**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Fri Jul 05 02:59:58 2013
Jul 05 03:01:43 <_jester_> hello world
Jul 05 03:03:33 <_jester_> DrCode: has your device arrived as yet ?
Jul 05 03:04:34 <_jester_> ecc3g: does your nick signify your signal strength ?
Jul 05 03:19:45 <ecc3g> heh.  no, just collisions, unfortunately
Jul 05 08:04:32 <Macer> is there a way to change the sensitivity of the scrolling ?
Jul 05 08:05:00 <Macer> i find myself always making it scroll backwards or having it scroll 20 screens
Jul 05 08:58:27 <psycho_oreos> Macer, maybe buy and apply some sort of screen cover?
Jul 05 09:39:09 <Macer> psycho_oreos: i already bought and applied a screen cover
Jul 05 09:39:26 <Macer> i think it is more a fundamental flaw in the way the scrolling works
Jul 05 09:39:36 <freemangordon> could some recommend a carholder
Jul 05 09:40:31 <psycho_oreos> Macer, or simply the sensitivity, period.
Jul 05 09:41:20 <psycho_oreos> freemangordon, for N900? I used to use one of the generic branded gps type holder thingy. It works to an extent (until the plastic got brittle and snapped piece by piece).
Jul 05 09:41:58 <freemangordon> psycho_oreos: I need something that can be bought now :)
Jul 05 09:42:12 <freemangordon> ooh, generic
Jul 05 09:42:30 <Macer> psycho_oreos: which is why i was asking if there was a way to adjust it
Jul 05 09:42:52 <psycho_oreos> freemangordon, not sure where you are but I visited to one of those usual electronic shop. These days velcro grips are the talk (iinm).
Jul 05 09:43:25 <psycho_oreos> Macer, not to my knowledge. I thought usually applying a screen cover is a way to lower the sensitivity threshold.
Jul 05 09:43:49 <freemangordon> naah, those are too fragile, I bough one a while ago, it felt on the floor and got broken
Jul 05 09:44:21 <freemangordon> I am glad I didn;t have time to mount it in the car with n900 in it :)
Jul 05 09:45:07 <psycho_oreos> ouch, I was about to say.. hmm ok I'll try to find that generic holder thingy. They might still sell it.
Jul 05 09:50:27 <psycho_oreos> Hmm they also sell Belkin Universal Phone Holders. Not sure what they're like.
Jul 05 09:55:03 <psycho_oreos> freemangordon, http://www.dicksmith.com.au/mobile-phone-accessories/belkin-universal-phone-holder-dsau-e8134 <--- maybe this?
Jul 05 09:55:16 <Macer> http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss?url=search-alias%3Daps&field-keywords=n900+car+mount
Jul 05 09:56:45 <Macer> http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_trksid=p2050601.m570.l1313.TR0.TRC0.Xn900+car+mount.TRS0&_nkw=n900+car+mount&_sacat=0&_from=R40
Jul 05 09:56:50 <freemangordon> doesn't look like any of those will allow me to open the kbd
Jul 05 09:56:55 <Macer> ebay has a few actual otterbox ones
Jul 05 09:58:46 <psycho_oreos> I thought otterbox only makes cases for phones/devices, not car mounts.
Jul 05 09:59:15 <psycho_oreos> Yeah that's true, that's the issue that I had with those universal phone holders for car.
Jul 05 10:00:03 <psycho_oreos> http://www.amazon.com/GTMax-Windshield-Mount-Holder-Suction/dp/B0038B4BY4/ref=sr_1_13?ie=UTF8&qid=1373018183&sr=8-13&keywords=n900+car+mount <-- that looks like the one I used to have until individual "legs" started getting brittle and broke off one by one.
Jul 05 10:00:05 <freemangordon> psycho_oreos: yeah, I already research a lot, that is why I am asking here i anyone knows a car mount that is suitable for n900 and still in sale :)
Jul 05 10:00:13 <freemangordon> researeched even
Jul 05 10:00:18 <freemangordon> shit :)
Jul 05 10:01:29 <psycho_oreos> freemangordon, not for one that will allow you to open the keyboard out. :/ I'd be happy if I could find a product that would allow me to do just that.
Jul 05 10:02:31 <freemangordon> psycho_oreos: well, the universal one that got broken was fine. 
Jul 05 10:02:41 <freemangordon> it needed just a little tweaking
Jul 05 10:03:46 <psycho_oreos> freemangordon, in the latter link that I mentioned? if so lol, needs to be removed everytime when one parks their car in the sun. Cheap builds often leads to excessive wear and tear.
Jul 05 10:04:16 <freemangordon> psycho_oreos: yeah, cheap plastic :)
Jul 05 10:05:52 <psycho_oreos> freemangordon, sadly, and no metal braces to hold "individual legs" in place. There's also this (just browsing through the link Macer posted): http://www.amazon.com/N4U-Accessories-Nokia-Windscreen-Holder/dp/B0087PT6DM/ref=sr_1_30?ie=UTF8&qid=1373018523&sr=8-30&keywords=n900+car+mount
Jul 05 10:06:16 <psycho_oreos> hmm (need to use bit.ly for links to amazon lol).
Jul 05 10:07:49 <psycho_oreos> http://www.amazon.com/iKross-Windshield-Holder-Samsung-Android/dp/B009Z1XIK4/ref=sr_1_38?ie=UTF8&qid=1373018791&sr=8-38&keywords=n900+car+mount <-- seems like I'm getting closer.
Jul 05 10:12:05 <psycho_oreos> http://www.amazon.com/ZS-Slim-Phone-Mount-Nokia/dp/B006MS89DO/ref=sr_1_83?ie=UTF8&qid=1373019044&sr=8-83&keywords=n900+car+mount <-- no "feet" though.
Jul 05 13:23:51 <amin007110> :(
Jul 05 13:23:54 <amin007110> :)
Jul 05 13:28:23 <DocScrutinizer05> finally some fun on freenode - it started to get boring
Jul 05 13:28:31 <DocScrutinizer05> ;-)
Jul 05 13:59:57 <DocScrutinizer05> hey gals n' guys, how about offering freenode to run a server VM on maemo.org infra?
Jul 05 14:02:01 <Apic> Sounds good.
Jul 05 14:04:22 <DocScrutinizer05> yeah, what I thought. Particularly since they maintain their VM, no workload for maemo techstaff
Jul 05 14:04:33 <DocScrutinizer05> and resource requirements are modest
Jul 05 14:04:36 <Apic> Cool.
Jul 05 14:05:13 <DocScrutinizer05> 5Mb bandwidth, 1GB RAM - LOL
Jul 05 14:05:53 <GeneralAntilles> What about DDoS threats?
Jul 05 14:06:20 <DocScrutinizer05> yeah, that's what I pondered as well, but in the end they'd probably need and use their own IP
Jul 05 14:07:03 <DocScrutinizer05> nevertheless I'm tending to offer a hidden hub rather than a leaf server
Jul 05 14:08:16 <DocScrutinizer05> otoh you know irc.kde.org etc which are all just cnames for freenode, might be cool to run irc.maemo.org
Jul 05 14:08:49 <DocScrutinizer05> but that requires cooperation from Nokia dnsmaster :-S
Jul 05 14:10:00 <DocScrutinizer05> I'll try to catch Falk and talk with him about feasibility
Jul 05 14:11:06 <DocScrutinizer05> http://freenode.net/hosting_ircd.shtml
Jul 05 14:11:25 <DocScrutinizer05> outdated, according to freenode staff
Jul 05 14:11:39 <DocScrutinizer05> nevertheless they pointed me to it
Jul 05 14:13:46 <GeneralAntilles> Might be trademark issues with that.
Jul 05 14:13:57 <DocScrutinizer05> oh yeah
Jul 05 14:14:46 <DocScrutinizer05> well, I'm sure IPHH wouldn't mind if we run the freenode server under their sponsorship and they get mentioned at http://freenode.net/acknowledgements.shtml
Jul 05 14:15:36 <DocScrutinizer05> thugh it's a pita that maemo community can't use maemo [TM] for such purposes
Jul 05 14:16:04 <DocScrutinizer05> how about HiFo?
Jul 05 14:16:24 <DocScrutinizer05> HildonFoundation/IPHH
Jul 05 14:16:49 <DocScrutinizer05> I'm sure somebody will create a nice logo
Jul 05 16:01:59 <win7mac> Yet another good idea from DocScrutinizer05 ;-) The technical details are beyond my scope, but basically I think it's a good idea.
Jul 05 16:02:43 <win7mac> I might even create a nice logo if reminded about it next week.
Jul 05 16:19:29 <GeneralAntilles> Hildon Foundation is fine
Jul 05 16:19:43 <GeneralAntilles> and I think Maemo Community is OK, too.
Jul 05 16:20:16 <ShadowJK> As someone who's had experience running irc servers, I'd say it's a bad idea ;-)
Jul 05 16:20:53 <DocScrutinizer05> http://privatepaste.com/86defde9b7
Jul 05 16:21:03 <DocScrutinizer05> ShadowJK: please elaborate
Jul 05 16:22:45 <ShadowJK> The freenode server infra is solid as is, so the benefit to freenode would be minimal, and the benefit to maemo users would be minimal. On top of that, most hosting providers (and their providers) forbid it, due to the increased ddos risks. Even if the hosts have capabilioty to filter, up to what their upstram capacity is, the extra workload is often unwelcome.
Jul 05 16:23:21 <DocScrutinizer05> ok, much appreciated
Jul 05 16:23:42 <DocScrutinizer05> does this apply as well for hidden hubs?
Jul 05 16:24:19 <ShadowJK> Hidden hubs get "hit" less often, but when they do, they get hit *hard*
Jul 05 16:25:02 <DocScrutinizer05> we'd probably implement a policy to simply pause the freenode VM when they start to hog the uplink more than we allowed them to do
Jul 05 16:25:21 <ShadowJK> That doesn't actually work though
Jul 05 16:26:24 <ShadowJK> Usually the only thing that works is to nullroute the entire IP range
Jul 05 16:26:32 <DocScrutinizer05> ugh
Jul 05 16:27:22 <DocScrutinizer05> seems I have to talk to the experts at IPHH if they have sharp measures to fight DDoS then, eh?
Jul 05 16:28:20 <ShadowJK> Well, 95% of providers will give *paying* customers a sharp "No!" response to irc :-)
Jul 05 16:28:30 <DocScrutinizer05> hehehehehehe
Jul 05 16:28:48 <DocScrutinizer05> *that* bad?
Jul 05 16:29:14 <DocScrutinizer05> how's IRC way worse than e.g a vulnerable apache with PHP
Jul 05 16:30:06 <ShadowJK> because that can be fixed with hammer to the machine with the apache
Jul 05 16:30:18 <DocScrutinizer05> anyway, seems I'm in for some flames. I will reconsider my suggestion
Jul 05 16:31:47 <ShadowJK> The instant nature of irc means that attacking irc infra gives instant results and instant gratification, and instant "revenge" on whoever pissed someone off
Jul 05 16:31:57 <DocScrutinizer05> though I still fail to see the difference between a DDoS to port 80 and port 6667
Jul 05 16:32:47 <ShadowJK> Webservers fall over by themselves so often nobody can tell the difference if it was usual php mysql runaway or if it was an attack ;-)
Jul 05 16:32:52 <piggz__> so, did tizen get scrapped before being launched? thats worse than harmattan
Jul 05 16:32:54 <DocScrutinizer05> anyway, I'm afk. cya l8r
Jul 05 16:34:45 <ShadowJK> an N900 has enough cpu and ram to run a irc server on a 100k user network, so the ddos is just sheer traffic, to any port, or no port in particular
Jul 05 16:35:59 <Sumedhe> Hmmm... I also have used IRC on N900.
Jul 05 16:36:39 <ShadowJK> If the attacker is out for more than just a show of power, and wants to inflict real damage, they'll distribute the attack to every IP in the range, and maybe also hit the upstream provider with a broad barrage
Jul 05 16:37:38 <DocScrutinizer05> that applies to any server and any service
Jul 05 16:38:18 <DocScrutinizer05> so unless you say irc servers are particularly prone to DDoS, I don't see any difference
Jul 05 16:39:16 <DocScrutinizer05> on the bright side: IRC servers don't get raped by MSDN spiders
Jul 05 16:39:59 <DocScrutinizer05> nor by benevolent users "just mirroring"
Jul 05 16:40:18 <DocScrutinizer05> ooh, I'm away
Jul 05 16:40:22 <DocScrutinizer05> sorry
Jul 05 16:47:19 <ShadowJK> Yes, I do say irc servers attract more ddos than other services
Jul 05 16:55:42 <GeneralAntilles> Yeah, there's a certain antipathy tHat IRC providers seem to generate.
Jul 05 16:57:32 <Fonk> talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=1356583#post1356583
Jul 05 17:57:19 <DocScrutinizer05> ok, didn't expect that. Scrap my suggestion then
Jul 05 18:37:59 <ShadowJK> Anyone remember dalnet when it was under sustained attacks? :)
Jul 05 18:38:42 <ShadowJK> When you pinged and didn't get any replies, reconnected to a different server, and saw 3 copies of yourself from the past talking
Jul 05 18:38:47 <DocScrutinizer05> never heard of dalnet
Jul 05 18:40:24 <ShadowJK> Well it was the most popular irc network by usercount
Jul 05 18:41:08 <ShadowJK> iirc they probably had about 40 servers, but more or less was killed by ddos
Jul 05 18:44:59 <DocScrutinizer05> freenode is probably different, in that it manages all servers centralized
Jul 05 19:58:26 <DocScrutinizer05> \o/ #6 - with silver-white screen frame, and spare mainboard
Jul 05 19:58:43 <DocScrutinizer05> seems no urgently need USBfix though
Jul 05 19:59:38 <sixwheeledbeast> you have six pairs of hands ;)
Jul 05 19:59:42 * DocScrutinizer05 wonders if he already failed on counting ;-D
Jul 05 20:00:14 <DocScrutinizer05> seems to* urgently need USBfix though
Jul 05 20:11:32 <DocScrutinizer05> sorry for OT, but...
Jul 05 20:12:33 <DocScrutinizer05> I just watched in TV what's happening in Kairo and wondered where from I know that. Feels damn sadly like Germany 1932-33
Jul 05 20:13:49 <DocScrutinizer05> Admittedly the Germans back when were not as brave to meet in the streets in million-counts. 
Jul 05 20:14:54 <DocScrutinizer05> But we also had paramilitary armed gangs that represented only a few marginal percent of the people, yet they took over
Jul 05 20:43:09 <GeneralAntilles> DocScrutinizer05, some would argue the outgoing guys are more . . . ideologocially similar to the Nazis.
Jul 05 20:45:45 <ShadowJK> Doesn't matter what their ideology is, if they can't communicate "Well, we're basically fucked, everyone of us. Please work hard!" in a more palatable phrasing, they'll remain fucked.
Jul 05 20:46:06 <DocScrutinizer05> GeneralAntilles: well, that's what I said at least
Jul 05 20:50:19 <DocScrutinizer05> this Morsi guy pushed a constitution that really doesn't earn that name, he neutered jurisdiction, imprisoned journalists that didn't have the right membership book, and finally tolerated some of the totally mentally sick "leaders" to publicly request killing of "the enemies" while he was sitting in the audience
Jul 05 20:50:56 <DocScrutinizer05> now those idiots bitch about their democratic rights got deprived from them
Jul 05 20:51:27 <Drathir> DocScrutinizer05: but when ppl are angry saying that if good remember the ppl chos me in legal vote and i dont even think go away dont meant any good reaction from protsting thousens of ppl... second side if isnt dictature a miss with comunication and dont speak each other "must" faster or not evolue to bunt and protests...
Jul 05 20:51:30 <DocScrutinizer05> and the mob goes rush the streets and shoot everybody that's not "them"
Jul 05 20:56:18 <DocScrutinizer05> I'm not a friend of *any* religion, I'm highly skeptical against religions that look down on others and think they need to convince them of "the one true confession" - but I utterly *hate* those who think they can "win" by using weapons and violence
Jul 05 20:57:03 <DocScrutinizer05> in short: I'm an anarchist
Jul 05 20:57:06 <ShadowJK> heh
Jul 05 20:58:28 <ShadowJK> I think one of the best advices wrt religion I've ever seen, I read in the quoran. I don't remember the exact wording, but the meaning was essentially "It's pointless to argue/fight with religious lunatics, they'll believe whatever they want to believe, and you will believe whatever you want to believe"
Jul 05 20:59:00 <DocScrutinizer05> I'd not sit on Tahir place and drink tea and wait for those muslim brothers to rush in and kill me, I'd head home find my M134
Jul 05 20:59:12 <ShadowJK> Anyways
Jul 05 21:00:00 <ShadowJK> I'd hope that the current interim president would attempt to explain to the people, that free fuel/food isn't going to come back no matter who they elect, and that times will be hard nomatter who they elect
Jul 05 21:00:30 <DocScrutinizer05> I bet almost everybody knows by now
Jul 05 21:00:51 * Drathir think any kind of religion is kind of sect in less or more form...
Jul 05 21:01:07 <ShadowJK> Do you think total military takeover would be better? The military was quick to hand over power to that judge, because the military gets lots of money from the US, and that money has terms and conditions attached, one of which is "no military coups" :-)
Jul 05 21:01:41 <DocScrutinizer05> I don't mind my neighbour praying to the holy spaghetti monster
Jul 05 21:01:50 <DocScrutinizer05> but please leave me alone with it
Jul 05 21:02:01 <ShadowJK> for sure
Jul 05 21:02:07 <GeneralAntilles> To Each His Own
Jul 05 21:02:15 <GeneralAntilles> Also: leave me the hell alone.
Jul 05 21:08:12 <DocScrutinizer05> and our brilliant foreign minister Westerwelle complains that removing Morsi was a serious step back for democracy. What a moron. Morsi himself was a serious threat for democracy
Jul 05 21:10:24 <ShadowJK> He hasn't been loud enough to exceed the news threshold here :)
Jul 05 21:10:30 <GeneralAntilles> Problem is, a lot of political types expouse democracy as a good per se.
Jul 05 21:10:53 <GeneralAntilles> Well, we can all vote to have DocScrutinizer05 drawn and quartered.
Jul 05 21:11:00 <GeneralAntilles> Nothing more than mob rule.
Jul 05 21:12:08 <ShadowJK> election polls and such develop mob rule
Jul 05 21:27:48 <DocScrutinizer05> when Morsi got elected, there hasn't been a costitution, all that existed was his promise to include all of his people interest and be a president of all Egyptians. This been a blatant lie, and now he and his fanboy club bitch about the 20 mio that demonstrated to remove Morsi didn't obey the democratically installed constitution. That's downright ridiculous
Jul 05 21:29:03 <DocScrutinizer05> almost as ridiculous as our foreign minister stating basically the same. 
Jul 05 21:29:45 <ShadowJK> The world is insane anyways
Jul 05 21:29:54 <DocScrutinizer05> since from Morsi and his muslim bro's you'd expect exactly that argumentation. Not though from a german politician
Jul 05 21:30:34 <DocScrutinizer05> El Baradei has put it straight
Jul 05 21:30:44 <ShadowJK> When before, whistle blowers from the USSR revealing their government's opressive surveillance and control of the people fled to the US for sancturary, now whistle blowers from the USA revealing their government's opressive surveillance and control of people flee to Russia
Jul 05 21:31:24 <DocScrutinizer05> well, you probably can switch roles between USSR and USA
Jul 05 21:31:31 <GeneralAntilles> It's all politics
Jul 05 21:31:36 <DocScrutinizer05> not that much of a difference after all
Jul 05 21:31:44 <GeneralAntilles> Although at least our political prisoners seem well fed.
Jul 05 21:31:55 <GeneralAntilles> No gulags in the UD
Jul 05 21:31:57 <GeneralAntilles> US
Jul 05 21:32:12 <GeneralAntilles> Nor are people queing for toiletpaper
Jul 05 21:32:26 <GeneralAntilles> Or likely to be executed by secret police.
Jul 05 21:32:29 <DocScrutinizer05> yeah, they use somewhat more sophisticated tortures than the USSR
Jul 05 21:32:49 <DocScrutinizer05> like water boarding
Jul 05 21:33:16 <DocScrutinizer05> or dogs
Jul 05 21:33:21 <GeneralAntilles> Also: not building "American" towns to train spies from birth.
Jul 05 21:33:53 <GeneralAntilles> Nor sending people to jail for "hoarding" food.
Jul 05 21:33:56 <ShadowJK> China is building every town on earth :)
Jul 05 21:34:04 <ShadowJK> They have a London copy, a Paris copy, a NYC copy :)
Jul 05 21:34:10 <ShadowJK> complete with hudson river :)
Jul 05 21:34:13 <GeneralAntilles> All empty. ;)
Jul 05 21:34:16 <ShadowJK> that too :)
Jul 05 21:34:38 <ShadowJK> for a show-off, they'd be better off restoring the chinese wall
Jul 05 21:34:42 <ShadowJK> All the way
Jul 05 21:34:44 <ShadowJK> into mongolia
Jul 05 21:36:05 <DocScrutinizer05> on a unrelated bot on topic topic: Dremel and a cylindrical diamond mill head made a nice new grip for fingernail to the worn lockswitch of my latest N900
Jul 05 21:36:24 <DocScrutinizer05> s/bot/but7
Jul 05 21:36:43 <ShadowJK> On my last N900 I used to insert nail between switch and case to activate it
Jul 05 21:36:48 <ShadowJK> the little tab broke off :)
Jul 05 21:36:56 <DocScrutinizer05> same here
Jul 05 21:37:04 <ShadowJK> Current N900 has intact tab
Jul 05 21:37:12 <DocScrutinizer05> but that's a bit too cumbersome
Jul 05 21:37:19 <ShadowJK> Became reflex for me
Jul 05 21:37:30 <ShadowJK> I'm probably still doing it on current N900
Jul 05 21:37:35 <ShadowJK> dunno, muscle memory and such
Jul 05 21:38:48 <DocScrutinizer05> hmm, inserding a tiny object between the lockswitch slider and case would allow for a gap for fingernail
Jul 05 21:38:58 <DocScrutinizer05> inserting*
Jul 05 21:39:18 <ShadowJK> mine was round enough to create a gap
Jul 05 21:39:27 <DocScrutinizer05> but my milled-out trench in that tab works as well
Jul 05 21:39:32 <ShadowJK> :)
Jul 06 02:07:23 <RST38h> ...Instances of SCP-1354 are capable of written responses to verbal communication via the manifestation of letter-shaped pasta.
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Sat Jul 06 02:59:58 2013