**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Fri Aug 07 02:59:58 2015 Aug 07 03:00:02 Symlink your version of libusb-0.1.so to libusb-0.1.so.4 and see what happens Aug 07 03:00:06 It may or may not work. Aug 07 03:01:22 my /usr/lib/libusb-0.1.so.4 is a symlink pointing to libusb-0.1.so.4.4.4 Aug 07 03:01:36 and I have 32 and 64bit libs of same name Aug 07 03:01:57 most likely you didn't install the lib correctly Aug 07 03:02:03 doesn't seem to work. Aug 07 03:02:17 how else should I have installed it? should I compile it? Aug 07 03:04:08 but I may have symlinked improperly Aug 07 03:04:49 please ask in the support channels of your linux distribution. The way and pathnames libs are installed and integrated into system differs Aug 07 03:05:15 I'll do that, thanks. Aug 07 03:06:07 your pathnames might be different than my stuff in http://privatepaste.com/3fcd8bc604 Aug 07 03:06:30 which distribution do you use? Aug 07 03:06:43 opensuse Aug 07 03:07:00 oh, then most likely, yeah. Aug 07 03:09:05 also see `man ldconfig` Aug 07 03:09:18 a common mistake to not call that binary Aug 07 03:10:43 this stuff is way above my paygrade Aug 07 03:11:04 your package manager should usually call it when installing the lib pkg afaik Aug 07 03:12:16 * DocScrutinizer05 glares at Nokia for not statically binding flasher-3.5 Aug 07 03:13:15 I still don't understand why they don't just release the source of it. if they're abandoning the n900 and maemo, they might as well. Aug 07 03:13:17 DocScrutinizer05: Without scrolling up through all the techtalk, why do ya'll care so much bout rebuilding/rev-engineering the flasher? Aug 07 03:13:23 Also... Aug 07 03:13:32 Has anyone ever thought to give the CEO a phonecall and just ask? Aug 07 03:13:39 Just sayin. Aug 07 03:13:42 Hell, I'll do it. Aug 07 03:13:46 Tell me what to ask for Aug 07 03:13:50 I've got a silver tongue Aug 07 03:13:56 threre's no more CEO to ask Aug 07 03:14:04 There is someone, right? Aug 07 03:14:15 nobody Aug 07 03:14:16 I can call Bill if ya need Aug 07 03:14:34 So who would have access to what you need DocScrutinizer05 ? Aug 07 03:14:38 I'd love to be able to help out Aug 07 03:14:46 Just tell me what you want Aug 07 03:14:50 I'm serious too Aug 07 03:14:55 Not trying to be funny hahah Aug 07 03:15:39 honestly afaik there is nobody anymore who could publish any maemo code. The code probably is lost Aug 07 03:15:52 So.... What is it you want DocScrutinizer05 ? Aug 07 03:15:59 Give me details; let me work through my contacts Aug 07 03:16:11 ~closed Aug 07 03:16:11 somebody said closed was http://wiki.maemo.org/Why_the_closed_packages or https://wiki.maemo.org/Fremantle_closed_packages, or http://elinux.org/N900 Aug 07 03:16:14 I didn't establish ethicalreporting.org without the concept that I keep friends in high places when I do whitepapers. Aug 07 03:16:49 that's really sad that they'd just delete all of the source code Aug 07 03:17:05 I'm betting it's not deleted recharged Aug 07 03:17:11 Again, what do we need? Aug 07 03:17:19 Sometimes, all you have to do, is just ask. Aug 07 03:17:52 this has been tried for ~4 years now. And for all I can tell the last opportunity to get any code released closed ~1 year or longer ago. Now the code is no more, even when you would find somebody willing to release it, they couldn't Aug 07 03:18:07 So you want maemo source code. Aug 07 03:21:22 I've tried what you're wanting to do with other companies. they won't give up anything, even for small, unmaintained software. source code is very important to them, so they can keep "muh proprietary trade secrets" Aug 07 03:21:46 You're not me recharged =) Aug 07 03:21:59 I do whitehatting, so I've managed to make "friends" Aug 07 03:22:27 I doubt anyone could persuade microsoft. Aug 07 03:22:48 much of maemo been done by subcontractors for Nokia and Nokia doesn't even have the right to publish it Aug 07 03:22:58 DocScrutinizer05: RX-51_2009SE_10.2010.13-2.VANILLA_PR_EMMC_MR0_ARM.bin RX-51_2009SE_20.2010.36-2_PR_COMBINED_MR0_ARM.bin Aug 07 03:23:01 Yes? Aug 07 03:23:04 Source for those two files? Aug 07 03:23:40 and they don't know which code been done by whom under which license, and they have no budget to pay lawyers to check all that stuff and negotiate with colabora et al about disclosing sourcecodes Aug 07 03:24:17 Lawyers, legal and all aside Aug 07 03:24:27 Would the source for those two files accomplish something good for the n900? Aug 07 03:24:47 stryngs: forget it! on that level you won't get anywhere. RX-51_2009SE_20.2010.36-2_PR_COMBINED_MR0_ARM.bin even contained commercial songs and videos Aug 07 03:25:11 DocScrutinizer05: I get where your going my friend, I get it =)... Just tell me, would that help? Aug 07 03:26:00 but yes, basically "the source for RX-51_2009SE_20.2010.36-2_PR_COMBINED_MR0_ARM.bin" is most of the stuff we need, and sorry the media was in VANILLA Aug 07 03:26:10 Ok Aug 07 03:26:22 Let me see what I can do. No promises, but it doesn't hurt to try. Aug 07 03:26:29 basically VANILLA is nonsense, not really important Aug 07 03:26:47 what all is in vanilla? Aug 07 03:26:58 ~flashing Aug 07 03:26:59 i heard maemo-flashing is http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware, or - on linux PC - download&extract http://maemo.cloud-7.de/maemo5/patches_n_tools/maemo-my-private-workdir.tgz, cd into it, do sudo ./flash-it-all.sh Aug 07 03:27:29 VANILLA is data Aug 07 03:27:38 COMBINED is code Aug 07 03:27:48 alright, gotcha. Aug 07 03:29:40 however note that most of the code in COMBINED already is published and FOSS. Refer to: Aug 07 03:29:42 ~closed Aug 07 03:29:43 methinks closed is http://wiki.maemo.org/Why_the_closed_packages or https://wiki.maemo.org/Fremantle_closed_packages, or http://elinux.org/N900 Aug 07 03:30:16 flasher-3.5 however is NOT in combined, neither vanilla Aug 07 03:31:21 stryngs: please don't quote the bot about ~flashing Aug 07 03:31:38 No worries, I just want to know what you need. Aug 07 03:31:41 refer directly to http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware Aug 07 03:31:51 If I can provide something to the community, then I have fulfilled my role Aug 07 03:38:05 DocScrutinizer05: Aug 07 03:38:07 Ari Jaaksi Aug 07 03:38:09 ^ Aug 07 03:38:16 That's where the breadcrumbs begin =) Aug 07 03:39:03 SOUNDS GOOD Aug 07 03:39:11 sorry capslock Aug 07 03:39:51 they all will tell you they no longer have access to any sources Aug 07 03:40:16 but sure, trying won't hurt I guess Aug 07 03:40:57 has anyone in this channel worked for nokia? Aug 07 03:41:12 One thing I've learned, about the higher ups in society... They put on their pants everyday, just like you and I... One leg at a time. At the end of the day, people are pretty cool. Aug 07 03:41:22 dunno who of them is still around Aug 07 03:41:44 Also, the human side of things; if I created the n900 source code, I'd damn sure keep a copy. Aug 07 03:42:03 Take yourself DocScrutinizer05, I guarentee you have work you're proud of, backed up. Aug 07 03:42:10 what about anyone in jolla? aren't they from nokia? Aug 07 03:42:14 they didn't since at no times a single person had access to everything afaik Aug 07 03:42:23 recharged: yes Aug 07 03:42:37 We shall certainly find out Aug 07 03:43:16 do you think they have anything? Aug 07 03:43:31 although, if they do, I'd doubt they'd want to go through any legal troubles. Aug 07 03:43:52 yes, that's a serious concern with all that Aug 07 03:44:30 nobody is *allowed* to publish the sources, and probably nobody has a copy Aug 07 03:46:14 for every single binary those who once hat a saying in this and think they still do (if any such person exists), will have to go through every single binary and check if they actually are the copyright owner Aug 07 03:46:26 s/hat/had/ Aug 07 03:46:27 DocScrutinizer05 meant: for every single binary those who once had a saying in this and think they still do (if any such person exists), will have to go through every single binary and check if they actually are the copyright owner Aug 07 03:47:40 as already mentioned lots of that stuff were done by subcontractors and neither Nokia nor the subcontractor holds sufficient rights to publish the sources, as I understood what 'they' told me Aug 07 03:48:37 One small question: where can source code for osso-rss-feed-reader, latest version, be found? It's apparently open-source, but I can see only older version: https://hsivonen.fi/maemo-src/ Maemo repository seems to have only "binary", not the source code /everybody welcome to check and search/ Aug 07 03:48:45 so Nokia and e.g. Colabora would need to negotiate if Nokia (or Colabora) may publish the sources for XY. Then again same procedure for XZ Aug 07 03:49:31 osso is core nokia stuff Aug 07 03:50:23 afaik Aug 07 03:50:57 And osso-rss-feed-reader is not closed: https://wiki.maemo.org/Fremantle_closed_packages and there is open-source of an earlier version of it: https://hsivonen.fi/maemo-src/ Aug 07 03:50:59 DocScrutinizer05: The good thing, Ari is in San Fran Aug 07 03:51:04 So he's a phone call away for me Aug 07 03:51:08 Versus yourself Aug 07 03:51:14 Long long long distance and all Aug 07 03:51:21 It costs me nothing to have a protracted call with him Aug 07 03:55:14 Oksana: http://maemo.org/packages/search/?org_maemo_packages_search%5B1%5D%5Bproperty%5D=name&org_maemo_packages_search%5B1%5D%5Bconstraint%5D=LIKE&org_maemo_packages_search%5B1%5D%5Bvalue%5D=osso-rss-feed-reader&org_maemo_packages_search%5B2%5D%5Bproperty%5D=title&org_maemo_packages_search%5B2%5D%5Bconstraint%5D=LIKE&org_maemo_packages_search%5B2%5D%5Bvalue%5D=same Aug 07 03:57:42 Member of Jolla's Board, former head of Nokia's MeeGo division... Fascinating. | Actually, there is even open-source for an old version of Osso-rss-feed-reader-list , while the latest version is considered closed-source... | So? It gives binary.deb? It's not source code, right? Aug 07 03:58:45 Ah, thank you!!! It's obscure: http://maemo.org/packages/source/view/fremantle_sdk_free_source/osso-rss-feed-reader/1.8.03-3+0m5/ But it is here Aug 07 04:00:03 * Oksana got it through Package events; Releases did not have proper link at all, and I did check all five of them Aug 07 04:03:06 Still, it's not latest version. Have to dig more. Yes, http://repository.maemo.org/pool/maemo5.0/free/o/osso-rss-feed-reader/osso-rss-feed-reader_1.8.22-2%2b0m5.tar.gz Aug 07 04:03:21 okay, so a quick question: if a software is around for 95 years, will it become public domain after that? Aug 07 04:04:31 Depends on whether anyone inherited rights to it, I think. Aug 07 04:05:55 would the source code then have to be released if they didn't? Aug 07 04:06:41 :-/ https://gitorious.org/maemo-multimedia/ohm/source/a683b973722553fce95f260e4829ce4decb26d3e:ohmd Aug 07 04:07:32 If source code exists and was published, then yes (like a book). If it exists and wasn't published (like personal diary), don't know, maybe. If it doesn't exist, no, you would get public domain binary. Aug 07 04:08:24 well that sucks. there needs to be better laws regarding software. Aug 07 04:12:51 Well, it's like forcing book publishers to store their typesetting information (TeX, or whatever) for centuries, to release it into public domain. Reverse-engineering and OCR are basically the same. Aug 07 04:20:22 excellent example Aug 07 04:30:45 recharged: In the USA, at least, copyright length is currently 70 years + life of author, or 120 years for a work for hire. However, it has been retroactively extended multiple times in the past (often speculated that it was to keep Micky Mouse and other Disney works in copyright, due to Disney's driving lobby effort). Aug 07 04:31:37 copyright laws are so ridiculous. Aug 07 04:32:19 For all countries that agreed to the Berne Convention, copyright length must be at least 50 years + life of author. Aug 07 04:32:59 Well, I am glad that Three Musketeers are in public domain. Aug 07 04:33:00 (and that is pretty much all countries actually in a position to enforce copyright) Aug 07 04:33:27 I want to move to a country which doesn't enforce copyright laws. Aug 07 04:34:06 recharged_: Odds are, you are already in it. Internet is miraculous for finding anything. Aug 07 04:35:02 Though, I would not recommend trying to sell DVDs with pirated movies from 2015 written on them. Aug 07 04:35:26 Though in some countries even that happens. Aug 07 04:36:05 recharged: Then you would most likely be moving to: A) a country with a dictatorial government that is considered rogue by most of the worlds nations, B) a country that is so poor or war-torn that their government cant enforce copyright anyway. Aug 07 04:36:33 I live in the US, so copyright laws are very strict here. sorry, I realized that I was running three instances of hexchat. Aug 07 04:36:42 does vietnam enforce copyright law? Aug 07 04:37:22 seems like it does. Aug 07 04:37:31 Yes. Aug 07 04:37:38 According to a quick search anyway. Aug 07 04:38:05 You know what is really disgusting about copyright law? Take a look at this: http://www.slate.com/blogs/moneybox/2012/03/30/infinite_copyright_is_killing_culture.html Aug 07 04:39:39 that's ridiculous. Aug 07 04:40:26 what a free society we live in Aug 07 04:40:56 Almost all of that huge dip is probably orphaned works: things that have no apparent or documented holder, and yet there is no recourse to republish them since the law considers there to always be a copyright holder, and they can just pop up and sue you for huge sums. Aug 07 04:41:13 The problem? Aug 07 04:41:20 Lawyers don't have the balls to fight back. Aug 07 04:42:32 do _you_ want to get into that kind of fight? Aug 07 04:42:35 A lot of lawyers aren't very nice people, and most of the ones that are can't see the forest for the trees, so to speak. Aug 07 04:43:15 Regardless, there is really nobody in the position to do anything, anywhere in the world. It is stacked up specifically to prevent repeal. Aug 07 04:44:11 If one country tries to roll back copyright length to pre-Berne Convention lengths, they will find that they are in a quagmire of treaty violations and furious lobbyists. Aug 07 04:44:44 And that is assuming that a whole government can actually agree on doing so. Aug 07 04:45:37 this is why we need copyleft Aug 07 04:45:45 Probably the only way to get rid of it would be for a country to commit itself to being isolationist. Aug 07 04:45:48 Yes, exactly. Aug 07 04:46:57 Well, if they just put it to be bare Berne minimum, it would already be something. Aug 07 04:48:54 It would be a very slight improvement, but not much. Aug 07 04:50:43 IMO, the driving force behind social and political change is the development of infrastructure (social, technical, or economic). If you drive the development of infrastructure through FLOSS, then you will have very positive effects indirectly. Aug 07 04:51:09 Like the Internet has been, for example. Aug 07 04:53:11 Projects like Fremantle or the Neo900 might seem small, but they are the building blocks of future development. Like Openmoko was for the Neo900. Aug 07 04:54:51 Sorry for the OT political rant. :) Aug 07 04:55:26 the free software movement is probably the best thing I've considered myself a part of my entire life. you really do see a difference. Aug 07 04:56:30 What's the best RSS feed reader on maemo 5 currently is? /Trying to persuade somebody else to fix bugs in osso-rss-feed-reader by showing how frustrating competition is/ Aug 07 04:58:03 I always liked resistance and feeding-it. Aug 07 04:58:19 but they both had different options I liked that the other didn't have. Aug 07 04:59:11 * Oksana is installing feedingit feedcircuit feedhandler ... Thank you for resistance, will try it too Aug 07 05:16:00 recharged: if you cant remove anything on any particular os it always means corruption and most likely partition was remounted read only because of errors Aug 07 05:16:17 which also resulted in inability to install things Aug 07 05:16:38 check dmesg and mount Aug 07 05:18:02 what should I be looking for in those? Aug 07 05:18:18 dmesg -s 999999|grep -i error Aug 07 05:18:23 for a quickie Aug 07 05:18:39 mount |grep ro Aug 07 05:20:10 nothing in dmesg, but a few things show up in the mount one Aug 07 05:20:26 should I copy them to pastebin? Aug 07 05:20:42 mount |grep ro|grep -v /proc Aug 07 05:20:45 this one Aug 07 05:21:25 alright Aug 07 05:24:53 http://pastebin.com/FZ94SSNf Aug 07 05:25:24 hmm Aug 07 05:25:49 /dev/mmcblk0p1 on /home/user/MyDocs type vfat (rw,noauto,nodev,noexec,nosuid,noatime,nodiratime,utf8,uid=29999,shortname=mixed,dmask=000,fmask=0133,rodir) Aug 07 05:25:51 rodir? Aug 07 05:26:17 not sure what it means. Aug 07 05:26:27 read only directory? Aug 07 05:26:32 googling Aug 07 05:27:22 but i have the same for that mountpoint so its not that Aug 07 05:28:00 where did you get that error with writing? Aug 07 05:28:20 ? Aug 07 05:29:14 rm: cannot stat '/opt/pymaemo/bak.GfbLYc/usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages/zenmapCore/DelayedObject.pyc': Input/output error Aug 07 05:29:17 right Aug 07 05:30:01 is that from earlier? Aug 07 05:30:34 Yes, from failed installation of fmms Aug 07 05:31:22 that's what I thought. now I need more clarification on the question. Aug 07 05:31:32 try rm now Aug 07 05:31:36 then dmesg Aug 07 05:32:10 just type rm, or try to delete something? Aug 07 05:32:27 well Aug 07 05:32:31 even ls could fail Aug 07 05:32:39 so: ls /opt/pymaemo/bak.GfbLYc/usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages/zenmapCore/DelayedObject.pyc Aug 07 05:33:11 maybe your emmc is dying Aug 07 05:34:24 after I do that, do you want the full dmesg or the one you wanted me to type earlier? Aug 07 05:34:59 for easy time: dmesg |curl --upload-file - http://transfer.sh Aug 07 05:35:09 assuming you have curl installed Aug 07 05:35:30 it's not, sadly. Aug 07 05:40:31 http://pastebin.com/thxU5g3R Aug 07 05:40:34 I just did this Aug 07 05:40:53 if you want more, I can get more (but xterm cuts off a lot from dmesg) Aug 07 05:40:56 um Aug 07 05:41:02 can you do it from normal term? Aug 07 05:41:05 without chrrot? Aug 07 05:41:08 chroot Aug 07 05:41:22 how? Aug 07 05:41:28 my xterm has always been in a chroot Aug 07 05:41:31 try /bin/ls instead of ls Aug 07 05:41:57 (this wont free chroot but will free you of aliases) Aug 07 05:42:34 it says input/output error Aug 07 05:42:38 should I get the dmesg? Aug 07 05:42:41 sure Aug 07 05:43:44 when I do the one you sent me, nothing is shown. the dmesg -s 999999 one. what should I do instead? Aug 07 05:43:54 just dmesg Aug 07 05:44:05 how do I get all of it? Aug 07 05:44:32 dmesg > some-file.txt Aug 07 05:44:44 that's what I thought, thanks Aug 07 05:47:41 http://pastebin.com/m5HbcnqZ Aug 07 05:47:51 I don't know what you'll get from this, though Aug 07 05:48:10 [18286.811706] FAT: Corrupted directory (i_pos 442939) Aug 07 05:48:24 you need to fix your emmc Aug 07 05:48:34 oh wow Aug 07 05:48:36 how? Aug 07 05:48:38 fsck Aug 07 05:48:39 :) Aug 07 05:48:51 i think rescueos has fsck Aug 07 05:48:53 what should I fsck? Aug 07 05:48:59 and dont try to run it on a live fs! Aug 07 05:49:07 or you make things worse Aug 07 05:49:07 can I do it from my pc? Aug 07 05:49:25 also, if you have anything valuable there, backup first Aug 07 05:49:49 everything is mostly backed up, but I'm gonna do a system backup Aug 07 05:49:56 http://n900.quitesimple.org/rescueOS/rescueOS-1.2/ Aug 07 05:50:01 http://n900.quitesimple.org/rescueOS/rescueOS-1.2/documentation.txt Aug 07 05:50:48 is it safe to make a backup to the emmc or should I find a microsd to save it to? Aug 07 05:51:06 you will be fscking emmc Aug 07 05:51:07 :P Aug 07 05:51:14 so its the other way round Aug 07 05:51:40 I mean, can I make a backup and save it there then move it to my desktop? Aug 07 05:54:50 backup error occurred. what do I do now? go without backing up? Aug 07 05:56:05 depends how attached you are to data in /home and /opt Aug 07 05:56:20 could be safe, could erase most of it Aug 07 05:56:39 I'll try again with a microsd Aug 07 05:57:25 after this, should everything go back to normal? Aug 07 05:57:30 yup Aug 07 05:57:31 almost Aug 07 05:57:38 almost? Aug 07 05:57:41 you will have to fix those packages that didnt install correctly Aug 07 05:57:50 but its easy Aug 07 05:57:55 okay, good Aug 07 05:58:44 it's backing up to the microsd Aug 07 06:04:56 okay, so now that I'm in rescueos, do I just fsck mydocs? Aug 07 06:05:01 or everything? Aug 07 06:05:11 fsck /dev/mmcblk0p2 probably Aug 07 06:05:46 um Aug 07 06:05:48 p1 Aug 07 06:05:57 but you can fsck both Aug 07 06:08:15 fsc.auto: No such file or directory Aug 07 06:08:19 don't Aug 07 06:08:24 it's silly Aug 07 06:08:30 just tar, mkfs and untar Aug 07 06:08:35 ? Aug 07 06:08:38 he has vfat corrupted Aug 07 06:08:47 oh Aug 07 06:08:58 attach to a computer and fix it from there Aug 07 06:09:00 so he cant even rm that dir Aug 07 06:09:19 recharged: try: dosfsck /dev/mmcblk0p1 Aug 07 06:09:47 logical sector size is zero Aug 07 06:10:02 that's not an issue i think Aug 07 06:10:11 ...wait Aug 07 06:12:16 how did you even mount that: Aug 07 06:12:26 mount what? Aug 07 06:12:59 he means, maemo shouldnt boot Aug 07 06:13:24 so my device shouldn't be working right now? Aug 07 06:16:45 i just tried it again and it worked Aug 07 06:16:53 I have three options Aug 07 06:17:07 copy original to backup, copy backup to original, or no action Aug 07 06:17:12 which should I choose? Aug 07 06:18:11 unless you know what to do you can simply add -a for automatic repair Aug 07 06:18:48 dosfsck -a /dev/mmcblk0p1 ? Aug 07 06:18:57 yes Aug 07 06:19:22 in the worst case just do full flash Aug 07 06:21:33 I would, but that was discussed earlier Aug 07 06:22:00 missed that part Aug 07 06:22:18 the device was last at 28%, is there any chance of it dying while doing this? Aug 07 06:22:20 it's alright Aug 07 06:22:36 it seems like you have to manually charge it Aug 07 06:22:52 from rescueos, I mean Aug 07 06:23:45 if you battery isnt ill, you should be fine Aug 07 06:24:07 or if you need phone, just boot maemo and charge Aug 07 06:35:55 this sure is taking awhile Aug 07 06:36:06 30gigs of data Aug 07 06:36:22 it is? Aug 07 06:36:22 and appropriate amount of structures Aug 07 06:36:56 oh wait Aug 07 06:37:03 because the emmc is 30gb Aug 07 06:37:21 how can this little device handle all of that? Aug 07 06:37:36 one by one Aug 07 06:37:39 usually Aug 07 06:37:45 by rereading fat Aug 07 06:37:51 what would happen if it died? Aug 07 06:37:59 would it corrupt more? Aug 07 06:38:02 or just stop? Aug 07 06:38:12 depends Aug 07 06:38:31 on? Aug 07 06:38:50 i dont know if -a implies -w (write to disk immediately) Aug 07 06:39:09 it's auto-renaming things Aug 07 06:39:12 so I'd assume so Aug 07 06:39:47 did you disconnect it from pc without umounting first earlier? Aug 07 06:40:03 (in windows its called 'disconnect safely') Aug 07 06:40:39 Hopefully yes, but I don't remember which switches I used. So, if you can, keep it charging while it fsck-s. | In Linux, it's Eject or something? Aug 07 06:40:51 I didn't, iirc Aug 07 06:40:55 oksana: he is in rescueos Aug 07 06:40:59 ie. one console only Aug 07 06:41:03 ie. no bmc Aug 07 06:41:21 no GNU screen... Alright. Aug 07 06:42:07 sync before disconnect mostly helps, and umount after... Aug 07 06:42:20 drathir: cant sync on windoze i guess Aug 07 06:42:29 only way is to click that green arrow Aug 07 06:42:38 linux i mean sorry.. Aug 07 06:43:06 recharged is using Linux, if I remember correctly... Aug 07 06:43:12 yes Aug 07 06:43:28 and yea m$ is hopeless only safe diisconnect/eject device is there... Aug 07 06:51:37 oksana: in linux it's umount Aug 07 06:52:03 once you umount partition, all dirty buffers are written back Aug 07 06:52:48 and eject will probably not do that before (unless it's worked around/aliased somehow on specific distros) Aug 07 06:57:14 how long should this take? Aug 07 06:58:06 who knows, depends on count of the files and level of corruption Aug 07 06:58:38 can it be finished in 12 hours? Aug 07 06:58:47 most likely Aug 07 06:59:17 that's all that really matters Aug 07 06:59:38 do you think the device is charging while in this mode if the usb cable is connected to it? Aug 07 06:59:45 nope Aug 07 06:59:56 rescueos doesnt enable automatic charging Aug 07 07:00:02 why not? Aug 07 07:00:08 you need to run a script Aug 07 07:00:20 I know, but I can't currently, right? Aug 07 07:00:23 bencoh, yeah, pity it only has one console by default Aug 07 07:00:46 hmm, nice idea for rescueod, telnetd Aug 07 07:00:47 :) Aug 07 07:00:51 and usb networking Aug 07 07:02:04 I think we already discussed that here (with N.IN101 :) Aug 07 07:02:31 I feel like this is going to die far before it's finished Aug 07 07:02:33 worth mentioning again (till it gets implemented, he he) Aug 07 07:06:51 well, it died. Aug 07 07:09:56 Well, now use rescueos again, but enable charging before running fsck, and use both -a and -w , just in case fsck does not get to finish it in one go? Aug 07 07:10:16 oksana, rescueos has only 1 console Aug 07 07:10:34 So, you cannot just enable charging, and then do something else? Aug 07 07:10:37 nope Aug 07 07:10:59 Would 'charge.sh &&' or something put charging script into background? Aug 07 07:11:22 never actually charged device in ros, don't know if it need any use interaction Aug 07 07:11:32 and it should be single & Aug 07 07:11:47 otherwise next commend wont run before previous finished sucessfully Aug 07 07:12:17 In worst case, charge battery to 100%, then run dosfsck -a -w /dev/mmcblk0p1 as long as the battery allows? Aug 07 07:12:29 sure Aug 07 07:12:32 that's what I'm doing this time Aug 07 07:12:35 assuming battery is quite healthy Aug 07 07:12:44 I don't think it is Aug 07 07:13:19 anyway, gotta run Aug 07 07:13:23 * Oksana has one entirely unhealthy battery which stores around 10% (20% at best) of the charge it should have stores Aug 07 07:13:40 remember, in the worst case you can do full reflash Aug 07 07:14:00 (or can be emmc be flashed without other parts?) Aug 07 07:14:22 not with only 0xffff, that's my problem. Aug 07 07:14:31 flasher-3.5 ? Aug 07 07:14:43 you don't need to flash emmc, really Aug 07 07:14:44 I have issues with it regarding libs Aug 07 07:14:46 Full reflash requires flasher-3.5, which has some obscure problems (unable to find libusb or something...) | I rarely use it, since I have two Polarcell batteries which are healthy Aug 07 07:15:06 recharged: run some livecd ? Aug 07 07:15:14 the only thing 0xffff can't do is flash the emmc Aug 07 07:15:22 but you can just load rescueos and mkfs manually Aug 07 07:15:29 kerio: what about file structure? Aug 07 07:15:30 you also get to choose your partition sizes that way Aug 07 07:15:33 I might try that. Aug 07 07:15:41 KotCzarny: the vfat directories... eeh Aug 07 07:15:48 i think they're created by something at some point Aug 07 07:15:49 you need at least user home dir Aug 07 07:16:00 and opt Aug 07 07:16:03 the stuff in /home gets completely wiped and copied on first boot Aug 07 07:16:07 it's not in VANILLA Aug 07 07:16:22 it's the reason you can't flash VANILLA without also flashing COMBINED Aug 07 07:16:43 in the rootfs of COMBINED there's a file that signals that on first boot, /home has to be cleaned and rebuilt Aug 07 07:16:43 recharged: while n900 is charging, you can grab some 32bit livecd Aug 07 07:17:06 preferably some older one (2009-2011 era) so it will use similar libs as flasher-3.5 Aug 07 07:17:08 first partition vfat, second partition ext3, third partition swap? Aug 07 07:17:13 i don't remember Aug 07 07:17:20 kerio, he only needs vfat fixed afaik Aug 07 07:17:30 anyway, im out Aug 07 07:17:41 I'll look for an old *buntu iso Aug 07 07:17:44 see yah Aug 07 07:25:39 Oksana: also depend on filesystem linux make sync time to time, and only buffered not writed data get lose... Aug 07 07:27:52 chargin isnt controled by onboard chip+battery chip for control lvl of charge? Aug 07 07:29:05 also if linux see device You can fsck from pc, but i guess its less reccomend... Aug 07 07:29:09 charge.sh 2>/dev/null >/dev/null & works Aug 07 07:37:39 i still can't believe that nokia released a device on which copying a big file causes a reboot Aug 07 07:58:40 kerio: ? Aug 07 08:53:38 yeah, fsck on windows could work too Aug 07 08:54:35 bencoh: queue gets full, n900 becomes completely irresponsive, watchdog bites Aug 07 08:55:02 bad watchdog, bad! sit! Aug 07 08:55:29 it bites unless you pet it Aug 07 08:55:39 every 30 seconds Aug 07 08:55:50 attention bitch Aug 07 08:55:52 tickle? Aug 07 08:55:56 kick? Aug 07 08:56:01 what's the correct verb? Aug 07 08:56:04 poke Aug 07 08:56:37 don't poke the watchdog! D: Aug 07 08:56:41 poor watchdoggy Aug 07 08:56:48 poke with a stick Aug 07 10:13:28 Asus did the same with a few android tablets Aug 07 11:35:39 what you think? Will n900 die with 512gb sd card. Aug 07 11:36:07 huh? Aug 07 11:36:23 like in 'reboot'? Aug 07 11:36:52 maybe it runs out of mem Aug 07 11:40:33 just guessing will it work Aug 07 11:40:47 most likely Aug 07 11:40:48 or do those cards need some more power etc... Aug 07 11:41:37 i just realised that they are available with reasonable price Aug 07 11:41:45 there are cards with specific voltages required Aug 07 11:42:11 also saw 1tb usb stick. Would be perfect for saving programs from tv. Aug 07 11:42:22 usb sucks power Aug 07 11:42:57 but if it's not stated otherwise, I guess those cards are pretty much standardized. Aug 07 11:43:36 but if i hook such stick with tv, I guess it doesn't matter. Aug 07 11:43:52 sorry speaking of two things at once... Aug 07 11:45:35 but i think vfat on 512G will eat quite a hunk of mem Aug 07 11:46:18 hmm no idea about that Aug 07 11:46:25 fat is old Aug 07 11:47:09 yes, that i know Aug 07 11:47:21 and prone to corruption Aug 07 11:47:28 now i have 32gb card and it works fine so far Aug 07 11:47:55 My laptop specs are approaching that of a modern smartphone (again). :D Aug 07 11:48:43 for most needs, 1.6-2.2G dual core cpu, 2G of ram and ssd drive is more than enough Aug 07 11:48:43 well don't be sorry. My desktop is already ancient history :D Aug 07 11:48:55 * svetlana isn't :) Aug 07 11:49:33 i have 1,3ghz tb with 700 something mb of memory Aug 07 11:49:46 little burner Aug 07 11:50:09 just grab old thinkpad x4[01]/x6[01] Aug 07 11:50:23 but with 512gb card i could store all my stuff in phone (and lose all at once haha) Aug 07 11:50:31 yup Aug 07 11:50:34 true, that Aug 07 11:50:44 keep backups and rsync occasionally Aug 07 11:51:06 maximum size of FAT32 is 512GB per partition Aug 07 11:51:50 is maemo treating it as fat or fat32 or does it even matter? Aug 07 11:52:05 no one uses fat16 these days i think Aug 07 11:52:13 and even fat32 is phasing out Aug 07 11:52:29 scratch that Aug 07 11:52:32 2TB is the limit Aug 07 11:52:38 with 512b sector size Aug 07 11:53:03 but max file size is 2/4GB Aug 07 11:53:09 is 2gb maximum file size still there? Aug 07 11:53:10 so forget about isos/rips Aug 07 11:53:38 ah well most of my stuff is just mp3 libs Aug 07 11:53:54 well not libs but music... Aug 07 11:54:03 :> Aug 07 11:54:18 consider using oscp, or trackerd will eat you Aug 07 11:55:12 i thought it tracks once and if nothing changes, leave me be Aug 07 11:57:04 http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=90275 Aug 07 11:57:11 apparently it rescans on every boot Aug 07 11:58:06 oh Aug 07 11:58:24 although i only boot when i need to calibrate battery Aug 07 11:58:24 could be some bug or specific device breakage Aug 07 11:58:42 anyway, consider using cluster size bigger than usual Aug 07 11:58:52 if you plan to store big files Aug 07 11:58:53 so when booted it will be hooked with battery Aug 07 11:58:56 16-64k Aug 07 11:59:31 nah nothing bigger than few mb's Aug 07 11:59:40 still Aug 07 11:59:45 it will make FAT smaller Aug 07 11:59:46 might have few flac's tho Aug 07 12:00:05 big files == anything bigger than few tens of cluster sizes Aug 07 12:00:40 you are sailing way over my head right now KotCzarny :D Aug 07 12:01:02 in short, anything bigger than 128k Aug 07 12:01:03 ;) Aug 07 12:02:31 ok Aug 07 12:02:46 and when formatting i can change cluster size? Aug 07 12:02:51 yes Aug 07 12:03:07 so should one use biggest alternative option? Aug 07 12:03:14 if you dont like cmd line tools, you can do it from pc too Aug 07 12:03:16 or are there some draw backs? Aug 07 12:03:30 only draw back is lost space Aug 07 12:03:43 because even 1 byte file will take 1 cluster size Aug 07 12:03:56 so if you plan to unpack kernel there or something, its not a good idea Aug 07 12:04:00 well with 512 i thing i would have few gigs to spare :p Aug 07 12:04:10 but if you mostly keep music/vids there, then it doesnt matter Aug 07 12:04:29 oh now i think i understand Aug 07 12:04:30 16 or 32kB will be the best Aug 07 12:04:44 64kB can be unsupported in places Aug 07 12:05:03 one cluster is minimum take no matter file size? Aug 07 12:05:08 yes Aug 07 12:05:19 and multiplies Aug 07 12:05:21 if it's less than cluster obviously Aug 07 12:05:44 so with 16kB cluster, 17kB file will take 32kB Aug 07 12:05:45 etc Aug 07 12:05:58 so if i have like 1mb cluster and file is 2,01 it will take three? Aug 07 12:06:09 max cluster is 32kB Aug 07 12:06:16 oh lol Aug 07 12:06:17 (and sometimes 64kB) Aug 07 12:08:20 hmm i think going with 32kb would be my best option Aug 07 12:08:53 another thing to consider is read-ahead Aug 07 12:08:54 and now i just realized how come there was so big difference in map tile size and file taken fom disk Aug 07 12:09:11 all life is learning. True that, thx :) Aug 07 12:09:52 because if file is fragmented or accessed randomly in little parts, whole 128kB gets read every time Aug 07 12:10:20 though, bigger cluster size means lower fragmentation anyway Aug 07 12:10:46 or fragments are bigger Aug 07 12:11:03 it's like hardened glass, sort of Aug 07 12:11:04 bigger fragments == lower chance of bad fragmentation Aug 07 12:11:17 yes Aug 07 12:11:37 you can check how device will behave even now, if you have any sd card Aug 07 12:11:37 10 piece puzzle is easier to make than 1000 Aug 07 12:12:05 i have 32, but it's closing to be full Aug 07 12:13:02 it would be interesting if bigger cluster size makes accessing sd card faster and less memory hungry Aug 07 12:15:06 are you speaking about devices ram or what? Aug 07 12:15:12 yes Aug 07 12:15:27 don't know how linux vfat driver behaves Aug 07 12:15:42 but on windows it loads big chunk of FAT into memory and keeps it there Aug 07 12:16:04 never thought that card size could impact in ram Aug 07 16:37:34 starting fsck again Aug 08 00:04:45 Whoever wrote python2.7-minimal Aug 08 00:04:48 You should be: Aug 08 00:04:56 Shot, Hung, Drawn and Quartered Aug 08 00:04:59 In that order Aug 08 00:05:01 ln: /usr/lib/python2.7/python2.7: File exists Aug 08 00:05:03 dpkg: error processing python2.7-minimal (--install): subprocess post-installation script returned error exit status 1 Aug 08 02:30:31 okay, so my phone will not hold a charge throughout fsck. is there any way I can do it through my own computer? Aug 08 02:35:57 recharged: wall jack? Aug 08 02:37:38 you can't charge the phone while using fsck on rescueos. there's only one terminal, and you have to charge the battery manually with a script. **** ENDING LOGGING AT Sat Aug 08 02:59:58 2015