**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sun Sep 27 02:59:59 2015 Sep 27 04:03:25 Regarding the registers file again: https://vcs.maemo.org/git/?p=kernel-power;a=blob;f=kernel-power-2.6.28/debian/patches/bq27x00-sysfs-registers.diff;h=3f0ac979e4dfc191fa0321e15a0d7f136b1400d2;hb=d40aed045abdfa257a112079efe7e4a03d9de656 Sep 27 04:04:24 So probably not something that's going to appear in mainline. Sep 27 04:04:45 * Maxdamantus wonders if there's a typical way to handle that sort of thing. Sep 27 05:24:04 Is the source for the CSSU version of camera-ui still available somewhere? Sep 27 05:28:09 Ah, it's in community-testing. Sep 27 05:51:04 * Maxdamantus is going to see if he can add some sort of "fix" mechanism to camera-ui. Sep 27 05:51:28 so when it's in that mode, it doesn't autofocus/autoexpose, etc Sep 27 05:52:40 have to keep setting focus back to closest after taking each picture, and if you want to take something like a panorama, you should have the same exposure/ISO/colour/focus/.. Sep 27 05:53:45 fcamera kind of does it, but it's weird. Sep 27 06:47:10 Where is modified-hildon-desktop? Sep 27 06:49:06 http://repository.maemo.org/extras-devel/pool/fremantle/free/m/modified-hildon-desktop/ Sep 27 06:49:15 could be in -testing or just extras too Sep 27 06:49:53 nope, just -devel Sep 27 06:50:03 usual extras-devel warning applies Sep 27 06:56:36 By the way, which is more practical, having just -devel, or both -devel and -testing? Sep 27 06:58:31 er mhd is included in CSSU Sep 27 06:58:49 sixwheeledbeast: cssu-testing? Sep 27 06:58:56 yep Sep 27 07:00:07 and you are best to only have -devel otherwise you'll slow HAM down, it also strongly advised you only enable devel when you need it. Sep 27 07:00:29 Hello. Does anyone know of a good calendar / agenda / organiser application? Sep 27 07:01:18 I use the Qt version of the stock one? Sep 27 07:02:06 I'm not content with it, as it cannot remind you earlier than 15 minutes beforehand Sep 27 07:02:12 And there are not recurring reminders Sep 27 07:02:18 I doubt mhd in extras is even up to date with CSSU changes. Sep 27 07:02:59 ebzzy: never ever do apt-get upgrade (or update in ham) with extras-devel enabled Sep 27 07:03:11 just use it to install single packages Sep 27 07:03:48 abramelin: I believe in the Qt version you can, not sure about reoccuring tho Sep 27 07:04:04 abramelin: setup a regular alarm clock for recurring events? Sep 27 07:04:21 you can choose which days of week its active Sep 27 07:05:26 For reoccuring things I have always used alarmed Sep 27 07:05:37 ~qalender Sep 27 07:05:42 ~alarmed Sep 27 07:05:49 ~ping Sep 27 07:05:50 1 packet transmitted, 1 packet received, 0.0% packet loss Sep 27 07:05:57 hmm Sep 27 07:06:02 ~listkeys alarm Sep 27 07:06:03 Factoid search of 'alarm' by key (8): 12 alarmer ;; gtkalarm ;; smoke alarm ;; alarm applet ;; ipaq alarm ;; argh - some car alarm ;; ants alarm ;; ipaqalarm. Sep 27 07:06:08 ~listkeys calendar Sep 27 07:06:09 Factoid search of 'calendar' by key (10): calendars for the web ;; event calendar ;; mod_perl calendar system ;; tkccalendar ;; myphpcalendar ;; rosenet community calendar ;; cst-calendar ;; webcalendar ;; webevent calendar ;; calendar faq. Sep 27 07:06:35 sixwheeledbeast: thanks Sep 27 07:06:59 BTW, when installing catorise, I got: "Can't locate Locale/gettext.pm in @INC ..." Sep 27 07:07:09 ebzzry: np Sep 27 07:07:29 I would use catorise myself Sep 27 07:07:39 s/would/wouldn't/ Sep 27 07:07:40 sixwheeledbeast meant: I wouldn't use catorise myself Sep 27 07:08:06 abramelin: talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=90820 for Qt Calendar Sep 27 07:08:45 ~qalendar Sep 27 07:09:25 infobot: qalendar is http://wiki.maemo.org/Qalendar Sep 27 07:09:26 sixwheeledbeast: okay Sep 27 07:11:33 abramelin: the other work around if you do not wish to install alarmed for your re-occuring events is to import an iCal made elsewhere into your calendar Sep 27 07:13:22 ebzzry: There are many "widgetz" that offer limited extra functionality, however they are normally costly to system performance. Sep 27 07:21:17 sixwheeledbeast how can I install qalendar? I couldn't find it in extras-devel Sep 27 07:22:13 no info on that wiki page/ Sep 27 07:23:02 abramelin: it's listed on the wiki page how to change your default calendar to qalendar. The package currently is in -devel I believe. Sep 27 07:23:23 cssu-devel or extras-devel? Sep 27 07:23:44 also worth reading the thread ^^^ Sep 27 07:24:39 yeah, info about install is in wiki (indirectly but is) Sep 27 07:24:51 extas-devel Sep 27 07:24:53 KotCzarny: you should know better :P extras Sep 27 07:25:16 swb: i've just started my cssu adventure :P Sep 27 07:25:28 cssu-thumb even Sep 27 07:26:14 cssu-devel is experimental system updates for devs, apt-get only! Sep 27 07:26:22 yeah Sep 27 07:27:13 cssu-thumb is pretty solid I would use it only I don't wish to be forced into some of the other packages it comes with Sep 27 07:27:21 happy only stable Sep 27 07:27:27 s/only/on/ Sep 27 07:27:28 sixwheeledbeast meant: happy on stable Sep 27 07:27:38 im planning on creating some dummy replacement packages Sep 27 07:28:13 still not stumbled on that thread of mt's about dummy packages Sep 27 07:28:45 in debian its done via equivs util Sep 27 07:29:11 That maybe it, ported Sep 27 07:29:14 http://eric.lubow.org/2010/system-administration/creating-dummy-packages-on-debian/ Sep 27 07:29:36 sixwheeledbeast the thread only tells me to look for a package called qalendar in extras-devel, and the instructions on the wiki assume that I've already installed it Sep 27 07:29:51 Am I overlooking something? Sep 27 07:30:20 abramelin: wiki page explains gotchas for qalendar Sep 27 07:30:59 nope, install package with HAM (or whatever). Then do the instructions on the wiki so the widget will default to qalendar. Sep 27 07:32:04 sixwheeledbeast: ok. thanks. Sep 27 07:33:21 KotCzarny: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=92653 Sep 27 07:33:56 sixwheeledbeast that's the point. I can't find any package named qalendar Sep 27 07:34:36 abramelin: oh well it's there. maybe your repos are incorrect or out of date? Sep 27 07:37:16 swb: thx, last time i looked at equivs it required some recent debian utils Sep 27 07:38:08 KotCzarny: I have never tried it but it appears to work from reading the thread Sep 27 07:39:06 The mere existance of this package is a great indicator for how broken Maemo really is. Sep 27 07:39:08 hehe Sep 27 07:40:32 Yeah, I think there's definitely something wrong with my repositories. I can't find nearly as many applications as before, and half the applications I install don't show up in the menu Sep 27 07:41:20 abramelin: it's a fresh install? Sep 27 07:41:24 Yeah Sep 27 07:41:49 what repos do you have enabled? Sep 27 07:42:03 extras-testing, extras-devel, cssu-testing Sep 27 07:42:09 enable extras Sep 27 07:42:19 and disable extras-devel Sep 27 07:42:46 In fact, extras was also enabled Sep 27 07:42:55 and 'before' was it configured by you or some second-handed fresh buy? Sep 27 07:43:05 I reflashed Sep 27 07:44:23 sixwheeledbeast: isn't mhd's name modified-hildon-desktop? I have CSSU-Testing but I can't search it via 'apt-cache search modified-hildon-desktop' Sep 27 07:45:22 extras-testing was only enabled in Faster Application Manager but I've enabled it in the normal one too now Sep 27 07:45:22 ebzzry: the packages is not installed but the patches are included in the system Sep 27 07:46:03 swb, ask him if he has cssu or stock Sep 27 07:46:10 abramelin: qalendar is in -devel not -testing Sep 27 07:46:20 KotCzarny: testing ^^^ Sep 27 07:46:29 right Sep 27 07:46:41 question is, was it properly installed? Sep 27 07:46:52 ~xy Sep 27 07:46:52 i guess xy is The XY problem: You want to do X, but don't know how. You think you can solve it using Y, but don't know how to do that, either. You ask about Y, which is a strange thing to want to do. Just ask about X. http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html#goal Sep 27 07:47:05 i have mixed feeling about cssu installation process Sep 27 07:47:19 (it requires proper repos setup and clicking on enabler icon) Sep 27 07:47:57 KotCzarny: it had to be designed that way. Sep 27 07:48:30 sixwheeledbeast: how can I make the patches active? Sep 27 07:48:30 i understand, still, repos setup should be checked and fixed by installer Sep 27 07:49:33 not sure if it can check stock repos, it installs the new repos for you. Sep 27 07:50:41 still, having cssu-thumb is worth it Sep 27 07:50:54 and i thank cssu team and freemangordon Sep 27 07:50:56 :) Sep 27 07:51:06 by the way, what's -thumb? Sep 27 07:51:30 ebzzry: it's a way to save memory Sep 27 07:51:39 it's a separate arm instruction set where a lot of the instructions take up half as much memory Sep 27 07:51:43 (for the very basic version) Sep 27 07:51:48 Ya, I remember now. Sep 27 07:51:55 but is not that much tested package wise on maemo Sep 27 07:52:08 I wonder if -thumb is why recording calls doesn't work Sep 27 07:52:13 So, regarding my question earlier, how will I take into effect the MHD patches from CSSU-Testing? Sep 27 07:52:51 I actually wonder why -thumb wasn't the default in the first place Sep 27 07:52:52 luke, install stock + cssu and compare Sep 27 07:52:59 ~jrtools Sep 27 07:53:00 extra, extra, read all about it, jrtools is http://wiki.maemo.org/User:Joerg_rw/tools Sep 27 07:53:00 tekk: bugs in chip Sep 27 07:53:05 ah Sep 27 07:53:15 ie. unstable at places Sep 27 07:53:17 I'd always assumed it was the same shining competence that gave us the dependencies in packages :p Sep 27 07:53:25 ~tell ebzzry about jrtools Sep 27 07:53:50 KotCzarny: too much time/trouble Sep 27 07:54:14 ~tell ebzzry about cssu-thumb Sep 27 07:54:18 luke, n900 devices go cheaply nowadays, grab some Sep 27 07:54:36 meh Sep 27 07:54:47 I have a spare, but still takes time Sep 27 07:55:12 I haven't flashed fresh since 2010 or earlier. Sep 27 07:55:14 flashing and installing few apps can be done in 15-30 mins Sep 27 07:55:17 so I'd have to read up on how Sep 27 07:55:24 ~flashing Sep 27 07:55:24 i heard maemo-flashing is http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware, or - on linux PC - download&extract http://maemo.cloud-7.de/maemo5/patches_n_tools/maemo-my-private-workdir.tgz, cd into it, do sudo ./flash-it-all.sh Sep 27 07:55:31 use docs tool ./flash-it-all.sh Sep 27 07:55:36 its fully automatic Sep 27 07:55:42 ebzzry: the list of mhd features is on the cssu wiki age I believe Sep 27 07:55:51 s/docs/doc's/ Sep 27 07:55:54 hmm Sep 27 07:58:56 http://wiki.maemo.org/Community_SSU/Features/hildon-desktop Sep 27 07:59:13 http://wiki.maemo.org/Community_SSU/Features Sep 27 07:59:30 http://wiki.maemo.org/Community_SSU Sep 27 08:00:42 Can anyone point me to the customizing rx-51 page? Sep 27 08:01:03 what do you mean by that Sep 27 08:01:14 maemo is all about customizing Sep 27 08:01:20 and hacking Sep 27 08:03:33 I mean, are there now things about rx-51 now, aside from it lives in /usr/share/X11/xkb/symbols/nokia_vndr/rx-51 Sep 27 08:03:49 still too generic Sep 27 08:03:52 what do you want to do Sep 27 08:04:20 I lost my config. I'll try to restore it from memory, then I'll ask if I'm stuck. Sep 27 08:04:53 ~bm Sep 27 08:04:54 rumour has it, backupmenu is http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=63975 Sep 27 08:05:04 for future reference for you Sep 27 08:05:55 Ya. I remember using that before. Sep 27 08:06:11 Forgive my ignorance but what is uBoot? Sep 27 08:06:18 ~uboot Sep 27 08:06:18 N900 uBoot is a siamese twin binary [uBoot+stockMaemoKernel] that resides in kernel NAND partition /dev/mtd3 aka "kernel". You can't uninstall it, rather you'll nuke it when you flash/install another kernel like stock maemo kernel or powerkernel. To start other than stock maemo kernel via uBoot, you have to provide the according kernel image files, or http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=81613 Sep 27 08:06:55 What does it do? Sep 27 08:08:00 see the link? Sep 27 08:09:18 Are the Qole, Ruskie, Matan, 0xab still alive? Sep 27 08:09:31 haven't seen them on irc Sep 27 08:09:51 see the tmo user statistic pages for their last activity date Sep 27 08:09:58 I mean the repos Sep 27 08:10:13 same Sep 27 08:12:44 Ohh. uBoot has bootmenu too? Sep 27 08:12:56 can uboot and backupmenu co-exist? Sep 27 08:20:29 ebzzry: u-boot can practically coexist with anything. Sep 27 08:20:35 Maxdamantus: ok Sep 27 08:20:50 I think backupmenu is just within Linux, so it shouldn't clash. Sep 27 08:21:12 Are there must-have apps before, that are considered deprecated now, or maybe supplanted by other apps? Sep 27 08:21:25 u-boot is a bootloader that can be used to load a desired kernel with desired arguments and a desired initrd. Sep 27 08:22:15 "apps" :) Sep 27 08:29:32 Hm. I figured out how to remove the dialogue that pops up when you connect a USB cable: uninstall hildon-status-bar-usb Sep 27 08:30:26 but something else turns the screen on. Sep 27 08:30:30 * Maxdamantus suspects it's mce. Sep 27 08:36:47 Hm. Does `mce` just listen for commands from something else to toggle the display? Sep 27 08:38:01 If I disable the `display` module, the display doesn't turn on based on USB, but it doesn't turn on otherwise either. Sep 27 08:38:41 but something else seems to maintain a toggle for the input. Sep 27 08:39:18 so without mce turning the screen on/off, the input still toggles based on flicking the switch on the right, etc Sep 27 08:46:07 Maxdamantus: at some point you will have stripped out so much from maemo you'd be better of building your own mobile os Sep 27 08:47:14 I'd like to do that at some point. Sep 27 08:47:26 but it wouldn't necessarily be a "mobile os" Sep 27 08:48:02 it'd just be a system similar to the ones I already use, just slightly better optimised for a small device with a touchscreen and slightly reduced keyboard. Sep 27 08:48:19 aka maemo Sep 27 08:48:23 it's annoying trying to set all that up on my only phone though. Sep 27 08:48:35 Maemo isn't much like the other systems I use. Sep 27 08:48:55 it's probably more like it than other commercial phone OSes. Sep 27 08:49:47 N900 probably isn't much like the other PCs you use Sep 27 08:50:05 Why not? Sep 27 08:50:28 It's a box with a PCB inside that has a CPU and some other components. Sep 27 08:50:36 krhrhr Sep 27 08:50:55 that definition applies even to my microwave oven Sep 27 08:51:20 :) Sep 27 08:51:30 maybe if those components were useful enough and I could run Linux on the CPU, I'd want to spend more time on it. Sep 27 08:51:50 er, thought you said my microwave oven. Sep 27 08:51:53 nah, I'm already spending too much time on my oven Sep 27 08:51:57 there are fridges that are connected to the internet Sep 27 08:52:13 and coffee makers Sep 27 08:53:06 and vending machines Sep 27 08:53:11 Maxdamantus: there is hald plugin for detecting usb cable Sep 27 08:53:27 anyway, maemo is nice enough to be used as an os, but it has annoyances Sep 27 08:53:53 being old and not being able to upgrade it to recent libs is one of them Sep 27 08:53:55 freemangordon: so does mce look at that? Sep 27 08:54:01 yes. For example pukeaudio Sep 27 08:54:29 Maxdamantus: use the source Luke Sep 27 08:54:34 ~mce Sep 27 08:54:34 MCE = Machine Check Exception. Mode Control Entity Sep 27 08:54:37 hehe Sep 27 08:54:45 Yeah, got the source, looked at it for a few minutes. Sep 27 08:54:47 KotCzarny: amen to that Sep 27 08:54:49 ~listkeys mce Sep 27 08:54:51 Factoid search of 'mce' by key (11): #maemo mcebug ;; weathercode tlemcen zenata ;; mce ;; toolbox _delmcentries ;; toolbox _getmcentry ;; airport mce ;; toolbox _setmcentries ;; mcedit ;; weathercode kmce ;; weathercode mmce ;; weathercode mcentire air national guard weather facility base. Sep 27 08:55:06 KotCzarny: though, if people manage to get all the core parts open, you could theoretically port those parts Sep 27 08:55:12 to newer versions Sep 27 08:55:24 Wizzup: actually, we have most of the core parts open Sep 27 08:55:28 wizzup, kernel+glibc is a must Sep 27 08:55:54 iirc it is only PA modules and omap3camd that are show-stoppers Sep 27 08:55:58 KotCzarny: what about openssl? gnutls? support for newer crypto? openssh? :) Sep 27 08:56:09 freemangordon: right. Although cameras are not a necessary part of the 'open core' :-) Sep 27 08:56:23 neither is sound, but still Sep 27 08:56:26 freemangordon: so basically the -voice module? Sep 27 08:56:29 wizzup, do they rely on some n900 specific hw/libs? once you have recent glibs you can pretty much upgrade them too Sep 27 08:56:30 :nod: Sep 27 08:56:50 Wizzup: ^^^ Sep 27 08:56:58 KotCzarny: well, I'm not a debian-package expert, and I think it'll still entail quite some work Sep 27 08:57:01 freemangordon: ? Sep 27 08:57:06 Yeah. :) Sep 27 08:57:18 Wizzup: the ":nod:" was pointed to you Sep 27 08:57:19 Debian stable is still using an old-enough glibc. Sep 27 08:57:27 2.13 Sep 27 08:57:37 why would you want an old one? I don't get that. Sep 27 08:57:37 * Maxdamantus wonders when it's going to upgrade. Sep 27 08:57:55 To be honest, I'm much more a fan of the rolling distro idea. Sep 27 08:57:55 Because 2.14 doesn't support Linux 2.6.28 Sep 27 08:58:09 Packages get updates continually, but you can decide to stay at some older (more stable) versions fory ears Sep 27 08:58:10 freemangordon: thanks for the work on cssu-thumb, do you still use/maintain it? Sep 27 08:58:19 * Wizzup uses cssu-thumb Sep 27 08:58:32 Maxdamantus: if I had a choice I'd go for musl libc :) Sep 27 08:58:52 wizzup: i think l29ah tried using musl and had problems Sep 27 08:59:22 I use musl on several systems and it works, so I don't know what 'problems' means. But yeah, regardless Sep 27 08:59:49 KotCzarny: yes, recently I was very short on spare time and very tired, things are getting better now, so I'll issue a new update soon Sep 27 09:00:23 the question "do you use it" is pointless :) Sep 27 09:00:31 freemangordon: my suggestion is to recompile next few entries in top Sep 27 09:00:32 tomorrow mega-moon Sep 27 09:00:46 KotCzarny: like which? Sep 27 09:01:08 hmm, let me find the log Sep 27 09:01:12 ok Sep 27 09:01:25 DocScrutinizer05: tonight even, yeah :) Sep 27 09:01:26 I think I've found the line in mce to skip. Sep 27 09:01:30 'bloodmoon' :) Sep 27 09:01:40 * freemangordon is going to have some food Sep 27 09:05:18 * Maxdamantus wonders where to get hald-addon-bme-dev Sep 27 09:07:10 > freemangordon, would you find some time to recompile image-viewer, rtcom-call-ui, systemui ? and Sep 27 09:07:10 maybe browser* Sep 27 09:08:10 “it is in rx51-bme-replacement/hald-addon-bme repository” Sep 27 09:10:17 * Maxdamantus wonders where that is. Sep 27 09:11:03 http://logs.nslu2-linux.org/livelogs/maemo/maemo.20150602.txt Sep 27 09:11:06 regarding musl Sep 27 09:14:52 KotCzarny: browser is already recompiled Sep 27 09:15:02 systemui is some 20-30k binary iirc Sep 27 09:15:10 and closed source Sep 27 09:15:15 hmm, i just took few entries from the top Sep 27 09:15:19 the others are closed source as well Sep 27 09:15:29 image-viewer is closed? Sep 27 09:15:30 O.o Sep 27 09:15:35 yes Sep 27 09:16:37 maxd: https://gitorious.org/rx51-bme-replacement/hald-addon-bme/source Sep 27 09:16:53 KotCzarny: I totally forgot about that buildserver Sep 27 09:16:55 lrn2useTAB Sep 27 09:17:17 KotCzarny: does gitorious.org magically work for you, or have you not tried that link? Sep 27 09:17:23 doc: lrnthatsomepeopledontusesamesoftwareyoudo Sep 27 09:17:36 seen the archive.org move Sep 27 09:17:37 Anyway, I found it. Sep 27 09:17:53 the -dev package that is, not hald-addon-bme itself. Sep 27 09:18:11 (just need a single header file from that, I think) Sep 27 09:18:55 also, fwiw, I use QImageViewer, which I think provides a similar UI to the original one. Sep 27 09:19:09 but it seems to handle alternative directories better. Sep 27 09:19:25 actually, that's probably not what's invoked by other Maemo things that try to open images. Sep 27 09:20:34 I want to bind Fn+Left to Escape. How should I modify /usr/share/X11/xkb/symbols/nokia_vndr/rx-51? Sep 27 09:21:58 i think fn is the third field Sep 27 09:22:06 just see the example on letter a Sep 27 09:22:15 and compare which field maps to which combination Sep 27 09:22:18 KotCzarny: ok Sep 27 09:23:04 Yay, my mce modification does what I want. Sep 27 09:23:54 https://gist.github.com/Maxdamantus/d607903103bd63667fee Sep 27 09:24:19 cool Sep 27 09:24:27 make it configurable somehow? Sep 27 09:25:02 Maybe. Sep 27 09:25:04 but yeah, its kind of wrong place for that originally Sep 27 09:25:33 *sigh* Sep 27 09:30:39 popup dialog should disable tklock, not tklock itself Sep 27 09:30:47 usb popup, that is Sep 27 09:33:04 /usr/sbin/osso-usb-mass-storage-disable.sh Sep 27 09:35:03 That's not responsible for the dialogue or the display toggle. Sep 27 09:35:38 right. and nobody said it was. ke-recv-test at Sep 27 09:35:53 ke-recv isn't responsible either. Sep 27 09:36:07 right. and nobody said it was. Sep 27 09:37:25 mce isn't responsible either Sep 27 09:38:39 I guess poettering and dbus are responsible ;-P Sep 27 09:40:03 ~xy Sep 27 09:40:03 i heard xy is The XY problem: You want to do X, but don't know how. You think you can solve it using Y, but don't know how to do that, either. You ask about Y, which is a strange thing to want to do. Just ask about X. http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html#goal Sep 27 09:45:43 mce doesn't do it in reaction to anything to do with ke-recv. Sep 27 09:46:16 ebzzry: re: apps that's a difficult question to answer. Applications come and go, bugs are found maintainers disappear, this is Maemo. It's different from other well maintained distros. Sep 27 09:46:44 sixwheeledbeast: ok. Sep 27 09:47:15 sixwheeledbeast: what other well maintained mobile distros are there out there Sep 27 09:47:34 Maybe things would be slightly different if that project to move all the Maemo stuff into normal Debian were maintained. Sep 27 09:47:53 Maxdamantus: do it Sep 27 09:47:59 :) Sep 27 09:48:03 I think you're just preaching to the choir Sep 27 09:48:08 It's hard, and the software is old now. Sep 27 09:48:09 (also, would prefer it to be not just debian) Sep 27 09:48:14 the best advise it's to minimize your "widgetz" and becareful what you install always have a backup Sep 27 09:48:29 https://wiki.maemo.org/Maemo_on_Debian Sep 27 09:48:36 Linux distros obv. Sep 27 09:51:24 i think the only distro that can make phone calls on n900 is fremantle Sep 27 09:51:48 assuming you want audio. Sep 27 09:51:58 assume i want Sep 27 09:52:13 But what good is a phone call if you're unable to speak? Sep 27 09:52:16 and 99.999% of the people that want phone calls Sep 27 09:52:39 i can speak, but will they hear me? Sep 27 09:54:26 KotCzarny: I think that can be fixed/changed. Sep 27 09:54:40 As fmg stated, reverse engineering the -voice module will make a difference Sep 27 09:54:55 and since mainline also supports nokia modem + cmt_speech, with that module it should be possible to "make it work" Sep 27 09:55:01 And like the neo900 project would benefit too Sep 27 09:55:05 s/like/likely/ Sep 27 09:55:05 Wizzup meant: And likely the neo900 project would benefit too Sep 27 09:55:23 how so? Sep 27 09:55:40 if you want to run maemo on said device, the core pa part needs to be open iirc Sep 27 09:55:45 benefit from the porting of Maemo to Debian. Sep 27 09:55:53 no, that's not what I meant at all Sep 27 09:56:23 debian == dependency hell Sep 27 09:56:26 I meant that opening the pulse modules is essential to getting sound to work well there iirc (at least for maemo) Sep 27 09:56:30 you dont want debian on n900 Sep 27 09:56:37 Neo900 isn't going to require those pulse modules. Sep 27 09:56:53 * Wizzup wants a second opinion Sep 27 09:58:14 "porting of Maemo to Debian" err what? porting demian to linux first? Sep 27 09:58:23 debian even Sep 27 09:58:37 maemo *is* a debian system Sep 27 09:58:54 No. It's an apt system. Sep 27 09:59:08 It's not compatible with debian. Sep 27 09:59:14 no, it's a linux system Sep 27 09:59:46 how is maemo not compatible with debian?? Sep 27 10:00:07 It has its own system of packages independent from any of the Debian releases. Sep 27 10:00:07 I have tons of debian tools installed to maemo without a single patch applied to them Sep 27 10:00:14 Please don't argue stupid semantics. Maemo is based on debian. Sep 27 10:01:57 * DocScrutinizer05 idly wonders what's a "system of packages" Sep 27 10:04:01 DocScrutinizer05: you can't smoothly use Debian's repositories for their releases of .. Debian. Sep 27 10:04:26 tzz Sep 27 10:04:55 dpkg and apt don't imply Debian. Sep 27 10:05:08 pretty happy about that - otherwise we had damn systemd now Sep 27 10:05:21 +1 Sep 27 10:06:34 and of course I can use e.g. devuan's ARM repos to install arbitrary binaries to maemo Sep 27 10:06:58 for some reason I have apt and dpkg installed on Gentoo. Sep 27 10:07:06 as long as they don't conflict with libs Sep 27 10:07:22 Maxdamantus: it's in the repos (at least dpkg) Sep 27 10:07:35 # epm -qf `which apt` Sep 27 10:07:35 java-config-2.1.11-r1 Sep 27 10:07:37 O_o Sep 27 10:07:45 app-arch/dpkg Sep 27 10:08:11 Yeah, there's an actual package in portage for dpkg. Sep 27 10:08:21 which is often useful. Sep 27 10:08:33 lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 13 Nov 22 2010 /usr/bin/apt -> run-java-tool Sep 27 10:08:44 This `apt` thing is just weird though. Sep 27 10:09:01 ant ... apt ... only one char difference Sep 27 10:09:07 * Maxdamantus is removing java-config Sep 27 10:12:21 * DocScrutinizer05 suggests Angstrom aka openembedded, the "linux for microwave ovens". It already has everything removed, you can start tight away with the more interesting task of *adding* stuff again. Stuff like dedicated users - everything running under root on Angstrom Sep 27 10:12:50 right, even Sep 27 10:23:43 Apparently Ubuntu is based on an actual release of Debian. Sep 27 10:24:15 so it, unlike Maemo, really is a variant of Debian and not just another OS that happens to also use apt/dpkg. Sep 27 10:25:49 and debian doesn't really require systemd. Sep 27 10:27:03 systemd is just a piece of software that you can choose not to use. The repositories have something like sysvinit still, and possibly upstart. Sep 27 10:27:20 maemo **IS** based on debian!!! Sep 27 10:27:49 It's based on the package managers that Debian uses. Sep 27 10:27:51 Maxdamantus: maemo was made by taking a debian as base Sep 27 10:27:51 >>systemd is just a piece of software that you can choose not to use<< plain wrong, see devuan.org Sep 27 10:27:54 no, you're wrong Sep 27 10:27:57 It actually uses debian Sep 27 10:28:15 devuan sounds like a variant of debian. Sep 27 10:28:28 in the same sense of Ubuntu. Sep 27 10:28:45 Maxdamantus: step 1) take debian stable step 2) copy repos step 3) add maemo packages step 4) maemo was born Sep 27 10:28:46 aha Sep 27 10:28:53 interesting how that sounds Sep 27 10:29:54 ~systemd Sep 27 10:29:55 systemd cabal: a bunch of people (Lennart Poettering, Kay Sievers, Harald Hoyer, Daniel Mack, Tom Gundersen, David Herrmann) who want to turn linux into their wet dream perverted version of windows-me-too: http://0pointer.net/blog/revisiting-how-we-put-together-linux-systems.html -- Rumor has it that 2016 systemd will have replaced kernel, or see https://devuan.org http://without-systemd.org/wiki/index.php/Arguments_against_systemd Sep 27 10:29:58 its not debian in the sense debian is a trademark hold by some group Sep 27 10:30:51 it's not Debian in an additional sense, which Ubuntu is. Sep 27 10:31:06 *plonk* Sep 27 10:31:13 *held Sep 27 10:31:38 and i can have debian tools in slackware/gentoo etc, which doesnt make them debian Sep 27 10:32:06 debian is a system which is installed from specified official repos packaged by debian team Sep 27 10:32:27 Yes, and that's what Ubuntu is too. Sep 27 10:32:47 ubuntu repackages debian stuff Sep 27 10:32:47 but not Maemo. Its base set of packages aren't from Debian. Sep 27 10:32:59 BULLSHIT Sep 27 10:35:13 if you take debian os and package it your own way you cant call it debian Sep 27 10:35:22 (trademark) Sep 27 10:35:33 Maxdamantus: it really is, though Sep 27 10:35:38 apt-get source libc6 Sep 27 10:35:44 look at the changelog. Sep 27 10:35:59 but honestly who except you cares? when you want debian, usedebian! maybe wen you ask nicely, they even will host maemo on their repo and so fullfill your dream of "porting maemo to debian" Sep 27 10:36:11 Does it look like it's gone through the history of Debian maintanance? Sep 27 10:36:25 maemo *is* a debian system Sep 27 10:36:44 * Start debianised version glibc-2005q3-1 from CodeCourcery. Sep 27 10:36:44 -- Yauheni Kaliuta Wed, 11 Jan 2006 17:22:25 +0900 Sep 27 10:36:48