**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sun Feb 28 02:59:57 2010 Feb 28 03:12:54 Well, rsync to nilfs2 took 16 minutes, rsync to btrfs on same device took 58 minutes :-) Feb 28 03:35:03 i need to play with btrfs Feb 28 03:37:16 2.7 gigs of data Feb 28 03:38:56 i want to muck with it on my fileserver hehe, just worried about bugs that'd cause kernel panics Feb 28 03:47:06 hm, a few page allocation failures from kernel.. Feb 28 03:47:51 order 4... starts at asm_do_IRQ :D Feb 28 03:48:04 bluez though, not btrfs Feb 28 03:49:57 216megs (out of 512) free, but no order 4 pages :/ Feb 28 04:33:41 heh, running ext2 test now. It started out really fast, but it's getting slower and slower and slooower... Feb 28 04:33:45 * ShadowJK goes sleep Feb 28 04:33:51 :P Feb 28 04:34:22 it's not the bandwidth, it's the IOPS :) Feb 28 04:34:28 always! Feb 28 07:02:09 i got moblin going under fedora arm 12, but it's an ancient version of moblin... Feb 28 07:08:36 cool, how? Feb 28 07:40:30 just installed "regular" fedora 12 arm and yum installed various moblin* packages. The interface is very much for a desktop though (e.g. small "X" in upper right corner to close windows etc). Again, this is a much older version. I have mock going now and have been able to run one package thru it so far. Feb 28 08:42:26 "ARM port is currently being maintained in the OBS project devel:arch:arm. " per http://wiki.meego.com/ARM_Support But I don't see that anywhere in OBS https://build.opensuse.org/project/list_public Feb 28 08:45:10 hello everyone. Feb 28 08:45:19 jebba: afaik that's still password-protected. Feb 28 09:02:48 jebba: moblin obs, not novell obs :) Feb 28 09:12:31 heya Stskeeps Feb 28 09:14:08 morning th0br0 Feb 28 09:17:47 People waking up? Feb 28 09:18:30 yeah.. slowly Feb 28 09:19:19 morn david Feb 28 09:35:49 Stskeeps: lbt we should really try to find some date for the first packaging meeting soon... or should we wait until the source release for that? Feb 28 09:47:03 right - i'm available most of the week next week but i think a bootstrap meeting could be good to shape up the page, make it into an actual proposal and submit to TSG Feb 28 09:53:36 likely so Stskeeps Feb 28 09:54:53 i'm pondering to start a thread so we can get some procedures for WG creation going Feb 28 10:12:45 Hello all Feb 28 10:14:06 morning wazd, qgil Feb 28 10:14:36 hi there Feb 28 10:14:48 Stskeeps: heya Feb 28 10:16:58 stskeeps: sorry for marina mod delay, have some personal problems :( Feb 28 10:17:15 wazd_e63: it's fine, my world is up and down with the whole meego thing anyway :) Feb 28 10:17:37 Stskeeps: heh) Feb 28 10:17:45 it was interesting to see http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o3TdoY868kc Feb 28 10:19:06 Stskeeps: my sister adored my UI concept btw :) And if she says "fine" then it's genius :D Feb 28 10:19:24 the platform wars will be won in the reference implementations.. i mean, if meego can end up being the typical system board vendors put out and let people build on, we have a winner : Feb 28 10:19:52 currently this is minimal linux systems or android Feb 28 10:20:08 probably, yes Feb 28 10:20:39 Stskeeps: android has some serious issues with all that custom frontends Feb 28 10:21:02 wazd_e63: yeah, differentiation can sometimes harm too Feb 28 10:21:13 if you are targetting an Intel Atom chipset the story becomes quite clear now: pick the Qt baseline and you can start already now Feb 28 10:21:27 looking forward to see good support from other chipset vendors Feb 28 10:21:35 Stskeeps: you can expect anything if someone says "android" Feb 28 10:21:40 having dual platform also makes it much easier for people to prototype Feb 28 10:22:05 develop most of your system for a atom cpu, transfer it to your resulting ARM device Feb 28 10:22:35 there the Qt + Web Runtime machinery is promising Feb 28 10:23:03 Stskeeps: I think intel will have serious problems with atom in future because of CULV platform Feb 28 10:23:05 The Qt team is used to support different platforms and still offer a single API Feb 28 10:23:08 A lot of people say that Android backend is *not* a real Linux Feb 28 10:23:09 Stskeeps: yes, I would prefer a strong reference UI with enough customization built in that vendors reuse it instead of building their own Feb 28 10:23:20 not that their work is easy but they are used to it :) Feb 28 10:23:20 i wonder why noone is asking if Booklet is getting MeeGo Feb 28 10:23:21 :P Feb 28 10:23:35 qgil: Yes, Symbian and Maemo Qt APIs appear to be different. Any news on that? Feb 28 10:23:48 and web runtime sits on top of web technologies also designed to be crossplatform since the beginning Feb 28 10:24:04 Stskeeps: Sorry, you cannot just develop on Atom and transfer to ARM Feb 28 10:24:11 Stskeeps: I've asked it! I want to buy :) Or I want to buy a Nokia Tablet 3G w MeeGo. Feb 28 10:24:14 RST38h: worked in Mer. Feb 28 10:24:18 Stskeeps: First thing that will kill you is going to be data alignment Feb 28 10:24:24 RST38h: s/Atom/X86 Feb 28 10:24:39 Stskeeps: Second thing will be the performance tuning Feb 28 10:24:44 of course Feb 28 10:24:51 Stskeeps: booklet is kinda tricky thing) Feb 28 10:24:52 Stskeeps: Atom, X86, it does not matter Feb 28 10:25:15 Stskeeps: long battery life but no serious gpu Feb 28 10:25:34 Stskeeps: The architecture is different enough to require different optimizations and programming guidelines Feb 28 10:25:39 Stskeeps: aluminium body but terrible plastic cover Feb 28 10:26:06 Stskeeps: I can easily do stuff like char *P; int N=*(int *)P; on x86 Feb 28 10:26:15 On ARM...ewwww.. Feb 28 10:26:35 RST38h: i'm not even going to discuss that issue as you'd win in argument based on merit alone Feb 28 10:26:35 rst38h a lot of the trick is around Qt iterations Feb 28 10:26:38 :P Feb 28 10:27:01 4.6 is a different game than 4.5 when it comes to Symbian and Maemo support Feb 28 10:27:11 4.7 is in its way, then 4.8.... Feb 28 10:30:35 Stskeeps: Anyways, not expecting any particular benefits from debugging on x86 (after doing it for years though :)) Feb 28 10:31:06 qgil: You mean, DUI/Orbit will completley change from 4.6 to 4.7? Feb 28 10:31:27 RST38h: yeah - i guess i'm blessed by not having to do char *P; int N=*(int *)P; on a regular basis Feb 28 10:32:08 and if i had to do those things, i would be using u_intX_t :P Feb 28 10:32:19 i talk about Qt itself, Orbit dui are "candidates for inclusion" from a qt pov Feb 28 10:36:28 Stskeeps: what do you mean "not having to do"? Every man should do it once a day :D Feb 28 10:38:55 * Stskeeps is really looking forward to going back to his apartment Feb 28 10:39:23 the work getting all the floors polished is finally done and now we have to move all the furniture back Feb 28 10:59:15 Stskeeps: good post on meego-dev list. i do agree that as a newcomer i don't have a clue where to start from. Feb 28 11:01:19 maybe i'll just continue with qt basics in maemo environment for now Feb 28 11:06:21 crysaz: yeah, i'm reading up on .spec, rpm and bootstrapping in rpm Feb 28 11:07:06 qgil: Ah, interesting, so there is Qt and there are DUI/Orbit, one of which (the better one) will presumably go into Qt 4.7 proper? Feb 28 11:12:52 not 4.7 Feb 28 11:13:03 4.8 or later Feb 28 11:13:08 or never. Not decided. Feb 28 11:17:53 th0br0: Stskeeps agree. It would be good to do some brainstorming of issues and scope Feb 28 11:20:36 Stskeeps: for bootstrapping take a look at the OBS 'build' script too Feb 28 11:22:21 yeah Feb 28 11:22:22 wazd_e63: hah, cool with marina theme - it shows bubbles when closing a window in switcher Feb 28 11:23:25 * lbt wonders who's around from the pkging group Feb 28 11:23:56 the repo or the debian one? Feb 28 11:24:05 repo :) Feb 28 11:24:49 X-Fade: jeremiah Clay are online Feb 28 11:26:31 the meeting : http://meego.mkdir.name/logs/meego-meeting/2010/meego-meeting.2010-02-24-20.04.html Feb 28 11:26:51 kinda re-scoped the repo-WG in my mind Feb 28 11:27:22 i will need to read that through.. Feb 28 11:27:33 of course I do see everything as an OBS shaped nail at the moment Feb 28 11:27:53 MeeGo is merely something for OBS to build ;) Feb 28 11:28:08 and the repos are what OBS makes Feb 28 11:28:14 * RST38h is mostly getting garbage when closing windows in switcher Feb 28 11:28:18 and QA is how you get it through OBS Feb 28 11:28:35 and dev community is about how devs use OBS... Feb 28 11:34:17 http://blog.chris.tylers.info/index.php?/archives/227-Mock-config-for-ARM-building.html Feb 28 11:37:39 Any news when first meego smartphones will be available? :) Feb 28 11:38:10 no news Feb 28 11:38:23 it will be the Harmattan device, but we can't tell you the date :-) Feb 28 11:38:59 my bet is on 2012, right after the world ends ;p Feb 28 11:39:22 it didn't end, didn't you see the movie? Feb 28 11:39:52 yes and regretted it very soon afterwards Feb 28 11:43:00 :D Feb 28 11:43:10 Stskeeps: Did they at least get a chance to violently destroy the White House again? Feb 28 11:43:21 I hope it will be before world ends :D Feb 28 11:44:09 do you think it is possible there will be Nokia smartphone with Meego in iPhone formfactor? Feb 28 11:44:33 Yes! Feb 28 11:44:43 * RST38h shakes his 8-ball Feb 28 11:46:32 cenebris: as in "big capacitive, multitouch screen" ? Feb 28 11:47:40 thiago_home: yes, exactly, like Nokia X6 I believe Feb 28 11:47:49 cenebris: that's what was announced for the Harmattan device Feb 28 11:48:00 thiago_home: without keyboard Feb 28 11:48:24 nokia desperately need to jump on the gorilla glass bandwagon if/when they do tbh Feb 28 11:48:58 I can't tell you if it's going to have a keyboard or not Feb 28 11:49:03 nid0: yes, this glass would be great Feb 28 11:49:06 I can only repeat what has been publicly announced Feb 28 11:49:22 thiago_home: you work for Nokia? Feb 28 11:49:24 cenebris: So, you do not want the keyboard? Feb 28 11:49:35 yes Feb 28 11:49:40 cenebris: And you want a large capacitive glass touch screen? Feb 28 11:50:06 thiago_home: ok, good to know :) Feb 28 11:50:11 cenebris: And I suppose you also want the brilliant 480x320-pixel LCD? Feb 28 11:50:38 since the N900 is already 800x480, you can expect the Harmattan device to be no smaller Feb 28 11:50:52 thiago: Then it will not be able to compare to iPhone Feb 28 11:50:57 RST38h: like iPhone - no keyboard, large display, perhaps 800x480 like N900 Feb 28 11:51:23 cenebris: I see. Do you also want an Apple logo etched on the back? Feb 28 11:51:39 hd2-sized screens are the way to go for phones in that style tbh Feb 28 11:52:14 RST38h: no, I don't like the iPhone itself, but imho it's form factor is best for what I want/need Feb 28 11:52:48 nid0: I agree - big screen and pretty thin device without keyboard Feb 28 11:52:52 as almost all touchscreens are essentially the same form factor as the iphone, you're not exactly short on choice if thats what you want Feb 28 11:52:57 isn't entering data without keyboard to awkward on such devices? Feb 28 11:52:57 cenebris: Well, the funny thing is, N900 is exactly the same dimensions as iPhone with screen exactly the same size Feb 28 11:53:03 *too Feb 28 11:53:07 It is thicker, due to keyboard etc Feb 28 11:53:16 gour yes it is, personally I wouldnt want a phone without a keyboard Feb 28 11:53:16 But it *is* "the iphone form factor" Feb 28 11:53:29 but then I use it for data entry quite a lot, your average smartphone user doesnt Feb 28 11:53:37 * gour agrees with nid0 Feb 28 11:54:01 i want that phone is just one app on the device and use it more as mobile computer Feb 28 11:54:07 I find the keyboard on the n900 restrictive as it is, being as I come from the 5-line spacious mammoth on the e90 Feb 28 11:54:25 certainly wouldnt want any less than the n900's Feb 28 11:54:39 RST38h: yes, but it has keyboard, that makes it thicker and personally keyboard only complicates everything for me (few languages, display keyboard is better in this case) Feb 28 11:54:44 Somebody, please tell me I am doing the wrong thing buying BH-905 Feb 28 11:55:15 cenebris: I would not buy it without a keyboard, sorry Feb 28 11:55:40 RST38h: tests says it is very good headset, although I didn't test it. Quite pricey though Feb 28 11:55:43 you're doing the wrong thing buying bh-905. Feb 28 11:56:11 RST38h: well I would, hope Nokia can make models for people with different needs :) Feb 28 11:56:41 cenebris: There are x6, 5800, and its smaller sibling Feb 28 11:56:53 cenebris: They should all satisfy you well Feb 28 11:57:35 cenebris: Amazon offered the thing for $199, so I ordered it Feb 28 11:58:14 Not exactly an economy model, but reasonable given the features Feb 28 11:59:17 RST38h: and are you sattisfied with this headset? Feb 28 11:59:31 no idea yet, will get it in a week or so Feb 28 13:01:49 dear god, please dont let people turn my tsg questions into a meego n900 thread Feb 28 13:02:15 So, Stskeeps, will Meego run on N900? =) Feb 28 13:02:23 * RST38h hides Feb 28 13:02:42 RST38h: hell if i know. it may run on n8âx0 Feb 28 13:03:00 as its armv5 atm Feb 28 13:03:08 Stskeeps: Gotta get rid of that PowerVR dependency though Feb 28 13:03:34 RST38h: xfce ;p Feb 28 13:03:43 Won't be a Meego then =B Feb 28 13:04:16 heh Feb 28 13:04:30 noone statements make sense until we see code. Feb 28 13:04:47 But really, all that clutterfuck does not perform any useful role anyway Feb 28 13:05:03 Some code is already in the repo Feb 28 13:23:22 RST38h: What repo? Feb 28 13:23:30 I thought the only repo was the Moblin 2.2 one Feb 28 13:23:32 which is not meego Feb 28 13:26:42 I have recently seen a repository with some packages compiled Feb 28 13:26:53 Cannot locate the URL at the moment Feb 28 15:08:15 Hi Feb 28 15:08:47 What is the current state of development of MeeGo? Is there a first release scheduled? Feb 28 15:10:28 What is the current state of development of MeeGo? Is there a first release scheduled? Feb 28 16:49:48 Latest registered user on MeeGo: http://meego.com/user/3259 Feb 28 16:52:37 what about him/her? Feb 28 16:54:30 * GAN900 hands thiago_home a "them". Feb 28 16:57:16 thiago_home: nothing really, just happy to see the number of registered users climb. Feb 28 16:57:33 are you sure it's sequential? :-P Feb 28 16:57:59 * thiago_home once devised a registration number for an association that used a complex rule so that the numbers would grow quickly Feb 28 16:58:56 thiago_home: I'm sure there is like 5% dead registrations, but I'm rathar naive and thought that you were not involved in the numbering scheme this time! :) Feb 28 17:03:36 * thiago_home finds a bunch of meego-dev messages in his spam folder Feb 28 17:04:28 not a bad start in some cases :j Feb 28 17:04:31 :) Feb 28 17:06:19 Apple mighty mouce + wooden desk = problems Feb 28 17:06:21 14, including most of the TSG thread Feb 28 17:06:43 they thiago Feb 28 17:07:33 hi Feb 28 19:39:27 about MeeGo community... Feb 28 19:39:59 ... I was thinking that starting the Summit discussion is probably one of the most urgent things on the table Feb 28 19:41:20 for when? Feb 28 19:41:25 or is that on the table? Feb 28 19:43:07 we only have a table, the rest is to be decided :) Feb 28 19:43:15 http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=44947 Feb 28 19:43:19 will there be icecream? Feb 28 19:43:28 granted Feb 28 19:43:33 I'm in Feb 28 19:43:42 that's why Feb 28 19:44:43 qgil: What is the estimated number of Moblin people at the summit? Feb 28 19:44:48 I wonder what the point of this summit is? compared to maemo ones? Feb 28 19:45:20 they seem to have been 'educational' historically Feb 28 19:45:39 by september can we assume that much planning is resolved? Feb 28 19:47:19 by the time of the Summit (September?) I wonder what 'Moblin people' will mean Feb 28 19:47:59 the Moblin summits were purely for developers, and even platform developers Feb 28 19:48:32 at least this is what I would guess from the fact of being collocated with the Linux Collaboration Summit Feb 28 19:48:34 o/ ahma Feb 28 19:49:04 qgil: The real question is about the ratio of people from different sides of the fence Feb 28 19:49:25 RST38h: it is? in 6+ months time? Feb 28 19:49:33 I guess, ideally, you would want an integrated summit with topics interesting for both sides, rather than having two summits side by side Feb 28 19:49:53 lbt: Yes. We do not know how this will look in 6+ months. Feb 28 19:50:01 lbt if the first MeeGo release is planned for 2Q, I really hope by September (again: ?) a lot of planning is done and we are just increasing mass and speed Feb 28 19:50:22 lbt: I.e. I have some idea but not prepared to talk about it Feb 28 19:50:40 rst38h" the fence" being... handset guys vs netbook guys or...? Feb 28 19:50:42 I think there will be a lot more problems to resolve than at normal Maemo summits Feb 28 19:50:58 qgil: Moblin guys vs Maemo/Meego guys Feb 28 19:51:05 (cf the opt problem which was addressed last time ... I expect a *lot* of them) Feb 28 19:51:14 qgil: But yes, you can call the first group netbook people Feb 28 19:51:39 Moblin/MeeGo guys vs Maemo/MeeGo guys? Feb 28 19:51:55 qgil: My guess is that traditional netbook people will continue calling their stuff Moblin Feb 28 19:52:07 vs all the nw people joining that didn't care much about Moblin or MeeGo before? Feb 28 19:52:15 no way Feb 28 19:53:09 RST38h: the same way that traditional smartphone people will continue calling their stuff Maemo? Feb 28 19:53:12 qgilN900: do you know the moblin summit organizers? Feb 28 19:53:27 yes, the Intel guys Feb 28 19:54:33 Hi ppl, I had the idea to buy me a nexus one and install meego there when its ready would it work? Feb 28 19:54:45 qgilN900: i was hoping for a less generic answer Feb 28 19:54:49 saft: you should ask Google that question Feb 28 19:54:50 Dirk, Imad... Feb 28 19:54:53 saft: it's their hardware Feb 28 19:55:01 thiago_home: i did Feb 28 19:55:10 saft: what did they say? Feb 28 19:55:15 bla Feb 28 19:55:34 how unsurprising Feb 28 19:55:42 there is no awnser since there is no meego :P Feb 28 19:55:43 saft: meego is (will be) an open OS ... if you have open HW then you should be able to run it. Feb 28 19:55:59 * thiago_home bets that SnapDragon will be one of the supported ARM platforms (we have to convince Qualcomm) Feb 28 19:56:04 lbt: and the time Feb 28 19:56:13 and the energy to adapt the various levels required Feb 28 19:56:17 timeless_mbp: he's got time to be on irc... Feb 28 19:56:23 oh! yeah Feb 28 19:56:27 but whether all the hardware that is on the Nexus One is supported, and whether you can flash anything onto the device, those are questions best asked to Google Feb 28 19:57:14 qgilN900: so, personally i like montreal or toronto as host cities Feb 28 19:57:18 qgilN900: what areas will the summit address? Feb 28 19:57:32 will there be a break with classic X11 for meego? Feb 28 19:57:34 moco is using whistler (outside vancouver) for summits Feb 28 19:57:36 well if you can use the hartware with the linux kernel who cares about google? its not like i asked dell if i could install linux on my laptop?! Feb 28 19:57:37 there's so much new stuff that I wonder if it needs to be longer Feb 28 19:57:44 lbt: it's *our* summit, so we decide Feb 28 19:57:48 but they're for 'core' (roughly 400 core people!) only Feb 28 19:57:57 yep... these are questions for us all :) Feb 28 19:57:59 are we having a cagefight? Feb 28 19:58:03 * w00t tags lcuk Feb 28 19:58:05 you're it ;) Feb 28 19:58:17 pupnik: no, not until there's something better than X11 anyway Feb 28 19:58:18 damn! Feb 28 19:58:21 pupnik: what do you mean break? Feb 28 19:58:23 * lcuk tags pupnik Feb 28 19:58:25 (evening all) Feb 28 19:58:28 like using qtopia? :) Feb 28 19:58:32 o/ w00t Feb 28 19:58:38 lcuk: the atmosphere seems loaded somehow... Feb 28 19:58:39 conference someplace reasonably cheap and free of hassles pls Feb 28 19:58:46 no, not Qtopia Feb 28 19:58:49 but QWS, who knows Feb 28 19:58:50 * w00t reads scrollback Feb 28 19:58:52 maybe Lighthouse Feb 28 19:58:56 pupnik: Amsterdam... (ask lcuk) Feb 28 19:59:14 it's becoming more difficult to define "cheap" when Europe/America seem more balanced in MeeGo Feb 28 19:59:16 not Qtopia? we thought that was the future... wow..... deal-breaker Feb 28 19:59:19 the amsterdam venue was very nice Feb 28 19:59:21 im serious about video linkups Feb 28 19:59:29 Qtopia was EOL'ed one year ago Feb 28 19:59:39 I also wonder what might come out from Asia, since Intel has plenty of partners there... Feb 28 19:59:42 QWS/Lighthouse, who knos Feb 28 19:59:46 * lbt stops teasing thiago_home Feb 28 19:59:48 thiago_home: technically, it's community support, isn't it? Feb 28 19:59:59 right, EOL'ed as a product Feb 28 19:59:59 what do you mean? qtopia is really the secret future Feb 28 20:00:06 thiago: aww, i'm sure we could resurrect it! Feb 28 20:00:09 who here has contact to intel/moblin? what do those guys want? Feb 28 20:00:15 timeless_mbp: die in a fire Feb 28 20:00:28 pupnik: I will go for money =) Feb 28 20:00:29 w00t: oh, i have no love for Qtopia Feb 28 20:00:33 hehe Feb 28 20:00:34 want about what? Ice cream as well, I guess Feb 28 20:00:37 pupnik: the problem with intel/moblin is they don't have the same kind of community maemo had Feb 28 20:00:37 pupnik: Dunno about the rest Feb 28 20:00:39 timeless_mbp: development of qtopia is still ongoing for the openmoko phone Feb 28 20:00:40 did anybody manage to find/build a moblin image for pentium m chipsets? Feb 28 20:00:45 but it seemed like a stupid question, so it deserved a stupid answer Feb 28 20:00:55 lcuk: no Feb 28 20:00:57 ljp: isn't openmoko dead? :) Feb 28 20:01:00 lbt that is not a problem but an advantage Feb 28 20:01:04 lcuk: although you may try Moblin1 Feb 28 20:01:32 timeless_mbp: the community is still thriving, companies still sell updated hardware Feb 28 20:01:33 qgilN900: yeah s/problem/thing/ Feb 28 20:01:35 well its quite funny here... Feb 28 20:01:41 well heck, make it somewhere in europe if possible. i think that will get best attendance Feb 28 20:01:43 lbt: not so sure that's a problem, in some ways, it means there's less directions things can be pulled in Feb 28 20:01:47 qgilN900: we're still assuming a 3 day weekend summit? Feb 28 20:01:48 * lcuk watches the shadows vs vorlons having a massive megabattle Feb 28 20:01:51 we don't know (until they tell us) what they'd like to focus on Feb 28 20:02:09 summit: we need to rethink everything Feb 28 20:02:35 multiple device family support Feb 28 20:02:49 qgil: Will there new SDK / hardware in time for the summit? Feb 28 20:02:56 ROFL Feb 28 20:02:59 there [be] new Feb 28 20:03:03 it might even make sense to have a GUADEC-likev model, with certain days for core developers and some days for a wider audience Feb 28 20:03:11 * lbt passes qgilN900 a magic 8-ball Feb 28 20:03:20 * thiago_home suggests Munich Feb 28 20:03:25 * timeless_mbp frowns Feb 28 20:03:35 * w00t suggests his living room Feb 28 20:03:36 HEL to YYZ for 9/23 to 9/27 is ~900USD Feb 28 20:03:42 rst38h new sdk for sure. read again: MeeGo release in 2Q Feb 28 20:03:45 if you put it next to Qt Dev Days again, at least make it the same city :-) Feb 28 20:03:49 Aha, cool Feb 28 20:04:04 * RST38h suggests Moscow Feb 28 20:04:10 thiago: yeah that was fail Feb 28 20:04:14 hardware... I guess there will be at least an Atom refverence hardware Feb 28 20:04:15 any advantage to piggyback it to a wider linux event? Feb 28 20:04:19 thiago_home: linking with a Qt may be an idea Feb 28 20:04:22 * ljp suggests Brisbane Feb 28 20:04:27 * RST38h Although hotel costs are probably gonna be prohibitively high Feb 28 20:04:28 hrm, HEOL to SFO for 9/23 to 9/27 is ~900USD (but prices go up faster) Feb 28 20:04:31 yeah, I'd love to go to Brisbane Feb 28 20:04:34 s/HEOL/HEL/ Feb 28 20:04:34 timeless_mbp meant: hrm, HEL to SFO for 9/23 to 9/27 is ~900USD (but prices go up faster) Feb 28 20:04:35 it snowed last year in MUC Feb 28 20:04:38 qgilN900, to ease some of the work for the smaller talks, barcamps have a method where plans for them are posted on a board on the day Feb 28 20:04:49 just open slots Feb 28 20:04:59 fwiw, HEL pretty much sucks as a point of origin Feb 28 20:05:03 plan video team in advance... :) Feb 28 20:05:09 so does OSL Feb 28 20:05:19 ok, HEL to YVR for 9/23 to 9/27 has a base of >1350USD Feb 28 20:05:26 which i think means YVR is out :( Feb 28 20:05:27 * lbt was super-impressed with the Debconf live videostreaming... Feb 28 20:05:28 going to PDX in one week will require 2 stops Feb 28 20:05:35 lcuk, call me traditional but before I'd like to agree on scope, audience, location and dates :) Feb 28 20:05:38 (well, 2stop base of >1050USD) Feb 28 20:05:49 then we know we can of beast we have creeated Feb 28 20:06:05 * w00t would concur with qgilN900 really Feb 28 20:06:09 qgilN900: =~ s/creeated/created/ Feb 28 20:06:11 qgilN900, of course, but opening a couple of rooms and being freeform for that purpose doesnt harm? Feb 28 20:06:16 HEL to SEA is ~900USD Feb 28 20:06:18 discussing the how before the what seems a little erk Feb 28 20:06:22 i'm quite happy w/ SEA also Feb 28 20:06:29 * lbt thinks the scope could be more than just the attendees Feb 28 20:06:31 open conference Feb 28 20:06:41 unconference Feb 28 20:06:41 and that's an important starting point Feb 28 20:06:43 lbt: in what way? Feb 28 20:06:50 ok, so roughly crossing the pond from HEL has a 900USD base price w/ a penalty to go to YVR Feb 28 20:06:53 One thing I know for sure is that dividing scope into Maemo and Meego parts is wrong Feb 28 20:07:04 well, meego 'community' could be much bigger than maemo Feb 28 20:07:13 rst38h that's for sure Feb 28 20:07:15 Better intertwine things, even although it may feel artificial at times Feb 28 20:07:16 and there will be a lot of people we should include Feb 28 20:07:22 ooh Feb 28 20:07:23 we have technology to support that Feb 28 20:07:30 virtual attendanve Feb 28 20:07:32 HEL to CHI gets me <800USD base Feb 28 20:07:32 right Feb 28 20:07:38 of course, thats a sensible idea Feb 28 20:07:39 CHI? Feb 28 20:07:42 timeless_mbp: stop posting prices please Feb 28 20:07:57 thiago: Chicago Feb 28 20:08:01 ah, ORD Feb 28 20:08:04 not sure which airport Feb 28 20:08:10 * thiago_home will be there in about 10 days Feb 28 20:08:12 it might be Midway Feb 28 20:08:25 BOS is about the same as CHI Feb 28 20:08:38 US can be a pain for visas for many people Feb 28 20:08:44 Boston is a great deal closer Feb 28 20:08:53 thiago: it only saved about 100USD Feb 28 20:08:54 so should the summit primarily focus on the attendees or should it aim to provide info for the non-attending community too? Feb 28 20:08:55 qgilN900: not to mention the generally quite strict border control Feb 28 20:08:57 yeah, I'll have to renew my visa for the US this year Feb 28 20:08:59 which all things considered is trivial Feb 28 20:08:59 Australia it is then! Feb 28 20:09:08 I need visa for Australia too Feb 28 20:09:09 can we do hawaii Feb 28 20:09:10 how about Ireland :-p (mildly serious as it's "between" EU and US) Feb 28 20:09:10 and for Canada Feb 28 20:09:18 bfree: Iceland Feb 28 20:09:22 arjan: can you sponsor everyone? Feb 28 20:09:24 Canada is also relatively strict AFAIK Feb 28 20:09:27 good idea bfree Feb 28 20:09:31 Ireland may not be such a bad idea Feb 28 20:09:34 northpole Feb 28 20:09:40 (selfish but good) :) Feb 28 20:09:40 everybody head north Feb 28 20:09:40 * timeless_mbp ponders Feb 28 20:09:49 not London! Feb 28 20:09:51 Dublin was nice in 2006 Feb 28 20:09:54 lbt: er.. I'm still a little confused by what you quite mean - obviously, the more eyes on and attention the better, but focus in what sense? Feb 28 20:09:58 Spain? Feb 28 20:10:00 Portugal? Feb 28 20:10:05 Both should be relatively cheap Feb 28 20:10:12 so we have platform developers (high % of professionals and the rest can be funded) Feb 28 20:10:13 Gran Canaria again? Feb 28 20:10:16 also good RST38h Feb 28 20:10:22 france! Feb 28 20:10:23 app developers are relatively easy to map Feb 28 20:10:24 * timeless_mbp ponders Feb 28 20:10:26 * w00t notes signal to noise ratio is starting to suck Feb 28 20:10:26 May I suggest Greece? Feb 28 20:10:38 RST38h: incredibly expensive from USA i'd imagine Feb 28 20:10:39 lcuk: You wanna deal with another transportation workers strike? Feb 28 20:10:44 if you sponsor intel to greece Feb 28 20:10:51 w00t: the content and scope could change if you included virtual attendance Feb 28 20:10:53 and then contributors & lovely users everywhere (but with certain areas of density) Feb 28 20:10:59 Anything is expensive from USA. Feb 28 20:10:59 http://pininthemap.com/maemo Feb 28 20:11:06 Especially when donw before September 15th Feb 28 20:11:07 locations of a great number of the maemo community Feb 28 20:11:18 RST38h: usa to LHR/PAR is generally tolerable Feb 28 20:11:22 FMO germany central in europe with multiple airports close to amsterdam, dortmund, hamburg and dusseldorf Feb 28 20:11:23