**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sat Mar 19 02:59:56 2011 Mar 19 03:00:12 How high is the risk? Mar 19 03:00:25 Between 0 and 1 Mar 19 03:00:38 ebzzry, what are you muching about for? Mar 19 03:00:44 ebzzry: unclear Mar 19 03:00:45 I'm trying to free rootfs space. Mar 19 03:00:47 A fair fraction of the running processes have watchdogs. Mar 19 03:00:51 Why? Mar 19 03:01:03 I almost ran out of it. Mar 19 03:01:23 ebzzry, backup your data now. Mar 19 03:01:31 DocScrutinizer is right ;) Mar 19 03:01:45 then if you do move the wrong thing Mar 19 03:01:48 you can restore it :) Mar 19 03:02:23 Ya. I did. Fortunately I do routine backups. Mar 19 03:02:28 Does GCC touch rootfs? Mar 19 03:02:35 If yes, approximately how much? Mar 19 03:02:41 yes, dev tools are not optified Mar 19 03:02:44 large Mar 19 03:02:53 build-essential is 70mb I believe Mar 19 03:03:18 Ohh Mar 19 03:03:25 it has been historically one of the largest packagegroups to eat it and not be shouted at because it is not designed for on device use Mar 19 03:03:51 But then I need gcc because I need bigloo/chicken. Mar 19 03:04:17 DOING IT WRONG. Mar 19 03:04:31 cp / to /home/user/copy Mar 19 03:04:42 cd /home/user/copy;chroot . bash Mar 19 03:04:49 ebzzry, cat /etc/maemo-optify-auto-opt.conf Mar 19 03:04:53 apt-get install gcc Mar 19 03:05:17 hmm. Mar 19 03:05:18 i normally add things like /usr/include in there Mar 19 03:05:21 Let me try that. Mar 19 03:05:30 use the example command it will show space Mar 19 03:05:48 adding a line into that file and rebooting will try to optify it Mar 19 03:05:55 That way you have no concerns about space on / Mar 19 03:06:05 And borking your system by installing wierd shit. Mar 19 03:06:06 you have backups and your own confidence of what to change though. Mar 19 03:06:17 And no concerns about backups or anything. Mar 19 03:06:26 OK. Got that. Mar 19 03:06:27 SpeedEvil, can that chroot be stored on /home/user/MyDocs? Mar 19 03:06:39 lcuk: no Mar 19 03:06:45 shame Mar 19 03:06:46 lcuk: vfat and shizzle. Mar 19 03:06:55 I resized mydocs to 4G though Mar 19 03:08:19 ebzzry, http://maemo.gitorious.org/maemo-af/maemo-optify-boottime/blobs/master/README Mar 19 03:08:45 lcuk: I gather maemo-optify-auto-opt.conf as well can cause bootloop, no? Mar 19 03:08:47 lcuk: copy Mar 19 03:09:21 DocScrutinizer, it like any other file system operation can be broken by misconfiguration and editing Mar 19 03:09:40 it requires root and ebzzry is already doing the same process by hand Mar 19 03:09:44 I meant like optifying /usr Mar 19 03:09:51 these scripts just try best to do it and document as much as possible Mar 19 03:10:12 we never tested that far Mar 19 03:10:40 I shall tell you now, hold on Mar 19 03:11:03 mmm I will do /usr/share actually first ;) Mar 19 03:11:09 (Side note: It's just now that I've been to maemo.gitorious.org, and gah, it's very difficult to read the gray text! y u no black?) Mar 19 03:12:36 http://maemo.gitorious.org/maemo-af/maemo-optify-boottime/blobs/raw/master/README Mar 19 03:13:48 Thanks, even it tells my browser to store it locally. Mar 19 03:14:23 By the way, is moving /opt/maemo to /media/mmc1/*somewhere*, then have a symlink, safe? Mar 19 03:14:43 (Why do I want to do that? Because I'm running out of optfs space) Mar 19 03:15:00 ebzzry, lol Mar 19 03:15:08 what have you got installed? Mar 19 03:15:15 sounds like a phat maemo system Mar 19 03:15:22 Not that much actually, but I think I have plenty in ~/ Mar 19 03:15:36 I also have emacs which weighs in almost 100MB Mar 19 03:15:37 I used to have to clear out loads from / Mar 19 03:15:52 that was where the optify-boottime script came from Mar 19 03:16:08 DocScrutinizer, it is booting with /usr/share only Mar 19 03:16:11 lcuk: mount rootfs atime; bindmount a copy of /usr (/opt/usr) ove /usr when mounting all the /opt rocks. have a *hard*link to /usr and later check that /usrTOO which files got touched during boot Mar 19 03:16:15 and it is unwinding the filesystem Mar 19 03:16:53 I even moved ~/.cache, ~/.thumbnails, and ~/.modest to to /media/mmc1 (ext2), but then I was having issues when I plug the device to a host machine: I had to kill the processes using those directories. Mar 19 03:16:53 it reached a desktop Mar 19 03:16:59 but themes are not there Mar 19 03:17:09 sanitize those to live in /* rather than /usr/* Mar 19 03:17:21 hand on, just curing it Mar 19 03:17:36 I digressed. Back to my question: is moving /opt/maemo to /media/mmc1/*somewhere*, then have a symlink, safe? Mar 19 03:17:57 I dont think so Mar 19 03:17:58 unclear Mar 19 03:18:07 themes and fonts are there... Mar 19 03:18:09 prolly not Mar 19 03:18:17 and microsd gets mounted after UI is started, so...... Mar 19 03:18:17 What gets mounted first? /media/mmc1 or /opt? Mar 19 03:18:20 -->bootloop Mar 19 03:18:25 Ah, that answers it then. Mar 19 03:18:29 Not good. Mar 19 03:18:45 Does the external card get mounted last? Mar 19 03:19:32 aah wait, opt. that's no diff to mmc1 Mar 19 03:19:58 ebzzry: aiui both get mounted ~same moment Mar 19 03:20:11 DocScrutinizer: the same? Mar 19 03:20:30 around the same Mar 19 03:20:45 I think mmc1 gets mounted long after UI has started... Atleast with my ext3 mmc1 card I get the "corrupted mmc" message long after UI has started :-) Mar 19 03:20:59 But technically, when looking at the mount scripts, what gets mounted first? Mar 19 03:21:04 but why would you want to move things from /opt to uSD? Mar 19 03:21:42 Because I have cowabunga stuff in /opt, like Emacs (~90MB) and CCL (~90MB), too. Mar 19 03:21:55 Make /home bigger then Mar 19 03:21:58 so what? Mar 19 03:22:09 yeah Mar 19 03:22:14 so what? <- In prepartion of lcuk's stuff? Mar 19 03:22:48 if 2GB is too small, resize it Mar 19 03:22:57 OK. Mar 19 03:23:03 I'd look at moving emacs to microsd, because atleast emacs isn't boot critical Mar 19 03:24:19 Wee! I'd like to do that with /opt/maemo/usr/share/texmf* too! Mar 19 03:27:48 I suppse this is where btrfs (or the idea of it is cool Mar 19 03:28:04 just being able to insert a new partition to grow the filesystem Mar 19 03:29:00 Jaffa: ping Mar 19 03:30:46 I forgot the name of the project, but treating directories like partitions has plenty of potentials. The horrors of creating/deleting a directory tree with thousands of small files is unforgettable. When it behaves like a partition, we can just have a: "create_new_fs " Mar 19 03:33:36 I need help setting up USB networking between an N900 and a Windows computer. http://wiki.maemo.org/N900_USB_networking#Starting_USB_network_mode_with_Windows Mar 19 03:34:32 That page says "MADDE ... not required ... just files maemo_usbnet.inf and maemo_usbnet.cat". Where can I get those files and what do I do with them? Mar 19 03:34:42 I don't have the bandwidth to download all of MADDE Mar 19 03:38:03 lcuk: I thought that's called LVM Mar 19 03:41:09 so no-one knows what time of the day is the best time to catch Jaffa online? Mar 19 03:46:17 btrfs takes llvm and raid into the filesystem itself Mar 19 03:54:16 jonwil: http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog/search?q=jaffa+has+joined Mar 19 04:06:13 packages in repos appear smaller in size than they once appeared;much smaller that even optification could justify.. Mar 19 04:06:22 any thoughts on it? Mar 19 04:06:41 like FM radio receiver was once 6.6 MB seems now to be just 867kb Mar 19 04:07:16 and Advanced power monitor is incredibly small-just 14 kb Mar 19 04:10:47 MaKa: according to what? Mar 19 04:11:52 MaKa: I guess you're talking about size needed to install, and that's probably reported including all the dependencies Mar 19 04:12:39 on a second install, all the dependencies are already there so don't need any 'new' space Mar 19 04:13:06 oh,Thanks for the clarification DocScrutinizer Mar 19 04:13:26 But i never got those two apps work at the second install. Mar 19 04:13:39 never after that. Mar 19 04:14:00 But i am avtually not talking about the size needed to install. Mar 19 04:14:20 i am talking about the size of the file that is to be downloaded. Mar 19 04:15:45 hmm, I recall a few days ago I tried to install FM radio while on a walk. It failed, and then I noticed it already been installed, nevertheless it tried to install again Mar 19 04:16:13 http://www.allaboutmeego.com/features/item/How_to_unlock_the_FM_radio_on_the_Nokia_N900.php Mar 19 04:16:18 so maybe you're actually on something there Mar 19 04:16:39 this link shows the size of the app to be 6.6mb Mar 19 04:17:11 but the repos give me only 869 kb. ' Mar 19 04:17:25 where? Mar 19 04:17:39 But i am trying to install this after uninstalling DocScrutinizer Mar 19 04:17:48 non stripped? Mar 19 04:17:54 So i think this is not trying to install which is already installed. Mar 19 04:18:18 when i use apt-get, only some 869kn is downloaded, Mar 19 04:18:20 *kb Mar 19 04:19:05 hmm, I can't find any useful info on the link you gave above Mar 19 04:19:27 and also I suggest to generally use HAM instead of apt-get Mar 19 04:19:31 didn't you check the video on that link? Mar 19 04:19:40 meh, video Mar 19 04:20:03 this video shows some 3rd hand info of maybe decades ago Mar 19 04:20:14 worthless Mar 19 04:20:17 oh,okay. Mar 19 04:20:19 :P Mar 19 04:21:09 then my new error now after using HAM is Error: cannot load radio driver module, Mar 19 04:21:27 I'm fed up with that site when I read "secret radio that's not in the specs" Mar 19 04:21:47 Yeah which sounds too much of a lie and exaggeration Mar 19 04:21:48 damn, it's even written on the box of N900 Mar 19 04:22:49 DocScrutinizer: check this thread http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=55710 Mar 19 04:23:11 check for what? Mar 19 04:23:28 see if it's entertaining? Mar 19 04:24:03 will this be possible? Mar 19 04:24:25 (btw sorry, the box writing only mentions the FMTX, not the FMRX) Mar 19 04:25:05 possible that a tmo thread is entertaining? nah, almost impossible Mar 19 04:25:08 ;-D Mar 19 04:26:52 someone has said there they rectified this on downgrading power-kernel Mar 19 04:27:29 not entertaining,but informative? Mar 19 04:31:28 I'm not regularly going to check random stuff of unspecified topic, to see if it might contain useful info Mar 19 04:33:03 see, I can't follow 700 other people and check everything they find interesting for one reason or another, just to see if it actually is or not Mar 19 04:34:05 if you want my feedback, you have to break it down for me so I might decide in advance if it's worth my time Mar 19 04:34:49 Yeah i understand you DocScrutinizer . Mar 19 04:35:42 And sorry for that annoying video link Mar 19 04:50:54 Hello Mar 19 04:51:26 uh, quick question... when the n810 is plugged to a PC's usb port, does it STILL use/drain the battery? Mar 19 04:54:38 anyway, shitting up all my ba...uh backing up all my sh...uh nm Mar 19 04:56:03 hm, the n810 had a separate charger port didnt it Mar 19 04:56:06 delt: good question, lemme check that Mar 19 04:57:39 hmm, yup. Definitely my N810 doesn't take power from USB, so obviously needs battery (and/or power plug) to work Mar 19 04:59:50 FFS, tepco raised dosage limt to 150mSv for their at-site workers Mar 19 05:00:15 Is that good or bad? Mar 19 05:00:31 now it starts getting nasty, while until now it's been more a sissi thing with radiation in the uSv/h Mar 19 05:01:52 DocScrutinizer: Do you disagree with them doing so? Mar 19 05:02:09 lemme put it this way: 1000mSv are really something you'll notice quite immediately Mar 19 05:02:14 I would belive it is more important to limit the radiation than to loose a few workers. Mar 19 05:02:39 You said 150mSv Mar 19 05:02:56 6000 mSv will kill most people witin a month Mar 19 05:03:01 If you get it at once Mar 19 05:03:04 within hours Mar 19 05:03:14 yes what it matters how long you are exposed Mar 19 05:03:54 chx: well, similar to sunburn, yes Mar 19 05:04:24 If I get exposed to 6000mSv in 100 years I would probably be OK. Mar 19 05:04:33 It is a diffrence between showering and drowning. Mar 19 05:05:01 ot doesn't matter if you catch that dosage during one second or one day, but you might (and will) see less severe effects when distributed over 10 days Mar 19 05:07:33 What choice do they have? If they let it be, more people will die from cancer later. Mar 19 05:10:10 sure. Just a significant change in their published notion about the event. But meh, I heard yesterday tepco asked the prime minister to allow they abandon the whole fucku-I as they felt like not getting anything done anymore. I'd not like to know what they got told Mar 19 05:11:14 DocScrutinizer: thanks Mar 19 05:11:20 yw Mar 19 05:11:37 uh.... fetching adapter ASAFP :/ Mar 19 05:12:27 delt: btw that's the significan difference when flashing: N8x0 doesn't boot up on plugging in to USB Mar 19 05:15:35 while our NPP crews here, when interviewed, state "Of course I'd stay at site, no matter how dangerous or even fatal. That's my job" Mar 19 05:16:03 heh thanks again for the tip... would have been moderately pissed if it failed at 97% ...!! Mar 19 05:16:15 lol Mar 19 05:17:06 and by "moderately" i mean, CNN would probably invent the term "nukeia" Mar 19 05:17:08 jk =) Mar 19 05:17:55 so how long before the "Fukushima 50" book hits the stores? a month? even less? movie in two years? Mar 19 05:18:20 so anyway, there's my data travelling from n810 to pc, and back to n810 in gzipped form.... and all is well, seems well =) Mar 19 05:18:38 docscruti: thanks Mar 19 05:20:03 Hello, just one more question .... Mar 19 05:20:19 [pts/2][root@deimos]:/media/disk-2# file 2gig.img Mar 19 05:20:20 2gig.img: x86 boot sector; partition 1: ID=0x6, starthead 0, startsector 1, 131071 sectors; partition 2: ID=0x83, starthead 3, startsector 131072, 3530752 sectors; partition 3: ID=0x82, starthead 3, startsector 3661824, 270336 sectors, code offset 0xb8 Mar 19 05:20:20 heh, you actually met the highlight regex :-) Mar 19 05:20:45 this machine has an ARM processor right? Mar 19 05:21:20 DUH! never knew file is that smart Mar 19 05:21:33 so, put simply, why does "file", on the image of my 2gb internal memory, show it as a x86 boot? Mar 19 05:22:21 boot sector, it's not meant to have any code for any particular processor, on N900 at least Mar 19 05:22:48 MBR Mar 19 05:23:24 it probably has X86 format, at least for the partition table Mar 19 05:23:56 wont that cause a lot of confusion? isnt the endianness different? Mar 19 05:24:03 uh Mar 19 05:24:12 good question :-D Mar 19 05:24:27 obviously not Mar 19 05:24:40 docscrutz: first guess.... so that win...ferior systems can use the device? Mar 19 05:24:41 x86 is little, but ARM was always both Mar 19 05:24:50 uh Mar 19 05:24:53 DEbian ARMEL Mar 19 05:25:02 i was obviously not thinking Mar 19 05:25:06 that el is endian little? Mar 19 05:25:10 ARMel Mar 19 05:25:17 yes Mar 19 05:25:18 what the tel Mar 19 05:25:19 endian-little? Mar 19 05:25:41 i am just guessing the endiannes of the N900 :) Mar 19 05:25:43 what el stands for Mar 19 05:26:01 ARM was both since the dawn of tiem but i gues the N900 is little as the x86? Mar 19 05:26:30 armEL Mar 19 05:26:52 I thought it was ARMel Mar 19 05:27:00 bzip2'ing image, just to see the resulting filesize Mar 19 05:27:14 INTARM!! Mar 19 05:28:23 just emphasizing the Endian-Little Mar 19 05:29:10 so yeah, this idea of using the n810's internal 256mb as "backup" boot partition, and the other 2gb one as main ... works quite well!! Mar 19 05:29:41 epsecially with a vfat formatted SD card Mar 19 05:30:02 well, micro SD / tflash in a minisd adapter, but works like i said, quite well Mar 19 05:30:29 could you postpone your posts until my reconnect happend? ;-D Mar 19 05:30:38 reconnect as in isp? Mar 19 05:30:42 i.e. some ~240s Mar 19 05:30:48 yep Mar 19 05:31:10 4 minutes? well, 3:30something now...? Mar 19 05:31:16 k waiting Mar 19 05:31:25 Time for IRC ping pong Mar 19 05:31:26 depending on my RTC it can't be long until Mar 19 05:31:55 or not, channel's logged, damn! Mar 19 05:31:57 sheduled for 6:30 but clock often is fast Mar 19 05:32:10 :-D Mar 19 05:32:22 say something when you're disconnected :P Mar 19 05:32:59 mohammad hahahaha something like "my 71 virgins are great, but one is missing" ? Mar 19 05:33:22 and "69 of them are male wtf???" Mar 19 05:33:34 toldya, it's a bit early Mar 19 05:33:39 docscrut: wb Mar 19 05:34:07 01:30 < MohammadAG> say something when you're disconnected :P Mar 19 05:34:10 01:31 < delt> mohammad hahahaha something like "my 71 virgins are great, but one is missing" ? Mar 19 05:34:13 01:31 < delt> and "69 of them are male wtf???" Mar 19 05:34:37 as you see, havent missed much :3 Mar 19 05:34:45 yeah Mar 19 05:35:55 recently i've been going nuts on microSD cards.... *sigh* i HAVE to start putting labels on my sd cards GAAAAAH Mar 19 05:36:22 I wonder how you boot from 2GB on N810 Mar 19 05:36:35 /media/disk-* just doesnt cut it, unless i do 'df' to see the size of each mounted fs Mar 19 05:37:21 DocScrutinizer: yeah, was just wondering the name of the command (for the boot loader) ....started with the initials of the fellow who worte it iirc Mar 19 05:37:50 o.O Mar 19 05:38:12 anyway, i can ls -l /media/whatever/bin/ > ~www/miscjunk/somelist.txt or whatever, but that wouldnt be much help i guess Mar 19 05:39:45 personally, i wouldnt mind rewriting the boot loader thing myself, so it times out after X seconds instead of waiting forever..... Mar 19 05:39:47 s/ls/ln/? Mar 19 05:40:21 still wondering Mar 19 05:40:22 was a simple script that used ncurses 'dialog' iirc Mar 19 05:41:00 aaah, maybe something exploiting that preinit hook, like rescueboot Mar 19 05:41:00 quite use^H^H^Hjackass friendly =( Mar 19 05:41:03 =) Mar 19 05:41:29 delt, I'm still not sure who came up with that 7* virgin bullshit :P Mar 19 05:41:34 but anyway, OT here Mar 19 05:41:44 yeah, iirc we had that on diablo, while it vanished for early fremantle versions? Mar 19 05:42:53 where's dialog on fremantle? Mar 19 05:42:54 i thought it was that islam "prophet" who ripped off the first 5-6 books of the Bible and had some "illumination" Mar 19 05:43:16 or was that bouddha (sidharta gutama or something) Mar 19 05:43:16 well, no, it wasn't Mar 19 05:43:35 please no religion topics here Mar 19 05:43:55 I can't comment on those ;-P Mar 19 05:43:57 well, the founder of islam clearly based himself on Gen... uh ok sorry Mar 19 05:44:11 <--- stfu :D Mar 19 05:44:39 otoh, beer is good Mar 19 05:44:41 unrelated to religion, but why would someone even need 71/2 virgins... Mar 19 05:45:06 unrelated to religion, beer is good =) Mar 19 05:45:11 :D Mar 19 05:45:31 I'm sure everyone agrees Mar 19 05:45:33 my cDc is not exactly debatable, and also largely unknown a religion ;-D Mar 19 05:46:15 and MohammadAG, quite obviously nobody needs 71 half virgins ;-D Mar 19 05:46:31 i was (and would be) very happy with 1, even if she isn't / wasn't technically "virgin" ... Mar 19 05:46:47 well, exactly, wtf would you do with 7w Mar 19 05:47:05 so any middle eastern suicide bomber could take away the 71 other ones and i wouldnt gaff Mar 19 05:47:15 ok sorry Mar 19 05:47:26 that was rather offensive, and i aplog*ZAP* Mar 19 05:49:07 ok so there was a thunder storm..... how yall doin :D Mar 19 05:49:11 delt: (beer is good) nah, there's also Heineken, and what's that called? mayer's? Mar 19 05:49:42 Miller's Mar 19 05:50:08 uh.... i like heineken, but if you want to buy it, any store in Canada you go to the beer dept. -) Mar 19 05:50:10 and tha fake Budweisser Mar 19 05:50:29 even, heineken is quite very very tasty in fact Mar 19 05:51:18 most ppl say im stupid when i "confess" this, but heineken and mexican corona have a similar (and very good) taste Mar 19 05:51:54 some are like, wtf?? heineken is horse piss! corona is the real cerveza!! and vice versa Mar 19 05:52:15 vice verveza :D Mar 19 05:52:37 corona, well once a month Mar 19 05:52:53 still bzipping... whoa :? Mar 19 05:53:01 i like both, personally Mar 19 05:53:34 I prefer our worl class Germen breweries Mar 19 05:53:40 german even Mar 19 05:53:57 MohammadAG btw really sorry about that out-of-color comment about terrorist bombers :( :( :( Mar 19 05:54:14 sprichst du eigentlich deutsch? Mar 19 05:55:01 <--- hab ein wenigh deutsch in der schule gelernt =) auch wohnte 4 jahren in deutschland / schewitz als ich junge war Mar 19 05:56:02 heh, a Canadian who knows German Mar 19 05:56:04 aber seit etwa 3-4 jahren hatte ich keine gelegenheit, mit jemand die sprache zu ben :( :( :( Mar 19 05:56:05 delt: Ich sprichst eigentlich deutsch Mar 19 05:56:30 someoneelse: toll, wo hast du es gelertnt? Mar 19 05:56:43 lease stop that Mar 19 05:56:48 please Mar 19 05:56:56 delt: Ich haben nicht Mar 19 05:57:16 * DocScrutinizer points at the wonders of /query Mar 19 05:57:35 (hinweis: ich "spreche", ich "habe) Mar 19 05:57:51 DocScrutinizer: You could always ignore me again :P Mar 19 05:58:24 DocScrutinizer: I don't speak a single word of german. Your grammar is fucked up. Mar 19 05:58:25 I'm not supposed to ignore inadequate behaviour in this channel Mar 19 05:58:50 docscru yeah mein vater war in der luftwaft von kanada als ich geboren bin, und dann 4 jahren in Lahr, west-deutschland gestellt. Mar 19 05:59:27 delt: Oh noes, how did they caputer you? Mar 19 05:59:49 please stick to English, as that's the preferred language of this channel. It's considered rude to the other users to use any other language than English Mar 19 05:59:50 <--- bawrn in awttwa, grawn up in dawtcchlaynd!) Mar 19 06:00:19 DocScrutinizer: numai vih (jk) Mar 19 06:00:56 delt: So why where your father in the air-something? Why didn't you stay at your birthplace to go to Lahr? Mar 19 06:01:01 uh sorry that would be (g)nu mai (m'dai) vih Mar 19 06:01:57 someoneelse: cause my parents "could have" just dump me in a sewer and then 4 years later check if i was still there, but... =) Mar 19 06:02:22 English is your second language? Mar 19 06:02:31 *raises hand* Mar 19 06:02:53 uh was that a global "to everone" question? Mar 19 06:03:19 Nope, just you. Your grammar was interessting. And I know German grammar is illogical Mar 19 06:03:52 well, like i said im a canuck frenchie... so my native lang. is fr Mar 19 06:04:37 2nd english 3d german (or the other way around) Mar 19 06:05:29 though im better at eng. id consider it my "third" language, since i was exposed to .de first, THEN learned english Mar 19 06:05:44 anyway, we each have our own personal history Mar 19 06:06:09 yuck French. I completely forgot tout que j'avais aprendu about that in school Mar 19 06:06:56 appris =) Mar 19 06:07:25 though your thought process is logical Mar 19 06:07:40 what's the smiley for puking Mar 19 06:07:53 and fr is ...... uh... yeah, logical :/ Mar 19 06:08:19 especially our demented, crazy mangled version of it in the eastern canadian provinces Mar 19 06:08:27 10 times worse =) Mar 19 06:08:30 lol Mar 19 06:09:41 hey, bz2 managed to compress the entire 2gb (something like 90% full) to like 1gb on the sd card :D !! Mar 19 06:10:45 (imaged the whole fs, not mount & cd, then tar -czvf . /wherever/bleh.tar.gz) Mar 19 06:10:52 s/gz/bz2/ Mar 19 06:10:53 delt meant: (imaged the whole fs, not mount & cd, then tar -czvf . /wherever/bleh.tar.bz2) Mar 19 06:11:07 uh thanks bot :D Mar 19 06:11:17 yeah i remember that bot was smart =) Mar 19 06:11:46 could do most common sed commands Mar 19 06:11:49 ~botsnack Mar 19 06:11:50 thanks, DocScrutinizer Mar 19 06:11:56 hahaha Mar 19 06:12:01 ~help Mar 19 06:12:09 :-D Mar 19 06:12:38 got a whole bunch of ...uh, info in a /msg window =) Mar 19 06:12:59 which might be helpful in the future, never know heh Mar 19 06:13:07 she's smart, obedient, and furious Mar 19 06:13:24 ~attack delt Mar 19 06:13:25 * infobot grabs a pen, screams like she's possessed, and begins chasing delt Mar 19 06:13:43 whoa.... he's a it.. uh, it's a he, i mean she... ??? Mar 19 06:14:00 ~gender Mar 19 06:14:01 I'm male Mar 19 06:14:06 ~gener Mar 19 06:14:09 ~gender Mar 19 06:14:10 I'm female Mar 19 06:14:13 tss Mar 19 06:14:15 ~gender Mar 19 06:14:16 ~gender Mar 19 06:14:17 ~gender Mar 19 06:14:22 lol Mar 19 06:14:31 ~othergender Mar 19 06:14:47 ~sexualorientation Mar 19 06:15:01 ~rape delt Mar 19 06:15:02 * infobot takes delt behind the WallMart and makes a few grunts and screams Mar 19 06:15:22 ~i_am_not_into_bots_even_female_ones Mar 19 06:15:55 even tho i did meet a beautiful chick in a "wal-mart" outfit at the store earlier today, said she was just back from work Mar 19 06:16:24 maybe it's been infobot? ;-D Mar 19 06:16:47 hahaha yeah, she uh... i mean it, had the face of a bot :D Mar 19 06:17:32 so, no wonder she bought petr-oil, vaseline, and anti-freeze! Mar 19 06:18:32 DocScrutinizer: you live in germany? what time is it there (or where else you live)? Mar 19 06:18:47 umm, to early Mar 19 06:19:02 vi chpt ist sse Mar 19 06:20:02 you accidentally switched to a weird keyboard layout? Mar 19 06:20:54 looks like somebody trying to use a dvorak kbd Mar 19 06:21:34 uh yeah, can yo.... uh i mean yh, n y hlp m pt t bk?!?? Mar 19 06:24:03 damn, i knew i should have added those ~a ~n etc. spanish letters to my berkustomeizt-kihbordlyaut Mar 19 06:26:02 k anyway, its about 2:24 am.... good night, bonne nuit, good night, magandang gabi, buenas noches, sous'dei dt tau, etc etc ..... Mar 19 06:26:22 s/tau/te/ Mar 19 06:26:24 delt meant: k anyway, its about 2:24 am.... good night, bonne nuit, good night, magandang gabi, buenas noches, sous'dei dt te, etc etc ..... Mar 19 06:26:58 /infobot thx a lot now stfu plz? Mar 19 06:27:13 ok, cya all gnite Mar 19 06:57:37 I wish there was a computer I felt was worth investing in Mar 19 06:58:39 just give me a 7 inch arm tablet that has a nice resistive multitouch or active digitizer screen but no we can't do that for you sir Mar 19 06:59:24 that will run Ubuntu or some other OOS on it, but no no no that will never happen Mar 19 07:00:35 even 10" just don't make more than a pound, anyone whose worked with mobile devices know that after a while no matter how light your 3lb tablet is, it simply isn't after an hour of holding it Mar 19 07:12:08 hi all Mar 19 07:14:22 http://www.zerohedge.com/sites/default/files/images/user5/imageroot/von%20havenstein/Crying%20TEPCO.jpg Mar 19 07:14:57 hi Mar 19 07:23:19 RST38h: despite the picture, the article is from an awful, AWFUL tabloid from the UK Mar 19 07:23:34 doc: I have not seen the article Mar 19 07:23:41 their whole thing is $item CAUSES CANCER or Immigrants are evil! Mar 19 07:23:51 doc: But it is TEPCO's director in the picture =) Mar 19 07:24:11 $item causes evil immigrant cancer! Mar 19 07:24:14 RST38h: different culture all the same Mar 19 07:24:30 Here, I have just saved them about 10-15% of paper and inkcosts! Mar 19 07:24:39 hehe Mar 19 07:45:28 Hi! How do I insert UTF-8 characters? Mar 19 08:01:32 ܠكউৣઊઔਊCੴോභஇం໗๛โฬฟ丢乴使屢痢㉣ぽ걢ᚎᚏ Mar 19 08:08:20 Can I use the N900 as a bluetooth headset for another phone? Mar 19 08:09:48 Possibly, but I bet it'll be laggy Mar 19 08:10:29 Doc, why are YOU of all people talkingUnicode now? Mar 19 08:12:27 RST38h: that's been at me? Mar 19 08:18:46 wow, finally. "LIVE" video from FUCKU-I Mar 19 08:20:25 Doc: URL? Mar 19 08:24:00 none available Mar 19 08:24:05 TV Mar 19 08:24:39 showing a closeup of fire brigades properly hosing #3 SFP Mar 19 08:25:24 btw I still have no highlight set on 'doc:' Mar 19 08:26:05 Ah Mar 19 08:26:20 http://www.ladyada.net/pub/research.html <=== the police note, ah, the police note! Mar 19 08:32:23 LOL, always thought at MIT they are a bit smarter even in the management Mar 19 08:41:51 jet taken out over Benghasi. Most think it's one of Gadafi's, some think it's rebel's. I wonder if it's been a french jet ;-P Mar 19 08:42:25 Doc:No, not really. And they are really spooked by all the students too Mar 19 08:49:05 http://www.jaif.or.jp/english/aij/110319FukushimaEventStatus-14e.pdf >>hydrogen of SFP exploded<< :-S Mar 19 08:50:03 Status of Fukushima I at 16:00 on 18 March read "exposed" instead "exploded" Mar 19 08:54:20 Doc: afaik #4 building is gone Mar 19 08:54:26 there was a photo somewhere Mar 19 08:55:46 Here: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/special/world/japan_earthquake/wide_img/img/reactors976x550_3.jpg Mar 19 09:34:57 block #5 #6 >>Vent hole opened on rooftop to prevent hydrogen explosion Mar 19 09:36:08 even those lies called official reports are really scary ->http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_the_Fukushima_nuclear_accidents#cite_note-JAIF_status_20110317_1600-72 - esp when comparing then one after the other and watch the changes Mar 19 09:42:05 Jaffa: ping Mar 19 09:44:54 ...lists a total of 63 persons with the title of "President" as well as [DATA EXPUNGED] title O5. The signal then changes from ASCII to an as-yet undeciphered format, listing an estimated 7 more names. Mar 19 09:44:59 DocScrutinizer: because it's nuclear power station explosion that caused earthquake and tsunami Mar 19 09:45:02 DocScrutinizer: isn't it? Mar 19 09:49:38 good morning Mar 19 09:49:55 well, we're yet to see the really good blast. I doubt the facts listed in those jaf status reports a lot. For example when they inject seawater into pressure vessel / core since days, then I'd expect those reactors safe, and also lots of steam escaping from all 3 buildings. But they say they even stopped containment venting, so what's going to happen with that sea water injected into those few m^3 core pressure vessel Mar 19 09:50:38 it's going to blow up Mar 19 09:51:04 DocScrutinizer: as time goes down, decay heat reduces. Mar 19 09:51:14 I guess they're feed seawater to core by the teaspoon Mar 19 09:51:36 SpeedEvil: yeah, but it takes like couple months for it to reduce to reasonable values Mar 19 09:51:41 At some point, decay heat will reduce far enough that conduction can validly cool the core, to the point at which the pressure vessel can shut the valves Mar 19 09:51:49 nah, of course that's mere BS & lies Mar 19 09:51:49 i think it is that single rod produces 25W after 90 days Mar 19 09:51:57 It's IIRC been reported at a percent now. Mar 19 09:52:16 SpeedEvil: of power while it's fully on load Mar 19 09:52:20 yes. Mar 19 09:52:23 SpeedEvil: that's still lot of heat Mar 19 09:52:28 Which is 14 megawatts or so. Mar 19 09:52:30 it's like 10MW Mar 19 09:52:50 you can create local summer with that sort of heat Mar 19 09:52:53 yeah, 10MW, for at least 60 days Mar 19 09:53:27 that's why they start to circulate that water Mar 19 09:53:30 or it will heat up Mar 19 09:53:33 and blow up Mar 19 09:53:38 well cooling needed for at least 60 days is what they said. Not that power will stay at 10MW Mar 19 09:53:57 well, that's in normal conditions Mar 19 09:54:03 now parts of core are molten Mar 19 09:54:13 and somewhere on bottom of reactor Mar 19 09:54:17 which makes things worse Mar 19 09:54:29 i suppose that would need more cold water to cool down blob of molten stuff Mar 19 09:54:32 hmm, then not Mar 19 09:54:35 than rods that are designed to be cooled Mar 19 09:54:56 that's why i really like CANDU reactors Mar 19 09:55:15 I don't like any reactor Mar 19 09:55:21 you're german Mar 19 09:55:26 except fusion Mar 19 09:55:45 i've heard you are so scared of nuclear electricity that you are closing down all nuclear power stations in couple years Mar 19 09:56:12 fission is an incredible mess and dirt Mar 19 09:56:31 I'd hope we did Mar 19 09:56:36 If I've got the numbers right, at 14Mw, there is about 50Kw/m^2 of heat from the reactor vessel. Mar 19 09:57:02 and I hope those fsckers that built and operated them, will eat the nuklear waste Mar 19 09:57:14 DocScrutinizer: coal is worse than nuclear Mar 19 09:57:25 but then, what to do with those fukkers Mar 19 09:57:28 long term effects of one nuclear power station exploding every 10 years Mar 19 09:57:44 are less severe than running coal power stations all the time Mar 19 09:58:07 we're planning for windparks and sun here Mar 19 09:58:10 To be honest, I'd like to see some plants that use the nuclear waste: I mean, we've got hot pools, and need to cool it with power... why not use that power on the grid? Mar 19 09:58:17 DocScrutinizer: and what about night Mar 19 09:58:22 DocScrutinizer: when there is no sun and no wind Mar 19 09:58:25 Put a dome over it, run the steam through a turbine. Simple. Mar 19 09:58:31 robbiethe1st: CANDU Mar 19 09:58:41 Alright then, good Mar 19 09:58:51 jacekowski: storage Mar 19 09:58:58 There are already reactor designs that can burn nuclear waste Mar 19 09:59:01 DocScrutinizer: where? Mar 19 09:59:10 robbiethe1st: CANDU can pretty much run on any kind of nuclear fuel Mar 19 09:59:18 Even really low grade? Mar 19 09:59:21 robbiethe1st: yes Mar 19 09:59:24 Good. Mar 19 09:59:31 Then, start building loads of em. Mar 19 09:59:32 robbiethe1st: it's designed to run on natural unenriched uraniom Mar 19 09:59:43 it's running at atmospheric pressures Mar 19 10:00:09 jacekowski: in Norway, in caverns, in Alps, in batteries... Mar 19 10:00:54 batteries with lead and acid Mar 19 10:01:01 that have to be replaced every couple years Mar 19 10:01:30 jacekowski: nonsense Mar 19 10:01:44 there's WAY better technologies than lead-acid Mar 19 10:01:58 and besides, have you calculated how much power you get from square meter of land Mar 19 10:02:03 of sun power Mar 19 10:02:09 and assuming you get sun for 12h a day Mar 19 10:02:11 not here, in Sahara Mar 19 10:02:27 Like what? Best I've seen is say a liquid-sodium battery, which might work on -large- scale... but still needs to be kept hot etc. Mar 19 10:02:30 then build nuclear power stations there Mar 19 10:02:36 if it blows up there Mar 19 10:02:41 there's a pan-european project under way Mar 19 10:02:45 nobody will care about some niggers glowing at night Mar 19 10:02:50 DocScrutinizer: a wok? Mar 19 10:03:05 eh? Mar 19 10:03:17 and you're risking that shit like it's happening now will cut you from electricity Mar 19 10:03:25 I'm not talking about chinese food Mar 19 10:03:57 me neither Mar 19 10:03:58 jacekowski: lame argument Mar 19 10:04:18 and even then Mar 19 10:04:24 you get 12h of sun a day Mar 19 10:04:29 Let me just say this: If we can build some sort of converter that can convert heat energy to electricity effeciently at temperatures <80F, that would solve a lot of problems. But without something like that, solar panels and other renewable energy just won't cut it everywhere. Hydro would, and does... but only in limited areas. Mar 19 10:04:40 robbiethe1st: We can't. Mar 19 10:05:05 it's 1kW to 2kW per square meter Mar 19 10:05:23 robbiethe1st: 30C-20C - say - you have a delta-t of 10K, and an efficiency of about 1/27th maximum. Mar 19 10:05:31 meh Mar 19 10:05:33 jacekowski: rarely over 1, never over 1380 Mar 19 10:05:42 1.38 Mar 19 10:05:55 SpeedEvil: Alright... Mar 19 10:06:04 robbiethe1st: Carnot efficiency. Mar 19 10:06:17 How much energy would that generate, then? Mar 19 10:06:42 robbiethe1st: 30W or so peak per square meter. Mar 19 10:06:55 robbiethe1st: 10W or so average, optimistically. Mar 19 10:06:57 assuming safe value of 200GW that just germany uses Mar 19 10:07:15 and assuming 100% efficiency at 1kW per sqare meter Mar 19 10:07:18 square* Mar 19 10:07:55 Hm. So, you could easily have 200W constant power per house, 24hrs a day. And far more during the day. Not great, but that'd be something Mar 19 10:08:13 so assuming that Mar 19 10:08:18 and assuming 12h of power per day Mar 19 10:08:23 and that your storage is 100% efficient Mar 19 10:08:36 robbiethe1st: you're assuming the solar collector is free. And that the theoretical efficiency can be achieved. Mar 19 10:08:48 you would need solar power station Mar 19 10:08:54 fully loaded with solar panels Mar 19 10:08:58 SpeedEvil: Well, heat-collector, but yes, I suppose. Mar 19 10:09:07 on square of size of 20km by 20km Mar 19 10:09:18 jacekowski: Efficiency is rarely over 20% for solar panels. Mar 19 10:10:10 that makes it 44km by 44km Mar 19 10:10:47 jacekowski: For germany, the average insolation is _much_ below 1kw/m^2*12h Mar 19 10:10:55 it gets worse when nights are longer and days are shorter Mar 19 10:11:18 so imagine 100km square Mar 19 10:11:47 and time it takes to install that Mar 19 10:11:58 http://re.jrc.ec.europa.eu/pvgis/apps4/PVcalc.php Mar 19 10:12:16 i think before you got to installing first 10% of that you would have to replace first panel because it deteriorated so much Mar 19 10:12:21 You're looking at ~1100Kwh/year per m^2 Mar 19 10:12:32 error Mar 19 10:12:34 This is ~2.5KWh/day. Mar 19 10:12:43 http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=newsarchive&sid=a0PwC089VU_I http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=newsarchive&sid=aoA1lvLbVDXU http://www.google.de/search?hl=de&q=desertec+siemens Mar 19 10:12:45 And this is for a pointed panel. Mar 19 10:13:34 DocScrutinizer: math says it's not going to happen Mar 19 10:13:34 The actual horizontal space is more like optimistically 1KWh/day/m^2 Mar 19 10:13:43 uhuh Mar 19 10:13:48 (for large horizontal panels) Mar 19 10:14:08 sorry, I believe in math of Deutsche Bank bankers, more than in yours Mar 19 10:14:14 solar thermal seems to be a promising technology Mar 19 10:14:19 Knock at best 20% off that for storage. Mar 19 10:14:20 DocScrutinizer: then do your math Mar 19 10:14:45 The idea seems to be like a solar hot water system only on a much bigger scale and with much more concentration of the heat Mar 19 10:14:48 SpeedEvil: old water pumped storage station in poland has efficiency like 75% Mar 19 10:14:50 so it uses the sun to boil water Mar 19 10:14:55 and produce steam Mar 19 10:14:57 SpeedEvil: and it was built 40 years ago Mar 19 10:14:57 to run a generator Mar 19 10:15:17 Geothemal is also a good idea IMO Mar 19 10:15:24 jacekowski: Sure - now work out how much resovoir area you need to store 2 days * 200GW. It's a fucking huge number. Mar 19 10:15:25 SpeedEvil: so losses on storage are not that high Mar 19 10:15:35 put it on the orbit Mar 19 10:16:10 In orbit adds other huge problems. Mar 19 10:16:26 Cost of launch, and maintainability, and rectenna size. Mar 19 10:16:35 rectenna? Mar 19 10:17:08 i'm not talking about something like that Mar 19 10:17:18 pumping water up and down to and from orbit Mar 19 10:17:21 with long hose Mar 19 10:17:23 A microwave antenna used for power reception Mar 19 10:17:33 garden hose Mar 19 10:17:46 Oh - never mind, I thought you were being serious, I wasn't reading closely enough. Mar 19 10:17:48 water on the orbit would have huge potential energy Mar 19 10:17:57 you're quite funny about that Mar 19 10:18:23 SpeedEvil: it is valid concept from physics point of view Mar 19 10:18:30 jacekowski: No, it's not. Mar 19 10:18:51 jacekowski: Integrate gravity from geostationary orbit to ground. Mar 19 10:19:21 what was it (G m1 m2)/l^2 Mar 19 10:19:27 It is possible with single wall nanotube cables to have a cable with modest taper - say 30:1 - reaching from geosync to ground. Mar 19 10:19:31 no Mar 19 10:19:36 that was force between two objects Mar 19 10:19:39 E.ON is one of only 5 German (err European actually) Power companies. Siemens is... well if you dunno, I can't help. Deutsche Bank same. Do you really think those have bilions to spent of wrong math? Mar 19 10:19:41 A pipe would have a completely hopeless tether. Mar 19 10:19:58 s/t of/d on/ Mar 19 10:19:58 DocScrutinizer meant: E.ON is one of only 5 German (err European actually) Power companies. Siemens is... well if you dunno, I can't help. Deutsche Bank same. Do you really think those have bilions to spend on wrong math? Mar 19 10:20:04 DocScrutinizer: Subsidised panels are not fairly counted. Mar 19 10:20:17 DocScrutinizer: it's probably government funding that makes math work out for them Mar 19 10:20:35 what fsckng subsidized panels? Mar 19 10:20:55 anyways Mar 19 10:20:56 be back later Mar 19 10:20:58 I'm not talking about PV Mar 19 10:20:59 A large slice of germanys solar output goes to subsidised german panels. Mar 19 10:21:00 i'm going to MOT my car Mar 19 10:21:44 i've spent 6h taking suspension apart and then putting it back together Mar 19 10:21:46 SpeedEvil: you checked the links to desertec? Mar 19 10:21:54 so it would be nice if it passes Mar 19 10:22:19 well financialy it may work out Mar 19 10:22:28 as in they're not going to make loss on it Mar 19 10:22:30 Oh - the thermal thing - no I diddn't. Mar 19 10:22:46 but it's not going to replace conventional power stations Mar 19 10:22:51 And yes, the prroblem is that germany has few deserts. Mar 19 10:23:04 Maybe it could fix that. Mar 19 10:23:23 they plan to install it on sahara Mar 19 10:23:29 and then transport electricity from there Mar 19 10:23:58 http://www.welt.de/wirtschaft/article7298116/Wie-Siemens-in-Spanien-den-Wuestenstrom-testet.html Mar 19 10:24:00 transport 200GW over that distance Mar 19 10:24:21 * DocScrutinizer wonders why he's talking to dudes not interested in listening Mar 19 10:24:43 jacekowski: Siemens does exactly that Mar 19 10:24:50 "MV DC Mar 19 10:24:50 DocScrutinizer: It is some foreign language Mar 19 10:24:54 2MV DC Mar 19 10:25:11 or was it 400kV Mar 19 10:27:11 this is a project way larger than e.g. the suez channel, or the assuan dam Mar 19 10:28:14 or some minecraft things i've seen Mar 19 10:28:26 Long distance power transmission is not technically challenging. Mar 19 10:28:37 It's simply annoying engineering-wise. Mar 19 10:29:29 And puts you in the position of either having to defend militarily the pipeline and collector, or rely on the good will of all future goverrnments along the pipeline and collector. Mar 19 10:31:13 that's the main reason the sensible solution to the world energetic problem - solar and geothermal power stations in the sahara, with hydrogen as a vector - will never be actually implemented :( Mar 19 10:34:08 Hydrogen is not a sensible vector if you just want to move energy from pointA-B Mar 19 10:34:15 Wires are much cheaper Mar 19 10:34:18 that's not hydrogen, but nevermind Mar 19 10:35:01 SpeedEvil: good point Mar 19 10:35:36 WAY cheaper, and probably even less loss Mar 19 10:35:54 way more sturdy Mar 19 10:39:20 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Desertec Mar 19 10:44:29 DocScrutinizer: i think hydrogen is a pretty cool guy, eh is inefficient but doesn't afraid of pollution Mar 19 10:45:14 * SpeedEvil hits kerio over the head with his anti-meme lolcat. Mar 19 10:45:55 can't has memes? :(/ Mar 19 10:46:25 really though, hydrogen sucks but at least when you burn it it releases water and not stuff that kills you Mar 19 10:47:03 hmm, we don't want to burn the energy we get from solar power plants in north africa Mar 19 10:47:19 solar and geothermal Mar 19 10:47:41 geothermal is done locally Mar 19 10:48:04 yeah but takes space Mar 19 10:48:10 below the solar panels we'll have lots of space Mar 19 10:48:15 as in, under ground Mar 19 10:48:16 the whole Rhine valley seems has good preconditions for geothermal Mar 19 10:48:35 eh, geothermal takes space? Mar 19 10:48:51 to make enough energy Mar 19 10:49:27 non-renewable energy sources make a shitton of energy :( Mar 19 10:49:32 how's that? Do you plan to mine the geoheat in open mining? Mar 19 10:49:39 hmm, "are"? Mar 19 10:50:05 DocScrutinizer: digging under stuff is harder than digging under nothing Mar 19 10:50:17 who's digging? Mar 19 10:50:22 what for? Mar 19 10:50:52 Hello there people. Mar 19 10:51:14 I'm wondering if it's possible to install a not-so-ancient Perl version without chroot yet? Mar 19 10:51:19 drilling for geothermic power is like drilling for oil, just cleaner. For sure you don't dig and don't need large real estate Mar 19 10:51:48 you need space underground because above you have solar panels everywhere Mar 19 10:52:13 kerio: don't eat acid for breakfast! Mar 19 10:55:30 orange juice is slightly acid, does that count? Mar 19 10:59:03 Morning, all Mar 19 10:59:16 jonwil: pong Mar 19 10:59:18 DocScrutinizer: pong Mar 19 10:59:58 Jaffa: any news on whats mentioned in https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11128#c8 Mar 19 10:59:59 Bug 11128: Opening the source for Sharing services framework Mar 19 11:00:00 ? Mar 19 11:01:23 Or are the "powers that be" still trying to figure out what to do? Mar 19 11:04:57 you are the power that be Mar 19 11:05:43 jonwil: I've chased once. I'll do so again next week. Mar 19 11:05:52 ok Mar 19 11:06:07 I suspect these things are going to take time whatever happens Mar 19 11:07:00 * Jaffa nods Mar 19 11:10:09 me, I am concerned that the Nokia people will simply say "these particular packages are dead, everyone should be hacking on ofono/conman/whatever" Mar 19 11:37:52 * RST38h yawns Mar 19 11:38:11 Time to reanimate this channel: looks like Harmattan will be marketed as "Maemo" after all. Mar 19 11:39:40 Does any of this mean anything to me as a N900 owner? Mar 19 11:40:13 No, you are ok, go back to sleep. Mar 19 11:40:18 RST38h: I'm sort of lost on the Harmattan / Meego / Maemo naming, what is what actually? Mar 19 11:41:02 Maemo = Nokia's own product,based on Debian for the base OS and gtk+ for UI Mar 19 11:41:27 Harmattan = last icarnation of Maemo, aka Maemo6, with the same Debian for the base OS and Qt for UI Mar 19 11:42:06 Meego = the supposed "future" OS, developed in supposed "collaboration" with Intel, based on Fedora base OS and Qt UI Mar 19 11:42:19 thx :) Mar 19 11:42:36 is there a good place to find info about harmattan? Mar 19 11:42:38 Notice that Harmattan and Meego share the supposedly same Qt UI Mar 19 11:42:48 merlin: Google? Mar 19 11:43:19 no google is the suck, with the bloody localized search optimisation I just get bs when googling for harmattan :D Mar 19 11:43:43 worksforme. Mar 19 11:44:40 I get lots of hits for the wind, and some french pages about whatever :D Mar 19 11:44:58 Hello Mar 19 11:45:09 learn to use google properly then Mar 19 11:46:03 I just love answers like ^ Mar 19 11:46:19 Harmattan is a wind :P Mar 19 11:46:23 so is Fremantle Mar 19 11:46:39 but then again, you didn't link me to lmgtfy.com/ :D Mar 19 11:47:01 justfuckinggoogleit.com is better Mar 19 11:47:16 (real site btw) Mar 19 11:49:19 "Something must be done! This is something, therefore it must be done." Mar 19 11:49:46 google: nokia harmattan maybe? Mar 19 11:50:16 * alterego finds the idea of keywords quite easy to comprehend, therefore it must be quite easy to comprehend .. Mar 19 11:50:59 Yet, it is quite amazing how seemingly lazy some people are. otoh, I wouldn't mind teaching people how to perform decent search queries. Mar 19 11:51:32 Like, how do I google for information on maemo/meego harmattan Mar 19 12:10:14 What application can I use on N900 to create desktop shortcuts to bash scripts? Mar 19 12:10:32 queen beecon Mar 19 12:10:44 thx Mar 19 12:10:47 http://maemo.org/packages/view/queen-beecon/ Mar 19 12:23:50 Any idea how to make the N900 believe the keyboard has been opened while it's closed? Mar 19 12:30:19 depends which app you want to trick Mar 19 12:30:26 some apps listen to a gconf value Mar 19 12:31:04 /system/osso/af/slide-open Mar 19 12:38:46 SpeedEvil: what a powerful tool! thank you again :) Mar 19 12:39:08 OkropNick: It is awesome, thought he icons are rather odd. Mar 19 13:03:44 one more question. what is name of program which is displaying short messages on the top of screen in cases of: chargerv connected, charger disconnected, sms delivered and so on. I want use it for other purposes Mar 19 13:14:00 OkropNick: it's a Hildon Notification Banner Mar 19 13:14:13 OkropNick: what language are you developing in? Mar 19 13:14:59 alterego: thanks - I'm not gonna developing anything big, I'm just want to use it with queen beecon Mar 19 13:15:27 Ah, erm. Probably best bet is to write a small python wrapper then Mar 19 13:16:48 yay python Mar 19 13:16:51 OkropNick: easiest is probably to use the osso module (python-osso if you use python) to show such a notification Mar 19 13:17:37 villager: is easy way to display hildon banner using bash script? Mar 19 13:19:48 should be, but I don't see any shell script examples of the banner... only of the system note dialog, which is bigger and in the middle of the screen Mar 19 13:20:19 That's why I'm saying you'll probabk Mar 19 13:20:37 ly need to write a python command to do it that you can call from shell Mar 19 13:21:53 someone might be able to see what dbus commands libosso sends and convert it to shell commands Mar 19 13:22:34 ok, i'm reading about it. I need to build small tool for display message and vibrate when power level will be - for example 10% Mar 19 13:22:46 morning allz Mar 19 13:22:46 I'll write you a little app, ang on. Mar 19 13:23:21 alterego: oo, thank you. I can put it to fcron Mar 19 13:23:53 short message and one short vibration - thats all I need Mar 19 13:24:10 would anyone have a tip on what's the optimal way to get n900 stock rootfs into a qemu host stage Mar 19 13:24:39 think I'll try to see what libosso does, out of curiosity Mar 19 13:24:52 i.e. is there an image that is used for that usually or do i need to manually copy / from device Mar 19 13:25:07 the Hildon Banner code is in libhildon, not libosso Mar 19 13:25:56 oh wait its somewhere else Mar 19 13:25:56 jonwil: it's in osso for python Mar 19 13:26:01 oh ok Mar 19 13:27:29 hi all, is there a way to list all the fonts i have available? i want to change the default font in opera Mar 19 13:29:30 OkropNick: http://stage.rubyx.co.uk/m5infoprint.py Mar 19 13:29:36 alterego: I've just found code for system notification: dbus-send --type=method_call --dest=org.freedesktop.Notifications /org/freedesktop/Notifications org.freedesktop.Notifications.SystemNoteInfoprint string:"NOTIFICATION" Mar 19 13:29:46 alterego: thx, I'll check it Mar 19 13:29:59 Or that yeah :) Mar 19 13:30:56 well, the syntax for my command is: ./m5infoprint.py "Whatever message you want" Mar 19 13:31:11 here is many cool things: http://wiki.maemo.org/Phone_control Mar 19 13:31:24 Yeah, that's a good page. Mar 19 13:32:50 jonwil: you can show the banner two ways: either with hildon, which makes the *app* own it... or with libosso, which makes some system process own it Mar 19 13:32:59 oh ok Mar 19 13:33:59 jonwil: personally I use the hildon way when I need control, and the osso way when my script will exit immediately and can't keep it open itself Mar 19 13:34:13 ok Mar 19 13:34:40 hmm, looks like libosso just sends the same freedesktop.org notifications that are on that phone control web page... Mar 19 13:35:07 OkropNick: so yeah, you can do it from a shell script: http://wiki.maemo.org/Phone_control#Send_notification_.28orange_one_line_popup.29 Mar 19 13:35:50 I guess it's only the second one there that's the big one, not the first one Mar 19 13:36:08 villager: yes, I'll join it with one vibration and never forget about charging when N900 is in pocket Mar 19 13:38:48 ok i guess not. but how come there is no distcc package for maemo Mar 19 13:42:42 oh ok Mar 19 13:43:11 do you need distcc? i find it easier to mount the slow machine via nfs, chroot there and have the whole emerge process run on my quadcore which hardly ever runs out of memory. - i only work on x86, though, i don't know if this could possibly work with an arm target. Mar 19 13:43:17 this is pretty good thinking too Mar 19 13:44:21 macmaN: most C/C++ developers do not compile on the n900, they cross compile on their regular pcs, no need for distcc for maemo Mar 19 13:45:00 but distcc on a network of N900s is leet Mar 19 13:45:47 villager: right but where do i get the correct libc setup Mar 19 13:46:28 villager: my buildrig is gentoo and by default its crossdev thing installs all the latest libs, i dont think some sort of maemo-template exists Mar 19 13:47:00 althought that'd be really really nice Mar 19 13:48:03 macmaN: I use the scratchbox-based maemo sdk, but if you plan to develop with Qt I hear there are also some qt sdks that might be easier to use than scratchbox Mar 19 13:48:53 like MADDE or something Mar 19 13:49:56 qtcreator Mar 19 13:51:21 Yeah, the Nokia Qt SDK is really good, though I use it with Scratchbox too. Mar 19 13:51:34 Got it nicely integrated for on device or scratchbox deployment. Mar 19 13:54:35 the good thing about the scratchbox thing is that it has kind of a n900 emulator so you can do quick tests of your app in it without downloading it to the phone all the time Mar 19 13:54:57 not a great emulator, but at least something Mar 19 13:57:15 Well, that's why the Nokia SDK with maemo deployment is good, ctrl+r and it copies and runs it on the device. Mar 19 13:58:18 scratchbox is a little more combersome, but I have the same thing anyway, like ctrl+r runs my project in qt creater under scratchbox, when I've set the target to scratchbox Mar 19 13:59:06 I usually use a mixture of both, I use scratchbox to create packages though. Mar 19 14:21:46 hmmm, yes i should install the qt sdk on linux Mar 19 14:37:56 hi all, is it possible to change the default font in opera mobile? each time i change it in opera:config, it reverts back Mar 19 14:51:44 lol DocScrutinizer, optifying /usr/share is a bit "tricky" Mar 19 14:55:49 w00t, got qemu chroot working mounting n900:/ over nfs Mar 19 14:55:53 awesome Mar 19 15:06:22 DocScrutinizer, booted happily now but did not end up saving as much rootfs space as I thought Mar 19 15:06:27 * lcuk ponders trying /usr Mar 19 15:10:49 Someone should make a list of all the folders on the rootfs that actually NEED to be on the rootfs Mar 19 15:12:02 jonwil, I will expect you to have the wiki report finished by 4pm Mar 19 15:12:14 :P Mar 19 15:12:42 jonwil, you like investigating things - have you booted MeeGo yet? Mar 19 15:12:51 nope Mar 19 15:13:06 Not interested in alternative OSs on my N900 Mar 19 15:13:23 only in making the one I do use better Mar 19 15:13:33 too late in the day for me to play with /usr stuff Mar 19 15:13:44 jonwil, ok then well I found out MeeGo by default does something immensely faster than Maemo Mar 19 15:13:51 can anyone share a keyword about re-configuring /etc/resolv.conf when making usb network connection? Mar 19 15:14:17 i would like nameservers reordered when i connect with usb0 and then restored when i disconnect Mar 19 15:15:05 i understand dnsmasq takes care of it at 127.0.0.1, so should i push something into dnsmasq configuration or directly into /etc/resolv.conf Mar 19 15:17:03 http://wiki.maemo.org/N900_USB_networking only has info about manual editing, but there is some debian-way to do automated reconfiguration.. no? Mar 19 15:18:16 macmaN, I hear people talk about editing ifup ifdown configuration thingies to do odd things like this Mar 19 15:20:05 hmm, how is that strange, i am not sure i can make network dhcp available through usb and you might not always want to either Mar 19 15:20:11 but still access the internet Mar 19 15:22:47 ok i should probably google this from the debian pov Mar 19 15:25:28 alterego: I wrote simple ash script to vibrate and display alert when energy level fall below given value. Do you want it? Mar 19 15:26:04 can be run by fcron for example Mar 19 15:26:05 energy level? Mar 19 15:26:13 charge level Mar 19 15:26:28 doesn't bme do that? except the vibration bit Mar 19 15:26:49 It uses bme, I'll show you, w8 Mar 19 15:28:30 http://pastebin.com/bUZvfUgy Mar 19 15:29:37 It's very simple but I was missing that feature Mar 19 15:30:01 BME does that Mar 19 15:30:17 It goes beep, displays battery low, and then later, double beeps Mar 19 15:32:00 but it's too quiet. I can't hear it when I have headphones or when phone is in pocket Mar 19 15:32:10 hal-device bme | grep percentage | awk '{print $3}' Mar 19 15:32:18 I kinda hate regexes :P Mar 19 15:32:25 :) Mar 19 15:34:10 useless use of grep Mar 19 15:34:24 awk '/percentage/{print $3}' Mar 19 15:34:44 thx Mar 19 15:48:35 kinda dead in here today Mar 19 15:50:09 MohammadAG, same everywhere Mar 19 15:52:34 lcuk: another thing that annoys me, wonky photos :P Mar 19 15:52:49 alterego, haha Mar 19 15:52:59 in which thing alterego ? Mar 19 15:53:04 (note which chan you are on) Mar 19 15:53:11 the nokia tablet mockup Mar 19 15:53:21 Yeah, I nkow :P Mar 19 15:53:34 http://www.meegoexperts.com/2011/03/conceptual-meego-tablet-ui-pictures/ Mar 19 15:53:41 I felt sorry for MohammadAG :P Mar 19 15:54:17 lol Mar 19 15:54:34 alterego, you know I could just tap #meego on the chanlist :P Mar 19 15:57:02 Yeah well Mar 19 16:00:30 kinda dead in here today |it's just i was asleep Mar 19 16:01:18 MohammadAG, 2 things Mar 19 16:01:36 1) when you go to Jordan you ping me first i liked the laptop price Mar 19 16:01:44 2) what keyboard do you use Mar 19 16:02:16 My laptop's keyboard xD Mar 19 16:02:29 you don't have desktop? Mar 19 16:02:39 I do, but I don't use it, at all Mar 19 16:02:53 Logitech, some old model that's probably extinct now Mar 19 16:03:31 i want something like mac's Mar 19 16:03:41 http://www.ret.ru/images/m51393/743027.jpg Mar 19 16:03:47 like this for example Mar 19 16:03:55 but we don't have Mar 19 16:04:20 lcuk: weird, whilst working on my UX ideas, I sketched something that looks a lot like handset ... Mar 19 16:04:41 sketch iOS!!1eleven1 Mar 19 16:05:37 ZogG, get a mac keyboard? Mar 19 16:05:43 I think they work on PCs Mar 19 16:05:46 it is white Mar 19 16:06:03 racist! Mar 19 16:06:08 :P Mar 19 16:06:25 and it's too expensive, i mean it's not that i don't have that money, but they want too much only cause it's apple and i don't want to feed jobs =) Mar 19 16:06:39 MohammadAG, oh i am racist =) Mar 19 16:06:59 I once got a mac keyboard, but between the hamburger button and fries dispenser it was a bit useless Mar 19 16:07:43 MohammadAG, ZogG :( Mar 19 16:07:44 Hahah Mar 19 16:08:11 lcuk say wut? Mar 19 16:08:18 ZogG: http://www.dealextreme.com/p/foldable-and-undestructable-usb-flexible-keyboard-109-key-13684 Mar 19 16:08:23 lcuk, what? I'm racist towards muslims Mar 19 16:08:23 Hmm, it is very strange. When I run this script http://pastebin.com/Em7sWnKK from terminal, it displays text and vibrating, but when I run this script from fcron there is only vibration, no message. Mar 19 16:08:26 xD Mar 19 16:09:01 SpeedEvil: ive been thinking about those kinds of solutions to carry for tableting Mar 19 16:09:08 if i only had a maemo/meego tablet :/ Mar 19 16:09:25 SpeedEvil lol Mar 19 16:09:45 i wonder how small that folds to Mar 19 16:09:51 and is it usable enough for coding Mar 19 16:09:55 on the run Mar 19 16:10:21 macmaN, perhaps not on the run Mar 19 16:10:34 macmaN, you can use http://www.indiana.edu/~libpres/manual/materials/matimages/notebook.jpg this for coding Mar 19 16:10:39 100 metre dash + SMS Mar 19 16:10:47 ai32ursdnhvks5 289rsfer2iridsjv98d\ s uew 8sud98fshj45jr98sfs9t45 jo4wr w8tr9432tr Mar 19 16:10:52 lcuk, why not, there is nike coding shoes =) Mar 19 16:11:08 lcuk, is a bot ^ Mar 19 16:11:26 ZogG, I use something similar for coding :) Mar 19 16:11:47 lcuk, i used to code with steps shoes Mar 19 16:12:01 when you dance in Morse's code Mar 19 16:13:45 * lcuk has a mac mini keyboard Mar 19 16:13:50 ZogG: http://liqbase.net/liq.n810.laptopmode.20080305.S6002381.JPG Mar 19 16:14:51 lcuk i want one for desktop and not maemo Mar 19 16:14:56 why woud i need one for maemo? Mar 19 16:15:50 is n900 or n8*0 keyboard more comfy? Mar 19 16:16:09 ZogG, for coding, 810 and 900 keyboards are good for poking Mar 19 16:16:23 but tough to get required characters for efficient coding Mar 19 16:16:33 lcuk, you built nice mac pro there =) Mar 19 16:16:38 tab and | mostly (I know you can configure them) Mar 19 16:16:49 lcuk i have | on n900 =) Mar 19 16:16:54 and tab Mar 19 16:17:04 I have that too, look .|.. Mar 19 16:17:06 there is script in extras Mar 19 16:17:20 as stated, they can be configured Mar 19 16:17:41 n900 is awesome Mar 19 16:17:52 all the droid and iphones are just for games Mar 19 16:17:59 n900 is real business here Mar 19 16:18:09 * lcuk nods Mar 19 16:18:19 * ZogG xmms2> Peter Gabriel - My Body Is A Cage ["Scratch My Back" 2010] Mar 19 16:18:22 what is the most fully loaded n900 around? Mar 19 16:18:28 nice song from last house =) Mar 19 16:18:32 who has pushed it to uber limits with most OSes and stuff? Mar 19 16:18:46 lcuk, MohammadAG ? Mar 19 16:19:04 MohammadAG is tame :P Mar 19 16:19:09 i think he tried ubuntu or fedora =) Mar 19 16:19:15 MohammadAG, did you? Mar 19 16:19:26 MohammadAG is lame :P Mar 19 16:19:28 lol Mar 19 16:19:31 ZogG, we were doing ubuntu on n810 and stuff Mar 19 16:19:49 oh and there was someone porting gentoo to n810 =) Mar 19 16:20:13 http://nosocomia.com:8099/n810-gentoo/ Mar 19 16:20:56 ZogG, yeah Mar 19 16:20:57 ZogG: https://github.com/slonopotamus/ Mar 19 16:21:07 i just got n800 booting gentoo Mar 19 16:21:17 Congrats. Mar 19 16:21:29 macmaN just right now/ Mar 19 16:21:41 SpeedEvil, aren't you happy for them? Mar 19 16:21:46 with xorg-server-1.9.4, wireless and all Mar 19 16:21:51 well no, a day or so ago Mar 19 16:22:23 lcuk, I had 6 OSs on the N900 Mar 19 16:22:33 macmaN, how does it work? Mar 19 16:22:39 MohammadAG, :D Mar 19 16:22:45 MohammadAG, wich ones? Mar 19 16:22:47 * lcuk retracts his previous comment Mar 19 16:22:47 lcuk: im installing gentoo prefix on n900 right now Mar 19 16:22:57 MohammadAG is awesome :P Mar 19 16:23:19 now I only have Maemo and MeeGo Mar 19 16:23:40 MohammadAG, how can we benchmark properly between them Mar 19 16:23:56 move Maemo to the eMMC I guess Mar 19 16:23:57 MohammadAG, meego is on sd? Mar 19 16:24:02 since yesterday I noticed that by default MeeGo appears to have better configurations for compiling stuff within Mar 19 16:24:02 i want to get there too Mar 19 16:24:06 ZogG: very nicely! i will be figuring out next what kind of UI i will put on it, it needs some thought considering theres no keyboard and most of the software out there isnt for tablets Mar 19 16:24:10 for now nit and maemo Mar 19 16:24:11 no, internal eMMC Mar 19 16:24:20 actually i think there might be room now for a tablet-desktop-environment for linux Mar 19 16:24:22 uSD sucks Mar 19 16:25:31 MohammadAG, do not want to format emmc and split it =( Mar 19 16:25:32 MohammadAG, it doesn't suck so much. but to use eMMC requires planning and lots of mucking around resizing partitions - most important is user data on there Mar 19 16:25:54 is meego already usable? Mar 19 16:26:05 as lcuk never answer me on twitter =) Mar 19 16:26:50 ZogG, use gparted Mar 19 16:26:57 just resize it, no need to format Mar 19 16:27:36 meh Mar 19 16:27:46 i did it on laptop Mar 19 16:27:49 took ages Mar 19 16:27:58 also hinking to get to ext2 on emmc Mar 19 16:29:57 mammas don't let your babies grow up Mar 19 16:29:59 ZogG, where, what, when? Mar 19 16:30:07 to be cowboys Mar 19 16:30:18 lcuk, not that much of a risk tbh Mar 19 16:30:48 ahh ZogG Mar 19 16:31:11 well you knwo the DeveloperEdition is in progress, track it to see http://wiki.meego.com/ARM/N900/DeveloperEdition Mar 19 16:31:29 * alterego ponders how cool it'd be if all handset UXs were written in QML .. Mar 19 16:32:19 alterego, well since the powersaving is not yet inplace, it wouldn't be that cool Mar 19 16:32:22 ruskie, hey byddu Mar 19 16:32:29 as much as I like QML, I'd hate the fact that my UI is interpretted :P Mar 19 16:32:42 drop the second t Mar 19 16:33:08 MohammadAG: it's not really interpreted .. Mar 19 16:33:25 * lcuk puts hand up Mar 19 16:33:33 Well, the javascript is, but the Qml is used to build a scene graph Mar 19 16:33:35 alterego, where is the QML compiler? Mar 19 16:34:09 MohammadAG, how is yopur mediaplayer? Mar 19 16:36:36 very usable as a music replacement Mar 19 16:36:44 music-only replacement mediaplayer Mar 19 16:38:04 alterego, do you know of a gstreamer based widget for Qt? Mar 19 16:38:43 QMediaPlayer? Mar 19 16:39:21 Or whatever it's called, whatever is in QtMultimedia Mar 19 16:39:36 meh, don't want to use QtMultimedia Mar 19 16:39:53 Yes, stick to mafw compliance :P Mar 19 16:42:25 mafw rocks :P Mar 19 16:42:48 actually, yeah, mafw's good, Nokia's implementation sucks Mar 19 16:51:41 http://thethoughtexperiment.files.wordpress.com/2011/01/happyfreaksviaiwanabeyourdog.jpg R. Crumb - janis joplin Mar 19 16:52:47 sigh Mar 19 16:52:56 managed to get my n900 into a reboot loop Mar 19 16:52:59 damn Mar 19 16:53:57 reason? Mar 19 16:53:58 i wonder how Mar 19 16:54:07 no idea Mar 19 16:54:49 the only suspicious thing i did was letting emerge update ld.so.cache Mar 19 16:54:59 is there some way to monitor the boot process Mar 19 16:57:01 hmmm Mar 19 16:57:47 actually i did use qcpufreq to put max at 900mhz Mar 19 17:00:19 MohammadAG, you mean no video and radio support for now Mar 19 17:00:36 radio is supported, sort of Mar 19 17:00:50 but yeah, for now, I'm the only one working on this :( Mar 19 17:01:24 =( Mar 19 17:01:30 i don't think it's for now =( Mar 19 17:01:42 MohammadAG, how would you handle video btw? Mar 19 17:01:43 why? Mar 19 17:01:49 mafw Mar 19 17:02:02 mplayer is nice =) Mar 19 17:02:26 screw it, needs a fast CPU Mar 19 17:02:48 and I'm replacing the stock player, not changing the whole underlying stack Mar 19 17:03:33 most stuff is easy to implement, but idk how to do the gstreamer widget Mar 19 17:03:54 what do you mean. the one for displaying video? Mar 19 17:04:03 yes Mar 19 17:04:50 think I should get genres view working next Mar 19 17:04:50 then playlist view Mar 19 17:05:00 then music only replacement is done Mar 19 17:05:06 internet radio should also be easy Mar 19 17:05:46 * RST38h moos, greets Mohammad Mar 19 17:06:51 moo Mar 19 17:06:58 hey pupnik Mar 19 17:06:59 moo RST38h :D Mar 19 17:07:04 n900 is bestest thing ever Mar 19 17:07:25 but it could be better.. ;) Mar 19 17:07:34 MohammadAG, http://stackoverflow.com/questions/1873113/how-to-implement-a-video-widget-in-qt-that-builds-upon-gstreamer Mar 19 17:07:55 are you really including all the humand methods of getting satisfaction into the comparison? Mar 19 17:08:40 MohammadAG, as well this can be releated and it's releated to n800 http://www.qtforum.org/article/26990/how-to-show-gstreamer-video-inside-qt-widget.html Mar 19 17:13:30 ZogG, I guess I'll need to read about gstreamer too Mar 19 17:19:32 haj: what two things would you change Mar 19 17:25:43 http://www.engadget.com/2011/03/18/internet-explorer-versions-1-through-9-compared-signs-of-progre/ epic title Mar 19 17:26:50 hrm somehow getting access to rootfs in this flash mode would be very nice Mar 19 17:27:00 i wonder if i should just re-flash the kernel to start Mar 19 17:47:04 wtf Mar 19 17:47:16 i swappped to wifi and lost my tmob cell connection Mar 19 17:47:34 is there something i can do to reset the modem without a power cycle? Mar 19 17:48:28 swapped to wifi? Mar 19 17:48:32 yes Mar 19 17:48:48 i manually connected to my wifi when i got home Mar 19 17:49:04 but i have been running into this problem all on its own Mar 19 17:49:11 where i lose the tmob connection Mar 19 17:49:18 the 3g data connection? Mar 19 17:49:21 and have to power cycle to get it back Mar 19 17:49:23 both Mar 19 17:49:42 the data and cell connection Mar 19 17:49:48 hmm Mar 19 17:50:02 data lossing should be normal... but losing the cell connection... Mar 19 17:50:14 yeah. it just seems to die on me Mar 19 17:50:29 is there some way to re-run the modem startup? Mar 19 17:50:46 in order to get it to reset itself without powering off? Mar 19 17:50:54 no clue Mar 19 17:51:05 heh Mar 19 17:51:52 hrm, so how long is the knightrider show supposed to go on after flash Mar 19 17:52:02 after flash? Mar 19 17:52:13 and now... tmobile isnt listed in my internet connection list Mar 19 17:52:15 ugh Mar 19 17:52:20 macmaN: serveral mins Mar 19 17:52:27 i think it is time to dump the n900 :) Mar 19 17:52:30 macmaN: takes ages for first boot Mar 19 17:52:38 i should get a g2 or something Mar 19 17:52:47 ahh indeed Mar 19 17:52:51 ok now pin code entry Mar 19 17:53:18 i wish there was an android rom with a gnu environment Mar 19 17:53:26 that would make android perfect Mar 19 17:54:43 Macer: exactly Mar 19 17:54:51 Macer: can i haz just the hardware please pretty much Mar 19 17:55:50 sigh, back to installing cssu n friends :/ Mar 19 17:59:54 i really wonder how i messed it up Mar 19 18:04:14 * RST38h hates .MKV Mar 19 18:04:23 * ruskie loves .MKV Mar 19 18:04:44 * macmaN loves .MKV Mar 19 18:04:55 RST38h: It could be worse. Mar 19 18:05:03 * SpeedEvil hates the new BBC files from get_iplayer that don't play on the n900 Mar 19 18:05:07 derf: Yes. It could be motion JPEG. Mar 19 18:05:16 Or .rm! Mar 19 18:05:19 Or the freaking .FLV Mar 19 18:05:24 or .wmv Mar 19 18:05:29 Actually, there is an option of .rm Mar 19 18:05:35 mbmp Mar 19 18:06:01 .wmv isn't _that_ terrible, as a container format. Mar 19 18:06:18 and what exactly is wrong with .mkv? Mar 19 18:07:12 ruskie: not supported on N900, very badly supported on Windows, makes players crash, subtitles get desynced or lost Mar 19 18:07:40 mplayer works fine... Mar 19 18:08:12 as for the rest... haven't used windows for anything other than minor work related things in last 5 years... haven't had any crashes... and the only times I got desyncs was due to crappy encoding Mar 19 18:08:47 It has similar problems to Ogg... it tries to be good enough for enough different use cases that implementing it is fairly complex, and thus often wrong. Mar 19 18:09:13 Oh, btw, I hate Ogg too Mar 19 18:09:16 Same issues. Mar 19 18:09:31 Yes, I think that was my point. Mar 19 18:09:42 nanny ogg? Mar 19 18:09:57 Of course, the alternative is to be bad at everything. Mar 19 18:10:03 So it's not like you can win. Mar 19 18:10:10 irssi syndrome, too eleet to be usable :) Mar 19 18:10:47 irssi syndrome? Mar 19 18:10:51 with a *bunch* of /scripts, irssi is quite all right aside from vertsplit windows Mar 19 18:10:52 i don't see how uh. unusable? Mar 19 18:11:02 i don't really use any other client Mar 19 18:11:21 I guess it depends on the people actually using it... Mar 19 18:11:28 RST38h has just never spent serious time with BitchX. Mar 19 18:11:32 Or ircII. Mar 19 18:11:49 or maybe he prefers the simplicity of those clients Mar 19 18:12:21 I know I enjoyed the simplicity of dumping the traffic from all my channels into one window. Mar 19 18:12:42 I'll pick whatever works best for me... and so far mkv, irssi and other things haven't caused any probs Mar 19 18:12:53 i don't need vertical tabs of channels, 1337-scripts for VIP ACCESS or mouse access. i like my always-accessible client. Mar 19 18:12:55 hell avi, wmv and mp4 caused me more headaches Mar 19 18:13:08 <3 mp4. you fickle bitch Mar 19 18:13:38 open one file, plays fine with all players. open another file, only plays on ps3 and n900 ?! Mar 19 18:24:00 what format are the spelling dictionaries in on the n900 Mar 19 18:24:04 how do you add those Mar 19 18:34:10 ok something called ezitext it seems Mar 19 18:34:54 which prompts another question, anyone come up with a list to clean up all the useless language support packages Mar 19 18:34:58 eZiText Mar 19 18:35:25 macmaN, well the prob is if you remove them they tend to pull out quite a few required system packages as well Mar 19 18:37:16 eZiText being something propriteray used in quite a few systems that I can recall Mar 19 18:39:50 I wonder how I could check if a keypress is a letter and not otherwise... Mar 19 18:39:54 the language files have been set as some sort of hard dependencies...? damn thats gayness Mar 19 18:40:53 macmaN, everything for the basesystem is a harddependency :( Mar 19 18:41:17 and quite a few system packages also harddepend on those Mar 19 18:41:52 ok thanks to this reflash, im getting a nice apt-get remove command together to clean out useless apps Mar 19 18:41:53 I have a removelist on my User:Ruskie wiki.maemo page Mar 19 18:42:01 might want to look at that Mar 19 18:42:02 osso-rss-feed-reader and so forth Mar 19 18:42:08 oh thanks Mar 19 18:42:16 feel free to append things Mar 19 18:42:42 note any removing will generally remove the fremantle metapackage as well Mar 19 18:43:02 ahh you repartitioned emmc? Mar 19 18:43:07 i was thinking about that Mar 19 18:43:10 yeah Mar 19 18:43:12 I did a lot of stuff Mar 19 18:43:14 32g for FAT is such a waste Mar 19 18:43:26 Oh yeah: http://www.engadget.com/2011/03/19/red-bull-augmented-racing-game-lets-you-build-tracks-with-red-bu/ Mar 19 18:43:34 but sadly I had to make adjustments Mar 19 18:43:43 due to the overall borkedness of the setup... Mar 19 18:44:13 derf: I am using ircii for 10+ years now Mar 19 18:44:43 derf: It is ok. Irssi and BitchX I just cannot stand, they both feel like those ancient eleet hacker BBSes to me Mar 19 18:45:25 to each their own ;) Mar 19 18:45:25 rainbowy, crufty, egomaniac shit Mar 19 18:45:30 lol Mar 19 18:49:58 RST38h: admit it you were just 'too lame to read bitchx.doc'! SCNR Mar 19 18:50:04 hehe Mar 19 18:50:32 dm8: no, I was just too busy scratching my eyes out, after I looked at BitchX opening "screen" Mar 19 18:50:49 what the heck is skyhost Mar 19 18:51:00 skype p2p agent Mar 19 18:51:09 okay Mar 19 18:51:25 ruskie, hey Mar 19 18:55:33 RST38h: yes, bx is umm too much, with irssi I'm happy. but everybody is free to have their favourite, beauty of IRC Mar 19 18:56:15 thank you Mar 19 18:57:32 I went from bitchX to pidgin, till I found something better. Mar 19 18:57:44 Turns out pidgin hasn't irritated me enought o bother finding something better. Mar 19 18:58:05 heh Mar 19 18:58:11 irssi! Mar 19 19:07:24 pupnik: more RAM... Thats my only complaint... perhaps dualcore cpu, but i guess that the problems i have with maxed out cpu is due to the software being originally written to suit PC processors, and then ported to the N900.. Mar 19 19:07:52 hehe yep Mar 19 19:07:59 I'd like 512M of RAM Mar 19 19:08:05 pupnik: gPodder for instance.. I can't really complain it eats away on the resources if I download podcasts with 3mb/sec.. ;) Mar 19 19:08:11 Dual-core would be nice. Mar 19 19:08:28 Well - SMP dualcore Mar 19 19:10:56 When we are at it, a Nvidia Tegra based N9x0 with 4-5" display and at least 512MB RAM would be cool. Mar 19 19:12:04 I'm unsure. Mar 19 19:12:20 The form factor is pretty ideal for most of my use-cases. Mar 19 19:13:24 Would I like it to fill more of the bezel - yes. Mar 19 19:13:50 wtf is up with Nokia-N900:~# apt-cache rdepends libmodest-dbus-client Mar 19 19:13:55 whole system depends on it.. Mar 19 19:14:28 I was able to - PR1.1? - remove modest Mar 19 19:14:31 apt-get remove modest Mar 19 19:14:34 with no issue Mar 19 19:14:56 yeah i used modest* Mar 19 19:15:09 just wondering about the libs Mar 19 19:15:09 And it worked? Mar 19 19:15:12 wackness Mar 19 19:15:20 Removing, I mean Mar 19 19:15:48 no, i stopped it, the rdepends list is huge Mar 19 19:15:54 it wants to kill almost everything Mar 19 19:16:03 ah Mar 19 19:16:06 because of that stupid modest library Mar 19 19:22:40 interesting macmaN - never used rdepends before Mar 19 19:23:25 BitchX is crap, and Panasync is moron. Mar 19 19:28:17 what do the rc marked packages mean Mar 19 19:36:34 macmaN: release candidate is usually what rc means in software Mar 19 19:40:24 good afternoon Mar 19 19:40:51 hey and bye Mar 19 19:40:53 going to sleep Mar 19 19:40:57 ok Mar 19 19:41:02 bye Mar 19 19:41:08 hey ZogG :) Mar 19 19:41:09 bye Mar 19 19:41:19 welcome venemo Mar 19 19:58:59 US Federal Government attacks Libya ... http://english.aljazeera.net/watch_now/ Mar 19 20:03:58 Venemo, did you figured out with music files? Mar 19 20:04:32 ZogG, totally removing the tags, readding them, and then 'touch *' in the directory and reindexing in Banshee did it :) Mar 19 20:04:56 hmm Mar 19 20:04:58 that's wierd Mar 19 20:05:05 banshee sucks than =) Mar 19 20:05:09 nope Mar 19 20:05:27 yes it does =) Mar 19 20:05:33 xmss2 ftw Mar 19 20:05:34 it's actually smart. only re-indexes files that have their modification date set newer than before Mar 19 20:05:44 actually EasyTag sux for not setting the file modified date Mar 19 20:06:02 maybe there's a setting for it, but I didn't find it Mar 19 20:06:19 does anyone know how to run fcron jobs as 'user', not as 'fcron' ? Mar 19 20:06:34 don't banshee has re-index option? Mar 19 20:06:51 OkropNick maybe threr is as well group fcron Mar 19 20:07:34 ZogG, it remembers the modification dates, and only reindexes the ones with newer dates to speed up the process. Mar 19 20:08:31 Venemo lol=) just found it Mar 19 20:08:40 it took 2 seconds =) Mar 19 20:09:01 ZogG, really? Mar 19 20:09:16 easytag -> settings-> preference -> file settings Mar 19 20:09:21 eeh. Mar 19 20:09:29 get rid of "preverse file date modification" Mar 19 20:09:29 ZogG, you're a mastermind Mar 19 20:09:54 Venemo, meh =) i'm joking man, don't get pissed =( Mar 19 20:10:05 you know i'm stupid =) Mar 19 20:10:13 ZogG, no you are NOT stupid at all Mar 19 20:10:18 everyone does, as i don't keep it as secret Mar 19 20:10:33 Venemo, i like being realistic =) Mar 19 20:11:14 ZogG, realistically, you're a clever person. believe me. Mar 19 20:12:00 the man who isn't a pessimist is a damned fool. Mar 19 20:12:01 - Mark Twain Mar 19 20:12:20 not true Mar 19 20:13:33 Venemo, man you can't argue with Twain Mar 19 20:14:23 hehe Mar 19 20:15:15 i can't find quote Mar 19 20:15:26 ZogG, he can, but I doubt he will get a reply. Mar 19 20:15:43 he was saying something like "pessimism is made up by people who is afraid of reality" Mar 19 20:16:07 lcuk, very grown up of you =P Mar 19 20:16:13 anyway night folks Mar 19 20:17:49 night ZogG Mar 19 20:19:00 wait before i go Mar 19 20:19:15 what is the name of multitouch resist screen/ Mar 19 20:33:33 did anybody have any luck running jackd on N900 ? I'm getting this http://pastebin.com/FN1ZQJf3 and nothing changes when I add the file Mar 19 20:44:06 ZogG: stantum? Mar 19 21:01:24 MohammadAG: please check http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=968973&postcount=173 (missing modules in PK) and do *something* about it - e.g. kick PK maintainer's idiotic ass Mar 19 21:01:51 but.. but... I don't live in Germany Mar 19 21:03:00 I never knew kernel-power lacked those modules... Mar 19 21:07:43 we *need* a sane way to *install* additional kernel modules, via some pkg or whatever Mar 19 21:08:41 the debian way is dkms Mar 19 21:08:48 we lack gcc to use that Mar 19 21:11:59 anybody see an inspirion duo thing? Mar 19 21:12:01 that turns into a tablet? Mar 19 21:12:05 i was wondering how it was Mar 19 21:12:05 Macer: yes Mar 19 21:12:12 any good? Mar 19 21:12:13 Macer: not personally Mar 19 21:12:24 Macer: Send me one, and I'll review it. Mar 19 21:12:26 :) Mar 19 21:12:27 hah Mar 19 21:12:39 i was thyinking of getting one but it runs win7 Mar 19 21:13:02 it is an n550 dual core 1.5ghz atom tho Mar 19 21:15:20 it is overpriced Mar 19 21:15:25 and runs win7 so meh Mar 19 21:17:56 MohammadAG: I'd think two basic things: 1) most kernel modules can live in /opt aka eMMC, as not needed for boot. 2) if those are taking too much space, and you want to get rid of some - - so what, just do it. shouldn't be hard to rm some .ko, then run debmod -a or somesuch Mar 19 21:19:20 to be more specific: if we can't have installable modules, then install 'all' modules and give user an option to get rid of useless cruft Mar 19 21:20:11 or package modules in extra packages Mar 19 21:20:13 "ewww, PK pkg DL is 14MB" - so WAHT? Mar 19 21:20:21 kernel-power-cdrom-modules Mar 19 21:21:03 with the proper rdepends I don't see the problem either Mar 19 21:21:25 why has nobody done that yet? (except maybe fcam) Mar 19 21:21:52 fcam's implementation is stupid Mar 19 21:22:12 it just tries to load all modules Mar 19 21:22:26 stock ones will fail on kernel-power, kernel-power ones will fail on stock Mar 19 21:22:50 we don't support stock, so nevermind Mar 19 21:23:45 MohammadAG: could you help with this? some users of h-e-n got really desperate Mar 19 21:24:14 sure, one question though Mar 19 21:24:21 where the f is titan Mar 19 21:24:33 you showed them playing drHouse from DVD, and they don't get their drive mounted Mar 19 21:25:23 NFC, send him here to receive his spanking, if ever you meet him Mar 19 21:28:15 hm Mar 19 21:28:21 dell netbooks suck Mar 19 21:28:30 they use old single core atoms Mar 19 21:34:41 s/old single-core// Mar 19 21:35:33 heh yeah su2300 > atom Mar 19 21:37:59 s/su2300/an abacus/ Mar 19 21:38:22 i like the thinkpad x series Mar 19 21:38:53 i can watch videos on mine and the cpu fan doesn't even turn on Mar 19 21:39:54 DocScrutinizer, I was using our kernel :) Mar 19 21:41:04 MohammadAG: thought as much. Were the DVD/sr modules config'd by Paul, or did you do that? Mar 19 21:43:32 DocScrutinizer, I did Mar 19 21:44:34 MohammadAG: I consider it necessary to host a h-e-n support pkg for PK Mar 19 21:46:07 I don't care if that contains additional modules only, or a complete identical kernel *plus* additional modules. I'm also indifferent to whether we offer this via garage or in repo, and when repo, in which one Mar 19 21:47:58 wow Mar 19 21:48:04 i dont even want this netbook Mar 19 21:48:09 or we finally sanitize the fscking PK situation Mar 19 21:49:28 sanitize means, get the thing into a shape where usual kernel devels can work on it. I.E. support git Mar 19 21:49:59 then have a few maintainers so we're not shouting "WTF is titan??!!?!?!!!" Mar 19 21:50:14 lol Mar 19 21:50:33 no idea what you're on about DocScrutinizer Mar 19 21:50:44 then stfu Mar 19 21:51:38 haha Mar 19 21:52:02 the ones concerned will know what I mean Mar 19 21:52:36 and I don't want to see powerkernel get abandoned and orphaned eventually, inkluding h-e-n Mar 19 21:52:47 * lcuk will remember that next time the channel turns into French or Spanish or German or some other language Mar 19 21:53:13 lcuk: ??? Mar 19 21:53:37 " the ones concerned will know what I mean" Mar 19 21:53:44 * lcuk was joking on that Mar 19 21:53:51 people in other languages will know too Mar 19 21:54:18 sorry, this was a comment about somebody claiming he doesn't know about the problems of powerkernel maintenance Mar 19 21:54:36 *custom kernel maint is a problem Mar 19 21:54:57 so I gather he's not the typical candidate to take concern about maintaining PK Mar 19 21:56:02 are there no 64bit atoms? Mar 19 21:56:06 :) Mar 19 21:56:22 I have two Mar 19 21:56:34 Atom330 and N510 Mar 19 21:59:36 hmm Mar 19 21:59:59 is it possible to change the sound volume on the N900 from terminal? Mar 19 22:00:09 I'd like to invite interested individuals to ##mhd, to join in to a h-e-n centric discussion how to get a sane PK-alike thing that has proper maintenance Mar 19 22:00:41 lcuk: javispedro: Jaffa: donno who else ^^^ Mar 19 22:07:31 ShadowJK: i thought a 510 was still 32bit Mar 19 22:07:56 1.6GHz netbooks from dell are still 279 Mar 19 22:08:15 and it comes with all this win7 crap i would never use Mar 19 22:08:27 N510 is 1.5GHz dualcore (4 virtual cpus in total) Mar 19 22:08:45 Macer: so? Mar 19 22:08:46 the inspirion duo netbook/tablet thing looks neet.. but runs win7 Mar 19 22:08:54 Macer: win7 on it makes it cheaper Mar 19 22:08:58 which version of the Ovi Maps do I need for the n900? im running maemo 5. Mar 19 22:09:00 heh Mar 19 22:09:10 Macer: it's subsidized by companies that pay to install demo versions of their software Mar 19 22:09:11 does it? Mar 19 22:09:24 yuck Mar 19 22:09:30 Macer: so in fact you get windows for free Mar 19 22:09:44 sq-one, it doesn't matter because you can't install or upgrade the included one Mar 19 22:12:47 ShadowJK: hmm im trying to download the map files and store them in /home/user/cities/diskcache. Mar 19 22:13:19 ah Mar 19 22:14:24 sq-one: use ovi suite Mar 19 22:14:27 I downloaded the map files for version 3.0.6 and copied them into that folder. When I know start this map application it just quits during the startup Mar 19 22:14:36 jacekowski: i would rather not get it for free and install kubuntu on it :) Mar 19 22:14:37 im running linux Mar 19 22:14:47 but either way. they are selling single core atoms for 279 still Mar 19 22:14:56 netbooks should be comign down in price :) Mar 19 22:14:58 Macer: you can get it like it is and install kubuntu on it Mar 19 22:15:22 jacekowski: i would rather get it for what it is really worth and install kubuntu on a barebones one ;) Mar 19 22:15:27 let me see how much i can find one for Mar 19 22:16:55 it would cost you at best same possibly more Mar 19 22:34:16 is maemo's destiny still undecided? i keep reading blogs, posts, wikis and the more i read the more i get confused. is everything actually that unclear from nokia's development side? they seem to support meego along with intel. the last i've read, is that meego is set to be a developer version on n900, great! what's the end product?! Mar 19 22:35:20 compengi: it's decidedly dead, what's the confusion? Mar 19 22:35:30 Be sure to check dates of blog posts too :P Mar 19 22:35:34 congrats to the new council Mar 19 22:36:14 :/ Mar 19 22:38:21 test Mar 19 22:43:29 jacekowski: heh. i am just saying they are overpriced Mar 19 22:43:36 they are not following normal marketing rules Mar 19 22:43:54 the hardware is dated and not reducing Mar 19 22:44:01 in price :) Mar 19 22:44:16 i mean cmon. it has been years since netbooks came out and a dell single core 1.6GHz atom for 279? Mar 19 22:44:51 i will look around to see if i can get something else that doesn't suck heh Mar 19 22:45:11 i wanted a netbook but those dells sure in hell aren't worth it Mar 19 22:47:37 alterego, so Meego is the future on n900? Mar 19 22:51:32 compengi, we don't know yet. Mar 19 22:52:14 why nokia drops it's support for an OS it has put an effort and money on it? isn't that a waste of time and money? what kind of marketing business are they running, self-destructive? why other companies like apple, google, windows etc.. take 1 project and work on it till the end and nokia fails? Mar 19 22:53:15 The hope when the decision was made is basically it'll result in more profit later. Mar 19 22:53:20 I question this. Mar 19 22:54:51 Meego is dead Mar 19 22:55:18 n900 is so awesome Mar 19 22:55:37 * alterego sighs Mar 19 22:55:43 it is, but only if it's running Maemo Mar 19 22:55:45 At least we have MeeGo .. Mar 19 22:55:49 Sc0rpius, any progress on tree view mode's MR? :) Mar 19 22:55:51 gemrb is nearing a new release Mar 19 22:56:16 SpeedEvil, Yeah.. Exactly! I don't know where they stand and what they are doing.. Look at other companies like Google, they bring something and keep that up. That's why everybody wants to have it on their smart phones, but everybody maybe knows Nokia i guess.. Mar 19 22:56:29 hmm well yeah I was merging with my master branch and also preparing to request the modifications of tinymail first Mar 19 22:56:30 wtf happened to dell laptops Mar 19 22:56:34 since it won't run without that Mar 19 22:56:40 well it will run, but it will crash heh Mar 19 22:56:44 the xps laptops used t obe almost as awesome as old thinkpads Mar 19 22:56:49 now they are cheap made in china trash Mar 19 22:58:25 SpeedEvil, They keep using this outdated Symbian OS that's have been on the phones since the early 90's :/ Mar 19 22:59:03 yeah Mar 19 22:59:13 They don't like to compete I guess Mar 19 22:59:31 you complain about nokia not sticking with an operating system Mar 19 22:59:35 then you complain about nokia sticking with an operating system Mar 19 23:02:04 pupnik, no, i complain about nokia not willing to support it's newest os for something outdated Mar 19 23:02:25 how do you know symbian is outdated? Mar 19 23:03:26 because it never tried to compete with the newest smart phones and yet they still use it Mar 19 23:04:35 and try to modify it and bring multi-touch in it lol Mar 19 23:05:57 have you used the N8? Mar 19 23:05:58 instead of working really on something worth it Mar 19 23:06:10 it's still not out afaik Mar 19 23:07:13 o_O Mar 19 23:07:17 aside from some stability issues it seems like a functional, contemporary phone OS Mar 19 23:07:32 The N8's been out since like September Mar 19 23:07:32 or before that Mar 19 23:15:26 still nothing beats maemo Mar 19 23:15:51 pupnik, i totally agree with you. that's why i'm pissed off Mar 19 23:15:59 mhm me too Mar 19 23:16:41 nokia still can deliver a meego/maemo phone and license the accelerated dalvik vm for it Mar 19 23:17:19 so we get our true linux stuff and people who want google services and other online services can get that from android Mar 19 23:17:52 make a bigger version of the e7 Mar 19 23:18:58 With a licenced copy of the useful libs for wine-7 Mar 19 23:21:51 if there are Star Trek and/or Star Wars fans here, enjoy: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hNxhrPaaCA4 Mar 19 23:28:18 woke up of bad dream Mar 19 23:28:34 Venemo, btw i have a question Mar 19 23:28:46 yea ZogG, I'm listening Mar 19 23:28:56 Venemo if there are 2 databases Mar 19 23:29:01 how do yo do syncing Mar 19 23:29:11 i mean you can up one to eachother and so on Mar 19 23:29:22 but how you updtae only needed parts Mar 19 23:29:33 theoretriclly Mar 19 23:29:35 * pupnik is sad Mar 19 23:29:53 you track of last update or how? Mar 19 23:30:16 ZogG, depends on the situation Mar 19 23:30:27 Venemo ? Mar 19 23:31:10 ZogG, so you want to synchronize two different databases, storing what? Mar 19 23:31:19 yes Mar 19 23:31:35 ZogG, storing what? Mar 19 23:31:40 storying abything Mar 19 23:31:47 notes Mar 19 23:31:52 okay, but do you mean the same kind of data? Mar 19 23:31:57 calendar e g Mar 19 23:32:03 mhm Mar 19 23:32:06 well, it's easy. Mar 19 23:32:17 ok Mar 19 23:32:21 how do i do that? Mar 19 23:32:22 remember the state of the db at the time of the last sync Mar 19 23:32:42 why does it make it simple Mar 19 23:32:44 then, see 1) what's been added and add those to the other 2) see what's been deleted and delete it from the other Mar 19 23:32:48 both of them can be changed Mar 19 23:33:01 3) repeat 1) and 2) for the other database Mar 19 23:33:14 it is too heavy Mar 19 23:33:28 i mean it would take a lot of data and more time =) Mar 19 23:34:06 i would look in existing examples i think Mar 19 23:34:27 libreoffice builds too long Mar 19 23:34:40 going back to sleep Mar 19 23:35:26 then there is the other idea. simply iterate through the databases and generate a difference Mar 19 23:36:34 see how diff / patch is working ;-) Mar 19 23:38:45 you go a common parent, two versions A and B that have arbitrary changes against parent, and you merge those diffs into a new child common version, handling conflicts where both A nd B have conflicting changes on the same records Mar 19 23:39:21 pupnik, i'm very sad too. Mar 19 23:39:39 good morning Mar 19 23:40:15 btw is nokia, intel and linux foundation financing meego or it's just community open source support? Mar 19 23:40:41 the first Mar 19 23:41:25 pupnik, very nice, i hope it's gonna be for the best. btw, i'm trying very hard to be optimistic Mar 19 23:42:01 morning Termana Mar 19 23:42:16 pupnik, do you know as well if n900 will be fully supported? Mar 19 23:48:12 compengi: i think n900 is a bit low on memory for it Mar 19 23:52:30 pupnik, i don't own a micro sd hc card, so i haven't tried it yet Mar 19 23:52:46 compengi: minus Nokia, for practical purposes Mar 19 23:52:59 compengi: Nokia is moving to Windows-only Mar 19 23:53:14 that sucks so much Mar 19 23:53:16 compengi: MicroSDHC has nothing to do with memory Mar 19 23:53:44 i've got a major psychotic hatred of microsoft again Mar 19 23:53:50 lol Mar 19 23:54:19 luke-jr, i didn't try meego because i lack sdhc card Mar 19 23:54:29 o Mar 19 23:54:43 :) Mar 19 23:55:05 indeed.. it sucks alot Mar 19 23:55:14 "a lot" Mar 19 23:55:33 indeed Mar 19 23:56:01 oh i meant ms actually :) Mar 19 23:56:19 damn Mar 19 23:56:33 my spidey sense is tingling on getting an alienware m11 Mar 19 23:56:39 what a little beast Mar 19 23:59:06 Macer, I thought you might get some activity on your extraterrestrial beacon detector rather than spidey sense for Alienware Mar 19 23:59:17 Hmm - Dell ate them. Mar 20 00:00:55 http://tinyurl.com/6edp882 lol what?! Mar 20 00:01:58 compengi: please don't post uncommented random URLs Mar 20 00:02:29 DocScrutinizer, ok Mar 20 00:02:38 compengi: esp don't post tinyurl, as it doesn't give a friggin clue ehat the original site is all about Mar 20 00:02:56 should i use full url? Mar 20 00:03:07 usually yes Mar 20 00:03:22 okay :) Mar 20 00:03:31 Mmmm. Extraterrestrial bacon. Mar 20 00:03:33 compengi's link is a Nokia 32GB SD card thats $156 dollars. Mar 20 00:03:41 as long as it's not like 755 chars Mar 20 00:04:58 Termana, yeah.. is that normal? Mar 20 00:05:00 :D Mar 20 00:05:59 compengi, depending on what class it is Mar 20 00:07:20 Seems about right, but I haven't brought a 32GB microsd card in a while Mar 20 00:09:53 wow, such prices Mar 20 00:10:36 a 16GB regular SDHC card is $20 Mar 20 00:10:52 32 is more Mar 20 00:11:10 yea, only 2x the capacity but more than 2x the price Mar 20 00:11:34 Looking on ebay, about $65 Mar 20 00:11:39 which seems about right Mar 20 00:11:44 higher cap is harder tomake Mar 20 00:12:48 lol ... im imagining you as a apple iphone user that has the 32GB version and trying to justify the price Mar 20 00:13:03 "its harder to make" Mar 20 00:13:27 It is. Mar 20 00:13:50 The individual chips that go into making the 32G SD are newer tech. Mar 20 00:14:02 They laminate 9 or so chips on top of each other. Mar 20 00:14:06 is pratchett.freenode.net particularly laggy? Mar 20 00:14:15 And bond them all together. And stick them inside a microSD Mar 20 00:14:35 you are pinging a bit slowly. Mar 20 00:14:51 hmm, slowly like 30s RTT? Mar 20 00:15:10 naah - 1s Mar 20 00:15:22 laggy as in, when I ping it, it gives no response Mar 20 00:15:31 DocScrutinizer, i have you on 0.27 second(s) Mar 20 00:15:33 hmm - variable. Mar 20 00:15:36 0-3s Mar 20 00:15:41 packet loss? Mar 20 00:16:25 donno, something fishy. sometimes lags of 10..30s, most of time 72ms Mar 20 00:17:23 * DocScrutinizer enters admin op mode Mar 20 00:18:25 Channel operators, users in disguise Mar 20 00:18:54 Do you also deop when I say "Autobots fall in"? Mar 20 00:21:24 * SpeedEvil rofls. Mar 20 00:21:27 http://apple.slashdot.org/story/11/03/19/2241226/Apples-App-Store-Accepts-Gay-Cure-App Mar 20 00:21:35 Funny on so many levels. Mar 20 00:24:38 lol Mar 20 00:25:29 lol SpeedEvil Mar 20 00:30:47 lol Mar 20 00:37:37 Termana: admin of my friggin router and LAN, not op of this chan Mar 20 00:37:59 *sigh* bbl Mar 20 01:20:02 ~botsnack Mar 20 01:20:03 DocScrutinizer: aw, gee Mar 20 01:27:54 it's embarrassing to fix spooky LAN issues by powercycling the router and WLAN AP Mar 20 01:50:28 DocScrutinizer: I've found the Maemo kernels to be annoyingly broken Mar 20 01:50:38 with regard to networking Mar 20 02:18:30 helloooooooooooooo Mar 20 02:20:14 UcefKH: WAT Mar 20 02:21:13 question: is it normal for the n900 battery to only last a few hours after moderate use? Mar 20 02:21:34 sleepee_: depends on 'moderate' Mar 20 02:21:39 a few hours as in 5-8 hours Mar 20 02:21:45 if you had it online, sure Mar 20 02:22:28 well yea... i was browsing the web some... and i had im accounts online... and i think my email syncs every 30 mins or so.. Mar 20 02:22:39 and i had bluetooth on.. Mar 20 02:22:42 lol Mar 20 02:22:43 definitely Mar 20 02:22:45 lol.. Mar 20 02:22:49 you're lucky it lasted 5-8 Mar 20 02:22:53 that ain't moderate Mar 20 02:23:05 it's heavy Mar 20 02:23:34 really?? my friend has an iphone and his battery lasts a lot longer... Mar 20 02:24:08 and he's always online, constantly talking, cehcking facebook... Mar 20 02:24:44 hmm.... oh well.. guess i'll have to buy a car charger Mar 20 02:48:13 sleepee_, iPhone cheats. Mar 20 02:48:29 Doesn't have real multitasking **** ENDING LOGGING AT Sun Mar 20 02:59:57 2011