**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sun Feb 19 02:59:58 2012 Feb 19 03:06:30 DocScrutinizer: well, T-Mobile is the only option in the US, and 3G is spotty enough; it doesn't seem to work reliably for SIP even when uninterrupted, though Feb 19 03:10:05 yeah, I guess t-mo is mean enough to intentionally spoil SIP Feb 19 03:12:21 O2 otoh offers voicecall flat rates for same fee as their 5GB data "flat rate", and they save the termination fee for outbound calls wehn user is using SIP via arbitarry 3rd SIP provider rather than a GSM call Feb 19 03:14:05 while for t-mo GSM calls to 40% of mobile phones and 90% of landlines are "free" when user uses GSM on their D1 network Feb 19 03:14:26 as they then own the whole network from origin to destination Feb 19 03:14:47 at least here in germany Feb 19 03:14:54 home of t-mo Feb 19 03:14:59 :-S Feb 19 03:49:51 What, if I have the money, would be a better Linux-computer-in-your-pocket device to get, an n900 or n9? Is developer support still good for the n900, or has it all migrated to the n9? Feb 19 03:59:40 * ShadowJK isn't sure about activity on either Feb 19 04:04:34 ShadowJK, hmm? Feb 19 04:06:13 But then I don't hang out on forums anymore :P Feb 19 04:06:19 and I don't hang out in the N9 channel Feb 19 04:06:34 OK. :) Feb 19 04:06:54 N9 takes some effort to unlock, I've understood Feb 19 04:07:00 while N900 is unlocked Feb 19 04:07:20 my main interest is getting something as open as possible. Feb 19 04:07:20 N9 has decent amount of RAM and faster cpu. N900 is kinda RAM starved, but it has hw keyboard Feb 19 04:07:45 the software on N900 is older Feb 19 04:08:52 can I say, easily run standard Linux software on n9 the same way one can on an n900 (or n810, which I have)? Is the basic stuff ported? Feb 19 04:09:27 for example, if I want to run gnupg and a linux email program with it, will it work OK on an n9? Feb 19 04:09:35 older == more mature here Feb 19 04:10:03 I don't care if it's a little old, I started programming for Linux in 1992 or therabouts. :) Feb 19 04:10:25 harmattan of N9 has aegis aka MSSF Feb 19 04:10:28 ~aegis Feb 19 04:10:28 http://www.developer.nokia.com/Community/Wiki/Harmattan:Developer_Library/Developing_for_Harmattan/Harmattan_security/Security_guide , or "The purpose of this framework is: ... to make sure that the platform meets the requirements set by third party software that requires a safe execution environment.", or http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trusted_Computing#Criticism, or http://en.qi-hardware.com/w/images/1/10/ME_382_LockedUpTechnology2.gif Feb 19 04:10:33 N900 is definitely more like N810 Feb 19 04:10:40 definitely Feb 19 04:11:03 But also keep in mind that you're talking to the two guys who just ordered their third N900s, so we might be a bit biased ;p Feb 19 04:11:08 while N9 is... like an andridiot device cooked in nitric acid Feb 19 04:11:15 Though DocScrutinizer has had N950 and N9? Feb 19 04:11:52 yup, I have the direct "diff" Feb 19 04:12:05 and N9/950 is MEH Feb 19 04:12:09 fo rme Feb 19 04:12:49 both nice phones, but not the N8x0/N900 NIT philosophy anymore Feb 19 04:13:08 where did you get your n900s from? I might want to get it from the same source, I don't really trust some cat in hong kong without dealing with them first. Feb 19 04:13:35 well, I found a dealer here in Germany Feb 19 04:13:45 do they ship to US? Feb 19 04:13:56 don't think so Feb 19 04:14:14 you should be able to find new ones in USA as well Feb 19 04:14:29 I haven't been able to find them on ebay located in USA. Feb 19 04:14:48 only either used, or new from hong kong, which is who knows what really. Feb 19 04:14:52 ebay is crap, I found the dealer via google Feb 19 04:15:08 OK.... maybe I should google then. Feb 19 04:15:47 have to check if what they offer is actually what I want Feb 19 04:16:44 ugh, $420 and up according to google shopping. Feb 19 04:17:02 seems a tad too high Feb 19 04:17:03 there is one entry that's 290, but that's really an xpress music nokia, not the same thing. ;-) Feb 19 04:17:39 though here they start at a few bucks less than 300EUR Feb 19 04:18:05 even used ones are sold for that price Feb 19 04:18:08 I really want it $300 or less, and the more less the better. Feb 19 04:18:39 you can get used ones for way less as well Feb 19 04:18:40 hong kong's "new n900" was $199, but I don't trust them. Too easy to get screwed. Feb 19 04:18:53 o.O Feb 19 04:19:10 the only HK source for N900 I know of is 249EUR Feb 19 04:19:20 this was on eBay. Feb 19 04:19:29 yup Feb 19 04:20:02 http://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-Nokia-N900-3G-32GB-WIFI-GPS-5MP-QWERTY-SmartPhone-/290672828957?pt=Cell_Phones&hash=item43ad73621d#ht_4339wt_952 Feb 19 04:21:03 I thought they were all made in korea? Feb 19 04:21:34 we're talking about where seller resides and devices ship from Feb 19 04:22:04 seller is in Hong Kong, they claim at the link device was made in finland, a likely story. ;-) Feb 19 04:22:12 I think there also were hungarian and finsih builds Feb 19 04:22:23 hmm, ok, I guess its possible then. Feb 19 04:23:55 I tried bidding on one a couple of days ago, bidding overshot my bid and went up to $200, so getting it much lower than the buy-it-now price isn't all that likely. Feb 19 04:24:23 I wasn't willing to spend $200 on it unless I knew it was good. Feb 19 04:24:46 not from China I wasn't. Feb 19 04:24:58 no offense to the Chinese meant of course. Feb 19 04:25:49 yeah, I'm also feeling hesitant Feb 19 04:26:44 yeah, the likelyhood of getting a lemon or even a KIRF for your troubles is too high. Feb 19 04:48:09 lol, seller ratings for n900 are at "47%" with three stars. Feb 19 04:48:33 and of course only those low rated third parties are selling it there on Amazon. Feb 19 04:49:15 I found one on Craigslist, that's kind of promising, as long as it isn't a serial killer or something. ;p Feb 19 05:06:41 Check Ebay Feb 19 05:06:57 Ebay tends to be reliable for me Feb 19 05:08:28 http://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-Nokia-N900-3G-32GB-WIFI-GPS-5MP-QWERTY-SmartPhone-/280829324626?pt=Cell_Phones&hash=item4162bb6d52 Feb 19 05:20:46 robbiethe1st, that's in Hong Kong.... I checked out expansys and they're selling refurbs for $199, and they're considered to be more or less a reliable dealer, so I think I'll go with them. Feb 19 05:21:04 Fair enough Feb 19 05:21:09 robbiethe1st, unless you've bought from that dealer before. Feb 19 05:21:55 No; I did notice however that it is /not/ the dual-sim knock-off, looks right, has maemo 5, and the seller has enough feedback to likely be good Feb 19 05:22:13 Alternately, there are several used ones around that price Feb 19 05:22:35 I'm a bit worried about getting an n900 used sight-unseen, as I've heard of usb port troubles. Feb 19 05:23:33 I've had said troubles: Typically, the port will either be fine, in which case you've got a while, or it won't be... and that will be told about in the auction Feb 19 05:23:54 OK. Feb 19 05:24:27 Even if you get a /good/ one with /good/ port, the traces are weak; I'd still recommend using a blob of solder between the port and the neighboring chip tin cover to support it Feb 19 05:24:47 Because repairing broken USB ports is a /pain/. Feb 19 05:24:50 ugh. Feb 19 05:25:35 My first N900 lasted about a year before the port broke Feb 19 05:25:50 the n900 seems to be about the best UMPC that's relatively open running Linux available, which is why I'm interested. My n810 is very nice, although slow, so I've been looking for a phone that's like it. Feb 19 05:26:29 I have an HTC HD2, but it's not like a computer in your pocket, though it does run several different mobile OSs. :) Feb 19 05:26:53 Yeah Feb 19 05:26:56 It is. Feb 19 05:27:28 I will say though that you do want to do some tweaks to make it more usable; stuff like Swappolube and -- honestly -- overclocking. Feb 19 05:28:05 I was hoping that meego would eventually be available in open beta in working condition for the HD2, but that project seems to be on hold thanks to NokiaSoft burning the platform. Feb 19 05:28:42 and now I hear that meego is not all that open... :( Feb 19 05:28:47 I'm hoping for a Kubuntu derivitive Feb 19 05:28:50 and no, it isn't Feb 19 05:29:14 N900 is great about running any software you can manage to get loaded Feb 19 05:29:19 N9.... not so much Feb 19 05:29:43 yeah, I could run standard Linux programs, though open office taxed it a bit much, on my n810. :) Feb 19 05:30:04 It's still taxing on my N900, even at 950mhz, but it does work. Feb 19 05:30:35 I use it for converting .docs to .html, for ebook reading purposes, and while slow, it is usable for that Feb 19 05:30:36 my HD2 can run Ubuntu, but linux really sucks without any keyboard whatsoever. It actually is a better experience on my touch pro 2, even with the slower processor, because of that. Feb 19 05:30:46 Yeah Feb 19 05:32:49 robbiethe1st, you know Canonical has dropped Kubuntu, so if you want that running on it, it won't be the latest soon enough. Feb 19 05:33:24 Yeah, I heard that Feb 19 05:33:27 maybe a derivitive will be made though that will be kept up to date. Feb 19 05:33:47 Personally, what I want is a debian-derivitive(any), with a good UI. Feb 19 05:34:11 really I don't like a lot of the way that the latest GNOME/KDE/Unity desktops are going, tablet UIs don't work good on the desktop. Feb 19 05:34:13 KDE is a good UI, along with Hildon. Actually, Swipe is a good UI also, but not /quite/ as good as hildon Feb 19 05:35:14 I liked KDE3, even KDE2 (KMail was nice when it had status messages!) Feb 19 05:35:16 Eh... KDE's latest desktop UI looks fine for me. Looks to me like they're just desigining it with the 'plasma' widget part to be compatible with different UIs, so I could, say, run the same widgets on desktop, laptop, tablet, phone etc, Feb 19 05:35:28 that sounds cool. Feb 19 05:36:25 I like Qt a lot, it has a lot of portability and a good full featured API. Feb 19 05:38:24 Yeah. I've really been impressed when I took a simple PyQT application I'd written on my Linux desktop, dropped the files onto my N900's drive, ran the main python file, and it started right up Feb 19 05:38:41 UI elements looked different, and the small size of the screen was a pain... but it /worked/ Feb 19 05:38:55 robbiethe1st, that beats Android, where you are stuck with Java and their API. :) Feb 19 05:39:08 Yeah Feb 19 05:40:40 robbiethe1st, what's the software scene like for the n900? Are people still writing new software for it? Feb 19 05:40:51 I don't know. Some. Feb 19 05:41:06 Less now than before the N9 came out Feb 19 05:41:16 But it's still worth the $200 easily Feb 19 05:41:32 I was a bit afraid of that, because my n810 got kind of abandoned when the n900 came out. Feb 19 05:42:00 Nokia never seemed to understand how important backwards compatibility is, for any of their platforms. Feb 19 05:42:33 Yeah Feb 19 05:43:27 Well, it's more there have been several teams working on things, I think. The N900 was an /excellent/ prototype; a little more work and they could have had a iphone/ipad killer. But... Feb 19 05:44:02 N9 is more of a iphone /clone/, though I do admit it's loaded with enough shiny to keep it looking nice Feb 19 05:45:02 Microsoft didn't want real Linux on the phone to succeed obviously, or they wouldn't have taken over Nokia. (Don't know how else to describe transplanting most of their executives from Microsoft as.) Feb 19 05:45:26 Yeah Feb 19 05:45:48 And it kind of shows - the N9, even with all of it's restrictions, still outsold the MS phone... Feb 19 05:45:59 yep. Feb 19 05:46:10 Because it was A, linux based, and not locked down too far on the developer end... Feb 19 05:46:36 they sold it like in only two places, Switzerland and some other country not in the mainstream, yet it sold better than their WP7 phones. Feb 19 05:47:07 Yeah Feb 19 05:47:21 'Cause noone really likes WP7 Feb 19 05:47:24 NokiaSoft didn't want the n9 to succeed. Feb 19 05:47:33 That's been obvious Feb 19 05:48:39 well, anyway, I'm kind of used to running doomed phones in one form or another. Between my Palm Pre, and my HD2. ;-) I can run another. ;-) Feb 19 05:48:58 heh, yeah Feb 19 05:49:22 I will point out, however, that the N900 is not the greatest phone, especially if you're not careful Feb 19 05:49:23 webOS under the hood was a lot more like Linux than Android, but that doesn't say much. Feb 19 05:49:49 Because you can run as many apps as you want, you can bog the thing down so far it won't respond to incoming calls Feb 19 05:49:59 OK. Feb 19 05:50:05 as long as it lets me close them. Feb 19 05:50:22 Yeah, that's no problem at all. Feb 19 05:50:48 is it easy to get it bogged down, or does it perform OK? Feb 19 05:51:02 Really depends on the tweaks you do. Feb 19 05:51:07 Hm Feb 19 05:51:28 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kWVJ-6l6sWM Feb 19 05:51:35 What mine's most like Feb 19 05:53:02 There /is/ a quirk, however: If you leave certain things open -- mainly several large web pages, and leave it for an hour, when you come back it will have swapped most of the data out of memory and be unresponsive for several minutes. So you just have to close most open windows between uses. Feb 19 05:53:19 ...which is a good idea anyway, as most apps will drain your battery if left running. Feb 19 05:54:23 OK Feb 19 05:54:24 Basically, you have a situation here where unlike the iphone, /you/ are in control of your battery life and performance. It doesn't manage pausing and resuming applications for you, or managing memory usage, auto-closing apps... you have to do it yourself Feb 19 05:54:39 Essentially, it's awesome. :P Feb 19 05:54:42 :) Feb 19 05:55:38 you can still play youtube on an n900, can't you? It comes with flash 9, but it can be spoofed succcesfully? Feb 19 05:57:48 Yeah Feb 19 05:57:53 I did just the other day Feb 19 05:57:57 ok Feb 19 05:58:15 240p works best Feb 19 05:59:04 Oh, also: there's a 'flashblock' extension thingie you have to install - it turns all flash files into 'click-to-play' buttons, really boosting web performance Feb 19 05:59:19 OK. :) Feb 19 06:06:34 * ShadowJK recommends getting a genuine sandisk Mobile ultra MicroSDHC, creating a swap partition on it and use swap there Feb 19 06:07:24 lack of ram, and slow backing store is a major issue :P Feb 19 12:33:25 to pick up on OT talk 7h ago: FSCK PLASMA! Feb 19 12:35:01 honestly KDE4 always been a PITA Feb 19 12:35:34 it's taletelling that OpenSuse now ships with support for KDE3 again Feb 19 12:39:20 lemme put a simple example: 4 or 5 years ago my Konversation IRC client worked great and I had a dedicated sound as well as arbitrary other notifications/actions for basically arbitrary events (each highlighted nick with its own click). Now it's all FUBAR and wenn I say A then i mean beyond ALL repair, and knotify memleaks like mad Feb 19 12:43:17 every now and then friggin KDE/phonon/whatever breaks my audio to thoroughly that only rcalsasound force-reload PLUS opening the friggin KDE phonon config and setting new all the audio devices helps Feb 19 12:46:24 even KDE devels seem to consider Konqueror obsolete :-(( Feb 19 12:48:53 yes Feb 19 12:48:53 and whenever I accidentally happen to look at my KDE desktop alias plasma(?), I wanna kill my PC. Honestly who needs that crap? I *always* got ~30 windows minimum open at maximized size, and switching between them via alt-tab or windows bar (which I moved to top of screen and out of the standard bar at bottom) Feb 19 12:49:04 there's "reconq" now Feb 19 12:50:01 Somehow I managed to configure kde into semi-usable. I think the liveusb kubuntu defaulted to "netbook" kde, which is some incomprehensible mess Feb 19 12:50:47 NEVER touch buntkuh Feb 19 12:51:29 please! don't give me that buntkuh pain, can I has windoze please instead?! Feb 19 12:52:49 KDE was the best possible GUI for me, around end of KDE2, beginning of KDE3 Feb 19 12:53:30 and it still would be if they hadn't changed it into an unbearable mess, particularly starting with KDE4 Feb 19 12:54:59 the pity: I'm now bbasically locked in to KDE as all my customizations could never be ported to any other desktop, and even if they could it would take weeks of full time work Feb 19 12:56:20 honestly, I still got KDE1 heritage in my $home(/.kde) that I actively use Feb 19 13:00:11 well, next is probably a MacMini with 24" screen and a tripleboot system on it (though I wonder when I ever used the dualboot on this PC I'm typing on ;-) >>13:59pm up 102 days 13:33, 13 users, load average: 0.17, 0.25, 0.29<<) Feb 19 13:00:44 but I guess I will do a real clean start on friggin KDE with that occasion Feb 19 13:00:51 ubuntu seemed to have the best hw support in live version out of debian,fedora and ubuntu, and k version was less offending than unity version :P Feb 19 13:01:17 *cough* Feb 19 13:01:38 * ShadowJK has basically switched desktop environment every os upgrade :P Feb 19 13:01:42 * DocScrutinizer << meber and president of "no G*!" club Feb 19 13:02:15 afterstep - gnome - kde - xfce Feb 19 13:02:44 afterstep sounds... violent and obscene Feb 19 13:02:54 ;-P Feb 19 13:03:23 kickass would be a really friendly name in competition Feb 19 13:03:33 it's like GNU Step without the Objective C, I think.. Feb 19 13:04:16 well, I'm a first hour fan of NeXTStep Feb 19 13:05:21 from times when it needed a cube or NeXTstation to run it, prior to any x86 versions even been announced Feb 19 13:07:36 * DocScrutinizer even had the extremely nice 4 book drawer "NeXTStep developer docs" (some 10kg) which he read like belletristic each weekend back when Feb 19 13:09:16 DocScrutinizer, Don't get a Mac if you want to run Linux outside of a virtual machine. The proprietary SMC is not supported well by Linux, which means the CPU runs at the wrong voltages, and laptops run the battery down. Feb 19 13:09:45 and Apple, of course, will never reveal what makes the SMC tick. Feb 19 13:10:36 mhm, thanks for the comment. My friend thought "his" macs can do linux quite easily, well he's a Apple fanboy with no much clue about linux, and I got no clue about Mac Feb 19 13:10:54 so I rethink and probably cancel that plan Feb 19 13:11:49 EdLin: really a thousand thanks for warning me just in time :-) Feb 19 13:12:27 DocScrutinizer, no problem. Really, although it's against freenode rules to talk about it, a hackintosh makes a better triple-boot system if you want to do that kind of thing. Cheaper too. Feb 19 13:13:08 nah, I'm not interested too much in the mac world Feb 19 13:13:49 then you definitely don't want Apple kit, even if you manage to put up with the way it performs in a triple-boot system, you can't completely remove OS X without fouling its booting up. Feb 19 13:14:11 a proper x86 architecture whatever brand with virtualization to run an occasional "genuine" redmond bullsh*t will suffice. Has to support linux, that's #1 requirement Feb 19 13:14:56 will go for the one with blue button then, I guess Feb 19 13:15:01 yep. Speaking of which, my monitor all of a sudden doesn't support Linux framebuffer or X11. I'm getting a new DVI cable to see if that fixes it, if not, I'm going to have to get a new monitor. Feb 19 13:15:58 so I've been having to run Linux in a VM in Windows all the time, which is annoying, and something I haven't done since I had a Mac mini. Feb 19 13:16:06 what's that freenode policy comment of yours about? any link? Feb 19 13:16:24 (I'm supposed to know, as chanop on a dozen chan) Feb 19 13:16:44 DocScrutinizer, freenode doesn't allow the discussion of things that are "illegal", or at least that's what they say on the ##mac, #macosx, etc channels. Feb 19 13:17:15 I wouldn't give too much for what they say there Feb 19 13:17:47 there is a hackintosh IRC network, irc.osx86.hu. There aren't any such channels on freenode, as far as I know. Feb 19 13:17:53 #freenode or http://freenode.net/, or it didn't happen Feb 19 13:18:42 well, creating a channel whose name or topic suggests it's about illegal stuff - that'S something completely different Feb 19 13:19:39 you sure it's the monitor and not the graphics chip? Feb 19 13:19:39 but talk in legit channels is free, unless chanop (or users) complains Feb 19 13:19:58 ShadowJK: you wrote what I was to lazy to... :-D Feb 19 13:20:04 too* Feb 19 13:20:07 DocScrutinizer, talk of hackintosh in any of the Mac channels is a ban offense, pretty much. Feb 19 13:20:27 that's chan policy, not #freenode policy Feb 19 13:20:31 ok. Feb 19 13:20:46 you may talk about hackintosh all you want, in channels Iown Feb 19 13:20:51 ;-D Feb 19 13:20:54 lol Feb 19 13:21:19 nota bene I don't own this chan Feb 19 13:22:04 actually I'm surprised I got no -o since long time here Feb 19 13:22:22 I own ##mac-social, but since I am also on the #macosx-ops channel due to that, and still peek in the mac channels, I don't want to rock the boat by discussing hackintosh there. Feb 19 13:22:26 while X-Fade put me on his ignore list Feb 19 13:22:29 ;-P Feb 19 13:23:00 EdLin: sane policy Feb 19 13:24:43 * DocScrutinizer idly wonders how many *active* chanops this chan got anyway, and fires a /cs access list Feb 19 13:25:16 I'm guessing it's like most freenode channels: 0 Feb 19 13:25:59 mhm, X-Fade, jaffa, GAN, and me - in sequence of increasing activity Feb 19 13:26:09 oops andre__ Feb 19 13:26:55 ~seen GeneralAntilles Feb 19 13:26:55 generalantilles is currently on #maemo (9h 26m 12s) #harmattan (9h 26m 12s) #meego (9h 26m 12s), last said: 'But whatever.'. Feb 19 13:28:42 smells like zombie state around next corner, while #meego already reached that Feb 19 13:30:40 well, not really yet. there's been quite some dozen lines convo on 13., 15, 16. Feb 19 13:31:26 while we recently see days with equally low traffic here Feb 19 13:32:51 still not feeling like merging #harmattan into this chan Feb 19 13:33:35 it would finally suffocate the low traffic volume actually addressed at fremantle and kill fremantle talks for good Feb 19 13:34:59 fremantle and harmattan too similar to tell apart which of both a post is related to on first glance, but still they are way too different in a lot of aspects for unifying discussions Feb 19 14:31:15 On the N900, we have currently Qt 4.7.4, isn't it ? Feb 19 14:31:34 so it's QtQuick 1.1 that is supported, isn't it ? Feb 19 14:42:16 Tofe, through the CSSU yes Feb 19 14:43:16 great Feb 19 15:34:39 who was claiming that plain firefox is faster than fennec on N900? Feb 19 15:48:14 Ok, my first try with QML end here, I think Feb 19 15:48:42 I've got a simple app I'm quite happy with Feb 19 15:49:09 Mainly dedicated to reading LeMonde.fr -> would it interest someone ? Feb 19 15:50:40 Well, I can always publish it on extra-devel, as QtCreator seems to know how to do it Feb 19 15:53:43 Did someone try to use QtCreator to upload to extra-devel ? Does it work well ? Feb 19 15:54:02 I wouldn't want to mess the thing :) Feb 19 15:59:33 Mmmh I'm quite new to all this "garage" thing. Is it a problem is the application isn't really useful/finished yet ? Feb 19 16:32:32 Tofe: it's not a real problem, but it does not make sense to fill the repo (from which the index is dl on all devices) with non-functional applications Feb 19 16:32:47 also I don't know a thing about qtcreator extras upload stuff Feb 19 16:34:34 well, it does work Feb 19 16:35:02 but the functionalities are not really over-exciting right now... Feb 19 16:42:14 i have an app to read lemonde.fr too! Feb 19 16:42:24 it's called **a browser** Feb 19 16:42:52 :) Feb 19 16:44:47 I never said it was a breakthrough, on the contrary; but if I can make so that it can aggegate other sources in a nice, it might become useful Feb 19 16:45:24 anyway it was just a way for me to discover qml; if the app isn't useful to anyone, that's not a problem :) Feb 19 16:50:50 ooh, i like the idea of a good RSS reader Feb 19 16:51:02 especially if you find a way to get google reader integration working properly Feb 19 16:51:19 there's another RSS reader that supposedly works with google reader, but it never worked properly for me Feb 19 16:55:19 I can always try Feb 19 16:59:14 is google reader supposed to show only some minimal information ? Or is there an "expanded" content ? Feb 19 17:02:08 HELP HELP HELP!!! i cannot download the latest firmware from http://tablets-dev.nokia.com/nokia_N900.php Feb 19 17:02:19 please help! any other link? Feb 19 17:02:59 "cannot download"? Feb 19 17:03:14 r00t-eeepc: yes, links are dead Feb 19 17:03:36 ahm 1 minute to try from another browser Feb 19 17:04:09 oh, but using google reader supposes some sort of authentification Feb 19 17:04:55 would be nice, though. Feb 19 17:05:20 r00t-eeepc: FAIL.. :$ fail with google chrome ... with another browser its ok\ Feb 19 17:05:28 . . . Feb 19 18:13:25 hi. fm transmitter not working on n900 after reflash (and restore using bacupmenu). i get the error Unable to use fm transmitter. Feb 19 18:13:26 Previously i got it working using method described here Feb 19 18:13:26 http://discussions.europe.nokia.com/t5/Maemo-and-MeeGo-Devices/Top-12-Maemo-N900-Issues-amp-Fixes/m-p/755784/highlight/true#M18287 Feb 19 18:14:34 could n900-fmrx-enabler packages cause problems? When I try to remove n900-fmtx-enabler apt-get would like remove 40 other packages. Feb 19 18:14:48 HOw to troubleshoot further? Feb 19 18:30:00 hello Feb 19 18:46:55 shanttu: the fmtx-enabler should stay Feb 19 18:46:59 (part of qt I think) Feb 19 18:47:17 you can try installing fmtx-faker from extras-devel and rebooting Feb 19 18:49:46 I have a weird problem - when playing music, but only with fm transmission I sometimes get a 10 seconds pause in the middle of the song Feb 19 18:53:04 never experienced that myself Feb 19 18:53:24 I'd check output of 'dmesg' for strange things Feb 19 18:57:00 couldnt notice anything yet Feb 19 18:57:19 I've read about power requirements of fm tx which could produce bugs Feb 19 18:57:36 only idea I have. trying a new widget (fm rds) Feb 19 19:09:30 merlin1991, thanks. already reinstalled fmtx-faker and still nothing Feb 19 19:13:56 guylhem_: extremely strange Feb 19 19:14:02 guylhem_: pause or mute? Feb 19 19:14:08 mute Feb 19 19:14:22 hmm Feb 19 19:14:49 it last for approx 10s then happen irregularly approx 1x / 2 or 3 minutes at times, sometimes not at all Feb 19 19:14:59 IIRC FM TX is via analog audio, so I can't see how any mute would be related to FM TX Feb 19 19:15:49 I've seen similar ultrashort dropouts (<0.5s) every now and then when using BT headset Feb 19 19:16:13 always thought they were related to some other process hogging CPU Feb 19 19:16:39 I rarely use bt. It never happens with the speaker or the headphones. like you I believe it could be related to CPU usage. Feb 19 19:17:10 what is the best way to increase cpufreq during fm transmit ? (thought it might solve the issue) Feb 19 19:25:16 I'd think it's totally unrelated to cpu use Feb 19 19:25:41 because it basically needs no cpu at all to function Feb 19 19:26:10 speaking of analog paths, fmtx actually goes mute if you reduce volume to 0 Feb 19 19:26:26 FM TX yes, that's why I said the above. USB PCM to BT, not. MP3 decode, not. Feb 19 19:32:36 guylhem_: I strongly doubt any up/over-clocking of CPU will improve or fix the issue. Feb 19 19:33:31 if it's related to other processes somehow blocking regular CPU operation for audio playback, then most likely it's closely linked to IO during swap Feb 19 19:34:06 or logging huge amounts, or otherwise strong activity on storage Feb 19 19:34:22 interestng Feb 19 19:34:24 my 2 cents, aka semi-educated guess Feb 19 19:34:51 overclocking reduces the problem! :D Feb 19 19:34:54 i'll check which apps could be logging. some lsof could help Feb 19 19:35:31 kerio : did you experience the same issue ? Feb 19 19:35:36 I'd first of all switch to tablet mode or airplane mode and see if wireless incl all the daemonized tasks linked to it may cause the dropouts Feb 19 19:35:49 guylhem_: eh, not really Feb 19 19:36:18 kerio is practicing on trolling, and really performing poor on that Feb 19 19:36:55 DocScrutinizer: nah, i just figured that i might as well trash the cpu, my n900 is slowly dying anyway Feb 19 19:37:13 trolling require time and effort. keep up the good work and the trolling force will be with you Feb 19 19:39:12 DocScrutinizer: I dont have battery logger or others which could explain this. I installed conky so that enxt time it happens I can quickly check the processes Feb 19 19:40:56 you'll be too slow. I suspect something in the modem stack acting up when unsolicited inbound msgs arrive, like change/handover of cell, smscb, whatnot Feb 19 19:41:27 yes for that theres nothing I can do Feb 19 20:20:55 when i am using flasher with -f -R, it should reboot the device after flashing, is that right>? Feb 19 20:22:44 guylhem_: see my advice above Feb 19 20:22:57 dmesg Feb 19 20:23:03 ? Feb 19 20:23:07 also had anyone experienced any problem with the touchscreen on N900? Feb 19 20:23:19 oops Feb 19 20:23:22 airplane - ok Feb 19 20:23:28 I'd first of all switch to tablet mode or airplane mode and see if wireless incl all the daemonized tasks linked to it may cause the dropouts Feb 19 20:24:02 tzorvas___: yes Feb 19 20:25:19 and as that's a mere convenience thing (you can reboot 'the classic way' anytime) and since rebooting is absolutely forbidden for some sequences of flashing eMMC, you should simply never use -R Feb 19 20:25:45 DocScrutinizer: i am unable to tap. only some random times after fully charge of battery i am able to enter my password and after a while i am unable to use touchscreen but only keyboard Feb 19 20:26:08 hm Feb 19 20:26:18 DocScrutinizer: i didnt add -R to emmc but the next one Feb 19 20:26:21 so how's that related to -R ? Feb 19 20:26:41 i tried to reflash my device Feb 19 20:26:47 but nothing is working Feb 19 20:26:57 well, this sounds like a hw defect Feb 19 20:27:37 and most likely unrelated to battery charge state Feb 19 20:27:45 i tried to do flash rootfs -> emmc -> rootfs and still nothing Feb 19 20:27:54 :nod: Feb 19 20:27:55 dont know its weird the whole thing :( Feb 19 20:28:38 probably your touchpanel is defect Feb 19 20:28:50 it shuddenly died Feb 19 20:28:54 :( Feb 19 20:29:07 can you ssh in? Feb 19 20:29:47 also i experienced with some bugs when trying to turn on my phone. orange led is showing twice before device starts and some weirds bugs Feb 19 20:29:52 as fist and foremost priority now is to set up device so you can operate it for diagnostic purposes without using touchscreen Feb 19 20:30:50 i'll go for that Feb 19 20:31:06 umm, orange led showing on device power on isn't exactly a bug? Feb 19 20:31:46 esp when hooked up to USB Feb 19 20:33:15 DocScrutinizer: i am trying to boot up without usb and orange led flashes twice before boot Feb 19 20:34:05 hmm, not exactly worrying Feb 19 20:37:44 21 days uptime. maybe I could dare a boot :-) Feb 19 20:38:35 facebrick devel is stopped. any way to store an api auth somewhere and bypass the normal process, so that it just works? (http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=49216). thought about creating a new app to get a new api key. Feb 19 20:38:49 or is there a widget I don't know about? Feb 19 20:40:09 tzorvas___: I have to admit my device doesn't show any amber blinking when booting from proper off, without any USB attached Feb 19 20:41:11 white fade-in, then white NOKIA screen, then white LED switch-off, then blackscreen with evetually the moving dots Feb 19 20:42:50 mine does from time to time Feb 19 20:42:56 this doesn't change even when tap-hlding the touchpanel Feb 19 20:44:12 well, I don't see how the amber blinking could be linked to touchpanel defect/misfunction Feb 19 20:45:08 until black screen with moving dots, only NOLO is involved in booting, and USB charging resp indicator LED is unrelated to touchpanel. Feb 19 20:45:37 tzorvas___: you could try coldflashing to make sure you got a clean NOLO Feb 19 20:45:59 but it's rather unlikely it's caused by NOLO Feb 19 20:46:06 I suspect a hw defect Feb 19 20:48:07 DocScrutinizer: for cold flashing i should run "flasher-3.5 -c -h RX-51: -F -f" ? as being told @ http://wiki.maemo.org/Flasher Feb 19 20:50:16 yep Feb 19 22:17:01 DocScrutinizer: how to find hw revision>? :$ Feb 19 22:17:34 flasher will show you Feb 19 22:17:38 iirc Feb 19 22:17:57 or you can find it in err proc/cpu? Feb 19 22:18:30 cat /proc/cpuinfo Feb 19 22:22:52 probably --read-device-id, -i Print out the device type Feb 19 22:24:26 tzorvas___: the hw-rev is in CAL aka NAND partition 2 Feb 19 22:25:04 DocScrutinizer: hw rev 2101 :) Feb 19 22:25:07 coldflashing needs this only as there might be no CAL at all when device is really "cold" alias empty Feb 19 22:25:11 yup Feb 19 22:25:14 usual Feb 19 22:25:38 hm Feb 19 22:25:41 Using serial port /dev/ttyS0 tcgetattr: Input/output error Feb 19 22:25:55 errr wut? Feb 19 22:26:38 --serial-port, -S Serial port used for cold flashing or "usb" Feb 19 22:27:05 -S usb Feb 19 22:28:00 also make damn sure your battery is fully charged ;-) Feb 19 22:28:50 fully fully?? :P Feb 19 22:29:20 this is the error log http://sprunge.us/MZjh Feb 19 22:29:37 from flasher-3.5 -c -h RX-51:2101 -F /media/A9D4-E539/RX-51_2009SE_20.2010.36-2_PR_COMBINED_MR0_ARM.bin -f Feb 19 22:30:10 you've seen my last 4 lines here? Feb 19 22:31:15 do i need -S ? :$ Feb 19 22:31:34 well, it seems to target your problem, no? Feb 19 22:31:45 --serial-port, -S Serial port used for cold flashing or "usb" Feb 19 22:32:26 flasher-3.5 --help might do exactly that: help Feb 19 22:32:31 ;-) Feb 19 22:33:43 sometimes even -U is useful Feb 19 22:34:18 ooh, and of course you need to start flasher first, THEN plug in USB to device in off-state Feb 19 22:34:51 otherwise I guess ROM bootloader will not get detected by flasher Feb 19 22:35:43 and other than NOLO "normal flashing" there's no "hold U key" to enable coldflashing mode Feb 19 22:36:18 ROM BL will ping USB just one time, and if there's no immediate echo, it will go on and load NOLO Feb 19 22:36:35 ah so maybe this is the problem Feb 19 22:36:36 which doesn't help for *flashing* NOLO Feb 19 22:36:43 because i tried flasher-3.5 -c -h RX-51:2101 --usb-device=002:046 -F /media/A9D4-E539/RX-51_2009SE_20.2010.36-2_PR_COMBINED_MR0_ARM.bin -f and i had the same problem Feb 19 22:37:37