**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sun Apr 10 02:59:58 2011 Apr 10 03:13:33 Jaffa, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=873Ig7-wS9Q - maybe you should add it to news, monodev on n900 Apr 10 03:21:22 Halo fellow Maemoian's Apr 10 06:09:34 what is flash sms? Apr 10 06:29:44 Meanwhile: http://www.globescan.com/news_archives/radar10w2_free_market/ Apr 10 08:28:42 woooooooof Apr 10 08:29:49 hey alterego :) Apr 10 08:30:22 Hey :) Apr 10 08:30:30 h Apr 10 08:30:38 Having a good weekend? Apr 10 08:32:03 sure. spent yesterday mostly with sleeping :P Apr 10 08:32:24 alterego, do you wanna have some C++0x fun? I've been experimenting with something interesting. Apr 10 08:35:26 Oh yeah, what's that? Apr 10 08:35:56 I've been experimenting with something interesting in qml over the past couple of days actually :) Apr 10 08:39:46 alterego, I've implemented Queryable class that can spare me some code Apr 10 08:39:57 alterego, for a small demonstration, check this: http://pastebin.com/adpfkCqB Apr 10 08:40:55 alterego, lambdas ROCK! :) Apr 10 08:41:49 That is cool :) Apr 10 08:42:13 And yes, lamdbas are awesome, I didn't know they were in C++ yet. Apr 10 08:43:35 alterego, well, they are not (yet), but C++0x has them. and C++0x has just been finalized, and fortunately GCC already supports some of it :) Apr 10 08:44:17 Cool Apr 10 08:44:25 there is only one downside to this all Apr 10 08:45:01 ? Apr 10 08:45:03 Qt Creator chokes on lambdas. http://bugreports.qt.nokia.com/browse/QTCREATORBUG-4439 Apr 10 08:45:45 Heh Apr 10 08:46:15 so the code compiles (even when I use Qt Creator), it just underlines the lines with lambdas and it also breaks the auto-indent functionality Apr 10 08:46:49 Yeah, Apr 10 08:47:56 Well, I've been playing with auto UI generation. Apr 10 08:48:12 here is the implementation of Queryable: http://pastebin.com/tZdkJQCd what do you think about it? Apr 10 08:48:21 what's auto UI generation? :) Apr 10 08:50:07 Well, right now all I'm doing is automatically populating cotext menus. Basically you have a type registry whkch contains references to types like "Person" or "GeoCoordinate" Apr 10 08:50:53 sounds nice Apr 10 08:51:19 Which are associated to actions, so when you have a listview or any view that shows different types of data, the UI can say: when this item is selected, show these options, when that item is selected show those options. Apr 10 08:51:39 So it's a sort of semantic context menu generator at the moment. Apr 10 08:52:30 that's good Apr 10 08:53:24 at first, from the sounds of it, I thought it will be something that generates a form from the metadata of a model class Apr 10 08:54:06 but this is cool too :) Apr 10 08:54:20 I wanted to do it so Columbus could have plugins that add actions to a types context menu. For instance, I have a plugin that allows you to open your current location in google maps, what this will allow the plugin to do is extend the UI and allow me to open any kind of "location" in google maps practically free. Apr 10 08:54:44 now that's _very_ cool :) Apr 10 11:41:38 This is good: http://info.ee.surrey.ac.uk/Personal/Z.Kalal/tld.html Apr 10 11:41:39 :) Apr 10 11:45:53 good morning Apr 10 11:56:03 alterego: Unable to flash firmware yesterday. :( DocScrutinizer stayed up late trying to help me. Apr 10 11:56:37 kwtm: :( Apr 10 11:56:52 kwtm: can you give me a summary of what your issues were? Apr 10 11:56:57 s/were/are/ :) Apr 10 11:57:17 DocScrutinizer: is very capable, I doubt I'll be able to add anything more to what he suggested though Apr 10 11:57:43 alterego: Sure. This is what we tried. So, first off, I've flashed about 7 times before. This was about a year ago. No problem each time. This time, what happened was: Apr 10 11:58:23 Oh, and I used the same script from last time that I wrote, just to make sure I wasn't mnissing any steps and I could go over and make sure there were no typos. This is the same script that successfully flashed last year. Apr 10 11:58:49 m'hmm Apr 10 11:58:57 I started flasher program; it said "waiting for USB" (not exact words --you know what I mean) --- and then I connected while holding down U key. Apr 10 11:59:51 Then it said "USB found " and then about 4 more lines of output, and then it said again "waiting for USB " and then it just hung, and would not flash. The N900 screen had the Nokia logo but no backlight, and the USB icon appeared in the upper right, but then disappeared. Apr 10 11:59:54 This is an N900 right? Apr 10 12:00:15 This is my 3rd N900, yes. This is what we eliminated: Apr 10 12:00:33 it wasn't from my patching the Vanilla eMMC image since I also tried to flash the unmodified image. Apr 10 12:00:56 it wasn't a battery problem or a USB cable problem since, amazingly, I could flash the firmware with no problem ... but not the eMMC. (???!?!?) Apr 10 12:01:05 Heh Apr 10 12:01:33 it was not an "order of execution" thing since we tried different orders of firmware first then eMMC or vice versa, or even just only doing the eMMC. Apr 10 12:01:47 Yeah Apr 10 12:01:57 We tried the "absolutely safe" way of doing it by first removing battery, then plugging in USB cable, then holding down U key, then inserting battery. Apr 10 12:02:13 I don't bother with the 'u' key to be honest. Apr 10 12:02:18 Just turning it on works for me. Apr 10 12:02:34 Did you try that? Apr 10 12:02:35 So, anyway, I am astounded that everything went so smoothly last year and now this doesn't work. Apr 10 12:02:45 alterego: Of course I tried that. :P Apr 10 12:02:54 So you're using Linux as the host OS presumably? Apr 10 12:03:07 I can only think of one thing but I was just too exhausted to try any more. Apr 10 12:03:32 Yes, I'm using Linux. Oh, yes, and we eliminated the cdc_phonet and *phonet modules as a problem since I unloaded those and blacklisted them. Apr 10 12:04:04 Those shouldn't be a problem, the OS shouldn't even be getting that far for flashing. Apr 10 12:04:16 What version of Linux are you using? Apr 10 12:04:54 s/version/dist/ :) Apr 10 12:05:16 So the only thing I can think of are two: the eMMC firmware image, which is the same as what I got last year (so I didn't download a new copy yesterday) does not work with PR 1.3 (I've been using PR 1.2 up to now). Or ... there is a new eMMC firmware image they've put up, but it has the EXACT SAME filename (including the version number embedded into the filename). Apr 10 12:05:25 Kubuntu 10.04 (long-term-support edition) Apr 10 12:05:58 I'm pretty certain the image isn't a problem, as it doesn't even seem to be getting that far. Apr 10 12:06:17 You could always check the checksum though of your vanilla emmc download. Apr 10 12:17:48 kwtm: emmc is same Apr 10 12:18:56 jacekowski: That's what I thought. The ONLY other thing I can think of is ... somehow Ubuntu changed, so that the flasher program doesn't work correctly any more. :P Apr 10 12:19:32 kwtm: what is the error message you get? Apr 10 12:19:34 It's a very attractive option since one no longer needs to check if the problem is at Nokia's end, but somehow I doubt it. Apr 10 12:19:39 kwtm: I think it wouldn't flash rootfs if there was some inherent problem with ubuntu+flasher Apr 10 12:19:42 jacekowski: Let me call up the previous paste .. Apr 10 12:19:46 alterego: True. Apr 10 12:21:48 jacekowski: I think I erased my copyscreen. Anyway, there was no error message, just a "No suitable USB device found, waiting." message. Note that this is the SECOND message; there is a first such message just before I plug in, and then when I plug in the USB, it immediately says ... whatever it's supposed to say, about 4 lines of output, something like "Found USB device at address xxx bus xxx \n Now doing whatever \n ... \n No Apr 10 12:21:49 suitable USB device found, waiting." Apr 10 12:22:12 kwtm: hmm, are you on windows? Apr 10 12:22:26 either DocScrutinizer or nox- was saying, "looks like it decided to boot up into kernel mode" or something --the USB icon did disappear. Apr 10 12:22:36 [05:04] Kubuntu 10.04 (long-term-support edition) Apr 10 12:23:59 kwtm: did you check the checksum Apr 10 12:24:21 alterego: No, I did not. I flashed this same image last year, though, and it worked. Apr 10 12:25:04 I'd check to be sure Apr 10 12:25:21 tablets-dev has a list of md5 and sha checksums Apr 10 13:17:04 hi ;) Apr 10 13:27:37 huhu Apr 10 14:20:34 pupnik_ ping Apr 10 14:56:06 Northrop Grumman said they successfully tested for the first time an on-board laser defense system known as the Maritime Laser Demonstrator (MLD), using it to destroy a small target vessel. Apr 10 14:56:21 The test actually accomplished several other benchmarks, including integrating MLD with a ship's radar and navigation system, and firing an electric laser weapon from a moving platform at-sea in a humid environment. Apr 10 14:58:12 * DocScrutinizer pets his MTHELs Apr 10 14:59:36 Ok, the target was basically a dinghy boat Apr 10 15:01:13 And the good engineers have been sawing it for a while before it blew up: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=awsQs4ct0c4 Apr 10 15:02:57 Looks like Elite/Frontier were pretty much on target in terms of required laser burn times, except that no shielding will be required =) Apr 10 15:05:47 kwtm missed to mention he always started flasher via a script he wrote. Just for completeness of the testbed description... Apr 10 15:07:57 Hah Apr 10 15:33:06 alterego: indeed. I asked him to start that single cmdline via direct entry to a shell, but he was reluctant. Apr 10 15:33:18 :) Apr 10 15:33:52 I'd be interested to see if he did the checksum Apr 10 15:34:10 that as well Apr 10 15:34:11 Have"t heard anything from him in a while, it is a very curious issue .. Apr 10 15:35:39 I'll not help in *anything* further investigation, than just >>download fresh VANILLA, start flasher cmd via cmdline and c&p that very line here for scrutinizing<< Apr 10 15:36:27 oh, I missed >>boot PC<< Apr 10 15:37:35 :D Apr 10 15:37:40 I don't think any modules on PC are irrelevant, as even ROM BL enumerates Apr 10 15:38:25 *might* result in udev loading whatever freaky kernel module that spoils the show Apr 10 15:38:29 Well he seemed to say that rootfs flashed fine Apr 10 15:38:35 yep Apr 10 15:38:42 it did Apr 10 15:39:11 you two familiar with OneNAND's error blocks? are they critical if found to have errors when the device is booted? (N900) Apr 10 15:39:14 but that's been like 6 tries, with random rmmod in between Apr 10 15:39:29 hurp, starting to feel a bit chilly now, might have to grab a jumper. Apr 10 15:40:16 psycho_oreos: error blocks of NAND are a really tricky thing Apr 10 15:41:03 sure they must not have errors, but then they never get written, except when "formatting" the NAND Apr 10 15:41:06 is there a way to install coreutils without killing the os? Apr 10 15:41:23 BigWookie: coreutils-gnu, works fine Apr 10 15:42:06 head->table, thanks :) Apr 10 15:43:23 psycho_oreos: you're interested in links with details about OBB error blocks etc? Apr 10 15:54:54 http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/NAND_bad_blocks Apr 10 15:57:14 (NB the incredible PaulFertser and SpeedEvil contributed to that page as well) Apr 10 15:59:08 great paper: http://www.ccs.neu.edu/home/pjd/papers/fast10-flash.pdf Apr 10 16:06:14 DocScrutinizer: i thought the NAND controller would handle bad blocks transparently Apr 10 16:06:14 pupnik_: nope, you mean the SD controller Apr 10 16:06:21 ahh Apr 10 16:06:57 widespread misconception about NAND Apr 10 16:07:44 jffs/ubifs are exactly about emulating that controller on plain dumb NAND like the 256MB on SoC Apr 10 16:09:34 finally back home Apr 10 16:09:35 * SpeedEvil wishes he could program the processor on microSDs. Apr 10 16:10:01 Heh Apr 10 16:11:06 SpeedEvil: you *can* "program the processor" of oneNAND though ;-) Apr 10 16:11:53 Well - yes. Apr 10 16:12:14 * DocScrutinizer wonders if you could _bypass_ the processor of SD cards Apr 10 16:12:21 no Apr 10 16:12:54 never say never! Apr 10 16:13:06 there might be undocumented service cmds Apr 10 16:13:21 of course highly proprietary Apr 10 16:14:41 hell, there might even be a flashing romcode option for the controller, but you'd need a helluvalot of non-disclosed papers to exploit that Apr 10 16:14:43 no such thing even in command set extensions Apr 10 16:14:59 and I think the command set has been designed to avoid possible buffer overflows Apr 10 16:17:03 I'm even quite sure each controller has its own set of fab QA cmds, to access certain "direct" functions to verify certain quality standards of the flash chip Apr 10 16:17:57 hmm Apr 10 16:18:11 http://www.flickr.com/photos/flight404/4350866500/in/photostream/ Visualization of forces generated by subatomic interaction Apr 10 16:21:15 Dunno, if it does, probably requires a different hw connection Apr 10 16:21:35 yeah, quite probably Apr 10 16:28:18 Maybe SPI mode, which all cards have to support by the standard, but few people actually use Apr 10 16:28:18 at least that's what I would do, to ensure nobody (runaway prog) nukes the card Apr 10 16:28:18 I'd go for nonstandard logic levels, like "rise VDD to nominal+15%" Apr 10 16:28:19 BTW, you can make host quickly run through all possible commands (512 - known ones) and see if you get any positive responses Apr 10 16:28:19 as each interface knows how to SPI as well Apr 10 16:28:19 anyone knows if meego has got a build in updater? Apr 10 16:28:19 RST38h: you bet that's some cmd sequence like "write 47 to 11, then write 11 to 47" - hard to find with a simple scan Apr 10 16:28:19 What would be awesome would be some generalised API to access theNAND raw. Apr 10 16:28:19 sorry, user_ is on my ignorelist Apr 10 16:28:20 user_ told too much nonsense yesterday Apr 10 16:28:20 SpeedEvil: exactly Apr 10 16:32:53 Adrian Hands was suffering from ALS and had lost motor skills when he used his legs to type in Morse code and fix a 9-year-old bug in Gnome. The patch was submitted three days before he passed away. Apr 10 16:37:11 Qt 4.7.2 seems to be working fine Apr 10 16:38:06 have they fixed the locale bug? Apr 10 16:38:29 where it looked at the secondary keyboard language to guess the locale? Apr 10 16:40:09 RST38h, hm, how do I test that? Apr 10 16:42:59 they did WHAT?! Apr 10 16:43:09 Set secondary language to something non-English, then run a localized Qt app, like Qthello Apr 10 16:43:13 muhahaha, a funny idea Apr 10 16:43:28 In my case, Qthello comes up with Russian menus and cues Apr 10 16:43:52 Even though the only "Russian" setting I have is the secondary keyboard language Apr 10 16:44:27 "No, no I don't know whether that book is 'downloadable'. . . ." Apr 10 16:44:29 :-P Apr 10 16:45:11 GAN900: You might enjoy that British "Black Books"soap Apr 10 16:45:58 "Computer? What computer? To your knees! Here we have the Musical History section. Search!" Apr 10 16:46:29 Haha Apr 10 16:46:57 Poor guy crawled out of woodwork two episodes later,with a book in his hands, weeping "I found it, found it!" Apr 10 17:05:11 hey all Apr 10 17:05:39 could anyone suggest me how do I check the call_status of the incoming call Apr 10 17:07:52 using dbus-python methods Apr 10 17:08:53 dunno Apr 10 17:09:45 what happened to lcuk :( Apr 10 17:12:37 Dunno, think he's on holiday? Apr 10 17:19:33 is anybody having trouble with audo boost? Apr 10 17:20:51 * alterego wonders what tha is. Apr 10 17:20:53 s/tha/that/ Apr 10 17:22:06 What's the flowchart symbol for an interrupt? Apr 10 17:22:58 Flowcharting home automation stuff, have a routine that turns on the lights in the room if there's motion detected. Apr 10 17:23:22 Terminator usually. Apr 10 17:24:13 Like a starting point but intersecting a workflow. Apr 10 17:24:23 As it's basically just another process flow. Apr 10 17:24:41 But I need to set it up so turning on one of the switches will kill the countdown timer. Apr 10 17:24:51 Ah, OK. Apr 10 17:27:07 * GAN900 refrains from attempted stabbings today. Apr 10 17:27:16 What phase is the moon this week. . . . Apr 10 17:28:11 Today is Setting Orange, the 27th day of Discord in the YOLD 3177 Apr 10 17:32:58 DocScrutinizer, thanks for the link, going to have a good read at it now :) Apr 10 17:33:14 hmm Apr 10 17:33:37 FAT32 can't preserve permissions right? Apr 10 17:34:20 Nope. Apr 10 17:34:34 * SpeedEvil wonders about permissions hack over fat layers. Apr 10 17:34:39 * SpeedEvil forgets the names. Apr 10 17:34:54 To layer unix permissions over fat files. Apr 10 17:34:58 Popular back inthe day. Apr 10 17:35:29 * MohammadAG ponders getting a 1TB HDD Apr 10 17:35:47 SpeedEvil: umsdos? Apr 10 17:35:55 SpeedEvil, Discord sounds about right. Apr 10 17:36:03 hagbard: Sounds familiar. Apr 10 17:36:06 SpeedEvil: Hi, I just joined the channel, just got a hand-me-down n900 from my dad. Apr 10 17:36:06 if only Sony could get ext3 in the PS3's kernel Apr 10 17:36:11 then I wouldn't need vfat :/ Apr 10 17:36:16 MohammadAG, like the Caviar black. Apr 10 17:36:31 GAN900, external actually Apr 10 17:36:34 hagbard: Congratulations! Or commiserations. Apr 10 17:36:49 I like it so far. Apr 10 17:37:13 congrats hagbard Apr 10 17:37:49 just curious what the developer-intended pc-connectivity manager is meant to do? Apr 10 17:38:14 easy ssh over USB I think Apr 10 17:38:17 USB networking Apr 10 17:38:35 ahh, so I don't need to ifconfig usb0 on the phone manually. Excellent. Apr 10 17:38:49 I don't use it anyway Apr 10 17:38:59 just added ifup usb0 to pcsuite-enable.sh Apr 10 17:39:28 that way when I click PC Suite mode when I plug in the USB, it sets it up automatically Apr 10 17:42:12 Noice Apr 10 17:51:42 achipa, Qt 4.8 isn't out yet right? Apr 10 17:52:04 Heh Apr 10 17:52:08 No, it's not out yet. Apr 10 17:52:48 and 4.7.4? :P Apr 10 18:04:53 ~ping Apr 10 18:04:54 ~pong Apr 10 18:07:24 FBI Releases Document Confirming Roswell UFO Apr 10 18:09:21 http://vault.fbi.gov/hottel_guy/Guy%20Hottel%20Part%201%20of%201/view Apr 10 18:10:54 cd .. Apr 10 18:10:56 oops Apr 10 18:11:11 Stale NFS handle. Apr 10 18:11:45 kill -11 1 Apr 10 18:11:46 RST38h: read that Apr 10 18:12:27 RST38h: "an investigator said" then it attributes it to an informant Apr 10 18:12:34 RST38h: this , at best, is hearsay Apr 10 18:13:19 opsie sorry Apr 10 18:13:26 RST38h: if you answered i did not see **** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sun Apr 10 18:20:31 2011 Apr 10 18:45:13 Hi Apr 10 18:50:45 moo Apr 10 18:51:03 huh? Apr 10 18:51:10 moo = hi Apr 10 18:51:35 Oh... but that's the way cows talk eachother. Not humans Apr 10 18:51:44 I guess. Apr 10 18:53:33 the content is similar Apr 10 19:00:26 Making a theme for Maemo is harder than to S60 devices :\ Apr 10 19:02:00 I heard it was easier :P Apr 10 19:02:15 Not for me, :( Apr 10 19:02:19 Maybe you're doing it wrong :D Apr 10 19:02:22 RiD: You mean, you are not a cow? Apr 10 19:02:36 You could ask on the forum for some tips? :) Apr 10 19:02:57 I'm a shy guy! Apr 10 19:05:08 But at least we have theming, something Android can only have with custom ROMs. Apr 10 19:06:08 THE IMPOSTOR! STOMP HIM! CHEW ON HIM! =) Apr 10 19:06:33 Ahem? Apr 10 19:06:38 :) Apr 10 19:10:44 you using any utilities to make themeing easier RiD ? Apr 10 19:11:24 pupnik: Stskeeps hildon theme example with MADDE Apr 10 19:12:27 pupnik: but i understand nothing of MADDE, so i'm reading "http://wiki.maemo.org/MADDE/Theme_building/" Apr 10 19:12:49 kk Apr 10 19:15:03 pupnik: it says to run try_it_out.sh via madde terminal, i already cd to the right place but what's the command to run it? (I'm a complete n00b when it comes to that kind of stuff) Apr 10 19:15:37 What? I need a Windows to install the CSSU? Apr 10 19:15:57 No, you can install it via the phone. Apr 10 19:16:31 My Phone just told me I should use the Nokia PC Suite. Apr 10 19:16:52 Err, then you did something wrong or the phone is trying to piss you off. Apr 10 19:17:04 Probably both Apr 10 19:17:04 game is slowly becoming playable :D Apr 10 19:22:45 * Treibholz threatens his n900, that he buys an Android-Phone tomorrow! Apr 10 19:23:10 N900 will surely start working properly, Treibholz. Apr 10 19:23:29 no, it still wants to be connected to Nokia PC Suite to install the CSSU Apr 10 19:27:34 then something's conflicting Apr 10 19:27:43 try apt-get upgrade Apr 10 19:28:03 yeah i easily sovled it with disabling some repos and remove some conflicting packages Apr 10 19:28:04 alterego, any ideas if QtM is backwards compatible? Apr 10 19:28:19 (if I push 1.1, would that break 1.0 apps?) Apr 10 19:29:49 I guess try and see. Apr 10 19:29:53 It probably will though Apr 10 19:30:13 I'd discuss it with the council, it would be goot to upgrade. Apr 10 19:30:26 But we'd need extras builder to build everything that depends on it again. Apr 10 19:30:52 alterego, that'd force everyone to use the CSSU though Apr 10 19:31:06 Yeah, good point. Apr 10 19:31:07 so it's not the same as Qt then... Apr 10 19:31:14 Well, I don't know. Apr 10 19:31:16 Give it a go. Apr 10 19:31:19 Qt 4.7.2 doesn't break 4.7.0 Apr 10 19:31:27 that's why it's going in the CSSU Apr 10 19:31:42 Yeah, but 1.0 to 1.1 4.6 to 4.7 Apr 10 19:31:54 +is like Apr 10 19:32:18 "dpkg-buildpackage: error: unable to determne source changed by ~/hildon-theme-exam.............." . Does anyone knows something about theming here? Apr 10 19:32:54 alterego, 4.6.2 apps worked with 4.7 Apr 10 19:33:28 Well, like I said, try it :P Apr 10 19:36:14 bbl Apr 10 19:37:08 Aah, this is giving me a headache. I'll try it out later Apr 10 19:54:14 I nominate "you need to use NokiaSuite to flash" for the worst most misleading error message of the last 3 years Apr 10 19:54:33 congrats, Nokia Apr 10 19:55:05 The nominee surely has my vote! Apr 10 19:55:13 DocScrutinizer: does nokiasuite even flash? Apr 10 19:55:44 nfc, how can I know, with not any redmond product on my IT equipment? Apr 10 19:56:26 maybe you might have had some virtual machine with it Apr 10 19:56:40 i can't tell either, that's why i asked Apr 10 19:58:20 it can Apr 10 19:58:47 hmm, dist-upgrade wants to install upstart? Apr 10 19:58:53 is that normal? Apr 10 19:59:15 ~MohammadAG Apr 10 19:59:16 [mohammadag] your father Apr 10 19:59:20 :D Apr 10 20:06:27 Treibholz: well, upstart should be already installed Apr 10 20:08:23 MohammadAG: it will be a long while before 4.8, 4.7.4 is closer but still not exactly tomorrow Apr 10 20:11:22 MohammadAG: qtm 1.1 shouldn't break 1.0 apps, but be careful with the packaging as there are extra modules, changes in the plugins, etc Apr 10 20:17:58 Hello, can anybody recommend a linux video editing tool for videos taken from the N900? Apr 10 20:18:16 jacekowski: http://paste.debian.net/113618/ Apr 10 20:18:37 rd: audacity? Apr 10 20:19:09 Treibholz: it's just dependencies problem Apr 10 20:19:19 Treibholz: that new version can't be installed because of that Apr 10 20:19:37 try apt-get upgrade first Apr 10 20:19:46 jacekowski: i already did Apr 10 20:20:05 then you can do it hardcore way Apr 10 20:20:07 Treibholz: thanks, will try it. Apr 10 20:20:17 which is forcing dpkg to remove conflicting packages Apr 10 20:20:25 and then upgrade whatever you can Apr 10 20:20:33 and then install upstart again Apr 10 20:20:45 but if for whatevr reason your phone reboots while doing that Apr 10 20:20:52 you will have to flash Apr 10 20:20:56 keep in mind if the battery runs out without upstart installed... Apr 10 20:21:03 nevermind :P Apr 10 20:21:53 hmm, my busybox is 3:1.10.2.legal-1osso Apr 10 20:22:09 3:1.10.2.legal-1osso is >= 3:1.6.1.legal-1osso8 Apr 10 20:23:49 audacity does not even open the n900 videos for me Apr 10 20:25:01 none of the importers supports the file format (using debian and debian-multimedia.org) Apr 10 20:27:02 ~moo Apr 10 20:27:02 * infobot mooooooooo! I am cow, hear me moo, I weigh twice as much as you. I am cow, eating grass, methane gas comes out my ass Apr 10 20:31:34 rd: I heard audacity is mainly for audio. Might have changed, but... Apr 10 20:32:43 not saying it's easy to playback those friggin videos on a regular desktop linux Apr 10 20:33:20 rd: audacity is an audio editor ... avidemux is quite good for cutting sections Apr 10 20:33:56 http://www.openshotvideo.com/ is supposed to be good Apr 10 20:37:14 hmm.....I tried avidemux before, but often in the result sound and video were out of sync Apr 10 20:37:16 rd: sorry, I mixed avidemux and audacity. Apr 10 20:37:46 avidemux has good sound/video resync ability .... one reason I like it :) Apr 10 20:38:40 lbt, ok let me make a quick test again. Apr 10 20:38:49 it has an adjuster Apr 10 20:39:36 .... tick the 'shift' checkbox and select the audio offset Apr 10 20:48:19 lbt, how do you save the created video? Apr 10 20:48:37 do you give the same extension (mp4)? Apr 10 20:50:39 For me the sound on the saved video is too fast. Apr 10 20:50:47 yes - you may need to do some research on codecs vs containers Apr 10 20:50:51 (when I play the saved video with player) Apr 10 20:55:16 Do you have an idea where I configure that? Did you change something in the setting to make it working for you? Apr 10 20:56:50 no, it just works Apr 10 20:59:53 just tested and my sound is fast too Apr 10 21:01:24 rd: go to audio/build VBR time map Apr 10 21:01:43 should sort it out Apr 10 21:02:38 wow, cool, indeed that fixes the problem. Apr 10 21:02:51 \o/ Apr 10 21:03:14 we've used it for years to trim adverts out of TV shows which we save to DVD Apr 10 21:03:59 it's brilliant at that... but you can't shuffle sements and it's hard (start again!) to edit them once you've cut a bit Apr 10 21:04:18 openshot is looking like a real player though ... Apr 10 21:04:39 but avidemux handles lots of formats Apr 10 21:13:50 * DocScrutinizer << bored Apr 10 21:19:15 can someone point me back to where in the wiki it says where to change CSS definitions so my SMS message display has a larger font size? Google seems to be throwing off all sorts of red herrings today. Apr 10 21:24:31 tmo Apr 10 21:25:38 somewhere next to http://blog.dawid.lorenz.co/2010/05/disabling-smiley-icons-in-conversations_171.html maybe Apr 10 21:56:53 I found the one I had seen before; there may have been others. If anyone's interested and/or logging this, I got it at http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=48872 Apr 10 21:57:07 thx anyway though. Apr 10 22:03:55 Where are the system fonts stored? I want to change font settings on /usr/share/themes/default/gtk-2.0/gtkrc but I want to make sure the font sizes exist. Apr 10 22:06:46 is this a good place to ask aobut the hildon-desktop? Apr 10 22:08:04 i want more ssu updates Apr 10 22:15:21 newbie007: there is likely no other place at least Apr 10 22:33:22 hey. there is no "plugin.default_plugin_disabled" in firefox's about:config in order to enable flash Apr 10 22:33:37 how can I not find it? Apr 10 22:51:41 is anyone using Mumble on N900? Apr 10 22:52:11 I know it's not being developed or anything, but I was wondering if someone's had problems being able to speak and been able to fix it Apr 10 22:52:34 I installed it from extras-devel so I think all the dependencies are also installed Apr 10 23:03:18 Can a supposedly fake battery act as an original nokia battery the first 3-5 chargers and then become like a 3 year old used one? Apr 10 23:05:31 Probably Apr 10 23:05:39 If it's a crap battery :) Apr 10 23:07:10 But it looks exactly like an original one Apr 10 23:07:17 And the first chargers.. really good! Apr 10 23:07:26 argh, same typo twice. charges* Apr 10 23:13:08 vldcnst, did you reboot at any point? Apr 10 23:13:24 ShadowJK: it's not a battery management issue. Apr 10 23:14:06 ShadowJK: been running powertop regularly Apr 10 23:15:32 If the copy battery used a 100k@20C thermistor instead of a plain resistor, if you reboot with a warm battery, the charge metering thinks the battery is much smaller than it is, and might tell you fairy tales Apr 10 23:16:19 on the other hand, if you replace the most expensive materials in an actual battery cell, you get one that wears out in 5-10 cycles... Apr 10 23:16:28 ShadowJK Apr 10 23:16:41 ShadowJK: the battery was bought from an official nokia shop.. that's what makes it strange Apr 10 23:16:46 but ive only ever heard of that being done by ghost shifts making cylindrical cells Apr 10 23:17:39 ShadowJK: on normal usage, first cycles I was getting about 1 day. now it's about 2 hours, with powertop showing 250 wakeups in idle and everything except 2G gsm on Apr 10 23:18:16 hal-device bme | grep reporting.design Apr 10 23:18:52 1264 Apr 10 23:18:59 seems ok Apr 10 23:19:08 get ShadowJK 's bq27200.sh script Apr 10 23:20:59 vldcnst, are you able to use terminal/shell? Apr 10 23:21:19 I bet the problem is unrelated to battery at large Apr 10 23:21:45 powertop doesn't tell about all the possible powerhogs Apr 10 23:22:02 ShadowJK: yes Apr 10 23:22:11 DocScrutinizer: using the older, original battery, usage is normal Apr 10 23:22:14 Yeah, something using 100% cpu doesn't show up in powertop Apr 10 23:22:25 1day or more. Apr 10 23:22:30 so it's specific to this battery Apr 10 23:22:37 GSM pings also don't show up Apr 10 23:22:43 http://enivax.net/jk/n900/bq27200.sh http://enivax.net/jk/n900/i2cget Apr 10 23:22:44 GPRS* Apr 10 23:23:02 I have those in /root/ as you need root to use it anyway Apr 10 23:23:44 that's why you call it like ./bq27200.sh :-) Apr 10 23:24:27 chmod +x on them, './bq27200.sh' for a datadump, pastebin.com that for us. './bq27200.sh 5' to get a vmstst-like output one line every second (the fastest the hw updates) Apr 10 23:24:37 one lihe every 5 seconds* Apr 10 23:24:41 line* Apr 10 23:27:33 so you'd like the latter? Apr 10 23:28:05 Well, both. First do the plain './bq27200.sh' dump Apr 10 23:29:45 ShadowJK: http://pastebin.com/rmDMSg6F Apr 10 23:30:17 looks like that, for an example Apr 10 23:30:19 (it went into idle for a few times) Apr 10 23:30:19 http://wiki.maemo.org/User:Joerg_rw/jrbme/bme_chargefloat_log Apr 10 23:31:24 idle consumption looks good Apr 10 23:32:46 yep Apr 10 23:33:07 10h til empty Apr 10 23:33:19 normal with screen on Apr 10 23:34:03 18 23 19 19 also sane Apr 10 23:34:47 Cycle Count since Learning: 95 Total Cycle Count since last full reset: 95 Apr 10 23:34:50 o.O Apr 10 23:34:55 So if you had it fully charged since last empty, you're at about 584 mAh remaining, (though shutdown happens at about 50-100mA left, and low battery warning comes before that) Apr 10 23:35:10 DocScrutinizer: does that mean it was charged 95 times? Apr 10 23:35:26 584 remaining assuming 1200mAh battery Apr 10 23:35:33 that measn chip in phone didn't reset since 95 charges Apr 10 23:35:51 can't seem to resolve repository.maemo.org in the sdk Apr 10 23:36:11 which means no installation of more -dev packages Apr 10 23:36:14 usually it's supposed to reset on battery out >10s or so Apr 10 23:36:14 ShadowJK: that seems about right Apr 10 23:36:14 narf Apr 10 23:36:18 Dhraakellian, find every resolv.conf and fix then Apr 10 23:36:42 DocScrutinizer: I just had it without a battery a few hours ago, for more than 2 minutes Apr 10 23:36:55 that's why o.O Apr 10 23:37:08 ShadowJK: *blink* Apr 10 23:37:19 DocScrutinizer51: I don't follow Apr 10 23:37:33 okay, I remembered to do that in the host system, but it totally didn't occur to me to do it within scratchbox Apr 10 23:37:37 thanks Apr 10 23:37:38 I was wondering how that can happen Apr 10 23:38:41 I gather you properly shut it down prior to swapping bat, and you didn't accidentally touch the powerbutton while bat out Apr 10 23:38:54 DocScrutinizer: proper shutdown, yes. Apr 10 23:40:10 still didn't work Apr 10 23:40:16 poking around a bit Apr 10 23:40:48 vldcnst, so the chip is uncalibrated. the NAC column shows remaining mAh. Because it's uncalibrated, it sets NAC to LMD (1956) on full battery, and counts down from there. Anyway, if you charge it full, start the script with logging ('./bq27200.sh 5 | tee /home/user/bq.log'), and use the phone until it normally shuts down on low/"empty" battery, you should be able to figure out how many mAh your battery has by examining the logfile Apr 10 23:41:23 Dhraakellian, I did find -name resolv.conf . or something Apr 10 23:41:31 there's a shitload of them :( Apr 10 23:41:42 and they get crapped on regulary :( Apr 10 23:43:23 ShadowJK: I did that (full cycle) a few days ago, when I got the battery. Would swapping batteries affect that calibration? Apr 10 23:43:37 No it never calibrates Apr 10 23:44:21 ShadowJK: not seeing anything Apr 10 23:44:44 do the find as root outside scratchbox Apr 10 23:45:08 In general, you need to stop BME and run till it a bit after it would normally shut off. Apr 10 23:45:13 For it to calibrate. Apr 10 23:45:36 And you need to repeat that about 4 times Apr 10 23:45:36 (There are other criteria - it has to be fully charged, and go to empty, and the temperature cannot be outside limits. Apr 10 23:45:55 ShadowJK: Only if initial capacity is over an eigth out. Apr 10 23:45:55 find / -name '*resolv*' Apr 10 23:46:08 SpeedEvil, which it is :P Apr 10 23:47:20 ShadowJK: could you change your script to print RS? Apr 10 23:47:46 it's 21 Apr 10 23:48:07 (Experimentally determined by ssirka's ampmeter) Apr 10 23:48:20 jig and ampmeter Apr 10 23:48:22 I didn't ask about size :-) Apr 10 23:48:40 I know where from we got that value Apr 10 23:49:13 I've been the one talking him into doing that Apr 10 23:50:23 vldcnst, so easiest is to look at last line in log that isn't 6% or less, and do 1956-NAC, and then multiply by 1.07 to get approximate battery capacity :p Apr 10 23:51:07 results will vary by 100mA or so depending on system load at point when bme decides to shutdown Apr 10 23:53:20 ShadowJK&Doc: thanks. will do some further testing Apr 10 23:53:26 Might even ask for a replacement battery Apr 10 23:53:28 np Apr 10 23:53:55 btw, 3800ish mV and approx 50% femaining look fine too Apr 10 23:54:23 yup Apr 10 23:54:33 the battery seems to be ok Apr 10 23:54:53 if this was guess-the-battery I'd say you were using the "good" battery Apr 10 23:55:03 exactly Apr 10 23:55:30 that's where I came from when looking at the cycle-count and found it at 98 Apr 10 23:56:11 I've only ever seen mine reset when it was sans battery for 2 month round-trip to nokia care ;p Apr 10 23:56:27 duh Apr 10 23:56:31 It was charged 3 hours ago to full Apr 10 23:56:47 And it's to 35%~ now, without any calls Apr 10 23:56:52 * DocScrutinizer off for checking sth regarding bupbat in schematics Apr 10 23:56:55 Only activated wifi to download the sh scripts Apr 10 23:57:21 I'vre only seen mine reset when I stop BME, and run it out Apr 10 23:58:41 mine doesn't reset even on that Apr 10 23:59:12 hmm, 150uF Apr 10 23:59:15 btw: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=65568&highlight=battery+mod+test (battery benchmarks, some mods, and a silly voltage-based abattery meter) Apr 11 00:00:39 Twitter needs threading. Apr 11 00:00:44 * GAN900 misses Jaiku. Apr 11 00:01:10 DocScrutinizer, is that the capacitor for bq27200? Apr 11 00:01:36 I think I've cleared out all the resolv.conf-ish files it's found so far... no luck still Apr 11 00:02:05 cleared out? Apr 11 00:02:37 You're supposed to make them say "nameserver 8.8.8.8" or something... Apr 11 00:02:59 ShadowJK: buffer on VBAT Apr 11 00:03:25 so yes, also the capacitor that powers bq27200 when bat is out Apr 11 00:03:35 right... I'm used to networkmanager and such refilling them Apr 11 00:04:27 DocScrutinizer, bq27200 also has its own capacitor Apr 11 00:04:39 meh, a 100nF Apr 11 00:04:52 connected to VBAT via 1k Apr 11 00:05:21 Dhraakellian, oh also, there's some conf file in an /etc/apt/ or apt.d directory somewhere configuring a nokia internal proxy server Apr 11 00:05:26 a 1k is no diode Apr 11 00:06:01 and I need to be wandering off Apr 11 00:14:10 okay, wandering delayed Apr 11 00:14:23 I finally got all the needed files changed, it appears Apr 11 00:48:19 well, fact is a 150uF could feed the bq27200 for days and months, but I'm not sure about the rest of N900 in power-down state (there are lots of chips directly connected to VBat) Apr 11 02:33:18 has anyone ever tried to get gmote running on a n900? Apr 11 02:36:53 *gmote-server that is Apr 11 02:47:29 is the "turning control" for phone app on standard maemo or only ssu? Apr 11 02:54:32 i mean, do you guys have it? **** ENDING LOGGING AT Mon Apr 11 02:59:57 2011