**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Tue Nov 05 02:59:58 2013
Nov 05 08:36:42 <vi__> yo
Nov 05 08:50:16 <vi__> what is the design process of the neon900?
Nov 05 08:50:52 <vi__> I understand it is the GTA04 board, re-shaped to fit an n900 casing.
Nov 05 08:51:07 <vi__> Who is doing the re-shaping?
Nov 05 08:51:28 <vi__> What format are the schematics in?
Nov 05 08:56:12 <jon_y> neon900
Nov 05 08:56:21 <jon_y> didn't think it changed titles :)
Nov 05 08:59:00 <Aggese> vi__, http://neo900.org/
Nov 05 09:20:22 <vi__> I found the feasibility study.
Nov 05 09:20:28 <vi__> That is what I wanted to read.
Nov 05 09:27:39 <Wizzup> wow, the n900 donation made it
Nov 05 09:27:49 * Wizzup is still planning to donate soonish
Nov 05 09:42:27 <l4m3rx> yep, the neo900 project seems to be starting up quite nicely ;]
Nov 05 09:42:42 <anYc> interesting, css works on talk.maemo.org but not on www.maemo.org
Nov 05 09:45:27 <l4m3rx> in microb?
Nov 05 09:46:05 <l4m3rx> it seems to work normaly for me... just tested it.
Nov 05 09:57:11 <ShadowJK> css on www is on port 81
Nov 05 10:04:52 <anYc> couldn't WMO refer to the css of TMO? I'm behind a firewall here
Nov 05 10:44:03 <DrCode> hi all
Nov 05 10:44:09 <DrCode> when I my n900 connect to car bluetooth , my volume get mute
Nov 05 10:44:24 <DrCode> any idea?
Nov 05 10:52:35 <vi__> kerio: yo
Nov 05 10:52:48 <kerio> sup
Nov 05 10:52:57 <vi__> whats new with n900?
Nov 05 10:53:02 <vi__> I have been away.
Nov 05 10:53:03 <kerio> idk
Nov 05 10:53:07 <kerio> mine has a broken wifi
Nov 05 10:53:20 <vi__> okily dokily then.
Nov 05 10:53:24 <kerio> apart for that... idk
Nov 05 10:53:27 <vi__> How did you break the wifi?
Nov 05 10:53:28 <kerio> the neo900 project
Nov 05 10:53:31 <kerio> i have no idea
Nov 05 10:54:06 <vi__> time to pick up an n900 with a fooked screen on fleabay for $10.
Nov 05 10:54:20 <kerio> i already have two n900
Nov 05 10:54:38 <kerio> one has a broken musb, the other has a broken wifi
Nov 05 10:54:42 <vi__> only 2?
Nov 05 10:54:50 <kerio> "only"
Nov 05 10:54:56 <vi__> I have ~4 working.
Nov 05 10:54:57 <kerio> do you think i'm made of money dude
Nov 05 10:54:58 <vi__> XD
Nov 05 10:55:48 <vi__> :-!actually, maybe only 3 since the great CMT failure of 201.
Nov 05 10:56:01 <vi__> actually, maybe only 3 since the great CMT failure of 2013.
Nov 05 11:25:07 <ShadowJK> migrating to fifth n900, cmt fail
Nov 05 11:34:29 <kolp> I just started using the 4th (or 5th??) a few weeks ago because of that :/
Nov 05 11:34:38 <kolp> Running out of spares...
Nov 05 11:39:25 <ShadowJK> i have no more spares
Nov 05 11:51:26 <l4m3rx> huh
Nov 05 11:51:55 <l4m3rx> i'm still on my first ... 
Nov 05 12:15:35 <DocScrutinizer05> I'm actually on my first two still, though I admit wouldn't notice when t900 (devel device) cmt fails - no SIM
Nov 05 12:16:45 <DocScrutinizer05> I start to wonder if cmt failure maybe is an EM problem similar to OC burnout but on the BB5 TX
Nov 05 12:17:35 <DocScrutinizer05> IOW the cmt breaks after a certain amount of call-hours*TXpower^3 got used up, pa
Nov 05 12:17:49 <DocScrutinizer05> -, pa
Nov 05 12:18:46 <DocScrutinizer05> ShadowJK: are you living in an area with poor GSM signal? are you using GPRS a lot or doing many long phonecalls?
Nov 05 12:19:40 <DocScrutinizer05> I goddamn wish Nokia would disclose the results of their internal failure analysis regarding that cmt breakage
Nov 05 13:33:39 <DocScrutinizer05> ** RECOVERY Service Alert: www.maemo.org/Disk is OK **
Nov 05 13:44:28 <DocScrutinizer05> ~seen thedead1440
Nov 05 13:44:32 <infobot> thedead1440 is currently on #maemo (16d 16h 24m 34s) #n9 (16d 16h 24m 34s) #harmattan (16d 16h 24m 34s) #meego (16d 16h 24m 34s) #maemo-ssu (16d 16h 24m 34s), last said: 'hehe'.
Nov 05 13:47:19 <DocScrutinizer05> http://xkcd.com/1286/
Nov 05 14:03:06 <DocScrutinizer05> http://www.reddit.com/r/linux/comments/1pvefs/openphoenux_neo900_25k_funded_in_less_than_a_week/
Nov 05 14:03:54 <Tekk_> congrats DocScrutinizer05!
Nov 05 14:04:08 <DocScrutinizer05> >>I know that. I was just saying that you can't say people don't trust Canonical. If they had set their goal at 12 million they would have 480 times more money.<<  Answer: with a community ~10000 times larger, driven by a company definitely 10^9 times larger
Nov 05 14:04:47 <Tekk_> DocScrutinizer05: you have a company for phoenux? :P
Nov 05 14:05:18 <DocScrutinizer05> >>OpenPhoenux Neo900: 25k€ funded in less than a week! Donations are still open and qualify for a rebate on a finished device.<< Answer: but they asked for 200+ donations of >100EUR and have only reached ~80 so far
Nov 05 14:05:45 <DocScrutinizer05> Tekk_: GolDeliCo of course is a company
Nov 05 14:05:50 <Tekk_> h
Nov 05 14:06:20 <DocScrutinizer05> @all: if anybody can get bothered to answer - much appreciated. I don't have neither want an account on reddit
Nov 05 14:06:21 <Tekk_> oh, any hope for a gecko update in the future or too ram heavy?
Nov 05 14:06:49 <Tekk_> oh! probably a problem of gtkmozembed right?
Nov 05 14:06:58 <DocScrutinizer05> eh?
Nov 05 14:07:22 <Tekk_> doesn't web use some ancient gecko?
Nov 05 14:07:34 <DocScrutinizer05> what is "web" ?
Nov 05 14:07:42 <Tekk_> default browser
Nov 05 14:08:00 <Tekk_> as opposed to the gnome browser of the same name
Nov 05 14:08:56 <Tekk_> google sites complain about support for my browser being dropped soon and some sites flat out don't work unless I use midori
Nov 05 14:10:38 <vi__> DocScrutinizer05: reddit requires no authentication on account creation.  Just choose a username and password.  No emails involved.
Nov 05 14:10:52 <DocScrutinizer05> ooh
Nov 05 14:12:19 <vi__> so get in there and educate those gnuobs
Nov 05 14:14:26 <Tekk_> oh, any suggestions for good games in the repos? I'm waiting to board a several hour flight
Nov 05 14:14:59 <DocScrutinizer05> FUCKYOUREDDIT! I blocked all cookies of that site since they were annoying and a bazillion. Now it doesn't let me log in
Nov 05 14:15:45 <Tekk_> how else do you expect them to know you're logged in? http is connectionless
Nov 05 14:16:48 <vi__> Tekk_: emulators
Nov 05 14:17:13 <vi__> The majority of n900 games suck asses.
Nov 05 14:17:22 <Tekk_> vi__ already have them. I was wondering if there was native good stuff
Nov 05 14:17:22 <vi__> with the exception of nethack.
Nov 05 14:17:38 <vi__> You know nethack...right?
Nov 05 14:17:38 <Tekk_> nethack has problematic stairs :P
Nov 05 14:17:45 <Tekk_> sil seems okay too
Nov 05 14:17:46 <vi__> ?
Nov 05 14:18:20 <vi__> unfortunatley my game gripper weared the tops off some of my keys :(
Nov 05 14:18:22 <Tekk_> you need angle braces to go down stairs unless you remap
Nov 05 14:18:29 <vi__> aah.
Nov 05 14:18:40 <Tekk_> which aren't on the default keyboard
Nov 05 14:18:44 <vi__> I have run a 'fuller' keyboard for about 2 yeas.
Nov 05 14:18:48 <vi__> ^years.
Nov 05 14:18:52 <Tekk_> ah
Nov 05 14:19:15 <vi__> I have < > on shift+blue+v/b
Nov 05 14:19:24 <Tekk_> I've been trying to figure one out but the very limited key space is annoying
Nov 05 14:19:34 <vi__> what language are you using?
Nov 05 14:19:41 <Tekk_> us english
Nov 05 14:19:52 <vi__> ~vi_kbd
Nov 05 14:19:59 <vi__> ~search vi
Nov 05 14:20:01 <Tekk_> hm, blue+shift may be helpful
Nov 05 14:20:13 <vi__> ffs, how do you search irc thingies again?
Nov 05 14:20:47 <Tekk_> bot may just be broken
Nov 05 14:21:05 <vi__> ~botsnack
Nov 05 14:21:05 <infobot> :), vi__
Nov 05 14:21:09 <vi__> nope
Nov 05 14:21:20 <Tekk_> you have curlies in your map too? being able to do some perl would be nice
Nov 05 14:21:27 <kolp> ~listkeys vi
Nov 05 14:21:29 <infobot> Factoid search of 'vi' by key (12 of 1075): aravind ;; baldvin ;; bizarre 1999 invitation intro ;; devilish ;; emulate otravi ;; giving each other wedgies after gym class. this ;; gservices ;; hitachi vibrator ;; jargon elvish ;; list bakemono with travis's foot up his ass, where ;; mixview ;; productivity.
Nov 05 14:22:03 <vi__> ~listkeys vik
Nov 05 14:22:05 <infobot> Factoid search of 'vik' by key (14 of 25): bondevik ;; vikas ;; weathercode reykjavik ;; weathercode makkovik ;; weathercode nanisivik ;; craft: the viscious vikings ;; weathercode kjevik ;; weathercode narvik ;; vikram ;; weathercode inuvik ;; weathercode ornskoldsvik ;; weathercode aklavik ;; viking ;; weathercode ivvavik park.
Nov 05 14:22:16 <vi__> ~listkeys vi_
Nov 05 14:22:18 <infobot> Factoid search of 'vi_' by key returned no results.
Nov 05 14:22:23 <vi__> ~listkeys vi__
Nov 05 14:22:24 <infobot> Factoid search of 'vi__' by key returned no results.
Nov 05 14:22:29 <vi__> ~listkeys vi___
Nov 05 14:22:31 <infobot> Factoid search of 'vi___' by key returned no results.
Nov 05 14:22:38 <vi__> they have all been delted!
Nov 05 14:23:00 <vi__> Tekk_: http://wiki.maemo.org/Remapping_keyboard/user_vis_awesome_kbdmapping
Nov 05 14:23:18 <Tekk_> thanks
Nov 05 14:23:44 <Tekk_> oh vi__, nspeed is okay as far as native games
Nov 05 14:23:53 <Tekk_> very reminiscent of f zero
Nov 05 14:24:12 <vi__> The truth is I rarely have time for games anymore.
Nov 05 14:24:19 <vi__> or the paience.
Nov 05 14:24:26 <vi__> patience,
Nov 05 14:26:27 <vi__> tekk: make sure your keymap is working before you reboot
Nov 05 14:26:39 <vi__> otherwise you may end up with a non-booting device.
Nov 05 14:27:35 <Tekk_> now to try to remember how to copy in the browser
Nov 05 14:27:47 <vi__> ctrl+c
Nov 05 14:28:43 <Tekk_> well it's more a selection problem than a copy one
Nov 05 14:29:33 <Tekk_> xkb allow /* */ comments? that's probably easier than doing all //
Nov 05 14:30:43 <vi__> I have no idea
Nov 05 14:31:08 <vi__> xkb is an un-documented mix of magic and hate for humanity.
Nov 05 14:31:55 <Tekk_> at least it fits with the rest of X then
Nov 05 14:39:24 <Tekk_> it'd be nice if setxkbmap gave some sort of help in  errors..
Nov 05 14:42:47 <vi__> You have an error?
Nov 05 14:43:58 <Tekk_> mhm
Nov 05 14:46:41 <Tekk_> oh
Nov 05 14:46:57 <Tekk_> yeah, just need to figure out again how to select...
Nov 05 14:47:22 <vi__> how to select?
Nov 05 14:47:44 <Tekk_> select text in the browser
Nov 05 14:47:50 <vi__> please tell me you are doing this via ssh on a real computer with a real keyboard...
Nov 05 14:48:23 <vi__> to select text in browser swipe from the bottom left of the screen to the top right to make the pointer appear.
Nov 05 14:48:27 <Tekk_> nope. don't have access to one of those atm
Nov 05 14:48:33 <vi__> press the pointer button.
Nov 05 14:48:38 <vi__> select text.
Nov 05 15:08:02 <Tekk_> thanks vi__, works
Nov 05 15:08:12 <Tekk_> forgot a curlie then had to board
Nov 05 15:09:03 <vi__> it is liberating to have a 'fuller' keyboard.
Nov 05 15:10:43 <vi__> as liberating as an open air dump.
Nov 05 15:40:34 <zamn900> hi all... how to lock with terminal command?
Nov 05 15:40:42 <zamn900> lock the screen
Nov 05 15:42:28 <anYc> I don't know either, but in the wiki, there was a list of usefull commands
Nov 05 15:42:42 <anYc> useful
Nov 05 15:42:50 <Sicelo> quickest way to to install 'phone-control' package.. otherwise you can use dbus directly
Nov 05 15:47:59 <zamn900> here we re 
Nov 05 15:48:01 <zamn900> dbus-send --system --type=method_call --dest=com.nokia.mce /com/nokia/mce/request com.nokia.mce.request.req_tklock_mode_change string:"locked"
Nov 05 15:51:52 <Sicelo> if you like it that way, lol
Nov 05 15:54:55 <SAiF> anybody got the flash 12 packages. ?
Nov 05 15:58:13 <Sicelo> 12? for Maemo? i'm sure that's not more than a wish
Nov 05 15:58:31 <SAiF> I meant that faking packages.
Nov 05 16:03:10 <SAiF> well its really adobe-flashplayer-10.deb  binaries. and we fake it to flash 12. The links dont seem to work. Does anybody got it?
Nov 05 16:48:00 <DocScrutinizer05> ~listkeys vis_awesome_kbdmapping
Nov 05 16:48:02 <infobot> Factoid search of 'vis_awesome_kbdmapping' by key returned no results.
Nov 05 16:48:41 <SAiF> Doc,
Nov 05 16:48:41 <DocScrutinizer05> ~listvalues vis_awesome_kbdmapping
Nov 05 16:48:43 <infobot> Factoid search of 'vis_awesome_kbdmapping' by value returned no results.
Nov 05 16:48:50 <DocScrutinizer05> ~listvalues http://wiki.maemo.org/Remapping_keyboard/user_vis_awesome_kbdmapping
Nov 05 16:48:52 <infobot> Factoid search of 'http://wiki.maemo.org/Remapping_keyboard/user_vis_awesome_kbdmapping' by value returned no results.
Nov 05 16:49:09 <DocScrutinizer05> ~listauthor vi_
Nov 05 16:49:31 <sixwheeledbeast> ~keyremap
Nov 05 16:49:31 <infobot> from memory, keyremap is http://wiki.maemo.org/Remapping_keyboard
Nov 05 16:49:38 <DocScrutinizer05> ~listauth vi_
Nov 05 16:49:38 <infobot> factoid author list by 'vi_' returned no results.
Nov 05 16:49:41 <sixwheeledbeast> bottom of page :)
Nov 05 16:49:44 <DocScrutinizer05> ~listauth vi__
Nov 05 16:49:44 <infobot> factoid author list by 'vi__' returned no results.
Nov 05 16:49:53 <DocScrutinizer05> ~listauth vi___
Nov 05 16:49:53 <infobot> factoid author list by 'vi___' returned no results.
Nov 05 16:50:02 <DocScrutinizer05> ~listauth vi
Nov 05 16:50:02 <infobot> factoid author list by 'vi' returned no results.
Nov 05 16:50:07 <SAiF> lol
Nov 05 16:50:25 <DocScrutinizer05> ~factinfo keyremap
Nov 05 16:50:29 <infobot> keyremap -- created by MohammadAG51 <~MohammadA@78.46.226.25> at Thu Jul  1 20:22:51 2010 (1222 days); it has been requested 4 times, last by sixwheeledbeast, 57s ago.
Nov 05 16:50:44 <DocScrutinizer05> meh
Nov 05 16:50:52 <DocScrutinizer05> that's not vi_ related
Nov 05 16:51:15 <sixwheeledbeast> the bottom of the wiki page is the link to vi's
Nov 05 16:51:32 <DocScrutinizer05> sure, but I know there been a factoid
Nov 05 16:52:03 <sixwheeledbeast> k, sorry. IIRC you did that last time and give up
Nov 05 16:52:32 <DocScrutinizer05> yes, since it's impossible to search for vi
Nov 05 16:53:06 <SAiF> Doc took a 3hr break in 1 hr, right Doc?
Nov 05 16:53:25 <DocScrutinizer05> ~#maemo awesome-keymap is http://wiki.maemo.org/Remapping_keyboard/user_vis_awesome_kbdmapping
Nov 05 16:53:26 <infobot> DocScrutinizer05: okay
Nov 05 16:53:40 <DocScrutinizer05> SAiF: my clock works different
Nov 05 16:53:59 <DocScrutinizer05> but i'm afk again now
Nov 05 16:54:12 <SAiF> Good
Nov 05 16:54:20 <sixwheeledbeast> ~listauth vi*
Nov 05 16:54:20 <infobot> factoid author list by 'vi*' (18 of 42): /.config usually ;; 1024? what ;; alt+printscreen+ub ;; carrot ;; could u aswear this one: what ;; d21 d21 ;; docscrutinizer05 ;; fact apt ;; frankyfourfinger ;; ftppassive ;; garoeda ;; gh0sty gh0sty ;; googlesyncevolution ;; helldeskgriep ;; keri0 ;; lugwv_050304 ;; np nvidia ;; p3lim.
Nov 05 16:54:39 <sixwheeledbeast> factinfo keri0
Nov 05 16:54:49 <sixwheeledbeast> ~factinfo keri0
Nov 05 16:54:49 <infobot> error: you do not have enough flags for that. (o required)
Nov 05 16:54:50 <infobot> keri0 -- created by vi__ <~user@146.90.189.50> at Tue Aug  7 21:22:32 2012 (454 days).
Nov 05 16:56:01 <DocScrutinizer05> ~forget /.config usually
Nov 05 16:56:02 <infobot> DocScrutinizer05: i forgot /.config usually
Nov 05 16:56:17 <DocScrutinizer05> ~forget 1024? what
Nov 05 16:56:18 <infobot> i forgot 1024? what, DocScrutinizer05
Nov 05 16:57:07 <DocScrutinizer05> ~literal docscrutinizer05
Nov 05 16:57:07 <infobot> "docscrutinizer05" is "<reply>see DocScrutinizer"
Nov 05 16:57:18 <DocScrutinizer05> ~factinfo docscrutinizer05
Nov 05 16:57:19 <infobot> docscrutinizer05 -- created by vi__ <5860d978@gateway/web/freenode/ip.88.96.217.120> at Fri Jul 27 09:02:56 2012 (466 days); last modified at Fri Jul 27 09:03:55 2012 by DocScrutinizer05!~HaleBopp@openmoko/engineers/joerg; it has been requested 6 times, last by SAiF at Tue Aug 13 10:41:09 2013; it has been locked by DocScrutinizer05.
Nov 05 16:57:30 <DocScrutinizer05> o.O
Nov 05 16:57:33 <Gh0sty> wtf? 
Nov 05 16:57:37 <sixwheeledbeast> :)
Nov 05 16:57:39 <Gh0sty> why does infobot highlight me? 
Nov 05 16:58:03 <SAiF> me too?
Nov 05 16:58:05 <sixwheeledbeast> factinfo gh0sty gh0sty
Nov 05 16:58:16 <sixwheeledbeast> ~factinfo gh0sty gh0sty
Nov 05 16:58:17 <infobot> error: you do not have enough flags for that. (o required)
Nov 05 16:58:17 <infobot> gh0sty gh0sty -- created by vipe <n=vipe@lugwv/member/vipe> at Fri Nov  4 14:48:59 2005 (2923 days); it has been requested 2 times, last by pcj at Fri Nov 21 10:46:58 2008.
Nov 05 16:58:20 <Gh0sty> and what does that mean? 
Nov 05 16:58:31 <Gh0sty> ooh
Nov 05 16:58:39 <Gh0sty> this is that old silly generic bot thing 
Nov 05 16:58:49 <Gh0sty> thats a long time ago :P
Nov 05 16:59:00 <sixwheeledbeast> you have a factiod in your name
Nov 05 16:59:05 <Gh0sty> rikerbot or something isnt it ? 
Nov 05 16:59:11 <sixwheeledbeast> :nod:
Nov 05 16:59:30 <Gh0sty> lol 3000 days ago
Nov 05 16:59:31 <Gh0sty> damn 
Nov 05 16:59:36 <Gh0sty> am i that long on irc! 
Nov 05 17:00:59 <sixwheeledbeast> factoid last used 2008 :)
Nov 05 17:01:45 <Gh0sty> created 2005 
Nov 05 17:01:47 <Gh0sty> :o
Nov 05 17:05:20 <SAiF> going home
Nov 05 20:47:43 <sixwheeledbeast> M4rtinK: I have noticed that in full screen mode there is no quit button on modRana?
Nov 05 20:48:13 <sixwheeledbeast> It that correct or is it hiding?
Nov 05 21:03:04 <M4rtinK> sixwheeledbeast: yep, that is correct
Nov 05 21:03:47 <M4rtinK> sixwheeledbeast: you can always either unfullscreen or just close it from the task switcher
Nov 05 21:04:16 <M4rtinK> sixwheeledbeast: IMHO most apps behave like this in Fullscreen in Fremantle
Nov 05 21:04:47 <sixwheeledbeast> ok, seems I was looking for it "how do I quit". Thought it would be easy to add a button to menu?
Nov 05 21:05:07 <M4rtinK> well, it already has a quit button on some platforms :)
Nov 05 21:06:35 <M4rtinK> where there is no close button in decoration
Nov 05 21:06:48 <M4rtinK> IIRC Android chroot for example
Nov 05 21:06:48 <sixwheeledbeast> Possibly because I am used to SMM10 having a quit button.
Nov 05 21:07:28 <M4rtinK> sure, it might not be a bad idea to add it
Nov 05 21:07:55 <M4rtinK> it basically means just setting needsQuitButton to True in the N900 device module
Nov 05 21:08:43 <M4rtinK> and there are even two spots free in the main menu
Nov 05 21:09:07 <sixwheeledbeast> mmm, so did you leave it out of N900 for a reason?
Nov 05 21:10:33 <M4rtinK> didn't occur to me it might be needed :)
Nov 05 21:11:02 <M4rtinK> BTW, might be party because I'm using the camera button as to activate task switcher
Nov 05 21:11:26 <M4rtinK> also some users are using the power button menu and just kill apps
Nov 05 21:11:38 <sixwheeledbeast> Ok, maybe it's just me but I expected it to be there. taskswitcher is a pain to get to in car holder
Nov 05 21:11:45 <M4rtinK> but yeah, having it in the main menu should be faster
Nov 05 21:11:49 <M4rtinK> good point
Nov 05 21:12:03 <sixwheeledbeast> I use camera button as skip track
Nov 05 21:12:16 <M4rtinK> yeah, for car it should be a good improvement
Nov 05 21:12:59 <M4rtinK> btw, there should be "are you sure" screen after clicking the in app quit button
Nov 05 21:13:23 <sixwheeledbeast> come to think of it music controls would be handy in modrana :)
Nov 05 21:13:26 <M4rtinK> so that it won't quite due to misclick
Nov 05 21:13:51 <sixwheeledbeast> i don't see "are you sure" on quit here.
Nov 05 21:14:05 <M4rtinK> well, I mean for the main menu button
Nov 05 21:14:24 <sixwheeledbeast> I see
Nov 05 21:14:45 <M4rtinK> or at least I added that when adding the quit button
Nov 05 21:15:56 <M4rtinK> would be unfortunate if instead of getting to the track logging menu modRana would quit :)
Nov 05 21:15:56 <M4rtinK> regarding music control
Nov 05 21:16:07 <M4rtinK> there is indeed a lot that could be improved
Nov 05 21:16:21 <M4rtinK> like adding hooks before/after espeak is speaking
Nov 05 21:16:25 <M4rtinK> so people can hook scripts for pausing music
Nov 05 21:16:40 <M4rtinK> and maybe even support pausing the default media player
Nov 05 21:16:58 <M4rtinK> regarding control
Nov 05 21:16:59 <sixwheeledbeast> :nod: pause and skip would be handy
Nov 05 21:17:13 <M4rtinK> modRana has a very rudimentary widget system
Nov 05 21:17:20 <M4rtinK> that could be improved a lot
Nov 05 21:17:26 <M4rtinK> including playback control
Nov 05 21:18:21 <M4rtinK> it is on my todo list, but unfortunately there is also a lot of other stuff :)
Nov 05 21:18:35 <M4rtinK> I think I last worked on the widgets back in 2010 for example
Nov 05 21:18:55 <M4rtinK> so any help in this matter would be appreciated :)
Nov 05 21:19:45 <sixwheeledbeast> I have voice guidance off TBH. I understand your TODO list is large.
Nov 05 21:20:47 <M4rtinK> BTW, the widgets live here: https://github.com/M4rtinK/modrana/blob/master/modules/mod_showOSD.py
Nov 05 21:21:15 <M4rtinK> as you can see, it is very very simple & not that efficient :)
Nov 05 21:21:48 <sixwheeledbeast> I suddenly seem to be having trouble with downloading tiles 
Nov 05 21:21:58 <M4rtinK> oh, BTW, I've pushed the latest modRana to Extras-testing: http://maemo.org/packages/package_instance/view/fremantle_extras-testing_free_armel/modrana/0.43.4/
Nov 05 21:22:22 <M4rtinK> 2 tester votes remaining before the Extras package can be updated ! :)
Nov 05 21:22:27 <M4rtinK> which layer ?
Nov 05 21:23:45 <sixwheeledbeast> all of them OSM Mapnik
Nov 05 21:26:19 <sixwheeledbeast> just "Loading..." on every tile...mmm
Nov 05 21:26:37 <M4rtinK> seems to work fine here
Nov 05 21:27:20 <M4rtinK> check options->network->network usage
Nov 05 21:27:26 <M4rtinK> if it is set to "unlimited"
Nov 05 21:27:51 <M4rtinK> otherwise it won't automatically download files
Nov 05 21:28:53 <sixwheeledbeast> "mapTiles: tile data returned by remote tileserver was not an image"
Nov 05 21:29:41 <sixwheeledbeast> Yep, Unlimited and I am on WiFi
Nov 05 21:31:31 <M4rtinK> this looks like the tileserver does not like you :)
Nov 05 21:31:36 <sono> modrana is?
Nov 05 21:31:49 * sono clicks
Nov 05 21:32:16 <M4rtinK> sono: the modRana flexible GPS navigation system :)
Nov 05 21:32:27 <sono> looks interesting
Nov 05 21:32:57 <M4rtinK> sixwheeledbeast: the server is probably returning a html error page instead of a tile
Nov 05 21:33:34 <sono> woa. apparently i did not have the python deps yet. this ill have to wait until i get home.
Nov 05 21:33:39 <sixwheeledbeast> where are tiles stored?
Nov 05 21:33:54 <M4rtinK> MyDocs/maps
Nov 05 21:33:56 <M4rtinK> by default
Nov 05 21:34:10 <sono> as a cyclist tho it looks interesting
Nov 05 21:34:27 <M4rtinK> hmm
Nov 05 21:34:29 <M4rtinK> wrong
Nov 05 21:34:34 <M4rtinK> MyDocs/.maps
Nov 05 21:34:56 <M4rtinK> sono: looking forward to your feedback :)
Nov 05 21:35:36 <M4rtinK> sono: BTW, modRana support bike-optimized offline navigation :)
Nov 05 21:37:16 <sono> =)
Nov 05 21:40:39 <M4rtinK> sixwheeledbeast: you can checkout what the server is actually sending you
Nov 05 21:40:51 * sixwheeledbeast has NFC why it's not showing tiles
Nov 05 21:40:54 <sixwheeledbeast> how?
Nov 05 21:41:14 <M4rtinK> sixwheeledbeast: by enabling "Tile loading status to terminal" in options->Debug->Tiles
Nov 05 21:41:52 <M4rtinK> it will start printing stuff like this:
Nov 05 21:41:53 <M4rtinK> loading tile mapnik_13_4540_2797
Nov 05 21:41:56 <sixwheeledbeast> that's were I got the message quoted above
Nov 05 21:42:45 <M4rtinK> this corresponds to this URL
Nov 05 21:42:46 <M4rtinK> http://b.tile.openstreetmap.org/13/4540/2797.png
Nov 05 21:43:23 <M4rtinK> (I really have to make it print the URL in the future for easier debugging)
Nov 05 21:44:05 <M4rtinK> you can try in browser or with wget
Nov 05 21:44:12 <M4rtinK> and inspect what are aou getting
Nov 05 21:44:20 <M4rtinK> *you
Nov 05 21:47:09 <sixwheeledbeast> ah
Nov 05 21:48:35 <sixwheeledbeast> tiles
Nov 05 21:48:41 <sixwheeledbeast> mmm
Nov 05 21:49:13 <sixwheeledbeast> M4rtinK: what does Map overlay settings do?
Nov 05 21:51:05 <M4rtinK> you can have two layer at once
Nov 05 21:51:06 <M4rtinK> *layers
Nov 05 21:51:12 <M4rtinK> if you set a layer that is not working over a working one with 100% opacity... :)
Nov 05 21:51:28 <M4rtinK> hmm, looks like a usability issue :)
Nov 05 21:52:01 <sixwheeledbeast> Ok so I had no tiles with OSM mapnik as main and none as background. 
Nov 05 21:53:38 <M4rtinK> hmm, so that is not the issue I guess
Nov 05 21:54:01 <M4rtinK> btw, I think "none" might be a bit problematic sometimes
Nov 05 21:54:24 <M4rtinK> BTW, the QML GUI can overlay more than two layers
Nov 05 21:54:36 <M4rtinK> but can't remeber them just yet :D
Nov 05 21:54:42 <M4rtinK> *remember
Nov 05 21:55:05 <sixwheeledbeast> it's "map as overlay" setting with off I have tiles with on I have "Loading..."
Nov 05 21:56:04 <M4rtinK> I'll check it out
Nov 05 21:56:51 <M4rtinK> oh, right
Nov 05 21:57:10 <M4rtinK> definitely a bug
Nov 05 21:57:34 <M4rtinK> now when I think about it, it combines the two tiles and caches the result
Nov 05 21:57:46 <M4rtinK> to optimize cache usage
Nov 05 21:58:16 <M4rtinK> well, if one of the layers has no tiles, it can't combine them and waits forever :)
Nov 05 21:58:21 <sixwheeledbeast> ah that's it. with "map as overlay" on and "none" as secondary map. I can reproduce it.
Nov 05 21:58:27 <M4rtinK> well loads
Nov 05 21:58:34 <M4rtinK> yep
Nov 05 21:58:43 <M4rtinK> if you use two normal layers, it seems to work fine
Nov 05 21:59:06 <sixwheeledbeast> :) I now have OSM and VE OS as secondary 
Nov 05 22:01:07 <M4rtinK> sixwheeledbeast: thanks for finding the issue :)
Nov 05 22:01:20 <M4rtinK> I've added it to the issue tracker (https://github.com/M4rtinK/modrana/issues?state=open)
Nov 05 22:01:35 <M4rtinK> hopefully should be an easy fix
Nov 05 22:01:47 <sixwheeledbeast> np, I thought I was doing something wrong 
Nov 05 22:04:35 <M4rtinK> BTW, for what I'm currently working on:
Nov 05 22:05:33 <M4rtinK> * Qt 5 GUI based on PyOtherSide (the asynchronous Python-Qt interface from thp )
Nov 05 22:05:54 <M4rtinK> * finally getting the Monav routing data repository back in order
Nov 05 22:06:12 <M4rtinK> + the usual assorted stuff :)
Nov 05 22:09:06 <sixwheeledbeast> :) cool
Nov 05 22:09:55 <nox-> M4rtinK++
Nov 05 22:09:58 <nox-> :)
Nov 05 22:12:30 <M4rtinK> nox-: thanks :)
Nov 05 22:13:25 <nox-> would be cool to see monav working again :)
Nov 05 22:15:50 <M4rtinK> Monav the app ?
Nov 05 22:15:53 <M4rtinK> or the Monav routing support in modRana ?
Nov 05 22:16:32 <nox-> i saw the app fail, routing db incompatible or so
Nov 05 22:16:52 <nox-> is it better in modrana?
Nov 05 22:17:55 <M4rtinK> as long as you have working data packs, it should work fine in modRana
Nov 05 22:18:49 <M4rtinK> those are a bit outdated, but should work fine: http://monav.openstreetmap.de/
Nov 05 22:19:07 <M4rtinK> these might be a bit corrupted at the moment: http://www.modrana.org/data/monav/
Nov 05 22:19:24 <M4rtinK> and there is a guide how to use them: http://wiki.maemo.org/ModRana_offline_routing_guide
Nov 05 22:21:24 <nox-> thx, might try that later
Nov 05 22:28:50 <sixwheeledbeast> Does it still not support address to address routing?
Nov 05 22:48:38 <M4rtinK> sixwheeledbeast: online does, offline (Monav routing) is point to point only
Nov 05 22:49:08 <M4rtinK> sixwheeledbeast: Monav actually can work with addresses and has its own optimized address storage format
Nov 05 22:49:59 <sixwheeledbeast> but modRana can't?
Nov 05 22:50:06 <M4rtinK> http://code.google.com/p/monav/wiki/UnicodeTournamentTrie
Nov 05 22:50:33 <M4rtinK> yep
Nov 05 22:50:33 <M4rtinK> the Monav routing server modRana is using
Nov 05 22:50:46 <M4rtinK> (using localhost sockets and PBFs by the way)
Nov 05 22:51:26 <M4rtinK> only accepts geographic coordinates for start and destination
Nov 05 22:51:51 <M4rtinK> and there is no Python compatible interface to the file format
Nov 05 22:52:16 <M4rtinK> it is documented, so it would be possible to make a python parser for it
Nov 05 22:52:25 <M4rtinK> but it will be quite a lot of work
Nov 05 22:52:44 <M4rtinK> (for the format)
Nov 05 22:53:10 <M4rtinK> or not, not sure as I haven't done something like this yet
Nov 05 22:53:38 <M4rtinK> so doable, but quite time intensive :)
Nov 05 22:55:23 <sixwheeledbeast> mmm, I see. So where does the online routing data come from?
Nov 05 22:58:19 <M4rtinK> modRana uses the Google Map API for online routing
Nov 05 22:58:22 <M4rtinK> at the moment
Nov 05 22:58:45 <M4rtinK> that can work with both coordinates & addresses
Nov 05 23:00:51 <M4rtinK> and theoretically if you are online
Nov 05 23:01:08 <M4rtinK> you can use address search (which uses the Nominatim geocoding API)
Nov 05 23:01:41 <M4rtinK> to to manually find the start and destination and then start point-to-point offline routing with Monav :)
Nov 05 23:03:35 <sixwheeledbeast> So you are at home on WiFi and search for destination then leave with no data scenario
Nov 05 23:15:17 <M4rtinK> yeah, basically
Nov 06 00:15:17 <Win7Mac> http://neo900.org/#donate looks great today! very promising development, congrats!
Nov 06 00:18:27 <DocScrutinizer05> thanks, been a bit of work to get there, even the simplest changes need careful thinking and discussions, and of course coding and review
Nov 06 00:19:16 <DocScrutinizer05> but yeah, now it looks like it's supposed to, once again
Nov 06 00:19:36 <Win7Mac> thought so, awesome job, respect!
Nov 06 00:19:47 <sono> wb doc
Nov 06 00:19:52 * sono finally gets around to installing modrana
Nov 06 00:19:58 <DocScrutinizer05> most of it is dos1's awesome work
Nov 06 00:21:19 <DocScrutinizer05> maybe what's missing: "we won't produce for the shelf, we build to order"
Nov 06 00:21:55 <sono> yea, i keep mentioning that in addition
Nov 06 00:22:17 <DocScrutinizer05> actually odds are we won't have any devices to sell to those who didn't donate >=100EUR
Nov 06 00:22:44 <sono> plan is to keep donating during the project until i "bought" one
Nov 06 00:22:59 <sono> i suppose others think alike
Nov 06 00:23:12 <sono> it does make sense
Nov 06 00:23:27 <Win7Mac> i think a lot of people would opt for board only
Nov 06 00:23:33 <DocScrutinizer05> thought that complicates our statistics, it's much appreciated nevertheless
Nov 06 00:24:57 <sono> it also makes it much easier for me to pay, and results in a steady cash flow
Nov 06 00:25:10 <DocScrutinizer05> if 100 people donate 7 times 100 EUR, we might end up with 700 N900 we bought to recover spare parts from them, and no money left to build the 100 boards
Nov 06 00:25:46 <sono> mhm
Nov 06 00:26:26 <DocScrutinizer05> so make sure you always mention the previous order-confirmation number in your donation, so Nikolaus can concatenate them into one "order"
Nov 06 00:26:45 <sono> right!
Nov 06 00:27:02 <sono> i wouldn't have done that
Nov 06 00:27:11 <sono> thanks for the notice
Nov 06 00:27:54 <DocScrutinizer05> right now our progress bar shows donations, not unique donors, and it doesn't check at all for the amount of the donations (>=100?)
Nov 06 00:28:49 <DocScrutinizer05> of course when your donations are <100 per donation, then our book-keeping gets much simpler, since those don't count as a new device to produce
Nov 06 00:29:06 <sono> nod
Nov 06 00:29:49 <Win7Mac> is there an end date set to the fundraising period yet?
Nov 06 00:30:28 <DocScrutinizer05> we don't really plan to ever end the fundraiser (well we might when the last device got produced)
Nov 06 00:32:06 <DocScrutinizer05> some day in the future we will announce "OK, tomorrow we open real preorder page: in two weeks we start to produce a device for everybody who preordered" and you can claim your rebates on that preorder page for two weeks
Nov 06 00:32:43 <DocScrutinizer05> after that, it's a new world
Nov 06 00:33:25 <Win7Mac> sounds great
Nov 06 00:36:28 <Win7Mac> let me know if HiFo can do anything for neo900 (or anything else)
Nov 06 00:38:11 <DocScrutinizer05> well, I think apart from spreading the word, there's little HiFo could do
Nov 06 00:38:35 <DocScrutinizer05> thanks nevertheless :-)
Nov 06 00:40:30 <Win7Mac> i spread among those few linux-interested guys i know, but i'm not using any social netorks...
Nov 06 00:40:39 <Win7Mac> *the word
Nov 06 01:06:19 <Win7Mac> latest change to http://neo900.org/#donate looks even better! it's focussed on number of devices (boards, actually), which is more important than amount of money
Nov 06 01:06:56 <Win7Mac> 2 bars for both would be perfect ;)
Nov 06 01:59:42 <qwerty123>  solution to that getting frozen device is optimizen900. Idk why, but it works ( for last two time ).DocScrutinizer05: 
Nov 06 02:02:44 <qwerty123> Have put optimizen900 on home screen and whenever the phone goes into that state, simply click on optimizen900. It works.
Nov 06 02:03:09 <mashina_> figure out the cause and a prevention
Nov 06 02:06:41 <qwerty123> If i could recreate the problem at will, i would have figured out the answer. Atleast for now, i know one of theprocesses in the optimizen900 script causes the problem, else its restarting wouldnot have been the solution. 
Nov 06 02:06:46 <qwerty123> mashina_: 
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