**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sat Sep 22 02:59:59 2012 Sep 22 05:50:28 oh joy, i've got phantom "birthday" entries in my calendar :( Sep 22 07:49:32 ah fuck, after syncing i have no birthdays in the calendar at all Sep 22 07:49:34 wtf Sep 22 07:49:36 i don't even Sep 22 07:50:11 meh Sep 22 10:06:13 Hi, I need flashing output dumps from flasher-3.5. I'm rewriting 0xFFFF code and I need to understand NOLO protocol. See http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=86969 Sep 22 10:07:15 If somebody will need to flash N900 (on linux), please use ld preload library from that thread. It write to stdout some control informations Sep 22 10:55:03 does anyone here use yappari? Sep 22 12:36:08 anybody compiled last nmap or p0f for Maemo5? Sep 22 13:38:57 >mfw Flash 10 for Maemo leaked Sep 22 13:39:09 I've definitely been out of the Fremantle forum way too long. Sep 22 13:42:47 speaking of which, mods, if you're awake, please change the Flash 10 megathread's title! Sep 22 13:43:04 the flash thread is awesome Sep 22 13:43:18 50+ pages about a seriously horrible piece of software that most people hate deeply Sep 22 13:46:03 Lava_Croft, true, but some people need it for some other horrible POS web app. Sep 22 13:46:17 fortunately, it's mostly considered "deprecated" nowadays Sep 22 13:46:18 if your webapp requires flash, you should find another one Sep 22 13:51:56 Scheduled to be released next month, Ubuntu 12.10 now includes both Amazon ads in the user's dash and by default an amazon store in the user's launcher. Sep 22 13:52:00 * RST38h ROTFLs Sep 22 13:52:15 Canonical is 'confident it will be an interesting and useful feature for our 12.10 users.' Sep 22 13:52:42 * RST38h suspects that by "users" they mean Amazon Sep 22 13:54:20 RST38h: :) Sep 22 13:54:40 Another reason to just use Windows7 Sep 22 13:54:54 riiight Sep 22 13:54:56 not really Sep 22 13:55:04 hope Kubuntu guys don't do the same Sep 22 13:55:05 use another distro, perhaps? Sep 22 13:55:24 time to switch to gentoo :-) Sep 22 13:55:26 i love my wintoon :< Sep 22 13:56:00 better said, i love my games, which makes me have to love windows:| Sep 22 13:56:24 i love my 58 games on Linux too, ;) Sep 22 13:56:33 nethack ftw Sep 22 13:56:43 nethack got boring over 10years ago Sep 22 13:57:02 impossible Sep 22 13:57:14 nethack wasnt that great anyway Sep 22 13:57:20 i enjoy adom and doomrl much more Sep 22 13:57:41 but you can't die by falling down stairs in those Sep 22 13:57:57 i can do that irl Sep 22 13:58:00 dont need a game for that Sep 22 13:58:25 doomrl = Doom in Real Life Sep 22 13:58:26 ? Sep 22 13:58:32 DOOM the Rogue Like Sep 22 13:58:38 omg Sep 22 13:58:40 pretty neato roguelike Sep 22 13:58:51 http://doom.chaosforge.org/ Sep 22 13:59:11 they even have sprite gfx nowadays! Sep 22 14:00:49 i think i'll stick with my little @ Sep 22 14:03:08 your little @ is used in just about any roguelike:) Sep 22 14:03:11 also doomrl:) Sep 22 14:04:49 nah because you said the even have sprite gfx Sep 22 14:05:24 yes, nethack does too Sep 22 14:05:29 its a matter of choice and preference Sep 22 14:05:35 of course it is Sep 22 14:06:03 just as it is which rogue-like you play Sep 22 14:06:19 no, people that play nethack are really inferior Sep 22 14:06:26 ;) Sep 22 14:06:26 lol Sep 22 14:07:15 http://doom.chaosforge.org/images/12.png Sep 22 14:07:19 :) Sep 22 14:07:48 fancy Sep 22 15:00:44 Hello, is there easy Wifi tethering solution for N900? Sep 22 15:00:57 I found JoikuSpot, but it's paid. Sep 22 15:01:01 qmobilehotspot? Sep 22 15:01:31 you'll need kernel-power though Sep 22 15:01:59 is it in repos? qmobilehotspot? Sep 22 15:02:16 yes Sep 22 15:31:53 http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=1270647#post1270647 # Wanna join !n950club for only +2500 EUR ? #MeeGo #HarmattaN #n950 #MerProject Sep 22 15:56:25 Hm... The latest update of cssu wants me to connect to the pc suite to update Sep 22 15:57:06 * Wizzup updates cssu enabler first Sep 22 16:16:38 Think I figured it out Sep 22 16:50:36 Wizzup, install the Operator thingy first, then it works Sep 22 16:56:29 andre__: yeah, I found that under the ``problems'' tab after some googling :) Sep 22 18:03:35 Testing new Nokia BL-5J 1400-something mAh claimed. So far battery internal resistance feels disappoitnig, capacity might be as claimed though Sep 22 18:05:36 Low IR is mostly interesting for faster charge times :) Sep 22 18:11:16 what is the capacity? Sep 22 18:11:26 *supposed Sep 22 18:25:19 ShadowJK: low Z also interesting for usable capacity on heavy load, like during phone call Sep 22 18:25:55 and yes, that's a known symptom. Higher capacity on same volume usually also means higher Z Sep 22 18:26:16 so the higher capacity easily might turn into opposite on high load Sep 22 18:28:50 ShadowJK: see goldcaps where that's obvious. The capacitors in Farad range usually have Z in the range of hundereds of Ohms Sep 22 18:42:22 But Japod has highest capacity I've encountered so far, AND lowest Z Sep 22 18:45:12 In other news, the battery of my SmartQ7 seems dead Sep 22 18:47:53 too long empty i guess Sep 22 19:07:04 probably old question, but I haven't been able to find a definite answer. My n900 "randomly" (not really that randomly, but I haven't been able to pinpoint it yet) loses connection to my GSM card... Sep 22 19:07:50 hints about an once-and-for-all solution? (besides "don't use it", if possible :) Sep 22 19:15:01 gomiam: alas this usually is a symptom of a hw defect Sep 22 19:15:10 I feared that Sep 22 19:15:59 of course I suggest to reflash a clean PR1.3 and run it without any additional apps installed for several days, to verify it's not sw caused Sep 22 19:16:01 the forums I read talked about pushing it with some kind of rubber... Sep 22 19:16:07 BS Sep 22 19:16:10 nevermind Sep 22 19:16:21 I will have to try flashing it, just in case Sep 22 19:16:35 if it's hw, then it's soldering or bonding of BB5 cellmo chip Sep 22 19:17:09 o-u-c-h :) Sep 22 19:17:18 applying random force to the whole PCB (mainboard) can change symptoms a bit, but not for long and not always to the better Sep 22 19:17:25 thanks for the info :) Sep 22 19:17:28 yw Sep 22 19:17:32 sorry though Sep 22 19:18:39 resoldering chip might help, if you can get access to proper SMT reflow workstation, or want to go the extremist way of DIY reflow in oven Sep 22 19:18:41 don't be, I knew this could happen. Sep 22 19:19:09 odds are you'll kill the device completely during such enterprise Sep 22 19:19:30 Fortunately I still have my previous phone handy if I don't manage to fix this issue. Sep 22 19:20:36 * DocScrutinizer05 ponders to set up a wiki page "Symptom: SIM crossed out", and list all aggregated knowledge about the reported cases by ShadowJK and others Sep 22 19:20:49 SpeedEvil also, irrc Sep 22 19:20:54 iirc* Sep 22 19:21:01 it might be a good idea Sep 22 19:21:48 gomiam: anyway, clean your SIM contacts (sometimes dirt on contacts causes similar symptom) Sep 22 19:22:06 will do, too Sep 22 19:22:22 makes ure the contact springs in holder look "normal" and equally positioned Sep 22 19:22:29 make sure* Sep 22 19:23:27 press keyboard firmly (ask SpeedEvil (iirc) about where to press exactly), it's been reported to instantly induce change in SIM detection state Sep 22 19:24:09 check syslog/dmesg for cmt messages Sep 22 19:25:22 try talking to modem when it says "SIM not present": start pnatd, enter " AT" should answer with "OK" Sep 22 19:25:52 if it doesn't, you probably have a dead modem Sep 22 19:25:53 I was checking dmesg but found nothing... then again, I probably should test it a few more times :) Sep 22 19:26:17 fortunately it seems to work... if I handle it with care :) Sep 22 19:26:24 until it stops working, of course Sep 22 19:27:06 any mechanical effects to "SIM missing" are a strong indicator of usual chip-soldering hw defect Sep 22 19:27:53 btw, all screws in a N900 are supposed to be Torx, right? Sep 22 19:28:08 (all the screws that keep it together, I mean) Sep 22 19:28:12 ooh, there's also a small chance that a waek and worn-out battery (or dirty battery contacts) may cause modem resets and dropouts Sep 22 19:28:36 nope, only the two that keep kbd frame in place are TX-6 Sep 22 19:28:41 ah, ok Sep 22 19:28:43 other are philips Sep 22 19:28:52 I'm used to tinkering with my N800s.. Sep 22 19:28:53 iirc Sep 22 19:28:54 :) Sep 22 19:29:09 that matches what I see right now Sep 22 19:29:14 get L1_2 Sep 22 19:29:58 fortunately I have a "weird screw heads" box and a "precision screws box" Sep 22 19:54:49 damn, the RE components BOM lists >>Main PCB, Bottom User Interface Battery Rechargeable 1 Seiko Instruments XH414H Battery - XH-HG Capacitor, 3.3V, 0.08F, Button Type, , w/ Integral Battery Contacts + XH414H + SII JAPAN 2 4.80 1.40 Visit URL<< for bupbat Sep 22 19:56:24 http://www2.electronicproducts.com/Nokia_N900_Mobile_Phone-whatsinside_text-90.aspx Sep 22 19:58:03 damn, because I hoped the problem with bupbat was caused by Nokia using the LiIon type and you could use the capacitive type to get a better MTBF than the obviously common <12months Sep 22 20:00:22 well, even iSuppli might be wrong. AFAIK there's no proper label on the bupbat Sep 22 20:02:48 If nokia was a tad more community-oriented and openminded, we just could ask them what's the actual brand&type of bupbat used in N900, but nokia isn't even able to "disclose" resistance in Ohms of a single resistor Sep 22 20:33:58 DocScrutinizer05: nothing against suse, have the least experience about it regarding "the big ones" so can't say anything about it. Sep 22 20:34:29 my basis of recommending mint is based on my experiences of recommending it to newcomers Sep 22 20:35:48 hmm Sep 22 20:36:11 I don't think mist is mainly focused on stability and security Sep 22 20:36:14 even though I try to leave recommending anything to others as my expectations of a good distribution (be it ease of use or stability) might differ dramatically from someones who is coming from windows Sep 22 20:36:18 mint even Sep 22 20:38:34 it's focused on simplicity Sep 22 20:38:38 i guess Sep 22 20:39:08 or should i say end user experience Sep 22 20:40:04 hi all. Does anyone know if yappari (the whatsapp client) is in any repo (or why it doesn't seem to be)? Also any impressions (how well does it work) would be much appreciated :) Sep 22 20:41:40 aaaand me had wrong channel :) Sep 22 20:42:49 well openSuse is basicaly the community backport plus new development of the SLED mission critical grade distro, and of course it comes with commercial grade administration tools Sep 22 20:43:54 Skry: (wrong chan) not really. The other one been way more wrong chan ;-) Sep 22 20:44:18 (not that it was exactly on topic here either) Sep 22 20:45:24 dafox: nfc about wutsap or whatever the name, nor about any of the clones Sep 22 20:45:58 I only know it's a quite likely a pretty poor concept and a poor idea to use it Sep 22 20:46:47 DocScrutinizer05: why do you think it's a poor concept? Sep 22 20:47:49 since all I heard about it indicates it's a third rehash of VoIP Sep 22 20:48:00 even worse than skype Sep 22 20:48:24 and for sure not as free (in beer) as you love to think Sep 22 20:48:46 it ripps off all your private data afaik Sep 22 20:49:37 DocScrutinizer05: I think you may be thinking about skype? whatsapp is the sms-over-wifi type thing Sep 22 20:49:56 pretty much the same, no? Sep 22 20:50:18 not really, one is voice, one is text messages Sep 22 20:50:33 both are 'cheating' the network operators Sep 22 20:50:56 there's no free-of-charge SMS sending, and if this particular service doesn't charge you in money, they will charge you in some other currency Sep 22 20:51:33 its only a modified jabber protocol Sep 22 20:51:41 DocScrutinizer05: I don't really know how it's all sponsored, I think on android its ad-driven Sep 22 20:51:43 usually in getting your valuable private data, inspecting your SMS/IM content, whatnot else Sep 22 20:51:44 they dont send sms, you need to use internet access Sep 22 20:52:31 anyhow, lots of people around me use it, and I heard someone made a n900 version, so I thought it might be nice to have, as an addition to regular sms (since they seem to use it quite a bit) Sep 22 20:55:35 Isn't it just an IM thing? From what I recall from one whatsapp reverse-engineering page, it's just XMPP with a funky proprietary space-saving encoding (called "FunXMPP") and presumably some extensions (and more proprietary fluff for registration and so on). There were quite a few people hoping (unsuccessfully) to get support for it in libpurple. Sep 22 20:55:44 there've been texting services around since ages, and they either plainly say they're making their money by adding ads to each message you send via that service, or they charge you in money though less than what a standard GSM SMS handled by your carrier would cost. And then there's *real* jabber, and IRC, and whatnot else, and of course SIP INFO messaging Sep 22 20:57:27 I can't see why I would want to use some BS mutation of jabber, and disclose my real phonenumber plus additional privacy data to them Sep 22 20:59:15 I mean, google mail is terrible enough with their scanning of all my mail content and analyzing my habits based on what they can deduce from my mails. That's why I don't use gmail. Why would I use watsap which is doing even worse? Sep 22 21:12:04 DocScrutinizer05: true, somewhat offtopic indeed but it's nice to have some at times Sep 22 21:14:25 (( both are 'cheating' the network operators)) No, actually I think they're cheating on their customers, by making them think those could get something for free while they had to pay for same service with their network-operator aka provider aka carrier Sep 22 21:16:25 in fact the custumer pays as well when using whatsap etc, just those cheaters don't admit that. You however can calculate what's the real monetary value of the info/data those cheaters collect about their customers Sep 22 21:17:46 and it usually turns out tthat in the end you (the customer) pay *more* with those cheaters than you'd do with your network provider Sep 22 21:25:55 the server is only free 1 year, after that is 0.99 /year i believe Sep 22 21:26:10 not sure how much can they make with that Sep 22 21:27:28 DocScrutinizer05: just get Google Apps for Businesses. $50 a year, and no scanning. Sep 22 21:27:56 You can use a @gmail address or @whateverdomainyou'retheproudownerof.com Sep 22 21:29:32 And regarding WhatsApp, they just put stupid messaging in a nice wrapper, and marketed it to the young hip crowds. "Free messaging, images and file transfer for you and your buddies" Sep 22 21:29:41 They were smart, nothing more to it. Sep 22 21:30:56 Most of us here know there's no such thing as a free lunch. Let those who can convince people of that fact make the money they want. Sep 22 21:33:56 teotwaki: probably you're right, I should listen to FZ:"SON OF ORANGE COUNTY" and not try to save the world Sep 22 21:36:17 You won't save the world by bitching and moaning in a dead IRC channel. Sep 22 21:36:46 Face it, the people who are still here already have a vested interest in Free Software---it's like preaching to the choir. Sep 22 21:42:34 pretty much every 'free' service does that, tries to create a 'profile' and target ads or sell it to someone else, that's just the way it is nowadays. Regardless it would be nice to communicate with friends and family using the same 'app', if possible. However if it's only free for one year I don't know if it's really worth the effort Sep 22 22:59:27 ~chaninfo Sep 22 22:59:28 125/125 channels, 4831 users, 3444 unique: #debian/1162, #kde/353, #maemo/258, #gsoc/200, #asterisk/176, #meego/174, #harmattan/173, #wowuidev/153, #oe/129, #wowace/125, #wowhead/101, #webos-internals/100, #arm-netbook/94, #openmoko/87, #utah/70, #openmoko-cdevel/62, #edev/61, #uclibc/61, #n9/59, #bzflag/56, #curseforge/52, #asterisk-dev/51, #maemo-ssu/51, #qi-hardware/51, #tomcat/50, #htc-linux/49, #sc2mapster/47, #cubieboard/40, #/38, ... Sep 22 22:59:57 rank #3 after #debian and #kde I wouldn't call "dead channel" Sep 22 23:07:49 DocScrutinizer05: those are channels with infobot on it Sep 22 23:08:28 just #freenode and #ubuntu make us 5th place, DocScrutinizer05. Sep 22 23:54:41 teotwaki: I'm aware this is a infobot-POV. On freenode at large, #maemo is on rank #79 in a list of 12108 channels Sep 22 23:55:02 well, what percentage of n900 owners is that then? Sep 22 23:59:03 98 Sep 23 00:03:44 rather high... I'd think there more more users left... :( Sep 23 00:04:24 98% sounds unlikely yeah... Sep 23 00:09:42 nfc what we're talking about Sep 23 00:09:56 well, what percentage of n900 owners is that then? Sep 23 00:10:16 doesn't get much clearer on repeating it Sep 23 00:11:23 i guess he was wondering how many n900 users are in here... Sep 23 00:11:34 percentage of N900 users in #maemo? percentage of N900 users in freenode? percentage of freenode users in group of N900 users? Sep 23 00:11:38 how many of the remaining users that is Sep 23 00:12:06 without any real way of measuring that, my hope would be 'far less than 1%'. Just because there are just a few users on IRC doesn't mean that nobody is using n900 anymore Sep 23 00:12:51 I still use it as my main phone Sep 23 00:12:53 percentage of #maemo users in total number of remaining n900 users Sep 23 00:13:07 <1% Sep 23 00:13:11 yeah Sep 23 00:14:58 even council wasn't on IRC until I suggested to them Sep 23 00:15:12 some didn't even bother after I suggested Sep 23 00:15:40 exactly. I don't think that kind of channel ranking is in anyway indicative of 'being dead' Sep 23 00:15:52 I'd even think tmo isn't used by more than 10% of N900 users Sep 23 00:16:28 eh? teotwaki talked about a "dead channel" iirc Sep 23 00:16:30 well, if they're anything like me there may be many 'read only' users :) Sep 23 00:17:53 if anything, we might discuss how relevant IRC activity is for a living community Sep 23 00:18:02 I thought he meant to imply maemo/n900 was 'dead' :s Sep 23 00:18:35 it only smells funny :P Sep 23 00:18:43 hehehe Sep 23 00:19:04 highly evolved perverted tango Sep 23 00:20:06 * nox- just wonders what will happen once nokia drops the websites... Sep 23 00:21:30 Nixon will bring them back ;-P Sep 23 00:21:40 :P Sep 23 00:24:54 please take your shoddy language parsing abilities elsewhere. I made it very clear that I was taking about this very specific channel. Sep 23 00:24:56 This is Be-Bop, Even though you think it doesn't sound like that. Sep 23 00:25:59 If you read anything more than that into my statement: piss off, go troll somewhere else. Sep 23 00:26:15 hey, chill! Sep 23 00:26:26 :-) Sep 23 00:28:02 * teotwaki lights a cigarette and throws one at anyone who asks. Sep 23 00:32:01 it seems in my company we are 3 smokers of >50 employees :-/ Sep 23 00:32:33 DocScrutinizer05: in mine, it's roughly 40 smokers for 50 employees. Sep 23 00:35:02 well, it's a bit strange there in general. We also seem to have no coffee, nor any other supply for beverage Sep 23 00:35:14 hi again... Sep 23 00:35:21 hi Sep 23 00:35:51 I'm trying to flash my n900 through the software updater but it complains it is connected through a hub even though it is connected directly to the computer Sep 23 00:36:03 how can I tell the software updater not to pay attention to that? Sep 23 00:36:28 gomiam: several PC mainboards have on board USB hubs Sep 23 00:37:03 I guess that is the problem, but I can't really open up my laptop :) Sep 23 00:37:09 and actaully I have no clue about sw updater. I recommend to user flasher-3.5 Sep 23 00:37:14 gomiam: have you tried different USB ports? Sep 23 00:37:23 teotwaki: all 4 of them Sep 23 00:37:32 what about the fifth/ Sep 23 00:37:34 even the USB 3.0 one Sep 23 00:37:38 The one behind the battery? Sep 23 00:37:55 not in this laptop, sorry Sep 23 00:38:07 He has a brain. Sep 23 00:38:09 :) Sep 23 00:38:10 use flasher Sep 23 00:38:11 XDD Sep 23 00:38:21 teotwaki: thanks... I guess :P Sep 23 00:38:37 ok, I'll try flasher. Sep 23 00:38:54 since I already downloaded the files some time ago Sep 23 00:38:58 Last time I pulled that one on #ubuntu, the guy disconnected... Apparently he wasn't connected to a socket. Sep 23 00:39:04 ~flashing Sep 23 00:39:05 well, maemo-flashing is http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware Sep 23 00:39:06 XDDDDDD Sep 23 00:39:32 teotwaki: perhaps he had the Ethernet connector on the back of the laptop Sep 23 00:39:49 oh man, don't talk about that Sep 23 00:40:12 check if you do ;) Sep 23 00:40:19 couple weeks ago, I borrowed a wireless keyboard/mouse from a colleague's desktop (after hours) for my raspberry Sep 23 00:41:02 once I was done with it, I put the USB dongle back into the little placeholder for it, next to the keyboard's batteries. Sep 23 00:41:55 When I got back the next morning, there was an email to the whole company, from the chick's manager (the chick I took the keyboard from), and the office manager Sep 23 00:42:15 Both saying something along the lines of "Someone stole the dongle, return it immediately or face the consequences" Sep 23 00:42:27 XDDD Sep 23 00:42:30 haha Sep 23 00:42:32 I went and told them it was in the storage thingie. Sep 23 00:42:50 well, I've been known to wonder where the hell the dongle was storeds at with some wireless mice Sep 23 00:43:07 The IT guy (who happened to be there) looked at it, went "Oh, I didn't know they provided such a little hiding spot" Sep 23 00:43:08 e.g., it was hidden below the battery. Sep 23 00:43:20 teotwaki: my reaction, exactly. Sep 23 00:43:23 And then he tried to plug it in. It didn't work. Sep 23 00:43:31 now that's stranger Sep 23 00:43:52 I told him "You can't really put a USB connector in the Ethernet port. They're not electrically compatible" Sep 23 00:44:25 He's the CEO's brother. Can you guess why he's the head of IT? Sep 23 00:44:42 I guess he didn't even blush Sep 23 00:47:49 I have had that problem too... usually when trying to reach the back of a computer by touch alone. Then again, I usually check the hole isn't too big :D Sep 23 00:48:38 Pro-tip: if you can stuff your pinkie in it, it's not a USB port. Sep 23 00:49:19 If you can't stuff your pinkie in an ethernet port, you're obese: get a bicycle. Sep 23 00:49:22 actually I just first time noticed they are almost same size Sep 23 00:50:04 (USB and RJ45 that is) Sep 23 00:51:01 fits surprisingly well Sep 23 01:05:23 ok, flashing... failed, yay! Sep 23 01:06:24 let's see whether it works, anyway Sep 23 01:11:56 ok, first message is telephony functions disabled. But it's not that surprising because I took the SIM card off. Sep 23 01:12:49 Does anybody remember that website with EULA summaries that people were tweeting about a month or two ago? Sep 23 01:14:55 GeneralAntilles: ¿google? Sep 23 01:16:08 ok, language selection ok Sep 23 01:17:51 ok, flash successful. Time to check the SIM. Sep 23 01:19:37 booting... Sep 23 01:19:55 and no message about telephony failure yet... Sep 23 01:20:39 and no dice: telephony functions disabled. Damn Sep 23 01:25:02 ok, bed time. I'll try it again tomorrow Sep 23 01:25:08 bye and thanks Sep 23 02:16:41 ok seriously Sep 23 02:17:13 I've never liked microB because of random crashes, sometimes it needs to be restarted Sep 23 02:17:36 And it does its' job unusually bad now by simply not working *at all* ... Sep 23 02:19:38 it's never crashed for me **** ENDING LOGGING AT Sun Sep 23 02:59:58 2012