**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Thu Oct 10 02:59:58 2013 Oct 10 03:24:00 please explain in neo900 thread, so Nikolaus gets to know. I have a hard time convincing him about tlv320aic34 Oct 10 03:25:48 sure, our modem will have differnt interface anyway, and will not need some of the pa-nokia voodoo since it has built-in echo cancellation and noise suppression Oct 10 03:28:33 spilling the beans: we plan to open preorder in 1..2 weeks. sth like 100EUR down payment to apply for one of the Neo900. 2000EUR for one of the prototypes. Donations to get your name etched on all PCB otherwise. Aiming at 20k Oct 10 03:31:46 we might try to get 50% of the aim via direct preorder, other 50% via kickstarter (which has better PR but is a PITA otherwise). If we reach the aim during 2..4 weeks we will start prototype design. Unclear what we'll do when we miss the aim Oct 10 03:34:54 anyway any dicount will apply only for those who joined the early preorder. later preorders will have regular price Oct 10 03:36:42 I', a noob at those marketing details and economics, so that's just how I got it what is a possible business plan for initial phase right now. disclaimer: may change, and maybe I even got it wrong Oct 10 03:37:32 anyway: stay tuned, and keep your purse at reach ;-) Oct 10 03:39:46 hi all Oct 10 03:39:46 I have install android in n900 Oct 10 03:39:49 nitraid Oct 10 03:39:51 fro meamo Oct 10 03:39:52 any one using it? Oct 10 03:39:53 jonwil: btw Option is PCM master, not slave like BB5. So any alsa soundcard device for option modem will be a very natural behaving soundcard, not some weird stuff like that ISI timing adjustment message shite Oct 10 03:40:07 DrCode: condolences Oct 10 03:40:33 hi DocScrutinizer05 Oct 10 03:41:02 It load android ok but I have some issue about voice call , any idea? Oct 10 03:41:12 sorry, no Oct 10 03:41:23 never touched *droid, and prolly never will Oct 10 03:41:46 Android is a decent OS; better than the alternatives, but nowhere in the same class as Maemo Oct 10 03:41:56 *if* I ever do, then on a genuine android device Oct 10 03:42:06 Which -- I'm thus far convinced -- is the best mobile phone OS ever designed. Oct 10 03:42:09 ok Oct 10 03:42:27 robbiethe1st: ack Oct 10 03:42:47 meamo is the best os , but I have missing apps like waze Oct 10 03:42:48 that I am using in my car Oct 10 03:43:25 N900 has maps, doesn't it? Oct 10 03:43:50 also: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=79860 Oct 10 03:43:51 I asked that a zillion times now, so this time I don't care I again forgot what's waze. I seem to better not know, otherwise I would recall Oct 10 03:44:05 I had to google for it, too Oct 10 03:44:16 but hey, it apparently already has a port for Maemo 5 Oct 10 03:44:24 LOL Oct 10 03:44:45 if it's worth using it, it has a maemo5 port Oct 10 03:45:05 Yup Oct 10 03:45:06 if it has no maemo5 port, rather forget about it Oct 10 03:45:31 I know there is qtwaze Oct 10 03:45:32 Eh, not sure... Is there a port for the Arduino IDE? Oct 10 03:45:41 witch is not updated and dosn't work well Oct 10 03:45:47 can I run backupmenu with u-boot? Oct 10 03:45:55 yes Oct 10 03:46:09 completely unentangled domains Oct 10 03:46:46 it's just kinda annoying that both check for kbd slider open/closed Oct 10 03:47:09 I'd prefer one of both to check for a different indication to pop up Oct 10 03:47:13 but what will load before? u-boot or backupmenu? Oct 10 03:47:33 of course uBoot load first since it's a bootloader Oct 10 03:47:46 backupmenu is a linux userland app Oct 10 03:47:52 though a special one Oct 10 03:48:00 I see Oct 10 03:48:06 I see Oct 10 03:48:22 i will find it in u-boot? Oct 10 03:48:35 you will find what? Oct 10 03:48:37 or after I boot it will load backupmenu? Oct 10 03:48:43 exactly Oct 10 03:48:51 in u-boot list? Oct 10 03:48:56 no Oct 10 03:49:17 you boot standard maemo, and when kbd open, first app to get started is BM Oct 10 03:49:47 ok Oct 10 03:49:50 thnku Oct 10 03:49:52 yw Oct 10 03:50:07 anyone know what omap mcbsp is? Oct 10 03:50:31 Multi Channel Bidir Serial port Oct 10 03:50:55 or sth like that Oct 10 03:51:24 ok, but whats connected to it on the N900? Oct 10 03:51:37 audio chip? Cellular audio interface? Oct 10 03:51:37 ask freemangordon, maybe others just call it MIPI HSI Oct 10 03:52:02 jonwil: there are like 3 or 4 McBSP interfaces on OMAP2420 Oct 10 03:52:08 ok Oct 10 03:52:12 3430* Oct 10 03:53:01 jonwil: DSP, AUDIO, CMT :) Oct 10 03:53:13 ola fmg Oct 10 03:53:17 hi Oct 10 03:53:29 ok, so /sys/devices/platform/omap-mcbsp.2 would point to what exactly? Oct 10 03:53:33 Audio chip? Oct 10 03:53:39 CMT audio? Oct 10 03:53:40 McBSP == HSI? Oct 10 03:53:41 what? Oct 10 03:53:47 DocScrutinizer05: no Oct 10 03:54:05 it is used for... sideband audio Oct 10 03:54:13 or whatever it was called Oct 10 03:54:23 jonwil: ^^^ Oct 10 03:54:26 ok Oct 10 03:54:33 so its part of the audio chip? Oct 10 03:54:39 or the CMT? Oct 10 03:54:50 jonwil: mompls, need to check schem Oct 10 03:54:53 BSP is a bus, he same way SSI is Oct 10 03:54:56 ok Oct 10 03:55:36 MCBSP2: audio codec tvl320aic34 Oct 10 03:55:37 just mind you it is 5 to 7 here and I just started my first coffee :) Oct 10 03:56:40 I just wonderd if I should have my last coffe or rather a nap, since you know... it's 5:56 here Oct 10 03:56:48 DocScrutinizer05: check McBSP1 Oct 10 03:57:04 iirc CMT uses it Oct 10 03:57:25 McBSP4 : RAPU Oct 10 03:57:42 McBSP1 : WLAN Oct 10 03:57:46 hmm, no, this is muxed to SSI Oct 10 03:57:59 McBSP4 that is Oct 10 03:58:01 McBSP3 : BT Oct 10 03:58:05 ok Oct 10 03:58:53 RAPU == ISI Oct 10 04:00:08 freemangordon: >>BSP is a bus, he same way SSI is<< dang, tha last few days all your moaning and quoting sources made me think SSI == HSI Oct 10 04:00:47 sure thing, the difference is in speed Oct 10 04:01:01 SSI is up to 110 Mbit Oct 10 04:01:16 not sure about HSI, but it is higher Oct 10 04:02:34 http://www.omappedia.com/wiki/HSI Oct 10 04:03:22 the same thing we have Oct 10 04:03:45 SSI === OMAP3, HSI == OMAP4 and higher Oct 10 04:04:13 "Supports HSI(OMAP4+) and SSI(OMAP3) " Oct 10 04:04:42 >>HSI link is the recommended IPC for OMAP4 modem connectivity. It offers a high speed multi-channel interface to connect 3G and 4G (up to LTE Category 3) modems. The OMAP HSI driver supports both OMAP MIPI HSI (as defined in MIPI documentation mipi_HSI-PL_specification_v01-01-00a.pdf) and OMAP SSI devices through different device files, and a generic SW driver.<< Oct 10 04:09:06 anyway: http://www.omappedia.com/wiki/Kernel_McBSP Oct 10 04:09:27 "buffered", not "bidir" Oct 10 04:26:00 freemangordon: so you say BB5/RAPU is connected via (some of) McBSP4 balls on OMAP, but those balls are ModeN-muxed to SSI instead of McBSP? Oct 10 04:26:16 :nod: Oct 10 04:26:20 thanks Oct 10 04:26:32 not easy to spot for an EE like me, from schem Oct 10 04:27:12 check the schematic on p.2 Oct 10 04:27:22 makes sense since SSI~=HSI and HSI is THE interface for 3G/4G Oct 10 04:27:29 SSI(7:0) Oct 10 04:27:34 :nod: Oct 10 04:28:09 since no datasheets for BB5 I thought McBSP == SSI Oct 10 04:28:32 been mistaken Oct 10 04:28:57 seems McBSP is a glorified PCM/IIS Oct 10 04:30:29 it's just funny since HSI pretty much matches the description of multichannel buffered serial protocol Oct 10 04:30:44 on a functional level Oct 10 04:31:22 damn, upstream broke video playback :( Oct 10 04:31:33 and since MIPI HSI is (C), I thought this is TI's proprietary name for it, similar to what you often see for I2C Oct 10 04:31:46 framebuffer memory cannot be allocated Oct 10 04:32:26 prolly somebody else already seized it Oct 10 04:32:52 I don;t think so, seems noone is testing :( Oct 10 04:33:00 but me :D Oct 10 04:33:03 hehe Oct 10 04:33:40 they removed VRAM allocation in 3.8 and moved to dma API Oct 10 04:33:47 which uses CMA Oct 10 04:34:28 unfortunatley CMA is not good enough to find a contignious 2 MB block of memory, despite I reserved 64MB for it Oct 10 04:34:39 http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=91142&page=76 Oct 10 04:34:53 That last post explains whats up with pulseaudio-nokia and pulseaudio Oct 10 04:35:00 (HSI) try to find that friggin mipi_HSI-PL_specification_v01-01-00a.pdf, it's more sekrit than the bootloader seckey Oct 10 04:35:12 MIPI is a plague Oct 10 04:36:45 I see what you mean about that pdf, plenty of people who say "read that PDF" but no links to it anywhere Oct 10 04:37:09 I guess we'll just have to revert that, I won;t dive into kernel MM system in an attemt to fiz CMA Oct 10 04:38:19 fix even Oct 10 04:40:18 anyhow, I can say that we will have to identify if pulseaudio-nokia relies on the specifics and characteristics of any parts of the audio system (e.g. does xprot rely on the specifics of the N900 speakers, does pulseaudio-nokia cmt voice bits rely on the specifics of the N900 cellular modem other than the libcmtspeech interface, etc) Oct 10 04:41:08 But I do know for a fact that there is a direct tie between pulseaudio-nokia and the tvl320aic34 Oct 10 04:41:29 and a direct tie between the statically linked libcmtspeech and the cellular modem Oct 10 04:41:32 jonwil: that could be just "neable" sysfs entry Oct 10 04:41:36 Beyond that we need to do some identifying Oct 10 04:41:41 *enable Oct 10 04:41:42 and no its more than that Oct 10 04:41:47 damn Oct 10 04:42:24 jonwil: what entry it uses? Oct 10 04:42:55 there are references to /sys/devices/platform/omap-mcbsp.2/st_ch0gain, /sys/devices/platform/omap-mcbsp.2/st_ch1gain, /sys/devices/platform/omap-mcbsp.2/st_enable and /sys/devices/platform/omap-mcbsp.2/st_taps Oct 10 04:43:02 as well as to /sys/power/vdd2_lock Oct 10 04:43:12 the last one is easy Oct 10 04:43:32 yeah I figured Oct 10 04:43:36 it just makes sure there is enough bandwidth in interconnect Oct 10 04:44:44 All the evidence that I have shows that using the same tvl320aic34 chip as the N900 will make it much easier to keep pulseaudio-nokia working correctly Oct 10 04:45:08 There may be other bits we want to reuse too, I dont know enough about the other audio hardware of the N900 to say for sure Oct 10 04:48:35 we might want to copycat the headset detection Oct 10 04:49:27 everything around N4007 N4008 Oct 10 04:49:41 and ECI_AD Oct 10 04:50:35 actually I pointed pali to a ECI (multibutton wired headset) driver for N900 android just a few days ago Oct 10 04:50:46 DocScrutinizer05: Does what I wrote help explain to Nikolaus why we need to copy bits of the N900 audio subsystem in Neo900? Oct 10 04:50:59 jonwil: see my answer :-) Oct 10 04:51:09 :) Oct 10 04:53:04 freemangordon: jonwil: we need to come up with a stopgap solution for dialer&audio for Neo900 Oct 10 04:53:39 so early adopters can somehow *use* the phone even when PA adaption and RE not yet finished and tested Oct 10 04:54:26 I would be willing to completely tear down PA to enable phone operation Oct 10 04:54:52 making phone standby and e.g. MP3 playback mutually exclusive Oct 10 04:55:51 I wouldn't care if this bandaid doesn't support BT headsets, even wired headsets (though those should be easy, once handset audio works for cmt) Oct 10 04:56:43 ok, so I wonder if pulseaudio-nokia depends on specifics of speaker amp, speakers, microphone, microphone interface, headphone amp, FMTX, FMRX or Bluetooth audio Oct 10 04:56:51 porting a dead simple dialer form e.g. SHR should suffice Oct 10 04:57:02 yeah for all that we could use whatever GTA04 is using Oct 10 04:57:07 i.e. GTA04 cellular modem audio Oct 10 04:57:14 which is already supporting the Option stuff Oct 10 04:57:27 and fsogsmd from GTA04 for cellular modem functionality Oct 10 04:57:35 and whatever GTA04 has for calls and SMS Oct 10 04:57:35 yep Oct 10 04:57:43 that would work for stopgap Oct 10 04:57:52 :nod: Oct 10 04:59:00 ok so we need to ID if pulseaudio-nokia references specifics of any of the other audio related components other than the tvl320aic34 Oct 10 04:59:28 e.g. if it does audio processing based on the exact characteristics of the microphone or speakers Oct 10 04:59:32 or speaker amp Oct 10 04:59:33 or whatever Oct 10 04:59:47 for your question above: speaker amp 0, speakers well dont worry, mic 0, mic IF 0, HP amp 0, FMTX FMRX needs further investigation since will differ from N900, BT same Oct 10 05:00:52 No reason not to use the same N900 speakers (they will fit best in the case if nothing else) Oct 10 05:01:04 we will use same speakers Oct 10 05:01:09 probably Oct 10 05:01:22 when we use better speakers, they simply will be better Oct 10 05:01:31 no negative impact on PA crap Oct 10 05:02:04 er... Oct 10 05:02:20 doesn't PA do some sort of trickery to not blow up the speakers at high volume? Oct 10 05:02:27 worst case XPROT doesn't exploit full capabilities of better speakers Oct 10 05:02:27 you won't need that with better speakers Oct 10 05:02:44 exactly Oct 10 05:02:59 no i mean Oct 10 05:03:07 that's bad Oct 10 05:03:12 yes Oct 10 05:03:19 worst case XPROT doesn't exploit full capabilities of better speakers Oct 10 05:03:57 but we won't adapt XPROT to work better for better speakers Oct 10 05:04:03 we simply nuke it Oct 10 05:04:41 anyway Oct 10 05:04:50 how do you get better speakers that fit in the n900? Oct 10 05:04:53 XPROT is a silly dynamic compressor/limiter and a highpass filter Oct 10 05:04:58 if they existed, someone would've already tried it Oct 10 05:05:05 *them Oct 10 05:05:08 *shrug* Oct 10 05:05:09 *whatever Oct 10 05:06:03 Nikolaus tells the knowles speakers are same formfactor and footprint, just 36Ohm instead of the 7Ohm of the speakers in N900 Oct 10 05:06:27 I don't worry Oct 10 05:06:58 ok, in any case we do have reverse engineering to do on pulseaudio-nokia for cmtspeech if nothing else Oct 10 05:07:11 :) Oct 10 05:08:35 hmm, I thought there is some FOSS cmtspeech which got used in SHR? Oct 10 05:09:17 at least for basing an own driver on it, which i helped to design a bit Oct 10 05:09:32 there is foss cmtspeech in meego repo Oct 10 05:10:05 but the problem we have is that libcmtspeech is statically linked into pulseaudio-nokia-voice remember Oct 10 05:10:11 cmtaspeech is a weird silly thing that feeds chunks of audio to cmt in sync with the timing correction messages that the cmt sends to APE Oct 10 05:10:30 yep, I remember Oct 10 05:10:49 and also the foss cmtspeech is quite a few versions ahead of the one Fremantle has Oct 10 05:11:07 well, it seems to work for BB5 Oct 10 05:11:58 it does but the interface to the rest of the pulseaudio stuff has likely changed Oct 10 05:12:26 which interface, when in fremantle it's linked Oct 10 05:13:19 you mean the function calls available? Oct 10 05:13:31 I don't think they changed Oct 10 05:13:35 I mean the interface we need to know so we can rip parts out of pulseaudio-nokia-voice and replace with something new Oct 10 05:18:27 jonwil: the Options have built-in echo cancellation and noise suppression. And a way cleaner protocol than the BB5. I suggest to replace pulseaudio-nokia-voice by a plain bridge interface to a alsa soundcard that represents the Option PCM audio Oct 10 05:21:26 ISI has no way to do proper realtime PCM or other audio, thus it does time adjust messages and cmtspeech sends 5ms chunks (burst) on a pace it adjusts according to those time adjust msgs Oct 10 05:22:15 Options are PCM master, thus a pretty standard soundcard basically Oct 10 05:22:58 you have a dedicated PCM interface that pulls frame by frame realtime from a IIS interface on the OMAP Oct 10 05:23:43 pulseaudio-nokia-voice doesn't need to do much, basically it doesn't need to do *anything* for Option Oct 10 05:24:08 at least that's what I think right now Oct 10 05:25:02 pulseaudio-nokia-voice does a lot more than it looks at first glance Oct 10 05:25:36 maybe it should convert whatever input it gets to a mono signal @ 8kHz Oct 10 05:26:01 so we need to find out what it does Oct 10 05:26:07 pulseaudio-nokia-voice that is Oct 10 05:26:26 yes we do Oct 10 05:27:30 its got xprot, agc, drc, temprature read from BME, aec and more Oct 10 05:27:40 as well as cmtspeech Oct 10 05:27:58 xprot? Oct 10 05:28:16 ooh, for inbound audio Oct 10 05:28:52 agc, aec, drc(?) are already in Option Oct 10 05:29:03 nfc what for it needs temperature Oct 10 05:29:14 aah xprot Oct 10 05:30:05 cmtspeech is a slave<->master converter basically Oct 10 05:30:19 which we don't need for Option either Oct 10 05:30:21 also, it does stuff with voip Oct 10 05:30:31 UGH Oct 10 05:30:42 FFS Oct 10 05:31:04 wel NO! Oct 10 05:31:22 the source filenames I can see in the .so file include voice-voip-source.c, voice-voip-sink.c, voice-util.c, voice-temperature.c, voice-sidetone.c, voice-raw-source.c, voice-raw-sink.c voice-optimized.c, voice-mainloop-handler.c, voice-hw-source-output.c, voice-hw-sink-input.c, voice-event-forwarder.c, voice-cs-call-sink-input.c, voice-cmtspeech.c, voice-aep-sink-input.c, timestamp.c,... Oct 10 05:31:24 ...module-nokia-voice.c and eq_fir.c Oct 10 05:31:30 our Option *IS* identical to a VoIP connection, basically Oct 10 05:31:41 does it do sidetone? Oct 10 05:31:56 dunno, sidetone is overrated Oct 10 05:32:51 sidetone is a silly -18dB feedback from mic to earpiece, to comfort the user by hearing his own voice silently in hte earpiece Oct 10 05:33:21 you probably wouldn't even notice when sidetone missing Oct 10 05:34:29 maybe pulseaudio-nokia-voice also creates comfort noise that's for givibg user a audio feedback during silence periods, so user doesn't think the call stalled Oct 10 05:35:45 when far end doesn't talk at all, no data gets transferred to save bandwidth and traffic. receiver side fills in confort noise (mute pink noise or whatever) during those periods Oct 10 05:36:31 I haven't checked Option datasheets yet, but I guess Option doing *all* this on-board Oct 10 05:37:41 * DocScrutinizer05 wishes konttori was around, to ask him about that stuff regarding BB5 Oct 10 05:40:46 jonwil: think of BB5 like a raw data transceiver which happens to have a GSM codec in datapath. everything else audio processing is done on APE, probably because N900 product specs specified that the audio is APE centric Oct 10 05:41:16 Option otoh is a self-conprised complete phone Oct 10 05:41:33 that just has PCM for mic and speaker Oct 10 05:41:47 yeah I suspect option modem was designed in part for use in usb cellular data sticks and things Oct 10 05:41:56 we really don't need much of whatever pulseaudio-nokia-voice might do Oct 10 05:42:05 yes Oct 10 05:42:57 but for maemo an option module PCM and a SIP PCM is absolutely identical Oct 10 05:43:12 maybe this gives you some ideas ;-) Oct 10 05:43:57 we could pretend Option speaks RTP Oct 10 05:44:25 and wrap it into a VoIP account Oct 10 05:45:13 pulseaudio-nokia-voice shouldn't notice any difference Oct 10 05:45:48 I actually think Option talks 711a Oct 10 05:46:02 or sth *very* similar Oct 10 05:49:51 jonwil: our problem is ped and the audio routing and switching of the same Oct 10 06:03:20 `yeah we need to deal with closed alsa-policy-enforcement Oct 10 06:03:27 and also closed policy-settings-rx51 Oct 10 06:03:35 well policy-settings-rx51 has been partially decompiled Oct 10 06:03:38 but not completly Oct 10 06:03:49 and I dont know if the decompile we have is or isn't a 100% decompile Oct 10 06:04:11 jonwil: I think we should trust Pali it is Oct 10 06:04:19 and it is in CSSU since ages Oct 10 06:04:21 ok, but its not completly decompiled Oct 10 06:04:27 the dresc file Oct 10 06:04:40 ok Oct 10 06:07:22 * DocScrutinizer05 starts to wonder if we could kick ped and PA and all that crap completely, and replace it by sth we designed... but... will be rather a long term project Oct 10 06:07:46 I think we can figure out partially what module-nokia-voice is doing by comparing earliest module-meego-voice to binary of module-nokia-voice and matching up functions Oct 10 06:08:05 sure Oct 10 06:08:20 question is if we need to do it at all Oct 10 06:08:33 I think we do Oct 10 06:08:39 why? Oct 10 06:08:53 Its doing things not just for cellular audio but for other things Oct 10 06:09:08 so just keep it? Oct 10 06:09:08 we could try and run the Neo900 without that module and see what happens Oct 10 06:10:32 we could try to create a SIP call via alsacard cmt rather than via telepathy and RTP Oct 10 06:12:50 whatever RTP interface SIP is using/creating that pulseaudio-nokia-voice is connecting to and piping audio data to it and from, we could just hijack it and redirect it to cmt PCM Oct 10 06:13:42 don't you think we could? Oct 10 06:14:16 aiui this would need zilch patching or RE on pulseaudio-nokia-voice Oct 10 06:59:38 we have no clue what pulseaudio-nokia-voice will do if it cant find /dev/cmt_speech or if it cant properly talk to it Oct 10 07:00:23 we ave, this is what was happening before we had SSI driver running :) Oct 10 07:02:52 ok, what happens? Oct 10 07:03:09 it just spits some errors in syslog Oct 10 07:03:31 you can test it easily Oct 10 07:03:46 ok Oct 10 07:03:59 just "stop pulseaudio;rmmod cmt_speech;start pulseaudio" Oct 10 07:06:22 A wonderful good Pungenday Morning (UGT) to You all! Oct 10 07:53:20 http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=1372710#post1372710 FPTF mantra Oct 10 07:54:10 btw how would the situation on Neo900 differ form a N900 with broken cmt? Oct 10 07:54:27 afaik you can still use such phone to do SIP calls Oct 10 08:26:03 DocScrutinizer05, can i disable the rotating deamon in cssu ; it bugs too much for me Oct 10 08:32:21 ~jrtools Oct 10 08:32:22 from memory, jrtools is http://wiki.maemo.org/User:Joerg_rw/tools Oct 10 08:32:40 some gconf keys Oct 10 08:33:06 gui-may-rotate=no or sth like that Oct 10 08:34:14 beware! touching the rotation-lock systray/menu button will revert that, so you need to set those keys again Oct 10 08:34:55 thus I made me a 2liner bash script Oct 10 08:36:04 IroN900:~# cat `which no-portrait-gconfkey` Oct 10 08:36:06 #!/bin/sh Oct 10 08:36:07 gconftool-2 -s /apps/osso/hildon-desktop/ui_can_rotate -t bool false Oct 10 08:36:47 hi all Oct 10 08:36:49 I want to reflesh n900 Oct 10 08:36:51 I have u-boot installed Oct 10 08:36:53 When I poweron and press u it go directly to u-boot, any idea please? Oct 10 08:37:16 your battery isn't charged Oct 10 08:39:39 when battery charged, and holding 'u' then plugging to charger, it must stay on NOKIA screen with usb symbol upper right. If it doesn't, your battery is not fully charged, or your charger or USB is broken Oct 10 08:39:51 I see Oct 10 08:39:57 ok, thankyou Oct 10 08:40:01 yw Oct 10 08:40:03 I am charging it now Oct 10 08:42:07 or the 'u' key ;-P Oct 10 08:42:51 or you're the one who just developed a new NOLO bootloader Oct 10 08:44:16 if I connect usb cable and make boot with u key , it can work ? Oct 10 08:44:29 or I will need to full charge battery first Oct 10 08:45:27 first charge your battery Oct 10 08:45:39 ok Oct 10 08:45:41 thankyou Oct 10 08:45:56 I have played with niroaid Oct 10 08:45:59 unless your charging is broken, in which case you got a problem Oct 10 08:46:32 ok Oct 10 08:46:35 Thank You Oct 10 09:03:24 DocScrutinizer05, ok thanks Oct 10 09:05:22 ihave a bug with freemantle that i aleady had inthe past but it seems more oftensince i switched to cssu; randomlyafter somehours of usingthe phone, i can not "click" any buttn/wifdget onthe desktop Oct 10 09:05:41 i need to launch the start menu and launch application or reboot th ephone Oct 10 09:05:58 (sorry backspace broken on netbook) Oct 10 09:06:41 i have a bug with freemantle that i aleady had in the past but it seems more often since i switched to cssu; randomly after some hours of using the phone, i can not "click" any button/widget on the desktop Oct 10 09:35:06 When My charger is connected, I can't boot n900? Oct 10 09:37:10 thedead1440: "such BS"(talk report) ... you have to live with dumb people and doc replied properly, it's not like spamming the thread with posts Oct 10 09:40:42 thedead1440: want moderation rights in Maemo5? Oct 10 09:57:35 DrCode, if you ran out of battery it might not boot through until it has been charged enough, I usually let it charge for a few minutes, disconnect charger, turn it on until I see the code entry keypad and then plug it back Oct 10 11:05:38 kolp: an admin team is asigned, community representatives need to be voted on - councils BoDs etc - and the active userbase is >100 so yes {(Currently Active Talk Users: 676 (69 members and 607 guests)} Oct 10 11:18:17 hmmm, what to reverse engineer next... Oct 10 11:19:59 I wonder whether there be any copyright issues? Oct 10 11:20:09 copyright issues with what? Oct 10 11:20:17 jonwil: You could build a GPS-Driver for NITDroid. *duck&run* Oct 10 11:20:35 I refuse to touch the abomination that is NITDroid Oct 10 11:20:49 and I have already given up messing with the GPS for now, its too complex :P Oct 10 11:21:23 ;-0 Oct 10 11:22:10 using nokia casing Oct 10 11:22:39 I am totally misunderstanding i think Oct 10 11:23:04 I think Nokia doesn't care so much unless you are producing devices that claim to be Nokia devices but which arent Oct 10 11:23:11 i.e. trademark violation Oct 10 11:24:56 jonwil: How about that plugin that shows the wifi icon in the status bar (connui-*?)? Oct 10 11:25:20 It'd be great to have a wifi strength indicator there, like in the menu if you tap the sttausbar Oct 10 11:25:47 Already tried that one before, couldn't get anywhere with some of the stuff in libconnui that it was using Oct 10 11:26:03 chem|st: Yes, I know about the admin team, council, BoD. I was just wondering if the council was still needed. Oct 10 11:26:09 jonwil: Hm, too bad Oct 10 11:26:40 needed and/or necessary Oct 10 11:30:07 jonwil: What about that lib that's responsible for corrupting the events database? (rtcom-*) Oct 10 11:30:56 rtcom-eventlogger is already foss Oct 10 11:31:00 http://repository.maemo.org/pool/maemo5.0/free/r/rtcom-eventlogger/ Oct 10 11:31:35 Oh Oct 10 11:33:14 Has anyone attempted to fix that bug? Oct 10 11:35:16 no idea Oct 10 11:36:23 kolp: true Oct 10 11:40:33 Given that there is (1) no voting infrastructure, (2) (so far) no one running for council, it might be worthwile to consider liquidating the council in a controlled way before it collapses Oct 10 11:41:18 (3) questionable need (IMHO) Oct 10 11:43:01 jonwil: rtcom-accounts-ui? :) Oct 10 11:43:36 Hm, probaly it's already possible to clone that Oct 10 11:43:44 Based on telepathy Oct 10 11:45:01 nope, might take another look at connui-statusbar-internet (widget for data status) Oct 10 11:47:43 What I wouldn't give for the chance to pick the brain of some Nokia pulseaudio people and find out just what things like mudrc, stw and some of these other strange terms actually mean Oct 10 11:48:05 but thats never going to happen so maybe I should give up on PulseAudio for good Oct 10 11:51:50 * jonwil looks at connui-statusbar-internet Oct 10 11:52:07 * jonwil sees all the undocumented libconnui calls Oct 10 11:52:18 * jonwil remembers why he gave up on trying to figure that mess out Oct 10 12:04:44 All of the interesting/useful bits of the N900 system are too hard to reverse engineer :( Oct 10 12:11:31 heh Oct 10 12:11:37 like conversations? Oct 10 12:12:26 remember when nokia was trumpeting the "open community" when that was en vogue? Oct 10 12:16:57 I actually miss conversations Oct 10 12:17:16 I don't miss its slowness though Oct 10 12:18:00 ...n900 with arch? possible? Oct 10 12:18:26 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DCk1iu2Aa60 uhm... Oct 10 13:14:19 MohammadAG: slowness? compared to what, apple phone? Oct 10 15:05:26 freemangordon, just about anything really Oct 10 15:05:48 using browserd instead of a native list was a sloppy mess Oct 10 15:06:03 reminds me of Samsung Oct 10 16:19:24 Any recommendation for a n900 charger? Oct 10 16:19:43 the nokia one Oct 10 16:19:47 and that's about it Oct 10 16:19:55 i use a nexus 4 one fine Oct 10 16:20:22 k Oct 10 16:20:25 AC10 (what cerio said) Oct 10 16:20:31 *kerio Oct 10 16:20:54 aah thats what its called Oct 10 16:27:26 isn't the n800 one ac4? Oct 10 16:28:56 n800 or n900? ac4 doesn't sem to have micro usb Oct 10 16:29:17 I don't replace my n900 Oct 10 16:29:24 I even bout two now Oct 10 16:29:42 two new bare phone Oct 10 20:10:39