**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Tue May 07 02:59:59 2013 May 07 08:32:17 hm odd May 07 08:32:33 i have an ancient email on tmo May 07 08:32:43 went to changee it and says it is in use? May 07 08:36:59 ok fk it. i give up May 07 08:37:06 i will vote next time May 07 08:37:24 the voting is already far in line with what i would have voted for anyways heh May 07 08:52:27 hm May 07 08:52:39 guess i cant vote with my acct May 07 08:52:41 weird May 07 08:52:43 oh well May 07 08:52:59 says i am not a voter or have already voted May 07 09:09:35 Macer: EH???? May 07 09:10:57 Macer: either you got a token mail, or you missed it and need to get a new one, or you never got sent a mail since you're not in electorate table (too low karma, no or too young garage account). Anyway please see my instaructions May 07 09:11:50 >>Important info: This time basically everybody is entitled to participate in voting and we very much like to ask you to actually do. If you haven't received a token mail yet, this might be either due to problems with sending the mail to you, or you're not in the bunch that automatically got a mail due to karma or account age issues. please see http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php...13#post1338413 how to proceed, there's probably no May 07 09:11:51 reason why you shouldn't be allowed to vote.<< May 07 09:12:14 from http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=1339359#post1339359 May 07 09:13:11 the crippled URL in quote should be http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=1338413#post1338413 May 07 09:14:46 (( the voting is already far in line with what i would have voted for anyways heh)) I can't make any sense out of that May 07 09:16:09 except for the highly likely fact that 5 out of 7 will get elected, how do you know that vote is in line with what you whould have voted for? May 07 09:20:57 * DocScrutinizer05 insists in macer voting, hoping for macer to vote doc out of the councils May 07 10:15:24 oh sheet... my n900 keeps rebooting in loop... it does not start anymore... then it starts the boot loader... what shall I choose on backup menu? May 07 10:19:15 oh no sheet now neither boot loader ... May 07 10:27:47 zammy: reflash! May 07 10:27:48 yay! May 07 10:28:01 actually not necessarily May 07 10:28:03 you can use rescueOS May 07 10:28:13 I fucked up May 07 10:28:20 I can reset May 07 10:28:32 there was no file necessary to save May 07 10:29:08 I got how to run the bootloader May 07 10:29:19 now I see backup boot loader May 07 10:29:25 but I did not backup anything May 07 10:29:35 alright my experiments are ended May 07 10:29:36 XD May 07 10:29:47 I fucked up idk how May 07 10:29:56 I downloaded the nokia kernel May 07 10:30:05 then I suppose that has fucked up May 07 10:30:32 I was trying to get my mice on n900 May 07 10:30:39 unsuccessful May 07 10:31:32 install extmou May 07 10:31:53 aiming at what? May 07 10:45:47 "vote doc out of the councils" - fun idea, but sorry, won't happen. ;-p May 07 10:51:20 GRRR May 07 10:52:40 flashed May 07 11:15:08 backup boot loader? May 07 11:15:49 I'll happily help to get your terminology straight. :-) May 07 11:16:04 there's backupmenu May 07 11:16:12 it's unrealted to bootloader May 07 11:16:53 there's also bootmenu (which backupmenu is based on) - also unrelated to bootloader, despite the name May 07 11:18:20 then there's uBoot, actually a bootloader (chainloaded bootloader in fact, NOLO original bootloader will still be in place and effect) - but it's unrealted to backup. Might be the cause for bootloops though May 07 11:21:11 most common root cause for bootloops: mismatch between kernel that gets loaded by bootloader NOLO or uBoot and the kernel modules of rootfs (aka "/") that gets mounted (actually passed to kernel via kernel cmdline) by bootloader May 07 11:22:03 recent top rank #2: fscked-up bme in rootfs May 07 11:24:02 #3: leete geeks trying to optify parts of libs or tools that are needed during init process, thus causing mass segfaults on dsme-safeguarded system processes, like pulseaudio, X11/hildon, browserd, whatelse May 07 11:25:08 all this is usually completely fixable by a flashing of *COMBINED* plus standard hildon backup restore May 07 11:26:31 for uBoot and kernel related fsckups you have some additional work ahead of you to restore your system to what it been before you ruined it, since normal restore can't restore uBoot or custom kernels May 07 11:53:10 does anyone know if a newer version of libc6 exists, newer than the one we have, which is 2.5. I am looking for a version -> 2.7. May 07 11:53:48 DocScrutinizer05: no big deal :) guess it's all about tmo posts? heh May 07 12:03:25 no one knows? May 07 12:06:31 anthonie: sorry, I don't May 07 12:06:46 Macer: huh? You lost me May 07 12:08:09 DocScrutinizer05: thanks, I asked in the devel channel as well; no answer. May 07 12:10:05 I think a newer libc version wouldn't play nice with current maemo system which is based on the libc version we have May 07 12:10:48 my uneducated guess on that May 07 12:12:16 i am afraid so. well, probably going to try anyway. Have mpd up and running now and would love to use ncmpcpp as a client for that May 07 14:24:01 does anyone know how to unlock latest DTG? May 07 14:24:56 ~seen MartinK May 07 14:24:59 i haven't seen 'martink', Pali May 07 14:27:01 ~seen M4rtinK May 07 14:27:02 m4rtink <~M4rtinK@ip-86-49-81-87.net.upcbroadband.cz> was last seen on IRC in channel #harmattan, 20d 15h 49m 59s ago, saying: 'RzR: BTW, any info how long will the meego obs stay up ?'. May 07 14:40:27 DocScrutinizer05: voting for packages not working May 07 14:40:48 probably midgard login related May 07 14:40:48 when I clicked on thumb up button nothing happened May 07 14:41:07 but I'm logged in May 07 14:41:30 Pali: mhm. But honestly, I dunno what to do about it right now May 07 14:41:56 we're just discussing way larger projects, in admin channel May 07 14:42:11 s/projects/problems/. May 07 14:42:43 and we have nobody who would know where to kick to make that voting work, anyway May 07 14:43:36 Pali: I invited you to admin channel for a reason anyway May 07 15:48:54 what the hell my nokia says ever that read only May 07 15:49:12 I tried all kind of stuff about normal linux chmod and chown May 07 15:49:14 no way May 07 15:50:53 you tried not hard enough May 07 15:51:04 is it mounted readonly? needs fsck? May 07 15:56:08 it probably needs a fsck May 07 15:56:13 didn't you just reflash, zammy? May 07 15:57:46 reflash of rootfs/combined May 07 15:57:53 not of eMMC I guess May 07 15:58:42 zammy: a tad more accurate info about the particular error message would help a lot May 07 16:35:09 MyDocs is read-only May 07 16:35:19 there is some mount problem May 07 17:13:47 hi May 07 17:14:19 tomorrow I'll leave the country... while this sounds irrelevant, I wonder how to prevent my n900 from happily connecting to internet asap when I turn it on for this May 07 17:16:54 FIQ: disable automatic connections, disable data while roaming? May 07 17:17:19 right May 07 17:17:32 just wanted to make it 100% sure it wouldn't connect anyway May 07 17:17:32 if you're *really* worried, change the APN May 07 17:17:35 and screw me up May 07 17:17:37 to something that's not working May 07 17:17:50 though I guess flight mode would work too :) May 07 17:17:58 s/flight mode/not entering PIN/ May 07 17:18:00 FIQ meant: though I guess not entering PIN would work too :) May 07 17:18:10 FIQ: you mean tabletpc mode :) May 07 17:18:20 well whatever it's called.. :P May 07 17:54:49 M4rtinK: ping May 07 20:10:30 lol, did they really tell Elop: "Are you aware that results are what matter? The road to hell is paved with good intentions. Please switch to another road," as reported in http://mybroadband.co.za/news/business/77306-nokia-investors-losing-patience-with-ceo.html May 07 20:14:24 oh no, not another road again, pls elop go staight to hell dont take detour, dont stop, hurry up May 07 20:16:21 Idiots. May 07 20:16:28 Can't switch direction again or they'll be done. May 07 20:17:40 they'll done anyways May 07 20:18:19 I don't see the purpose in ejecting all control over your own fate and tying yourself to another company May 07 20:18:35 especially one that has not demonstrated an ability to keep up in the mobile device market. May 07 20:20:08 that plan was doomed from the very beginning May 07 20:20:36 at best they may sustain as niche player now May 07 20:21:27 one among others May 07 20:21:36 i bet that rereleasing the 3310 would work well May 07 20:21:39 No chance for innovation. May 07 20:23:09 btw didnt jolla wanted to announce a real device already? May 07 20:30:17 cehteh, 20 or 24th of this month, I think. May 07 20:30:21 I'm tired of their marketing. May 07 20:30:27 All fluff and vapor May 07 20:32:18 yeah me too, i'd just wish them luck while wait and see. there are no much other alternatives when you want some mostly free OS and a native platform May 07 20:32:35 well my n900 still works .. so i'll just keep using that anyway May 07 20:33:10 i am a bit jealous about my wifes note 2 hardware ... but android makes me angry May 07 20:37:25 I wonder if Elop had accepted this job when he had to toss in all his private assets and would've get paid in Nokia shares, or even better in nokia options May 07 20:38:45 or, best idea ever: 0.5% percent of total of employee wages paid by nokia May 07 20:45:09 cehteh, BlackBerry 10 is a reasonable stop-gap compromise. May 07 20:45:41 i dont need a compromise as long my n900 stays working May 07 20:45:50 You said you're jealous of the hardware. :P May 07 20:46:00 It's pretty much got the hardware May 07 20:46:17 with a UX that managed to accomplish most of what Harmattan was aiming for. May 07 20:47:05 i just hope my n900 will hold some time longer... and when it dies someday i check whats available then May 07 22:28:59 Woodyyy... glad you're joining, will we see election results as fast as for referendum? May 07 22:32:52 depends on when my ride shows up. ;) May 07 22:33:48 What, your ride is more important than this May 07 22:34:03 ? ;-) May 07 22:35:00 Well, at least you'll keep me from wasting the next 1, 5hours just on waiting... ;-) May 07 22:41:03 how are the ballots actually counted? With an old version of OpenSTV? May 07 22:41:13 Define old? :) May 07 22:41:17 oh. wait. There is no STV, right? May 07 22:41:18 * muelli is confused May 07 22:41:45 No, it's OpenSTV... 1.6.1 I think May 07 22:42:00 yeah. probably the last free relesae. May 07 22:48:36 We actually sent in the "suggested donation" for it. Damned if I know where the file went to turn off the "you should donate" cruft though. May 07 22:49:21 reguardless... it's findable and testable on your own system. 100% perl, so you can even run it on your N#00 or N9. :) May 07 22:49:48 Long live Maemo! May 07 22:49:59 .oO(I know, because I did just that the last couple elections to get results before they were official. :) May 07 22:50:40 But yeah... last hour or so here people. If you haven't voted yet, get to it! May 07 22:59:37 what's a typical capacity for a N900 battery? the charge meter chip has measured 1100mAh for mine. is that really low? May 07 23:00:07 my original was 1250 when new-ish May 07 23:00:29 The new nokia bl-5j are over 1400 when new and fresh May 07 23:00:45 ah, not too far off. I'm looking at your charger script right now ShadowJK ;) May 07 23:02:28 it's very cool but I still need the datasheet open just to work out what's going on May 07 23:03:36 I'm not sure I'd call it cool, as I stopped working on it once it worked for 97% of my own use May 07 23:04:14 I would. it's nicely written and super useful in Debian, which doesn't have bme yet May 07 23:05:01 and in fact my bme in Maemo has gone wrong and doesn't charge from a wall charger or a non-charging USB port whereas your script does May 07 23:05:30 does it say Wall: 0 ? May 07 23:05:49 that's suggest data lines are damaged May 07 23:06:26 Wall: 0 when plugged in to non-charging USB port May 07 23:06:57 and with a charging USB port May 07 23:07:18 0 would be expected on generic usb ports May 07 23:07:37 and with the wall charger too. always says 0 May 07 23:09:00 I wouldn't trust being able to use usb port dor data again then May 07 23:09:51 I wouldb't too... May 07 23:09:54 * Win7Mac wonders if it'll be worth waiting another hour for unofficial results? May 07 23:09:57 how can I test that? when I plug the N900 in to a PC it does create usb0 and ttyACM3 May 07 23:10:47 but you reckon it might work sometimes and not others, or go wrong in subtle ways only occasionally? May 07 23:11:15 it's possible May 07 23:12:02 but then again when I plug in my own chargers too slowly wall charger isn't detected and dialog pops up asking to choose pc suite or mass storage May 07 23:12:08 not to worry, the wireless works well May 07 23:12:47 so could be flaky firmware in BQ27x00? May 07 23:14:16 Nah May 07 23:14:27 neither bq are involved in that May 07 23:19:46 why does the script read from musb_hdrc/charger and then do nothing with the result? May 07 23:22:50 reading it triggers side effects May 07 23:23:15 Like reducing power use by 80mA if you've got a wallcharger plugged in May 07 23:23:40 Also, reading bq24150 status register had side effects :-) May 07 23:24:54 right, so if I want to port to Ruby then I need to preserve all of that behaviour carefully May 07 23:25:52 In a "cool" version, it'd also use the result to set input current limit as unlimited May 07 23:26:13 but then again, that wouldn't work very well with out device and chargers, heh. May 07 23:26:22 lazyness paid off, i guess. May 07 23:44:33 I don't understand "i2cset -m 0xFF ..". isn't that "-m 0xFF" redundant because it will write all bits? May 07 23:46:23 yes May 07 23:46:37 also, the whole idea is a bit silly May 07 23:47:02 because some registers have different functionality depending on whether you're reading or writing.. May 07 23:47:32 yes, STATUS/CTRL registers? May 07 23:49:34 right May 07 23:52:29 trying to get my battery calibrated, I discharged it down to when it started blinking red, and then suspended it and let passive draw slowly drop it below EDV1 but I just let it discharge to flat... then plugged it in to recharge... it still didn't count as a learning cycle... is there something special that needs to be done? May 07 23:53:28 the thing that made it blink red probably switched off the phone May 07 23:54:31 yes probably... but it should have been slow enough to hit EDV1, unless it shuts off the phone before EDV1? May 07 23:55:25 does u-boot shutdown when the battery is low. if not, maybe that would be a way to discharge to EDV? May 07 23:56:31 have to disable all battery management software to do this relearn cycle I guess? May 07 23:57:15 probably May 07 23:57:30 mine seems to discharge completely in Debian but I guess you don't want to install that just to calibrate? May 07 23:57:51 I think my battery I'm using in this phone is pretty crappy now... it is several years old now, internal resistance is pretty bad compared to two other cells I have... May 07 23:58:34 on stock you'd do "stop bme" and manually "start bme" again in the few seconds between edv1 and phone dying from lack of power (which can probably cause fs corruption) May 07 23:58:41 but stock doesn't flash red, so.. May 07 23:58:46 based off of the estimated capacity numbers it seems like it still holds 1.1AH or so if discharged slowly... May 07 23:58:51 Why not just replace it? May 07 23:59:01 They're like $12 for a good knockoff May 07 23:59:08 running KP52 + stock BME... May 07 23:59:37 * ShadowJK likes to do calibration at some resonable rate of discharge, so that it's calibrated for capacity when used, not capacity in standby mode ;) May 07 23:59:40 Oh I have two much better condition batteries, I just want to milk the rest of the life out of this one. May 08 00:00:31 I figure that the phone will be in standby most of the time for me, it's not like my primary computer :o May 08 00:02:27 (this battery suffered two years of abuse in a Nokia 5230...but maybe not nearly as much "abuse" as in an n900 that drains it faster...) May 08 00:08:45 OK guys, you asked for it, here you are: 3 entities, 2 councils :-/// May 08 00:16:04 Woody14619: big fail May 08 00:17:59 how so? May 08 00:21:49 non-identical May 08 00:22:34 well, 4 out of 5? :P May 08 00:22:43 one or two trolls were thinking it's a nice idea to vote different for both elections May 08 00:23:19 or rather, vote for one election only May 08 00:23:19 1 or 2 were enough? May 08 00:23:37 well, such is life. :P May 08 00:23:58 yeah, and me losing interest in all this also is life May 08 00:24:00 *1 or 2*??? May 08 00:25:15 anyway, thanks for voting to everybody May 08 00:25:58 win7mac actually, like 6 or 7. but, yes... May 08 00:26:16 results are here for everybody to watch and muse: http://maemo.org/vote/results.php?election_id=33 http://maemo.org/vote/results.php?election_id=31 May 08 00:26:17 there were delats in the sub votes too. :P May 08 00:28:45 k... well.. there you have it. :) off for a bit to eat & what not. May 08 00:35:39 congrats to all 6 new council... 4+1 & 4+1. :) May 08 00:41:24 I started this whole thing to unify both councils into one. I'm not going to attend two councils for 6 months, and I'm not going to adjust what I promised to what this friggin 2 fools made of that election. Either I find a way to unify the both councils or i'll step down May 08 00:42:19 we can live with two councils for a few weeks maybe May 08 00:43:33 but I don't like to have two council meeting, two council meeting minutes, and discussions^2 with BoD for the next 6 months May 08 00:43:51 I can't do that, physically May 08 00:44:12 there are just two different persons, isn't it possible to have them both on the council? May 08 00:44:31 people* May 08 00:45:41 no May 08 00:46:04 there's no rule to have unelected members on either of both councils May 08 00:46:31 and there's no rule that allows 6 MCC members either May 08 00:47:46 there is a way to unify both bodies, but that has to get discussed non-public May 08 00:48:59 and that won't happen today, it's late in europe May 08 00:50:55 also, as already said, we don't need to unify noth entities tonight, but we shouldn't wait til next election is near May 08 00:51:09 s/noth/both/ May 08 00:51:09 DocScrutinizer05 meant: also, as already said, we don't need to unify both entities tonight, but we shouldn't wait til next election is near May 08 00:53:55 anyway, welcome on board merlin1991 chem|st qwazix thedead1440 sixwheeledbeast May 08 01:08:21 since there seem to be ambiguities, I haven't said I'd step back right away! No way! I say I can't sustain running in 2 councils for extended periods of time May 08 01:09:42 but your council wasn't your council if we hadn't thought about a plan B already. We will find a way to handle that as well, I'm rather sure about that May 08 02:07:33 On election results: the huge amount of votes you got, joerg, is an indication of the community's appreciation of the work you are doing. May 08 02:08:22 too bad about the differing results, but this probably wasn't the best way to address this issue-but worth a shot I guess. May 08 02:09:41 shawnjefferson: rhanks a lot :-) May 08 02:09:45 thanks even May 08 02:10:08 alas it was the only way May 08 02:10:15 why not a referendum? Cut and dry, easy for both users and BoD and MCC to interpret. You won't get a small minority screwing things up either. May 08 02:10:23 thanks to a certain person in HiFo May 08 02:11:14 a referendum is a tool of MCC, which has no saying about any HiFo related things incl HFC May 08 02:12:26 I been well aware of a possibility that a minority screws up stuff for everybody, which is not a true democratic spirit in that procedure May 08 02:12:54 but, as mentioned above, it been the only possible way May 08 02:13:19 except for HiFo BoD accepting/appointing MCC as HFC May 08 02:13:58 the we would have had a unified HFC/MCC *before* elections, and everything fine May 08 02:14:17 but one person in HiFo wasn't happy with that approach May 08 02:15:25 should have been, but I'm aware of the issues with that board member even if I dont understand him at all. May 08 02:16:42 welcome to the club! ;-D May 08 02:17:47 we're a really huge club already May 08 02:19:44 I'm sure we'll get it sorted out somehow. May 08 02:20:09 not really a problem, 4/5 of both bodies are identical May 08 02:21:20 as I said above, we anticipated exactly such issue and have a plan b for that May 08 02:22:47 it's however bad style and not politically correct to discuss this plan b publicly May 08 02:23:09 for obvious reasons May 08 02:27:13 good luck! May 08 02:27:23 thanks! :-) **** ENDING LOGGING AT Wed May 08 02:59:58 2013