what did you add in the update?) Feb 16 15:10:09 the .so (oops) :) Feb 16 15:10:24 I couldn't find the .so too :p Feb 16 15:11:20 yeah, but now the autobuilder is complaining, a tic... Feb 16 15:11:53 blearh Feb 16 15:12:15 BT builds for ARM but not for i386 Feb 16 15:12:22 also, any idea where I can get QtM 1.2 for Ubuntu? Feb 16 15:12:54 the forum nokia PPA, of course ! Feb 16 15:13:04 there's a PPA? Feb 16 15:13:28 yeah, but don't tell anyone, because they might get confused Feb 16 15:13:38 https://launchpad.net/~forumnokia/+archive/fn-ppa Feb 16 15:13:39 lol Feb 16 15:17:02 achipa, only source packages available? Feb 16 15:17:14 MohammadAG: what ? Feb 16 15:17:20 what process should I kill to restart calendar application and reminder daemon on N900? Feb 16 15:17:29 achipa, I can only apt-get source, not install Feb 16 15:18:16 MohammadAG: you apt-getting it wrong... it has binaries for lucid and maverick Feb 16 15:18:26 did you add the ppa line correctly ? Feb 16 15:18:38 of course lol Feb 16 15:18:45 hi there Feb 16 15:18:55 is the kernel power from the devel-testing ready to use productive?! Feb 16 15:18:55 mohammad@mohammad-i5laptop:~$ cat /etc/apt/sources.list.d/forumnokia-fn-ppa-maverick.list Feb 16 15:18:56 deb http://ppa.launchpad.net/forumnokia/fn-ppa/ubuntu maverick main Feb 16 15:18:56 deb-src http://ppa.launchpad.net/forumnokia/fn-ppa/ubuntu maverick main Feb 16 15:19:09 or is it better to use the stable one?1 Feb 16 15:19:27 depends Feb 16 15:19:31 do you want usb hostmode? Feb 16 15:19:46 maybe Feb 16 15:19:52 MohammadAG: apt-cache policy libqtm-sensors Feb 16 15:20:01 what does it say ? Feb 16 15:20:15 oh Feb 16 15:20:41 you used that naming scheme Feb 16 15:20:41 Ubuntu repos use the name qt-mobility Feb 16 15:20:52 Get:1 http://ppa.launchpad.net/forumnokia/fn-ppa/ubuntu/ maverick/main libqtm-connectivity amd64 1:1.2.0~tp-0fn~maverick0 [137kB] Feb 16 15:20:58 libqtm-connectivity is there Feb 16 15:21:00 MohammadAG: yeah, no "firmware legacy" in naming there Feb 16 15:21:03 so it's not an upstream bug achipa :P Feb 16 15:21:24 no, libqtm-connectivity I fixed :) Feb 16 15:21:36 ah Feb 16 15:21:44 the .h-s in the -dev missing are the upstream thingy Feb 16 15:21:59 heh Feb 16 15:22:03 they all failed :P Feb 16 15:22:13 trying to overwrite '/usr/share/qt4/mkspecs/features/mobility.prf', which is also in package qtmobility-dev 1.0.2-2ubuntu0.1 Feb 16 15:22:23 you should really use Conflicts: :P Feb 16 15:23:04 MohammadAG: yeah, those were originally lucid packages, which had no mobility anyway Feb 16 15:27:10 hmm Feb 16 15:27:17 achipa, any ideas on Cannot mix incompatible Qt library (version 0x40700) with this library (version 0x1040700)? Feb 16 15:27:58 MohammadAG: weird numbers... Feb 16 15:28:13 (as in the 1 in the second) Feb 16 15:29:58 ThreeM: probably PK of devel repo is best Feb 16 15:30:00 hmm Feb 16 15:31:11 i hope :) Feb 16 15:31:52 hello, doeas anybody know what file in nitdroid.com/downloads is the latest one? im downloading popov now Feb 16 15:31:58 LOL, has Mr Flop uttered some new threat? since 60min, shares are going down again Feb 16 15:35:34 Hehe Feb 16 15:35:34 Everybody else just noticed. Feb 16 15:38:33 DocScrutinizer: drop some more and I buy some... Feb 16 15:38:45 shares are going down, eh? Feb 16 15:39:57 he probabbly just walked in nokia building and someone saw him Feb 16 15:40:38 nah, had a sharp ditch to BID 6.71, after high at BID 6.83. Now recovered to BID 6.78 Feb 16 15:40:59 How do you get a package out of extras testing? Feb 16 15:41:17 I have a, for example, 0.5-1 and publishing 0.6-1 now leaves 2 in testing. Feb 16 15:41:26 do I need to add a 0.5-2 and not promote it? Feb 16 15:41:32 or is there some other magic? Feb 16 15:41:47 ditch happened @ 15:45..16:15 CET, so he probably came out of Nokia building Feb 16 15:42:55 http://i.imgur.com/S82FY.jpg Feb 16 15:43:44 hardaker: aiui you can't get anything out of testing Feb 16 15:43:45 ketas: London ... 6,77 EUR 16.02.2011 Feb 16 15:43:49 16:23:05 -19,09% Feb 16 15:43:53 ThreeM: just need a microwave Feb 16 15:43:56 then you can live there Feb 16 15:44:09 hehe Feb 16 15:44:17 DocScrutinizer: but that would mean it would grow infinetly with packages that never got certain versions promoted to extras? Feb 16 15:44:21 na j/k , canned food will do Feb 16 15:44:42 elop has left the building gentlemen Feb 16 15:44:53 Or, more appropriately, I really mean "out of the waiting to be promoted list" not necessarily out of the repo itself. Feb 16 15:45:07 you can just thumb a package down yourself Feb 16 15:45:07 even when promoting to extras, the version in extras-testing stays there Feb 16 15:45:16 if you're the maintainer, itll drop from testing Feb 16 15:45:38 DocScrutinizer: lifeview tells a raise from yesterday Feb 16 15:45:39 nid0: Ahh... I didn't try that. I'll give that a go. Feb 16 15:45:44 at least in london Feb 16 15:46:58 chem|st: yep, since yesterday the rating got at ~+2% at max, ~10:30 today Feb 16 15:47:46 now life Realtime L&S Indikation is at -0% Feb 16 15:47:51 +-0 Feb 16 15:49:46 according to intraday rating Flop entered Nokia building 9:15, had lunch out at 11:45, and left at 15:45 CET Feb 16 15:50:00 +1.2% london +0.6% NY 5 minutes ago Feb 16 15:50:11 http://www.finanzen.net/realtimekurs/Nokia Feb 16 15:52:58 BID = ASK = 6.77 LOL - you can trade for free ;-D Feb 16 15:55:04 I'm just waiting for BID > ASK X-P Feb 16 16:00:10 gamblers Feb 16 16:03:52 ketas: if your bank would offer you to get $1.10 for 1 unit of your currency, and also pay $1 for 1.10 of your currency, what would you do ;-D Feb 16 16:04:19 s/pay/you pay/ Feb 16 16:04:19 DocScrutinizer meant: ketas: if your bank would offer you to get $1.10 for 1 unit of your currency, and also you pay $1 for 1.10 of your currency, what would you do ;-D Feb 16 16:04:56 i wonder if that bot takes regular expressions... Feb 16 16:05:05 s/./test/ Feb 16 16:05:06 BCMM meant: i wonder if that bot takes regular expressionstest.. Feb 16 16:05:14 BCMM: it doesn't Feb 16 16:05:26 DocScrutinizer: that's definitely a good thing. Feb 16 16:05:49 s/t/TTT/g Feb 16 16:05:50 DocScrutinizer meant: BCMM: iTTT doesn'TTT Feb 16 16:06:57 and yeah, ............................ s/./................................./g works, but gets truncated eventually Feb 16 16:10:04 hmm Feb 16 16:10:07 s/./......................./ Feb 16 16:10:15 aw Feb 16 16:10:19 s/aw/......................./ Feb 16 16:10:21 kerio meant: ....................... Feb 16 16:10:27 s/......../............................../g Feb 16 16:10:41 it's not exponential! Feb 16 16:10:53 kerio: i doubt it will correct a correction Feb 16 16:10:54 stop regular expressing yourself! Feb 16 16:10:55 dude! Feb 16 16:11:07 s/!/!!/ Feb 16 16:11:07 DocScrutinizer meant: dude!! Feb 16 16:11:12 s/!// Feb 16 16:11:14 DocScrutinizer meant: dude Feb 16 16:11:31 i see Feb 16 16:11:37 s/./.........................../g Feb 16 16:11:43 come on, . is any character Feb 16 16:11:47 stupid regexps Feb 16 16:11:52 kerio: i just tested that... Feb 16 16:11:55 NO regex!! Feb 16 16:11:56 it doesn't take regexps Feb 16 16:12:17 i even tested by trying to match . Feb 16 16:12:43 it's probably built around strcmp Feb 16 16:13:26 check ibot source if you want to know the details Feb 16 16:14:22 s/ /\/ Feb 16 16:14:23 DocScrutinizer meant: check\ibot source if you want to know the details Feb 16 16:14:23 i wonder if it likes escape sequences. \n Feb 16 16:14:41 s/wonder/\n/ Feb 16 16:14:42 BCMM meant: i \n if it likes escape sequences. \n Feb 16 16:14:49 ah well, nm Feb 16 16:16:04 s///g is the most advanced thing you can do with it Feb 16 16:16:11 s/a/b/ Feb 16 16:16:18 s/b/a/ Feb 16 16:16:24 doh Feb 16 16:16:41 aah I forgot it clears buffers after some 10s Feb 16 16:17:17 and s/ obviously doesn't get buffered Feb 16 16:17:52 if done correctly Feb 16 16:18:00 s/if/when Feb 16 16:18:03 s/if/when/ Feb 16 16:18:04 DocScrutinizer meant: s/when/when Feb 16 16:18:13 pun Feb 16 16:19:02 punpunpun Feb 16 16:19:09 s/pun// Feb 16 16:19:10 ketas meant: punpun Feb 16 16:19:14 what Feb 16 16:19:19 s/what// Feb 16 16:19:19 ketas meant: Feb 16 16:19:23 yes Feb 16 16:19:24 lol Feb 16 16:19:26 i meant nothing Feb 16 16:19:51 Feb 16 16:20:07 s//wtf/ Feb 16 16:20:18 s/ / / Feb 16 16:20:20 ketas meant: Feb 16 16:20:58 DocScrutinizer: that isn't usually as easy as getting 10 cents for free Feb 16 16:21:19 s/10 cents/.10/ Feb 16 16:21:19 ketas meant: DocScrutinizer: that isn't usually as easy as getting .10 for free Feb 16 16:21:25 ketas: that's usually very unusual Feb 16 16:25:40 w00t_: you in HEL? Feb 16 16:25:45 yes Feb 16 16:26:10 meego meetup! Feb 16 16:26:19 oooh fun Feb 16 16:26:36 ¡ Feb 16 16:26:36 s/hel/hell/ Feb 16 16:27:02 http://www.theregister.co.uk/2011/02/16/data_tariffs/ <-- or option 3... users drastically cut back on data usage or even *gasp* cancel data usage all togheter... Feb 16 16:27:26 three is still offering a truly unlimited data tarrif. Feb 16 16:27:50 WTF are you going nuts over there? Feb 16 16:27:58 Though only if you buy a phone, you can't get it with a SIM. Feb 16 16:28:07 Many providers have slashed their caps. Feb 16 16:28:15 Down to 500M in many cases. Feb 16 16:28:32 BLAERGH Feb 16 16:28:51 here they just went unlimited Feb 16 16:29:00 I get 500M for €10 and 5G for €25 Feb 16 16:29:05 I'm on 1G/mo - for 4 euro/month. (locked in for 6 months) Feb 16 16:29:24 I just bought an Ipad plan, for 15.99/mo that will get me 10G/mo Feb 16 16:29:24 2g/mo/~12eur Feb 16 16:29:31 that's still best tariff I ever heard of Feb 16 16:29:35 or I could get 20gb/mo for 18eur Feb 16 16:29:40 please help install java on n900 Feb 16 16:29:49 No, I don't have a Ipad - I'm hoping it'll work on a n900 with duct tape. Feb 16 16:30:16 unlimited €8 here Feb 16 16:30:26 ketas: Where are you? Feb 16 16:30:28 the speed is limited, however Feb 16 16:30:36 to 1.5Mbit/s Feb 16 16:30:46 * SpeedEvil sighs. Feb 16 16:31:04 in estonia Feb 16 16:31:08 The reason I bought a 15G/mo plan is so that I can get my ISP to fix my DSL line. Feb 16 16:31:19 Without worrying about it going down. Feb 16 16:31:39 most expensive operator around Feb 16 16:31:41 At the moment I'm doing wierd stuff like taking the line down for several hours around midnight, so it does not retrain to low. Feb 16 16:32:03 what? Feb 16 16:32:15 didn't understand Feb 16 16:32:22 ketas: Would it be stereotyping to suspect that the number of people with data capable devices in estonia may be rather low? Feb 16 16:32:41 SpeedEvil: that'S considered contraproductive Feb 16 16:33:04 ketas: My DSL like falls over around midnight every day. I'm trying to get my operator to fix it, which may involve some days or weeks of reduced connectivity. Feb 16 16:33:08 DocScrutinizer? Feb 16 16:34:06 you should make it train when there's low noise of crosstalking wires, so the others will adjust to lower bandwidth when going online Feb 16 16:34:10 SpeedEvil: don't know how low Feb 16 16:34:28 DocScrutinizer: Doesn't work. Feb 16 16:34:46 DocScrutinizer: If I train at those times, the modem syncs at 160K, if it syncs at all. Feb 16 16:34:54 what kind of adsl is that Feb 16 16:35:06 that's weird Feb 16 16:35:10 i have adsl2+ Feb 16 16:35:13 16/1 Feb 16 16:35:29 DocScrutinizer: Then my line has a 'maximum stable rate' of 135K, and is limited to that for the next 3 days, even if it's synced to 2500K during the rest of the day Feb 16 16:35:50 WTF?! Feb 16 16:36:02 They ratel-limit the packets going into your connection to the maximum stable rate, to avoid congestion on the larst leg. Feb 16 16:36:16 This rate-limit is only updated after several days. Feb 16 16:36:33 incredible crap Feb 16 16:36:44 ISP screws you :D Feb 16 16:36:45 what's it's official speed Feb 16 16:36:50 To add to the fun - the rate limit is not applied by my ISP, but by the organisation they pay for their transit to my ecxchange - so they can't turn it off. Feb 16 16:36:54 SpeedEvil: you're in the uk arent you? Feb 16 16:37:01 ketas: 'up to 8M' Feb 16 16:37:23 if you're on a non-llu connection, you can ask BT to manually increase the limit Feb 16 16:37:25 "up to" - the BS of the decade Feb 16 16:37:34 nid0: That doesn't help. Feb 16 16:37:43 nid0: As I can't actually talk to BT Feb 16 16:37:43 i can actually get my 16/1 Feb 16 16:37:56 when I buy sth, I don't want "up to", I demand "at least" Feb 16 16:38:01 SpeedEvil: run their speed tester, then call them direct and reference it Feb 16 16:38:07 is there way to read sdhc class directly from card? Feb 16 16:38:20 if your ip profile is lower than the current sync speed of the line, they can clear the currently set profile for you Feb 16 16:38:28 nid0: BT (broadband) are seperate now from BT (central), who is seperate from the engineers that go out, who are now OpenREach. Feb 16 16:38:30 nid0: Sure. Feb 16 16:38:38 SpeedEvil: i'm fully aware of that. Feb 16 16:38:39 nid0: I need to do this every day, at 1AM. Feb 16 16:38:50 regardless of who your ISP is, BT can adjust your ip profile for you Feb 16 16:39:04 nid0: But it gets reset when the line next retrains. Feb 16 16:39:13 nid0: Also - BT central won't talk to end-users. Feb 16 16:39:24 nid0: Most of the time they won't even talk to openreach!!! Feb 16 16:39:41 well, theres your problem, but with the line up BT will remove the profile limit for you without needing to allow the 3 days for it to adjust yourself Feb 16 16:39:54 I know this, because I Feb 16 16:40:04 had to get them to do it several times for me where i used to live Feb 16 16:40:09 They remove the profile limit, and it is then reimposed when the line retrains back down. Feb 16 16:40:42 It's not an artificial limit when it's training down - it's getting 3-4dB margin at 160K Feb 16 16:40:44 spam them with calls, so they rethink this idiotic policy Feb 16 16:41:59 Well, it's whether you want to persist in calling them to have the profile removed so you can get decent speeds during the day once the line's synced back to a decent speed Feb 16 16:42:05 until they get round to fixing it, that is Feb 16 16:47:47 nid0: I've tried - BT wholesale will not talk to end users. Feb 16 16:48:11 nid0: When were you doing this - policies have firmed up in the last couple of years - according to the engineer who was here yesterday. Feb 16 16:48:31 my adsl2+ modem is at 20476 kbps / 1020 kbps now :D Feb 16 16:49:08 SpeedEvil: you need to speak to BT's faults line, as it is (or at least was a year and a half or so ago when i had an almost identical problem to you) considered a fault with the line, which you do have through them, rather than anything to do with the actual net connection service Feb 16 16:49:29 I had almost exactly the same problem you're currently having due to a fault at the exchange, at totally random times there'd be a huge burst of noise on the line that would drop the line's profile all the way down to 125k from like 6000, Demon obviously couldnt help but BT just told me after the line resynced at a decent speed to run their speed tester then give them a call, and they'd reset Feb 16 16:49:29 the profile for me. it at least gave me proper speeds back until the line next cocked up Feb 16 16:50:33 whether or not theyre still willing to do that I wouldnt know, but itd seem strange to utterly refuse to do so when they obviously have the capability and previously would do so when there was a clear problem with intermittent line noise and their profiling Feb 16 16:56:02 which bot does regex fixing? Feb 16 16:56:06 s/bot/ircbot Feb 16 16:56:40 [lcuk] wanted to say 'which ircbot does regex fixing?' Feb 16 16:56:57 lol Feb 16 16:57:04 SpeedEvil: For what it's worth, there's at least a thread on the BT forum from less than 2 weeks ago where a guy managed to get his IP profile manually reset by emailing the board's mods: Feb 16 16:57:06 s/lol/laugh out loud/ Feb 16 16:57:06 lcuk meant: laugh out loud Feb 16 16:57:07 http://community.bt.com/t5/BB-in-Home/IP-Profile-is-there-a-procedure-for-getting-it-reset/m-p/111819 Feb 16 16:57:09 :D Feb 16 16:57:12 ahhahahhhh Feb 16 16:57:32 the last slash makes the difference Feb 16 16:57:48 yes, I gather now. Feb 16 16:58:14 Odd. Feb 16 17:00:51 is infbot a supybot? Feb 16 17:00:54 infobot Feb 16 17:02:52 nid0: Also - that's BT broadband - which may still have somewhat better access to things than other ISPs, though they are not supposed to. Feb 16 17:04:12 kerio: damn you Feb 16 17:04:16 how i disable scratchbox hijacking of tools (perl)? Feb 16 17:04:41 kerio: however i would want my upstream to go up Feb 16 17:05:27 SCRATCHBOX_REDIRECT_IGNORE=/usr/bin/perl ? Feb 16 17:06:04 ketas: and that's because i have a 20/1 Feb 16 17:06:22 kerio: in private house i can't get faster now but elsewhere 100/20 is possible, even ftth which i dream about Feb 16 17:07:47 maybe they raise downstream in future Feb 16 17:08:11 * ShadowJK is <3 ftth Feb 16 17:08:31 Mostly because of the latency and packet loss (or absence of it) Feb 16 17:08:39 and 0 jitter Feb 16 17:13:09 i want ftth Feb 16 17:13:25 but not sure when and if Feb 16 17:13:34 needs overhead line Feb 16 17:13:43 I dont seem to be getting ftth or even fttc for a long long time :< Feb 16 17:13:47 * nid0 curses BT Feb 16 17:13:58 ftth? Feb 16 17:14:00 fttc? Feb 16 17:14:03 fttb Feb 16 17:14:10 to the brain Feb 16 17:14:22 ftth is fiber to the home Feb 16 17:14:43 c is somewhere near Feb 16 17:14:49 We started our own company for ftth :P Feb 16 17:14:58 wtf? Feb 16 17:15:21 really? Feb 16 17:15:29 yeah Feb 16 17:15:32 where Feb 16 17:15:38 .fi Feb 16 17:16:00 pulling overhead lines? Feb 16 17:16:02 :) Feb 16 17:16:10 Well it's a co-op actually, not a full fledged for-profit company Feb 16 17:16:30 to private houses? Feb 16 17:16:54 and companies, and government buildings Feb 16 17:17:15 underground lines Feb 16 17:17:44 :( Feb 16 17:17:50 overhead is high maintenance Feb 16 17:18:02 overhead fiber, i imagine Feb 16 17:18:17 overhead anything Feb 16 17:18:35 well i have phone line overhead Feb 16 17:18:50 had problems, right, line is over the road Feb 16 17:19:29 you need a guy running around with a chainsaw culling trees before they fall over the lines Feb 16 17:19:55 power lines are overhead too Feb 16 17:20:07 it's fucking expensive to dig them to the ground Feb 16 17:20:36 when you stick them underground, it's mostly people with excavators you need to worry about, and even then if you had accurately registered the location of your cable the excavator dude pays up when he breaks it Feb 16 17:21:05 sure Feb 16 17:21:08 still expensive Feb 16 17:21:15 that's why they are on the air still Feb 16 17:21:46 The fibre cable was dug down with this knife-looking thing Feb 16 17:22:11 i've seen such devices Feb 16 17:22:14 interesting Feb 16 17:23:17 so it didn't require scooping up ground, putting down cable, closing trench. Feb 16 17:24:25 It really all started about 5 years ago when this dude was almost running around door to door asking people to sign their interest in ftth Feb 16 17:24:30 we have quite rocky soil here Feb 16 17:24:37 sadly Feb 16 17:25:28 there was a guy with a big excavator and a sturdier knife/pole thing running ahead, it pushed up rocks pretty good Feb 16 17:25:53 i mean there's layer of rock Feb 16 17:25:59 near the ground Feb 16 17:26:03 ah Feb 16 17:26:06 can it cut that? Feb 16 17:26:12 Depends how hard it is Feb 16 17:26:17 :) Feb 16 17:26:24 If it's a layer of loose boulders - perhaps Feb 16 17:27:05 it's not loose Feb 16 17:27:29 if it's a layer of obsidian you need a diamond pickaxe Feb 16 17:27:57 but then you are protected from creapers blowing up your fiber line Feb 16 17:28:10 it also helped take-up that telcos were showing signs of pulling out, and replacing people's phonelines with stationary gsm tablephones Feb 16 17:28:19 adsl obviously doesn't work on that :) Feb 16 17:28:22 no one here plays minecraft? Feb 16 17:29:03 well not me, I don't really understand why minecraft is fun to other people Feb 16 17:29:05 umm Feb 16 17:29:16 like lines replaced with fix gsm? Feb 16 17:29:23 yes Feb 16 17:29:27 probably bad lines? Feb 16 17:29:31 old, crappy Feb 16 17:29:55 Proteous: minecraft will one day become an excellent game, I'm sure. Once they add a game to the rather nice engine :-) Feb 16 17:29:57 telco fiber ends in a fiber to pots converter outside my house Feb 16 17:30:01 so not that old Feb 16 17:30:14 ccooke: bah, it's fun now! Feb 16 17:30:16 ccooke: No, now you're talking about Crysis :P Feb 16 17:30:22 Shadikka: *laugh* Feb 16 17:30:37 ShadowJK: why to pull out then? Feb 16 17:30:56 Proteous: a lot of people seem to think that. Right now, I start it up every few weeks to see what's changed and if they added a reason to play it yet. Feb 16 17:31:17 Proteous: I mess around for a couple of hours, then decide I can wait. Feb 16 17:31:19 ccooke: it's like a big set of lego to me Feb 16 17:31:20 their overhead lines too costly to maintain they claim Feb 16 17:31:49 Proteous: The problem with it is it's like a big set of level with *grinding*. And I don't see why I should waste my precious time with grinding :-) Feb 16 17:32:24 Proteous: when they've actually added a reason for you to build stuff - trade, better monsters, whatever - then it will be fun for me to play. Feb 16 17:33:08 as it is now, I'll play it for a few hours, enjoy the pretty, then conclude that I really should take up 3d modelling again. Then procrastinate about that and go back to playing Dwarf Fortress :-) Feb 16 17:33:21 DF... Feb 16 17:33:31 (and hey, I can play dwarf fortress on the n900, now) Feb 16 17:33:36 heh\ Feb 16 17:33:52 ketas, besides, I think it's near universal telco policy to do whatever you can to piss off users :-) Feb 16 17:33:53 Well, sort of. Via ssh to my server, I can Feb 16 17:34:35 (and technically I'm not using an n900 atm, but that's not the point; I'd *prefer* to be, after all :-) Feb 16 17:35:45 ccooke, \oare you still hiding away in the bowels of python code? Feb 16 17:37:05 lcuk: Nope. Ended up doing huge amounts of ruby for a while with some horrendous hours Feb 16 17:37:14 ShadowJK: why should they want to piss off users? users can walk away Feb 16 17:37:31 lcuk: then work decided to royally fuck with me, so I made it clear I wasn't going to do any of that any more. Feb 16 17:37:36 old telcos think users have no choice :) Feb 16 17:37:56 lcuk: right now I'm beating my head against a horrifically broken server farm and *much* more relaxed Feb 16 17:38:02 lcuk: how about you? Feb 16 17:38:50 bashing head against daily meego images, trying to make it usable Feb 16 17:39:03 Nice. I still haven't had time to try meego at all. Feb 16 17:39:26 ShadowJK: well here i indeed have only one telco providing me adsl Feb 16 17:39:27 lcuk: lol, well good luck with that Feb 16 17:39:38 would love to see a meego image eventually that is usable day to day Feb 16 17:39:41 ShadowJK: but it doesn't screw me Feb 16 17:39:41 I hope it stabilises to the point of getting some decent devices out this year, though Feb 16 17:39:52 rm_work, I pick it up and use it every day now Feb 16 17:39:56 lcuk: there are at least a tablet or two expected out this year, IIRC? Feb 16 17:40:14 lcuk: i heard you can't receive calls unless you have the phone app open? lol Feb 16 17:40:40 ccooke, I have a meego tablet (lenovo ideapad) Feb 16 17:40:48 or, do you mean on the tablet thing they gave out in ireland? or something else entirely Feb 16 17:40:49 ah Feb 16 17:40:53 yeah, the tablet thing Feb 16 17:40:58 it runs handset nicely :) looks a bit odd holding a 10" slate to ear though Feb 16 17:41:05 lol Feb 16 17:41:32 ShadowJK: i pay ~31 € for iptv, adsl and phone Feb 16 17:41:46 lcuk: *grin* Feb 16 17:42:16 rm_work, the N900 adaption is catching up at a tremendous rate - speed increases and kernel adaption is solidifying Feb 16 17:42:21 cheaper than my stuffs then : Feb 16 17:42:42 and stskeeps mentioned today that once the harpfp builds come through the cooker we should see even more speed bumps Feb 16 17:42:54 lcuk: how is it compared to maemo? Feb 16 17:42:59 (now) Feb 16 17:43:21 ccooke, how is what? Feb 16 17:43:31 or rather, which parts do you seek comparison of Feb 16 17:43:31 ShadowJK: a vod too Feb 16 17:43:37 I miss user apps Feb 16 17:43:47 yeah :/ Feb 16 17:43:53 but looking forward to alien dalvik? Feb 16 17:44:02 or is that not going to be available except through OEM? Feb 16 17:44:04 I need more ethernet cable to hook up iptv :( Feb 16 17:44:09 I saw vasvlad ported omweather though which made me smile Feb 16 17:44:37 i don Feb 16 17:44:46 lcuk: hmm. How responsive are the UI and basic apps? Feb 16 17:44:59 ShadowJK: i don't use it either, now Feb 16 17:45:09 lcuk: that's really the speed that *matters* to a phone: How long you have to wait to make a phone call or read an SMS Feb 16 17:45:15 ShadowJK: it's having 100 channels now iirc Feb 16 17:45:36 (it's one of the ways that maemo on the n900 is *still* better than most of the Android phones I've tried, for instance :-/ Feb 16 17:45:40 ccooke, I have not tried my sim in it. Others are obviously working at that Feb 16 17:46:34 ccooke: it's faster? Feb 16 17:46:54 i want n900 too Feb 16 17:47:11 quite expensive thing Feb 16 17:47:55 ketas: about the same speed to get to the phone apps. the n900 has a slightly simpler dialer which is a touch easier to use. During calls, the n900 is more predictable (not locking at the wrong moment) Feb 16 17:48:31 also, the n900 has much better phone hardware than my current HTC Desire Z. Much better speakers, better microphone... Feb 16 17:48:57 hahaha, because that Feb 16 17:49:02 's nokia Feb 16 17:49:14 sad if nokia hw goes away Feb 16 17:49:27 N810 speakers are much better than N900 :( Feb 16 17:49:36 :( Feb 16 17:49:52 my gf got old n770 for free Feb 16 17:50:32 a non wsod version? Feb 16 17:50:42 under the battery, it says it's made in estonia, you don't see that this days Feb 16 17:51:12 My N810 says made in Finland :) Feb 16 17:52:29 ShadowJK: really? I felt they're about par Feb 16 17:52:47 Proteous: what you mean? Feb 16 17:53:18 right Feb 16 17:53:27 white screen of death Feb 16 17:53:39 happens to a large percent of n770s after a while Feb 16 17:54:02 (the n900 is the best phone I've had in years. It annoys me that I don't currently use one; yes, there are things Android does better, but...) Feb 16 17:54:05 still working i guess Feb 16 17:54:20 I guess if it's still working then it must have super secrit wsod protection :) Feb 16 17:54:27 why you don't use n900? Feb 16 17:54:36 now Feb 16 17:54:47 it doesn't fit in the packet of his new slim fitting trousers Feb 16 17:55:13 s/packet/pocket/ Feb 16 17:55:13 Proteous meant: it doesn't fit in the pocket of his new slim fitting trousers Feb 16 17:56:27 I think maemo is light years ahead of android,, instead of a repository android has a "market place" perhaps I can purchase a terminal app Feb 16 17:56:28 packet doesn't fit into pocket Feb 16 17:56:49 sneakernet FTW Feb 16 17:56:52 n900 is quite a brick actually, yes Feb 16 17:57:19 i have 5800 currently Feb 16 17:57:27 newbie007: yes and no. Android is *much* more polished, and it has a better app community. Part of that is that it supports paid apps, sure. Feb 16 17:58:01 * ketas polishes ccooke Feb 16 17:58:02 There are apps on Android I wish I'd had on the n900... although conversely, some of the n900 apps are better than anything I've found on Android Feb 16 17:58:22 what apps were on android? Feb 16 17:58:31 angry birds Feb 16 17:58:37 done for n900 Feb 16 17:58:53 I want gnumeric, awesome ti, nes etc... Feb 16 17:59:05 gpodder Feb 16 17:59:19 How's google docs on Android? Feb 16 17:59:24 really what I want is to put Maemo on my Nook (e-book reader) I do not have/want an android phone Feb 16 17:59:26 Sucked last time I tried it Feb 16 17:59:33 But that was a while ago Feb 16 18:00:29 ketas: Stuff I use a lot that doesn't really exist on the n900: The kindle app (although I'll probably grab a kindle device evntually), some decent (offline) google reader apps, more seamless Dropbox support, various tools that help me GM D&D. Feb 16 18:00:46 Stuff for playing and recording Go. Feb 16 18:01:20 There's also a whole class of locational things that work better if you have a magnetometer Feb 16 18:02:54 Things I seriously miss from the n900... The absolute best sleep-cycle tracker alarm clock I've used. Better terminal (goes with the better keyboard!), I generally preferred the browsing experience (although the new android phone is faster, so handles flash better) Feb 16 18:03:06 the seamlessness of network transitions on the n900 was *very* good Feb 16 18:03:43 (oh, and: I never found a twitter app I really liked on the n900, although there were plenty of apps and that's more than likely just me) Feb 16 18:04:09 you guys are using maemo in past tense,, is maemo dead ? Feb 16 18:04:38 newbie007: I'm using it in the past tense because I don't currently have a usable maemo phone Feb 16 18:04:58 did you brick it? Feb 16 18:05:05 ... Feb 16 18:05:16 maybe hourse ate it Feb 16 18:05:24 didn't you read, his pants are too tight to pocket it Feb 16 18:05:31 pants, trousers whatever Feb 16 18:05:54 nope. usb connector. For the third time. Actually, my *wife's* usb connector. I had a phone upgrade due, so grabbed an android phone to see if it's improved a bit. Feb 16 18:06:04 and let my wife steal my n900 Feb 16 18:06:14 your wife has usb connector? Feb 16 18:06:21 doesn't yours? Feb 16 18:06:27 if not you should return her to the factory Feb 16 18:06:28 ketas: several. Feb 16 18:06:52 umm what you mean usb connector, did it broke? Feb 16 18:07:09 happens, some people like to swing them around by the cable Feb 16 18:07:20 hahaha Feb 16 18:07:28 ketas: the n900 has a known weakness in its usb connector. It's fine if you are careful, but a bit of bad luck or careless use... Feb 16 18:07:43 basically, the only thing hlding the connector on is solder. Feb 16 18:07:49 bad bad bad Feb 16 18:08:07 they have changed the design Feb 16 18:08:08 is it possible to fix? Feb 16 18:08:19 but early phones had the weak connector Feb 16 18:08:27 so new n900 probably doesn't have this weakness? Feb 16 18:08:32 ketas: open it up and add some hot glue? Feb 16 18:08:35 if i buy it now Feb 16 18:08:39 yeah Feb 16 18:08:45 no i mean if it does broke Feb 16 18:08:50 oh Feb 16 18:09:02 depends on how good you are at surface mount soldering Feb 16 18:09:06 Proteous: I didn't hear they'd changed the design. Feb 16 18:09:08 does it break pcb traces? Feb 16 18:09:10 Proteous: that's good to know Feb 16 18:09:19 ketas: they can be repaired. Feb 16 18:09:27 I'm just too busy to get around to it :-/ Feb 16 18:11:08 Proteous: presumably, when mine got a new main board, it should have the new design connector? Feb 16 18:11:17 I would assume so Feb 16 18:11:53 piggz: how come you got new main board? Feb 16 18:12:23 Proteous: changed design? citation needed! Feb 16 18:12:37 yeah, I'm looking for one :) Feb 16 18:12:43 I remember seeing it! Feb 16 18:12:48 been a while though Feb 16 18:12:59 ketas: it was always crashing...not a s/w issue, maybe a faulty mem chip or something Feb 16 18:13:43 thanfully, since i got it back it hasnt crashed once Feb 16 18:13:57 even with all the buggy cssu goodness ;) Feb 16 18:14:14 Today, I have learned something interesting: http://wojtek-soldierbear.weebly.com/ Feb 16 18:15:00 (Bah, this is the wrong channel for that. But hell, it's interesting anyway) Feb 16 18:17:44 piggz: Oh, what bugs? Reported and logged under http://j.mp/communityssu-bugs ? Feb 16 18:18:08 Jaffa: i was joking...i havnt found anything, its awesome! ;) Feb 16 18:18:29 cant wait for that fast rotation if possible Feb 16 18:20:21 * Jaffa 's looking forward to that. Was thinking of trying to implement it when thp popped up with his PoC Feb 16 18:23:42 * GAN900 still hasn't upgraded back to PR1.3. Feb 16 18:29:59 * ZogG snorts ccooke Feb 16 18:30:21 how much did you pay for it Feb 16 18:32:59 ZogG: hmm? Feb 16 18:34:53 Jaffa, piggz: anywhere I could read about this fast rotation PoC? Feb 16 18:35:49 javispedro: youtube Feb 16 18:35:59 not sure about any patches floating around Feb 16 18:36:37 * javispedro tried once, removed the animation but I didn't saw much improvement... Feb 16 18:37:51 ccooke, http://www.nerdnirvana.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/12/so-much-cocaine.jpg Feb 16 18:38:48 lol Feb 16 18:39:02 webos is niiicie Feb 16 18:39:40 ZogG: *laugh* Feb 16 18:39:48 hehe Feb 16 18:39:52 ZogG: I keep meaning to try webos. What's it like? Feb 16 18:40:06 I guess ccooke is not from Coke. I once met a guy named Anthony Cooke Feb 16 18:40:08 so that must be his last name Feb 16 18:40:18 I meant "coke" Feb 16 18:40:21 javispedro: fast rotation isn't going to happen because of slow interface to lcd Feb 16 18:40:25 the drug, not the drink Feb 16 18:41:25 jacekowski: you know this for a fact? Feb 16 18:41:43 I was wondering the same Feb 16 18:43:14 Venemo_N900: i know for a fact that you can only push so much data trough interface Feb 16 18:43:31 Venemo_N900: so if you can come up with nice idea of making it look good with lower bandwidth Feb 16 18:43:36 that would be nice Feb 16 18:45:40 ccooke haven't tried saw video review Feb 16 18:46:23 Sc0rpius actually the name of drink has same roots as drug Feb 16 18:46:25 and once there was little bit coke in coke Feb 16 18:46:40 hmm Feb 16 18:48:10 Sc0rpius, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coca-Cola#Coca_.E2.80.94_cocaine Feb 16 18:48:45 let's see Feb 16 19:40:11 hi Feb 16 19:40:16 anyone using jmirc on nokia Feb 16 19:40:19 how do you identify to a nick Feb 16 19:40:35 or can anyone suggest a nice irc client thats secure enough for nokia Feb 16 19:40:59 xchat works well for me Feb 16 19:41:31 does it support identifying to a nick ? Feb 16 19:42:02 sgev yes Feb 16 19:42:04 also is it possible to use encryption or something Feb 16 19:42:59 sgev: /msg nickserv id Feb 16 19:43:24 all the rest are just wrappers aroung this Feb 16 19:43:29 actually /nickserv works Feb 16 19:44:00 and i prefer using that, maybe one day NickServ/ChanServ is down and some smartass gets the nick and the passwords people send him Feb 16 19:44:09 slonopotamus: for jmirc or xchat Feb 16 19:44:24 sgev: for ANY irc client Feb 16 19:44:46 sgev: just send private message to nickserv with that text Feb 16 19:45:08 maybe he wants an IRC client that has automation for nick identification (a script) Feb 16 19:45:23 Sc0rpius: and what do you think /nickserv does? Feb 16 19:45:38 ah ok Feb 16 19:45:39 /nickserv is not a PRIVMSG Feb 16 19:45:42 thanks Feb 16 19:45:54 Sc0rpius: and what do you think /nickserv is? Feb 16 19:46:01 it's equivalent to a QUOTE NICKSERV Feb 16 19:46:03 it's different Feb 16 19:46:10 I mean it's equivalent for end users Feb 16 19:46:19 but if someday some guy makes /nick NickServ Feb 16 19:46:23 because NickServ is down Feb 16 19:46:28 he won't get passwords sent via /nickserv Feb 16 19:47:04 type: /quote nickserv help Feb 16 19:47:09 that will send a NICKSERV HELP Feb 16 19:47:17 if you type: /msg nickserv help Feb 16 19:47:22 that will send a PRIVMSG NICKSERV HELP Feb 16 19:47:36 I'm just paranoid, /msg nickserv, no way. Feb 16 19:48:00 Sc0rpius: and why you think that Alice won't get your /quote if she changes nick to nickserv? Feb 16 19:48:21 because it's not a PRIVMSG Feb 16 19:48:44 hanks Feb 16 19:48:55 because I think in the implementation of the daemon, and actually I'm almost sure, the communication between the daemon and the nickserv service through NICKSERV raw messages are direct Feb 16 19:49:00 or you could just sent the password as login password to the server ;) Feb 16 19:49:06 you know how many people Feb 16 19:49:14 gets the nick nicksrv waiting for you to typo? Feb 16 19:49:17 thus avoiding all of this ;) Feb 16 19:49:17 or nckserv Feb 16 19:49:25 Sc0rpius: on freenode /msg nickserv is as safe as /quote nickserv Feb 16 19:49:35 yeah but /msg nicksrv is not Feb 16 19:49:40 and /nicksrv gets a nice error Feb 16 19:49:43 or just send the pass at connection ;) Feb 16 19:50:00 don't make a mistakes Feb 16 19:50:00 server pass++ Feb 16 19:50:18 what stops you from making mistake like adding space in front of command Feb 16 19:50:22 so you end up wit Feb 16 19:50:31 /quote nickserv identify password Feb 16 19:50:36 and everybody sees it Feb 16 19:50:46 or use a script or some other method of automating it... Feb 16 19:52:15 well I still prefer /nickserv, it's faster, less keys to press Feb 16 19:52:21 try /ns ;) Feb 16 19:52:24 same thing ;) Feb 16 19:52:26 just shorter Feb 16 19:52:36 and it's more secure since it's a direct to NickServ@services.server Feb 16 19:52:38 :) Feb 16 19:52:47 well yeah Feb 16 19:52:47 well nickserv.pl works as well Feb 16 19:52:51 I learned something /ns Feb 16 19:52:52 thanks Feb 16 19:53:01 no more /nickserv for me! Feb 16 19:53:09 :) Feb 16 19:53:16 and as said... sending pass as server password at connecting... works as well ;) Feb 16 19:53:25 really? Feb 16 19:53:27 lemme try that Feb 16 19:54:39 nah that didn't work Feb 16 19:54:54 worked for me so far Feb 16 19:54:56 I had to identify manually Feb 16 19:55:38 but I'm happy with /ns now Feb 16 19:55:48 http://blog.freenode.net/2005/08/ Feb 16 19:56:10 see that blog post Feb 16 19:56:14 quite strange, i've got email with vcal invitation, and modest does not show it at all. no attachment, no indication there is something besides text. that sucks! Feb 16 19:56:37 As a convenience to our users, you can now identify to NickServ as you connect to the network. Just connect with your registered nickname and specify your NickServ password as a server password. We hope this will make identifying to NickServ easier Feb 16 19:57:33 maybe you're not passing the pw correctly or something? Feb 16 19:57:49 with irssi I know it's /connect server port pass Feb 16 19:57:54 I do, but I'm using chat.freenode.net as server Feb 16 19:58:00 shouldn't matter Feb 16 19:58:00 maybe I have to specify a real server Feb 16 19:58:14 lemme try again Feb 16 19:59:36 I think it works I just think it doesn't work Feb 16 19:59:41 » Logged in as: Sc0rpius Feb 16 19:59:45 it seems it works Feb 16 19:59:47 hehe Feb 16 20:00:03 no I have to disable my script Feb 16 20:00:14 ok let's see now Feb 16 20:00:24 I'll get banned with server hammering Feb 16 20:01:00 nope, I'm not logged in Feb 16 20:01:02 doesn't work for me Feb 16 20:01:02 hmm Feb 16 20:01:05 interesting... Feb 16 20:01:12 identifying manually Feb 16 20:01:22 might try to bug the fine folk in #freenode ;) Feb 16 20:01:33 it's ok, I have a script anyway that does it for me Feb 16 20:02:10 user:password Feb 16 20:02:35 iirc Feb 16 20:02:40 ohhh Feb 16 20:02:42 that changes everything Feb 16 20:02:46 I thought that was only for tor Feb 16 20:02:58 I should send that as server password? Feb 16 20:03:04 try it Feb 16 20:03:05 yep Feb 16 20:03:07 I'll try later, I think I'm getting banned in any moment now Feb 16 20:03:10 lol Feb 16 20:03:13 doubtful Feb 16 20:03:19 nah Feb 16 20:03:28 does https://garage.maemo.org/builder/fremantle/ EVER get cleaned? Feb 16 20:04:09 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0v2xnl6LwJE Bad. Ass. Optical Illusion. Feb 16 20:04:31 slonopotamus, hmm well nothing from 2009 there... Feb 16 20:04:36 so I'm assuming it does... Feb 16 20:06:26 ruskie: but lots from summer 2010 Feb 16 20:08:17 worth a download Feb 16 20:08:51 that's the Escher's Waterfall Feb 16 20:09:06 if you see it from the side, you'll see why it works Feb 16 20:09:54 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Escher_Waterfall.jpg Feb 16 20:10:13 this is the original picture, but if you see the structure from the side, it's actually downhill Feb 16 20:10:22 yes i know Feb 16 20:10:44 now build it and make the water fall from 'top' to bottom Feb 16 20:11:57 anyway for xchat: http://toxin.jottit.com/xchat_connect#11 Feb 16 20:12:59 maybe also of interest: http://toxin.jottit.com/freenode_nickserv_commands Feb 16 20:13:42 haha the water is not coming from the "bottom" Feb 16 20:13:47 it just looks that way Feb 16 20:16:04 Sc0rpius: can you explain it? Feb 16 20:28:35 alterego, ping Feb 16 20:29:11 what's to explain with it? it's a 2d representation that doesn't make sense when you try to extrapolate it into 3d with usual rules Feb 16 20:29:31 well if you try to visualize it without the vertical posts (or delete them somehow) you can see the real structure Feb 16 20:29:36 emphasis on *usual* Feb 16 20:29:44 the damn vertical posts look connected from that angle and your brain deceives you Feb 16 20:29:58 there is no real structure Feb 16 20:30:05 it's a 2D painting Feb 16 20:30:12 you saw the video? Feb 16 20:30:25 he wants us to explain the video Feb 16 20:31:03 Sc0rpius: you only think you understand it Feb 16 20:31:12 that's because you understand so little Feb 16 20:31:27 DocScrutinizer: so the water is computer animation? Feb 16 20:32:05 i understand how the structure can be flat on the floor Feb 16 20:32:14 with a mild incline for the water Feb 16 20:32:25 umm, sorry. No idea what you're talking bout Feb 16 20:32:36 DocScrutinizer hasn't watched the video Feb 16 20:32:55 but the 'falling' bit makes no sense Feb 16 20:41:12 meh Feb 16 20:41:24 i hate scratchbox Feb 16 20:41:26 meh, watch the shadows at 0:32 Feb 16 20:41:43 i hate those who decided to use scratchbox for maemo Feb 16 20:42:02 SB is an abomination Feb 16 20:43:51 just compiling inside a full system qemu would probably suck less Feb 16 20:43:55 Scratchbox is not bad, but I hate it can't emulate armel bins using qemu Feb 16 20:44:04 (so many packages suck goats at crosscompiling) Feb 16 20:44:23 Sc0rpius: it isn't bad, it is EXTREMELY bad Feb 16 20:44:35 I have never had a problem with scratchbox, but changing from x86 to armel is tedious Feb 16 20:44:51 while I stay in x86, it works as expected Feb 16 20:45:00 if you didn't have problems with scratchbox, you just didn't use it. Feb 16 20:45:06 hah Feb 16 20:45:16 I use it everyday, fixing the bugs you guys report Feb 16 20:45:34 first problem I had prior to even initially starting that shit Feb 16 20:45:42 it raped my HDD space Feb 16 20:46:14 I have it locked in a VMPlayer and I think my virtual HDD is no more than 20 GB Feb 16 20:46:21 SB > Madde Feb 16 20:46:28 Sc0rpius: how the hell i'm supposed to build perl package usable on n900 without hitting that 5.8.4/5.8.3 crap? Feb 16 20:47:02 also, is it me, or was debhelper updated to version 7 Feb 16 20:47:04 oooh no more that 20GB --- seriously? o.O Isn't that outright marvelous Feb 16 20:47:38 (the one who decided to use different versions of packages on device and on buildbot deserves separate punishment) Feb 16 20:47:47 my whole fscking root is less than 20GB Feb 16 20:48:27 I even have boxes that have <20GB storage *total* Feb 16 20:48:30 how do you live with 20GBs? :o Feb 16 20:48:39 you want to build perl? Feb 16 20:48:52 Sc0rpius: i want to build git Feb 16 20:48:55 because scratchbox lets you choose which version of perl you want to use Feb 16 20:49:29 Sc0rpius: and through a chain of several tens of deps that ends up in libdbi-perl Feb 16 20:50:09 how do I live with 20GB? Ruthless filtering, baby Feb 16 20:50:19 i want to use _none_ of scratchbox tools Feb 16 20:50:28 * MohammadAG got mindraped with Qt Feb 16 20:50:31 did you read /scratchbox/doc/perl.txt ? Feb 16 20:50:33 you didn't, did you Feb 16 20:50:52 where the hell i'm supposed to get that? Feb 16 20:51:02 don't you think i have scratchbox locally? Feb 16 20:51:47 it exists here Feb 16 20:51:51 where the hell? in /scratchbox/doc/perl.txt Feb 16 20:52:11 [sbox-FREMANTLE_X86: /scratchbox/doc] > vi perl.txt Feb 16 20:52:19 Sc0rpius: i don't have /scratchbox. builder has. Feb 16 20:52:56 ok first questionÑ: Feb 16 20:53:02 did YOU install the Maemo SDK? Feb 16 20:53:08 of course no Feb 16 20:53:22 it doesn't have installable for n900. Feb 16 20:53:31 you don't develop in the N900 Feb 16 20:53:34 you develop in your PC Feb 16 20:53:35 i do Feb 16 20:53:44 see, It's simple absurd you need 20GB to build a (set of) binary that fits into 100MB Feb 16 20:53:57 sadly, my n900 didn't come bundled with a development PC Feb 16 20:54:08 don't you have a PC? Feb 16 20:54:23 irrelevant Feb 16 20:54:30 i do develop on my n900 Feb 16 20:54:40 well good luck with that Feb 16 20:54:45 now what you exactly want to do? Feb 16 20:55:02 and everything works here. it's maemo builder who has troubles because it has scratchbox. Feb 16 20:55:31 Sc0rpius: i want to build libdbi-perl on builder and after that install it on my n900 Feb 16 20:56:07 it's for the community or only for you? Feb 16 20:56:18 because if you are using builder just because you want a .deb you don't need it Feb 16 20:56:21 however, http://maemo.org/packages/package_instance/view/fremantle_extras-devel_free_armel/libdbi-perl/1.605-1maemo1/ Feb 16 20:56:50 maemo builder pulls perl-5.8.4 from somewhere Feb 16 20:57:01 according to google, it comes from scratchbox Feb 16 20:57:17 but n900 only has 5.8.3 Feb 16 20:57:52 so, maemo builder is broken because it builds for something different than the _only_ maemo5 device - n900 Feb 16 20:58:11 does it make sense? Feb 16 20:58:22 that "depends" line is in devian/control file, is not something builder should be putting there Feb 16 20:58:28 debian/control Feb 16 20:59:51 I'd have to see that line in the debian/control file of your package Feb 16 21:00:34 the Depends: and Build-depends: lines Feb 16 21:00:50 slonopotamus: funny Feb 16 21:01:46 I just found out that my VMWare with Ubuntu + Maemo SDK Feb 16 21:01:49 it's just 9 GB Feb 16 21:02:08 9.15 GB to be exact Feb 16 21:02:19 aiui builder should try to use lowest version of libs always. That's how they try to keep pkgs compatible with older PR versions Feb 16 21:02:26 indeed. Feb 16 21:02:39 I think he's porting the libdbi-perl from another OS Feb 16 21:02:51 and that's why he's getting weird dependences Feb 16 21:03:14 but package perl-base for Maemo is different and includes more things, and I think, (almost sure), includes perlapi Feb 16 21:03:17 I guess builder is built from perl ;-P Feb 16 21:03:54 and gets mental about what's "userspace" and what's its own 'brain' Feb 16 21:04:09 and I REALLY SUGGEST you use Maemo SDK. If you are a smart guy using W7, just download VMWare Player like smart guys do, install an Ubuntu environment, and install Maemo SDK tehre Feb 16 21:04:34 you don't have to give up your precious Windows 7 workstation for a nasty Linux environment Feb 16 21:04:41 * Sc0rpius waits the haters wave gonna hate Feb 16 21:05:23 Sc0rpius: all OK at your site? o.O Feb 16 21:05:28 hehehe Feb 16 21:05:51 ... Feb 16 21:05:54 actually look this setup Feb 16 21:06:07 this is a Corei5 quad 750 4 GB RAm running W7 64 bits Feb 16 21:06:09 two monitors Feb 16 21:06:12 the host OS (Windows) in one Feb 16 21:06:32 VMWare maximized running Ubuntu in the other monitor Feb 16 21:06:40 so it's both environments at the same time Feb 16 21:06:58 VMWare is extremely fast, you don't notice any performance degradation in the Ubuntu VM Feb 16 21:06:58 Sc0rpius: from debian/control: Depends: ${perl:Depends}, ${shlibs:Depends}, libplrpc-perl Feb 16 21:07:03 ah then you got me Feb 16 21:07:10 now Build-Depends: ? Feb 16 21:07:32 just a couple of lines above Feb 16 21:07:53 WIN7(VMware(LINUX(ScratchBox(ARMemu(Maemo(compiler))))) Feb 16 21:07:55 Sc0rpius: debhelper (>= 7), perl-modules, quilt (>= 0.40), libtest-pod-perl, libplrpc-perl, libtest-pod-coverage-perl Feb 16 21:08:06 that's the Build-Depends: ? Feb 16 21:08:13 yes Feb 16 21:08:27 Sc0rpius: do you see 5.8.4 there? i don't Feb 16 21:08:50 WIN7(virtualPC(Ubuntu(VMware(LINUX(ScratchBox(ARMemu(Maemo(compiler))))))) Feb 16 21:09:05 and it gets correct 5.8.3 if built on n900 Feb 16 21:09:10 "* Disabled scratchbox hijacking of /usr/bin/perl" Feb 16 21:09:14 what exactly includes that change? Feb 16 21:10:13 DocScrutinizer: :D Feb 16 21:10:13 Sc0rpius: export SBOX_REDIRECT_IGNORE=/usr/bin/perl and export PATH=/usr/bin:/bin:/scratchbox/tools/bin in debian/rules Feb 16 21:10:28 Sc0rpius: without that, things were even worse Feb 16 21:11:02 well i think I'm gonna download the sources and see what the problem is Feb 16 21:11:10 umm Feb 16 21:11:11 beacuse you don't really need to do that Feb 16 21:11:14 if I stash a commit Feb 16 21:11:21 how do I reapply it? Feb 16 21:11:31 MohammadAG: git stash pop Feb 16 21:12:12 Sc0rpius: without those, scratchbox tries to load arm .so into x86 perl (coming from /scratchbox) and happily fails Feb 16 21:13:24 MohammadAG: or git stash apply (that'll keep it on stash) Feb 16 21:14:44 http://xkcd.com/394/ Feb 16 21:15:25 I'm retarded Feb 16 21:15:33 I worked on something for 3 hours Feb 16 21:15:35 MohammadAG: what's the matter? Feb 16 21:15:37 it didn't compile Feb 16 21:15:39 \o/ finally Feb 16 21:15:41 I gave up and removed the changes Feb 16 21:15:58 and still no luck :-P Feb 16 21:16:02 Veggen: hehe :) Feb 16 21:16:16 MohammadAG: welcome to the club Feb 16 21:16:18 no, I was using CONFIG += mobility Feb 16 21:16:18 :-D Feb 16 21:16:21 instead of mobility12 Feb 16 21:16:31 * MohammadAG faceplams :/ Feb 16 21:16:37 lol Feb 16 21:16:40 3h work, gone Feb 16 21:16:44 oh well Feb 16 21:17:22 :( happens to the best of us. Just make sure your gf wont hear about it Feb 16 21:17:31 3h? bah, nothing! if it's like 3 weeks, maybe 3 months, then you are entitled to start moaning Feb 16 21:17:58 commit early, commit often :P Feb 16 21:18:04 muhahaha Feb 16 21:18:11 then squash and push :) Feb 16 21:19:12 hello Feb 16 21:19:25 has any one been able to get rsync to work with n900? Feb 16 21:19:31 * DocScrutinizer idly ponders how long until he gets the much wanted versioning fs on all his boxes Feb 16 21:19:40 I can ssh into it Feb 16 21:19:51 sure Feb 16 21:20:04 doing that every day, literally Feb 16 21:20:09 cronjob :-D Feb 16 21:20:41 rsync [OPTION...] [USER@]HOST:SRC... [DEST] Feb 16 21:20:44 need a hint? Feb 16 21:21:08 please...I've read the man page and I'm still not able to get it to work properly Feb 16 21:21:11 Sc0rpius: i'm going to sleep, if you do smth good/have ideas with libdbi-perl, please, /msg me Feb 16 21:22:07 while ! rsync -vaRzx --fake-super root@$1:/ ~/Documents/N900/backup/$1; do echo "$1 not available via ssh, retrying in 30 minutes"; sleep 1800; done Feb 16 21:22:09 echo "########## rootfs synced, now syncing /home" Feb 16 21:22:10 while ! rsync -vaRzx --fake-super root@$1:/home ~/Documents/N900/backup/$1/home; do echo "$1 not available via ssh, retrying in 30 minutes"; sleep 1800; done Feb 16 21:22:51 thanks Feb 16 21:27:24 rdesfo: this assumes you have set up your .ssh/authorized_keys properly Feb 16 21:27:50 hmm Feb 16 21:29:12 DocScrutinizer: thanks Feb 16 21:29:13 rdesfo: and $1 obviously is the N900 IP target. I got fixed IP assigned to my devices in /etc/hosts, so I call this script like `rsync-N900 IroN900` where IroN900 is the name of my daily phone as of /etc/hosts Feb 16 21:31:49 of course `rsync-N900 192.168.1.41` will work as well Feb 16 21:36:27 I can't find debhelper >=7 all I got and I can get is 5 Feb 16 21:37:07 oh there's 7 Feb 16 21:37:12 btw I *LOVE* hardlinks Feb 16 21:37:27 moo. Feb 16 21:38:48 moo javispedro Feb 16 21:39:34 cp -al FTW Feb 16 21:41:17 javispedro: If you're still looking for the rotation PoC, see thp's most recent blog post on Planet Feb 16 21:42:10 thanks Jaffa Feb 16 21:42:36 javispedro: And the merge request/commits under http://gitorious.org/community-ssu/hildon-desktop Feb 16 21:42:50 * DocScrutinizer ponders idly to peek at recent MWKN Feb 16 21:43:15 DocScrutinizer: You can ignore my blathering on the front page, I won't mind Feb 16 21:46:30 hum Feb 16 21:46:42 I wish I had some time to continue my experiments with xrandr.. Feb 16 21:46:53 I still believe it is plausible to do it seamlessly Feb 16 21:50:25 javispedro: what do you want to do? Feb 16 21:50:50 to make it rotate handset ux-style, without ditching xrandr Feb 16 21:51:11 heh Feb 16 21:51:19 i'm sorry i have no context for that. maemo or meego? Feb 16 21:51:33 local tv is getting The IT crowd =) Feb 16 21:51:45 badly written show, sadly Feb 16 21:51:48 great concept Feb 16 21:51:53 pupnik: meego's handset ux Feb 16 21:51:56 ah ok Feb 16 21:52:08 but using maemo as test platform Feb 16 21:52:15 (as maemo currently uses xrandr) Feb 16 21:52:23 * pupnik loves e7 design Feb 16 21:53:51 Jaffa: why ignore that? all I read there is to the point Feb 16 21:55:50 http://nokiapla.net/ <- makes me happy Feb 16 21:55:53 err Feb 16 21:55:54 I still got a feeling of doom about that "meego device". Might be a tablet? Feb 16 21:58:48 Doc: Will be a Harmattan phone. Stop winding yourself up. Feb 16 22:02:58 RST38h: http://www.flickr.com/photos/10938917@N00/5451361389/ the slide that shows the inspiration for WP7's UI =) Feb 16 22:03:14 http://nokiaplans.com/ Feb 16 22:04:24 javispedro: well it shows perfectly the fact that it's a giant clusterfuck Feb 16 22:05:08 javispedro, that looks like very very early stage liqbase than WP7 :P Feb 16 22:05:23 lcuk: yeah, that tiles concept.. Feb 16 22:06:09 they should have put liqbase in that slide too ;) Feb 16 22:06:34 nahh I bet my handwriting wasn't neat enough Feb 16 22:06:37 it is now ;) Feb 16 22:06:38 http://liqbase.net/liq.20110214_135930.liqpostcard.scr.png Feb 16 22:06:57 http://nokiaplan0.com/ <- is better Feb 16 22:07:47 which one is the genius and which one's the insane again? Feb 16 22:08:40 javispedro, hehe, see the next slide with all the text Feb 16 22:09:12 then compare: http://liqbase.net/liq.20110131_081956.liqbookreader.scr.png Feb 16 22:09:20 it's about typography! Feb 16 22:09:38 lcuk: did you make a font with your handwriting? :) Feb 16 22:10:06 you could sell it :) Feb 16 22:10:20 javispedro, no, I made the UI use anybodies handwriting Feb 16 22:10:47 javispedro, I actually did it in 2008 :) Feb 16 22:10:55 the hand written gpl is awesome Feb 16 22:11:17 http://liqbase.net/liq.20081124_225643.gary.scr.png Feb 16 22:11:28 (before I learnt how to write neatly :) ) Feb 16 22:11:37 heh Feb 16 22:12:04 that was about a week before I started work on turning liqbase into a library Feb 16 22:12:18 was practically the last thing I tried in classic liqbase :) Feb 16 22:14:29 time to reboot Feb 16 22:15:11 ah yes a question I always forget when I am here ... :p Feb 16 22:15:22 does N900 and the current firmware support ipv6 ? :/ Feb 16 22:22:24 * timeless is having trouble installing The One Ring Feb 16 22:22:27 can anyone help me? Feb 16 22:24:19 Onion? Feb 16 22:24:48 he wants to rule us all ... dont help him! :p Feb 16 22:25:27 //ns rename timeless brain Feb 16 22:25:47 * trumee ssu channel seems to be dead. Feb 16 22:26:07 hrm, so Vuze is downloading a JRE Feb 16 22:26:13 * timeless wonders which JRE it grabbed Feb 16 22:26:59 * DocScrutinizer wonders if Jaffa is asleep Feb 16 22:28:06 nick:password as server password worked Feb 16 22:28:17 \o/ Feb 16 22:28:26 heh Feb 16 22:28:29 toldya Feb 16 22:28:44 * Gh0sty still wondering where alarmed actually saves its stuff ... :/ Feb 16 22:28:44 that's nicer than /ns identify Feb 16 22:28:55 since it updated it only works half :p Feb 16 22:28:56 plus you get cloaked prior to autojoining channels, as a bonus Feb 16 22:29:06 yeah though I don't have a cloak Feb 16 22:29:21 it kills my sound in the evening but does not put it back to general ... :/ Feb 16 22:29:23 Sc0rpius: cloaks are cheap Feb 16 22:29:31 how much Feb 16 22:29:58 wow, vuze grabbed j6u23 Feb 16 22:30:00 * timeless is impressed Feb 16 22:30:12 brb Feb 16 22:30:16 DocScrutinizer: Nearly Feb 16 22:30:28 so... the one ring... anyone? Feb 16 22:30:29 .config/alarmed/jobs Feb 16 22:31:03 * timeless tries "Google Voice plugin for Conversations and Calls" Feb 16 22:32:11 hm nicu DocScrutinizer Feb 16 22:32:11 Gh0sty: ^^^ you might want to rm .config/alarmed/jobs/* Feb 16 22:32:20 nicu? Feb 16 22:32:23 nice* Feb 16 22:32:32 I was looking for something like .alarmed :P Feb 16 22:32:49 who had figured it has a .config in front of it ... :) Feb 16 22:33:01 yeah, I hate it Feb 16 22:33:16 I hate the other crap in there even more, thanks Qt Feb 16 22:33:21 yes indeed I want to delete it and reconfigure it again in the gui ... Feb 16 22:33:35 since now I have no clue what it does exactly Feb 16 22:33:42 think some jobs got deleted Feb 16 22:34:01 and some are still there, but after a full device reflash it recovered the jobs but there is nothing in the gui :p Feb 16 22:35:28 * DrGrov is missing his N900 Feb 16 22:36:33 quite strange, i've got email with vcal invitation, and modest does not show it at all. no attachment, no indication there is something besides text. that sucks! Feb 16 22:36:44 DrGrov: broken? Feb 16 22:36:51 or you learned it how to swim? :p Feb 16 22:37:33 Gh0sty: No, I sold it for my cousin. I got myself a N8 instead but got tired of Nokia and how they do business and got myself the HTC Desire HD on Monday this week. Feb 16 22:38:03 I know, I am a phone whore ;-) Feb 16 22:40:09 Arkenoi: meeting invitations is implemented in PR1.2 for ActiveSync (MfE) according to https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=9296#c9 - no idea about non-MfE though Feb 16 22:40:13 Bug 9296: Exchange event invitations scheduled without a prompt Feb 16 22:40:40 Gh0sty: ping Shapeshifter Feb 16 22:43:44 DocScrutinizer: did a couple of days ago Feb 16 22:43:53 but I think hes from a very different timezone Feb 16 22:44:01 he responded at 3am or something :p Feb 16 22:44:13 ~seen Shapeshifter Feb 16 22:44:21 shapeshifter is currently on #maemo (18h 42m 51s) #meego (18h 42m 51s). Has said a total of 76 messages. Is idling for 12h 20m 28s, last said: 'is that a service pack to Red Hat 98plus! ?'. Feb 16 22:45:10 hmm Feb 16 22:45:16 between 10 and 12 :) Feb 16 22:45:21 lets see tomorrow then :P Feb 16 22:51:51 I started working on a Bluetooth Messenger for the school project Feb 16 22:52:07 "beta" seems to be working fine Feb 16 22:52:36 what's a BT messanger? Feb 16 22:53:04 MohammadAG: hold on, what? Feb 16 22:53:14 Bluetooth Feb 16 22:53:20 don't you handle the CSSU and a shitton more maemo projects? Feb 16 22:53:28 works between the N900 and Ubuntu Feb 16 22:53:34 kerio, blame my school Feb 16 22:53:45 it's a school project Feb 16 22:53:48 * DocScrutinizer pondered a BT/wifi p2p web, for states with lots of people crowding up but GSM switched off by authorities Feb 16 22:54:04 wifi rapes battery (ad-hoc at least) Feb 16 22:54:11 yeah Feb 16 22:54:19 not BT though Feb 16 22:54:24 BT's ideal Feb 16 22:54:36 and with Qt Mobility, it's cross platform Feb 16 22:54:51 in Tokio and UAE they date in bus via BT Feb 16 22:55:04 lol Feb 16 22:55:12 why not extend it to form a network nobody can tear down Feb 16 22:55:31 i need to implement stuff password protection on rooms though Feb 16 22:55:34 (C) jr Feb 16 22:55:54 well, simple answer Feb 16 22:56:02 I need a shitload of N900s to test Feb 16 22:56:19 I'd take pride in all those dictators hating me for the idea :-D Feb 16 22:56:21 00:02 < DocScrutinizer> in Tokio and UAE they date in bus via BT Feb 16 22:56:22 Qt Mobility works better on the N900 than on Ubuntu (weird, eh?) Feb 16 22:56:28 I should visit tokio! :P Feb 16 22:56:45 in america they date via chatroulette Feb 16 22:56:55 get back to $yourLocation Feb 16 22:56:59 lol Feb 16 22:58:51 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tMy_w5HsfdI Feb 16 23:23:02 hi there Feb 16 23:23:14 hi Feb 16 23:23:41 I have compiled my modified kernel with dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot -uc -us -sa Feb 16 23:23:53 do you know if now I need to set the n900 in flash mode? Feb 16 23:24:09 or have I just to use dpkg -i with those .deb files Feb 16 23:25:45 deno, you will have to flash your kernel as well Feb 16 23:26:08 trumee, uhm is not enough: Feb 16 23:26:21 dpkg -i kernel-power_2.6.28-maemo46_armel.deb Feb 16 23:26:21 dpkg -i kernel-power-modules_2.6.28-maemo46_armel.deb Feb 16 23:26:21 dpkg -i kernel-power-flasher_2.6.28-maemo46_armel.deb Feb 16 23:26:21 dpkg -i kernel-power-bootimg_2.6.28-maemo46_armel.deb Feb 16 23:26:23 ? Feb 16 23:26:46 deno, no idea. sorry Feb 16 23:26:57 umm Feb 16 23:26:59 k thx anyway Feb 16 23:27:08 only the first 3 Feb 16 23:27:18 why not the last? Feb 16 23:27:24 the -flasher package flashes the kernel, you just have to reboot Feb 16 23:27:30 iirc you need modules, kernel, flasher, in this sequence Feb 16 23:27:34 -bootimg is for multiboot, you don't need it Feb 16 23:27:52 ah ok Feb 16 23:27:53 yeah, listen to MohammadAG Feb 16 23:28:00 the order is ok? Feb 16 23:28:01 he knows his stuff Feb 16 23:28:05 kk Feb 16 23:28:19 kernel + modules can be done in one step Feb 16 23:28:31 then flasher Feb 16 23:28:31 flasher in a separate one (it predepends on the other 2) Feb 16 23:28:40 ooh? Feb 16 23:28:43 yep, you know your stuff to apparently :P Feb 16 23:29:03 tbh, i just dpkg -i * Feb 16 23:29:12 uhm Feb 16 23:29:17 it fails the first time obviously, but when I run it again, it works :P Feb 16 23:29:25 ok makes sense :) Feb 16 23:29:27 yeah Feb 16 23:29:38 i'm just lazy :P Feb 16 23:29:45 :D Feb 16 23:29:49 thank you :) Feb 16 23:30:04 yw Feb 16 23:30:14 I should go to bed :/ Feb 16 23:30:30 me too :D Feb 16 23:30:43 time for lunch Feb 16 23:30:49 o.O Feb 16 23:30:54 where are you DocScrutinizer ? Feb 16 23:31:01 USA? Feb 16 23:31:06 Germany lol Feb 16 23:31:13 sol3 Feb 16 23:31:15 lol Feb 16 23:31:39 commonly called 'earth' Feb 16 23:31:42 even in germany is not time for lunch Feb 16 23:31:44 :D Feb 16 23:32:08 Ah MohammadAG one last thing Feb 16 23:32:18 should I put the nokia in flashmode or not? Feb 16 23:32:33 during the installation of these packages Feb 16 23:32:41 nope Feb 16 23:32:43 no Feb 16 23:32:48 -flasher does everything Feb 16 23:33:03 just reboot Feb 16 23:33:06 ah ok cool Feb 16 23:33:12 after install Feb 16 23:33:24 ok Feb 16 23:33:43 it's a bit big the kernel maybe I have to copy it in /opt Feb 16 23:33:44 ok Feb 16 23:33:59 thank you again :) Feb 16 23:34:04 it's flashed to /dev/mtd2 at installation Feb 16 23:34:17 don't copy it anywhere, it's deleted after flashing ends Feb 16 23:34:28 you can place the .deb anywgere Feb 16 23:34:43 have a good uhm Feb 16 23:34:52 lol I was saying you by Feb 16 23:34:53 bye Feb 16 23:34:56 uhm Feb 16 23:35:06 yes, .deb doesn't matter Feb 16 23:35:12 .fiasco does Feb 16 23:35:16 One time I tried to install the packages from the 32GB memory but it was not possible Feb 16 23:35:19 it has to stay in /boot till flashed Feb 16 23:35:29 deno, nope, should work fine Feb 16 23:35:41 MohammadAG, maybe was just that time.. very strange Feb 16 23:35:43 k Feb 16 23:36:01 see you Feb 16 23:36:05 have a good night Feb 16 23:36:06 can someone tranquilize me? I really need to sleep Feb 16 23:36:22 tranquillize you for what? Feb 16 23:36:23 night :P Feb 16 23:36:40 I'm on IRC Feb 16 23:36:55 k Feb 16 23:37:22 go to sleeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeppppppppp Feb 16 23:37:23 :P Feb 16 23:37:48 ah right Feb 16 23:38:20 better? :-P Feb 16 23:38:21 if is possible to install packages from Feb 16 23:38:25 the MMC Feb 16 23:38:38 so it's possible also to mount root on it, isn't it? Feb 16 23:39:44 that's a bit more complicated Feb 16 23:40:13 meego is doing that Feb 16 23:40:34 uhm Feb 16 23:40:37 they need uBoot bootloader for it Feb 16 23:40:44 why so complicated? Feb 16 23:41:06 because NOLO bootloader will not mount and boot rootfs on MMC Feb 16 23:41:40 ok Feb 16 23:41:43 DocScrutinizer: Mohammad told me to tell you to unquiet him. (after he's gone) ;) Feb 16 23:41:44 no way Feb 16 23:42:19 thank you again Feb 16 23:42:20 see you Feb 16 23:42:23 have a good night! Feb 17 00:07:02 andre: it is non-mfe, just vcal file attached. Feb 17 00:08:17 omg wtf? Feb 17 00:08:31 bbq? Feb 17 00:08:38 its logging all this stuff into irclogs/freenode/*/ Feb 17 00:08:47 why the heck does it use /*/ Feb 17 00:09:02 I feel there is a ghost in the system! Feb 17 00:09:02 big brother is * Feb 17 00:09:27 was wondering why it did not go to freenode/##overflow or freenode/#maemo Feb 17 00:09:30 don understand :/ Feb 17 00:10:00 ever eat spicey peppers and later have spicey poops? Feb 17 00:10:59 my friends don't understand what spicey poops are Feb 17 00:11:14 how can some people not have spicey poops? Feb 17 00:13:06 test Feb 17 00:13:26 iciles Feb 17 00:13:41 strange Feb 17 00:13:46 very strange Feb 17 00:13:51 just reconnected and now it runs fine Feb 17 00:21:11 DocScrutinizer: the song 'Bette Davis Eyes' classic synth sound is the Sequential Circuits Prophet-5 (1977) Feb 17 00:58:25 when did speedevil ping out? Feb 17 00:59:53 Odd. laptop 'locked up', no ssh, display won't wake up - no keyb activity, yet flash videos audio is still going. Feb 17 01:23:37 N900ev1l: Are you using Firefox? Feb 17 01:24:14 As it happens, yes. Feb 17 01:24:44 N900ev1l: Linux I presume? Feb 17 01:24:51 I've noticed video is a lot less smooth in some flash visdeo streams. Feb 17 01:24:54 yes. Feb 17 01:25:01 fcam needs a bit more documentation... Feb 17 01:25:14 I have had that exact same issue from time to time. Not too much but a few times over the past 6 months or so. Feb 17 01:25:29 So then I suggest for you to drop to terminal 1. Should be Ctrl+Alt+F1 Feb 17 01:25:34 also, Example 1, "A program that takes a single shot", quite evidently takes three shots Feb 17 01:25:36 Then do a "killall -9 firefox-bin" Feb 17 01:25:39 DrGrov: nope Feb 17 01:25:51 N900ev1l: Which Linux are you using? Feb 17 01:26:07 DrGrov: no keyboard was working, including magic-sysrq Feb 17 01:26:16 slackware. Feb 17 01:26:27 Ah, then that is an another story. I have had it with a keyboard still working luckily. Feb 17 01:26:49 Maybe a thermal issue. Feb 17 01:27:14 N900ev1l: Could definitely be so. I have had some issues as well, not sure if thermal issues but still that exact same thing. Feb 17 01:27:19 Except the keyboard was still working Feb 17 01:56:58 hello, do I need unpartitioned disk space on the eMMC on my n900 for it to work properly? Feb 17 02:00:13 N900ev1l: flash is running and occupying CPU, the kbd events don't get processed in due time. If you're unlucky to issue some kbd event that's not directly switching to another task (i.e. esp ctrl-alt-F1), then this event sits like a cork on top of kbd fifo, and later ctrl-alt-F1 won't show any effect Feb 17 02:01:12 2hich doesn't explain magic sysrq not working. Feb 17 02:01:20 yep Feb 17 02:02:39 except if there's some spinlock or flow-control in kernel even blocking the low level kbd drivers Feb 17 02:03:49 depending on what flash is using in gfx-accel, this might well explain it Feb 17 02:04:14 DocScrutinizer: Still awake coding all the time? :) Feb 17 02:04:19 DocScrutinizer: I love the passion you have :) Feb 17 02:05:04 it's more like sitting in my own virtual prison, hoping for time to pass by and things to change Feb 17 02:05:22 but you don't really need nor want to understand this Feb 17 02:07:55 flash is disgusting Feb 17 02:08:39 DrGrov: didn't I tell you to go away? Feb 17 02:09:16 pupnik: Huh? I can not even make questions anymore? Feb 17 02:10:04 DocScrutinizer: I see. I just thought that what drives you. Feb 17 02:10:15 i just think you should take your trolling elsewhere Feb 17 02:10:23 good bye Feb 17 02:10:44 pupnik: I am not trying to insult anyone. I am merely trying to understand. Feb 17 02:12:22 http://www.fsf.org/working-together/quizzes/support [ Do you support software freedom? ] Feb 17 02:12:44 the question answers itself Feb 17 02:15:41 pupnik: I really don't understand what is your problem. I can not even ask a simple question and perhaps wonder? Feb 17 02:15:52 pupnik: But nevermind, seems like you are in a unfriendly mood tonight. Feb 17 02:21:19 What's the best way you can think of to play all of your music remotely (select it on the n900 and the linux box plays it...)? Feb 17 02:22:22 i don't have a n900 but i'd look into MPD Feb 17 02:22:49 hmm, I forgot MPD had remote capabilities Feb 17 02:22:57 Does anyone know how to disable this annoying red led when the video camera is active on the n810? Feb 17 02:23:13 there's a big thread on how to do it for the n900 but nothing for the n810 Feb 17 02:29:32 How can I find out which dbus interfaces are registered/exported by a particular app? Feb 17 02:31:30 sevard: /etc/mce/mce.ini (if the path hasn't changed) Feb 17 02:33:04 DocScrutinizer: I tried that, I put a # infront of all of the PatternWebcamActive lines Feb 17 02:33:25 the only line I didn't comment out was LEDPatterns=Patten1blah;Pattern2blah Feb 17 02:33:44 do I need to restart a process that reads mce.ini ? Feb 17 02:35:14 yes Feb 17 02:36:01 mmcqd ? Feb 17 02:39:25 reboot :) Feb 17 02:39:57 you can Feb 17 02:40:01 initctl stop mce Feb 17 02:40:02 initctl start mce Feb 17 02:40:07 that reloads the mce.ini config Feb 17 02:46:19 on fremantle yes Feb 17 02:56:43 Hm Feb 17 02:56:46 well a reboot worked :) Feb 17 02:56:54 Does anyone have sshfs for n810? these links are dead ;/ **** ENDING LOGGING AT Thu Feb 17 02:59:57 2011