**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sat Apr 16 02:59:58 2016 Apr 16 03:00:04 this approach should work as long as the target process is susceptible to running under GDB monitor Apr 16 03:01:08 IOW as long as the tracee is ptrace-enabled Apr 16 03:04:27 afaik only one tracer can get attached to a tracee at any given time Apr 16 03:05:08 so this excludes traced processes from the set of valid candidates for swapfd Apr 16 03:05:57 some nasty programs may do tricks like tracing themselves to blocj RE via gdb and the like Apr 16 03:06:08 iirc skype is such a nasty candidate Apr 16 03:06:58 anyway the ptrace approach seems sound Apr 16 03:07:17 regardless of the implementation details Apr 16 03:07:32 and yes, way more portable and generic Apr 16 03:10:38 you probably can just ptraqce_attach to target, close($fd); open($fd, "new/path/to/file") and detach - well you should check the filehandle options that the original open() used, I guess Apr 16 03:12:21 I think the only option you might want to maintain would be CLOEXEC. Apr 16 03:12:29 there are some "details" to take care, like mmap() instead of open() etc Apr 16 03:12:32 also, open is only one way to create an fd. Apr 16 03:12:41 :-D ^^^ Apr 16 03:13:32 I'd expect it to actually open /proc/$swapfd/fd/$x Apr 16 03:13:34 I wonder if mmap is a simple fd on /proc level. prolly should be Apr 16 03:13:48 so that you can do things like that first command I gave. Apr 16 03:13:58 swapfd 1234 1 >(blah) Apr 16 03:14:14 yeah, makes sense, as long as we talk about write-only FDs Apr 16 03:14:17 (`>(blah)` is some bash syntax) Apr 16 03:14:34 I know that syntax Apr 16 03:15:28 write-only would already be a great tool, much better than what we got now (zilch) :-D Apr 16 03:15:52 read-only is similarly simple I guess Apr 16 03:16:07 read-write is a tad more involved Apr 16 03:16:53 and with pipes like you use them in that command, positioning the write pointer gets tricky too :-) Apr 16 03:17:05 fds are usually considered to be read or write anyway, not both. Apr 16 03:17:14 except with files. Apr 16 03:17:23 yep Apr 16 03:17:30 of course Apr 16 03:18:04 but even reading and writing to the same file fd is reasonably uncommon. Apr 16 03:18:41 sorry, reconnect Apr 16 03:18:51 15:18:03 < Maxdamantus> but even reading and writing to the same file fd is reasonably uncommon. Apr 16 03:18:54 in case you didn't see it. Apr 16 03:19:04 ta Apr 16 03:19:21 really time for a nap Apr 16 03:19:23 o/ Apr 16 10:28:10 i've advanced a little bit with the port to libwa Apr 16 10:28:27 it's not much, to be honest, but it's enough to see a little spot of light at the end of the tunnel Apr 16 10:28:34 it now seems at least feasible Apr 16 10:29:08 is your api properly separated into frontend--backend ? Apr 16 10:29:24 so-so Apr 16 10:29:37 improve that separation while you are at it? Apr 16 10:29:37 when i finish the port to libwa, it'll be Apr 16 10:29:49 yes, i'm basically forced to do it Apr 16 10:29:58 as libwa does less things than yappari-wa Apr 16 10:30:06 but it does them better Apr 16 10:30:06 :) Apr 16 10:30:17 for example, yappari-wa was in charge of storing logs Apr 16 10:30:35 so once i finish porting to libwa, there'll be nobody to store logs Apr 16 10:30:42 so i'll have to do that in a separate module Apr 16 10:30:43 how long is the ban, btw Apr 16 10:30:56 it's a bit more work, but it'll be better in the end Apr 16 10:30:57 24 to 120h Apr 16 10:30:59 depends Apr 16 10:31:04 three months i think Apr 16 10:31:22 3 months is a little bit more than 5 days Apr 16 10:31:24 nope, i think it's 60 days Apr 16 10:31:32 let me check Apr 16 10:31:42 i guess they have different bans available Apr 16 10:31:46 there was a time when they banned for 24 hours users of whatsapp plus Apr 16 10:31:56 but nowadays they just ban you for good Apr 16 10:31:59 for different 'offenses' Apr 16 10:32:06 yes Apr 16 10:32:12 but i think it's almost always the longest one Apr 16 10:32:28 60 days, confirmed Apr 16 10:32:40 that's the longest i've ever seen Apr 16 10:32:52 60 days < 3 months Apr 16 10:32:59 yes, i was mistaken Apr 16 10:33:01 it's two months Apr 16 10:50:43 DocScrutinizer05: what kind of video out port(s) are on the Neo900? Apr 16 10:51:37 isnt that a question more suiteable for #neo900 ? Apr 16 10:52:22 less traffic there i guess and he snoops that channels more closely Apr 16 10:52:52 didn't know it existed Apr 16 10:53:19 (also brushing against the channel limit) Apr 16 10:53:25 :) Apr 16 12:10:19 DocScrutinizer05: i just took off the batlog.txt. it discharged over night and the calibration script finished. http://sprunge.us/jhYJ LMD now 1431 Apr 16 13:34:45 guys Apr 16 13:34:47 sup Apr 16 13:34:52 anyone uses encfs on maemo? Apr 16 13:46:50 Luke-Jr: CVBS and USB Apr 16 13:48:10 DocScrutinizer05: is USB video out different from standard USB host? Apr 16 13:49:07 no Apr 16 13:49:23 CVBS is with the same video-out connector N900 had? Apr 16 13:52:43 yes Apr 16 13:53:58 DocScrutinizer05: also, am I interpreted https://my.neo900.org/index.php?id_product=1&controller=product&id_lang=1 correctly? 480 EUR is 40% of the total price of 1200 EUR? Apr 16 13:54:38 possible, yes Apr 16 13:58:16 see http://neo900.org/estimate Apr 16 14:03:21 DocScrutinizer05: so 900-1200 EUR basically; or is the lower estimate there not including the N900 parts? Apr 16 14:03:38 exactly Apr 16 14:03:59 which? Apr 16 14:05:51 both Apr 16 14:06:35 990 for NeoN, + ~150 for N900 Apr 16 14:06:43 and mounting etc Apr 16 14:08:32 and when we could sell 5000 (like pyra prolly does) instead of 500, we could cut a 300 off from that Apr 16 14:09:58 a 300 bucks that is Apr 16 14:14:55 apropos pyra and video-out: pyra using omap5 which supports digital video, something that omap3 doesn't Apr 16 14:18:01 yeah, expected that Apr 16 14:19:05 DocScrutinizer05: no ETA yet for Neo900, right? Apr 16 14:19:22 It says Q32016 on the page Apr 16 14:19:28 oh Apr 16 14:19:59 well, Q3 is optimistic, 2016 is honest Apr 16 14:20:57 * Luke-Jr puts "No earlier than July" ☺ Apr 16 14:21:03 https://www.pyra-handheld.com/wiki/index.php?title=Comparison_Chart FWIW Apr 16 14:21:18 if and only if we can find another few hundred customers, we're not at our feasibility level yet Apr 16 14:21:51 ooh nice :-) Apr 16 14:22:08 isn't cooperation with the pyra guys feasible? Apr 16 14:22:53 to increase component reutilization Apr 16 14:22:56 pyra has same touchscreen like Neo900 Apr 16 14:22:57 or whatever Apr 16 14:23:24 an issue for Pyra right now is min. order of 500 for each of the modems.. Apr 16 14:23:39 apparently ED isn't expecting >500 of each 4G model for some reason O.o Apr 16 14:23:42 that comparison chart says a different thing Apr 16 14:23:53 Neo900 has a 3 LEDs on side of KBD for shiftlock, modem-active and whatever Apr 16 14:24:52 what's "Dvorak impossible"?? Apr 16 14:25:40 ceene: ? Apr 16 14:25:52 DocScrutinizer05: not physically possible to align the keys for Dvorak Apr 16 14:25:52 how much is the Pyra? Apr 16 14:25:59 you can have whatever keymapping you like, just the writing on keymat won't magically change, you need to blindtype or manually change the writing like on 99.99999% of other kbds Apr 16 14:26:13 DocScrutinizer05: the LEDs: colour or binary? Apr 16 14:26:22 err? Apr 16 14:26:43 DocScrutinizer05: Dvorak has the middle row far to the left of the bottom row; N900's keyboard doesn't have that many keys wide Apr 16 14:26:57 ok Apr 16 14:27:01 [14:23:53] Neo900 has a 3 LEDs on side of KBD for shiftlock, modem-active and whatever <-- are these single colour or RGB? Apr 16 14:27:03 now that makes sense Apr 16 14:27:27 actually I think they are RGB, need to look tbh Apr 16 14:27:44 DocScrutinizer05: any idea about my battery log data? Apr 16 14:27:56 Linkandzelda: URLß Apr 16 14:28:00 ? Apr 16 14:28:05 DocScrutinizer05: http://sprunge.us/jhYJ Apr 16 14:28:20 calibration finished, im running it again Apr 16 14:28:40 ending LMD was 1431 now instead of 16xx Apr 16 14:30:03 I'd say your battery has around 1100 to 1200mAh Apr 16 14:30:33 can't tell for sure since the discharge starts at 77%, not 100% Apr 16 14:31:14 DocScrutinizer05: on the side of the kb is underneath the face when closed? or way over to the side? (which side?) Apr 16 14:31:16 i see Apr 16 14:32:56 so, no one uses encfs :/ Apr 16 14:33:10 those 3 LEDs are probably left to kbd and not visible when kbd closed. We have a planned 2 pattern LEDs on the two device lower corners visoble from 180° to 270° around device no matter if device sits on display or back Apr 16 14:34:51 Luke-Jr: you know we just have the drivers to control them just like the indicator LED in N900, and we got that spacerframe that literally asks for intergratinf LEDs into it Apr 16 14:35:34 and visibility of indicator LED never was really great Apr 16 14:35:48 DocScrutinizer05: the N900 LED is fairly well-positioned inside the N810 case BTW Apr 16 14:36:01 antranigv: well I use luks Apr 16 14:36:02 yes, sort of like N810 Apr 16 14:36:15 but 2 corners, not 1 Apr 16 14:36:51 NIN101: on N900? o.O Apr 16 14:36:55 DocScrutinizer05: so with a new battery having 1320mah, is it worth getting a fresh one? Apr 16 14:37:02 antranigv: yes Apr 16 14:37:10 Linkandzelda: I'd say prolly not Apr 16 14:37:24 NIN101: any instructions? Apr 16 14:37:43 https://n900.quitesimple.org/crypto/encrypted_home/ Apr 16 14:37:56 NIN101: love you 0_0 <3 Apr 16 14:38:10 but it's rather difficult (annyoin /time consuming) to set up Apr 16 14:49:20 NIN101: I'll give it a try on one of my N900s Apr 16 14:53:11 well, i've replaced yappari's registration code with the one on libwa Apr 16 14:53:22 now, that's the easy part, because that's a pretty small module Apr 16 14:53:45 but at least i've verified that the build system is working, linking and that the basics are fine Apr 16 14:54:16 issue now is that i think it's mandatory now the newprotocol Apr 16 14:59:04 ok, on with the comparision chart Apr 16 14:59:51 Luke-Jr: kbd backlight: YES (RGB) Apr 16 15:02:02 interesting Apr 16 15:02:09 Luke-Jr: Primary Operating System ... well, maemo? Devuan bare bones BSP incl factory test programs and installer wizard? Apr 16 15:02:52 DocScrutinizer05: what's it ship with? website said Debian :p Apr 16 15:03:07 it should already say Devuan Apr 16 15:03:25 it however say nothing about armhf Apr 16 15:03:26 cool, cuz Debian sucks now ;) Apr 16 15:03:42 it says BSP Apr 16 15:07:35 Luke-Jr: afaik pyra and Neo900 use identiacal WLAN/BT module Apr 16 15:07:37 ok, so change to Devuan..? anything else? Apr 16 15:07:53 fremantle compatibility Apr 16 15:08:08 afaik this module can't do ac Apr 16 15:08:20 http://neo900.org/stuff/block-diagrams/neo900/neo900.html Apr 16 15:08:39 DocScrutinizer05: The WiLink8? Apr 16 15:08:45 yup Apr 16 15:09:42 * Luke-Jr wonders if he misunderstood https://pyra-handheld.com/boards/threads/gpd-is-going-to-release-an-x86-console-palmtop-computer.76762/page-27#post-1370758 Apr 16 15:11:02 we also use same modem module 8though Neo900 offers more variants) which means GNSS is also identical, though the Neo900 one has additional safeguard to block GNSS Apr 16 15:11:55 upgrade: Via USB in battery compartment Apr 16 15:12:54 that's there already ;) Apr 16 15:13:09 s/USB/HackerBus/ Apr 16 15:13:17 (although hns was curious how you managed to get a 3rd USB port on OMAP3) Apr 16 15:13:26 oh Apr 16 15:14:50 high power draw: 4..5h Apr 16 15:15:23 s/hotswap/warmswap/ Apr 16 15:16:26 we don't do the hotswap anymore, too much effort and we got suspend-to-disk meanwhile so we suspend device and then swap battery. The hotswap trick is maybe still working but not officially supported/warranted Apr 16 15:17:05 suspend-to-disk means it's not really Neo900-specific then? Apr 16 15:17:16 USB: micrio-AB Apr 16 15:17:59 What is Micro-AB? O.o Apr 16 15:18:06 well, it's not completely Neo900 specific, though our complete hw allows to do suspend to disk, which isn't warranted for arbitrary other platforms Apr 16 15:20:11 NFC: YES Apr 16 15:21:09 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USB#/media/File:USB_Micro-AB_receptacle.svg Apr 16 15:22:18 that's it I guess Apr 16 15:23:14 no battery life during usage claim? :P Apr 16 15:23:57 err Apr 16 15:24:28 https://pyra-handheld.com/boards/threads/gpd-is-going-to-release-an-x86-console-palmtop-computer.76762/page-27#post-1370758 chip is nonsensical, 802.11a is 5GHz and fine Apr 16 15:24:58 ac is multichannel and possibly even spread over both bands 2.4 and 5 iirc Apr 16 15:25:43 http://www.ti.com/lit/ds/symlink/wl1837mod.pdf Apr 16 15:26:48 WLAN Baseband Processor and RF Transceiver Support of IEEE Std 802.11a, 802.11b, 802.11g, and 802.11n 20- and 40-MHz SISO and 20-MHz 2 × 2 MIMO at 2.4 GHz for High Throughput: 80 Mbps (TCP), 100 Mbps (UDP) 2.4-GHz MRC Support for Extended Range and 5-GHz Diversity Capable Apr 16 15:27:50 (( no battery life during usage claim? :P)) ??? Apr 16 15:28:29 I don''t see anything except >>Battery life (claimed, high power draw)<< Apr 16 15:28:34 I answered that Apr 16 15:29:04 you did? Apr 16 15:29:08 though I think "high power draw" is not the typical usecase for Neo900 Apr 16 15:29:30 oh Apr 16 15:29:30 we rather brag with 10 days standby Apr 16 15:30:36 and over 24h with light use Apr 16 15:31:58 wich actually brings the conceptual differneces between Neo900 and Pyra to the point like nothing else does Apr 16 15:32:06 1320mAh is correct? any idea what voltage? Apr 16 15:32:14 the usual Apr 16 15:32:18 I guess users can put any battery in Apr 16 15:32:20 it's LiIon Apr 16 15:32:40 yes, you can connect arbitrary LiIon to HB Apr 16 15:32:52 will you be shipping with any battery? Apr 16 15:34:36 of course! standard Bl-5J Apr 16 15:34:41 BL Apr 16 15:34:58 or compatible Apr 16 15:35:12 whatever we can source and is decent Apr 16 15:36:30 did the side-of-kb LEDs turn out to be RGB? Apr 16 15:36:37 or just the backlight? Apr 16 15:36:45 (nik wondered where we got the 3rd USB) well, OMAP3 has 1 OTG and 2 host USB interfaces Apr 16 15:37:14 "OMAP3 has up to USB 3 ports (according to the data sheet). One is used for the OTG port. The next one needs an external controller chip and is needed for the 3G/4G module. And the third one is not available through pinmux or only if the second one is not high speed. So to my knowledge there are only 2 ports and no spare one." Apr 16 15:39:09 lemme check (http://neo900.org/stuff/eaglefiles/proto_v2/3-2015-09-09/Neo900_no-vectorfonts.pdf)... Apr 16 15:39:36 p33 sheet29 Apr 16 15:39:58 indicator and 2 corner LEDs Apr 16 15:40:13 * Luke-Jr pokes KDE for not liking neo900.org Apr 16 15:41:02 next page (34) MOD 3 momocrome LEDs left to KBD Apr 16 15:42:02 err ooops, seems we picked a single RGB for that Apr 16 15:42:30 so 1 RGB on face, and 1 RGB on left side of kb? Apr 16 15:42:36 and 1 RBG kb backlight Apr 16 15:42:40 kbd are backlight LEDs Apr 16 15:42:58 I don't know how to read schematics btw Apr 16 15:44:07 well, let me count: we got: indicator LED and 2 AUX (corner) LEDs which are RGB and can do patterns like N900 Apr 16 15:45:26 then we got 6 RGB backlight (KBD) LEDs, each individually controllable in color and brightness (N900 has 6 white LEDs for that) Apr 16 15:46:22 then one more RGB LED plain visible at left side of kbd Apr 16 15:46:38 hm Apr 16 15:46:47 and one RGB privacy LED which replaces the red-only LED at camera lens Apr 16 15:47:06 the 3 face LEDs are all independent, or share the same signal? Apr 16 15:47:19 which ones? Apr 16 15:47:19 * Luke-Jr not sure he was aware of the red LED O.o Apr 16 15:47:23 [15:44:07] well, let me count: we got: indicator LED and 2 AUX (corner) LEDs which are RGB and can do patterns like N900 Apr 16 15:47:35 those are completely independant Apr 16 15:47:50 all our LEDs are "solitaire" Apr 16 15:48:10 except the display backlight white ones Apr 16 15:48:28 backlight has RGB *and* white ones? Apr 16 15:48:32 no Apr 16 15:48:38 DISPLAY Apr 16 15:48:42 oh Apr 16 15:48:54 forgot that even existed XD Apr 16 15:48:58 hehe Apr 16 15:49:01 hmm, there isnt a GSM-free neo900? Apr 16 15:49:11 i thought it was a privacy oriented platform :D Apr 16 15:49:13 FSM-free? Apr 16 15:49:18 ok, so Notification LEDS: 3 RGB LEDs on the face, 1 on left side of keyboard (not visible when closed) Apr 16 15:49:20 GSM even Apr 16 15:49:27 no we always need finite state machines DocScrutinizer05 :D Apr 16 15:49:31 And Keyboard Backlight: Yes (6 RGB LEDs) Apr 16 15:49:54 buZz: Neo900 allows you to power off the GSM, IIRC Apr 16 15:50:14 why would i buy a car with a gun, only to disable the gun Apr 16 15:50:18 Luke-Jr: yep when 'on the face' means 'surface'. 2 are on case corners Apr 16 15:50:45 so actually on the corner, ok Apr 16 15:50:49 why would you buy a car? Apr 16 15:51:02 yeah good point Apr 16 15:51:10 so Notif LEDs: 3 RGB LEDs on the display (2 visible from the sides), 1 on left side of keyboard (not visible when closed) Apr 16 15:51:21 yes Apr 16 15:51:33 er wait Apr 16 15:52:20 we got N900 indicator LED plus 2 new ones in case corners (360° visoble), then we got a little one left side of kbd Apr 16 15:52:31 so 4 LEDs Apr 16 15:52:34 right Apr 16 15:52:54 plus privacy LED Apr 16 15:53:02 buzz: because you want to hide under the radar Apr 16 15:53:08 the litthe formerly red light next to main camera lens Apr 16 15:53:19 now also RGB Apr 16 15:53:22 how do I turn the red light on? O.o Apr 16 15:53:38 i just dont wanna support systems i want to take no part in :) Apr 16 15:54:01 buZz: welcome, and thanks for the constructive contributions Apr 16 15:54:18 DocScrutinizer05: oh, in the middle of the torch? Apr 16 15:54:32 Luke-Jr: you lost me Apr 16 15:54:37 the red light Apr 16 15:54:42 yes Apr 16 15:54:58 between the 2 big white flash LEDs Apr 16 15:55:02 i guess i need to stick to N800/N810 then :/ sad Apr 16 15:55:32 you can always desolder modem chip from n900 Apr 16 15:55:33 yes, a N900 successor is no valid replacement for N810 Apr 16 15:55:40 if that wasn't obvious yet Apr 16 15:55:58 i really wish ppl would just make PDAs again :( Apr 16 15:56:07 when you don't like N900 you won't like Neo900 either Apr 16 15:56:20 buZz: Pyra will have a modem-free model, and there's GPD Win Apr 16 15:56:36 Luke-Jr: ah cool, didnt see that yet (@ modemfree) Apr 16 15:56:40 Neo900 can also be ordered without any modem Apr 16 15:56:50 ah it can? also didnt see that Apr 16 15:56:55 which is why i asked Apr 16 15:56:56 just don't hope for substantial savings from this Apr 16 15:57:32 if money was a motivation i wouldnt be looking at neo900/pyra at all ;) Apr 16 15:57:43 fair point Apr 16 15:57:58 buZz: Neo900 get built to order Apr 16 15:58:28 DocScrutinizer05: look good now? Apr 16 15:58:35 lemme F5 Apr 16 15:58:44 * Luke-Jr throws "Optional" on Neo900 modem Apr 16 15:59:03 make it 'option: modem free' Apr 16 15:59:42 pyra still lacks a dualtouch r-ts like Neo900 got Apr 16 16:00:07 Pyra uses "our" chip ;-) Apr 16 16:00:24 * Luke-Jr fixes Apr 16 16:01:21 now if only someone would fork Pyra and add the Neo900-exclusive features to it.. :p Apr 16 16:01:44 LEDs look good enough, though "on display" is a tad missleading since the corner two are in main body spacerframe Apr 16 16:02:12 so when kb and display separate, they stay with the kb half? Apr 16 16:02:14 so basicaly above stylus and symmetrically on left side Apr 16 16:02:20 yes Apr 16 16:03:07 on the lower left and right corner/edhe of device Apr 16 16:03:14 Total 5 RGB LEDs: 1 on the display; 2 on the sides; 1 on left side of keyboard (not visible when closed)
1 on the rear above the camera (between the flash LEDs; visible only when camera open) Apr 16 16:03:27 YES!! :-) Apr 16 16:05:25 BT is identical between Pyra and Neo Apr 16 16:05:39 http://www.ti.com/lit/ds/symlink/wl1837mod.pdf Apr 16 16:06:37 do you have some way to get FM & NFC off that, or use a separate chip? Apr 16 16:06:58 3.7V vs 4.2V -- this is just nominal vs maximal voltage of a standard LiIon cell Apr 16 16:07:41 we got separate chip for FM, and a very unique and versatile NFC subsystem of our own design Apr 16 16:07:58 designed by Werner Almesberger Apr 16 16:08:09 (with a little 'help' by me) Apr 16 16:08:10 seems like the wl1837mod *should* have FM on the chip, but it's disabled I guess Apr 16 16:08:34 We'll check that Apr 16 16:08:55 if we can use it, we will Apr 16 16:09:21 I didn't see any mainline kernel code for it at least Apr 16 16:09:26 unless effort is lower with a separate FM-TX/RX chip Apr 16 16:09:53 that sounds likely if you already have a separate chip done Apr 16 16:10:00 again, check our *very* nice blockdiagram! Apr 16 16:10:02 ~bd Apr 16 16:10:03 [bd] Bangladesh Apr 16 16:10:07 lol infobot Apr 16 16:10:09 ~#neo900 bd Apr 16 16:10:10 methinks #neo900 bd is http://neo900.org/stuff/block-diagrams/neo900/neo900.html the very fine and detailled Block Diagram, or http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=1445200#post1445200 Apr 16 16:10:40 makes me wonder why we don't have this chat in #neo900 instead of here where it's rather OT Apr 16 16:10:59 now we're almost done so nm Apr 16 16:11:18 whoa, Neo900 has dual SIM? Apr 16 16:11:21 which software has that diagram been made with? Apr 16 16:11:39 Luke-Jr: (block diagram) you get all the datasheets from there, just a mouseclick away Apr 16 16:11:52 Luke-Jr: yep, 'dual' SIM Apr 16 16:12:04 ceene: ask wpwrak Apr 16 16:12:14 ceene: /join #neo900 Apr 16 16:13:55 ceene: (dual SIM) depending on what modem might support in future with a firmware update, we might support dual SIM dual standby, for now we canonly support SIM swap. Plus you can use either of both slots as smartcard reeader muutually exclusive to modem SIM Apr 16 16:43:48 well, so it seems that the guy from Chat-API which implements WA protocol on PHP lives also here in Madri Apr 16 16:44:00 :) Apr 16 16:44:03 s/Madri/Madrid Apr 16 16:44:15 beer coding session? Apr 16 16:44:37 probably, yeah Apr 16 16:44:51 he's almost studied on the same building as me Apr 16 16:44:53 lol Apr 16 16:45:00 he's done the shorter grade Apr 16 16:45:05 small world Apr 16 16:45:11 but we're profession colleagues Apr 16 17:51:06 offtopic but funny: http://i.imgur.com/pTYT70h.png Apr 16 18:08:15 Hi. Apr 16 18:08:37 * APic is going to buy a spare N900 from a Friend. How can he securely erase all his private Data, but leave the Device flashable for me? Apr 16 18:09:46 just do full flash ? Apr 16 18:10:04 there's a thing in settings, isn't it Apr 16 18:10:06 run rescueos and do dd ? Apr 16 18:10:14 idk if it makes it a "secure" erase though Apr 16 18:10:36 unless he works in data forensics simple dd writing zeroes over the emmc is enough in any case Apr 16 18:13:55 ~tell apic about flashing-cmdline Apr 16 18:16:07 when you want to make sure, do a dd if=/dev/urandom of=/home/user/xxx; rm /home/user/xxx; dd if=/dev/urandom of=/home/user/MyDocs/xxx; rm /home/user/MyDocs/xxx Apr 16 18:16:32 *after* flashing Apr 16 18:17:03 Thanks. Apr 16 18:17:08 yw Apr 16 18:17:11 B-) Apr 16 18:18:13 /dev/urandom is SLOW Apr 16 18:23:23 you could do (ls -lR /; cat /home/user/xxx)|dd of=/home/user/xxx to speed up Apr 16 18:24:47 particularls for /home/user/MyDocs/xxx instead of /home/user/xxx which otherwise will take quite a while via dev/urandom Apr 16 18:25:28 full flash should be enough, if there are any files in mydocs remaining, just delete them Apr 16 18:26:47 APic: most definetely do not do dd if=/dev/whatever of=/path/to/file without a count= Apr 16 18:28:00 Ok Apr 16 18:28:02 Thanks Apr 16 18:28:54 boot from rescueOS, zero out the emmc, then flash both COMBINED and VANILLA Apr 16 18:31:53 DAMN Apr 16 18:31:58 i see hotpixel on my lappy Apr 16 18:31:59 :/ Apr 16 18:32:12 my life is ruined :/ Apr 16 18:32:17 kerio: yes, he shall do exactly that Apr 16 18:32:35 do dd until no more room on storage left Apr 16 18:32:48 APic: ignore that Apr 16 18:32:49 now that i look.. 4 of them Apr 16 18:33:10 Ok Apr 16 18:33:13 APic: what you should NOT do is "zero out the eMMC" Apr 16 18:33:14 KotCzarny: rip Apr 16 18:34:59 wth, 6 Apr 16 18:35:31 display a checkerboard pattern fullscreen Apr 16 18:35:41 or a solid color i guess Apr 16 18:35:52 checkerboard would make them easier to spot Apr 16 18:35:54 could be i just didnt look at the screen closely before Apr 16 18:36:07 1680x1050 is quite high dpi Apr 16 18:36:14 (for 15") Apr 16 18:44:42 APic: for two reasons: you shouldn't write brute force to the device anyway, and for sure not all zeros since that might get optimized out by the eMMC's contrller and not result in any real write Apr 16 18:47:18 after you did fill the complete storage with one file with pseudo random data (not all zeros), you can optimize the eMMC again by doing exactly that: write all zeros to a file until storage full, then delete the file Apr 16 18:48:13 this will possibly tell the controller that the flash pages are unused Apr 16 18:48:26 unlikely but possible Apr 16 18:48:42 Ok Apr 16 18:48:51 still, overthinking Apr 16 18:48:59 your chances are better on the vfat fs than on any other Apr 16 18:48:59 remove the files then do full flash Apr 16 18:49:12 either the controller knows about all zeroes and will just mark the pages as unused or it doesn't know about all zeroes and will just write them Apr 16 18:49:24 but by marking the pages as unused you'll still obtain the desired result Apr 16 18:49:36 and most definetely you need to do that on the whole device anyway, not on a single partition Apr 16 18:49:40 or the controller knows about vfat and optinizes Apr 16 18:49:45 because the controller doesn't split the device in partitions Apr 16 18:50:46 also, 'controller optimizing' would mean that you get meaningful data on read, still, you would get all zeros. so as i said, unless you are doing forensic flash data retrieval as a work/hobby, no point in overthinking Apr 16 18:50:49 good point, make that dd if=/dev/urandom of=/home/user/xxx; dd if=/dev/urandom of=/home/user/MyDocs/xxx; rm /home/user/MyDocs/xxx; rm /home/user/xxx; Apr 16 18:51:13 still no need to use urandom but ok Apr 16 18:51:24 and you forgot about the swap, which is probably even more critical Apr 16 18:51:33 considering that private material ends up there all the time Apr 16 18:51:37 no, you also could use /dev/one Apr 16 18:51:59 surely it depends on the innards of the controller Apr 16 18:52:02 what about fingerprints on the screen? Apr 16 18:52:08 deleted nand pages appear as 0xff, not 0x00 Apr 16 18:52:11 dna samples in keyboard? Apr 16 18:52:17 KotCzarny: eeew Apr 16 18:52:22 what do YOU do with your n900 Apr 16 18:52:28 I didn't forget about swap, I considered it safe enough and likely enough to get corrupted for all but the most security relevant purposes Apr 16 18:52:51 kerio, i assume you are treating n900 with white gloves, eh? Apr 16 18:53:04 ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°) Apr 16 18:54:07 (use dev/one (which doesn't exist)) or do what I suggested to speedup Apr 16 18:54:44