**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Thu Aug 06 02:59:58 2015 Aug 06 03:07:05 When I try to 'apt-get install ffmpeg' it complains that the following dependencies are not installable: libavcodec52, libavcodec-extra-52, libavdevice52, libavdevice-extra-52, libavfilter0, libavfilter-extra-0, libavformat52, libavformat-extra-52. Aug 06 03:09:51 Some of these look like they are present in 'libav-mini', but when I try to install it it says 'libav-mini' doesn't exist. The package is in the extras repository though. Aug 06 03:15:20 This isn't the first time that I have tried to install something and there are missing dependencies. When I check, they are in the repository according to the repository.maemo.org webinterface. Aug 06 03:17:14 ShadowJK: (lardman) GC would be Generalantilles, no? Aug 06 03:46:40 Hmm, I think my repositories are messed up but I'm not sure what is wrong. Aug 06 06:16:57 ZetaR: which repository are they supposed to be in ? Aug 06 11:51:46 i know this is not right chan, but just for fun. Ps4 or Xbox one and why? Aug 06 11:51:54 pc Aug 06 11:52:39 and why? graphics quality, price, games prices, upgradeability, usability, moddability Aug 06 11:52:42 need more? Aug 06 11:53:33 but that wasn't an option ;) Aug 06 11:53:44 but it is the answer ;) Aug 06 11:54:32 hehee Aug 06 11:54:38 not to mention if you wanted to play older games.. Aug 06 11:54:40 ;) Aug 06 11:54:54 or emulated ones Aug 06 11:54:57 oh yes Aug 06 11:55:16 i have ps3 and so far all old games have worked Aug 06 11:55:30 but they look not so pleasant Aug 06 13:01:17 Vajb: depends, as for DRM I would suggest the ps4 is better Aug 06 13:01:27 but xbox one has pretty decent games and ecosystem Aug 06 13:01:36 oh if you get a ps4 Aug 06 13:01:44 there's a game called n++, do recommend Aug 06 13:01:52 the 1001 deaths of you Aug 06 13:03:16 drm? As protected mp3 or such? Aug 06 13:03:28 As in you are owned by the device, you don't own the device Aug 06 13:03:31 as in game sharing with friends Aug 06 13:03:44 which again brings pc on the top Aug 06 13:03:46 yes i think i heard of it Aug 06 13:03:55 no more loaning games for friends Aug 06 13:04:14 so ps4 doesn't have that? Aug 06 13:04:27 they made few ads just for bragging about that Aug 06 13:04:56 which is weird twist, because its a sony Aug 06 13:05:34 simple hit where it hurts idea Aug 06 13:05:52 no problem if you dont have friends to share with Aug 06 13:05:53 :) Aug 06 13:05:59 hahah Aug 06 13:06:34 or play with... Seems like one console two player games are disappearing as well Aug 06 13:06:40 but im pretty happy with steam sharing, works great for kid control Aug 06 13:08:21 cool Aug 06 13:08:42 I wouldn't know since I don't have kids :) Aug 06 21:33:23 Vajb: PS4 but yes it is OT... ;) Aug 06 23:04:22 for some reason, a lot of software isn't installing on my n900, and from the logs, it seems like it has to do with python. why? Aug 06 23:04:41 What is the error message? Aug 06 23:07:01 pastebin it, if it is too long? Aug 06 23:08:39 it's a lot and really confusing, but seems like it stems from python. I'm trying to save it but for some reason it won't let me access my files and save it other than in root Aug 06 23:09:41 I had my usb cable connected, oops Aug 06 23:10:08 Be careful with mass storage mode, especially in case of Windows computer... Aug 06 23:10:48 don't worry, no windows here. Aug 06 23:12:12 [2015-08-04 Tue 08:34:53] I just ran an apt-get dist-upgrade on my N900 and it literally purged everything and killed itself Aug 06 23:12:58 shh, that was yesterday, I've reflashed since then. Aug 06 23:12:59 http://pastebin.com/m7aZErZL Aug 06 23:13:43 >>> Emerging (2 of 5) media-libs/qimageblitz-0.0.6-r1::gentoo Aug 06 23:18:54 any chance anybody knows what to do here? could it be a repo issue? Aug 06 23:51:47 pymaemo-optify had an error during installation, so all other python packages depending on it complain that pymaemo-optify is not configured yet. | I do have fmms installed, so it should be solvable... Aug 06 23:58:34 I have pymaemo-optify 0.5, just like you. But my fmms is 1.3.6-1, not 1.3.3. Also, what is starhash-enabler?.. | Is it possible that you run out of space in /opt directory? Aug 07 00:02:14 starhash-enabler allows you to make calls while using the star (*) and hash (#), such as *67 (which allows you to make a call without showing your phone number). I may have run out of room, but I highly doubt it. I'll check, though. is that not reset when it's flashed? Aug 07 00:04:10 I also had an error while attempting to install starhash-enabler, but I don't think it was related. Aug 07 00:04:19 I was missing a dependency, I believe Aug 07 00:04:57 also, /opt is 41% full. Aug 07 00:06:06 Okay, then it's weird that rm /opt/pymaemo/something had input/output error Aug 07 00:06:37 * Oksana tries to install starhash-enabler Aug 07 00:06:42 could it be because it still has the data from a previous install? Aug 07 00:08:17 Maybe, something is corrupted? Remove contents of /opt/pymaemo/ and try to install fmms again? Aug 07 00:10:31 recharged: Input/Output errors are solved by fscking? If you have to, fsck multiple times? Aug 07 00:12:47 does ls not work properly in xterm? and it seems like fsck isn't installed Aug 07 00:13:10 ls works, should work at least. Aug 07 00:14:01 I forgot to run fsck as root Aug 07 00:14:14 but ls only works in root, too Aug 07 00:14:15 weird Aug 07 00:16:01 ls should work not only as root. Either you reflashed with something weird, or you installed something strange, or there is lots of filesystem corruption? Aug 07 00:17:05 So, you have fsck? Do you know how to use it? /opt partition should be relatively small, fsck-ing it should not take hours Aug 07 00:18:04 relatively, as in, compared to MyDocs Aug 07 00:18:10 probably some sort of corruption. the only things I've installed have been rootsh, starhash-enabler and fmms. Aug 07 00:18:20 I do know how to use it, somewhat. Aug 07 00:24:33 rootsh is very common, fmms is common, starhash-enabler is not as common but nevertheless there are no reports of it creating filesystem corruption. What kind of error did you have while installing starhash-enabler? I installed it just now, without errors. Aug 07 00:28:09 I don't think it has anything to do with starhash-enabler, I've previously installed it without any errors. I believe the same problem followed me from a previous flash, I just flashed this device a few minutes ago and it's doing the same thing, not allowing me to install fmms (and a few other different software, such as advanced-power-applet). I figured I had just messed something up and decided to reflash the device, to see if I Aug 07 00:28:09 could install the software I was having trouble with. Aug 07 00:31:26 So, is it a problem of hardware, or of corrupted image you are flashing with? Aug 07 00:32:17 I think it likely has to do with my emmc. Aug 07 00:34:19 eMMC is MyDocs partition, if I recall correctly? Feel free to reflash everything including emmc, if you have to. Also, checking MD5sums or something could help to make sure that images you are using are not corrupted. Aug 07 00:34:50 * Oksana hasn't flashed for a very long time... Aug 07 00:35:38 that's right. I would if 0xFFFF supported it. I'll check the md5sum, but I don't think that's the problem. Aug 07 00:37:23 Do you need N900's flasher-3.5 ? Aug 07 00:39:40 I have it, I just can't get it to work due to dependencies not available in debian sid (they're too outdated). Aug 07 00:41:37 Ouch... If I have flasher-3.5, it's likely self-contained executable for Windows. Can you run flasher-3.5 from within a virtual machine of whatever debian version it requires? Aug 07 00:43:35 probably, yeah. I could try it, I suppose. I just don't know which version has the libraries that I need. Aug 07 00:45:00 do you think if I made a bug report for it nokia would even care? would they finally release the source code? Aug 07 00:46:05 Unlikely. Besides, it's probably part of the Nokia Mobile division which was bought by Microsoft. Aug 07 00:46:40 that's what I was thinking, which is sad. Aug 07 00:47:15 also, according to the docs, libusb (one of the two libraries I need) is packaged with the windows executable. Aug 07 00:51:14 libusb is needed only for Windows and Mac, not for Linux: http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo_5_Developer_Guide/Development_Environment/Maemo_Flasher-3.5 | http://mirrors.muarf.org/maemo/tablets-dev/maemo_dev_env_downloads/ Aug 07 01:01:30 it's needed, it's just that libusb is preconfigured in the kernel. and I use a bleeding-edge kernel, therefore libusb is a newer version than what's required for flasher-3.5. Aug 07 01:17:52 If you want to avoid struggling with debian dependencies, try .tar.gz file with flasher-3.5 , then the only obstacle remaining will be actual incompatibility with new software. Aug 07 01:18:11 Or, you could use virtual machine with older kernel? /not sure/ Aug 07 01:22:43 I might do the virtual machine option, but maybe later. I wonder if I could get nokia on using the libusb software without specifying their changes to it? it's LGPL. they only offer you a download to the source code of the original libusb, yet package libusb with the windows executable. Aug 07 01:23:05 then, they would have to release the source code of flasher-3.5, right? Aug 07 01:30:42 * Oksana does not know exactly how licences work... Aug 07 01:31:47 how do you know that their windows executable is modified? Aug 07 01:32:09 I don't. that's the point. Aug 07 01:33:27 they didn't release the corresponding source code so there's no way I could know. and due to the fact that libusb is dual-licensed as GPL and LGPL, I could claim that they used the GPL libusb and they would then have to release the source code of flasher-3.5. Aug 07 01:33:51 ah, that Aug 07 01:34:21 you could compile yours for windows, and compare the md5sum or assembly Aug 07 01:35:45 I don't have a windows computer to test that on so somebody else would have to do that. Aug 07 01:36:18 and, how could I compare it if libusb is packaged with flasher-3.5? Aug 07 01:38:25 if it's a .dll, then maybe; if it's within the same file then harder Aug 07 01:43:18 nevermind, I just found their source code for libusb. Aug 07 01:43:29 hah! and it's not lgpl then? Aug 07 01:44:09 it's LGPL, they just released the source via download. Aug 07 01:44:49 http://pc-connectivity.garage.maemo.org/upstream/libusb-win32-src-0.1.12.1.tar.gz Aug 07 01:45:57 The GNU Lesser General Public License (LGPL) is a free software license published by the Free Software Foundation (FSF). The license allows developers and companies to use and integrate software released under the LGPL into their own (even proprietary) software without being required by the terms of a strong copyleft license to release the source code of their own components. Aug 07 01:46:05 no probs, they don't have to release the flasher though Aug 07 01:46:38 yeah, which is a really dumb license from the fsf, if you ask me. Aug 07 01:47:45 Well, that's why Apache OpenOffice's source code can be used in LibreOffice, but not in the opposite direction. Aug 07 01:48:17 what do you mean? Aug 07 01:48:18 they've been adding some better "recently"... GPLv3 does not have this issue if memory serves Aug 07 01:48:46 it doesn't, LGPL is just a bad license imo. Aug 07 01:49:05 http://www.gnu.org/licenses/license-list.html#LGPL is their official statement on it Aug 07 01:49:46 Using the ordinary GPL is not advantageous for every library. There are reasons that can make it better to use the Lesser GPL in certain cases. The most common case is when a free library's features are readily available for proprietary software through other alternative libraries. In that case, the library cannot give free software any particular advantage, so it is better to use the Lesser GPL for that library. Aug 07 01:49:58 This is why we used the Lesser GPL for the GNU C library. After all, there are plenty of other C libraries; using the GPL for ours would have driven proprietary software developers to use another—no problem for them, only for us. Aug 07 01:49:59 . Aug 07 01:51:19 Unfortunately can't comment on libusb. Do not know how 'unique' and worth clinging to it is, how much competition it has. :) Aug 07 01:51:39 LibreOffice can borrow code freely from OpenOffice, OpenOffice cannot borrow at all from LibreOffice. http://www.datamation.com/applications/apache-openoffice-vs.-libreoffice-2.html Aug 07 01:55:53 I get the point of LGPL, I just think it was a bad idea on the fsf's part. if someone is going to make proprietary software, let them use a proprietary library/compiler. I don't care about proprietary software, to hell with it. Aug 07 01:56:13 but I didn't know that about openoffice and libreoffice. Aug 07 02:02:45 No, you're missing the point. The point is that LGPL is to be used to get your free software into places which it would otherwise not be Aug 07 02:02:51 The compiler is just an example. Aug 07 02:03:17 Because the wider spread the (open source) software is, the better. Aug 07 02:04:51 but if it's used in conjunction with proprietary software, then what would it matter? it's still proprietary. while if libusb was exclusively GPL, then flasher-3.5 would have to be free. Aug 07 02:05:29 The point though is that it /wouldn't/ be free. Nokia would have just used something other than libusb(a competitor) Aug 07 02:06:27 is there a non-free alternative to libusb? Aug 07 02:06:48 I'm sure there is... Windows sure has one. Aug 07 02:07:09 The other option is that Nokia just uses the Windows usb libraries, and doesn't produce a Linux flasher version. Aug 07 02:08:20 I guess there's that. Aug 07 02:10:01 if GCC was exclusively GPL, would that mean that every software compiled with it would have to be free? Aug 07 02:10:51 Possibly... which would mean that instead of using GCC, you might use ICC. Aug 07 02:11:29 oh geez Aug 07 02:12:13 The point is that the license was chosen, and then people decide or not to use it based on that Aug 07 02:12:22 There's no retroactive changing Aug 07 02:14:26 that's true. Aug 07 02:19:29 no, GCC is a tool. The products you produce with a tool are not licensed by the tool's license Aug 07 02:20:02 at least not under GPL license Aug 07 02:20:23 this might differ for any libs you use Aug 07 02:21:28 but the binary produced by a compiler is no derivative work Aug 07 02:22:20 What about the C standard libs? Aug 07 02:22:26 etc? Aug 07 02:24:48 [2015-08-07 Fri 04:20:23] this might differ for any libs you use Aug 07 02:26:34 that's why libs often are under LGPL Aug 07 02:28:02 actually LGPL wouldn't make any sense when the compiler you need to use to use the libs was inheriting its GPL to the binaries it builds Aug 07 02:28:21 oh wow, I just reread what svetlana copy-pasta'd earlier. the gnu c library is LGPL, I thought it said compiler. Aug 07 02:28:27 the compiler is GPL. Aug 07 02:37:36 That makes sense Aug 07 02:38:48 the only thing that doesn't make sense to me is how to compile GCC if it's written in C++ Aug 07 02:40:27 recharged: I honestly doubt you can't get the right working 32bit libusb for flasher-3.5 Aug 07 02:41:15 heck, it works on distros as young as 1 year (haven't checked newer one yet) Aug 07 02:42:50 it's not like usually they'd break backward compatibility for newer builds of a library. If they do, they are mandated to change the lib name too. e.g. from libfoo to libfoo2 Aug 07 02:43:41 plus you could even install different versions of a lib in parallel Aug 07 02:44:22 it is under a different name. libusb-0.1-4, while flasher-3.5 requires libusb-0.1 Aug 07 02:44:48 no, the name is libusb-0 in that case Aug 07 02:45:02 ? Aug 07 02:45:47 http://www.tldp.org/HOWTO/Program-Library-HOWTO/shared-libraries.html Aug 07 02:46:45 then I don't know why it doesn't work, but it doesn't. Aug 07 02:49:03 this is what it prints when I try to run it: ./flasher-3.5: error while loading shared libraries: libusb-0.1.so.4: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory Aug 07 02:49:14 ~xy Aug 07 02:49:14 xy is probably The XY problem: You want to do X, but don't know how. You think you can solve it using Y, but don't know how to do that, either. You ask about Y, which is a strange thing to want to do. Just ask about X. http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html#goal Aug 07 02:50:15 are you telling me to describe what actions I took to get to that error? Aug 07 02:50:27 this error means there's no libusb-0.1.so.4 in your library path Aug 07 02:50:43 exactly what I've been saying Aug 07 02:51:21 it's not available in debian sid. Aug 07 02:52:57 http://privatepaste.com/3fcd8bc604 Aug 07 02:55:17 http://privatepaste.com/36fb340f2f Aug 07 02:56:32 I'm not sure what to do with this data. **** ENDING LOGGING AT Fri Aug 07 02:59:58 2015