**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Fri Nov 17 03:00:03 2017 Nov 17 03:17:54 Is Mugen alive? http://mugen.co/mugen-power-nokia-n900-2400mah-extended-replacement-battery-with-battery-door.html Nov 17 03:43:06 Am I correct in saying that there are only three phones capable of running Maemo/Mer/MeeGo/Sailfish, having a camera and a hardware keyboard: Nokia N900, Nokia N950 and Jolla+TOHkeyboard ? Nov 17 03:43:52 Because Nokia N900 isn't quite compatible with Telstra network in Australia, and my cellular provider recommends switching to a different device. Nov 17 07:23:20 https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/348544204072288257/380981105232314368/screenshot00.png Nov 17 07:23:26 silly keepassx Nov 17 07:25:17 change your theme to eat less button space Nov 17 07:26:34 What package provides perl module File::Temp ? it was on my n900 before os reinstall. Seems something was removed from repos since then Nov 17 07:26:55 I'm using one of the default themes Nov 17 07:27:01 which one do you suggest Nov 17 07:28:16 I'm also using an application to make fonts smaller Nov 17 07:28:46 no wait, it's set on default Nov 17 07:29:20 Font Changer Nov 17 07:36:58 Oksanaa: I guess that the Neo900 meets your critera too? Nov 17 07:37:40 s/critera/criteria/ Nov 17 07:37:40 brolin_empey meant: Oksanaa: I guess that the Neo900 meets your criteria too? Nov 17 07:38:08 s/// Nov 17 07:38:19 s/s// Nov 17 07:38:19 brolin_empey meant: Okanaa: I guess that the Neo900 meets your critera too? Nov 17 07:38:44 s/ // Nov 17 07:38:45 brolin_empey meant: Oksanaa:I guess that the Neo900 meets your critera too? Nov 17 08:26:44 https://wiki.maemo.org/Remapping_keyboard/user_vis_awesome_kbdmapping Nov 17 08:26:54 >ALWAYS TEST to ensure you have done it right BEFORE rebooting or you WILL end up with an unbootable system. Nov 17 08:27:10 so tempting, so scary Nov 17 08:28:35 One of the reasons why you should set up an alternative boot sequence to get into a system where you can fix this sort of stuff. Nov 17 08:31:39 that, or playing scorched earth on fault :P Nov 17 08:32:24 so, about this alternate boot sequence... Nov 17 08:35:38 there is always rescueos Nov 17 08:36:19 That's the obvious one. Nov 17 08:38:04 I don't use the ubifs on NAND for the normal OS, so I basically use that as a pseudo-initramfs when booting normally, or to a shell using a 3.14 kernel. Nov 17 08:39:19 ~resqueos Nov 17 08:39:51 ~rescueos Nov 17 08:39:51 hmm... rescueos is http://n900.quitesimple.org/rescueOS/ Nov 17 08:40:38 Is it feasible to run the OS from the internal SD card? Then you could easily access the OS installation from another computer by removing the SD card if the OS installation will not boot on the N900. Nov 17 08:41:26 requires os scripts changes Nov 17 08:41:45 because there are quite a few assumptions what happens with sdcard Nov 17 08:41:56 ie. when back cover is removed Nov 17 08:42:05 or mounting partitions Nov 17 08:42:27 The back cover issue requires a replacement of the mmc kernel module. Nov 17 08:42:55 I think there is a version of keepass with the buttons changed to fit N900 better somewhere. Nov 17 08:42:56 so while it is doable, expect gotchas Nov 17 08:43:13 Has anyone successfully used an N900 running an OS from the SD card, though? Nov 17 08:44:26 The easier solution would be to just put something like rescueos on the SD card, so you can boot into that and fix things there. Nov 17 08:44:40 brolin_empey: I'd imagine so. It's certainly possible. Nov 17 08:45:09 RescueOS has to be booted using a flasher tool? Nov 17 08:45:26 brolin_empey: if you're familiar with tweaking/debugging the init mechanisms used on a Linux system, you should be able to figure it out. Nov 17 08:45:45 I see that some current models of x86-64 desktop motherboards have M.2 sockets, which is neat because then the (up to at least 6) integrated SATA ports can be saved for non-SSD devices such as HDDs and ODDs. Nov 17 08:46:11 * Maxdamantus runs everything off eMMC .. would probably have been pretty much the same changes to make it work from SD. Nov 17 08:46:22 cabutts: yes, but it's ram upload, also always works (assuming battery is ok) Nov 17 08:46:38 I'm familiar with Android rescue boots requiring one of the volume keys pressed Nov 17 08:46:49 during normal boot-up Nov 17 08:46:58 (except for the mmc driver change, which would basically be required to prevent the system dying when taking the back cover off) Nov 17 08:47:02 if you preset uboot for menu boot you can have similar Nov 17 08:47:12 * Maxdamantus already changed the mmc driver to not do that anyway. Nov 17 08:50:36 >Uboot PR1.3. RISKY INSTALL Nov 17 08:50:39 >DO NOT USE THIS UNLESS YOU KNOW WHAT YOU ARE DOING. RISK OF REBOOT LOOPS! MAY EAT YOUR BRAIN. Nov 17 08:50:44 hehe Nov 17 08:51:15 well, if I break something, I can always rely on reflashing, right? Nov 17 08:51:26 what are the odds of a permanent brick? Nov 17 08:52:35 Very low if you still have USB working. Nov 17 08:54:01 You can pretty much always reflash using USB, unless you overwrite NOLO, dunno how to do that. Nov 17 08:54:36 ~NOLO Nov 17 08:54:36 rumour has it, nolo is NOkia bootLOader, Nokia's version of uboot-alike first (actually 2nd) stage bootloader for NIT like N900, or somebody said it was a nasty character in Norwegian languange Nov 17 08:58:46 first or 2nd Nov 17 08:58:54 almond wine or cyanide :P Nov 17 09:00:32 both Nov 17 09:01:11 so what does installing uboot mean for ability to flash phone again? Nov 17 09:01:36 You can still flash it. Nov 17 09:01:45 ah, so no worries there Nov 17 09:01:58 but one advantage is that you probably don't need to. Nov 17 09:02:06 #absinthe Nov 17 09:02:30 Since you can just store multiple kernels on eMMC or SD and boot from one of those. Nov 17 09:13:13 Probably would help being familiar with Linux more Nov 17 09:13:20 I am a windows user Nov 17 09:14:20 lol Nov 17 09:14:27 yes. n900 is all about linux Nov 17 09:14:37 n00bs go to android Nov 17 09:18:55 I've had an Xperia E Nov 17 09:19:02 didn't stick too long Nov 17 09:19:25 I don't like android very much Nov 17 09:19:52 particularely the UI design the capacitive touchscreen imposes Nov 17 09:20:08 no stylus smaller than a meat sausage! Nov 17 09:22:36 also, keyboards/keypads are a minority Nov 17 09:25:44 * CatButts mumbles something about Steve Jobs rolling in his grave Nov 17 09:28:24 "We already have 10 stylii, we don't need to invent another one." Nov 17 10:12:43 n00bs go to android” Or to Apple iOS. Nov 17 10:35:19 <__axon__> hello everyone, I have a used n900. What is the most uptodate instructions to bring it as uptodate as possible? Which libraries are still online? Nov 17 10:39:09 http://wiki.maemo.org/Community_SSU Nov 17 10:41:43 ~flashing Nov 17 10:41:44 i guess maemo-flashing is http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware, or - on linux PC - download&extract http://maemo.cloud-7.de/maemo5/patches_n_tools/maemo-my-private-workdir.tgz, cd into it, do sudo ./flash-it-all.sh; or see ~flashing-cmdline, or see ~lazyflashing Nov 17 10:41:47 ~cssu Nov 17 10:41:47 cssu is, like, http://wiki.maemo.org/Community_SSU, or (Community Seamless Software Update) Nov 17 10:42:00 those two pieces Nov 17 10:45:11 <__axon__> CatButts, KotCzarny, I'll try and let you know what happend! Thanks a lot! Nov 17 10:49:54 __axon__ Nov 17 10:49:55 http://www.fladnag.net/downloads/telephone/n900/ Nov 17 10:49:58 also this Nov 17 10:50:34 the articles still have a lot of dead links to nokia site Nov 17 10:50:56 flasher script from infobot has all working links Nov 17 10:51:05 and is preferred Nov 17 10:57:22 <__axon__> one other question, does anyone of you guys prefer an more uptodate device ... or has insider informations about neo900? Nov 17 10:57:58 neo900's pricetag scares me :P Nov 17 10:58:10 for neo900 info go to #neo900 Nov 17 11:01:06 actually, disregard my previous statement, as it's based on an outdated memory Nov 17 11:09:29 ~symbian Nov 17 11:38:07 <__axon__> CatButts, KotCzarny, Thank you guys! everthing worked like charme out of the box! may I ask: do you have a list of applications, that are super useful? Nov 17 11:38:26 what uses are you looking for? Nov 17 11:38:36 <__axon__> Or do you have a python2.7 version? Nov 17 11:38:59 python should be available i think Nov 17 11:39:11 install any pygtk app and see Nov 17 11:39:11 get sheepdrawing :P Nov 17 11:39:14 <__axon__> with apt-cache search I get only 2.5 Nov 17 11:39:20 <__axon__> not 2.7 Nov 17 11:40:09 <__axon__> And is it worth to install any camera apps? are they really better? Nov 17 11:40:19 some say yes Nov 17 11:40:21 <__axon__> Is there a good calendar app? Nov 17 11:40:31 oksana is the best local camera freak Nov 17 11:41:09 <__axon__> Is there a good method to enable swap? Or will I never use it in your experience? Nov 17 11:41:28 memory is low Nov 17 11:41:55 so yes, might be good in some uses, but better to clear the device a bit Nov 17 11:42:08 remember some apps are preloaded even if you dont use them Nov 17 11:42:23 i personally just disable the preloading (ie. email app) Nov 17 11:43:59 <__axon__> how do you do that? Nov 17 11:44:08 <__axon__> is it somewhere in the menu? Nov 17 11:44:34 by disabling preloading line in /usr/applications/hildon/ or something Nov 17 11:44:40 dont remember exact path Nov 17 11:45:34 so i guess first things you should install is rootsh and ssh server Nov 17 11:50:33 What sound API would I use for a quick-n-dirty CLI sound test on the N900? Nov 17 11:50:45 aplay ? Nov 17 11:50:55 mplayer works too Nov 17 11:51:22 aplay is CLI tool and not sound API? Nov 17 11:51:32 realtime audio Nov 17 11:51:57 like playing a programatically generated sine, for starters Nov 17 11:51:58 system is hostage of evilaudio Nov 17 11:52:01 if you ask about that Nov 17 11:52:14 paplay, since maemo uses pulse Nov 17 11:52:15 you can disable it, but then never use device speakers with raw alsa Nov 17 11:52:24 oh, and ... the pulse API then Nov 17 11:52:35 bencoh, evilaudio provides alsa emulation socket too i think Nov 17 11:53:05 yes, there is a alsa->pulse emulation layer Nov 17 11:53:58 I should probably take the SDL path Nov 17 11:55:32 I installed EdiCom editor and ran its gcc install scripts, but I feel I might regret it :P Nov 17 11:55:41 you will Nov 17 11:56:00 you can have fun with gcc on device, but dont go apt way Nov 17 11:56:16 rootfs space is precious and scarce Nov 17 11:57:40 looking at edicom.sh, it does apt-get Nov 17 11:58:00 maybe they have prepared som optified package Nov 17 11:58:04 but be warned Nov 17 11:58:13 apt-get install Nov 17 11:58:19 once you get rootfs full its close to bootloop Nov 17 11:58:53 gcc, libc6-dev, linux-kernel-headers, libgcc1, gdb Nov 17 11:59:26 doesn't N900 have 32gb internal? Nov 17 11:59:36 yes, but rootfs is on nand Nov 17 11:59:39 oh Nov 17 11:59:54 there is 2gb for user data in emmc, rest is vfat in mydocs Nov 17 12:01:50 1.22gb available Nov 17 12:02:24 vfat does not allow executables to be executed, right? Nov 17 12:02:45 usually Nov 17 12:02:52 and generally breaks permissions Nov 17 12:02:55 and file naming Nov 17 12:03:19 best way could be sdcard formatted to ext3/4 and using build tools there Nov 17 12:03:34 or even debian chroot Nov 17 12:03:59 vfat is not formatable, yes? Nov 17 12:04:00 i have a scratchbox chroot that fits in ~300MB initially Nov 17 12:04:12 yup, dont mess with predefined partitions Nov 17 12:04:19 hardcoded stuff in plenty of places Nov 17 12:04:25 unless you are willing to learn Nov 17 12:05:41 CatButts: you can repartition eMMC with a larger /home though Nov 17 12:05:53 there is a wiki page about that iirc Nov 17 12:05:58 (or maybe even a script) Nov 17 12:07:32 do most people here use maemo on their n900 or load an alternate distribution? Nov 17 12:08:00 i run maemo Nov 17 12:08:04 with cssu thumb Nov 17 12:08:15 and some hacks for more memory Nov 17 12:08:53 ~tell __axon__ about jrtools Nov 17 12:10:31 what advantages does thumb have besides saving space Nov 17 12:13:00 ~chroot Nov 17 12:13:01 [chroot] a way to change the root directory of a process, see also http://people.debian.org/~walters/chroot.html Nov 17 12:14:06 saving space == saving memory Nov 17 12:32:29 power-kernel can coexist with uboot, yes? Nov 17 12:34:15 13:40 < __axon__> Is there a good calendar app? << qalendar Nov 17 12:34:33 CatButts: yes Nov 17 12:35:01 default calendar is good enough :) Nov 17 12:35:49 off topic: i find it odd that windows calendar can't show weeks Nov 17 12:37:44 Vajb: qalendar is a FOSS remake of the stock calendar with nice extras Nov 17 12:40:17 i see. It does not seem to be in repo's. Nov 17 12:41:00 probably in devel repo then Nov 17 12:41:13 has recurring events for example Nov 17 12:59:57 where can i browse devel repo? Nov 17 13:00:25 what devel repo/ Nov 17 13:00:34 does anyone develop applications for maemo? Nov 17 13:00:49 yes, you use scratchbox for that Nov 17 13:00:52 ~sb Nov 17 13:00:52 i heard scratchbox is a cross-compiling system that uses binfmt_misc, rpc calls, and an nfs mount to make a cross-build appear to be 100% native, and is found at http://www.scratchbox.org/, hosted by maemo now. Also at http://maemo.merlin1991.at/files/SB Nov 17 13:01:28 thanks, is Qt5 on maemo? Nov 17 13:01:59 best way would be using google and talk.maemo.org forum Nov 17 13:02:04 plenty of useful information Nov 17 13:02:39 it's difficult to know if what i'm looking at is out of date Nov 17 13:02:59 tmo is not out of date Nov 17 13:03:04 like, does this show the latest packages people have posted http://maemo.org/packages/ Nov 17 13:03:12 tmo? Nov 17 13:03:17 oh talk.maemo.org Nov 17 13:03:18 talk.maemo.org Nov 17 13:03:33 as for the link, yes Nov 17 13:03:48 is it possible to install qt5 on maemo? Nov 17 13:03:57 it seems you are new, so quick hint: extras* is user submitted repo Nov 17 13:04:24 extras-testing is meant for testers (dysfunctional now), and extras-devel is wild west Nov 17 13:04:26 qt5 - no. Nov 17 13:04:40 ie. untested packages live here which might result in need of reflash Nov 17 13:06:10 why is it not possible to install qt5 on maemo? Nov 17 13:07:04 who said that? i;ve just said i dont know the status Nov 17 13:07:40 sicelo said no Nov 17 13:07:59 oh Nov 17 13:08:03 missed that Nov 17 13:09:35 i believe it has been tried .. but there are huge differences Nov 17 13:10:57 so it turned out impractical Nov 17 13:11:07 what you want qt5 form Nov 17 13:11:21 *for? Nov 17 13:12:14 (i'm talking about Maemo by the way, not alternative OSes) Nov 17 13:12:21 qutebrowser with webkit Nov 17 13:12:51 i tested it on archlinux arm on n900, it's somewhat laggy but pretty nice to have full javascript support Nov 17 13:13:09 and qutebrowser is a great browser Nov 17 13:13:15 even qt4 is very imperfectly supported on N900, afaik Nov 17 13:14:32 then we can run drawpile server on the n900! Nov 17 13:15:05 http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=84782 Nov 17 17:08:37 /cleanup Nov 17 18:08:01 I'm lazy and won't write code Nov 17 18:08:14 someone roll me over the keyboard Nov 17 18:53:01 What's the abi used on Maemo 5? Nov 17 18:53:16 gnueabi? Nov 17 19:51:36 yep Nov 17 19:51:55 sounds familiar Nov 18 01:11:58 >Thus the binaries from CSSU-Thumb will not work in a "normal system", and several things like uBoot or flashing --flash-only=kernel stop working the way they used to Nov 18 01:12:29 in what way uBoot will not work the same way? Nov 18 01:47:14 I think it means if you compile uBoot with Thumb. Nov 18 01:49:41 https://wiki.maemo.org/Community_SSU/Thumb#The_Countermeasures **** ENDING LOGGING AT Sat Nov 18 03:00:01 2017