**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Wed Jan 22 02:59:59 2014
Jan 22 03:00:00 <DocScrutinizer05> iirc those made it to extras
Jan 22 03:01:42 <DocScrutinizer05> tsting and QA never really worked as intended, but everything else works even worse
Jan 22 03:03:07 <DocScrutinizer05> for HARM Nokia replaced that by absolutism via store and Nokia based commercial QA, and paegis
Jan 22 03:17:18 <DocScrutinizer05> ~batterypatch
Jan 22 03:17:18 <infobot> speedpatch is, like, http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=1012405#post1012405 >>first i don't realy understand what does this patch do (that is why it is called miracle patch)<< [/quote original-author-of-speedpatch]
Jan 22 09:04:52 <zGrr> moin :)
Jan 22 10:08:43 <Maxdamantus> --2014-01-22 23:07:40--  http://scratchbox.org/download/files/sbox-releases/branches/hathor/r1/deb/i386/scratchbox-core-1.0.26-i386.tar.gz
Jan 22 10:08:48 <Maxdamantus> Everything seems to be outdated :(
Jan 22 10:09:04 <Maxdamantus> Those last two hyphens are apparently meant to be underscores.
Jan 22 10:11:44 <Maxdamantus> Wait, the tarballs have hyphens, the debs have underscores .. it chose the wrong directory.
Jan 22 12:16:43 <Ori_553> anyone else suddenly experiencing "you do not have status updates" in the facebook widget in maemo 5 ?
Jan 22 14:30:52 <SAiF> how do you control a service?  start stop restart.. etc.. what commands to use.  where can I get good docs abt maemo and busybox?
Jan 22 14:31:47 <Ashley`> I am not sure, but, take a look at /etc/init.d/
Jan 22 14:32:06 <Ashley`> (# /etc/init.d/initscript_name command)
Jan 22 14:32:55 <Ashley`> (for example, /etc/init.d/ssh restart)
Jan 22 14:37:26 <SAiF> thats good,  but another thing.. where else could a daemon go, I couldnt find the intended one in init.d/
Jan 22 14:40:14 <merlin1991> even.d
Jan 22 14:40:18 <merlin1991> it's upstart
Jan 22 14:40:28 <merlin1991> so you could read some ubuntu docs about that :D
Jan 22 14:40:37 <ShadowJK> event.d
Jan 22 14:44:56 <SAiF> thanks again.. and anywhere else..?
Jan 22 14:44:58 <SAiF> :)
Jan 22 14:45:18 <SAiF> I should probably be using ubuntu docs.. :)
Jan 22 15:50:31 <sixwheeledbeast> upstart cookbook
Jan 22 15:50:57 <SAiF> huh?
Jan 22 15:52:44 <sixwheeledbeast> as for *patch. many of the votes where from noobs that didn't use the QA system properly. Thankfully that is partly resolved now, after bringing this to CC attn.
Jan 22 15:53:44 <sixwheeledbeast> I can only see the above being stopped by blocking QA until x Karma is reached on garage profile.
Jan 22 15:54:23 <sixwheeledbeast> SAiF: http://upstart.ubuntu.com/cookbook/
Jan 22 15:56:11 <SAiF> Thanks a lot sixwheeledbeast 
Jan 22 15:56:24 <sixwheeledbeast> np
Jan 22 16:00:19 <infobot> DocScrutinizer: infobot joined!
Jan 22 16:31:26 <sixwheeledbeast> somehow amazingly yappari has 7 votes in less than 12 hours, three of the votes are <10 karma. This is not facebook or youtube thumbs up you are suppose to test the application. Not saying there is anything wrong with yappari I have never used it TBH.
Jan 22 16:35:01 <DocScrutinizer05> see what I mean?
Jan 22 16:36:14 <DocScrutinizer05> not only "test" but actually VERIFY, by running a set of pretty clearly defined tests against it
Jan 22 16:36:41 <DocScrutinizer05> I bet none of those testers even checked if it's properly optified
Jan 22 16:37:25 <DocScrutinizer05> nor if it uninstalls cleanly, or if it hogs CPU or has other similar problems
Jan 22 16:39:40 <sixwheeledbeast>  exactly, but this is fanboy votes like for *patch, hence my suggestion.
Jan 22 16:40:08 <sixwheeledbeast> it only happens on a very small amount of pkgs
Jan 22 16:41:44 <sixwheeledbeast> It only a small update I believe, but this is no excuse.
Jan 22 16:57:24 <hbib1> even if it is/may be against the rules and may result in lower package quality i think there is nothing wrong with having some important packages for daily usage in the repos more basing on users opinion/need than on their actual technical quality :)
Jan 22 16:59:00 <hbib1> and by the non-technical user-vote it is at least ensured that these programs work regarding their promised features ...
Jan 22 17:06:45 <SAiF> thats true.. yappari works fine for me.. and its the only choice i have got I think.
Jan 22 17:12:39 <sixwheeledbeast> lowering package quality is a big no IMO. If it's a small important update, maintainer could ask CC to push an update in some cases. 
Jan 22 17:13:55 <sixwheeledbeast> You don't have to be "technical" to QA and package test. There is a guide on what to do. More experienced people will do better testing but to vote you MUST have done the QA checklist.
Jan 22 17:14:26 <sixwheeledbeast> WFM isn't package testing either
Jan 22 17:16:17 <sixwheeledbeast> http://wiki.maemo.org/Help_testing_software http://wiki.maemo.org/Extras-testing/QA_checklist
Jan 22 17:18:18 <sixwheeledbeast> also how do you rate important? yappari isn't important for me, but that's IMO. important are system updates provided by CSSU.
Jan 22 19:24:24 <hbib1> freemangordon: you are totaly right, but i think the problem is that meamo hasn't the power to go only for (high) quality but has to accept instead any works ensuring the it's usability for daily "smartphone-work"
Jan 22 19:25:34 <freemangordon> hbib1: sorry, could you rephrase, I am not sure I parse ^^^ on 100%
Jan 22 19:25:37 <hbib1> and yes, for me whatsapp/yappari is an imprtant program, because sadly many people use ist and without it I couldn't keep using my n900 (and even order a neo900) as daily, main and only phone
Jan 22 19:26:12 <hbib1> freemangordon: i think the problem is that maemo hasn't enough developpers :)
Jan 22 19:26:23 <freemangordon> oh, tell me about it :)
Jan 22 19:28:34 <hbib1> or, to be more precisive, not in the topic of "modern" smartphone software regarding all that stuff like whatsapp/instagramm/kik/twitter/whatever, which is sadly need to hold contact with non "technical" people
Jan 22 19:32:23 <hbib1> *precise
Jan 22 19:59:08 <FIQ> is there a good reason for why maemo.org has 4 different account dbs?
Jan 22 19:59:19 <FIQ> there's garage, bugzilla, wiki, tmo
Jan 22 19:59:40 <FIQ> wouldn't it be easier to just... have 1
Jan 22 20:04:48 <trx> that would be nice
Jan 22 20:06:00 <bef0rd> I know why tmo is differnt, tmo used to be a different site, not owned by maemo.org
Jan 22 20:46:50 <Ashley`> hm... is decoders-support package broken?
Jan 22 21:01:47 <DocScrutinizer05> hbib1: maemo QA will not turn into a sympathy contest. The purpose of QA and etras-testing is to ensure no defective or rogue application enters maemo-extras repo. When you want an app in mameo-extras then you will have to go the way of developing, testing, QA, like every other packet had to do so far
Jan 22 21:02:29 <DocScrutinizer05> when you can't find your preferred app in maemo-extras, well then it isn't in extras. You need to find it elsewhere (e.g. in extras-devel)
Jan 22 21:02:59 <DocScrutinizer05> we will not poison maemo-extras repo by moving apps from extras-devel to extras without proper QA
Jan 22 21:05:32 <DocScrutinizer05> FIQ: actually maemo.org only has 2 account db: talk.maemo.org and garage.maemo.org. everything else is based on that afaik. I.E. all your "accounts" except tmo should be handled by garage
Jan 22 21:07:11 <DocScrutinizer05> if that's not correct, then nemein and community volunteers failed to implement/finalize the SSO that been planned in 2012
Jan 22 21:10:28 <FIQ> well I had to create a new account for bugzilla
Jan 22 21:11:02 <DocScrutinizer05> hmm, that is probably since bugzilla using your email-add as login-name
Jan 22 21:11:16 <FIQ> speaking of this
Jan 22 21:11:18 <DocScrutinizer05> for obvious reasons
Jan 22 21:11:42 <DocScrutinizer05> anyway, you're free and welcome to improve all that infra
Jan 22 21:11:53 <DocScrutinizer05> techstaff has no manpower for that
Jan 22 22:44:08 <DocScrutinizer05> loosely related (to maemo): http://www.jakoblell.com/blog/2013/12/22/practical-malleability-attack-against-cbc-encrypted-luks-partitions/
Jan 22 22:50:37 <sixwheeledbeast> I believe FIQ is correct. garage, bugzilla, wiki, tmo are separate accounts because they all run on different things.
Jan 22 23:07:38 <DocScrutinizer05> yes, maybe x-fade stopped the SSO project/effort
Jan 22 23:08:36 <DocScrutinizer05> anyway it would be a major PITA to add it while running. How to handle all the existing accounts?
Jan 22 23:09:12 <DocScrutinizer05> same username, differnet passwords? UGH!
Jan 22 23:09:22 <DocScrutinizer05> different* even
Jan 22 23:16:07 <sixwheeledbeast> I don't disagree
Jan 22 23:37:34 <r00t|eeepc> install libc update via apt-get => time for re-flashing...
Jan 22 23:56:41 <Maxdamantus> Hmm .. so the N900 apparently has a magnet mechanism to detect whether the back cover is on, to determine availability of the SD card.
Jan 22 23:57:09 <Maxdamantus> does that mean if you have the SD card mounted, the block device will disappear when you open the cover?
Jan 22 23:57:23 <Maxdamantus> (resulting in IO errors or something)
Jan 22 23:58:49 <Maxdamantus> or is it software-controlled, so the OS normally reacts to the signal by unmounting the filesystem?
Jan 23 00:00:30 <Maxdamantus> actually, the block device wouldn't disappear if it's mounted .. it would just result in IO errors, if the mechanism isn't software-controlled.
Jan 23 00:00:31 <r00t|eeepc> it's not magnetic i think, but a light reflection thing, shared with the lens cover?
Jan 23 00:00:48 <r00t|eeepc> and, it triggers a script that umounts the card
Jan 23 00:01:01 <r00t|eeepc> just as is done when you connect as usb-storage
Jan 23 00:02:20 <Maxdamantus> Okay, so you can presumably just remove that functionality if you didn't want to use the SD card as something you'd normally remove at will.
Jan 23 00:03:21 <r00t|eeepc> actually what would be the point of a non software-controlled mechanism that disconnects the card when the cover is open? might aswell just wait for the user to disconnect the card by pulling it out
Jan 23 00:05:56 <Maxdamantus> Dunno. Maybe if the slot were fiddly and it were likely that the card would be powered off and on rapidly while being inserted.
Jan 23 00:06:24 <Maxdamantus> but even in that case, there are probably better ways to handle it.
Jan 23 00:08:00 <Maxdamantus> also: http://forum.dailymobile.net/index.php?topic=20949.0
Jan 23 00:08:06 <Maxdamantus> seems to be a magnet.
Jan 23 00:45:16 <int_ua> http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=1408340&postcount=1087
Jan 23 00:45:34 <int_ua> PLEASE HELP! My life could depend on it
Jan 23 01:35:26 <DocScrutinizer05> rmmod adp1653  -- watch out, may break camera!
Jan 23 01:35:48 <Maxdamantus> Though he left.
Jan 23 01:36:01 <DocScrutinizer05> use carton and chewing gum, or black sticky tape! cover the LED "lens" window
Jan 23 01:36:17 <DocScrutinizer05> yes, but he might check chanlog
Jan 23 01:36:48 <DocScrutinizer05> I guess it's a bit of trouble to stay online all the time while in a civil war
Jan 23 01:37:29 <DocScrutinizer05> Kiev might become the new Tien nan men square
Jan 23 01:37:34 <DocScrutinizer05> this night
Jan 23 01:38:19 <Maxdamantus> tbh, in that situation, I'd probably just shortcircuit the LED with solder.
Jan 23 01:38:28 <DocScrutinizer05> aaahyes
Jan 23 01:38:32 <DocScrutinizer05> with solder
Jan 23 01:38:47 <Maxdamantus> though I don't know how difficult that is; I don't have a device yet.
Jan 23 01:39:31 <DocScrutinizer05> it's for sure too difficult to do it in the street, while everybody trowing rocks and stones and smash stuff around you
Jan 23 01:40:05 <DocScrutinizer05> I just hope he'll survive
Jan 23 01:40:26 <Maxdamantus> in that case, I'd at least remove the module from the filesystem and reboot.
Jan 23 01:40:29 <DocScrutinizer05> and the revolution will survive and conquer
Jan 23 01:40:44 <DocScrutinizer05> rmmod might break camera
Jan 23 01:40:59 <Maxdamantus> permanently?
Jan 23 01:41:01 <DocScrutinizer05> I had no time to check
Jan 23 01:41:23 <DocScrutinizer05> no, but at least for two boots, plus editing
Jan 23 01:41:26 <Maxdamantus> or just lose access to it, because it's also the actual camera driver
Jan 23 01:41:59 <Maxdamantus> ah, not the camera driver, but might control the camera in some way.
Jan 23 01:42:16 <DocScrutinizer05> the cam-ui app or v4l2 might blow chunks when flashlight not available in /sys or /dev
Jan 23 01:44:30 * DocScrutinizer05 moves over to TV, check NTV and CNN etc
Jan 23 01:51:42 <DocScrutinizer05> :-S zilch
Jan 23 01:52:50 <DocScrutinizer05> http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/world/ukraine-police-storm-kiev-protester-barricades-killing-5/story-e6frg6so-1226808228511
Jan 23 02:18:09 <DocScrutinizer05> http://rt.com/news/kiev-protest-clashes-updates-862/  hmm
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Thu Jan 23 02:59:58 2014