**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sat Sep 21 03:00:00 2013
Sep 21 03:11:46 <ShadowJK> Does it load talk.mameo.org fast
Sep 21 06:01:25 <jpinx> nice work http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-24171520#sa-ns_mchannel=rss&ns_source=PublicRSS20-sa
Sep 21 06:01:32 <jpinx> Stephen Elop to receive $25m pay-off  *AND*  he gets his old job back in MS !!
Sep 21 07:25:53 <psycho_oreos> Meh, nothing fancy. He sold nokia to microsoft and made sure both board of directors happy.
Sep 21 07:27:27 <psycho_oreos> Correction he sold a branch of nokia (probably a really large branch) to microsoft.
Sep 21 09:56:42 <oooaaaooo> im trying to install less but apt-get says "Couldn't find package less" do i have to enable the extras repo to be able to follow http://wiki.maemo.org/User:Joerg_rw/tools
Sep 21 09:56:47 <oooaaaooo> can someone help me
Sep 21 09:58:51 <sixwheeledbeast> ~pkg
Sep 21 09:58:52 <infobot> [pkg] http://maemo.org/packages/
Sep 21 09:59:01 <psycho_oreos> ~pkg less
Sep 21 09:59:40 <psycho_oreos> hmm.. *facepalms self*.. anyway did you refresh the package list after you have enabled the extras repo?
Sep 21 09:59:53 <sixwheeledbeast> http://maemo.org/packages/view/less/ it's in devel
Sep 21 10:01:45 <psycho_oreos> Well, there you go. :)
Sep 21 10:03:58 <oooaaaooo> yup
Sep 21 10:03:59 <oooaaaooo> thnx
Sep 21 10:07:16 <Pali> what less is only in -devel?
Sep 21 10:07:23 <Pali> it should be in extras
Sep 21 10:12:11 <oooaaaooo> how do i install find on n900
Sep 21 10:12:16 <oooaaaooo> Nokia-N900:~# aptitude show findutils
Sep 21 10:12:17 <oooaaaooo> No current or candidate version found for findutils
Sep 21 10:12:17 <oooaaaooo> Package: findutils
Sep 21 10:12:17 <oooaaaooo> State: not a real package
Sep 21 10:12:17 <oooaaaooo> Provided by: busybox
Sep 21 10:17:18 <psycho_oreos> http://maemo.org/packages/view/findutils-gnu/
Sep 21 10:17:39 <oooaaaooo> ahhh
Sep 21 10:17:42 <oooaaaooo> thnx
Sep 21 10:18:03 <psycho_oreos> It's all easy to find in that link: http://maemo.org/packages/
Sep 21 10:48:13 <robotanarchy> hi :) could it be that the thumb cssu isn't compatible with the very useful recovery-menu?
Sep 21 10:49:03 <robotanarchy> I've reflashed 3 times in a row and now I think that's the cause >_>
Sep 21 10:49:20 <oooaaaooo> hi guys when i run a program i get a "Ouch!  Got SIGSEGV, dying.. Segmentation fault"
Sep 21 10:49:28 <oooaaaooo> how do i fix this
Sep 21 10:49:46 <DocScrutinizer05> use a better program version
Sep 21 10:50:28 <DocScrutinizer05> robotanarchy: I never heard about recovery-menu
Sep 21 10:51:35 <robotanarchy> DocScrutinizer05: sorry, the name is actually "recovery console", here's the thread: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=72726
Sep 21 10:51:49 <DocScrutinizer05> SEGV is always a sign that you rprogram has a bug (or your installation is terribly messed up)
Sep 21 10:53:44 <DocScrutinizer05> robotanarchy: ask Pali
Sep 21 10:54:57 <DocScrutinizer05> though I can't see how something is not compatible to thumb enabled kernel
Sep 21 10:55:13 <DocScrutinizer05> maybe recovery console is special
Sep 21 10:56:07 <DocScrutinizer05> or you're bitten by a bug lately temporarily introduced into iirc the screen output command (forgot the real name)
Sep 21 10:57:03 <robotanarchy> hmm... i guess its a bug. just saw a post in the thumb thread: "im trying installing thumb since 2 days now, but whenever it competes  downlding and itstalling, it never boots, it just show that nokia flash  screen and then everything black, nothing else plz help, ive flashed  vanilla and other thing but no luck of thumb"
Sep 21 10:57:10 <robotanarchy> this is not my post, but i have basically the same problem
Sep 21 10:57:34 <robotanarchy> boots to blackscreen :-\ at least after some reboots.
Sep 21 10:58:14 <robotanarchy> I think when I tried to install CSSU thumb in march, there was a testing and a stable thumb repo, right? because now there's only the one based on testing. is there a way to install a more stable thumb repo?
Sep 21 10:58:24 <oooaaaooo> DocScrutinizer05: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=62800
Sep 21 10:58:28 <oooaaaooo> DocScrutinizer05: yup
Sep 21 11:04:47 <oooaaaooo> so what is the fastest browser available on n900
Sep 21 11:04:52 <oooaaaooo> web
Sep 21 11:04:57 <oooaaaooo> browser
Sep 21 11:05:52 <mashina> opera was pretty good
Sep 21 11:06:05 <oooaaaooo> mashina: yup ive got opera
Sep 21 11:06:07 <mashina> and you can fake your way with microb if you browae mobile sites
Sep 21 11:06:22 <robotanarchy> if you don't mind text browsing, try w3m :p
Sep 21 11:06:34 <oooaaaooo> robotanarchy: ha ha ... 
Sep 21 11:06:41 <mashina> elinks > w3m. heathen
Sep 21 11:06:59 <oooaaaooo> so midori isnt ported to the n900
Sep 21 11:07:19 <mashina> other webkit browsers should be fine
Sep 21 11:10:34 <oooaaaooo> which webkit browser is available for the n900
Sep 21 11:14:31 <psycho_oreos> midori is available in extras-devel iinm.
Sep 21 11:18:10 <robotanarchy> so... does anyone know if there is a "stable" thumb cssu, that one can install instead of the one based on testing?
Sep 21 11:19:13 <oooaaaooo> psycho_oreos: you are right!
Sep 21 11:19:20 <oooaaaooo> psycho_oreos: what was i talking about!
Sep 21 11:53:34 <Pali> ~zimage-fb
Sep 21 11:53:34 <infobot> hmm... zimage-fb is on http://mohammadag.xceleo.org/public/maemo/kernels/framebuffer/
Sep 21 11:53:56 <Raimu> Does anyone know of a simple app or a script for n900 to patch microphone input to TV-out's audio output?
Sep 21 11:54:10 <Raimu> Like, for making n900 a dumb microphone.
Sep 21 11:54:50 <oooaaaooo> raimu doesnt the nokia have a composite video & stereo output cable?
Sep 21 11:54:56 <Raimu> Yes
Sep 21 11:55:18 <Raimu> But the phone's microphone signal isn't automatically carried to that cable. :)
Sep 21 11:55:19 <oooaaaooo> what apps would you use to stream stuff using that?
Sep 21 11:55:57 <oooaaaooo> Raimu: that sucks
Sep 21 11:56:01 <Pali> Raimu: so you want to use n900 jack for audio input?
Sep 21 11:56:20 <oooaaaooo> output i believe
Sep 21 11:56:21 <Raimu> Yeah
Sep 21 11:56:34 <Raimu> Integrated mike input -> n900 jack audio output
Sep 21 11:56:49 <Raimu> So basically that n900 would be a high latency microphone
Sep 21 11:57:05 <Raimu> Connected to a sound card input for example via the n900 jack.
Sep 21 11:57:48 <Pali> Raimu: use alsamixer for settings switches
Sep 21 11:58:11 <Raimu> Thanks for the tip :)
Sep 21 11:58:12 <Pali> or look at TMO, I saw some application which can configure audio input/output jack
Sep 21 11:58:18 <Raimu> Ah
Sep 21 11:58:26 <Pali> but I do not rememeber name
Sep 21 12:00:35 <oooaaaooo> hmmm using the "arrow" key in midori is buggy; how do i turn off password masking?
Sep 21 12:41:49 <jean_brat> Hi, I have been struggling with extkbd issue from quite some time, now all the required keys are working except the SHIFT key with special symboles and capitals,
Sep 21 12:41:49 <jean_brat> However after the BT keyboard is synched, it works like a champ inside LXDE desktop terminal, with all the key like a proper desktop... but outside debian chroot and xterm, It is still a compromise.
Sep 21 12:41:49 <jean_brat> Is there any way i can check which layout it uses inside squeeze (debian) and set the same thing with same laout in maemo terminal using setxkbmap??
Sep 21 12:52:39 <sixwheeledbeast> ~boot-process
Sep 21 12:52:39 <infobot> boot-process is, like, http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=87959
Sep 21 12:55:14 <jean_brat> ~extkbd
Sep 21 12:59:42 <sixwheeledbeast> ~listkeys map
Sep 21 12:59:44 <infobot> Factoid search of 'map' by key (18 of 122): /.xmodmap ;; dynamic mmap ;; dynamic-mmap ;; example html <map> ;; hemaphridite ;; hermaphroditic ;; html <map> ;; imaptool ;; jmap ;; kimap ;; mapserver ;; normandymap ;; omap ;; omap-oc ;; openmap ;; portmap ;; ptkfunc tk_getbitmap ;; ptkfunc tk_getcolormap.
Sep 21 13:00:07 <sixwheeledbeast> ~listkeys vi
Sep 21 13:00:08 <infobot> Factoid search of 'vi' by key (14 of 1075): 32-bit video cards ;; cfcc video algorithm ;; cmd: melvinoops (.*?) ;; cool! then all we have to proviude ;; craft: the viscious vikings ;; device3dfx ;; devices ;; dilvie ;; evil thing about the 8052 ;; exit vi ;; gnu development environment ;; korenavi ;; moviecomposers ;; movies.
Sep 21 13:00:21 <sixwheeledbeast> mmm
Sep 21 13:01:20 <sixwheeledbeast> jean_brat: http://wiki.maemo.org/Remapping_keyboard
Sep 21 13:10:38 <DocScrutinizer05> ~vi-kbd
Sep 21 13:10:38 <infobot> it has been said that vi-kbd is http://wiki.maemo.org/Remapping_keyboard/user_vis_awesome_kbdmapping
Sep 21 13:11:47 <DocScrutinizer05> ~n900-kbd-mapping is <reply> see vi-kbd
Sep 21 13:11:47 <infobot> okay, DocScrutinizer05
Sep 21 13:12:07 <DocScrutinizer05> ~listkeys mapping
Sep 21 13:12:08 <infobot> Factoid search of 'mapping' by key (5): n900-kbd-mapping ;; texture mapping ;; mip mapping ;; karnaugh mapping ;; so the memory mapping.
Sep 21 13:12:29 <DocScrutinizer05> ~forget so the memory mapping
Sep 21 13:12:29 <infobot> DocScrutinizer05: i forgot so the memory mapping
Sep 21 13:34:51 <Sysaxed> what's wrong with my connection?...
Sep 21 13:42:03 <zammy> hey
Sep 21 13:42:19 <zammy> some advice for best pdf reader?
Sep 21 13:42:24 <zammy> on n900?
Sep 21 13:51:31 <zammy> alright evince
Sep 21 14:43:46 <sixwheeledbeast> ~jr-tools
Sep 21 14:43:47 <infobot> i guess jrtools is http://wiki.maemo.org/User:Joerg_rw/tools
Sep 21 14:49:05 <oooaaaooo> i notice some programs dont auto rotate is that normal?
Sep 21 14:53:43 <psycho_oreos> By default most programs run in landscape mode. With CSSU for instance you can force rotation, otherwise there are certain replacements that can also do portrait mode without looking like it was some nasty hack. For instance openmediaplayer which can also do portrait mode (amongst other things that the standard mediaplayer cannot do).
Sep 21 14:54:49 <oooaaaooo> speaking of which
Sep 21 14:55:01 <oooaaaooo> what is a good media player for n900
Sep 21 14:55:10 <oooaaaooo> i dont see vlc
Sep 21 14:56:14 <psycho_oreos> I think vlc was available for download. Though vlc the last time I used was quite flaky. If you want something really fancy but retaining that nice osso-mediaplayer UI, I'd recommend openmediaplayer.
Sep 21 14:56:29 <oooaaaooo> k tnhx
Sep 21 14:57:12 <oooaaaooo> i dont see it
Sep 21 14:57:18 <oooaaaooo> what repo is it
Sep 21 14:58:46 <psycho_oreos> extras-devel...
Sep 21 14:59:27 <oooaaaooo> i have it turned on bhut it doesnt show up in  am
Sep 21 14:59:30 <oooaaaooo> ham
Sep 21 15:01:19 <psycho_oreos> Try punching in a few letters, it'll open up a search box. It is in extras-devel: http://maemo.org/packages/view/openmediaplayer/
Sep 21 15:03:14 <oooaaaooo> psycho_oreos: yeah nothin shows up...
Sep 21 15:03:24 <oooaaaooo> im updating all
Sep 21 15:03:34 <oooaaaooo> see if that makes a diff
Sep 21 15:05:25 <psycho_oreos> oooaaaooo, weird, in any case maybe download it from the link I provided above. There's a link within that page that allows you to grab the deb file. Install that (but also double-check forum links to see if it's the latest build).
Sep 21 15:05:39 <oooaaaooo> k
Sep 21 15:20:07 <entitled> Riddle me this, why is the input lag nonexistent when ssh:ing to irssi shell, when I download something like a torrent now? I guess that torrent keeps data connection open all times, and with only ssh active, it's in somekind of burst mode (extra handshakes, something) and you get more lag
Sep 21 15:23:06 <entitled> Or is there any sense to all this, why I was typing that, it came back (the lag, that is)... but for quite some time the input lag was smaller than ever before
Sep 21 15:23:35 <entitled> (the bandwidth is more saturated now, could be just that)
Sep 21 15:26:52 <entitled> yeah it's great again when I limited the speed down
Sep 21 15:30:37 <entitled> TCPkeepalive fixes it
Sep 21 15:30:39 <entitled> ?
Sep 21 15:36:28 <psycho_oreos> cpuload-applet comes to mind. There's also things like powertop which may help. I wonder if it could be powersaving that is causing the device to lag. Then again depending on bittorrent clients, they can be quite I/O intensive.
Sep 21 15:37:56 <entitled> I'll enable the tcpkeepalive and enable seconds in timestamps too, both should force the connection more active
Sep 21 15:39:16 <entitled> but I'll check if the powesaving could be blamed also, as I forced the clocks to 900 900 for the torrenting
Sep 21 15:44:16 <jonwil> ~seen merlin1991
Sep 21 15:44:16 <infobot> merlin1991 is currently on #maemo (10d 16h 4m 45s) #harmattan (10d 16h 4m 45s) #maemo-ssu (10d 16h 4m 45s). Has said a total of 5 messages. Is idling for 9d 22h 19m 51s, last said: '#neverdothatatall'.
Sep 21 16:00:00 <DocScrutinizer05> bot's answers are not channel specific ;-)
Sep 21 17:37:06 <SAiF> is there a way to open non local files in maemo 5?
Sep 21 17:37:49 <SAiF> I know shared videos can be played, but images cannot be viewed.
Sep 21 17:38:20 <SAiF> I mean I cannot view non local images, but can play non local videos
Sep 21 17:39:51 <psycho_oreos> I believe you are talking about UPnP stuff, osso-imageviewer I don't think has the ability for one to view images hosted on UPnP.
Sep 21 17:40:28 <SAiF> so which image viewer has the capability?
Sep 21 17:42:09 <psycho_oreos> Enna (I think it was called) had that ability. Though it was slow. If you search on Google you might find some, or maybe UPnP/DLNA browsers.
Sep 21 17:47:55 <SAiF> thankyou for clarifying psycho_oreos, I am really happy when some one replies to me.
Sep 21 17:50:25 <psycho_oreos> SAiF, it would be nice if you would also stick around and do some volunteer support. :)
Sep 21 17:51:13 <DocScrutinizer05> SAiF: you just have to wait a bit, it doesn't help to quit channel 10min after asking a question
Sep 21 17:51:50 <SAiF> I wish I could, volunteer, But I dont know much.
Sep 21 17:52:04 <psycho_oreos> ^ I'd also like to add that the availability on the knowledge is also limited. We're not all geniuses who knows everything.
Sep 21 17:52:19 <psycho_oreos> Everyone had to start from somewhere.
Sep 21 17:52:21 <SAiF> Doc,I know this point from my experience on #maemo. :)
Sep 21 18:35:12 <RiD> 'sup MohammadAG 
Sep 21 18:38:21 <Sysaxed> http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=1373064&postcount=370
Sep 21 18:38:33 <Sysaxed> funny
Sep 21 18:41:58 <bennypr0fane> anyone care to take a look at my problem? http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=91425
Sep 21 18:44:23 <bennypr0fane> I'd like to know how I can deal with this in general. For starters, I don't understand why one broken package will completely block usage of apt-get. So let it be broken, no? But always this "held-back packages" issue, it prevents me from installing, removing upgrading anything.
Sep 21 18:46:39 <bennypr0fane> also, this has been sitting there for a while now: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=91334
Sep 21 19:06:49 <psycho_oreos> 1) Seems like that was solved, GPG errors with nokia repo is because nokia didn't (and would probably never bother from now on to) update their keys. 2) Seems like the package contains files that probably belongs to another package, There is a command within dpkg that will allow you to search for which packages own the file. See if that version is newer, maybe cutetube's dependencies needs updating or something. 3) Seems like missing file, you coul
Sep 21 19:06:49 <psycho_oreos> d probably do a dirty hack by touching a file as that so that dpkg may no whinge about it. 4) Never, never ever do apt-get upgrade. 5) No idea, I believe such information are stored collectively in database. There may not be an easy way to do it, so you may have to deal with it. Alternatively you can get your hands dirty and find ways to extract meaningful data and maybe delete it from the database by hand. (Only skilled people can do it properly).
Sep 21 19:08:19 <psycho_oreos> bennypr0fane, ^
Sep 21 19:11:01 <Pali> yes, nokia refused to fix GPG errors
Sep 21 19:11:28 <Pali> I got email from nokia/accenture that they will not fix this problem
Sep 21 19:11:52 <bennypr0fane> psycho_oreos, what information is stored collectively in database?
Sep 21 19:12:13 <psycho_oreos> In addition to what I said: 1) There was a tmo thread about that. It's not important and you can safely ignore it (furthermore disable the repository as it no longer exists). 3) Files stored in /tmp are usually temporary files. They are usually in a volatile area. The loss of that file causing swappolube-nogui to fail removal maybe trivial...
Sep 21 19:12:35 <bennypr0fane> alright, I'm not worried about the GPG warnings
Sep 21 19:12:36 <psycho_oreos> bennypr0fane, Your second link on contacts that has facebook accounts.
Sep 21 19:13:19 <psycho_oreos> 4) Failure of apt-get upgrade (thankfully) was the result of 3).
Sep 21 19:13:51 <psycho_oreos> Well there you go, straight from the kernel-power maintainer now on GPG errors.
Sep 21 19:14:51 <bennypr0fane> I only have a problem if these errors completely block the package manager
Sep 21 19:15:48 <psycho_oreos> I guess you should try and fix swappolube-nogui first.
Sep 21 19:16:05 <bennypr0fane> how do I start?
Sep 21 19:16:43 <psycho_oreos> I wrote a rough guide in that massive IRC "post" above. See 3)
Sep 21 19:18:16 <bennypr0fane> psycho_oreos, I don't understand yr guide, sry! :-( "touching a file"?
Sep 21 19:18:41 <bennypr0fane> which file? how do I "touch" it?
Sep 21 19:19:32 <psycho_oreos> bennypr0fane, touch /tmp/tuning <--- might need to do it as root as maybe /tmp is set with root ownership.
Sep 21 19:20:28 <bennypr0fane> I want Cutetube (QML used to work before my last reflash, now the .deb is gone from announcement thread). swappolube (gui or no gui, whatever works best) and ankimaemi - must have worked at some point, too
Sep 21 19:21:19 <bennypr0fane> psycho_oreos, still not following. what do mean I should touch it? what is that?
Sep 21 19:21:33 <psycho_oreos> Install swappolube GUI. Don't bother with nogui version if you aren't even familiar with linux CLI commands.
Sep 21 19:21:44 <psycho_oreos> ^
Sep 21 19:24:14 <bennypr0fane> familiar - yes, firm - no
Sep 21 19:25:44 <psycho_oreos> At that rate if I were curious what 'touch' was, I'd read up manpages.
Sep 21 19:27:38 <bennypr0fane> the thought didn't even cross my mind that would be a shell command. haven't heard of it before
Sep 21 19:28:30 <psycho_oreos> I wouldn't be telling you CLI commands if your pastes were all from terminal. :)
Sep 21 19:28:51 <psycho_oreos> Think of it that way, finishing a start.
Sep 21 19:29:39 <bennypr0fane> I thought that "touch" was some sort of tech-speak for a multiple-step-procedure unknown to me  that you could apply to a file, just didn't ring a bell as a command
Sep 21 19:30:19 <bennypr0fane> "Update  the  access  and modification times of each FILE to the current
Sep 21 19:30:19 <bennypr0fane>        time."
Sep 21 19:31:22 <psycho_oreos> 'touch' can also be used to create empty files. Just specify an non-existant file and it'll create it.
Sep 21 19:31:50 <bennypr0fane> whew, I'm relieved. swappolube installed fine, removed the nogui-package too
Sep 21 19:32:48 <psycho_oreos> Good, now we've killed two birds with one stone there. You should be able to install the other two packages by now.
Sep 21 19:33:26 <bennypr0fane> you mean without the need to touch that missing file?
Sep 21 19:33:53 <psycho_oreos> In regards to 2), there's a dpkg command that'll search files owned by a package. It's sort of the inverse look up of telling dpkg to tell what files are contained within a package.
Sep 21 19:34:14 <psycho_oreos> That and installing/removing other packages turning out to be a failure.
Sep 21 19:34:29 <psycho_oreos> Including the apt-get upgrade.
Sep 21 19:37:05 <bennypr0fane> now cutetube installed without a hiccup too
Sep 21 19:37:41 <psycho_oreos> That's why I said we killed two birds with one stone there.
Sep 21 19:38:35 <bennypr0fane> I thought you said that because getting swappolube installed also removed the troublesome nogui-version
Sep 21 19:39:45 <psycho_oreos> Oh wait.. cutetube depended on anki. Even better. No need to worry about anki, now probably ankimaemi is left.
Sep 21 19:40:11 <bennypr0fane> shoud I try installing ankimaemi again?
Sep 21 19:41:55 <psycho_oreos> I didn't really imply that, I was suggesting installing the swappolube (GUI). At that time I was thinking what happens if dpkg still whinges about broken/partial install with swappolube-nogui. Turns out (as you probably would have noticed now), swappolube conflicts with swappolube-nogui (or it seems) hence swappolube-nogui got removed (if that ever applies).
Sep 21 19:42:10 <psycho_oreos> Yeah, whatever that is I suppose, and if you needed it.
Sep 21 19:45:55 <bennypr0fane> well anki is still broken
Sep 21 19:47:26 <psycho_oreos> Time to ask Google how to make dpkg show /package/name/X/installed/this/file in the name of the package. On a simple glance it seems to be part of python-2.5.
Sep 21 19:49:09 <bennypr0fane> I'll try man dpkg first
Sep 21 19:49:16 <bennypr0fane> being brave
Sep 21 19:50:39 <psycho_oreos> I've got the answer from Google.
Sep 21 19:50:45 <bennypr0fane> awesome
Sep 21 19:51:09 <bennypr0fane> so if I find which packages installed that file, how does it help me?
Sep 21 19:52:15 <psycho_oreos> I'd check the version that the original package includes. If its newer then the extra dependency on anki isn't needed, otherwise I guess you'll need a differently packed original package.
Sep 21 19:52:57 <bennypr0fane> psycho_oreos, what I want to know first is: "which package installed that file", yes?
Sep 21 19:53:09 <bennypr0fane> dangit, I have to go
Sep 21 19:53:38 <psycho_oreos> bennypr0fane, yup.
Sep 21 19:53:50 <psycho_oreos> dpkg -S -- http://www.debianhelp.co.uk/findfile.htm
Sep 21 19:53:51 <bennypr0fane> one day I'll get to that level of understanding that you have of packages etc. holy oath
Sep 21 19:54:11 <bennypr0fane> any advice how to start?
Sep 21 19:54:17 <bennypr0fane> thanks
Sep 21 19:55:11 <psycho_oreos> I dunno, having linux installed everywhere forces me to learn how to use linux properly. The rest very much is about google-fu, etc.
Sep 21 19:55:35 <bennypr0fane> I'm sorry I have to remain stupid for tonight. Thanks for your patience. 
Sep 21 19:55:45 <bennypr0fane> It's been working the same way for me
Sep 21 19:56:25 <bennypr0fane> But never for all these apt-get problems, dependencies etc, it's all greek to me
Sep 21 19:56:40 <psycho_oreos> *nods* I sort of had to apologise for getting angry at a command you ran. Sort of left me annoyed for a good moment or so.
Sep 21 19:57:07 <bennypr0fane> it made you angry I ran apt-get upgrade?
Sep 21 19:57:15 <psycho_oreos> Yeah, sometimes when in doubt you can always google. Even if you don't get the exact hits you may get rough idea of what the issue maybe.
Sep 21 19:57:32 <bennypr0fane> the emphasis in "may"
Sep 21 19:57:40 <bennypr0fane> or not
Sep 21 19:57:56 <psycho_oreos> More specifically whoever told you to ran apt-get upgrade on maemo. It was known to break maemo setup very easily.
Sep 21 19:57:57 <bennypr0fane> after 1 hour or so of googling, still nothing
Sep 21 19:58:20 <bennypr0fane> it can tempt you to try looking for people who just know 
Sep 21 19:58:52 <bennypr0fane> psycho_oreos, I know running apt-get was risky, but didn't know it's totally forbidden
Sep 21 19:58:53 <psycho_oreos> Yeah partially the issue lies packages that seems to target a single platform. If the case here was debian or ubuntu for instance, you may have better luck when pasting errors into google.
Sep 21 19:59:08 <bennypr0fane> exactly
Sep 21 19:59:25 <bennypr0fane> it's all specifically mean in maemo
Sep 21 19:59:50 <bennypr0fane> well thanks again, gotta go
Sep 21 19:59:55 <bennypr0fane> have a good one!
Sep 21 19:59:58 <psycho_oreos> It's not that its forbidden, nobody is stopping you. Though fixing the mess it may leave behind will be fun (usually). Luckily apt-get upgrade in your case failed due to swappolube-nogui (mainly).
Sep 21 20:00:08 <psycho_oreos> Yup, inevitably.
Sep 21 20:00:18 <bennypr0fane> yup i was lucky this time
Sep 21 20:00:26 <psycho_oreos> Alright, have fun! remember, manpages and google.
Sep 21 20:00:33 <bennypr0fane> thanks
Sep 21 21:02:43 <jdoles> If you get a subscription for some fast Internet (14.4Mb/s), can you also use it with the N900 in a slower mode? (I don't think the N900 does 14.4Mb/s, because it lacks a modern chip)
Sep 21 21:03:31 <jdoles> That is, do the networks fall back to whatever the phone does support or can you basically throw away your N900 is you still want to use some mobile internet? 
Sep 21 21:03:48 <jdoles> s/is/if
Sep 21 21:04:53 <wotan147> Folks is it possible to package a maemo app form ubuntu without scratchbox? just with dpkg-buildpackages?
Sep 21 21:14:26 <psycho_oreos> jdoles, the provider probably will support fallback/slower speeds. As long as they are using the same frequencies as N900 then it should be possible.
Sep 21 21:15:10 <psycho_oreos> wotan147, doubt it. scratchbox is mainly needed also for cross compiling. Plus it has all the necessary maemo deps.
Sep 21 21:16:19 <psycho_oreos> You might be able to forgo scratchbox setup, but you may end up with a messy build environment that is mixed with maemo stuff. In the very least scratchbox is provided so that the mess is somewhat more contained.
Sep 21 21:25:47 <wotan147> psycho_oreos  hm :(   okay thanks ;)
Sep 21 21:28:18 <samuel1> holaaa
Sep 21 21:35:50 <DocScrutinizer05> jdoles: fallback
Sep 21 21:52:43 <jdoles> Regarding speed, I am seeing that lots of networks still support on 2Mb/s vs 14.4Mb/s and that lots of people have reported 9Mb/s to work on the N900. Is it really annoying to use the 2Mb/s variant?
Sep 21 21:53:41 <jdoles> Most bandwidth limits are really low, so the only benefit would be reduced latency when browsing, but even via wifi that's not really that fast on an N900 (it seems CPU limited).
Sep 21 21:54:22 <jdoles> I am even considering to just keep the N900 as a toy and get another phone for more serious things. 
Sep 21 21:56:20 <DocScrutinizer05> n900 is no phone and no toy, but a tool
Sep 21 22:04:00 <jdoles> A tool for doing what exactly? 
Sep 21 22:04:40 <jdoles> A laptop can do the same things, except for calling, which even a Nokia 3210 can do (with much better battery life).
Sep 21 22:05:49 <jdoles> Don't get me wrong, it's great that a phone exists on which one can run Debian, if one is so inclined. 
Sep 21 22:23:34 <int_ua> what's the right word(s) to call dpkg dependencies separated by | (vertical bar, meaning either one is good)
Sep 21 22:23:35 <int_ua> ?
Sep 21 22:25:29 <DocScrutinizer51> alternatives?
Sep 21 22:27:58 <int_ua> DocScrutinizer51, thanks :)
Sep 21 22:41:04 <int_ua> Doesn't HAM understands them really?  Can't find any info
Sep 21 22:46:16 <DocScrutinizer51> int_ua: seems HAM is't prepared to send the right commands to apt and generally handle a few such thigs
Sep 21 23:21:00 <RiD> jdoles i still use it as my primary phone
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