**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Wed Jul 11 02:59:58 2012 Jul 11 03:14:13 wow, modrana is a must-have app in maemo Jul 11 03:14:53 it should replace the out-dated built-in ovi maps :) Jul 11 03:35:41 why is everybody so eager to *replace* anything?? Jul 11 03:36:01 WTF became of "freedom of choice" in FOSS? Jul 11 03:40:22 REPLACE camera, REPLACE kernel, REPLACE mediaplayer, REPLACE maps - dang, I get angry hearing that all the time Jul 11 03:41:27 Well, if the original can't be /modified/, it should be /replaced/? Jul 11 03:41:53 instead of feeling happy they got a choice, people think they have to force their own preferences onto others. dafaq! Jul 11 03:42:08 robbiethe1st: BULLSHIT! Jul 11 03:42:24 Why not? Jul 11 03:43:15 Isn't that the whole point to OSS stuff? It may not do what you want, but you can /modify/ it to(and hopefully, someone else has already done it and made it a config option)? Jul 11 03:43:19 I got 3 maps apps on my N900, and I'll get into a blood frency when somebody comes REPLACING one of them with something HE thinks is better for *me* Jul 11 03:43:44 Well, if you mean replacing as in 'removing the alternative', then.... Jul 11 03:43:59 yes, that's what everybody means by REPLACE Jul 11 03:44:12 I would expect it to be replaced as in busybox-power; it's an option that replaces the original, but is non-mandatory Jul 11 03:44:20 (and conflicts with the original) Jul 11 03:45:14 Now, what the 'default' option should be, that can be argued(i.e. whether the stock or modified version of something should be in, say, cssu, but... Jul 11 03:46:40 cssu wil NOT REPLACE anything, it will offer FREEDOM OF CHOICE whenever possible Jul 11 03:47:17 Doesn't it replace stock packages with 'upgraded'/modified ones? Jul 11 03:47:40 Like some of the custom-patched versions? Jul 11 03:47:47 if there's any such thing like a default, user should have a select option to make "default" whatever she likes Jul 11 03:48:40 indeed somebody managed to push nicocam into cssu, on of the root sins Jul 11 03:48:46 one of* Jul 11 03:49:15 Depends... I don't see what's wrong with alternate packages that conflct with/provide the original package; On this device, there's not enough space for all versions of everything, so... Jul 11 03:49:21 esp since for camera it's *utterly* simple to offer a default-selector Jul 11 03:49:45 True; that's something I've had for many months... Jul 11 03:49:56 I have two camera packages + flashlight + mbarcode Jul 11 03:51:05 since friggin nicocam my DSP locks up when taking photos - comment of cssu-responsibles: "well, get a proper kernel-power, it's a bug that's fixed in there" FINE¡¡¡ Jul 11 03:52:16 what exactly is the benefit of nicocam in cssu for me now? Jul 11 03:52:25 I'd argue that if the kernel-power is included/marked as a dependancy of nicocam, then that's fine. Otherwise... Jul 11 03:53:00 * ShadowJK guesses nicocam isn't feature complete with the default cam? :P Jul 11 03:57:55 * DocScrutinizer05 figures arch linux / younameit distro upgrade REPLACING firefox by opera Jul 11 03:58:29 even replacing msie by firefox would kill the system Jul 11 03:59:47 that's why you always got a selector which progarm shall be default on your system Jul 11 04:00:12 and nobody ever dares to *replace* stuff, unless inevitable Jul 11 04:01:42 just fools rushing over cssu think cssu is meant to *replace* everything Jul 11 04:02:04 (I don't mean my friends the maintainers) Jul 11 04:16:01 this whole thinking is probably a result of Nokia's idea to ship a 'monolithic' OS revision including 'everything'. So people don't think "fine, I got modrana now. Could I recover the space (on screen, in storage) taken up by ovimaps? Could I change which app addressbook will open when clicking on an address?" - they stay in Nokia's walled garden and think "duh, how could I *replace* this friggin ovimaps?" Jul 11 04:17:16 i hate it when i accidentally start ovi maps .. its so slow to kill it :P Jul 11 04:20:58 well, who doesn't? Jul 11 04:22:15 someone at nokia either liked it OR wanted to punish their customers Jul 11 04:22:29 that didnt worked out .. so they moved to windows phone :P Jul 11 04:23:33 Oh, that reminds me... speaking of low-level mods, remember many months ago I wondered about 'pausing' browser/browserd when the screen is off? Jul 11 04:23:58 Turns out, it works great; 99.9% of the time, windows Jul 11 04:24:55 'resume' just fine(transparently), and I have none of the swap-lag I used to get as the app got swapped out of ram while waiting. Battery usage is /far/ better - browser windows can be left open without impacting battery life now. Jul 11 04:25:43 I've had a /couple/ of crashes of browser/browserd, but, well, that happens normally, and considering I use it every day(with multiple pause/resume cycles a day)... Jul 11 04:26:47 (and, I might add, I have far more crashes on my desktop with firefox than I do with the stock browser, so...) Jul 11 04:28:43 Aanyway, I think that's enough of that. I do suggest everyone who's interested, try it out. Jul 11 04:30:42 how did you do that? dbus scripts? Jul 11 04:31:35 kill -STOP it or what? Jul 11 04:31:59 Dbus script that calls kill -STOP on "lock" event Jul 11 04:32:06 and then resume on the unlock event Jul 11 04:32:42 that was my guess ,, fine :) .. i shall do that Jul 11 04:33:27 I forget where the dbus event script thingie is located, but... Jul 11 04:47:58 how do I get to rsync from my laptop to the SDcard of my n900 when I have it mounted sshfs over usb. I keep getting operation not permitted. Jul 11 05:11:31 jpinx: why dont you use rsync over ssh instead sshfs .. that would be far more efficient Jul 11 05:12:55 cehteh: [citation needed] Jul 11 05:13:10 unless he's *updating* files, the transfer protocol is the same Jul 11 05:13:15 cehteh saied that :P Jul 11 05:13:17 hell, rsync does a bunch more checks Jul 11 05:13:35 kerio: sshfs has much more network turnarounds for metadata Jul 11 05:13:48 hmm Jul 11 05:14:11 and if the destination doesnt exist then rsync just sends the data Jul 11 05:14:19 jpinx: why don't you use sftp (over ssh) instead of sshfs? that would be far more efficient Jul 11 05:14:34 well i use sshfs sometimes .. its nice Jul 11 05:20:28 kerio: and cehteh I like to be able to write to the SD card with cp, nano, rsync, et al -- but "operation not permitted" is what I get now Jul 11 05:20:43 jpinx: what does mount say? Jul 11 05:20:53 so then you dont have permission or its mounted readonly Jul 11 05:21:24 mount in the laptop says... user@192.168.2.15:/media/mmc1/ on /home/jpinx/n900-card type fuse.sshfs (rw,nosuid,nodev,max_read=65536,allow_other,user=jpinx) Jul 11 05:21:59 kerio: you can see it is rw, and user is me Jul 11 05:22:15 can you write stuff to it from the n900 itself? Jul 11 05:22:22 no Jul 11 05:22:25 and you are logged in as root or user on the n900? Jul 11 05:22:29 what's the error you get? Jul 11 05:22:34 sshfs is bad in handling multiple users Jul 11 05:22:48 (aka root owned files) Jul 11 05:23:17 next if you have fat in the way and you try some metadata operations fat may not support this can yield that error Jul 11 05:23:26 the SD >card is all rwrwrw and all files owned by user Jul 11 05:23:48 how is it mounted on the n900? Jul 11 05:23:59 sshfs Jul 11 05:24:10 locally .. fat? Jul 11 05:24:14 as per user@192.168.2.15:/media/mmc1/ on /home/jpinx/n900-card type fuse.sshfs (rw,nosuid,nodev,max_read=65536,allow_other,user=jpinx) Jul 11 05:24:15 readwrite? Jul 11 05:24:27 not the sshfs mount i meant on the n900 locally Jul 11 05:25:17 /dev/mmcblk1p1 on /media/mmc1 type vfat (rw,noauto,nodev,noexec,nosuid,noatime,nodiratime,utf8,uid=29999,shortname=mixed,dmask=000,fmask=0133,rodir) Jul 11 05:25:19 and well .. use rsync over ssh and not sshfs .. that would be a first start to debug this and having success later Jul 11 05:25:35 cehteh: rsync fails in the same way Jul 11 05:25:51 yes but you dont have 3 layers to debug Jul 11 05:25:57 there is only here and there :) Jul 11 05:26:02 ;) Jul 11 05:26:25 rsync gives me operation not permitted when trying to write Jul 11 05:26:34 use scp or something like that Jul 11 05:26:38 rsync somesmallfile user@192.168.2.15:/media/mmc1/ Jul 11 05:26:41 can you *ssh* to the n900? Jul 11 05:26:41 like this? Jul 11 05:27:12 next try the opposite fetch some file from the n900, does that work? Jul 11 05:29:13 kerio: yes - straightforward ssh works Jul 11 05:29:54 and from that ssh session you can write to /media/mmc1/foo? Jul 11 05:30:15 if so, then there's no reason scp shouldn't work Jul 11 05:32:40 ok - fixed it Jul 11 05:32:45 here's what you do Jul 11 05:33:23 first off - remove the image you are using as a desktop background which is located on the sdcard, reboot, and you're done Jul 11 05:33:59 *anythin* that is using the sdcard will block remote access to it Jul 11 05:34:44 kerio: and cehteh many thanks for the boot up my ass ;) Jul 11 05:34:59 huh? Jul 11 05:35:22 sounds strange .. i doing such things many times Jul 11 05:35:37 if anyone knows what the mechanism is that blocks the remote access to the sdcard while anything else is using it - I'll be interested to know Jul 11 05:36:25 I now have drag and drop in the laptop (debian) filemanager into and out of the n900 sdcard Jul 11 05:36:48 rsync chugs along perfectly Jul 11 05:37:33 all back to normal and I put the image I like as screen background on the main phone SD card -- there is no conflict from there Jul 11 08:00:11 cehteh: kerio I'm back - after a disconnect and unplug and re-plug, the SD card is again not available Jul 11 09:08:56 jpinx: wait, unplug/replug? Jul 11 09:08:58 of what? Jul 11 09:09:05 are you exporting the µsd through usb mass storage? Jul 11 09:55:23 haha Jul 11 10:00:38 Can I ask a stupid favour off anyone here? Jul 11 10:01:13 teotwaki: asking is free Jul 11 10:02:01 The school were I got my CS degree is being shut down, however, the teachers have decided to start a petition to keep it going. Would anyone mind signing the petition? Doesn't matter where you are, frankly. Message me if you want the link. Thanks. Jul 11 10:14:15 Gee, thanks for the support :) Jul 11 10:38:34 kerio yes - it's a usb cable connection I use ( wwith wvdial to get to the internet) Jul 11 11:02:15 Jaffa, ping Jul 11 11:02:24 GeneralAntilles, ping Jul 11 11:43:41 teotwaki: >>Message me if you want the link<< prone to fail epically Jul 11 11:43:45 ~ask Jul 11 11:43:46 Questions in the channel should be specific, informative, complete, concise, and on-topic. Don't ask if you can ask a question first. Don't ask if a person is there; just ask what you intended to ask them. Better questions more frequently yield better answers. We are all here voluntarily or against our will. Jul 11 11:45:03 DocScrutinizer: I was also trying to not spam the channel with something immensely off-topic, noob Jul 11 11:46:22 OH NO YOU DI'N'T Jul 11 12:04:12 yeah you n00b Jul 11 12:04:28 * Lava_Croft chuckles like he is watching a game of CoD played by a 6 year old Jul 11 12:36:01 Estel_: pong (although he's gone) Jul 11 12:46:32 DocScrutinizer, hi. can you write steps how to start usb host mode with charging? Jul 11 12:47:09 Pali! Jul 11 12:54:46 Jaffa, GeneralAntilles, ping Jul 11 12:58:33 Pali: basically: start normal hostmode. After establishing everything plug in external power to Y-cable. Stop vboost(-script). Start charge21.sh Jul 11 12:58:57 ~hostmode-charging Jul 11 12:58:57 [hostmode-powered] http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=921203#post921203 Jul 11 13:00:31 Pali: it's very inportant to NOT have any vbus supply plugged in when starting hostmode. As I explained before, you can select speed of musb-core only when no vbus voltage from any source (external or internal) is locking the USB session Jul 11 13:03:58 charge21 or any other BME substitute, right? Jul 11 13:04:10 Pali: keep in mind that even after disabling boost mode (or unplugging the external power supply) there will stay the voltage on VBUS for quite some time, buffered by capacitors inside N900 as well as in the attached peripheral. You can try to speed discharge by a couble of measures, but finally you should check for current voltage on vbus before continuing with anything like automatic speed switching Jul 11 13:04:23 kerio: right Jul 11 13:04:37 what happens if you turn on BME at that point? Jul 11 13:04:46 shit breaks awfully? Jul 11 13:04:48 except bme itself, which possibly might collide with hostmode eventually /see fastcharger detect) Jul 11 13:04:56 i see Jul 11 13:04:57 :) Jul 11 13:05:33 fastcharger detect will mess with D+ D- which kills USB data transmission Jul 11 13:05:54 how do inductive chargers work? a special battery? or something that plugs in the phone? Jul 11 13:06:19 DocScrutinizer05, how to correct check for voltage on vbus? Jul 11 13:06:29 something that "plugs in" into the phone. Jul 11 13:06:49 not just the battery, then? shame Jul 11 13:06:56 Pali: there's generic vbus sysfs node, but that's poor. Better check session status in musb-core Jul 11 13:07:23 erio, why so? inductive charging circuit on battery could work, but would confuse a shit out of bq27x00 module, and from bme Jul 11 13:07:41 DocScrutinizer05: how many n900s do you have? Jul 11 13:07:52 lemme count Jul 11 13:08:07 seems they are 4 now Jul 11 13:08:16 ;) Jul 11 13:08:21 Estel_: so you can charge while doing whatever you want with the usb port Jul 11 13:08:27 DocScrutinizer, funny, as just five minutes ago I connected some things to my N900, and was cursing like hell due to it refusing to work - I forget to *not* apply external voltage before connecting ;) Finally- figured it out myself, then came here, and red Your reply Jul 11 13:09:26 DocScrutinizer05: I think of having another one now... Jul 11 13:10:21 meh, you want to compete? i'll have to get another two then ;-P Jul 11 13:10:31 chem|st: i have two ^_^ Jul 11 13:10:35 although one is still MIA Jul 11 13:11:26 mia? Jul 11 13:11:27 can i use backupmenu to restore a backup that was made on a n900 on a different n900? does it work? any problems wrt hardware IDs? Jul 11 13:11:47 chem|st: missing in action Jul 11 13:11:48 ~wtf mia Jul 11 13:11:49 MIA: missing in action Jul 11 13:11:55 infobot: too slow! Jul 11 13:11:55 no, you're too slow! Jul 11 13:12:02 ...what the hell Jul 11 13:12:10 ~feed infobot Jul 11 13:12:10 actually you may apply external voltage as soon as you've chosen speed. I.E. whenever you press "Vboost" button in H-E-N you also may apply external voltage, NOT earlier Jul 11 13:12:11 * infobot offers infobot some toe-jam Jul 11 13:12:16 i... i wasn't expecting that Jul 11 13:12:24 ~botsnack Jul 11 13:12:24 chem|st: aw, gee Jul 11 13:12:33 chem|st: anyway, broken USB port and some other minor problems Jul 11 13:12:53 the usb is easy to fix, what are the minors? Jul 11 13:13:14 the sim card pins are kinda flaky Jul 11 13:13:27 internal battery is f'ed, but that's standard Jul 11 13:13:50 and then generic software problems that can be fixed by reflashing Jul 11 13:13:57 except that NOPE.jpg Jul 11 13:14:22 the thing is, it was my only phone, so i couldn't exactly get it fixed Jul 11 13:14:25 because i needed my phone Jul 11 13:14:37 now, i'll probably fix it and maybe sell it? Jul 11 13:17:00 simcard pins? what have you done to that? Jul 11 13:17:07 kerio: that's what backup menu offers to user - complete and convenient migration to a new device Jul 11 13:17:23 chem|st: nothing! i swear! Jul 11 13:17:30 it could also be the sim itself, mind you Jul 11 13:17:38 it? Jul 11 13:17:49 kerio: then there is no problem with the pins, it is the gsm-firmware being dodgy Jul 11 13:18:02 or your simcard Jul 11 13:18:03 DocScrutinizer05: so there are no weird mismatches wrt imei/wifi mac address/bt... mac? address? Jul 11 13:18:14 all in CAL Jul 11 13:18:21 you can't copy CAL Jul 11 13:18:26 i see Jul 11 13:18:27 my simcard looks like driven over several times and is still working Jul 11 13:19:12 got it replaced with a microsim anyhow Jul 11 13:27:18 chem|st: hm, with an adapter? Jul 11 14:05:22 wtf, why is there a wine package Jul 11 14:05:48 aww, no integrated qemu :( Jul 11 14:14:29 (sim adapter) NEVER use SIM adapters on slot-in SIM holders Jul 11 14:15:12 we've seen N950 fatalities on that Jul 11 14:15:34 blood and all? Jul 11 14:15:39 yeah Jul 11 14:16:19 nice Jul 11 14:16:23 probably, since the user tried to remove locked-up SIM with a blade finally Jul 11 14:16:30 * StyXman doesn't want to see his n900's blood Jul 11 14:16:47 Hey, how to fix "camera-ui: operation failed"? Jul 11 14:16:49 it has gaseous blood, you will recognize it by the smell. Jul 11 14:17:23 jaska: I hope I don';t get to see it Jul 11 14:17:27 Helloer: check dmesg Jul 11 14:17:50 (or - better - syslog) Jul 11 14:18:07 although we call that "the devil that make electronics work", given all the black magic involved even on a single transistor... Jul 11 14:18:43 jinnie, aka "blue magic smoke" Jul 11 14:18:57 never let it escape the chips Jul 11 14:23:05 hmm, genie Jul 11 14:25:44 DocScrutinizer05: what is the DSP 's "name" again ? xD Jul 11 14:26:04 dhbiker: hmm? Jul 11 14:26:20 umm how its named Jul 11 14:26:24 in which domain? datasheets? sysfs? Jul 11 14:26:31 datasheet Jul 11 14:26:39 errr Jul 11 14:26:59 one of the well known TI series iirc Jul 11 14:27:05 oh Jul 11 14:27:11 ok ill google that out Jul 11 14:30:00 found it... OMAP3430 Jul 11 14:30:47 http://maemo.org/packages/view/omap3430-dsp-libraries-ti/ Jul 11 14:30:57 omap3430 is the whole SOC Jul 11 14:33:09 http://www.edaboard.com/thread69235.html Jul 11 14:34:02 yeah just saw in a datasheet Jul 11 14:34:05 C64x Jul 11 14:35:42 DocScrutinizer05: http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=T6DePr9f thats all Jul 11 14:36:08 goddamn it, how to make external keyboard connected to N900, to wortk inside Easy Debian desktop enviromnent (LXDE) Jul 11 14:36:13 = inside xephyr Jul 11 14:36:26 work = correctly work [- now it allow only lowercase lettersm no numbers or special chars Jul 11 14:36:56 N900 keyboard layout - including custom hardware remap - work by copying rx-51 file from Maemo to same location under easy debian Jul 11 14:37:31 Estel_: check pm (irc)^^ Jul 11 14:37:48 hoever, external keyboard connected via freemangordon's extkbd package, works great on Maemo - also for ED programs run from Maemo, but not from xephyr Jul 11 14:38:24 bbl Jul 11 14:53:37 i'm going crazy - how's the mobile traffic counter widget called? Jul 11 14:54:36 ooh, personal dataplan monitor Jul 11 14:54:39 found it Jul 11 14:58:41 kerio: with adapter yes, would never use that on a slot... as the guys replied after you Jul 11 15:26:42 will build-essential from the maemo sdk repo fit on my n900? Jul 11 15:54:19 kerio: mobile traffic counter is in settings-phone Jul 11 16:00:31 DocScrutinizer05: yeah but there was a neat widget that displays that same counter on the home screen Jul 11 17:07:05 DocScrutinizer05: if i provide external poer to my peripheral, is it safe to simply stop bme, and switch N900 usb to host-mode without using booston? or do i always have to booston? Jul 11 17:08:40 *powe Jul 11 17:08:46 gawd. Jul 11 17:26:17 Sicelo: you have to hit vboost button in h-e-n GUI anyway Jul 11 17:27:13 if you do manual hostmode the hacker way, it's safe to apply external vbus power instead of starting booston script, same momnent Jul 11 17:28:12 the 1707 PHY chip detects VBUS voltage, but it doesn't mind where from it origins Jul 11 18:03:08 DocScrutinizer05: as long as there is >0.65v present at the base, the transistor will be biased irrespective of ib? Jul 11 18:03:38 vi__: ?? Jul 11 18:04:05 this statement is correct? Jul 11 18:04:12 vi__: if that's a generic question, then the answer is "yes" Jul 11 18:04:32 where Ib==the current flowing into the base. Jul 11 18:05:04 also, Ie=Ic+Ib. Jul 11 18:05:26 if U(e-b) is >0.65..0.7V there's no way no current flows into base Jul 11 18:06:35 I thought as much. Jul 11 18:15:35 Sorry Guys, Does Maemo.org work for you? Jul 11 18:17:18 says who? Jul 11 18:17:29 oops Jul 11 18:34:57 monoceros, yes it does Jul 11 18:46:23 yes, now it works also for me... thank you Jul 11 18:46:31 monoceros, http://www.downforeveryoneorjustme.com/maemo.org Jul 11 18:47:01 thanks for info DocScrutinizer05 :) Jul 11 18:57:59 andre__: or isup.me Jul 11 18:58:13 MohammadAG: your alternate lockscreen. i don't like it Jul 11 19:00:04 Ahah thank you andre__ and kerio :) Jul 11 19:09:29 Sicelo: you're welcome! :-) Jul 11 19:18:30 I updated usbmode.sh script: http://atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz/~pali/kernel-power/usbmode.sh Jul 11 19:18:52 Now autodetection of speed working on my tested devices without problem Jul 11 19:19:07 DocScrutinizer05, see ^^^ Jul 11 19:19:32 I think script is now complete Jul 11 19:20:04 all maemo testers: test this new script for usb host mode Jul 11 19:20:33 will it work on previous KP? or only 51? Jul 11 19:20:51 usage: ./usbmode host (activate host mode) ./hostmode peripheral (deactivate host mode) Jul 11 19:21:02 Sicelo, yes only for kp 51 Jul 11 19:21:07 ah Jul 11 19:21:19 it use new charger driver for boost Jul 11 19:21:45 Sicelo, booston daemon script was moved to kernel Jul 11 19:22:13 i'm not of 51 yet. tell me .. this new script - is it safe to use with external power as well? Jul 11 19:24:05 Sicelo, should be safe Jul 11 19:29:24 thanks Jul 11 19:32:24 Pali: i'm not sure speed autodetect is that good of an idea Jul 11 19:36:23 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bv3X5y-ajtc Jul 11 19:36:30 err Jul 11 19:39:21 too late for my n900! Jul 11 19:43:16 so, in short how do I use the new charger chip module? Jul 11 19:43:38 do I stop bme, insmod bq+charger module. Jul 11 19:43:40 ? Jul 11 19:43:50 or is there more to it than that. Jul 11 19:44:07 * vi__ waves to Pali. Jul 11 19:44:33 vi__: use that script, for instance Jul 11 19:44:37 oh, you mean in general Jul 11 19:44:45 i doubt it's ready for "primetime", so to speak Jul 11 19:49:25 vi__, look at: http://atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz/~pali/projects/maemo/bq2415x.html Jul 11 19:50:11 vi__, you must stop bme and then load bq2415x_charger.ko module Jul 11 19:51:01 when bq2415x_charger is loaded it auto charge battery when charger is attached Jul 11 19:51:27 also it autodetect wallcharger and set correct current limit Jul 11 19:52:27 also chip stop charging when battery is fully charged Jul 11 19:52:37 so charing working without user interaction automatically Jul 11 20:01:56 kerio: Thanks :D Jul 11 20:04:15 MohammadAG: the media controls are kinda weird Jul 11 20:04:26 and wtf, the beach in the background Jul 11 20:17:34 kerio: It was a concept more than anything Jul 11 20:17:35 QtLockscreen bases on my code Jul 11 20:18:44 hm Jul 11 20:18:49 so qtlockscreen is supposed to be better? Jul 11 20:31:30 On the stock media player - has anyone seen audio files seeking back to the beginning and stopping after ~2 mins sometimes? Jul 11 20:31:50 SpeedEvil: yep Jul 11 20:31:53 noticed multiple times Jul 11 20:32:00 on pr1.2, but apparently the bug is still there Jul 11 20:32:13 not sure if it's a mafw bug or if it's a mediaplayer bug, i hope it's the latter Jul 11 20:32:25 now i'm using OMP, but i haven't played a lot of music there, so i can't say it works better Jul 11 20:32:44 it used to happen a lot, especially when changing song a lot Jul 11 20:32:57 i said "a lot" a lot, didn't i Jul 11 20:39:59 pali, that is a work of bueaty. Jul 11 20:40:30 kerio: Not ready for prime time? I was haxing maemo when you were still in diapers. Jul 11 20:41:48 :o you had OS2005 in 1995? Jul 11 20:41:51 damn, you're l33t Jul 11 20:42:23 no, OS2004 right? Jul 11 20:42:26 maemo1 Jul 11 20:42:51 maemo 0.001a - alpha proof of concept version. Jul 11 20:43:40 of course there was no hardware back then, we just drew it on peices of slate with a bark pencil. Jul 11 20:51:12 hmm, so what's missing from the bq modules? the userland part? Jul 11 21:29:20 kerio: aiui missing is the signalling from USM ENUM power negotiation to charger max current, anf the replacement for hald-addon-bme Jul 11 21:29:31 USB* Jul 11 21:29:48 the what? Jul 11 21:30:05 hmm? Jul 11 21:30:06 "It also detect USB/host charger and dedicated/wallcharger, so working without user interaction." Jul 11 21:30:17 -- Pali, http://atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz/~pali/projects/maemo/bq2415x.html Jul 11 21:30:20 dunno Jul 11 21:30:40 hell, you can even force a particular mode in addition to going with auto mode Jul 11 21:31:03 hell, *I* specified that Jul 11 21:31:22 so what's the missing signalling? Jul 11 21:33:10 I'm not sure if pali implemented anything regardin that, but when you plug your N900 to a PC via USB hub, the hub will tell (actually PC will) "N900, you can draw max 300mA, as PC delivers 500 and I need 100 and there's a kbd as well that needs another 100) Jul 11 21:33:16 " Jul 11 21:33:53 this is happening deep in USB drivers, and I dunno how tightly pali coupled that to charger chip Jul 11 21:34:33 so would setting the n900 to charger mode make it such as much power as it can? Jul 11 21:34:35 I'd hope not too tight since it's a complex theme with lots of niche cases that work slightly different to usual case Jul 11 21:34:52 *suck Jul 11 21:35:08 it sounds dangerous Jul 11 21:35:17 (for the host and the rest of the devices) Jul 11 21:35:47 it *might* result in N900 suck 500mA unconditionally, and that *might* cause some PC to blow chunks, usually under windows and sw side, but occasionally even hw side Jul 11 21:36:06 the sheevaplug comes to mind, actually Jul 11 21:36:20 its power supply can barely sustain 500mA plus the rest of the system Jul 11 21:36:39 plugging in "bad" usb devices can and will cause the PSU to blow up Jul 11 21:36:46 (ish) Jul 11 21:36:59 well, not really, but it'll stress it Jul 11 21:37:46 what's much more lacking in daily usage though is the hald-addon-bme and libbmeipc.so that allows hal to display meaningful status of charger etc Jul 11 21:38:35 and in the end takes care to shut down system gracefully instead of simply pulling the plug when battery is completely on its knees Jul 11 21:38:39 so... the battery icon? Jul 11 21:38:57 oh right, there's also the graceful shutdown Jul 11 21:41:19 I *think* there should be a better way not involving HAL and the bq24140/bq27x00 and bluetooth and whatnot, since iirc the twl4030 has two thresholds, one for graceful and one for ultimate shutdown. Alas iirc this isn't used Jul 11 21:42:23 for sure you'll get no battery icon and no bat-low warnings without hald-addon-bme Jul 11 21:43:22 and 80% of the crappy acme-battery-monitors out there will cease to work Jul 11 21:45:36 hm, what's the twl? Jul 11 21:45:41 as opposed to bq Jul 11 21:47:34 apparently pali has no taste for dill sauce. Jul 11 21:47:54 I wish FMG would keep a blog like that. Jul 11 21:48:16 twl is the TI companion chip that does power managment, USB PHY (in some cases, not the n900, and some other stuff Jul 11 21:48:23 It would be majorly beneficial when he comes to try and find work post uni. Jul 11 21:48:50 i see Jul 11 21:49:03 isn't that what BME uses? Jul 11 22:23:53 g evening Jul 11 22:50:47 morning Jul 11 22:51:14 morning Jul 11 22:52:06 * DocScrutinizer05 ponders to rite lengty explanation to kerio Jul 11 22:52:21 DocScrutinizer05: for what? Jul 11 22:52:24 * DocScrutinizer05 decides against it Jul 11 22:52:28 kerio: no Jul 11 22:52:43 better explain to me how to get the libs in the right place for building armel targets Jul 11 22:52:55 ouch, noob here Jul 11 22:53:13 yawning noob Jul 11 22:53:15 usually $PATH has it Jul 11 22:53:28 libraries? hardly Jul 11 22:53:41 but no it is looking somewhere in the target compiler directory Jul 11 22:54:59 well a package having -dev at the end should have postinstall script looking if it is running from device or sdk and place the libs at the right place, no? Jul 11 22:55:13 libraries are "fun" stuff Jul 11 22:55:19 always Jul 11 22:55:37 had a symlink loop a while ago Jul 11 22:56:40 http://www.tldp.org/HOWTO/Program-Library-HOWTO/shared-libraries.html Jul 11 22:57:01 pretty decent info Jul 11 22:57:07 app-management should change to something like there is a base system all can use, special stuff needs to be packed with the program Jul 11 22:57:41 you're free to do that Jul 11 22:58:10 debian should start something like that and have "stable" announced 'base' Jul 11 22:58:36 man ld-linux Jul 11 22:58:44 I don't care about fscked suse or foobuntu Jul 11 22:59:03 ;) Jul 11 23:00:04 I am familiar with ld-linux Jul 11 23:00:33 but usually everything works over her Jul 11 23:00:34 e Jul 11 23:00:44 also with ld-library-path? Jul 11 23:01:32 and the always ignored ldconfig ;-p Jul 11 23:04:43 I should buy a new netbook the first day it is on the market, again. 15 kernels and at least 100h later I had a working device and was used to booting into init 1 every second boot Jul 11 23:17:58 tape a raspi to an lcd screen Jul 12 01:11:50 Meanwhile: Bloodsucking Parasite Named After Bob Marley Jul 12 01:18:39 Hi Jul 12 01:19:53 Three out of every five major patent suits involve Apple Jul 12 01:20:41 How many in here does still use N900 as their main phone? Jul 12 01:20:50 I did. For today. Jul 12 01:20:51 me Jul 12 01:21:06 It made me realize exactly how shitty the Harmattan browser is. Jul 12 01:21:10 I just moved my main 'landline' onto it. Jul 12 01:22:01 @GeneralAntilles Well. The default browser in N900 is pretty slow. Jul 12 01:22:19 Despite that it actually works. Jul 12 01:22:25 I can actually visit websites and browse them. Jul 12 01:22:34 and click on small links Jul 12 01:22:44 Unlike with the various WebKit-based piles of poo that are passed-off as browsers by other platforms. Jul 12 01:23:15 What about the upcoming piles of chrome? Jul 12 01:23:35 @GeneralAntilles What websites? N9's browser works fine for me. Jul 12 01:24:12 SpeedEvil, Google can go die in a fire. Jul 12 01:24:19 General: Use Opera Jul 12 01:24:36 DocScrutinizer: infobot joined! Jul 12 01:24:57 GeneralAntilles: I in many ways agree, though I've ordered a nexus 7. Jul 12 01:25:02 RST38h: Opera doesn't integrate nicely niether into Maemo or MeeGo. Jul 12 01:25:15 louis: it integrates nicely enough for me Jul 12 01:26:32 RST38h: When you open it on N900 it shows a keyboard right? Jul 12 01:33:50 louis__: my n900 is main phone, main computer and occasional modem for my laptop Jul 12 01:34:15 jpinx: Nice Jul 12 01:35:32 louis__: the browser sux - depending on the specific site (how scripty/flashy it is) but that's life ;) Jul 12 01:35:59 I feel like there're more community apps and open source apps in development for the N900, than the N9. Jul 12 01:37:20 louis__: there almost certainly is,but a lot of it is too technical for me Jul 12 01:38:45 jpix: Have you tried some browser under development for N900 like the midori browser? :) Jul 12 01:39:50 I tried midori a while back - it's worse than the standard Jul 12 01:40:51 jpix: Loading website or the interface? Jul 12 01:40:55 louis__: if you want to be fancy, install a chroot, install debian with really basic X and install swiftfox (stripped down firefox) Jul 12 01:41:30 I've tried Chromium in Easy Debian ;) Jul 12 01:41:46 * jpinx is allergic to google Jul 12 01:42:29 I have every script/cookie/flash blocker known to man installed ;) speeds thing up a lot Jul 12 01:42:31 * louis__ does only use Google for searching. Jul 12 01:42:48 louis__: use duckduck Jul 12 01:43:12 jpinx: It's based on Bing right? Jul 12 01:43:21 no Jul 12 01:43:41 go and research it ;) Jul 12 01:45:06 Right okay ;) Jul 12 01:46:01 SpeedEvil, I was thinking about it, too. Jul 12 01:46:14 I have a fascination with 7" tablets even though I have no use for them in my life. Jul 12 01:47:17 GeneralAntilles: I was considering an upgrade of my Wopad i7 tablet to one with 1G of RAM - and it was either a no-name chinese one for $150ish, or one with a _much_ faster processor, bluetooth, high res screen, ... for $199 Jul 12 01:48:13 Yeah, it looks nice Jul 12 01:48:29 Supposedly being sold around cost. Jul 12 01:48:40 It's actually almost exactly the same measurements as my existing tablet Jul 12 01:48:44 to a couple of mm Jul 12 01:50:45 nexus7 pricing is weird. Can understand in us gooogle is hoping on google play content, but in UK nexus7 wont get all that, yet comes with same peanuts price.. and in eu the google play situatuin is presumably similar to UK, yet price is double.. Jul 12 01:51:11 I dunno. Jul 12 01:51:18 I recently bought a book on google play. Jul 12 01:51:28 Admittedly - more would be good. Jul 12 01:51:44 * ShadowJK is considering an Asus TF700 with keyboard dock.. Jul 12 01:52:26 Google's got so much cash Jul 12 01:52:42 Spreading Android is probably more important than making bucks on commodity hardware. Jul 12 01:52:44 availability is shitty though. Jul 12 01:52:44 And also I keep thinking it'd be infinitely more useful with a proper os :) Jul 12 01:52:53 "" Jul 12 01:53:13 ShadowJK, yeah, well, when there's a proper mobile OS available. . . . Jul 12 01:53:32 GeneralAntilles; well it's essentially a laptop but with android Jul 12 01:53:43 Oh, the TF700? Jul 12 01:54:40 * ShadowJK wonders if he can buy from google play uk store, and if not, if that would violate eu single markets directives :) Jul 12 01:54:44 GeneralAntilles; yes Jul 12 01:55:11 loleu Jul 12 01:55:35 amazon store is US only - for android Jul 12 01:57:33 ShadowJK: needs a remote shell ;) Jul 12 01:58:23 I want the next tablet I buy to have pop-out quadcopter blades. Jul 12 01:58:27 So I can't drop it. Jul 12 01:58:49 Magic Jul 12 01:59:07 It does not have to be made out of a cat. Jul 12 01:59:13 Though I'd pay extra. Jul 12 01:59:28 Might be smelly Jul 12 01:59:44 * jpinx gives SpeedEvil a mini-parachute Jul 12 02:01:25 SpeedEvil: fwiw - I saw heavy duty silicon cases for various phones and tablets in the market - and the guy demonstrating their "bouncy-ness" ;) Jul 12 02:01:47 :) Jul 12 02:02:01 I have wondered about doing something with some CF fabric. Jul 12 02:19:25 The USB port broke on my N900 :/ Jul 12 02:20:05 louis__: there is reams about fixing that on the web Jul 12 02:21:43 SpeedEvil: fwiw - I use my n900 standing on buses etc and I use a wrist-strap -- both to prevent it clattering on the floor and to deter snatchers ;) Jul 12 02:22:31 it also means I can let go deliberately to find money for tickets etc and not worry Jul 12 02:23:19 * jpinx 's only real gripe with the n900 is the high battery use Jul 12 02:27:10 jpinx: Seems like you have to be every good with a soldering iron: http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=693493&postcount=12 Jul 12 02:28:01 louis__: reasonable - and use a very fine pointed soldering iron Jul 12 02:28:51 louis__: you can do the same trick with araldite or similar, but be very careful to not be messy ;) Jul 12 02:29:17 jpinx: Too bad it's hard to just buy a N900 motherboard w/ all things attached except cover. Jul 12 02:29:54 louis__: I buy any "broken" n900's I find if they are cheap - just for the parts Jul 12 02:30:13 some only need cleaned and reflashed ;) Jul 12 02:31:18 jpinx: It's hard to find broken N900's on ebay. Jul 12 02:31:39 * jpinx is not in USA Jul 12 02:32:59 * louis__ is not in USA either. Jul 12 02:33:38 I live in Denmark, Europe so I find parts from either germany or UK, Jul 12 02:38:22 * jpinx travels a lot ;) Jul 12 02:45:25 * louis__ have 2x N900s with broken USB, and 1x with broken mic. Have brought them used. Jul 12 02:45:46 And 1x N9 with stock power button! Jul 12 02:46:16 * louis__ should be hired as crash tester for Nokia/Jolla. Jul 12 02:49:25 louis__: sounds like you have easily got the makings of at least 2 n900's ;) Jul 12 02:50:25 hi, where is the audio file of camera when taking a photo? Jul 12 02:54:49 Do you use some nice software for your N900? :) Jul 12 02:56:18 louis__: nope -I played with chroot et a few years ago but my situation requires me to reboot often and setting it up every time was too much of a pain **** ENDING LOGGING AT Thu Jul 12 02:59:58 2012