**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sun Jul 29 02:59:59 2012 Jul 29 03:00:35 actually I recall some user asking similar thing just 2 weeks ago Jul 29 03:01:32 thunderstorm is close enough for visible lightning now Jul 29 03:01:37 still no power :D Jul 29 03:02:36 ooh, no power with 50.1Hz ? how's that? Jul 29 03:03:25 http://wiki.maemo.org/Fremantle_Unsupported_Bluetooth_profiles Jul 29 03:03:28 oh that's from a website Jul 29 03:04:40 aaah Jul 29 03:04:59 LaoLang_cool: seems PAN is better supported than DUN actually Jul 29 03:05:19 LaoLang_cool: now the question is: can your BB offer PAN server? Jul 29 03:05:30 or only DUN? Jul 29 03:05:57 http://wiki.maemo.org/Bluetooth_PAN Jul 29 03:06:29 DocScrutinizer05, palm is a dead phone, I don't think it support fancy feature :( Jul 29 03:06:55 hmm Jul 29 03:07:16 sorry I'm short of good pointers off top of my head Jul 29 03:07:42 @previous comment about 50.1hz: I'll bet you that the Nokia charger for your N900 will work on just about any frequency, so long as the voltage range is right... Because it's just got a bridge rectifier->capacitor setup on the input, versus some sort of PFC circuit. Jul 29 03:08:01 I think it's possible for sure to get DUN and/or PAN client running on N900, but I don't know how and don't know good pointer Jul 29 03:08:30 robbiethe1st; that was from website, I was trying to check how widespread the outage is Jul 29 03:08:37 oh Jul 29 03:08:58 if lots of load suddenly disconnected, I would've expected the frequency would be near the upper end of the allowed range Jul 29 03:09:13 Probably Jul 29 03:09:26 But that assumes you have something that cares about the frequency. Jul 29 03:09:58 also there was a line on national grid that failed twice within 5mins, relatively close to where i am, but 20 minutes before power was lost here Jul 29 03:10:47 robbiethe1st; spinning generators do, if load is lost they start spinning faster Jul 29 03:11:08 No, I mean load wise. Jul 29 03:11:28 right Jul 29 03:12:13 And, most importantly, if that increased frequency would cause any /harm/ or make anything work outside of acceptable parameters(a 3600rpm motor spinning at 3700 rpm? Likely not a problem) Jul 29 03:12:46 robbiethe1st: (you have something that cares...) actually every powerplant generator cares Jul 29 03:12:55 ok, I give up to share palm's networking to n900. Jul 29 03:12:57 They Jul 29 03:13:06 trying to share pc networking to n900 now :) Jul 29 03:13:17 I'm on windows xp sp3 Jul 29 03:13:39 ...You don't get what I mean. The power plants do care, and will carefully control it as best they can, due to(at least in the US) it being used as a time source. Jul 29 03:13:48 I want to share the networking via usb, is it possible? Jul 29 03:14:09 LaoLang_cool: yes Jul 29 03:14:21 On the load side, however, I'm saying there isn't a lot that cares, except for things that A, use special input circuits, or B, use it as a time source. Jul 29 03:14:31 And our chargers are not one of those. Jul 29 03:14:45 LaoLang_cool: http://wiki.maemo.org/Networking Jul 29 03:14:57 DocScrutinizer05, thank you, reading on it Jul 29 03:16:19 list of powerlines on national grid tripping has grown by 4 near where I live :D Jul 29 03:18:09 robbiethe1st: that's never been the point though Jul 29 03:18:16 ? Jul 29 03:19:18 robbiethe1st: ShadowJK checked for frequency of his power grid on a webpage to find if in his region there's been some sudden noticeable drop of load, which *automatically* causes increase of frequency Jul 29 03:19:34 ah, yeah Jul 29 03:20:25 it'd have to be a pretty wide outage to affect frequency, as entire nordic region (excluding iceland etc) runs synchronous grid Jul 29 03:20:59 and 50.1 is at or close to upper limit Jul 29 03:21:08 ok, I'm reading http://wiki.maemo.org/USB_networking, but I don't know which part is for share networking from pc to n900, too words to hard to undsreatnd for me :( Jul 29 03:21:25 50.02 now Jul 29 03:21:39 I'm on windows Jul 29 03:22:38 http://wiki.maemo.org/N900_USB_networking Jul 29 03:22:58 LaoLang_cool, why not just get a $5 usb-> wifi adaptor, setup Ad-hoc network? Jul 29 03:23:27 http://wiki.maemo.org/N900_USB_networking#Starting_USB_network_mode_with_Windows Jul 29 03:23:35 robbiethe1st, I want to share pc networking to n900, not n900's to pc :) Jul 29 03:23:42 Yeah Jul 29 03:23:54 You can do Internet Connection Sharing on Windows Jul 29 03:24:23 Share the connection you have otherwise /to/ the wifi ad-hoc network, and through that to the N900 Jul 29 03:26:29 robbiethe1st, I prefer to usb wire, it's easy to find Jul 29 03:27:09 Makes sense, but it's going to be harder Jul 29 03:27:12 On windows. Jul 29 03:27:19 DocScrutinizer05, thank you for the link, I can understand, what I need is just to download a packge and install it :) Jul 29 03:28:09 robbiethe1st, yes. DocScrutinizer05 give a link to a easy instruction :) Jul 29 03:29:04 You need to download a package, configure it, then edit about a half-dozen files. Jul 29 03:29:14 And edit the registry. Jul 29 03:29:34 Not impossible, but it'll take you a bit of time Jul 29 03:30:13 robbiethe1st, oh, you scared me a lot! Jul 29 03:30:41 That's what that page says, anyway, and I'm sure it's correct. Jul 29 03:30:41 s/you scared me a lot/you make me scared/ Jul 29 03:30:43 LaoLang_cool meant: robbiethe1st, oh, you make me scared! Jul 29 03:31:39 LaoLang_cool: it's only 2 files that need edit on N900 Jul 29 03:32:18 DocScrutinizer05, will try it, downloading, networking is slow :) Jul 29 03:33:05 >> (actually MADDE for Windows is not required, but just files maemo_usbnet.inf and maemo_usbnet.cat for installation network device Linux USB Ethernet/RNDIS Gadget)<< Jul 29 03:35:02 LaoLang_cool: even http://wiki.maemo.org/N900_USB_networking#One-time_Quick_.26_Dirty_Connection Jul 29 03:36:10 >>on your Other Computer, open a terminal and type the following for Ubuntu; **modify appropriately for other computers**<< though Jul 29 03:36:50 I dunno enough of windows to tell you how to transscript those 3 lines to dosbox cmd speak Jul 29 03:37:11 DocScrutinizer05, thank you, lunch time now, will back when finish ;p Jul 29 03:38:56 ooops, forget my last 3 posts, it's about ssh *to* N900 only Jul 29 03:39:03 uhhh.. so I have no power, ups is switched off without battery, but connected. Outside lit up blue, ups beeped. Jul 29 03:39:10 doesn't help for proper internet sharing Jul 29 03:40:01 ShadowJK: :-o Jul 29 03:40:17 ShadowJK: took me a while to parse your post Jul 29 03:43:36 seems like it's going to pass within 300m Jul 29 03:45:56 LaoLang_coo_: actually it seems http://wiki.maemo.org/N900_USB_networking#Windows is the right for you Jul 29 03:51:55 weuuut? whjy all the mess? Jul 29 03:52:06 LaoLang_coo_, just install QTMobileHotspot... Jul 29 03:52:18 follow it's GUI instructions on how to setup USB networking with windows... Jul 29 03:52:34 then, from windows, use it's GUI to share internet connection with USB networking Jul 29 03:52:52 on N900, provide IP of Pc with windows as gateway... Jul 29 03:52:56 and as a DNS Jul 29 03:53:09 job done Jul 29 03:53:21 * ShadowJK wonders why mobilehotspot is involved Jul 29 03:53:29 (of course, IP associated with USB networking, can be done from qtmobilehotspot IIRC Jul 29 03:53:39 ShadowJK, because it allow fool-proof usb networking setup Jul 29 03:53:49 fort someone who doesn't feel OK with editing dozens of files Jul 29 03:53:58 and o nexit, it clean it up again ;0 Jul 29 03:54:31 i.e. "automagically" does all steps,. that otherwise are manual (including many fail-safe solutions to clean settings in case of crash, etc) Jul 29 03:54:49 ah Jul 29 03:55:01 I'm not discouraging LaoLang_coo_ from messing by hand, as it's very educational, but I bet he will end without any connection at all, at the end, at least initially :P Jul 29 04:03:15 >>install the Mad Developer application on N900 and start it and press "Usb Networking" -> "Windows Network" -> "Close".<< Jul 29 04:04:25 >>Press button "Edit" and enter following IP Address: 192.168.2.15, Netmask: 255.255.255.0, Peer IP: 192.168.2.14. and then press "Configure" (this address will be used for the SCP client as well).<< Jul 29 04:05:40 that's it, no messing with any file editing, no mobilehosespot Jul 29 04:06:31 http://wiki.maemo.org/N900_USB_networking#Windows Jul 29 04:08:43 well, mad developer on N900 instead of 1t mobilehotspot for common user? why so? Jul 29 04:08:56 s/lt/qt/ Jul 29 04:09:32 BTW, qtmobilehotspot is based on improved code from both mobilehotspot (non qt) and mad developer ;) Jul 29 04:12:24 >>WARNING: This software requires custom kernel!<< maybe because of that? Jul 29 04:13:45 qt mobilehotspot requires kernel-power? I msut admit I wasn't aware of that. But cmon, every normal person uses kp ;) Jul 29 04:14:12 but seriously, if it really does, for sure mad dev is fail safe solution working on stock too Jul 29 04:14:40 Wait, someone uses stock kernel? Jul 29 04:14:45 in any other case, I would recommend Qt mobilehotspot, as it's brillantly written, clean and well proven one Jul 29 04:14:54 robbiethe1st, You're touching delicate matters :D Jul 29 04:15:11 But, like... stock kernel is sucky. Jul 29 04:15:18 "someone" not only uses kp, but also demand ABi compatibility with it Jul 29 04:15:22 * Estel_ hides Jul 29 04:15:29 yes, it is Jul 29 04:15:35 Screw that. Jul 29 04:20:31 yeah sure, you probably would suggest to install an alternative OS to change the wallpaper. Based on the rationale that "it's brillantly written, clean and well proven one" Jul 29 04:21:32 don't you think installing a new kernel is a bit of an overkill to make USB networking work? Jul 29 04:22:24 and btw I'm not demanding anything like what you made up i'd do Jul 29 04:23:28 I'm just clearly saying you shall stop trying to forcefeed custom kernels to everybody Jul 29 04:23:32 DocScrutinizer, qt mobilehotspot also have other functionality like... mobile hotspot?:P that actually requires kernel-power (as most up-to-date funcionality, anyway...) Jul 29 04:23:44 odds are like 99% that LaoLang_coo_ have kp installed, anyway Jul 29 04:23:57 if not, I admit (and did so) that mad developer may be fastewr option Jul 29 04:23:59 faster* Jul 29 04:25:13 nevertheless, You msut understand that 99,995 of people consider kernel power and CSSU as true basics, that should be present on device of all power users Jul 29 04:25:46 (heck, even N900's bought from people who are definitelly *not* power users have KP installed, most of the times. Even for some units, that haven';t had rootsh/sudser installed!) Jul 29 04:25:48 uhuh, please show me the poll that gave you that numbers Jul 29 04:26:15 DocScrutinizer, should I re-use Your argument, stating that "i'm not going to get caught in Your troll trap"? ;) Jul 29 04:26:21 You know reality as well as I Jul 29 04:26:38 of course everyone is free to *not* use KP Jul 29 04:26:49 as everyonme is free to *not* use any kind of root access on N900 Jul 29 04:26:53 just my reality is quite a bit different than yours, thank God for that Jul 29 04:26:59 but demanding assuming such situation from others is kinda overkill Jul 29 04:27:29 no surprise, as You're mostly active on IRC (but even here, 90% of people use KP, as you may easily guess ;) ) Jul 29 04:27:58 * DocScrutinizer05 yawns and turns away Jul 29 04:28:01 You don't have problems with considering rootsh/sudser as basic things, but You deny to acknowledge that for other people, kernel-power is in exact samed category? Jul 29 04:28:10 well, good night, then :) Jul 29 04:28:30 and no, i don't want to hear about batterioes exploding due to kp Jul 29 04:28:31 * Estel_ hides Jul 29 09:11:02 goddammit, why does HAM actually list the repos in sources.list? :( Jul 29 09:14:36 oh, beautiful Jul 29 09:14:55 i can put my freaky repos in a different file in sources.list.d and ham will ignore them Jul 29 09:14:56 :D Jul 29 09:20:53 yo vi_ Jul 29 09:21:11 should i enable extras and e-testing if i have -devel already enabled? Jul 29 09:21:47 I do not know. Jul 29 09:23:37 How am I supposed to enjoy using my n950 when I know I cannot take it outside? One slip and it is fucked. Jul 29 09:23:52 No spares, no replacements. Jul 29 09:24:15 wth... my n900 is having weird issues... just randomly shuts down or drains power Jul 29 09:24:28 vi_: buy an otterbox for it! :D Jul 29 09:24:32 ruskie: powertop Jul 29 09:24:43 ruskie: new battery Jul 29 09:24:43 yeah I'll check with that as soon as I can Jul 29 09:24:45 kerio: no one made such acessories for it. Jul 29 09:24:49 kerio, it is a new battery Jul 29 09:24:54 like 2-3 months old Jul 29 09:24:55 original Jul 29 09:25:10 vi_: get to work then :D Jul 29 09:25:15 do you have batterygraph? Jul 29 09:25:31 used to run it but stopped ages ago Jul 29 09:25:40 ruskie: same here. Jul 29 09:25:58 anyway will see once I get into a runnable state again Jul 29 09:26:06 however if it is somthing that only triggers from time to time it may be worth reinstalling. Jul 29 09:26:36 To see if there is a massive CPU spike at the point of mass drainage. Jul 29 09:27:18 it's weird I charged it up yesterday.. unplugged it.. and when I wanted to use it now... off... Jul 29 09:27:59 runaway process has eaten your battery. Jul 29 09:28:09 I blame kernel power settings. Jul 29 09:28:49 :C Jul 29 09:28:56 why do you blame k-p-s? Jul 29 09:30:10 because some times it used to spazz out and eat my battery. That was a few versions back though so who knows if it still does. Jul 29 09:30:20 I don't use power kernel Jul 29 09:30:59 well I'll be. Jul 29 09:31:34 ~powertop Jul 29 09:31:35 somebody said powertop was available from http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=491333, or http://www.2shared.com/file/11135428/bbe19274/powertop_111-1_armel.html Jul 29 09:32:29 ~seen a grown man naked Jul 29 09:32:31 i haven't seen 'a grown man naked', vi_ Jul 29 09:46:20 :p Jul 29 09:55:05 zeq1: hi Jul 29 10:08:18 hxka: hi Jul 29 10:08:28 freemangordon: hello Jul 29 10:08:59 hxka: what did you do pal, clicked kernel-power uninstaller? Jul 29 10:09:55 No, I did run 'sudo /usr/sbin/kernel-powr-uninstall' Jul 29 10:10:59 aah, even better :D. But why? I wrote in the post that if you have kernel-power it will remain, no new kernel will be flashed. Jul 29 10:11:19 Just for testing Jul 29 10:11:51 well, you are aware that uninstaller flashes the stok kernel, are you? Jul 29 10:11:57 *stock Jul 29 10:11:58 Yep Jul 29 10:12:28 now, you have a pile of thumb2 compiled binaries, how do you think, will they run without errata workaround? Jul 29 10:13:15 No, no, no Jul 29 10:13:21 by removing the only kernel on your device, which provides kernel-feature-errata-workaround, you remova all of the packages that depend on that kernel feature Jul 29 10:13:28 The problem caused by 'apt-get remove --auto-remove -y kernel-power-flasher' line Jul 29 10:13:38 hxka: what then, i don't understand Jul 29 10:13:45 It produce that: http://paste.kde.org/524660/ Jul 29 10:14:20 hxka: kenel-power and kernel-power-modules depend on kernel-power-flasher Jul 29 10:15:08 so, by removing kernel-power-flasher you remove kernel-power and kernel-power-modules, and all of the packages that depend on kernel-feature-errata-workaround Jul 29 10:15:54 and you remove also the packages the depend on hildon-desktop, libgtk, microb-engine, etc,etc Jul 29 10:16:12 That's what I'm trying to say from beginning: if 'community kernel' would not be separate package but a newer version of kernel, there won't be such problem at all Jul 29 10:17:03 hxka: did you have kernel-cssu installed before executing 'apt-get remove --auto-remove -y kernel-power-flasher'? Jul 29 10:17:10 No Jul 29 10:17:28 so, in what exactly way your problems are caused by kernel-cssu name Jul 29 10:18:10 hmm, i see Jul 29 10:18:22 yeah, you have your point Jul 29 10:19:55 hxka: I got it, you want the kernel in cssu-thumb to keep users from unbootable device if they have kernel-power installed and run the uninstaller by accident, do you? Jul 29 10:21:06 That would be a solution Jul 29 10:23:36 hxka: but not the correct one ;). It is a bad solution to workaround a bug in kernel-power uninstaller by calling kernel-cssu "kernel" Jul 29 10:24:10 there is just no way of stopping anyone from bricking his/her device Jul 29 10:30:39 merlin1991: ping Jul 29 10:31:19 freemangordon: devil's advocate: if it's supposed to be *the* kernel then it should be called "kernel", or at the very least replace the stock kernel package Jul 29 10:31:19 freemangordon: you said there is no particular reason for calling it kernel-cssu. I can give a reason to call community kernel as kernel: it supposed to be replacement of kernel. And having different package for that seems to me like 'dirty hack'. Jul 29 10:31:32 yeah, what hxka said Jul 29 10:31:45 also lol at hxka for removing half of his packages Jul 29 10:32:30 hxka: I agree, but it is still not a part of the "official" CSSU. When/if the time comes there will be a discussion on that and I will not forget your argumentation. Jul 29 10:32:56 the point of cssu-thumb repo was to prove/not if stable thumb2 is possible on n900 Jul 29 10:33:43 Now it is proven it is, despite what a bunch of so called "gurus" say. But there is still a long way to go ;) Jul 29 10:33:50 hxka: ^^^ Jul 29 10:34:07 kerio: Luckily, I did a backup yesterday Jul 29 10:35:03 hxka: point taken, thanks Jul 29 10:35:53 freemangordon: glad to hear that ;) Jul 29 10:45:24 freemangordon: HAM wants me to use pc suite to upgrade to thumb13. I have 85mb free rootfs. Also kcssu throws a message about breaking 3rd party policy and gives no ok button Jul 29 10:45:59 qwazix_900: and what is on "problems" tab? Jul 29 10:46:21 qwazix_900: have you ran cssu enabler? Jul 29 10:46:43 kerio: hold on Jul 29 10:46:48 hello, I'm trying to make a HildonEntry/GtkEntry only accept numbers (make the virtual keyboard only show numbers for input) but I can't find any information about it, all I found is a 3.0 features that doesn't appeart to exist anymore in 5.0 (http://maemo.org/api_refs/3.0/hildon-docs/hildon-libs/hildon-libs-hildon-input-mode-hint.html) Jul 29 10:46:54 any advice is appreaciated Jul 29 10:48:12 freemangordon: conflict with application packages: Linux kernel for community ssu (bootimage for u-boot and multiboot) Jul 29 10:48:23 freemangordon: btw, I've been reading the -thumb thread, how (un)safe is to upgrade, I mean, how many people do you think is using it? how many issues are known? how often new issues are found? Jul 29 10:48:25 qwazix_900: ooh, are you using multiboot/uboot? Jul 29 10:48:31 no Jul 29 10:48:51 clean device flashed yesterday Jul 29 10:49:03 qwazix_900: remove bootimg by hand Jul 29 10:49:09 only cssu-thumb and fcamera Jul 29 10:49:14 freemangordon: ok Jul 29 10:49:14 <_berto_> luca_: http://maemo.org/api_refs/5.0/beta/gtk/GtkEntry.html#hildon-gtk-entry-set-input-mode Jul 29 10:49:37 it was installed because of apt stupidness Jul 29 10:50:08 luca_: it is used by at least 20 people, no reported problems so far. Jul 29 10:50:27 (despite some packaging stuff) Jul 29 10:51:03 qwazix_900: you can also remove it by using HAM Jul 29 10:51:29 I just did Jul 29 10:51:33 :) Jul 29 10:51:58 waiting for HAM to get itself together and try again Jul 29 10:52:16 hehe, I am going to have some lunch then :P Jul 29 10:52:46 qwazix_900 i hope you also have cssu-testing Jul 29 10:53:02 otherwise you're gonna have a bad time Jul 29 10:53:23 kerio: stop that, enabling CSSU-thumb also enables CSSU-testing. And qwazix is not a noob Jul 29 10:53:27 k Jul 29 10:53:43 freemangordon: and they idea is to make the standard cssu compiled with thumb in the future? Jul 29 10:54:16 luca_: well, CSSU maintainers don't like that ;) Jul 29 10:54:23 freemangordon, it continued (and threw me out of irc). Thanks. Jul 29 10:54:29 freemangordon: I'm very tempted to try it but that's my only and main phone :) Jul 29 10:54:49 luca_: I am using it on my only and main phone :P Jul 29 10:55:16 but it is upt to you of course :) Jul 29 10:55:40 luca_, Ive been using it for about a month with no problems Jul 29 10:56:19 freemangordon: too bad, so, unless (you or somebody else) keeps updating the thumb fork, it won't get updates, right? is it possible to switch between the 2 without flashing (I don't care if I have to manually install packages using dpkg, or whatever) Jul 29 10:56:30 qwazix810: well, there was an issue with TLS TBH Jul 29 10:56:44 qwazix810: and you see any difference in performance/responsivness? Jul 29 10:56:48 And I dont know if its fresh device speediness but my N900 is faster than my N9 lately Jul 29 10:57:00 luca_: you won;t believe it Jul 29 10:57:32 freemangordon, indeed, but I didnt encounter it but once Jul 29 10:57:58 it is fixed now, but we were talking about issues and that one popped ;) Jul 29 10:58:12 I just recall it Jul 29 10:58:37 luca_: you may check on thumb thread on TMO about how often it is updated Jul 29 10:58:52 I just wrote a nice replacement for bluetooth-sysinfo Jul 29 10:58:55 freemangordon, I cant wait to test your fennec :) Jul 29 10:59:27 qwazix810: unfortunately it is still far from neing usefull as microb replacement :( Jul 29 10:59:32 *being Jul 29 11:00:35 and knowing how fast is thumb2 compiled microb-engine, you know ;) Jul 29 11:00:54 Id just like a usable browser with sync. Because all my passwords are on ff+sync Jul 29 11:01:23 qwazix810: well, will upload fennec in thumb repo after I have some lunch Jul 29 11:01:37 I dont really care to replace microb just yet, until more sites break with it Jul 29 11:02:05 it is not that bad, but i would love it to be useful as microb replacement Jul 29 11:02:23 well, ok. I will opload it in 1-2 hours Jul 29 11:02:27 *upload Jul 29 11:03:10 I would love that too of course, but that would mean cursor mode which I understand is near impossible. I will test as soon as Its up Jul 29 11:03:35 1-2=-1 so you will travel back in time to upload it? :p Jul 29 11:04:06 qwazix810: we have all the tools needed to replace gecko backend Jul 29 11:04:48 that is good news Jul 29 11:05:25 I wonder if we could use maemo 4 microb ui which IIRC is open Jul 29 11:05:45 are there any tools to make it stop memleaking or using more mem than it can handle? Jul 29 11:05:48 so we have a full fast open browser Jul 29 11:06:03 rebooting the n900 stays necessary after a week or so ( Jul 29 11:06:09 qwazix810: we don't need to replace ui for a gecko replacement Jul 29 11:06:27 some friend even sold it since he said picking up phonecalls gets impossible if you leave it on for a month ... Jul 29 11:06:34 I know, I was just saying, for the sake of openness Jul 29 11:06:47 Gh0sty: care to share which firmware/CSSU is that? Jul 29 11:06:58 _berto_: thanks, it worked! Jul 29 11:07:11 Gh0sty, you have to see my N9. Needs every day reboot Jul 29 11:07:12 the latest and greatest pr 1.3 with the community updates, a power kernel ... Jul 29 11:07:33 have swapolube on it too Jul 29 11:07:43 but seems even maemo forgets stuff after it reboots Jul 29 11:07:52 recently mine starts locking again after a reboot Jul 29 11:08:03 while in the settings auto locking is disabled?!? Jul 29 11:08:10 Gh0sty: either you have some crappy SW installed which eats your RAM, or you need to move your swap to uSD Jul 29 11:08:26 after a while swap gets fragmented Jul 29 11:08:34 how do you move swap to uSD? Jul 29 11:09:15 Gh0sty: use your favourite search engine :P Jul 29 11:09:19 think i once read something about that but that involved reinstalling the whole thing or something? :p Jul 29 11:09:24 no Jul 29 11:09:47 well guess it wouldnt be that more difficult than a normal linux Jul 29 11:09:57 create swap partition mkswap. swapon Jul 29 11:10:02 just repartition your uSD, do mkswap on partition you dedicated for swap, do swapon ;) Jul 29 11:10:02 swapoff the other one :p Jul 29 11:10:08 exactly Jul 29 11:10:30 * freemangordon is off for lunch Jul 29 11:10:34 i sometimes tend to forget its not windows, you dont need to be a brainsurgion to understand it :P Jul 29 11:10:47 i dont know if its kcssu related but after plugging in, my battery icon shows false values until I reboot Jul 29 11:11:18 I mean plugging in for a little while Jul 29 11:12:00 it shows almost full now, and I know that it should be around 30% Jul 29 11:12:15 BME silliness maybe? Jul 29 11:12:26 were you using kernel-power before? Jul 29 11:12:40 also try shutting down, removing the battery for a couple of seconds and putting it back in Jul 29 11:12:47 it resets one of the battery chips, can't remember which one Jul 29 11:12:51 always, since v46 Jul 29 11:13:16 basically since mobile hotspot was out Jul 29 11:13:33 kerio, ill try Jul 29 11:13:38 gtg now Jul 29 11:13:42 bbl Jul 29 12:04:34 I am looking for someone who has a N900 who can try something for me by typing in (in xterm or ssh) sysinfo-tool -g /certs/ccc/pp/wlan-chanel and tell me if you see something that isn' Jul 29 12:04:39 isn't FCC Jul 29 12:08:03 hello, i am trying to use touch.facebook.com in microb but the page is not functioning properly, the 3 icons above are missing and the side bar just reload the page when clicked, Jul 29 12:34:25 hello. I'd like to update Maemo from kp 50 to 51. I was wondering if this will mess with U-Boot? Jul 29 12:36:01 most definetely Jul 29 12:36:12 actually maybe not Jul 29 12:36:17 is it the bundled kernel? Jul 29 12:36:30 I'm not sure which version of U-Boot I have installed right now, Pali edited the first post of U-Boot thread since I installed it... http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=81613 Jul 29 12:36:42 bundled with what? Jul 29 12:36:58 uboot on the n900 usually has the kernel "embedded" in the image too Jul 29 12:37:06 so you can either load that or a kernel from somewhere else Jul 29 12:38:13 what do you need uboot for, btw? Jul 29 12:38:25 yes, When I installed U-Boot it flashed the strock kernel to nand Jul 29 12:39:01 but I have kp50 too Jul 29 12:39:11 Pali gave me instructions Jul 29 12:39:14 installed as a -bootimg? Jul 29 12:39:28 I think so, need to check... Jul 29 12:39:37 apt-cache policy kernel-power-bootimg Jul 29 12:39:57 I want U-Boot to be able to boot Nemo from Sdcard Jul 29 12:40:19 i see Jul 29 12:40:51 why do you hate fremantle? :'( Jul 29 12:41:13 I DON'T Jul 29 12:41:21 what would make you think thaT? Jul 29 12:41:47 ...I'm just not satisfied with portrait mode... Jul 29 12:42:05 and curious about what's coming! :-) Jul 29 12:42:17 what's coming is more fremantle! Jul 29 12:42:21 anyway, wait for Pali Jul 29 12:42:23 I sure hope so! Jul 29 12:42:25 he's here often Jul 29 12:42:41 in the meantime, install cssu! Jul 29 12:42:59 I'm running TEsting Jul 29 12:43:37 But I want the super-fast transitions with forced rotation enabled Jul 29 12:43:55 Haven't found the perfect combo yet Jul 29 12:44:14 older work on transition didn't support CSSU Jul 29 12:44:38 now there's a whole bunch of transition mods out there Jul 29 12:44:39 1) portrait is bad and you should feel bad Jul 29 12:44:49 2) transitions.ini is still the same, so why shouldn't it work? Jul 29 12:45:05 still testing what suits me best Jul 29 12:45:18 what do you mean "portrait is bad"? Jul 29 12:45:25 what's that supposed to mean? Jul 29 12:45:35 it's evil! Jul 29 12:45:39 it was sent here by the devil! Jul 29 12:45:43 you're evil Jul 29 12:45:49 :-D Jul 29 12:45:51 and the n900 is a bit too bulky for it to be comfortable for me Jul 29 12:45:55 so clearly it's wrong Jul 29 12:45:57 what the hell man? Jul 29 12:46:45 decent one-handed operation would make this device complete for me Jul 29 12:47:42 there's just a lot of situations for me , where I'd like to shoot off a quick sms or select a funky track from the media player Jul 29 12:47:47 with just one hand! Jul 29 12:47:49 bennypr0fane: OMP supports portrait Jul 29 12:47:55 pretty well Jul 29 12:47:55 I know Jul 29 12:48:00 yay! Jul 29 12:48:01 got it installed Jul 29 12:48:19 actually, i think that forcing everything to portrait will still set stuff in landscape when the keyboard is open Jul 29 12:48:30 so you'd get the best of both worlds, so to speak Jul 29 12:48:48 But they are never gonna bless N900 with a real portrait vkb Jul 29 12:48:49 (that's how i set the Phone app on my n900, because the accelerometer is annoying) Jul 29 12:49:00 of course not, vkbs are also evil Jul 29 12:49:08 bennypr0fane: http://wiki.maemo.org/Community_SSU Jul 29 12:49:08 and it's really, really hard to make a good one Jul 29 12:49:15 Oh, sure. I forgot about that Jul 29 12:49:22 They ARE evil Jul 29 12:49:49 i wonder if the opera mobile portrait kbd can be "extracted" to work on other stuff too Jul 29 12:50:03 btw Pali doesn't mention anything about the kp 51 meesing up U-Boot: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=85665 Jul 29 12:50:27 it's more evil than the CSSU pseudo vkb! Jul 29 12:50:41 I mean the one from Oper mobile Jul 29 12:51:36 It just says to install U-Boot (done) and then install kernel-power? Jul 29 12:52:51 after I have this up and running, I'll get USB HOST MODE! 8-) Jul 29 12:53:10 (-8 Jul 29 12:53:11 qwazix, vi__: uploading fennec in thumb repo(will take maybe 15 minutes), have in mind you should manually install libqtm-12 Jul 29 12:53:18 h-e-n works with kp50 too Jul 29 12:53:23 Opera Mobile is closed source Jul 29 12:53:31 what is h-e-n? Jul 29 12:53:40 ~h-e-n Jul 29 12:53:41 do ~hostmode and ~factinfo hostmode, this is your maemo council :-/ Jul 29 12:53:52 ~hostmode Jul 29 12:53:52 [hostmode] piece of crap written by morons to fry other people's devices! beware! Jul 29 12:53:59 ~hen Jul 29 12:53:59 do ~hostmode and ~factinfo hostmode, this is your maemo council :-/ Jul 29 12:54:09 ~fuck yourself Jul 29 12:54:31 nice dialog, infobot and freemangordon! Jul 29 12:55:08 who is that "warning" actually coming from? Jul 29 12:56:35 it's Pali who announced (and made?) USB hostmode. Maemo Council hates Pali? Jul 29 12:56:56 bennypr0fane: wait, what? Jul 29 12:56:56 no Jul 29 12:56:58 hostmode-gui Jul 29 12:57:04 it was there since a long time ago Jul 29 12:57:32 http://maemo.org/packages/package_instance/view/fremantle_extras-devel_free_armel/hostmode-gui/0.2-2/ Jul 29 12:58:01 what about hostmode-gui? Jul 29 12:59:03 "Maintainers: Jul 29 12:59:03 Mohammad Abu-Garbeyyeh" Jul 29 13:00:10 Guys, it never stops confusing me how people get dissed in this channel and there's no sign of this kind of controversy on TMO... Jul 29 13:00:19 bennypr0fane: 'twas a joke Jul 29 13:00:26 it's a funny, strange little world Jul 29 13:00:38 what? by the infobot? Jul 29 13:01:00 bennypr0fane: h-e-n is hostmode-gui Jul 29 13:01:19 there is a recent package Made by Pali, which is aimed to replace it Jul 29 13:02:03 bennypr0fane: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=85658 Jul 29 13:02:12 didn't tried it though Jul 29 13:02:40 ...and "!!Note that pre release kp51 does not provides kernel-feature-usbhost-new!!" Jul 29 13:03:25 haven't tried hostmode yet either Jul 29 13:03:33 old one neither Jul 29 13:03:59 I was waiting for a stable solution Jul 29 13:04:13 time has come no, I hope? Jul 29 13:04:18 *now Jul 29 13:06:30 freemangordon, you have any idea, whether or not installing kp51 will kill UBoot? Jul 29 13:07:29 bennypr0fane: "stable", lol Jul 29 13:11:42 kerio It no say "beta" or "testing", no warnings whatsoever Jul 29 13:13:03 no idea, how you define stable. If not in extras-testing, extras-devel, or explicitly labbelled alpha/beta, and coming from a trustworthy source, I'll assume it's stable Jul 29 13:13:08 well, it works properly for a lot of people Jul 29 13:13:58 bennypr0fane: depends on which kernel has u-boot embedded in Jul 29 13:15:06 my v of U-Boot has stock kernel embedded Jul 29 13:15:14 I think Jul 29 13:16:29 updated kp in HAM. at reboot, U-Boot is still there, but kp is still v.50 :-( Jul 29 13:17:26 you need kernel-power-bootimg Jul 29 13:17:53 is that in extraS? Jul 29 13:18:55 jonwil: etsi/eu Jul 29 13:19:17 qwazix_900: fennec is in the repo Jul 29 13:19:29 right. I hate it when I read stuff wrong/overread it. :-/ Jul 29 13:20:37 qwazix_900: but you should install libqtm-12 by hand Jul 29 13:20:57 freemangordon: downloading asap :) Jul 29 13:21:06 :) Jul 29 13:23:55 freemangordon: 17a1thumb0? Jul 29 13:24:05 yep Jul 29 13:24:10 freemangordon: ok Jul 29 13:28:06 I have an apt-get update problem. "W: Conflicting distribution: http://repository.maemo.org fremantle-1.3 RElease (expected fremantle-1.3 but got ) Any idea what this means? Jul 29 13:29:52 "W: You may want to run apt-get update to correct these problems" except, apt-get update is what produced this output :-$ Jul 29 13:51:49 wow, windows phone 8 can take screenshots Jul 29 14:02:07 freemangordon, fennec is very good, but memory footprint is huge. Now it's on 190MB with two tabs open. Jul 29 14:02:46 qwazix: wat Jul 29 14:02:49 that's... not good Jul 29 14:04:59 kerio, I've tried virtually every fennec version on any device I got that fennec can run on, and this is the only one that's usable (even on dual core androids, fennec is... bad, to put it politely) Jul 29 14:05:33 qwazix: but even considering buffers and cache, i only have 90mb of free ram now D: Jul 29 14:05:34 (except N810, i fear I don't want to see what happens) Jul 29 14:05:43 After spending far too many hours trying to integrate a modern QEMU into SB, I think I've come to realise why SB1 development was abandoned in favour of SB2. Jul 29 14:06:03 htop now shows 220M VIRT on fennec Jul 29 14:06:18 oh firefox, you so silly Jul 29 14:06:32 qwazix: what version are you referring to? Jul 29 14:06:39 17a1 Jul 29 14:06:55 on what device? Jul 29 14:07:08 N900 Jul 29 14:07:28 freemangordon's and zeq's fennec Jul 29 14:08:01 qwazix: oh, was it pushed to community-thumb? Jul 29 14:08:17 qwazix: where?? Jul 29 14:08:32 yep, there Jul 29 14:11:20 anyone got an egg? I can fry one on my N900 now... Jul 29 14:12:48 qwazix: because of fennec? Jul 29 14:14:16 probably, but I'm crash-testing it, I opened the most js/img heavy sites I've made to see what happens Jul 29 14:14:45 it has slowed down but it's still responding Jul 29 14:27:59 fennec is a hungry boy| Jul 29 14:28:01 ! Jul 29 14:29:04 it ate ALL my rams Jul 29 14:29:51 and it didn't quit with the x button. I had to killall it to get rid of the process Jul 29 14:30:22 about:memory Jul 29 14:30:55 w8 Jul 29 14:31:51 ###################################### forms.js loaded Jul 29 14:31:51 ###################################### content loaded Jul 29 14:31:52 ###################################### forms.js loaded Jul 29 14:31:52 ###################################### content loaded Jul 29 14:31:52 creating 1! Jul 29 14:31:54 [TabChild] SHOW (w,h)= (0, 0) Jul 29 14:31:56 Segmentation fault Jul 29 14:32:00 lame Jul 29 14:32:26 :( Jul 29 14:32:46 probably swapping Jul 29 14:33:08 about:memory started with 45mb Jul 29 14:33:09 about:memory should show where it's going Jul 29 14:33:29 now I'm opening a few tabs to see what's happening Jul 29 14:35:19 what do you mean swapping? Jul 29 14:35:20 zeq, which one is total mem used? Jul 29 14:36:14 vi_: I mean the process wasn't sufficiently resident to be quit in reasonable time Jul 29 14:37:56 Removing fennec ... Jul 29 14:37:56 dpkg: error processing fennec (--remove): subprocess pre-removal script returned error exit status 1 Jul 29 14:37:59 E: Sub-process /usr/bin/dpkg returned an error code (1) Jul 29 14:38:01 Errors were encountered while processing: fennec Jul 29 14:38:19 seems to be a problem with the uninstall script as well. Jul 29 14:38:19 qwazix: I don't know Jul 29 14:38:46 zeq, should html5 (webm) videos work or not? Jul 29 14:39:19 zeq, memory sizes @about:memory seem reazonable, except a vsize one that is 140M Jul 29 14:39:22 qwazix: they don't work for me last time I tried. Jul 29 14:39:30 well, they try to work Jul 29 14:39:44 but the video isn't updated properly Jul 29 14:40:05 ok, good to know Jul 29 14:43:57 after hitting minimize memory usage, things seem better Jul 29 14:44:31 zeq: deleting ~/mozilla/fennec/* has fixed the seg faulting. Jul 29 14:44:46 however it does not want to apt-get remove. Jul 29 14:45:38 vi_: I've noticed something gets left in an unrecoverable state in .mozilla/fennec after crashes Jul 29 14:46:29 is that (reduce memory usage) a flag? or is it a one-off cache flush? If it is a flag maybe we can have it always on considering the lack of ram on N900? Jul 29 14:46:53 NFC Jul 29 14:47:15 zeq: perhaps somthing is created with the wrong permissions and cannot be overwritten. Jul 29 14:55:39 vi_, don't uninstall just yet, after a bit of use it's become a lot more fluid. It's pretty fast now with 3 heavy tabs open. It still eats your ram though Jul 29 14:56:55 qwazix: It closed happily with the x button for me. Jul 29 14:58:11 check htop, no fennec process there? Jul 29 14:59:44 qwazix: nope Jul 29 15:00:13 hmmm, ok suppose it was just one of those things that happen once in a while Jul 29 15:02:08 I still believe that xul is to blame for all that slowness Jul 29 15:02:40 vi_, yep now it quit normally here too Jul 29 15:21:29 talking about fennec, I installed fennec1.1 on the N810, and it is faster than fennec ever was on the N900 (except this thumb version now, and it's near). Maybe this info will help you find a cause of the slowness. Jul 29 15:25:28 maybe the gecko engine was just not meant to be run on arm. Jul 29 15:26:21 runs fine, even with 96mb compcache. Jul 29 15:27:31 but N810 is still arm no? Jul 29 15:48:01 fennec1.1 will probably run really quickly on the n900 too Jul 29 15:49:25 qwazix: sure N810 is ARM Jul 29 15:49:35 qwazix: even OMAP Jul 29 15:50:21 kerio, I was there when it was released, you couldn't call that quickly without all the worlds sugar coating Jul 29 15:51:20 the only barely usable fennec on the N900 till now was 8-9 and that wasn't a joy to use Jul 29 15:52:01 DocScrutinizer05: that's what I thought, so the processor shouldn't be the problem Jul 29 15:53:56 * DocScrutinizer05 idly wonders if N810 OMAP2 might actually be faster on thumb than N900 OMAP3 with the SiErr-workaround it needs Jul 29 15:54:33 * DocScrutinizer05 waiting for shitstorm rising Jul 29 16:03:27 DocScrutinizer05: oh you ;) Jul 29 16:13:03 For sure it doesn't make battery exploding Jul 29 16:13:06 morning, guys :) Jul 29 16:13:38 qwazix, does fennec have some kind of cursor mode? or mozilla failed to provide it after 12 versions? Jul 29 16:14:07 nothing I'm aware of, except long tap to select text Jul 29 16:14:15 what's a RegExp that'd match "http://www.facebook.com/*/posts/*" Jul 29 16:14:19 for use with QRegExp Jul 29 16:14:22 hm, virtual memory is, most of the time, assigned to swap, and assignmed is bad word - it's jsut "reserved". It shouldn't be much of a problem, although of course, "minimize memory usage" reduces that too Jul 29 16:14:37 qwazix, and when external mouse is connected? Jul 29 16:14:49 generic Maemo's cursor does work, or is ignored like in microB Ui? Jul 29 16:15:15 Estel_, don't know but freemangordon says it works just like the cursor is your finger Jul 29 16:15:41 doesn't sound bad, after all.for what else, except highlighting text, we need cursor? Jul 29 16:15:47 right click is possible, yep? Jul 29 16:15:53 (as long press) Jul 29 16:16:25 btw it would be great to add some keyboard shortcut to automatically go into highlight mode Jul 29 16:16:40 and another one to automatically invoke context menu like with long press :D Jul 29 16:16:49 qwazix: fennec has two processes opened, fennec and plugin-container, both eating equal amount of RAM Jul 29 16:16:50 usability on N900 goes up by 100% Jul 29 16:17:06 freemangordon, do you consider it easidly doable? Jul 29 16:17:22 (adding keyboard shortcut or keyboard shortcut + tap as instant-long-press-menu activator?) Jul 29 16:17:32 Estel_: it is pontless if we don't reduce memory usage Jul 29 16:17:36 any ideas, for what we would need cursor mode, otherwise? Jul 29 16:17:42 MohammadAG, http:\/\/www\.facebook\.com\/[^\/]*\/posts\/.* Jul 29 16:17:52 freemangordon, sure, but AFAIK real memory used is OK Jul 29 16:17:55 it's only virtual memory Jul 29 16:18:01 Estel_: no, it is not Jul 29 16:18:05 it s RSS Jul 29 16:18:05 and qwazix said hitting "minimize memory usage" flag makes it OK Jul 29 16:18:09 ah Jul 29 16:18:34 Estel_: your "running gags" (if they are even meant as such) are so damn lame I consider putting you on my ignore list again Jul 29 16:18:34 Estel_, hovering, and dragging (or using things like svgedit) Jul 29 16:18:41 well, do we even know what cause such memory usage? was it the same before maemo patches? Jul 29 16:19:06 Estel_: do you have mozilla on your desktop? Jul 29 16:19:10 DocScrutinizer, well, everyone is free to do so, but is kinda childlish from your side - like You're very overreactive about Your own self :) Jul 29 16:19:15 Estel_, 170mb VIRT is not ok, but it makes it usable, if it's the only app running Jul 29 16:19:55 I don't go berseker when you openly attack me, like in times of battery exploding discussion, and You're mad about some little " ;) " aimed and some random nonsense, without even mentioning Your name? Chillout, DocScrutinizer Jul 29 16:19:58 the other problem it that it takes ages to load even google Jul 29 16:20:03 freemangordon, yea, I do Jul 29 16:20:13 freemangordon: have you tried without any plugins? Jul 29 16:20:24 well, check memory usage, it does not have maemo patches :P Jul 29 16:20:32 well, consider what's more childish, a lame meme ala "and by the way kartago needs to get destroyed" that annoys and bores everybody, or the reaction on that which is add ing you to /ignore Jul 29 16:20:47 zeq: plugins? Jul 29 16:20:49 freemangordon, my firefox on desktop, having 15 tabs open, uses 93 memory total, including virtual Jul 29 16:20:58 freemangordon, I noticed that, it's like I had slow dns, (i do have slow dns from time to time so I didn't mention it) Jul 29 16:21:01 or not Jul 29 16:21:03 93 is private memory Jul 29 16:21:21 freemangordon: plugin-container should just be for containing nsplugins Jul 29 16:21:24 qwazix: there is even a bug opened Jul 29 16:21:34 and please quote "I openly atacked you during any discussion of last 24h" or live with attribute "liar" Jul 29 16:21:40 I'm just wondering why it gets so big Jul 29 16:21:42 zeq: I'm afraid no, it is used for everything Jul 29 16:21:58 I don't have plugins.enabled to true Jul 29 16:22:00 poorly named? Jul 29 16:22:06 could be Jul 29 16:22:23 qwazix, thanks :D Jul 29 16:22:32 np Jul 29 16:22:33 DocScrutinizer, I think quoting discussion from last 24 h is more boring to "audience" and could be done in private channel, but if You insist - when I asked for arguments about overclocking leading to exploding battery, you called me troll ;) Jul 29 16:22:53 but DocScrutinizer, seriously, do whatever please You, if You need to add me to ignore list, just do it, without need to pre-announce Jul 29 16:23:02 freemangordon: have you brought up the memory usage on #mobile? Jul 29 16:23:04 I'm quite tired of Your overreactivity, so do what pleases You Jul 29 16:23:12 can I make my n900 into an ip cam? Jul 29 16:23:16 can we push it into private query or end here? Jul 29 16:24:10 Estel_: count posts of me and you, then tell me who of us both is overreacting and perpetuating (intended) insulting meme and flooding the channel Jul 29 16:24:50 I installed firefox sync on microb. And it stays there (I had tried years ago and it succeeded but was nowhere to be found after restart). The problem is the preferences page doesn't show up ok. The text-edits are missing and I can see only connect/disconnect/syncnow buttons Jul 29 16:25:03 anybody knows about xul? Jul 29 16:25:09 my posts count been around 5, which was enough for you to flood the channel with liteally hundereds of "replies" Jul 29 16:25:10 probably equally, especially when I'm begging - use query! it's of no interest to anyone else here, except us two Jul 29 16:25:21 zeq: no, I am still waiting you to fill all of the bug requests :) Jul 29 16:25:21 and not even stopping 24h later Jul 29 16:25:45 unless you like to argue in public for sake of arguing, we can easily talk it out on private channel Jul 29 16:25:55 zeq: and to confirm that ! does not make any difference in maemo5 Jul 29 16:25:56 :P Jul 29 16:26:11 I'm not interested in *any* talking with you about such BS Jul 29 16:26:15 freemangordon: I get distracted too easily :/ Jul 29 16:26:39 wasted far too much time on qemu/sb this weekend :( Jul 29 16:26:59 zeq: yeah, i see, that is why I remind you from time to time :D:D:D Jul 29 16:27:09 Interesting, microb is recognized as fennec by sync... I wonder how much fennec code is based on microb Jul 29 16:27:20 I'm just informing you that your style already is concieved intentionally provocing and offensive Jul 29 16:27:24 aka trolling Jul 29 16:27:27 DocScrutinizer, so just stfu? It looks msierably between al prollductive talk lines other people are doing here. After all, you msut learn to live with small and innocent jokes like "exploding battery due to OC" - such things remain in memory, without any negative stance against You :) Jul 29 16:27:46 qwazix: microb IS fennec, i.e. gecko Jul 29 16:28:15 freemangordon, You've said we have everything we need to replace gecko engine behind microB Jul 29 16:28:22 do you mean replacing it with fennec backend? Jul 29 16:28:28 or separate project? Jul 29 16:28:29 I mean the sync.xpi, has a switch clause somewhere and does a on fennec and b on regular firefox Jul 29 16:28:31 Estel_: sorry I don't buy your innocent mindset here Jul 29 16:28:45 DocScrutinizer, no problem, I can live with that :) can you? Jul 29 16:28:52 you've proven several times too often what your real intentions are Jul 29 16:28:53 microb executes the fennec part of the code (or so it seems) Jul 29 16:29:09 zeq: seriously, lets finish that until romaxa still have interest in helping us. We do't have any chance without him Jul 29 16:29:22 s/until/wjile/ Jul 29 16:29:24 freemangordon meant: zeq: seriously, lets finish that wjile romaxa still have interest in helping us. We do't have any chance without him Jul 29 16:29:56 DocScrutinizer, sure. My real intentions are to dig Your everwhitstanding authority via sneaky and sub-consciounesly reminding absurdish nonsenses You've picked, like battery exploding due to OC. Happy now? Jul 29 16:30:02 has freemangordon says, microb and fennec are the same thing. microb just has a native UI, and is based on a version from a few years back. Jul 29 16:30:07 how much both of you are getting paid for this ongoing comedy? DocScrutinizer Estel_ Jul 29 16:30:21 NIN101, I got potato order Jul 29 16:30:21 zeq: :nod: Jul 29 16:30:24 I'm proud of it! Jul 29 16:30:38 will make somke fried chips of it, later Jul 29 16:30:40 s/has/as/ Jul 29 16:30:41 zeq meant: as freemangordon says, microb and fennec are the same thing. microb just has a native UI, and is based on a version from a few years back. Jul 29 16:31:04 well, there are a bunch of fixex from Nokia Jul 29 16:31:05 I just feel pissed about somebody pasting bullshit memes to provoke me while same time claiming my relies were oh-so-unproductive compared to his BS Jul 29 16:31:28 replies* Jul 29 16:31:46 wrong assumption - I don't want to provoke You, in fact, I haven't even though about You while writing about battery exploding :) Rather had such idiotic claim by someone on forum, in mind Jul 29 16:32:03 I know, its hard to belive that I'm not thinking about You 24/7, but it's time to realize it Jul 29 16:32:10 bwahahaha suuuuure Jul 29 16:32:16 guys, can't you just leave that for hours when noone reads but you Jul 29 16:32:32 freemangordon, I was asking for 5 lines to bring it into private query, if necessary :P Jul 29 16:32:40 freemangordon, zeq, yeap, and I was wrong about the code block, it probably just crashes before it reaches there anyway Jul 29 16:32:43 does not matter Jul 29 16:32:54 Estel_: ^^^ Jul 29 16:33:17 last time I checked, query wasn't read by anyone than participants Jul 29 16:33:42 Estel_: then just query doc Jul 29 16:34:04 if he does not respond, well, i think you will still have sound sleep Jul 29 16:34:23 well, good idea, I didn't wanted to do so for someone who clearly replied that isn't interested in query - I felt "forcing" query a little offensive Jul 29 16:34:28 but it seems unavoidable :) Jul 29 16:34:49 true, my sleep is sometimes too sound ;() Jul 29 16:35:01 Estel_: ( freemangordon, I was asking for 5 lines to bring it into private query, if necessary :P) sure, but YOU decide it *is* necessary since you can't stop continuing on the topic anyway Jul 29 16:35:14 ?query DocScrutinizer Jul 29 16:35:16 ops Jul 29 16:35:31 don't even bother, i told you i'm not interested Jul 29 16:35:45 just STFU Jul 29 16:38:14 well that was fun. Jul 29 16:38:18 anyway... Jul 29 16:38:21 freemangordon, but considering that microB ui is closed, how do You plan to make it utilize updated features fennec provide? Jul 29 16:38:30 zeq: ! Jul 29 16:38:34 freemangordon: ! Jul 29 16:38:39 vi_, ! Jul 29 16:39:00 zeq: after all it seems "if (mIsTopLevel || mListenForResizes) {" behaves in the same way as "if (!mIsTopLevel || mListenForResizes) {" Jul 29 16:39:03 Thankyou for this marvellous fennec update. Your hardwork is appreciated by all. Jul 29 16:39:06 on maemo5 that is Jul 29 16:39:08 I mean, are we sure that it is compatible at all? No changed invokes, function name,s etc? Jul 29 16:39:23 Estel_: of course it is not compatible Jul 29 16:39:41 that is why Nokia invented eal Jul 29 16:39:54 stands for engine abstraction layer Jul 29 16:40:06 uh, translator? Jul 29 16:40:09 and it is the layer we can implement Jul 29 16:40:10 freemangordon: have you tried applying the microb patches to a newer xulrunner? Jul 29 16:40:10 yes Jul 29 16:40:12 i mean, it translates calls? Jul 29 16:40:21 wow, sounds nice Jul 29 16:40:54 now we *only* need to find out, why gecko from microB uses reasonable ammount of RAM, and gecko from current fennec used 20x more for same task ;) Jul 29 16:41:10 but, but, using microBUi mean, that we still won't be able to properly use add-ons :( Jul 29 16:41:19 Estel_: http://browser.garage.maemo.org/docs/browser_paper.html Jul 29 16:41:39 zeq: no i didn't Jul 29 16:41:39 even now it is possible to install ones comaptible with current gecko engine, but they're unusable due to gui not implementing extensibility Jul 29 16:41:45 thansk a lot *reading* Jul 29 16:42:29 OTOH, we could use fennec UI and microbUi on the same device, i.e. use microB when we need it's capabilities like cursor mode, and fennec UJI when we need usage of extensions, yes? Jul 29 16:42:33 or tabs Jul 29 16:42:39 or anything that is implemented in UI Jul 29 16:42:41 correct? Jul 29 16:43:49 Estel_: in theory Jul 29 16:44:32 zeq: would you comment on the bugtracker, that it seems the change is not needed. After all we can always open a new bug Jul 29 16:44:57 i will ping romaxa Jul 29 16:45:25 honestly, main problem I have with microB, isn't in it's capabilities due to underlying engine, but with tab-less Ui, and impossibility of adding such things as lazarus form recovery, or spell checker, or... Jul 29 16:45:48 of course it's my private point of view Jul 29 16:47:21 don't want to sound like negatron, as Your work on freenec is wonderful, but considering how well chromikum behaves even through Ed, I wonder if proper Maemo port wouldn't be more effective. I'm sceptical about possibility of teaching mozzila to eat less RAM Jul 29 16:47:25 just thoughts Jul 29 16:47:47 freemangordon: will do Jul 29 16:48:01 zeq: thanks Jul 29 16:49:00 freemangordon, zeq, we don't have any chance of kicking out microB UI, due to bounds with other Maemo components? Jul 29 16:50:00 Estel_: primary goal is to have fully functinal fennec which does not bring n900 to its knees. Jul 29 16:50:12 once we have it, we'll see Jul 29 16:50:25 I managed to run the sync setup wizard on microb, which completes successfully but then nothing happens... Jul 29 16:50:45 qwazix: sync is supposed to work on fennec Jul 29 16:50:58 yeah on fennec it works perfectly Jul 29 16:52:07 one odd bug on fennec. arrow keys do not work in google.com text fields. Jul 29 16:52:38 freemangordon, sounds sane Jul 29 16:52:42 vi_: yeah, fennec does some craxy keyboard remapping, mainly because maemo6 Jul 29 16:52:53 brb, or I will be left without food and water :P Jul 29 16:52:53 Don't know if it is relevant but arrows don't work at all on harmattan fennec Jul 29 16:52:58 fuck maemo 6. Jul 29 16:53:05 we'll get rid of it once major issues (speed and RAM usage are fixed) Jul 29 16:53:48 vi_, You asked how to enjoy n900 if You need to keep it into safe - well, i'm buying leather otterbox for it, already ordered screen protector, and cut one for camera too, from bigger one Jul 29 16:54:27 also, DIY'ing wonderfull capacitive stylus for precision. sure, it still will sux compared to normal stylus on resistive screen, but will be orders of magnitude better than any normal capacitive stylus available for purchase Jul 29 16:54:52 * Estel_ run to shop Jul 29 16:57:37 zeq: going to look at microb patches to see if there is something useful Jul 29 16:59:07 freemangordon you nickalerted me? Jul 29 16:59:08 ah nevermind. "we'll get rid of it" Jul 29 17:00:26 hello, I updated my kp50 to kp51. it's in a bootimage in U-Boot. I can't boot it though, only the stock kernel Jul 29 17:01:09 the screen goes black after it says "starting kernel" Jul 29 17:01:18 ..and powers off Jul 29 17:01:36 how can I diagnose what's wrong? Jul 29 17:06:36 has Pali been sighted here today? Jul 29 17:07:59 bennypr0fane: have you tried reinstalling it? Jul 29 17:12:46 not yet Jul 29 17:13:03 you mean, remove first adn then reinstall Jul 29 17:13:14 freemangordon: there certainly are interesting sounding patches, but who knows what applies anymore. Jul 29 17:14:05 maybe there's a problem with uboot Jul 29 17:15:59 bennypr0fane: It works for everyone else. Jul 29 17:16:19 bennypr0fane: have you tried disabling the watchdogs? Jul 29 17:16:48 watchdogS? Jul 29 17:16:53 what'S that? Jul 29 17:19:09 use Flasher to enter R&D mode with no watchdogs flag. Jul 29 17:19:27 I'm in R&D mode Jul 29 17:19:48 then set the no watchdogs flag. Jul 29 17:23:58 vi_: I'd suspect kernelmodule issue Jul 29 17:24:09 or corrupted kernel image Jul 29 17:24:14 vi_ How do I set the flags? Jul 29 17:24:43 flasher --help Jul 29 17:25:09 and how to remove kernel-power-bootimg? Is it safe to just uninstall it with apt-get/HAM? Jul 29 17:25:24 you need to enable R&D mode, and set --no-*wd flags Jul 29 17:26:19 bennypr0fane: should be safe aiui, since it's just a set of files on your filesystem when you didn't boot to that kernel Jul 29 17:27:21 uBoot config however might not revert to previous state, dunno about how this config gets handled by installation of additional kernel-*-bootimg Jul 29 17:28:00 In kp announcement thread it says never uninstall kernel power packages, only remove via menu entry "Nokia Kernel", but I don't have that I the menu, so I guess that warning does not apply to kp in bootimg? Jul 29 17:28:39 bennypr0fane: your first and best bet would be to compare md5sum of the kernel-power-bootimg, and check size and files of modules dir Jul 29 17:29:24 bennypr0fane: that applies when you flash KP as your primary kernel - that's not how uBoot works Jul 29 17:30:20 of course you never should remove any kernel parts of the kernel you just booted from Jul 29 17:30:45 DocScrutinizer05: now I booted from stock kernel Jul 29 17:31:23 DocScrutinizer05: you wouldn't jhappen to know where the bootimg is located? Jul 29 17:31:33 so you're basically free to do to kernel-power-bootimg whatever you like Jul 29 17:31:43 sorry, nope Jul 29 17:32:11 but virtually everybody else in here should be able to tell you Jul 29 17:32:15 then I guess I'll just ry and reinstall it first Jul 29 17:32:43 crap. this shell doesn't have "whereis" Jul 29 17:33:45 bennypr0fane: check free space on / Jul 29 17:34:50 df -h /lib/modules Jul 29 17:36:35 * DocScrutinizer05 moves 48MB syslog out of /var/log, to cure the 98% used misery Jul 29 17:37:08 DocScrutinizer05 wow, your device must be stuffed! Jul 29 17:38:28 I have 72.7MB available Jul 29 17:39:38 removed kernel-power-bootimg. does make sense to just reinstall it right now, or do I need to do anything else first? Jul 29 17:39:46 so lack of free space is no explanation for a possibly missing install of /lib/midules/*PK*/* Jul 29 17:40:04 *removed it via apt-get Jul 29 17:40:20 should I reboot? Jul 29 17:40:21 reinstall I'd say Jul 29 17:40:35 no need to reboot Jul 29 17:40:56 nothing in your system is accessing those files right now, so no reboot needed Jul 29 17:41:57 It removed kernel-power-settings before, but it doesn't want to reinstall that now Jul 29 17:42:05 sorry I have no uBoot install here, so I can't check what's the supposed dir/file names and sizes Jul 29 17:42:34 ummpf, yesterday I heard it allegedly vanished from repo Jul 29 17:42:56 If only this kind of info wasn't so complicated to dig up from maemo.org Jul 29 17:44:08 you should check your catalogs, and use HAM to install kernels etc system stuff Jul 29 17:44:59 I did have a problem with the repos before Jul 29 17:45:08 But couldn't make sense of it Jul 29 17:45:38 when I apt-get update it says repo conflict-something Jul 29 17:46:29 I did update in HAM before that though, and it was ok Jul 29 17:47:02 just tried to boot kp51 now, still not happening :-( Jul 29 17:47:57 bUt, this seems kp51 installed now, while before I think it was 51r1! Jul 29 17:49:08 how can I check which version of uboot I'm running? Jul 29 17:53:16 DocScrutinizer, You've said that open kernel on N950 can't provide fully open device, as it already runs into bits closed by hardware parts Jul 29 17:53:26 but, how Mer achieve restriction-free device, then? Jul 29 17:53:37 in case of running n9/50 with Mer? Jul 29 17:54:32 mer simply doesn't use the locked bits Jul 29 17:55:11 when there's nothing in system checking the device lockcode, then you won't even notice you can't change the lockcode Jul 29 17:55:47 if there's no aegisfs in system then it won't break Jul 29 17:58:08 here's my apt-get update fail: http://pastebin.com/DQxY1KgD Jul 29 18:00:56 check your catalogs Jul 29 18:01:15 disable all those not needed for what you plan to do Jul 29 18:01:26 (hint: ovi might be one of those) Jul 29 18:01:56 what about extras-devel? Jul 29 18:02:55 disable, usually. Unless you plan to install something from there (hint: e.g. most recent PK) Jul 29 18:03:27 fff HAM is taking forever Jul 29 18:03:36 and disable CSSU-extras or whatever it's called, if you might have that Jul 29 18:03:44 why do you even use HAM :( Jul 29 18:04:01 because we're dealing with kernel installs here Jul 29 18:04:28 won't fapman do the same without issues? Jul 29 18:05:03 well, i see what you mean. fapman catalogs are separate Jul 29 18:05:35 no, fapman is known to fail on exactly those critical installs, like powerkernel etc Jul 29 18:05:52 lol. Jul 29 18:05:57 * RiD hides in a corner Jul 29 18:06:10 i used fapman on those installs Jul 29 18:06:45 HAM is recommended or apt-get in the kp announcement threads Jul 29 18:07:16 I dunno, this seems broken. catalogues are not loading Jul 29 18:07:38 well, then use apt-get, but use HAM to enable/disable/define/delete catalogs Jul 29 18:07:38 probably BCS of this issue Jul 29 18:07:48 oh, there they are. took almost 3 mins Jul 29 18:08:06 that's almost fast for HAM Jul 29 18:08:34 so which one DO I need for this? Jul 29 18:08:45 and what's that issue even about? Jul 29 18:09:17 I don't know for sure what's the issue. But it's evidently something about repos/catalogs Jul 29 18:09:22 I have only maemo.org and extras-testing, and Nokia enabled now Jul 29 18:09:39 and disabling unneeded catalogs always is a very sane thing to do Jul 29 18:10:00 disable testing, enable extras-devel Jul 29 18:10:09 but u think this is related to the kernel not booting? Jul 29 18:10:19 might Jul 29 18:10:34 the kernel in testing for sure isn't what you planned to install Jul 29 18:11:02 ok, it's updating. kp51 is in devel Jul 29 18:11:54 now install kp51 Jul 29 18:12:27 I've had an issue with repos like this (or the same one) before, but I can't remmeber what I did to fix it... Jul 29 18:13:04 you mean install the regular one or bootimg? Jul 29 18:13:49 probably bootimg Jul 29 18:14:22 since aiui you want it to work under uBoot Jul 29 18:14:52 Yes. that's not here in HAM though. In fact, first time I installed it with apt-get bcs of that Jul 29 18:15:40 Here I have only the regular kp51 package, and boot img "for BFS user", whatever that is... Jul 29 18:15:48 DocScrutinizer05: does HAM always read sources.list and every .list in sources.list.d? Jul 29 18:16:06 seems so Jul 29 18:16:24 the HAM specific version of it Jul 29 18:16:34 afaik Jul 29 18:16:52 I suspect Pali never put it in that repo or sth Jul 29 18:17:01 shame, i really wanted to only leave the system repos enabled for HAM and only leave -devel and sdk for apt Jul 29 18:17:02 oh well Jul 29 18:17:13 quite possible, so follow instructions on KP howto or tmo Jul 29 18:18:13 could it have sth to do with the fact that kp version in HAM is 51r1, and the bootimg is 51? Jul 29 18:18:33 I'm guessing the bootimg didn't get that latest fix Jul 29 18:19:35 "Changelog: Jul 29 18:19:35 kernel-power (1:2.6.28-10power51r1) fremantle; urgency=low Jul 29 18:19:35 * Fix bug in bq2415x_charger driver which cause reboot when driver is unloaded" Jul 29 18:21:54 could that be it? If so, how to best alert Pali? Jul 29 18:23:57 how to check the version number of a package? Jul 29 18:24:57 wait for pali to pop up here Jul 29 18:26:40 it says I have the bootimg v. 51r1, so that's not it... :-( Jul 29 18:27:37 I guess I'm stumped for now... Jul 29 18:31:27 you need pali I guess Jul 29 18:31:42 or post a "bug report" to tmo thread Jul 29 18:32:24 * DocScrutinizer05 suspects some problems with kernel name vs uBoot config Jul 29 18:33:00 possibly related to what you'll see when you do ls - l /lib/modules Jul 29 18:33:30 or (also maybe) related to depmod -a Jul 29 18:34:06 OK, full backup of everything (tm) completed, i'm jumping into thumb2 bandwagon :) Prepare vine and hookers Jul 29 18:58:32 Vine? Oh, you're taking the jump Tarzan way. Although I don't really recall whores in the books. I don't think this is canonical. :D Jul 29 19:04:32 ;) Strong Black Vine Jul 29 19:05:25 BTW, no whores! In presence of vine, hookers transform into elegant promiscuous vintage ladies Jul 29 19:05:30 it's know chemical reaction, Ya know Jul 29 19:06:08 Wow. Never knew. ;p Jul 29 19:06:25 but be sure to google for promiscuous translation, though Jul 29 19:07:07 I got little question for sheeps using facebook, if you don't mind. There is possibility to send message to someone who is not inside Your 326r32475446325463253252 friends collection Jul 29 19:07:17 but, are those messages delivery at all? Or redirected to /dev/null? Jul 29 19:07:33 s/delivery/delivered/ Jul 29 19:07:34 Estel_ meant: but, are those messages delivered at all? Or redirected to /dev/null? Jul 29 19:16:01 Pali, ping Jul 29 19:16:07 freemangordon, ping Jul 29 19:16:18 Estel_, I have anonymous messages blocked on my Facebook profile. Jul 29 19:16:41 or rather, non-friend messages. Jul 29 19:16:51 hm, they could at least wanr that user have it blocked Jul 29 19:17:00 used to have them enabled, until someone ranted at me via it. Jul 29 19:17:08 stupid shitbook :( Jul 29 19:17:28 thanks for info, nevertheless Jul 29 19:17:38 http://tech.slashdot.org/story/12/07/29/1627203/facebook-abstainers-could-be-labeled-suspicious?utm_source=slashdot&utm_medium=facebook Jul 29 19:18:45 freemangordon, both kernel-cssu3 and kp51r1 (not suprisingly, as they're same) changed something re watchdog (program to tick watchdogs)? Jul 29 19:19:03 after installing any of those kernels, backupmenu works, but reportf- at start - that Pali' Jul 29 19:19:10 Pali's watchdog haven't been found Jul 29 19:19:18 and of course, it shutdowns after timer Jul 29 19:19:38 EdLin, user comments from that story say that norway killer had a facebook account! Jul 29 19:19:47 so the headline is opposite Jul 29 19:19:58 tank-man, yep. So much for slashdot being accurate. ;) Jul 29 19:19:59 Estel_: I am not aware of any change in that regard Jul 29 19:20:09 better ask Pali Jul 29 19:20:22 freemangordon, I'm 1005 sure that kernel resulted in this change, nothing else installed, and it worked 5 miunutes ago. Jul 29 19:20:24 or report on KP thread Jul 29 19:20:25 Ok,. i'll ask him Jul 29 19:20:29 on kp thread, yea Jul 29 19:25:38 freemangordon, hnuh, sorry for bothering, false alarm. It was because I had already new modules installed, but kernel not flashed yet =) Jul 29 19:25:44 after all, multiboot flash it on first run Jul 29 19:26:01 so no surprise, that backupmenu haven't found /dev/watchdog Jul 29 19:26:07 everything else works fine Jul 29 19:26:14 s/else/now/ Jul 29 19:26:15 Estel_ meant: everything now works fine Jul 29 19:32:36 freemangordon, by any chance, have You managed to build kernel-power-settings 15 and uploaded it to thumb repos? Jul 29 19:35:32 Estel_: I won't do anything until Pali explains what is the situation Jul 29 19:35:50 uh, and you've asked him already? Jul 29 19:36:00 I may do it in kp thread Jul 29 19:36:07 he was here today, for few hours Jul 29 19:36:08 ok, do it Jul 29 19:36:14 np, and thanks :) Jul 29 19:36:15 i missed him Jul 29 19:42:14 nice, only 62 packages remaining for installation. time for some whisky Jul 29 19:55:33 freemangordon, could You, please, tell me version of qt-components-base-theme on your device? Jul 29 19:55:45 same for qt-components-10 Jul 29 19:55:51 what? Jul 29 19:55:52 and iptables Jul 29 19:55:55 sorry for bothering :) Jul 29 19:55:57 version Jul 29 19:56:01 of packages with such name Jul 29 19:56:09 qt-components-base-theme Jul 29 19:56:12 qt-tocmponents-10 Jul 29 19:56:13 why do you think i have such package installed? ok. lemme check Jul 29 19:56:16 iptables Jul 29 19:56:20 I know You have ;) Jul 29 19:56:21 thanks Jul 29 19:56:46 well, maybe except iptables, sorry if this is the case. but the former 2 for sure. Jul 29 19:58:16 dpkg -l qt-components-base-theme Jul 29 19:58:16 No packages found matching qt-components-base-theme. Jul 29 19:58:40 iptables 1.4.12-1maemo1 Jul 29 19:58:48 Estel_: ^^^ Jul 29 19:59:08 wut? It got pulled now, when installing cssu-thumb 0_o Jul 29 19:59:19 same for qt-components-10 Jul 29 19:59:20 wtf Jul 29 19:59:31 now it even want to get upgraded Jul 29 19:59:36 that's qt-mobility 1.0 Jul 29 19:59:40 something is fishy here, I can't recall it being in thumb repo Jul 29 20:00:02 qt-components-10 is qt-mobility? I know name, but can't recall what it is? Jul 29 20:00:16 NFC what qt-components-10 is Jul 29 20:00:44 ah, so qt-components-base-theme is qt mobility 1.0? Jul 29 20:01:06 also, you know thayt this verison of iptables You have got upgraded lately, without changelog, by unknown person? I wonder if it works as it should Jul 29 20:01:26 Estel_: qt-mobility-1.0 is qt-mobility-1.0. NFC what qt-components-... is Jul 29 20:01:32 ah Jul 29 20:01:38 ok, i'll try to trace why it got installed now Jul 29 20:01:44 and in thumb repo there is thumb-compiled qtm-10 Jul 29 20:01:48 with cssu-testing and cssu-thumb enabled Jul 29 20:01:49 a-ha Jul 29 20:01:53 thanks, and sorry for bothering Jul 29 20:03:27 I wonder if friggin apt could create a dependencies diagram, or tree, or whatever Jul 29 20:04:11 s/create/actually print out/ Jul 29 20:04:12 DocScrutinizer05 meant: I wonder if friggin apt could actually print out a dependencies diagram, or tree, or whatever Jul 29 20:04:21 I recall sometihng like recursive dependencies in ipkg, a embedded version of apt for openwrt, so I think apt-get is capable too Jul 29 20:04:35 ough, "unknown person" who uploaded iptables lately, seems to be Pali Jul 29 20:04:42 he could start providing changelogs, though Jul 29 20:05:08 without changelog and TMO thread, I though it may be some "unknown update", especially, that it was pre-quelled by 6 failed attempts of building Jul 29 20:05:25 and after marmistrz's update to glib I was a little more cautious about -devel ;) Jul 29 20:07:27 http://maemo.org/packages/package_instance/view/fremantle_extras_free_armel/qt-components-10/1.0-pre2-1+0m5/ Jul 29 20:07:29 wtf? Jul 29 20:07:41 it got promoted to extras by hand, X-Fade did it Jul 29 20:07:52 but missing dependencies? Jul 29 20:13:13 MohammadAG: ping Jul 29 20:14:26 Today is a good day to [strike]die[/strike] test things on N900. Thumb ready, going to test new hostmode and bme-replacement modules :) Jul 29 20:19:21 Jaffa, pong Jul 29 20:19:46 MohammadAG: Erm, I forget. Possibly "is Socialty in a repo?, e.g. AFM" Jul 29 20:20:08 Jaffa, no, but updates are handled internally Jul 29 20:20:39 MohammadAG: Ah cool. So can I say something like "User can also click @@@ to get the latest update"? Jul 29 20:21:29 hi MohammadAG Jaffa Jul 29 20:22:02 Jaffa, it notifies you, or optionally, About -> Check for Updates :) Jul 29 20:22:18 MohammadAG: Ta Jul 29 20:22:30 I probably should improve that Jul 29 20:22:32 http://mohammadag.xceleo.org/sociality-mtf-version Jul 29 20:22:43 MohammadAG: Neat ;-) Jul 29 20:23:08 Time to commit what facebook broke Jul 29 20:25:16 facebroke Jul 29 20:26:13 facebrick, asskick Jul 29 20:27:05 I'm taking pride in not having a FB account and thus being a potential mass murderer Jul 29 20:27:25 If there's anyone I know I'd classify as "a potential mass murderer" ;-) Jul 29 20:28:43 /kickall Jul 29 20:28:54 ;-P Jul 29 20:30:00 Fortunately, I've got respawn Jul 29 20:30:19 with a 4 second delay Jul 29 20:30:45 How long's it take a Cylon, eh? Jul 29 20:31:15 ooh, that KIT on legs? Jul 29 20:31:20 this way annoying to fix https://gitorious.org/qtbook/sociality-mtf/commit/5a66e2698f0e0d0e5710144c28602a2483bb587a Jul 29 20:33:01 * DocScrutinizer05 wonders the 100th time, while staring on N9, if the "curved" display was worth the headache and expense Jul 29 20:33:47 MohammadAG: ewww Jul 29 20:33:52 actually yesterday I tried to find out how much of curved it actually is, and I still wonder if anybody would notice the difference Jul 29 20:34:54 DocScrutinizer05, it's actually a bit nice :P Jul 29 20:35:02 but yeah, not worth replacement expenses Jul 29 20:35:26 call me numb, I don't sense any difference in using it, compared to N950 Jul 29 20:36:23 if it wasn't for the reflections, I'd not even find a way to tell it's curved at all, unless I'd use a ruler on it Jul 29 20:36:55 modulo the 5mm frame Jul 29 20:37:45 which probably wasn't the major technological challenge Jul 29 20:38:37 Sony Trinitron CRTs were curved the same way :P Jul 29 20:38:52 meh, actually nope Jul 29 20:39:05 they were perfect cylinder segments Jul 29 20:39:23 I know, poor attempt at humour :) Jul 29 20:39:42 :-) Jul 29 20:40:12 Why do you say "were"? I have one downstairs. Using it for debugging TV-attached gadgets. Jul 29 20:40:24 Still works like a charm Jul 29 20:40:30 I was going to suggest they just shrink one, no need for new tech :) Jul 29 20:41:05 yeah, if it wasn't for some complete swap of my assets by desaster incident, I'd still have a nice small one around Jul 29 20:41:28 they were/are nice tubes Jul 29 20:41:32 like 12" Jul 29 20:41:45 or was it 14"? Jul 29 20:41:47 Meanwhile, everyone is expecting their world to collapse with Win8 release Jul 29 20:42:01 Even Microsoft, hehe Jul 29 20:42:39 will anybody even notice? Jul 29 20:43:03 My gf just had her company laptop "upgraded" to Win7 Jul 29 20:43:23 Some people will Jul 29 20:43:27 (from XP) Jul 29 20:43:48 * RST38h definitely noticed Win7 upgrade - it became difficult to use computer for anything meaningful Jul 29 20:43:53 .win7 is allright. Jul 29 20:44:08 Not if you are doing development Jul 29 20:44:15 very similar to kde4 Jul 29 20:44:30 AFAIKT Jul 29 20:44:33 AFAICT Jul 29 20:44:57 cannot comment on development, however as an end user OS it is ok. Jul 29 20:45:09 So, KDE has finally caught up with its target Jul 29 20:45:10 XP is a decade old. let it go. Jul 29 20:45:22 They have successfully implemented Microsoft Windows on Linux? Jul 29 20:45:48 I think they managed to out Microsoft, Microsoft :) Jul 29 20:46:02 bugs included ;) Jul 29 20:46:14 No problem letting it go, dude. It is the next thing that freaks me out. Or rather the tendency of each next thing to be worse than the last one lately Jul 29 20:46:33 XP was more or less ok Jul 29 20:46:59 three CRT TVs and 2 CRT monitors here Jul 29 20:47:02 no actual use though Jul 29 20:47:02 XP was w2k with bling Jul 29 20:47:11 w2k was ok too Jul 29 20:47:19 Vista/7... bling with some apps Jul 29 20:47:23 ME was a lemon, but let us forget it Jul 29 20:47:32 Vista was ME^2 Jul 29 20:47:45 Win7 is ME^2/2 Jul 29 20:47:59 7 is good Jul 29 20:48:02 Vista was horrible Jul 29 20:48:02 From what I have read, Win8 is ME^3, with Metro and all Jul 29 20:48:06 the theme was awesome Jul 29 20:48:28 Mohammad: Try disabling UAC, then renaming a file in Explorer or creating a new file ;) Jul 29 20:48:33 Mohammad: Try fixing it Jul 29 20:48:38 heh Jul 29 20:48:47 don't worry, I mastered UAC Vista times Jul 29 20:48:57 Not to mention that the last service pack cannot install on about 30-40% of Win7 installations Jul 29 20:48:58 then 7 came along and fixed the issues, thus wasting my time Jul 29 20:49:12 the only thing I regret is the money I spent on Vista Jul 29 20:49:35 Do you know who implemented the ext automount feature? Jul 29 20:49:37 Meanwhile,Lumia decided to update OS Jul 29 20:49:42 Scary Jul 29 20:50:14 Anyone jailbroken it already? OS is the only thing pulling it down =( Jul 29 20:50:25 no, locked bootloader Jul 29 20:50:48 the only unlockable lumias are the ones Nokia forgot to upgrade before shipping it Jul 29 20:50:53 s/it/them Jul 29 20:51:54 qwazix, ext automount of what? Jul 29 20:52:21 ext microSDs Jul 29 20:52:29 freemangordon / Pali Jul 29 20:52:33 MohammadAG, if N950 is locked even with open kernel, due to kernel coming in and seeing device locked already by hardware trustMyass computing... Jul 29 20:52:34 "Political Science Prof Asks: Is Algebra Necessary?" Jul 29 20:52:44 How Mer achieve unlocked device? Jul 29 20:52:46 Answer: Not really, for political science profs. Jul 29 20:52:57 qwazix, Pali update ke-recv to automount usb disks and ext ones Jul 29 20:53:02 and vfat ones too ;0 Jul 29 20:53:18 freemangordon - of my, 50 % of RAM free and 16 mb of swap used Jul 29 20:53:26 I know, you have heard it before :D Jul 29 20:53:36 it leaves much room in RAM to promised hookers Jul 29 20:53:42 s/to/for/ Jul 29 20:53:43 "This debate matters. Making mathematics mandatory prevents us from discovering and developing young talent." Jul 29 20:53:44 Estel_ meant: it leaves much room in RAM for promised hookers Jul 29 20:54:31 vi_, windoze 7 is as good for end user as windows phone is Jul 29 20:54:44 for any other use case - i.e. any that matters, and if you really need to sue windoze - xp owns all Jul 29 20:54:51 s/sue/use/ Jul 29 20:54:52 Estel_ meant: for any other use case - i.e. any that matters, and if you really need to use windoze - xp owns all Jul 29 20:54:55 lol, freudic mistake Jul 29 20:55:24 Estel_, who? Jul 29 20:55:26 but, honestly, debian or life ;) Jul 29 20:55:33 Estel_, I really didn't get what you said :P Jul 29 20:55:52 understandable, as I'm talking multi-tasking way, announcing recipents and beginning of message :p Jul 29 20:56:11 as for You, MohammadAG, I asked how Mer deal with CAL locked by trustedasscomputing Jul 29 20:56:12 etc Jul 29 20:56:19 Estel_, do you have ext formatted memcard? Jul 29 20:56:24 open kernel for harmattan can't stil ldo many things, as parts of n950 are locked, yep? Jul 29 20:56:35 I have no idea Jul 29 20:56:40 qwazix, actually no, but why asking? I kinda know how this new ke-recv work, so i may be able to help Jul 29 20:56:41 about the mer part Jul 29 20:57:05 MohammadAG, Mer doesn't seems to be affected by trustedasscomputing, so I wonder if this could be adaptable for harmashit too Jul 29 20:57:18 and open kernel, without loses that come with it Jul 29 20:58:06 Estel_, I've got an sd with an extX e-d partition, an Ext2 NITDroid partition and the rest is FAT. File manager shows all 3 partitions normally but I still get the "Memory format unsupported" at boot Jul 29 20:58:09 freemangordon, what have You done to thumb? i'm usually prone to palcebo effect, but device, it's UI, really seems *faster* with thumb, not only RAM usage lesser Jul 29 20:58:20 I know it is impossible, but it's really present Jul 29 20:58:23 and I was wondering if it happens to other people too Jul 29 20:58:37 opening thins, like setting, messing with windows, everything is absolutely smooth like never before Jul 29 20:58:53 Estel_, I have this feeling too Jul 29 20:58:56 qwazix, huh, for that silly message, no idea Jul 29 20:59:12 but if 1st aprtition (mmcblk1p1) is vfat, it should be ok Jul 29 20:59:16 even if it's 2 Mb in size Jul 29 20:59:32 so maybe You juist need to change order of partitions Jul 29 20:59:38 Hmm, probably it isn't. My FAT partition is last IIRC Jul 29 20:59:59 yeaa, making it first would fix it, without drawbacks - microSd isn't hdd, so earlier partitions aren't faster Jul 29 21:00:18 anyway I don't care much, I just thought maybe it's one of those bugs everybody has but nobody reports as it's trivial Jul 29 21:00:31 qwazix, quite possible Jul 29 21:00:35 it may be worth reporting to Pali Jul 29 21:00:38 in CSSU-testing thread Jul 29 21:00:45 (as updated ke-recv is aprt of cssu-t) Jul 29 21:00:57 hey, power usage on thumb is also lower, and it's not hoax 0_o Jul 29 21:01:02 idle one is stable 4mAh Jul 29 21:01:13 while it was always 4-8 mAh, averaging on 6 mAh Jul 29 21:01:15 mA Jul 29 21:01:20 replace all mAh with mA ;) Jul 29 21:01:30 wut the...? Jul 29 21:01:41 how it's possible that cssu=thumb changes affected this? Jul 29 21:02:12 sure, 2 mA change may sounds irrelevant, but for idle running time it's quite big, 50% change Jul 29 21:02:22 even with GSM on, it's 25% better Jul 29 21:02:36 it's a kernel msg? Jul 29 21:03:07 25% better standby time is something that I would like to know where comes from. freemangordon, what have You did?;) Jul 29 21:03:29 what have You done* Jul 29 21:03:58 Estel_: some comes from a better (newer) compiler Jul 29 21:04:06 zeq, sounds sane Jul 29 21:04:15 but it's really nice surprise Jul 29 21:04:43 didn't we mention it? Jul 29 21:04:47 :) Jul 29 21:04:51 better speed? actually, no. Jul 29 21:04:52 :) Jul 29 21:04:59 standby current with modem on is rather random Jul 29 21:05:02 better power usage on idle? never mentioned it Jul 29 21:05:12 sur,e that's why I tested it with modem off initially Jul 29 21:05:19 I've a custom build of h-d, makes things even better ;) Jul 29 21:05:21 that was the 5 mA -> 4 mA change Jul 29 21:05:29 6 mA - > 4 mA I mean Jul 29 21:05:42 zeq, why not pushed to cssu-thumb, then?:) Jul 29 21:06:18 I will :) Jul 29 21:06:28 BTW, less power usage seems constant, with modem on it's lower by same ammount, and even with screen off, it's average lesser by 2-3 mA than before (sure, this one is harder to prove, due to fluctuations, but I'm talking about average) Jul 29 21:06:37 zeq, will you marry me? Jul 29 21:07:01 err... no Jul 29 21:07:05 ;) Jul 29 21:07:06 :D Jul 29 21:07:50 well, I'm absolutely amazed form the beginning, cssu-thumb evolved much since early version I've tested long ago Jul 29 21:08:07 now time to see benefits of Pali's hostmode implementation and bme replacement module Jul 29 21:14:20 benefits from that are way more abstract and hardly evaluable Jul 29 21:16:55 arrrrrrrrghhhh Jul 29 21:17:04 not related to thumb, but I still can't plkay .ogg and theora files Jul 29 21:17:18 even reinstalled fuckin mafw, fuckin tracker, then, ogg-support and everything related... Jul 29 21:17:38 during reinstallation, I saw it touching all .ogg and theora files, and tracker sedes them, even sees play time... Jul 29 21:17:58 still, it doesn't create thumbnails for theora files, and can't play it, spitting idiotic message: Jul 29 21:18:04 http://lorienart.pl/theora.png Jul 29 21:18:13 foir .ogg files, it just skips through them Jul 29 21:18:20 of course knowing their playtime Jul 29 21:18:43 it seems that it read those data from it's id3, but why of why it reports lack of necessary code, when everything required is installed and worked a month ago? Jul 29 21:19:54 I've reinstalled gstreamer010-maemo-xiph too Jul 29 21:22:48 flac works well, surprisingly, but .ogg and theora still doesn't *hitting brick wall with a head* Jul 29 21:32:36 Estel_: are you sure the codecs for ogg/vorbis are installed? Jul 29 21:33:02 I would say "yes", but it doesn't work for some reasons, so... Jul 29 21:33:12 I have ogg-support and decoders-support, though Jul 29 21:33:26 also gstreamer-plugins-bad-extras set Jul 29 21:33:34 strangest thing is that it worked like charm for months Jul 29 21:33:52 and suddenly, most likely after CSSU update that touched tracker, it stopped to work and doesn't want to start again Jul 29 21:34:04 so since month or so i don't have .ogg and theora playback Jul 29 21:34:26 I even went berseker and re-installed everything that got mafw and tracker in name, then, gstreamer0.10, of course ogg and xipg and vorbis also... Jul 29 21:34:41 still, it just acts like codes are not installed Jul 29 21:34:57 of course mplayer plays them jsut fine, (but it's not long-term solution) Jul 29 21:35:06 both openmediaplayer and stock mediaplayer fails, though Jul 29 21:35:40 as said, they're indexed by tracker properly, categorized by albums etc, but no thumbnails for theora files, so I bet it read id3 data (+ maybe something else, as it knows playtime), but nothing else Jul 29 21:35:47 I'm sure thumbnails worked when playback worked Jul 29 21:35:57 i'm out of ideas and quite desperate, it's irritating like FCKD Jul 29 21:36:11 so even craziest dieas that doesn't require reflkash are welcome ;) Jul 29 21:39:04 Estel_, ask on #mer, I honestly don't know Jul 29 21:39:13 * Estel_ nods Jul 29 21:39:25 (related to other question, before) Jul 29 21:46:13 People screwing with permissions annoy me Jul 29 21:46:25 I feel like crashing the app rather than warning them Jul 29 21:49:10 why not burning hardware via i2c, then Jul 29 21:49:41 why is there no package for reaver yet? :8 Jul 29 21:49:44 er, :( Jul 29 21:50:13 no idea, You may go ahead and package it Jul 29 21:50:41 it's kinda straightforward it's single file ;) Jul 29 21:51:07 (considering that 2nd one, to search for wsp networks, doesn't work anyway) Jul 29 21:51:10 Estel_: do you have a link to a prebuilt one? Jul 29 21:51:14 wash too Jul 29 21:51:34 or walsh? Jul 29 21:52:25 walsh or wash doesn't work Jul 29 21:52:31 no use in putting it there Jul 29 21:52:42 and latets reaver is somewhere near last page of, surprisingly, reaver thread Jul 29 21:52:49 I don't remember if I have latest Jul 29 21:52:56 k whatevs Jul 29 21:52:58 btw it's quite a pity that wa(l)sh doesn't work Jul 29 21:53:06 I wonder why Jul 29 21:53:43 grrrrrrr Jul 29 21:53:55 can't make this fuckin mafw to play theora/ogg still Jul 29 21:54:01 and what the hell is x-annodex decoder? Jul 29 21:55:29 part of gstreamer0.10-plugins-base. I have reinstalled this one, though Jul 29 21:55:35 ~rape mafw Jul 29 21:55:49 ~rape mafw Jul 29 21:55:50 * infobot takes mafw behind the WallMart and makes a few grunts and screams Jul 29 21:58:44 Estel_, here's your thread :) http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=1244741 Jul 29 21:59:06 wow, thankie a lot Jul 29 21:59:15 it's huge and lovely and big and informative :D Jul 29 22:00:46 how develoepr mdoe is allowing us to install nano or htop? Jul 29 22:00:53 on n950, it just enabled terminal Jul 29 22:02:18 qwazix, what about unrestricted-systemui? Jul 29 22:02:26 it sounds like essential, too Jul 29 22:02:54 other than that, it's what I needed, especially mentions of -testing and -devel equivalent :) Jul 29 22:04:17 Estel_, I never liked arbitrary apps adding things to my system tray anywhere, that's why I didn't include it, but you're free to reply to the thread. 2nd post will be probably used for consolidating reader comments Jul 29 22:05:16 I agree, but afaik unrestricted-systemui jsut allows using harmattanish equivalent of status menu, not forces it Jul 29 22:05:22 i.e. removes nokia's lock Jul 29 22:05:35 sure, will note it later :) Jul 29 22:05:52 now I'm fighting with #@$$#@ mafw not wanting me to play .ogg and theora, and I can't find reason for life of mine Jul 29 22:06:08 Estel_: just thinking about your codec error, could it be your mime types? Jul 29 22:06:31 If you go to settings, security, developer mode, there's a truckload of available tools to install Jul 29 22:06:54 zeq, thanks a lot, as I imagine that oit msut be extra hard for anyone willing to help (no traces, generally) Jul 29 22:07:14 zeq, mime types? they're registered with tracker, at least Jul 29 22:07:17 but I'll do experiment Jul 29 22:07:25 I'll rename .ogg to .mp3 and check if it plays Jul 29 22:07:28 just rename Jul 29 22:08:24 I though, month earlier, that it is jsut tempoerary problem, but honestly, it's getting worse and worse with time, as I really can't find a reason for it Jul 29 22:08:41 as said, it started near cssu update, and first symptom was that .ogg and theora disappeared from my list at all Jul 29 22:09:02 merlin1991 suggested then, that something in the update haven't registered mimetypes properly Jul 29 22:09:14 after registering them by hand, files appeared, but never wanted to play Jul 29 22:09:22 then I went with reinstalling ogg-support, etc,m to no avail Jul 29 22:09:51 weeks later, i.e. currently, I tried reinstalling mafw and tarcke rpackages, gstreamer0.10 packages, ogg-support, extra decoders support (decoders-support), gstreamer plugins sets... Jul 29 22:10:31 during reinstallation of ogg-support I see in console that mimetypes for tracker (ogg and theora) are added Jul 29 22:11:08 maybe theora during gstreamer0.10-maemo-xiph or gstreamer0.10-theora, doesn't matter, it is there... I wonder how tracker know correct playtime of files, from id3? Jul 29 22:11:33 albums, artist etc comes from id3 for sure, but playtime? Altrhough, thumbnails for theora doesn't work... i'm, puzzled. Of course I tried rebuilding tracker database too, plentora times Jul 29 22:12:16 hm, renaming .ogg to .mp3 doesn't work, so for sure it really doesn't have decoder to decode it Jul 29 22:12:30 earlier, I though that it may be able to decode, but think that it isn't... Jul 29 22:12:39 In reality, it *think* that it can decode, but when trying, it can't Jul 29 22:12:55 theora result in splitting error I've posted screenshot erarlier: http://lorienart.pl/theora.png Jul 29 22:12:59 .ogg jsut skips Jul 29 22:13:13 it's in openmediaplayer, stock mediaplayer just throw error about unsupported decoder Jul 29 22:16:49 and, don't roget that .flac works (!) Jul 29 22:16:57 zeq, in any way, thanks for even trying to help Jul 29 22:18:22 Estel_: I lost the ability to play videos with cuteplayer with a CSSU update a few months back, perhaps even the same update... Jul 29 22:18:42 hm, interesting... but mediaplayer works well? Jul 29 22:19:04 I've not tried playing ogg or vorbis files, but otherwise yes. Jul 29 22:20:27 I can play other videos and music to, just ogg ans theora spasms Jul 29 22:20:39 but other people can play it without problems Jul 29 22:20:46 http://lorienart.pl/Blood-roses.ogg Jul 29 22:21:12 I wonder, what is the difference between ogg-support and xipg-support package? xipg-support conflicts with ogg-support Jul 29 22:21:31 I'm almsot sure I had ogg-support always, and it worked, but... also, ogg-support is more recent, as per package date Jul 29 22:23:04 BTW You've never regained You possibility to play videos in cutetube? Jul 29 22:23:08 it's .flv IIRC Jul 29 22:23:19 I've got ogg-support installed. ^ above file works fine Jul 29 22:23:39 WHAT?! I don't have gstreamer0.10-ogg, despite having reinstalled gstreamer-plugins-base 324324 times? Jul 29 22:23:52 and despite having ogg-support and it's dependencies reinstalled just few seconds ago? Jul 29 22:23:53 no I tried to fix cuteplayer a couple of days back, couldn't work it out. Jul 29 22:24:11 chekc if You have gstreamer0.10-flv installed, heh Jul 29 22:24:32 the HAM package manager "Multimedia support" == xipg-support? Jul 29 22:25:01 no idea, i'm using fapman... direct name is ogg-support for package we both have, and xiph-support for depreciated one Jul 29 22:25:45 well, installing sucessfuly gstreamer0.10-ogg doesn't change a single thing Jul 29 22:25:49 still can't play .ogg Jul 29 22:26:02 Estel_: yes, I have -flv installed Jul 29 22:26:18 hm Jul 29 22:28:10 seems that gstreamer0.10-xiph is more recent equivalent of gstreamer0.10-ogg Jul 29 22:28:14 what a mess Jul 29 22:44:10 Estel_: removing ogg-support and installing xiph-support broke ogg playback Jul 29 22:45:39 Estel_: (.ogg) there are two possible explanations: either you installed *too much* - too many codecs, means some of them killed it for you (you should retest with a clean PR1.3.1 install). Or (yeah I know you don't wanna hear that) the DSP is borked and refuses to decode .ogg (hardly any sensible story would explain why it works for mp3 then, but... it's just the possible explanations) Jul 29 22:52:32 Estel_: FWIW blood roses plays fine here Jul 29 22:52:41 CSSU-T Jul 29 22:55:16 thanks for looking into it too, DocScrutinizer Jul 29 22:55:37 I made progress, though Jul 29 22:56:07 after installing libsdl-mixer-ogg-mp3-1.2 Jul 29 22:56:14 .ogg file renamed to .mp3 plays well Jul 29 22:56:15 (!) Jul 29 22:56:18 what the fucky fuck? Jul 29 22:56:43 zeq, DocScrutinizer, any of You have this package installed? what sdl mixer have to do with mafw? Jul 29 22:56:44 o.O Jul 29 22:57:18 theora also splits other error now Jul 29 22:57:42 "can't find codec" application/octet-stream decoder" Jul 29 22:57:50 /home/user/MyDocs # apt-cache search sdl-mixer libsdl-mixer1.2-dev - Development files for libSDL_Mixer libsdl-mixer1.2 - Mixer library for libSDL libsdl-mixeroggwav1.2-dev - a variant of libsdl-mixer1.2-dev, supporting only Ogg Vorbis libsdl-mixer1.2.8-dev - development files for SDL1.2 mixer library libsdl-mixer1.2.8 - mixer library for Simple DirectMedia Layer 1.2 Jul 29 22:59:08 guess what, .ogg as .ogg *not* renamed to .mp3 also plays fine Jul 29 22:59:16 I'm happy (yet theora still doesn't work), but wtf? Jul 29 23:06:14 Estel_, application/octet-stream is a mime type used by web servers when they upload files through http. Jul 29 23:06:46 specific implementations of upload scripts mess the mime types of uploaded files Jul 29 23:06:52 yea, so wtf it have to do with my lovely theora concerts ;) Jul 29 23:07:04 did you download this file off somewhere? Jul 29 23:07:08 nope Jul 29 23:07:11 encoded it by hand Jul 29 23:07:19 that is odd... Jul 29 23:07:20 and it worked perfectly before this disaster started Jul 29 23:07:43 yea, even more that my .ogg definitelly plays with mafw, with low cpu usage and pulseaudio and mafw working, so wtf sdlmixer have to do with it Jul 29 23:08:31 I feel i'm on it, anyway, making theora work is just a matter of little more research on repos, I think Jul 29 23:08:49 I've encountered this error mostly with files that have gone through email clients and such. E.g. doc files got stuck in my doc->pdf script because they had application/octet-stream mime instead of application/msword Jul 29 23:09:03 I resorted to only check extension ( I know, lame ) Jul 29 23:09:56 DocScrutinizer, could You check for gstreamer0.10-ogg installed in your system? Jul 29 23:10:03 qwazix, you too if You have n900 by hand Jul 29 23:10:31 Estel_, probably not, I reflashed yesterday... Jul 29 23:10:39 ;P Jul 29 23:11:44 /home/user/MyDocs # apt-cache search gstreamer0.10-ogg Jul 29 23:11:45 gstreamer0.10-ogg - GStreamer ogg plugin from the "base" set Jul 29 23:12:02 Package gstreamer0.10-ogg is not installed, so not removed Jul 29 23:12:26 Anyway, I'm off to bed. G'night. Jul 29 23:12:33 damn, my jack audio input from amplifier got some voltage on it Jul 29 23:12:44 when touching it with tongue it sparks Jul 29 23:12:52 just made my n900 reboot Jul 29 23:13:21 bb qwazix Jul 29 23:13:29 I need to finally disassemble this amp box and see wtf Jul 29 23:13:55 I hope that electrical surge wasn't dangerous for n900 audio subsystem Jul 29 23:14:06 oohohoh Jul 29 23:14:44 AV-gnd isn't true GND, it's in fact FM-antenna Jul 29 23:14:58 ... Jul 29 23:15:06 so it's especially risky? Jul 29 23:15:08 means there are components between AV-GND and USB-GND Jul 29 23:15:21 particularly a bead Jul 29 23:15:32 to block RF Jul 29 23:15:47 this bead can burn out easily Jul 29 23:15:58 it's built for max 100mA or somesuch Jul 29 23:16:07 damn. without it, what doesn't work? Jul 29 23:16:20 audio on AV Jul 29 23:16:25 whole? Jul 29 23:16:29 and video of course Jul 29 23:16:33 yep Jul 29 23:16:33 good side is that I will know if it work or not, soon ;) Jul 29 23:16:40 missing GND is fatal Jul 29 23:16:55 of course, but this bead, itself Jul 29 23:17:04 if it would be jsut connected without it Jul 29 23:17:10 in case of burnage Jul 29 23:17:15 fry *all* the things! _ò/ Jul 29 23:17:16 you might simply short it, and never again use FMRX Jul 29 23:17:29 so it's required for fm radio input, eh? Jul 29 23:18:17 the FMRX antenna dipole is basically between AV-gnd and USB-gnd Jul 29 23:18:39 shorting the two.... Jul 29 23:18:41 + headphones acting as part of it when connected, of course Jul 29 23:26:19 well, AV works fine Jul 29 23:26:50 this amp have 5.1 input and stereo imput 9via normal jack). 5.1 works fine, but whole amp had some hard times once, and jack imput is strange Jul 29 23:27:07 music plays well, but when you touch this imput (with stereo imput enabled, of course), it buzz very strange sounds on speakers Jul 29 23:27:14 it seems to "accumulate" some kind of charge Jul 29 23:27:15 Estel_: get a DI-box Jul 29 23:27:35 for example, now with tongue I don't feel electricity, but few minutes earlier it was there Jul 29 23:27:43 it seems that while it stays idle, it accumulates something Jul 29 23:27:47 DI-box, hm? Jul 29 23:28:36 ~wiki di-unit Jul 29 23:28:45 I couldn't find a matching article in wikipedia, look for yerselves: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Search?search=di-unit&go=Go Jul 29 23:29:01 ~wiki DI_unit Jul 29 23:29:09 At http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DI_unit (URL), Wikipedia explains: "A 'DI unit', 'DI box', 'Direct Box', or simply 'DI' (variously claimed to stand for "direct input", "direct injection" or "direct interface"), is a device typically used in recording studios to connect a high-impedance, line level, unbalanced output signal to a low-impedance microphone level balanced input, usually via XLR connector. DIs are frequently used to connect an electric ... Jul 29 23:30:36 lokks nice, and cheap Jul 29 23:31:11 night all Jul 29 23:31:16 but in my case it isn't high impendance signal, so i suspect You just mean separating it from surges? Jul 29 23:31:16 while others can have a ground lift switch (to avoid ground loop problems), Jul 29 23:31:19 see ya zeq! Jul 29 23:33:41 http://www.ebay.de/itm/ZEALUM-ZUS-ANS-Audio-Noise-Suppressor-Trenntrafo-/390442912251?pt=Kabel_Stecker&hash=item5ae83609fb Jul 29 23:33:55 nah, it wasn't surge, after all Jul 29 23:34:15 it turned out, that I connected non-working plug to charge device, and it jsut died due to low power and bme off :P Jul 29 23:34:37 but it really looked like surge, at moment of shutting down, amplifier made *loud* cracky sound Jul 29 23:34:46 probably due to those strange things happening on jack Jul 29 23:35:59 home stereo usually has severe voltage potential vs GND, due to attached arial antenna Jul 29 23:37:13 and there's that age old recommendation to never connect two cables concurrently to a mobile device like N900, unless one of the cables definitely has proper galvanic separation Jul 29 23:37:52 for USB chargers I'd not bet on any such proper galvanic separation Jul 29 23:38:17 yea, but of course it haven't happened during plugging in, I just though that it "charge" for while, doing ad-hoc wifi Jul 29 23:38:24 while in fact it was discharging Jul 29 23:38:30 for empty battery, you know the rest Jul 29 23:38:41 a DI-box / separating adapter however is made to ensure galvanic separation Jul 29 23:38:52 sounds nice. BTw I wonder if my amp doesn't have it inside Jul 29 23:39:02 but this DI sounds like thing good to have, anyway, if even basic passive one Jul 29 23:39:11 better safe than sorry Jul 29 23:41:10 well, it turned out that gstreamer0.10-ogg is required to play ogg (what a surprise). hoever, why it isn't dependency of ogg-support is beyond me Jul 29 23:41:25 libsdl thing just acted as catalyst to refresh mafw mimetypes again Jul 29 23:41:45 and what gstreamer0.10-maemo-xiph does, if not ogg, ffs? Jul 29 23:42:28 still need to find out why theora doesn't work, though Jul 29 23:47:58 (hoever, why it isn't dependency of ogg-support is beyond me) - one word: maemo-PR Jul 29 23:48:14 err maemo-MP Jul 29 23:49:24 dunno if theora ever worked Jul 29 23:53:54 of course it worked Jul 29 23:54:07 I used it personally, and it was working great (although, on CPU, IIRC) Jul 29 23:54:15 (but through mafw :D) Jul 29 23:54:47 what maemo-mp have to do with ogg-support lacking dependency of gstreamer0.10-ogg? I have just installed the latter without any conflicts or apt trickery Jul 29 23:58:51 well, maemo-mp got 'invented' because Nokia thought it's too cumbersome to keep proper comprehensive dependencies up to date in their maemo packages Jul 29 23:58:59 that's the link Jul 29 23:59:47 and btw ogg never been in the set of OOTB-supported codecs Jul 30 00:00:52 another tomfoolery of maemo/nokia Jul 30 00:01:45 IIRC Jul 30 00:17:38 well Jul 30 00:18:00 yes, but ogg-support isn't package form nokia Jul 30 00:18:07 Kulve and Contreas did it in their spare timer Jul 30 00:18:09 time* Jul 30 00:18:20 gstreamer0.10-theora - GStreamer theora plugin from the "base" set Jul 30 00:18:37 and ogg-support was always managed professionally, IIRC. either i still don't get something, or should gstreamer0.10-ogg be put as dependency of ogg-support? Jul 30 00:18:51 after all, without gstreamer0.10-ogg, no real ogg support, so it should be pulled automatically Jul 30 00:19:09 DocScrutinizer, sure, reinstalled gstreamer0.10-theora zillion times Jul 30 00:19:17 :-/ Jul 30 00:19:27 that's the point, nfc why it doens't work, as I'm 1`2326423% sure that it worked before Jul 30 00:19:40 I even spent some time determining best pixel ratio for smallest files with best quality/size ratio Jul 30 00:19:42 for N900 Jul 30 00:20:27 (using old TV tricks to make high vertical pixel density, but less horizontal one, = get small file sizes, yet turning on better quality of compression, = better results that with full resolution files and lower quality) Jul 30 00:20:53 (of course correcting aspect ratio by pixel ratio, for example 1.8 :1 horizontal:vertical ratio Jul 30 00:20:55 ) Jul 30 00:21:16 I tested every attempt ond evice, and foun out, that 1.8:1 gives very good results Jul 30 00:21:48 better than h264, int erms of quality/size, one and only drawback is that it's decoded on CPU Jul 30 00:21:53 gstreamer0.10-ogg Reverse Depends: ogg-support Jul 30 00:22:00 so, summing it up, i'm perfectly sure it worked on device =) Jul 30 00:22:22 wut? on my device, i can remove gstreamer0.10-ogg without ogg-support complaining Jul 30 00:22:39 in fact, it was the case for last month Jul 30 00:22:46 apt-cache showpkg gstreamer0.10-ogg Jul 30 00:23:17 wait, but reverse depends mean, that it need ogg-support before installation, yep? Jul 30 00:23:24 or not Jul 30 00:24:05 i don't have gstreamer0.10-ogg installed, and i can play ogg file Jul 30 00:24:05 aiui it means installing ogg-support will pull in gstreamer0.10-ogg as a dependency Jul 30 00:24:31 kerio - impossible Jul 30 00:24:48 unles syou're playing it via mplayer instead of openmediaplayer or stock Jul 30 00:24:51 Estel_: dude, i'm one of the ones that tried your .ogg file Jul 30 00:24:57 remember, gstreamer0.10-ogg is not in "user" section Jul 30 00:25:03 You need to show all packages Jul 30 00:25:09 ... Jul 30 00:25:12 I for one think that apt pkg database gets fsckdup pretty easily Jul 30 00:25:13 are you kidding me Jul 30 00:25:13 I knwo you've tried it Jul 30 00:25:19 apt-cache policy gstreamer0.10-ogg Jul 30 00:25:22 shows it not installed Jul 30 00:25:26 kerio, but gstreamer0.10-ogg *is8 required to play ogg files :P Jul 30 00:25:30 lol Jul 30 00:25:32 wtf? Jul 30 00:25:44 so what xipg/vorbis/ogg related You have installed? Jul 30 00:25:54 i have ogg-support Jul 30 00:25:58 define 'installed' Jul 30 00:25:59 which pulls gstreamer0.10-maemo-xiph Jul 30 00:26:09 maybe that's enough? \_o_/ Jul 30 00:26:14 * Estel_ is banging head against desk Jul 30 00:26:16 this is madness Jul 30 00:26:29 no, i have gstreamer0.10-maemo-xiph, and it wasn't working Jul 30 00:26:47 i just installed ogg-support and it worked Jul 30 00:26:51 honestly, no fuckin idea what gstreamer0.10-maemo-xiph does, it should allow both .ogg and theora to work, by common sense Jul 30 00:26:53 no, gstreamer0.10-plugins-bad is madness Jul 30 00:27:01 DocScrutinizer, hm? Jul 30 00:27:18 ooooh Jul 30 00:27:20 I have gstreamer0.10-plugins-bad and gstreamer0.10-plugins-bad-extra installed, but always had, and it worked Jul 30 00:27:22 i have *that* installed Jul 30 00:27:35 and -extra too Jul 30 00:28:11 now .ogg works, but mr. tracker show that I don't have any music/video files installed, despite touching them ;) Jul 30 00:28:11 nobody has a friggin clue what's the deal with gstreamer0.10-plugins-bad gstreamer0.10-plugins-mad gstreamer0.10-plugins-sad gstreamer0.10-plugins-fat Jul 30 00:28:21 bad, ugly, good Jul 30 00:28:24 gstreamer0.10-plugins-good, gstreamer0.10-plugins-ugly Jul 30 00:28:41 tracing their conflicts and dependencies is even more funny Jul 30 00:28:46 ugly conflicts with bad Jul 30 00:28:52 but bad doesn't conflict with good, obviously Jul 30 00:29:06 it's only me, or it starts to sound political? Jul 30 00:29:22 + someone was so bright to add -multiverse variant of those Jul 30 00:29:30 gstreamer0.10-plugins-ugly-multiverse Jul 30 00:29:32 for example Jul 30 00:29:35 whatever it does Jul 30 00:29:40 sounds ubuntu'ish Jul 30 00:29:47 never dared to install that, though Jul 30 00:30:08 still, I haven't touched thta shit for months and my .ogg and theora stopped working, so i'm pissed off Jul 30 00:30:13 now .ogg works, thanks goodness Jul 30 00:30:19 thanks to gstreamer0.10-ogg Jul 30 00:30:29 but now kerio say it works for him too without that package, so wtf I ask Jul 30 00:30:41 and what is with theora Jul 30 00:30:48 * Estel_ kicks tracker in ass Jul 30 00:30:58 and that damn thing is so slow on rebuild database Jul 30 00:31:15 s/rebuild/rebuilding/ Jul 30 00:31:17 Estel_ meant: and that damn thing is so slow on rebuilding database Jul 30 00:31:39 I'm close to --purge everything related to decoders Jul 30 00:31:56 would do the same to mafw, but it would break pr, probably Jul 30 00:31:58 well, sudden breakage of such stuff 'out of nothing' quite usually in fact is caused by fapman doing autoremove or other sad shit Jul 30 00:32:01 and install from scratch Jul 30 00:32:13 my fapman have autoremove turned off Jul 30 00:32:34 I could bet that my ogg playuback worked without gstreamer0.10-ogg before, just like kerio Jul 30 00:32:48 gstreamer0.10-maemo-xiph should be freakking enough Jul 30 00:33:24 ~assasinate decoders in repos Jul 30 00:33:34 ~assasinate decoders in repos Jul 30 00:33:37 yeah, probably you did an upgrade and it installed a fsckdup version from -devel Jul 30 00:33:51 nope, there was no upgrade for them since ages Jul 30 00:33:57 or rather, fapman did Jul 30 00:34:07 ~assassinate decoders in repos Jul 30 00:34:15 ~ping Jul 30 00:34:16 ~pong Jul 30 00:34:21 I HATE FACEBOOK Jul 30 00:34:27 ~murder decoders in repos Jul 30 00:34:28 LOL Jul 30 00:34:29 * infobot shoots decoders in repos in his sleep Jul 30 00:34:37 4 fucking updates in one day Jul 30 00:34:43 MohammadAG, stop using it, it's simple like that :) Jul 30 00:34:55 Estel_, I'm not using it, I'm developing an app for it Jul 30 00:35:01 masochism?:P Jul 30 00:35:05 even worse Jul 30 00:35:14 for me, it returns &expires_in=0 Jul 30 00:35:22 for others, it returns &expires=1324 Jul 30 00:35:25 or some random number Jul 30 00:35:26 I'm not killing people, I'm selling bombs Jul 30 00:35:30 ;P Jul 30 00:35:38 I had to read logs and guess that Jul 30 00:35:45 You could chosoe tool for geocaching Jul 30 00:35:46 since I removed access tokens from logs Jul 30 00:35:52 or for feeding dogs remotely Jul 30 00:35:55 but no, facebook ;P Jul 30 00:36:22 I think I'm done for today Jul 30 00:36:37 admit that, you're doing it just to incorporate backdoor and get private photos of chicks Jul 30 00:36:54 but why Maemo target audience, then?:P Jul 30 00:37:10 womans here are countable using one hand Jul 30 00:37:12 MohammadAG: too late, the hoofed one alias zuckerberg made you sign in blood Jul 30 00:37:13 women* Jul 30 00:37:33 Estel_, some members have GFs :p Jul 30 00:37:38 maybe MohammadAG bought faceshit actions on first day :p Jul 30 00:37:45 MohammadAG, good point ;) Jul 30 00:37:55 but seriously, if I was a pervert that'd be a good idea Jul 30 00:38:00 (actions = shares) Jul 30 00:38:10 meanwhile, laptop started creaking Jul 30 00:38:13 now need to work hard to regain losses Jul 30 00:38:21 well, he is fed up with faceshit too Jul 30 00:38:43 well, i'm fed up with mafw/gstreamer/whatever refusing to play my theora files Jul 30 00:39:51 erm, twisted progress Jul 30 00:40:07 .ogg files work now as said, but tracker stopped being aware of theora fgiles playtime Jul 30 00:40:10 I'm fed up with mafw for poor design that doesn't allow proper fade-in/fade-out/crossfade (almost highlighted somebody)/and particularly gapless playback Jul 30 00:40:12 W-T-F? Jul 30 00:41:01 well, theora files still complain about octet stream, and lost ability to show playtime Jul 30 00:41:33 and .ogg files work,s but disappeared from tracker Jul 30 00:41:35 WTF? Jul 30 00:42:37 I must admit, whatever framework Apple uses for media, it's awesome Jul 30 00:42:53 honestly? it isn't. Jul 30 00:43:06 I would be more than happy with normal linxu framework ;) Jul 30 00:43:15 linux even Jul 30 00:44:07 honestly, it is Jul 30 00:44:20 let's see that linux framework handle rotation without pausing Jul 30 00:44:55 what's the problem? Jul 30 00:44:59 even N900 handles it Jul 30 00:45:08 pivot screens on desktops handle it no problem Jul 30 00:45:29 and, agtain, honeslt,y rotating during pause is nevertheless somewhere between 0K degrees on my scale of hot features Jul 30 00:45:43 0k as in 0 Kelvin Jul 30 00:53:10 no, really. Now tracker lost ability to see albums Jul 30 00:53:15 and generally, id3 tags Jul 30 01:01:29 MohammadAG, wouldn't having a program handle creating a lossless stream and piping it to mafw be the solution if we really can't do away with it? Jul 30 01:01:42 think of the helper program avisynth-style. Jul 30 01:02:39 it does all the (cross)fade(in/out) and gapless, and pipes the output into mafw Jul 30 01:09:40 kerio, still here? Jul 30 01:09:49 or DocScrutinizer ? Jul 30 01:10:12 could one of You with working .ogg check if package gstreamer0.10-vorbis is installed? Jul 30 01:10:59 meantime, i've installed it and reinstalling ogg-support for 3254r38952137856235902350813263219680438069-326890230823969326023=69-8235613258326903746794394 time Jul 30 01:11:14 ...because without it, any changes to gstreamer0.10* are not recognized anyway Jul 30 01:11:38 (that's why it though sdlmixedr helped, when in fact, it was "one package earlier" gstreamer0.10-ogg) Jul 30 01:15:56 gstreamer0.10-vorbis: Jul 30 01:15:57 Installed: (none) Jul 30 01:16:42 thanks Jul 30 01:16:59 poor tracker, have lot of work today Jul 30 01:17:04 tonight Jul 30 01:17:06 whatever Jul 30 01:18:06 do you remember, how to check mimetypes registered with tracker? Jul 30 01:19:30 fuck that, i'm purging everything gstreamer/tracker/mafw related Jul 30 01:19:36 Moar! Jul 30 01:20:45 and in the end, it will turn out to be something fckin trivial Jul 30 01:22:00 suuuure, .ogg files plays, but even during playback, media player doesn't know it's playing time Jul 30 01:22:16 and seeking is disabled Jul 30 01:22:28 total playtime - 00:01 second Jul 30 01:30:35 gstreamer-plugins*, fear me coming! Jul 30 01:30:35 http://www.fanboy.com/archive-images/wookie.jpg Jul 30 01:47:11 i just found a nokia n9 for $125. is that a good price? it dual boots meego 1.3 and android 4.0 Jul 30 02:06:31 sounds kinda too good Jul 30 02:08:29 DocScrutinizer, You know who depend sont hose gstreamer0.10-plugins-bad-extras etc? Jul 30 02:08:30 CSSU! Jul 30 02:11:47 ShadowJK, just found out...cracked screen Jul 30 02:12:04 * Estel_ is fighting with mafw and friends for 6h already, and think that should be payed for that Jul 30 02:13:13 and only 16GB Jul 30 02:14:17 yeah, since 20.2010.36-2maemo16 Jul 30 02:20:11 but, it worked, then ;0 Jul 30 02:20:30 well, i've just nuked everything (tm) related, and re-installing, after reboot Jul 30 02:20:51 marble got hit in the process, as it was depending on too much ogg related things Jul 30 02:20:59 installing it back too Jul 30 02:21:20 next thing is ogg-support and extra-decoders supporft, and I should be "in home" Jul 30 02:21:24 we will see... Jul 30 02:22:33 do you even play marble? lol Jul 30 02:22:44 my head is too dumb for that game Jul 30 02:23:05 marble as in navigational tool Jul 30 02:23:07 and maps Jul 30 02:23:14 oh LOL Jul 30 02:23:19 i thought you meant the game Jul 30 02:23:25 Marbles Jul 30 02:23:29 :) Jul 30 02:23:38 no, i play Homeworld on N900 Jul 30 02:23:40 no jokes Jul 30 02:23:44 gdizzz ported it Jul 30 02:24:13 i saw that thread Jul 30 02:24:40 I must convince him to port some Elite port Jul 30 02:24:44 on open engine Jul 30 02:24:56 carmageddon is my only game Jul 30 02:25:08 not on n900, but on pc Jul 30 02:25:30 maniac Jul 30 02:25:45 what? why Jul 30 02:25:56 try some real game, like The Witcher, You will never return to this again ;0 Jul 30 02:26:11 no. I'm addicted to carmageddon Jul 30 02:27:17 the joys of running over innocent human beings and animals! then reversing to kill that poor one who survived Jul 30 02:31:26 being a nightcrawler sucks. everyone's sleeping. Jul 30 02:40:31 most of the night shift guys enjoy the silence Jul 30 02:41:17 ~seen merlin1991 Jul 30 02:41:20 merlin1991 is currently on #maemo (7d 20h 59m 38s) #harmattan (7d 20h 59m 38s) #maemo-ssu (7d 20h 59m 38s). Has said a total of 210 messages. Is idling for 1d 11h 44m 58s, last said: 'http://gitorious.org/community-ssu/microb-engine/commits/thumb-testing'. Jul 30 02:49:20 YEA, after nuke, .ogg files works fine, without that strange gstreamer0.10-ogg package Jul 30 02:49:30 and tarcker sees it, and file playtime is detected ok'ish Jul 30 02:49:45 theora doesn't play yet, but gives sane message about lack of Theora decoder Jul 30 02:49:52 I feel ultimate victory is coming! Jul 30 02:50:07 * RiD knocks on Estel_ head Jul 30 02:50:18 i win Jul 30 02:50:22 wut? Jul 30 02:51:13 i win. the ultimate victory is mine Jul 30 02:51:15 won* Jul 30 02:51:23 don't you know that I generate 220v on my own, to supply 220->5v converter? Jul 30 02:51:54 It's like turning whole nature wraith upon You ;) Jul 30 02:52:02 my friend has a massager that sends shocks to his body Jul 30 02:52:07 he first tried it on his neck Jul 30 02:52:13 called vibrator Jul 30 02:52:15 he ended up laughing and jumping Jul 30 02:52:20 see? Jul 30 02:52:38 then he tried it faster and set the power to 8 (in 1-10) Jul 30 02:52:49 he was laughing, crying and jumping Jul 30 02:53:11 i should buy one of these for terrible wake up pranks Jul 30 02:54:15 or change colleagues Jul 30 02:54:24 get *rid* of them Jul 30 02:54:29 hehe Jul 30 02:54:56 well, theora still doesn't play after installing gstreamer0.10-theora Jul 30 02:54:57 hm Jul 30 02:55:12 now, what was package that allowed it Jul 30 02:55:50 at 5 AM is suspect ultimate victory, not: Jul 30 02:56:31 http://i.iflip.im/2bb1.jpg Jul 30 02:56:59 when i open my eyes I better see some Theora playback! **** ENDING LOGGING AT Mon Jul 30 02:59:58 2012